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World's First Tree-sitting Weblog
An anonymous reader writes "Amit Asaravala over at Wired News has an interesting article up about the tree-sitters in Humboldt County. Apparently a bunch of tech activists from the Indymedia Center are setting the tree-sitters up with an 802.11b network so that they can blog about all the logging going on up there. Seems like a pretty interesting way to use technology to help the environment, which isn't something you see everyday."
I thought people like that were anti-technology. I guess they're afraid of burning fossil fules or something, I don't know. But why would they want Internet access if they don't like technology?
Insert offensive troll-style sig here. Please mod or respond appropriately.
Only terrorists use 802.11!
that the loggers use Dells and all the tree sitters use Macs. What could that mean? I'll check back in 24.
Where does the power for this technology come from? Does it use any plastic (oil)? Any metal (mining)? Any manuals included (wood)?
Hypocrites.
BC
...so he's protesting logging, and logging the experience.
Good judgment comes from experience.
Experience comes from bad judgment.
how will he spell his scream as he falls out of the tree to his death
Hey, as long as their not on welfare they can sit in a friggin' log for all I care. What I would like to know is where they got the platform that she is sitting on. I assume it is made out of wood. Reminds me of the guy who broke a window at a fur coat store in Manhattan. The news anchor was making fun of him because he was wearing a leather jacket and leather shoes.
...from the hmm-it's-getting-boring-up-here-with-no-internet-a ccess dept. :)
ClutterMe.com - easiest site creation on the Net. Just click and type.
If these people dislike logging so much why don't they simply wait until the fire season and start playing with matches.
I doubt they have an extension cord running through the forest to their tree. They must go through a lot of batteries.
FoundNews.com - get paid to blog.,
"Blog" is a stupid word. You know that, right? Okay then.
One of these days, you know, someone's gonna come along with evidence that 802.11 causes birds to fly into trees and buildings.
Do you think that'll stop the tree-climbing environauts from using it?
Of course not!
Ed R.Zahurak
You know, oblivion keeps looking better every day.
"And if you go up in the tree, you can't come down for anything, not a phish concert, not even for Burning Man"
At least now they can communicate a bit more with the world while sitting in the trees. Though one has to wonder how they recharge their laptops? Those would need to be some pretty long extension cords.
It was 1 Funny when I saw it. Guess it takes all kinds
As opposed to what? All of the really exciting stuff going on in your parent's basement? Since when have weblogs been interesting? Quite hypocritical for someone who probably plays games all day to rip on someone who is trying to help save the environment.
My beliefs do not require that you agree with them.
They are not as clueless as you are, that's for sure. Chopping down a large part of a forest will destroy the habitat for animals and other species living there, some of which may be very rare.
If you would have read their weblog you would have known more about why they are protesting.
Trees, eh? I'd love to see a Beow... oh, never mind.
I'm not very good at making decisions... Or am I?
I wonder how much polution the power companies are producing to give them the electricity they need to do this.
http://www.contrast.org/treesit/
I'm not a Karma Whore!!!!
"Seems like a pretty interesting way to use technology to help the environment, which isn't something you see everyday."
In helping the environment you mean they want the forests to remain as is and not evolve and keep the forests nice and tight so a fire will take everything out.
The evolution of a western United States forest doesn't stop at the large conifers, fires are supposed to clear out the conifers so the next phase of the forest continues.
We fight fires, so the forests remain coniferous. For the last few decades clear cutting has been replaced with selective cutting, but yahoos like these hippies want things to remain static. Well a forest of big pine bombs waiting to go off will just cause one hell of a fire someday and the trees will still be dead.
Bah to the hippies.
It's perfectly reasonable to question how many people will ever read these blogs (aside from those who are already fully on board the movement). It may be preaching to the choir, but it could also be used as an effective alert system to get "the choir" quickly to the site of illegal action.
I'm sure their will also be a couple members of the more mainstream alternative media (folks like Willamette Week, or even Harper's) who will spread some of the better stuff to the general public.
...Nothing interesting here. Just move along...
If you're blogging about logging,
While sitting in a tree,
Then the chances are,
You're a geek hippie.
Swaying in the branches,
Laptop in your hands,
No safety net to speak of,
Just a couple of rubber bands.
Be safe up in the treetops,
And please try not to fall,
Despite all that long hair,
You will not bounce at all.
Meow meow meow meow, meow meow meow meow...
Do you REALLY think that all the people who consider the earth's natural environment to be of intrinsic value are anti-technology and want to return us to the stone age?
I know many such people and almost all of them see technology as the solution for our environmental problems.
If adequate funding was given to clean energy sources then perhaps this dream could become reality. Of course, with GWII in power, oil buddies come first!
Dear Diary:
Had a grand ol time at Pooh Bear and Tiggers pajama party last evening. Things really rocked when the Country Bears stopped by and busted out some tunes. Ol Smokey really put a damper on things at the end though with the whole "only you can prevent forest fires" blog.
Heard about Bambi's mom. Real bummer, Grizzly Adams was really bent out of shape about it, going on and on about the damn recreational hunters.
And a tree fell yesterday. It didn't know I was watching, it made no noise.
"Seems like a pretty interesting way to use technology to help the environment, which isn't something you see everyday."
We'll let's see here newbie, Blockbuster now simply charges my credit card for late movies, and I think that's a stretch more interesting use of technology than stringing cable through the evergreens. And Donna, remember sitting in a forest writing a diary on logging is like camping out on Aisle 5 and writing about a Mom who chooses Jif over Peter Pan. It's gonna happen sweetheart. Now sweetie, I know your getting your birkenstocks all in a wad, but before you fill your all-natural-llama-hair sweater full of crocodile tears, let me remind you of something you may have forgotten between you double-lattes served in a styrene cup: specifically, the tree in which you now sit, his brother, though now long gone, is the very thing which allows us all to heat our homes, preserve our thoughts, and keep our bottoms clean.
"This isn't a study in computer science, its a study in human behavior"
Tree hugging with VR gloves is next?
Cheers, Nostrada
I don't think you can characterize anyone who is pro-environment as anti-technology. Not everyone on /. thinks corporations are the spawn of evil. I do wonder if many people who are pro-environment know all of the pollution that chip manufacturers produce... etc.
However, for all of you who will slam others for their inconsistencies, keep in mind that it is almost impossible to be 100% consistent. Just because someone has decided to choose one area to focus their energies on for some good, and isn't trying to be super(wo)man and fix everything, that should not nullify any truth that is in their message. That should not be pointed out to discredit them, or make you seem smarter. Every bit of good helps.
I don't understand why the logging companies just don't call in the police to remove these tree sitters. Why hasn't this been done yet?
Mac OS X and Windows XP working side by side to fight back the night.
Put simply: why on earth would someone who is against the logging of a forest be automatically anti-technology?
Donate free food here
Can't you see that everyone is buying station wagons?
I can just see the IM traffic..
Tr33Hugg3r: Hey man, can you toss me over another bag of granola? The last one fell on that park ranger's truck.
fukDaMan: sure, if you toss me another bag of soy nuts.
veggieChix0r: I'm cold, I want to go home.
1l0v3Tr335 : damn, my batteries in my MP3 player died, no more Bruce Cockburn for me..
Trolling is a art,
And if people don't post about Hezbollah using 802.11, then why is there stuff about Earth First?
b ui ld/forests/ecoterror.php?nnn=2
"Headwaters has been the scene of numerous clashes between Earth First environmentalists and Pacific Lumber."
Good, I hope someone gets a paddlin' by some loggers.
http://www.montanaforum.com/rednews/2002/08/29/
http://www.cdfe.org/ecoterror1.htm
ALF, Hezbollah, Earth First, Earth Liberation Front, Hamas, Violent Right to Life, WCC...
Terrorism is terrorism.
Maybe, instead of watching logging, they should read a science book or three, but then again all religions, be they god based or nature based, are resistant to science. Extreme environmentalism is just another religion.
It's all just ideology, and it degenerates the human mind to less than that of a crude robot. I've met these extreme enviro types. They have passed beyond reason and rationality and truth into a fantasy world. They should be in padded rooms getting help rather than in the tops of trees.
--- Ban humanity.
The laptop being used is made entirely of hemp.
Good quote, too many chars. Seriously, the slashdot 120 char limit sucks!
Maybe, I'm one of few, but I see the environment pretty much everyday.
Trying is the first step towards failure.
Right. Nobody's suggesting that *all* economic activity should stop on environmental grounds. What they're protesting is how and where logging happens.
Sure, we need wood and paper, but do we really need to cut down ancient redwood forests containing the tallest trees in the world? If managed correctly, tree farms can produce all the pulp that we need.
A car battery recharger powers the equipment
I'm not quite getting how this works. A car battery charger plugs into wall and thus charges the battery. But, since the activists are up a tree, how are they plugging in?
I'm assuming it means they're using a car-battery to charge it, but eventually that would run out of juice too.
I'm saying that I beleive everyone who is pro-environment is anti-technology. Just the extremists. Just like I don't think every Muslim wants to destroy America, just the extremists.
:)
Say what you will, but the tree sitters are the extremists.
Ok, I'll turn the Rush Limbaugh button off now.
Insert offensive troll-style sig here. Please mod or respond appropriately.
I suppose this article is timely - it is the season of fruitcakes after all! But seriously, isn't there something useful they can be doing with their time?
Maybe they could study architecture or engineering and come up with good, economical ways to build housing without lumber? Or do fundraising to purchase land to make reserves? Or research to find better, more environmentally friendly ways of logging? Perhaps if some lumber company choose to do old style logging (where you pick individual, strategic trees to remove instead of clear cutting leaving a good variety of trees and undergrowth), they could lobby to support such companies, despite higher lumber costs?
I dunno, just seems like there's more productive ways to spend your life, and still make a difference.
Slashdot: New for Hippies, Stuff that is irrelevant.
In a broader sense, I don't have a problem with these people making their statement... there's plenty of other trees to cut down, and frankly I'm glad they're out of the way.
It's when they start causing harm (sabotaging equipment and putting nails in trees) that they step over the line.
There's a Mercedes gap too. I want one and can't afford one, but it's not government's job to do anything about it.
If these people dislike logging so much why don't they simply wait until the fire season and start playing with matches.
You don't know how hard I had to resist moderating that as flamebait.
i found it interesting that a person who is willing to live in a tree for months on end to protest the destruction of that tree would use a car battery to power her computer. car batteries can leak, corrode, and are generally bad for the environment if they are not recycled properly. the process the make car batteries is, i'm sure, taxing on the environment as well.
perhaps she could use solar power, or muscle power to power the equipment. it just seems a half hearted effort to demonstrate, but to use a polluting device in the process.
http://github.com/gbook/nidb
Although I respect the strength of the resolve of all Sitters, I can only wonder at the effectiveness of this tactic? As I look out my office window, the company I work for is producing many millions of board feet of timber products. Each year, our production numbers increase and each year our environmental efforts increase to ensure the timber industry continues. Point is, the industry is *much* more responsible and sales continue to increase every year. Seems like the General Public isn't as worried that we are going to take a mower to the trees now that it is known that most of the industry has grown up.
I bet you wouldn't hear one single tree-hugger crying if all the mosquitoes in the world suddenly vanished.
Just one question, though: Where do the tree-huggers live when they aren't up a tree? Do they live in special "wood-free" houses?
"I'm just here to regulate funkiness."
Haven't any of you radical tree-huggers noticed something interesting about plants?
THEY GROW BACK!
You cut down trees, and a few years later they just grow back again. You cut down the new ones, and more grow back. Its called a renewable resource, like corn or wheat or apples, etc.
Up here in the NW we've had our logging industry devastated by these radical nutburgers. They got the media to play up the spotted owl issue to the point that logging was shut down all across the state. And now it ends up that there isn't anything special about their habitat -- they'll even nest in KFC signs.
But do they apologize for devastating and industry and putting thousands out of work? For raising the prices of the wood we build our houses with? No. They don't have to apologize -- they meant well, didn't they?
So please don't give me any of this helping the environment crap. It doesn't need any help from us.
Remember Lexington Green!
Do they really deserve protection? :)
Link here
Logging protester killed by falling tree, activist group says Published Aug. 26, 1998 Sacramento Bee
FORTUNA, Calif. (AP) -- An activist was struck in the head and killed by a falling tree Thursday afternoon while trying to block the logging of ancient redwoods on Pacific Lumber Co. land, Earth First! said.
The radical environmental group said David Chain, who uses the nom-de-guerre "Gypsy," was standing among redwoods marked for logging and trying to dissuade tree fellers when he was killed.
A fellow protester who fled the scene reported that the impact cracked open Chain's skull, said Earth First! co-founder Daryl Cherney, who said sheriff's deputies told the group he died at the scene.
"It's easy to get hit by a tree out there," said Cherney. "Even experienced activists or seasoned people -- it doesn't matter. One time I found myself in a hole and had to scramble out before the tree fell."
Pacific Lumber did not return telephone messages seeking comment. The Humboldt County Sheriff's department and the California Department of Forestry confirmed only that they were responding to a logging accident.
Earth First! had staged a 12-day protest against the logging of an ancient redwood stand along Grizzly Creek, in a ravine near the mill town of Fortuna, about 300 miles up the coast from San Francisco.
Eight of the group's activists had been arrested Wednesday on trespassing charges. Thursday was the first day the group engaged in the more aggressive tactic they call "cat and mouse," putting their bodies in harm's way.
The protesters say the logging, on land adjacent to a "lesser cathedral" of centuries-old redwoods purchased under the $495 million Headwaters Agreement, is destroying the protected habitat of the Marbled Murrelet, an endangered seabird that nests in the tops of the majestic trees.
CALREPORT | SACBEE HOME Copyright c The Associated Press Copyright c The Sacramento Bee
If we don't fight for ourselves no one will.
Being inconsistent because it is too difficult to be consistant isn't an excuse. If you are trying to figure out a way to solve the problem that the logging solves, without logging (that area) then you aren't being inconsistent, and using your energy wisely.
If you are merely pointing out problems, and criticising me, then you are wasting your energy, and not affecting any good. If you are doing this, and contributing more to the ultimate problem, then you are a hypocrite.
Complaining of a problem IS NOT working on a solution. If these people have a VIABLE solution to solve the problem that the logging solves, then that would be productive.
It is not contradictory to use technology to protect the environment. By and large, what these people are against is the thoughtless, greedy, UNSUSTAINABLE raping of earth's resources. Corporations have demonstrated themselves to be incapable of thought beyond the bottom line.
People like this are you and I. There's a saying: "If you're not outraged, you're not paying attention." Instead of labeling these public servants, read a bit about the issues and I'll bet you find yourself in the same mindset.
~gb
From the article... "I miss being on the Internet..." Do you know what I'd miss "being on" if I was stuck up a tree for 8 months, the toilet!!
--My sig is bigger than your sig--
They used to keep track of everything on paper and pencil. Both being wood related products they decided to use plastic and other chemically derived non biodegradable products like those commonly used in the production of electronic devices to show how much they care for the environment.
In related news, the Loggers Local 131 union hired non union workers to build their new headquarters because of the significant cost savings over using union labor.
Bad boys rape our young girls but Violet gives willingly.
If they can not live in a manner totally consistent with their beliefs, then how can they even ask me to?
If you have a belief that you want someone to follow, then you can't waiver in how you follow your own belief. That is the basic definition of hypocrite.
Blogging about logging.
Well.
I know I'm excited.
And shouldn't that be "tree-huggers", not "tree-sitters"?
t_t_b
I'm on PJ's "enemies" list! Are you?
This is real, honest to god, natural selection. With medical facilities as good as they are in this day and age, deaths due to stupidity are rare, but here's a classic example. Good to see at least one more idiot won't be contributing to the gene pool.
On a related note, the sitter in this article named her tree "Jerry". And takers on when she's gonna be the next example of natural selection in action?
If it gets slashdotted the whole damn forest could go up in flames taking the activists with it.
Hey, wait a minute...
I was just at the site and they have pictures of the activist chicks doing the traditional wood nymph blessing dance...in the nude. Check it out...streaming video too!
This is more than a little offtopic, but do these people come down to do their business or do they just hang their asses over the branch and let loose on the unsuspecting below?
"I'm a leaf on the wind. Watch how I soar."
-Hoban Washburn
But of course they won't do that because these kinds of groups are very unreceptive to criticism and debate. Trolls aside (and what message board doesn't have trolls), I think they would find that their cause and methods are not as accepted or supported as many of them believe.
"Ask not what your country can do for you." --John F. Kennedy
I hear the bloggers flog the loggers in their blog. It's slashdotted now, that is, the dotters are hogging the blog flogging the loggers. The blog is bogging down, logging 404's. I'm logging this log blog hogging in my blog.
"I don't know half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."
A group of australia lifeguards have expressed immense interest in the endeavour; the only technical hurdle they have to face is that their thongs are too small to accommodate any extra piece of equipment, namely the wireless devices needed to access the service.
"Is that your cellphone in your Speedo, or are you happy to see me?", asked Cindy, when meeting her fellow lifeguard Jon.
In five easy steps.
1 - Climb down out of the tree.
2 - Get a job.
3 - Save up money.
4 - Buy land with trees on it.
5 - Don't cut them down.
Out of all of them, #2 is the only one that takes a lot of effort.
My Other Computer Is A Data General Nova III.
From the article: A car battery recharger powers the equipment
So what powers the car battery recharger? A Honda generator?
"I think the great thing about tree-sitters using 802.11 is how they can post on the Internet without wires. That way, they can type 'AAAAAAAAAAAAAA!' while falling out of a tree, and click 'Submit' right before they hit the ground."
...
Sure, it's always about the tallest, the cutest, the warm and cuddliest. Why not cut down the tallest, and spare some of the short young trees? Haven't the redwoods already had their day in the sun?
Chop down the trees with the treehuggers in them. Plant a new one, it'll grow back. Plus old-ass forests aren't good for the ecology. It's good to thin out the forest to allow other plants to grow.
-- Liberalism is a mental disorder.
I'm one of those nutty Indymedia activists. I have serious problems with the conservative domination of our so called "liberal" media, and am doing proactive, constructive things to work to change that. Among them is writing for my local IMC, another is working for media reform, as much of this has been made possible by federal legislation and other actions by the Fed.
anyway, serious bravo to folks at San Fran IMC for doing this. Technology is not necessarily paradoxical to environmental activism -- and if anything, the high tech world needs a serious dose of environmental awareness, power consumption and chip production being the two main things that I'm sure we could come up with very creative solutions to.
Briefly more on IMC: I can only speak for my local Indymedia, but we've been doing a lot of reporting on things that the Big Media(tm) have ignored. There've been a number of controversial things happening in Madison over the past few years. While we are fortunate to have more than one daily newspaper, we're as affected by radio, TV, and cable conglomeration as the rest of the United States. That means that in the major press outlets, many of these controversial issues have gone on without more than the Official Word(tm) being spoken about it. While we're still small, we're growing, and with it a sense that fair and accurate reporting needs to happen by everyone -- corporate media and volunteer/activist media alike. I'm proud to be working with what must now be the thousands of other media activists in the 100+ IMCs that exist around the world. let's keep it up!
-- haaz.
...does anyone hear it fail?
Bush should have died, not Reagan -- Morrissey
Morrissey rides a cockhorse -- The Warlock Pinchers
New trees will grow to take their place.
Xaotik Designs
Can't we add loggers, lumberjacks, and similar extractivist workers to this extinct species list? If they are unable to adapt to the new environment-conscious society that has evolved in the last few decades they should die.
As for rare food, I like sushi but woodland creature should be well cooked. After all they have been running around a germ infested forest for god knows how long.
A lot of these same folks preach solar power use. But it not only takes more energy to produce a cell than it will ever return, but the chemicals in the manufacuring are extremely hazardous....
Some how, there's something very darwinian about reading the stories of deaths from people falling out of trees where they were living/sitting in protest. Makes you feel like humanity is taking a step in the right direction..
Truth is I support some of their argument, but this is not how to do it....plus the laptop up there is throwing doubt on my joy of eliminating the dead weight!
One minute... "It seems to be sucking the life out of my big battery up here. Maybe a third battery would be appropriate..." The next minute... "In just under two hundred years, the euro-american value system has killed off..." blah blah What's it going to be lady?
LOL, Bravo!
They're probably fighting to save the big trees to hide the little trees.
There was a pretty good movie, Homegrown , about pot growers in Humboldt County.
Redwood forests are, if I remember correctly, post-climax ecosystems, which mean that they have less biodiversity than a forest that is between 5 and 20 years old. When a forest is logged, it opens spaces where new growth (read: stuff that animals eat). I am not advocating cutting down all of the redwoods, but selective logging (leaving the healthiest trees to reseed the area) will certainly increase the health of the local ecosystem in the long run.
I grew up 10 miles south of Eureka and 10 miles north of Scotia where Pacific Lumber is based. These tree sitters are invading private property and breaking the law. Pacific Lumber has a legal right to harvest those trees. Why we tolerate this is beyond me. If the target was a high tech office building in Santa Clara instead of remote Humboldt County, Calif. it would not have been allowed to continue. There is only around 100,000 people in the entire county and the major economic activities are Tourism, Agriculture, Fishing and Timber. The only one that pays worth spit is timber.
BLOG! .plan it's good
What's full of posts
and lying boasts?
it's BLOG, it's BLOG
It's better than
it's BLOG BLOG
It's not a question of 'should'
What's boring and lame
and always the same?
it's BLOG, it's BLOG
It's a diary on the 'net
it's BLOG, it's BLOG
it's stories about your pet
Everyone loves the BLOG
Everyone needs a BLOG
BLOG from Whammo!
or if you like the logs...
LOG!
What rolls down stairs
Alone or in pairs
Rolls over your neighbor's dog.
What's great for a snack
And fits on your back
It's log, log, log!
It's lo-og, lo-og,
It's big, it's heavy, it's wood.
It's lo-og, lo-og,
It's better than bad, it's good.
Everyone wants a log,
You're gonna love it, log
Come on and get your log,
Everyone needs a log...
BY BLAMMO!
Day six: Frank asked if I was a vegetarian today. He already knows this. What does he mean?
Day twelve: Will no one let it rest that I dreamed I heard chainsaws?
Day twenty-nine: Another fricken squirrel!
Day sixty: I'm just going outside, and I may be some time.
Keep your packets off my GNU/Girlfriend!
I always wondered if these tree sitters all live in wood construction?
Atto
I didn't use the preview button, so get over it!!!!
Mike
Extremism runs both ways, there, parking-lot-boy.
If you believe that a tree farm is an acceptable replacement for an integrated forest ecosystem maybe it's you who should crack open a science book. (BTW, that would be biology.)
- Hail to our fearless misleader! Fool speed ahead!
How is ripping on someone that is trying to help the environment, while playing games, hypocritical?
Are you implying that if you play games, you should also be a tree hugger?
How small a thought it takes to fill a whole life
Up here in my little portion of Massachusetts, Tree Farms are all over the place. Public land, private land. Its one of the ways that you manage a forest. When you read these stories, it seems like the only way these eco-terrorists want to manage things is to keep everybody out but themselves. I guess that is why I enjoyed the ending to Rainbow Six so much.
"I went on a diet, swore off drinking and heavy eating. And in fourteen days, I had lost exactly two weeks. Joe E. Lewis
this is actually kind of funny!
**>>BELCH
Seems like a pretty interesting way to use technology to help the environment, which isn't something you see everyday.
You may not see it everyday, but perhaps your eyes aren't sufficiently open.
Think about big general trends: What aspect of modern life has the most significant impact on the size of woodlands and forests? It's the need to feed a growing population! From around 1850 to the turn of the 20th century, millions of acres of trees were cleared in order to make way for farmland.
Now take a look at this report from the USGS.
Looking at the text I calculate the following:
1850: ~13 acres of farmland per person
1990: ~1 acre of farmland per person
And, this is with the U.S. now having gobs of surplus agricultural production to help feed the rest of the world! True, the report shows that a significant portion of this farmland became (sub)urbia. But, that is how a growing population distributes itself. Imagine how much worse it would have been for the forests had we needed to maintain that 13ac/person.
And what allowed this miracle to happen? It wasn't people sitting up in trees, that's for sure. It was technology, including machinery, pesticides, irrigation, and lately, lots of information technology to help with more efficient planting and harvesting protocols.
All this, in addition to the fact that only rich societies can even afford to care about such luxuries as old-growth forests. To the vast majority of the world, such concerns are trivialities. In a real sense, it is only technology which allows these tree-sitters to exist at all.
If humans are mostly water, and beer is mostly water, then humans must be mostly beer.
Could someone seriously explain what these people are protesting for? Is it wrong for people to cut down trees?
Trees are burnt to the ground in forest fires, how come people aren't protesting forest fires? I understand that it would be bad if someone were to cut down all the trees, but that wouldn't make much financial sense for a logging company to do that. Is it an age thing? Like an older tree shouldn't be cut down but it is ok to cut down younger trees? What is the criteria for being an older tree?
BTW, what are their platforms made of? Plastic? Metal? Wood?! What about the food they eat? Even if they are vegan, what makes a tree's "life" more sacred than some bean sprout?
Speak truth to power.
Logging companies completely clearcut vast swaths of forest. When they bother to replant, they typically do so with monocultures - a single tree species, which must then be massively fertilized and insecticided to survive. When not clearcutting they select the tallest, straightest, healthiest trees which leads to a degradation of the tree gene pool in the area and shittier trees.
Clearcutting also results in the decimation of streams and habitat for other creatures. Trees also create rain and are the sources of forest streams through transpiration, so clearcutting is also an assault on our water resources.
Modern agriculture is a disaster. We've created a system where we put in more calories of energy into a crop than we can harvest. Simply saying that logging companies are doing 'tree farming' is really a complete condemnation of what they're doing.
It is possible to profitably harvest trees at a sustainable rate that has a negligible effect on the forest. It can even improve the forest by thinning out diseased or damaged trees. Yes, this would result in a somewhat lower supply of trees, but there are many, many methods to reduce tree usage in home construction.
1 house == 1-2 clearcut acres. Is this really the way to go???
and how exactly do you argue with those in power before they clear cut the old growth. I have a business, and can easily recognize the necessity of doing what you believe in. many people are hippocrits, these people just happen to actually do something the rest of the time. as for your scientific statement of forest fire causes, the research is inconclusive (just like global warming!), and affects primarily planted areas, not established forests which are older than our country. i oppose clrear cutting primarily because nobody respects the material any more. it's such a shame to cut down trees such as these for shit furniture and mini-villas. stewardship! lol!
Who will win?
Hey freaks: now you're ju
Thanks for the article. Now I'm going to go jam the 802.11 signal near them and they will be forced to come down! Damn tree huggers.
Thank you for expressing so clearly the essence of the environmentalist credo: Humans right have no more moral import than the "rights" of non-human animals, plants, bacteria, etc.
At that point, the conversation ends.
If humans are mostly water, and beer is mostly water, then humans must be mostly beer.
Please realize that many times environmental damage can have an extremely detremental impact on peoples lives in terms of health and safety.
Toxins and carcinogens are not just affecting animals once they are in our air and water but people as well.
Environmental Activism is where profits are no longer put first but the wellbeing of our families and our earth.
If you want to see how environmental activists have done a great job go to www.nyenvirolaw.org and get an education on what does an environmental activist do. Activist means being active and not just sitting around and doing nothing.
Maladies such as asthma, lead poisoning, pesticide exposure, etc. which are caused by environmental damage are harming people. These are facts based on science. Slashdot should be as pro-environment as possible because they are supposed to be scientifically aware....
take an ecology class.
the ecosystem does not soley exist on just any old trees. it depends on these ancient trees and their natural process of decay and slow regrowth. if you cut down all the large trees, this cycle will be broken and the ecosystem will degrade.
-------
"don't smoke, don't drink, don't fuck
at least i can fucking think"
Minor Threat
not about some fundamentalist eco-purism.
Maxxam's desperate cutting to pay off it's junk bond funded buyout of Palco (a tactic made illegal shortly afterwards) has resulted in many folks who live downstream from the timber lands losing their homes to floods and landslides.
And the silting and warming (due to removal of the sheltering canopy of the big trees) of the rivers that flow through Palco's land has greatly impacted the the local salmon fishery, which used to employ thousands (alot more than the increasingly mechanized timber industry).
IOW, this is about protecting the common resources of the area from a rapacious multinat, not about extreme environmental purism.
Semi-on topic, but flat out avoiding logging and squashing every flame that comes along is not necessarily in the best interest of the environment.
Protected the trees from fire and logging changes the environment. For example, some pine trees take a brute force approach of many many many seedlings that are individually weak and the expectation is that a fire will wipe most out, but the few that remain will be fine..... Others, take a long time to develop a few saplings while fireproofing. Without fires, these slow and steady species get starved out. I don't know too much about this stuff (my wife is the Bio/Botany/Genetics person), but moderating logging can serve as a good, efficient replacement for raging wildfires (which interfere too much with our lives to tolerate beyond small, controlled, often wasteful controlled burns).
XML is like violence. If it doesn't solve the problem, use more.
OK. You want a medal or decoder ring or something?
I also support this project and the tree sitters.
You have every right to.
What disgusts me are the right wing anti-hippy posts on this thread.
That's it, boy! Revel in your ideological stupor! Proudly shout your blinkered, monochromatic worldview to the world! There's only leftwing and rightwing! Yeah! There's nothing in between or outside! Woo hoo! You go girl!
I'm not some tree-hugging hippy, but would love to take that Stihl chainsaw to some of your suburban, cubicle-dwelling libertarian heads.
So we don't have the right NOT to agree with the tree sitters, eh?
Ah, yes, the quite, tempered, reasoned voice of the religious fanatic. :-) Shouldn't you be thumping a copy of "Earth In Balance" somewhere?
--- Ban humanity.
and the previous Sherrif & DA who supported a more active (aka brutal) campaign against protest(including dabbing pepper spray in the eyes of bound protestors) lost the last election in a landslide.
Since Maxxam bought Palco with junk bonds and instituted hyper aggressive logging practices to pay them off, which practices led to the flooding of dozens of homes, and a sharpt decline in the salmon industry (which used to employ thousands), the local folks have gotten pretty fed up.
Palco used to rely on thousands of employees of it's own to vote the company line on local issues, but Maxxam's liqudation of the Palco pensions and automation of it's tree farms have resulted in very few people actually relying on the timber industry any more, with a consequent decline in local political support.
In short, the cops will come when they aren't busy with murders, rapes, and robberies, and they will definitely come if the loggers kill anyone again, but they aren't going to climb any trees or set up trail blocks to protect the "private" property of a multinat that has severely impacted the property and businesses of it's downstream neighbors.
Not necessarily, at least. The technology in this particular instance is helping political activists pursue their agenda more than it is actually helping the environment.
"On the Internet, nobody knows you're a dog!" - a dog
This may all be true, and wanting to save resources are a fantastic idea, just as battling Big Brothers' love of industry (read: money) over nature...
BUT- It seems to me that, if more of these wack-jobs would get themselves into some science classes and study up on ways to create renewable fuels or, better efficiency from solar products, this whole problem would go away.
I guess it's just allot more fun to be a pain in the worlds' rear and play rock-stars in Trees than it is to get educated and make a REAL difference.
Hippies- We really need the tornadoe-on-a-can to toss these people into... they require SO MUCH attention. Oddly, the person who builds the first 90% efficient electric motor or somthing similar will probably win the Nobel, which just happens to come with a lot of attention.
They will be: an Orange tree, Japanese Maple, Flowering Plum and a tree to be named at a later date (Magnolia, probably).
The Magnolia (probably) will be available for a tree sitter around 2005. It will be fully wired for gigabit Ethernet. I'll begin accepting applications next summer.
I figure it will be a conversation piece and help me score with pagan babes. Akter I hose them down, of course.
--- Ban humanity.
Anyone out there who agrees with me on this who has a website, link to her so that she gets more publicity! Tree-sitting in itself doesn't do much good, it's the publicity for the cause that counts.
My site: Free Nature Pictures
See previous post: Ents
-FF
SQUEAK, the Death of Rats explained.
That would actually be a great way to kill two birds with one stone...hypothetically speaking of course :)
This space for rent.
The tree-huggers whine about the precious trees, and tie up legal logging in the courts, and then stand idly by when the forests burn down because they haven't been thinned out.
You are completely correct. Selective cutting reduces fire danger. If a selectively-cut forest burns, it is just a healthy burn, taking out the underbrush and leaving the old growth trees intact. Fires are not supposed to take out large trees. That's enviro-crap. A century of fire suppression has made today's fires very intense, killing large trees and often sterilizing soil.
If you don't understand any of my sayings, come to me in private and I shall take you in my German mouth.
I've actually tried this, to some extent, and let me tell you, it's not easy! You can't expect that of people, you're right, it's absurd. On the other hand, if you're serious about protecting the environment, that's the direction in which we have to move. Problem is, it's a really hard way to live, especially if you're alone. It can only be done with lots of support from other people, and this takes time and energy, and, yes, money to put together.
All of us who have grown up in the system need some decompression time before we're ready to "go back to nature." I think we should all applaud the efforts of anyone who is even vaguely moving in the right direction, instead of criticizing them for not going far enough. Give it time!
My site: Free Nature Pictures
I was responding to the poster, not the original article. The post I was responding to already made the assumption that they were trying to influence others.
The fact that this isn't the case doesn't nullify my point. In fact, the fact that it isn't the case is irrelevant to the ensuing discussion.
He's clueless? Well dip me in shit, all this time I thought those trees were growing.
You're honestly going to tell me that forestry companies don't replant trees?
Come on people, why aren't you all sitting in wheat fields too? I mean farmer Brown cuts his wheat crop and.....???????
Logging, like any other ag business has a cycle. Plant, tend, harvest, repeat.
The wildlife you speak of also depends upon cycles. There are points in those cycles which used to include forest fires and predators. We've decided to fight fire so in most instances logging can take the place of fire (for wildlife, plant seeding is another issue however {which is why we have more forests now and less prarie})
No pal, you're the one who's clueless. Try hooking up with your local educational facility and learn a bit about biology, ecology, business management and zoology. I don't know how to advise you on obtaining common sense.
. Quit playing Monopoly with Bill. Switch to one of many non-Microsoft products today.
1) Quit school
2) Find a tree that is about to be cut down.
3) Sit in tree
4) Have people deliver me food.
5) Get a laptop and internet access, FREE!
Mod mudshark up! I never knew there were so many George Bush, corporate loving, environmental hating slashdotters. Kind of makes me sick.
First let me honestly hope that you are referring to those as professions and not people. Maybe not, most environmentalists tend to be violent people in my experience.
Now let's look at why loggers, lumber mills, and paper mills exist. Think about this for a minute. I don't know what society you are a part of but mine demands wood and paper products.
Look around you. Very carefully look around you. Are you, someone who is a part of "the new enviroment-conscious society" creating a demand for wood products?
Unless you can tell me for certain that you do not, in any way, shape, or form, use or depend upon anything wood based......well, I don't want to hear you complain about people who work DAMN HARD to satisify YOUR DEMANDS for wood products.
. Quit playing Monopoly with Bill. Switch to one of many non-Microsoft products today.
I consider this a detestable use of technology to help keep the world backwards in technology.
If this is perfectly ok, can I board up your house because you work for Microsoft?
If you could be told what you can see or read, then it follows that you could be told what to say or think - BoC
I want to see this on WiGLE.
Since they are going to pollute the air with RF and use more electricity to power their wireless gear, I am going to print out each "blog" or weblog entry created by these people.
Watch out for the lumberjacks
Bush should have died, not Reagan -- Morrissey
Morrissey rides a cockhorse -- The Warlock Pinchers
It's amazing how many people bring up the whole "it's their private property" line, without realizing that their loggins has demonstratably affected other peoples' private property, along with public property.
The fishing in the area has been hurt because of all the mud that's been washed into the rivers because the trees aren't there to keep it from eroding. There's also the fact that Eureka is now flooding more often because the watershed can't buffer the large storms. People's houses and businesses are being flooded. OTHER peoples' private property is being destroyed.
Or is tresspassing a much worse offense than the destruction of property?
"You know your god is man-made when he hates all the same people you do."
There was a famous case in the recent past, where a logging company wanted to unload some deeded land. It seems the land was too rugged to log profitably.
The logging company found some tree climbing people to climb trees, and make a big protest.
The press went wild (probably paid to do so). The tree climbing people cried for the cameras etc.
After several years of litigation, a very rich local government bought up the land for many-many times (x50) it's worth. The government then made it illegal for mortals to visit this precious land.
The result was fantastic for all parties involved.
The logging company made many times more money by selling the land, than they would have if it were logged.
The lawyers made a huge profit.
The tree climbers got famous, and made money on the speaking tour, and selling books about crying in front of the camera.
The elected officials made good political hay too!
It seems the only losers were the tax payers who got to fund the whole deal. Now their government is many BILLIONs in the red. Their economy is in the tank. Their taxes are going to skyrocket.
Is this merely round two?
- High Tech workers, please say NO to Union Carpenters, their Union sees fit to control our compensation.
Also, trees are being cut on YOUR land. See this site for aerial photographs of national forest land throughout the Pacific Northwest..it nicely portrays the destruction: http://www.forestcouncil.org/learn/skymaps/index.p hp
The rate of logging in these lands is completely unsustainable. No, planting two trees for every one logged is NOT a solution and does NOT replace the forest. All this does is make the public land a farm...instead of planting corn they plant trees. And the diversity of the original forest is lost.
I would suggest to everyone to please go and see the trees in question before forming an opinion. I am willing to bet you will not think the same way after seeing them.
PMP
example.org - powered by Linux!
All of the above
hemp = headache
It must be that smug superiority of geeks, sustained and amplified through years of telling each other we're all so goddamn smart that we actually believe the hype. Gosh, if you can hack the Linux kernel, or if you can build a complete content management system for a company Web site, or if you can get paid a buttload of money at a computer job right out of high school, why then, you must know everything there is to know about the world, right?
That's the only explaination I can find for the concentration of knee-jerk anti-enviro hounds around here. Okay, if all y'all think yer so goddamn smart, a challenge:
It's easy to pick at an argument or position, to find inconsistencies or to attack parts of it. It's a hell of a lot harder to posit a position or argument yourself. The challenge, then, is to explain and support the idea that all of the changes made to the natural environment by humankind are a-okay and nothing to worry about. Oh yes, and no references whatsoever to the defects in the arguments of environmentalists, or any technology-will-fix-it-all-someday hand waving. Bonus points if you're actually aware of all or most (or even a lot) of the changes made to the natural enviroment by humankind.
Anybody up to the challenge?
I second that. Most of the replies Ive seen here are from immature posers. I live in Humboldt county and strongly support tree sitters. It definetly helps raise awareness, even you heard about it. You should actually be thanking them for standing up and trying to do something for the enviroment.
Save the whales, fuck the humans! Complain amd whine about everything, and offer no possible solutions. Then write it all down on a clip-board and post it on your blog so the world knows how much of a weeny you are. Goddamn, at least help some worth-while causes like landmines or starving folks in N. Korea.
/. Slow news day, eh?
If it somehow involves the exchange of energy in the form of electricity, someone just has to post it on
The biggest trick the devil pulled was letting lawyers become politicians so they can write the laws.
Just so you know, they eat sleep and Sh*t up there in the tree. There is no bathroom break, they go in a bucket. They do it for us , our planet and our children. Have you ever done something so courageous in your life. I doubt it. Why dont you come to humboldt county and put in a little time your self.
Of course, if any of you people who use this argument had actually bothered to educate yourself on the topic, you'd know some interesting facts:
Fire-suppression in the nation's forests became entrenched policy and widespread with the rise of the conservation movement in the United States, with the likes of Gifford Pinchot. The idea was that fires destroy the valuable lumber in the forest. Yep, fire-suppression is a policy implemented to protect commercial logging interests.
First loggers suppress the small, brush-clearing fires that don't affect the big trees, then bitch when the fuel builds up to fuel crown fires of Biblical proportions. A lot of environmentalists favor letting the little fires burn. They know that fires aren't supposed to take out large trees. That's logger crap.
Instead of burning, big trees are supposed to fall down and rot. Forest soil is generally not rich soil, and a healthy forest needs the nutrients from rotting trees for the next generation of trees. Logging, even selective logging by the big lumber corporations, pulls out those nutrients.
That's not to say that selective cutting isn't possible in a healthy forest, just not on the scale of the big lumber companies. There's a Native American reservation here in Wisconsin where they practice intelligent selective cuts. They started with 3 billion board feet of lumber in the 19th century, they've produced 9bn board feet over the years, and have 6bn now. That's good stewardship, but production rates that the big lumber companies would scoff at.
To recap: Letting small fires burn also reduces the danger of the catastrophic forest fires, but it's the logging interests suppressing the small fires.
I grew up in Humboldt and Mendocino counties. In a little town called Covelo, and on my grandfather's ranch, 2 miles south of the Humboldt/Mendocino county line. I fully expect to see my post modded down because it is NOT what people want to here. Before you label me a troll, realize this. I have been on slashdot.org for 2 years, and post rather infrequently. This is TRUE and is not trolling.
There are four groups in most of the small towns in that area: the potgrowers, the ranchers, the loggers, and impoverished native americans. The lines between the groups blur, but one thing to keep in mind, is the "full-time" environmental activists up there are often from the pot grower category.
The environmental sentiments of the potgrowers is not leaving nature alone, but leaving their crops alone. There are a some true hearted environmentalists up there, but if you watch you will notice a pattern to them. They will be real active November-February, not hear much from them March-May, and then active June-September. This is because the plant in the spring and harvest in October.
Further the protesters that travel up there do not know their rears from holes in the ground. For example in 1993, approx 25 people traveled up to the Mendocino National Forest to protest logging. They ended up chaining themselves to trees on the Campbell Ranch that were not scheduled to be logged, and rustling and killing 3 calves from the Campbell's herd. Eventually they left the ranch, well, were run off by the sheriff's deputies, and they filed lawsuits for police brutality which were dismissed.
In the Spring of 1990 or 1991, don't remember for sure which one. A PRIVATE airplane went down in a remote canyon in Mendocino county enroute between Eureka, and Lakeport. Its emergency beacon was originally tracked, but shut off approximately 4 hours later. The battery should last for 48-72 hours minimum. I was in the SAR Command post, when the volunteers doing the ground search were driven off by men wielding AK-47's. I was present when an air volunteers plane was shot, and the search eventually called off. I was also present when the coordinator of the search was told in November they got an anonymous tip and the plane found, under a camoflage net near a pot garden. It was not clear if the occupants had died in the crash or from their injuries shortly thereafter.
I know a friend who lost a testicle and part of his hand when he stopped to take a pee next to the roadside and triggered a pipe bomb which was planted to protect a nearby pot garden.
I also saw the same people I knew were growers, marching in protest of logging. Now, many of the loggers have lost their jobs, and moved away.
Earth first!
We'll get to the other planets later.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Have you ever even been to Eureka ?? Your statement is total hogwash regarding the flooding. I know, I lived in a around Eureka, Loleta, Fortuna and the other parts of the county for almost 20 years and my parents are still there. Actually the locals would love to have some good flooding like we had in the early 1960s. That how the farmland around Eel River stays fertile.
I believe that trees are the answer to a lot of questions about our future. These include: How can we advance to a more sustainable economy based on renewable fuels and materials? How can we improve literacy and sanitation in developing countries while reversing deforestation and protecting wildlife at the same time? How can we pull carbon out of the atmosphere and reduce the amount of greenhouse gases emissions, carbon dioxide in particular? How can we increase the amount of land that will support a greater diversity of species? How can we help prevent soil erosion and provide clean air and water? How can we make this world more beautiful and green? The answer is, by growing more trees and then using more wood, both as a substitute for non-renewable fossil fuels and materials such as steel, concrete and plastic, and as paper products for printing, packaging and sanitation.
[...]
http://www.greenspirit.com/trees_answer/
When a clearcut happens the ecology is disrupted and many bushes grow up. This creates a thick underbrush which burns hoter and faster than fires in mature forests. This problem of over growth in clearcuts is why they use spray herbicides to keep down the brush. Instead of sustainable logging where you only take some trees but leave the ecosystem intact, clearcutting strips everything down. When it grows back you then have a forest that will never on it's own return to the stable old growth ecology. Not even in 2000 years!
The power of technology is manifest in how it is applied within the social matrix.
There are a lot more trees in North America today than there were a century ago.
Let me also point out that old growth forests offer next to nothing for large fauna. That's why there are a lot more deer and other woodland creatures in North America than there were a century ago.
Putting trustafarians up friggin trees is not the answer.
If the US had put it's power behind developing renewable energy back in during the oil embargo we would no longer be dependent on middle east oil. Which would solve a lot of todays problems.
"If Diet Coke did not exist it would have been neccessary to invent it." -- Karl Lehenbauer
Can't we add loggers, lumberjacks, and similar extractivist workers to this extinct species list?
If you look closer, those are just different populations of humans. There are many trying to exterminate the humans. One culture at a time.
You can't destroy the humans all at once. Just section off the small fringe cultures out side of the centralized conciousness. Keep taking out the small groups on the outside. The core will starve with out them.
- High Tech workers, please say NO to Union Carpenters, their Union sees fit to control our compensation.
When they bother to replant
Actually the U.S. Forest Service replants. They charge the lumber company for the job. The Forest Service grows and replants the trees.
The main stream media focuses on the fact that the Federal Government does not see the money from lumber sales. They hide the fact that that money went to the local schools.
- High Tech workers, please say NO to Union Carpenters, their Union sees fit to control our compensation.
Ok. You almost have it right, but your missing several very important points. Don't feel badly about it, most people miss them. The one thing that all sides of this argument forget is that right now, today, we still don't know everything. The concervationists and the logging interests both only have so much knowledge. I will judge (without bias) that you are more pro concervation than pro logging, even selective logging or selective thinning.
:)
I am totally pro forest stewardship. I am for the responsible use and preservation of our natural resources, whatever form they may come in. I am also very pro logging, so long as it's done responsibly by companies who will hold themselves to a high standard of conduct in the forest.
Now, on to your arguments!
You assert that it is logging interests that have implemented the current and past fire-suppression policy for their own selfish purposes. You are correct in that assertion. What you have overlooked though is that when the logging interests pushed for that policy, nobody understood the forests need for small intense fires. People were concerned about the wildlife that would be killed or left homeless by these small burns and don't forget that even these "mild" burns leave an ugly scar on our lands. By the time the logging community figured out how important the "mild" burns were, approximately 1965, it was too late. The environmental movement had started and the public was beginning to believe that the logging interests would tell any lie they needed to as long as it would let them keep cutting down the trees. The logging community was the first group to assert that we needed to have fires to maintain healthy forests. The slash burns that took place was not simply a method to dispose of waste after a clearcut but to rapidly replenish the soil with necessary nutrients that can only be produced by a fire. The lesson is that even those stupid loggers can learn, just like the preservationists, concervationists and environmentalists.
You next assert that big trees are supposed to fall down and rot, returning nutrients to the soil. I'm not sure where you get your data, but I'd like to see the nutrient return ratios from large dead trees to the soil as they rot vs nurtient return ratios after a clear cut followed by a slash burn. I think if you take the time to look, you'll be surprised at what you find.
Now, on to selective cutting. This is one of my favorite topics. I'll ask a couple questions and also provide the answers.
1. If 10% to 25% of the trees are thinned in an old growth forest, what happens to the remaining trees?
Within 2 years and additional 25% to 60% of the trees that are left standing will be on the ground as a result of storms. The actual percentage will vary depending on the topography, climate and type of forest. In the following years, expect a declining number of trees to fall annually due to storms.
2. What if we take the same 10% to 25% from a 30yr old reproduction forest(that's a forest that was clear cut 30 years ago, planted and actively managed).
The loss would be greater than 60% in the first 2 years and would not decline much in the following years.
Trees need other trees of simillar size/age to hold them up in the wind storms of winter. If we take a bunch of trees out of a mature forest and introduce new trees into the mix, the new trees will not help block the wind for the older large trees and since trees are competitive in nature, the small trees will be shaded out and die.
The solution?
Tree farms or no wood products used. Yup, that's it. Unless we have a replacement for wood resins used in making plastics for things like ballpoint pens we're going to have to continue cutting trees. Until we all start living in something other than wood houses, we'll have to continue cutting trees. Yes, even those pesky printers on our desks are going to cause more trees to be cut down(even if we never print a singel paper page with them, the plastic is made with resin from wood).
I am a tree hugger, I love them in all of their stages of life and death. The are wonderful to walk through in a forest, they are beautiful when crafted by a skilled wood worker into my desk, and they are wonderful as a medium for my favorite authors to print their words onto.
Until we have a better solution, we'll have to continue cutting down trees. The question you have to answer is this:
Would you prefer to have clearcuts on large scale tree farms near cities and urban areas where everyone can see them or would you rather they were in the heart of our national forests where only the lucky loggers will get to visit them regularly?
Just cause I know you'll want to know:
I live in Bellingham WA, I am a software engineer though I d/won't work for the evil empire, I have spent much of my life in the forest, hiking, camping, fishing, skiing and even logging, I am the son of a man who has opperated a logging company for the last 35 years and have seen first hand both the tragic results of mismanagement and the beauty of a well managed forest.
Let the flaming begin
Only when you do it while hugging trees. It's part of the costume.
This isn't the sig you are looking for... Carry on...
Once upon a time, when I was training to be a mathematician, a group of
us bright young students taking number theory discovered the names of the
smaller prime numbers.
2: The Odd Prime --
It's the only even prime, therefore is odd. QED.
3: The True Prime --
Lewis Carroll: "If I tell you 3 times, it's true."
31: The Arbitrary Prime --
Determined by unanimous unvote. We needed an arbitrary prime in
case the prof asked for one, and so had an election. 91 received
the most votes (well, it *looks* prime) and 3+4i the next most.
However, 31 was the only candidate to receive none at all.
41: The Female Prime --
The polynomial X**2 - X + 41 is
prime for integer values from 1 to 40.
43: The Male Prime - they form a prime pair.
Since the composite numbers are formed from primes, their qualities
are derived from those primes. So, for instance, the number 6 is "odd
but true", while the powers of 2 are all extremely odd numbers.
- this post brought to you by the Automated Last Post Generator...