Sony Announces PS3 Slim, Price Cut, Improvements To Home

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Sony Announces PS3 Slim, Price Cut, Improvements To Home

Posted by Soulskill on Tuesday August 18, 2009 @06:45AM from the worst-kept-secret dept.

Sony's press conference today at the Gamescom convention was full of announcements. They officially revealed the PS3 Slim, which will be 36% lighter and 33% smaller than the normal PS3. It will come with a 120 GB hard drive and list for $299 when it hits retail stores in early September. Normal PS3s will drop to that price as well starting tomorrow. (Unfortunately for Sony, their unveiling was spoiled a bit by several retailers jumping the gun on new advertisements, not to mention the rumors that had been swirling for weeks ahead of time.) Sony also announced a PS3 firmware update as well as new features and customization options for Home. In addition to that, the PS3 and PSP will be getting a digital reader service. At launch it will bring access to Marvel comic books, and will expand from there. They didn't talk much about their upcoming motion control scheme, but promised more details next month at the Tokyo Game Show.

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Sweet by c00rdb · 2009-08-18 06:46 · Score: 1, Insightful

I'm gonna buy one. This is a good deal.
1. Re:Sweet by GigaHurtsMyRobot · 2009-08-18 07:02 · Score: 5, Insightful
  
  Rather than a good deal, I'd say it's finally priced the way it should be. I will also be getting one at this price... I have been a 360 zealot for a long time, but will get one of these for exclusives and PSN titles if I want them.
2. Re:Sweet by iamhassi · 2009-08-18 08:56 · Score: 1
  
  "Rather than a good deal, I'd say it's finally priced the way it should be. I will also be getting one at this price."
  
  Agreed. I finally broke down and bought a PS3 earlier this year when the price dropped to $200 on ebay. Ended up with the 40gb basic model with one controller but it works fine, does a great job streaming Hulu through PlayOn.
  
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3. Re:Sweet by Darkness404 · 2009-08-18 13:12 · Score: 1
  
  ...Except for the fact that usually the best games from a system comes from the first party because they designed the system and know how to program it. Just look at all the crap for the Wii most of it doesn't work, but most Nintendo games are the few gems (Brawl, Galaxy, etc). The same thing happened with the launch of the DS but that has settled down to where third parties make decent games. The Cell isn't exactly easy to program and optimize for, so I would imagine that Sony games would push the hardware to its limits. Just look at older consoles, the most impressive SNES games were made by Nintendo and some of the most impressive Genesis games came from Sega.
  
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4. Re:Sweet by motang · 2009-08-18 17:11 · Score: 1
  
  Yeah I think it's prized well also, and will be picking on up in Sept.
5. Re:Sweet by Darkness404 · 2009-08-19 08:51 · Score: 1
  
  there is not any technical reason for limiting a game to a particular console
  
  There are a lot of reasons. for one differences of controllers, there are a lot of games that work great for the Wii but doesn't work for most other consoles. The PS3 is going to be better at doing HD, and the 360 has Xbox Live.
  
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It would be really nice... by 8127972 · 2009-08-18 06:48 · Score: 5, Insightful

..... If Sony restored backward compatibility with PS2 games. That and not the price nor the size of the console is why I haven't bought one yet.

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1. Re:It would be really nice... by Microlith · 2009-08-18 06:51 · Score: 5, Informative
  
  Considering that PS2s are still selling (strangely) well and getting new game releases, it's unlikely Sony will restore BC (even if only software emulation) to the PS3 platform. We'll probably see it return around the time they EOL the PS2 platform completely (once the PS3's successor is out.)
  Although I'm not sure that holds water, at least if they're still selling the PSOne, which I think they are...
2. Re:It would be really nice... by space_jake · 2009-08-18 06:53 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  Just seems like they are shooting themselves in the foot by not offering backwards compatibility with the PS2. The PS2 has a huge library and dominated the console market for its generation.
3. Re:It would be really nice... by geminidomino · 2009-08-18 06:56 · Score: 4, Informative
  
  Just seems like they are shooting themselves in the foot by not offering backwards compatibility with the PS2. The PS2 has a huge library and dominated the console market for its generation.
  They did on the early models. They yanked it out of a later revision (a month before I was going to buy one, amusingly enough).
4. Re:It would be really nice... by Xtravar · 2009-08-18 06:59 · Score: 5, Informative
  
  Find a used CECHA01 (that's the serial number that has hardware backward compatibility).
  Yes, I now own two PS3's. The CECHA01 runs a little hotter and slightly noisier, but I mostly fixed that by changing the thermal paste on it - heck, the warranty was void anyway.
  ZOMG NERD ALERT!!
  
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5. Re:It would be really nice... by Mad+Leper · 2009-08-18 07:03 · Score: 5, Funny
  
  Sony will however sell you a PS2 compatibility kit to go with your PS3. It's 100% compatible with all PS2 games and even comes with an original PS2 controller.
6. Re:It would be really nice... by greg1104 · 2009-08-18 07:13 · Score: 1
  
  Backward compatibility costs Sony significant development resources for a feature that only impacts a small number of people. The real diehards all bought the early PS3 models that had support for PS2 games. While vocal, the people who are still left waiting backward compatibility but not willing to pay for it in the past are a tiny number, and I can't imagine any scenario where Sony starts caring about you. Like those of us who wanted a PS3 when they played SACDs, a feature cut in the same period as backward compatibility, you should just recognize that Sony doesn't feel your sale is worth what it would cost to produce the product you want, and they never will.
7. Re:It would be really nice... by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-18 07:18 · Score: 1, Insightful
  
  Seriously, if that's the only thing holding you back, you're really missing out on some great exclusive titles...
8. Re:It would be really nice... by mattack2 · 2009-08-18 07:19 · Score: 1
  
  Obviously you're joking, but having two separate consoles would be easier if they (1) took one power plug(*), (2) took one input on the TV/receiver.
  Personally, the lack of backward compatibility is the major reason I haven't even thought of buying a PS3.. though admittedly, I don't get *tons* of games for my PS2, and even then, they're basically always $20 games. (Though I do tend to buy as many as I can new, and not on ebay.) Even software backward compatibility, with a list of games they KNOW have major issues, even if they say in some cases they WON'T fix them, would let me judge whether it was good enough for my cases.
  (*) What I really mean is to have a "pass through" power plug so you could theoretically plug the PS2 into the back of the PS3. Vaguely similar to how some receivers have power plugs on the back for other devices (though those require the receiver itself to be on, I think).
9. Re:It would be really nice... by eln · 2009-08-18 07:24 · Score: 1
  
  PS2 compatibility means nothing to me, but then I don't have a huge library of PS2 games, and games from that era now look so terribly dated by today's standards that they're hardly worth buying even at used prices.
  
  I do, however, really dig the idea that the XBox 360 can be used to play Netflix instant play movies on the TV (although it requires an XBox Live account). If PS3 had that as well, I'd buy the PS3 over the 360 in a heartbeat now that they're basically price compatible. As it is, though, I'm torn. Although, since I'm also looking at possibly getting an HDTV in the near future, the BluRay player in the PS3 could become a big deal as well (they still have those, right?).
  
  Dammit Sony, stop screwing around and start supporting Netflix on the PS3 and I'd buy one tomorrow!
10. Re:It would be really nice... by halcyon1234 · 2009-08-18 07:28 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  We'll probably see it return around the time they EOL the PS2 platform completely
  I doubt it. I'd love to be able to play my PS2 games on the PS3, but I know it'll never happen. Not when they can "sell" the same games through the PS Store and get another $10-$20 out of people who have already bought the games.
  
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11. Re:It would be really nice... by Zencyde · 2009-08-18 07:31 · Score: 1
  
  I'd like to remind you that you ARE posting on Slashdot.
  
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12. Re:It would be really nice... by King_TJ · 2009-08-18 07:33 · Score: 4, Interesting
  
  It only seems strange that the PS2 is still selling so well, until you realize that the PS3 really isn't "standard def. TV friendly".... I know quite a few people who play games on their PS2, and bought replacements when their old unit broke/wore out, but have no real interest in a PS3, simply because they're still using a large-ish tube type standard-def TV as their main television set. (If you have cable or satellite, you really have no need to replace it, after all.)
  My experience with using a PS3 in standard def resolution was eye-strain inducing, trying to read many of the text fonts the games would display.
  There's a pretty big ratio of PS3 owners who coupled the purchase with a new plasma or LCD TV .... partially because they wanted a Blu-Ray player for that fancy new set, but realistically, it's practically a requirement to enjoy many of the game titles too.
13. Re:It would be really nice... by Mad+Leper · 2009-08-18 07:33 · Score: 1
  
  Acknowledged, I already had a PS2 before I bought a PS3 so backwards compatibility wasn't a big deal for me. I've heard of nothing but problems with the XBOX software emulation so I think hardware would still be the ideal option for 100% compatibility.
  The pass-through idea is interesting, I wonder if it would be possible to design a PS3 with a docking port of some kind that would take the PS2 console power/video/controller inputs and feed them through the PS3.
14. Re:It would be really nice... by bickle · 2009-08-18 07:35 · Score: 1
  
  Backward compatibility costs Sony significant development resources for a feature that only impacts a small number of people. Uh, not really. It was a hardware chip, so it required zero development resources. It actually required resources to redesign the PS3 without the chip. Later revisions included a software emulator which did require development resources, but early in the PS3 lifecycle the only cost was the cost of the chip (which I would think would be even cheaper now).
15. Re:It would be really nice... by Nursie · 2009-08-18 07:35 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  I've got one of the ones with hardware back-compat.
  Unfortunately I bought it in the far east and live in Europe.
  So it won't play any of *my* old games library. Damn them.
16. Re:It would be really nice... by Enderandrew · 2009-08-18 07:39 · Score: 1
  
  Penny Arcade covered this. PlayOn will give you Hulu and Netflix access on your PS3. You have to pay a one-time charge for PlayOn, but that is cheaper than 4 months of XBox Live.
  
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17. Re:It would be really nice... by revengebomber · 2009-08-18 07:41 · Score: 1
  
  Microsoft payed for console Netflix exclusivity. Sony responded by including it in every product except the PS3.
  
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18. Re:It would be really nice... by Chris+Mattern · 2009-08-18 07:51 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  Er...you can't buy PS2 games for non-compatible PS3s through the PS Store because the lack of PS2 compatibility means you can't play them. You can buy PSX games through the PS Store, but you can also play PSX games right from the disc (if you still have your old copy) on *any* PS3. The real gyp is that you can't play old PSX games on your PSP, because the PSP has no way to read the discs. For that, you really do have to buy them again from the PS Store.
19. Re:It would be really nice... by evilkasper · 2009-08-18 07:52 · Score: 1
  
  For me it was the price, I could care less about the backwards compatibility, it was convenient for sure. I still have a perfectly good PS2 that I still use. The initial buy in price was to steep for the majority of their target audience, especially when you could get the same title on the 360. Sure you can argue the PS3 has better graphics, but truthfully graphics aren't everything.
20. Re:It would be really nice... by vrillusions · 2009-08-18 08:07 · Score: 1
  
  This is why I don't understand why Sony doesn't do this. Supposedly the ps1 games are selling good, why not add ps2 games to that list? And it's not like they don't know how to code the software compatibility because it was in the launch 60gb ps3 (I think). Just seems like a no brainer to me as it's something that would make money. Although sony never really seems to "get it" when it comes to... anything
21. Re:It would be really nice... by mattack2 · 2009-08-18 08:08 · Score: 1
  
  Well, I think the backwards compatible PS3s will actually keep value because of that feature.
  I thought you needed an adapter to use the PS2s memory cards (which are WAY cheaper from third parties, btw) on a PS3 anyway.. Will it then use the PS3's memory after first importing the data?
22. Re:It would be really nice... by MeatBag+PussRocket · 2009-08-18 08:10 · Score: 1
  
  The BC was sketchy at best and several games suffered performance issues or didnt run at all. Because the PS2 proccessor was actually incorporated into the PCB it caused some performace issues for PS3 games as well. software emulation would be nice but personally i think the PS3 would need more RAM to effectively due this without any noticeable performance issues. i actually waited until the BC was removed to buy mine for this reason. you can pick up a used PS2 from Game Stop for $60.
  
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23. Re:It would be really nice... by Lulfas · 2009-08-18 08:10 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  Launch PS3 used an Emoticon Chip. Essentially, they cheated and hid a PS2 under the hood. It was NOT done with software.
24. Re:It would be really nice... by Aggrajag · 2009-08-18 08:12 · Score: 1
  
  There are a lot of CECHA01's available on ebay, prices start from $400.
25. Re:It would be really nice... by Chris+Mattern · 2009-08-18 08:13 · Score: 4, Informative
  
  No, the original PS3 actually had all the hardware of a PS2 built into it to provide compatibility; no software emulation. Then they removed most of the hardware and did software emulation, and then the current models removed the rest of the hardware and provide no compatibility at all. Europe was the most out of luck here; no hardware-compatible PS3 was ever released in PAL format, although they did get a software emulation model.
26. Re:It would be really nice... by Xtravar · 2009-08-18 08:15 · Score: 1
  
  Ya, I bought mine when live.com offered 25% cash back on 'buy it now' ebay purchases. Win!
  BTW - The PS2 card reader for PS3 doesn't work on 16MB cards. You need to transfer saved games to an 8MB card on a PS2, if you intend on using old saves.
  
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27. Re:It would be really nice... by BassMan449 · 2009-08-18 08:15 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  360 is the same way. It looks beautiful on a decent size HDTV, but developer seem to still not realized that not everyone has a 720p or better TV. On my old 26" tube most text outside of the main menus was completely unreadable for most 360 games.
28. Re:It would be really nice... by HAKdragon · 2009-08-18 08:22 · Score: 1
  
  Yes, PS2 (and PS1) games store save games on a virtual memory card on the PS3's hard disk. If you already have game saves on physical cards, you need to buy the adapter to import them.
  
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29. Re:It would be really nice... by Stormwatch · 2009-08-18 08:23 · Score: 1
  
  People still watch tube tvs?
  Well, I use one to play video games.
  
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30. Re:It would be really nice... by moon3 · 2009-08-18 08:25 · Score: 1
  
  Well XBox 360 runs old Xbox titles with no problem now (most of them).
31. Re:It would be really nice... by ObsessiveMathsFreak · 2009-08-18 08:25 · Score: 4, Informative
  
  My experience with using a PS3 in standard def resolution was eye-strain inducing, trying to read many of the text fonts the games would display.
  This was precisely my experience before I bought a HD capable monitor. Next gen games are quite simply unplayable on anything less than 720p.
  However, the big problem here is that Last gen games are unplayable at anything above 576p! OK slight exaggeration, but old games do look awful on a HD TV. Aliasing everywhere. And therein lies the biggest reason that Sony and Microsoft need to keep up backwards compatibility. I can tell you that PS2 games played on a PS3 instead of a PS2 look a hell of a lot better. It's like night and day. Add to this the convienicen factor, and I'm pretty irritated with Sony for dropping this feature and refusing to reimplement it. There are still loads of fantastic PS2 titles I haven't played, and more are still coming out!
  
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32. Re:It would be really nice... by Talderas · 2009-08-18 08:35 · Score: 1
  
  To be honest, I don't know the time frame of when or what versions had PS2/PS1 compatability. I've heard a lot of things like the 40GB versions didn't have it while the 60 and 80GB versions did. All I know is that I bought an 80GB PS3 in a Metal Gear Solid 4 bundle and I haven't run into any problems playing PS2 or PS1 games on the PS3, aside from the graphics on PS1 games being terrible. I actually think FFXII looks better from the PS3 compared to the PS2....
  
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33. Re:It would be really nice... by greg1104 · 2009-08-18 08:36 · Score: 1
  
  First off, there is still plenty of coding involved to support PS2 titles even when one has the Emotion Engine chip present only on earlier PS3s. The chip doesn't just work on its own without associated driver software that needs to be maintained, and there's specific features like the PS2 upscaling involved too.
  And product development resources aren't just coding. The work that was going into the PS2 Support List wasn't trivial either, and in a real product every feature you advertise needs its own dedicated QA. My guess is that the QA effort here is why there hasn't been any success on the long-rumoured software-only PS2 emulation; it's just a giant support mess for Sony relative to what it's worth to them in terms of product sales.
34. Re:It would be really nice... by DigiShaman · 2009-08-18 08:39 · Score: 5, Insightful
  
  People still watch tube tvs?
  That was a dumb question. Of course they do!
  More often than not, very large tube sets are "good enough" for most people that have them. However, replacing them is such a huge PITA because of how large and heavy they are. So until it decides to die one day, there really isn't much of an incentive replace it with a flat panel.
  
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35. Re:It would be really nice... by harl · 2009-08-18 08:39 · Score: 1
  
  Amen. I had the same problem with the 360 and a tube television. The text in some games was unreadable. Dead Rising I'm looking at you.
  
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36. Re:It would be really nice... by Talderas · 2009-08-18 08:40 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  The problem exists with XBox 360 as well, Dead Rising was a PITA to read text on.
  However this is indeed an issue. I couldn't read most test for GTA4, my minimap in Dynasty Warriors 6 was fuzzy and practically useless. I had to pause to look at the largest battlefield map to get an idea of what was going on. A lot of things became a lot cleared when I went to a HDTV.
  
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37. Re:It would be really nice... by dangitman · 2009-08-18 08:48 · Score: 1
  
  Considering that PS2s are still selling (strangely) well and getting new game releases, it's unlikely Sony will restore BC (even if only software emulation) to the PS3 platform.
  
  That still doesn't make business sense. Wouldn't they want people to migrate to the PS3? A PS3 sale is worth a lot more to Sony than a PS2 sale - what with the extra profits from the Playstation Store, higher-priced games, and royalties from Blu-Ray movie sales. Besides, if that was the logic, why did the original PS3 have PS2 compatibility at launch?
  
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38. Re:It would be really nice... by mister_playboy · 2009-08-18 08:48 · Score: 1
  
  I can confirm this. The card reader won't read any card larger than 8MB at all... I've seen 16,32, and 64MB in stores.
  
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39. Re:It would be really nice... by metamatic · 2009-08-18 08:57 · Score: 1
  
  I can tell you that PS2 games played on a PS3 instead of a PS2 look a hell of a lot better. It's like night and day.
  Funny, my experience is that the PS2 signal upscaled by my TV is more pleasing than the PS3 emulation of the PS2, at least for the WipEout games, Rez, and Katamari Damacy...
  
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40. Re:It would be really nice... by Ihmhi · 2009-08-18 08:59 · Score: 1
  
  Iunno. Considering how cheap PS2s are, it'd be nice to be able to grab one if you feel like getting backwards compatability. It's not as huge of a deal to me anymore.
  
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41. Re:It would be really nice... by iamhassi · 2009-08-18 09:00 · Score: 1
  
  "If Sony restored backward compatibility with PS2 games. "
  
  I thought the same thing when I got my PS3 but realized that the PS2 is selling so cheaply used that there's really no reason I should sell it. Besides, we all know there's no such thing as "100% compatible".
  
  The only people that 100% compatible should matter to are those that don't own a PS2 already (are there any?) or if you're trying to install the PS3 in your vehicle or other area with very limited space.
  
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42. Re:It would be really nice... by mrdoogee · 2009-08-18 09:08 · Score: 1
  
  That's why I love my First Gen 60GB PS3. Full Emotion engine hardware support, 4 usb ports, and every kind of flash card reader I can think of (SD/MultiMedia Card, CompactFlash Type I/Type II, Microdrive, Memory Stick/PRO/Duo).
  I did pay a buttload for it though... the curse of the early adopter.
43. Re:It would be really nice... by iamhassi · 2009-08-18 09:09 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  "PS3 really isn't "standard def. TV friendly".... My experience with using a PS3 in standard def resolution was eye-strain inducing, trying to read many of the text fonts the games would display."
  
  I use a ps3 on a 5 yr old reasonably-sized SDTV and you couldn't be more correct. It is a HUGE pain to try to play any games with small print. PixelJunk Monsters is almost not playable because your character is too small to see, and you can forget trying to read any subtitles or instructions. I keep looking for a way to increase text size or change the screen size but it seems everything is set-up properly to display in SD, it's just the way the games display.
  
  I'll probably get a HDTV within the next year so it's not a huge deal, I really bought the ps3 to play one particular game and that works well, and lately I've been using it for Hulu and the seemingly endless supply of free game demos so I'm satisfied.
  
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44. Re:It would be really nice... by mrdoogee · 2009-08-18 09:10 · Score: 3, Informative
  
  There is a way to run a PS1 disc in your PS3 and stream it to your PSP over LAN/Internet.. .Location free player is the util, I believe. It does have (especially over the internet) some major latency issues though.
45. Re:It would be really nice... by Gizzmonic · 2009-08-18 09:16 · Score: 2, Interesting
  
  Hell yeah! I got a 36 inch Sony tube HDTV with 1080i res, HDMI, all the candy! SDTV *and* HDTV look great. The first thing people normally say when they get an HDTV is "SDTV looks horrible." Not so with my TV! However, it does weigh 220 lbs. (100 Kg) so it's not going to be fun to move.
  
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46. Re:It would be really nice... by mrdoogee · 2009-08-18 09:20 · Score: 1
  
  Cell Chip + Emotion Chip is a greater cost per unit, while the redesign was a 1 time r&d cost, I guess sony counted on the R&D costing less over the life of the console than the continued production of the multi-hardware system.
47. Re:It would be really nice... by iamhassi · 2009-08-18 09:26 · Score: 1
  
  "Penny Arcade covered this. PlayOn will give you Hulu and Netflix access on your PS3."
  
  This is what I use my PS3 for primarily, watching Hulu through PlayOn. It works incredibly well but you do need to have a fairly decent PC to stream from. PlayOn wants a 3ghz or dual core processor to stream real-time. I have a 2.6ghz Celeron Dell just for Playon and I have to let it stream a few seconds before playing. I was a bit worried about wifi not being fast enough but it's been streaming fine. I've found tons of shows I didn't even know existed, I even "cut the cord", haven't had cable TV in over a year.
  
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48. Re:It would be really nice... by dns_server · 2009-08-18 09:31 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  For you in America and Europe yes they did that but not in Australia where it was done in software.
49. Re:It would be really nice... by Hatta · 2009-08-18 09:36 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  So keep an old CRT around. They're cheap, and you need one to play Duck Hunt anyway.
  
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50. Re:It would be really nice... by Theoboley · 2009-08-18 09:53 · Score: 1
  
  Well, I concur. I Bought my 60 gig ps3 with the BC and I used it very rarely... When it crapped out (it wouldnt read any disks) I exchanged for an 80 with limited BC... That was 2 years ago. I have yet to put a ps2 title into it. Backwards compatibility is well and good.. if you don't already have a ps2.
  
  My question would be, how many people have bought a ps3 wishing for BC, when they already have a ps2?
  
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51. Re:It would be really nice... by discorob3 · 2009-08-18 10:01 · Score: 1
  
  luckily yours hasnt got the seven blinks of death yet! i got a 30 inch just like yours and its badass.... when it dies on you go here: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=928945
52. Re:It would be really nice... by Garbad+Ropedink · 2009-08-18 10:06 · Score: 1
  
  I can attest to that. I had a 62" high def tube tv. The bulbs went on the damn thing and it's mind numbingly expensive to get those things replaced. Since it was the size of an upright grand piano I'd have to rent a van just to haul it to the repair place. So I decided to cut my losses and just throw it out. Since a decent flat screen will run you around $600 it makes way way way more sense to just go with one of those models. Save some back pain anyhow.
  
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53. Re:It would be really nice... by NoobixCube · 2009-08-18 10:10 · Score: 1
  
  It's amazing how every company seems to subscribe to this philosophy. I like to call it "FTSH", "Fuck the Southern Hemisphere". Usually it's done by doubling the price, or severely limiting availability of a product, not crippling features. Although no wallet-conscious person would buy Alienware anyway, this is a valid point to make: Compare Alienware's Australian prices to the American ones. Convert them to the same currency, and the Australian site still has them at almost double the price; sometimes with less powerful hardware, even.
  
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  Admit it. You post strawman arguments as AC so you get modded Insightful for refuting them, rather than Troll
54. Re:It would be really nice... by Psx29 · 2009-08-18 10:14 · Score: 1
  
  Nevermind how the games look, there is a serious problem with input lag in converting the original 480i ti a progressive signal for a modern LCD, upscaling can also add lag (albeit not as much as i->p). This makes any games that require time-sensitive movements (in my case: DDR and shmups) difficult to play. And this is why I will likely always have a CRT around.
55. Re:It would be really nice... by Joe+Jay+Bee · 2009-08-18 10:23 · Score: 1
  
  GTA4's text was unreadable for me. Sitting 2m away from a 21" screen, unable to read the text or clearly see what the minimap had on it. I've resorted to sitting on my usual computer chair at a normal computer-using distance just to be able to play it properly. (Great game, mind.)
  
  --
  I write bullshit
56. Re:It would be really nice... by DinDaddy · 2009-08-18 10:29 · Score: 1
  
  But since there are several million PS3s out there with hardware BC, they are already doing those tasks. They haven't disabled it in the launch consoles.
57. Re:It would be really nice... by DinDaddy · 2009-08-18 10:33 · Score: 1
  
  All PS3s made everywhere play PS1 games (although regions are enforced).
  60 and 20 GB US launch models had hardware PS2 BC. European 80 GB launch model and first US 80 GB model had RSX hardware and Emotion Engine software BC. Regions were enforced.
58. Re:It would be really nice... by lewiscr · 2009-08-18 10:49 · Score: 1
  
  More often than not, very large tube sets are "good enough" for most people that have them.
  It's not so much that it's "good enough"; the CRT was better. When I purchased my CRT, it was cheaper than a 720p LCD (much less 1080p). Given the variety of resolutions that I use (Analog Over The Air, S-Video, 480p, 720p), the CRT produces a better picture at all resolutions than the 1080p LCD did. I spend most of my time watching digital cable, and the high res crisp display makes all the digital cable artifacts look even worse. All in all, I'm happy with my CRT. I have to hope that I'll have some way to make sub-standard input signals look good on the LCD when I eventually have to buy one.
  Lest you think I'm a ludditte, I ditched my vinyl in favor of digital audio years ago.
59. Re:It would be really nice... by Beardo+the+Bearded · 2009-08-18 10:58 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  Also, LCD and plasma look like hell. That's the reason I haven't replaced my CRT. At least that's the case on every single one I've ever seen, no matter what feed it's using.
  Blue-Ray feed with HDMI cables on a 240Hz LCD still has ghosting and jitter.
  Plasma is like watching a slideshow.
  
  --
  
  ---
  ECHELON is a government program to find words like bomb, jihad, plutonium, assassinate, and anarchy.
60. Re:It would be really nice... by Toonol · 2009-08-18 11:25 · Score: 1
  
  The majority do, in fact.
61. Re:It would be really nice... by geekoid · 2009-08-18 11:33 · Score: 1
  
  well, until they see a Samsung series 8 LED.
  I tried to hold the remote to the Samsung LED TV, but my boner kept knocking it out of my hand~
  
  --
  The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
62. Re:It would be really nice... by Toonol · 2009-08-18 11:41 · Score: 1
  
  I agree with the first part. The PS2 library is better than the 360's and PS3's combined. If I had to choose one console, and only one, it would be the PS2.
  
  However,
  
  For what it's worth, PS2 games look shit on big screens. The colors are very lackluster, and the video is almost as shit as the Wii.
  
  The Wii has significantly better video output than the PS2. Heck, the Gamecube was significantly better, and the Wii is a substantial bump over that. The Wii can output all games/video to 480p; the PS2 can only do that on a few select games.
63. Re:It would be really nice... by Thing+1 · 2009-08-18 11:44 · Score: 1
  
  but realistically, it's practically a requirement to enjoy many of the game titles too.
  
  Yeah, the Xbox 360 is the same; I had to buy an HDTV just so I could read the GTA4 menus without changing my glasses prescription.
  
  --
  I feel fantastic, and I'm still alive.
64. Re:It would be really nice... by Toonol · 2009-08-18 11:45 · Score: 1
  
  Besides, we all know there's no such thing as "100% compatible".
  
  The Wii begs to differ.
65. Re:It would be really nice... by Hadlock · 2009-08-18 12:09 · Score: 1
  
  I just use a ps2 emulator. on a modern computer most popular games run just fine
  
  --
  moox. for a new generation.
66. Re:It would be really nice... by DonkeySpew · 2009-08-18 12:40 · Score: 1
  
  That isn't correct either. They later removed pieces of the PS2 hardware which were emulated, but it still required some of the original chips. No version of the PS3 has ever had pure software emulation.
67. Re:It would be really nice... by aesiamun · 2009-08-18 12:46 · Score: 1
  
  Because it's a waste of a bullet to shoot a dead horse :)
68. Re:It would be really nice... by bakes · 2009-08-18 12:51 · Score: 1
  
  Just seems like they are shooting themselves in the foot by not offering backwards compatibility with the PS2. The PS2 has a huge library and dominated the console market for its generation.
  I saw the headline and my first thought was "Yay, time to get a PS3", remembering that I had read previously that (most) PS2 games could be played on the PS3.
  Now I'm reading that the newer PS3's do NOT, in fact, play PS2 games. I don't have a huge collection, but there are plenty of games I want to continue to play without having to buy them again (if they are even available in PS3 format).
  You just lost a sale there, Sony. I'll hang on to my PS2 thanks.
  
  --
  Ho! Haha! Guard! Turn! Parry! Dodge! Spin! Ha! Thrust!
69. Re:It would be really nice... by CronoCloud · 2009-08-18 13:34 · Score: 1
  
  It costs money to ship/support things to an English speaking PAL country in the middle of nowhere, far far away from the other English speaking, PAL using country.
70. Re:It would be really nice... by mgblst · 2009-08-18 13:36 · Score: 1
  
  Why not, they make most of there money on the games, not on the hardware. Surely this would make them sell more games?
71. Re:It would be really nice... by CronoCloud · 2009-08-18 13:38 · Score: 1
  
  Remote play works just fine with actual PS1 discs too, done it myself quite a few times.
72. Re:It would be really nice... by NoobixCube · 2009-08-18 13:45 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  Not enough to justify getting games up to 18 months after their release date, or paying $120 for a new game when the US$ price is about $60 and the exchange rate is up at roughly 80c. At least TV and movie producers have wised up. There was an article here a few years back saying how much of global piracy happened just in Australia, just because we got TV series and movies so late.
  
  --
  Admit it. You post strawman arguments as AC so you get modded Insightful for refuting them, rather than Troll
73. Re:It would be really nice... by greg1104 · 2009-08-18 13:45 · Score: 1
  
  The QA tasks they're only doing on the old hardware, and they don't have to re-run those again every time they change something that only impacts newer models. If a new model they might still be issuing updates to shipped with the backward compatibility feature, they'd have to add the whole PS2 testing back into to their QA matrix again. And they'd have to plan for an uptick in the support cases related to that feature too. I find it hard to imagine why Sony would go through all that just to pick up the small incremental market share that comes from people who want backward compatibility but didn't buy a model that had it back when they were available.
  The usual excuse I hear from people in that category for why they didn't buy one of those is "they were too expensive", which also does not bode well for how much revenue Sony can expect from those customers anyway. They satisfied the big spenders and early adopters already, and it's unrealistic to think the remaining market is worth much very much to them. The costs of serving that market would need to be very tiny for it to make sense, and product costs in software aren't just based on manufacturing and development costs.
74. Re:It would be really nice... by walshy007 · 2009-08-18 14:05 · Score: 1
  
  Something to look into if you love analog, high end analog projectors, you can get ones that do 3000x2000 + resolution, and your screen then becomes your wall. Plus a quality one will last you fifteen plus years before you have to replace the tubes.
75. Re:It would be really nice... by arth1 · 2009-08-18 14:27 · Score: 1
  
  Not only that, but newer models also lack the card slot, and can't play SACD music CDs like earlier models can. Sony has consistently dumbed down the PS3, and each model becomes a little less feature rich than the predecessor.
  This feature reduction in newer models seems to be a common theme with Sony. Other examples include Walkman phones who had the memory reduced and the card slot removed, and the Sony Reader, which you no longer can get with a backlight.
  With other manufacturers, you expect that the newer models will offer something more, but with Sony, expect less.
  Street price for a used 60 GB PS3 with the PS2 chip, memory slot and SACD compatibility is far higher than the new crippled ones. Because they are better.
76. Re:It would be really nice... by Doctor_Jest · 2009-08-18 14:38 · Score: 1
  
  You could pick up a slim PS3 and slim PS2 and you're set for $400. I have a slim hooked to my old tube TV, because contrary to popular opinion, most PS2 games look like hammered ass on my 46" HDTV (even with my PS3.)
  
  Still, this price cut is a good thing... FINALLY people can stop bitching about how expensive a PS3 is... considering the new "Elite" 360 doesn't come with a friggin HDMI cable (now that it's only $300 and even though the MS pack-in cable blew dead bears), we can stop with the "whaah, sony doesn't include HDMI cables... whaah." :) Or at least I hope we can. :) I'm sure there is something else for the fanbois to bitch about.
  
  --
  It's the Stay-Puft Marshmallow Man.
77. Re:It would be really nice... by nacturation · 2009-08-18 14:47 · Score: 1
  
  I have the original 60GB PS3. Do you know if they completely dropped support for PS3s with the Emotion chip (switching it to software emulation only) or do they still support hardware emulation for PS3s that have it?
  
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78. Re:It would be really nice... by TSPhoenix · 2009-08-18 14:48 · Score: 1
  
  They are cheap, but they take up lots of room, which for some is fairly scarce. I certainly have nowhere to put one.
79. Re:It would be really nice... by Narishma · 2009-08-18 14:56 · Score: 1
  
  So if you already have a PS2 why would you care if the PS3 plays PS2 games? Can't you just play them on the PS2?
  
  --
  Mada mada dane.
80. Re:It would be really nice... by Narishma · 2009-08-18 15:04 · Score: 1
  
  That's because the Wii is basically an overclocked Gamecube.
  
  --
  Mada mada dane.
81. Re:It would be really nice... by bakes · 2009-08-18 15:32 · Score: 1
  
  Yes I could, but my wife doesn't want the lounge room cluttered with redundant electronic devices and the associated cables.
  
  --
  Ho! Haha! Guard! Turn! Parry! Dodge! Spin! Ha! Thrust!
82. Re:It would be really nice... by smash · 2009-08-18 15:33 · Score: 1
  
  Backwards compat is over-rated. It was a selling point for the PS2. I have a PS2, and also have a PS1. I have a library of over 40 genuine PS1 games. Know how often i've used the backwards compat in the past 9 years? About 3 times. And i have an old PS1 in the closet that I can use if i get desperate anyway (ditto for PS2 when i upgrade to a PS3). And even if i didn't i could pick up a PS2 for about 20-50 bucks these days anyway...
  
  --
  I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
83. Re:It would be really nice... by TuaAmin13 · 2009-08-18 15:51 · Score: 1
  
  For you in America and Europe yes they did that but not in Australia where it was done in software.
  Not true. The EU 60GB model and US 80GB (with 4 usb ports) still had PS2 GPUs installed. the PS2 CPU was emulated, which is why it only has ~85% compatibility. The US 20/60GB models had a full PS2 inside.
  
  The current lineup of PS3s do not have any PS2 parts, which is why I don't think we'll see a return of PS2 compatibility this generation.
84. Re:It would be really nice... by TuaAmin13 · 2009-08-18 15:53 · Score: 1
  
  They didn't remove functionality, if that's what you're asking. So long as your hardware supports PS2 games, you can play them.
85. Re:It would be really nice... by DigiShaman · 2009-08-18 16:28 · Score: 1
  
  I agree with you on the LCDs, but not plasmas. I'm not sure what generation of sets you were looking at, but my 42in" Panasonic Plasma (TH-42PZ85U) has superior contrast ratio and color depth to any LCD (duh) and CRTs (interesting) I've seen.
  I've looked at the Samsung LED's at my local BestBuy. I would take one of those over an LCD hands down. But I still think the Plasma is better still. Once OLED screens come down in price, watch out! That technology will become the new benchmark.
  
  --
  Life is not for the lazy.
86. Re:It would be really nice... by Lemmy+Caution · 2009-08-18 16:47 · Score: 1
  
  I think that the cost of adding full hardware-based compatibility to a PS3 would be about the same as getting a separate PS2 - about $100. Which would make the PS3 $100 less attractive to the majority of would-be buyers who already have a PS2.
  They've just hit the price point and specs that I've been waiting for. I'm getting one.
87. Re:It would be really nice... by Lemmy+Caution · 2009-08-18 16:53 · Score: 1
  
  Adding that compatibility costs money (software compatibility was a bit of a dissapointment; hardware compatibility is spendy, makes the console bigger, etc.) The primary objections of the market were on price, not features. The PS3 at launch was, what, $500? $600 for the deluxe model?
  I used to want PS2 compatibility, until I realized that a new, slim PS2 cost under a hundred bucks. I already have a PS2, so if Sony's going to discount the PS3 after getting rid of compatibility, I'm for it.
88. Re:It would be really nice... by nacturation · 2009-08-18 16:54 · Score: 1
  
  Right... I was thinking that they might have cut the code that supports the Emotion chip from later PS3 updates as that might save them from having to maintain separate code branches depending on specific PS3 model.
  
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89. Re:It would be really nice... by mrchaotica · 2009-08-18 17:33 · Score: 1
  
  So? It works!
  
  --
  "[Regarding the 'cloud,'] ownership was what made America different than Russia." -- Woz
90. Re:It would be really nice... by dakameleon · 2009-08-18 18:07 · Score: 1
  
  That isn't correct either. They later removed pieces of the PS2 hardware which were emulated, but it still required some of the original chips. No version of the PS3 has ever had pure software emulation.
  Neither is that - Japan & America had the hardware emulation at launch, PAL territories (EU/AU) had software. This was later replaced too, along with dropping the flash card readers. See the wikipedia table of models to see how frequently Sony have changed their minds (presumably in the hunt for cost cutting).
  
  --
  Man who leaps off cliff jumps to conclusion.
91. Re:It would be really nice... by Blue_Wombat · 2009-08-18 18:24 · Score: 1
  
  Apart from which, many probably do what I do. When the new TV is purchased, the old tube one (especially if it was a good one) becomes the second TV in the spare room, games room, bedroom or whatever. This is probably then the TV to which the kids are banished with their console, while the good one is used by the parents as an actual TV in the living room. No need to pension off a good large tube set that still goes, if you have the room to redeploy it.
92. Re:It would be really nice... by muckracer · 2009-08-18 21:14 · Score: 1
  
  Getting rid of that farking region code would be terribly nice too. As far as I am concerned, publishers of games etc. should be grateful if people still buy their stuff at all, instead of worrying of where they purchase from.
93. Re:It would be really nice... by muckracer · 2009-08-18 21:21 · Score: 1
  
  > My experience with using a PS3 in standard def resolution was eye-strain
  > inducing, trying to read many of the text fonts the games would display.
  Agreed. Have...ironically, a Sony Trinitron tube-TV and any kind of written
  text in PS3-games is so small you can hardly read it standing within arm's
  reach of the TV. Very annoying.
94. Re:It would be really nice... by ookaze · 2009-08-18 21:54 · Score: 1
  
  For you in America and Europe yes they did that but not in Australia where it was done in software.
  That's not true.
  No PS3 emulates the PS2 entirely.
  The US PS3 had all the PS2 hardware and emulated nothing.
  In both Australia and Europe, the PS3 emulated most of the PS2 in software, except one chip, I think that's the Emotion Engine.
  That's why I can play Shadow of the Colossus on my PS3 without any slowdown compared to the PS2, for example.
95. Re:It would be really nice... by TuaAmin13 · 2009-08-18 22:44 · Score: 1
  
  Honestly I don't think they've improved the Emotion Engine emulation at all. I haven't seen "Improves playback of certain PS2 software" as a fix in a long time
96. Re:It would be really nice... by TheRaven64 · 2009-08-18 23:32 · Score: 1
  
  Especially things made in China, which is so much further away from Australia than Europe!
  
  --
  I am TheRaven on Soylent News
97. Re:It would be really nice... by ookaze · 2009-08-18 23:34 · Score: 1
  
  Next gen games are quite simply unplayable on anything less than 720p.
  However, the big problem here is that Last gen games are unplayable at anything above 576p!
  OK, you have a crystal ball and all. Now what about current gen games?
  Joke aside, last gen games are not at all unplayable at anything above 576p.
  Saying that they are unplayable in this case is not just a slight exaggeration, it's a blatant lie.
  
  OK slight exaggeration, but old games do look awful on a HD TV.
  No they don't. Some HDTV are awful at displaying SD content, like most LCD based TV.
  You put the blame on the last gen games (and consoles) when clearly the problem is with the TV. I have a 55" 1080p HDTV and I bought it specially for my Wii, and every single games (specially the Gamecube games) looked better on this HDTV than on my old 52" CRT.
  Besides, the look of the game has nothing to do with it being playable or not.
  Except perhaps if people equate games with FPS only, and even then, they were playable on SDTV which have less precise image.
  It's funny because it's always the people with such high standards regarding content on their TV (so much that games become unplayable to them because they look awful) that manage to not buy the best equipment (HDTV with actually good logic able to display SD content at least as well as a SDTV) and complain about it (people into HC usually know that their TV is the problem and don't complain about the content being the problem).
  
  And therein lies the biggest reason that Sony and Microsoft need to keep up backwards compatibility. I can tell you that PS2 games played on a PS3 instead of a PS2 look a hell of a lot better.
  LOL, are you kidding?
  You just proved that your HDTV is the problem: the PS3 is doing the exact same thing with the PS2 output that your HDTV should be doing. The PS3 just does it better than your TV, which must have very crappy logic for upscaling SD content.
  In my case, the HDTV and the PS3 are doing as good a job as each other.
  But the PS2 games are actually the games that look the worst among all my games, as they're the only ones where the aliasing is visible even with the PS3 or my TV upscaling logic.
  Of course, that still don't make them unplayable.
  This has no incidence on why Sony and MS need to keep up BC.
  People just don't care: lots of these machines are hooked up to SDTV or through composite cables anyway.
  
  It's like night and day. Add to this the convienicen factor, and I'm pretty irritated with Sony for dropping this feature and refusing to reimplement it. There are still loads of fantastic PS2 titles I haven't played, and more are still coming out!
  See?
  The content is not the problem: you still want to play the PS2 games despite them being in SD and you having a HDTV.
98. Re:It would be really nice... by ookaze · 2009-08-18 23:41 · Score: 1
  
  Also, LCD and plasma look like hell. That's the reason I haven't replaced my CRT. At least that's the case on every single one I've ever seen, no matter what feed it's using.
  Blue-Ray feed with HDMI cables on a 240Hz LCD still has ghosting and jitter.
  Plasma is like watching a slideshow.
  Seems like you missed the last 3 years in HDTV development.
  I agree with LCD, as this technology is the more widespread because it's cheaper under certain sizes, but it's also the worst for displaying any SD content.
  But plasmas actually display SD content better than SDTV. The only problems is that the ones that do are very expensive and only available above a certain size.
  I'm thinking of some of the Pioneer Kuro line of HDTV.
  The higher number of Hz in a HDTV specs doesn't make it better at all, quite the contrary. Usually, people into HC disable all these useless features that break the video quality.
99. Re:It would be really nice... by TheRaven64 · 2009-08-19 00:23 · Score: 1
  
  How are two devices which do different things redundant?
  
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  I am TheRaven on Soylent News
100. Re:It would be really nice... by billcopc · 2009-08-19 00:33 · Score: 1
  
  Enough gamers are pissed off over the current BC fiasco, and you're suggesting they do it all over again for the PS4 ? SURE! If Sony wants to be the next Nintendo (pre-Wii, that is). Watch the user base decrease with each successive generation as they charge more money for less functionality.
  Backware compatibility is a huge driver for a significant chunk of the market. Rarely do I ever see a craigslist ad for a PS2 that doesn't include a stack of PS1 classics, or a Wii without a pile of GameCube hits. Quite a few of my gamer pals have several dozen games from each generation, representing thousands of dollars in investment, that they still play to this day. Great games are timeless, and I have to say that quite often, the new releases are shit, compared to the old ones.
  The problem, of course, is that console hardware is often cheap and unreliable. Maybe the CD/DVD reader goes blind, or the memory cards wear out, controllers break... but the software survives! Having a modern console with backward compatibility is a way to breathe new life into those old game discs. On a different angle, what if someone skipped a generation but wants to catch up ? For example, I passed on the PS3, but if/when the PS4 is out, I might want to try some PS3 hits that I've missed... if the software is compatible, great I'll buy the disc. If not, I will pass and Sony loses that sale - a highly profitable software sale - all because they're too cheap to include one silly little retro first-party CPU. That is just weak.
  Even major PC game houses have been re-releasing part of their back catalogue via emulators such as DosBox, enabling people to play 20-year-old games on almost any PC built in the last decade. It should be obvious to anyone that old games are a thing of nostalgia, that people are willing to pay for.
  
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101. Re:It would be really nice... by Tetsugaku-San · 2009-08-19 01:54 · Score: 1
  
  That's not even slightly true, I have a UK 60GB PS3, which has all of the PS2 hardware in it.
  
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102. Re:It would be really nice... by chrysrobyn · 2009-08-19 01:59 · Score: 1
  
  People still watch tube tvs?
  I do. Went looking for my "next" TV in 2002 and found HDTV standards still in flux, so I went and bought the best CRT TV I could find, a 32" Sony Trinitron for $650. I can't say I'm perfectly happy with it, but I am certainly happy enough with it not to cough up $500-$1500 for its replacement. It plays PS2 and Wii games perfectly well, and there are no difficulties playing DVDs or videos transcoded on the AppleTV (in 480i). There's no blacker blacks, no fake resolution blurring and it doesn't tip over or break when my son throws something at it.
  I imagine this beast has a lot of life left. I can't imagine "needing" to upgrade until my kids are old enough to be gentle (youngest is 3), or a HD Wii successor comes out. My mother-in-law keeps asking when we're going to upgrade to the "HDTV generation" and what we're going to do with our old set when we do, so if it still works when we replace it, that tube is going to keep getting used for a long time.
103. Re:It would be really nice... by zerocool^ · 2009-08-19 02:29 · Score: 1
  
  I own a slim PS2 and a PS3.
  The ps2 is in a cardboard box, even though I still want to play games on it occasionally (the dragonquest VIII game that I never finished). There are two major reasons it's not plugged in right now.
  1.) No HDMI. I'm sick of extra cables. I don't want to do the optical + svideo thing.
  2.) No wireless controllers. The PS3 controller was kinda weird for the first 2 hours I owned the PS3 - after I was done, I was used to winding up the cable and putting the controller up by the console. Then, I got used to it, and now, I'm convinced that the PS3 controller is the greatest thing since sliced bread.
  I recently bought a house, and my living room is about 15 feet across. I can't imagine stringing a controller cable across the room like that, with an extension cable and everything. Ugh.
  In short, the PS3 functions as my dvd and blu ray player, my media center (with TVersity), and my console for gaming. It is a utility box; it sits in the entertainment center, and I interact with it remotely, wirelessly, except when changing discs. The PS2 honestly at this point feels like an NES - you plug it in, then it sits on the floor in front of the TV and there are cables everywhere.
  I really wish they'd release PS2 compatibility via PSN. Even if it was like $30 from the store, I'd buy it.
  ~X
  
  --
  sig?
104. Re:It would be really nice... by pnewhook · 2009-08-19 02:49 · Score: 1
  
  I had a 62" high def tube tv. The bulbs went on the damn thing
  
  Theres no such thing as a 62" tube tv, and tube tvs dont have 'bulbs'
  
  --
  Tesla was a genius. Edison however was a overrated hack who liked to torture puppies.
105. Re:It would be really nice... by pnewhook · 2009-08-19 02:55 · Score: 1
  
  The higher number of Hz in a HDTV specs doesn't make it better at all, quite the contrary. Usually, people into HC disable all these useless features that break the video quality.
  No. 120Hz is used because 60, 30 and 24Hz all divide evenly into it so you dont get frame jittering. And a good system will interpolate between frames to smooth things out. The difference in a side by side comparison is quite clear.
  
  --
  Tesla was a genius. Edison however was a overrated hack who liked to torture puppies.
106. Re:It would be really nice... by SenseiLeNoir · 2009-08-19 02:55 · Score: 1
  
  The problem is your wife then...
  My wife is *more* than happy for me to splash out on a PS2 to go with my PS3, so she can play some ps2 games that she has, heck she will even get a Wii, and make space for it.
  I was not too keen on the PS2 (multiple units, etc), and she came up with the point, that the PS2 can also play DVDs (leaving the ps3 for games /blu ray)
  clever girl.
  
  --
  Have a nice day!
107. Re:It would be really nice... by mrdoogee · 2009-08-19 03:18 · Score: 1
  
  As have I. I've played Chrono Trigger from the PSX re-issue disc (Final Fantasy Chronicles was the compilation name I think) on my PSP in my bedroom with my PS3 running downstairs.
  Like I said, the latency over WLAN was tolerable but noticeable.
  And thanks to AC for the correct name.
108. Re:It would be really nice... by Chris+Mattern · 2009-08-19 03:23 · Score: 1
  
  No, it doesn't. The 60 GB PAL PS3s (model numbers CECHCxx) did not have the Emotion Engine hardware installed and use software emulation.
109. Re:It would be really nice... by SenseiLeNoir · 2009-08-19 03:54 · Score: 1
  
  Plus, having backward compatibility increased power usage, and heat, as well as possibily more things to go wrong. the newer consoles were more quiet, used less power, and apparently more robust
  
  --
  Have a nice day!
110. Re:It would be really nice... by Beardo+the+Bearded · 2009-08-19 04:14 · Score: 1
  
  Also, LCD and plasma look like hell. That's the reason I haven't replaced my CRT. At least that's the case on every single one I've ever seen, no matter what feed it's using.
  Blue-Ray feed with HDMI cables on a 240Hz LCD still has ghosting and jitter.
  Plasma is like watching a slideshow.
  Seems like you missed the last 3 years in HDTV development.
  In all fairness, I only know what I saw two weeks ago at the store.
  
  --
  
  ---
  ECHELON is a government program to find words like bomb, jihad, plutonium, assassinate, and anarchy.
111. Re:It would be really nice... by Just+Some+Guy · 2009-08-19 04:21 · Score: 1
  
  People still watch tube tvs?
  I've got a Sony Wega that has a brighter, sharper image than any TV I've seen since. It's not HD, true, but it still looks beautiful. Throw on an anamorphic DVD and put the TV into the mode where it compresses the same number of scan lines into a smaller vertical patch on the screen and there's nothing better. Why would I want to downgrade?
  
  --
  Dewey, what part of this looks like authorities should be involved?
112. Re:It would be really nice... by nacturation · 2009-08-19 05:12 · Score: 1
  
  Me neither. I'm hoping I don't see one that says "Discontinued support for Emotion Engine to ensure consistency between all PS3 devices".
  
  --
  Want to improve your Karma? Instead of "Post Anonymously", try the "Post Humously" option.
113. Re:It would be really nice... by Garbad+Ropedink · 2009-08-19 05:33 · Score: 1
  
  Oh wait. It was a rear projection tv. :/
  
  --
  And that was the last Terry Fox run I ever participated in.
114. Re:It would be really nice... by Megane · 2009-08-19 06:36 · Score: 1
  
  More specifically, CECHA and CECHB have the full chipset, with CECHC and CECHE having only the GS chip with software emulation.
  The most interesting thing about that link are the words "Third party operating system support removed." WTF? With all the Slim rumors flying, this is the first I've heard about that.
  
  --
  #naabhaprzrag, #sverubfr-000, #agi-fcbafberq, negvpyr[pynff*=' negvpyr-ary-'] { qvfcynl: abar !vzcbegnag; }
115. Re:It would be really nice... by Megane · 2009-08-19 06:46 · Score: 1
  
  I'll stick with the PS2 fat. Not only are there tons of cheap games, with a boot card you can load your games to a HD and jukebox it. Plus, it saves wear and tear on the optical drive, and it's faster rip games to the HD with WinHIIP on a PC anyhow.
  
  --
  #naabhaprzrag, #sverubfr-000, #agi-fcbafberq, negvpyr[pynff*=' negvpyr-ary-'] { qvfcynl: abar !vzcbegnag; }
116. Re:It would be really nice... by Megane · 2009-08-19 06:47 · Score: 1
  
  All three of them? Including Lair?
  
  --
  #naabhaprzrag, #sverubfr-000, #agi-fcbafberq, negvpyr[pynff*=' negvpyr-ary-'] { qvfcynl: abar !vzcbegnag; }
117. Re:It would be really nice... by hazydave · 2009-08-19 07:01 · Score: 1
  
  I got one of the last models that supported PS2 -- the software emulation console, still around in the Spring of 2008. My main concern, though, was the ports: specifically, four USB ports (versus the default two) and the flash card ports. For a games console, maybe no big deal, but for a video player, flash memory is increasingly important... many new BD players support this.
  There are probably good reasons for Sony's consolidation of features, though. They launched the PS3 in the day when most BD players ran $700-$1000, so it wasn't simply the best BD player, but among the cheapest. They made a more expensive console than the competition, in order to jump-start BD and win the market versus HD-DVD. This was a magic trick... all HD-DVD players were subsidized by Toshiba... they were selling at or below cost. That's why no one else every made their own HD-DVD player (the closest were a few very expensive dual-function BD/HD-DVD players). Toshiba launched HD-DVD just like a video game -- they would make it up on disc sale royalties, but the kept everyone else out of the market.
  In order to win, Sony had to keep BD an functionally, not just technically, open platform... anyone should be able to play in the hardware contest. So they had to follow the same economics as everyone else with dedicated players. But the PS3 lives in the land of subsidized hardware, and in fact, was too expensive in 2006-2007 for life as a succcessful gaming console, much less the problems with blue laser supply (which actually kept Sony out of the dedicated BD player for awhile... they had to use the lasers they had for the PS3). So they very much risked the gaming market... a big deal, as that was once over 40% of Sony's income.
  But today, you can't really fault Sony for making choices that enhance the PS3 as a game console. Sure, it'll still play BDs, and it's starting to be the case, with console games, that the 50GB storage of a BD is an advantage over the 8.5GB storage in a single DVD, for modern games releases. They don't have to make the PS3 any better as a BD player, you can get one for $100 at Best Buy if you just want to watch BDs. I think, at this point, there is a critical mass of PS3 games on the market. PS2 game compatibility is largely of interest to existing PS2 owners, and they already have a PS2. Charging more for PS2 compatibility doesn't sell many more PS3s now, and it certainly doesn't sell more PS3 games, which is critical to the PS3's longterm success.
  
  --
  -Dave Haynie
118. Re:It would be really nice... by hazydave · 2009-08-19 07:27 · Score: 1
  
  Early LCDs looked much like LCD monitors still often do... grey rather than black, relatively dim whites, etc. But there has been furious work on LCD. Most of the current LCD TVs (which are often called "LED" by their makers, confusing people relative to OLED... OLED TVs cost $2500+ and are not large-screen yet, most are under 20" (Samsung and a few others have show larger prototypes... but if you buy a "Samsung LED" TV today, you're buying an LCD TV with zone-variable LED backlight), and there are only a handful actually shipping) use zone-dynamic LED backlighting, so it's actually a composite of LED and LCD, allowing decent blacks, bright highlights, and contrast at least as good as the CRT typical 10,000-15,000:1. The other big advantage -- LCDs, particularly with LED backlights, use dramatically less power. If you're a TV addict, you might factor in the savings. I did the math when I swapped out two 19" CRT monitors for two 24" LCD monitors, and found I'd pay for the monitors, based on my usual work day, in less than three years.
  Plasmas pretty always rivaled CRTs in quality, as they're essentially just digital CRTs. They use the same kind of phosphors as used on CRTs, and while they do have an issue with delivering really black blacks, they also don't have to count on the persistance of the phosphors over long persiods of time. The big problems with Plasma: they such power like no tomorrow, and they don't really remove the issues with CRTs relative to burn-in... phosphor is phosphor. Only, a plasma can burn it harder than a CRT.
  Nearly three years ago, I had to decide on a large TV, and settled on DLP. I had no use for flat screen, and while DLP uses a projector bulb, it's still lower power than a 3-CRT projection TV, and dramatically less weight. They were also the first to bring in high-level color (mine is a 5-color model from Samsung, Mitsubishi was delivering 6-color models that same year, though they had a few issues that led me to judge Samsung superior) and 120Hz video. Based on extensive comparisons, using Blu-Ray discs and a nice viewing room at Tweeter's, I found the top DLPs, Plasmas (Pioneer elite) and Sony LCoS to be a dead heat -- limited by the quality of the video, actually. Having been into HD for six years at that point (this was my second HDTV), working in digital video both as a hobby and professionally, I knew all the places to look.
  People still more or less want the plasmas to be better, since they still cost more. I don't let cost influence by viewing decisions, and I'm not a fan of plasma, far less than a few years ago. It just doesn't deliver the black-blacks that DLP and modern LCD can, much less the spectacular display you'll see on the few OLED displays in existance. The logical followon to plasma, FED/SED (a much better way of building a digital phosphor TV) has been caught up in some amalgam of tech and legal problems. So a few companies are trying to keep plasma going, and hey... it's not bad. But if you're previewing one, get a really good dark scene going ... the "lava" battle in Star Wars 3 on BD is a good one. See if you get dark on dark definition, compare this to modern LCDs and (if you don't need flat panel) DLPs. You'll probably think less of plasma if you test it properly.
  
  --
  -Dave Haynie
119. Re:It would be really nice... by tom17 · 2009-08-19 09:21 · Score: 1
  
  Also, I am saving a couple of old TVs for when my 5 month old is old enough to take stuff apart. If we don't keep the last few TVs of today, our children will never know and understand cathode ray tubes. This bothers me. Tom...
120. Re:It would be really nice... by dangitman · 2009-08-19 10:17 · Score: 1
  
  Well, I have a PS2 (and a PS3 without backward compatibility) and the PS2 is gathering dust, despite the fact that I'd quite like to play games on it sometimes. The reason is that it's a hassle having another unit to plug into the TV, and it's difficult to go back to being tethered to the console with wires, after getting used to the luxury of wireless controllers. I'd like to be able to use my wireless controllers with my PS2 games, and also use the handy hard drive storage and backup facilities of the PS3 to replace those puny and inconvenient memory cards.
  
  --
  ... and then they built the supercollider.
121. Re:It would be really nice... by dangitman · 2009-08-19 10:53 · Score: 1
  
  In all fairness, I only know what I saw two weeks ago at the store.
  There's your problem. You won't get any kind of accurate impression based on floor models in your typical retailer. Their sets aren't properly calibrated, lighting conditions are usually poor, and the video source driving them is often sub-par. You need to go to a decent screening room, or to someone's home who has one set up and calibrated properly, to see what they really look like.
  
  --
  ... and then they built the supercollider.
122. Re:It would be really nice... by k8to · 2009-08-20 01:09 · Score: 1
  
  I see ps2 slims on sale for 70. If you pull out:
  - shipping
  - packaging
  - power supply
  - optical drive
  - overhead
  from the sale, I can't believe it would cost more than 40$.
  But sure, 300 is the top end of the useful price range for the ps3 right now. 340 wouldn't cut it. 300 is still more than I want to spend on a system. I'm just not that enthused about games these days, so something that goes out of style in a few years is meh.
  
  --
  -josh
123. Re:It would be really nice... by bickle · 2009-08-20 04:34 · Score: 1
  
  "First off, there is still plenty of coding involved to support PS2 titles even when one has the Emotion Engine chip present only on earlier PS3s. The chip doesn't just work on its own without associated driver software that needs to be maintained, and there's specific features like the PS2 upscaling involved too."
  Of course there was plenty of coding. But that doesn't mean it's a continuing cost. The hardware BC coding was done, it's not like it had to be reworked over and over (unlike with software emulation having to tweak for individual games)
124. Re:It would be really nice... by TrekkieGod · 2009-08-23 05:51 · Score: 1
  
  Considering that PS2s are still selling (strangely) well and getting new game releases, it's unlikely Sony will restore BC (even if only software emulation) to the PS3 platform.
  I've heard that argument before, but I don't get it. If everyone who were going to buy a PS2 decided to get a PS3 instead, I figure Sony would be ecstatic. I would think that they would much rather sell PS3's than PS2's, so they can compete with the current generation of consoles. After all isn't that the point of introducing backwards compatibility? They made the PS2 able to play PS1 games so that people who were interested or already had a large PS1 game library would buy PS2s. They made the PS3 (initially) compatible with the PS2 for the same reason so that people would buy PS3's.
  The only reason to not have BC is the exactly the opposite. If the PS2 was not selling well, and no new games were coming out, and there was no interest in it at all, then they shouldn't include it because it would increase the cost to produce the PS3 for no reason.
  
  --
  Warning: Opinions known to be heavily biased.
125. Re:It would be really nice... by Bat+Country · 2009-08-23 05:59 · Score: 1
  
  This new PS3 may be the first one they make a profit on the hardware with.
  Whereas the PS2 process is streamlined enough that it seems that they're able to profit on each PS2 sold.
  The PS2 is a more credible competitor for the Wii than the PS3, as the PS3 and Wii are not even close to in the same class of console. Wii has no non-streaming media support, no HD output (not even 480p), no digital audio and minimal internal storage. This puts it much closer to the same class of product as the PS2, which, although it plays DVDs, has optical digital audio output, also does not come with any substantial storage and outputs in standard def (though some games support 480p.)
  If Sony is selling PS2s (and they are in large numbers), they are profitable, compare favorably in market price to the Nintendo Wii and developers are still producing games for the PS2 (they are,) there is no reason why Sony should cut the PS2.
  The idea that the PS2 is cutting into potential PS3 sales is somewhat ludicrous when one realizes that the people buying PS2s are largely doing it for economic reasons - it's $300 cheaper and the games run around half to one quarter the cost. If the people who would have bought a PS2 were buying a PS3 instead, they'd spend far less money on software and accessories, thereby essentially making Sony less profit than if they'd bought the more expensive console.
  
  --
  The land shall stone them with the bread of his son.
126. Re:It would be really nice... by Cowclops · 2009-08-23 06:07 · Score: 1
  
  He probably meant 62" CRT rear projection. The definitely don't have bulbs in the sense of light bulbs, but it does have the tubes themselves that create the image. This is probably what died.
127. Re:It would be really nice... by Anonymous+McCartneyf · 2009-08-27 10:44 · Score: 1
  
  Ah. I was wondering how Sony had managed to make the PS3 affordable. When the first editions were selling for a loss at $600, I was surprised to hear about the price cut and slim-lining, But now that I know what they're slim-lining out, I understand better...
  Just as long as it still plays all the PS3 games, I'm not worried.
  
  --
  There is a fine line between recklessness and courage... -- Paul McCartney
No Linux Support? by alphan · 2009-08-18 06:48 · Score: 4, Informative

"Removal of 'Install Other OS' feature
The new PS3 system will focus on delivering games and other entertainment content, and users will not be able to install other Operating Systems to the new PS3 system."
http://www.scee.presscentre.com/Content/Detail.asp?ReleaseID=4842&NewsAreaID=2
Sony abandoning Linux on new skus means they are effectively doing the same for the old ones.
Epic failure.
1. Re:No Linux Support? by ivan256 · 2009-08-18 06:52 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  Sony abandoning Linux on new skus means they are effectively doing the same for the old ones.
  Explain.
  To me it says "we used slightly different controllers and peripherals, and don't feel like investing the time to port the drivers and such to a new linux kit".
  I didn't see the bit where they said they were making it stop working on my existing device.
2. Re:No Linux Support? by alphan · 2009-08-18 06:56 · Score: 1
  
  It will continue to work, but now that it's officially a dead product there is little point in investing in it.
3. Re:No Linux Support? by CannonballHead · 2009-08-18 06:58 · Score: 1, Funny
  
  Couldn't you have waited for someone to say "but does it run Linux?" before posting? ;)
  Seriously, though, that's rather annoying. I wonder why.
4. Re:No Linux Support? by Microlith · 2009-08-18 06:58 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  They'll make it stop working on your existing device by simply removing the option to install when the update comes down the pipe. I doubt there's any real technical reason for dropping it, other than some beancounter deciding that the loss of respect from technical users was less costly than the upkeep for the hypervisor (assuming they remove it.)
  Assuming they don't, you'll be able to keep what you have on there, but not reinstall or do a new install. Which is a huge amount of ass considering how much work was done by the open source community to port things to the PS3 including kernel patches and various GCC ports and additions for the SPUs. All of that is now wasted, even on older consoles unless you never, ever let them contact PSN.
5. Re:No Linux Support? by dunezone · 2009-08-18 06:59 · Score: 1, Troll
  
  They lost my purchase.
  
  This morning as I started to see news feeds coming in that the price was being dropped to $300, a reasonable price for somethign that primarily would be used a blu-ray player. I was willing to purchase since there were some other areas I could explore in the system, including installing outside operating systems. The fact that this was something I could do with the system and now the fact that Sony can retroactively remove it, is not worth my time or my money.
6. Re:No Linux Support? by Turken · 2009-08-18 07:00 · Score: 5, Insightful
  
  I would assume that the loss of Linux support is likely due to not bothering to accommodate for the large changes in hardware under the hood. If their research shows that not enough people are using a feature make it worth developing and supporting, why should they waste resources on that feature? Of course, by that logic, then Home should have dies a long time ago too...
  At any rate, it shouldn't take too long for unofficial workarounds to show up.
7. Re:No Linux Support? by hattig · 2009-08-18 07:00 · Score: 2, Interesting
  
  The internal design architecture of the new PS3 system, from the main semiconductors and power supply unit to the cooling mechanism, has been completely redesigned, achieving a much slimmer and lighter body. Compared to the very first PS3 model with 60GB HDD, the internal volume as well as its thickness and weight are trimmed down to approximately two-thirds. Furthermore, power consumption is also cut to two-thirds, helping to reduce fan noise.
  So: Still has internal PSU (my major worry), but isn't as great a size reducation as say the shrink from the PS2 to the PS2 Slim. Sounds like more chips are 45nm than before. Obviously there was a circuit board redesign. One major fail is not having a USB port on the back for PlayTV.
  Even quieter fan noise will be a nice feature for movie watchers, not that it is a major issue now.
  And the price is very competitive with the 360. Price drop here coming soon I presume! Otherwise there's even less reason to get a 360 compared to the PS3, especially if you don't have wired ethernet near your media setup.
  The new firmware looks like it has some nice features, for people who get excited by such things.
8. Re:No Linux Support? by rAiNsT0rm · 2009-08-18 07:06 · Score: 1
  
  Gah! No one else mentioned this yet... major bummer. Now if I could just get real data on the new power draw of the slim.
  
  --
  http://teasphere.wordpress.com - A little spot of tea
9. Re:No Linux Support? by ivan256 · 2009-08-18 07:07 · Score: 3, Informative
  
  No doubt they *can* make it stop working on my existing PS3 if I choose to install their update. But it doesn't say anywhere that they are planning to remove it. I highly doubt they are, since the cost of maintenance on leaving it there is zero.
10. Re:No Linux Support? by timster · 2009-08-18 07:12 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  Not really surprising... they used the same pattern with the PS2. Announce during the pre-release hype that there will be Linux, and you get a bunch of pundits and gullible geeks talking about how it's going to be taking over from the Real Computer. The actual possibilities with the Linux kit end up limited and forgotten, little more than a technical curiosity.
  When the hardware gets updated later on, the Linux kit doesn't as it was only part of the pre-release marketing process. Expect the same thing with the PS4.
  
  --
  I have seen the future, and it is inconvenient.
11. Re:No Linux Support? by KnownIssues · 2009-08-18 07:13 · Score: 5, Funny
  
  I never realized how badly I wanted to be able to install another operating system on my PS3 until I found out I wouldn't be able to.
12. Re:No Linux Support? by Mad+Leper · 2009-08-18 07:19 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  The install other OS option was utterly useless, only one cell was supported and you had no access to any of the advanced hardware. No reason for Sony to continue to support a feature that was used by only a very tiny fraction of PS3 owners.
  People who pick this above all others as a reason not to buy a PS3 are just being petulant.
13. Re:No Linux Support? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-18 07:26 · Score: 1, Informative
  
  To play *NEW GAME* you have to update your firmware... or Game installs new firmware when you load it without you knowing about it
14. Re:No Linux Support? by Nursie · 2009-08-18 07:43 · Score: 3, Informative
  
  1. There is only one Cell in a PS3
  2. You had access to the main cores and all but on of it's vector processing units
  3. The GFX chip is what was cut out.
15. Re:No Linux Support? by lymond01 · 2009-08-18 07:44 · Score: 1
  
  If their research shows that not enough people are using a feature make it worth developing and supporting, why should they waste resources on that feature?
  They would do it for the Slashdot. Wouldn't you?
16. Re:No Linux Support? by ivan256 · 2009-08-18 07:47 · Score: 1
  
  Um, no. It never updates the firmware without you knowing about it.
  Though some new games do require that you update the firmware.
17. Re:No Linux Support? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-18 07:54 · Score: 1, Interesting
  
  could mean that they dropped the hypervisor
18. Re:No Linux Support? by Sponge+Bath · 2009-08-18 08:15 · Score: 1
  
  It's a shame though, as I only started playing around with cell programming on an older spare PS/3. The power core + multiple SPU approach is interesting. The only hardware alternative for cell is the super expensive QS22 blades from IBM which cuts out most educational and hobby use. You would think that IBM and Sony would want to maintain interest and training on this architecture to help justify further development. A cheap $299 box is a good way to do this. Maybe they will add the Other OS feature back in a future upgrade once they have had time to develop the Linux support.
19. Re:No Linux Support? by Endogenous · 2009-08-18 08:19 · Score: 1
  
  Of course, if you already have your PS3 (like your comment suggests you do), you can still do so. Have fun!
20. Re:No Linux Support? by jdgeorge · 2009-08-18 08:19 · Score: 1
  
  According to Wikipedia, the Slim model has an external power supply.
  Here's a photo of the rear of the unit, where you can see the unusual power connector (lower right) that seems indicative of an external brick.
21. Re:No Linux Support? by garyfreder · 2009-08-18 09:06 · Score: 1
  
  sigh no PS2 no Linux next they will remove the Blu-Ray... I have an original 20Gb PS3 that has BC and Linux. I do not use them a lot, but I can. I was excited with the Yellow Dog Linux that just came out - YDL on a Stick, I thought I had a way to spend $300 and some change and have a place to both play with Linux and the Cell and a Blu-Ray (I have a Blu-Ray burner and would be able to use it to make blu-ray disks with nifty menus) hmmm It seems like those PS3 Cluster supercomputers would be even more common with the price of the PS3 25% less than before. It probably does not make Sony a lot of $, but it should be good PR. I'm currently playing FF VII - a PS1!!! game. sigh
22. Re:No Linux Support? by metamatic · 2009-08-18 09:22 · Score: 1
  
  There's a similar pattern with controllers. The PS2 had a mouse and keyboard, but they were never used. The PS3 has mouse and keyboard support, but they're almost never used. (I guess some people use the keyboard for Home.) The PlayStation Eye has been used by maybe a dozen games, pretty much only as a way to upload a static JPEG of the player. (Exception: Eye of Judgement.)
  I confidently predict that the amazing new motion capture wand will soon be forgotten too.
  Then there are all the expansion ports that the engineers build into the first version of the console, that never get used, and are removed from later revisions. e.g. PS2 Firewire port, hard drive port.
  
  --
  GCHQ Quantum Insert installed. If only our tongues were made of glass, how much more careful we would be when we speak
23. Re:No Linux Support? by Kokuyo · 2009-08-18 09:28 · Score: 1
  
  That looks like a normal appliance socket to me.
24. Re:No Linux Support? by GizmoToy · 2009-08-18 09:31 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  That's a standard "figure 8" connector typically associated with AC transmission. You see them on everything, but the place a Slashdot reader is most likely to have seen them is on the cord that goes between the AC wall outlet and a laptop's power supply. Dell uses them a lot.
  I see nothing that would indicate an external power supply, and in fact the presence of that connector would imply the opposite.
25. Re:No Linux Support? by Sponge+Bath · 2009-08-18 09:35 · Score: 1
  
  There is an unboxing here. No external power supply, just a 2 prong AC cord instead of the 3 prong version.
26. Re:No Linux Support? by richcsst · 2009-08-18 10:44 · Score: 1
  
  Sony's probably trying to ditch the Linux support to make room for features that the virtual machine is taking up room for. Could also be a new design to where the virtual machine is loaded and run instead of being part of the firmware, so science still can use the device. Fixstars may be a bit ticked off one of their revenue streams just got axed. Heck, Sony could make the Linux feature something you have to purchase separately now via a special kit or disc.
27. Re:No Linux Support? by David+Gerard · 2009-08-18 12:24 · Score: 1
  
  That's because for a Unix-based toaster, you need NetBSD.
  
  --
  http://rocknerd.co.uk
28. Re:No Linux Support? by CronoCloud · 2009-08-18 13:52 · Score: 1
  
  Linux on the PS2 wasn't announced till AFTER the console launched, so there was no pre-release Linux hype.
29. Re:No Linux Support? by Pollardito · 2009-08-18 13:53 · Score: 1
  
  They're probably just tired of eating whatever per-unit loss they have on consoles for people that aren't going to buy games to make back the money. And since this new hardware costs less than the last generation used to, their per-unit loss is probably even higher? (Production costs keep dropping and probably make this less of a loss than the previous generation was when it was introduced, but their loss is probably higher on this new model than the old model had at the end?)
  
  I'm not denegrating people that install and run Linux on their PS3, you bought the hardware and can enjoy it how you want to. But from Sony's perspective those customers that aren't buying games are a loss.
30. Re:No Linux Support? by CronoCloud · 2009-08-18 13:56 · Score: 1
  
  The PS2 had a mouse and keyboard, but they were never used.
  The PS2 has USB ports, any USB keyboard and mouse will work just fine with games that support them. I've probably got a dozen games with keyboard support at least.
  
  The PS3 has mouse and keyboard support, but they're almost never used.
  Any game that uses the standard PS3 text entry widget for any reason, supports the keyboard. It's a godsend for naming your spells and items in Oblivion.
31. Re:No Linux Support? by CronoCloud · 2009-08-18 14:06 · Score: 1
  
  Anyone that bothered to install linux on their ps3 soon got pissed off with how rubbish and unusable is was. Linux on the PS3 was unusable as a desktop and the PS3 is not suitable as a server.
  Unusable as a desktop?
  
  Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux ppc64; en-US; rv:1.9.0.12) Gecko/2009072311 YellowDog/3.0.12-1.ydl6.2 Firefox/3.0.12 [CronoCloud@mideel ~]$ cat /proc/cpuinfo processor : 0 cpu : Cell Broadband Engine, altivec supported clock : 3192.000000MHz revision : 5.1 (pvr 0070 0501) processor : 1 cpu : Cell Broadband Engine, altivec supported clock : 3192.000000MHz revision : 5.1 (pvr 0070 0501) timebase : 79800000 platform : PS3 model : SonyPS3
  
  It runs just fine. Did you use one of those other distros that don't really focus on the PS3? Did you try to run a full KDE4 desktop on it or something. There are people that use them as servers and almost everyone that has Linux on one runs a few services like Samba or CUPS.
32. Re:No Linux Support? by marcansoft · 2009-08-18 14:24 · Score: 3, Interesting
  
  My prediction:
  - The PS3 slim will be hacked. Now that there is no Other OS support, there is the same incentive as there has been for running homebrew on every other console.
  - Said hacks will be used for warez, probably by people other than those who developed the hacks.
  Linux hackers tend to be much more successful at system reverse engineering and exploitation than the kids who want warez. This is why Other OS is a Good Thing for Sony: it removes the incentive to bypass their security for a lot of people. By removing this option, they're setting themselves to have their security broken. And we all know how long it takes for "other" people to use these hacks for less than legal purposes (I learned this the hard way).
  I firmly believe Other OS is one of the main reasons why there is no PS3 software piracy so far. Check out this table from our 25C3 presentation.
33. Re:No Linux Support? by marcansoft · 2009-08-18 14:30 · Score: 1
  
  Laptop power supplies rarely use "figure 8" connectors. Instead, most use "mickey mouse" connectors, which are similar but have an earth ground pin. The proper tems are IEC C7/C8 and IEC C5/C6, respectively, and your regular desktop power supply connector is IEC C13/C14 (there's two names for each connector, one for the male side and one for the female side).
34. Re:No Linux Support? by Narishma · 2009-08-18 15:32 · Score: 1
  
  Of course, by that logic, then Home should have dies a long time ago too...
  Have you actually used Home? People on the internets like to bash it but it's quite popular and Sony's making a lot of money from it.
  
  --
  Mada mada dane.
35. Re:No Linux Support? by donaldm · 2009-08-18 20:02 · Score: 1
  
  To play *NEW GAME* you have to update your firmware... or Game installs new firmware when you load it without you knowing about it
  Yes you are prompted to update your PS3 firmware however this is only if you are on-line. In this case you don't have to but then you won't be able to play on-line. As for a game loading new firmware you are always prompted to update to the new firmware revision that supports the particular game. You can say "no" but then your game won't play. The same is true for PC's, Xbox360's and I assume the Wii.
  
  Still it is is worth upgrading to the latest firmware although I don't recommend upgrading for a few days, preferring to do a web search to see if the new firmware has any issues. It has happened before although it is rare but it is not nice if you are one of those PS3 owners who does have a problem due to a firmware update.
  
  --
  There ain't no such thing as proprietary standards only proprietary formats. Standards are by definition open.
36. Re:No Linux Support? by donaldm · 2009-08-18 20:58 · Score: 1
  
  No doubt they *can* make it stop working on my existing PS3 if I choose to install their update. But it doesn't say anywhere that they are planning to remove it. I highly doubt they are, since the cost of maintenance on leaving it there is zero.
  In the case of choosing an alternate OS (ie. a Linux Distribution) it is rather pointless to remove the option while still supporting the previous PS3's. I did read that a John Koller, Sony's director of hardware marketing stated that they are only concerned with the PS3 OS but I have a feeling he had no real technical expertise since the same person stated that the PS3 slim would have a power brick which is clearly untrue.
  
  I love this quote from John re PS2 backwards compatibility. "It's not coming back, so let me put that on the table, Koller says with an air of finality. But it's all people ever talk about!" - You have got to be kidding me, what arrogance or is this the reporter quoting out of context. If allot of people are talking about BC then wouldn't it be a good idea to implement it and get more people interested in purchasing a PS3. Many original PS2 owners do have games that they would still love to play on a BC PS3.
  
  I have a BC PS3 (PAL version so it's predominately software emulation) which support well over 85% of PS2 games (6 out 60 of my PS2 games have artefacts - all work). One of the nice things about BC on the PS3 is your PS2 games are up-scaled to 720p and/or 1080p and smoothed. The difference between PS1 and PS2 games is quite significant while the difference between a PS2 game and PS3 game while not as detailed graphically is not as significantly between the graphics of a PS1 compared to the graphics of a PS2 game. I find that playing a PS2 game on my PS3 is retro gaming with very good graphics that is not hugely different and just as much fun as playing PS3 games.
  
  Personally I do play PS2 games on my PS3 and do save a considerable amount of money. I have over 20 PS3 titles but I still like playing many of my PS2 games. As for playing PS1 games I rarely do that now, finding the graphics even though up-scaled and smoothed are nothing like what a good PS2 game looks like on my HDTV.
  
  --
  There ain't no such thing as proprietary standards only proprietary formats. Standards are by definition open.
37. Re:No Linux Support? by donaldm · 2009-08-18 21:18 · Score: 1
  
  sigh no PS2 no Linux next they will remove the Blu-Ray
  Removing Blu-ray would be totally stupid for Sony and won't happen. One of the main reasons for choosing Blu-ray in the first place was to push a High-Definition media format for movies and games (ie. 25 GB and 50 GB). So far this appears to be working quite well since the price of Blu-ray burners and media has dropped significantly and if you want you can compare this to the price of DVD player/recorders and media back in 2000.
  
  I personally think PS2 BC should be brought back (I have a 60GB PAL BC PS3) although I have not looked at the statistics of the people who did not care. Personally I have a feeling the majority of people asked about this did not even know what BC was and where not informed. For a correct survey the people surveyed should have some clue or be informed properly, not doing this is what I call "Hedge Statistics".
  
  --
  There ain't no such thing as proprietary standards only proprietary formats. Standards are by definition open.
38. Re:No Linux Support? by donaldm · 2009-08-18 21:28 · Score: 1
  
  Take a look at the back of the original PS1 and PS2 and you will see they have same figure "8" AC 240/110V connectors. In fact many appliances have that type of connector for AC. The Wikipedia article has been changed and there is now no reference to the so called "power-brick".
  
  --
  There ain't no such thing as proprietary standards only proprietary formats. Standards are by definition open.
39. Re:No Linux Support? by donaldm · 2009-08-18 21:41 · Score: 1
  
  I'm guessing they are removing support for this as it made ripping blu-ray movies very easy, if you knew how.
  Just a guess, wouldn't want Sony's own product ripping a Sony owned format!
  If you want to rip Blu-ray movies you can do this now on your PC and then burn the movie to your Blu-ray media on your Blu-ray burner which can be got for under US$200. I am not sure if this would work though and it could be expensive to find out since the media is not as cheap as DVD yet. If you can get a HD movie into a format that the PS3 supports and put that onto a USB Hard Disk or USB key and it will play on your PS3. My son downloaded an "avi" formatted TV show and it played and looked really nice on our HDTV via our PS3.
  
  --
  There ain't no such thing as proprietary standards only proprietary formats. Standards are by definition open.
40. Re:No Linux Support? by klui · 2009-08-18 22:23 · Score: 1
  
  That's true. Older Dells used the Mickey Mouse 3-socket connector and newer ones use an in-line 3-socket connector. Older HP notebooks before the Compaq merger used the figure 8 connector as did Toshiba.
41. Re:No Linux Support? by Whalou · 2009-08-18 22:28 · Score: 1
  
  I would assume that the loss of Linux support is likely due to not bothering to accommodate for the large changes in hardware under the hood.
  My theory is that:
  - Sony is/was losing money on each console sold hoping to make it up by selling accessories
  - Some groups bought hundreds of console to make clusters without buying any accessories
  - Sony got tired of financing the deployment of these clusters
  - ???
  - No profit
  
  --
  English is not this .sig mother tongue...
42. Re:No Linux Support? by Crayon+Kid · 2009-08-18 23:30 · Score: 1
  
  This is why Other OS is a Good Thing for Sony: it removes the incentive to bypass their security for a lot of people.
  
  It wouldn't remove the incentive. The kind of people who want to tinker with their hardware out of passion would still push the envelope even if the Slim was Linux-friendly. People hack stuff that's completely open as well.
  There's a much greater issue here. People buy a piece of hardware end expect to be able to do whatever they want with it, including getting all the guts out and putting them in upside down if they want to. It's a basic, logic, assumption. It's a natural impulse towards creativity.
  But the manufacturer comes in with stuff such as the DMCA+DRM and says "No, you can't do that. Yes, you payed for the stuff, but I can still dictate what you can[not] do with it, even in the privacy of your own home."
  Why do that? It's all part of a great delusion. Any person with an ounce of logic and some basic technical understanding will tell you that once you give me some software and expect it to run unattended, locally, on a piece of hardware I own, there's no way in hell you can still control it. It can be reversed engineered, hacked to pieces and modified.
  But they don't want that. Which is why they're attempting to achieve the impossible in two ways. The first is passing a law (DMCA) which says "you can't do that". Which is just as effective as passing a law denying the gravity pull. The second method is trying to sell you hardware spiked with DRM, which will ask remote permission before doing stuff (and using the DMCA to, again, say you can't pull out or circumvent the DRM bits).
  Result: absolutely nil. In spite of DRM, in spite of whatever measures they take, someone will hack the Slim. And in case it is so dependent on remote control that you can't hack it, you gotta ask yourself: do I really want to spend my money on the illusion I own a product which is in fact a complete zombie that someone else controls?
  
  --
  i ate crayons when i was a kid and now i have two braincells and the blue ones taste nicer
43. Re:No Linux Support? by ookaze · 2009-08-18 23:48 · Score: 1
  
  Sony abandoning Linux on new skus means they are effectively doing the same for the old ones.
  Epic failure.
  To me, that means that Sony decided to rebrand its console as a gaming console, like it always should have, instead of a mini PC with DRM in the living room.
  That means they decided to focus, as their plan to takeover the living room clearly is not working.
  So yes that's an eppic failure, but I'm not sure that's not good for their future.
44. Re:No Linux Support? by ookaze · 2009-08-18 23:54 · Score: 1
  
  They lost my purchase.
  This morning as I started to see news feeds coming in that the price was being dropped to $300, a reasonable price for somethign that primarily would be used a blu-ray player. I was willing to purchase since there were some other areas I could explore in the system, including installing outside operating systems. The fact that this was something I could do with the system and now the fact that Sony can retroactively remove it, is not worth my time or my money.
  Good!
  That means what they're doing is working.
  You see, the problem with the failure of a business strategy used by Sony, is that they lose money on the consoles, and have to make it back by selling lots of other content: games or BRD movies.
  Which goes in complete contradiction with people buying the console primarily to install other OS. Because these people won't buy the lot of content necessary to subsidize the loss on the console.
  Basically, Sony doesn't want a customer like you, as they lose money with people like you.
  So their strategy is working, they manage to repel people like you from buying their console.
  Why didn't they think of that before? That's because they were stuck in trying to be the media hub in the living room.
45. Re:No Linux Support? by marcansoft · 2009-08-19 00:42 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  The kind of people who want to tinker with their hardware out of passion would still push the envelope even if the Slim was Linux-friendly. People hack stuff that's completely open as well.
  Ah, but there's a difference. With Other OS, people still want to hack out the GPU access restrictions (as has been done once or twice). With the facility removed entirely, people will attack the Native OS. Piracy shows up when you start messing with a console's native facilities, not a linux-specific mode that games can't run on anyway. I also learned this the hard way: software piracy on the Wii is possible (and popular) because we embraced the existing OS facilities and explored them, which then made it trivial for the warez kiddies to build launchers and whatnot. If we'd done something like BootMii to begin with (and ditched all of the existing proprietary code), they probably wouldn't have succeeded in creating piracy tools. (BootMii is a complete replacement of the Wii software starting at one of the early boot stages, including both the PowerPC code and the "security" ARM code).
  Besides, I know a few hackers (including myself) who have chosen not to attack the PS3 because Sony actually made an effort to enable (some) open programming. People value the Other OS feature more than you'd think.
  Sure, some people have been trying to hack the PS3 Native OS anyway already, but now you'll have a lot more people trying (those who wanted the Other OS feature as is, and those who were avoiding the PS3 due to Sony's attempt at being open).
46. Re:No Linux Support? by hattig · 2009-08-19 00:45 · Score: 1
  
  Both Sony and Microsoft are selling their consoles for profit, and have been for a while, the 360 longer (although RROD fixes have probably eaten up a lot of this). Just recently there was a report saying that Sony have dropped the cost of PS3 production by 70% since launch - I don't know if that includes the Slim or not.
47. Re:No Linux Support? by GizmoToy · 2009-08-19 00:51 · Score: 1
  
  I don't know if I'd say that. Maybe it's a difference between the Dell's Business and Home lines. We have hundreds of laptops of various vintage from the Latitude line purchased over the last 5 years or so that all use the Figure 8s. Going back further, they used the IEC C13/C14. I don't think we started seeing the Mickey Mouse connectors until about 6 months or so ago on Dell's newest machines. I haven't seen the in-line 3-socket connector klui mentioned, even on the ones that arrived as recently as a few weeks ago.
  Maybe Dell's the oddball, though, and everyone else has been using them longer.
48. Re:No Linux Support? by Ezel · 2009-08-19 00:53 · Score: 1
  
  USB Keyboard and Mouse support in hardware. But only ONE SINGLE FPS (Unreal Tournament) uses the standardized Mouse+Keyboard controller scheme. Horrible horrible!
  
  --
  Prosp long and liver.
49. Re:No Linux Support? by marcansoft · 2009-08-19 01:29 · Score: 1
  
  The Dell Inspiron 5000 already used the Mickey Mouse connector, and it's from way back in 2000/2001. I personally haven't a laptop that doesn't use this kind of connector.
50. Re:No Linux Support? by Turken · 2009-08-19 02:35 · Score: 1
  
  Yes, I have used home. I've even logged into it more than once (three times to be precise) and spent an hour or so trying things out each time. In the end, I just couldn't find any reason for going back. If I want to talk with my friends, it's easier to just call them up on the phone/VoIP. If I want to play simple mini-games (and not wait in line for the privilege to do so) there are a lot more options immediately available from my web browser. If I want to dress up dolls, I can go play with my sister's old barbies for free, and not have to pay extra for every piece of clothing. If I want to dance like a fool in public, I can just get up and go outside.
  And I'm still trying to figure out why so many people are griping about the lack of BC in the PS3. I have a 60GB model, and I've used the BC feature maybe two or three times total since I bought it. Yeah, it was an important feature back when there were very few quality games for the system in general, but now there are enough current-gen games to play that I don't have the time or need to go back and play old ones. The thing is, most people who actually care about playing PS2 games either already have a PS2, or they already have a PS3 w/ BC because they bought one early on. Meanwhile, the vast majority of people saying the lack of BC (or the price, or the lack of linux) is why they won't buy a PS3 never really intend to buy one anyway. They just enjoy griping about Sony, and nothing short of giving them some Super-Jesus-Machine-of-Orgasmic-Pleasure for free will ever make them happy. And even after that, some of them will still find reasons to complain.
51. Re:No Linux Support? by brkello · 2009-08-19 03:30 · Score: 1
  
  Uhh, you are delusional. It doesn't matter if "Other OS" is there or not. People are going to try to hack it. And eventually they will.
  
  --
  Support a great indie game: http://www.abaddon360.com
52. Re:No Linux Support? by Gravatron · 2009-08-19 04:01 · Score: 1
  
  Also useful for the peer-to-peer messaging, or basically any feature that requires you to type something. A lot of games that lacked voice support also supported it for messaging in game.
53. Re:No Linux Support? by garyfreder · 2009-08-19 04:17 · Score: 1
  
  >>sigh no PS2 no Linux next they will remove the Blu-Ray
  >Removing Blu-ray would be totally stupid for Sony and won't happen.
  Yep - it would be one of many things I find totally stupid. It would be totally stupid for Sony to remove the Blu-ray AND I think BC and Linux are things that are not critical, but differentiate the PS3 from the rest. I do not want just... a games console, I want everything! :-)
54. Re:No Linux Support? by Just+Some+Guy · 2009-08-19 04:29 · Score: 1
  
  But it doesn't say anywhere that they are planning to remove it. I highly doubt they are, since the cost of maintenance on leaving it there is zero.
  When has Sony ever passed up a perfectly good chance to remind their customers of their rightful place in the food chain?
  
  --
  Dewey, what part of this looks like authorities should be involved?
55. Re:No Linux Support? by ivan256 · 2009-08-19 05:10 · Score: 1
  
  I may be going out on a limb here, but... Maybe when they added the feature in the first place?
  Sorry. I guess I messed up your rhetorical trolling.
56. Re:No Linux Support? by GizmoToy · 2009-08-19 05:57 · Score: 1
  
  It probably is a Home/Business difference, then.
  We have a bunch of Latitude D820s and D830s from 2007/2008, some D800s from 2004, and a spattering of IBM Thinkpad G41s from 2005 that all use the Figure 8s, so they're definitely out there.
  It wasn't until the E4300s early this year that we started to see Mickey Mouse connectors on the Latitude power supplies.
57. Re:No Linux Support? by marcansoft · 2009-08-19 09:48 · Score: 1
  
  Unfortunately, you're thoroughly confused. Modchips died with the last generation of consoles, there is no such thing any more. Modchips modify/replace system ROMs, while this generation uses Flash storage which defeats the purpose. There are two ways of warezing software on today's consoles:
  - Drivechips, which modify/hack the drive's firmware to detect copies as originals. There is a large industry around these, and they are not what my argument was about.
  - Softmods, which either load warez from another location (USB) or simply change the way the console interprets what would normally be a non-game (writable) disc. These attack the system firmware (not the drive) and are used by the warez kids who are too cheap to get a modchip.
  The drivechip industry has so far failed with the PS3 because it has a robust security system in place for the drive. Their loss. Not my point.
  My comment was regarding system firmware hacking and, therefore, softmods, and the too-cheap-to-even-pay-for-the-ability-to-warez scene. These people are either a) the same people who hacked the system in the first place (i.e. people who willingly support both homebrew and warez) or b) clueless idiots who piggyback on homebrew efforts to develop (usually pretty crappy) piracy utilities. In the case of the Wii scene, the answer is B. I seem to recall that option A applies to the PSP scene, though someone might want to confirm that.
  Big Piracy Tool Industry is interested in hardware modifications (drivechips), not system firmware exploits (which would involve no hardware whatsoever). Meanwhile, the people who are interested in homebrew already use Other OS. If Sony removes Other OS, then the homebrew enthusiasts will start applying more pressure onto the existing firmware security. And as soon as it cracks, the clueless warez kids will get their opportunity to write piracy utilities.
58. Re:No Linux Support? by marcansoft · 2009-08-19 09:50 · Score: 1
  
  Oh, and I forgot: homebrew/softmods rely on unsigned mode, while drivechips only require media detection trickery. This is why drivechip piracy existed on the Wii long before homebrew, and why getting a 360 to run pirated games is much easier than getting it to run homebrew. There is a huge technical split between drive modification-based piracy and firmware modifications (homebrew and softmod-based piracy) in this console generation.
59. Re:No Linux Support? by marcansoft · 2009-08-19 09:51 · Score: 1
  
  My point is that if Other OS is gone then more people will try to hack it, and will succeed sooner.
60. Re:No Linux Support? by dangitman · 2009-08-19 11:05 · Score: 1
  
  Rarely? Practically every laptop I come into contact with uses that C7/C8 connector. The Toshibas and Apples we use at work all have them. The laptops I'm seeing with 3-pin IEC connectors are mostly older ones.
  
  --
  ... and then they built the supercollider.
61. Re:No Linux Support? by marcansoft · 2009-08-19 11:15 · Score: 1
  
  Apple definitely likes C7/C8 for their smaller power supplies (laptop power supplies and stuff like iPod/iPhone chargers). However, the Mac Mini power brick and at least some iMacs use C5/C6.
62. Re:No Linux Support? by dangitman · 2009-08-19 12:09 · Score: 1
  
  Hmmm... all the recent iMacs I've seen are C13/14. Are you perhaps referring to older models, like the "desk lamp" iMac?
  
  --
  ... and then they built the supercollider.
63. Re:No Linux Support? by marcansoft · 2009-08-19 12:14 · Score: 1
  
  Yes, older iMacs (see here).
64. Re:No Linux Support? by bmatt17 · 2009-08-22 03:03 · Score: 1
  
  While that may have some effect I think the main reason the PS3 doesn't have software piracy is the blu-ray drive. As far as kids wanting "warez" the cost of a blu-ray burning and media is currently too expensive versus just going out and buying the games.
Re:preorder by BobZee1 · 2009-08-18 06:53 · Score: 1, Insightful

Hell yes. Time to buy ps3 number two. Call me a fanboi all you want, but I love this console.

--
dumber people are doing harder things everyday
Re:preorder by abigor · 2009-08-18 07:01 · Score: 1

Agreed, best electronics purchase I've made in a long while (got mine back in Dec. 2008).
The price cut is nice, but mine was only $350 CDN back then, so $299 US doesn't seem that much different (around $20 or so).
Still overpriced in the UK by iJed · 2009-08-18 07:02 · Score: 1

According to the BBC the UK price is amazingly Â£250 or about US$413. Which is a ripoff. At this price there is no way that I would consider buying one.
1. Re:Still overpriced in the UK by hattig · 2009-08-18 07:11 · Score: 1
  
  So it's Â£217 without VAT (assuming 15% here, and that Sony will swallow the increase back to 17.5% next year) which is $360. That's a $60 markup for the UK, or 20%. That's a bit rude really, but par for the course.
  On the other hand, I got my PS3 for Â£240 over a year ago, so I'm not too bothered.
2. Re:Still overpriced in the UK by Gwala · 2009-08-18 08:36 · Score: 1
  
  Remember the UK has a ridiculous electronics import duty too.
  
  --
  #!/bin/csh cat $0
3. Re:Still overpriced in the UK by Xest · 2009-08-18 08:37 · Score: 1
  
  Yeah, that's a big deal to me, especially as I only paid £229.99 for my Xbox 360 back in August 2006. I want a PS3 because I'm dying to play Killzone more than anything, but I just can't justify paying more for a console of the same generation now, than I did 3 years ago. This late in the generation consoles needs to be sub-£200 IMO.
  To be fair on Sony, that's what the price point is in North America - £180, which is the same as the Wii at £179.99 whilst the 360 for the premium model is £149.99. £180 is a reasonable price point, but £250 simply is not. I don't know what Sony's playing at really, but they've certainly lost a sale here for the time being. I wont get my wallet out for one until it's under £200, particularly as it is in the US.
  Yeah yeah I know there's the argument about higher taxes in Europe, but seriously, we don't get taxed £70 on a £180 product - that's like a 38% markup, whilst VAT is only 15% right now. There's really no justification for that, and it's not like a £250 cost for a console of this generations is justifiable this late in the game, especially when we're still in a recession.
  On one hand I kinda feel, finally Sony get it by doing a price decrease in the US to a reasonable level. On the other, I feel they still just don't get it based on the UK price. I'm assuming the rest of Europe will face a similar price to the UK.
  Perhaps it's just because NA has been Sony's weakest market this generation and they feel they need to discount further there?
4. Re:Still overpriced in the UK by hattig · 2009-08-18 09:40 · Score: 1
  
  Oh yeah, our benevolent government doesn't want us to be able to have thrills and gadgets on the cheap in case we don't value them enough!
  Still, we do get some consumer protection I guess ...
5. Re:Still overpriced in the UK by Xest · 2009-08-19 02:25 · Score: 1
  
  There are import duties into to the US too as they're manufactured in Asia.
Meanwhile, in my country... by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-18 07:03 · Score: 1, Insightful

PS3 (40 GB version): $600
PS3 games: $100
Yeah, I'll skip.
1. Re:Meanwhile, in my country... by broeman · 2009-08-18 14:37 · Score: 1
  
  Nice troll
  1. There is no 40GB PS3 on sale any longer (except some old ones on storage, I guess)
  2. It sounds like the price for 40GB PS3 2 years ago in my country, but it is much lower now (even before the new price cut)
  3. If it still is the price for a 80/160GB PS3 today, what is the price for a Xbox 360 or Wii? to make a comparison
  
  --
  
  (yes this can be compared with sex)
2. Re:Meanwhile, in my country... by Macgrrl · 2009-08-18 15:14 · Score: 1
  
  Sounds like Australia to me...
  
  --
  Sara
  Designer, Gamer, Macgrrl in an XP World
Re:Break out the 80 grit by hattig · 2009-08-18 07:06 · Score: 1

It's ironic that many people were bitching about the shiny black before, because it was a dust magnet.
Some things you can't win I guess. Stick it in your media centre and forget about it.
Or get the current model before it sells out.
Glad to hear by MBCook · 2009-08-18 07:11 · Score: 1

There have been one or two games I'd like to play that are on the PS3 only, but they are some coming that I'd really like to play (God of War 3, possibly FF XIII, I know there are others). I didn't want to spend $400 for a game or two. Having the price down to $300 helps.
Of course I'm not going to jump at it yet. I'll wait for the inevitable God of War III bundle.

--
Comment forecast: Bits of genius surrounded by a sea of mediocrity.
1. Re:Glad to hear by Nemyst · 2009-08-18 13:12 · Score: 1
  
  *cough* Where were you? FF XIII is coming to the Xbox 360 too, at least in Europe and NA.
  
  Not to say there aren't plenty of nice games on the PS3 (I own more games for that console than the 360, actually), but FF XIII isn't one of those exclusives.
2. Re:Glad to hear by MBCook · 2009-08-18 14:04 · Score: 1
  
  Oh yeah, I forgot about that. And I own a 360.
  My list of games for the PS3 I'm interested in is Metal Gear Solid 4 (a big one), God of War 3, and the rumored Twisted Metal game. I'm sure I'd find more if I went looking (especially into the list of already released PS3 games).
  
  --
  Comment forecast: Bits of genius surrounded by a sea of mediocrity.
Power consumption? by valenti · 2009-08-18 07:12 · Score: 1

Any news on how much juice the Slim sucks? I heard it would be less.
And I assume that Stanford's Folding client still runs on them?
The 'old' PS3 is $299, too by Dr.+Manhattan · 2009-08-18 07:14 · Score: 2, Informative

The 'fat' PS3's price is being cut to $299 and it retains the "OtherOS" feature. The press releases says "users will not be able to install other Operating Systems to the new PS3 system" [emphasis added]. (It's also not clear yet how hard it'll be to upgrade the HD in the 'slim' model, if it's possible at all.)
I've got Linux on mine, but I haven't had a chance to use it much. The annoying thing is that there's no real equivalent to a bootloader. If you set it to boot Linux, it will always boot to Linux until you boot the PS3 "Game OS", at which point it will always boot Game OS until you explicitly change it again. Makes it annoying to experiment with when the kids use it, too.

--
PHEM - party like it's 1997-2003!
1. Re:The 'old' PS3 is $299, too by revengebomber · 2009-08-18 07:43 · Score: 2, Interesting
  
  At least the removal of the easy Linux functionality will spur developers to look for more "complete" paths to develop for PS3 systems.
  
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  09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0
  45 5F E1 04 22 CA 29 C4 93 3F 95 05 2B 79 2A B2
2. Re:The 'old' PS3 is $299, too by Jophiel04 · 2009-08-18 11:15 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  The HDD is user-upgradeable as confirmed by engadget
3. Re:The 'old' PS3 is $299, too by donaldm · 2009-08-18 21:04 · Score: 1
  
  It's also not clear yet how hard it'll be to upgrade the HD in the 'slim' model, if it's possible at all.
  The Hard Disk access slot is in the front of the machine at the bottom. In fact you can easily change the disk just like the "fat" PS3 and not void your warranty. There are pictures on You-Tube that show you how to do this on the "slim" PS3.
  
  --
  There ain't no such thing as proprietary standards only proprietary formats. Standards are by definition open.
4. Re:The 'old' PS3 is $299, too by Dr.+Manhattan · 2009-08-18 22:48 · Score: 1
  
  Yup, when I replied the whole story was just a few hours old. Thanks for the update.
  
  --
  PHEM - party like it's 1997-2003!
Are we still expected to pay $0.30 for Home shoes? by _xeno_ · 2009-08-18 07:19 · Score: 4, Informative

So, new changes coming to Home. More customization options. More places. Neat, I guess.
Except for the part where they apparently think people are willing to pay $0.29 for a pair of shoes that no one is going to see. Likewise the $5 to buy a new "personal apartment" that basically no one except yourself is ever going to see. (Sure, you can invite friends over to your virtual apartment but, really, how much is it worth to have your virtual self live in the Ghostbusters station?)
Not to mention the charges on logo-ed shirts. I can't remember prices, but I think those were in the $0.50-$1 range. So I'm expected to pay money to be a walking virtual advertisement. Sure...
If the Home avatars had any use outside of Home (like the Miis and the Xbox Live Avatars) I could almost see the more pathetic fanboys paying money to dress them up in a T-shirt with a Ghostbuster logo on it. But $0.50 for a virtual shirt that can only be seen in a single virtual space in which there is essentially nothing to do? Please!
Last time I checked (which was a month ago, so not terribly long ago) PlayStation Home was still just like this Penny Arcade cartoon. The only difference I found from the beta last year is that the stores now actually sell something rather than being completely empty.

--
You are in a maze of twisty little relative jumps, all alike.
Re:An even better model by The+Living+Fractal · 2009-08-18 07:24 · Score: 1

Though your case study of two units is hardly statistically meaningful, I do share your sentiment. I wonder what the percentage of failure is for these units within one year?
And compare that to the 360.
And compare that to the PC.
I doubt the PS3 is much worse, but it seems like it sometimes.

--
I do not respond to cowards. Especially anonymous ones.
Re:An even better model by DoofusOfDeath · 2009-08-18 07:27 · Score: 1

Though your case study of two units is hardly statistically meaningful, I do share your sentiment.
Agreed. I would have preferred to know the failure rate before buying them. Are those data even publicly known?
I would have had to buy the PS3 anyway, since I needed to do some research involving the Cell processor. But I sure regret looking like a jerk to the random Craigslist guy.
Good, but not perfect by tepples · 2009-08-18 07:29 · Score: 1
Sony will however sell you a PS2 compatibility kit to go with your PS3. It's 100% compatible with all PS2 games and even comes with an original PS2 controller.
I made this same point in a recent article, but somebody pointed out the following reasons why just buying a PlayStation 2 console is not perfect:
1. Extra set of cables to the TV.
2. It comes with only one controller, and multiplayer games don't work with his existing collection of Sixaxis/Dual Shock 3 controllers, even though it has a USB port on the front.
3. It doesn't have anything like the virtual memory cards of the PS3's PS1 emulation and the early PS3's PS2 emulation. Apparently people like to play sim games that take up 10% of the memory card, and some failure modes render all files on a memory card unreadable.
Re:Break out the 80 grit by ergo98 · 2009-08-18 07:32 · Score: 1

>Some things you can't win I guess. Stick it in your media centre and forget about it.
Define "win". You realize that it's very likely different people you hear from each time, right?
Discontinued soon? by tepples · 2009-08-18 07:32 · Score: 1

The 'fat' PS3's price is being cut to $299 and it retains the "OtherOS" feature.
But how long will the 'fat' PS3 continued to be manufactured?
1. Re:Discontinued soon? by Narishma · 2009-08-18 15:09 · Score: 1
  
  For a long time? There are 2 versions of the fat PS3: the 80GB and the 160GB. They are replacing the 80GB with the new slim 120GB but are keeping the 160GB fat version. And all the fat versions support Linux.
  
  --
  Mada mada dane.
Re:An even better model by dc29A · 2009-08-18 07:35 · Score: 5, Insightful

How about they release "PS3 Reliable edition"?
Of the two PS3 owners that I know (a friend and myself), both have had the Blue-ray drive fail. And mine failed just after I sold the console on Craigslist, making me look like a fraud.
The plural of 'anecdote' is not 'evidence'.
Re:Whoa! by Enderandrew · 2009-08-18 07:42 · Score: 5, Insightful

* 120 gig HDD.
* Built in wifi-fi.
* Streams all my media content from my computer.
* Top-notch BluRay player.
* Built in web browser
* Oh, and plays games.
I think it is a great value actually, But to each their own.

--
http://blindscribblings.com - Tasty pop-culture in conceptual fashion.
Firmware 3.0 by CopaceticOpus · 2009-08-18 07:43 · Score: 5, Interesting
The new firmware is designed to help Sony advertise, and does almost nothing that PS3 owners actually want.
New Features:
- "What's New" screen (ads for Sony products, links to Sony store)
- Sony store now appears in several menus instead of just one.
- New animated themes that you can buy.
- New avatars, some of which are for sale. (Yes, they're really going to charge you to put a little picture of Sonic next to your username.)
Things People Actually Want:
- PS2 Compatibility
- Better video support, especially MKV files. (Yes, you can convert MKV files to be playable. No, I don't think that's good enough.)
- Ability to play media files over a Windows/Samba share, rather than having to use media server software.
- Ability to backup the PS3 over a LAN automatically.
- Less klunky web browsing
- 1080i support for more games. (Since some TVs are 1080/480 only, and downgrade 720 down to 480.)
Thanks a bunch, Sony.
1. Re:Firmware 3.0 by DarkEdgeX · 2009-08-18 08:18 · Score: 1
  
  Whenever they update their Divx support the MKV support should be included (since the new Divx uses MKV files).
  As for the rest, agreed. The web browser should just use some custom build of Firefox, and the PS2 backwards compatibility would help bring in the people who want to keep playing their existing PS2 games.
  
  --
  All I know about Bush is I had a good job when Clinton was president.
2. Re:Firmware 3.0 by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-18 08:22 · Score: 1, Interesting
  
  The new firmware is designed to help Sony advertise, and does almost nothing that PS3 owners actually want.
  Thanks a bunch, Sony.
  Virtually all of the recent PSP firmware 'upgrades' have followed this model as well. No functionality gains, just more sales and marketing...
  I was really pulling for Sony to not bone this one.
3. Re:Firmware 3.0 by MaWeiTao · 2009-08-18 08:39 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  "What's New" screen (ads for Sony products, links to Sony store)
  The What's New screen has always been there.
  
  Sony store now appears in several menus instead of just one.
  I'm not sure what you mean by this as I haven't read anything about it, but the Store is already exceedingly easy to access.
  
  New animated themes that you can buy.
  Themes have always been for sale as well although there are a decent number which are free. In my opinion, however, at least 95% of them are amateurish garbage. I'm not sure how the companies producing these themes were allowed to offer such crap.
  I personally would never waste money on something like a theme. And there's a tool available that allows anyone to create their own theme, for free. I assume the tool will still be available for the slim PS3. And you can change the background image to anything you want any time you feel like it.
  
  New avatars, some of which are for sale.
  I assume you're referring to Home. This is nothing new. Sony even charges for clothing.
  Frankly, I think it's ridiculous especially given there's not much of anything to do in Home. I also think anyone spending money on that stuff is a fool. But hey, that's their own decision.
  
  PS2 Compatibility
  Do that many people really want PS2 compatibility? It would be nice, but is it all that crucial?
  I'd argue most consumers are clamoring for the latest games. And for anyone who owns a decent library of PS2 games I have to assume they already own a PS2 otherwise what's the point of all the games.
  
  Better video support, especially MKV files. (Yes, you can convert MKV files to be playable. No, I don't think that's good enough.)
  Ability to play media files over a Windows/Samba share, rather than having to use media server software.
  I don't see why either of these requests are important. It seems like an issue a miniscule segment of the user-base would be concerned about so why should Sony bother investing time and money into this?
  
  Ability to backup the PS3 over a LAN automatically.
  Backing up to a USB drive is so trivial that I don't see much of a need for this. And there are games out there that, frustratingly, don't allow backups anyway.
  
  Less klunky web browsing.
  It's not great, but it does the job reasonably well. There are things that probably should be addressed but honestly, how many people really care about this? It doesn't matter what they do, the experience is unlikely to ever compare to browsing on the PC for many reasons; the PS3 uses a non-standard browser and websites are designed with PCs in mind.
  
  1080i support for more games.
  Again, this is a minor issue. What HDTV today isn't 720p or 1080p? The biggest issue I have here is that most games are don't run at 1080p, but addressing that is far from trivial.
  Sony's responsibility is to satisfy as large a segment of consumers as possible. It would make no business sense whatsoever for them to try to address every last issue people raise. What you want isn't necessarily what most people want or even care about.
4. Re:Firmware 3.0 by DrXym · 2009-08-18 08:51 · Score: 1
  
  Things People Actually Want: * PS2 Compatibility
  Who says it won't return in some form? But if it means that much to you, go buy a PS3 second hand containing it. Or just keep your PS2.
  * Better video support, especially MKV files. (Yes, you can convert MKV files to be playable. No, I don't think that's good enough.)
  The PS3 already plays MPEG2, ASP, AVC and VC-1 media from a variety of containers, from local storage and remote. It probably has the best multimedia support of any console. Yes MKV would be nice, but I suspect it will only happen if Sony wants DIVX 7 certification. I'd also note that MKV support by itself is completely meaningless since it's what's in the container that matters. MKV is just a container not a magic wand to make random content play.
  * Ability to play media files over a Windows/Samba share, rather than having to use media server software.
  Would be nice, but it's hardly a big deal. There are plenty of DLNA servers and you can also get media by plugging in an external drive, or just downloading it through a browser.
  * Ability to backup the PS3 over a LAN automatically.
  Again it would be nice, but I'd prefer first to be able to selectively back up content. My HDD is full of movies which are duplicates so I see no reason backing up again.
  * Less klunky web browsing
  It would be nice if they dumped Netfront for WebKit or Gecko. Realistically the crappy Netfront browser would still have to kick around for legacy in-game browsing.
  * 1080i support for more games. (Since some TVs are 1080/480 only, and downgrade 720 down to 480.)
  1080i support is never going to be mandatory. 1080i/480p sets are out of the dark ages. Virtually every HD set in the last 4 years supports 1080i, 720p and even 1080p. Sony are not going piss off game devs by mandating something which a small and ever diminishing number of users even care about.
5. Re:Firmware 3.0 by Cochonou · 2009-08-18 09:38 · Score: 1
  
  Sony's responsibility is to satisfy as large a segment of consumers as possible. It would make no business sense whatsoever for them to try to address every last issue people raise.
  
  The point is that the users of the console probably do not care at all about what would make business sense for Sony. They are the customers at the end of the pipe, and not executives caring about a bottom line: the more the users get, the better for them. Of course, Sony is free to only address the issues they feel being the most important. And the users that do not get the features they want (whether they are widely requested or a "personal pet peeve") have all the rights to complain about it, or not to buy the end product.
6. Re:Firmware 3.0 by CopaceticOpus · 2009-08-18 10:23 · Score: 1
  
  1080i support is never going to be mandatory. 1080i/480p sets are out of the dark ages. Virtually every HD set in the last 4 years supports 1080i, 720p and even 1080p. Sony are not going piss off game devs by mandating something which a small and ever diminishing number of users even care about.
  My HD TV is three years old, and it supports 480i, 480p, and 1080i only. Many TVs function in this way, including many made by Sony! An HD TV is a large purchase, and most purchasers are hoping to get something close to a decade of use from their TV.
  This isn't an issue for a majority of users, but there is a large subset of users who are affected. Sony is choosing not to pay much attention, which is their prerogative, but they're going to make some people unhappy. It also makes them look bad when all 360 games do support 1080i.
  Sony isn't all bad. The fact that their console serves as a browser and a network media player is pretty great. If they would keep improving these features, they could make it a major selling point, and gain some very happy, loyal customers in the process.
7. Re:Firmware 3.0 by jmorris42 · 2009-08-18 12:00 · Score: 1
  
  > Do that many people really want PS2 compatibility? It would be nice, but is it all that crucial?
  > I'd argue most consumers are clamoring for the latest games. And for anyone who owns a decent library of PS2 games I have to assume they
  > already own a PS2 otherwise what's the point of all the games.
  Ok, I'm not typical but I'd like it. Here is my reasoning. I haven't bothered with owning a console since the A2600 but have thought about trying it again. Also have grandkids around the house nowadays. The kiddies have access to a Gamecube and Xbox360 at home so I'd like to go with something that would let them play different stuff. Also important is that there is a metric boatload of games for preschoolers for the PS2 and they are cheap. Spongebob doesn't really need next gen power after all. A look at the offerings at Walmart & Game Stop don't show many titles for Xbox360 or Wii that kids could or should be playing and what few there are cost twice the price of typical NEW PS2 titles.
  Wii is another option; games for kids are available but are almost as expensive as PS3 or Xbox since Wii is a current gen platform. Good grief, why is a schlock movie tie in game twice as expensive as the DVD of the movie itself? The trade off is a serious shortage of titles for adults.
  Meanwhile most titles that catch my eye are next gen. My TV is still a fairly good but SD unit with only one set of inputs still unused. (Home theater, MythTV, etc. filled it up) So unless I want to add yet more complexity (which lowers WAF) and install a game switch box the limit is ONE system. So unless backward compatibility comes back to the PS3 they are going to lose a sale to the PS2 and I'll game on a PC and take a look situation again when the wheel turns to the next generation.
  
  --
  Democrat delenda est
8. Re:Firmware 3.0 by Nemyst · 2009-08-18 13:16 · Score: 1
  
  For your information, it's up to the developer to introduce 1080i support in the games, not Sony. I know Criterion added 1080i support to Burnout Paradise in a patch, which proves it can be done.
9. Re:Firmware 3.0 by CronoCloud · 2009-08-18 14:19 · Score: 1
  
  PS2 functionality is crucial for those who want to play FFXI, it requires either a "fat" PS2 (to put the PS2 hard drive in) or a PS3 with backwards compatibility.
10. Re:Firmware 3.0 by Narishma · 2009-08-18 15:26 · Score: 1
  
  You know you can get a PS2 new for $100 or a used one for around $50 right?
  
  --
  Mada mada dane.
11. Re:Firmware 3.0 by olingern · 2009-08-18 17:41 · Score: 1
  
  "What's New" screen (ads for Sony products, links to Sony store)
  The What's New screen has always been there.
  
  Sony store now appears in several menus instead of just one.
  I'm not sure what you mean by this as I haven't read anything about it, but the Store is already exceedingly easy to access.
  
  New animated themes that you can buy.
  Themes have always been for sale as well although there are a decent number which are free. In my opinion, however, at least 95% of them are amateurish garbage. I'm not sure how the companies producing these themes were allowed to offer such crap.
  ......
  I don't know why you would troll Copa's post. Many of his request are not what you call "minor." I would say that there is a large base of users and would-be users who would want to use the ps3 as their primary media center instead of investing in a desktop. Many of these features along with the recent price cut would change a would-be user like myself to a happy owner of a ps3. I don't have a ton of time to dedicate to video games right now in my life, so I need extra incentives in order to make a purchase like this. Think the features Copa mentioned in his post would definitely woo people like me into this purchase, not to mention that it would give bragging rights over all the x-box fanboys. Basically, MaWeiTao, I think your post is troll shit.
12. Re:Firmware 3.0 by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-18 22:15 · Score: 1, Insightful
  
  "Do that many people really want PS2 compatibility? It would be nice, but is it all that crucial?
  I'd argue most consumers are clamoring for the latest games. And for anyone who owns a decent library of PS2 games I have to assume they already own a PS2 otherwise what's the point of all the games."
  Then you are being mere argumentative.
  How difficult is it for you to understand that, for the customer, the ability to do something equates to value and hence incentive to buy the product?
  If I'm plunking down hundreds for a console, I want backwards compatability. Doesn't freaking matter if I will use it or not, I may, I *might* want to. If I don't get it, and find out I've got to buy a separate console box, or maybe think I will have to, I'm far less inclined to buy the product.
  A couple of the reasons why the Wii sells isn't because of the motion controllers--it's also because Nintendo announced they were porting old games and it was backwards compatible with the Gamecube. People *bought* classic controllers for this former, even arguing against 3rd party controllers that didn't have analog control.
  Do most people buy a Wii to play old school games? No. But those who did might have said, "Hey, that's cool, I can buy some of the old NES games if I want." Extra value, more incentive to buy. Not a difficult argument to understand.
13. Re:Firmware 3.0 by donaldm · 2009-08-18 22:35 · Score: 1
  
  You know you can get a PS2 new for $100 or a used one for around $50 right?
  Yes but a PS2 does not up-scale and smooth a PS2 game to 720p or 1080p. Ok you can get an up-scaling amplifier but they are not that cheap. Personally I would rather have one device that can play PS1, PS2 and PS3 games and I do :)
  
  --
  There ain't no such thing as proprietary standards only proprietary formats. Standards are by definition open.
14. Re:Firmware 3.0 by donaldm · 2009-08-18 23:01 · Score: 1
  
  My HD TV is three years old, and it supports 480i, 480p, and 1080i only. Many TVs function in this way, including many made by Sony! An HD TV is a large purchase, and most purchasers are hoping to get something close to a decade of use from their TV.
  Sorry you don't have a HDTV, you basically have a Standard Def TV. Look at the following for more HDTV information (see the two tables). Even TV's advertised as 1080i where only "HDTV ready" which is IMHO a con (yes I did get one of these over 6 years ago). If you want a real HDTV your TV must support 720p and/or 1080p as well as having backwards compatible SDTV support of 480i/p (NTSC) or 576i/p (PAL) depending which country you are living in. HDMI input is an option although preferred but component input is mandatory. If all you have is composite, S-video or even SCART inputs then you definitely will not display HD content.
  
  Actually saying HDTV's are expensive is not right. For large (say 50" plus) costs are high but smaller (32") HDTV's are reasonably cheap. In fact you can get a 24" 1080p monitor with HDMI input for less than US$200 all you need is either a HD set top box or a HD HDD recorder (better value for your money) or even use it on your PC (great for gaming as well). Personally I don't really care for HD or even SD tuners in my HDTV since I only teat my TV as a monitor.
  
  --
  There ain't no such thing as proprietary standards only proprietary formats. Standards are by definition open.
15. Re:Firmware 3.0 by Ezel · 2009-08-19 00:59 · Score: 1
  
  So MKV is now included in the new Divx? That just means we will get stuck without the new Divx on PS3 since Sony just loves screwing their customers.
  I try to use my PS3 as a mediacenter but I soon will give up and buy a Popcorn Hour or something since Sony doesn't give us customers the love we deserve.
  
  --
  Prosp long and liver.
16. Re:Firmware 3.0 by CopaceticOpus · 2009-08-19 01:52 · Score: 1
  
  That's silly. I have a real, actual HD TV. It just doesn't support all of the possible HD resolutions. I can watch HD broadcasts and Blu-Ray movies at their highest resolution, which is much higher than any standard def TV. I use a DVI connection, which is equivalent to HDMI without the audio channel.
  It didn't seem likely when I bought the TV that I'd have any need for 720p or 720i. That just seemed like a step down from 1080i. There are many TVs out there like this, and the PS3 could support them better, but it doesn't. I guess I should have thrown out my TV because I bought a game console?
17. Re:Firmware 3.0 by DarkEdgeX · 2009-08-25 21:42 · Score: 1
  
  Yeah, I think it's called "Divx HD", and there's already hardware coming with that certification. I do agree that Sony seems to be missing the boat when it comes to functionality beyond games, and I was personally hoping from something more from a major firmware revision.
  
  Hell, it'd be nice to see them add exFAT support so I can watch movies larger than 4 GB on attached storage (currently only FAT32 is supported on USB mass storage class devices; this means full length HD content usually needs to either a) be copied from a DLNA network share or b) split in to separate files for storage on the FAT32 formatted device).
  
  --
  All I know about Bush is I had a good job when Clinton was president.
18. Re:Firmware 3.0 by Anonymous+McCartneyf · 2009-08-27 12:06 · Score: 1
  
  Ability to play media files over a Windows/Samba share?
  Okay, I can see why you'd want that -- but surely, for Windows shares at least, Microsoft would have to cooperate... So what is the likelihood of that happening when there are still XBoxes floating around?
  
  --
  There is a fine line between recklessness and courage... -- Paul McCartney
19. Re:Firmware 3.0 by CopaceticOpus · 2009-08-28 03:43 · Score: 1
  
  Samba works without Microsoft's help. However, I don't know if the PS3 could incorporate Samba without breaking the GPL. They might have to write their own implementation.
  The PS3 can browse files shared using uPnP, but it is really slow. It's sad that my modded Xbox can browse through my music over the network so much faster than what my PS3 can do.
Finally! by Capeman · 2009-08-18 07:44 · Score: 1

I've always told my friends once the PS3 price would be on par with the 360, it would sell more, why would that be? Because the PS3 is a better console hardware-wise and can play Blu-Ray discs. On games, think about it, most third party games are made for both consoles, the differences are mostly Halo and GoW for the 360 and Uncharted, Gran Turismo, Infamous and others for the PS3. So it is a matter of taste. We'll seethis holiday season wich console sells more.
1. Re:Finally! by elrous0 · 2009-08-18 08:16 · Score: 1
  
  Four years into this generation is a little late for a comeback. Not saying it's impossible, but it would certainly be unprecedented. Besides, the Xbox 720 will probably be out by Christmas 2010.
  
  --
  SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
2. Re:Finally! by Capeman · 2009-08-18 08:23 · Score: 1
  
  Yes, it is a little late, but look at Sony's past consoles, sure they were on the lead back then, but the thing is, years after their competitor's consoles were dead, Sony's consoles still were selling strong.
3. Re:Finally! by snuf23 · 2009-08-18 10:01 · Score: 1
  
  The sales and market performance of a previous generation console mean nothing for the current generation. See the sales impact of the Atari 5200 or hell even the Gamecube vs Wii.
  
  --
  Sometimes my arms bend back.
4. Re:Finally! by Anonymous+McCartneyf · 2009-08-27 12:52 · Score: 1
  
  A lot of XBox 360s can conk out between now and Christmas 2010.
  Seriously, everyone seems to be doing a mid-generation update this year. Nintendo is issuing a new Wii controller, Microsoft is replacing its most common XBox with a new model ASAP, and, well, you know what Sony is doing. This at least gives Sony the possibility of coming close to where Microsoft is before Christmas 2010.
  
  --
  There is a fine line between recklessness and courage... -- Paul McCartney
Sony Electronic Reader by Orion+Blastar · 2009-08-18 07:44 · Score: 2, Interesting

I want to be able to do more than read Comic Books with a reader program. I want to be able to read PDF, ODF, RTF, HTML, CHM, and other formats that eBooks come in.
If I buy a PSP or Slim PS3, I want an educational value for it as well as a gaming one. I want more than a Language Tutor program or BrainAge, I want to be able to read eBooks as well.
I am sticking to a PS2 because the PS3 price is too high and they took away backwards compatibility with PS2 games on most PS3 models. I might as well buy a Wii because it runs GameCube games, or an XBox 360 with a hard drive that can run XBox games. Sony really needs to learn a lesson here to run legacy software like the others, or risk losing these console wars.
No more Rootkits either, ok? Sony we are sick of them.

--
Remember, Slashdot does not have a -1 disagree moderation, and no, troll, flamebait, and overrated are not substitutes.
1. Re:Sony Electronic Reader by MeatBag+PussRocket · 2009-08-18 08:41 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  I want to be able to do more than read Comic Books with a reader program. I want to be able to read PDF, ODF, RTF, HTML, CHM, and other formats that eBooks come in.
  If I buy a PSP or Slim PS3, I want an educational value for it as well as a gaming one. I want more than a Language Tutor program or BrainAge, I want to be able to read eBooks as well.
  I am sticking to a PS2...
  
  last i checked the PS2 has none of those features. if you're serious about using a gaming console for education i actually think the PS3 is about as close as you'll get. in addition to the obvious of being able to teach somebody the basics of running linux from the command line, since its the only console with a blu ray you can get the blue planet series on BD its an incredible documentary that is full of education.
  
  --
  i wage a holy war against the apostrophe.
Comment removed by account_deleted · 2009-08-18 07:51 · Score: 1

Comment removed based on user account deletion
PSP Digital Reader Service by gEvil+(beta) · 2009-08-18 07:52 · Score: 2, Informative

Sure, the PS3 Slim is nice. But what I find interesting is the PSP Digital Reader Service. The (very brief) article mentions that Sony is teasing about extending it beyond comics by the end of the year. Not coincidentally, that's also when they plan to have their eBookstore migrated over to the ePub format. Considering the iPhone/iPod Touch are among the most used digital book-reading devices, and the PSP has a screen resolution that's similar, this could be a very wise move. Assuming this actually happens, you'll also have the ability to buy new releases directly from the PSP using WiFi (something that many people are wishing for in a new Sony eBook reader). Interesting times ahead...

--
This guy's the limit!
Re:An even better model by Filip22012005 · 2009-08-18 07:55 · Score: 4, Interesting

The failure rates were published on joystiq a couple of days ago: http://www.joystiq.com/2009/08/17/game-informer-xbox-360-at-54-2-percent-failure-rate/.
xbox: 54.2%
ps3 10.3%
wii 6.8%
Too bad Greenpeace didn't consider those when they named Nintendo such a non-green company.

--
When the policeman of the tie, rule you violate, hello punishment of the kitty?
Re:Are we still expected to pay $0.30 for Home sho by Sinbios · 2009-08-18 07:58 · Score: 1

Don't like it? Don't buy it. What's the problem?

--
Anyone can "stand up for what they believe", but it takes a very brave individual to change what they believe. - Loundry
Re:Are we still expected to pay $0.30 for Home sho by gEvil+(beta) · 2009-08-18 08:11 · Score: 4, Insightful

Not to mention the charges on logo-ed shirts. I can't remember prices, but I think those were in the $0.50-$1 range. So I'm expected to pay money to be a walking virtual advertisement. Sure...

Hell, people pay 20-30 bucks (and more) all the time to be walking real-life advertisements.

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This guy's the limit!
If you're not fixated on playing at the TV set... by Lonewolf666 · 2009-08-18 08:12 · Score: 1

...you get a decent midrange gaming PC for $500 these days, with dual core, 4 GB RAM and one of the better 128 bit GPUs. The PS3 still has more CPU power, but I think the PC wins in all other things.
While this is a bit of an apples to oranges comparison, it shows the PS3 is not THAT much cheaper than a PC with decent gaming performance. Which is also useful for your home office. So I tend to agree about "too little too late for Sony".

--
C - the footgun of programming languages
Re:Are we still expected to pay $0.30 for Home sho by _xeno_ · 2009-08-18 08:17 · Score: 1

It's not a problem, so much, as it is a question of whether the new Home content is actually going to be worth anything or if it's all going to be worthless options locked behind a pay wall.
The article says that Home will be getting "new character customization options" - are we expected to pay for these? Since they're currently charging money for the current "character customization options" in the forms of virtual clothing, it seems quite likely that these new options may simply be more paid clothing.
Likewise, the new areas are apparently branded advertising areas. (The examples given were an Audi and SingStar area.) Will there be anything to do there? Or is it yet more walking around 3D models with the option to buy branded clothing?
In other words, is Home still a virtual shopping mall where the only things you can buy are virtual goods that can only be used inside the virtual shopping mall? That's the problem - there's nothing to do in Home except buy useless digital junk.

--
You are in a maze of twisty little relative jumps, all alike.
Re:Are we still expected to pay $0.30 for Home sho by MaWeiTao · 2009-08-18 08:18 · Score: 1

Well, if Sony wanted to entice people to actually participate in Home they'd make that sort of thing free.
And secondly, it's the principle of the thing. Companies only take advantage because people allow them to do so. If consumers formed a united front and took at stand against this sort of nonsense a lot more DLC would be free. It's one think when they're offering a substantial add-on to a game and another thing altogether when it's some costume piece.
I also don't understand how anyone could tolerate paying for clothing emblazoned with gigantic logos. These people have paid to be walking billboard. It's ridiculous in real life and in games, but then I suppose people are more concerned about image than principles.
Needs an Infrared Port by jubei · 2009-08-18 08:28 · Score: 1

It would be nice if they would have included an infrared port for universal remotes. The PS3 is reportedly the best Blu-Ray player, but it is hard to integrate into many people's home theaters because of the RF remote.
Re:Are we still expected to pay $0.30 for Home sho by KDR_11k · 2009-08-18 08:28 · Score: 1

But at least those are real shirts that perform the purpose of a shirt. The virtual shirts do nothing exxcept have a logo, they don't keep you warm.

--
Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
They had backwards compatibility by Prien715 · 2009-08-18 08:31 · Score: 2, Interesting

Sony is retarded for removing backwards compatibility. It's the only one of the 3 consoles where the developer got the bright idea to remove features.
I bought a PS3 last year since I wanted to play Metal Gear, but I also wanted to get rid of my PS2 (DDR is still played on occasion).
You can still find them on Craiglist/etc. Be sure to look for the 60 GB one as it's the only one that has it in hardware.
(But it's not as good as Nintendo's. You have to buy a memory card converter to actually get save games on it and buy another peripheral if you want to use you Guitar Hero instruments on it (is there another way to play the GH1 track?). But the play itself is solid/perfect as far as I can tell.)

--
-- Political fascism requires a Fuhrer.
1. Re:They had backwards compatibility by DinDaddy · 2009-08-18 10:31 · Score: 1
  
  The 20 GB US launch model had it as well. It was missing card readers and wifi, but it had everything else the 60GB had.
2. Re:They had backwards compatibility by ookaze · 2009-08-18 23:45 · Score: 1
  
  Sony is retarded for removing backwards compatibility. It's the only one of the 3 consoles where the developer got the bright idea to remove features.
  Do you realize that they were forced to do that because they were bleeding too much money?
  I understand your anger but that was not a retarded decision at all for them.
  They bled billions of dollars despite this cost reduction.
Re:Are we still expected to pay $0.30 for Home sho by gEvil+(beta) · 2009-08-18 08:32 · Score: 1

True enough. But I'm sure you've heard kids in the store going "But Mom, that one doesn't have a big Nike swoosh on it."

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This guy's the limit!
Re:Whoa! by geekoid · 2009-08-18 08:38 · Score: 1

What limitations are there on playing content from your computer?

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The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
Re:Whoa! by Enderandrew · 2009-08-18 08:42 · Score: 1

Just certain codecs, but it is a pretty liberal list.

--
http://blindscribblings.com - Tasty pop-culture in conceptual fashion.
Re:An even better model by hansamurai · 2009-08-18 08:42 · Score: 1

Too bad Greenpeace didn't consider those when they named Nintendo such a non-green company.
For what it's worth, many RROD's 360's can be repaired by Microsoft or even through hardhack methods. I don't know Greenpeace's method of calculation, but I suppose even if they can fix them, shipping all these broken 360's back and forth doesn't help.

--
Reviewing just the first hour of video games.
Re:Are we still expected to pay $0.30 for Home sho by geekoid · 2009-08-18 08:42 · Score: 3, Interesting

I agree. What I think they should do is offer those items as accomplishments for in game goals, and have a place to shoe them off. Use the peple desire to collect and show off stuff to sell games.
Shocking, I know.

--
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
Re:Needs an Infrared Port by tlhIngan · 2009-08-18 08:43 · Score: 1

It would be nice if they would have included an infrared port for universal remotes. The PS3 is reportedly the best Blu-Ray player, but it is hard to integrate into many people's home theaters because of the RF remote.
Yeah, unfortunately they didn't. My PS3 is almost exclusively used for Blu-Ray movies (most games I purchase for my Xbox360 - if Sony would allow developers to use the machine to the fullest rather than parcel out power over the years...)
However, there are options.
If you own a Harmony remote, the Logitech PS3 adapter is the best and cheapest option. And if you have a home theatre, you probably ought to pick up a Harmony.
But then again, if you have a Pronto or other such thing, you probably can find the remote codes for the PS3 adapter as well. If not, you have the IR2BT Tci, a pricey $150 adapter that supports basically whole system integration with its built-in RS-232 port and such. Cheaper option is the PS3toothfairy, which at $55 looks cheap, but you also need to spend $20 on a PS3 remote and install it (it fakes the PS3 button pad).
Re:Are we still expected to pay $0.30 for Home sho by geekoid · 2009-08-18 08:43 · Score: 1

Who said there was a [problem? what is it with you people who pull out this bullshit when people are just discussing what they don't like about a game?
Ironic, considering your sig.

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The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
Re:Pics of the new hardware by geekoid · 2009-08-18 08:45 · Score: 1

"Worlds greatest gaming system"
Based on what? certianly not sales.

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The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
Full Story? by atari2600 · 2009-08-18 08:48 · Score: 1

Here's a rumor posted on the PSN boards: http://boardsus.playstation.com/playstation/board/message?message.uid=42798489 I said rumor but the post raises some questions that no one has addressed so far:

- "OtherOS" support has been removed.
- A Cheaper Blu-ray drive is being used. It wont be any slower, but expect to see similar issues that another competitor had a while ago.
- Touch-sensitive buttons on the front for power/eject are gone in favour of cheaper push buttons.

This makes the first batch of PS3s that came out, the "best" ones to own (backwards compatibility with PS2 games from having the full emotion engine on hardware, ability to swap in drives as big as 500GB and being able to install other OSes)
Re:An even better model by MaWeiTao · 2009-08-18 08:54 · Score: 1

That statistic of over 50% is so high that I find it hard to believe. Half of all units fail? What is even more shocking is that so many people remain loyal to the Xbox. I'm guessing it's that people feel they don't have a choice given they've already invested in the system owning several games, controllers and whatnot.
Actually, I was one of the 10.3% of PS3 owners with a failed unit. Having not touched the console for a few days I turn it on, the fan starts up, the LED flashes yellow, the console beeps a few times, and shuts down with a blinking red LED. It wouldn't run long enough for me to even eject the disc stuck inside. And the system sits in a fairly well ventilated location. When describing what happened to the representative I was told that the unit would be replaced. And that's what happened. The day they received the old unit the shipped out a new one.
The PS3 was only about 7 months old. So although Sony handled things reasonably well and fairly quick with the replacement this doesn't instill a whole lot of confidence in me that it wont happen again.
Coming from a history of PC gaming I had to laugh when first prompted to update some game and I was chagrined when I encountered my first crash. I do recall friends blowing into NES cartridges so that they'd boot up properly so I suppose it's nothing new.
Re:Wow by chrisG23 · 2009-08-18 08:59 · Score: 1

$300 is not low enough to get people to buy it, especially if people already have PS3s.
Umm..... are you and I in different consumer planes of existence? If I had a PS3 why would I be purchasing a PS3 for myself? To be the cool guy with the slimline version? No thank you, I will pass. If you meant people that already have Xbox360s then your comment makes more sense, to me.
Re:Needs an Infrared Port by PRMan · 2009-08-18 08:59 · Score: 2, Interesting

http://www.schmartstuff.com/sony-ps3-ir-upgrad.html
Just a satisfied customer.

--
Peter predicted that you would "deliberately forget" creation 2000 years ago...
Re:Too late... by petermgreen · 2009-08-18 09:11 · Score: 1

So use component for one of them. At HDTV resoloutions and refresh rates that should be more than sufficiant for a good picture.

--
note: i'm known as plugwash most places but i screwd up registering that here somehow in the past and now can't register
Things People Actually Want: by denzacar · 2009-08-18 09:14 · Score: 1

A mod-chip.*

*I've said this earlier couple of posts above and got modded down. Not exactly sure why. Honest to god - I am not buying it unless I can play "backuped" games on it. And by backup, I mean download from the internet. And by downloaded from the internet, I mean bought from the local shop that does the downloading and sells it to people who own the particular console. That is how it goes here in Bosnia. $300 is still almost an entire average monthly pay. With import and Value Added Taxes + seller's profit margin it is way over that. Almost two average paychecks. $90 (price+tax+profit) for a GAME? There is a market for about 300 of those here. And about as many non-modded PS3s. On the other hand, there is a market for tens of thousands of modded PS3s, hundreds of thousands of controllers and various spare parts.

--
Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens
Re:SLIM is a good name... by kramerd · 2009-08-18 09:29 · Score: 1

to describe their probable sales volume. There's very little there in terms of improvements for PS3 owners. For those of us who bailed on PSx line after #2 I don't see anything enticing enough in terms of new features to make me consider purchasing a ps3 slim.
Except for the price drop, from 399 for an 80GB to 299 for a 120GB HD...even if you also buy a PS2 for BC, then its still a bigger hard drive for a (total) lower price.
Re:Are we still expected to pay $0.30 for Home sho by hibiki_r · 2009-08-18 09:33 · Score: 1

I get it, they are making a sanitized version of Second Life! Brilliant!
Re:Whoa! by gbarules2999 · 2009-08-18 09:39 · Score: 1

We're not talking value here. I'm a poor college student that doesn't have $300 to spend on a game console. I might be able to scrounge together $200 for a 360.

Why was I modded troll? I suppose most people wouldn't have guessed, but I'm holding out for a PS3. It's a better machine. I just cannot buy one right now.
Re:Are we still expected to pay $0.30 for Home sho by 222 · 2009-08-18 10:03 · Score: 1

First and foremost: I own a PS3, an Xbox 360, and a Wii. I love all of them.

My girlfriend loves my Xbox. She bought her own controller that she put stickers on. She's often the one bringing up the idea of playing video games or checking out 1 vs 100.
The draw? She LOVES her Xbox avatar. It seems like every time she comes over she's completely overhauling her outfit. She made an offhand comment about how dressing up her avatar replaces her need to go shopping. Me, on the other hand? I rarely change my avatar. I did give him a monocle a couple of weeks ago; its pretty awesome :- )

But yea, if this stuff doesn't apply to you, don't worry. It isn't meant to. It does, however, bring girlfriends closer to the gaming, which we can all agree is a good thing. Who knew we could learn so much from Nintendo?
To put it in other words:For the 1st time since'05 by D4C5CE · 2009-08-18 10:10 · Score: 1

...families all across the world can't just turn off the heating all winter through from Christmas day.

It will be 33 percent smaller, 36 percent lighter.
And hopefully no longer requiring new power plants for every quarter that has had a few of them under the trees.
On Sale at Amazon UK for 249 Quid by Busshy · 2009-08-18 10:12 · Score: 1

Amazon UK have put up a page with the new 120GB PS3 Slim at 249 Pounds Delivered, for the moment ill stick with my PS3 Brick :) Whos actually gonna buy one ?
Re:Are we still expected to pay $0.30 for Home sho by geekoid · 2009-08-18 10:32 · Score: 1

So it's an expensive doll house?

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The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
Remake by DinDaddy · 2009-08-18 10:40 · Score: 1

Slim?
Time to remake this then:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x7PhJp3ciRQ
three letters by geekoid · 2009-08-18 11:34 · Score: 1

LED

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The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
1. Re:three letters by lewiscr · 2009-08-18 11:59 · Score: 1
  
  LED doesn't help. It's still a fixed resolution display. Displaying 480 lines of resolution still won't look right when the display has 1080 lines.
  Technically, CRTs are fixed resolution too. But the phosphers are dense enough that it can display arbirtrary lower resolutions without looking like a bad downsample.
Wait a minute... by geekoid · 2009-08-18 11:36 · Score: 1

You can get HULU on your PS3? I thought they blocked it.

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The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
1. Re:Wait a minute... by CronoCloud · 2009-08-18 13:40 · Score: 1
  
  They're probably streaming HULU via PlayOn or another media server on their PC.
Not overseas by caitsith01 · 2009-08-18 11:36 · Score: 1

For mysterious reasons, Sony is slugging those of us in the EU and Australia an extra US$120 for the honour of buying their console.
When you do the maths based on the prices in each area then they work out at:
US: US$299
EU: US$422
AU: US$413
Converting to local currency, it should really be costing about AU$360 in Australia (not $499, as it will) and 211 euros in Europe (not 299 euros).
Sony, you've done it again!

--
Read Pynchon.
1. Re:Not overseas by Hadlock · 2009-08-18 13:12 · Score: 1
  
  USA! USA!
  
  --
  moox. for a new generation.
2. Re:Not overseas by VGPowerlord · 2009-08-18 19:32 · Score: 1
  
  I could understand why Microsoft would price stuff like that (US being MS's home market, it can get them here cheaper), but since Sony is a Japanese company...
  Maybe it's because the US economy sucks and no one can afford expensive things here. Either that or they're trying to undercut the Xbox 360 Pro/Elite model or something.
  
  --
  GLaDOS for President 2016! "Well here we are again. It's always such a pleasure." -- GLaDOS, 2011
3. Re:Not overseas by donaldm · 2009-08-18 22:05 · Score: 1
  
  For mysterious reasons, Sony is slugging those of us in the EU and Australia an extra US$120 for the honour of buying their console.
  I suppose you have not looked at what the Xbox360 and Wii costs in Australia. Hint, they all do it. :)
  
  I actually brought my BC PS3 from "Game" for the equivalent of US$400 (retail at the time was over US$800) over two years ago including trading my old "fat" PS2 and 10 games. I have never regretted doing this.
  
  While I am on a roll here have you looked at the price of Games in Australia compared to the US? It actually is cheaper to import a game, in fact it is sometimes better especially since our "nanny state" minded politicians have deemed that R18 classifications for so called adult games will hurt our "young adults" and may be used by under aged gamers. That however is a rant for another day.
  
  Actually PS3 and Xbox360 games do have a tendency to drop dramatically in price (usually by 50% to 60%) after about six months but with the exception of shovel-ware most so called AAA games on the Wii have kept nearly the same price even after two years.
  
  --
  There ain't no such thing as proprietary standards only proprietary formats. Standards are by definition open.
Misc. Reactions by Gunslinger47 · 2009-08-18 11:48 · Score: 1

PS3 Slim - Only two USB ports. I guess you'll need to pick up a USB splitter if you want to play Rock Band. - Still can't stack it. I guess you probably shouldn't anyway, but it's required for some setups. I've seen more than one PS3 perched atop a 360. - I never owned a PS2 of my own, so I'm one of the people who really miss the full, hardware backward compatibility. Price Cut - The price cut has made me reconsider buying a PS3. It was always too expensive for me to justify considering how few quality exclusives it had. At least one of those issues has been resolved. - Why do the hard drives keep getting bigger? Some models had only 20 GB to begin with. It seems that anything less than 120 GB models will be discontinued soon. Home Improvement - ... - Well, at least Trophies are viewable by your friends through your profile now. Yay Sony.
1. Re:Misc. Reactions by Anonymous+McCartneyf · 2009-08-29 06:03 · Score: 1
  
  You think those in charge of The Beatles: Rock Band were aware of this reconfigure? The fullest standard pre-packaged kit comes with just a ("Hofner") bass, a drumkit, and a mike. Since the new PS3 still has Bluetooth, that probably meshes with the number of controller ports on slimlines exactly...
  It will put a crimp in full bands, though. It won't be fun for people who want Rickenbackers and Gretsches.
  Good thing they aren't stopping production of the fat models immediately, then. It's tough enough that this and similar killer apps are also available for Xboxen; I haven't checked close, but I don't think Microsoft is changing how many controllers its new XBox takes. (Microsoft is savvy in the strangest ways.)
  
  --
  There is a fine line between recklessness and courage... -- Paul McCartney
Re:PS2 Still Selling Well Because.... by rubies · 2009-08-18 11:49 · Score: 1

Not to mention Free McBoot and Simple Media System - being able to play all of your standard def media in the bedroom over the network on a PS2 is very neat.
Re:Whoa! by geekoid · 2009-08-18 11:53 · Score: 1

First off:
"We all reel in shock and awe. We totally did not see that one coming, did we?"
That reads like a troll.
Secondly:
"The rpice is still a hundred bucks too high for my taste, but it's a step."
You should ahve said :
"The price is still a hundred bucks too high for my budget, but it's a step."
Taste implies it doesn't have the value for you... or you pay people to lick things.

--
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
Re:An even better model by geekoid · 2009-08-18 11:55 · Score: 1

Yes it is..in fact a friend of mine had something happen to his second uncles roommates friends that says anecdotes are evidence.

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The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
Re:Whoa! by Enderandrew · 2009-08-18 12:15 · Score: 1

Sony is offering a deal where you can get $100 off a PS3 is you apply for the Playstation credit card. When I did it, I got $150 off. It isn't a mail in rebate or anything. They instantly reduce the price of the console by applying for, and purchasing with the new Playstation card.
If they keep the promotion with the new discounted price tomorrow, then you can have a PS3 for $199.

--
http://blindscribblings.com - Tasty pop-culture in conceptual fashion.
Re:Whoa! by GuyRiley · 2009-08-18 13:05 · Score: 1

I'm going to join the many here in announcing that I would be ready to buy if they included PS2 backward compatibility in that $300 package. Some of the greatest games ever made were for PS2 (Final Fantasy X)

I don't have the room to keep every generation of each console around. When I can play my old games upscaled to HD with wireless controllers will be when the PS3 replaces my old fat PS2 next to the 360.
Re:Are we still expected to pay $0.30 for Home sho by CronoCloud · 2009-08-18 14:12 · Score: 1

Pretty much. It looks amazingly like a graphically souped up SL with fixed content. Why they didn't just get Linden Lab to do a client for the PS3 is beyond me, or get the source and do it themselves
Re:Are we still expected to pay $0.30 for Home sho by CronoCloud · 2009-08-18 14:16 · Score: 1

The problem is, there isn't enough pretty stuff for female avatars in Home, especially if you're used to having all sorts of stuff in something like Second Life or the Sims. I've got tons of pretty hair, clothes, shoes, and skin (essentially makeup) for my SL avatar, but the choices in Home are less than inspiring.
Re:Whoa! by Grieviant · 2009-08-18 14:33 · Score: 1

True, and I know a few people don't play games but have purchased a PS3 for that very reason (media streaming and Blueray).
According to the (limited) sources I've been able to find, they're apparently still losing money on each console sale though. Probably more with this price drop, unless 45nm saves them a pile.
Re:SLIM is a good name... by CronoCloud · 2009-08-18 14:36 · Score: 1

Quick caveat, I have the older CECHE01 model.
And it's an upscaling DVD player. It also plays CD's and SACD's, rips them too, to AAC, MP3 or ATRAC. Plays MP3, AAC, WMA, or ATRAC files on the hard drive or external storage, same goes for pictures and video.
It has a built in web browser. Sure, it's a crappy Netfront, but it gets the job done. If you want something better there's always:
Linux. NetHack on your TV.
It runs PS2 and PS1 games, upscales them too.
Re:Whoa! by gbarules2999 · 2009-08-18 15:19 · Score: 1

I'm unable to find this deal; I believe it expired already. If you can track it down and find the link you used, that would make a poor gamer very happy indeed.
Re:Whoa! by gbarules2999 · 2009-08-18 15:20 · Score: 1

Are you saying that you DIDN'T see the PS3 Slim coming? I don't care if it "reads like a troll" (what the hell does that mean, anway?) - it's truth. This thing was rumored and pretty much validated several times over. I don't know why that earns a Troll mod.

Though I did spell "price" wrong, yes.
Re:An even better model by Gizzmonic · 2009-08-18 16:16 · Score: 1

Yep, out of 15 ppl I know with 360, 13 have had RRoD. Most of them have had it multiple times. One of my friends who bought at launch has gone through 4.

--
(-1, Raw and Uncut is the only way to read)
Sell it while you can by kulawend · 2009-08-18 20:29 · Score: 1

I totally seen this coming and a month ago I sold my PS3 so that I would not loose money when the old PS3's drop in value.
Re:An even better model by donaldm · 2009-08-18 22:22 · Score: 1

The failure rates were published on joystiq a couple of days ago: http://www.joystiq.com/2009/08/17/game-informer-xbox-360-at-54-2-
If you read the article they surveyed 5000 people although they did not say what was the breakup of the number of PS3, Xbox360 and Wii owners surveyed. Assuming say approx 1,600 per console (3 way equal split) that is not a very good population statistically speaking. I wonder what their demographic (geographical, console age ... etc) and confidence factor were and how did they actually extrapolate the results? Sounds like poor statical analysis techniques, still if you get more readers then I suppose they have done their job. Too bad that these results will be quoted verbatim as "truth" by other bloggers with an axe to grind.

--
There ain't no such thing as proprietary standards only proprietary formats. Standards are by definition open.
Re:An even better model by Filip22012005 · 2009-08-18 23:14 · Score: 1

A sample size of 1,600 should be more than enough*. What may be a bigger concern is how the sample was constructed. I'm not sure on what grounds you think the analysis is done poorly. You write about things they may have done wrong, but is there any evidence either way?
* What I did was calculate the confidence interval with sample size 1,600, an observed frequency of 54% and a confidence level of 99%. The population failure is expected to be within 51 and 57%. My statistics-fu is rusty though.

--
When the policeman of the tie, rule you violate, hello punishment of the kitty?
Re:If you're not fixated on playing at the TV set. by TheRaven64 · 2009-08-19 00:39 · Score: 1

Why does this exclude playing at the TV? That expensive graphics card almost certainly has DVI output and so will plug into an HDTV, and probably has s-video or composite output for an SD set. Add bluetooth peripherals and you can keep the PC in a cupboard.

--
I am TheRaven on Soylent News
Re:150 million Sony PS2s by geminidomino · 2009-08-19 01:31 · Score: 1

150 million PS2s have been sold worldwide. 120 million or so are waiting for the PS3 to drop in price down.
Read above. I was going to get a PS3, but they pulled out PS2 support a month before I was going to get one, with no price drop to compensate for the loss of the "killer feature" (fuck blu-ray). Two years later they're finally dropping the price? Day late and dollar short.
Don't be so quick to assume fanboyism, or you end up looking like one("Tiny xbox fanboy niche", "piece of shit RRoDbox?" Yeah...) Sony fucked up.
Re:Whoa! by eison · 2009-08-19 03:19 · Score: 1

I wish the extra features weren't so frustrating. Built-in wireless disconnects a lot, and the streaming video player doesn't always resume where the disconnection was, so if you want to actually watch videos you basically have to go wired or copy them to the local the drive first, but good luck getting the copy to complete it will error out half way through and isn't smart enough to resume the partially complete copy. Web browser alternates between being incredibly slow and painful to load flash videos or just getting stuck and hanging and you have to power cycle the system.
It's so frustratingly close to perfect, that it's frustrating. But to do something like watch a flash video on your tv when your friends are over, you basically still need to hook up a laptop to do it quickly and reliably.

--
is competition good, or is duplication of effort bad?
Re:Whoa! by Enderandrew · 2009-08-19 04:32 · Score: 1

My wifi has never dropped. And the PS3 supports video bookmarks, so any video you're watching, it should resume at that spot. But wifi is always a little iffy.

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http://blindscribblings.com - Tasty pop-culture in conceptual fashion.
Re:Whoa! by Enderandrew · 2009-08-19 04:34 · Score: 1

http://www.sonyrewards.com/en/gateway/?offerlink=srnowps3

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http://blindscribblings.com - Tasty pop-culture in conceptual fashion.
Firmware upgrade with old ps/3 means losing linux? by B.Stolk · 2009-08-19 16:28 · Score: 1

Hi,
I have an old PS/3, with linux already installed.
If I upgrade my firmware to 3.0, will I lose my OtherOS feature on my old PS/3?
thx
Bram

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Will get one now... by Hasney · 2009-08-19 19:29 · Score: 1

But I'll wait for the old models to drop in price 2nd hand. My local shop currently has 60gbs with PS2 b/c for £250. Once they hit £200 it's mine.
Re:Whoa! by eison · 2009-08-20 15:49 · Score: 1

What wireless router do you use?

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is competition good, or is duplication of effort bad?
Re:Whoa! by Enderandrew · 2009-08-20 16:04 · Score: 1

D-Link DIR-655
http://www.dlink.com/products/?pid=530
The latest firmware update basically had an ad in it trying to sell me on a service, but other than that, I really love the router.
The only thing that would make the router better is if it were one of the WRT routers I could drop Linux on.

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http://blindscribblings.com - Tasty pop-culture in conceptual fashion.
120Hz is only good for video by lmnfrs · 2009-08-23 17:01 · Score: 1

I agree 120Hz is great since it's a common product of frame rates, but the interpolation of any "good system" can be bad for games. The interpolation introduces lag because it delays the picture display while creating the artificial frames. That's bad for any interactive situation, but what's really bad is that some of these TV's don't give you the option to disable it.
I recently overheard somebody trying different types of video cables for his Xbox360 because there was lag on his new LCD. He had no idea it was the new TV causing the problem. And how many salespeople are knowledgeable enough to warn people?
1. Re:120Hz is only good for video by pnewhook · 2009-08-24 04:17 · Score: 1
  
  The interpolation introduces lag because it delays the picture display while creating the artificial frames.
  So on a 1080p/60 source each frame is 16.7ms apart. Are you saying that you can tell when there is a 17ms lag on the video? I highly doubt that since a really good reaction time is about 10x that.
  Even on a 30 fps source, and you assume a really crappy tv that lags two frames behind to interpolate, you are still looking at about 65ms, but most interpolation lags are way smaller than that.
  
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  Tesla was a genius. Edison however was a overrated hack who liked to torture puppies.
2. Re:120Hz is only good for video by lmnfrs · 2009-08-28 02:11 · Score: 1
  
  I'm not familiar with the specifics, but the lag can be more than 17ms. I'm not too familiar with the source on consoles these days either, but I know 1080p is rare.. are they 60fps?
  Either way, a quick google of "hdtv lag" leads to some additional causes of delay.
  Considering some gamers, who know very little about technology, instantly notice lag when they try their new TV, whatever the delay is it's not quick enough.
3. Re:120Hz is only good for video by pnewhook · 2009-08-28 07:52 · Score: 1
  
  I'm not familiar with the specifics, but the lag can be more than 17ms. I'm not too familiar with the source on consoles these days either, but I know 1080p is rare.. are they 60fps?
  Now I do not doubt that some cheaper TVs or early HDTVs would have this problem, and would end up throwing out every second frame to do 30fps. I highly doubt any tv would display less than 30 though. If you read this link: http://hdtvlag.googlepages.com/ , those tests used s-video - there obviously has to be an additional delay as it takes the analog source from s-video and recreates the digital signal. Those tests did not use an HDMI which most hi-def users would actually use. He didn't characterize HDlag, he characterized the lag of upsampling from analog.
  However if you have a good quality HDTV, and use the HDMI inputs so its digital source to digital output, any delay would be barely perceptible if at all.
  
  --
  Tesla was a genius. Edison however was a overrated hack who liked to torture puppies.