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Kids with Cell Phones, How Young is Too Young?
An anonymous reader writes "CNet is reporting that the average age of a child receiving their first cell phone is continuing to drop. A report carried out last year showed that the average age of a child's first cell phone was just eight years old and is expected to drop closer to 5 years of age this year. The author raises the obligatory medical questions that have been argued about in adults for years. Just how young is too young for a cell phone?
I wonder if this survey counted those cell phones that will only call certain preprogrammed numbers, like home or Mom or some such? I would be all over those suckers if I had kids.
Five year olds NEED cell phones, guys. Duh. How else are they going to handle buisness calls and stay in touch with family and friends when they go out on their own?
Easy. Anyone under the age of 18 -- with virtually no exception.
In my experience, many problems with family harmony can be either traced back to cell phone use -- or cell phones helped compound the problem.
I don't think ANYONE should have a cell phone until they are emancipated *AND* pay for the damn thing themselves.
That said: I've seen the FireFly -- and T-Mobile's new "kidconnect plan". Both look very interesting and may force me to rethink my position.
Like my life on the road isn't hectic enough already with soccer moms in their SUVs changing lanes without looking because they are on the phone. Now I'm going to have to worry about running over little kids stepping away from the ice cream truck with their cellphones stuck to their heads.
Because there is no such thing as too early.
Where were you when the voynix came?
While cell phones can be useful, I dont think any child needs a cell phone.
I often have trouble remembering which way is out of bed in the morning.
just stay the f*ck off my lawn!
I'm sure "SlashdotMedia" will improve on all the wonders that Dice Holdings blessed us all with
WTF 8?! what does an 8 year old need a cellphone for - I had one when I was 16, and I rarely used it - most I used it for was talking to my girlfriend one my way home from work at the time, and the occasional "yo $parent i'm going to X, don't expect me till Y", and for emergencies when my buddies and I were out rock climbing (only needed to use it once for this purpose - once too many, but then 10 year old little brothers don't always listen to their dad, their older brother, and their older brothers friend all take turns lecturing them about being careful)
If you cannot keep politics out of your moderation remove yourself from the Mod Lottery.. NOW!
It really depends on why you are equipping your child with a cell phone. As TFA points out, many parents are not doing it for social reasons:
If a child can hold onto the phone, this could be a nice way to keep track of children. I can think of two major caveats to tracking: the aforementioned loss issue and the fact that kidnappers will search their victims for cell phones now thus in a true emergency they will not really help.
Information wants a fueled airplane waiting at the hangar and no one gets hurt.
Poor means hoping the toothache goes away.
Who are these kids talking to? When I was 8, I would ride my bike somewhere and meet up with my friends or my parents would drop me off at their house. They definitely didn't drop me off at the mall or have me running around town thinking that the fact I had a cell phone was good enough to keep tabs on me.
Just because your kid has a cell phone doesn't mean they are protected.
Utility is when you have one telephone, luxury is when you have two, opulence is when you have three -- and paradise is when you have none. -- Doug Larson
Res publica non dominetur
As a person who just graduated from High School, I can say, without absolutely without regrets, 19. God, I hate those things.
In Soviet Russia, backwards is everything.
If the child has not yet reached the age where they are allowed to engage in activities without parental or some other form of supervision, then they are too young to need a cell phone. Consequently, this age will probably fall somewhat in line with the legal driving age most of the time. So, ballpark figure, probably somewhere between 14 and 16 years old.
Me, personally, I didn't get one until I was 22 and moving into my own place.
"You will pay for your lack of vision..." - Emperor Palpatine to Ray Charles
"Dude, stay in there! It's not worth it, they just dragged me out by my legs and spanked me!"
In your best Cartman voice, of course!
Where were you when the voynix came?
it means being able to track them if they go missing, and it means they can call you when they do something dumb. Concentrate on raising good kids and you won't have a problem with them abusing it anyway.
Hi! I make Firefox Plug-ins. Check 'em out @ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/youtube-mp3-podcaster/
My mother once said wiselly this:
It's not common that a kid asks for own cellphone with reason "because all other kids has also one". Also it's not common that that reason is taken down and the request is denyed.
But when the majority of the kids has one, then the culture, communication and habits form to rely on cellphones, so a kid without one is forced to borrow other friends cellphones to make the needed calls to support the daily social life of his friend community.So think twise when you deny a cellphone from your kids. He might actually need it or he will be dropped outside from his friends.
I generally agree, but a cell phone probably saved the life of a friend of mine who stopped to render aid to a car which had slid off the interstate. Another car hit my friend at 65 mph. He lost half his leg, but lived thanks to quick medical aid.
My kid is 5, and I have been mulling the idea of getting her a cell phone. I have a problem with the thought of kids at any age yapping into a cell phone at school (or just about anywhere/anytime), but safety and security may well have to override this. If there was a good cell phone that was only capable of calling preassigned numbers and which can only receive calls from specific numbers or from callers who know the password, I would probably go buy it now. As far as I can tell, this combination of phone and service does not yet exist in Silicon Valley/Bay Area. Also, a phone with live GPS tracking would be truly awesome. But I don't think we're there yet.
If we microwave their little brains now, they won't be able to take our jobs whgen they grow up.
Cell phones for all the little kiddies.
- Adam L. Beberg - The Cosm Project - http://www.mithral.com/
Seems what little kids really need is a simplified cell phone which can only have a few numbers programmed into it, e.g. home, mother's work, father's work.
An obvious idea, now watch some potlicker patent it.
A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
Every baby "goes wireless" when they get their cord cut at birth.
I just got my first cell phone two weeks ago, and I'm 20. I did fine without one all that time and even now I don't use it all that often. I really only got one because I won't have a landline phone in my apartment (though, I will admit, it is nice to have just in case and has proved handy a few times). Even so I mostly use it as a watch :P
5-year olds with cell phones...maybe it IS the end of the world...
In your opinion you hate them? My opinion is that you just dislike them.
Cellphones have done a hell of a lot for us. They've also done a hell of a lot to us. However, I think ultimately they are a necessary step towards ubiquitous mesh-networked internet access, simply because they will cause demand for same.
The simple fact is that you can't stop technology and always-on, global communications is a dream of everyone who wants to be connected. Anyone who doesn't want to be connected should consider the possibility that their life in civilized society is both wasted and causing them emotional problems; they should sell all their posessions and move to bora-bora, live in a grass hut, and shut the fuck up. The rest of us are trying to move progress on, because when it comes to escaping from the results of technology, the only way out is through. We either develop enough technology rapidly enough to sustain our technological growth, or we have mass dieoffs and possibly the species goes extinct. There is no middle ground.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
I think that this whole cell phone culture is pretty fascinating. I mean, a few millenia ago it was pretty common for kids to live in tribal societies where they knew and had easy access to their friends in physical space. Walk to the next hut over and talk to your friend, if you're not busy doing chores.
In modern society, I think that social networking and technology are bringing people "virtually" closer together despite the fact that many of us now live orders of magnitude further away from our friends and even relatives than our ancestors did. So in a sense, the idea that a kid is "too young" for a cell phone really cuts to controlling that child's interactions with his or her peers. I mean, once they would have been able to physically play with their friends, but now they live 30 miles from their best friend.
To me, it seems like it will happen anyway - we will see kids getting phones as soon as their language skills reach the point that they can appreciate having conversations with people that they can't physically interact with. Instead of restricting the phones, though, I wouldn't be surprised if there weren't phones developed which allowed parents to restrict/track contacts in the same way that parents long ago would visually keep an eye on their kids.
It's a different world, but in a way, there's nothing new under the sun again. Just technology enabling old ways of interaction to be feasible (at least in spirit) in a faster, more spread-out world.
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Of course, that was in Finland.
Look, CNET is running an example of Yellow journalism.
Or is it an advert for the Disney "find the kid" phone?
I'm to lazy to find out if their sponsors are fearmongering politicians or money-grubbing marketeers.
Where's the Kaboom?
There's supposed to be an Earth-shattering Kaboom.
This is a covert government program to mutate the brains of kids. The hope is that brain capacity will double, and the kids will grow up to have over sized craniums like space aliens in 1950s B movies. Murphy says that it will decrease by half. Which may suite the aims of George "Prince of Dimness" Bush just fine. [Not to be confused with Phil, "Prince of Insufficient Light"]
To repeat an earlier point:
Group intelligence is multiplicative when idiots are involved - combining a half-wit with another half-wit does not result in a full-witted person, it results in a quarter-witted person (1/2 x 1/2 = 1/4). Combining a full-witted individual with a half-wit still only yields a half-wit. The more of these "half-wits" you have involved in the process, the worse things get.
The only question is, how many dim-wits make a half-wit?
"It is a greater offense to steal men's labor, than their clothes"
Try driving a vintage car and claiming that.
While they can be terrible in the hands of the wrong person, they can be an incredibly useful tool.
When I was 5 years old I couldn't convince my mother to buy me a new GI Joe .... there's no flippin way I could have gotten a cell phone, even if they did exist.
;-)
What the hell does a 5 year old need with a cell phone? Call the babysitter to tell them you'll be late because you're power lunching with Billy on some cool mudpies? Call AAA if your Big Wheel breaks down? (Assuming they still make Big Wheels
Crap do I feel old now.
Lost at C:>. Found at C.
My girlfriend's son is 10, and he got his first cell phone from his mother this year. The phone is from Cingular. He has had 7 calls from strangers in one week since he got the phone. Apparently someone had the number before he got the phone is why he is getting these calls asking for someone named 'kalita' if that is how it is spelled. I told her to start treating them as harassment calls and report them to the authorities if they continue to call his number.
When government fears the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. - Jefferson
It made me realize that children with cell phones never get to be completly free of their parents. Who remembers, as a child, being able to get away from over-protective parents by simply walking away from a phone? Now, as children get cell phones, over-protective parents will flip out whenever the "battery dies".
No, I will not work for your startup
I think Verizon is on to something, but IMHO something like that is bound to be lost by a primary school aged kid.
Better form factor, a watch like device or a pendant.
With a form that is more difficult to lose, then, I can easily imagine kindergarten aged kids having one strapped to their wrist.
An _average_ of 5? Come on, even mode average isn't going to realistically account for this, I don't buy it. They must be looking at only those familes that have cash laying around, there are families that can't even afford cable and a computer, for crying out loud!
Boneheads!
Kids that young lose everything. There's no way I would give a kid something that costs that much money since they are just going to drop it on the playground.
I have a nine year old son who really wants a mobile phone. I'm not willing to give him one simply because he has no real need for one. His friends all go to the same school, and if he wants to call one he just has to pick up the phone. He also has free access to the net - no filtering - but the computer is in the front room. Mobile phones also are being used as a medium to bully other kids; sending mean txt messages and generally harrasing classmates out of school as well as in school.
As somebody with a mild addiction to technology myself I know that just because you can (have a phone) doesn't mean you should. Mobile phones are unnessasary for a nine year old. I would prefer not to have one at all; except sometimes its good to be able to txt people when coordinating meetings on the run. Also, at work we have one phone between six - as our roles do not involve much external communication, and most of that communication is by email.
18.
-uso.
What you hear in the ear, preach from the rooftop Matthew 10.27b
http://www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/store/controlle r?item=phoneFirst&action=viewPhoneDetail&selectedP honeId=2060
Sure, 16 year olds work and drive. Let the parents program their cell phones, home phone, and the kids work phone number. That's all they're legitimately need.
Future ruler of a small Asian-Pacific island
Other than nearly-instant communication for most populated areas of the Earth? Gee, I can't imagine how that could possibly benefit mankind. let me guess, it was uphill to school both ways as a kid, grandpa?
It use to be
"Give me your lunch money or I well pound you"
Now Its going to more like these
"Give me your cell phone or I well pound you"
It always nice to see even the school yard bully can evolve
Terrible... I don't think that words what you think it means
Or at least which friend's house they left it in so you couldn't track them on their wild rampages through town. Unless you shackle it to their arm before they leave the house; do any phones come with a handcuff option??
I Am My Own Worst Enemy
In a culture that is innundated with media reports of school shootings, amber alerts and the faces of missing children plastered on milk cartons, is it any wonder that parents want to feel as if their kids are constantly connected to them? Cell phones are an extension of the leashes they attach to toddlers. As long as their kids are within "reach", even when that reach is wireless, parents feel more secure.
It's a mistaken notion, of course. But it's the one marketers are using to get cell phones into the hands of younger and younger children.
...the problem is maturity and responsibility.
I believe that, with current regulations in the United States, the recommended youngest age for owning a cell phone should be 18 (give or take a few years). Here's my reasoning behind this approximate age limit:
If you're a parent with a whiny kid who demands a cell phone, do your research. There are models out there that can be "locked in" to only allow a few phone numbers to be called. Wireless providers like Verizon can change your plan so it blocks the sending and receiving of text messages (those cost up to ten cents each!). Remember: you're basically giving your kid access to your line of credit — control your kids' spending like you control your own spending!
Back in the 50s and 60s some scientists were afraid the radiation from television tubes would harm children watching TV all day. Now we know from how the boomers turned out!
Considering the crap most people feed their children, the danger of a mobile phone is a minor addition.
Open Source Drum Kit, LPLC deve board - mjhdesigns.com
I'm realizing that I may never have a landline again (I havent had one for years).. So having a kid call her friends is getting a bit more complicated than back in the landline era. I'm still not sure how it will work out.....
Once they are old enough to afford a real cell phone then they can pay for it.
Storm
If a job's not worth doing, it's not worth doing right.
Got my mobile which I still have at 20 and getting out of undergrad . For the longest time I fought getting the thing because I hated the thought of paying 30 bucks a month when I wouldn't use most of the minutes. I still don't use most of my minutes and they will just roll over and over and over. And now its upto almost 50 bucks. Bloody Cingular. It seems like all the prepaid options suck too so even if I get off contract I'm sorta stuck paying the same thing.
The sad difference the cell phone made - I used to memorize my friends cell numbers and five digit dorm phone numbers - now I don't have to and so while I have more peoples numbers I don't think I can recall more than 10 from memory. Sigh.
Offtopic - does anyone kno if cell phone companies have been investigated for either price fixing or being virulently anti-consumer.
Reality must take precedence over public relations, for nature cannot be fooled.
I have 4 sons, the oldest of which is 8. For my children, there is no place that they go where they are not supervised by adults. So it's not really an issue... yet. But it soon will be. Soon, I'm going to be faced with a dillemma. On the one hand, I want them to have access to a cell phone so that they can call me if they need me. It's a safety thing.
On the other hand, I really don't want them eating up 17x10^23 minutes every month. Nor do I want to worry about the frequency with which my kids tend to lose things. They lose things that aren't important to them. And if I gave them a device that limited their minutes and contacts (e.g. a firefly type device) then they'd probably lose it because it's just not that important to them.
The one thing I am absolutely certain of, however, is that I do not want to see some law come in and make the decision for me. Let me decide how old is an appropriate age for my children to have a cell phone. What might be a sensible answer for my kids might not be a sensible answer for my neighbor's kids. My neighbor is a single parent mom. Her 8 year old has a cell phone. She absolutely relies on her kids ability to have a cell phone, and it seems a sensible thing for her situation. Any law, even one that tries to think of all the contingencies, will ultimately fail to account for something. This is better left to individuals to decide for themselves and leave the legislation out of it.
Key to financial independence: Spend less than you earn. Save and invest the difference. Do it for a long time.
Awesome. I hear Bora Bora is a paradise filled with fruity cocktails and topless women.
...then, as far as I'm concerned, they are old enough to have one. I'm sure my daughter will ask for a cell phone at some point, and if she's able to work and afford the $40/month bill then more power to her.
-------
"Every artist is a cannibal, every poet is a thief."
But I think this is good. Mobile phones agre great for kids.
As a student myself, I can say that in my country kids get a mobile phone as they are about 10 years old/3-4th grade, usually. They can call their parents, they can send SMS to friends (say, about homework).
How about teens? Why are some of you think that kids/teens having a mobile phone is stupid? I think it's a good way for parent to contact them if they're out in town, etc.
Of course, it's OK and very good as long as they understand the price of it. I mean, the bill. For young kids a good solution is "pay-first-the-use-for-what-you-paid" SIM cards, where you pay some sum of money and then you use the phone untill it ends up. That you can refill it
Pay Phones are becoming rare these days. Many of the ones that were in Minneapolis are now removed due to lack of use. In addition to that many of them will not allow calls during certian times due to the "war on drugs". Not that I think that they need cell phones, when other phones are so abundant. for local calls, I have rarly been turned down when I ask to use a restaurant's or other establishment's phone.
But then I still don't have one of those things at 30+.
Every human, at least the ones that I've known, needs some privacy and time alone once in a while. On weekends, I turn off my cell phone and check my voice mail if and when I damn well feel like it. If you want to reach me - too damn bad - it can wait until Monday.
Ubiquitous Internet access? Nice sometimes, but no thanks. Too much information coming in all the time actually diminishes our ability to think, since it can be overwhelming, and if you're *doing* something all the time, you're not thinking...
We either develop enough technology rapidly enough to sustain our technological growth, or we have mass dieoffs and possibly the species goes extinct. There is no middle ground.
"IT" is not the only area in which technology can advance, y'know. There's aerospace, energy production, transportation, biomedical, etc; all of which are probably more important to our species' survival than everyone being able to access Google at 2:47am in the middle of the Kalahari. (That might save some individuals' lives, but it won't impact species survival as a whole.)
-b.
Quite a few accidents are caused by cellphone use however :/
I'd say that as soon as the kid is trustworthy enough to go places without the parents, they should be given a cell phone and allowed to do as such. Of course, for some individuals, this puts the age at 18 years old when they can legally get their own, but for most, it's around the driving age.
This has been expressed many times in this thread.
I'm of mixed opinion about fully-qualified vs. feature-limited phones for younger people who are using them, though. How many people is Joe Twelve going to be actually calling? Sure, he might call his friends who also have cell phones, but it's unlikely he'd make very much use of the gadget if he does have it. Additionally, every single cell phone I've seen (kid-marketed or not) does have the ability to restrict various settings. I had a Qualcomm Kyocera phone that had security options such as restrict outgoing calls to numbers in the address book only, disable adding new entries to the address book, and disable the window where the phone told you its own phone number so you couldn't give it to people and tell them to call you. My Nokia has something similar, I'm pretty sure, although I haven't looked.
These features allow you to easily cripple any phone and turn it into something akin to the LG Verizon MiGi device, except with the ability to, say, re-enable the blocked features if the owner is going away somewhere they need them. Out, for instance, with grandparents, or a friend or friend's family, where they might need to dial other people for a while.
It would also allow the phone to be "unlocked" as the kid got older or got more responsible, or both.
More and more people I know don't maintain landline service, or have that service in the sense that they have wires running out to their house but lines are so poor it's nearly never used. These people have cell phones as their only method of communication, and people tend to not like sharing with other people. I think it's perfectly acceptable to give a kid a feature-limited line on a family talk plan or something in these situations, at a very early age. For others, not so much.
Truly "vintage" cars are usually simple enough that the crap that goes wrong can be jerry rigged with some tubing, wire, etc; some creativity; and the right set of tools. You'd be better off carrying a good toolkit, some oil, water, and a good pair of sneakers if your car's that unreliable. Even in "populated" states, there are stretches of sometimes several miles with no cell reception.
And, yes, I do have personal experience. The first two vehicles that I owned were a 1980 Fiat Spider and a 1982 Yamaha XS650 motorcycle (both in the late 90s!).
-b.
the so called emergancys. and this is especially true for parents.
Every little thing is life and death everything is the biggest deal in the world.
Let your kids be, parents are raising a kids of wimps so protected from everything they are gonna fall apart emotionally and physically when they hit 18. (bday invites can only be given out if everyone is invited at some schools now)
Kids do not need a cellphone...
The phrase "more better" is acceptable English. suck it grammar Nazis
I'm an IT freelance and don't really need mine either. It's an ancient Siemens M35i which I'm going to replace when it falls apart - which will probably take another 20 years, since it apears to be indestructable.
However, my 8 year old daughter isn't getting a cellphone anytime soon, simply because her brain is still developing and I don't want it to near to a microwave emitter that often. That's the same reason I don't carry my cellphone at my belt anymore.
I think the age for a cellphone is the age at which people can appreciate the technology and are facinated and willing to learn about it without just numbly taking it for granted without thinking twice. It's the same age I'd give young people their own computer. Around about 15/16.
When she's old enough my daughter I'll buy my daughter a good quality cellphone with all the current gadgets and have her read, understand and apply the manual. That's all I ask about people using technology, be they young or old. If you're to dumb to grasp what's going own when you use a technical device - then don't use it. The world would be a much better place if people followed that rule.
We suffer more in our imagination than in reality. - Seneca
I would have loved to have a mobil phone when I was five.
I'd have taken it apart to try to figure out how it worked. And when I couldn't get the peices working together again, I'd have thrown them in with my lego set to use as parts of spaceships.
Quite a few accidents are caused by cellphone use however :/
No. They are not.
Quite a few accidents are caused by people being poor drivers, or by allowing themselves to act like poor drivers because they're doing something that's distracting them (putting on makeup, eating a sandwich, looking at the cows in the next field that will be their next sandwich, fiddling with their iPod, yelling at the kids in the back seat, smoking, digging through their briefcase - whatever). Cell phones don't cause accidents, people do.
Don't disappoint your bird dog. Go to the range.
Given that a recent scientific study showed that talking on a cell phone while trying to do anything else is like (or worse than) driving drunk, I'd say the legal age for cell phones should be the same as the legal age for drinking.
Which if you live in the UK or France is great, but in the antiquarian US, it's not so great.
-- Tigger warning: This post may contain tiggers! --
Great. Me too. I frequently simply don't answer my cellphone, or my home phone, for that matter. How exactly is the ubiquity of cellular telephony preventing you from doing this? (Sekrit Answer, hold your screen up to the mirror to read: .t'nsi tI)
Personally, I think and act at the same time. I find it important to think about what I'm doing. Consequently, I still have all my fingers even though I've used many a table saw, for example.
You basically need two things to drive technology, population and communications. The first one, well, I think we have that one solved, at least in terms of producing population. The second one is what you're railing against. The fact that progress marches on is the reason that your words are doomed to obscurity. Eventually we will all have communications technology that enables us to communicate with anyone else who permits us to contact them, any time, all the time. This will allow us to participate with one another on a global basis in a way that is only dimly foreshadowed by our current conception of "instant" communications.
In other words, by complaining about the ubiquity of communication, you're only doing two things. One of them is trying to hold back progress; I think we've covered that. The other is pissing and moaning about nothing since it's not really affecting you anyway. Just as people who kill people with guns would have killed them with a sword or a bow three hundred years ago, so people who currently drive like dipshits while talking on the cellular phone would have been doing something else twenty years ago, whether it's shaving or putting on makeup or taking their eyes off the road long enough to turn around and backhand their kid in the back seat.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
Anyone who wants to be continuously connected should consider the fact that they're a sad bastard with no real life, probably no real friends, and should consider getting treatment for thier emotional problems and joining civilized society where people still converse face-to-face and enjoy activities which have absolutly nothing to do with the Internet, wireless communication, or even electricity in many cases.
Just junk food for thought...
The OP mentions medical problems. Is it more dangerous for a young 'still growing' person to have a transmitter next to their heads?
Remember, this is Slashdot: News for Luddites, stuff that scares us
I hate normal phones too, why would I want to take one with me everywhere? I've never, and will never, own a cell phone.
The problem is, with the rise of cel phones, there are no more pay phones. At least, hardly any. I've tried to find one once or twice, and it's hard. As such, any teen who wants to contact their parents either has to have a cel phone or borrow a friend's. You can't even guarantee that if they're at a friend's house, there will be a landline for them to call on (or for you to call them on)! I'd definitely want my teen to have one, just because these days there is a serious lack of other options.
That said, I agree with other posters that until the kid is old enough to be doing this kind of stuff on their own, they probably don't need one. Although the ones people have mentioned that will only call parents or emergency #s sound like they might not be a bad idea, as long as the kid knows when and how to use it responsibly.
Warning: Apple/Nintendo fangirl. Likes her electronics cute & cuddly. May be rabid.
To talk to someone on a cellphone requires a lot of attention that should be given 100% to driving. Even more than most of the other examples you cite.
That's why it's *illegal* in most countries to drive whilst using one. Not that it needs a new law.. driving with one hand on the wheel (illegal), driving without paying attention to the road (illegal), etc.
I started using a cell phone at 16. The reason, in case you haven't guessed, has to do with driving. My parents were more comfortable with me driving if I had a phone to call for help from (NOT to use while driving).
Why an 8 year old needs a cell phone is beyond me, but if the parents want it then it's their (possibly ill informed) choice to provide it.
I know adults who have no need for a cell phone and 14 year olds who would benefit from having one available, so a specific age is not so important (unless somebody can prove damaging effects from radiation).
-Tim Louden
This got modded insightful? OMG
If I didn't have a "real life" and "real friends" then I probably wouldn't have people I wanted to be continually connected to.
Being continually connected doesn't mean continually tapping that well of information. It means being able to do so any time and any place. I don't understand why that is such an emotional issue for some people.
But ultimately, one thing I have learned is that you are a jackhole. The simple fact is that we Are all continually connected because none of us exists in a vacuum. Ubiquitous communications simply add another layer to this, that allow us to communicate more efficiently. Efficiency is a good thing.
Assuming I have no life because I want to be connected makes you an ass, plain and simple. (I, too, am an ass, but on an entirely different level. The reader is invited to draw their own conclusions about whether that's a higher or lower level, and then keep them to themselves because I couldn't care less.)
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
I swear, if I have to hear one more middle-aged housewife blather on about the details of her marital problems in the aisle of a grocery store, I'm going to start carrying a portable cell-phone jammer with me. Don't get me started on people who talk on their cell phones in traffic... I propose a better question: How old do you have to be to have consideration for other people?
Insisting on "correct" English is like saying that there is only one, definitive recipe for chili.
I was referring more about the other kind of thought, the kind that allows people to invent, write, whatever... That tends to require undisturbed-ness.
Eventually we will all have communications technology that enables us to communicate with anyone else who permits us to contact them, any time, all the time. This will allow us to participate with one another on a global basis in a way that is only dimly foreshadowed by our current conception of "instant" communications.
If use of they tech. is truly voluntary, then fine... If people, like our bosses and clients, *expect* us to be on call 24/7, not so fine! And, if the technology becomes ubiquitous, we will be expected to use it. Furthermore, if we're on call 24/7, our home lives start to be seen as an extension of work. No, you can't go hiking and leave your cell at home this weekend - I might have to call you in to fix some hardware (in a sane world, it could wait until Monday). No, you can't smoke outside of work...
The other thing is that our lifespans are somewhat finite and person-to-person interactions are much more rewarding than electronic ones. So, if electronic interaction becomes more common, we'll experience less of the real kind. But, then again, Slashdotters can't really be expected to know ;D
-b.
If you're too young to reliably use a headset instead of holding the antennae to your cranium, then you're too young for a cell phone.
-I like my women like I like my tea: green-
Five year olds need cellphones so they can call their lawyers when RIAA sues them for filesharing. Duh.
Heh, water's not going to do much good in an aircooled VW.
Anyways, my car is remarkably reliable, in spite of its age, probably more reliable than many new cars. However, there are some things which really can't be fixed on the side of the road, and do require a call for help. Like the time I had all four lug nuts come off one wheel and scatter all over a highway (and yep, I always check them at every oil change, so I still have no clue how that happened).
The car thing seems arbitrary, though the 16 year old driving age seems arbitrary to me too. You should be able to (drive|drink|vote) when you can prove you are responsible and capable enough to handle it. I think the same should go for cell phone ownership. When you are responsible enough and capable of paying for your phone, you are old enough to have one. Until then you aren't. They are a luxury device, and no matter what anybody says, nobody *needs* one.
As for the 'medical concerns', I'm convinced that this crap is only ever brought up by people who find phones objectionable for other reasons, and they're just trying to find some way to get everybody else to hate them too.
>8 year olds should NEVER be put in a situation where they would need a cell phone
Well, ok probably true for 8 year olds. But my soon to be 12 year old is about to start commuting to school on public transit. Maybe she is young to do this, but other kids at her school do it also and certainly high school kids do it frequently, in my area.
She'll be met at the station, but the train could break down, she could fall asleep and miss the stop, lots of things could happen. So I'd like to know, or like the school to know, if any of these things do. Hence she has a cell phone.
I'm no behavioral expert, but with a very limited plan, you could use the phone as a tool for teaching the concept of time management. Sort of a way to have them thinking about that clock in the back of their mind when they are chatting to their friends. Besides, they're going to have to have a mobile phone at some point in their life.
Wow, you must be old. I'm 18, and I had to go to Wikipedia to get that reference.
:( )
(All in good fun. Please don't kill me, Mr. Oldperson.
-Ed
"You can either have software quality or you can have pointer arithmetic, but you cannot have both at the same time."
Interesting.... The author mentions that the possible medical effect on kids is the primary concern here; however no one on /. seems to have brought that up. I agree, radiation effects of cellphones are not proven yet, but I still get the impression that people are more concerned about money and manners than the health of our kids!
Age is no measure at all of a person's ability of using a cell phone(or anything else). Let's face it, most people make us wish they didn't have access to the technology we use. But it is also the only way for improvement. The new generation is growing up with technology. Sure it was great when the Internet wasn't swarmed by idiots, but at least those idiots are hopefully learning at least something from being on the Internet. Children should, from the beginning, have unrestricted access to all information - that is the only way they can learn how to handle it. Shielding them from the world won't make them ready for it. If you are looking to bring up a helpless, defenseless kid that will fall victim to the first person with not so great intentions - go ahead and shield them. It is nothing but a perversion of the human mind to keep control over others, and make them dependent on you. So the right age to use a cell phone? Forget the age. Take the IQ instead. And apply it to everybody, not only kids.
I've heard this argument many times before, and each time it ends up leading into an incredible morass of entrenched thought. To me, this problem can be overcome by being willing to live on less - this opens up a lot of jobs and even careers that have the potential to actually make you happy instead of giving you an endless series of obstacles to surmount.
Mind you, I did this, and it backfired and I'm still not happy, and I'm making jack shit. On the other hand, I'm looking for something else, and the criteria do not include an immense salary. I want to be happy more than I want to be wealthy, and like daytime TV says, these are the days of our lives. Do you want to look back on your life and ruminate on all the time you spent behind a desk, or what?
Anyway, enough about that, it always turns into a horrible argument and may in fact do so this time in spite of my [comparative] restraint.
I don't believe that it necessarily stands to reason that as we have more electronic communications we will have less face to face ones. Technology can enable life, not just replace it. I use my cellphone on the way home sometimes - with headset, and let's not get into that debate too, because I am more than willing to ignore the person I'm on the phone with if my attention is needed - to ask my lady if she wants me to stop someplace and get something to enrich our lives when we are face to face, like maybe some food :P
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
Maybe one day Verizon will open kiosks in delivery rooms.
I hear Huggies has a new style with a pocket that will fit a cell phone or an iPod.
Although I would like to be able to monitor who they are calling....
They should be at least 14 years old before being responsible enough to have a brain tumour-generating device like a cell phone.
SEO Copywriter. Just Say ON
I'd start with a borg implant at the zygote stage to the kiddies can have the cell phone incorporated into their nervous systems from day one. Billg would be proud.
I am becoming gerund, destroyer of verbs.
I meant for drinking while doing repairs in the boonies :)
You know, plenty of generations of children have grown up without having cell phones. If I was going to be somewhere public and needed a ride, I took a dime. If I was at a friend's house, I used their phone. I can't remember once saying 'oh, if I only could call my parents, everything would be okay'.
They don't need cell phones. Frankly, you probably don't either. (You might... it's the same thing with pickup trucks or SUVs. 90% of people who drive them do _not_ need them. 10% actually do need them and use them.)
There is no need for a kid to have a fulltime cell phone. Sure, maybe to have on hand for safety reasons, but as for any other purpose, there's no need. Plus, cell phones are only going to add stress to one's life.
How in the world can anyone believe a totally made up number like an average age of 8yrs old for a child's ages when they get their first cell phone? I can only assume that is the average of all children between the ages of 7 and 9 who actually received cell phones. Otherwise, there must be an awfully large number of 1yr olds with phones in order to balance out the (obviously to any thinking person) number of teenagers with the things. Personally, I'd be much more inclined to believe a number like 11yrs, and that only if we limit the definite of "child" to someone who has yet to reach their teens AND only include the kids who actually have phones (any child without one would count as an age over 12, in my scheme).
Also, I've yet to see a situation where a child would need a phone over something simpler (cheaper and less flexible, too) like a two-way radio.
It was in the "Posleen War" series by Ringo, and was something to the effect of:
Heroes are created because somebody made a mistake. We don't want heroes in this war.
These situations are also where contingency plans come into affect. Yes, you shouldn't need one, but in the case of an unexpected scenario, or mistake, they could be what saves the day. One situation I can easily think of is where the person watching the child has a medical accident out at the park, or on a hike, whatever.
I wasn't aware that cellphones were stopping a mass dieoff and possible extinction of our species. Pretty powerful little devices.
I mean what parent wouldn't want a way to keep in contact with their children at all times? I think some of these even double as GPS recivers, so now you can keep in touch with your kids AND know where they are. Win Win if you ask me. Except for the kids of course.
Make it the same as drinking age. If they can't handle alcohol (according to your local laws) they can't handle a phone.
What about the kids whining they need to talk to Annie or Billie? Well, Get your lazy fat ass from the couth onto the new bike I bought you and go over there and actually talk to him face to face.
And no, you can not use my PC to chat, I am watching por^Wa documentary.
While you are at it, connect all legal issues to that drinking age, including a drivers licence, entering the army and voting.
Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
If we start buying CDs then the terrorists have already won.
I can see it now....your kid is born and you get his little baby bracelet, footprint and his lifetime cell phone number. The "Number of the Beast" folks were just a little off; it's not a barcode tattoo. The Beast not only has a number, he has a Calling Plan too :)
That's why one keeps about a flask of vodka! Plus, it has the added bonus of being useable as fuel if one manages to run out of gas in the boonies.
How exactly was this average calculated? They obviously didn't average over the age everyone got their first phone. Otherwise adults would have skewed the number to be much higher. Did they only count kids under 18? I think that would have given them a number greater than 8 too. So what cutoff did they use, 10? That might give you 8 as an average.
None of my ten year son's friends have cell phones (to my knowledge). I have a hard time believing the average age is that much lower in the UK.
Paul Carter
She's six years old and it spends most of the time switched off.
... honestly ... it's not a lot. She's got one of my old phones. She gets handed down the old technology, just like the computer in her room, and the TV. The phone is on a pre-paid credit account. I've put $20 (Australian) on that account so far, and that was about a year ago. It's still running on that. She made a lot of calls out of the novelty of the thing in the first week, and hasn't really bothered since. If she wants to use it more when she gets older, then we can work out a deal where she gets phone credit instead of an allowance. Or she can get a job and do what she likes.
I like her having it, because she DOES go and do things without me. She visits friends. She has dance classes. When she does these things, I throw the phone in her bag, and she knows it's there. If "something happens" she knows how to to call Mummy or Daddy, or any of the other relatives or close family friends we've got stored in the phonebook. If whoever is picking her up has a problem - a flat tyre, a train running late - we know, always, what number to call.
I've seen a lot of posts here about cost
It's not a control thing, it's a security thing. I feel better knowing she can reach me, and I can reach her, any time. Guess what? We hardly ever actually use it. The last time she called me was a few weeks ago when she hurt herself slightly at dance class. She talked to me for a minute, then went back to doing things. Would it have been better for her to just sit at the side of the class feeling bad and wondering when daddy was coming to get her? Sure, her teacher was keeping an eye on her, but that doesn't make a sad kid feel much better when the attention has to be split with the other 15 kids in the class.
People didn't have these things when YOU grew up, so they're bad now? I never expected that kind of attitude here. Improved communication is a good thing, folks. It certainly can't HURT. My daughter is growing up in a world where she has an ability to get in touch with someone whenever she needs to, wherever she is. That's what we're building all this stuff for, after all.
Wasting your time since 1997.
Track your wandering kid [or elderly relative]; details:
http://www.i-kids.net/
http://mobiles2go.com.au/ == from memory
If you're under the age of 12 and are a little girl on her cell phone: Don't Drive
God spoke to me.
I got my first cellphone when I was 2nd yr in college, it is kind of a good work "reward" for me and it's a Nokia 5110! Anyway, in my opinion, "fancy" and "hi-tech" mobile phones should be restricted to at least 18 yrs old or above. The reasons is that, here in our country, just having a cellphone exposes you to a lot of danger like "cellphone snatching w/ a free icepick stab if you resist". I don't want the children or teens exposed to that kind of danger, at least in our country.
Personally, I feel any earlier than the third trimester is too young to have a cell phone. Although an iPod is fine if the fetus continually whines for one.
* * * * * *
I'd horsewhip you, if I only had a horse.
--Groucho Marx
I remember when i was a kid like 8 or 9. I was the only kid who knew how to hook up TVs, game consles , and computers. So when ever billy or timmy dad took away the televison or nintendo i could fix it.. for a price. In this case it would be the kid who figures out how to download ringtones, or send txt messsages and tells all his friends...
What kind of curve does that graph follow, if 5 year olds are the average?
sig fault
The solution to the cellphone problem is to go for a prepaid account and to use a provider/plan/whatever that locks out premium calls (ringtones, international calls etc).
Then, they can have the cellphone to call you in emergencies AND to talk to their friends but you can keep a lid on the spending.
My 2 year old has her own cell. It's my old one . . . of course she doesn't have service. Doesn't stop her from calling her grandma all the time and carrying on long (one sided, duh ;)) conversations :)
"If you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear." - Every fascist, ever
Eight? Holy shit. And I was like 'wtf?!' yesterday when I saw two junior high kids with skateboards talking on their cellphones in a bus shelter...
Friend: "The NIC is misconfigured..." Me: "No prob, I'll just telnet in and fix it." *Silence*
Back in my day, during the summer, the neighbourhood kids would all leave the house early in the morning (riding our bikes with no helmets) to go play with GIJoe or Star Wars figures in somebody's back yard, go to the comic book store (tended by an eerily similar fella as the one in The Simpsons), go play (and pirate) C64 games at somebody's house, and just be all over the place, including woods and construction sites and our parents had no idea where we were all day, nobody could reach us. Only rule is we'd have to be home by the time it was dark. I don't recall ever having someone we knew go missing or of anything awful happening to anybody, maybe we were just lucky (middle class suburbs of Chicago), but then again we weren't stupid either, we knew not to get into cars with strangers and what not. Anyway, those were the days, no worries, no responsibility, pure independence, all day.
Give a kid a cell phone and you make them trade that experience for your own peace of mind, all of a sudden you burden them with something there. It's tough though, if I were a parent I'd be too fretful to let my kids run about like I did. Parenting must be a totally different experience now with the internet and cell phones, you're not sure who your kids are associating with. At least back then our parents knew that were were only associating with other kids more or less our age, but with the net, dunno.
I have 3 young kids; the oldest is 9. I'm constantly shuttling them, their friends, and their older cousins around. I have to say that I just don't believe that the *average* age that kids are getting cell phones right now is 8. I've never actually encountered a kid younger than 8 with a cell phone. I know that they exist - it's interesting enough that my kids have come home to report some young kid they've met that has a phone. But it seems clearly the exception. Does the 8 year average sound right to other parents?
http://www.kajeet.com/ , they hype kids, cell phones and freedom. Freedom from what??
As they say in their faq:
Q: Isn't this whole "technology for kids" thing getting out of hand? We live in a technological world. There's no escaping it -- and who would want to?!
Woo hoo!!
Where I live (Denmark) it's quite common for 4th or 5th graders to have cell-phones (that would be around 10 years of age). They don't call one another that much (let alone their parents unless they need a ride or something) - they use their phones to send each other text messages. Piles of them. That has become such a part of their pattern of social interaction that kids without cell phones feel left out. And quite frankly, they often are.
Most cell phone plans nowadays feature an optional "all the SMS'es you can send for DKK99 (~$15) per month" that is VERY popular with the young crowd (and certainly their parents).
My oldest son is in 2nd grade now, and in a few years we'll buy him a cell phone. Not for GPS tracking, partly for minor emergencies (of the "missed the bus" kind), partly for "I'm at Johnny's house" messages but the primary reason is that a cell phone is often a required device for social interaction with friends at that age. I may not like that (in fact, I don't) but the social well-being of my son is more important than my personal taste. A group of parents (myself included) have been trying to make my son's school ban cell phones from the classrooms with some success, but after school there's not much we can do about it.
Black holes are where God divided by zero
I think if they can handle a home telephone, they are well on the way to handling a mobile phone. Not like cost is an issue, my son's phone cost negative $50, after rebate. (If I had stayed with my current carrier, he would been able to choose from 3 previous phones I had lying around) When I was his age, mobile phones cost several thousand dollars and minutes cost a dollar or more...each.
"I forgot my mantra."
The safety and parenting arguments have had a good airing, but these aren't what concerns me about mobile phone use for the very young. I am more concerned about the effect they have on mental and society development. There is a lot of concern about how children have become more watchers than participants in anything from sport to natural history, as all media have become more sophisticated. A huge number of people now prefer to watch than to take part, which leads to a worldview that the only interesting things that happen are somewhere else. I grew up in a small town and that felt to be the case anyway, and that was in the days of punch card computing. Add to that the fact that groups of teenagers spend more time concentrating on their text messages than on the people they have chosen to be physically with and this sense of alienation looks set to increase. Going for a walk in the country without a mobile phone (or even one that's switched off)can be liberating in part because the only interest and entertainment must come from who and what's close to hand. If we want to encourage a generation that investigates their surroundings and engages with it, giving them unlimited access to mobiles seems like a retrograde step.
The arguments for giving 5 year olds a phone are not even funny. You have to raise your kids to take care of themselves. What do you mean they can call when they need help? Help doin what? The only thing I can think of is if they're running away from a gang of murderers, and thats just bad luck cuz you can't dial when you're doing that.
If your kids are lost or have been robbed or are unhappy they can
a) Find a f*ing police officer
b) If they can't find a f*ing police officer, find a f*ing phone booth
c) if !(a || b) find open grocery store, library..etc, run inside and tell someone important that they are lost and need to phone home.
d) get on a f*ing bus and go home.
Raise you kids right. They can't have everything. Our civilisation is going to ruin because of the we are raising our kids. The world hates us, companies are charging us $600 for consoles..let's get a grip on things ok?
The minimal age for cell-phone kids is 12.
This is Marketing designed to be self-fulling not a real survey. It's to make the trend following keep up with the Jones' crowd think that everybody else is doing it so they need to.
It was carried out for Disney Mobile (no prizes for guessing their target market) by Dhaliwal Brown a marketing company that states the following on the home page.
Working with a wide range of clients has given us the ability to see commonality and parralels in market development and share this experience with emerging sectors, such as convergent telecoms media.
To call dad, press two
To call the popular kid from Mrs. Smith's class, press three
To find an adult who will buy you beer and cigarettes, press four
For all other questions, please stay on the line
Interested in a Flash-based MAME front end? Visit mame.danzbb.com
When the kids can pay the monthly bill. If the kid does not pay for it, they have no incentive to keep the monthly costs down. That means it is more likely for kids to go over the limit (too many minutes), text message (if the provider charges per message), etc.
Kids really don't need cell phones.
Why should parents give kids every new electronic device that comes out? Can't parents just say no?
"... they might well create competition among children for who has the coolest new gadget."
:-)
..."
Like setting a cell phone age minimum would solve that problem.
"The jury is still out on whether or not mobile phone radiation is harmful to children
Translation: there's no consensus that such radiation is harmful to anyone.
"The other issue is privacy, something that should be respected no matter how old you are. Of course you want to know where your child is at all times, but there are times when not feeling like you're being watched is important."
Who, in his right mind, thinks a 2 year-old's privacy rights outweigh the need to know where he is at all time? And who thinks a 12 year-old always tells the truth when you call and ask where he is?
"Finally, do we really want our children picking up bad mobile habits? Spelling gr8 instead of great and developing RSIs at the age of 14?"
"Gr8" would be a bad habit only if it apppeared in an English essay, and repetitive strain injury is more likely to acquired by working at Burger King than by using a cell phone.
On the plus side, bad habits like yakking while driving or in a restaurant can be beaten out of kids, but adults enjoy certain misguided legal protections from such sorely needed correction.
When they can pay for the damn thing themselves.
I went out for dinner the other night, with a bunch of friends, male and female. We're all in our mid-late 30's, none of us have kids.
I happened to notice a family of 3 at a table a couple of metres away. Dad and Mom were sitting silently, watching the world go by, making the odd comment to each other. The young daughter, of about 12 or 13 was sitting with her nose buried in her celery phone, playing a game or texting her friends. This is not the first time I've seen this sort of thing. Every time I go out to eat, there's at least one family where this is happening. Usually the phone only goes down long enough for the kid to spoon something sweet and nasty into its cakehole, and then it's back at it.
I commented (loudly, in retrospect) to my girlfriend that when I was that age, the cellphone would have been left at home (forcibly if necessary), and I would have had to sit and make decent conversation with mom and dad. Either that or my mom/dad would have taken the thing away from me and turned it off. My friends would have understood that I would be incommunicado for a couple of hours. I doubt now that kids that age even know the meaning of the term. Anyway, daughter must have heard me, because she actually put the phone down for a few minutes and took a bit of interest in what was going on around her. 10 minutes later, her phone peeped again, and being short on memory and attention span (like most kids these days) she was back at it. Mom and dad gave each other resigned looks, but didn't say a word.
I remember a time when cellphones didn't even exist. Somehow we survived without them.
remember to loot and pillage before you burn!
And can I buy just the phone, if not? (because Verizon is kind of outside my area of interest)
It's better to be the foot on the boot than the face on the pavement. ~~ tkx Kadin2048
In the State where I live (Minas Gerais) we have four GSM operators (two GSM-only, two GSM+AMPS) and zero CDMA operators.
It's better to be the foot on the boot than the face on the pavement. ~~ tkx Kadin2048
Ironically, I did look it over (that's how I even got referenced to this thread). I spoke mostly from my own experience (as is the only thing I can do). I didn't assume your line "Brasilian since 1970 :-)" meant you were in Brasil (there are some up here too, in fact two of my coworkers are Brazillian [one for 6 yrs]). Up here, btw, refers to Massachusetts, US.
As for phones, you might still be able to get some useful info. The site I quoted before does carriers... try Cingular & T-mobile phones: they are GSM and you may be able to find unlocked versions of the phones or instructions on how to unlock them.