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When Is There a Good Time to "Switch" to Apple?
AllNines asks: "With all the hype of MacWorld and the compelling keynote given by Steve Jobs about the upcoming Tiger and Spotlight, I am thinking about 'switching' (Linux user since '97) but I am not sure the time is right. It seems like the PowerBooks are getting very long in the tooth and the iPods are due for a major rev. When is the right time to jump on the Apple ship? Am I going to get burned by a sluggish overpriced laptop that is updated next month?"
http://buyersguide.macrumors.com/
If you believe Think Secret (page bottom), the powerbooks will be upgraded next week, since the current stock is completely out. I've been looking into one for a while now, and am waiting 'til at least Tuesday. I'm not expecting G5 laptops or Tiger until at least summer, and even then they'll be way more expensive than I'm planning on spending. If nothing happens next week, though, who knows when it will. It all depends on how long you can wait.
No matter what brand you buy or what arch, there will always be another new model around the corner.
But, at least here in Iceland the Mac's hold their reselling price alot better then all the rest.
All that aside.......i'd go for the switch, i've tried alot of OS'es and arch's but it's no contest...my beloved 12" PowerBook is the best yet.
-- Isak Ben.
someone drops a bag of money on my head ?
Funny, that's basically my experience with switching from OS X to Linux - except it didn't have as nice eye-candy....
I had a similar problem a while back - I jumped in and bought my 12" PB just before they speed-bumped it.
To be honest, it hasn't made too much difference, it's still far and away the best laptop I've ever used. Just get enough RAM!!
The thing is really, there isn't ever a 'best' time to buy anything like this. Look at the PC market - we have new motherboards, cpu's etc. coming out all the time.
At least with Apple its fairly regular that they do major updates, usually at MacWorld time!
I think the best time will be very soon. Wait till they release Tiger, and start shipping it on the Minis (or just get one and pay for the upgrade).
The Mini is the cheapest Mac available, and you can re-use all your old monitor/mouse/keyboard etc. Hell, even if you dont like it as a proper desktop, there's still the media-centre/server thing everyone seems keen to turn these babies into.....
The best time to buy Apple hardware is a week after they introduce new equipment... That gives you the longest time between your purchase and the replacement coming out. The week gives you time to check the early adopter's trouble reports too :) Always check the rumour sites, or you'll do as a friend of mine did, and buy a 30GB iPod a week before the 40GB appeared for the same price.
Friends of mine who bought the first model of any product line (G3 towers, Powerbooks, etc) find they get all the teething problems associated with a new release, so if you can, wait for the second revision of anything.
So if you want a Powerbook, check the rumour sites - they are all estimating Q2 shipping. This would suggest a revision anything up to 6 months later (usually just a speed bump, but they tend to iron out the wrinkles too).
If you can't wait that long, buy one now - they're still great machines, even if they're superceded next week!
Following this advice I got a 30GB iPod when it was new (the 2nd rev of the 3G series) and the 17" 1GHz iMac (first of the widescreen ones, but not the first flatscreen), both of which have never given me a day's trouble.
Mark
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It's not that easy to answer. Generally, the only way to have any idea of when Apple will be releasing new hardware is by following the rumour sites (Thinksecret, Appleinsider etc) and using large pinches of salt. Of those, Thinksecret, the one with the best record on accuracy, is being sued by Apple, so the chances of their being "in the know", in future are slim.
The register is no good as they make all sorts of wild claims which almost never come true.
Usually Apple releases new hard- and software on two regular occasions: Macworld (just past, this january) and the Mac developer conference, in the middle of the year. Buying a new Mac just before then is usually not the best of ideas.
The only way to do this, if you're seriously interested in wasting a lot of time, is to spend time on the Appleinsider forums, noting occasional leaks before Apple C and D's them, and keeping up with current industry trends.
That means, at present: The chances of an Apple G5 Powerbook being released soon are very slim, as far as I can see. The chances that Apple will first release upgraded G4 Powerbooks with the new Motorola G4 and "Freescale" processors is much higher, since those would take the G4 above 1,5GHz.
If you have the patience, wait until the developers conference is over in the middle of the year. I'm sure Apple will have announced something by then.
After 10 years of Linux, I was happy to finally switch to Mac OSX due to all the Linux deficiencies, stupid configuration issues, and a crippled GUI. I bought more Apples since that time. Now all of my systems are Linux-free and I am a happy boy now.
My first answer would be wait until 'Tiger' comes out, that way you will more than likely get Panther installed on the box and Tiger on CDs. At least that is what happened when I bought my Imac last year (cept of course it was Jaguar-Panther). I got two Oses for the price of one. Bargain.
on the flip side of that, you may as well upgrade now as every day on windows is a day when your PC can crash and die and get infected with malware etc etc. (Bit dramatic I know, but hey that is what too much time spent on billyware does to you!)
'By the pricking of my thumbs, something wicked this way comes'
Yeah, I tried Windows XP once too.
More seriously, you might want to elaborate on your comments, because I haven't found any of them to have ever been true. Maybe I'm just used to working around the "stupid configuration issues" and "crippled GUI" (I *do* use the Terminal a lot, after all) and it is just that the apps I specifically use never crash, but...
Integrate Keynote and LaTeX
...that a laptop becomes sluggish the very moment the next revision comes out ? I didn't know about that, and my 3 year old iBook doesn't know either.
As usual when you want to buy a computer (or quite anything technology-related), you have to know what you need, and jump and buy it... Of course it will become outdated shortly, but do you really need the new one ?
Cats are intended to teach us that not everything in nature has a function.
The best time is to buy Apple hardware is shortly after the Rev B version of whatever you want comes out. This means you get something that won't be replaced for a while and which has most of the bugs removed. A good example is the 12" PowerBook which ran very hot when it first came out and also suffered from warped cases and the pads on the base falling off. The Rev B model had none of these problems.
This is so plainly a troll or flamebait that modding it up as interesting can only be done by the opposite of a Mac zealot; a Windows only person, or a Linux zealot. I'm guessing its a Linux fanatic, due to the Gentoo comment.
OSX has its faults, but none of them are show stoppers, the apps definitely do not crash wildly and the GUI is most certainly not crippled and there is no way in hell that configuration is anywhere as difficult or problematic as in your average Linux distro.
If you do (or intend to do) a lot of editing of big images or video editing or compiling big applications, then you are probably more concerned with speed. Check out the benchmarks, or try a machine out with your nearest Apple dealer. It could be that the present machines already beat your current linux box.
. . . never had a sluggish Powerbook, and that's all I've owned since 1992 and - hang on! - the 170. 16MB RAM, that baby was hot!
A smart way to save bucks is to buy new the next-to-newest model. I'm writing this on a 17" 1.33 with max third-party RAM (never pay for Apple RAM, oh nooo) and it is an immensely cool tool.
My iMac G5 arrived yesterday. I haven't had much time to play around with it but so far i'm very impressed with it. OS X is a bit weird at first, but after a short while you'll feel very comfortable with it.
You're probably gonna get a lot of "wait for the new product announcements" or "wait for Tiger" comments, but seriously, why should you wait? New products might be announced next week... maybe the week after that, maybe the month after that, hell you might end up waiting until June. Or you could just buy one now, and you'll be sure that whatever you buy will most likely still run the latest versions of OS X and other software in 4 years time.
Ease of use: The OS is very stable, as stable as anything in the Linux world. The apps are generally of better quality than stuff found in the Linux world, although you can use those on OSX as well. The GUI and applications all use the same user interface, which means that you don't have wildly differing interfaces such as is the case of GTK+ and KDE apps. (Think GIMP and OpenOffice and tell me why most apps don't even follow the GNOME HCI guidlines).
The OS is incredibly easy to configure compared to the various competing KDE/Gnome distros (which is exactly the problem there). And if you need the terminal and wish to do stuff by hand, it's there, and you're free to do what you like with the system's innnards as it's OSS and well documented.
The OS, apps and hardware are tightly integrated, which means that problems like hardware compatibility don't exist.
The software and hardware are both of high quality, which really means something if you've used Dell or no name brands.
It goes way byond things like Eye Candy, which says to me that you've never actually used the OS for a period of time yourself.
What makes you think you can't "do stuff" with a Mac? Or Linux, or Windows, for that matter.
It's an excellent, well designed, stable, powerful OS coupled with excellent quality hardware and all the applications you need are there unless your definition of doing stuff means playing Half Life.
I have been a UNIX user since 1990, Linux since 1994 and I got my first Mac just over a year ago when the G4 iBook appeared. The main reason I bought the Mac is that I use my laptop for almost everything I do, it is my portable office, and I decided to give Apple a chance after my third Intel based laptop in as many years keeled over.
:-)
I always ran Linux on my laptops and with a bit of care an x86 laptop for Linux is a great tool but to get the best compatiblity I couldn't really go for the budget machines and ended up spending £1500 last time on a Toshiba. It was dead after a year. The surface finish (silver paint) rubbed off and scratched, the case cracked and chipped, the battery stopped holding any charge (just after the guarantee ran out) and the backlight died. The Mac was £500 less, and with OS X, the OS it was designed for, it is more than powerful enough.
Learning to use OS X has taken a bit of time but I have made a decision that my next desktop machine will also be a Mac because I love the UNIX base, the interface, the fact I can use X11 apps too. I also like having the menu bar at the top and also like the dock. Some others in the Mac community laugh at me because I do my development using vi in an xterm but what they hey, it works for me! At least I have syntax colouring turned on
The hardware is well made, it has already outlasted my last three x86 laptops and shows no signs of failing. It doesn't run hot, the battery life is excellent, the performance is also good. Having played with the new iMac G5 I can't say I notice it being blazingly faster than my 933Mhz G4 so I think the desire to jump into a G5 laptop is misplaced, the G4 is still a pretty good chip and excellent for mobile applications. Sticking a G5 in is going to increase the heat output, shorten battery life and probably not really increase performance all that much. Just get a lot of RAM for the Mac, I have 640MB in mine and that makes it a very smooth experience.
Would I run Linux on my Mac? Possibly, but to be honest I like OS X, I like the fact that most open source software is also available for the Mac. Sometimes I choose to use the Mac native app, other times I use open source. I like NeoOffice but have MS Office X too. When NeoOffice becomes fully aqua (widgets and all) then I will use it all the time. I certainly won't be buying another copy of MS Office, I'll just keep the one I have for compatiblity but do new docs in NeoOffice. Firefox is better than Safari. I tried using Safari but the slow page rendering annoyed me so I switched back. I have changed from Thunderbird to Apple Mail which I like a lot.
All in all, I think there is a lot to be said for the Mac. Does it mean I don't like Linux? No, I still have a Linux desktop (at least until my next machine) and I will keep Linux on my servers and continue to use open source apps on my Mac.
"I have the attention span of a strobe lit goldfish, please get to the point quickly!"
I only had OSX crash on me when I trying to do stuff like SMB mount from the command line, but its fixed now. Every once and awhile AQUA will crash, I just ssh into the box and kill -9 the process and its back up.
The only time I reboot is for security patchs, but not all need to reboot.
We currently play WoW on it, and underneath I have irssi/squid/vnc running, with multiple ssh sessions.
Running a dual g4, great box, needs a new gfx card, but speed wise, its great. I'd have to say I miss my native vga font for terminals (im oldschool, i like perfect fixedfonts).. But a xwindows workaround is a vga.bdf and rxvt, even colors are correct then. (iTerm is ok, but not even close to putty or konsole)
I also have a gentoo box, a sparc sunblade 100, gentoo is rock solid on it now, still 2.4.x kernel, but very stable.
I'd say if you want a unix workstation, OSX is by far the best.
Biggest downside, home/end doesnt work on command lines in OSX, and other shortcuts, key combos. I wish they would let you pick or customize your settings.
I'm sure it's not the only reason that you want a Mac, but Beagle is quite similar to Spotlight and likely to be realeased at a similar time...
http://www.gnome.org/projects/beagle/
whoa. a troll. Macs aren't expensive - comparison's been done over and over again, they are roughly on-par with PC's, what's more, the intangibles - things like the user experience, iLife apps and OS are worth a lot more. Please, grow up.
Fight Crime - Shoot Back!
Whenever Tiger is out, it will come pre-installed on all the new macs, and thus save you 100 bucks to upgrade from Panther if you get a mac before that. It is scheduled to be released within 2005 Q2. As far as Powerbooks are concered, the new update is long due and supposedly will happen within 10 days (according to rumor sites).
On the plus side, most native apps are reasonably solid and stable, and the interface is simple and easy to use.
On the negative side, we both found that interface is so simple there's not much you can do to customise it. As for integrating the Mac into my *nix (NFS) network, that was a real bitch, and it still isn't right. Apple really made it harder for me when they put all the network settings into that binary database rather than applying the simple Unix-style approach.
We were also a bit disappointed by the general lack of basic games, having been spoilt by the great suite that comes by default with Gnome. Sure, I know about Fink, but my experience is that X11 apps don't seem to render that well on the Mac screen.
*I only had OSX crash on me when I trying to do stuff like SMB mount from the command line, but its fixed now. Every once and awhile AQUA will crash, I just ssh into the box and kill -9 the process and its back up.*
hilarious! this is the attitude!
you consider it stable when "every once and a while AQUA" crashes? isn't that like arguing that windows is stable but it's the explorer that crashes and as such it's not a biggie?
seriously.. "it just WORKS" and you SSH of all things into the box to fix things...
You're still trolling.
First of all you can change the default browser in the System Preferences. The list of open Applications is in the Dock, marked by the little triangles. An then, why would you install thousand fonts? Of course, if you want that you should be able to do it, but just imagine the loooooooooooong list in the font selector. Using Linux or Windows is no different in this respect.
I'm not even sure anymore that you have ever used Mac OS X.
If Apple were to introduce a Mini like diskless slim client, it would probably blow both Windows and Linux away. The diskless Mac "Metro" clients would connect via Gigabit ethernet to a Mac "Metro" Station, the latter performing the role of a raided iSCSI/Fileserver with an inbuilt network switch to directly connect each client.
Sample Mac "Metro" client specs:
Using the Mac Mini as a starting point
Ditch the DVD and Hard drives,
Make one to two Gigabtyes memory as standard,
Upgrade the 100/10 Mib network to 1Gig,
Boot using PXE,
Run all programs on the client in ram, using iSCSI read only access for a common system partition, and dedicated zones server side for each client for swap and read write disk space,
Cheap price, these diskless systems should be well under $100 US
Mac "Metro" "Station" specs:
Combination fileserver and high speed network switch,
Sell four, eight to forty eight ( plus one/two uplink ) port variants, each can support the same number of Metro clients that connect to their own dedicated port,
Raid array as standard, scaled to the number of clients supported,
Filesystem versioning ( Revision tracking and control ) as standard for all document directories and intergrity checking for all filesystems,
A DVD R/W ( or better ) drive for upgrade nd backups.
At a low/suitable per client price, such a system could blow Microsoft out of the business desktop market.
I agree that the reasons I gave look like your average Mac zealot, but the guy asked why the original would prefer OSX over Linux.
Those reasons, cliched or not, are real.
I should have put in a disclaimer that OSX is not perfect and that there are occasional hardware problems, but my experience on the whole over 15 years of using PC's (from Windows 2.11) and Macs (System 6) is that Apple's hardware is among the best there is overall.
I've had PC hardware from no name chinese brands that fail rapidly, Dell stuff that fails often enough to be a real problem (I used to be a Sysadmin for Windows and dell machines) and IBM stuff that is as good as or better than Apples, but really, only HP and IBM are as good as Apple in terms of hardware quality in my experience.
And your comment about a Linuc head only going for the hardware is simplistic, don't you think. OSX has a lot of features and gimmicks that are nowhere to be found in Linux (and vice versa, of course) and those could be valid reasons for wanting to use it as well. It's not just the hardware.
In case you missed it in my other post, I wonder how much effort you really put in to the problem of your default browser. You can change the default browser in Internet Explorer as well, and there are at least two third party apps that do this as well.
5 minutes in Google would have told you that.
I've been using Linux since '96 and I could care less about OSX, besides adopting a couple of its neat GUI ideas into the Free desktop. I can understand Windows users wanting to switch -- for them it's a huge leap forward in all aspects. But for us long time Linux users, it's just another mildly interesting member of the Unix family tree.
:P
Speak for yourself!
I've been running Linux on Macintosh hardware since 1996 and I use Mac OS X as my primary system (even though I develop solutions/software on Debian, FreeBSD and Solaris systems for a living).
May of us see the virtue in having a system which 'just works', and as good as it Debian and GNOME don't quite do that for me (and KDE doesn't delivery the funtionality I'm looking for, I prefer the GNOME style of implimentation). I'd much rather have Debian as a server, but I can't say the same about a desktop.
I agree that KDE/GNOME and x.org will catch up within a couple of years and with the better performance of an accellerated window manager and an even better (but already very impressive) GNOME/nautilus driven environment I'll be tempted to switch back.
Whether it's a "good time" depends on your needs. Do you need a laptop, a web browser, and MS Office, but little more? The mac is the machine for you. Do you need a particular commercial software package that runs on mac and windows only? Buy a mac.
Other than that, don't expect too much: macs have their share of installation and management problems, the hardware is pokey, and battery life of the laptops is not competitive anymore either. Fink is supposed to give you many linux packages, but linux software still feels out of place on the mac. And OOo is at best an emergency solution on the mac, given its poor x11 performance.
On the desktop, it' not even a question really: installing something like SuSE is so easy and gives you so much great software that the mac really pales in comparison.
So, unless you have a specific reason to get a mac, like software that runs nowhere else and that you have to have, I think you are better off buying a laptop with linux preinstalled: you get far more software and it all just works out of the box; no installation or fiddling required. Whatever you do, be prepared to pay a big premium in hardware and software merely to match what you get with linux.
I mount my NFS mounts at the command line, and I have yet to run into any major issues. I didn't bother with the GUI-stuff... :)
The XONX X-server project on Sourceforge works nicely. I switched to the "X11.app" package from Apple and it works even better. For anyone with an OSX machine that wants to install additional software that you have gotten used to on a UNIX machine, I strongly suggest that you install darwinports (From darwinports.org) and let it manage your packages for you.
OSX "UNIX-friendliness" has come a long way since 10.0!
this Tuesday if the rumor sites are correct(probably nothing major like a g5 powerbook, but a g4 speed boost more than likely, though they are pushing the limits of that chip). I personally would wait until at least next Tuesday to make the decision. If new powerbooks don't come out, you may just be better off with a top of the line iBook. The price difference is too great as it stands for the bit of extra power you get with a powerbook(unless you like big screens, the iBook max rex is 1024x768)
I think you will be glad you took the plunge!
Monstar L
Sorry to butt in, but thought I'd throw in a couple cents:
There are a few virtual desktop managers for OS X (a few of which are free):
I didn't mean to include Virtual Desktop from AWOL Software, which is for Mac OS Classic... sorry.
Basically did not want another XP system in the house. I spend too much time updating XP, zonealarm, adaware, spybot etc etc etc etc on the 3 existing PCs. Then checking no nasties have sneaked past. Simply did not want a forth system to hassle me.
I did consider a cheap laptop with Linux but the windows tax put me off. Also from playing with employers laptops and linux I know that not everything works - like power management - without tinkering. I know how to fix that kind of thing but did not want to have to, if that makes sense.
For my wife I wanted a simple appliance. Zero admin overhead. The iBook fitted the bill. All I can say is that it is fantastic. Its only the 12inch lowest spec (with a 60Gb drive.) Not even put extra memory in it yet. But its plenty fast enough for everyday use. Battery life is amazing. The iLife programs are a lot of fun. No registry. Whole apps are single files. Not files spewed all over the system. Mac OS has proper multi-user with fine user privilege controls. So no worries about the kids accidently resetting the wep key - even if they are using an admin account (it prompts to re-enter passwd.) Lots of interesting and useful features that are so easy to find. I felt at home with Mac OS immediately. I was pleasantly surprised to find there is no shortage of software out there - for example, I found a great DVD ripper within 5mins of looking. I love it. Now we fight over who gets to use the iBook! I did not expect to be even using it.
While your storry is of course serious and Apple probably disgraced themselves, I don't really get what you are after.
... you want a clearly understandable, clickable list of running windows. ?? Well, what about right clicking in the task bar on any app? Does there not pop up a list of open windows of that app?
:D
Let me paraphrase three things:
a) you install new stuff on your machine, after that a application (Safari in this case) mysteriously crashes. You, as an old geek, don't come to the idea to revert the change? (And partialy reapplying it ntil it crashes again to find the particular problem?)
b) Taks bar
c) You are unable to change the default browser because the default browser crashes and you need to configure the default browser with the default browser? So why don't you just right click on a ".html" file and choose "open with" and select "make this the default"?
Als there is a CLI command you can google for, to change the default browser with
angel'o'sphere
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
Do a search for games on macupdate or versiontracker. You'll find a mess of games, from freeware to commercial. Try Snood.
If by interface you mean skins, there are ways to futz with it, but they caused stability issues for me, so I don't advise them. Google for OS X and "haxies". As for other ways to change the interface, there are numerous programs that replace the dock, change finder behaviors, etc, that many swear by. I've actually grown to love the simplicity, so I'm not using anything anymore, but I'm sure that there are others that will give recommendations.
Sorry, I can't help you on the network issue.
It's not offtopic, dumbass. It's orthogonal.
You're missing the point. A useful computer is not one with a stable OS or one with a GUI interface (computers have had those for ages, even back to Windows 3.1. Well, maybe not the stable OS bit.)
The main benefit of Mac OS X is the quality (and integration) of the applications. You can drag-and-drop any file onto any application, and (if it understands the format) it will open it. You can use any application's print command to get a PDF, which can be searched in the same preview window. Hell, in Tiger, you'll be able to look for a phrase anywhere in any document of the system. Want to know the signature of the Runtime.exec() method? Type in 'Runtime.exec()' in the spotlight bar, and it will bring up the JavaDocs and PDFs that have that phrase on your system.
All Cocoa apps have access to text-to-speech synthesis (thus; it's easy to use a remote phone to dial up and have it read your e-mail contents over the phone, which is very useful if you're a road warrior) via the built in services. You can open a URL in any application with a single keystroke, or send a file to a bluetooth device.
It syncs with your phone, your printer is discovered automatically, and if you've got a SlimServer running on your network it's already in your browser's bookmarks.
Oh, and you can get hardware that works. No, you don't have to google across multiple websites to find supported hardware, or see what the initialisation string you have to hard-code in a config file. You plug it in. It works.
Problem with your system booting up? Boot it and hold down Command+T, then plug another Mac box in with a firewire cable; you can browse the mac as a very large and expensive firewire disk.
And for those of you that love multi-button mice; yes, they work out of the box. No config file changes, no having to configure apps for each key combo. It just works.
As an operating system, Mac OS X and Linux are very similar; Unix was designed to be.
As a user experience, Macs Just Work.
The best time to switch to Mac is before some new virus attacks and kills your PC. So how about now? Honestly, until you've run with a Mac and with no worries about viruses and spyware and IE popups and all the annoying little things that make using any PC frustrating...... The best time to switch is when you're ready to stop worrying about your computer and start enjoying it again.
Oh, and how about a ... taskbar!
Errrm, what about the dock?? That looks like a taskbar to me, plus it is more configurable than the windows one and even though it doesn't show child windows within a particular app expose is a good substitute, as IMHO I think it is easier to know which window is which by looking at them as they run even if they are small than the truncated mess that is the taskbar when you have more than 7 or 8 windows open at the same time.
'By the pricking of my thumbs, something wicked this way comes'
iPods are only about 3 years old. They have had multiple generations already with different wheels, button configurations, and improvements. Why would they be in need of a MAJOR revision? Probably because in such a short amount of time they have achieved HUGE market penetration and its hard to image what life was like with those crappy pre-iPod mp3 players. What other product has had so much success in such a short amount of time? Perhaps sliced bread... Powerbooks are getting long in the tooth? Do you mean just the fact that they still use a G4 or the design? The current model of Powerbook was introduced 2 superbowls ago, IIRC, replacing the titanium models. Do you want a G5 laptop? Well you'll have to wait. Intel doesn't launch a new processor and have a laptop immediately available. Why should the expectations be different for Apple/IBM. Speaking of IBM, has the thinkpad design changed drastically at all over the past TEN years? Maybe a little lighter, but I would say that laptop is much longer in the tooth.
Now, how about the fact that you are considering migrating from linux and an MP3 player is one of your major deciding factors. Who deserves that credit? Would you be paining over a Creative 64MB rio mp3 player?
Apple has changed the way people consider their computers and accessories so much over the past 3-5 years, that sometimes people lose track of time and perspective. If you want to migrate to apple here is my advice. Do it today. If it doesn't go well, you can go back immediately. That way you won't lose another night sleep pondering what life would be like in OS X vs. KDE/GNOME (yes I know OS X runs X11, I use it.)
Personally, I made the same switch in May of 2004 - it was the perfect time for me. OSX had become much better as version 10.3 - OSX allows me to keep from completely losing my unix skills - and the app I use for work started providing a Citrix solution over the web, which worked flawlessly within Safari. And, the powerbooks had just had a drop in price for the G4's.
I'd read the previous Slashdot story, where it suggests the G5 laptops will come out soon. Usually, Apple will upgrade specs, but keep prices fairly similar to the existing lines, so for the same prices as G4's, expect G5's within the next few months.
The only other thing I could think of waiting for is a higher-capacity DVD, but that sounds like its gonna be about 8-12 months out before it ends up in laptops, etc. Good luck!
You said business desktop, right? Really, Linux on the desktop is fine and dandy for us nerds, but it's not OK for business-at-large. Your average office worker knows Word, Excel, etc., not OOo or gnumeric.
In other words there is a *huge* advantage to the Mac in your example, even in terms of IT management: namely, you won't be getting helpdesk calls all the time about how to use a word-processor.
however, even if you are in a laptop market, it's never a bad time to switch, i think. next-gen PB will be a speed bump, most likely. rumored dual-core G4 or G5 are highly unlikely, and even without those, i wouldn't call current PBs "sluggish." i have a two year old PB - 867 MHz G4. it's been doing great because CPU speed is one thing but OS X is quite another. (the difference, however, will be perhaps less "shocking" for you since you use linux, not windows.)
if you were thinking of Mac mini/iMac, go for it now. otherwise, if you can afford to, might as well wait a few months at most for PM/PB update/price drop. i imagine something will happen with the iPod (since you mentioned, even though it's not a Mac, per se) by the two year anniversary of iTMS in late April.
I've been a Linux user since 2001 and am also currently thinking about jumping on the Apple ship. I think I'm just getting fed up with all the fiddling, really.
Example: wireless card on my laptop kind of works, but causes a kernel panic in FC3, suspend-to-disk kinda-sorta works after a lot of fiddling, nautilus CD burning kind of works, but seems to burn a lot of coasters on my brand-new burner and there's no way to change the burn-speed, YAST2 is kinda nice, but slow and clunky.
I spend a lot of time reporting and dealing with annoying bugs in distros. I like all the polish I see in MacOSX, the nice configuration tools. I'd like to just be able to use my computer.
I use Linux because the x86 alternative (Windows) is *so* awful. I mean, I'm a free software developer and even I can see good reasons for switching.
My PowerBook is over three years old. I keep trying to convince myself it needs replacing, but it still does the job great. The differences between the Mac you get today and the one you get in three months are purely incremental. Plus three months of lost productivity/fun.
Free, legal music for iTunes users.
Waiting for Tiger will give you a good chance to see if they are updating any of their hardware systems soon as Apple usually makes various boosts to other products along with major releases. Even if hardware updates aren't in close sight, Tiger has a lot of promising features and it's nice to stay up-to-date on an OS without having to pay for it. If you are really worried about loosing a chance at a top of the line machine, buy a refurbished one. Recent Macs have excellent resale value and you can be sure that you will make back most of your money selling it in trade of a newer computer for when they arrive. Also, not having a top of the line Apple isn't a huge deal as they have a long shelf life. I used a 400MHz G3 for six years and it was still extremely useful for graphics/ sound/ video editing (although far from the best). Of course, more power is drool worthy and since two months ago I own a 2x2GHz G5 :)
Jump into it whenever you are comfortable, my only suggestion of avoidance is to not buy a brand new machine a month before the next Macworld.
Yes, NZheretic is David Mohring.
At least in terms of reliability, a multi RAID server + Gig ethernet setup is better than imaging drives across each client system. The Mac Mini has athe slower 2 1/2" Hard drives, I think that a common shared RAID array could deliver better performance as well.
The simple truth is that hardware and software will always get faster and cheaper, so don't upgrade until there's something you need to do that your current syhstem just can't handle. And then don't look at the adds for 2 months, or you'll wind up feeling bad! (:
I think someone's trying to dig up the FUD they read in 1998 and pass it off as informed opinion...let's take a look at some configuration settings for the network.
I'm afraid the lameness filter stopped me from posting a larger chunk of that file, but the DTD is given on the next line and you can indeed download the schema from Apple. Or perhaps we want to observe which nameservers we're using?
...and so on. Looks a little, well, plain-text (or at worst XML) to me. Not binary. Perhaps you're thinking of NetInfo, which has got very little to do with network settings but is instead a directory service for name information. That's stored in Berkely DB format; yes it's binary but it's hardly the world's least-understood format.
Works for me^{TM} on a production network involving OS X, Linux, NeXT, OpenBSD and Slowlaris. One of the OS X servers is serving a filesystem as is the Solaris box. No problems on the Mac side; the Sun's rpc.rquotad is a bit broken so remote quotaing on the Sun machine isn't good. I expect the problem you're observing is related to using a Linux machine as an NFS server. Linux' support for NFS is not very good and never has been very good; if you're creating network mounts on a Linux machine that need to be read on anything else then you should be using Samba. Linux NFS just isn't good enough.
I work with X11 all the time (on Macs and Solaris mainly), and other admins I work with are Linux/Solaris admins; I showed them some X11 action and we all agreed it looked no different from the rendering under XFree86 on Linux. In fact, that's unsurprising, as it's the same XFree86 code as many Linux distributions; the difference is that because Darwin has IOKit and Linux hasn't, you don't need to write an XF86Config-4 on OS X. Nor, indeed, on Darwin/x86.
A note to fellow moderators: marking something as 'insightful' just because it regurgitates known FUD is wrong. Try at least a small attempt to verify the truth in the statements made before deciding whether they contain any insight. A further note, the parent post did not contain any insight, just old and tired dogma.
Why would this be a post of a "Linux" user switching? This, like many articles on slashdot since Ballmer beat his chest about attacking the OSS community where it lives (uhum... here?) looks to me like a psychologically tuned meme designed to undermine Linux users' pride in their choices...
Let's stick to windows users switching to OS X. We all know that Linux users love it too, but it is highly unlikely that they would "switch" - just buy a mini or a laptop to augment their collection of hardware.
The reason that it can be true that 1+1 > 2 is that very peculiar nonzero value of the + operator
That is one reason why I bought a 12" Powerbook at the end of Novemember. Tiger is due out in April. If your looking to buy , hold off until then. If you buy close enough to the release date you do get a free upgrade.
G5 powerbooks won't be out until at least June, if not even August. Though I must admitt I haven't had a speed problem on a 1.3ghz G4 yet. I run Fire, iTerm, Firefox, iTunes all at the same time. Add Photoshop, X-Chat Aqua, and force the Powerbook to run two displays(lcd, and 19" flat screen) and I can force the fans to turn on. Sluggish nope, it still responds quickly, unless I have photoshop doing a large image manipulation.
What's better, it's small and light. Want to sit in front of the fire place? go for it, for light web surfig the fan won't come on, it stays that cool. My only wish is that Apple would build the Newton 2.
i thought once I was found, but it was only a dream.
how many people decide to ask Slashdot these tpyes of questions, rather than do any research themselves.
Not that there won't be some good replies to this question, but who do you want controlling your financial decisions? Yourself, based on research, and personal needs/wants, or a bunch of nameless people who really have no incentive to give you accurate and unbiased information?
Again, I'm not saying that there won't be any good responses or anything, but it seems that these "what should I do" questions come up an awful lot, for a geek-based forum, and people tend to take the responses as gospel, rather than verifying the information, or doing any research themselves.
The article yesterday about possibly moving to China, and wondering about censorship was a great one! Where else are you going to easily find out that kind of information from people, but these "what should I buy", and "what's best for me" questions... Go to Google, search previous discussions here, go to pricewatch and do some comparisons, and go to your local CompUSA, or Applestore, and try one yourself.
Only you can determine what's best for you.
I switched to an iBook G4 1GHz back in August 04. I got my ibook about 5 weeks before they were upped to 1.2GHz. Will i notice that 200MHz? nope. hell my printer probably has a 200MHz processor in it. I won't miss it. I can tell you that i would have missed this iBook. I've run Debian, RH, windows 2k, xp, 98, 95, 3.1(1), and I use a lot of different systems and operating systems at UM and i can tell you that this was the best purchase i've ever made. I'm actually happy that my dell laptop died and made me buy this machine, that i (by the way) bought simply because with my education discount was less than a grand. I have read above that you should wait for tiger to come out, and if its not an emergency, then wait for tiger, but otherwise.... just do it. i was angry and unhappy at first that i wasn't using kde and that there wasn't a start button, but once i get it configured nice for me, i don't even like sitting at a windows machine. makes me uncomfortable. I'm really disappointed that Matlab still runs in X11. it makes things less easy for me than windows, but good thing is i don't have to deal with that very often. I'd say, plan on sitting there for a week getting used to it, and you'll love it. I've come a long way since my days of making fun of apple supporters, and apple has done nothing but put their best foot forward.
-=gabe2=- macbook dual 2.0
When is the right time to jump on the Apple ship?
In general, the time to switch platforms in any direction is when you've finally got everything running smoothly on your current platform of choice after some major disaster. I'm sure that seems illogical at first, but it stems from the fact that you do not want to switch when you're in the middle of an emergency. If things have always been smooth, there's no need to switch at all. If things are becoming a reoccurring mess, resolve to switch, but then still clean up the current mess! It'll make the switch that much easier when you're not trying to transition all the mission critical stuff a once.
Am I going to get burned by a sluggish overpriced laptop that is updated next month?
Only if you're a fucking idiot. If you think a Mac is sluggish today, why the hell would you buy it? It doesn't matter if a vendor is updating their systems next week or next year. Either what they're offering today meets your needs or it doesn't, and if it doesn't and you still buy it, then you should probably be fired (or beaten by friends and family). The march of technology still guarantees any purchase you make is an expense, not an investment. Stop pretending you can wait to "buy low" because you will never, ever be able to "sell high".
I have been using Linux since 1994. Then I decided to switch 2002, I wanted a good laptop and at the Time the 667Mhz powerbook was the best laptop for the price. Linux is a good OS for servers, OK for desktops, but not the best for laptops. Linux wireless interface seems needlessly complex, some of the drivers are picky, and laptop centric features like enabling and disabling the tap click on the glide pad. Handling many of the extra keyboard features like volume control. Yes I am sure someone will give me links on how to fix these issues. That isn't the point sometimes our time is a little more valuable to spend hours downloading, and configuring all these little patches to make linux work good on your system (If they don't work then you need to do some cleanup work). Apple makes the hardware and the OS. The OS recognizes the hardware and works well with it out of the box. It also handles 3rd party devices cleanly and easily. Most of OS X eye candy actually is designed for a reason, and quite well, the shadows help the eye recognize which window is on top when they are next to each other, the transparencies are just enough for a person to notice movement behind an object but not mess up your ability to read it. The fancy minimize and maximize graphics help the eye follow where the windows went and let you know that you haven't just closed the window, and if something did happen when it was minimizing you would know that it happened, some color throbs to show that the application is still responding, All the eye candy is respectfully done vs. say Clippy, and actually rather out of the way and unintrusive.
If something is so important that you feel the need to post it on the internet... It probably isn't that important.
If you are dead set on a laptop then you should wait. Buying a G4 just doesn't make a ton of sense to me right now. But for a little perspective lets look at the big picture and take it from there.
By the end of '05 we will see the extension of Apple into the movie distribution business. Think NetFlix without the mailers. All you will really need for this is a Mac Mini next to your HDTV either on a ethernet wire or connected wirelessly. Buying a Mac Mini now and learning the ropes of OS X and the iLife apps wouldn't be a bad thing or a waste of money.
Then when the rest of the Apple product line is upgraded to G5's (portables and eMacs) you can get a desktop or portable to anchor this system (personally I'd get an iMac or PowerMac). Hang a big firewire based HD off of it and you've got an entertainment hub. Throw an Airport Express or two by your stereos (not the one next to the TV since the Mini will hadle that) and you can now beam music and video around your house. Or show your photo on your TV set.
Don't forget to load the free Xgrid on the Mini and any other Mac you might have to create your own cluster. Once you get hooked into editing your home movies and making DVD's you'll appreciate the distributed computing.
I think with the big picture in mind, rigfht now is a fine tine to buy. Get a mini and learn the ropes or an iMac (or PowerMac if you just have to have dual processor and a FSB that won't slow it down) and start on that end and slowly build out your digital home entertainment system where music and video can be accessed and viewed when and where you want it.
And you can neetboot from linux: http://frank.gwc.org.uk/~ali//nb/
And the knowledge that they fear is a weapon to be used against them...
maybe if you quit passingthecrackpipe around, you could run your machines right ;)
Careful with that.
/etc/ files directly) can lead to inconsistent results.
Because Mac OS X uses the netinfo database for a lot of config data, doing things like ifconfig by hand (even modifying the
Use system preferences and the net info manager wherever possible. There are command line variants for most of them, but they aren't well documented.
I'm not saying don't use ifconfig - just be sure you know what you're doing.
Clear, Dark Skies
I've been using Linux as my primary OS since 97 and I've been considering getting a Mac -- and leaving OSX on it.
In 2000, I bought a Powerbook Pismo (g3/firewire) with the intention of running Linux. It runs Linux marviously, and there isn't an application (other than Macromedia flash) which it cannot handle fine -- even with the (now) older 400mhz processor. I extensively use the airport adapter , so the only cable I use with it is the power adapter, and I keep the machine in my living room.
Now, I'm afraid when I decide to replace that laptop, I won't be able to use the new machine in the way I used the old one. ACPI under Linux is awful, so I can't buy x86 -- and the Airport Extreme cards don't work under Linux.
What is a geek to do? Run OSX, kill the Dock, run an X11 server, and compile your own apps (or use something like fink). It isn't pretty, but its the friendliest Unix laptop -- even if it isn't Linux. Nobody says that OSX can't be "just another Unix" -- it just hides it by default.
I forget which rumor site says it, but the best time to buy a computer that fits your needs now is now. I don't see any reason not to buy today. Products scale incrementally except for processor change like G4-G5, which don't come along very often. Even if Apple released a G5 PowerBook today, it'd be better to wait a few months for Apple to work out the issues. They won't leave you out in the cold if you buy a computer with problems, but it's annoying to have to get it repaired, even if you don't have to pay for it.
I find that it's best to wait until a product comes along that makes you want to upgrade. Anticipating specific future products leads to long waits and disappointment when the final product isn't what you expect. If the PowerBook is compelling to you now, you should buy it now. You won't regret it. If it's not, then wait until Apple releases something you want to buy (if you're waiting for a PowerBook G5 specifically, you could be waiting a long time).
I got tired of thinking about the computer when I just need to use it. That's the main reason my Dell sits idle. It's not that Linux can't do enough, it's just not fully fleshed out for a Desktop OS nor especially as a Laptop OS. Linux remains my absolute preference for a server OS.
Did someone say, "What about Windows?" Yeah, that's the OS my kids use on their non-networked machine for edu-tainment. Otherwise, I have no use for it.
Full disclosure: I switched temporarily in 2002 to a TiBook G4, but switched back to Windows/Linux as my Laptop OSes due to work requirements and the immaturity of Mac OS X in a Windows environment at that time. With OS X 1.3, I have none of the problems with printers, really networked resources in general, that I had previously. I wrote about "Switched Back" at that time. Things have improved so much I *know* I won't be switching away again. Not unless something insanely great comes along...
-- @rjamestaylor on Ello
*Make one to two Gigabtyes memory as standard,*
* these diskless systems should be well under $100 US*
you know the old robot saying "DOES NOT COMPUTE"? you aware that apple thinks 425$ to be a fair price for 3/4 of a gbyte? or does the calculation just assume that prices will drop in which case you could just as well keep the specs as same..
world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
The Mac mini makes it very cost effective to switch... see sig for details.
Hop on e-bay and look for something like an iBook G3, I got a 12" model with an airport card for $600. $100 later I had a 512 MB DIMM and a very useable laptop.
Unless you are doing a lot of video editing a G3 should be enough of a computer to allow you to get used to OS X and see if you like it without spending too much on a new box. You can also pick up a B&W G3 on e-bay for around $100.
I am definitely an apple user, so my advice will be a little biased, but I think that you should try out the Apple world before you make a serious commitment. There are sure to be some differences in the OS and a small learning curve, but if you get used to all of those before you spend $2k I think that you'll be much happier. Also, by starting with a slower machine you'll be able to gauge what speed machine will really suit your needs in the future.
Those who know, do not speak. Those who speak, do not know. ~Lao Tzu
Command up / Command down took me a while to figure out...
Here's my reasons:
Hardware support! On my x86 desktop, one Linux distro doesn't set up sound, another one sets up sound, but not my printer, and another freezes on shutdown. On my iBook, all the above work, with zero effort on my part.
Also, the hardware is better than most PC laptops.
Slow down, cowboy! It has been 4 hours since you last posted. You must wait another few hours.
I've had my G5 on for the last year rebooting only for updates and it has crashed twice in my memory. It's not a perfect record, but it doesn't crash 'every once in a while'
if you're looking for bragging rights, simply wait until a product announcement (usually at one of the semi-annual shows). buy that day.
the only thing that's worth waiting for at this point is Tiger: the OS advances at a bit more of a steady state, and we have a pretty good idea what's going to be in it (and let me tell you, the dev previews of things like Dashboard look pretty sweet). of course, you can buy a mac now and buy Tiger later if the new features are useful to you; you get to start using a mac now (a big win!), and can upgrade or not as you see fit.no. Apple does not make any such thing. their current lowest-end laptop comes stock with a 1.2Ghz and 256 MB of ram (okay, you're going to want a bit more than that, but it's not ludicrous); nothing that qualifies as being in the same neighborhood as "sluggish". it also starts at $999, which is a far was from "overpriced" for anything with similar performance (not to mention usability, reliability, &c.).
i speak for myself and those who like what i say.
When you buy your exquipment, the best advice is not to look and second-guess. There will be someting better/cheaper coming out soon, there always is. So what?
Don't buy it then scour the web for new stuff/ better prices for the next few months, you'll drive yourself nuts..
If the equipment does what you need when you buy it you'll be happy with it.
We have an old 600mhz ibook that keeps running. It does what it did when we bought it. Very light usefull machine for surfing, video playing, even coding.
One thing to note, if you can get a computer with the new OS, thats great. Ususally apple gives a discount on the New OS to those that bought a computer with the old OS close to the Newos release. But if the computer ships with the new OS its free. (those major OS upgrades run >100$)
I'd been using Linux since 98, and I switched to OS X in 2002. My fiance's been using Linux since 97, and he's planning on switching to OS X as soon as he can afford a new computer (which might be a lot sooner thanks to the mini). Why? I think theolein covered most of the main reasons. Plus, I like having things "just work," as Apple advertises. I had to have my machine dual-boot windows b/c I couldn't find Linux drivers for my digital camera. I'm guessing that's less of a problem these days, but still - I'd have to download drivers. With my Mac, I just buy something and plug it in. Other than price, I can't see many reasons *not* to switch. You still get a command line, etc - but you get a much wider range of high-quality software, including whatever you used in Linux if you want it.
Warning: Apple/Nintendo fangirl. Likes her electronics cute & cuddly. May be rabid.
I doubt you're ever going to get burned by a "sluggish laptop" assuming you're not buying a five-year-old one off eBay. But my vote is to wait til Tiger comes out. It looks to be a great update to the OS, and you don't want to waste an extra $100 when you could just wait a couple months. I bought my eMac right before Jaguar came out, and then kicked myself, hard. (Bought it like a week or two too early to get the "If you bought your computer in the past month" discount on Jaguar.)
Warning: Apple/Nintendo fangirl. Likes her electronics cute & cuddly. May be rabid.
There will alway be something cheaper/better/smaller/cooler/etc. in the future. If you really like what's offered today, get it.
There exists no way of exchanging information without making judgments. --Bene Gesserit Axiom
1 Gb Ram runs from $150 to $200 US Retail. I assume that Apple purchasing in bulk should be able to get a much better deal than that.Sans the HD, DVD and IDE/SATA interfaces, it should be quite do-able from Apple.
(see subject line)
http://alternatives.rzero.com/
First, my parents. They have a Sony VAIO (poor unfortuante souls) that they don't really know how to maintain. They run IE, despite my putting Firefox on it, and some version of Windows XP, which I haven't updated since I haven't been home since I got married. All I've heard about it are complaints that it runs extremely slowly, which is odd for a 1.66 GHz processor running the OS it came with. So it's probably spyware-laden, and possibly virus-laden. They should switch ASAP.
For anyone that has any inkling of how to run and maintain a computer, which would any of the people reading this... getting older models right after the newer ones come out would be a good idea, just as it's a better value for your money to purchase a manufacturer-certified 1-year old used car instead of a brand new one. That is an entirely economic decision that's based on your needs and the weight of your wallet. :-)
-Rob
Marriage doesn't have to suck!
Every computer company and technology progresses. They all introduce new products at six month intervals or thereabouts. There is no exactly right time.
This is a case where the marketplace actually sort of does operate, and is reflected in the street prices of the gear you buy. If you wait for the hot new product and buy it immediately, you'll find that you will likely a) pay full list price, b) experience unpredictable but significant and annoying shipping delays--including changes in promised ship dates, and c) suffer from various teething pains in the first run of the product.
Those teething pains can vary from serious (high failure rates and product recalls) to cosmetic (Apple Cube "cracks") to trivial but still annoying (on a G5 Tower purchased immediately when first available, when the CD ejects it sounds cheap and clunky and you have the feeling that the door-opening mechanism may fail--although it hasn't yet. They made some kind of improvement and later models are much smoother and confidence-inspiring... that sort of thing...)
Meanwhile, in the runup to the new product introduction everyone is trying to clear out old inventory, and you can get a fire-sale price and all sorts of deals with "free" extra RAM and bundled printers and so forth.
When you buy in is a personal matter, but the actual price you pay and the deal you get tend to reflect the marketplace judgement of the current value of the gear.
If you're waiting, that means you don't have enough money to just buy a new computer every year or so. Personally, I get at least four years out every computer. Four years from now, your computer is going to be four years old. Depending on how clever you are about jumping in just after the leap in technology, it may feel like it is effectively three-and-a-half years old or four-and-a-half years old. It doesn't really matter.
Besides, over the last ten years an amazing thing has happened: performance has been levelling off AND hardware has started catching up to software. These days, you can spend a thousand bucks and get "enough." Whatever enough means. I use a 1.8 GHz G5 at work. My home machine is a 400 MHz G4. Is there a difference in speed? Sure. Is my home machine "fast enough?" Yes.
"How to Do Nothing," kids activities, back in print!
I'm going to answer the questions that were actually asked.
1. The right time is when ever you are ready to jump. Before jumping, though, I'd suggest that you do some research on which one of Apple's currently shipping system meets your needs.
2. If you are the type that MUST have the latest and greatest all the time then the answer is yes. Apple has an unofficial policy that they should introduce something new every 90 days. Now that you know that time schedule, you will only get burned if you allow yourself to be.
Now to address your previous comment: It seems like the Power Books are getting very long in the tooth and the Ipods are due for a major rev.
Since it was the first Apple product to receive the, now ubiquitous, minimalist industrial redesign, I suppose the Powerbook is getting long in the tooth. I'm certain Apple is aware of this and is working on something.
As for the iPods, their current hardware designs, and software, are fairly new and they work as advertised. What more do you really need from a portable digital music player that is so incredibly easy to use?
It's time to switch when the apple interface allows you to resize your document windows from all four sides and corners. Currently you can only resize from that lower right hand corner.
I need to reposition my programs all the time because the interface puts them wherever the hell it wants, mostly hidding the bottom of the windows beneath the screen.
So you can't resize it without much hassle. Not very user friendly to me. I hear a lot of things about mac that are good, but honestly this is extremely lame.
...::----::...
I am in no way affiliated with this sig.
The right time to switch to Apple is Tuesdays, between 2 and 4pm, unless its the second Tuesday of the month.
Reality has a liberal bias
You seem to want the cutting edge, but another buying idea is to wait until there is an update and buy the last generation new when they slash prices to drop inventory... You get a really good price, and Macs tend to be usable longer. I bought a new computer my first three years in College, and now I've had my PB G4 867MHz for almost 2 years. I'm perfectly happy with this computer now, and if I buy a computer any time soon, I'll probably get a desktop and keep this laptop until it falls apart.
Like anyone can even know that
I switched about 3 years ago. At the time I had (2) Linux boxen and (3) M$ boxes. Now I have (1) Windows system running 98, for my old PC games. (1) Linux firewall and (3) Macs!
;-)
I freaking LOVE them. I work on XP all day and look forward to going home to get on the "good" systems.
you consider it stable when "every once and a while AQUA" crashes? isn't that like arguing that windows is stable but it's the explorer that crashes and as such it's not a biggie?
Well, lets look at this for a moment. People get pretty defensive both of their purchases and their hardware/software choices. So when ever you hear soemone talking about stability, you have to take it with a grain of salt. Personally I run OSX, Linux, Win2K, and NetBSD. I find Win2k has the most crashes while the others are about the same, which is to say I remember one or two crashes for each system. Back in the early days (beta and some of 10.0) of OSX I remember a few times the window server locked up and I had to ssh in and restart it. I had the same problem with one redhat release. One nice thing is that you can ssh in and fix the window server. On windows it means a reboot and is indistinguishable from a system crash and you have to restart all your applications and services. I have not had to restart the window server on either linux or OSX for at least 2 years though.
Any production machine, where new software is installed on a regular basis will have some bugs. I've noticed that OS X, like the other BSD systems, had a few stability issues in the early days, then became pretty indestructable. The only person I know that had serious stability issues (a crash or 2 every month) eventully traced the problem to cheap, 3rd party RAM and the system has been fine since its removal.
Personally, I am thankful that OS X is so stable and that it has a capable CLI so that if I do something stupid (like hack the UI) I can recover from it without a reinstall. I wonder what OS you might run that would be more stable. I rank OS X 10.3 about the same as NetBSD, maybe slightly more stable than fedora, and better than anything else I have used by a significant margin.
This was typed on Win2k and boy am I missing my spell check service.
You are going to get burned by warranty fees and support.
I have heard a story similar to this one from a number of people in real life.
http://www.megatokyo.com/?strip_id=512
search on page for
"I'm a little irritated with Apple right now."
and you'll be at the begining of the apple story.
build it myself support it myself. if something goes wrong my wife can bitch at me until I fix it
"He's a real midnight golfer"
Err, if you had taken the trouble to read my post properly, you would have noticed that having just paid out good money (which, incidentally, I did not say I regretted) for a Mac, I had more motivation to make the damn thing work than to spread misinformation about it. I had no preconceptions about Apple other than what I had briefly come into contact with some 20 or more years ago, and I was more than happy to give them a fair trial.
Linux' support for NFS is not very good and never has been very good; if you're creating network mounts on a Linux machine that need to be read on anything else then you should be using Samba. Linux NFS just isn't good enough.
Crap. Linux NFS support works perfectly well with my BSD systems, and I don't know how much closer to the original Unix NFS you're going to get than that. On my network, the nodes have to work both as server and client, and if I find that a Linux, NetBSD or FreeBSD machine takes some 5 minutes to mount an NFS share on an OS X machine (with portmap running on all nodes) then I think that is reasonably good evidence that there's something wrong with the OS X implementation. As for Samba, I hate it, and have absolutely no reason to run it, since I have no Windows boxes.
As for configuration, on any of my BSD or Linux boxes, all I need is a single line in my /etc/exports files to make NFS happen. You cannot possibly make any informed claim that OS X makes it that simple.
This aside, you seem to have interpreted my post as an anti-Mac rant. You misunderstood. The whole point of the thread (go back to the top of the page) was about switching from Linux to Mac. I don't ask anyone to moderate my post as insightful or whatever, since I already have all the karma I need. I was simply raising some issues which might be of interest to anyone who is considering switching from Linux to OS X.
I dispute this. most of the 'average office workers' neither know nor use enough of the esoteric functionality of Word, Excel etc. to make any difference what application they use, as long as it has the basic functionality and buttons/menus in roughly the same place.
Now, Word/Excel power-users are a different kettle of fish. Which is why the better-planned migrations seem to be keeping such users on MS Office (for now, at least).
[Watching "Spaceballs: The Movie". They reach "now" in the movie.]
Dark Helmet: What the hell am I looking at? When does this happen in the movie?
Colonel Sandurz: You're looking at now, sir. Everything that happens now is happening now.
Dark Helmet: What happened to then?
Colonel Sandurz: We passed then.
Dark Helmet: When?
Colonel Sandurz: Just now. We're at now now.
Dark Helmet: Go back to then.
Colonel Sandurz: When?
Dark Helmet: Now!
Colonel Sandurz: Now?
Dark Helmet: Now!
Colonel Sandurz: I can't.
Dark Helmet: Why?
Colonel Sandurz: We missed it.
Dark Helmet: When?
Colonel Sandurz: Just now.
Dark Helmet: When will then be now?
Colonel Sandurz: Soon.
And the men who hold high places must be the ones who start
To mold a new reality... closer to the heart
I've been a Mac fan since 1987. I love graphical user interfaces, and Mac OS (any version) is great. I'm not too much of a command line/Unix/
Linux user, but I think the control that this allows is intriguing.
Well, MacOS X is UNIX! It's BSD. I would think that this would excite all Unix/Linux users.
Also, not too familiar with Unix, but X11 windowing is included with OSX. It's supposed to be fairly easy to recompile or run Unix apps ontop of MacOSX with X11. This is amazing! Trillions of apps written for Unix can be run on the Mac! Anyone excited about this?
http://news.com.com/2100-1001-981495.html
http://www.apple.com/macosx/features/x11/
only then will you find your switch is for a reason and purspose. Then you won't need marketing hype and /. to stiffen your resolve to make some leap of faith switch.
There is so much misinformation here it's astonishing. You may have had bad experience with Apple hardware, but the vast majority of people have had no problems. I've had a Mac Plus, a Quadra 605, a Duo 2300 and an iBook G4 800 and they have all been solid machines and in fact still run to this day with no hardware problems at all.
OpenOffice does suck pretty hard, but good things have been heard about NeoOffice. As for Microsoft Office, it may not be great, but remember, it is what most of the world uses, and Linux users have been playing catch-up to try to develop something that works with Office files. I personally have not used Pages or Keynote yet, but I think you're wrong about it not being acceptable for business or academic use; the only thing it really lacks for the average business user is a spreadsheet. What kind of average user needs serious math and drawing tools in their normal business life? Does MS Office come with that on Mac or Windows? I've never needed any of that stuff.
You seem to want Photoshop for free out of iLife, and that's not what it's for. iPhoto is a great cataloging tool for digital photos, and lets you do the simple stuff home users want to do, like fix redeye. You're not going to be able to clone out that thumb over the lens in that picture or do otherwise complicated things, because it's not meant for that. I've never had the need for iMovie so I can't comment on that.
Outliners and brainstorming tools, I'm not sure about. I mean, there are wonderful things like SubEthaEdit that allow you to do online collaboration on documents that save in a large variety of formats. OmniOutliner is supposed to be excellent. Where's the problem?
Fink sucks. Just because MacOS CAN run linux software doesn't mean it SHOULD.
Never had problems with networking. It's a breeze. I can't see what you could be complaining about here. Doing anything wireless on MacOS is infinitely easier than on Windows or Linux, and I've had the experience to back that up. Both wired and wireless connections just work, simple and easy. And it's not just the basic default network, I've changed all kinds of settings, including WEP, with ease.
SMB could be done a little nicer, but for the most part it's pretty simple. The trouble is more with a lousy protocol and spec than with a lousy implementation, but there could be improvements made. And if you want to make Linux and Macs talk nicely, install AFS on your Linux machine. I did it on my Ubuntu machine and it was easy and now they talk to each other very nicely.
As for your comments on the GUI, I don't think I've ever seen anyone be as wrong as this in one sentance before. Slow is a comment I've only heard from someone trying to run Panther on an old slow machine, and if you tried to run XP on a machine at the low end of the compatability spectrum you'd say it was slow too.
"Non-Standard" deserves its own paragraph. I can't imagine how you could tell a Linux user that the MAC INTERFACE is non-standard. Apple INVENTED the standard GUI interface. The Macintosh Human Interface Guidelines are still the best ways for people to interact with a computer short of plugging it directly into your brain like Data from Star Trek. It is THE most standardized user interface out there, and the only one where you're SURE that Cmd-S will save your document in any program, every time.
The MacOS is NOT a Unix workstation! Why would you think it is? When has it ever been put forth that way? The hardware is about as modern as it gets; remember who made the first 64-bit desktop available. There's plenty of applications available, and they all have the same interface and you'll be sure they will work when you install them (as in, you won't need to make sure that your python libs are >=1.23.06; if you have 1.23.05, the program WILL NOT INSTALL).
I swear, if you didn't have specific complaints I would think that this was just some badly formed joke about Linux, because a lot of these complaints are the exact problems people have with Linux, and the problems that the MacOS actually SOLVES.
.. until Apple fixes some really fundamental problems with the Macintosh operating system and GUI...
You're joking right?
Windows and Linux (and every other platform on the planet for that matter) have perfect OSs and GUIs I suppose or by your logic you should never buy anything until it's perfect.
Seriously, sounds like you played around with OS X once and decided that because it wasn't what you were used to it has "fundamental OS and GUI problems."
Quark XPress users who spend their whole day in the program laying out newspaper pages tell me often that Photoshop has "fundamental GUI problems" too.
Poor bastards don't know the joke's on them.
Same could be said for your point of view too IMO.
But hey, 6 Billion people, 6 billion opinions.
Four weeks, Twenty papers, that's two dollars
I tend to buy my apple stuff right after they introduce new stuff, but I snag the old stuff at steep discounts.
I use an 800 MHz TiBook at home that I got as a refurb about a month after the faster ones came out. I got it because it would still boot into OS9 for some legacy stuff, and had a graphics card that works with an old game that I was addicted to.
I use a 1 GHz TiBook at work that I got a while later, and I honestly don't notice any real difference between the two machines' performance (and I use both daily).
I also have some sort of high end WinXP "workstation" at work that I use for running FEM software (and really not much else). It's only a few months old, so it really screams, but because I trust windows so little, I don't use it for much else. It solves transient models really fast though, and the most significant thing about it is that it's really quiet, despite the speed. I've heard older machines that sound like a jet landing in your office.
One more tip: Tiger (10.4) is due out 1H05, so waiting a few months until it's included with new hardware will save you a ~$100 upgrade (price varies with rebates & education discounts.)
I switched to an Apple at the beginning of September. The tipping point was when I figured out that the ammount of time I was spending in maintaining my Windows and Linux boxes exceeded the amount of time I was spending doing real work with them. I've got several entries in my Slashdot jouranl about my early experiences with my PowerBook. I had one glitch when I unboxed the thing, and that's it.
The verdict so far: it just works. I have MS Office for the Mac installed, so I have compatibility with the office computers. I put Apple's development suite on the machine, so I'm able to write software. (I'd recommend getting the "Building Cocoa Applications" book off of eBay.) Most of the Linux programs I used have OS X ports, and I don't have to fuss with keeping the system running. I can also count the number of system crashes I've had so far on one hand.
It's good to use your head, but not as a battering ram.
Well, you yourself just said:
So, the Macintosh is not a UNIX or Linux workstation, it is a pain to get the FOSS to run on it that Linux users are used to, and Macintosh users need to buy expensive commercial apps for a lot of basic functionality. None of the other things you say matter in the context of this question (wrong as many of them are) because you yourself agree on the core issue: the Macintosh is not a substitute for a Linux machine.
Windows and Linux (and every other platform on the planet for that matter) have perfect OSs and GUIs
I didn't say any of that. In fact, Windows and Linux have lots of problems. But Macintosh doesn't fix most of them and it creates lots of problems of its own, so there is no point switching to Macintosh. In different words, I have been on the Macintosh side, and the grass is no greener. That's why trying Macintosh was a disappointment.
I suppose or by your logic you should never buy anything until it's perfect.
No, my logic is much simpler: if you are a Linux user, don't bother with Macintosh; Linux is at least as good, comes with tons more software, and will cost you less.
Seriously, sounds like you played around with OS X once and decided that because it wasn't what you were used to it has "fundamental OS and GUI problems."
Actually, I have used it much more than that. But even if I had "just played around with it", Apple's claims for it are such that that should have been enough to convince me how intuitive it is. In reality, it's just another GUI that does things slightly differently from everybody else.
Indeed. I have been using my Dual 1.8 since Thanksgiving Day 2003 and just had my first system crash last week when trying to print something and then do something else before it spooled. Before that, my ontime was something like 7 months, the last time I has a power outage I would guess. Since the Deep Sleep actually WORKS on a G5 you dont ever think about turning it off or on.
As long as it is a "New World" Mac running Open Firmware it will boot.
During event at the Apple Retail Stores for the past two operating system releases (Jaguar an Panther), systems have been 10% off. You can also check out the special deals on refurbished equipment at the Apple Store online.
Am I going to get burned by a sluggish overpriced laptop that is updated next month?
This is the down side to being a Mac user. Unless you order a PowerBook the day new models come out, it WILL happen to you.
Cue a raft of posts saying "but it happens to PC's".
Ok - lets make it simple here - there are a LOT less portable Macs than there are models of PC laptops, and PC laptop models get updated all the time. Mac's get speedbumps occasionally, but then will make a big leap; usually three weeks after you buy one.
Well... actually, I guess it depends on what you mean. I find it's a *little* odd that so many people ask this question, since it is like any other hardware purchase: you know for a fact that what you buy today will become obsolete in a remarkably quick timeframe. Even if it doesn't become obsolete, you'll be able to buy your same hardware for less money, again in a remarkably quick timeframe.
With the quick devaluation of hardware as a given, I understand what the question is about: how do I avoid the pain of buying hardware right before an update is announced ? Other than buying right after an announcement ( which presents the possible pain of buying before a price drop, of course ), there's no *really* good way to know what Apple has ready to go.
I understand the PC user's issue with that- usually you see Intel or AMD is announcing a new chip or chipset, etc, well before you can buy a PC with those parts, but you don't have quite the same clues with Apple. Sure, maybe IBM is developing a new chip, but will Apple use it? You almost never know.
Maybe think about it like you think about getting a new graphics card... then realize, you either just take your chances and buy what you need or can afford, or don't buy something that hasn't been updated in a while, or buy only after something's announced. Take your pick from one of those three methods.
Right now, I wouldn't buy a PowerBook ( unless I just have plenty of spare cash ), I'd wait, those are due for an update. I _would_ buy a dual G5. Or a iMac G5. Or, if I wanted a small, simple machine, had a monitor, and wasn't editing DV, I'd get a Mac mini. I would consider getting an iBook- they're actually a damn good deal right now, and were updated not long ago.
But really, is there a good time to NOT switch?
how has this been modded troll?
are all you mods absolutly positive that he is making this up?
damn you
It seems to me that anytime is a good time to switch.
I know people worry about any computer getting too old too soon, but I've got to admit, I just played with a 1.42Ghz G4 and it's quite fast. I would think it would last me at a minimum of 3-4 years.
After that, of course the G6 might be out, and I might be ready to finally buy a G5!
Don't worry about getting a G4... They are plenty fast. If you go for an iMac or PowerMac in the G5 realm, you get even more bang.
Just do what I did if you have fears, find the nearest apple retailer and just sit in front of their computer for an hour or so.
That's what I did, I shut it down, restarted it, opened lots of programs at once and just pretty much put it through the paces.
Try one out and see how it works for you... That's the best test there is.
I bought a IIci in '87 (second from top of the line at that time) and had it for 8 years. I bough a first release iMac in (when was that, 96 or 97?) and had it for 5 years. I bought a refurbished 400 Mhz G4 two years ago and would not have considered getting a replacement except that these mini's are so amazingly (for apple) cheap. (even so, I will probably wait) My point is that, even with technology's march, Macs keep being useful for longer than PCs. I have kept useful Macs for 5 to 8 years and watched my windows PC buddies need new PCs every 3 or 4 years. So don't stress out so badly about the timing of getting in. I promise that you will feel sad when the next release comes out. But we all get over that. And your Mac will survive. PS: 2 notes. 1) I do not game much... that may have changed my ROI history 2) Linux is (much) better at running on old PC hardware than new MS OS releases.
The Mac mini also lacks the gig ethernet. It is only 10/100.
Lasers Controlled Games!
Oh, and how about a ... taskbar! I don't know how people can work without a clearly understandable, clickable list of running windows. Expose you say? sorry, but that is just a flashy hack to cover up the fact that eyecandy is more important then usability and effectiveness.
I find expose and the doc far easier to use than the task bar. It's easier to think in apps than in windows, especially when there's a pile of windows open.
DUH!!! Make the CALs $1000/apiece. Sheesh. Do I have to think of everything around here? :)
(NOTE: For those of you out there without a sense of sarcasm - this is an example of such)
If you mod me down, I shall become less powerful than you could possibly imagine.
I found the Macintosh laptops to be a big disappointment. First of all, there were hardware problems: one died within a few weeks, the replacement didn't play DVDs properly.
Sounds like you got some bad hardware. Unfortunate but not representative of the whole.
The processor is pretty slow, too: even in its heyday, a G4 wasn't all it was cracked up to be, and today it is really not competitive anymore.
Slow for what? It's well maintained that most home users will have a hard time maxing a 1 ghz processor let alone anything faster. I've not come across anything yet where I felt the processor was the bottle neck and not say the hard drive.
And it's not true that the thing never crashes; it's not bad, but the GUI will hang on occasion, and I have had it crash, too.
I don't think I've ever had the GUI hang. Invidual applications, yes, but not the entire GUI. I suspect that's what happened to you as well. As for crashing the system, unless the last time you played with this was sometime arround 10.1 or 10.2 on an old G3, crashing the whole system has been in my experience someting very difficult you use, and usualy involving mucking with something like AFS.
Then, your only real choice for an office suite is Microsoft Office. If you want a laptop just to run Microsoft Office, I suppose it is better than a Windows laptop. OpenOffice has too many limitations on the Mac (among other things, forget about using it for presentations) and it requires you to fiddle with X11, which isn't well integrated (and also needs to be installed).
Well, really your only real choice for an office suite anywhere is MS Office. As much as I hate to say it, they are the standard. However, there's also NeoOffice (OO without X11).
iWork isn't a serious academic or business tool either: no spreadsheet, no math, limited drawing.
No it's not. Not yet anyway. Though keynote does fine for presentations.
The iLife applications are useless toys: iPhoto doesn't let you fix even gross problems with images, iMovie has limitations on what you can important and export (looks like they are deliberate). You probably need to upgrade to expensive commercial packages if you want anything that's more than a toy.
They're hardly useless, but it looks like you're looking for something more akin to the GIMP or something like that.
If that's the case, you can get the GIMP
http://www.gimp.org/macintosh/
Or you can get a nice little app I found called PhotoLine
And most macs should still come with graphic converter, which while not GIMP or Photoshop does more than iPhoto does. iPhoto is more management than editing although that has supposedly changed considerably with the new version. But iPhoto was never meant to be an editor.
iMovie is purposefuly restricted on import and exports that's true. It's designed for the purpose of pulling video from your DV Camcorder and doing home movie editing and then exporting. If you're looking for Professional level editing, is it really a suprise that you need professional level programs?
I thought there were going to be a bunch of nice outliners and brainstorming tools for Macintosh--lots of them are advertised with great fanfare and colorful ads, but they were pretty much a disappointment, too: proprietary formats, complex UIs, and limited functionality. There are better open source tools available than that.
What exactly where you trying to do that OmniGraffle and OmniOutliner didn't handle? And as a further question, did you search to see if your favorite apps had been ported yet?
Fink is supposed to be the way to install more of a real UNIX/Linux environment on Macintosh, but I had no end of trouble. Worse, for many packages, there are two versions of it: the Fink version and a non-Fink version. Some Mac applications assume one, some the other, and if you install both, you run into conflicts. Cygwin
T Money
World Domination with a plastic spoon since 1984
How do you figure taking a $500 machine, dropping the optical drive and hard drive, then quadrupling (or octupling?) the RAM and upgrading to gigE is going to lower the price "easily" to below $100? Because they'll save $400 worth of plastic on a smaller case, maybe? Maybe you're expecting the dollar to make a huge comeback.
Actually, I was trying to be Insightful, not Funny.
-
Nobody says that OSX can't be "just another Unix" -- it just hides it by default
-
my next desktop machine will also be a Mac because I love the UNIX base
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a unix OS with a nice consistent GUI AND the ability to run X11 apps
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I'd say if you want a unix workstation, OSX is by far the best
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As an operating system, Mac OS X and Linux are very similar; Unix was designed to be.
And apparently Apple itself thinks OSX might have something to do with Unix.If you wait until Tiger is released, and until new Macs are shipping with it, then you won't have to pay the $129 for the new OS.
Plus, if you buy a Mac before Tiger comes out, you won't quite know how well it will take advantage of Tiger features like CoreImage.
If Tiger comes out first, you can check the hardware requirements for various features before buying, so that you won't be disappointed.
September 2011: Looking for Cocoa/iOS work in Boston area Cocoa Programmer Quincy, MA
hilarious! this is the attitude!
you consider it stable when "every once and a while AQUA" crashes? isn't that like arguing that windows is stable but it's the explorer that crashes and as such it's not a biggie?
Humm, Once and awhile means monthly not weekly like windows. And aqua doesnt take down the OS when it crashs, just aquadock. I havnt seen a bouncing ball or complete crash since 10.1.
Most crash I've seen are games exiting back to normal desktop, doesnt happen often, but its also the same crash type on windows.
I find running WoW in window mode easier now, so i can run chat/webbrowser/IM without issues, Uptime for weeks now.
And for explorer on windows, theres a registery tweak to have explorer shell and explorer browsers to run different instances, so a explorer browser wont restart your gui. That has made windows more stable on a day to day basis, and I wish M$ would make it standard.
So, yes, OSX the OS is rock solid, the GUI can crash, but normally when exiting a game, but only once a month, so yes, thats very stable.
KDE and Gnome crash more, but then i use IceWM and Windowmaker because they are reallly stable.
But nice troll, trying to make it sound like I ssh in daily to reset processes, funny troll.
I'm twitching on the subject of ifconfig at the moment because I'm in the middle of writing device drivers for Mac.
Clear, Dark Skies
Mac "Metro"? Surely this is an Apple-is-gay troll?
This is tricky, but it can be done. Regularly grab the latest prices of the gizmos n doodads that you want from Apple. The right time to "switch" is when you see them on eBay for 75% of their retail cost.
It may seem scary @ first, but you've got to believe in yourself. Good luck.
[o]_O
if I find that a Linux, NetBSD or FreeBSD machine takes some 5 minutes to mount an NFS share on an OS X machine (with portmap running on all nodes) then I think that is reasonably good evidence that there's something wrong with the OS X implementation.
You are mistaken. Those symptoms are evidence that you do not have dns set up properly. A long delay followed by a successful mount suggests that one or both of the systems is timing out on name service queries. Those symtoms are consistent with missing 'A' records, missing 'PTR' records or both.
As for configuration, on any of my BSD or Linux boxes, all I need is a single line in my
You are correct that it requires more than adding a line to
1. Add a line to
2. Send a hup signal to mountd (killall -1 mountd) Or reboot.
How is that harder than BSD or linux? It is identical to BSDs. I admit that I'm guessing about the need to inform mountd to reload configurations on linux since I have not used it in 5 years.
To mount a remote volume manually you can use "connect to server" in the finder, or use mount from the command line. (This seems identical or easier than Linux depending on your approach).
To make volumes mount and unmount automatically, add a line to
The automount daemon adds a dynamic mount point for every fstab entry containing the 'net' option (this is equivalent to the 'mounts' domain in netinfo).
After restarting the automount daemon, or rebooting, when you refer to
Having administered dozens of Unices both commercial and free, I find that the various ways to get Macos X to work as an NFS client or server is either consistent with other unices, or nicer. Your sweeping claims that Macos X is broken merely reveal your ignorance of basic unix administration.
Don't get me wrong, client side NFS could be improved on Macos X. It handles manual mounts and automount(8) mounts flawlessly out of the box. My only complaint is that the port of amd (which comes bundled with the os for use by experts) is a bit sketchy when using complex map rules. I would prefer to use amd but ended up reverting to automount(8) about a year ago. I believe that Apple will eventually migrate from automount(8) to amd, but it is not ready for wide use yet.
For windowshading, try WindowShadeX. I haven't used it myself, but it gets great reviews.
As far as being careful with software - it's not so bad
With drag/drop install, to uninstall all you need do is delete the app, and the associated files (if any) that were created in ~/library/application support/appname and ~/library/preferences.
Of course, application stability is a whole 'nother discussion
You may want to get a Kensington or MS mouse because their drivers allow you to speed up the mouse movement beyond the standard (very slow) maximum speed for an Apple mouse.
MOUSEZOOM does the same thing for any mouose/trackball type device.
i don't mean to troll but remind me how you get digital still cameras, DV camcorders, bluetooth mobile devices, bluetooth headsets to work in Linux? Assuming you do ... what do you do then? Where's the Linux device synchronization strategy, like, you know, iSync?
What does the digital music marketplace and music device market look like for Linux?
What's a decent document authoring tool in Linux? vi, emacs, and Open Office do not count.
the post author just might be interested in doing niftier things with his computer. you know, like when you have a girlfriend ... then a wife ... then kids ... and you like to take pictures and videos, and perhaps easily author DVDs
sure ... he could stick to Linux. Linux is nice. I've used it for a while. but today, why bother? OS X is hands-down a far superior operating system. And that's precisely because it not-only draws from the open-source community, but also adds a whole layer of innovations targeted at fulfilling the needs of, you know, mere mortals who don't spend their time compiling kernels all day long.
you've obviously got a lot of learning to do about OS X.
Extraordinary Vacations. Exceptional Prices
Work gave me a obsolute mac and we put osx on it and I ran if for a couple of days. It is ok if you want email and a browser. It reminds me of a linux desktop that you have to pay for all the software. It was about as good as a boat anchor because I cannot bring myself to buy software for it.
Not thanks a linux box gives me anything I ever needed in software without forking out a dime.
Got Code?
Instead of isync, you use the linux kernel modules.
Change is certain; progress is not obligatory.
Use linux.
Change is certain; progress is not obligatory.
Apple charges insane prices on their RAM, HDS, CD/DVD ram/roms/writers. Which is a really good reason why it would cost alot less.
Change is certain; progress is not obligatory.
That about describes the way I buy computers. I did about a year's worth of research, compared prices of the top contenders (IBM Thinkpad, Sony Vaio, Apple Powerbook G4) and the Powerbook was actually the best deal. I got the AppleCare Protection Plan, and it's been more than worth the money. Not because of the phone help (not usually too useful for a knowledgable user, but I did need some help resetting my P-RAM in Open Firmware) but because of hardware repair. After about 2.5 years of reliable service, my laptop started freaking out, freezing a la Windows. That was very disturbing, since I've come to expect smooth sailing with OS X.
I sent my laptop to the shop (free shipping) and they replaced the hard drive. Stupid, because I had mentioned to an Apple rep. that this freezing problem occurred even when booting off an external hard drive. Anyway, I sent it back again, and when it was returned they had replaced the mainboard, CPU, the part around the edges where all the paint chips, and a couple other parts. It feels like I have a new laptop.
That was not the first time I used AppleCare. Previous, the insulation on the power cord cracked, and Apple sent me a new one promptly. I just stuck the old one in the same box and sent it back (again, free shipping!)
Anyway, in spite of getting my laptop back to normal, it was time for a new machine. Got a dual 2.5 GHz PowerMac G5, since it has to last for the next four years.
Si la vida me da palo, yo la voy a soportar Si la vida me da palo, yo la voy a espabilar
The MacRumors.com buyers guide is an excellent resource and I have used it many times to pick the right time to buy.
Yeah, like the list I've got now, it says:
E:\ D:\ My Sla Whe Sla My Mee
How could I live without it?
(OK, poster has a point - living with no windows list on my Solaris box is a pain. Are there any good ones?)
Just wait until I buy a PowerBook G4. The G5's are certain to come out within the next couple weeks.
I got a powerbook 667MHz a while back and it's still going strong. Best laptop I've ever had. Sure the 1.2GHz or faster models are a bit snappier, but it's totally usable.
:)
The difference between a 1.2/1.3GHz today vs. a 1.4/1.5GHz in a month or two (which is what it'd be given the inevitable shipping delays for the newest gear from Apple, even if something happened next week) will be minimal at best. Of course if they 'bump' includes more RAM or a bigger hard drive...
Anyway, main point is it doesn't much matter. Even when a G5 laptop ships it's going to be a new model and the existing ibook/powerbook series has been around for a while so expect more bugs to work out. I'd recommend waiting for the second model to sport a G5, so you're not stuck working out Apples overheating, loud fan, poor battery life, failing mainboard first attempt at a G5 (not that any of that has happened before
Also, for those who question moving from *linux* to a mac, even when you have the skill to get something working doesn't mean you have the patience or time to devote to it. Having stuff "just work" without any trouble is a very nice selling point for Mac hardware and OS X. Much better even than Windows, the nominal target market for most add-ons. Besides, it *is* unix, despite the eye candy. I was sold when I shut the lid on my powerbook at work, it snoozed, I opened it at home, and it automatically figured out it was on a different network, switched from the cabled connection to wireless, and was up and running within seconds of opening the lid. Compared to an IBM thinkpad/XP pro machine that takes 45-50 seconds to 'wake up', plus gets easily confused about network connections... It's nice to have stuff just work, and do it unobstrusivley in the background.
"But actually trying to use m4 as a general-purpose langage would be deeply perverse" --ESR
That's exactly what to do (though I recommend darwin-ports over fink). If you really want to run your own window manager just install it and then log in with ">console" to enter darwin without the GUI, then start x in your favorite way after you log in. Then you pretty much have a pure BSD system and you can install and run whatever you used to run under linux. Of course, you won't be able to run OS X apps (except command-line apps) without starting the OS X GUI. You'll probably want to run the X11 server on top of the OSX GUI even though it's a little kludgy.
Chances are, you will eventually learn to love the OS X GUI as much as the rest of us, and a lot of commonly used linux apps have been rewritten to take advantage of Apple's GUI which means you won't have to run them under Apple's X11 server anymore.
is the best time. I've been using a Mac at home for almost two years, but I've only recently been able to stop dealing with Windows problems at work (moved from tech support to network admin/cisco stuff). My sanity is no longer in jeopardy.
I have to agree with at least part of this. The Core OS is very stable. What crashes on my powerbook ALL THE TIME? Microsoft Offive V.x I paid $180 for this turd that was required for .uni and it does nothing but crash and and crash and crash. I've called MS, I've reinstalled the OS, I've 'reset permissions." on it.
I don't necessarily blame Apple, but it's a damning endorsement when the major apps for your platform are a crashfest.
I have to agree with the parent. I wouldn't go so far as to say it was that stable. But I get those aqua crashes at least weekly and I have to SSH to kill the session. What causes them? Trying to print to a mixed Windows printing network with AD/4.0 printers. Also printing to printers with an IPP address that also exist in AD. See it's all Microsoft's fault again. The other problem is when you kill the finder, you lose any unsaved work, and basically that means all my running apps are killed too. So what starts out as a minor annoyance turns into at least hours of lost work. It's good but it was miles to go before being considered 'stable'
Can anyone tell me how far along Mono has come on OS X?
What makes you think Stardock didn't copy Apple? I seem to remember when this Object Dock software came out, and it was after OSX did.
Try a Via EPIA-based system. $165 for a fanless 1GHz C3 + board (plus video, NIC and sound), $35 for 256MB RAM, $60 for an 80GB hard disk, $50 for an appropriately tiny case, $35 for a decent CD Burner.
Add $70 to upgrade to 512MB RAM and a 16x DVD Burner, and it's still $80 cheaper than the base config of the mini, and only VERY slightly larger, plus the C3 can handle 6 channel sound. Spend the $50 on a low-profile bt878 PCI tuner, and have an absolutely marvelous little theater appliance.
-- I wanna decide who lives and who dies - Crow T. Robot, MST3K
If you have a USB keyboard and mouse and a good monitor already, buy the $599 Mac mini (add wireless and DVD-R if you need them) and put a 1GB DIMM in when you get it. Get a 20GB iPod with it. For under $1000, you've got a good selection of Apple products. Try them out. Try not to use Windows or Linux -- use OS X as your primary computing environment. Don't try to make OS X behave just like Linux (or whatever other UNIX you prefer). Installing Fink does not count as trying to make OS X just like Linux (Fink is good!). Don't partition the HD. Use one partition. You may remove Classic (I don't have Classic/OS 9 on any of my Macs -- who'd want it?). Use OS X on Apple's terms and see if you like it.
Alternately, you could do what I do -- wait for the hardware updates, then buy the discontinued models on closeout for substantial savings. I got a previous model $999 eMac for $600 with AppleCare included when Apple last upgraded the eMacs. My wife loves this machine. She doesn't even know that I use it to serve my Subversion repository and as my MySQL server!
One of the macworld keynotes demoed netbooting among other things. First Steve used one iMac pulling data from a server, without a local hard drive. (even going as far as to show he removed the drive)
:)
Then, after saying "1 client, 1 server - you would never do that... Why don't we bring out 50?". The room went nuts as a rack of 49 iMacs rolls out.
Now, if it was Microsoft, we'd see 50 BSoD's...
I use Macs to up my productivity, so up yours Microsoft!
There really are no Motorola G4 processors anymore; Freescale is the manufacturer of G5 processors and is Motorola's direct successor (i.e. Motorola spun off their processor division which became Freescale).
Repetition does not transform a lie into the truth. - FDR
Under $100? A gig of ram by itself would be $100 at least. Never mind the CPU, case, CD drive, and ports. Plus the market for this would be so small they'd make no money on it.
now or never: http://apple.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=05/01/31/ 1351214