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Human-powered Helicopter Fails to Lift Off
Peter writes "The Human-powered helicopter didn't even get off the ground. A team of University of British Columbia engineering students tried to win the $20,000 US prize offered by the American Helicopter Society. Three metres off the ground and hover for a minute was the challenge. But before the rotors were able to produce enough buoyant force they hit each other. More details: Vancouver Sun."
I suggest NCAA Champion, WWE Champion and now Minnesota Viking Brock Lesnar.
If humans were meant to fly [on their own power], he/she would have been given wings.
Wow, a human powered helicopter! Great, I would be free from traffic congestion on my five minute commute to work!
HA HA!
... you should never have tried in the first place!
No it wasn't, jackquoff.
I dunno, for some reason, the second half of that headline seems pretty predictable after reading the first half :)
...not getting off the ground makes it difficult to crash.
Show me on the doll where his noodly appendage touched you.
Really, what is the point of this? Even if they had succeeded, it is not as if our Army would be in a frenzy to purchase these so their pilots can pedal their way to Iraq. I can see the point of the X-Prize competition, but this seems like reaching to me...
Everyone knows Canucks can't fly.
So no simulations or models or just spinning the rotors indicated this might happen?
"Right now we're all taking bets on what's going to fail first"
Sounds like this venture was well planned!
But killing humans and using them for fuel? That's horrible!
... He'd have provided more engineering graduate students.
The little guy just ain't getting it, is he?
I note with some puzzlement that Ceren Rocks is not a fan of Ceren. I find this discrepancy quite intriguing.
"My feeling at the moment is that the machine is actually quite unstable," said Mike Georgallis, leader of the team that has been working on the project for six years.
Maybe they did know that this wasn't likely to be a success.
Cheers,
Erick
http://www.busyweather.com/
But before the rotors were able to produce enough buoyant force they hit each other.
What does that mean
Didn't this happen like, 3 or 4 days ago? Does this still qualify as NEWS. Seems more like OLDS to me.
as a consultant(or maybe the people that infused him with the powers, I can't remember who)..
Peter writes "The Human-powered helicopter didn't even get off the ground. A team of University of British Columbia engineering students tried to win the $20,000 US prize offered by the American Helicopter Society. Three metres off the ground and hover for a minute was the challenge. But before the rotors were able to produce enough buoyant force they hit each other.
I assume 'they' refers to the rotors, not the team...
if he got off the ground then crashed. Probably would have made them rethink the whole ridiculous idea. Dr. Vegas
This is kind of a nitpick, but buoyant force has nothing to do with how helicopters work, blimps and boats use buoyancy, helicopters and planes use aerodynamic lift.
"I'll have a Guinness, no wait, make that a Coors Light" -Grad student I work with, who shall remain anonymous...
Does this mean Lance Armstrong will soon become an astronaut?
I've seen machines in the past that are glider-based, and a human could actually keep them in the air for a fairly long time. But a helicopter? I wonder what they're trying to accomplish here. I mean, obviously the students are trying to win $27,000, but I have to wonder what the American Helicopter Society is thinking. Vertical flight always consumes a heck of a lot more energy than horizontal. I'd like to see more effort put in to human-powerd glider projects.
But God demonstrates his love for us, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us - (Romans 5:8)
but then we got hiiiiiigh!
Just goes to show kids that the evils of marijuana make you fail at everything! Even making yourself fly high!
To this story.
A normal helicopter needs several Kilowatts of engine power to produce enough lift to even get itself off the ground, much less loaded down with a human. The human body constantly generates an approximate 200 watts. In case anyone's wondering, that's about 0.26 horsepower, and that's assuming that you can apply the full 200 watts of your energy.
:-)
It's fun to see them try, but the physics say that the energy just isn't there. Perhaps if the copter weighed almost nothing, and it was constructed of super-strong materials. Of course, then we'd have unobtainium.
Javascript + Nintendo DSi = DSiCade
IANAAerospace Engineer.
From reading their Project Status/Schedule page, it appears their problems may have arisen during the manufacturing stage:
July, 2004
It has been a while since our last update. We have been busy.
COMPOSITE SPAR MANUFACTURE/TESTING
All spars have been cooked including the tapered sections. Assembly of all this is complete for the four wings. Static testing was carried out for the assembled spars. All four eventually passed the test (see Thunderbird Projects - Picture gallery).
WING CONSTRUCTION
All four wings (for the two rotors) have been completed. This includes all wing parts (leading edges, trailing edges, suction side,
"Eventually passed the test"? Uh oh.
[There were no updates from December 2001 to July 2004]
December, 2001
COMPOSITE SPAR MANUFACTURE/TESTING
Static testing has been carried out for the CFRP spars. Static tests included both bending and torsion. A large effort was put in manufacturing the tapered mandrel for tapered composite spar production. One tapered spar has been manufactured with disastrous results. The tapered mandrel still requires some work (modifications). Composite spar manufacture continues (including straight sections).
It appears there were construction issues early in the project.
I am certainly not knocking their efforts. However, even the most elegant design can be compromised by sub-optimal manufacturing/implementation resources. I wish them the best in the next iteration.
I want to drag this out as long as possible. Bring me my protractor.
well it was when we where all sitting round the bong smoking in our dorm room, oh well , better light another one
Wow did you see the size of the rotors on that thing?
Its a real shame that it didn't work, sounds like the team have been working on it for a long time, which makes me wonder, wheres the tail rotor?
here are the rules of the competition.
The obvious cheats (lighter than air gases, storing energy in a battery) are banned, but you could 'cheat' by using a human to store up a lot of energy in a low-drag rotor that then changes angle of attack to convert the stored energy to lift.
A pizza of radius z and thickness a has a volume of pi z z a
Laboratree - Scientific collaboration based on OpenSocial.
Never underestimate the power of human ingenuity. For many years the thought of sustainable human powered flight of any kind was considered an impossibility but in 1979 we saw the Gossamer Albatross cross the English Channel. I believe that sooner or later someone will manage to meet the requirements to win this American Helicopter Society prize. However without a doubt even then human powered flight will be just an interesting curiosity and not of any practical use.
and no one caught such a simple design flaw.
All they had to do was have the outer wing on the bottom.
I would suspect they would have to have gears to get the rotors up to speed but, judging from the picture, I guess they figured the pilot had enough to do, what between holding on for life, pedaling, and praying to the gods.
You are checking your backups, aren't you?
*calls engine room* Put on more humans!
It was a joke! When you give me that look it was a joke.
...please don't moderate this insightful or anything - not meant to be making statements.
Why don't they build a regular looking helicopter that uses something like a bicycle transmission? I mean, getting the rotors to spin at first would seem kind of hard, but once they're up to speed for that gear shift to the next one. You would probably go through a hundred gears, but in my mind that seems right?
So it's like a big with a rotor blade..... I'm a geek damn it, we'd need more steriods then could be made for us to even be able to work a bike!
Is it possible someone did the math and figured out people can't generate enough lift to keep themselves in the air (the more people you add, the heavier it gets).
So once they figured this out, they thought it would be funny to watch people try? I'm having flashbacks to the movie "Chicken Run."
Southeastern Virginia REPRESENT!
The human body constantly generates an approximate 200 watts
You mean the average human...
Lance Armstrong can sustain power outputs around 600 watts, and several people (most competative amatuer cyclists) are capable of a ~1 minute burst of over 1250 watts.
"I'll have a Guinness, no wait, make that a Coors Light" -Grad student I work with, who shall remain anonymous...
How much difference would there be in air pressure between the top and bottom of each rotor?
It's been a while since my last fluid mechanics class, but wouldn't the low-pressure above the bottom rotor "suck" the top rotor downward every time the two rotors overlapped each other while spinning?... causing the top and bottom rotors to bounce (if ever so slightly) up and down?
Isn't this version cooler? (scroll half way down the page to see it)
The weight isn't as important as a little forethought.
It has to be human powered? Fine...put Joe Powersource on it...let him peddle like mad. Store that up in a flywheel or other such reservoir. Let Joe keep peddling one more minute while you tap the flywheel to get the darn thing in the air and help hold it there for a minute.
Eh...then again, I didn't read the rules for this thing - but I'd be looking for the easiest solution the rules will allow rather than the most elegant one. You are trying to win 20k...not the nobel prize.
No it isn't. The story you linked to, is talking about the flight, due to happen Tuesday past. If this was a follow up, then it should have been posted Tuesday, when the flight attempt happened. Or maybe on Wednesday, the day the the linked article was written.
If I submit a headline for "Burt Rutan makes succesful first shot at private space flight" today, would that be a follow up? No, it would be OLD news/redundant.
Semantics aside, this happened on Tuesday, was well publisised (in fact, it was referenced ad nauseum in the story about the Canada robotic hubble fixer), and is no longer news. Don't defend the idiot Michael, just accept that this was News, 3 days ago.
In un-related news, two tropical storms are building in the Carribean, people in Florida are told to prepare for severe weather three days from now.
As a follow up, stock markets around the world tumble, looks like 1929 is going to be a lean year.
Still think its news? Or a follow-up?
The art of flying is learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.
(S(SKK)(SKK))(S(SKK)(SKK))
I was a member of a team way back in around 1993 that was going for the Sikorski Challenge, which I believe was similar to this one. At the University of Illinois at Champaign-Urbana our project, named the X-391 Dragonfly, was to hover at 1 meter for I forget how many minutes. We got as far as building the main rotor from carbon fiber/kevlar/foam injection with a custom made oven/vacuum bag contraption as well as designing the 'cockpit' the rider would sit in. It was a great experience even if it never "got off the ground" pardon the pun.
You are only popular on the Internet.
I believe the only way we could create human-powered aircraft is when the components (mostly wing area) was large and light enough to overcome thrust-drag ratios.
POINT 1: Can someone comment on the maximum sustained (3 minute duration) power output of a well trained human body? I believe it's less than one horsepower... ("he was stronger than a horse"), but not by much.
Regardless, it seems to me the components on a controllable helicopter include a Sikorski rotor assembly (that allows different angles to be put on a blad depending on it's position in a rotation). That dictates towards rotor blades that can occilate rapidly, and thus can very strongly stand up to high-speed torsions as well as flexing.
POINT 2: Since the blade structure is complex, and the rotors must be quite powerful, it seems to me that dictates tight restraints on design given the weight must be severely limited. Is there any discussion of exotic materials used in any other news article? I suspect a lot. What would the rotor blades be made from, standard materials like commerical helicopters?
POINT 3: I suppose the competition prevents someone from using a power storage device like a big battery or flywheel that a person can pump up to accumulate energy?
POINT 4: Does "Human Powered" mean chemically? Suppose I dried and accumulated enough of my own "dung", then burned it to distill alcohol, then used that alcohol as fuel in a conventional helicopter, it would be "human powered"... (grin).
Unitarian Church: Freethinkers Congregate!
Have they actually ever got the thing off the ground? I mean surely you test these things before you go off to the competition infront of 1000's of people? or did they just finish it and think ah, dang, we really should just stick a tarp over it and leave it until the big day, no use just having a quick go now.. maybe with a video camera. Actually knowing most engineering projects im guessing they just finished building the thing in the morning!
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its one of the rules for the competition. a big rubber band would violate the rule and disqualify them.
HA! HA!
The pilot could pedal for a minute or so prior to liftoff and tighten a coil spring, which would be used for the intital takeoff, just to get the blades up to speed faster. Don't know if that would violate the rules though.
if you put weights in the rotors to give them a large mass like a flywheel, then use your angle of attack cheat. would that violate the energy storage rule?
So it's not allowed for the rotors to have any mass, as this would store up kinetic energy?
Since only some geeks become engineering grad students.
that the theory "helicopters can't fly; they're just so ugly that the Earth repels them" is incorrect. Oh well, back to the old drawing board...
The only way I can imagine this working is with a really strong spring that weighs almost nothing being used to store a few hours of pedaling, to be released over a period of 3 minutes. Maybe in 100 years, when we have nano-technology to make everything out of carbon-nanotubes and diamond monofilament, okay, maybe then. But from the looks of it, they'll add that to the "cheats" list.
I'm surprised they didn't just come out and say "Make a working pedal-power helicopter out of granite and mud. You may use power tools, but only those made of pudding."
Climbing Mt Everest is a difficult, but sane, goal. Climbing the smoke from a campfire is nuts, no matter what school you're studying at. (yes, even MIT.) Anyone who has ever tried climb the rope in gym class knows how hard it is to lift oneself three feet off the ground. And that's with a nice, solid rope in your hands!
This reminds me of the Dilbert cartoon where they are supposed to build an integrated global supply chain using only post-it notes and a toothpick.
This is a great argument against the use of psychedelics when reviewing project specifications. I'm sure the kids had fun, though. Good for them.
"A witty saying proves nothing." ~Voltaire
"d'Oh!" ~Homer
I guess there goes my dream of being a human powered .. helicopter ... pilot. Soaring through the ... 3-meter-sphere. Okay, nevermind.
A team of University of British Columbia engineering students tried to win the $20,000 US prize offered by the American Helicopter Society.
Since when is Canada part of America?
=)
Dewey, you fool! Your decimal system has played right into my hands!
"the atmospheric conditions caused a dangerous imbalance in the craft's two rotor blades: the bottom blade was producing lift while the top blade wasn't." Sounds to me that what really happened was that they tried to save weight and didn't make the upper blades, which are longer, torsionally stiff enough. This caused a phenomenon similar to aileron reversal: as you produce lift, you produce a nose-down pitching moment which can elastically twist the blades, and may be capable of reversing the direction of lift. If this is what happened, then I can easily see the upper blades flapping down into the lower set of blades.
This aileron reversal effect is actually a fairly hot research topic in the rotorcraft community. People are trying to exploite it by using embeded actuators to control trailing edge flaps to create a pitching moment to twist rotor blades and thereby eliminate the swashplate for primary control.
...russians are rather fond of using the dual counterrotating design.
t tp://www.airliners.net/open.file?id=123084/ /www.aeronautics.ru/kamov/ka5201.jpga eronautics.ru/archive/vvs/ka27-01.htm. zap16.com/mil%20fact/kamov%20Ka-50.htm
http://www.airliners.net/open.file?id=056899
h
http:
http://www.
http://www
Not sure if this violates the "stored energy" rule, but put a few burritos in the guy and forget the rotors completely!
You know the last thing going through his mind when he crashed? His ass! Whooooaaaaaaa!
Crack- it's not just for breakfast anymore. JF is an asshole!
We all know that BA from the A-team won't fly, and he is the only one which can power it right!
I only read slash. for the articles...
not getting off the ground makes it difficult to crash
...
That's not the only danger though. If you read the competition rules at vtol.org, it's clear that the crew is allowed to burn their clothes, hair, and limbs to generate lift.
Personally, I hope that none of them is quite that committed to the challange. Maybe if the prize were closer to a million
I think someone would produce more spectacular results if one were to build a rocket onto a Schwinn like Bob Lazar's www.unitednuclear.com/jetplans.htm
and add wings...
then again, maybe it was Bob on a flying Schwinn, over Area 51, after all.
Props to Bob and his alien craft reverse engineering!
He'd have been born with rotors!
Busy aligning my non-linear thoughts.
Since you only have to store then energy for a minute, why not use a gearing system to store energy into a flywheel and then release it to supplement what you are still generating for the 3 minutes. you would also have to use variable pitch propellers or possibly a gearing system that allows you to charge it without moving the blades.
A spring would violate the "No devices for storing energy either for takeoff or for use in flight shall be permitted." section.
Two rotors? The blades are so big the drag will make it really hard just to sustain RPMs. If the rotors have independent speeds of course they will smack each other given they are nearly in the same plane.
Can't tell from the pictures if there really is a gear shift but it doesn't look like it.
Add a gearshift and use one pair of lift blades as well as a tail rotor
Shorter blades are likely better. The long blades may require fewer RPMs but the tips of the long blades will be really moving (v = wr) anyways.
A reasonable design is to take a real helicopter, strip the engine and other paraphernalia out of it and install a multi-person pedal system. Then test the endurance of an average person carrying a weight up a flight of stairs for one minute. Take 1/2 to 2/3 (maybe 1/4 or 1/5 depending on helicopter efficiency) of the maximum weight carryable, divide the weight of the helicopter by this weight to obtain the number of people required to pedal
Know your pads. One time pad: good for cryptography. Two timing pad: where to take your mistress.
See?
The dangers of knowledge trigger emotional distress in human beings.
>
To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
18.) IS THE PILOT A PROFESSIONAL CYCLIST?
The pilot is not a professional cyclist. He is a professional engineer
As a fellow engineer I would like to point out this design flaw.
Seriously though, having a professional cyclist would make a world of difference. Even their Ironman triathlete Engineer (who specalizes in endurace, not 1 minute intervals) is no match for the power output of a pro bike rider.
they missed a bit off the faq: Q. Did it work. A. did it fcuk.. honeslty, how with 160 'people' etc did they not notice the blade might clip...
Since when is Canada part of America?
We took them over back in '49... we just haven't told those stupid Canucks yet! Don't give away the secret!
Makes me glad I previewed it 7 times hehehe.
Yeah, some people like to mod comments down just because of who posted them. I get even with those people by moderating fairly instead. We'll see who still has excellent karma in 6 months. Yesterday I got modded troll, and it was up to +4 insightful by end of the day. The comment I posted kvetching about the retarded moderation was modded offtopic. And you know what? I'm glad some fool wasted his mod points on that.
Don't cry for me, Argentina-er, AKAImBatman. But, I do appreciate the kindness.
"A witty saying proves nothing." ~Voltaire
"d'Oh!" ~Homer
Those hosers are trying to steal our American helicopter prize money eh! And further more, what's this meters crap, I'm an American you insensitive clod!
---
Those who can, do
Those who can't, teach
Those who don't know how, supervise
Journalists being humanities majors, they aren't expected to (and don't) study anything that gets very far outside their field (say, basic math and science).
From the science end of the world, this drives me up the wall to no end. I not only am expected to have a working understanding of the humanities, but actually take pleasure in tasks such as studying and writing history. The result? Well, reading a newspaper already puts me on edge from constantly noticing little grammatical blips. As soon as I start reading some science reporting this is multiplied tenfold by the preponderance of errors born from the fact that the reporter doesn't understand the subject.
I say the only solution to this plague of hack BAs is to ban the degree and turn all humanities majors into minors. Unshackle ourselves from the tyrrany of people who don't know their way around basic reasoning skills but continue to try to make "reasoned" arguments that drive public attitudes and politics!
And while we're at it, we need to figure out a way to increase the value and reputation of trade schools. Lots of people are really wasting their time and money getting four-year degrees when all they really want to do is be lab techs and such, anyway. Maybe it would help if the concept of a major course of study were banned entirely. . .
When the Wright brothers were kids, they received a helicopter-like toy as a present... They decided to duplicate it by building a larger scale replica. The thing failed to take off and was very dissappointing. They learned from their mistake (power needed to scale up more than in a linear fashion for the higher payload), and they went on to contribute to the field anyway. :-)
You wish to know more about us? Excellent! After all, knowledge should be free, eh Captain?! Let's see... about us well, we ARE the Crimson Corporation, and the Crimson Corporation is us. When the Corporation's earnings are up, our quality of life soars, and our benefit packages improve. The further up the ladder you are, the more you profit individually.
When times are hard, the Corporation must cut costs, usually by laying off employees. Since everything on our world is Corporation property this means any ex-employee is instantly trespassing and is guilty of stealing Corporation property such as air and sunlight. The only appropriate penalty for theft is to feed the furnace.
..humans may be turned into a battery cell, but they may not necessarily generate a lot of power :D
http://efil.blogspot.com/
Get some hamsters and put them inside wheels. Woo hoo! Hamster-powered chopters!
If they wouldn't have made the pilot smoke a 4 gram crack rock it might not have went fast enough to break itself. Of course it probably doesn't help much that it looks like a helicopter made out of toothpicks.
If carrots got you drunk, rabbits would be fucked up. - Comedian Mitch Hedberg R.I.P. 03/30/68-2/24/05
Why not try a few politicians. Then you could have a hot air powered chopper. Which would never fail because it would never run out of hot air perpetual motion
they actually get one to work in the future.
What happens if your hamstring cramps with 10 M. of altitude?
Would it be considered cheating?
My rights don't need management.
Douglas Adams said it in HHGG.
There are a decent number of pedal-powered gliders, brought about largely because a well designed ultralight aircraft will fly without them, for a while at least.
Now, helicopter. It is no accident that no one has ever successfully glided a helicopter in to land. They have the aerodynamic qualities of a blue whale. Even if you could get it to work, and I honestly have no doubt that they can, at least far enough to get three meters off the ground, or whatever it was they needed. As for actually flying anywhere? Not only does manuvering seem like it would be really awkward, but the effort involved would be ridiculous.
ad logicam Claiming a proposition is false because it was presented as the conclusion of a fallacious argument.
Paragliders FLY,
Human powered helicopters don't.
Paragliders need just some wind,
Human powered helicopters need some spin.
Paragliders take off and glide,
Human powered helicopters from the air hide!
Paragliders let the man vie with the birds,
Human powered helicopters are fun only for nerds.
Paragliders can accept a man with a motor for flight,
Human powered helicopters' pedals are a real blight...
Looking at the pictures and the description of what went wrong, it looks like they needed more clearance between the top and bottom rotors. The Russian Helix, with the same eggbeater setup, has probably got about 5 feet of clearance between blades that are much stiffer to begin with. The Canadian appeared to have maybe a foot, with blades that are probably just as big, if not larger, but much less stiff. Finally, I'm sure that their hub probably had a little bit of play in it due to it's light weight that would become evident in any sort of wind. Overall though, I like the eggbeater design because it provides the necessary countertorque while still providing lift. Plus, they were able to repair it with cellophane in 17 minutes and made a second attempt! Unfortunately, the chain broke. Maybe they should've gone with a SRAM powerlink?
Also, the article stated incorrectly that the helicopter didn't have enough buoyancy. Buoyancy is a force due to differences in density of fluids and supports blimps and boats. The proper term is lift, which is pressure-related and makes wings and water-skis work. A nitpick that someone else already mentioned, but that comment has gotten buried in the responses.
A final point to those wondering about the feasibility of the project: The article (hint) states that two other teams have gotten craft to fly, they just haven't gotten high enough.
It's more the prestige of winning the competition than the money at this point, as well as the abilities (and job prospects) that come out of working on team based projects.
... the first human-powered cross-Channel flight. I know one of the guys who was on the support boat for it, and who was heavily involved with the project. They figured it was easier to get a cyclist and teach them to fly an aircraft, than to get a pilot and train them up as a champion cyclist.
They DID crash ..
But before the rotors were able to produce enough buoyant force they hit each other.
Is it just me, or do you find it ridiculous to spend $75,000 in order to win a $27,000 prize?
I LIKE TOAST!!!
Where is the sound track with the kwa kwa sound :).
One day I was at the south end of campus, exploring the woods, when I step out from the trees and it turns out I'm in a (mostly) fenced compound for the plant ops. There's lots of junk lying around behind an old warehouse, bricks, lamposts, spools of wire. So I look around, and I find a slightly damaged solar powered car under a layer of dead leaves. I think in a year this helicopter will be sitting right next to the car.
newspapers are reporting a large human-powered helicopter has been suspended from the Port Mann Bridge!
I believe they nearly got rid if the gifted/talented (In elementary/middle school) and Honors programs at my high school because of just such complaints from parents of those kids who didn't get in.
As if high school didn't hold me back enough as it was... High school without even honors math/science? *shudder*.
Thank God for taking part-time classes at Rutgers my senior year of HS when I ran out of things to take there.
retrorocket.o not found, launch anyway?
Someone forgot to drink their RedBull! Because as we all know, RedBull gives you wings! RedBull Flugtag!!!
Didn't get close to the 9m / 1min requirements, but they did manage to get off the ground, over a decade ago! http://www.calpoly.edu/~wpatters/helo.html
IAARowing Engineer
Use an ergometer, or an "erg," as the rowing community likes to call them. I'm an above-average rower, and I could sustain almost 700W for about a minute or so. There are people out there who do much better than me, as well.
An erg allows you to use your back and arm muscles as well as your legs. Three sources of power is certainly better than just one.
I don't believe it would be too hard to hook up several ergs to spin one rotor. I'm pretty sure this would be the best way to go about doing this project.
At 10 I was f*cking playing Lego.. for Christ's sake.
Next generation nerds, you see.
Rule #24b: The human powering the helicopter must survive the flight.
This would keep teams from setting fire to the unlucky pilot and powering the helicopter with a steam engine, too. =D
Eh...then again, I didn't read the rules for this thing
Just drop the helicopter *and* the judges out of a plane. Woohoo, human powered flight!
Yeah, I didn't read the rules either.
Light weight rotors and other mechanisms developed for this type of effort could later be applied to low-powered, low-RPM craft that might be more useful.
>> However, I hate to say it, but I remain a naysayer - I do not think this will happen, and should it happen, would never become universally accepted. Pedal-cars exist now. How many people do you see pedalling down the street?
That sould do it!
Excellent point. Had not thought of that. Makes you wonder how long it will take until such parts reach production widespread.
Whatever happenned to the team that built a large bladed helicopter for this event, when it was first started - I remember it was a university team, and the helicopter had one rotor, but was tip propelled by props on the end, which were powered by the rider via thin cable (monofilament?) which was wrapped around hubs on the axles of the propellers, and was drawn in by pedalling. By having it tip powered, they eliminated the extra rotor (as in the current contender's design), as well as not needing a tail rotor (as in conventional designs) - and since it was powered from the tips, there was no center torque to counteract...
Reason is the Path to God - Anon
They should fill those wings with Helium next time.
He sure as hell wouldn't have rotors.
Without links to sources reproting these facts, you are, at best, as bad as those who you try to refute.
I would love to read about these facts you report, if accurate they would likely change my outlook.
"I'll have a Guinness, no wait, make that a Coors Light" -Grad student I work with, who shall remain anonymous...
the lack of functionality means it's unlikely to crash and tragically kill its 21-year-old operator...
....I think not.
The design schematics claim that: "the wing span is greater then that of a 737"
And the composite structure that they built looks to have been so heavy that a "biker" could not throw it into the air. Just think for a minute the size and weight of fan propelled gliders and how much lift they produce. From what I can see a simple lay man would have had better perspective on this design. Every picture and schematic you look at you see them fashioning parts that look like they could be used for a gass powered plane...None of them even look remotely suitable for a Lance Armstrong powered plane, let alone whoever they found to fly it.
and they can fly hundreds of kilometers. See Daedalus project here, for example.
________
a war on terrorism? How can we end a war on a method?
The Gossamer Albatross is basically a giant wing, right? A helicopter is a vehicle that flies because it has a rotating wing. Soooo, take two Gossamer Albatrosses, and join the tips of each one's left wing together so that they form one long line but face opposite directions. Put a small cabin at the point where you join them, and put a human in there. Now you have a 3-person, human-powered helicopter! One passenger in the middle, and two engines^H^H^H^H^H^H^Hother passengers on the wings.
More seriously, what about economies of scale? Could a two-person or three-person human powered helicopter actually be more efficient?
Whats with the awful web design. It's like they are trying to suck...
Look at vaporware.
I can produce around 5000 watts with my right hand, if only we could harness the power of the porn.
Hear about the 2 dismantled Russian nuclear warheads that were found in a bunker that was covered by 10 meters of concrete?
A missile containing radioactive material is not a nuclear warhead, not unless you want to claim the US used "nuclear weapons" in both Iraq wars. AFAIK, they're missiles armed with the same depleted uranium that the warheads we've been saturating Iraq with use.
but it was reported hard and heavy on almost every major radio outlet.
Given that they've been a principle source of misinformation, it's not surprising you're so misinformed.
Your long list of cites is pretty much worthless. A bunch of articles about the same handful of shells dating back to the 80s. A little bit of lost inventory was bound to show up. It's not like we're particularly good at keep track of our chemical/biological agents.
Long-debunked reports and rumors of captured weapons. Most of the articles are the initial news reports that Fox News trumpeted across the airwaves. Naturally, Fox and Rush didn't give you any follow-up.
Honestly, if we actually found nukes in Tikrit, don't you think the Bush adminisrtation would still be talking about it? Posting several articles about the same assinine claim doesn't make it true.
The Bush administration's chief weapons inspector has come out and outright said there were no WMDs. We've controlled the country for over a year and all we've found is a few decades old shells and Bush is reduced to claiming we invaded because Saddam had "weapons of mass destruction program-related activities"? Quite a ways off from the mushroom cloud they were claiming was going to be the smoking gun, isn't it?
What happened to all those WMDs that the Bush administration repeatedly claimed to know the exact location of? Seems like a few of them should've shown up.
I wonder if this thing has shifters like a bike. (Based on the photo of the transmission and the single chainring I would say not.) Breaking a chain is a symptom of mashing the pedals too hard instead of gearing down and spinning. (In a recumbent you can really apply a lot of force that way because you can push your back against the seat... very bad for your knees though.) Perhaps they ought to gear down, spin, and keep shifting as the rotor speed increases. That is probably the most efficient way to get power.
Interesting you immediately call me misonformed when I have obviously read and heard BOTH sides of the argument to a very apparent large extent. I read the Liberal rags and I listen to the Conservative radios. I read FoxNews and then listen to the opinions of the very leftist Slashdot crowd. Calling me misinformed only shows a lack of thought on your part. I'll give you some slack, it is Friday and you are probably tired as well.
The fact the these same claims showed up in several locations does not make them bunk, it only helps to solidify them.
As a side, do you really have the gullibility to believe that NO weapons were shipped out to Syria? That's why I posted one specific link to that story. There were caravans of trucks that moved across into Syria leading up to and during the beginning of the attacks. Oh, wait, I'm sure those were food rations and medicine supplies. No way could those have been truckloads of weapons being moved and dispursed to groups.
The simple to see for anyone with cognitive abilites fact is a ruthless, heartless threat to the entire middle east and supporter of violence in America had either the weapons or was actively trying to get weapons, and needed to be stopped. The pacifist people are the first ones bitching that we had no business being there, but when either he, or one of the people he supplied and supported, killed innocent Americans (or innocent people of whatever country you are in), they then become the first people bitching that our bad intelligence let it happen and we should have done more to stop him. Well, this time we did do more, and the entire area is safer for it. But wait, they've gotta bitch about that too right?
Is Bush a good president, no probably not, but was the right thing done here to help make the world a little safer? YES.
Knightfall
Suppose I have a mass of 75kg and want to rise to a height of 3 meters above ground in 30 seconds. The power required is (75kg)*(9.81 m/s^2)*(3m)/30s, which is about 75 Watts, which is possibly doable. Granted, 3m in 30 seconds is excruciatingly slow ...
Human being (n.): A genetically human, genetically distinct, functioning organism.
I don't understand. You mean they started fighting over the money they weren't going to win? Gee. I wrote them and offered my assistance but they doubted my ability to slip a nitrogen steam hybrid dual catalyst powerhouse engine past the judges.
If Saddam really had wmds, then why didn't he keep them and use them against the US? I mean, he knew he was going to be captured, why not go out taking as many lives of USians as he could?
Maybe if he did have wmds, getting rid of them may pay off - maybe he will eventually be allowed some form of freedom somewhere (as he wasn't proven guilty of what the US claimed).
Is Bush a good president, no probably not, but was the right thing done here to help make the world a little safer? YES.
Hmm. Having reviewed the international legal issues concerning the US intervention in Iraq, the US just didn't have the legal justification. Their arguement claims that the authorization to use force under UN resolution 678 was still in force, but this requires too much threshold interpretation of various UN resolutions and international law to convince me.
What we are left with is the proposition that the US can invade any country it wants to for being a threat based on evidence judged solely by the US. Great for the US, and I see why alot of USians support this interpretation, but shit for the rest of the world and self-determination of peoples. I suspect that if the tides were turned, most USians wouldn't want a foreign country invading the US because it felt the US government was a threat.
The question is, how will the world react the next time the US wants to invade someone for being a threat? Will they allow it to happen so long as the US has some international legal smoke and mirrors to claim legitimacy? What about when there is no smoke and mirrors argument and they only claim preemption (the threat argument)?
What an amazing line. How the hell did he get to be president again?
I would still like to know what I said that was wrong.
Or are you a troll?
"I'll have a Guinness, no wait, make that a Coors Light" -Grad student I work with, who shall remain anonymous...