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30 Days Is Too Long: Animated Rant About Windows 8
First time accepted submitter Funksaw writes "Back in 2007, I wrote three articles on Ubuntu 6, Mac OS X 10.4, and Windows Vista, which were all featured on Slashdot.
Now, with the release of Windows 8, I took a different tactic and produced an animated video.
Those expecting me to bust out the performance tests and in-depth use of the OS are going to be disappointed. While that was my intention coming into the project, I couldn't even use Windows 8 long enough to get to the in-depth technical tests. In my opinion, Windows 8 is so horribly broken that it should be recalled."
The rants and negativity is getting old while there are tons of people who take a few minutes to get used to it and feel it's actually better.
Why not learn from a 3 year old how to use Windows 8?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dlZgcAacIxU
Or from a five year old?
http://microsoft-news.com/microsoft-portugal-shows-the-simplicity-of-windows-8-in-a-different-way/
This space for rent.
Sounds like a user problem to me. Windows 8 is working just fine for me.
Nope.
" Windows 8 is so horribly broken that it should be recalled."
Now, forgive me, but you can totally enter into windows 8 from a standard windows interface (as I understand it). That and, data shows, people are becoming familiar with it. Put that onto anecdotal evidence that younger individuals pick up the interface just fine and I'm inclined to think you knew what you thought before ever using windows 8.
Eat sleep die
This video shows that you just can't copy Yahtzee Croshaw without his motor mouth rambling, it just doesn't feel right :D
Captcha: copied :D
Glad we can ignore you and read someone else that is less biased about things.
Tens of millions of licenses have been sold... I don't understand how you can claim that you didn't like it because you weren't used to the interface when you gave up on it immediately.
So if I have no problem using it, does that make you dumb, or just lazy?
I've been using it just. I put up with the NewUI instead of the Start Menu when I have to, but other than that, I spend 99.9% of the time on the desktop and it works just like Windows 7. I haven't used the NewUI/Metro Tiles/Apps or Store since the first day I installed it, and I have no plans to either.
Been using it for months. At first it is a bit odd, after awhile it is really not very different than Win7 other than being faster. Metro is cool IF you have a touch device. Otherwise it is kind of in the way.
I just finished building a budget pc to replace a dinosaur. I put the XP SP3 on and did a clean 'upgrade' to 8 Pro. After three days, I have to say I quite like it. I mostly use the desktop but flipflop to the metro stuff now and then too. Still a bit put off by lack of start button but I've not really gone too deep into the whole Win8 thing to find out all the short cuts and other features (I've not had to). BTW, my other OS on the machine is FreeBSD so hardly a rah rah MSFT guy. But I do think much of the hyperobole against it is misplaced.
Honestly, it seems like this guy just had a bone to pick. I've been using Windows 8 on my primary computer for a month. While I didn't like it at first, it took maybe a day to get used to it. Now I rarely ever venture into the Metro interface. To be frank, the shit is cake and people complain just to complain.
It seems a bit over the top for the context, but it is well-done.
"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong."
-H. L. Mencken
And who are you? "Those expecting me to..."; who was expecting you to do anything? You wrote about some OS releases 7 or 8 years ago, and now you didn't even write anything up, you made an animated video?
I'm supposed to care about this guy why?
I have been using Windows 8 for the last few weeks and it seems to work just as well as Windows 7 did on the same machine. I suspect most of the issues the OP is having is just due to change anxiety due to for example the new Metro interface. Metro does take a while to get used to but like the ribbon it grows on you after a while. I think there are better things to rant about than Windows 8 to be honest.
You're not technically adept if you have trouble with Windows 8. Sorry, but it's true. There is literally no difference in desktop mode other than the re-location of a few Control Panel options, and the Metro apps are like any tablet/phone OS; they're big, take up the whole screen and generally don't have the same flexibility as apps in Desktop mode. You have two options for apps, not particularly complicated.
whilst
in short:
"It's not what I am use to so I won't bother with a in depth analyses that may not support my bias."
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
He's not real bright.
You can pretty much use Windows 8 just like Windows 7, just the "start menu" is now fullscreen. Press the windows key, start typing what you want, bingo.
Tens of millions of licenses have been sold because there's no choice. One buys a PC with an operating system to view and edit files, and a lot of industries have standardized on file formats exclusive to applications that are in turn exclusive to Windows. Windows 8 is the only thing that sort of reliably runs these applications that Microsoft still sells for bundling with a new PC. If Windows 7 were still widely available, tens of millions of Windows 7 licenses would be sold instead. If application publishers made a point of supporting Wine, at least millions (if not tens of millions) of Xubuntu licenses would be sold instead.
Some of us started on paper tape and punch cards. Windows 8, Unity, whatever. It's not going to stay the same forever. Cry me a river!
Now I rarely ever venture into the Metro interface.
How do you prevent yourself from swiping the wrong way on your laptop's trackpad to accidentally bring up weather, as the video points out? And if the interface formerly known as Metro is something to be avoided, why was it made the default in the first place?
To be frank, the shit is cake
Is this in the sense of "let them eat cake" or "the cake is a lie"?
and people complain just to complain.
No, they complain because they can't change it back to what they know they can operate at least as efficiently.
I'm holding it wrong?
QUESTION: Why'd Microsoft attempt to shove something down folks' throats they didn't, & clearly DON'T, want (and the figures show that much backing me)?
* Answer me a another question: Why should I, or anyone else, have to learn anything new they didn't WANT IN THE 1st PLACE??
(We're all used to the Win9x style interface, there was nothing wrong with it @ all - so what was YOUR point???)
Understand this as well, per my subject-line above:
You're using "blank slates" in 3 & 5 yr. old children!
So - have you considered the rest of us are NOT "blank slates", & that we're already conditioned & used to something we've all used for, what?? 17 yrs. or more now???
Please... your links are comparing us to children who haven't gotten used to a damned thing yet.
E.G.-> Why don't you learn how to drive a crane to work instead of your car... oh, wait - what's that?? You aren't used to it??? What's the MATTER with you, boy!!!
APK
P.S.=> A cardinal rule of sales: You can't sell something people don't want... & they do NOT want to have to LEARN what they do not want to - get it? Good... now, try make Microsoft understand that, & thanks.
Above ALL else here - This, from me? It isn't "negativity"... it's just telling it how it is, & I'm probably 1 of a VERY SMALL MINORITY AROUND HERE (windows fans, vs. *nix folks)
... apk
...from a usability standpoint; and as everyone has pointed out a million times, it's the lack of some type of Start menu. It just doesn't make sense to have to completely leave the desktop whenever you want to launch another application. The silly corners aren't even that big of a deal (although they work much better in a tablet environment than on a desktop).
Win8 was obviously built for a touch screen. Microsoft sees things headed in that direction and decided to make that the primary focus. The desktop gets what feels like a "port".
It's sad too, because other than that Win8 works really well. And it really could have been the perfect desktop. Picture this: You boot into Metro. That's perfect for people who just want to check email or a quick look at the news or weather or what have you. It's good for mouse and awesome for touch screen. When you have serious work (or gaming) to do, you click the "desktop" icon and boom, you have your actual desktop. I mean a real desktop, with its own menu for launching applications. If you want to go back to the Metro it could be a hot corner or even a right-click option. Whatever.
The point is, if you're in the middle of something and need to launch, say, a calculator it's just silly to have to leave the desktop to do it. Sure, you could clutter things up putting the icons everywhere but who wants to do that? I get why MS wanted this for its tablet (how is the Surface working out for you, by the way?) but it seems just plain lazy to not have a true desktop version.
I'd imagine that someone will come up with a mod that essentially adds it back (actually, there already is one, although all it does is put metro in a window on the lower right of the screen where the Start menu would be--not ideal, but it shows people are thinking about it) or maybe even MS will realize that it's best to give people what they want.
But then, everyone knows you skip every other version of Windows anyway.
Coming from someone who has had a deep and long dislike of Microsoft, Windows 8 is not that bad. Metro is half baked and feels like it was tossed in at the last moment. Other than that, I have had less issues with Windows 8 than its predecessors.
Now then, what were they thinking with Metro? I have no idea. It feels half assed, and adds no value. The screen looks like someone's idea for webcasting push technology from the late 1990's.
"To those who are overly cautious, everything is impossible. "
Just out of interest, I walked into a PC World store to check out the new touch-screen PCs running Windows 8.
I timed myself: I was sitting there trying to work out how to do the gesture to get the Start screen. 90 seconds later, I simply gave up.
Windows 8, even on high-spec hardware with multitouch displays is completely unintuitive, completely undiscoverable, clunky, and amateur-looking.
I am GOBSMACKED, that Microsoft claimed that they've put a million user-hours into usability testing.
It'll snow in Hell before I put my hand in my pocket to upgrade.
have kids try working desktop and metro apps at the same time.
MS will need to let you install metro apps out side of the app store and let up on some of the sand boxing as well.
The Sandboxing in the app store apps just get's in the way of many work flows.
There's inevitably going to be fans for any OS, even windows ME.
Since we have a Windows 7 slate that I really wanted to upgrade (read: make usable, as 7 is pants on a slate) daughter and I went to an Office Despot that had Win8 running on a big touch screen monitor, and I tried to get it to do stuff. Never touched Win8 before, but had worked on most previous Windows operating systems, (starting with 3.1, 3.51, 95, 98 SE, NT 4, 2000, ME (shudder), XP (still using it) and 7, plus experience with server 2000 and 2008) how hard could it be?
I massaged the screen for about ten minutes and couldn't get it to do anything useful. Oh, you can touch a tile and something happens, but it's easy to get into a mode where it's not at all obvious how to get out. GUIs, especially touch GUIs, should have visual cues on how to navigate, or at very least do things in consistent ways.
After awhile, daughter pushed me aside, as she has experience with Windows 7, Android and iOS on touchscreen, she wanted to take a crack at it. She figured out how to get out from where I had gotten stuck, but not much else after another ten minutes of pawing at the thing. Like 7, there seems to be little cabalistic gestures one has to learn to perform certain actions in 8, and they don't seem to be similar to what you had to do in 7. We finally gave up.
Mind you, I'm sure it's possible to learn Windows 8. The point is, it's not at all obvious how to use it.
Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
treat the Start screen like a full-screen version of the Start menu
And because it's full-screen, it all but encourages the user to forget what he's working on. Ever have amnesia as you go through a doorway? The fact that the Start screen is full-screen is like that.
You don't need a Start orb to click on -- just hit the Windows key.
How are users who have been opening the Start menu with the mouse for a decade and a half expected to discover the Windows key?
I don't like the fact Win8 has two "modes" and hidden context/UI, but frankly, being a VIM user, I don't think I have the right to make that complaint.
Seriously, there's a lot that's broken about Windows 8 right now, but I'm willing to give Microsoft the benefit of the doubt long term. I'm certainly not going to upgrade until they've fixed a lot of their poor UX decisions, but I'm pretty sure they'll figure it out by the next version. Microsoft "Window" is a very apt analogy at the moment, but I'm putting my money on this being a success long term.
...But I found this entertaining and pretty accurate. But hey, I have no connection to Microsoft. For all the guys calling this man an idiot, well, that's just idiotic. He's clearly no idiot; just doing quite a good job at a well-deserved rant about a grotesque product. It sure beats 20 minutes of jabbing pins into a Billy doll, which I'm sure many are doing or should be, just in case it has an effect.
metro apps need to be able to run in a window / over lap as well.
limited # of apps at the same time on the same screen is not a good idea on a desktop or big screen laptop.
use windows shell
If you HAVE to deal with a Win8 system then install classic shell and be done with it
If you think the measure of things is how a 3 year old does them then i would suggest your choices are a bit different beginning with say your underwear,
note for MS please restore the Start menu/Orb at least as an option for SP1
note for IT managers please allow things like Classic Shell so that your folks can get WORK done.
Any person using FTFY or editing my postings agrees to a US$50.00 charge
Metro apps are designed to be very simple, quick full screen apps. if you want to "work" you would not be doing so through a metro app. you would use a real software program witch would not run through metro and thus it would works 100% the same as windows 7. you can have 500 windows open side by side if you wish.
Even the windows 8 calculator is not full screen and maybe some at MS said calculator does not need to be full screen but to bad metro apps need to be full screen so it's not a metro app.
I managed to watch about 2 minutes of his poorly done video. Apparently 5 or 6 years ago he wrote a couple of free lance articles, which makes him an O/S guru. Now he's out of work again and sounds like he's trying to make a name for himself by riding the anti-Win 8 band wagon. Hope he finds a good day job because he's not going to make it free-lancing.
Most of these comments are from stupid people who either (1) work for micro$oft or (2) wish they did. Why is it fashionable to say 'OH NO! He's negative! He's wrong!" Oh QQ and STFU. Windows 8 sucks and so do most of you.
Use those two tools to make it even easier.
You are being MICROattacked, from various angles, in a SOFT manner.
Now then, what were they thinking with Metro? I have no idea. It feels half assed, and adds no value.
I've already posted a bunch of anti-Windows 8 comments to this story, so I'll try to balance it out a bit: Adding support for the "modern UI" might have something to do with ability to buy one application and run it on your Windows Phone 8 phone, your Windows RT tablet, and your Windows 8 PC. Or it might make Surface Pro and other x86 tablets more desirable. Or it might make the interface easier to navigate with a remote control; the Xbox 360 bears this out (apart from the ads that take up two-thirds of the tile space).
Basically, he discusses the four c's: control, conveyance, continuity, and context, and gives examples about why all of these are horribly back-leveled from earlier Windows versions. Most damningly, he points to reduced control by the user...which is a trend that seems to have permeated through Windows since Windows 95. He summarizes by referring to someone else who observed that Windows 8 was really designed for content consumption by the user rather than content creation as personal computer devices were originally intended for. Content consumption is probably the main purpose of a tablet but we will still need content creation equipment and Windows 8 appears poorly suited for that, while not offering any alternative due to ending sales of Windows 7. His most damning comment is that Windows 8 is "user hostile." The best thing about his comments is that they will (hopefully) start the discussion about what capabilities need to be retained in future personal computers and future Windows versions.
It is clear to me now that you've never even used Windows 8. Please refrain from commenting on how terrible it is until you've actually tried it?
You are correct that I have not purchased a copy of Windows 8. I wasn't aware that one had to pay Microsoft in order to participate in Slashdot. But I have watched the video, and I am commenting on the video.
I hear Windows 8 is perfectly usable as long as you reconfigure the HOSTS file. Any idea how to do that?
How is a person supposed to know what to type to find a thing that isn't listed? This has frustrated me at times in Ubuntu also. Why the menu hate?
troll
on the Princess Bride? INCONCEIVABLE!
I usually never promote software unless i think it's a game changer. As stupid as this might sound to some, i would highly recommend getting the Stardock Start8 start button app and installing it. Once you do that, disable all the hot-spots, and tell it to boot straight into the desktop, and voila.. it's just like using windows 7 but with all the new upgrades and features that are in win 8. Honestly i agree with the authors assessment of windows 8 but this 5 dollar app completely turns it around and makes windows 8 completely usable. Microsoft should thank Stardock for creating a cheap app that fixes their complete train-wreck of an OS.
Looking over the posts, most of the one defending Windows 8 follow this scheme: "Windows 8 is great, [I installed something | I found a way] to never use Metro".
Considering that the UI formerly known as Metro is the heavily advertised main feature of Windows 8, are people now endorsing or rejecting Windows? This is so confusing.
at least in 95 you can still do folders setup win 3.1 style.
8 get's rid of the menu and folders / groups for starting apps with out 3rd party add on's.
A desktop loaded with apps in not a cell phone and NO I don't want to scroll though pages of apps to find one.
OR let's say take a game in's folder you can have links to a webpage , a map editor, the game add, maybe a updater app, unit editor, uninstaller, also add expansion packs with there own links and ECT. Now all of that fit's nice into 1 folder and NOT a full page of the windows 8 start screen.
Why should I, or anyone else, have to learn anything new they didn't WANT IN THE 1st PLACE??
You shouldnt and you dont. If you dont like Windows 8 then dont use it, use something else. If you must use Windows 8 then install one of the many start menu replacements, navigating the start screen just once to get to the desktop isnt that hard.
We're all used to the Win9x style interface, there was nothing wrong with it @ all - so what was YOUR point???
We were all used to the Program Manager in Windows up until 95 too and there was nothing wrong with that.
Understand this as well, per my subject-line above:
You're using "blank slates" in 3 & 5 yr. old children!
So - have you considered the rest of us are NOT "blank slates", & that we're already conditioned & used to something we've all used for, what?? 17 yrs. or more now???
You have to upset the status quo to make meaningful progress and when the status quo is so heavily ingrained you do indeed find change significantly disruptive. If you are not able to adapt (or simply do not want to) then perhaps you should choose an OS that you have control over.
They do have a reason for doing it, to have a unified look across their platforms, the price for this is a slight inconvenience for the desktop users in the form of an extra step to get to the desktop.
If you cannot get windows 8 down in 30 seconds, you really should return it and buy a Apple product. That will be more your speed.
I've been using Windows 8 exclusively on my primary computer since it became available on MSDN in August. It originally BSOD'd randomly and had a weird file copy bug, but MS has really stepped up their patching game since it was released to the general public in October. I haven't BSOD'd in almost a month, and the file copy bug I was experiencing seems resolved as well. The OS seems to have seen a host full of bugfixes since official release, and stability has certainly improved.
he surely has some valid points,
and i'm no windows fan,
but this piece is super fluffy.
it seems like about 80% "it's terrible, it's like < analogy >, it's really bad" and 20% actually saying what was bad,
so in the end it's 80% appeal to this dude's authority.
anit trust / EU laws / enterprise / GOG/ steam /ea / adobe and others are a big and MS can't just lock people in.
I'll state it again - E.G.-> Why don't you learn how to drive a crane to work instead of your car... oh, wait - what's that?? You aren't used to it??? What's the MATTER with you, boy!!!
* You can call me an "unwilling to change" type & all that, but... I've done SO MUCH CHANGING since 1982 on computers it's not even funny.
You noted this earlier: I was used to Program Manager, but I was also used to OS/2 2.1-3.0 WorkPlace shell as well (& loved it, hence why taking to the Win9x desktop was cake for me).
This new desktop & metro stuff? No, I know it's not for me is all... many are agreeing, ala "argue with the numbers" & not just on /. (the home of 'anti-MS' & 'anti-Windows' to a large extent amongst the populace here, excluding myself... heck, I am practically the poster-child for "Windows Fan of the Year" around here & everyone knows it), but all over the place.
MS messed up imo & apparently that of many. That's ok though - they CAN afford to make a minor blunder like a desktop shell & bounce back NEXT round.
Besides - the "turn-around time" is a drag on productivity, just like making you drive a crane to work vs. your automobile (or truck) per my example above.
APK
P.S.=> The rather fundamental mistake MS made? It wasn't developing a SINGLE CODEBASE for their PC desktops, mobile phones, tablets, etc./et al - it was not offering the option on the PC desktop during installation for users to have the option to do either the classic desktop, vs. the new "metro-ized" 3 to 5 yr. old ready one (which imo @ least, makes sense for smartphones or tablets, but not on a PC desktop)... that's all!
... apk
i got to 2 minutes into the video... i have a word...
UNWATCHABLE.
I find it a little hard to take seriously. Partly because I don't recall hearing about this guy before, so no, wasn't expecting a review from him. But mostly because he refers to one of his past reviews as being for "Ubuntu 6". There is no "Ubuntu 6". There was Ubuntu 6.04 and 6.10. And if that seems too picky, maybe he just glossed over that? Then why did he mention the full version number for OS X?
Now try that on a WinRT tablet.
Also, by default, Win8 insists on using Metro apps for a lot of things. E.g. the default file associations for images and PDFs are Metro viewers for the same - and they open even if you double-click on those files from the desktop.
I think you'll find that they're going to take a very committed run at it. Everyone else is getting away with it now, so they have a bit more of a defence.
I am not at all a fan of Metro, I think it is a stupid decision to try and force their tablet sales, and it isn't going to work. I dislike the start screen, and on my personal work desktop I replace it with a start menu (Start 8 is my choice).
However it is not hard to use. It is different, and I feel a number of the things it does make for a less efficient workflow, but it is not hard. Inferior to what it replaced, but not hard.
So if you truly can't figure it out you are either:
1) Extremely technically inept. No shame there, but don't write for a technical publication.
2) A moron, in which case please try and get your learn-on and don't be.
3) Trolling/lying, in which case please stop.
I get tired of the tech troll types trying to make Windows 8 out to be worse than it is. That is stupid and it weakens your real point (which is presumably that people shouldn't use 8). If you have to lie to make your point, it leads one to question how valid that point is. If you can't make your argument based on truth, then you need to reevaluate it.
Windows 8 has a somewhat poor user interface, not a hard one. There's a difference. A command line is a hard user interface, though it can be very good for some things. Without training you will likely be able to do literally nothing with the system since there are no hints as to what to do. When one learns it, it can be very efficient, but it is hard to learn.
8 is the opposite, it is actually quite easy to use and learn, but it is somewhat inefficient compared to what it replaced. That is a bad thing and MS shoudl be scorned for it, but don't try and claim it is hard.
OK, let's see if I understand this...
99% of people on Slashdot use smart phones and tablets that inevitably use a touchscreen. Yet when a Desktop machine uses, or even suggests that a touchscreen would be useful, the same people howl like banshees.
I'd love to see some of what my Android phone UI has on my desktop system - seems like sensible thing to use touch for some things.
And another large part of the Slashdot community are Linux users who quite happily choose a Desktop UI to suit their specific needs and tastes. And do so proudly. Yet the suggestion that a Windows 8 user would choose to "turn off" the Metro UI in favour of a the Classic desktop is met yet again by howls of outrage, either that you're only using "half of Windows 8" or that making that choice somehow suggests that Microsoft is deficient.
Yes, I'm amused.
(Disclaimer: have only used Windows 8 for a few minutes in a store. Didn't find that it offended me. But then again I only use Windows anything for about 20 minutes a month.)
Three Squirrels
I always found myself pressing the power button and turning off my PC when going for the DVD drive Eject button, clearly this is a terrible design problem and the fault of someone other than me.
On my laptop, the power button is fairly close to the Esc key. But it has a decidedly different feel from Esc: it's slightly recessed, and it needs slightly more force, which helps with blind reaching. If two buttons are that close together, and the eject button feels like just like the power button, then the case does indeed have a design problem.
And when I press power on my laptop, I get a dialog box that offers the choice of log out, restart, sleep, hibernate, or shut down, and it defaults to something sane after 30 seconds. If your operating system goes straight to shutdown without an option to cancel, then the operating system has a design problem.
you'd have to be pretty defective to even think that the concept of touch typing would work on a touch screen.
That signature is aimed mostly at people who think physical buttons are obsolete, that everything traditionally done with physical buttons can be done better with gestures. But good luck typing or playing something like Mega Man or Contra on a touch screen.
Because you can move to the bottom right and do the same thing.
So why does the charms bar visually slide in from the right center no matter where the user activates it instead of sliding in from the top right corner when the user activates it at the top right corner or sliding in from the bottom right corner when the user activates it at the bottom right corner?
Or press WIN+C.
When I pull down a menu in the desktop, I get a list of reminders of the keyboard shortcuts for those menu items that have them. Why doesn't the charms bar have a "Win+C" reminder?
Then it should slide in from the right when activated through the trackpad gesture or touch screen gesture, slide in from the bottom right (and end up where it currently is) when activated with the mouse at the top right, or slide in from the bottom right (and end up where it currently is) when activated with the mouse at the bottom right.
...he can always switch to Ubuntu and Unity - oh wait...
It must have been something you assimilated. . . .
Windows 8 is now about giving each application your full attention
Which leads to doorway amnesia, as I pointed out in another comment. I don't want to give attention to an application; I want to give attention to a task that involves the use of several applications.
The Start screen is an overview of everything you have available and live tiles allow them to each give you different types of information allowing you to decide if they are worth your time or not.
So why can't I have this Start screen take up only half the screen, so that the other applications involved in this task remain at least partly visible to retain context in my brain?
The best way to describe what's been done is that windows is now more about flipping through a book
A task may require (and often does require) more than one book.
and less about putting all the pages spread out on your desk.
In other words, as the video points out, it's Microsoft Window, singular, not Microsoft Windows, plural.
Make a folder with all the shortcuts you want, name it Start. You can split it up in to subfolders if you want. Add the toolbar to your taskbar. Now you don't have to deal with that POS metro start page.
All you need to know is - who the hell decided to call this crap on the side the "Charms Bar"?
Seriously? That alone disqualifies Windows 8 from being a usable operating system.
His list of four design elements that Windows 8 CLEARLY breaks is perfectly correct. A tablet and a desktop PC are TWO TOTALLY DIFFERENT ANIMALS. Mixing the UI metaphor is just stupid.
I don't think the notion of a "recall" is likely to be a useful suggestion. However, I think a "Service Pack" that makes some of the UI screwups "optional" is likely to be in Windows 8 immediate future, despite Microsoft's insistence that there won't be any more "Service Packs".
OTOH, there are enough third party utilities out there that attempt to correct some of the more egregious UI errors that maybe Microsoft will try to "tough it out". After all, as the guy says, anyone buying a new machine is pretty much going to be force-fed Windows 8, and we all know Microsoft couldn't care less about its customers.
I do agree that Linux is undergoing the same sort of stupidity. The Ubuntu Unity interface was roundly denounced by many Linux users. I didn't like a lot of the KDE 4.x changes when I shifted from KDE 3.x to 4.x and either never used the "features" that were added and in a couple cases disabled them.
I don't have an a priori problem with trying to improve PC user interfaces. I DO have a problem with making changes that no one has asked for, simply on someone's notion that "hey, this could be COOL!" "Cool" invariably leads to CRAP.
Richard Steven Hack - This sig is TOO GODDAMN SHORT TO DO ANYTHING USEFUL WITH! MORONS!
Yes, that was the idea of Metro. The problem is that as Apple has shown, Desktops/Laptops and tablets are used in very different ways, so need a very different UI and apps.
There's literally a fucking tutorial that shows you how to access most of what you mentioned
If you have parental controls turned on, is there a version of the tutorial that doesn't involve the fucking?
I thought in a general sense, as a community, we'd moved past cheering for nerd-rage melodrama.
Windows 8 makes a few gaffes, but they're largely the same problems that Windows 7, Office 2007, and others started introducing. It can be annoying, but it's the same stuff taken to a reasonable next step, as well as UI unification between desktop, laptop, and tablet.
None of that is necessarily a fun thing, but OSX has been pushing many similar UI changes for longer. A lot of people were unhappy with Lion's increasing similarity and unification with iOS, just in case anybody actually forgot that in less than a year.
The bottom line is, 8 works in the same ways as 7, just with some added complexity. The easiest way to almost entirely remove that complexity? A start menu replacer. People recommend Start8, ViStart, and others. My personal recommendation is "Classic Shell". It works exactly the same as it used to on Vista+, except it adds the "Apps" to the start menu as well.
But even so, why wouldn't somebody be able to figure this out? The video author was squealing about how the start menu "hurt him deeply". Trackpads aren't really supposed to do "touch gestures" by default. It's vendor opt-in. Logitech opted in, and chances are, this guy didn't install whatever WIndows 8 drivers or control panel may or may not be available. Either way, it's a vendor issue. Just like 'no install/repair/recovery/etc' disk is a vendor issue. If you don't want vendor issues, you don't buy things from those vendors.
All of the UIs Windows (95-W8), OSX, KDE, iOS, Android, etc are different. What everything has in common is that there are roughly 6 different things you have to know about each, then consistency covers all of the multi-step operations, or using various applications. Occasionally you get something that breaks out of that a bit (Office 2007+). There are so many "advanced" things, like command line digging, reinstalling from scratch, that the overwhelming majority of people will simply ask a friend for help with or pay a PC repair company. That's pretty much regardless of operating system.
But I digress. The rant is pretty simply over the top drama. It should sell itself as entertainment (if it at least had any humor), not as something relevant to 'tech news'. It's not politically correct to mention, but this guy sounds and acts like the stereotypical nerd, going into a panicky, narcissistic rage about primarily one change that, overall, isn't that significant to day to day use, AND for which there exist free, open source, and easy to use workarounds, while still obtaining benefits of a newer OS.
He himself admits he only tried it for 30 minutes, in a coffee shop, and didn't bother one iota further.
Personally, I've been using it for 4 months (and preview versions before that) with NO issues that would meaningfully impact your average, or above-average user. All of my personal complaints are exceedingly specific and technical, and have mostly been taken care of by various updates.
And, in the interest of disclosure, I'm not the kind of person who likes Windows, or most other OSes, in a general sense.
I prod and patch kernels, have no problems custom-rolling EFI stub-only boot on Linux, etc. What I really miss, is being able to run highly customized FreeBSD and still use ~90% of my Windows games at full speed. That's mostly a hardware/driver/wine(!) issue, though.
So when I say I'm using Windows 8 in the exact same manner as I use Windows 7, I'm not exaggerating. I actually like the availability of some of the W8 new features. I middle click on the start button (or use Shift+Windows) if I want to see live tiles like the weather...just like on OSX, you use F12 to get the Dashboard to pop up a full screen of 'one glance' kinda information. Even before using Classic Start, the only quirk I took issue with, on the 'start screen', is that when typing for programs, it wouldn't search for stuff like control panels "by default". You'd have to move the mouse over to select "settings". Mos
"A Goddess rarely smiles for she is forced by others to be an island unto herself." - Zephiris
Sooner or later I am going to walk in somewhere and have to use Windows 8 to get something done. Sooner rather than later. Currently, there is no major OS that I could not be modestly productive on in a few minutes. However, the video rant gave me pause with respect to this new iteration of Windows. Also the video was actually instructive in a backassward sort of way. Note to self: Careful with the touchpad. Or disable the swipe feature. Use Windows key to see applications Etc...
So now I am going to take advantage of the price-of-a good-dinner introductory cost and put Windows 8 on an old Vista laptop I have in order to do a solid familiarization. Perhaps I will be pleasantly surprised. And ... Forewarned is forearmed. I might even RTFM. A little.
This appears to be a matter of self preservation because in my experience there seems to be some stuff that has a learning curve for dweeb types, but not for three-year olds. I remember the terrible experience I had with iTunes the first time I used this "easy-to-use" application. (And a lot of people do find it easy to use.) At the time (about four years ago) I had had an MP3 player of one sort or another (not Apple) since 1999 (Creative Nomad was my first). Someone gave me an iPod Shuffle she wasn't using. So, and for the very first time, I downloaded Apple's music utility onto my PC and attempted to use it to put mp3 files on the Shuffle in the straightforward way I was used to. All my other players worked like flash drives if I wanted. It took me far too many frustrating minutes (and a dash to the dreaded help files) to realize that Apple's resource was padding my experience and preventing me from using the equipment in the manner I wanted and which made sense. Nanny Apple: "First we make a playlist... etc". Sometimes resources are so dumbed down and bullet proofed that people who have a feeling for how computers work get limited, confounded and frustrated. Seems like this poor guy repeated my brief iTunes nightmare with Windows 8 -- on steroids. And since I have had similar experiences with easy-to-use stuff I better get familiar with 8 since it might not be a cake walk should I walk into it cold.
So, as I said, A reverse effect. Now, instead of being put off by the negative review, I heave a heavy sigh and download this thing. This because sooner or later I'll have to deal with Windows 8. Good, bad or indifferent. Feh!
"No fear. No envy. No meanness." Liam Clancy
Windows 8 isn't bad... it's new. Just like Windows 95 was... and we all know how Windows 95 through windows 7 failed so miserably. (Can anyone remember the term "Ludite"?)
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=edit+hosts+file+windows+8&l=1
For one, editing your hosts file is unchanged from the previous version (you were a lying idiot over-simplifying to the point of incorrectness). For another, the security feature restoring it to default can be disabled, so your oversimplification was still incorrect, even if we forgive the simple factual errors in it.
Learn to love Alaska
Who cares how many Unix geeks like Windows 8?
Windows 8 has one purpose in life, to come before Windows 9. Something new had to be done (to remain competitive in a phone/tablet market). Windows 8 is just a try it and see tool for that market. It does fine. Anyone who can use a computer, 3 years old and up, can use windows 8 just fine, and may bitch some about it - big deal. Bitching is how things get changed for the next release.
Isn't it here on Slashdot where we are reminded constantly about how Microsoft misses every other release? And your friggin memories are that short?
I'm sure you all want to hear my thoughts on how bad KDE and OSX are, don't you? I didn't think so.
slashdot troll = you make a compelling argument I do not like the implications of.
23 minutes is too long for a rant about windows 8.
>Adding support for the "modern UI" might have something to do with
Ah, desperation. It is a terrible perfume.
What I don't get is how some pieces of metro can feel so unpolished when they've had years and two other touch/tablet OS's to copy from?
Just wanted to come back and point out, that if you read the previous articles this author did for HardOCP, he slagged on Windows Vista for pretty much the same concerns, and also said "Yes, it is possible to enjoy both Windows and Linux - but unfortunately this product is unfit for any user."
There's an EDITOR'S NOTE attached that says: "The fact is that Vista is far from "unfit for any user," and this statement by the author is simply incorrect."
Coincidentally, it was his last article on the subject for HardOCP. I wonder why...
"A Goddess rarely smiles for she is forced by others to be an island unto herself." - Zephiris
It's big on platitudes, but fails to actually deliver on substantive problems. Like the "goblins farting in your face" thing. I'm sorry, but the weather application does *not* suddenly pop up over things when you are typing. That must have been some kind of stuck key or something. Otherwise, can someone please provide the actual repro steps, because that sounds like a plain old bug. Again, I've *never* seen a metro nor desktop app decide to just suddenly pop up. It feels more like this author made that sh*t up completely.
He confuses his own terms "Control" and "Conveyance". He complains he can't navigate away from Weather as an issue of Control. Bullshit. Upper left corner. Lower left corner. Windows key. Alt tab. Drag from top to bottom. There are tons of ways to navigate. Issue with "Conveyance"? Maybe. Not one of Control. Now that I know how to navigate Win8, I've never had any issues.
I *have* had issues with discoverability. Win8 is definitely bad in this regard. They botched the tutorial : "swipe in from the left" -> nothing happens because the tutorial is shown during OS bootup - ????? yes, that's idiotic. But once I learned the ropes, actual navigation is *easy* (not easier, but definitely not hard).
I really couldn't get through this video. Despite what he says, if he couldn't figure the OS out, yet I could, then he *is* dumb. The OS isn't unusable. It's poorly understood, Microsoft's user education is a total fail, and Microsoft missed so many opportunities to make the UI way, way better. Once you actually get it, it's not bad. I wouldn't pay $99 for it, but it's not preventing me from getting work done.
I figured that I would buy a copy and load it on an unused computer I have sitting around. You know what, they only sell an OEM version with no support or upgrade. There was no clear info on the various packages to be found. In general they even succeeded in breaking their own web site and curtailing sales that way. Well did you ever finally get a copy you ask? NO!!! I got so pissed at the site and the ridiculous complication of trying to find what I was looking for that I gave up. I will stick with Vista and 7 for now and later migrate to some flavor of Linux. Microsoft is a ship without a rudder, no prop, and hell the engine is even seized as well. Nice job Microsoft, I didn't even have to buy a copy of your OS to be dissuaded. Mike
Maybe it is you that is terribly broken.
Seemed like a good time to Harvest a Stock Loss.
I'll buy them back at $0.01 on the dollar when Window(s) 9 with New Improved Multiple Windows comes out.
I read how all the Win8 promoters say "it's not that bad once you install this, and this, and this, and this, and this, and this, and you ignore that, and once you've spent all this time to make Win8 usable, it's just like Win7!"... er.... So the point of Win8 is for people like you to make their regular donation to Microsoft as a thank you for making you fuck with their new operating system until it looks like their old one?
At least with Ubuntu, if I hate Unity (I don't, I like how it put the menus in the top bar, and liberates more screen estate for my windows, and I keep the "task side bar" hidden) I can just not use it. And if I hate the next version (12.10 - I really hate the vanishing of the 2D session and the forcing of 3D trinkets that only make my computer as fast as a 386 because of the "pretty seethrough windows") you just either stay on the LTS or go with the competition - which provides the same thing with a more palatable GUI - say... Linux Mint or the XFCE desktop of Ubuntu. And I don't pay any taxes to Canonical either.
The Xbox UI is, to be frank, shit. Nintendo's isn't great but Xbox is light years behind that. Microsoft's UI gets in the way of what you want to do and if you want to buy a game via code, God help you. Let's not even talk of the intrusive updates and requirements to pay their subscription to use applications which are free on other platforms.
8 get's rid of the menu and folders / groups for starting apps with out 3rd party add ons
No it hasn't. This structure is maintained and displayed in the all apps menu (win+Q). You can pin this folder to your toolbar too.... pin %USER PROFILE%\Start Menu as a toolbar and you have a mini start menu replacement... no third party apps required.
Oh, here's a really good one in Windows 8 with the PDF view.
Open a file with the default windows 8 reader. Ok, winkey out or go to something else like most people will by default.
Open up firefox and attach the pdf to an web based email (yahoo in this case). Uhh? what?
It doesn't work??? (a normal person would be putting a tech call, or doing some serious google-fu about now).
Oh, you have to figure out how to close that damn reader first.
I have not used Windows 8. I have only used Win7 on a friend's laptop a few times, because that is what it came installed with. I came to the conclusion long ago that I do not like the way M$ does business nor the way they treat their customers. Therefore I use their products as little as possible. If it were not for a few programs (mostly games) that I really like, I would not use it at all.
Even if I were an M$ fan, I would not like way that they try to lock customers into their products and frequent upgrade cycle (both hardware and software). BTW I do not like the way (Cr)apple does business, nor do I like their vastly overpriced inferior hardware. Nor do I like their walled garden aproach to software.
All that said, I use the OS, software and hardware that suits me. I also allow others to do the same without comment unless they ask my advice. If someone asks my opinion, I will give it honestly, which is why I tell them I have not tried Win8, so I have no opinion about it.
So use what YOU like, and allow others to do the same. Post you honest opinion about things you like or don't like. But the insults and flame wars are just silly to me.
One wonders how this user can rate a very Vista-like OS that he can't even operate.
Believe it or not APK, you don't have to use Microsoft software, there is no law saying you must use Microsoft software in the USA.
You're just not the target audience. :)
Change is certain; progress is not obligatory.
If only there was some sort of magic information warehouse that someone could access from a variety of electronic devices in order to access basic documents that could explain in simple terms how to use Windows 8 or anything else for that matter. We could call it, I dunno, the internet
And in the video, the reviewer ended up searching the Web for how to solve each of the annoyances. But the reviewer had to pull out a second computer running a more familiar operating system to have a chance to do this without accidentally running into one of the annoyances. So Windows 8 is fine as long as you already have a second computer on which to search the Web.
Windows 8 has it's problems, such as most of the built in apps being good, but lacking expected features(Being able to sinc up with gmail and the calander but not the contacts list). I don't care much for the metro interface, but the speed increase of Windows 7 has me sold. If I need to press escape to get to the desktop, it effects me less than the speed decrease of going back to windows 7. And heck, for the current upgrade price of 40 bucks, it is worth it. I figure that with the next release these bugs will be fixed, but the speed..... THE SPEED!
And we still had the program manager in XP as a fully usable option. Hmmm...maybe I should see if it can run in 8.
I'm starting to think GNU is the problem with "GNU/Linux" these days.
Is this an actual problem you've experienced or just something you're supposing could be the case?
I have in fact experienced this on another platform. The launcher on both iOS and Android is a full-screen application, and the effect when bringing it up resembles that of clicking "Show Desktop" (Win+D) on a machine running Windows XP or Windows 7. Android has a list of Recent Apps (dedicated on-screen control under Android 4.x, or long-press Home on a 2.x device) that just dims the frontmost application instead of completely hiding it, but if the application I want to use isn't in the list, I have to lose all on-screen context, drop to the launcher, and navigate to the application. And I've often lost my train of thought while switching to another application, at least more often than I would have under Windows or Xubuntu where the launcher takes half the screen if that.
Install machine:
Fujitsu Lifebook P1620 (tablet.. not multi-touch, etc)
2gb RAM
64GB SSD
1.2ghz C2D
Okay, I got this machine for like $75 off of ebay awhile back. Upgraded the RAM with a 3rd party module off of ebay, tested and works fine. I was going to install linux, but I already have a linux laptop in the form of a Sony Vaio TR3A (Pentium M 900, 1gb RAM (same 3rd party vendor), and a 32gb CF Flash card as a cheap SSD test). Besides, from the research I gathered online, the tablet functions are pretty spotty and I hate having functional hardware that's not supported. Besides, I can always install something else later. Anyway, replaced the HD with the SSD the other night and installed Win8 on it.
Thoughts so far: Okay, it's an old machine, no multi-touch. No finger recognition, but I can use my nails or the stylus and it's generally okay. Definitely not as smooth as my android phone, but this is hardware, not Win8 (it was fine on the tablets I played with the other day). I installed Visual Studio 2012 (I work primarily in the .NET world at work), and ghci and clisp, and just added IntelliJ to the mix earlier today. So far, haven't done anything intensive, but it's not been so bad.
Things I don't like:
Where the fuck do I shut the goddamned machine down? Or do I have to "sign out" everytime I want to use the shut down feature? This is beyond annoying. The spash screen that I have to move to get to a login is an unnecessary step. I think I'll have to dig through the user settings and see if there's a single user mode.
Moving tiles around on the screen is hit-or-miss, at least with my 2005-era hardware. I don't mind moving my tiles around, and using that to launch on the desktop, as that feels like an extra step.
Things I like:
As a tablet, and even with crippled touchscreen hardware, I actually like this a lot. I can lay in bed and read or browse books in tablet form, typing with my stylus on the soft-keyboard. A modern tablet touchscreen would make this much smoother, so can't fault Win8 here.
So.. as a serious dev system? since I use the keyboard, a lot of the touch interface seems to be a bit clunky and clumsy. When I'm deving, I don't want to fight metro, i just want a desktop.
As a tablet, web browsing machine: Lots of potential, and wouldn't hate it on a phone, for example.
I'll give it a few more weeks and see how I like it then, at which point I might wipe it and install fedora or mint on it.
If you were me, you'd be good lookin'. - six string samurai
i install start8 on every windows 8 computer i service. other than that, customers seem very happy with the increased speed.
Interesting. I wonder who's in the wrong here - it could be that the reader opens file with inappropriate sharing mode (i.e. anything more than 'read'), or whether it is Firefox that does the same (also shouldn't need anything more than 'read').
They seem to hire some of the brightest engineers, but the dullest, untalented program managers, designers, and strategists.
He explained exactly what was wrong, and why.
He used the basic principals of GUI design and explained why Windows 8 is a total failure.
Great job. No wonder the MS shills are going crazy.
Multiple versions of windows came with the single click to launch option (default in one of them I think).
If single-click means launch, then what click means select? You already said you don't want to add a right-click to select an item and bring up a menu of actions.
and even over Mac OS X is the it's ability to finally connect to our wireless network without an extra client or configuration profiles.
We use EAP method TTLS and PAP for Phase 2 authentication. In prior versions of Windows, you'd need something like the SecureW2 client to connect (and in OS X you'd need to download and configure a profile). In Windows 8, you literally just click the wireless network, enter your user credentials, and you're on and running. Much easier for the end users
All I saw was a 20 minute Patton Oswalt impression.
You never expect irony, do you?
Want to be a professional wrestler? Visit www.iyfwrestling.com
@iyfwrestling
also funny AND insightful.
For more years than I can remember I've been A Windows User, pretty much since Microsoft HAD Windows.
Don't blame me, I worked for Companies and Companies used Windows Desktop Computers.
But suffice to say that Using Windows had become an ingrained habit.
The one day I found myself the excited owner of a MacPRO desktop Personal Computer.
Despite the many and various differences, I found almost everything intuitive, almost everything was pretty obvious, and the not immediately obvious things were not hard to find.
Since then I've become a very happy MacOS user.
Any new OS I have the opportunity to explore now has an extremely high standard to live up to, because quite frankly if it's even slightly more difficult to 'learn' than my experience migrating to MacOS was I'm going to give up in frustration.
IMMEDIATELY.
Yes I have become a SPOILED CHILD as a result, but let me be very clear about this I'M A VERY HAPPY SPOILED CHILD - you WILL NOT gain my business by FRUSTRATING THE LIFE OUT OF ME.
I DO NOT and NEVER WILL care that your shiny-new is "better" or "faster" (unless it's measurably orders of magnitude faster), if it is NOT significantly "easier" you have an extremely hard sell in front of you.
Visit CryptoGnome in his home.
This guy is an idiot. It is not hard to understand the UI nor is it that vastly different that you do not know what you are doing. This is only a guy upset that it is not Win 7. I have beta tested it for about a year and have had no problems with the OS or any programs, drivers or security...
Also, knowing a few shortcuts will save you a lot of pain:
For completeness, a a few bad things about Windows 8:
I find Windows 8 to be usable. Not great, but at least usable.
Great post - all the people I lknow who like it - have loaded new UI's
Its neat you can do that. Its appalling you have to !!!
Or you could just use the taskbar to switch between open apps.
I understand the frustration. First time I used it I had no idea what to do. I could not find the control panel, I did not know about the charm bar or how to access the metroUI until I hit the Windows Key, afterwards did not know how to close the metro apps, did not know how to shut down the pc. It took some time and got used to it, but yeah, the new OS GUI interaction is not as obvious as with the previous versions. Once in a while MetroUI freezes which I can easily rid off by simply hitting the windows key. And I just don't see any performance boost over windows 7. Maybe they should had released this as a service pack without the metroUI and release the metroUI for windows 7 as an option for those who want to use touchscreen or just web apps on the desktop.
I enjoy Windows 8 much better than any previous iteration. It is very intuitive and very polished. Prior to this release I have been Slackware guy, since 1999, but this one changed my mind. Instead of doing a windows VM-ware, I am doing slack on VM and using windows as my primary machine. The new version of powershell is equally amazing and quickly replacing perl for all of my system level scripting needs.
Why is this on Slashdot? I got more frustrated listening to this person who is either a moron or faking his problems, than he pretended to get using Windows.
But now there is video proof of this guy's inability at using something so simple even first times have no problem. Good luck getting another job there dude.
I know that. I've used Linux before as an example (all of summer 2010, & KUbuntu 10.04 was PRETTY GOOD), & many times before that (Slackware 1.02 circa 1994 iirc, sucked bad, & RedHat 6.0 circa 1999 iirc, sucked but not as bad). Linux has GROWN more, but it had the room to grow, copying things from Commercial *NIX & NT-based OS @ the time to become an "enterprise/mission-critical class" NOS. I used OS/2 long in that timeframe too (1992-1995 iirc) & loved it, IBM 'nuked it' though... too bad - it truly ROCKED & ran fast on a 486 Dx/4 133mhz 32mb Fast Page 30ns RAM rig even in those days. Solid as iron too.
I just think that MS could have put more time into fixing security bugs (and trust me most folks aren't privy to how many there REALLY are still, thank goodness, or the hacker-cracker types would be too... at least they patch the ones that become WIDELY known, fairly fast), and, also optimizing it more for speed (they used "mere tricks" in Win8, that 'tweakers/tuners' have been doing like myself, for ages well into the early to mid 90's even that still apply, like services cut offs (this really does work well as 1 example thereof for more RAM, cpu cycles, & less I/O output for no real reason many folks don't really need)).
Problem is: Once a business is PUBLICLY HELD/TRADED? It's NOT always about "better superior product" being built... it's about making "the holy dollar" for stockholders.
APK
P.S.=> Anyhow, I've said here MANY TIMES, I won't touch it unless forced to on the job... why?? Suspicion: Mr. Ballmer KNOWS he's in a big jam and that the board of directors can "oust" him IF this doesn't pan out for the stockholders... hence, why Outlook 2013 doesn't support Office 97-2003 files. A lot of folks STILL USE THOSE, & MS knows it... nobody better than Mr. Ballmer. How to make MS make more money, & drive up the profits he LIVES for (that's his BIG thing he raves on as far as his performance there), by forcing folks to buy into the DUMB "ribbon" driven Office 2007-2013 coming up... It's "ALL ABOUT THE BENJAMINS", and any fool with 1/2 a brain can see it & the ploys being used to do so. Look @ some of the other replies under the parent poster here. There's some GOOD SOLID REASONING, perhaps better than my own, in other replies VERY ALONG THESE VERY LINES - thus, I am NOT the only person seeing what's what & going on & realizing "the game @ hand"...
... apk
I watched a good portion of the video, but could not reproduce any of this guy's complaints. I haven't modified the way the touchpad is setup on my laptop with a fresh windows 8 install, but there is no weather app popping up every 1.5 minutes due to moving the cursor (or swiping).
So I gave up watching, decided that life's too short to waste on this silliness (especially since we have 12 hours and 2 minutes till the end of the world).
He was "trolling me" man (everyone here knows I am a hosts file user, ala -> http://start64.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=5851:apk-hosts-file-engine-64bit-version&catid=26:64bit-security-software&Itemid=74 )
Plus - I've "dusted" a lot of my "naysayers" here on that very subject, vs. other "competing" solutions on a technical basis before...
Thus, I feel it's MORE than "fairly safe to assume" that Mr. Troll there's doubtless one of those "dusted naysayers" of mine in regards to custom hosts files usage & yes, replying as AC so I can't "toss it back into his face" on exactly how, when, & where + why I could & did do so in dusting him...
Yes - lots of "geek angst" around here in that regard, lol!
* Now, looking at his statement as YOU interpreted it? All you need to do is realize that creating an "exception" in Windows Defender on Windows 8 solves the hosts file issue on it... easy as apple pie!
APK
P.S.=> And, there you go...
... apk
I was able to check out 8 a year and a half ago in a class at my local college. Not much has changed since that initial offering. I was disappointed by the Metro overlay on non-haptic monitors. The new OS basically has Metro stapled over the top of 7 and it is not an ideal productivity rig; especially without haptic support. I've seen estimates thrown around lately that suggest less than 2% of the bare metal 8 is installed on is capable of haptic interfacing. Big mistake M$.
TL;DR; of the video: He spent less than 30 minutes using the OS (apparently). He couldn't find his way around. Gave up.
This video is horribly flawed. While there are things to complain about in Win8, he not only misrepresents several things (ie. he ignores the fact that the desktop is still fully functional), but he start conflating ignorance about the interface with the lack of features in the interface. Sure, it's good to have hints about what to do, and MS failed that one, but they do at least have the ability to perform all the old functions. Tucking them away is not a great idea, but it's is not removing them entirely. I'm also having a hard time reproducing his trackpad problem. I get where he's coming from, but it somehow is not making my (or anyone else who I know) computer "unusable". Lastly, his "icon" comparison - why would he have icons somewhat familiar common apps on OSX compared to obscure icons on Win8, and especially not using the video medium to show that the Win8 icons are animated... So much fail in this video.
In Soviet Russia computer adapt you for use.
I feel for you bro. I, too, wanted to seriously give Windows 8 a try, but I've found that it seriously disrupts my Norton Commander workflows.
Our support group meets every Thursday on 7 pm. That's right after Asperger's, so you can conveniently attend both.
My exception safety is -fno-exceptions.
Albeit, "beneath the covers", ala this tiny partial list only from me next:
HEAP Protection via "Guard Pages", as well as "Chunk Randomization" -> http://news.softpedia.com/news/Chris-Valasek-The-Windows-8-Heap-Manager-Is-the-Most-Secure-to-Date-282466.shtml
Plus lastly for performance' sake?
* "Self-Terminating Services"...
(However, this last one can be compensated for by doing it yourself manually if/when you don't need them in former builds of Windows NT-based OS').
APK
P.S.=> Before you guys "mod me down" as troll, OR call me "MS SHILL"? Realize, I too, have "bitches" about the new "metro" interface & Windows 8, ala -> http://tech.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3330901&cid=42354181 & thanks - I don't LIKE it anymore than many others do...
... apk
The guys just don't say anything precise, he just say it's bad with no reason. He press hotkeys and compare it to a goblin jumping in your face? Plus, he stolen a lot of art from Yatzee.
> Why not learn from a 3 year old how to use Windows 8?
>
> Or from a five year old?
As the video stated, tablets are targeted at *CONTENT CONSUMPTION*. You can use them to...
* read ebooks or reports
* view images
* view Youtube videos
* play "Angry Birds", etc, etc.
And so can a 3-year-old.
But what about *CONTENT CREATION*? Try...
* *WRITING* a 5 page report, let alone a 500-page novel, on a tablet
* *EDITING* images (Photoshop, Gimp, MS Paint, etc) on a tablet
* *EDITING* videos, beyond merely changing the simplest settings
* *WRITING* computer games, or any other type of program
Windows 8, being so tablet-oriented, is a bleeping *TOY*. Yes, a 3-year can use it, but they can't do serious work with it. And neither can an adult.
I'm not repeating myself
I'm an X window user; I'm an ex-Windows user
Press the windows key to get to the metro screen. Start typing "desktop" .... a search textfield comes up. Press enter. Viola, desktop screen appears.
I've seen trolls on Youtube who display more professionalism. I get it - you don't like the OS. I don't expect you to say otherwise. That is your right as a reviewer. But using analogies like Goblin farts, raping dogs? (I closed the video at this point - I realized this wasn't a reviewer so much as a rant)
And I'm not sure whether he was using a tablet or a computer with a keyboard (as suggested by the animation). If one app pops up and it is full screen and you can't figure out how to close it - how about Alt+Tab? How about Win+Tab (which has been there since Vista)? Hell, how about Alt+F4 to close apps? Should the user know these shortcuts? Of course not. But he seems to be using it like a tablet (everything full screen) while wanting a desktop experience, but refusing to touch the keyboard. He doesn't get that he can press the home button (start) - like every other phone or tablet (I don't know how to close apps on any other mobile device either - without task killing)
It seems like this guy has never used Windows before and looks at the tablet UI and decides that he doesn't want to use the keyboard or mouse. Sure, there could be indicators that tell him where the start is and charms bar is (I won't defend all the poor UI choices). But if he claims he wanted to use it for 30 days, maybe he could put an hour effort in learning how to use the OS?
It was like the first time I moved from Windows to Linux (I use both on a daily basis - I love Linux for remote command line via SSH, but as a desktop I prefer Windows). If I wrote a rant about how Windows shortcuts failed in Linux and dropped it after half an hour, I'd get flamed and fully deserve it. Every OS has a different system. There are only two major additional shortcuts in Windows 8 that I use - Win+I, and Win+C. Everything else is almost like Windows 7 - whether it is a change for better/worse is a personal opinion.
But if you want to be a profession reviewer, take some damn pride in the job and put some minimal effort into what you are doing. Here is a hint: If you want to write a complete review, learn some tricks that can help you navigate the OS and share it - then it might even be helpful to a broader audience. The OS is something people interact with (via applications) for years. So if you take one hour to learn a few tricks that saves you a lot of time, it is worth it for a normal user and that would be a good review. If you want to claim (after learning a few simple shortcuts) that it is still not worth it - go ahead. I'll listen. But to say - I started it and it didn't immediately do everything just the way I want - that isn't a review. That is whining.
Just because people have found ways to make Win8 more usable, or more like Win7, doesn't mean they are "promoters". They have spent the time to figure things out and are making suggestions. The common rhetoric that win8 detractors use is to call those who have learned to use it "promoters".
At first, I hated Windows 8 because of the "fuck desktops, you're gonna use a tablet!" interface. Now I hate it for a much bigger reason.
Metro Apps, which Microsoft refers to as "modern" and intends to replace desktop apps, are only available through Microsoft's walled Windows Store. This could put an end to, and Microsoft intends it to put an end to, both free and Free software. It's an anti-consumer powergrab.
He brings up a lot of good points. To be fair, there are a lot of UI changes in the new OS, and many are not "Conveyed" well (to use his language). However, I feel like he really didn't give the OS a chance. He openly admits he didn't figure out how to do certain things. He says he doesn't know how to close apps in the Metro UI. He says he couldn't figure out how to easily open up Control Panel. Um, hit start, start typing "control panel" and it pops right up.
Come on. It's different, but it's not impossible to use, not by a long stretch.
Disagreeing with me does not mean you get to mod me troll.
Need to learn a new OS? Time to switch to Linux or OSX.
I haven't used it yet. I'm quite leery of it. I really didn't like the idea of ribbon's in office and still have annoyances even after years of working with them.
But one adapts to these things, even if they are a step backwards, and in some cases they are a step forward.
The video, even if you take into account irrational bias or whatever, still has some pretty damning comments.
However, the biggest put off for me is... well... just look at it. Its just plain fugly. As OSes go, its the equivalent of the ugly girl in your class at school. Yes, you remember the one. The one who nobody would ever date, except as part of some nasty dare, which would inevitably leave the poor girl even more depressed. This is Metro... hell, even CDE or windowmaker could look nicer than this. And... can i have a desktop background please? Something that identifies my desktop, personalizes it, shows it as being mine?
Now, plenty of people have mentioned installing a classic shell program. That's cool. I love things that allow you to customize your desktop, but that is flying in the face of where MS want to go, and as Windows RT, Windows 9, etc are developed further, i imagine this is going to become harder and harder to do.
For all its faults,Linux is awesome because i can chose the desktop interface of my choice, and customize like crazy. This is what we are losing with Metro and the planned direction for Windows.
Fuck off, you cock.
Like it or not, Windows 8 is here and it shall be staying. Don't get me wrong, there is a lot to dislike about the OS and keeping a steady stream of criticism (at least mildly constructive) is a good thing, in the hopes that Service Packs and forthcoming versions of Windows will improve it. However, just saying "OMG it sucks, its horrible, its unintuitive etc..." isn't going to change the fact that it is currently the latest version of Windows, the vast majority of new PCs not sold exclusively for business use are going to come with it thus leading to a growing installed base, which all means that developers of Windows software/drivers/etc.. are going to start targeting the "new, up to date" Windows. Criticism is important and the suggestion to move to another OS (preferably Linux) is good advice, but regardless there are still going to be a lot of people using Windows and increasingly its going to be Windows 8 in front of them.
Thus, I suggest that the power user, developer, and enthusiast community who will have direct or even tangential exposure (ie. All your relatives are going to be looking to you for tech support on their new Win8 PCs purchased during the holiday) should start educating themselves and others on privacy, safety, usability and other configurations, tips and tricks for Windows 8. Providing tutorials for accessing the different features of the UI, Metro features such as the Start Screen's live tiles, how to find certain functions is a great start. Instruction on Secure Boot and UEFI/BIOS features is important for users that wish to install another OS Suggesting additional programs like Start8 or ClassicShell to provide additional functionality or is another benefit. One of the most important issues I feel is that of privacy and security. Win8 has a lot of potential vectors for private information to be shared and it behooves those with the knowledge to show how to configure to protect one's privacy and any trade-offs that may require. For instance, should users turn off SmartScreen within Win8 itself? Create an "old fashioned/offline" user account instead of one linked to their MicrosoftLIVE account? What Live Tiles are safe to use and which send information to unknown 3rd parties or make it available for data mining? Likewise, the Windows Store etc..
Some will, quite rightly, say that it shouldn't require this sort of analysis and decision making to an OS without being the victim of privacy, security, or just an obtuse UI, but the fact of the matter is this is what we're given to work with in terms of the latest Windows OS. Much like how "Make sure you install Service Packs/updates, Install and use Firefox instead of IE for general use, Install MSE/another antivirus etc..." has always been part of the tenets of preparing and using previous Windows versions in private, secure, easily accessible manners, we're going to need to add some additional steps for Windows 8. Figuring out a relatively simple set of steps meant to help users of Win8 ensure that the OS is efficiently serving their needs is paramount for dealing with it as a part of the market.
While we provide constructive criticism and offer alternatives such as switching to Linux, we have to deal with having the Windows ecosystem revolve around Windows 8 until (hopefully) an improved, newer variant comes along. Just saying how horrible it is, in and of itself, isn't constructive.
That's why he's so frustrated, he's missed a big issue. As a fellow computer-literate-expert-for-decades-with-grandparents I know the dream of making computer use easier for grandparents. And I also know that things like creating an installation disc are important and vital things that need to be done on every computer.
Here's what he missed. Windows 8 does one big thing really really fundamentally. It wasn't required, and it could have been subtle, but it's not. It's done as a fundamental core element. Windows 8 divides users into two classes -- user and support. Cheerleader and IT geek.
For any given task, simply ask: "is this a task for a cheerleader or for an IT guy?" Then it all makes sense. Creating an installation disc? IT guy. Identifying apps by iconic representation? IT guy. Identifying apps by their content? Cheerleader. Knowing how to get to a particular setting? IT guy. Knowing how to close an app? Guess what, you need never close them. Real people don't leave rooms, they enter other rooms.
This particular it geek is frustrated by the configuration of his logitech/acer touchpad. As though that can't be adjusted. He's upset that he didn't know the command to create an instal disc. As though decades of regedit didn't prepare him for under-the-hood maintenance.
Windows 8 does a fantastic job of letting dumb users -- e.g. my grandparents -- figure things out in a way that doesn't get them into trouble. And it does a fantastic job of letting expert IT admins access areas that are effectively hidden from the dumb user. Just like my car has a "check engine" light, and my mechanic knows what it means with a simple tool. I don't.
Icons have been fun. And the whole concept of icons was to replace a wealth of information with a small object for space-conservation. Tiles are super-nice for anyone who already knows what their own tiles mean. Sure it's not obvious to someone looking for the first time. But why am I using my own computer for the first time? It's mine, I'm using it thirty times a day. Ramp up the learning curve, and let me benefit from it being mine.
But hey, like every time, I've got the patience. In six months there'll be a teeny tiny service pack that adjusts three defaults, and this same guy will swing the other way saying that it's the best thing in the world and credit the service pack for having changed a few defaults.
My advice to the frustrated computer expert? Read the manual. Don't go in blind and expert to know how to generate an install disc. The default configuration is for the dumb user -- which makes sense because expert users can change defaults, whereas dumb users can't. It's that simple.
The only reason to upgrade to 8 (except if you need to make Metro Apps) is if you don't have Windows 7 and you want to get a similar OS for 30 euros (until Jan 31). The interesting part is, they didn't even verify if I had a legal version of Windows XP when I upgraded. In the email, they didn't even say that I bought the upgrade. They said "here's the Windows 8 Pro product key, enjoy."
Microsoft needs to destroy Android or they will lose their monopoly pricing power,
They don't have anything like "monopoly pricing power" in the markets where Android is relevant, i.e. on mobile devices not intended for serious work.
If the users see desktop first there's no reason for Metro apps to be developed, and with no applications, no reason to by WinPho.
It may come as a shock to you, but there are already users of Metro UI on tablets and phones where it works rather well, regardless of how Windows 8 feels to all kinds of change-averse people. You may hate Microsoft as you like, just don't try to pass this for market analysis. Or why the heck not, this is Slashdot.
My exception safety is -fno-exceptions.
Are they still in business?
right.. then you have tons of annoying context switching between metro and the desktop whenever you want to start any new programs.. just give me a damn little menu already.. all this flickering flashing gesturing bs is counterproductive.
Seriously. I always thought the press was unfair on IBM for the whole OS/2 debacle. OS/2 actually worked good, till MS decided to kill it with good anti-marketing. IBM helped kill it themselves with their ad campaign stating that OS/2 "obliterated" your software. Oh, I guess the karma thing is coming back on Microsoft now. Instead of Charlie Chaplin friendly ads, there are ones showing me how stupid I am because a 3 year old can do Windows 8. Really? I think MS obliterated my software. Seriously.
Oh, yeah! Wise guy, huh? Woob woob woob woob! Nyuk! Nyuk!
Like it or not, Windows 8 is here and it shall be staying. Don't get me wrong, there is a lot to dislike about the OS and keeping a steady stream of criticism (at least mildly constructive) is a good thing, in the hopes that Service Packs and forthcoming versions of Windows will improve it. However, just saying "OMG it sucks, its horrible, its unintuitive etc..." isn't going to change the fact that it is currently the latest version of Windows
I don't mean to sound rude but aint that like saying yellow is still yellow even if you happen to think yellow is a shit color? What information is being conveyed with such statements?
Thus, I suggest that the power user, developer, and enthusiast community who will have direct or even tangential exposure (ie. All your relatives are going to be looking to you for tech support on their new Win8 PCs purchased during the holiday) should start educating themselves and others on privacy, safety, usability and other configurations, tips and tricks for Windows 8.
When people ask me what I think of windows 8 I recommend against upgrading.
When people who have windows 8 express displeasure I tell them how to contact the vendor of their new PC to obtain a "downgrade" to Windows 7.
The few people who care about what I think are now happy campers.
Win8 has a lot of potential vectors for private information to be shared and it behooves those with the knowledge to show how to configure to protect one's privacy and any trade-offs that may require. For instance, should users turn off SmartScreen within Win8 itself? Create an "old fashioned/offline" user account instead of one linked to their MicrosoftLIVE account? What Live Tiles are safe to use and which send information to unknown 3rd parties or make it available for data mining? Likewise, the Windows Store etc..
Or you could just install windows 7.
What Live Tiles are safe to use and which send information to unknown 3rd parties or make it available for data mining? Likewise, the Windows Store etc..
Trick question.
Some will, quite rightly, say that it shouldn't require this sort of analysis and decision making to an OS without being the victim of privacy, security, or just an obtuse UI, but the fact of the matter is this is what we're given to work with in terms of the latest Windows OS.
The fact of the matter is Microsoft is a business and its survival is tied to customers purchasing products. The defeatist additude you are powerless and have no other choices is both incorrect and self-reinforcing.
There is no more powerful driver in business than voting with your dollar.
Windows 8 is not about imparting any new value on the customer. It is about CPR on tablet and phone market share. It is about a boiling frog approach to a closed app store model where all execution must be currated and approved by MS with hands in the cookie jar at every step. It is about epic leaks of data and privacy. It is about monitizing everything possible... even the shit metro apps that come with windows have ads with content downloaded from the Internet.
If you don't like all the bullshit you have a choice. If enough people fail to exercise their choice it will in fact vaporize.
For example the movie industry would like nothing better than to kill off DVDs and force everyone upgrade to blueray. Why don't they?
When I masturbate, I like to open at least two and up to four different porno videos and tile them over my screen, so that I can get most visual stimulation at once. Will I be able to do this in Window 8? It seems to devote all screen real state to only one application at a time.
Your video link doesn't work.
I don't have much of an attention span at the moment, and 23 minutes 43 seconds is too long to watch stuff whoosh about a screen with annoying sound effects and a voiceover in an impenetrable accent.
The windows ribbon was like having to give the give the priest a blowjob to avoid detention.
Windows 8 is the act of sodomy that you endure to stop the video of the first act being released.
People love the Metro window.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GKbtBuz_uJk
I personally can't get stuff done on most operating systems: be it windows 8, windows 7 or mac os x. The lack of control and conveyance is just so frustrating.
The only operating system I find usable is Linux. It appears to be the only system designed for productive use.
A review of window 8: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=seuQbbFanPg
Metro is clearly a bunch of shit. *Everyone* I know who's tried it says so. I don't know a single business that plans to upgrade to it. W8 may have improvements under the hood that make it superior to 7, but Metro is a regression, plain and simple.
it's a hybrid OS that makes enough compromises on both sides to make both mediocre.
Really, it's getting boring. I'm using Win8 for 2 months now and it works fine... my desktop at work is CentOS and I've been using Fedora for years at home.
Some people like it. Some people don't. That's life.
none
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ODFvy1mjoY&feature=player_embedded
Or it could one of those notorius ID 10 T errors. Or just a shill for open source, we get it you love it, leave us alone and go back to stroking your kernel.
I had a similar experience.
Background: I am a network architect with 17 years in the industry. I am well familiar with all previous versions of Windows as well as Linux, Solaris, Netware, WindRiver...
I walked into Costco and up to an HP ~21" touchscreen desktop with mouse. The desktop tiles had a smattering of junk apps, such as Weather and Photos that I was immediately able to touch/click to access. That's OK I guess, but pretty useless for me. I decide to find another application like Calculator or Notepad, surely Windows 8 has Notepad. It took me nearly 3 minutes(literally!) to find the slide in panel with the "start" button on it, but I still couldn't find Notepad. I kept getting the freaking tiles! Surely this thing has Notepad, right? After another full minute of struggle with this computer, I stumbled onto another obscure slide in bar at the bottom that had a small clickable link that produced ALL programs. Literally every icon that would normally have been categorized into program groups and submenus on the old start menu was vomited onto the screen in a hideous full screen entirely full of icons. After perusing this screen for a bit, I was able to pick out Notepad from the cluster.
That's 4 full minutes for a professional computer user to open Notepad for the first time! Cue the posts about how stupid I am, blah blah blah. But, GUI interfaces are supposed to be intuitive and discoverable. Windows 8 is neither of those things. The Windows 8 interface is an abomination that is as discoverable as the command line, perhaps less so.
But, it didn't end there. I remembered reading about issues shutting down Windows 8. I set out to shutdown and restart the computer. Despite now knowing how to work the "start menu" and the hidden tool bars, it took me another full minute(60 long seconds) to find the shutdown option! The Windows 8 interface is a complete POS. I couldn't even be bothered to explore it further.
I hate that idiocy like this gets posted here.
Disclaimer: I've never used Windows 8. I have however, used every version of Windows (excluding Vista) since Windows 3.11 -- And I'm currently using Windows 7.
Seriously; anyone. Have they fixed COPY yet? When I drag files from one folder to another, it still does a blind copy. It doesn't check available disk space, it doesn't perform a count of files, the estimated time remaining is still a wild guess, and if there's a problem (such as duplicate file name in target), it still brings up a requestor in the middle of the operation, when I might be busy doing other things.
It seems to me that a lot of CORE functions of being an "os" are still from the 16-bit days, and when you consider that MS is supposed to be full of relatively bright people, they still manage to create a dumb-as-a-sack-of-bricks Operating System.
If telephones are outlawed, then only outlaws will have telephones.
Take your own advice troll.
In single click mode, hover did selection.
I haven't seen a touch screen that detects the sort of finger proximity without contact that would be required to implement hover. A lot of Slashdot users have supported the early decision not to support SWF on tablets because too many SWFs rely on hover. In Android, one emerging pattern is for a long press to select an item, and then once an item is selected, the context menu replaces the toolbar. But of course, if you have a bunch of items to select, a long press (or even a long hover) on each is likely to take a while.
In older versions of Windows, if I moved the taskbar to the top and clicked the Start button, the Start menu would always appear next to the Start button. It's the same Start menu; it just appears next to where it is summoned. Menus summoned by taskbar notification icons, or by jump lists in Windows 7, also appear next to the control used to summon them.
This guy is a tech columnist and he can't shut down a program.
Except now I can pin a metro app next to the classic desktop in a 20/80 split and retain full functionality between both of them.
And I've been able to put a desktop application and a desktop application side-by-side since Windows 3.1. Windows 7 and several X11 window managers added the "snap" gesture. Besides, how should one develop and distribute applications that support this 20 percent without paying Microsoft its annual tax or running the risk that Microsoft will decline an application because it allegedly duplicates a feature of one of Microsoft's own applications?
"What the hell do I need a fork for, I have fingers to eat with"
I remember that some movie asked that exact question. The movie pointed out that a fork can be washed after a meal, but so can hands. Later, when I was eating in a college cafeteria, I realized the answer: a fork allows washing to be deferred to a later time and to be performed by someone else.
I know a much more relyable way to figure out if I will get rained on than looking at a computer screen.
How so, without using television and watching television's ads, or using the radio and listening to radio's ads? What I want to know is whether I'll get rained on during the drive there, whether I'll get rained on during the lunch hour, and whether I'll get rained on during the drive home. If all the rain will fall while I'm inside the office, I can still assume no rain. Radio and TV tend not to give the hourly precipitation potential forecasts or on-demand long-range radar loops for which I used to use The Weather Channel's web site and now use the National Weather Service web site.
Other than paying more for fewer windows?
New and shiny doesn't count for me.
They've basically moved the start menu and provided a new type of app that behaves exactly like android apps.
If Windows Store applications on Windows 8 and Windows RT behaved exactly like Android applications, then the user would be able to turn on "Unknown sources" and install third-party app stores. As it is, one has to install a developer certificate to sideload and renew it every 30 days, and I've read that Microsoft monitors the use of developer certificates to control what it considers misuse.
showing someone running Windows 8 on their PC ... with the guy(or guyess) holding the 24" monitor in his hand and using smartphone gestures to control the apps. Should be absolutely fsckin' hilarious. Even better if it is done whilst the guy (or guyess) is on a train or plane.
I think it was a 16-bit app that never got converted to 32-bit. If that's true, it won't run in 64-bit Windows 8.
Hello Microsoft shills! Just because users *can* adapt does not mean that they should! It is NOT a user problem. Computers should behave how a user expects, not the other way around.
What if Windows 9 drops English, French, German, and all of those languages that you might be used to and replaces them with Esperanto? It is more efficient! Right? It is new and improved and somehow better, right? And if you don't do things the great One True Microsoft way than you are an idiot and a Luddite, right?
There are reasons people do things they way they do. Don't piss on them. Even if Microsoft pays you to.
Why do you need the mouse when you can use the start button on your keyboard.
I've known gamers to pry off the Windows key after one too many accidental presses has jerked the player out of the game, causing a crash in some single-player games or a disconnection in online multiplayer games.
Fucking Windows Update in 8 doesnt give a postpone option, as in 7, and rebooted the damn machine in the middle of an allin in a poker game. And now it again says it has to reboot in 2 days. What kind of morons wrote this OS. New fked up ways to close screens. Do a search for windows update and it only appears if you are in settings. Its a wonder these guys even exist, wish Linux wasn't so unfriendly for desktops (repo and dependency hell). M$ is all about how to break a perfectly good OS. The retards who are ranting at this OP must have loved Vista too.
Did you use it with a kinect? It was designed for use with a kinect from what I can tell. Were you using it as a home entertainment hub? I upgraded last weekend, and yes a lot of stuff broke. It's either that or you run viruses from the eighties. I enjoy then new interface, and am excited that all the content from my xbox will be available on my pc, which is a lot easier to hack than an xbox. go back, load all your movies, turn on netflix, amazon prime, buy a kinect and play with the development kit. Hook it up to a 42" screen. Until you have done that, then you have not tried windows 8.
It's pretty clear what Microsoft is doing with Windows 8, and it really has little to do with desktop user experience. They are trying to get developers to build applications for their mobile/tablet ecosystem by leveraging the one thing they are dominate in - The desktop. That is the sole reason they force Metro on everyone and are selling the upgrade for $40. If people are forced to use it, companies will develop for it (or so their thinking goes...).
Unfortunately for them, it's not working. Companies still look at the Windows mobile platform as a joke (behind Blackberry for crying out loud) and instead of effectively leveraging the desktop, they are destroying it. The criticisms of the OS are spot on and unless they are addressed, you're going to find people looking for alternatives. Right now there aren't that many viable ones - but if they don't get their act together soon, there will be.
This goes beyond being people being "afraid of change" - Microsoft just really just dropped the ball. It's almost 2013 - You shouldn't have to fight with an OS on top of all the critical work you use a desktop computer for.
Hello, his video rant is nearly insufferable, however he does have a point.
In his setting, he is using a laptop without a touch screen but with a touchpad.
On a touchpad, one moves the mouse cursor with swiping fingers. By default, W8 interprets these swipes as gestures, and interprets them. Hence W8 keeps switching applications seemingly randomly. This is useful on a tablet but not on a touchpad.
Moreover there is no easy way to turn gestures off. Overall this is pretty terrible of W8. If you are not using either a true mouse or a touchscreen you are stuck.
who doesn't give a damn about the start button?
Why don't you learn how to drive a crane to work instead of your car... oh, wait - what's that?? You aren't used to it??? What's the MATTER with you, boy!!!
Perfect analogy. Different tools, different use cases....
I can't even begin to comprehend how people can defend Windows 8... unless they are getting paid.
Go back to Microsoft you blowhard shill!
The Linux desktop was essentially done with Gnome 2. Sure, there could be a bit more polish, it could be a bit faster, tons of thing to improve. But as a whole it worked, it was (sort of) consistent and it let users get their work done.
But no, that couldn't possibly fly, everything had to be changed for change sake. So now we have Gnome 3 that gets in the way of getting work done. But we can also choose Unity that doesn't let us get our work done effectively. Or KDE 4.whatever that is more occupied with itself than quietly letting us getting work done.
Really, UI developers need to get over themselves. I use a computer to get my work done. Not to use your idea of shiny new crap.
There is a registry entry that calls up the Apps list of the start screen. You can create a shortcut that points to that registry entry, then change the icon on the shortcut to look like the start button (I used the Media Center icon). Pin it to the taskbar on the left, and there you are.
I found out how to do this by googling Windows 8 setup tips, but don't remember where I saw it.
Also, if you put your desktop tile of the default start screen on the top left, hitting enter will take you to the desktop. Since the windows key takes you to tile view, it's pretty easy to toggle back and forth. The way I look at it, the tile view and full apps list are the same as previous Windows pinned to start button and "All Apps", just blown up to full screen size for touch devices.
"Perfect analogy. Different tools, different use cases...." - by VTEX (916800) on Friday December 21, @01:20PM (#42361929)
However - It's only telling it how it is really!
* :)
APK
P.S.=>
"I can't even begin to comprehend how people can defend Windows 8" - by VTEX (916800) on Friday December 21, @01:20PM (#42361929)
Well, there ARE some "good points" about it albeit, technically, beneath the "surface of things" (metro, ugh):
http://tech.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3330901&cid=42356261
Metro *might* makes sense on tablets, smartphones, netbooks, etc.-et al of that ilk of computing device, but on a PC desktop? No way... & thanks for your link too!
... apk
Hm...people complaining about GUI changes....AHHH I found it "A totally new screen design begins with a desktop even less useful than the one on the Mac, whose icons, folders and document orientation have been "borrowed," lock, stock and subdirectory. Desktop icons let you explore files on My Computer and in the Network Neighborhood. You can also click on a Recycle Bin, where deleted files are stored until you empty them; a Briefcase, which lets you pack files for travel; an electronic Inbox, which stores your mail and faxes, and, unless the Justice Department intervenes, the Microsoft Network on-line service. The Start button at the bottom left of the screen launches a list of programs and documents. A Taskbar beside it shows what programs are currently running and is supposed to be visible at all times. But in just one of many maddening inconsistencies, multimedia programs often make the Taskbar mysteriously disappear." This was taken from the windows 95 UI review....back in AUGUST OF 1995. Seriously people...idiots who are afraid of change shouldn't be reviewing new software. http://www.nytimes.com/1995/08/01/science/personal-computers-personal-computers-what-is-windows-95-really-like.html?pagewanted=all&src=pm
I suggest seeing a doctor if you are having problems keeping a thought for longer than a few seconds.
You mean a doctor like Professor G.A. Radvansky, who led a study about doorway amnesia?
If you are Microsoft, you actually can sell stuff people don't want. You just bundle it up cheaply with something that people do want. So OEM pricing of Windows 8 with new computers, while eliminating OEM access to Windows 7. Customers will be thinking about buying a new computer instead of actually buying Windows 8 on its own merits.
"I think there are better things to rant about than Windows 8 to be honest."
Absolutely. It's been a few hours and still no story on this truly monumental event:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-20812870
Jeesh, people, where are your priorities? We already know that Win 8 sucks, Apple is a walled garden, and the Raspi is a great platform for doing nothing. How about some "news" for nerds?
I thought the author made some good technical arguments about the usability, and was going well with valid criticisms, until he started having to use the F-word to criticize Windows 8.
Now I cannot safely point other people to the video, because they will find the content utterly offensive.
I am shocked Slashdot would link to such a thing.
"I don't mean to sound rude but aint that like saying yellow is still yellow even if you happen to think yellow is a shit color? What information is being conveyed with such statements?"
Simply that we have deal with the fact that something is yellow, no matter if we approve of the color or not. The damn thing is yellow. So now, what CAN we do from here?
"When people ask me what I think of windows 8 I recommend against upgrading. When people who have windows 8 express displeasure I tell them how to contact the vendor of their new PC to obtain a "downgrade" to Windows 7. The few people who care about what I think are now happy campers."
I offer similar advice, but I am realistic enough to know that especially as time goes on, the amount of people who are going to be satisfied by these steps is going to decrease. I've already talked to people who don't want to bother getting Win 7 as a downgrade, reinstalling, setting up their data and programs again (and/or don't have the technical know how) simply to get away from an OS that "works", yet has some irritating OS issues and esoteric "invisible in one's day to day life until a calamity happens" privacy, security, and ethics flaws.
"Or you could just install windows 7."
I most certainly can. But many of those people purchasing new PCs (including touch screens, tablets etc..) can't, or won't. It will become more expensive even for those who are self-built and buying their own OS. (Buying Win8 Pro is already considerably cheaper than Win7 Pro, Ultimate, Home Premium in many cases).
"Trick question."
Not at all. There is going to be a significant difference between using some Facebook tile, one that only connects to Microsoft directly, and one that is simply a UI add-on for some Free Software program. etc. I expect that with Windows Store and whatnot there is going to be a whole assortment of varying Metro app policies. Would you rather have a bunch of Facebook and Angry Birds stuff alone, or would you rather direct a user who WANTED TO USE A METRO APP to something like VLC Player (which is attempting to secure funding to get VLC player on the Windows Store/Metro Approved.). Not to mention, a "ClassicShell-like" FOSS alternative to Metro such as KDE/QT Plasmids that can provide the Metro-like experience without some of the dangers, if users are knowledgeable enough about their presence.
"The fact of the matter is Microsoft is a business and its survival is tied to customers purchasing products. The defeatist additude you are powerless and have no other choices is both incorrect and self-reinforcing.
There is no more powerful driver in business than voting with your dollar.
Windows 8 is not about imparting any new value on the customer. It is about CPR on tablet and phone market share. It is about a boiling frog approach to a closed app store model where all execution must be currated and approved by MS with hands in the cookie jar at every step. It is about epic leaks of data and privacy. It is about monitizing everything possible... even the shit metro apps that come with windows have ads with content downloaded from the Internet.
If you don't like all the bullshit you have a choice. If enough people fail to exercise their choice it will in fact vaporize.
For example the movie industry would like nothing better than to kill off DVDs and force everyone upgrade to blueray. Why don't they?
I'm not advocating quitting, or even rejecting the notion of offering criticism and voting with your dollar. However, I'm pragmatic enough to know that even if every single geek self-built PC rejected Win8, MS would barely be scratched compared to all the pre-installed and embedded marketplaces. Most users who want/need Windows for whatever reason and aren't open to switching to something entirely different as well as those that simply use what comes with their new PC/device, are going to increasingly be using Windows 8. Microsoft has heard our objections and frankly doesn't care - they are betting that the big OEMs a
...trying to support end-users over the phone when they're using an interface like this? Help Desk turnover has always been very high (I once saw someone hired to work the HD leave for lunch and never come back -- on their first day). I hate to think of the level of stress they're going to be subjected to having to walk someone through problems when applications are running on Win8/Metro.
CUR ALLOC 20195.....5804M
http://www.cnbc.com/id/100337335
STILL yet others (Thanks Hairyfeet):
http://bgr.com/2012/12/18/consumer-reports-windows-8-criticism-257728/
http://bgr.com/2012/12/05/microsoft-surface-sales-q4-2012-est/
http://www.tech-thoughts.net/2012/11/windows-8-sales-weak-microsoft-blames-oems.html
---
PART of that is "hard times" economically though, which makes folks "make do" with what they have, & what they have, nowadays? SPEEDSTERS... ever since the Core series came out by Intel?? VERY fast. More than adequate.
Personally?
Well - I cannot BELIEVE the MS folks didn't see it coming, & especially from the 'business men' there, AND, more especially from an ECONOMIC point of view.
(NOW was not the time for "changes"... sure, develop that unified codebase, but don't "piss off" your PC desktop + laptop using public & force them into unfamiliar territory... especially not now!)
Damn dumb actually of them, to be blunt about it.
* However, MS can afford to make a mistake now & then, especially a silly easily replaced one like a desktop shell!
(Though Mr. Sinofsky is the one who REMOVED the ability to hack the registry & replace the 'metro' shell with one users know & like, Explorer IE shell, what we've been using essentially since 1995 onwards to present).
APK
P.S.=> Bottom-line? Ok - THIS is WHAT YOU GET, when you put "money men" @ the helm & whose ENTIRE EXISTENCE is "the holy dollar", when @ the wheel of companies, rather than techies who are also businessmen who UNDERSTAND their target markets (ala "King Billy"/Mr. Gates, whom I call that out of RESPECT)...
That type? Hey... they don't know their target market, & are out of touch in that regards, & again: YOU JUST CAN'T SELL SOMETHING TO PEOPLE THEY DID NOT WANT, & that's cardinal RULE of sales you'd *think* that THAT type of man, would @ least understand - apparently? They don't...
... apk again:
I tried in the shop and it was as bad as I expected. As a power user creating stuff I like multiple programs open and clearly this not the OS for that. I guess they are targeting the 90% of users who simply consume and only single task. That's fine, I have the choice of sticking with what I like, Linux Mint Cinnamon edition, but do I really?
As I looked around the shop at all those Windows 8 laptop I wonder how many of them have locked down boot loaders that won't let me install Linux? And how many retail store are going to let boot a USB key and have a look at the HDD with a partitioning tool to see if it will be possible? I left the store depressed about the loss of choice. Maybe the old joke "We have both types of music, country and western" should now be "We have both types of OSes, Windows 8 and Mac OS 10.8".
Most of the criticism of Brian's criticism is valid, but this video is hilarious and points out some very valid flaws. They may be overstated, yes, and if he gave it the 30 days of use he was planning to give it, maybe Windows 8 wouldn't be so perplexing, but I'm sure glad we got to experience this knee-jerk reaction in its current form. Kudos for Brian for posting this awesome animated essay.
Erroneus/john b wilcox: When you eat, is your dish a wheelbarrow, your fork a pitchfork, and spoon a shovel or what http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3345911&cid=42414637 ? Does your bed use chevy truck coil springs and struts to hold your fat ass off the floor too? Hahahaha. No wonder you said this "Oh... to eat pizza again..." by erroneus (253617) on Saturday December 22, @05:20PM (#42371769) from http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3335159&cid=42371769 you disgustingly fat hog.
Erroneus/john b wilcox: When you eat, is your dish a wheelbarrow, your fork a pitchfork, + spoon a shovel or what http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3345911&cid=42414637 ? Does your bed use chevy truck coil springs and struts to hold your fat ass off the floor too? Hahahaha. No wonder you said this "Oh... to eat pizza again..." by erroneus (253617) on Saturday December 22, @05:20PM (#42371769) from http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3335159&cid=42371769 you disgustingly fat hog.
From -> http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3319303&cid=42428733
Utterly HILARIOUS... he accused me of "modifying my method" but I quote RIGHT FROM WHERE I POSTED IT (to destroy the "indestructible rootkit")...
I.E.-> He CLAIMS I said ProcessExplorer was for killing a rootkit... I said NO such thing, see here:
"My problem with your randomly capitalized, scatterbrained posts is that you claimed rootkits (not this particular rootkit, but rootkits in general) could be removed with Process Explorer when other tools fail. Yes, you also included Recovery Console in there, but you stated "removed" with Process Explorer. Afterwards you modified this to be "mopped up" with Process Explorer. (hmmmm... changing the terms of the argument again. Seems to be something you do a lot of. Terrified of losing, maybe?)" - by cbiltcliffe (186293) on Sunday December 30, @10:45AM (#42426167) Homepage
---
Ok then: NOW, here is EXACTLY what I said, from the thread on the "indestructible rootkit", quoted verbatim - Anyone can SEE that I "modified" NOTHING I originally said & the link below proves it (direct quote of my method, which makes your "tool" completely unnecessary & YOU KNOW IT):
---
PERTINENT QUOTE/EXCERPT of my method, from here in the thread he said I said otherwise: ->
"STEPS TO TAKE TO ERADICATE THIS ROOTKIT/BOTNET. NON-DESTRUCTIVELY:
---
1.) Recovery Console bootup
2.) listsvc command to spot offending bogus MBR protecting driver (hello_tt.sys)
3.) disable command to stop it from loading
4.) Reboot to RC again
5.) Fixmbr command to clear bootsector (no longer protected by said driver since it was disabled from load)
6.) REBOOT NORMALLY (it WILL be gone, guaranteed)
---
MY ACTUAL WORDS & METHOD QUOTED VERBATIM FROM -> http://it.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2282088&cid=36653602 above...
* Which works against ANY rootkit, both bootsector originating type, or driver driven type (or like this one, a combination of BOTH), 100% guaranteed - NO QUESTIONS ASKED, period...
APK
P.S.=> Then, IF this thing "hauls in" any more malware, which it CAN do?
Then - You "mop it up" using Process Explorer completely once the rootkit is destroyed!
(ProcessExplorer.exe works vs. ANY malware, even hidden ones beneath other std. processes hooked by libs/dlls, or services even)
I.E./E.G. -> You use its "suspend" feature to send HLT instructions to the offending malware, & then?
Then, you can delete it on disk & it's "Gone With The Dawn"...' - by Anonymous Coward (Myself, APK)
---
* NOW? LMAO, you can ALL watch this punk cbiltcliffe "dance", trying to deny his own words that I "modified my methods" in his trolling me THIS year again on it!
(cbiltcliffe - Who *tried* to say I 'modified my method' posting 10 days after I showed otherwise no less, trying to "get the last word" on me, here -> http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3319303&cid=42428733 recently!
APK
P.S.=> I said I would EMBARASS him with it, & am keeping to my word now, in doing so is all...
Funniest of all?
I have another 50 LIKE IT - which is MORE than ANY OTHER SINGLE 'naysayer' troll who minces words or tries to 'post weeks later to get the last word' as he did shown above!
50 debates - Where I blew him away totally, on:
---
1.) hosts files
2.) unsigned driver installs
3.) DNS clientside cache
4.) Saying nobody reads my posts or cares about them
4.) Saying I said TcpView OR processexplorer was for killing rootkits ala:
---
"My issue has always been with your claim that coul
From -> http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3319303&cid=42428733
Utterly HILARIOUS... he accused me of "modifying my method" but I quote RIGHT FROM WHERE I POSTED IT (to destroy the "indestructible rootkit")...
I.E.-> He CLAIMS I said ProcessExplorer was for killing a rootkit... I said NO such thing, see here:
"My problem with your randomly capitalized, scatterbrained posts is that you claimed rootkits (not this particular rootkit, but rootkits in general) could be removed with Process Explorer when other tools fail. Yes, you also included Recovery Console in there, but you stated "removed" with Process Explorer. Afterwards you modified this to be "mopped up" with Process Explorer. (hmmmm... changing the terms of the argument again. Seems to be something you do a lot of. Terrified of losing, maybe?)" - by cbiltcliffe (186293) on Sunday December 30, @10:45AM (#42426167) Homepage
---
Ok then: NOW, here is EXACTLY what I said, from the thread on the "indestructible rootkit", quoted verbatim - Anyone can SEE that I "modified" NOTHING I originally said & the link below proves it (direct quote of my method, which makes your "tool" completely unnecessary & YOU KNOW IT):
---
PERTINENT QUOTE/EXCERPT of my method, from here in the thread he said I said otherwise: ->
"STEPS TO TAKE TO ERADICATE THIS ROOTKIT/BOTNET. NON-DESTRUCTIVELY:
---
1.) Recovery Console bootup
2.) listsvc command to spot offending bogus MBR protecting driver (hello_tt.sys)
3.) disable command to stop it from loading
4.) Reboot to RC again
5.) Fixmbr command to clear bootsector (no longer protected by said driver since it was disabled from load)
6.) REBOOT NORMALLY (it WILL be gone, guaranteed)
---
MY ACTUAL WORDS & METHOD QUOTED VERBATIM FROM -> http://it.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2282088&cid=36653602 above...
* Which works against ANY rootkit, both bootsector originating type, or driver driven type (or like this one, a combination of BOTH), 100% guaranteed - NO QUESTIONS ASKED, period...
APK
P.S.=> Then, IF this thing "hauls in" any more malware, which it CAN do?
Then - You "mop it up" using Process Explorer completely once the rootkit is destroyed!
(ProcessExplorer.exe works vs. ANY malware, even hidden ones beneath other std. processes hooked by libs/dlls, or services even)
I.E./E.G. -> You use its "suspend" feature to send HLT instructions to the offending malware, & then?
Then, you can delete it on disk & it's "Gone With The Dawn"...' - by Anonymous Coward (Myself, APK)
---
* NOW? LMAO, you can ALL watch this punk cbiltcliffe "dance", trying to deny his own words that I "modified my methods" in his trolling me THIS year again on it!
(cbiltcliffe - Who *tried* to say I 'modified my method' posting 10 days after I showed otherwise no less, trying to "get the last word" on me, here -> http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3319303&cid=42428733 recently!
APK
P.S.=> I said I would EMBARASS him with it, & am keeping to my word now, in doing so is all...
Funniest of all?
I have another 50 LIKE IT - which is MORE than ANY OTHER SINGLE 'naysayer' troll who minces words or tries to 'post weeks later to get the last word' as he did shown above!
50 debates - Where I blew him away totally, on:
---
1.) hosts files
2.) unsigned driver installs
3.) DNS clientside cache
4.) Saying nobody reads my posts or cares about them
4.) Saying I said TcpView OR processexplorer was for killing rootkits ala:
---
"My issue has always been with your claim that coul
From -> http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3319303&cid=42428733
Utterly HILARIOUS... he accused me of "modifying my method" but I quote RIGHT FROM WHERE I POSTED IT (to destroy the "indestructible rootkit")...
I.E.-> He CLAIMS I said ProcessExplorer was for killing a rootkit... I said NO such thing, see here:
"My problem with your randomly capitalized, scatterbrained posts is that you claimed rootkits (not this particular rootkit, but rootkits in general) could be removed with Process Explorer when other tools fail. Yes, you also included Recovery Console in there, but you stated "removed" with Process Explorer. Afterwards you modified this to be "mopped up" with Process Explorer. (hmmmm... changing the terms of the argument again. Seems to be something you do a lot of. Terrified of losing, maybe?)" - by cbiltcliffe (186293) on Sunday December 30, @10:45AM (#42426167) Homepage
---
Ok then: NOW, here is EXACTLY what I said, from the thread on the "indestructible rootkit", quoted verbatim - Anyone can SEE that I "modified" NOTHING I originally said & the link below proves it (direct quote of my method, which makes your "tool" completely unnecessary & YOU KNOW IT):
---
PERTINENT QUOTE/EXCERPT of my method, from here in the thread he said I said otherwise: ->
"STEPS TO TAKE TO ERADICATE THIS ROOTKIT/BOTNET. NON-DESTRUCTIVELY:
---
1.) Recovery Console bootup
2.) listsvc command to spot offending bogus MBR protecting driver (hello_tt.sys)
3.) disable command to stop it from loading
4.) Reboot to RC again
5.) Fixmbr command to clear bootsector (no longer protected by said driver since it was disabled from load)
6.) REBOOT NORMALLY (it WILL be gone, guaranteed)
---
MY ACTUAL WORDS & METHOD QUOTED VERBATIM FROM -> http://it.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2282088&cid=36653602 above...
* Which works against ANY rootkit, both bootsector originating type, or driver driven type (or like this one, a combination of BOTH), 100% guaranteed - NO QUESTIONS ASKED, period...
APK
P.S.=> Then, IF this thing "hauls in" any more malware, which it CAN do?
Then - You "mop it up" using Process Explorer completely once the rootkit is destroyed!
(ProcessExplorer.exe works vs. ANY malware, even hidden ones beneath other std. processes hooked by libs/dlls, or services even)
I.E./E.G. -> You use its "suspend" feature to send HLT instructions to the offending malware, & then?
Then, you can delete it on disk & it's "Gone With The Dawn"...' - by Anonymous Coward (Myself, APK)
---
* NOW? LMAO, you can ALL watch this punk cbiltcliffe "dance", trying to deny his own words that I "modified my methods" in his trolling me THIS year again on it!
(cbiltcliffe - Who *tried* to say I 'modified my method' posting 10 days after I showed otherwise no less, trying to "get the last word" on me, here -> http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3319303&cid=42428733 recently!
APK
P.S.=> I said I would EMBARASS him with it, & am keeping to my word now, in doing so is all...
Funniest of all?
I have another 50 LIKE IT - which is MORE than ANY OTHER SINGLE 'naysayer' troll who minces words or tries to 'post weeks later to get the last word' as he did shown above!
50 debates - Where I blew him away totally, on:
---
1.) hosts files
2.) unsigned driver installs
3.) DNS clientside cache
4.) Saying nobody reads my posts or cares about them
4.) Saying I said TcpView OR processexplorer was for killing rootkits ala:
---
"My issue has always been with your claim that coul
From -> http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3319303&cid=42428733
Utterly HILARIOUS... he accused me of "modifying my method" but I quote RIGHT FROM WHERE I POSTED IT (to destroy the "indestructible rootkit")...
I.E.-> He CLAIMS I said ProcessExplorer was for killing a rootkit... I said NO such thing, see here:
"My problem with your randomly capitalized, scatterbrained posts is that you claimed rootkits (not this particular rootkit, but rootkits in general) could be removed with Process Explorer when other tools fail. Yes, you also included Recovery Console in there, but you stated "removed" with Process Explorer. Afterwards you modified this to be "mopped up" with Process Explorer. (hmmmm... changing the terms of the argument again. Seems to be something you do a lot of. Terrified of losing, maybe?)" - by cbiltcliffe (186293) on Sunday December 30, @10:45AM (#42426167) Homepage
---
Ok then: NOW, here is EXACTLY what I said, from the thread on the "indestructible rootkit", quoted verbatim - Anyone can SEE that I "modified" NOTHING I originally said & the link below proves it (direct quote of my method, which makes your "tool" completely unnecessary & YOU KNOW IT):
---
PERTINENT QUOTE/EXCERPT of my method, from here in the thread he said I said otherwise: ->
"STEPS TO TAKE TO ERADICATE THIS ROOTKIT/BOTNET. NON-DESTRUCTIVELY:
---
1.) Recovery Console bootup
2.) listsvc command to spot offending bogus MBR protecting driver (hello_tt.sys)
3.) disable command to stop it from loading
4.) Reboot to RC again
5.) Fixmbr command to clear bootsector (no longer protected by said driver since it was disabled from load)
6.) REBOOT NORMALLY (it WILL be gone, guaranteed)
---
MY ACTUAL WORDS & METHOD QUOTED VERBATIM FROM -> http://it.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2282088&cid=36653602 above...
* Which works against ANY rootkit, both bootsector originating type, or driver driven type (or like this one, a combination of BOTH), 100% guaranteed - NO QUESTIONS ASKED, period...
APK
P.S.=> Then, IF this thing "hauls in" any more malware, which it CAN do?
Then - You "mop it up" using Process Explorer completely once the rootkit is destroyed!
(ProcessExplorer.exe works vs. ANY malware, even hidden ones beneath other std. processes hooked by libs/dlls, or services even)
I.E./E.G. -> You use its "suspend" feature to send HLT instructions to the offending malware, & then?
Then, you can delete it on disk & it's "Gone With The Dawn"...' - by Anonymous Coward (Myself, APK)
---
* NOW? LMAO, you can ALL watch this punk cbiltcliffe "dance", trying to deny his own words that I "modified my methods" in his trolling me THIS year again on it!
(cbiltcliffe - Who *tried* to say I 'modified my method' posting 10 days after I showed otherwise no less, trying to "get the last word" on me, here -> http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3319303&cid=42428733 recently!
APK
P.S.=> I said I would EMBARASS him with it, & am keeping to my word now, in doing so is all...
Funniest of all?
I have another 50 LIKE IT - which is MORE than ANY OTHER SINGLE 'naysayer' troll who minces words or tries to 'post weeks later to get the last word' as he did shown above!
50 debates - Where I blew him away totally, on:
---
1.) hosts files
2.) unsigned driver installs
3.) DNS clientside cache
4.) Saying nobody reads my posts or cares about them
4.) Saying I said TcpView OR processexplorer was for killing rootkits ala:
---
"My issue has always been with your claim that coul
Yeah, I've had a very little experience with Windows 8 on someone else's computer. Hated it. Microsoft really should have emulated Apple in this respect: create one OS for phones/tablets and another for computers; merge them slowly if at all. The Classic Shell program free from Sourcefourge should make it more familiar and will be one of, if not the first thing I install if I get Win8.
Now that you had to "eat them" -> http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3348385&cid=42428889