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The Return of the Sparrow Electric Vehicle?
H0NGK0NGPH00EY writes "I have been keeping my eye on the Sparrow electric vehicle, following last year's bankruptcy of its creator, and recently noticed that the brightly-colored three-wheeled electric commuter car has been reborn. Myers Motors will begin selling an upgraded version this summer, after having acquired the rights and tooling from Phoenix Environmental Motors, who mention this on their official homepage."
..first it was a sparrow, then it was a dodo, now it's a phoenix?
"BSD: Free as in speech. Linux: Free as in beer. Windows 10: Free as in herpes." --Man On Pink Corner in #52607549.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Too many "alternative" ideas don't understand that "different" and "popular" are very rarely correlated.
There was an old lady who drove in a shoe...
If I didn't already have a solid-performing, small Civic, I'd seriously think about one of these.
Except that I drive too much.
Commuter market is hard to handle. One has to worry about safety in city driving, and how close to work one has to be for it to be practical. If you work in any sort of fabrication facility, chances are you live a good distance from work. Wouldn't want to run out of juice on the side of the road in a vehicle that's difficult to refuel w/o a large time investment.
"A group of words expressing something other than their literal intention. Now that... is... irony!" - Bender
This is a great example of a staggeringly well-designed technology. Efficient, clean, useful, and damn cool looking, if you ask me. I want one.
My site: Free Nature Pictures
...a Beowulf Cluster of those things.
Or, just buy a regular car.
I think I think, therefore I think I am.
Strike 1: it's electric. After listening to the Big 3 say for years and years no one wants electric cars, the public doesn't want electric cars. Baaaa.
Strike 2: single seater. After listening to the Big 3 say for years and years that SUV's and trucks can do more for you, the public won't care about a car with a single seat. Baaaa.
Strike 3: limited range. After listening to the Big 3 say for years and years that a car should be able to drive across the US or Canada on a moment's notice... eh, you get the idea.
Sparrow concept = neat
Sparrow sales will = bleh
Personally, I like the Tango more than the Sparrow.
It sort of resembles a nose... Very ugly; I don't care if its computer driven, I wouldn't take one if they were giving them free.
In any case, note that since top speed is 70mph, you'll only be able to drive 20 to 30 minutes at that speed. That hardly even qualifies as a commute by many people's standards!
It's a neat idea, but the batteries just aren't there. Still, I'm sure that battery technology has advanced a bit since 2000, right? Maybe they'll produce yet another upgraded version soon.
Ceci n'est pas une sig
Fire the market researchers! Why didn't they learn, right back from this - The Sinclair C5. It failed then, so why don't they learn that people don't want to ride around in something that makes them look like a fool?
Now, if they follow the examples set by manufacturers such as Toyota, where they make hybrid, dual fuel cars (gas/electric) that switch fuel type depending on the usage, we'll get to the point where we can effectively use less damaging energy sources. We're getting there, slowly, but this just isn't it.
If I could afford one at the moment, I would put myself on the list right now. Next time I'm in the market for a car, I'll probably buy one, or something very similar.
My site: Free Nature Pictures
when I can run my beauty on the one substance that stands for peace, freedom and the fight against terrorism - Liberated Iraqi Oil.
My main question is: how practical is this car? You have to pay over 13,000 for something that only seat one. What if you have to fit wife, kids, and dogs into your car?
I personally would only consider an electric car if it comes in a wagon.
Given the number of times that brakes are mentioned in the list of improvements, one wonders if the lack of braking lead to the financial demise of the original company...
:
(the following upgrades and fixes have been added)
Improved Braking
Dielectric grease in connector [very nice]
Hard washers for Wheel bearings
New outer suspension, complete with brakes [!?]
Cover for front brake lines to eliminate shorting
Hard tubing for brake lines
Moved brake pressure line switch.
I don't think you should see it as a replacement for a car; rather it is an all-weather, electric alternative to a scooter, commuter bike or delivery vehicle. In Sweden, similar small, enclosed gasoline-engine moped-classed vehicles have become popular for just those roles. This could probably be a good higher speed alternative.
I guess that in a way, having USA as their home marked is not a good thing. You would probably see a lot more acceptance for this in Europe.
Trust the Computer. The Computer is your friend.
Myers Motors? As in Mike "groovy baby" Myers?
"Have you ever thought about just turning off the TV, sitting down with your kids, and hitting them?"
having acquired the rights and tooling from Phoenix Environmental Motors
I did not know you can acquire the rights to Ugly! Good design, yes, patents, yes, ugly, I don't think so, and this car is just ugly!
Firstly, there are other ways of generating electricity, and massive measures are being put in place for this in the UK (wind farms, for a start). Not a bad thing.
If people are not educated about the nastiness of fossil fuel burning, then we might as well just give up now.
Secondly, your SUVs etc ARE damaging to the environment. Your "small" gasoline engines are far larger than they actually need to be. Why on earth do you need a five litre V8 to take the kids to school? Basically, you don't. All of this crap being pumped out in inner-cities makes it difficult to breath, which is where research into other methods (even hybrid methods) is a boon, and should only ever be welcomed.
But people who actually, unfathomably, look at other people who welcome progress and change as "traitors" will never listen. I'd like to see you drive your V8 around those craters when the fuels run out.
Three Mile Island was America's worst commercial nuclear disaster ever (Note: Military Nuclear Disasters have had some worse fates). AND NOBODY DIED. Not even in the long term. Nuclear is RELATIVELY non-poluting.
All you trolls look at people driving electric cars with scorn, while the whole time increasing America's dependance on foreign oil.
I hope to god you were trying to be funny.
"If we let things terrify us, life will not be worth living."
- Seneca
The Merlin Roadster is also a three wheel drive, but not as ugly and has an ICE. A mini review is here.
R(k)
And price. I think it's a failure to the masses, but at least they're not so pretentious about their product, unlike Dean Kamen and his certain scooter. Remember, it will promise to "change the way cities are made"!
The people responsible for this business plan need to understand that, if an invention turns out to be ugly, the chances than it can be spinned into something fashionable are quite slim.
They should be working to mitigate that, not enhance it by painting it purple!
www.enterweb.pt
That is ugly. Perhaps if it were designed something more like this: Carver
hehe, do think they made it look like a nose on purpose??
Yeah, and go get a haircut, you hippies!
It looks like a giant duck bill... the daffy mobile
"Academicians are more likely to share each other's toothbrush than each other's nomenclature."
Cohen
Unless your a bird, insect or pollinating plant. Then wind farms are a very bad thing indeed.
"Have you ever thought about just turning off the TV, sitting down with your kids, and hitting them?"
Oh, I've seen uglier cars and I really needn't name any of them, it would just incite flaming.
That said, if I were driving this thing I'd feel like I had to keep a look in the mirrors to make sure Dick Dasterdly and Muttly weren't trying to sneak up on me.
The last motorized three wheeler I built looked vaguely like a Surtees TS-7 and was convertable from internal combustion to electric, I never did bother making it road legal, it was just a "mule", and the next I expect to look vaguely like the Whitney Straight Maserati 8CM. That one I'm planning on making a hybrid. That's part electric and part pedal powered.
KFG
And what is its average airspeed velocity when unladen?
Don't forget, a 1000MW coal plant releases 88 lbs of radioactive stuff every day.
.03 mrem .009 mrem
Coal plant, living within 50 miles:
Nuclear plant, living within 50 miles:
(Both figures are considered extremely low levels.)
HIV Crosses Species Barrier... into Muppets
What I always needed for our coconut migration plan.
Looks like a Death Trap.
At around $14,000 and only a 20-40 mile range I really can't see this as a real option for anyone. You can buy a hybrid car at that price. And get a range closer to 400 miles....
If the price were around $3,000 I'd consider it. Heck, even if the top speed were around 45 MPH I'd be happy enough.
As Nietsche famously said, "If you stare too long into the Abyss, 1d4 Tanar'ri of random type will attack you."
You should stop spreading so much FUD about nuclear energy until you actually know something about it.... glowing craters my ass.
TMI-2, the unit which comprised the only nuclear accident on US soil was the fault of a secondary cooling system that malfunctioned and caused sensors to misread the backup valves. The reactor overheated and the cladding on the bundles in part of the reactor fused due to the LOCA. The plant was stabalized that day and only 1-2 millirems of radiation were released (you get maybe 100-150 a year, 10 or so when you get an x-ray).
As for what is the safest and most efficient power source? Nuclear hands down.
However, I will agree that coal and oil are killing us, every second they are running.
First, do you notice all the Wagon's, Van's, Sport Van's (SUV's) driving buy that weigh many tons and having room for 6?
Having two vehicles would make more sense.
A one commuter car, and a family/friends car.
An electric hummer is hardly more efficient or better on the environment than a gas one. You would still be driving a giant cube vehicle around.
Hey ppl! Chk out this electric car -REVA -from India.
Features Grab:
This elegant, light-yet rugged, two-door sedan comfortably seats 2 adults in the front and 2 children upto a height of 5' and 6" (165 cms) in the rear. It has a range of 80 kilometers in stop-and-go city driving, and a top speed of 65 km/h.
you can read a review about it Here
It costs somethin like Rupees.2.20 lakhs (which is abt $5300).
Why does yahoo do this
Keep an eye on ogrish for future graphic accident photos.
Unless your a bird, insect or pollinating plant. Then wind farms are a very bad thing indeed.
Why? Because they produce energy without physically burning anything? Or is it because they change the skyline? (Not that I mind, I'd rather have the graceful spinning of blades than the cancerous cloud of a coal/oil based plant)
What really has me curious is why they included power ports for laptops in the thing. With the battery life it has (or hasn't), who would dare add on anything that would use more electricity?
For that matter, why have power windows? The only reason I like power windows is so I can raise/lower passenger and rear windows. In this car, there isn't a window that is even the slightest bit difficult to reach by the driver.
Edward Burr
Having a smoking section in a restaurant is like having a peeing section in a swimming pool.
Unless as a personal intra-city transport device, and even then:
1) Bad weather places that are congested
2) In a city like London, a small vehicle is good
3) If this vehicle was exempt from the 5/day congestion fee
If you drive daily in London, then this vehicle could save you up to 1500 in congestion charges **IF** this vehicle was exempt because it was small and non-polluting. In 5 years that would be around the cost of the vehicle itself.
It has enough power to get you to and from work in a small area. It is ugly and geeky, so it won't get stolen. You can rent a garage for your main car somewhere cheap for when you need to do a long journey somewhere.
Somehow I don't see the government wanting to give up precious congestion charge fees, even to forward small economical (? how much does the electricity for a full charge cost in this vehicle anyway ?) vehicles over large uneconomical ones.
There's some ugly cars out there.
But you're right, I can think of no production car that is more hideous then this one. And the guy that said it's beautiful must have also purchased a purple iMac and never replaced the stupid mouse.
- It's not the Macs I hate. It's Digg users. -
Good aerodinamics (small contact area), small wheight, better security and weather protection than a motorcycle. Everything I would like in a ... gas vehicle.
Id buy one of these if it has a gas motor, I dont want to pay the wheight and cost of batteries, and want the flexibility (refueling everywhere) and manutenability of a gas engine. (no need to change that whole battery set once and while)
I seriously want a gas engine vehicle that consume much less, but no way Id like a battery powered vehicle.
You'll need two of 'em!
and I get a lot of garbage. I would think that if they can not get a decent website, that I do not want to trust their engineering.
That Carver is a nice car, but I have some observations to make:
- "4 cylinder 16 valve turbo intercooler"
Here in Brazil we use 8 valve on the economic cars, Im not sure if that would be more economic.
- "65 bhp at 7.500 rpm"
Im not sure if that motor would last very much reaching so high RPMs
Do you have any idea of how much it costs?
I actually like the idea of electric cars. For one, my work is only about 3 miles away from my house. I could use a bicycle, but if it rains or snows, or cold out, thats out. I bought a cheap car to get me too and from work and it is reliable. But with the gas prices going up, it would be nice not to spend a penny on gas. Now, I don't pay for electricty either, so plugging in a car to my outlet is no big deal to me (AF base, free utiliteis).
Has anyone figured out how much your electric bill would go up by charging your batteries at home?
Mark
i don't like that it has 600 lbs of batteries and such a short range. i something like this but with a 500 or 1000 cc turbodiesel would be a lot faster and have much better range, depending on the tank size (600 lbs is almost 100 gallons).
it would probably get close to 100 mpg.
two seats would be nice, but for 100 mpg i'll only complain a few times a week.
hybrid turbodiesel 2 or 3 seater would be very cool.
comments? discuss among yourselves.
Where's Robin Hood? We could kinda really use him now.
Seriously. "There was an old lady who drove in a shoe..."
Ah, 8kW is a full charge. In the UK that is around 80p, or 25p if you charge overnight and you have an economy electricity plan. (My electricity is 12.4p / unit during the day, and 2.78p / unit overnight, dropping to 5.82p and 2.68p respectively after a certain amount of usage.
A normal car doing 30mpg would cost around 3.60 to go the same distance as that 25p/80p electricity. So the running costs are 1/14th to 1/3rd of a petrol engine. Of course, you could buy a cheap 1.0l diesel that does 50mpg to somewhat counteract that.
This is a much better example of the potential of electric car technology than that fugly little nose-on-wheels.
Electric cars don't NEED to be ugly, slow and have tiny ranges. Take the tZero for instance, 100 mile range, top speed of ~100 mph, 0-60 in 4 seconds; handily beating Ferraris and Porsches in an 1/8 mile. and it's only moderately hideous looking! The price, however, is entirely hideous.
- "Hear that?! The percolations are imminent! Cease your ingress!"
There's a guy that has one of these who regularily catches the Bainbridge Island ferry here in Washington State. From what I can tell, he's got a good deal, because they always put him right at the front of the boat, and it seems like they must charge him the motorcycle rather than as a car. It seems to have enough storage space too -- I'd been trying to figure out what it was, as it seems like it would be an ideal commuter car.
Until then it is useless.
Most electricity in the US is coming from coal fired plants which are pretty nasty in terms of burning fossil fuels. Maybe we should be like the French and more reliant on nuke plants? I dunno.
And then there are those batteries. Where do they go for disposal? How often are they replaced?
I don't think there is really any need for the vast majority of SUVs owned in the US, (or the aforementioned France which has recently found that SUVs are very popular there too) but until we get our electricty from some cleaner methods, I don't think electric cars are doing much good either.
this sig deleted by another sig
Reviews: 3-Wheelers and The independant.
Doesn't the phrase "begin selling" require someone to actually buy one of these things?
It could be a decent idea if they sold it for a few hundred bucks, but 14 grand? I could buy a real car for that amount. And don't give me any crap about how these things are better than cars, the fact remains there are numerous uses for cars which these are not suitable for such as transporting passangers, carrying other items (such as groceries, etc), driving on highways, etc.
Mathematics is made of 50 percent formulas, 50 percent proofs, and 50 percent imagination.
It looks like those plastic fisher price cars trendy parents bought their toddlers 12 years ago.
Somebody on campus has one of these things- I see it parked with the motorcycles all the time. Not something I would want to take on a highway, but it would be great in most situations where a moped would suffice.
They can spin physics with all the sales pitches they want, a three wheeled vehicle is an insanely stupid idea.
It's a nice car, but isn't practical for most people. (Any room for groceries?) Personally, I like the Honda Civic Hybrid. Approx. 50 miles to the gallon, that's about 650 miles in one 13 gallon tank. And it holds several people. Still not the most fuel efficient vehicle, but it's so much better than the gas guzzling SUVs consumer America is obsessed with.
You can say it: It's disgusting.
It isn't a bad thing. Frankly it's about time the UK started addressing this issue!
Wait? You say surely I'm confused?
Lets see:
Wind generation capacity:
US: 4,400,000 KW [est 2002, DOE]
UK: 0,331,000 KW[foe.co.uk]
Oh my! Even with 4.67 times the population, the UK has only 35% the per capita wind generation capacity...
Frankly, I don't disagree with that statement. Selfish newbie 4-wheelers can destroy good trails in no time flat, cause severe erosion, and worse! But seriously... Shouldn't we really be more concerned with how much more or less they are doing so? The smartest people on earth, with the largest arrays of data can only guess at the relative environmental impacts of things like this. There are not only too many factors, but we just don't know how the 'environment' works. I'll give you that they would seem to be somewhat worse in many forseeable situations... [Like sitting stuck in trafficWhy do you need a computer to read? You don't. I really can't explain 302's in trucks, except to guess that they're pretty old? Mine has a 415...
Inner-cities are a completely different discussion. With small exceptions, this is not the clientel for $14k 1 seaters with no A/C...
Oh dear, another reactionary has gone and confused progress with change again... I'm not sure exactly who you're labelling what here...
Oh gosh, now I understand. It's evil Americans.
I personally get annoyed at conservative 'everything is fine now' types AND reactionary freaks who run around labeling people evildoers...
Do you know that most idiots think they're smart? I certainly do.
;)
What the Sparrow makers should do:
...
1) Make it wider, and two seater
2) This would allow another 6 or so batteries to fit in the extra space
3) That would extend the range 50%
4) It wouldn't look like a nose
5) That is a lot more space internally for shopping, a passenger
6) It would appeal more to the average person
7) Try and drop the price to under $10k - doable if sales are higher
8)
9) Profit
That tZero looks great. So what do they do? They price themselves out of the market. I know a lot of people that would buy a 2 seater vehicle that had sports car characteristics, had a 100 mile range and cost under one quid to recharge overnight. Shame that savings on electricity are negated by needing to get a new set of batteries every 2 years.
You fucking retarded mods. Look at the fucking grandparent first. Flamebait my fucking ass.
Slow, expensive, shit ugly. One-gear transmission, because that is all you need.
No no, you misunderstand, I was simply reacting against the original poster. He was referencing those who use electric cars as "traitors", and also referenced himslef as a SUV driver (as far as I am aware, not many of these have 1.3 litre engines!). The craters reference was with regard to his original comment, referring to the damage left behind by nuclear reactors.
You will also note I mentioned progress AND change, why do these have to be mutually exclusive. Does one not forgo the other? I personally welcome it.
As far as the UK and windfarms is concerned, I agree, there's been little done to bring it in, in the past, and I welcome the changes they are making. However, politically, it is causing havoc in the areas where they are installed. I don;t see the problem with it myself.
As for SUVs destroying the trails etc, they probably are, but I've been hiking all around this place and have yet to see one beeping me out of the way. However, through the main streets of Sydney you can hear and smell them a mile off. They are unnecessary (and notice I am not just referencing the USA here, I'm not a xenophobe) - just like the four-wheel drives that idle around suburbia in the UK. The analogy with reading on a computer doesn't make sense - I read on a computer because the material is easily searchable etc etc. How does taking the kids to school in a V8 compare to taking the kids to school in a 1.3 Micra? You'll get there in the same amount of time.
And I never switch my engine off in traffic jams unless I've been sat in the same spot for yonks, and am running low on fuel - do you know how much that stuff costs us??!
Finally, I disagree with you on the target demographic for the small 1 seater electric car. I think it is purposefully aimed for inner cities, where short ranges are the norm, but heavy traffic is hard to navigate. Just look at the Mercedes owned Smart car, and how popular it is in bigger cities in Europe (I know it's not electric, but it still meets the same market).
A year ago I finally got to see one of these face to face just in time to hear the owner say "Did you know the company just went out of business 2 days ago ?". What a bummer !
So now its back and I'm not sure I want one anymore...
These days I'm thinking more about converting an old car for vegetable oil or using biodiesel
Lurking in the desert
It's perfict. RMS will have to give up his SUV (yup, he drives one) to buy this baby.
"Who are in control, they are not in control of anything - they don't even control themselves!" - Glen Beck
Oh, the Aztec wasn't so bad, not great, but not bad. Kind of a clunkier TVR 2500, which was a bit clunky itself, but in an endearing sort of way. The Aztec 7 was worse in my opinion, but some like that ultra-wedgey look. I'm more of a Maserati 300S, Porsche 550 Spyder curve loving sort of guy, although I can't deny that the Lotus 72 is lovely, but then, even though it's a wedge, most of its surfaces are actually curved for rigidity.
Oh, you mean that recent monstrosity from Pontiac, don't you? Sorry, hysterical amnesia.
Everytime I see one driving by I have to repress the urge to yell at the driver -- "WHY?"
KFG
Take the tZero for instance, 100 mile range, top speed of ~100 mph, 0-60 in 4 seconds; handily beating Ferraris and Porsches in an 1/8 mile.
Because as we all know, Ferraris and Porsches are designed for one thing: 1/8 mile runs. (sarcasm). There are Honda Civics out there that will beat a Ferrari in an 1/8 mile. What does it prove? Nothing. For $10,000 you could make a frickin picnic table run those speeds if you really wanted to.
The tZero is an unproducable (the linked website still says production is "expected" to start in 2002) science project. Even if you HAD the money to meet the price listed on their site, I highly doubt you could actually buy one.
Electric cars are VASTLY overrated. They ARE slow, and have crappy range because IT GOES WITH THE TECHNOLOGY. They use batteries.
Electric cars are ALWAYS going to be at a disadvantage compared to other technologies with better energy densities: Gasoline, Natural Gas, Fuel Cells, Hydrogen, Biodiesel, etc.
Life is too short to proofread.
"And then there are those batteries. Where do they go for disposal?"
:)
Car batteries (lead-acid) in the US are highly recycled (over 98% in 1993, and over 90% of the lead/ lead oxides is recycled or exported for recycling-newest info I have handy). I believe the cases are recycled as well-the plastic must be used for new battery cases only-by law IIRC. Pretty much any place that sells them will take them. They are actually worth something. After all, a small fee is charged (I assume everywhere) if you don't recycle yours.
Other battery types are also recycled-it is one of the things they consider when introducing different battery types.
"How often are they replaced?"
Probably as often as other car batteries
Step 1: remove one wheel from the old fashion 4 wheel model...
Step 2: try to invent some really expensive technology that looks cool and creates market buzz, then tell everyone it will reclaim the stability that was lost in the removal of that "extra" wheel.
Step 3: stock up on liability insurance
Step 4: profit!
Commentators later added:
'The loss in street cred however, is priceless and the increased costs of social suicide are not negligible..'
...is that mike myers?
According to the web site, the battery pack is led acid, weighs just shy of 600lb, and lasts only 1 - 4 years.
If you are considering this vehicle as an eco-friendly alternative to gasoline cars, this is a huge factor. Lead acid batteries pose enormous environmental challenges, from mining, to worker lead exposure, to disposal. The only way I would even remotely consider a vehicle that could chew through a quarter ton of lead every year would be if the battery packs were recycled. What they should do is lease the battery packs, take the returns and recondition them.
IIRC, the Honda and Toyota hybrids use NiMH batteries. Nickel is not very toxic, especially compared to lead, and in fact were it not for their sheer size the battery packs could be disposed of in municipal landfills under federal regs. In principle the nickel could and should be recycled, but unfortunately neither Honda or Toyota have made a commitment to do so.
In my mind this lack of a clear recycling closes the environmental gap between hybrids and small, efficient conventional vehicles such as the Civic and Volkswagen diesels. Many people wouldn't see a dramatic mileage difference between a Toyota Prius and a Toyota Echo; but the gasoline car's proven technology might well translate to a longer service life, an a larger fraction of its components are likely to be recycled as scrap. Estimates are that 95% of the steel in scrapped autos is recovered and recycled.
In any case, this vehicle would be much cooler with NiMH batteries. The gravimetric energy density of NiMH are betwen 60-120 Wh/kg, as opposed to 30-50 for Pb-acid. So you could pack more than twice the energy in the same weight, and be talking about a 50-100 mile range instead of 20-40 miles. A NiMH battery would cost twice as much, but probably last at least twice as long, so the lifetime costs would be comparable, and the environmental costs would be much smaller.
Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
we've already had the future of personal transport over here for years... the Sinclair C5
they went down as well as Windows ME at a Linux Conference.
we've also done brightly coloured three-wheelers too... that design classic the Reliant Robin
However just when you think all european design sucks, take a look at the sexy Carver from the netherlands.
This is the way manufacturers will get people to buy smaller more efficient vehicles, in my opinion, by making them desirable and functional. Beautiful design wins customers, look at the success of the iPod.
Damn if I can see one of these things tipping over. it has a 4' x 8' foot print and a 57" height on 3 wheels... one good corner and whammo your toast. Get nailed by an SUV... Organ doner... Sure it looked really cool with a whale tail in the Austin Powers Gold Member, but you wanna pick up your date in one of these things? Damn, forgot, single seater just like their other unit the Merlin. At least the Merlin looked like it would stand up to a stiff side wind.
You want balls out excitement, check out T-Rex
Granted it isn't electric but it is a two seater, motorcycle engine and heart pounding fun. I got the chance to see on up close at Sturgis last year.
I hope the sparrow does do well though as it will innevitably translate into all around better transportation options in other areas.
flinging poop since 1969
It's a little more straightforward to regulate a dozen powerplants than it is to regulate ten thousand cars.
"How often are they replaced?" :)
Probably as often as other car batteries
Actually, it's more likely that they would need to be replaced signifcantly more often, as they would go through much deeper charge/discharge cycles.
In normal car, the only time you're actually discharging the battery is when you're drawing power AND the engine isn't running.
Life is too short to proofread.
In dense cities. In particular in cities like San Francisco (assuming it can hill climb) where parking is at a premium. A vehicle this size, like a motorcycle, can park perpendicular on the street, in those tiny little slots between driveways that can't fit any regular car and which are fairly plentiful. Or perhaps in designated motorcycle parking.
That makes a big difference in quick city trips, which are actually a lot of trips for urban dwellers. They are far under 20 miles, and the biggest hassle is getting through traffic and parking.
In addition, many people have a single car garage and could fit a small vehicle on the street in those spare short spaces where a full sized vehicle would not make sense.
Of course a motorcycle can also fit these applications though they don't have a cargo area and don't fit the style of many.
Has it been over a year since you last donated to the Electronic Frontier Foundation
According to this site, electric cars produce less emissions even when you count the power plant emissions.
In a study conducted by the Los Angeles Department of Water and Power, EVs were significantly cleaner over the course of 100,000 miles than ICE cars. The electricity generation process produces less than 100 pounds of pollutants for EVs compared to 3000 pounds for ICE vehicles. (See Table 3)
Engine Type CO ROG NOx Total
Gasoline 2574 262 172 3008 lb.
Diesel 216 73 246 835 lb. Electric 9 5 61 75 lb.
http://www.windmeadow.com/
At least Pontiac was quick to reconsider design changes to it.
In only 2 years after it came out the Aztek already went through some changes. The unsightly plastic cladding was removed, allowing for a more conservative monochrome paint job. Sure, it's still not very pretty but it's easier to look at now.
Its amazing what can be accomplished when investor money is used for R&D instead of paying for Tom Corbin's company-leased Bentley.
hybrid turbodiesel 2 or 3 seater would be very cool.
I'd be happy with a modern (common-rail direct injection) 500 - 750 cc turbodiesel and a 5 speed stick. This would give great fuel economy without requiring the added complexity of a hybrid drivetrain. Diesel is simple and reliable, no need to add on a genset and batteries. How I wish BMW offered a small turbodiesel in the 3-series for the American market......
I wonder if you could take advantage of the diesel's torque to implement some sort of oversized flywheel for energy storage...
BTW, have you seen the numbers on the new Mercedes CDI diesel? Same size displacement as their 3.2 L V6... Gasoline: 221 HP, 232 ft-lbs torque.... Turbodiesel: 201 HP, 369 ft-lbs torque (at a lower rpm, no less!)
((Granted BMW and pretty much anyone in Japan can crank out more HP in a 3.2 L gasoline car than Mercedes can... I just found the numbers from two fairly modern engines from the same company to be quite interesting))
No, lead acid battery powered cars have horrible range because of the technology. Many current natural gas and hydrogen designs are for electric cars. And as car as I know, there isn't a fuel cell design for a car that isn't for an electric car.
As for diesel, did you know that diesel locomotives are actually run by electric motors? We will have electric cars as soon as they get it to scale efficiently and cost effectively.
The Tzero does not have a 100 mile range. It's closer to 300 miles. They have switched to lithium batteries. It is predicted that mass-produced automotive lithium-sulfur batteries could have ranges of well over 400 miles. That's more than any dino-juice burners get, and the performance is better.
Did you learn nothing from Three Mile Island?
Ted Kennedy's 1967 Oldsmobile has killed more people in the USA than all of our nuclear power plant accidents combined.
According to this site, electric cars produce less emissions even when you count the power plant emissions.
I took a look at that site but I don't buy it.
The process for an electric car goes:
Chemical energy(possible after refinement)=>mechanical energy=>electrical energy=>long distance power transmission=>voltage conversion=>chemical energy=>electical energy=>mechanical energy
While it's true that some of these processes can fairly efficient, others are bound to loose a signifcant amount of energy.
For example, the site you linked to mentioned no losses from long distance power transmission (7.4% at the grid level) or voltage conversion, etc.
They also seem willing to make some rather strange logical leaps to support their cause, as well possible deliberate omissions.
An example of this would be their choice of a 1995 model year vehicle, one year before the government-mandated OBDII engine control standard went into effect (reducing emissions).
I would be really interested to see a less biased study on the matter.
Life is too short to proofread.
We saw the sparrow in CycleWorld in 1998, ordered one immediately, reservation number 38. Got it in March '00, after much design/redesign/rework by Corbin. It is absolutely the coolest vehicle we've ever owned (and we've owned more than a few vehicles.) The fit and finish was excellent, and it really looks better in person than it does in photographs. We do all our own maintenance, and have upgraded quite a few things on our bird. It'll do 100 MPH, has about a 40 mile range (which is rough on the batteries, 20 gives lots more charge cycles), carries 6 Kilowatt-Hours in its 13 batteries (i.e. it'll run your laptop _and_ your cellphone both for about 2 weeks - motive power takes orders of magnitude more juice than bit-flipping, a good freeway ramp acceleration can easily draw 300 amps at 160 volts - that's 48 KW, enough power to run ten average houses).
We've talked to (literally) over 2000 interested people in the last four years of driving, and have had hundreds of people say they'd buy one "tomorrow" if Corbin were in business, or if it was made by GM, or if it got a little better range. The big problem is battery technology. Lead acid batteries are big and heavy - even the expensive hi-tech spiral-cell units are tempramental and basically hate being discharged. Better batteries exist, like NiMH or Li-Ion, but right now they would add $4000 to the price of the vehicle - once those prices come down, the.Sparrow with a Li-ion pack could have a 200 mile range. As it sits, having a plug at work is probably a good idea.
Corbin's big problem was they had a design concept, but didn't want to listen to the expertise of the engineers they had. (They employed Jeff James, Peter Senkowski, and Claire Bell at various times - all electric vehicle experts, all ignored and blamed to greater or lesser degrees) Eventually the company collapsed in a mire of pointy-haired-boss syndrome and financial impropriety.)
I'm pleased to see that Myers is looking to improve on the design, and fix some of the things which Corbin addressed with hand-waving. (Although I must say that early on, Corbin was great about supplying parts, fixing problems, and listening to our comments. Then the money got tight.) I'd also love to see the DOT decide that there was a place on our highways for a smaller vehicle - the reason the Sparrow is a three-wheeler is that it gets around thousands of expensive, heavy, or (for an electric vehicle) downright contradictory "automobile" design requirements by being classed as a "motorcycle". However, this put weight and size restrictions on the vehicle which forced compromises on range and stability. Other countries have the concept of a mini-car, which can go at speeds above 25 MPH but may not be allowed on the highest speed freeways.
I'm also glad that there's somebody to buy a replacement windshield from - I've been worried that we'll take a stone one day, and I'll have a $14,000 paperweight!
The ultimate answer, as a motorcyclist, an electrical engineer, and a dedicated geek: With knowing in advance what we'd go through finding insurance, fixing problems, breaking drive belts, changing batteries... I'd do it again in a heartbeat. The Sparrow has been an absolute blast, a total head-turner, the ultimate conversation piece, and it's won a trophy in every car show we've entered it in - even got "People's Choice" in our home-town once!
---
-- No No No NO, Don't tug on that! You never know what it might be attached to. - Buckaroo Banzai
You're wrong, asshole.
Do me a favor and post your home address, so I can come educate you, you fucking puke.
Then again, don't bother.
I'll find you.
And as car as I know, there isn't a fuel cell design for a car that isn't for an electric car.
I wasn't as specfic as I meant to be. I should have said: battery-powered electric cars.
I consider a car that charges a battery "electric", but I would call a hydrogen/alcohol fuel cell powered car, "(energy source) powered."
While fuel cell powered vehicles use electric motors, it's more on an implementation detail.
Life is too short to proofread.
Ok, how about these: here, here and here.
All three give different numbers but state that EVs have less overall pollution. Two of the articles state that EVs in California would be particulary helpful because California has cleaner power generation.
http://www.windmeadow.com/
Serenity: The Official Movie Website
is up and working now. OK, OK, so it's a bit off topic, but it deserves some publicity!!!
Ted Kennedy's 1967 Oldsmobile has killed more people in the USA than all of our nuclear power plant accidents combined.
To clarify:
In the USA, Ted Kennedy's 1967 Oldsmobile has killed more people than all of our nuclear power plant accidents combined.
Anyone know who first said this? I'm thinking it originally came from Rush Limbaugh, but I'm not quite certain.
So what IS the real cost of this thing ?
Let's try: 20-30 miles/day * 300-360 days == 10000 miles/year. Ok, that is barely covered by one charge cycle/day, but we'll be generous. So that is a NEW set of batteries every year. The cost of 13 new batteries and services charges must be at least $1000. The other servicing costs must be around $500/year or so, so let's say $1500/year.
Now, electricity: the thing needs 8kwh of energy per charge. I pay 12 cents/kwh from NiagraMohawk, so that's $1/day or $400/year/10000 miles, not too bad.
So the TCO for 10000 miles/year is about $2000 or 20 cents/mile. I suppose that is similar to a regular car... Okay so, no way is it much cheaper to run than a regular car...
I'm really glad you put your money where your mouth is! I have a friend who has a Sparrow and he also loves it. You make two incredibly insightful points.
1. Li-Ion/Li-Poly batteries! Exactly! Convert any existing vehicle and get roughly 3 times the range for even less weight. The laptop/cell phone/model airplane industry has been driving the market for years. They are just now starting to entire usage in people carrying vehicles. I firmly believe they will be in wide spread vehicular use in the next 10-20 years. The technology is here now, it will just take that "economy of scale" thing to make it a reality for the common person.
2. Infrastructure! I build record setting human and electric powered vehicles (check my website), and while I can build a vehicle that will go 100mph on 1 horsepower, there is simply no place to drive such a thing. The wind from an SUV/truck would hurl it off the road. I would love to see a alterative transportation network setup like rails-to-trails that allow for small and quiet vehicles. Maybe a 45 mph speed limit?
Regardless of what anyone says about the Corbin Sparrow, by purchasing one you are helping to pave the way for a cleaner more efficient transportaion system.
Thanks.
I drove one of these once. Zippy and small, but not very practical - one-seater designs have never been successful. Yes, it's economical, but I've also driven the Smart (here in North America), and it's a much better car, even if it does consume gas/diesel.
don't be foolish, there's nothing at all that has to be slow and 'overrated' about electric cars, the one on that page proves it, it's very fast with extremely quick acceleration. electric motors are fantastic, they have very high torque at low rpms and large working rpm range. by the way where excatly do you think the energy from fuel cell/hydrogen/hybrid etc. cars is going to go? oh yeah, an electric motor. duh. the fact that a car is electric says nothing of its power source.
- "Hear that?! The percolations are imminent! Cease your ingress!"
It is certainly possible they may need to be replaced more often. I imagine it depends upon the application. One study I have read assumed batteries would be replaced twice in a EV's lifetime. As batteries can fail due to time OR load, this doesn't seem to far outside normal.
If you discharged the batteries deeply on a regular basis, you would probably be right, though. Hence the wide time to replacement variation given by this manufacturer.
These guys appear to avoided the Sinclair C5 marketing mistake, the T-Zero car is actually desirable (imho) and technically interesting too.
The best (less money, more feature, better looking) electric car I have known about is REVA
~Aha~
I've never understood how electric cars can be rated zero emissions. They require a charge. A charge requires power. Power requires a power station. Most power stations in the US burn coal to produce the power your electric car needs to recharge. Hmm.
So, in reality you're just shifting the emissions to someone else and making some hippy self feel better--but it's not really accomplishing anything.
And let's not talk about the possible environmental damage caused by the increase of batteries in our land fills.
By far, walking or cycling is a better solution. But who wants to load up the family bike for a 400 mile vacation?
Ahh. Don't get discouraged. Here. Hug this tree awhile. Better? Good.
have a look at REVA
It come for around $5000 and is good value for money.
~Aha~
Type "idaho falls nrts accident" into google and choose the link of your choice to learn about the three people killed when the SL-1 reactor went critical. Last I checked, Ted's Olds has only killed one person. [Though based on the rumors of his alcohol consumption level, I'd wager that if he still owns the '67 Olds, he might yet be able to catch up....]
sorry, sorry, sorry ... it's pot ugly! ...)
...
where are the solarcells for a recharge?
make it longer, seats two, kindda like
in a military jet or apache helicopter...
why doesn't it fly?
why don't they make a four wheeled drive
with a rotary(*) engine in each wheel?
why not store electricity in a fly wheel
kindda pipe (some swiss company (sic) makes
mechanical capacitator
why do they have three wheels (i'd rather
losse one and have a motorbike)?
why not just tilt the wheels 90 deg.
so they're horizontal and add a "turbo
fan" plus a ballon kinnda thingy in the back
(yeah know, hot air ballon thingy)
so we can fly around in da "car"?
(*) that is a invers rotary engine, if you can
imagine it
i want a 3D printer for sizes 0.5 m x 0.5 m x
0.5m!!!
Since all of the journalists doing standups in front of Three Mile Island later died from leukemia, one can conclude that Teds Oldsmobile must have been one hell of a killer machine ;-)
send + more == money?
I really want one.
Thunder Sky LiONs. 5 times more power than the shite old lead acid ones ones he's using. And they cost about the same as lead acid ones for a similar capacity.
It just reminds me of an ill-fated car in an excellent movie : Brazil by Terry Gillian.
j pg
i l.html
Snapshot of an happy driver:
http://trond.com/brazil/images/brazil19.
A site about the movie:
http://orangecow.org/pythonet/brazil/braz
I am not Remy Mouton, unfortunately: http://remy.mouton.free.fr/art/
Yeah, as if the history of the last 25 years demonstrates that anyone much pays attention to the Big 3.
I don't remember those big GM ads saying "Buy Japanese", or the Chrysler ad saying "VW makes a sensible small car" or the Ford ad that says "Hey those Ferraris are neat".
Obviously I have forgotten them.
"My old RD400 was cool too, not only could you fit the chippie on the back, but she had to hang on, and it was really easy to ditch her if she started to get too whiney."
You sure she didn't jump off rather than listen to you?
nevermind.
Even those who arrange and design shrubberies are under considerable economic stress at this period in history.
Battery technology is advancing extremely quickly, driven largely by mobile devices however the technologies apply just as easily to cars.
LiONs, Li-Poly are here now giving a 5+fold improvement in performance and next year Li-S batteries promise to double that again, and the cost? Well the current range of Thunder Sky Lions cost about the same as 200 year old lead acid shite that people who don't know what they're talking about keep harping on about.
http://www.everspring.net/product-battery.htm
Who said that electric car are ecological?
In order to make it work, manufacurer are developing fast charge, long lasting bateries.
Goodbye Smoke, Hello Toxic Water. (acid->toxic rain)
It probably will stay dead. With a range of only 20-40 miles there really isn't going to be many people that are going to want one of these.
the Portland episode.
True. I ride farther than 20 miles to work and back on my bike every day. Anybody that cares about the environment enough to put up with the eccentricities of an electric vehicle should really consider bicycle commuting. You can get a hell of a nice "mule" type bike (hybrid or other heavy bike) and trailer for far less than this, and have way less environmental impact as well.
To head off the comments, cycling in the rain is NOT a problem. It's some kind of modern fallacy that apparently people melt in water unless it's the special kind of water that comes out of the shower. I've tried it and it's not true. $50 in a rain cape and booties, and you're good. It's actually kind of fun to ride in the rain. And no, you don't get cold; you're pumping out so much heat, the main problem is to get vented well enough to not bake.
Useless ugly POS vehicle. For $13k I'd take a chance on a Kia and have something more useful and less ugly.
Companies like this go bankrupt for a reason - nobody wants to buy their product.
Self awareness - try it!
LI-on life is probably worse on the nasty discharge cycle than L-A.
Steve
Have a look at MCC SMART - they do a 600cc diesel - reported consumption around 70+ miles/UK gallon
I run their 2 seater petrol car (597 cc) - av consumption 12-14miles/litre depending on how much motorway - fully auto, top speed 80mph - only critique I have is small tank (about 220mile range) - hard suspension (rear wheel drive) but very nippy, easy to park and low insurance
One gear transmission because electric motors have all their torque available all the time, unlike engines that have to spin up to a certain RPM before they can put out their best torque.
This thing meets an SUV or worse a semi-truck and you are virtually guaranteed to be oozed out of this thing like someone stepping on a banana. So here's my rant. Look it up and you will determine that BEV (Battery Electric Vehicle) technology has been virtually stagnant for almost 100 years. We have virtually the same range now as we did then. Battery technology: Lead Acid - replace a 2-4000$ battery pack every 3 years. NiMH - replace a 4-8000$ battery pack every 1000 recharge cycles (basically 3 years). Lithium Ion - replace a 11-15000$ battery pack every 500 (1000 if you are lucky) recharge cycles again basically 3 years. On top of it - 3 hour recharging time ? Come on, get it down to 15 minutes - even 15 minutes to reach 70% charge on a vehicle with a 300 mile range will give you 200 miles of driving. Some battery chargers are capable of doing this but it requires special wiring with the charger kicking out 440v at an ungodly amount of amps. Give me an uncramped and safe commuter vehicle that can withstand all the nastiness that winter has to throw at me with a 200 mile or greater range. Then give me a "family" car that is a plug-in hybrid with a decent batter bank - 200 mile range minimum. Top it off with an NEV (Neighborhood Electric Vehicle) for those quick errands around the near-city. Make it have multiple charging options and then - maybe - we have something. We all talk about Open Source and the sharing of information. I have looked at sites about converting vehicles to electric and its an unorganized hodgepodge. We have enough minds in the Internet community to make something happen for those of us who want it to happen.
Where's the Trunk?
Will this thing fit anything other than the driver? With a 20mile range (requring most people to recharge it at work, good luck finding a plug), and no cargo room (can you figure out where to put your laptop/groceries?), you might as well ride a bike.
(the commute will take 1-1.5hrs on a bike, you can carry a signifigant cargo capacity, and all you need to recharge is a snickers bar)
On a side note, would this little thing FIT an average American? I'm not exadgerating. I woudn't want to figure out how to cram a 250lb male into one of these things. (especialy since that would constitute 1/6 the combined mass of the car)
Actually this would be a nice vehicle if it sat 2.
(say one behind the other?)
I would rather be ashes than dust!
try a bike! that's my transportation of choice. it's elegant, efficient, uses no gas, and creates zero pollution.
nature loves variety::society hates it get your variety at http://www.monkeypantz.net
I would also assume that Pontiac gave NCR a deal that they couldn't refuse to get rid of those god-awful things.
A fine is a tax you pay for doing wrong and a tax is a fine you pay for doing all right.
Never took a physics class, didja? Cars are not end tables.
Why does electric cars have to look so strange.
The think looks like an SUV in comparison and has decent safety. Wonder how the sparrow looks like after a collision.
www.think.no
It takes 8kWh to recharge for a 20 mile range. At 8 cents per kWh, that is 64/20 = 3.2cent/mile for fuel. If you have a 50mpg car, you would have to be paying $1.60/gallon for gas before you hit break-even. (When someone says 20-40 mile range, I think 20 mile range unless you are going downhill.) You also have to replace the batteries every 1-4 years.
there is a certain providence in the rise of a sparrow.
--Joey
I don't understand why these electric car companies don't get together and set out a standard electric cell design (like a large AA battery for vehicles) that would fit in all their cars (e.g. Cell Spec v1.0: physical dimensions are 1u x 1u x 3u, pin configuration like this.., max charge 1,000 W per hour etc etc etc) Then the petrol/gas stations can carry a stock, and when you are running low, you give them your old one to recharge and install one of the recharged ones they had next to the sacks of charcoal and bottled gas.
Then instead of the 2 to 6 hours currently quoted when your car runs low on juice, its only about as long as it takes someone to put petrol/diesel in their fuel tank.
We saw a Pontiac Aztek at church one Sunday, and my oldest son said, "Dad... I can't believe what I just saw. I've never seen that before."
"What's that?"
"An Aztek without dealer plates!"
Tim
there's also the T-Rex, made near my hometown, which isnt electric, but looks bloody noice nonetheless (www.go-t-rex.com/)
So, does anybody have figures on how much more oil it takes to produce the electricity for an electric car than it would take to just run it on gasoline in the first place?
Wow! Check out the GMAX 48v
Now this a a true CARt -- just like the rest in my opinion.
What does it actually cost to recharge this baby? If my gas bill goes down but my electric bill triples, then what am I really saving?
(Stolen sig) Remember: it's a "Microsoft virus", not an "email virus", a "Microsoft worm", not a "computer worm
The Merlin Roadster is also a three wheel drive, but not as ugly and has an ICE.
It has Intrusion CounterElectronics? I mean, okay, I don't want anyone to jack into my car, so that's probably a Good Thing.
Does it use Gray ICE or Black ICE?
USE HOT GRITS WITH STATUE OF NATALIE PORTMAN (NAKED AND PETRIFIED)
This thing has exactly the right size. I like this thing so much that I'll buy two. One for each foot.
USE HOT GRITS WITH STATUE OF NATALIE PORTMAN (NAKED AND PETRIFIED)
Probably? Probably not.
would swallow that thing.
I've heard that Myers is planning to charge more liek 18,000 for each. That is crazy!!!
It would take 80 square feet of good sun-catching surface covered with cells to charge something close to 6KWh in 8 hours.
And on a cloudy day...
As to the power ports for laptops, it's pretty common since you already have the circuitry. If you ran your laptop for 8 hours, it would take about 1% of the battery capacity. This is perhaps why there is a power port because there are many things you could plug in that would be useful but wouldn't reduce the cars range noticeably.
ICE - internal combustion engine. In the Merlin's case, it's a big ass Harley V-Twin.
R(k)
Just to let you know, the old lady in the shoe called, she said she wants her car back...
-Gamma
You missed "incredibly homosexual".
No, because energy gets taken out of the wind. Well, you asked.
You can 'fill up' in under 5 minutes
there are enough stations to be able to drive anywhere with out having to plan where you have to stop
market to more than just comuters
have a range of at least 200 miles
have a high enough top speed to be able to drive on the highway
Do these, and I'd buy one. Until then, I'll keep my hybrid Civic
Fast, Far, Cheap.
Pick 2.
Oh, well, that's obvious. Everyone knows batteries suck. If you recharge your fuel cell electrically (to crack H20) would that be an electric car?
I'd call anything with an electric motor electric. Eh, semantics; who knows what they'll be called should they (whatever kind of alternative car it is) ever become popular.
The enemies of Democracy are
Oddly, the TZero is one of the more practical electric cars out there, but not because of speed (and certainly not because of price) -- it has a range of almost 300 miles on a single charge. That's the same range I get out of my Nissan SE-R on a single tank, more or less.
Also, it's powered by a bank of laptop batteries, no kidding. Clever, that.
Not that there's anything wrong with it, but their primary "Value" (which I assumed was going to talk about price, to be honest) is to "Glorify God". Also, their logo has "Romans 12:2" in tiny print at the top, which is:
"And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God."
Just thought that was an interesting tidbit about the culture behind the product.
Your post was fairly well written, but mistaken on the subject of turning engines on and off. Idling is by far the worst thing you can do to an engine, as coolant and oil do not flow properly at idle speeds. An idling engine winds up lubricating itself with the dirtiest part of the oil, increasing wear even more than constant usage, which is why "highway miles" are much worse than "city miles." In stop and go traffic, it isn't the and go that ruins your engine -- it's the stop.
Furthermore, stopping your engine for thirty seconds or even a few minutes in traffic is not enough to cool combustion chambers nor catylitic converters. Once they're hot, they stay hot for a good long time. Starting a warm engine is an easy thing to do; in fact, the author of Drive it forever suggests using a block warmer, even in the summer, to avoid the wear of starting and idling a cool engine. The same book suggests cutting the engine at long (30 second+) stoplights to reduce idling.
Cutting your engine rather than idling is GOOD for your car, good for the environment and can save up to 100 gallons per year. All it costs is your dignity when people with their windows rolled up and A/C blasting look at you funny for "stalling out."
Hey freaks: now you're ju
"While fuel cell powered vehicles use electric motors, it's more on [sic] an implementation detail."
Right. And while battery-powered vehicles use electric motors, it's more of an implementation detail.
You made a mistake. Own up to it. Face it like a man. (Or for the PC, face it like a person.)
Is this even a very "green" choice?
battery life (of 13 car batteries) of 1-4 years?
How nice is it to throw out a battery every 1-4 months?
I'd say a hybrid might be wiser, as it gets you away from the extension cord, gives you cargo/multipassenger, adds great range, and puts you into the market where the momentum resides (helpful when one must get it repaired)
tone
gives a whole new level of danger to keying your car, tho, doesn't it. Oooh. that kid just cost you $20000 worth of solar cells...
Advantages of the Sparrow over a bike:
- Potentially faster (depending on traffic conditions)
- More comfortable
- You can plug your phone and laptop into it (although why you would do this while you're driving is beyond me)
Advantages of a bike over the Sparrow:- No waiting for batteries to charge
- No searching for a place to charge batteries away from home
- No need to waste energy by pushing an extra 0.65 tons around
- 1-2 orders of magnitude cheaper to buy
- Lower operating cost
- Great for your health
- Easier to park/store
- Easier to maintain
- Can go places the Sparrow can't (e.g., bike trails)
- No toxic waste from lead batteries
- Quieter
- Does not contribute to power plant emissions
- Range limited only by the time and endurance of the operator (40 miles in a day is easily within the reach of a regular bike commuter)
- Parts and labor for repairs can be found locally
That's just a start. I didn't mention safety because there are too many variables, so it's not clear which has the advantage.I'd rather drive a Sparrow than a car, but the bike still beats them both.
King_of_Prussia,
I'm assuming by using this name that you might live near the Philly/King of Prussia area.
You ever hear of the frickin' Limerick Nuclear Power plant that resides damn near King of Prussia? And you know damn well that out of any nuclear power plant that Three Mile Island is one of the safest in the entire country because of all the damn oversight from regulatory agencies.
Junior, when you learn about real environmental issues you come back and then you might be able to talk with the adults.
If you were paying attention there is more pollution from mutiple emission point sources (ie. CARS!) than from a single point source like a power plant.
We should be looking into these instead of electric cars that require coal-burning power plants to recharge, which introduces trapped carbon (and uranium and mercury and lead and...) into the system, which is why there is too much in the air.
Or we can get off all our asses and FORCE those lazy solar panel tecnologies/technologists to become more than 15% efficient. The only freely-available currently free energy for the short-time is that burning death star we call the sun. Nobody is willing to design any electric cars after the hidden ether technology that Nikolai Tesla spoke of and powered in his own electric car. Neither does Edmond Gray; Gray Laboratories at California desire to discuss how he uses his free energy from "split the positive" from his electrolytic capacitor enhancment circuits for cold fusion, nor will he discuss His patents on how he harnesses such free energy with His specially designed DC motor.
Everyone is keeping all the free energy a secret as if it will be the ruination of the world should it become mainstream. Even the combustion engine has a secret, the {Peu-geott} carbeurator, which was documented back in the 1940's to improve a Ford Studebaker's mileage to about 300 Miles per Galon of fuel. Even looking to Japan, there is a secret carbeurator that improved fuel mileage to over 500 Miles per Galon, yet when they are exported from Japan to the grand ol' honest United States Customs they are *magically* tuned and no-where near as efficient.
This post started out +Funny, but it concludes as +Interesting/+Informative.
I agree with you. Designers that put a single wheel in the front or rear are asking for any damn thing to spin and role out of controll when that single wheel fails. I think they should have an inner wheel next to a single wheel; the inner wheel is much smaller, but is solid rubber whilst the wheel that touches the ground is the one that is hollow and oh so soft to the touch.
But no matter how you patch it, it's still a crippled horse.
I'd love to get something like this. I have a short commute, and basically a covered motorcycle (something I can use in rain and snow) is what I'm looking for.
But no where on the Myers site does it say how much the bloody thing costs! Sure, they'll take your $1000 deposit towards the purchase, but they don't say what that final price will be. In fact, their reservation process page says this:
So I'm supposed to tie up $1000 on a deposit without knowing the final purchase price? You've got to be kidding.
(The Phoenix site does mention "$14,900 retail price and up", but there's no link from the Myers site.)
I also worry about a company whose "Values" statement (sorry, can't link, part of a Flash presentation) contains "Glorify God" and "Share our financial success on behalf of God's kingdom" as bullet points. It wouldn't stop me doing business with them, but it is a little off-putting to us non-believers in the market. Which cult are they a member of, anyway?
Chelloveck
I give up on debugging. From now on, SIGSEGV is a feature.
You want ugly? I'll give you ugly.
What?
...a gigantic flag sprouting out of the top of the vehicle to make it visible to the SUVs everyone else is driving, and keep it from getting smooshed. A constant blaring siren would help, too. I'm all for tiny, efficient electric cars, but when everyone else on the road is driving a Hummer, even the Neon I drive now is really too small to be safe.
That is one fugly car.
With that kind of storage and power capabilities, the car could be very useful as a self-portable, silent and pollution-free power supply. It wouldn't be able to move itself very far, but even a mile is plenty for many important applications.
Scientists restrict study to entire physical universe; creationist
|Oddly, the TZero is one of the more practical electric cars out there, but not because of speed (and certainly not because of price) -- it has a range of almost 300 miles on a single charge. That's the same range I get out of my Nissan SE-R on a single tank, more or less.
No the range is only 100 miles, and then only if you drive "very carefully".
Did you know every 2-3 years you would need to spend $3000 just on new batteries? The car is insanely expensive both to buy AND maintain.
Also, it's powered by a bank of laptop batteries, no kidding. Clever, that.
No, it's powered by spiral-cell lead acid batteries. See the features page.
Life is too short to proofread.