Slashdot Mirror
Gaming Communities Cause Of TV Ratings Decline?
Bendebecker writes "We all know about the falling popularity of television this season, but Mike Malone of ABC News has a very interesting viewpoint on why this is happening. He seems to think that the growing popularity of online gaming communities (the example he gives is Counter-Strike) are causing the decline, which is particularly noticeable among the young male demographic."
Posting a mirror in case you slam ABC's website
So young males are playing video games, and that is the source of your falling ratings? Could there perhaps be a correlation between crap, and lower ratings, which in turn leads to higher video game consumption?
Granted advertisers need to advertise their product, what happens when they infiltrate the computer gaming market more. I can see it now, blowing someone away with a headshot and a message in my headphones "now how about a refreshing cola?". Oh dear...
:-)
Though I shouldn't fear someone will have a crack shortly when that happens
...in bed
How about blaming the fact that TV shows are just sucking lately?
Reprise the theme song and roll the credits!
What is this "TV" thing?
Life in Orange County
Games arn't the only reason.. Sure they might be a big factor, but another is like the reason we download mp3's off iTunes.. The ammount of crap on TV channels nowdays is amazing.. If they put on some quality shows at the right times, you may lure back some gamers.. But not all...
To NULL or not to NULL.
If TV is worth watching it will attract the viewers. Viewers are being selective because so much TV is poor quality; stimulation can be found elsewhere - particuraly for proactive young people who will make the effort rather than being mushrooms.
-- Alchohol is a hard drug. Cannabis is a soft drug.
so what your saying is that a new form of entertainment that can be attained in the home at night and is rising in popularity is actually stealing people from another form of entertainment that can be attained at home at night? FASCINATING!
When a new form of entertainment emerges, it can take away from the time spent with current forms.
People only have so much free time in a day. If they begin spending 2-3 hours a day playing video games, that's 2-3 less hours they have for tv, music, reading, etc.
There was a time when you read books for entertainment, and that's about all you COULD do. Then radio came along, and families sat around in the evening listening to radio shows. Then TV, now video games. It makes perfect sense.
I do want to say that I think this is a good thing. For the most part TV is the most mindless, unstimulating, unsocial form of entertainment we have today. If more people play games (still maybe not the best entertainment, but challenging and oftentimes social none the less) than watch TV, well, I'm all for it!
It's just that the new shows are increasingly like the music comming out today. It's all the same: Reality this, real life that, American Wannabe, they're all modeled after a small group of once successful shows. I presently only watch maybe 3 to 4 hours of TV per week, and it's usually educational stuff (TLC, Discovery, Travel, etc). If the people in Hollywood were to do some real research and come up with something original again, maybe people would start watching again. But it will have to happen soon, or their only audience will be folks who dont have a net connection.
my guess is the internet is somewhere on top of the list... that includes multiuser games and, ofcourse , pr0n! the target demografic, i.e. males 18-24, are more interested in unlimited pr0n than sitcomes....
now ratings would WNBA get if they'd played without panties?....
Just because I don't care, it doesn't mean I don't understand. Homer J. Simpson
While programs like EQ, DAoC, Counter Strike, etc... are probably a part of the reason, another reason is because the current programming sucks. Most of the shows that they seem to be targeting that age range seem, to me, be a bunch of teen-aged soap operas (OC comes to mind).
I guess they figured that if it worked for Beverly Hill 90210, it should work now. With the Internet as it is today, people are expecting a more interactive form of entertainment. When I get home, I want instant gratification. I don't want to wait until the predetermined date and time to watch a show when I can load up DAoC and have fun.
Of course most people will choose gaming/computers/internet over TV. Computing/gaming has become the fabled "interactive TV," whereby the viewer is in complete control of the content he/she sees. With television, you sit there and watch monsters destroy the city, or cops catch bad guys. With games, you are in control of everything that happens, which provides a much more immersive experience than merely absorbing what others want you to see. Therefore it comes as no surprise TV ratings are declining in favor of gamedom.
Things like Video On Demand are getting closer to consumer control, but until there are TV ws where you can choose the paths the characters take, people will play games.
everyone's just sick of reality tv
slashdot, news for crazed liberal socialist zealots
Maybe in the future games would be free and new games would come out with the frequency of new TV shows. Ads would be places between rounds or something. Bad games don't get renew and good games get improved to keep the audience interested. We all know games like Everquest are way more addictive than TV. Market waiting to be tapped?
EvilCON - Made Famous by
Gaming as the cause of falling ratings? I don't think so. The TV watching demographic is not 100% the gaming demographic.
Couldn't it just be that there's nothing good to watch?
evil adrian
More frequent and longer commercial breaks, split-screens during credits, product placement and other techniques are thought to IMPROVE the viewing experience.
How does the Slashdot Effect happen given that no slashdotters ever RTFA?
Ok, I think I figured it out.
The shows suck.
I would be happy to sell this research to any network that can afford it.
-Spack
The above link is a 404.... Just to warn you all..
To NULL or not to NULL.
TV shows that are not worth watching.
Nothing to see here, move along now.
yes, I would agree with him. If I don't have anything to do, and DON'T watch TV, instead I play a pc game, if I don't have a new one I can still play UT.
Can't remember myself watching TV in the last few month.
I haven't had a cable connection for more than a year now.. I have high speed internet over ADSL. I surf and download what I want to watch now.. And most of what I watch can't be found on local cable anyway. (No I am not talking about Pr0n)
EA David Gardner -"... but the consumers have proven that actually what they want is fun."
You learn way more reading slash than watching your teevee
In fact I learned..
Teevee is dying according to the latest netcraft report.
and the increase in reality TV shows. Coincidence? I leave it to you, the gentle reader, to determine.
Mod me down with all of your hatred and your journey towards the dark side will be complete!
I wonder if maybe this guy is making excuses for his television channel/station/broadcast industry in general.
CS an other online games don't consume that much time, and somehow I don't think that 20% of males 18-24 just decided to stop watching they're TV's and start playing video games, the typical hallmark of the geek.
cs statistics
Sig & Below
Yuck Fou
First violent behavior, and now this? When will the madness end?
The Human Cow - bringing you scrumtrelescence since 1995
so, uh, were you just having your daily look at goatse when you came across that. btw, it is funny.
I agree. I've got an Xbox and Xbox live and it's always surprising to see how many people are on during prime time. I looked at the Crimson Skies on-line rankings a few nights ago and there were at least 10,000 people who went on-line even though the game was only out for about a week. I think the on-line gamers have more fun killing each other than watching TV.
You realize what you just did? You just gave the TVAA authority to sue the game communities for its losses.
most people i know who play online games have the tv or music going in the background. they are more like to leave it on the same channel, instead of flipping every time commercials come on. the advertisers are more likely to get their message across to them while they are playing, since they are too busy to change the channel
because there is nothing worth watching. Networks like Fox cancel all the good shows (e.g. Andy Richter Controls the Universe, Family Guy, Firefly etc). All thats left on network TV is reality tv garbage in my opinion
It's only been 2 years and one month since the 9/11 attacfks and we're talking about televison and video games?!? Where are your priorities?!?
I'm 32 and you know what, my TV watching habit has been limited for one reason; it sucks. I have limited time that fails between work, personal projects, and family/friends. Online Games gets it since that is what I enjoy the most between the two.
What this guy is failing to note is that in people's free time, they will gravitate to what is the most entertaining for their limited time/dollar. Right now, that is video games. When TV gets better, people will return, until then they will stick to Games.
Linux O Muerte!
Pr0n and /.
Actually Pr0n only takes up about 3 minutes of time.
with /. however, I can take hours thinking up funny things to post.
But don't you mind that fact that I've played Diablo 2 for 18 hours in the past week.
"...thousands of young men (and a few hundred young women) are playing it on the Internet -- instead of watching TV."
Wow, thousands of viewers lost! No wonder television is tanking. Brilliant analysis.
I imagine the television industry would love to blame declining ratings on competion from games, even though it makes about as much sense as the MPAA blaming its decline on the 20% of movie piracy that is NOT due to insider pilferage. But it's better than admitting that most of television has become too stupid to waste time watching. Because of course that couldn't be the problem.
I rarely watch TV anymore, and haven't for years.
Granted, I'm a few years out of the demographic they're saying is just now stopping watching TV (I'm 29), but I think I was around 24 or 25 when I just stopped watching TV pretty much all together.
I guess I'm just ahead of my time.
Thursdae
Since I got my wife to start playing Star Wars Galaxies we've gotten a new computer and have no plans to upgrade our 10 year old tv.
I actually get a bit of the old nausea when I watch anything on mtv (except jackass). Like the real world and such.
Games rock becuase your brain is actually a part of the process.
I would like to see an fMRI of someone watching survivor vs someone playing and FPS like Desert Combat or An MMORPG
Funny. I believe it. Technology changes peoples daily habits, and these habits spur entire industries. Lately, everything that always been, is having some sort of problem. McDonalds sales are declining! Open source software is gathering more and more momentum. Cell phones are so ubiqitous that I only use a regular phone when someone, over 50 I presume, actually calls me on it. The Post Office is even complaing at times. Yeah and the RIAA.
This is a free-market, kind of, and you pay heavily when you rest on your laurels, or take business for granted. Everything is changing.
The dot bomb cracked me up. It was a tremendous kaboom, economically, that fueled incredible specualtion onlymerely based on the idea that there was a new way to do business - well I suspect that that was just the very beginning of how computer technology is going to change things dramatically.
Network TV is simply going to have to adapt, or get better. The same 'ole - same 'ole isn't going to cut shit anymore.
I love it.
all else is crap otherwise... well, except maybe for alias, westwing, and there are some mad hotties on that new las vegas show... ;/
;(
oh, and no more buffy either...
and yes, I am an avid gamer, and tend to either tivo, or download episodes of the net at my leisure.
"Computer games don't affect kids; I mean if Pac-Man affected us as kids, we'd all be running around in darkened rooms,
Games r more funner that than the telivsion. + my mom doesn't like me waching two much tv.
Geminatron
Anyways, the only things worth watching reruns of the Simpsons, which is better than any new stuff that's put out, and hockey. If I want to watch an actual tv show, I'll just download it for a more convenient time; and commercial free!!!
Well its already happening to some degree already. In EA Sports games all the advertisements in a stadium are for real companies and products though you could just say that's a byproduct of trying to go for realism but i've started to see it in other genres of video games too, In Enter the Matrix in the Airport there were ads for the Pentium 4 and Nvidia plastered around.
There used to be a sense of connection with other people after watching a popular show. I could talk about a show with my friends at school -- but rarely can we all actively do the same thing at the same time anymore (such as watch the same shows). This is compounded by the fact we've seen it all, and the stuff we haven't seen is just something better experienced on our own.
TV just isn't exciting. I can see how hard they're trying to make it exciting by using shock value -- it won't help in the end. I don't care what other stupid actors/actresses and common blow joe on reality TV is doing. These people are idiots, why should I try to live my life through these idiots?
I'd rather play a game than watch TV. At least I'm taking charge of my interaction. I can also talk to other people while doing it. I can IM my friends and hook up a game whenever we have the time.
I never understood why people watch sports. Why watch basketball when I can play basketball? But it goes even further with videogames. We can participate in things we can't do in real life; whether it's using magic in an RPG, racing a car in a simulation, or doing a rocket jump in an FPS. We can express our laughs and frustration througha quick text message.
In order for me to consider watching TV again, TV needs to supply images and information I can't get online. It needs to provide entertainment beyond the mindless reused crap on air currently. TV is not tailored like the internet. Having 100 channels of commericials is not what I want to spend my time on. Fitting my schedule around a show that actually has some meaning is something I could have most likely read on the internet.
There used to be a connection with TV, and it's pretty much dead. TV is my last resort in how I spend my time. I don't own a TV or listen to the radio -- after using the internet, they both seem to be just drawing me further away from the connection I want to have to information and my friends.
If someday the internet was to vanish, there would always be a good book and a telephone.
It never ocurred to them that HBO is kicking all the 'Free' TV stations in the behind because HBO has the cohones to produce shows that people want to see.
Then again the ABC's of this world are P-Whipped by the Advertizers and Local affiliates in the sense that the ABC's cave to their wishes. They will never be bold enough to ignore them and go in new directions.
Look at what happened to Futurama. Perfect example.
The only new shows worth watching this season are the Sopranos and Kid Notorious (Comedy Central). Both Cable shows who's formulas for sucess are ones that the 'Free' TV stations will NEVER touch.
Dolemite
____________________
Save the World! Use a Quote!
http://www.nomoremrniceguy.com/forums/
It's already happening.
.. I'd hate to see my rocket launcher firing cola bottles all of a sudden.
Take a look at Valve's (Half-Life, Counter-Strike, etc.) Steam.
Steam is, to say it simply, a server-browser and integrated patching system.
And indeed, it has banners during level loads, server browsing, and probably some other places.
It's not that annoying thankfully
The path I walk alone is endlessly long.
30 minutes by bike, 15 by bus.
> did u see teh story about wathcing less tv??/
> Terrorists Win
> gg
> wtf!
> camping fag
> 0vRl0rd-[WFX]- is cheating
> fuck yuo!!!!!1
> gg
> your jus pissd cuz i shot yuor head
> 0vRl0rd-[WFX]- is cheating
> 0vRl0rd-[WFX]- is cheating
> 0vRl0rd-[WFX]- is cheating
> stfu
> 0vRl0rd-[WFX]- is cheating
> no flash grnades retard
> cover me!
> HOW DO I PICK UP TEH WAEPONS???
> im swtiching sides
> wtf?
> gota go, homework
In other news, scientists have discovered a startling increase in the use of w00t! on the internet. Scientists are baffled by its meaning. Overly sensitive special interest groups blame violent video games for this bizzarre phenomenon.
"There is no spoon." - The Matrix
I wander door to door, when called, town to town, fixing up computers, vcr's... occasional tv or stereo, and there's one thing I've always noticed when I'm in these houses, the tv channel their on. Occasionaly, but rarely, it'll be a sporting event, on satellite or cable. Sometimes, more often, it will be a soap.. or some pointless dribble. 90%, its either Cartoons, or the Disney channel, even if there's no kids in the house!. The other 2% or so are watching either the history channel, or the discovery channel. So basically, people are still watching, they're just watching things they like, rather than the NBC, CBS, ABC pointless crap reality shows.
*There's Klingons on the starboard bow, scrape em off Jim!*
Maybe the demographic is changing because there are fewer 18-24 year olds being made. We don't get ABC here or the WB or UPN, but CBS and NBC are almost 100% pure crap. This mornijng Les Moonves was bragging about how shows like "Everybody Loves Raymond" and "CSI" (chicken shit idiocy) are destined to become the next classics on the order of "MASH" and "All In the Family." And maybe he's right 0 hell, Lawrence Welk still gets rerun on PBS like it was once some piece of great highbrow entertainment, and so far as I can see that was just pure shit, too. So in twenty years maybe the current crop will reflect how shit things were now, but people will be nostalgic for it just because they're idiots just like their grandparents were.
Oops. Anyway, I know I watch much less TV than I did just last year. And I skip many of the shows I used to think I like - ER, Frasier, etc. The only shows I KNOW I like are the reality shows everyone seems to find fashionable to trash. Given the choice between fear mongering crap like CSI or the jingoist cheeleading of Jag, those "reality shows" are pure gold.
It seems to me he's "sorta" right. It's online communities that's leading people away, but not just gaming. I've never been much of a gamer, but I sure find bitching about life on /. more entertaining than vegging over yet another moronic murder "action mystery." Even the news isn't worth watching - why the fuck should I give give 30 minutes a day of my life to assimilating the corporate propoganda? This morning I checked out "Today" just for the hell of it - I turned it off in disgust after about three minutes of Katy Couric's ultraliberal feminazi claptrap.
Ratings are down because TV sucks ass and people are, thanks to online alternative viewpoints, beginning to realize just why it sucks. The chickens have come home to the corporate roost, so to speak... their reign is as doomed as the dodo.
At some point, continued watching of network television programming causes so much atrophy of brain tissue that people lose even the ability to recall what sucks and what doesn't, so like moths they dance around towards whatever flickering light catches their ever fleeting attention span.
In other words, 99.999% of most programming is horrible, formulaic, brain-sucking crap that is indistinguishable from the intersperced commercials (except the commercials have more character development and plot).
I think what is happening because of the internet is that people are able to find their own niche interests that are not mainstream. Because these interests are so specific it is nearly impossible to mass market things on TV or on other traditional mediums.
It's not just that the programs are crap, it's that they're crap filled with ads.
I buy my Andromeda on DVD. I don't pay for it by watching ads. If there are any SciFi producers out there: Screw the stations, produce for Region 0 DVD. Put up a BitTorrent link for your pilot and a "buy it now" link on your website.
I've got a 13 inch television. It was purchased in 1981, last time it was turned on was in 1999. It worked then, but I've re-arranged furniture since and never bothered to plug it back in. I watch television at my friend's homes when there's a reason for a group of us to do so (hockey game or some such), but that's about it. If there's more like me, then the internet is definitely to blame for TV program's falling ratings. :)
Hey, they cancel the one show I watch, guess what? I won't be watching TV. Simple.
FOX "News". All the writers that the networks never bothered to hire back after the strike, replacing them instead with pointless "reality" shows like Survivor, Elimidate, 5th Wheel. QVC and NBC Home Shopping channels. Jerry and Maury. Round-the-clock infomercials.
The real reason is that the general quality of television is at the lowest it has EVER been. Even the Honeymooners beat the crap out of what's on today. When Teletubbies and Mr. Ed reruns are the best thing on, you can bet your sweet Neilson Box that anybody with a computer is going to walk out of the room and go turn it on. I'd rather visit the goatse man than sit through five minutes of Temptation Island or Joe Millionaire or watching buff bimbos have to choke down a bowl of maggots to make it to the next round. Shoot me now!
Of course hes right, and if you ask me it's pretty obvious. I'm a young male and I spend a much larger percentage of my time with games than I do watching TV, I'm sure if I didn't have games then my TV viewing time would be much much higher. Most of my friends are the same way.
I don't know why half the people in this discussion want to blame crap tv shows either. Christ, 80's television was total ass, the stuff we have today is lightyears better.
Yes, gaming is doing it, yes I'm fine with that. No I really don't care if the industry runs into problems because of it.
Sigs are awesome huh?
What worth watching now that Buffy the Vampire Slayer has finished it's run?
Last I checked there weren't millions of people playing CS.
Can't wait for the TV studios to get wind of bittorrent.
I know what the real cause is of falling ratings. These things called books! They capture a potential TV victim for hours without even one advertisement! How fucking dare they. They are stealing money that is ours.
-- taking over the world, we are.
$250 laptops!
1) The shows suck by and large
2) the shows that are ANY good get moved from time slot to time slot, due to the stupidity of the "programming" managers
3) The cost of doing quality programs has gone through the roof for no apparent reason.
I would take several decent black and white shows over any 'reality" TV crap.
My Dempgraphic is the 50 Plus Demographic, and I have the MONEY! 18 to 30 year olds simply do not have the cash to matter in the commercial TV world. Wake up and smell the cashflow! If you aer old enough to remember the Twilight Zone, The Outer Limits and the like, you found more content per show in a thirty minute to an hour time frame than you see today in a 2 hour episode of Joe Millionaire! Hey I liked American Idol and all it's spinoffs, but that is mere fluff for the mind.
Public TV is full of commercials disguised as , well not disguised at all. When you mention a Company and a product or service, then it is a commercial! Nuff said. I am a big fan of the Antiques Roadshow, but I find the Dan Elias bits to be pure shit, I watch the Roadshow to see stuff and what it is worth, not the cultural history of some backwater burg with an equally unimpressive artist. I say Can Dan! That is all I have to say...Not!
but ive been to bus... cya my turn to plant da bomb.
How the hell did they draw that conclusion? Seriously, even more interesting is how do they calculate viewers? Or better still, the popularity of a show?
I was reading a few months back that this season is the best in 10+ years, etc... Who the hell came to that conclusion, and based on what data? There is only one single new show I like (Las Vegas, on NBC), and even that is just better than average, not amazing, all the other stuff on primetime is crap! And all networks (FTA or Cable/Sat only) are simply taking an existing show and putting it back out with a new name, and new cast. Fox's OC is 90210 rehashed, Countless Reality shows, etc... even Discovery and TLC are dropping to new lows... How many Monster 'fill in the blank' shows can they produce... it's novel if it's a single show, not when it's 10.
I'm willing to bet that if I went to a major city, and asked 100 random people in a shopping mall to rate this season's TV, it wouldn't come close to the reported 'amazing new season, best in 10 years' crap that came from all the previews in August. Of course viewing is at a record low, that's obvious, the fact that execs are surprised and need to find something to blame is surprising... There is only so long that you can keep telling yourself it's not shit, but eventually you do taste it... These execs are dumber than I though possible.
---
Programming is like sex... Make one mistake and support it the rest of your life.
Best. Slayer. Evar.
It took me a long time, but I'm coming to grips that games are becoming too much like reality. Honestly, when I get home, I don't want to interact with anybody. I want to disconnect, and these MMOGs aren't helping me.
Just like advertisers and companies had to deal with the radio to TV shift, they will have to deal with another. Will it be a complete and saturating shift, like radio to TV? Or just partial? We'll see on that one.
Not too many crowd around the radio to listen to news, sitcoms, music and sports, but at one time
that's what they did. Music is still listened to
on the radio, but news, sitcoms, and sports are on TV, and people crowd around the TV. And now more
people depend on the internet and their computers
for entertainment.
I would expect more companies to begin advertising in games. You know, as you run around in one of them, you'll see Coke signs, IBM, Ford, Dell, etc.
Vip
I sold my TV 3 years ago and haven't looked back since. I get my entertainment from books, the Internet, and games. Living without a TV was tough for about the first 6 months and then I stopped missing it. I don't smoke, but I wonder if it's something akin to giving up a cigarette habit..
When I am exposed to TV these days (at bars or at a friends house) I can't get over just how much garbage is on it. Not only are the shows bad, the news seems to be aimed at 9 year olds. The final insult is the advertising which seem more and more to appeal to the emotional side (buy this SUV and you'll feel like you're roaring through the mountains!) as opposed to practical advantage (sucks less, costs less, works better).
While TV, video games, and the Internet are all time sinks (and I believe there's data that backs this next claim up) - people tend to use their brains more while playing video games or using the net. And, to me, that can only be a good thing!
To see a world in a grain of sand, and then to step back and see the beach where the sand lies
If you live on the West Coast and get East Coast satellite feeds. But that's pretty contrived.
The continually-more-immersive nature of console and computer gaming has also been taking its toll on the pencil-and-paper roleplaying game (viz D&D, Vampire: The Masquerade, etc.) market. In various threads on forums like RPGnet's or gaming newsgroups, some game fans suggest that it's a lot easier to have a fun and immersive experience looking at pixels on the screen than it is to try to run a live game amid distractions ("Where's the cheetos!") and with other players who can detract from the fun of the experience ("I cast magic missile...at the darkness!"). Where RPGs used to sell in vast numbers, now the figures have declined to where a thousand copies sold is considered a smashing success. (CCGs may be partly to blame for that, but not anywhere near entirely.)
You have to admit, computer and console games have gotten a lot more involved over the years, be they single-player simulations or shoot-em-ups or team games, and they offer a heck of a lot more depth of play than in bygone days. And as a benefit over TV, they're more interactive and thus mentally stimulating. You feel like you're doing instead of just seeing.
And in terms of sales, I've seen articles about how computer games are threatening to eclipse even the movie industry...
Anyway, I kind of think the author of that article is onto something.
Editor Emeritus and Senior Writer, TeleRead.org
When something on television is more entertaining than playing Neverwinter Nights or Metroid Prime I'll watch it. Until then I'll stick to video games. When the choices of shows range from boring sitcoms to unreality TV my interest wanes. I would rate farting on a snare drum as more entertaining than the latest sitcom from ABC. I'm not in any of the demographics prime time television is aiming at and thus prime time television has nothing to offer me.
The shows I have been interested enough in to actually watch have all been taken off the air. Family Guy, Futurama, and God, The Devil, and Bob. Making prime time safe for conservatives and kiddies is not going to get my eyeballs glued to the screen. I suspect the situation is the same for other people more like me than the prime time demographic.
We'll watch something interesting on cable or flip on a game instead of watch Ten Rules (RIP JR.) or Survivor MLCXXIII Sebastopol. Most of the time though I'll go somewhere with my friends or take a walk. I find night time walks during the new Fall television seasons are to be especially nice. There's few people out and about and the glow of the televisions in livingrooms make up for broken street lamps. Sometime I feel like the Stranger walking down the sidewalk.
I'm a loner Dottie, a Rebel.
It will look a little something like this.
ASCII stupid question, get a stupid ANSI
They said it themselves:
Martin said many of the critics he's talked to across the country are surprised at how the quality of writing has slipped for many returning shows on all networks.
I cut off the cable and sold my tv almost 3 years ago. After seeing Babylon 5 it became very clear to me that pretty much everything else sucked by comparison.
It's called "100Mbit optic broadband".
I see a TV-show i like? *click* *click* *typetypetype* *click* *few minutes mintues* *done* *watch*
News? Slashdot.
GAAH! MY PRINTER IS ON FIRE!!! PUT IT OUT! PUT IT OUT!
No annoying commercials! At least in game you can put people on /ignore !! If I could stop the constant bombardment of advertisements, I'd probably go back to watching TV, but you can't seem to sit for more than six minutes before you're interrupted by the network news propagating FUD teasers, being told you're too fat or too poor, or that the new H2 will give your life meaning. The invasion of television commercials has made the signal-to-noise ratio of television unbearable (not that most programming isn't mindless in the first place, but you can't even watch the Discovery channel anymore without having your train of thought mowed down by that dumbass from Video Professor hawking "FREE CDs!!")
It's ridiculous. It's like someone set up a drum set in my living room and goes into a solo every six minutes, for six minutes.
Does anyone have any data on the proliferation of commercial air time compared to actual content on television? It seems to me that commercial breaks are even more numerous and longer. This is the one defining element of gaming that has not been so brutally co-opted, though I know we're seeing that change as well.
The revolution was not televised and it's over. Broadcast TV sucks and something better has replaced it. I get my mail, news, entertainmet and much more on the net. Deal with it or die.
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.
TV executives blame video-games for a drop off in viewership, and the news outlets owned by the same people call for video-games to be banned...
ASCII stupid question, get a stupid ANSI
Another reason to by a Tivo. Watch want you want and do important stuff the rest of the time, like read a book!
I do hope that the TV executives are seeing this but I doubt it they are probably thinking of the next big hit show -- "Survivors go cannibal". GAWWWWD! What a hit that would be....
Isn't it entirely possible that the decline is due to the utter CRAP we have to watch on TV nowadays? Hmmm?
I think you'll find that this was completely covered in a patent filing some two years ago.
The advertising boys will have to pay to use games as an advertising medium.
unlucky!
At any rate, I didn't notice it was him until a little ways into the movie, and when I did realize it, all I could think was (to use your eloquent term) "fap fap fap." Totally ruined the movie. Maybe it was "Blow," but I can't be sure.
Besides shows on TV being utter crap. I also finding the commericals are becomming more and more annoying.
i am sure radio took ratings from barn dances and campfire ghost stories, i am sure TV took ratings from Radio, and the internet took ratings from TV, and gaming has taken ratings from TV too...
its progress, don't stand in the way, you might get run over...
seriously ... between:
o more channels than ever before
o more video consoles than ever before
o more online/interactive games
o that intraweb thing
o more movies on dvd
o whole series being released on dvd
o recycled television line-ups
where are those viewers going? so many things to choose from, it will take something with a very strong appeal to draw viewers back in.
given the large amount of crap on tv these days, i don't think they'll ever enjoy the same numbers they've had in the past.
perhaps the heyday is over, and they should stop trying to find something to blame it on.
I have a 5 year old who won't watch TV at all. If he has to, he fiddles with the channels, the volume, the widescreen/normal, the teletext. As soon as he can, he gets off it back onto the 'net, playing Spongebob flash games, looking for Homestar easter eggs, hanging out on Sesame Street ... when he can, he'll play Total War for hours -- I've had to hide Quake in case he finds it.
The key is interaction, folks, it's feedback. It's playing around, and seeing the effect of your actions. In ten years time, that little guy will not own, or even want, a TV. In 20 years he'll have one to amuse the crusties when they visit.
My reading time is before bed. The hit it takes is not so bad.
I can listen to music while gaming. Music is nice and I have a whole ancient computer dedicated to pumping it out to an even older stereo. I also enjoy music while doing other things like bike riding. Ogg files play nice on Open Zaurus. 64MB flash is cheap and plays an hour or so. Music is one of those things you can enjoy while doing other things. If only those idiots at the RIAA would spontaneously combust, the world would be a nicer place. Tauzin, I'm talking about you!
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.
the fact is a lot of people like these reality this, real life that, american wannabe type shows and few people like TLC, Discovery, Travel etc. If you're into computer gaming chances are you won't like these soap or reality type shows. My gf will sit in front of the tv and watch all these crappy shows and I'll watch techtv or cnn or sports/cartoons. I think what the article is trying to get at is gamers don't watch tv at all, so it doesn't matter what is on they just don't care anymore. They are ignoring the medium.
did you forget to take your meds?
She's at it again? Maybe your problem is you suck in bed and your roomate is obviously better.
Hey, first real post on /. so, yay for me, even though im an Anonymous Coward still...anyway..
/. ... all of it is much much more entertaining..
:/
Im a college freshmen, and have been living in my dorm for about 2 months without a TV. Period. All I need is a computer and im set, and its been like that ever since...i owned my own computer..
TV is boring, the stuff on it is crap...playing games, being online, reading
Now, all I have to do is figure out how to set up Linux on this comp..
I agree that TV programs have declined in their style and attractiveness quite a bit. However saying, that games are the reason for causing people to watch less TV probably is not a 100% true statement.
Does anyone read the rankings? (of most popular shows) The Simpsons (a popular show for young males 18-24) remains about number 30 every week. That is in comparison to all TV shows (while others that are watched by mostly a different type of people (soap opera's) have remains also in the same spot. More or less what I am saying is that overall TV viewership is on the decline. Counterstrike... yea right.
The Internet is more likely to be the cause. (oh, TV has always sucked to a group of people - saying TV is any better than 5 years ago is crap. People that were our age [right now] 5 years ago probably though TV was crap also.)
There is always a frontier where there is an open and willing mind
Good thoughts, wish I had mod points. Personally I agree, I can't get tivo in canada, so I get to either watch tv shows on tv, or buy the DVDs, and if it's something that's honestly a good show that I want to watch (a la, buffy, angel, 24, etc) I'll pay the money for it (and I have). However, people putting crappy programming up for download in BT are going to find the same thing that the record companies have found, that if people have the choice they'll ignore the crap.
An average line up for a night's programming (UK tv):
show about a couple going house hunting
show about two people buying a house and doing it up
show about a pair of people building a house from scratch
Show about two people who bought a house last year on a tv show and have redecorated it since.
Hmmm, interesting. As a 24 year old bloke, just what I want to watch. I think I'll go play BF1942.
Maybe it's a little bit offtopic since the article was about network tv, but I'm still suprised to see that nobody's mentioned Adult Swim. I'm also a college freshman, with a tuner card in my pc that gets dusted off exactly once a week: sunday night at 11. Everything else is crap, even most of the cable networks now... what the hell happened to Discovery, TLC and the like? All you see there nowadays are "In Search Of" ripoffs and english car chases.
Something distinct that people will remember better than my name
if you want "No More Hiroshimas" then I say "You First. No More Pearl Harbors."
As far as I'm concerned marginalizing such serious computer gaming is just as daft as marginalinzing Wimbeldon, The PGA or the World Cup would be. They're all just "games," and all of them only draw their import from the fact that people give them import.
That's an interesting point. I think that online games have much more import than televised ones, because I can *participate* in the games online. It's entertaining to watch sports, I guess, but online, when the outcome of the game depends on me personally (and my teammates of course), it tends to get my adrenaline going a bit better.
Not many televised sports involve machine guns and rocket launchers, either. That would be pretty cool if they did, though:
Shoom... KA-BLAM!
Announcer: "Oh! And the quarterback is toast! Wait... it looks like a penalty's been called on this play..."
Ref: "Spawn camping, Number 51, Axis... fifteen yard penalty."
Ph-nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn.
I don't watch TV at all. No cable, not even an antenna on the TV that is here for PS2 use in the bedroom. Call me crazy, but I'd rather spend my time doing something interactive.
My news comes from websites, not the evening TV News. At least web news is at my own pace, rather than me having to wait through a bunch of pointless information to see the one or two things I care about.
If I want to "veg out" I pick a relatively mindless game to play. To me that's still better than just staring mindlessly at talking heads, or various contrived shows.
The current crop of TV shows does not encourage me to return to watching it either. Why do I need 'reality' TV? I already deal with enough reality on a day to day basis. Games offer new worlds to explore, and in some cases new people to actually meet and interact with. Rather than just watching another life, you can LIVE another life.
I don't miss it in the slightest. The few shows that are even close to being worth watching don't justify cable bills. It's not that I can't afford it, I just don't feel there's enough value in it. My roommates had cable in my previous apartment, which I made little to no use of, now that it's just me and my significant other, we don't have any form of TV reception, and my life is better for it.
--ExInferus
Well, as someone who was once hooked to every half decent show, the last year has seen me ignore my DVD collection, the final Season of Buffy, and even almost forgot to tape the first episode of 24 series 3... the cause - Shadowbane...
A thought did occur to me though - couldn't some or all that talent be used to create better events in our new virtual worlds...?
Heh: This Quest brought to you by "Ford: Built Tough as your Centaur Crusader"....
Last year I timed the commercials and found the major networks (ABC, FOX, UPN, etc) all had 16 minutes of commercials per hour (or was it 18?), if you don't count the split screen during credits as commercials. I timed them again at the beginning of the fall season and found it hadn't changed.
So the timing didn't change this year, but in a Mash special last year I cought mention that episodes used to be 26 minutes and 20 seconds. And Mash isn't an ancient series.
This year I also checked the duration and timing of commercials within episodes and confirmed something that seemed obvious: the commercials get closer and closer together toward the end of the program. News programs are the worst, with programming segments at the end of the program being shorter than the commercials.
I've been meaning to set up a web site with history and statistical data on commercial TV but I couldn't really care less anymore. I've given up on TV.
Amy
I am suprised they mentioned CS instead of EQ. I personally know far more people who play EQ then play CS. I personally play both, and have been for the past 4 years.
... damn good show, been watching it since the first season. ... mainly because thats what my family likes to watch durring dinner. I don't turn on the TV just to watch that.
... it makes me sick. When people don't like whats on TV, they will find other things to ammuse them selfs. Online gaming plays a big role in this, and its not just the 18 - 24 crowd. I know plenty of people in there 40s playing EQ and what not.
... no, it was becuase the movie sucked ass. Sorry, but I dont spend my money on movies that look bad.
Outside of work, I spend most of my time coding and/or playing EQ or CS. I typically only watch TV for 2 things.
1) 24
2) Charmed
Once in a while I will get a chance to watch the Simpsons or what not. But, its pretty rare.
Most of the shows on TV these days suck. I can't stand watching things like "Friends"
Its kind of like when they said that internet piracy was to blame for the bad sales of "The hulk"
until (succeed) try { again(); }
Am I the only one who watches TV while playing games?
Coder's Stone: The programming language quick ref for iPad
I think, however, that it might point to a new trend
I think one may draw an analogy with animated films or comic books. It used to be that people watched animated films as children and then they grew up and didn't watch them anymore. That is no longer true: look at the popularity of anime films for instance. Or even Disney films which seem half-aimed at an adult audience today. Same with comic books: where once was Donald Duck and Superman, today you may find American Splendor.
Naturally, if people play games for a longer period of their lives, then the larger the group of people playing and the more hours spent playing. This increased time spent on gaming means less time spent watching television (given the same amount of hours leisure time). If they also spend more hours per day playing games (as opposed to merely hours per life-time) then they have even less time to watch television (given 24h per day). The only way television could compete with that natural phenomenon would be to broadcast better and more attractive programmes, i.e., not just as good as before but actually better. Given the plethora of 'reality' shows (does anyone actually watch Survivor?) at the moment, I don't think that has happened just yet.
The liver is evil and must be punished.
More specifically, its the network promos. It was hard to sit and watch the World Series with another ad for Skin and then Joe Millionaire 2 every 10 minutes. I watch 2 TV shows all week. I was trying to watch a third last night and got antsy after 20 minutes because of the ads and went upstairs and played Day of Defeat.
Yeah, I should probably read more instead of playing video games, but they are better than TV. If I had a TiVo or if they gave us uninterrupted television I might watch more.
Don't moderate flamebait as Troll. Know the difference or you will be Meta-moderated.
As someone who has litterally stopped watching TV since the 1.2 beta release of Counter-Strike, I am really someone they want to reach.
The problem is, I don't even own a TV. Perhaps a alternative may exist already: Nullsoft TV
I like watching Futurama episodes when I've got the time, but going and sitting down, taking time out of my day to watch commercials for 15 minutes an hour doesn't really appeal to me.
http://www.fsckin.com/
Other than sports, I haven't watched a TV show live in years. I either record it for viewing later (skipping the commercials) or do without. Plus now, you figure if a show is any good, it will be released on DVD in a year or two.
When I was a boy, there was a sense of urgency about watching TV, because if you missed an episode, it was gone forever. That's just not true anymore.
He decided to just watch the government, and kind of scale it down to size, and run his life that way. --Laurie Anderson
Maybe if TV didn't suck so bad on average people would pay attention to it more often. I mean, who are the geniuses who canceled Family Guy and Futurama instead of giving them better time slots? And the Simpsons is beating the proverbial dead horse every new episode-- you can tell it's uninspired committee written scripts; utter crap.
Serious, last time I started watching TV? Firefly. Loved it. They cut it before it had a chance.
Before that? Enterprise.. 4 Episodes, I was hoping. Hopes were dashed.
Before that? Earth: Final Conflict, Loved it. First Season. They changed the team behind it and trashed the quality so bad the fan sites turned into hate sites.
Before that? Babylon 5. Love it. JMS spoiled me. The only time I can recall that I wasn't disappointed by a show, they didn't cancel it with all the ends loose and they didn't change it to be a Voyager clone.
Before that? MTV.. Liked it, When it played Music.
The common theme here is that every show/channel I liked they took away or completely changed. They dropped Firefly so fast that I had only seen 2 episodes before they killed it. HINT: Once you've lost the viewer they won't sample all your new shows on premier night, give it some time to attract viewers *or* advertise it brutally and in places we'll see the ads.. Like Penny Arcade.
Don't blame reality TV for falling ratings. First, the offerings are back down to a reasonable number. Fear Factor, Survivor, and Joe Millionaire are the only ones I can think of running on the networks. After the glut two years ago, we are seeing a return of comedies and dramas, big time. I can't remember when I've seen as many new dramas as have come out this year.
As others have pointed out, blame the quality of the programming. Many of those new shows have already been tossed in the dumpster. Older shows are coasting (South Park's RIAA episode was okay, crab people was lame) or haven't started yet (I'm looking at you, Fox). There are also few shows with a hook to get you watching week to week. Paramount won't force Star Trek to be anything other than episodic in nature. CSI and the bunch have followed the Law and Order thing. There's absolutely no reason for me to make sure I watch it next week.
Maybe something can be learned from 24 and Sopranos. Each tells a compelling story with week to week continuity. I think Sopranos succeeds better at bringing in new viewers, but can't be 100% sure without seeing the ratings trends.
Unfortunately, much of this is nothing new. The networks have spent the past 50+ years churning out variations on the same 'hot theme'. (Even back in the radio days, there were several variations on Gunsmoke, Paladin, Matt Dillon, etc, etc.) But when radio went to TV, the same people stayed in charge, so they didn't bitch (as much) about losing radioshare. What is different is that people have an alternative that isn't owned by NBC or CBS (old Westinghouse, FWIW). You better believe that if NBC owned Rockstar Studios or if CBS owned Sony Online Ent. they wouldn't be complaining. As much.
There is also the issue where the networks attempt to appeal to all people. This insures that they appeal to almost none. The cable stations can afford to be niche marketed. ABC et al. find themselves trying to sell Ford Tauruses while Discovery, Comedy Central, etc. can sell PT Cruisers and New Beetles. Sure, you may hate 'em, but somebody loves 'em enough to keep them in business and doing well.
So, all you upmodded reality TV haters, try and expand your vision a little bit. The situation is hardly as simple as that.
Jesus was all right but his disciples were thick and ordinary. -John Lennon
Read my sig. BTW.
Good shows get canned and utter crap (reality TV) takes over all the airwaves, and they are wondering why we're not watching anymore?
IMPORTANT MESSAGE TO ALL TV EXECS FOLLOWS:
If you move a show around week after week until even its most dedicated fans have no idea when is on, its ratings will drop.
Not because nobody wants to watch the show, because no one can.
Firefly , Futurama, Family Guy, etc. They are good shows, fun shows, shows people want to watch over and over again, but CAN'T because they get put in the Random Shifting Mystery Time Slot of Death and then cancelled for "low ratings" and replaced with boring, run of the mill cookie-cutter snore fests.
Yeah, I'll play videogames instead, at least I can rely on my game to be the same game next time I load it and not be pre-empted by a tv preacher telling me I'm going to hell unless I give him money to finance the next preempting of my TV show.
THIS IS THE IMPORTANT PART:
Respect your viewers, and for god's sake never ever again justify your decisions with the phrase "nobody ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the america public"!
</rant>
You can't take the sky from me...
Because if I wanted to watch a "homosexual comedy hour", i'd hang out at Starbucks and see it in 3D.
Bowie J. Poag
everything will be changed then.
A total mind shift.
Total revolution.
Hdtv on demand.
choose your poisin.
It will kick ass and the big 3 network will finally die out.
VGA boxes are available for at least Dreamcast, PS2, GameCube, and Hbox, and is a PC running a Knoppix or Gentoo live-CD that much different from a console? My gaming console has a VGA output. So is my 15" LCD necessarily a TV?
Better definition: A TV is a video display with a TV tuner. A "TV tuner" is defined by your national broadcast regulator.
Will I retire or break 10K?
Has everything to do with the clit centered universe that only exsist on tv. Fuck'em, I like being discarded like a used tampon.
I think the major networks should have taken the warning writer Alvin Toffler mentioned some 34 years ago in his most famous book, The Third Wave.
In that book, Toffler mentioned that as communications technology improves, this drastically increases the choices for people wanting their entertainment and information, and as a result the high ratings of TV networks in the past will never happen again; he called this concept the demassification of the media.
Since 1979 (the year The Third Wave as published), we've had the following:
1. Videocasette recorders (and now increasingly personal video recorders) effectively destroying the concept of prime time. Why stay up to watch The Late Show with David Letterman when you can watch it the next morning from a recording?
2. Cable TV with its 60-plus channels and direct-broadcast satellite TV with its 200-plus channels has allow for much more niche programming aimed at specific smaller audiences.
3. The rise of pre-recorded home videos, first on videocassettes in the 1980's and now on DVD since 1997 has allowed home viewers to see recent movie hits and even complete TV seasons!
4. The rise of the public Internet since the early 1990's has taken away a LOT of TV viewers, especially since the Internet can be considered a true interactive medium.
Small wonder why the TV networks are suffering nowadays.
Commercials
... that crank up the volume on breaks.
How many ads are in games? ZERO.
Sneaky Networks
Fox Network Admins
Last year Boston Public was milked for all it was worth. They skimped on it, put off the premier till like November. This year they learned and had the premier early on. Fox ruined Dark Angel, too, by cutting the budget and playing the surprise game.
The Surprise Game
Guess what? Your show isn't on tonite because we have this *insert stupid special or network excuse*. Stick to the fucking schedule or fuck off I'm playing Quake.
Stupidity
How many shows started off in the first year with a bang but lost all credability in the second year? Dark Angel. Boston Public. Ally McBeal. Shit, most of the shows being launched are totally stupid, except for a couple. Enterprise was stupid in the first year, but at least now it's getting really good, imho.
Repitition
Keep playing all the same shows on cable or sat and you get a lot of bored viewers who just tune out. Re-runs and double-ups are a sleeping networks answer to bad planning and dwindling budgets. Problem is, it's the cause and the some idiots at the networks think it's the answer -- at the same time!
The Video Game Market is Flooded
There are so many titles out right now for video games. It's the best it has ever been, and even while every game is like a varriant of about five archetypes, at least there is a variety that hasn't been there before, among copy-cats. The games that will stick out are going to break ground, no questions asked.
DooM 3
When DooM 3 comes out, who will want to watch TV at all? The DooM 3 experience is like watching TV or a film, but controlling the characters and propelling the storyline. Id Software is setting the bar for the new video games, and that can only mean one thing. We are aiming toward an eventual fusion between film and video game, that brings them closer than they have ever been. People are going to say FUCK commercials, give me more action and less bullshit. Stop wasting my time.
It's my money... I'll always spend it on the number one value. To me, that is GAMES.
The shows that really have mastered how to create an experience worthy of my time are CSI and CSI Miami. They know quality, and they will build loyalty of an audience as along as they keep giving us what we come to see... quality.
Wow, it sure took 'em long enough to notice that gamers have more interesting things to do than watch their trashy, non-entertaining shows. I don't even remember the last time I sat down and watched TV (unless a polygonal TV in Mega Man Legends 2 counts {credit goes to The Mega Man Home Page for the image - I didn't want to /. their server}) - it's been THAT long. The only reason I even have a TV is for playing games on consoles, and watching the occasional movie on DVD (and even then, I sometimes watch the DVDs on my PC).
...soon we will get to watch commercials for the rest of the round after we die in counterstrike?
The unofficial
Television is advertising interrupted by shows. It's that simple. The ads are enough to drive a reasonable person completely out of their mind. If I hear one more "sound happy now" female voice explain in excruciating detail how wonderful life is in her personal suburban paradise, or one more "smile at each other now" quasi-yupptified couple enjoying their most recent five-figure material purchase, I'm going to projectile vomit.
Television is all about what's coming up next. It's newscasters, hosts and ads screaming at people not to change the channel. The total amount of time spent not advertising some other product or some other part of the show is negligible. It is the perfect medium for the distracted, erratic and unfocused personality.
Television is the constant playing of the first seven notes of a scale.
Business isn't willing to pay for products, innovation and careers, so we get brands, mortgage commercials and layoffs.
back in 'tha day (pre retail version of CS)
sundays at 9:00 it would be very hard to find a CS game.. everyone would watch the simpsons
but on thoes nights where it was a repeat.. no prob... it was just one of thoes 'quaint' observations i noticed.
The More Knowledge you have the Luckier you Get- J.R. Ewing
It's simple enough. Interactivity. In a game I am in control of the action and the main character and I decide their fate; for good or for ill. On TV it's just the same old shit every fucking week...night after night, new actors same plot...christ, it's toilet and it's time it stopped. Is it any wonder we turn to kick-ass games instead of re-runs of Frasier?
All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain.
Anybody cosidered that maybe young people have a mind of their own and wont put up with the crap that their parents did when there were no alternatives.
:) and watch it in my own time.
I have a phat pipe, If I _really_ wana watch something (very rare) I'll download it ad-aware free
TV is for hooking your console in (if your that way inclined). I live in a little hole with single diget channels and more ads than content, why bother...
Give me a pay per view (at a reasonable price ie. less than my phat pipe costs me a month [its fucking expensive here]), digital, when I want, where I want option and I might just switch too it if has enought content (content IS important!!!). And don't even consider the one episode a week model, that shit don't work anymore.
My 2c, could make you a rich man, but then again, fear of change, and wanting to milk the cow till its dead means not in my life time.
GPLv2: I want my rights, I want my phone call! DRM: What use is a phone call, if you are unable to speak?
Well, last time I checked, there was only one show on TV worth watching: 24. I make it a point to watch every episode of 24 that is played on Fox. Maybe if TV shows were a bit better, I'd make it a point to watch more shows.
Not that the million various reality shows out there aren't interesting. But they're not. I didn't care about the first generation ones, much less the fifteenth.
Trent Polack
www.polycat.net
Doubtless it will be whoever it is that sells Moutain Dew..."now how about a refreshing jew" ;-)
All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain.
ever since i started playing Quake2 in 98, ive hardly watched TV.
Before that i used to always watch for several hours a night.
I tend to spend my couple of hrs free time on irc, playing quake with my clan rather than watching the latest soap opera.
When i had a tv in my room i would then just have MTV/news 24 on as background noise.
- strudles
Oh that's good. I'd watch that. Must see TV
today is spelling optional day.
Reality TV overload! I never liked Survivor. Joe Millionaire, bachelor, any of those, I can't stand. In fact, reality tv is the exact opposite, they put people in unreal situations and film it while they make them gimmicky. There was one "reality" show that I did like. Frontier Quest, a Canadian show that aired on PBS in the US. Why? Because they didn't turn it into a "produced" show making the people do wierd stuff... They were given simple rules, spend one year on the frontier and then they sit back and film it. But in general, if I want to watch something "real" I'll watch the evening news.
So now music, movies, and television are blaming file-trading, text-messaging, and gaming, respectively, for their drop in ratings.
Funny how none of the industry wonks are suggesting the obvious answer, that all three industries' ratings are going down because they are dishing out awful, unmitigated shit season after season.
All's true that is mistrusted
T.V. ratings are declining is because more and more shows are being made to be provocative just for the sake of being provocative, like The Shield and Nip Tuck. There is no real character development, storyline, etc.
Unfortunantly this is a growing trend because more and more people like it "Or at least that's what Corporate America would like us to believe."
This reminds me of the claims of dropping CD sales (here and here). Maybe this has the same cause as the drop in TV viewing? A lot of the same potential reasons seem to apply, at least.
That's about the first mainstream media article, abc no less, that I've seen really accurately describe a computer subculture. He's dead on, too. The reason I don't watch any TV anymore is because computer gaming has filled up that entertainment space.
Really didn't see any mistakes in the article, except maybe implying that 100 people could play on the same server at the same time.
Hmmm...
Games are not just interactive. They also are relatively social. He mentioned how some of the clans have BBQ's together, and actually get to meet each other.
I remember this happening back when I was in the PC Demoscene in college. NAID '96 was the first time I'd met almost all of these people with whom I had spent countless hours with, making, watching, and discussing the various artworks and programs that made up that odd subculture. Online games are bringing people together in a way that TV hasn't. Is it any wonder that cable companies are trying to bring that interactivity to the TV now?
There is a joint report on television "clutter" generated each year by the American Association of Advertising Agencies (AAAA) and the Association of National Advertisers, Inc. (ANA) entitled the Television Commercial Monitoring Report. The latest report I found was for 2002, reporting on 2001 television programming. If you look for the report you'll find a large PDF, but here's a summary.
quoting http://www.ana.net/news/2002/02_14_02.cfm...
"The report showed that on average, non-program minutes reached an all-time high. Of the six dayparts monitored, three set clutter records-early morning (18:02 minutes per hour from 17:44 in 2000), daytime (20:57 in 2001 from 20:03 in 2000), and local news (17:10 from 17:05 in 2000). Although not at record levels for their dayparts, non-program minutes were also high for late night and network news. Prime boasted the only decrease-down to 16:08 from 16:17 last year, the lowest it's been since 1998."
I've occaisionally wondered how advertisers think they can get their message accross in such a crowded commercial environment, and if you read the page you'll find that the advertisers have the same concern, and may actually be arresting the networks' drive toward more and more ad time.
Amy
but I think it is a symptom of the declining quality of whats offered on TV. When the networks are showing 12 hours of programming in a 24 hour period, claiming that showing the same movie for three nights in a row is a BONUS FEATURE instead of a cop-out, when rather than expand programming the US networks add a new stations, dividing the limited pool of original or new material while reaping the benefits of the only true addition, more commercial time to sell to the sponsors. Rather than take advantage of the digital revolution to vary content and provide more, the networks choose to try and re-hash the VHS is going to end the world as we know it argument and seek legal protection for their outdated, unprofitable business plan thru payed legislation, misinformation, outright lies and deception. What do they expect ?
errr....umm...*whooosh* *whoosh* Is this thing on ?
----
---- "Excuse me. Where's the children's gun section?"
Maybe it's just that all the shows this season suck?
Fox has pissed me off. They got rid of firefly and John Doe and gave me Joe Millionaire 2? Go to hell fox.
I can't even name a single show on CBS -- not one.
ABC has nothing I want to watch, just reality shows and lame sitcoms.
I still watch a few things on NBC, like Frasier and the West Wing. However both of these shows have different writers than last season, so perhaps some viewers have simply become alienated.
Of course, the networks will never, ever admit that their problem lies with themselves. So rather than blaming On-line gaming, allow me to offer up the following scapegoat:
What about the availabillity of such shows through bittorrent?
For instance, check out www.suprnova.org.
I'm probably rather atypical in this regard, but I've often not made as much effort to "not miss a show" simply because I know I can always get it later if I do.
has family still being terrorized in Jerusalem
Here's a crazy idea, why don't they LEAVE, they don't belong there.
=> Americas Army
I find the "second run" stations [TNT, WGN, WB, and UPN] to do a much better job at making the good shows available. I'm never around for first-run stuff any more...I work second shift, so it's get a TiVo or you'd better show it again when I'm home! The other good thing about the "seconds" is that they usually commit to at least a whole season of something...and repeat it often enough to catch you up. Things like WB's Super Sunday nite "reruns" or the SciFi mini-series work out great. They also get off cheaper because they get to reuse content 3-4 times a month..and there's enough else on other stations if I'm actually around for a "rerun"
I also like Dish because I can get west coast channels [when the locals don't block] and get a second chance [cheapskate time shifting] to watch stuff when I have the time...Another thing to note for the networks: This is a crappy economy! People have chores, errands, and work to do...not watch TV. The little time they had for TV is now used for catching up email, IM, gamming, /. ..in addition to kids & house. You have to show the..shows when people have time to watch them, and stick with them long enough to build a following! [and KEEP the following when you get it..ala Dark Angel]
Just replace one word:
A typical episode: the SG1 crew has a problem with some alien race.
Why don't they just wipe them out using a banana peel and a rubber band? They have MacGyver for crying out loud!
your video card costs more than your TV. Maybe this reporter was on to something....
I'd say it's a mix of most television content these days being total CRAP and the fact that alot of good games are coming out right now. *Goes back to playing Final Fantasy XI*
Friend: "The NIC is misconfigured..." Me: "No prob, I'll just telnet in and fix it." *Silence*
My son is 12 and has his own TV, VCR and cable in his room, not to mention a few gaming machines. He's not really that geeky or nerdlike (no matter how hard I try to convince him to be), but he tells me that he doesn't watch that much TV anymore. He says he prefers chatting on the web, playing with his dog and reading.
My question is: is he scamming me? I think he might be starting to choke the chicken, but give the outward appearance that he is actually a model child.
Any fatherly advice out there? I don't want to go into [Homer-voice] Why you little! [/Homer-voice] strangulation mode without any backup.
I'd rather play Diakatana, then watch most the crap on TV, but then I cancelled my satalite because the crap to cost ratio is way out of line.
When I pick up the airwaves for free, and 75% is crap, then fine. when I PAY 50bucks a monthand 90% of it is crap, then I'm taking my money elsewhere. likes, say, a computer game.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
we have transended for a population that has nothing to do but watch tv in there off hours, to a population with a bunch of stuff we can do in our homes besides watch TV in our off hours.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
the industry is starting to behave the same way towards Doom3 that it did for Diakatana.
I have only seen 1 screen shot that inpressed me. And that one was made for a teaser, so it may not be the same in the game.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
Reading through the list to date...
Crap on VHF broadcast TV? Doh! Who would have guessed?
Internet gamers mean less viewers? Yup. But an uptick in basketweaving could also mean less viewers.
One reader almost touched on another big reason for the drop in their HBO post (HBO: Its not television, its porn). Namely, we now have access to 500 or more channels of satellite broadcasts which arrive at a little dish for a reasonable monthly fee. When one gets this many choices, one can easily avoid such gems as the conventional broadcasters currently call programming. A dish gets all the over air local broadcast stations... do I watch them? Generally, no.
Would I consider watching them if the quality bar of both programs and commercials went up (not to be confused with color bars and tone, which on some days is actually preferable to "over air" broadcasts)? Sure. Television should educate and entertain... yet today it drops to new lows to hook viewers. Disgusting items like the upcoming hack piece by CBS, which features Barbera Streisand's husband trying to attack and besmirtch the good name of one of the most popular US Presidents in American history by altering truth and rewriting history makes viewers tune away... When you want to send a message, use Western Union. See BS, get a clue.
People shut off their televisions because the news slants in whatever ways best fit the broadcaster's agenda, the entertainment programing is not entertaining and there are better ways to spend one's time. What ever happened to over air broadcasting being in the public interest? If you are really angry about the quality of these networks and stations, write the FCC and get some station licences pulled. When it hurts pocketbooks and bottom line, only then will things change.
Clue: If over air broadcast television gave us something worth coming back to, we would be back... but I certainly won't hold my breath.
3 things:
1. it's time for them to endorse pull or on-demand technologies; there's no reason for me to change my habits or schedule to watch a TV show i might be interested in or to put up with whatever is on the TV at the time i rest on the sofa... web-reared audiences now go for what they want, if TV is not providing it, the internet will. There's a big difference between thinking "let's see, i wonder what's on TV right now" and "gee, right now i'm interested in this thing and i wanna watch something about it"
2. thanks to the media conglomerates consolidating and things across the board being homogenized, i have little interest in most of what's on TV these days; take for example the most agressive consolidator of media and you'll see that being true; rupert murdoch's Fox and etc... News channels such as Faux(fox) News assume i'm a brainwashable retard to the extent i feel outraged and somewhat insulted whenever i have to endure the evident deliberate "unfair and unbalanced" reporting that they do. Their entertainment shows including the reality TV glot and the sleazy nonsnese somehow assume i'm superficial and driven by hedonistic instinct, and if a female then i'm slutty and shopaholic; liberalism and conservatism aside, it's all just to brainwash me into a drone who'll buy products and remain a loyal subscriber; in the form of "you really want this, we'll keep pumping it to you". What's worse is that other and rival media outlets have felt compelled to compete and therefore you often end up with such nonsense on all channels. It's quite remarkable that fox news seems the most aggressively conservative yet fox entertainment is the most sleazy of the mainstream channel. Well it's good to know that the answer to monopoly now is to abandon the medium altogether.
3. the trend towards TV is the same towards that towards mcdonalds and junk food; people no longer want junk unhealthy stuff, they want healthy choices not just in their food but also in their meme intake; recently i've turned into a healthier lifestyle and found that TV such as above was very very unhealthy, i felt happier listening to audiobooks, respectable radio such as BBC and NPR, and reading books, and i felt much healther as a person in mind and consequently in body.
Last year all the big media companies made their biggest profits. This means they sold the most commercials. You can tell by the way tv and radio is carpet bombed with commercials. For every three hours of television programming, one hour is commercials now. The rate is even higher for AM talk radio. I pay about $75/month for digital cable. This means I am paying $25/month to watch commercials. This is also why I am disconnecting that f*cking spam machine.
Please, Please do this if some market researcher asks you why you dont watch TV. Tell them there aren't enough commercials. Tell them that you work 50 hours/week, and you love commercials because it helps you figure out what to buy with all the money you make from working so much. Tell them how much you love all the funny ads, like the bear who builds a beer dispenser out of a bookshelf. Also mention that most of the women are very beautiful on commercials, and you like to see them as much as possible. I think the commercial carpet bombing of tv and radio has alot more to do with this drop off in viewers than most people think. Also, I propose we don't call them commercials anymore. I like "targetted marketing payload" myself.
I am a BIG gamer, but I still watch tv. Just one thing. THERE IS LITTLE GOOD new stough coming out. Cut the BS they brung out, and get some good stough, say farscape, and other shows, and hey maby I would wath more.
On TV: Commercials & lack of choice/control On PC: No Commercials (relative) & mucho choice/control simple decision...
We are lucky that there is no TVAA otherwise we'd see gaming made illegal and honeypot counterstrike servers set up to catch people.
Well, I liked one new show in the last 2 years: .....
Firefly. But it got axed
Let me guess.... TV companies are going to start suing games developers for loss of profit? I think they could make a case for it. After all these companies KNOWINGLY provided games that take people away from television, hurting profit for the good honest billionaires who own the networks. They might even have links to terrorists!!! They must be stopped!
Quoth the article:
Meanwhile, some network executives are blaming Nielsen Media Research, the folks who measure viewer ratings, claiming that the firm's methodology is faulty in this new era of digital cable boxes and satellite dishes. Nielsen, of course, disagrees
I was astounded to find out that to be a 'Neilsen reviewer' you had to watch more than 5 hours of TV per day.
ALL OF THEIR STATS ARE BASED OFF OF THESE PEOPLE!
With that in mind, just how realistic do you thing their stats are going to be to begin with, let alone if a large portion of their viewing population is disappearing from them. Would they even notice until the revolution has them up against the wall?
Zapman
I saw a channel that seemed to be showing the unedited raw footage for "world's scariest police chases", with extra pauses while they waited for something to happen.
I think it was called "Fox News".
For foreign news, it informed viewers that drunk loutish teenagers were called "yobs" in England, and that police would like to discourage them from behaving badly.
Ohhh, poor baby, how dare those evil arabs try and defend their homes from an invading army? You would think that their run-in with the nazi's would be enough to teach Israel the evils of intolerance.
I've been a pretty avid gamer since I got my atari and my C64 way back when. My parents used to say "You play too many games...". This is time when they were just basically watching TV at nite.
My normal reply was just "At least I get to interact and think with a game, with TV it's just passive and you don't think at all."
Even today, I can only find stuff to watch on certain cable stations and NPR - broadcast TV is simply crap and not even worth watching. And many good shows just get canceled so whats the point.
One thing I've noticed is that shows that frequently appeal to what many would consider the "geek" demographic - the same people who would be most into games - seem to to die quickly, get cancelled, get shuffled around a bunch until nobody knows they are on, ect.
Fox's firefly comes to mind. I never watched it, but I know it got some press on slashdot when it came out, and some of my fellow dorky coworkers sweared by it, and it was cancelled quickly. Futurama is another show with a huge geek following that was shuffled around, then cancelled, despite loyal fans. While I'm busting on FOX, I'm pissed they killed Fastlane. Hot chicks, stuff blowing up... maybe a bit thin on plot, but the kind of show that's fun to watch after a long day, and that appeals to many of the same kind of people who game. UPN's The Sentinal (now on SciFi) used to have a pretty loyal geek following.
There are probably a ton more examples. If TV wants to appeal to young, computer savy guys, they should stop cancelling shows that are liked by young, computer savy guys. I know lots of people like myself who liked the above shows, and very few people under 40 who watch Survivor et al.
I have blog like everyone else
..makes me wanna shoot stuff, not aviod TV by default. Thought I usually have it on when I play.
-Valiss
I had no idea there was a decline in TV ratings. I guess they only talk about it on TV or something?
Edith Keeler Must Die
This is what we need.
It would eliminate crappy shows. It would make the MEDIA incapable of lying to us, and lots of other beneficial things.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_U.S._Election_c
TV networks, you want to make money off of me? Make every episode of a shows downloadable, comercial free, on your website for a $1, and I'll be there. Maybe this way you can keep shows around that happen to be good, but don't necessarily get high ratings.
I was at home and it was just garbage reality TV so I went to the bar. Another night I did some reading. And sure I did spend one night playing a computer game, but the decline in TV viewing is not just gaming. The TV shows are currently not worthwhile with the exception of Alias, 24, and a couple of other well written shows. Don't even get me started on the cheap effects and lame plots on Jake 2.0 and Threat Matrix. My sister's kids could put together skits in the living room.
Brennan Stehling - http://brennan.offwhite.net/blog/
I get my tv from the 'net. People said to me 'you should check out "6 feet under"' so I *aza'd it, liked it and got them all. same for 'curb your enthusiasm'. I don't care if it is 'legal' under the DM whatever CA or whatnot but I can skip the commercials - who wouldn't take a pill to alleviate a pounding headache? The point is, as it has always been, "adapt or die" this applies to networks, rating agencies, music companies et al. This whole discussion could be FUD due to a simple failure to keep up with tracking different viewing mediums.
is the the increase of cable television. 20 years ago cable hardly existed. Now with over 10 times the choices that exist on cable then network, that is the real problem.
Who gives a shit? He makes some awesome bikes. I'm a jerk, too. There are jerks in the world with aggression problems, and not all of us are bad guys. Sack up and stop puling.
Why travel that far ? Just look for the nearest wallpaper-tile-making, shell script bloggering, Arizona fatass for that. Try a mirror.
...when they finally start showing porn at 8:00.
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They Are Vermin Feeding On Each Other's Feces.
I Hate \.
Let's see... TV ratings are falling, let's blame it on games? Huh? Hmmm. I've got several hundred DVD's and I subscribe to 29 movie channels on satellite. Do I need to watch "Survivor - This time we mean it!"? I doubt it. TV people don't have a clue. How much ER do I need to see? I watch Discovery Channel, History Channel, The DIY channel, and several other channels like that.
Do I want to watch the liberal slant on the big 3? Nope. Do I want to watch the Clinton News Network? Nope.
No one I know likes the commercials. The only time that commercials are worth watching is during the superbowl. The market hasn't figured it out that people use TIVO, or they flip the channel. One stupid "Burger King - Fire is ready" and I've had it.
My son watches kids' channels that specifically do NOT have commercials.
I'll pay $80 a month for 30-50 channels without commercials. I already pay that much for 29 movie channels and all the rest of the crap.
-- No sig for you!
woooooooooooo!!
HOOOOOOOOO!!
Thats fuckin funny!
It's true, the latest drivel from our networks makes M*A*S*H look like a Nobel prize winner, but the reviewers did say so. (It's movies where crud like "Pearl Harbor" will get a huge boost in momentum from hype reviews, selling up a big opening weekend before the word of mouth gets out.)
"Fundamentalism" isn't about divine morality. It's about human authority.