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North Pole Heads South

blamanj writes "Things are not looking good for Santa. First, news that it's getting warmer at the North Pole, and now, scientists report that the (magnetic) pole itself is on the move. 'Earth's north magnetic pole is drifting from North America at such a clip that it could end up in Siberia in the next 50 years.'"

289 of 393 comments (clear)

  1. Pole Reversal? by MichaelSmith · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Is it true that we are overdue for a reversal in the polarity of the Earths magnetic field? Would this be a Bad Thing for us humans if it happened soon?

    1. Re:Pole Reversal? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I believe the problem is that around the time it switches, the magnetic field will weaken so we have less protection from solar flares etc.

    2. Re:Pole Reversal? by kryten_nl · · Score: 1

      Bad thing: yes, you will have to buy a new TV (CRT)

      --
      For the perfect anti-Unix, write an OS that thinks it knows what you're doing better than you do and let it be wrong.
    3. Re:Pole Reversal? by Max+von+H. · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Is it true that we are overdue for a reversal in the polarity of the Earths magnetic field? Would this be a Bad Thing for us humans if it happened soon?

      Yes, it would be a Very Bad Thing (tm) because when a reversal happens, we're left without the Earth's magnetic field, which protects us from lethal cosmic rays which are high enery/DNA disruptive stuff, such as gamma rays among other niceties.

      Magnetic field reversals coincide with mass surface life extinctions, I'll bet it won't do us any good if it happens in our lifetime.

      --
      -- It's always darker before it goes pitch black.
    4. Re:Pole Reversal? by Bastard+of+Subhumani · · Score: 1, Funny

      They'll set up a scheme where you swap with someone from Australia, or something. Don't know what they'll do about the bathwater, though.

      --
      Only three things are certain; death, taxes, and apocryphal quotations - Ben Franklin.
    5. Re:Pole Reversal? by nwbvt · · Score: 2, Informative

      There is no timetable on which the poles reverse, and it doesn't happen at regular intervals. Yes, I believe the time since the last reversal is longer than the mean time between pole reversals, but the term 'overdue' does not apply here.

      --
      Mathematics is made of 50 percent formulas, 50 percent proofs, and 50 percent imagination.
    6. Re:Pole Reversal? by luvirini · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Well the shift around the globe to Siberia is something that has apparently happened before.. the magnetic pole has never been stationary, but what is news in the article is the fact that the mevement speed seems to be accelerating.

    7. Re:Pole Reversal? by Bloke+down+the+pub · · Score: 2, Funny
      we're left without the Earth's magnetic field, which protects us from lethal cosmic rays
      Simple solution
      --
      It's true I tell you, feller at work's next door neighbour read it in the paper.
    8. Re:Pole Reversal? by stupid_is · · Score: 4, Informative
      Yes it is (both). This article goes into some speculative detail. Upshot is, possibly damaging a shed load of electrical devices, disruption to electrical grids, etc....

      Could be interesting times (mental note: buy manual tin opener)

      --
      -- Intelligence is soluble in alcohol
    9. Re:Pole Reversal? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      I thought the magnetic field helped us stay on the earth and when it reversed we are all going to shoot out into space.

    10. Re:Pole Reversal? by KwKSilver · · Score: 2, Informative

      There's a long period around the reversal when the earth's magnetic field is dowm. No protection from cosmic rays & other miscellaneous high energy particals. Hundreds of years. One resource on the Brunhes-Matuyama reversal about 780K years ago is: here. Here's another more general one on reversals from NASA.

      --
      If you want your life to be different, live it differently.
    11. Re:Pole Reversal? by drgonzo59 · · Score: 1, Interesting

      We just have to make sure we destroy ourselves so our lifetime is not long enough for the cosmic death rays to get us. Drugs, wars and bird-flu should do the job very nicely, and are a lot more fun than gamma rays if you ask me...

    12. Re:Pole Reversal? by Yahweh+Doesn't+Exist · · Score: 5, Insightful

      not true. even when flipping there is enough of a field to protect us. plus the magnetic field does nothing to protect us from gamma rays anyway. if a gamma ray burst happens anywhere in our neighbourhood and is aimed at us, then we're fucked field or no field. there are cosmic rays passing through us every second anyway.

    13. Re:Pole Reversal? by fredrik70 · · Score: 2, Informative

      um, no, it's not that bad, you seen too much movies!
      http://www.badastronomy.com/bad/movies/thecore_rev iew.html

      having said that, question is what would happen to birds and other animals that navigate by the magnetic field. anyone know?

      --
      if (!signature) { throw std::runtime_error("No sig!"); }
    14. Re:Pole Reversal? by cervo · · Score: 3, Informative

      Well hmm according to http://image.gsfc.nasa.gov/poetry/venus/RevScience .html the earth's magnetic field does not cause mass surface life extinctions. If you would like to make an assertion like that, you really do have to back it up with something. In fact it will cause little change in the way things function, maybe a few thousand extra cases of cancer each year. Now if the field never came back and our atomosphere ionized, then we would be screwed.

    15. Re:Pole Reversal? by InvalidError · · Score: 1

      All we need now is consumer-grade CRT-based TVs to survive the next 30-40 years and see how much this will affect them over time.

      It is true that the first TVs were highly sensitive to the Earth's magnetic field to the point of needing re-tuning whenever the TV was moved but I seriously doubt modern CRTs (most things made over the last ~30 years) would have significant issues with that - try turning your TV around to simulate a pole inversion and see what happens.

      In any case, most of these will have long been replaced by LCD/OLED/LEP/SED displays by then.

    16. Re:Pole Reversal? by ortholattice · · Score: 3, Informative
      Yes, it would be a Very Bad Thing (tm) because when a reversal happens, we're left without the Earth's magnetic field

      Supercomputer simulations do not show that. According to the site: "Reversals take a few thousand years to complete, and during that time--contrary to popular belief--the magnetic field does not vanish. 'It just gets more complicated,' says Glatzmaier. Magnetic lines of force near Earth's surface become twisted and tangled, and magnetic poles pop up in unaccustomed places. A south magnetic pole might emerge over Africa, for instance, or a north pole over Tahiti. Weird. But it's still a planetary magnetic field, and it still protects us from space radiation and solar storms."

    17. Re:Pole Reversal? by Alien54 · · Score: 1
      Is it true that we are overdue for a reversal in the polarity of the Earths magnetic field? Would this be a Bad Thing for us humans if it happened soon?

      It's all a russian plot to take over the world

      Actually, if it recall correctly, predictions are that, if a pole shift were to happened, it would created a period of turbulent/chaotic magnetic field configurations. You would get lots of transient and shifting polarities across the entire planet. Scientists believe that the process would take hundreds of years. Even so, this could really screw up animals like migratory birds, etc. It also would effect cancer and mutation rates.

      Heck, NOVA even had a showon it.

      --
      "It is a greater offense to steal men's labor, than their clothes"
    18. Re:Pole Reversal? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      In a word, no, we aren't clearly "overdue". The average time between reversals in the last few million years is about 250 000 years. The most recent reversal (the Brunhes-Matuyama chron boundary) was about 780 000 years ago. Aha, people say: therefore we are "overdue".

      Don't believe a word of it. The timings for the last 5 million years (borrowed from the Wikipedia page on geomagnetic reversals) are: 5.25 5.01 4.89. 4.81 4.64 4.47 4.29 4.17 3.59 3.33 3.22 3.12 3.05 2.59 2.14 2.08 2.00 1.78 1.19 1.06 0.90 0.78 million years. Do the math, and you'll see that extrapolating "we are due" from intervals with such a high variance (some intervals are 40 000 years) is rather suspect, though it is true that the most recent "normal" interval is the longest of that time period (problem is: if you go back further, you find plenty that are even longer).

      The field varies in alot of additional ways -- pole position on the surface, various measures of total field strength, that kind of thing -- in addition to polarity flips. There is a good rock record of these sorts of variations too, and they demonstrate that what we are experiencing now is "normal". However, there are *hints* that we *might* be creeping closer to the potential of a magnetic pole flip sometime in the next few centuries or millenia (which is relative soon as the scale of these things go), but I wouldn't say it is clear-cut yet. Suggestive, but give it another century or so of monitoring, and there will probably be better answers. For all we know, the weakening trend for some total field parameters that has been observed for the last century will simply reverse, as it has many times before, and the field will re-strengthen.

      Would it be a bad thing for the magnetic poles to flip? In some ways. It would increase solar and cosmic radiation flux at the surface for the time it takes for the new field to become established with the opposite polarity (imagine the effect as if you lived near the current magnetic poles, where the protection offered by the field is less). Some animals would be affected (e.g., some animals navigate using the Earth's field as a compass or variations in magnetic field strength as landmarks).

      But it wouldn't be the real "wrath of God" stuff, like cats and dogs living together, mass hysteria, or that kind of thing.

      Note that there are some crazy people out there who confuse magnetic polarity reversal with some kind of bizarre and physically impossible geographic pole flip, but this is pure crankology.

    19. Re:Pole Reversal? by Stachybotris · · Score: 1

      Aren't pole reversals also generally linked to major climate shifts (i.e., ice ages)? Either way, the poles have been wobbling and varying in their year-to-year intensity for the past several years. Whether this is because they've suddenly started doing so or because we've just recently gotten sensitive enough instruments to detect is beyond me though. Any geologists lurking around?

    20. Re:Pole Reversal? by andersa · · Score: 1

      That site sets off my bullshit alarm bigtime..

    21. Re:Pole Reversal? by Vo0k · · Score: 1

      Meantime, the news that NORTH POLE is moving SOUTH is completely no news. As if it could move in ANY other direction.

      --
      Anagram("United States of America") == "Dine out, taste a Mac, fries"
    22. Re:Pole Reversal? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

      False. Cosmic rays *are* deflected by magnetic fields - they are charged particles. (Well, most of 'em - cosmic ray is a tad vague - let's say the ones that are really bad for us.)
      Magnetic fields and water/ice are two methods proposed for protection during space missions.
      Luckily the earth has plenty of atmosphere to protect as well.

    23. Re:Pole Reversal? by Sembiance · · Score: 1

      This tin smells spoiled!

    24. Re:Pole Reversal? by QMO · · Score: 2

      Isn't anywhere it goes North, because North can be defined as "towards the North Pole?"
      So, the North Pole can only go North.

      (Posts like this happen when things are slow at work.)

      --
      Exam 4/C again. Maybe I'll do better this time.
    25. Re:Pole Reversal? by QMO · · Score: 1

      I don't remember my nethack very well.
      If you are holding a cursed two-handed weapon, can you still use the tin opener?

      --
      Exam 4/C again. Maybe I'll do better this time.
    26. Re:Pole Reversal? by stupid_is · · Score: 1
      But it's part of the Open Source Energy Network - how could anyone here possibly have anything bad to say about it?

      Seriously, I agree that it doesn't have many particularly scientific references at the bottom (merely 2 links to NASA docs), and I did label it as speculative.

      --
      -- Intelligence is soluble in alcohol
    27. Re:Pole Reversal? by Bill+Hayden · · Score: 1

      We really need a need moderation option called "Factually Incorrect -1". "Overrated -1" is the closest we're got, but it really doesn't accurately describe this (all too common) situation.

      --
      Protect your browser with the Force Safe Search add-on
    28. Re:Pole Reversal? by mysticgoat · · Score: 2, Informative

      ...when a reversal happens, we're left without the Earth's magnetic field, which protects us from lethal cosmic rays...

      A quick google shows that this incorrect. The atmosphere continues to block most incoming radiation even during those times when the magnetic field has completely collapsed. 'Cosmic ray' is not the right choice of wording here, either-- very little of the incoming radiation meets the definition of cosmic ray, which is good because neither the magnetosphere nor the atmosphere provides much protection against true cosmic rays.

      Magnetic field reversals coincide with mass surface life extinctions

      This is completely incorrect. There have been numerous studies to look for correlations between pole reversals and extinction rates; no significant correlations have been found by any of the serious researchers (though it is currently fashionable among the half-baked set to claim otherwise--- the fun of Chicken Little Syndrome).

      Here's one reputable source: the British Geological Survey. Google will reveal thousands more, but you'll need to sort out which ones are authoritative and which suffer from CLS.

    29. Re:Pole Reversal? by mrogers · · Score: 3, Funny

      Don't be silly, people aren't magnetic. It will only affect metal things like coins and buses.

    30. Re:Pole Reversal? by exosyst · · Score: 1

      One of the noticeable effects would be that every year or so people will have to retune their TVs and stereos. As the magnetic poles shift so too do its effects on radio waves

    31. Re:Pole Reversal? by operagost · · Score: 1

      I'm sure someone will find a way to blame it on the Bush Administration.

      --

      Gamingmuseum.com: Give your 3D accelerator a rest.
    32. Re:Pole Reversal? by operagost · · Score: 1

      At least we don't have to worry about that climate-change issue anymore.

      --

      Gamingmuseum.com: Give your 3D accelerator a rest.
    33. Re:Pole Reversal? by TerminalInsanity · · Score: 1
      Since the sediments record the earth's magnetic field at the time, scientists used carbon dating to track changes in the magnetic field.

      im wondering what else they found with those sediments that had the same pole position? mass extinctions? eheh

      gta:vc calls...
    34. Re:Pole Reversal? by Rich0 · · Score: 1

      Cosmic rays are deflected, true. However, they still go flying through the earth due to their very high velocities. Just about anything slower is blocked by the field. Cosmic rays have VERY high energies - we're talking particle accellerator speeds...

      As the parent indicated - EM radiation is not deflected by the earth's magnetic field.

    35. Re:Pole Reversal? by Morgalyn · · Score: 1

      I don't think so. I will have to try this out tonight, since it bugs me that I cannot remember!

      --
      You say you got a real solution
      Well, you know
      We'd all love to see the plan
      (The Beatles)
    36. Re:Pole Reversal? by hunterx11 · · Score: 1

      To be pedantic, the magnetic North pole is not at the geographic North pole, and conceivable could move toward it.

      --
      English is easier said than done.
    37. Re:Pole Reversal? by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      I read once that during the reversal the earth's magnetic field would be in a state of flux and we would lose the majority of our radiation protection (save that, of course, which is the result of having an atmosphere - that is considerable.) But who knows, I might have read that anywhere, or even dreamt it.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    38. Re:Pole Reversal? by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      Cosmic rays don't necessarily have to be going that fast. Some of them are, however, and sometimes a particle moving at a large fraction of C shows up and causes some detectable perturbations (IIRC Mir had a device for detecting them.)

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    39. Re:Pole Reversal? by Anonym1ty · · Score: 1
      I seriously doubt modern CRTs (most things made over the last ~30 years) would have significant issues.

      Yes they will

      try turning your TV around to simulate a pole inversion and see what happens.

      Don't just turn your TV around... Turn it upside down... remember the Earth is round

    40. Re:Pole Reversal? by Kadin2048 · · Score: 1

      What? Care to explain why that would be?

      If I take my TV right now and turn it about its vertical axis by 90 degrees, the earth's magnetic field is now running through it in a completely different direction than it was before I turned it. Seems to work fine to me.

      When's the last time you had to retune your TV because you reorganized your living room? It's not that sensitive to geo-magnetic fields.

      The biggest group of people this is going to affect are cartographers, and maybe some people who use maps and compasses to navigate (the ones who are left and haven't switched to GPS). But any good navigational chart has a seasonal correction factor on it of a few degrees per year already, this might just mean -- if the pole really is now moving faster -- that the seasonal correction will have to be increased, and maybe we'll have to print new maps and navigational charts more often.

      --
      "Ladies and gentlemen, my killbot features Lotus Notes and a machine gun. It is the finest available."
    41. Re:Pole Reversal? by InvalidError · · Score: 1

      Don't just turn your TV around... Turn it upside down... remember the Earth is round

      Yeah, sure... I may as well try face-up/down while I'm at it... no difference on my ~15 years old Sears-branded Hitachi.

    42. Re:Pole Reversal? by yfkar · · Score: 1
      Umm... if you walk forward do you walk towards yourself?

      And are we talking about magnetic or geographical North Pole?

    43. Re:Pole Reversal? by fit4130 · · Score: 1

      I think it might have been a spider.

    44. Re:Pole Reversal? by Anonym1ty · · Score: 1
      no difference on my ~15 years old Sears-branded Hitachi

      Well I've tried many Sonys, Sanyos and Zeniths, The colors go all funny... However the better ones have an automatic degausser on power up which will usually fix the problem... If you still have a computer CRT, turn it sideways while it's on as though you wanted to play a vertical CRT mode MAME game and see it yourself.

    45. Re:Pole Reversal? by SteveAyre · · Score: 1

      While that's true, these strong magnetic fields are far stronger than the Earth's field.

      Earth's field is between around 30 microteslas and 60 microteslas.
      The fields you're talking about on the other hand are measured in thousands of teslas - 6 or 7 orders of magnitude greater.

      So the Earth's magnetic field will only affect "metal things like coins and buses" (at least to a noticeable degree).

    46. Re:Pole Reversal? by Shakrai · · Score: 1

      bird-flu should do the job very nicel

      Am I the only one who is getting a little sick of hearing about bird-flu? Am I the only one who notices that nobody in power talks about things like bird-flu until elections are almost around the corner and they need to show how proactive they are being? Or to change the topic in the media?

      For all the damage that the Spanish Flu did I'd point out that most healthy adults will weather it just fine. Plus a lot of the conditions that helped the Spanish Flu spread don't exist anymore (The Western Front and Trench Warfare).

      Yes, it's something we need to think about and plan for. Not at the expense of everything else though.

      --
      I want peace on earth and goodwill toward man.
      We are the United States Government! We don't do that sort of thing.
    47. Re:Pole Reversal? by Arandir · · Score: 1

      if you walk forward do you walk towards yourself?

      If you are the center of the universe, like I am, then the answer is yes.

      --
      A Government Is a Body of People, Usually Notably Ungoverned
    48. Re:Pole Reversal? by marcello_dl · · Score: 1

      Magnetic field reversals coincide with mass surface life extinctions

      Well then it must be coming. A mass extinction is happening right now.

      --
      ---- MISSING MISCELLANEOUS DATA SEGMENT --- [sigdash] trolololol
    49. Re:Pole Reversal? by drgonzo59 · · Score: 1

      The reference to bird-flu was ironic - just like the whole comment...

    50. Re:Pole Reversal? by susano_otter · · Score: 1

      Note also that all the cases of bird flu in humans so far have taken place in densely populated urban centers, where people customarily share their living space with their livestock (in this case, birds), under less-than-(western)-ideal hygienic and sanitary conditions.

      Since I: do not sleep with chickens, do not live in close proximity to hundreds or thousands of people who do, take a shower and brush my teeth every day in clean water, eat only government-regulated foodstuffs, and am not even suffering from failures in my immune system due to the onset of old age, I don't see much reason to worry about bird flu.

      I'm much more likely to die of cancer caused by the preservatives in Twinkies.

      See also: SARS.

      --

      Any sufficiently well-organized community is indistinguishable from Government.

    51. Re:Pole Reversal? by QMO · · Score: 1

      I wouldn't define forward as towards me, but more away from me.

      So, maybe the North pole is moving North (towards itself) and South (towards the South Pole) at the same time?

      --
      Exam 4/C again. Maybe I'll do better this time.
    52. Re:Pole Reversal? by ChocoBean · · Score: 1

      In Communist Russia, Magnet Comes to you! but seriously, maybe this is caused by/is causing the giant tsunami and big storms and everything. Geologically it all sounds "normal", but we're talking a thousand years here. Us puny mortals think 50 years is a really big deal...

    53. Re:Pole Reversal? by ceoyoyo · · Score: 1

      Actually, it only takes a tesla or so to make a little tree frog float. The key is that you have to oscillate it rapidly.

    54. Re:Pole Reversal? by ceoyoyo · · Score: 1

      I work in an MRI research centre... right underneath what used to be the only mobile 1.5T MR scanner in the world. It runs on tracks in the ceiling. Most of us have LCDs, but the poor sucker with a CRT could tell you when the magnet was moving because his monitor would be pretty much unreadable until it stopped and he degaussed.

    55. Re:Pole Reversal? by Shakrai · · Score: 1

      I'm sure it was. And I didn't mean to slam you. Just pointing out that we've heard way too much about bird-flu and not enough about other issues that are important.

      Hell, if mankind weathered the Spanish Flu with WW1 technology then somehow I think we'll manage the bird-flu. Kinda makes you wonder how the human race survived for all those years without media pundits and politicans scaring them half to death.

      --
      I want peace on earth and goodwill toward man.
      We are the United States Government! We don't do that sort of thing.
    56. Re:Pole Reversal? by Yorrike · · Score: 1
      No mass extinction has ever coincided with a polar inversion.

      Geomagnetic reversals happen within time frames of tens of thousands to tens of millions of years. There are also quick switches that occur over a 5 thousand year or so, called "tiny wiggles".

      In short, it's not something you should worry about.

      --

      Looks can be deceiving. Or CAN they?

    57. Re:Pole Reversal? by Yorrike · · Score: 1
      The Earth's magnetic feild is generated by (or so it's theroised) the rotation of the liquid section of the iron core around the solid section. Tsunamis, storms and you jumping up and down coming up with wild, unresearched theories has no affect on the magnetosphere.

      Read the Wikipedia entry, or ask you local geophysicist.

      --

      Looks can be deceiving. Or CAN they?

    58. Re:Pole Reversal? by Yorrike · · Score: 1
      Geologist at your service.

      I believe you maybe confusing the magnetic and rotational poles.
      The geographical (rotation) poles go through two periodical variations, which are part of what's called Milankovitch cycles;
      Orientational variation (the tilt of the earth) - this varies between ~21 and 24 degrees every 25,000 years. This varies the intensity of the summer and winter in the upper latitudes, especially in the southern hemisphere. Orbital inclination - this is from the rotation of the earth being out of sync with it's orbit around the sun. Basically, every 100,000 years, the summer and winter months will switch and then switch back from northern and southern hemisphere.

      Ice ages and the like are caused by different environmental mechanisms.

      --

      Looks can be deceiving. Or CAN they?

    59. Re:Pole Reversal? by Gyga · · Score: 1

      Cool, I tried that Firefox RSS button turned purple.

      --
      I don't preview or spellcheck.
    60. Re:Pole Reversal? by LWATCDR · · Score: 1

      Gamma is not effected by magnetic fields. Photons have no charge. Now you may get secondary gamma radiation from high energy particle collision but that is caused by the particles hitting the atmosphere.

      --
      See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
    61. Re:Pole Reversal? by nwbvt · · Score: 1

      No and in fact their orientations after the fact in places like Hawaii was one of the major clues that these reversals happen.

      --
      Mathematics is made of 50 percent formulas, 50 percent proofs, and 50 percent imagination.
    62. Re:Pole Reversal? by Uber_geek69 · · Score: 1

      If the Pole is moving, wouldn't this be the true effect of the present warming trends of gobal warming?????

  2. Cyclic? by Mortiss · · Score: 2, Informative

    Is this a part of the cycle of the reversal of Earth's magnetic field? I always though that this cycle took much much longer ( but 1/3 of the way down in under 50 years?).

    1. Re:Cyclic? by dougal.s · · Score: 1

      According to wikipedia, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth's_magnetic_fiel d#Magnetic_field_reversals, it takes about a quarter of a million years, so 50years certainly seems pretty fast!

  3. Quick, we have to act fast by drspliff · · Score: 1, Funny

    Quick, we have to act fast.. Lets assemble a crack team of scientists to drill into the center of the earth and re-align it using nuclear explosives...

    Coming soon to a cinema near you!

  4. The Russian are trying to steal our pole ! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    Quick, call G.W. Bush that the russians are stealing the pole to hide weapons of mass destruction in siberia !
    We haven't found them in Iraq, so they MUST be some else.

    1. Re:The Russian are trying to steal our pole ! by Carewolf · · Score: 5, Funny

      In Soviet Russia compasses attracts the North Pole.

    2. Re:The Russian are trying to steal our pole ! by dougal.s · · Score: 1

      Wouldn't surprise me if this happens anyway!

    3. Re:The Russian are trying to steal our pole ! by ArthurDent · · Score: 1

      In Soviet Russia pole magnetizes you!

    4. Re:The Russian are trying to steal our pole ! by lionheart1327 · · Score: 1

      If we're gonna attack somebody over having WMDs then it might as well be Russia.
      At least they sure as fuck actually have them.

    5. Re:The Russian are trying to steal our pole ! by Tongo · · Score: 1

      Don't forget the mineshaft gap!!

    6. Re:The Russian are trying to steal our pole ! by Cl1mh4224rd · · Score: 1

      And here I thought it was our precious bodily fluids they were trying to steal...

      --
      People will pass up steak once a week, for crap every day.
    7. Re:The Russian are trying to steal our pole ! by Bobke · · Score: 1

      all your poles are belongs to us!

    8. Re:The Russian are trying to steal our pole ! by iamlucky13 · · Score: 1

      That was good. Unfortunately, for every good "in Soviet Russia joke," there are 10,000 bad ones. It's not worth it.

    9. Re:The Russian are trying to steal our pole ! by Barryke · · Score: 1
      Quick, call G.W. Bush that the russians are stealing the pole to hide weapons of mass destruction in siberia !
      We haven't found them in Iraq, so they MUST be some else.

      Remember kids, its all relative!
      They've actualy rotated Iraq (and the surrounding land) a little North to hide these weapons of mass destruction.

      Besides, isn't the magnetic north, in this case, a WOMD itself? (all hail Santa)
      --
      Hivemind harvest in progress..
  5. news by akhomerun · · Score: 2, Interesting

    i don't think it's news that the north pole is getting warmer, but the actual magnetic pole moving?

    well now that i read about it the poles moving seems pretty normal.

    "They found that the north magnetic field shifted significantly in the last thousand years. It generally migrated between northern Canada and Siberia, but it sometimes moved in other directions, too."

    1. Re:news by Malc · · Score: 1

      If you look at the volcanic rocks created by the mid-Atlantic ridge (presumably in other similar places too), you will find magnetic banding. As the rocks cool any iron content will align with the magnetic field. A cross section of the rocks perpendicular to the ridge shows distinct bands where iron aligns in opposite directions. The earth's magnetic north completely switches on a regular basis (frequent basis too in geologic time).

      As for the pole wandering around in the north: look at any real map (perhaps not a motoring atlas) and you will see both true north and the magnetic north marked. The magnetic north will be dated to when the map was produced, and often there will also be a note about how much its delineation is varying so that you can at least make an attempt to compensate if you're trying to use the map with a compass to navigate a few years later.

  6. Not at the... by confused+one · · Score: 4, Funny

    Santa doesn't live at the magnetic North Pole, silly.

    1. Re:Not at the... by Yazeran · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Santa doesn't live at the magnetic North Pole, silly.

      Exactly, as the magnetic north pole is somewhere in Antarctica (or close to, cant remember). The north pole on the compass points north due to the magnetic south pole there (somewhere between Canada or Siberia depending on time).

      Yours Yazeran

      Plan: To go to Mars one day with a hammer.

    2. Re:Not at the... by bhadreshl · · Score: 1

      So if the North Pole is *actually* the South Pole. Than East is actually West?

    3. Re: Not at the... by gidds · · Score: 1
      Exactly.

      That's why you call the red end of your compass needle the north-seeking end. It's a magnetic south pole, and seeks the earth's magnetic north pole.

      --

      Ceterum censeo subscriptionem esse delendam.

    4. Re: Not at the... by PhilHibbs · · Score: 1

      Wikipedia agrees with the OP, that Magnetic North is a geomagnetic south pole.

    5. Re:Not at the... by msmikkol · · Score: 1

      Santa doesn't live on any pole, silly. Santa lives in Finland. :)

      --
      The aim of science is not to open the door to infinite wisdom, but to set a limit to infinite error.
      -Bertolt Brecht
    6. Re:Not at the... by smithmc · · Score: 1

        Santa doesn't live at the magnetic North Pole, silly.

      [snicker] Heh heh, he still thinks Santa is real... [snort] [guffaw]

      --
      Downmodding is the refuge of the weak. Don't downmod, make a better argument!
    7. Re:Not at the... by daeley · · Score: 2, Funny

      Santa doesn't live on any pole, silly. Santa lives in Finland. :)

      Maybe so, but his Village is in Southern California. Or maybe New Hampshire. Or possibly Illinois. Or even the lovely named Bracebridge Muskoka in Ontario. :) Of course, there is controversy.

      --
      I watched C-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhauser gate.
    8. Re:Not at the... by HardCase · · Score: 1
    9. Re:Not at the... by Kadin2048 · · Score: 1

      Pffft.

      Federal Express says that he lives in Snowmass, Colorado. And if FedEx says it, it must be true.

      http://www.davidm.net/personal/fedex.html

      --
      "Ladies and gentlemen, my killbot features Lotus Notes and a machine gun. It is the finest available."
    10. Re:Not at the... by jc42 · · Score: 2, Funny

      Well, any Fortran programmer will tell you that Santa is real unless declared integer.

      --
      Those who do study history are doomed to stand helplessly by while everyone else repeats it.
    11. Re:Not at the... by glenebob · · Score: 1

      Santa lived in Turkey. I dunno what made people think he went north after having been dead several hundred years.

    12. Re:Not at the... by KitWalker · · Score: 1

      Exactly, as the magnetic north pole is somewhere in Antarctica (or close to, cant remember). The north pole on the compass points north due to the magnetic south pole there (somewhere between Canada or Siberia depending on time).

      You've got the right idea, you just haven't worded it correctly. The magnetic north pole is in the Arctic. The north magnetic pole is in the Antarctic. The reason you stated (north on a compass points to a south-type pole) is quite correct, but the order of the words is important, because the qualifier should be the first word in the name, ie. the north magnetic pole is one of the two magnetic poles of type 'north', the magnetic north pole is one of the four northern poles of type 'magnetic'.

    13. Re:Not at the... by mgcarley · · Score: 1

      No, he lives in Lapland. He even has his own "official airline" ( http://www.finnair.com/ )

      From the Finnair website:
      Do you know where Santa lives? He lives in Lapland, of course. Finnair flies there every day. In fact, Finnair is The Official Airline of Santa Claus.

      --
      Founder & COO, Hayai India (hayai.in) / USA (hayaibroadband.com) // t: @mgcarley
  7. it's a good thing that by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

    no one can use a compass/map anymore or we would have a problem

  8. Duplicate from June by thomasdz · · Score: 1
    --
    Karma: Excellent. 15 moderator points expire sometime.
    1. Re:Duplicate from June by Ginnungagap42 · · Score: 1

      So what you're saying is that we only have 49.5 years before the magnetic pole is in Siberia?

  9. this is news? by v1 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    The magnetic poles have been moving for what, millions of years, and science has known about this for many years now. Magnetic history found in rock has shown the poles have actually completely switched places several times in the past.

    --
    I work for the Department of Redundancy Department.
    1. Re:this is news? by AndersOSU · · Score: 1

      It is on a geological time scale.

    2. Re:this is news? by mattwarden · · Score: 1

      Great. I guess we can bank on seeing this story about 350,000 more times. We get slashdot dupes with events that span only a couple months.

  10. Should happen every 23,000 years by rassie · · Score: 2, Informative

    When I went to school I was taught that the magnetic poles swap places once every 23,000 years, so I guess the NP (or should it be SP - who knows?) is just getting ready to leave.

    1. Re:Should happen every 23,000 years by Fastfwd · · Score: 1

      You are thinking of the wrong concept. The 23K years event is the "preseance des equinoxes". No idea what it's called in english.

    2. Re:Should happen every 23,000 years by shreevatsa · · Score: 2, Informative

      It's called Precession of the equinoxes. And Wikipedia says it's "approximately 25800 years" (at the moment. One of you jokers may go change it to something else, who knows? ;)

    3. Re:Should happen every 23,000 years by BushCheney08 · · Score: 1

      You're thinking of axial precession.

      --
      Be a real patriot: Question authority. Think for yourself. Formulate your own conclusions.
    4. Re:Should happen every 23,000 years by heinousjay · · Score: 1

      Almost constantly, assuming that it has something to do with sex.

      --
      Slashdot - where whining about luck is the new way to make the world you want.
    5. Re:Should happen every 23,000 years by Malc · · Score: 1

      I seemed to remember a 22,000 number too (pretty close). I don't remember the precession thing that other people replying to you pointed out.

      Here's some info from Wikipedia about pole reversal. Apparently the last reversal was 780,000 years ago.

    6. Re:Should happen every 23,000 years by drew · · Score: 1

      I think you missed a 0. IIRC it's 230,000 years. And it's not 'every' 230,000 years, the interval just tends to be a multiple of 230,000. The last reversal was something like 700,000 years ago.

      --
      If I don't put anything here, will anyone recognize me anymore?
    7. Re:Should happen every 23,000 years by srchestnut · · Score: 1

      The precession of the equinoxes relates to Earth's axis of rotation. The article refers to the magnetic north pole which is not the same but perhaps related since the "north" pole usually is very far south or very far north (ie the magnetic and rotational axes have similar orientation). Only during reversals when the location of the pole is highly unstable does it reside in the middle latitudes (at least historically).

  11. Good gravy! by tbone1 · · Score: 4, Funny
    Even the North Magnetic Pole is getting outsourced! It's a sorry world.

    --

    The Independent: Reverend Spooner Arrested in Friar Tuck Incident - ISIHAC, Historical Headlines
  12. Interesting fact by SamSim · · Score: 1, Informative

    The so-called "North Pole" is actually a south magnetic pole. Think about it: the north pole of any bar magnet you use as a compass points "North", but with magnets, opposite poles attract, so the north magnetic pole of a magnet points towards the strongest nearby south magnetic pole, so if it's pointing North, there must be a south magnetic pole up North somewhere! Likewise, the South Pole is a north pole.

    1. Re:Interesting fact by peragrin · · Score: 2, Informative

      Unless of course they mislabeled your compass. What if it's the compass that is backwards. Damn that means a conspiracy going back thousands of years.

      It's well known that compasses are actually labeled backwards.

      --
      i thought once I was found, but it was only a dream.
    2. Re:Interesting fact by SamSim · · Score: 1

      Well, there's two ways of looking at it: either the Earth's magnetic poles are labelled wrongly, or EVERY OTHER MAGNET IN ALL HISTORY is labelled wrongly. Take your pick.

    3. Re:Interesting fact by Mendokusei · · Score: 4, Informative

      Well, there's two ways of looking at it: either the Earth's magnetic poles are labelled wrongly, or EVERY OTHER MAGNET IN ALL HISTORY is labelled wrongly. Take your pick.

      Compasses aren't labelled incorrectly. The North side of a bar magnet in a compass is labelled North because that is the way it points, not for its magnetic pole. They aren't saying, "Hey, this is the North pole of this magnet," they are saying "Hey, this side of the magnet always points North." Those are two completely different meanings.

    4. Re:Interesting fact by cervo · · Score: 1

      Aside from the fact that opposites attract, the decision of north and south is quite arbitrary. Just like with rotational motion someone decided clockwise is negative and counterclockwise is positive, they could have just as easily have decided the other way. But the fact is that whatever your compass is labeled is the opposite of the way it is pointing (okay a confusing statement). But if you take two magnets and try to hold the two north poles together, they repel each other and it is quite difficult. Now if you hold the north and south together, they attract each other. The same is true with the earth. If the compass's north point is attracted to the earth's south point. Once the pole completely shifts the compass's north point will have a south magnetic pole because the earth's new magnetic north will be in the north pole, so the north point of the existing compasses will point towards the magnetic south which will be located in the south pole.

      The real annoyance is for navigation, but as long as we use GPS we should be okay.

  13. South Pole will be Chile or Argentina? by digitaldc · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Does this mean the South Pole will shift to Chile or Argentina as well?

    --
    He who knows best knows how little he knows. - Thomas Jefferson
  14. When the north pole moves... by Lostie · · Score: 3, Funny

    ... is it called pole-vaulting?

    1. Re:When the north pole moves... by ScottyB · · Score: 1, Funny

      No, it's a pole dance.

      * Dollar bills at the ready *

  15. Travel and brimstone by Coop_DH · · Score: 1, Interesting

    This does not bode well for our sources of travel...We have all depended on the compase on everything and with the movement it could cause catostrophic damages for plains, boats, and any other form of travle that depends widly on a compus. Then of course there may be those who would worry about the earth having violent reactions to a polarity change...imagine violent earthquakes, volcanoes erupting, tsunamis, and any other kind of major disastor we can imagine. All of this effected by a change in polarity...

    1. Re:Travel and brimstone by WaZiX · · Score: 1

      Man, ever heard about GPS? Its been quite a while since anything has relied on compasses to position itself!

    2. Re:Travel and brimstone by nwbvt · · Score: 1
      "We have all depended on the compase on everything and with the movement it could cause catostrophic damages for plains, boats, and any other form of travle that depends widly on a compus."

      Really? I didn't realize we were still in the 19th century. I thought we for the most part relied on GPS systems nowadays.

      Sailors have known for centuries that their compasses vary. They have had to compensate for it since the days of Columbus.

      --
      Mathematics is made of 50 percent formulas, 50 percent proofs, and 50 percent imagination.
    3. Re:Travel and brimstone by lowrydr310 · · Score: 1

      Doesn't GPS eliminate our dependence on magnetic poles? Of course if the poles swap and earth gets bombarded with cosmic rays, our GPS receivers might not work so well (nor would any other electronic components onboard our sources of travel).

    4. Re:Travel and brimstone by Vraylle · · Score: 2
      Compasses? GPS? You young whippersnappers and your fancy gadgets and gizmos.

      In MY day, the rich used the stars to navigate. My family couldn't afford them, so we used moss.

      And we were GRATEFUL.

      --
      Mutant Freaks of Nature: "Frighteningly Addictive"
    5. Re:Travel and brimstone by ExtraT · · Score: 1

      This does not bode well for our sources of travel...We have all depended on the compase on everything and with the movement it could cause catostrophic damages for plains, boats, and any other form of travle that depends widly on a compus.

      Compasses always were imprecise because local variations in magnetic field can be quite conciderable. For example, every marine map has a special compass correction scale. Where I live the correction is about 15 degrees. The truth is that compass was never the exclusive naviogational tool - it is rather one of the more important ones, the one that can be used to maintain direction. But navigation based on compass alone is not possible - no matter how precise your compass is.
      BTW, to all the "Who needs compass, there is GPS now!" people: Get a life! GPS is NOT a replacement for compass. it is a great tool for detection of POSITION, but it is completely useless for DIRECTION. GPS is always used in conjunction with a compass or some other direction finding tool.

    6. Re:Travel and brimstone by n54 · · Score: 1

      I think you might be confusing a shift/reversal of the magnetic poles with the violent shift and relocation of the polar icecaps usually known as the HAB theory (http://www.habtheory.com/index.php).

      Unless one triggers the other of course :)

      I wouldn't worry much about anything but animals when it comes to the magnetic shift/reversal. Then again they might have been through it before (at least some of the species should have iirc, like crocodiles).

      --
      this comment is provided "as is" and without any express or implied legibility or congruity [...]
    7. Re:Travel and brimstone by kuma_act · · Score: 1

      Sure, GPS only gives you position. But if I take a reading at one point, get my position, and then walk a couple of hundred feet, and get my position there, I can use the two position readings to figure out directions.

    8. Re:Travel and brimstone by rwise2112 · · Score: 1

      ... and before GPS there was, and still is, INS.

      --

      "For every expert, there is an equal and opposite expert"
  16. Re:Let me be the first to say by GreyPoopon · · Score: 1
    In Soviet Russia, north pole switches you!

    Hurry! Quick! Do something! The Russians are trying to steal the North Pole!!

    --

    GreyPoopon
    --
    Why is it I can write insightful comments but can't come up with a clever signature?

  17. Re:Let me be the first to say by Viper+Daimao · · Score: 1

    That was uncreative and bad, someone give me some bad karma for that.

    --
    "In the game of life, someone always has to lose. To me, if life were fair, that someone would always be Oklahoma." -DKR
  18. When South Pole Butts North by tobozo · · Score: 1, Funny

    I wonder what will happen when I flush the toilets

    Will it still flush counter-clockwise on northern hemisphere ?

    1. Re:When South Pole Butts North by stupid_is · · Score: 2, Informative
      That's something completely different (although not as impacting as you'd think)

      --
      -- Intelligence is soluble in alcohol
    2. Re:When South Pole Butts North by squidguy · · Score: 2, Informative

      No... flush rotation has nothing to do with the magnetic field. It is related to the coriolis effect (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coriolis_force) though it seems that the field of physics now implies that the coriolis force is too weak to manifestly impact fast moving water going down the tube. The velocity is a result of conservation of angular momentum. Flow direction (influenced by coriolis) is more impacted by the shape of the container.

    3. Re:When South Pole Butts North by spike2131 · · Score: 1

      It will only change if you're pipes are made of iron. If you have copper plumbing, or PVC, or something else non-magnetic, it shouldn't make a difference.

      --
      SpyDock: Scientific Python in a Docker container
  19. No piccies by DavidHOzAu · · Score: 5, Informative

    But this site sure has them and this site has some too.
    Read them. They are worth it.

    It looks like there are two magnetic norths on the planet. Our current one looks like it is just the additive of the major and minor magnetic fields of the earth with their collective strengths oscillating over time... hence the apparent movement.

    1. Re:No piccies by troon · · Score: 1

      From one of the links:

      Keeping track of the north magnetic pole is Newitt's job. "We usually go out and check its location once every few years," he says. "We'll have to make more trips now that it is moving so quickly."

      North pole track-keeper - what an easy job!

      --
      Ydco co ,df C erb-y go. a Ekrpat t.fxrapev
    2. Re:No piccies by lawpoop · · Score: 1

      Two magnetic norths? Are you referring to the two center points in this image? One is magnetic north, the other is geographical or geometrical north -- the center of the 37.5* arc that the Earth rotates around.

      --
      Computers are useless. They can only give you answers.
      -- Pablo Picasso
    3. Re:No piccies by Brian+Boitano · · Score: 1

      Oh, there's more than two; they're all over the freakin' place! The other day one passed through my back yard, and boy, let me tell you, it sure left a mess!

      --
      What would Brian Boitano do?
    4. Re:No piccies by Kelson · · Score: 1

      Very interesting. I'd always wondered how Europeans came to rely on compasses when the magnetic pole was so far west from true north. The diagram showing the magnetic meridians shows that, for whatever reason, the direction of the field ends up being much more aligned with geographical north than one might expect.

    5. Re:No piccies by ianturton · · Score: 1
      Keeping track of the north magnetic pole is Newitt's job. "We usually go out and check its location once every few years," he says. "We'll have to make more trips now that it is moving so quickly."

      North pole track-keeper - what an easy job!

      Pah - I spent four years of my life doing north pole tracking for my PhD and let me tell you its a thankless task. As soon as you work out where it was its moved. Then people (alright my supervisor) want to know why its moved!

      Ian

    6. Re:No piccies by Seanasy · · Score: 1

      Also, check out an animation of a spontaneous pole reversal in a simulation on a Cray C90 circa 1996.

    7. Re:No piccies by DavidHOzAu · · Score: 1

      Actually, that's the dipole approximation of the Earth's magnetic pole as seen from above the Article Circle. The link said:
      Although almost 90% of the observed magnetic field can be approximated by a dipole, the 10% left over, called the non-dipole field cannot be ignored. In places it can be large relative to the dipole field, thus altering noticeably the shape of the observed field.
      Hence I was referring to this image of the total field intensity.

      From the link I posted:
      The strength of the magnetic field is no longer a maximum at the North Magnetic Pole. In fact, there are now two maxima, one over central Canada, the other over Siberia.
      So if we were to plot 'magnetic field strength magnitude' over 'Earth surface', it would have two local maxima. (in other words, see the picture.) At the moment, the one over Canada is stronger. The North Pole appears to 'move' when you are at a distance because the field strength of the Siberian maxima is getting stronger relative to the Canadian maxima. It is a simple average of two magnetic fields.

  20. Stoner! by lowrydr310 · · Score: 1
    "This may be part of a normal oscillation and it will eventually migrate back toward Canada," Joseph Stoner, a paleomagnetist at Oregon State University, said Thursday at an American Geophysical Union meeting. Previous studies have shown that the strength of the Earth's magnetic shield has decreased 10 percent over the past 150 years. During the same period, the north magnetic pole wandered about 685 miles out into the Arctic, according to a new analysis by Stoner.

    Those crazy stoners. They're always analyzing something...

    =)

  21. Where is north then? by dascandy · · Score: 1

    1. The north pole is defined by magnetic north. If the magnetic north shifts, so does the north pole. It isn't moving south because it's the definition of north.

    2. Even if you interpreted it as the author intended, Siberia is not south of the US. It's to the west, east or north (through the north pole is the shorter route), but not to the south.

    1. Re:Where is north then? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      The North pole is NOT defined by magnatic north, but by the axis of rotation of the earth. The magnatic north and the true north pole do not lie on the same place. That's no news.

  22. Magnetic North Pole by metlin · · Score: 4, Informative

    The magnetic North Pole has never been a single point.

    It has always been a general area, and at any given point of time, the *actual* North Pole would be somewhere in that area.

    So, given that, this is not really surprising.

    1. Re:Magnetic North Pole by metlin · · Score: 2, Informative

      Actually, I should rephrase that - it has been a single point, just not a single steady point. It's a point that varies in its position.

      The general area where the point might be is known, but the point itself keeps changing its position.

    2. Re:Magnetic North Pole by Ethelred+Unraed · · Score: 3, Funny

      Personally I think we should send a commando squad to nail it into place.

      Especially if it's going to Siberia. Clearly it was a double agent from the Cold War. Because it is leaving the geographic North Pole, the North Pole will clearly get warmer, adding a whole new meaning to "Cold War". Thus we will have new war with Soviet Russia, which will be called the Warm War, so we'll dig up Reagan, who will tell the Russians to stop dancing around our pole (while the Poles will go on strike against martial law and double entendre).

      Some call me Nostradamus. Others call me "raving lunatic". You be the judge.

      Cheers,

      Ethelred

      --
      Everyone wants to be Ethelred. Even I want to be Ethelred.
    3. Re:Magnetic North Pole by mpfife · · Score: 1

      I'm founding the PLF - Pole Liberation Front. We're gathering funds right now to have people fly up and we'll tie ourselves to this marvelous magnetic pole to make sure that it isn't continnual exploited by economically and class oppressive multi-national corporations bend solely on profit. They abuse the natural energies of the pole for their crude navigation. Military regimes use this natural resource that belongs to all of us to aim murderous weapons, and weekend hikers that steal it's power with tiny metal rods that direct them where to tramp and destroy our natural world. We're willing to die for our cause, we just need your support.

      Quotes from recent visitors: "You can feel it's natural energies pouring out and bathing our world." "Its a shame this resource is abused by so many" "Everyone should take a trip up here to see this invisible magnetic phenomenon!" "Shit, Polar bear - run!"

      Won't you please donate today?

    4. Re:Magnetic North Pole by metlin · · Score: 1

      Howdy!

      Well, so this is what I missed while I was away. :-p

      Lots of funnies, eh? ;)

  23. By definition by Triones · · Score: 1

    North pole is always the north by definition. So no matter where it goes, it can't 'head south'.

    1. Re:By definition by Bazzalisk · · Score: 4, Informative
      Ah, no.

      The geographic north pole is north by definition, the magnetic north pole is not - so it can head south.

      --
      James P. Barrett
    2. Re:By definition by Short+Circuit · · Score: 1

      It depends on your definition of "North Pole" ...Magnetic North? Geographical North? Coldest northern point?

      All three are different places.

    3. Re:By definition by narcc · · Score: 1

      It's moving South relative to it's earlier position. I wouldn't worry unless it somehow managed to move east.

  24. Losing the North Pole? by base_chakra · · Score: 1, Funny

    Great. First control of Internet, now this!

  25. Re:Make perfect sense to me. by TallMatthew · · Score: 4, Insightful
    That's uberliberal to you.

    I never understood conservatives' problems with environmental issues. Things like global warming, the eventual depletion of fossil fuels, deforestation ... why is it stupid to consider this issues like this? I mean we live on this planet, don't you think we should look out for it? We're not going to get another shot at this. Once we fuck it up, we're extinct.

    Politicians have a good reason to be anti-environment because they and their friends make serious bank by drilling oil, cutting down trees, running industries that pollute and the like. I can understand their point of view. But why does their profit mean anything to you? You realize that by supporting their point of view, you're just making them rich at the expense of the planet's (finite) resources, right?

  26. shite! by rhesuspieces00 · · Score: 2, Funny

    now i'm going to have to relabel all my magnets.

    1. Re:shite! by maxwell+demon · · Score: 1

      So are we now finally going to get an East Pole and a West Pole?

      --
      The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
  27. Yeah, by wralias · · Score: 1, Informative

    that would be a very bad thing. The magnetosphere currently protects our planet from the solar wind. A significantly weakened magnetic field would allow the solar wind to ionize Earth's atmosphere and carry it off into space (read this NASA webpage for more info). Needless to say, that would be very bad. Polarity reversals have occurred frequently in Earth's history, and some argue that they coincide with mass extinction events.

    1. Re:Yeah, by cervo · · Score: 4, Informative

      Have you read the NASA article that you linked? It says nothing about mass extinction events and polarity reversals in earth's history, it appears to be talking about mars. Now if you look at this link http://image.gsfc.nasa.gov/poetry/venus/RevScience .html you would see that field does not coincide with mass extinctions. Furthermore when the last one happened paleontologists said there were no major changes in plant an animal life. So your mass extinction seems like a leap of imagination.

  28. Rubbish by mrRay720 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Gamma rays are photons - i.e. light. They are not affected by the weak magnetif field surrounding the earth. Loss of the magnetic field would be devestating long term because it would make it easier for solar winds to slowly strip away the upper atmosphere.

    But... a weakened field for a few decades will not send us all to early graves. The biggest impact of a changing magnetic field would be to:
    - Navigation. I guess we all have to adjust to GPS and similar.
    - Animal navigation. Sadly birds, fish, etc. haven't yet implemented and learned how to use GPS. They'll have loads of trouble.

    In terms of dangers it poses to us in the next hundred or so years, should this be a continuation of the existing decrease/beginning of reversal in field strength, it's importance is way below things like climate change, oil reserves running out, etc.

    Nuisance for us, a bitch for animals that rely on it to migrate, but as a race, the danger from it is effectively zero.

    1. Re:Rubbish by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative
    2. Re:Rubbish by Alioth · · Score: 2, Insightful

      It's unlikely birds etc. will have a real problem at all. Or even people who use compases to navigate their small boats.

      The poles have been moving around since before life began - and has certainly shifted around significantly whilst birds that can use it have existed. In any case, a compass can only really provide you with rough navigation - a bird won't be using the magnetic pole as its sole navigational system (if it did, then normal day to day weather changes would screw them up much more than a pole that takes 50 years to move to Siberia - 50 years being many times longer than most migratory birds lifespans). Birds will at most use their in built compass to tell them the general cardinal direction they are travelling in, and will refine it by other means to take them to their exact destination - and they'll adapt quite happily as they have done during the many times the pole has moved around while migratory birds have existed.

    3. Re:Rubbish by ShamusYoung · · Score: 4, Interesting
      I'm sure you're right. Obviously birds have survived this before.

      Consider: Birds don't live for decades. If the pole were to shift within a year or two, it might very well hose the bird population. However, if a flip happens over the next 50 years, then there will be many bird generations between now and then. Each generation will get "used to" the new orientation as it happens.

      From a strictly Darwinian standpoint, this would explain why birds don't live very long. A bird that lives longer will experience more of the shift during its lifetime. During a shift, more of them will become lost and confused. Therefore, having a shorter lifespan is an advantage. Birds that live longer would tend to have more trouble during a shift, and would get weeded out of the gene pool from time to time.

      Stupid birds.

      --
      --This sig is in beta. Please let us know abut any errors you find.
    4. Re:Rubbish by beauzo · · Score: 2, Interesting

      If you are worried about climate change, then you should also be worried about polar shift. I'm sure the two are more related then you think. -B

    5. Re:Rubbish by meringuoid · · Score: 1
      Problem is, that our (GPS) satelites will probably be out of commission too, as they are no longer protected by the earths magnatic field against solar winds.

      The GPS satellites are in a very high orbit, far above the region where comsats and space stations live; I doubt the Earth's magnetic field gives them any significant protection at that altitude.

      --
      Real Daleks don't climb stairs - they level the building.
    6. Re:Rubbish by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      Ahem, I think they were designed that way.

    7. Re:Rubbish by tomthebomb · · Score: 1

      Gamma rays are photons?

      So nuclear reactors just emit sunlight and happiness?

      How about you go test - go walk around inside Chernobyl and tell me if it's bright in there.

    8. Re:Rubbish by blancolioni · · Score: 1

      Birds that live longer would tend to have more trouble during a shift, and would get weeded out of the gene pool from time to time.

      Every old bird was a young bird once, and thus had plenty of opportunities to pass its genes on. The net effect is zero.

      Birds don't live for decades.

      Cockatoos can live for more than sixty years.

    9. Re:Rubbish by SnapShot · · Score: 3, Insightful
      Birds don't live for decades.

      The Red-Tailed Black Cockatoo can live for up to 100 years. And, according to this article, "The [Albatross] is a survivor. It flies 1,900 kilometers (1,100 miles) per day, with pinpoint navigation, and returns to its nest repeatedly over its 50-year lifespan."
      --
      Waltz, nymph, for quick jigs vex Bud.
    10. Re:Rubbish by mrRay720 · · Score: 1

      Interesting theory, but I think you're wrong.

      The rarity of MAJOR changes in the magnetic field wouldn't, I imagine, have any real effect. Moreso, if using the poles for navigation was so unreliable over the course of a single lifetime, such an ability wouldn't have been positively selected for in the first place.

      There are many much more significant changes that happen far more frequently (day/night, summer/winter) that have been easily adapted to that I doubt your suggestion is valid.

    11. Re:Rubbish by Lando · · Score: 1

      There are 3 forms of radiation, ie alpha, beta and gamma. Alpha particles have the mass of He atom stripped of it's electons and are positively charged. The beta has the same mass as an electron and is negatively charged. Gamma is an electro-magnetic wave, which light x-rays, infrared etc are. Gamma radiation has no charge so magnetic fields don't effect it.

      Ps freqency of
      gamma waves is 10^24 - 10 ^ 20...
      X rays 10-^21 - 10^17
      visisble light 10 ^14.somthing - 10^ 15.something

      --
      /* TODO: Spawn child process, interest child in technology, have child write a new sig */
    12. Re:Rubbish by mrRay720 · · Score: 1

      It's true, there's not going to be some mass bird extinction. Their navigation can't help but be affected - they do rely on it in part - but for the majority of species I don't think we'll be taking catastrophe. After all, I don't think many species if any navigate by that method alone, and the fact that it happens (in geological time) so reguarly implicitly implies that it's not an end of the world scenario at all.

      I'm sure that if this does go on further to be a full on change over a hundred years or so, there'll be large numbers of animals (singular and large groups) turning up in unexpected places, that sort of thing.

    13. Re:Rubbish by vertinox · · Score: 1

      But... a weakened field for a few decades will not send us all to early graves. The biggest impact of a changing magnetic field would be to:

      I wish I could find the source this, but it was an episode on Nova I saw a while ago about the magnetic fields and pole reversal, but it has been known that when the poles flip it tends to last longer than just a few decades. One is known to last over 3,000 years.

      But in general, it won't be too bad because obviously life survived through that. Increased cancer rates will most likely be noticiable.

      Our electronics industry might have some issues though.

      I found the link on the show on PBS:

      http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/magnetic/

      --
      "I am the king of the Romans, and am superior to rules of grammar!"
      -Sigismund, Holy Roman Emperor (1368-1437)
    14. Re:Rubbish by mrRay720 · · Score: 1

      Gamma rays are photons? So nuclear reactors just emit sunlight and happiness? How about you go test - go walk around inside Chernobyl and tell me if it's bright in there.

      WTF does that have to do with anything? Extreme amounts of UV is 'just light' too, but you wouldn't want to go walking around it it. Please learn even just the basics of phyics before making such comments - it'll stop you from looking stupid. Yes, gamma rays are just high frequency light, just as are X-rays.

      Besides, the point was that being light the barriers stopping most of it in the atmosphere is not the magnetic field. When was the last time you saw light bending/reflected from what is effectively a very weak magnet?

    15. Re:Rubbish by whopis · · Score: 2, Insightful

      The GPS satellites are in a very high orbit, far above the region where comsats and space stations live; I doubt the Earth's magnetic field gives them any significant protection at that altitude.


      The GPS satellites are in a low-earth-orbit. The communication satellites that are in geosynchronous orbit are much further out. The inner Van Allen belts fall inside the geosyncronous orbit, but they actually don't provide much protection from radiation. In fact, when they become amplified, they have been known to damage satellites.

    16. Re:Rubbish by rspress · · Score: 1

      It may turn out then when the shift comes and one is coming at sometime in the future, that the animals may handle it better than we do. They have been around, pretty much in their present form, for longer than we have and thus have seen more shifts.

      The problem I have with some environmentalists is they subscribe to the stable earth view. That the climate has not changed until man started messing with it. In fact between 1350 and 1850 we had what was called the little lce age. The was responsible for the many glaciers and ice depths that are now melting. Around 985 the Vikings were populating Greenland, they called it Greenland because of the abundant grasslands and forests present on it. In fact the temperatures back then were warmer than today.

      Do I think we are warming the environment, sure I think we are. Are we responsible for all of the warming. I don't think so. The problem is we don't have enough information to be sure. Environmentalists in the 1800-1900's thought that the solution for local pollution was to make the smokestacks of factories higher. It did help with local pollutions but spread the problem over a much larger area. Another problem not helping the cause of the environmentalists is that anything they wish to come up with says proves their point. It is hotter than laster year, it is colder than last year, it is the same as last year, we have more rain, less rain, the same rain, more storm, less storms, the same storms, all seem to them to prove that disaster is around the corner.

      Should we all be driving electric cars? Well it would cut our dependence on oil or at least cut it down but where is the electricity to come from. California democrats have vetoed again and again any new hydroelectric or nuclear plants. The power to charge electric cars has to come from someplace.

    17. Re:Rubbish by meringuoid · · Score: 1
      The GPS satellites are in a low-earth-orbit. The communication satellites that are in geosynchronous orbit are much further out.

      I knew that. I knew that.

      * bangs head on desk in orbital-mechanics embarrassment *

      That'll teach me to post on /. after having been to the pub at lunch...

      --
      Real Daleks don't climb stairs - they level the building.
    18. Re:Rubbish by Daxster · · Score: 1

      - Navigation. I guess we all have to adjust to GPS and similar.

      Nah, all nautical charts have a standard deviation. It'll just be...deviated more. Yes.

      --
      Death by snoo-snoo!
    19. Re:Rubbish by elgatozorbas · · Score: 1
      From a strictly Darwinian standpoint, this would explain why birds don't live very long. A bird that lives longer will experience more of the shift during its lifetime. During a shift, more of them will become lost and confused


      It is really doubtful that the reversal of the magnetic field is in the critical path of the aging of birds. Birds are in general small animals. Small animals tend not to live long, probably because their hearts tend to beat faster and therefore are worn out sooner (but that's just my assumption).

    20. Re:Rubbish by shambalagoon · · Score: 1

      The story I heard was that Greenland and Iceland were named as they were to attract navigators to icy Greenland (who would of course leave) and repel them from habitable Iceland, which they wanted to keep for themselves.

    21. Re:Rubbish by rspress · · Score: 1

      That is one view that in the end towards the fall of Greenland when the climate was getting colder may have been true. The Vikings also had after 985 lots of grazing animals. Lots of cattle, sheep and goats. Cattle and sheep need large amounts of fertile grasslands. I am not saying the entire country was one green grassland, far from it. For several hundred years Greenland and the Vikings did prosper and had plenty of wood to use for even trivial use. As the climate grew colder they grew weaker and the ice bridging that was not present before allowed Inuits to move down from other regions and attack the weakened Viking people. Vikings were use to surviving in cold climates but not as cold as Greenland became. The Inuits were much more accustomed to the colder climates and had the advantage.

      You can tell there was a great climatic change there as to reach the old Viking settlements many areas had to remove layers of sand, soil and permafrost. Large numbers of cattle would not survive in areas of permafrost.

      Both the little ice age and the warmer temperatures before are pretty much agreed on by all scientist. Actually both were responsible for both the lives and deaths of many people around Europe and middle east at that time. Mostly by making the environment palatable to disease carrying insects and animals.

    22. Re:Rubbish by Taevin · · Score: 1

      Visible light: 4.00 * 10^14 Hz to 7.50 * 10^14 Hz
      Ultraviolet: 7.50 * 10^14 Hz to 3.00 * 10^16 Hz
      X-Rays: > 3.00 * 10^16 Hz
      Gamma-Rays: typically on the order of 10^20 and higher

      The parent is right about the rest... Gamma rays are extremely high energy and are ionizing (i.e very bad for your health). So yes, gamma rays are just electromagnetic radiation like any form of light but they have little to do with happiness :)

    23. Re:Rubbish by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      Incidentally, that cockatoo is hardly the longest-lived one around. The Citron Cockatoo, for example, can live up to 125 years...

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    24. Re:Rubbish by alanh · · Score: 3, Informative

      GPS Satellite are NOT in LEO. The GPS constellation orbits at 20,200 km. This is between the LEO sats: Iridiums (780km), the Hubble (569 km), the Space Station (351 km); but much lower than geosynchronous communications or weather satellites (35,786 km). They orbit the earth twice/day.

      For a really cool visual demonstration, check out J-Track 3D over at the NASA web site. The GPS satellites are just about the only thing you find between the cloud near the earth, and the Clarke Belt.

      --
      - AlanH
    25. Re:Rubbish by ConceptJunkie · · Score: 1

      Well, sunlight and happiness that can turn you into the Incredible Hulk.

      Oh, and a few other types of radiation too (alpha and beta particles).

      --
      You are in a maze of twisty little passages, all alike.
    26. Re:Rubbish by kcbrown · · Score: 1
      From a strictly Darwinian standpoint, this would explain why birds don't live very long. A bird that lives longer will experience more of the shift during its lifetime. During a shift, more of them will become lost and confused. Therefore, having a shorter lifespan is an advantage.

      Huh? This is bullshit.

      A shorter lifespan is never an advantage to an organism's genes unless it serves to reduce the competition (e.g., for scarce resources) between an organism and its own offspring.

      Why? Because a longer lifespan automatically means more opportunities to reproduce if nothing else.

      Or to put it another way, a longer lifespan is a superset of a shorter one. Everything you could do in a shorter lifespan, you can do in a longer one as well (all other things being equal, of course).

      In the case of the birds and their navigational difficulties in the face of a moving magnetic pole, either the bird dies earlier due to a shortened lifespan or it dies due to navigational error. It dies either way, so there's no advantage conferred here by dying earlier due to a shortened lifespan.

      --
      Use 'slashdot stuff' in the subject line in any email you send me if you want to get past the spam filter.
    27. Re:Rubbish by Slime-dogg · · Score: 1

      Sounds like a chicken vs. egg type of problem. .

      --
      You need to restart your computer. Hold down the Power button for several seconds or press the Restart button.
    28. Re:Rubbish by DevNova · · Score: 1

      Interesting... now aren't the Cockatoos tropical, and therefore non-migratory? It would be interesting to see if lifespans of non-migratory birds were longer than those that did migrate, assuming that non-migratory birds would be less dependent on magnetic north.

    29. Re:Rubbish by susano_otter · · Score: 2, Interesting

      One thing I always wondered about the warmer period before the little ice age... wouldn't it have flooded Europe, just as people predict the current warming trend will do?

      --

      Any sufficiently well-organized community is indistinguishable from Government.

    30. Re:Rubbish by aclarke · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Oh no. Now you've gone and disproved evolution. I'd say the "migratory bird lifespan observation" was its strongest proof yet.

    31. Re:Rubbish by Bloke+down+the+pub · · Score: 1
      Interesting... now aren't the Cockatoos tropical
      African or European?
      --
      It's true I tell you, feller at work's next door neighbour read it in the paper.
    32. Re:Rubbish by Hognoxious · · Score: 1
      Small animals tend not to live long, probably because their hearts tend to beat faster
      That and the fact that cats kill the buggers.
      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    33. Re:Rubbish by rspress · · Score: 1

      It would depend on many things. Path of the jetstream and other factors. No a warmer need not flood Europe. It really depends on how warm and where.

    34. Re:Rubbish by cfuse · · Score: 1
      Animal navigation. Sadly birds, fish, etc. haven't yet implemented and learned how to use GPS. They'll have loads of trouble.

      Well, that's just fucking great!

      I've just finished putting the laser on my shark's head and now you tell me this. And after I put the GPS in what's next huh? Am I going to have to put in a DVD player and stripes on the side? It never ends!

    35. Re:Rubbish by Alioth · · Score: 1

      I don't think the speed at which the Earth's magnetic poles change has any bearing on bird lifespans. The weather has a *much* greater effect on their navigation, and changes over a period of hours. Once you're airborne, you won't notice that the 20 knot tailwind has changed to a 20 knot crosswind unless you're supplimenting your magnetic sense with something else. At the speed a bird flies, even a modest crosswind would blow them a long way off course over even just ten miles or so.

      Most birds have extremely good eyesight. I read recently that research indicates birds use ground features to aid navigation, just like a VFR pilot in a light aircraft - they follow roads, railway lines, ground features like mountains and rivers.

  29. All normal by JeepingNET · · Score: 1

    While it does often that a very long time to poles to shift and temperature to change when I was in school and looking at the historical data you will find the change in temperature and change in poles is not one of a current change. It seams to have in the past at certain times in history taken sudden changes and in fact we are currently behind in the shifting of both according to the historical records. How valid these records are is up for debate but I think all the earth is doing is just trying to equalize itself. Heck I'm in canada and its december and we haven't had snow yet or had to mitts! I'm all for this!

  30. Re:Well That Proves It by wpiman · · Score: 1

    I am sure somehow they will discover a way to blame this on the Bush administration.

  31. Where else could it go? by vagabond_gr · · Score: 5, Funny

    North Pole Heads South

    Well, it didn't have much choice, did it? The north pole is the only place on earth where no matter where you're going, you're going south. So what's all the fuss about?

    (of course the fact that it is actually moving is quite a story)

    1. Re:Where else could it go? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      Well, it could be going east or west.

  32. Pole movement in real time by digitaldc · · Score: 1

    http://www.arctic.noaa.gov/gallery_np.html

    Watch as the pole shifts oh sooo slowly...

    --
    He who knows best knows how little he knows. - Thomas Jefferson
    1. Re:Pole movement in real time by Gulthek · · Score: 1

      We speak of the magnetic pole, not the actual North pole.

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geomagnetic_field#Mag netic_poles

  33. Birds, not planes by amanox · · Score: 1

    I'm not realy concerned about planes, boats and other ways we travel (GPS), but what about the birds (or any other species that migrates).
    Don't they use the magnetic poles to "navigate"?

  34. That's the only place it can go by Narcogen · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Actually, since the North Pole is the northernmost point there is, no matter what direction it moves in, it's going south. So it was inevitable.

  35. Re:Make perfect sense to me. by shmlco · · Score: 1

    Not every conservative wants to start burning trees and immediately dump dioxin into the water. Many in fact do "get it" and comments like these merely serve to polarize the issues, while at the same time making the liberal "point of view" seem hopelessly simplistic and naieve.

    --
    Any sect, cult, or religion will legislate its creed into law if it acquires the political power to do so.
  36. Hah, I win by jurt1235 · · Score: 1

    All those boyscouts with compasses laughing at me when my GPS fails once in a while! All your compasses will fail you completely. JUSTICE!

    --

    My wife's sketchblog Blob[p]: Gastrono-me
  37. What about the SP? by dirtydog · · Score: 1

    So... if the NP is going S, where is the SP going?

    Wouldn't it follow that if one is moving, the other is as well?

  38. GPS by leathered · · Score: 1

    Man, ever heard about GPS? Its been quite a while since anything has relied on compasses to position itself!,

    GPS is not an approved method of navigation for aircraft, it is only intended as a supplementary navaid to VOR/NDB, your charts and of course the compass. I've no doubt that it will become the primary method of navigation in the future, but at present it's not accepted by aviation authorities as being totally reliable. A big problem at present is GPS's vulnerability to solar activity.

    --
    For all intensive porpoises your a bunch of rediculous loosers
    1. Re:GPS by jskiff · · Score: 1

      GPS is not an approved method of navigation for aircraft, it is only intended as a supplementary navaid to VOR/NDB, your charts and of course the compass.

      GPS is most certainly approved for navigation on aircraft. It's much more accurate than a compass (what with the errors depending on where you are over the earth). Boeing released an update called "FANS" (Future Air Navigation System) back in 1995 that added GPS navigation capabilities to the 747.

      The new standard -- Future Air Navigation System 1 (FANS-1) -- allows the 747-400 to make primary use of Global Satellite Positioning System (GPS) equipment for navigation and a datalink system which uses VHF radio or satellites to communicate with air traffic controllers.

      --
      It's "no one," not "noone." Who the hell is noone anyway?
  39. Completely misrepresents the article by Sethra · · Score: 1

    If you RTFA you'll see:

    "Earth's north magnetic pole is drifting away from North America and toward Siberia at such a clip that Alaska might lose its spectacular Northern Lights in the next 50 years, scientists said Thursday."

    Yet blamanj quotes it as:

    "Earth's north magnetic pole is drifting from North America at such a clip that it could end up in Siberia in the next 50 years."

    These are VASTLY different statements - nowhere in the article does it give an indication that the north pole will swing that far out of alignment - only that the aurora may relocate over the horizon from Alaska. An actual shift of the magenetic pole to Siberia would be catastrophic, but a circular wobble around the north is merely interesting.

    I understand the need to make spectacular headlines but quotes are suppose to be LITERAL by definition.

    1. Re:Completely misrepresents the article by geekpuppySEA · · Score: 1

      I love the original anyway, because losing the Northern Lights does sound like the absolute most catastrophic thing that could happen to any part of the polar region in the next 50 years...

      --
      Intelligent Design: because MATH is HARD.
    2. Re:Completely misrepresents the article by Tarkadot · · Score: 1

      From the article: "At the present rate, the north magnetic pole could swing out of northern Canada into Siberia. If that happens, Alaska could lose its Northern Lights, which occur when charged particles streaming away from the sun interact with different gases in Earth's atmosphere."

  40. Re:Make perfect sense to me. by petabyte · · Score: 1

    ... while at the same time making the liberal "point of view" seem hopelessly simplistic and naieve.

    Cause, ya know, statements like that won't polarize us at all ... :P

  41. Re:Well That Proves It by stontu · · Score: 1

    That would be short term thinking. Let's blame the "Heck with the Kyoto Protocol", oh i think that's Bush administration fault too.

  42. No auroras in Alaska? by eightball · · Score: 1

    That comment seemed odd to me. That would seem to suggest that Siberia does not get auroras now. I also seem to remember parts of Europe getting auroras as well.
    Alaska getting LESS auroras would make more sense to me.

  43. wrong by Griim · · Score: 1

    From the link mentioned above:

    "They've also learned what happens during a magnetic flip. Reversals take a few thousand years to complete, and during that time--contrary to popular belief--the magnetic field does not vanish. "It just gets more complicated," says Glatzmaier. Magnetic lines of force near Earth's surface become twisted and tangled, and magnetic poles pop up in unaccustomed places. A south magnetic pole might emerge over Africa, for instance, or a north pole over Tahiti. Weird. But it's still a planetary magnetic field, and it still protects us from space radiation and solar storms."

  44. Billy Connolly anecdote by scotbot · · Score: 1, Funny

    A man is strolling through the Olympic Village and he sees another man walking along with a great, long stick over his shoulder. He asks the man, "Are you a pole vaulter?" To which he receives the reply, "No, I am a German. How did you know my name was Walter?"

  45. Field reversals are similar to the sun's.... by wowbagger · · Score: 1

    The field reversals of the earth are in many ways similar to the solar sunspot cycle. Sunspots are places where the sun's magnetic field is "tangled up", and happen as the sun's field reverses.

    The same sort of "tangles" will happen as the earth's field reverses - the only difference is that since the earth is not undergoing nuclear fusion, we won't see "earthspots".

    However, I wonder what will happen to the earth's magnetosphere and ionosphere as the flux lines break and reconnect - on the sun that is what causes solar flares as the energy contained in the twisted flux lines is released. Will the released energy from the earth's flux lines reconnecting be dumped into the ionosphere? Will they cause even more dramatic aurora?

  46. No Aurora in Alaska? by Tarkadot · · Score: 1

    What about that Auroral Research Program the government is running? ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HAARP )

    I know there's a link here somewhere. But I don't want to think too hard about it while I'm not wearing my foil hat.
  47. Ecology vs economy, round infinity by geekpuppySEA · · Score: 2, Insightful
    It's the ages-old assertion that any change in policy that benefits the environment must come with economic costs, and vice versa.

    It all comes down to individual costs vs. group costs. The Left is more concerned with long-term group costs - not to say that they're not concerned with individual costs, but they're more willing to pony up for stuff that makes long-term sense. Conservatives, for the most part AFAICT, can't be bothered with worrying about the group costs.

    I'm not going to say that not worrying about group costs automatically makes you greedy and evil, although the Left would love everyone to think that (and I would too, insofar as it might get the system changed before we're all choking to death.)

    But I DO claim that being concerned about individual costs more than group costs makes sense from an evolutionary perspective - the individual mind must be more concerned with its own survival rather than everyone else's too. One lone organism can persist to reproduce, etc even if all its clan are killed off. Clearly, this kind of mentality had to evolve prior to group selection.

    However, it's been said repeatedly that the history of modern morality and cultural evolution describes an expanding circle, in which more and more people are encompassed within the region of "people we need to care about and grant rights to." In modern times this has surpassed individual humans and expanded to include the whole environment.

    So conservatives aren't wrong, they're just not caught up with the rest of the world.

    Now, is it going to make sense when those on the Left who are crazies (don't deny it, every side has got 'em) - when they start targeting oil executives (why aren't those pansies doing that shit yet anyway!), is that going to change how people think? Probably not - but it sure would make those revolutionaries feel better. Not that I'm advocating that - it would be better if they'd just realize the error of their ways and start giving a shit about other people. That'd make all that x-tian rhetoric all the more realistic...

    --
    Intelligent Design: because MATH is HARD.
  48. The magnetic poles always wander around a bit by Secrity · · Score: 1

    The difference between Magnetic North and True North historically (magnetic declination) is constantly changing. Clued people who use magnetic compasses are well aware of the dynamic nature of magnetic declination and take it into consideration when determining compass directions. For more information see http://erg.usgs.gov/isb/pubs/factsheets/fs03501.ht ml and/or http://www.geography.wisc.edu/sco/maps/magneticdec lination.php

  49. Re:Make perfect sense to me. by MECC · · Score: 1

    Maybe its because conservatives are more hierarchical than egalitarian. This study found an assiciation between a hierarchical point of view and lowered perception of environmental risk, as well as an association between a higher perception of environmental risk and an egalitarian point of view.

    Others have suggested that conservatives don't really want to hurt the environment, but rather fear the loss of status they experience when the things tied to symbols of their worldview, such as wealth and power, become directly or indirectly stigmatized as bad.

    Thus, if reducing greenhouse gas emissions will make it harder to accumulate wealth, it should be avoided, if being wealthy is accepted as a measure of personal success in someone's worldview. So, they want to avoid seeing greenhouse gas as a 'bad' thing, because its associated with accumulation of wealth and power. Hence, the attempt to pretend that the climate isn't changing due to pollution.

    Unfortunetly, worldviews won't change until the world changes.

    --
    "We are all geniuses when we dream"
    - E.M. Cioran
  50. GPS can do direction... by everphilski · · Score: 1

    it is a great tool for detection of POSITION, but it is completely useless for DIRECTION

    Direction can be derived from multiple positions. It's easy. And thats kind of the point of having multiple satellites. You get your position lock. You move. You get your new position lock. Your difference is a vector. Guess what... that vector points... in a direction!

    -everphilski-

    1. Re:GPS can do direction... by ExtraT · · Score: 1

      Direction can be derived from multiple positions. It's easy. And thats kind of the point of having multiple satellites. You get your position lock. You move. You get your new position lock. Your difference is a vector. Guess what... that vector points... in a direction!

      Suuuuure, it looks real well on paper or in a math class. But in real life NOBODY relies on GPS for directional readings. There is always some kind of other source: every sailboat has a compass, every hiker tries to maintain some direction relative to his surroundings, airplanes use radio beacons AND a compass, etc...
      Oh, and BTW: typical serious marine GPS doesn't even have directional reading, because it wouldn't be reliable enough.

    2. Re:GPS can do direction... by rwise2112 · · Score: 1

      Well, as previously working for an airborne survey company, I'd have to disagree completely. We used GPS to fly pre-planned survey lines.

      --

      "For every expert, there is an equal and opposite expert"
    3. Re:GPS can do direction... by everphilski · · Score: 1

      Read my profile and draw your own conclusions:

      Aerospace engineer: Missile systems

      I can't make any specific comments but rest assured... direction is done with GPS

      -everphilski-

    4. Re:GPS can do direction... by ExtraT · · Score: 1

      Well, as previously working for an airborne survey company, I'd have to disagree completely. We used GPS to fly pre-planned survey lines.

      So, you want to tell me that your airplane had NO OTHER instruments on board besides GPS?

    5. Re:GPS can do direction... by rwise2112 · · Score: 1

      Of course it had all the standard avionics, but for the surveying itself, only the GPS was used for both navigation and altitude.

      --

      "For every expert, there is an equal and opposite expert"
    6. Re:GPS can do direction... by ExtraT · · Score: 1

      How convinenet it must be for you that you can't make any specific comments. :)

      So, you're telling me that a GPS guided missile has no other navigational sensors on board? None what so ever?
      Google is our friend: Here is a general description of JDAM's guidance mode from FAS:

      Once released, the bomb's INS/GPS will take over and guide the bomb to its target regardless of weather. Guidance is accomplished via the tight coupling of an accurate Global Positioning System (GPS) with a 3-axis Inertial Navigation System (INS). The Guidance Control Unit (GCU) provides accurate guidance in both GPS-aided INS modes of operation (13 meter (m) Circular Error Probable (CEP)) and INS-only modes of operation (30 m CEP). INS only is defined as GPS quality hand-off from the aircraft with GPS unavailable to the weapon (e.g. GPS jammed). In the event JDAM is unable to receive GPS signals after launch for any reason, jamming or otherwise, the INS will provide rate and acceleration measurements which the weapon software will develop into a navigation solution. The Guidance Control Unit provides accurate guidance in both GPS-aided INS modes of operation and INS-only modes of operation.

      So. it turnes out that even JDAM, the "ultra-cheap, GPS smart bomb guidance system" is, primarily, inertial guided weapon, with GPS data only used to correct it's trajectory!

      Go ahead, give me an example of one navigational system out there that uses GPS exclusively, from A to Z, without any initial data, without any reference points - just positional data from GPS.

    7. Re:GPS can do direction... by everphilski · · Score: 1

      The work I do is classified. I cant say shit. I dont work on JDAM but yes JDAM does use INS and GPS. Together INS and GPS is a great system. But remember guidance for a missile isnt concerned about direction its concerned about position (direction is a secondary effect of position... think about it. From two positions you can derive a vector, which is a direction). You said GPS can't do direction; that's the argument I'm addressing.

      Look at this commercial off the shelf product GPS product: http://www.gpspilot.com/products/modules/gps.shtml Look at the red words in the middle of the page... The directional arrow at the center shows direction you are heading to. Guides like this one http://www.walkgps.com/GPS%20Navigation.htm also refer to using the compass pointer on the GPS unit primarily and only having a magnetic compass as a backup, if your GPS were to fail.

      -everphilski-

  51. RTFA by tomzyk · · Score: 1
    The parent comment should not be labeled as "Insightful" just because he tells us something that is already in the article.
    Direct quotes FROM the article:
    Scientists have long known that magnetic poles migrate and in rare cases, swap places.
    Previous studies have shown that the strength of the Earth's magnetic shield has decreased 10 percent over the past 150 years. During the same period, the north magnetic pole wandered about 685 miles out into the Arctic, according to a new analysis by Stoner.
    The north magnetic pole was first discovered in 1831 and when it was revisited in 1904, explorers found that the pole had moved 31 miles.
    In the study, Stoner examined the sediment record from several Arctic lakes. Since the sediments record the Earth's magnetic field at the time, scientists used carbon dating to track changes in the magnetic field.
    They found that the north magnetic field shifted significantly in the last thousand years. It generally migrated between northern Canada and Siberia, but it sometimes moved in other directions, too.

    Damn. Even our MODERATORS don't RTFA.
    --
    Karma: NaN
    1. Re:RTFA by Malc · · Score: 1

      Where does your quote from TFA state that the magnetic north pole does more than just wander around the true north pole? The OP made another much more significant point: the magnetic pole switches completely on a regular basis so that magnetic north is actual at the true south pole. I don't know whether it weakens to nothing and then strengthens again reversed, or whether it just wanders quickly from north to south across the equator.

    2. Re:RTFA by tomzyk · · Score: 1

      Try reading my first quote from the article.

      --
      Karma: NaN
    3. Re:RTFA by Malc · · Score: 1

      Sorry, I overlooked the end of your first quoted sentance.

      I suppose in my defence I can say: this is /. and by historical definition people don't RTFA before posting! Ok, that's a bit weak, but that's how it's been on /. as long as I remember.

    4. Re:RTFA by tomzyk · · Score: 1

      heh, I know. And clearly you know this better than I since, by comparing our IDs, you seem to have been around here even longer than I have.

      --
      Karma: NaN
  52. Oh, no! by cluening · · Score: 1

    We havn't seen this happening in the last 200 years! It _must_ be happening because of human factors! We need to stop poluting the world with little magnets!

    --
    Posted from the wireless couch.
    1. Re:Oh, no! by jc42 · · Score: 1

      We havn't seen this happening in the last 200 years!

      Actually, the first couple of expiditions to the north magnetic pole, in the early and mid 1800's, found that the pole had moved a few miles. Since then, navigators have kept track of its wanderings. Navigation charts are reprinted every few years, and this is one of the reasons (along with changing sandbars, harbor construction, etc).

      The only actual news in this story is that in the past 5 or 10 years, the magnetic pole seems to have moved faster than before. Nobody really knows if this is "normal", though. It's probably not really significant to anyone other than navigators (who are rapidly switching to GPS as their primary technology).

      --
      Those who do study history are doomed to stand helplessly by while everyone else repeats it.
  53. CNN reports... by Majik+Sheff · · Score: 1

    Earth's defenses weakened, are we too distracted by Iraq?

    N.Y. Times: Magnetic poles moved, GPS companies suspected of price gouging.

    L.A. Times: Poles on the move, how long has Bush known?

    Washington Post: Earth's magnetic field shifts. Women and minorities hardest hit.

    --
    Women are like electronics: you don't know how damaged they are until you try to turn them on.
  54. Re:Its happened before...quite often by Slaveway · · Score: 1

    The idea you posted is correct except that is not in the sedimentary layer where the information is stored.
    The Geologic record of the poles shifting can be found in the undersea volcanic rock at the Mid-Atlantic rift zone.
    As the volcanic magma cools the the record of the direction of the magnetic pole is frozen in the rock.

    --

    http://www.Slaveway.com
  55. Some people fear change by WormholeFiend · · Score: 1

    but I embrace it.

    I came across the web archive of an experiment done by the guy who used to run fanaticus.com, before he was shut down by the DEA.

    He had read about how UV lights had modified aquarium plants, which ended up causing an ecological disaster when they escaped into the sea, via the aquaducts...

    So he put blacklights on a timer in his mushroom growing cabinet, and produced an albino strain, AFTER the mycelium had colonized the substrate, but before it started pinning.

    And the spores from that first generation of albino mushrooms produced albinos as well.

    I would not be surprised if this is how evolution works -- after a major change, the first batch of offspring of any given species changes to adapt to the new conditions.

    If we get exposed to more cosmic radiation or if the Earth's environment changes as a result of a shift in the magnetosphere, I believe we will evolved to cope with it.

  56. The "REAL" North Pole is moving too. by gmiller123456 · · Score: 1

    If the fact that the magnetic poles are moving is news, then this is news too. Google for Precession Nutation for more info. Maybe the original poster should have been more specific.

  57. Re:Make perfect sense to me. by vertinox · · Score: 1

    Once we fuck it up, we're extinct.

    Waddya mean we, human!

    -Signed Cockroaches of the World

    --
    "I am the king of the Romans, and am superior to rules of grammar!"
    -Sigismund, Holy Roman Emperor (1368-1437)
  58. Blame globalization by dmccarty · · Score: 1
    It's just ludicrous that some people still don't (or won't) believe that global warming is real. Things like this are direct proof. As long as big companies like ExxonMobil, PetroChina and those perfume companies keep spraying their products into the atmosphere this will only get worse.

    If the US had signed the Koyto treaty this wouldn't have happened!

    --
    Have fun: Join D.N.A. (National Dyslexics Association)
    1. Re:Blame globalization by Kamel+Jockey · · Score: 1
      If the US had signed the Koyto treaty this wouldn't have happened!

      --
      Have fun: Join D.N.A. (National Dyslexics Association)
      I know that as technical people we should always "eat our own dog food." But isn't this a little extreme?
      --
      In case of fire, do not use elevator. Use water!
  59. aren't the Poles already reversed? by Dot_Killer · · Score: 1

    I remember watching a show on something like the Learning Channel awhile back that stated that what we now consider the magnetic North Pole is actually the magnetic South Pole. And that this has been the case almost since the last Ice Age or the last pole reversal.

    If that is the case then in reality the magnetic north is the magnetic south, and the magnetic south is the magnetic north.

    If the "magnetic north pole" is drifting and possibly heading for a pole reversal then we would actually be setting the poles right for the first time in recorded history.

    --
    Euphemism, what is that a euphemism for something.
  60. far out by crabpeople · · Score: 1

    "the north magnetic pole wandered about 685 miles out into the Arctic, according to a new analysis by Stoner."

    Yeah right. The polls not moving YOU ARE.

    put down the bong man...

    --
    I'll just use my special getting high powers one more time...
  61. Why is this news? by Gallowglass · · Score: 1

    Get a good cartographic map. Look at the margin. On a good map, you will see a reference to Grid North (the vertical lines on the map point up to Grid North), True North (where the North Pole, the top of the Earth, is), and Magnetic North (where the compass points). You should also see a reference to the magnetic declination which is a factor you multiply by the number of years since the map was printed , and then add to the printed value of the Magnetic North. This then gives you the value of where Magnetic North is this year.

    In other words, my poppets, Magnetic Morth moves every year and always has! Indeed the article makes reference to this fact. But making the assumption that since it is moving in a specific direction, it will continue to move in that direction is without foundation. It is well know to scientists (and Canadians) that the magnetic pole wanders about (quite slowly) in a random walk.

    Just more crappy science reporting.

  62. Global warming... by turbotalon · · Score: 1

    So, how are we going to blame this on global warming as well? :)

    --

    I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy

  63. obligatory global warming article..... by phlegmofdiscontent · · Score: 1

    Every day, I hear about it. Global warming this, global warming that, doom, gloom, and FUD. Got a hurricane problem? Well, it's obviously because of global warming, not a long-term, unrelated trend. Hot day? Well, that's global warming too, not just a high-pressure system. Global warming is even getting blamed for allergies:

    http://www.livescience.com/humanbiology/051122_all ergy_rise.html

    What's next, missing socks blamed on global warming?

    Seriously, though, I'm not saying that there's no human factor in the current climate change, I'm just saying that the climate change is probably not as bad as some people are trying to make it out to be (FUD sells) and a significant portion of the climate change is probably natural. The fact is, we don't know for sure, and to make grandiose proclamations about climate change is unscientific.

    And now, to the relevant portion, here's this link.

    http://www.junkscience.com/MSU_Temps/Arctic.htm

    Yes, the Arctic has been warming, but then again, it also cooled for a while, (and the last few years haven't even been the warmest on record) according to these guys. Granted, they seem to be biased in the anti-global warming direction, but at least it's an alternative voice in a din of FUD.

  64. Compass does not point at any pole by elgatozorbas · · Score: 1

    As everyone knows a compass does not point to the north pole. A bit lesser known is that it also does NOT point to the magnetic north pole. It simply aligns with the magnetic field lines at the point where you put it. This should be no surprise because it can easily be deflected using a magnet (which locally changes the field lines). Even when no magnet is nearby the tangent to the field lines need not necessarily point to the magnetic north (e.g. when the soil contains a lot of iron ore) although it is general more or less in that direction.

  65. Santa's Moving? by IHateUniqueNicks · · Score: 1

    Santa's moving to Russia??
    Now what will Canada do with our H0H0H0 postal code??!!?

  66. I wouldn't touch this joke with a by SmallFurryCreature · · Score: 2, Funny

    ten-foot pole. Thank you.

    --

    MMO Quests are like orgasms:

    You may solo them, I prefer them in a group.

    1. Re:I wouldn't touch this joke with a by iamlucky13 · · Score: 1

      Stop it! You're going to polarize slashdot readers into two groups: those who enjoy these chains of silly puns, and those who don't.

  67. All I have to say is... by robertjw · · Score: 1

    Thank God we have GPS. At least we don't have to rely on stupid compasses while the north pole is having a jaunt.

  68. Of course it is moving south by SmallFurryCreature · · Score: 1

    By definition EVERY direction FROM the north pole is south. If you stand ON the north pole and walk in any direction your compass will show that you are heading south the northpole at your back.

    --

    MMO Quests are like orgasms:

    You may solo them, I prefer them in a group.

  69. So where is the news? This is nothing new. by Conor+Turton · · Score: 1

    Fuck me, why are they posting this as news? I learned about this when I was a kid.

    UK Ordinance Survey maps have shown the annual magnetic north change for donkeys years.

    Anyone who knows anything about map reading knows that the Magnetic vs Grid North increases a couple of degrees every year. When taking a bearing off a map, you do a grid to mag conversion where you add/subtract the number given for the magnetic variation multiplied by the number of years since the map was produced.

    --
    Conor "You're not married,you haven't got a girlfriend and you've never seen Star Trek? Good Lord!" - Patrick Stewart
  70. There is also an interplanetary magnetic field by LM741N · · Score: 1

    After a solar flare, if the interplanetary magnetic field points south it often causes geomagnetic storms which knock out radio communication. Relatively low lattitude auroras are also caused by the phenomenon.

  71. No, the cat does not "got my tongue." by Impy+the+Impiuos+Imp · · Score: 1

    > 'Earth's north magnetic pole is drifting from North America
    > at such a clip that it could end up in Siberia in the next 50 years.'

    God damn George Bush and the oil and car companies!

    --
    (-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
  72. Re:Make perfect sense to me. by paiute · · Score: 1

    I mean we live on this planet, don't you think we should look out for it? We're not going to get another shot at this. Once we fuck it up, we're extinct.

    The neocons believe (seriously, you could not make this shit up) that if and when the planet goes to hell, whether by thermonuclear war, rising ocean levels, giant meteor, or whatever, that Jesus will come back and save us. Them, actually, because they are going up in the Rapture, not us.

    By the way, they believe that they are headed to Heaven to weep on the shoulder of Jesus when any objective person who compares the historical commandments of Jesus with the behaviour of the neocons will conclude that Jesus will meet them outside the Pearly Gates and kick the shit out of them, screaming (in Aramaic) "What part of turn the other cheek/love your enemy as your brother/give all your wealth to the poor did you not understand?"

    --
    If Slashdot were chemistry it would look like this:Cadaverine
  73. Re:Gamma Rays by I+Like+Pudding · · Score: 1

    Don't make me angry

  74. No, it's all my fault by Roadkills-R-Us · · Score: 1

    I forgot to pay the magnetic bill.

  75. Re:Dont worry by modmans2ndcoming · · Score: 1

    wind turbines statistically kill less birds than sky scrapers per year. so, STFU.

  76. Someone needs to learn geography... by Rick+Genter · · Score: 1

    ...if they think that Siberia is south of North America.

    Now, if the North Pole was heading toward, say, Ecuador, that would be news!

    --
    Don't underestimate the power of The Source
  77. Nah, no need by Analogy+Man · · Score: 1

    There has been enough lying, cheating and stealing that we don't have to peg natural disasters on them. It will be interesting to watch for alternative scientific viewpoints. A denial of magnetic polarity or the existance of magnetism entirely. My ability to attach my kindergartener's drawings to the refrigerator with a cylinder of processed ferrous material is proof of God's abiding presence and approval of my parenting, not some hack theory of mysterious fields we can't see!

    --
    When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.
  78. Good point, except by thepotoo · · Score: 1
    You are missing a critical detail. That is, how far does your Cockatoo migrate? The albatross, while it does travel, doesn't use the north pole to navigate (at least it probably doesn't; we don't know jack about most off shore birds).

    For the most part, parrots (and allies) and wandering birds (petrols, shearwaters, etc) don't migrate. They have defined terrorties (yes even albatrosses have staked out hunting areas, though these are huge).

    Thus, we can conclude that song birds could live a lot longer, but those that migrate don't live as long, simply because of the movement of the north pole.

    --
    Obligatory Soundbite Catchphrase
    1. Re:Good point, except by SnapShot · · Score: 1

      I don't disagree. We must reformulate the original hypothesis from "evolution leads to short lifespans in birds because the magnetic poles shift over time..." so that it now reads "evolution would lead to short lifespans in species of migratory birds if those birds rely on the position of the Earth's magnetic poles to determine their migratory navigational routes because magnetic poles shift over time..."

      Isn't it cool that we can refine our hypotheses when discussing evolution? Try having his conversation using Intelligent Design as the foundation; "Birds live as long as they live because a Higher Power designed them to live that long." I'm not saying it's necessarily wrong, just that it doesn't lead to very interesting conversations.

      --
      Waltz, nymph, for quick jigs vex Bud.
    2. Re:Good point, except by squidfood · · Score: 1
      does your Cockatoo migrate? The albatross,

      Arggh! Geek crisis! I don't know whether to say 'African or European?', 'ALBATROSS!' or 'if you hadn't nailed it to the perch it would be pushing up daisies.'

  79. what about weather? by GmAz · · Score: 1

    Would this also effect the weather?

    --
    Click Click Bloody Click PANCAKES!
  80. It's the magnetic station on the LOST series by slashname3 · · Score: 1

    This is happening because the cast on LOST did not punch in the numbers on the computer. That caused the magnetic pole to start shifting which will eventually result in total destruction of the planet.

    I am surprised to see that no one seems to be blaming the current adminstration for this. I would have thought the Kyoto freaks would have been all over it. Repeat after me, "It is all a big cycle, it is our egos that make us think we have an effect over the whole planet."

  81. Cool! Equatorial lights! Aurora Equatoralis! by hpulley · · Score: 1

    Set up your lawn chairs and enjoy the show, folks...

    --
    $#!^ happens, but why does it always have to happen to me???
  82. One world: 2012 by clcobra · · Score: 1

    One world: 2012 :/

  83. Some maps by srchestnut · · Score: 1

    The poles actually move around quite a bit with no real predictability although, fluid models of the Earth's inside have been able to reproduce pole reversal. this page: http://gsc.nrcan.gc.ca/geomag/nmp/long_mvt_nmp2_e. php has some nice maps of where the Pole's been for the last few hundred years. The way they figure out where magnetic north was in 1600 is by the magnetic polarization of sea floor near spreading areas. Each new piece of the sea floor cools with a record of the magnetic field when it was created.

  84. Re:Make perfect sense to me. by Cowboy+Deejay · · Score: 1

    Oh that is because God is going to save all of the righteous at the very moment our atmosphere burns away....following 7 years of no fossil fuels.

  85. In Soviet Russia by shrtcircuit · · Score: 1

    The magnetic poles move YOU!

    Oh come on, it's at least on topic. They're moving to Siberia.

  86. The Rime of the Ancient DUPE! by CaptainCarrot · · Score: 1

    http://science.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=05/06/1 2/0436204&tid=99&tid=14 Not the exact same article of course, but this is not the first time the subject's been discussed here and it's not exactly news anyway.

    --
    And the brethren went away edified.
  87. You actually were here last time the pls. shifted? by gd23ka · · Score: 1

    That of course was your asshole talking with your intestines for a mind.
    I'm sorry to have to put that so bluntly but it sounds like you're having an
    intestinal fear reaction.

    Using your head and thus your brain however, you will undoubtedly agree:

    A You don't have sufficient data from the last pole shift to backup your claims
    B We are exposed to gales of solar wind, high energy particles coming from the sun
        that would kill off the biosphere within a handful of years if not stopped

    For all we know the magnetic field could collapse from one minute to the next and then
    take a hundred to maybe five hundred years to reach adequate protective levels in the
    its reverse polarity. You, me, animals and crop would be exposed to nearly every
    high-energy particle flung from the sun at us that didn't get stopped by the atmosphere.
    We will get sun-burns and our crops will wither, cancer and food shortage will greatly
    reduce our numbers.

    On the bright side however, there wont be much of government left to harrass us wherever
    we are on this planet.

    If it all pans out like I think... hell maybe, maybe not. Like our reassuring pseudoscientitst I don't have the data to predict. A pole shift however is coming
    and a loss of 10% of field strength over 150 years + this leap towards sibiria plus the
    fact that we are already running late for a pole shift... it all adds up to one thing:
    Our poles will shift polarity, sooner than we may like.

  88. My pole heads north! by Hurricane78 · · Score: 1

    > North Pole Heads South

    and later:

    > Earth's north magnetic pole is drifting from North America at such a clip that it could end up in Siberia in the next 50 years.

    Do you really want to tell me that siberia is near on on the south pole? Well then go look at a world map first. (Maybe better not one from the usa, as there you could not find it... ;)

    Btw: I live on the top of the "Gory Putorana" in Sibria, where the map looks at YOU, you insensitive clod!*

    * Truth quality of statement measured to be comparable to an average slashdot post.

    --
    Any sufficiently advanced intelligence is indistinguishable from stupidity.
  89. Weakening magnetic field by Ex-MislTech · · Score: 1

    So this begs the question, if the field is getting weaker, and more
    radiation is hitting the earth, then is that putting more "heat"
    in the atmosphere .

    If so, could this be part of global warming .

    Ex-MislTech

    --
    google "32 trillion offshore needs IRS attention"
  90. Re:Santa's postal code by AK+Marc · · Score: 1

    You can write Santa and ask:

    You have it wrong. The *real* Santa Claus lives in the good ol' USA.

    Santa Claus House
    101 St. Nicholas Drive
    North Pole, AK 99705

  91. Send in a Giant Electro Magnet! by rubberbando · · Score: 1

    Why don't we just setup a giant electro magnet where the north pole belongs and pull the pole right back into place?

    Also, I was wondering if that giant nuke the Russians set off up there a couple decades ago might have effected our poles as well..

    --
    DEAD DEAD DEAD DELETE ME
  92. Hmm... whats going on here?? by Rooked_One · · Score: 1

    The real story is that the climate is warming.... Who cares if the magnetic poles shift - it has happened many times. I heard on NPR that the oceanic conveyer belt had started to slow and if this is the case, then add this, and you have pretty irrefutable evidence something big is about to happen. We have pretty much fucked ourselves in the worse case senario.... Makes me think that moving to the equator a little bit early wouldn't be such a bad idea - I mean, of all longitudinal lines, it has the most real estate, so prices should be cheap right? :)

    1. Re:Hmm... whats going on here?? by Rooked_One · · Score: 1

      its called insulting under an alias... They don't call it a coward for nothing

  93. No... it's heading north by ceoyoyo · · Score: 1

    Has been since it was discovered in the early 1800s (so it's not relaly that much of a story). Right now it's in northern Canada. It's headed towards the geographic north pole. When it passes that, then it'll be heading south, into Siberia.

  94. Wheres all the looneys to blame this on industry? by therealking · · Score: 1

    Come on I know you wanna speak. Blame this on corporate greed or better yet tie it in with global warming so you get more bang for your buck.

    --
    Gadget News at Gizmo.com
  95. yes...but... by The+Queen · · Score: 1

    ...all you have to do to protect yourself is just turn your tin foil hat inside out.

    *ducks*

    --

    The House Between - Original Sci-Fi Series
  96. It's not Santa. by Zambo+McSplanky · · Score: 1

    It's Magneto. He's busy moving Asteroid M around, the freak. Has no respect for compasses whatsoever. Somebody call the X-Men!

  97. Re:Fast Birds. by Bloke+down+the+pub · · Score: 1

    Do you get wafers with it?

    --
    It's true I tell you, feller at work's next door neighbour read it in the paper.
  98. Re:Fast Birds. by Hognoxious · · Score: 1

    Of course you don't get fucking wafers with it. It's a seabird, innit?

    --
    Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
  99. Nah, that's obviously not the problem... by raehl · · Score: 1

    This polar shift is obviously caused by excessive emissions. We're putting tons of pollutants into the atmosphere, and now the poles have started moving faster. This can't be coincidence.

    Coming to an enfironmentalist's pamphlet near you.

  100. Re:You actually were here last time the pls. shift by gd23ka · · Score: 1

    I'm an oncologist. If I can give you one piece of related advice: Stay out of the sun :-)

  101. Re:Fast Birds. by Bloke+down+the+pub · · Score: 1

    What flavour is it?

    --
    It's true I tell you, feller at work's next door neighbour read it in the paper.
  102. super magnet. by rhyskegtapper · · Score: 1

    Damn! I knew I shouldn't have lent the Russians my super magnet.