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What Mac OS X Could Learn From Windows
An anonymous reader writes "It is almost unheard of to see something written about what OS X could learn from Windows but this details some good examples. And yes, it includes the right-click mouse." I find about half the suggestions compelling enough to be worth griping over, and the other half off-base, but YMMV.
Works FINE - just a aftermarket option. Command-Click, Jus' like Winders.
"Flyin' in just a sweet place,
Never been known to fail..."
Apple - and the zealotry - need to concede that this battle is lost.
Huh? So Apple are meant to disrupt the muscle memory of practically every Apple user, by dropping a scheme that they have stuck to for decades, to make it slightly easier for a minority of people who use two different systems on a regular basis?
What complete and utter nonsense. What next? Drop the dock in favour of a taskbar that works like Windows... because "this battle is lost"? After all, if it doesn't work like Windows, then it must be a disaster!
Apple has had support for a two button mouse for the better part of twenty years. Just plug one it, and go...simple as that. The fact that most users chose not to spend the extra $30 to do so, tells you that they didn't really miss it.
StupidChildren...the reason jesus is crying
This one is a real bother for me on my with Macs. Anybody have a hack or 3rd party way of doing this.
FYI to non Mac'ers, Mac OSX only allows you to re-size windows at the top left corner of the window .
Well then, why not a "New" button on toolbars? Why not copy and paste? Why not a toolbar button extravaganza like Microsoft Office?
Because Mac users use menus and keyboard shortcuts for basic features, that's why.
From TFA (emphasis mine):
1) Compatible control keys. Switching between Mac and Windows this drives me nuts. I have to consciously think "command-C or control-C?" It shouldn't have to be that way. And if you're running RDC or VPC and copying and pasting between OS X and Windows!! Sheesh!
The problem isn't the labeling, it's the location of the keys used. I had to use a Windows PC today and I kept pressing Alt-C to copy. This is why it's a problem. If it was simply a matter of labeling, no worries, mate. Apple - and the zealotry - need to concede that this battle is lost.
Implementing this would rock many people's boats, so if Apple did make this change it'd have some serious domino affect on other keystrokes and applications that use them, but maybe it could be done with the switch to Intel, just to ease the pain slightly.
Umm, how exactly did Apple lose? Was there a national convention that decided that the main command issuing modifier key should be hit by the pinky? I much prefer to move my thumb from the space bar and hit command than move my pinky from the a to hit control. Why exactly do we need to conceed here? Because you think you you're right Mr. Author?
Track your TV Shows with your iPhone - FREE
OSX can learn by the bad example that Windows sets in terms of security, usability, stability, and well, just about everything else. Wait... In fact it seems like OSX has already learned those lessons!
Hexy - a strategy game for iPhone/iPod Touch
Really nice feature to use with apps like Tortoise SVN.
I think the idea is that your cursor doesn't change into a dozen different zany pictures and adopt a dozen different functions depending on which part of the window you're pointing at.
It's all about simplicity.
there's more than one way to do me.
I think this writer still hasn't got it. OSX has supported multi button mice for ages - I have a 5 button Microsoft bluetooth mouse working perfectly with 10.3, making expose easy to use.
The whole point of the one button mouse is to make it easy to use for beginners, and to prevent developers being lazy when designing programs. And using expose with a single mouse button only needs for the screen corners to be set up to trigger the actions.
While some of the points seem relevant, others are completely off the mark.
Overall, I'm just not impressed. If these are the changes that'll make Longhorn the (all together now) "Apple-Killer" -- well, the future is already here, and it's sitting on your couch next to the fried chicken.
StupidChildren...the reason jesus is crying
Save button on toolbars: This is hardly an OS X issue. Lots of Mac apps have them. I can't remember if iApps do or don't, but there's no big deal there.
Only showing relevant file types: The current method is classic Steve. You show all files because the user knows they exist and you don't want to confuse him. Advantages both ways.
Sort directories to the top: If that's a problem, you probably have your tree setup poorly. Again, one can argue this both ways.
What I'm listening to now on Pandora...
...like something equivalent to CTRL-ALT-DELETE, ENTER (does "lock computer").
A curious juxtaposition:
4) Only show relevant file types in open and save dialogs. For those who like seeing every file that's every existed in their Documents folder, give them a checkbox to show all files. But personally, if I am opening a Pages file, I don't want to see all my iMovie, Excel, iDVD etc files. And OS X already knows which are which because non-related ones are greyed out.
This I dig, especially if you can filter down the list with a substring match or regular expressions.
5) Sort folders to top of directory listings I know that we don't go folder mining as much since we got Spotlight, so I won't labor on about this one.
Oh, so if you have your nice trimmed open/save dialog you still need to scroll past all the folders to figure out what file you want to open.
-mkb
Genocide to the Caps lock key!
Is SUN is the only one truly with a clue about the keyboard?
Compatible control keys
No. Making things easier on those who use both Mac OS and Windows at the expense of those who are used to just Mac OS is not a good move, now is it.
Save button on toolbars
I guess they could make it optional...
A multi button mouse
The horse is dead tell you. Show its carcass some respect.
Only show relevant file types in open and save dialogs
I'd say it's better for users if it doesn't look like some files are suddenly missing from their folders. And as stated, the dialog won't let you open files the application can't handle anyway.
Sort folders to top of directory listings
I prefer alphabetical sorting. I don't find your arguments compelling enough to change things.
More context sensitive help
Kind of what we used to have with the help balloons that no developer ever wanted to write help text for?
Mac already supports right-click, and more. in fact, my iBook scroll pad has the functionality of a mouse with 5 buttons and 2 scroll wheels. but I usually use my Apple single-click buletooth mouse. it's enough.
REQUIRE just one button, SUPPORT multiple is the Mac way. and it's also the best way. anyone who doesn't understand this is ignorant.
Here, it's at down right corner...
;)
Apparently, WMMV.
1. Control keys can be changed in the preferences for the OS, and for RDC and VPC as well. Plus, it wouldn't be horrendously difficult to change the key mapping to make it more convenient as well.
2. Save buttons on toolbars are up to the developers. And in all honesty, I think a lot more people use keyboard commands to save, instead of clicking on a tiny little button in a toolbar that not even every app has. This definitely is not an OS specific thing...they're available if you need it, but nobody's forcing anyone to use it..
3. My Logitech MX518 works on my Macs. So does my MX900 bluetooth mouse. And all of the other multi-button mice I've ever bothered to connect via USB or bluetooth. end of argument, unless you're trying to say that Apple should ship multi-button mice with their computers. They shouldn't. There's almost nothing worth having a multi-button mouse for that you can't do with a one button mouse, or with the keyboard (except when it comes to gaming and the likes). Now, with the coming Intel Macs, maybe they should. But that's only assuming the person buying the machine will install another OS on it as well.
4. Why on earth do you need to see only the relevant file types? Sometimes OS X will grey out the ones that aren't relevant or not selectable, but what good is it going to do? Afraid of accidentally naming your file a name that already exists?!
5. Useless. In all honesty, Spotlight/Quicksilver/Launchbar sort of get rid of the need for that, like the article mentioned.
6. Why on earth is this supposed to be a Windows thing? It's not. It's in OS X. Blame the developer(s) if it's lacking in the software you're using and complaining about.
Frankly it sounds like the author is just an idiot, but that's my two cents. All of his points are almost completely irrelevant or not applicable.
On top of that, might I add that Microsoft and Apple have copied each other too many times to count, and it's not necessarily good.
Creating an interface that doesn't require the detailed knowledge of how to use a multi-button mouse is a GOOD THING. It is one of the finer details of Mac OS, always has been. It forces application developers to make easier to use and understand applications rather than going for flashy looking stuff that might be quicker to use, but has a much higher learning curve. That being said, this five button mouse on my iBook works fine. Middle click opens in new tabs, right click pulls up contextual menus and I have the additional buttons set for Expose.
Now on to his other critiques.
Compatible control keys
I don't use VPC, so this has never been an issue for me.
Save button on toolbar: Irrelevent. Toolbars a for very often needed options. Things the app was designed to do. In pretty much every single app I've used on OS X it won't let you close a window unless you tell it to save or not to save.
Only show relevant file types in open and save dialogs. I'm not sure what version of OS X he's using but it does that in a better way than he suggests. The user isn't left wondering "where did my file go". Things that are useable by that app are bold and things that are not useable by that app are dimmer and you can't even click on them
Sort folders to top of directory listings This assumes that the person is always first and foremost looking for a nested directory. You CAN set on either a universal basis or a folder by folder basis and ordering sort you want.
More context sensitive help As long as things like clippy are discouraged, that's not so bad. Though, I've always found how Windows tries to hold my hand very annoying and frustrating. Window's devopers aren't very good at guessing what people want to do and it shows.
Burn Hollywood Burn
I'm a recent switcher (I bought my Mac Mini the day after Tiger came out) and my biggest gripe is the control key placement. I love my Mac to death, but it's useless for any text editing because I use a lot of keyboard shortcuts. Pressing Ctrl + C on a PC keyboard to copy text is easy; Command + C on my Mac requires me to twist my fingers because the Command key is too close to the alphabetic keys to be a natural reach.
I don't think it's just a matter of getting used to it, and of breaking old habits. No, the placement of the Command key really is detrimental to its use, at least as far as my fingers are concerned. Until today I've been trying to live with it, but now I'm going to find a way to remap the keys so as to move Command farther to the left.
Most of these seemed to point out litte small niy-picky things. With the save button, I know when im working on a document its easier just to hit Commad-S from the keyboard then to go to the mouse and hit a button on a tool-bar. I usually turn any sort of tool-bar off though to save screen space. Multi-Button mouses? God. The mac is compatible out of the box but its more of a statement of how simple it is to use then anything else. Moving folders up to the top is just a pain in the ass if you are trying to find a file in a folder full of other folders and files. Say if the file has a name that begins with "F" you have to hit the F-Key a bunch of times to get past all the folders that have names starting with it to get into the files. Wastes more time like that then it could possilbley save, plus you can sort by type. And anyway, who reads documentation for a Apple product?
OSX should just feature the Windows Key+L shortcut.
-William Brendel
and one of the things that I hate about windows is that folders sort to the top of directory listings, it's like I have to go through the alphabet twice.
And I would be really upset if Apple changes the command key, I like it where it is, anyone that can't easily switch between Windows and OS X has some type of personal problem. I use VNC all day and have no trouble at all copying and pasting between my Mac and Windows boxes.
I suppose that the option to only display relevant files types would be nice, but I'd hope that it is just an option, not the standard. If I'm not mistaken I've even seen some applications do this.
And I also have no need for save buttons on tool bars, I rarely save anything by using the menu, it's almost always a command-s or I just wait to be done with the document. Most of the time if I'm creating anything I'm using the keyboard anyways, even with photoshop.
Those who know, do not speak. Those who speak, do not know. ~Lao Tzu
1. There are tools to remap keys. I'm sure the command and control keys can be switched as well. Yes, you do need to look for the tool or option.
2. Idiotic. Command S is not easy enough? Tool bars are generally evidence of poor design. You memorize the shortcut keys for your frequent options. Yes, there can be designs where there are too many keys to remember but SAVE? Oh command S people.
3. control click anyone? why a multi button mouse when control click works just as well and doesn't confuse new users?
4. Interesting, I'll agree.
5. This is horrible. Totally completely stupid and horrible. You sort by name and just TYPE the name of your folder and then press command down arrow to open it. Why in hell do people want an alphabetical sort to separate any files from folders? How do you know when the folders stop and the files start? What if you have more than one screen of folders? Folders at the top is something I really really think is pretty damn stupid as it breaks the metaphor of alphabetical sorting. Oh, if you want it, PathFinder, a finder replacement, has it
6. Um, ok. Software authors heed to increase their budget to have a copywriter write the context sensetive help.
And on : - Existing files selectable in Save dialog
This sucks. I want to click in the file list to set my focus there so i can command up or command down arrow into and out of folders. But now, when I click to set focus, if I hit a file name, I mistakenly replace my current file's filename with that of another file and if I press save, I run the risk of overwriting it and deleting that other file. Super lame.
- Zav - Imagine a Beowulf cluster of insensitive clods...
Finder needs an equivalent to View, List in Windows Explorer. I don't want the full detailed listing, nor the big icons, nor the NeXT-like view. Just a nicely sorted list of filenames with a small icon next to them. While we're at it, View, Thumbnails would be pretty handy too.
Also QuickTime should seriously stop regarding full-screen playback as a "Pro" feature to charge extra for. Windows Media Player may be evil, but at least it can play a full-screen AVI file.
The Simpsons: "ooh look at me, I can't program my vcr, I can't open a bag of airline peanuts... I'm a freakin' moron"!
TFA: "ooh look at me, I can't switch to a different mouse, I can't figure out copy/paste/save commands... I'm a freakin' technology columnist"!
clowns...
"Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts." ~The Honorable Daniel Patrick Moynihan
I think this is a matter of personal preference. The Cmd key actually makes a lot of sense -- it's much closer to the alphabets than the Ctrl key, so if you use a lot of keyboard shortcuts, you don't have to strain your hands as much (particularly if you've small hands).
Ditto for people who use their Caps Lock keys as a Ctrl key. (You can actually activate this mode in Tiger).
I suppose newbies might agree with you. Most of us use Cmd-S.
Get The Mouse.
Okay, I happen to think that the Mac OS X file dialog is pretty lame. Opening files requires too many mouse-clicks. In Windows, I can select a wildcard mask, and have autocompletion in the textbox.
Spotlight makes it slightly more bearable, but not by much.
Tab completion is nice, but only works for paths (to activate this, type / or ~ or Cmd-Shift-G, and tab away).
The only reason folders end up in the middle is because Folder starts with F. Heh heh.
But you're right.
OS X doesn't have a very good help system I have to admit.
- Compatible control keys.
- Save button on toolbars.
- A multi button mouse.
- Only show relevant file types in open and save dialogs.
- Sort folders to top of directory listings
- More context sensitive help.
Well, that's my breakdown.The problem isn't the labeling, it's the location of the keys used. I had to use a Windows PC today and I kept pressing Alt-C to copy.
There have been third-party tools to remap keyboards for a long time. I'm sure there are a few for Mac OS X as well. You shouldn't have to make all Mac-only users switch just to appease the Windows-switchers and dual-platform users.
So what should it look like, hmm? Surely not the anachronistic 3.5" disk long banished from the platform.
Existing aftermarket mice work just fine, and they both aren't round and have actual buttons on them!
This might have some merit. It may be a mistake to show disabled options, even files, if there's no way in that instance of the window to make the files selectable.
However, it does give you information over what files exist so you don't name a file the same as another that isn't associated with this program.
Maybe a sorting or suppression option.
Sort by type isn't sufficient?
I haven't really had a problem that way. The system is easy enough that I generally don't need help.
Oh, say does that Star-Spangled Banner entwine / The myrtle of Venus with Bacchus's vine?
Or, perhaps, someone can tell me how to get XP SP 2 to do any of the following:
OK, on that last one, tweaking the keymap would do it. (And that would solve the article's author's problem with Command vs. Control--swap Windows and CTRL on his Winbox keymap, or Control and Command on his Mac.)
And I don't want stuff that only works for the current load/save dialog, like switching to list view. Yeesh.
At least most Windows apps finally stopped defaulting to saving in the directory the program is in, that was really dumb.
Not that Macs are perfect, either, but they're closer to how I want to use a machine than Windows is.
1) Compatible control keys. Switching between Mac and Windows this drives me nuts. I have to consciously think
OS X is not Windows, strangely enough, some people even choose it above Windows because it is different.
2) Save button on toolbars. I don't think any of the Apple software ever gives you the option to include a Save button.
Learn to use Cmd-S, buttons for every command is a Windows thing, though it has crept in in some programs like MS Word.
3) A multi button mouse. And you thought I'd say two.
Plug in your PC mouse.
Only show relevant file types in open and save dialogs. For those who like seeing every file that's every existed in their Documents folder, give them a checkbox to show all files.
This is debatable, but the only one of his points which might have some foundation - it would be handy to be able to winnow files in the open dialog. Presumably the justification is that files should always be visible, even if they're not directly available in a certain program.
In fact in Tiger you can do this in a neat way with Smart Folders (create one for only word documents, one for images etc, then put them in your sidebar or someplace easy to find from the open dialog).
Sort folders to top of directory listings I know that we don't go folder mining as much since we got Spotlight, so I won't labor on about this one.
Click the 'Kind' column in column view, or smart folders again.
More context sensitive help. I notice since I first raised this two years ago, more of it has crept into OS X. So I guess at least I can't be flamed for this one!
I assume this means tooltips. Don't like them myself, as I feel they encourage GUI designers to litter the screen with cryptic buttons with the excuse that users can use tool-tips to decode them.
Now why is it that I can list all the features I want Leopard to have and as long as none of them are from Windows, its cool?
But dare suggest OS X needs a feature already in Windows and the world comes down on you.
Additional features are not always welcome, efficient or even necessary.
What's far more important than an extensive feature list is that features are well integrated, consistent and well thought out - throughout an operating system and the applications. If I have one major criticism of Apple recently it's that they have forgotten to keep things simple and consistent in their myriad home-grown apps.
And if you can take the heat, what would you like to see Apple borrow from Windows?
There are undoubtedly a few ideas in Windows (which haven't already been borrowed already : ) which would be great on OS X. Some parts of the Finder could do with help for a start (Network, thumbnail browsing etc). Any long time Windows users like to suggest some? (No, things which are just different don't count, there has to some things which work better).
Sometimes I think Slashdot articles would be more thoughtful and insightful if the editors just linked to comments from previous stories rather than uninformed nonsense like this.
How about focus follows mouse?
And how about a decent package manager? Yesterday I saw an attempted installation of iWork on a friend's machine, and it kept telling him that it was already installed and refused to install one off the CD. He was certain that it was not installed.
badness 10000
You know, I bought a machine for running Linux the other day, and it DIDN'T COME WITH ANY MOUSE AT ALL! or a KEYBOARD! OMGLOLWTF!! PCS ARE THE SUCKS!11!
You there with the 50-button mouse (the one you bought SEPARATELY) complaining about the one-button mouse on macs: yes, YOU ARE AWESOME. Because you use a 50-button mouse, YOU TOTALY ROCK! Now. Just take that sucker and plug it into your Mac. OMG!! It works.. wait, you don't even OWN a Mac? WHY ARE YOU WHINING!
And you: the X Windows user. You too are a GOD AMONG MEN. I don't dispute that. Pasting with the middle mouse button is exactly like how the scriptures said JESUS would paste content. YES! That time you accidentally sent a porn link to your boss had NOTHING to do with the usability of this configuration, no siree.
You there: calling your mom "stupid" behind her back because she hasn't mastered right-clicking on your SWEET windows box. Yes, she IS dumb. Because this is a skill EVERYBODY should have mastered before the age of 12. Somehow your mom missed the COURT-ORDERED euthenasia for people who can't right-click.
The one-button mac mouse is not a problem! You guys just don't like people to know how to operate a computer without being "trained" first. It makes you LESS SPECIAL that grandpa doesn't need to figure out which of two UNMARKED BUTTONS are gonna get him his email. TOO BAD!
I switched from gentoo to OSX, and I'm liking most of apple's changes, like dock instead of multidesktop (it works better, even if it isn't as cool), etc etc, but the one button mouse is a pain. I hate having to ctrl+click everything. Alas, I must use Apple's wireless mouse, because it's beautiful. Third party ones don't compare. If Apple can design a mouse as cool as the one button mouse, then I will buy it in a heartbeat (If you know how the one button mouse works, you know what I mean, its neato)
On Windows: drag icon to the taskbar's tab for the target process, wait for the list of open windows to appear, drag to the relevant entry and that window will pop to the front. Nice - notice you're still just using the mouse.
On OS X: start to drag the icon, then hit F9 with your other hand to invoke Expose, choose the relevant window, wait for the window to come to the front and then release. Notice how you had to use both keys and the mouse there.
That's pretty much it on the UI front for me. I would definitely like to see Apple incorporate the Windows-like mouse-only behaviour though.
Cheers,
Ian
I use a simple AppleScript named "Lock Screen" that I launch with LaunchBar. Cmd-space, lo, done.
there's more than one way to do me.
Who wants /Applications, /System, /Users etc. CAPS!!! yes CAPS!!! in a UNIX OS! Evil. Not to mention some dirs have spaces *gasp* very annoying at the command line.
Also, of course, Finder. What the fuck is up with the Finder? It's like they're obeying some law, OSX can be only so good, so lets cripple the FileManager. Honestly, wtf? A button to switch between metal/non-metal look? What genius thought that up? Normally Apple is so good with GUI stuff. Open/Save dialogs are a part of Finder, and they suck too. No "up" button. Urgh. No address bar. Only cool thing about finder is the pretty icons and the multi-rowed browsing.
The second thing is the lack of a maximize button. Zoom doesn't cut it. I want to make one window full-screen with a click. A few programs like Mail.App let you command-zoom to maximize. But most just maximize vertically or fit the window to the size of the data inside it.
If I really do have to keep juggling manually (is this how they sell you a Cinema 30"?) can I at least have sticky edges so windows gravitate toward screen and nearby window edges when moving and sizing?
It really does. It just never act like I expect in many ways. I just want a "right click" open folder in new window.
Either it always opens in a new window or never does.
How about:
- the ability to give my windows, background etc. all the possible colors instead of having to choose between a few
- a utility with which you can choose the standard application for certain file types/processes
- a decent clock that gives you the date when you hover your mouse cursor over it
Yes, they are small things, but small things are often the ones that annoy us the most, because you keep seeing them.
-- Cheers!
For instance, most hardware vendors will include a two button mouse. This has nothing to do with MS Windows. One can buy many types of mice and use it on many different windowing systems. However, by making the two button mouse standard, the applications, and indeed the windowing system, can utilize this standard. Whether the result is effective is debatable. What is true is a single button mouse is more effective for the new user, and those with hand problems. When Apple enforces the single button mouse, the computer is generally available to more people. One can buy a two button mouse, or a track pad, or sketch pad, or a pointer, or whatever one wishes. But Apple sells one thing.
The second isue is what is standard. IS the control key standard. Probably. I use it in X Windows. But complaining about a shortcuts keys miss the basic issue. In a GUI the first consideration should be does the GUI work. In this respect, one can argue whether menus should take advantage of habit and stay in the same place, or realize the the screen is huge and move. But if one is going to talk about shortcuts, one should remeber that it was Apple that enforced the consisant shortcuts, i.e, meta-c is always cut, and the likes of MS who pushed against that consistancy to maintain competative advantage. But really the whole thing boils down to basic confusion. The layout of the keyboard is not the OS. One can buy a Mac keyboard to use on the PC. Of course, due to silly bios issues, one still needs a XT keyboard.
So, lets stick knife in this puppy. A valid issue, that involves a discussion of complexity, number of ways to reach one command, and even the sensibility of the toolbar itself. It seems to me that one graduates from the heirchical menu system to the keyboard shortcut, and usefulness of the toolbar is in that it allows you to get to things you need, but no so often that you remember the shortcut.
The most interesting suggestions are limiting files and sorting. I like working with OO.org in x-windows because I can select by type. OTOH, most files in Mac OS I open from the desktop. If I need 10 files, I open them. It used to be you print fro the desktop to. I miss that. It could be with many thing MS Windows, the feature is a hack for some other deficiency in the system, perhaps now fixed, or a relic from the CLI days. I would say the folder was the same thing. I have never missed it.
I really do not mean to be a fanboy here. There are significant issues with Mac OS X. It still hangs. I wish it included more wireless drivers. But this article is lame because, like so many others, it does not try to understand the philosophy of different OS, and why some things needs to be different. I know that most users cannot differentiate between the layers of a computer, just like they think that IE is the internet, but if you are going to write about something, try to think a little harder before you start.
"She's a scientist and a lesbian. She's not going to let it slide." Orphan Black
Sort folders to top of directory listings. I hate this about Windows. Does anyone know how to disable this under Windows XP/2003? When I sort by name, I want to sort by name, not folders first and then name. Duh.
This sound more like: "I want them to be the same 'cuase I use both but can't be bothered to learn the small differences."
Now if he would have said use Joliet instead of 9660 then that would be an arguement.
http://mac.pieters.cx/ - LockTight sets a key sequence to lock the computer, configurable on the key set too IIRC.
I am, and always will be, an idiot. Karma: Coma (mostly effected by
Clearly many people commenting on this are either not reading the article, or are not comprehending it.
The macintosh has support for the second mouse button. HE DOES NOT DENY THIS. However, Apple's own apps and the finder have middling to piss-poor support for the second mouse button.
Why can't I sort a folder from a context menu? Irritating as hell. Quicktime, both buttons do the same thing, indicating the designer didn't know or care about usability (quicktime's not exactly a marvel in any usability aspect, I admit.) The iLife suite in general has lame context menu support. Spotty support is in some ways worse than none.
Third party apps are much better about this than Apple is. It's an almost euphoric experience to use a Mac app with context menus as well-defined as a windows or Linux app.
PLEASE, Apple! I'm not leaving the platform over this, but you're not even doing as good a job as your third-party vendors.
I have only one thing to say about this:
Shift+Del, Ctrl+Ins, Shift+Ins, forever, baby!
From article: Switching between Mac and Windows this drives me nuts. I have to consciously think "command-C or control-C?" It shouldn't have to be that way. And if you're running RDC or VPC and copying and pasting between OS X and Windows!! Sheesh!
If you really must do this, you can do it in 'system preferences'. Just go to the 'Keyboard & Mouse' pref pane and click the modifier keys button. voila! switch control and option or whatever else you want.
There are 10 types of people in this world, those who can count in binary and those who can't.
All I know is that on Windows, I can open files in apps that aren't the officially designated one.
Overall, this article is typical windows user complaining because they don't want to spend the time to learn a new platform. OS X has these features, it just takes time to learn them. Same thing if switching from Mac to Windows. Let's go down the list, shall we then...
1) Compatible control keys.
OS X already does this... just look in system preferences for the keyboard and mouse pref pane.
2) Save button on toolbars
This is an app specific criticism and has nothing to do with the OS. Office has these save buttons in the toolbar. in iTunes, iPhoto, etc. such a feature is not needed (everything is saved by default.)
3) A multi button mouse.
see parent: Exactly. That's a hardware issue, not an operating system (OS X) issue. It's not OS X's fault that Apple ships computers with single-button mice.
4) Only show relevant file types in open and save dialogs
conceded... I guess. I don't mind the OS X behavior here because I am in the habit of opening files via drag and drop from spotlight or the finder.
5) Sort folders to top of directory listings
Finder's list view does this if you sort by the 'kind' column.
6) More context sensitive help
conceded. OS X help system in general needs work. But last time I ran Winders it wasn't much better.
There are 10 types of people in this world, those who can count in binary and those who can't.
You resize a window by dragging the bottom right corner of the window, or zooming it my clicking the green button at top left of the title bar.
AppleScript the tool is awesome. Anything I can do with my Mac can be scripted, and generally if I find myself doing something repeatedly, I bang out a script for it. Most of these scripts are just a few lines long, but they save me a ton of work in the end. As an example:Dead simple, amazingly useful.
there's more than one way to do me.
If anyone is in the wrong here it's Windows. Appel established all the common keyboard shortcuts years before Windows was even a gleam in Bill Gate's eye. Windows copied them - BUT DECIDED TO USE ALT INSTEAD for its modifier. Maybe it had no choice - those early PC keyboards didn't have the appropriate key that Apple had added to their keyboards.
But don't go blaming Apple for this, they decided it needed a special, different key and so added it. They have stuck to their guns and rightly so - the Windows implementation is a workaround. As usual Windows ignores what is RIGHT and does what it can within its own imposed limitations, and the population is just expected to learn it that way and to hell with the HCI research.
I personally recommend the original microsoft laser pointer mouse. The scrollwheel works great, and os x lets you configure what you want to use the extra buttons for. For me, it's expose, desktop, and dashboard.
Why would any one expect apple to put out a good mouse?
I used to go to the apple computer at my work and get pissed of at the hockey puck mouse. My hand would quickly loose directionality. I need then to look at the mouse reorient and that would work for another minute.
Well after that mistake they decided we didn't need mice buttons so the whole mouse moves. Instead of a simple finger click the whole arm has to move and release preasure off the back of the mouse, thus requiring a change in clicking technique for the worse. I can move a finger faster than an arm.
I wonder how crappy their next mouse will be.
It has been statistically shown that helmets increase the risk of head injury.
Another result of the same decision to use th eALT key for keyboard shortcuts is that it prevented form being used as a kind of super-shift key for typing characters. On the Mac this is great - it's trivially easy to type accented charactérs as you gö along if you want, without breaking your typing speed or train of thought - by using ALT (or option, in Mac parlance) to get to those characters. On Windows, you have to open up a whole separate character palette and cut and paste it from there, or else memorise very arcane keyboard codes. While OS X also has a character palette, it's not often that you have to use it, while on Window you have little choice. To compound the problem on Windows, it also cuts and pastes the font and style from the character palette, which is just plain stupid - I just want the character, please adopt the font and style where I paste it! This is so obvious that I wonder just who provides UI decisions on Windows - this one could have been done better if a 5-year old child had been consulted.
What MS should have done is to specify that an extended keyboard with a command key would be necessary to access keyboard shortcuts in Windows, and within 6 months or a year, those keyboards would have been the standard. Instead they imposed a workaround that had no upsides except compatibility with the existing PC keyboard, and many downsides that are simply accepted by the 'dozers today as "the way it is".
Like everyone else, I'm going to look at the suggestions:
1) Compatible control keys.
Oh, please, no.
If it matters, then there should be an argument about which way is better, other than "more people are used to the Microsoft way". And if it doesn't matter, then it shouldn't be a big deal.
It isn't the labelling, but the position? Let's not muck around too much with the position, eh? It was an unmitigated disaster when some bozo decided that the control key ought to be on the same row as the space instead of to the left of the "A" key; let's not continue the trend of rendering the standard keyboard unusable.
If you want a different layout, remap the keys yourself, or buy a different keyboard. Line up to buy one of the Optimus keyboards if they come out next year, and map all of the keys to exactly where you want them.
If I were paranoid, I'd say that this suggestion was designed to drive the sorts of people who haven't been appropriately indoctrinated into the Microsoft Windows Way[tm] away from computers entirely. If I had to use the Dell keyboard that came with the machine at work, I'd probably be contemplating a job that didn't involve computers, and wouldn't for the foreseeable future.
2) Save button on toolbars.
As has been pointed out, this is an application thing, not an OS thing.
Personally, I'm not a big fan of toolbars. Trying to puzzle out the little icons isn't a profitable use of my time (and! yet! here! I! am! on! slashdot! yeah, yeah, I get the irony.), so I'd just as soon have the option to get rid of the toolbars and reclaim that screen real-estate for getting actual work done.
Finally, the appropriate solution would be to give the user the choice of setting up the toolbar (like Mail.app) with every possible leaf in the menu-tree. Why bicker about "save", when all the leaves in the menu should be allowable targets for the user to put into the toolbar?
3) A multi button mouse
Hardware request. Bogus objection.
What I want is a freaking three-button mouse with a scroll-wheel, where the scroll-wheel isn't trying to double-up as the third button. Yes, I know, I can "just click on the scroll-wheel", but I don't want to. I also don't want tiny little buttons that I can use with my thumb or pinky or whatever. I'm not looking for a funky keyboard on my mouse, after all (which is where this eternally-growing-button-list trend goes).
But if the OS works with a single-button mouse, fine. Why should that be a problem? You want people who do best with a single-button mouse to have a terrible time with their computer? Such sadism makes for a very poor UI, and is no doubt part of the reason I bailed out of the Microsoft-centric world-view many years ago.
4) Only show relevant file types in open and save dialogs.
Many applications ghost out "inappropriate" files already. But making the actual hiding of information a system default is just bad form -- I get extremely annoyed when my computer hides information from me.
Which leads into this nonsense of "hiding file extensions". THEY ARE NOT FREAKING EXTENSIONS: THE ARE SUFFIXES!
Yes, boys and girls, it's the height of idiocy to look at the NAME of a file to determine how to handle it when you can look in a file to see what sort of thing it actually is. One of the stupidest "features" of Microsoft Windows is it's inability to understand that a JPEG file is actually a JPEG file even thought it's named "Foo", or, gosh darn it, even maliciously renamed to "Foo.GIF".
5) Sort folders to top of directory listings
Th
Pick One: http://www-rohan.sdsu.edu/~stremler/sigs/sigs.html (Note - disable Javascript first!)
Open/Save dialogs are not part of the Finder, they are a UI service provided by the OS frameworks.
There is an "Up" button - just click the menu at the top and you get the full path down to where you are, with the current location highlighted. Go up one. In fact go up two, three, whatever - it's much more useful than a single "up" button. Also, there is a back/forward button so you can easily navigate through your file browsing history.
There are legitimate issues with Finder usability, but to be honest most actual users don't spend much time in the Finder, they use applications to get Stuff Done(TM).
I can totally relate to this guy. Apple should start using some of Microsoft's ideas, like binding the browser on a molecular level to the OS itself! I upgraded my iBook to 10.3 and it put in Internet Explorer, which I don't prefer to use. I was able to delete it by dragging it to my trash can! No BSOD, no registry conflicts, no "flagrant system errors", nothing!
Those who believe the Internet is private,
find their privates are on the Internet.
--Rick "If it isn't broken, take it apart and find out why."
OSX is perfect. Now pass the Kool-aid.
Games from Ambrosia Software actually use this as a pause key. If its on the game is paused. I even think some first person shooters use it to toggle the always-run or always-walks modes.
Just because you don't imagine yourself using it does not mean someone else isn't.
Jumpstart the tartan drive.
I keep plugging in a trackball into my powerbook because the shitty trackpad there only has one button. This is my biggest criticism (apart from the battery debacle) about an otherwise fine laptop. Can't Apple just see this, that people who buy their laptops aren't just 'Mac Fanatics' who hold Jobs in the esteem of some prophet and lap up everything he says.... LOTS of us want 2 button (or more) trackpads...
Every time I hear about articles like this, even if they have some sort of merit, I feel that the author missed something:
If I travel to another country, people there have their way of doing things. They have their own culture. Sure things may seem difficult to the foreigner, but to the people living there everything makes sense and for them it is obvious. The only way to deal with it is to learn about that culture and accept things for what they are. Of course that doesn't mean that they are immune to learning different ways of doing things.
Switching to a different OS is much the same thing. Not everything is going to make sense, but some things might. Over time you learn the way things work there and accept things for what they are, better or worse.
Jumpstart the tartan drive.
I have used KDE menu's and an active user of True Launch Bar for my windoze box. Definitely the best way to mouse around apps.
If only Mac would come out with a framework to support this off of the Dock....
Any Ideas?
Ironic that he says the Mac needs more context sensitive help. Mac OS 7 thru 9 had context sensitive help everywhere--hit the Help key, then hover the mouse over something to get a help balloon. The system was universally derided in the press, as I recall. Users really didn't use it, and eventually a lot of developers stopped bothering to implement it.
GCHQ Quantum Insert installed. If only our tongues were made of glass, how much more careful we would be when we speak
1. Resize from any side/corner of a window. You could at least drag by side borders in OS 9 - neither border-drag or side/corner resize is an option ins OS X. You use the bottom right corner or you live with it (this sucks for Photoshop).
:P
:P
2. Directories sorted before files. It's not a BIG thing, but I for one like it and wouldn't mind it being at least an option.
3. Windows tells me how big the directory I'm browsing is. Compare to OS X, which tells me how much free space I have on the disk, forcing me to get-info on a directory (or view as a list with "calculate all sizes" on, and be prepared to wait if it's a big directory) to find out how much space it's eating. Given just how big Apple is on the column view, you'd think they'd do something about this.
4. You can Fullscreen apps like IE and Firefox. And by full screen, I mean FULL. SCREEN. None of this dock shit - this functionality alone makes it a hell of a lot easier to use Windows for web kiosks.
What is so hard or odd about Ctrl Click ? Why must there be a consideration in conformity ? I like the Ctrl Click method, because in is not that Windows platform.
The one thing I really would like is the ability to delete files directly from the Save and Open dialogs. It doesn't need a button, but highlighting a file and pressing delete should allow me to get rid of that file.
Apple is doing just fine.
These are all trivial and silly. For instance, I would argue that Apple has it right with the Command key and it's Windows that needs to catch up. I'm sick of breaking my hand in two trying to hit Control and another key at the same time, move Ctrl in beside the space like Command on a Mac and we'll all be happier.
He's just using a troll headline to drum up some traffic. And, damn it, I fell for it.
I think that it doesn't make sense to compare Windows to OSX or - say - KDE or Gnome. "What can learn OSX from Windows?" - That's not a serious question.
Microsoft is putting out patches from time to time to fix vulnerabilities, but thats all. Apple releases feature upgrades every now and then. And thats the major difference. Realisticly, it'll take another one or two years until Windows users will have transparent windows and eye-candies like you can see on OSX. ONE to TWO years!
Sure, there might be some features that could be "ported" over to OSX, but it'll take just a few months until they'd be available.
The development-cycle of MS Windows is just too slow nowadays. Nothing really happens anymore. If I see a Windows-box at work, I feel like last century and I guess that a lot of customers are feeling the same. All the "inventions" in Longhorn are already there: OSX, KDE(!), Gnome, and if not, they'll be implemented in the next time.
MS is just too slow. It's just rediculous. The world is not like it was ten or twenty years ago, where it was easy to paint a one-OS-monopoly for MS. The potential customers are realizing that the real inventions are happening somewhere else.
BTW: Some of the majer "analysts" are saying the same and I hope that the shareholders are realizing whats going on with MSFT.
Why is the only way to access the Context Menu from the mouse? I much, much prefer the Windows key method in Windows. This is particularly so when I'm typing text in an email message or Word. To follow thru on this example, I want to be able to activate the context menu on a mispelt word without having to leave the keyboard and find the mouse. I love being able to press the Windows key on a PC and selecting the correct spelling and fixing the mistake, all without leaving the keyboard. There should be a way to activate the context menu from the keyboard!
I wish Apple would bring back the close-all-windows-in-focused-app keystroke from OS8 and OS9. 2 years after jumping to OSX, I still find myself pressing Option-Cmnd-W, especially when looking at many graphics or documents in Preview.
>>> I don't think it's just a matter of getting used to it, and of breaking old habits. No, the placement of the Command key really is detrimental to its use, at least as far as my fingers are concerned. Until today I've been trying to live with it, but now I'm going to find a way to remap the keys so as to move Command farther to the left.
Try using different fingers. On my work machines (windows), I use left pinky and index for Ctrl+C, where as on the mac, I use ring and middle. Both gestures require you to move your left hand away from "base position", and personally, I find neither inconvenient. I do agree that trying to use the same fingers you use on windows is contortion at best, which is why I found a new way when I switched.
So I would argue, that yes, it is a breaking of old habbits.
We don't need an "overrated" so much as we need a "you completely missed the parent's point, dumbass..."
I want to say two things that should be at the back of your mind when reading such an article:
;-)
1) Mac OS is and will always be a mix of an entry level system and a power house. A (sometimes awkward) marriage of a first-timer computer and a professional work station. So if you want the kind of contextual menu's Windows has (with every option available), dream on. That's way too much for a novice. If you want a system that actually needs a three button mouse, stick to what you're used to. I wouldn't dream of only using one mouse but know quite a few intelligent people who can't master more than one button. If this depresses you, go out and smell the roses
OTOH OS X does allow for a fair amount of tweaking, so at least some of the author's preferences can be met by digging in preferences settings or third party add-ons.
2) These kind of usability opinion pieces are always better when they come from the kind of person who spends about 50/50 time on each system he tries to evaluate. I'm not saying the guy doesn't have points, but most of them only make sense when you're actually a windows guy stuck on OS X.
I'm not out to blow this article away, just saying that if you take these two points into consideration, it all makes a bit more sense and helps differenciate between the author's personal preferences and genuine usability issues.
I think, therefore I am...I think.
Look at any study with "new" computer users and you will see that most of them have a lot of trouble adjusting to a "right click".
...And exactly where is the double click in a Web interface? It turned out that the best way to get an old lady to double click a Mac mouse was to get her to click (to select), go to the File menu, and choose "Open". That's for Mac tech support (and I've done plenty.) For Windows tech support, having them click the right mouse button, then choose "Open" (or some other option) was at least as easy.
Now look at any study of what percentage of computer users these days are "new" users. Hint: 1984 was more than 20 years ago and there have been some MAJOR changes in computer user demographics since then. In the US, the average computer user is NOT still using his first computer, and his first computer more likely than not, had a two button mouse.
Granted, in markets such as India or China, most users are now new users, but Macs are nowhere to be found in those markets, and Macs are still using that canard about new users to justify their design in their major markets where only a small fraction of users are new to using a computer mouse.
Have you ever worked in technical support?
I don't know about him, but I used to *run* a tech support department. I whiled away many hours trying to teach old ladies how to double click a single-button Mac mouse...
do us all a favour and work as a web developer for a few years before you touch any desktop applications.
That's just for the newbies, though. Over time, the percentage of our users who had to be walked through the process of double clicking declined (we kept stats on all issues that resulted in calls, thereby costing us money). It never disappeared, but crippling the interface for the average user to accommodate newbies makes less sense now than ever, and if you must do it, and your theory about Web usablility being the way to do all app usability, then when is the Mac going to eliminate double clicking?
I thought not. And now that a huge percentage of the population has spent years using computers with twin mouse buttons, having Macs crippled in this way just makes them annoying to use. (Again, as the other poster said, getting an external 2-button mouse isn't very useful when the OS & most apps are context menu deficient.)
"Those who have never entered upon scientific pursuits know not a tithe of the poetry by which they are surrounded."
Some file systems should not be write-cached. I find it very strange that I can't simply remove a flash memory card from my Mac's card reader without first unmounting the flash volume. I can understand that external harddisks and such must be unmounted first, but a flash memory card?
Apple could learn from Windows in this regard.
What i hate about the Finder is when you open a view of a Folder using "View As List", and then have to manually tweak the window size in order to fit the list details in that view.
.. and it will resize the list view columns as well, so that the data just fits nicely.
.. why isn't Finder smart enough to adjust the Detail columns according to the metrics of the data being displayed? Seems to me I could fix it with Applescript, but damn .. I wish Finder just moved itself around to conform to your window setting..
With Windows Explorer, you can hit Control-Numpad+ and it will automatically do a little jig for you to get all the content revealed in your window
I desperately need this feature in Finder
; -- the corruption of government starts with its secrets. a truly free people keep no secrets. --
There is only one feature (or rather, group of features) I miss from Windows. Image viewing, outside of iPhoto.
Yes, there is Preview. And it is better than the default Image and Fax Viewer in Windows in many ways. But, for instance, I like that I can load one image in IaFV in Windows and immediately I have the option of using the arrow keys to browse other pictures in the same directory...I would love to see it integrated into Preview. I also like "Filmstrip" mode in Windows.
iPhoto is a great app, but I don't always want to use it for browsing through pictures...I generally just use it for pictures from my digital camera.
And I think that's the whole point. Anyone can use a Mac as-is, and those that need it can add functionality with another mouse. Those people, of course, are the same people that are most likely to understand their need and know what to buy. A kindergartener, on the other hand, certainly lacks the wherewithall to change the mouse on their computer! Shouldn't the burden be on those who are capable of bearing it?
Not to mention quite how wasteful the Windows use of the alt key is. A single key on the keyboard dedicated to invoking menus? Who thought of that idea. Not using the key for a common function, or as a modifier, using it to invoke menus. From which several key presses are then required to select any options.
I am TheRaven on Soylent News
"And yes, it includes the right-click mouse."
Chalk up another mouth-breathing moron incapable of buying a regular USB mouse and connecting it to a Mac. Will the pain ever end?
The INFAMOUS Apple mouse is NOT part of OSX, it is not included with OSX, it is not necessary to use OSX, and it is not necessary to use a Mac. If you don't like having just one button then, GASP, buy a mouse with two, or three, or even five!
Gadgetoid.com - Gadgets & Games Journalism
SHENS as Genmayers would say.. I think.
This article is clearly a half-arsed attempt at pulling in curious traffic by producing something controversial about OSX. Either that, or the writer really is as moronic as he sounds. It's a tough call.
1) Compatible control keys Long story short, the Apple keyboard is a piece of hardware. Can we tell the difference between hardware and software, I think so. Can he? Evidently not. Here is a simple tutorial:
2) Save button on toolbars He wants to click a button to save? What the bejesus is the CTRL+S key combination for? I have never even noticed this problem because, odly enough, my Mac is capable of running software not manufactured by Apple- funny that. Even so, how are save buttons in software a feature that the operating system could use from Windows? Can we tell the difference between operating systems and applications? Maybe. Can he? I'll let you work that out for yourself.
3) A multi button mouse Looks like he is having the hardware/software confusion problem again! What a terrible shame. Wait, he claims it is not a windows feature "per se"... yet he is still incapable of connecting any standard USB mouse to a Macintosh. Idiot. If I had a penny for every moron who complained about the one button mouse I would be rich, rich, rich, and they would still be whinging about their one button mouse rather than plugging in a standard two, three, five, or eight billion button one.
By god, the final 3 points are minor but actually relevant! Looks like he saved me from having to waste my time shooting down his entire article- bravo! Moron. You lose anyway.
The only thing OSX needs from windows is its user base!
Gadgetoid.com - Gadgets & Games Journalism
I don't agree with any of the preferences of the author, but that's beside the point, it's always good to look at other GUI's.
There is however one thing that I do like in Windows. All media you plug into a PC shows up in one directory (forgotten how it's called, My Devices, My Disks, My whatever). It's device-centric, which IMO (or maybe more honestly: in my experience) is ass-backwards but it does work.
So on the Mac, I wouldn't complain about having a sort of directory where all of your devices (printers, routers, etc. included) would show up, along with some relevant options, including access to the media inside the device.
Yes, I DO like the Mac way, and I wouldn't want to change it. Whatever you plug into your mac, the actual media will appear on the desktop, not the device carrying it (you'll see the CD, not the CD reader/writer). And as a bonus you can set the preferences to for instance open iTunes, or when inserting a camera, iPhoto. That's great, no sweat.
Nevertheless I think it wouldn't hurt to have both ways of looking at things, and incidentally one that switchers will be more familiar with.
Purists will hate the idea, but who cares.
I think, therefore I am...I think.
First, required reading for anyone writing these types of articles: Apple Human Interface Guidelines.
Now, I'm not going to address every point the author makes, but here are a two comments:
1: I find the placement of the Command key much more ergonomic than that of the Control key on most PC keyboards. Furthermore, it's called the Command key because it's for issuing commands! CTRL-[some character] shouldn't issue a command. The control key is a modifier key.
2: While saving IS a very common task in some programs (like Text Edit... where Command-S is the way to go...), the problem with providing a toolbar button for it is designing an intuitive icon for it. A picture of a disk doesn't make sense because Macs haven't used floppies since the iMac first came out. Oh ya, did I mention Command-S? It's extremely ergonomic. Use your left thumb and index finger.
The bits on the bus go on and off... on and off... on and off...
1. Compatible control keys
The gist of this writer's complaint is squarely focussed on the positioning of the 'Command' key (some call it the 'Apple' key) on the Mac keyboard. He goes as far as to say that 'Apple - and the zealotry - need to concede that this battle is lost..
I am both a Windows and OS X user (Windows mainly for games) and I can attest that the Mac keyboard command key layout is vastly superior to that of a standard PC keyboard because of the position that you must contort your hand into in order to use the latter.
For many PC users it is a case of simply not having experienced any better, so it's difficult to convince them to change their ways, but take an objective view of using both layouts with just one hand, and it's incredibly difficult to argue that the PC way is less strenuous. Perhaps this is responsible for much greater adoption of keyboard shortcuts among casual users on the Mac platform.
2. Save button on toolbars
Saving actively modifies a file on disk, perhaps overwriting or saving a 'bad' copy over what was originally a preferred version by accident. I am content not to have my toolbar filled with such items. However, this suggestion is not entirely devoid of merit (unlike the others, as we'll see).
3. A multi-button mouse
I don't understand why we still have this issue. You can plug practically any mouse into OS X, with any obscene number of buttons you desire and it will work. The writer continues: 'Why stop at two? Especially with things like Exposé, Dashboard and Spotlight.'. It would, frankly, be a nightmare for anyone but a poweruser to use. My mother does just fine with a one button mouse, she has enough trouble remembering what needs to be single clicked and what needs to be double clicked in the interface. This is truely a ridiculous idea. The preliferation of dozens of buttons of mice is a typical Windows thing - just look at how the Start menu itself has also grown from a simple and fairly useful applications menu (Win 95) to the default monstrosity of usability that it is today (Win XP).
It's also worth mentioning that the usability of software on the Mac platform benefits hugely by forcing developers to come up with more elegant ways with which to allow control of the app - rather than (as is all too often the case in Windows) relying on the context menu to shuffle all the little commands into.
4) Only show relevant file types in open and save dialogs.
This has the effect of confusing users by making it look as though some of their stuff may be missing. It also does not allow for the identification of a folder via its contents (looking for a folder: "It's the folder with the Picture of Mom in it" for example). The OS X way gives you the best of both worlds. If anything, it should be Windows changing to the OS X way here for these important usability reasons.
5) Sort folders to top of directory listings
Not without merit.
6) More context sensitive help.
God... please no. Tooltips should, in the perfect interface NEVER be necessary. They are analogous to sticky tape holding together the interface... 'what's that? I've designed a crap interface and no-one can tell what this button is supposed to do from it's placement and icon? Well I could go and redesign the interface, or I could 'fix' it by adding a tooltip, and leaving it up to the user to figure it all out."
This sig has been deprecated.
The single most useful feature of windows over mac is the users ability to manipulate files anywhere in the OS. It saves a great amount of time to be able to right click on files in save/open dialogs and create new files, zip other files, or delete. Additionally, you can right click on your 'Favorites' and 'Start' menu items. Having a pervasive menu bar is extremely useful, especially when combined with the 'folders' view. Finally, the right click to 'create new shortcut' is actually quite useful as well. I'd rather use Mac any day, but the Finder is missing so many features that I can work more efficiently on winXP. Using Spotlight is fine, but I have tons of data files whose names I don't remember, so I need a solid file browser to back it up and Finder no longer makes the grade.
Is the Open/Save dialog from windows. you can rename files there, oben a Explorer for the folder, paste a (long) path there
IMO Windows is the one that should switch. Using the Control key for key combos puts unnatural stress on your little finger that can lead to very real RSIs. Using the thumb instead, as you do when using Apple's Command key, is much more ergonomically sound.
The most amazingly stupid thing about Windows: when you close all documents, the application window insists on being opaque gray. What the heck good is that, other than making it impossible to click on the desktop or windows of any other running app? The app window, void of documents, should absolutely go transparent.
Why it is that users worldwide put up with this horrible implementation is beyond me.
https://app.box.com/WitthoftResume Code: https://github.com/cellocgw
Don't think I can agree with any of these:
.extension.
:-)
Comapatible control keys:
I can get used to the difference, it is a pain yes, but why change something when it simply aint broke. - on balance this is the suggestion I have least problem with tho...
Save buttons on toolbars:
Mac has -always- made more use of keyboard shortcuts, by making them consistent and easier to learn. I would say most ppl go for a {insert platform key] + s to save, and that is better than a button on the toolbar.
Multimouse Buttons:
More than two I believe gets unwieldy - you are welcome to go and purchase one and map its buttons to Expose functions etc etc, but shipping by default makes no sense to me. So, you can already have this if you are mad enough to want it.
Show only relevant files:
No bloomin way.. ever used Word/ Textpad etc to open up a file that you know it understands, but the little drop down isn't set to the right
Folders to top of dir listings:
My jury has been out on this for ages.. in a way I would prefer, but whats stopping them is the keystroke searching through the filelist.
Anyway... It'a good to see these things being brought up... the article is valid for that at least, and questioning the status-quo is good (and why they ever got to number one I will never know
Microsoft should by Apple and put Windows on Macs. Apple designs great hardware and this move would allow Microsoft to counteract the whimpering from Dell and HP by offering quality hardware as a Windows value add. The iPod line could be easy converted to play WMAs and the purchase would give Microsoft an instant launch into the online music business. If Microsoft decided to support OS X then Microsoft's Mac BU division could provide more applications to needy Mac users. This would also be a great defense against Linux desktop users. JUST KIDDING!!!
He left out a couple of things I thought surely would be in there:
1. a windows explorer-style finder, where you can see your whole nested-folder structure all the time, if you want. Moving and copying files and folders around is a pain. Oh and, get rid of column-view, unless you can make it actually work right. The column width resizing issue really gets on my nerves. It does not obey!
2. Maximize just doesn't work. Why can't Mac OS do something as simple as MAKING A WINDOW TAKE UP THE WHOLE SCREEN?
On the whole, I disagree with most of the points raised in the article. And I'll take Mac OS over Windows any old day.
Powerbook G4/1.5GHz 12", Toshiba Satellite 1135-S1554
Windows - which initially listed the mouse as merely "recommended" - has always had much stronger keyboad support. But I suppose with the Windows GUI shoving this feature under the rug (e.g. the Alt-key underlines turned off by default), I suppose I'm swimming against the tide asking for this.
http://alternatives.rzero.com/
The OS remembers what order it was in before, so if you sort alphabetically, it will be alphabetical, then if you sort by type, it will be sorted by type, with each type sub-sorted alphabetically. It might not be quite what is wanted, but it will separate the folders into an alphabetical listing. Personally I detest the brain dead way it gets sorted in windows. YMMV
Why learn from a bad OS when you can learn from a good one?
1) I'd love a text based application switching menu top right, rather than the pointless single application menu that puts junk like 'ChineseTextConverter' in the most promient position and slides the far more important 'File' menu about depending on the length of the application name.
2) Bring back the old customisable Apple menu.
3) Put the wastebasket on the desktop.
and most importantly...
4) Let me turn the dock off!
A pizza of radius z and thickness a has a volume of pi z z a
One thing that Windowx now handles much better than Apple:
Sub-pixel font smoothing
Windows font smoothing is really easy ont he eyes, whereas Apple attempts to smooth the fonts in two dimensions, something that comes off looking clumsy. (Because the red, green, and blue parts of the pixel are arranged horizontally, one can simulate a white line that's 5/3 of a pixel wide by lighting up all of one pixel and then R and G of the next, but the height has to be a whole number of pixels.)
It's supposedly a licensing issue, but I'd really like to see Apple make some kinds of deal and adopt something closer to ClearType. It really is a joy to look at.
This is one of the Major reasons I switched to Mac from BeOS.
I fell in love with this concept using BeOS and was one of the reasons I used it for so long as my Primary OS. (4 years)
After the Dissolution of BeOS, I decided to go back to a Mainstream OS. (GNOME and KDE had stagnated, and still haven't progressed IMHO). Windows "International Keyboard" Keymap was a Joke at best, so I chose a Mac.
The blue screen of death in aqua of course
Republicans are jackballs...there, I said it!
The real problem with Apple and one-button-mice is that unless you buy a Mac mini, Apple FORCES you to buy their stupid single button mouse along with your new Mac (or worse, a built-in single button trackpad on their laptops).
They already find Mac to be more useful as is. My parents don't need a two button mouse they prefer the single one. They don't need and open/save dialog to change filenames. They don't need a Windows type explorer. Apple does a great job for those people who never used a computer to sit down and start using one. I've posted this in the past that my parents, who are complete novices, first bought the Dell WindowsXP paperweight. When I pushed my Mom to purchase an Apple then she started using it and my Dad can't get off the computer anymore. He went from being scared of the damn thing to ordering everything he wants online and even sold his Dell paperweight on E-Bay. We forget about those individuals that have no experience on a computer and find that the GUI and mouse is very intuitive. Which is why the Mac OS is exactly bothersome for people who used Windows but for others it's perfect as is.
Save Pangaea!! Stop Continental Drift!!
If they do, then programmers will start assuming that the user has two buttons and start programming for them.
Right now I can do everything I want with one button, and can use two if I want... If every developer and every future potential developer signed a contract in blood to the effect of "I won't make crappy decisions like burying an essential operation in a stupid contextual menu" then Apple might consider a two button mouse... until then, please... hold your breath...
Like anyone can even know that
is missing from both windows and OS X:
Middle click paste (from PRIMARY)
I cannot stand being without it, I am so used to it from linux. I try to do it in windows all the time and am befuddled when I click on my scroll wheel and it does absolutely nothing (or worse yet, changes it to a scroller).
An idea to solve the 1 button / 2 button mouse thing that I would really like to have on an ibook or powerbook is that if I tap the pad it is a regular click and if I press the button it is a right click. If I am going to use an external mouse I am going to use one with a wheel, but sometimes carting a mouse around that you have to put someplace when you are trying to use it just isn't an option.
What can OSX learn from Windows? Absolutley nothing. ^-^
"People are not born bastards. They have to work at it." ~Rod McKuen~
From a Linux (and forced Windows) user:
2) Save buttons: I can't think of the last time I actually clicked on a Save button. If I'm doing something that actually requires saving (editing and viewing a web page), I use Ctrl-S. For most work, saving is not something the user should have to worry about - the program should keep a frequently updated backup on disk, so the user shouldn't need to keep saving.
3) Multi button mouse: I hate multi-button mice. I had one of those MS 5 button ones for a while and it drove me mad - I kept accidentally clicking. You can't just grab the mouse and move it, as you have all these buttons on the side.
There's no 'on' position on the Slacker switch!
I use both and generally prefer OS X. However, the two Windows features that I prefer are (1) resizing from any side (also in KDE) and (2) easy menu navigation starting with alt. Regarding (2), I find it very easy and natural in Windows to glance at the menu items, press alt-whatever to get to a particular one, and get to whatever submenu I need.
I know about ctrl-fn-f2 (on my iBook), but, to me, it's not nearly as nice.
This is the Constitution.This is the Constitution under the Bush administration. Any questions?
Unfortunately two buttons doesn't help on laptops either, because a trackpad isn't handled the same way as a mouse where two fingers may be held steady on two buttons.
It isn't very practical with a touchscreen, nor with a stylus. Starting to get the picture?
Multi-button mice, or rather multi-button clicking, is not a very well-thought out UI concept. And tell me why, why does windows use double and triple-click too? I mean, those are substitutes for the rare occassions when you really need multiple click modes.
When you are sitting in front of your laptop, instead of cursing the button deficiency you should pray that your problem is solved by more developers following apple's example and cut the ties to a particular two-button input device. Seems even MS are trying; PocketPCs have a "click-and-hold" which, incidentally works exactly as in the OS X dock. Why? Because requiring several click buttons is impractical.
There's no 'on' position on the Slacker switch!
There's no 'on' position on the Slacker switch!
how is this offtopic???
There are 10 types of people in this world, those who can count in binary and those who can't.
Please bring us a fast Remote Desktop like MS RDP 5 or ICA.
Yes the apologists will say:
- Use SSH
- Use VNC with compression
- or from a technology standpoint, that it isn't doable with the inherent bitmapping in Quartz Extreme.
A fast secure remote desktop protocol for use with both servers and clients, is definitely one point that Apple's OS X sorely has missed.
Actually, users may very well end up being forced to use context menus. A few badly-ported mac apps do this, because the programmer was so spaced-out on context menus that s/he didn't care to put equivalent commands in the real menus.
In contrast, look at how the mac actually works: everything is available in the Fitt's law-compliant top menus, and certain common options as well as power user features are in context menus too. The advantage? Since developers can't expect anyone to be looking in the context menus, they have to make all options available in dropdown menu.
Which they should have done in the first place, but as you might know developers are people too and occassionally take the easy way out...
There's no 'on' position on the Slacker switch!
- A setting for customising any keyboard shortcut
- A (fairly recently added) setting for exchaning command/option/ctrl/shift/caps lock in any way you like, including turning caps lock off!
You were probably talking about the older (1) while the (2) is the setting relevant to this overinflated issue. Just to clarify!There's no 'on' position on the Slacker switch!
Oh, and don't miss the hilarious cursor enlargement feature
There's no 'on' position on the Slacker switch!
Nope, Apple got it right: it's a question about ergonomics. The most popular command-key shortcuts (Cmd-Z, X, C, V, A, S, F, Q, W) are situated around the lower left of the keyboard, i.e. where the command key is on a Mac keyboard. You can use your thumb to hit the command-key, which is a clear ergonomic advantage.
In this particular case, the ctrl key is way off in the corner of the keyboard, so you must strain your thumb to death or use your (comparatively weak) pinkie. Duh.
--Bud
1) Compatible control keys.
.xls files in the directory... and I personally find that annoying as hell because it saves me no time... and I'm not so computer-illiterate that I'd open Final Cut Pro thinking I want to use it to work on that Excel spreadsheet... considering one would create a spreadsheet in excel, any third-grader should remember that Excel is the preferred application to launch in the first place if you want to be opening XLS files.
... Also have a selector that allows you to choose between showing all file types, or just those native to the application.
Windows doesn't have compatible control keys from one application to the next. Apple is far more strict about uniformity between applications.
Also, because Windows uses Ctrl and Apple uses Command... is not an argument. The fact is, it took my wife less than a few days to be completely adjusted to Macs after a lifetime of using Windows.
2) Save button on toolbars. I don't think any of the Apple software ever gives you the option to include a Save button.
Wrong In any application where a document is created for the purposes of customized use by the user, e.g. Pages, Adobe Photoshop, etc., the "X" (close window) button in the file window changes to a dot. Clicking it prompts a "Save" dialogue box. Windows has no such function.
Also see "File > Save"... consistent in every OS X application, including those which aren't designed for custom document creation (e.g. Safari).
I don't know if the same can be said of Windows, but I would hope so.
3) A multi button mouse.
This argument is the single most repeated, ad nauseum, by those who have never really been aware of Mac's features for the past twenty years.
4) Only show relevant file types in open and save dialogs.
Last I checked, they do precisely that. Unlike Windows, which, if it doesn't recognize a file type, will give you a choice of every possible application under the sun, OS X displays the ones it thinks are most likely to work, or you can select "Other" and pick the one you want to attempt.
Furthermore, control-option-click will switch "Open With..." to "Always Open With...", so the next time you open that document, it always opens with the application you want it to....
Edited something in Photoshop, exported as JPEG and now you want Preview to open it instead of waiting for Photoshop's plug-ins to load? There you go... "Always open with..."
In an "Open" dialogue box, generally, the application shows you all files, but greys out any files that can't be opened by that application. Personally, I like seeing other file types.
If I'm in Microsoft excel, and I want to take a crack at opening a CSV or other such file into Excel, Windows won't so much as show me the file. Granted, it might not open the file anyway... but what use is a directory-browsing function if you can't see what's in it? Maybe I forgot the file type and I don't want to have to use Windows' horrible desktop navigation to find it since I'm already browsing a directory in the 'Open' dialogue box.
Windows Microsoft Excel just shows me the
But for that matter, certain OS X apps that have a need for cross-application support (like Final Cut Pro, which, by the way, does export batch lists in CSV format... one reason I might want to SEE other file formats in Excel)
Some of us like having the option. Isn't "choice" what Bill Gates keeps telling us Windows is all about?
5) Sort folders to top of directory listings I know that we don't go folder mining as much since we got Spotlight, so I won't labor on about this one.
You see that label at the top of your Finder window that says "Kind"... click it and be amazed.
6) More context sensitive help. I notice since I first raised this two years ago, more of it has crept into OS X. So I guess at least I can't be flamed for this o
Let me also add... regarding the "save" function... I've always wondered what was the point of a "Save" button in the toolbar, anyway... when "File > Save" is immediately above it? Are people seriously that stupid that they need a million redundant functions? I like Pages... the toolbar isn't cluttered to hell with icons so small the elderly, who are the most computer-illiterate to begin with, generally can't tell one apart from the other. And for those who truly are computer-illiterate... like my 63-year old mother... Having to jog the mouse one more inch on the screen is the least of her problems. Windows has been an enormous hassle for her... so much that we, the kids, are considering getting her a Mac Mini.
just like the control key mess. It's the whole reason Microsoft sold, and it's the whole reason Microsoft continues to sell.
It's the illusion that you don't have to change anything to get an advantage.
No fuss, no muss, no changing your keyboard, cpu, memory, etc.
Pay MS your money and they'll bring you all the features everybody else invents,
at rock bottom prices,
with no inconveniences
(And you don't even have to understand what you're doing.)
I'd forgotten about this, but you're absolutely right - I use alt-v, which makes a checkmark, all the time on lists and spreadsheets and things. (I'm on a Windows computer right now, or I'd've put the checkmark in there.)
Warning: Apple/Nintendo fangirl. Likes her electronics cute & cuddly. May be rabid.
First, I currently use Windows XP, OS X, and Debian, sometimes all at once. I never have any problem remembering which button is which, except when I move to a differently shaped keyboard (ergonomic ones, etc.). The author's problem is muscle memory. The only place where I can agree this problem exists is in X11 under Aqua, where most X11 apps use the control key, and the rest of the Apple apps use Ctrl. But even then it's not that bad. And if you think I'm using some ubernice keyboard, I'm using a 12" iBook keyboard. It's pretty small.
Has this person used MS Office for OS X? It exists there. It depends on the program you're using. It's not an OS-level problem.
This is a fundamental split in philosophy between Windows and Macintosh. The Windows philosophy is "Can we do it? Then let's do it!" The Mac Philosophy is "Will this get in the user's way? Let's put it in there, but make it so a user who knows how to use it will know how to activate it." OS X has support for ubermice with god knows how many buttons. I have a five button trackball that works with no problem. And case-in-point with the Mac philosophy: My parents don't bother with the right mouse button. All it ever does is confuse them. Hell, it confuses some of my more computer savy friends. The only use they really have for a right mouse button is to bring up the Display Prefs to change their background, and gaming.
The other problem here is that Exposé, Spotlight and Dashboard are not asking for dedicated mouse buttons. I can picture it now, my dad trying to click on a link, whoops! Hit the wrong button! "*Insert my name here*! What the hell happened to the computer?" Seriously, it would be that bad. One wrong click suddenly causing dramatic change of the desktop environment? No. Besides, I use the keyboard more often than the mouse. I have no problem with F9, F10, F11, and F12.
That's just stupidity. There are reasons that the Movies, Music, Documents, etc. directories exist. Documents in OS X is not My Documents in XP. Home in OS X is more akin to My Documents. And last time I checked, XP didn't have this feature. This is the user's sheer lazyness, in refusing to organize their files. Try organizing it from a command line.
I kind of agree with this one, but there's always Sort By Type.
Rawr
My only interface beef with Mac OS X is having to go all the way up to the menu bar to access the menus, instead of having menus in individual windows. I work on a G5 with dual 30-inch displays, where I am often on the right display several thousand pixels away from the menu that I need.
That being said, I don't want to have menus in every window like in Windows, but I would like a mouse button or hotkey that pops up the active menu--not the contextual menu, but the active main menu--right at my cursor location like on the old NeXT computers.
I should have entitled my comments, "What Mac OS Could Learn from NeXTSTEP", but then, Mac OS X is a derivative of NeXTSTEP.