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The War Between p2p and Record Companies Heating Up?
the-dude-man writes "Securityfocus.com Reports that there may be a new nasty turn to the battle between the p2p networks and the RIAA/MPAA. recently, the RIAA has been trying to flood kazza with files that appear to be valid copyrighted material (movies,mp3s, ect) but are empty or, in one case, of Madonna Louise Veronica Ciccone, contain a voice file asking, "What the f*ck do you think you are doing?". The p2p networks are considering a possible move agianst the RIAA in response to this by using recently enacted anti-spam laws."
Almost sad to see a portion of such a large industry going through its death throes. I imagine the horse & buggy manufacturers acted much the same about 100 years ago...
Stop by my site where I write about ERP systems & more
I sue the RIAA for $1.00 or something
I have to spend it quickly, because the RIAA is about to sue me for $17,000.
I'm not going to be the one who simultaneously antagonises the RIAA and admits in court that I tried to pirate music.
Most courts in an illegal contract will just leave the parties as they stand, unless one party can show less culpability such that they should be allowed some relief. The court could construe that by advertising a copyrighted work on a P2P network, that in itself is illegal, and therefore, whoever recieves that file would not be able to claim that they were defrauded by getting a fake file. While it's a nice conflict of law here, I don't think it will fly.
I spent ages on KaZaA looking for the fuck off Madonna track, filling my computer with propert Madonna material.
The historians can't seem to settle whether to call this one "The Third Net War" (or the fourth), or whether "The First P2P War" fits better. We just call it "The **AA War." Everything up to then and still later were "incidents," "patrols" or "police actions."...
My days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle...
RIAA members are going to see their sales shrink again this year. Kazaa is only one manifestation of the mp3 trading that will doom them. Many I know, don't use Kazaa, they just trade with friends via CD-R, DC++ and S-FTP.
I was driving near the airport in SF in Feb. I looked at the car next to me. I saw a teenage girl leafing through a 3-ring binder full of CD-R's with band/album names drawn on the CD-R with a black marker. With or without Kazaa and public p2p, these guys are going to lose another 10% this year.
Musicians will have to make a living from live performances.
IEEE Spectrum Magazine's topic for the month of May is "Invasion of the Music Snatchers." A number of copying and filesharing attacks and counterattacks are discussed.
Many of this month's articles are online, but if you are not an IEEE member you are limited to the "publicfeature" URL's.
Flooding networks with spam files will just result in networks becoming smarter to route around the garbage. Suppose for example that new p2p networks use a weighted reputation system where individual content files can be rated by the users of the network. Of course, positive ratings by users who have good reputations would indicate that the file is good, likewise negative ratings for a file by reputable individuals would indicate that the file is garbage. Similar to how these comments are rated on Slashdot.
It's their own customers they're risking alienating. If they fight fair, they'll win, and deservedly so. If not, then there will be consequences. It's as simple as that.
woxy.com - Bam! The Future of Rock and Roll
I used to do this a lot when you had to upload 2 songs for every one you downloaded via ftp.
what im wondering is why these "corrupt" files are a threat to p2p. how can they they propogate on something like kazaa? seems to me bogus files would be deleted by the user in an instant.
KaZaA Lite has a webpage with verified downloads (seems to be under construction, right now). Or just google. That simple.
Despite this, there is a rating system in KaZaA Lite.
Excellence: Moderate (mostly affected by comments on your karma)
...P2P trust model infrastructures.
It looks like the RIAA/MPAA are driving innovation, for a change.
"What the f*ck do you think you're doing?"???
I guess when the RIAA doesn't have any arguments, insults are the next best thing.
Oh ya the cold war between riaa/mpaa and geeks is getting hotter!
You can't win.
"What the f*ck do you think you are doing?"
Isn't that harassment? Kazaa is so far a legal program. Until it's declared otherwise I don't think I should have to deal with obscenities screamed at me by one group that doesn't like what I'm doing.
The coolest voice ever.
The "what the fuck" clip has already even been remixed. The site with the links for that is here.
A screenshot of madonna's hacked site can be found here.
Any legal action taken by the P2P companies against RIAA would fail under equitable estoppel (aka. the "clean hands doctrine").
If the networks were simply being flooded with random garbage, they might have a case. But since the complaint is one of misrepresentation -- that the files appear to be valid copyrighted material -- the P2P networks clearly do not have "clean hands" with respect to people searching for those files.
Tarsnap: Online backups for the truly paranoid
I just can't feel bad for anyone who intentionally tried to download Madonna 'music'.
"Similar to how these comments are rated on Slashdot."
Yes, thats sure to work. What planet do you live on, I dont need to use a p2p client to use the network, roll youre own tools. Morals? What morals? As for ratings? I shall click "Hell yeah download this" on ever freaking shitty copy.
I guess i should have known that i was getting a fake file when i had 175 users. Oh well it was new weird al so no major loss =]
You can find the original "wtf do you think you're doing" Madonna mp3, along with a pile of remixes at the Madonna Remix Project.
It's about fucking time they did this. I was thinking of this myself about a week ago....I was attempting to download the movie "Identity" which only took less than an hour using Kazaa with my cable modem.
I couldn't find the real one at fasttrackmovies.com or their forum, so I had to guess at which one would be the real one. I tried twice and they were both fakes.
Man, was I pissed. I started thinking about the waste of bandwidth that had just occured and wished these fuckers would get nailed for spam.
I finally got it off of Bit Torrent, but how long before these motherless sons of bitches start poisoning the BT files as well?
I agree. While I'm not for the death of networks like Kaaza. If this forces us to use 'smarter' networks (freenet) then its a good thing. Just like what the death of Napster did.
My days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle...
I was watching Celebrity Justice of Fox (I know, I know) and apparently the person saying that line on the music files is Madonna herself.
Its dissappointing that people in the music industry dont seem to understand the concept of free advertising...
-- "Man is born free, and everywhere he is in chains." Jean Jacques Rousseau
Unlike spam, you solicit your downloads by choice. If they used a bug in a P2P network to fill people's hard drives with crap unsolicited, the anti-spam angle would seem workable. As it is you solicit their system to engage in obvious copyright infringement. Your claim for relief against fraud for an for an 'unpaid' service while attempting to break the law is going to be seriously weak.
I think you'd have a better chance asking the judge to prosecute someone for selling you a joint filled with oregano. At least in that case, you gave someone money and thus (in most states) there is an implied contract of fitness for the generally recognized use of the product.
On the one hand, you really can't FAULT the RIAA for trying to do something, but on the other hand the route they're taking amounts to essentially vigilante justice. Whether you think people SHOULD be allowed to share music or not, they AREN'T at the moment, so (technically) should be "punished." It is not up to the RIAA to dole out this punishment, however. What they're doing is also wrong. Two wrongs don't make a right (my mommy taught me that, happy mother's day to her).
Madonna Louise Veronica Ciccone
... you mean to say someone has figured out her last name?
Wow
The One Rule Of Chess You'll Ever Need: Don't play someone who carries a kit in their bookbag.
I prefer the third option for the RIAG(estapo).
The RIAA should stick to legit services like Apple has started and stop the electronic goosing - it's hardly the high road.
The P2Ps should 'fess up, at least to themselves, lose the weak arguments (95 percent of what they claim as justification) and realize they are in fact trading in illegal-by-contract goods and should be grateful they're around this long.
Theyre really just treading water in "it's-only-illegal-if-you-get-caught land. Silly basis for an industry.
And remember, for the most part, you get what you pay for. It doesn't matter how scammed the traders get, and it doesn't matter what the RIAA does, it won't stop them.
A fair and well-managed system will. When it's reasonable, people will pay and use just like books. The VCR didn't kill the video rental or sales industry, and the copier doesn't stop a single sale at Borders or B&N. Granted digital copying makes things easier, and the ecoonomics helps, but that's what needs to be in the new model. Most people with most traditional media would rather have a legit copy than a pirated one.
"Win treats sysadmins better than users. Mac treats users better than sysadmins. Linux treats everyone like sysadmins."
First of all, the RIAA has been doing this (flooding Kazaa with fake music files) for ages, at least a year, so this is not new news. Anyone who uses Kazaa a lot knows this. Secondly, what they are doing is not spam. It has nothing to do with email, and besides, it is solicited. When you search for "dave matthews band" and you get all sorts of "dave mathews band.exe" and "dave matthews band.html" which are all 16kb in size, you asked for it. And really, if someone else wants to create such a file and share it, that is their choice. By using Kazaa and performing searches, you have to expect this sort of thing (lots of bad hits from searches). Apple's music service will not have this problem, but of course Kazaa is free, and illegal, so what do you expect?
I loathe Madonna's music, but I really wanted a copy of her saying that, I don't know why. I looked, and I couldn't find a fake song of hers on the Kazaa network.
Does anyone have a file name & size to look for?
jred
I'm not a mechanic but I play one in my garage...
1) What the F*ck Do You Think You Are Doing? - Madonna ...
2) F*ck Off and Buy the %$#^*@! CD - Metallica
3) We Don't Want Your P2P - Hillary and the Shylocks
4)
In other entertainment news, a startling shift has occurred in Madonna's music style as the lyrics to her latest #1 single are found to be far less offensive than usual and the song far more musical in general.
Sigs are bad for your health.
nt= you leeching son of a bitch
... or is the RIAA getting real desperate? It amuses me that their broad 'onslaught' of lawsuits against P2P networks, downloaders, uploaders, etc.. as well as more 'creative' activities such as these envisioned to battle illegal copying of shared digital media had almost zero effect on its proliferation. P2P file sharing is alive and kicking and I just bought myself a brandnew Sony car radio that - big surprise - also plays MP3s (what irony I might add). UPS is also in the process of delivering my shiny new KISS DP-500 from Europe, which plays DVDs and - you probably guessed it - DivX and Xvid files as well (and it has an Ethernet port - droool ;-)
So, I really wonder what the RIAA's vision of the future is - obviously they are paying a lot of people (i.e. lawyers) very high consulting fees to come up with something to preserver their 'interest' (pun intended) - and this is the BEST they can come up with? LOL
Seriously - a friend of my and I came up with a working, commercial P2P digital distribution model 3 years ago, that would kick illegal copying to the curb since it actually rewarded people for downloading. We actually pitched it to the usual suspects and got laughed at. I'm actually surprised that noone has replicated our effort up to this point - maybe I'll pick up on it when I'm done with my current company.
Maybe Rosen should buy herself a copy of 'Sun Tsu' (a book about the art of warfare which predates the bible) - and I quote: 'fighting a protracted war against an overwhelming and resourceful enemy should be avoided at all cost.' It is time that the RIAA fesses up to its evils and relinquishes these silly stabs against P2P downloaders - they just wind up pissing off their greates asset - the kids willing to pay good money for concerts and 'affordable music' (Rosen: re-read the last sentence three times).
Hell yea, use the anti-spam laws to counter the effects of the DMCA. That would be so ironic. The RIAA can choke.
After all, it now tells the RIAA which users are supplying "the best dope" to the p2p system.
Then now have an awfully good system to find just who to target... the users that are providing the best goods.
Imagine (bear with me) that all drug users had an online survey to report just who their favourite dealers were. Don't you think the Drug Czar would pay attention, and go after the providers of the best smack first?
Support a few technologists in Washington.
In most countries, it is not illegal to download copyrighted music. It's illegal to redistribute copyrighted music against the wishes of the copyright holder.
The RIAA can't come after you just for downloading music. You have to be actively re-sharing that music out again to break a law.
On the flip side, though, you are not procuring that music through legal/legitimate means, so you may not be granted certain protections and warranties that you might otherwise be granted, so your law suit might be tricky.
Your jurisdiction may differ, though.
The battle between RIAA and P2P users actually bears some fruit. As the rules for engagement become dirtier and dirtier, I hope people see the sad shape the industry is in and the need for change is recognized.
I'd love to think all of this fuss will wake people up to the fact that the current music industry is incredibly flawed. At some point I hope some artists unite and stop going through the RIAA.
Sadly, in today's world I wonder if any good change will ever be realized... at least Apple's music service is a good start. It's too bad that at 128Kbps in AAC a lot of audiphiles won't bother with it.
Very neat.
After Madona flooded the P2Ps with mp3s of her repeatedly saying "what the fuck do you think you're doing?" somone took an appropriate response by hacking her website, posting her full new album on it, and writting "This is what the fuck I think I'm doing..."
Maybe, in the long run, instead of wasting money on P2P control (in the short-run they should continue it), they could bring all the participating record labels together and make purchasing music easier. At the same time, they should push a campaign about how morally wrong it is to pirate songs. (Of course, they are already doing it, but this should go together).
Music labels working together could make custom CDs and, maybe, even DRMed music downloads (for MS Win and Mac users at least) from across music labels. This is especially beneficial for custom CDs.
For instance, I want songs A, B,...,K. Songs, E and G are owned by Klingons while songs F and K by Romulans. The rest are owned by the Borg. Furthermore, except for songs A and B, all other songs are from different artists or different albums.
A good part of P2P users are probably doing it because they find it difficult to buy 200 different CDs in which more than 65% of the songs are not what you want.
Thank you
GrimReality (The Idiot)
2003-05-11 16:51:54 UTC (2003-05-11 12:51:54 EDT)
leaching peice o'shit
But if they're allowed this solution, they shouldn't be allowed legal redress as well, or their response would be disproportionate. I would hope that the courts would and will recognise this in their considerations.
But seriously, I can't see how this does anything other than shift the rules of the game back to the way they were: copying between friends was fine (and will still be better - and faster - than it was in the cassette days), but the wanton copying between people who have neither met nor would care to will decrease as the costs of copying in terms of time and effort increase.
Sorry, couldn't resist :)
What about the movies that are family titles that are actually cheap pornos, maybe they are behind that as well!
My favorite band of about 6 years, Guster, has a very nifty little system for music sharing. They're releasing a new album come June 24th, Keep It Together, and they've released all of the songs on Kazaa, but replaced the lyrics with "meow"'s, the songs are all labelled with the actual name, but have no voice.. Just Brian, the congeuro, using a "meow mix" machine that produces different pitches of "meow". It's been great though, because you get to hear the excellent instrument work, and the sound of the album... just to wet your wistle. They also released 5 of their new songs on their website in Flash formats... While I have already recorded them to WAVs and then encoded them to MP3 (for my personal use on my MP3 player), it will prevent most music listeners from ripping the songs from Kazaa or other P2P networks. Mike
I've spent too much time chasing windmills.
Gnutella's use of SHA1 checking seems to work well; unless the Dark Powers set up a large number of servers with the bogus files, most people will delete the fake tracks. If what you got doesn't match up with the SHA1 of most of the hosted copies, you've probably got a garbage file.
That's not a soda... it's a caffeine delivery device!
They MIGHT pull out of this slump and not be a dying breed.
It would help out the starving artists too.
For better or worse, the world is changing, and they need to adapt, and not just piss on their customers every chance they can get if they want to survive..
---- Booth was a patriot ----
What ever happened to "It's ALL about the music maaaan..." ?
I want to say something to the selfish artists: you guys are greedy. You used to be cool, but now you want money and to "make it big." If you want to do that, fine. But you are sell-outs. You are not genuine anymore. You instantly become phony-balony manufacturing tools the moment you sign away your heart and soul.
Not when you take the stage to rap against eminem, but the VERY INSTANT you sign! You hesitate before signing your name, then you feel shame as you are writing it, and finally you know you have lost all honor when you dot the "i" in your middle-name, "Idiot".
Consider many points of view when you sell your art in public.
I suggest you read Slashdot
I've submitted stories that were rejected, only to show up later. Don't take it personally, it happens.
This was news about 2 weeks ago. Even the security focus article was posted on May 04, 2003. TechTV had stuff about it last weekend.
.gov, .mil, etc address it would be useful too.
TechTV had an interview with one of the guys at one of the P2P companies and he said something like, "They are free to connect to our P2P network, but when they start using fradulant claims, flooding, and sending out unsolicited messages, they start to break user agreements."
It would be pretty easy to track down the networks they are using and then just have a little button in your P2P client that blocked their networks. There are programs to do this, but they seem to not work 100% of the time. If it also blocked known
Why read the article when I can just make up a snap judgement?
If you look in my car you wont see a single pressed cd.
I copy ALL the cds that i use in the car.. the summer heat, and scratches from chuckholes, are murder on cds.. and since you cant exchange them except for buying a NEW one at retail cost... i wont risk the orginals..
Hey, thats 'fair use'.. regardless of what they want to believe/restrict.
---- Booth was a patriot ----
I was in the record store the other day and saw Madonna's new album. I remembered that she had done her silly little 'what the f**k do you think you're doing' thing.
On a whim I put some other CDs on top to hide her regurgitaged euro dance crap.
Now every store I go into I do that... Just my little way of protest...
On my piffling dial-up connection, all the legit files are on average 2 to 4Kbps, whereas all the fake files download at 7 to 15Kbps (which is inconceivable for a regular file download, and only usual when downloading a web page.)
That makes them pretty identifiable.
Corporation, n. An ingenious device for obtaining individual profit without individual responsibility. - Ambrose Bierce
Yarr matey! I know just how ye feel.
Those scurvy dogs at the RIAA have already made peg legs illegal leaving me with no leg to stand on, but now they've kidnapped me pet parrot and replaced 'im with one that just says "What the fuck do you think you're doing? ARRWK!".
This be the last straw.
Was mentioned far above, better.
In addition, the user has a history of copying others ideas - see previous posts comapred to higher threads.
Check out the Madonna remix project for the original sample and some nice remixes.
The "All Your Fucking Music Are Belong To Us" remix is nice :)
How small a thought it takes to fill a whole life
The RIAA could be more deceptive with P2P networks if they were smart enough. What about putting large files out there with ten seconds of a song and the rest static? That would get people to waste their time downloading junk files. Or songs with "skips" in various places in the last half of the song? Downloaders with analog modems would suffer the most in this scenario. And who would know if it was the RIAA doing this or just Joe User who can't create MP3s properly? This little Madonna incident isn't very creative, IMHO.
haha, i thought exactly the same and searched deperately for that. To me madonna saying "what the fuck" sounds so sexxxxxy - a lot better than the song. There are many like us dude,Check this page out
Siggy Say, Siggy Do
I usually try not to be this anal, but please try to spell KaZaA right-- I help administer this site, and as you might guess, about 90% (my estimate) if not more of the traffic taking up bandwidth is people looking for P2P software.
and yeah, I know it's a mess. we're working on it.
cheers
p
[nt]
I will trace you and skull fuck your eyesockets.
Soulseek, the P2P client, doesn't really have problems like that because of its more community-oriented nature. I have about 10 users that I download albums from who I know always have real mp3s ID3ed correctly at 192kbps.
My Journal - 1,337 fans and countin
You mean in the way that eMule does? (I don't know about eDonkey and the others) I've started to download several files only to find in the comments that the files were fake. I've even let a few finish just so I could see for myself and they were actually marked correctly.
=]
bork bork bork!
> Granted, they need to be in compliance with the law as they take swipes at pirates...but c'mon, they're still pirates.
Exactly! And there are existing laws to deal with piracy.
Maybe I'm wrong, but don't the P2P companies keep claiming that they have no control over what is shared, and it is for sharing any file people want? Then why would it be wrong for the RIAA to share these files? And better yet, why would they care enough to sue, since according to them, they have no control and want no control, yet they want to control what the RIAA puts on there? If they can do that (even by lawsuit) shouldn't they have to control what other users put on, including copyrighted material?
"Information wants to be expensive" - Stewart Brand, the same guy who said "Information wants to be free"
laws in cyberspace?
people say what they want, do what they want
Its international waters and there is no real jurisdiction.
I guess that what I'm saying is vigilante justice is the only means at their disposal and they can try to fight this war.
But considering most musicians I've encountered are scared of "the internet" and "computers", its like sending a house-wife into a warzone with a bb-gun. They aren't prepared for the war.
Maybe, but one of the reasons P2P hasn't been used for more legitimate purposes is because the networks are spammed with the RIAA's crap. Much of it is stupid people putting up the real music, but the RIAA flooding makes it worse.
Say you want to find a picture of the madonna. Even if you type "virgin madonna"--guess what will pop up? A thousand entries for "Madonna-Like a Virgin.mp3". Yeah, maybe you can add jpg to the search, but you'll lose the pngs, gifs, etc. If you want to find a audio discussion, forget it.
So we use SHA-1 or another cryptographically secure hash to refer to data, and trusted sources of hash information. You use a hash tree, so that you can have your client detect bogus files partway through download and delete them. The MP/RIAA cannot afford to pay for 1 byte of bandwidth for each bogus byte sent to a user. They depend on propagation of bogus files.
Hell, Razor and other clearly illegal cracking and warez groups have had well-orchestrated release policies for years. (As a matter of fact, warez releases have reached a point where they are more consistently packaged than commercial software.) It's far easier to do so with P2P. Use cryptographic signatures. "Yup, this hash tree file was signed by Razor." Piece o' cake. Releasing databases of signed hash trees in an anonymous, distributed manner is also easy -- Freenet can already do this.
I have some other ideas that I'm working on for some of the other attacks on P2P networks, but this really isn't a problem -- we've had folks putting spam files on P2P for years, and there are good solutions for it.
May we never see th
You can use the laws from the european community to put a hold on those company's.
What the fuck do you think you are doing?
Does that baby look like it's strangling the virgin madonna? And boy, what an ugly baby!
social sciences can never use experience to verify their statemen
If you search for copyrighted material, and the RIAA or their cronies offer you the file, then you do not have "clean hands". But they always respond to all queries. I have actually tried to find non-copyrighted non-music materials on Kazaa, and the RIAAs intervention made it difficult.
Try search kazaa for "American Flag", "US constitution", or "The RIAA agrees to donate $50 to the FSF if you attempt to download this file". They will return a hit for each one.
In light of Kazaa/gnutella/p2p being a communications medium useful for more than mp3 trading, they are violating the law.
Hmm... *thinks hard*
Perhaps more downloads of sig2dat? (part of K++, you know that hacked Kazaa with no spyware)
Or perhaps people will just switch to networks that have used file hashes from the beginning, like eDonkey, etc. RIAA will have a hard time fooling those.
Beware: In C++, your friends can see your privates!
I like to do the MP3s my self... most music on kazza is poorly made 128 kbps...
I just borrow cds from my friends and rip them...
Ask me no questions, and I'll tell you no lies...
Yes, and eDonkey even use a hash *as well* as having support for a comment system. So you'd be pretty damn stupid if you still happen to pick the fake file. :-)
Beware: In C++, your friends can see your privates!
Maybe p2p network which allows to spread fakes is just broken by design? In Edonkey2000 every file is identified by hash, so when you have correct hash it is not possible to fake that file in any way. Of course someone can still put fakes in network, but they won't spread.
Overall - this is good thing, broken p2p networks will shrink, and good networks like edonkey will grow. Evolution.
Please don't spread the word about Soulseek. Especially not on big sites like Slashdot. The central sever is overloaded enough as it is, the audiogalaxy crowd have almost ruined it already. If spreading the word meant more paying users, then maybe they could afford to upgrade the server, but the I don't think advertising it on Slashdot brings the right kind of people.
And for those of you not in the know, Soulseek is primarily for electronic music, so don't go there to download the latest Britney album.
How small a thought it takes to fill a whole life
riaa.org again! DDoS! DDoS! DDoS!
I thought music was an art? All about the consumer?
Who gives a damn about selling CDs? No one but the RIAA, Musicians tour and give concerts and would make more money without the RIAA around, Fans would be given more concerts and better overall deals along with cheaper music.
Looks like both the creators of art and the consumers of art win with P2P, if we are a democracy and not a plutocracy, we should have a vote on it and if the people decide on P2P, the laws should be changed.
Outlawing P2P in my opinion does more harm to the industry than making it legal, musicians cant make money because of the contracts with the RIAA not allowing them to use P2P to advertise their concerts.
You see, P2P makes a musician popular enough to give concerts, and this is where the real money is made.
College students wont pay for music, but we will pay to go to a concert, I go to the movies more now that P2P exists than I did before it existed, I'll be going to see the Matrix, and I WILL buy software if its at a decent price,
People who think P2P makes the industry lose money, they are right the guys in suits who dont create anything lose money, and I hope they all go bankrupt, but the musician gains money and the consumer gains quality service, better concerts, and can get music at a better price.
What ever happened to democracy? the DMCA wasnt requested by anyone but CEOs and lobbyists who dont even make music.
If you use Linux, please help development of Autopac
I'll make music, so will every other musician, do you know why? The musicians dont make money selling CDs, we make money selling concert tickets!
I'd spread my music all over the net, just so I can sellout at all my concerts and make $20,000 in a day, about the same amount I'd make in a year selling CDs if I made anything at all.
Theres no shortage of wannabe musicians, some which have talent, I suggest you go outside more, theres free concerts all the time all over the place, because musicians are desperate for fans.
Fans matter more than CD sales, CD sales only matter to record companies, Fans go to concerts, buy Tshirts, and give musicians the big money.
A musician is not a doctor or engineer, you arent trained to do it, you can take a kid and give him a mic and this kid could be the best singer of all time (Think Michael Jackson),
Under this Model we will have increased supply, the quality will be just as good, but because there will be more to choose from, YOU might not like alot of the new music flooding the market, this doesnt change the fact that there will be alot of music you will like.
Whats wrong with increasing the supply? Music is not a profession its an art.
If you use Linux, please help development of Autopac
If everyone started using that, the RIAA would just start marking lots of legitimate files as fakes.
Look at regular TV, its free, thats the only reason why its so successful.
Look at the internet, its free, and its successful.
Then you have the music industry, which isnt free, and the RIAA controls almost 100 percent of the industry, this is the probblem. Cable is a niche market which you dont need to watch tv, theres pay sites on the net, which you dont really need, but they fill a niche,
The RIAA controls every type of music imaginable, and has a monopoly, they dont let independent music on MTV, so they wonder why people pirate their music?
Why not let some free Music get play on MTV and maybe people wouldnt pirate the RIAA so much anymore.
Honestly most of the music I listen to is from independent artists anyway.
If you use Linux, please help development of Autopac
Contact the John Cage estate and tell them the RIAA is distributing copies of Cage's copyrighted silence (4'33", exactly 4 minutes and 33 seconds of silence). They've won cases against people infringing against their silence in the past. If they're distributing any substantial chunk of silence as "music", it's probably a copyright violation.
The RIAA goes out of business and loses its monopoly on the industry.
Artists make money on tours, at clubs, having concerts. CD sales are for the record companies, the artists dont usually see a penny.
Why should an artist need to pay a record company back now? Record companies dont do anything anymore, we dont need them anymore.
Artists have the internet and P2P companies now, the problem is, record companies cant stand competition, so they want to fight the technology.
I say let the record companies burn in hell, all of them, their musicians will continue to make music when they are gone, most of these musicians will actually make more money, the quality of the music will most likely be the same because currently its not like record companies are recordinng music in surround sound.
Concerts are what really matters, shitty musicians like Britney Spears wouldnt survive because their concerts suck, Musicians like Michael Jackson would return to the spotlight, the overall talent would be on display, not just how much money a person paid a producer to help them write and make stuff, they need talent to do it on stage.
This is good for us because we'd get more music, kinda like how the comedy industry works, most comedians make money at shows, they dont make their money selling CDs and Videos, not unless they are extremely good.
If you use Linux, please help development of Autopac
Actually, the indie scene is thriving on it as well.
My Journal - 1,337 fans and countin
I know.. it's sad :(
Used to just be us elitist IDM'ers :)
How small a thought it takes to fill a whole life
Lovely CDR levy, even big box retailers are campaigning against it. It's pretty much the most blatantly ignorant legislation on this issue so far. A portion of every CDR sale is supposed to go to musicians...even if the CDR is not exclusively used for music. Retailers have to lower their margins to be competitive, and 'legitimate' users of the media have ot pay more. Go figure.
I hope that the lawyers for Kazaa etc... can find some means to sue
I think trying to go after the RIAA with anything other than technology on this one will only legitimize their claim that the purpose of P2P is to pirate media, not to share files in general.
Are people going to claim that it is somehow illegal to name your own files certain things and place these files in publicly available areas of your machine (I think there might be a case if it was harmful to the system downloading said files, trojans etc...), that sounds like an enormous restriction of ones right to control their own computer, you guys don't want that restricted do you?
"I'll have a Guinness, no wait, make that a Coors Light" -Grad student I work with, who shall remain anonymous...
Another story on Slashdot discussed Apple's newest p2p service, a pay
service (like $1 a song, $10 an album). The funny thing is, Apple's
made millions on this in the few weeks it's been running....
And the RIAA is claiming that there is no money to be made?
If I had an option to pay $1 for a music single I liked in MP3 format,
I'd jump on it.
I'd also note, MP3 is a lossy technology, even at best sampling, it
looses some data.
Karma Whoring for Fun and Profit.
I am reading through all these comments and no one seems to have nailed it.
The way I see it there are several reasons the RIAA is in trouble.
(in no particular order)
1. Todays music sucks donkey ass through a crazy straw. This is the oldest reason, and the reason why the RIAA loosing money predates Napster. On the surface it sounds like I am blaming the musicians, after all they are making the music. Wrong. Many years ago the RIAA realized that POP music is where all the money is. They have been ignoring decent artists for a while now in favor for people whom they consider low risk. It is those risky folks that put out great music.
2. Failure to acknowledge and take advantage of a changing marketplace. If the RIAA had been on the forefront of digital downloads this would be an entirely different, and I suspect legal marketplace. Instead they screamed and kicked like a 4 year old. No amount of wishing and suing will make the digital domain go away. For whatever reason that I cannot understand the RIAA refuses to even consider to adapt. My best guess is it is a poorly chosen use of 'pride'.
3. Abuse of there most loyal customers. I used to buy a lot of music. Something along the lines of 2 to 3 albums a month with the occasional splurge of a 5 album or a box set purchase. Then I began learning about my computer. Then I bought a CDRW drive. What I did next was to back up my investment. I am tired of scratching overpriced CD's and making them useless. I am tired of having them stolen. I am tired of having to track them down when I have misplace them. I am tired of having to decide what gets kept at work and what not. A PC and a CDRW drive (legally too I might ad) resolves all those problems. Now whenever I buy a CD I feel like a scmuck. I feel like I am being treated so badly by these people I must be out of my mind to spend money on the overpriced product.
That is no way for an industry to act. I should feel good buying there product.
The RIAA is dying and it is a death that cannot come soon enough.
Sooner or later a talented and smart musician will utilize the web and digital downloads to reach superstardom and cut the RIAA trappings out of the equation.
That day will be the axe to the neck of the RIAA and it cannot come too soon for the industry.
Users of the Agnitum Outpost firewall can download the Blockpost plugin which blocks access to sites at the IP level (i.e. you would not even be able to ping such restricted sites). A Blockpost filter list based on the P2P Enemies list can be found in this thread.
The thing is they have been doing this for quite a while. What you have to do is just type in the name of the song and then 'real.'
The problem with what they are doing is that the fake copies will eventually be deleted or what not. Nobody will upload fake crap if they know it's not real. Unless, that is, the RIAA started buying out college students to start uploading fake music, (It would look better than them persecuting them and turning them into martyrs)and in return they get either money or free memberships to legit P2P networks.
I should shut up now before the RIAA starts coming after me, asking me to upload garbage for them...
I just find it sad that the RIAA continues to sink lower and lower and lower... What next, the replacement for Hilary Rosen being a cross between Darth Vader, Bill Gates, and Cthulu?
you're limiting our ability to steal your shit, now give us your money.
>> A lot of people seem to think that record companies "need to adapt", which seems to be a shorthand for "sell things to us in the manner we want them sold, all terms dictated by us, and the price we want them sold at"
Yes, they're that strange alien race called "clients", who possess an interesting device called "money", which they got in exchange for hard work.
RIAA wants that "money" for a song.
RIAA should be protected from pirates, ok, but should _not_ have so much power as to attack civil liberties. This is so idiotically obvious!
If only there was a correlation between big bucks and music quality...
Piracy started because of them, in the first place. Nobody would pirate a 99 cent music... they can only pirate because there are lots of buyers who can't afford high prices.
RIAA wanted all, therefore lost all. This is only fair.
Uh... Since when? Real downloads usually range from 10KB/sec to 100KB/sec. And then there are a few times you might get a better (or worse) speed.
Luke-Jr
We all know how great Slashdot quality control is. :)
That teenagers are just about the only people downloading movies and/or music (and if they couldn't download it they'd find someone at school and copy the CD) everyone else who is not a teenager uses the P2P to download porn
To be honest I was not a big fan of music. That was of course until I discovered P2P. All the files you want, all of the time, for no price at all. So I started downloading music from System of a Down. I loved the band so much that I went out and bought all three of their CDs. I have them somewhere in my closet, unwrapped. I've done this with every artist I think deserves my money. Fact is, not everyone using P2P is a criminal. If the music industry does not enbrace the digital generation its future is doomed indeed.
> a voice file asking, "What the f*ck do you think you are doing?"
Huh? How the fuck do you pronounce that? "What the fasteriskck"? Doesn't make sense...
It looks like the RIAA and MPAA along with any corperation using laws like the DMCA are looking for a new Digital War a war that involves people to stand up for there rights of privacy and fair use. We are losing our rights and I for one am a fighter!!!!!!!!!!
I say this enough is enough lets start screaming!!! knocking real doors down start rising mailing the politions !!! Acting !!!
I really think DVD piracy is subsiding...You can get the DVD, with a bonus DVD and the sound track for a reasonable price, sometimes LESS than the cd music track alone !!!! While I've downloaded some DiVX's in my time the quality is not there and it is usually just a teaser before buying or actually renting, I'm a netflix addict these days :)
errr....umm...*whooosh* *whoosh* Is this thing on ?
The raw data of a CD would be easy to checksum with md5 but will mp3's checksum and who would be willing to provide a site for valid checksums. I haven't taken the time to setup the free web account I have but if a machine readable file shows up that I can verify I'll consider putting it online.
Also does
Two wrongs don't make a right....and when the RIAA pulls this crap, all they do is hurt their cause. This is why ultimately they will lose. This is a desperate act, much like someone who has nothing to lose would do. Their problem is, the RIAA has already lost. They just don't realize it yet. They had a two year window to embrace the new technology; instead they tried to squash it. Problem is, though you can kill a server room full of computers, you can never kill an idea. Every time they win a court battle and out one p2p program offline, three replace it. In fact, the tide is beginning to turn and they're now losing battles in court. Their response now is to break the law themselves, killing any credibility or moal high ground that they ever had. As I said, a true act of desperation on their part.
Unlike spam e-mail, p2p files are sought out by people wanting to download them. I should be able to have a file on my pc with any info I want, and whatever file title I want, and have it in a directory that's shared on a p2p network. If someone downloads it, and then sues me because it wasn't construed as a misleading file title, that's a serious erosion of my individual rights. The RIAA members should also have the right to share any files they want, even if they are intentionally misleading, through the same reasoning. It would be ironic if the RIAA were sued for sharing misleading files, but they couldn't identify and sue people actually distributing their copyrighted works illegally, as they've been trying to do in court now for some time, with limited success. Anyway, support of such legislation is a serious erosion of individual rights that should be frowned upon by this community. The courts got it right in letting Morpheus and Grokster off the hook. Let's not take a step backward by restricting what people can put on p2p networks.
Vote for Pedro
Her LATEST single. Search for her latest single. quality==128. size==over 1M.
...they're pissed because some people just aren't buying the same things again and again and again. I can only stand so much of the same crap. I've stopped listening to the radio. I haven't searched for an mp3 for my own amusement and delight in at least a year and a half. I download, pretty much, from technomusic.org or just sit with DI open over an mp3 stream. The CDs I make for my car are techno remixes and rips of CDs I own. I have become that anomoly of a person who owns just about every mp3 they have and prefers them for management space over CDs.
I still support the P2P experience.
Peer-to-peer networks are not responsible for their content. The only 'point of contact' is the software provider, but there are many of those, now. gnutella (the original client) is all but gone, replaced by a million clones. There's dc, dc++ and a few hundred clients and p2p networks like it. No one could ever watch them all.
The RIAA can't get a grip on the idea that they're slowly losing album sales to mediocrity. MTV is slowly disintegrating. The economy is in the trash, unemployment is fluctuating, but mostly towards the rising / steady mark, not towards the steady / dwindling one. It couldn't be that a decline in sales came from a decline of readily available money on hand, could it? Heaven forbid.
They're spending an awful lot of money on people who will be able to do one of two thing: make them regredt it, or be able to ignore it entirely.
I just finished a 6 month project downloading every mp3 I could remember by song or group.
Collection complete and backed up off line TWICE.
I got mine, Jack!
Actually I think this would be the best: Think something like .torrent, only with a public key infrastructure on top (i.e. PGP signature). Trust the keys of the major ripgroups (finding a trusted source for that shouldn't be too hard), and the RIAA/MPAA can try to fake as much as they like, but they only manage to fake a few blocks that'll be instantly recognized as bogus. At least that'll work well for movies, that have very few rippers. Audio might be slightly tougher, but no biggie I suppose. Note that I wouldn't mind having that on legal files as well, the biggest reason I don't like downloading anything off P2P networks is that I have no idea if it's been trojaned or not without going through a lot of trouble to find the right key and signature.
Kjella
Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
Careful with the community bit.
In the fevered view of the powers that be that quite easily becomes "hacking group", cf. Drink Or Die and related IRC purges.
What utter crap. Of my rather large CD collection, I'd say about 15% was produced by a large record label, and only about half was produced by a label at all. I don't infringe copyrights because the music spewed out by labels is almost completely crap, and the few bright spots I'm more than willing to pay for.
I get most of my CDs by going to shows and getting them (usually for free) from bands I like, or downloading the tunes from their websites.
Ever heard of marketing? Mailing lists? Salesmanship? Good old-fashioned pressing the flesh? I know lots of bands that do that to get people interested in their work. Oh wait... you mean you want musicians not to have to work at it?
Hello! Earth to Eminor! The music being spit out ALREADY lacks credibility. The quality ALREADY is no good. In fact, the only decent music I can find with a very few exceptions comes from people that RIAA members wouldn't touch with a 10-foot pole.
Hey, if you feel you need some suit to decide what music you should choose from, go for it. But don't act like they're doing the rest of us a favor, OK?
All's true that is mistrusted
...it just seems to be very hypocritical to me. I hate the fact that the **AA uses its seemingly infinite legal budget to stab at broke college students and and all the other users of P2P. At my school, recently the MPAA wanted to have the University kick the student out of school for sharing a copy of Austin Powers. I think that is a bit obsurd. The advocates complain that every new step in technology, the hackers (crackers) will be there to break and abuse it. The problem is as long as the steps continue to limit the features that people can use, people will revolt and just find a way around the new restrictions. Anytime you assume you are smarter than someone else, you will always eventually find an instance that you're wrong. That being said, if people are going to use "illegal" methods to crack their software, I don't see why they can do as much as possible to make it harder for them. The only people that are being hurt by a fake song on KaZaa are the people that are attempting to steal that song. (Okay, sure, you can say you're going to get a "back-up copy of a song that you own... Sure, that's what everyone is doing.... In that case, rip it yourself). Thus, you can't say "Heeey, the RIAA is making it harder for me to steal songs." Either you foot the money, or find a way to filter out the bad songs (checksums?) Anyway, how long can it be before the bands realize that they don't have to deal with the crap from the record companies. They get into a contract where the get $.50 (or less) on an album that is sold for $18. Sooner or later, they'll realize the record compainies are the enemy there... not the people who actually like the music.
The so-called discussion is in fact a goatse link.
Sounds to me like Blue Stone is using a 56K modem with data compression. An MP3 file (a compressed format) would download at the modem's speed limit. A blank or garbage file, probably full of repeating junk, might be highly compressible and therefore download much faster.
Fun with Anagarams! LADS HOST, SHALT DOS. HAS DOLTS. AD SLOTHS, HATS SOLD. ASS HO, LTD.
A MP3 or .OGG with an attached TXT file into the header or footer ascii info so that bands can distribute their music via p2p and advertise via the ascii info.
FSCK the music industry, I like my funker vogt, de/vision, and porn on beta while playing games more than n'sych, briteny spears or metallica.
Fun with Anagarams! LADS HOST, SHALT DOS. HAS DOLTS. AD SLOTHS, HATS SOLD. ASS HO, LTD.
I think you are saying the same thing about music. That putting files on the sharing networks can actually HELP the music sell in stores. And this is so true.
The thing is that if allowing bootlegs is profitable, well then they should make it so. But a company making bad business decisions is no excuse for the general public to override it. It is after all their copyright and they have the right to be as anal about it as the law permits. And we as consumers have the right not to accept that and not to buy it. But taking something for free because we do not want to pay the price is wrong. Be it for information or physical property.
Kjella
Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
Begun the spam wars have.
i live on an island, its 7 mile drive from mainland, then i have to drive another 10 miles to the store, and pay $25 for a cd that i only want maybe 2 songs on it. its just too expensive. anyone get their cd's stolen? how much fun is that getting those back, if i have cdr's of musik, no one steals those. and most of the musik i listen to are not even sold in this country! much easier to d/l them.
SimonTek
So.. if the whole premise is that the RIAA's and Madonna's actions "are deceptive" and "affect commerce," and it's a given that they're being deceptive, how is it again that P2P inteference is "affecting commerce"?
... but then completely neglects to explain how the RIAA's actions actually "affect" commerce while going on at lengths to describe how the actions are deceptive.
So says the article:
'The actions of RIAA and MPAA in placing files on p2p networks to deceive users of those networks into thinking they're actual music or video files, to waste their time, resources, energy and bandwidth (not to mention hard drive space and CPU cycles) quite likely is "deceptive" and undoubtedly "affects commerce."'
Oh, so he thinks that wasting someone's free time and a few fractions of a cent worth of hard drive storage somehow qualifies as "affecting commerce"?
Does he think that the commerce in this case is the transaction of the consumer and their ISP? Who says there's a guarantee that the customer must have clean connectivity and that disconnects, packet loss, and other forms of network problems aren't part of this nebulous "commerce"?
And who says that inserting machines onto a P2P network that say, "Yea, I have that song. Here!" and then send chunks of garbage to the requester is illegal to begin with? Does that mean that anyone who causes a song or movie to be corrupted to the receiver (for example, by deliberately jiggling the network cable) is similarly liable? Is corruption defined as missing pieces, too?
This is all such fucking bullshit. The answer is superior technology and networking that is robust to interference, not lawyers and legislation.
The only people fucking whining about Madonna inserting those samples are the ones who are too stupid to use a network that enforces file integrity with MD5 or rsync-like rolling hashes. Let the whiners whine. Madonna and people like her aren't going away. The solution is to deal with it with a better P2P network, not to sue Madonna into the dirt. As soon as we do that, we're no better than them.
Sheesh. Haven't we learned anything yet?
Since they are now CREATING bogus files, this would constitute the most original recording they have made in 20 years. Matt Groening and Fox are taking this to another level. They are now creating pirate Simpsons T-shirts that look great when you buy them at some shady swap-meet, then fall apart in the washing machine... oh, wait, that's what the LICENCED one did...
And they proposed to their girlfriend. Thats whats truely funny about it. His proposal was to hack Madonna's web page and let the whole world see it.
I bet Madonna felt nearly as used as the unlucky few who downloaded her fake files...
$17 for her new disc??
Hope she did...
Yawn blah blah RIAA blah blah blah get some news!
woah...
edit that above.
i just read the article. Was i off on the proposal
Looking for info in Linux - look for a "howto". Looking for info about the game of Go - use the koren term "baduk".
Independant musicians should agree on a unique word to aid searchers in finding their sites - something like "indepmusic". Well, that one kinda sucks, but if there was such a word - searching would be way easier.
What changed under Obama? Nothing Good
Apparently not. PIRACY IS ILLEGAL UMMMKAY? Get over yourselves. Either BUY the music, or don't, but don't perpetuate illegalities because they want to put bogus files on a p2p network. Thats the NATURE of p2p. TOTALLY OPEN. If you want to pirate music/movies/software/etc, EXPECT TO GET FUCKED OVER. IT IS ILLEGAL TO PIRATE.
jesus.
Now didn't the so-called PATRIOT Act (enacted in such a hurry after 9-11) make attacking a computer network an act of terrorism? My question is, why don't the people decry the RIAA's "P2P Warfare" as such an act? I'd love to see the RIAA get what they deserve, but to use a bad law in a good way would be a first. What do you think?
The rest of the $50,000+ software and mp3's I got off kazaalite wuz free
muahahahahhaha
Yes, just check all your downloads, delete any fake files, relabel everything correctly, and the network will remain relatively clean.
Can someone tell me where i can get a sample of Madonna saying "What the f*ck do you think you are doing?" ? (And please don't say Kazaa, I wouldn't want to risc downloading a real Madonna mp3 and thusly violate her copyright!)
If Google really cared they would fix Android Chrome to reflow text, instead of discriminating
I downloaded the song from the copyright holder and got a "corrupt" file. So I download the same song the RIAA offered from a different source. Since they're offering it for free I have their implied consent to download it from somewhere else.
A good lawyer could use this to weaken their copyright.
You may or may not like this type of music http://www.gentlemanj.com/ but there are thousands of free music sites around - I actually have round a thousand of CDs, all legal and most copied to mp3, BUT I really don't like to pay extra to people who only collect the money - I like to pay creators.
... listening to Madonna?!?!
Mongrel News all the news that fits and froths
Ok, is it me, or while so many people are focusing on problems downloading the supposed 'crap' that the big labels are feeding you, and on the 'war' to counter their countermeasures, and getting outraged, etc... what both sides are effectively doing is destroying the viability of the P2P model for music. Isn't this _exactly_ what the RIAA wants ? The threat to the them is that artists can distribute content globally, instantly, and without any help from the big labels, not that people will continue to download the Back Street Boys (and hence buy into the big label crap machine). I'm all for flagging RIAA backed content - for the Exclude filters !
It's an old trick from a bunch of old thinkers, and as we over 30 know, age and treachery will always overcome youth and enthusiasm.
Keep your eye on the ball people.
"Whoever would overthrow the liberty of a nation must begin by subduing the freeness of speech."--Benjamin Franklin
Debunking the "59 Deceits"
Vocal Jazz Director--LOL!!
Poor understanding of PHP--LOL!!!
Playing Card references as insults--LOL!!!!
Dinosaur defending dinosaurs--LOL!!!!!
nimwitted and retarded juvenile who lacks a superego. Goddammit, highschool teachers are the biggest hypocrites--LOL!!!!!!
A blank or garbage file, probably full of repeating junk
So how can you tell the difference between a file that's full of repeating junk that's fake and a file of repeating junk that's what the RIAA tries to pass off as music? (sorry, just too easy).
Good judgment comes from experience, and a lot of that comes from bad judgment.
Business prop. Take a P2P setup with a twist. Allow purchasing. Allow sales (discount or the like) of music through this site with the legitimate distributors. Encourage users to proudly let the RIAA and U.S. goverment know enmasse what the stats are of users and music bought per person. semi anonimizing by showing the the max ratio min and average ratios of music bought to users to amount downloaded. And ignore the fact that some (for now) independent labels are doing something similiar.
And the awnser is: A dupe.
I would much rather face a dupe than an "Upgrade" from microsoft.. (I am living the hell of upgrading to Win2K)rather than the easy upgrade to linux because of compatability issues, plus Linux does not support my faviorate games unless you want to jump through many hoops.
I am not ragging on the community, however I am right on the cusp of picking windoze 2000 vs. Mandrake.
Not a simple choice let me tell you!
PS. My spelling sucks worse, Reading it. My grammer is not so good, My feelings are there for the exposiure.
I expect a lot of flames, but at least I speak from my heart.
I dreamed about her asking me what the fuck I was doing, but it had nothing to do with music.
The article Slashdot your representative has been reposted from floating atoll ; please see the site for updates, responses, etc.
One advantage of not being totally decentralized is that you have influence, legally. Now the Internet community can actively use the laws it's helped pass. There needs to be more of this kind of thing; it just takes a few more votes. Participate!
I propose a modification to Slashdot, such that users who have logged in and provided a name, address, and 9-digit zip code (in the united states) or a 6-digit post code (in the united kingdom) are shown a new link with articles: Contact your representative.
Now the Slashdot effect serves to enable millions of hits a day with the chance to vote. The last figure I remember was hearing was 30,000 unique visitors a day; imagine if ten percent of them each send one fax to their representative. Suddenly they're hearing the voices of three thousand Slashdot users, clearly, once a day.
Now do it more often. For every article. And support the United Kingom efforts, too. Other countries, too; perhaps a distributed network of Slashdot users with modems.
Well the record industry ripped us off of millions of dollars, and a class action suit that they spent a ton of money on and lost, got the consumers (if you are one of the lucky ones) a pair of cheap 'bud' earphones....I'll listen to downloaded music with mine!
if there is one strand of which i can agree with the RIAA persuing legal action against someone is if they actually stole the copy---that is they took studio quality audio and ripped it [before it was released on cd]. that's what they are all pissed off about, isn't it? it wasn't the regular cds...i mean really...how much 'david bowie changes two' are they a going to sell? however brand new -pre-release- stuff is definitely leaked by someone...why not go after hte person who actually made the leak? that is hwat i can consider stealing and would understand if it were illegal. by the way however, i plan on ripping ALL of my riaa cds once i get my system able to...but i wouldn't reccomend this to others...[i just hate the riaa...etc]
GENERATION 26: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation.
Remember this story from a few months ago? Why not do something similiar to RIAA? Find out what addresses they use for official correspondence, and send them everything under the sun. Make a recording of your kid singing in the tub, and send them a demo.
Heck, is there anything that can be legally mailed, but cannot be tossed in the trash because of environmental regulations? Like used automotive oil or something? What do you suppose they would do if they started getting a couple hundred gallons of something they can't toss in the trash in their mailroom every day?
Ok, maybe it isn't the answer, but it would be pretty funny.
Casca
i was in voice training for more than half my life, by choice. Not every musician needs it, but to be a musician implies some level of music, and some level of practice. I do not need music to get lovers, I'm already in the relationship that i want. I do not need music to get famous- it's unlikely that music will make me famous, and if it did, i wouldn't know what to do with it. I still have a day job. So it obviously isn't the money. I still want to study and have even more of a day job, i like to work.
I don't know why this debate always comes down to the same statements over and over again. "Music downloading is/isn't theft," "The RIAA is good/evil," "Copyright infringement and intellectual property can/can't/should/shouldn't be controlled."
We've all heard each other's arguments ad nauseum. What i don't hear is more than a few coherent plans, from either side, thinking about what to do next. I'd love to be proved wrong, i'd love to hear all this discussion rise above simple negation and into a more friendly debate. (I came here for an argument! 'NO, you didn't!")
I'd like to believe that we do more than repeat the same stuff every time the DMCA and RIAA come up; at least with the microsoft debate we manage to find relevant, new ways to look at it on a regular basis...
sol
"I'd say 'Have a good time,' but arson is still illegal.
to a NY Judge, somewhere in the late 1800'as or early 1900's I can't recall exactly, this braqinchild decided that corporations were entities unto themselves, rather than grouping of individual entities. Things went staright to hell from there. The american revolution was as much about the chartered companies control over the new world as it was about anything else...
I agree that an individual should have the inalienable right to contribute, a corporation SHOULD NOT BE A SINGLE entity but a group of entities...Make them use the PAC route and convince their employees to act in the companies interests if they can....That single change would have A HUGE IMPACT on the political system in the US.
errr....umm...*whooosh* *whoosh* Is this thing on ?
As a musician who's seen a lot of local bands, I can tell you that the "suits" are doing the majority of people a favor by filtering out people who are kidding themselves about how good they are. "Majority" meaning "popular" or "mass" culture. The problem with the suits is that they've made the supposed artistic venture of music into 100% business. There is money to be made. Because that is their sole objective, they take the corporate tact of conservativism, seeking trends and not necessarily relishing the idea of originality or breaking new ground.
As a musician, I am completely sympathetic to the plight of trying to get my stuff heard, and someone like you is the exception rather than the norm; someone who understands that the best place to find music is probably not going to be your Top 40 radio station. But, what REALLY needs to happen is that indies need to unite to *compete* with the RIAA and use whatever criteria *they* see fit to define "good" music and boost their roster of excellent musicians.
In this way, they too are filtering through the zillions of crappy or mediocre musicians doing ad hoc recording and showcasing the "good" ones. When banded together, these indies can equal the might of the larger corporate labels in a marketing sense but who bring to the table more discerning taste in music. That will help "press the flesh" for musicians with fewer resources, and still help to filter out the inevitable crap that exists everywhere you look.
I really want the RIAA to sue me. First day in court I'd show up dressed like a pirate, eye patch and all. Then I'd play a song and tell the jury that since they didn't pay to hear it that they'd be next. I'd start selling official GeekBot the Pirate eyepatches on eBay and start making guest appearances. Before long I'd be on Letterman making the RIAA walk the plank in effigy.
This is utterly stupid! Those who somehow argue that stealing music and other files over P2P is what the internet was made for are more than missing the point. What if all goods could be gotten for free? Just because it is technologically possible to steal music, video, software and text documents easilly does it make it any different than taking a physical good? Think about this from the production side. From the author side. Say I am a craftsman and I make widgets in my basement. I make a widget with $1 of raw materials and $20 of my labor and sell the things for $50 in the stores. The more widgets I make, the more money I make. Now say someone can get an exact copy of my widget for free in a magic duplicator machine? What do i have to do? Figure out a new way to live. A new way to pay for the other widgets in my life made by other people. And don't pity the poor artist stuck in the "bad" contracts. I just saw the Matrix Reloaded and I know this world is all about choice. No-one forced them to sign the record contracts. Record companies invest alot of money into artists. Most of who never sell any records and OD in a bathroom somewhere. The few that do make it pay for all those who don't. That is life. Get over it!