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Microsoft's AntiSpyware Disabled by Spyware
Ruke writes "A trojan has targeted Microsoft's AntiSpyware program, deleting all files within the C:\Program Files\AntiSpyware folder, as well as logging keystrokes at several online banking sites." The good news is that it's a Trojan, so one still has to bother with running an attached file.
The news itself might be interest, but in the realm of well written articles this will not make the list. A choice nugget from TFA:
<<< The password stealing Troj/BankAsh-A Trojan, discovered yesterday, is a spyware. It keeps a track of user activities on the computer. It spies on you. >>>
Er, didn't we cover the spying part two sentences ago? Is A spyware? A spyware what?
<<< The Trojan also removes important entries of the antispyware in the registry and thus literal kills the antispyware. >>>
Literal? Come on - this reads worse than half of the AC posts in YRO. I hate playing the grammar nazi, but this was painful to read...
"As the intrepid kobold companion continues his journey, he begins to wonder... if priests raises dead, why anybody die?
Preview here
Rock that crushes, Paper & Scissors that don't matter.
Not that that has ever prevented Slashdot from reporting things like these as "vulnerabilities".
Yes, nobody ever expected a trojan to attack a piece of free MS software. I mean, look at Outlook. And Internet Explorer.
And in other news - "Google" gaining marketshare with "PageRank" technology
The best antispyware is buy a Mac, or install your favourite distro.
Sorry, but there it is.
It gets tiring fighting the broken dam, you can't hold all the water back forever.
Am I the only one who was humming the "Trojan Man" theme song while I read this?
They could have taken a working product, repackage it, only to have it compromised less than a month after their re-release.
Wait, nevermind.
How long till the Slashbots come out in droves proclaiming M$ sucks and their spyware removal sucks and they should all go to hell because a trojan(more like a crappy little batch file) is able to disable their program. Nevermind the fact that with the way this program works it would be just as effective on AdAware or SpyBot...and nevermind the fact that before running this trojan the MS spyware program TELLS YOU NOT TO!!
Please do not let scientific accuracy interfere with the intended humourous/interesting/insightful value of this comment
Viruses shut down norton antivirus.
I mean really, who didn't see this coming?
ItWasFree.com - Take the mystery
I know it's immature but...
Let me be the first to say, PWN3D!!!1one!!1
When a true genius appears, you can know him by this sign: that all the dunces are in a confederacy against him.
That by the end of this week CoolWebSearch "affiliates" will be bundling it with their software to ensure that they remain undetected (except by HijackThis, Ad-Aware, and Spybot).
Striking fear in the authors of godawful fanfiction, I am here, appearing in darkness, Tuxedo Jack!
not surprising since their "focus on security" similarly led them to release a firewall that didn't activate until after the internet connection was established and could be remotely disabled anyway.
None of this is a surprise and a series of new malware tools attempt to disable various protective services.
For example, deleting the MSI Installer Service such that when you try to install something like SpySweeper the installer won't work properly.
Alternatively, killing Antivirus or Personal Firewall processes or placing known good-guy websites in the restricted zone of Internet Explorer.
The 'solution' IMHO is to have multiple layers of defence and to some extent, perhaps to use less popular tools (i.e. not McAfee and Norton) which won't be on the malware's 'hitlist'.
I know security through obscurity isn't a solution, but in this case, security through not being one of the masses may be.
I say this having spent nearly a whole day trying to remove Spyware from a friend's laptop.
Indy Media Watch-Proctologist of the Internet
R'ing TFA made me literally weep and gnash my teeth. literally.
A patch? Its a Trojan Horse. You can't patch against this, there's no bug. If I gave you a binary that erases your hard drive...
what the heck can the OS do to stop it?
It's a bit early to point the finger.
Indy Media Watch-Proctologist of the Internet
For all its security efforts, Microsoft continues to let users run as administrator by default, which is downright irresponsible. I just spent an evening cleaning an acquaintance's computer of a persistent, multiple spyware infection because of this policy of Microsoft. Needless to say I created separate restricted user accounts for all members in the household, but the Microsoft installer should have done this from the beginning! You cannot expect regular users to do anything except go with the default.
I also installed Firefox, and set all of the Internet Exploder security settings on "High" on all accounts except the administrator one (so that Windows Update can be run).
I didn't know about it.
-dave
http://millionnumbers.com/ - own the number of your dreams
FYI Outlook isnt free. ( Outlook Express is.. )
"They" dont just attack Free Microsoft Items.....
But i agree.. no big suprise here..
---- Booth was a patriot ----
"you have to consciously or unconsciously run the EXE to install the server side on your computer."
This is opposed to your computer plugging itself in, tapping into the internet, downloading and running itself?
Seriously, every peice of malware one gets is result of human action or inaction. If one were more conciencious of the threat, they would take necessary precautions. ( install Firefox/Linux )
I also think this title tries to make a funny or ironic statement at the expense of accuracy. A Trojan is not what I consider spyware, or, something that sneaks it way in via website, javascript, etc... A trojan targets just teh fools.
How about denying your user write access to system related folders?
It's a bit early to point the finger.
What? Wait until tomorrow? This isn't a Spyware problem, it's a virus scanning problem for your incoming mail.
A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
The fact that you have to run as administrator to get any work done is a security hole big enough to drive a truck through. It is ridiculous that you can trash your filesystem just by double-clicking a mail attachment. *All* linux distributions I've used set up a user account for you and encourage you to use it. Mandrake, for instance, gives you a big red warning if you start KDE as root.
Until microsoft fixes this it will be plagued by security holes. And don't give me this bullshit about usability -- Mac OS X got it right, why can't windows?
___
If you think big enough, you'll never have to do it.
You have to be running as Administrator for it to affect your system. It works by writing files to the system directory, deleting the MSAS install directory, and writing keys to HKLM, among other things. All of these are blocked if you are not administrator.
you're going to have to cut and paste man, im too drunk to mess about with html. and oddly they seemed to work in the story preview when i submitted it. perhaps plain old text formatting works better for story submissions
STOP LOGGING ON AS ADMINISTRATOR!
Problem solved.
You wouldn't log in and do everything as root on your Unix machine, and run random scripts, would you?
whoever wins, we lose
my last sig was too controversial... now, a new and improved useless sig!
I'm pretty sure that regular users can't write the "C:\program files" directory on Windows XP.
Anyone have a link where I can download this at?
So, someone developer an application that deletes some files and installs a keylogger. Whoop-de-doo... :-S
Beware: In C++, your friends can see your privates!
As long as you're not logged in as an Administrator or root.
are an ass....
You know it....
It isn't spyware it is a Trojan. Spyware are programs either secretly installed by a base program to monitor your habits of browsing and usage or installed but mildly covered. This is a Trojan intent on stealing banking passwords and such. Two completely different things.
if you cant get lokitorrent.com working then i think you NEED a beer lol
You *should* be able to install such a program on your computer. You *should* also be smart enough to know what you decide to put on your machine.
So thanks to today's news that Symantec programs may execute programs that should be flagged, one must now only use a solid product like Symantec Anti-Virus to load up software to remove Microsoft's anti-spyware software. Beautiful. Perhaps I should save everyone the time and hassle and just make a website with a malformed jpg or gif that loads an ActiveX script to then download the trojan and thus get it all done in one shot. Vulnerability after vulnerability after vulnerability. Perhaps this guy wasn't so far off.
Of course, I can't help but point out the obvious: rumors keep abounding that M$ will charge for its anti-spyware and anti-virus softwares. So let me see if I'm clear on this... they write shitty code that I'm forced to use (since the apps I need only run on Win32), and then I have to pay again for software to keep people from exploiting the software that was shitty to begin with. Isn't that a bit like selling you a piece of shit car, then charging you to use your warranty when the clutch fails on day #2 of ownership? You know, many of us thought that the day would come that M$ would charge for access to WindowsUpdate. Is there anything they won't charge for? Don't they ever say "we fucked up... here's a freebie on us"? Or "you already paid $300 for our OS... here's a way to secure it for free".
"The good news is that it's a Trojan, so one still has to bother with running an attached file."
:-D
Haha, that's assuming you aren't being safe and also have Symantec Anti-Virus
We've seen viri/trojans that delete antispyware before. All the more reason to install software somewhere other than the default location, and to run more than one antispyware/antivirus solution.
Also, when software starts disappearing from your computer you might want to look into it.
Slashdot is not here to break news.
Slashdot is here to point us to interesting things on sites which we would not normally visit.
As a result of that, it is a _requirement_ for other sites to have covered the issue first.
Don't complain just because you don't understand how slashdot works - by your UID you've been here enough years that you should have figured it out by now.
Install elsewhere. I've found very, very few applications will not accept another partition to install to.
The problem is that lots of software REQUIRES Administrator simply to function properly. You can argue that one should simply ditch that software, but unfortunately its not always that easy.
.NET 2003. Debugging managed code in a Web Application/Web Service, or a Windows Service pretty much requires Administrator access.
Case in point: Visual Studio
Don't ask anti-virus people for a straight answer - they're terrified. If one of these apps seems to have a legitimate purpose than no matter how it gets on your computer, no matter what else it does, it seems like it's immune from deletion by AV.
The AV people are tyring to walk an increasingly thin line between malicious spyware and malicious viruses. Pretty soon, they're going to have to make some hard decisions.
"...Well, there's egg and bacon; egg sausage and bacon; egg and spam; egg bacon and spam; egg bacon sausage and spam..."
I think the trojan is probably pretty safe from that particular OS protection...
So my email stating "Click start and then run and then type CMD and then click OK and then in the nifty black box type 'del C:\Program Files\AntiSpyware\*.*' and then hit Y on your keyboard and then forward this to 10 of your friends so Bill Gates will send you $100" is getting around a bit.
"I am the king of the Romans, and am superior to rules of grammar!"
-Sigismund, Holy Roman Emperor (1368-1437)
When Microsoft released their Antispyware, everyone said, "Oh, well, Microsoft didn't do anything, they just bought the software from Giant.". Now that there's a problem, "Whoa, Microsoft's software really sucks. It's sure is all their fault."
Pick a side, people.
... thinking of Tim holding Gareth's stapler out the window when they heard this?
"Win treats sysadmins better than users. Mac treats users better than sysadmins. Linux treats everyone like sysadmins."
In another news, the CIA was considering using Micro$oft Antispyware to keep out North Korean spies.
Alas!
Dude this isn't fark :)
Windows runs in root. That means that by default all user accounts are created will full administrative access.
OSX and Linux (and nearly every other OS under the sun) creates user accounts with limited rights. That means things cannot happen without your specific permission.
In Suse 9.2, for example, when I need to do something like that requires root access, I'm asked to supply a password.
A similar thing happens in OSX. When you install software you're asked for a password.
Accordingly, by default Windows is less secure as programs can install and system settings can change behind your back and without your permission.
I admit that Windows gets a lot of attacks because it's a big target. However, everyone has to realise that a lot of the attacks occur simply because Windows is insecure by default.
If someone says he and his monkey have nothing to hide, they almost certainly do.
I wasn't sure I knew that song, so I was sitting here asking myself "Do I know the Muffin Man - the Muffin Man, the Muffin man?..."
Turns out I do know that song.
"Domination of your PC II: Revenge of the Spyware"
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
I set up my father inlaw with a user acccount. He went from getting tons of spyware each month to NO spyware each month.
If someone says he and his monkey have nothing to hide, they almost certainly do.
Runs on root? What are you talking about. With Win NT, 2000, and XP, go into local users and groups and add a user. Does the user automatically have administrative rights? No. Does the user have power user rights? No. If your using Active Directory, add a user in there. Does the user automatically have any kind of administrative rights? No. If you're still running Windows 98, well that's your problem
"you have to consciously or unconsciously run the EXE to install the server side on your computer"
Damnit. I always knew my sleepwalking would get me in trouble some day...
SIERRA TANGO FOXTROT UNIFORM
I would like to see an operating system feature that offers what amounts to "Undo" for disk drives. VirtualPC has had this for years, and there are (or were) a handful of third party programs available to do the same thing. Basically, it keeps a running log of changes to the disk. At any time, you can go "oops" and back up a configurable number of steps. Some backup programs offer a similar feature, but they're again third party, and the interface is confusing to new users.
This should be completely integrated into the operating system, and the data log should have root permissions. The OS itself could even watch for suspicious activity, and ask the user if he/she would like to roll back. Of course, this would require some architectural changes, and - in the case of Windows - a proper implementation of a multiple user environment. Still, I think it's the only final solution to the problems offered by viruses and their ilk.
Formerly GNU/Anonymous Coward. This message has been determined to cause cancer in laboratory animals.
When you install Windows the account automatically created has administrative privileges. Sure you can change them later. But by DEFAULT they are administrators. That is what I mean by DEFAULT.
Default: computing preset option: an option that will automatically be selected by a computer if the user does not choose one
The fact that Microsoft offers an OPTION for restricted accounts obviously is having very little impact on the stopping of malicious software. That is why it should be done by DEFAULT. Do you get it now?
If someone says he and his monkey have nothing to hide, they almost certainly do.
"Slashdot is not here to break news."
No, Slashdot is here to break servers.
I've certainly figured it out by now how Slashdot works. The point is that this story was on a lot of sites that are cited here every day. I enjoy interesting articles, but this one comes off as filler.
as if we expected anything less of a microsoft product..
I have long remained curious about the reason for calling a condom 'Trojan'. Do a bunch of soldiers jump out of it when you open the packet? Or, worse still, *while you're having sex*? Perhaps they only fit (wooden) horses?
...for that tip!
that I think about how bad Trojan is for a name of a condom.
Actually, something keeps disabling my Security Agents in Microsoft Antispyware. Could this be the cause? Or something else?
Three days from now?? Thats tomorrow!! ~Peter Griffin
Honestly, did anyone NOT see this coming?
I jokingly predicted this exact situation in a post when they first released the beta of the app (though admittedly I thought it'd take a little bit longer before it was actually in the wild). Rest assured that it is only a matter of time before you see this in a non-trojan form that is automatically installed via an IE exploit delivered by some ad-serving company.
Microsoft's move of buying up and releasing an anti-malware application of their own is IMO nothing more than an attempt to improve public perception of their so-called efforts towards improving Windows security.
Amusingly enough, I believe it to also be an example of how much they simply don't get it and/or don't care -- the insecurity of the underlying OS is the direct cause of the probem, not the spyware.
No amount of anti-malware software targeting the effects (automatically installed spyware) of the problem (insecure OS/Web Browser) will have any positive impact because it's the problem itself that allows the effects to continue... and have enough power to take the anti-malware software and just turn it off.
Blocker blocker blocker blocker blocker blocker blocker blocker blocker blocker blocker blocker FUBAR FUBAR
Fake! Fake! Oh, it's a fake!
Blocker blocker blocker (etc. ad nauseam)
A few people have pointed out that you can set up limited user accounts in XP, and the default user account is admin. Everyone screams and moans 'but how many normal users will set up a limited account?'. Their argument is that 'normal' users don't have the wherewithal or desire to set up a limited account and that Microsoft should do this for them. The problem with that argument is that 'normal' users like that are also the same exact type of users who would simply type in the root password to install the trojan or spyware anyway. If you think someone is too dumb to set up a limited account (which is one of the easiest tasks to do in XP), then why would you give them the benefit of the doubt to not type in their password whenever the window pops up????
Well, here's MY catchy thing of the day.
I've run Adaware with latest defs and voila... those system hooks didn't help... a client's computer was CRAWLING with spyware and adaware is what removed them... strange since Giant... *cough cough* MICROSOFT antispyware was running with all settings enabled... strange indeed... oh well, guess some things get past it...
goes to play that since Microsoft put all the dummies, morons and assholes on the 'net... they now have to deal with irate, moronic assholes and idiots who think they're "compewtah gawds" (read, idiotic asinine MORONS!)
Besides, has anyone besides me found that Antispyware simply flags legitimate apps half the time (VNC, NetopHost, etc, PC Anywhere, you name it all get tagged as spyware)
" What luck for rulers that men do not think" - Adolf Hitler
You know. I honestly believe that if Microsoft released it's own MS branded virus that some enterprising coder from the eastern area of Europe would write an anti-virus virus that exploited some unbelievably obscure buffer overflow vulnerability and Slashdot would pick up the story.
It wouldn't end there because the anti-virus virus writer would complain to his ISP which happens to be hosting his website where he geefully took responsibility for the anti-virus virus and chastised Microsoft for their inability to code a secure, virus. The anti-virus virus writer would also praise the extreme security of Linux by hypothesizing that if it had been a Linux virus he couldn't have destroyed it the way he had the MS one.
As the webserver that hosted the site of the anti-virus virus begins it's thermal meltdown, the ISP calls Cowboy Neal to ask him to PLEASE cache the site for their customer. Cowboy Neal (being the astute person he is) notes the anti-virus virus writers name and writes it down. Cowboy Neal then realizes that Microsoft has posted a $134 Gazillion dollar reward for the capture and mutilation of the anti-virus virus writer and quickly shoots off an email to Bill.
Bill calls the BSA Death Squad and they march on St. Petersburg, finding the anti-virus virus writer sitting at a local Burger King with a laptop. They drag him outside and mercilessly beat him with rubber hoses until, lying in a pool of his own blood the anti-virus writer dies.
Bill, in his infinite gratitude sends Cowboy Neal a check for $134 Gazillion dollars which Cowboy Neal uses to flee the country with his mistress.
Despite all of the drama here a couple of lessons will be learned.
1. Slashdot STILL doesn't cache sites.
2. Microsoft isn't the target because it's big. It's the target because it's EASY!
3. Cowboy Neal can not be trusted with large amounts of cash.
4. I haven't seen my wife since he got paid.....
A trojan has targeted Microsoft's AntiSpyware program, deleting all files within the C:\Program Files\AntiSpyware folder...
Good thing I installed it in C:\Program Files\Microsoft\AntiSpyware.
A trojan is historically a program that does something malicious while appearing to the user that it is doing something good. Such as a game that also opens a back door for your computer to be remotely controlled. I have no idea why the condom company uses it. Maybe because when you least expect it, thousands of little men burst out and cause lots of problems.
Anthropic principle: We see the universe the way it is because if it were different we would not be here to see it.
I applaud your awesome troll. You should catch like 4 different slashdot cults with varying lacks of a sense of humor. I sorrow for your Karma, though.
...it's really a sad day for America when we require a goddamn ACT OF CONGRESS to make our DVD players work properly. ~
Well, given that Paris was probably the most famous trojan, and stole the most beautiful woman in the world from her husband, I could probably outline a few theories.
...it's really a sad day for America when we require a goddamn ACT OF CONGRESS to make our DVD players work properly. ~
Now some people say that Microsoft software is has more trojans, etc. because it is more popular. But - MS antispyware is a lot less popular than other spyware products, yet it is the only one that is really easily disabled by a trojan, so that makes the "Microsoft is more popular" argument invalid! Well... this wasn't surprising considering Micrsoft's security track record.
Try writing in multiple sentances with paragraphs.
OS X is not immune either. It only takes one line in the terminal to delete your home directory, and it can a really small script file, or you can be tricked into typing it yourself, if you aren't smart.
Unfortunately, apple shares this with M$: the first user is an admin. Luckily root is diabled by default.
Public download, but can't provide feedback without becoming a MVP. Sigh.
I have my taskbar on the left edge of the screen, and any "toast" windows that popup in the bottom right corner just quickly scroll up and off the screen.
But, I guess someone else will have to report it.
M$ when you want software really bad, we have really bad software.
So Long and Thanks for all the Fish.
Because ever since that fateful day in Troy, whenever someone gets wood, they think of Trojans...
A virus or malware, which cripples, but does not actually disable any security tools which may be on the system so that the user is still compelled to believe that their antivirus and antispyware tools are functioning normally, but in fact the tools have been altered slightly to simply behave as though the one particular piece of malware in question wasn't actually present, and meanwhile the malware performs exactly as normal.
File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
i'm wondering... can't an app just pretend to be kdesu and ask for your root password?
Yes, IE has plenty of holes that allow exploits to ravage a system. That definately falls on the maker.
But, if you're a jackass who's making software to spy on people, claim it's something else, and then put in measures to ensure that the programs run "no matter what..." Well, I'm willing to put plenty of responsibility on you.
It doesn't matter what platform the author is targeting, nor what company makes that platform. You're still trying to find unethical (an in many cases illegal) ways to get your stuff to run on an unsuspecting target, and you plan on stealing with it (be it bank account numbers, passwords, or something as little as bandwidth to push ads).
Spyware targets whatever will attempt to remove it. I've seen trojans that prevent some scanners (Ad-Aware and Spybot especially) from detecting that the spy process even exists. I've seen processes that create backups to make sure that both keep each other running if one ends or gets cleaned out. It's something new all the time with these people. It was only a matter of time before something like this targeted Giant's product regardless of whether MS got involved or not.
Don't trust your PC to this Microsoft micro-trash. My crack team of security experts (my pet cat and a 5-year-old nephew who mentioned something about bug squashing at a Christmas gettogether) and I have developed malware detection and removal software that will kick any other anti-crap's hindquarters. Spending unheard of manhours (many of which were used to make late-night caffeine runs and failed attempts to get laid) over a span of nearly a week, my team and I developed a program that will secure your information technology from those evil evil hackers out on the big bad Internet. Now if your current ad removal system or firewall says my program is keylogging to send your credit card information to me, this is only because it's jealous. I suggest you remove other spyware removal tools and anti-virus programs as soon as possible!
I'd like to proffer the URL for my program now, but it would seem my host has mistakenly taken the site down for the moment. I intend to call them soon and have this terribly injust mistake rectified immediately.
On vit, on code et puis on meurt.
1) If Windows had protected the antispyware program in some special way, we were now all complaining about antispyware being considered "special" by the OS and thus being in unfair competition with other spyware programs.
..Go and flame me now.
2) On any Unix machine you have to be root to install most of the software (you usually have to be root before rpm or make install) : a simple trojan relying on *stupid* user behaviour can be written for any platform and this is not a security problem of the platform, is a security problem of the user's brain.
3) From 2, even if the default user was not administrator, most people would simply try to install this new porn-lemmings game they received and they would "run as" it (just like you su - make install on linux).
4) It's not even only a problem in the user brain. I wonder how much would it take to discover 5 malicious lines inserted in some big open source project. This *is* a possible evet, it could be an angry sourceforge employer, a security hole somewhere, a
5) It seems to me whatever the choice of MS is in any particular matter, there is always someone who takes it to bash it down. When the fact is ridiculous like in this example, this kind of behaviour is detrimental to the whole community. Do you live to make Linux great ? Than use your time to make it the perfect OS, not to make Windows appear the worst OS ever - 90% of users have chosen it as the best product for them and they will not change their mind because you are bashing it down, they will change their mind when they'll see something better *for them*.
In Outlook Express 6... Tools:Options Security Tab Tick "Do not allow attachments to be saved or opened that could potentially be a virus" OK This looks like it should do the job for most people - those who don't need to receive executable attachments by email.
>I'm pretty sure that regular users can't write
>the "C:\program files" directory on Windows XP.
I wonder if the trojan is hard coded for that folder or get the default program forlder from Windows. some localized versions of Windows (for example the swedish one) uses another default folder name for program installation. MOst program handle that but some insist to go for "program files" no matter what.
Apparently, Microsoft now has offical plans to begin charging for Antispyware (like they didn't before). This morning I noticed this new message: This version expires in 170 day(s). This version of Microsoft Antispyware expires on July 31, 2005. Please contact Microsoft for an updated version.
It's not just software (pun intended). If you think of the original meaning of a Trojan horse, it's still not a very inspiring name for a condom. Good thing we don't have those here in Finland. A typical Finnish condom is called Sultan, btw, which I think makes a lot more sense. Of course being a true Slashdotter I can only speak from a theoretical viewpoint.
Escher was the first MC and Giger invented the HR department.
Talked to my father-in-law on the phone yesterday... Wachovia was targeted too. The support guy had no ideas about it other than "it's your computer". Of course but this just shows the big companies are in no way prepared for what is starting to happen: an all-out crippling of computer systems by hackers.
Our profession will not take off with commodity computing due to hackers! We have to fix them.
BTW, anyone know what can fix the Wachovia keylogger?
Expect Freedom.
That is why it should be done by DEFAULT.
No, stupid users only deserve to suffer. It's one of my joys in life.
Dedicated Cthulhu Cultist since 4523 BC.
Most said 'boo' when they found out MS was releasing antispyware software, but said 'ok that's fine' when they found out MS didn't write it. Microsoft bought the rights to engineer and 'have' a specific piece of software and is therefore responsible for the contents.
Personally I've found MS Antispyware to be completely unnecessary, and in fact may lead to more problems than it can fixed. Anyone remember reading in a previous article how it produces a lot of false positives, even going so far as to detect Spybot S&D protection as spyware? (And yes, I believe I tested this).
We lived fine without MS Antispyware before, and we can live fine without it now.
What everyone fails to think about (especially here) is that in the world of us knuckle dragging, bad sinus having, anti-social, beer swilling techno-geeks we don't mind having to be Ruler of All Things Computer (ie: root) to get any work done. The average computer user and yes there are a few million of them out there, do not want to be bothered with having to enter passwords everytime something needs changed. We as techno-gods deal with this every day "what button do i press to make it do my job?" Viruses, Trojans, Spyware, and Adware were not written to attack the "I is smart cause i work with puters" bunch...it's written to attack the VP of marketing whose computer you have to go fix cause he is a moron surfing porn on his lunch break or your Mom who wanted to send you that email because someone really did wake up in a bathtub full of ice missing a kidney. Do not make the mistake of being so arrogant as to think that we are the ones that are meant to be effected by malware...we are the ones that end up cleaning up the mess. FYI...I have had great success running M$ Antispy in tandem with Kaspersky AV on XP pro systems where the people just won't listen.
I guess this just goes to show exactly how well they know their own product!
-- Game Developers: Stop porting badly-textured games from crappy console systems!
i would think then, if real programmers can't be bothered to get it right, then why would virus writers :)
So, you're saying that when you install Linux that you can do it without creating or ever using a root account? Its exactly the same thing. Now do YOU get it? With Windows, one Administrative account is created during installation. Subsequent accounts created do not have administrative rights by default. Please explaing how you can install Linux or OSX without creating an administrtive account? Stephen
Hell, the whole process of tuning permissions is so obfuscated in Windows that no Joe Average can do it even if he wanted to.
Whereas on Unix it's very easy to elevate user privileges when necessary. Windows simply was not designed that way - its rotten roots are all too obvious still.
'Once scientists, even the dim-witted social scientists, get muzzled, the Western Civilization is finished.' - oldhack
VMware also now offers possibility to create easy-to-install complete virtual environments.. for clients etc.. in installer form. Check it out.
I run Windows at work exclusively under VMware. It's faster to run sandboxed Windows in virtual machine than it is to run it natively with all the resource-hodging kludgework (anti-virus, anti-spyware etc) on top.
Other plusses of VMware include, but are not limited to:
-Easier backups (just copy the VM partition files somewhere)
-Easier deployment and testing (keep a 'clean' Win2K / WinXP image, clone it).
The server version is kinda expensive, and requires blessed hardware, but the workstation version is a bargain.
'Once scientists, even the dim-witted social scientists, get muzzled, the Western Civilization is finished.' - oldhack
Well, to me it sounded as if she where saying that by default, new account where automatically given administrative rights. I do agree with you, but I wonder how things would be for a typical joe sixpack end user for their home Linux installation? Don't you think they'd create the root account during installation, and then continue to use that account for subsequent access? Most Linux users are technically savy, thus this issue doesn't often exist. But, as Linux's popularity grows, the issue may become the same. Stephen
THIS THING KILLS MS ANTI-SPYWARE (oh, btw, it logs key presses too.. kthxbye)
Thank you! Thank you! Best help I've got on this! It would seem that for the price of support you pay for with QuickBooks (one of my clients pays for it for their company) They would know this and happily give you this information. But wouldn't life be simplier if everyone followed the basic security rule of "Do nothing under root or Administrator except setup".