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OpenSolaris Code Released
njcoder writes "C|net's news.com.com has reported that Sun Microsystems is releasing parts of the OpenSolaris code today licensed under the OSI-approved CDDL . The release consistes of over 5 million lines of code for the base system OS/Net (kernel and networking). OpenSolaris is based on Solaris 10, the current version of Sun's Unix Operating System. Back in January, Sun released the code for DTrace, a dynamic tracing tool for analyzing and debugging kernel and userland events. DTrace is one of the big features in Solaris 10. Some other highlights include the GRUB bootloader, SMF (Service Management Facility) which replaces init.d scripts, it starts up processes in parallel for faster boots (7 second boot on a dual opteron workstation I think that was the setup) as well as providing features for automatically restarting. OpenSolaris provides support for x86/x86-64 processors as well as Sparc. The Blastware guys are working on Polaris which is an OpenSolaris port to PowerPC. Sun has been working on opening Solaris for over a year now. The OpenSolaris project started with a pilot group of Sun and non-Sun users. During the pilot program a lot of info including screenshots could be found on various OpenSolaris member blogs. (My favorite is Ben Rockwood's blog). Teamware is the source code management system Sun uses for Solaris and OpenSolaris. Which was designed by Larry McVoy (now of BitKeeper) while he was at sun. No word yet on if Teamware will be available for OpenSolaris developers or not. Sun also uses CollabNet for it's Open Source project websites so that might be a possibility as well."
Combined with an Open Source/Forkable license, what more could a Solaris Geek want? Get out the party hats people, because this has got to be THE most awesome thing Sun has ever done!
(I'm excited, can you tell? *Happy Dance* *Happy Dance*)
Now for the bad news. Sun has taken the tack of encouraging users to build their own system. That is a good thing. Unfortuntely, all builds require a system to bootstrap the build. At the moment, the only option is Solaris Community Edition, a non-Torrented download. (Boo!) That being said, I don't think we'll have to wait too long for the OSS community to fix that little issue.
Javascript + Nintendo DSi = DSiCade
now maybe we will see some driver development for all the cool hardware that is out there?
comment directly in my journal
Well, does it?
this code is a trap to scuttle linux development. sun will be looking to sue coders who they feel copy concepts and code from opensolaris into gpl'd codebases. do not look at the opensolaris code is you are a linux coder or code in gpl'd software. protect yourself and your code.
I sincerely hope that all the people that were shouting "Vaporware fuh fuh fuh its Vaporware!" (or in some instances Vapourware) will finally be satisfied... I dont really have a problem with the fact that they said it, because at the time it was technically true, but now its time to give credit where credit is due.
Live according to the Categorical Imperative. If the Categorical Imperative tells you not to live by it... ignore it
Is zfs included?
Are there parallel boot scripts made for other distro's? Fedora or Red Hat or Slackware etc....
Since I'm mostly unfamiliar with Solaris, what are the main advantages it has over Linux, BSD and Windows? Just curious.
Solaris doesn't stand a chance against *BSD or Linux... their logo sucks! Come on... seriously... what's more cuter than a Penguin or a Daemon?
Sometimes the best solution is to stop wasting time looking for an easy solution.
Many of Solaris's drivers were either bought from SCO or are ports from BSD. Basically, the best system out there for drivers is Windows followed by Linux.
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
windows automaticay restarts for me all the time. I get a quick flash of blue and then bam! restart.
"What does slashdotting mean?"
"You've never heard of slashdot?"
"I know it makes websites not work."
"Teamware is the source code management system Sun uses for Solaris and OpenSolaris. Which was designed by Larry McVoy (now of BitKeeper) while he was at sun. No word yet on if Teamware will be available for OpenSolaris developers or not."
Remember folks. You hate Larry.
If it runs on Xen, then it can run in parellel with Linux. That would be a good way for code to move one way or another.
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
Check out Gentoo. It uses /etc/init.d, but without the rc levels and numbering and all that crap. It works by having scripts depend on other scripts being started first. The only time you have to symlink is for multiple network devices.
LOAD "SIG",8,1
http://www.sun.com/software/solaris/get.jsp. Requires registration though.
I am trolling
if this project is half as successful for sun as openoffice is i'm sure they'll be happy they decided to open it...
Get your torrents...
Perfect. An open source OS backed by a well known name. The perfect stepping stone to get hesitant PHBs to accept an open source OS without a big company behind it into their shops.
... free t-shirts? thats another.
Free T's to the first 1000 swag whores.
1: get free tshirt
2: wait 10 years
3: ebay or equivalent
4: ???
5: profit!
I'm curious about how the SMF boot parallelization code stacks up against the InitNG project, which does the same for Linux. Anyone had experience with both?
Or , so at least we'll be able to make "compiling...." jokes about it.
Some Sun guys are doing a port to Xen. This'll give you near-native performance for Solaris apps, along with the comprehensive device support provided by a Linux (or NetBSD) "domain 0" (host virtual machine).
_ xen_summit (it seems to be down right now).
See http://blogs.sun.com/roller/page/tpm/20050510#the
Jörg Schilling will be so happy. He can finally release SchilliX, the Linux lookalike that runs cdrecord the way god intended it to.
Try out fish, the friendly interactive shell.
Ckeck out Blastwave.org http://www.blastwave.org/ for some torrents, apps, guides, and other goodies.
Additionally, SunFreeware http://www.sunfreeware.com/ is another great site for getting applications.
Or just use smf on Solaris/OpenSolaris
Spokeman from SCO annonced today that they are currently closely examining Solaris source code for any "infringing" SCO's Linux code.
When asked about the legitmacy of the action, however- "This IS the property of SCO, that's final...no we don't have proof for that, but we are working on that."
I agree. I think this is pretty good proof of Sun's good intentions. Hopefully Groklaw's PJ can stop with the Sun conspiracy theories now.
Will.
"7 second boot on a dual opteron workstation I think that was the setup"
You don't have to think, just RTFA, where you can see that it was a single AMD64 setup.
Still, I guess that would be too much trouble for the simple gain of being correct ?
You do realize that *BSD systems don't use init.d, right? They use the much more sensible (albeit less "flexible") rc.d system. The concept is simple:
This is the master startup script. After it runs, it loads subscripts from this directory. Life is good.
My own feels have always been that init.d's flexibility comes at far too high of a price in maintainence and ease of use. I'm sure there are others who would disagree, though. (No, I don't want to hear about it.)
Javascript + Nintendo DSi = DSiCade
I believe we are seeing the monopoly finally begin smashed to pieces. Besides the Linux and *BSD alternatives, we now have open-source x86 Solaris at our disposal, as well as the upcoming release of yellowTAB Zeta (based on BeOS). And with Mac OS X coming to the x86, things may really start to get interested. Just as people thought the x86 PC operating system market would start to stagnate, we have all sorts of innovation coming our way!
Cyric Zndovzny at your service.
You could make a more convincing case that Apple is going to x86 to counter OpenSolaris (since OpenSolaris came first). Note that I said more convincing, not convincing. Give the wacky Sun theories a day off, please.
Am I part of the core demographic for Swedish Fish?
my Duron 850 boots Fedora 1 in about 30 seconds. Granted, it doesn't boot database, web or other servers at startup and doesn't have a bloated JVM installed as well, but still...
It's a friggin Opteron and the substitute for init.d scripts should work faster than that!
I don't feel like it...
MS moved to "Shared Source" sometime ago. It was done in hopes that Linux coders would borrow from MS. So far, it has not happened.
But this has potential to do what MS could not. Solaris is at least respected by the development world. This is simply another trap being laid by Sun and MS against Linux.
What is funny is how little ppl seem to remember from just 7 years ago. Sun actually ported to X86 once before AND "opened" their source code. Then when they thought that things were going well, they dropped it. If Sun ever feels like things are going in their favor, it is almost certain that they will do it again.
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
You can use init.d in a non-braindead way.
This is a very good thing.
Some of us have been waiting for true POSIX compliance for some time (woohoo shared memory mapped files!)
Though Sun gave pretty sweet deals for Solaris (think I got intel for $100), opening it up means a lot more people can be programming for it, specifically where it was weak (drivers).
/\/\icro/\/\uncher
I quote:
/ 2130030/kevin-mitnick-art-intrusion-part
"Sun Microsystems claimed that you caused $80m of damage by illegally downloading the source code for Solaris.
It's a bullshit figure. What was really unnerving was that to demonstrate to the public and the courts that I was such a bad guy, the only things they could show were financial damages.
What I was essentially doing is stealing source code to analyse it for vulnerabilities. I was moving it because I wanted to be on my target's computers for as little time as possible.
So what the government did was come up with these huge numbers; they basically told the companies to provide the loss as the R&D investment to develop the software. So if I look at Solaris source code, which was sold to educational institutions for a few grand, I merely copied it over to the computers at USC - which already had a copy of it, incidentally.
-------------
See - look at the lies and bullshit and now a few years later SUN open-sources the code!!! If the sun sets on sun it will be ok. I do not invest in sun and I do not use or support any sun products.
-------------
What a crock!
This comes from here:
http://www.computingcareers.co.uk/vnunet/features
It seems to me that every now and then (in recent years) Sun will come out supporting Open Source movement and then short time later put its foot in its mouth by coming out swinging *AT* Open Source movement. It leaves me wondering if burried somewhere in the legalese of their license agreement is some nasty clause that will just screw Open Source movement over at a later time.
ELOI, ELOI, LAMA SABACHTHANI!?
When will the Sun compiler be released under the CDDL? Currently, Sun Studio is under a different license.
Slackware has no init.d either, you get rc.S for single user, rc.M for multiuser and rc.4 for graphical login.
I see 57005 people
Way cool. When my PPC PB 15" is ready to be replaced with a new Intel one, I can repurpose it with a Polaris load. Very nice.
Time to steal the good features and port them to Linux :)
IMHO, Slowaris is relatively polished, but some things are clunky and slow.
I have run a Solaris system since the 2.3 days.
If you are deploying a system that will be around for several years, Sparc Solaris lets you upgrade hardware and software with minimal hassles and downtime.
Try bringing a 1998 Linux install in a 24x7 environment and upgrading the disks, CPU, memory, mobo, networking, the OS, apps and libraries without breaking everything that has been tacked on to the system in the past 7 years. This is done all the time with Solaris.
If the lifespan of your app/server is only 18 months, then none of this matters.
Wow, I've been waiting for this one. And I was also one of the first 5000 on the website, so I scored myself a nifty free opensolaris tee as well :)
:)
Go Sun!
The launch date of OpenSolaris was set in stone more than a month ago. Pilot members knew it was going to be today.
I don't know if it compares to SMF (probably not), but Gentoo's init system is quite good. It supports parallel service launching, does automatic dependency checking (so if you restart one service that others depend on it restarts them all).
It also doesn't require you to add and remove symlinks in a bunch of rc.d directories which is really nice. If you want to add or remove a service there's a simple one command utility that does it for you.
It's suberb ! Everything works jus
SMF is going to be a head check for a lot of people who LIKE init.d/rc.d (though backward compatability with that has been retained so far). Myself, I like the fact that it's more robust and faster, and I don't like the fact that it's managed with a handful of different commands depending on what you want to do. And I'm not terribly thrilled that the backend is XML, but you'll have that.
7 November 2006: The day Americans realized corruption and incompetence weren't addressing 11 September 2001
when people would rather give out their mailing address than their email address????! ;)
Do a full text search for sco on the source browser: http://cvs.opensolaris.org/source/
If they're smart, the Linux guys won't be looking at it - just like the Solaris engineers shouldn't be looking at Linux. And the FreeBSD guys shouldn't be looking at anything.
With all the different licenses floating around, there is too much risk of getting polluted and accidentally mixing IP.
- Old Man of the Mountain ---- "I want to disturb my neighbor"
...OpenSolaris will be done. Until then, I assume Sun will play its usual EOL games with hardware (ZX off in 1-2 versions (crippled when officially supported, hackable onto Solaris 7), and the drop of 32bit hardware in Solaris 10 for example?). Evidence of them doing this again is in the code - note that a search for leo brings up it being in a filter of "Obsolete hardware".
Twitter supports and protects racists - by smearing their critics with the "Hate Speech" label.
From a technical perspective this is a good thing.
But:
- How does this ensure Sun's going-forward viability? e.g. will Sun be around in 10 years to support this? Based on their stock's selling price, I'd say the investment community is betting against Sun being around as Sun.
- How exactly does this make PHB's feel better? I'm all for OSS especially with the credibility of a Sun behind it, but PHB's want support.
Mod me down, but I think they are good questions.
http://www.maxineudall.com/2010/02/should-economists-be-sued-for-malpractice.html
What drop of 32bit hardware in Solaris 10 are you referring to?
Solaris 10 runs on Sparc (which has been 64 bit for quite long), x86 and AMD64/EM64T.
Be kind. There are too many mean people out there already.
OO.o was released in July 2000. KOffice was started in 1998.
As a point of clarification, OO.o is under the LGPL and the SISSL. Obviously LGPL is GPL-compatible, but SISSL isn't (though it is still free).
This is in contrast to the CDDL of OpenSolaris, which is also GPL-incompatible.
SMF actually replaces all of inetd and *some* scripts found in /etc/init.d
This should give you something useful to learn from: http://www.sun.com/cddl/CDDL_why_details.html
When it can be run fully from sun4cdm machines...
Sure, if you can get Solaris 10 to run on a 4c machine like an IPC, with its blistering 25MHz CPU and SCSI-1 bus and maximum of 64MB (IIRC) RAM, you go ahead and do that. I'll be over here doing something fun, like compiling Gentoo while watching paint dry and hitting myself in the head with a hammer.
Until then, I assume Sun will play its usual EOL games with hardware (ZX off in 1-2 versions (crippled when officially supported, hackable onto Solaris 7), and the drop of 32bit hardware in Solaris 10 for example?).
Do you really expect Sun to support every piece of hardware they ever made forever and ever? That is a rather naive viewpoint. It would be nice to see S10 run on some 4m machines - e.g. an SS20 with 512MB RAM and dual Ross HyperSPARCs - but is it practical to expect the vendor to support these [relatively] aged machines? Of course not. Hey, you've got the code - go nuts!
Evidence of them doing this again is in the code - note that a search for leo brings up it being in a filter of "Obsolete hardware"
First, that should be le0, as in "Lance Ethernet 0 (zero)", the onboard NIC in 4[c,m,d] machines. Second, le0 is rather obsolete: it is (again, IIRC) a half-duplex 10Mb NIC that has been around for 12? 14? years. What is the point of supporting such an old NIC in a new OS version, particularly when the platforms containing said NIC cannot run the new OS?
I want to drag this out as long as possible. Bring me my protractor.
I wonder what the real reason behind this could be. First Apple announces its working with Intel, now Sun's announces it will revile part of its code. If I wasn't such a skeptic, I'd be tempted to say it's a sign of Armageddon.
How can it be hard to maintain or understand the Solaris init.d/rc.d setup?
I mean, really. You are going to runlevel 3. The init script goes into /etc/rc3.d, which contains a bunch of K## and S## scripts, many of which are links to a master script in /etc/init.d just so that you don't have to modify five copies of a Sendmail startup script if you play with it.
It runs all the scripts with K## with "scriptname stop" and all the scripts with S## with "scriptname start".
You're up.
Dependencies are implicit in the numbering order for the various scripts, not explicit anywhere, so that's somewhat of a drag. But other than that, what's not to understand?
Sure, you could put it all in one long shell script for each run level. That works too. Do you code your hundred thousand line C programs in one .c source file too?
Secure and stable uh-huh.
If you had looked at their roadmap you'd see that there is more coming...
http://www.opensolaris.org/os/about/roadmap/
Now before I get modded down, I be to remind whoever might read this that what I am saying is FACT. - bogaboga
I tried Solaris 10 before but it cannot even find my hd! does it support my VIA SATA now?
hmmm... dumb...
Meaning, grub as in GRand Unified Bootloader?
I thought that was a GNU project...
If it's so secret, then how come I've never heard of it?
The 7 second boot was for a zone within a Solaris instance, so this was not a complete boot.
6 #boot_chart_results
It looks like the complete boot took 32.6 seconds.
See:
http://blogs.sun.com/roller/page/eschrock/2005010
My mistake. I missed the info on the charts. Looks like the 7sec boot time was for a zone running on 1 processor. The dual opteron workstation the zone ran in, booted in just over 30. Still. That's pretty fast.
Open Source Java DAO Generator
Envy my 5 digit Slashdot User ID!
I dont like this statment in the FAQ
"The Solaris OS is Sun's supported operating system offering. Future versions of the Solaris OS will be based on technology from the OpenSolaris project."
perhaps i am just being cynical but it sounds to me like Sun is gonna open Solaris 10 wait for the OS community and then take all are code and put it back in their own propreity software. Has any one read the license?
On the other hand, now we have solaris open, darwin was always open (though aqua isnt), how long till we see openO/S2 or OMG *gasp* OpenWindows(tm)?
Sun means about as much to me today as MS does which is just about nothing. I don't need anything that either one of them produces and if I did I would just code it.
Got Code?
SCO have already said they have no problem with Sun releasing OpenSolaris. Some have speculated that this is because Sun's agreement with USL gave it enough rights to the Unix code (much of which came from Sun to USL) to make it open anyway, whether or not SCO like it.
A ray of Sunlight, coming at the right time
/.), I'm already halfway thru a bottle of Jack D from Tennessee, celebrating...
:):)
Never have I been prouder of my (very) old Sun machines nor of my IRC nicks (DrSolaris, docSunny) than on this day. No longer do I need to feel ashamed for running Sun's own OS on SPARC, where it kicks root... and having to spend 2 minutes excusing and explaining myself at Free Software events. Sun, you made my day!
I've cancelled my appointments for the afternoon and given my date for the evening a No honey, not tonight: I have a headache! -> and I intend to have one, too!! While ritually installing S-10 in a couple of Ultra's and a E3500 (and writing this comment in
Well, of course, not too exuberantly: maybe, just maybe, as someone with a sense of humour already commented above these lines those awful codewar-mongers at SCO are now going thru every single line of Solaris code to see if they might claim a few trillion or zillion dollars! And Sun has been so permissive with M$ on Java issues, maybe they let the big bad wolf in among the sheep (...) ??
RMS, the man, told me recently that they're nothing to worry about (at least, nothing compared to the EU software patents situation, see here), but...
As long as SCO and their none too saintly part-owner M$FT are "out there" playing their fuzzy games and trying to scare the Free Software community (confusing aspiring or new adopters), I'll not bat an eyelid. Freedom is still a fragile thing, it would seem, and needs continually to be defended!
No sleep for the weary... but we can cautiously celebrate another little milestone, today!
So have a Sunny day, y'all, and please help me free some of the content of my bottles of liquor in a toast to Sun
* Signal 15... "Ceterum censeo Microsoftem esse delendam." Cheers cq. BRgds: DrS aka UNIXmafia@ribeco.net
> When "GOTO Considered Harmful" was written, it was THE flow-control structure. Only unthinking idiots actually believe it is never Ever EVER to be used.
I agree with you, and I have always been prepared to use a GOTO when that is the best way to do the job ("best" means a combination of most efficient, most readable, most maintainable, most flexible, and so on).
Now it happens that in my 25 years working as a programmer, I have never used a GOTO. But I'm still open to the idea.
I have seen other people use GOTOs where it didn't offend me, even though I would have done it differently. I have, for example, seen people use GOTO where I would use a SELECT.
Perhaps the most common place where the use of a GOTO seems inevitable is to jump down to some clean-up code when doing an error-return from the middle of a function. The odd thing is, though, that I never seem to get myself into that situation, because I never seem to have to do any clean up before exiting my code. Maybe I should study why that is, one day. I suspect that it has something to do with concepts like read-ahead, and late-binding, that many programmers never quite seem to grasp.
But I digress. The point is that I have never rejected the use of GOTOs. In fact, I have written the programming standards for more than one project, and, while those standards have stated that the use of GOTOs must be justified, they have never forbidden it.
The opensolaris pilot team were a group of people inside and outside of Sun that were invited to have access to NDA materials and code while the non-free code was removed from Solaris. Some examples of the pilot members were Jorg Schilling (author of cdrecord), Ben Rockwood (owner of Cuddletech.com), Al Hopper, Rich Teer (active members of the Solaris x86 community), and site owners of many Solaris freeware sites. I was included because of my project on the Gentoo forums to bring the Gentoo package management system to Solaris.
What Will SCO Do?
Instances of SCO code usage in OpenSolaris
Not that we care, but you know, we should in light of their accusations against Linux.
bo
bad_outlook
--
Is this vague enough for you?
I just installed it on my 15" PowerBook, and it certainly feels snappier.
Larry McVoy designed a prototype called 'NSE Lite' which was based on concepts developed by Eric Schmidt and Bunker Lampson which were incorporated into NSE which was built by a host of people including, but not limited to, Jon Fieber, Marty Honda, Ethan Adams, Terry Miller, David Hendricks, and Jill Foley. Larry McVoy had absolutely nothig to do with NSE or the core concepts of copy-modify-merge except for being an unhappy NSE customer. Glenn Skinner is listed as the patent author for 'smoosh' which is the central technology to both NSE-lite and Teamware. Larry claims that he is co-inventor. I don't know, I was in the NSE group, Larry was in the OS group at the time. Teamware itself was designed and implemented by Ethan Adams, Terry Miller, Jill Foley, Mark Sabiers, Lewie Knapp, Josh Sirota and Mitchell Nguyen. Larry's primary contribution was to complain a lot. Larry is a bright guy, but he didn't design Teamware anymore than Bill Joy designed Unix. He deserves a tremendous amount of credit for sucessfully productizing the technologies invented by the NSE team (and a lot of others) something that Sun, with substantially more resources, was unable to do, but it is an extreme stretch to call Larry the designer of Teamware (even though if Larry thinks so).
Solaris 10 is light years ahead of Linux in terms of reliability, fault tolerance, and scalability.
Their support infrastructure is amongst the best in the industry.
Where it lags is in easy, quick, cutting edge and fancy little tools (of which Linux has more than its share).
This is mostly the result of a stabilizing bureaucracy and carefully directed architecture.
It sure ain't "SVR4" any more though.
For years it hasn't been very clear where they are going with the OS. With Solaris 10 we are starting to see.
Where else are you going to turn, when you've got to run big jobs - HP? AIX? Mainframes?
I'd consider rolling out Linux or BSD on the little servers.
But for the big boys, Solaris is the way to go.
So then as a technology manager you would have to wonder, why deal with different support contracts, different vendors, different employee skill sets and development tools - when you can get everything from one place?
Besides, once the Linux standards are finally cast, Sun promises "Solaris will be Linux", that it will meet all of the standards.
Cool stuff.
OpenSourcing it further strengthens the product, if for no other reason, than allowing their user community the ability to go in and see what is under the covers for themselves.
I'm glad they were able to finally follow through with the promise to open this up.
O=='=++
Oh ye of little faith.
Stick Men
... if it were released opensource, the ironing would be delicious...
Sorry, I dozed off while reading it.
apropos: From the manpage you besmirch for not having been updated in 10 years:
(first paragraph):
(footer):Maybe it hasn't been updated because it hasn't needed to be?
dhcpconfig: I don't know, it worked fine for me. Our two anecdotes cancel each other out, it seems.
interface names: Yes, Solaris names the interfaces by the drivers providing them, which are in turn named for the hardware chipset (which a few exceptiosn like qfe, which stands for "quad fast ethernet" and refers to the number of chips on the cards, as opposed to the chipset). Since you seem to already know apropos, why didn't you do:Also, I have no idea how you managed to bungle 'ifconfig -a', but it doesn't require any specific interface argument. It works almost exactly the same as on Linux ("almost", because it doesn't show you some of the interface statistics like Linux does - use kstat for that). If I were spanking-new to Solaris, I think I'd do 'ifconfig -a', and then when I saw a bge0, I'd probably try 'man bge' and what do you know?
I've found Solaris to have really pretty excellent manpages, and docs.sun.com is very, very good. I honestly wish Red Hat for example would have documentation even a fraction as complete and good as the stuff all over docs.sun.com. There's plenty of valid things to fault Solaris for, but you've hit on none of it.
I see that Solaris 10 is a licensed Unix 2003 product. Is OpenSolaris, as well? Wouldn't that be a really bad thing for Linux, if it were? I mean, why use a free Unix clone when you can use a free, professionally built Unix system?
You have tried to support your argument with faulty reasoning! Go directly to jail; do not pass Go, do not collect $200!
are you sure he didn't run a zone ... that takes only 3sec ....
Use my userscript to add story images to Slashdot. There's no going back.
"Extra! Extra! OpenSolaris Code Released!" shouted the paper boy once more. Just as suddenly as they had stopped, drinkers resumed their drinking, pool games played on, card players continued their dubious gambits. A brawl seemed to be brewing at the end of the bar, and the paper boy was quickly forgotten.
Thanks for the useful info. You're totally right about the `apropos` man page. I skipped right over the description because I know what it does and I thought that's what would be there and I should've read the diagnostics, but I found the info elsewhere. It does seem odd to me that they wouldn't run the `catman` command while setting up the rest of the server info. As for my network problems, looking back on it, the problem I was having with `ifconfig` was that the interfaces weren't set up, and that's what I was trying to do. `ifconfig -a` just showed le0. The Solaris 9 manual said to create a file called "/etc/hostname.interface name" but never told me what the interfaces were supposed to be called. I had found /dev/hme so I thought that was it and wasted a bunch of time on that and other interface names I found in forums before just doing a `sys-unconfig`. I'm still trying to figure out how to get dhcp set up and I've gone through like 5 tutorials.
I think it's sad that I'm asking an honest question, honestly frustrated with solaris, honestly trying to get Solaris to work right for me, but by expressing my frustrations and asking Solaris Guru's, who will no doubt be reading this thread, why Solaris is so much better I get modded down as a troll. I can take a firm rebuke and a disagreement in why Solaris is frustrating/better/worse, but I'm not trolling. I'm trying to frustratedly trying to configure a Solaris server.
Apparently the kernel and some core OS pieces have been released as OPEN while some 'binary stuff' is still closed.
/bin/* /kernel/* etc?
Does anyone care to share if the free stuff alone is enough to have a bootable and runnable system? Do we have libc, init,
BTW I saw nVidia has released drivers for Solaris too as of June 1st. The free OS market suddenly is crowded... for the better.
"Give orange me give eat orange me eat orange give me eat orange give me you." -Nim Chimpsky
That's a feature.
What possible reason does the FSF have to give the CDDL their approval? The foundation has made it clear that they do not wish people to use and/or contribute to non-GNU projects. Approval of the CDDL would very likely cause a number of people to abandon GNU/Linux.
It sounds, however, that the CDDL *is* compatible with other OSI-approved but not FSF-approved licenses (APSL, MPL). Maybe some sharing of code between these projects (say, Solaris code in Darwin? other way around?) would encourage a change in attitude at the FSF.
Mmmm.....
I guess some questions I have:
1) Can I download the entire tree and make changes to the source code, and run my own versions of Solaris, and allow people to download them and improve upon my improvements?
How about the build chain, do they publish the tools to compile the OS?
If you can't do that, this intiative will die, or wither as it will not be able to compete against the Penguin Armamda in Suns skies.
(i.e. most Linux engineers just don't care.)
2) Can you redistribute the code you modify under the GNU License.
GNU=Why Linux is Great.
At least in my opinion from the stand point of insuring copyrights are enforced by authors who contribute AND no single entity can take over the OS and screw its user community.
3) What sort of support is SUN planning for those who run a different version of the OS and deploy it in there organizations?
-Hack
Got Geometrodynamics? Awe, too hard to figure out? Too bad.
oprofile monitors the whole system at last check...
DTrace lets you go from the kernel down to the program, and it has a very functional scripting language 'D' that lets you do things that at last check where near impossible to do in oprofile.
Anyone interested in trying to port this beast to Apple PPC/NuBUS hardware with me? I'd love to replace my last incarnations of MacOS seeing as OSX doesn't support older hardware and MkLinux was killed. :-)
/\/\icro/\/\uncher
According to Eben Moglen (the one-man legal team behind the Free Software Foundation), Sun sold its soul to Microsoft for funding, which required them to not release Solaris 10 with the GPL itself; Eben had been working with Sun to make that happen, and that they suddenly changed course to help fund the construction of Fujitsu's new manufacturing plants (to compete with IBM's new smaller chip core size and thus possibly get Sun back into the UNIX server world ... a giant step backards).
OpenSolaris's use of the non-GPL compliant CDDL is possibly a preventive step to appease the MS lawyers.
Use my userscript to add story images to Slashdot. There's no going back.
I agree about not running 'catman -w' at install time. You'll find lots of things like this in Solaris. There seems to be a general philosophy of not making decisions for you, which you can get to appreciate, with time. I think they kind of assume that if you want to use apropos, you'll slap a 'catman -w' into one of your jumpstart scripts. Rememeber that it's really an OS geared for bigger corporate environments with dedicated staffs of sysadmins, not desktop users or casual passers-by. But, I do agree that it'd be nice for it to take care of that automatically. If that bugs you, you'll also be bugged trying to use sar, and a few other things that they except you to go explicitly enable. My big gripe is that they abandon that philosophy when it comes to which network services they'll enable - they enable pretty much all of them and expect you to go explicitly turn off the ones you don't want - in stark contrast with the general philosophy of asking you to explicitly turn on the stuff you do want. But, again, really, this is all very superficial stuff. It's not nearly enough to condemn an OS by. You just turn on the stuff you want and turn off the stuff you don't, and if you're in Sun's historical customer demographic, then you're a corporate sysadmin just adding stuff to your jumpstart scripts.
Sorry too that I didn't understand what your beef with ifconfig was. Yes, ifconfig won't show you any interfaces that haven't been "plumbed." The concept of plumbing an interface doesn't exist in Linux, of course. I don't have a Solaris machine handy to play with this second, so I can't tell you a sure-fire and elegant way to get a list of all valid-but-unplumbed interfaces, but I know it can be done. In fact, one of the Solaris install scripts does it (I believe that if you bomb out of an install or toss yourself out of a begin/finish script at the right place, and do an 'ifconfig -a', you'll see all the interfaces on the box plumbed up). I'm not suggesting that's a valid way to do it, just pointing out that it must be possible, because Solaris itself does it. Here's a hack I came up with that should do it:By the way, comp.unix.solaris is a great resource, full of very smart and helpful people (many of whom work for Sun, including several kernel engineers) who have always spent a lot of time answering all sorts of questions, from newbie to insanely technical and complex. Some people also like BigAdmin, and of course SunSolve and docs.sun.com are invaluable. Make sure especially to check out the System Administration Guide on docs.sun.com.
Keep an open mind and be patient - it's definitely an acquired taste, especially for someone coming from Linux, but I personally think it's a truly great and unique OS that's totally worth the effort.
You know, I was out walking at lunch and I realized that this OS seems geared towards a more knowledgable, learned audience who have been trained or educated in how to use it, which is definitely not the crowd I fall into. An old co-worker had used it in the Airforce, I sure which he had been tasked with this! I was reading and reading and reading through these manuals and I did find a bunch of stuff where I thought "Damn, I've always wanted that ability in linux/windows/os x." This seems like a bigger change from Linux than BSD was, and I guess I wasn't expecting that. Still terribly frustrated... No worries about the tone of your reply, and thanks again for all the info. I'll probably be sorting through that newsgroup over the next few days, but I already downloaded every pdf from dosc.sun.com that has anything to do with Solaris 9, IP services, etc.. Right now I'm trying to figure out why examples from the manual for dhcpconfig return errors. Didn't expect to see Java errors in the terminal, especially on textbook examples:
/etc/dhcp
bash-2.05# dhcpconfig -D -r SUNWfiles -p
Created DHCP configuration file.
Created dhcptab.
Added "Locale" macro to dhcptab.
dhcpconfig: Error - creating server macro for server java.lang.NullPointerException.
Hmm... maybe it's a hostname problem. Anyhow, thanks again for all the info.
It has nothing to do with the "approval" of the FSF. The GPL defines certain terms, the CDDL defines certain terms, and the two just aren't compatible. The FSF can't "change" its "attitude" about the CDDL any more than it can retroactively change the licensing of the enormous amount of code that has been put under the GPL over the last decade.
I love how twits like you spin this as a fault of the FSF. What were they supposed to do? Prognosticate the terms of the CDDL in 2005 when they wrote the GPL 14 years ago? Sun had a choice: be GPL compatible, and be able to take advantage of the huge amount of GPL code that's out there, or not be GPL compatible. Since their license came (much) later, it was up to them to either play with the community, or not. They chose not to. That's their right, but don't get uppity at people who point out that Sun's decision is a major constraint in what code can be used in OpenSolaris and where OpenSolaris code can be used.
A deep unwavering belief is a sure sign you're missing something...
Anyone know if the sun4m line of hardware is going to be supported?
since the cool things in Solaris 10 are missing on the NON-Sparc platform it looks to be another UNIX toy... I have never been able to get any of our MCAD software ported to Solaris/X86 even though the software exist on the Sparc platform... :-(
Your Average Joe
Then they hit me
Then they told me
They don't like me
--Zappa
I actually used dtrace for the first time to solve a real problem the other day at work. As opposed to just playing with it, which I've been doing for a while.
So why is the OS looking for libfoo.so in those places? Hmmm...must be somthing wrong with LD_LIBRARY_PATH. Quick edit, restart, problem solved.
Cool.
...laura who works for people who don't trust Windoze for anything that matters
And the GPL is not BSD compatible. Who cares? Both licenses are Free Software. If you want to make code compatible with everything, release it as public domain (or MIT licensed).
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FreeBSD and NetBSD now use rcNG, which has separate scripts with explicit dependencies (on abstract services, rather than other concrete instances), allowing parallel launch of the scripts once their dependencies are satisfied.
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AFAIK Shillin my resume is the same as OpenSolaris without any binary part.
GNU had a big hand in making Solaris a success: when Sun was still successful at universities and in research, everybody was installing GNU tools and X11 on Solaris.