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Red Hat Releases Version 6.1
RaymondInFinland writes "Red Hat 6.1 appeared on ftp.redhat.com Only a i386 version but the
release also comes as an ISO image. " Its not supposed to be official for a bit yet, and my guess is that it'll be pretty rocky
downloading for a bit, but it is there.
--
Sunsite is going around 50k/s.
ftp:// sunsite.unc.edu/pub/linux/distributions/redhat/red hat-6.1/6.1-i386.iso
A mirror of the 6.1 ISO is available at ftp://heavy-ind.com/pub/linux /redhat-6.1/6.1-i386.iso
Share bicycle touring info worldwide: http://wheretocycle.com
Aaah, Grasshopper: look at the patches inside the SRPM -- both BIND and Sendmail had the security fixes applied before 5.2 shipped. :-)
Remember, when RH 5.2 shipped, BIND 8 was not in very wide use, and Sendmail 8.9 was quite new. Rather than release a new, largely untested version of something with possibly huge new security holes (which thankfully didn't actually happen, but it's a lie to claim that there was no or low risk at that point), they released the old, known-to-work version with a patch for the known security holes.
A lot of stuff RH does may not be great, but don't slam them on this one -- they got it right, for certain. (Now, releasing pre-kernels may be another story, but there's a good argument to be made that said pre-kernel was much more stable than the official release at that point...)
6.1 is a bug fix. That's what the *.* means. The major releases are done re-numbered in the first number. In case you haven't noticed it's pretty much the standard way of nubering programs.
Devil Ducky
MY peers would get out of jury duty.
What's realy needed is one tool that maintains it's own database and can install rpm's, deb's, and stuff you compile.
God does not play dice - Einstein
Not only does God play dice, he sometimes throws them where they
wrt RPMs, try rpmfind. www.rpmfind.net
$ rpmfind will, when configured correctly, find any apps matching that, plus work out the dependencies needed that aren't met on your system, and offer to d/l it all for you. It's not perfect, but IMHO a reasonable solution.
I'd like to a new packaging system developed, combining the strengths of rpm and apt together with standard tarballs for distribution and local/remote management. Such a thing would be really cool and kick everything else into touch.
I am in the midst of dling the new RH and am curious if support for the HighPoint Ultra ATA/66 Controller that comes on new Abit boards is supported. Anyone know?
If I didn't have to constantly be upgrading then I would still be using that "other" OS... It always needs fixed in some way.
Devil Ducky
MY peers would get out of jury duty.
It's not to let you ignore your screwed up whatever. It's to let you boot *one* time without it. Yes, you could do this in single user mode. This just makes it easy to start up your services one at a time if you chose.
Nope. kudzu handles updates. up2date handles actual package upgrades.
--
Jeremy Katz
Every time RHAT drops to 70% of its highest value they announce a release. No... I have been using RH since 4.1. They have a release about every 6 months. This is from before stock was ever mentioned.
Christopher McCrory "The guy that keeps the servers running" chrismcc@gmail.com http://www.pricegrabber.com
In another paycheck or two, I'll be switching over to KRUD, Kevin's Redhat Uber Distribution. It is a mere $44 a year with monthly CD updates. I will no longer have get and install Xemacs :) No free support, but you didn't want that anyways.
http://www.tummy.com/krud/
"Kevin Fenzi, co-author of the Linux Security HOWTO, and a senior member of tummy.com has created a distribution based on Red Hat which includes the most up to date security and application errata. This distribution, called KRUD, also included a variety of other freely distributable software."
Plato seems wrong to me today
cheapbytes.com usually takes about 4-6 weeks to come up with their version. I've had very good experience with them.
Try rpm --freshen package.rpm
It will upgrade any packages that are already installed. Nice for getting up to speed from updates.rehat.com.
-Pete
Well, since it isn't "officially" released yet, you probably won't find an whats-new list from Red Hat util it is. Suppposedly that will happen on Monday. However, if you search you can find a whats-new list for the Beta release (code named Lorax) and extrapolate from there.
umm... you mean the file 6.1-i386.iso locatated in directory /pub/redhat/redhat-6.1/iso is only version 6.0?
.
This doesn't have the new Common UNIX Printing System yet? Or does it?
There is a difference. If package is free it is part of Debian, point. This is why potato has ~4000 packages as of right now. You don't have to hunt for packages on the web looking in various dubious places. Since those packages are part of the distribution, they follow guideliness of the distribution. Very often I saw dependencies break easily on redhat, just because those packages are not packaged by redhat, they sometimes don't have the quality of the main redhat packages.
OK dumbshit here is the WHOLE URL for you..
a t-6.1/iso/6.1-i386.iso
ftp://csociety-ftp.ecn.purdue.edu/pub/redhat/redh
Like I said. I pulled 300k/s thru the whole thing.
And maybe you should look around an FTP site
before posting inaccurate information. The nerve
of some people. As if anyone would actually post a bullshit FTP Mirror.. Please.
I hate idiots.
I believe the previous poster was refering to the rpmfind tool that can be *downloaded* from rpmfind.net. It's a little text mode tool that lets you search for RPMS and will download them along with all the RPMS they depend on.
I still don't think it's quite as cool at apt. But it does solve the major portion of the problem.
f tp://ftp.ou.edu/mirrors/linux/redhat/redhat-6.1/i3 86/doc/rhinst/figs/cd-rom-gui/
The trick is that any mirror of the actual distro. (an not just the iso file) will have this directory of images of the installer. They are from the installation manual.
I know I will be moderated down for this, but . . . Vincent
I bet the very first "first post" post was both cool and funny. Glory for him who inveted it (and a kick in the ass for those who copied it).
I tried to get an early beta to run, but the PCMCIA install was hosed back then, so I never got it going...
Perhaps asking for screenshots is a little lame, but I'd really like to see what the graphical installer looks like. Anyone got 'em?
Where do you pick up a cheap distro of Linux or OpenBsd in Canada without paying insane shipping charges or duty fees?
If you really screwedup your whatever config, then you should probably fix it, not ignore it. Giving this kind of options is, imho, probably a bad idea. Booting in single user mode would let you fix it without taking ages to start, and without letting your system half-running at the end.
seb.
--
Memory fault -- brain fried
Don't expect to see beowulf support in your standard RedHat any time soon. According to US export laws, beowulf-capable systems are, for all intents and purposes, munitions.
Yeah, and you can buy a CD with such a system on any street bazaar in Russia.
Export laws on software are a joke.
<^>_<(ô ô)>_<^>
Make money, be happy!
Honesty. Loyalty. Kindness. Laughter. Generosity. Magic!
Anyone mirroring the ISO yet?
I recently upgraded my 3.2 to 3.3 and it went flawlessly. Great job from the FreeBSD team. The release is *REALLY* worth it's money....(unlinke some others OS's i know off *cough*win*cough*). And with the availability of the iso images things ARE looking a bit brighter after all :)
Kudzu handles identification of hardware, and will optionally let you configure new hardware. It doesn't do any updates.
4.2 is the oldest supported release.
South park wasn't cool 2 years ago.. and it's not cool now.
$rpmfind --latest RedHat
And that should update . . .hmm, maybe it is 'redhat', Oh, well, you can figure it out ;)
this has gotta slow down.. i think there should be some "service packs" and not new version #'s for minor upgrades and such.. i would have hoped redhat 6.1 would have waited until Xfree86 4 or something a lil more worth the version # change would have come out.. whats new? is there anything listed on the site? and one beta release is pretty balsy..
Does anyone know if APM is compiled into the default kernel with this release? It was for 6.0, which made it very difficult to update my desktop machine which uses a non-standard APM that causes an APM kernel to crash; a lot of desktops do, actually, so I thought it was a poor default choice.
When RedHat releases a new version they don't stop releasing updated packages for previous versions. I'm running a server on 5.2 and when a security problem is found, they will release an update package for 5.2 as well. So there's no reason to update the entire system to just get one security fix. I personally will never consider an OS vendor that does not do things this way. I don't appreciate being forced into a vendor's release cycle. Red Hat's release cycle is short but you're not forced into it so it's all good.
I have seen the future, and it is inconvenient.
While I think that "narrowing it down" is generally a bad thing when it comes to Linux, I think that if they can afford Mandrake, they should snap them up. From what I can tell, they are basically the same, except for the fact that Mandrake is more polished. Redhat could benefit from the better setup, etc, and Mandrake could benefit from the spending power and brand name.
Redhat and Mandrake seem to be going for the exact same market, unlike a lot of the other distros, so I don't think there would be any sacrifices in diversity.
Redhat's ALWAYS put out a new release every 6 months. This is good because generally it's about that time that there's so many updates from the previous version that nobody on a modem has an icicle's chance in hell of downloading all of them. (and indeed, 6.0 was at this point due to XFree86, GNOME, KDE, glibc, netscape, samba, apache, and all kinds of other security fixes and upgrades). Hell, I'm on a cable modem and keeping 6.0 up to date is painful.
:) This may or may not break some pretty canned certification, but the upshot is anyone who's used 6.0 can use 6.1 just fine. (and in fact anyone who'd used 5.2 could use 6.0 just fine as well - the only interesting admin change was that KDE moved from /opt to /usr :)
From a user point of view 6.1 is identical to 6.1 other than the nicer installer (it's about on par with Win98's, which means there's still room to go) and the automated update facility (finally - I almost switched to SuSE to get that
And finally, if you're running a corporate IT cluster and it's working fine with no crashes and 5 months uptime DON'T UPGRADE IT EVER. Pay no attention to the shiny new boxes. I'm serious. Most IT people I know don't want to screw with anything once they have it working right, and with Linux that's quite possible. The only time you should upgrade such a system is 1) retiring the hardware for new boxen 2) a software upgrade requires it (ie, if Oracle 9 comes out and requires kernel 2.4).
Grr. The day after I decide to update my old ... Oh well,
Alpha to 6.0, Redhat makes a 6.1
I guess it's not such a loss -- the Alpha 6.1
isn't around yet anyhow.
For every problem, there is at least one solution that is simple, neat, and wrong.
SlashMirror: Where to put files for fellow /.'ers
SlashMirror: Where to put files for fellow /.'ers
I sent them an email suggesting a subscription model for update CDs....no response....not even a form leter
yeah, i'm afraid my mocking wasn't clear (blunt subject line with the minimally helpful body) i was trying to demonstrate how the replier came off, poor taste from both of us.
Hypothetically, anything hypothetical is possible.
ftp.microsoft.com/pub/thirdparty/redhat/redhat-6.1 /iso/6.1-i386.iso
If you look at the Net shot, you'll notice that they've a box for ternary DNS.
I find this really amusing, because while Ternary is close, I think what they really were shooting for was Tertiary.
Bah.. Best? Of the ports I've tried, half of them didn't even compile (Various packages related to KDE).
But then again, here are the problems with the various distributions of Linux I've run into as well:
RedHat 6.0 - The included Gnome config just simply does not work correctly. I shouldn't have to right-click, minimize, then left click to get a window back in the foreground.
Debian 2.1 - dselect is absolutly horrible, I'd rather not have a package selection interface than use it. It's included DHCP client doesn't work for me other than the first try, and the Netscape packages won't install regardless of what I do.
TurboLinux 3.6 - No problems at all, other than it's based on glibc 2.0.7 instead of 2.1
Caldera 2.3 - Again, no problems.
FreeBSD 3.2 - Included package for DHCP client refuses to work even when I compile bpf support into the kernel and make the device files. Great.
Linux Pro 5.4 - Why the hell does LinuxMall even bother sending this piece of trash?
Linux Mandrake 6.0 - My particular CD won't boot. Bah.
To FreeBSD's credit, it's the only free UNIX like that even boots off my HD now. Lilo just sits there and looks dumb. Joy.
Out of this stack of Linux distributions (RH, Caldera, Mandrake, Slack, TurboLinux, LinuxPro, SuSE 6.2,) and a FreeBSD CD, I've found 3 reasonably usable distributions to me that work within a few hours after install - Slack 4.0, Caldera, and TurboLinux.
Yay.
Of course, all the zealots out there will flame me for stating my experiences and opinions. I don't care.
By the way, all the distributions I tried were installed from CDs I bought from LinuxMall.
rpmfind.net also distributes a program called rpmfind that does the work for you, it just downloads everything you need and drops it in /tmp
There's a SCSI/IDE emulation module for NT? I'm aware of one for Linux but not for Windows NT. Remember, the original poster was talking about using the NT port of cdrecord.
--Joe--
Program Intellivision!
its pre-order. cds will ship in a week or two
"rpm -UvhF *" will upgrade only already installed packages. Although I think the -F option is fairly new - only arrived with RH6.0
... with eskimo chains i tatto my brain all the way...
(Disclaimer: I've had most of my Linux experience with RedHat, so most of my comments about my usage apply to that.)
I've seen a lot of talk about "make a server-only distribution." That's something I've been thinking about a lot lately.
Today, pretty much every Linux distribution uses the same "super duty" philosophy: put every package known to man on the user's computer, start the same set of services, and there you go. Instant server. Instant workstation. Instant anything, Instant everything.
This is troubling to me. I know that for my server installation, I don't WANT X, I don't want Netscape, I don't want GNOME or KDE or any of that other client-oriented, workstation stuff installed. It just wastes space sitting on my hard drive. However, Redhat's server install is the biggest of the 3 options, throwing EVERYTHING on the drive, leaving me with perhaps 300 megabytes of crap I just don't need. I even deselected X, and I still got some of the X11 packages installed!
So why don't distribution makers make server oriented distributions and workstation oriented ones, keeping the 2 separate? Simple. Linux users are stubborn people, perhaps the most stubborn of any in the industry. CUPS comes out, and there is lots of talk about how the current system works fine, we don't need a new system. Berlin is in development, but a mere mention of that brings up the X zealots, ready to kill anyting anywhere close to being modern. About the only thing Linux users will upgrade for is the kernel, and only because it's chic to run Linus' latest and greatest. The current set of Linux users is a rather small subset of all the types of users out there. Mom doesn't need Apache, wu-ftpd, or nfs. Mom just needs StarOffice, X, GNOME/KDE/wtahever, and Netscape. Why force it on her?
The fact is, separating workstations and servers makes a whole lot of sense. A lot of the security holes you see in servers come from client-oriented apps (Some of the GNOME bugs come to mind.) Similarly, for machines that only run workstation stuff, server stuff causes problems (wu-ftpd is an excellent example here). Why install stuff that won't be used?
I wish distribution makers would realize this. The world doesn't need 50 distributions that can do it all; how about one that does one thing really, really well? It seems to me that it would make a lot more sense.
Just think about it...a lean distribution, optimized to do what it does well. Now that would be something.
why not?
Both of these are fine, and I've used them both, but:
1) The public betas don't give us any of the information I was referring to in my first post. I'd like to know why they choose what software they include and why they ignore others. If/when things like next-generation subsystems might be integrated. Why they stick to old versions of certain software. Why do they choose to add certain patches, and what their rationale is in their directory structure (which I personally happen to like for the most part). That's what I mean when I say I'd like to know where the development is headed.
2) Rawhide is a good effort, but it really seems a bit haphazard at time (look at the kernel packages right now). The SRPMS often don't match the RPMS (or extra SRPMS are left around), and it's just not the same as having a group of packages that Red Hat endorses as being "reasonably tested and approved" for use by users who want/need newer software.
3) Even if Lorax and RawHide did solve the problems of open development and new packages, I would still prefer two branched distributions. I'd rather see more server-side stuff on a Server Distribution CD when I'm installing the servers (optional PAM and apache modules, maybe a choice of databases, etc), and more client/workstation packages (where to begin) included on the Workstation Distribution CD.
Am I way out in left field on my thinking?
Debian has been releasing ISO images of its binary and source cd's for several releases now. I can't remember when they started, maybe with 2.0(hamm). So I would say that Mandrake and RH learned from Debian.
-- I can't say enough in 120 chars!
Seems you slashdotted yourself :)
That's the way I do it... kinda silly, but it works.
but fixed is more broken than broken.
the slave escapes only to find a stronger set of chains.
Dude, put the coffee down . . I said PUT the COFFEE DOWN!
>real Microsoft-like behaviour on RedHat's part.
It's mainly a bugfix release, compile all the new updated RPMS from the 6.0 release and any new software that you would want to upgrade (KDE, GNOME, XFree86). You don't HAVE to buy this, from anyone, you don't even have to download it if you don't want. Personally if I have a stable system I am not going to mess it up just for the latest and greatest.
Would you rather have it where they _don't_ release, and every time you install a new system you have to spend all day applying fixes and upgrading packages. I didn't think so. Just put the new boxes out there for the marks to pay for and only upgrade if necessary, you can even steal specific RPMS from the new distro and apply them to the old if you want.
Anyway if they were really Microsoft they wouldn't release at all, just sit on the bugfixes and new features instead of replacing the current version with a newer one.
>*ALL* of Linux is a fucking media circus
Oohh, if it's popular it can't be good. Take me to some dark, dank corner where no one is and I'll be happy. That way I can be "Elite" with all my friends. Blech.
-- Remember: Wherever you go, there you are!
--
They sold beowuld CDs a year ago, and I suspect they still do... The HW might be classified, but "the beowulf distribution" was nothing but plain RH, a couple of freely available programming environments (MPI, PVM) and a couple of small utilities. Nothing fancy, and I don't think most people bragging about it knows what is is: A cheap way of doing parallell computations, which are programmed in a certain way to take advantage of the multiple processors.
try -U with multiple rpms ... now if it only installed right for me ... : )
should make you not hate rpms so much
don't get me wrong i don't like rpms either, but they're not so bad as you make them out to be. and yes i agree debian package system absolutely kicks
As the others have said the CDs have the upgrade option right there. But if you're like me and don't want to download 650MB before getting started, you can just download a few packages and install them.
.rpmsave. In fact, I'm right now in the midst of upgrading to Mandrake 6.1 (from what was originally Mandrake 5.3). I'll just download those packages that apply to me, install them, make sure they work, lather, rinse, and repeat. It takes a few days with my 56k modem, but it'll be done eventually...
I've done this a few times now. I have many RPMs I've created myself so I like to double check that everything is working before moving on to the next package. The last thing I want is to have all daemons on my system to not be working right because RPM moved their config files to
If your cdwriter is IDE you need to enable the SCSI emulation module (and use the SCSI CD-ROM driver.)
--
Redhat releases a new update every 6 months. They always have, they probably always will.
As I said, it's shaping up to be _really_ solid from what I can tell.
.2c
I find it interesting that a installer can change everyones views so rapidly. Shows the signs of the times for the community, as I see it. Meaning, we are hitting the desktop market these days.
It is my opinion that a system doesn't become solid for a while. Takes time and testing to truely see a solid system. Though, I'm sure that Unknwn and I are just on different wavelengths and think of different meanings of the word "solid" in the current context.
cyphunk
PCMCIA installs work now (I just finished upgrading my laptop :) Words of wisdom... don't use popen() in a daemon.
--
Jeremy Katz
My idea was to do just that, from my first use of linux.
:-)
One thing that kills it, I've noticed, is the libc wars. Everyone was saying, oh, you've got to upgrade, libc6 is so much better.
So I upgraded to a distribution that was based on the new c library. Come to find out, that was stupid. glibc 2.0 has a hideous, terrible bug in dlopen (or something like that), so it's worthless. Upgrade again, becomes the mantra.
Since nearly every piece of code in the world depends on the c library, upgrading to glibc 2.1 seems to mean upgrading every other package in the world.
So much for the advantages of dynamic linking.
The factory CDs will ship in a few weeks. CD-R's of the downloadable .iso image are shipping NOW. Check facts, eh?
You know, this strikes me as real Microsoft-like behaviour on RedHat's part. Let's take a look here.
Win95 was released late in 95. Q1 96 gave us OSR2, which was just a bunch of bugfixes hidden behind 'added features.' RedHat released 6.0 early in 99, if memory serves correctly. And here it is, 2 quarters later, with a new version.
Welcome to how RedHat plans to make it's money, folks. Microsoft didn't really make any money on OSR2 because it was just Win95. But then came 98. And then 98SE, which was $90 if you had 98.
Welcome to RedHat 6.0. Here comes RedHat 6.1. Want a manual? That'll be another $80. RedHat isn't counting on downloaders for their profits; you're all probably off their radar and filed away in the trash bin. They don't want you; they want businesses that shell out the $80 for every new release. Nevermind the fact that the only updates are to GPL or such software, and the commercial stuff that comes along 'free' is still the same version. They need those manuals and those little updates. So out comes the check book.
RedHat's always rushed to release. Need I remind you RedHat supporters of 3.0.0, the biggest disaster of a distro *ever*? RedHat doesn't care about beta testing at this point - if it's broken, release a new version. They have 'credentials' and a solid brand now; the businesses will pay.
Really nice guys, those RedHat people, huh? If they can't ripoff the end users, they'll get the businesses instead. I think maybe I'll just switch back to an all-AIX environment. At least AIX doesn't come out with bugfixes daily then say 'oh, screw you. Here's a new version you have to buy.' They can sit on a version, release bugfixes, and integrate them into the next version, a year or two down the road.
Pfah. RedHat. It's sad to see what Linux has become.
-RISCy Business | Rabid unix guy, networking guru
your company here.
shelby != ford
Yeah. Unkwn is on the wavelength called reality. You're on the wavelength called pedantic.
Brought to you by someone with too much time on his hands and the letter Q.
I wish I could say you're one of the first bandwagon RedHat haters. Stop hating and participate pony boy.
Brought to you by someone with too much time on his hands and the lette Q.
Or at least offer an All-Pentium Compiled version of the distro. Maybe they do that on the official boxed-set version?
Do you have the other box? The one that your girlfriend has? I hope so for your sake.
Brought to you by someone with too much time on his hands and the letter Q.
Seriously, go to http://www.debian.org, follow their directions, and fill it out as a wishlist item for apt.
Do you think that the apt developers will notice a suggestion tossed out deep in a thread on slashdot about Red Hat's new release? I thought not!
Cheers,
Ben
My usual seat in the cluetrain is at A HREF="http://pub4.ezboard.com/biwethey.ht
I know that, I meant just having 1 packaging system though. It would be much easier for distributors of software, etc. Why should something be packaged .deb, .rpm, etc.
I just use what works for me. If I get another 10 gig drive, or more... I'll probably setup Debian on it though to do an honest comparison. But from a file standpoint, Debian looks like old technology compared to *any* distribution that doesn't -Slackware- off :)
Not trying to flame here, I'm all for 50 distribs, I just want a little sanity to them to make it easier on the 3rd parties.
--
CodeRed, the lower user #. No relation to SirCam.
Hmm, yea 100KB/s that must suck..
Languages that feature overloading.. Usually something that is widely embraced in the programming world. How ironic. ;)
~ Kish
Then follow unstable instead of stable.
hehe, I'm sick I know... But I like a stable base thats safe to fall back on, and just manually upgrade what files I really want new features on.
It's like having RH 5.0, and then getting RH 6.1 RPMs. Too much of a headache. But having 6.1 and then upgrading to newer RPMS is much easier since I can just go back to 6.1 and know its stable.
If somethings too old, I'd have to update too much, etc etc.
The debian package management system blows RPM away.
I wish someone would tell me exactly why (in tech details). I have never read anything other then "It can update from the net and RPM can't (and of course, rpm can)" I just want to get the true facts down on why it is better.
--
CodeRed, the lower user #. No relation to SirCam.
ftp://ftp.ou.edu/ mirrors/linux/redhat/redhat-6.1/iso/6.1-i386.iso
Why do you have to use "broken's" name in vain? Scarlagious!
Sorry.. cant spell
Oh, it's just probably the first onset of the microsoftization of RedHat by an army of evil marketdroids.
Exactly. Technology becomes out-of-date so fast that knowing all the details is usually much less important than knowing how to find and learn the details when you need them.
I hereby decree that from the moment Slashdot contains an article detailing a new program, new version, etc, be it free software or commercial, software or hardware, every single person viewing said article MUST, under penalty of going to Windows, download, install, purchase, and use for no less than fifteen minutes per week said software. There will be no exceptions no matter what the reason.
.. now at least there is a reason for people to bitch and moan about every article on here. "Boo hoo, I use Debian so I'm not going to load Redhat." "Waaa, my mommy said C rules and Delphi is for losers." "Oracle is made by Satan and is demonstrative (notice that word!) of the fall of Linux and mankind." "Rob/Hemos/Roblimo/Katz/etc are lamers because I don't find this topic interesting." "My ftp program beats anything else, so you all can go to hell! You go to hell and you die!" Is there any point to any of these people posting other than to whine? If it doesn't apply to you, just move on with life already!
There
In closing, I'd like to say, "Sheesh."
$ gftp ftp.cc.gatech.edu/pub/linux/distributions/redhat/u pdates/6.0&
Or get the excellent autorpm or rhlupdate proggiez from rpm.org. A little manual reading, and you'll never have to fret about missing updates again.
The Roman alphabet was heavily influenced by the Phoenicians and Summerians. The Romans didn't just whip an alphabet out of their ass.
Brought to you by someone with too much time on his hands and the letter Q.
"News sources vying for market share may have a reason for being first with every story, but you'd think slashdot'd be above that sort of thing. " If you look at the first ten comments on any slashdot article ever, you'll find the words "pirst fost!!1!" Thus, I'm struggling to understand your comment, particularly the part about slashdot being "above" anything.
Maybe we need to set up an open source version of UPS and/or Fed Ex. Anyone want to head that project?
Brought to you by someone with too much time on his hands and the letter Q.
It would be better if Debian used RPM's. Then I could just mix and match them.
.rpm to/from .deb
.slp (Stampede), .tgz, and .tar.gz
Debian has a program called alien, with the Red Hat Package Manager installed, converts from/to
Alien also handles
He actually _did_ help them out.
/., admittedly, and it would, of course, be wiser for him to go into a #linux on some network or asking a mailing list, of course people could reply to him via e-mail which would be even the wiser, but then hes an AC so thats not possible.
It's kind of hard to ask for Tech support on a story on
-[ World domination - rains.net ]-
(By distribution, I mean major distribution, not the zillion minor distributions that each have about three users).
right?
Shhhh! RedHatNT is still under wraps. Stockholders, all that.
For christ's sake son, shut up.
New release a Microsoft tactic? Ever noticed how EVERYONE releases new versions? And you can download the ISOs or individual RPMs for G'DAMN FREE.
'Release early, release often'. Funny, that mantra sounds somewhat appropriate.
Son, you're getting top quality software handed to you on a plate, for free, and all you can do is whine? Go outside, get a life.
el bobo
Just do a custom install and choose your packages then do a "mkkickstart" to create a custom install script for future installs!
I must say, that's one area that I wouldn't mind distributions leaving as is. We don't want to end up where Windows folks are where any yocal can click around, and voila they're a network administrator.
It's one thing for some guy out there to make a GTK/KDE frontend to ipchains or something. But for a distribution to add these things to their list of features is hazardous. It is far better to go through a few extra steps, read some HOWTOs, learn a good bit about Linux, before setting up a firewall. Once you've become knowledgeable about such things, you will know a lot about TCP/IP in general, security, etc. If there's a simple 1-2-3 approach to firewalling, these "administrators" will not know enough to watch CERT advisories, Bugtraq, or their own distribution's security announcements and they end up getting cracked. And of course, in their inexperience, they blame Linux. What good does that do?
I see a number of people moving to Mandrake. I don't understand why. Could someone give the pros and cons of this? I hope it's not just because they hate Redhat. Isn't Mandrake based on Redhat? Also, Redhat 6.0 has had some security issues, were these also present in Mandrake 6.1?
Thanks!
What do you mean by Beowulf support? Software for clusters is almost always custom-written - there's very little it would do for most "regular" applications without work. To a certain extent, any distribution supporting networking provides basic tools for a Beowulf.
What they could do would be to ship packages of common building block libraries like PVM or an MPI implementation and provide tools for managing large clusters of machines, but none of that would do anything for most people who didn't want to write custom apps (pvmpov is the only relativley general pre-written one I can think of off-hand).
Hey, moderators...you spelled "stupid" wrong.
www.cheapbytes.com is offering RedHat Linux 6.1 on their site, now that is what i call fast
you could set up a machine to be your gateway....
ftp/http proxies are not tooo hard to setup, i'm sure theres several you could find for any platform that supports your cable modem and an additional ethernet card
you might consider setting up a mini-distro 386 or something to do ip-masq and rrlogin anyhow (if you can get to the internet 24/7, the internet can get to you 24/7 and a little firewalling never hurt)
rr in my area doesn't make us use rrlogin, although it does give 5 minute dhcp leases that don't change *shrug*
Need a Catering Connection
It's a minor screw-up, I mean were they trying to align with a moon or what?
For someone like me who just wants to evaluate stable software, and somehow push it to the Microsoft head's in my company this is a great thing. Keep all the bugfixes in a current release.
People are getting pretty sick of installing service pack on service pack.. "Hmmm.. Better set up a test server for NT 4 SP6 Beta 2.."
The ones who are whining about a 6.1 release half a year after the 6.0 release are the ones who would probably be happier with windows 95...
anyone know where redhat5.2 iso's can still be obtained?
I run a 6.0a install, that's been tweaked to a fare-the-well. I've upgraded lots of things by hand, including many runtime libs, and (more than
one) custom kernel. Hopefully there's a decent
way to upgrade a package at a time.
Is linuxconf improved? Will the base system install allow only updating things that are redhat specific? I really fear upgrading redhat. I've
only ever wiped and reinstalled.
-fb Everything not expressly forbidden is now mandatory.
Or you can just go to Cheap Bytes for a CD. You can preorder RH 6.1 now for $1.99.
Could someone please tell me why my comment was rated as flamebait? Maybe offtopic, but not flamebait. Mirroring:
On the subject of upgrades, but getting off topic, I'm using Mandrake 6.0, and the update thing seems pretty easy, but does it matter where I put them? Does each one need to be in a certain place, or can I put them just about anywhere?
Use Debian instead.
No, seriously, Debian 2.1 out-of-the-box has good support for IP masq'ing and firewall rules. Took me 5 minutes (yes, 5 minutes!) to get my dial-up connection up and running and masquerading for my home network after the OS booted, and it was the first time I'd ever used Debian.
"We can categorically state that we have not released man-eating badgers into the area." - Major Mike Shearer, UK
I'm in doubt.
You'd think after the mandrake fiasco people'd learn to wait for official announcements.
I know that it's where were were told it was, but it's possible Red Hat are waiting for a reason.
News sources vying for market share may have a reason for being first with every story, but you'd think slashdot'd be above that sort of thing.
Any attempts to log onto ftp.redhat.com before typing this are purely hypocracy on my part, but should not invalidate my point.
=]
~i met a boy wearing vans, 501's... then i punched him in the face.
-*|remote_system_is: Tandy|*--
It appears that the student is teaching the master.
Free Mac Mini. Yes, I'm
This may seem a little off-topic. But I am a little confused about the ISO images. Do I just burn the one big file to a CD and make the CD bootable, or do I need some type of extraction tool for the .iso first? And just what the heck is an ISO image?
Matt
"It's not premarrital sex if you're not planning on getting married."
This is a good thing. It looks as though SuSE may be forcing Redhat to release versions more frequently which only benefits the community.
hehe, luckier than me. i tried to do a from-harddisk install, and it spewed out python errors.
--//--
I've put up the screenshots from the GUI Install.
You can find them at http://aurore.net/stuff/rhinst/.
fuck you too
I see that many people suggest rpmfind. So let me point out the differences (and inferiority of the rpmfind aproach) 1) Debian's dselect and apt not just download the package that you need, they also solve the dependencies and conflicts automatically (apt-get)
/var/rpmfind/*.rpm /var/rpmfind/*.rpm
Have you ever actually *USED* rpmfind ?
Yes, it does automatically solve the dependencies and download packages you need.
Actually, that is it's only purpose. Otherwise you could just browse the freshmeat, or something.
2) apt-get and dselect do not just download packages, they also install them
Hmmm... yes, that is a real big problem with rpmfind. How about creating following shell wrapper, let's call it dselect
#!/bin/sh
rpmfind $*
rpm -ivh
rm -f
Now, that was really hard, wasn't it ?
3) This is the biggest difference. Debian package management was designed with network installs/updates/upgrades in mind. If a program is a free program (GPL, BSD, etc) then it is most likely a part of the OFFICIAL main Debian distribution.
This at least make some sense. You don't have a RedHat utility that will search ONLY redhat official site. Oh, wait, you have, it's called rpmfind, you just need to RTFM and set preferences line in ~/.rpmfindrc
Note: I actually use both Debian and RedHat, and liked dselect(1) (It is not newest Debian, as my RH is not newest also).
Also, GNORPM comes to mind, something 'fully integrated' (like apt, no need for shell wrapper script above) and in GUI. Not that I like GUIs particullary...
Maybe so, but pretty much all companies that sell linux CD's like that are US-based, and none of them ship for canada for less than the product costs, $5.00US is DAMN good compaired to what alot charge (last time, i ordered form LSL, and shipping was $10, but I didn't mind as the CD's themselves were free.
I see that many people suggest rpmfind. So let me point out the differences (and inferiority of the rpmfind aproach) 1) Debian's dselect and apt not just download the package that you need, they also solve the dependencies and conflicts automatically (apt-get) or interactively (dselect) and download or remove the packages that depend or conflict. 2) apt-get and dselect do not just download packages, they also install them. 3) This is the biggest difference. Debian package management was designed with network installs/updates/upgrades in mind. If a program is a free program (GPL, BSD, etc) then it is most likely a part of the OFFICIAL main Debian distribution. This means that you don't have to look in various places for packages, everything is in one place. Second, the packages are usually of higher quality, since they are a part of distribution and they MUST meet all the guidelines of the distribution. If a package is buggy, the distribution will not release until it is fixed (or removed from main tree if it is too late)
ftp.sco.com/pub/sco-nextgen/6.1-i386.iso
perhaps that's why its x.1? not 7 =8) mirrors please!
just wanna know if its just me
My GOD, are you high!?
Quarterly server updates, bi-weekly consumer updates? This only appeals to the (few, the proud, the) Nerds! Anual updates to the server and quarterly updates for workstations would be more than any IT group could handle! Why would you want to re-install your server every quarter!? How would you keep current product on the shelves for conumers?
They are in the business of making money... how would your idea help this???
ok, now that that is out of my system-- the idea of what you are talking about, forked content sounds good-- why make Linux as bloated as windows! They have branding, so they should split up and try to hit both markets.
But, think about the logistics of the frequency! Subscription services are one thing... but how long does it take to press CD's? You might be able to make a very rough alpha (devel forks) every month, and a beta every two months... but i think the physical limitations associated with distributing what people pay for limits the viability!
This *IS* market fragmentation.. and NOT what we need. IS groups run stable systems, IS groups will upgrade workstations for the latest and greatest, but never a rollout on such a short product cycle would happen in any instituin of a good size.
Err, wait a sec, please don't say "we", because at least one of us, namely me, does need this. There is nothing I want more from Red Hat at the moment than an update to the oh-so-nearly excellent 6.0 release. Lets have some bug fixes. Lets have a better kernel than 2.2.5. Let's have a gnome that works. Let's have more great KDE apps, updates to MySQL and PostGreSQL, Code Crusader... etc. etc. etc. I'll stop now, the list goes on for about 1,000 apps... and that doesn't even count the bazillions of subtle system fixes that have been done since 6.0.
Arguing against regular updates is pretty much the same as arguing against motherhood.
Life's a bitch but somebody's gotta do it.
I see that many people suggest rpmfind. So let me point out the differences (and inferiority of the rpmfind aproach)
1) Debian's dselect and apt not just download the package that you need, they also solve the dependencies and conflicts automatically (apt-get) or interactively (dselect) and download or remove the packages that depend or conflict.
2) apt-get and dselect do not just download packages, they also install them.
3) This is the biggest difference. Debian package management was designed with network installs/updates/upgrades in mind. If a program is a free program (GPL, BSD, etc) then it is most likely a part of the OFFICIAL main Debian distribution. This means that you don't have to look in various places for packages, everything is in one place. Second, the packages are usually of higher quality, since they are a part of distribution and they MUST meet all the guidelines of the distribution. If a package is buggy, the distribution will not release until it is fixed (or removed from main tree if it is too late)
Shaky versions is true. They used Pre-Kernels even :) How bad can you get... And an unfinished GNOME.
Reasons why I don't trust RedHat (shipping pre-kernels as production...not a good idea)
But I prefer RedHat because it comes with what I need, and has a standard (RPM) instead of going against the grain (especially since RPM is GPL'd).
The debian package management system blows RPM away. It's that simple. rpmfind is simply not the same. Many others have already posted why this is so.
Debian has too late a release schedule for me.
Then follow unstable instead of stable. It's awesome to be able to have the latest and greatest with two commands (apt-get update; apt-get dist-upgrade) Debian unstable tends to actually be sufficiently stable for home use (well, actually, I've never had any problems with debian unstable)-- definitely stay with 'stable' for important machines though.
It would be better if Debian used RPM's. Then I could just mix and match them.
It can -- and it can use tgz's and slp's too. alien is a wonderful program that can easily convert among them all (deb, tgz, rpm, slp)
When is the next release of Debian coming out. I'm in the process of making i386 binary CDs with a hacked up version of slink_cd, but it's an awful pain.
Debian should periodically make some unstable ISO images, as I tend to hesitate to get people to install Debian, for fear of the 100-200 MB upgrade to unstable over a 56k modem.
Also, does anyone know of any distribution that uses rsync to update packages? (Think dpkg/apt-rsync). That would take a great load off the mirrors. (How many times do we download a 4MB package that does nothing but fix a few bytes in typos?)
I should learn to proofread my posts.
--------
"I already have all the latest software."
Red Hat doens't have a 6 month product life cycle, they have a 6 month release cycle. RH supports products for 3 years from time of release. Yes, thats right, 5.0 users can still register for technical support, and 4.2 users who are registered can still submit tickets. You might want to take a good look at their support page.
Additionally, Red Hat has a beta program. From what I've heard, people who submit useful bug reports into bugzilla, as well as major application vendors, and vendors who have products on the applications CD are often asked to participate. For those not asked to participate, Rawhide, the current development version of Red Hat, is available to the general public.
I downloaded it today and got Redhat 6.1 installed on my server system here. So far it works pretty well. I'm just waiting for a distribution to come set up with good options for firewalling and masquerading.
I'm aware of Debian's ISO images; however, where Mandrake actively encourages downloads of the ISO image, Debian discourages it. Maybe they've changed their tune after the stunning success of Mandrake.
Free Mac Mini. Yes, I'm
I want to switch over to Linux, but am running NT here - how so I burn an ISO image onto a CD from within Windows NT?
Of every package management scheme I have seen (barring debian - have not used it), FreeBSD is the best.
What about when I hose sendmail by installing a bad RPM and need to get the old one back? Starting in single-user would be a much more difficult way of doing things than just starting everything at init5 except sendmail and downloading the RPM. Sure, you can do it your way, but that's a lot harder.
hrm, too bad rpmfind does all that.
Get it?
--------
"I already have all the latest software."
same thing happened to me! does someone knows a way to fix it?
Stop talking about this or that mirror. The speed of the m depends just on where you are at yourself. Find a mirror close to yourself and it should be fast try this link for it! http://ftpsearch.lycos.com/cgi-bin/search?form=med ium&query=6.1-i386.iso&doit=Search&type= Exact+search&hits=15&matches=&hitsprmatch=&limdom= &limpath=&f1=Count&f2=Host&f3=Path&f4=Na me&f5=Size&f6=Time&header=none&sort=hostdist&trlen =20
Stop talking about this or that mirror. The speed of the m depends just on where you are at yourself. Find a mirror close to yourself and it should be fast
m edium&query=6.1-i386.iso&doit=Search&type= Exact+search&hits=15&matches=&hitsprmatch=&limdom= &limpath=&f1=Count&f2=Host&f3=Path&f4=Na me&f5=Size&f6=Time&header=none&sort=hostdist&trlen =20
try this link for it!
http://ftpsearch.lycos.com/cgi-bin/search?form=
(typed as one line into your browser of course)
Actually, MS was charging for access to the beta (or, in my ignorant estimation, alpha) versions of Win2000. They may have had an earlier version that was free, but if so I didn't hear about it. I think that MS probably wants to make product testing into a profit center.
I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
From all of the narrow minded, paranoid comments I have heard, I can come to only one conclusion. For all of you who feel that RedHat is a "moron" for updating to 6.1 in fear that you will have to learn something new is only the thoughts of a Winders user. Microsloth is notorius for putting out new books and training courses for software version updates. MICROSOFT IS ALSO A BILLION DOLLAR MONOPOLY. Get a grip. Linux isnt owned by any one person, so you dont have to go and rush out and buy books to learn the new 6.1. If you dont like 6.1, then use Debian, or Slackware. This is what linux is all about. The UNIX commands will always remain the same. There is no reinventing the wheel. I refer to it as an "object-oriented operating system" meaning you will always have reuseable information stuck back in that thing you call a brain. Paranoia is for Microsoft. Dont bring it into MY LINUX COMMUNITY. I have been with linux too long, and seen the god awful rush of real "morons" plague this wonderful operating system. For the love of the penguin... THINK! THINK! THINK!
"And for those who need more complex or customized setups, or just want the kitchen sink, the classic distributions (RedHat, Suse, etc) aren't going anywhere."
This doesn't require additional distributions. Just new menu choices on the install screen. Instead of choosing:
1 Workstation, 2 Server, or 3 Custom
you would choose:
1) Firewall, 2) Secure E-Mail Server, 3) E-Commerce/Web Server, 4) WorkStation (user), 5) WorkStation (developer), 6) Custom
modes: E)asy, N)ormal, E)xpert
I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
re: RPMS
.0 releases, but the .2's have always been stable for me (I've been using RedHat since 3.0.3). But then again, I imagine if you've been having problems mixing RPM and non-RPM packages, it's conceivable.
I've run into occasional RPM difficulties upgrading packages, but that is generally solved if you're running the current RedHat release (I'm not but that's a different story). As for a central repository for RPMS, you've obviously never heard of rufus (Also called RPMFIND. It's a computer with about 60GIG of RPMs for just about all RPM-based distributions. The webmaster has also written a program called rpmfind which will search rufus (or other rpmfind mirrors) for packages you specify. It will find the latest, suggest upgraded packages, even find source packages. It rocks.
re: General flakiness
You had flakeyness with RedHat 5.2? I find that odd. I had problems with all
Yes, RedHat 5.2 shipped with several buggy packages, but if you've ever been to their errata pages, you can download the latest packages to correct the problems. I still run RedHat 5.2 boxes. Now that RedHat 6.1 has come out, I may take another crack at it on my test systems.
Improvise, adapt, and overcome.
I think that you may be expecting the development process to be more orderly than it actually is. If you are on a development branch, things seem chaotic because they really are chaotic. Part of the development process is composing different possible answers to development problems. Another part is filtering out the errors. And another is choosing between different workable solutions. And these are all happening at once. So in one snapshot you'll encounter one bug, and in the next that one will have been fixed, but a new one will have been introduced. That's the way an active development tree operates.
I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
And so it goes. Linux users prove themself to be dumb with stupid comments like this. Have you ever heard of live and let live. Linux is not the only way to use UNIX.
I'm getting 210 kilobytes/sec. on metalab, downloading to a machine on a network with dual T1s. This of course, is at 5:30 EST on Sunday, which isn't exactly prime usage time for metalab.
Click Here
Unrelated Question: I didn't get a chance to play around with lorax - Did RedHat fix that annoying kernel compile issue with SMBFS (Win95 bug workaround should be turned OFF!)? I don't want to have to recompile the kernel one more time just because of RedHat's inability to realize that enabling the workaround did more harm than good! I assumed originally that 6.0 would be compiled without the option enabled, as dictated by both rules of common sense and "cover-your-ass by putting out non-volitile stuff and let the users customize the experiemental stuff." Anyone know if they've addressed this, or do I have to do another recompile on a slow P100.
Sean
Ah, what a witful exchange. Reminds me of junior high when we used to argue over which was better, Sega or Nintendo. But even then, we actually laid out reasons why we favored one or the other. ~pay no attention to the tech behind the curtain
does it have beowulf support yet? that would rock..
Why don't you email these ideas to suggest@redhat.com instead of posting them on slashdot? Get heard!
-Yiango
haha Snes or Genesis? You Snes loser ;)
My beer is better then your wine cooler.
MY intolerance is better then yours.
blah.
--
CodeRed, the lower user #. No relation to SirCam.
What is the difference between 6.1-SRPMS.iso and 6.1-i386.iso? I know the i386 is the full image, but what is the SRPMS? Is that like if I want to just do an update? or is it extra RPMS or what? Sorry, Linux newbie here.
aarnet's mirror project has made a 6.1 mirror
1 /
available at:
ftp://mirror.aarnet.edu.au/pub/redhat/redhat-6.
including the iso images.
-jason
They should start selling update cd's. These could be made more often. Then they could have som kind of membership deal. Where the members got a cd once a month form RH. That would be a good service deal for many people.
Um... get the latest one from the ISC site.. The one distributed w/ RH 5.2 is 2.0b1pl6, over a year old....and broken (in some obcsure situations; but still...) The current version is 2.0 final; with 3.0b1pl0 already out...
--
Time is on my side
already have more then 560mb downloaded, at over 100KB/s but the speed is rapidly dropping as I started at almost 300KB/s, so I guess more people have found out.
ftp:// ftp.eecs.umich.edu/pub/linux/redhat/redhat/redhat- 6.1/iso/6.1-i386.iso
I know this is off topic, but I have to know, is there a place where I can download an ISO of OpenBSD v2.5? If so, where? Thanks in advance. //Ex RH user.
I am currently using 6.0, does anyone know if RedHat is providing some sort of upgrade so that I don't have to reinstall from scratch?
(no matter how nice the new installer is, I would prefer not to have to reconfigure again)
well, windows is at 98 and soon with a giant leap it will be at 2000, so they've got some catching up to do :)
I am in quebec, and i just ordered from cheapbytes, I ordered 3 copies of the CD and it totaled $10.61US the shipping is actually very resonable, $5.00US, to canada.
too bad they dont realize that the 5min leases means that the client is renewing every 2.5 mins (or so according the the guidelines in the RFCs); thus they are causing a WHOLE lot more traffic to their DHCP server than they really need... (also making a short problem with the DHCP server much bigger than it really is.. since the client will "notice" that the server is down sooner than a 6 hour lease [which gives them 3 hrs before the client notices, and 6hrs before it loses its lease]}
--
Time is on my side
Trying every way (text/graphical/Install KDE workstation/Custom/Upgrade) fails after defining normal users. The message that is displayed on the window starts:
Traceback(innermost last):
File "/usr/bin/anaconda.real"
line 255, in ?
intf.run(todo,test=test)
File "/tmp/lib/python.5/site_packages/text.py", line 1000, in run
rc=apply (step[1](), step[2])
and so on..... I have a customized version of RH6.0 on partition hdb3. I'm trying a ftp-install/upgrade in a cyrix166, S3 Trio 64, 64 Mb ram, cable modem
ISO, This means it's an Image of a CD.
You can drop it directly onto CD NO hassle.
T.
(I hope I'm right.)
the downside to having to maintain that many packages, of ocurse, is that in the ~2 years that have have been using linux, there have only been two versions of debian released, while this is redhat's 5th (not counting 4.2 which was only a few months old when i first used linux)
also, the one time that i did decide to install debian, i gave up after having to sort through that list of all several thousand packages to choose which ones i wanted and which ones i didn't, and then have it prompt me for configuration info for a quarter of them as it installed them. the system administrator where i used to work, who has probably installed the same version of debian at least 20 or thirty times, once told me that he has gotten to the point where he can get through that whole process in about a half hour on a fast enough computer. i can take a version of redhat i've never seen before, and go through all of it's installation questions in under 15 minutes (much less if i choose their predefined groups rather than individual packages), and then let it sit for anywhere from 15 minutes to several hours (depending on whether i am doing an install from hard disk, cdrom, or ftp) while it installs all of those packages without any intervention from me.
If I don't put anything here, will anyone recognize me anymore?
well, it doesn't work for me. ~~10:30pm Saturday
If I were a stock holder, which I'm not, I'd be concerned about the number of returns. I don't pretend to know much about resale channels, but I've got to think there's a lot of surplus.
What do they do with all of that stock, anyway?
Currently pulling it at 192KB/s at 10:39 EST
isn't this a well timed event? by not telling the world at large they get the 'early adopters' out of the way (who find out through word of mouth) and free up the ftp servers for the masses...
ftp://ftp. orst.edu/pub/packages/linux/redhat/redhat-6.1/iso/ 6.1-i386.iso
This is the beauty of the GPL. RedHat and Mandrake feed off each other in a symbiotic circle.
Question is, when can we expect to download the Windows 2000 ISO? Answer: never, unless it's WaReZ.
Sig (appended to the end of comments you post, 120 chars)
Sorry, I guess I didn't make myself quite clear. I didn't actually mean two separate development tracks, just two different distributions, as you said. The RPMs should be usable on either distribution. Now that I think about, maybe Red Hat should just ship on a DVD, with a better set of defaults for Workstation and Server? Oh yeah, not too many servers have DVD drives (or workstations for that matter). Nevermind.
Uh, what does ISO mean?
Cranking along at 106 K/sec (and climbing).
...
I tried lots of the other mirrors, without any luck. An attempted download from ftp.redhat.com stalled out last night.
Rebuilding my firewall box will be a good sunday
.
Can't remember where though...
This sig left unintentionally blank.
hehe... sorry... (I am one of those adding to your woes...); but if it will make you feel better, I am downloading it for a semi-private local LUG mirror... [accessible only to the local connections from the local .edu(s), .k12.us, and local ISPs in the area of the LUG]
I'm not ever going to bother with Redhat again unless they fix the following major problems:
:) :P
:P
RPMS
There is no way that I know of to easily upgrade packages. Sure, you can just rpm -i the new rpm, but then it depends on some other new rpm that you have to locate, download, upgrade, only to find THAT requires something else.. etc.. There is no central repositry for RPMs like there is with debian...
Something like apt (debian) is desperately needed to figure out package dependancy downloading for you
To get around the braindead dependancies i just compiled stuff from source, which kinda defeats the purpose of HAVING rpms
General flakiness
The last redhat release i played with (version 5.2) had sendmail 8.8, and bind version 4.9 or something... any reason for this? Both were known security problems (that had been fixed for a while) on the day it shipped AFAIK
I really dont know what everyone seems to see in redhat...
smash (not intended to be flamebait, just curious - btw I was a Redhat user for all versions between 4.1 and 5.2, switched to debian...)
I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
Cranking along at 120 K/sec (and climbing).
I tried lots of the other mirrors, without any luck. An attempted download from ftp.redhat.com stalled out last night.
Rebuilding my firewall box will be a good sunday
.
Y'know, the "First Post" thing is neither cool nor funny anymore... Not to flame or anything, but just letting you know for future reference...
I would still prefer two branched distributions. I'd rather see more server-side stuff on a Server Distribution CD when I'm installing the servers (optional PAM and apache modules, maybe a choice of databases, etc), and more client/workstation packages (where to begin) included on the Workstation Distribution CD.
What about us who own high-end machines that can act both as a server and workstation, at home, for example. I consider it one of the important advantages of Linux to be able to use a single distribution in place of several other systems (Win98 & NT). Also easier if machines exchange jobs, no need to install a different distribution, just update it to be a server/client as well. So I'm against in branching Red Hat Linux, but once the different jobs get too big, i'm all for a compromise: Instead of a single Main CD-ROM, ship a Workstation and a Server CD, while preserving the possibilities of mixing them and keeping all compatibility. I think that's the best way to solve the problem, if there ever will be such a problem, for a mainstream distro like RedHat's.
(Maybe that's what Can meant? In that case, great, there's no problem at all!)
-- Eavy (: Linux Is Not UniX
ftp://ftp.crc.ca/mirrors/by-site/rh-mirror.redhat. com/redhat/redhat-6.1/iso/6.1-i386 .iso
Downloaded rh6.1 earlier and tried to do a upgrade via hd, however it failed during trying to figure out which packages to upgrade. During the "Reading package info" part it dumped a bunch of python debug into to the screen, then exited.
Yes, Redhat 6.0 would still have plenty of copies in most big-name stores. I doubt whether 6.1 will hit the shelves in a flurry - eventually it will, and the cost of it will want to be kept to a minimum of course.
Redhat 6 does exactly what it was intended to do from day 1 - most users want that objective - and don't quite need 6.1 yet.
Besides, a lot of people couldn't be bothered downloading a cd.
---- Windows Emulator for Linux: kill -9 $RANDOM
Well in *some* defence of AC posting. Remember when we have those stories about goverment doing so and so, and we have *whistle-blowers* come out of the woodwork and validate what the stories saying. I'm certain their are other examples as well. Also moderation has it's flaws, I've seen good, but contraversial posts not get moderated up. And sometimes worse, good post get moderated down because the moderator doesn't agree with the post. Yes AC has it's merits, shame that the few have spoiled it for the majority. Of course having a name attatched doesn't stop mediocrity. just look at usenet.
Really? I am using Road Runner in the NY Capital Region area, and have no problems. But we moved off the Login Client almost 4 months ago.
Heh. That's the only problem with cheapbytes. Shipping's more expensive than the product itself! (US$5 shipping for US$10 of product is pretty expensive, imho)
Redhat offers the - Red Hat Member More program.
= /more_rh_rhmembermore.html
http://store.redhat.com/commerce/store.cgi?page
Includes the following:
1 Membership Card
Each release of the Official Red Hat Linux Box Set for one
year
8 Update CD shipments
Quarterly Newsletter
1 Red Hat Baseball Cap
1 Red Hat T-Shirt
15% Discount on all Red Hat, Inc. retail products* during
membership
Free passes to all tradeshows Red Hat, Inc. attends during
membership period
Complimentary gifts at tradeshows
"Members only" specials announced on our website
periodically throughout the year for RHMember Program
participants.
Additional "members only" specials reserved only for
RHMember More program members.
you forgot the fact that the glibc libs are broken, as 99% of all older software will not compile under red-slap while it does under SuSE,Slackware,Yggdrasil etc... in-consistencies with other distribs- (THIS IS LINUX NOT REDHATUX) in filesystem setup ... basically it has a really long way to go before it's useable as a desktop or mission-critical server... until then my servers use SuSE!!!! (Yee Hah!)
Oh yeah, did they fix the flaky red-hat X configuration junk yet?? I had to help several people with that... "Ignore what the red-hat book tells you, it's junk... just type XF86Config and answer the questions...No, Linux is still reliable, as long as you use the real software and not the things that the red-hat place shoves down your throat, you'll be fine.... yes?... I can come over and install Slackware if you want... ok... be right over!"
Pleasse Red-hat get the stuff right before you release!
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
Has anyone even given YellowDog Linux a chance? Their distro is quick, stable, and it has just what you're talking about! They have what they call a "Champion Server" version and a "Gone Home" version. It runs on PPC hardware to boot! :) Check it out!
Anyone know what the default window manager is? Ist it the same one that was with 6.0?
150 Opening BINARY mode data connection for 6.1-i386.iso (674164736 bytes). 226 BINARY Transfer complete. Transfer done: 674164736 bytes in 1319.853 secs (510.79 k/sec) woo! :) I love cable
redhat should buy up a few distros to narrow it down and bring more talent in and spread some of the wealth.
Redhat has ALWAYS released updates every 6 months.
/. account, and leave us to our innovations. We'll be sure not to write.
Why?
Is it an evil capitalist plot to screw your mom?
No, it's called "Free software advances pretty fast". 6.0 came with the 2.2.5 kernel, KDE 1.1.1, XF86 3.3.3, and a bunch of other now horribly outdated and insecure stuff. You could literally spend all day downloading all the update RPMs to 6.0 to fix that. Or you could just update to 6.1 (say for $1.99 at CheapBytes - there's no need to pay Redhat a cent if you really think they're the second coming of Ballmer) and get the identical benefits a lot more easily and on 1 CD.
Lest you think only Redhat does this, consider that FreeBSD 3.3 is now out, and that's the second release this year, same as Redhat. Oh no, they must be EVIL too!!! Calgon, take me away!
Would you really rather everything stagnate like AIX has? If so, please go back to it, delete your
why is X installed for server???
/dev/null for the server.....
because REd-hat is mirrioring WindowsNT
NT has the Gooiey installed, that's why it takes 90% more resources than it really needs! so red-hat in order to help the brain dead NT sysadmins that only know how to click and drool(Espically MSCE's) can fake trying to understand linux server administration... it's a way to help the morons that barely know computers (Corperate IS people) do their jobs...
Now Unix gu-ru's or someone that has 1/2 a brain? they'd rather see that GUI installed on
(Note... does it seem that I hate the morons that are employed as corperate IS techs? YUP! because I now hired in as one and have to clean up the mess the last two idiots left.. nither one knew what the hell thwey were doing! and they were MSCE certified! I'm not and nwever will be BTW!)
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
Not to start a flame war, but Why can't people just keep thier systems up to date, without reinstalling the whole thing? I'm still kina running redhat 5.0. But, I've kept everything quite up to date, actualy, I use tarballs more than anything (I like to compile my own stuff) I've had terrible luck with rpm's. And to boot, I don't realy care for the way redhat does a lot of the stuf...Heh...I was a slackware user for for about 4 years before I got redhat (got it due to a HD crash, and I needed a distro fast). Also, as a note, the only programs I use much, are netscape, emacs, and rxvt. (major apps anyway) Aside from that, keeping the rest upto date is easy.
:)
Just got netscape 4.08 last night
http://www.xpurple.com
Really this is a non-issue. You can ship all the packages you want on 1 or more CDs. Just choose what type of system you want at install time. If you want a Server install then you get your choice of DB, if you want a Workstation then you get your choice of Tetris clones. The other packages will still be on the CD if you want them. Kinda like Suse with its umpteen CDs.
-- Remember: Wherever you go, there you are!
Obviously 6.0 has become stable so if I were you I'd just get the updates for 6.0, and wait a while before jumping to 6.1. It's not such a bad thing to lag a minor version behind, at least most of the security holes in 6.0 should have been plugged by now! (if there were any ;^)
I was certain the hangup for the release of 6.1 was the new GNOME 1.50 and the big bugfix 2.2.13 kernel. Probably too much pressure to get something out, now that they are publicly traded.
As for this release just being an update, that if for the most part true. The main focus of this release was the introduction of the graphical installer. This is and excellent installer, easier than previous Redhat installs and far easier than other Linux distros and Windows installers. (My roommate did extensive testing of it in lorax) Kudos to Matt Wilson for his excellent work.
As for the announcement of this on /. before it was officially released by Redhat, I think a huge mistake was made. /. often warns that downloads may be rocky for awhile when it reports on a new distro release or a new kernel, but part of the reason that this is true is that the mirrors don't have time to get it before /. users start pounding it. I think many of us dislike the "first post" mentality that clouds useful discussion on /. and we should be fed up with /. following the same model for news when doing so is inappropriate.
--
Gregory J. Barlow
fight bloat. use blackbox.
Gregory J. Barlow
fight bloat. use blackbox.
It is all still GPL. They still pledge to release everything they write under GPL, and show no signs of changing that. ~luge
People shouldn't be getting "6.0" training, I'm not even sure they should be getting RedHat training. I would suggest teaching on two levels:
- Administrators: Learn the core system of Linux, a typical layout of files, runlevels, daemons, etc. Then learn how some distros organize those files differently. I administer a company with Debian and RedHat systems, I know this works.
- End users: End users don't care what distro they're using. Seriously. They barely care if they're using Gnome or KDE, but that's what they should be taught, because the theory is that's all they'll need. Gnome apps, KDE apps.
Errata is released almost constantly as bugs of a sufficent severity are found. But that doesn't help people who buy RH on CD and don't have the bandwidth to be downloading big binary patches like the updated X packages.I would tend to agree that jumping to 7 over a window manager and kernel would be silly, but nobody's doing that.
I would still prefer two branched distributions. I'd rather see more server-side stuff on a Server Distribution CD ..., and more client/workstation packages (where to begin) included on the Workstation Distribution CD.
'Customized' distributions are an enormous advantage that Linux has over Microsoft, which basically has a one-size-fits-all product strategy (the only difference between NTS and NTW is the connection limit in NTW - the NT Server even comes out of box with workstation defaults, such as running foreground applications with a higher priority).
In a few years, I can imagine a "Linux Firewall" distribution, a Linux "Secure Mail Server" distribution, an ecommerce distribution, any number of customized workstation installations, and so on. No need to have a guru on hand, just drop in the CD and answer a few questions and you are running with a reasonable assurance that you don't have a gopher server in the background or 50 MB of extra applications you don't need. Sure this is fragmentation, but the lower cost of ownership a tailored distribution would bring makes up for it. Plus it would still be the same Linux underneath.
And for those who need more complex or customized setups, or just want the kitchen sink, the classic distributions (RedHat, Suse, etc) aren't going anywhere.
Business. Numbers. Money. People. Computer World.
--
--
Some of the more "mainstream" news sites like ZD and writers like Dvorak, Berst, etc. do check in on slashdot, and they WILL report on things like this and will draw their own, usually wrong, conclusions. PHBs read Dvorak, Berst, et. al. and form their opnions from what they read.
The "early adopters" will also be the folks who go to a mirror when the real announcement comes out.
Maybe RedHat should set up a round-robin DNS like kernel.org has, to spread the load all over.
We have a couple NT/98 boxes here and one Linux box. By far the easiest way for me to install is to FTP over DSL (3-4 hours) from my local mirror (co-located at my ISP) to the NT box and do an FTP/HTTP install from there. Installing over 100mbs ethernet is probably faster than loading from a CDROM anyway...
Or maybe their just doing this to try and get me to set up an NFS server on my NT box. Anyone know of any freely available ones?
moe
mandrake is easy to install just like redhat, in addition to redhat it comes with TONS of preconfigured programs (i586 optimized too!). for example: > cd burning > vnc > kde > gui apps, like lyx, xmms, etc. > server side: php3, mod perl, etc. it is just filled with goodies so you don't have to bother to configure everything. Plus it has a newer kernel than redhat.
How long does it usually take cheapbytes.com to make a cheap version of RedHat after it is released? Does anyone else know a cheap, reliable place other than cheapbytes to get Linux cd's (I wonder who will make RedHat 6.1 available first)?
I just got ~150KB/S from metalab/sunsite on a measly T1.
--------- Matt
has anyone heard of/done the equivalent to:
mount -t iso9660 -o ro,loop=/dev/loop0 image mountpoint
in NT?
--------- Matt
I really wish Red Hat would open up their development process a bit. Or, at least tell us some of their plans. I realize they don't like to pre-announce features and be accused of vaporware, but it would be nice to know what their thinking is in terms of when packages get updated and when they don't. Or when/why major version numbers increase.
I also know Red Hat is trying to strattle the line between stability for servers and functionality for users, so maybe it's time for two development tracks? One that has a smaller, with a core set of sever-type packages and an server-centric installer. This distribution would get the current treatment of quarterly, well tested updates, and emergency security patches.
But then there should also be a second distribution that is more of a "rolling release" system that maybe gets a bi-weekly set of updates. I think this second distribution is needed to keep up with the active development in the area of user applications.
Both packages would have a lot of overlap, in fact the RPMS should generally usable on either distribution. But for example, we don't need GIMP and the latest version of XBill on servers, but it might be nice to have newer version of GNOME for the desktop distribution since there is such a big difference in the software in four months.
I realize this may not be the ideal way of doing things, but we need to keep two things in mind:
1) Linux is still under heavy development on the client end. In one month, Linux has gnoe from completely unusable on my brand new laptop to almost fully functional thanks to new releases of software. We need this kind of functinoality in the biggest distribution.
2) Microsoft has shown what kind of a mess you can get into when you try to maintain everything from the consumer-level system all the way up to the highets end server-level systems all in one bundle. You get a compromise that doesn't work well for either.
So, at least for another couple years while Linux is in such constant development, wouldn't it make sense to treat Linux distributions a bit differently?
First off, no real complaints with the 6.1 .iso dl. The upgrade from 6.0 went smoothly and I must admit the new graphical install is pretty slick. The warning is just for SBLive users to avoid making the silly mistake I made. The current beta drivers only support kernel version 2.2.5-15 and not the 2.2.12-20 that comes with 6.1. If you don't mind being without sound until Creative ramps up a new beta for 6.1, go ahead and install. Realistically, you're better off waiting unless there's something in 6.1 that you absolutely need. This may be news many of you don't need, but just consider it a friendly little warning.
ChodaBoy
- The preceding statement is the product of a deranged mind and the sole property of the voices in my head.
It's been my experience that people who refer to themselves as a "guru" usually aren't...
--"A man's Palm is his best friend."
--"A man's Palm is his best friend."
(IIIx, that is...hehehe)
Patrick Barrett
Yebyen@adelphia.net
Restating the obvious since nineteen aught five.
If you've actually used Red Hat, or Linux for that matter, I wouldn't expect you to make comments like "suckers who got 6.0 training need 6.1 training" - that's just not the way it works. If you know how to use Red Hat 5.1, you can probably do just fine with 6.1. Linux changes every day. Red Hat rolls up those changes every 6 months or so, with their new features as well.
:-)
And of course, anyone trained on 6.0 who thinks 6.1 will be confusing (!) well - they can just keep running 6.0.
Seriously though, it's more compact and more elegant. It packs more information into a smaller package, plus it requires no translation (well, not into Roman-numeral languages anyway)
Sorry to burst your bubble, but, while we may use the Roman alphabet, we don't use Roman numerals, otherwise we'd be releasing RedHat VI.I with kernel II.II.XII. Most Western nations and some non-Western nations (like Japan) use Arabic numerals which give us a revolutionary concept of place value
Gnome 1.0.50 (which is a major-effort coordinated release) is *almost* ready to go - so I'm surprised that they didn't wait a week or so for that. Ah well. Easy enough to upgrade. Or maybe it's already in there?
--
Friend, you have got to be kidding. How can adding a bunch of package set prompts, disk partitioning options, etc. make this EASIER? It may be nicer for seasoned Linux users, but new Linux users haven't a clue what xdaliclock is, nor do they care (that's just one example).
Besides, a number of these graphic install screens offer similar if not identical options that the Caldera installation offers.
Try to keep your biases under wraps, okay? Your statement is patently false. The Red Hat graphic installation offers more control, but it is NOT easier than Caldera's. You can be pro-Red Hat without lying.
I think, "First Post" posters are cool. I'm an 11 year old boy who's been trapped in a sewer pipe at a construction site for two years now. All I have with me is my laptop and network connection and it's dark here and my leg's broken and wedged behind me and the only thing I have to look forward to is reading /. The "First Post" posts really brighten my day. Oh yeah, my sister e-mailed me today to tell me she has cancer. So please, think of me and don't stop the first post posts! Ok, back to trapping rats for food :(
so where on god's green friggin earth would one find a sparc iso? of 6.0, even? judas, does the world revolve around the shitass intel architechure?
-fester
(please don't answer that.. i have intel, motorola, sparc and hppa at home...)
-'fester
Call me anal, but why didn't RedHat put an md5 checksum or something similar along with the iso? md5s are in rpms, but I'd like to see one. 642 MB seems a little bit big to just assume everything went correctly... Anyway, just a thought
I was very impressed that the folks at FreeBSD finally offered official .iso images, as I had picked up the official 3.2 at a computer show 2 days before the release of 3.3. It's nice to see this becoming a more popular form of download and more distros of both Linux and *BSD doing it. I'm primarily a Redhat user, so this was an additional plus.
--
I love the fact that Linux is constantly being improved and new releases coming out, but I worry that the early announcement of Mandreake 6.1, and now RedHat 6.1, could hurt the community. Or, rather, the world's perception of the community.
a nd-it's-mine-because-it's GPL'd-right-now people. Yes, the stuff's on a public FTP server. But it has yet to be announced as officially released.
Things like this could very well foster the idea in the media and the "mainstream users" that Linux users are greedy, immature, impatient, I-want-it-all-screw-you-hippie-gimme-what's-mine-
If RedHat felt that the time was right to tell the world, they'd tell the the world. But announcing the release before the mirrors are ready, and before RedHat is ready (if they were ready, they'd make the announcement themselves) is bordering on irresponsible, IMHO. The whole thing isn't even posted yet, just the i386 binaries!
This may not officaly be a help center, but in reality it is where alot of people learn about linux. If help is needed i don't see why we can't give it here on /.
But: They left their FTP servers open for public downloads of the RH6.1, which does not make sense for me (they have a separate host rh-mirror.redhat.com for mirrors downloading).
Does anybody have an explanation for this?
-Yenya
-Yenya
--
While Linux is larger than Emacs, at least Linux has the excuse that it has to be. --Linus
5.1 and 5.2 were mostly patched versions of 5.0.
At some point, it sucks for new people to download 6.0 and apply 25 patches. So 6.1 is released, new and improved.
It never was cool or funny.
No easy way to update RPMs? Try reading the man page. =] The -U does a 'update' though it might not be an update some people like. Of course everyone knows what the -v is for .. =] And of course the -h prints hash marks. Anyway, the help associated with the -U is as follows: Upgrade the package currently installed to the version in the new RPM. This is the same as install, except all other versions of the package are removed from the system. ...They have more then just RedHat rpms (SuSe, Caldera, OpenLinux, etc) ...Though, RPM Repository and Linuxberg have to be the best sites to goto.. =]
I do agree with the package dep. part, but hey, that's the fun of admin'ing.. =]
As for a 'central location' of RPMs, try http://www.rpmfind.net/linux/RPM/
One distro. Incredibly easy and sane remote source updating. Awesome linux compatibility. /usr/ports. All system files available on the world-record holding ftp.freebsd.org. FreeBSD rocks.
does anyone have any suggestions to get around this??
Na .. *BSD guys hate everyone in their little stuck up little world
Much appreciated.
There have been and there are betas of RedHat. This is what lorax was and this is what usually the `roughcuts' is for. "Cartman" is supposed to be a stable release and I think that for some of us the inclusion of XFree-3.3.5 makes it worth downloading. Please remember also that this is FREE SOFTWARE and that it can be easier to ship a completely new `fixed' distribution rather than loads of `service packs'... It is worth remembering as well that the 2.2.5 kernel of Hedwig was not one of the "most stable" ever released... hence I belive that a 6.1 before the 7.0 has been a good idea... Still I'm looking forward to install the successor-to-be to lorax! [with maybe XFree 3.9]
I've been beating pretty hard on the 6.1 beta (lorax) since it's release.
:) :)
To say that at first there weren't any bugs would be a lie of course, but I've seen _great_ leaps ahead over the course of it. At the beginning, it took some work to get it to work.
But, through lots of beta testing, and lots of late night hacking by Matt Wilson, it's now to the point that it's the easiest installer I've seen. Much easier than Caldera's graphical, in large part, because it gives you a lot more freedom in the install. The GUI install works for CDROM installs, NFS installs, and (untested, but should work I believe) hard drive installs. If the GUI installer doesn't work for you (or you don't want it even), never fear. There's still a text-based installer for low-ram machines, and ftp or http installs.
Other nice neat things in 6.1 (for those wondering)
- kudzu: kudzu does hardware detection and will start the appropriate configuration tool. Very neat
- an interactive startup option (disable-able) ala choose what you want to start during startup for Windows 9x and DOS; so for when you screw up your sendmail config, you can still start without taking ages
- up2date: service to give access to a priority server upon registration and then will give you the new rpms in updates and give you the opportunity to install them, just download them, few other options
- fsck has a progress bar
- rp3: an easy-to-use ppp configuration tool. I haven't actually completely tested this one being on ethernet and all, but it appeared to work
- XFree 3.3.5, 2.2.12, GNOME 1.0.40 stuff (newest when it mastered...), KDE 1.1.2, glibc 2.1.2
Think that's most of the good interesting stuff. As I said, it's shaping up to be _really_ solid from what I can tell.
--
Jeremy Katz
I have been saying the same thing. They should have waited for gnome kde 1.1.2 and netscape 4.7, also what about that exploit in the kernel tcp/ip stack from last week? A lot of people are going to be pissed that next week they are going to have to go through a kernel upgrade because of a memory leak or security hole. Waiting for 6.2.....
It would have been more polite to wait for the
answer on the mirror list.
This was a goof on redhat's part... they were
going to keep it restricted until Monday.
Anyway this is a much better state of affairs
than the 6.0 release, which leaked from a few
mirrors before it was available on redhat and
before other mirrors had a chance to get it.
Our mirror completed around midnight. I'm not
eager to hose our bandwidth quite yet, so I'm
keeping it private til Monday.
If you don't want to help someone out then just quietly move on with your reading.
Hypothetically, anything hypothetical is possible.
...but they still should have waited for the kernel et al.
The user group of the city where I use to live uses to distribute Linux CDs either for a symbolic price (roughly 1.5USD) or with a 3-for-2 scheme (3 blank CDs for 2 recoded ones). Indeed I am downloading 6.1 right now in order to prepare the next release. I wish more LUGs were going to do the same! (hint... our idea is not patented... yet!)
Why jump to this conclusion?
/everything/ to make sure it still works is likely to take absolutely ages.
I don't know when 2.2.13 is expected, and it can't be that long off, but there's nothing wrong with wanting to get a new release out now, and if they have to *test* the stuff first, waiting on a new kernel and then testing
~Tim
--
Rushing on down to the circle of the turn
Actually it has already been fixed. I think the first samba errata that was put out had that fixed.
"Fighting the underpants gnomes since 1998!" "Bruce Schneier knows the state of schroedinger's cat"
/sbin/pump sucks. I'm still using DHCP from the RH 5.2 distro in order to get RoadRunner working. It's actually on the RH FAQ somewhere...
Every time RHAT drops to 70% of its highest value they announce a release. On 8/23 they were at 63 after an opening week high of 89 and they announced a beta. That got them to 123. Now they're at 87 and sure enough, they announced a release although not an official release for a bit yet. I predict their stock will have another peak and drop back to 70% at which time an official release is announced. Red Hat is very into pushing software releases according to market value and using high version numbers to instill confidence. They rarely get on portals unless they bump up the version numbers and bump up the version numbers they do, with a vengence.
You really get what you deserve if you do...
The /.ing of a server is not cool for those who have to deal with it, but let's keep mirrors out of this. They do get the stuff early. case in point: the University of Oklahoma mirror, for example, got it. This may seem trivial, but I'm on that network and I know how bogged down and slow it is!
I think the codename on this one deserves a reason for upgrade alone. Do you think we can get one of those nice big logos on login like debian and mandrake? That would be wicked "sweeeeeeet."
I'm sticking with Mandrake, you fscking lusers! Er..
Joke!
One good thing does arise from all of the bitching, whining, first posting, and other offtopic idiocies.. These morons make it quite clear who is and is not worth listening to, as they all lump themselves quite neatly into.. that's right.. the latter.
I want some filters that make it to where I can't read posts from certain users. Blocking out articles isn't very exciting. Filtering out those with very, very low signal/noise ratios would be a Good Thing, especially since more and more people who you'd think would stick to AC trolling are actually getting accounts. At least those without accounts are easily filtered (and yeah, hard thresholds of 1 are highly recommended.. every once in a while I look to see what the ACs have to say about my comments.. talk about unfounded, uncreative, unintelligent deragotory flames that could only be unleashed from the mind of an impotent psychopath with so low self-esteem as to validate the notion of pressing various baseless insults, biggotry, and other "high-minded" prejudices upon a person solely for the purpose of cracking their self-confidence and/or ego.. it's kind of sad, really, especially because these "brave" souls can't even log in to say those kinds of things.. they have to snipe from the sidelines like good little cowards.. ;).
~ Kish
csociety-ftp.ecn.purdue.edu I pulled 300k/s thru the whole download. have fun!
Someone is on the way to turn on the water.