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Man Convicted For Hacking Xbox
PipianJ writes "Remember the ruling in Britain which outlawed mod chips last year? BBC News is reporting that a man has been convicted of modding an Xbox and sentenced to 140 hours of community service, a fine of 750 pounds (about $1300), and the confiscation of his PCs and Xboxes." From the article: "The man had been selling modified Xbox consoles which he fitted with a big hard drive containing 80 games. 'This case sets a major precedent which marks a milestone in the fight against piracy,' said games industry spokesman Michael Rawlinson." Update: 07/04 22:12 GMT by Z : Updated to more accurately discuss the story.
Kinda relevant, but somehow missed from the main slashdot post:
There are legitimate reasons to chip consoles, e.g. to run your own OS on them. I wonder how the case would have gone had the guy just been selling modded console sans illegal software. Anyone want to turn themselves in and find out?
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just dont sell modded xboxes. i don't understand why every slashdot post has to make a mountain out of a molehill.
Maybe he shouldn't be making a profit while doing something illegal? I heard that was a sure way to get busted... Just like selling Illegal software vs downloading...
A very clear one. Resistance is futile.
Global warming is a cube.
Look, there's a lot of activities you're allowed to do legally as long as it is for personal use. If you try to make a profit off of it, you're hurting the bottom line of some company and you are going to get slammed for it. How simple is that?
I know this gonna be an unpopular opinion on Slashdot, but why are these fringe type of actions seen to be a premonition of things to come? It's not.
From the article:
"The man had been selling modified Xbox consoles which he fitted with a big hard drive containing 80 games."
So.. um.. not just mod chips, then.
Precedent or no, this guy no more deserves our sympathy or support than some guy selling bootlegged CDs on a street corner.
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Does it mean someday tweaking OS can land you behind the bars. Oh wait you cannot tweak MS Window. Sorry my bad.
"The man had been selling modified Xbox consoles which he fitted with a big hard drive containing 80 games."
Copyright infringement. It wasn't just the mod chip.
Mod your x-box, put Linux or what-have-you on it: OK. Mod your x-box, put 80 pirated x-box games on it, and sell it: Not OK. Seriously, what did he *think* would happen? Even the most liberal interpretations of copyright prohibit making a bunch of copies of something and selling them at a profit ...
"Because Science" is one step from "Because old book". Try "Because of my experiment testing my falsifiable assertion".
He was modding and selling Xboxes with 80 fucking pirated games. Can we lose the dumbass leading question in stories please? Or at least go with a total fucking non-sequitur like "Could this increase interest in non-Windows OSes (Linux, OS X etc.)?"
Well since Britain's court system doesn't rely as strongly on precedence as the US systems do, it's just the luck of the draw with the judge.
"but what precedent does this set for casual homebrew gamers and importers?"
Well, uh. None.
What does this mean?
Do it yourselfers who only modify boxes for themselves probably won't be bothered.
Those who do it for friends for free or just the cost of parts may but only if someone rats them out.
Those who are doing a high-volume business OR who are making any kind of profit are toast.
In a nutshell, the industry will play wack-a-mole and go after the higher-profile targets first.
Knowledge is how to play a game, intelligence is how to win, wisdom is knowing what game to play.
He probably would've been pretty safe if he didn't sell them - I think they would've had a pretty tough time convicting him if it had just been some guy who chipped his own xbox at home for personal use.
(BTW: For those who havn't done it, modding an xbox is so easy that virtually anyone can do it. It actually takes longer to take the thing apart than it does to install the modchip and a bigger HD).
N.
"Nothing strengthens authority so much as silence." - Charles de Gaulle
You know, It's getting real fucking close to time for the ammo box!
Just a guy with an opinion
The headline / summary of this article needs to be rewritten to mention something about selling pirated games.
I caught the Mountain Wumpus! He gave me his treasure chest ($100) to let him go free again.
Modifying hardware in that way is certainly "hacking" in the "original", RMS-cum-ESR meaning, but doesn't the Original Meaning of "Hack" (OMOH) preclude illegal uses of a computer?
In that way, isn't Slashdot doing a disservice to the OMOH by blurring the line between it and the negative Mainstream Meaning of Hack (MMOH)?
I mean, it is an effect of a legislation that expels from legality many playful activities associated with the OMOH, but the deliberate breaking of laws is certainly MMOH, isn't?
How does one get out of this riddle?
That they would label this article as, "Man busted for chipping box." When in fact it had nothing to do with the chip itself, but the PIRATED SOFTWARE the hard drive contained. It should be properly labeled as "Man busted for selling pirated Xbox software." if he had been selling Linux running xbox's with homebrew apps, it would have been a nonissue. As the slashdot commmunity, we do ourselves a disservice by labeling stories this way and spreading F.U.D. that would lead us to believe that chipping your box is illegal.
Next time excercise some editorial control and highlight the fact the man was selling Pirated Xbox software and that this was all part of a greater nonissue. You pirate software and sell it(Whether in Hard Drive or Disc Format) you are going to get the hammer. Guy got off amazingly light in the face of what he was doing.
John Walsh once found me while looking for some other kid. He was not amused.
...this isn't Xbox modding, this is Xbox infringement.
I'm against laws prohibiting modification OF MY OWN DAMN POSESSIONS. That's like saying I can't put a heavier recoil spring in my handgun, or improve the fuel mileage in my car with a better carb.
HOW LONG BEFORE I NEED TO HAVE A FEDERALLY APPROVED "SOLDERING IRON" OR "OSCILLOSCOPE" LICENSE?!
Now this guy got nailed for piracy but the quote about "chipping consoles is an illegal act" towards the end makes me uneasy. Real uneasy. It's only a matter of time before people get nailed like this under the US DMCA.
They aren't using this guy as a posterboy for generic anti-piracy, they are using him as an example for mod-chipping.
Is there such a law against modding the XBox in the US? I knew someone who knew someone who knew someone who was hacking Direct TV cards to get free channels by programming an assembly jmp instruction around the code that performed the authentication. Direct TV kept modifying its cards and moving the authentication code around to get around the hackers. I think eventually Direct TV started going after people who SOLD the hacked cards online but not after the individuals who modded the card.
Regardless of the fact that this guy deserved to be punished, I can't see how chipping for a legitimate use (ie, to use it as a media centre etc) can possibly be illegal.
I would hope that if I bought the hardware I'd be entitled to do whatever I liked to it, provided I didn't actually break the law by putting pirated games on it.
I fail to see how taking a soldering iron to your X-Box can be interpreted as an illegal act.
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I believe it was Bobcat Goldthwait who said, "If you go on the Tonight Show, don't set the dressing room on fire!" There's a lesson here for Modman.
"Mod your x-box, put Linux or what-have-you on it: OK."
I think a more interesting scenario would have been if he was selling modded XBoxes with Debian or something similar on them. I would find it much more scary if that was determined to be illegal by the authorities.
He probably wouldn't have been caught if he didn't include 80 games on the drive of every xbox he modded.
That's like giving out 80 bags of hash with every bong you sell....the cops probly care more about the amount of hash you're giving out than they are the fact that you're selling bongs.
I guess when I go to a store and pickup a box with hardware in it, its still regarded as software: you don't "own" anything, just the right to "use" it.
Its an interesting conundrum which is only showing up in the computer age. If I bought a car tire, turned tied it to a tree and used it as a swing, I could do so. If I resold it as a swing, the manufacturers wouldn't care. It would still be an increase in their sales.
What gives with computer hardware/software anyways? Why does it have to be so different? I think the only problem here (which I agree to) is that some mods can be used to play games which were copied without first buying them. I think to make this go away: 1) cheaper replacements for broken discs past warranty should be allowed (some companies charge $20 or $30! - the cost of the game), 2) allow for some way to mod it without circumventing the copy protection on the games while still allowing functionality.
For example, with #2, if you want to mod your X-BOX as a weather station, to stream media in your house, to make the next Terminator robot, you should be allowed to - and even resell the design. In this way, you're using the hardware as you want to, MS makes the hardware sale (their prob if they sell at a loss) and you don't get to copy games.
He was selling cracked games too. :-D
Modifying hardware is fine, breaking the DMCA in the process isn't.
I don't know what this has to do with Windows?
Maybe if you had the source to modify it, but that's pretty dumb regardless of what OS it is since YOU aren't an OS programmer and would probably just screw it up
But if I want an X-Box to be able to play games from another country that I've actually bought and had shipped over, and modding it is the only way to do it, shouldn't I, as the owner of this licensed box, be able to modify how it operates to work with software I own? Am I violating a copyright or am I violating the DMCA in any way? (I don't ethically think I am, since I legally purchased the items in question, and while I'm no lawyer, I believe it's my right to be able to make something made for the same platform, but from a different country, able to work with my system.)
I personally think (mod me up/down/whatever) that this kind of ruling is stupid. I do not like this one bit, this seems to screw over everyone who wishes to make sure their system works with any software they buy that's "designed" for such a system. (This also makes me wonder, why develop PAL and NTSC? I mean, if you're going to make the system, (from now on replace system with XBox) and distribute it worldwide, should this XBox not have the same hardware, same BIOS, etc? Why the hell would I need to buy the same XBox, TWICE, from different countries just so I can play a game from a differnt land?
Just to clear it up, I don't own an XBox (The whole statement above is a theoretical/POV one) and this is one of the reasons I'll *NEVER* buy a console, and instead wait for emulation.
Still waiting on Serviscope_minor to wake up to fucking reality and realize that Jessica Price isn't going to fuck him.
As read in BBC news:
Man convicted for chipping Xbox Xbox console
(image)
(NOTE: extra-tiny caption. almost invisible)"The Xbox was fitted with a 200GB hard drive packed with games"
A 22-year-old man has become the first person in the UK to be convicted for modifying a video games console."
As long as you can't buy sex on the internet, they'll always have a revenue stream.
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If all he had been doing was modding the boxes with bigger drives or a different OS, then selling them, that sounds fair. He had to pay to get them to begin with, so that didn't cost MS or other console makers any money, but the issue here was that he was also sticking games on the drive that you bought with the system. That is unreasonable unless the person bought copies of each of the games that he sold with each of the systems.
80 games/system... sell 10 systems would need 10 copies of each game to go with them...
It really doesn't matter, if my understanding of the legal system is even vaguely close to accurate, as to whether the person was "guilty" of software piracy, if he was in fact prosecuted under a different law entirely. What matters is what the judge ruled on, how and why.
For example, if the judge said something along the lines of "the piracy was the offence, and the xbox mods were an aggravating factor", then I don't think there's anything to be too concerned about.
On the other hand, if it was the reverse of that, that the mods were the offence, and the piracy was an aggravating factor, then there could be some implications, as that would imply that the piracy was merely a detail that made things worse, in the eyes of the law.
Without clearer information on exactly what was said, and without some input from a legal expert who can give some interpretation, it's very hard to see what exactly this case means. However, if the latter idea (ie: mods are bad) is correct, then what we're seeing is probably the "worse possible case". In other words, someone who was caught selling modded boxes only would not be likely to get anything worse.
Of course, the whole thing might be thrown out on appeal. The appeals process would go to the appeals court, then eventually to the House of Lords, and (if necessary) to the European Court of Human Rights. The House of Lords has a lot of grudge matches going with the House of Commons at the moment, so don't expect them to be sympathetic to the Government. The EU is in an even worse mood, so if it gets to them, almost anything could happen - and probably will.
This is not like America, where the Government can throw around impeachment threats, whenever the Supreme Court rules against them. The Law Lords cannot be impeached by the sitting Government and have pretty much free reign to decide how they like. They are supposed to rule by the law, but when they get seriously narked by Government attitudes, they're just as likely to rule in retaliation.
Most likely, it won't go to appeal, as the fine isn't super-huge and community service is unlikely to involve the rooftop of Stangeways, or the insides of Dartmoor's equally notorious prison. Depending on how many boxes were sold, he might easily cover the costs of the computers and the fines from his "income".
It's a small world and it smells funny; I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money; Take back what I paid (SoM)
Imagine if Ford Motor Company filed frivolous lawsuits (and won) against someone who sold a Ford they souped up.
Where were you when the voynix came?
That they would label this article as, "Man busted for chipping box." When in fact it had nothing to do with the chip itself, but the PIRATED SOFTWARE the hard drive contained.
Without the court docket all we have to go on is the article. The article says he was actually convicted for chipping, not copyright violation. Possibly he plea-bargained down to that (or the UK equivalent)... but regardless, IF he was convicted for chipping then this case can be used to help make the next case against someone doing something less obviously illegal, like selling Linux XBoxes...
Almost every time I have ever seen the BBC run an article covering some kind of clash between technology and the desires of large traditional commercial copyright holders, they seemed to have gone absolutely out of their way to slant the article in favor of the copyright holders.
I don't follow the BBC closely and I don't really know much about their normal news coverage. But it seems that on this one set of subjects they seem incapable of or unwilling to write a balanced article.
Somehow I don't think it's just a coincidence that the BBC is, itself, a large traditional commercial copyright holder.
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Your not breaking the law by modding your own machine to play software you own. However, the person who sells you the mod chip is breaking the law.
By the twisted logic of the DMCA therefore, you've got a chip you can only get illegally, and if (horror of horrors) you're not in the country they meant the game you bought to be played in, then you're a thief. A thief who's money the companies they represent have got, since you paid for their products, but still a thief because you've violated their precious licence.
The sheer mind-numbing stupidly of being classed as a criminal after actually paying for the thing you're meant to be stealing beggers beleif, but there we are.
Alas the world is changing, and the RIAA et al represent the people who want it to change in a way which suits them. It won't, but try telling them that. Just wait, soon it'll be 'you may only play this game for one month after purchase unless you buy the extended licence'.
This guy probably wouldn't have been busted if he didn't include a bunch of games with the modded Xboxes. The spin makes it sound like it was all about modding, but it was more about the 80 games he included with the things.
But the thing about software. I do agree that some companies are trying to push the envelope when it comes to ownership versus a licence to "use" the software. But there's a reson for it.
Sure, you can buy that tire and use it as a rope swing, but you can't copy the tire and equip all your cars, your friends' cars, and anyone connected to the roads' cars. With software, you can do that. So, it's different.
But, now that there's the internet connected to almost everyone's house - at least, anyone that would want to play "top pirated" software like games - it doesn't even matter anymore. Game publishers just make their software check-in every once in awhile to make sure you have a good copy, or you can't play online, or register, or whatever.
As far as the Microsoft hardware sale, well, we all know that the game console companies lose tons of money when they sell these things. They only make money on the game licensing or royalty-type money from the game publishers. That's why there's so hard of a push to stop console hacking. Not that I agree with it - it's not my problem that you're selling these at a loss of profit.
- It's not the Macs I hate. It's Digg users. -
PipianJ writes "Remember the ruling in Britain which outlawed mod chips last year? BBC News is reporting that a man has been convicted of modding an Xbox and sentenced to 140 hours of community service, a fine of 750 pounds (about $1300), and the confiscation of his PCs and Xboxes From the article: "The man had been selling his modded Xboxs, instead of modding it for personal use, but what modified Xbox consoles which he fitted with a big hard drive containing 80 games. 'This case sets a major precedent does this set for casual homebrew gamers and importers?" which marks a milestone in the fight against piracy,' said games industry spokesman Michael Rawlinson."Update: 07/04 22:12 GMT by Z: Updated to more accurately discuss the story.
errrr, ok. offtopic
13 million whoo!
I don't get this. I know a company here in Ottawa that used to mod XBoxes but stopped, presumably for liability reasons, but to make modding illegal...? It's stupid. Changing hardware simply CAN'T be against the law.
I'm interested to see whether the original XBox can be made into an XBox 360 with a simple mod, or not. Frankly I don't see why it should be hard, and it'll open the floodgates for modding.
The title of the story is unrelated to the meat of the story. It's like ordering filet mignon at a fancy restaurant from a pretentious waiter and getting a plate of Rhesus Pieces.
This is about copyright theft, not modding. The title is uninformative and flame bait. Zonk should have known better than to release this story with that title.
Watch this post get modded into oblivion. I don't care, my karma is bullet proof, bitch.
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BMO
precedent on Xbox modding is grossly mistaken. What we have here is a seller of pirated software that happened come with a modded Xbox. He deserves no sympathy and did a disservice to those in the "modding community" who are simply enthusiasts who like to see what their hardware can do (Installing Linux for instance). As a matter of fact, his sentence when compared to others convicted of software piracy may well be lenient. What isn't mentioned is just how many he sold. With the amount of information available on the web for modding Xboxes, I doubt he would have been noticed if not for the piracy. What this WILL do is drawn more attention on those with more modest goals. What he did was WRONG, and don't give me some "fight the power" garbage. BTW, I believe in fair use.
"Build something idiot proof, and someone will build a better idiot" - Samuel Clemens
i don't understand why every slashdot post has to make a mountain out of a molehill.
I was *very* amazed (and pleased!) that he didn't get jail time. Maybe if this had happened in the USA he could have ended up sitting in prison for a few years. Sounds like he got off a little easy, but maybe in this case the punishment finally fit the crime a little better.
Look, there's a lot of activities you're allowed to do legally as long as it is for personal use.
In this case, you aren't allowed to do it for personal use either. UK courts have found mod chips illegal in general - read the submission.
If you try to make a profit off of it, you're hurting the bottom line of some company and you are going to get slammed for it. How simple is that?
I call BS. Consider these three situations:
1. I buy an Xbox for myself and mod it.
2. My friend buys an Xbox and pays me to install a mod chip.
3. My friend pays me to buy an Xbox, install a mod chip, and give it to him.
Microsoft's bottom line is exactly the same in all three situations, because the only way to get an Xbox is to buy it from Microsoft.
If you were referring to the illegally copied games, you're still wrong: the game company's bottom line is the same whether you download a copy of their game for free, or buy it from some guy on the street corner, or even if you choose not to buy the game at all and buy a DVD instead. Either you're paying the game company or you aren't.
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I'm guessing that last "From the article" bit is the update to more accurately discuss the story, right? I dread to think what was there before. What the hell is going on here? Personally I've noticed a huge drop in quality lately, and have been visiting this site less and less.
Its amazing, this guy actually did violate copyrights with piracy, for profit, and on quite a large scale and he gets a small fine and community service. Dimitry Skilerov violated no copyrights, in another country, and mearly talked about it and he got 6 months in prison.
This brings me to another point: If the whole purpose of a copy-protection device is to stop you copying something, then why do you need a law to prohibit tampering with the device?? If its such an amazing piece of engineering why does it need legal protection? It seems like 'they' are getting the best of both worlds - they can have their copy-protection devices AND the law behind them when only ONE is actually necessary. Perhaps consoles should be sold under a contract making it clear that you don't actually own the console and you may not modify it. For fucks sake someone just choose one of these options, you cant have your cake and eat it too.
This comment does not represent the views or opinions of the user.
A funny way I misread this line: first time through, I thought it said "in the fight against privacy." Might've been rather more fitting.
ProofReading Markup Language - and yes, I find typos.
It does look like the BBC are just running the ELSPA press release here.
It would be more useful to know what charges he faced, what he was convicted of, and what the judge's summing up said.
On another note, is a 750 quid fine going to really deter some Del Boy from doing this? He wouldn't have to flog many boxes to pay it.
It isn't everyone's God-given right to own modded hardware, given that it's illegal. It's kind of like saying 'why shouldn't people be able to buy marijuana if they don't have the resources to grow it at home?'
It isn't that hard to learn how to solder, anyway. Even I can do it.
It isn't everyone's God-given right to own modded hardware
Why not?
it's illegal
Why?
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it's illegal Why?
You should read this.
In the USA? The DMCA.
Others have pointed out that the real concern was the pirated games but I think it's important to point out why this is such a major issue. The game systems themselves are sold at a loss inorder to get market share with the games sold for profit. If they can't make enough on the games the system cost will have to be raised. I guess if you don't mind paying twice as much so other people can sell pirate games it's a non issue. The other problem is he is helping draw negative attention to modding. The guy isn't a hacker or geek he's a sleazebag who deserves to go down. He wasn't doing it for the greater good he was trying to make a buck selling pirate materials.
Just a point on fair use for imported games - with DVD's the region encoding and the scrambling are two separate things AFAIK. Throwing all controversy with DMCA/EUCA out for a moment, breaking the scrambling/CSS part of the DVD would clearly by illegal, but breaking the region coding is not in any way a copyright violation or a breaking of a copy-protection device. Assuming the XBox works the same way, modding for compatibility with imported titles is not the same as modding so that a copied disk can be used or so that it can load from a hard-drive. Hopefully that would stand up in court, although given how crappy the law is in the first place i doubt it.
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Don't forget to add the 80 games he preinstalled, if you are naive enough to think that had nothing to do with this case then there is truly no hope for you. so in your analogy you also need to put 80 games onto his modded xbox for free.
I didn't forget. Perhaps you forgot to read down to the bottom of my comment - notice the paragraph starting "If you were referring to the illegally copied games"?
The fact remains that the game company's bottom line (which was what the post I replied to was talking about) would be affected just as much whether he sold those illegally copied games, or gave them away for free, or whether they never existed at all. All that matters, as far as their profits are concerned, is the number of people who buy legal copies - if you get an illegal copy, it doesn't matter where you get it or how much you pay.
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What 80 games were on the drives? Doom 3, Halo, and the like or some home brewed pong, brick, and minesweeper? See how that changes the issue. Notice how irrelevant the process of modding is in that context? So modding is illegal, but that's ok because the law was used to slap a bad guy? No. Modding should be legal. Period. It's my hardware, it's my right. Should this guy receive punishment? Maybe, but not for modding. He is being punished for modding. Read it: "A 22-year-old man has become the first person in the UK to be convicted for modifying a video games console." Throwing in the 80 games bit obfuscates the issue. He will probably receive additional punishment for copyright infringement.
Last year I seem to remember a story about a local man (I live in thames valley, UK) being convicted of breaking the law as he was importing ps2 modchips. At least I think thats how it went
As already posted here a dozen times the illegal acts were the fact that he was selling modded XBoxes with 80 pirated games on the disk.
There is no longer anything that can be done with computers that is nontrivial and clearly legal. -- Paul Phillips
"If you were referring to the illegally copied games, you're still wrong: the game company's bottom line is the same whether you download a copy of their game for free, or buy it from some guy on the street corner, or even if you choose not to buy the game at all and buy a DVD instead. Either you're paying the game company or you aren't."
Uh...what the hell are you talking about?
If I buy a game, copy it and sell the copy to five people, that's five people who haven't paid money to the developer. They've lost that revenue.
You can't possibly be that stupid.
You are such an idiot.
Its imposible to avoid bias completely, but shouldnt an attempt be made to at least present all the facts ?
Why wasn't the fact that the accused was allegedly selling the modded X-Boxen with pirated software presented in the post ? Just what is it that goes into selecting a submitted story to post ?
The root name server story is another example if you wan't a mother lode skim the archives of the politics section.
This story isn't about modding, it's not about hacking, It's not about fair use, It is about a guy who used techniques he didnt create to rip off people who made things he couldnt. By my way of thinking he got off too easily.
How fortunate that this guy cops a slap in the head for his silly action.
Neither can you. Those five people are, at best, potential sales. Presuming that an illegally-copied product is the same as a sale in terms of financial loss is an invalid premise, and is the core fallacy of the media industry's "War on Piracy." Hard numbers are harder to come by, but do indicate that the losses sustained by the content people are substantially less than they would have us believe. Remember, they have a vested interest in inflating those numbers as much as they possibly can. This is an industry that has lied to everyone from governments on down since the advent of recorded entertainment, so that should come as no surprise.
The higher the technology, the sharper that two-edged sword.
According the the BBC http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/4650225.stm "the modification of video games consoles has been an illegal practice since October 2003, when the UK enacted the EU Copyright Directive."
'why shouldn't people be able to buy marijuana if they don't have the resources to grow it at home?'
That's easy.
1) Drugs are bad mmkay 2) marijuana leads to heroin 3) pot is 30x stronger than in the 70s 4) Marijuana finances terrorism 5) You will become schizophrenic 6) What kind of message would that send to the children
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This very much depends on your jurisdiction. Slashdot may be an American website, but there are still enough people from other countries here that the blanket statement "It's a criminal offence" is unreasonable.
In Canada downloading *absolutely is* legal. There have been rulings on this point from the high courts, and the CPCC is steamed about it. The comment from the minister in charge of these things was something like "It is very disappointing to discover that this is the case in Canadian law. We'll have to fix that."
They haven't fixed it yet, and Canada is hardly the most IP liberal country in the world. I believe France had similar rulings lately, largely because they have a similar copyright levy system.
Even in the US, though, downloading is *not* a criminal offense. You cannot go to jail for downloading. You can only go to jail for distribution. It's illegal, and you'd have to pay damages to the RIAA, but you will not have a criminal record. The FBI and local police will not and cannot investigate downloading. There will be no wiretaps to find out if you're downloading.
It simply isn't that kind of offense, which is why the RIAA has its own evidence gathering goons.
Even if it were a criminal offense, it would be a stupid thing to try to prosecute. The burden of proof in criminal court is "beyond reasonable doubt." Hard for downloads, only really worth trying for distribution. In civil court it's "the preponderance of evidence", which is easy.
If the crime was modding an XBOX, why were the man's PCs and printers confiscated. I can understand if the PCs were used to obtain and place software for the XBOX, but printers, that doesn't make any sense. That is like some on taking a bootleg movie in a movie theater and they take his cell phone.
Mod parent up! This isn't offtopic, it's exactly what the debate should be about. In the grand scheme of things, nobody will care about X-box mods 20 years down the road. The thing we should be worried about is the precedence this is setting for giving the power to large corporations and taking it away from individuals. This is a continuing trend as our judicial systems are manipulated to pull the cash from the consumer and feed it to the corporation.
I think it's pretty sick that the purpose of our courts has been so far twisted away from its orriginal intent. I mean, weren't the courts founded to protect the little guys from those with power? If the current motto of our court systems is "might makes right" then what purpose do they serve? What's the difference between Microsoft having thought police patrolling our neighborhoods, and the government doing it for them?
UK, US, same thing. Today's governments are tools of the rich, not unbiased arbitrators. The wonderful thing about democracy is you get to vote on which croud of rich assholes to give your money to. Yeah, your vote counts for someone, but unless you have frequent flyer miles on the company jet, it probably isn't you.
Damn! That means I'm stuck with info! And I hate info!
"It's too bad that stupidity isn't painful." - Anton LaVey
I just want to start of by saying I don't think drug use is right.
1) Drugs are bad mmkay
Clearly state that illegal drugs are bad. I think Advil is a GREAT drug. Plus with governments around the world legalizing marijuana, who are you to say it's bad? Smoking cigarettes is no better than marijuana. Drinking is fairly bad also. If you drink or smoke, then you are also doing a pretty bad thing... mmkay.
2) marijuana leads to heroin
Who said this? Where did you read this? Please supply some links, because I think this is completely false.
3) pot is 30x stronger than in the 70s
Give me proof please.
4) Marijuana finances terrorism
Are you telling me that Al-Qaeda gets all of their money from marijuana sales? So that drug dealer down the street is actually an Al-Qaeda spy? Don't exaggerate the idea of marijuana sales to terrorism, or at least if you are, give some proof.
5) You will become schizophrenic
This is theory, and not proof. We have to wait for this to either be proved or disproved.
6) What kind of message would that send to the children
You and I both agree that buying the stuff is a pretty private act. You don't buy it in front of strangers or children (or at least I hope not). If you want to say what you just said, at least ask what kind of message are governments sending to children by legalizing marijuana. THAT'S a much more public act than someone buying drugs off the streets.
dear jackass
/.
please get a clue. the parent poster was mearly showing what the slashdot story originally said and what it's been editted to now so that everyone can see what a fuckup Zonk is. all you've done is made yourself look like a tard
regards,
all of
I have reasons to know a little bit about this...after all, it's important to know what laws I am breaking...No, I don't SELL modded xboxes, but I've modded quite a few in my day. The bottom line is this: any mod chip other than the exenium (which has it's own bios) and I believe the new executor (same reason) is illegal because it uses illegally obtained code. Same thing goes for any dashboard other than the linux cromwell setup (which uses no micro$oft code), they are all based on programming which was illegally obtained, therefore, any hardware chip is illegal, any dashboard is illegal, copying games etc is illegal AND all of the above violate the EULA. That hasn't stopped me from modding the crap out of all of my friends boxes...nothing like firing up my xbox and checking /. with firefox !!!
...not selling a modded X-Box.
The man had been selling modified Xbox consoles which he fitted with a big hard drive containing 80 games.
So, the bigger crime is that he sold modded X-Boxes, rather than the fact that he loaded it with 80, most definitely pirated, games??? What's the world coming to... That would be like if someone was arrested for having a hydroponics setup, rather than for the large marijuana crop that individual was growing.
Duct tape is like the Force. It has a light side, a dark side, and it holds the universe together.
Good. He is a thief.
that 150 hours of community service and $1300 fine is really going to stamp out piracy!
1) Drugs are bad mmkay
Yeah only the illegal ones - how silly of me
2) marijuana leads to heroin
No way - the DEA and ONDCP have proved it conclusively. Don't you know that 99% of herion addicts have used marijuana?
3) pot is 30x stronger than in the 70s
Look man, ONDCP and just put out another press release confirming this. What gave you the idea that you have the right to think for yourself, anyway?
4) Marijuana finances terrorism
Gee you must have missed the TV ads.
5) You will become schizophrenic
See point 3 above.
6) What kind of message would that send to the children
The message we must send to children is: We will put you in jail. That is the message that we must send to kids who break the rules. MAKE NO MISTAKE.
Do you ever get the feeling you're being made fun of?
I think they like to be called homosexuals these days.
Mmmmmmm. Monkey Bits!
Yes, that is a theory. If you use to much pot then you can develop a tempory schizophrenic like mental illness. IOW, marijuana induced psycosis.
How much is to much? Well, that all depends on the individual, however, 1-in-4 people are at risk of developing long term problems if they use to much of the stuff. Problems generally start to show up if it is used more than once every two weeks.
If pot is used in a safe way, then it is a safe recreational drug. If pot is used to much, ie more than once a week, then it can cause some nasty problems.
Does it go on forever?
It is odd, that you can legally own a thing. Possess it in your home. But not allowed to "take it apart." That really means you don't own it. The way I see it, what I do in my own home, as long as it stays there, is simply no ones business. I also believe if I am smart enough to crack someone's OTA encryption, then all's fair in love and way, I should legally have access to what I am smart enough to recognize. If get help from someone else, or give the content to someone else, that is an entirely different manner. Regarding copyright. Shouldn't that be regulated by Anti-Trust law? Copyright is now the backbone for huge revenue - more than some telecom.
please re-read my post. It doesn't matter that there were 80 games on the drive. The man was convicted for modding, not copyright infringement. I'm not attacking the parent poster. I'm noting that, given the conviction, the 80 games mentioned are beside the point.
I wish this were the first time this had happened here, but of course, it isn't. Why does /. continue to post FUDdy headlines like this?
If you're referring to cannabis psychosis, your numbers are way off. Most studies I've read say that heavy cannabis use "almost doubles" the risk of psychosis. Note that the risk is slightly less than 2% in the general population. So heavy use of marijuana makes a very small minority slightly larger.
s is-risk/2005/03/01/1109546844568.html?oneclick=tru e
http://www.google.com/search?q=cannabis+psychosis& ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8
http://www.smh.com.au/news/Health/Cannabis-psycho
You sure it's illegal? See the wikipedia entry on modchips. It appears only modchips with hacked bioses are illegal under the DMCA. That's why they're sold loaded with bioses like chromwell, which can only run linux. However, most people do download an illegal bios elsewhere and flash it to the chip. But the chip itself is not illegal.
No way - the DEA and ONDCP have proved it conclusively. Don't you know that 99% of herion addicts have used marijuana?
So? I'm willing to bet that 99% of heroin users have also used a flush toilet. Doesn't mean that flush toilets lead to heroin use.
Causation. Learn it.
Did the marijuana use inevitably lead to heroin use? Okay, I don't know either. But while marijuana has long been touted as a gateway drug, if this were actually the case, then we should have a lot more people who get fucked up on a daily basis.
Personally, I think alcohol abuse is much more of a problem then marijuana, but after the U.S. Government botched Prohibition, I don't think we're going to return to that....
Kierthos
Mr. Hu is not a ninja.
"Do you ever get the feeling you're being made fun of?"
Apparently not...
I think the writer of this news should go back to writing school. The person was not judged for selling modded xbox's, but for piracy. If you buy a modded Xbox or you sell it, its not illegal. But if you fill the Harddrive with any type of game from 1 to whatever it fits, this is what is illegal. I guess he was pretty dumb to do it. Its because of idiots like this we pirates don't have a hobby anymore... ;)
Nom de dieu de putain de bordel de merde de saloperie de connard d encule de ta mere.
That's how, not why.
No,the BBC WERE accurate, the offence was breach of the EU Copyright directive, which makes it illegal to chip the xbox - actually to defeat a copy protection system. That's what the guy did, and thats what he was convicted for. The piracy didn't help but the copying of games was actually just a side issue that didn't help his case at all
And the people shall be oppressed, every one by another, and every one by his neighbour Isaiah 3:5
The US government didn't "botch" prohibition - prohibition is an inherantly flawed model for the control of dangerous substances, that invariably causes more harm than good.
Why would the man not yet be named? He is 22 years of age, therefore not a minor and there is therefore no legal precedent (here in the UK) to stop him being named in the press.
This is quite clearly a Microsoft or ELSPA piece of propaganda, designed to put fear into those currently indulging in software piracy, nothing more.
I don't support piracy in any way but I am sick and tired of propaganda stories designed only to put fear into the general populace.
Gentoo Linux - another day, another USE flag.
I love the incredibly deceptive title of this story. It's not even news that someone would be convicted for selling XBoxes preloaded with games on the hard drive, but what actually happened is twisted: "Man convicted for hacking XBox". He was convicted for selling games illegally, a la piracy. Someone realized this wasn't even a story and decided to bank on the Slashdot group mentality of hacking freedom (which I agree with by the way) to get readers.
WHO NEEDS SHIFT WHEN YOU HAVE CAPSLOCK/ DAMN1
Potential sales? If the only way to get a game is to pay the developer for the game then the developer will make money on every copy run by an end user. If everybody can get the game for free then very few people are going to pay money for it. If people don't want to pay for a game then why would they want to play it?
-- You're too stupid to be an atheist.
Your mistake is splitting world up in black and white. It's not.
You see it as either people would like to play the game, and pay $50 for it, or they don't want to play it at all. You forget the people who would like to play the game for $20, but don't think it's worth $50. Others would like to play it for $10 or $5.
These people are counted as a sale at $50, even though they would never have bought the game at that price.
*points at sky*
Look, over your head, a joke passing at supersonic speed!
With 80 games the chance is very high that he would have bought at least one of them had he not received them illegally. You are competing with MS and others in the games arena by using what is rightfully theirs. You can obviously price much lower because you didn't have to pay for developing the games so if they didn't stop you by legal means you'd have the capability to destroy their market by offering copies of their products for a fraction of the price.
Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
They have been illegal in the UK since the Copyrights, Designs and Patents Act 1988, with the first specific testcase in 2002:
n uary/001464.html
t icle.asp?name=../articles/CD%202001%20Part%204%20v 7.htm
http://www.xenoclast.org/free-sklyarov-uk/2002-Ja
http://www.lawdit.co.uk/reading_room/room/view_ar
I understand what you're saying but it's still bullshit.
-- You're too stupid to be an atheist.
I guess it's also illegal to modify your DVD player to skip the previews.
How long before it's illegal to switch off your television or mute it during commercial breaks (anyone remember Max Headroom?)
But while marijuana has long been touted as a gateway drug, if this were actually the case, then we should have a lot more people who get fucked up on a daily basis.
You are quite right there.
If it indeed was a gateway drug, then the Netherlands and Canada would be full of heroin users. I do not know about Canada, but I do know that heroin usage in the Netherlands is definitely not higher then in surrounding countries which do not permit sale and use of marijuana, and in many cases it is actually lower.
Personally, I think alcohol abuse is much more of a problem then marijuana, but after the U.S. Government botched Prohibition, I don't think we're going to return to that....
As with any potentially dangerous drug, it is a matter of using instead of abusing.
Preventing people from gaining experience with alcohol and other drugs while they have a high learning capacity still is one of the main causes of abuse of drugs. While the average 17 year old that is allowed to drink alcohol might at first get utterly drunk a few times (which in itself is harmless untill they start driving a car or such), they have a much better chance of learning to not abuse it.
What is really messed up is allowing 17 year old kids to drive a car, and then at 21 allowing them to use alcohol. They have no experience with the potential danger and have an extremely high likelyhood of messing up.
Last but not least, it is noone elses business whatever I decide to do to my own body, as long as I don't make others pay for the consequences.
The fact that you don't like an argument does not make it bullshit.
Specifically, the fact that someone is not prepared to pay a say $50 price for a specific game, and as a result would nnever have bought it is not bullshit.
The direct consequence is that not every pirated copy equals a lost sale.
Actually, there are situations where a pirated copy can result in a sale.
In the very early 80s Firebird released a game called Elite.
I first got it as a pirated copy, and after looking at it and playing it for a bit, I found it to be so good that I wanted to buy it, despite it costing more money then I would get in a month as a 14 year old at the time. Here a pirated copy resulted in a gained sale. Just an incident? maybe, but not one that is entirely unique from what I have seen.
Saying that every pirated copy is a lost sale is BS. Not because I don't like the statement, but because it can be shown to be wrong.
I'd mod you down, but there are too many people saying the same damn thing and I don't feel like wasting my mod points on one article.
HE WAS SELLING A HARD DRIVE WITH PIRATED GAMES ON IT!
Read the fucking article.
I'm the guy with the unpopular opinion
I didn't RTFA, but I spotted the headline and thought "HOLY SHIT!, this is insane" only to read a little further and see he was selling modded Xbox's with 80 gigs worth of pilfured games.
It's the proverbial "bad apple" that will spoil the bunch. The day you cannot hack equipment you own for your express usage, you can thank this guy.
I am Bennett Haselton! I am Bennett Haselton!
Wow, what a misrepresentative headline.
He wasn't convicted of hacking them for his own use, as would be suggested, but for selling them with 80 games installed.
Were the 80 games legal?
Public domain?
Come on guys, you can do better.
Don't be so sensationalistic.
I hate sigs.
Am I the only one who thought: $1300? If he was selling them at the correct price, he made more money than that.
Have you ever wondered How to Take Over
screw those phishing titles! goddamit
headline: mans arrested for giving out candies!
TFA: the was distributing candies fillied with cocaine near a elementary school.
(-1, Unable to Recognize Satirical Material)
And you are a fucktard.
Let stop pretending we are idiots, ok?
We all know what is the incentive for copying 80 games and selling them.
If you think people buying them are hurrying up to do so when they hear TuxRacer you are completely deluded.
IANAL but write like a drunk one.