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LucasArts and BioWare to Develop New Star Wars RPG
Ant was the first of a number of folks to write about the press release that came out from LucasArts and Bioware. Bioware, you probably remember, has done Icewind Dale and Baldur's Gate with their Infinity Engine. Pretty cool stuff - the setting of the game is going to be prior to the Star Wars movies. I don't know whether that means prior to Episode I or Episode IV, but the real-world ship date is supposed to be 2002. So, donna hold your breath.
Actually, that was Hemos's comment, not Ant's. Read more carefully before you flame the wrong person. ;)
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hymie
Thank you, that's good input. If I had mod points today I would give you some ... oh wait you're an AC, anyway.
Since most of /. audience is American, a sly anti-American post can snag a few suckers. Nothing blatant, of course.
You haven't been following me too closely, I basically do it all the time. Maybe I'm too blatant, though. Well actually, given how the slightest irony manages to get over the head of a dozen posters usually, I'm not sure subtlety would be such a good idea.
Drop in a line about the ungrateful Americans, without LaFayette we'd be speaking English instead of American.
Now that's mind reading or something, as on another forum I used almost this line already. Actually it was quite a good flame, you know I got the usual "if it was'nt for us you'd be speaking German", the post was ridden with spelling errors so I replied saying that if we had'nt help them get rid of the brits, maybe they would spell properly.
And what is it with America's fear of body scents and hair. You might as well fuck a silicon Barbie doll, hairless and descented, if you're going to fuck a dispassionate American woman, moot point for an American geek, though.
I don't know, after all I'd rather fuck a real doll than an american chicks those days, at least they would'nt play the victim all day long and start crying for mummy every time they don't get what they want.
If you've ever played planescape torment, you'd see that Bioware was capable and willing to do storylines that engross, freak out, and completely surprise their players, so far they havent done a game yet that was not extremely appealing to an adult audience.
"Arrogance and Stupidity all in the same package. How efficient of you." - Londo Mollari, Babylon 5.
New Star Wars RPG? Quick, get the tents! The sleeping bags! The MREs and survival gear!
2002 is a long way off, but I can make it!
This will be the best line ever!
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Go ahead, blame me... I voted for Nader!
OK, your party of six characters (the Jedi, the Wookiee, the Smuggler, the Princess, the Yappy Droid, and the Short Droid) walks into a 10" x 10" room.
How on Earth (or Alderran) would six characters fit into a 10" by 10" room? The thing's less than a cubic foot!
Then again, I guess it makes sense if the game is being played on (in?) a G4 cube (or a Cobalt qube, if they port it to linux).
Suddenly my mind is full of analogies from the G4 cube to the Borg cube to the death star to... a perfectly spherical desktop computer, with a divot on one side for stability?
Kevin Fox
Kevin Fox
I also had a helluva lot of fun kicking the crap out of my friends with Vader's light saber in "Masters of Teras Kasi"
I have to say I haven't really been pulled into the genre. last rpg I played was Baldurs gate and the one before that would have to have been a mud, but I know enough people who have played it and still have lifes..... your just wishing you had one right? :)
they made the best game ever : maniac mansion (parts I & II), closely followed by the secret of monkey island, but since then I never saw anything like that ever again, which is sad ...
Yes, I'm left. You have a problem with that?
Often it seems that much of the technology in Star Wars matches much of the technology that seemed possible at the time; biotechnology (cloning, gene manipulation) wasn't really a going concern in '75, but computers and holograms were within-grasp technologies that seemed to have a lot of future to them. (Where are we at with holograms, anyway?)
What? IANASWBE (I am not a Star Wars biotechnology expert), but what do you think the the mentions of the clone wars in EP4 were all about? What do you think EP2 or 3 will be about? Why do you think battle droids were replaced by more reliable (cloned) stormtroopers? Biotech is old (failed) news in the Star Wars universe.
What is the matter with On the Origin of Species? Darwin was actually a Christian man. I assume that you are speaking from the stand point of a Christian person. There seems to be two factions of Christians these days. Those like me who say that evolution might have happened (in fact I believe that it did) and that it doesn't matter anyway as long as you believe that it was God's hand that directed the creation. And then there are those who stick to a strict adherence to the Genesis account of creation even though many of the leading Christian scholars feel that it is not historically accurate(I suggest getting a hold of some of Dr. Tasjian's work). In fact Darwin only proposed micro evolution not mega. Do you even know anything about evolution? That is one thing that really concerns me is that if more Christians actually learned about what they were criticizing that they would be less likely to do so. I suggest that you study some of the current theologians out there today and see what their thoughts are on this. By the way, don't read anything by Dobson. He is a moron and many in the more learned of the Christian community feel that his teachings are not based on the Bible but his own opinions.
Again sorry to everyone else for the religious discussion here but I wanted to clear something up.
Molog
So Linus, what are we doing tonight?
So Linus, what are we going to do tonight?
The same thing we do every night Tux. Try to take over the world!
I'm sure that a wink wink nudge nudge suggestion to beta test it will have rabid linux geeks knocking down the doors to test it. Hell, I walked out of my one and only game testing job from how shitty a job it is, and I'd be willing to do it.
--
Does narcissism count as a hobby? --Shawn Latimer
Just like you read all the previous comments which said exactly the same thing as you just did?
"For the game, LucasArts and BioWare are creating an entirely original storyline set some four thousand years before Star Wars: Episode I. The ancient era is dominated by an epic struggle between the Jedi and the evil Sith."
:)
Wow... I mean. Our "human civilization" is only about 5k years old from relative stupidity to now. Is this game even going to have vehicles with spaceflight? Or is it going to be something like sword-wielding jedi? Note... sword _not_ lightsaber...
All things being equal and relative, to say our civilization won't have ships that rival Star Wars in 3,000 years would be madness. Which means that the setting should be somewhere around the year 1,000.
If they _do_ have spaceships 4,000 years prior to Ep 1, then they'd better have a darn good excuse- like an older race in the area or something.
:)
D
The thought also occures, is it going to be Jedi v. Sith, or will it be many races and the ability to explore many worlds and space. You could do a space sim and a world-based system. Sound cool? lets lobby Lucasarts to do this.
If people can connect to one another even the smallest of voices will grow loud.
--Serial Experiments Lain
So now we have this to look forward to. Please don't fsck this one up LA! Please, I'm begging you. Use the force, take id's stance of "ready when it's ready," just please please give me another star wars game I can play until I fail out of school again [now college - hehe higher stakes].
Lemure, wtf! Don't you mean Lemur?
Has there been any historical mention of what was happening 4000 years before the films? How long did the Old Republic last?
-B
Remember what Slashdot is here for? They post topics, and we yap about them.
I make mistakes, you make mistakes, Hemos and Taco make mistakes, instead if ripping each other's heads out, let's just bite the bullet and do what we're here to do: yap about the topic. Please?
and the infinity engine they created for Baldur's Gate and Icewind Dale is a great piece of work. In a good portion of the gaming community, Bioware has quickly become a very respected game-maker, I've heard them compared to Blizzard by reviewers. (Personally I like Bioware more than I like Blizzard, but that's just me). The Dev teams at Bioware are also very responsive to their fans. The dev team for Baldur's Gate 2 maintains a strong presence on the Interplay message boards for that game, and they take a lot of feedback from the users of the board into account during the development cycle.
Neverwinter Nights is being developed by Bioware, and it will be very similar to a MMORPG, except that individuals will be able to run their own servers on which they can set up persistant worlds they have created. It's feasible that Bioware could be doing something like this (a MMORPG) with the Star Wars RPG.
On a side note, check out www.teambg.com to see some people who have done wonderful things hacking the Infinity Engine. They've managed to release their own expansion pack for Baldur's Gate, without access to any of the development tools that Bioware has. TeamBG created their tools using a lot of hex editting, and VB (don't laugh, their programs are very good). Go take a look at it, very cool.
Moller
It's actually somewhat irrelevant. Episode I and II are about 30 - 50 years apart. So it's either 4000 years before Episode I or 4030 - 4050 years before. Nitpick all you want, but I don't distinguish much between 2000 BC and 1950 BC.
Good luck with both your pets, I hope the one with cancer isn't in pain. I used to be a vet tech and have done some writing on animal death and euthanasia, so if you need to talk about anything, let me know.
-Kahuna Burger
...will work for Chick tracts...
GameMaster: *Rolling a d20 die, checking the result* Why, you DO sense a disturbance in the Force!
I'd like to GM one of these games, if only to say those lines.
Tongue-tied and twisted, just an earth-bound misfit, I
Learning to fly, Pink Floyd.
Gamespot have just put up a short preview of this game here, amongst other stuff it is claiming this game will be released on PS2, Dreamcast and Mac along with the PC.
maybe if hemos would read the articles before commenting on them ...
For the game, LucasArts and BioWare are creating an entirely original storyline set some four thousand years before Star Wars: Episode I.
-Sigs are for losers.
Er, a throwaway line?
Perhaps some of the books talk more about clone wars, or the stormtroopers being clones, (are SW books cannonical?) but everything I recal of the actual movies supports the idea that biotech was not a concern. Come on, even when Luke lost his hand, he built a robotic one to replace it, even though it reminded him of Vader's transformation and scared him. Why not just grow a new one?
And even if you assume the same tech level, the same social structures lasting for millenia? Its their universe, they can say that if they want to, but why not be believable instead? What would they be losing?
-Kahuna Burger
...will work for Chick tracts...
No more Jar Jar!
That kinda sucks. I'd test it for free. Course they would probably have some issues with that, but there must be something that could be done. Neverwinter Nights sounds like it could be an incredible game. It would be tragic if it wasn't released for Linux as well.
It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds. - Captain Hammer
Will the game use the AD&D rules like Icewind Dale, Baldur's Gate, etc.? That would be extremely cool if it does. I want a +2 Lightsaber!
-Antipop
Who on earth is Donna, and why will she be holding her breath?
-- Dr. Eldarion --
The engine's there, graphically I'm sure LucasArts has digitized art laying around - what more needs to be done?
- I don't care if they globalize against free speech. All my best free thoughts are done in my head.
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...and boned up one your reading skills...
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'one'?
The irony is killing me.
- Jeff A. Campbell
- VelociNews (http://www.velocinews.com)
- Jeff
Who's Donna and why should she hold her breath?
Keeping
I know that a troll started this, but I've thought about creationism vs evolution a lot, and here is my conclusion:
The bible says "When I was a child, I spake as a child. Now that I have grown, I put away childish things." The bible has a very simple (childlike) explanation of how the world came into existence. We now have a more detailed theory that does not deny the existence of God (grown). There is no reason to think that now, with our understanding of genetics and mutations, that we can't understand some of the methods that God used. The bible didn't elaborate on those methods because none of the people of the time could have understood them.
My random thoughts.
Hopefully this will just be a much better done version of the episode 1 game. Imagine a Final fantasy style Star Wars RPG!!!!!! first post?
.: 2+2 = PI SQRT(1+N)
I thought that Verant, makers of EverCamp, were supposed to make the Startwars MMRPG?
This RPG is entirlely sepearte from the MMORPG in development with Verant, you can see the LucasArts press release here (since they don't seem to link to it themselves anymore), you can find more info about it on my webpage about SW On-line.
Meanwhile the Star Wars Combine is creating a totally free Star Wars on-line RPG, it's well worth a look.
I heard they are redesigning the main character. His name is Luke "Troubled Soul" Lionhart and he will use a light saber that is the size of a giant meat cleaver. Also they are using a completely different magic system that sucks where you are forced to spend too much time drawing "the force" from bad guys, and then are filling in the games' gaps with hours upon hours of slow, boring cg scenes where you are forced to sit and do absolutely nothing for a long time. Also, the nemesis will a knockoff of the last game they had, but he will suck even more. Oh wait... this isn't Star Wars I am taking about. I got this confused with the new Final Fantasy
"The 85 I fear they don't got a clue."
I like my sarcasm and cynicism as subtle as the next guy, but how veiled is this? jeez...i thought i was going to have to cut&paste my standard "you're a redneck piker and you should be raped by a huge convict" speech, but then i noticed that it was funny. i dont know why i replied to this.
"They think its sexist"
"They think its sexist"
"Well, whats wrong with being sexy?"
As such, if indeed BioWare is responsible for a SW RPG, I would be willing to bet that it will make Lucas' own storytelling endeavors suck in comparison. Screw SW Ep. 2... THIS is the SW fix we have been waiting for.
Plus, we can hope they put Jar Jar in the game, cause in that case, we'll probably be able to chop his head off and cackle in glee.
I remember reading in a Wizard (comic guide) news article that there would be three new Star Wars movies, one released in 1996, the second 1998, the third 2000. And that the next three would follow 2002, 2004, 2006.
That was in '93, though.
So we'll see this game in.. um.. 2010.. when computers are obsolete.
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when the rain comes, they run and hide their heads. they might as well be dead.
Information on that time period has been covered by Dark Horse Comics in their 'Tales of the Jedi' comic book series. That's about all we have from that period to work with. (Yes, I am a Star Wars geek.)
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Brazil has decided you're cute.
I guess the good part would be playing as Jar-Jar and then finding new ways to commit suicide.
I'd rather have someone respond than be modded up.
I wonder if this effects the deal LucasArts made with Sony/Verant, makers of EverQueer, to do something similar. Here's the press release.
We must respect evil, and we must make evil respect us.
loev,
Axel
mhm23x3, alt.fan.karl-malden.nose
I've even got my name picked out already. Heh heh.
where's that lucasarts we used to know, the one that produced TIE fighter? if this is an episode one game, it better not be as bad as the other ones...this is just the type of star wars games we've been waiting for (although if it was more action/rpg than item/points management it would be cool, but I've never played baldur's gate so I'm not sure of the format). lucasarts arguably hasn't had a really good game in a few years...here's their chance
----- DevLibrary ( http://devlib.virtualave.net ) -----
I hope they'll allow you to build up your midi-clorian levels to invincible proportions the way you can build up your characters in diablo or Final Fantasy type games so you can go around throwing guys by waving your hands.
The man who trades freedom for security does not deserve nor will he ever receive either. - Benjamin Franklin
Well I've fucked a few american chicks lately and they were really fucked up, in a consistent way: victimized, and they expected to deserve everything.
Friend, Baldurs gate game out years after Diablo was released. Frankly, it is often touted that Diablo CREATED the 'action-rpg' and thus brought
BioWare the market in which to create their games!
By stating "Baldurs Gate stomped Diablo into the ground" is rather misleading. IMHO it would be more accurate to say "Bioware infused the action-RPG genere with ingenuity"
Aside from all this, Bioware is still a great company and should prove to make an Excellent Star Wars RPG that fans will be proud of.
And, like other MUDs, you only get out of it what you put into it. if you spend all your time sitting around, complaining about this MOB not spawning, do you really think you're going to enjoy yourself?
or, on the other hand, you can attempt to meet people - go adventuring - and explore the game that was created for you. just like MUDs, you only get to see what the programmers thought was really cool by spending some time at exploring. and just like MUDs, they can quickly get boring if you don't interact (or don't enjoy interacting) with other human beings.
out of curiosity, what do you consider to be a "very good MUD"?
-lw
Mods: Disagreeing with me != my post Offtopic / Flamebait.
World without hate or war, invaded. Tragic?
After the game comes out and people start modifying it. How about adding a 'hot grits' item so that all the people who love to talk about it on here can actually go live out their greatest fantasies through this game instead of posting about it.
The man who trades freedom for security does not deserve nor will he ever receive either. - Benjamin Franklin
And, as i've noted before, you only get out of any game what you put into it. if you expect to be wowed and amazed sitting around - get real.
as for the quests, many of them are incredibly done, especially the long Kunark ones. "little or no information"? they tell you what they want - do you really expect the quest to be a shopping list, detailed down to letter? how would that be any fun, if you didn't need to *quest* for a thing?
as for game bugs, they are few and far between. i've been playing for nearly a year now, and i've never had any experiences like the first you detailed above. zone crashes don't cause loss of equipment - you probably died when the zone crashed, and you corpse had all of your equipment. GMs can't do anything about "general loss of equipment", because once it leaves your person, they have no idea wether you sold it, dropped it, or destroyed it. and yeah, they could go by your world - but then they'd have to go by everyone's word, and most people just aren't that honest.
yeah, EQ has some bugs. no game is perfect. if you get hung up on the small stuff, you'll never enjoy yourself.
As for Episode I, after being a hardcore star wars fan since I saw the original trillogy, i am greatly saddened by the fact that episode I was aimed at 6 year olds.
-mike
Mods: Disagreeing with me != my post Offtopic / Flamebait.
World without hate or war, invaded. Tragic?
Qel-Droma will win
Death from a +3 saber
RPGs are cool
You mean to say that you are conceding the possibility of it taking 3970 years for Anakin Skywalker to become an 8 year old boy? I guess that means that his mom has been around for at least that long as well... And since he said he's been a slave for most or all of his life, man, that's got to suck. Living on Tatooine for almost 4000 years as a slave! No wonder he wanted to get out of there so fast...
The Englishman Who Came to a Concert
Wow. I'm really sorry to hear about Elvis's cancer. I've never had a chronically ill pet. The part about the Dachsie was pretty sad too. I'm glad you found a good companion for Elvis, though. Separation anxiety can really make a mess of a good animal.
Hope you enjoy your family member.
And, just so you can go away feeling better, Petrified Linux-Port Natalie Grit Cluster.
You never really know how close to the edge you can go until you fall off.
Eeeagh! A role-playing game based on Microsoft's click-wrap licenses! Quick, roll a save versus crushing monopoly!
It's actually somewhat irrelevant. Episode I and II are about 30 - 50 years apart. So it's either 4000 years before Episode I or 4030 - 4050 years before. Nitpick all you want, but I don't distinguish much between 2000 BC and 1950 BC.
No, the question was: is it before both episodes, or is it only before Episode IV (i.e. between I and IV). As you say, the difference between 4000 and 4350 years is pretty irrelevant, so it clearly is before both episodes, so Hemos (not Ant, my apologies) obviously hadn't read the press release before posting that question.
Sailing over the event horizon
Well, they sure have enough time to work on it... Hopefully they'll work on the Mac/"other" OS ports concurrently. It'd be nice if they were all released at the same time.
Hopefully they'll take a lot of the story/lore from the Star Wars: The Roleplaying Game books... those were very cool, and were excellent reading.
The Tales Of The Jedi stories were cool, I liked the comics... that will make for some excellent game play.
A Star Wars timeline
personally, i'm excited (though not horribly) by the idea of a not massivly multiplayer star wars RPG (the one being made by verant is MM). i for one used to enjoy playing the old PnP Star Wars RPG from west end games. i think it is much more likely that this game will use a custom designed ruleset than relying on AD&D 3rd Ed. ad&d wasn't designed for that kind of thing. if bioware makes the game, it should undeniably rock. they have yet to make a bad game, and they are masterful at making both the technology (Infinity Engine/ the beautiful MDK2 engine/ the revolutionaty Neverwinter Nights engine) and the content to make great games. on a side not, Bioware did not make Icewind Dale. Interplay's Black Isle Studios (even better RPG developers in my opinion) did.
Molog
So Linus, what are we doing tonight?
So Linus, what are we going to do tonight?
The same thing we do every night Tux. Try to take over the world!
Actually, that was Hemos's comment, not Ant's. Read more carefully before you flame the wrong person. ;)
D'oh. Apologies to Ant, and a particularly big "you suck" to Hemos, then, who really should have known better :-)
Sailing over the event horizon
The Old Republic and the Jedi are separate entities as far as I know, so Obi-wan's statement does not cover the OR. The Jedi Council does not seem to have any direct authority over the senate, nor does the opposite seem to be the case
:P
As for the game stretching into Episode I... A game covering 4000 years?? Must be the sequel to Civilization or something?
-17028
Bioware, The History
First off, let's take a look at Bioware: Bioware was the brain child of two Alberta doctors who decided for a variety of reasons to go after a dream founding the game development company we now know. Originally, Dr. Greg Zeschuk and Dr. Ray Muzyka intended on designing a fairly detailed encompassing RPG which had absolutely no relation to AD&D but still held a fantasy like aura. Later, when Black Isle and Interplay became associated with Bioware, the developers suddenly had access to Interplay's aging AD&D licences which had not been used to develop a title of wide success. From this was born the new Infinity Engine and their second title: Baldur's Gate. However, by this time Bioware had already aquired a sizable and strong development team which had experience as a cohesive unit from the development of Shattered Steel. Furthermore they had already established an annimation division which gave Bioware a specialized resource: talented exclusive annimators and modellers. Baldur's Gate was released as their first major title earning them much acclaim and respect as developers. This in term earned them the rights to MDK producing the Omen engine and the suceeding title, MDK 2.
What can be drawn from this is that Bioware is not a single title and single technology company. They are versatile and quite capable of producing a wide variety of games in many differing styles and genres. Baldur's Gate started as a non-AD&D RPG not using a D20 system. While it is indeed a AD&D game and was widely influced by the developer's experiences with pen and paper AD&D 2nd ed. the product should not be taken as the direct result of the AD&D franchise. Furthermore, they proved their ability to produce specific game engines for a widely differing genres with the creation of Shattered Steel, Infinity and Omen. These engines share very little in common but are all well done solid packages. If anything, Bioware's experience with franchises demonstrates an ability to comprehend their subject matter and produce original material which follows in not only the tradition of the franchise, but also with the concept and principles: they know what the point of their subject matter is. In this, one can trust that Bioware will produce a title fitting of Star Wars. Their Star Wars title will be a Star Wars game to the core.
Bioware, Preferences of Design
Bioware also has shown a definite preference for design spaces without too many constraints. In Baldur's Gate they choose the least defined area they could find in TSR's Forgotten Realms which allowed them to create as much original material as possible. With MDK 2, the plot only holds basic restrictions in terms of design without any specific problems such as well defined areas (this place must look like this, etc). This holds true with the new SW RPG -- set in the distant past Bioware has a lot of room to move around in. In a way this also helps alleviate any presure to have a title that falls to stigmas... not all Dwarves hate Elves, Elves don't have to be wizards or rangers, not everyone in the Battletech universe is a Mechwarrior and in Star Wars not everyone uses the Force. It is a fair assumption that the title will not be the Jedi versus the non-Jedi Force wielding bad guys -- but such is enivitable to some extent.
Bioware also tends to develop highly personalized titles. By this I mean that their titles have always been from a close perspective in terms of game narration -- Baldur's Gate was a small party of 6 or less, MDK 2 was played as one of the three protagonists and Shattered Steel was first person in all respects. I doubt they were choosen to develop an MMPOG or any similar system. Even Neverwinter Nights is a party based experience even though it has a target of approximately 64 players per server. At the core all of their games are personal stories of greate proportions. This is what their SW title will almost definitely be like... it's also a reason why their is limited competition between Verant's SW RPG and Bioware's: they are targetted at different audiences.
The Engine
It was announced that this product will be using a new engine. When Bioware announced Neverwinter Nights it was said to be using the Omen engine which was very heavily modified from MDK 2. Subsequently this will not be an Omen derivative as some have conjectured. With the experience of Omen under the belt as well as an RPG adaptation of the engine, it is fairly certain that the engine will be 3D with a more freeform nature than in Neverwinter Nights (you cannot look up or follow from odd perspectives, etc).
Addressing the cross-platform release of the game (console, PC, Mac), I do not believe there should be any doubt that they will deliver. With the simulataneous parallel development of Neverwinter Nights and the previous development of MDK 2, it should be fairly obvious that they are more than capable of developing on all the mentioned platform proficiently.
D20 and RPGs
Just to have it clear at the beginning: it is not certain whether or not Bioware will be using WotC D20 system as seen in their version of the Star Wars RPG or a new statistics system.
Many state that D20 isn't really suited for RPGs and fast paced RPGs because it is tends to involve quite a great more dice rolls and general statistics than a D6 system. However, this does not hold true for computer games at all -- computing a D20 combat sequence is arbitrary. Furthermore, the user can be completely abstracted from the entire statistics systems. AD&D was designed as a highly versatile statistical system which was easily understood primarily based upon 5 percent segments. In AD&D 3rd edition which is very similar to D20, the system has been further generalized providing specifics on handling non-RP situations which was not associated with the fantasy genre. Basically the D20 system provides a set of combat, action and skill rules which can be applied to anything which can be reasonably segmented into 5 percent slice with results having the acompanying degree of error.
It seems ridiculous to consider a +5 light sabre or a 48D8 Sith lord, but it is similarly odd to consider the same situation in terms of statistics. All things being considered, it is just a finite segmented manner of representing statistics rather than developing an overly complex smoothly progressing system in terms of the base units.
Many of the restrictions which are associated with AD&D and the D20 system do not really exist in the computer world. In pen and paper a lot of situations and environments where non-RP elements came into play were very difficult to represent for an unassisted DM. It was not that the rule set did not allow certain actions or environments to look like a certain fashion, it was more that the DM was either not imaginative or capable of generating, tracking and handling the required information.
Consider the timeframe, effort and resources availible to a D20 computer game versus a pen and paper version. A developer spends 2 to 5 years developing a single title which encompasses what is relatively a short timeframe in terms of play time. This same developer has a whole host of designers, artists, developers and SQA working on the project as well as the direct creative assistance of the developers of the original system. A DM, on the other hand has himself and the rule books. It's no particular surprize that many DMs fell into the simple way out in creating almost out of box situations. Without the lengthy combat roles and statistics checks as arbitrary and the time and man hours to create a vibrant environment, I find that the D20 completely acceptable.
Game Play
Currently the game is being developed as a single player RPG, but it is fairly certain that a multiplayer element will enter in upon the game. given the shorter development cycle than Neverwinter Nights and the stipulation of a new engine, it is doubted that the RPG will be of the versatile scale of Neverwinter Nights. It is not particularly hard to add in a party like element such as in Baldur's Gate or even cooperative DOOM.
Just as an offhand note, the game play doesn't neccesarily have to be at a slow pace or have an abstracted method of control as in AD&D and many other RPGs. It could just as well involve much more action whether using a high level approach with general commands or a low level approach with more fine control in terms of actions. Even if they decided to use D20 this could be implemented...
As for everything else, who knows? Here's a bit of reference material where you can get more information:
Bioware Corp
Press Release (Bioware) (Lucasarts)
The Making of a Monster: Creating Baldur's Gate (CGDC 2000 Presentation)
Shadow's of Amen Message Board
Icewind Dale Message Board
Neverwinter Nights Message Board
Slashdot on D20
Open Gaming Foundation
Ryan Dancey Interview
WotC Interview with Ryan Dancey
WotC Star Wars RPG
Eric Noah's Unofficial AD&D 3rd Edition News
Basic Clarifications
This product is being developed by Bioware: not Lucasarts or Black Isle or Interplay
It will feature a new engine not based on Omen
The game is currently being developed as single player
It is unconfirmed whether or not the game will use D20 or not, D20 is currently being used in the yet to be released Star Wars RPG from WotC
Molog
So Linus, what are we doing tonight?
So Linus, what are we going to do tonight?
The same thing we do every night Tux. Try to take over the world!
Read David Brin's Uplift books to see how something like this might work.
Freedom: "I won't!"
Now THERE's a conspiracy theory. And look, you made the 'karma mafia' junk stop, too.
If you read the other posts, you might have noticed the wise person stating Lucas Arts' deal with Verant was to create a MMORPG - like Everquest. This deal is with BioWare - the folks who produced Baldur's Gate and Icewind Dale.
Um... I'm sorry you don't like EQ, and you had bad experiences with their Guides / GMs. I've had nothing but good interaction between them. And frankly, I think EQ is one of the best games out there. Lucas Arts - and probably George Lucas - agrees with me enough that they are allowing Verant to develop under the rather closely guarded Star Wars liscense.
As for 'ruining his good name', I guess you don't remember Episode I, or the tens of thousands dissapointed Star Wars fans.
-lw
Mods: Disagreeing with me != my post Offtopic / Flamebait.
World without hate or war, invaded. Tragic?
Heh. Nevermind.
Don't you actually read the articles you post about? It spells out as clear as day that the new game will be set before Episode 1.
/. -- lack of attention from the senior people. You can't expect quality journalism from your staff if you don't even take the time to do it yourself. :(
I would expect this sort of goof from a junior staffer, not one of the senior people. Shame on you! I don't think it's too much to ask that you read and really understand an article before you post a synopsis/blurb about it.
This isn't a major crime, but it is sloppy as hell and symptomatic of what is ailing
And in case anybody's wondering, Icewind Dale is far better than Diablo II :).
My legal education, in nifty podcast format
Thanks for clearing this up. If BioWare's storytelling talents are to be judged on the strength of Baldur's Gate alone, then I still have faith in whatever they intend to put out. Black Isle, however, takes the crown for being the most innovative design studio out there.
Hehehe you'd kinda expect people to read posts before they flame them to eh?
Paying $10 a month to log on to over-taxed and buggy servers is a joke as it is, but then when they finally made a tiny expansion to the game world like they promised back during the initial release, they had the gall to charge their regular customers, who already shelled out $60 plus monthly fees for what is really just a MUD with pictures.
Screw EQ. Go Worldforge team!
Information wants to be anthropomorphized.
-Legion
I don't know about all that. I agree with you about Jedi Power Battles. It sucked ass, but I did enjoy the Star Wars side scroll series on SNES. They weren't fantastic but enjoyable nonetheless. Well that's my two cents.
It's just a graphical MUD, and not even a very good MUD. You spend all your time waiting around monster spawn points trying to build up your character so that you can go wait around bigger monster spawn points. What's the point?
It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds. - Captain Hammer
Whoops, yeah, I meant I and IV. I should be careful decrying ;)
...posted by Gamespot. It supposedly will be using a brand new 3D engine and will be designed for the PC with possible conversions for the Mac, the Dreamcast and the PlayStation 2. It's also supposed to be, at least as it stands now, a single-player game.
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Even as you read this, your pants are strangling your loins! Aaa!
Just thought I'd clear up some confusion amongst a lot of people. Icewind Dale is not a Bioware game. It, and Planescape: Torment, were produced by Black Isle Studios with the Bioware Infinity engine. However, Baldur's Gate 1-2, and NeverWinter Nights are indeed games produced under the now famous label. Sorry about the tangent, just wanted to clear that up.
How cool would it be if the game is released with all the options of the new NWN engine in place? Since they are placing the game approximately 4000 years before ANH, they could be giving the time frame and the story lines to the fans.
Having seen the ease of use involved in making fan based missions in NWN, this could result in an plethora of wonderful fan based, Star Wars stories! This could blow the EQ Star Wars model away!
yep.. you got me.
Them: For the game, LucasArts and BioWare are creating an entirely original storyline set some four thousand years before Star Wars: Episode I. The ancient era is dominated by an epic struggle between the Jedi and the evil Sith.
I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say they're talking way before the current batch of movies, unless ol Darth of the original trilogy is really old...
DO NOT LEAVE IT IS NOT REAL
real-world ship date is supposed to be 2002
And the day after it ships, someone will be up on Ebay, selling their Boba Fett character for a $1000 starting bid.
I've been cringing ever since I heard the initial rumors about Verant being involved. MOstly because, while EQ does fill a certain need, the one thing it succeeds above all else is in being the most boring game ever created. Never has so little been accomplished in a game in such a long amount of time.
Methinks that George L. (Initials reserved to protect anonymity) got tired of waiting for an Orc Warlord to spawn and figured that there had to be someone who could make a faster game.
--sugarman--
OK, your party of six characters (the Jedi, the Wookiee, the Smuggler, the Princess, the Yappy Droid, and the Short Droid) walks into a 10" x 10" room. In the room are six Stormtroopers. Roll for initiative.
Ten minutes later...
Through clever strategy and a great deal of space-bar-pausing, you have defeated the Stormtroopers. After searching the bodies, you find a Blaster +1, a Green Key, and 87 gold pieces. Your party turns the corner and are surprised by two Wampas. Roll for initiative.
--
www.kitchengeek.com -- Nosh for
Being that I live in Edmonton and work in the IT industry I think it is fantastic that local boys (Bioware) have struck what should be a lucrative deal with Lucas Arts. Deals like this can help a cities industry enormously, and believe I could use more money ;)
and to those who wonder why I simply say...
Every time one is announced I wait with much anticipation, but when it arrives I am yet again greeted with much dissapointment. In my oppinion, there has yet to be a really great star wars game ever to truely live up to the star wars name (I am mainly refering to the console based games, i thought the tie fighter and dark forces series were excellent).
Why does it seem that the games always have so much potential but fail to achive it, as if the programmers got bored with the idea and quit half way through it. Jedi Power battles is a perfect example, that game looked so unbelievably cool, wandering around, slashing the crap out of droids with you saber. When I played it, though, it fell into the console game trend, it SUCKED. The control was absolutely terrible, as with most of the console releases.
Does any one agree with me that the Star wars console games never live up to there potential? This doesnt include just the latest, I think even the SNES releases were lacking. The only game that ever really hit it with me on a console was Shadows of the Empire for the 64...That was a truly great game.
admit defeat, live in decline, be the victim of our own design
Molog
So Linus, what are we doing tonight?
So Linus, what are we going to do tonight?
The same thing we do every night Tux. Try to take over the world!
Hey Enoch Root/Signal 11, FUCK YOU. I am really getting sick of you trolling your own messages with that damn "karm mafia" junk. Do you really need all that attention?
Do not misunderstand me... they are still developing for Linux as well. However, the Linux version may not see the light of day.
Oceania has always been at war with Eastasia.
I thought the Everquest people were doing a StarWars RPG already? Judging by how stinky EQ is, I really hope someone gets to do this.
I'm impressed, they've managed to hit about ever area of gaming with a Starwars title.
Jeez.. aside from the last 2 paragraphs, the whole thing was ripped almost directly from a real review of Episode I by an extremely conservative religious group.
I'm not sure where the rest of it came from, or if he just made it up, but since this is obviously either an attempt at humor or an attempt at trolling, we should all just read it, and either snicker or shake our heads and be on our way.
It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds. - Captain Hammer
Pretty cool stuff - the setting of the game is going to be prior to the Star Wars movies. I don't know whether that means prior to Episode I or Episode IV, but the real-world ship date is supposed to be 2002. So, donna hold your breath.
According to a story I read on Blues News the game takes place 4000 years before Episode IV (or for the very pedantic 3970ish years before Episode I)
DrLunch.com The site that tells you what's for lunch!
..perhaps the Neverwinter Nights -engine.
If so, the chances of a Linuxport would be rather
high, as Neverwinter Nights is developed for Linux as well as windows.
It has always seemed to me that a lot of work go
to waste creating 3d-engines. Only a few gets
reused.
Sounds good, but who's Donna, and why are you trying to kill her?
AJS
Quite possibly this article is a troll. However, seeing as it has attracted some nibbles...
First off, I take issue with the fact that you describe youself as "a moral family." All families are moral-- and which morals are passed onto the other members of the family, depends on the particular family...
As for Star Wars, Mr Luucas is telling a story. This story reflcets Mr Lucas's ideas about the worl, including no doubt, mant of his morals. In that respect, the Star Wars films are "moral" films.
Some might argue that the very values you seek to dissuade you children from inhariting, such as an appreciation for the fantastic-- are the very stuff of most children's literature, and not coincidentally, the very subjects that lead children from fuctional literacy into bibliophilia.
Many of the themes developed in Mr. Lucas's works are derived from common themes in Greek, Roman, and Hebreic mythology. The incidents you so blandly describe as "several different aliens working together" refelect a common core in literature stretching back perhaps thousands of years.
However, I digress. You obviously are not familiar with the games Black Isle has thus far produced. In Baldur's Gate and Torment, characters can buy various alcoholic beverages, and there are plenty of prostitutes. In Fallout (1&2), the drugs are stronger, and I am given to understand that one of the moneymaking opertunities in Fallout 2 involves working in a brothel (either as a pimp or as a prostitute) and the choice is more dependent on ones sexual identity rather than on one's chromosome. In Baldur's Gate and Torment, the level of bloodshed is quite high, and you can play as an evil character.
Indeed, in LucasArt's Dark Forces II, you could succesfully complete the games as a "dark jedi." (Read: "evil bastard"). In addition, the so called "Golden Age of the Sith", which I assume is the time period covered by this planned RPG, involves a certain amout of moral ambiguity, as evidenced by some of the comic books.
Even the movies welcome this kind of moral questioning. In Return of the Jedi, the theme that, I think, redeems the movie, from being too simplistic is the confronation between Luke and Vader. Both characters prove themselve to be fallible: Vader ultimately embraces the Light Side, as Luke embraced (part of) the Dark.
As for unspeakable violence-- perhaps you might be more comfortable with a family film such as "Reservior Dogs."
I forgive you for being confused, Siggy.
I am not an idiot. Please use my name to email me.
"That's right, I'm quoting myself."
-Upsilon
I didn't post that comment :). Hemos did.
Ant(Dude) @ Quality Foraged Links (AQFL.net) & The Ant Farm (antfarm.ma.cx / antfarm.home.dhs.org).
The Neverwinter Nights engine is nothing like
the infinity engine.
The infinity engine is 2d, while the engine
for NN is fully 3d. It is as I've managed to figure out based on the MDK2 engine,
which is about as far from the infinity engine as possible.
well your point is well taken but your timing is off unless you are refering to the differance between I and IV. I and II are only a differnce of 5-10 years
While the article is very clear on this point For the game, LucasArts and BioWare are creating an entirely original storyline set some four thousand years before Star Wars: Episode I.
I think it is sad when slashdot readers post without actually reading the article, but it is pathetic when the poster doesn't even read it!
-DCookie
My SIG is a SG-552 Commando
Ummm, Ant asks: "the setting of the game is going to be prior to the Star Wars movies. I don't know whether that means prior to Episode I or Episode IV". Its not hard, Ant. According to the press release that you linked to:
LucasArts and BioWare are creating an entirely original storyline set some four thousand years before Star Wars: Episode I.
I think that answers your question.
Is it really too much to expect people who submit stories to actually read the links they are submitting? I guess it is...
Sailing over the event horizon
4000 Years before Episode 1: "For the game, LucasArts and BioWare are creating an entirely original storyline set some four thousand years before Star Wars: Episode I. The ancient era is dominated by an epic struggle between the Jedi and the evil Sith. "
I have some reservations about a Star Wars RPG. The movies were morally ambiguous at best, and it's probably safe to assume that this same ambiguity would find its way into a game based on the movies. The concern that I have as a parent, then, is that the game is properly rated and labeled, and placed in locked shelf displays if need be. It doesn't take much effort to protect American families from material like this, and I for one hope that video game vendors are up to the task.
The Phantom Menace provided many challenge to moral families. Many parents, including myself, went and saw the movie before I took my family to it, and I was left struggling with many questions. Should I allow my children to see this movie? Menace had many examples of objectionable material, such as copious statue nudity, impudence in the form of a small boy refusing to listen to his mother's command to go to bed, and an incredibly offensive subplot revolving around a virgin birth. Throw in elements of magic and the occult and you're left with a movie that is in most ways no better than the Harry Potter books.
In the end, I allowed them to see the movie. I did bring along earplugs and eyepatches that were used to protect my children from the movie's more dangerous moments. Still, I can't help but wonder if I did the right thing. Some of the ideas in the movie were downright dangerous. For example, the final battle scene that had several different races of aliens and humans working together to destroy the Trade Federation was a pretty thinly-veiled endorsement of the sort of liberal multiculturalism that is being forced upon Americans today. And the level of violence was nearly unspeakable.
In the end, I guess that Lucas should probably be allowed to make this game. I won't be buying it and my kids won't be playing it, but we cannot forget that the end result of this exercise is supposed to be wealth creation for an American private corporation, so from that perspective it is a great thing. Let's just not get carried away, okay?
I believe BlackIsle Entertainment developed Icewind Dale using Bioware's infinity engine, not Bioware themselves.
I just got this link for an Episode II trailer.
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IanO
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Objects in Mirror are Losing!
Set about four thousand years before Star Wars: Episode I, the game's story will focus on the ancient struggles between the Jedi and the evil Sith. Fans of the Dark Horse Sith series of comics will note that this period in Star Wars history has already been richly developed by the comic books. However, this game will have an entirely new story that currently does not involve any of the characters from the comic books. In this period, the Jedi Knights form a huge and far-reaching order that protects a multitude of planets in a vast republic, as well as unaffiliated, outlying systems. There is no monolithic evil overwhelming the galaxy, as in classic Star Wars, but the Sith, the predecessors of Darth Vadar and the Dark Jedi, are spreading their dark influence.
Rapid Nirvana
The press release states that the game will take place some 4,000 years before Episode 1, in an era dominated by Jedi vs. Sith warfare.
This Gamespot report also has some more info, and Bioware has stated that it will use a modified version of the Neverwinter Nights engine.
The MMORPG that Verant is developing is certain to be very different from Bioware's game. They'll probably be about as different as... Everquest and Baldur's Gate.
"I live in a world of make-believe, with faeries and leprechauns and tiny little frogs with funny hats."