Slashdot Mirror
Europe Heads for the Moon in July
Orlando writes "The BBC are reporting that Arianespace are all set for sending Smart1 to the Moon in July. The mission's primary objectives are testing planetary exploration technologies. This is particularly good news after the recent Arianne rocket explosion." China's also planning a moon mission. The U.S. is planning to sit around and watch.
"The U.S. is planning to sit around and watch. "
Do you ever just sit here and read slashdot and think, "Man, that's a little too easy to troll."
everyone's lunatic
> The U.S. is planning to sit around and watch
No, we're sitting saying, "been there, done that" - among other things at this point.
Michael you ass.
fp
Hey, America's already Been There, Done That.
Here's what we discovered.
As the mighy Allah will have had his righteous revenge on you pig dogs and burned out your eyes with Anthrax laced Big Macs!
America beats you to moon!
they won't think its so cool when they go up there and find the terrible secret of space!
-You're wasting your time. Alfador only likes me.
With all those veiled Internet trolls to whom Art Bell &c. give a voice.
I hope they figure out who owns what before it touches down, too, or we'll end up with frivolous lawsuits aplenty over lunar property rights.
We recently had heard in the office over one of the Yellow Machine that's made by Anthology Solutions.
I for one am glad to see a continued interest in the space program especially after the the recent shuttle disaster. Funding could have easily been reduced out of fear for safety and lack of profitability.
Planetary exploration is all well, but disregarding the current economics of space mining, is there anything on the moon worth mining?
The word 'your' shows posession as in:
"This is your hat. You should wear your hat."
'You're' is a contraction of the words 'you' and 'are' and would've been the appropriate form in this situation. Here's a combination of the two forms that will hopefully clarify the usage:
"Your grammar sucks, and that's why you're teh ghey."
With everyone going to the moon these days, maybe I should get there first and sell moonland to the new guys. Instant profit! :-)
Let's all chip in five bucks and buy Mr. Chirac a ticket.... With any luck (and given their success making successful launches), we'll get to see fireworks!!
Wonder if Europe and China will start a "king of the hill" by knocking over the U.S. flag and posting their own when they get there.
That SMART-1 is a solar-plasma-hall-effect propelled... thing? (I don't know what to call it. "technology demo" would be most fitting)
Anyway, with US short a shuttle, I'd think there should be more of europe stepping up to support the ISS; you know, the *international* space station? of which they are also a part of?
Granted, it'd be the day when you see muslim (like, say, from Saudi) or chinese (as in, from Beijing) flying to the ISS on a regular basis, so maybe it's not that international...
My life in the land of the rising sun.
Well theres the supposed ice in the perpetual shadows of some craters.
And they could only mine to see whats down there to start with, to see how the moon is made up and to determine if it was part of the earth once.
Score 1: Delusional. Any proof to back that up, Kemosabe?
Though space.com has good articles, I think http://www.spacer.com (also going by the name spacedaily.com) has some very nice write-ups. Check out the following three articles on the Chinese space ventures -6 fq.html 9 c7.html
i. China to shoot for the moon after sending man into orbit - http://www.spacedaily.com/2003/030302075956.spawz
ii. China may launch unmanned moon mission in 2005 - http://www.spacedaily.com/2003/030303030843.54odg
iii. Shenzhou's Changing Face - http://www.spacedaily.com/news/china-03j.html
Suhit
When america loses astronaughts their manned space flight shuts down untill years later after an investigation is done. In SOVIET RUSSIA they just kept sending man after man after man up into space. I have a feeling china would do the same damn thing. I'm sure they'll get there eventually.
----
Go canucks, habs, and sens!
This isn't a race. In case you forgot, we visited the moon over 30 years ago. The value of a trip now wouldn't justify the cost. I fully support the space program and realize its importance, but realistically the only reason it's around is for the boost it gives to nationalism.
The U.S. is planning to sit around and watch.
I think it is good that the US government is finally seeing it the way the average joe sees it. them them do it this time...
xao
xao
http://TheHillforum.hopto.org
We've been there. We're going to Mars with 2 rovers in May and July.
That's not sitting and watching.
We'll probably be bombing people at that time. We wouldn't want to divide our brilliant minds between science and bombing, would we?
reality.
Insightful flamebait? You see something new every day...
Well (YOU'RE)absolutely correct.I'm going to just lay down and go to my happy quiet place now and hope i can afford the years of therapy i'm now going to have to endure..
A little competition to get us back on track. We need to take NASA away from the politicians and give it back to the engineers.
It's great that Europe and China are making their first attempts to send robotic probes to the moon. The United States has some experience in this area. Yes, Americans can sit around and watch to see how well the Europeans and Chinese do something that NASA achieved over four decades ago - and repeated dozens of times since.
A bulleted history of US missions to the Moon:
1998 - Lunar Prospector
1994 - Clementine
1972 - Apollo 16,17
1971 - Apollo 14,15
1970 - Apollo 13
1969 - Apollo 10,11,12
1968 - Apollo 8, Surveyor 7
1967 - Lunar Orbiter 3,4,5, Surveyor 3,4,5,6
1966 - Lunar Orbiter 1,2, Surveyor 1,2
1965 - Ranger 8, 9
1964 - Ranger 7
We have a firm commitment to NATO, we are a part of NATO. We have a firm commitment to Europe. We are a part of Europe.
--Dan Quayle
The aliens and their demand we stay off the moon?
I had a sucky sig.
With every day that France delays you fatheads, and now Turkey holding out on your efforts to bribe cooperation, every day your economy worsens and the more everyone else hates you.
>Hey, America's already Been There, Done That.
Where's My Tee-Shirt then? Huh??
Life moves pretty fast; if you don't stop and look around once in a while, you could miss it. -FB
the UN was the one that banned Iraq from possessing those weapons, and the UN was also the one that declared the need for proof of the weapons' destruction.
these weapons are dangerous enough that they can't be left unaccounted for.
humankind won't be able to progress if it's destroyed or held hostage by criminally insane dictators with WMDs.
(this post brought to you by the Trolls Will Always Catch A Post committee.)
Soviet Lunar Missions
http://nssdc.gsfc.nasa.gov/planetary/lu
Recent interplanetary missions
http://www.stellarlink.com/css/
You know, the rest of the world has REALLY stopped 250,000 of our troops from amassing on Iraq's borders. Yeah, you matter. NOT!
Do you really we care that much anymore? When the UN doesn't have the balls to enforce its own resolutions, it doesn't matter much either.
I think it'll be good for us. When the Ruskies got sputnik up there, it really riled us up. A lot of people stepped up and said, "I can do better than that!". "I'll see your satelite and raise you the Moon," they said.
So Europe wants to go to the moon? Good for them. They can have second place, and if it motivates us a bit, we'll see Mars, astroid mining, and the Space Hilton long before I'm visiting the Lunar Beni Hana.
I hope they go there; it'll light a fire under our ass to get back into the swing of things.
There were two, Luna and Zond. (See that link if you trust the federal government). The Soviet missions ran from 1959 to 1976 overall; Luna was the ground mission which picked up three lunar ground samples (Luna 16, 20, 24) and Zond was the satellites that flew over the moon (probably trying to set up a laser defense array or something).
The important thing isn't that moon travel has happened before; it's that it's being seriously considered again.
We recently had heard in the office over one of the Yellow Machine that's made by Anthology Solutions.
Quit your bellyaching and get a reality check. The cool tech most people in China are waiting for is running water. All empire fall, but it is going to be a while still before China uniformly leaves the U.S. in the dust....that is assuming they themselves aren't subverted economically by labor and intellectual capital even cheaper than themselvs. So far they are the low cost choice, but once standards start to rise there, they will also hear that "giant sucking sound" from cheaper locales like every other producer in the free trade world.
You can't breathe up there!
The Russians lost dozens of men due to shoddy safety standards, but they also lost equipment and time. Engineering for safety is not about being cautious, it is about conserving your resources - your trained staff, your equipment, and your time.
If you DONT go in you look like cowards, if you DO go in you look like lying and bribing invaders.
Its a lose-lose for the US.
All the US is going to get out from it is a couple of weeks of your state controlled media whooping it up saying you won the war against terror followed by 10-20 years of finacial instability and still the threat of terrorist attacks.
gg triple chins!
The U.S. is planning to sit around and watch.
Are we supposed to go do it again? Considering we did this four decades ago?
Next time you fuckers can bomb the future Bosnias and Kosovos by yourselves... if the genicide isn't over by the time the French get done dicking around with diplomacy.
So what exactly was the last world problem that Europe actually solved?
Israel has violated UN declarations as well, you never see us huff and puff about them. Probably because there is no significant amount of oil, if any, in Isreal. North Korea readily admits to developing a nuclear program and defying the US, and we don't care too much about them either (no oil). China launches takes and uses its army to kill its own people, including children, it is broadcast live to our livingrooms, and they just get scoled by Bush Sr. "Bad china! Don't do that again!" (No oil). Now when we are in a very depressing economic situation isn't it convenient that the Bush Administration is pulling Iraq out of their hat again. Nothing like bringing up Iraq changes the subject so well eh? Well at least Bushinomics are bringing tax cuts for the rich. Of course the masses are too busy being destracted by Bush and all of his war mongering.
http://www.archive.org/details/ThePowerOfNightmares
The same reason Michael thinks it's worth noting that the US is "just" going to sit and watch is the same reason this article will probably be duped in an hour or two like so many others.
Welcome to 40 years ago.
Isn't amnesia fun?
Ben
Work Safe Porn
humankind won't be able to progress if it's destroyed or held hostage by criminally insane dictators with WMDs.
So when is the next US federal election anyway?
Fascism should more properly be called corporatism, since it is the merger of state and corporate power.
Look, I don't think any of us can really understand the reasons for the Golf War without actually being closely connected with the warring factions. Sure, some of us may say "Is Tiger Woods really that annoying?", but we don't have all the facts. I am just a spectator, and all I can say is BRING ON THE B-52's
1. China will already be there and will have mined all the good moon rocks
2. They will read slashdot and find out that European life is in doubt anyway!
the editor's comments did the trolling for you.
"As an American, I'm getting sick and tired of other countries."
No really...people are almost the same in every country. The only thing that seperates them is their level of ignorance and tolerance for others. Europeans claim tolerance, but can't tolerate Americans. Americans claim tolerance because they can deal with Californians, but they don't know anything else about any other country. Some are just so ignorant that they just make up facts without consulting reality.
You, of course, fall under the very ignorant and cant-tolerate-others categories.
slow down cowboy
...How many of you expected to see the discussion hijacked by the single sentence about Americans opting to Sit and watch,Please, Raise My Hand:-)
Israel has violated UN declarations as well, you never see us huff and puff about them. Probably because there is no significant amount of oil
Or maybe it's because Israel is a Western, democratic civilization who occupies the land it acquired through defeating Arab aggression, in order to attempt to control acts of terrorism against its citizenry, that have been carried out for decades. How many times has Israel attempted to conquer its neighbors? How many times has it used chemical warfare against foreign or domestic parties?
The war the UN waged against Iraq never ended, it simply moved into a cease-fire on the terms that Iraq disarm itself as per the UN's instruction. It hasn't, and over the last decade it's engaged in multiple acts of aggression against UN planes. The last time I checked, the UN didn't go to war against Israel. Maybe they'd rather not have the impossible job of occupying the lands of contention, and 'ensuring' an end of terrorism against Israel.
Iraq is responsible for a piddly 3% of oil exports. The U.S. could invade Central and South American countries for less than it would spend on a war with Iraq, and physically secure more of its personal sources of oil.
So what exactly was the last world problem that Europe actually solved? ..Discovering America.
Did anyone else read "Europa Heads for the Moon in July"?
:)
I guess I should probably get some sleep
Nope, the US is planning sabotage. We can't have all those euro-socialist scumbags find out that we didn't really go there in the 60's. Of course not!
I hear they're planning to send Buzz Aldrin by himself to Europe to personally pummel the ESA's people.
And I hope they get it on tape again!
/^[A-Z0-9._%+-]+@[A-Z0-9.-]+\.[A-Z]{2,4}$/i
The thing I am wondering is when a country will decide to build a space station on L4 or L5 so that they can more easily go to Mars, or other places.
;^)
(For those that don't know, L4 and L5 are the stable Lagrange points, where the gravity of the Earth and Moon are equal. Can be said for any other set of orbiting bodies too, but I am talking about the moon)
Whoever controls L4 and L5 would have the capability to control all travel to Mars,Venus, etc. Not like we will have a manned visit to Venus any time soon
LedgerSMB: Open source Accounting/ERP
What we really need is some kind of international space agency that any country could contribute to. We'd be able to claim things for humankind rather than bickering about country lines. Plus, we could get alot more done with resources from many countries. Of course, this is unfeasible as all hell for the world to get along.
Actually I get and watch Fox News, CNN, BBC, SKy News, Euro News, CCTV (Chinese), and some India news channel I forget the name of. All with their own views and sides to the news.
What the f*ck does a typical US person get to watch? A state controlled biased propoganda news channel? And you call us ignorant?
This is totally offtopic until Iraq threatens to nuke the moon. But let me answer your idiotic points -- yes Iraq has not accounted for chem weapons; we know this not because they declared it (since you're so anxious to believe them) but because we (i.e. the USA) SOLD THE FUCKING WEAPONS TO THEM. Then we stood idly by and watched them gas their own people with them, and Rumsfeld didn't miss the chance for a photo-op shaking hands with Saddam at the time. For the US to get high and mighty about this shit 20 years later is fucking ridiculous. And finally since when is mere possession of chem weapons grounds for war? Hussein is no more "criminally insane" than Musharaff (whose country, don't forget, has had NUKES as well as chems since the 80s, and has openly threatened to use them against India in the very recent past), or any other fucking tinpot tyrant with access to nasty weapons. Hussein may be a cruel dictator but he's not suicidal and like most state leaders, he will do what is in his best interest -- threatening the US with an unprovoked chemical attack is not there. Now, using chems or whatever else in response to a US attack on Iraq -- that's a much more likely scenario. And its one that the criminals currently in power in the US had better start taking seriously otherwise American lives will be sacrificed to their shortsightedness.
'scuse me? I missed the part where Bush gassed Northern California, or sent the entire DNC to slave labor camps. Fucking moron.
Enough of our heroic men are buried there so Europe would have the opportunity to be 40 years late getting to the moon.
Like they say about California -- it's the cheese. Miles and miles of green cheese. Mmmmm, cheese.....
The parent post makes a good point.
i like my women like i like my coffee
in a plastic cup
dms0
-= world leaders choose world leaders not us, not a democracy, not a revolution! =-
Which is important because after a long day of working in the mines, nothing is better than a nice cold beverage, preferably scotch on the rocks. We need that ice!!!
The most dangerous person on the planet to other human beings today is... not Saddam Hussein. The poster also said nothing about Americans, he mentioned humankind. Are you a member?
Fascism should more properly be called corporatism, since it is the merger of state and corporate power.
This the same conflict the US were scared to commit ground troops as they still had hang ups from Vietnam about fighting on the ground? The same conflict were the US tried to take over the actual control of it from the designated NATO leaders? And is this the same conflict the US set up black op bases without the knowledge of UN/NATO and armed the KLF against the law of not providing any side with arms? And were caught spying on their allies?
And now you wonder why you are not liked!?!
When you can make your own craters in Iraq?
Now if there was oil on the Moon...
it would imply life
or a leaky spaceship
or astronauts frying food...
What is the inverse of the Matrix?
It's funny to see how cold war thinking still infects US minds. The "space race" was only a "race" because the US desparately wanted to prove that US society was superior; in part, this was because right after WWII, the Soviet model actually seemed to be working pretty well in terms of economics and science, and it looked for a while as if the Soviets were going to take over pretty much the rest of the world. In contrast, after WWII, Europeans didn't really care about anybody proving superiority to anyone anymore, they just wanted to live in peace and prosperity. Big guns, big rockets, or big words stopped impressing Europeans. This is perhaps also why Bush finds it so hard to get much support for his current adventures.
The moon isn't going anywhere. Missions to it (as all space exploration) should be driven by available technology, resources, and scientific goals, not by some horse race mentality.
Why kill your own citizens? Bush has enough fun blowing up innocent afghans...
Oh but its a war on terror! Thats different then!
those who control the past, control the future. those who control the present, control the past.
Which part of the water atom goes bang and makes rockets move?
The most dangerous person on the planet to other human beings today is... not Saddam Hussein.
Okay, I agree on this, but who would you like to nominate for that position? Do I even need to ask?
we are planning just to do the staged moon landing thing and save a few bucks.
Our alternative plan is to secretly sew our flag inside another countries flag (with the outer flag being UV sensitive).
Wonder what they are doing in Soviet Russia?
Damn, they never told me continental drift was that bad.
Apparently, the Chinese are going up there to mine - they don't have enough dirt in their country. As if that weren't bad enough, here's a not-so-subtle dig at us:
"I should point out that some powers in the world are on the way to militarizing outer space, not peacefully exploring outer resources," Huang Huikang, an official from China's foreign ministry, told the China Daily.
Umm, yeah. I think Huang's been watching too many Austin Powers films. I'm surprised he didn't mention the "reckless" and "provocative" Alan Parsons Project, which threatens the peace of the whole world. They may be disappointed when they reach the moon only to find that we haven't turned it into a "Death Star" (finger quotes) and that there is no secret moon base, just a big pile of space dirt.
Meanwhile, western Europe's got to try to prove to themselves that they still matter to the world by getting in on the action. Whatever they need for their own sense of self esteem, I guess. When's Canada going to the moon?
Go ahead, moderate as flamebait... my karma can stand it.
The U.S. is planning to sit around and watch.
no the US is going to figure out what killed seven of our astronoughts before we kill any more. Plus continue other projects into deeper space than the moon. I just love the way the comment is phrased. Bash us for our genuinly stupid foreign policy, you can point to good fodder with Bush and his "kill all brown people" policies without making up ways to poke the space program. But of course bashing the US for anything and everything is an internatial pastime, some of it well deservered. NASA however, is the least deserving of bashing.
-- Insert wisdom here:
Israel has violated UN declarations as well, you never see us huff and puff about them. Probably because there is no significant amount of oil, if any, in Isreal. North Korea readily admits to developing a nuclear program and defying the US, and we don't care too much about them either (no oil).
We sure as hell do care about North Korea. And don't even tell me anything Israel has done is even comparable to what Saddam Hussein has done. Israel has not killed 150,000 of its own people with mustard gas and VX. This is what boggles my mind when people make these ridiculous comparisons between Iraq and any other country, or between Saddam Hussein and any other world leader. Not even Slobodan Milosevic was worse than Saddam Hussein. Hussein is directly responsible for far more deaths of both his own and his enemies' people, and in far more gruesome ways.
The oil argument in general is absurd to begin with. The best thing for oil prices and the economy would be for us to cool it and say "ok, Iraq's complying, everything's fine". If this were about oil, that's what we'd do - that's what would make our own oil companies happy. But this is not about oil. I suspect we will see what it's really about sometime down the road, as I suspect our government knows more than it's letting on - but even what it has let on to this point as well as what Hussein himself has done publicly would be more than enough to land Saddam Hussein in jail for the rest of his life (or worse, if he were a common citizen in the US), and is more than enough to justify his removal from power, forcibly if necessary.
who would you like to nominate for that position?
At the moment, the single person who has the potential to kill the most human beings through one irrational act would have to be the leader of North Korea.
At the moment, the single person who has the potential to kill the most human beings through coldly calculated, profit motivated war would be the leader of the United States of America.
You didn't have to ask, you already knew it.
Fascism should more properly be called corporatism, since it is the merger of state and corporate power.
"What do you mean you forgot to include oxygen for their trip home?"
What the hell!? America...state controlled media? HAHAHAHA! That seriously had to be the most idiotic and ignorant statement I've heard all year...and I'm not exaggerating.
America has the most free press in the world. There is absolutely nothing state controlled about it. If any government official ever came close to trying to censor or restrict the media, everyone in America would scream bloody murder.
In America, we also have worldwide news channels... well, at least those with satellites or broadband cable get them. For those who don't, we still get CNN, Fox News, MSNBC, local news, local newspapers, the internet, etc. Our press is generally liberal, usually questioning the governent rather than supporting it. But of course, knowing your ignorance and paranoia of Americans, I bet you'd claim that these are all state controlled as well.
At the moment, the single person who has the potential to kill the most human beings through coldly calculated, profit motivated war would be the leader of the United States of America.
You mean as opposed to simply for the thrill of it, like Saddam Hussein?
I often wonder how people would react if George Bush killed 150,000 New Yorkers with mustard gas because we were getting on his nerves. Protesting against the war? Hit 'em with some VX!
How long do you think Bush would last in power? About 5 minutes. How long has Saddam Hussein lasted? 15 or more years since he did it. He did it to the Iranians as well as to his own people too. And the only reason he didn't do it to us is because we threatened to nuke Baghdad if he did. Sounds harsh, but that's war. It saved a lot of American lives in the end.
You're trying to tell us all that George Bush is more dangerous than Saddam Hussein. I'm sorry, but much as I hate Bush (and I did not vote for him, nor would I again), that is simply offensive. Completely offensive. Not just as an American, but as a human being. People who use mustard gas on their own countrymen are not to be defended, however much you dislike their enemy's policies. Saddam Hussein is not the lesser of two evils.
And this whole oil argument was used in 1991 too. Try to come up with something original. The results of that war should have been pretty conclusive proof that it's not about oil - we wouldn't even let him sell it afterwards. Use your freakin' head.
The U.S. is planning to sit around and watch
why is everyone like, "well, we already did it."
sure we already did it. And I already backed the server up last week, so why do it again?
we sure didn't learn everything we could from a mere 7 landings!
Yes, but what good is that if your market share is only 2% ??? TI owns the market.
Welcome to the 1960s.
Yet another signature that refers to itself. The irony and humor is dead.
That would be the conflict where NATO's management system became a total joke and targets were selected by commitees (Kosovo to you uninformed.)
Funny thing is, it was still the US doing most of the work. Seemed to end the conflict too, even if it wasn't pretty. Wonder why NATO wasn't invited to go to Afghanistan with us? There's your answer.
apparently, the bang comes from both parts when you put them together.
It was me, I did it, I moved your cheese
Why does every non-American think the only news channel we get if Fox? I realize that Murdoch has the money to get that channel into nearly every market. This is usually just another example of Euros thinking they know something and providing evidence of their own ignorance.
BTW, I get pretty much all the same channels you do above and probably many more. There's this recent technology call Digital Cable that allows about 800 channels to beam straight to my living room (and we aren't even going to start counting web sources.) My personal favorite is ITV, but also get a kick out of NHK.
What media outlet in the US is state controlled anyway? The closest you can get to it is NPR, which is pretty liberal.
Why don't they just send the french ahead to check the place for truffles or something.
Well if Europe goes to the moon then that will help the US get the full support of the Security Council .... won't it?
"She's a West Texas girl, just like me" - G.W Bush Iraqis
Its late, I'm tired.
Oh, hang on, I get it.
1. Go to the Moon.
2. ???
3. Profit!
After all, it worked for the US.
You guys all missed the cool part, they're doing it with an ion drive! Science Fiction technology at work, folks...
1 Euro == 1.08 Dollars
When is we canuckians gonna land on the moon, we do have the know how, and we are one of the few countries that has the money, Surplus, oh yah, so why? I ask why we don't
People who use mustard gas on their own countrymen are not to be defended, however much you dislike their enemy's policies.
And what of the country who sells it to them? What is their moral position?
The results of that war should have been pretty conclusive proof that it's not about oil - we wouldn't even let him sell it afterwards.
It's not about oil, I never said it was. It's about taking US taxpayer dollars and laundering them via shares in munitions companies and landing the residue in the accounts of a who's who of the rich and powerful in America.
Use your freakin' head.
I do. I use it to look behind the scenes, never taking what the media feeds me and thinking about the real motive behind things. Take the current situation. Saddam Hussein is the leader of a country. He is a heinous human being and the leadership of the US has repeatedly told the public through the media that the US needs to do something about that. That something is war.
Why not simply send in a 3 man assassination squad and get it done? Not enough media, no profits for United Defense and no innocents die. Do you think this would ever happen? What world are you living in?
You're trying to tell us all that George Bush is more dangerous than Saddam Hussein.
Who has the potential to order the deaths of more human beings over the next 6 months? That's the only point I'm trying to make.
Fascism should more properly be called corporatism, since it is the merger of state and corporate power.
The first cut? Nope. Science benefits in times like these. The US government is the biggest VC in world history. Of course, it depends what you're researching. You can map technological innovation almost directly to the time leading up to conflicts and the conflict itself. It's only in very recent history that commerical use has been a driving force (and that doesn't pay for big research, high-risk research.)
This is basically what the history books say about the Vikings and North America--technically first, but who cares. Columbus and the English (and French, Spanish Germans, Dutch in descending order) get the recognition.
That, of course, begs the question as to what indeginous Moon people Eurasia will replace when they do colonize the Moon, but let's not go there, shall we?
-- @rjamestaylor on Ello
While the US gave all their thrust to the Space Shuttle, Arianne has proved to be a LOT cheaper way of putting new satelites in orbit.
With all the security risks in the Shuttle program it's really nice to see ESA take over.
Sci-fi tech has nothing to do with it. Ion drives have been around for over 30yrs. Just check JPL or NASA Glen. While Ion drives are cool, they're not as neat as Hall Thrusters.
The Arabs were fine in there before the Israelis decided to come and steal their land. If someone invaded your land wouldn't you fight back?
Israel invaded and occupied parts of Egypt and Lebanon in case you forgot.
I believe you to be correct regarding the chemical warfare. However Israel does possess nuclear weapons as well as the means to deliver them.
You are also right regarding the cease-fire. Regarding the planes I do not remember if the no-fly zones were UN or US mandated.
There also was terrorism against Serbians in Kosovo. There still is. Yet NATO put their asses inside regardless.
Iraq would export more oil if it was allowed to. Regarding the US invading Central and South American countries: they already did! Little point in invading countries that already willingly provide you with oil. Most of them already have US controlled puppet rulers or soon will once be again controlled by US puppets.
Planetary exploration is all well, but disregarding the current economics of space mining, is there anything on the moon worth mining?
Even NOT disregarding current economics, a Helium-3 mining facility would be technically (as well as economically) feasible.
Wow. This might be the first new land they've set foot on without surrendering!
Oh, you're not stuck, you're just unable to let go of the onion rings.
Or maybe it's because Israel is a Western, democratic civilization who occupies the land it acquired through defeating Arab aggression, in order to attempt to control acts of terrorism against its citizenry, that have been carried out for decades.
Israel is located around the same neighbourhood as its Arab neighbours, and yet they are Western? Assuming this is so, is it then absolutely fine for a Western civilization to invade their non-western neighbours?
How many times has Israel attempted to conquer its neighbors?
Last I checked about half of Israel is conquered land.
How many times has it used chemical warfare against foreign or domestic parties?
How the hell would you know? I mean, seriously... While Americans keep a very close watch on Communist and Arab states, they don't give a rat's ass about what Israel are doing. They kill unarmed women, children and old folks just because they happen to live in the same neighbourhood of some wanted terrorists.
Sure the UN is not at war with Israel... the US owns the UN... the US also happens to be good friends with Israel. Israel will be free to do whatever the hell it wants as long as good old Uncle Sam is up there. But as the saying goes, every dog has its day... you just won't know when the day will come.
Welley Corporation - SLM Scammers
Well, power is cheap for starters. There's a lot of He3 for fusion, or you can just roll out a bunch of solar panels (made locally, of course!).
Once you've got power, you can do a lot. Shipping stuff into orbit is easy; a laser-based propulsion system will lift stuff of the Moon readily. Heck, even if all you can lift off is moon rocks, you can use that as construction material, you know.
Furthermore, the Moon is thought to be geologically like the Earth's mantle. You know, the top bit where we get all of our metals and minerals from. If that is the case, the Chinese could reasonably expect to mine metals up there, and use those for construction materials.
The point here is that you don't have to ship the stuff back down to Earth to be useful. You can leave it in orbit and use it there; orbital shipyards, anyone?
Of course, if you can ship it back to Earth, then you've got a weapon of enormous potential. A few tons of rock coming in at orbital velocities makes a big splash. And don't think that hasn't been thought of by the Chinese, either. Ever read "The Moon Is A Harsh Mistress"?
"Software is too expensive to build cheaply"
Most of the people there are saying "no!". Aren't you supposed to be democratic about this thing, too?
Europeans will be the first ones!
"The craft is using an innovative form of propulsion - an ion thruster - that will take it on a 15-month spiral to the Moon."
I don't know what an ion thruster is, but it sure seems slow to me.
Why is this innovative? Why is it so slow? How will this be a good propulsion mechanism if we really need to go faster, faster, faster to get anywhere in any kind of reasonable time?
dpete4552 wrote:
> Israel has violated UN declarations as well, you never see
> us huff and puff about them. Probably because there is
> no significant amount of oil, if any, in Isreal.
Israel has great religious significance to the religious right, a strong faction of the republican party, and the part of it currently in the White House. Not only do we not huff and puff, we send them aid and sell them many weapons. But then we helped Iraq obtain the very biological, chemical, and nuclear weapons we now accuse them of still having.
> North Korea readily admits to developing a nuclear
> program and defying the US, and we don't care too much
> about them either (no oil).
North Korea was a major blunder on Bush's part. North and South Korea are in the process of reuniting into one Korea, which Bush didn't approve of. Bush made a bunch of warlike rhetoric, talking about taking on Iraq, "axis of evil", blah, blah, blah. N. Korea got scared, and started making nuclear noises. It isn't clear that they actually have any working nukes, but fear that they exist has thus far deterred the US from attacking. The US had their fuel oil supplies cut off, leaving them only nuclear plants to heat their homes, which they started up. Unfortunately, we did not keep our 1994 promise to build nice peaceful light water reactors, so the only ones they have to heat their homes with also make the material for nuclear weapons. And up and up it escalates. Bush has been told repeatedly by N. Korea's neighbors to sit down and talk to them, but I guess that would ruin his plans for Korean War II.
> China launches takes and uses its army to kill its own
> people, including children, it is broadcast live to our
> livingrooms, and they just get scoled by Bush Sr. "Bad
> china! Don't do that again!" (No oil).
China produces oil, about the same amount as the US itself. China is too big to swallow whole, making diplomacy the route that the US has chosen to deal with this situation. Of course, diplomacy could solve most of the stuff Bush wants to go to war over, even Iraq. In diplomacy, you have give and take. In war, you have conquer and rule. The latter is more fun, but only if you are the president of the conquering nation.
> Now when we are in a very depressing economic
> situation isn't it convenient that the Bush Administration
> is pulling Iraq out of their hat again. Nothing like
> bringing up Iraq changes the subject so well eh?
You think this is depressing, just wait. The new budget has a $300 billion deficit (mostly Homeland Security, as a lot of other stuff got cut), not counting Iraq costs. The war could be $50 to $200 billion (depending on who you talk to) without reconstruction costs. State and local governments are in deep financial trouble, with no help coming from the federal government.
What does this mean to you and me? Well, not only is the US not going to the Moon anytime soon, but between insane gas prices and badly maintained roads, we are going to have a heck of a time getting to work. Assuming we have jobs...
> Well at least Bushinomics are bringing tax cuts for the
> rich.
So the rich get richer, and the rest of us have billions more government debt, no decent government services, and all of our own problems to boot. Great system for a feudal kingdom constantly running off to the Crusades (if you don't mind an occasional Robin Hood), but very bad for a 21st century USA.
> Of course the masses are too busy being destracted by
> Bush and all of his war mongering.
Public opinion worldwide, including the US, is against this war. In every member state of the coalition of the "willing", the leaders are joining in defiance of their people's wishes, and at risk to their careers. The peace movement is huge, organized, and extremely active: whether it's getting 10+ million people to protest on the same day in 60 countries and 600 locations, or organizing a call/fax/email your US senator and president day for 400,000 people (with, oops, over 1 million actually participating)! The unions in the US have come out against the war, so I would expect a lot more people to get undistracted quite quickly.
And, yes, those against the war know what it is doing to our economy. That is one of many, many reasons to oppose the war.
"All our tomorrows, Great Sun, by the Light, are very forgotten.
The Light dies. We pray and it sleeps."
"Oh Peace Oh Light Return" (national song of mourning) from "Gojira" (Godzilla) 1954
of course, neither of the groups you mentioned were the first to 'discover' the continent we call america. the "natives" have been here for what, thousands of years? and furthermore they have colonized most of the massive continent quite fruitfully and almost peacefully in some places.
if your analogy holds, perhaps we will find the grey aliens on the moon coexisting with eachother, waiting for some dominant english/norwegian/columbus/spaniard folk to genocide them...
GENERATION 26: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation.
"Israel has violated UN declarations as well, you never see us huff and puff about them."
.. Funny, I seem to recall Bush pushing for hybrid cars in his State of the Union address. Here's a man who can see that reducing our massive consumption of oil will allow us to get the hell out of the shithole that is the Middle East.
Israel is also a) an ally and b) has the economy and scientific community to build nuclear weaponry if they feel like it.
"North Korea readily admits to developing a nuclear program and defying the US, and we don't care too much about them either."
We don't care? Oh, we care. However, we're not stupid enough to start a nuclear war by attacking a country that's ruled by a madman.
"China launches takes and uses its army to kill its own people, including children, it is broadcast live to our livingrooms, and they just get scoled by Bush Sr."
Where can I find these broadcasts? Are they similar to the rounding up and imprisoning of Japanese Americans during World War II? The Native Americans a few dozen years earlier?
Let's ignore the fact that China has a) nuclear weapons and b) a population base large enough to require massive drafting if we piss them off and thus are forced into war with her.
"Well at least Bushinomics are bringing tax cuts for the rich."
If you can buy a computer, yet not invest in the stock market or elsewhere to reap the benefits of Bush's plans, you have yourself to blame.
Consumers who think they need to buy everything they see on TV aren't the product of Bush's economic planning. Most of the current issues with the economy aren't a result of anything Bush has done - the economy is never a product of the president that currently resides in office. The economy sucks? Then lay proper blame - the previous eight years of Clinton and the jackasses who blew up the WTC.
As for 'oil this, oil that!'
A pity the whining liberals will slam down his motions in Congress, and then blame him for the same.
if launch costs from earth come down to $10/kg, the estimated 1 trillion litres of water at the pole ==> $10trillion worth of water sitting waiting for someone to sell to wandering space explorers.
The Singularity is closer than you think
Quant
"The U.S. is planning to sit around and watch. "
;)
2 9/1.ht ml
With all those Echelon surveillance gear installed in almost every european country the U.S. will have at least a bright and clear picture of what is going on up there.
Read this
http://www.heise.de/tp/english/inhalt/te/69
for more information.
So, you think the slashdot crowd is interested in science for the sake of science?
...RIGHT?
The first thing that happens when some other country tries to go to the moon is that there's nooo reason to do it, it's been done... the us has already won...
and we all know that science is about winning right?
not about the pursuit of knowledge.
America won science 40 years ago...
and of course ESA is planning to test equipment on the moon for nationalistic reasons...
becuase Europe is a nation?
If this story tells us anything, it'd have to be that technology is at a point where it's economically feasible to go to the moon for scientific reasons...
of course we can do incredible things if there are political reasons to do it... but what can we do for purely scientific reasons?
In my mind a far more interesting question.
Would have thought the slashdot crowd had the same interest in science.. but I guess I was wrong.
"I don't know that Atheists should be considered as citizens, nor should they be considered patriots." -George H.W. Bush
Hmm... What about the railroads? Automobile industry? Telephone? Utilities? Printing press.... Any industrial process related to mining... Navies, even those driven by conquistidors Were driven for economic reasons first. If there was a barren wasteland in the new world, you can bet that the old world would've stopped sending ships to it...it would've cost too much for no return. And, if you look at war, there are a number of things that start it, and certainly economic factors take a big part of this. They have more money than us, let's raid them. They have control over a parcel of land that has X natural resources, let's take it from them...
I saw that movie, they never go "to the moon" they go around it. And while I am too lazy to look the rest of these missions up, I am not convinced they all landed on the moon and then returned.
I bang your littler sister's cooter.
on going to the moon via a solid fuel rocket will earn some money.
It's the 1960's calling, they want their technology back
nuff said!
Fredrik
"I think of it as the beginning ... of the archeology mission," laughs Rayman. "DS1 is still going around the sun in a roughly circular orbit between Earth and Mars -- perfect for a time capsule."
o gy /ds1_archeology_021220.html
http://www.space.com/businesstechnology/technol
Or that little place in England... what's it called. Cambridge. I heard there's a guy there, name's Stephen Hawking? Oh, and we can't forget David Deutsch, he's also there... created quantum computing and all.
Biotech? Dolly the sheep, first successfully cloned animal. That was in Europe. And then there's the Oxford AIDS vaccine. And with the current attitude towards stem cell research, a lot of the American resarch is moving towards Europe and other areas of the world more friendly to it.
Computer Science? Tim Berners-Lee creating the web while working at CERN? Opera is a company in Norway. I suppose that's all pretty unimportant. And I don't think there's any good wireless stuff coming out of Europe either. I mean, there's that little Nokia company, but what do they do?
I heard this guy, called Linus Torvalds, was a Fin (okay, he's moved to the US now). And there's Alan Cox, in the UK.
And what about the brand spanking new American Advanced Encryption Standard (AES) to replace the aging DES, well, that's also known as Rijndael, and was developed in Belgium, I believe.
Or how about major engineering projects? How about the Channel Tunnel?
You know, I can go on like this for ages.
doubt they'll let europe and china use the same movieset to plant their flags...
PjotrP
Yes. Or admit that the USA has passed its prime as a society and is now on the slow slide into cultural and moral decay. It is not what you did in the past, it is what have you done lately that counts.
People like you have been declaring the "death of America" for the past hundred or so years. Our slide into "cultural and moral decay" is the reason why Japan thought we wouldn't fight back after Pearl Harbor, the reason why the USSR thought we needed to be forced into Communism, the reason why everybody thought Japan was going to whip our butts in the 70s and 80s and why on September 11th a bunch of terrorists thought that they could blow up the Twin Towers without any retribution.
Heck, you can even go back to the founding of this nation when the wise Europeans didn't think we would last more than a couple years at best.
America has been underestimated for pretty much its entire existence.
NASA's "focus" for the past two decades has been to build a space station and a shuttle to get to it. After the moon landings this is a pretty logical next step.
Unfortunately we have ran into more technical and engineering challenges that we would have liked. But we tried. Now we have to move forward and figure out what to do next. However, you cannot start comparing us to the Chinese and Europeans until after they have landed on the moon and asked themselves "what's next?".
BTW, we have sent up a ton of different mission including the Hubble Telescope and the Mars Pathfinder. These have generally been "side projets" in comparison to the grand vision, but any one of these would be considered a "tremendous accomplishment" to China or Europe.
Brian Ellenberger
OMG!!! Europe is already so infested by Smarts that we are sending some on the Moon!!!
I'm fat, you're ugly. I can get slimmer, and you?
How nice of you to mention the first man to the US race... kinda puts the "we did that 40 years ago" attitude into perspective doesn't it? Europe was murdering indians loooooong before you guys even thought of killing iraqi's.... (and Europe is putting on their "been there, done that" stance?)
PjotrP
We all know the French cheese reserve will be empty in 2017. They've got to find a replacement source before.
Nice page on what else is going on with space missions...
You are not root, go away.
...when I saw this was to wonder why ESA was sending an automobile to the moon.
Whoo! I guess satellite computers were pretty smart.
People will pass up steak once a week, for crap every day.
I think it's really disgusting how some people can actually say: "Oh, that's been done already. Fsck the Chineese and Europe, America rules!"
Folks, America is dying, and at the risk of being offtopic, this story is just more proof. Here, the rest of the major countries of the world with the resources to fly missions to the moon are finnaly going to go ahead with it, and all you can do is scoff? Laugh, and pretend you look so cool because you're "American"? Everyday there are a buttload of articles right here on
Not to oversimplify too much, but I don't think the rest of the world sucks dispite all this, simply because we sent some guys in a rocket to the moon. America is great, we have lots of cool things and privilages many other places in the world don't. And every single day we come closer and closer to losing it, because we're too busy worrying about what everyone else is doing.
Wake up, I can actually smell your hypocrisy.
CAn'T CompreHend SARcaSm?
This will allow us (european) to check if there is really an american flag there.
capture the flag party.....
that the US isn't threatening war against nations researching space travel in the name of 'national security'
"Funny thing is, it was still the US doing most of the work. Seemed to end the conflict too, even if it wasn't pretty. Wonder why NATO wasn't invited to go to Afghanistan with us? There's your answer."
We didn't need to send the whole of NATO, just John Simpson of the BBC!
Anyway aren't the US part of NATO. And I know the Brits were definitely there.
No, the US is planning to create its own lunar surface in the Middle East
Offtopic, but I have seen your sig quite a few times now, and I have a little karma saved up...
I am not sure if it escapes people's memory, but the US did give war a chance. Remember the war a little while back in Iraq? What did that leave us with? In fact, what did ANY WAR that US has fought since WWII leave us with?
So, that's not leaving a very good track record. Before anybody start spewing off stuff about Afganastan being a successful lil excursion, I'd like to remind everyone that a) the US trained the taliban - something people tend to forget conveniently for some reason, and b) Bush's energy certainly does not seem to be focused on Afgan restoration, or locating Bin Laden, who is still at large, after nearly a year and half being supposedly the most wanted man on the planet.
Even if we assumed that the US can get some kind of act together and indeed do things properly - overthrow Saddam, rebild Iraq, etc. It is also something to mention that muslim countries often were never accustomed to democracy and it isn't something that's wanted anyhow - there are examples of citizens voting themselves a new king, whose whole campain was "I will do away with this democracy shit if I get elected." That's not to mention US's nonchalance toward other non-democratic countries, a good example being, say, Kuwait.
Moreover, I am sure most people are familiar with the UN weapon's inspector's stance of "golly, nuclear weapons is not exactly an easy thing to hide, and we can't find any of them" right? Even US's "strong" allie, UK, admits that from the evidence available, it is quite impossible for Sadam to get anything near nukes for quite some time (several election terms, if you don't mind).
Now, back to the point - If US was able to do things properly, and for the right reasons, does the war has to start, NOW? When the stock market takes a plunge at every mention of war? when the economy is not seen as recovering? Spending a few hundred billion waging a war for no logical reasons is, frankly, beyond description.
The only real intention I can conclude about Bush is that he is either incredibly stupid and don't realize this, or he realizes this but don't care as long as there is good for himself and his few good friends. Enron execs gets off to a nice retirement with 200 millions but MCI / A.Anderson execs gets jail time? Bush simply does not come off as the most morally straight person, which, again, puts doubts into me that he is doing this for moral reasons.
So, yeah, I would give war a chance, if only this president has demonstrated either some capability of analysis, foreign policy, morality, etc. You know, presidential stuff. It's a shame that he runs head-first into this and seems so sure of himself that a large portion just goes with the flow and assumes that this is leadership, when it's in fact something awful and repugnent, be it stupidity or corruption.
My life in the land of the rising sun.
Shouldn't it just be kinda cool that we are going to the moon again - instead of all this 'us and them' shite?
Well... the money has gone from NASA to DOD :-/
You do realise that the U.S. helped him do this, don't you?
This was a while back when the current enemy flavour of the month was Iran, and the U.S. would aid anyone who would oppose Iran.
Malike Bamiyi wanted my assistance.
However, we're not stupid enough to start a nuclear war by attacking a country that's ruled by a madman.
There seems to be a big fashion for people to call certain world leaders they don't like 'madmen'. Now, while I'll agree this is a nice easy way of demonising someone without having to explain it, you should also consider this.
I know of another country where, if you asked to inspect their weapons, you would go away with laughter spittle on your face. They are known to have chemical weapons, biological weapons and nuclear weapons. Hell, they even turned away U.N. inspectors, who they seem to be acknowledging as an authority right now. Not that this country believes in an idea of authority which is not them and only them.
This country has stuck its nose into foreign affairs, starting wars in its interest, at a rate of about 3 a decade, ever since the fifties.
This country is also led by a bunch of religious fanatics.
And they blatantly have an ambition to extend their control over the world.
And unlike other countries, this country is waving its weapons in a threatening manor.
You may have guessed that this country is the U.S.
Malike Bamiyi wanted my assistance.
I missed the part where Bush gassed Northern California.
Westeners seem to not like the fact that the U.S. had a part in the gassing of Kurds.
Malike Bamiyi wanted my assistance.
You're trying to tell us all that George Bush is more dangerous than Saddam Hussein.
Quiz: since 1950 which country has started more unprovoked attacks?
Malike Bamiyi wanted my assistance.
Did you remember the name of the Country who helped America during it's independance war ? :-)
...we will stop at nothing to achieve our goal!
And that is why their goal is so clever. It's completely undefinable or measurable. Who's to say when the war on terror is won? When the people responsible for the WTC attacks are brought to justice? When every last terrorist is dead? When all potential terrorists are dead? Until we say so we can go and attack whoever the hell we want and have it supported by the public hidden under the banner of 'patriotism'. It's just such a brilliant plan!
Malike Bamiyi wanted my assistance.
...The U.S. is planning to sit around and watch.
No, no. They're far too busy trying to take control of this planet.
Malike Bamiyi wanted my assistance.
Humanity needs to get off this planet, and a permanent mission on the Moon will be a good first step. If it does nothing more than mine fuel and put it into lunar orbit for use by other missions, it will have paid for itself.
I'm old enough to remember the Apollo missions; how vividly I recall that day in July 1969, when the words "Tranquility Base here: the 'Eagle' has landed." came crackling over my transistor radio. Years later, when I took my own children to see "Apollo 13", I tried to explain to them what it was like back then, when we used to fly to the Moon. They asked me why we were going any more, and I didn't have a good answer. Still don't.
So, three cheers for the Chinese and the Euros, and God speed to them.
[this
"Hall thrusters have been operating on Russian satellites since the early 1970s.
r es earch/hallth.htm
Hall Thruster Basics:
Hall thrusters consist of plasma inside an axis-symmetric channel with inner and outer magnetic poles that construct a radial magnetic field (see Figure 1). An anode at the propellant injector and an external cathode establish an axial electric field. Thrust is created in two ways in the Hall thruster. The first way is through electrostatic acceleration of Xenon ions. Neutral Xenon gas is injected at the back of the thruster, which also acts as the anode. An external cathode, or electron source, emits electrons outside the thruster. Some of these electrons enter the thruster and collide with the neutral Xenon atoms to form positive Xenon ions and more electrons. The Xenon ions are then accelerated axially out of the thruster by the potential difference that exits between the internal anode and the external cathode. This acceleration of ions is one of the ways thrust is produced. The second way involves electron trapping. Electrons enter the thruster from cathode, and they are also created inside the thruster during the ionization process. These electrons are drawn towards the anode by the electric field existing between the anode and cathode, but once they gain velocity, they are quickly deflected and accelerated azimuthally by the magnetic field. This is often called the Hall effect and arises from what is generally referred to as the Lorentz force (F = qE + qv x B). This azimuthal trapping of electrons promotes ionization of neutral Xenon atoms and also creates thrust through a magnetic pressure force exerted by the electrons on the magnets."
SOURCE:
http://web.mit.edu/dept/aeroastro/www/labs/SPL/
So Europe wants to go to the moon? Good for them. They can have second place
Second? Surely you mean third, at least as far as unmanned missions go. The Russians had unmanned probes on the Moon before the US did.
It's official. Most of you are morons.
... in bombing a "3rd world" dictatur, than in space programs !
:o)
Anyway, if they plan to go to war agains every world dictatur, i do think the moon will never see again a "start'n stripe" before next millenium
At the same time, china is moving forward !
By the way, what is the US policy against the new atomic demonstration that north corea is doing those days ?!? Did we all have to wait for an incoming bomb ?
-SLK
Sorry buddy, you're about 20 years too late.
An American named Dennis Hope thinks he owns (0wnZ?) all of the planets in the Solar system sans Earth.
http://www.moonshop.com/
http://www.lunarembassy.com/
Of course, it could be complete bollocks.
The sheep make the men nervous! ;)
America has the most free press in the world. There is absolutely nothing state controlled about it.
1 6
Actually the US ranks 17th in press freedom. There are 13 European countries with more press freedom than the US:
http://www.rsf.fr/article.php3?id_article=41
A quote from the article:
"The poor ranking of the United States (17th) is mainly because of the number of journalists arrested or imprisoned there."
Why is it that Americans are so jealous of Europeans? Maybe because in Europe the streets are not filled by unemployed nigger fags with guns?
Until very recently, most of Europe lived in a condition that was little better than a 3rd world country.
The europeans are tired, old, and care more about living quietly until they die than in accomplishing anything.
I salute the chinese, but the europeans? They'd rather smoke pot, stay goofy-happy, and then quietly die while somebody else pays for their pathetic little apartment and medicient to help them forget they're now officially irrelevant.
But hey, doesn't BMW make nice cars?
"So the US won an arbitary race they contrived."
False. The moon was always the prize.
How does it feel to live in an apartment, not own a car and bitch at the US?
In the US, our hillbillies have a better life than you.
But hey, you've got socialized medicine, and no freedom of speech, so I guess you're morally superior.
You are something to pity and laugh at.
The US doesn't have to think about trying to get astronauts/scientists/whatever up to the moon. They're going to create an earthbound version right here in the coming months.
It will be the latest Disney style theme park, bringing the wonders of the rest of the world, and now the universe, home to the good old USA, so Americans don't have to venture outside their wonderful borders and find out the reality of what's out there!
Pisses you off that the US invented the PC, invented most of the useful electronic technologies (Oh, and Alan Turing was a flaming fag...look it up).
And best of all, we invented and own most of the internet.
Pisses you off, and makes me laugh at your pathetic existence.
I watch as everyone jumps on the bandwagon that the United States' space program sucks. All because we have not returned to the moon.
Okay, our manned missions have become fairly lax, but NASA's unmanned missions are doing a fair job of making up for it. Just check the current list: http://www.nasa.gov/missions/current/
Plus, the Hubble and Chandra are doing real good work - in Earth orbit.
Andrew Borntreger
Champion of cinematic disasters
Wasn't there a project a few years back to create ENIAC-on-a-chip as part of some sort of anniversary celebration?
>> He took a leap and landed somewhere no person from his continent or any continents he had ever known before had landed before (yeah, that's a confusing line, but it's correct.)
Correct, my arse!
Take a trip up to L'Anse-aux-Meadows, Newfoundland, and learn which Europeans made it to North American first. Then take your Columbus, who never set foot on anything that is now American soil, and shove a Viking helmet up his arse!
...was actually the Scandinavian, Leif Ericsson, and he wasn't trying to get to India, but to lands reported to be to the west of Greenland. A viking colony called Vinland (due to the new lands wine-growing potential) was established, and lasted for some time before being wiped out by hostile natives.
Israel has not killed 150,000 of its own people with mustard gas and VX. This is what boggles my mind when people make these ridiculous comparisons between Iraq and any other country, or between Saddam Hussein and any other world leader.
http://edition.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/tiananmen/
"Twelve years ago the Chinese Government lost patience with a student movement calling for democracy in Tiananmen square. They ordered the peoples army to turn their weapons on the people. he bloody suppression of the students effectively smashed the pro- democracy movement and drove dissent underground."
China killed thousands of people, including chilren. They ran the protesters over with tanks, including a pregnent woman, and sprayed the croud with automatic weapons. And the whole while it was being broadcast live to our living rooms via CNN (and other networks). Thousands upon thousands of people died in that attack. The only thing that Bush Sr. did was scold China and he stopped us from buying military hats from China for a few months. Now Iraq kills its own people, and suddenly we want to declare ourselfs the saviors of the world's people *puke* Yeah, right. No altierior motives involved in that *rolls eyes*.
http://www.archive.org/details/ThePowerOfNightmares
The best thing for oil prices and the economy would be for us to cool it and say "ok, Iraq's complying, everything's fine". If this were about oil, that's what we'd do - that's what would make our own oil companies happy.
No, the best thing for us economically, and our oil companies, would be for us to occupy Iraq and have our oil companies control the oil found in the region.
http://www.archive.org/details/ThePowerOfNightmares
slashdot entertainment?
Surely some mistake!
That's very perceptive of you Mr Stapleton and rather unexpected in a G Major
You are something to pity and laugh at.
And your last post was designed so many more could return the favour.
...the US was first on the moon. Just like Christopher Columbus was first to the US - but he didn't stay. It where the pilgrims that repeated the trip and stayed.
-- Contradictions only exist in thought - not in reality.
Well, well, well....more anti-American hot air. Please don't forget the good ol' USA went to that dead rock over 30 years ago. These cuntries seem to be a bit late don't ya think?? They can't possibly think they're going to find something we did not, with the exception of our landing vehicles and the RED WHITE AND BLUE stuck in the surface.
Oh well, let them go spend billions and billions of dollars trying to copy the Americans, bring back tons of junk, ONLY to find out they did all that work to get ROCKS. That's right...rocks. PSSSST - the moon is a dead rock. Everyone knew that for years and years, but it's just another means to slam the USA on slushfuck.
Nothing scientific or newsworthy here..just like usual....slashdot - news for linux/anti-American/anti-capitalism zealotry, stuff that's irrelevant
Why is it these great stories about the Moon appear in the middle of the night when I'm sleeping! Oh well...
/. articles you'll see that they had a long delay due to regulatory issues, but finally got the approvals they need around the middle of last year, and actually launched a test vehicle last December. The schedule is to do it for real later this year... so it should happen! Along with Smart-1.
TransOrbital's lunar mission has actually been featured here on
slashdot a few times but nobody seems to remember private space ventures when public projects come up. Sigh...
Anyway, if you'll peruse those links to past
Energy: time to change the picture.
"Sit there and watch"?
Hey asshole, we've already been to the moon, several times, over thirty fucking years ago!
Of course we'll sit back and watch, we did it long before michael was a fucking little squirm!!!!
Who was the imbecile that wrote this headline?
"..sit around and watch"
Ummm.... weren't we sending probes there over 35 YEARS AGO, and men 34 YEARS AGO? Clementine was a decade ago??
Get a life.
I Just Heard that the Chinese craft that is to be used on this expedition is being manufactured in sweat shops all over asia. Maybe if we lock down some of our young and disabled people we can go back to the moon as well.
So that's what he meant by "Weeks not months"!
-- It only takes 20 minutes for a liberal to become a conservative thanks to our new outpatient surgical procedure!
Look, I dislike Bush as much as the next guy (actually, probably more than the next guy), but I'm afraid your assertion that he only increased NASA's funding after the Columbia disaster is not correct.
President Bush released his proposed 2004 budget Monday. Prepared before the Columbia tragedy, Bush calls for increasing the NASA budget by roughly $500 million to $15.47 billion, about a 3 percent increase. Funding for the space shuttle program itself would rise from $3.2 billion to $3.9 billion under Bush's proposal.
source
I'd suggest you don't use Slashdot as your only news source, or you will suffer permanent brain damage.
There needs to be a different perspective on space. Up until now.. its been Russia and the US.. and thats really it. As far as the moon goes the US got their. But we didn't do anything more than just get there.
It seems they're taking a different turn. They're going there because its the closest planet like rock that you can test out planetary travel with... make it better safer and all that jazz.
Hey if other countries and corps get involved in space exploration.. maybe it'll fire up our programs a little more.. maybe make this cheaper. I mean hell the reason why everything is so expensive is we've been doing it first.. and there has been no outside perspective. Well, besides the russians... but they've been hurting as of late. But we got the space station out of that.. so i'd say even more good can come from other people doing stuff to progress.
plus I'm such a Sci-Fi freak I wanna see people living in space and traveling to other planets.. that would rock.. though I'm not quite so optimistic it will happen in my lifetime..
Who makes you Sig?
why is this +4? it certainly isn't informative, insightful, underrated or funny. Really, its just political bashing with baseless facts. Absolutely baseless.
first you have to assertain that he patient actually has cancer.
That's very perceptive of you Mr Stapleton and rather unexpected in a G Major
Im from the US, and I would rather be dead than red. Not 100% chance of death maybe, but I would certainly risk my life greatly to avoid being in a communist country. Yourself?
You are an idiot if you honestly think this way. And yes...I'll be happy to back up the assertion I just made.
/. with things like "Another American company patents something that shouldn't be", "Another lame rights-infringing American law is passed", "Another stupid American politician says something stupid about technology because he was bought off"....every single day.
I think it's really disgusting how some people can actually say: "Oh, that's been done already. Fsck the Chineese and Europe, America rules!"
I don't hear anyone saying that....that is somewhat of a strawman arguement. Alot of people do correctly still think that the American space program is doing alot more than what many people think though. Sure...it's not as exiting as having a guy walking around on the moon (which is mostly an aesthetic type of exitement), but they are doing alot of scientific research up there...it's not all glamorous, but it is beneficial. It sets the stage for bigger things later, when the U.S. makes it's next moves in manned space travel. It'll be interesting now that we might have to push the schedule up on the next generation of U.S. spacecraft due to the loss of another shuttle actually. Those things are what...20, 30 years old? And they do this well STILL, compared the the rest of the world. I'd say I can't wait to see what those scientists can do if we stand behind them and support it, instead of shitting on the program every time we see someone else doing something "cool" that we want. That is childish. Be diligent, persistant, but most of all, patient. Lives are at stake, and there is a lot to be learned yet before space travel is going to be a more reasonable proposition. Trying to make a race out of it in this day and age (we aren't in a cold war with Europe I hope) is a really immature way to approach space travel at this point...I suppose it's great if you are the astronaut who might get blown up because proper time wasn't taken to do things right...getting up there fast is sooo important.
Folks, America is dying
America is only dying to the people who think it's dying and already gave up on it. America is quite alive and well thanks. The Europeans have been telling us our country is wrong or dying or similar rubbish for centuries now. The world's continued underestimation of this country serves it well. Think we'll never make it...think again. We've been there before.
Here, the rest of the major countries of the world with the resources to fly missions to the moon are finnaly going to go ahead with it, and all you can do is scoff?
I am not scoffing. I say good for em. Hopefully if they learn anything interesting, they'll be as kinda as America has been with it's space knowledge and share it.
Everyday there are a buttload of articles right here on
Well...two things there. Slashdot is an American site, so it's pretty big on American news. Guess what...the editors...they are Americans. They also have notorious biases. If you think that no one overseas has any of those things going on, on a daily basis, you really aren't reading enough foreign news sources. Broaden your horizons and you'll find that pretty much the whole world is a pretty fucked up place, honestly. The Euro's have their own problems, although you won't hear about as many of them here as it would inteferre with the American bashing...slashdot's favorite pasttime.
Not to oversimplify too much, but I don't think the rest of the world sucks dispite all this, simply because we sent some guys in a rocket to the moon. America is great, we have lots of cool things and privilages many other places in the world don't. And every single day we come closer and closer to losing it, because we're too busy worrying about what everyone else is doing.
I am somewhat with you on this...but it's only partly worrying about what everyone else is doing - it's also worrying about what everyone else is thinking. That is not to say that we should have complete disregard for the rest of the world (although some would like you to believe we already do, and they need to get their facts straight), but Americans are different from Europeans, who are different from Africans, who are different from Australians. When you are so concerned with what other people will think of you, you lose the ability to think openly and objectively. I love the stupid reasoning they try to paint on Americans though...the reasoning like "we pulled out of Kyoto because our leaders are terrible people who want to burn oil and rape the earth" type of statements. It's a whole other debate that I am not even going to begin to go into, but people should seriously do a little more reading on the subject.
Wake up, I can actually smell your hypocrisy.
That's the inside of your anus...get your head out of there. It smells ok in most parts of the world. America is doing well enough...and it's unlikely to every completely fall unless your willing to take into account that we'd have to take half the planet with us. American companies own plenty of things in Europe and have investments there, and Europeans have quite alot of ownership of American companies and investments there. Our bets are hedged. This type of thing wasn't possible in the days of the Roman Empire for obvious reasons, so those analogies are just plane stupid (I hear them alot on Slashdot) - and the analogies to the fall of the Soviet Union are just as bad. We didn't have a fraction of a percent of the cross ownership and investment that we do today. If Europe succeeds financially, any American with an internationalized portfolio will be happy just the same as when America succeeds financially. These are strange times.
I still call most Europeans friends personally...but I've got things I disagree with some of them on. Doesn't mean we hate each other...that's just life.
ROFL
seriously though, its a good thing.
...are they coming back, and will they bring us anything cool? ;D
It would certainly be easier to take you seriously if you stopped lying, I think.
you sure put a lot of time and effort into being WRONG. Go take economics 101, then explain to me how bush's tax cuts are bad for the poor. The rich DO get richer. The poor ALSO get richer. Guess what? The poor get richer at a faster rate than the rich, percentagewise.
Not only that, who gets to decide who is rich(evil) and who isn't. Am I rich? I don't think so. Does someone in nigeria think Im rich? Apparently. So wheres the cutoff then? Flat taxes=the only fair way to do it. Right now the 'rich' already pay way more than their fair share.
grr. communists piss me off. Communisms career success record: 0%. Capitalisms career success record: 100%. Communists countries build walls to keep people in. Capitalist countries build walls to keep people out. Why is that?
you, sir, are an idiot.
NASA is already seriously considering building a second station at the Earth-Moon L1.
This wouldn't be a science station, unlike ISS. This would be an staging "gateway" for missions to asteroids, the surface of the moon, Mars, and to construct huge space telescopes. (Because it wouldn't be a science station, it would be simpler that ISS in many ways. This, combined with the experience gained developing ISSfar higher than the shuttle can.
All of this has been discussed heavily on the web in discussions of the NASA Exploration Team's (NExT's) planning for expanding joint human-robotic exploration.
And do you recall the circumstances of that "conquering"?
something about an invasion, 5-1 odds against?...crushing a vastly superior enemy in less time than most nations take to notice an attack.
Food not Bombs is a nice platitude but it breaks down when you notice that the Bombees are usually well fed
Is this a rhetorical question or am I simply too dense to get your humor? If you split apart a water molecule you get 2 Hydrogen atoms and 1 Oxygen atom. Hydrogen is a highly flammable gas that has been used in a high number of space vehicles. All you have to do is add an oxidizer (like the other half of the water molecule we split apart) and you have yourself a rocket. If you use solar power on the moon to split water, you can get the fuel to orbit for much less cost than you can lift it from earth. This could be critical for sending missions to other planets. On most space missions, the fuel massively outmasses anything else. If the fuel were produced in space, it would make it much less expensive to undertake the exploration of our solar system as you would have to lift less mass out of Earth's gravity well. The Hydrogen and Oxygen would also be handy around the moon base as well for power and respiration, respectively.
Enigma
"The U.S. is planning to sit around and watch"
what else could the "U.S." do?? What has THAT acctually have to do with the "U.S."? uh? Why do americans are always thinking that anyone cares what they think about an issue?? It's such an arrogance by the fucking "U.S." that sometimes it disgusses me.. ohh... and whoever wrote that "note" (the us is planning...) don't forget to lick my ass
"They did not fight on the Germans's side. They collaborated with the Germans."
Anybody remember Operation Torch?
No, actually, we are going to Pluto. Pluto is about 6 billion kilometers (or is that 6 trillion meters ?) away. The moon is about 384,400 kilometers away. You do the math.
Oh, and if I recall correctly, we should get there before Pluto's atmosphere completely freezes. If someone else goes 40 - 50 years later, it will be far less usefull from a scientific standpoint.
Either way, good luck to Europe, China, Japan, and anyone else with a space program. I'm interested in all of them, as any one of them, including the US, seems to move at a glacial pace. Now if only someone would start a permanent colony somewhere. That would be a new accomplishment worthy of history books.
Dean G.
Although most of your post was accurate, I think this is a little off the mark. I believe what you meant to say was the Moon is thought to be geologically similar to Earth's crust, not mantle. The mantle is molten material beneath the crust. IIRC, the Moon is geologically stable and has no liquid core (and hence no magnetic field to shield solar radiation). The earth's crust is so rich in heavy metals because it is constantly being replenished from the mantle via upwelling at tectonic plate boundaries (i.e. volcanoes, ocean vents, etc). AFAIK, the moon is made from much lighter material (mostly silicates) and does not have the abundance of heavy metals that the Earth possesses. There will be some heavy metals due to asteroid impacts, but I think our 'gold mine' on the moon will be He3, O2, and H20.
Enigma
1) The french preferred the German occupation
2) Productivity was higher under the German occupation
3) The french willingly handed over jews and gypsies to the germans
4) There was no french resistance.
5) It was a myth created by degaulle after the war to help fuel french nationalism.
behind the u.s shield.
And Canada's.
Don't laugh, Canada had a potent military when it counted. In World War II, about 10% of Canada's population - yes, that's 1/10 of everyone living in the country - were in the military. Canadian military might was respected around the world (but gradually the military was cut back because, frankly, who would want to attack Canada anyway? It's a country without enemies).
There's also the U.K. While the U.S spends about 5% of its GDP on the military, the U.K is close at a bit more than 4%. During the first Gulf War, Britain sent 50,000 troops, compared to 250,000 U.S troops - since it's about 1/5 the population of the U.S, that works out to the same commitment per capita. Britain has always been prepared to defend Europe during the Cold War.
And don't discount the European armies that made up NATO were quite heavily armed when an actual threat existed.
The U.S might have been the largest Western military power, but it was not the only one. The difference is, once the military threat disappeared, most countries sensibly spent less on defense (sometimes to extremes - see Canada and helicoptors). The U.S, by contrast, seems to have done its best to make more enemies...
BTW, military force is useless against terrorism - terrorism is designed to bypass military confrontation, and succeeds. Israel has seen more military deployments in the past year than some countries have in the past century, and still...
Under study ABE ARES AIM ASCE Constellation-X Dawn EUSO GEC Geospace GLAST JIMO Kepler LISA Mag Constellation Mag Multiscale Mars 2007+ MARVEL NetLander New Frontiers New Horizons (Pluto) NGSS NGST Phoenix SCIM SDO Sentinels SIM Solar Probe Space Tech 7 SPIDR THEMIS TPF preliminary concepts In development AMS ASPERA-3 Astro-E2 CINDI Deep Impact GALEX Gravity Probe-B Herschel Hubble SM4 Mars '03 Rovers Mars '05 Orbiter Mars Express MESSENGER Planck Rosetta SIRTF SOFIA Solar-B Space Tech 5 Space Tech 6 STEREO Swift TWINS Operating ACE Cassini Chandra CHIPS Cluster FAST FUSE Galileo Genesis Geotail HETE-2 Hubble (HST) IMAGE INTEGRAL MAP Mars Global Surv. Mars Odyssey Nozomi Polar RHESSI RXTE SAMPEX SOHO Stardust Starshine SWAS TIMED TRACE Ulysses Voyager Wind XMM-Newton Deep Space Network Space Science Data Past missions Ended after 1989: ASCA Astro-1 / Astro-2 Astro-E BBXRT Clementine CGRO COBE CONTOUR CRRES DE-1 Deep Space 1 Deep Space 2 DXS Equator-S EUVE HALCA / VLBI Hipparcos Hubble SM3B Hubble (past) IEH-3 ISEE-3/ICE IMP-8 IRTS ISO IUE Kuiper (KAO) Leonid MAC Lunar Prospector Magellan Mars Clim. Orb. Mars Observer Mars Pathfinder Mars Polar Lander NEAR ORFEUS Pioneer 10/11 Pioneer Venus ROSAT SAC-B SNOE Spartan TERRIERS TSS-1, TSS-1R WIRE Yohkoh
"It takes considerable knowledge just to realize the extent of your own ignorance." - Thomas Sowell
- About half of the members now have significant positions in the current U.S administration (there's that Rumsfeld guy for one...).
- They have explicitly advocated conquering Iraq since at least 1996 (possibly earlier), during the Clinton adminstration.
Take a look - the open letters give some of the real reasons for the Iraq war (note that merely disarming Iraq is not one of the options).We've discovered at least two new ways of killing seven people at a time.
NASA died 30 years ago. I don't think we should expect anything special from them until they get into another tirade about 'beating out the commies'
And unlike Kennedy, he actually lived to see his vision come to fruition. One of his primary goals was to bring an end to the Cold War. Many will claim that he had nothing to do with the execution of that vision, but at any rate, he had a vision, and set about achieving it. I think he was quite successful.
We knew how to get there, but like Goldie Hawn frequently said at the time, "I used to know all that stuff." Now we don't have a clue as to how to get back.
Oh come on now. It's just rocket science.
-CausticPuppy "Of all the people I know, you're certainly one of them." -Somebody I don't know
Helium-3
u m3_0006 30.html
Here is a excerpt from a space.com story:
Scientists estimate there are about 1 million tons of helium 3 on the moon, enough to power the world for thousands of years. The equivalent of a single space shuttle load or roughly 25 tons could supply the entire United States' energy needs for a year, according to Apollo17 astronaut and FTI researcher Harrison Schmitt.
Here is the link:
http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/heli
I'd say that is a pretty good reason to go.
Let's start a rumor that there's OIL in them thar lunar hills. Cheney's hand will be up GW's ass within seconds to have him "articulate" a new national priority of lunar exploration. They will invoke all kinds of lofty ideals, and use the lunar program to justify more coal-fired power plants here on earth. Oh, and of course, the need to invade Iraq.
...and most of them are in the Middle East.
Hopefully not, but I'm not the only one who sees Bush as the guy riding the Atom Bomb like a bucking bronco as it falls from the bomber (sorry, blanking on the name of that movie!).
We should take the billions we're spending on the "War" and use it to further the idea of not being tied to a single planet. Yeah, it's a long way off, but the sooner we start, the better chances we'll finish before someone or something (big rock from space, environmental meltdown, aliens who have to kill us for making the X-Files...) smokes the Earth.
Well, yeah. Been there, done that, got the t-shirt. We're like the big brother watching his little brother climb a tree--we feel no need to bother anymore.
Plus--and here's a big secret--we know what they don't know: it's not worth doing. It's just a lot of money with no return. It'd be cheaper to burn a pile of $100 bills. Heck, it'd be cheaper to burn a pile of $1,000,000 bills!
We're not bothering this year because we'll have enough craters to look at in Iraq.
Bowie J. Poag
When the Chinese explorers arrive at the Apollo landing site, they'll find, inscribed in the side of the lander, the word "First!"
The year is 2037 and in this edition of Chinese Moon Manufacturing News we discuss China's recent abandonment of all manufacturing on the Moon.
Because of the economics of the situation and recent acceptance of the UN Free Trade Agreement, all Chinese Moon Manufacturing positions have been exported to Mexico.
CMM management will remain on the moon for a transitional period, before the doors are locked and the lights shut off.
That is all.
In all honesty, a manned mission to the moon by another country would be great. It would finally shut up all of these conspiracy theories about how the manned missions to the moon by the U.S. were elaborate hoaxes.
That's no longer the in-vogue conspiracy. Now we admit that they went to the moon, but it's what they found there that's being covered up.
My God, it's Full of Source!
OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
Deep space nine just re-routed the deflectors to provide enough push to get to worm whole in mere minutes! We should do that too..... -Iowa
"He who laughs last, didn't get the joke."-Cap
"they won't think its so cool when they go up there and find the terrible secret of space!"
Could be worse: They could find the Prince of Space.
Actually the US ranks 17th in press freedom.
Well, its linked to a French server, so it must be true. Everyone knows the French are very objective when it comes to Americans.
"The poor ranking of the United States (17th) is mainly because of the number of journalists arrested or imprisoned there."
You failed to quote this: Arrests are often because they refuse to reveal their sources in court. Also, since the 11 September attacks, several journalists have been arrested for crossing security lines at some official buildings. which is an unsubstantiated claim that sounds more like American bashing than fact. Crossing over lines to contaminate a crime scene doesn't qualify as 'gagging' the press. The press's rights to not reveal sources is so strong in America as to be bordering on aiding criminals. And we tolorate it anyway.
Nothing personal, but I have good grounds to compare freedom on press, as well as personal liberty in France vs. America. No contest. I notice they rank their own country very high, too. After reading it, and looking around at this groups mission statement, the fact that they appear to be full of shit on many counts is quite obvious to any objective person.
Yes, its easy to bash France. Their arrogence and incompetance is what made it so easy, tho.
Tequila: It's not just for breakfast anymore!
They most certainly did not do it for the colonist's benefit, it was done solely to hurt England.
Fourth, actually. The Japanese orbited their "Hiten" probe around the moon about 10 years ago.
Well said, well formulated, and generally insightfull. Me and my journal agree completely.
With great power comes great electricity bills.
Thank you. I hadn't read that far in Churchill's "The second World War". You gave me the occasion. According to the Wikipedia, the English attacked French territory to gain a base in North Africa. From what I read they did a defence that was hardly more than formal (hahaha surrendered ! that's so funny). That's what's you're supposed to do when your territory is attacked. The Germans were not too pleased with the surrender as they then occupied Vichy France. Did the French declare war to Brittain after Torch ? I think not. That's what's your supposed to do when you get attacked.
In 1778 France and the United States entered into an alliance against Great Britain, which thereupon declared war against France.
It was done to hurt England of course. But Lafayette for example really served the American cause.
NASA and the government have higher priorities in the space program than toying with the moon again e.g. space shuttle issue
Before China or India or any other no-septic-systems-and-our-kids-are-starving country wants to go to the moon they have to get their goddamn economies straight. The only way Chinese would ever afford going to the Moon is if they start burning their own people as fuel. I am sick and tired hearing about some countries that are alomost at the bottom of the shitter have big plans for space exploration. Would not spending money on improving the quality of living be more reasonable?
Funny, since the White Man was in America long before any of the so-called 'native americans' were. I assume you've heard of the Kennewick man, but there are other discoveries as well.
a l/story.jsp?story=358001 s keleton_ohio001127.html m (a good overview)
http://news.independent.co.uk/world/science_medic
http://abcnews.go.com/sections/science/DailyNews/
http://heritageanddestiny.com/LostWhiteAmerica.ht
useless sucker that you are, can't even spell words in your own language, knowledge of history ZERO, knowledge of cultures ZERO, knowledge of languages ZERO, considering himself powerful cause he happens to live in the new Rome, pityful creature
The amazing thing is that you actually BELIEVE in the freedom of US press. That is "their" greatest achivement, a mindless pack of followers yelling "USA USA"
"I think we should just go bad the the fudual days "
Well, I'm hoping we go back to a time when people could construct sentences and spell.
"the more everyone else hates you."
I guess the Americans are finally getting a taste of how the French have felt ever since they bent over and spread their ass cheeks to the Nazis, just 60 or so years ago.
Signed,
A Brit who understands history
Britan is a true ally.
The US knows and understands that.
From a US citizen, thank you.
Britan remembers we share a common heritage.
Britan remembers we saved your bacon twice in the last century.
And now Britan stands alone against the unwashed masses of europe.
Germany - started 2 world wars, responsible for the death of millions of jews, homosexuals, gypsies and other minorities.
Russia - as the soviet union responsible for the death of 30 million Ukranians by *starving them to death*. Joseph Stalin is a butcher that makes Hitler an amateur.
France - is a whore to whoever gives them money... Hitler, Saddam Hussein, whatever.
I'd rather *not* be on the same side with these lepers.
France - need I
Your country is so corrupt and irrelevant that you'd rather security for a few more years than stand up for principle.
Why did the US have to get rid of the butchers in your midst just 4 years ago? You had genocide going on in your back yard and you looked the other way.
So dont' lecture the US about the right thing to do. Your country wouldn't do the right thing if it involved more than a committee and a "study".
Your country is the definition of cynicism. You and the "humans" that inhabit your country now mean nothing. You no longer count as humans. You're slugs slime the earth and hope there will be rotting plants around to feed your fat, disgusting carcasses.
Sickening.
We should let Saddam go and invite him to invade france. You guys would surrender in 3 weeks.
That in Europe, there is no guarantee of freedom of speech?
You have free speech in Europe... as long as it doesn't offend anyone.
This isn't even a little bit of an exaggeration.
The most racist countries on earth are in Europe. And they have the nerve to criticize the US.
Its like Satan criticizing Jesus, Budda and Muhammet because the hem of their robes were dirty from helping the helpless.
Europe is the most cynical place on earth.
I'd rather live with the kooks in the middle east. At least they care about something other than the comfort of their pathetic little flat.
"Do you think that "Europe" can only plan one space mission at a time? "
No, I doubt they can manage that many at once.
Holy cripes.
Opera is irrelevant.
And while Tim/Bernard/Lee put together the first web browser, it was the Americans who turned it into something useful.
The Channel Tunnel? Please. Had that been in the US, it would have been done 200 years ago.
You're spineless, are a "me too" bunch of nations, and then trumpet.... Opera? Cripes. If you weren't trolling, you'd be stupid.
The US is coming, its coming hard, coming fast, and we dont' care if you like it.
Afghanistan is/was a complete success.
Iraq/Kuwait was a success.
We've reduced alqueda to a handful of filthy muslims goat-fuckers.
Iraq 2003 will be so fast and furiuos that it scare the shit out of you.
You'll be decrying the US military for its "brutality" while secretly having a hardon wishing your country didn't whine about Arriane and the Chunnel.
Pathetic.
If the human race was as cowardly as you, we'd still be living off mushrooms and sleeping in trees.
Thank god the Chinks have balls. Humanity has hope.
Won't happen, because there isn't a person in europe (a) smart enough to build a rocket ship (b) brave enough to get in one if they did.
Hey, maybe the ruskies can build it and fly it for you. They're pretty good at it, and they're mentally strong enough for it.
Tell me... is it against "International Law" in europe for men to have balls and courage? Or are all they all effeminate little squirrls like you that get nervous at the thought of doing the right thing?
Maybe your grandmother was personally fighting germans in belgium.
But there was no organizaed french resistance. I fully realize that not everyone in france is complete coward. But as an "organized resistance"?
Complete and utter myth.
"The United States are only barely united."
Right.
I hope you aren't paying for that education, because it barely qualifies.
Europe is dying. Surely as *BSD is dying or a lot of interesting stuff.
You would rather sit around and hope that the state will wipe your ass than do something.
Arianne is an economic failure; not a failure on the scale of, say, Airbus. But close and for the same reasons.
Europeans think committees and rules solve problems. It makes me laugh out loud.
The french are fucked. Are you're packing alongside them.
The worst scandel is how France attempted to destroy NATO.
Let me say this. Next world war you guys start...we're not saving your lazy, pathetic asses next time. Ihope Hitler 2 comes along, your asses will be in a sling.
We'll help england, but the rest of you can go to hell.
And I mean that sincerely. Go fuck yourselves.
" The EU a loose confederation, not much more"
Exactly. Its why the US is laughing at all of Europe.
France wants so desperately to be relevant.
Only they're not. And they look so dumb trying.
EU. makes us all laugh. Its a figment. I give it until 2008. It would stop sooner, but the europeans are so lazy and rooted, it will take them 5 years to fall apart.
Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Bomb
Directed by Stanley Kubrick, starring Peter Sellers.
http://us.imdb.com/Title?0057012
That no matter what, they will always be a junior member in the EU.
How pathetic that anyone would join an organization where France has some power.
I'd rather die, or worse, live in Belgium.
Future Wiki -- If you don't think about the future, you cannot have one.
And boring.
Yawn.
How does it feel to have such a pathetic life.
In the US, I wouldn't know how to live down to your level.
You should thank your god that we saved your asses a million times over the past 100 years.
Ingrateful frog.
All hitler did was trod on your toes.
He did say "sorry".
No, I'm pretty sure I meant mantle.
:)
IIRC, the Moon is currently believed to have been made by a large asteroid slamming into the primordial Earth. This smeared a large chunk of the Earth's crust and mantle (the crust is essentially solid mantle, and back then it was a lot thinner) out into space, where it coalesced into the Moon. Initially, the Moon's core would have been liquid as well, but being smaller and less dense it would have cooled fairly fast.
Could be wrong, of course...
"Software is too expensive to build cheaply"
It's unfortunate that this article had to turn into a bunch of Americans debating their governments' priorities. The real story here is some interesting new technology that going to be tested that will expand science for everyone's benefit.
To the Americans out there - we in the rest of the world are very impressed by your past accomplishments. The fact that other nations are also developing their own space programs does not mean it's an insult to you guys.
You will benefit from everyone else's space exploration, just as you benefit from Japan's semiconductor research, Canada's telecommunications research, and Europe's alternative energy research. Yes, other nations benefit from U.S. research too. It's a team game we're playing here, and it's time we stopped with the us/them frame of mind.
Think for a second where the U.S. rocket technology came from. Was it strictly a U.S. invention, or was is based heavily on German technology?
My point is that countries can accomplish more working together than in isolation.
"I have never let my schooling interfere with my education." - Mark Twain
Off the top of my head, I can think of solar sails and laser sails. These are at least two propellantless propulsion technologies being seriously studied by scientists. Obviously, neither requires 'propellant' in any shape or form.
Qu'on me donne six lignes écrites de la main du plus honnête homme, j'y trouverai de quoi le faire pendre.
Yeah, I probably shouldn't have tried to put words into your mouth. I have a nasty habit of doing that....
However, from the Projects to Employ Resources of the Moon and Asteroids Near Earth in the Near Term (PERMANENT) website:
First, the Moon is made of lighterweight material blown off of the Earth's surface, and is poor in materials from the Earth's mantle and core. We see this in the aluminum-rich lunar highland geologies. We also know by measuring the mass and density of the Moon by Apollo and other scientific instruments. Overall, the Moon is not very dense.
The mantle has heavy metals that are carried by convection from the core. While the Moon has some heavy metals, it certainly isn't close to the concentrations the the mantle.
Enigma
movie sets up there... and that we just faked it...
signed,
Confused
Cake or Death? Cake Please!
False. Poland has NOT surrendered during WWII.
I'm quite dismayed by the "we went there a generation ago, big deal" responses. The moon IS a big deal!
Luna should be considered a science-critical, mission-critical, humanity-critical resource that's just aching for our close attention and more manned and unmanned missions.
1. Astronomy. Hubble is great. But can you imagine a ground telescope on the dark side of the moon? We could image back to the beginning! We could discover more extrasolar planets, prove or disprove more theories, unlock the secrets of the cosmos. The stability of a ground based scope is so great; and the total lack of an atmosphere would permit such fantastic resolution! Think of Keck _on the moon_. Wow.
2. Further solar exploration. Creating a staging area on the moon for missions to mars, jupiter, io, saturn, ganymede, titan, uranus, the asteroid belt, ceres, venus, the oort clouds-- all these things at which we need more looks-- it would make launches to them faster, more efficient and less energy intensive. Especially when we employ
3. Lunar Mining. There are significant lunar resources from which we can truly benefit. Robofactured propellents. Building materials. Water? People if there's water under the lunar surface (still only theoretical, I know) we MUST get there and SOON.
There's more, I know there is. I just can't believe we'd cast aside the moon so easily because "we done that afore hyuck hyuck!" There's so many ways further lunar exploration would assist all other space exploration that it's foolish to ignore it.
J
yes. that's all I'm going to say in all comments from now on.
The humans must be shoved!
He who laughs last is stuck in a time dilation bubble.
The US is willing to spend massive ammounts of resources in a senseless war against so called "evil countries", instead of concentrating on productive and positive activities.
That's even worse than just sitting around.
Airegin
I'm not sure about you but I've never tried to cross a large area of tundra region by foot. I can assure you however that it's not quite as simple as you make it out to be. These peoples have crossed mountainous terrain and frozen wasteland alike in order to have discovered and colonized the known world here. One of the things that was made very clear to us in high school which I should have taken far more seriously is the knowledge that the land is always more powerful than you are. Don't try to master nature - it will master you. Perhaps that's just here in Canada, though, where I won't walk home outside for fear of freezing to death. But seriously, there is much to the environment and discovering most of this land than just simply 'walking across'...
GENERATION 26: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation.