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Army Looks at Robotic Dogs
mr. squishie writes "Someone important must have gotten an Aibo...According to Wired news, the Army's Tank-automotive and Armaments Command has just awarded a $2.5 million contract to build a prototype of a large robot dog that would follow soldiers into battle and carry food, ammunition, and medical supplies. This is apparently part of a larger movement by various branches of the military investigating the uses of robots based on various types of wildlife, ranging from engine-repairing robot elephant trunks and mine-destroying robot lobsters to the cliched robot-fly-spy-on-the-wall trick. I wonder if they're looking into giant robot anteaters as an alternative to costly bunker-buster bombs?"
Work on robot soldiers, and save yourself all of the hassle of killing people at all. That would be a lot more fun to watch on CNN anyway.
would then be the cheap alternative.
Its called a mule.
They need look no farther than Val Kilmer's "Red Planet" to see how dangerous robot dogs can be.
Let the addition of lots of redundant Dr Who "K-9" references begin!
Ah hell, I really can't bring myself to type it. I deeply apologise for my descent into Slashdotism. It won't happen again. I promise. Honest.
Cheers,
Ian
robot sharks.... with laser beams.
...the Sanyo TS7.
I don't think it'll be much good at busting bunkers, but it does have nice Star Wars-looking armor (mirror in case of Slashdotting).
The Army reading list
I wonder if they're looking into giant robot anteaters as an alternative to costly bunker-buster bombs?
Why not? After all, they've already got a giant robot chimpanzee as an alternative to a defense secretary.
<rimshot>These sigs are more interesting tha
I've no problem with this idea if they don't call any of the dogs "Beagle."
...PETA's gonna be pissed.
>> "What would the robut do? Frame someone!"
Pretending to protect national security, provide the troops with better gear to fight terrorism, and other great headlines, our government is spending more of your money on projects that will go way over budget and provide little of the original promises.
Unfortunately, this is how our federal government always works. We've lost our capitalist direction in the last 140 years, and are now thoroughly mercantilist. Promises are made, but in reality those promises only lead to friends of the government getting a big wad of cash -- and when they over extend the budget, they just ask for more.
Sure, $3 million doesn't sound like a lot, but when has government ever provided anything at or under budget?
I'm disgusted that the average citizen allows this. There is really no reason to allow more and more of our hard earned income to go into the pockets of those friendly with the powers-that-be. Both the Democrats and Republicans have lied and lied, and neither is going to help us stabilize the economy and put more money in your pocket without increasing the costs to others.
...will welcome our new, wardroid masters.
>
When the early prototype mysteriously faild to deliver the food, an investigation revealed that they had foolishly based the design on Scooby Doo.
Sheesh, evil *and* a jerk. -- Jade
I wonder if they're looking into giant robot anteaters as an alternative to costly bunker-buster bombs?"
Who is deploying giant robot ants? If no one is deployiong such a weapon, why are we creating something to eat them?
Miauw...
...BOEM...
Silly dog. Who caries around C4 strapped to his back.
Miauw...
Miauw...
Silly dog.
Miauw...
Burns: "I'm looking for something in an attack dog. One who likes the sweet gamey tang of human flesh. Hmmm, why here's the fellow ... Wiry, fast, firm, proud buttocks. Reminds me of me."
http://unmoldable.com W:"No one of consequence" I:"I must know" W:"Get used to disappointment"
How about the sections of Snow Crash told from the point of view of the robotic guard dog.
Trouble making decisions? Just flip for it.
Does anyone else remember the robotic dog enemies in the game Robocop vs. Terminator?
I think someone should show the US Army all the Terminator films before they go ahead and make them happen...
Have there been any related stories about the US military checking out human-shaped robots? Because they're out there, and they are just waiting for someone to strap a grenade launcher to 'em...
http://world.honda.com/ASIMO/
At Sunderland, we're working on a 'robotic sheepdog' to help find victims in building collapses or similar disasters. This would be able to track its controller acoustically and use similar technology to localize and track sound streams of interest.
Could it be that someone has been watching too many episodes of "Zoids" on Cartoon Network?
The dogcow says "Moof!"
I've always thought that legged vehicles where an obvious solution to all-terrain travel and transport. Rubber tires become increasingly inefficient at the terrain becomes rougher (absorbing energy in all the deflections from rocks, etc.). And walkers can go where no wheeled vehicle can pass. The problem has always been designing legged motion systems that have the fluidity of biological walkers (the jerky move-stop-move motion of oldstyle robots is too slow and inefficient). But with faster embedded processors and sensors, true fluid walking and running are possible.
I wonder if this presages the return of true calvary -- robotic-horse mounted soliders.
Two wrongs don't make a right, but three lefts do.
In the book version of Starship Troopers by Heinlein, there is a whole military division of soldiers paired with cybernetic dogs called the K-9 Corps.
My copy is on loan to a friend, but I did find a PDF of it on the internet through google. Don't know if it is legit though: Starship Troopers
-- DrZaius - Minister of Sciences and Protector of the Faith
If I were a soldier, the first thing I'd do is reprogram my dog to walk ahead of me, not behind me. Let it step on the landmines, absorb enemy fire, etc.
Oh wait, this robot is worth $2.5m, eh? Ah, now I understand why the soldier is in front.
Slashdot monitor for your Mozilla sidebar or Active Desktop.
If they were serious about this, you'd think they'd spend a bit more. I mean, it is the U.S. military after all.
It looks pretty cool, in a science fictiony way, but why build something with four legs? Popular wisdom states that, when building a walking robot, six legs or more is preferable. And that's under ordinary circumstances, such as walking across uneven terrain. What happens when a mortar takes off one of its legs?
Unless it needs to climb stairs or hop up into vehicles, it seems like tank treads would be the most practical solution. On the other hand, a robotic dog might be effective in psychological intimidation.
I wish that my inferiority complex were as good as yours.
-RenderHead
Great. Now we can sick our robot dogs on Japans running robots.
Will WW3 take place at Robot Wars?
I wonder if they're looking into giant robot anteaters as an alternative to costly bunker-buster bombs?
How about AT-AT's?
Garg
Garg
Alumnus, Xavier's School for Gifted Youngsters
I wonder if they're looking into giant robot anteaters as an alternative to costly bunker-buster bombs?
No, they're not.
United States of America, good ol' backers of world peace.
He said the Imperial Walkers were on the way. (Does this mean the US Army will now develop plans to thwart Luke Skywalker?)
Legs aren't necessarily a great form of transport. The are slow and use lots of energy. Evolution never came up with the wheel, or tracks (like a tank) or rotating blades (like a helicopter). Why should a robotic "dog" be better than a tracked vehicle, for instance?
Perhaps the real plan is to give them glowing red eyes and smoke coming out of their mouths, to scare the opposition. Now that would we worth doing...
Might be because of that quote from the headline "Someone important must have gotten an Aibo". But then again maybe you didnt even read the headline. ;-)
The big robot dog
Dogma - "let's just say we'd like to avoid any empirical entanglements."
I thought that's what E3's were for. Won't we be putting all our PFC's and Lance Corporals out of work?
All's true that is mistrusted
RoboDog: AiBone detected. Pick up AiBone.
Field Marshall: No! Stop! That's a landmine! It's just been painted pink to confuse you!
RoboDog: *boom*
I didn't RTFA, so I'm sure I'll get modded down, but I see alot of problems with this, even for the military.
First of all, it's a heck of alot harder to create a walking robot than it is a wheeled one, for obvious reasons. Or atleast one. A Walking Robot has more moving parts.
Secondly, if this thing is going to be following soldiers into combat, into a warzone, wouldn't it be better to have a wheeled robot for the additional stability? Just make something like a mars rover, only bigger, to carry supplies.
Edward@Tomato - /home/Edward/ man woman
man: no entry for woman in the manual.
"Qua!?"
Why not just use a real dog?
It's much more efficient, easier to fuel, infinitely more intelligent, far less expensive
And they taste good too!
Forget robot dogs, flys, and lobsters. Give the soldiers something they'd actually use, like robot women!
Stop by my site where I write about ERP systems & more
I for one would love to ride a giant metal dog to work every day. And at 50 pounds per squad thats 400 pounds capacity at least.
Then you could paint it up like a Warg Beast from LoTR.
Last one in jail is a fascist.
True anarchy is impossible, but under a libertarian system (which would allow capitalism, of course), things are as anarchic as you can get, since there is the least coercive rule.
What is interesting is the totalitarians who dare to call themselves "anarchists" and "socialists" at the same time: saying that they favor no government while arguing for more and more obtrusive government. An excellent illustration of this type is Emma Goldsman, who is called an "anarchist" despite the fact that she was an activist that encouraged the government to increaee meddling in people's lives. Noam Chomsky is a modern example of a person who uses such oxymoronic claims.
What's the advantage of a robot like that (which could have a quite hefty price tag) to a cheap mule/horse/real dog/etc to carry equipment?
Everybody has a purpose in life, maybe mine is to lurk in slashdot.
Is this the first step to the development of REAL Mechwarriors?
I've already seen this done. Just look here. The kid that comes with it, though, is hyper-annoying.
Viv
Gmail invites for ip
I've always thought that as soon as we develop robots to fight for us there will be no more war as we know it. Think about how demoralizing it is for the oposition when they're holed up for hours fighting a machine. if they win all they have to show for it is scraps of metal and they know the american economy can pump out more robots like there twinkies. a scary thought.
I, for one, welcome our new robotic canine...ah fuck it. This isn't fun anymore.
To improve their flexibility, and thus their utility in an ever-unpredictable combat situation, these robots will be able to assume a variety of conformations; to transform, if you will, in order to disguise themselves from hostile guerilla forces.
Indeed, think of the benefits to the army Corp of engineers if they can respond to an unexpected hostile presence by combining their earth moving equipment into a giant combat robot! Given the assymetric threats our military is expected to face in the coming century, do policy makers really have any choice?
The good and new comes from no quarter where it is looked for, and is always something different from what is expected.
I think the government is moving along quite nicely. Maybe within a few years they will have robot versions of all forms of animal life, fighting our wars, chopping our trees, dropping our bombs. Its always good to see a major poitical orginization take its ideas from a best-selling videogame series. Maybe they can call these things "Reploids", I dunno, has a nice ring to it.
...it isn't even a real dagget!
Drill baby drill - on Mars
This would serve much like a Tauntan in Empire Strikes Back.
That said, I honestly would hate to see any life shed, so robots would reduce that risk.
Yell & scream & rant & rave... it's no use... you need a shaaaave ~ Bugs Bunny
A mule can be far more difficult to control and less reliable than even an MS-Windows based robot.
Of course these dogs will run on an altered Microsoft Windows CE operating system. Therefore, the number of KIA's in the next major conflict might increase by 300 percent.
"Honey, I feel a certain distance between us..." "Really? A 31ms ping ain't that bad..."
For instance, I sure hope that robo-dog doesn't fetch the boms I launch at the enemy...
Do you mean Tarkus?. The treads are hell on stairs, though.
Don't blame Durga. I voted for Centauri.
We have and do use war dogs. The Marine kennels are in North Carolina and Virginia and the Army kennels are, I believe, in Oklahoma. In addition, MPs have canine squads just like civilian cops and many of these squads have war dog training in addition to police dog training.
They're useful for sniffing out booby traps and ambushes. There are a couple of problems, though:
All's true that is mistrusted
iKill?
...wait till you see the Army's $349,000 pooper scoopers for said dogs.
I couldn't agree more, but I believe the reason is animal cruelty. People are drafted rarely, but only after they have the priveledge of voting. The rest of the armed forces are all volunteers. Dogs are neither capable of voting or of volunteering, so someone would raise a fuss about it.
Of course, war is war. People die, and yes, animals die too I'm sure. Back when wars were fought on horseback, it wasn't like the movies -- the horses DID get injured and killed.
no comment
"Unit 247 wakes up. He is excited. Others are barking. Someone is trying to hurt a nice girl. This makes him angry."
Just how far away from Stephenson's Rat Thing are we?
.M@
--
do you use them for good, or for awesome?
NOT. The "common man" type people in this country need to wise up to the fact that they are here to serve the state. The USA is a socialist nation where you will do as you are told and you will only do that which serves the state. People of the USA need to have their taxes increased so much that they can barely survive. As a socialist I support the type of police action that occurred at Ruby Ridge, Waco, and other less publicized events. All "individualists" in this country need to reigned in and made to be dependent on the government or else be destroyed. Gun owners, constitutionalists, patriots, etc need to be shot to death by the federal police or burned to death. PERIOD.
Robot sharks with friggin' laser beams on their heads!!!!
RoboFrog v1.0, which will be followed closely by RoboRedneck v1.0 (steel and aluminum telescopic gig accessory standard on the "dee-lux" model!) Also, you won't have to worry about this (although fabricated anyway) happening, as the Kevlar waders accessory are already available for ordering.
This space intentionally left (almost) blank.
Yes - I do know that AI is not at that level - yet. And it will be a loooong time before it will advance to the point where it will begin to resemble Hollywood's ideas of it. What is striking though is that the pictures of these robots are uncannily similar to what hollywood depicts as cold, impersonal, killing machines. Imagine that these are larger and equipped with weapons. Now imagine that you are on the other side of the combat line. Not hard to imagine that you are in Cameron-esque world, isnt it?
So whats left is really only the development of AI. And who knows, maybe the defense organizations already have a working prototype....
There is no such thing as luck. Luck is nothing but an absence of bad luck.
In Greg Bear's Slant, the military used a variety of robots - built from 'local' materials and nanotech (on demand)... pretty similar idea. Hopefully these robots won't need to eat you in order to complete their circuitry!
I wonder if they're looking into giant robot anteaters as an alternative to costly bunker-buster bombs?
Licking terrorists to death is probably SOME violation of the Geneva Convention!
K9 from Doctor Who! Yeah!
Oh. Um, l-- look, i-- i-- if we built this large robotic badger--
Me, I'm still waiting for my sonic screwdriver.
Can a basselope project be far behind for the DOD?
The only thing that we learn from history is that nobody learns anything from history.
Of course, the robotic dogs could always shoot bees...
Insert witty comment here
How many millions did those idiots sink into designing and building the first Aibo? They really expect to make a quality robotic dog with all of this functionality with only $2.5m? It sounds like they're just trying to shut someone up that kept saying "come on guys, give it a chance!" Seriously, have you seen Aibo try to run and keep up with a person and still remain somewhat "stealthy"? This project is doomed from the start and our tax money is funding it. $2.5m might not be that much split 250,000,000 ways, but how many bad $2.5m ideas have they come up with lately?
Wake me up when I can get one of these.
--
"Outlook not so good." That magic 8-ball knows everything! I'll ask about Exchange Server next.
Because dogs are useless in deep penetration missions. Or whatever you would like to call them.
I have read about experiences of dogs just dropping dead after couple of weeks behind enemy lines. That's just not cool. There is a reason why we evolved to use only two legs.
But things get *shot at* in battle. Remember the Middle Ages? They armored horses then, even developed races of extra-large battle-horses to carry the armor and an aromred knight. If animals were better than machines in battle, the Polish cavalry should have defeated the German panzers in 1939.
Prototype Robot Dog
erroneous: look me up in a dictionary
How can the army agree to spend money on a science fiction project like this?
I remember seeing a program on Discovery of the armys various failed attempts at creating fully autonomous high-altitude spy-planes. I mean seriously, why not use a remote-controlled aircraft? (which is actually what they use, to some extent)
The same applies for this; sure, you could use a weird million dollar dog to carry your equipment. Or you could use an ACTUAL LIVE DOG or a DAMN HORSE.
Who's going to carry the robotic dog food?
ARTHUR:
What happens now?
BEDEVERE:
Well, now, uh, Launcelot, Galahad, and I, uh, wait until nightfall, and then leap out of the rabbit, taking the French, uh, by surprise. Not only by surprise, but totally unarmed!
ARTHUR:
Who leaps out?
BEDEVERE:
U-- u-- uh, Launcelot, Galahad, and I, uh, leap out of the rabbit, uh, and uh...
Reminds me of Zhuge Liang's wooden oxen (back in the 3rd century AD - though now people think looking at the plans he left behind it might just have described the invention of the wheelbarrow rather than an actual mechanical beast)! From Romance of the Three Kingdoms:
"I have had a scheme ready for a long time. The timber that I collected and bought in the River Lands was for the construction of wooden transport animals to convey grain. It will be very advantageous, as they will require neither food nor water and they can keep on the move day and night without resting...They are being made now after my plans, but they are not yet ready. Here I have the sketches for these mechanical oxen and horses, with all their dimensions written out in full. You may see the details."
Zhuge Liang then produced a paper, and all the generals crowded round to look at it. They were all greatly astonished and lauded, "The Prime Minister is superhuman!"
A few days later the new mechanical animals were complete and began work. They were quite life-like and went over the hills in any desired direction. The whole army saw them with delight. They were but in charge of Right General Gao Xiang and a thousand soldiers to guide them. They kept going constantly between Saber Pass and the front carrying grain for the use of the soldiers.
Along the Saber Pass mountain roads
The running horses bore their loads,
And through Xie Valley's narrow way
The wooden oxen paced each day.
O generals, use these means today,
And transport troubles take away.
Where asked where the idea came from he replied:
"The world is filled with things of man's making. I have long observed vehicles throughout the land, and considered the principle by which beasts of burden walk, and thus invented this..."
The story also comes with a case of military espionage as the enemy Sima Yi captures some of them and tries to copy the design.
er, welcome our, er, robot dog overlords.
There are places where the networks are not touching,and there are places where they are-Boeing's Lori Gunter
Didn't Mr. Clinton already create an Atomic Dog ?
What would we do if robo fido saw robo fifi we would just end up being out of 2.5 million dollars. Or even worse if he saw robo Mr. Kitty he would be gone in a flash.
MonkeysKickAss
Live animals have lots of limitations: most notably, if you don't treat them well, they die.
As for why "dogs", well, legged vehicles - autonomous or not - should have a lot of advantages in broken terrain.
Finally, I'd like to point out that if the army *didn't* invest in science fiction projects, you wouldn't be reading this message, because the internet wouldn't exist.
Clear, Dark Skies
In the "robot lobster" article... "Biomimetic Underwater Robot Program". I can see it now...
... later
Ensign Schmoe: Captain! The waters ahead appear to be mined!
Captain: Very well... launch a BURP!
ENS Schmoe: Aye aye, sir!
(loudspeaker) All hands man your BURP stations!
*splash*
ENS Schmoe: BURP away, Captain!
Sean
There has never been a true communist state
There have been several. Vietnam, Korea, and Cuba are remaining examples.
Whether or not they are "true" communist is possibly debatable. However, these countries are as "true" as communism gets.
He's going to hire them to run across Iraq, delivering USO packages to the troops.
There exists no way of exchanging information without making judgments. --Bene Gesserit Axiom
Because when you have 1/3 of the taxpayer's dollars to do whatever you fuckin want, and you got to spend it, you start to lose that kind of perspective. How's about this: a ROBOT FUCKING NEGOTIATOR??! Oh, sorry, i forgot that the plan is to ALWAYS be at WAR! How's about a robot that delivers some sense to General Thompson (the third) when he suggests a ROBOT DOG??!!
There are no trolls. There are no trees out here.
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So, is it your contention that the high-tech research resulting from this, and the money spent, somehow doesn't benefit the general population? They spend that money on stuff...stuff that the citizens make. They spend that money on research - employing us. The results of that research then become consumer-grade products, which, guess what, benefit us.
This is like people carping about the cost of space programs..."All that money shot up into space when there are hungry chillllldrun" and all that. The money doesn't go away just because it's being spent, it gets spent to further jobs and technologies that employ and benefit us.
Some damned Rebel Flyer wraps a cable around the legs.
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you'd know that they actually require a good deal of pampering to get them to perform reliably.
Besides, I'd love to see a dog that can carry a 40 pound pack all day.
Clear, Dark Skies
I think that they should look to Scifi for inspiration... Wasn'r R2 *designed* for most of what they are talking about? Maybe they can go ahead and make C3PO while they are at it, or lightsabers. That would scare the shiat out of the enemy...
"If you have done 6 impossible things this morning, why not round it off with breakfast at Milliways" -- hhgg
were empathically bonded with their dogs and vice versa; and the bugs decimated the k-9'ers by killing one half of each team - which rendered the other half an emotional cripple.
Clear, Dark Skies
In Schwartzeneggar's voice, "The war of the machines has started! IIIAAAAUUUU!!"
now they want more money?
This idea came pretty quickly after the new Battlestar Galatica movie.
sergeant dagget?
...when we really should have been watching out for LickYourOwnBallsNet.
Wouldn't they have more fun looking at pictures of naked women? Is this what happens when the armed forces can only recruit hayseeds from poor areas in the south?
Edith Keeler Must Die
The wars of the future will not be fought on the battlefield or at sea.
They will be fought in space, or possibly on top of a very tall
mountain. In either case, most of the actual fighting will be done by
small robots. And as you go forth today remember always your duty is
clear: To build and maintain those robots. Thank you.
-- Military school Commandant's graduation address, "The Secret War of
Lisa Simpson"
What is funny is that we are already building so many robots to kill people, like cruise missiles for example, drone spy planes etc. Where has the Asimov's idea of the three robotics laws gone?
You can't handle the truth.
I am holding out for the first generation of Robot Goats(e)!
The future is ALL robots on the battle field. It has alread started. The predator drone is the first big step. It flies and attacks remotely. All of the new DoD research money is going toward robotic replacements for soldiers. Our tanks now are controlled completely electronically. It shouldn't make a difference whether the soldiers are staring at a computer monitor inside the tank or miles away in a safe place. And why send a soldier down a fox hole, when an X10 wireless webcam and a $30 RC car from radioshack would do the job? The final step will be when mostly human-shaped robots with rifles are controlled remotely. It would be able to do most things a soldier does if it has a microphone and speakers and video cammera. He could see and hear what it does and speak through it. It will be much easier to take over 3rd world conutries when we have no casualties, soldiers don't have to sleep, and have machine accuracy for targeting.
A slashdotter who didn't build his own computer is like a Jedi who didn't build his own lightsaber.
And instead of hauling a broken machine back after a prolonged firefight in which it became damaged, you can eat it...
meh
Extended Warranty? How can I lose!
Dogs, with bees in their mouths, and when they bark they shoot bees at you
This sounds a little like the robot dog from Neal Stephenson's book "Snow Crash".
The robotic dog from the movie "Red planet" comes to mind. It's certainly one of the deadliest and most believable robots in the history of cinema - small, fast, reasonably strong and with many robotic features.
Honestly, it was the best part of a mediocre movie.
Sigged!
Have a look at their Engineering page. You'll see images of both Rugged RHex (featured on Slashdot earlier) as well as Sony's bipedal Qrio robot. Marc Raibert has assembled an impressive team of people to work on these very cool projects.
Once you work out the fine points of making the robot walk correctly, how do you get it to follow the army without being a liability? You don't want it falling into the hands of the enemy with all your supplies on board. Every method of signaling I can think of seems vulnerable to jamming or duping.
Bleeding edge research always costs alot of money but if they are successfully it could have a huge impact. For instance, how about robotic seeing eyedogs? I'm sure there are countless applications for this sort of technology.
I'm also sure that there have been many military research projects that have had huge benefits for society. I can't recall any off hand but I can barely remember what I had for supper last night.
"Thanks to the remote control I have the attention span of a gerbil."
Go Bobby... Go fetch Osama for Uncle Sam
42 + 1 = 42
If anything the POTY issue would have become a two-edged sword: acknowledging, but also revealing, the extent of his influence -- and surely, surely discussing his role as a lightning rod for those who disagree with Bush's policies. (And even for those who agree; Italy and Spain begged Bush to keep Rummy on a leash before the Security Council's meeting with Powell, because all his "old Europe" comments were pissing everyone off.)
According to "The Hill," from which this story came,
Time Managing Editor James Kelly ...in an editor's note recount(ed) that when he and several other editors "met with Rumsfeld at the Pentagon in November to talk about the war, [the Defense Secretary] made the pitch, unsolicited by us, that the Person of the Year should be the American soldier. (Or as he put it, the American volunteer.)"
What Rummy did was shrewd. He's deflecting fire from himself by equating the military with the policies it carries out.
Time, meanwhile, has just accepted editorial direction from Donald Rumsfeld. (Those rascally liberals in the media! What won't they do to shoot down this President! It's an outrage!)
"Fundamentalism" isn't about divine morality. It's about human authority.
If you're really that disgusted, now's a better time than ever to get your feet wet in politics. Campaign yourself. Put your money where your mouth is. Or hell, lobby. Demonstrate. Do something! Don't just sit on slashdot bitching that you're disgusted.
So many people complain that both parties are corrupt, but when it's ballot-punching time those same complainers get their buttons pressed just like every other schmoe and panic-vote for the lesser-of-the-two-evils.
After the debacle in Florida in 2000 it's going to be easier than ever to keep people locked into the existing two parties.
So what is a solution that will work? How do you suggest dealing with the problems you moan about? Because if you don't have a solution, working within the existing system will do a hell of a lot more to change things than sitting on your ass and complaining that the system doesn't work will.
Remember, the only built the robotic dog because they did not have time/resources to bring along the real dogs(Daggits).
Looking for a job?
Want your resume written professionally?
DON'T USE TUNAREZ!!!
phewww.
i never saw this show but a buddy of mine (DanK of Leviathan Enterprises) raves on about how we should turn his EV1 robotics kit into a full fledged k-9 robot dog. the theme song rocks my socks, though.
my contribution was that it should probably dock up to some sort of "water dish" which would recharge its batteries.
SIGERR: laziness exceeds quota
link. [grin]
Ant(Dude) @ Quality Foraged Links (AQFL.net) & The Ant Farm (antfarm.ma.cx / antfarm.home.dhs.org).
People, read dada21's posts and realize you're dealing with a True Believer. He's only going to provide countless conspiracy theories showing that every major war, the Great Depression, the Holocaust, the Dark Ages, and Adam Sandler were all caused by the ever-present scapegoat of Mercantilism. The solution is So Simple: everyone should just switch to Anarchocapitalism. Of course, if anyone points out any flaws or failings of capitalism, he will just claim that that's not really capitalism, but Mercantilism.
Just ignore him and realize that there's little point in debating him, since a) he will never be swayed by arguments, only by growing out of this little phase, and b) his "anarchocapitalist" utopia will never come about, so there's no need to fight it.
I am Sartre of the Borg. Existence is futile.
Prelude of things to come?
The GEEK shall inherit the earth...
There's been a lot of press lately about our supersoldiers of the future, and all the gear they'll carry, and how they'll be able to camoflauge themselves with adaptive bodysuits and all this stuff. Now they're going to have robotic dogs (presumably with adaptive camoflauge as well) following them around, but the technology is many years off because robots with legs don't work very well. I have two suggestions. 1) Use real dogs for now. Dogs can be about as well trained as most soldiers, probably better. They are all-terrain, rugged, and their food probably won't weigh more than a battery. 2)Keep on dumping money into robotics R&D. This keeps geeks and other Worthwhile People in gainful employ, AND the sooner you develop a robot that can walk properly, the sooner you develop a robot that can get me a beer from the fridge.
here. Sorry, I need more caffeine!
Ant(Dude) @ Quality Foraged Links (AQFL.net) & The Ant Farm (antfarm.ma.cx / antfarm.home.dhs.org).
For quiet actuators they should look at the Shadow Project http://www.shadow.org.uk - they make artificial muscles that run on compressed air.
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I've used them and they're very quiet, and extremely strong.
Of course, when you need more compressed air, things get very noisy. But it runs quietly as long as its tank of compressed air lasts.
"The Air Muscle is an extraordinary actuator that is small, light, simple and 'friendly'. It is soft, has no stiction, is easily controllable and exceptionally powerful.
The Air Muscle consists of a rubber tube covered in tough plastic netting which shortens in length like a human muscle when inflated with compressed air at low pressure.
An Air Muscle has a power-to-weight ratio as high as 400:1, vastly outperforming both pneumatic cylinders and DC motors that can attain a ratio of only about 16:1. It has been in continuous development for advanced robotics work by Shadow since 1982, and is now available for use in a variety of applications as a powerful, lightweight actuator. Air Muscles are normally operated using compressed air in the 0-60psi (0-4 bar) range."
http://www.shadow.org.uk/products/airmuscles.sh
Video of Shadow air muscles in action:
http://www.shadow.org.uk/movies/HandA-be
If this "dog" was being developed for walking on Mars or running Linux as an OS, the Slashdot community would have an enormous boner about how cool it was. Since its for a military purpose, it must be bad and no other useful technology could possibly come from this rearch?
The most obvious movie comparison is that of the little Marine doggy they brought along on Red Planet. It went wacko and killed everyone except Val Kilmer.
Concentrated private power is every bit as dangerous to liberty as excessive government power, and in some respects even more so, since government quickly becomes its tool. Believe it or not, some people think this is going on in the U.S. right now.
Only the "chicken littles" who don't look where the real danger is. The government "slice" of the GDP is getting larger and larger, and government is taxing the hell oot of business and over-regulating at an inreasing rate.
The dog ate my orders, honest!
Laws come from a societal need, usually in backlash to something undesirable.
In the absence of laws, the cheapest alternative and the safest alternative to accomplish something will always exist in tandem. In the case of robotic killers, they may be cheapest AND safest, when compared to the cost of deploying trained (expensive!) human soldiers.
I am looking for VC money to create technology to help eDogs sniff butts just like real ones. Brown-nosing experts also wanted.
Table-ized A.I.
Great, now my robot insurance is going to raise rates.
help fill in hidden movie endings @ End of the Credits
Combine this with a robotic nose and a little more homeland security and we have a Fahrenheit 451 situation here!
I can see it now..
It's been a while.
Heh. Now I'm going to spend the rest of the day telling people "I am a 30 second bomb."
Clear, Dark Skies
all this talk of human/dog/elephant/your favorite beast-shaped robots just over the horizon is confusing.
...just cut off their robotic noses and throw them into our tanks.
what's the advantage of being human/dog/elephant shaped (but 10 times heavier than a real one?) weight distribution and center of gravity issues could pose real problems to mobility.
can dogs carry more burden than trucks? tracked vehicles? or do these robotic dogs have dog-smell (spidey-sense-style) too?
there's no benefit in restricting technology by forcing them to play by the rules and constraints of living, organic creatures.
in other words, robotic tanks have real function and purpose. robotic human-sized androids with superhuman strength wielding a 155mm howitzer fired via a finger trigger over one big crazy shoulder and aimed with a little scope on top => utterly senseless waste of money.
I suspect that dogs are looked on as "A Man's Best Friend". Besides, if it were a mule, folks would start calling it a Robot Ass...
When you hear the knocking at the door, don't bother trying to run or hide. Running and hiding from the RoboAntEater3000 is futile.
The tongue will find you.
I'm too lazy to compose a creative sig.
During WW2, soviet dog were trained to go hunt tanks. The dogs carried explosives and ran under tanks were the bomb evantually detonated. The problem was that the dogs didn't make the differance between the bad and the good guys tanks. The dogs mostly ran under the soviet tanks that were used for their training. You can find this story in that book Book
Colosse.
Wasn't this the plot of "screamers" or something like that? Though they had a hot robotic girl too....
man, you suck monkey balls I'm not kidding, you must be the biggest moron on /. since that other guy who was more stupid
It should be noted that "Mine-Destroying Robot Lobsters" would be a good name for a rock band.
What about Squid-inspired hovering hunter killer machines? They could call them 'Sentinels'...
% Some time later, the city honors Bart for his work.
Quimby: For decimating our giant robot pigeon population, and making Springfield a less oppressive place to while away our worthless lives, I present you with this scented candle.
% Away from the speech, Skinner and Lisa talk.
Skinner: Well, I was wrong. The giant robot lizards are a godsend.
Lisa: But isn't that a bit short-sighted? What happens when we're overrun by giant robot lizards?
Skinner: No problem. We simply release wave after wave of giant robot Chinese needle snakes. They'll wipe out the giant robot lizards.
Lisa: But aren't the giant robot snakes even worse?
Skinner: Yes, but we're prepared for that. We've lined up a fabulous type of giant robot gorilla that thrives on giant robot snake meat.
Lisa: But then we're stuck with giant robot gorillas!
Skinner: No, that's the beautiful part. When wintertime rolls around, the giant robot gorillas simply freeze to death.
Is this a sigs-optional kind of place? 'Cause I am totally down with that if you know what I mean.
where they release a robotic dog to track down criminals and televise it on tv... and in the dog's mouth it has a cyanide syringe. COPS in 2050? who knows...
So, If the Government in the Terminatormovies, had designed these medical bots, I wonder how the robotic rebellion would have looked like then.
when the Mississippi Robotic Leg Hound takes a notion to his leg. A little tip for the enemy: "It's best to just let him finish."
796F75617265616E65726400
Why does it have to be a dog? Does it have to be a quadraped at all? Why not a robotic self-guided wheeled platform???
Well "K-9" was already used back in the 70s over several seasons of Dr. Who , and even had his own pilot spin-off show called "K-9 and Company" (gay name to be sure).
Hopefully these new ones will also have the radar ears for triangluation and a laser blaster nose... in addition to the requisite chess playing abilities and witty banter.
-Jake Bullet
well, these things would have to be wired to a network to operate, they need an operating system too, no they wont use linux or anything like that, they'll use a military-like software, right?
hopefully, but yeah, my point is, this could be more dangerous than helpful, seeing as technology fails, enemy can get their hands on it, midify it to use against us, or since they'll have to be on a network to recieve orders or work alongside, etc.. that could be accessed and hacked, and all of a sudden, man's artificial best friend will be his worst enemy on the battlefield. instead of giving him supplies, it's attacking him or jumping on him when he's about to fire, or knocks a mortar over in the direction of the unit.
isnt a wise idea. we put too much faith into machinery and computers, what happens when it fails? and with the way computers are still entirely unreliable 100% of the time, and are as flawed as people make them, I wouldnt trust them.
I also wouldnt trust a dog created by man.
I wonder what kind of genetically engineered dog beast they could come up with for 2.5 million. Look at the amazing variation in canine species achieved through passive manipulation (selective breeding), and imagine what could be done with active manipulation through genetic engineering and goal of creating a large, robust, energy efficient, intelligent, and fast animal capable of serving as a pack animal, protector, or weapon.
If they can make a cat that glows under UV light, why can't we have battlefield dog beasts! Besides, just imagine the fun the soldiers could have when they cry out "Release the HOUNDS!" or "CRY HAVOC! and LET SLIP THE DOGS OF WAR!"
The idea that making them exactly like animals is a primary goal of this project is a misconception. The only similarity between these robots and a real dog is that they have 4 legs and they're about the same size. The 4-legged design was chosen so they could navigate more varied terrain than a wheeled robot.
Why not just use a _real_ dog?
...is that someone that has a different opinion than you is considered 'brainwashed.' That is the level that discourse has sunk to all across America.
The reason why there are no wheels in larger animals is because of the problem in feeding the wheels. How would a rotary joint carry blood across? Indeed, I think you are right, if Nature had evolved wheels, many animals would have tracks instead of legs.
I think a better explaination is that nature never developed roads. Only a few natural locations exist where long straight even terrain would be benificail to those organisms with wheels instead of legs. On the other hand, nature is mostly rough, uneven, and marked with vegitation. Small creatures might get away with rolling around for short distance, but large animals with wheels instead of legs are unpractical.
I always knew the movie C.H.O.M.P.S. (http://imdb.com/title/tt0078924/) would eventually become reality.
I really felt for that dog. Especially when it got half it's face blown off and started to overheat. Can't remember whether they mentioned if they bothered to reconnect the pain recptors of its organic brain.
Does anyone have any info on the development progress of electromagnetic pulse weapons (nuclear or otherwise)? Goldeneye-type stuff? It would seem something like this could turn a battalion of robot soldiers or field of robotic support dogs into a pile of titanium scrap.
Hrmm. A little googling revealed this rather thorough article in the Crypt Newsletter that seems to indicate that any claims these weapons are viable is hogwash.
So bring on the robots! Woo-hoo!
True, wheels are a fairly terrible form of movement unless you have a road system of some kind. One of the Central American civilizations (Mayan or Incan) had children's toys with wheels but never implemented them in actual carts because of the rugged terrain.
Likewise, there is good evidence that the inhabitants of the Northern Sahara abandoned the wheel for the same reason.
When the robot dog is captured, say in China, it won't be eaten, unlike a real dog or cat.
"...The original DARPA internet was funded by the US DoD..."
According to Al Gore, the internet was created when Gore was in the Senate.
First we get the robotic Dog/Mule/Horse then we get the Robotic Marine, Robotic Pilot ( already in limited use ). Wars become telecomuting jobs from underground bunkers in Kansas.
Afterall this seems the logical direction for american military might to take due to the ever increasing desire to spare human life even while we take it.
This way we can project our might (noses?) without ever leaving home.
If this prooves successfull it looks like the military will bankroll the creation of mechanical slave labor. Afterall once you have inspect/repair capacity AND real world manouvering capacity you have the pieces needed to form a self sufficient robot poulation.... just so long as we don't let them form SKYNET !!! wait we already elected the terminator.... run for the hills AHHHHH.
Ok the last bit got silly, but seriously if you can make robots work in the real world... and I don't think it gets more real than something that can autonomously keep up with soldiers in the bush... and Robots capable of a wide range of diagnostic/repair actions you really can put them to work from the begining of the production cycle to the end. Thus they becomes our slaves or our overlords.
Do we control or welcome them ? After all a mechanical labor pool could well kill capitalisim as a viable system.
I don't ask you to be me. I only ask you not expect me to be you.
If I were the enemy, I'd make a virus that reprograms the robodogs...
"No! Down robodog! What ARE you trying to do to my leg!? BAD robodog!"
...if they will invest in robotic mares to prevent STD spread and sexual abuse of civilians by soldiers.
The Japanese have already been working hard on their robot war dogs. We need to hurry up.
US Army creates a mine detecting lobster!
US Army creates strawberry grenades!
US Army creates Penguin Missles!
US Army creates glitter cannon, which utilizeses little stored rays of sunshine to defeat the enemies.
and all the how-to's to build these will arrive on slashdot in two weeks...
When they start developing a robotic chimp, we'll know Bush is secretly planning for his succession.
The DoD is also working on robotic soldiers to be best friends with the dogs.
As a bonus, the robotic dogs have been trained to declare all foreign fire hydrants as U.S. territory.
Ceci n'est pas une signature.
people that grew up after the transformers got lame and stupid and turned into "BEAST WARS" now have themselves grown up and have jobs in the Army.
My opinions are my own, and do not necessarily represent those of my employer.
Does anyone here remember the crap that US Navy went through with animal rights activists over training Dolphins to look for mines attached to ships (or, potentially to put them there)? So now you want to know why they are investigating mechanical dogs, mules, elephants, lobsters, etc rather than putting real animals in harm's way?
When they use animals they're cruel, thoughtless and exploitative. When they use machines they are mindless wasters of taxpayer money.
I detect a public that can't make up their mind what they want. Either way, the military must be pilloried because it's the politically correct thing to do.
But, if you absolutely must build something mechanical with legs, why not a robot bug instead of a robot dog ? Unlike dogs, bugs have 6 legs, which means that they can always keep 3 legs on the ground, which makes them easier to build.
>|<*:=
That's it, I'm moving to Canada.
I'm a minister!
Don't be surprised when the Army adds to the feature requirements: robotic dogs must have bees in their mouth and when they bark they shoot bees at you.
Your Momma's so fat she makes emacs look like nano!
Go Fido Go!
Wil the robot dogs shoot robot bees out of their mouths?
It's simple: I demand prosecution for torture.
I guess a robotic donkey wouldn't be as cool as a robotic dog. Why do we even make these things resemble animals? They're made out of metal.
Military Intelligence for ya.
Kind of a nit, but it wasn't really a robot dog, it was a cyborg dog with a real live organic dog brain that thought it was a normal dog. A much sadder creature.
The enemies of Democracy are
I saw the designs, and they suck. Bigtime.
When you're riding a bicycle you don't want to carry a ruck.
When you're marching for twenty miles, you really don't want to carry a ruck.
They need to shitcan the "dog" anthropomorhpic and look into the spider format, then supersize that puppy, so you can get some utility out of it. Spiders are a much better model, and imagine the terror they would invoke (mmmmmm, sweet terror).
The spider morphic is a great design, tested by nature, it can be accessorized to work in different terrain. Water wouldn't get it down, just give it some "water-skipper" booties.
Swamp? Not an issue, just give it a floatie around it's midsection and it will move through any deep spots by flicking along.
Wooded terrain? It could easily amble along a game trail by making it's "working footprint" narrower, just like a real spider.
If I'm in the desert or tundra/snow-pack, just put some booties on the bugger and it will amble along just fine, could even "self-right" when necessary and it would be able to hold my baggage on a spine-framework where the abdomen would be. And it would be able to roll and remain static by dropping power to the the elastomer muscles, allowing the mechanical resistive force of the legs to retract into that familiar "ARGH! Something just touched me" posture spiders can assume.
Another nice aspect of the spider design is that it could also support a winch, survive a fall using that "touched spider" config, and if you drape it in camo net or a poncho it would give you shade (depending on the scale). This would be a serious asset for squad missions, and you would only need one, maybe two of these to support a squad. With the proper leg configuration and a solar-cell "net", it could recharge itself during breaks, hold radio gear (bluetooth squad commo through the puppy on crypt/fm), and a mess of other things that make sense. But really, unload the soldier so "light-fighter" makes sense. They want soldiers that weight 150lbs and then they put a 100lbs on their back and act like this is some kind of good idea. Ha!
A dog-bot...sheesh, typical DARPA lack of vision.
You'd think Dr. Evil and his friends at DARPA would at least demand a
"LASER".
Every new form of media has it's own Requirimento
Bunker-buster bomb: Take a normal 2000 lb. dumb iron bomb, strap a GPS guidance system to it, and weld an artillery tube to its nose. These were made on the fly during the First Gulf War to take out Iraqi bunkers.
Cost: $20,000. Works near-instantaneously.
Giant robot anteater: Based on technology and AI routines that don't exist yet. Unsure if one is feasible or even effective at its mission requirements.
Cost: Millions+ to develop, unknown cost estimate to produce. Takes hours or days to work if it does indeed work.
Hmm. Seems like a no-brainer to me.
Light a fire for a man and he'll be warm for a day. Light a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
Sony Research and Development ?
Why is ARO developing this technology from scratch? Sony's AIBO and QRIO research teams already have many of these problems solved -- they already have a running bipedal robot. The author of the article fails to even mention these programs. This seems like a remarkably inefficient way to go about solving problems.
Will they be any good with plum sauce?
In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king.
The robot dogs, called Rat Things, were residential watchdogs communicating with other Rat Things in the neighbourhood, sort of a hive mind.
Rat Things can be descendants of what the military is coming up with right now.
...proving that RHex can beat up Roomba.
They have robotic bees in their mouth and when they bark they shoot robotic bees at you...
It's OVERLORDS, sheesh.
paintball
You should use the Ice Shotgun on Spark Mandrill.
On the other hand a "dog" type robot that would mimic the protective nature of a real dog, while carrying supplies would be a welcome thing on the battle field. Start thinking like FPS here...in the real world there aren't medpacks convienantly stashed by the enemy in a safe corner out of range of the guns...but these robots could take medical supplies, spare ammo, etc to troops in buildings, caves and other spaces no vehicle can follow. That extra bit of help could be the difference between a successful or failed mission...or more dead troops. Or, They could be programmed to home on fallen troops taking communications and medical supplies to a soilder rather than pulling another soilder from the mission...
However, pure oxygen at lower pressures is not lethal at all (well, not directly, anyway).
The intention was to have pure oxygen at lower pressure, which would have simplified some components and saved some weight in the space capsule.
What killed the Apollo 1 astronauts was not the pure oxygen atmosphere, but the fire that spread rapidly in it, due to normally low-combustable materials having much higher combustability in the pure oxygen atmosphere.
Those who sacrifice security to condemn liberty deserve to repeat history or something. - Benjamin Santayana
This sounds good. They'll work out a design spec for DogOne, build a few prototypes, test them a bit in simulated combat and order 20,000 for immediate deployment.
Then six days after deployment, somebody will decide that they need a bigger DogTwo to carry more stuff and a bid request will go out, followed by testing, big orders etc.
And then six days after that one is fully deployed, they'll decide that Dog version 2 is still not enough so the concept for DogThree will be developed. D3 will be spec'd to carry tons of supplies without complaint across all terrain in all weather, and it must be capable of carrying soldiers if needed.
Four years later, DogThree will immerge looking suspiciously exactly like a WWII era Jeep, because THAT'S WHAT IT IS. Except, they'll fly, cost $40 million each and weigh 20 tons.
Remember, the Humvee was born from a program to replace the simple but effective Jeep. Compare size and utility of Jeep with Humvee. That's what happens when the Military starts with a simple idea and packs on the upgrades and "wouldn't it be great if it coulds...."
So they'll start with this stupid idea for a robot dog that seems to be nothing more than a pack mule*, and out will come a flying cargo Jeep no doubt armed with a cannon, anti-tank rockets, etc etc etc, and built to carry full-size truck containers.
*Apparently the fact that real pack mules already exist is not important. No doubt the machine version will be infinitely better so long as you keep it out of the rain. Guess freaking out about rust beats stepping in mule waste.
"Dog"
- Biological templates are quaint, but mythological and fictional templates should be considered as well. Probably, the "Dog" design template was first considered because the K-9 units have the necessary transport containers. Fuel is probably high-energy canned cyber-spam.
"Centaur"
- 4-legs and 2-arms. Better in-field manipulator capability. Optional 6-legged gait. Multiple survivable gait modes on battle field. Can be armed with TOW-missiles, or in a pinch, bows and arrows. And can be camoflaged with bearskins. Top speed around 80 kph, but would require a very compact high-capacity drive system, and high-capacity heat stealthing technology. Probably feeds on cyber-hay.
"Push-me Pull-you"
- Two heads are better than one. Better surveillance coverage through independent sensor mounts. Improved survivability. Faster refuel rate. No waste. Dual visual-acquired-targeting systems for liquid stun propellent for close combat. Great pack robot, being sure-footed, as long as both sensor mounts compute the same terrain navigation solution. Also, probably, feeds on cyber-hay.
"Incredible Mr. Limpet"
- Well, yes, the Don Knotts character was some kind of human-transformed tuna, but an actual limpet is a rather obnoxious mollusk well known for fastening en masse onto the hulls of ships, disrupting the efficient flow of water, thereby increasing drag, and reducing manueverability and speed.
Now consider, a robo-limpet designed to increase the drag on enemy foot soldiers, by increasing their inertial fully-loaded mass by 20%, or by simply changing their center of gravity by 15%.
The robo-limpets would roll, drop, or glide into combat, identify an enemy combatant, and then latch on with the ultimate crazy-glue foam system.
The foam could be designed as an unstable acrylic-based, or urethane-based, plastic explosive, sensitive to sudden impacts, heat, and electrical discharges, when hardened.
There would be a spray-on catalyst that would dissolve the foam harmlessly, for those combatants quick enough to avoid losing their balance, after a limpet attacks, and smart enough to surrender. Light armor units could have difficulty with robo-limpets, as well.
Active flock/flight-control and target-acquisition would allow airdrop, catapult, or mass-driver, delivery so that payload can be maximized. Fuel not required. Robo-limpet capacitors would be charged using microwave transducers just prior to airdrop. A robo-limpet should be about the size of a paintball, and a few dozen should be able to immobilize an enemy combatant. A normal air-drop from a single B-52 should consist of several million robo-limpets.
"Kanga and Roo"
- A high-speed, extremely capable, obstacle jumper, capable of target-hovering to launch a secondary delivery system with smaller attack profile and higher penetration speed. Besides, both systems would pack a "punch" when facing enemy combatants. Watch out for the tails and the left-hooks.
"Heffalump"
- High capacity, multi-tonnage, transport robot, equipped with phased-array radar and infra-sound detectors with air-coverage range, snorkle-capable flexible breather manipulator for submerged transport and self-maintenance, optional battering rams, and stealth capability. Definitely feeds on cyber-hay - and honey.
I haven't seen one - Have you? (grin)
DarkStarZumaBeachSurfinApocalypseWow
and have machine accuracy for targeting.
They also have machine accuracy in judgement.
Donate background CPU time to fight cancer.