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12Mbps Powerline Broadband Trial Unveiled
An anonymous reader writes "The tiny state of Tasmania in Australia has kicked off the country's first commercial powerline broadband trial. The service is capable of providing Internet connectivity of up to 12Mbps but during trials, it will be limited to 4Mbps. Costs will range from $12 (A$15) to $67 (A$80) per month for speeds between 256Kbps and 4Mbps. Powerline broadband has received wide support from leading vendors including Intel, Motorola and Cisco Systems -- all of whom support an organisation called the HomePlug Powerline Alliance."
...that our once thought unfounded fears of someone programming our toaster to eat our dog are not not-so-radical?
When one person suffers from a delusion, it is called insanity. When many people suffer from a delusion it is called Rel
In other news, Los Angeles is working on an implementation of electricity over power lines. Still a few bugs to work out in their implementation though, apparently.
Tasmanian Devil reportedly not impressed. Already using 1GBit fiberoptic connection.
Taz administer broadband network!
NNNNyehhh, what's up doc?
Taz eat hacker rabbit!
You can't talk about Wikipedia's flaws on Wikipedia
http://www.tastel.com.au/bpl/price_broadband.html
I bet I can do that in a day or two just patching a game? Or am I reading it wrong?
* Winners compare their achievements to their goals, losers compare theirs to that of others.
Aren't HomePlug and BPL different, or have they merged, or what?
Comment forecast: Bits of genius surrounded by a sea of mediocrity.
Ah, who am I kidding - I would never leave the house with broadband that fast...
DAMN YOU OCTODOG! DAMN YOU TO HELL!
I have Comcast cable internet and I'm pretty happy with my download speeds. The thing that I wish they would allow for is higher upload speeds.
So this new service offers 12Mbps download... but what are the upload speeds?
It's kind of sad that these companies have so little respect for the Ham Radio operators.
With all of the evidence showing the damage that the broadband over powerlines causes, this is kind of sad...
After I spent all this time getting off-grid!
but even with a UPS, you'll no longer be able to surf the 'net if the power grid goes down. The data signal is going through all the same places as the regular power.
A small price to pay though, does anyone know the maximum range on this technology?
c'mon, guys. Is it asking too much to report the ACTUAL bandwidth used in the trial, instead of some arbitrarily-high number that the users involved will never actually see??
Broadband over powerlines makes a whole lot of sense. Currently if you want broadband you have to run cable from your local cable provider, phone line from your local phone company, optical fiber from . . . whoever might offer that service (not an option in most areas, including my own, so I'm not sure), or you'll have to set up a satellite dish and worry about weather effects.
But what's the one thing that all computers have in common? They use electricity! And even if you're generating your own, you're still likely hooked up to the grid so that you can sell your excess back.
I can definitely see broadband over power lines being a big hit in developing countries, since they won't have to worry about the added infrastructure for connecting their residents to the Internet. Add voice over IP and you end up with VOIPOPL: Three products for the price of one (give or take a bit of added overhead).
On the bright side, you no longer have to worry about such predators as the Tasmanian Tiger
last line of communication over relatively large distances will be threatened... on the flipside, if everything does hit the shits, due to some type of disaster, all the powerlines down etc., the frequencies will be back online/usable...right?
So, any outlet could be an internet connection? I envision web cams and microphones left in every room by your crazy ex-girlfreind... Kind of expensive to have to replace all appliances, electronics, and outlets after an ugly breakup.
"Sky-Net"
Be afraid... very afraid.
Real programmers don't comment their code. It was hard to write, it should be hard to understand.
The article alludes several times to the higher possible speeds:
According to Ehrenfeld, the BPL service will be capable of providing an Internet connection for homes and businesses that is "vastly quicker" than the 24Mbps maximum possible with ADSL2+ technology, which uses analogue telephone lines. Such speeds are so far only being offered by only a couple of ISPs, with several more offering speeds up to 12Mbps.
But what really caught my eye:
"engin and Mitsubishi Electric engineers have worked closely together in both Australia and Japan to incorporate engin's VoIP technology in the 200Mbps BPL product developed by Mitsubishi," said a statement from the VoIP vendor on the trial.
Bah!
1) Spiders, snakes are rare in Tasmania.
2) In Tas, the water is to cold to swim in (hence sharks are no problem)
3) Maoris are only deadly if you don't know they're from New Zealand, not Australia.
My pics.
http://www.tastel.com.au/bpl/price_broadband.html
256kb/64kb
1Mb/256kb
1Mb/1Mb
4Mb/1Mb
Comcast's maximum upload is 768 Kb. If youre not paying for the "speed" its significantly less.
The tiny state of Tasmania
Just to give some idea of what 'tiny' is in this context, Tasmania is about half way between West Virginia and South Carolina in terms of area.
The gift of death metal does not smile on the good looking.
I can hear them now...
How do I plug in my Powerline BroadBand? Can I surf the web with my monitor? Can this thing run on batteries?
He who knows best knows how little he knows. - Thomas Jefferson
The tiny state of Tasmania Tasmania is about 68,000 sq km in area, which makes it bigger than West Virginia, Massachussetts, etc. Would you write "The tiny state of New Jersey"?
Come to Hamburg, Germany .... here you can get a 25 MBit/s DSL line for 28,99 EUR + 29,95 EUR if you want all this flat.
In addition, you have none of the above bads and no hurricanes, earthquakes et al. Maybe the weather is bad, but who cares if you have that much bandwidth.
Will this deployment of Broadband over Powerline cause interference to radio services and be subject to interference from radio services ?
: 2099729486:pc=PC_2845
The American Radio Relay league has information on BPL in the USA at
http://www.arrl.org/tis/info/HTML/plc/
The Australian Government has information on BPL at
http://www.acma.gov.au/ACMAINTER.2490560:STANDARD
Peter AI6PG
Hello, this is Australia, where are the crocs on your list?
;)
Think about the only two Australian celebrity exports - Mick Dundee and Steve Irwin. See what I'm getting at?
Seriously, have cheesy 80s movies taught you NOTHING about the deadliness of crocodiles?!
Mother, do you think they'll like this sig?
I can't wait until the day comes when I can send someone an instant electric shock through the internet.
-- www.punkmusic.com
Compared to the rest of Australia, Tasmania is tiny. Yes, you would say the tiny state of Rhode Island if you talking about states in the US, even though the Vatical City is smaller.
I haven't thought of anything clever to put here, but then again most of you haven't either.
Secondly, if saying Maoris are a reason not to move to a country isn't racist, I'm not sure what is.
When Argumentum ad Hominem falls short, try Argumentum ad Matrem
Ah, and I nearly forgot: Starting from Oct 2005 you can get a 18 MBit/s flat incl. telephone line for 49,90 EUR.
... so move.
Though, the 25MBit mentioned in my post above is a trial, this one is RETAIL! You can get it in 14 cities of germany
p.s. sorry for the german links. Maybe try babel or google translation to get a clue.
This fatal flaw will seriously limit the way that BPL can be deployed and will decrease the reliability of a BPL system in any area where it is possible that nearby radio transmitters could be operating. Under the FCC's rules, BPL is an unlicensed device that must accept any interference caused to it by authorized radio services. In the past, and through decades of experience, such interference is rare to other broadband services, such as DSL, cable or satellite. However, in all of the BPL areas tested for susceptibility so far, the unshielded wiring that is used by BPL apparently picks up nearby radio transmitters and overload or otherwise degraded the performance of the system. Although this has been seen at power levels as low as 5 watts from Amateur Radio transmitters, Amateur Radio transmitters can use as much as 1500 watts of power, greatly extending area over which BPL will be unable to tune out these over-the-air signals.
See the ARRL.org website for more info. http://www.arrl.org/tis/info/HTML/plc/ 73 de W7COM
-- I have a private email server in my basement.
What do you get when you cross a Tasmanian Devil and a /.er? A deviled egg-head!
Thanks, folks, I'll be back tomorrow too.
Brodband over Powerlines has been offered in the Allentown/Bethlehem area of Pennsylvania USA, since 2004 by PPL electric utilities.
I cant wait till I have 3mb up at my house.
Does anyone have the pinouts so I can make a NEMA 5-15P to RJ-45 crossover cable?
Muhahaha!
I wonder if I need to use Cat5 cable or lamp wire?...
A couple of years ago I did some work for these guys. Their products were great, but ISTR that only about 6 homeplug devices could be used on a given circuit. OK, things will have moved on a bit in that time, but I wonder what the limit is now. Also, they would not work across a transformer. Correct me if I'm wrong, but where I live every neighbourhood has a step-down transformer to convert the high voltages used to transport electricity over the grid to something that won't fry any poor bugger that gets within a few feet of it.
Modest doubt is called the beacon of the wise. - William Shakespeare
How many people share a powerline? More than share my cable loop? How much capacity per subscriber?
"It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
Secondly, if saying Maoris are a reason not to move to a country isn't racist, I'm not sure what is.
Well other then it would be speciest, I don't think the Maoris will form a coalition and lobby world gov'ts for equal rights.
I mod down so you can mod up. Your welcome.
I learned everything I know about Maoris from Whale Rider and the All Blacks...
DAMN YOU OCTODOG! DAMN YOU TO HELL!
Was it evasion or accident that caused you to not include Kylie Minogue and Rolf Harris. I'd like to add Eric Bogle but I guess he's a niche celebrity.
This fatal flaw will seriously limit the way that BPL can be deployed and will decrease the reliability of a BPL system in any area where it is possible that nearby radio transmitters could be operating. Under the FCC's rules, BPL is an unlicensed device that must accept any interference caused to it by authorized radio services. In the past, and through decades of experience, such interference is rare to other broadband services, such as DSL, cable or satellite. However, in all of the BPL areas tested for susceptibility so far, the unshielded wiring that is used by BPL apparently picks up nearby radio transmitters and overload or otherwise degraded the performance of the system. Although this has been seen at power levels as low as 5 watts from Amateur Radio transmitters, Amateur Radio transmitters can use as much as 1500 watts of power, greatly extending area over which BPL will be unable to tune out these over-the-air signals.
Perhaps in the US, but it's Australia testing it in Tasmania, where the FCC has no jurisdiction, as that is a US agency, and Australia is a sovereign country that has its own agencies. And it's not like Antartica will be complaining about radio interference - they're too far away to the south.
Tasmania is an island on the SE tip of Australia.
And they can decide which band to use, regardless of what the Yanks want.
-- Tigger warning: This post may contain tiggers! --
The amateur radio geeks and their incessant whining. Pssst I'll let you in on a secret, radio dorks, NO ONE CARES what you think about this. NO ONE CARES that your silly little HOBBY will be harder or impossible. Maybe if you mattered they would. But you don't.
Aside from this theme, there's the interference: power lines act as antennas that amplify and increase (by air) the frecuencies the BPL modems use. And this is bad for radio comunications, notably amatteur operators.
As mentioned before on Slashdot, Japan's JARL has stopped any implementation of the technology if they could not come with an answer to the interference, and USA's ARRL it's threatening even with legal action, as a nice article they've made stats.
To give you an example of the amplitude of the problem, here in Mexico the technology is seen as a means to compete with the largest provider (some say a monopoly) by smaller companys, they've been granted capital by Google, Goldman Sachs and Hearst Corporation, and they talked with goverment officials (disclaimer: I'm one of them) to get sympathy (on competitive grounds and consumer's benefit), and my side has stated clear that we're not going to support BPL if there's a disruption in HAM's radio comunications.
Ladies and gentlemen: this is a HUGE, and we must wellcome anything that increases competitive business, lowers prices and amplify the reach of broadband access to the Internet, but keeps things as important as Amateur Radio working...
Carlos Niebla
Is the data riding the low-voltage lines (110/220V), or the primary distribution lines (15/13.8kV)? (note: voltages may vary depending on your country)
IIRC, there was an article years ago on Wired saying that data over power lines could work better (only?) in some countries due to the architecture of the power distribution grid.
If it relied in big central transformers, then wide areas covered by a low-voltage grid it would be easier to implement (the continuous "media" would cover a large area).
If it had high-voltage lines all over the place, then a myriad of small-power (~10kVA) transformers to serve low-voltage for every neighborhood/block/building, then it was a problem, because every transformer would have to have a "data bypass" to interconnect the "subnets". (this is the Brazil scenario).
The Wired article was about a guy who claimed to have solved the bypass issue, but had failed to show anything more than pretty numbers.
Was that problem solved, or Australia has the "good case" power grid?
the unshielded wiring that is used by BPL
Okay. So how hard is it to add shielding?
I mean, serious question. It isn't like we'd have to rewrap the entire fifty zillion miles of power lines in the U.S., or anything. Broadband at this point is mostly a "last mile" problem. The only wires you'd have to reshield are those wires in the last mile. Once you've done that, getting lots of fiber or something directly to the NOC is easy.
Irritable, left-wing and possibly humorous bumper stickers and t-shirts
"Hey, Johnson tap that connection over there to copy the data stream."
ZAAAAAAPPPP!!!!! EWWWOAH!!
Another question: how fast is it? "12Mbps" you say? No, that's not how fast it is. That's how "big" the pipe is. What I want to know is: how much latency?
If this is anything like satelite, I wouldnt go near it even if it did come to the US.
Talking about the 80's and cheesy, what about Olivia Newton-John?
If you mod me down, I *will* introduce you to my sister!
Are you referring to the Treaty of Waitangi?
When Argumentum ad Hominem falls short, try Argumentum ad Matrem
I may not be able to receive because of the BPL interference, but I can still transmit.
... and even if they did, what I'd be doing is PERFECTLY LEGAL.
Legally.
Ansd, I can do so at power levels that will utterly destroy all BPL signals within a half-mile of my truck.
And, that's the FIRST thing I will do when/if the BPL noise shows up **anywhere near** where I live.
The BPL service WILL be taken out, randomly, and the idiot techno-nothings at the power companies won't be able to find me
The unreliable BPL service will be dismissed by the early customers due to poor value. Who wants their Vonage, pr0n surfing, etc., to be randomly interrupted?
Game, set, match.
While you may not think that your neighbor yammering on his CB, or another neighbor listening to broadcast from Radio Swaziland,or listening talk radio on AM broadcast are very important, there are other communications that are also disrupted: HF radio is used by emergency response agencies all over the world. The inadequacy of communications (among other failures of emergency services) was well demonstrated by the recent Hurricane Katrina disaster. BPL will make this worse.
HF radio, unlike cellular telephones and other centralized radio systems, has the ability to comunicate over long distances without any intermediate infrastructure. The is vital for disaster communications where the infrastructure is overloaded or destroyed.
Worst hit would be the poorer nations of the world, where telephone service is often unavailable or unreliable, and much of the communication has depended on HF radio. While the interference at a distance will be less, it will still be strong, very easily strong enough to make a weak signal calling for help in Afria disappear in BPL noise generated in Australia or the US.
It goes both ways: HF radio can also interfere with BPL. I think that, in an area where BPL is interfering with Amateur Radio, that the Amateurs will not hesitate to use more powerful transmitters (if they can afford the electric bill for doing so). These will disrupt BPL, quite easily to the point of being unusable. And I doubt the BPL ISP will let you out of the contract because of such interference! So don't sign up. It's not worth the headache, and the guilt, and angry hams and other angry HF radio users.
I had set up a computer in the basement furnace room and tried to get a wireless connection to it. It never worked 100% of the time.
I tried the internet over the power line. Set up a connection from my office upstairs to the basement and presto an instant connection. I was so impressed with how easy it was to install. took me less than 5 minutes and that includes the walk from upstairs all the way down to the furnace room.
I use the computer as a file server for MP3 and other old files that I want to have access to at various locations around the house.
I do have power line filters and UPS on both ends of the Internet over the power line adaptor with drops the transfer rate to about 5-6 megs a second. With out the power line filters and UPS I was easily getting 10-11 Megs a second. I am not transferring 100's of Megs at a time.
I am impressed with the technology and was impressed how flawlessly and seamlessly it works. Given how poorly people set up a wireless router for their home I would rather have them set up a simple internet of the power line for their home. It can be a tad bit more secure.
My Sig indicates the end of the comment I posted.
Are you sure you're not thinking of Kiwis??
This is a Maori.
This is a Kiwi.
I don't know if this is the reason for the trial, but Tasmania has only one power company for the whole state (Aurora Energy, or when I worked there.. the Hydro Electric commission). In the 1950's, a forward-thinking premier of the state invested a lot of money into powering the entire state via hydro electricity. Being an island, it's also fully self-contained and I believe generates a fairly hefty surplus each year (or used to..)
This is a horrible idea. It will mess up ham radio.
The human race is artificial intelligence created using object orientated programming.
What's the transfer limit? That's the one thing preventing me from moving to Europe - most ISPs have some sort of transfer limit that, when triggered, I've heard puts you on dial-up speeds.
Read and be enlightened http://www.arrl.org/tis/info/HTML/plc/files/HomePl ug_ARRL_Dec_2000.pdf
"I can still transmit. Legally. Ansd, I can do so at power levels that will utterly destroy all BPL signals within a half-mile of my truck"
That's just mean & nasty, but I'll be in my van about a mile from you, and will be glad to rag-chew with you for hours on end. Let's see... at 3920 KHz, LSB, with the interference level the way it would be from the BPL, we would need about 1.5 KW PEP, right? The law says we have to use the lowest amount of power for reliable communications, so, as you said, it would be "PERFECTLY LEGAL."
Both ISPs are so self-named premium ISPs in Germany. All discount providers do it the way you described above. AFAIK, both: Alice and T-Com never put a transfer limit on anyone. In fact, I use Alice too (6Mbit/s Down, 600 kbit/s Up) and never experienced any limit.
.... on a 2 ounce head
This is classic Motorola behavior. Sell a new system, such as the increasingly common but expensive 800 MHz trunking. Then let problems develop, such as interference from digital data over power lines. Motorola can then market a new system that's more immune to that noise. Imagine yourself as a cop in serious trouble and you can't reach a dispatcher because of a nearby power substation, and you'll see why communities will be forced to upgrade yet again, and again, and again.
Even more important is the interference these systems will create with disaster communications. HF radio (3-30 MHz) is one of the few ways to communicate out of a wide-area disaster such as a hurricane, and HF is utter trashed by digital data over powerlines, which are nothing more than giant antennas attached to broadband noise generators. And those who claim that disaster areas don't have a functioning power grid miss the point. In a disaster you need to be able to communicate out of the disaster area to undamaged locale where the phones and Internet still work. That's where reception will be rendered difficult or impossible, particularly since HF communications already has to contend with high natural noise levels, particularly at the low end of HF (3-7 Mhz) used by most disaster communication.
One of the key failures in Louisana was the inability of poorly prepared New Orleans and Louisiana state officials to communicate with each other, so they could discover what was happening and make sensible (rather than hysterical) requests to FEMA. There the problem seems to have been the competence of the mayor, governor and those they had appointed. But digital over power could be deadly even when the area affected has disaster officials as competent and well-prepared as those in Florida have become since hurricane Andrew.
--Mike Perry, KE7NV, Seattle, Author: Untangling Tolkien
See thats what happens when someone uses a list of things, and the fourth item of the list is not comparable to the other three. Animal, Animal, Animal, Tribe of Humans.
I mod down so you can mod up. Your welcome.
Wow. I'd certainly pay $12 for 256K. I pay $14.95/mo right now for dialup, and would love to be able to keep an always-on connection and leave my phone line free, even without the speed increase.
It's rather annoying as I do tech support for a cable internet company in another state that offers 256K down for as low as $19.95/mo in some of their markets (rural CO/WY) while my provider (eastern KS) only offer 3M down as the lowest speed (and charges $29.95, a little more than I want to pay)
4mbps for $67?? I get 5mbps for $45
I may not be able to receive because of the BPL interference, but I can still transmit.
... and even if they did, what I'd be doing is PERFECTLY LEGAL.
Legally.
And, I can do so at power levels that will utterly destroy all BPL signals within a half-mile of my truck.
And, that's the FIRST thing I will do when/if the BPL noise shows up **anywhere near** where I live.
The BPL service WILL be taken out, randomly, and the idiot techno-nothings at the power companies won't be able to find me
The unreliable BPL service will be dismissed by the early customers due to poor value. Who wants their Vonage, pr0n surfing, etc., to be randomly interrupted?
Game, set, match.
Years ago, when they were testing data over power lines in the UK, they had problems with the powerlines carrying data actually broadcast the data and you were bale to pick it all up simply by standing near an overhead. You'd obviously need the appropriate gear to pick up the data, but it still was a privacy issue. Has that problem been looked after?
WURD!!
Here's a good FAQ on BPL:
http://www.qrpis.org/~k3ng/bpl.html
73 de w7com
-- I have a private email server in my basement.
I'm pretty sure the US has all of the above except for Maori. Off the top of my head:
e nt=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&oi=def more&q=define:Maori
Deadly Spiders - brown recluse, black widow, though actual deaths are unlikely. Loss of limbs due to gangrene is a more common outcome, and a lot of pain is more common yet.
Deadly Snakes - assorted rattlesnakes, and others. these are likely to cause more damage if you get bit, but bites are much easier to avoid.
Deadly Sharks - we get shark deaths/bites occassionally, though you're much more likely to die by lightning strike.
So now lets find out what a maori is
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&hs=kMG&lr=&cli
which indicates maori are the natives of new zealand. I'm unclear on how natives of new zealand would be more likely to kill you in australia than the US. Are there a lot of murderous emigrees?
"Who is the Journal of Quantum Physics going to believe?" --Stephen Hawking
That said, there's nothing quite like an amp at 2.5kV, hitting the plates of a pair of 3CX800A7s.
BPL causes gross EMI radiation on FCC protected bands due to the use of unshielded transmission lines (powerlines are more like antennas) and is also highly sensitive to interference from legal RF transmissions.
a tive_or_pdf=pdf&id_document=6515383154
BPL has to be killed. If BPL trials come to my area, I'm going to get my HAM radio liscense, a Yaesu 20 meter transmitter, and drive around transmitting legal power and kill all your downloads!
http://www.arrl.org/tis/info/HTML/plc/
http://gullfoss2.fcc.gov/prod/ecfs/retrieve.cgi?n
-=[ place
Maori are from New Zealand, not the mythical land of Oz...
Go Away! Not for Sale
Finding a library guilty of copyright infringement for placing a photocopier right next to a stack of books. So close, it induced people to copy books! The horror!
Learning HOW to think is more important than learning WHAT to think.
"Deadly Spiders - brown recluse, black widow"
Call those deadly? In the words of Mick Dundee (probably poorly remembered) 'Now I don't want to put down your Black Widow spider, but a Funnel Web spider can kill a man in 8 seconds... just by looking at him.'
"Deadly Snakes - assorted rattlesnakes, and others."
Call those deadly? Four of the five deadliest snakes in the world are Australian. The venom from one bite of a Fierce Snake (Inland Taipan) is enough to kill 100 people. 1/14,000th of an ounce of the venom from a Western Brown is enough to kill you.
The North American Coral Snake comes in at a measly 8th, and the Mojave Rattlesnake is 11th. Just your basic lizards really.
"Deadly Sharks - we get shark deaths/bites occassionally"
They catch sharks bigger than Jaws off the coast of Western Australia. And we still surf and go swimming out there.
Now Maoris I can believe are deadly! I wouldn't want to tangle with most of the ones I have met. Mind you they are nice people, so no need to tangle with them.
Hm.. Here, in Sweden, quotas only applies in some case, either to the highest speeds or the most crappy of ISPs.
I currently have a 41$/month 10Mbit (both ways) service.
For example, there is a 100 mbit(also both ways) option from my provider(Bredbandsbolaget, it costs approx.77$/month) they have a cap at 300 GB each month. If if you go beyond that, either you pay
26$ for each 100GB beyond that, or continue at 128 kbit/second.
If you don't use all the extra quota(not the base quota), it's transferred to the next month.
My understanding is that caps, like the one i just mentioned, in general are still quite rare.
However, i know that ISP:s in Great Britain and France was known to be really bad before(anyone know how it is now?). Maybe that's what you heard?
When this technology does hit mainstream availability where will Cable, DSL, FiOS, and WiMax be? It isn't accurate to compare the specs of a future technology with what Cable and DSL are have today.
Saying Java is nice because it works on all OS's is like saying that anal sex is nice because it works on all genders.
I dont know how, but someone is going to figure out a way to send a huge amount of current over the line and blow someone's computer out of their wall.
:-D
I, for one, am looking forward to it
Watt? This could make a potential difference to Australia's current broadband availability!
An account with no download limit with tesco.net in the UK costs £17.97 per month, according to their website. How much are you currently paying?
Good luck sometimes arrives disguised as bad
Naomi Watts -> Ring Series
Cate Blanchett -> Lord of the Rings
Hugo Weaving -> Lord of the Rings
Sam Neil -> Jurassic Park (Grow up in Melb)
Anthony LaPaglia -> Without a Trace
Geoffrey Rush -> Pirates of the Caribbean
Nicole Kidman -> Days of Thunder
Heath Ledger -> The Brothers Grimm
Lots of others, most born in Oz, some moved at an early age.
Oh yeah.. "Perfectly legal"... You keep thinking that way pal, and I'll read about you being tossed in jail for being the twit you are. If you haven't learned yet that messing with the bull gets you the horns, then you're either very young, or just a slow learner.
What does it mean to the user? Does it mean you just plug in your computer to a socket in the wall without any changes to the building? Are new wires required?
Geoff, Heath, Sam and Hugo were born in NZ, Naomi and Nicole were born overseas (USA? Can't remember.)
Seen "Once Were Warriors"?
Again, You'll find that there ARE NO CROCODILES in Tassie. Too freaking cold. Other than that, its great here :D
I'm fed up with all these companies trying to package services together and forcing people to pay for all of them. Give us broadband without the mandatory electricity, oh wait . . .
The Tasmanian trial appears to be BPL-to-the-home rather than Homeplug. What's on offer is disappointing: low download limits, poor speed and uncompetitive pricing. Have a look at http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-replies.cfm?t =266922&p=8#r153/ for detailed criticism
All in all it looks like yet another BPL beat-up: enthusiasm, spin and disappointment when trials don't proceed to a large-scale commercial roll-out. That is inevitable because the cost of fixing radio frequency problems means BPL in Australia is commercially uncompetitive
Last time this came up, FCC took some serious beating on /. for "pandering to big business" at the expense of HAM radios and the few emergency crews that, supposedly, still use them.
Some (high-moderated) remarks about Michael Powell (the then-FCC chairman) were rather unkind...
In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
Presuming the modems at each end are as efficient as DSL & use similar packet sizes, there's little reason to expect different latencies.
Why would anyone engrave "Elbereth"?
Tasmanian Police were sent to a house of one of the triallers after the RIAA contacted them to let them know illegal downloads were taking place. A RIAA spokeperson said that their network of informers had told them that the trialler "was using the internet to download ACDC, or something like that"
Yes, like Tasmania is the island south of the mainland, the Maoris live on the Australian islands east of the mainland. The only problem is because of the sorrowful state of human rights in Australia we don't give them a vote.
Some of the sheep.
That'd be gone in about 10.5 minutes. Another 5 minutes later, and your speed would be reduced back to that of dialup. Oh, and they charge you 10c/MB beyond that too.
Why would anyone engrave "Elbereth"?
How long will it be until broadboand modems are integrated into computer power supplies....
I'm unclear on how natives of new zealand would be more likely to kill you in australia than the US. Are there a lot of murderous emigrees?
Over here we call them "rugby players"
"I've got more toys than Teruhisa Kitahara."
FTA: " Data packets passing down unshielded cables cause them to act like giant antennas, spreading interference over a wide area, according to a report in The New Scientist "
Pure uneducated speculation would suggest to me that packet sniffing would be incredibly easy.. Am I wrong?
The whole idea of using normal power lines for data transmission is just plain silly, at least in urban areas. When you factor in the costs of all the extra hardware needed to inject and extract the data while blocking the electricity itself, then add the problems inherent in trying to send data down what's literally an unshielded bare wire, then compare the cost of doing that to, say, hanging a fibre bundle on the pole, the whole rationale for using the power lines goes down the toilet.
The ONLY reason American power companies care about broadband-over-power lines is because they want to be the third data carrier in their market, standing alongside the phone and cable companies. The catch is, due to government regulation, getting permission to hang fibre bundles next to power lines (with zero mutual interference) is a major problem, vulnerable to challenges by the incumbent phone and cable companies. But if they can somehow squeeze data down the power lines, it's easier to slide it past the regulators.
I guarantee -- the moment the FCC officially codifies the right of power companies to offer broadband and makes it an unalienable right not subject to refusal or regulation by states, every last power company in America will instantly abandon broadband over power lines and run fibre instead unless they're explicitly prohibited from doing so.
I call BS. There is no way in hell you can get more ( let alone vastly more ) data over a single conductor of varrying size that is connected to dozens or hundreds of end points with all kinds of noise than you can over a point to point twisted pair.
I mean just think about it for a second. 100 MBps ethernet can only run what? 100 meteres? And that's over high quality point to point twisted pair ( two pairs actually, one for xmit, one for recv ), not the rat's nest that is a typical power grid.
That is one of the main problems, yes. Transformers clobber the high frequency signals so they require extra repeaters to be installed to bypass the transformer.
A typical grid in the US consists of a distribution station, which steps down the 650,000+ volt transmission line to ~15kV and distributes it out over the lines on poles next to the streets.
The street lines typically run for a few miles where they are stepped down via a transformer to 440 or 880 volts for transit in underground lines into your neighborhood.
Then typically every 4-8 houses is connected to another transformer, usually in green metal hut, that steps the voltage down to 110/220 that is fed to the houses.
Assuming they ran fiber to the distribution station and then BPL from there, they would have to install a relay at the transformer on the pole, and each of the green huts in the neighborhood.
Assuming they could get say, 40 Mbps from the distribution station, that 40 Mbps would be shared with ohh... 10,000 people. Obviously that isn't going to work.
So maybe they would string fiber up on the poles, and go BPL after the step down transformer to the neighborhood. Then install repeaters in each green hut.
Now assuming they can get 40 Mbps over this ( which is very generous ) and you're sharing with the 50-200 people in your neighborhood or apartment complex, it's starting to look like cable modem type speeds or less.
We already have cable modems around here, so why would the power company invest in all this new infrastructure when they wouldn't really be able to compete with cable?
The Russians have enough nukes to destroy the world three times over, while the US only has enough to destroy the world two times over! The US is behind, we need to catch up!
Or was it the other way around? I was pretty young when the cold war ended. Either way, most people understood that it didn't matter much.
US snakes are deadly enough to kill anyone stupid enough to get bit. It doesn't matter that snakes elsewhere don't need as much venom to do it, if you are stupid enough to get bit by a poisonous snake you die.
200 Mbps at the physical layer and 130 Mbps at the application layer are available since early 2005 using proprietary DS2 technology and in Europe Opera organization have taken steps to develop a standard based on this technologies.