Slashdot Mirror
Coffee Maybe Not a Health Drink!
perbert writes "Canadian researchers have published a study in the Journal of the American Medical Association indicating that excess coffee drinking (4+ cups a day) could lead to an increased risk of heart disease if you have the wrong gene. In light of other studies linking antioxidants in coffee to a reduction in heart disease, who is right? Or will they cancel out in a coffee death-match?"
As with anything related to toxicology, the dose is the poison.
I think I should wait until the quad venti skim latte kicks in before contemplating the coffee deathmatch.
500GB of disk, 5TB of transfer, $5.95/mo
"the difference between medication and poison is the dose"
So say we all
"Coffee Maybe Not a Health Drink!" Gasp! :-)
Swedish plasma phys. PhD student; MSc EE; knows maths, programming, electronics; finance interest; seeks opportunities
Does anyone really drink coffee because supposed health benefits?
...
I thought it was just the magic breakfast juice that helps me move, think,
I drink 8 cups a day and I ... I ... feeling ... stabbing ... chest pain ... 4y957q048ri ejifj...
More and more often I keep hearing about things like this.
"Doctors say more than 4 cups is bad for you!"
then, 2 months later... "Doctors say more than 4 cups is good for you!"
One month you hear too much fiber is bad for you, then cholesterol is good for you.
I think as long as everyone comsumes food/drinks moderately and not go over board most people have nothing to worry about. Although, with obesity in the United States the way it is today, I would say it's already too late.
Those who trade in their freedom for security, deserve neither.
I've started injecting it, so I'm not sure how this applies to me.
... namely one Commander Samuel Vimes: "Coffee is merely a way of stealing time that by rights should belong to your slightly older self".
"The dew has clearly fallen with a particularly sickening thud this morning"
It shouldn't be too surprising that too much of anything is bad for you. Most food stuffs have complicated chemicals in, and thus too much of any of them can give your body a hard time due to damaging reactions, or difficulty in disposal.
;)
However having said this, I until recently was having something like 6 cups of coffee a day. A few months ago my body started reacting really badly to even the smell of coffee, drinking a cup gives me a terrible reaction with shivering, accelerated heart rate and light-headedness for up to a few hours.
The stuff is nasty.
Currently I'm drinking 6 cups of tea a day instead
Health hazard or health drink? What to do? The answer is simple. Find studies that support your pre-determined point of view and use those to guide the decision. I like coffee very much. Caffeine addiction is not a problem so long as I can find at least one study that proves how healthy my coffee habit is.
Now back to our regularly scheduled programming, "TCO analysis for the enterprise"
Anything that stimulates you like coffee, quickens your heart beat and keeps you awake can not be healthy!
Take that, all you sad unhealthy coffee-addicts!
/me tosses back the third black tea of the morning in celebration
Slashdot Burying Stories About Slashdot Media Owned
I was basically forced to quit drinking caffeine in Decemeber. This was not something I ever expected to be able to do. The migraine lasted for about a week straight but I have been basically fine since.
Since I was 22 I have had high blood pressure. I've spoken here about it before and complained about the high cost of Rx meds to control it and my belief that my Doctor (undercompensated by my insurance provider) is possibly pushing name-brand drugs instead of their generic counterparts to recoup some of that cost in kick-backs.
Anyway, I was gaining on 200mg daily of various meds to control the BP. I was also gaining in daily consumption of caffeine. After switching to Diet Cherry Vanilla Dr. Pepper (aka Liquid Crack) I was heading for 5 to 6 20oz bottles a day (at work) plus 5 to 10 12oz cans every two days (at home).
After quitting the caffeine habbit I'm on 10mg of BP meds (about $10 a month) and water.
So, if you're looking to limit your heart disease and the high cost of protecting yourself against it with prescriptions, you might want to first take a look at your caffeine intake. It worked for me.
Studies about the effects of coffee have gone back and forth countless times. My guess is that so long as you don't drink 10 gallons of it everyday, you'll be fine. I hate these studies because they change every 6 months. I remember when chocolate was supposed to be bad and then they said well its actually good. I'm just waiting for that to change again.
Dr's say drinking four cups of semen a day while on Spring Break due to your being a total whore probably not good for your health either.
Will wonders never cease!
Both studies are "right". Some coffee may be good for you, too much may be bad -- the human body is nonlinear. Some people may react well to coffee, some people react poorly -- the human gene poll is heterogeneous.
Two wrongs don't make a right, but three lefts do.
morning wake-up juice = coffee black
evening night-cap = captain morgan 'n' coffee black
If a nation expects to be ignorant and free, in a state of civilization, it expects what never was and never will be.-TJ
- the sun rises in the east
- Barry Bonds took steroids
- Iraq is a dangerous place
When is the medical profession going to move beyond descriptive statistics to something more? In some respects, the medical profession appears to be at about the same level as the alchemists were prior to the evolution of chemistry. "If I mix this, then mix that, I get something. I don't know why."
The studies may each be meaningful and well-designed, but to an individual trying to make good decisions, the information is basically useless, since it appears contradictory and in many cases is arbitrary and non-intuitive. "You should eat 5, not 4, pieces of celery, but only after consuming 2.5 cups of coffee *UNLESS*, of course, you have gene XYZPDQ319, in which case you should drink only 1.5 cups of coffee before urinating at sundown."
for the future of Java? For now, I'm drinking green tea and coding in C#.
This sig donated to Pater. Long live
Why does the summary give an either or proposition as an outcome. That isn't even implied and I find it curious that the submitters brain imposes such a flawed outcome.
What happens is that conflicting summaries get posted around the Internet and everyone thinks scientists are just having them on.
If you look carefully the summary for the research is saying the caffeine is bad for you, and that the study concluded this based on research into coffee consumption. The other studies that claim coffee is good for you were actually referring to other chemicals in coffee, not the caffeine, nor the entirety of the coffee.
Also people seem to think that scientists study everything about a topic before releasing results. But that is a misunderstanding about how science works. Generally scientists focus on very small areas of large topics and then propose more sweeping conclusions. Usually the media then make even more generalised conclusions that result in complete misunderstanding in non-scientists.
Peer review is also important, often these studies are fundamentally flawed and even though the submitted paper offers a conclusion, the scientist writing it is well aware that in science, nothing is proved by one paper. Instead wait ten years for more supporting evidence, rinse, repeat and progress.
Next they're gonna tell me my 2 boxes of cigs ain't good for me either...
Let's face it, no matter what you do, your health is not going to enjoy it. The food you eat has pesticides, fungicides, preservatives etc. in it. The air you breath is full of particulate matter and NOx. Your tap water is... no, I don't even want to know what's in there.
Will my coffee intake make any difference is the question. THAT is isn't the healthiest thing to do is a given. The question is rather, does it matter between the other toxins and carcinogenes that you inhale, swallow and absorb with your skin?
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
If we started writing off things we consume just because in excessive amounts they can be bad for you, there really would be few things that we could say were good for us. Most people do not drink 4 cups a day. Aside from the health aspect, we cannot deny how big a role coffee has played in our lives and in society since it's creation. It helped fuel the industrial revolution, is one of the world's largest traded commodoties, and is still increasing in popularity. No matter what this study says, coffee will continue to play a singificant role in many of the world's cultures.
"I do not have as much of a fear of dying as I do of not having lived."
Anything to excess is likely to be harmful. The key is to find balance — moderation in all things, including moderation!
All about me
In other breaking news, smoking may cause cancer!
Frog blast the vent core.
I am proposing that eating a Whoopie Pie a day is part of a healthy diet. Prove me wrong and give me a pie!
It is by the juice of the coffee bean that thoughts acquire speed, the teeth acquire stains. The stains become a warning
Even in the summary the finding was qualified by the fact the detriment was related specifically to a single gene. The two studies do not contradict each other because one study applies to a specific gene and the other study is, I assume, more general. Note: I have no idea if either study is correct, I simply want to point out that they do not contradict each other. The story submitter was implying a contradiction where there is none.
In a 24 hour period. If you are not hallucinating by 11AM, it's time for another cup of coffee.
Comparing it to Windows will be a moot point, since El Dorado is going to have a 40% larger code base than XP.
"Studies have shown that research causes cancer in lab rats."
I think the problem with stories like this is that broad generalizations on health are made using one narrow area of research. In this case it is discovered that 4+ cups a day may cause heart disease.
Wait! Only if you have a certain gene that expresses itself. Or maybe it's because the gene causes a stressful life and it has nothing to do with coffee.
Perhaps in 20 years 1 cup a day will cause colon cancer. Maybe it will help you live 20 years longer. We are far too willing to jump to holistic health decisions based on a single narrow study.
I would hope that no one would make drastic life decisions (not that drinking/not drinking coffee should be that drastic) based on a single study.
Cut back on fast food, drink more water, eat more fruits and vegetables. My mom was trying to tell me that 20 years ago. You feel better and your body can better handle the impurities that you put in it. Then you don't have to focus so much on the small stuff.
You keep using that word, I do not think it means what you think it means
The linked article doesn't help much: which kind of coffee, American or European style? How much in a cup? A bit hard to tell, there.
Stéphane "Alias" Gallay
Now, where did I put this witty quote?..
And how does this increased level of risk compare to, ummm, death by car?
Coffee may not be a health drink, but Irish Coffee certainly is.
He who knows best knows how little he knows. - Thomas Jefferson
I miss read that for a second..... 4+ cups a day. I thought it said 4+ pots I guess I'm still safe.
So here's a small problem with your signature - you run the while loop until the beer is full...but you chug the beer inside the while loop. Which means that once your beer is full...you stop drinking. Of course, this is all dependent upon the fact that chug doesn't empty the glass, which is usually what happens when you chug...so basically I think you need to check the return of chug to make sure it didn't fail. Otherwise you might have problems.
Sorry for wasting your time.
Geeks will live a long time due to their complete lack of their ability to get their noodle wet - which will also cause in the same symtoms you descibe.
People have known for decades that coffee is not 'good' for you. Does this even deserve to be listed as news?
drinking an excess of dihydrogenmonoxide could lead to a person collapsing or in rare cases, dying. In addition, drinking an excess of flavored, carbonated beverages has been shown to cause significant weight gain in some people which can lead to other medical conditions including heart failure.
Not to sound trite but how is this news? Every person is different and will react differently to external stimulae. In my case I can eat whatever I want in whatever amount I want and not gain a pound. However, the guy in the cube next to me probably can't do the same thing. Why? Because we're all different (in case you missed it the first time).
If the issue revolves around whether one has a certain gene or not then this almost sounds like at birth we should be screened to see if we have this condition so we'll know not to drink so much coffee to prevent or stave off heart disease.
Genes are what determine who we are. As of yet we don't have the means to fully change those genes to correct issues like this. We're all different (just making sure you didn't miss it the first two times) so at best we can use these studies to reinforce the old adage: everything in moderation.
We will bankrupt ourselves in the vain search for absolute security. -- Dwight D. Eisenhower
Buuuut, coffee stunts your growth!
Since I gave up coffee 3 months ago, my penis has enlarged by 2 inches.
If this keeps up, I'll be bucking along with Ron Jeremy in no time!
This seems like another example of what we've been told for decades: Everything in moderation.
:)
Except trans fats.
I can only laugh as I sip on my Large Double-Double[1] Coffee from Tim Hortons. Coffee can kill me, my Work may kill me, walking across the street is dangerous. On the plus side, the coffee helps me cope at work and keeps me alert as I walk across the street: reducing 2 out of 3 risks isn't too bad.
[1] For those not in the know: double-double -- a coffee with double cream, double sugar (especially, but not exclusively, from Tim Hortons). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_slang
Proof by very large bribes. QED.
Coffee not a health drink? Balderdash. Next they'll be telling us hard liquor, cigarettes, and lap dancers aren't healthy for us either.
"You'll get nothing, and you'll like it!"
Floyd Maxwell,
and yes I drink Maxwell House
I come here for the love
It never ceases to amaze me that in relatively simple systems designed by man, people recognize that different inputs will have different results for different systems. Yet, in a far more complicated system designed by Who Knows What or what knows what (depending on your beliefs) people are foolish enough to think they can reduce the determination of optimal input to a simple equation that applies to all the systems. Bolix! Until we actually understand the variations in "hardware" and "software" running on the human systems, and are able to determine the "versions" and "models" in the biological sense, 99% of all medical recommendations like this are just absolute BS. One fo the articles I read on this very study mentioned this, and I thought "well, it's about time the medical community started waking up to this issue.". To be fair, they've recognized many genetic issues for quite some time, but releasing studies with the implicit assumption that everybody can use the results is still all too common.
For all intensive purposes, "whom" is no longer a word. That begs the question, "who cares"?
Bender: "You seem a tad wound up, buddy. And your face is greasy. Real greasy. You've been up all night?"
Fry: "Of course I've been up all night! Not because of caffeine, it was insomnia. I couldn't stop thinking about coffee. I need a nap." *snores* "Coffee time!"
No one cares what your captcha was
Houston TX, USA
Moderation is best for a person. This mean taking moderation in moderation and having some coffee. Because if you don't deviate from strict moderation once in a while your not taking you moderation in moderation! (I think hear this from a evening radio talk show host I just can't remember which one) www.coffeegeek.com to learn more about coffee's wonderful properties. Warning lurking in the forum could lead to a greater coffee addiction and additional cost. Slashdot regulars should avoid due to their already addictive nature.
Too much Aspartame gives me wicked headaches. Aspartame also breaks down into formaldehyde by your liver - how much or how long - I don't know, but that's what I've been told by a dietician - a real dietician from a hostpital. Not your typical "self educated" one who learned about diet from magazines thay, well, may not be the best source for that kind of information.
Saturday is April 1. Slashdot will be shut down. Sorry for the inconvenience.
Is that 5oz, 8oz, 16oz, or the venti? I drink a lot....am I gonna die now?
You know, it seems for every time something beneficial is found in a food, someone else discovers something else in it that causes cancer. And vice versa.
So you know what I recommend? Use some common sense. Eat a reasonable, balanced diet. Enjoy your favorite foods, but don't overindulge - everything in moderation.
You gotta go sometime, so you might as well eat what you enjoy eating. It appears the "experts" disagree and can't really tells us for sure one way or the other what's really good or bad for us, anyway. By the time you get done going through your tally sheet of what you can and can't have, what you should and shouldn't consume, you've probably added enough stress to your day that you'll keel over from a heart attack or develop an ulcer!
Constitutionally Correct
The hype-meter on my toolbar is pegged to the right. One questionaire, not even a clinical trial, about a substance with many, many compounds and they've got the results pegged to one allele that metabolises just one compound, caffiene, slowly. Let's put a "why do you loose sleep" on the slashdot poll. May as well conclude that slashdotters who loose sleep staying up all night do so because of cowboy neal. Well, so long as they have some odd genotype.
When I worked at a particular car dealership, there was a Burger King half a block away. Every morning, we would send one of the parts drivers there to pick up breakfast for me and another guy.
Burger King has the Croissan'wich and Hash Rounds. Let's say I wanted one Croissan'wich and one Hash Rounds. I would request a "One and one." (The default Croissan'wich flavor was sausage. If you wanted a different flavor, you would say "One and one, ham," for example.)
You can do the math from there. One and two. Two and one. On particularly bold days, two and two.
I don't think we ever got into the "threes." Thank god.
Web 2.0 == Giant Blogspam Circle Jerk
Blame the media's lousy science reporting or poor reading comprehension skills, but what people see as conflicting results are often nothing of the kind, they just miss the details.
I saw one study that said a single cup of coffee a day was good for athletic training, and another that said that the more coffee you drink, the lower the risk of heart disease.
This study says that more than four cups of coffee a day are bad for you if you have a particular gene.
None of these things are contradictory-- just like how a glass of wine may be beneficial, but 10 glasses may cause liver disease. Or how some types of cholesterol are good, but others are bad.
Well, when will you people learn that we are being lied to by the American government? The sheep are bleating.
I would never have expected this to surprise anyone in 2006. For those who never go out or read anything, maybe we should do some basic education :
- MacDonald's food is bad for your health (even salads because of the dressing)
- Coke is not healthy neither
- Cars pollute
Seriously, has anyone ever been taught coffee was healthy ??
"Studies show that research causes cancer in lab rats."
Quite honestly, all that these studies keep showing is that we still really don't understand how it all works and that, for now, you should just go ahead and eat what makes you feel healthy and good.
This sig has absolutely no significance and serves only to take up screen space and waste the time of the reader.
The key is to find balance -- moderation in all things, including moderation!
/. You've just made me shoot coffee thru my nose and all over my keyboard. Note to self: Hot Coffee and Slashdot are a near-fatal combination....
Quite ironic to find those words here on
Still waiting on Serviscope_minor to wake up to fucking reality and realize that Jessica Price isn't going to fuck him.
I probably really should cut back, but I really drink coffee almost exclusively during the cold months.
Think Deeply.
I quit all other drugs in my life. The only thing I have left is coffee. They can take it when they pry it from my cold (well, warmed), dead fingers. I started drinking it in college and fell in love. It's the right way to start a morning. It doesn't offend with its smell like tobacco. It doesn't impair driving like alcohol. It is the primordial source of gathering in the break room. It is the basis for the original Terry Tate, Office Linebacker skit. It gives cops something to hold along with a donut. It provided cease fires during the Civil War as the south traded tobacco for coffee with the north. It is the foundation of eclectic, bohemian establishments wherein college kids make it, and other college kids drink it (coffee shops) and also birthed some of the first public access to the Internet outside of libraries. It is a primary staple product in many South American countries. It's something that (according to my systematics professor) the English don't make very well. It revs you up before anything you need revving up for. I use it before my workout too. It is best when freshly ground and french-pressed. It has created many wonderful cups that say things on them. It gives dentists something to clean during checkups. Wtf beat it up? Study says this/study says that.
Next: water -- a study shows too much of it can make your lungs stop producing needful oxygen....
"All great things are simple & expressed in a single word: freedom, justice, honor, duty, mercy, hope." --Churchill
Congratulations on everyone's excellent reading comprehension. The article isn't merely stating caffeine is bad, but they actually offer an explaination as to why, and why different studies show different results.
If you read the article, the research found that certain individuals with one of two variants of a certain gene process caffeine differently. The one group is able to better metabolize it, while the other group isn't. So people in the first group could quite easily drink 4+ cups of coffee per day with less negative effect then the second group.
This explains why some studies show health benefits, while others don't, due to individuals processing caffeine differently.
"Coffe is a slow poison; it has to be, I have drunk eight cups a day for fifty years, and I'm still not dead." -- Voltaire
It's been my understanding (perhaps wrong) that the buzz you get from coffee (and tea) is supplied by your adrenal glands, and so caffeine drinking taxes your adrenals, perhaps leading to future pernicious effects. Any researches out there? Has there been a study on this, if not, would you do one?
San Francisco Photographers
American researchers have published a study in the Journal of the American Medical Association indicating that reading studies about the health benifits of anything is useless since two months later another study will contradict the findings. The researchers came to the conclusion that people should just do whatever they think is right and let darwinism work out the rest.
Since it's the number of cups that makes a difference, I guess I just need to switch to a bigger cup .....
RFC2119
In this case, it may be the gene that's the poison. It appears that a gene called CYP1A2 determines how fast you metabolize caffeine, depending on which of two variants you have. People with two copies of the variant CYP1A2*1A metabolize caffeine about 4X faster than those with two copies of the other variant, CYP1A2*1F. The study found that more than 2 or 3 cups of coffee a day increases the risk of cardiovascular disease for the slow metabolizers, but may actually reduce it for those carrying CYP1A2*1A.
That could be why studies on the health effects of coffee have been all over the map. The trick is to know your genotype with regard to CYP1A2, and of course very few of us do (or can)...
. html
See http://www.newscientist.com/channel/health/dn8816
Since this is a north american study, is it safe to assume that they are talking about black coloured water poured while facing a photograph of coffee beans instead of the liquid Europeans call coffee?
Haven't the Mormons been saying this for 150 years?
Read any good sonnets lately?
"Maybe" != "May be"
Researchers announced today that breathing air is bad for you and hence suggest that all breathing stop in order to preserve your health... The sky is falling, the sky is falling. =)
Karma: a simple way of silencing those with unpopular views regardless how correct or just that view might be.
Cancer leads to death.
I'm a Book
On the Bookshelf
As with all addictive substances, it's best not to become addicted.
Two cups a day means you are addicted. If you "need" a cup a day, you are addicted.
A Google fight between 'coffee heart disease' and 'coffee antioxidants' makes it clear that this no contest.
Coffee heart disease: 8,860,000 results
Coffee antioxidants: 1,500,000 results
Now should I feel like Fry when they discovered what Slurm really was?
"Ewww!" (sip)
As a graduate assistant in engineering it really is either coffee or cigarettes. They can't seem to decide whether coffee is mostly harmless or slightly helpful, but nobody's gonna argue that cigarettes aren't bad for you.
I'll take the lesser evil/not-evil.
As with anything related to toxicology, the dose is the poison.
:)
Not to mention the person's physiology. There's a reason they call the lethal dose of something the "LD50", and that's because that's the dose at which 50% of the animals they injected the substance into died. (they measure it in milligrams of drug per kiligram of animal, in case you're wondering).
Some people are immune to AIDS, some people are allergic to peanut butter, in some people Ibuprophen works for headaches, in others Asprin or Tylenol works. Sometimes people are just plain different.
There was an article in The Economist (print edition, so I wont bother linking) about how doing DNA tests on people and finding out how they would react to drugs would save a lot of time and possibly lives. The reason we don't is because it's expensive and people (all of a sudden, and seemingly on this issue alone) are concerned about privacy.
There was a reason 1 out of every 100,000 people who took Vioxx died, and it's not because Merck was "evil," it's because they simply couldn't account for all the different physiologies out there. Don't worry though, the law suits will certainly ensure higher prescription drug prices in the future, all due to ignorance and jerks like James Sokolove.
Latewire
I hear news about coffee every month. We're obsessed with knowing whether or not it is good or bad for you, and people wasting their time figuring out "It may increase your chance of heart disease" and "It may help the war on Alzheimers" seem to be have been on a one lined broken record for the past 5 years. If the obvious health affect, ill or not, aren't apparently evident (I.E. smoking); then relax, and tell the people that "anything in excess of 4 per day might be harmful to your death". Yes, the rule of 4 keep me alive!
The beatings will continue until Morale Improves!
These damn genes. I should have gone with the +3 resistance to coffee-induced hypertension and taken the hit on flawed cholesterol transport... Reroll?
I really don't get geeks' caffeine worship. Some seem to think that it's somehow a good thing to not be able to wake up properly before drinking half a pot of coffee.
Oh, and all you self-righteous green tea drinking hippies are no better.
This is why I have coffee after a night of liquor. Let them duke it out for control of my heart.
There exists no way of exchanging information without making judgments. --Bene Gesserit Axiom
cigarettes not really a good weight loss tactic.
Judges and senates have been bought for gold; Esteem and love were never to be sold.
... when you pry it out of my cold, dead (yet still shaking) hand!
#include "humorous_pop_culture_reference.h"
It's only pathetic that people can't understand the difference between "An apple is good for your diet" and "An apple is bad for your teeth."
Both can be true at the same time. No contradiction, just lousy reporting or lousy reading comprehension.
Perhaps instead of throwing your hands up and whining about science contradicting itself, you could instead make the logical conclusion from those two statements that you should eat an apple now and then and brush your teeth afterward.
Just making sure. Intent in internet posts can be notoriously hard to decipher sometimes.
Science must be even harder to decipher, given the difficulty people seem to be having.
Know your genes OR switch to decaf! :) Yeah, I'm aware of that recent study that says decaf may be bad for you. However, it didn't study the various kinds of decaf and I seriously doubt water-filtered Arabica decaf is very much different from run-of-the-mill Arabica coffee.
Cheers,
-l
Help cure AIDS, cancer, and more. Donate your unused computer time to worldcommunitygrid.org. Join Team Slashdot!
Alas, there are not enough antioxidants in coffee to offset even a fraction of the highly free-radical sugar that most people put in their coffee, never mind the rest of their diet.
Anyway, the gene in question is linked to caffeine metabolism not to coffee metabolism. But the "questionnaire revealed that quaffing coffee boosted the risk of a heart attack in those who had genes making them slow metabolizers."
So tell me.... were those coffee drinkers putting sugar in their coffee? Were they fat? In the absence of obesity, what was their daily carbohydrate intake?
My reasoning is sugar raises your insulin which has a stronger link to heart disease than either coffee or caffeine ever did. Other studies have linked high blood pressure to heart disease.
Other studies link caffeine to high blood pressure. But from what I can tell those studies only studied people with high blood pressure to start with. I have never seen a study that shows that, in the absences of high blood pressure, that caffeine raise it to "abnormal" levels.
Incidentally I used to have high cholesterol and high blood pressure. Now both are normal. I'm 50, my BP is 120/70 and I still drink 8 mugs (that's 16 cups) of coffee a day.
I'm not saying coffee is good for you.... just that the genetic link to heart disease should basically be ignored.
Red wine not good for you!
Beer not good for you!
Watching porn good for you!
Watching porn makes you blind!
Watching porn doesn't make you blind!
Cocaine is good for you!
Cocaine is not good for you!
Red wine IS good for you!
Take your pick.
Mine's a strong black coffee.
return 0; }
It's not the dose that matters here, it's whether or not you have a particular gene that slows the metabolism of caffeine.
For folks with the gene, even two cups was harmful. For those without, the more the merrier. Please read more carefully.
I'd much rather have a cupful of liquid that is almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea.
In other words, keep it to a cup or two a day and you'll be fine.
According to the study, two cups a day raised the risk of heart disease by 36% over one cup in people with the gene. The article does not say how much a single cup raises your risk.
It's not the !@#!@#!! dose in this case, as so many people are wrongly pointing out, it's whether or not you carry a particular gene. Without the genes, coffee reduces your risk of heart attack.
Extra! Extra! Bacon is not a healthfood! Shockwaves sent across scientific community
I remember mumbling something, just this morning, like "you'll get my coffee cup when you pry it out of my cold dead hands." Never mind, just the ramblings of a coffee addict.
Pardon my exasperated screaming-- people seem to be totally misreading this study.
This study is not showing that moderation is key, it is showing that the genes you carry are key. Previous results that as many as four cups of coffee a day reduce risk of heart attack still stand for folks not carrying two copies of the slow-caffeine-metabolism gene.
I like to have a dose of espresso before meditating. It makes it more challenging. /K
From a life-long geek's perspective:
Regarding health, it will be bad for someone's if I don't get my coffee.
A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
Add in triathlons, bike races, etc... its to the point where the sports supplements companies have started making stuff specifically to combat it. The last Tri I was at one of the free-bes in the grab bags were electrolyte pills. Basically capsules of salts and such to keep you from bonking from losing electrolytes through sweat or diluting them too much by drinking alot of water.
tm
Support TBI Research: http://www.raisinhope.org
Is not how much coffee you have, but rather balancing whether or not you have the gene that makes coffee bad for you.
I don't believe "being born with a slow caffeine-metabolism gene" is something you can do in moderation. For everyone else, as many as four cups a day is still good for your heart attack risk.
It's like that with everything, though, and people need to be more attuned with their bodies... remember when low-carb diets were all the craze? You know what? It worked really well for me... some people respond better to losing weight by cutting fat, some people respond better by cutting carbs. But more than weight, it had a lot of other positive effects for me. I won't go into detail because it's OT.
I was continously diagnosed with high blood pressure by my doctor. After I stopped drinking regular coffee, my blood pressure dropped into the normal range... but there's more, it's more than just caffeine - because when I stopped drinking de-calf, too, my allergies to pollen went away. And when I thought back, they started while I was in college... right around the time I started drinking coffee.
Some people should be eating more vegetables, some people less... everyone is different.
Stupid sexy Flanders.
Green Tea
CAFFEINE SEZ:ARE YOU REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY SURE THAT COFFEE CAN BE BAD FOR US BECAUSE YOU KNOW THAT IT HAS SUCH WONDERFUL BENEFITS LIKE MAKING SURE YOUR BRAIN IS OPERATING AT OPTIMUM WARP AND CAN EVEN KEEP YOU AWAKE LONG ENOUGH TO SIT THROUGH YET ANOTHER MEETING WITH PEOPLE THAT WANT TO ARGUE ABOUT NITS BUT REALLY IT ISN'T THE CAFFEINE IT IS ALL ABOUT THAT WONDERFUL BREWED-IN-THE-SAME-POT-FOR-10-YEARS-WITHOUT-CLEANI NG TASTE BUT REALLY YOU CAN SOMETIMES STICK A FORK IN IT AND THE FORK WILL STAND UP.
But seriously folks... so many things we consume are not good for us. Some coffee additives add loads of cholesterol, and others add chemicals that we don't fully understand.
However , coffee is a social drink that doesn't cause accidents, and is great when you're cold or when your throat has dust bunnies first thing in the morning. If nothing else, life is what we make of it - and the social interaction that often surrounds coffee is generally a very good thing. I sincerely hope that conclusive studies don't find major issues with coffee - it adds to the experience of life these days.
Besides, Tim Horton's/Starbucks are great places to meet folks! (In other news Starbucks and Tim Horton's merge into Timbucks...)
A Passionate Independent Musician
Will you just SHUT THE F**K UP and GO AWAY!?! You give us almost an entire week of freedom from your stupidity only to come back with some stupid post that isn't even all that funny! Yet, your fanboys mod you up while a similar post gets hit with an "overrated", probably by the same, idiot fanboy who modded you "funny".
Idiot. I'm shocked that you didn't get your beloved, egocentric, "hey, everyone, look at me" first post.
II dddddrriiinnk 44 ppppppootttss aa ddayyy. III haaaaavvee nnnnnneevverr bbbbbeeeeeennn hheeaallllthiiieerrrr. I jjjjussssst wwiisssshh ttttthhhhheeeeessee ccoonnssttttaanttt eeaarrthqquuuaaaakees wwwwouuldd sttopp!!
1) Everyone is different
2) Why are you drinking it?
It compounds the effects of smoking. Are you drinking it because you life sucks and it helps you forget you got the late morning and aftertoon to go yet?
A blog I run for the wealth
...is to become a snob. Because you can't permit yourself to drink the brown water that they serve in the lunchroom, or the over-roasted, over-heated stuff at Starbuck's, you're forced to find a nice small espresso shop, or buy a machine for home.
Drink less of the crap and more of the good stuff, and not only will your intake drop as you savour your shot of espresso or your well-made cappucino (BTW, if it comes in something the size of a bowl, it's wrong. A good cappucino is smaller than a regular cup of coffee) but you'll feel good about drinking less.
Besides, part of being a geek is analysing things to death and a streak of rampant snobbery. It's why I used to run Linux, and why I run OS X now. I drink my coffee black, and Tim Horton's can pour their drek down the sink!
What are you, 6?
....
"coffee maybe not"
I don't mean to discount their identification of a genetic link (which I think is valid), and I have no idea how Costa Ricans drink their coffee, but previous research has identified a risk in unfiltered coffee like that through a percolator or French press (or Turkish, Espresso machine, etc) vs filtered coffee. Since terpenes (oils) in unfiltered coffee are suspected raising cholesterol, it is possible that elevated cholesterol levels from drinking unfiltered coffee may also play a role here.
In any case, having that gene and drinking a lot of unfiltered coffee would put a person most at risk, I would think.
As you said, TMM's been away for a week, and the moment he posts again, you leap all over him, frothing at the mouth.
You must really have a hard-on for the Monkey. That week he was away must have been simply devestating for you.
A lot of who is right depends on who funded each study and what they set out to prove (or disprove) in their study.
In light of other studies linking antioxidants in coffee to a reduction in heart disease, who is right?
Perhaps they are both right. I remember reading in one study that coffee contains hundreds of different chemicals and compounds and that there is no data regarding the possible long term effects of many of these chemicals. It is quite possible that coffee contains both good and bad things, but either way I will not stop drinking my coffee just because of reports like this, although I do drink fewer than 4 cups per day already anyway.
Won't people understand this! Coffee may be good, like plenty of other things. But anything can be bad if you abuse. It's a matter of balance. Stop believing that something is bad for your health because if you take too much it has nasty consequences. Taking too much coffee is unhealthy, as can be taking too much water, so I don't believe we should take too seriously that article.
I know what you mean, but this is just a thought.
I cried real tears when Li Mu Bai died.
Caffeine is not a drug. It is an essential nutrient, necessary for proper brain function in humans.
is going to kill us!!
Si vis pacem, para bellum! For evil to succeed good men need only do nothing!
Coffee lovers have been trying to extoll the virtues of coffee for decades. In the 192x book "All About Coffee" (still considered the foremost book on the coffee trade), an entire chapter is devoted to the medical benefits of coffee, including quotes from doctors saying things like, "There is strong medical evidence suggesting that a cup of coffee a day is not only harmless, but a benefit to the fortitude and energy of the individual." This continues modernly, as many of you have noted above, with studies about the heart & the brain & worker productivity. Recently, I read an article claiming coffee drinkers were less likely to committ suicide - which is awesome, because I don't want to committ suicide.
On the other side are the green tea drinking, yoga people who think coffee ruins your nervous system, and vehemently attack it because they assume we are ignorant of what they think.
And let's face the facts - who cares? Life isn't living without coffee. If I found out that cofee was going to make me shit out my kidneys in 45 years - I'd probably drink more water and hope for the best.
Coffee and caffeine addiction can be a problem for people that have addictive personalities. I, for example, have been drinking coffee for 5 years (I'm 23, started at around 18). I drink maybe 3-4 cups a week. I can get through a day without drinking it and be fine. In fact, some days I have found a liter of water to be much more rejuvenating than coffee. My favorite drink at Starbucks though is a venti Chai with 3 espresso shots, but I usually burn out on caffeine afterwards and don't drink any more for a while. I believe that it is healthy for most people, but can be harmful in excess. Of course celery is good for you too, but if you eat 100 lbs of it, you're going to gain 100 lbs.
excess coffee drinking (4+ cups a day) could lead to an increased risk of heart disease if you have the wrong gene.
In related news. If you eat over 8 potatoes in a day or drink large amounts of water you will die.
It's all about moderation folks.
to wreck a keyboard, even the great IBM original. This was the only IBM keyboard I've ever seen fail too.
I come here for the love
...eating 15 pounds of carrots daily may also be harmful to your health.
I'm feeling so confused today
they've gone and changed the rules again
cos in my life I'm trying hard
to do it all so I can remain
healthy and sane
I'll live forever, always one more tomorrow
living forever, always one more tomorrow
I heard it on the radio
too much of what they said wasn't so
and now we've got to do those things
that they thought before were so wrong
to be healthy and strong
and live forever, always one more tomorrow
living forever, always one more tomorrow
I know we don't need you
I know we don't believe you
you don't really have the answers
you think you know better
you think it really matters
you just want to rule over everybody's lives
I think I'll change my life today
gone are the times of taking care
and I really don't need a reason why
all I need is all in a day
survive in a way
or just till tomorrow, there's always one more tomorrow
living forever, do you really want to live forever
I like this one better...
It is by coffee alone I set my mind in motion,
It is by the beans of java that thoughts acquire speed,
The hands acquire trembling, the trembling becomes a warning.
It is by coffee alone I set my mind in motion.
Q: " ... In light of other studies linking antioxidants in coffee to a reduction in heart disease, who is right? ..."
A: Since it's the presence of a gene that matters which is right, Check family history:
Look for heart disease or diabetes (essentially, the same thing as far as your likelihood of heart disease goes). If found, avoid coffee.
Check family history again, look for average age at death. If less than 60 for males, assume heart attack, avoid coffee.
For females, ignore childbearing age, look for deaths aged 40~60. If found, assume heart disease, avoid coffee.
If most of your ancestors and siblings seem to live past 70, assume decent heart, drink coffee.
If most live past 80, you may safely ignore cause of death, even if from heart attack, because they didn't "really" die of a heart attack, they died because they were healthy and got old, like all healthy people do and everyone dies of something. Drink coffee.
Laboratory researchers cause cancer in lab rats...
Pavlov wouldn't be so famous if he'd used a can opener instead of a bell.
Life results in Death.
Given that, eat well, drink well, be kind, and you'll die when it's time.
Swisssushi - When the going gets tough, get some tenderizer
I Am Not a Doctor, but any high dosage of stimulants (and coffee is a stmiulant - specifically, caffiene is) runs the risk of nervous system failures - the brain can only take -so- much activity. The heart can only pump so fast, as well.
~ Wizardry Dragon
All that the "lastest studies" do is reduce public confidence in science. A long time ago, I tuned out all the "latest studies" on food as a bunch of fraudulant BS foisted upon the public by "scientists" looking to feather their nests with research grants or lawyers looking for an ambulance to chase. Check out the following link. "According to the latest study" campaign. I just follow two maximums that have been know for hundreds (if not thousands) of years and that did not require multi-million dollar research programs to figure out : 1) All things in moderation and 2) eat a balanced diet.
From The Onion
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Drinking Dog Urine Lowers Heart-Attack Risk, Say Snickering Researchers
July 28, 1999 | Issue 3526
BALTIMORE--A team of researchers at Johns Hopkins University have found a link between the consumption of dog urine and the decreased likelihood of heart attacks, team leaders announced Tuesday in cracking, uneven voices.
http://www.theonion.com/content/node/29429/print/
What's really funny is when people like TMM (and Rhombus, apparently) think that all of TMM's detractors are only one person. I particularly enjoyed how you continued what I had started. Oh, but that's right! As far as they're concerned, we're the same person! I forgot.
Let them think that we're the same person. It only proves how delusional TMM is about his self-importance.
there weren't any twelve-step programs for coffee drinkers
I'm on the 6-step program.
Its every OTHER day at time.
This study was made her in Costa Rica, in the local news it was reported to be applied to 4000 people, not 2000 as the nature article states.
For the lucky ones who speak spanish:
http://www.nacion.com/ln_ee/2006/marzo/08/aldea1.h tml
------------------
El café aumenta riesgo de infarto cardíaco en algunos
El peligro es para quienes metabolizan la cafeína de forma más lenta
La investigación se desarrolló en 4.000 pacientes costarricenses
Debbie Ponchner
dponchner@nacion.com
Tomar café en grandes cantidades -más de cuatro tazas al día- puede aumentar hasta en 64% su riesgo de sufrir un infarto cardíaco, pero solo si usted es uno de los individuos cuya genética dicta un mecanismo lento de absorción de la cafeína.
En cambio, quienes metabolizan la cafeína de forma rápida no aumentan, con cada taza de café que disfrutan, su riesgo de padecer enfermedad coronaria.
Además:
# El corazón de 4.000 ticos 'bajo la lupa'
Esta relación entre la cafeína, la genética de la persona y la enfermedad coronaria fue demostrada en un estudio en el que participaron poco más de 4.000 costarricenses, todos habitantes de la Gran Área Metropolitana.
Bajo la dirección de investigadores de la Universidad de Costa Rica, la Universidad de Toronto y la Universidad de Harvard el estudio confirma observaciones hechas antes de que existe una relación entre el consumo de café y el padecimiento de infartos. Sin embargo, demuestra que solo es cierto para personas con una genética específica.
El estudio lo da a conocer hoy la revista Journal of the American Medical Association y fue desarrollado por la costarricense Hannia Campos en colaboración con Ahmed El-Sohemy, Marilyn Cornelis y Edmond Kabagambe.
Un gen. Todo se debe al gen CYP1A2, encargado de llevar a cabo el metabolismo de la cafeína en el hígado de la persona, explicó Hannia Campos en una entrevista telefónica desde su oficina en la Escuela de Salud Pública de Harvard, en Massachusetts.
Popular bebida
El café es una buena fuente de cafeína, el estimulante más consumido en el mundo
Existen dos alelos o formas de "escribir" ese gen. Ambas son correctas y se distinguen una de otra en tan solo un aminoácido en la cadena de ADN que lo compone.
Esa minúscula diferencia hace que algunas personas hereden la versión del gen que realiza un metabolismo lento de la cafeína, mientras que otras obtienen la que realiza el metabolismo rápido.
Quienes tienen la versión lenta, no logran eliminar la cafeína del todo de su cuerpo.
Al cabo del tiempo, esa acumulación de cafeína puede llevar a un aumento en la presión sanguínea y otras condiciones involucradas en un posible infarto, explicó Campos, quien también es investigadora del Centro Centroamericano de Población de la Universidad de Costa Rica (UCR).
El estudio. Teniendo en consideración la existencia de este gen involucrado en el metabolismo de la cafeína, Hannia Campos y Ahmed El-Sohemy diseñaron un estudio que evaluara el efecto del consumo de café, el gen y el riesgo de sufrir un infarto.
Tomaron a 4.000 costarricenses. La mitad de ellos sufrieron un ataque del corazón entre 1994 y 2004, la otra mitad son individuos, de edad similar a cada uno de los pacientes, pero que no han tenido infartos.
A todos los participantes en el estudio se les realizó entrevistas sobre su alimentación y estilo de vida; además se les tomó muestras de sangre y la medición de la proporción de grasa en el cuerpo.
Primero determinaron cuál alelo tenía cada persona.
En la población estudiada, el 55% tenía el alelo
Check out Website development, maintenance and accesibility cons
In another study, they said that caffeine can help Ashkenazi women to reduce their risk of getting breast cancer. However, the most effective dosage exceeds 4 cups.
Just like anything that a human can ingest, moderation is the key. Try drinking gallons of water in a short period and see whether that would kill you.
...that is opening up a Tim Horton's in Kandahar. Canadian soldiers aren't over there to help keep the peace, they're slowly trying kill genetically-succeptable Afghanis with a coffee overdose!
Okay, that's a stretch, even for me. But honestly, what with the relationship between Canadians and the almighty Timmy's, it probably puts the soldiers more at risk than the average Afghani.
Hit the alarm! Drinking to much coffee will kill you.
At age 80+, that is.
"If you loved me, you`d all kill yourselves today"
Spider Jerusalem
Maybe Not Good English
"People carrying a common variation in a certain gene could be worsening their risk of a heart attack simply by drinking several cups of coffee per day."
How typical of an article to stir this much emotion based off so little science. The key words being "could be" are an immediate sign of 'alarmist science-journalism.' Since massive trials have not been conducted to address how much coffee affects different gene types, how can any person be sure if they are susceptible?
Simple. Don't be the average American. Take small steps.
If a study claims that a person may benefit from something, don't overdo it. Feel _how_ your body reacts to certain 'doses' of anything you may do or consume (exercise included.) If you feel bad after eating or drinking something, consume less or stop consuming it entirely. If not, keep doing/consuming it until you feel bad.
On a side note, I used to smoke cigarettes. I knew it was bad, but I didn't 'feel' what they were doing until sometime last year. I'm happy to say I was able to stop entirely, but I realize that coffee may be like cigarettes to others --it's hard to stop consuming something despite how you feel afterwards.
No sig for you! Come back one year!
Oh, fuck off! It is, it isn't, it is, it isn't, oh, hang on a sec, it is. Is it?
'Hi. I'm Anonymous Coward, and I'm a slashaholic.'
everyone: "Hi A.C.!"
could lead to an increased risk ...if you have the wrong gene.
:-)
That is true of just about anything. If you have a gene that shuts down brain development at the fetal stage you are also at risk. Some of you were born with the gene to mod me down. Nasty gene that one is
Table-ized A.I.
How dare they discredit the secret bean!!!!
Life just isn't that good. Most of us are probably better off kicking the bucket a little earlier, anyways! It'll save SSI some money :-)
Some people have naturally too low production of endorphins. Such people tend to live in permanent subconscious level of pain, which a proper dose of opiates can make go away and make them feel genuinely better. That is likely to be a major predisposition for addiction to opiates.
Overstigmatization of addiction causes serious problems for people with chronic pain. Due to fear of people feeling better than somebody thinks they should, doctors are limited in prescribing even non-opiate painkillers, so people unnecessarily suffer. Maybe it makes somebody powerful feel better, I don't know.
Some people, not a majority, and perhaps not a signifigant portion.
Let them get a diagnosis, and get something that does not have serious social consequences. A minority of people is not an excuse for street drugs, since a majority of people who get hooked have no reason too, and only cause problems for society.
To draw an example, I know a signifigant amount of people who smoke pot, and only a single one of them smoked it for pain (post-polio), while the rest were purely recreational. Heroin, I'm sure is the same. Its about the hit to the pleasure-center, and not a medical disorder. For the minority with the disorder, I would endorse methadone, or more probably some more standard pain-killer with less addictive consequences.
Please don't assume that I am against the minority with a pain condition that can be medically verified. Let the opiates flow to them in a pure, and well controlled stream.
A patriot must always be ready to defend his country against his government. -edward abbey
Eat healthy, excersize, do everything right and I can assure you - you will die one day anyway. Nobody gets out of life alive.
"So I'm a water addict?"
Yes.
"They" say that you can beat any addiction in two weeks, if you quit cold turkey.
Come on! You can do it!
Exam 4/C again. Maybe I'll do better this time.
Personally I am a severe insomniac. One cup off coffee can screw up my entire night.
Coffee is just like water. It is essential to life.
Coffee is a health drink. Trust us. We don't think there are health risks, and we believe that a lifetime commitment to drinking coffee is a wise and healthy choice.
and 4 cokes and a pack of cigs.I couldnt calculate the movements of a 3,4,5.6,7 body system in 4d in my head without them.LG