Slashdot Mirror
New Microsoft Mouse Scrolls Both Ways
Library Spoff writes "The BBC are reporting that Microsoft are bringing out a mouse that will use the scroll wheel to tilt as well as roll. The innovation means that users will be able to scroll vertically as well as horizontally without using on-screen navigation bars." How long before I get a trackball embedded in my mouse?
Isn't this pretty much the same idea that Apple had some time ago?
Follow your Euro bills at EBT
From Jakob Nielsen's Top Ten Web-Design Mistakes 2002:
3. Horizontal Scrolling
Users hate scrolling left to right. Vertical scrolling seems to be okay, maybe because it's much more common.
Web pages that require horizontal scrolling in standard-sized windows, such as 800x600 pixels, are particularly annoying. For some reason, many websites seem to be optimized for 805-pixel-wide browser windows, even though this resolution is pretty rare and the extra five pixels offer little relative to the annoyance of horizontal scrolling (and the space consumed by the horizontal scrollbar).
So now why do I want this mouse?
John.
I want webpages to be designed like they currently are. For people that use 800x600 or 1024x768 (like they should) there is little need to scroll horizontally.
Let's not allow this to become commonplace. I would prefer that all information is easily seen on a single page.
i already have an ibm mouse that does this. have had it for 3 years
I always knew MS "scrolled both ways" this confirms it!
ok, mod me down, that was terrible, but if i didnt, someoen else wouldve said it!
Well, can you, or do we need yet another button?
after twenty years, they'll develop a mouse that scrolls in and out.
how exciting!
that does Diagonal as well..
The Good Life
Everyone else got one 5 years ago...
...only scrolls to the left.
This sounds cool though, IMO microsofts mice and keyboards are about the best on the consumer level market. Or maybe tied with logitech.
I don't need no instructions to know how to rock!!!!
Is Taco using the story generator again?
this sure will help me keep one hand free while looking at these 1600x1200 "pictures."
First the optical mouse... now the side scroller! Yeah for microsoft, for once.
Of course, if somebody would just make it illegal to have html that needed to scroll left to right... it would save us much more heartache.
Obviously, this is gonna rock in game play...
Davak
Introducing, the Microsoft BiMouse. That Mouse that Scrolls Both Ways (tm)
Beauty is in the eye of the beerholder.
I was browsing thinkgeek and ran across this mouse. Sounds like this is old news.
.. I can bind the new controls to lean left/right in FPSs. :)
I remember reading about such a mouse, with a joystick scroll type thingy in the middle, many years ago. Old news.
ok
1] not many sites need a horizontal scroll.
2] woopty fucking doo! if that's news for nerds, than I must not be one.
YOU SUCK BALLS!
My parents bought a dumbass Radio Shack mouse about 2 or 3 years ago that had a horizontal scroll wheel right under the vertical one. I think it has been used a total of 2 times.
I'd love a "scroll ball button" in place of the "scroll wheel button" I have in the middle of my TrackMan Marble Wheel. Basically it would give me two trackballs on one base, one main one for cursor control that allows for precision because it is large and doesn't click and a smaller one for scrolling that can also act as my middle mouse button (gotta have my X paste!)
I already have a trackball embedded in my trackball embedded in my trackball embedded in my...
Alowing me to navigate the web in an infinity of dimensions.
Roving Web-Teleoperated Robot
Say you have a folder filled with, I don't know, mp3s. Many of them.
Notice how the window's contents are arranged HORIZONTALLY? Seems a horizontal scroll-thingie would me mighty useful in this situation.
Or how about wave editing? It would be nice to mouse-scroll across the waveform HORIZONTALLY.
Just some thoughts.
GeekNights!
Late Night Radio for Geeks!
MAN AT BAR: [coughs conspicuously, smiles]
WOMAN AT BAR: [politely but nervously smiles back]
MAN AT BAR: My, uh, mouse goes both ways, if you know what I mean.
WOMAN AT BAR: [begins to quietly edge away]
As the average time we spend on these machines increases so does the damage to our fingers and wrists.
Also a zero decible CPU and a monitor least stressful on eyes would be nice.
for the last time people, I am "frodo from middle eaRTH", not "middle eaST".
Oh don't troll. This is actually an interesting article. Although this might not be world-shattering it is still a pretty nifty thing. The uses for a trackball in the mouse would incredible for a gamer. Imagine instead of WASD layout you could have all movement and shooting controls on one hand with the other one free for equipment managment and chatting.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
I'd like for Microsoft to bring back the old intellimice. The ones with the big Back/Forward internet buttons. The reduced sized ones they are currently selling are but mere nuisances for my sausage fingers.
All you have to do is hold down the wheel and move to the left and right. At least it works that way in Microsoft's browser...
with the track point in their mice...Here's one!
Now I can finaly tilt left/right in AmercasArmy :). I've been using the scroll wheel for it, but this would be much nicer. Plus I could use the wheel to go prone and stand up instead.
Nice!
Cheers,
Andre
...You mean like the Tecstorm TSOTS1?
= PROD&Store_Code=HO&Product_code=MI14032
http://www.tecstorm.co.uk/tsots1.htm
Another link - http://www.hardwareoptions.com/merchant.mv?Screen
I'd honestly never heard of it before this article, but after reading the idea of a mouse with a trackball in it, the idea seemed intriguing, so I did a quick Google for "trackball in mouse" and found that one... Looks interesting... Anyone ever used one?
Never ask a geek why, just nod your head and slowly back away. -Rob Malda
i bought a dual scroll wheel mouse like 4-5 years ago for $6 on sale at radio shaft. even has a third button. only problem is that they dont have win2k/xp drivers for it, hehe. only works win9x.
i sell illegal drugs
I used to have a mouse that had two scroll wheels on it, and that was 5+ years ago. I used it for both horizontal and vertical scrolling (though it was configurable what you could actually do with it).
Also, in some linux toolkits (gtk I believe, possibly others), you can scroll any scrollbar (no matter what direction it's in) just by putting the mouse over it and scrolling.
For example, in gaim, if your buddy list has a horizontal scrollbar, you can scroll horizontally by putting the mouse over the horizontal scrollbar and scrolling. Even better, it doesn't even have to be a scrollbar: on the experimental bittorrent client, you can scroll the little frob that controls the maximum number of uploads this way.
Fun stuff! I see little point in providing a hardware solution to a problem that was solved with software long, long ago.
Wow, Another 5 years or so and they will have the trackball.
MoFscker
Unless you have a really pathetic resolution.
Do what my logitech scroll mouse on OS X does. Scroll regularly for vertical and in those rare cases, press shift to scroll horizontally.
The innovation means that users will be able to scroll vertically as well as horizontally without using on-screen navigation bars.
Need I say more? This is a hardware solution for a software problem.
Whats next? WWW and email buttons on my computer? How about a Windows key to get in your way every time you go to use the left control?
When I was a windows developer (I've reformed), I got really loaded on coffee and hot chocolate mix and actually pulled the damned windows key off of my keyboard, drilled a hole in my office wall, and shoved it in there.
OK, what is this mouse for?
I've used a coulple of programs where, if you put the cursor over the horizontal bar, the wheel moves things in a left-right manner.
Or is that still too much movement. Are the lusers THAT lazy?
Should be great for RSI. Not. I find using the keyboard for paging feels better than that wheel over time. No serious RSI yet though.
Up and down! But seriously... it'd better either roll both ways or tilt both ways, otherwise it's not terribly intuitive.
Though this isn't a new idea, it is a good one, IMHO. For some reason most of the comments have been about web pages, and though not an especially useful feature for those, it would be very handy with spreadsheets, databases and graphic design tools. I use my scroll button quite a bit and would like to be able to horizontally scroll in such applications. I'm sure this feature would apply to many more apps.
So now when I open up those 5MP porn images I can see all of it easily without having to use two hands...yummmmmm
Sig & Below
Yuck Fou
And how long until your embedded trackball has another mouse embedded in it?
my fingers dont do horizontal bending when on a mouse. its that simple. they bend sort of front to back when on a mouse, which is convienent for a vertical scroll, not a horizontal one.
i do think it would work for the thumb, tho...
i sell illegal drugs
How long before I get a trackball embedded in my mouse?
Depends on how fast you can click this link and order this mouse.
~Philly
1) Create a browser sensitive to page widening
2) Create a mouse that scrolls widened pages
3) PROFIT!!!
(Sorry - I know I should be shot now)
BSD is designed. Linux is grown. C++ libs
Another bonus feature of this new mouse is that is only clicks Microsoft programs and products.
For your safety, the mouse will not open any programs that Microsoft doesn't make money off of. It could be a virus.
Furthermore, whenever you do click a Microsoft product, the mouse will waste your bandwidth be automatically connecting the internet, contacting Microsoft, and checking all your serial numbers to make sure your licenses are up to date.
Then, if you have old software that has an update release from Microsoft, the mouse will open a browser where you can download updates (for a fee of course).
Then to save you the hassle, the mouse will move the cursor over the Download Updates link and click for you, automatically charging your credit card.
We hope you enjoy your new Microsoft mouse with added features. And don't forget to sign your EULA before opening the package.
Slashdot Syndrome: the sudden, extreme urge to correct someone in order to validate one's self.
Will it come with linux and BSD drivers?
A ballsy mouse!
HEY!!! ....
SCO has the exclusive copyright on the multi-scrolling mouse. Prepared for exortion!!!!
Oh, wait, is that you Mr. Gates? Sorry, we didn't mean to.. eh.. we just got a bit carried away, yes, we do remember, oh please let's still be friends.. it'll never, ever happen again.... sorry
Oh yeah, you should have to use two hands to scroll sideways. How innovative of them.
Whoops - that would be the sift key that makes my scroll wheel work horizontally, not the command key. Still, though, why put another wheel/button on the mouse if it has already been solved quite elegantly with existing input devices? Virtually everyone I notice keeps at least one key on the keyboard, so the shift key modifier seems easiest.
I have two complaints about this:
1. It's already hard enough to "scroll" the damn things vertically without accidently "pressing" it and thats using fingers with knuckles that are the result millions of years of evolution to facilitate such tasks.
2. This will encourage even more of those foul evil UI-nightmare horizontal scrollbars. And as I have a policy of not buying MS products that means my fingers will ache.
One of the reasons the scroll wheel is successful is because it's comfortable.
Why? Your knuckles allow your finget to curl with your finger remaining parallel to the side of your hand.
However, a side scrolling wheel requires either
(i) an awful lot of play in your knuckles, allowing you to curl them to be non-parallel with the side of your hand, or
(ii) bending the wrist to move your entire hand side-to-side.
Neither is particularly comfortable, and both result in sore hand parts quite quickly. I predict that this will never be used much... too tough on the hands.
Support a few technologists in Washington.
I've been asking for a trackball in a mouse for a long time. It'd make working with large OrCAD and AutoCAD files alot easier.
If you think education is expensive, you should try ignorance -- Derek Bok, president of Harvard
IBM had a scrolling mouse with one of those notebook pointing devices that hung out between the g and h keys on the keyboard.
It worked well. I miss that mouse. I like the fact the harder you pushed it the faster it scrolled.
Wouldn't it just be easier to use a trackball?
I mean, with this new mouse you still have to move the thing around in order to move the pointer. You get full X and Y axis movement using a trackball now and it remains in the same place on your desk. You don't even need to clear your collection of empty RedBull cans in order to use it.
Plus, its easlier to play FPS using a trackball.
Cruising the internet on my TI-99/4A @ a whopping 300 baud!
I have a Kingston mouse that does the exact same thing. it has two scroll wheels and it rocks my world. Although I don't use it on my windows machine, this mouse hasn't given me a single problem in the 2 years I've had it. It still has it's smooth as silk glide, where all others would have gummed up.
"It's the little touches that make a future solid enough to be destroyed" --William S. Bourroughs
TROLL? (Sorry, I had to!)
Linux: Helping nerds look smarter since the late 90s.
New Microsoft Mouse Scrolls Both Ways
Sweet! Does this mean we'll finally get some mouse-on-mouse action?
NO CARRIER
And here I thought keyboards already allowed them to do this.
from the yes-i-said-it dept
Whatever.
Next.
what are they gonna put a fricken track ball as the middle button? besides my mouse already does that if you click the middle button. not to mention that fewer and fewer webpages need to be horizontally scrolled anyways. they are probably going to charge 10 bux more for it and make ie require it to work. spooty spoot heads.
Trust Your Technolust
Because it's done by M$? Because it's done via "tilting"? 4-D mice are not new.
2 wheels
1 wheel (presumably via kybd modifier)
a trackball
Move along, people, nothing to see here. Please, go back to slamming Real or something much more important.
I know you were joking, but I want my Karma, so I'm going to reiterate your post in a serious tone.
Hey guys!
I see many replies about other mice with second scroll wheels or a built in trackball.
This mouse let's you TILT the scroll wheel. That is the innovative part here. And personally I think that's gonna be much more usable than a second scroll wheel or a trackball on your mouse.
Cheers,
Andre
One button mouse, two button mouse, scroll wheel, scroll wheel that clicks, now two direcition scroll wheel, Taco's suggestion of the trackball in the mouse...
...why not just put the whole fscking keyboard on my mouse?
Oh, I guess they already have it.
Most mice with a scroll wheel allow it to act as a button. When pressed you can then scroll in any direction using the mouse.
That's not the point.
The point is making it more efficient. Why in hell would I want to have to reach over to the keyboard and find a key when I could easily just lift a finger?
If you don't want it, don't buy it.
"Moderate drinking can help prevent amputated limbs" -- Abigail Zuger, NYTimes, 12/31/02
THere are dual wheel mice, that have a horizontal and a vertical wheel... sheesh.
how does this make any page of slashdot, let alone front?
"Champagne for my real friends - and real pain for my sham friends!" http://ericblade.postalboard.com/
The little red nipple/eraser in the middle of my thinkpad keyboard allows me to scroll vertically and horizontally using the middle 'mouse' button. So... why is this news?
I guess trackpoing is the official title, not nipple/eraser.
Good news!! Joe Blow consumer can now crash his computer in a new and exciting way. I hope this mouse comes in colors.
Harpo Tunnel Syndrome--my wrist feels funny.
so whats new! but an advert for the antichrist AARRR
while(karma less_than enough_karma){karma++}
I wish I could do this on my Macintosh with my generic two-button scoll mouse.
Oh, wait (holds down command key) I can scroll horizontally. In any application. With no new drivers, equipment, or fuss.
Yay for Mac OS X, I guess. What's the big deal again?
Why is it that whenever a company people dislike (with good reason in this case) releases some new technology, everybody jumps to show that their new technology is stupid, or redundant, or both? You can be sure that if Apple released this exact same product, people like you would be extolling its virtues.
So yay, it's a new mouse idea, and maybe it will catch on and prove useful in some areas (like a large spreadsheet maybe, where you need horizontal scrolling and may already be employing your command key). Maybe then a company that we find agreeable will make a similar product and we can all go and buy our new dual-scrolling mouse.
My roommate bought an optical mouse that does this one year ago, at Target. Let's hear it for innovation!
Do not read this sig.
Just remember...if it's not supported under Ninnle, it's probably not worth having.
Eraser-head poinrer you say? We always called this... well, I can't tell you what we called it because I'm at work. Use your imagination, dude!
I had the same reaction to this that I did when I first heard about the wheel mouse: "what a dumb idea. I'm never going to use it."
Of course now, x years later, I can't live without that little wheel. It's made a huge difference in the way I use my computer, no lie. (And of course it's great in games.)
Like anything, all it requires is a killer app.
If there's any SCO code in there that MS bought from SCO...
I'm not a prophet or a stone-age man,
I'm just a mortal with potential of a super man.
...claiming they thought of this first and threatening to sue current mouse users for owning Microsoft mice.
You is good at grammar.
Welcome to the net of 1000 lies. Upgrades are scheduled soon that should bring us to the 10,000 lies mark.
IOGear already has something like this. Check it out at ThinkGeek.com: http://www.thinkgeek.com/computing/input/keyboards /5e45/
Tilts both ways...bats both ways. Get it?
Sorry, it's been a long day...
So this is like... a mouse on top of a mouse?
So it's a bi-directional mouse that swings both ways.....interesting.....
I wonder if we'll see discrimination lawsuits against companies that only provide uni-directional mice.
That (http://www.tecstorm.co.uk/tsots1.htm) has got to be one of the worst web pages ever. Neve mind the design (I didn't even notice I was so distracted), but the whole f'in page is image squares! What kind of brainless manager found out how to use imageready or some such image slicing program and came up with that?
Ugh.
This has always been an annoyance to me, that I cannot scroll horizontally easily.
I quickly figured out an easy remidy though... set your middle-click to pan around.
So, while this is kinda neat... it's not a necessity.
no comment
You mean up and down?
Analogies don't equal equalities, they are merely somewhat analogous.
This is nothing new. That it gets reported as an 'innovation' by the BBC is a bit ridiculous.
One more technology that Micro$oft will "invent" that really was created well before them by someone else.
A better description would be Micro$oft is 'popularizing' or 'marketting' or 'giving a nod' to 2-axis scrolling. Certainly there is no 'innovation' here.
IBM has had horizontal scroll for years now.
ScrollPoint Pro 800
I want webpages to be designed like they currently are.
Y'know, some people actually use their computers for more than just web browsing. And there are other applications besides web browsers that use horizontal scrollbars! Strange, I know, but true.
I have one of these IBM Scrollpoint mice at work and I love the thing. I never cared for the scrollpoint as a pointing device on a laptop but it works great on a mouse for scrolling in either direction, heck if I'm looking at a large image in a browser I can even scroll diagonally. Trying to tilt the wheel on at new MS one and roll it at the same time would be more dificult I think.
Troll he certainly was. Raises the "slashdot payola" accusation again. I'm assuming the answer to that question is still no?
-Looking for a job as a materials chemist or multivariat
Maybe this will eliminate the traditional insult among FPS geeks? We'll have to invent a new one.
Nah, I don't know about you, but I'd rather keep my middle finger. I like the WASD combination anyway, keeps the continual stress on my hands balanced.
Ibm had this at least 3-4 years ago with their Scrollpoint Mouse. It's gone through a bunch of iterations, but it's always had that functionality.
Good thing SCO didn't have this first...or did they?
There are 01 types of people in this world. Those that understand binary, and me.
Agreed. But the Brits just discovered oral hygine so what do you expect?
I don't need a horizontal mouse... I just turn my monitor on its side!
bytesmythe
Hypocrisy is the resin that holds the plywood of society together.
-- Scott Meyer
...on my IBM ThinkPad -- if I press the conveniently placed middle mouse button, the trackpoint turns into a multi-directional scroller. I can 'tilt' it left and right to scroll horizontally, up and down for vertically.
"!"
[Logitech] also questioned Microsoft's decision to stop scroll wheels clicking as they are spun back and forth
!!!!!!!!!
The clicky feel of the scrollwheel is the one of the finest things on this Earth! How can Microsoft even contemplate dropping that. Though Logitech has always done it better (I love my Trackman Wheel so much)
Trees can't go dancing
So do them a big favor
Pretend dancing stinks!
They exist. The one I have in my hand now (no, the other hand...) was made by a company calling themself Starlogic, although I think they went out of business even before I bought mine from Circuit City for $8 last November. Google on Starlogic, trackball and mouse and you'll get lots of hits. There's even a couple on e-bay, but be warned, like most stuff on e-bay (I.M.H.O.) this is a scam - the mouse is showing currently at 99 cents, but the bastard will charge you 12 bucks shipping to send it to you if you "win".
I'm an American. I love this country and the freedoms that we used to have.
since the day i got my intellimouse explorer, i've had it set to scroll up/down as i move the scroll wheel (duh), and to scroll left/right as a move the scroll wheel while holding shift. it's VERY useful, *especially* for the websites made by morons that are too wide (the morons and the sites)
dude, I have a mouse with this "new feature" that connected through a SERIAL PORT. That alone should tell you how old this idea is.
1q2w3e4r5t6y7u8i9o0pqawsedrftgthyjukilo;p'azsxdcf
...is sure to create a schism in the Church of the User Interface Designers.
Two extra bindable buttons, Wow. a horizontal scroll would kick-ass for gaming. w00t!
I wonder though will you be able to scroll both at one? Diagonal scrolling?
/.ers lucky enough to use IBM Thinkpads can use the third mouse button to activate scrolling capability for the keyboard mounted TrackPoint. Interestingly, this works better than mouse mounted TrackPoint because you don't have to work to keep the keyboard still as you scroll.
As others have noted elsewhere in this discussion, there isn't nearly as much use for the side to side scrolling as the up/down. It is useful for navigating spreadsheets and large graphics files.
PS I know there is no such mod as CORRECT. However, that doesn't mean that there shouldn't be.
Lasers Controlled Games!
Like those little rubber thingies in the middle of a laptop keyboard, only put it on the mouse instead.
Hmmm a joystick stuck on a mouse base.. the sort of things you dream up during a college party after you have had too much beer.
I supposed they patented this 'innovation'..
---- Booth was a patriot ----
I don't see why this is news. Just take a look here for oodles of dual-wheel mice. A) this is not "innovative" and B) Even if it were a new concept, why would it be on Slashdot?
rooooar
I like the scroll wheel, but to use it as a button on some models you have to press it directly down from the very center or it will slip'n'scroll [instead of|in addition to] pressing. Adding the horizontal pivot factor in would make me a little nervous about trying to press the middle button. Like trying to jump on a balloon wearing rollerblades.
I use my scroll wheel all the time, as I'm sure most of us do, but wouldn't a "joystick" be a better solution?
... and I have a Logitech trackball mouse... of course the trackball is for moving the cursor, not scrolling, but meh.
You can move it in different ways, and you don't have to "scroll, move finger to top, scroll, move finger to top..." over and over, you just hold down, or left, or right, or up.
This is nothing new, there's one at ThinkGeek for $17.99 from IOGear. I have it and it works fairly well, except for the fact that no Linux application recognizes horizontal scrollage. Fortunately, I still get use out of the trackball, since the mouse can switch in hardware to 'trackball' mode, where the trackball and the mouse proper switch roles. Moving the mouse up and down to scroll is a lot easier than twiddling a roller or a ball.
i've got a four button mouse from a year and a half ago that will copy/paste/minimize/alt+tab... and you can set it up on any of the buttons.
Wow, I'm rather impressed. So far we haven't been ablt to /. Microsoft yet. Next time Microsoft, we will get you...and your little dog too!!!
Life is not for the lazy.
I have seen this feature on several mice from IBM. Essentially, they mount a large pointing stick (like the ones used on ThinkPads, only 5x the size) in place of a scroll wheel on the mouse, and you can scroll in any direction.
IBM currently sells two mice which feature this. However, they have sold mice with this function for several years (I believe I first saw them over 5 years ago).
This isn't new news. However, it is a great step forward, as I love the conveinence 2-dimensional scrolling provides
-- If you try to fail and succeed, which have you done? - Uli's moose
It might not be a bad idea to add a toggle switch to
utilize the vertical wheel for horizontal movement. The vertical wheel would be much easier to control than a horizontally placed wheel.
The best thing about such an implementation would be that it can be done with modifications to the system's drivers. It could be possible to use the second button as a toggle.
pseudocode:
if mouse.button2 && mouse.button4:
mouse.button6=1
elif mouse.button2 && mouse.button5:
mouse.button7=1
I have been using this mouse for over two years, and there is no stupit tilting or rolling required, you just sliiide your finger a bit.
(Sorry for the PDF link, there was no other decent picture to be found.)
my
Nowdays there are different weapons and different ammos. Counter-Strike will more comfortable to play.
Who scrolls horizontally??
Another fine product concocted without market research... Next: the Diagonal scrolling mouse.
The power of Christ compiles you!
i can scroll vertically anyway, i just hold it down and move it to the right/left, just how is this 'new' idea supposed to help me out further?
In Mac OS X, if you hold down the shift key and scroll with your mouse, it scrolls side-to-side.
Why is this newsworthy? My MSMouse already scrolls horizontally -- if you click with the wheel, you get a cursor with arrows in the direction that the page is available to scroll in. This has been built into the software for at least a couple of years......
...we are from the government - we are here to help...
"How long before I get a trackball embedded in my mouse?"
a company called iogear make a mouse with a trackball for scrolling.
www.iogear.com
GME421
lose != loose
New Microsoft Mouse Scrolls Both Ways
IBM are going to roger SCO to death and people really care about this stuff?
It's not exactly groundbreaking stuff. I'll bet every third person has looked at a wheel mouse and wondered why they don't scroll left and right as well. I know I have.
I guess this is what passes for inovation at MS.
http://a4tech.com/EN/product3.asp?CID=1&SCID=8&MNO =WOP-35
I don't see it as an innovation at all, particularly since I'm sitting here using a "Starlogic" optical mouse with a track ball built into the top that lets me scroll horizontal, vertical, or any combination of the two. I got it for 8 bucks last November at Circuit City. I think the company went under, but the devices still exist (beware extremely inflated shipping charges on e-bay).
I'm an American. I love this country and the freedoms that we used to have.
...legal in Hawaii and Canada.
"The greatest obstacle to discovery is not ignorance - it is the illusion of knowledge." - Daniel Boorstin
You need this if you REALLY want to be cool :)
They can do a lot more than that.
Old idea. The had it as a stick and not a wheel. The mouse broke down (dang moving parts) and I started to have troubles finding drivers to support it.
Good old MickeySoft claiming innovation off someone elses idea.
like my thinkpad has. I hate rolling the scroll wheel over and over again.. Why can't I just push on it????
And while it supports mice, I find them to be extraneous.
"The humble computer mouse is about to move in a whole new direction"
Come on. There have been 4D (two scroll wheels) mice for a while, and the IBM trackpoint mouse, and trackball mice.
The IBM mice were usually made by Logitech, they are high quality.
The only thing this shows is the skill of MS's marketing deparment in ignoring previous products completely and claiming they have something new. Yeah, it's a little different from other mice techniques to get this done, but it isn't something revolutionary.
That's it, Microsoft is gay.
No, really. Their mouse goes both ways, their products have lots of loose back doors...
Somebody get that guy an ambulance!
Why can't I just turn my mouse 90 degrees and use the wheel?
This post cannot be rebroadcast without the express written constent of Major League Baseball.
I worked with an IBM mouse that had a small "J" button on it, it worked in the four major directions to scroll not only up and down, but side to side as well.
But I can't find it now so I may have been dreaming.
So rise up, all ye lost ones, as one, we'll claw the clouds.
It depends on the effect that you want to achieve. I've see a few websites that have really wide formats - on purpose. It tells me that for most things, vertical scrolling is fine, but certainly don't restrict the medium ti vertical scrolling because Jakob Nielsen says most people hate scrolling left to right. There's generally two reasons for this - one is people are not used to it, and the second is that they didn't have a way to do it (since most scroll wheels only goes vertically).
A good example of a horizontal scrolling is the image of the UNIX/LINUX genealogy.
Why limit yourself?
The BBC IS reporting that microsoft IS.....
http://www.clasohlson.se/images/products/S/hi/B/32 4086_Xw2.jpg
Very often in CounterStrike you come to a position where your crosshair is just -slightly- to the side of someones head, where gross wrist motion will take your aim too far to the other side to hit them. I think the ultimate combo would be a normal mouse with the sensativity cranked way up for moving and quick turning, and a trackball with a lower sensativity used for precise aiming/adjustments.
http://www.idg.co.nz/magazine/pcworld/feb98/ibmmou se.htm
scrolling up/down and left/right - isn't that a trackball ?
How long before I get a trackball embedded in my mouse?
You've been able to get the Typhoon "8D Scoll Ball Mouse" here in Europe for a while now, it's a mouse with a build-in trackball.
You can either use it as a mouse (the trackball will function as a 4-way scroll wheel) or a trackball by switching it over with middle-button left or right.
It's cheap too, about 12 euro at lidl (budget supermarket).
A lot of other people have it too --
IBM for one has this 'trackpoint' which can be used to scroll anydirection on a plane
So does the 'Scratchpad' invention - what new does this thing offer?
... I guess it could be described as bidirectional.
bar this is the way to go
Sorry. It was meant to be a reply to this post
Linux user since early January 1992.
I think this is a terrible idea. I think a better idea would be to change the mouse driver so that when you click and hold the middle (scroll wheel) button and move the mouse, it moves the window content.
I'd rather see them add a second ball to my trackball instead of a scroll-wheel. Now THAT would rock!
I've seen mice with two wheels, one for horiz and one for vert at Best Buy.
As good as this may all be, I will never give up my Razer Boomslang. At 1000/2000/2500 dpi, it's the best thing going for input. Sounds totally gratuitous, but for graphic design and counter-strike, I don't leave home without it.
To read more:
www.razerzone.com
I have an IBM Scrollpoint mouse here that I've had
for a couple of years, that lets you scroll both horizontally and vertically, without using the on-screen navigation bars.
Granted, it isn't exactly like the MS mouse being described, since it doesn't have a wheel, but a stick (ala the Thinkpad "J stick").... but it's hardly a huge innovation to use the wheel to scroll horizontally.
// TODO: Insert Cool Sig
Interesting. I have a scroll mouse from a company called Starlogic. Waranty is useless, I could never even find the company or get a response from their e-mail address, and they had no web site, just an e-mail addreess. The photo you posted a link to shows the exact same mouse as I have, except that the photo shows some name painted on the back of the mouse, (mine is just black there). Interesting mouse, but the trackball only worked for a few months, then started getting erratic (you move one way, the page moves the wrong way at first). I see this "new" mouse claims a 3 year warranty, but I can't even avail myself of the 1 year warranty I supposedly have. I would suggest not getting a mouse from someone who's business model is to fold up the tent every and now and then and show up selling the same thing under a diferent name later.
I'm an American. I love this country and the freedoms that we used to have.
No "In SOVIET RUSSIA the mouse scrolls you" post?
My laptop's touchpad supported this for about two years now.
25000 dpi.. lol
so long as there are people who believe whatevers written on the back of the box, there will always be money to made.
Then buy one.
I've always found it interesting that MS hardware is so much better than its software. It seems like that's a strong piece of evidence that it lacks sufficient competition in the software market. In hardware, MS has to contend with quality goods from established players like Logitech--companies it can't just run into the ground by changing a standard. The software world has no such established competitors to force MS to provide the same level of quality control for products like Windows.
An interesting anagram of "BANACH TARSKI" is "BANACH TARSKI BANACH TARSKI"
My middle finger is dextrous enough...
all this exercise is going to make it that much easier to emote my four-letter answer to just about everything
Let me be the first to say that male mice already have 2 balls.
'mmmmmmmmm.... forbidden donut'
Bink.nu has some REALLY big pictures of the new Intellimice on their site, and there are some more reasonable-sized images at warp2search.
For more information, click here.
Instead of embedding a trackball or a tilting wheel in your mouse, use two different mice/trackballs. My current setup has a mouse on the right and a trackball on the left so that my hands can *never* get tired from using one or the other. Adding an option so that one of them could move me within focused windows would probably be a good convenience.
Making it a "standard convenience" to have two would open up other options for control, also. One control could move the cursor with lower sensitivity than the other, for example.
The mouse will come in 2 flavors:
Genuine leather and vanilla plastic
Check my site: http://pixel.pagina.nl
You're off by an order of 10...
I said 2,500 dpi not 25,000 dpi.
It sounds like you're the kind of person I'd be happy to meet in an online arena - more score padding.
Per-pixel movement at 1600x1200 makes a difference in high-end situations. If you owned one, you'd understand better. Optical mice only get 400-450 dpi.
So this is essentially (or could become soon) a trackball embedded in a mouse. But the mouse and the trackball do not agree on the sense of motion. Moving the mouse to the right moves the pointer to right, but moving the trackball to the right moves the image to the left. This sounds like a recipe for confusing users. Futhermore, the pointer position relative to the document now depends on two controls, and scrolling becomes a tricky task of managing the rolling of the trackball in a moving mouse. There are so many better UI ways to allow efficient finding of data than the double mis-direction of a trackball and mouse.
As if thousands of people didn't think of the same thing before. The next obvious logical step to most people, but it takes MS years to figure it out.
What would really make sense is having the two buttons be button/wheels, where the left button-wheel controls up/down and the right button-wheel controls pgup/pgdn.
social sciences can never use experience to verify their statemen
While the wired version of this mouse may be cool, I'll let a few others buy the wireless before I go out and grab one. Microsoft's last venture with the "Wireless Blue Mouse" was a horrible flop... the thing ate my batteries down weekly, and wouldn't work more than 3" from the receiver (hell, sometimes right beside the receiver it didn't register clicks).
Now, go back to the good ol' days, and MS was actually competing nicely with logitech for mice. They actually did have some good hardware then (decent keyboards too). In short, wait until a few reviews come out before you go and grab one, but don't bash it just because it's MS because they do have some decent hardware, and at least you can expect the OS to support the crazy little features it might have.
Mine was packaged as a "Starlogic" brand. 1 Year Warranty. No website for Starlogic, just an e-mail address that never responds. From the photos it's clearly the same mouse, with the only difference being mine doesn't have IOGEAR written on it's back.
Have you figured out how to open the ball? Those two holes on the sides of the retaining ring make it look like that ring should screw off or otherwise easily remove, but I haven't been able to get mine to even try cleaning under there yet. You're not the only one who is having problems with the erratic ball scroll motion.
I'm an American. I love this country and the freedoms that we used to have.
How long until I get a trackball embedded in my mouse?
Try turning the mouse over.
I have a mouse that I got on clearance at Staples that has both a horizontal and a vertical scroll wheel. Getting drivers for it for anything other than Win95 was a pain, and I finally found some half-@$$ ones for XP that are ok. The only reason I was disappointed with this mouse was the fact that the current software treats the horizontal scroll bar, if there is one, as a vertical bar, if that doesn't exist. Maybe this is a Windows API problem, or maybe this is a workaround for mice that only have one wheel. I would actually use the horizontal wheel if it worked in more stuff.
I love the fact that people make a big deal out of this, and how Apple has done it before, and that maybe some others have done it before, but it's news because M$ is doing it now. At least now maybe the horizontal wheel I have might actually work, since I'll be able to just grab a usable Intellimouse driver from M$ to use on my existing mouse.
If you hold ALT and scroll up and down you will move through your browsers history, at least on the Mozilla family.
...so fu(ing what?
-- Liberalism is a mental disorder.
You dumb fuck, this is innovative. The wheel actually tilts.
First of all, you spelled grammar incorrectly. Check your own spelling and grammar before you criticize others, hypocrite. Secondly, the author's opening phrase "The BBC are reporting that Microsoft are..." is standard British usage. Whenever the British refer to groups, such as companies or sports teams, they always treat them as plural nouns.
,etc.
From their point of view, the American usage is incorrect. For my part, I think their way is more consistent. The American rule of thumb seems to be "if a noun sounds singular, treat it as singular; if it sounds plural, treat it as plural." For example: "The Chicago Bulls are terrible"; "Chicago is bad." Both sentences refer to the same entity, the Chicago Bulls, but the first sentence treats "Chicago Bulls" as a plural noun and the second one treats "Chicago" as a singular noun. The Brits on the other hand, would say: "The Chicago Bulls are terrible"; "Chicago are bad". It sounds funny to American/Canadian ears, but it seems more consistent to me.
If you don't believe, just listen to British football (soccer) commentators next time you have a chance: "Manchester U are...", "Liverpool are..."
Before you tell me that their way is wrong, just think about which country is older, the origins of the English language, and ancestry of most Americans. Personally, I don't think either way is "incorrect". The British have one set of grammatical rules and Americans have another. Just like Americans insist on spelling "favour", "colour", etc. differently from British people and Canadians.
Malda is strictly a homo, and a bottom at that.
That buck-toothed skank is just a beard.
...the mouse scrolls YOU!!!
Not entirely relevant, but... I discovered in OS X that the mouse wheel scrolls horizontally if you hold the Shift key. This is very useful, and I probably prefer it to an extra mechanism on the mouse that I'll undoubtedly activate unintentionally. I don't know if this functionality exists in other OS's (though it doesn't appear to be in W2K).
My Co-worker has had his mouse that scrolls "Both" Ways for over a year now. I guess Microsoft say's that since this mouse was viewed using their browser they must own the patent.
I know from previous posting and links Apple applied for a patent for this type of mouse long ago. Does this mean Micro$oft will take credit for someone else's ideas as they have in the past and still. ;-) )
Consumer: would you rather have a poorly engineered mouse that has these new functions that is propietary and limited support. Or a product that is build based on a standard that numerous sources can support (ie. Open Source).
Useability: Many of you stated and questioned the use of such a mouse... here are some ideas.
CAD applications
Excel (cell browsing
Games... (strafing for one...)
Programming- instead of using your hand and wrist to scroll through long lines of code.
Also Notice in all these articles (not that i have read) none of them state wether or not the mouse is instead to be stationary or laser or other form. I would like to hear more of the communities intelligent opinions on the usability and functionality of such an item and wether or not they think it will be adopted in the near or far future.
That allows you to scroll up/down and left/right Maybe not as "user friendly" (it wasn't really precise) but pretty much the same idea...
-- Leeeter than leet
The ScrollPoint mouse uses a TrackPoint stick rather than a roll which allows for horizontal and vertical scrolling as well as continuous scrolling with having to constantly re-roll the mouse wheel. I have had a ScrollPoint for at least 2 and half years, maybe longer ...
P.S. I have the older a ball-based version, but the link points to the newer optical version.
How long before I get a trackball embedded in my mouse?
It'll be there in 5...4...3...2...
Whaddyamean it didn't show up? Hmm... problem must be on your side, it faxed out just fine from here.
I assert that my comment is only my opinion, not that of any employer, past, present or future.
This is not to say I would recommend that mouse, even though when it works it's very pleasant to use. I am on my third one. The first developed a problem where the cursor would jump to the corner of the screen too frequently. The second just stopped working completely. Both were replaced for free by CompUSA. All of them had or have a problem where the cursor jumps to a corner of the screen on dark surfaces or when the surface isn't just right. (I would much prefer that they were instead programmed just to refuse move under these marginal conditions - corner jumping is a pain when you're say trying to edit an image in GIMP or Photoshop.) My third unit now sometimes just dies, even if I unplug and plug the USB connector, until I reboot my VAIO laptop. I'm not sure if it's a hardward or software problem, but it does seem to be more prone to dying when XP starts to otherwise decay (you know, frozen programs that can't be killed etc.), requiring a reboot anyway (actually a hard power down reboot, because the programs can't be killed so it will never shut down).
Other than that, I like this little mouse.
These IBM mice are called ScrollPoint and they are still being made. I am using a recent optical version right now. These are my favorite mice and I had to order mine from US (those are only available here in Europe with a complete system from IBM)
What force to counteract? When I am using a mouse, the back of my hand still touches the tabletop, so pulling this hand away by moving the same is equivalent to pulling yourself up by the ears.
I find those mice a much better idea than the Microsoft-style wheeled mice, because:
1. You can also scroll horizontally.
2. If you want to keep scrolling, just push the stick into desired direction and hold. With a wheel, you have to keep scrolling. The harder you push the stick, the faster you scroll. Wheeled mice are only good for contant-speed scrolling.
3. I still have a full-width middle button. Your typical mouse wheel is not really a very convinient button for prolonged use (say, paste in X)
The mice are very well made and look cool, especially that blue LED backlight inside the little stick. (which is quite a bit larger and more comfortable too than the little clit they put onto laptop's keyboards)
Overall, I'd rate the ScrollPoint as one of the most significant advancements in HCI, to which effect it also won some awards. As usual, IBM can neither hype it properly themselves, nor make the related patents properly accessible to other manufacturers.
Yeah, title says it all. I just wanted to plug http://www.fingerworks.com/ for their incredibly good Touchstream Keyboards, that support very natural horisontal and vertical scrolling without taking your fingers off the home row!
Slashdot. It's Not For Common Sense
geez, all you need to do w/ konqueror is scroll near the bottom of a page, and it will do the horizontal mombo.
Memo to Redmond: Get on to Pete Townsend pronto and buy the licence to Pinball Wizard. What a launch we'll have ! We'll call it Tilting at Windows
How long before I get a trackball embedded in my mouse?
JUST the story please. We don't need to hear your uneducated and faggoty remarks Taco.
Oh, and for those of you that are unfortunate enough to not live in the USA, faggot means REALLY GAY.
This is not new A4Tech mouses have had this ability for 3 years or more now. And they are good mice as well, as I have been using one for 3 years now! Go buy an A4 Mouse if this intrest you, dont buy the Microsoft one!
why not just go the whole distance and put a nipple-maus there to act as an all-directional scrool wheel?
if the answer isn't violence, neither is your silence / freedom of expression doesn't make it alright
Those are called Spaceballs, oddly enough...
DNA just wants to be free...
I got one with my Aptiva freshmen year.
Didn't really like it, but it did scroll in four directions.
This is nothing special...
We will have to License the mouse as opposed to purchasing it.
Upon installation, it will need Product Activation and an internet connection.
It will be Trusted, so you won't be able to click on those MP3s.
For $10,000 you can see inside of it in through Sharing program for governments.
Oh yeah, and Linux driver support: out of the question...
Sounds like a winner to me!
IBM Scrollpoint II did this at least 3 years ago. I got one with my Aptiva in my freshmen year of college.
Didn't really like it, but it did scroll in four directions.
And this is with just the middle scroller, no modifier key required, no second scroller, etc.
So really, as others have said, THIS IS STILL NOTHING SPECIAL.
Seems to be part of the continuing trend that everything from the default Windows directory structure to the MMC interface to just about all their documentation uses an identifier that is closer to a sentence than a name.
The help documentation (CHM files) are particularly amusing. When a help file is opened, the default size is maybe 150 or so pixels in width. Works for the first page, but once you start reading content, you find the need to go full screen to accommodate the page. Even with that, the TOC never fits.
Could be that this the cause for this lies somewhere between accomodating user preferences (read "stupidity") to poorly thought out (read "bad") design. There are very few programs that deserve an expansive chunk of screen real estate. That said, most everything else should be made to fit without having to scroll horizontally.
You must be new here.
This is ridiculous. Scroll wheels, scroll nipples, and embedded trackballs are a tendon-pain-inducing and unnecessarily complex and kludgey way to implement a hardware interface for scrolling. I second the suggestion of this guy, who would rather have a "grab button" on his mouse. Hold down the "grab" button, and you can scroll the contents of the focused (or perhaps the under-the-mouse) content by dragging in whatever direction you like. I used to have something like this rigged on my old Mac with Scrollability (shareware) and in OS X with uControl (GPL'd). I found both solutions far more comfortable than my scroll wheel, though I'd love to see this supported more seamlessly (e.g., scroll more smoothly, work everywhere (even in graphics programs), and don't make me kludge it together with mouse-button-triggered modifier keys). After all, we already have one perfectly good tracking device; why stack another tracking device on top of it? This solution should work even on trackballs. Whadday'all think?
Here it is, shared free of charge, for the benefict of all mankind, the ultimate mouse mod:
You grab a mouse, and you glue a joystick on top of it.
A mostick! Or maybe a Joyouse, you choose.
(genious or what!!!?)
<conspiracy theory>
Microsoft is doing this in order to make tab browsing[and/or mouse gestures] in Mozilla less appealing to consumers. If they copied the features wholesale than everyone would see that they were playing 'catch-up' and they would consequently no longer be viewed as 'innovators' so instead they are trying to break their competitors functionality. Using a mouse button to change apps also doesn't seem as clean to me as dragging the mouse off the side of the screen to get a seperate fully-setup desktop.
</conspiracy theory>
Why not just program the existing scroll wheel so that when held down, it behaves like the "hand" tool in Photoshop. Press down the middle button, and then drag the document around the window.
Why would anyone need a bisexual mouse?
Library Spoff, please stop being a tool of Microsoft's marketing department. It is already getting old reading all the "me too" posts about mice from years ago and from a dozen manufacturers that had this same functionality.
Healthcare article at Kuro5hin
I do hope they've tested this sufficiently. My right arm was finished with mice 3 years ago, and (after teaching myself to become ambimoustrous like GLS) the left one is now developing twinges. I'll probably be using a graphics tablet by the time I'm 40. The human hand was not designed to work in this way!
When I am king, you will be first against the wall.
A 2D scroll bar widget, located at the bottom-right corner of the document where both scrollbars meet.
It would allow 360 degree movment of the document without having to release the current scrollbar and relocate the mouse cursor to the other scrollbar.
This widget wouldn't require a mouse upgrade either.
I personally own a nice optical mouse with a trackball instead of a wheel. It exists and it is called 4D Magic Ball Optical Mouse (by some kind of El-Cheapo brand).
Nothing new on the horizon...
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProduct.asp?descript ion=26-123-101
But I am still trying to get my Winmodem to work under linux. If the mouse is anything like a Winmodem For god sake run away from it as fast as you can....
From excellent karma to terible karma with a single +5 funny post...
IBM Mouse
I've have the exact opposite experience. I've bought plenty of mice, and the only ones I had problems with were MS and Logitech. The Logitech one was dead before I even used it. Yeah, I did have a non-MS, non-Logitech cheap $10 mouse (Keysonic I think) die after a year, but I considered that resonable.
It's strange though. In my experience, it seems the cheaper brand mice seem to be more durable than the more expensive ones. Some of them may not glide as smoothly, and may be more likely to collect gunk on the rollers, but they don't seem to have as many problems. I'm using a cheapo generic optical mouse, and aside from the scroll wheel doubling as the third button, I think it's great.
All I do is hold down the scroll wheel and drag the cursor left or right.
Works fine for me.
Just once, I'd like it if someone called me "Sir".
Without adding, "You're creating a scene."
Indeed, IBM does make a mouse with a 2D mouse pointer. I own it and like it alot. It's called a "ScrollPoint" mouse. It's currently on sale for $21.
Picture, specs, pricing
Full Specs
This is an optical mouse with three buttons, the center button being programmable. Mine opens up a filesystem explorer application. The "joy-knob" (I know, I know) is a rubberized stub that sticks up behind the center button. It works like a scroll wheel front-to-back, except with much less effort. It can also work as a horizontal scroll wheel.
In fact, it can even scroll DIAGONALLY, if you so wish. Try doing that with two separate scroll wheels!
Finally, there is a very simple and cool mouse by "Micro Innovations". It has two standard mouse buttons, a vertical scroll wheel, a horizontal scroll wheel, and also a programmable, side-mounted "thumb button". It's about $10.
MI PD99i mouse
pic, reviews and price
...and looked it up. Turns out they call it "ScrollPoint". You can see one here. Mine is an older model, and so doesn't look like that, isn't that color, and isn't optical. Still, looks like they do still make them.
Just for the record, for a general laptop mouse, I don't particularly like those TrackPoint ones; I prefer the touchpad kind. But as a scrolly deal, it's pretty neat. I just wonder when someone will try to put a touchpad on a regular mouse.
"A great democracy must be progressive or it will soon cease to be a great democracy." --Theodore Roosevelt
I think if microsoft was going to add something "innovative" to their mice they should add a ctrl+alt+del key/button to them... now THAT would come in handy a lot :)
Actually that is not such a bad idea. Envision a wheel identical in nature to the wheel on top, but located on the side of the mouse, preferably near the base of the mouse where the thumb is when naturally at rest. Use it to scroll left / right, and click it to go back a page (the default action of the thumb button on the so-equipped mice I have used so far...)
Maybe I need to patent that.
Glonoinha the MebiByte Slayer
My Logitech trackball has been doing the same thing for over 5 years now. Correction, my Logitech trackball scrolls in all eight directions, meaning it can scroll up/down and to the left/right at the same time. {=)
I'm sure this new Microsoft mouse uses a different implementation, but the effect is the same.
"People should be allowed to keep midgets as pets."
- Gov. Jesse Ventura
..my laptop *has* four-directional scroll. Guess dell are just doing that innovative thing again.
But seriously, how is this innovative exactly? Any major change of direction accompanied by a press release from a major company seems to be treated like some sort of computer renaissance. It's common sense at best, and fairly redundant. I don't *ever* use the four-directional scrollpad on my dell laptop. I just don't use any applications that require me to scroll left and right, except when I'm HTMLing and forgotten/chosen not to leave wordwrap on.
I am a viral sig. Please copy me and help me spread. Thank you
That clunky single-button of theirs is probably the reason #1 I don't want an Apple machine. (most of their other hardware and the OS are quite all right meanwhile, IMHO) I so don't buy their argument that more than one button is confusing. Most Apple programms end up using keyboard modifiers to achieve the same thing they could've done with a couple of extra buttons and that's a lot more confusing to me. I think a mouse needs as many buttons as users can tell apart by touch without looking, which is probably about 3.
:(
Apple just don't want to admit Microsoft beat them there on a UI-related issue, so they come up with idiotic pseudo-inventions like this new mouse just so that they could sneak in extra buttons. I figure, M$ also added a wheel mostly because they finally figured out 3 buttons were better than 2 after all, but didn't want it to look like they followed Logitech's lead. In the interest of full disclosure, my perfect mouse would be an IBM ScrollPoint, but it would have those Honeywell double legs for sensors. (allows for a fully sealed case and works on absolutely any surface) Extemely unlikely anyone will ever build such a combo, as both the ScrollPoint stick and Honeywell sensor are covered by expensive patents.
-so it's hard to portray source code in a text file.
... at least get a general feel for what is going on, and I am human.
Are you on drugs? Pretty much every source code file I have jacked with over the past 20 years is a text file (my meager exposure to java using Visual Age for Java being the exception.) Heck if you were ambitious you could write code using copy con and if you were good it would actually compile (editing it would require an editor, of course.)
And assembly (machine language) is pretty much linear with lots of jumping around, but I can read it (decipher is more like it) by looking at a hex dump
Glonoinha the MebiByte Slayer
South Park episode.
Ben
Work Safe Porn
Yes, Apple's mice are REALLY teh best ... lemme count how many button it has: so ... here ...we ... have ... ... ... one ...and ... and .. and ...
i already have an ibm mouse that does this. have had it for 3 years
Yeah, the first thing I thought when I used my bi-directional scrolling mouse to click on this page was, "So. Fucking. What!" El-cheapo Taiwanese manufacturer A4 has been making these mice since the 90's. Why in the hell is this on the front page as "news".
Hey, in other news, you can combine 3 color screens in a cathode ray tubes and create a "color monitor" that makes web viewing so much more vibrant.
Won't this cut into their joystick market?
A mouse with bi-scroller disorder!
-antim
Boo to the writer - "Are reporting" ??
Heh... when I first read that I thought you wrote "WSAD layout" and I wondered what IBM's dev tools had to do with gaming.
I've been at work for too long... Bring on the weekend...
My A4Tech mouse simply has two scroll wheels, one for each axis and works fine, thank you very much.
"Nine times out of ten, starting a fire is not the best way to solve the problem." - my wife
"How long before I get a trackball embedded in my mouse?"
That depends on how hard you can throw the trackball.
Cheers, Paul
Right now I'm using an A4Tech 4D++ optical mouse with two scroll wheels. They both go up and down physically, but one is set to scroll right to left when it is used. It works pretty well.
I just have to flip it over.
Back in 1997, at Comdex Fall I bought a mouse which had two scroll wheels (vertical and horizontal) preciselly for this reason: to scroll around big pictures. Not exactly the ones you imply, but I think it can solve your er... problem.
BTW, the mouse was from A4Tech.
Micro innovations makes a bunch of mice with built-in trackballs.
mice
And the "PD99I" has dual scroll-wheels too, for just $10.99
http://www.a4tech.com Look at their home page.
I have an IBM Mouse that I just love, instead of a wheel it has a tab that sticks up like the nipple mice on laptops, only contoured for a finger. The only problem I have had with it is the software does not work with Opera for some reason. It works with every other program I have except opera...
"The mice will also have a feature that lets people switch between open applications by pressing down on the scroll wheel instead of using the keyboard. "
I hate the default operation these wheel mice have for the wheel click. I prefer to assign double click to the wheel mouse. Makes moving around the desktop much faster.
But you don't see me bragging about it on Slashdot. Oh wait, I guess I just did. Ahem. Well, then.
That's gotta fit into your schema somewhere
The innovation means that users will be able to scroll vertically as well as horizontally without using on-screen navigation bars."
BFD. I have an IBM scroll-point mouse that can do the same today. I've had this mouse since 1999.
Innovation? Feh!
*** Where are we going? And what's with this handbasket?
A slow news day.
Do you think that the geniuses at Adobe will figure out that if the up and down arrow keys scroll up and down, the left and right arrow keys should scroll left and right?
How long before I get a trackball embedded in my mouse?
/me runs over to the patent office!
I remember back in 1999 working in a client pc room where IBM mice had 2 buttons and a trackpoint on top of it. Yes, in place of the wheel, a trackpoint. Provided you had the correct driver, it worked quite well. I was disappointed (no pun intended) not to se it elsewhere.
Is it such a bad idea or had IBM some patent on the trackpoint ?
I tried a logitech trackball about 5 years ago and never went back to mice. At home on all 3 workstations I use the new marble trackball. Instead of moving my arm, I just move three fingers. In counterstrike, I never have to pick up the mouse and with three fingers you can aim really precise. Ive seen a few other gamers use trackballs too, and good at it.
Theyre also good with laptops. I would buy a logitech trackball embedded into the side of a laptop anytime. Not the old apple/toshiba trackballs in the center below the keyboard though.
I know the learning curve is steep, but I have NO idea why people arent trying these.
"Give orange me give eat orange me eat orange give me eat orange give me you." -Nim Chimpsky
I want a mouse with one of those laptop eraser head thingys in it.
Mouse moves the cursor, eraser head moves page underneath cursor.
Also make the eraser head a button click when pressed down. Don't know what for... but sounds neat.
Jono
The mice will also have a feature that lets people switch between open applications by pressing down on the scroll wheel instead of using the keyboard.
This is amazing. This means I don't have to rest my thumb and middle finger on Alt-Tab when reading web-pages at work. Because, you know, pressing those two buttons can sure be one hell of a workout.
Ever try clicking with that center button/scrolly thing?
What comes up?
A small icon that looks like a compass, and allows you to scroll around your document in any direction you want.
Since most of the scrolling people do is vertical, this is more than sufficient. It still allows users to take full advantage of the horizontal scroll features at the expense of just one click.
How long before I get a trackball embedded in my mouse?
... you might get it
...where do I get a mouse with a blow-job attachment?
... for someone to come out with a decent quality mouse that's optical, wireless, has 3 buttons, and NO wheels!
All of my mice at home are 3-button with no wheel because that works best with X. At the office I've had to put up with a wheel mouse, and although the scrolling comes in handy, it gets extremely annoying when I try to simply middle-click on something and it accidentally turns into two middle clicks or it scrolls past the link I was aiming for.
If I were to try one of these, and really liked it, then we would really have to begin a campaign to update or ditch the X Windows protocol. I think it is maxed out with three buttons, plus the two pretend buttons for vert. scrolling. It only allows for 5 buttons in the protocol.
Any way around it? I already have 6 buttons on a Logitech mouse, of which only 5 are useful
-- Hello_World.c: 17 Errors, 31 Warnings
4D Optical Web Cruiser by iogear. Granted, it's not the exact same thing... it's far superior. Wonder why IOGear didn't get a BBC feature?
LilMikey.com... I'll stop doing it when you sto
Heh, That doesn't even meet the minimum hardware requirements for xp, not sure about 2k...
Wasn't it enough to use something like this: http://shop.store.yahoo.com/mdionline218/a4tecgrea t4d.html
It does provide you scrolling function of both left-right and up-down. Why in the world does Microsoft & Apple spend so much resource of inventing something that do the same thing?
We just say it the "incorrect" way in English because "approaches infinity" and "approaches three" look pretty much the same when written in math. That doesn't make "approaches infinity" correct though; the correct terminology is "increases without bound".
It's always a long day... 86400 doesn't fit into a short.
There is a worryingly large amount of people who do not reach the bare minimum of 30 hrs per week. Vote vote vote!
I've never found the scroll wheel to be in a good location. Lifting just the middle finger is hard for me for some reason. I once wrote to Logitech to ask if they'd consider designing a mouse with the scroll wheel where the thumb is, which I find to be much more flexible than my middle finger.
Maybe I just need to practice lifting my middle finger more often.
I've had a Honeywell (SM3???) mouse that's had this feature for at least 4 years.
I can't see where the innovation is.
Can someone explain how this is news????
Burma?
Sorry, dude. I don't scroll that way.
Macintosh humor! MacComedy.com
To scroll I just press the thumb button and the trackball then acts as a window navigator. Up, down, left, right, diagonally, and anything in between.
That clunky single-button of theirs is probably the reason #1 I don't want an Apple machine.
;-)
If that's really your #1 reason, then do yourself a favor, buy a Mac and then...I know this is a stretch...spend the extra $25 or so for a three button mouse. You'll be just fine, trust me.
August 7, 2003: Today the Episcopal Church voted unanimously to approve the use of the new high-tech Microsoft mouse by the church leadership. The Bishop of Virtual Space, Al Gomorrah, commented that, "We are sure that if the apostles were living today, they would be using this great new advance." He continued, "We believe that all scrolling orientations are equally valid, and thus should serve in the Church." Reports that the new mouse had been used to browse porn were rejected as, "a desperate, last minute attempt by old-school users."
I don't know, but it works for me.
Ummm... is it just me or have i been doin this for several months with my logitech trackman pro?
just hit the top thumb button and WHAMMO the whole tracball scrolls sidways and verticly.
i think MS is a little late...
The full trackball embedded would be even better - would be nice to be able to control orientation of movement and orientation of POV independently with one hand...
Why not just eliminate the keyboard all together, then kids will not be tempted to learn how to hack!
This is not innovation it is just silly. Soon I will be able to mouse remote and speak into a mic, watch my Microsoft computer entertainment centre and go completely gaga brain dead, lets see another XY function to screwup hardware venders. Oh I am sure windows users will find it the next best thing since sliced bread not having to take ones hand off the mouse. Just think lf the fun you will have recoding for the interface, what a pile of crap. I am sure this will break in Open Office and most freeware, and be a pain in the arse to impliment, typical. You can bet Mozilla, and Netscape or AOL will not avail itself of the wonderful function quick enough, and wind up being criticised by MS mouse junkie morons, because of it.
OH THE SHAME I fell off the wagon and use sigs again!
It seams that you could emulate this capability in a trakball by holding down a button while moving the ball left and right. It may be able to do without recompiling anything. I'm now crafty enough to know where to begin.
Excuse me, but I think slashdot has been publishing too much windows stuff lately. Has slashdot already crossed over to the dark side?
From people saying how to do this and that on windows, to new products, it seems that deep pockets are reaching slashdot users. I have seen lately too many references to media player, explorer, start menu, etc.
How is turning something 90 degrees innovative? The word has lost all meaning...
As sarcastic as the parent is, there is a point. It's not new, nor is it useful otherwise it would have been adopted by now.
I've found a moderate use of the scroll wheel on my mouse to give me severe aching in those particular fingers. I've used mice and keyboards fairly heavily for years and suffered very little RSI. Yet as shortly after adopting a scroll wheel to scroll rather than using scroll bars - and more out of laziness than practicality since a scroll bar gives you more control over the scroll - I've found the pain so bad in my right index and middle fingers (I switched to my middle finger after it became too painful using my index finger) I've had to stop using the scroll wheel altogether.
With the world's dominant technology force behind it, this kind of trackball-on-mouse will probably become ubiquitos. But probably not widely used.
I suspect I'm not unique with my aversion to using the scroll wheel, given the speed with which RSI set in on my fingers. (And I'm a lad, for those of you with dirty minds - so, no, 'that' is not the cause!)
Back to the nice scroll bars for me - which I now prefer for usability reasons since I can easily control the scrolling of a page rather than the guess work that came with using a scroll wheel.
Free Gamer - Free games list and commentary
Great! now i can actually use all the badly designed sites that dont render properly in one browser or another (or all of them) which means you have to scroll left and right to actually read the txt that goes off the screen! oh wait i can already do that with my keyboard..
This comment does not represent the views or opinions of the user.
I'm a native UK English speaker, and I'd say "sandpaper" for the paper-with-sand-glued-on you use to smooth wood.
:-)
If I remember correctly, emery paper is a type of harder sandpaper for use on metal (it's a while since I've done that sort of thing though, I mostly stick to software
I think I have in my hand an IBM mouse that does just that.
(though since I left using windows on this particular machin, I don remember ifmI had to put the mouse cursor on the scrollbar or not)
errera hunamum ets
Before the world goes and congratulates Microsoft for putting the entire damned keyboard on the mouse, let's stop and think a bit...
I've been using a trackball for years, and will never go back to a mouse. Recently I tried a new trackball that had a scrollwheel. It was so damned superflous it wasn't even funny. Why not just use the trackball? A little side button to click to put it into scroll mode, and then use the trackball to scroll vertically, horizontally, diagonally, or any other direction you can manage to contort.
Frankly, today's mice have too many controls. And this is coming from a guy who demands three buttons! Don't put funky little doodads between the buttons. Don't hide wierd clicky thingies on the side or put them below the regular buttons. If people want them, sure go ahead and market them. But keep the standard pointing device simple. With a trackball and three buttons, all the controls you need are there already.
A Government Is a Body of People, Usually Notably Ungoverned
My ibm mouse already does that.
scrolls to eleven!
Thats one higher than ten!
The Knob is a wheel, about 3cm in diameter, on a vertical axis, flush mounted on the keyboard. It turns very smoothly, probably on ball bearings. It controls either vertical or horizontal scrolling, depending on whether you're holding down the Shift key.
There are two major advantages to having a whole side of The Knob exposed, rather than just a quarter of the rim (as on mouse wheels).
First, you're making a smoother movement for long distance scrolling, because you don't have to keep moving your finger off and back onto the device.
Second, there is an intuitive way to vary your scrolling speed: touch The Knob near its axis to go faster, or near its rim to go slower.
Scrolling devices don't necessarily belong on the mouse!
You have received this message in error.
Having a trackball on top of the mouse actually has been around for several years; I have used them at work for quite some time.
Here's Iogear's mouse with a trackball in the top of it. I checked it out about a year ago. It's not a bad product but the ball is so small it's difficult to maneuver precisely with it (not that there's much call for that, but anyway)...
filmcritic.com - Movie reviews on Internet time
Good point. Losing the ability to use the scroll wheel clicker would make tabbed browsing in Mozilla less appealling. If you don't open new tabs by middle-clicking (not default; must set in Preferences), you have to right-click and select Open Link in New Tab.
IBM used to make a mouse with a little joystick,
(like the ones you see on some laptops) in the middle button, which you could use to scroll both ways if you installed special drivers.
Here is a track ball on top:I tem=GM E421
http://www.iogear.com/products/product.php?
There is also a nonoptical version that has been around for years. 4-direction scrolling is nothing new, M$ just wants you to think so
I used to use a dual-wheel Radio Shack mouse. It was actually very cool.
Its the wireless intellemouse they are talking about. supposedly the black one has a leather cushion looks badass Wireless Intellimouse
Does anyone get carpal tunnel from the mouse wheel? I do. I can't imagine having two of them.
haven't you?
4-D Optical Mouse
I bought it and it works ok. The horizontal scrolling tends to not work as well as it should though. For instance, when scrolling through my mp3 folder if I scroll up and down MS interprets it as side to side scrolling which works fine (view set as list) but if I scroll horizontal it scrolls 5-6 lines at a time even though it's set at 2 in the IOGear s/w. Works great in Opera though.It was even an infrared wireless, which I thought at the time would be very cool. The fact of the matter is that IR wireless mice suck big mouse balls (it wasn't optical), having significant range and line-of-sight issues.
Ultimately I got rid of this expensive paperweight for the reasons above, but I was very happy with the two scroll wheels. I had a choice between two models -- one where the side-to-side wheel was mounted horizontally below the vertical wheel (which is what I chose), and one which just had two vertically-mounted scroll wheels, the left one slightly above the right one so that they were on a diagonal. On either setup, you could change which wheel did which function.
Neither wheel was clickable, which I suppose is a shortcoming we'd notice today, but that didn't bother me at all at the time.
How is the Riemann zeta function like Trump rallies? Both have an endless number of trivial zeros.
On my PowerBook, I have the Function key bound such that when it's held down, the trackpad becomes a giant 2D scroller. On my desktop system, I have it configured so that pressing Control-Option-Command turns the mouse into a giant 2D scroller. I find both of these very useful, very often.
Actually, I use the clicky (top) wheel for left-right and the non-clicky (bottom) wheel for up/down because it's too easy to click when you're pelting down a document. Even more so with Microsoft mice, so I'm betting that getting it right with their proposed mutant mouse is going to be something of an art.
I like the AOpen because it's light, and easy for little children to use. They tend to struggle with the heavier mice. However, I've recently found an even better one, a tiny scroll-wheel optical not much larger than a matchbox. They're sold, of all places, in Big W stores (a kind of KMart-ish branch of Woolworths) here in Australia. I don't have the original packaging, so I can't tell you what they're marketed as (will reply to this with details if I get another one) but the markings on the bottom say this:
(the (/) being the tick-over-circle symbol).Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
...was three times as good as that!
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
Alternatively, I could use two mice... which would absolutely rock in a tank game (one mouse == tracks (wheel == engine), other == turret (wheel = elevation)).
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
That way, there'd be no finger-lifting for movement, like there is now if you use the mouse (or trackball) for movement, and you could control your speed.
Just push with more lateral force to move faster in a particular direction.
For non-gaming uses, push harder to scroll faster.
This would be much better than the current method, where you click the wheel button, then move the mouse to control scrolling speed.
Those who sacrifice security to condemn liberty deserve to repeat history or something. - Benjamin Santayana
It appears that such a mouse already exists.
It is discussed below.
Those who sacrifice security to condemn liberty deserve to repeat history or something. - Benjamin Santayana
I'm right-handed, but use the mouse with my left hand, because of pain in my right hand. As this switch was a gradual process, I never reprogrammed the mouse and use it as I think you do, mostly with the hand diagonally over the mouse. It is just a matter of habit and no less natural than using the right hand. I occasionally switch back to using the right hand on the mouse and have now internalized the different right-hand and left-hand behaviours, and I no longer feel that urge to "mirror" my hand behaviour that is natural when first switching hands doing something.
The side buttons are sometimes annoying but can usually be ignored.
I have a life. I really do. I've just chosen to ignore it.
well. that's what i thought it said when i first read it.
I aggree that Apple is rotten for not having more than one button. It's a total waste of space to have that long button on laptops. Also, I think it's about time that they put Link lights on their on-board NIC ports. How freaking cheep can they be? For $2,000 a machine, the least they could do is foot for a little more plastic and two LEDS. How do you get the info a link light would give you? Throught the GUI, a complete waste of time. I too would not buy a Mac, albeit a Logitec mouse would work fine. It's the company's overall philosophy that I am against.
In sum, if it passes the "phone test", they should have it on their machine. That is, if a complete newbie understands you when you say, "Hit the left mouse button twice...", then you are good to go.
I have one of their mice.
I heard they made some software as well. What was it, Microsoft Doors? Something like that.
I have a life. I really do. I've just chosen to ignore it.
I think people should make their programs work with the keyboard in conjuction with the mouse. Like in Gimp you just press Control and then the wheel does horizontal scrolling. Having to many functions for one hand makes me confused. Then there's always the chap that hinted the masturbation-to-pictures value of a device like this. But I'll leave that to him.
this isn't exactly new. Plenty of mice have either two wheels, one for horizontal and one for vertical scrolling, or they use a point stick like the IBM Scrollpoint. There are many other designs as well.
It seems odd and not very efficient to design a mouse with a tilting wheel for horizontal scrolling; maybe that's simply to avoid the patents on all the other bidirectional scrolling mice people have developed.
It may be that the reason for the one-button mouse may have been cost, rather than a belief that more than one button is confusing.
It's too bad that they're too stubborn to change it, now that they've been shown to be wrong.
Those who sacrifice security to condemn liberty deserve to repeat history or something. - Benjamin Santayana
Twist scroll button on the horizontal scrollbar and you scroll sideways. Move mouse off and it scrolls vertically.
Quite handy.
Derek
Microsoft says they invented something...
/. believed them!!!
...and
You could scroll both ways without taking your
hands out of typing position on mouseless CP/M
systems from 1978 on.... True, vertical scrolling
was more convenient than horizontal -- but ain't
it funny how even cursor-independent vertical
scrolling disappeared from successful mass-market
software except in a particular company's
mouse-oriented all-graphical "operating
environment"? To know the history is to know how
the Redmond Ripper acquired millions of slaves....
The ScrollPoint accelerates the scrolling when you keep pressing in the same direction.
This is something you just can't do with a wheel, which tops at the speed you are able to move your finger.
In addition, with a wheel I usually have to set the scrolling ratio to something around eight lines per tick (otherwise it takes me centuries to scroll over a couple of pages).
With the ScrollPoint, on the other hand, I set this ratio to one or two lines per tick. The ScrollPoint scrolling is also extraordinarily smooth, and stopping at any given line is extremely accurate (with little practice).
Even more, what you are controlling with different amounts of pressure from your finger is not the displacement, nor the speed, but the amount of acceleration itself.
The control you can get this mouse is impossible to understand without actually trying it. The pity is it has only drivers for Windows.
--
A few years ago when I did a little bit of CAD related stuff I kept wondering what it would be like to have a left hand mouse in addition to the right hand one. Just imagine the possibilities of virtually grab things with two hands instead of one.
I congratulate microsoft on their move. However, the addition of lateral scrolling on mice won't be a "killer app" like the vertical scroll. Clicking the center button by default creates a free-scroll, the rarely used method is already available.
What I would like to see is a ergonomic (butterfly) keyboard with an integrated scroll pad. I have seen these before, but they aren't in the right place.
Placing mouse control on the wrist-wrest is inconvenient because one must move their hand in order to get to it. I would rather keep my hands in the home keyboard position.
Instead, I would propose moving the "lock" indicators in the center of the butterfly and replacing it with a scroll-pad. One could configure the scroll-pad in software so that it controls either scrolling, or mouse movement.
The beauty of IBM's scroll point is that it allows one to move the cursor without removing your hands from the home-keys. With the introduction of 17" "lap-zillas", I hope that some manufacturers offer interchangeable keyboards whereby a butterfly fan can easily remove a keyboard/status light panel and replace it with an ergonomically shaped one where the touchpad is in the center instead of on the wrist-wrest.
-------- -------- Support Wesley Clark for president!!!
You mean like this?
Finding the original model (which was shoddily made, gets dirty fast, and is pre-USB) is almost impossible now, unfortunately...
(-: deem g/d/r included :-)
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
Turn your mouse upside down. WOW! Lookee there, a trackball!
Not sure if anyone's posted this, but in OS X, holding down Shift while using the scroll wheel causes it to scroll horizontally.. up is left, down is right.
Like MS-Word's internal format, yeah, rii-ight... (-:
Anyhoo, I'd like to see the higher-level description that produced this. (-:
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
Really, how hard is it to click the scrolling button and move the mouse left/right? You know that prices will be jacked up for this new mouse.
The scroll wheel makes my arm hurt.
I'd like a scroll wheel for MY FOOT!
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They Are Vermin Feeding On Each Other's Feces.
I Hate \.
...all of those 40-something design engineers in places like Sony are working so hard to make three-meter LCD displays affordable? (-:
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
The scrolling's easy to adapt to, and the middle-button-paste thing is just bonzer. Swipe console window, move mouse to browser, click, done. Swipe non-linked URL in browser, click, done. Swipe or double-click search term in browser window, Ctrl-click, searching... done. KDE rocks, never mind the resource useage. For the user, by the user, of the user. (-:
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
my very old (late ninties) web racer touch pad does that, also I had a generic compuse infrared mouse that had 2 scroll wheels one for veritcal one for horizontal. once again m$oft releases old tech as its newest innovation.
I had a mouse a while back called the scrollware 4d, it had a vertical scroll wheel and a horizontal one below that, and the third button was by the thumb. It was useful for browsing large files or on old machines running new software. I wonder if the hooks for the horizontal scroll wheel are similar to those for vertical; if I recall correctly, everything was customizable from the control panel tab.
Anyway, you can check out a newer model here
The dream reveals the reality which conception lags behind. That is the horror of life- the terror of art. -Franz Kafka
Seems I have heard just this quote before about a very similar situation with Apple. I am confused now... goodnight!
I've been using this kind of mouse for some year...
Trust sells something similar, A4tech does, so that's nothing new. Just the same old "innovation" from Microsoft.
I use a program called Maya. If this program there's a 3D camera that you control by holding down alt and clicking the mouse buttons (left orbits, right zooms and middle pans.)
It's much faster and easier to control the camera this way. Why can't this extremely easy, accurate and fast method be brought to scrolling in all programs? It's also easier on the middle finger. Better yet, why not put those thumb buttons commonly found on today's mice to practical use by making them a "scroll mode" button. Then one could use the other buttons to control the axis one scrolls on (kinda like in XSI.)
I'm extremely disapointed in the lack of progress in mice. It's hardly changed at all since the 80's. All we have now is a light that makes it slightly more accurate (and in some cases less accurate and in a few cases unusable) another 3 buttons that are rarely put to practical use and a scroll wheel that kills one's middle finger and usually either scrolls much or too little.
-Derick
My old crappy Trust "Ami Mouse Scroll Pro" had two way scrolling buttons when I bought it 4 years ago.
Oh, and to me it's completely useless.
It's from Trust, and it was cheap either. :-)
:-p
The feeling of the ball is nice, and you can also "reverse" it in hardware with a key combo to use the ball for the cursor and the mouse to scroll windows
But under X 4.3 it scrolls only to the left
Ciao,
Rob!
AniToolBox! An Open Source animation program!
i know this is a late and nitpicky post hasn't the article placed the words horizontally and vertically the wrong way round ?
"if i'd known it was harmless, i'd have killed it myself"
What good will it do without the application support? I expect this to be similar to Windows, which also still has useful mappings for 2 buttons only, not the middle one.
:)
I suppose I could map the extra buttons to common keyboard modifiers via software myself, but wouldn't that be an un-Applish procedure? I mean, an Apple user is assumed to be a total idiot
The extra diagnostic LEDs are certainly very easy to design in these days and don't even cost any extra plastic. There is a part available that integrates one or two LEDs directly into the plastic RJ45 housing. It's got to cost a bit more, but certainly gives you those LEDs at no extra design and/or space cost.
:)
One could argue that this is a security measure. Remember all this talk about how you can reconstruct the bit stream from a LED's blinking remotely?
Have a pity on a poor foreigner with a limited vocabulary.
What, you mean this old thing?
doesn't have a horizontal scrollbar. Whatever version of Outlook work has lumped on us, any email you open you cannot scroll sideways. Maybe it is easier to innovate new hardware than fix Outlook.
The Singularity is closer than you think
Quant
Mac OS X fully supports two-button mice with scroll wheels. There's no configuration or special drivers involved; just plug it in and go. As you'd expect, the right button calls up a contextual menu, and the scroll wheel, er, scrolls.
On Mac OS 9, you'd need to load a driver. Most mice come with the right software. There's a popular shareware program, USB Overdrive, that will work with any USB mouse (and most other USB human-interface devices, for that matter). The driver just has to map the right click to a click with the Control key held down, which brings up the contextual menu. This feature has been in Mac OS for some time.
Have you ever tried to help a person who isn't a computer expert over the telephone and walk them through using a two-button mouse? The majority of people who use a computer don't realize what the right button is for. The term "right-click" confuses them. You may think that it shouldn't be confusing, but the plain fact is, it is confusing to a whole lot of people. No amount of deeply-held personal belief will change that reality.
By shipping computers with a one-button mouse, and designing the user interface so that every feature is accessible with just one button, Apple has made the system a lot more comprehensible to people who aren't into computers. The contextual menus are shortcuts, and you can use the full system without ever knowing about them. When you're ready, you can purchase an inexpensive mouse with a second button, and away you go.
I've seen way too many Windows programs where you have to right-click to access parts of the program. Perhaps that's why the "Windows keyboard" has the almost-useless "contextual menu" key between Ctrl and Alt to the left of the spacebar, where you can hit it by accident and screw up what you were doing?
Besides, mice are a personal thing. A mouse that's comfortable for one person is hell for another. (I'd love to meet the person that thought the original Apple USB mouse, the hockey puck, was comfortable.) It's not such a bad thing for people to buy an unbundled mouse.
I purchased this mouse two years ago.Programmable buttons,two scroll wheels etc.Drivers for win and mac only,though.
OS X has system-wide application support for multi-button mice: right button is context menu, scroll wheel does what you think, etc -- just like Windows.
The software that came with my Logitech mouse by default sets the scroll-button click to be double-click, but everything can be customized.
It's too bad that Apple doesn't publicize this fact -- too many people make the same mistake you did and assume your stuck with a one button mouse if you choose to buy a Mac.
From my experiance most "wheel" mice have functionality to press the 3rd button(wheel) and your presented with a sort of panning scroll. SO how does adding more moving parts to a mouse help? I prefer as little hand movement as possible, I propose a vim mouse!
Damn MS at their marketing scheme again eh? Dunno about you guy but the scroll wheel on my mouse lets me press down and will scroll any ol direction I need it to. IBM IntelliMouse, P/N X06-08477. A simple click, pointer changed to either an up/down arrow (on a screen width page/document) or a 4-way arrow (larger than screen width/spreadsheet) and I can scroll at a variable speed based on how far I move the mouse left or right. So what, now I push the scroll wheel left or right now? Geez. One more reason to use Linux....at least they don't claim original thought when it is obviously not.
Well.. It's "new" to come from microsoft. But horizontal scrollwheels have been on mice for like 6 yrs already.. and to me it sounds stupid having 2 scroll wheels A much better solution has already been made by someone.. it's called the "Star Logic 8D Optical Mouse" available from: http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B00006BXBQ/ summitpost-20/104-5196218-4945532
On the contrary, I hate pages which are a certain "width", they should have a dynamic width.
if a page opens up at a measly 1024px width on a 3200w screen, it would be extremely annoying.
point is, most users need a vertical and horzontal scrolling capability in a trackball style, they just don't know it yet.
And NO, none of these "software-solutions" can replace it.
since the whole point is to be able to move your cursor at the same time as you scroll and maybe hold a mouse button.
The "clicks" in a scrollwheel come from trying to make a cheap solution for the wheel, (when rotating, switches get hit each click) and also use less cpu..
There's no question about a stepless scroller being better (but more expensive)
Well.. It's "new" to come from microsoft.
But horizontal scrollwheels have been on mice for like 6 yrs already..
and to me it sounds stupid having 2 scroll wheels
A much better solution has already been made by someone..
it's called the "Star Logic 8D Optical Mouse" available from:
8d mouse at Amazon
On the contrary, I hate pages which are a certain "width", they should have a dynamic width.
if a page opens up at a measly 1024px width on a 3200w screen, it would be extremely annoying.
point is, most users need a vertical and horzontal scrolling capability in a trackball style, they just don't know it yet.
And NO, none of these "software-solutions" can replace it, since the whole point is to be able to move your cursor at the same time as you scroll and maybe hold a mouse button.
The "clicks" in a scrollwheel come from trying to make a cheap solution for the wheel, (when rotating, switches get hit each click) and also use less cpu..
There's no question about a stepless scroller being better (but more expensive)
Actually it depends.
:{
I have a mouse with a little nub-thingy on it at work that does that.
It makes my finger go numb if I use it too much.
So, what don't they just put a small trackball on top of the mouse? Then you could scroll up/down/sideways/combo.
The second wheel moves sidewise. Has a programmable third button on the side. Never installed it, though. Wheels move smoothly, no detent. Box says 520 DPI. Reminds me of the old Textronix graphic terminal with two wheels at right angles.
It's called the Dual-Wheel Scroll Mouse, with their catalog (?) no. 26-551. 10-digit bar code is 40293 14109.
PS/2, M$ Intellimouse compatible. Was $10. in 1999.