Half-Life 2 Release Date Broken

That's great... by Japong · 2004-11-12 06:29 · Score: 4, Informative

... but with out Steam registration you're not going to get very far. He can't play single player, multiplayer, or anything else but look at the box and manual. You're waiting until the 16th, get used to it.

Re:That's great... by spikestabber · 2004-11-12 06:42 · Score: 2, Insightful

The crackers will have it opened up any minute now.
Re:That's great... by KDR_11k · 2004-11-12 07:21 · Score: 1

A local retailer has a warniong sign on the door that basically says you can register before the official launch but Vivendi will sue you.
the reason is that by registering your copy the Steam servers assume that it's okay to activate all download copies and Vivendi claims this will cause big losses to retailers and itself.

--
Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
Re:That's great... by Farmer+Jimbo · 2004-11-12 07:28 · Score: 2, Insightful

This is a little different than just straight DRM. Whether you install from CD's or pre-order through steam, you can't play until Valve says so. Why? Becasue not only is the content encrypted (which could be cracked) but it's missing vital parts of the game that can only be downloaded from Steam/Valve.

Even if the gfc encryption is broken you wont be able to play until valve lets you download the rest of the game! How in the hell is a cracker/hacker gonna get around that?
Re:That's great... by Khasmo · 2004-11-12 08:56 · Score: 1

I can't believe that Valve would actually do that. My assumption has been that Valve made the statement that to assure online buyers that they would be able to play as soon as anyone. They never actually said that they would allow any copy to be activated before the official launch. registration activation.

That said, I wouldn't be surprised if VU used a little FUD to try to keep retailers from breaking the release date.
Re:That's great... by Moonlapse · 2004-11-12 08:58 · Score: 1

Yea, so basically you are required to have an internet connection to play. What exactly is this "switch" the allows single player play? Does it require turning on every time you want to play or just the initial? I.e. if you want to play HL2 outside on your laptop, is this feasible?

--
- I got my free iPod and a free Nintendo DS....why not
Re:That's great... by Jad+LaFields · 2004-11-12 09:27 · Score: 1

Gotta have a Steam account when you install it, but then you can go internet-free any time you want to play single player.

I still think its bullshit, no matter how many of Valve's users have an internet connection.

--
[SIG] It's like putting a moose in the blender -- a recipe for disaster!
Re:That's great... by Sevn · 2004-11-12 09:52 · Score: 1

When it happens, don't be shocked.

--
For every annoying gentoo user, are three even more annoying anti-gentoo crybabies. Take Yosh from #Gimp for example.
Re:That's great... by AvitarX · 2004-11-12 11:02 · Score: 1

I would imagine they want to sell before it is available via steam.

Also, am I to understand that you need internet access to activate the game?

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Wow, sent an e-mail as suggested when clicking on "use classic" banner, and got a fast response that addressed my msg
Re:That's great... by SySOvErRiDe · 2004-11-12 12:19 · Score: 1

Release an extra pack that 'fills in the blanks'? Doing it via Bittorrent for example. That work around sounds rather obvious =\
Re:That's great... by junkgrep · 2004-11-12 15:21 · Score: 1

Uh, no, vivendi won't sue you. No one will sue you. You can't play the game until Tuesday, and that's that.
Re:That's great... by junkgrep · 2004-11-12 15:23 · Score: 1

It's how they wanted to do copy-protection. If you don't like copy-protection, fine, but I don't see what's so wrong with making it internet based, anymore than forcing people to have 3d acceleration.
Re:That's great... by Farmer+Jimbo · 2004-11-12 15:35 · Score: 1

Not to me, unless your talking about after the game is turned on.

Once valve opens activation and releases the final download, It's going to be cracked, of that I'm sure. But that means mission one was accomplished, they held the unwashed masses at bay until release day.

Keep in mind that valve can take this victory, concede the SP battle for now, and continue to fight the MP battle witha very robust platform.
Re:That's great... by Mycroft_VIII · 2004-11-12 17:40 · Score: 1

Depends on whether they make it clear that it HAS to phone home before you can play it, in a way that mr. Smith buying it for Junior can clearly see and understand.
Elsewise they may have significant returns to deal with.
Personally I don't trust an app that has to phone home unless it's an obvious requirement for the app to do it's job (such updates for anti-virus programs). Not to mention it potentially adds one more infection vector for viruses and other mallware.

Mycroft

--
https://signup.leagueoflegends.com/?ref=4c3ed6600b6ea
Re:That's great... by Drakonite · 2004-11-13 07:23 · Score: 2, Insightful

Ok, lets take a moment and assume broadband internet is a reasonable assumption... What happens a couple years from now, when for whatever reason valve's servers are no longer online to active your copy, or worse yet when they decide to no longer active copies so you are forced to buy a new game.
Maybe I'm alone, maybe I'm completely different than anyone else, but I don't like the idea of buying a game and knowing I might not be able to install and play it in a couple years.
The same idea applies to games which have a large online appeal but are designed to prevent you from using unofficial servers.

--
Shoot Pixels, Not People!

Not really by Grand · 2004-11-12 06:30 · Score: 1

Then can install it, and that is about it. It has to authenticate to steam. Since steam has not unlocked HL2, no one can play it. It will sit in the "Coming soon" section of steam just like everyone else.

Future Slashdot headline: Sierra/Value sue EB by bergeron76 · 2004-11-12 06:30 · Score: 4, Funny

I can just see it now: Valve to sue Electronics Boutique over HL2 sales

--
Don't think that a small group of dedicated individuals can't change the world. It's the only thing that ever has.

CDS?!? by rastachops · 2004-11-12 06:32 · Score: 3, Insightful

Why is it that many games are still released on CDs? I heard that it's because Americans would have trouble if they sold just DVDs.
[/troll]
But seriously, why do games manufacturers still produce CD's rather than DVDs when DVD drives are so cheap now!

Re:CDS?!? by BRSloth · 2004-11-12 06:36 · Score: 1

Because the large base of users with CD readers that still work and don't plan to change?
Re:CDS?!? by Timber_Z · 2004-11-12 06:38 · Score: 1

Perhaps because DVD's die at the drop of a hat?

I have an old beat up starcraft cd, major scratches and everything, put in last night for the heck of it , and it fired right up.

I have had several DVD based games (PS2) die with only the slighest of Defects, Extremly annoying.
Re:CDS?!? by Fade_to_Blah · 2004-11-12 06:50 · Score: 1

I still do not have a DVD burner/reader on any of my 3 machines. I have no use for one honestly. I am not going to watch DVD movies on my computer nor do I need it for backup purposes since I have a machine that I back things up on.

Not everyone has DVD readers yet.
Re:CDS?!? by djdanlib · 2004-11-12 07:09 · Score: 5, Insightful

DVD drives are too inexpensive for the tired (and increasingly expensive) old argument of "Oh, I don't need to upgrade, my 16X CD drive works just fine. Eight or nine CDs is fine". Seriously, you can get a 16X DVD-ROM drive at Staples (AT STAPLES FOR CRYIN OUT LOUD!) for $45. And that's not a sale price, folks. If your system is of high enough caliber to run these games, it should have either come with a DVD drive, or you should have bought one when you built it. A combo DVD-ROM/CDRW drive shouldn't run you over $60. (It will at Staples, though.) I paid that for one over a year ago.

It's time to upgrade now if you haven't yet. Just imagine. No more "Oh, I HAVE to buy the CD version because I was too cheap awhile back." Instead, you'll be saying: "Sweet, my first DVD is Half-Life 2!" And soon enough you'll be saying, "Whoa, my computer monitor is far better for watching DVDs than my 19 inch Walmart special television!"

As far as media longevity, I have this to say. Stop storing your media outside the proper cases! If you've got a problem with piles of discs lying around, then get cases, and a shelf or box for your cases to sit in, and keep that by/on/under your computer desk. Don't use those awful sleeves or books for storage, either, because they contact the disc surface. If you don't think it matters, why is there an ISO standard (18925) for disc storage? There is no difference between the media's protective surface in either technology, so they are equally easy to scratch, break and gouge. If your drive can't read a scratched disc, then your drive is bad. I have DVDs that are as old as purchasable DVDs can be, and they have not degraded one bit due to age.

Who wants to go to the store, and have to buy the CD version because the DVD version is sold out and nobody thus far has purchased the CD version? Not me. It's almost happened.

Remember floppies? Must we go through the same thing again? Please insert Disc 6 to continue!
Re:CDS?!? by Fred+Or+Alive · 2004-11-12 07:17 · Score: 1

Isn't the PS2's DVD drive supposed to be notoriously bad though? (At least in early models)[1] That could be part of the problem as well...

[1] Then again my mate has a launch-day PAL model that still works perfectly.

--
10 PRINT "LOOK AROUND YOU "; 20 GOTO 10
Re:CDS?!? by EnronHaliburton2004 · 2004-11-12 07:33 · Score: 1

I heard that it's because Americans would have trouble if they sold just DVDs.

That has to be one of the dumbest anti-American rants I've ever read. Somehow, I think you posted just so you could snipe at America...

What's your point?

--
94% of Repubs and 21% of Dems voted to renew the Patriot Act
Re:CDS?!? by vhold · 2004-11-12 07:40 · Score: 1

I'm going to have to agree, I don't really mind having to install with 4 cds once.. but I do mind:

Games that are so cheap all the cds come in crappy paper sleeves. Now they're all scattered, or I have to put them in one of those annoying cd organizers.. ugh.

Games that come in poorly manufactured 4 CD case things where all the little holding tabs break off constantly. What the heck? These things -always- break off, then the cds slip out of place in such a way that when you open the container they could slide into the joint and get busted if you aren't careful..

DVD cases are so much nicer then CD cases, I've never had one break, compared to the 40 or so CD cases I've accidently snapped one of the various little plastic bits on. They can fit some -fairly- beefy manuals (by today's standards) in with the game. Most PC games are so backwards that thy contain the DVD case size manual next to a CD case?

So I think if PC games just came in DVD cases even if they were CDs, I think I'd be happy....... erhmmm.
Re:CDS?!? by Sancho · 2004-11-12 07:42 · Score: 1

A similar argument was made when CDs were just coming out. Of course, the gap in data size was much larger then, but with the prices of DVD drives these days, there's little excuse not to pick one up next time you need an optical drive or the next time you buy/build a computer. A nice incentive would be if games started coming out on DVD (more).
Re:CDS?!? by Babbster · 2004-11-12 07:59 · Score: 1

I don't have a problem with the idea of requiring people to have DVD-ROM - frankly, it's past due. My biggest reason has less to do with the inconvenience of disc swapping during install (though obviating that need is delicious) and more to do with the fact that if disc 4/6 goes wonky then I'm SOL when I go to install a game. But, I have to take some small issue with this:
As far as media longevity, I have this to say. Stop storing your media outside the proper cases!
It's not very helpful when so many PC games come with no cases at all. My copy of Half-Life (with all the expansions), for example, came in a bunch of paper sleeves. You know, because Half-Life didn't make enough money to pay for CD cases. Even the evil companies of the RIAA spring for a CD case for their crappy $2.99 compilation CDs.
Re:CDS?!? by macrom · 2004-11-12 08:03 · Score: 1

Remember floppies? Must we go through the same thing again? Please insert Disc 6 to continue!

I remember hefting a game at the store and having it weigh 16 pounds because of all the floppy disks inside. I think the last huge game that I bought on a floppy was a Star Trek 25th Anniversary game, and I remember that coming on 20-some disks.

We are certainly heading down that path now with CDs, though they weigh far less. CD drives were outlandishly expensive and scarce when games like 7th Guest and Myst came out and both of them managed to break sales records. If companies were to ship games on DVD only then it would drive the technological stragglers to catch up with the times.

What really blows my mind is when games that require huge machines (like HL2) come out only on CD with the premise that not everyone has a DVD drive. If you can go out and purchase a P4 with a Radeon 9800 but can't go to Fry's to get a $20 BTC DVD drive on special, then there is something seriously wrong with your purchasing priorities. :^)
Re:CDS?!? by Severious · 2004-11-12 08:07 · Score: 1

Who has a 200$ videocard to play Half Life 2, Doom III, or Unreal 2004 yet does not have a 15$ DVD ROM. I have been complaining about this for years, at least some games are starting to release DVD versions, I know Unreal 2004 did, but you had to wait an extra few weeks for it.

--
Tinfoil hat? Naa, I long since replaced it with a reinforced titanium alloy.
Re:CDS?!? by UWC · 2004-11-12 08:08 · Score: 1

So I think if PC games just came in DVD cases even if they were CDs, I think I'd be happy

Max Payne came in such a case, inside one of the small form factor PC game boxes. I forget if the manual was in that case.

Max Payne 2 came on 2 CDs. Its entire package was one of those cardboard jacket type deals where the case slides out and unfolds into 3 or so segments.

Those are the only two games I have that came in DVD-size cases. Others come in various types of jewel cases, or cardboard or paper sleeves. Most recently it seems to be the annoying multidisc jewel cases unless there are more than 4 discs.

Interestingly enough, the only DVD-based PC game I have (I still need to get the UT2004 DVD version) is Metal Gear Solid 2: Substance from (I think) early 2003. It's in a completely transparent jewel case with no art, inserts, or anything.

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Honor Among Slackers. A veri
Re:CDS?!? by MindStalker · 2004-11-12 08:08 · Score: 2, Interesting

Ok, but I'd love to see the breakdown of people with good enough graphics cards to play this, and yet don't have a DVD player. Even better what was Doom3's excuse?
Re:CDS?!? by HAKdragon · 2004-11-12 08:13 · Score: 2, Interesting

The original PS2 DVD laser crapped out pretty early on for many users. As did the laser on the original Playstations. It seems Sony refuses to put a decent laser in their system until after the systems have good market penetration. It makes me feel sorry about anybody who's buying a PSP at launch. For those who are wondering, this isn't an anti-Sony rant, I have both a Playstation and a PS2, both of which work fine, but there have bene large numbers of units who have had problems with their disc drives.

--
"Our opponent is an alien starship packed with atomic bombs. We have a protractor."
Re:CDS?!? by KDR_11k · 2004-11-12 08:31 · Score: 1

With DVDs less discs and therefore less cases are required, making companies more likely to include enough cases. Well, at least I hope so.

--
Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
Re:CDS?!? by KDR_11k · 2004-11-12 08:36 · Score: 1

Or you could have gotten the Collector's Edition of UT2004 which was available immediately and came with a headset and a tutorial DVD that supposedly taught you to make mods (IMHO it did a really bad job, teaching you very litle but still managing to throw in bad practice).

--
Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
Re:CDS?!? by Poseidon88 · 2004-11-12 08:36 · Score: 1

I don't have a DVD drive. I've been incrementally upgrading the same computer since 1995, and I've just never felt I had enough use for one that I should buy it. I'll admit that it's starting to get annoying with most games coming on 3 or more CDs these days (Far Cry came on 5!!!), but HL2 isn't a very good game to make your point with, as you can buy and download it through Steam and not even have to deal with discs of any sort.
Re:CDS?!? by irc.goatse.cx+troll · 2004-11-12 10:04 · Score: 1

Someone who doesnt own any DVDs?

--
Pain lasts, kid. Its how you know you're alive. Sometimes I think this growing up thing is just pain management-TheMaxx
Re:CDS?!? by Shinglor · 2004-11-12 10:49 · Score: 1

And with UT2004 and other games you get charged for special edition crap that you don't want just so you can get the game on DVD.

Not only are multiple discs annoying but CDs are very slow compared to DVDs. A 16X DVD drive is the same speed at 142X CD drive!
Re:CDS?!? by Reapman · 2004-11-12 11:29 · Score: 1

Don't mean this as a troll or anything but... This is probably one of the contributing factors to the lack of developer support for the PC platform for gaming. On my console, I can pop in a DVD disc and away I go. No disc swapping, no trying to reduce video quality so it will fit on a CD. Heck, next gen consoles are already looking at higher storage mediums then DVD, while PC's are using the floppy disc of the 21st century. If the same people that say DVD discs are unnecessary won out back in the days the CD was making a break through... *shudder* progress is good... spend the $30 and buy a drive
Re:CDS?!? by mrseigen · 2004-11-12 11:31 · Score: 1

Don't count on the "market penetration" bit; their new smaller PStwo units also have disc drive failures similar to the standard units.
Re:CDS?!? by jimi+the+hippie · 2004-11-12 11:39 · Score: 1

"games that require huge machines (like HL2) come out only on CD"

Actually, HL2 will be sold on CD or DVD. It's up to the user.
Re:CDS?!? by Blakey+Rat · 2004-11-12 12:26 · Score: 1

Interestingly, the new Myst game, Myst IV requires a DVD drive to run and it isn't selling all that well from what I've heard.

Me? I'll buy a DVD-ROM when my CD-ROM drives stop working. They're both only about a year and a half old and they work fine and, as of yet, there's nothing out there I want that's on DVD-only except Myst IV... and I can live without Myst IV.

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Comment of the year
Re:CDS?!? by PyroMosh · 2004-11-12 13:22 · Score: 1

I sell PCs for a living now. What amazes me is that when CD-ROMS came out, people got that they weren't just for music. That you could have music or data on a CD.

People do not make this connection with DVDs.

When I present a computer to someone in my store, 9 times out of 10 when I point out the DVD drive or DVD burner, people ask "Ohh.... is that so I can watch movies?" or "Ohhhh... well what do I need that for, I don't want to record movies..." or similar expressions (sometimes they simply need me to explain what a DVD is, as they seem to not have ever heard of them / have no idea that it's not the same as a CD.).

For the life of me, I can't figure out why people accepted CDs as vessles for data so easily, and yet they don't get that DVDs are the same thing. I think that if I tried to explain the concept of DVD audio, that it would cause some kind of brain hemorrhaging.

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Touch everywhere, even when inappropriate.
Re:CDS?!? by shufler · 2004-11-12 15:27 · Score: 1

You can probably pick up a DVD-ROM for $30. In fact, now that I think about it, I don't think I've seen one for sale in a long time. A lot of CD burners seem to have DVD reading capabilities, and most DVD burners are well under $100.

I picked up a spindle of 100 DVDs for $8 a month or so ago during an in-store promotion at one of the local computer store chains. Yes, EIGHT dollars. I think I picked up a spindle of 100 CDs at the smae time, for more like $15 or so, but I only use CDs to burn audio for full-length albums.
Re:CDS?!? by shufler · 2004-11-12 15:30 · Score: 1

Weird. I bought the HL Platinum Collection, and each came can in its own jewel case.

In fact, every game I have ever bought in a box, has had the game held within a jewel case inside, with TWO exceptions: Mafia, and Starsky and Hutch. I feel the reasoning in both cases was to save money, sincle clearly, both were very cheap productions (that's not to say Mafia wasn't a great game. S&H was sub-par, especially since the default controls had you driving your car with the arrow keys, and SHOOTING A GUN with your mouse)
Re:CDS?!? by Babbster · 2004-11-12 15:36 · Score: 1

I don't buy many PC games anymore (three consoles and a nice TV makes upgrading my PC low on the priority list), but my Half-Life Platinum (purchased about three months ago) came in paper sleeves, Neverwinter Nights came in sleeves, Freelancer came in a cardboard sleeve. The only PC game I've bought recently that included a jewel case was The Sims 2 - I think EA is a company that still includes cases, generally.
Re:CDS?!? by Mycroft_VIII · 2004-11-12 17:45 · Score: 1

No kidding prices on dvd burners are dropping like a rock lately. My dual layer burner (lite on) was $78, Though it was marked on the shelf for $108.
Still I rarely have use to burn a single layer dvd.
Games that come on 3+ cd's should be at least offered on dvd as well.

Mycroft

--
https://signup.leagueoflegends.com/?ref=4c3ed6600b6ea
Re:CDS?!? by MayonakaHa · 2004-11-12 17:56 · Score: 1

I think this is mainly because more ignorant (not meant as an insult, meant as lack of knowledge in the area) are buying computers and not learning what they can do. There's a bit of a reason for that too. Even just a few years ago the price difference between a low end computer with a cd-rom (and later, cd-r/rw) and one that has a dvd-rom is enormous! Less people could afford the price so they tended to check it out first, they wanted to know what they were spending their money on and what it could do, plus a good deal of them were computer geeks anyways.
Nowadays Joe Sixpack doesn't even have to spend half his paycheck to buy a computer, so he does. Even though he has absolutely no clue what he can do with it! He just buys it because "everybody has one" and "cause I 'need' to get on the intarweb".
Re:CDS?!? by Mycroft_VIII · 2004-11-12 17:59 · Score: 1

I got the dvd version of enter the matrix. First time I saw it, it was 19.99 while the cd version was 29.99 (clearly labled on the box, stickers had 'dvd ver' or 'cd ver' and 19.99 or 29.99 on it) but had already spent to much and my friend had it on his xbox anyway so I didn't get eigther.
Next week the prices had reversed.
Next week they were both 17.99 so I went ahead and bought it.
I think less comes out on DVD because the game companies can't figure out to charge more for the version on the better tech, or charge more for the version that cost more to make (since both dvd's and cd's cost the same to stamp out). And rather than decide they just give up in total confusion and indecision.

Mycroft

--
https://signup.leagueoflegends.com/?ref=4c3ed6600b6ea
Re:CDS?!? by bhtooefr · 2004-11-12 22:37 · Score: 1

Of course, what about us who have laptops that weren't purchased by us, and the person who ordered it didn't order a CD-RW/DVD (like requested)? Oh, and this model has a non-removable optical drive. (It's a Dell Uninspiron 1100)
Re:CDS?!? by lav-chan · 2004-11-13 01:19 · Score: 1

Maybe you missed where he said '[/troll]'. As if he were emulating a troll!
Re:CDS?!? by junkgrep · 2004-11-13 05:18 · Score: 1

We America, vote good! ha ha! Vote DVD2004, big joke! Now where my lardcake...
Re:CDS?!? by Sunspire · 2004-11-13 06:52 · Score: 1

I think the point was that Half Life 2 is only being sold on DVD in Europe for example, and this is pretty much the trend for all recent games, i.e. you can't even get the CD versions anymore. Why is that? Clearly there is some reason no publisher is willing to risk DVD games in the states.

--
It's like deja vu all over again.
Re:CDS?!? by aiyo · 2004-11-13 07:04 · Score: 1

Well if HL2 is being released on both formats there is only one way to let Valve know you want games on DVD from now on: with your wallet.
Re:CDS?!? by EnronHaliburton2004 · 2004-11-13 07:55 · Score: 1

It's a dumb troll though... usually you should troll to make people think a bit-- it's why I have this account...

--
94% of Repubs and 21% of Dems voted to renew the Patriot Act
Re:CDS?!? by F34nor · 2004-11-13 08:17 · Score: 1

I got the HL P and they came in envelopes.
Re:CDS?!? by CronoCloud · 2004-11-13 12:54 · Score: 1

When CD first came out there were articles in mainstream magazines about it could not only hold music but computer data. ie how one could put a whole encyclopedia on one.

When DVD appeared that didn't happen, even the name of the disc in consumers eyes (Digital Video Disc) implies that it's a video storage medium. In ads for PC's a DVD drive is mentioned as "letting you watch or burn movies" rather than letting one store lots of data or installing software with only one disc.
Re:CDS?!? by CronoCloud · 2004-11-13 14:01 · Score: 1

When I first heard that the Playstation 2 would be DVD based I cheered. No more mulitdisc Square RPG's, They could slap the whole thing on one disc.

What's even more amazing is that Sony actually thought about putting the newly invented DVD drive in their original Playstation. They went with a CD drive for cost reasons.

This is by u-238 · 2004-11-12 06:35 · Score: 1

the result of some unresponsable assistant manager, nothing more. Like the rest have stated, he's going to have to wait until the 16th to create a hl2-accessable steam id, simple as that.

Radeon, eh? by wizbit · 2004-11-12 06:35 · Score: 3, Insightful

He's sporting a "Radeon X800" from the looks of the pamphlet next to the keyboard in the second pic. Which reminds me: I heard somewhere that ATI's are relatively bad gamer cards and was wondering, what with D3 and HL2 around, what are the gamers using these days?

Re:Radeon, eh? by RealityMogul · 2004-11-12 06:50 · Score: 1

I got a Radeon 9700 Pro. Works great on high settings in both Doom 3 and FarCry. I would expect it would run HL2 reasonably well also.
Re:Radeon, eh? by djdanlib · 2004-11-12 06:51 · Score: 1

I don't know who told you that, but there haven't been any differences that a gamer would care about between ATI's and NVidia's offerings since the Radeon 9200/GeForce 5200 series a few years ago.

If you're in the market, my advice would be to check reviews on cards in your price range from both brands, from multiple sources. You just can't trust an NVidia or ATI fanboy to provide accurate data, so the only way to get that is to read around.
Re:Radeon, eh? by Mr.+Sketch · 2004-11-12 07:04 · Score: 1

Slightly OT: But ATI just released new linux drivers that work with Doom 3, and according to the ID website, ATI cards are now supported with the new driver. I just played the demo through with the new drivers without a hitch.

--
Things you think are in the Constitution, but are not.
Re:Radeon, eh? by DeadBugs · 2004-11-12 08:35 · Score: 1

Right now most gamers are buying the NVIDIA 6800 series video cards. The performance between the top end ATI and NVIDIA cards are close on DirectX 9 games. However ,the 6800 series offers support for DirectX 9.0C and Shader Model 3.0, while ATI does not. The NVIDIA drivers offer better support for OpenGL (Doom3) and for Linux. And if you are rich and want the fastest on the planet you can use "SLI" to run dual 6800's

Not to mention a lot of the 6800 cards come with the game Far Cry which is one of the best games released in the last year or so.

--
http://www.kubuntu.org/
Re:Radeon, eh? by ThetaPi · 2004-11-12 10:11 · Score: 1

I'm using a Radeon 9800 Pro.

I was in the market for a new card a few months back and was able to pick it up at nearly half price. I thought it was a good deal to pick up a ~$270 card for $160 after tax.

--
"When God kisses Satan and the Incarnations applaud." "Death is dead. Long live Death!"

Best Buy? by dshaw858 · 2004-11-12 06:39 · Score: 1

Didn't something like this happen with Best Buy a little while ago? I don't remember if it was HL2 or something else (probably something else). Man, stores need to start paying attention to things!

- dshaw

Re:Best Buy? by Fade_to_Blah · 2004-11-12 06:52 · Score: 1

I think it was Doom 3....I remember reading a story somewhere (could have been here on /.) about Best Buy selling Doom 3 before it was released.

Sure enough, I tried the two local best buy with no such luck:(

Either by Nomihn0 · 2004-11-12 06:42 · Score: 4, Insightful

Gamers are using both ATI and nVidia cards, in nearly equal numbers (if I recall the Valve survey correctly). To be honest, the two companies are competing to be the most powerful for brand recognition, not for use. As much as I want one for status, and I'll readily admit this, I do not need an nVidia 6800 sucking down electricity as fast as Homer eats donuts. I'm not running predictive weather simulations on my graphics card.

If you want to have a reasonably priced, competitive, computer system for gaming, you're going to have to do some research. You'll have to see whether the specific game you want to play runs better with nVidia or ATI drivers, you'll have to determine which midrange card is cheaper, and you'll have to decide between a cheap 256mb card or a speedy 128mb one (both bus and GPU speed). There are so many marketing ploys in effect right now, it's difficult to do a good job. Regardless of what you do, somebody will criticise you. I presonally use an nVidia card. [flames below]

Re:Either by u-238 · 2004-11-12 06:52 · Score: 1

For the enthusiast, and there are a great many of them out there, the nVidia 6800 is in fact not enough. Even that, one of the most state of the art gfx cards available, cannot run full performance (e.g. 100fps constant) at full graphical (e.g. FSAA etc.) settings without significant performance drops.
Re:Either by vhold · 2004-11-12 07:23 · Score: 1

That's not justification to say that it's not enough. The game still looks and runs great at all sorts of settings. The game is just designed to grow into the future some, which is one of the great things in PC gaming.
Re:Either by SansTinfoilHat · 2004-11-12 07:30 · Score: 1

If you want to have a reasonably priced, competitive, computer system for gaming, you're going to have to do some research. You'll have to see whether the specific game you want to play runs better with nVidia or ATI drivers, you'll have to determine which midrange card is cheaper, and you'll have to decide between a cheap 256mb card or a speedy 128mb one (both bus and GPU speed).

And people wonder why console gaming is so popular...
Re:Either by Fweeky · 2004-11-12 08:15 · Score: 1

Ergo the 6800 isn't enough to play HL2 (or mods which are doubtless going to be somewhat less optimized) at the settings some people desire. What's justification if not that?

This is why there's a market for SLI, and even more insanely powerful hardware :)
Re:Either by Flunitrazepam · 2004-11-12 10:43 · Score: 1

Or if you don't have the time to do all the research, word has it that it is pretty safe to trust the guides at anandtech.

I think their Overclocked System Guide is especially handy if you want to get the most bang for your money. Although it hasn't been updated in over a month, which is rare.

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1) Your analysis is based on bad assumptions so your result is way off. 2) You're a sick bastard for fucking a horse.
Re:Either by kyhwana · 2004-11-12 17:27 · Score: 1

I beleive in the steam hardware survey, the most used card/GPU is a nvidia geforce4 mx 4x0.
Which is pretty crappy these days.

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My email addy? should be easy enough.
Re:Either by j.bellone · 2004-11-13 03:59 · Score: 1

Neither is the X800; performance tests show that the 6800 outperforms the X800 in the only Source game we have avaiable right now (Counter-Strike).

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I'm f#$king magic!

Guy I know on IRC got an early copy ... by oldosadmin · 2004-11-12 06:50 · Score: 3, Interesting

http://forum.oldos.org/viewtopic.php?t=2318

Apparently someone he knew saw them on the shelf and called him, he bought it, the registration wouldn't work, and he got that email.

Yet another reason to hate activation.

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Jay | http://oldos.org

Re:Guy I know on IRC got an early copy ... by doodzed · 2004-11-12 07:32 · Score: 1

I heard somewhere that once stores started selling it, those of us that bought it via steam would get it activated.

This is a contractual matter between vivendi and valve. If it was up to valve, it would have been activated after it cleared QA.

Anyway.... this is all thirdhand.... but I might be skipping the kegger, my friend's band and possible date tonight to play HL2 if they do decide they can activate it.

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It's not the size of your stack that matters, it's how you push and pop
Re:Guy I know on IRC got an early copy ... by junkgrep · 2004-11-12 15:33 · Score: 1

That was a rumor started by... what else: crazy overzealous fans. They aren't going to let one or two stores screwing up mess up their worldwide distribution plan.
Re:Guy I know on IRC got an early copy ... by Slothy · 2004-11-13 05:41 · Score: 1

Except Activision isn't publishing Half Life 2. Vivendi is.
Re:Guy I know on IRC got an early copy ... by Talrias · 2004-11-13 08:23 · Score: 1

He said activation not Activision. :)

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aterr - an open source threaded discussion board.
Re:Guy I know on IRC got an early copy ... by Slothy · 2004-11-13 08:58 · Score: 1

Doh.

I guess working for Activision makes me read things :)

Who cares... by JavaLord · 2004-11-12 06:50 · Score: 3, Interesting

Despite being clearly marked, numerous stores have begun selling HL2.

It says not to display them, not to avoid selling them to the people who pre-ordered. It makes no difference since they can't play anyway.

This guy even got a phone call from EB telling him to pickup his pre-order, so he did what any one would do - He picked it up.

It makes sense, why not sell them to the pre-order people now, then on the games release day you don't run into the issue of having the game on hand but not being able to sell x amount of copies to the people that didn't pre-order.

If they can't play the game anyway, what difference do the physical CD's make?

Re:Who cares... by Baikala · 2004-11-12 07:32 · Score: 1

You can take a picture of the boxand cd's and get posted on /.

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16,777,216 comments ought to be enough for any forum!
Re:Who cares... by j.bellone · 2004-11-13 00:52 · Score: 1

It does matter, to Valve at least. They could be losing a potential sale on Steam. Which is why the said, if there is a major break on the street date, they will release it on Steam early as well.

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I'm f#$king magic!

Marketing Ploy? by Deluxe_247 · 2004-11-12 06:52 · Score: 1

it was mentioned I believe in the Steam Forums (or possibly another of the 5billions places this story was posted) that this might not be such a 'foul up' as originally thought. HL2 has been marketed mostly by word of mouth and videos on the web.. Everyone with a video card worth over 100$ knwos about this game 'somehow' so a hard marketing drive hasn't been needed... But consider the way Steam works and the set up where even if you buy retail, you still have to authenticate through the system... This ensures NOBODY can play before the official release date (short of hacking the authentication) - so who cares if its sold early or not? The ONLY thing that is going to happen is more people are going to buy the game by the 'release date'.. And considering this is now being posted on every gaming or semi-informational tech website, think of all the free publicity! I think EVERYONE who knows ANYTHING about this type of game has been somehow reached and is ready to shell out their 50+ hard earned bucks to pick up a copy. This seems like a final quick push to grab a couple extra sales.. (Or of course, it could be that Best Buy are a bunch of idiots and just plain didn't bother to look at the release dates) =)

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Its Deluxe, son. Deluxe!

Re:Future Slashdot headline: Sierra/Value sue EB by superpulpsicle · 2004-11-12 06:55 · Score: 1

I just called 4 EBgames around me, and not one of them had it. If anything they all confirmed it was redated to Nov 16th.

Would it be ethical to use a crack on this? by LordJezo · 2004-11-12 06:57 · Score: 1

Once a crack is released would it be ethical to use it in order to start playing the game?

You spend your hard earned money on software and you are not even allowed to play it..

Re:Would it be ethical to use a crack on this? by Deluxe_247 · 2004-11-12 07:03 · Score: 1

I'd say no - Technically it wasn't proper for the vendors to sell the copies of HL2 until the 16th. Thats why the authentication is in place to begin with. Cracking the Authentication, even though you have purchased the retail copy, is still unethical.. "Two wrongs don't make a right" probably fits...

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Its Deluxe, son. Deluxe!
Re:Would it be ethical to use a crack on this? by NextWish · 2004-11-12 07:22 · Score: 3, Funny

By the time one's out? Hell there's already three of them out!

Half.Life.2.NOCD.CRACK-RELOADED
Half_Life_2_Cra ck-VENGEANCE
Half.Life.2.CRACKFIX-LuZiFeR

The only question which remains unanswered is which one installs the best backdoor.
Re:Would it be ethical to use a crack on this? by Baikala · 2004-11-12 08:02 · Score: 1

Half Life 2 is a "NO CD" game straight out the box.
The authentification is online and has nothing to do with cds. I know there should be some preatty good crackers out there working on some of this sold-early copies but so far all the game cracking they have done was just figure out witch of the 6 or so cd auth. methods is been used and debug (trace) the code until they can found the callback function for the (usually) thirth party auth, dll.

This is a whole diferent scheme, I dont say it would be imposible to crack, for valve to claim that would be only an ecouragement for the really really good hackers that work out of love for challenge to solve the auth method sooner, but beating piracy for a few weeks is a major advance in my book.

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16,777,216 comments ought to be enough for any forum!
Re:Would it be ethical to use a crack on this? by irc.goatse.cx+troll · 2004-11-12 08:22 · Score: 2, Informative

Oh, its already been cracked months ago. Valve even did it for us, really. The HL SDK comes with a local steam client/server for debugging your mods. Its how you could play cs:s, cz, or any of the other leaked copies of hl.

You could play online through a bug in steam, but its nothing valve couldnt fix. Basicly, you'd create a new steam account with no games attached, try to register for Condition Zero saying you already own the boxed game, give them a keygenned key, then kill steam.exe after it starts to auth but before it gets denied. then you use that steam cookie to get into cz servers or even CS:S.

Probably still works.

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Pain lasts, kid. Its how you know you're alive. Sometimes I think this growing up thing is just pain management-TheMaxx
Re:Would it be ethical to use a crack on this? by Flunitrazepam · 2004-11-12 10:53 · Score: 2, Funny

I just wanted to respond to your post in order to finally mate our .sigs

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1) Your analysis is based on bad assumptions so your result is way off. 2) You're a sick bastard for fucking a horse.

Re:Can't play without Valve authentication by bonzoesc · 2004-11-12 07:03 · Score: 1

Actually, I heard that you can play the retail version just by setting your clock forward to the 16th, but I can't verify this because the Steam version is encrypted.

What's the big deal by Matt+Perry · 2004-11-12 07:13 · Score: 3, Insightful

Why the big deal over release dates? Why ship the product and then tell them to hold it until the 16th? What is that supposed to accomplish anyway?

This isn't a troll, I'm just wondering what the motivation is behind companies doing that.

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Slashdot: Failed Car Analogies. Amateur Lawyering. Anecdote Battles.

Re:What's the big deal by Zed2K · 2004-11-12 07:35 · Score: 2, Informative

From what I understand the main reason is that it gives all stores a fair chance to sell it on the same day. The big stores get way more copies than the small stores and usually send their own trucks to pick up the copies for bigger games. If the big stores started selling it as soon as they got it it would hurt the smaller stores.
Re:What's the big deal by fireduck · 2004-11-12 08:07 · Score: 1

the idea behind simultaneous worldwide release is to combat piracy. i didn't really give it a thought until around the time Alpha Centauri was coming out, and was reading the forums regarding the worldwide release (and how SE Asia was a hotbed of pirated games owing mainly to much delayed release times). Game comes out, pirates immediately start selling copies in regions that don't get official release for weeks/months later. Seriously cuts into profit margin of company. Thus, the push to release the game at the same time worldwide. Yes, it won't stop all piracy, but it will stop the fan (who isn't normally inclined to break the law) from buying the $5 copy of the game, when an actual retail version is available.
Re:What's the big deal by Chyeld · 2004-11-12 08:24 · Score: 5, Informative

If you want your product to be carried in the big stores, they want something in return. If you are a big store, you might be able to bully your way into releasing the product in your stores earlier than other stores. Thus, driving sales to you. However, if you go and sign such a deal, you have a much harder time getting into the other stores, since obviously they can't release it earlier and since the people who really want the product will have gotten it from the one that released it early.

As a result, most of the time everyone has the same release date. Not only does this keep the smaller stores from just saying 'forget it, we won't be able to sell any' and still give the big stores a date to promote.

The reason these things are shipped so early, is that the date needs to be far enough ahead of the ship date to help clear up any shipping screwups. Otherwise, if something goes wrong and one store is left out on release date, they aren't going to be as willing to carry your games in the future.

The store agree to this for the same reason, if you don't agree to stick to the release date, then the product won't be shipped to you till the last minute. If something happens then, you've missed your best selling opportunity and probably lost a few customers to the stores that were carrying it.

This sort of scheme is used for pretty much any product that has a 'shelf-life' in terms of demand. You aren't going to ever see any release day parties for the newest version of the Swifter Jet Dry Rhomba Auto Mop, because it'll still be selling (or not) until the end of it's product life. But things like music, movies, games, and even (to a limited extent) books, all are considered to sell most of what they are going to sell in a short period right after they come out.
Re:What's the big deal by Poseidon88 · 2004-11-12 08:41 · Score: 1

This is part of it, but I also think a big part of the decision to release HL2 worldwide simultaneously has to do with Vivendi Universal's lawsuit against Valve. If they don't release the game in, say, Europe at the same time as it is released in the US, more people in Europe might be motivated to buy through Steam instead of going to the retail store. That means more lost sales for VU.
Re:What's the big deal by T-Ranger · 2004-11-12 08:52 · Score: 1

Maby what they should do is have each computer sold have a "region" code burnt into it... shit; nevermind
Re:What's the big deal by XellDx · 2004-11-12 15:10 · Score: 1

The reason these things are shipped so early, is that the date needs to be far enough ahead of the ship date to help clear up any shipping screwups.

See also: Games released by Square-Enix (Aka Chains of Promathia which we got 3 weeks later than the other continents)

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X

Seems fair by Klowner · 2004-11-12 07:16 · Score: 4, Funny

If you're keeping score, if anyone has broken a release date, it would be Valve (3 or 4 times at least now).

VALVe Responds, EBGame's employee's fired. by NextWish · 2004-11-12 07:17 · Score: 5, Informative

VALVe Responds http://img120.exs.cx/img120/4149/hl2receipt.jpg

Hello, We noticed that you just registered a Half-Life 2 key. Where did you come across a copy of the game? You're not in trouble or anything, but you're registered pretty early, and the game isn't activated just yet. Thanks, Erik Johnson Valve

EBGames Employee's Fired

In an E-Mail sent to all EBGames associates, the president of EBGames has stated that the persons who broke the street date at their stores have been terminated. As well, should anyone else break the street date the employee, manager, and district manager will all be held responsible. The e-mail was sent yesterday at aprox 5:30 PM EST.

Re:VALVe Responds, EBGame's employee's fired. by mykingdomforahorse · 2004-11-12 07:41 · Score: 1

those are some uuuugly feet. yech.
Re:VALVe Responds, EBGame's employee's fired. by gothzilla · 2004-11-12 09:08 · Score: 1

Of course, http://img120.exs.cx/img120/4149/hl2receipt.jpg is a Best Buy receipt.
I always screw up the usage of the word "irony." If I used it now would I be screwing it up again? :)
Re:VALVe Responds, EBGame's employee's fired. by SySOvErRiDe · 2004-11-12 12:29 · Score: 1

persons who broke the street date at their stores have been terminated. poor guy
Re:VALVe Responds, EBGame's employee's fired. by scaife · 2004-11-13 07:40 · Score: 1

That number in the top right of that Best Buy receipt is the employee number of the person who checked that out. I wonder how that Best Buy store would like to know that their employees are breaking release dates.

Re:Can't play without Valve authentication by Yablo · 2004-11-12 07:17 · Score: 1

Oh bonzo, you card!

And why are there so few posts? by Lord+Bitman · 2004-11-12 07:19 · Score: 1

Everyone is running around to all their local EBs, of course

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-- 'The' Lord and Master Bitman On High, Master Of All

Another example as to why release dates are stupid by Mean_Nishka · 2004-11-12 07:43 · Score: 2, Insightful

Seriously, what's the point? They drive such a demand for the product that they pratically create a market for pirated and jumped release dates.

I think Valve's STEAM distribution system is going to revolutionize the industry much like iTunes is doing for music. It's a shame they couldn't let HL2 out quicker

Companies can release the day they go gold to pre-empt the pirates (you can pay to get it quicker), and it will ultimately allow smaller studios to regain their foothold in the industry.

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www.lonseidman.com

Mo Hype Mo Money! by blueZhift · 2004-11-12 07:45 · Score: 2, Interesting

All of this hype is just getting me high! Given that you can't play the game until the 16th because of the online activation, the broken date doesn't cost Valve anything. Now there will be yet another story in the mainstream media about Half Life 2, and if the story about the fired EB employee is true, then they may even get a little TV time. All of this marketing without spending a dime!

Now, I don't have any proof that this is all intentional, and it probably isn't. But the guys at Valve must be pretty happy with all of the attention. In our strange twisted world, I could see a class action lawsuit on behalf of HL2 pirates demanding a piece of the profits for all of the free publicity and promotion they've been doing!

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To the making of books there is no end, so let's get started

Re:Mo Hype Mo Money! by Jherico · 2004-11-12 08:43 · Score: 2

the broken date doesn't cost Valve anything
It costs Valve goodwill and credibility. I'm sure there are numerous people going into a store and purchasing the game with no foreknowledge of the official release date or that they won't be able to take it home and start playing. When they discovered that they've just paid a chunk of change for nothing (at least nothing for this weekend) its going to piss them off. I know it would piss me off. When I bought the game on steam I was still working under the assumption that I'd be able to play it as soon as it was 'done'. Done to me means when they finish making it, not when Vivendi deigns to allow us to play. I've already purchased this game and there's no way I can undo the transaction, but this will be the last game I buy from Valve. Between this and the original Sep 30/03 release date they promised and then didn't comment on when it passed, they've used up all their goodwill.

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Jherico
What can the average user can do to ensure his security? "Nothing, you're screwed"
Re:Mo Hype Mo Money! by junkgrep · 2004-11-12 15:31 · Score: 1

Geez, gamers today have like, the biggest sense of entitlement I've ever seen. Whatever you desire, little prince!
Re:Mo Hype Mo Money! by Mycroft_VIII · 2004-11-12 18:17 · Score: 1

What you don't think he's entitled to what he payed for?
He paid for a game that was do to be done by a certain date and got NOTHING, not even an apology for the delay.
Course it's possible you were joking, in which case I've missed it completely.

Mycroft

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https://signup.leagueoflegends.com/?ref=4c3ed6600b6ea

Re:What the bloody mother fucking fuckshit? by Lord+Bitman · 2004-11-12 08:07 · Score: 1

"two wrongs don't make a right" probably requires that at least one of those wrongs be defined as wrong in a universe which isnt completely fucking insane.
A customer sees a game he wants, so he purchases it. That is RIGHT.
A customer sees that he can't play the game he just spent money on, so he finds a way to play that thing which he currently owns. That is RIGHT.

Bypassing broken copy protection is always okay and can never be unethical. Any protection system which does not let you play even though you spent money on a real copy is broken.

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-- 'The' Lord and Master Bitman On High, Master Of All

Re:Can't play without Valve authentication by rsmith-mac · 2004-11-12 08:13 · Score: 3, Insightful

I'm sort of torn on the whole issue. On the one hand, The Inq is spot-on that it's cool that Valve has found a way to make sure that everyone can be the first guy to play the game, and that it's not leaked ahead of time, but on the flip side, I'm not comfortable with this level of control. Who is Valve to say that I, a customer who shelled out $55+ for their game, can not play it until they say so, even though they already have my money and I have their software? When I put down that kind of money for a AAA title, I don't think it's unreasonable that I should be able to play it offline how I want, when I want, considering I've done nothing wrong unless buying a game is wrong.

Yea, Valve now has the ability to make sure everyone gets it together, but at what cost? Must I now always be a slave to them just to play an offline game that could run perfectly fine without their meddling? I'm not at all the least bit comfortable with where this is going - I should have more control over my computer and my games than this.

Re:What the bloody mother fucking fuckshit? by Deluxe_247 · 2004-11-12 08:16 · Score: 2, Interesting

It's people like you that are the problem.. Please learn to read. Problem 1) The VENDOR sold a game that was clearly marked not to be sold UNTIL 11/16/2004. (NOTICE THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE CUSTOMER BUYING IT, BUT RATHER THE VENDOR SELLING.) Problem 2) Because the VENDOR made a mistake, that does not give the purchaser a right to "HACK" the software so he can play it. The rules still stands that the game has *NOT* been officially released, and therefore should not be played. Think of it like buying software over the internet.. say Windows.. You purchased a legit copy, and its 'in the mail'.. so instead of waiting 2 days, you just go ahead and download a copy of bittorrent and use a stolen CD key and your up and running.. you DID pay for the software right? -WRONG. That's unethical and against the user agreement of the software (in most cases).. (You probably have never read one, which goes to show why you responded the way you did.) You are licensed to use the software you purchased, with the KEY you purchased.. Not any version of the software with any key you can find. And FYI - Bypassing ANY copy protection is unethical unless you have been given permission by those that have put the copy protection on the system. It doesn't matter how you THINK it should be, it's still unethical.

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Its Deluxe, son. Deluxe!

Re:What the bloody mother fucking fuckshit? by KDR_11k · 2004-11-12 09:02 · Score: 1

You're confusing unethical with illegal. All the things you mentioned there are illegal but calling them unethical is something different. E.g. I'd consider breaking a defecive copy protection as ethical but the law considers it illegal. Ethics are subjective, law is absolute (well, okay, once you include corruption law is relative).

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Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.

Re:What the bloody mother fucking fuckshit? by Zed2K · 2004-11-12 09:05 · Score: 1

If it were so black and white then there wouldn't be debates and questions over whether it was right or wrong.

Now climb down off your high horse and go get some fresh air.

Re:Can't play without Valve authentication by Ford+Prefect · 2004-11-12 09:54 · Score: 1

I'm sort of torn on the whole issue. On the one hand, The Inq is spot-on that it's cool that Valve has found a way to make sure that everyone can be the first guy to play the game

I''ll be on a PC-less business trip in Belgium and France from the 14th to the 25th, you insensitive clod!

And even when I do get back, my PC's in dire need of replacement. Argh! :-)

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Tedious Bloggy Stuff - hooray?

Re:Another example as to why release dates are stu by Lord_Dweomer · 2004-11-12 09:57 · Score: 1

"I think Valve's STEAM distribution system is going to revolutionize the industry much like iTunes is doing for music."

Thats just what I want, a system that centralizes all the mods so I have to go through Valve to get my gameplay fix, and that won't even let me play singleplayer without a friggin internet connection. I will NOT be purchasing HL2 SOLELY because of the fact that they require product activation for singleplayer.

Valve got greedy, and since people will end up buying HL2 anyway, they will only get more greedy.

Enjoy it all you want, and I hope you are looking forward to having to pay for your mods via Steam, if your comparison to iTunes holds any salt.

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Buy Steampunk Clothing Online!

Re:Another example as to why release dates are stu by Zed2K · 2004-11-12 10:31 · Score: 1

"Thats just what I want, a system that centralizes all the mods so I have to go through Valve to get my gameplay fix, and that won't even let me play singleplayer without a friggin internet connection. I will NOT be purchasing HL2 SOLELY because of the fact that they require product activation for singleplayer."

Its a ONE time activation. Just like XP which you are probably using right now. Or are you refusing to buy that also. You can't complain about internet access because you have just posted here, so you have to have access somehow. So it just boils down to you being a cheapass and not wanting to actually PAY for something. Everyone complaining about activation are probably the same people that had no intention of buying it in the first place and will just download it anyways.

No Internet? by Doley · 2004-11-12 10:58 · Score: 1

I like how valve has this all set up for their release.. but what about the people who don't have an internet connection? (God bless their souls) Are they going to shell out the 50 bucks and then come to find out that they can never play the game because they can't activate it on steam???

Re:No Internet? by Low2000 · 2004-11-12 13:34 · Score: 3, Funny

This was going to be a problem, but when they ran an on-line survey on current half-life players, they discoverd that 100% of their user base had an internet connection! Thank god for on-line surveys! (statistics are fun!)
Re:No Internet? by majid_aldo · 2004-11-13 04:34 · Score: 1

...not to mention , my connection is heavily firewalled.
HELLO VALVE!!!!!

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--- widget evolution: enhanced, plus, super, ultra, extreme, exxxtreme, ultra-extreme, ..etc.

Re:What the bloody mother fucking fuckshit? by 0racle · 2004-11-12 10:58 · Score: 1

Murder is wrong but there is no shortage of people that are willing to do it. Just because people are willing to argue, question or do things does not make it a 'grey area' of judgement. The game was not to be sold untill the 16th, when activation will be available. This keeps an even playing field for those who pre-order and those who buy online. Just because someone else did something they weren't supposed to does not mean you can crack another system because you want to. Both are wrong, and as was said, two wrongs to not make a right.

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"I use a Mac because I'm just better than you are."

Re:Future Slashdot headline: Sierra/Value sue EB by slumpy · 2004-11-12 11:02 · Score: 1

I work at EB, and we got it thursday. We've been told to tell no one we have it....oops. And a manager has supposedly been fired over it.

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http://www.commaecho.com

Is this game multiplayer only? by xplenumx · 2004-11-12 11:03 · Score: 1

Help please, for those of us who are clueless. Does this game have a single player mode - can someone without an internet connection play this game?

Re:Is this game multiplayer only? by jimi+the+hippie · 2004-11-12 11:51 · Score: 1

Yes, it has a single-player mode (30-40 hours IIRC) which should be very good. However, to play it you must activate it on Steam (through the Internet). So, no internet = no HL2, not even single player.

Re:Arghhhh! by Marc_Hawke · 2004-11-12 11:05 · Score: 2, Insightful

Look at the number of people playing CounterStike. As of several months ago, EVERYONE playing CounterStrike had a Steam Account.

Valve was really sneaky with Steam. It started as some sort of throw-away download system. Make on account, make 10 accounts, forget a password..who cares, just make another account, etc It also appeared to be a ladder system, like gamespy stats or something. It wasn't that, but appeared to be.

But it changed to a hugely risky (for the consumers part) content management, DRM, product activation system. I recently installed it. It asked what Valve games I had and if I wanted to play them. I own HL1, so I said 'Sure, I'll play that." It then said, "This CD-Key is now inextricably tied to this account. Don't lose your password or you can never pay Halflife 1 again."

It's really scary. I hope it fails...but fails in a way that they still try online content delivery.

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--Welcome to the Realm of the Hawke--

What sucks you in? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-11-12 11:16 · Score: 3, Interesting

The mystery!

There is a lot of talk about why their marketing is so brilliant, but I think we are missing the real clincher by a long shot.

What is getting so many people talking and frustrated is they know they have the damned game loaded on their machine, yet the can't play it. How often have geeks had to change settings, updated drivers, tweaked this or that on their machine to get the newest game to work?

It's so counter-intuitive for gamers to patiently wait for anything. THAT is why it is brilliant marketing. The game is so close, yet so far away.

Kudos to Valve for figuring this out. It is now fair for everyone. Those that follow the rules, and those that break the rules, no matter you get the game at the same time.

Of course the gamers will thank the developers with their hard-earned money. I dont believe pirating has ever signficiantly hurt the gaming industry. I believe those who pirate generally can't afford the software anyway and those who priate AND could afford the software, is a very small percentage. No that is not truely what the lawful gamers appreciate, they don't really care if someone gets a free ride.

What we appreciate is for once our money and our patience and following the rules buys the same access as the thieves get. For once, following the rules pays off big. For once, I don't have to hear about some spoiled coddled 16 year old kid that spent $1800 on eBay for an early copy when $0 of his money went to those who deserve the credit for writing the game.

I still think the most brilliant part is having it so close yet... so far. It is loaded but it isin't working! Our normal instinct is to go to the forums and find the answer. What switch do you throw? What config file do we edit? Well there is no answer, but as time honored tradition dictates, we talk and talk and talk until one is found. In this case, I doubt there will be one until the 16th.

Anti-piracy so good. you'll wonder ... by vhold · 2004-11-12 11:21 · Score: 1

... which reason the sales are so stratospherically high for. After the dust settles in a few weeks and we're able to compare HL2 sales to other blockbusters somewhat objectively, how would you determine what percentage of the sales are attributable to the extreme lengths of the anti-piracy and not neccesarily just the fact it's a good game or not?

Will game companies just off the cuff attribute any possible record shattering sales to the ultra DRM ? If so, will HL2 forever alter the course of PC gaming with everybody and their moms scattering to invest in developing their own digital distribution means and rights management? What happens when your system has 4 steam equivalents running on it at once.

Will Valve regret not even trying to leverage their existing infrastructure to licsense to other companies, or is that something up their sleeve they are holding to play at exactly the height of the executive frenzy in the PC gaming industry in response to HL2 sales?

Re:Another example as to why release dates are stu by Lord_Dweomer · 2004-11-12 11:40 · Score: 1

Wow, very brave statement making a lot of assumptions.

First off, XP came with my computer, I did not need to activate it. Just because I have internet access and use it to post to Slashdot does NOT mean I will have internet access on the computer I would have played HL2 on.

I am insulted by your flamebait claim that I am a cheapass and don't want to pay for it when I would love to buy HL2 as I think its a game worthy of paying for. However, I am not going to be buying it on principle because I want to put my money where my mouth is in regards to this issue.

The fact that you are making a gross generalization that people who don't like product activation are all pirates shows that your post was nothing more than a troll.

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Re:Can't play without Valve authentication by Ratso+Baggins · 2004-11-12 11:52 · Score: 1

"Who is Valve to say that I, a customer who shelled out $55+ for their game, can not play it until they say so, even though they already have my money and I have their software?"

You do realise, I know you do - you're just choosing to ignore it, sowftware is licenced (generally) and not sold. You are sold the right to use it. You aggree to their conditions to use their software. Sometimes at the end of this agreement you are supposed to destroy the software, install media and documentation. If you don't like that then don't use it. I don't like it as much as the next guy, but that's how it is.

Free software can have provision for you to own it, try that instead....

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"we live in a post-ideological world..." - Billy Bragg.

Copy Protection losses my business. by Anonymous Coward · 2004-11-12 11:59 · Score: 1, Insightful

I don't know how many other people have my attitude, but I will not be buying HL2 simply because of its copy protection.

I can afford most new titles, but I refuse to buy, in protest, any software that has a copy protection system that limits my fair use of the product I have paid good money for.

I believe that if I pay the massive price (and it is expensive compared to say a movie which also takes a large amount of time and money to manufacture) I should not have to 'jump through hoops' to be able to use it for the fair purpose of just playing the bloody game. I can't stand the , now standard, CD must be in the drive to play attitude. But that alone will not prevent me from purchasing the software. However, this activation bullshit is rediculous and it doesn't feel like I have purchased the software at all, it feels like I have rented it off valve, and at the given price, this is just rediculous and not acceptable.

I find it extremely greedy and if that is how they are going to treat someone who is willing to purchase their software, well I am not going to purchase it.

What I wonder is if there is as many (or more) people who share my attitude as their will be people who would have normally pirated the game and will now purchase. If this is the case, Valve will actually loose out, not to mention the cost of developing and implementing these anti-piracy measures.

-GoaT

Re:Copy Protection losses my business. by SanityInAnarchy · 2004-11-12 20:49 · Score: 1

Gee, sorry you feel that way. Most of us see it as an INCREASE in fair use.

Think about it: With most games, you have to have the CD in the drive to play, which is why many people who have a legitimate copy use a No-CD crack anyway.

With Half-Life 2, you can order online and download the whole thing, and never need the CD at all. What's more, you can download it to as many computers as you want, so long as you never play it on more than one at once. And if you're not pirating, you wouldn't be doing that anyway, unless you have two heads and four arms.

Now, what about that activation? Again, I don't have a boxed game, so my "activation" may be simpler than yours, but I just gave them a credit card number, chose the Silver Edition, and bound it to my old Half-Life account on Steam. I don't appreciate how HL2 costs $50-60, and the HL pack my brother found cost something like $30-40, and I now seem to have bought many of the games on that account twice. But that's really my only administrative complaint.

What about price? I agree, $60 is a lot. But if you're willing to spend $10-20 on a movie which keeps you passively entertained for 2 hours, you ought to be willing to spend even $50 on Prince of Persia: The Sands of Time, which keeps you entertained actively for about 6 hours. Half-Life 2 is likely to be much longer, and it includes quite a few other single-player games -- such as the original Half-Life and Half-Life:Source whenever they get around to releasing it. Or, at least, the Silver Pack does.

So what's left is your "feeling" that you are "renting" the game because it requires you to be online ONCE (not to mention that it includes some of the most popular and best online games ever). And that is really just a "feeling" -- it doesn't even require a monthly donation of time, much less money. If anything, it's a free service, as you automatically get updates whenever you're online.

If you're like me and don't like how much power this gives Valve (they can remotely deactivate my game if they so choose), then you should consider running Linux and sticking to Doom 3 in a sandbox. Or, more seriously, you should make a backup of your installed and activated copy. I don't know if it's legal, but it's very easy to just have a dedicated Steam partition, then image it. If Valve ever starts "renting" it, and charging you a monthly fee, you can always pull out your archived copy of the game.

My only complaints against Valve are the features that are missing that were present in even one of the first PlayStation 2 games (Jak and Daxter), such as: quick startup, no loading ever, autosave, no glitches, and no requirement of owning a copy of Windows. Yet Half-Life was good enough that I am willing to put up with all of that, even pre-order the game, to play HL2.

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Don't thank God, thank a doctor!
Re:Copy Protection losses my business. by kannibal_klown · 2004-11-13 05:14 · Score: 1

I'll agree about the "CD must be in the drive" thing, and raise you an "unable to backup CD without doing something suspicious." Those 2 things combined drive me crazy.

Firt of all, I 2 huge friggin Hard Drives, why can't I just play it off of them. Second, because I MUST use the CD all of the time, the chances of it getting damaged increase. Backing it up would be nice in this case.

As for Steam, I don't mind it. I was against it from it's conception, but I've recently warmed up to it. I cancelled my box pre-order and purchased it via Steam. I have the new Verizon 3MBit DSL connection, so downloading it all didn't take that long.

Now, I don't need a CD in the drive, and Steam lets me back up the files into compressed DVD sized chunks (or CD sized). As for protection, I don't mind it that much. Sure, I think it's stupid to force an Internet connection for Single player, but it allows less people to play it pirated online.

After a while, someone generated my Half-Life 1 CD key when they were still using WON servers, and I often could not get on. Now, my HL-1 CD-key is tied to my account and nobody else's.
Re:Copy Protection losses my business. by thirty2bit · 2004-11-13 09:25 · Score: 1

Valve/Vivendi lost my business too. So has Symantec (Norton Internet Security/Norton Antivirus). I'm dead-set against this 'activation' crap. I don't want to beg anybody to reinstall software that I legitimately purchased. And if I choose to install/move the SW to any one of my four current desktops (all different procs, video) for testing, I shouldn't have to by put on trial to explain why *I* should be allowed to reinstall. Fark that!.

I don't see why Valve just doesn't make the HL2 CD files completely 'single player' until you register/activate, and they send you a set of files (DLLs, executables, key files or all of the above. Whatever) that will make HL2 multiplayer. That can be done through Steam. This will ensure that their perpetual cash cow can continued to be milked for all it's worth by Valve.

Personally I'm rooting for the Pirates. What's your favorite team?
Re:Copy Protection losses my business. by thirty2bit · 2004-11-13 15:22 · Score: 1

As stated: "install/move". That's because you can't just "move" software these days. You have to "install" it. Gotta have that registry and Windows directory pollution for software to function.

Symantec gives you four installs before you are boned. Go Google for stories regarding other user's tribulations trying to get Symantec to "allow" them to reinstall. That's a hinderance. What hoops will Valve put users through with HL2? Guess I'll have to wait for that to happen to someone then read about it.

Maybe I should have just wrote "move" so you wouldn't be jumping to conclusions, anonymous coward? Thanks for automatically assuming I'm trying to cheat someone.

What if... by nicksthings · 2004-11-12 12:40 · Score: 2, Insightful

Great copy protection scheme they have, no doubt. But, what if someone who purchased Half Life 2 didn't have access to the internet and therefore couldn't activate the game via Steam? Maybe this is unlikely that someone who would own a PC capable of running the game wouldn't have an internet connection, but I'm sort of curious how that would be handled.

Re:What if... by majid_aldo · 2004-11-13 04:38 · Score: 1

..not to mention my heavily firewalled connection.
HELLO VALAVE!!

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No, Yes, No by ReKleSS · 2004-11-12 12:40 · Score: 1

Is this game multiplayer only?
No, it's not. There's a single player mode.

Does this game have a single player mode - can someone without an internet connection play this game?
Although it is playable SP, you still need an internet connection, at least to activate it. This is valve's form of copy protection - similar to XP's activation scheme - but I don't think we'll be seeing a pro corp version of HL2. I think it may be possible to connect to the internet once, enable steam offline,then play all you want, though. (That's how we play CS at lans... a use for all those AOL CDs?)
-ReK

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md5sum -c reality.md5 reality: FAILED md5sum: WARNING: 1 of 1 computed checksum did NOT match

I see nothing savvy about this. by SetupWeasel · 2004-11-12 13:25 · Score: 1, Redundant

I don't see the point in keeping people from playing when they legally purchased it.

Re:Can't play without Valve authentication by DeltaSigma · 2004-11-12 14:15 · Score: 1

You have to admit, he worded the post well. He doesn't appear outraged, or surprised. He's not making it out to be a vast conspiracy. He just seems to be stating what we all feel: we should have the final say on how our own property operates.

Re:Can't play without Valve authentication by Electrum · 2004-11-12 14:15 · Score: 1

You do realise, I know you do - you're just choosing to ignore it, sowftware is licenced (generally) and not sold. You are sold the right to use it. You aggree to their conditions to use their software.

Your theory is incorrect.

Re:Another example as to why release dates are stu by Night+Goat · 2004-11-12 14:44 · Score: 1

Companies need release dates... how else would companies set a date to start selling their products? What the hell are you talking about?
As for why they don't release games when they go gold, it's because if Valve just started selling via the Internet, they wouldn't get any business from people with slow internet connections, and retailers would say "Sierra, you're telling us you're not going to sell this hugely anticipated game in the standard channels? Well fuck you, we'll keep your products off the shelf."

Re:Can't play without Valve authentication by rsmith-mac · 2004-11-12 15:12 · Score: 1

Of course I realize that it's licensed, and to that extent I don't mind the current hoops we have to jump through, such as copy protection and cd-keys(though I don't really like the former), but it's like this is the straw that broke the camel's back. I used to be able to exercise some control when I played my games offline, but with this I feel like I've given too much - I don't want to have to get Valve's permission to do something that couldn't possibly affect anyone besides me(playing the game offline). At this point, I'm starting to doubt that I'm going to buy the game because of this.

Re:Can't play without Valve authentication by Ratso+Baggins · 2004-11-12 16:26 · Score: 1

I agree entrirely about not being able to play offline. Unfortunately there are two options, one legal and one not - legal: don't buy (licence) it. Illegal: see previous nocd cracks etc.

That's the way it goes when the rights of the few outweigh the rights of the many.

If "I'm not buying it" occurs on mass then the publishers will have to change their tune.

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"we live in a post-ideological world..." - Billy Bragg.

Re:Can't play without Valve authentication by Ratso+Baggins · 2004-11-12 16:29 · Score: 1

IANAL but the provision you reference states "once you own..." but as I said you may not be buying it after all, so the provision would not count?

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"we live in a post-ideological world..." - Billy Bragg.

Re:Can't play without Valve authentication by Ratso+Baggins · 2004-11-12 16:32 · Score: 1

yep sure did, but I was not trying to dissagree rather remind them of the software licencing misconception and that their only real option is not to buy into it, as they eluded to.

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"we live in a post-ideological world..." - Billy Bragg.

At this point in the game by GinoMGG · 2004-11-12 18:05 · Score: 1

At this point I doubt Valve will release the game early despite their earlier report. Wait a few days, make sure Steam is ready for the surge....lather, rinse repeat

Re:Can't play without Valve authentication by DeltaSigma · 2004-11-12 18:32 · Score: 1

Yes. If only there was a way to allow Valve to know that I'm not purchasing their offering because of this fact, outside of a snotty letter.

Re:Can't play without Valve authentication by SilentChris · 2004-11-12 18:54 · Score: 1

It's simple: you weren't supposed to have a copy in the first place. Valve specifically stated that retailers couldn't sell the game before its release date. A few did (and are getting in trouble), so a few customers got copies.

But does that absolve the customer from all guilt? Should they be allowed to do whatever they want with Valve's product just because stores made a mistake? Of course not. It'd be like having a ban on assault weapons time out in 2006, and a store selling you an assault weapon early. Just because you got your hands on the gun doesn't mean you can shoot it in the streets. Retailer decisions don't affect how customers use products.

Probably... by SanityInAnarchy · 2004-11-12 20:30 · Score: 1

Valve has always focused on the actual gameplay, and neglected anything technical which doesn't make the game prettier or more fun. This is why a map of CS:Source takes so much longer to load than a map of Doom 3.

I mean, come on. Intelligent people who care about security embed Gecko, not Internet Explorer. I won't even get started on DirectX vs. OpenGL, but the only opinion I have EVER heard from anyone in the gaming industry is that OpenGL is faster for 3D.

What's sad is that it's possible to do this right, which is why I'm skeptical of a HL2 crack coming out. After all, the preload says the files are encrypted. A machine fast enough to play HL2 should be able to do blowfish encryption about as fast as cdrom access speeds. In fact, all Valve would really have to do is embed GnuPG/OpenSSL. Especially with the preload -- since Valve doesn't appear to be using anything like BitTorrent (preferring instead to spend their own bandwidth), there's nothing to stop them from encrypting a version for each user, so that even if someone could somehow grab the key and share it, it wouldn't do any good unless they also sent the entire game.

But then, someone intelligent enough to find the PGP key in the mess that is Steam is probably intelligent enough to know what BitTorrent is, anyway.

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Don't thank God, thank a doctor!

Re:Probably... by irc.goatse.cx+troll · 2004-11-12 22:01 · Score: 1

Its a 128bit RSA encryption. You can spot the key inside your ClientRegistry.Blob file. Anyone that really wants it cracked can do so, but theres usually easier ways to pirate stuff from Valve.

Like hypotheticly when Condition Zero first came out and I may or may not have downloaded the HLDS(dedicated server) update tool and told it to download all of czero/ so that I could run a server..then proceded to copy the dir into Half-life/ like it was a mod..and then played it online first day it was out.... Hypotheticly of course ;)

As for BT.. Valve hired the guy that coded it, but so far the only BT valve has used is when they bundled steaminstall.exe with the game content

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Pain lasts, kid. Its how you know you're alive. Sometimes I think this growing up thing is just pain management-TheMaxx

Re:Can't play without Valve authentication by KDR_11k · 2004-11-12 21:27 · Score: 1

I'd say that was not stated in the sales contract you entered with the store. The sales contract says you own what you just paid for, the EULA isn't agreed to until after you've bought it already and alters the first contract without the agreement of a party involved (the store didn't sign it).

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Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.

Re:Another example as to why release dates are stu by richy+freeway · 2004-11-12 22:50 · Score: 1

I will NOT be purchasing HL2 SOLELY because of the fact that they require product activation for singleplayer.

Your loss. Sometimes people let principles get in the way FAR too much. The rest of us will just activate and enjoy while you lose sleep over greedy games companies and product activation.

Really, I can't help but laugh.

Re:Future Slashdot headline: Sierra/Value sue EB by Hedonist23 · 2004-11-12 23:16 · Score: 1

Actually, I used to work for a game store and I can tell you that we were always forwarned that the store would get massive fines if we put out a game early and it was found out. The fines sounded like something in the contract between the store and the distributer. I'm sure that's how it works.

hed.

Re:What the bloody mother fucking fuckshit? by Zed2K · 2004-11-13 05:01 · Score: 1

Yeah because murder is just like cracking a game you legally bought but can't play yet. You probably think that people that apply no cd patches to games they bought should be tossed in jail along with all the other murderers also.

Some folks still don't get it which is just fine, they'll just continue making up the same responses when topics like this come up.

Re:I agree! by junkgrep · 2004-11-13 05:14 · Score: 1

"but requiring to register your legally owned purchased product to just play SINGLE PLAYER is absurd." When you make you own awesome FPS, you can decide hwo you want authentication to work. The real silliness is that despite all the bitching about hypothetical situations, virtually everyone that is complaining would have absolutely no problem installing and authenticating the game. Heck, most could just buy it over Steam. So it's all a tempest in a teapot.

Half-Life 2 For Sale @ Best Buy by ScottAuth · 2004-11-13 08:57 · Score: 1

I've just returned from Best Buy on my lunch break and they are selling it on their shelves and at the front of the store. So I became a little curious and when I returned to work [CompUSA] I ventured back in the warehouse and we have our display shrink wrapped with several bright orange tags on them declaring not to sell it until the 16th. Just a little fyi.

Copy Protection is flawed anyways... by zentu · 2004-11-13 16:48 · Score: 1

Acctually, Cracking shouldn't be an idea of ethics versus legality. You buy the right to use your copy how you want, I should be able to install software on any machine I want, and as long as only one is using the software at one time, not break the law.

Personally, I have used cracks on my laptop to avoid bring the media. I have also used cracks to avoid the crap lag that you gain by trying to run it off a disk, or through some form of encription (like safedisk or securerom).

Hell, I have personally seen 10% to 20% perfermance increases on avarage due to using a crack that bypasses the encryption.

The problem shoud be fixed by not spending money on a crappy form of encryption that adds cost to the product, but by going after the stupid rings of warez groups.

Heck, I even personally like Valve's little gambit of requiring you to verify it with the vender first, now hopefully they don't require me to have the disk inserted when I play the game, that way I don't get the performance lags that I can't handle otherwise, I would upgrade my machine, but I have to decide between college/food and computer parts.

Re:Another example as to why release dates are stu by Yer+Mom · 2004-11-14 21:12 · Score: 1

Its a ONE time activation. Just like XP which you are probably using right now.

So, is there a Half-Life 2 Corporate Edition?

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