Slashdot Mirror
Google Seeks to Develop Parallel Internet?
KhanReaper writes "As reported on On the Media and Business 2.0, Google appears to be purchasing dark (unused) fiber optic cable across the United States with the intention of building its own alternative parallel internet that would presumably be called GoogleNet. Possessing such a thing could allow Google to offer internet access in the form of free wifi or other means and create a powerful captive marketing audience which Google could monopolize. Outside of these marketing opportunities, such a development in infrastructure could help reduce Google's long-term content delivery costs were it to take on more bandwidth-intensive activities in the future."
I suppose better Google than Microsoft, right...?
Its to connect datacenters together so that all of Googles search databases have the same information. Just maybe that is the reason the would need a high speed internet of their own.
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
12345
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
As much as I love Google as a search engine, I do have to say that this one is just a little bit scary. Can they really create their own internet, and still do no evil? Already, they are complicit in censorship in China. It doesn't make me really trust them with a project of this scope (though free wi-fi is cool...)
San Francisco Photographers
At least there's never any confusion over what google's inventions are going to be called.
Curious to see exactly what they have in mind..
Twenties Retirement
Hey, if it's free internet, I don't care if it's from SCO, sign me up!
Send email from the afterlife! Write your e-will at Dead Man's Switch.
... "Google Seeks to Develop Parallel Universe?"
They would have to change name to Sky, but you never know...
Google hires an operating system engineer.
Clearly Google is writing the operating system to a super space robot that will be used to eradicate Microsoft!
Google buys a company that makes photo organizer software.
Clearly Google is doing this so that they can recreate iPhoto, as a preliminary step to creating competing products to iCal, iDisk, Apple Mail, and finally Mac OS X itself!
Google hires a janitor.
Clearly that janitor is secretly a superhero with super-strength which Google will use to eliminate all crime on earth!
Google buys up some disused fiber-optic cable.
Clearly Google is going to make their own internet!
I think they should do that
They're forking the internet again!
it shouldnt be hard to compete with the greedy likes of sbc/comscast/etc on price/bandwidth ratio...everything google does need not be free to be a success
There would be no bigger prize than GoogleNet. Like the internet and Internet2 before it, GoogleNet will be hacked and polluted with porn, movie uploads, warez and viagra spam.
I don't give it a month before it loses its virginity in the back seat of a Cisco router.
This GoogleNet idea is an interesting one, but I expect such a proprietary internet would lack would be shunned by the hackers and outlaws that bring true innovation to the technology world.
That being said, Google is much more open to developers than the other monopoly we're familiar with. And they have been collecting money and PhDs at an alarming rate -- they have something big planned.
Clearly Google realizes (like Microsoft before them) that he who owns the platform wins. By building a "better" internet, GoogleNet could be the next Win32 API enabling Google to have an earth-shattering money machine. Perhaps Google's stock is not over-valued afterall.
Sam
And what do you want us to do about it?
So is this the Internet where we took a shottie to the Vulcans, or is it the one where Biff found a book about all the World Series back in 1950s?
In other news "Microsoft Seeks to Develop Parallel Universe".
"GoogleNet" sounds a bit too much like "SkyNet" for my sensibilities. Of course, if any company were to bring about Armageddon, I'd trust Google to do it in the most efficient, user-freindly and non-evil way.
In Soviet Russia, backwards is everything.
As much as I love Google as a search engine, I do have to say that this one is just a little bit scary. Can they really create their own internet, and still do no evil?
So what if they do. Just because Googlenet shows up doesn't mean the old internet ceases to function. If it becomes a draconian mess, no one will use it, and it will slip into irrelevance like Gopher.
Wow this could be cool. Google could offer high bandwidth, secure content unlike anyone else (although at this point this is speculation). Not only could they be an incredible application service provider they could provide nearly endless bandwidth. google is certainly seems to be doing the right things.
...They get it right.
In my opinion, what Microsoft seems to suffer from is getting things to market as fast as possible to remain (or at least appear to remain) competitive. The problem is, that once a product is in the wild, a lot of bugs and security flaws turn up which results in patching the software for the remainder of the time you own it.
The release and patch process is what the Mozilla Foundation seems to be falling into lately as well.
Google, on the other hand, seems to take a more "future use" approach to what they do, giving their products better longevity and as a result, a better experience to their users.
If they (Google) can "get it right" with a parallel network, they basically trump everyone in the market today who has laid claim to making the Internet better. If Google applies their anti-spam engine to network nodes, spam virtually faces extinction. And you know, if they watch what I surf and how I surf and it results in a better experience for me then I for one welcome our new Google overlords.
R(k)
May be at First. After they have consolidated required market share, charges will apply to anything you do. It is a corporation, you got to think of shareholders and their profits.
We are seeing another monopoly happening.
I'm indifferent on the matter
Behold the glorious bragging rights
if you build it, they will google
This is not the greatest
Couldn't be just that they need cheap conection between their computing nodes?
--
Dreamhost superb hosting.
Kunowalls!!! Random sexy wallpapers (NSFW!).
Hosting 20G hd, 1Tb bw! ssh $7.95
If there is one thing I have noticed as of late, it is the fact that the Slashdot audience as a whole, especially those in charge of posting stories, have had a sudden swing in viewpoint about Google. Now all of the stories about Google have negative undertones, and there's always a hint of disdain in the way the story is worded.
The gradual making of a new evil entity, and new Slashdot scape goat is nearly complete! We're all being set up to hate Google now. Gotta love it, Google has not charged me for a single thing. They provide me with excellent free email, outstanding search, a nifty map site, and even a suitable chat client now. And how much have I paid them? Nothing. I for one still love Google, say what you want about them buying the world.
I know it.
It's just meting out technology, at a rate primitive human minds can handle.
At First yes. After they have required number of market share, charges will be applied to anything you do with it. They are a corporation, they have to think of shareholders and their profits. We will be seeing an other company rise to monopoly.
I think that some of us are not paying too much attention. All the buzz lately, in technology communications industries, the USPTO, the FCC, and just about anywhere you turn on the Internet, has been about broadband, wired, wireless, mesh, all kinds of broadband... for Google to buy up a small part of the worlds existing as-yet-unused-broadband infrastructure only means that Google wants to still be relevant in 3 years time. I don't think it means anything more than that... it is what every telecomms company should be doing to ensure relevance in the comming All-IP all the time world.
Support NYCountryLawyer RIAA vs People
Google technicians have lost the ability to administer part of their server farm. It appears that a group of systems has independently begun buying up unused networks for a yet unknown purpose. Wireless access points popping up all over the world with the SSID GoogleNet have prompted some paranoid conspiratorialist to claim an autonomous attack on privacy is underway. Others claim it's a plan create an alternative network, and once completed will overcome and destroy the Internet. At this point Google could levy any access fees they feel like and reach total network dominance.
When asked for a comment, a Google representative just shrugged and said, "Uhhh, dunno, but if I don't run I'm going to miss my free lunch."
"What do you despise? By this are you truly known." --Princess Irulan, Manual of Muad'Dib
/)
Google Tarkin and Dark Fiber--only they could be so bold!
http://www.webmasterworld.com/forum86/519.htm
Its an quick, interesting read.
Google to create its own Internet? Unlikely.
The whole reason that Google is an important company is that it crawls through the publicly-accessible parts of the Internet in order to index its contents.
If Google is to retain its premier position in the search engine market, then it will very much so remain firmly connected to the existing Internet.
This is why I agree with the parent post: It is quite reasonable to believe that Google might require this bandwidth for its own purposes.
There is nothing at all wrong with this. The Internet, after all, is merely a network of networks. All this means is that behind Google's accessible IP addresses lurks a mammoth network of its own.
If you say so.
Instead of transmitting data 1 bit at a time, it will transmit 8 bits, so will be 8 times faster.
Lemming.
The higher the technology, the sharper that two-edged sword.
Google Ubiquity.
GoogleNet sounds soooooo 1982.
The only surefire protection against Microsoft infections is abstinence. - The Onion
Yo, Eric Schmidt*, let me tell you about this little debacle called "Iridium", wherein a once proud US technology titan, name of "Motorola" [you might have heard of 'em - back in the day, they had this bitchin' little CPU called the 68000 series], thought they could dominate [maybe even monopolize] the US communications bidness, by launching a whole mess of satellites into geosynchrynous orbit; invested billions of dollars in the thing, which, at one point, was widely believed to have been the largest privately financed infrastructure expenditure in the history of mankind.
Care to venture a guess as to the return on their investment? A big fat goose egg, that's what. Actually even less than that, if you factor in the fees that the bankruptcy lawyers must have charged them.
*It's a real testament to Novell engineering that this moron didn't drive them into bankruptcy, as well...
I don't quite get the description. It appears that they might provide another avenue for Internet access, and add to existing infrastructure, but how exactly does this ammount to a parallel internet or separate entity from the rest of the internet?
Didn't I hear that Google hired Al Gore? Maybe they are making their own internet...
Why not. Perhaps it's better if all of the Googleness, including all of the breathless press coverage, could be confined to a stand-alone network. All of those that have been Touched By The Googly Appendage will live blissfully within a completely self-containted universe where all news is about, and reported by Google. CommanderToogle's new site, slashdot.goo, will have new and improved moderation choices:
1) Completely About Google
2) Mostly About Google
3) At Least Somewhat About Google
4) Funny, But Not At Google's Expense
5) Troogle
6) Undergoogled
7) Overgoogled (very rare - can there be too much Google?)
Don't disappoint your bird dog. Go to the range.
Hey, maybe this would bring a whole new meaning to when people talk about "the internets."
The laws of probability forbid it!
afaik, dark fiber refers to a rented optical fiber without any service attached to it, the customer must deal with light transmitters and receivers, as opposed to a fiber that is live with some IP/tunnel/data/whatever service. Dark fiber does not mean "unused".
that soon we can be utilizing google's capabilities for piracy.....err wait.... everyone does that now. But a private network controlled by one giant...err wait... isn't that why AOL is failing?
You're right that the tone has changed, but it isn't completly unwarranted. We like Google for all of the products and services they've offered us (free), but only a fool could watch a business acquire the kind of widespread power and dominance Google is working towards without atleast a little apprehension.
you can bet it is for googlegrid (domain names already purchased).
Maybe if they _do_ form their own seperate network they can implement more secure (thus incompatible) mail protocols.
Saying Java is nice because it works on all OS's is like saying that anal sex is nice because it works on all genders.
That's the obvious and reasonable interpretation, yep.
:P
However, it might not be particularly unrealistic to suspect that Google might be considering starting an ISP.
Right now the ISP market is kind of shrinking because last-mile issues are effectively preventing anyone from providing broadband service unless they already own a high-bandwidth wire going directly into your house. However if 802.16 and similar technology delivers on its promises, it could remove this obstacle-- meaning that you'd be able to break into the ISP market with little more than the kind of purchases Google is making right now.
This theory is most definitely a stretch! However, unlike Business 2.0's "make a second internet and provide free access for some reason!" theory, at least it isn't stupid.
Also, who's to say Google even has a plan as to what to do with this dark fiber? As even Business 2.0 notes, now is a really good time to buy this stuff; you can get it cheap. Anybody ever heard of buy low, sell high?
Irritable, left-wing and possibly humorous bumper stickers and t-shirts
Who is the lemming? I think this is about it for me in reading comments in slashdot. Really has become too tiresome, with the boring anti-MS blah, blah, blah. And now possibly as the parent suggests, anti-Google blah, blah, blah.
So long, and thanks for all the fish.
As telco companies have been splitup (the babybell's) they've been scrambling to pickup wider markets. Introducing Phone, internet, and TV through yoru phonelines (Yahoo! & SBC are doing it, keep an eye out) Cable companies are following the same practice: Ok we have TV, but now you have dvrs, Home security, and Telephone serivce (voip) As this convergence happens, Google realizes that they were too late to the show. Yahoo! already partnered with SBC, and The cable co's already have thier proprietary technology. Googles response? well Free internet for everyone, why would they pay for the lined services? Dark Fiber + Wireless, is going to allow Google to get its stepping point in, as a 3rd alternative..... I dont see it being a seperate internet, just a rise against the 2 powers : Phone / Cable. take it for what you will.
google is innovative, and it might be helpful if it stays with the mainstream. a little conservative view..
"Lieutenant Kyle, your agonizer, please."
Survival of the fittest. They should have fled or barricaded themselves in a secure location. It's not like they didn't know the damn storm was coming.
/.
/. article? Get some priorities!
Also, look at yourself before chastising
THOUSANDS ARE ABOUT TO DIE BY KATRINA'S WINDS and all you can think about is posting useless, unhelpful shit about it on every fucking
If it's so damned important, then get off your ass and do something helpful you fucking hypocrite.
You appear to be the only person in this universe to hvae read it that way, but several thousand people in a parallel universe where the only difference from this one is that the universe is known as the "interverse" made this mistake.
Letter To Iran
welcome our new all-singing all-dancing super-searching masters.
Cheap Broadband for the Proletariat!
This is the one in which Bill Gates has a beard.
In all honesty, and it's been talked about already in this topic. That Google is simply buying fibre to connect their networks.
Now with the amount of fibre they could be buying, why not put up free access points and come up with a good advertising delivery mechanism behind it. Could well be the targetted location based internet advertising that so many marketing companies have wanted to do for so long. "Buy a coffee at Joe's! Mention this ad an get a free donut!"
As well, could you imagine the communication costs that they are incurring as we speak? The amount of data that would be traversing their network at the moment would be out of control. Why not just buy some fibre now, setup another company to manage it and slash your comms costs? Especially if they are ordering in the hundreds of gigabits of data which I am guessing they probably are (Think about it for a second)..
Gmail going live, there's another few terabytes worth of data burnt each week having to store all that... All the extra internet content that gets loaded on each day, and they have to index it... Site redundancy.... The lists go on and on...
So what if they setup a second internet? Let them! If it encourages competition, why the hell not? MCI and AOL and everyone else isn't exactly going to sit on their hands and let their market dissapear in front of them are they?
In all honesty though, what are the chances of them making a change in business tactic from being a content search facility and marketers to being an internet service provider.. I don't think it fits in with their business model.
The only thing I think they could be doing is connecting datacentres and possibly (Not having seen WHERE they have bought fibre) they could quite easily be trying to get peering arangements with all the major ISPs to try to distribute the input load onto their network as it could quite well just be getting beyond the point of stupidity and manageability.
BTW, how much are they paying Akamai at the moment?
Curiosity was framed; ignorance killed the cat. -- Author unknown
Most Geeks will attest to their dislike of the Sun (not SUN MICRO), this will work better as public acceptance grows. No more will we have to waste money on Foreign oil to light our internets.
And most important of all, on a dark internet nobody knows your downloading porn.
Sorry about the writing. Robot fingers, you know? Cliff Steele in DOOM PATROL #23
It's funny to watch Slashdot. A single article said Google is evil, now, reading the posts, according to Slashdot Google is evil.
What was Google guilty of? Raising salaries for software engineers (heaven forbid we should make money comparable to our corporate masters) and draining talent (which just means that people want to work there). Oh, and it's hard to get venture capital because venture capitalists want ideas that can compete with Google. I guess that I'll have to put off getting hired by some lame website that sells toe-nail clippers.
Get a clue. Seriously. Tell me what they are doing that is evil.
Who is Katrina? Why was she eating curry if it affects her so badly?
Curiosity was framed; ignorance killed the cat. -- Author unknown
Soft or hard? American or non-American? Penile or Lactic? 70s or 80s? Rounds or slices?
I don't think Google could pull this off, at least at the scale that this article discusses. I doubt that there is enough dark fiber remaining in an amount comparable to even Akamai, one of the largest networks in the world.
Moreover, I doubt something like GoogleNet could even overtake the Internet as we know it. What I can see, however, is a GoogleNet in terms of a web service combining Google's all over the place software approach into a single unified framework.
Finally, as usual, I hope Google isn't discounting the presence of Microsoft. Microsoft, has in-fact, the world's largest VoIP and gaming network with Xbox Live, a fact that many people often seem to forget. And to think, it only took them a fairly short while to get it up and running.
The proper term would be intranet not Internet. Hopefully they have found something useful to use all that fiber capacity for.
Weirdly enough, though, Al Gore is on the board of directors of Apple Computer.
Irritable, left-wing and possibly humorous bumper stickers and t-shirts
The moment Google 'forks' the Internet, they lose value because less people can use their services. The fact is that Google is one of a handful of companies that knows that they NEED open protocols. They have a corporate culture document that says 'do no evil' because doing evil would detract from their bottom line, and top management wants everybody in the company to know it.
[100% ISO 646 Compliant]
SVM, ERGO MONSTRO.
It's not really a shock, but I am wondering why people think google is planning a second internet. Is the old VOIP-guessing not spectacular enough anymore ?
Honestly, I'm praying for Google to do what these already established companies do not want or are too feeble to pull off: which is to make the layer (if not barrier) between VoIP and cellular networks transparent (or non-existent). Google, your (wireless) internet provider. Google, your cellular provider. Crossing my fingers.
"So don't get programmed by anybody but yourself" --Bill S. Preston, Esquire
Gspot... no?
they've got to find some way of spending all that surplus (what is it now...eighty some billion dollars?) after becoming publicly traded and hyped as they now are.
Simple math people. An OC-192 costs a ton of money in hardware, I can't remember the Fujitsu equipment that handles it, but I do know that the Xen-Packs for our Force10 switches ares under 10,000 USD. So instead of paying a provider, or even paying a telco for an OC-192, you buy dark-fiber and run ethernet right over it, no dirty telco in-between. This works great for us. I was handed a 30M ethernet (literally, they put a switch in and gave us IPs, no CSU/DSU, no DS3 yadayada) just here's you're cat 5.
I thought their bits all went to 11.
One line blog. I hear that they're called Twitters now.
if google does do that, then atleast we know it won't suck..
*plays the Apogee theme song music*
They've been doing this for a long time now. Any conspiracy theories you might have will take a while to come to fruition.
Actually, that's closer to seven billion. 2.5 they already had, plus 4 billion from the recent public offering. It makes sense, though. Their stock was inflated, so they sold some. Fiber is about the cheapest we're going to see in awhile, so they bought some.
As for making their own internet, I don't think they'd do that. But if they did make a new internet that was more secure and relatively free from spam, people would line up in droves to sign up. I would.
Since obeying evil laws makes you evil, everyone who is a copyright infringer is a hero! Hooray for copyright infringement! Lets all thank the Chinese for leading the piracy effort!
ALL censorship is evil or none of it is. I don't want to hear crap about how only Chinese censorship is bad but American censorship is good, thats just political BS.
They're buying up all this dark fiber to connect all of their data centers, and possibly implementing IPv6 on all of their networks.
My guess is they're jumpstarting the migration to IPv6 with their own backbone. Offer free WiFi, but it'll be IPv6. Not only does everyone (possibly) get free WiFi, but they also get their own net block.
*scratches chin*
Now THAT would be something.
No, they should think I do that.
We can have the:
Gstring!
G-sized bra!
C'mon guys, run with Google Clothes!
It's actually for a recursive network to handle all of the bandwidth generated by Slashdot rumors on Google's buying of fiber lines.
So, am I supposed to start up by GPC, wait for my GoogleOS to load, open up my GoogleFox, connect to Googlenet, and search Google, while chatting with my friends on GoogleTalk? Geeze, do they really think Google will control EVERYTHING? I think they're a little smarter than to overextend themselves THAT much. Google's fastest growing product: GoogleHype. It's still in Beta though...
And that, my liege, is how we know the Earth to be bannana-shaped.
Do everybody a favor and STFU until you can communicate in English.
Laws are for people with no friends.
Can anyone see the connection here?
Google creating a second Internet would be counter-productive to what they do. However, this could be used to expand their web accelerator. If subscribers could access a reasonably up-to-date copy of resources on the original Internet, via Google's servers, both to accelerate and to filter malicious content, it could represent a huge change in surfing. I would sign up.
Stasis is death. Embrace change.
it's called the World Wide Web for a reason.
Let them buy all the "dark fiber" they want in the Continental US; this ain't 1990 - that don't mean squat no 'mo.
The Internet is much, much larger than just America, and this is coming from an ExPat American.
A message from our sponsor
The funny part is how many people scrutinise their various projects as if we're are being forced to participate and use their products/services. We're not. That said - I'm certainly using them. Insofar all of Google's services I quite enjoy, with the exception of the desktop search and deskbar stuff which I don't really have a need for.
Buy as much stock in Google as you can afford. Tell every college graduate you know from MIT or Caltech to work for good, and promote Google.
This might be the one chance we have to bring democracy to the tech industry. Microsoft has been dictator for FAR too long.
Keeping a search engine index up to date requires massive amounts of bandwidth. In fact more money is spent on crawling bandwidth than on buying/providing CPU power for search operations. We are talking millions of dollars of bandwith a month. A large customer like that can get special treatment in how their traffic is priced and handled. Say, per IP address prices. Then Google crawls all data locally using a few distributed data centers across the USA and the rest of the world, and then ships only the updated data in compressed form over their newly acquired dark fiber.
What if this turns into a 'private' network, with Google in total control
They control TLDs, they control access, they control content..
Dont laugh, it could happen.. Remember Compuserve?
---- Booth was a patriot ----
... because of OSDN's trademark. And the moderation system is changing, to FSM-knows-what.
Nice of you to link FSM with g00gle, and decidedly speaking, the Google logo seems to fit the image of the FSM. Coincidence?
The dangers of knowledge trigger emotional distress in human beings.
Google is bringing democracy to cyberspace. Microsoft has been dictator for far too long. What would a more democratic internet look like? What would a more free and open internet look like?
Apple releasing OSX for the PC, Google working on a Linux based OS, and now Google wants to buy the internet? How much do you want to bet that Google and Apple are allies and Apple has plans to launch its Itunes services over GoogleNet?
This is the best chance we have for rapid world-wide deployment of IPv6. Nobody wants to convert their existing networks, but if you're building out something new, why not? You heard it here first: the entire current internet is effectively just a relatively small subnet in IPv6 address space.
http://tinyurl.com/4ny52
Please note that the domain is registered to a company _not_ in Mountain View, CA, who, among thousands of other, own domains such as: www.0---0.org www.0--porno.info www.0-0-0casino.com Somehow, I don't think that those are Google domain names....
Begining Monday, all Slashdot editors will be subjected to MANDATORY, that means you Taco, drug testing. All violators will be shot on sight.
You can close your connection anytime you like, but you can never leave!
"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something" - Plato
Google is building a competitor to the cable and telco network, that will use everyone else's content (as indexed in their search engine). They will build lightweight apps that people can use anywhere. They might even start to build their own content, or buy it from existing libraries.
Google isn't competing with Microsoft (although they will without hardly trying). Google is competing with the ghost of AOL/TimeWarner. The integrated play that Wall Street wanted, but paid Steve Case and the rest too much up front for them to bother finishing. This time around, Google is using its IPO money to actually do it. I just hope the rest of us can compete with them, or find enough niches in their platform to survive. It's time to start making all our apps work with the Google API, or get left behind. If we do it right, they'll need us so much that they'll keep the API open.
--
make install -not war
Anyone else tired of Google might be !
Google plans to offer broadband over powerlines. Al Gore plans to help create the next internet, and bring internet TV to the masses with current TV. Apple plans to offer Itunes over the new internet, through Googles new internet based linux operating system.
Now all we have to do is bring Nintendo into the fold and get some of the gaming companies involved. I look forward to the day where I can play games online through wifi from anywhere.
Here are some URLs to back up my statements.
Al Gore, Google, Current TV, Broadband Over PowerLines
Information on who Google is hiring Google Hiring
Google will hire all the best Phd students from the elite universities first. Once Google becomes so large that they run out of Phd students from elite universities, then they will begin hiring us! So I'm now in love with Google. Google if you are reading this PLEASE PLEASE give me a job, even if I'm just doing something completely stupid, I'm sure with all the millions of jobs you are creating that you'll find something for me.
I hope Google continues to innovate because these innovations are creating jobs by the millions. Building a new internet would create millions of jobs for all of us. Building a new OS would create thousands of jobs. I hope Google gets involved with the gaming industry and lets me have access to a video game search engine. I hope they let us gamble and bet on games. I hope Google creates a new video game stock market where we can bet on the success or failure of games. GIMME MONEY DAMNIT!
Here comes the Aquinas Protocol... The Deus Ex writers were visionaries.
...might I suggest this classic short story on which it was probably based.
I don't know where people got the idea that Google was creating InetDos...Om Malik's article talks about dark fiber and free WiFi hotspots, not internet backbone. He even goes so far as to mention the fact that Google has been working with Feeva, a company that provides free Wi-Fi hotspots and suggests that Google build a large broadband network. He never says replace the Internet.
"What if Google (GOOG) wanted to give Wi-Fi access to everyone in America? And what if it had technology capable of targeting advertising to a user's precise location? The gatekeeper of the world's information could become one of the globe's biggest Internet providers and one of its most powerful ad sellers, basically supplanting telecoms in one fell swoop." -Om Malik
If you think about it, replacing the Internet makes no sense for Google. Not only are they not an infrastructure company they aren't set up to service this kind of business. Have you ever tried to get customer service from Google?
Besides, Google's model works better the more open an environment is. More pages = more space in which to display their advertising inventory.
It seems to me that Google's real play is voice...advertising subsidized voice.
Think about it; you just signed up for GoogleTalk via SMS. Google now has your cellular number and knows everything you search for.
What would you say if they offered to subsidize your cellular calls in exchange for LISTENING to brief targeted messages served to your phone prior to placing a call? If the ads were relevant and the exchange was fair; say 10 minutes calling per ad served don't you think a few million minutes of calls would be delivered this way?
I wrote more about this here: http://www.mobile-weblog.com/50226711/images/googCertainly it is obvious that Google has recognized the significance of the small screen to the future of search. They understand the value of connecting an advertiser to an interested customer and vice versa. They've created maps and mapping tools to help you locate what you want. It only makes sense that they take themselves off the PC and into the MOBILE in the most pervasive way the consumer that will allow. You watch; turn by turn directions over your cell phone to the location of your choice, all courtesy of GoogleNav is not far away.
There is no "I" in B-O-R-G.
If it is an ISP they're making, they could really flesh out their cache. Say a user wants a site that has never been cached. All Google has to do is intercept the data as it heads off to the user. This way popular sites could get cached almost immediately.
Similarly, if they're watching browse patterns, they may be able to refine their pageranks.
I'm interested to see where they go with all this.
According to sources inside the company the new universe would be called a Googlelarity. Instead of marketing discrete groups of users, Google plans on marketing entire civilizations after seeding suitable planets with protolife and making content delivery part of the evolutionary process.
That's our life, the big wheel of shit. - The Fat Man, Blue Tango Salvage
dark internet nobody knows your downloading porn? Vogon poetry is too good for you.
Isn't it time for a new category in slashdot? It could be called "google" or "speculation", whatever fits best.
Yes, but is it an evil internet?
/me puts pinky to the corner of his mouth
to the dark side.
Brought to you by
your friendly neighbourhood
Google.
You can't handle the truth.
In my opinion, what Microsoft seems to suffer from is getting things to market as fast as possible to remain (or at least appear to remain) competitive. The problem is, that once a product is in the wild, a lot of bugs and security flaws turn up which results in patching the software for the remainder of the time you own it.
Of all the software running on the typical Internet connected computer how many lines of code were written by Microsoft? Well let's see, there's the operating system, web browser, multimedia player, dozens of listening services and numerous client interfaces.
Now, how about Google? Hmmm... Google Toolbar -- a browser plug-in; Google Desktop -- a local search facility; Picasa -- an image searching interface; Google Earth... maybe? The rest of their products and services are delivered over the web, and so at worst usually run within an existing browser process locally.
Granted, Google's got some pretty neat little tools, but why do they automatically get a pass card for security and stability when the nature of what they're doing is so much less core to the security and stability of the host in the first place?
Strangely, if you follow the instructions at http://www.google.com/support/talk/bin/answer.py?a nswer=24073, (which actually gives instructions on how to download GAIM, as well as configure it to work with the Google Talk Jabber server) it works just fine. I'm logged into talk.google.com right now with GAIM.
[100% ISO 646 Compliant]
SVM, ERGO MONSTRO.
RTFA; the summary is spot-on. I agree that it's a ridiculous idea, but the "However, this is slashdot" crap is way beyond old...
The wheel is turning, but the hamster is dead.
With all the hoopla lately about cable companies and telephone companies having to share and then not share with isps and the like.. I wonder what would become of this if google goes through with it.
Could that mean cable and telcos will be fighting for access to the lines so we can get googlenet over what kind of lines?
Some cities already have fiber to the house, to the premise, to the curb.. will these residents be able to tap into googlenets fiber?
Google has not even tried it's hand at at being an isp yet.. i can only imagine how this will turn out.
So what I ask- There are millions of private networks out there. Banks and credit agencies own unmeasurable amounts of copper and fibre throughout each and every city you could imagine. Tons of private companies link branch offices all around the globe and datacenters. Country's governments are linking to other governments and other organizations to ensure a reliable transport. The phone company owns tons of fibre and copper. Major Internet providers (MCI, Verison, etc) own large percentages of the global Internet.
Keep in mind, ATMs (1.5-155Mbit) are very common amoungst all organizations. Over longer distances and in larger volumes (or with growth strategies in mind), fibre is popular as well.
Google is buying circuts, possibly to build some sort of network. Okay? So what? This is all speculation. Maybe they want to make a reliable link for their own content and databases? Maybe they're doing content distribution? Maybe they want to set up some more links to certain areas and join the likes of MCI, Verizon, etc at the top of the Internet for options that other ISPs could route through.
Or maybe they are trying to start their own unconnected network... Who knows! But there is NOTHING even remotely unusual about a company buying up private circiuts for its own use. Most big corps have many of them linking offices, dataceters, and various parts of the world.
NEXT
-M
when you see the word 'Linux', drink!
Sounds to me like SkyNet.... Damn, some prophets are true prophets!
If you mod me down, I *will* introduce you to my sister!
Its only natural some people are going to assume trivial decisions and undertakings of Google are going to usher in Armageddon.
Here
More conspiracy theories, more Chicken Littles screaming "the sky is falling!" Don't you folks get tired of always being wrong?
... just so you know, you're not really there in your chair reading this. You're buried deep inside the Earth, housed in a membrane capsule and immersed in organic fluid while being fed intravenously with your sole purpose for your existence being to provide power to Google Robots who took over the Earth thousands of years ago and enslaved the human race. When your usefulness is depleted, you'll be flushed from your capsule like a giant turd in a toilet bowl, minus the corn. However, there is hope for your freedom, all you need to do is find The One! Believe and you shall be set free!
-Ignorance is Bliss- says the naysayer
"It is essential that justice be done
1. Buy cheap techy stuff
2. Let slashdot get wind of it
3. People commend with every crazy idea on the face of the earth.
4. ????
5. Profit!
One designed to stop spam, viruses, spyware, phising , etc? Obviously there's only so much that can be controlled but a lot can be if your willing to take the appropriate action on the network side.... Would be interesting.
All I have to say is if they do this I want them to make my daily porn intake a enjoyable experience.. Please no pop-ups as I see Pam Anderson pop out of her shirt!!
I'm all for idealism and things here, but this is just too damn far out. Google may be purchasing dark lines, but what gives? I happen to know for a fact that IBM has a system that indexes and models the *entire* web daily, and has been able to find documents from various terrorist organizations, sometimes before plots were set to be carried out. I'd say that Google is perhaps doing this or some other form of improved searching technology. It is possible that they want to lauch a(n) (G)ISP. If they did, it would depend on the service they offered. It would probably be better than shitty Cable and DSL providers (also monopolies, for those keeping score). I'd say to Google, go for it. You seem to ahve too much money to spend and is overvalued. Google wants some cash to flow out. They may just be making a long term investment. Companies do this...
How's this for a conspiracy theory then:
- Free/cheap WiFi for all
- All HTTP requests transparently proxied through Internet Accelerator
- Content cached, indexed, etc at each of these proxies
Suddenly the need for regular spidering has been quite dramatically reduced.
Glenn
The Smrt way to trade CFDs on the ASX
I am surprised no one has brought up Epic or Google 2014. The predictions when this came out were cool. Watch for a similarity :-D
I am Lord Snowbeam. Heed my call!
Why are the most dangerous places on earth the most inhabitated?
I can understand for agricultural societies to build near volcanoes because the soil is better there but why in a swamp below sea level likely to be hit by tropical storms like New Orleans?
What would Robin Sloan and Matt Thompson say? http://www.robinsloan.com/epic/
I really think that Google has been successful because it can out Microsoft, Microsoft. In a manner of speaking because they defy conventional practices and dliver a quality product. It may be a good thing in the long run by creating a whole new competition to the status quo and prevent the stranglehold that the Baby Bells could create with the latest FCC Rulings.
Signature applied for, Patent Pending
Don't like that one? OK how about this: Denver International Airport is part of a top secret government conspiracy (along with the Free Masons, Natzis, and illuminari), to provide a high density feed lot for the alien overlords to feast on the great unwashed in exchange for eternal life. It also is part of a giant underground tunnel system that interconnects large parts of the western US. Since Google knows about all this because of thier ability to search so well, they're hoping to cash(e) in by holding the above mentioned groups hostage. The only way they can make sure they can deliver the secret data is by building thier own network. Since it is such a big cover up, they need lots of smart people to work for them, to figure out how the whole thing fits together.
So you see, there's nothing to worry about. Google will
"Well, good luck finding a judge that doesn't run a bestiality site."
Maybe the case of Google purchasing its own fiber optics is not for "evil" intensions and quite reasonable for future plans - I'm quite sure that I read somewhere Google is developing some kind of astronomy datacenters to map the complete sky and universe and that computing the teraflop databanks may take hours, if not days and/or months! This would probably seem to be the reason to own such unused fiber optics and be able to transmit gigaflops of data from and to different locations. After all, i don't believe Google can just map the entire universe and sky from its headquarter locations. Then again, Google always seems to amaze me.
Maybe Wayne Rosing and Google still have a connection and common interest after all.
Maybe i read wrong or i may be the only one paying a little bit too much attention to some print articles. Hence, i might also have read it recently on Wired Magazine (sorry but i dont have Wired Mag copies this moment), but you may correct me on this one =)
The above idea and understanding of Google's action and what i read in a glance just 'googles', err Boggles, my mind.
Pfft. I work for a company that provides dark fiber, and there is literally tons of use for it. We drop fairly large cables in the ground (432/864), use a few strands ourselves, and lease the rest out. People use it for everything from fast-e over media converts on up to mass OC192 DWDM stuff. Some are carriers, some are normal companies. Dark fiber is usually alot cheaper in the long run that purchasing point to point or switched circuits from a carrier. Hell, Google's been doing this for a while, to connect some of their clusters, and to run their own circuits to ISPs. Theres nothing really new about any of this - companies have been doing this sort of thing for years.
--
Will Google be mailing out scores of CDs to all of us so we can access this online network?
Aside from use of this high-speed private network for its own internal database-communications use, and for its nifty new long-distance voice chat toy, Google needs this fiber for its media delivery platform: significant torrent master nodes archiving vast repositories, supplying fat-pipe seeds with data for torrent distribution.
These fat-pipe seeds will be commercial ventures, perhaps paid by Google for their service; just as we'll pay Google for access to their media banks.
We won't purchase DVDs of TV series seasons; we'll torrent them, paying a buck or two a viewing, and very likely simply erasing the episode after we're done -- it's cheap enough to get again, and how often does one *really* want to watch an specific episode? Too much new stuff to bother with the old!
Ditto for computer/console games: download them when you want them, delete them when you're done. Or not: games have good replayability, and the vid companies can make money off a user-pay multiplayer network.
And, importantly, ditto also for internet memes. Like the Coral cache or Akamai.
For any popular, largish-file sharing, torrenting is an excellent delivery mechanism for non-realtime use, and Google would stand a very good chance of becoming a dominant "Network Television/Network Radio/Network Bigfiles" company.
--
Don't like it? Respond with words, not karma.
Whatever man. All I know is that I'd see some tits (apparently real nice ones) and then have an abundance of lube.
No pr0n, no warez, no music share
is that you called internet ?
Hah no thanks
[My english is better than most other people's Turkish, so please point out mistakes politely. Thank you.]
AFAIK Google makes the majority of its money through advertising. If Google begins to offer free Internet you'd have hordes of people flocking to it, including people who have not previously used the Internet.
But they'd be a catch, like viewing Google ads (maybe through a Google browser?) while surfing?
Remember those ISPs that provided free access? Google's MUCH bigger than them, and could do something as crazy as this.
It would be putting competition out of practice, and it would securing itself more people to sell ads to. Win Win!
Because historically it was an essential port that controlled all commerce coming to and from the Mississippi?
Same priorities, different situation.
Google Future History
You aren't remembered for doing what is expected of you
If I recall correctly, Katrina is the wife of Rob Malda, the purveyor of slashdot. It all makes sense now.
If your business is profitable you wont require a billion dollars investment. Also, Google hires American workers, they page high wages, they treat employees exceptionally, and they love us.
Saving the world is profitable. In fact its more profitable to save the world than to destroy it because the profits as sustainable over long periods of time.
People actually do start companies to give stuff to the world. Have you heard of Alonovo?
Most serious people start companies for both political and business reasons. Helping the world is more profitable than destroying it.
Seriously, while we're speculating wildly, I have an even wetter dream: Google is famously Linux-based, see, so wouldn't it be great if we just had two internets to go with our two PC-based OS systems? Keep the Windows comps off the Google-net, and the Linux geeks won't venture into AOL-land!
Whoops, what about Macs and Suns and BeOS's? Nahh-h-h, it'd never work!
To develop Iridium, HUGE amounts of money was borrowed... The cost of carrying the debt was a HUGE fixed cost. This meant that high prices were needed to cover those costs.
Iridium goes bankrupt and is sold for pennies on the dollars. The debt is repaid from the proceeds at pennies on the dollars.
If you spent $5b building something, at 10% interest, you have $500m a year in interest payments.
If you go under, and firesale it for say, $1b, the new owners, at 10% interest, have a $100m a year interest payment. That is a MUCH lower fixed cost element.
That is why Iridium is able to go with cheaper rates now. It was an unviable investment, but it was better to sell at a loss then just shut down, and the new owners can make money.
Google is in a space where anyone with a better algorithm can raise venture money, like Google did, and enter the search market.
To strengthen their position, Google has integrated the Ad business via Adwords to not be at the mercy of a third party like everyone else was. Google has done a LOT to strengthen their position.
However, the one thing Google has NOT ever done, and has made clear that they WON'T do, it lock users in. They do have a bunch of patents to try to keep a new competitor out, but they haven't tried the lock in.
The founders have made it clear that they believe handcuffs on users counter-productive and don't believe in them.
They have consistently made it clear that they believe that they are the most innovate company, and have no need to block competition, they will simply out-compete.
That's their corporate mission, identity, and culture. Don't Be Evil is a clever way of putting. However, the company has been focused on winning by being the best, and believe that the best way to fight as a tech company is to be the best, not lock consumers in.
I applaud that, and respect the company, and have no problem with them dominating ANY industry, as LONG as they don't try to create barriers to entry or customer lock-in, they aren't a monopoly, and will never be a monopoly.
If Google was the ONLY search engine, they wouldn't be a monopoly, because without barriers to entry, they can't extract "monopoly rents," they are forced to the competitive rates because with no customer lock-in or barriers to switching, they are in the competitive space, which is where Google seems to want to play. Go Google!
Alex
Google believes that barriers to switching, or vendor lock-in, is counter productive. In many ways it is. Customers LIKE to have choices, and lock-in deters them from choosing you. They have decided that avoiding the lock-in deterrent is a worthwhile trade-off from not having the lock-in down the road.
Instead of looking for industries where they can establish barriers to entry, they have chosen to just be the best in the industry.
Google has made it their corporate culture to do what we as consumers should desire, a company that doesn't erect barriers to entry or barriers to switching.
As long as they are willing to compete whenever and where ever they are, I say, AWESOME. If only EVERY industry had players willing to do that.
NOTE: I say this as someone who owns no Google shares, engages in SEO and has been mistreated and banned by Google more than any other engine, and is generally floored by the way they run their company. OTOH, I respect an entity that is willing to play in a competitive marketplace, instead of looking for sleazy tactics to monopolize industries.
Alex
...you do not only rely on a fully automated PageRank, but also you can weight links by how often they are clicked. We would all become their PageRank pingeons! ;)
Well, I know they redirect every click in their search results to their own servers to know which results are being clicked more often. But if all of our clicks in any web site would go through them, privacy issues aside, they would have a really good map of the interesting part of the web, as people do not tend to waste their time following the links of obnoxious link farms.
Also, that would give Google a good view of the "hidden" Internet (is that the word?), that is, the web accessible only by forms and dynamic pages.
Who cares about the DoJ when you've got a spiffingly low Slashdot ID like yours? I _say_ old chap. And maintainer of the infamous jargon file text archive to boot, my my.
Ooh, you have a low Slashdot ID, yes you do, ooh!
What would you say if they offered to subsidize your cellular calls in exchange for LISTENING to brief targeted messages served to your phone prior to placing a call?
Some company tried that a few years ago in Belgium. They didn't last long.
There is a difference between glancing at ads for a seconde each all day long and having to listen to some ad for 30 seconds while you only want to talk to each other.
This is a fact. Fact's are good.
This is wild speculation. Wild speculation is bad.
What's been happening to
Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant
As some stupid amount of all internet traffic is P2P and increasing would they not save a hell of a lot of money by providing internet to everyone in america, they would then have to pay nothing for the P2P bandwidth going outside their network, and surly would make a hell of a lot more money?
Nick
I have to agree.
As of recently a whole bunch of Slashdot IDs that I've personally never heard of start posting heavily about how Google could do something evil with one of their recent actions, and thus deducing that they are evil. Then people start talking as if it were some kind of Slashdot consensus. The whole thing smells of a deliberate smear campaign, sort of a reverse astroturf. How about we give them a chance to commit evil before we condemn them for it, eh? Why not focus on a few organisations that have had the chance to commit evil acts, and chosen them almost every single time?
Maybe one day Google will become a horribly abusive monopoly who abuse their staff, customers, and local governments in an effort to squeeze them for every cent they have. But... and how about this... perhaps we should wait until they actually show signs of having any intention of doing this sort of thing? Perhaps it is worth focusing on organisations who are _already_ doing this, rather than ones who show all signs of not being inclined in this way at all?
The USA, Germany and France do not wish to censor the likes of The Tianamen Square massacre.
The difference between the laws you refer to and those of China is the purpose and scope of the limitations; the purpose of the Western laws is to protect some groups in society, the purpose of the Chinese law is to protect the government. The scope of the Western las is clearly limited and will be balanced, where freedom of expression is relevant, by national constitutions which are enforceable by citizens.
You were the chosen ones!!!! You were supposed to save us from the corporations, not join them! To preserve the light of information, not leave it in darkness! You were our brother, Google! We loved you.
>What would you say if they offered to subsidize your cellular calls in exchange for LISTENING to brief targeted messages served to your phone prior to placing a call?
I would say they will lose money big time.
First, it was tried before (startups back in 2000, all went bust since) and didn't work.
Second, why would I listen to some ad crap when phone calls are FREE (Skype, etc.) or , in worst case, so cheap?
I can think of a few reasons. Skype is only free on-net and for now, mostly tied to a PC.
Not everyone thinks that mobile calls are cheap and some people just enjoy saving their money. If you're not one of them, clearly this isn't for you.
Third lots of stuff was tried before Google came and reinvented it. The key is relevance. If Google is supplying you with advertising related to things that interest you, it changes the dynamic from an intrusion to an offer you might consider.
Google's ability to deliver highly personalized and useful advertising is unparalleled and will become even more refined as they tune the messages to meet with your taste.
Lastly, Google has a pile of cash to burn. It may well be worth it to them to lose a couple hundred million to capture a few million or more phone numbers that are tied to people using other Google services.
Don't you think that mining that data is going to be the most lucrative activity of all for Google at some point? Or perhaps selling it to other companies?
Sooner or later the value of that data will force Google to take advantage of the resource. You don't sit around and twiddle your thumbs when you've got a more valuable asset than any you're currently selling while it slowly expires.
In short, there's more to this idea than free phone calls. A lot more. Sure, it's pure conjecture, but there is logic to the idea and it is already clear that Google is looking towards voice and mobile...doesn't that equal cellular? Or at least VoWIFi?
There is no "I" in B-O-R-G.
Can we just get free wireless in all the Airports? That's all we ask. Just all the Airports...
Please see my prior response to this same sentiment in an earlier comment. Essentially the difference is relevance. Prior companies had no clue what you were interested in. If the matching to your interests is exceptional, the advertising might not be painful, but interesting or enjoyable. You browse computer catalogs, don't you?
There is no "I" in B-O-R-G.
Just before before internet browsers became popular, MicroSoft was trying to beat AOL and the InterNet with its own protocol. However, the world wide web took off so fast that these plans never took off.
Since then MicroSoft continues to try to co-opt parts of the Internet with proprietary IP-extensions, a free browswer, and proprietary parts of XML.
Bye.
-Eric
SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
Yeah, but just because they have power does not at all necessarily mean they will use it for evil ("power corrupts" isn't an absolute, just a guideline). That seems to be the mistake many people are making--automatically assuming that the fact that they are on top of the heap means that they are evil, and must have used unethical means to get there, or intend to use unethical means to stay there.
The problem with this kind of thinking is that Google didn't use unethical means to get there--they just got there by being the best at what they do. And that's all they have to keep doing to stay there.
Google knows what happens when a company starts using their power for evil--they lose all their brownie points and people start leaving them because they don't like being treated that way. It is to their advantage to Stay Good (poing!), and they know it.
Dan Aris
Fun. Free. Online. RPG. BattleMaster.
That's quite easy to check:
Does it have a goatee?
If you think people did not pay taxes there I have a few weapons of mass destruction I want to sell you.
IANAL but write like a drunk one.
.... what is the posting saying we should say?
In all honestly, I think your mask slid and you were blinded.
IANAL but write like a drunk one.
The point isnt to win by "beating" the competitor. The point is to win by having a higher quality of life. If we compete ourselves into an early grave what exactly are we working for?
Profits are fine for the short term, but if you know you arent doing something sustainable its only a matter of time before theres no customer left to sell to, nothing left to buy, and what then? If theres no one to hire, or sell products to, and no new products to buy, whats the point of profits if you can't spend your money? I can understand if you want to spend money, but in order to spend money society has to exist and no, not everyone in society is your competitor. If you view it as everyone for themselves eventually our species will kill itself trying to kill the competition. Honestly, I'd rather see our species go into space, master nano techonlogy, create new life forms, create robotics, and make our lives BETTER, mor ENJOYABLE, LONGER.
The point is, if all you do is make a buck, eventually you won't have any customers to make a buck from because like the Tabacco industry you kill your sources of income. Sustainable businesses work to improve life for everyone. This creates economic stability, environmental stability, so that we all can get richer. When you compete in a survival of the fittest manner, you have more losers than winners, and eventually the winners become losers. so whats the point? We arent going to make it out of the nanotech age if everyone in the industry just tries to make a buck.
hey guys.. even if Google can place cables all around the USA, there are a lot of people out USA. Would Google miss a world of opportunity? Do americans want to hide, isolate? Try to imagine the future. Try to see the past. Control always moved hand to hand, and USA had your chance to do the right thing.