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Wal-Mart Sells PCs Preloaded With Sun's Linux
badboy3062 writes "Wal-Mart this week started selling Microtel PCs preloaded with Sun's Java Desktop System. Prices start at under $300 for a system without a floppy drive or monitor. Jonathan Schwartz, Sun's executive vice president for software, says this move is just another step in its plan to gain new audiences for its technologies."
No... must... not... shop... at... evil... Wal*Mart... must... stay... away...
It kind of pains me to see this. Why does a store that I hate have to go and do something that smacks of coolness? Why couldn't it be Target or KMart?
And isn't Microtel a motel chain?
You are in error. No-one is screaming. Thank you for your cooperation.
This sounds great at first glance but my gut feeling is that most of these units sold will be reformatted with Windows. That's the ugly truth methinks.
Trolling is a art,
Does Sun require an annual support subscription for these things, like their enterprise versions?
Because if so, there's going to be a lot of unpatched Linux boxes out there in a year or so.
Reading the Walmart page (link in the article, or http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.gsp?cat=395 1&dept=3944&product_id=2592736&path=0%3A3944%3A395 1%3A41937%3A86796%3A132690) I finding it amusing that WalMart sells the Sun Linux OS as "the first viable Microsoft Windows alternative." Does this mean that Lindows and Mandrake, sold on other WalMart cheap-PC's isn't a viable alternative?
Because you know that a floppy drive adds hundreds to the manufacturing cost.
Quid festinatio swallonis est aetherfuga inonusti?
Africus aut Europaeus?
What's up with everyone wanting to put their linux stuff in walmart? Does it actually amount to sales? My guess is that having something to sell in Wallmart is more about PR than sales.
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And here is the link to the accessory they recommend for this item (guess who).
I don't know whether this is informative or humorous. I chuckled and shook my head at the same time.
Microsoft Trackball Optical
HAHAHAHAHAH
REM Old programmers don't die. They just GOSUB without RETURN.
From what I understand, It's a Linux system, running a modified Gnome with some extra nicely well done integration with Java's runtime. I think more accurately it should be called the 'C' desktop.
I wonder if it's bundled with 'digital ready' speakers.
Does it hurt to hear them lying? Was this the only world you had?
here you go
as low as $288
vodka, straight up, thank you!
clicky
I am an IT (greatly diminished by the times) and I still need to use a floppy from time to time for standard office tasks or to move something small quickly across the room. It is handy to secure something small as management demands it sometimes. I am happy to oblige because if I hand it to then then at least it's part of their responsibility now (LOL silly them). How does everyone else feel?
Wal-Mart, USA's largest retailer and biggest employer, set on stage to go head to head with Microsoft, evil software giant extrodinare. Something tells me Ali vs. Foreman this ain't.
You can't spell LOLCATZPURR without TROLL.
"Sun has delivered the first viable Microsoft Windows alternative. The Java desktop system is a more affordable, secure desktop, designed to thrive in a Windows-centric world and run thousands of Java technology-based applications."
It goes on and on, including mentioning that it comes with StarOffice, it can exchange files with MS Office, it isn't prone to viruses, etc. They really are doing a good job at selling this to the average person and letting them know that there is a pretty viable option to Windows (other than mac of course)
But does it run Windows?
Its been around for a while, I like its clean look. Here's more info
This will be interesting to see what Micros~1 does against this. Microsoft is big, but I do think Walmart might be bigger in terms of value. Not sure about who lobbies the most.
I have never let my schooling interfere with my education.
It's just marketing-speak. The Walmart page is an advertisement, after all.
The local pc shop in my area sells that case for $6 bucks. I wonder if it's NEBS level 3 certified?
*groans* Now customers are going to call me... "How do I set up my server?" - "Sir, where did you get that server? HP? IBM?" - "Wal-mart!"
Those are "Lindows" machines, not "Sun Java Whatever" machines.
I can see it now
"Hello AOL internet support, how can I help you?"
"I just bought this PC from wallmart and I can't check my mail"
The Java Desktop is a subscriber product did Wal~Mart get a discount due to expected volume or does the end user have to pay an annual maintenance fee for updates. IIRC it was $50-$100 per year depending on if you got it during the big sale (possibly still in progress). Having to pay that sort of maintenece costs would seem to push users toward Mandrake.
I'm actually curious because I had the same idea, but didn't investigate it far enough to see if SUN was willing to cut OEM customers a break. It would be nice to advertise a SUN operating system that everyone is hearing so much about rather than the scary (to small customers) Linux.
Degaussing scares the bad magnetism out of the monitor and fills it with good karma.
is that why sun didn't want to open up java? to protect their new java desktop "os"?
hmmm....
e.
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So, does this mean that wal*mart is going to start stocking software for linux as well? Or just the cool windows games as usual?
-- The major difference between a thing that might go wrong and a thing that cannot possibly go wrong is that when a thi
This is a genius price, and wal-mart's massive distribution capabilities could easily push the desktop market dramatically in the direction of linux. How large is wal-mart? Let me give an example. There's the story of the local piemaker who won a contract with wal-mart to sell his pies. Wal-mart ordered 10,000 TRUCKLOADS of pies! If they can do that kinda volume on the linux machines, Microsoft's in for a ride. Fortune 500: Microsoft = #46, Walmart = #1. Walmart wins!
In other news, see my artist interview at fulcrum gallery.
stuff |
My friend has a machine from Wal-Mart, and I'm reasonably sure that he couldn't run Linux to save his life. Most Wal-Mart PC customers aren't going to be comfortable with that kind of power. After all, these are (more-or-less!) the dregs of the technology world; people so far from the bleeding-edge that...I mean, they buy PC's at Wal-Mart. The only effect this is going to have is to expand our reputation for making geek-use-only software. And, of course, boost Dell sales.
Selling *anything* at WallyWorld practically guarantees broad exposure in markets that a vendor might not otherwise reach. Imagine if - years ago - you could have walked into [that store] and picked up an Ultra 10. I use the U10 as an example because it is/was essentially a low-end, mass-marketed (sort of) item from the Sun line. Wal-mart would be unlikely to carry the Ultra 60 just like they are unlikely to carry gigantic plasma TVs: the clientele probably are not the ones to buy high-end merchandise (or at least not buy it there).
PS Microtel makes very, very small communications devices. You're welcome.
I want to drag this out as long as possible. Bring me my protractor.
Hope they weren't indending to sell any Macs.
Atheism is a non-prophet organisation
But chocolate cream pies don't run monolithic kernels with GUI's built on GTK, baked by a thousand international (amateur) chefs.
Wal-mart selling another distro of linux on "their" PC's. That's kinda nifty, but it does make one ask the question:
Could this mean they'll get a clue and make their music store compatible with the computing systems they sell?
(Perhaps maybe around the time when we see Mac OS X run natively on a Microtel PC).
Said alternative is Linux, not Sun's distribution. Read that way, Sun is delivering the first viable alternative to Windows, just as Red Hat, Mandrake, and Debian are also delivering it.
I think that Apple has stronger grounds to be annoyed at that statement, but Sun and Wal-Mart could make the case that Mac OS doesn't run on x86 machines, so it's not a drop-in replacement for Windows.
Dewey, what part of this looks like authorities should be involved?
They might also do for a cheap unix/linux developer box should a PC die unexpectedly at your work place. Being able to pop out and get a PC with Linux preloaded saves quite a bit of setup time and if that saves half a day of installation work that would save money.
U mean me? Or parent? Or the mods that made parent +3 insightful? Anonymous prick. ;p
I just had a client order a PC from Walmart 3 weeks ago, and I thought the cost (with Lindows, not the Sun offering) was more like $215, though that was with 64M RAM. I thought it was $265 after shipping.
Oh well. Still better than paying the Microsoft tax.
- Nice, wide aisles crammed with displays and products, only allowing enough space for a single cart on either side of said display.
- The nearly universal rudeness of the patrons of said store to STOP right in the middle of said aisle and block the way of others.
Because of these two reasons:I talk about stuff.
So, let me take a guess and assume that the primary user is running with root level permissions? That may not be a good thing given 99% of the people who would buy a PC at Wal-Mart probably can't manage/secure their Windows based PC let alone a Linux box.
for the most part this is useless, hardware, why not buy a dell, with twice the processing power for 499, keep the ms windows xp disk, in cas eyou change your mind, and install whichever flavor of linux you want and have a pc that is much quicker, (hardware not os) now if dell sold the same hardware subtracting the cost of windows, then wed all be happier more productive and reliable
is the fact that you can't walk in to Wal-Mart and pick one of these up. They're only available online.
REM Old programmers don't die. They just GOSUB without RETURN.
I've heard really good things about Sun's Java Desktop Linux. If it's based on SuSE (9.0 is so !@#$ sweet it's not even funny), it's gotta be good. I've considered purchasing the $50 discount copy, but I still wonder what their server strategy is. I actually prefer linux on the server to solaris for a lot of reasons, as I don't do anything high level enough to require a sparc. I want an end to end solution, and Sun is making it difficult.
Basically, I like the idea of using the same distribution for the server and my desktop. I can install SuSE on everything from my desktop to the Dell blade servers that I install, and it just works. This is very appealing, since I can become familiar with the environment by using it on my desktop in addition to the server.
When I went to price out one of Sun's new AMD systems, I was somewhat disappointed. First of all, the website does not give the level of detail that Dell's does. I want to know everything about the system from ram speed, to hd speed, to bus speed, etc. Then, I want much more ability to configure scsi, ide, raid levels, etc. On top of that, it was pretty expensive. You can get a dual xeon dell with 2GB of ram, 15K rpm scsi for about $1,000 less than a bare bones sun with an amd chip. For what it's worth, IBM is much worse in this regard when pricing any of their systems online. I think they're even more expensive and the website sucks way more.
Then, you have the option basically for solaris x86 (32 bit) or supplying your own SuSE 64 bit (community edition, whatever that means), or RedHat enterprise.
My conclusion is that Sun is still not going after the low end. I don't know if they just can't get the economies of scale or what, but don't sell an entry level server and pretend that you're going to offer a "premium" entry level server when the website is worse, you have fewer config options, and the price is way more than can be justified.
That said, I hope they read this stuff and adapt. How hard can it be to provide an entry level server when plenty of white box places do it even cheaper than Dell??? I can't even imagine what you get for the premium price tag.
Still, I would love the idea if they gave me a Java Server system with Linux on the bottom of the stack with Java completely installed, configured, and supported, and the option for the Java Enterprise system on top of it. What's with their affinity for Solaris, especially on the low end servers? Even if it's better in some regards, it's not as familiar, performs worse, is difficult to get app support for, etc. Give me the real deal please, which for me is Linux.
The first mac (not apple II/III variant) I ever played with was a 9" B/W fishbowl mac running 7/7.1 at the local wal mart, it just looked cooler than those AST/ACER/Packard Bell Win 3.1 systems, but no games and double the pricetag, no thanks.
09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0
Actually, the tagline "the first viable Microsoft Windows alternative" originates with Sun, not with Walmart. Check out Sun's JDS webpage - the very first line includes the "first viable Microsoft Windows alternative" phrase.
OK, skip walmart and go here, buy your system, and download/purchase your favorite distro and install. It seems there are some even better systems for less than the Wal-Mart price.
I think Sun is serious about becoming the biggest Linux vendor, as they suggested a year ago with their china deal where McNealy said "This, I believe, makes us instantaneously the number one Linux desktop play in the planet."
If they're going for volume, you can't beat Wal*Mart and China.
Does that mean we'll see them in a bulk pack of 5 for only $1000 at Sams? Sweet! When I get my 10000 pack of Ramen Noodles, I can get a pack of Linux computers too. Yeah-Hoo!
Welcome to Soviet Russia.
Walmart.com actually has had a lot of options in terms of pre-loaded OS's. They come / have come with Windows, Lindows, Lycoris, Mandrake, Sun Java Desktop, and FreeDOS. Or you can get them naked.
True, all of these are cheaper than Windows (except for, of course, Windows), but if all Walmart was interested in was being Cheap, they would all be using Lindows (remember flat rate licensing?). The inclusion of Lycoris and Sun Java Desktop is an indication that they see value in having a variety of Linux desktops available.
Now, it may very well be that they simply contract out through individual companies, so that if someone wants to sell a Lycoris desktop through Walmart.com it presents no risk to Walmart, but that doesn't mean Walmart is inherently exploitive.*
*on this particular issue.
The ______ Agenda
Can you even download Sun's Linux? If you can, I am completely list as to how/where. Support for linux on my sparc32 is bleak... something officially from Sun would be nice.
"When life gives you lemons, don't make lemonade. Make life take the lemons back!" -- Cave Johnson
By your logic, Because walmart always wins ( and believe me I agree 100%), ANY PRODUCT they sell will defeat their competing products. Ok, Walmart sells coke, therefore Walmart will crush pepsi. Walmart also sells Pepsi, therefore Walmart will crush Coke. So who wins? Sams Choice Cola.
Walmart likes to help its vendors... at first. They worked exclusively with Tide to see if they could reducce their operating costs. Great, Tide now operated more efficently as a compnay. Then Walmart introduced Great Value Liquid Clothes detergent (compare with Tide!). Walmart might be working with Sun, but noting that they are essentially just selling a free OS, Its just a mater of time before Walmart introduces the even lower cost Great Value Linux . It will happen, believe you me.
Well.. maybe. Or Maybe not. But Definitely not sort of.
Most likely, Microsoft has enough other outlets that they can tell WalMart to take it or leave it.
Conversely, where else is WalMart going to get a best of breed[1] desktop OS? ([1]well, that's how the retail world sees it...)
the preceding comment is my own and in no way reflects the opinion of the Joint Chiefs of Staff
Sorry, I did not intend my earlier comment for flamebait. But I still believe that Linux is not suitable for people being introduced for the first time. With windows or macintosh, a non tech-savvy user can modify settings, install/uninstall software, and manage devices (cameras, scanners, etc) with friendly wizards. Linux, while it has made great steps in this direction, can't be as user-friendly as OS X. If these browser/shoppers could have a little training, this would be great for linux. But I think dropping machines with Linux on unsuspecting moms and families is a bad idea.
buy a mini cd-rw and burn whatever you wanted to move. it's that easy.
There are going to be a lot of systems out there with root passwords of "password" soon ;^)
It's better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.
- E. Debs
The only people who would buy a non-MS PC are relatively technically competent ("enough to be dangerous"), and the majority of these folks should be smart enough to know what a bad deal this is--you can piece together a much better system for the same $$$. Hello, eBay? So the target audience is...?
Linux = Anti-Monopoly Walmart = Attempting a Monopoly Why Sun..... Wwwwwhhhhhhyyyyyy???
you might notice the following:
The PC is up on blocks.
The case has a shotgun rack
The customer wears a wife-beater shirt with a penguin on the front.
There are dipstick oil marks on the floppy drive.
The hard drive is full of Johnny Cash MP3s.
The case is modded with a transparent confederate flag window.
The mousepad is red and black plaid.
Traces of pig feces on the keyboard.
The open source internet browser default page is www.y'all.com.
The USB port cover panel is welded shut.
The wallpaper on the desktop is of a scanned black velvet Elvis painting.
The case has a side-mounted spitoon.
The customer added an 8-track tape player in one of the drive bays.
There are John Deer stickers on the case.
-
I believe you are correct about the profits portion of the equation. But you forgot to include the support costs of floppies.
There are a limited number of moving parts in those computers. A floppy drive is a moving part and the only one (other than the CD) that the user is expected to jam things into.
Not including it does boost profits.
-and-
Not including it means one less thing that is likely to break and result in a phone call and/or replacement.
When you're looking at profits that small per unit, you do NOT want to waste any of it on a support call because someone jammed a floppy disk in upside down or put in a floppy with a bent metal slide.
What's the big deal here. If you go to Dell.com and click on Small Business you can get a Poweredge server for $279 with the following components:
Intel P4 2.4 Ghz
40 GB Hard Drive
128 MB Memory
Floppy Drive
48x CD-ROM
($379-$100 mail in rebate) I hate mail in rebates!!!!
This is basically a low-end desktop with no OS. Load your favorite distro and there you go!!
I think it's great that a company is selling computers preloaded with Linux but this really isn't news.
I don't know what the Sun Java Desktop is like personally, but it is probably pretty good - Gnome and StarOffice and all that jazz.
As such it should handle what most people use a PC for pretty well - internet, e-mail, chatting, letter to the bank manager.
You don't need Windows XP for these tasks.
Now the price is a bit high given the hardware - you could build the same for a lot less, but Walmart will be making a slice and Sun will be too I imagine.
And these boxes will be faster than 2.8GHz Celeron boxes judging from reviews online.
Man I have bought a bunch of these boxes. I normally buy the cheap 200 dollar not loaded model and throw fedora core on them and give them to our customers. In the two years now of running them I only had one that had the power supply give up the smoke. For non power users that just want to surf the web and do a occasional spread sheet the box is more than fast enough.
Got Code?
The Microsoft Mouse adds 10% to the cost of the computer. Pretty amazing considering not so long ago, $300 was 10% of the cost of the computer.
Despite his flamebait tone, the parent post has a good point.
We shouldn't forget that this is the company that was using illegal immigrants as below-minimum-wage night custodians. When the feds raided them they claimed ignorance of the illegals, blamed it on a sub-contractor, and made sure the feds didn't arrest the illegals until the end of their shift so the stores were bright and shiny the next day.
And that's just one of many problems at Wal-Mart.
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing.
The folks at sub300 for instance sell a sub US$ 300 PC with 256 Mb, that's more like it (no link provided because I am really not posting a plug).
Didn't Sun also get a big JDS contract with China, recently? This, along with HP and IBM boosing Linux is really great news. Hopefully, we can put off World War III long enough to finally enjoy ubiquitous desktop Linux.
Vote in November. You won't regret it.
More interesting is that WalMart is preloading OpenOffice on their low-end Windows PCs. That's will accelerate OpenOffice deployment. Lots of kids are going to be doing their book reports on OpenOffice.
wal-mart got to be #1 by doing things better, faster, and cheaper than their competition.
/.er
Wal-mart's original website was a horrible mess of asp on a all MS platform. They replaced it with a linux front end after a very short time. It was big news at the time but is probably pre-history for the average
joel
Forgive my ignorance for knowing next to nothing about linux other than you need to mess with a lot of config files to make it work. What happens if Jane Public buys a copy of The Sims and tries to install it on this linux box?
I'd say if it doesn't install every bit as easily as it would on windows (ie: insert CD, click okay a few times, then ready to play), then Jane Public will forevermore considder linux and anything to do with it to be crap, and will have windows installed just as fast as she can borrow a windows install CD from a sympathetic friend. That right there is the ultimate hurdle that Linux -must- overcome before ever hoping to compete seriously with MS.
Great idea, but MAN is that an oogly looking box.
Walmart shoppers are middle America, buying censored CDs of the latest MTV pseudo-punk band. You need to give them something Carson Daly would use.
Share and Enjoy!
Is anyone else bothered that the desktop enviroment is named "Sun's Java Desktop System"? Why did they do that? From what I've seen/read about the desktop, it's Gnome, or a modified version of it, that has nothing more to do with Java than any other *nix desktop, right? Are they trying to pass Java off as a generic desktop name? When I see it I think if a *shudder* desktop running pure java! Would somebody please think about the refresh rates!
CB
free ipod and free gmail!
If there is one company that can stand up to Microsoft and sell the OS that they want, it's WalMart.
The other computer OEMs haven't done it. They're not big enough to say "screw you, MS, were not paying $100/license"
WalMart is extremely interested in delivering the lowest price to their consumers, and removing the Microsoft OS is one way to do it.
http://github.com/gbook/nidb
A solid piece of hardware - I now have three operating in various capacities around the house - but noisy like you wouldn't believe. I've become accustomed to some minimal amount of acoustic engineering going into boxes these days -- all of the name brand boxes have an average (low) amount of noise. Not so with the Microtel. The power supply has a whoosh to it, and the CPU fan a bit of a low whir. You may be able to remedy this with a replacement low-noise PS.
Not bad for under $300, but, as always, you get what you pay for.
Why don't we have boxes with external (fanless - noiseless) power supplies? Everything that goes on inside the box is low voltage DC, right?
The cure for cancer is coming: Reovirus
...so what is your point? If all the poor (and/or price conscious) people shopping at WalMart give their kids a cheap linux computer...then BOOM...linux is the OS that the unwashed masses are familiar with. Windows will be seen as the overpriced POS it is. Windows became popular because it was cheap and almost freely available...such is happening to Linux, except Linux is actually a quality product, and the hardware necessary to run is it practically free.
Think about it, Linux, which is free, can run on hardware that costs as much as a Windows license alone.
Every Wal Mart I've been to always feels crowded (with people reminding me of well preserved zombies, minus the need to feed on raw flesh) to me. Hence the clausterphobia and murderous rampage urges.
I talk about stuff.
Its just a mater of time before Walmart introduces the even lower cost Great Value Linux . It will happen, believe you me.
Except Linux is already pretty much free. How are they going to undercut that any further?
As a Sun employee, I can say we are indeed eating our own dogfood. :) And it tastes GREAT.
Now, I have that exact keychain drive and it actually appears as a 64MB partition. Out of that box of floppies, I'd be surprised if more than 80% work for more than one day. Also, given that every computer I've seen in recent memory has a USB port, and very few have floppy drives, it's more likely that you can use that keychain drive without purchasing additional hardware.
More expensive? Nah. They've been cheaper for a while now.
Dewey, what part of this looks like authorities should be involved?
Want a USB cable at 9:15 PM? Go to Wal-Mart and get it. If you go downtown, you will find that the stores have already closed about 4 hours ago. They did not even want your business.
No, it's because small retailers such as myself actually pay our employees decent wages, and we can't afford to stay open that late. If I were to pay minimum wage like Wal-Mart does, I could stay open almost 24 hours.
Not if the downtown actually decides it wants customers.
Again, our downtown actually is thriving. We have homes, offices, locally-owned food co-ops, bars, restaurants, etc. Oh yeah, and did I mention free, town-wide wi-fi (what I'm posting with right now)?
Nobody NEEDS a USB cable at 9:00PM. Wait until the next day.
here is some more info and screenshots of Sun's Java Desktop System.
The small towns stores destroy themselves by not bothering to serve the customers.
Oh, and I don't know if you noticed, but the kind of people who shop at Wal-Mart are the dregs of society. It pulls in about the same clientele as strip clubs and pawn shops. That's not wanted in our town. That's why I live here. We don't have your typical Wal-Mart customers living in this town. Instead of a night out shopping for cheap plastic shit made in Asia that we don't need, we tend to go hear local music, see an art exhibit, or do something that doesn't require spending money on crap, and does require your brain.
It's not gratis at all for corporate use. You have to pay someone to make a distribution for you, whether by paying Red Hat a lot of money, or by paying your IT staff a lot of money. Even if Wal-Mart decided to undercut Sun by making their own "Sam's Choice Linux", they'd have to hire a department of technicians to build it, test it, and get it ready for release.
As long as Sun can do that cheaper than Wal-Mart can do it for themselves, they'll get the business. That is how you undercut "free".
Dewey, what part of this looks like authorities should be involved?
I love you! Welcome to my friends list. What town is this if I might ask?
I'm actually willing to pay 10-15% extra for most items if I can buy them from a local supplier. I avoid the chain stores (and this includes the chain supermarkets) like the plague. Why should I deal with unhappy minimum wage employees, shitty parking and being treated like a thief (see this post) when I can go park downtown and walk in the store where I am in a first name basis with everyone from the stockboy to the owner and get what I need?
I have better things to do at midnight then go shopping for USB cables anyway. And I'll point out that I can buy a USB cable cheaper from my local computer store then I can from Wally-World ($20 for a 6' USB cable??? WTF is that? -- $50 for a 25' piece of Cat5? I could buy a friggen 1000' box of it for that price)
I want peace on earth and goodwill toward man.
We are the United States Government! We don't do that sort of thing.
Oh, and I don't know if you noticed, but the kind of people who shop at Wal-Mart are the dregs of society.
The clientele is really just about everybody. However, you are contradicting yourself now. If what you say really were true, you would want a Wal-Mart, as it would draw only the "Dregs" out of your downtown, right?
That's not wanted in our town
Which town is it? I would bet you that your claim is not true. Everywhere Wal-Mart goes in over the objections of tiny mindless activist groups, the customers and workers flock there, proving it is wanted and that the so-called community activists were lying all along.
If it really isn't wanted, why not let it open? You'd prove a great point as this unwanted store closes within 5 months
(...but you and I know it would be quite popular, and your town would love it)
Instead of a night out shopping for cheap plastic shit made in Asia that we don't need,
Actually, people guy stuff at Wal-Mart because they have actual need for it. It is the good name-brand stuff as well. Sony is made in Asia, but it has a good reputation.
They left the State of Nebraska, oh wait there are 2 for the whole state.
Kosh: "Understanding is a 3 edged sword, your side, their side, the Truth."
Electronics Computers Desktops Microtel PCs Sun Java Desktop Systems
Microtel SYSWM8001 PC With AMD Duron 1.6 GHz, No Floppy Drive $298.00
Availability: 1 to 4 business days to process before shipping.
Shipping Cost: To see the shipping cost for this item, add it to your cart.
Sun has delivered the first viable Microsoft Windows alternative. The Java desktop system is a more affordable, secure desktop, designed to thrive in a Windows-centric world and run thousands of Java technology-based applications.
Model No. SYSWM8001
Accessories Included Keyboard,Mouse,Speakers.
Description
* AMD 1.6 GHz Duron processor with 3D-Now technology
* 200 MHz frontside bus
* 128 MB 266 MHz DDR memory, expandable to 2 GB
* 1 PC266 DDR DIMM socket available
* 40 GB Ultra ATA-100 hard drive / 5400 rpm (total accessible capacity varies, depending on operating environment)
* 52x CD-ROM drive
* Note: does NOT include a floppy drive
* Integrated 10/100 Ethernet connection
* 56 Kbps modem
* Integrated video with up to 32 MB shared default setting is 16 MB
* Integrated AC'97 Audio
* Mid-tower ATX case (7.25"W x 18.75"D x 16.44"H)
* Available drive bays: external, two 5.25-inch, two 3.5-inch
* Available slots: 2 PCI
* Serial port
* Parallel port
* 4 USB 2.0 ports (2 front-mounted)
* 104-key keyboard
* 2-button mouse with wheel
* Audio port (line-in, line-out, mic-in)
* 14-watt (RMS) stereo speakers
* 1-year warranty, return to manufacturer
* Sun Java desktop system
* Complete desktop environment with office applications (word processor, spreadsheet, presentation, browser, email, calendar)
* Based on Linux operating system
* Uses the security features of Java to prevent unsafe codes, such as viruses, from damaging the system environment
* Additional pre-installed software includes StarOffice 7 Office Suite
* Word processing, spreadsheet, presentation, drawing and database capabilities
* Exchange files with other office suites, including Microsoft Office
* Maintain your current investment in other file formats, and collaborate with users of Microsoft Office
* Seamlessly interchange documents with enhanced Microsoft Office interoperability
* Share files within and outside your organization with the popular PDF read-only format
* Easily mail documents without separately starting up the email client or navigating a file hierarchy
* Bring StarOffice multimedia presentations to virtually any Web browser with the new Export to Macromedia Flash feature
* Any editor that supports XML can be used to read, edit and save StarOffice documents
* File sharing is easy, and users are not locked in to a proprietary vendor format
* Automate repetitive tasks, and assign shortcut keys with the new Macro Recorder
* View, edit and save documents to and from Palm and Pocket PC devices
* Share StarOffice presentations with Web-conferencing support from Placeware
* Easily integrate with MySQL databases to extract, manage and analyze data
* Database Report Autopilot enables quick and easy report generation from databases
* Accessibility features for seeing or hearing-impaired users
Shipping weight in pounds: 30.0
Product Measurement in inches: 16.44 x 18.75 x 7.25
Volts: 110 or 220V
Instruction Manual: Included
Instruction Languages: English
Assembled Country of Origin: USA
Components Country of Origin: USA and/or Imported
Really? So if you are a guest in my home that means I can require you to undertake a cavity search when you leave to make sure you didn't steal anything?
As if the closed circuit TV systems that monitor every square inch of the store aren't enough. Let's stop someone walking out of the store with a pack of chewing gum and a picture frame in his tiny little blue Wal-Mart bag to make sure he didn't steal anything!
My civil rights are violated if they ask to search my belongings to make sure I didn't steal anything. If they caught me on camera doing it then fine -- call the cops. But Wal-Mart employees don't have the power to require me to submit my items for inspection or to require me to remain there until the cops arrive. I'm sorry but that blue overcoat and smiley face t-shirt doesn't give you arrest powers.
I want peace on earth and goodwill toward man.
We are the United States Government! We don't do that sort of thing.
But it does have a lot to do with Java. There is Java pre-installed, a reasonable number of Java applications and tools, and StarOffice which has Java as the main way to interface with databases and write extensions.
Perhaps Jane Public should read the requirements printed on the box first.
I agree though, it's silly to try to sell these to people who are bent on running Windows software with no Linux equivalents.
"Would it kill you to put down the toilet seat?" -- Maya Angelou
Debian would be cheap, or Gentoo, but not lindows. Even Suse is $10 Cheaper.
Kosh: "Understanding is a 3 edged sword, your side, their side, the Truth."
The two cases I know of where this is a factor is in selling modified albums, with the consent of the artist, to change *evil* content, and refusing to stock certain birth control in their pharmacies.
I would be pissed if I bought an album at Wal-mart and came home to find that it wasn't *really* the ablum but some modified version.
WWJD? JWRTFM.
I'd love to say what town this is, but I'd like to keep my anonymity as much as I can. But suffice to say that it's a small, very progressive town in central NC. No big box stores at all. Many educated people. I have a retail store that's been open for about a year and a half, and people are very often surprised when they see that we have good salespeople, good parking, good hours, and prices better than what you can get at those big box stores. Of course, those stores are chomping at the bit to get in here, but the closest they've gotten (and ever will get) is jost over the border, 2 towns away (the neighboring town is the same way). So, really, I live in one of the few remaining places in the US where there are thriving businesses and a real community, and none of that giant commercial crap. Hell, the largest store of any kind in town is a giant gourmet supermarket (not a chain.... this is the only location). Hell, we don't even have Blockbuster video in this town! They try to come in, but they get beaten by the local chain that has better selection, better pricing, and better atmosphere. I *do* love living here!
Well, I imagine that Walmart or microtel is paying Sun for each version, or perhaps they have a voluem licence. I think Sun is being paid in one form or another. Walmart is very good at undercutting everyone. If there is enough money to be made, they will enter the market. Right now they are probely just using lycris, Lindows, and sun to gage the market and find all of the pitfalls with out spending their own money.
Well.. maybe. Or Maybe not. But Definitely not sort of.
You have to pay someone to make a distribution for you,
Only if you want to have a custom distro. Otherwise, you can slap Debian on there.
But seeing as how the Java Desktop System normally costs $100/yr, I'd imagine that Wal-Mart is paying Sun something. And a decent Linux hacker can roll a simple distro fairly quick 'n' cheap, by basing it off of another distro.
I'd expect some of the technology worker bees and programmers not to have much difficulty moving to something like this, but how about further up Sun's management hierachy that lives and breathes things like Excel spreadsheets and Powerpoint presentations?
I hate to burst your bubble, but having worked for Sun for the last 2 years, I can tell you that Sun does a pretty good job of keeping their own employees using Sun software. This includes Star Office and Solaris. Most Sun offices use SunRay terminals hooked to a Sun Enterprise server. They run StarOffice 7 on top of Solaris 9. This makes it pretty easy for a Mac geek like me to open work documents using OpenOffice on OS X. In fact, up until very recently it was a fireable offence to even install Windows XP on any work computer. They were pretty worried about all of the privacy issues in XP and didn't want MS stealing corporate secrets through some unknown backdoor. Now, they allow you to run XP only if you run some script called XP Neuter first.
If anything, things are the other way around here, simply because of the NIH (not invented here) syndrome. Sun employees tend to be extremely anti-MS and anti-IBM, and most would not run MS Office or even Internet Explorer unless they were forced to by some management directive.
About the Java Desktop rollout: I can't speak for those in large Sun offices like Broomfield, CO and Burlington, MA; they may be running it already, but out in the small field offices it hasn't been rolled out yet. I haven't had a chance to preview it yet with the LiveCD thingy, but I would imagine within a year or so everyone will be running it.
"When the president does it, that means it's not illegal." - Richard M. Nixon
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Microtel SYSWM8006 PC With Hyper-Threading 3.0 GHz Pentium 4 & CD-RW/DVD Combo
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800 MHz frontside bus
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3.5-inch floppy drive
Speakers included
* 800 MHz frontside bus
* 256 MB 400 MHz DDR memory, expandable to 2 GB
* One 184-pin PC400 DDR DIMM socket available
* 80 GB Ultra ATA-100 hard drive / 7200 rpm (total accessible capacity varies, depending on operating environment
* 48x, 24x, 48/16x CD-RW/DVD-ROM combo drive
* 3.5-inch floppy drive
* Integrated Intel Extreme Graphics up to 32 MB, default setting 16 MB
* AC'97 six-channel audio
* Integrated 10/100 LAN
* 56 Kbps PCI data/fax modem
* Mid-tower ATX case (7.25"W x 18.75"D x 16.44"H)
* Available drive bays: external three 5.25-inch, one 3.5-inch; internal four 3.5-inch
* Available slots: 2 PCI, 1 AGP 4x
* Serial port
* Parallel port
* 4 USB 2.0 ports (2 front-mounted)
* 104-key keyboard
* 2-button mouse with wheel
* Audio port (line-in, line-out, mic-in)
* Stereo speakers
* 1-year warranty, return to manufacturer
* Sun Java desktop system
* Complete desktop environment with office applications (word processor, spreadsheet, presentation, browser, email, calendar)
* Based on Linux operating system
* Uses the security features of Java to prevent unsafe codes, such as viruses, from damaging the system environment
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* Word processing, spreadsheet, presentation, drawing and database capabilities
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Shipping weight in pounds: 30.0
Product Measurement in inches: 16.44 x 18.75 x 7.25
Volts: 110 or 220V
Instruction Manual: Included
Instruction Languages: English
Assembled Country of Origin: USA
Components Country of Origin: USA and/or Imported
I saw a bunch of e-machines on sale in my local Walmart. They were decent 2+ GHz boxes with LCD monitors included all for $500. They come packaged in huge cardboard boxes.
Tsunami -- You can't bring a good wave down!
Does anyone know what kind of package management the Java Desktop uses?
The Wal-Mart Prank Part 1 and Part 2 .
Without giving too much away, it concerns a fellow who exacts sweet, sweet pornographic revenge for the loss of his job...
free speach
Did you mean: free speech
it sucks to go into "Joe's Jewlery and Electronics" to shop for a DVD player and have him show you the one model that he stocks, (sometimes), but it is out of stock right now so he shows you a flyer and tells you he'll get it for you in 8 to 10 days
I've had that happen at Sears on a larger and more frustrating scale. Instead of one model, there is an entire 4 x 5 array of DVD players. Every one of the models is out of stock: the only one there is the display model, and they refuse to sell you that one. Then you get a rain check (scribbled on the back of a business card: is this how a huge retailer operates?) but just forget it and go to Best Buy which dares to sell what it sells.
What's with that?
Don't blame Durga. I voted for Centauri.
I appreciate the look inside. I was honestly curious and not just deliberately trolling.
I work on a Linux box all the time and use to use Sun workstations until a few years ago, but all the managers above work on Windows boxes. And, when vendors come in from the outside world, it usually means Powerpoint on Windows.
Someday I hope to make a strong case for managers being able to move to Linux boxes, too. But until I can demonstrate that other real life managers can really live without MS, the case is much harder to make. From a practical standpoint, Mac OS X is an even easier case to make than Linux because of Word, etc. being available on that platform. But even with that there are enough bad anecdotes about interoperability between Macs and Windows that I guessed it was still going to be a while before a strong case could be made.
"Provided by the management for your protection."
Nobody NEEDS a USB cable at 9:00PM.
No offense, but who the (insert favorite expletive) are you to decide what others need or should be allowed to buy at what time? I'm about to go visit my family--traditionally I end up doing computer-related things for them. I'm time constrained, and can't necessarily know what I need in advance so that I can buy when folks like you deign to have their stores open.
I'll cheerfully buy from Wal-Mart, thank you very much.
Even then, you're paying for the "slap" step. Who decides what packages get included by default? What version of Debian? KDE or Gnome? Which default web browser? Which default mail program? Does the shipped kernel provide full support for every bit of hardware on the system?
Then, you have to pay someone to regression-test new packages and security updates to be reasonably sure that pushing a bugfix to your customers won't result in tens of thousands of disabled machines.
I assume you've heard the phrase "Linux is only free if your time is worth nothing", and in the corporate environment, this is very true: payroll time is, in fact, not very cheap at all. The question is whether Wal-Mart could get the per-unit costs of a home-rolled distribution to be lower than what Sun can offer, and as Wal-Mart isn't in the business of producing software for external clients, that very well may not be the case.
And a decent Linux hacker can roll a simple distro fairly quick 'n' cheap, by basing it off of another distro.
That hacker is wonderful and cost effective if he happens to be you, or if he works for your company and you can have him fix problems on-site as they occur. That same hacker is not useful in the situation where he's building a release that will run on (hopefully) millions of customers' desktops. In that case, you want an engineering team to design a system, then hand it of to a QA team that does their best to break it.
Dewey, what part of this looks like authorities should be involved?
Right under the ad, there's a section called "Accessories We Recommend for This Item"...and the only reccomended accessory is:
Microsoft Trackball Optical
$29.96
Which you can order with your system from Wal-Mart.
"How do you equate Wal-Mart haggling for better prices with Marxism!?"
Wal-Mart would only become like Marxism if they shot half their workers and forced the customers to wait in 3 hour lines to buy anything.
Instead of 3 out of 1,000 stores having workers locked in, you'd have 997 out of 1,000 stores with workers chained to the floor.
You exactly the sort of AC poster who keeps me reading /. at a zero threshold. Well said!
Information wants to be anthropomorphized.
Per year? I would scoff at an OS that wanted me to pay a yearly licensing fee like this... think about it: the average end user will keep his PC about 2-3 years.. brings the total cost for the OS up around $100-$150.. more expensive than XP home.
I was active in a very minor way with Linux when I worked at Sun. The management just didn't get Linux at the time. It is moves like this that will be necessary to get numbers for Desktop Linux. This is also the sort of thing that is going to be necessary to make the $100 PC happen-and the $50 PC happen. For all of their flaws, Sun and Walmart may be getting that they are companies that benefit by emergence of really low cost personal computing--because sale of really cheap pc's means more sale of servers and software.
Oh, and I don't know if you noticed, but the kind of people who shop at Wal-Mart are the dregs of society. It pulls in about the same clientele as strip clubs and pawn shops.
Had I not already posted in this topic, I'd mark your post as Funny. There's a certain irony in someone whose linked site advertises free pr0n complaining about the riff-raff who shop at Wal-Mart.
Dell could easily sell the computer with Dell Linux and everyone would buy it. Its the Dell name brand that people want, not the Microsoft Windows crap.
They trust Dell, and if Dell were to say that Linux is the next big thing, well it is. Without Dells support Windows XP would have never taken off! Windows 98 was far more compatible at the time and XP wouldnt run any dos based games or 16 bit software.
Why do people use XP now? Because OEMs shoved it down their throats. No one went to a store and purchased XP, XP sold because new computers just come with XP instead of 98/ME. Many people including myself removed XP and put Windows98 or 2000 on there.
People don't exist to serve systems, systems exist to serve people.
I suspect the same people that will buy these systems are the people that use AOL as their internet provider. I doubt the geek crowd will buy them because they're underpowered. The office "power user" crowd won't buy them because they're not loaded with Windows and Office. The remainder are casual internet users. These people don't know what Windows is, yet alone Linux. Many of these same people also use AOL as their internet provider.
How is Walmart/Sun/Etc... going to deal with the fact that AOL does not run on Linux? I expect massive returns of these computers if that issue isn't solved.
Really? So if you are a guest in my home that means I can require you to undertake a cavity search when you leave to make sure you didn't steal anything?
If I am carrying a bag from your living room, and I didn't come in with one, you wouldn't ask what was going on?
I don't get stopped when walking out of WalMarts without bags full of loot.
I personally think you were being extremely rude. You have some expensive stuff there, just let the poor security people see the receipt and move on!
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
As if the closed circuit TV systems that monitor every square inch of the store aren't enough.
Actually, not all of the camera domes you see in the ceiling have cameras in them.
That being said, I once had one of the Wal*Mart greeters chase me out into the parking lot and demand that I return inside the store because I apparently set off "Wal*Mart's inventory control system!". She refused to tell me why I needed to go back inside, so I shrugged and walked away. A plainclothesd LP came up to my drivers window as I was about to pull off. I told her she was free to ask her question in the parking lot, but I would not be inconvenienced to return inside the store unless she could give me a good reason. She told me they were calling the cops. I handed her my driver's license, said "Write down my name, go watch your videotape, and decide if you need to call the cops", took it back and drove away.
The funny thing was the reaction of the cops when I called them warning them that Wal*Mart was going to call them, and I gave them the full story. The copy who answered the phone had kind of an exasperated sound. "Yeah, they do that sort of stuff all the time", he told me.
Go figure.
Speaking of cameras, some Best Buy stores actually track 1 in 50 or so customers from entrance to exit for marketing purposes. You won't see the typical big black camra domes, instead there are little white camera domes on the trusswork, very, very inconspicuous. They're a few meters apart and completely blanket the store. (You should see the racks they go back to, it's insane) It's not in every store, but they tell me that the watch where you go, what you pick up, what you actually buy, etc.
Kinda scary really.
Dell may help bring a version of windows (such as XP) to the masses. But that's much easier to do than bring a completely different operating system to the masses. I think Dell can help (as well as other vendors). But Linux needs to establish itself as a viable desktop alternative.
What average Joe is going to buy a computer that doesn't have Windows and MS Office on it? Even if there were alternatives (Linux & Open Office) it's a complete turn off and wouldn't work unless the price was drastically different.
Seeing prices on Dell's nowadays...I don't see that happening.
Better than Flickr - Manage, Share, Archive
How is that you can even logically have a mail-in rebate to a mail-order company?
I understand the logic of why they do it. But the fact that "we" as the public go along with that escapes me.
Made-up senerio:
Me: "I'd like to buy your widget for $279"
Them: "That will be $379 on your credit card then?"
Me: "I thought it was $279?"
Them: "It's $379 with a $100 mail-in refund to the manufacturer."
Me: "Aren't you the manufacturer?"
Them: "Yes"
Me: "Don't you know that I'm talking to you and buying it right now? Why do I have to send you proof of purchase and a rebate form, to prove to YOU who I'm talking to, that I purchased the product, that you are selling to me, NOW to get a discount on the price that YOU'VE set?"
Walmart will complain to AOL and they'll add linux support, which, although AOL sucks, would be a good thing for linux. Think about it, TV ads: "AOL 10.0, now supporting Linux" Jo-sumer:"Hey, whats Linux *asks tech at work* So it works just as good or better than windows and its free?! Sign me up!!". Well, we can hope...
"Sic Semper Tyrannosaurus Rex."
Just the employees.
"Sic Semper Tyrannosaurus Rex."
You can't serve customers when a Wal-Mart comes to town. Not unless you offer things that Wal-Mart dosen't.
Such as service. They aren't too lazy to open a few hours later or stay open a few hours later in order to offer me goods. At the same time, the downtown store's door is locked.
replacing smart people with mullet-worshiping rednecks
I do know what you mean there, bro. My local Wal-Mart has an altar with a giant mullet on it at the center. It is pretty hard to move around that part of the store due to all the rednecks genuflecting there.
Nonsense? I know many businesses in parts of upstate NY that went out of business because of WalMart (I can provide specific examples). Some of these were other chains, sure, but most were in fact local businesses with local owners. Now all that revenue goes up the chain to the corporate headquarters, and then out to the shareholders. Upstate NY gets NOTHING except $5.15 jobs.....and Chinese-made consumer goods at a low price.
Unless your area never had a viable 'downtown' to begin with, you have no excuse being this ignorant. I suppose few people question things that work in their favor.....
===---===
Together, we will drive the rats from the tundra.
Wal-Mart cameras more often than not target the employees rather than the customers. Shoplifters are a problem, but the low-income, often teenage cashiers ringing up "special sales" for their friends (e.g., bringing a computer and a pack of gum to the counter and only paying for the pack of gum) is a much bigger, and costlier one.
Same mouse.
"Sic Semper Tyrannosaurus Rex."
On a radio interview I heard recently, a journalist who's covered WalMart and (I believe) wrote a book about them pointed out that WalMart has threatened suppliers with having copies of their merchandise made by a Chinese supplier.
This may not be illegal, but it doesn't exactly smack of what nice guys do. It smacks a lot of what mean people do.
Might not need DELL to prove it since HP is stepping up their Linux support and will now pre-load with Linux, I believe Mandrake or SUSE - see recent posts to Slashdot.
Reasonable suspicion. Presumption of innocence.
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I would not put starting wars to preserve a monopoly beyond certain companies with a virtual monopoly in the PC OS arena.
You're the one who said it, not me. Using 9 '?' characters isn't terribly good obfuscation, either, given the ample context provided in your post.
Let the history books record that it was Anonymous Coward who started the long chain of unlikely events that will end the world as we know it.
Gee, thanks a lot. Next time you leave your parent's basement to get a Big Mac and a large vanilla milkshake, you'd better watch your back, 'cause if I see you I'll smash the Big Mac under your smelly hat and pour your milkshake down the back of your pants!
Vote in November. You won't regret it.
I hope you get keyed.
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Oh, and I don't know if you noticed, but the kind of people who shop at Wal-Mart are the dregs of society. It pulls in about the same clientele as strip clubs and pawn shops. That's not wanted in our town.
Great insight, Mr. Free Pron! Pot calling kettle black, maybe??
Front access, same access across the aeons, and PHB simplicity. That's why I use still floppies.
I administer dozens of machines -- everything from 386s on up to P4 systems. I buy middle-aged used systems if the task warrants. On some older machines the only input I have other than ethernet (mandatory) is a floppy. No CD!
Even on some P3-ish things, the only FRONT access I have is CD or floppy. I'm not crawling around the back of machines to be raped by dust bunnies just for the privilege of using my USB key to update a network driver or move the average Word doc or run MEMTEST86. Nor is it worth my time to play BIOS olympics with menopausal systems that may or may not be able to boot from that 7 year old CD-ROM drive.
Sure I could install USB extension cables on every machine that needs one but that does NOT cover my install base completely nor does it guarantee the machine can boot from USB. My USB key is still not totally useful, only occasionally useful. And not all my OSes and MBs can do the USB-thing seamlessly anyway...
And don't get me started on CD writers. Training a PHB on how to copy his Word file to a floppy is dead simple. Getting him to understand Nero Burning ROM? BWUAHAHAHA! Not worth it. He'll move dozens of files around using a floppy and a sneaker net quite happily. Having to spend a half hour annoying him with CD burner training? That $7 floppy drive starts to look REAL good...
Add that all up and ONE common thing works for me -- floppy drives. Eventually those older machines will die but I bet I won't build a floppy-less PC for another 3 - 5 years.
(I hear skeptics saying "He said ethernet! He said ethernet! Why does he even need floppies?!" Word docs to the home PC of the PHB who is not on the net very often. MEMTEST86. SPINRITE. Emergency FAT fixes. Older system OS/NIC driver installs. Hard drive migration software. If I were a genius I'd figure out the whole boot from LAN thing (yeah, THAT'S easy...), but I'm a moron.)
I'm thinking about it, therefore I might be.
No, it's because small retailers such as myself actually pay our employees decent wages, and we can't afford to stay open that late. If I were to pay minimum wage like Wal-Mart does, I could stay open almost 24 hours.
I worked at a Wal-Mart one summer in college, and they paid more than minimum wage -- no one would've worked there if they didn't -- hell, if I'd stayed on for another few weeks, I would've been elligible for bennies.
Nobody NEEDS a USB cable at 9:00PM. Wait until the next day.
And what if the next day is Sunday and all the stores are closed or only open a few hours after church?
It's because of store-owners like you that Wal-Mart, Best Buy, and Borders thrive.
Les Miserables Volume 1 now up with my reading of
Oh, and I don't know if you noticed, but the kind of people who shop at Wal-Mart are the dregs of society.It pulls in about the same clientele as strip clubs and pawn shops. That's not wanted in our town.
Oh, no, we don't want those types. They might ruin the property values. Gotta keep 'em out.
Les Miserables Volume 1 now up with my reading of
Articles that talk about cheap pc's with Linux whether its Lindows or Java Desktop System on it. Because its so trivial. Its a FREE OS. They slap it in to say its functional and keep it cheap. There's no glorious mission to bring Linux to the desktop here.
People buy it and I guarantee that after the initial novelty of an 'alternate OS' wears off, that drive goes NTFS. I think I am even being generous at that. I wouldn't be surprised if that boot sector never got read before an 31337 version of Windows XP is already blowing it out.
Sorry guys, nobody cares. No Linux adoption is happening at Wal-Mart today.
[sig]darkfus[/sig]
What we would really like to see from you are PC's WITHOUT an OS at all. That way, you don't have to include any OS specific tech support costs in the price of your machines.
And then they'd probably make the hardware so proprietary that the developers of alternative operating systems can't figure out how to write a driver for it. If you doubt this strategy, then find me the SANE driver for the Microtek Scanmaker 4850 that I got for free.
I'm curious, where's the eval. Am I just expected to shell out $100 ($50 discount) for a pile of worthless cr@p? It may be exactly what I've always wanted but - sorry I'm not one for gambling.
I know the computers may not be the best, but I believe that selling computers with Lindows and now Sun's Linux, is a complete step in the right direction of getting another OS choice widely availiable in the market. Most "casual" users don't know how, or wouldn't, install a different OS, but hopefully at least some people will catch on with alternative OS's through computers like these. ^^
"And when their kids grow up, which OS do you think they'll use and trust?"
The cheapest one at wal*mart.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
Speaking of which, how hard is it to build ones own laptop. Last time looked( ~ 6 years ago), it was not a real option. Just googled and found nothing interesting. As you say, most of us build our own desktop machines and while I doubt that saves any money anymore, I still think you end up with better quality. Same should be true for a laptop. Pointers appreciated.
Squirrel!
You'd need a special custom power connector for it, which would raise the price per unit some, if you changed from good ole' standard.
I think some machines have this already (didnt apple on the cube? maybe im wrong). But your sub-$300 pc is going to cut pennies wherever it can.
-
You're not too quick, it seems. The company (Dell in this case) can offer the product for $279 if they offer it with a rebate. They know that they'll only pay out maybe 50% of the rebates. If they just gave everyone the discount, they know that they could only offer the product at $279 + $50 (i.e. 50% of the $100 rebate). So they would have to advertise it as being $329. If some other company offers a similar product at $279 (after $100 mail-in rebate), more people will go to buy the "$279" one and they'll lose sales.
That's the secret. Rebates are a trick of statistics.
My other first post is car post.
Do you claim that AOL webmail works only from a Microsoft Internet Explorer brand web browser, not the Mozilla web browser that AOL used to bankroll? I don't have an AOL account so I can't check webmail against Mozilla 1.7b.
Selling cheap PCs in 5-packs to home users could in theory solve the problem of multiplayer being better on consoles. Give each member of the family a computer and LAN them up. Then produce el-cheapo games for Sam's Choice Linux, and now Wal-Mart is competing with Nintendo.
I think its great someone finally has a choice in Operating software that comes pre-loaded but I think this is driving our best Friend "Gates" mad...Not that its a bad thing... But can the average Windoze user finally grasp Open Source? Thats the true question...
Yes, actually they are. Law enforcement can't touch me or search my belongings without some sort of probable cause (or warrant) -- do you really think that a Wal-Mart employee has the right to do so?
They do, actually.
Really? Wal-Mart employees have the right to require me to remain in their store? Show me where in my state laws it gives arrest powers to private citizens or corporations. Because if you are restrained from movements you are considered to be under arrest. Ever hear of false arrest laws?
I want peace on earth and goodwill toward man.
We are the United States Government! We don't do that sort of thing.
Personally I don't think they even have the right to detain a thief. The only way a private citizen can detain someone is by a citizens arrest. Corperations have no such power. Henceforth the only way Wal-Mart can prevent me from walking out the door (even if I steal something in plain sight of them) is if an employee chooses to execute a citizens arrest.
Is Wal-Mart going to defend said employee from a false arrest lawsuit brought by the person being arrested? Because unless they tell me in writing that they will do so I'm not going to put my hands on anyone (assuming I worked for them which I thankfully do not) -- nor will I do anything more aggressive then asking a suspected thief to "Please wait until the cops arrive". And even if they do witness you steal something and decide to execute a citizens arrest how can they do it? Are they going to physically restrain you? From everything I have read the amount of forced used in a citizens arrest has to be purporante to the crime you think they committed. If I see you blow someone away and I think you are going to escape I'd probably be justified in shooting you. If I see you steal a $5.99 CD out of the bargin bin at Wally World am I really justified in using any sort of physical force whatsoever to restrain you?
I wouldn't touch anyone with a ten foot pole if I worked at Wal-Mart.
I want peace on earth and goodwill toward man.
We are the United States Government! We don't do that sort of thing.
The trick is to keep walking. Don't stop to let them reply, to get back-up, to close a door or get in your way. Don't even break your stride... "Can I..." "No"... Out.
If you keep walking, they have to physically stop you. If they've got no hard evidence to back up their claims, and they manhandled you in any way, you can press criminal charges for battery against the employee who touched you while suing the store for big bucks.
IANAL, but this was training I received when I worked in retail. Physically touching a suspected shoplifter was a very bad thing and only certain specially-trained security people in the store were authorized to use physical force to prevent a shoplifter from escaping.
As for your "well-timed threat to sue them for false arrest"... The stores don't arrest you. The cops do. The stores may have unlawfully detained you via the threat of physical force and sullied your good name and reputation. They may have also committed battery against you by actually using physical force to detain you. But at any store where they actually train their managers, threatening to sue for "false arrest" over a detainment just makes you look dumb.
Start a happiness pandemic
This will probably just be viewed as a personal rant, probably because it is. It most certainly isn't my patent pending Bullshit Theory of the Day. However, I know that when certain companies get themselves into the Slashdot news they skulk and troll around to see what people are saying.
So here goes.
A little over a month ago, SUN held a little webinar. You sign up for the seminar, watch the keynote, answer some questions, and they promise me a free copy of Java Desktop.
Even before this promise, as a continuing student, I have contacted SUN sales to inquire about educational discounting, because I'm really wanting to get the software installed on something! Even if it means they aren't going to offer me support. Their last response, it's coming soon.
Now all the Wally Worlders are getting their copies of JDS before mine?! Man, that's just annoying.
And what the heck, while I'm ranting and raving and going to be modded into oblivion anyway, what about a copy of Looking Glass to go along with it? I'm more than happy to be a beta.
"Genius may shine aloof and alone, like a star, but goodness is social, and it takes two men and God to make a Brother."
I agree, but I have to say I've never seen shoplifting like I have at Walmart...I can't tell you the number of times I've walked past double-packs of everything ranging from shampoo to batteries & seen one missing, cut out, stolen.
...& before you ask why I not only shop at Walmart but pay such close attention, I'm a grad student, & poor. I do, however, accept Paypal.
Despite these draconian security measures.
So obviously, they aren't working...
>the kind of people who shop at Wal-Mart are the dregs of society There's the pot calling the kettle black, Mr.Here's-my-free-porn-site. thane
If there were no God, there would be no atheists. -- G.K. Chesterton
>the kind of people who shop at Wal-Mart are the dregs of society.
There's the pot calling the kettle black, Mr. Here's-my-free-porn-site.
Thane
If there were no God, there would be no atheists. -- G.K. Chesterton
I never imagined I'd see Sun products being sold at Wal-Mart!
-Rich
Even though I don't know a lot about that OS, I think that it's really good for more computers to be shipped with Linux. Besides this, Wal-Mart also sells computers stocked with Lycoris. I've actually toyed around on those and they are pretty good -- I love the OS!
Besides Wal-Mart computers, we of course have IBM's computers that come with their variant of Linux and UNIX and HP's new line of corporate computers shipping with MandrakeLinux. 2004 is the year to shine for good ol' Tux!
"Instant gratification takes too long." - Carrie Fisher
I liked this little blurb in the description:
Note: LindowsOS and other Linux operating systems may not be compatible with some dial-up Internet services, such as AOL or Wal-Mart Connect.
this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom. -- Lincoln, Gettysburg Address
Will these boxen be at the store or will they just be mail order?
Religion is the main cause of atheism.
WOW My very own Sun box from WallyWorld!!!! I'm going tomorrow!
And when Walmart releases GreatValue Linux (compare to Lindows!) they will make sure it is AOL compatible, too. Thats a kick in the pants idea, for sure.
As a Sun employee that DOES work in Broomfield, I can wholeheartedly confirm we've been using this for some time. Moreover, I work in a particular building on the campus that has its own Sunray network. We're mandated to use this special network, which contains just about everything on the bleeding edge that Sun has to offer, including the next unreleased version of Solaris and StarOffice, so we get to deal with the problems before the customers do.
So just to add emphasis to your statement, is Sun "eating its own dog food"? Damn right it is.
Karma: Frotzed (mostly due to the Frobozz Magic Karma Company)
ugly, underpowered, outdated? Why, because dad bought you the latest dual Intel Xeon with a $500 video board so you can frag away with your friends?
I'm writing this from one of those ugly, underpowered, outdated 1.3 Ghz Duron, 128 MB Microtels right now. 1.6 Ghz comparable to a postage stamp? You've been brainwashed by the gaming/hardware industry, my young friend.
While no one I know has purchased Microtels from Walmart, I'd say that's because there aren't any Walmarts in the area. I have, and business associates I know have, purchased Microtels from TigerDirect. I've been run Apache on several of them for about 3 years, with uptimes exceeding a year. Business associates have been using them for file/print, dns, apache, and desktops. Yes, desktops. Instead of spending $600 to $1,000 for business desktops (just the hardware and Windows operating system), they can spend $200-$230 plus shipping, and get a fully functioning computer that is more than sufficient for their offices, and to replace lesser powered, older systems.
Of those that need faster systems for some reason, they are still using the Microtel systems, but are forwarding X over the lan from a more powerful server (still under $1,000, including memory upgrade).
Walmart doesn't sell bath soaps and cereals to your mom, young man. They sell whatever consumer goods to consumers that consumers want or need. And through their wholesale division, they also sell to businesses. But their wholesale division is not located at every location where a regular Walmart is located, so Walmart relies on their Walmart stores to also sell to businesses.
Small businesses far outnumber medium (500+ employees) and large businesses. And small businesses are far more likely to have retail versions of software licenses, including Microsoft server licenses. And they are far more likely to run out and pick up a new desktop or three, on a spur of the moment, or over a weekend, than big businesses (though I've known techs from billion dollar companies do this also).
You may think a Microtel is ugly, outdated, and underpowered, especially if running a Microsoft operating system, but according to some of your fanboy tech enthusiast sites, my 1.3 Ghz Duron powered system will run rings around a 2 Ghz Celery powered system, especially against office productivity testing programs.
One problem was OpenOffice taking long time to load, but that problem was removed with OpenOffice optimizations to memory settings in the 1.0 release, faster startup in the 1.1 release, and the fact that in office settings on a server/client setup with X forwarding, OpenOffice can and often is left running on the server. While KDE is bloated compared to Windowmaker or Xfce, and KDE is often activated as the default environment, it can easily be switched to another lighter desktop, and in that case, can run even on a postage stamp. But the Microtels have no problems running KDE and OpenOffice on them, without a memory or processor upgrade, I should know, I'm doing it now.
Another fact that you or your dad may not have considered coming from a Windows environment, is that because a large number of small businesses are running old systems, dating back to the first generation of pentiums, 486s in some of the small businesses I know, and even Intel 8086s, and 8088s for custom written calculations in DOS that they 1. don't want to pay to have rewritten, and 2. aren't aware that Linux has DOS emulation. The last time I suggested moving off WordPerfect for DOS and onto Linux/OpenOffice, the response was, "why?" "It works". "Why mess with it, if it works?"
Business owners, especially small businesses, are very conservative. If something works, they don't want to upgrad
You're not good at reading, it seems.
The parent post that you replied to said this:
> I understand the logic of why they do it. But the fact that "we" as the public go along with that escapes me.
(my emphasis)
And then you explained in detail "why they do it."
A little late in the game to be posting this, it'll probably never get noticed, but...
Does anyone else find it kind of ironic that they're selling computers running linux, yet their online music store requires Windows Media Player?
You were taking actions that implied something was out of the norm - walking out of the store with a bag without obviously having been by the register - a quick flash of the receipt and you would have been on your way (as I know by experience) as it would have been enough of a signal that all was right with the process.
The rudeness you encountered was a reflection of your own behavior - you are the one who delayed yourself!! By your own actions you added the implication of theft by refusal to even show a receipt or glance in the bag. Common courtesy on your part would be to give some indication that you had just bought it elsewhere in the store, instead of tucking a WalMart bag in your jeans before you walked in and taken a Fantastic Plastic discount.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Well done! I think you just nailed what this guy is really saying. He stopped just short of acknowledging that they have "natural rhythm" or fretting about intermarriage diluting their genes. Had I not already been involved in this thread, I would mod you up as insightful.
Information wants to be anthropomorphized.
>Apparently, Walmart doesn't have to deal with "the fact" of AOL not running, or "massive returns". Walmart has been selling Lindows on Microtel, and possibly several other Linux distros for over 2 1/2 years now, possibly as much as 3 years.
In the stores or just on the web? My impression was that WalMart selling Linux PCs in their stores was a new thing.