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How To Vet Clever Ideas Without Giving Them Away?
Rival writes "As an inquisitive and creative geek, I am constantly coming up with 'clever' ideas. Most often I discover fundamental or practical flaws lurking in the details, which I'm fine with. As Edison said, 'I haven't failed; I've found 10,000 ways that don't work.' Other times, I discover that someone else has beaten me to the idea. I'm fine with that, too. At least I know that I've come up with a great idea, even if I'm not the first. There are times, however, when I can find no flaws with an idea and nobody else seems to have thought of it. I'm not conceited enough to think my idea is genius; I just assume that I'm not knowledgeable enough to see what I'm missing. In these times, I often want to ask a subject matter expert for their thoughts. On the admittedly long chance that an idea is genius, however, what is the best way to ask for another's insights while mitigating the risk of them stealing or sharing the idea? Asking a stranger to sign a contract before discussing an idea seems like a good way to get a door closed on my face. What are your experiences and suggestions?"
Ideas are a dime a dozen. What matters is confronting your idea with real world feedback and you'll be astonished by the results (read this for more on keeping your idea confidential: the great startup idea that I can't reveal yet).
Guy Kawasaki gave one really good suggestion to test your idea: convince a woman. It sounds stupid and insulting, but what he really means is that it's too easy for geeks and tech lovers to fall in love with a geeky idea. Presumably, women are more grounded and will tell you why your idea is not practical.
Finally, regarding confidentiality: don't worry about it so much
What ideas did you have? This will help us make suggestions.
Give them a FriendDA?
A device for removing money from stupid people: http://store.theonion.com/yu-wan-mei-device-p-1021.html
You're looking for a non-disclosure agreement. No method other than a contract has force of law behind it. That is, if you're using an untrusted stranger in the first place. There's something to be said for asking friends, even if they may not be giving you a completely unbiased opinion.
In other news, you do come across as kinda arrogant here ("as an inquitive and creative geek..."). Everyone has ideas. You are not a beautiful and unique snowflake.
It's better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.
- E. Debs
Got an idea for a better mousetrap? Build it and see if it really is better. Talk is cheap and action speaks louder than words.
I live ze unknown. I love ze unknown. I am ze unknown.
I'm not conceited enough to think my idea is genius; I just assume that I'm not knowledgeable enough to see what I'm missing.
Dude, I would be ecstatic if people thought my ideas were worthy of discussion. A lot time my personal friends just respond with "meh" or less. Tells me I'd be torn apart to put it out online and never get anywhere coding it.
You're going to fail a lot of times. Just fail early and fail often. Don't worry about someone stealing your ideas because your ideas are really not that great. If you admit that now, everything gets a lot easier.
Funny that I actually gave up on an idea that revolved around this very concept for the exact same reason you are describing. When the Android SDK came out, I fired up the example and set to create a project that would allow the free exchange of ideas. Real original, right? It was simple, you authored ideas in 1,000 characters or less and saved them on your phone in your portfolio. Meanwhile they went back to the server and were databased, searchable and fed back out to other users. Users could view/tag/rate/add comments to/social network around ideas that others had made and add them to their collection of ideas. The best ideas would be rolled out to a web page or wiki with the original authors and contributing authors given credit. The idea being that you could read ideas on anything on your android phone or jot down ideas and store them server side when you're waiting for the bus. You could see all the ideas from a particular person, search based on tag, etc. Lots of things you could do with that.
So I pitched this idea to my friends as I started writing the server side service. Funny, they were afraid of the exact same thing you are. And yet another one of my projects barely in the larval stage died. Because of the fear of sharing ideas. You are not alone in your logic but you're not going to get very far if you don't shed that mentality. I guess your motivation may be money instead of just doing something interesting. If that's the case, I hope you are one smooth talking salesman because venture capital is harder to get these days.
My work here is dung.
They will find flaws
hi!
I see this a lot in the game industry, everyone always has this idea which they can't tell you in case someone else steals it. "The million dollar idea!" they say.
Only problem with this thinking is that anything you've thought up has been done before and telling people that you have an idea but done want to tell anyone is just annoying the people around you, if not slightly insulting that you can't trust them.
...provide and example?
TOP DSLR Cameras Reviews of the top DSLRs
and have the expert vet that element. You said yourself you think details are what you're missing; you have to hypothesize what details are missing or wrong and ask the expert to vet the hypothetical.
Talk to people you trust. It's just that simple. Use your friends and family as a "soundboard" for your idea. They will see the holes you did not.
I wouldn't expect anyone to ever sign an NDA without knowing what they are getting into. I don't recall the article, but it basically said any company who signs an NDA like that is opening themselves to liability. That's why most will not even discuss ideas so that you cannot later take them to court for stealing your idea. If you want to discuss an idea and they already have 2 years of research into the exact same thing they are opening themselves to the liability of a lawsuit from you. The same apparently goes for music companies.
Once you are sure you have a good idea run with it and don't stop until its too late. Anything else and you are setting yourself up for failure.
IMAGE VERIFICATION IS EVIL!
That way you can sell people with clip art, flying headlines, and indecipherable diagrams that will cause people to want what you've got, but have no clue what it is and how it can help them!
Is it sad that I am more likely to recognize you and your posts by your sig than your name or UID?
Just implement the idea and sell it. The market will give you a pretty good indication of the idea's worthiness.
Most of your geekiest friends are intelligent people who can tear your idea apart and find the flaws, true enough. Just identify the geeks whose ideas you'll trust, but are far too unmotivated to take your idea and run with it. With a little research (you've been playing videogames with these guys at LAN parties for years, so you know who their friends are), you can make sure that you only show your idea to the most brilliant intellectually, but hopelessly inept socially. They'll never get it off the ground! And all for the price of a cup of coffee or a pizza! Win/win!
You can't take the sky from me!
if you actually just gave them away.
Everything that I have invented is just in thought and is not produced for lack of money. These inventions are property of myself and are to be patented, copyrighted and trademarked under my name: Shampoo.
So just remind everyone constantly that your idea was invented by Rival and should be patented and trademarked and copyrighted under your name: Rival. It's that easy.
My work here is dung.
You come up with a lot of ideas. If someone steals one why let it worry you? Just come up with another idea. If you come up with so many, why do you think they're so valuable? Do you think you;re the only person with good ideas
Come up with the best idea for a business in the world. Ask a VC for funding. He'll laugh at you. Come up with the best idea for a novel ever. Ask a publisher for an advance or an agent to represent you. They'll ignore you. Nobody weants an idea. They want a fully fledged plan at the very least. Ideally they'll want a prototype.
So talk to people. Tell them your idea. If they're good they'll come up with 100 reasons why it won't work/. Deal with those reasons (either by proving they don't matter or working out how to solve them) and you;re on your way to a solution.
What's wrong with being bought out? If your idea is good and your business plan is decent then odds are that you can set it up in such a way that you can retire with the proceeds from being bought out.
Friends of mine got into the ISP business back in the day before it was even on the radar of $Monolith_Company. $Monolith_Company eventually bought them out. They've since spent their days traveling the world and working because they want to, not because they need to. What's wrong with this outcome?
I want peace on earth and goodwill toward man.
We are the United States Government! We don't do that sort of thing.
You have a few routes, but, be prepared: 1) NDA - allows for consultation, etc, while disallowing your consultants to leak info -Flaws: could be expensive, as you'll likely need a lawer to draw it all out; The external parties must agree to it (obviously); Nothing's really there to stop people from violating it; If people break the NDA, what are the terms involving breach of contract? Lawsuit? Damages? 2) Build your genius invention, apply for patent protection, and enjoy 20 years of income for your device gradually erode as knockoffs and patent violators line up As with one of the above posters, build it, and let the world judge if it really is genius. I've made a few small-time inventions that have pulled in a few grand for me which I though were pretty clever, but to declare one's own self as "genius" is nothing short of arrogant, even if it's worded politely. Take it from a biomedical engineer who's done some pretty nifty independent projects, if you are posting to /. for advice on this, it's not genius, probably just high-risk/high-gain. Keep rolling those dice. In the meantime, if anyone wants to earn the title of "genius", try solving on of Hilbert's problems:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hilbert's_problems
Acquire a Men In Black mind eraser.
in book margins, and add that the space is not enough for explain yourself fully. Worked for Fermat for 400 years.
What I do is I pitch a modified version of the idea where several key components are blatantly impossible, stupid, and possibly illegal. Then I pitch it to my friendly neighborhood geek and ask for his advice. They'll start ranting about how retarded my idea is, but I'll keep goading them and say "Okay, but imagine if we could fix that, what else do you think?" Knowing how geeks are amenable to abstract hypotheticals, and love to refute things in a thorough point-by-point fashion, they'll keep going on and on about the rest of the design too. I'll pretend to take notes the whole time, but in actuality I'm just seeing what they say about the real parts of the design. But when I depart, they're left with the overall impression that my idea was retarded and useless. I get my feedback, and they're none the wiser!
Anyway, that irrelevant nonsense aside, I'm busy working on a high performance V-8 hemi engine powered by babies. I'm having some troubles with the baby pump getting clogged by babies, and also my valve timing equations could use some tweaking. Any automotive engineers want to help me out with some constructive criticism and proprietary engine timings? Thanks!
The enemies of Democracy are
Ideas are worth absolutely zilch. Any of the 6 billion people on earth can come up with your idea, and probably have. What is valuable is the execution of ideas.
So my advice is to pick one idea that you like and execute on it. You'll probably find out your idea wasn't that good after all and fail. Do this another 10 times or so and you'll finally get one idea that works. Stick with that one. Good luck.
A Magic the Gathering Article and Forum Aggregator
You say you come up with a lot of ideas, but what exactly are the ideas for?
For example, I'm a marketing person at my day job, I think of new ways for our office to promote our listings and so I send out these ideas, after some testing and Q&A with my graphics and research departments, in monthly installments to everyone. No harm in anyone taking my idea and claiming it as their own as it ultimately wouldn't matter because any successful idea potentially helps generate revenue for our office and thus keep us all employed. Of course if you are a paranoid person about corporate sabotage within your own office because Dude in Department A wants your job I guess that would be a different story, fortunately I'm not a paranoid person.
Now lets look outside the office and maybe you have creative ideas for a new business or a potential expansion of an existing business. Well with this you may want to keep a tighter lid on things because of the potential for competitors to use the idea first. That is one of the main reasons any good business person will have potential business plan reviewers or investment personal sign an NDA before reviewing any ideas on paper. This is common and anyone who isn't willing to sign one before potentially working with you isn't worth talking too as they will either screw you over or waste your time.
Ave Molech Setting
I always thought if I had a great idea to go ahead and write it down and take it to a notary. I BELIEVE this will prove you had it at a specific time and date without giving it away. I admit I am not trained in patent law it is just an idea though. Good luck!
You know those people you know you can trust...
When you say "Don't tell anyone about my great idea..." and they DON'T?
Yeah those are great people to talk to.
really, that's what patents are for, people who think their "linked list" idea is so genius nobody else thought about it and they need to protect it from the evil programmers (who make a living out of coming out with stuff like that every day) who want to steal it.
--
Stay tuned for some shock and awe coming right up after this messages!
Don't worry about someone "stealing" your ideas. They don't make money by stealing ideas, they make money by funding other peoples' ideas. A lot of money. They don't need to steal anyone's ideas. If you keep it to yourself, they will be perfectly happy to fund two dozen other people who share their ideas, and to make a killing doing it.
Nobody is that interested in ideas; ideas don't make all that much money, believe it or not. Execution makes the money. If it's a good idea, lots of people will be happy to pay you a comparatively small amount (that well may seem huge to you) for the privilege of bringing it to market. They don't steal ideas; that would be killing off the golden goose. Venture capital and other similar interests don't want the ideas to stop coming to them, which is what would happen if they actually stole ideas.
Same thing with publishing and creative works. When I was younger and working on my first books, I was very wary of publishers. I hated to discuss a manuscript. Everything I sent was plastered with copyright notices and I would be sure to send myself a sealed certified copy first with a postmark date on it and then file it away in a safe deposit box. I was that sure that my prose was precious.
Now I have the better part of a dozen books on the market and I've been through the process a few times and I know much better. The publisher isn't interested in what's in your book. They're not impressed. They've seen tens of thousands of manuscripts. It's no crown jewel to them, no matter how good it is. They just want to know whether or not they can sell it. If they can, they're perfectly happy to pay you the royalty and rake in the dough.
Ideas people often make the mistake of thinking that we live in a world of ideas, in which ideas are precious and he who has them rules. In fact, we live in a world of employees and middlemen, most of whom are perfectly uninterested in ideas. With or without your idea, they'll continue on their merry way to be successful by paying for ideas from someone and turning them into products.
If you don't get over your fear, what will happen is that they'll continue to make money, continue to pay other people for their ideas, and you'll continue to have nothing but your great ideas that nobody knows about. Just put them out there. Talk about them as much as you can. That's the way that you broaden your network of contacts, potential funders, and potential buyers to the maximum extent possible.
STOP . AMERICA . NOW
For instance:
I have this awesome idea that does this thing with this do-hickey which lets everyone do stuff in original and clever ways. Like when you're doing that thing and it wont do this thing, you know? That's where this thing really shines!
I say don't drink and drive, you might spill your drink. Before you get behind the wheel just stop and think.
"Don't worry about people stealing your ideas. If your ideas are any good, you'll have to ram them down people's throats." -- Howard Aiken
Irony Can Be So Ironic (Massachusetts Edition)
If he understands and digs it, it's been done or is fatally flawed. If he stares at you blankly, maybe you're on to something. Best part: he's guaranteed not to accurately disclose or competently act on your idea!
"The ability to delude yourself may be an important survival tool" - Jane Wagner -
$100, no lawyer needed.
Warning: this article may contain humor, sarcasm, parody, and perhaps even irony. Read at your own risk.
A friend of my brother's actually set up a private social network precisely for the purpose of batting around ideas. Each member contributes a number of ideas each month, and the members discuss it, pointing out flaws or opportunities. The ideas may be business ideas or invention ideas or ideas for writing a book.
One of the conditions of joining the club is that each member agree that any idea belongs with its originator, and that nobody commercialize anyone else's idea without prior permission. I don't know how well such an agreement would hold up in court, but it's a start.
Another approach is to bounce the idea off someone who might be in the target market, but who isn't an expert in your field. Several times, I've bounced a gadget idea off my brother, who will respond with a question like "but why would I use that instead of product x?"
Help find a cure for cancer. Join the [H]orde
Exactly. People overvalue the concept of "idea" and undervalue the concept of aggressive business positioning, development, marketing, capital, and a lot of, well, work.
I was at Harvard when facebook was "born." I was persistently skeptical about the whole thing, as the concept was not new *at all*, and friendster was reigning supreme, which I kind of thought was a silly fad. I was subsequently astounded over the years how facebook has taken off. (I am still astounded.) But, had the founders listened to me, or saw that their idea was "taken," it would have gone nowhere.
That being said, I wouldn't give a highly established potential competitor research data that you have gotten to get your idea off the ground. Despite my words, I also hold a few patents, but these are mostly defensive positioning and required by my corporation.
Nebulous "ideas" have an insignificant chance of being "thought of" already. What you need to do is get honest feedback about the barriers to implementation, then just go and do it!
Slashdotter, ID #101. UIDs are in binary, right?
As a fellow genius wannabe, I have - just like you - come up with several ideas. Some good, some bad, some great but had already been discovered (damn you, Einstein - just kidding ;-). But seriously, the way I approach any "good idea" is talk I to people that 1) I trust (family members, friends mostly) and 2) those with some experience in the field (although non-experts can give exciting and diverse points of view). Being unbiased helps.
But on the other hand, as one poster mentioned, ideas are dime a dozen. The problem is (generally) not coming up with the idea per se, but putting it into practice. Having said that, there's a good chance that someone has already thought of it, but is too lazy/busy/worried about other things to pursue it.
All in all, I wouldn't worry *too* much about it, just talk to people you know who are unbiased and get their feedback, then go from there.
I've found myself in a similar situation for the past couple years. Like others have suggested, you just have to pick the one you like the most and try it out. Most people have no incentive to truly review your ideas. What I would definitely recommend, however, is to make sure that you write down all of these ideas somewhere. You never know what you will do with them in the future. And make no mistake: you *will* forget about the best ones by the time you're finished with the crappy one you are currently trying out!
You'll need to pay people to drag it away.
That is all.
I can find out if my tyres filled with a non-newtonian fluid and little ladders for moths to climb out of the bathtub with will be successful!
-- Lattyware (www.lattyware.co.uk)
My experience has been that sharing the ideas creates contacts and opportunities which keep me employed at work I love and, last week, sent me all expenses paid to Hawaii where on the Big Island I did off-road driving like a maniac in a rented Jeep through lava deserts to beautiful deserted beaches.
You are, as you put it, "constantly coming up with clever ideas." Don't worry about it if someone swipes one of them. Sooner or later, entrepreneurial folks who you become acquainted with notice that you're an idea man and some will pay to have you put your creativity to work on their projects. And if you tend to have really good ideas, they'll pay you quite well.
And as the entrepreneurial guys decide to jump out and start the next company, your name is on the list they'll invite to join them.
Of course, if you keep the ideas to yourself, no one will ever notice how clever you really are and the opportunities that could have been yours will swing wide of you instead.
Moderating "-1, Disagree" is simple censorship. Have the guts to post your opinion.
Don't worry about people stealing your ideas. If your ideas are any good, you'll have to ram them down people's throats."
Howard Aiken
Aiken was right. I know. I've been traveling that lonely road for a long time. Good luck.
Here's how: tell them your idea. Nobody is going to bother to "steal" your idea until you have already taken the risk and expense. People aren't cruising around looking for ideas to steal. Think about it: have you ever heard, even second-hand, of anyone doing that? Have you ever thought of doing that (forget whether or not you'd do it; have you ever even considered it)?
What good idea-stealers do, is watch to see who makes what work, and then imitate. You won't be imitated until after you succeed.
If your invention is the "flashy thingy" from Men In Black, then I think you've solved your own problem.
I'll tell you how I think you could do it, if you'll just sign this contract first...
You either trust the person not to steal your idea, or you need to get him to sign documents. There is no other way. I am going to give a shameless plug to an article I wrote regarding trade secrets.
The basic idea is that if you want to protect a trade secret, you should keep it secret. Even if you trust the guy giving you advice, a third party who misappropriates your trade secret may claim that it wasn't confidential if you let this other guy read it without a confidentiality agreement. In fact, that's probably the best way to get your advisor to sign: my explaining that it prevents third parties from claiming that the information is not confidential.
You could also file a provisional application, which is relatively cheap. After you file the provisional, you have up to a year to file a full-on patent application. However, it sounds like you are not ready for this expense yet. In that case, you should stick with a non-disclosure agreement or at least a confidentiality agreement that clarifies that the information is sensitive and confidential.
A NYC lawyer blogs. http://www.chuangblog.com/
Dude, you're not a Slashdot geek... your microwave isn't in the same room as your PC. You mean you have to walk to another room on another floor in order to get yer grub?! Who can live with that sorta distraction?
If you want people to sign contracts, pay them.
If their advice isn't worth paying for, it's not really worth having anyway.
It was a "Jump to Conclusions" mat. You see, it would be this mat that you would put on the floor... and it would have different CONCLUSIONS written on it that you could JUMP TO.
I think the possibility of having your idea stolen is sooo remote compared to the upsides. As you say, it's pretty likely it's been tried, or dismissed already. You could learn about why from these conversations. If you have an OK idea, you might gather key insights to further it. You might be talking to someone who instantly becomes your business partner. Or can introduce you to someone with more advice or time to work with you. Or funding.
Remember that an individual, and all the more so a large company, have something to lose from stealing your idea. Lawsuits, bad press, etc. Presumably you are talking, also, to someone you trust.
On the other hand, I've gone on to ignore plenty of people who approach me with a 'secret' idea and won't just describe it, or want an NDA, and in the end just have an idea that has already been implemented ages ago. You can harm yourself by being too secretive.
I read an very truthful-sounding (as well as depressingly down-to-earth) advice on new ideas that goes like this: "Don't worry if anyone will steal your ideas... if they're any good you'll have a hard time showing them down people's throats anyway."
The point is - ideas are a dime a dozen. If the idea needs some help to succeed - money, resources, people, etc. - which you don't have, there is very slim chance that some friend you tell it to will have them. If, and this is the really long shot - you ever come to find sponsors for the idea that would invest in it in any way - you will correctly assume you need lawyers. Once you convince *your sponsors*, you'll sell the idea to them anyway, in exchange for more or less money, depending on how good your lawyers are.
There is no way to get useful feedback on an idea by sitting on it and not discussing it with anyone.
-- Sig down
It seems like you're concerned about whether or not your idea is justified or desired. Sometimes people don't know they need something until it's put in front of their face, and they instantly realize what they've been missing, and generally say the phrase, "I can't believe I've gone so long without this thing!" Those kind of ideas are what you'd need to discuss with the average person, if even a friend you can trust.
My problem isn't for want of justification of the idea, I just don't know how to go about properly building it. For instance, I know exactly how I'd like to create a unique DC motor, using IGBTs to fire individual coils and a timer for firing the IGBTs, but I don't know enough about the technical aspects: Can IGBTs handle huge inductors of 5-10 Henries? How are IGBTs wired? If I crank this capacitor value up, what happens? That sort of thing. I feel as if I'm going to need an expert to verify that it can be done, almost an electrical engineer.
If this is your problem, we're in the same boat.
The few useful and sound ideas that people have are probably re-invented a thousand times a year across the world. What makes the difference between "genius" and forgotten is whether the person who thinks of it (again) has the ability, resources and interest to follow through and make a success of it. It's not the idea itself, but how you progress it that is the difference between success and failure..
On that basis, so long as you don't disqualify your idea by disclosing it, if you wish to patent it, discuss it with anyone you like - it won't make any difference. A true expert will either have already thought of it and discounted it for th reasons they will tell you, has thought of it but has no interest in pursuing it or hasn't thought of it and therefore won't really be in a position to offer advice on whether it would or would not work[1]. If you think they'll steal "your" idea, you've been watching too many bad TV dramas.
One last thing - I hope you're expecting to pay the experts who's advice you are seeking. If so, just draw up a contract with an NDA in it - there, I bet you didn't think of that simple "genius" solution or yo wouldn't have had to ask the question, would you?
[1] generally if an "expert" hasn't thought of an idea themself, they will tell you that it won't work and give you various technical reasons why theu're right. However, since you had to go and ask them to start with, that shows that you do not have the knowledge to judge for yourself - so are unable to make an assessment of whether they're right or wrong. Experts are not that good at saying "yes, even though you are a layman, you've come up with an idea that none of the learned professionals in this field have ever considered before." It may be that they're so bad at saying this because it never actually happens.
politicians are like babies' nappies: they should both be changed regularly and for the same reasons
Sign a non-disclosure agreement.
I've had a couple of ideas in my life that were very similar to several very successful start-ups at a similar point in time as their founders did (as I imagine several hundred thousand people did) and I have learned that most of the world is quick to find fault with original ideas and offers little advice on how to overcome those problems.
My suggestion would be to refine your idea into the simplest form possible and create a prototype to show to people, and then use their feedback to improve your idea. Realistically, if your idea is too complicated to to create a prototype it is probably too complicated for you to be successful with anyways ...
a phrase I do not invoke lightly
especially the exclamation
Now please excuse me while explain the cause of my amusement to my coworkers...
"The ability to delude yourself may be an important survival tool" - Jane Wagner -
The solution is obvious if you think about it, just increase the stiffness rate of the Piston Return Springs and your problems are solv-ed.
Of course, if you're running a high viscosity of Red & Green Running Light Oil, then you may have to consider installing a Rubber Lobed Camshaft to compensate.
If you are going to ask another person for advice on an idea, they give you good suggestions, and you use those ideas, wouldn't you be stealing ideas from them to make your idea better? I found that if you offer to include them in on the patent, they loosen up and give out some very good insight. They will also have an invested interest in the idea and will be less likely to give it away.
The guvenat0r has the answer:
http://twitvid.io/abv1
- Mad, ingenous - they've both left you puzzled -
"I'm not conceited enough to think my idea is genius; I just assume that I'm not knowledgeable enough to see what I'm missing."
You used 4 I's and a my in a sentence where you're not supposed to be conceited. I think irony has been invented friend.
Rudyard Kipling: "They copied all they could follow, but they couldn't copy my mind, so I left them sweating and stealing a year and a half behind."
Gasp! It's RIVAL. You bastard! You picked the Pokemon to which my one was weak! You're always two steps ahead of me! And now I find you're the champion of the Pokemon League! Augh!!!
What if his idea was how to execute another idea?
then kill the person and hide the body.
Now that I've told you all, step a little closer to the screen, please...
Ask a lazy person, or even better, a serial procrastinator. They may want to steal your idea, but will never get around to it.
The television will not be revolutionized.
There is a ton of information available here: http://www.uspto.gov/web/patents/howtopat.htm
I've been trying to come up with sayings and I think I might have come up a good one:
"You can't come up with sayings. Either the saying you come up with is no good, or someone has said it before."
(If that is a good saying (maybe with some polish to the wording (english is my third language)), it's the last saying there can be. Or maybe someone's allready said it?)
Some of my favourite people are from th US; Vonnegut, Chomsky, Bill Hicks.
The point of a good idea is that it provides some benefit you desire if implemented. I've found that the fastest way to get the implementation of my best IT ideas is just to post them here. Six months or a year later, There's a product review and I browse over to Newegg and buy the product. Everybody wins!
Help stamp out iliturcy.
We wont give the game away. Promise....
An intriguing solution to a problem that should never have existed in the first place...
You cannot change the world if you never tell anyone about your idea. If you truly believe that your idea is good, share it and make the world better place.
Good chance is that noone is interested in your idea. It takes years and years of work to get anyone interested in your work, much less some ideas with no proper effort behind them.
Ideas are useless, if noone implements them. It's the implementation that gets patent protection, not just the idea. But we can only implement the very best ideas - it takes lots more effort to extract useful result out of an idea than it takes to invent the idea. And it's boring manual labor of hundreds of people to make an idea useful.
Obviously, you just need to sit down and THINK about your idea.
You seem like a fairly smart person, you should be able to objectively look at your idea and say "Okay, this is useful / useless", forget your personal likes/dislikes.
Question people on the space of their life that you intend to fill with your idea: your idea has to be useful for people.
This doesn't involve telling anyone anything.
You can throw in some control questions to figure out whether your person is smart or average. Sound smart? Just walk away. (this might require a lot of preparation if you aren't in to the whole mind games thing)
Don't bother risking the "make people think they want this" method, thousands of people fail with this every year, probably significantly more go unreported. (some end up risking their entire life just for some idea they refuse to give up, which is just tragic)
You need to aim for the majority when starting out.
Do not aim for a niche market just as you are sprouting, make sure you have at least 2 successful products out there. (successful being decently profitable)
Also, write down all your ideas, whether it is in a word processor, or paper.
Order them in to lists of time to produce, price to produce, intended market, etc.
Implement the simplest, cheapest and most profitable ideas first.
You can use the money to help pay for protection of other ideas.
This is from the quote of the day a month or so back:
Don't worry about people stealing an idea. If it's original, you will have to ram it down their throats.
Howard Aiken (1900 - 1973)
I've found this to be true working at a biotech startup - I don't know if that's good or bad for our future.
I once had a great idea. I turned it into a product. Now every once in a while someone who likes the product tells me they had the same idea a while back. Yep, lots of people did, but they never did anything about it, so no one cares.
The important thing isn't even to make the idea into something real, the important thing is working out all the details. That's like, the wrap drive, maybe the Star Trek writers came up with the idea, but it's pretty worthless until someone works out how to make it work, not necessarily build it, but come up with enough to make the thing doable.
This being said, even when you turn your great idea into some real and practical, it can take a while and much demonstrating before anyone gets it. As the first comment in TFA quotes: "Don't worry about people stealing your ideas. If they're any good, you'll have to ram them down their throats!". You could hardly overestimate other people's inertia to radical new ideas. Ideas directly sway little more than the people who have them. If you have a visionary idea, that's mainly because merely enunciating your ideas just won't suffice to carry your vision.
You just got troll'd!
I have an idea for a niche electronic product, and I've built a prototype. I'd really prefer not to spend the thousands of dollars involved in an international patent, not to mention the thousands more to defend the patent if I think that patent actually has been breached.
My only concern is that some "other company" might patent my idea, then sue me for infringement of that idea. Does "prior art" cover this? As long as my invention has been published/marketed/discussed/shown to my friends, the "other company" can't then go on and patent my original idea, right?
As I said, it's a niche product, custom-made to order, so I don't expect some big factory to steal the idea then churn them out by the thousand. So should I bother patenting it?
*Yes, I realise that asking for legal advice on Slashdot will have a terrible signal to noise ratio.
sustainable living
I agree with the body of your post, but not the subject.
What's wrong with this outcome?
...their employees, who quite liked working for a small local company rather than $Monolith_Company who don't give a shit about anyone, don't get any say in the matter.
That's what's wrong.
If vetting of your idea requires expertise that you yourself don't possess, you should be prepared to offer those you consult with a stake in the venture. Otherwise you'd be guilty of the very thing you seek to prevent.
If you are truly a serious inventor, journal your marketable thoughts, email, print and mail them to yourself to establish authorship. If possible, prototype the idea to establish prior art. Let those you discuss the idea with know the idea is documented and you should be protected as fully as the law allows.
Do you keep friends who you do this to?
Disclosing an idea to someone but not letting them steal it is really easy, i have the perfect process.
but i can't tell you what it is, sorry, you might steal my idea.
Rands suggests the FriendDA for approaching friends about ideas without requiring an entire, legally-vetted NDA. His post about it can be found on his blog, but the long and short of it is a short agreement that your friend signs agreeing not to screw you over by stealing your idea.
It might not be exactly what you're looking for, but check out http://whynot.net/ for idea exchange.
Friends are usefull, so are ideas, but resources are what you need. I have been involved in a few un successfull start ups (as a developer). The failures were all due to lack of resources. Sometimes it was capital, sometimes it was programers, sometimes it was mangement. It was a shame really, to see such good ideas go to the wall. So, your idea's might hold water, but the real skill is in developing that idea. I think quite a few ideas are not realised because they lack the resources to fully flesh it out. My idea is to gather like minded experienced and skilled people, then apply that to an idea. True it may take a really powerfull idea to galvanise the herd, but once the work animals are pointing in the right direction you can crush and destroy.
Step one: Patent your invention. It is an invention, right? Not just some half-baked idea, but instead, something you can write a paper about, providing implementation details sufficient to "allow one of ordinary skill in the art to make and use the invention without undue experimentation"?
Patenting your invention is not a vetting process. In fact, some inventions get patents because they do something in a more stupid way than the prior art teaches. The idea that a patent somehow confers credence is a marketing ploy hundreds of years old, but there's no truth to be found in it.
But you do get two benefits from patenting your invention: One, you find out some information about whether your invention is actually new, what parts of it are old (and possibly protected by their own patents), and you'll find out something about the techniques your competitors might be using (this information can be helpful, but it's not necessarily complete). And two, you get exclusive domain over your patent for 20 years from the filing date (possibly longer), so if you share your idea with a venture capitalist, only to find that the next year, they've taken your idea and cut you out of the loop, you can file a lawsuit to claim damages from their infringement.
If you choose to go the patent route, by the way, I strongly recommend that you hire a patent attorney. Very few pro se applicants know how to file a proper application, and even fewer can follow up by responding to the USPTO's actions with proper responses. For that matter, I've seen quite a few patent attorneys screw it up in small ways, but it's easy to tell how much of a hand an applicant had in drafting an application.
"Don't worry about people stealing an idea. If it's original, you will have to ram it down their throats." - Howard Aiken (Computer Pioneer - built MK 1 at Harvard)
One "Aw, Shit!" is worth 100 "Ata boys!"
Just post your ideas on "Ask Slashdot", of course!
MCSE? No, sir...I don't do Windows. Yes, I am an idealist. What's your point?
What I would do is find someone who's well acquainted in the field, then tell him your idea in great detail. If it's a bad idea, nothing lost, if it's a good idea, you can threaten to slaughter his whole family.
Help fight spam
You could probably get a grant to study how to make a vat of solar powered babies, using stem cells, as long as you could prove that it will have a positive net effect on global climate change.
Oh, and that it will "save or create" jobs. You might want to get union backing for that part.
Of course if you go off on your own, and do grow a giant baby, you could also get help if it becomes too big to fail!
The richest and most successful people I have ever known are completely oblivious to what others think of their ideas. I know many people who most would consider average or of below average intelligence who had ideas that make others laugh at them and then they turn around and make a fortune.
I have had some great ideas and shared them with my 'intelligent' friends and allowed them to talk me into believing they are not as great as I initially thought, only to later see someone else doing them and becoming wealthy.
So, the key to success with a genius idea is often a lack of desire to gather the feedback of others. It is also the safest.
Thank you for the best post ever on this subject. In fact they should remove all other posts except yours and close this thread.
You haven't made too explicit queries on Google for that, do you ?
Sorry, the "Jump to Conclusions" mat has already been done.
Serious what did the actually guy invent? Seams he ripped off (or rather paid a fair price for people to develop what where just ideas that needed a fair amount of development to make profitable) the people that came up with the ideas and got loaded himself!
IranAir Flight 655 never forget!
1. ideas don't make you rich, doing something with the idea does. it's all in the execution and the marketing.
2. if you can't even spell "vette", I don't hold out much hope for your execution skills.
Top Ten Geek Business Myths ( abridged ):
I recommend reading all of them; they are well-written and insightful.
So, if you're worried about someone 'stealing' your idea, making a bunch of money, and not sharing anything with you, Rondam says it won't happen. Nobody will ever steal your idea.
Are you worried more about your idea being stolen, or someone making money off of 'your' idea? Because making money is more about doing boring, stupid business stuff than having the Next Killer App. Remember Segway? Went nowhere, really. Want to really make money? Buy a dry cleaning establishment. One of the best, most guaranteed business investments out there. Except, it's all boring business stuff, like hiring and firing employees, working every day, having an accountant, paying taxes, etc. Buy an established one, with an existing clientele, rather than take the pains of starting up a business on your own. Saves a lot of the boring small-business start up crap.
Computers are useless. They can only give you answers.
-- Pablo Picasso
What's wrong with this outcome?
...their employees, who quite liked working for a small local company rather than $Monolith_Company who don't give a shit about anyone, don't get any say in the matter.
That's what's wrong.
It's not their company. They have no say. Welcome to the real world. Perhaps in communist countries, everybody has the right to get their say when the state owns everything, but here in the real world we have something called ownership. You don't own it, you can bitch and moan but you don't get a say.
Then they can quit. Employers certainly have an obligation to their employees. To treat them well and not screw them over if it's possible to avoid. No employee has the right to expect that their boss will run the company forever anymore than an employer has the right to expect that an employee will work for them forever. Not to mention that if we're talking about companies based on ideas, a lot of the employees are stock holders.
There are books on this stuff. "Patent It Yourself", by David Pressman, has long sections on how to tell if your idea is worth pursuing.
The two big questions are 1) has it been done, and 2) is there demand for it. Even if it's been done before, it may be worth doing again, but you should find out how things went last time.
There are different kinds of ideas. There are solutions to known problems; areas where others have tried and failed to develop a solution. Those are typically hard to do, but easy to sell if your solution works. There are "new cool things", which are more of a marketing issue than an implementation issue. (Apple didn't sell the first MP3 player.) There are new kinds of businesses; FedEx and NetJets are successful examples. Webvan is an unsuccessful example. (WebVan wasn't a bad idea; their problem was that they botched the growth strategy. They needed 30% market penetration in 3 markets to get economies of distribution; they got 3% market penetration in 30 markets.)
Which kind of idea is yours?
depending on what it is and what the market is, the answer probably is quite different. if its an iphone app, execute and publish, probably don't need to talk to anyone (i.e ifart). in regards to software targeted at corporations, i've gone thru a bit of this in the past, i've been both very open and secretive and I think these are reasonable behaviors, the problem is for someone that has not gone thru idea to success its difficult to know what steps to take and especially if they do not have access to someone else that has. i think with software though in many cases you can actually be quite open, and my experience is that after working in software for many years, there is a very long journey between ideas and turning that into revenue. also consider, even if its not new ideas, but you think you can deliver something that exist but with better value, its often a long journey. at the end of the day, push forward, get your ideas to the point where you have even generated revenue, and then profit, stay focused. if you truly think you have an idea, you can spend a little money and talk with a lawyer. i did this once, thought i had something unique, and I went to 2 lawyers to see if I would be the same or different opinions. both advised me to not patent and instead execute and compete. also keep in mind, it takes a lot more than writing the software... i think a successful software application could be delivered to 10 teams, the code already written, ready to be sold, and failure rate... might be the same as it is for software start-ups that have not written a line of published code yet.
If you need to check with a subject matter expert to determine whether your idea is any good, then you don't know enough about what you're talking about to have an idea that's worth anything. People who come up with really valuable ideas, ARE subject matter experts, at least for the narrow band of subject which covers their idea. If you don't know enough about the field to at least build a simulation of your idea and see if it works then you're never going to make any money out of it. No one ever gets rich off of "what if engines were 100% more efficient" they get rich of ideas like "if you put this thing into an engine here it will be 100% more efficient", if you know how to build "this" and how to put it "here" you don't need a subject matter expert, if you don't then your idea will never make you rich no matter how good it is, because the money will, quite rightfully, go to the person who worked that out.
Initially at least send yourself an email with a detailed description of the idea include drawings etc.
This gives at least some minimal protection by date & time stamping the email and the idea's conception by you.
One of the first things you might want to do is go to the US Patent and Trademark Office web site and use their search tools:
http://patft.uspto.gov/
and do a search to see if someone actually has come up with the same or very similar idea.
If you can't find anything then perhaps talk to friends to see if anyone has a reference for a Patent Lawyer you could consult with.
First, if your idea is that easy to steal, then it's probably not that good. The best ideas have some secret sauce (e.g. a really elegant algorithm) behind them, and it's that secret sauce that makes them valuable. If your idea is just a concept, and isn't based on some secret sauce, then it probably isn't as good as you think.
For instance, I once helped build a CRM product called SalesLogix and our secret sauce was a database synchronization system. Telling you that the system relied on DB sync isn't telling you much of significance, because it just describes the concept and not the secret sauce. Even describing the secret sauce, which was based on field level logging, wasn't that big of a deal because it took a lot of trial and error to build the logging system and the sync system.
In a similar vein, there is a quote by Paul Hawken that I love that says basically the same thing. The gist is to not worry about people stealing your ideas because the best ideas are an integral part of you and your experience and the only way to steal them in their entirety is to steal your life.
Don't worry about people stealing your ideas. If your ideas are any good, you'll have to ram them down people's throats. - Howard Aiken
File a provisional patent. It costs less than a couple of hundred bucks and takes one day of focused work. It gives you a year to talk about the idea and seek feedback before over-investing.
If it turns out to be a good idea, you can file for a full patent that goes back retroactively to the filing date of the provisional.
All of the "discoveries" of the universe have and always will be there. The theory of relativity, quantum physics, micro-biology, chemistry.. the list goes on to infinity. All of these have always existed. Are people that full of themselves that simply because enough time and researched elapsed to facilitate it's realization by individuals, that those individuals consider themselves genius or think they have discovered something new? Just because it's new to you, your company, your county, or in fact the world does not make it novel or genius.
Your just another patent troll. Don't waste our time.
Hope is the currency of fools
I'd love to give you my ideas on the matter, but I'm worried you might steal them. Maybe if you email me your ideas I can tell you whether they're worth getting an expert opinion on.
Get me a meat pie floater!
Im the founder/ceo of a funded tech startup.
Let me share some advice I learned the hard way:
Share your great ideas promiscuously as possible to attract collaborators, even in highly specialised science and engineering fields.
Otherwise your ideas will never gain traction and actually happen, and you will always be a dreamer.
In the unlikely event that someone steals your idea, take it as a compliment and move on to the next great idea.
Great ideas are easy to come up with. It's the execution that's the tough part. Startups are 1% inspiration and 99% perspiration.
Unless only 1-2 people in the world understand what your talking about, pretty much anything you communicate verbally is not going to have
much value to a competitor.The vast majority of the time secrecy is extremely toxic and harmful to getting an idea off the ground.
Few tropes are as tired and tiresome as Edison's claims, such as 'I haven't failed; I've found 10,000 ways that don't work.'
Back then, Edison could (and did) hire hundreds of engineers, have them grind through the experiments, and then claim their inventions as his own. It was then legal for a single powerful executive to claim all patents as his own, even when he'd done none of the work. (Now, they just get to claim they're co-inventors.)
consistent with many other industry executives. I did some reading after my initial reply to this thread, and although the open source world has been a huge inflection point, competition is as fierce as ever.
http://www.intel.com/pressroom/kits/bios/grove/paranoid.htm
One of the most insightful posts I've seen on Slashdot in a while. Nicely done.
It's better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.
- E. Debs
who know something about the field of the idea.
no sig.
File a patent disclosure, I believe that gives you 1 year to file a patent. Consult somebody who knows more than me your mileage may vary.
Be careful when and where you give out such ideas. Some hiring practices and some colleges make you sign away your intellectual property rights if any portion of them required resources by said party making you sign on the dotted line.
"They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety" Franklin
He was a "certified genius".
"I don't every worry about people stealing my ideas, if the idea is any good you'll have to beat people over the head with it to get them to accept it."
But seriously, good "ideas" are a dime a dozen, good implementations are what is importany
Not quite the quality review that was originally suggested buy I have had good mileage by emailing a summary via gmail.
I have vetted a few proposals inadvertently in the planning stage by exchanging emails with partners via gmail. The advertising algorithm picks out ads that related to the terms and seems to reliably catch the "someone else is doing something very similar" problem.
If you are really concerned about keeping it "yours", then write it down and register the copyright for it in your country. I believe that sending it as a fax to someone is a proper and legal way of making it "published". If you really think that it's also valuable, file a patent application (this is not automatic like the copyright, but works on a first come, first served basis, so better be first than sorry). The "writing it down" (and optionally faxing it) makes sure that you are the author of that specific "version" of the idea, which could come in handy later, but it's also probably the first step required to be able to distribute it "as yours" to other people and have it peer-reviewed (in a sense) by your colleagues/friends/whatever. You could use this second "step" before applying for a patent to avoid extra costs for having to revise it should something be wrong and the initial application is rejected by the Patent Office - although the nice country of the USA allows patents on software and I'll bite my nails for the first flawless piece of software, so I wouldn't worry about flawed ideas that you might want to patent if they're worthy... In summary, share it (publish), fix it (peer-review), and use it (?)
Can I put a spell on those who can't spell?
Your wheels are loose and they're losing their grip, good you're there.
One of the issues I have with such agreements, especially when the friend is an "expert" in the particular field is that it is probable that, being an expert in the field, he has already heard or thought about the idea.
People usually think the idea they thought of was never thought of before.. but I think it is more likely the idea has been considered many times.. possibly not yet implemented. So I think the OP should not really worry about NDAs and secrets.. talk to friends/experts about it. If it looks like something worth spending time on, so and spend sleepless weeks and months implementing it. That's the hard part, and what's unique/rare. Ideas aren't.
http://dilemma.gulecha.org - My philospohical short film.
If you can't tell it's a winner without "vetting" it, it's mediocre crap that might be worthwhile, but not good enough to win you prizes, fortune, fame, or whatever it is you're after. Seriously.
+++OK ATH
If you're the kind of person who comes up with novel ideas seemingly all the time, forget right now about supporting yourself with your "genius" alone. Especially if you are actually that smart.
Forget also about just patenting that one good idea and living off it for the rest of your life. It is just not going to happen.
You are simply far too small a player for intellectual property law to help you.
Intellectual property laws exist so that some ideas can enslave others. (A corporation is an organisation made out of ideas, and the people who serve them.)
The only way you can succeed at this is by giving away many ideas and becoming known for coming up with good ones. Once you have a sufficient measure of fame then you will have bargaining power to argue the case for your upkeep. Until then you are just another yokel with an Idea.
Proving Examples ;- Any of the big names in OSS, or indeed people like Edison, Farnsworth, Armstrong (of superheterodyne fame) etc.
Don't worry that you're selling yourself short - think in terms of your worth to the global community. If you patent one idea then live off it for the rest of your life, then ultimately you are just a drain on resources - not earning your keep.
Hell, a lot of good technical ideas occur to multiple people often almost simultanously - If that is the case, and you've just had an idea in isolation from the first to come up with it, is it "your" idea? And how can you be certain that you really were the first? And does it even matter?
All this competition is just a meaningless pissing match - and always has been.
Anything at all that gets in the way of implementation and utilization of a good idea is ultimately a waste of time.
The time and effort people spend pissing around with lawyers, they could be actually developing the idea and doing something productive with it.
You talk about the "risk" of people "sharing" "your" idea.
First of all, think about it closely and realize that the idea owns you, not the other way around. It wants to get out, and then it may no longer need you.
Let's look at this from a biological perspective. We developed brains. Then we developed spoken language, then we finally developed written language and shared culture and were able to stop developing biologically through the old survival-of-the-fittest.
At which point we began developing ever more complex rules and systems with little to no basis in reality. These rules and their interplay began to take on a kind of virtual life of their own, culminating in the creation of the "corporation". A virtually alive creature awarded the same protections under the rules we call law, as the individual. Since then they have been using their advantages in not needing any specific person to survive in order to outcompete all individuals.
Ergo, you cannnot win against them. IP Law is merely the next stage of evolution of the leading exponent of life - which is the corporation, not us. With IP law they finally gain not only the control of our physical bodies, but the control of our minds as well.
Forget about those who say "oh, just declare yourself a corporation". This can never work - you are still a corporeal being, with corporeal problems.
Remember that big corps eliminate small corps all the time - quite often illegally too. The states of the world aren't going to step in - governments plus their people are like a bastard cross between the individual and the corporation - they have the disadvantages of both, and this makes them weaker then a corporation.
This is why outright very high end corruption is prevalant in the USA. "campaign contributions"?
The first rule of Fight Club is you don't talk about Fight Club.
For every person with a great idea to talk about, there's another one with the same idea who didn't waste time talking about it.
Attempting an implementation is the best way to find problems.
-- 'The' Lord and Master Bitman On High, Master Of All
I once came across duct fans with more thrust than weight and immediately had the great idea of making a helicopter with four rotors, a gyroscope and feedback. Couldn't find it on google, so I twisted my brain and came up with a name as great as the invention: Quatrocopter! I googled that and found all the others who had invented the same thing and given it the same name.
1. Get started
2. Talk to people you know
3. Be clear and honest
4. Offer to collaborate
I'd say in life the big challenge is almost always getting people on board with your idea at all. Trying to titrate between getting them to believe in it enough to figure out the flaws but no so much that they run with it seem more difficult than useful. But if you have to, pitch it to the people you'd want to work with on the project. If they get psyched and want to run with it, you can run with them.
But as many have said, ideas aren't hard. It's implementation, revenue, and luck that are hard.
To that end, here's a million-dollar idea I'm not going to do anything with.
It's Bitter - Binary Twitter, for the geeks.
Because for lots of us, 140 characters are too imposing. It's like doing multiple Haikus at once. But binary we can do.So, with Bitter, you just get a bit. Your status is 0 or 1. You change it as appropriate. Eat a yummy peach: 1. Miss your bus: 0.
And it saves a ton of time for the author AND the audience: you can immediately see the status of a million friends in a 1000x1000 bitmap! Just try that with Facebook.
And just think of the data-mining and mashup possibilities. Track how and when people flip their bits. Tie it into Facebook and other profiles to see what coorelations there are between activities there and bitflipping. It would be glorious!
Oh, and the million bucks? Just sell $1M in advertising. An idea like this, it can't miss! What could possibly go wrong? :).
Anyway, it's only half a joke. It'd be an amusing little Facebook app or whatever. Could make some money maybe, but maybe wouldn't. But I've got a book to finish, and a third of another book after that, and a house remodel, and making Silverlight awesome. No way I'd ever get to it.
Ideas are cheap. Attention is expensive. And other people's sustained attention is REALLY expensive (=employee). That's the hard part.
My video compression blog
Oh man! I'm so writing an iPhone app consisting of a single red bigass button to flip your bitter status!
I'm a gonna be rich!
Whatcha doing buddy? Oh, just flipping my bit.
People replying to my sig annoy me. That's why I change it all the time.
First up, some citation is needed. I couldn't find a single trace of a lawsuit coming about from burp-tanks.
The story just sounds like some fictional feel good story passed around to cheer up people who think they hold a genius idea. Do correct me if you can find a source or citation for this story though.
Secondly you say that he could of made more money by being patient, but i'd argue that is far from true. You never know when someone else is going to come up with an invention that would make your invention either obsolete or just an alternative.
Sooner you go to production, the sooner you can establish a a foothold, and set companies in their ways with your product. By the time a competing idea comes along, hopefully you idea is so ingrained that they just won't bother with the alternatives, at the very least you'll have the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_mover advantage.
As for loosing most his money to lawyers, I'd expect very much that if he did win all his lawsuits, he would of made more then if he had a legal arrangement, at least short-term. Punitive damages are designed to do just that. He should of got what he wanted for his idea AND then if his lawyers were any good, received large punitive damages on top.
As for mending the resulting burnt bridge, I'd say with all that cash you just received you'd be able to purchase some top notch marketing. If your product is worth using, I'd say you'd be able to come to some arrangement rather easily.
If your that scared of burning them, out of court settlements are also great way to come to a mutually beneficial agreement.
Sitting on an idea and letting it rot while you try to make the 'perfect' launch is a great way to fall behind the times or be 2nd to the punch.
To avoid criticism; Say nothing, Do nothing, Be nothing.
These are the 3 types of ideas I myself have worked with.
1. The idea is impossible in practice.
This is almost always due to the idea being incoherent in some way, and you can ask about the part you guess might be incoherent.
Next is that the idea has some kind of bottle neck, such as there being no widely known fast algorithm to solve the problem.
2. There is an essential part of the idea, typically an unknown or too slow algorithm.
When you ask, those smart enough to answer, will often immediately understand the idea, while those not smart enough to understand the idea, will not know if there is a good enough algorithm.
However, I have experienced on several occasions that very smart and knowing people did not get my idea, because it was too unusual. So, if your idea is sufficiently unusual or untypical, but can be made from parts that are typically used in other fields, asking can be done relatively safely.
3. The idea is doable, and only needs excellent people to implement it.
In this case, there tends to have already been several teams which have tried it, and failed, typically in Java.
My experience is that these ideas can be asked in parts without revealing too much, and even if revealed, it is not a big problem because people usually fail at implementing it. This is the kind of idea that I typically am able to implement myself, alone, but which I will fail implementing when part of a team, especially if it is a Java team.
You guessing that contracts is disliked, is an indicator that you are smart enough to actually come up with genuine original idea.
Kim0
First, technical reviewing.
There's tons of really bright people around. And the thing about these people is that they, like everyone else that's any good at what they do, have far too much to do and not enough time to do it in.
They are fully invested in the problems that they are involved with right now, and don't have time for doing anything outside their area.
So find the smartest people you know that seem reasonably trustworthy, and that are in a different area to your idea, but are close enough that they have the skills to critique your idea.
They should be able to find any clear technical failings in your idea.
As for the rest, a venture capital guy once gave me a great one minute summary of what you need to make it when you are thinking about doing a new startup.
1. A working product.
2. A confirmed market.
3. A sweetheart customer.
All three? You win. Two, you have a good chance. One, maybe but unlikely.
Notice that the IDEA for the product doesn't feature at all. Unless you get quickly and easily get that idea into a working saleable (first-generation) product, and find either a proven market or a big bootstrap customer, you're venture is dead regardless.
The problem is of course that there are few people around with any sort of cleverness to spark-off. The 'trust problem' might best be approached by discussing small ideas first.
PS Never underestimate how conservative people are - even techies. "Not-invented-here" is an incubus that seems to affect 99.99% of the population.
PPS Of course a rubbish idea that is easy to sell is a handy fallback.
The comment "Find geniuses who work in a different area" is probably your best bet here.
Start with a decent NDA with followup clauses, so if someone does a Microsoft on you (like Stacker) you can at least go after them.
Having an idea isn't worth much unless you have also a path to turning that idea into benefit or profit (the latter is required if you want investment). Get hold of a business plan template because it gives you an idea of what to think of. It's OK if you don't know everything, try to fill as many gaps as you can and be honest about what you can do.
Oh, and be realistic in your expectations. Too many good ideas are thrown out because the inventor wants to be rich overnight. That's rather rare :-)
Good luck :-).
Insert
The value of an idea lies in its execution
I have a good idea on how to vet ideas without giving them away!
It's one of those offhand jokes that slowly reveals itself as multifaceted brilliance, no?
My video compression blog
It's all about execution.
Pay for a consultation with a licensed engineer. Make clear that this is a work for hire situation. Make him/her sign an NDA. At least here in Alabama, complaining to the professional engineering board if the engineer steals your idea after will likely get his/her license suspended and an embarassing writeup in the yearly bulletin from the State Board of Engineers.
If simply describing what your idea is or does is enough to give away the supposedly clever bit behind it, then it's not clever, just obvious, so you've lost nothing anyway. Otherwise, you can talk about /what/ your idea does, and others can tell you what the usual kinds of problems in doing that whatever-it-is are.
"Don't worry about people stealing your ideas. If your ideas are any good, you'll have to ram them down people's throats."
Howard Aitken, Computer Scientist, (1900-1973)
Its not clear to me if you're asking how to vet an idea or how to get it commercialized. The former is my guess, but if you're interested in commercialization, I suggest this book:
http://www.amazon.com/Commercializing-New-Technologies-Getting-Market/dp/0875847609/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1248437892&sr=8-1
As for vetting, if its an actual invention, then you're talking patent and you can't really discuss it with anyone publicly, requiring the aforementioned NDA at the least. If its an idea that might not be patentable, I have used my wife and trusted colleagues as sounding boards. A trusted colleague is someone with personal moral standards beyond reproach and who I want to have involved with the development of the idea.
...their employees, who quite liked working for a small local company rather than $Monolith_Company who don't give a shit about anyone, don't get any say in the matter.
When those employees come up with the capital to start a company and assume all of the risks in doing so then they can have a say in what happens to the company. It's utter bullshit to think that someone who collects a paycheck every Friday and whom can walk away at any time deserves the same say as the person who mortgaged his house and went into debt to start the business in the first place.
If I had a business I would certainly take my employees into consideration when deciding what to do with that business but at the end of the day the decision is mine and mine alone. If I want to sell out and retire to a tropical island filled with naked chicks that's my right.
I want peace on earth and goodwill toward man.
We are the United States Government! We don't do that sort of thing.
You sound like a creative and interesting person, someone who has lots of good ideas and interesting perspectives on all sorts of aspects of life. I'm sure some of your ideas are money makers and some of your ideas are perspectives on life. But I wonder why you hold yourself back from expressing yourself to other people? Talking through thoughts with other people is one of the great joys in life. I actually read your question with sadness because I see you as an intense person, thinking deeply about lots of issues - but if you hold yourself back from expressing yourself you will always be the impotent loner. Is that what you what to be? Scared to stand up and put your idea out there in case some 'steals your thunder'? As an exercise I suggest you take your number 1 best money making idea and give it to the world - throw caution to the wind and go talk to the 'subject matter expert' and spill your guts....something wonderful will happen - I promise you! :)
I'm assuming the idea solves some problem, no?
maybe in conversation, rather than saying "Hey I have this great idea..." you can pose the problem and see what solutions the other person might have for it.
It may expose other solutions that you have overlooked; solutions that would make your idea obsolete. Or maybe the person would say "I have no idea how to solve that problem". If your idea does solve the problem then it's a good idea.
As a convinced Fundamental Solipsist, I find that delegating my great ideas to the huge pool of cosmic consciousness I'm not using at the moment is a great way to slowly improvise A Better Universe for All of Me.
;-)
Seriously, what's wrong with altruism? Open Source? Public domain? Better minds than yours will develop your idea better than you could do it yourself, if its worth anything. Bang the rocks together, like Douglas Adams said. You get what you need...
Seriously seriously, haven't you already noticed that large cooperative synergies own more of the future than enterprise-based competition? Linux will eventually link us to the stars, when Microsoft and Apple have morphed into game consoles. It's evolution.
``Tension, apprehension & dissension have begun!'' - Duffy Wyg&, in Alfred Bester's _The Demolished Man_
So, tell me your ideas and I will tell you if they are good or not when I try to sell them.
You're the "inquisitive and creative geek" and you can't think of a way? Hmmmmm. I don't think that you are very creative.
If all ideas are essentially worthless, then there should be no difference between great ideas and horrible ones. In fact, there should be no such thing as a great idea. So I'd disagree with what a lot of people here are saying. Of course ideas have inherent value. That value cannot become realized until the idea is instantiated, but that doesn't mean the original idea doesn't have value. How about the wheel? The idea that we shouldn't pee in our drinking water? Salting meat? How about any innovation?
Try Rands' FriendDA at http://friendda.org/
Original article at http://www.randsinrepose.com/archives/2008/10/19/friendda.html
He left off the second half of the quote:
"'I haven't failed; I've found 10,000 ways that don't work. Then, I, simply, stole a working idea from Telsa."
Rules of Conduct:
#1 - The DM is always right.
#2 - If the DM is wrong, see rule #1
Ideas are worthless. Execution - priceless.
All bow to his Noodliness!! His Noodle Appendage has touched me!
When I was going through architecture school we were all very proud of designs that we felt were novel or unique. We would get irritated when our professors and the upperclassmen would say, "Everything has been done before." The idea that something we had never seen before, that we had created, could somehow have existed in a time past was completely infuriating. But, as time and experience mounted and we progressed through the history of architecture, art and invention we came to realize that the adage was true. That just because the tools and technologies, materials and methods, exist today to make some 'novel' ideas practical, doesn't mean they weren't conceptualized in a time when they were impractical, or even impossible. The ideas of da Vinci are probably the prime examples in common history, but what of the dozens of unrecognized people that fueled da Vinci's imagination and helped him conceive the helicopter centuries before the technology and intelligence existed to make it a reality?
Having an idea and having the expertise and means to make it a reality are two different things. I have had a few ideas "stolen" from me over the years. Some have been successfully implemented, and some have fallen flat on their faces. Now, was their success or failure due to the merits of the idea or the people and methods used to implement them? Obviously, it's a mixture of both. Having an idea is one thing. Having the know-how, time and money to make it happen are another thing entirely. Most great ideas are too big to tackle alone. It is imperative that you share your idea to recruit talent and funding to help you implement it.
Sharing an idea can be scary, but there are ways to share that will allow you to protect your intellectual property. If you don't have a friend who is a patent attorney (like my friend Lawrence), then you will want to consult one or just follow some good procedures (Google is your friend) to protect the idea so you can refine it, market it, get it funded and get it out there.
Now is the best time to start an entrepreneurial effort. There is little to lose in this economy and a lot to gain. I wish you luck!
I'll just patent the process of vetting good ideas, and profit $$$$$
The basic rule is: If it is physically possible for someone to grab your idea and run with it, someone will!
A NDA is just a piece of paper. It doesn't help you if the other one gives your data to a third person, who then creates a big company, and sues you if you so much as speak of that idea as being yours again.
What will you do? Sue the middle man? That won't bring you back your idea or stop the third person, will it?
Trust is a hard thing to get right. But it's trustworthy people that you need. At least if you can't patent it.
Any sufficiently advanced intelligence is indistinguishable from stupidity.
Here's a story about a 'clever idea' I wanted to vet. I wanted to vet it because although it seemed clever to me I didn't know enough about it to know if it was just plain silly. I know very little about physics and electronics, so I posted it in sci.physics.
A while back a guy named James Woodward did an experiment where he attached capacitors to piezoelectric elements which vibrated them back and forth at a certain frequency. The capacitors would be charged and discharged in time with their vibrations. Woodward claims that the mass of the capacitors changes when charged and discharged in such a way that when they are being pushed by the piezoelectric vibrator they have a different mass than when they are being pulled thus producing net thrust. ( I have no idea or ability to judge the silliness or not of this basic idea ) however he claims to have seen the effect on a tabletop device.
Suppose it's not real. Then whooptee doo nothing to see here.
Suppose it is real. Another dude, figured out that the thrust is affected by ( I don't remember was it the 4th power? of the frequency of vibration . I can't find the paper any more. ). Woodward's device vibrated in the X kilohertz range, which was about as much as such a device could do, and produced ( he claims ) a small signal. However if you could devise something that operated in the megahertz range you'd have a clear and undeniable yes/no, as well as probably a practical device that could be used for flying jetson cars etc.
It seemed to me that the basic problem was to find something that could store and release energy as a capacitor does which can also be vibrated at megahertz frequencies. An answer that seemed plausable to me was: Why not have a piezoelectric crystal that is also phosphorescent? You could have say a drum shaped piezo crystal and shine a light on the center to charge it with energy as it vibrates in one direction, and then it would release that energy as it moved to it's other extreme and vibrate back and forth. There are phosphorescent substances that release their energy quite fast, so megahertz operation should be possible.
Anyway, I posted this on usenet, and guess what - nobody cared. It was a dumb idea probably. If you have to ask experts about your idea then it's probably not a good idea to begin with. This is because you don't know what the heck you are talking about.
...
Facebook is actually the best example of why not to share. Remember that lawsuit Facebook went through because it turned out that Mark Zuckwhatever had actually lifted the idea from some fellow students at Harvard? Facebook bought out the company at well above market value as a settlement.
As the owner of a small tech business, I would suggest that you consider using NDA's and MNDA's whenever possible. It allows you to share, but people with money and ideas of their own will know that you are both serious and collaborative. I've been told by other companies and individuals that they knew we were serious when we showed up with NDAs or MNDAs.
And to echo an earlier comment, no the value of ideas is what drives most of our economy these days, and let not forget our favorite slashdot subject of patent trolls. You should cover your ass legally if you think you really do have a good idea. Non-Disclosure agreements and Mutual Non-Disclosure agreement are available online for free to customize.
(for instance)
Bit Law Sample NDA
Don't trust anyone who JUST tells you your idea is worthless. They either don't recognize the value, are an ass-hat, or a thief. If your idea really is worthless, someone who really understands your idea will explain it in a way that will totally convince you that it is either dumb or overdone or impractical. Otherwise, you should be signing NDA's for everything and ignoring the dweebs here that say it doesn't matter. They don't know what they're talking about. If you told me your idea and I didn't sign a contract I'd take it if I were a jerk. Shit, I've even got a co-location, a couple extra servers, a perl/javascript developer and a web designer not to mention a couple extra quadcore rackmount servers.
So now that I think about, yeah.... NDAs and MNDAs are the dumbest thing ever. Your idea is worthless and stupid, and I'd be happy to hear all about it under no legal obligations with your full technical disclosure...
I agree that you need to take that "risk" and share your idea with others. Just like you I also had the same dilema about my ideas. At one point I realized that having them stored in my brain or somewhere on a piece of a napkin will not do any good to anyone. I decided to air them out on a blog, still have a bunch to add but here is a sneak preview to show you what I mean: http://innovationsforgrabs.blogspot.com/ The google ads made me 84 cents so far so it's a bonus too :)
On the other hand, I decided to devote my efforts on starting my own company. I'm developing a software application that already exists in many shapes and forms. However, I found room for improvements and I believe that with effort and persistance I will succeed.
Because normal people don't do it for the money! If you do only care for the money, you do not care for the idea in itself, and how it is realized, anyway.
I, for one, as most healthy people, am rather poor and have a entry in the history books for my idea, than to be rich, and leave that entry to some asshole with a truckload of money.
Any sufficiently advanced intelligence is indistinguishable from stupidity.
"what is the best way to ask for another's insights while mitigating the risk of them stealing or sharing the idea? Asking a stranger to sign a contract before discussing an idea seems like a good way to get a door closed on my face. What are your experiences and suggestions?"
If you tell anyone at your company you'll get a 'I thought of it first and it didn't work' type of response. later on they'll claim credit for it. Your best bet is total disclosure or have it patented. Whether you are going to make any money out of it is another question.
1. Write the idea down and mail it to yourself. This will put a date on the idea. Leave the envelope unopened.
2. When you talk to business about the idea, tell them that you have begun the patent process.
My understanding of the law is that an idea is yours provided that you meet both of the following:
1. Prove that you thought of the idea first
2. Show that you're actively developing the idea.
The steps above should have you covered.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Asking someone to sign a non-disclosure contract to vet an idea is only crass if you don't offer to pay them. If your idea is "interesting" enough to go to the effort of an NDA, it should be interesting enough to put a little cash down to support.
But maybe before going to a subject matter expert, you can do a little informal market and pricing research. Ask your friends how much they would pay for a product based on your idea, if they would buy it at all. See if that fits in the ballpark for how much it would take to manufacture and deliver it. If something will cost $20 to make, it probably won't fly even if your friends are willing to pay $20 for it, since you still have to cover overhead, advertising and so on. Your margins have to be high enough to cover those costs plus recover your startup costs within about a year to a year and a half depending on your sales volume. High margins are a double-edged sword, though. It makes it harder to justify the price in the consumer's mind, plus it provides an incentive for competitors to enter the market.
But the main thing is, if you want to vet your idea, there are several aspects to explore informally before you have to shell out for expert opinion.
We are the 198 proof..
Sometimes it's a good idea to file a preliminary patent. It's less expensive and documents when you had the idea. It also might keep someone else from patenting your idea down the road and sending you a cease and desist letter.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
To make him forget what you told him. I have great big periods of time I don't remember. It usually starts with walking in to a bar, but beyond that I forget how to make it happen!
for(b=(a=0)+1;;b+=(a+=b))print(a+"\n"+b+"\n");
Because normal people don't do it for the money! If you do only care for the money, you do not care for the idea in itself, and how it is realized, anyway.
Suit yourself. Eventually your patent will expire and/or $Monolith_Company will find a better way to implement your idea and you'll be run out of business. Or you'll become the next Microsoft and wind up answering to shareholders that care less about your idea and more about the quarterly results. Either way you become part of the system and steadily lose more and more control over your idea.
Personally I would rather sell out to $Monolith_Company once I've established my business. Get a decent enough pile of scratch to retire and let others worry about the rat race.
I want peace on earth and goodwill toward man.
We are the United States Government! We don't do that sort of thing.
This is someone who's "well acquainted in the field". He'll slaughter you first, for certain.
I had what I thought was a very good idea, so I created a demo and pitched it to a company that I wanted to hire me to implement it. They recognized that it was a good idea and half way through the demo realized that I could pitch it to one of their competitors, that I had a good running start, and that being first to market had advantages. They had ideas too, so they stopped the demo, brought in their corporate counsel and insisted on a mutual NDA before continuing. Eventually they decided to steal the idea and have someone else implement it, but there was that pesky NDA. They bought me out, hired me as a consultant, and eventually, after their other vendor failed, let me implement it. It was the most lucrative idea I ever had. So, in my case (plural of anecdote is not data) fear of having you work with the competition is a good reason to sign an NDA.
If you are the kind of person who has lots of good ideas, there's plenty more where they came from. I'd only worry about this if you'd sunk investment into making the idea real, e.g. if you have a company that's about to release a product.
I've given away ideas, really *good* ideas, and never lost a wink of sleep over it.
Once I was chatting with a software entrepreneur I knew about a software product he wanted to develop for the military. He'd had some success demonstrating the product deployed on a small scale, but the system concept wasn't practically scalable to large deployments. After hashing over the various approaches he'd tried, I drove home and as I did I had an epiphany. I realized how to make the product dramatically simpler to use on a large scale. I sent him an e-mail, and he went out and hired a math PhD and a couple of developers to make my idea work.
I never received a cent; I never asked for one. He did all the hard stuff. He made the business contacts, he wrote the proposals, hired the staff, everything. He put up his own money too. I just had a nice half hour chat and spent about ten minutes writing an email.
If I thought I only had a limited number of ideas like that in me, I'd worry about getting paid for a valuable idea like that. But I don't. The more ideas you discuss, the more you create. If you hole yourself up in your garage, you'll end up spending your time on useless ideas. This is heresy, but ideas really aren't worth much on their own. I've been in the tech business, and I've seen this is true. People who have lots of "clever ideas" have more than they can use. They get in the way. When they get a pot of money for idea A, you have to be careful they don't spend it on B. What you really need is money, time, discipline, contacts, technical skill -- a host of other things that are nearly impossibly hard to put together. Once you're able to do that, *ideas* looking for implementors aren't hard to find.
When you consider this, you'll see the idea that sensible people might want to steal ideas is naive. If the idea is easy to steal, it's not worth much in itself. If it's worth much in itself, it probably takes a lot of other stuff before you'll see any money out of it.
This gets to the nature of creativity. Ideas are like darts thrown into the wall. You can say, "Gee that's an interesting place for a dart to land," but that's not the same as being able to throw a dart into a bullseye not of your choosing. Really good ideas come from superior insights into the problem domain. When you pitch an idea to somebody, it should be clear that this idea comes from an unique understanding of the problem. That naturally makes you the best person imaginable to lead the conversion of the idea into reality.
Of course, if you think somebody is talking to you under false pretenses, you should cut off right there, but it is a rare, rare idea about which somebody could reasonably say, "Gee, I could make a lot of money at this by doing it myself, and I'd be better off doing that than working with the guy who had it." If you do have one of those one in a million lifetime ideas, then you ought to be talking to a patent attorney. But I can almost guarantee that none of your ideas are as valuable without you as they are with you. Very few ideas can be turned into money without solving many related problems which you have unique insight into. In that unlikely event, you should just *do it*, you should just create this amazing, money making, easy to implement thing. And of course get an attorney.
Mainly, I think you should concentrate on making your ideas a reality. If you do that, you'll probably make a living. Make enough money for other people, and you'll be in a position to make more money for yourself. If you want to get rich off your ideas, then be prepared to do a lot of the boring work it takes to make that happen. If you don't want to do that work, then prepared for other people to make money "off your ideas".
Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
I had the same discussion with myself, and ended up on beeing open with all ideas. I have to say, for me it has been nothing but good. I've got so much back from telling. And of course you have to be willing to give constructive feedback on others ideas without stealing them. Most importantly, I ALWAYS share and discuss the idea with at least one woman! Women ask questions and puts you on ground wich again make you rethink and evolve the idea... I wrote a blog on stealth mode, here http://phidulabs.com/?p=34 That is at least my experience, I don't think I'm in position to suggest what is right for you or all others.
Then onwards make billions out of each.
That is long term "inventor" stuff.
If you get just a couple of good new ideas per year, you're not going to make it anywhere anyway.
If you get more like two hundred a year, you're likely to succeed commercially.
So first get people to recognize your abilities and get well known in those circles.
Then make money by being very quiet about a great idea.
However, if you have a heart, and you think like RMS in some ways, do the GPL-counterpart of innovating - since you know that people are ready to steal ideas all the time, be very secretive about a good idea and deliberately take it to many bean counters or intelligent people, invite them to cheat you, so to speak, and start a new industry like the burp-tank guy. ;-)
That's a much better way of changing the world if you want to do that.
OTOH, if you want to be rich, invest where Wallstreet invests.
If you want to become famous, somehow kiss Britney spears in public!!
If you kiss her arse, more fame
As a scientist, I constantly have to do this. We all are working on our semi-secret projects, which other, very smart people are also experts in. When grant money starts runing out, people are naturally going to look for any idea. Whenever you are talking to a fellow scientist, you need to carefully navigate tapping into their expertise, while not giving them your idea.
The best way I've found to do this is to ask them questions about what they do, with some careful steering towards your particular sub-area of interest. Basically you are fishing for interesting facts. You have to rely on your own intelligence to be able to make sense of those facts and apply them directly to your problem.
If you get some facts, but don't feel comfortable tying them into your particular problem, then it's time to bring in the paperwork, and arrange a relationship. However, your previous time wasn't wasted. At least for scientists, asking them intelligent questions about their expertise is the quickest way into their heart.
One great way to vet an idea is to implement it as an open source project or as a free service. If the idea is truly revolutionary you'll end up making money, friends, and tons of professional opportunities. Here's a short list of "ideas" developed this way: Linux, MySpace, JBoss, Craigslist, Hibernate, MySQL, Apache... I would rather be counted among these organizations than lumped into the purely for profit realm of Microsoft, Oracle, Apple, etc.
Stop talking and do something. You leave this vague, but if it's code, write something. If it's real-world - e.g. an addition to an engine - build a model of some kind.
If you lack the skills to do any of this, than your idea is likely worthless because you likely have no clue what you're talking about.
-Jeff
Please learn the difference between a dissenting opinion and a troll before you moderate.
Lets face it, the idea to sell rocks to people to keep as pets was, on the face of it, a pretty bad idea. Nevertheless, millions were made doing so. On the other hand, I'm sure there are many great ideas that fail miserably, due to any number of reasons. And sometimes, people will implement really stupid ideas and throw a lot of money at it, and ... it just goes nowhere. Divx ... well, anything Circuit city has done lately actually.
The simple fact of it is, nobody is going to steal your ideas. Ideas aren't really worth anything by themselves. If you flesh an idea out, you might get lucky and sell it to someone, but even then, if there's not a reasonably proven revenue source behind it, even that is unlikely.
Where you succeed, is by taking 10 or 20 ideas, and implementing all of them. Now you have a reasonable chance that 1 or 2 of them might result in something successful and make some money. NOW people may try to steal that idea. Hopefully, they'll first try to buy it from you.
Play with my webcams and lights here
If you've come up with something, guaranteed that at least a dozen (12) others have also.
I've kept journals of my ideas for the past 30 years--dating, documenting/describing, and, when necessary, diagramming each. Some I've pursued and done well with; others I've not. You would not believe how often over the years I have run across others who have done something highly similar--if not identical--to my "idea".
My $0.02? Use common sense. Talk to those who can help you. Move forward.
As others have said, it's not the idea...it's the execution of that idea.
Thinking you're just going to come up with a genius idea is showing a lot of disrespect to the people that are actually geniuses.
It's like a woman going to the gym, afraid to work out too hard; because she might end up looking like a bodybuilder. Like it's easy and something you can do with 2 hours a week.
Now, unless you stop thinking(dreaming) and start doing(implementing the idea) you're not ever going to find out if you could be a genius or not. Now, get the fuck off slashdot and don't come back until you're that genius.
If you're just asking someone for basic feedback you can make a verbal contract by asking them a simple question like "This will have to stay between us, I hope that's okay?" if they agree to it then they've concented to a NDA, albeit not on paper, so burden of evidence would be harder. But it's less obtrusive than a big paper contract.
Don't worry, if you're idea is any good nobody will properly execute it.
If something is specific enough to warrant being potentially covered by a patent, then learn how to read and understand patents. A patent application for something that truly offers a customer value can and is sold all the time, if it seems likely to issue or certainly once it issues.
They are organized by Class and Subclass (like fasteners, etc) and are searchable through the www.uspto.gov.
Often that search will yield the example that someone has done "it", the idea before, but that doesn't mean you might not have a valid better, more efficient solution that could be patented.
Don't try to write patents yourself. That is like trying to go to court to defend against yourself in a criminal trial. The wording, strategy, alternatives, backups, procedures, significant positions, appeals, etc. are something you only learn over time.
Net result is that if there is MONEY to be made off your idea that is better than what is in the market, then investigate and find out if it can likely do what you think. Then get an application on file.
Looks like this was picked up on lifehacker, in a sort of recursive posting...
http://lifehacker.com/5322055/ditch-the-secrecy-when-vetting-ideas
"So you're sitting on an idea you consider to be a gold mine, but you're hesitant to share for fear that someone will run off with your gem. Here's why you shouldn't be overly concerned about having your intellectual property stolen."
-- My Sig is a P228.
Economists didn't just forget recent history. The theory behind the current big bail-outs is that the Japanese ones were done too late, which made them ineffective, and that's why there was so much pressure to issue the current bail-outs early in the recession cycle.
Or it could just be a big bluff to steal more of your money...
If you get bought out for being first to implement an idea, you'll be in the history books for that...
Making money is unlikely to reduce your chance of an entry in the books.
I think there needs to be a web site that allows people to post ideas freely. The concept would be that by posting an idea you put it into the public domain which gives you one year (if I understand patent law correctly) to patent it. The website would offer advice and help on getting a patent. You would have an easy way to post your idea, along with schematics or diagrams, and more importantly the fuzzy details that might be missing that require subject matter experts. There would then be a wiki like way for people to add to an idea with their expertise and the idea owner can then accept or reject that feedback and the idea would mature through that feedback. Hopefully it would mature enough to have enough info to patent or prototype. This would also be a good way to find potential partners for a startup, since most startups wonâ(TM)t be successful without subject matter experts. I have a specific ui in mind for this type of site but in general I envision each submittal looking sort of like a light weight patent submittal with affordances to attach videos, diagrams, etc. failurite@gmail.com
.
... and get his "flashy thing"
http://outcampaign.org/