Slashdot Mirror
U.S. Senators Pressure Canada on Canadian DMCA
An anonymous reader writes "The U.S. copyright lobby brought out some heavy artillery last week as
it continued to pressure Canada to introduce a Canadian DMCA. U.S.
Ambassador to Canada David Wilkins gave a public
talk in which he described Canadian copyright law as the weakest in
the G7, while Senators Dianne Feinstein and John Cornyn wrote to
Canadian Prime Minister Stephen Harper to urge him to bring in movie piracy
legislation."
I want YMCA
Sometimes I think the US should just leave the rest of the planet alone. Just because "they" think one thing, doesn't mean it is the case...
when in doubt press enter and we'll figure it out later..
I think I can speak for most Canadians when I say:
Please, leave us alone. We can run our own country just fine without you.
Tis nice to see valuable return on money invested in political "leaders"
- Minutus cantorum, minutus balorum, minutus carborata descendum pantorum.
This is such a blatant statement spoken by a politician on behalf of industry(s). What? They ONLY speak when they are speaking on behalf of some industry?
if i didn't know better i'd call it that.
[and quickly goes into exile..]
I'm all for completely getting rid of copyright.. Copyright is so goddamn fucked up now that I think it would be easier for us consumers to not have copyright at all.
Is there an existing PAC I can join?
--- We need more Ron Paul!
WTF is this??? Once again, the American Senators think they can go about policing the world using blatantly wrong informtion that was provided by people who should not be providing information. I am sickened by the level of stupidity displayed by the US's lawmakers. These people are either voted into office (and we all know how unhackable the Diebold and other eVoting machines are), or are placed there by people who have other agendas. What agendas you ask? The lining of their pockets and subjugation of anyone who doesn't agree with them. I think this happened once before in the course of human history. If I remember correctly, I think this empire was called Rome. Or Roman. (And yes, I AM being exceedingly sarcastic at this time, since 0.001% of the US Senators will know what Rome was...) Thankfully, the Roman Empire collapsed on itself when a bunch of crazy people took control. But it started with just one. And right now, the US has a VERY crazy/insane/retarded President in charge. Perhaps this is the begining of the end...??? I sure hope so.
Should be a giant "shove off" , "get lost" , "stuff it", etc. ...
We don't listen to that AssHat of a ambassador.. he just spews garbage anyway.
this is a warning! repeat - do not mess with the baldwins! if you persist to harrass that fine family, we will resort to even more draconian and/or violent measures!
http://wstewart.php0h.com - the sugarbuzz project blog
He keeps coming up to Canada and Flapping it Around like it's something special. Sorry buddy we don't want any of what you are selling. Figure it out - we are not interested in ruining our good name by supporting the paranoid, controlling tendancies of the figurehead govt currently running the US. I just wish that guy would shut up though, every week he comes up with something new to Bash Canada on. Look to your own house, rigged elections, unethical treatment of prisoners, a base of lies and innaccuracies supporting a personal vendetta/private war.
Just stop already.
"Thanks for all the money you paid to us. We've used it to buy off ISO among other things" -Microsoft
Why don't we remove all our photocopiers from our libraries while we're at it?
Canada already has somewhat reasonable laws on copyright (there's room for improvement, but there are countries that are far worse). As I remarked on michaelgeist's website on this matter before, all we really need to do is toughen up on our laws regarding recording copyrighted performances at a theatre or other public venue. Canada has an excellent "personal and private use" exemption to copyright infringement that I would hate to see disappear, but people who falsely represent themselves as qualifying for that exemption only to later go and start distributing the work to other people really need to be nailed. Of course, by the time they've left the theatre, it's too late... enforcement becomes impossible unless you stop them from recording it in the first place, and the theatres really need to have the support of the law on the matter.
Right now all they do when they catch people is delete the recording and then kick the person out. The police won't do anything right now since technically "no law is actually being broken".
C'mon Canada! Toughen up!
File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
To those interfering with our (somewhat balanced) laws:
Go FUCK yourselves! If you want to keep all your crap movies to yourselves, fine. Just don't try fucking with our sovereignty.
As a Canadian and a copywrite holder I say, you do what you like there, and we'll do what we like here. It's your country, have fun! But this is our country and we'll do as we damn well please.
We have more pressing problems. Social problems, economic and political problems. Copywrite? We've got bigger fish to fry.
The US is a huge net exporter of copyrighted materials. Of course they're going to put the screws to other countries to tighten up copyright laws. Welcome to the real world.
They were apparently criticizing the Canadians for having the strongest civil liberties (in this area) in the G7. I thought the U.S.'s foreign policy was to spread liberty? I'm confused now...
Every week he seems to make a few comments bashing Canada, usually at public events, and typically without any real justification. Some of these comments are patently false, or non-applicable to the Canadian reality, many of them are mean spirited and seem to be designed to damage the historically good relations between Canada and the US. The guy is single handedly responsible for 78% of the anti- american sentiment in Canada.
The rock, the vulture, and the chain
Isn't this the same guy who said that Canada should butt out on Arar being on the no-fly list, because it is an internal US matter?
Hmm.. surely he has the same attitude towards internal Canadian matters, right? Otherwise, he'd just be hypocritical. Right? Oh, wait..
I am the maverick of Slashdot
Dear USA, Please keep your ideas to yourself, and leave my country alone. It's better this way. Just because you're miserable doesn't mean you have to go spoiling things for the rest of us. Sincerely, Canadian
Tis nice to see valuable return on money invested in political "leaders"
It's Dianne Feinstein --- proof that everyone in California is either on drugs or insane. What did you expect?
Personally I think the problem has mostly to do (aside from general human stupidity-in-groups) with how Congressional committee chairmanships are handed out, based on seniority. That's what lets some of the complete numbskulls, like Feinstein, and her equally-obnoxious colleague on the other side of the aisle, Ted Stephens, remain in power: even people that can't stand them, still vote for them, because it would be damaging to their respective constituencies to lose their influence in key (read: "cash cow") committees.
"Ladies and gentlemen, my killbot features Lotus Notes and a machine gun. It is the finest available."
Stay the out of my country
Since you're new here, I'm gonna cut you a break... today. So, why don't you make like a tree and get out of here?
"It seems to me (and I know I'll get flamed for this) that the US is only trying to protect its exports. This is not an example of bullying or trying to run the whole world."
6 6216
Yes, that's exactally what it is. (Of course, you expected to get flamed!). Do you not recall the Slashdot story, where the claim that movies are generally pirated in Canada was false? The RIAA's own information contradicts that assertion:
http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=07/02/05/1
So, this is the RIAA, using it's bought and paid for Senators to try to influence politics in another country. Guess how much US Senators like Canadian politicians giving them advice? (Like 'don't go to Iraq'). About the same as we like US 'Ambassadors' telling us what we should do in our own country.
"History doesn't repeat itself, but it does rhyme." Mark Twain
Say, dis sure is a nice Canada youse got here!
Shame if somethin' were ta.. "happen" to it.
*crash*
Oh, was dat one o' yer citizens' personal liberties? How terrably clumsy o' me.
*crash*
and I want to apologize for my country's behavior.
Canada - please urge your politicians to tell our politicians to go f*** themselves.
I used to live in the US, and when I got my driver's license I got summoned for jury duty. Well, you think these idiots would know that a non-citizen has no business dealing in the judicial or legislative process of another country. It's simply not morally right.
But, by the same token, I would ask Senator Feinstein to PLEASE FUCK RIGHT OFF. I didn't serve on jury duty in your goddamned state, so don't ask our Prime Minister to do your dirty work for you.
AMERICA! Fuck yeah! Comin' again to save the motherfuckin day yeah! AMERICA! Fuck yeah!
I'd post the rest of the lyrics, but they're copyrighted.
"I also read that the movie studios are considering delaying the release of movies in Canada to reduce the incidences of movies hitting BitTorrent before they hit the theaters."
So they think that preventing Canadians from paying to see the movies in a theater will encourage them not to download those movies instead?
Oh, sorry, I forgot we're talking about movie studio logic here.
This story was discredited, it's a mess of bad stat's and unfounded allegations that are not supported by the actual facts. The original Canada.com story stated
Thursday, January 25, 2007 As much as 50 per cent of the world's pirated movies come from Canada, prompting the film industry to threaten to delay the release of new titles in this country. (someone note the bolded words, I could write as little as 0 % and not change the meaning of the sentence, why? Because it's a weak garbage sentence that implies far more then it supports.)
The link that you posted was a little more bald in it's assertions, but not really that different. Try reading this link to the Toronto Star to see where reasonable minds dispute the "facts" presented by the American Media Companies.
The rock, the vulture, and the chain
The article you are quoting says
So combine
1) the initial reports claiming 50% of movies were camcorded in Canada with
2) the threat of delayed movie releases in Canada and
3) demands for Americanized copyright protections in Canada
And you get a perfect example of bullying.
1- Either go along with what the US says;
2- or start watching movies that come out of Quebec.
People always talks about how much the american system sucks. But at the end of the day, the US produces more movies and technology than the rest of the world. So maybe, it's not so bad.
.. they can simply stop trading there. This is just another example of them manipulating and controlling and BULLYING. America will always be hated and be a target while they continue to persist in these tactics for any domain, not just IP.
http://www.rense.com/general79/wdx1.htm
How much do you think the movie industry had to pay to buy these politicians?...
Here's how much:
From the movie Industry:
2000 Feinstein, Dianne (D-CA) $127,788
2002 Feinstein, Dianne (D-CA) $9,428
2004 Feinstein, Dianne (D-CA) $11,000
2006 Feinstein, Dianne (D-CA) $64,400
Just under $200 Grand? Maybe the music industry gave her a bit more?
I have no idea why John Cornyn sold us out. He's always been a schill for the oil industry, and to see him jump on something like this without a cash incentive is strange.
BBH
Props to The Center for Responsive Politics.
...please tell Senator Feinstein what you think of the DMCA and her support of it.
http://feinstein.senate.gov/email.html
Canada has plenty to supposedly lose. Many American movies (or sequences within) are being filmed in Canada due to cheaper production costs & beautiful scenery. If the US movie industry goes down the tubes (economically speaking), Canada would be affected.
So it's a good thing that year after year, the US movie industry records even greater gains, and ever increasing box-office hits. (DESPITE ALL THE "ILLEGAL" MARKETING..er... PIRACY).
Adeptus
No trees were killed in the making of this post; however, many trillions of electrons were horribly inconvenienced.
Never has it been more true than during this shining era of Bush Administration that the world at large has been inclined to take America's advice to change, to "jackboot themselves into line", as an indication they are doing something right. This will only make us Canadians way more likely to loosen, rather than tighten, legislation.
The thing about your World Stage move from friend to bully is that nobody will take you seriously any more, not unless you pull out your big stick. For 'friends' this stick has always been your deep pockets, but thanks to your recent choices in leadership has been whittled away.
Before Bush: $1 US = $1.68 CDN. Today: $1 US = $1.16 CDN (and its been as low as $1.10).
Not such a big stick anymore...top that off with your rough foriegn policy and the increasing ease of global commerce, and suddenly we don't really care so much anymore when you get mad at us.
And, to be clear, dear Americans, this isn't "the politicians" talking, this is America talking...you vote for them, you let them run your country, they are your voice as surely and purely as anything you say yourselves. Only citizens of a dictatorship get to cry innocent.
Sooner or later you guys are going to have to take back what your elected weasels have taken from you. Until then, come on up North, we'll watch some downloaded movies, smoke some fine Cuban cigars, do some online gambling, throw rice at a couple of ladies getting married and freeze our asses off (hey, it's still Canada).
From TFA:
"It's not some effort to protect some high-paid Hollywood star or studio."
Really? Further along in TFA, it says quite plainly (with emphasis mine):
"The film and music industry lobby asked Schwab to add Canada to a "priority watch list" of countries that have failed to stem piracy."
Of course it's to protect "some high-paid Hollywood star or studio."
To my Canadian friends: Resist, resist, resist. Feinstein's the biggest MPAA/RIAA whore in our Congress. I've written (okay, typed for e-mail; maybe that's the problem) this idiot more times than I can possibly remember to protest her backing of various obnoxious things (broadcast flag, PERFORM Act, etc.) to no avail.
Those who can, do. Those who can't, write technology blogs.
I mean, if natural selection worked for countries, too, the USA would've died YEARS ago.
We don't have to beef up anything. We pay levy on blank media, and that is it. All personally made copies are covered by said tax. Fix your laws and country before telling others.
...so he'll probably do what the US wants.
... this sounds so dejavu, if we just move around the casting a bit and substitute USA with the USSR, members of the US Congress with members of the PolitBuro of the Soviet Communist Party.
We also used to live under the occupation of the Nazi Germany... but I really don't want to go there.
The rest of the world already thinks that the world-wide invasion of Hollywood made products accounts to cultural imperialism, which is killing local culture.
Dear US politicians, it's fine to try to protect the interests of the industries of your own country, but please don't forget what happened to those empires, which forgot that their legislative power is supposed to be within their own borders.
In general, all countries should support Copyright law as originally intended (don't publish other peoples work without permission), NOT help media conglemerates enforce their new "we control what you see or hear and when" agenda. DRM is *not* about copyright infringement. There is no need for a pirate (BTW - this term was used way back in the 1800's to describe copyright infringement) to decrypt media to copy and sell it. DRM is *only* about media corporations controlling your eye and ear gates with the goal of controlling your mind. Don't let them spread their poison to Canada! Educate your Politicians about what DRM is, and why it has nothing to do with copyright infringement.
Sure, it's trying to protect it's exports -- the only problem is that the exports? They're pretend.
"See this picture of a mouse? Yeah, you need to pay some guys in the US if you want to display it. And not just for today, or next week, or seventy years after the death of the artist. No, the citizens you represent are gonna need to pay some guys in the US for it -- forever." No, the law doesn't say that, just like it didn't say that all the other times it got amended and extended. For limited times, people, it's not rocket science!
US copyright laws are a contemptible fraud. No sane nation would have anything to do with them given a choice. The US may levy enough pressure to remove that choice. Let's hope they fail.
Yahoo! Pipes are awesome. How awesome? http://pipes.yahoo.com/jesdynf/slashdot
A choice quote from Senator Feinstein:
When any lapdog of the US media industry talks about "The Canadian Film Industry" or "The Canadian Music Industry", mentally substitute "The Canadian Subsidiaries of the US Media Industries". The vast majority of films shown in theatres up here belong to Hollywood and have little or nothing to do with Canada or the real Canadian film industry at all. You could give away DVDs of every big hit for free on street corners, and while the US media giants might suffer, the Canadian film industry would hardly even notice.
There is a spellbook here; eat it? [ynq]
Ok please anyone who knows who to call in Canadian Parlement to tell them that no US Canadians DO NOT want the complete screwup is the DMCA in the US. Considering its done nothing but screw up people lives in the US, why on gods green earth would Canada even think about getting it. so come on who do I call, mail, run up and speak to ??
Considering that US Ambassador David Wilkins' only argument is that Canada's copyright laws are the weakest in the G7, suppose that Canada reinforces their copyright laws as a result. David could then talk to another country, telling their government that their copyright laws are now the weakest and that they must do something about it. Repeat four more times for the remaining countries.
This looks to me like a worldwide RIAA/MPAA waiting to be unleashed. That is, if Stephen Harper accepts this.
P.S.: TFA is really short; what's so informative in it?
I think you might mean the MPAA, not the RIAA ... but your point is well taken. Regarding whether Canada is a major source of pirated movies, did you not read the reference article I provided?
The more you regulate a company, the worse its products become.
We have not just a Conservative government in place, but a small-'c' Conservative government. Such a government would most likely be only too happy to bring in DMCA-like legislation. Given this, what can we do *now* to at least try to prevent such legislation from happening? This issue is especially pressing as there is the possibility that the Conservatives will form a majority government in the not too distant future.
To reiterate: what can we do *now* to keep the abominable DMCA from reaching Canadian shores?
Yes and you never did any other research on it did you. I have seen other articles, some on slashdot that bring ALL those numbers under question. These losses I keep hearing about just don't make any sense anyway, O look that movie mad 1 Billion dollars and this one and this one. Yep they are losing so much cash. then who are all these people in Canada and the Us going to see movies and buying the DVD's ???.
I am. What our leaders do in our name is utterly insane. If I could change a single political concept here in America, it would be to remove the desire to control other countries. If we ever lose our monopoly of military power were going to be so screwed by every country we ever bullied.
You == clueless. Michael Geist has already conclusively disproved the notion that even a significant fraction of piracy originates in Canada.
The more you regulate a company, the worse its products become.
I don't know, but unless there is a DVD rip of the movie preview, its not even worth watching said movies. Feeling quality of said movies, is akin to running nails down the blackboard. I would highly disagree watching or waste time watching them. Often I'd opt going to cinema. People who don't go to cinema, usually don't decide so based on availability of movie in cruddy format.
p.
The government will invite the senators politely for coffee, listen to them, do a nice photo op, send them home and then go back to trying to gear up for the next election, trying to polish their image etc... The governemnt is inclined to do exactly... nothing
The Harper government has enough problems right now and has bigger problems than to try to introduce such a trivial piece of legislation. Especially when they are a minority government. This comes up every six weeks on slashdot. Something that should be taken into account is that as long as the governemnt is in a minority position, this issue is apt to be ignored.
http://www.techcrunch.com/2007/03/05/barenaked-lad ies-new-album-free-no-drm-now/
Fat fingered me - the parent quoted a different article than the one I qouted
absolutely how the bushleaguers do business in every way.
it would have been more entertaining if they watched "Billy Jack" instead of "the Godfather" during their formative years.
last weekend flipping the cable remote......
if this is supposed to be a new economy, how come they still want my old fashioned money?
Why does it seem like the only effect of the '06 election is that the payoffs go into a different set of pockets?
[Insert pithy quote here]
What bothers me about the tone of the responses telling the U.S. to f--- off is that we're not telling anyone they have to do anything.
It may be the case that we can go to some poor African or South American country, to whom we bestow billions of dollars in financial aid, and tell them they have to do something or have the funding withdrawn.
Canada is in no such position. Anything we ask of them is merely something to be considered. "Look, here are the (made up RIAA) statistics, why don't you sign onto the DMCA?"
All you have to do is say "no." You tell us to "f--- off" and then call the U.S. "divisive."
Stupid sexy Flanders.
As a Canadian, I've learned to ignore anything said by U.S. ambassadors. The message from the U.S. is invariably hypocritical.
On the matter of Maher Arar, a Canadian who found himself on a list of suspected terrorists and shipped to Syria to be tortured, a Canadian panel found that mistakes were made and Arar was given a formal apology by the Canadian government and a $10 million compensation package. Our government then requested Arar to be removed from the U.S. terrorist list because the information was shown faulty. U.S. Ambassador David Wilkins said, "It's a little presumptuous for him [our Public Safety Minister] to say who the United States can and cannot allow into our country."
On the matter of the U.S. ignoring World Trade Organization rulings and our North American Free Trade agreement and taxing our lumber exports, David Wilkins dismissed our ministers' complaints as "emotional tirades". That's $5 billion dollars in illegal tarrifs. Any country would get a bit emotional...
David Wilkins also questioned our claim to some of the Arctic waters bordering Canada's north. Wilkins objected to Canada placing military icebreakers up in the north. What, the U.S. thinks it has greater access to the Arctic than Canada??
And now he's telling us that our technology laws are too lax for America's comfort... So we can't tell the U.S. how to interpret international trade laws and we can't tell the U.S. that a man's rights were violated because of flawed intelligence and we can't tell the U.S. where our northern geographic borders lie... Yet David Wilkins believes the U.S. has the right to tell us how we listen to our music???
David Wilkins lacks the smooth rhetoric required of an ambassador. He's not willing to look at compromises. He's not a U.S. Ambassador to Canada. He's Bush's pitbull to keep the troublesome Canadians in check.
We will not accept that another country tries to tell us what to do!
and I endorse the above message.
(But I would have added "and take your neo-con shill Harper with you.")
American woman, stay away from me
American woman, mama let me be
Don't come here hanging around my door
I don't want to see your face no more
I got more important things to do
Than spend my time growin' old with you
Now woman, I said stay away
American woman, listen what I say
American woman, get away from me
American woman, mama let me be
Don't come here knocking around my door
Don't want to see your shadow no more
Colored lights can hypnotize
Sparkle someone else's eyes
Now woman, I said get away
American woman, listen what I say
American woman, I said get way
American woman, listen what I say
Don't come here hanging around my door
Don't want to see your face no more
I don't need your war machines
I don't need your ghetto scenes
Colored lights can hypnotize
Sparkle someone else's eyes
Now woman, get away from me
American woman, mama let me be
Yes, I read the article you provided. If you follow the one I did, and the /. article it was rebutting, you'll see the original CanWest News article from which this all originally came.
And yes, I meant MPAA.
"History doesn't repeat itself, but it does rhyme." Mark Twain
"I recall reading recently that a large percentage of the pirated movies originate in Canada."
Sure.
And I've also read that the population of elephants in Africa has tripled in the last 6 months.
And I REFUSE to take responsibility for the decisions of the power elite who rule over me. I will NOT help the cause of the ruling class by apologizing for THEIR decisions.
(You do admit the fundamental difference between government and the people, don't you? One group holds a special "right" to employ coercion as their means; anyone else who does so is a criminal. If that inequality of power didn't exist, government wouldn't exist, and no amount of indoctrination can change that.)
"All you have to do is say "no." You tell us to "f--- off" and then call the U.S. "divisive."
The problem is, the rhetoric is constant. '9/11 hijackers came from Canada'. Softwood lumber. Mad Cow. SARS. Security and Prosperity Partnership. Constantly ignoring us in Afghanistan, our response to Katrina and 9/11.
Your Ambassador (and his predecessors) are always telling 'little brother' what we should be doing that is good for 'bigger brother'.
After a while, 'F--- off and mind your business' is a perfectly cromulent response.
"History doesn't repeat itself, but it does rhyme." Mark Twain
Let me get this straight... Camcorded movies is why we need a DMCA?
First, I won't even watch one of those. And I can't see millions of dollars being lost to people who do. I mean seriously - who trades a theatre experience -- even a "home theatre" for a 'camcord rip'?? Anyone who does that was NEVER going to pay for the movie anyway.
Second, if that's the issue, we don't need a DMCA, at most we need a 'no video cameras in theatres' policy. And that's something the theatres are already welcome to enforce. (And many do so on advance screenings, and opening weekend shows.)
I also seem to recall theatres were developing camera detection technology to further combat cameras in theatres -- some sort of way to detect camera lenses as i recall...
30M Canadians includes kids too, which represent a fair portion of the population. Statistics Canada says family size is about 3.3 right now. So that's 30B for ~9M families, or 3300$/family.
So piracy means every single family - poor and retired folks included - 275$/month worth of entertainment, every single month, year-round? Ludicrous.
Yes, piracy has cut in my spending somewhat (not buying crap not worth buying anymore, but I still support my favorite artists), but it's not like I was even spending that much in the first place, even if you include things like cable TV and Netflix.
It seems to me (and I know I'll get flamed for this) that the US is only trying to protect its exports. This is not an example of bullying or trying to run the whole world.
If you don't like the laws of country X, don't do business with them. A smaller nation has no choice but to follow that rule (imagine Switzerland demanding canada change their banking privacy laws- they'd hear a loud f. u., if anything), the US however tries to pressure the government of X into changing their law. That is definitely telling others what to do, and in many similar cases the term 'bullying' is quite appropriate.
It just doesn't matter. The Chinese are taking over the pirate business at a dizzying pace. Retailers of pirated material are pressuring the wholesalers to have the movies recorded and burned in China. It turns out that they can be unloaded in Vancouver and shipped east for less than what even the most efficient Montreal pirate can do it for. Yeah, that's the downside of globalization.
Since Feinstein is a prominent Democrat, and not acting in a way that can conceivably be written off as being oppressed by the Republican majority, can we finally admit that both parties hate us?
Dewey, what part of this looks like authorities should be involved?
Don't forget about the blackout that affected Ontario and the north-eastern US. That came from Canada as well according the the Americans.
Actually it didn't it started as the result of a tree on power lines in Ohio or something like that. But even after finding out it wasn't Canada's fault did the Governor of New York state or the Mayor of New York City come back to the media and apologize for bashing Canada over it? No, no they didn't.
Please keep up your heavy-handed and insulting efforts to force Canada to change their laws. Where a gentler, more nuanced approach using the Canadian copyright interests might have succeeded, this sort of bullying is likely to inspire Canada to resist, and poisons the well for future lobbying attempts. May your tyranny always be tempered by incompetence.
Can't Blame Canada For Counterfeiting
" These reports invariably present a distorted picture - digital music sales grew faster in Canada last year than in either the United States or Europe and music downloading on peer-to-peer sites for personal purposes is arguably compensated through a private copying levy that generates tens of millions of dollars each year. Moreover, movie camcording in Canada affects roughly three percent of Hollywood films (not 50 percent of camcorded films as initially alleged) and Canadian copyright law is consistent with international treaty obligations. " Blame Canada!
The Canadian government should tell the representatives of the USA it would be happy to pass and implement a Canadian version of the DCMA just as soon as the USA agrees to reciprocate and make some concessions to the rest of the free world by ratifying and implementing the Kyoto Protocol, submitting itself to the jurisdiction of the Internation Criminal Court, doing away with capital punishment and releasing all foreign detainees that have not been charged with a crime to their country of origin. That will shut our idiotic representatives up in a hurry.
Well, if I susbcribe to your idea that Canadian piracy hurts the movie industry bottom line (which I don't, but for the sake of argument I will concede), then would it not benefit Canadians to pirate films as much as possible up to the point that the industry collapses? You know, since more movies will be shot in Canada, since it is cheaper, in order to keep profits up.
I don't want to imagine Harper, Dion, Duceppe and Layton dressed up as the Village People, performing that (but I bet you just did :)
Stasis is death. Embrace change.
malheureusement la stupidité n'est ni curable, ni mortelle.
I have also bought over 700 tracks on iTunes since it opened in Canada in December of 2004. Should I have been buying more music? What if I did not find some bands interesting? Stop producing so much crap and maybe you will see people willing to buy more music.
In a nutshell, piracy is not the problem. The problem is the content producers are not making much worth buying.
Jesus was a compassionate social conservative who called individuals to sin no more.
Really I think what's going on is completely backwards. Canadian MPs and Senators should be lobbying the American congress and senate for looser copyright laws. Encourage the the United States to switch from its current witch hunt lawsuit enforcement system to instituting blank media levies or something similar.
Oh, a lesson in history from Mr. I'm my own grandpa.
Not particularly, if the US movie industry did not exist, some other entity would fill the void concerning promoting new films. Filmmakers of course are certainly NOT going to stop making films as long as there are people who want to watch them, and the current movie industry is NOT essential to that process (please note that i do not say not USEFUL, they are merely not essential, especially since the costs for high-end effects and production are becoming less prohibitive all the time).
If the US movie industry went belly up, there would still be people who want to film around our scenery.
Ice Cream has no bones.
That may be so, but I understand why it gets on some people's chimes.
I don't care why you're posting AC
Not quite. Really close, but not quite. Dave's the Minister for International Trade. You'll want your local MP or the Heritage Ministry. Your local MP may not care that much about you. I'd write to them, sure, but CC them the letter that you're sending to the Heritage Critics.
In Canada, we actually have a group whose job it is to criticize the actions of the ruling party. We call them "Her Majesty's Loyal Opposition". It is their job and duty to ensure that the ruling party doesn't get too far out of hand.
The Heritage Minister (for Copyright stuff, including CCRA fees) is The Honourable Beverley J. Oda. You know how we've got a minority government and a multi-party system? Well, poor ol' Bev has no less than THREE people watching and critiquing her every move.
Charlie Angus, NDP Heritage Critic
Ms Christina Keeper, Liberal Heritage Critic
M. Maka Kotto, Bloc Heritage Critic
You may want to let those critics know that:
1. You're concerned about the recent lobbying around Bev,
2. You feel that the critics should be ever watchful about how American interests are attempting to take over Canada's sovereign rights and heritage.
3. Having American companies dictate when Canadians can use their equipment or listen to Canadian music is unconscionable.
M. Kotto will likely set Bev on fire. Just make sure you write in French.
---
ECHELON is a government program to find words like bomb, jihad, plutonium, assassinate, and anarchy.
David Wilkins can take a long walk off a short pier.
Stephen Harper (our douchebag PM) should tell the american government to go fuck themselves until they apologize, pay reperations and swear they will never ever kidnap and torture our citizens again.
and now they are shitting in Canada soil. Boy. Greed knows no boundaries. Drop a few hundred grants to a senator, s/he will go shit anywhere for you.
Read radical news here
I live in California and I have never and will never vote for Dianne Feinstein. It's not even that she is in a different political party as myself. She has magically managed to be on the complete opposite of every singe issue that has come up. I don't know how she does it. Does she have a team of researchers looking into my point of view so that she can have the opposite point of view?
It might be interesting if Senate and House legislators were to have all of their bank accounts (foreign and domestic) audited, pre election, post election, during term, after term. Oh, let's not forget the President's, and all of his cabinet member's accounts as well...
It might, just might, get rid of a lot of the "corporate influence" that seems to run through currently.
Who is general failure, and why is he reading my hard drive?
The entertainment industry is huge in CA, of course. A Senator's job is to represent her (or his) state. ... How long do you think a Senator would last who didn't represent their constituents?
I can guarantee you that the entertainment industry doesn't employ anywhere near the majority of the people in California. In fact, I rather suspect that many industries which are hurt by Feinstein, et al's, stance on intellectual property issues, which are not only pro-DMCA, but also pro-copyright-extension and mostly pro-broad-patents, vastly exceed the number of people employed by the few big studios that benefit mostly from the legislation.
In short, Feinstein, and most other Senators, do not represent their constituents, they represent their donors. A Senator who actually represented his or her constituents would probably quickly find himself outspent, and consequently out of office. That is one of the key failings of our current system. It's not really worth running for office in the United States unless you are either independently wealthy (on a multi-million scale for heavily contested state offices, and multi-billion for heavily contested Federal ones), or have donors with deep pockets (and, who are going to expect a quid pro quo in return for their lucre -- remember, there are no political donations, only investments).
"Ladies and gentlemen, my killbot features Lotus Notes and a machine gun. It is the finest available."
Fuck off. Thank you.
You know... we could just tell our own politicans to do that and save canada the trouble
Coming to you live from another dimension.
I find it interesting that there is all this talk surrounding the legality of recording movies in theatre. I have a friend who runs the independent film society here in my city and she frequently gets tickets to the screening of premiers - moveies that launch a week or two earlier before mass release. Without fail there are security guards equipped with hand held metal detectors who scan you and give your belongings a looksee at the entrance. It has always bothered me and I'm wondering how it can be practiced legally. Are screenings exempt or is it just a scare tactic? I have no interest in recording movies in the theatre, but I wonder what would happen if I brought my digital camera with me. Could they actually legally deny me entrance?
Of course, the USA put import tariffs on Canadian lumber , in direct violation of the NAFTA (North American Free Trade) and GATT rules. Fought tooth and nail against removing them for 7 years. Collected billions in illegal tariffs. Refused to abide by one tribunal decision after another, determining the duties were illegal. (Even though they signed the treaties to agree to abide by these tribunals' decisions).
In the end, they pressured the Canadians into signing away their right to export lumber to the USA duty-free, in exchange for the return of 40% of the duties they had already illegally collected, at the threat of 5 more years of the same...
This is just LUMBER. It's not even a major industry for the USA, but they still felt the need to fight dirty and nasty and long. It's just one example.
And they wonder why Canadians don't like being told how to run their country by Americans...
Despite the rhetoric designed to get us to implement DMCA-type laws, the copyright law in Canada is quite good. You cannot make copies for resale. You cannot even give away copies.
But if you're going to sue someone over this: (a) you better be prepared to set precedent, the details aren't ironed out yet, so you better have a good case (b) we pay a blank media tax for artists, the presumption obviously that some private copies will be made (c) if you sue and lose in court, you likely pay their lawyer costs (d) if you want to find someone's details from an ISP, you have to prove it to a judge in court, not just sign a paper allegation for a clerk (e) you can't demand usurious compensation, you have to prove real damages (f) there's no guarantee you'll get legal costs if you win.
I do know some guys from the early days of the internet here in Canada, who were nailed by Playboy for selling CD's of copyrighted pictures. Playboy didn't get rich of a bunch of kids, but they did make sure these guys would not take the risk of doing it again. Our legal system does work.
Somehow, the RIAA's trained senators don't seem to like fair rules.
Only citizens of a dictatorship get to cry innocent
When there are only two viable parties (for which I stopped voting, my vote is strictly split between the Greens and the Libertarians now, i.e. "none of the above") and a very, very rich corporation can "contribute" millions to the candidates of both parties (i.e., legalized bribery), then I'd say we actually do, in fact, have a dictatorship. Or mor accurately, a plutocracy.
If it were illegal to contribute to more than one candidate in any given race, and illegal to contribute to anyone you weren't eligible to vote for, you would have a point.
But the fact is, the US is not a democracy. It doesn't matter to [$multinational corporation] based in Japan (Sony-BMG) or France (Bertlesmann) or Germany (Crysler) which candidate I vote for, as both candidates are already beholden to [$multinational corporation]. In short, the multinational corporations, based around the world, are my dictators.
I have no more voice in my country than an Italian under Mussolini.
Then by your same logic, the fact that Canadian politicians listen to US senators indicates that the average Canadian listens to the American senators as well.
and freeze our asses off
Sorry! Dealbreaker right there. I'll just change residence to Cali and vote instead.
Anyone got a torrent?
Eternity: will that be smoking, or non-smoking? I Corinthians 6:9-10
Goose and Gander time:
b ackground-en.asp ..."A NAFTA Extraordinary Challenge Committee (ECC) agreed with Canada and unanimously affirmed the original NAFTA Panel's finding that the U.S. International Trade Commission had no basis on which to find that the U.S. industry was threatened by injury."...
c fm
i es/2005/07/25/story7.html
Despite WTO and NAFTA decisions supporting Canada (which the US ignored in typically arrogant fashion) It took 10 years to create a new softwoods trade pact to stop excessive tarrifs on Canadian softwood imports to the US:
http://www.dfait-maeci.gc.ca/trade/eicb/softwood/
You can probably thanks Georgia-Pacific and their ilk for that.....
The US also chose to ignore NAFTA (which they themselves pushed upon Mexico and Canada as benefitting all of NA) is order to keep Mexican cement out of the US (until they didn't have enough local product due to post-Katrina reconstruction)
http://www.thebta.org/news/newsreleases/12162005.
http://birmingham.bizjournals.com/birmingham/stor
Canada has had some interesting ideas regarding copyright and fair use which should not be trampled by the copyright holders who seek to enslave the elements of popular culture. USians make the mistake of seeing Canada as a miniUS, but from what I have seen is that their society has a lot of Liberal European ideas about individual rights which the US would be wise to consider if they were'nt ponied up to the trough of the copyright cartels..
-I'm just sayin'
I think Canada should invade the US for what we (I'm an American) have done. Seriously. Just send about ~500 guys to take over a small town in Maine, and don't give it back until the US leaders sign a treaty to not have American troops or ideals leave US soil.
Bush is (thankfully) on his way out, I can't believe he hasn't been impeached yet for what he has done. At least Clinton was cool and didn't throw the country headfirst into invading a soverign nation. And Bush had the balls to order the military to draw up plans for attacking Iran.
People get mad when I liken what the US is doing to Germany at the start of WWII, but anyone with half a brain can tell that's what is going on. Of course, the requirment for 1/2 a brain disqualifies most of my country.
Would any Canadians mind if I move to Canada after my schooling is done? I expect many intelligent Americans to do just that if there aren't major changes in how the US gov't is run.
"US" interest? You mean, a powerful private multinational industry interest that happen to be based primarily in the US. Just because US law currently has no mechanism to protect consumer rights doesn't mean that consumers who live in the US don't have interests that should be protected. US consumer interest should be US government interest--not some multi national private industry that's making quite enough money on it's own.
If the big media producers are hurting, why don't they cut back on those political contributions and lobbying? As long as they have the extra money to spend on politics, I don't believe they are hurting.
I am sick of USA and its corporate asshat lobbyists.
Your country sucks, but don't go pressure other countries and try to convince them to adopt your fucked up copyright ideologies and shit.
We don't want any of that crap.
...write to your Member of Parliament.
e form_action/
It's so easy, there's even an on-line form:
http://www.onlinerights.ca/get_active/copyright_r
Stand up and fight!
Mark
TWINKIE HOUSE!!
Harper is (ideologically) close to George Bush (but infinitely smarter).
That said, they'd need do something about the fair-use rights consumers have (you can make a private copy of a music CD that you borrowed) and stop charging the tariff on the blank media we currently pay. That or work it into the system.
Canada does a lot of things to keep the US happy. Most Canadians aren't against marijuana, and while there are laws in place, being caught we substantial quantities rarely amounts to much more than a slap on the wrist.
Unfortunately, the only thing more diverse than our respective takes on guns, drugs and fair-use-media is the size of the two economies. Sometimes Canada has to pay lip service to something that we'll never take action on. This is probably going to end up as one of those issues.
Fuck you, buddy...
Or, they'll unleash their ULTIMATE WEAPON upon us.
Celine Dion !!!
In an average living room there are 1,242 objects Vin Diesel could use to kill you, including the room itself.
As far as I am concerned. Especially those movies where the physics is really bad.
Do you think that Canadians can reduce the number of Hollywood movies being shown by pirating them more?
I say Go Canada Go!
Once I was a four stone apology. Now I am two separate gorillas.
I absolutely resent that statement!
Not EVERY Californian is on drugs or insane! We just keep getting outvoted by those who are.
Peter predicted that you would "deliberately forget" creation 2000 years ago...
Canada has Public Domain Day, while America does not. This should, even by itself, be a source of embarrassment for Americans. Every year that goes by wherein our corporate masters clutch their cultural assets ever tighter to their collective chests is another year of shame.
Laws do not persuade just because they threaten. --Seneca
Your statements are true in all ways except perhaps that there has been no 'official' declaration of this policy, yet.
The USA, and inded many nations, are run more and more by big business, and less and less by the consumers who live within the geographic area that was once their country.
...as grampa used to say. (sorry I couldn't afford the final 'e' in the title)
Specifically we would like to remind our American friends that you do not have a monopoly on stupidity. We are fully capable of, and frequently practise, making stupid decisions on our own.
In fact we'd like to hold a formal stupidy competition to prove that we're not just some trivial pissant to the north you can view with contempt. OK, we may not quite be able to match the whole "two terms for President G.W. Einstein" thing. Actually, that one's pretty much off the charts. Seriously, you've got to stop scheduling your elections to occur immediately after happy hour. The fact is we're all waiting for Ashton Kutcher to run out and tell the planet we been punk'd. Yes, that's it isn't it? Oh you kidders!
(sigh) Once again we come in second...
I'm not entirely sure how this would work, but would it be possible to encourage grassroots legislation to prevent campaign contributions? Like, start with some small towns or something, where they could ban it, and slowly work your way across a state?
If enough small towns do it, maybe there'd be some media attention, and then some of the larger cities - possibly whole states - might be encouraged to adopt the same legislation.
Shouldn't she be out banning scary looking guns or something?
Banning guns seems to be her hobby, but being a corporate shill is apparently how she pays the bills.
"Ladies and gentlemen, my killbot features Lotus Notes and a machine gun. It is the finest available."
TWO MONTHS and people think democrats can fix everything?
Whats going to stop progress?
1) Senator Lieberman, democrat in name only
2) VP Dick, senate tie splitter
3) veto Bush, who ignores the law and the constitution.
4) American Infotainment propaganda
The Democrats can only Demo and not actually produce anything. Impeachment is their only option and quite likely they can not convict. The media will spin it so it hurts the democrats and few of them have the guts to put their job at risk.
All the CAN do is de-fund the troops and hope americans are not retards and blame bush when he sends them in naked to die (which he almost did when the war started, and we know how he handled Katrina...) Dying in Iraq is dying for nothing, but dying in Iraq from the USA government actually working, that is worth dying for and what the oath is about. (the oath is not for iraq its to the us constitution)
"Tabernacle" is the only word I've ever heard bleeped out on MusiquePlus or Musimax.
...laura
I find this action by our government to meddle in the affairs of Canada highly offensive. Apparently our "Professional Politicians" haven't already been given enough power by the unwashed masses in this country. Now they want to tell Canada what to do... hopefully my neighbors to the north tell Washington where to put their DMCA...
To all Canadians, please accept my apologizes.
I voted Libertarian because, I believe in the government by the people for the people...
If you didn't vote Libertarian then YOU are part of the problem.
I think I speak for all Canadians when I say; "EH! F-off YA HOSERS!"
Being true north strong and free means WE have sovereignty to decide weather or not our rights get trampled in favor of the greed of the MPAA. Our freedoms cannot be easily swayed by foreign citizens.
that's 2000 Feinstein, Dianne ("D"-RIAA)
Tech Public Policy stuff
We don't make the same mistakes the US does. We learn from them, laugh, and move on.
I beg to differ. Here is a quote from Michael Geist's blog (http://www.michaelgeist.ca./):
Here is a quote from a BBC article http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/6334913.stm on the topic:
Now, let's look carefully at these two quotes and see exactly who is clueless. Geist says only 3% of Hollywood movies are camcorded in Canada. The BBC article says 10% of all Hollywood films are camcorded. I suppose we should forgive Mr. Geist for playing loosely with words since he is an attorney and that is what they do. But you are presumably a technical person who can see through this cleverness. Stay with me as I will now introduce some difficult math that may be over your head
Thanks for playing.
The more you regulate a company, the worse its products become.
Please refer to this post for an explanation of how 3% becomes almost 50% (BTW, I never said 50%, I said a large percentage, and I think the numbers bear this out). You may find it interesting to see how lawyers like Mr. Geist play with words and numbers in order to obscure the truth. http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=225394&cid=182 57448
The more you regulate a company, the worse its products become.
Thanks for the pointer to the Michael Geist "rebuttal". Please see my comment at http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=225394&cid=182 57448 for my analysis of Mr. Geist's trickery. He is an attorney after all, so I suppose we should forgive/expect his playing loose with words and numbers. But /.ers are supposed to be technically saavy and good at things like math and percentages, so we should easily see through his shoddy "defense".
The more you regulate a company, the worse its products become.
On top of that, the vast majority of my fellow Americans (which excludes an appreciable chunk of the
I would (and occasionally do) push for a change in our system, but that would take pretty hefty amendments to our constitution, which require either unbelievable unity among the common man in favor of them, or strong support from the people who benefit from the way things are now. Either way, at this point all my words are are annoying complaints.
Oh yeah, we could also have some sort of coup, but let's be reasonable, those never turn out well.
blamecanada? where's the blameamerica, blameidiotpolitician tags??
Given the number of Democrats who don't like her, unless she retires at the end of this term, I think you can expect one.
Tech Public Policy stuff
You may not have realised it, but there are actually entire other countries out there, many of whom produce movies too. For example, Bollywood in India alone produces more than twice the number of films that Hollywood does (if you don't count pr0n, that is).
Even if you just look at English-speaking movies, there's still the UK, Australia and New Zealand to add to the Canadian industry. The US probably spends the most money on movies, but I'm sure there's enough content elsewhere to keep most distributors afloat, especially when you add subtitled foreign-language films (e.g. Japanese anime) as well.
Then of course there's the stifling effect that Hollywood has on other markets. Without it, other countries might have a chance to get more of their films to an eager public, so any shortfall would be offset.
Why would anyone engrave "Elbereth"?
Hypocrite is not a dirty word in the U.S. and you have to remember that when you talk to Americans.
They never see it on the news, if they did they wouldn't care.
In fact I'd bet 3/10 Americans don't even know what it means.
But of course that's trying to make them follow our values, and that's not ok... So speak on Bush we're rapt.
..and no longer answers to the people, and I am saying this as a US Citizen. I am truly ashamed at the way my country has become, and coupled with the world's highest incarceration rate, the words "land of the free" have become an utter joke, a sick twisted oxymoron. Our gov't has become highly corrupt, and refuses the wishes of the people (most US citizens would not even dream of garbage like the DMCA or the bullshit the *IAAs are trying to pull. They did and end run around the American people, plain and simple)
Don't become like us, we are already well down the road to facism. I am starting to think
more and more everyday that revolution is going to happen within the next 20 years, and revolutions are NOT pretty.
Not To Be Nit Picky but its not G7, its G8. US,CAN,GER,FRAN,ENG,RUS,JAP,IT. Thanks High School History.
lol
Did you just completely ignore my post? I suppose that's typical. Set up your straw man and knock em right back down again.
I said very specifically: "Michael Geist has already conclusively disproved the notion that even a significant fraction of piracy originates in Canada."
But I note that you didn't quote that part, because that's not what you were addressing. Instead, you went off on a completely different tangent. I didn't say Michael's numbers were perfect. I said he's disproved the notion that a significant fraction of *PIRACY* originates in Canada. I didn't mention Mr. Geist's specific "3%" number at all, actually. So, then, what precisely are you trying to disprove of my statement that doesn't still hold? After all, it addresses an issue you completely ignored! Let me spell it out more clearly: the MPAA is spreading lies about Canada. Michael Geist disproved them.
Additionally, your silly logic about the popularity of movies being somehow a factor in that 3% (by implication apparently suggesting that the 3% is *from* the most popular movies to begin with,) is preposterous. Evidence? Quotes?
The BBC article isn't very clear either (unfortunately:) "As of August 2006, the MPAA documented 179 camcorded movies as the source for infringing DVDs since 2004." We both know that many of those 179 are going to be overlapping: more than one camcording individual is going to be recording "300" from theatres in multiple locations, for example. All those people selling counterfeit copies aren't going to be cooperating as perfectly as you are suggesting!
Finally, you are quoting out of context (Ben Jonson would be frowning at you for that) by ignoring the fact that Michael states plainly later on in the same article: "I acknowledge that counterfeiting may be an issue, but argue that Henderson and the CACN have exaggerated the impact[.]"
P.S. Why would you expect me to read through the entirety of your comment history for the one reference to a 30% figure you derived in a completely different conversation thread? Now pay attention: click "Parent" and then click "Parent" again and once more. Where's the 30%? I don't see any mention of 30%.
You == still clueless. I win.
End of Line.