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Unusable for CAD. A space mouse is almost always . And even if you're working with a normal mouse, it's nice to have a LARGE area that you can do decent drag modes. Can you set up your touch pad to do click-and-drag over an entire screen width AND still have very fine resolution? I've tried it (yes, even on a Macbook) and it simply isn't realistic. It's really slow. Get at least a regular mouse...

...growing more similar to traditional pro sports all the time.

No. Competition does not equal sport: I've heard professional chess players do weight lifting, but chess and StarCraft competitions are not a sport. There isn't the mind-body involvement demanded by traditional sports.

... Repetitive strain had injured Mr Lee's muscles ...

How does clicking a mouse cause RSI? Besides, these injuries have been preventable since the 1980s. Such injuries say more about the stupidity of the e-competitors than the authenticity of the 'sport'.

Is this a case of a bad 'work' environment, the usual cause of RSI? A dedicated e-competitor should be using equipment like the Space mouse, dedicated to high-speed input.

I've been navigating 3D worlds my whole career, and a Spaceball works just fine. A Spaceball already has a comfy surface to rest your hand, and you don't have to squeeze a switch to move.

I don't get your point. A 3D mouse isn't just a shell that covers a regular mouse. It is a very specialized piece of hardware/electronics that requires specialized software to work. So, yes, I can build a 3D printer but I can't build a 3D mouse. You can learn more about 3D mice here: http://www.3dconnexion.com/

Whittling is a subtractive process more accurately comparable to CNC machining. 3D printing is an additive process, nothing like "whittling".

I should point out that the term "Space Controller" is a trademark for this product:
http://www.spacecontrol.us/spacecontrol-3d-mouse-spacecontroller.html

But I usually see the Logitech 3DConnexion Space Mouse, which is often (incorrectly) called a space controller:
http://www.3dconnexion.com/

Keyboards are very good for data input. Mice and trackballs are nearly perfect for 2D input. If you want 3D input get a Space Pilot. http://www.3dconnexion.com/products/spacepilot-pro.html

http://www.3dconnexion.com/products/spacepilot-pro.html

Probably not exactly what your looking for, but its top notch hardware with a reasonably nice SDK. Depending on exactly what your app does, the multiple axiseses of control might also be beneficial.

Keyboards are for entering text. But even now programming is almost all entering symbols and references. Text is a lot of work entering lots of characters when a single symbol is produced. Typing allows all kinds of mistakes.

Because typing allows mistakes in a word processor, word processors have red underlines to highlight misspelled words. Because typing allows mistakes in a program editor, program editors have syntax highlighting and a similar use of red underlines. Furthermore, program editors have tab completion to speed up entering symbols.

And possibly most important, typing doesn't match the practice of mainly reusing code - you're always writing things from scratch, even to refer to existing code.

I've seen dataflow diagrams in products such as Rocky's Boots, LogicWorks, and Widget Workshop. In these environments, when you point-and-click to reuse code as a node in a dataflow diagram, you're drawing a lot of lines to hookup all the inputs and outputs to the other nodes, and you're drawing the lines from scratch. You're also pointing and clicking to find the reusable component you need as the needle in the haystack of components installed on your machine. And besides, how would the components be created?

20 years from now, if you're still programming, you'll be flowcharting and speaking.

Speaking? Overuse of the vocal cords invites the various dysphonias. I don't want the stranger sitting next to me on the bus hearing what I'm doing or (worse) thinking I'm criminally insane and calling the police on me. And speaking is just as linear as typing.

There will always be better accuracy and therefore faster communication when augmented by hands touching something that touches back

And until haptic feedback makes leaps and bounds that I haven't anticipated, "something that touches back" is the action of a buckling-spring keyboard. I'd like to see links to prove otherwise.

[Mobile phones] have keyboards mostly because of texting and the truly archaic phone numbers that are already being replaced by software directories

You still need a keyboard or on-screen keyboard to search the directory.

and directly messaging contact info around.

You still need a keyboard or on-screen keyboard to enter the recipient of the message the first time if you have met this recipient in person.

and keying text messages will start to be reliably replaced by speech to text (spoken over the network to the STT server).

With everyone else in the room hearing. That kills the big advantage of texting over speaking, namely the silence.

So by the time 20 or so years comes around, young programmers will use

...graphing calculators. Everything else that's programmable and affordable for home use will be cryptographically locked down to run only programs developed by professional programmers working for businesses and approved by the hardware maker.

Convenience and cost for the billions of users will probably mean most people just touch surfaces or gesture in the air for selecting options, while workers use "pens" that don't feed back unless they're working on the machine's state, not the state of more abstract work. People who must communicate more precisely or verbosely with the machine will use pens that feed back, and perhaps surfaces and objects that deform to interact with the pens, because the human wetware has the most expressive and receptive interface in that manner.

Which creates a bigger divide between the haves and the have-nots. Pens that feed back will be expensive, just as a 3D mouse is expensive, and for at least the first 20 years until patents expire, applications needing preci

You don't necessarily have to lift your arm off the table. Think of the gestures capable with simply adjusting the height of your fingers. I used to use a 3D mouse, and I think all the 3D movement from that piece of hardware would be comfortably implemented using a 3D vision system like the parent mentioned.

No this is what you would use for CAD application.

http://www.3dconnexion.com/

http://www.3dconnexion.com/3dmouse/overview.php

P.S. If you go to the ICC page you can see their Metaverse / Hive project, an open video archive. I think some links are Japanese but they have recordings of seminars too. I too dislike the disc changer idea but I don't know how much money you all have. If possible do as some other posters say, bring much high bandwidth cabling around and also put in clients with much horsepower. I was thinking of quad Mac Pro with large screen at each location. The huge fast SAN someone mentioned also sounds scrumptious. If you can't afford it all now just block out purchases in the future maybe. But don't get crappy old stuff.

Anyway on the Hive top page you see it is bilingual, and there is an announcement about licensing, and you can say click on an "ICC artist talk" like this one for Knowbotic Research who are very cool. There is info about the artists and their homepage, plus a link to the exhibit page from when their exhibit was in the museum (yes you have to archive all of that too, and probably hire an admin to manage updates, a student will do). There is a streaming link. And (whoa I just discovered this and will be diving into the hive from now on I assure you) a DOWNLOAD LINK! Where you can get a zip file of the talk which is perfect. The library makes it CC licensed and open to the Net which is also perfect. The file is a WMA at 720x480 and 44Khz audio, perhaps lower quality than you will have in the future. Check it out, the beginning of the file is Japanese but advance a bit and it becomes English. It would be nice to have an editing studio so you can add other language tracks in the future (or just subtitles, that would be easier in a separate file). In this video file you can see how they are having a panel discussion, and the speaker plugs their laptop into the projector. Figure you will have very high-end machines on stage potentially, or connecting to/from the net. And provide a HD camera for the view of the stage. Hope this helps, the ICC really built just what you want and it looks like they have kept it updated technologically. They even have a metaverse project. You may need to host virtual worlds in the future, I guess that is pretty likely right now. Many artworks are in 3d virtual spaces or in a large web of webpages, like i love bees and david blair's wax web (which also included video and was so slow over the web of about 95 or so.). Consider Blair was IIRC the first artist to plug a VCR into the net and stream it, you are definitely going to be having a taxed infrastructure and all you can do is make it delightful to be there and work with boosting it. A big SAN is probably something you need.

One thing I liked from something someone mentioned, the video jog dial (not really a jog, you spin it with your finger in the hole to advance or rewind video). That client looked like crap though. I'd consider how do people use the system and maybe for each station also consider (it's not that expensive) some usb add-ons like a tiny side screen for navigation (if you are full screen video), a 3D round shuttle like this or maybe this, and a cheapo printer. I have no idea if 3d printers will get cheap one day (well yes there's a nice tabletop one I think) but just something now that people can print out a screen shot or notes. Of course best if they can just mail to themselves maybe, then no need to stock paper/ink.

And then we have the SpaceNavigator and it's siblings, but that is actually used by a lot of CAD users. And if you use Google Earth you will love it.

The sad thing with it is that the default drivers doesn't allow it to be used as a joystick. There are thirdparty drivers but I haven't been able to make them work.

At work (I'm a design engineer) I use a spaceball for 3D navigation and a mouse for the 2D stuff. I don't need to put on some silly glove, it's cheap, and it all fits on a normal desk. I assure you, I could have done all of the operations they just performed in the video, but faster and more comfortably.

For sculpting you would need exact 1:1 mapping, which neither the normal Wiimote nor the add on provide. And even if you have 1:1 mapping you still would need feedback to make it really useful, so a Wiimote won't replace a haptic device anytime soon. However it might be possible to use it in the same way you use a SpaceNavigator, i.e. to navigate around in 3D space.

WARNING: THIS POST CONTAINS GRAPHIC DEPICTIONS OF MICROSOFT RAPING POOCHES FOR THEIR OWN PERCIEVED GAIN. DO NOT READ IF YOU ARE AVERSE TO GRAPHIC CONTENT OR EASILY ANGERED BY MICROSOFTS WANTON COCKMONGERING STUPIDITY.

The biggest issue is Vista drivers. And its not simply hardware people that need drivers, theres a huge base of software that relies on installing system level devices that perform various things Windows is simply unable to do itself.

MS really fucked the pooch particularly gruesomely in this department
1. Device driver development kits got shipped only at the 25th hour
2. DDK availability was low then and is low now. You have to like red tape and receiving anal sex to play this game anymore.
3. Oh yeah, DDK is now useless.

#3 is really where things get EXTRA DOUBLE Microsoft pooch screwing special. See, because Microsoft wanted a DRM safe platform the only way to secure the OS was to make only certified secure drivers able to run on the OS. Whereas before MS certification just a big roadblock most people just went around (see: not fans of pooch screwing), now its totally mandatory with no exceptions.

My favorite example of how badly customers get fucked by MS's great love of pooch rear ends is the RBC9 SpaceNavigator driver. Some enthusiast saw that the badass 6 degree of freedom controller from 3dconnexion was a) basically useless for anything these jerk offs didnt write a driver for yet b) is /nearly/ just a straight usb joystick device. Likely using the old DDK and making by his own confession very few changes he turned this sweet piece of hardware from something that can only be used with the handful of apps the jerk offs built the controller to support, to a universally accessible wonder controler you can use to stomp the crap out of people in gears of war and freespace 2 with.

Theres just one problem. Theres not a snowballs chance in hell there will ever be a not-totally-fucking trash 64 bit driver for this awesome controller. 3dconnexion thinks their business is selling shitty proprietary software when in fact all we want is a hardware company, they're to freaking drunk on software sales to write something actually useful for their hardware and have no interest in doing so. On the other hand, RBC9, who wrote this sweet driver, has no way of a) getting a new DDK for Vista 64, and b) distributing the driver in usable form if he DID get a DDK.

I largely suspect Adobe's similar pooch abuse related activities regarding availability of 64 bit flash relates to the above circle jerks. Its been nearly 3 years and they still dont have a Flash that runs on 10% of the world's Windows IE.

MS bent hte customer and developer and the pooch over backwards to produce Vista. I really hope it takes them a while to clean all the gore off their dicks when they're done.

link drop / references:

vista drm:
http://www.cs.auckland.ac.nz/~pgut001/pubs/vista_cost.html
rbc9 3dconnexion pooching clusterfsck:
http://www.3dconnexion.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=336&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=390&sid=8207b7e5a2e2949040a86ba9c6c31e1d

Yeah, *sigh*, Descent. Now that was a fun game.

I just got one of these:
    http://www.3dconnexion.com/3dmouse/spacenavigator.php

And, damn, it's cool with Google Earth.

But I really want a Windows version of Descent that would hook into the driver for this thing. That would be _ideal_.

Every 3D input device created over the last 15 years has failed without exception.

May I present the exception: SpaceNavigator. It is nothing like that waving around stuff but a simple knob with sensors detecting the force you apply. I got one some weeks ago and haven't had time to play with it a lot, but even so after some minutes it started to get quite intuitive.

Try a SpaceNavigator, SpacePilot, or SpaceExplorer. The SpaceNavigator is only $59.

http://www.3dconnexion.com/products/3a.php/

like the 3-dimensional navigator SpaceNavigator.

They used to make a product called the Spaceball, but since Logictech bought them, they've moved to space*. Maybe they were afraid of Mel Brooks coming after them for Copyright infringement. :P

http://www.3dconnexion.com/products/3a.php

But the trackball is my favorite 2d product, though the new ones aren't as stable/sturdy as the older ones. I've noticed my new one will occasionally tip, affecting my navigation.

It is amazing what the right input device can do for user experience. If you love Google Earth (or if you do a lot of CAD), you should do yourself a favor and get a 6-degree-of-freedom input device (for about $60). It makes using Google Earth with a mouse feel like using OSX with a keyboard.

Monitor: GVS Panoramic quintuple display. 5x 20", 9600x1200 resolution, or

Zenview Arena, 6 screens, one 2560x1600 and five 1600x1200

Input: 3D motion controller 3DConnexion SpacePilot

check out a spaceball.. amazing for 3d input. http://www.3dconnexion.com/products/3a2.php

It was once envisioned that the mouse would be something you held and moved around in space. It was quickly realized that this was annoying and tiring. Now the best tool we have for moving things in 3 dimensions is the SpaceBall. Oh shit. There goes the planet.

Logitech, under their brand 3DConnexion, has had a 3D mouse for years called the SpaceMouse. As far as I know their SpaceBall (yes that's really the name) is more popular, as you use it and a normal mouse in tandem.

I guess the story here might be that this device is more consumer oriented... And that it seems to suck.

Either way, 3D controls aren't new, they are just not common at home.

http://www.3dconnexion.com/products/3a.php

Any support for these 3D input devices? I mean, there are Linux drivers, but as of yet no open source drivers (to my knowledge) for these devices.

I''ve been trying to find out if it is possible to get the Sharp Actius AL3DU laptop to run 3DS Max in autostereo mode together with a plugin for a 3D haptic input device called the SensAble PHANTOM Omni. It also might be cool to add the 3Dconnexion SpacePilot input device for navigation.

I think this would be the ultimate interface for 3D design. Has anyone had any experience with this? I've been emailing all the companies involved and have gotten responses saying that there are problems with this setup. I'd like to try it out on my own, but putting it together would cost a fortune and I don't want to blow all that cash just to find out it doesn't work.

What's it gona take? The need to traverse 3d space. There exists mice for traversing it already, at this point we're waiting on gui's and apps to justify it (things other than cad's, where they've been in use for many years).

Personal opinion? For the things that a spacemouse-like thing would be useful, we'll just skip it and go to some other UI. I can't imagine someone playing a game using a spacemouse - I say that having actually *used* one, so the uninformed can keep their opinions to themselves :P For a game, we'd only need such a thing for first-person perspective, and I'm sure a 3d environ (sensors on your hands, and on the 3d glasses on your head) would be far more desirable. A spacemouse might be interesting for an overhead-type game, like Everquest or Warcraft/Starcraft, but...perfectly good spacemouse already *exist* that could be used for that. Again, its merely a matter of getting the app/OS to need/use it.

The short: it will take a need for it, and it will take apps and an OS supporting it. The device is already around.

Just to add to the list of already existing devices, there is also the Spaceball.

a space mouse has 6 degrees of freedom and is very useful when working in a "3d" environment such as CAD http://www.3dconnexion.com/products.htm

The company distributes a SDK.

For the older version of these devices, before they were spun off by Logitech - seems they're supported navitely by OpenGL.

From this page.

Linux GLut-OpenGl-X. Glut v3 seems to support the Spaceball directly. Should try aeroplane demo.

I've got a Powermate right here, and though it's a very cool and quite useful gadget, the SpaceTraveler seems to be in a different league.

I think it's a spinoff of the old SGI SpaceBall pointer devices, which allowed for multiple axis input - you can push, pull, and move it left and right. The powermate just turns left and right on a vertical axis and can be pressed as a button. Looking further at their other products, the SpaceBall 5000 looks a lot like the old SGI unit. The SpaceTraveler's just a smaller portable version.

Of course, they don't seem to mention how many axes of input the thing provides on the website, so I dunno.

I've got a Powermate right here, and though it's a very cool and quite useful gadget, the SpaceTraveler seems to be in a different league.

I think it's a spinoff of the old SGI SpaceBall pointer devices, which allowed for multiple axis input - you can push, pull, and move it left and right. The powermate just turns left and right on a vertical axis and can be pressed as a button. Looking further at their other products, the SpaceBall 5000 looks a lot like the old SGI unit. The SpaceTraveler's just a smaller portable version.

Of course, they don't seem to mention how many axes of input the thing provides on the website, so I dunno.

It's a miniture spaceball with a six degree-of-freedom knob and 8 programmable buttons. website picture and pdf.

Looks nice, but the buttons are placed around the rim and look like they'd be easy to confuse because they're identical.

(sorry for using the words spaceball, knob, and rim in this post)

It's a miniture spaceball with a six degree-of-freedom knob and 8 programmable buttons. website picture and pdf.

Looks nice, but the buttons are placed around the rim and look like they'd be easy to confuse because they're identical.

(sorry for using the words spaceball, knob, and rim in this post)

It's a miniture spaceball with a six degree-of-freedom knob and 8 programmable buttons. website picture and pdf.

Looks nice, but the buttons are placed around the rim and look like they'd be easy to confuse because they're identical.

(sorry for using the words spaceball, knob, and rim in this post)

Spaceballs

The CAD guys i used to work with swear by them. A spaceball for their left hand and a mouse for their right. I found them a lil twitchy though, but i guess thats something you can adjust to or just adjust.

You need this if you REALLY want to be cool :)

Take a look at the Magellan Space Mouse, which has an oversize twistable (analog) hat switch. (Granted, they didn't mount it on a mouse, but if mounting an existing device on a mouse makes it patentable, something is seriously broken with our patent system)

You just need a 3D input device like a Spaceball.

Something that handles moving and turning...