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Windows 9 To Win Over Windows 7 Users, Disables Start Screen For Desktop
DroidJason1 writes One of Microsoft's main goals with Windows 9, the next major version of Windows, is to win over Windows 7 hold outs. The operating system will look and work differently based on hardware type. Microsoft is looking to showcase the desktop for desktop and laptop users, while two-in-one devices like the Surface Pro or Lenovo Yoga will support switching between the Metro interface and the classic desktop interface. The new desktop will allow Modern UI apps to run in windowed mode, and have Modern UI apps pinned to the Start Menu instead of a Start Screen. There will also be a mini-start menu. Microsoft is looking to undo the usability mistakes it made with Windows 8 for those who are not on a touch device. WIndows 9 is expected around spring of 2015.
Isn't that supposed to be windows 8.2?
Can they also put a switch in this to make Office usable? I can't stand that fucking ribbon interface that makes everything I used to do the most often 5 times more difficult.
Damn_registrars has no butt-hole. Damn_registrars has no use for a butt-hole.
That it goes x64 only, much like they said a year and change ago.
Om, nomnomnom...
So this means my virtualized headless server won't have a touch screen interface? Glad someone used some common sense.
I'm not buying a new OS and relearning it unless there are amazing benefits. So far there are not amazing benefits.
Looks like MS is looking to continue the tradition of good odd-numbered Windows versions to make up for the bad even-numbered versions.
I finally got my Windows 7 system working reliably. I'm not budging until I have to.
[John]
Shit better not happen!
Why is releasing a re-labelled version of Windows 7 going to take until spring of 2015? Are they making a crew of interns re-type the source?
It's too late. Classic shell is better than the start menu ever was or ever will be.
I should use this sig to advertise my book ISBN-13 : 978-1501515132.
What about some of the huge downgrades in functionality that came with 8?
Audio controls being a big one.
I suppose this is the next Tick in Microsoft's equivalent of Intel's Tick Tock development model. In Microsoft's case, they get redesign hubris with every other version, then spend the following version back-tracking and undoing all the things they did wrong.
Much like Windows 7 pretty much was a fix-up of Vista, Windows 9 appears to be a "corrected" Windows 8.
Probably won't upgrade from Win7 until then.
So at TechEd, Microsoft basically publicly stated that windows 8.1 update2 would bring back the start menu... so in good faith I took the plunge and bought a Win8 laptop... my biggest grip with Win8 was with the stupid metro application launcher... Now you're telling that the most expense part of the laptop (OS) is worthless to me and I have to wait so that I can buy the newer version of windows to get what I need (and was promised) (and I thought I had already paid for) !!!
So:
Windows 9 is to Windows 7, what Windows 7 is to Windows XP.
Why?
Because Windows 9 is to Windows 8 what Windows 7 is to Windows Vista (which is Windows ME to Windows XP).
Head == asplode.
An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
Windows 8.X / 8.1X needs a new name to get rid of the bad PR and make the changes stand out more.
I know, ridiculous, right?
Microsoft could have avoided all this mess by simply listening to people who were beta testing and using 8 and complaining about the horrible start screen. I'm sure they got PILES of feedback, but they were so stubborn they even went out of their way to keep people from bringing back the traditional start menu.
What happened to listening to your customers? To providing options? Historically MS has always been all about that, and *Apple* has been the "our way, or the highway" company. It was really strange to see things reversed for Windows 8.
Also, MS really should break free of their "we are the only OS that exists" philosophy. Other operating systems support a wide variety of filesystems and networking protocols out of the box. Windows still only supports its own and assumes nothing else exists. It's time to knock that shit off, Microsoft.
How many users they will lose to iOS and Android in a whole year?
While it is nice to see Microsoft undo a horrific mistake for once, lets not be too quick to forgive and forget. (And don't even start until the gold release of Windows 9 is sitting on user's desktops)
The fact that Microsoft created this monster in the first place should tell you something about the remaining competence level there. You should be worried about their long-term stability. What is to keep them from pulling a similar stunt on you in Windows 10?
MS has interns do real work and not BS filler
Alt-Ctl-Del
I've heard that suggested before as a fix.
Instead of saying "One of Microsoft's main goals with Windows 9, the next major version of Windows, is to win over Windows 7 hold outs." wouldn't it be more factual to say the main goal is to "overcome the design failures that prevented widespread adoption of Windows 8."
As much as they love to pat themselves on the back for having such a "revolutionary" design, there is no better evidence that it Win 8 was a groupthink circlejerk than how no one who had the choice would use it.
iOS and Android on the desktop? / big screen?
Android can do Multi-Window. Ios needs an hack to do that.
everyone and their grandmothers has windows 7 and won't be switching till whenever support ends for it (and everyone wonders why they didn't stop years before).
Count me in the minority but I actually like the Start Screen, even on a touchless interface. Boot to desktop, and my frequently used applications are all pinned to the taskbar. For everything else, I've found that a well organized Start Screen beats cascading through nested Start Menu levels any day.
I hated the Start Menu back when it was introduced in Windows 95. I actually preferred Program Manager. The Start Screen brings back that feel, with everything I use readily displayed.
Kind of what you can already do in Windows 8 with classic shell and oldnewexplorer?
Will it bring back Aero, though? That was my main reason for not upgrading, the flat colors are fugly as hell. Currently on 8.1 with a custom theme right now... wouldn't want to do that on win9.
I thought they were bringing back the start *button*, not the menu...
.
Why in the world would I want to give Microsoft more money just to stay on the Microsoft Upgrade Treadmill©?
I wonder what reason they'll use to justify pulling it back out of Windows 10?
Dear Slashdot: next time you want to mess with the site, add a rich-text editor for comments.
Sorry, I couldn't help myself. :-)
Proverbs 21:19
Install Linux
Apple likes to surprise and delight.
Microsoft likes to disturb and annoy.
MS, listen to me. Most (60%) of users simply want hardware and software to run legacy applications and hardware acesssories. Stop breaking things!
JJ
Maybe Windows X will be as popular as XP.
It's long been a common complaint that Microsoft has too many SKUs for each version of Windows, and I agree. Vista went way too far on that, and if we ignore "RT", Win 8 was more a reasonable Home/Pro/Enterprise - and I don't know if they had upgrade/oem/retail sub-varieties. It's surely the wrong approach to divide up the functionality by SKU here. Instead, why can't Windows look at the hardware and make educated guesses as to the default behaviors, and then let users customize? Ballmer liked to criticize Google for developing multiple operating systems instead of a single strategic platform, but Microsoft is famous for this crap.
they're probably going to bring Clippy back or something like that
HP and Dell can give up any hope of a nice Santa Rally in sales this holiday season - for the third year in a row. A shame they took so long to get invested in Android. Samsung and LG are going to clean up this year.
Help stamp out iliturcy.
Last time they listened, we got clippy. An earlier version of clippy was in the user tests, and users loved it: it was useful, funny, and typically anticipated what they needed help for. They were so happy, Microsoft turned it up.
Is a turd, no matter how they colour it, and we sure do not want it.
I didn't mind the start screen as much as everybody else. I didn't like it, but I could work with it. The problem I had with 8 is that, when I tried to customize my desktop to fit my uses and upgrade everything, something would inevitably break along the way. I could be a day, a week, even a month invested in the operating system, but then something would break. But in a way that would make it impossible for my system to actually start. I want to like the new things, Microsoft, but I can't just leave it be and hope it works for the best.
I've had this since release day of Windows 8.0. Microsoft seems to be following almost exactly in the footsteps of Stardock with their products Start8 and ModernMix. Let's see: they brought back the start button (Start8 does that); they made a "close" bar with an X on Metro apps so they act more like desktop apps (ModernMix does that and then some, since it can make Metro apps windowed and resizeable); they are going to bring back the start menu in Windows 9 (Start8 has done that since its release around the Windows 8 preview)... So I've basically been running Windows 9 since release day of Windows 8.0. The one thing that confounds me is why Stardock didn't patent these things first so they could sue Microsoft for a trillion dollars for blatantly stealing all of their ideas (admittedly, many of these ideas involve "stealing" from previous versions of Windows, but the Metro UI enhancements in ModernMix are new to Metro.)
I know it might sound weird, but I like where things are at in Windows 8.1. Boots into desktop after login, transition to start screen is much less jaring when using the same background, configure the immediate left of the start screen with all your most used apps. It's very similar to the osx launchpad.
If they remove it in win9, I may just configure it back the way it was in 8.1.
"I herd you like Windows, so we decided to put MORE windows in your Windows!" But seriously now, what those articles tell me is that Windows 9 will behave like Windows 7 does on my current HW...soooo why the hell would *I* want to upgrade?
They release new versions of windows too often, and charge too much for the upgrades. Also, far too many things stop working once one upgrades.
I intend to hang on to 7 until the end of extended support, and possibly after that, because I have no incentive to upgrade. Their willingness to give me back the interface they shouldn't have taken away in the first place is not an incentive to upgrade, it is merely one less disincentive.
Lipstick. Pig. Still porcine.
What we wanted: Device-specific interface, with a shared software architecture for compatibility purposes. What they gave us: Device-specific architecture with a phone's interface. Apple may be able to get away with creating demand for whatever they put out (when you're selling more of a culture than a product, you can do that), but MS isn't there, and never will be.
Trust me. It was not worth even putting all the damn disks in.
Insert Spinal Tap joke here:
so long as they bring back the fucking games and media center, IN THE BOX.. and not as a store 'purchase' (even if it is 'free', you still sign your life away with the required ms account) or an added-cost addon (media center pack) to an added-cost upgrade (pro edition).
Wow, so one of their major goals is to release something people actually want to upgrade to.
Way to set your sights low, Microsoft.
Perhaps you should admit that Metro was nothing other than your executives suffering from collective lust explosion over Apple taking 30% off the top of every app sale and hoping that MS could force Windows users into the same situation.
You are in a maze of twisty little passages, all alike.
...and purchased a Mac Pro. My WIN2K machine started showing its age. HP stopped making ink cartridges for my printer. Upgrading required a completely new system as none my peripherals will work on Vista and higher. We started using WIN7 at work from XP and I just hated it. Since I had to buy a completely new system, a Mac Pro was only a little more money. And the migration to learning a new OS was easier than I anticipated. I have no regrets, especially seeing the stupid mistakes MS has made in WIN8.
Eternity: will that be smoking, or non-smoking? I Corinthians 6:9-10
With Microsoft abandoning the moronic push to "convergence," perhaps Unity will become optional. And, maybe, maybe Gnome will reconsider?
Stop trying to make revenue by forcing customers to upgrade Windows. Windows 7 is a mature O/S. It doesn't need anything except continued support. So put Windows 7 on a subscription system - $50/year and MS will put their dev team into sustaining mode and focus on fixing bugs and security flaws.
Much better for everyone as it no longer forces companies (and individuals) to go through extremely costly upgrade processes in which many if not most of the packages that they are running have to be upgraded/replaced. Not to mention retraining of IT staff to handle the changes in the O/S configuration, monitoring, vulnerabilities, etc.
MS gets a revenue stream, the world gets a stable platform to build on top of (which is what an O/S is supposed to be). Much better than MS trying to force everyone to pay $250 every few years to 'upgrade' Windows with all the ensuing costs and effort to change everything else that works differently (or not at all) with the 'new Windows'.
How to Tame your Operating System.. should be the moral to this story. "Let them Eat Code" should never be the mantra when Customers come screaming to you "Where's the Start Button".
The "plants" that forever say they "like Windows 8" should cash the check and go home already.
Apple likes to surprise and delight.
Microsoft - DON"T CHANGE ANYTHING OR I FREAK THE FARK OUT.
/ Perception problem.
Microsoft doesn't know the meaning of the term "focus group testing". Although I guess it is sort of pointless if you already know the masses are going to eat whatever shit you dish out.
Too little.... WAAAAAAY too late....
THANK YOU, Edward Snowden!! Americans owe you a debt of gratitude (whether they know it or not..)
I was actually at the first ever meeting of the IT department for my company from all over the country and about half of them did not understand why I do not like Windows 8...confirming the contempt I have developed for them based on the interactions I have had with them.
The truth is that all men having power ought to be mistrusted. James Madison
So, after having a bad experience with 8, and having to go back to 7, I see that Microsoft renames 8.2 as 9 (to avoid name recognition or something) and says they have some really neat features in 9 that will win over users of 7. (I had first written "win over 7 users" which still might end up being true...)
Um, ok, these are the same people who "put the start button back" in an update to 8, which turned out to be merely an icon over the hot spot that takes you to the start screen. Which was very much not the point.
So now that they say Windows 9 will act completely differently and appropriately on a non-touch PC, (which is potentially a good thing and something they should have done from the start, but never mind) how (this is the important part) how can we believe them?
So, at very least, the safe bet is not to be an early adopter, and see what others think after it's been in the wild for, oh, say a year. Or two.
And completely besides the point, why would I want to leave 7? It works. It's still supported as far as I know. I don't want to be an OS Q/A person, I have more interesting things to do. (At least, more interesting to me.)
Now, if I had to buy a PC with 9 on it... no, that doesn't work either, because you can still ask for 7.
I can see where people who for some reason were forced to use 8 might be interested. Maybe that's the primary market.
Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
God, I should hope so.
You are welcome on my lawn.
Is Windows relevant to anything anymore?
Windows ME Release 4?
If you're a true Windows 7 "hold out" then you won't be moving to a new operating system until that goes out of extended support in January 2020.
Working on one new update every two years, once extended support ends then it'll probably be Windows 11 that Microsoft will want those hold outs to move to, certainly not Windows 9.
Avantslash - View Slashdot cleanly on your mobile phone.
WHY are you powering down a desktop, never mind cutting its power off?? I mean, I can understand rebooting (which it does pretty damn fast - well under a minute to get back to the login screen on my system, and a good chunk of that is BIOS status displays - so I'm skeptical of your "four minutes" complaint) when needed, but powering down even without disconnecting power is an edge case scenario these days (use Suspend, or Hibernate if you need to) and cutting the power cord is an extremely rare need (also, you can hibernate if needed).
Even in the case that this is something you legitimately need to do, your complaint is stupid. Just wait until the power light on the case goes out (and the fans spin down, which is easy to *hear* even if you aren't looking at the case) before cutting the power!
There's no place I could be, since I've found Serenity...
I remember when all you had to do was replace a registry key for "shell" from explorer.exe to whatever you wanted and that was all it took to run any other front end from boot (progman.exe anyone?)
Awh those were the days
The answer to all your problems
My company has already started to ditch Microsoft over the gaff that was Vista 2.0 (Win8x). Starting six months ago as peoples machine came up on replacement schedule we started moving everyone to Ubuntu and Libre Office. (Not really all that thrilled with Ubuntu myself...) But what we are seeing here is that even companies are now getting tired of Microsoft flops every other version. With most of our software and applications being web based these days, as long as you have a web browser that works with java script you are pretty much golden. Even in the server environment now we are running nearly 50% Solaris or Linux and 50% Windows Servers, though we are replacing Windows with Unix or Linux as we can.
MS has planned all along to have Windows 9 come in "legacy" (regular desktop) versus "OEM" versions. Just wait, it's coming...! Legacy will cost a lot. The Metro stuff is to have a captive audience using Bing and other MS web services.
Windows NT 4 and Windows 2000 never had a home edition. Among Windows operating systems with a home edition, it went 95 bad, 98 good, Me bad, XP good, Vista bad until SP1 "Mojave", 7 good, 8 bad without Classic Shell.
I don't know what the state of the art emulator of the Sega Genesis 16-bit Video Entertainment System is, but you can run 16-bit Super NES software in Higan (formerly bsnes) and 16-bit DOS games in DOSBox. And you can probably run a bunch of 16-bit software in MESS. These emulators are available on multiple platforms, including Windows 8.1.
This is the best of both worlds. The metro interface works fine on tablets and smartphones with touch screen, but is cumbersome to use with a mouse.
What other disadvantages do you ascribe to it? It doesn't take up meaningfully more space than the menu bar would (it takes significantly *less* space than a menu bar plus a single toolbar), it is still navigable with a keyboard, it doesn't override existing keyboard shortcuts for specific actions (from Ctrl+S to Ctrl+Shift+=), it is still hierarchically organized and also still supports expanding (sub)menus for high option density where needed, it scales to multiple resolutions and window sizes better than menus do, it makes it easy to see what the effect of an action will be before you click, and there's still a customizable toolbar for commands you want to hit with the mouse in one click from anywhere.
These all seem like wins vs. the menu bar system...
There's no place I could be, since I've found Serenity...
I know this is flame-bait, but I'd love to get a headless / CLI-only version of Windows 9 for a discounted price. My company has a very small IT department and the whole company is Windows-based. We literally don't have the resources to learn & maintain Linux, especially since most of our vendors' hardware is also based on various flavors of Windows. Easily 30-40% of our Windows licenses are for headless devices controlling various bits of machinery, and it pains me to pay $100+ on a $500 computer for something we'll never hook a monitor to after the first day.
> ... is to win over Windows 7 hold outs.
What about us Windows XP hold outs you insensitive clod ?!
Use MDT and DISM to slipstream the updates into the install Or if you only do it once a year then two hours is no big deal.
Bringing back an actual Start menu is an important part of what needs to be fixed, but it's not the only thing. Windows 8, with its solid color design, looks flat and ugly compared to Windows 7 with Aero. Even if they plan to stick with the more spartan look, they should at least bring back frame translucency. (There is an add-on for Windows 8 that can do this, but it's still in beta and requires installation by hacking AppInit_DLL.) And the centered window titles are even more annoying. From Windows 95 onward, the title has always been left-justified. That's where my eyes are used to looking for it, and have been for nearly 20 years. Windows 8 moved it to the center because some graphics designer thought it looks cool, but this completely breaks my eye-tracking, wasting a few seconds here and there while I go hunting for the title that's not where my muscle memory says it should be. I don't care if they expose this in the UI, but there should at least be a registry key to fix that.
Isn't that supposed to be windows 8.2?
Windows 8.1 update (as opposed to Windows 8.1) is supposed to be Windows 8.2.
I hope this episode would convince the Gnome folks and Canonical to revert this whole "convergence" thingy (I think that's Shuttleworth's word). Touch is nice for portable screens but not for large, fixed screens. Maybe the next generation will grow up with their hands glued to a video display even for tasks like driving and typing book reports, but until that time let the mouse and touch pad die a natural death.
MS will probably do something stupid... windows 11 though will be decent.
Don't touch 12 though... 13 will ironically be great though.
And so on... why are they so stupid! At the very least, after coming out with a popular OS try to learn from that and build on that success.
I've decided to stop wasting my time responding to AC trolls/sockpuppets... so if you want a response from me... login.
Perhaps it's a $1,000 PC with a $9,000 specialized peripheral that has a driver for the included Windows OS but no driver for X11/Linux. These multi-thousand-dollar peripherals are commonly trotted out as reasons that businesses stay on outdated Windows. Heck, some CNC mills probably still run DOS (happy birthday FreeDOS!).
Switched to OS X and not going to switch back.
Stopped my rent agreement with MS and working on to get all my desktops switched to macs. Why? Because F*** Y** MS.
If they force an upgrade like they did with xp to vista to 7, or winodows 7 to 8 to get 8.1 then 8.1 for update 1, what other crap are they going to pull. they cant claim innovation, its the same one trick pony this time with a ribbon. Why do people buy this crap! Whatever happened to innovation? Windows apps are an apple idea rebooted?
Mindless cretins dumb enough to go to jail who can't read (neanderthals used pictures too vs. writing).
I've had far better luck installing a pirated version of windows then I ever had with a legal copy. I purchased an upgrade copy of 7, which was an upgrade from Vista which was an upgrade from XP. Either I install 3 versions of windows or install a clean 7 then call tech support to tell them I'm really not stealing windows and to please validate my install; or I just pirate a version of windows that allows me to update.
MS will probably come out with some bullshit requirement of always on connectivity to the cloud and such with Windows 9 that people will probably be singing praises about Windows 8 when the time comes out to roll out Windows 9. Mark my words.
Most PowerPoint presentations look like the 1998 internet when BLINK tags roamed the earth and ten fonts a page wasn't seen as excessive so why not have it as some sort of web page creation program instead of an archaic fucking magic lantern show? Currently it's not much different from screen scraping or a rewrite to make a presentation readable via a web browser.
All the presentations are made from devices that have web browsers already on them so why not something that looks good in a web browser?
There are no inventions in operating system UIs since the release of XP, right now we are suffering one big experiment that seems to be led by a horde of drunken chickens...
If builders built buildings the way programmers wrote programs, then the first woodpecker would destroy civilization.
Discussed this with friends since 8 came out. Detect a touch screen, *offer* (not force) the crappy METRO interface. Don't detect a touch screen, classic shell.
METRO makes sense on a tablet or a phone, but not on a desktop.
I've got better things to do tonight than die.
I wish they added a viable option to disable ClearType and Font Smoothing properly.
Hey, I just got here !
if they think that they can entice people using win XP to jump, fine. win 7, I literally just got here. bought my copy four weeks ago, and it works fine, I must admit. In this context, "fine" means " as well as win XP".
"If a boss demands loyalty, give him integrity. But if he demands integrity, give him loyalty." (John Boyd, 1927-1997)
So the selling point is that it will look like windows 7. Why should I pay for it then? Microsoft clearly wants windows to be a subscription. Why else knock out a new version so often and put little effort into fixing what you already have. I'm not into paying an obscene amount for a broken OS where there's osx and Linux which both are so much cheaper and perform better.
There seems to be a consensus that Vista is an overall crap, while 7 is an acceptable OS, on level of XP.
In my experience, they are the same OS with different name:
- the same UAC
- the same explorer (no parent dir button)
- the same Start Menu, Tray and Task Bar (likewise, some XP functionality is lost without replacements)
- the same mess in Control Panel (mostly obscure "website" layer over legacy dialogs)
- the same backward compatibility problems
Microsoft made it quite clear that much of the "issue" is that there are now simply too many options in Office. They tried to make a menu structure for 2007 and would have had to make several menus multiple submenus deep. They couldn't design a classic menu interface that they felt was workable for the features they added.
the more users will run screaming to the open arms of Android (or Desktop varieties of GNU/Linux) or Apple.
I mean... the more users will SLIP THROUGH YOUR FINGERS.
Microsoft is #goingdown, maybe even #ob-so-lete.
They just can't seem to understand that first, some people just hate Microsoft no matter what they do. Like me. I could be dying of inoperable brain tumors, Microsoft could find a miracle drug that costs the people a penny a dose, cures all cancers with one dose, and has NO NEGATIVE SIDE-EFFECTS, and STILL hate them forever. No sympathy for the devil, and they're definitely that. I (and I think I'm not alone here,) and many others would still hate Microsoft no matter what, and I doubt they're going to cure cancer. Those who just flat out hate them, (and they totally deserve it, IMO) will never willingly use anything they sell again under any circumstances. I won't. I don't think I'm the only one.
People who want a tablet would rather have an iPad or Android device than their... "hey, this is a PC that IS also a tablet!" While people who want a REAL computer and not a disease-vector for viruses and other mal-ware either pony up and pay the M$ tax, and then as soon as they get it home, rip it open, and install a REAL operating system like a BSD OS, a distro of GNU/Linux, or just say "screw it-" and buy a Mac. No one who CAN avoid it buys Microsoft crap anymore. Happily, Microsoft is dying. They simply can't attract new custom. Remember how the southern states freaked when the federal government mandated that new states entering the union would be FREE?
(The south wasn't pissed they weren't coming in as slave-states, they just wanted the states to have the choice, because otherwise they'd be surrounded by free-states, and increasingly isolated in an America that had an ever-increasing number of free-states, and that that fact would DOOM slavery. This is a little like that, in that Microsoft is so very hated, the crap they produce is such a nightmare for users, and unlike 10 or 15 years ago, there are now very REAL choices, you DON'T have to buy a Microsoft OS, or their branded junk-computers. YAY! FREEDOM!!!)
We're past the tipping point. Software now comes out on other platforms than just "Windows", they now often either produce a Linux version, or OS X/iOS or in the case of many games, a Steam version... so the reasons one once HAD TO HAVE M$ Windows have largely disappeared. I love not having to use antivirus software, I love that my computer is secure out of the box, and I don't have to fuck with it to make it run the way I want. Microsoft could do that, but they're far too busy trying to figure out how to force people to PAY FOR THE SAME SHIT THEY ALREADY BOUGHT OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN.
M$ may die before the "year of Linux on the desktop" in which case it will either be because the PC dies altogether, (unlikely) or Apple finally wins the PC V. MAC wars. With the addition of all the super-slick ass, dope-ass, fly-ass shnit coming up between Yosemite and iOS 8, with Continuity, etc. etc. etc., we may finally see the true beginning of the end for Microsoft, and good riddance to bad, stinking rubbish!
Microsoft is like a whale-fall. It will take about as long as it's been around to finally die completely and disappear like it never existed. If Ubuntu would get on the U-Ball, and get OEM's to start releasing Ubuntu-1 phones and have features similar to Apple's, we could see a new paradigm where it's a descendent of BSD-Unix (OS X) versus a descendent of the reimplementation, Linux, duke it out for dominance, with the nightmare that was Microsoft DOS, Win/DOS, Windows "NT" (Neanderthal Technology), and its miserable, deformed and horrible progeny nothing but a bad memory.
As in...
Person 1: Hey, remember when people still used, "MS Windows"?
Person 2: No, what's a Ms. Winn doze? Was she napping?
Person 1: No, it was a kludgy, dodgy old pathetic excuse for an operating system that was really just a way of malware aut
Dear Microsoft, Please sell a Family Pack similar to Windows 7.
It is better to be the hammer than the anvil.
My Lenovo Y580 worked really well with Windows 7 and almost as well with 8. 8.1 totally stuffed the WiFi, and it only works properly when using the Intel Windows 7 driver. If this hadn't worked, I would have reverted to Windows 7. I now remember why my last PC was a Mac....
...they'd better offer an in-place upgrade from Windows 7. Nobody (well, almost nobody) is going to back everything up, do a fresh OS install that blows away the old one, and then reinstall everything and reconfigure everything. It just takes too damn long. I'm thinking about moving my Dad from his XP machine to a Chromebook for exactly this reason - I'd upgrade him to Win8, except you can't do that.
Downmodding is the refuge of the weak. Don't downmod, make a better argument!
Go get a copy of Windows 3.1 on eBay and run it in your favorite VM. Google finds guides to install Windows 3.1 in DOSBox and in VirtualBox.
Seriously, I don't think I ever received anything from them that couldn't be sent in RTF format, but that's another story.
99% of the stuff that gets send as word processor files could be plain text.
MS ought to have realized by now that they need to just throw away any even-numbered releases. The only numbered releases that have not been failures due to function or usability have all been odd-numbered (assuming you forget about all versions before Windows 3.1). And just skipping the even numbers won't work because it's the ideas in the even releases that are failures.
Though perhaps it might be that MS needs the every-other-version beatings to actually produce decent versions?
--- Void where prohibited. Your mileage may vary. ---
I've always wondered why the Explorer interface as a whole has always presented itself as largely immutable (excluding HTA folder templates). Why not take a lesson from elsewhere in the industry (winamp?) and make it skinnable? Add plugin support. If you like the default MS skin, use that. Otherwise.. sign into whatever flavor of app market and download an alternative. This would include alternatives to the much hyped and boring Aero.
>> Can they also put a switch in this to make Office usable?
Just install Libreoffice.... Or Linux with LO.
aaaaaaa
Once when I tried to switch to Linux, my Microtek 4850 flatbed scanner wouldn't work. I checked SANE's list and it was marked as unsupported. I had to replace it with an HP.
First they'll have to conWINce us XP users.
All we have to do now is get rid of those ribbons...
My company is finally switching from XP to 8. However, for the about 80,000 world wide employees we have, the company decided to 1)disable the touch screen and 2)permanently install the start menu. We also went to SSDs so startup with multi-layers of security no longer takes 5 minutes but about 2. Only a few complaints about specific software not working (but we had those before!)
If 8 was designed for monkeys, 9 is just for audience.
Another thing that has kept some of us from upgrading is the pricing of Media Center in Windows 8. Not only is it optional at extra cost - the $10 add-on would be tolerable - but you can only add it to Windows 8 Pro, if you have the standard (home) edition you have to upgrade with a $100 Pro Pack. The net result is that you can count the number of HTPC users who are running Windows 8 with the fingers of no hands, and the manufacturers of TV tuner cards are unhappy because Microsoft has pretty much destroyed their business.
why would bringing up the lock screen menu fix anything?
Office 2013 (which we just switched to at work, over my objections after being one of our office's "beta" testers) is even worse than 2010, which was worse than 2007. In 2007, they introduced the non-conforming title bar, so you could barely tell by looking whether an Office app had the focus. (It changed to slightly darker, but only slightly. I had to look at my other apps and by process of elimination figure out whether Office had focus.) In 2013, the title bar changes *not at all* when Office receives/ loses focus. It's always white (or always light gray or a slightly darker gray). I finally found a work-around, using a high-contrast "theme" in Windows forces the title bar to change color depending on focus. Of course everything else looks rather ugly, but I'm gradually tweaking what I can. And Office 2013 has the ugliest icons and buttons I've ever seen. Looks like it was designed for a VGA screen, or maybe CGA... If you don't believe me, google "microsoft office 2013 ugly".
"The new desktop will allow Modern UI apps to run in windowed mode". Like... Windows 1.0, 2.0 3.0 will allow MS-DOS programs to run in windowed mode? Look, I get (a bit) that windows apps on a touchscreen device are hard to implement. Even though they break a proper GUI (I use android and I hate the fact that there are no windowed apps, especialy since tablets are getting the resolution to support it) I can accept that it is just difficult. But what in the hell are you thinking of implementing a non-windowed environment on a desktop. That's just... going backwards in time 20 years.
Until Microsoft removes every line of code of Metro, tiles, Charms bar, lock screen and other touch-centric elements, Windows 9 will be doomed.
Listen Microsoft: we don't want your phones and tablets. We don't want Surface and convertibles. We don't want an app store for Windows PC. We want a proper point-and-click, keyboard and mouse interface for a desktop.
You have lost the mobile device war to Google and Apple, suck it up and go play somewhere else. Stop chasing after a lost cause.
I don't feel like buying a new $150+ copy of Windows Pro every 2 years.
Comparing Windows 8 to Windows Vista isn't exactly valid. Windows 8 has a superior file system and is very stable. People just bitch about the Metro UI, which I just use as an application launcher for desktop applications.
Who needs time travel? I really do not get why you decided to get sarcastic and pretend to be stupid in reply to a post about documented versus undocumented file formats.
So what would I have them do? It would be nice if they would properly document their file formats (like those SEGD files from 1972), but since they won't for business reasons we have to work around it or avoid outputting in those formats.
What we currently have documented from them is a mostly useless XML wrapper around various undocumented formats. Since their internal processes are unable to retain compatibility between versions very well that means users have to do format shifting and partial rewrites to do things with old files on new versions of the software. A workaround is not to bother and keep legacy systems around to output to other file formats (eg. PDF) that can be used in more recent computer system environments.
I do hope there is an option to still be able to use or access it for Desktop users though. I has helped me make documents and folders a lot easier to access without cramming everything on the desktop. The Charm Bar not so much; after Windows 8.1 Update, it looks like they are trying to bring more of it to the Start Menu but the pop-out tab from the right (i.e. to do searches) is a feature I like as well.
There is nothing else to say. The best thing MS can do is just give us Windows 7 in a box labelled Windows 9. Most of us will be so happy to not have that fucking Charms Bars and Metro Screen interrupt us every 5 minutes for no apparent reason whatsoever that we would not even notice. Honestly, hand on heart, I would prefer Windows 95 to Windows 8.
The subject says it all. So far 7 does all I need I dont need to use touch screens on large displays and I do not trust the cloud, now would I ever store my, or a customers data in the cloud. The govt claims they have access to any of your data not physically in your possession so they could conceiveably track your on line transactions. Be it purchases, sales, savings, or investments. Course they could monitor any router you might go through as well.