Everquest Coming To the PS2

Boone^ writes "CNET's News.com is reporting that Sony is launching their online network with a bang as the most addictive, non-narcotic drug to ever grace a computer screen will now come to you in full NTSC quality courtesy of the PS2. Currently the release date for both the online network and "EverQuest Online Adventure" are TBA." The article points out part of the reason for introduction will be to drive sales of the Ps2 ethernet adaptor. Now, I haven't played since the Kunark expansion, but I'm hoping this version takes advantage of the Ps2's graphic capabilites, rather then what I've seen on EQ before.

Comments

mmm, Squaresoft

[Wingchild]

And thus Sony gaines the experience of running an MMORPG from the Playstation2, that they might pass it on to SquareSoft for Final Fantasy XI .. and the Lord looked upon it, and saw that it was good. ;)

Re:mmm, Squaresoft

[spyderbyte23]

...and the Lord looked upon it, and saw that it was good. ;)

That's one way of looking at it, but another way of looking at it is that now Sony intends to compete directly with Square. People play *one* of these things. They're just too time-consuming to do more than one. I bet Square is less than thrilled about this.

Re:mmm, Squaresoft

[yetiman]

With square supporting nintendo and the gamecube once again, maybe sony is realizing that they can't rely on third-party blockbusters alone to sell their systems.

Re:mmm, Squaresoft

[GeckoX]

Sony planning on competing with Squaresoft?
Square is like the butter on their bread, there's no competition involved, it's mutually beneficial.

Re:mmm, Squaresoft

[secolactico]

it's mutually beneficial

Didn't Sony buy Squaresoft after the went broke with the FF movie? If so, it's more than just mutually beneficial.

Re:mmm, Squaresoft

[Anonymous Coward]

They bought 19% of Square stock (as a result of Square practically begging them to).

Although they certainly are an independant company (they will probably be putting FFXI onto the GameCube), Sony has nothing to gain by trying to hurt thier success.

Re:mmm, Squaresoft

[synvekk]

Square isn't doing a great job of supporting the gamecube. FFXI can't even come out for the game cube due to the fact that there is no intent on having an ethernet adapter, or hard drive for the cube. Also I don't think that EQ can compete at all with FF. I played EQ for quite a while, and it's old news, the whole system is to slow. It takes forever to do anything in that game. Granted quite a few people still play it, more now that the graphics have been updated. However, I don't think you can really get more people to play it. and if you were going to play it would you really want to play it on a console rather than on your computer. I know my computer is faster, and much better than my PS2. Plus EQ sucks.

I think that the only reason that they are releasing it at all is so that when there ethernet adapter/hard drive comes out they want to have a game that will utalize it. No one would buy it if they didn't

Re:mmm, Squaresoft

[etrnl]

Do you even have a clue?

When DAoC came out, EQ had 300k+ subscribers. Now that DAoC's been out a while and people have played it, and EQ's released Shadows of Luclin, EQ is not at 420k+ subscribers.

EQ is still growing, and has actually made many changes to appease lower level characters. It's not the same game as it was two years ago.

It's still not perfect, but it's still head and foam above any other MMORPG out there, with no sign of any coming rival.

DAoC was the one people looked to to rattle Verant, and it seemed to be doing so... but then after a few months, a LOT of people left Camelot and came back to Norrath. DAoC did not hold people like EQ does, and for a MRC-based company... that's not good.

In the meantime, everything on the horizon is still horribly vapourware.

Well...

Outside of the next EQ expansion, Planes of Power.

[54 Cavalier] Jasmeralia Sorrowmist <The Companions> -- Tribunal Server

Hot Damn!

[dr_dank]

EQ PS2 features:
* Crazed loner mode cuts off upcoming broadband connectivity so you can be alone with the voices in your head

* New soundtrack by Ozzy Osbourne and Judas Priest

* Free Paxil to first 100 buyers

Suicide-blaming entertainment is now coming to a console near you!

Excellent News!

[ringbarer]

Let's hope we can get more PS2 owners to kill themselves!

Everquest on PS2

[GutBomb]

great. i will finally be able to get my wife off of the pc. but now i will never be able to watch tv :(

Re:Everquest on PS2

[Anonymous Coward]

You need a new wife, is she getting chubby too?

Think about the children!!!

[telstar]

Haven't we already concluded that Everquest leads to suicide? (link).
Surely this is a foolish move on Sony's part. Not only are they opening themselves up to potential legal action, but they're killing off their users!

Re:Think about the children!!!

[sdflkgfljdqshgjkqsfg]

hey, they say, it's a non-narcotic drug, they did'nt say anything about it being non-lethal...

Re:Think about the children!!!

[why-is-it]

Haven't we already concluded that Everquest leads to suicide? (link) [slashdot.org]. Surely this is a foolish move on Sony's part. Not only are they opening themselves up to potential legal action, but they're killing off their users!

So what? Phillip Morris has been killing their users for years! Sony is a mere Johnny-come-lately!

Re:Think about the children!!!

[telstar]

Maybe you missed the sarcasm...

Re:Think about the children!!!

[Oliver Wendell Jones]

No, no, no!

You have to learn to speak like a marketing person.

You don't say 'killing off our users'

You do say 'we're experiencing a reduction in dissatisfied users'.

Re:Think about the children!!!

[why-is-it]

Maybe you missed the sarcasm...

No, I got that - but maybe you missed the sarcasm in my reply...

Re:Think about the children!!!

[Programmer_In_Traini]

Ok, so someone committed suicide and it was related to EQ.

It was proved that the person was mentally instable. Let's just say he had a lower IQ than the average person and was socially rejected (IRL)

That, IMO, is an isolated case. *Most* EQ players have a more normal life with more normal behaviors and reactions to social situations.

Alcool, Drugs, Speed, Gaming, Sex, Violence, they all cause dependance at one point or another. Everybody has a different level of tolerance for each of these dependance (exception made for violence).

How many suicides are related to gaming ?? A WHOLE DAMN LOT if you ask me if gaming includes gambling. It *is* gaming after all.

Gambling provides some sort of shelter for the financially unstable people.
EQ (or Asheron's Call for that matter) provides a social shelter for socially rejected people. If that shelter crumbles, so does your stability.

IMO, the only reason why people are on a EQ boycott spree is because the mother of the child made it public.

Anyone can tell that, to a mentally unstable person, anything can get deadly, even a computer game.

Just a thought :)

Re:Think about the children!!!

[telstar]

No, maybe you ... this won't end, will it? :)

Re:Think about the children!!!

[Jnxer]

my thoughts exactly, Programmer_In_Traini.

I personally reckon

[yatest5]

that these games that 'simulate' real life are a BIG waste of time. They kid people into believing that they are not losers because they can 'live a life' online when actually they're just killing time until they die.

There's nothing wrong with playing games per se, but I think that games where you do cool stuff you never usually do, like fly jet fighters, and games where you achieve something more than holding a text converstaion with another similar loser, are far superior.

When I heard of people getting 'married' in these games, I didn't know whether to laugh or cry.

Re:I personally reckon

[Blackwulf]

There's nothing wrong with playing games per se, but I think that games where you do cool stuff you never usually do, like fly jet fighters, and games where you achieve something more than holding a text converstaion with another similar loser, are far superior.

Please tell me where in "real life" I can go slay orcs and dragons, and cast really big pretty magic spells.

When I heard of people getting 'married' in these games, I didn't know whether to laugh or cry.

I guess being happy for someone actually enjoying themselves is not an option for you, huh. They gotta either enjoy it your way or be pitied by you, even if they're having fun.

Re:I personally reckon

[iainl]

"I ain't 'happy' about people pissing their lives away sat in their underpants online, no"

Care to explain exactly what productive life you want them to lead, rather than do what they enjoy without hurting you in any way whatsoever?

Or perhaps you should shut the fuck up before coming to SLASHDOT of all places and start spouting off about people wasting their time.

Re:I personally reckon

[linzeal]

Um, go to the place where the bumperstickers read "My goddess gave birth to your god" and "Christians; can't live with them can't throw them to the lions anymore" that reeks of cheap incense and clove cigarettes. There will be many books of wiccan and druidic wisdom for your as now mere mortal mind to wonder over as you begin the transformation into this.

Re:I personally reckon

[Anonymous Coward]

The 60% of the "marriages" in AO were roleplaying (since these ARE RPG's, and there really wasn't anything else to do in AO except RP), and then 40% were between people who are already married in real life.

Re:I personally reckon

[yatest5]

Or perhaps you should shut the fuck up before coming to SLASHDOT of all places and start spouting off about people wasting their time.

And perhaps you should try and learn to discuss things without spitting your dummy and getting abusive from the safety of your underpants.

Re:I personally reckon

[iainl]

Sorry, I've got karma to use up here. It is true that this is an entire site for time wasting, so forcing your opinion of whats a worthwhile leisure activity on others is more than a bit off.

After all, its not like I've ever even played the game; maybe it really is this dull.

Re:I personally reckon

[Zathrus]

that these games that 'simulate' real life are a BIG waste of time

In no way, shape, or form does EQ, UO, AO, DAoC, etc. simulate "real life". They don't even vaguely attempt to.

They do vaguely attempt to simulate a fantasy world, but most of the nitty gritty stuff that makes life real is not simulated.

Talking to people online isn't simulated either. The fact that you seem to think so shows just how vapid and shallow you really are. There's a real person on the other end of those pixels, who has feelings, thoughts, and motivations just like you do. And therein lies the rub, and the reason why EQ and other MMORPGs have a following that eclipses pretty much every other game out there. Because not only do they allow you to "do cool stuff you never usually do", but they allow you to make friends, chat, and have the social interaction that is lacking in most other games.

Yes, yes, scoff if you want at the concept of social interaction. Then realize that /. itself is another form of that as long as you're a poster (gee, look, you are - and a rather prolific one as well). Social interaction hasn't been limited to face-to-face meetings ever since the invention of writing. The Internet, in all its varied forms, is just another version thereof.

If you haven't played an MORPG (which includes MUDs) then you won't Get It. Quake and the like aren't the same - the little interaction there is mostly trash talk. IRC, Instant Messanging, and so forth are pretty similar to MORPG's though. All of them allow the intellectual excercise of talking to an intelligent being that is not yourself, and who may agree or disagree with your goals, thoughts, yada yada yada. Yeah, I know, seems all mystic-y and crap, but that's a lot of what human interaction comes down to.

Why do "losers" (your term, not mine) gravitate toward online interaction? Because for introverted personalities (which most geeks are), it's easier to hide behind a persona than it is to go out in real life. It's a matter of comfort and of being able to distance yourself. And to lower those facades at a speed you feel comfortable with (and yes, they do come down as you get to know people better).

All of the crap that occurs in face-to-face interaction - bickering, rumormongering, petty feuds, etc. happen online as well. All of the good stuff - friendships, loves, happiness, etc. can happen as well.

When I heard of people getting 'married' in these games, I didn't know whether to laugh or cry.

Shrug. I've always thought these things were rather silly myself. Most of the real life couples I know who are married aren't married "in-game". Probably because it's assumed they're married.

And I know people who gotten married to people they met online. Most of them don't have "in-game" marraiges either. I don't.

Re:I personally reckon

[Mordaximus]

Please tell me where in "real life" I can go slay orcs and dragons, and cast really big pretty magic spells.

Sounds like a commercial for the army.

When I heard of people getting 'married' in these games, I didn't know whether to laugh or cry.

Funny that: When I heard "I really like that ring" in real life, I had the same reaction.

Re:I personally reckon

[jzilla]

Which is worse people wasting their time having fun or people wasting their time complaining about how others waste thier time.

Re:I personally reckon

[Anonymous Coward]

This is just another situation akin to the online relationships. Some people just "work" that way and it is very fulfilling for them while for others there are other things that trip their trigger. Who are you to judge another person's happiness?

If you prefer something else, go out and *do* something else, there's no need for you to give a crap much less pity those who prefer other things. This has nothing to do with the play value of the game, nor do game players expect that their recreational time will define their existence as seems to be anticipated by those who go up in arms about online interaction.

Re:I personally reckon

[Anonymous Coward]

doh, i thought i was playing to win?

Re:I personally reckon

[flatrock]

These games are entertainment. Do you know people who join softball teams and go out and socialize while they play. Or people who go out bowling together, or pick some other hobby. These games are just another hobby that allows people to interact socially with other people.

These games is much more diverse than bowling, or softball. On the other hand you get a lot less exercise playing the game. You also don't get face to face interaction. The lack of face to face interaction has it's benefits and drawbacks.

There's nothing wrong with playing games per se, but I think that games where you do cool stuff you never usually do, like fly jet fighters, and games where you achieve something more than holding a text converstaion with another similar loser, are far superior.

What do you actually achieve in a game where you fly a jet fighter? Both games are entertainment. You do a lot more than hold text conversations with the other players, but it's the interaction with the other players that makes the game unique. Usually, meeting other people is a positive experience, other times, it's not. But it does keep the game interesting.

When I heard of people getting 'married' in these games, I didn't know whether to laugh or cry.

I guess do whichever you like. I play Asheron's Call, and the in game weddings have been broken for as long as I've played. They apparently just got fixed today. Most people joke about the weddings. Some others take it more seriously, at least from a role playing perspective. Hundreds of thousands of people play these games. There is a tremendously diverse player base. You're idea of two losers chatting probably does exist among that diverse player base, but it's only a small representation.

Of course maybe I'm just one of those "losers" who likes holding text conversations with other "losers". Fine with me, I'm still having fun. :)

Re:I personally reckon

[duren686]

Please tell me where in "real life" I can go slay orcs and dragons, and cast really big pretty magic spells.

There are ways, but EQ's main selling point is that it's a non-narcotic alternative.

Re:I personally reckon

[Anonymous Coward]

Obviously, you've never played Operation: Flashpoint.

Now, that's a online blast.

Re:I personally reckon

[Anonymous Coward]

I can't agree more, people who think they are doing something worth of their time with those games don't realize they are just wasting REAL life time.

ugh.

[HobbitGod42]

it bites on the PC (most PCs can't run it at full graphics) it will bite on the ps2. I am not even going comment on the type of game... cause its a matter of opinion. personally I think they should work on making the PC version work before going on to a new version.

Memory limitations

[parliboy]

I'm confused. I had thought that one of the big problems with all the UQ expansions is all of the RAM needed for all of the new stuff, and all of the possible combinations of character/items that it has to worry about displaying. Doesn't the PS2 have, like, 8 Meg? How is this going to happen in anything but a stripped down version?

Re:Memory limitations

[HobbitGod42]

the only way they can get it to run is by making every texture white... I can run quake 3 at 2048x1536 at 600 FPS IF I turn all textures off. course I can't see anything... and my monitor don't support it... but its possible. also what happens when a patch comes out? if you don't have the HD you are fubared and can't play. unless they make a new game which won't need patching. Ah that'll be the day...

Re:Memory limitations

[FurryFeet]

Easy.
They don't run on Windows.
And this is NOT a troll. Consoles do need less memory to run games because of the more efficient OS. Check out the minimum PC specs on GTA2, and then consider that GTA3 runs on a PS2.

Re:Memory limitations

[Chester K]

How is this going to happen in anything but a stripped down version?

The PS2 version of EQ will not be connected to the PC version of EQ in any way other than name and background fiction.

It's a completely seperate game that happens to have the same style of gameplay.

Re:Memory limitations

[acoustix]

Actually I think the PS2 has 32MB of RDRAM for system memory. Does anyone else know for sure?

Re:Memory limitations

[CaseyB]

Total BS. While you save the upfront cost of loading the OS, the choice of OS does not affect the amount of memory required to store texture, model, and world data, which is the bottleneck for EQ.

Re:Memory limitations

[DireWolf109]

32MB, for sure, plus another 8Mb on the graphics chip.

Re:Memory limitations

[hrieke]

Well, this is how I would think it would work, FWIW.

The game is on a DVD disc, which has upto 18bg of storage, so the game could in effect track which textures needed for the onscreen action, and which models are needed as well. Figure an array for a few hundred items for that.
From there the images can be streamed off of the DVD as needed and stored in memory.

Re:Memory limitations

[stripes]

Total BS. While you save the upfront cost of loading the OS, the choice of OS does not affect the amount of memory required to store texture, model, and world data, which is the bottleneck for EQ.

That's true, but the OS also has drivers for all sorts of stuff resident, daemons, and in the case of windows spyware and the like. I could see needing 32M less RAM on a console. (And I remember when 4M was a lot of RAM for a Unix machine...)

Re:Memory limitations

[DapperDan]

The PS2 has 32MB of dual channel PC800 RDRAM (main) and 4MB eDRAM (video).

http://www.anandtech.com/showdoc.html?i=1561&p=1 4

Re:Memory limitations

[SydShamino]

I could see needing 32M less RAM on a console.

Well, since EQ needs 640 MB to run well now, I guess that means your PS2 needs, well, 608 MB.

Re:Memory limitations

[stripes]

Well, since EQ needs 640 MB to run well now, I guess that means your PS2 needs, well, 608 MB.

I guess that explains the streamlining....

Re:Memory limitations

[Anonymous Coward]

Less "more efficient OS" and more "designed for gaming." PCs are designed for general purpose computing. PS2 is not. The architecture is quite different.

Besides, does the PS2 actually run an operating system? I bet if you converted Everquest(PC) to use only BIOS calls, you could get some seriously high framerates ;)

Re:Memory limitations

[NeMon'ess]

*Ding!* You are correct. Also, the Dreamcast has 8MB RAM for graphics, plus texture compression in hardware from S3. However the Dreamcast only has 16MB RAM total, or maybe it was 24MB total. Anyway, Dreamcast beat the pants of the PS2 in that respect.

Re:Memory limitations

[flatrock]

Besides, does the PS2 actually run an operating system?

The definition of an Operation System is pretty nebulous. The PS2 runs something that can be considered an OS, that OS just isn't very complex, and is doesn't have many of the features of a general purpose OS you would run on a PC.

Re:Memory limitations

[flatrock]

There's also DIrectX libraries, and all kinds of OS code that is loaded, but in the end Everquest eats memory because of huge textures. I don't know how they're going to get around that for the PS2. It should be interesting to see what the end product looks like.

Re:Memory limitations

[screwballicus]

Consoles do need less memory to run games because of the more efficient OS.

But console graphics chips are in more or less the same boat as PC graphics chips. And, as far as memory issues, we're probably first and foremost talking about textures there. A 5K texture is 5K texture whether or not you're running a 'more efficient OS'. The only case in which a 5K texture is not a 5K texture is when it's subject to compression. Proprietary texture compression schemes will certainly help but, if I recall correctly, the PS2 has no hardware texture compression whatsoever. This makes it worse than pretty much every other chipset on the market for the purpose of economising on memory. Furthermore, I read correctly that the PS2 has 4MB of VRAM, right? I'm assuming half of that has to be framebuffer. So does the PS2 actually have no more texture memory than my Diamond Monster 3D (circa 1996)?

I upgraded from my Geforce and 256MBs of DDR RAM because Dark Age of Camelot came to a halt in any sort of relatively busy scene. Now, with 1GB of DDR and an ATI 8500, DAoC only slows down sometimes, in extremely busy scenes.

No matter how efficient your OS is, bringing an MMORPG that manages somehow to fill 64MB of video RAM and 1GB of system RAM (god only knows how) on a PC to a "more efficient OS" is not going to squeeze the same data into 4MB of video RAM and 32MB of System RAM.

Everquest is another story. Older technology, smaller textures and fewer polys. But the fact remains the same. There are some hardware shortcomings no OS could make up for.

Re:Memory limitations

[sahala]

Not sure if anyone else raised this possibility, but you can scale down the color depth and resolution of all the textures (since the display is NTSC anyway).

Re:Memory limitations

[enjo13]

You have to understand the PS2 architecture...

On the PC we are very bandwidth restricted when it comes to memory. The bus speeds on your typical X86 motherboard are generally rather slow and as a result a PC programmer constantly has to deal with this bottleneck. The solution has been (and still is) to basically read the data once and copy it into RAM, where it sits until its needed. Most games load up textures and geometry one "area" or "level" at a time into RAM and page it to the video card on demand. If you try to run things directly from storage, you will quickly choke the bus and things get rather ugly...(think virtual memory paging).

The PS2 on the other hand has a fairly robust bus system. The idea is that data is streamed from storage on demand, as opposed to simply dumping it in memory. You still need some memory to actually hold textures, but it is not uncommon for that memory to be refreshed every frame. It is possible to outrun the PS2 bus when basically every texture and every piece of geometry needs to change (this is the cause of the common "cut-scene slowdown" you see in some games)... As long as EQ's textures can fit into memory one frame at a time, things should go pretty well.. if you can't work in 8 megs (or whatever it has) of textures PER FRAME, you need to rethink your strategy.

This architecture can be difficult to get a handle on and requires a completely different approach to asset management... its also a large part of the reason that most programmers think the PS2 is hard to work with..

Nick

Re:Memory limitations

[Anonymous Coward]

Usually this is bypassed by compensating for a lack of texture detail by vastly increasing the geometry detail, which is a PS2 strength.

Re:Memory limitations

[byran lei]

>Total BS. While you save the upfront cost of loading the OS, the
>choice of OS does not affect the amount of memory required to store
>texture, model, and world data, which is the bottleneck for EQ.
>
>
You're full of bullshit. You're *NOT* dealing with an PC here. You clearly games on the PS2 don't make the kind of resource demands that their PC counterparts do. Would you even wager what kind of a PC you'll need to run a PC version of either Final Fantasty X or SSX Tricky as well as they do on the PS2?

Re:Memory limitations

[CaseyB]

You clearly [think] games on the PS2 don't make the kind of resource demands that their PC counterparts do.

They absolutely do not. No PS2 game has or ever will keep hundreds of megs of game data in memory. Everquest on a PC does exactly that.

The PS2 is great at what it does. What it does not do is manage very large amounts of data at one time. Console games are carefully designed never to do that.

Re:Memory limitations

[teapot]

It is possible to stream data directly from the DVD-Drive, because it doesn't issue silly IRQs or other sillyness.
Keeping hundreds of megs of data in memory is just lazyness; the processor is not going to use all that data for each frame, or even each minute. Lazyness, because you can use virtual memory instead of doing your own cacher :>
But, yeah, PS2 games have kept hundreds of megs of game data in memory: READ ONLY MEMORY! (Sorry!)

And large amounts of data is exactly what the ps2 is good at; especially generating it.

Lacking in the research once again...

[Bonkers54]

EQ now takes full advantage of modern 3D capabilities. The new Shadows of Luclin expansion has turned EQ into a game with lots of eyecandy all using the newest of 3D hardware. /. misses the obvious again.

Re:Lacking in the research once again...

[John Harrison]

/. misses the obvious again.

I think that what is obvious is that you were trolled by Hemos. Good job editors!

Re:Lacking in the research once again...

[Demonspawn]

Have you played EQ since the SoL expansion? It turns EQ into the exact same game with the exact same models you used before (cuz you turned off all the new ones) but with still more video lag!

I could comment more on the game, but I'll pass right now.

--Demonspawn

Re:Lacking in the research once again...

[Anonymous Coward]

Hey, I have 512 MB or RAM, dual Athlon MP 1500+ and a GeForce 3. I have all the textures turned on and it's only as choppy as Kunark was on my AMD 700 with 256 MB and a GeForce 2. Wait, now that I think about it, I blew my old system out of the water for specs and....uh oh...

Ads blocking the story

[EyesWideOpen]

I know this is highly off topic but I'm not sure where else to put this. I was in the process of reading the story The Handspring Treo In Real Life when I discovered that part of the story text is blocked by the ad when the browser isn't maximized.

I don't maximize my browser here at work because I need to be able to switch back and forth quickly if need be (I think you know why!) so it's an annoying side effect of already annoying on page ads.

Re:Ads blocking the story

[Schnapple]

All the more incentive to buy a subscription...

Geeks and Dork

[photon317]

I know a lot of hardcore Geeks think only Dorks play these kinds of games, but they really have value and you should check them out. To me EverQuest is an evolutionary step towards what VR environments will be like in the future. I first started thinking that about the Doom/Quake series, but EverQuest took it to a whole new level, albeit in a different genre. The immersiveness is amazing, just don't get hooked on the social crap there.

Re:Geeks and Dork

[Anonymous Coward]

Not to sound like a queer or nothing, but unicorns are kick ass!

Re:Geeks and Dork

[Binky The Oracle]

I expressed the same thought in a recent /. story on EQ. These games are a great proof of concept for virtual meeting/social spaces. Throw in some advances in voice/video over IP and a bunch more bandwidth, and the future is promising for telepresence.

Re:Geeks and Dork

[mashton]

"... just don't get hooked on the social crap there."

Yah, if you get hooked on social crap you might not be a Geek or Dork anymore.

Re:Geeks and Dork

[Anonymous Coward]

Yeah, you could graduate to Lord Geek Blith'an or Minthlorin, King of All Dorks.

Re:Geeks and Dork

[photon317]

Yeah, the social scene in these games is nothing short of pathetic. To participate in it actively would be the ultimate ascension to dorkdom.

Government oversight is needed

[Anonymous Coward]

Everquest was bad enough on small, VGA-quality monitors with tinny speakers and uncomfortable office chairs. But if Sony is allowed to introduce it into America's living rooms, where it can be experienced on 50-inch TV screens with full Dolby Digital and a comfortable La-Z Boy recliner, we may lose an entire generation of our youth. They will become mindless drooling zombies that only leave the house to get more Jolt and Cheez Balls. As a result we may lose the war on terrorism. Therefore I think the government needs to examine this very carefully before such a release is allowed.

thank you

Re:Government oversight is needed

[Anonymous Coward]

Can't lose the war when we become an isolantionist nation thanks to this game ;) Mos terrorists just want us occupied with something else. AL-Qaeda cell in Sony R&D perhaps?

*twitch*

[Kredal]

Great, now I have to buy a PS2 and broadband adapter thingy, and keyboard/mouse, all to get a worse quality crack than I have right now in my computer...

But ya know, I'll do it cause I'm an addict.

*sigh*

Streamlining=Different Game

[TheNecromancer]

"It's going to work in a similar manner (to the PC game,) but its very much a streamlined interface and to a degree streamlined game play," he said. "We're making sure it's very easy to get into it and start doing things quickly."

IMO, this will cause the PS2 version to be different enough from the PC version so that it won't be as successful. Add to the fact that you will need a bunch of peripherals to chat for the game (can you say 'expensive'?), and this will drive away all but the really hardcore Everquest gamers.

Re:Streamlining=Different Game

[DireWolf109]

Why expensive? You just need a USB keyboard (notice the two USB ports on the front of the PS2?), and they're what, £8?

Re:Streamlining=Different Game

[Anonymous Coward]

Eight pounds? Man, that's a heavy keyboard!

*rim shot*

Re:Streamlining=Different Game

[iamcadaver]

MO, this will cause the PS2 version to be different enough from the PC version so that it won't be as successful. Add to the fact that you will need a bunch of peripherals to chat for the game (can you say 'expensive'?), and this will drive away all but the really hardcore Everquest gamers.

Obviously, this person has never EXPERIENCED EverCrack. I sat stunned reading this story on the front page a few times. I fear EQ, quit two years ago. I honestly can't decide if it was easier or harder than smoking.

I can say that both had to be quit at the same time, EQ's time-dependency makes you smoke packs a day....

I hope they do bridge the game to the PC worlds. Why wouldn't they? The last EQ expansion was the first that the majority of players didn't rush to buy. I'd say make a snapshot of the current expansion sets, and link the PS2 and PC versions here and now....

What am I doing, damn EQ, it's taking up my time AGAIN just thinking about it now.
Want to know how addictive EQ can be? Check out NeverSleep.

Capitalism at it's best. Maybe VirtualWorld Services will offset the RealWorld damages... Remember the article that the _average_ EQ players spends more time playing than working.

Other great statistics here.

Re:Streamlining=Different Game

[Mattsson]

Well... It'll be perfect for everyone who's bought the ps2-linux. :o)

You've got ethernet.

You've got keyboard.

You've got mouse.

All you need is the EQ gamedisc.

Multi platform world, ya think?

[dmorin]

I remember when The Sims guy (I think) did an interview where he said that doing multiplayer online worlds across platforms like Win/Linux was incredibly difficult, verging on impossible, due to the tremendously minute detail required in keeping everything in sync. I wonder if this problem appears here as well.

In other words, will PS2 users play in the same world as PC users?

Re:Multi platform world, ya think?

[iainl]

"its very much a streamlined interface and to a degree streamlined game play"

Streamlined Gameplay says a different version to me. Apart from anything, the PS2 has a mere 4Mb of graphics memory (64Mb total if memory serves), so the 512Mb +32Mb graphics min-spec of Shadows of Luclin would send the poor thing crying home to the PSOne.

Re:Multi platform world, ya think?

[mirkurius]

You can bet your bottom dollar that the console online community will be distinctly different from the PC online community, and nary the two shall meet... There are many good reasons for this, including technical, financial, and demographic ones.

Re:Multi platform world, ya think?

[Kredal]

No, the time in the PS2 game is 500 years before the PC game. There won't be any interaction between characters from the two versions of the game.

Hopefully, playing the PS2 version will give people some insight into the history of Norrath... That right there is a great reason to play for some of us.

Re:Multi platform world, ya think?

[Anonymous Coward]

Hey, news flash - there is no history. It's not real.

I can't wait until you kill yourself and your momma tries to sue Sony.

Re:Multi platform world, ya think?

[GeckoX]

True if the PS2's architecture was comparable to a pc, but it's not, it's a totally different beast. It doesn't need as much raw graphics memory.

In a nutshell, PC's need huge amounts of memory to cache data since the pipes between components are tiny whereas the PS2 has _huge_ pipes so it can stream data constantly rather than caching data. This is also the core reason why the learning curve for developing on the PS2 is very big, totally different design philosophies. Developers have to forget all the tricks used in the past to surmount the inherant limitations of the PC's architecture and learn a whole new bag of tricks.

Re:Multi platform world, ya think?

[iainl]

Its true that (partly thanks to the work of Criterion etc) its getting a lot easier to code the PS2, the main memory you'll stream those graphics out of is still a lot less than the PC title is using. I'm actually glad that they are optimising for the intended platform anyway, rather than trying to shoehorn the original into the PS2 architecture.

Not that I will play it anyway, as I don't have broadband...

Re:Multi platform world, ya think?

[codexus]

I don't see any problem for an online world that works on Windows, Linux or Mac. If the game is correctly programmed and use abstraction layers that is easy. But in the case of the PS2, the platforms are very different and I don't the game is going to be exactly the same. And if the game is different, sharing the same world will be nearly impossible.

Re:Multi platform world, ya think?

[tubs]

Surely it all depends on what the client side does? If all you end up doing is sending character data, co-ordinates etc why should it be particularily difficult?

I know not in the same league, but MUDS have been working fine for years.

Re:Multi platform world, ya think?

[Anonymous Coward]

news flash, you're a cynical virgin... no one likes you.

i can't wait until you kill yourself...

Re:Multi platform world, ya think?

[sporty]

More-over, the question probably is, is it profitable to do all of this and "make it happen".

Re:Multi platform world, ya think?

[swillden]

EQ doesn't require broadband. It works okay on a 28.8 modem, and there is no difference in gameplay between, say, a 33.6 modem and a cable modem. A faster connection does help you transition between zones more quickly, but that's about it.

Re:Multi platform world, ya think?

[shren]

I remember when The Sims guy (I think) did an interview where he said that doing multiplayer online worlds across platforms like Win/Linux was incredibly difficult, verging on impossible, due to the tremendously minute detail required in keeping everything in sync. I wonder if this problem appears here as well.

Huh? This is one of the most vapid things I've seen rated to 5 in a long time. EQ isn't impossible on Windows, it's been done. The Sims guy is talking about having multiple people in a Sim-city, a fully dynamic enviornment, which EQ isn't in any way, shape, or form. EQ is entirely static geography, which makes it an entirely different case.

In other words, will PS2 users play in the same world as PC users?

What does that have to do with your first paragraph? The first discusses possibility issues and the second discusses porting issues. Huh?

Congratulations, you have successfully karma-whored by playing buzzword bingo.

Re:Multi platform world, ya think?

[Anonymous Coward]

YHBT. HAND!

Re:Multi platform world, ya think?

[WotanKhan]

EQ is strictly windows, not cross-platfrom Win/Linux. The poster, and his quote, are simply stating that the already difficult task of keeping MMORPG environments synchronized, would be magnified by forking the code-base to support different platforms. I think it quite likely that the PS/2 servers will be separate, and using a different version of the server code. Obvious perhaps, but hardly vapid.

Rereading things you don't understand is a good idea before you start flinging insults.

Re:Multi platform world, ya think?

[shren]

I understand quite well. Creating a new type of client doesn't have a significant effect on the data synchronization inside the server cluster, at least, it doesn't if Verant can program worth a damn.

Does anybody here have a clue anymore? Usenet servers don't have to be rewritten every time a new usenet client comes out. That's the point of the client/server split. UO had a linux client for a while, and you can bet for certain that the UO team didn't go out of thier way to support that server-side - and they didn't need to.

You finish with a good point, but I still don't see what the parent post, which is a mishmash of confused topics and miserable english, has to do with anything regarding this story...

Better graphics? Not likely.

[CaseyB]

I'm hoping this version takes advantage of the Ps2's graphic capabilites, rather then what I've seen on EQ before.

Very doubtful. While the PS2 chipset can drive a good framerate, the minimal memory and total absence of a hard drive would require stripping loads of detail from what you see on a PC. This engine is about a real *bulk* of data, not the small set of detailed models and textures in a typical console game.

Getting that sort of game, designed and optimized just for PCs, to run at all on the PS2 is going to be a real feat.

Re:Better graphics? Not likely.

[Ian Betteridge]

If I remember correctly, the broadband PS2 widgit includes a hard drive.

Re:Better graphics? Not likely.

[jmccay]

A lot of the graphics data could be kept on the CD. Most of it doesn't need to change because it's just graphics. If they do that, then you could see improved graphics quality.

Graphical MUD on Console?

[mirkurius]

EQ is a graphical MUD, a chat room with some role playing. It is not an action game, and a poor substitute for an adventure game. Streamline it for console? Hmmm... game is already mostly brain-dead... What makes it worthwhile is the human element provided by chat, and if this is missing from the console version what good is it?

Re:Graphical MUD on Console?

[iainl]

I can pretty much guarantee you this will support a keyboard for chat; PSO on the Dreamcast did this fine, as did its sequel. As the PS2 supports standard USB keyboards and mice I can't see this being a difficult thing to implement at all.

Re:Graphical MUD on Console?

[siegesama]

Phantasy Star Online worked out pretty well as a Graphical MUD/RP/Action Adventure.

It started on the Dreamcast, and now it's planning on coming to the PC, and the GameCube. This is just sorta the reverse. It could work!

Re:Graphical MUD on Console?

[NeMon'ess]

The problem with PSO is, how many people played it for more than a few months? Three friends of mine all quit after 4 months. The game was too simplistic and there was nothing new to do after several play throughs. My friends did not join the game to take part in a chat room. They wanted a game they could play with many other humans, since NPCs still suck generally as in game companionship. Games have to focus on gameplay first.

Re:Graphical MUD on Console?

[Anonymous Coward]

Why do you say that like that's a failure? Remember, Sega weren't charging for access on the original PSO, so play-for-four-months-and-quit is a nearly perfect usage mode for them.

NTSC Quality?

[rob_from_ca]

There's two words I've never heard together before...

Re:NTSC Quality?

[Anonymous Coward]

NTSC: Never The Same Color twice?

Re:NTSC Quality?

[Svartalf]

There's a unspoken "lack of" in the middle of that phrase, otherwise it's an obvious oxymoron.

Re:NTSC Quality?

[Anonymous Coward]

You stole the joke I was about to make.

Yeah, but

[PhoenxHwk]

This is all cool, but I've got two concerns:
1) How will it deal with the lack of keyboard? Communicating (and thus forming parties) will be more difficult.
2) Will the lack of hard drive effect anything? It seems that the game will be un-patchable and unable to work with expansion packs.

Re:Yeah, but

[demonbug]

As for lack of hard drive, isn't the broadband adapter (ethernet card, whatever) supposed to be bundled with a hard drive? I thought I saw that somewhere, but I'm too lazy (well, too disinterested anyway) to look.

Be nice, already.

[DohDamit]

Christ all fucking mighty, be nice.

To start, pay attention to what you wrote.

...but I think that games where you do cool stuff you never usually do...

People who do this are living lives they can't live here and now. Maybe they're not attractive. Maybe they're balding epileptics who live in their mother's house and spend all damn day between contracts playing Everquest. Maybe I have good friends like this, and maybe you should back the fuck off. My bud is having it hard, and self-esteem issues like his aren't helped when some self-appointed judge comes along and calls him a loser.

Or maybe, I'm just havin' fun. Dunno.

Re:Be nice, already.

[yatest5]

To start, pay attention to what you wrote.

...but I think that games where you do cool stuff you never usually do...

People who do this are living lives they can't live here and now. Maybe they

If we're talking some disembodied head that's wired up to a life-support machine, then cool, man, everquest it up. But even balding epileptics can go out, catch a band, see a film, talk to friends and maybe even girls!

No matter how unattractive your mate is, he's only gonna be more unattractive in future, and may live to regret wasting his youth online flirting with other bald epileptic dudes with female avatars...

Re:Be nice, already.

[Anonymous Coward]

So I fly jet fighters during the day, and want to sit around in my underwear at night?

And where do you work that you spend all day playing with elves and faires? I dun do that in real life...

And he thinks I need paxil.

Re:Be nice, already.

[katarac]

catch a band, see a film

Bands, movies? What a sad waste of time. How pathetic that you have to go see other people doing things in movies and on stage instead of going out and doing that I like to do.

Re:Be nice, already.

[iainl]

Quite. An acoustic guitar and a digital video camera are a hell of a lot cheaper than genetically engineering dragons every time you feel like killing one.

Re:Be nice, already.

[yatest5]

Bands, movies? What a sad waste of time. How pathetic that you have to go see other people doing things in movies and on stage instead of going out and doing that I like to do.

Hmm, that's a pretty clever reply. However, I don't believe that people bum around in their unwashed gruds playing online games 6 hours + a day as some kind of lifestyle choice - it's an addiction / compulsion fuelled by the fact that its much easier and less challenging (but by that same token less rewarding) than doing things in the real world.

I await your smarmy clever reply with anticipation.

Re:Be nice, already.

[katarac]

it's an addiction / compulsion fuelled by the fact that its much easier and less challenging (but by that same token less rewarding)

This may be true, (I don't know, I've only played the game a couple of times) and for all I know you may be a recovering EQ addict. But if you aren't, what do you base this on? The stereotype of the wormy, pale, lit by the warm glow of a CRT geek who has no social life and can't function outside of thier fabricated, online persona? Or maybe on the news story about the imbalanced guy who killed himself? I'm not an idiot, I know these people do exist, but I don't write off any possible redeeming qualities of "getting into" the game based on that.

Maybe you're right and people who play the game 6 hours + are just feeding a dependency. But why do you think that?

Re:Be nice, already.

[yatest5]

Maybe you're right and people who play the game 6 hours + are just feeding a dependency. But why do you think that?

Because I know people like that man :)

Re:Be nice, already.

[katarac]

Because I know people like that man :)

Are these people your friends, or just people you used to beat up in high school? ;)

Re:Be nice, already.

[yatest5]

Are these people your friends, or just people you used to beat up in high school? ;)

They were, but then they moved on, got married to other sweats online, the usual.... ;-)

Re:Be nice, already.

[EastCoastSurfer]

"Maybe you're right and people who play the game 6 hours + are just feeding a dependency. But why do you think that?"

I played DAoC for about 6 months(just recently quit). I probably played 4-6 hours a day during the week and more during the weekend. I still don't see it as wasted time, hell I had a good time while I played.

With that said I can see the problems with playing one of these types of games. Only by quitting the game did I see all the things that I let slide in other areas of my life. Gym, going out, reading, etc... all were second string to the game. Thinking about it after the fact scares me because a *game* had become that important in my everyday activities.

The hook(if you can call it that) in games such as DAoC and everquest is that they require time(lots of it) with no real end in sight. You can't just *play* these games, you must *commit* to them. In addition, they never actually end. I think that everyone who plays these types of games ends up being addicted to them at some level. I guess I am lucky that my OC personality is somewhat offset by the fact I get bored with things easily ;) The 6 months I spent playing DAoC is still by far the longest amount of time I ever spent playing 1 game.

Re:Be nice, already.

[katarac]

Thought so. Your posts have "jock" written all over them. ;) Or is that an unfair assumption?

Re:Be nice, already.

[Anonymous Coward]

Hmm I have a friend who loves to work out. Works out almost every day for many hours. Its a sick addiction. And then there is my other friend who really enjoys reading, reads constantly, what a freak he is?

Everquest is fun to me and to those who play it, whats your sudden problem. Who died and left you the deputy badge for policing peoples lives.

Re:Be nice, already.

[katarac]

Then I guess there is no real argument. It's just all about moderation. Everybody's addicted to something, you just can't let it take hold of your life. (Oddly enough, despite my smarmy comment earlier, I sometimes feel addicted to going to see hardcore and punk bands play at bars and going to movies.)

Re:Be nice, already.

[EastCoastSurfer]

I agree about moderation in everything. The problem with these games is that you can't play with moderation. They gear the game around everything taking a long time, because they know that the more time you invest the less likely you are to quit the game.

Anyways, I know that I will never pick another MMORPG up off the game shelf again cause I really don't have the time required to play. Guess I will go catch a movie and see a band afterwards tonight ;)

Re:Be nice, already.

[katarac]

They gear the game around everything taking a long time, because they know that the more time you invest the less likely you are to quit the game.

How sinister. My roomate bought everquest after a few friends and I concocted a "plan" to build up and sell high level characters at a premium (he apparently took us seriously). I signed up and tried it out, but unfortunatly (actually, drop the "un") my attention span has been ruined by tv and twitch games like Deathmatch Classic. I found the game boring and canceled my service in the next couple of days. All for the better it would seem.

Re:Be nice, already.

[Anonymous Coward]

Maybe he should kill himself. Why not suggest this at your next AD&D party?

Re:Be nice, already.

[Anonymous Coward]

Let's see, life as a badling epileptic...

Talking to a girl:
Girl: Hi, who are you?
Epileptic: I'm a balding epileptic.
Girl: ...bye.

Friends:
Friend: Sooo... what's up?
Ep: ...not much, you?
Friend: Pretty much the same.
Ep: ...
Friend: ...

Of course this assumes most of his buddies are those who understand him, i.e. in the same boat as he is.

Film:
Epileptic: *seizing on floor*

Band:
Epileptic: *seizing on floor*

...yeah, a whole lot of social opportunities he has, doesn't he?

Re:Be nice, already.

[yatest5]

Everquest is fun to me and to those who play it, whats your sudden problem. Who died and left you the deputy badge for policing peoples lives.

and various other quotes...

I'm not giving anyone shit - I'm expressing my own opinion on a *discussion* site. Can see all your interpersonal skills coming out in style - losing your rag because someone disagrees with you. Keep practising online - maybe one day you'll be able to have real friends in the real world :)!

Re:Be nice, already.

[Anonymous Coward]

Why doesn't your fat balding loser bud get his ass off of the Evercrack Lazy-Boy and into a gym. Maybe a bike ride. It'll do more for his self esteem than languishing with losers of similar calibre.

In related news...

[FurryFeet]

-eBay stock raises 10 points.
-After accepting that .tv domains won't sell, the island of Tuvali announces plans to produce and export Everquest high-level characters.
-Microsoft denounces Sony's plot to monopolize the online gaming world, giving the PS2 an unfair advantage over Xbox.
-A woman, who blames Everquest for her son's suicide, calls for action against what she calls "an incoming genocide".
-Thousands of Slashdot readers comment. "It's so cool", says some. "So, who cares?", says others. But the predominant opinion is "Microsoft still sucks".

Not the same game

[pknoll]

You won't be able to play the current EQ from a PS2. The game to be released is called "Everquest Online Adventures" and, according to the article, is based on EverQuest and will play much like the PC game.

The PS2 doesn't have the RAM or CPU power to play PC-EQ in its current incarnation no matter how powerful the GPU. 256MB of RAM is the practical lower limit on the PC game, the textures that need to be loaded now are -huge-.

YEAHH!!

[Anonymous Coward]

This one going to blow hour heads away .. ;D

PS2 processor power

[fabiolrs]

Does the PS2 have enough processor power to run the same EQ that a PC runs?

Well, i have a P3-800mhz, Geforce 2, 192mb RAM and i can barely run the game, i dont know if the PS2 will be able to run it even in a minimized version...

am i wrong?

Re:PS2 processor power

[Anonymous Coward]

It has the processing power to render EQ graphics but it won't be able to store character/zone textures and graphics because of tiny storage. PS2 has 4mb VRAM, 32mb RAM for any data. Even though it can read and write that 4mb video ram at 19.2 gb/sec, the whole system falls back on 5.4 mb/sec DVD read speed when it has to render more than 32mb of textures and models in one scene. In your typical EQ raid scene, you may have to render over 128mb of texture/model data at the same time. I'm guessing they will have a very stripped down version of EQ where you have to stream new data every time you walk into a new part of your zone or change a room or something alike.

Re:PS2 processor power

[fabiolrs]

well, i always thought computers were better gaming plataforms now i know why! :))))

PS2 first broadband?

[Dark Paladin]

I'm not going to talk about the "use a USB ethernet as a hack", but this is interesting for me.

Please not: this is not a rag on the Xbox. Well, it is, but it's not a rag because it's an Xbox, it's a rag because I like my Xbox and wish MS would stop being shitheads about managing it.

Anyway. Rewind the clock about a year to last years E3, where the Big Three (Nintendo, Microsoft, Sony) were sitting up, talking about their new consoles. I remember this discussion:

Interviewer: So, tell us about your online gaming plans.
Nintendo: Online gaming? We want to make fun games. We'll include online gaming if we need it.
Sony: We have a deal with AOL, and we're going to crush everybody online! Bwahahahaha!
Xbox: We have a built in Ethernet port into the Xbox, so we'll be online out of the box instead of having to buy expensive peripherals, and we'll crush everybody online! Bwahahahaha!

Now, fast forward to November, when I picked up my Xbox, and read in the help manual (page 15 I believe) that said:

Broadband support is coming in June of 2002. Deal with it.

Now we have Sony about to bring out their Ethernet/Hard drive adapter for the PS2. Will it make it as powerful as the Xbox? Probably not - unless you have the Linux kit, you won't be able to rip MP3's to the local hard drive (though I'm sure software developers will get that out), nor can you save games to the hard drive (unless the game is specifically programmed to do so - I could be wrong on this, but I don't think I am.)

Anyway. The point here is this:

Sony, at this rate, will beat the Xbox to true broadband Internet support without using a 3rd party hack. They will do so with Everquest behind them, Final Fantasy XI, and Star Wars: Galaxies. I can plug any standard USB keyboard/mouse into it, and it will work perfectly.

We still don't know what the Xbox plans are. While it has an Ethernet port, it only works on a local UDP network (unless you do some hacking with routers/Gamespy Arcade to get it online). Maybe there will be an update to add simple TCP/IP support, but why this support wasn't out of the fucking box I'll never know. (Come on - isn't the TCP/IP stack BSD license based? This should have been a no brainer, even if they had to put support in the Flash Bios or something instead of the hard drive. And they wouldn't have to worry about those "evil" GNU folks spoiling the party, since BSD doesn't make you share code.)

The Xbox will have... Seriously, I don't recall. Probably Morrowind (maybe - that's a single player game only right now), Halo of course, and some other games. I can't plug any USB things into it, so I have to spend more money for an Xbox keyboard/mouse (which I haven't seen announced yet - they could be out there, I just don't know.)

I like my Xbox - once I replace the controller, I'll like it even more. But I love my PS2, and Sony's making it hard not to like it more. And while I can't stand MMRPG's (experience, level, lather, rinse, repeat), I'm just interested enough in some of them (Final Fantasy XI), in the hard drive, and other bits that make me think that Sony's going to continue to stay in the lead.

Now, if we can just clear up their RIAA issues, and I'll really like them....

Re:PS2 first broadband?

[Anonymous Coward]

UDP is part of the TCP/IP protocol stack. Just because the haven't enabled TCP, doesn't mean the protocol stack isn't there.

Re:PS2 first broadband?

[WinterSolstice]

The funny thing about this is that Microsoft thought they could own the market on the first try.

I liked the concept of the XBOX, I liked the idea that things like Everquest would be easy ports. I liked the idea that everything would work with no setup. Heck, that's why I went to consoles this year. I got sick of paying big money every six months to upgrade my GD PC.

However, I went to buy a console last month, and lo and behold... the XBOX had only a handful of games (only 2 of which I liked), no real broad-band, decent graphics, and a controller that sucked, well MicroSoft :)

So, I bought a PS2. Funny that. It was cheaper, cooler, and had every game I could want. Plus, everything I wanted in a console was already there. (Ya know: games I like, a controller that was comfy, technology that was proven, a really cool developer kit, DTS)

I still like the XBOX. I hope that in the XBOX 2 or the XBOX 3 it will become a full-fledged console!

Everquest for the PS2, however, will be very interesting. How are they going to handle all the frigging patches? How about the fact that the game is 1.5 GBs? I bet the initial EQ port is going to stink SOOOOO bad.

-WS

Re:PS2 first broadband?

[lysurgon]

Interviewer: So, tell us about your online gaming plans.
Nintendo: Online gaming? We want to make fun games. We'll include online gaming if we need it.
Sony: We have a deal with AOL, and we're going to crush everybody online! Bwahahahaha!
Xbox: We have a built in Ethernet port into the Xbox, so we'll be online out of the box instead of having to buy expensive peripherals, and we'll crush everybody online! Bwahahahaha!

I'm sorry, man, but this is nothing new. Online console gaming has got to be one of the more vaporwared feature in tech history.

Case in point: I remember one of the things that sold me originally on the 16-bit Sega Genesis (when it first came out, like 10 years ago) was the proposed "teleGenesis" modem option. It sounded so sweet! You could play two players game against your buddies across town, and it included a keyboard and additional RAM to power-up your Genesis gaming experience. They even had a picture of it on the back of the box and claimed that special games would come out specifically to support it.

Did that ever happen? Not on your life. I wouldn't be surprised if the same thing occurs with one or more of the current consoles: a lot of talk and even some "demonstrations" to keep you interested in the platform and buying software, and then nothing, nada, zilch.

Like mom said, life just ain't fair.

Re:PS2 first broadband?

[spideyct]

First of all, I would hardly call plugging a USB ethernet card into a PS2 "a hack". Maybe its not officially supported by Sony, but its a pretty straightforward implementation supported by at least 1 retail game.

Second, the Sega Dreamcast has a broadband adaptor. I think there are maybe 3 games that support it.

Re:PS2 first broadband?

[stripes]

I like my Xbox and wish MS would stop being shitheads about managing it

Isn't hoping MS will stop being shitheads a lot like hoping the government will stop taxing people?

Re:PS2 first broadband?

[Anonymous Coward]

"Maybe there will be an update to add simple TCP/IP support, but why this support wasn't out of the fucking box I'll never know."

two words

netpliance iopener

microsoft built a console, they want it to be used as a console, so they didnt include any non-console functionality.

dont like it? build your own console.

Re:PS2 first broadband?

[Dexx]

I still like the XBOX. I hope that in the XBOX 2 or the XBOX 3 it will become a full-fledged console! Like everything else MS does, you've just gotta wait for the first few upgrades...

Re:PS2 first broadband?

[Steveftoth]

Another company did come out with a genesis modem, the same company also came out with a modem for the SNES, it let you play 2 player games on the phone lines.

Also, the Dreamcast was the first console to have broadband support. Unfortunatly, it was killed at the same time that it got it. Damn Sony. You can use the broadband adaptor (if you can get one) to program a DC (with special tools).

Re:PS2 first broadband?

[Doc Bullfrog]

Something tells me that you dont play many consoles. First off the XBOX GPU blows the Dreamcast and PS2s GPUs out of the water with sheer muscle power. That is a significant factor in the console world as they are only really updated every couple years or so (XBOX2, PS3, Nintentdo 2004-5) Titles. You dont like the titles released with the XBOX that is fine. But look at the titles released with the GCube and when the PS2 was released a year ago. It is merely a buildup of games developed over the extra time that it has been out. The developers are still getting used to the two newest consoles. Give it time like in all consoles it will get better. I think EQ on the PS2 will not be from luclin up and I dont know if they will go the free speech route. Depends on if the PS2 goes the route of including a "modem" type support or not. Because the broadband only connection that the XBOX has with no instructions on how to set up this system makes the ethernet port just a nonused hole in the back of it for most gamers. Anyways I am done ranting. In closing remember the console industry is and has been different than the PC industry and will remain that way I hope.

Re:PS2 first broadband?

[kaphka]

I liked the concept of the XBOX, I liked the idea that things like Everquest would be easy ports.

Say what you want about Microsoft, but I don't you can blame them for the fact that Everquest appeared first on the Playstation, and not the Xbox.

(Props to Sony for using the domain hierarchy correctly, though. You hardly ever see that in a .com these days.)

Re:PS2 first broadband?

[Anonymous Coward]

Who cares about Sega? They lost the race a long time ago. If they were smart they would team up with sony and make some cool games and add-ons to the system--like a sega usb adapter kit. The kit would come with a cd for the PS2 cd player with all the programs and stuff, and the sega adapter kit would contain a cd player for the sega games.

Re:PS2 first broadband?

[Deltan]

Xbox: We have a built in Ethernet port into the Xbox, so we'll be online out of the box instead of having to buy expensive peripherals, and we'll crush everybody online! Bwahahahaha!

The PS2 Ethernet Adapter will be $39.99. No more expensive than the DVD remote for XBox which isn't supported out of the box. Same Difference! PS2 isn't behind, it's ahead by a long shot as you indicated with FFXI, EQ, and Star Wars. Not only that but the Ethernet Adapter is already being play tested with games other than the aforementioned, has MS begun testing their online titles yet? Oh right, MS skips the whole testing process, I forgot.

Re:PS2 first broadband?

[Anonymous Coward]

... or you could use the included modem.

Jeez, it's not hard to plug a phone line from your DC into your Linux firewall, and dial up.

Re:PS2 first broadband?

[Dot Com Drew]

WRONG!

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B00005O0I 9/ qid=1018373758/sr=1-1/ref=s_e_0frp_2_1/002-6630246 -2031249

the xbox dvd controller is normally found for $25. The amazon inflated price is $29

basically the whole price of the xbox dvd controller is the licensing fee for dvd playback. they didn't include the feature in the box to keep the price down for people that didn't want to play dvd's like me.

Re:PS2 first broadband?

[geekoid]

"Broadband support is coming in June of 2002. Deal with it."

Is that an exact quote? Personally, I would have taken it back, wrote MS Xbox division, and the FTC.

MS is entering a whole new arena here, and if the treat there console customers they way thet treat there PC customers, they will lose.
The console market does have a lot of vaporware, but when it gets that close to shipping, or is shilling, they don't keep telling you its there. I almost bought one because of their "connectivity out of the box", but bought a PS2 because of the number of games.

I don't care what your product is, treat me like crap, and I return it.

Re:PS2 first broadband?

[Bravadaz77]

"The PS2 Ethernet Adapter will be $39.99. No more expensive than the DVD remote for XBox which isn't supported out of the box. Same Difference! "

This is a bit of a misnomer. The xbox in actuality is cheaper then then the Ps2. This is because the Xbox has a built in hard drive and 4 ports. So memory card for the ps2 = 39.99. Multi-Tap for ps2 is 40 - 60 dollars. Plus you dont have to buy an ethernet adapter. So having to buy a dvd remote for 30 bucks is much cheaper then buying a 40 dollar memory card a 50 dollar multi-tap and a 40 dollar ethernet adapter.

Also remember Microsoft is bringing out Sega's Flagship Phantasy Star Online 2 for the xbox. SO there will be atleast one MMORPG for the box. I think the box is much more suited for this and I dunno if Sony will get everyone to go out and spend another 40 dollars so they can play a handful of games online.

Bravo

Re:PS2 first broadband?

[Glonk]

There's a few big name games announced for Xbox Online already, including Unreal Championship (Unreal 2) and Sega's Phantasy Star Online 2.

Plus it's pretty much a given that MS will bring Asheron's Call 2 to the Xbox (AC1 was a better game than EQ, IMHO, and AC2 looks REALLY sweet...).

Re:PS2 first broadband?

[Anonymous Coward]

Um, don't you dare call PSO a MMORPG. It's diablo with a different viewpoint and graphics made for 8 year olds. Period.

Re:PS2 first broadband?

[Steveftoth]

but it's only as fast as your modem. The broadband adapter was a 100Mbit ethernet card!

Re:PS2 first broadband?

[DrEldarion]

Everquest for the PS2, however, will be very interesting. How are they going to handle all the frigging patches? How about the fact that the game is 1.5 GBs? I bet the initial EQ port is going to stink SOOOOO bad.

The size of the game is pretty small compared with what a DVD-ROM can hold. Patches will be done with the required hard drive upgrade.

-- Dr. Eldarion --

Woo hoo!

[AnimeFreak]

I wonder when the 512 MB memory upgrade for my Playstation 2 will be availble? :)

Re:Woo hoo!

[Anonymous Coward]

Umm its only recommended to have 512Mb...

Everquest will still start up with 256Mb and 128Mb of RAM

Soooo

[CashCarSTAR]

Am I the only person that read that Sony was bring Everquest to the PS2 with a *bong*?

Surrrrre

[gvonk]

I hope your "friend" gets real better soon.

Re:Surrrrre

[DohDamit]

Actually it is my friend of ten years or so. I don't play EQ....my wife would cut off my balls if I got hooked like he is.

As for going out and socializing, once again, we're assuming a great deal about the availability of someone's potential mate. My bud happens to have rather odd(from my perspective) tastes, and thus has a VERY hard time meeting these people. No, it's none of your fucking business, but rest assured its legal in every country in the world(even southern U.S.!) Ah well, my point is this: don't be so quick to judge people who can't find things they like doing beyond going online and fantasizing all day. After all, wtf are you doing, going to bands, listening to their music? What are you doing, going to movies? What are you doing, reading? Same fucking thing: fantasizing. Entertainment is all about the unreal.

Re:Surrrrre

[EastCoastSurfer]

"After all, wtf are you doing, going to bands, listening to their music? What are you doing, going to movies? What are you doing, reading? Same fucking thing: "

Actually your missing the real comparison here. You are right in saying that EQ is just like other forms of entertainment, but the time involved is the real difference. If someone was going to the theatre 8 hours a day 7 days a week most people would think they have a problem.

Re:Surrrrre

[DohDamit]

I still think it might be a matter of perspective.

If I post that I spend 20-30 hours a week doing all manners of activity on my computer, people here would react like I said I walk using both legs. On the other hand, people at the rec center would look at me like I grew a third arm out of my forehead.

The real litmus test is this: by doing this activity for this duration, am I harming myself by either causing myself some kind of damage or removing opportunities for other activities that I value? If the answer to this question is no, then no harm no foul. If the answer's yes, for any activity, I have problems.

Re:Surrrrre

[rnd()]

My bud happens to have rather odd

I think that's called "geek autism"... there was a /. story on geek autism a year or so ago.

Patches?

[Mechanik]

In other words, will PS2 users play in the same world as PC users?

That would quickly become a nightmare the moment they decided to release a patch for the PC version. Unless they are going to require you to add a hard drive to your PS2 as well, there is no way they are going to be able to patch a PS2 version to match.

Of course all of that is moot apparently, as someone has already mentioned that the games take place in different timelines, and thus do not intersect.

Still an intersting issue though. Can you think of any popular online game that hasn't absolutely required periodic patching to deal with bugs and/or cheating?


Mechanik

Re:Patches?

[Christopher Thomas]

That would quickly become a nightmare the moment they decided to release a patch for the PC version. Unless they are going to require you to add a hard drive to your PS2 as well, there is no way they are going to be able to patch a PS2 version to match.

Actually, you could get around this by having the game contact Sony for an in-memory patch on startup. Keep updating the patch on the master server, and the game patching takes care of itself.

You'd just have to patch a bit more intelligently than most games do (game patches don't *have* to be megabytes if you're only fixing bugs in the engine code).

Re:Patches?

[Anthracks]

What if the PC version added a new monster or dungeon? Online games DO have multi-megabyte patches precicsely because they are not simply fixing bugs, they are adding content to justify the monthly fee. Unless the PS2 version is going to magically hold an entire DVD worth of info in memory, I don't see how they could possibly patch anything but code in memory. I'll be interested to see how an online RPG with minimal new content each month holds up.

Re:Patches?

[jmauro]

Or sony could mail a new disk to subscribers. Even DVD's are cheap when created in sets of 10,000.

Re:Patches?

[flatrock]

Online games DO have multi-megabyte patches precicsely because they are not simply fixing bugs, they are adding content to justify the monthly fee.

This one apparently won't. I get the feeling that the game will be based on everquest, but will be considerably different in terms of expandability and content. Sounds like a marketing ploy to me, rather than actually bringing Everquest to the PS2.

Social Online Games and Consoles

[Ookoshi]

I don't know if anyone has played online games that required chatting on a console system, but talking there is a tremendous pain.

I played Phantasy Star Online for awhile on the Dreamcast. Even with all the chat shortcuts provided by the game, it was a pain in the ass to talk to other people.

I highly doubt PS2 players will play on the same servers as the PC ones. Their inability to chat properly will make them social outcasts. Who wants to hang out with people who are just going to spam what they have macro'd, or talk by typing with their joystick?

Sure, you can buy a keyboard for your PS2, but at that point, why don't you just play EQ on the PC?

...well

[MajikMan]

Pay to play games with crummy graphics? No thanks. I'm happy playing games like Counter-Strike, Diablo II, etc etc that are completely free to play online. When I really see gameplay in one of these MMORPGs with no single-player and gameplay that I can't live without, then maybe I'll sign up to pay my $10-$15 a month, but until then no thanks.

*sigh*

[Anonymous Coward]

First off, it isn't going to be a 'stripped down EverQuest'. It's not going to be EverQuest as we know it. It's going to be a totally different game.

Second, if anyone can make massively multiplayer online gaming work on a console, it's Verant/Sony. They led the pack on the personal computer, and arguably, still lead the pack. Now, they're setting themselves up to be the first to bring a quality MMOG experience to console users.

I wonder if Sony won't insist that VI should help Square out. Having both an EQ and an online FF on the Playstation 2 would certainly give them a hell of an edge in the market.

Fear "NTSC quality"...

[JoshMKiV]

(NT)

This isn't going to work

[dmarx]

Just look at Phanatasy Star Online: the entire system was destroyed by cheaters. Online gaming with the console simply isn't going to happen.

Re:This isn't going to work

[Anonymous Coward]

Nope, all character information in EQ is stored server side. I played it for hundreds of hours...and never saw a single instance of cheating.

Games like Counter-strike however, which keep player information on the client-side, are very prone to cheating.

I can see the ads for this now...

[chinton]

People are dying to play Everquest. What are you waiting for?

NTSC "quality"

[Rocky Mudbutt]

NTSC - 'Never The Same Color'

Trolls 1 - 0 Online Nerds

[yatest5]

Trolls 1 - 0 Online Nerds

Synchronization.

[Christopher Thomas]

Surely it all depends on what the client side does? If all you end up doing is sending character data, co-ordinates etc why should it be particularily difficult?

The way real-time game synchronization usually works is to take advantage of the fact that copies of the game on identical platforms will behave exactly the same way, given identical input. This lets you only transmit a very small number of state changes between machines in a multi-player game, with the automatic update of the rest of the world keeping most things in sync.

This starts to break down when you have platforms that handle math substantially differently (x86 and MIPS, in this case). Your world-update calculations will produce slightly different results, which will evolve into very large changes if you don't send corrective information every so often.

You can build a game to be resistant to this kind of drift, and to correct this kind of drift, but the usual result is that you have to send considerably more data during updates, with the game possibly becoming more sensitive to latency as well.

Re:Synchronization.

[Anonymous Coward]

Especially with intel's reputation for math, You'll never know where anything ends up!

Re:Synchronization.

[afidel]

Umm why do you think that, if I do a scientific calculation on my Intel based system and run the same computations on my Sparc I get the same results, it's called IEEE floats. Besides most of the game data is int's not float. For instance why would you need a fraction of a hit point or a fraction of a movement point, pen and paper games use just int's for instance.

Re:Synchronization.

[jmauro]

Except synchronization based on platform types will fail completely. x86's handle math differently based on their internal arch (athlons, PIV, PIII, 486). They even handle it differently within the same generation. PIII-Katmai handles floats differently that the PIII-Coppermine. The handling causes timing to be skewed and data to be skewed. Add to that all the processors are processing the data a different speeds. Any technique based on what your talking about would fail very quickly on anything other than a console. If a protocol is that dependant on the CPU Speed, arch, and OS, then the game's protocol is broken. World Calculations from the protocol should not be based on those things. I thought game designers learned all this when the IBM PC went from 4.77MHZ to 8MHz. Broke all sorts of games that assumed all PCs would be 4.77MHz. Things like timing loops wouldn't work right, games just crashed out of the box. If they're doing such silly crap again, then they need to go back to school and stop writing protocols.

Re:Synchronization.

[Christopher Thomas]

Umm why do you think that, if I do a scientific calculation on my Intel based system and run the same computations on my Sparc I get the same results, it's called IEEE floats.

An IEEE-compliant math unit will produce an answer that is correct to the ideal value within half a unit-last-place.

Except for operations like square roots, logarithms, sine/cosine, and so forth, where it's impractical or impossible to implement this degree of precision for all possible cases.

And except for systems where the math units aren't perfectly IEEE-compliant (there are many).

So while in theory you could do this, in practice you'll get small errors.

And this isn't even touching the fact that things like dot products are very sensitive to the order in which you choose to perform the fundamental operations required to implement them. If the compilers for your different platforms choose slightly different implementations, you have another source of noise.

In summary, the problem definitely exists.

Besides most of the game data is int's not float. For instance why would you need a fraction of a hit point or a fraction of a movement point, pen and paper games use just int's for instance.

Any game that has a true-3D world uses float to represent pretty much all coordinates. It doesn't take any more space to store a single-precision float than a 32-bit int, and it saves a lot of conversion hassle.

Re:Synchronization.

[Christopher Thomas]

Except synchronization based on platform types will fail completely. x86's handle math differently based on their internal arch (athlons, PIV, PIII, 486). They even handle it differently within the same generation.

All you're pointing out is that you can't elminate parameter noise even for an x86-only game. This is why games still do _some_ synchronization :).

Check the X-wing documentary from a couple of weeks ago for a description of how they chose to handle the problem.

Add to that all the processors are processing the data a different speeds.

This actually isn't relevant. All that's required is that if, say, you're sending an update every twentieth of a second in virtual time, all of your machines be able to update relevant parts of their world-models in less than one twentieth of a second.

In practice, it's even more flexible than this, as the update time steps for each client instance are allowed to be arbitrary. Naturally, this introduces more noise due to roundoff errors not maching up.

There is no way to avoid having to exploit this effect. A full update of the visible game state for each user would take a vast amount of bandwidth to send every frame. All you've shown here is that _some_ drift is unavoidable under real conditions - and I agree. The problem is that porting across architectures can only make the problem worse (and thus increase the cost of managing the problem).

Re:Synchronization.

[jgerman]

Heh I'd have modded you up if you put the link to that documentary, /.'s search engine blows sometimes ;)

Re:Synchronization.

[Anonymous Coward]

s/sometimes/all the fucking time/
s/;)/>:( slashdot is run by a bunch of queers/

Re:Synchronization.

[Anonymous Coward]

And except for systems where the math units aren't perfectly IEEE-compliant (there are many).

Over ten million, in fact. And that's just PS2s.

Somebody help me

[Lord Ender]

My roommate is addicted to Everquest. Yesterday he played for over 12 hours straight (eating microwave food). He plays until he goes to bed then plays when he wakes up. He doesn't go to class anymore. His girlfriend calls him and asks him to come up to his room and he says "not now, I'm playing the game." Friday and Saturday nights he plays Everquest until 6am. He was a quite normal guy before he got the game. But since January he has completely given up on his real life and only cares about his game life. My girlfriend and I never get any 'alone time' in my room because he NEVER LEAVES THE ROOM.
Please help. Is there anything I can do to get him to quit playing Everquest and save him from ruining his life (and my sex life)?

Thanks for any advice.

Re:Somebody help me

[jinx90277]

You might try this:

When you and your girlfriend are feeling amorous, mention casually that on your way to the room, you saw a real live elven maiden in the hall.

When he goes out in the hall to look, shut and lock the door immediately and do your business.

Re:Somebody help me

[Anonymous Coward]

this game ended my marraige in much the same way. luckily its just your roomate & not your S.O. thats addicted.

just block the game at the router. heres how (according to sony)

- -

You just need to block the following ports and you should be ok.

Patch Application:
A TCP connection is initiated from the player's PC (using an arbitrary port>=1024) to patch.everquest.com, port 7000. There are multiple IP addresses for the patch.everquest.com clusters, and they may change as the network demands, so check often using a DNS lookup tool if you provide a specific firewall rule for patching.

EverQuest client:
UDP datagrams are sent to/from the player's PC (using an arbitrary port>=1024) from/to one of the EverQuest servers (using an arbitrary
port>=1024).

The EverQuest server IP addresses are on the subnets: 64.37.148.* , 64.37.149.* , 64.37.150.* , 64.37.151.* , 63.241.40.*, 63.241.41.*, 63.241.42.*, and 63.241.43.*
These network blocks may be summarized as 64.37.148.0/22 and 63.241.40.0/22.

Please note that EverQuest opens a random UDP data port from the player's PC every time EverQuest is run. Thus, the need to have all
ports >= 1024 available.

- -

a word of caution, once youve done this, you will become the enemy. just like a heroin addict, anyone trying to keep an eq'er from their drug will be scorned & shunned.

no big loss really.

Re:Somebody help me

[Hello Titty]

First, I don't believe he's completely gone yet because, as you said, he's still sleeping.

As far as the other part goes, I suggest you just ignore him. Perhaps, using the very informative text contained in the first post of this article, you could go down on your girlfriend. I'd make sure he could see you two out of the corner of his eye, and ask her to be very vocal, even if she's not usually. At the very least it will make him turn for a moment, and, hopefully, he'll become so embarassed that he'll decide that even EQ isn't worth it and leave.

An alternate way to solve your problem is to get out of the closet, sort of. Approach him and tell him how wrong you feel with girls and how impressed you are with his EQ character. That every night you stay up pining for him, gently stroking your member until you fall asleep.

That might scare him away. Of course, you might find out he's gay or swings both ways too. So it's a bit more risky, but anyway.

Re:Somebody help me

[ivan256]

Next time he sleeps, tie him to the bed with 20 pound test fishing line (Over a blanket so there's no bleeding when he tries to sit up). Feed him through a straw for a week, and by that time the withdrawl should be over and he'll be able to walk away. (I.E His character will be so far behind all his online buddies that he won't have fun anymore.)

Warning, this may be illegal in some countries.

Re:Somebody help me

[squant0]

He still has a girlfriend?
That in it self is amazing, maybe she should just take his computer one day and throw it out the window?
That will make him stop, be much more fun, and not involve having to go out to buy the fish net, or spoon feed him.
Or you could just format his HD and put OS2 on it!

-squanto

Re:Somebody help me

[Dexx]

If you're a student, it's paper season. Write a few papers on your PC. That should take the next week or two.

If you're not, claim to spill something on your keyboard. That shorts 'em out nicely. "Sorry - I spilled coke/vodka/whatever on the keyboard and it's not working at all. I've sent it to be repaired and I don't know when it'll be back - they estimated a couple of weeks."

Either that or just ask him if he'd mind leaving so your gf and you can get some quality time and you can get some sleep on weekends, but that one's less fun.

Re:Somebody help me

[Anonymous Coward]

wow, big genius you are.

my guess is that your girlfriend has a room too. go have sex with her in her room.

problem solved.

Re:Somebody help me

[geekoid]

a couple of things.
a) When he gets up to go to the bathroom, renam his everquest directory, and make it a hidden directory.
b) install a "hidden" firewall blocking the EQ ports.
c) his girlfriend is obviously in need, I suggest you attend to her needs, heck maybe you can get your girlfriend, and his soon to be ex together to "get him" for playing that stupid game.

Top 10 ways to get someone to stop playing everquest:
10)Break their fingers.
9)When in the bathroom, turn the PVP mode on, and give away his stuff.
8)Put a quarter slot on the computer, every half hour, he has to put in a quarter.
7)Mysterious monitor problems.
6)reformat drive, install Linux
5)get his soon to be ex girlfriend to "swallow" if he gives it up.
4)tell him you find him attractive when he plays.(he may still play, but at least he'll be else where)
3)cancel his credit card.
2)call his parents and tell them what he's spending their money on.
and the number one way to get someone to quit everquest, leave a loaded gun next to the computer just before you leave on spring break!

Re:Somebody help me

[Anonymous Coward]

My standard method for making my EQ Addict roommate go away:
1) This only works if you have some kind of broadband router; it really works great if you have a wireless setup and a laptop so you can sit nearby.

2) Telnet to your router and block tcp traffic to the addict's port.

3) When the addict realizes he's booted, he will quit EverQuest and try pinging the outside world, or maybe fire up a browser. When you see him attempting these troubleshooting techniques, re-enable traffic to his port, so the pings work.

4) As he re-launches EverQuest, disable his port again.

5) Keep repeating this pattern until the addict gives up trying to live his loser fantasy life and leaves.

5a) If you don't have a router, loosen his connection so it can be easily "tripped over."

Re:Somebody help me

[Lord Ender]

He does still have a girlfriend. It is strange, they had been together for a year before he got the game. He blows her off to play it, so eventually he bought her a copy of the game! So they play it together sometimes (I am sure she hates it but she trys to get into it just to get to talk to him). Oh and a few days ago she was playing on his computer and he wanted to play, so she got annoyed with him and then he told her "get out of my room now." She left crying and he played EQ for hours. She came back the next day and he suggested she bring her computer down to my room so they can play together. He doesn't give a damn about her, he only cares about the game. But she stays with him for some reason.

Re:Somebody help me

[Anonymous Coward]

"His girlfriend calls him and asks him to come up to his room"

"My girlfriend and I never get any 'alone time' in my room"

Now, I don't mean to break the bonds of your relationship and all my friend... but you've got an opportunity of a lifetime. You must see it.

Some facts

[ajs]

1. This is not EverQuest as you may know it. This world will not overlap with standard EverQuest. There will be a limited race/class selection, and the world will not require zoning. You will also not get to interact with the rest of the EverQuest player base
2. EverQuest in its current form has much improved graphics over what you're used to from the days of Kunark (which was release something like 2 years ago).
3. If you haven't tried EQ since Kunark, you're missing much more than just graphics. There's a new playable class (Beastlord), a new race (Vah Shir: the cat people), post-60 advancement, new types of quests and scripted events (zone-wide wars, ring quests/scripts), chat channels (user created), and many more nifty features that older EQ players may want to come back and try out.

If you decide to come back, come look me up. I'm on 7th Hammer, and play Miskaton or Deepone.

Re:Some facts

[Frank of Earth]

Do items still last forever in EQ? The EQ economy is terrible because once you get a great item, you NEVER have to worry about it breaking/wearing away.

Re:Some facts

[Anonymous Coward]

Everquest is still wracked with huge bugs, many of which were introduced with the SoL expansion. Most of the new player models from SoL are horrible to look at, although a few are nice upgrades from the old models, and virtually all of the animations are very badly done making the characters very gimpy looking when animated. The new graphics engine is still at least a generation less capable than others available today. VI/SOE still hates their paying customers and the "new content" of SoL isn't much different that the what was there before. Definitely don't come back if you've left, try a different game from a company that actually appreciates your business ... almost any of eq's competitors will do.

Re:Some facts

[ajs]

Yes, but the EQ economy is still quite good. Don't know why you had problems. I've made an awful lot of plat selling everything from newbie items to high-end spell drops.

Re:Some facts

[ajs]

Everquest is still wracked with huge bugs, many of which were introduced with the SoL expansion.

As with the rest of your message, you're quite vague and don't seem to want to brook any sort of disagreement. The major bugs that I know of that were introduced with SoL have all been fixed. The biggest concern that I've heard from the user-base recently continues to revolve around changes that HAVEN'T been made (e.g. lack of new interface and Bazaar, which were supposed to be part of Luclin)

Most of the new player models from SoL are horrible to look at, although a few are nice upgrades from the old models,

Ok, I guess this is your call, but when I look at side-by-side comparisons, I can't imagine that you found any of the old models more appealing than what we have now. I would still love to see improvements for: Hafling, Dwarf and High Elf, but those races do look better, IMHO, than they did pre-SoL.

and virtually all of the animations are very badly done making the characters very gimpy looking when animated.

Compared to what? It doesn't make any sense to compare EQ to Q3 or Unreal. When's the last time you played Q3, moving across 200 levels with a couple thousand of your best friends logged in? The limitations imposed by having textures and models for thousands of items, dozens of character models, hundreds of type of terrain, etc are going to have an impact on the overall look of the game.

Of course, you can go the DAoC route and have a much more cartoony, hybrid 3D look. That's not a bad solution, and it's working well for them. EQ went for a much more realistic rendering model, and I think that helps gameplay a whole lot.

VI/SOE still hates their paying customers

Again, you're making an assertion about how they feel, but you don't give any evidence to back it up.

and the "new content" of SoL isn't much different that the what was there before.

Ah! Still subjective, but you make a point. Let's look:

* New race unlike any previous
* New class -- hybrid of previous, but unique play none the less.
* Ring events -- definitely new and changes the high-end game quite a bit over waiting for spawns!
* Mid-level scripted wars -- this take content that used to be reserved for the very highest level characters and makes it available to nearly everyone.

How are these things not new? Are you complaining that you want *more* that's new? Have you gone to CT? Have you tried Legends?

Definitely don't come back if you've left, try a different game from a company that actually appreciates your business ... almost any of eq's competitors will do.

Here's the crux. You want people to play the other games. Cool, that's fine. But don't rag on a game you clearly have unfounded personal feelings about without doing some research.

PS2 is far from the ideal platform for EQ

[Anonymous Coward]

Seems like the PS2 version is going to look quite watered down. Perhaps pre-Luclin models only? Lower quality textures? Game was designed with a PC in mind. PS2 architecture is very different. How is PS2 going to render 512mb worth of geometry and texture data when it chokes on anything over 32mb in one scene? PS2 falls back on 5.4 mb/sec DVD read speed when it has to render more than what can be stored in its memory in one scene. You often have to render 40+ characters that are using different models and textures in addition to your terain. Originally EQ required at least 64mb of ram back when it came out in 1998. Zones are stored, not streamed. Global character data files are already over 60mb in size and they are required to be loaded in memory otherwise you won't be able to render characters in a raid. I just don't see how you can stream this well at 5.4 mb/sec.

pc gamers different than console gamers

[Sorcerer13]

I doubt that Everquest on the PS2 will be as successful as on the pc due to one main reason, PS2 owners aren't usually the type to spend hours and hours doing the same thing just to raise their levels, especially online. The problem is that PS2 owners, besides harcore rpg players, don't really want to spend the time doing stuff like that. They would rather see massive amounts of blood and large explosions.

Re:pc gamers different than console gamers

[MentlFlos]

They would rather see massive amounts of blood and large explosions. TETRIS RULES

What version of tetris do YOU have?!?

Re:pc gamers different than console gamers

[Nobody's Hero]

Tetris: Blood Lust!!

the pieces are made of arms and legs and the squares are floating heads....

Heck, I'd buy it.

all joking aside though. You're right and wrong. I was a console gamer before I was a pc gamer and I spent hours and hours repeating the same battles just because that monster gave a bunch of experience. Final Fantasy III had me going for weeks!

PC Gamers just have the ablity to downloads cracks and cheats more easily than console gamers. So i'd wager that they actually spend less time trying to level up a character. I mean look at what happened to Diablo. Pk killers with axes that do 10000000000000 points of damage?

Granted the noble gamer doesn't do this...but who amog us can say they've never used a trainer?

Re:pc gamers different than console gamers

[Anonymous Coward]

Uh a little million seller called Final Fantasy X comes to mind.

Hemos, Is capabilites a word?!

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm hoping this version takes advantage of the Ps2's graphic capabilites, rather then what I've seen on EQ before.

Me too!?! What are capabilites???

Does Hemos even know how to spell the word capabilities or is "capabilites" a word? I can't find a definition for "capabilites" anywhere. Or is this a /. thing? AbiWord is recognizing it as spelled correctly as I type this.

Ann Landers to the rescue!

[mekkab]

Dear Lord Ender,

I'm not sure what this everquest is, but my staffers tell me its a video game. I remember when my husband was addicted to Pong I had no quaters left over to do laundry!
There are two ways you can deal with this.
Its almost may, and the way it sounds your roomate will be placed on academic probation and most likely not returning next semseter. So if you can hold out a little longer...

The second way to deal with this is to be firm but fair. Let him know that you are concerned that he is damaging his grades and social life. And let him know that his behaviour is damaging your chances of hitting the nappy-dugout. All work and no play makes Jack an angry, vindictive, revenge-monger.
If there is no change in his behavior (and your ability to get some) here is your plan: wake up early (10 am) one morning. Your roomate should be passed out from sheer exhaustion. remove his hard drive. remove his mother board. remove his net-connection. re-format his drive. Or just plain remove his computer. Leave a note in its place. He will be forced to go on a scavenger hunt to reclaim his lost computer! His ram is in a locker at the bus station down town.
His mother board is duct-taped to the bottom of a bench. His hard drive is hidden on the roof of the physics building. Have the clues hidden amongst people he must talk to/interact with to get.

This should take at least a few weeks, keeping him out of the room and giving you valuable "together time" with your honey.

Hope this helps!

Signed,
Ann Landers

I can see it now

[pjkacmar]

Everquest becomes a huge seller on the PS2, making the PS2 internet adapter the first successful console add-on. Developers start churning out games and sit back to check their sales... to find that they're only selling games to 1% of users with internet adapters. Cause of problem? 99% of users bought the adapter for Everquest, and they don't play any other games.

Will it work? I think so.

[Caball]

If Sony can get just 10% of its installed PS2 userbase to play the game, they will have over 800,000 players.That's not too shabby, and nearly twice the current PC player base.

Re:Will it work? I think so.

[nutshell42]

I thought they already sold over 20mio consoles

Re:Will it work? I think so.

[demonbug]

Well, I'm one PS2 owner who isn't going to get it. EQ sucks. Every MMORPG I have tried has pretty much sucked. Single player, off-line RPGs are much better. And no, I'm not talking about console RPGs.

Re:Will it work? I think so.

[Caball]

Aye, My figure was US sales only.

wonder if they will...

[nubbie]

make starwars galaxies for the ps/2 as well then...

EVERCRACK...

[superpulpsicle]

Great, now a couple more PS2 owners will kill themselves after not getting the proper dosage.

The nature of the PS2

[thatguywhoiam]

The first thing that strikes me about the majority of posts on here are the animus regarding the PS2. I say, the more the merrier. The console is not threatening the PC version in any way. Yet.

Those of you arguing the PS2's spec are missing the point. This is the first real big console MMORPG (exclusing Sega's efforts) effort. It will evolve. It's the reason Sony bought Verant. (Aside: the real news here is the inplication of SW:Galaxies, which is the biggest carrot yet).

The PS2 is a stealth-computer. Check out the shots of the Linux kit again. All the missing pieces. You already own the keyboard and mouse (in my case, an Apple Pro keyboard and a logitech optical mouse, 4-btn; all work flawlessly on supported games).

Also, most reports cite some sort of voice headset. If they've nailed this, it immediately leapfrogs the PC experience to my mind. Imagine role-playing, actually acting, in Star Wars galaxies, using (for instance) some sort of chording one-handed emoting system.. and your own voice. Much better.

I think it was Nicholas Negroponte who once said, 'Consoles are just computers in short pants.' First version won't be superior to the PC. Version 3....

.r

Grand Theft Auto Online?

[Russ Steffen]

I wish they'd make an MMORPG based on Grand Theft Auto 3. Now that would be a blast.

Re:Grand Theft Auto Online?

[Anonymous Coward]

Just wanted to say, "Yes"!

Beware the MPAA Toaster

[thatguywhoiam]

Let's all take a step back and remember that the PS2 is exactly Jack Valenti's idea of an ideal 'media' computer. Locked-the-fuck-up. This may bother you on some level.

Not that I'm saying you shouldn't buy one. Go for it; I did. But I will maintain my tradition of buying the stuff I like (i.e. Ico), and disdaining the things they throw at us that are ass (i.e. paid subscriptions over up-front fees).

.r

strange sound..?

[SubtleNuance]

Whats that sound? Thats the sound of every >18 year old rushing to out to cancel their accounts to avoid all 12 year old "suxorsmedonkee" players about to get an account.

They will, in one quick swoop change EQ from a MMORPG to a MMO???.

Oh well, im waiting for PlaneShift or the (really far out it seems) WorldForge -- though it seems the latter is FAR to ambitious to produce any playable MMORPG anytime soon.

Re:strange sound..?

[SubtleNuance]

WorldForge

Re:strange sound..?

[Anonymous Coward]

hey doofus, they're not going to share the same network... read the above posts!

Where's Madden???

[goldenfield]

I'm gonna hold out until there's network Madden... What I want is Madden tournament games...play thru a championship, then all the champions play each other, and so on until I've beaten everyone! =)

If they do that, though, they need to bring back the 'design your own play' option.

And what are they going to do with the voiceovers now that John and Pat aren't together? John and Al?

Re:Where's Madden???

[Nobody's Hero]

Madden???.....you poor poor soul.

You honestly think that madden is better than everquest? what are you even doing on this site?

Re:Where's Madden???

[buckeyeguy]

You mean like, "Madden's EverQuest 2002", a crossover game for both groups of players? Heh.... if JM showed up in EverQuest, he'd be depicted as a loud, fat troll with a lot of platinum...

Graphics

[amokk]

"...but I'm hoping this version takes advantage of the Ps2's graphic capabilites, rather then what I've seen on EQ before." Sorry to say it, but the PS2 (nor any other console on the market for that matter) cannot possibly compare itself to a half-decent PC. Sure, the PS2 looks great on a super-low resolution NTSC screen, but at the end of the day, is it going to run Max Payne at 1280x1024 at over 80fps? I don't think so. No console on the market today has that kind of power no matter what the fanboys tell you.

Re:Graphics

[geekoid]

80 fps is not needed in console games. The only reason 80 fps is needed in Computer games is because the frame rate drops when there is a lot of action on the screen. Anything over 30 fps doesn't matter because you can not see it.

Re:Graphics

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm not alone when I say that I can see a large difference between something running at 30fps and 60fps.

If I recall correctly (which I probably don't) you can "see" things that are around for as little as 1/200th of a second.

Re:Graphics

[byran lei]

>it, but the PS2 (nor any other console on the market for that matter)
>cannot possibly compare itself to a half-decent PC. Sure, the PS2
>looks great on a super-low resolution NTSC screen, but at the end of
>the day, is it going to run Max Payne at 1280x1024 at over 80fps? I
>don't think so. No console on the market today has that kind of power
>no matter what the fanboys tell you.
>
Hate to break it to you,but Max Payne as lame as these kinds of PC games are, already has a PS2 version out.

Re:Graphics

[Simon Garlick]

So I guess you force your PC's graphics adapter to run at a 30Hz refresh rate, right? I mean... anything more than that would be wasted, since you can't see anything more than 30fps, right?

Re:Graphics

[byran lei]

>_I'm not alone when I say that I can see a large difference between
>something running at 30fps and 60fps.
>
>
That's because you're using a PC that runs an Microsoft OS which slows to a crawl whenever anything demanding is placed on it. Why do you think there are PC's with 1ghz or higher processors these days? Consoles like the PS2 and GameCube don't need that kind of processor speed.

Re:Graphics

[Anonymous Coward]

Uh, I think you missed his implied reference to the fact that Max Payne on the PS2 runs absolutely shite.

Re:Graphics

[Anonymous Coward]

Why isn't this Score: 1? It's the painful truth... Big buckets & small pipes vs. Small buckets & big buckets. A parallel design required.

But will EQ be re-written for the PS/2? If not, then it won't run too well. All PC -> PS/2 ports suck, massive.

Re:Graphics

[Mattsson]

On the other hand, not even the x-box costs one third of what your "running Max Payne at 1280x1024 at over 80fps" pc costs. :-)

I do agree with you that it'll be hard to get a ps2 to compete with pc-graphics though...

Re:Graphics

[byran lei]

>Uh, I think you missed his implied reference to the fact that Max
>Payne on the PS2 runs absolutely shite.
>
>
No the lamer didn't know that there was a PS2 port of Max Payne. He was implying that the piece of PC-Gamer trash that is Max Payne was a PC thing only.

Re:Graphics

[Anonymous Coward]

>hy isn't this Score: 1? It's the painful truth... Big buckets & small
>pipes vs. Small buckets & big buckets. A parallel design required.
>But will EQ be re-written for the PS/2? If not, then it won't run too
>well. All PC -> PS/2 ports suck, massive.
>
>
That's because PC games basically suck to begin with. You can't improve what is basically garbage to begin with (PC games) by just moving it to another platform as you PC gaming dorks are finding out with the FlopBOX.

Will it have advertising?

[Animats]

Will console-based online games launch with advertising? It's "TV", right? So consumers might "expect advertising".

(Today, Yahoo Groups started adding large advertising images to e-mailed group postings.)

hopes and dreams

[emn-slashdot]

I expect they will use the Shadows of Lucin engine on the ps2. At least I hope they do. The old everquest looks like crap compared to the new engine, and I expect that there would not be a performace issue on the ps2 with the Lucin (aka EQ2.0) engine.

Cheers,

Maybe they're actually going to optimize it

[Anthracks]

Although I have never actually played EQ or this new expansion that wants such a ludicrous amount of memory, I imagine there is more than a little room for memory use optimization. I've seen screenshots from that expansion, and there are plenty of outdoor 3D engines that blow it out of the water with 1/8 the memory footprint. I am willing to bet, since they have to recode the thing anyway to use the PS2's totally different architecture, they will find a way to make more efficient use of memory.

Not hard if designed like that from the beginning.

[billybob]

Think id software. quake 3 arena is an excellent example.

Think about this one

[filmcritic]

Honestly, how many people here really truly believe that the PS2 has enough horsepower to run Everquest decently? From what I've read, the latest add-on for the game recommends 510 megs of RAM..last time I looked, the PS2 has 32.

Another thing worth looking at is the graphical power of the PS2. I watched someone playing Final Fantasy X over the weekend at a Gamestop for about 5 minutes, and saw everything stutter several times in that 5 minutes. How the PS2 is going to keep up with Everquest is beyond me....

Re:Think about this one

[Anonymous Coward]

Because the PS2 is very simple and has low system overhead. You think that Everquest on the PC uses all 510 MB for itself?

We'll never get Everquest II

[qurob]

Since it requires like 512MB of memory, and the PS2 has...32MB!

Re:Not hard if designed like that from the beginni

[Zathrus]

As others have pointed out, the issue is patches. In theory, it's not an issue having Mac, Linux, PC, etc. versions of an online game. Once you throw embedded systems into the loop (which is what the PS2 is, essentially), things become different fast.

That's one of many reasons that the console port of online games never interfaces with the real one. The other reason being that, in general, PC users will trash console users due to superior controls (go find and read Jon Carmack's statement on the PS2 version of Q3 for instance...)

you're joking right

[wishiwascool]

come to you in full NTSC quality

Isn't this a contradiction in terms?

Not the same EQ...

[throx]

It seems most people have missed the point that the EQ for the PS2 will not be the same "world" as the EQ for the PC. This means (thankfully) that current EQ players don't have to deal with the PS2 players who have significantly decreased interaction, or with the limits the processing power and graphics of the PS2 would impact on the main development tree.

In essence, I see EQ for the PS2 as something that will be the same in name only.

Now what was that L/R/R/U/D/A/B combo for dragon punch to Tormax again?

So what am I missing?

[Anonymous Coward]

The game will undoubtedly cost $50 or more (about twice the going rate for the PC version). It will require another $50-100 worth of equipment to make it work right (stuff every PC already has). And $12.95/month?

No thanks. If I have to pay full price (and more), I'll get the full featured PC version. If the PS2 version is $4.95/month, I'd consider going that route but only if it's damn good.

The trouble with trying to bank on the Everquest name is that anyone who cares about it already has it on their PC. They aren't likely to give up their current investment on that system to pay more money for a stripped-down version with sub-VGA graphics.

This will NOT be Eq as we know it.

[micromuncher]

This will be an "Everquest-lite", called Everquest Online Adventures, so there will be no interaction with the usual EQ world.

In the last Everconn QA, the question to developers was asked "Will there be a MacOS version of EQ?" The answer was "Everquest is totally dependant on DirectX, and will always be a DirectX game. There will be no Mac version."

PS2 doesn't support DirectX, does it? With DirectX portability/emulation APIs recently released on top of OpenGL, I wonder if EQs development staff has anything to do with this. The release states this is a "ground up" development.

I guess Sony is wielding a double edged sword.

Re:This will NOT be Eq as we know it.

[Anonymous Coward]

EQ is not inseperable from directx. I have no doubt that the EQ team couldn't swap in opengl in like, 42 mintues.

"The release states this is a "ground up" development."

wicked! that's what's required for a proper PS/2 title - it has to be designed with the PS/2 in mind, otherwise it will suck.

The PS/2 isn't a PC. I can't wait to write code for it! It will be very different, but the proper way to push polys.

Wow, post-60 advancement!

[Sabu mark]

Advancement past level 60? That's awesome! I was afraid I'd never be able to level endlessly anymore. What could be more fun than walking up to a monster, pressing a key, leaving the room for two minutes, and then repeating the process 467,892 more times? Hooray!

Re:Wow, post-60 advancement!

[ajs]

Advancement past 60 is not leveling. It's more skill-based (it's called "alternate advancement"). It's a very cool addition to the game, and makes raiding for experience post-60 make sense.

If you see EQ as a single-player game, it sucks after about level 40 or so. If you see it as an opportunity to cooperate and game with lots of others, it only starts to get interesting around those levels.

Many people who play past about 35 get stuck in what's called the "experience grinder". They think that the game doesn't begin until 60, so they have to just sit there and weather the next 25 levels. Unfortunately, they find that that's very boring and stop, or worse, they get to 60 and find that it's just more of the same (in some ways).

What people like myself find is that EQ presents almost too much variety, and if you just spend all of your time going into the 5-10 zones that EVERYONE is in, and grouping up with fast pullers, you're missing 90% of the game.

Re:Wow, post-60 advancement!

[|_uke]

Yah, like one of my fav moments in EQ was when my cleric was around level 12... we had a full group and we descided to take on crushbone. We actually ended up taking on the castle and held it pretty well. Fortunatly for us there was a couple high level players camping the high level npc's. (and who appricated having us sitting there camping the lower level stuff so they did not have to deal with them).

It was great, before long we where all around level 14-15.

It was pretty fun... one time one of the higher level npc's spawned without a high level player to camp it... we where doing alright until it spawned.. then the magic users where running out of mana and the tanks where running low on health... RUN RUN.. I stayed back and tried helping the tanks... think one died... I fell out the window on accedent at the end... which is funny because thats what saved my life! LOL.

It was great because it was very challenging. We where holding our own, but each of us had to do our best in keeping the group alive. And the thrill of being able to sit in the orc castle for an hour is just great :)

Another thing thats kinda exciting is trying to trek from freeport to quenos in a small low level group... LOL. Screw teleports, lets adventure!

Re:Wow, post-60 advancement!

[ajs]

Another thing thats kinda exciting is trying to trek from freeport to quenos in a small low level group... LOL. Screw teleports, lets adventure!

Heh... sounds like a fun player event. Call it the newbie marathon! I can just see 100 characters from 1-15 running across the continent. You'd have to do a few things. First, you'd want spotters along the way to make sure there was no cheating. Then bind everyone who wants to race at the starting point (no fair binding in the target city and then letting an orc pawn kill you).

I've heard of events like this. Usually you have to get naked first, since there are various items that would make it easier.

Re:Wow, post-60 advancement!

[ajs]

Just a couple more thoughts here, after playing some more last night. I really love the way that from 30 to 50, you get less capable solo, but more capable in groups (for most classes). I'm actually able to save my fellow group members' butts on a regular basis by expending a little effort above-and-beyond the basic grouping tactics, and they can save mine in the same ways.

I'm also seriously in love with the idea of long and complex quests that pretty much require a group. The WIS shield quest in Katta (a new Luclin city) is like this. We get together and camp the mob de jour. We pull whatever we can to make the time pass and gab and get some ok quest armor drops. We just finished our druid's skull collection last night, so the next step is to get a larger group together and go to Katta to turn in the skulls. As soon as we do, we'll get 8 of the mobs that the skulls dropped from, which we have to take out at once!

This sort of thing is what I pay my monthly EQ fee for. It's adventure, pure and simple, from the 8th dimension!

OSU? No big surprise!

[Geek In Training]

It's no wonder he has this behavior; you're at OSU. When I was attending that God Forseaken Hellhole in 1994-95, my roommates routinely terrorized me and my property.. because I had a comp-u-tar and it was on the phone (14.4 to a shell account) and what if their grandad had a heart attack at 1am and I was online? So I moved to another room only to have a physically abusive roommate in addition to two more tech-hating yokels from rural Oh-Hi-Uh. This was on North campus where "all the engineering kids are!" Engineers who hated computers. I wonder where THEY are today.

In the mean time, I started playing Magic: The Gathering with a few Graduate students. (This was my first RPG-ish experience... no D&D, no Final Fantasy or anything before that.) Next thing you know I am scrounging for cheap common cards and playing M:TG about 12 hours a day in the Union and the Grad dorm lobby, with another 5 hours spent in the computer labs. I slept between 9am and 4pm. Class was a freaking joke; 400 kids in a class, none of the TAs speaking english as a native language. I hated it, and I was 18 and knew everything. *GRIN* These "anti-social" behaviors only made my roommates hate me more.

By chance I found a girl online with like interests... at the University of Wyoming. We started ytalk'ing all the time, and emailing. I flunked out of OSU, said "see ya!" to my parents who were "so disappointed because I had so much potential," and moved to Wyoming. Married my Internet sweetie. Spent three years cutting my teeth doing desktop support, PC/printer repair, and data wiring.

I came back to Ohio with my wife and draw a salary that is comparable to the ones my idiot roommates were bragging that they would have someday, only WITHOUT the $50,000 in student debt, and five years in a classroom trying to figure out if the Teaching Assistant said "pigeons" or "business."

The difference between me and this guy is that this guy has given up on his gf, which is just plain WRONG. College age is the best time to get good nookie. This guy has taken an entertaining habit to an extreme that crimps your style.

On the other hand, Lord Ender, you have to ask yoruself... are you really a geek, or a geek-oppressor? :)

Re:OSU? No big surprise!

[Anonymous Coward]

It almost sounds like you're proud about flunking out of college. That's pathetic. Get a clue and a decent education.

Too many other issues such as client hacks, macros

[flatrock]

Many online games ban macros, and attempt to enforce those bans through the client code. Players often hack the client in order to cheat. Trying to stop client hacks and prevent macros on clients running on different OS's is an incredibly difficult task. It's an incredibly difficult task even on one OS.

There's also the reality that software has bugs. No developemnt team in their right minds wants to deal with the outrage their customers would express about having one group of customers not being able to do a quest, or not haveing an even chance in player vs player combat because of a client bug that doesn't effect all clients equally. Bugs are bad enough, but a bug that discriminates agains part of the player base fire people up REALLY fast.

An example of a client hack would be to hack the timer which determines how long it takes to cast a spell in the game. Suddenly that player's characters can cast spells twice as fast as other people. They need to be able to detect such hacks from the server side so that they can ban those players.

Developing a game that players can play on multiple platforms is likely going to be too complicated to be practical. It's just too likely that they will piss off their customer base, significantly increase development and especially testing costs, and not gain nearly enough users to justify the effort.

Why?

[athmanb]

Is there any evidence to the fact that the ancient inhabitants of Norrath were into something else than waiting for some monster to respawn?

Oh totally

[gvonk]

I know dude; I too am very open-minded about people's tastes and activities. I was just making a joke to mask my *sniff* insecurity ;)

Re:answers

[Anonymous Coward]

Before I answer the questions first this topic seems to be based upon rumors alone. Sony hasn't announced a release date for EverQuest on PS2 (eventhough it's likely that they will at some time). It's more likely that FFXI will be the first MMORPG tobe released on PS2. Also it's been confirmed that the planned relase date for the ethernet card(ie. online network) is August. PlanetPS2 has the full story.

1) How will it deal with the lack of keyboard? Communicating (and thus forming parties) will be more difficult
Answer) they'll likely sell a keyboard for it
2) Will the lack of hard drive effect anything? It seems that the game will be un-patchable and unable to work with expansion packs
Answer) You should remember that PS2 is a console not a PC. Standalone games are typically released for consoles. Thus if the first release of a game is fairly succesful a sequal can be expected. However, if Sony did want to release downloadable expansion packs their hard drive would be required. A hard drive has been announced, but no release date is planned thus far. The prob with releasing a hard drive is addons are notorious downfalls for systems (think SegaCD, 32X, etc.). Typically a small percent of gamers purchase the addons therefore for a game to rely on an addon that is not included with the system would be very risky.

Re:answers

[Anonymous Coward]

oops I was wrong, Sony has indeed releassed a release date for PS2 Everquest of sometime in 2003. PlanetPS2 and gamespot both have new articles on it. The game will be all new for the system. However their ethernet card is still being released in August so I conclude that FFXI will still be the first MMORPG for the system.