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Microsoft Will Allow Vista Reinstalls
Claus Valca writes "I just spotted over on the Windows Vista Team Blog the news that the Windows Vista retail licensing terms are being revised. Looks like PC home-brew system builders have been let back into the Vista party!" From the article: "Our intention behind the original terms was genuinely geared toward combating piracy; however, it's become clear to us that those original terms were perceived as adversely affecting an important group of customers: PC and hardware enthusiasts. You who comprise the enthusiast market are vital to us for several reasons, not least of all because of the support you've provided us throughout the development of Windows Vista. We respect the time and expense you go to in customizing, building and rebuilding your hardware and we heard you that the previous terms were seen as an impediment to that — it's for that reason we've made this change."
Looks like Microsoft has just discovered this PC and hardware enthusiasts group?!
thanks microsoft. didn't know you cared.
Vista wants to party all the time, party all the time, party all the time
Mark your calendars people, today marks the first day ever (or at least in decades?) that Microsoft actualy listened to it's customer based! WOW!
This is great news - with Vista's previous arrangement of reinstallation, I was seriously considering staying with XP. Now, i'm happy to say that I will be switching to vista. Great work Microsoft, thanks for listening to us for once!
I rent game servers, see my homepage for more information
-Eric
SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
We love you, thanks for forcing us to do the right thing.
[Our intention behind the original terms was genuinely geared toward combating piracy;]
If the only concern was preventing piracy, there wouldn't be any restrictions on what user that bought pre-built machines could do with their bought and paid for copy of Windows Vista either; if you bought a copy ofVista, and want to junk or upgrade your old machine and install that same copy of Vista on it, you should be able to. You paid for a license. The license terms were, and are, genuinely geared towards making sure that customers buy extra copies of Windows they neither need or want.
Not that I care all that much. If MS wants me to install a copy of Vista, they are going to have to pay me to do it. A lot. Mircosoft operating systems come with a huge amount of negative value built in.
this is a good thing no two ways about it. Sure, they shouldn't have limited the OS in the first place, but the fact they are so quickly changing this is a step in the right direction. Given what I have just read about the EULA, I won't be touching Vista, but for those that seriosly need their game fix and DirectX v10 is where it is at for them, at least they can buy that new 6 gajillion dollar gfx card (or 4 of them) and go nuts without worrying their Windows install is going to puke on them. I'm no MS fan and even less of a Windows fan, but when something is done right, it is best to applaude the move. So, I applaude you MS for doing the right thing, and before Vista is officially released!
The EULA and DRM is still like a pair of handcuffs and only Microsoft has the key.
The price will be right, so most consumers won't care until those handcuffs start getting too tight around the wrist.
If you value your freedom, you will switch to a different OS. BSD and Linux are two options.
http://www.maxineudall.com/2010/02/should-economists-be-sued-for-malpractice.html
This is a good first step and Microsoft are to be applauded for taking it. Now on to the other issue - virtualisation. I'd like the ability to install into a VM please, and I'd definitely like to view any form of media I choose whilst inside the VM. If consumer pressure worked once, perhaps it can work again.
Cheers,
Ian
Drink the Kool-Aid. Trust us - it's delicious.
No folly is more costly than the folly of intolerant idealism. - Winston Churchill
that's all I can say is wow. Is MS finaly opening their eyes?
Although last time MS made me say wow was when they made some kind of statement about how the pirates do not worry them becuase they know they make most of their money with licensing and through corporations. I was like, MS isn't greedy, do anything money grabbers? They made a thoughtfull and logical statement.
But then a year or two after that comment came Windows Genuine Advantage.
So, I will take this new comment with a grain of salt.
First Microsoft partners with Novell to support Linux and now they are responding to a request regarding a license change in an all too human way, with normal human words and everything. It reminds me of an old Dilbert strip:
If aliens kidnap and then impersonate Steve Ballmer, is it a bad thing?
It depends on the aliens...
slightly less evil today
http://www.CelloFourteGroupie.net
Is it just me is Microsoft acting more like My Little Ponies than the Borg today?
Something very bad is going to come of all this, but I am prepared.
My tinfoil helmet has arrived today.
Correcting a wrong != "We're doing this because we love you."
While I do appreciate this change back to the way it should be, it's a shame they've gotten so distanced from the consumer (read: greedy) that these sort of things have to come up in droves.
All of this aside, again, what's my incentive to buy an operating system that still has everything else wrong with it? One correction to policy does not a good OS make.
If all my base are belong to you and I attempt to retrieve my base, does that mean I'm freebasing?
Windows CE Kernel source opened, Microsoft offers support for Suse Linux, and now they revise the Vista EULA in a way that embraces their customers? Looks like I'll be bringing that winter jacket to hell when it's my time.
Similes are like metaphors
Sorry M$FT, you guys already tried to take away our rights--this isn't about helping your consumers and enthusiasts--it's about mitigating loss of shareholder value.
Too little, too late. After all the antitrust legislation--after all the lawsuits in Europe--you let your lawyers sneak that one through. Bring me the head of the parties who approved that license on a silver platter and maybe I'll consider Vista. Maybe.
http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=204291&cid=16
Looks like I was right. Good catch to the moderators, they moderated me all the way up to... er, well, 2. Which is exactly what I posted at. Oh, well...
Slashdotters falling on themselves to praise Microsoft for doing what they should've done in the first place. If Borg Gates says "Resistance is futile!", all these Slashdotters will surrender to Microsoft like the French surrendered to everyone else. Disgusting. :P
Like making DirectX open source?
I never saw Microsoft fan-boys before I visited the blog. Funny how every comment was almost exactly like "Thanks, thats great!" with only one guy bringing up any kind of discussion. I guess its one of the big differences between open communities and broadcast communities. I use the term broadcast to refer to closed box discussions performed inside corp vs. the open discussion of all developers, customers, onlookers, etc..
Not trying to start a flame here, but it was strange seeing people who -like- Microsoft!
Bye!
All it's gonna do is result in more people warezing the business version instead of the home version.
But remember. What Microsoft gives (under considerable pressure from bad press) they can also quietly take away (later, when it's "safe" to do so or if they change their mind, etc.).
This is the reason I don't buy software that requires me to ask permission to use what I've paid for.
Er...
Posted by PhilH
Thank you Microsoft! I know I for one was not enjoying switching to Linux as the original Vista EULA was forcing me to do. Its good to be able to once again be back in the Microsoft Camp.
?!?
>>They heard their customers and acted on their customers wishes.
No, they acted in their financial best interest, as they should. Someone at MSFT ran an accounting model showing a convincing model of financial loss due to this policy, and the number-pushers won.
So in today's reality, by reversing abysmally ignorant previous actions, one can actually gain favor.
Do not mistake understanding for realization, and do not mistake realization for liberation
I don't want to install it in the first place. I guess now I can not install it, multiple times?
Say what you will, (and I know you will,) but this is another example of how Microsoft is changing from inside. We're all quick to distrust MS, and inclined to bash, (myself certainly included) but I think that they are making some genuine steps lately towards being a likable company.
Why? Well, my theory is that as they have grown bigger and bigger, they can't help but hire some nice, decent people, and then these nice people have grown in influence internally. It could also be that they see Google as their chief competitor these days, so they're trying to out-"do no evil" Google. (If that makes sense.)
"Our intention behind the original terms was genuinely geared toward combating piracy" /. user's sig: If it ain't pirated... define "pirated" more broadly?
So paraphrasing one
I might not understand this sophisticated masterplan, but looks to me like it could only make more running copies "pirated".
Last Christmas I gave a homebrew PC to my sister our of extra stuff I had laying around and a couple things I had to buy new to make a complete system. We got XP for it all legit and everything, but a few months later the motherboard in it, that had been laying around my place for a while, gave out and I put a new one in, not exactly the same as the old one. We had to go through the whole call up Microsoft and explain ourselves to re-enable the XP install.
I was afraid this would be counted as the second license situation for Vista. Would I not be able to continue running it on what is essentially the "same" computer which had simply had a broken component replaced? Buying a new Vista license for every other motherboard replacement in "the same" computer would be flat out unacceptable. I'm not even talking about upgrading for the putpose of getting new or better features, I'm just talking about making a dead computer go again. Sure, swapping a motherboard, especially for not the exact same model, might be in that blurry part where you can't quite tell what side of the line your on, but would still totally suck when the cost to get my broken system running again more than doubles from just the hardware price because my motherboard is old and not available anymore for a more "exact" replacement, such as if I got it just as they were going end-of-life and it died a year or two later.
Except the new Core 2 Quads and the 4 core AMDs of tomorrow will have a hard time with this part:
"You may install one copy of the software on the licensed device. You may use the software on up to two processors on that device at one time. Except as provided in the Storage and Network Use (Ultimate edition) sections below, you may not use the software on any other device."
Haha, whoever tagged this article: "itsatrap" just made my day. I still can't stop laughing.
Thanks!
I think Microsoft woke up to the fact that "PC and hardware enthusiasts" provide billions of dollars worth of free technical support to friends (read: anybody who finds out that you're good with computers). This is something we'd be markedly less willing to do if we didn't use Windows ourselves.
Thanks to this new generosity, I think I will stay with Windows 2000 instead of buying a Mac.
http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=06/10/26/123823 9This is an example of an article deserving itsatrap. This article doesn't.
First the story of MS working with Novell & Linux and now this.
I'll be hiding under my bed till the world gets right...
Funny how every comment was almost exactly like "Thanks, thats great!" with only one guy bringing up any kind of discussion.
... actually I do most of my development nowadays in linux under the current contract ). It is a matter of preference, that's all it boils down to. When you work in a world that deals in Microsoft and become accustomed to those tools, some of them are actually damn good tools, and you can pry them from my cold, dead, fingers :P
Whats to discuss? They announced that they are changing the reinstallation restrictions.
If (hypothetically speaking) the sysadmins had been blocking slashdot at your place of work work, and then unblocked it, would you say thanks or go on a tirade of why they should have done it differently in the first place? Which is more productive?
Not trying to start a flame here, but it was strange seeing people who -like- Microsoft!
I feel more productive in Word than Open Office. I am more productive in Visual Studio than gvim/kdevelop (although I am quite capable in gvim
Uncle Bill, we know you'd come through!
Engineering is the art of compromise.
Free microsoft vista installs or did i read it wrong my brain wanders on ms topics
Thought microsoft had gone into the charity market or was that Bill the monopolist, philanthropist, just looking for more fertile grounds to spread his borg virus.
Free vista i tell thee, better give the chinese a heads up on this one.
im not seeing the problem who here was actually going to use a legit copy of vista anyway
And Linux supports none of what I need it to do.
Windows does, and Windows Vista, thus far, has done it well
Linux isn't always an option.
Since I get to say this so rarely without sarcasm... Good one Microsoft.
"We respect the time and expense you go to in customizing, building and rebuilding your hardware and we heard you that the previous terms were seen as an impediment to that -- it's for that reason we've made this change."
God bless their bleeding hearts. They're just trying to recoupe some of the market they have "given" to Linux, especially with glassy distros like Ubuntu that don't require much skill to setup and use.
They really need to get together with Intel and AMD. Virtualization is the future. Windows is destined to become a segmented product with multiple versions. Different products for different puposes simplifies everything. Everything in it's own VM. VM Appliances. The OS and Microsoft applications will become one through a reincarnated Windows CE.
We will have "Windows Media Center" for games and all that DRM goodness.
We will have "Windows Office" for business applicaitons.
We will have "Windows Server" for Internet applications.
There will be "Windows Datacenter" for databases.
And don't forget "Windows Vista" for legacy applications.
And it all works alongside other operating systems such as OSX and Linux. It requires lots of RAM and fast hardware so hardware vendors will be happy. Microsoft gets to sell multiple product licences and it's products become simplier to develop and release annually. No more OS wars or being a antitrust target. Everyone is happy.
This may be a dumb question, but there isn't a separate OEM license, right? I'd hate to think I had to pay the full retail price to be able to make major changes later to a system I was buidling from scratch at the moment. I only ask as it's the kind of stupidity I expect from Microsoft.
*claps hands* Microsoft loves homebrew computer hobbyists after all! *rolls eyes*
NO! I still won't ever upgrade to Vista!
"So, I applaude you MS for doing the right thing"
What you should be doing is complaining that MS tried to pull this bullshit in the first place. Thanking them for retracting an unfair and onerous provision is the LAST thing you should be doing.
You should be saying "That's right assholes fix your EULA, if you ever try to pull crap like that again I'll migrate my entire office to Linux". Applaud them? Right.
If you wanna get rich, you know that payback is a bitch
Nice that M$ is modifying the Vista EULA to accommodate those of us who build our own machines. Now could they please do the same for the DRM on their music files? The last time I upgraded my PC, MediaPlayer decided that I had my music loaded on 6 (!) machines, and told me to call M$ to fix it. After 45 minutes on the phone, either on hold or trying to get someone in India to understand what was happening, only to be told that I'd have to call back the following Monday to talk to someone in the U.S., I deleted all of the music files I'd purchased from MSN.
;)
CD Universe (www.cduniverse.com) is now my source for music. Their CD's even work under Fedora Core 6 which is my main OS now
considering microsoft's charactor i would take all this good news today with a dumptruck load of salt...
Politics is Treachery, Religion is Brainwashing
1. Scare potential users with outrageous limitations
2. Observe public's anger
3. Reverse decision on obvious 'lame ducks' (1 reinstall, etc) while leaving the real ones (DRM, etc) in place
4. Profit, profit, profit!
Perhaps the tag that has showed up on every Microsoft story submitted today (perhaps for a while...I don't normally pay attention) sums it up:
itsatrap
Apologizing for their error in judgement and rectifying it is a step in the right direction. But I see some here saying that Microsoft deserves no credit for this... that Microsoft shouldn't have made such a choice in the first place, and why should you thank someone for changing their mind about doing something wrong or stupid? But what does it accomplish to chastise someone for a wrong decision that they've already decided to go back on anyways? At best, nothing at all (although even then, it probably makes the criticizer appear needlessly petty) and at worst, give them some incentive to revert to their original decision, since either way they will obviously have people pissed off at them, and it might not be unreasonable at all to go with what originally looked good to them and suck up the PR hit.
I'm not about to fall in love with Microsoft for this change of decision, but the fact that they were even willing to do this at all strongly suggests that it just might be possible for even Microsoft to change for the better... we will just have to wait and see.
File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
Boy, the evil microsoft image is taking a serious beating this week... it's suddenly developed a conscience and is thinking about pulling out of China after its blogger persecution... it's partnering with Novell and linux, and now... it may not try to crush people who like to upgrade their hardware... You'd think they were running for public office or wanted something from all us consumers... --Ray
http://www.beanleafpress.com
No, I just bought a Dell that needed two motherboard replacements because of faulty on-board video!
Lest we forget...
Someone send the Link to Novell.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=im589uTchKs
In many cases, the actual amount of time required looks like this:
Time to rebuild from scratch 4 hours.
Each method has it's good points, each it's bad. When it was just me, and I had hours to devote to discovery, that's the root that I chose. Now, with my son, girlfriend, house repairs, etc., it just doesn't make sense to invest that much time in discovery. Besides, it's not like my Win gaming computer is an HA server.
Now can someone send Paul T. an email and explain to him that he was wrong?
LostHobo.com
Soup Kitchen of the Internet
You know, this doesn't matter to me anymore. This is great for some people, but honestly, Windows has become hard enough to pirate and expensive enough to buy I think I'll leave it at XP and work my way back into Linux. Considering I'll have to work about 20 - 60 hours to earn enough to pay for the OS ($600 if I want the super deluxe top of the line edition -- $300 if I can live with the extra stripped down edition, bleh), I think if I dedicate myself to a solid week getting accustomed to using linux as a client OS rather than a server, I'll break even. The end benefit being, of course, that I won't need to spend more hours working to buy more MS software in the future.
I have to take my hat off to MS, your greed is finally going to pay off for me.
My one big hurdle to tackle will be finding something in Linux to replace Corel Draw. I mostly use it for small DTP jobs, which might be an abuse of the app, but feh... OpenOffice is ok, but doesn't offer the flexibility. Any suggestions, apart from running it in VMware?
Either read up or shut up about the DRM. Look here's how it goes: The DRM is relevant only to media playback, specifically HD-DVD playback. It is MANDITORY if you want an AACS license, required to decode HD-DVDs. It doesn't affect anything else. It does not stop you from running whatever apps you like, it doesn't stop you from making your own media, nothing.
The other option they had was to simply not support HD-DVD. Maybe that's what you'd have rathered but I think you can see why they aren't interested in that.
So please, do a little more research or quit your bitching. People on Slashdot try to use "DRM" like this administration tries to use "terrorism", as an all purpose scare word to call something bad. This is not some evil lock you down so you can't use anything kind of DRM, it relates only to HD-DVD. If you don't like it the correct answer is to boycott HD-DVD and Bluray (has the same AACS encryption).
Keep in mind that (1) you deleted music that you paid for (basically, paid Microsoft for nothing) and (2) Microsoft doesn't know who you are or care what you've done.
(not that they already haven't anyway...).
.NET)
Look - they've got anti-piracy sorted.
Their software phones home.
It updates the phone-home and key-checking code regularly.
You can't get security updates and new software (e.g. IE,
without it.
Even if the locks get broken, they'll just update.
So here's what they should do... give away CDs.
Vista CD's should be distributed like AOL's once
were. They should be everywhere, in every mag, in
every box of Captain Crunch cereal. Let people download
it from MS's website.
Let it run for a month for free before it starts
to ask you to buy. You've got them hooked by this
stage.
Vista will be like heroin - once you get a taste its very
addictive. Make it trivial to buy - just take
a credit card number right from the login screen.
Do the same with Office. All good pushers know they've got
to give free samples to lock in their 'customers' for
life. And it works.
Wendy wouldn't exactly agree with you... I for one see plenty other things wrong with the EULA. The reinstall thing, as detailed here on /. on previous discussions, was a joke. You can always call the 800 number and whine and they'll give you a new key, an unlimited one at that. Someone said it's easier than browsing for the crack, you just dial and a nice person dictates the new license number.
Oh, and the virtual limitations are very real, thank you very much.
i ate crayons when i was a kid and now i have two braincells and the blue ones taste nicer
I got so tired of trying to crack XP. Good to know I'll be able to pirate a copy of Vista so I can run all the important programs that I can't run on my Mac or Linux boxes.
Now if only they'd come up with some important programs like that, I'll be set.
I was at a conference the other day about Vista, and I asked this very question about revalidating after hardware upgrades. He told me that it never was the plan to do that in the beginning. He claimed that revalidations are unlimited on all versions of Vista.
Can't be done... if you let real programmers see windows multimedia code then the holes will become public. The worst thing that MS can do is let out source, then we would see a flood of sploits that would all be posted on every bb from here to China! They are trying to be good guys by letting us change hardware, but letting the horse out of the barn could sink them. All they will allow is documented access to binary based functions, if you know how the function is coded then you can exploit it and create holes...sometimes this happens anyway but you do not get to see why. DirectX is well documented and quite usable but knowing Microsoft there are most likely back doors and leaks just waiting to hose the registry and OS. It might even be possible to create a virtual machine within the code then God forbid run other OS code directly within Windows like a DirectX enabled version of linux something like gilding the turd!
all Vista discs will be biometrically coded to their purchaser at the time of purchase, using a special USB fob that must be inserted to the computer when the disc is loaded. This will allow 'hardware enthusiasts' to enjoy vista, and will not be any inconvenience for anyone with a legally bought copy of Vista. Also, you biometry data will be sent to microsoft and kept on record, for security reasons.
I think the fine folks at Microsoft have spent a little too much time around all thoose lithium computer pieces.
Wanna fight ? Bend over, stick your head up your ass, and fight for air.
You're right, for some people here MS just can't win. I'm not ready to give them a Nobel Peace Price but at least they're doing the right thing on this one. Oh, and you left Odell Lake off your game list.
What will we celebrate next? That you can actually expect a system to be safe? That you can run and install software without being administrator? That you can create a SSL tunnel to it?
That's something I expect from my OS. Yes, I'm greedy and brazen like that to expect that.
What's next, MS threatening to take away our ability to run third party software and then suddenly "reallowing" it, and we'll celebrate them as the next messiah for it?
Folks, don't be silly here. The only reason they stepped back was that a lot of people voiced their concerns and said that they will not buy it under those conditions. They don't do us a service by allowing us to use a system we license.
We do them a service by licensing it.
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
MS claims enthusiasts are important to them - if this were true would BF2 run at 50% of the framerate it gets under WinXP?
That should just about cancel out the money lost at the hands of "PC and hardware enthusiasts" who provide billions of dollars worth of free piracy. Sad thing is, I'm half-seious.
Imagine that ... now that Vista can be reinstalled on new PC's, you decide to buy it because you want to be able to upgrade your entire system, chuck all the hardware, and keep all the software. (Or tell me why this isn't common. Microsoft thinks it's common enough that they changed their license terms.)
Now imagine that your new hardware has four separate processors. Or imagine that you want to install your legal Vista license on a VM image. Or imagine that you want to do any of the other things important enough that Microsoft specifically mentions them in the EULA only to prohibit them. (Or tell me why this isn't common. Microsoft thinks it's common enough that they include them in the license terms.)
It's still a trap. It's just got the bait in it now.
What if I'm using OEM or MSDN version?
My toy PC gets a reinstall of windows (or, more likely, a re-image from driveimage), at least once a month. I can't imagine being limited to 2 validations. My hardware also changes on average once a month. (What can I say, tweaking and buying new toys is one of my hobbies)
While I do have a legit OEM license for my copy of XP MCE, I've long ago found it most convenient to simply bypass the validation. In all fairness I think XP MCE is a pretty good operating system. For the most part, I don't mind MS operating systems (At least anything >= 2000). It's their business practices that bother me.
I would switch to linux in a second if it was decent for gaming.
Where in the 2000 lisences does it say they will automatically delete files it thinks are "high" or "Severe"?
(sect. 6 of the vista EULA)
Connects to MS and not tell you?
revokes your abiltity to play media if it thinks you ahve violated copyright?
(sect. 7)
Updates firmware without your permision? applies to media devices.
Plus all the stuff that exists in XP and 2000 that is crap.
It's not Vista I don't like its the EUAL and MSs business history I don't like.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
Or are they mimicking the venus fly trap? Luring us in with the smell of sweetness only to be trapped and digested over what will seem like 1000 years.
AMD 4x4 Will need 2 cpus
"You who comprise the enthusiast market"
So, in fact, the whining of nerds about MS screwups is worth whining. Because sometimes it protects everyone from MS screwups, when MS changes after hearing the whining.
When people complain about that whining, calling it "MS bashing" among other insults, they're working against the improvement of MS products, and for the screwups.
Whine on, nerds!
--
make install -not war
I wish they had thought of this revolutionary "buy once, install multiple times" feature back when Windows 3.0 or DOS were around. /sarcasm
Why did the chicken cross the road? Because Elon Musk put an AI chip in its head.
You know, I'm a pretty dedicated Windows user. I've ugraded to each version from 3.0 as soon as (or sometimes before) it's officially released (although I skipped Millenium). I was skeptical of XP at first because I didn't like the "Playskool look," but it grew on me and, moreover, the much improved stability was a welcome change. I've tried OSX, and quite a few flavors of Linux over the years, but I'm mostly a gamer/HTPC guy, and Windows gives me the best results in those areas. That said, I've tried the public preview of Vista, and I hate it. All of the established configuration and navigation controls have been needlessly reorganized, the hardware support is spotty (at best), it's unstable, overly restrictive, and excessively "secure," if by secure you mean "pops up a lot of dialog boxes whenever you try to do anything."
At any rate, I will certainly consider it in 6-12 months after release, but at this point Vista feels more like a step backwards. I get all of the disadvantages I listed above, and there are really no new advantages or incentives. I supposed I'll be forced to upgrade at some point because of DX10, but otherwise I see myself sticking with XP as long as possible.
https://www.eff.org/https-everywhere
Geewhiz,Thanks!
-William Shatner can be neither created nor destroyed.
I'm going to adopt the same process that I did when XP shipped.
I'm going to wait for SP1.
LK
"Hi. This is my friend, Jack Shit, and you don't know him." - Lord Kano
Can we stop tagging as "itsatrap" anything in the topic of Microsoft? Or maybe we should just rename the Microsoft topic?
This signature is far too complex to have been created by chance.
As the majority of hobbyists must be aware, most of you steal your software. Hardware must be paid for, but software is something to share. Who cares if the people who worked on it get paid? Is this fair?
e .html
http://www.blinkenlights.com/classiccmp/gateswhin
Ahhhhh. Thanks MS, for 'allowing' us to your your 400$ piece of bloatware. Frankly, you want to charge 400$ for anything, I better be able to not only install it as many times as I want on as many different computers(of mine) that I want any time that I want in the way that I want.
It's called a legal transaction. I pay you, you hand over the product to me. You don't get to keep it after that. That's called "fleecing".
I'm pretty much certain that XP is the end of the windows line for me. Ubuntu is looking great and OSX is becoming more widespread anyways.
It was really quite sickening to read the replies to the blog - so many replies of the form "Oh wow, Microsoft is so great, so generous, I love Microsoft, I want to have Microsoft's baby..."
I couldn't help thinking that some of the replies were written by Microsoft's marketing department...
Wanted: A better sig than this one. I have neither the wit nor motivation...
I think it is likely that their marketing strategy for Vista includes detailed plans for announcing harsh policies, unpopular default settings, etc., and then backing out a bit so it looks like they are giving up something. I believe that they know that Vista may not sell as well as they need it to due to the price and need for hardware upgrades to run it. The economy isn't like it was in 2001, and for most desktop general home and business use XP is more than adequate. Convincing people to upgrade is going to be a hard battle.
Well, my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle. -Firefly
Looks like PC home-brew system builders have been let back into the Vista party!
Oh, wheee. Watery beer and date rape.
I'm sure that Microsoft didn't "forget" about home-PC assemblers (dude, you build a wall with bricks and mortar, you don't "build" a PC. You snap together 6 parts that were all meant to work together)...
i'm sure that Microsoft was just seeing what they could get away with. At the WORST their original Vista plan would have raked in bazillions of dollars. At the worst, they were going to have to come back down off of their trial balloon...
with the result being that you now feel better about Vista even though you Windows users are STILL getting ass-rammed by the whole concept that it will call home, that it will still deactivate if you don't call microsoft to authenticate your computer, and that you have to call them each and every time you change your hardware.
its classic politics.... promise to give them a shit sandwich with rat poison... then fallback on just the shit sandwich.
Just a shit sandwich, you say?! Marvelous! That's much better than a shit sandwich with rat poison on it!
Listen... you are going to eat this shit sandwich.. now, you can put mustard on it... you can put a kick ass video card in it...
but in the end, you are going to eat this shit sandwich of a license agreement which gives Microsoft the right to snoop on you, pwn your computer, and shut it down at their earliest conveneince... whether you like it or not.
guns kill people like spoons make Rosie O'Donnell fat.
Microsoft,
What about running the inexpensive versions of Vista in virtual machines?
When it comes to Vista, that issue remains a "show stopper" for me, and for many other people.
What do you all say? Should Microsoft allow us to run the inexpensive versions of Vista in virtual machines?
Yeah, yeah, Mono, this that, RMS-says-Java-is-as-evil, but I am leaving -- no more targeting the lastest and greatest features on an MS OS.
what a bunch of retarded fish-squirrels...
oh, we're alienating our base market? the guys who build pc's for the low-end users? Can't have that now.
A computer once beat me at chess, but it was no match for me at kick boxing. Emo Philips
Microsoft is fully aware of the enthusiast PC user. Its the Game publishers that are clueless.
Do a quick scan of the posts. The moderators are taking a break. IOW, there's little insightful or interesting or funny going on here. Next!
Slashdot: Failed Car Analogies. Amateur Lawyering. Anecdote Battles.
Well, looks like the modding community got there wish, oh and everyone who builds there own PC's which is probably everyone who's knows slashdot existes. ----------------- I now know Steve Gibson is a fake. And to Viewer Like You! Thank you!
"Go suck your head." - Edward Runey
We thought we'd sneak this into the EULA. We can always take it out if we get too much flack.
You people is obviously blind. Let me clear it up for you.
Someone at Microsoft actually read your comments here, digg, or some other nerd hangout. And some top dog inside Microsoft decided to change the EULA to allow you to use 1 license on any SINGLE computer.
They has opened up to you. And they are more open to Open Source. I expect Microsoft will continue to show support in the future. After all, They have come to accept Apple Computer and OSX.
\
Use the software any damned way you want. You bought it from MS, use it like you want it for your own personal use.
I'm not reselling it, I'm simply using the software in a way that MS didn't intend. Whoop-de-doo. That kind of stuff wouldn't bother a Sunday school teacher.
Microsoft's wishes only matter until I pay them money. Then I use it the way I want it. Oh, I put a EULA on MS when I bought XP that said "Bill Gates agrees to wear a pink TuTu when I use XP". Oh my. He didn't do it, and so I don't listen to any EULA they sent me.
And anyway, who could even find out? As a practical matter, MS's wishes mean dick in this matter.
My advice is to get a Mac Pro. Microsoft obviously doesn't want your money any more. They're too busy fondling the buttocks of the media companies to care about me or you.
With all due respect to the new found power of the blogosphere etc.. now I'm worried, that was too quick and too easy, what new horrors, or worsened evil have we missed still that MS hope to make us KEEP missing by relenting on this one issue?
"Enthusiasts" aren't the only people who need to re-install Windows; in fact, everybody does sooner or later, as registry settings, DLLs, drivers, and other system components slowly but invariably get changed to the point that the system simply doesn't work at all anymore or shows some annoying behaviors.
I think the main difference is that "PC enthusiasts" are the ones who know that they actually can fix this with a reinstall, while most other people just go out and buy a new machine.
1. Stand on dick 2. Point and yell "I'm standing on my dick and I like it!" 3. Step off dick and apologize for waking natives.
If I don't 'uninstall' via some software process that presumably would tell MS you uninstalled it, can I still install it on another machine- eg in the event of a disk/hardware failure?
I don't like the use of the word 'uninstall' since it implies a physical process as opposed to just 'remove' or 'destroy' the original installation.
I imagine/hope they mean the latter, but if the former, that's a real problem. Would you have to call in to MS if you 'lost' an install without properly uninstalling?
licet differant, aequabitur
Say cheeeese next time you install Vista!
Of course many enthusiasts were and still are thieves and pirates, so that tradition continues as well.
A lot of times it's the same people who just use anti-MS logic rather than the regular kind that disallows contradiction.
I only wish Linux had such functionality. Or Windows 95...
This is progress?
Microsoft has the unique/horrifying/useful ability to re-intake their own shit, after it has been shat onto the world.
If they cannot control all of the conditions of the benchmark, and therefore the results, they are afraid to compete in an open marketplace on the basis of efficiency and reliability. Two words I live by when it comers to software quality.
I figured the "do-it-yer-selfers" would be such an insignificant base of customer that Microsoft would bypass them entirely and force them to re-register (or re-purchase) the product if the hardware changed. Perhaps they are using this "out of the goodness of their hearts" excuse as a way to hide the real reason. They don't want to receive thousands of wasteful support calls every time a guy named Chip changes his network card.
I'm suspicious. Microsoft knew that limiting their license would make people b!tch. And when they then say "oh oh, we _listened_!!" and remove the restriction, everyone like Microsoft... Sounds like a marketing trick to me? Anyone? ....
reading the comments i get the impression that everybody thinks it was a normal thing to forbid reinstalling a piece of software...
has it come to this? that people are actually THANKFUL to get a right, that MS shouldn't be allowed to take away from them in the first place?
that's like "the party" allowing some marriages in "1984" or the "world controllers" allowing some research in "brave new world"
The MAFIAA is a bunch of mindless jerks who will be the first up against the wall when the revolution comes
Unless you don't have at least 512MB of RAM and a DirectX 9 capable GPU, I'm calling bullshit on your claims.
I'm running Vista RC1 on both an AMD Athlon 2500+ 1.8GHz with a GeForce 5900 and an AMD Athlon 64 3500+ 2.2GHz with a GeForce 6800. The former system has 512 MB of RAM and the latter has 1GB. Both systems run smoothly. No, it's not as snappy as Windows XP Pro, but the difference is minimal. Certainly not as grievous as your claims make it out to be.
Vista does offload the graphical effects to the GPU (hence the DirectX 9 GPU requirement), so your statement to the contrary is false.
I can understand that some of the more vocal on Slashdot harbor intense hatred towards anything MS, but at least try to get your facts right before spreading FUD.
The Microsoft license is really extortion, not a tax. Taxes pay for things like schools, firefighters and the Hubble space telescope, while money paid to Microsoft just goes into its profits. In a democratic society, people can vote to decide who or what is taxed, how much, and where the money goes, whereas the Windows license fee is set arbitrarily by Microsoft.
Microsoft is a monopoly, so you don't really have much of a choice. Buying a buying a PC without Windows is difficult. If you manage to, you will break most of your custom apps (including Office macros to and Web sites dependent on ActiveX or MS-JVM, not just Win32 itself.).
I like the Windows key, but it was still designed as a marketing tool (copied from Apple.) That's why it has a Windows logo rather than something generic.
...in the software. While this clause is in the EULA, I don't see how "PC home-brew system builders" can use Vista.
Surely this is exactly what hobbyists are doing when they e.g. install a more powerful graphics card?
Ditto programmers when they work-around the bugs in any Microsoft API
Reduce, reuse, cycle
Let me just respond to Microsoft by saying, "Nice Try. I still won't buy it."
The 'itsatrap' tag proves how fucktarded the shitdot sheeple are, they will not be satisfied until Microsoft is out of business 'actually, all businesses should go under according to the shitdot mentality' all software is open-sores and all government systems are communist. FucktardTaco and BorkebackNeil should be arrested as communist and terrorist sympathizers, and shitdot should be taken down.
The MS engineers were testing Vista under various configurations by modifying their PCs hardware and kept having to re-license their own OS, since it was designed so securely they had no "internal hack", and testing was taking too long (read expensive) so management said maybe we ought to re-visit this thing...
I love the dualism on Slashdot. First it's, "Windows is finally getting a fancy UI like OSX and Linux! Geez, took the copycats long enough!" The next day the same people crow, "Stupid XP and Vista GUI uses too many resources! I'm sticking with NT 4!"
What are you, anyway? An MS-basher-basher? You disgust me 3/4 as much as the ugliness of win2k, and 1/2 as much as the heaviness of Vista.
But really, the truth of the matter is that OS X runs well on a computer with all its fancy graphics. XGL runs well on a computer with all its fancy graphics. Vista DOESN'T run well on a computer (watch as I paint broad conceptual strokes) with all its fancy graphics. Why do I need a 600-watt mega machine just to check my frking email? It's nice that they're making everything tasty on the interface end, but I'm mildly skeptical due to their history of winMe, WGA (a security threat, even if you're not a software pirate), product activation that made my life hell when I ran an internet cafe in mexico, etc.
They are not EEEEEEEEEVIL. But they're certainly not looking out for my best interest. A quote from the wordsmith.org a word a day mailing list:
Whenever people say 'We mustn't be sentimental,' you can take it they are
about to do something cruel. And if they add 'We must be realistic,' they
mean they are going to make money out of it. -Brigid Brophy, writer
(1929-1995)
love you all. eat your vegetables. microwaves are bad for you.
-Nathan Curry
Please stop stalking me, bro.
I like the Windows key, but it was still designed as a marketing tool (copied from Apple.) That's why it has a Windows logo rather than something generic.
... all it does is open the menu. Is that really worth having a special key for? How often to people actually dig around in that Start menu? How often do you need to get to applications that aren't in your quicklaunch bar?
I've had this question for a while (mostly because it's taken that long to find anyone who would straight-up admit to actually liking the Windows key): what the hell is it good for?
I mean, the Apple key has a purpose. It's an extra function key. A modifier; so that in addition to the usual Ctrl-[key] and Alt/Option-[key] and Shift-[key] combos, you can have one more. (Not to mention all the combos, e.g. [Opt]-[Apple]-[key].) So in that respect, it's basically functional.
But the Windows key
I use a Windows machine at work, and if I go into the start menu once a day it's rare, other than to turn the machine off. And in order to select anything in the menu, you have to get the mouse down to that corner of the screen anyway, so does it really save any time to pop the menu open?
It just seems like its biggest function is being there to get hit at random times and knock focus away from whatever application I'm really using.
It seems like the Windows key would be a whole lot more useful if it acted as an additional modifier key, like the Apple (aka Command) key does. But it seems like Windows intercepts all presses of the key, and just uses it to open the Start menu. Waste of a key, if you ask me.
"Ladies and gentlemen, my killbot features Lotus Notes and a machine gun. It is the finest available."