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17-inch flat-Panel iMac Dead
EnlightenmentFan writes "Apple plans to stop production in June of the iMac with flat-panel 17-inch display, according to this article at Asian tech-news site Digitimes. As with the now-history 15" flat-panel iMac, sales started strong but stalled once the early-adopter crowd had bought in. Probably-not-unrelated story (also posted today): Chungwha Picture Tubes is boosting the price of its 17-inch LCD monitor panels."
I have had limited exposure to Apple machines in the past, and I have to say I do like them.
But this is not the first time that Apple have had an unsuccessful product on their hands - the iCube went the same way. I mean, to me it was an excellent product, but I think it was just too expensive.
Apple are quite a big company, but they are not THAT big - perhaps they should learn from this and the iCube, and plan a little more carefully before they launch certain products? It must have cost them a lot of money in R&D and the parts for these things?
"Hey! Unless this is a nude love-in, get the hell off my property!!"
How could they? I thought they'd finally invented the perfect personal computer, and that the 17-inch LCD iMac would never be discontinued. I guess I thought wrong. :(
Karma: Good (despite my invention of the Karma: sig)
They'll probably announce that OS XI and OS 9.5 are going to be discontinued.
s/17-inch flat-Panel//g;
I will give them that. The real problem with that pariticular form factor is that youc cannot really upgrade the display easily and think that hurt the overall sales. It is hard to upgrade when the monitor is bolted to the chassis. But who wants an iMac when you can get a Dual G4 with one of those really pretty cinema displays. I would trade an appendage for that. I will just have to make do with my BRAND SPANKING NEW powerbook G4. Oh baby. Santa is my friend.
perhaps we should wait until MacWorld Expo to set straight the rumors, and see if perhap a new/great product will be introduced in its place, or if this will infact happen at all.
Apple normally doesn't throw out this kind of information, and if so, they do it quietly.
But if the information is true, it's really not an indication that the iMac is disappearing, but being revised. The iMac is still a very popular computer and is not a failure in any instance. The 15" systems were discontinued only because the 17" systems arrived.
Count on the new iMac with the same 17" display, but with improved processor speed, and optimized for Jaguar.
Vos teneo officium eram periculosus ut vos recipero is.
APPLE STILL SELLS 15 INCH monitor imacs. THere is no way they have a 7 month inventory backlog on 15" panels, so the article cannot be correct about then being discontinued in june. On the other hand it is true that apple stopped selling 15" monitors. It's conceivable they might discontinue 17" monitors in lieu of just using 3rd party monitors. if their profit margin was slim this would be a shrewd move to drive down the price of the macs, while still retaining their premium 22" monitor offering.
Some drink at the fountain of knowledge. Others just gargle.
The product may look cool but Apple continues to charge more for less. Also, this will be marked down as total flamebait, but I consider most Apple computers at this point to be femmie in appearance. If you are trying to sell a computer to the type of guy who drives a VW Golf convertible, sure, but a style conveys an image. I would have never thought it was possible to make a computer look "gay", but Apple succeeded.
MacOS Rumors recently noted that certain stores were unable to order more CRT-based iMacs and eMacs. This is what Apple does when they are about to update a model. And now this?
Maybe Apple is finally taking everyone's advice, and realizing that consumers would far rather have a small, integrated box, like the Cube, that can interface with VGA and DVI as well as ADC monitors, and that is price-competitive with the cheapest x86 boxes. The revival of something like the Cube, but sans monitor and starting at $600, would actually get price-conscious consumers to consider getting a Mac instead.
I love the current round-up of Macs, however I can't afford one yet.
Does the color of the iMac base remind you of beige?
The last two stories are:
17-inch flat-Panel iMac Dead
MicroBSD 0.6RC2 Released
shouldn't that be:
MicroBSD is Dead (or dying) and
17-inch flat-Panel Released (We've seen dupes, and late posts so why not)
just when you though you got things figured...
As with the now-history 15" flat-panel iMac, sales started strong but stalled once the early-adopter crowd had bought in.
wtf is this web site, the 15" iMac is still being sold!!??
This digitimes site says production was stopped in October. But I still see it for sale on apple.com!
Maybe they mean the factories shut down in October so everybody could catch up with the sag in demand??
The 15" iMac is alive and well. Tis only the 15" standalone LCD display that has been discontinued.
If this story is at all true, it simply means that 17" iMacs are impinging on the sales of G4 towers, and the iMac will remain 15" only for the time being.
What?
Clearly likely that the entire model line will be refreshed by June anyway.
They are just too dang expensive.
Drop the price, like a THOUSAND dollars, and I'll bet they move like hotcakes.
Sources: 17-inch flat-panel iMac to stop production in June
David Tzeng, Taipei; Chinmei Sung, DigiTimes.com [Thursday 2 January 2003]
The 17-inch flat-panel iMac will terminate production in June, following the same fate as the 15-inch flat-panel model, which stopped production last October, said local PC makers familiar with the matter.
It is estimated that about 500,000 to 600,000 flat-panel iMacs were sold in 2002 following their introduction last January. The once highflying desktop computer, which created a buzz with its desk lamp-like look, is expected to sell another 300,000 to 400,000 units between now and June.
The flat-panel iMac, which debuted last January, became a smash hit shortly after being introduced. Sales peaked in March, with local manufacturers working round the clock, fulfilling shipments of over 10,000 units a day.
Sales of the 15-inch flat-panel iMacs practically stalled in June 2002 after selling more than 300,000 units between February and May, resulting in an early production termination in October.
"First you gotta do the truffle shuffle."
Figure Jobs is going to announce the iMac III at MacWorld next week? His keynote speech is scheduled for 9:00AM this Tuesday morning, the 7th.
What about a headless imac... i would buy it if the price is right.
"Smokey, this isn't Nam, there are rules." -Walter
This flies in the face of the rumor mill that has been rumbling that *all* iMacs were going to be 17" or larger. Although I think this article is more believable.
I don't get the reference to the "now-history 15" iMac...". Did the poster mean to imply that the 15" iMac is being phased out, or that the 15" iMac has waned in it's popularity. Surely apple isn't phasing out *both* the 15" and 17" iMacs. right?
Hon Hai replaces LG as sole supplier of Apple's iMac/eMac PCs - report
TAIPEI (AFX-ASIA) - Hon Hai Precision Industry Co Ltd (2317.TW) has replaced LG Electronics Co as the sole supplier of Apple Computer Inc's iMac/eMac desktop PCs, with 2003 shipments estimated at up to 1.0 mln units, the Economic Daily News reported without citing a source. While Chunghwa Picture Tubes Ltd (2475.TW) will provide 17-inch monitors for the eMac machines, AU Optronics Corp (2409.TW) has been certified as a TFT-LCD panel supplier to Apple Computer, it said.
No electrons were harmed creating this post, though some may have been subjected to electrical and/or magnetic fields.
Both 19" and 22" iMacs have been rumored. It's MacWorld time.
It's not the end of the iMac. Apple will be in business next month. They will still be selling one button mice. They will still be annoying Wintel gearheads.
So far as I can figure, there are two types of people who bought this thing. The first group is predictible and, as such, irrelevant: Mac die-hards who would buy the latest-and-greatest regardless.
Then, there's the people living in this posh little urban apartments who bought it because it'd look cool on their Britanny Computer Desk from Crate & Barrel. These people are a good market, because they have too much money and they use it to buy things to make them seem hip. This may be a slightly down time for these people, but they're still around and you can bet your bottom dollar they'll be back in force the second the economy upticks.
For a little while, it really looked as if that was the new key market for these iMacs -- the designer crowd. But the problem with selling to the designer crowd is that if you don't have something *different* every six months or so, you've destroyed the whole point of the attraction. Once grandmas in the Midwest start getting these things on their desk, it's time to move on.
Well, this thing's overstayed it's time, and there's still no heir apparent. C'mon, Jobs -- you decided on the target market. Start selling.
Every year during my review, I just pray the words "slashdot.org" aren't mentioned.
The 17" iMac was one of the very few Apple products I've had any interest in. If there's any truth to this, maybe they'll have a sale on the remaining stock.
No sig for you. YOU GET NO SIG!
IIRC, there were a lot of problems with the 17 inch studio display. People were reporting "popping" sounds coming from their monitors. This usually means static discharge.
When you hear those sounds, it normally means your monitor is about to crap out. The problems I heard of had all occurred, conveniently enough, after Apple's 1 year warranty had expired. The cost for out-of-warranty repair for those studio displays is around $300. A friend of mine had to get repairs done on his for some reason (it wasn't static discharge) and that was the price they quoted him.
the byproduct of years of oppression by the white man
Perhaps that's more accurately described as "only adopter" crowd. This is a fact that many Mac fans wont face up to. "Good design" is on consumers lists of possitives but it's pretty far down the list below "good price"
The article has a related blurb (registration required) at the bottom that says that a 19" iMac will be available in 3Q.
If the 17" iMac caused the death of the 15", it would follow that the 19" would kill the 17".
Yes, that's right. Good. Maybe we can stop fretting about deflation, which causes people to wait for prices to drop and can result in a vicious cycle of slowing production and layoffs.
For all intensive purposes, "whom" is no longer a word. That begs the question, "who cares"?
If this is true, it probably means the PowerPC 970 is going to be ready to ship in Macs for MWNY.
My God, it's Full of Source!
OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
The recent rumors were that apple would intro a 19" iMac this January. But with LCD prices for this size range not dropping and possibly increasing, that rumor is fading. Additionally, a 19" 'head' on the same iMac base would not be aesthetically pleasing (it would look funny). The only way that Apple is dropping all 17" iMacs and moving to all 19" is with great pricing on the new screens and a form factor change. Don't forget that it is always possible that Apple is working on a new enclosure (mood Mac story)that might use a different 17" LCD.
.....of getting things wrong.
Actually the last quarter financials did not imply the LCD iMacs were quite so dead in the water. Most of Apple's $$$ recently has been from 10.2, and it is the G4 towers that have really not been selling as well as they should be. Everything else was steady. The reason Apple's profits were not as nice as some people would want (even in this market) was due to a lot of cash going to opening stores and in the buying a few software companies out.
It's possible Apple is switching to another plant. At one point Apple invested a lot of $$$$ in some LCD manufacturing plant, though i forget which one. That was why they did better in the LCD shortages than some other manufacturers. They traditionally have invested in some of the plants that produce their parts, and that seems to give them a bit of leverage when parts get tight and i guess helps them when they have their demands of secret products and quick production changes.
Somebody else would know better, but is the main Apple LCD supplying plant, or were they using it to get the initial supplies up to match initial demand? They have done that in the past too.
MacWorld Keynote is next week, i assume *something* will change there and maybe in the few weeks following. Last year the G4 towers were bumped to 1GHz in a no-press website update about 3 weeks after MacWorld SF.
The first time I saw an IMAC with the 17" flat panel...I almost wanted to own one. Despite being a die hard pc user, the flat panel on the imac came close to converting me.
To this day it just seems like the quality of the image with the bold, bright colors is the best flat panel out there.
YMMV
It seems to me Slashdot got trolled bigtime on this one. I don't see Apple discontinuing either of the flat-panel iMacs, especially since everyone seems to like them.
Now stopping production to update the product line? With MacWorld coming up, that doesn't seem to be much of a stretch. Or maybe they're just moving production to a company that doesn't broadcast all of Apple's future moves to the entire world.
This seems like a real blow for Apple. Although the G4 towers have higher profit margins, the iMac has always been very visible and great for home users, who are a large portion of Apple's customers. I'm betting that they're going to pull out something new at the upcoming Macworld show in January. We all know Steve Jobs likes a bit of suspense and showmanship...
Upon initial reading of this story and thread I was saddened by the loss of another Mac line but now I have the strange urge to find an old fellow named Ike Thomas.
Trolling is a art,
Apple is STILL selling 15 and 17 iMacs. The 15 DISPLAY was discontinued a while ago, but that has NOTHING to do with the iMacs.
A ppleStore
Go here to check http://store.apple.com/1-800-MY-APPLE/WebObjects/
Current rumors are that the 15 iMac will be discontinued at MW Expo 7 jan, in favor of a 17 across the board.
Digitimes should get their facts straight.
..to MacDot...who gives a shit, cuz it is all overpriced.
Just because the production is stopped does not mean that it will not resume at some point, maybe with modded specs...
Maybe I'm missing the rumor attraction, but since I am in the market for another Mac, I'm just going to wait to see what arrives with the next keynote speech, and go from there.
Everybody Chungwha tonight.
KFG
I haven't seen anything online suggesting that 15" production will stop altogether, so be wary of those who predict that every iMac will be a 17" model as of next week.
Apple, like most computer manufacturers, will EOL (end-of-line) a product depending on when they release a new model, as well as how many existing models they need to clear out of their stock. Apple could well have just stopped production on the current-generation iMacs because they're about to be replaced, and did so in October because they knew that interest in the initial models was fading fast after almost a year.
Mind you, would I (and others) like it if there were nothing but 17" models at about the same prices? Heck yeah.
Well if the article is right, then Apple will be releasing new models at MWSF right? This in itself is a bit of a scoop, you wouldn't expect them to have an all new iMac since the this model has only been out for a year or so and the point in which sales dropped off would not have given them enough time to design an all new iMac (esp considering how long it took for them to come up with the latest one). I assume then that they are simply retiring the current line and coming out with different screen sizes with tweeks in configuration.
;)
Either that, or they have strengthened the arm enough to stick a 19" crt on it
This person does not own a Cube. The Cube had a standard VGA connector.
And how often do you change a cable? I think it's been about 8 months for me. Oh my God! You might have to move the case to plug in a cable! Oh, you poor cripple!
Many of these people would dearly love to have a solid house on an acre of land out in the suburbs. But home ownership has become less affordable and many people haven't really experienced an increase in their standard of living in decades. So, they settle for something cheaper: a small apartment. But because they aren't complete slobs, they at least want it to look nice, and gadgets are a fairly inexpensive way of making a place look nice, even iMacs.
The last thing those people need is your snide remarks.
If these rumors are true, I'm betting they're discontinuing the line just so they can bring out a series of colored iMacs. The current white line is very polarizing - you either love it or you hate it. I can see Apple announcing a line of non-white machines, most likely black, magenta, and navy, before then, maybe during Mac World New York. The line's just too successful to think otherwise.
Marxism is the opiate of dumbasses
Far to the North where the winter storms whip the weather-beaten coasts, you will find a long and narrow country. Here you see dark forests with moonlit lakes, deep fjords surrounded by mighty snowcapped mountains, and long rivers and cold streams cascading down the mountain sides.
......... and all the trolls.
Nowadays this country is covered by snow and ice only six months a year. A long, long time ago, however, there existed a massive glacier that brooded over the entire country for thousands of years.
As the climate gradually warmed and the glacier slowly retreated to the North, Man to the South of the glacier followed in its wake. Looking at this country and finding it to be magnificent, they considered themselves to be its first inhibitants. People settled there and named it Norway. They were themselves called "nordmenn" (Men of the North).
As the climate gradually warmed and the glacier slowly retreated to the North, Man to the South of the glacier followed in its wake. Looking at this country and finding it to be magnificent, they considered themselves to be its first inhibitants. People settled there and named it Norway. They were themselves called "nordmenn" (Men of the North).
It did not trake them long, however, to realize that on this land there were various other creatures hiding out in the forests and mountain sides. People did not know what these creatures were, but they were generally believed to have supernatural powers, and they came to be known as trolls.
The trolls would come out of their hidingplaces only after sunset, and they would disappear before the morning sun arose in the East. Direct exposure to the sun could cause them to crack, turn into stone and possibly burst. On occasion the trolls would evidently forget to hide from the sun, and rock formations can today be found in various places with troll-like features.
The trolls were mostly seen on bright moonlit nights, or during stormy nights that could frighten about anyone who happened to be outdoors at that time.
The trolls had very distinct features. They had long crooked noses, only four fingers and toes on each limb, and most of them had long bushy tails.
Some trolls were giants, and others were small. There were stories of two-headed as well as three-headed trolls, and even a few had only one eye in the middle of their wrinkled fore-heads. Others had trees and rough moss-like growth all over their heads and noses.
Although they were shaggy and rough-haired, and most looked frightening, they were also known to be good-natured and naive. So naive in fact that even shy peasant boys could, on occasion, easily trick them. Stories about such encounters are common in the fairytales.
The ability to transform themselves counted among the trolls many supernatural skills. The fairy maidens - called "Hulder" - could transform into incredible attractive young ladies. However, they could not get rid of their tails. Hunters and farmers sons, who were lured to the mountains by these fairies, would usually check for tails on their new-found beauties.
The wrath of the trolls was boundless. It was therefore considered very important not to make them your enemy. If a farmer did provoke a troll, his livestock might be subject to disease or harmful sickness, or worse things could happen. On the other hand, a good relationship with the trolls could be very rewarding.
Now, even in modern times it is well advised to keep a good standing with the trolls, since you never know when you will meet one yourself. The next time you go to the dark forest and the mighty mountains with their deep lakes and roaring waterfalls, just remember, they propably mean no harm. But be aware. In the twilight hours you are no longer alone.
Then it is only you
First, stop referring to yourself in the third person. We know it's you. Nobody else would step in to defend your idiotic post.
Second, it's very off-topic.
those G4 towers won't sell because of the crapulous inability of Motorola to get the fucking MPC 7470 out the door. We would've upgraded our workstations this autumn if they had been true DDR machines (and maybe NOT looked like shit). Apple needs a FAST workstation to sell it - professional users don't mind spending the money, but we want a realistic speed boost over our existing 733Mhz 'stations. Motorola, do some fucking WORK!
That was classic intercourse!
Is this big news?
Man I was looking forward to getting a 17" model for my kid. Doh, better get one quick before they're gone.
I seem to recall a foreign site months ago saying that Apple was discontinuing 15" iMacs, but what really happened was 15" LCD displays went away.
Maybe a similar translation error is occuring here?
This says that the 17in iMac is a huge success that is going to enjoy one of the longest production runs i the Jobs era. (the normal rate is 6 months.)
...
It also says that production of the 15incher has stopped, so we will get an announcement @ MacWorld that the imac will be al 17inchers from now on.
So -- we are going to live with the current form factor imac for at least six or seven months to come.
Pity I still can't afford one
penhead
The iCube? There is no such thing. Try the "Cube".
Actually, it is a great product - just marketed towards the wrong audience. Quiet as a mouse but many power users do feel the need for extra slots, even if they don't use them.
- Zav - Imagine a Beowulf cluster of insensitive clods...
The article says that they were introduced last January. So that's a 1 1/2 year shelf life for a computer line. So what's the big deal? If they don't come out with a new model to replace it, now that would be a big deal.
I am an Apple Reseller. This is all wrong. As others have pointed out the 15" LCD iMac is absolutly still being made. I have proof that both the 15" and 17" are being produced.
Apple serial numbers include the week the product was produced. I got a delivery this very morning of both 15" and 17" made in the first week of december 2002.
blackfly
Go to the Apple Store at Apple.com.
Click on the iMac.
Notice that not only is the 17" iMac for sale, but so is the "defunct" 15" model.
Just another tribute to the Slashdot school of journalism.
While Mac OS X is breathtaking, and the aesthetic design of the cases is both stylish and functional, the processor technology lags far behind the x86 market, and the equipment is quite simply overpriced.
What is more, much of Mac OS X is written outside of Apple (BSD, Mach, gcc, et al). In theory, Apple's OS development costs should be somewhat below Microsoft. There are more than a few cases where Apple's OS tools are substandard, also.
I suggest that Apple release a $350 450MHz G3 with USB and a standard VGA connector. It could double as a gaming machine. Please bundle StarOffice, and it is also time to ditch IE (I hate popups).
Apple also ought to investigate the embedded market with OS X, especially since Linux has made great strides in this area. A Tivo running a stripped down OS X with Apple branding would have an enormous impact on Apple's visibility.
Get an XServe. Rack mount, no pastels, indicator lights on the front.... XServe design.
Yeah, that strategy worked WONDERS for Be, Inc and Sun (Solaris X86).
If you're going to troll, at least try to be clever about it.
Kind of strange how they've been selling computers for the past 20 years if NOBODY is willing to buy them...
For $1000 I can get a $200 Walmart PC that will run circles around an imac performance wise, and a nice 17" Viewsonic monitor. The current rate for a 17" imac is $1999. Does anyone else see the problem for Apple here?
e e-software-hassles wave. The problem is, none of those waves has done anything to create a solid customer base, and Apple is falling back into its old habit of hyping gimmicks to the undying cult of Mac Geeks, who cannot keep that company alive. The time has come for Apple to start a new wave, the Apple-switched-to-AMD-CPUs-and-cheap-RAM wave, and then the company might have a chance in the long run.
Apple's problem is that consumers have grown up. Windows is just as easy to use and more reliable (I have had fewer Win2K crashes since 1999 than I have with OS X since 2001.) than Mac OS 9 or X, so Apple cannot keep pushing the ease of use button. People know that Apple's 700MHz CPUs are slow compared to the 2+ GHz X86 CPUs, and that Apple is charging twice as much for RAM and old Nvidia/ATI cards than X86 vendors.
I have said this before and I will keep saying it; Apple computers cost too much. Buying my ibook was the worst computer-related decision I have ever made, and after seeing how an Apple system performs for the cost, I will never do it again, nor would I encourage anyone else to.
Apple has been riding on waves lately; the Jobs-is-back wave, the visual-aesthetics-are-nice wave, and is now trying to stay on top of the Linux-geeks-really-want-to-watch-a-DVD-with-no-fr
that's funny, I bought FOUR in the last 9 months.. a TiBook and G4 dual for home, a G4 for work, and a 17" iMac for my GF for xMas.
I'm going ot go out on a limb and say two things:
1. You have never USED a Mac running OS X (and you probably wouldn't know what to do with a shell, Apache, MySQL, a good GUI, etc anyway)
2. You have never actually built a box (or even better, bought one from Dell, Gateway, etc.) that was FEATURE EXACT and *then* made your "overpriced" out-your-ass comments. Given you cna't compare processor speeds per say (assume 1.5x to 2x speed of G4 == speed of Intel) go ahead. Make sure you include OS, basic productivity SW and so on.
God I hate moronic zealots (both PeeCee *and* Mac) it's fine to dislike somehing based on KNOWLEDGE AND EXPERIENCE... but fukcing-a 99% of the people who say "Macs suck, they are overpriced and blah blah blah" have never priced or USED one!!!!
OK, my rant for 2003 is done.
Department of Homeland Security: Removing the rights real patriots fought and died for since 2001
Yeah, that fits right in with Apple's business model. Please mod parent as "-1 Troll".
since quartz/aqua is built atop a bsd core, why couldn't apple just recopmpile it to run under linux. it shouldn't be THAT hard. i can't comment about problems with X, since i have 7 xclients set up in my classroom that run great, but, i know that most desktops/users wouldn't need the client/server architecture, and would love to run something like aqua on x86. there is no reason apple can't sell it on top of linux. it wouldn't need to link to any gpl code, and if i'm not mistaken, it's already compiled under gcc. imagine a new P4 running linux with aqua on top. it requires no porting of darwin, it doesn't really cut into mac sales, and it would be easy to get apps like photoshop, dreamweaver, etc., ported. well, that's what i think.
My problem? I was perfectly gruntled, until some numbnuts came by and dissed me.
First of all, the new product announcements are in a few days. That could clear things up. Second, are you all really going to take the word of an obscure Asian business journal as the death knell of the best selling computer Apple has built in the last three years?
The 15" iMac has been consistently rumored to have been discontinued, but this has been refuted by other sources. It is still for sale on Apple's site and in retail stores - but the reigining theory is that it will be history in favor of the 17" model. It has to do with better margins for 17" LCDs vs 15".
Another story widely posted Thursday details the iMac (and eMac) production being switched to a new manufacturer, so maybe the reporters got half the story.
And lastly, how the heck do you kill a computer six months from now? That makes little to no business sense. The rumors of the iMac's death... you know the rest.
Most Mac-rumor sites seem to think that Apple is going to drop the 15inch iMac in favor of the 17inch. I highly doubt Apple is going to stop selling both the 15in and 17in iMac. The LCD iMac does not seem to be another "cube" for Apple... this product has sold a -lot- better.
Slashdot needs to leave stuff like this up to macrumors.com, macosrumors.com, or thinksecret.com
"Things are more moderner than before- bigger, and yet smaller- it's computers-- San Dimas High School football RULES!"
Its all about market segmentation.
Some people are willing to accept low build quality and poor user experience in exchange for a low price.
Some people want high build quality and excellent user experience, accepting the high price it costs.
I want to enjoy using my computer. I therefore buy apple.
i agree 100% with you. Moto does not seem to be making the chips like they should. The rumors of the pending IBM 970 chip (rollout in 2nd half of 2003) are not going to help G4 tower sales for the next 6 months. I would think there will be at least 1 G4 tower revision between today and July. It may be next week, or in the following weeks/months. I think the people buying G4 towers now are people that NEED them. people that are thinking of upgrading, like me, are waiting or pondering the upgrade kits.
i could pay $1600 for a dual 867MGhz (or students can still get a single 867MGhz for about $1300 from the edu store) or pay $450 for a 800MGHZ upgrade card from Sonnet. Since the DDR doesnt seem to be benchmarking too much better, upgrading the processor on my G4 400MGhzAGP really seems like a reasonable hold over for the next year. Even if the 970 chips only end up in Xserve or something, the G4 towers should have the motherboards tweaked by then.
My entire post may be redundant, so feel free to point out and mod down, but as I understood it, the classic 1-piece iMac machines were the "iMacs" and the new lamp-shaped ones were the "iMac 2's", and I had assumed that when they started making the iMac 2, they stopped the iMac's. So now what, if this is the end of the iMac 2? Is there an iMac 3 on the horizon? Or is Apple sticking with another system? Making more iMacs?
Or do I have this completely wrong?
Schnapple
even tho the article explicitly states it is the 17" imac being terminated, i believe it to be an oversight. here's why: "The 17-inch flat-panel iMac will terminate production in June, following the same fate as the 15-inch flat-panel model, which stopped production last October, said local PC makers familiar with the matter." the 15" imac was not terminated. it was the 15" standalone flat panel monitor. following the logic of the above statement, would it not stand to reason that the 17" flat panel monitor would 'suffer the same fate' and NOT the imac? just my $.02
if it ain't broke, break it.
hey, when did Slashdot become yet another Mac rumors site? I must have been away for the holidays..
"Eagles may soar, but weasels dont get sucked into jet engines."
ROTFL Mac Rant ... I understand you people are one mass inferiority complex but despite your whining insistence to the contrary, you are not more knowledgeable about computers than PC users. Some of you obviously don't even know what a (wink) is. In fact I would say that most are to scared or lazy to try XP or Linux. Why is it most of you have started your letters with, "I have been using computers for X numbers of years" like that makes you an expert? I know a number of people that can run circles around you and I on a computer that are under 16 years old....
Everyone is waiting for the price to go down. Flat panels are way too overpriced. If the average flatpanel prices were cut by 1/3 people would start buying.
Save the World! Use a Quote!
An article at MacWorld UK says that Apple is going to be switching its supplier of iMacs and eMacs. I think it's likely that the real story here is that LG will stop production of the iMac in June, NOT that Apple will stop making them completely. Obviously I can't be certain that both reports aren't true, but this certainly looks like another example of bad journalism.
I remember reading somewhere that Apple has ordered a run of 19" screens (presumably for the iMac).
If this is so, I'd think we're just seeing another product cycle. I'm betting Apple keeps the current iMac alive until they upgrade the Powermac.
This is my post. There are many others like it. If you don't like what you read here, go try one of the others.
it seems unlikely that Apple would scrap the flat panel iMac all together considering the success it has brough them. also, as an Apple technician, the eMac CRT screens are notoriously bad with about 60% of them having to be replaced a few months after purchase.
if Apple wants to survive this year, they have to introduce a new CPU altogether. they've pushed the G4 as far as it can go and die hard Apple fans are not going to put up with yet another speed bump.
as for Macworld, i'm prediciting a new lifestyle device and perhaps a new iPod (perhaps one that sync wirelessly with your computer?)
Good lord man! How do you live with yourself? Considering your espoused hatred of zealots combined with your obvious Mac Zealot status, you must obviously go from day to day in a state of self disgust.
Unless we are talking about benchmarks optimized for MP and Altivec, there is no way that a mac cycle is even close to 2x as powerful as a p4 cycle. Maybe a 33% (but really more like 20%)clock for clock advantage for Mac.
Now Apple ships a 1.25ghz chip. Intel ships a 3.7ghz chip. The flagship comparison works out to something like 1.6-2ghz Apple vs. 3.7ghz Intel, when adjusted. So just stop lieing to yourself and everyone else about speed and be proud of your beautiful design and retard freindly interface.
LOL, zealot much?
PC's absolutely kill Mac's power-wise. There is no comparison. Yes, the PPC and can more work at the same clock but the clocks are way, _WAY_, different. You're comparing 1 Ghz Mac's to 3+ Ghz PC's. And PC's are hella cheaper.
OS X is OK, but not perfect. It's main problems are the damn dynamic binding of Objective-C (optimizing install - huh?) and the general "objectness" of the whole system (Aqua on BSD on Mach, blah blah). That stuff makes it run slow and the hardware doesn't help matters.
And you get all that for 2 times as much cost as a PC.
No, I'm not talking out my ass, I do own several Macs (bought just to run and play with OS X). I _HAVE_ benchmarked and compared processors and the OS performance. OS X is cool but Apple is far behind and Mac's are hardly powerhouses.
they own 30% of Samsung, IIRC.
Just raise the taxes on crack.
for pete's sake, is it that hard to understand?
Apple was using LG Electronics and they have ceased production. Hon Hai Precision Industry is now making the eMacs and iMacs.
I'll ignore the processor flaimbait.
iat of M$.
DD, Disk Utility, tcsh, and such have no included equivalent in winshit.
You can't judge a book by the way it wears its hair.
Your claim that a 800Mhz Cyrix is going to "run circles" around a 800Mhz G4 is beyond absurd. Benchmarks from half a dozen sites have clearly shown that the 800Mhz cyrix can't compete with 500-600Mhz celeron's. Those processors in turn are MURDERED by even equivalent speed G4's.
So the iBook wasn't for you. That's OK. Take a prozac. But if you can't figure out that for some users, macs are a great choice, you're doing them a great disservice in recommending something else.
For some computer users (i.e. the mass majority of computer owning consumers), its not the act of hacking away at their boxes that they derive satisfaction from, but the finished product they get from it that interests them. They don't admin networks or write cgi scripts, they make greeting cards and mix CD's for friends. Apple makes great consumer applications, and a lot of people buy them and have a good time. You shouldn't have giant bleeding ulcer's over it.
I appologize on behalf of Apple Computers that they had the gaul to release products that don't appeal to you. I might as well extend that to every other company on the planet who's goods or services you don't patronize.
This is where I get my recommended daily allowance of "Foot in Mouth."
According to this article Apple switched from LG Electronics to Hon Hai Precision Industry as the manufacturer of BOTH the 15" and 17" iMacs.
[sigh] Same FUD, different day.
MacTacToe - for every problem, an elegant solution
I was all set and ready to buy a 17" iMac ... as soon as I could get one without having to get the superdrive.
Maybe sales would not slump if people were able to get what they really want? I know that makes for a manufacturing/production problem, but if there are more like me who absolutely won't buy one until I get a combination that I can deal with, it is the difference between selling an iMac and not selling an iMac.
I think most Mac users would choke on their Wheaties if someone told them that they "should" add serial/parallel ports and a floppy drive to their systems. You DO realize that the only reason they've been on computers so long is because they're legacy devices, right?
And it's fairly evident that you haven't really used or read about Macs as of late. 256 MB is very much useable on most Macs (like my PowerBook 867) running OS X. It's also entirely possible that MacWorld San Francisco will bump up the minimum memory to 256 on at least the iMac, as well as add USB 2 and/or Firewire 2.
Furthermore: the current Firewire spec has actually been demonstrated as being about as fast (or faster) than USB 2 in practice. Most Mac users probably wouldn't care much about USB 2 except that they would want to ensure ultimate compatibility.
Your really not gettting it. The 15-inch went away because everyone wanted the 17-inch. The 17-inch will go away in June because it will certainly be replaced by and 18-19 inch iMac. All you have to do is read the number to see that the iMac has done very well and will coninue to do so.
Why don't these macs come with a built in digital out for sound? Except that strange USB solution, of course. This has been standard on most pc's for a long while and is especially strange since a lot of people use macs for audio/video-editing applications. I'm planning on buying one of those gorgeous powerbooks (first mac), but i'm going to have to spend another 100+ dollars on an USB to S/Pdif adaptor. Not that that'll break the bank, compared to the cost of the powerbook. Admittedly, these are the only drawbacks I could find.
Apple sells computers. Porting OS X to a non-Apple platform just means that they'd be in the business of competing with themselves. I.e., why buy a Mac if you can simply buy OS X to run on your Intel box? It doesn't business sense for Apple to do this.
-- Slashdot: When Public Access TV Says "No"
thank you for proving my point =)
/., and America wouldn't have to bomb Iraq when a Bush is in office.
I said do a COMPERABLE system. Did I say "my mac is as fast as the top of the line p4?"
NO!! BUT IT'S SO MUCH EAIER TO SPEW CRAP THAN THINK!!!
I'd say my dual 1GHz G4 is about as fast as a 2.1 GHz single processor P4. You may think otherwise... *sigh*
I hope someday there is a cure for "I need to bash what I don't understand" syndrom... then I wouldn't have to post on
As far as my "retard" interface, yesh, the Bash shell is pretty hard to mess up, no messy buttons to press, no contextual menus, so way windows can get lost behing the other ones... tho I miss not having a START button in case I'm too fuckign stupid to know what to do after I turn the damn thing on.
Department of Homeland Security: Removing the rights real patriots fought and died for since 2001
um, are you retarded?
Intel is NOT shipping 3.7 GHz chips...
Apple only ships duals in their towers.
If you compare a top of the line P4 to a top of the line G4, you get a dual 1.25GHz vs. a 3GHz P4.
make up some numbers in your head and weigh that.
Anyway... from the benchmarks I've seen... aside from SPEC which the PPC seems to do rather poorly in, the G4 usually pulled comparable FP and Int performance to an Athlon at the same speed (athlon slightly faster except in SIMD). Athlons are a lot faster than P4s when the clocks are the same.
Defending firewire vs. USB 2.0 is a lot like the Mac zealots of olde saying SCSI was so much better than IDE. Usually they would have to bring up esoteric engineering issues to "demonstrate" the advantage, since IDE was faster and much less expensive than SCSI.
As for serial and parallel ports - I'm using mine on my PC. The serial port is being used to download data from my GPS, and the parallel port is used with an older laser printer I have that still works fine. In both cases, I would have to buy extra equipment to use them on a Mac, equipment that would easily cost an additional $100.
They're working their ASSES off. It's just that things are a little tight, so they're not devoting all their resources to one single buyer who's fickle as hell, doesn't make them much money and is a GIANT pain in the ass to deal with.
Apple people are tired of hearing about "killing the clones" but that doesn't matter, because Moto's ass is still sore and you don't fuck with Daddy.
Enjoy your new windtunnel designs at MWSF. Bottlenecks are symmetrical, right? Maybe the next iMac will be conical. Form follows function.
Intel is NOT shipping 3.7 GHz chips...m l
yes the are: http://www.tomshardware.com/cpu/20021114/index.ht
Apple only ships duals in their towers.
Well, I did disclaim this in my original post when I exluded benchmarks optimized for MP and Altivec.
Anyway... from the benchmarks I've seen... aside from SPEC which the PPC seems to do rather poorly in, the G4 usually pulled comparable FP and Int performance to an Athlon at the same speed
You are right, the G4s are pretty slow in SPEC, but they are also considerably slower then both Athlon and P4 in videoediting apps optimized for Altivec and MP. look here for some proof.
"Apples processor's don't Lag Far behind anyone's processors."
You're either
(a) Trolling
(b) An idiot
Which is it?
"I make around $20,000 a year and I needed a new computer."
If you make $20K, you most certainly did not need a new computer.
If you needed a computer, you needed the cheapest computer you could find. Taking out a loan to buy a computer is the height of fiscal irresponsibility and marks you to your family and friends as someone whose judgement cannot be trusted. You confuse want with need must like an infant and must gain more maturity.
Said more simply: Your priorities are screwed up and you behave childishly.
it was stolen.
Linux - Because Mommy taught me to Share.
"For a CCNP with 5 years exp. there were approx 325 resumes for the last contract job I found. For a technical writer with 8 years exp, there were 276 resumes for the last contract job."
I understand. You don't work in the computer industry, you work on the periphery of the computer industry. CCNP is the equivalent of a computer operator, and a tech writer is... not a real job.
I said do a COMPERABLE system.
no you didnt. you said:
Given you cna't compare processor speeds per say (assume 1.5x to 2x speed of G4 == speed of Intel)
To which I responded with an attack on your assumptions regarding procesor comparisons. My conclusion was that as you were clearly so far off from from reality in your assessment that a G4 cycle is worth 1.5-2x a P4 cycle, that you must be a mac evangelist, a zealot and a sel loathing hermit.
The people are objecting are those he lampooned effectively.
If you don't like the reflection in the mirror than change yourself so the image no longer fits.
But don't blame the messenger for stating the truth.
Nobody has used the FUD acronym since the days when OS/2 finally died back in '95.
Regarding dual processing:
PowerMacs distribute processes between the two processors... NO ONE runs only one process at a time... why should you use benchmarks that don't consider this...
Probably the best benchmark would be a run a swarm of benchmarks simultaneously...
I can't believe with circa 400 posts no one noticed that the figures quoted in this piece of kaka article actually indicate an *increase* in flat-panel iMac sales!
... 500,000 - 600,000 sold in the 12 months of 2002 ... 300,000 - 400,000 forecast to be sold in the 6 months between now and *termination* in June 2003.
... and God knows they've confounded me on occasion ... but they'd have never lasted this long by cancelling products whose sales are still INCREASING!
Check it out
Look, I know a lot of you have very little respect for Apple's business acumen
Flat! Flat! Flat!
I was just reading the article, and I am just curious who these "sources" are, because according to the related links at the bottom of the page, Apple was going to release a 19" Imac in the third quarter of 2002.
Somehow, based on thier articles that they have posted, and the related announcements next to the article, by the fact that 15" Imacs and 17" Imacs, NOT 17" and 19" Imacs, that there is a bit of faultiness surrounding the "sources" that give this newspage it's articles concerning Apple.
My $.02, and probably said already at that... but oh well.
----- I want my LART.
Here's the problem with your comparison: I dont need serial ports, paralell ports, or a floppy drive. So why should I add them, just to make it exact? I haven't touched them in months with my Mac...and when I tell that to people, they get this shocked look on thier faces. You should have seen my computer teacher's face when I told her my computer didn't have a floppy drive. It was priceless. As for the mouse with more than one button argument...I too, prefer a two button mouse...with a scroll wheel, too...but I've used both in the past two weeks, and it's not too big a pain to use a single mouse button.
This story was posted by someone who doesn't have a clue about Apple products. The 15" flat panel iMac AND the 17" flat panel iMac are still in production.
All that's happened is that Apple has switched suppliers.
If a story is wrong it should be yanked.
I'd be the owner of a $350 E-machine (1.4 Ghz Celeron), and not an Apple.
A Celeron and a G4 are probably about equal for general purpose computing; the G4 is probably going to be faster at some specialized tasks and floating point.
/.); they could finally get back into the CPU horsepower game.
But when you talk the heart of the x86 line, the P4 and Athalon XP, they simply blow the G4 away. A 3Ghz P4 or 2.6Ghz A-XP are at least double the speed of the fastest processor Apple has in its arsenal.
That's why I think Apple ought to use these processors (and please don't demonstrate stupidity by saying "apple can't make money just selling operating systems"; it would display a level of ignorance about the difference between a platform and a CPU that should forever ban you from
As it is now, I think OS X is the best OS out there bar none. But they run on technology that is lagging by 18-24 months.
1) He certainly didn't need an apple
2) Even if he did, he could've bought a 2-3 year old Mac and done his work just as effectively without placing a financial millstone around his neck.
He is irresponsible. He is childish because he must have the fastest toys now.
And for what... to do word processing and picking up email.
He'll have debts for 10 years because he lacks a sense of perspective. That is not insightful.
Hi.
/. world why, in my book, Apple can do no wrong (for now).
/. mods do by now, so I'll light one up and let 'er rip.
... and it's /portable/, too, no way!?]
.Net... but man, in the shops I worked in during the late 80's and 90's if you had Ethernet to the local microwave link (56k) to the computer room across town, holy shit. *That* was performance.
... hey, maybe MS' bugs were a *positive* thing for them and their slick hardware bed-partners, eh?
... shudder ... need to get things working under Win32/CYGWIN. I can barely tolerate a 'make' in that universe on *good* hardware anyway...).
...
...
...
...)
...
...
... other ... 'operating systems'. I believe you can actually *get* to Java in OSX, heh heh ...
.Net, etc.
/other/ reason I can see for getting a decent PC these days, and it is a bad one. IMHO.]
I've decided I don't rant nearly often enough about shit like this and for some reason your post has set me off, so I'm gonna pitch in here and tell the
I am not someone who cares what
Here goes:
My 500mhz tibook ('chipped', incidentally, from a 400mhz one, quite happily) gives me *plenty* of bang for the buck and for me: IT IS THE PERFECT COMPUTER (almost).
Why? A few good reasons:
- 1Gig of RAM [this is !pure sex! to old-timers, lemme tell you
- Case design is *PHAT* and groovy, and goes extremely well with my perspex furniture, next to my 19" rack here in the living room...
- The display just can't be beat. I'm yet to be as impressed with a laptop display as I was with the one on the tiBook when I first saw it up close and personal...
- OSX
But now, really, the *ONLY* reason worth arguing about and in this case the tiBook truly shines for me:
- Productivity
Now, I am really, really productive on this box.
About as productive as I, personally, could ever be without getting some sort of scarey Rael'ian upgrade.
I should say that I'm not a 'typical' user, though I don't think there is such a thing actually.
I'm a (mostly C+Unix, still, after all these years) programmer, since - essentially - '79.
Well, I started using Unix and mostly hacking around then, anyway, but even still the line at that time between programmer/user was always pretty blurry.
During the 80's and 90's my platform-of-choice was always whatever unix-box was available. These were computers: so well made they could do more than one thing at a time, inherently.
Performance back then, at least in my personal sphere, was often expressed in terms of *modem* speed. CPU speed? Well, that was already being measured and appropriated out of our direct control, as it is about to become, yawn, with
As a programmer, I've always had the notion of running my code on distant computers.
CPU-speed was something for the *ADMINS* to worry about, based on user-demand, not me. As long as my code ran as well as it possibly could, and did the job, that was just fine.
Coder vs. Admin vs. User. In that order.
It seems to me, then, that the more you get involved in administering a box, the more you fret about its performance and get sucked into the upgrade loop
On the other hand, it's always sweet as a coder to work out how to make things run faster without needing *any* new hardware... That's the best possible result from the above equation, in my opinion... (API's that imply that this can still happen always get my vote!)
And anyway, no matter what you do, there's *always* a way to make code run faster and better without needing hardware upgrades... at least from my perspective.
Getting back to my rant-topic, with the tiBook I am extremely productive, and extraordinarily content as a computer programmer and user.
With my tiBook I can quite happily replace a small network of PC's I used to use for development with 4 VirtualPC sessions instead, each running its own particular PC-based OS (mostly BSD and Linux for me, but I have a Windows image around if I ever
Admittedly, these were ancient PC's (Pentium-I and -II class), but nevertheless they were, in spite of their hardware specs, being used productively in my computer room, and they're even virtually productive 'now' in VPC land.
(Not to mention that - when needed - I can *really* push my apps into the free space that 1GIG provides: portably. Whoa. Did I mention 'pure sex'? 64k was sexy, 1GIG is out of control)
So yeah, I guess I'm moderately old-school, computer-wise but for some reason this results in me feeling honestly that OSX is a dream to code for, from inside to out, top to bottom. It is the apex of a loooong - in computer-market terms - computing history.
I honestly do *not* want to get caught up in the horrid trap that is Windows: here's a strange thought - computer hardware should be getting *faster* as code is better and better tuned as it ages, not slower!!! It's the API's, dummy! The API's are Microsofts' hamster-wheel - they'll *never* get faster, only slower!
As someone who first cut their teeth in Windows hacking with the *first beta* of Microsoft Virtual C (not C++) for Windows3.1 (Pre-WFW 3.11) and subsequently ran screaming in terror back to his MIPS/RISCOS login until Borland came along, I think you can get the point about OSX being nice to code for
Speaking of that lovely MIPS login and all it offered to my personal working/coding (and thus, computing) 'heritage', I suppose I should admit that my 'personal hardware' history leading up to tiBook glory is a little off-beat. I guess it goes something like this:
-- Apple II - okay, hands up who *didn't* grow up trying to convince their folks to buy them one of these when they came out? That would have been me, but only because I spent *all* my free time in the Computerland Apple store, hacking away. I didn't *NEED* to buy it, what I needed to do was quit school and make enough money to own my own computer, fast! Heh heh... then Dad bought me:
-- Oric-1 + Modem. First personal computer, mostly a terminal, but it could play games and run a plotter. That was neat. With this, I discovered Unix at a lovely 300 baud, and thus C
Oh boy. I didn't *need* to own the computer in order to use it... oh boy, oh boy, oh boy
Skip forward 5 or so years to '87/'88:
-- MIPS R3230, across the room but accessible when I needed to load a tape. I had a couple shit 286's running Desqview, which was my first 'sniff' at PC-land... but they only ever ran telnet to that box.
-- MIPS Magnum Pizza-box (first 'desktop' computer, and by that I mean it was on my desktop rather than sitting in the computer room next to the other MIPS, WANG, and Tandem systems I worked on, where, actually, it belonged. To have it on my desk was the only way to guarantee nobody else bigger than me would use it, sort of
(I should note that during the MIPS-era I'd lusted after a Next Cube, 5 weeks before it was announced by Steve, publicly. Somehow the MIPS guys had details on it, and boy did I want it. (Mostly as a *TERMINAL*, but I had designs on that DSP... a *TERMINAL* with a DSP! WAY COOL!!) I'd heard that NextStep was sweet (later found this to be true with NS4/Intel) but alas the box was just too expensive for me to justify it to the bosses as a 'new terminal', so I missed out on that one. It hurt to see Next die, but it was well-deserved.)
-- AST 486 running something horrid. I think it was early versions of SCO Unix. That was a nice thing to see on cheap PC's, but I remember it had weird int's. I mostly did filesystem work then, and I *HATED* the test disks from this box for their endian'ness! If you can't guess why, I'll tell you: I never had the SOURCE!
-- Then I dl'ed this thing called Linux in '93 from some fast server in Finland, and got it running on whatever PC-hardware was around. At this point in time, I still didn't care much for PC hardware: I don't care what anyone says, the *mentality* of an 8-bit design is still there... but somehow, Linux made it better.
I became a PC user and Windows developer during the darkness that was the 90's, mostly due to client requirements, but I gave up soon after Windows 98. Microsoft can eat shit: I'm not working to make them bigger and greedier any longer, no matter *what* they try to offer me. It's a trap, programmers!
However, around '94/'95, there was hope for my personal computing needs, such as they were (Ethernet to something fast was always more important than my desktop system, though, as a coder...)
-- SGI Boxen, too many to mention, mostly Indigo2/Indy class though. I decided I couldn't afford an Octane, and O2 was too close to PC territory and then, a few months later, that Windows NT-ONLY workstation scared me off SGI for good... FOR SHAME! I thought there was hope for SGI when I saw that laptop in the tornado movie, but godamn it was only a prop and not even a very good one at that. Too bad, but it set the fires a-burnin' that would only later be put out by my tiBook
-- For general-purpose hacking and coder-chops (its important!) I scrounged and got myself a BeBox. This was a *fantastic* hacking box. Man, what a great idea. Unix-ish'isms, a promising GUI, and a tight new kernel. Hey, even the filesystem was groovy: AND IT HAS MIDI!!! Yay!
Damn, did I pick a loser. Oh well, at least I'd avoided Amiga!
-- So, for production (that is what we're talking about here) at this point I had to switch to PC laptops running Linux. Oh, the pain, the agony, after so many beautiful years of avoiding Intel... still, we had some good times, me and Linux and I loved her from the start (still do, deeply!), until the golden era began:
-- tiBook running OSX.
And now, here we are.
In my opinion, Apple is a computer company that has survived for so long and is now, even still, worth supporting. Maybe IBM too. I conside their Linux work to be amends, though.
Steve is back at Apple and he has delivered on his promise:
OSX. PowerPC. Totally Portable.
You can groove in BSD-land with you-name-it shell, mix and match even, or play nice and cool in Cocoa-land with Objective-C
Hack away at pure C with the tried and true (POSIX), or do fancy-schmancy graphics tomfoolery with PDF-based widgets and glorious things like Aqua. With what is, frankly, a pretty fresh API for a GUI - oddly enough it also feels well proven, actually, I'd say. Maybe there's some OpenGL mojo in there, too.
Oh, I forgot to mention Java (I don't do Java), but hey: I've heard tiBooks are *primo* Java hacking boxes, and the JDK integration in OSX is smoovier and far less S&M'ish to
MySQL. Linux-friendly. fink. gcc. gcc *3.1*.
A 'Media hub', and then iSome... Watch -or- burn DVD's (so sci-fi!).
All of this: WHILE SITTING UNDER A TREE!
Plus, no matter how far I travel (and I've travelled far) I am yet to see any other laptop *function* as well in tems of pure hardware design. It's aged, but its aged well and it has actually survived our journeys together.
Every other laptop I've ever owned would have been completely grungy and getto by now - however, this tibook has somehow managed to maintain its shine and lustre thorugh an almost complete circumnavigation of the planet.
Okay so its 'aged beauty' might have something to do with the fact that I've *actually* replaced my own keyboard, case and hard drive (not to mention the aforementioned chippin' for speed) - but how many times can you say you've done *THAT* with a PC notebook? (see www.pbparts.com for starters, a link *all* tiBookers should appreciate and use well, as I have...)
Development-wise, I've never *EVER* had to be worried about processor speeds. Whatever flavour chip is available, I've always been able to run my code *plenty* fast.
Performance != Productivity.
CPU speeds are irrelevant now. They have gone past the point where human perception really matters - and not only that, parallelism technologies are on the rapid track (Internet++) to putting us all where we can just *rent* extra CPU time where its needed: on computational backends like the terribly-late
Arguing, or actually, getting caught up in arguments about CPU speeds is a dead giveaway that the person doing the arguing is someone who simply isn't using their computer productively enough, and thus they have time to notice... which as a phenomena, is oddly enough, also observable in someone with a 'slow' computer...
The tiBook is the perfect computer. Look at its heritage. You cannot argue with its heritage.
Okay. I think I've said enough about this. I now return to a state of torpor. Thank you for reading.
[Incidentally, I'd happily trade a mint vintage BeBox for a vintage ~mint NS Cube, if anyones interested... oh, and yah, before anyone starts, I know that "Productivity != Games", which is the only
; -- the corruption of government starts with its secrets. a truly free people keep no secrets. --
Well, as an OS 9.2 user, on a lazily built clamshell iBook, I can confirm Apple products really are badly designed, buggy pieces of crap. How Apple gets away with rubbish Microsoft would get murdered for, I have no idea.
As for Quark, it's a diminishing advantage, given Quark is hell-bent on pissing off all its users into the hands of InDesign. I am a Quark expert of 10 years standing and I can't wait to ditch it for Adobe (quality stuff, listen to users, continually improve their products). I look forward to the day when as a publishing pro, I can leave the whole Mac/Quark tyranny behind and switch to Adobe running on XP.
It's not far off..
From Northern Light:
Source: AFX News - Asia
Date: 01/01/2003 20:22
Hon Hai replaces LG as sole supplier of Apple's iMac/eMac PCs - report
TAIPEI (AFX-ASIA) - Hon Hai Precision Industry Co Ltd (2317.TW) has replaced LG Electronics Co as the sole supplier of Apple Computer Inc's iMac/eMac desktop PCs, with 2003 shipments estimated at up to 1.0 mln units, the Economic Daily News reported without citing a source.
For the same reason you Mac zealots want PC users to add multiple monitor support or DVD recording software before you admit that PCs are cheaper. Duh.
And all macs are DUAL PROCESSOR, which gives them more (but not double) processing power at the "speed" number which actually has nowhere near the effect on machine speed as the marketing guys at BOTH Inten and Apple would have you think. Oh wait, I forgot, you are bashing a Mac, so therefore you don't know shit about them.
A dual 1GHz Mac is equivalent, if not slightly superior to a 1.5Ghz to 2.0Ghz single Pentium. And that is me being very conservtive to avoid more shitting out of the mouth from people who buy marketing lingo liek it was handed down from god.
Would you like me to dumb it down for you more??
Department of Homeland Security: Removing the rights real patriots fought and died for since 2001
...that someone read the article.
Integrate Keynote and LaTeX
Wow, you have a 19" rack?!
Post some picts on autopron!
As you see now from the comments, the headline and blurb are completely wrong. See other posts (many modded up to 5) for corroboration. This is bad info that needs to be corrected. A Slashback is fine, but it should be in the original story too. Please update this! Thanks.
One simple rule for its versus it's
People in the industry read /. and they trust it to accurately reflect its claims. You guys act like news editors (it says "news" in your logo!) yet you do not abide by the same rules as other news organisations are held to. Accountability? Whatever...
Stories like this can only harm companies like Apple. When ondustry people see it and say "Slashdot says..." others take it as truth. It would appear that Slashdot editors are starting to suffer from the same syndrome much of its readership does; not reading and checking facts and accepting the blurb as containing the facts. This is exactly how this came to my attention. Someone in the industry wrote to inform me that the 17" iMacs were dead (and were therefore not a viable investment).
I've come to expect this sort of thing from Timothy, but I was shocked that Hemos posted this one. I think you owe it to your readers, the industry and Apple to correct this story, if not pull it altogether.
This is bullshit. Own up.
- I am made of meat.
I work at an Apple Store, and although we are not privy to advanced info, I see ZERO reason Apple would even consider dropping the 17". It sells at least as much as all the 15" combined. People walk into the store, and we nearly have to wipe their drool off the machine (which resides right inside the door). I hear it's 60% of iMac sales in Australia. I wouldn't believe this post for a moment.
And lastly, let me add the Cube was a phenomenal machine. Really, if you haven't worked on a Cube, you can't nearly appreciate its beauty nor the greatness of its silence. Besides, now you can get a 1Ghz upgrade in one. If I had the cash, I'd buy a used one and slap in an upgrade this second!
http://images.slashdot.org/banner/devc0017en.gif?1 041572708346
How fitting.
- I am made of meat.
"i happen to work at an ISP and need a laptop on the go"
Uh. Right. If you needed one, your employer would supply you with one.
What you mean is:
"I can get paged anytime when I'm on call. I can either be at home to handle it, or I can go out with my friends and try to look cool when a page comes in and handle it via some stupid CDMA modem that is expensive but impressive"
And of course, you could get a $300 used laptop and run BSD or Linux on it, but no, you decided you have to have a $1700 that performs the same function.
its childish. Grow up.
"Does he need a new computer? Yes."
Son, you may think yourself the cleverest piece of shit on the block, but I'm a parent and a geek, and I'm pretty smart, but mostly I've got the savvy and cunning that comes with my job.
You're full of crap. He's full of crap.
if his machine "broke down", then I'll tell you what you can do:
1) If its a HD, buy a new HD. You can get one for $20 at a computer show. I know, I've done it.
2) If he has a laptop that's all broken and busted, let me point out that laptops will always get broken and busted. Unless someone else is paying for them, don't buy a laptop. They're fragile and expensive and mostly an ego boost.
3) I did some checking at the last computer show...I can get a well-equipped P3 machine without monitor for under $200. Load Windows or Linux on it. Either will work.
4) You want new? The latest entry level from Dell/Gateway is $600 with monitor.
Problem solved. Life is going to smack you and your dopey friends around and hard if you don't start separating need from want.
He wants a Mac laptop now that will last him 2-3 years and he's going to take out a 5-10 year loan to pay for it.
That's stupid no matter how you slice it. Its moronic and its pretty clear his mom or dad needs to kick his ass and tell him to act like an adult.
You're fucking welcome.
I'm one of the nice ones, and I'm in management.
Taking 4 courses and passing a test makes you worth about $15 an hour.
Let ms spell it out.
Motorola doesn't invest as much as AMD and Intel in x86 developmentbecause Motorola doesn't get the volume AMD/Intel does.
Money = speed, and AMD/Intel simply have more to spend on this particular game.
A see a lot of posts where people are talking about Chunghwa display products in Apple computers. But nobody seems to be talking about Chunghwa's quality. As a person who's been working on repairing displays for the past 6 years, i can definately say that their display products are inferior to a lot of the competition. I'd much rather buy a computing product where i could provide my own display, cause i'd definately choose another manufacturer of display product than them, even if it ment paying extra money. I often find myself not caring about speed of processor or other things to display performance. After all, who cares if my system is fast as hell to the point where speed is impreciptable, if i'm looking at an ugly display thats going to fail on me soon and require me to repair it.
This is not the first time that rumors and false advertising has been used to try to erode market share from a superior competitor.
From www.thinksecret.com...
The nation's two biggest Apple distributors -- Ingram and TechData -- are sitting on anywhere from one to four weeks of iMac and eMac inventory. Only the top-level 17-inch, flat-panel G4 800MHz iMac with 80GB hard drive and SuperDrive are such great demand that more units are in shipment to distributors from Apple in quantities over 1,000.
Not likely.
--Rick "If it isn't broken, take it apart and find out why."
real news would be the opposite:
'17" iMac production unchanged after 1 year!!'
i mean, seriously, what did you expect? apple will revise it's iMac line. surprise!
Specifically, how robust are those bits of chrome that attach the tea tray to the pudding basin? I've never seen one in the flesh, and it's hard to tell from the publicity shots, but I would be scared of snapping the thing off the first time I tried to clean the screen.
Virtually serving coffee
The rumours are based on Apple ending 17" screen orders with on esupplier. But it seems they are just changing suppliers.
No reason to panic. In fact, the 17" SuperDrive equipped iMac is experiencing a shortage, as can be read in other reports.
I don't expect that the fact that you've contradicted yourself in the course of two sentences will mean anything to you, so I'll let it pass.
However...
I support PCs and Macs. I can buy the following and install them into a Mac tower with no problem: PC100 and/or PC 133 memory; IDE drives; SCSI drives; USB 2.0 (via PCI card); nVidia and ATI video cards; aftermarket fans; internal ZIP drives--they're IDE but what the hell--floppy drives (via USB); VGA monitors (CRT and LCD) and CPU upgrades.
Two other points: (1) I can run most Windows applications just fine with Virtual PC; (2) Check out the Mac OS X pane of www.versiontracker.com sometime. You'd just about be ready to graduate high school by the time you'd tried all the freeware, let alone the commercial and shareware apps.
> I'm off to play Battlefield 1942, hahaha!
Judging from your apparent level of maturity, I'll bet you're going off to play with something else... if you can find it.
Well,
Let me put it like this.
Imagine the PowerPC product as the car in your garage.
Now imagine Iridium as a pot of Tea on a table somewhere in China.
Other than the fact that they exist as part of the earth, what do they have to do with each other?
Exactly. Nothing.
Now what does Iridium have to do with PPC? Nothing, other than the fact that they are related to Motorola.
That's not quite true...the multi-billion dollar losses Motorola pumped into its Iridium spin-off makes it even less likely they can invest in more PPC technology.
There, now even *you* can understand.
Except that with the exception of Photoshop and Quake3, there isnt shit out there that is optimized for MP. So your second processor sits there idol. You fucking dolt.
But even worse, why on earth would you compare a dual processor system to a single processor system. Not all macs are dual, last I checked the iMac wasnt dual processors. So make the comparison to a pare of Athlon 1800MPs or maybe a pare of PIII-S chips at 1.5ghz. Apple's high end always gets creamed by AMD or Intel's highend.
So just admit your a friggin Mac evangelist, a zealot and a quiche eater and be done with it.
Shit. I could care less about the Mac vs. PC debate; each one is a long way off from what they should be. I just wish you Mac evangelists didnt go around preaching and lieing like a fundamentalist southern christian.
Buying the right tool for the job, especially when you have $2000 of software for that tool, is ALWAYS the right thing to do, if you can do it. If the correct tool is $1500, and the wrong tool is $200 plus several hundred hours of hassle and learning curve and failures and configuration problems and so forth... well, opportunity cost here is high.
Clearly he was irresponsible for buying a good-quality used car, too... I mean, why spend $5000 on a car when you can get something that will probably at least make it home for $500?
Sheesh.
--Fred
Sign #11 of Slashdot overdose: You see the phrase 'moderate Republican' and you wonder if that would be a +1 or a -1.
Heck, I haven't used it since I got rid of my old Apple IIe clone, a Franklin Ace 1000.
(FUD = Franklin Utilities for the Disk)
--Fred
Sign #11 of Slashdot overdose: You see the phrase 'moderate Republican' and you wonder if that would be a +1 or a -1.
I'm a 23 year old woman, and I think iMac's are great! That's pretty much the demographic that Apple is going for, and it is working.
Sex - Find It
if Apple is going intel.... maybe they have to discontinue the flat panel iMacs because intel chips run too hot to be in that casing. The Powermac design is due for an upgrade as well. www.shampoopoo.com
You're really a 14-year-old dumb ass. You are also gay, and that's why you think iMacs are great.
my OPERATING SYSTEM is MP opimized you fucking dolt.
Department of Homeland Security: Removing the rights real patriots fought and died for since 2001
You live in an apartment, spend $80 a month on a cell phone, go out to eat all the time and then complain about the high cost of living.
You are the epitome of a mindless consumer.
A $1500 computer isn't inherently better than a $100 computer, its just faster.
And for doing web browsing and writing papers, the $100 will do exactly the same thing as the $1500.
He probably wants to do some gaming, so he's going into debt to play games. Moron.
Of course they're still making the 15" iMacs. They have a ton of LCD screens left over, and they're going to continue to make the iMacs with them until they run out. However... The 15" LCD screens HAVE been discontinued, just like the 17" screens will be in June.
So, the computer was made in December... how old are the parts?
i'm the jedidiahmarkfoster your parents warned you about