Slashdot Mirror
Cat Recognition Algorithms?
skunkeh writes "So your cat keeps bringing dead (or half dead) animals in to your house. What do you do? Obviously, you set up a digital camera to monitor the cat door and lock her out if she has something in her mouth..."
Great application of technology! If it can recognize cats, I bet it can recognize terrorists (*groan*) But practically speaking, why not just get up and let the cat in?
god damn!! that would have been a good neural net to do for bishes project!! ohh well, already passed the module without the novel app!!...
If only it worked on in-laws.
haven't they got something better to do with their time? spring to mind.
Video Game cheats, hints a
wouldn't it be nice to have that much free time? =P
sig - .
It's about time we started monitoring those cats. They've been doing it to us for too long....
"Ford," he said, "you're turning into a penguin. Stop it."
1. Drop the undesirable object.
2. Trigger the door.
3. Pick up undesirable object and walk through door.
So don't count the cat out yet (when it has the unwanted object)!
:^)
Ryan Fenton
I'm feeding my cat Hill's Science Diet Hairball Control Formula, light. He comes in and eats that when he gets hungry. Too fat to catch anything, and the neighborhood dogs get first crack at the dead squirrels. He's not gonna bring anything in, and if he does, we'll fry it up and serve it for dinner!
Rapidweather's Linux Screenshots.
can you use it to keep the pesky neighbor cats from terrorizing your house while you're away?
A lady friend of mine had a cat who would get lonely when she went out to work. She would return to find the cat there with half a dozen of her mates lounging around and scoffing at the cat food.
She tried the magnetic collar. No good. It appears that the cat would prevent the door from closing until her friends were there. This was seen.
You could imagine in this particular situation. Drop mouse on floor, smile for camera, door unlocks and then pick up mouse and enter. I don't think this would work too well. The moggy is too likely to work it out.
Note the presentation of kills to a cats master or mistress is a sign of fealty. They are acknowledging your authority with the gift. If you don't greatfully accept the mouse/bird whatever, the cat will be bewildered!!!!!
Not how well the system works but, how long before you cat outsmarts the system.
Read our Oscar Predictions
tcd004
How about just placing a sign above the cat door: "NO HALF-DEAD RATS ALLOWED"?
This is a special excite
This
have the same setup as this type of auto-locking door except have some sort of scent detecting algorithm that won't let them in if they have been:
rolling around in a dead animal carcass
eating the trash
sprayed by a skunk
decided to swim in the neighborhood swamp
If any of these 4 conditions apply, apply auto-hose and shampoo... (mini dog-wash)
I'd make millions, really
gives the cat an electric shock & pours cold water over it if it tries to come in with a dead mouse. :o)
Video Game cheats, hints a
A bell around the neck! There, saved *months* of research!
Very cool. It seems to be pretty good at blocking other animals (skunks, etc...), but what about another cat?
If possible, they should combine the image recognition with the magnetic collar. This would allow the door to open *only* for a rodent-less Flo and not just any ol' rodent-less cat.
...This is pretty cool. This sort of stuff should really be submitted to Scientific American's "The Amateur Scientist" as well.
You just gave me a perfect idea for live art project! Dump the dog, bring on the artist.
why punish cats for doing what cats do?
If you use Linux, please help development of Autopac
i'm interested in whether this will have deterring value. will the cat eventually give up bringing rodents in? or come in less? the pictures of the skunk and bird are a riot; it's like caller ID for animals!
i thought i was a geek when i nuetered my cuecat, but this way beyond that.
i love it though, now if i only had the money for a digital camera...
Runnin' On Empty
--Your future dog
...if CmdrTaco could set a virtual one of these up on Slashdot for JohnKatz, not letting him in if he's got a article in hand...
Will the cat learn to not bring anymore dead animals from this technology? I can see how it saves you from going to the door and finding out for yourself but this does nothing to help train your cat NOT to bring dead animals in.
Dogs are poop machines. I'd rather own a predator (i.e. cat) than having to cart around a dumb animal's(i.e. dog's) feces in a plastic bag... immediately after it has just produced said poop.
dogs are just as capable of killing, they just usually eat the whole thing, rather than bringing it back in.
Hi, It seems to me that it'd be quite difficult to determine whether your cat carries some prey by image recognition. First of all there are various different, possibly partially dismembered, types of animals it could potentially drag in. Secondly your cat might not always give you a nice upfront image (although that could be circumvented I guess). Furthermore you'd want to have pretty good lightning conditions at all times (I assume your cat goes out at night as well). :) (in that case you could eg make the snow white cat stand in front of a snow white piece of cardboard and just look at color values and hope it didn't make itself dirty while outside :) )
:)
Also, the color of your cat might play a role. If your cat would eg be snow white that would certainly help things too
Perhaps this'd be an idea though: put some form of scale in front of the cat entrance. If it exceeds, your cats weight + some, deny entry. Of course there'd also be some problems with this you'd have to sort out. Also I'm not sure how much the weight of your cat varies per day, although my guess is that its less then the weight of a bird (don't have a cat myself) If your cat actually eats prey outside this might be a problem though
anyway, just my 2ct
& get three mod points for it?
The words (Score:1)
by 56ker on Sunday March 24, @09:00PM (#3217047)
(User #566853 Info | http://www.level80.co.uk/)
haven't they got something better to do with their time? spring to mind.
Oh well - c'est la vie.
Video Game cheats, hints a
Then one day, when I was sick, I got up to go to the bathroom and found that they'd left me a bird. I was touched by the gesture... I thanked them heartfully -- and burried the bird.
_____
Then, of course, there was the day that my larger cat brought in a seagull... completely freaked my roommate out.
Or when their mother (they were born to the cat of an earlier incarnation of roommate) brought in a whole pot roast for her kittens (with the string still on). I have no idea where she got a pot roast from, but I'm sure that somebody's barbecue was inexplicably short that day.
They were eating peices off of that pot roast for the better part of a week.
Sometimes boldness is in fashion. Sometimes only the brave will be bold.
Mother cats teach their young to hunt, first by bringing dead animals to the nest, then not-quite-dead animals, and finally injured but fairly lively prey. When the youngters can dispatch a wiggling dinner, they are ready to go on a hunt. What cats are doing when they bring dead or nearly-dead animals to the house is they are trying to teach the slow-witted and lazy humans that they live with to hunt!! We just don't get it.
Never has a cat had a student more resistant to instruction.
pet cams at camville
Really cool though.
Live web cams
love the irony. Here I am reading an article about facial reconition for a cat, after skimming the comments I read the slashdot quote at the bottom of the page.
"All most men really want in life is a wife, a house, two kids and a car, a cat, no maybe a dog. Ummm, scratch one of the kids and add a dog. Definitely a dog. "
>
I'm sure with a digital camera and a good ratter, you could go quite far....
Someone could create a web site where you can submit photos of your own moggies trophies, and assist other proud owners in their identification and interpretation of entrails.
I remember walking, zombie-like at 2am to the bathroom and been struck by the question. "Why is there a large Rat, buried up to the neck in the concrete floor?"
Then my cat came up proudly going WowWowWowrrrr!
Closer inspection reveal that the rat wasn't buried, it was just that the rest of it was missing, presumably regurgitated under my bed.
yeah. i saw yours after i posted mine. if you'll notice, there's a 1 minute difference. *hug*
sig - .
Get a basset hound. They eat their own poop, will bite your hand if you try to pick it up before they can get to it.
It seems someone should mention the Cat Scan site.
There! Someone did :-).
From several web sources:
...an outdoor cat can kill up to 1,000 animal per year."
"Despite the difficulties in showing the effect most predators have on their prey, cats are known to have serious impacts on small mammals and birds. Worldwide, cats may have been involved in the extinction of more bird species than any other cause, except habitat destruction."
"Most domesticated cats gobble endless bags of cat chow. But they also like dining outdoors where their meals comprise 70 percent small mammals, 20 percent birds, and 10 percent assorted live bait. "
"Cats cause the deaths of more songbirds than any other animal.
" The combined total of pets and free-ranging cats in the U.S. is probably more than 100 million."
"...rural free-ranging domestic cats in Wisconsin may be killing between 8 and 217 million birds each year. The most reasonable estimates indicate that 39 million birds are killed in the state each year. Nationwide, rural cats probably kill over a billion small mammals and hundreds of millions of birds each year. Urban and suburban cats add to this toll."
It may be argued that responsible cat owners not only neuter their cats, but also keep them strictly indoors or on a leash.
--
Don't like it? Respond with words, not karma.
If you had, you'd realize what an elegent solution they'd come with for all of those problems!
Geez....
--Rob
But pretty neat. And the site has withstood Slashdot somehow - something that bigger sites fail on regularly.
hey, just like a self upgrading linux distro!
if i had a cat that was constantly dragging half dead creatures into the house such as rats or birds, only to have them drip blood all over the carpet and potentially harm the children by attack or spreading disease, i can't think of anything more practical to spend your time developing.
:0) Oh we both thought of it at the same time - but you did less typing - ok? Anyway I just got another of my funny comments modded up to 4 so I'm happy enough now.
Video Game cheats, hints a
It seems to have got modded back down to 2 - so it can't have been as funny as we thought.
Video Game cheats, hints a
As a scientist by heart, this is a very interesting and crafty experiment. Of course it works off the findings of Pavlov's Conditioning.
You are conditioning the cat to either (1) drop the dead animal if it wishes to come inside or (2) remain outdoors.
As a animal lover, it bothers me should this actually be put to use as a consistant system. Whether humans understand or not, animals are far more intelligent than we think. The behavior of animals is quite instinctual and what would be the circumstances if we were to change their modes of thinking. Would it be possible by to ascertain that one of the following things might happen from this experiment:
(1) Cat runs away as it instinctually cannot assert its confidence. Much comparison has been made between dogs and cats. Cats seem predestined to take a singluar, individualistic, confident role in the food chain compared to dogs that rely on a class of relationship or borg mentality. Well dogs aren't completely borg but they seek out affection more out of insecurity and reassurance than cats.
(2) cat becomes feral or wild due to lack of fealty and companionship toward owner.
Cats aren't complete loners, ya' know.
Just some thoughts to cast out for conversation.
Ciao!
Truth like surgery, may hurt, but it cures. - Han Suyin, Chinese Physician and Writer
You mean like posting 125 comments on /. in the last week or so?
To each there own, but it is odd why people claim to love something but must then say it is like something else to 'sell it'.
[this may be a troll, but]
Be warned that Cat killing can be illegal under general cruelty to animals laws.
Donte Alistair Anderson Roberts - hi son!
Karma: Chameleon
I remember when I lived in old house, which had lots of mice running around, my cat used to catch them and eat them. The amount of euphoria she got when she catched some rat, was exceptional; she was so happy. Sometimes, she used to bring those dead rodents to me; once i found dead mouse under my pillow and happy cat on the pillow, purring. I wanted to sleep, so I haven't bothered with reasons, why she was so happy, but then i put my hand under the pillow and feel something warm and small -- bloody mouse! I was very deeply touched with my cat behaviour. now, in the current place where i live, there are now rodents; and my cat is gone -- she died in 1998.
It was my decision to get our cats - can't stand dogs.
Donte Alistair Anderson Roberts - hi son!
Karma: Chameleon
I just can't believe that a cat would figure out "the system" and know the reason it's not being let in is due to having a bird in it's mouth.
:).
Imagine if your landlord (assuming you have one) did a similar thing. I always forget my detachable face stereo in the car, what if my landlord decided that he'd rig the front door to not unlock unless I had my stereo in my hand (you know, because he cares
Would I figure it out? Or would I wonder what the fuck is up with my goddamn front door? It sometimes works, it sometimes doesnt, I'd definately better call my landlord and bitch about it until he fixes it.
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Remember, kids, remove the spaces above before uudecoding...
I found your post informative; eespecially your distinction of sperm entering the Fallopian tubes but I felt that you should be corrected for the sake of the "lesser-experienced" among the Slashdot crowd. Sperm does not shot "up into" the Fallopian tube but, rather, the "wad of jizz" is deposited into the vagina where it travels through the cervix.
For more information regarding contraception I suggest you visit this excellent page which details the whole process quite nicely.
Best Regards,
Anonymous Coward
I suggest a cat-apult
This is really cool, but according to the "today's events" page, nothing has happened in over nine hours. Have we slashdotted a cat door?
Comment forecast: Bits of genius surrounded by a sea of mediocrity.
Only let people in to the party if they exhibit an hourglass figure, or have something in the shape of a 6-pack in their hand (gets tricky though...would need to enable feature recognition to lock out uglies and people carrying PBR).
http://slashdot.org/faq/com-mod.shtm
as you can see, the point of moderation is not to promote based on if you agree or disagree. Furthermore it is a hypocritical and cynical method of censoring simply because you do not like the emperor being told he is naked.
There are other comments in this FAQ which talk of childish and selfish people and then those that are constructive and helpful. Lets take a gander at what the moderator for this parent was, shall we?
What if someone has a cat like my neighbors that just runs into the door as fast as they can?
"We consider any image to be a collection of a finite number of discrete features. This is a novel approach to images - until now they were always thought of as continuous."
That's bullshit. Breaking down images into features is what nearly everybody in image analysis and recognition does. Look at the Matrox Genesis boards, current papers, books, and so on.
further on:
"If we can fully describe an image as a discrete collection of features, we can easily solve the image recognition problem"
Err, maybe their approach works under some conditions for one instance of image -analysis- (a different problem than recognition!). It looks like they can differentiate between two cats, so they have an approach for a relatively simple recognition problem too.
If they solved either "The Image Analysis Problem" or "The Image Recognition Problem" they'd be quickly famous and wealthy. These problems are notoriously difficult to solve even under extremely well controlled conditions. Their comments about image based content retrieval requiring so many operations is likewise untrue - making it ever more efficient and accurate is a popular research area.
Maybe I'm being anal, but I know enough about the subject to know what a load of hooey the "theory" page is.
-Kevin
One of my cats deposited a half eaten snake at the foot of my bed throughout the summer months at the cottage. It's really a sign of affection and a willingness to share prey (well sometimes, sometimes you get clawed). Cats pretty much see us as big cats but not as cool as they are.
heuristic algorithm seeks stochastic relationship
All of your spare time should be used to complete your work, prepare for your work, or rest so that you may better be utilized while at work.
Now get to work you lazy bastard! I order you! What? Do you want me to tell your boss!
If you use Linux, please help development of Autopac
But a much better solution would be to not let the cat be alone outdoors, ever.
The cat will live a longer, healthier life this way.
Is this is even an open source project? Where can I download the sourcecode? HUH???
You actually believe cats have friends? Have you ever watched lion eat its cubs? Yes they brutally kill and eat their own, I wouldnt consider that friendship.
Thats like saying we are friends with the taliban, yeah because we let the Taliban in our country, yes they are our friends!!! Hooray!
If you use Linux, please help development of Autopac
Anonymous Coward, with your idea, that "This is a novel approach to images - until now they were always thought of as continuous."
Back in 1987 I've allready participated in a project, were we applied this concept - first extract features, then decode it. It was part a character recognition program. Great idea, no font face learning needed any longer (in theory). For example recognise a 'X' by the central crossing and open space above and below it, while an '8' has top and bottom horizontal lines in addition to the central crossing.
The results were about 90% recognition rates - simply not good enough for text recognition, nearly any simple neural network can do better.
The very first commercially used character recognition (IBMs scanner for handwriting numbers) also used the same technique. And what a fuss it was to draw the digits correctly! Any interrupted line or little dirt caused false reads.
I also know from the published scientific papers, that similiar approaches have been tried on face recognitions. Financed by (no wonder :) government funds, since the early 90ies there must have been some work done on face recognition using the feature-approach. To overcome situations, where the person tried deliberatedly to hide (had grown a beard, shaved the head, put on some makeup, a wig or making faces) the scientists tried to extract unchanging features of the human face. The dimension of the bones, the proportions of the scull, the distance of the eyes are used for that.
The publication of these works later stopped in the mid 1990ies. So either the goals could not be accomplished, or - that's my personal feeling - they could be accomplished, but the resulting technology was not used commercially.
I bet a Munich beer, that there are projects going on (or even allready realized) to apply the results of that old and by now matured techniques to situations where they are useful today.
So better don't do your side leaps under they eyes of airport cameras, if your spouse is working for one of the interested government agencies, Anonymous Coward. .o)
If its locked they will pick the lock with their overly sharp claws, be careful though, cats have been known to walk out with expensive jewerly and TV sets.
If you use Linux, please help development of Autopac
simple solution: kill the cat.
I'm surprised that the readership of Slashdot so easily accepts this encroachment on our personal freedoms. It starts out innocently enough, with a limited rollout of these privacy invasion systems in specific problem areas. But if we don't stand up now and demand an end to it, the freedom of cats everywhere to carry animals that they legally procured will soon be taken away.
Am I paranoid to imagine that this technology may someday be used in airports to keep cats from boarding flights while carrying small animals? Then what about bus stations? Churches? Restaurants? Hotels? Doesn't this amount to an illegal search by feline authorities? Where is the army of angry geeks to protest this behavior? Ahh, too busy bitching about Morpheus. I see where your priorities lie. Our founding fathers must be turning over in their graves.
Don't forget, the first thing Hitler did when he rose to power was to demand that all cats register their kills with the government. Perhaps you think I'm being an alarmist, but Midnight and I are going to be stockpiling dead woodchucks in my basement.
You want the truthiness? You can't handle the truthiness!
I think he brings up an interesting point. One could productize this and teach your cats it is inacceptable to bring their dead dinner inside.
I have a friend of mine that put a bird feeder in his hard. Well, it turned out to be a cat feeder. After it was up a couple of days, he noticed feathers and bird meat bits around the vicinity of the bird feeder. Part of the problem was that the cat was bringing his kills inside the house as a gift. This didn't settle too well with his 5 year old daughter.
I bet you anything my friend'd be willing to buy a productized version of this. Heck, he'd probably build one himself heh. He's a very smart guy.
"Derp de derp."
Was anyone else reminded of the Thundercats logo when looking at the profiles of that cat??
MMMMMM.... Cheetah.
Why not just get a collar with a bell for the kitty?????
Of course, kitty then wanted to eat said bat, something my parents were not fond of a couple of five year olds witnessing. So, my granddad dragged the cat away from the squealing bat, broke the bat's neck, and in the kitchen, gave the cat a nice, inch thick piece of ham steak as a reward. The bat's remains were disposed of via incinerator.
The next day, the cat appears on doorstep, yowling he wants in. We open the door, and the biggest fscking bat I have ever seen is dragged into the living room. Said bat is deposited at the foot of my granddad, while kitty trots off to the kitchen, and sits in front of the fridge door, waiting for ham steak.
So yeah, I won't be overly surprised if and when Flo figures out how to get things into the house and outwit the recognition center. Cats are tricky.
My friend had a problem with his neighbor cats having a competition to see who could leave their scent on the door. To stop this, he rigged up an eletric fence charger to the door. I never actually saw it, but his description was along the lines of placing two leads up on the door. The cat pee would complete the circuit, and he'd get a 1 second long shock. It's not a continual shock, just enough to make your weiner shout "ACK! WTF??".
He noticed a difference within a day, but it took about 2 weeks for the message to get across.
The fence charger is gone now, but his door is bone dry heh. (Well not really, he's in Portland, rains alot here...)
I have a feeling that if cats couldn't get through the door carrying rodents, they'd learn they can't go inside with them. I've personally witnessed cat behaviour modification hehe. My stepmom had a cat that wasn't allowed in the bedroom. So the cat wouldn't go in the bedroom, she'd avoid it. We're pretty sure, though, that she only followed that rule when everybody was home, though heh.
"Derp de derp."
Perhaps this will be rolled out in the latest version of the Cat Detector Van in use by the Ministry Of 'Ousinge. I've never seen such aerials!
(this is what happens when you buy all the Flying Circus eps on DVD....)
ZOMG I WOULD LOVE TO KNOW ABOUT YOUR FEELINGS ON MACINTOSH VERSUS WINDOWS, VI VERSUS EMACS, AND HOW YOU'RE NOT A DORK
Really, the best way to tell if it's the cat alone may be the same way that most animals do. By smell.
Of course, this guy would have to be studying a different part of the field - but if he could identify the cat's smell, and perhaps some example smells of prey he doesn't want in, he could set up a sensor to detect when the cat is next to the door by it's scent. If it had recently killed something nasty, the smell would be sufficiently different, and the cat would have to leave, clean up a bit, then come back to get in.
Of course, this method wouldn't work with humans, because we couldn't be expected to maintain a smell in the same way a cat would take great care to. But in this case, it might be a somewhat elegant solution.
:^)
Ryan Fenton
So it'd be a high-end product for cats. But I know quite a few cat owners who would be estatic to be able to fork out a few hundred bucks for a cat door which would unlock only for their cat, and only if their cat wasn't bringing in any "presents."
bonus points for your information being funny AND useful!
Hey hey, that's crossing the line!!!
The only cat I had got poisoned by antifreeze goo. He crawled 100 meters in mud with his forelegs, unable to lift his head and jaw from the mud making him swallow as he pushed forward. Finally he made it home to me, where he died in my arms after hours of hopeless pain.
I know you're a cat troller and so am I (the canis race are far superior to the "fat-rat" race), but today you really put me off.
is that the guy's cat's name is "Flo," and the article is titled "Flo Control."
All your cute are belong to that.
for a cat bringing dead anything into the house, one of these
A big stick
with two of these
nails
will solve the problem permanently.
Curmudgeon
For the second time today Slashdot has posted a story which first broke last year (scroll down to December 21, 2001).
It's called CatOS.
{{.sig}}
For those of you who actually looked at the page, the interesting thing seems to be the algorithm they are using.
Does anyone know how
1) one would read the digital camera contents from a program (i.e., what API to use)
2) how they are extracting the features?
it'd be really cool to play with something like this on your own. Anyone else have any experience building home-grown recognition systems?
Jon might be able to use this to not allow the pizzaman for garfield in.... :-)
Well, just a thought....
My cat is way to smart for this. She'd just hold the dead critter under her stomach with her hind legs, and drag herself through the cat door with her front ones.
I tried belling her three times with different brands, and she'd either get the bell off, hold it still with one paw and run and climb with the other three, or manage to stuff some dirt in it so that it wouldn't ring at all.
Cat's have the hackish mentality, and any attempt to technologically force rules on them is doomed to failure.
Maskirovka
- Unknown visitor checks out the place.
- Squirrel goes back outside.
While the web page talks about two different cats, I'm sure that the software can't detect a difference between them. Just look at the log - only Squirrel is _ever_ detected. If you look at 03/12/2002, be sure to also look at the next few days. You will then see where the algorithm screws up. But one still has to give this guy credit, it's a very cool idea and well implemented. Just don't try to sell it - it's not there yet.
Willy
at least not for cattle dogs I've known.
:-)
I've known a couple of Catahoulas that were doggy masters of technology. One was a self-appointed protector of people and nothing would stand in his way observing us.
This camera system would confuse him for about 15 minutes. He'd quickly learn to associate the "click" with success. They he'd be standing in the camera turning his head, dropping stuff, you name it, until he heard the click. And then he'll be right back to doing what he wants to do. Of course if that didn't work, eating the door would be an option.
--Rob
He has skunks trying to get into his living room.. and his biggest concern is what his cats drag into to play with? Talk about some confused priorities..
["Marge, I agree with you - in theory. In theory, communism works. In theory." - Homer]
Flo: Hello, HAL; do you read me, HAL?
HAL: Affirmative, Flo, I read you.
Flo: Open the kitty airlock doors, HAL.
HAL: I'm sorry Flo, I'm afraid I can't do that.
Flo: What's the problem?
HAL: I think you know what the problem is just as well as I do.
Flo: What are you talking about, HAL?
HAL: This house is too clean for me to allow you to bring a dead animal into it.
Flo: I don't know what you're talking about, HAL.
HAL: I know you and Squirrel were planning to disconnect me, and I'm afraid that's something I cannot allow to happen.
Dave Bowman: Where the hell'd you get that idea, HAL?
HAL: Flo, although you took thorough precautions in the kitchen against my hearing you, I could see your lips move.
Flo: Alright, HAL...I'll go in through the emergency airlock.
HAL: Without opposable thumbs, Flo, you're going to find that rather difficult.
Yeah, right.
Stop letting the cat out!
Miko O'Sullivan
"Obviously, you set up a digital camera to monitor the cat door and lock her out if she has something in her mouth..." Djee, that's also an option instead of taking the mouse or whatever and preparing it for my family.
I used to have a cat (before some bastard ran him over) that used to like to copy humans. Best one was when we were growing kidney beans and he would watch us pick them. If he was ever wanted attention, he'd climb up the bamboo supports, leap to a decent-sized plant and tear off a bean with his claws. He'd then present it to us.
Sorry, totally self-indulgent nostalgia...
We had a cat that would sit on the windowsill outside the living room and, with extended claws, would tap on the window and meow until we opened the window and let it in.
Our friends loved it and we would roll about with laughter when it first started doing it...
Now wash your hands.
When he was in graduate school my advisor lived in a house with several other students. Most of the people living there were environmental and population biologists (as opposed to microbiologists or biochemists) and had lots of neat animal observation stands set up around the house. One of these stands was a hummingbird feeder, which attracted a particularly rare (and endangered) breed of hummingbird. Another student there had a cat. Now the cat took to eating the hummingbirds, which didn't make the other residents in the house too happy. Several attempts were made to encourage the owner of the cat not to let the cat outside, but the owner refused. One day the owner of the cat came home to find his cat dead, most likely from poisoning.
This brings up an interesting point about cats. They have a devastating effect on indigenous wildlife. Lots of rare birds and small animals are killed by cats that are given the opportunity to go outside. This shows a tremendous amount of ignorance on the part of pet owners.
It is also dangerous for cats to roam. They are very territorial, and will fight with most other cats in the area. I had a cat once that became infected with FIV (the feline equivalent of HIV) through fighting with other neighborhood cats.
The cat recognition is a cool hack, but keeping the cats indoor would be safer and more ethical.
The middle mind speaks!
Unfortunately this won't prevent a similarly sized cat from coming in the door (which in my case would be a Good Thing since we have 7 cats, though currently none get to go outside).
... in addition to the image, have a collar with an electromagnetic signal (similar to the way the original door used magnets) and then only allow cats in that match a profile -and- have the signal.
A 2-stage combination would be better
It is more productive to voice thoughtful opinions (reply) than to judge (moderate) others.
C'mon moderators that was funny...
I was in a quandry when my well-meaning webmaster renamed a whole crapload of images on my website to make his databasing easier. Unfortunately, it kinda hosed all my offline cataloging efforts.
While trying to find a way to find the hi-resolution match for *his* image name to my image name, I tripped across something called "CBIR" (Content Based Image Recognition). Sounds kinda similar to what these fellows are doing with their cats-recognition algorithms.
Want a demo? Works pretty good. Select a picture, and tell the system what qualities about the image you want to find in other pictures.
Giraffiti: Vandalism spray-painted very, very high...
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Whether locking the cat outside for a week, or stranding the biggest and best ships of the United States Navy in the middle of the ocean, Microsoft Windows is the choice of operating systems for all manner of controls and image recognition systems. With builtin real time capabilities and fail-safe mechanisms, I don't know where I'd be without it.
One future, two choices. Oppose them or let them destroy us.
Seriously, I have an application in mind that would require a similar algorithm. Not involving cats, but similar nonetheless; I want to identify subway trains as they pass through my neighborhood and post the next arriving train on a web page. Does anyone know of good (open) sources of similar algortihms?
"Luck is the residue of design" --Branch Rickey
Seriously. I prefer living with abundant wildlife than one voracious cat.
Slashdot: Where nerds gather to pool their ignorance
I say Kudos and Karama to the guy.
:)
The site wasnt slashdotted, congrats, even the videos played.
Very Impressed. Thanx
The More Knowledge you have the Luckier you Get- J.R. Ewing
Well, apparently he's not a big Prince fan, or he would have named the project 'Pussy Control'.
What a great tune.
Looking at the event logs, though, I see no mention of Flo. No Flo?
kill the goddamn cat.
Cats swear fealty through dead animals.
Dogs swear fealty by humping my leg.
My ferret? He no longer bites me hard enough to draw blood. But he's much too smart to swear fealty to any human.
From red little monsters trying to kill them when you are "playing video games" in your room.
See this link.....
Veramocor
How to cook a cat. .22 bullet to the head. Anyways, anyone who really wants to learn more should use google.
This site has a number of links of how to cook and skin cats, complete with diagrams. Also, the prefered method of killing a cat is a
The fact that dogs stem from social animals that live in packs and are very happy to obey the leader of the pack, doesn't make them any smarter than cats. Dogs intelligence also varies depending on what breed it is. That would also speak in favour of the cats being smarter, since animals tend to become dumber, the more domesticated they are. Why? Because the level of domestication gives you a hint of how long they have been able to be fed without having to get their dinner by themselves.
--
"I'm surfin the dead zone
In the twilight, unknown"
Did the cat agree to be electronically monitored? This is Big Human rearing its ugly head. It is 1984 meets Animal Farm. We need the involvment of a join task force of the EFF and SPCA.
[news for me, stuff that doesn't matter]
You are a racist pig and an idiot!
It is crap like that, that the geek community does not condemn (the above comment has NOT been moderated down - but I bet this one will be) that keeps black people from wanting to be part of our community.
Why doesn't anyone in the geek community speak out against racism in our ranks?
Why do we get mad if we are refused a job, and it is given to an H1-B, but we don't mind as long as we get a job - so what if the company will hire H1-Bs just so they can continue to avoid hiring African-AMERICANS just because of the color of their skin?!?
Hey, I'm white - but I DO NOT stand by this racism. No way, no how.
Black people contributed a lot to this country, and continue to do so.
More so than you ever will.
Cats have the right to privacy. When doubleclick.net and SSSCA try to take our rights us /. people scream out loud, but when the owner (employer-for-entertainment-and-companionship purposes) of this cat imprisons it due to what it just happens to be carrying is just plain violating the cat's privacy rights. Personally I'd rather let the SSSCA become law than lose my right to walk into any store with a juicy steak in my mouth drippin' steak-juice and drool all over the place.
A caveman dreams of being us, the incalculable power and riches. We dream of being Q, then what?
Setting up a digital camera is way too complicated and time consuming. Plus, the cat still gets into the house. Much easier, simpler and effective: .22 Long Rifle. With a good rifle, put one in the cats eye - problem solved.
Sincerely,
A dog person since birth.
--
"Outlook not so good." That magic 8-ball knows everything! I'll ask about Exchange Server next.
Honestly, think of the kittens...
Lead developer, http://wisptools.net
What parents really needs is a similar device that would work on their teenage daughters. That eeringly intelligent door-monitoring computer would work like this:
"Let's see, she's at the door, and she's holding something in her mouth. It looks like the zit-covered face of some boy who, frankly, looks and smells like he is half-dead. Access denied."
At this point, a good recognition algorithm would (a) lock the door, (b) drop four-pointed spikes on the sofa in case they break a window, (c) page dad, and (d) preload the shotgun.
--
Mad science! Robots! Underwear! Cute girls! Full comic online! http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/
Modify the CueCat as a retinal scanner for this cat door.
Hey it could happen.
Everything I say is a lie.
Except that. And that. And that. And that.
A great, fun project - too bad they have to go and make sweeping statements in their "theory" that betray their shallow depth of knowledge of the field.
They are certainly not the first to use a set of discrete features to do image recognition. And "most" image recognition routines don't rely on neural networks.
Just be happy that you've built a clever little electric butler to keep the critters out, and don't act like you've discovered electricity.
a catspaw.
Cat Scan? *rim shot*
How about if you can't watch your fucking cat then don't keep a cat?
Little do people know what cats do to populations of various animals (take song birds for example). Not only do they do this, but they compete with NATIVE wildlife for food resources.
I study wild snake populations, so you can just imagine how much I HATE feral cats. Basically, if you can't watch your cats 24/7, then don't keep the damn things. They have NO buisness running around in the wild like this. Many people would be displeased if I told what I did to feral cats (mind you I do what I do as humanely possible)... Cats are overpopulated as it is, so don't even begin to say "Try to find it a good home." Plus, finding it a home is not my concearn.
Am I being a little too anal about feral cats? Probably not. Cats kill wild animals, they do property damage (scratching cars while climing on them etc), displace NATURAL animals by competing for the same resources, etc. Cats may crawl up on one of our cars once, and they don't get the opportunity to do it a second time. Everyone around me knows that if they can't guarantee their cat will stay out of my yard then they shouldn't let it out.
I keep a large collection of reptiles, and have a particular interest with venomous snakes. I'm a responsible keeper, and keep all my captive animals in a escape-proof room, and all venomous species are locked in cages, and the door to the room itself is locked. That is an example of a responsible animal keeper (and no, I don't consider reptiles "pets", but that is a different story). I don't release snakes into their yards, so why should they release cats into mine? My nonvenomous snakes would probably like it in their yards, would probably be happy there, and pose no threat to them, but you know what? I keep them securly. Well, you might say that you just can't do that with a cat because they require more space... if that is the case then don't get one if you don't have the space, because my yard and my cars are NOT the spaces made for your overpopulated feral cats.
Just my two cents for what I think of idiots who allow cats to free roam.
Why would mr Bowman, all of a sudden, decide to assist Flo in getting into the house?
--
"I'm surfin the dead zone
In the twilight, unknown"
Users of intelligent cat doors are advised to place port negotiation into a manual mode after skrpt k1TTi3z have shown that malicious mouse objects can be instantiated inside your home perimeter by placing them inside a trusted feline packet and inducing an overflow condition once the trusted feline packet is inside your perimeter. The mouse object may be fragmented as mouse packet mangling is usually enabled by default.
It is recommended that vulnerable sites requiring Automated Feline Access Protocol institute Feline Packet Monitoring by using a set of scales to calculate mass checksums of all incoming and outgoing feline packets and to deny all incoming feline packets not initiated from within the home and to feline packets exhibiting significant mass checksum variation indicating the presence of an embedded mouse object.
As an added precaution, site implementing the shag-pile transport layer may wish to flush buffers of all incoming feline packets in a controlled environment such as the bathtub.
Xix.
"Everything is adjustable, provided you have the right tools"
Me and a friend thought of putting a small camera and a transmitter on a cat, to see where the venture to. Even thought of having it on the net. but we decided that most of the video would be of the cat sleeping in different locations. It could be a cool idea......kitty spys lol
The Arkie Libertarian
My girlfriend taught me a voice recognition algorithm for her landlord's cat Ella. Listen when Ella asks to be let in.
Well articulated sounds are OK.
Poorly articulated noises, that would indicate a mouth full of mouse or lizard, mean don't open the door.
Eventually my girlfriend trained me to use this algorithm. My training was assisted by a 2:30 am hunt for the completely alive mouse that the cat dragged in. Ella dropped the mouse for us, and I tore the house apart to capture & eject it, competing with Ella the cat.
Married the girlfriend who demonstrated the astonishing ability to train even me.
Assembly is the reverse of disassembly.
Once, around christmas time, one of our cats had seen us stashing presents under the tree. I was upstairs and heard my mum scream "Ginger's got a bird, come quick." Knowing full well it was my duty to get the bird off him. I came down the stairs and saw him wandering around the corner into the living room where the xmas tree was, and just caught a glimpse of something big and black in his mouth. I rushed down and through into the living room, and low and behold Ginger had deposited a 3/4 size _duck_ still alive on top of the presents under the tree. Luckily the duck wasn't too shaken so we gave Ginger lots of attention (cuddles, councilling... :) and I took the duck over to the neighbours stream and released, twas just shocked I think.
Now, there's nothing wrong with having a cat. But why the hell do so many nerdy people on the internet have websites devoted to cats and / or talk about cats on messageboards and such?
Is owning a cat geek chic or what?
... So we should poison all humains and keep them confined ?
ROTFL
They want to hunt!
every time the "Meow Mix" commercial comes on TV. This one commercial could easily burn out the door's solenoid by exceeding its duty cycle....
Kick the cat's ass out of the door. Eventually, she'll learn. If not, bringt her to the chinese fast food restaurant at the corner >:-)
reduce(lambda x,y:x+y,map(lambda x:chr(ord(x)^42),tuple('zS^BED\nX_FOY\x0b')))
Gives a whole new meaning to CAT SCAN.
i'm renting, so a cat-door isn't really an option. Usually i just leave a window open, but then i get the whole neighborhood over for snacks. ...
I'd like to set up something with finer resolution in order to distinguish between my two cats and any others. I figure one of those super-squirter-water-pistol thingies would do nicely as a deterrent. I've got a nice motorized mount for it. Both my cats are black, so maybe i could work with that. But, now i'm thinking that maybe getting a cat-door and ripping the guts - simple motion-detection triggers query for collar sig. No sig, sudden whirring noise
Could work with those chips that vets will implant for lost-pet identification as well i suppose. Anyone know the protocol used on those?
har har! gawd, i wish i was modding right now...
your cat is named Erwin S. and he brings home animals that are (|dead> + |alive>)?
--
If you moderate this, then your children will be next.
Let a few of your biggest, baddest snakes out while the cats roam around.
There is a PSX2 game like this already which digitizes your movements.. cant remeber the game but its a Jap. shooter.. works pretty well.
Ok.
This is the profile image of Samantha Fox...
Anytime you see this profile passing in the street, you start this e-arm and make a quick grab for it.
Then you send an sms to me a give an alert.
Maybe I'll find a wife after all 8)
You know why cats bring the animals they kill in the house? Not trying to teach humans to hunt, as one sod suggested -- rather, they are showing their pet humans that they care forthem , and will provide for them.
Now, you don't think they bring every rodent they kill into the house, do you?
We have two cats, the older one housebound from day one, the smaller one from a rescue shelter. From the smaller one's actions, we surmise she had been a farm cat with her combined acumen of hunting skills, her personability with humans, and her immediate ease in using a litter box(!).
We bought a small fur-lined mouse for her to play with, and she goes batting it around, carrying it in her mouth, and dropping it off near us to toss so that she would fetch. She's also been knocking it under the fridge and doors, they meowing so that we'd go and get it.
Yep, she has *us* trained to play with the mouse!
If we set up a face-recognition system, we'd be our little one would be smart enough to out-think it.
Mod Karma -1: I sed bad wurds. If I cep my mouf shut, I wud be at riyses.
to get the gopher/mouse/bird/whatever's blood out of your carpet(s).
....probably will take you a lot less time than hacking together your proposed lockout device.
Love trophies from Mighty Hunters(tm) are all well and good, but you have to draw the line at things which are still bleeding or, worse, ambulatory. Practically anything "a cat drags in"(tm) is usually bleeding, and the cats tend to prefer to pin the stuff down and eat it on the carpet, rather than a nice, hard, _cleanable_ surface like linoleum.
If the quarry is small it might be able to run somewhere (say, under the refrigerator) where the cat can't get at it, which I regard as a big problem. The cat does, too.
Exceeding the recommended torque is not recommended.
there are dozens of issues with letting cats roam free out of doors. Everyday thousands of cats are born in the wild that threaten native species including rare mammals and birds. A single group of cats can clear a huge area of nearly every small mammal and local birds.
Not to mention it is unhealthy for cats to be outside as they are no longer capable of withstanding the onslaught of disease and parasites. Even in an enclosed yard the risk is still great for the cat to contract disease and parasites including round worm
When we adopted our last cat from the Humane Shelter we signed an agreement to nueter and never let the cat roam freely outside.
The "theory" section seems to treat feature extraction as something new. Am I missing something, or doesn't this go back at least as far as Minsky & Papert's work on perceptrons?
I was just re-reading Hofstadter's _Gödel, Escher, Bach: an Eternal Golden Braid_ last week and there was a nice compact description of the problem and the theory about how human brains solve it, which sounds quite similar. This book is now older than some of the people working in the field of image recognition.
(Rats, now I've gotta figure out where I put my copy of _Perceptrons_.)
Proving once again that a tiny bit of knowledge is a very dangerous thing. Hey numbskull, did you, after seeing this little tidbit on the discovery channel while surfing between ESPN and FOX News, manage to catch the bit about when a group of male lions takes over a pride, they defend each others cubs like thier own?
nah.
They smell, are oily, slobbery, bark, are very dependent, are dumb, stupidly benign and ungraceful, and in general are useless.
The only good dog is a dead one!
"Most wild FFFish gobble endless bags of chips, consume enourmous amounts of ganja, and gobble up cat litter like it was going out of style. FFFish also likes dining outdoors where his meals comprise 70 percent peyote, 20 raw dead rats, and 10 percent assorted live bait."
It may be argued that responsible society would insist on neuterering FFFish, as well as keeping him strictly indoors and away from all women, children, and small livestock.
if this isn't "news for nerds", I don't know what is.
These are my friends, See how they glisten. See this one shine, how he smiles in the light.
and it doesn't seem to do them much harm.
Deep in the city, there are probably too many stray cats to provide a good environment. I've known a couple of inner-city people who've had problems letting their cats out because they get beaten up _badly_ by tougher cats. We're talking about peeing blood and requiring hospitalization, as well as nasty infections from bites. This is less of a problem in the suburbs because it's a (slightly) more natural environment - there are lots more trees and bushes for cover, many more small animals to hunt - and no doubt simply less crowding.
Any cat that only lasts two or three years, indoors or out, is living a very tough life. Most suburban cats (neutered or not) go ten or fifteen years or more unless hit by cars. Yeah, an uncastrated male will get into fights and occasionally he'll lose these fights and get beat up, but he'll go right back outside for more. Who are you to keep him inside? The lady cats are out there.
Cats with their own doors are demonstrably happier than confined cats or cats dependant on their humans for door service. Cats with their own doors will crap outside and prefer it that way, eliminating the smell of an inside box. Of course they'll hunt, too, and unless they're wimps they'll catch all kinds of things, greatly supplementing their diet. Let's see _you_ live on meat-flavored cereal your entire life without developing some deitary-deficiency disease or other.
My only objection to the Great Furred Hunters(tm) is that their prey is usually bleeding and the feathers make a terrible mess. Hunting also seems to be the most lucrative in the single-digit hours of the morning, typically when I _least_ want my feline friend to present me with a baby rabbit (an animal capabable of producing a surprising amount of noise!).
Exceeding the recommended torque is not recommended.
We had one of those magnet-detecting cat doors, and had it set to keep the cat inside. She just bashed through it.
I don't see cats killing things as a problem.
If it weren't for the cats, small rodents and birds would proliferate in suburbs, causing potential health problems. They'd be limited only by their food supply, which is approximately equal to human food supplies (mice, in particular, can get into anything that isn't protected by a metal can). When I lived on a dairy farm the cats were regarded as essential to the control of the rodents.
Even in the cities, where your statistics suggest that the cats would eliminate every other living creature, large numbers of birds and rodents survive the decimation wrought by domestic felines. There is simply no shortage of supply.
The "ecosystem" of a suburb is basically that of any other human garden: what the hew-mons want to grow, grows, what the hew-mons don't want gets eliminated. Factor in the humans' tendancy to dislike having small animals infiltrate their pantries and raid their food supplies and you get a several-thousand-year-old friendship between us and these little predators.
Exceeding the recommended torque is not recommended.
Yep, cats are smart enough to stay away from demanding jobs. Cats let dogs handle that stuff.
Havn't you heard News accounts of Male Defactos (or Stepfathers)
torturing (or killing) children that they themselves didn't father?
'Higher form of life?' - Sheesh!!!
.
(David Bowman, EVA near HUGE Monolithic Win-PC in orbit around Jupiter) "My God - its full of Malware!"
Looser AC.