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Hippies Say WiFi Network Is Harming Their Chakras

Anti-Globalism writes "A group of hippies is complaining that a recently installed WiFi mesh network in the UK village of Glastonbury is causing health problems. To combat the signals from the Wi-Fi hotspots, the hippies have placed orgone generators around the antennae." Although there have been many studies that show no correlation between WiFi and health issues the hippies say, "Yeah, well, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man."

432 comments

  1. That's odd... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

    I've been saying hippies are harming my wifi network for years. Damn hippies.

    1. Re:That's odd... by UncleTogie · · Score: 3, Funny

      Damn hippies.

      *I'M* a hippie, you insensitive clod!

      THOSE hippies, however, are morons.

      --
      Don't tell me to get a life. I'm a gamer; I have LOTS of lives!
    2. Re:That's odd... by Torodung · · Score: 4, Insightful

      If you're a moron, you're not really a hippie. You're just a moron who acts like a hippie.

      You should know that! I'm starting to wonder if you should turn in your Hippie card and "tea set." ;^)

    3. Re:That's odd... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Offtopic

      You long to hate yourself. You are your own nigger.

    4. Re:That's odd... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      I'm a hippy too. they are not morons. How is what they are doing any different than ingesting the flesh and blood of christ in church. Oh, I know, Christ doesn't protect against electromagnetic radiation which the common person (in the civilised US) has no way of avoiding. These hippies apparantly would much rather not live with the pollutants they are absorbing, but they have no reasonable recourse. They resort to psuedo-religious magic to compensate for their inability to control their environment.

      If you believe in mind over matter or more pragmatically the placebo affect, then what they are doing makes quite a bit of sense. (have you seen how much gold costs these days? Especially for a poor hippy.)

      Finally, if I have to listen to people complain about second hand smoke so much that I feel like a goddamned leppar then why can't I complain even the least little bit about electromagnetic radiation? I seriously doubt that if their were a scientifically founded protection for EM radiation, these people wouldn't use it.

    5. Re:That's odd... by UncleTogie · · Score: 4, Insightful

      These hippies apparantly would much rather not live with the pollutants they are absorbing, but they have no reasonable recourse.

      Considering how long radio, TV, cell phones, and other RF sources have been pumping out just as much juice through their bodies/karma/astral-selves, I'm finding it hard to be sympathetic for them. Shades of Don Quixote....

      --
      Don't tell me to get a life. I'm a gamer; I have LOTS of lives!
    6. Re:That's odd... by LoadWB · · Score: 4, Insightful

      True. I have known a lot of hippies who love TV, radio, and even cell phones. So what is so oppressive about WiFi versus the rest of this?

    7. Re:That's odd... by TapeCutter · · Score: 5, Insightful

      "I seriously doubt that if their were a scientifically founded protection for EM radiation, these people wouldn't use it."

      It's called a Faraday cage, you could probably get one made in the shape of a pyramid and kill too birds with one stone.

      "If I have to listen to people complain about second hand smoke so much that I feel like a goddamned leppar then why can't I complain even the least little bit about electromagnetic radiation?"

      You can complain all you like, just don't expect anyone to listen until you have robust scientific evidence like the second hand smoker's do. I'm also a smoker and I'm willing to act reasonably by smoking outside. However when a second-hand smoker waves their face while walking past a leppar colony on a smog filled street I feel justified in telling them to wear a gas mask if they don't like it.

      Same deal for EM radition, either put up the evidence or STFU and let me use my mobile.

      Disclaimer: I saw Woodstock on the news when I was 8-9yo, had hair down to my arse in the 70's. The Hippie ideal of maximum freedom and minimum harm is still very appealing to me. I'm simply unwilling to ignore human nature and throw out the philosophy of scientific skepticisim. Unlike any "other way of thinking" it is demonstratably usefull to me beyond a healthy body and control of my emotional state (not that I have either:). One of scientific skepticisim's prime uses is to judge claims from others against what you "know" (eg: does EM radiation harm anyone?).

      Like Yoga in wich the rituals can be useful for a healthy mind/body, scientific skepticisim is also a usefull skill that can be taught, of course you then have to work at it for a while before you see the benifits. The hardest part of that "work" for a good skeptic is accepting that you cannot "know" anything but you can have scientific evidence that goes beyond reasonable doubt.

      --
      And did you exchange a walk on part in the war for a lead role in a cage? - Pink Floyd.
    8. Re:That's odd... by gadget+junkie · · Score: 1

      [...] I seriously doubt that if their were a scientifically founded protection for EM radiation, these people wouldn't use it.

      ...Mass produced tinfoil hats, maybe?

      --
      "If a boss demands loyalty, give him integrity. But if he demands integrity, give him loyalty." (John Boyd, 1927-1997)
    9. Re:That's odd... by OeLeWaPpErKe · · Score: 1, Flamebait

      In order for a faraday cage to actually block a signal, it's metal wires must be nowhere more apart than twice the wavelength of the signal they intend to block. So that would be a grid for 900 Mhz signals. Well, just how close do these need to be ?

      (3 x 10^8)/(900 x 10^6) = 33 cm to (3 x10^8)/(2.2 x 10^9) = 13.6 cm

      So that would be a bit of an impractical grid to put around you, now wouldn't it ? A metal wire every 15 centimeter seems a bit ridiculous. Of course there will be no observable phenomena from being inside or outside the grid so selling them a faraday cage that doesn't in fact block cell phone radiation would not be discovered any time soon.

      (oh and there is obviously a difference between Christians and hippies, for starters the fact that Christians actually have a purpose and generally act very sensibly)

    10. Re:That's odd... by meringuoid · · Score: 3, Interesting
      So that would be a bit of an impractical grid to put around you, now wouldn't it ? A metal wire every 15 centimeter seems a bit ridiculous.

      Not really. Hippies are known to sit inside pyramids or yurts while realigning their chakras or whatever it is they do. Wire your Faraday cage into that so that they can meditate on an RF-free zone.

      Of course there will be no observable phenomena from being inside or outside the grid so selling them a faraday cage that doesn't in fact block cell phone radiation would not be discovered any time soon.

      Well, apart from the fact that the hippie's mobile phone would show 'NO SIGNAL'.

      --
      Real Daleks don't climb stairs - they level the building.
    11. Re:That's odd... by joss · · Score: 2, Insightful

      > (oh and there is obviously a difference between Christians and hippies, for starters the fact that Christians actually have a purpose and generally act very sensibly)

      Really ?? You must know better quality Christians and lower quality hippies than I do. Or, maybe you don't actually know any hippies, you just assume that the stereotypes from South Park etc are reasonably accurate.

      --
      http://rareformnewmedia.com/
    12. Re:That's odd... by dov_0 · · Score: 3, Funny

      It's NEW to their environment, so they respond with the basic and common human idiocy of fear of the unfamiliar or unknown.
      Then again, their brains are probably so fried they wouldn't know reason and sense if they fell over it.

      --
      sudo mount --milk --sugar /cup/tea /mouth /etc/init.d/relax start
    13. Re:That's odd... by dov_0 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Really ?? You must know better quality Christians and lower quality hippies than I do.

      So who's stereotype of Christians do you go by?

      --
      sudo mount --milk --sugar /cup/tea /mouth /etc/init.d/relax start
    14. Re:That's odd... by genik76 · · Score: 1

      What's the purpose you claim Christians have? I know many people, who claim to be Christians, but I have not been able to identify a specific "purpose" in their lives.

    15. Re:That's odd... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "I'm a hippy too. they are not morons. How is what they are doing any different than ingesting the flesh and blood of christ in church."

      There's no difference: *both* are morons.

    16. Re:That's odd... by TapeCutter · · Score: 1

      "So that would be a bit of an impractical grid to put around you, now wouldn't it ?"

      13.6 cm is a bit smaller than chicken wire but (as you say) since their is no evidence of harm from wifi, practicality goes out the window when one seriously contemplates using a grid for protection against wifi, doesn't it? ;)

      "oh and there is obviously a difference between Christians and hippies, for starters the fact that Christians actually have a purpose and generally act very sensibly"

      That's not obvious to me, but I have observed that all idealogs and zealots have a superiority complex and generaly act in a presumptious, condesending, even violent manner to anyone who does not share their faith.

      --
      And did you exchange a walk on part in the war for a lead role in a cage? - Pink Floyd.
    17. Re:That's odd... by nazsco · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      > Christians actually have a purpose

      +5 Flamebait

    18. Re:That's odd... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      they are not morons. How is what they are doing any different than ingesting the flesh and blood of christ in church.

      They're also morons

    19. Re:That's odd... by Dun+Malg · · Score: 1

      I'm a hippy too. they are not morons. How is what they are doing any different than ingesting the flesh and blood of christ in church.

      Sorry, those people are idiots too. People who believe in transubstantiation (cracker/wine=flesh/blood) are just as foolish as a chemist who believes in alchemy or the original four elements of the Greeks.

      --
      If a job's not worth doing, it's not worth doing right.
    20. Re:That's odd... by Dun+Malg · · Score: 1

      (oh and there is obviously a difference between Christians and hippies, for starters the fact that Christians actually have a purpose and generally act very sensibly)

      So far the only common purpose I've seen among Christians is that they get their lessons in morality and ethics from a 2000+ year old book, which is about as ridiculous as treating medical conditions based on the theory of balancing the four humours.

      --
      If a job's not worth doing, it's not worth doing right.
    21. Re:That's odd... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Their portrayal on South Park seems fairly accurate.

    22. Re:That's odd... by cbiltcliffe · · Score: 0, Offtopic

      Yet the vast majority of Western legal systems are based on Christian principles. Do you complain about the fact that you can't steal your neighbour's car when you need a ride somewhere? Do you complain that you can't kill them because you don't happen to agree with their lawn decorations?

      That 2000+ year old book that you so easily discount teaches a few basic things very strongly:
      - Personal responsibility.
      - Treating others with love and respect.
      - Not being a greedy, selfish twit.

      These three seem to be commonly espoused here on /., but suddenly when they come from a source with the word "religion" anywhere near it, they're a bad thing?

      If it doesn't make sense to use this book as a moral guide, maybe we should all be telling the government to wiretap the whole country, bitching that they don't raise my kids for me, telling communication companies that they need to charge more for less, and drop all connections outside their network to 512 B/s, and get a job paying a billion a year as the CEO of a company that sells guns to 12 year olds so they can kill their parents when they get grounded.

      Get a life, you hypocritical bastard.

      --
      "City hall" in German is "Rathaus" Kinda explains a few things......
    23. Re:That's odd... by mrchaotica · · Score: 3, Informative

      A metal wire every 15 centimeter seems a bit ridiculous

      No it doesn't; chain link fences and chicken wire are both smaller than that.

      (oh and there is obviously a difference between Christians and hippies, for starters the fact that Christians actually have a purpose and generally act very sensibly)

      No more so than hippies, really. Christians just have more social inertia.

      --

      "[Regarding the 'cloud,'] ownership was what made America different than Russia." -- Woz

    24. Re:That's odd... by Raffaello · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Yet the vast majority of Western legal systems are based on Christian principles.

      This is really not true. Stealing is considered wrong in both non-christian and christian societies, so having laws against stealing is not evidence of a specifically christian legal system. Similarly murder, adultery, etc.

      This is the broken argument that religious apologists always trot out. The fact is that religious people are no more likely to be moral than others (and probably quite likely to be less moral - see next paragraph). People share common moral values whether they are christian or not.

      On the down side however, christians are responsible for numerous and well documented heinous atrocities specifically due to their religion (crusades, inquisition, witch burning, annihilation of heretics, etc.).

      On balance, christianity has been a net cause of significant evil in the world. For more detail see Dawkins The God Delusion

    25. Re:That's odd... by mdwh2 · · Score: 1

      (oh and there is obviously a difference between Christians and hippies, for starters the fact that Christians actually have a purpose and generally act very sensibly)

      What is the purpose of Christians, and what evidence is there that people who believe in chakras do not in general behave sensibly?

    26. Re:That's odd... by Stachybotris · · Score: 2, Funny

      Actually, given the number of cordless phones and other devices operating in the 2.4 - 5.6 GHz range, it's clearly not the frequency (or even density) of the energy that's harming them... It's really the 802.11(a|b|g|n) protocol that's making them suffer!

    27. Re:That's odd... by Hatta · · Score: 1

      You can complain all you like, just don't expect anyone to listen until you have robust scientific evidence like the second hand smoker's do.

      Like the WHO study that showed a decrease in cancer risk in children exposed to 2nd hand smoke?

      That study is a real lesson on how to spin your data. They found a significant protective effect of 2nd hand smoke on children. The entire confidence interval for the odds ratio is less than 1. But they conclude: "Our results indicate no association between childhood exposure to ETS and lung cancer risk." They're clearly ignoring the negative assocation because it conflicts with their political stance.

      On the other hand they found an effect of spousal exposure to 2nd hand smoke. The odds ratio they found is greater than 1, but the confidence interval goes all the way down to 0.94. That means that they cannot state with any confidence that there is any difference in the odds of you getting cancer whether your spouse smokes or not. This is not a significant result, and I don't know where they get off calling this "weak evidence". Statistically insignificant results are not evidence at all.

      What's best is that they blame their inability to find a clear and direct relationship between 2nd hand smoke and cancer on small sample sizes. This was the biggest study of its kind, spanning 7 countries.

      Please not that I do not smoke (tobacco). I simply hate to see the scientific process twisted by political considerations. This is the same kind of bullshit research that keeps marijuana illegal. Lets not keep falling for the same shit over and over again.

      --
      Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
    28. Re:That's odd... by techprophet · · Score: 0

      How is what they are doing any different than ingesting the flesh and blood of christ in church.

      Because we aren't. Symbolism is not actuality. Communion is to continually remind us that he gave himself for us, not to turn us into cannibals. (which we would be if it really was his flesh and blood, or the flesh and blood of any human. It makes me sick just thinking about it that way)

    29. Re:That's odd... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Same deal for EM radition, either put up the evidence or STFU and let me use my mobile.

      Not that I really disagree with what you said but it's hard to get evidence of long-term effects shortly after the introduction of new technology. Some not-made-by-lunatics studies have hinted that exposure to EM from mobiles (and so on) can be harmful. So you have to be reasonable when demanding evidence. A five-year study into the effects of x-rays would probably not show that there are any risks if hospital staff stay in the x-ray room all the time.

    30. Re:That's odd... by Jeremiah+Cornelius · · Score: 3, Funny

      > Christians actually have a purpose

      Here's someone who didn't hear about the closing of the Coliseum...

      Love, Nero. ;-)

      --
      "Flyin' in just a sweet place,
      Never been known to fail..."
    31. Re:That's odd... by oldspewey · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Modded offtopic? Is there really any such thing as offtopic on idle?

      --
      If libertarians are so opposed to effective government, why don't they all move to Somalia?
    32. Re:That's odd... by cyberchondriac · · Score: 0

      On balance, organized religion has been a net cause of significant evil in the world.

      Fixed that for you. ;)

      --

      Look back up at my post, now look back down, you're on the Internet. Now look back up. I'm a signature.
    33. Re:That's odd... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      So who's stereotype of Christians do you go by?

      The only accurate one: George Carlin's.

    34. Re:That's odd... by cyphercell · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      Einstein studied alchemy.

      --
      Under the influence of Post-Cyberpunk Gonzo Journalism
    35. Re:That's odd... by Archangel+Michael · · Score: 1, Informative

      And why not toss a few Jews into ovens while you're at it. After all, we all know that Christians and Jews are the bane of the world /sarcasm

      --
      Agent K: A *person* is smart. People are dumb, stupid, panicky animals, and you know it.
    36. Re:That's odd... by Eli+Gottlieb · · Score: 1

      Let me tell you, I know hippies, and the South Park stereotypes are pretty much accurate.

    37. Re:That's odd... by cyphercell · · Score: 2, Funny

      You're right. The symbolism of eating crackers to protect yourself from a goat-man that lives in a lake of fire is vastly less crazy than using pyramids to protect yourself from invisible electromagnetic radiation (which at least exists).

      Out of curiosity, why is it that a literal interpretation of the earth's age is okay (maybe not on your part), while a literal interpretation of communion is barbaric?

      --
      Under the influence of Post-Cyberpunk Gonzo Journalism
    38. Re:That's odd... by BB_Cat_3k · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Western system are based more on Roman law than Cristian commandments. That book tells us nothing either unique or original, and its followers are (statisticly) among the least moral definable groups there are. Seriously, what moral system DOESN'T teach - Personal responsibility, treating others with love and respect, not being a greedy, selfish twit. Without that book as a moral guide, I am still to the wiretapping and telling the companies to charge more for less and everything else you mentioned.

    39. Re:That's odd... by Chih · · Score: 1

      Yet the vast majority of Western legal systems are based on Christian principles. Do you complain about the fact that you can't steal your neighbour's car when you need a ride somewhere? Do you complain that you can't kill them because you don't happen to agree with their lawn decorations?

      That 2000+ year old book that you so easily discount teaches a few basic things very strongly: - Personal responsibility. - Treating others with love and respect. - Not being a greedy, selfish twit.

      Ummm, glad you put that plus after 2000 there. The rules you speak of were ideals well before either book of the bible. Just because your book incorporated what we see as 'common law', doesn't mean common law originated from your book.

      These three seem to be commonly espoused here on /., but suddenly when they come from a source with the word "religion" anywhere near it, they're a bad thing?

      If it doesn't make sense to use this book as a moral guide, maybe we should all be telling the government to wiretap the whole country, bitching that they don't raise my kids for me, telling communication companies that they need to charge more for less, and drop all connections outside their network to 512 B/s, and get a job paying a billion a year as the CEO of a company that sells guns to 12 year olds so they can kill their parents when they get grounded.

      Get a life, you hypocritical bastard.

      Religious people need to understand two things. First, there is a huge difference between having faith and having a belief structure. Second, not everyone believes the silly stories that you do, get over it.

      "I love God, but I can't stand his fan clubs"

      --
      For best results, avoid doing stupid things.
    40. Re:That's odd... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In fact, someone has already gotten into the business of selling faraday cages to the hippies:

      http://www.equilibra.uk.com/screening.shtml

    41. Re:That's odd... by kdemetter · · Score: 1

      Well , if it wasn't for Christians , then the atheist videos from Pat Condell wouldn't be as good as they are now.

    42. Re:That's odd... by marhar · · Score: 1

      Faraday cages work great. I put my wifi base station in one and haven't been troubled by it since!

    43. Re:That's odd... by khellendros1984 · · Score: 1

      13.6cm is large enough to pass a CD through. 13.6mm is closer to a chicken wire size.

      --
      It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten by a grue.
    44. Re:That's odd... by evandrofisico · · Score: 2, Informative

      Einstein didn't studied alchemy, Isaac Newton did in the 17th century, when matter structure was far from know. During Einstein lifetime the basis for modern chemistry (excluding quantum chemistry) were already known, and rudimentary atomic theories were largely accepted among the scientists of the time.

    45. Re:That's odd... by NiteShaed · · Score: 1

      And did you exchange a walk on part in the war for a lead role in a Faraday cage? - not quite Pink Floyd

      --
      Some bring out the best in others, some the worst. Some bring out far more.
    46. Re:That's odd... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Religious people need to understand two things. First, there is a huge difference between having faith and having a belief structure. Second, not everyone believes the silly stories that you do, get over it.

      Here's an idea, how about you stop calling them "silly stories" and accept that those of us with a belief structure and a membership in a Church (in my case The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints) believe that they are a valuable tool for guidance in how to live our lives today and we won't make fun of you for not believing what we see to be obvious truth.

      I happen to believe that God gave us the free agency to make the decision to or not to believe (this is the teaching of my Church). Naturally I think that believing is the right choice but I am not going to tell you you are stupid or have no right not to. Atheists are often just as zealous and militant about their dis-belief and stupidity of those who hold the opposing view as evangelical or fundamental Christians/Muslims/Hindus/Sikhs etc are about their belief.

    47. Re:That's odd... by bogjobber · · Score: 1

      On the down side however, christians are responsible for numerous and well documented heinous atrocities specifically due to their religion (crusades, inquisition, witch burning, annihilation of heretics, etc.).

      I don't think this is really what the GP poster meant, but those things (particularly the Inquisition) are where our legal system got its start. There are also some pretty deep roots going back to Rome and earlier, but the majority of it is Christian. Think of Christian ideals such as repetence (ever wonder why you get a lesser sentence for confessing?), rehabilitation, parole, that sort of thing, and it's pretty easy to see the large influence of Christianity on the legal system, even in modern, secular society. Also, some of our most fundamental civil rights are responses to overly restrictive Christian governments. So the GP was right, just not in the way he thought he was. The fact is that our society is a mostly Christian society, and it is descended from millennia of all-Christian society. It's understandable if most longstanding institutions have roots in Christianity.

    48. Re:That's odd... by Crunchie+Frog · · Score: 1

      Einstein studied alchemy.

      Citation please?

        I think you may be thinking of Newton. Different times and all that.

      --
      --- Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity
    49. Re:That's odd... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actually, as a point of reference, the term "Christian" literally means "little Christs", and the Bible states that it was a term first used in Antioch ( Acts 11:26 ) and applied to the followers of Christ, because they exhibited behavior and acted like Christ did.
      To say that Christianity has been a net cause of significant evil in the world is a bit of a loose interpretation. There have definitely been atrocities carried out throughout history, by people who called them selves Christians, but can a person call them self a vegan while they are in the middle of eating a prime rib, that they just shot that day, field dressed and cooked for dinner??
      To follow Christ, simply means to ask Jesus into your heart as your personal savior, give Him control of your life and obey what He teaches. It doesn't say anywhere that you are supposed to set people on fire...
      On the other hand, Christians around the world, offer there time, money and indeed, their whole lives, to bring food, water, medical attention, etc, etc, etc, to people around the world, without asking anything in return - this is service to God.

      Not matter what you believe, He loves you too!
        16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son,[a] that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

      http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=john%203:16%20;&version=31;

    50. Re:That's odd... by krenshala · · Score: 1

      Standard Protection from EMR: the Faraday Cage. Take the afflicted hippie and lock him in a metal conducting cage and he will no longer be bothered by the EM radiation, as it will be blocked by the cage he is now trapped in.

      Two problems solved with one cage.

      --

      krenshala

    51. Re:That's odd... by krenshala · · Score: 1

      Amen!

      --

      krenshala

    52. Re:That's odd... by azenpunk · · Score: 1

      yes it is true, the US constitution first and foremost assumes that the Christian God exists, and secondly that our rights and personal sovereignty are assigned by that God, and then we assign a small piece of that sovereignty to elected officials to keep things running smoothly.

      as far as Christianity being a net source of evil, BS. Stalin, Hitler, Pol pot, Mao, have collectively killed more people (several times over) than the entire world population during the time of the spanish inquisition. also, considering that the brand of socialism practiced by these leaders is diametrically opposed to having religion, i'd say that secularism has caused far more evil than religion.

      Stalin outright banned religion in the USSR because the peoples belief in a God challenged Stalin's need to make the government the sole repository of power and the only entity that could assign rights to it's citizens. he later reinstated it because he needed something for people to hold onto when WWII started getting too hairy, in short he needed an opiate for his masses.

      both the practice of religion and political power can substitute a persons innate need to act and be moral, when it's substituted by political power is when the absolute worst in humanity comes out, far worse than anything a christian could bring themselves to do.

      stats:

      the total world population in 1850 is estimated at 1,262,000

      the spanish inquisition started in 1478 but ran until 1830 so lets use that 1.26 million people figure.

      the holocaust is estimated to have killed between 9 and 11 million people. so lets call it 9 million just to be safe.

      stalin's regime is estimated to have killed about 20 million, and i don't think that counts people who just got sent to gulags and later were freed.

      Pol Pot and the khmer rouge are estimated to have killed 1.6 million people

      China, under Mao Tse Tung, lost 40 million people due to starvation

      the highest death toll i can find for the spanish inquisition is 31,912, that's *almost* 32 thousand people.

      lets add it up, 20+40+1.6+9=70.6 million people dead from secular causes, and just the big name ones too.

      compared to 32,000 for the inquisition secularity has killed 2,200 times MORE people than religion, all during more modern, supposedly more enlightened, times as well. now were not adding in the salem witch trials or the burning of witches in england but even if both of those witch hunts had killed off the entire world population in their time it wouldn't make much difference to the ratio.

      religion has a lot of people to kill to catch up with secular causes, christianity alone has no hope of filling the gap. the things you say dont' even stand up to a little bit of critical analysis. people do heinous things in the name of religion, i'm not defending that. but when people are fighting in the name of their beleifs they at least have beliefs that they keep themselves to. when they fight in the name of political power they put no limits on themselves at all.

    53. Re:That's odd... by cbiltcliffe · · Score: 1

      I'm glad somebody gets it.

      You can say how there are all sorts of "atrocities by Christians", but what you really mean is "atrocities by people who call themselves Christian."

      There's a huge difference. The Spanish Inquisition (which nobody expects, I know, I know...) runs completely against pretty much every teaching Jesus ever gave.

      If you prefer the wording Raffaello used:

      christians are responsible for numerous and well documented heinous atrocities specifically due to their religion (crusades, inquisition, witch burning, annihilation of heretics, etc.).

      That wasn't specifically due to their religion. It was specifically due to their own warping and perverting of what they liked to call their religion for their own ends.

      --
      "City hall" in German is "Rathaus" Kinda explains a few things......
    54. Re:That's odd... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Misguided fool.

    55. Re:That's odd... by cbiltcliffe · · Score: 1

      Without that book as a moral guide, I am still to the wiretapping and telling the companies to charge more for less and everything else you mentioned.

      Just because you have similar morals without the bible, doesn't make using the bible as a moral compass "ridiculous," which is what the GGP stated.

      --
      "City hall" in German is "Rathaus" Kinda explains a few things......
    56. Re:That's odd... by TapeCutter · · Score: 1

      We have very large chickens in Australia. ;)

      --
      And did you exchange a walk on part in the war for a lead role in a cage? - Pink Floyd.
    57. Re:That's odd... by AvitarX · · Score: 0

      On balance, large organizations have been a net cause of significant evil in the world.

      Fixed that for you. ;)

      --
      Wow, sent an e-mail as suggested when clicking on "use classic" banner, and got a fast response that addressed my msg
    58. Re:That's odd... by Xabraxas · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Yet the vast majority of Western legal systems are based on Christian principles. Do you complain about the fact that you can't steal your neighbour's car when you need a ride somewhere? Do you complain that you can't kill them because you don't happen to agree with their lawn decorations?

      Western government and law is based on the principals of the enlightenment. The enlightment was a backlash against religion. Only murder and theft are commandments and also laws. Half of the other commandments have to deal with believing in God and only the Judeo-Christian God. If the ten most important laws in the Judeo-Christain belief system are barely represented in any Western country's laws how do you presume that they are based on Judeo-Christian principles?

      That 2000+ year old book that you so easily discount teaches a few basic things very strongly:

      - Personal responsibility.

      - Treating others with love and respect.

      - Not being a greedy, selfish twit.

      It also contains horrific things. A lot of children's books offer moral value but that doesn't make me believe in talking elephants just as I don't beleive in the resurrection or other fairy tales in the bible.

      These three seem to be commonly espoused here on /., but suddenly when they come from a source with the word "religion" anywhere near it, they're a bad thing?

      No one is disparaging those values, just religion. You don't have to disparge those values to disparage religion. There are so many other things that are ridiculous.

      f it doesn't make sense to use this book as a moral guide, maybe we should all be telling the government to wiretap the whole country, bitching that they don't raise my kids for me, telling communication companies that they need to charge more for less, and drop all connections outside their network to 512 B/s, and get a job paying a billion a year as the CEO of a company that sells guns to 12 year olds so they can kill their parents when they get grounded.

      This is exactly like your previous statement and I see similar statements like it a lot from religious people. Somehow you people think that throwing out religion means throwing out liberty, responsibility, and prosperity. You are the one who is being insulting. It's insulting to people like me and others who don't believe in fairy tales to be told that because we don't believe we're against everything you consider moral. I don't need God to tell me not to kill somone or steal from someone and quite frankly I think it's sad that you do.

      Get a life, you hypocritical bastard.

      Oh the irony!

      --
      Time makes more converts than reason
    59. Re:That's odd... by Xabraxas · · Score: 1

      the total world population in 1850 is estimated at 1,262,000 the spanish inquisition started in 1478 but ran until 1830 so lets use that 1.26 million people figure.

      There is a major flaw in your reasoning. You assume that the people living in 1850 are representative of the population over a 400 year period! You go on to list recent secular wars that obviously have high death tolls because of something called "the industrial revolution". You fail to mention any more modern religious wars though like the constant fighting between Israel and every surrouding Muslim country. You also fail to mention the war between Iraq and Iran. As for Christians, the most powerful country in the world for the past 50 years has been run by avowed Christians despite its secular standing, and it has had troops on the ground in some country every year for the past 50 years. Christianity has also been used in the United States to support lynching, enslavement, and bigotry.

      when they fight in the name of political power they put no limits on themselves at all.

      Do you really believe that? Christians and Muslims believe in martyrdom. Combine that with the fact that a personal God pretty much guarantees that personal bigotry and tribalism is justified religiously, and you have someone who will stop at nothing for completely irrational reasons. When a purely political leader gets crushed militarily popular support wanes. Getting slaughtered in the name of God is considered an honor. People are much more likely to behave irrationaly if they think God supports them.

      --
      Time makes more converts than reason
    60. Re:That's odd... by Xabraxas · · Score: 1

      You can say how there are all sorts of "atrocities by Christians", but what you really mean is "atrocities by people who call themselves Christian."

      Does it really matter? Religion is used as the justification precisely because it doesn't have to be rational. That's dangerous.

      That wasn't specifically due to their religion. It was specifically due to their own warping and perverting of what they liked to call their religion for their own ends.

      You know what they say, "Power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely." The idea of a personal and all powerful god is a prime target for corruption.

      --
      Time makes more converts than reason
    61. Re:That's odd... by millennial · · Score: 1

      "Christians actually have a purpose and generally act very sensibly"

      I'm sorry, I couldn't hear you; I was talking to an invisible man who I can't see or hear.

      --
      I am scientifically inaccurate.
    62. Re:That's odd... by CheshireDragon · · Score: 1

      I second the AC, damn hippies!

      --
      "That's right...I said it."
    63. Re:That's odd... by millennial · · Score: 1

      'You can say how there are all sorts of "atrocities by Christians", but what you really mean is "atrocities by people who call themselves Christian."

      There's a huge difference.'

      Not when it's the "atrocities by people who call themselves Christian." that have ACTUALLY HAPPENED. Semantics are irrelevant.

      Besides, I think you'd be hard-pressed to show me a single person in the modern world who was truly Christlike.

      --
      I am scientifically inaccurate.
    64. Re:That's odd... by CheshireDragon · · Score: 1

      At least the hippies are bitching about something that actually exists.

      --
      "That's right...I said it."
    65. Re:That's odd... by ScrewMaster · · Score: 1

      How is what they are doing any different than ingesting the flesh and blood of christ in church.

      WELL, as Captain Kirk once said: "there's no accounting for taste" ... but different or not they're both pretty messed up. Seriously. Some people check their brains at the door and forget them on the way out. Matter of fact, I have quite a collection in my living room closet, the last batch having been left by a contingent of Jehovah's Witnesses. I don't really know what to do with the things, I mean, they really don't work very well and take up a lot of space. Still, they were important to someone once, and I'd feel bad just throwing them out.

      Finally, if I have to listen to people complain about second hand smoke so much that I feel like a goddamned leppar then why can't I complain even the least little bit about electromagnetic radiation?

      Nobody's saying you can't complain. It's just unlikely that we'll pay much attention when you're so obviously off the deep end, and especially if you keep spelling "leper" like that.

      --
      The higher the technology, the sharper that two-edged sword.
    66. Re:That's odd... by ScrewMaster · · Score: 1

      > Christians actually have a purpose

      Here's someone who didn't hear about the closing of the Coliseum...

      Love, Nero. ;-)

      Funniest thing I've read all day. Thanks for that.

      --
      The higher the technology, the sharper that two-edged sword.
    67. Re:That's odd... by ScrewMaster · · Score: 1

      how about you stop calling them "silly stories" and accept that those of us with a belief structure and a membership in a Church (in my case The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints) believe that they are a valuable tool for guidance in how to live our lives today and we won't make fun of you for not believing what we see to be obvious truth.

      Sure, if you'll promise to learn the difference between Truth ... and fact.

      --
      The higher the technology, the sharper that two-edged sword.
    68. Re:That's odd... by ChrisMP1 · · Score: 1

      Yup. It's called Insightful.

      --
      <sig>&nbsp;</sig>
    69. Re:That's odd... by ScrewMaster · · Score: 1

      A metal wire every 15 centimeter seems a bit ridiculous.

      What? Window screen wire is substantially smaller than that ... you could make an efficient Faraday cage by nailing it to some two-by-fours. Heck, if you require complete coverage (you know, in case some of those sneaky RF waves make it through the clearly-visible holes) just make it out of tinfoil. In fact, you could even make it into a piece of headgear.

      --
      The higher the technology, the sharper that two-edged sword.
    70. Re:That's odd... by cbiltcliffe · · Score: 1

      Not when it's the "atrocities by people who call themselves Christian." that have ACTUALLY HAPPENED. Semantics are irrelevant.

      Ok...I'm going to call myself a computer geek, then go find everybody who doesn't understand security and properly use antivirus software, and burn them at the stake.
      I guess that means information technology will be the source of a bunch of atrocities, huh?

      Besides, I think you'd be hard-pressed to show me a single person in the modern world who was truly Christlike.

      The fact that you would even make that comment shows me you have absolutely no idea what Christianity is actually about.

      --
      "City hall" in German is "Rathaus" Kinda explains a few things......
    71. Re:That's odd... by Meski · · Score: 1

      We have very large chickens in Australia. ;)

      And we spell them E-Em-You EMU
      http://www.roadkillcafe.com.au/public/index.php?pageid=10073

    72. Re:That's odd... by millennial · · Score: 1

      An argument ad absurdum and a No True Scotsman fallacy! I feel so privileged.

      --
      I am scientifically inaccurate.
    73. Re:That's odd... by BB_Cat_3k · · Score: 1

      The ridiculous part is saying (or implying) that your particular book is still effective when -like the humors mentioned- it is mostley obsolite. No one, including yourself follows even half of the contents of the book, and I know this because you are not sending these commect from Old Bailey. In total, it is ridiculous to hold more than a few orphaned scraps of the Bible as a collection of moral pointers akin to a bargian bag of fortune cookies sayings. Actually "fortune -o" at the prompt would leave you no worse off.

    74. Re:That's odd... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      mod parent flamebait

    75. Re:That's odd... by Goth+Biker+Babe · · Score: 2, Informative

      Firstly that book is not 2000 years old. Its about 1600 years old.

      Secondly its *only* 1600 years old. Some concepts of basic British law do predate Christianity. And then the basic concepts of freedom which were first enshrined in the Magna Carta were there *despite* the Christian King of the time.

      Thirdly that book tells us that blind people and other disabled people will not go to heaven, its wrong to eat shellfish, you can stone bald people, and more importantly is the main cause for bigotry against me. For everything good in there there's a conflicting bit of madness. On the whole the general teachings of the Jesus character are good but you need to throw away the whole of the old testament and St Pauls letters to the Corinthians since he was a born again rabbid nutter. Oh yes get rid of the Book of Revelations, surely that's mushroom inspired!

      But basically yes it does teach

      - Personal responsibility
      - Treating others with love and respect
      - Not being a greedy selfish twit.

      But also that you should be a complete arse to anyone who's gay or transgendered, oh yes, and put women in their places. So I'm screwed on three counts. The are plenty of other religions that teach the good bits without the fuckwittery.

    76. Re:That's odd... by skyephoenix · · Score: 1

      Christians generally act more sensibly? I got my day's laugh....yeah right.

    77. Re:That's odd... by vitamine73 · · Score: 1

      (oh and there is obviously a difference between Christians and hippies, for starters the fact that Christians actually have a purpose and generally act very sensibly)

      nonsense: http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2009/01/another_shooting.php

    78. Re:That's odd... by ciderVisor · · Score: 1

      I don't need God to tell me not to kill somone or steal from someone and quite frankly I think it's sad that you do.

      It's also sad that nowhere in the Bible is the act of slavery actively condemned. We are told to treat slaves well in some cases, but nowhere is the point made that no-one should ever make another person their slave. That particular piece of moral guidance has no root in the Holy Bible or the teachings of Jesus Christ.

      --
      Squirrel!
    79. Re:That's odd... by cyphercell · · Score: 1

      Bingo! But, I couldn't find an online source either.

      --
      Under the influence of Post-Cyberpunk Gonzo Journalism
    80. Re:That's odd... by cyphercell · · Score: 1

      The only reason we are having this discussion is because you believe your crackpot beliefs are better than a hippies crackpot beliefs. You believe the hippy is something you would not want to be associated with, regardless of the fact that most hippies I have ever known are far more christlike than the majority of christians I've met. I'll make an exception for christian hippies.

      --
      Under the influence of Post-Cyberpunk Gonzo Journalism
    81. Re:That's odd... by Sj0 · · Score: 1

      Both hippies and Christians are generally sensible (or they'd be dead). Both have their moments of stupidity.

      "It's harming our chakra" vs. "Don't use birth control to prevent children you won't be able to afford to feed. If you do, the sky fairy will punish you for eternity!"

      Not that science ever had perfect outcomes either. Both of the above are stretches from original documentation. man-made Microwaves didn't exist when "chakra" was invented, and the command was "be fruitful and multiply", not "never prevent multiplication ever". Similarly, we've had the guy who figured since radiation was energy, drinking radium water must be good for you (until his jaw fell off)

      --
      It's been a long time.
    82. Re:That's odd... by BigGar' · · Score: 1

      In my experience, given the ratio of good things added to the environment by humans vs. bad things; I'd say their response is justified. Even if they're only playing the odds.

      --


      Shop smart, Shop S-Mart.
    83. Re:That's odd... by Sj0 · · Score: 1

      "Yet the vast majority of Western legal systems are based on Christian principles."

      This is often said, but I don't believe it stands up to any sort of scrutiny.

      Just look at the 10 commandments.

      There are no laws in modern western democracies regarding which god to worship.

      There are no laws against carving images of things in heaven above, nor in the earth below, nor under the sea.

      There are no laws against taking the name of the lord in vain.

      There are very few laws to keep the sabbath holy.

      There are no laws to force you to honour your father and mother.

      Adultery tends not to be illegal in western countries, and we tend to get very upset when we hear about islamic countries where cheating women are put to death.

      There is no law against coveting your neighbours house, wife, servants, or posessions. In fact, it's encouraged.

      So the great Christian values we're left with? "don't kill. Don't steal. Don't lie in court"

      Our legal system appears to be 30% Christian.

      --
      It's been a long time.
    84. Re:That's odd... by Sj0 · · Score: 1

      This sounds like the "No true scotsman" fallacy.

      "But the pope ordered these atrocities!" "but no TRUE scotsman would do it!"

      --
      It's been a long time.
    85. Re:That's odd... by Sj0 · · Score: 1

      Hitler was a roman catholic.

      Why bother reading the rest of your "facts" if you didn't bother fact checking something that simple?

      --
      It's been a long time.
    86. Re:That's odd... by OeLeWaPpErKe · · Score: 1

      You're making a real good argument about the tolerance and non-violence of atheists.

      I just don't think it's the one you want to be making.

      Your only reply to a statement of faith are personal insults. You disgust me.

    87. Re:That's odd... by ScrewMaster · · Score: 1

      You're making a real good argument about the tolerance and non-violence of atheists.

      I just don't think it's the one you want to be making.

      Your only reply to a statement of faith are personal insults. You disgust me.

      You're welcome. And I made precisely the statement that I was intending to make. It was not intended as a personal insult (that you took it as such was predictable and not particularly interesting.) In fact, I rather succinctly stated the major problem with faith as I see it: a frequently-manifested inability to make distinctions between what is believed to be true, and what is true. Worse, the usual method for resolving that dissonance is to ignore reality, and if necessary force others to ignore it as well.

      Now, if I were the type to be offended by someone else's criticism of my belief system (I'm not, actually ... being very much on the outside I see little practical difference between religions other than variations in dogma and degrees of intolerance of other religions) I certainly would take offense to your complete and immediate repudiation of my worldview. Your "obvious truths" are not at all obvious to many people: you would do well to remember that. We tend to have more evidence on our side as well, which makes a position such as yours less tenable with each passing decade. But, no matter: people should be free to believe as they wish. For me to have the freedom to not believe, you must have the freedom to do the opposite.

      Silly stories aside (and I'm not questioning the utility of Scripture as a pattern for living: the GP did that) the fact is, you have faith. You believe in that for which there is no evidence, that by definition cannot be rationally investigated by scientific inquiry ... and that's fine so far as it goes. That's entirely your business. It is not, however, the only way to perceive our shared reality, nor is it the most valid in light of current knowledge. My fiancee, for example, is Catholic, but has no problem accepting that. She believes in her God, and knows that I do not. We get along just fine, because we both realize that honest love and caring transcend such differences, and are a hell of a lot harder to find.

      Yet, I've encountered many women along the way who were not so tolerant: either I convert, somehow "find {insert favored deity here}", or I'm not good enough for them. Some of my more religious friends are convinced (and have no problem telling me) that I'm unquestionably destined for a short ride to Hell when I finally assume room temperature. Not because I'm a bad person, but because I don't have a certain mindset.

      My fiancee sees it differently (she's African by birth, not American, so maybe that explains it, I don't know): she believes that I'll find my way to a better place because it only matters if you live your life the right way. And I try: my life has been more "moral" by Christian standards than one Hell of a lot of regular churchgoers. Mostly because I don't have an organized religion to help me rationalize my hypocrisy. This is it, I have one chance to do it right. Still and all, if I'm wrong about God ... I certainly hope she's right!

      As my father said to me once, "I'm simply satisfied with a more mechanistic view of the Universe." That sums up my belief system in a nutshell, such as it is.

      I guess this nut didn't fall too far from the tree after all.

      --
      The higher the technology, the sharper that two-edged sword.
    88. Re:That's odd... by MrResistor · · Score: 1

      That 2000+ year old book that you so easily discount teaches a few basic things very strongly:
      - Personal responsibility.
      - Treating others with love and respect.
      - Not being a greedy, selfish twit.

      Does it? Because none of the christians I know seem to have learned those lessons yet.

      Also, way to treat others with love and respect!

      --
      Under capitalism man exploits man. Under communism it's the other way around.
    89. Re:That's odd... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's good to see that someone else has seen these particular studies and realizes that the 2nd-hand smoke crowd is operating from a flawed base.

      I thought I was the only one.

    90. Re:That's odd... by shnull · · Score: 0

      srusley, innit time we start freezing them for future reference ???

      --
      beware he who denies you access to information for in his mind, he already deems himself to be your master (SMAC-ish)
    91. Re:That's odd... by cyberchondriac · · Score: 1

      I don't know what fanatic modded down a post as "overrated" that was only originally scored at "1" to begin with (shameful abuse of moderation!), but maybe he/she/it should read some history. Most of the wars in Europe, from 1100CE to 1600CE, including the 100 years war, the witch hunts, and the Crusades, were driven or facilitated by organized religion, not clashes over territory. I stand by what I said: much evil in the world was caused by organized religion.

      --

      Look back up at my post, now look back down, you're on the Internet. Now look back up. I'm a signature.
  2. Shut up! by fucket · · Score: 5, Funny

    You can't own the electromagetic spectrum, man.

    1. Re:Shut up! by n0dna · · Score: 5, Funny

      "I can. But that's because I'm not a penniless hippie." /futurama

    2. Re:Shut up! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The cost is $35/yr/person for the reported cost of $15000/yr and 422 people using it. That's a pretty good price for broadband access. Pretty much anyone but the most penny-less hippies could own it!

    3. Re:Shut up! by sesshomaru · · Score: 2, Funny

      Jrrr: Hear me out. There are many good reasons to eat: Hunger, boredom, wanting to be the world's fattest man. But not revenge. Are we no better than they? Besides, Leela's my friend.

      Lrrr: (mumbling) Is this true, Earthling?

      Leela: (mumbling) Yeah, it is.

      [He takes her out of his mouth.]

      Lrrr: Leela's garbled words have opened my eyes.

      [The crowd cheers and Leela spits out and pokes Jrrr, who giggles. Waterfall Jr. holds the mic and strokes his hair.]

      Waterfall Jr.: OK, that's a start, that's very Earth-friendly. Now everyone join hands. Join hands, please. I'd like to lead you all in some swaying. Come on, pay attention. [The audience is not impressed.] I said do it! Yeah...

      Lrrr: Is he your friend too?

      Jrrr: No.

      [Lrrr eats Waterfall Jr. He pokes his head out of Lrrr's mouth.]

      Waterfall Jr.: This is not happening.

      [Lrrr swallows him and everyone cheers and applauds. Lrrr clutches his stomach.]

      Lrrr: I think there was something funny in that hippie.

      --
      "MIT betrayed all of its basic principles."
    4. Re:Shut up! by elrous0 · · Score: 1

      A tragic loss for all of hippie kind. He was a cutting edge advocate for animal vegetarianism. He even taught a lion to eat tofu.

      --
      SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
    5. Re:Shut up! by stleary · · Score: 1

      "I can. But that's because I'm not a penniless hippie." /futurama

      That's a bold statement! It might sound a bit more believable if your global economic system was not in the process of crashing about your ears. Pretty soon we may all be penniless hippies.

  3. Ironic by Goalie_Ca · · Score: 1

    Isn't ironic that hippies are harmful to my health.

    --

    ----
    Go canucks, habs, and sens!
    1. Re:Ironic by bytesex · · Score: 1

      'Alternative medicine' /does/ affect other people's health when, for example, they refuse immunization.

      --
      Religion is what happens when nature strikes and groupthink goes wrong.
    2. Re:Ironic by plague3106 · · Score: 1

      No it doesn't. If someone refuses to immunize, I still have mine, so I'll be fine. Viruses can mutate without having people that aren't immunized.

    3. Re:Ironic by coastwalker · · Score: 3, Informative

      The UK is being cited as the cause of the delay in eradicating Measles from Earth because a medical quack decided that he would fake evidence that the triple MMR vaccination caused autism. The gutter press got hold of it and screamed "save the children" thereby convincing concerned parents everywhere to not vaccinate their children. I'm hoping a few of them will die of measles in order to help sharpen up peoples discrimination between nutjobs and science. I'm perfectly happy for the people of Glastonbury to do without the 21st century but I strongly object to their invocation of psudo science and trickery to condemn the rest of us to their unenlightened state. These people are wrong and should be told so in VERY large letters.

      --
      Facts are history now plebs have politics for religion on social media.
    4. Re:Ironic by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You don't seem to actually know what you're talking about. The paper that caused the scare was published in the Lancet, Andrew Wakefield is not a 'medical quack', he is a fully qualified surgeon and was at the time a respected member of the scientific community. By the time evidence emerged (some years later) of his various misconducts the idea that the MMR vaccine was unsafe was very deeply rooted in the minds of the general public. These things are slow to erase, although it is being erased. Slowly.

      Parents who refused the MMR vaccine were not morons taken in by pseudo science, they made a valid decision on the basis of a paper published in a respected scientific journal which was eventually disproved. Nor was it the fault of the media - although they did their usual thing of whipping up a frenzy, on that occasion it was on a fairly strong foundation.

      It's the fault of the scientific community for letting it through in the first place and then being so slow to challenge it, so don't equate it with this wi-fi rubbish.

    5. Re:Ironic by gregbot9000 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I go to college, I'm used to pseudo science and trickery. It seems every professor I've had the last two semesters was bent on convincing the class that far left ideology is correct, and the best way to prove this was by assigning reading completely devoid of fact and unrelated to class.

      With that in mind, this story and that doctor don't surprise me at all, and go to the root of the problem. It ask questions I am still trying to answer: How do people hold a philosophical belief yet purposefully fake evidence to support their claim and yet not question the claim itself? If the only evidence supporting their claim is false information created by them yet is used by them to support it how do they not question their belief structure?

      I was assigned a book to read in my sociology class that was little more then subjective rhetoric and purposely set up situations to justify policy decisions. The authors concern was the good of society. What good could come from acting on false information? Information that more objective studies in my economics class had proven to be completely false through rigorous documentation. If goal is helping society and beliefs are shown to not coincide with that goal, why do people chose their beliefs over their goal?

      The goal of the doctor was probably to help people and he probably believed vaccines caused autism so he faked information that will more likely hurt people. His goal of helping people has failed miserably.

      Same with these "hippies." Is it just human nature to value opinion over fact? How can we address this problem?

    6. Re:Ironic by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The goal of the doctor was probably to help people and he probably believed vaccines caused autism so he faked information that will more likely hurt people. His goal of helping people has failed miserably

      Actually, although the inquiry isn't completed yet, from the evidence unearthed so far it seems a lot more likely that his goal was to make a great deal of money.

    7. Re:Ironic by 16K+Ram+Pack · · Score: 2, Insightful
      The problem is that non-vaccination doesn't just affect the children of idiot parents. There are some children who can't have the vaccine because of allergies.

      This wasn't a problem in the past because the level of vaccination was so high that there was herd immunity. The virus couldn't spread because the odds of someone with measles passing it on to someone else, then on to someone else and so on were incredibly low.

      Personally, I'd tell parents that they can't attend state school without a vaccine certificate. You either have a measles jab, or you homeschool them.

    8. Re:Ironic by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Opinions are like assholes: Everyone has one, and when mine tells me something, I listen. :)

      Seriously though, I think this has to do with peoples' want for instant gratification. It's easier to just believe something than to investigate it properly.

    9. Re:Ironic by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What evidence do you have that the doctor is a quack. How do you know the quacks are not in government and in the pharmaceutical industry all in each other's pockets to make money with phoney science. No vaccination has ever undergone a double blind test. Not one. Not ever. Does that sound like good science or quackery... This is mass medication, never tested and it has all kinds of quackery stuff in it, like foreign dna, and preservatives containing mercury and other harmful substances. Once upon a time we used to know in our advanced science that mercury was extremely extremely toxic and harmful poison, but now you can just inject it right into your veins. Any quantity is harmful. Vaccainations do cause extremely harmful side effects including death in a lot of people every year, due to allergies and unknown reactions. I have a relative who is undiagnosed, completely retarded after getting a vaccination, no other thing happened in his life that could have caused this since he was five he has suffered debilitating seizures and in 40 years has never been diagnosed by numerous "experts". His symptoms do however fit perfectly with extreme allergic reaction to vaccination. Here is some good science though: fraud investigation. Usually what you do is, you check out who is making the most money off the thing, then you see who is promoting it, through fear and spin, and you find out if the thing is actually good or devastatingly harmful to things like, oh you know, general population IQ, and cancer statistics and this kind of thing.... who benefits. A short amount of research off the mainstreat media ie in a real book with proper research not heresay from this official pharmaceutically paid expert to that, will show you that at the very least, there is a great deal of doubt surrounding vaccinations and at the worst they are possibly the most dangerous and evil thing that do no good at all. Don't believe what you think you know, find out the facts - that's the scientific way. Presently unless you can tell me and show me that you have done a double blind scientifically coordinated test on any vaccination at all, the evidence is simply not present.

  4. "Orgone Generators" by Suddenly_Dead · · Score: 5, Informative
    FTFA:

    One man has even begun making orgone generators, which use crystals, semi-precious stones and gold to purportedly put out positive energy to combat the negative vibes flooding the town from the Wi-Fi base stations.

    Elsewhere:

    Orgone Generators change negative energy from microwaves, TV's, cell phones, computers, fluorescent lighting, automotive wiring, large electrical structures, high voltage lines and step-down electrical transformers, etc. into pure or positive life energy.

    Positive Orgone is also known as Chi(China), Prana(India), and Ki(Japan).

    The basic and simplified theory of how the orgone devices work is that the negative energy is attracted into the device by the organic component and then it gets bounced back and forth between the resin and suspended metal particles. Crystalline structures within the mix cause the energy to get organized and re-radiated as a positive, clean energy.

    Oh yes, these sound like reasonable people.

    1. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Rei · · Score: 1

      I'm sure that before they made those claims, they consulted all the sages they could find in yellow pages.

      --
      "99 dead duelists of Dios on the wall. 99 dead duelists of Dios! Take one's ring, pass it around..."
    2. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Gandalf_Greyhame · · Score: 3, Insightful

      FTFA:

      One man has even begun making orgone generators, which use crystals, semi-precious stones and gold to purportedly put out positive energy to combat the negative vibes flooding the town from the Wi-Fi base stations.

      I am just sitting here wondering how long it is going to take someone to just pinch them all... surely there would have to be at least a few bucks in gold there. If not, it'd still be fun to pinch them and place them all around the town in people's gardens, on shop roofs, etc.

      --
      I am not stubborn. I am right!
    3. Re:"Orgone Generators" by ubernostrum · · Score: 2, Informative

      Martin Gardner's essay "Wilhelm Reich and the Orgone" is highly recommended reading on the topic (as is, well, pretty much anything he writes debunking pseudoscience).

    4. Re:"Orgone Generators" by tsuki.kodomo · · Score: 1

      hahaha...uh, yes...reasonable lads. lol. Like so reasonable dude....lol

    5. Re:"Orgone Generators" by QuasiEvil · · Score: 1

      You needed anyone to actually debunk these things? One look at the picture and that was enough to debunk any functionality in my book.

    6. Re:"Orgone Generators" by mofag · · Score: 2, Funny

      Well from the description it seems unlikely that the orgone generators interfere to any practical extent with the wifi so good for them! If building a few pretty sculptures turns the bad harmful wifi into good life-enhancing wifi then I'll have one too. Perhaps they could partner with Cisco to market value-addded hippie-friendly wifi?

    7. Re:"Orgone Generators" by mofag · · Score: 2

      Hey Gandalf, its no wonder they call you "the grey" - you can be quite mean at times.

      Actually I thought you meant pinch the hippies to wake them up. Only later (time dilates) did I realise you were referring to burglary.

    8. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Gandalf_Greyhame · · Score: 4, Funny

      nah, I don't want to pinch them to wake them up... I want to give them a bloody good bitch slapping and tell them to get a job

      --
      I am not stubborn. I am right!
    9. Re:"Orgone Generators" by im_thatoneguy · · Score: 1

      Wait... if Orgone Generators convert bad energy into good energy... then wouldn't the Wifi network be increasing the amount of Good energy with sufficient Orgone installation?

      The Wifi installation is actually increasing the input energy amount and should be praised for bring peace and stability.

    10. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm surprised they kept with it after the Mayan panoramas on their pyramid pajamas didn't help their little problem.

    11. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Many believed that X-Rays were just magic and illusion, now we know they illuminate fractures. Im not saying that the WiFi is bad but myths of laylines and magnetic fields have correlations. We know other animals can sense electromagnetic fields, so maybe we can too. Science is a discovery not a creation activity, and it simply has not caught up with our bodies.

    12. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Architect_sasyr · · Score: 4, Funny

      Note to self: Convert doomsday device to look like a hippy "good-vibe" machine.

      --
      Me failed English...
      FreeBSD over Linux. If my comments seem odd, this may explain...
    13. Re:"Orgone Generators" by mr100percent · · Score: 1

      Just tell them that the generators are actually mini-daleks

    14. Re:"Orgone Generators" by LoadWB · · Score: 5, Funny

      I have to call shenanigans on the whole "negative energy" thing.

      For one example, take a microwave oven. You put something in, turn it on, and the item cooks. That is an exhibit of POSITIVE energy flow. If you put a hippie in the microwave, the magnetron emissions does not suck the life energy out of the hippie, the hippie's life energy is released from its oppressive corporeal representation into the next higher plane. Ergo, another positive energy transfer! Come on, hippies... we are talking technology-assisted ascension!

      And TVs, radios, etc. POSITIVE energy. In all cases we are using technology to enhance nature, similarly to the way hippies use crystals, precious metals, and *ahem* herbs to enhance nature.

      Or at least that is how it works in my head.
      --
      Free Waterfall, Jr.: "We taught a lion to eat tofu!"
      Lion, sickly and emaciated: *cough* *cough*
      --
      Lur: "Ohhhh, there must've been something bad in the hippie I ate..." [/futurama]

    15. Re:"Orgone Generators" by LoadWB · · Score: 1

      Please skip directly to "Profit!"

    16. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Nethead · · Score: 2, Funny

      There is a strong connection between LSD and BSD. (and yeah, I've abused both.)

      --
      -- I have a private email server in my basement.
    17. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Funny

      I have to call shenanigans on the whole "negative energy" thing.

      If you put a hippie in the microwave, the magnetron emissions does not suck the life energy out of the hippie ...

      Of course it doesn't suck the life energy out of the hippie. You can't suck life energy out of something that doesn't have a life.

    18. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Yuuki+Dasu · · Score: 1

      Oh yes, these sound like reasonable people.

      Just to be fair, there's no reason to say that all or even most of the people complaining think that Orgone isn't full of shit.

      That sounds to me like either someone on the fringe of their fringe, or someone trying to catch some free publicity and sell some snake oil to some of the dumber locals (hippies can be just as dumb and just as smart as any other group of people).

      I highly doubt that anyone's being affected, but if they're making such a fuss as they say in the Fine Article, they might as well look into it.

    19. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Vanders · · Score: 1

      You laugh now, but just wait until he starts selling these things to Audiophiles at £10,000 a pop.

    20. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Hal_Porter · · Score: 5, Funny

      I'm sure that before they made those claims, they consulted all the sages they could find in yellow pages.

      No way man, experts and sages have all been paid off by Big WiFi.

       

      Incidentally, does anyone else find it ironic when hippies loudly proclaim that pot is harmless and then show signs of serious paranoia when they explain that it is only illegal because of some complicated conspiracy?

      --
      echo -e 'global _start\n _start:\n mov eax, 2\n int 80h\n jmp _start' > a.asm; nasm a.asm -f elf; ld a.o -o a;
    21. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Hal_Porter · · Score: 1

      Those were Ogrons.

      --
      echo -e 'global _start\n _start:\n mov eax, 2\n int 80h\n jmp _start' > a.asm; nasm a.asm -f elf; ld a.o -o a;
    22. Re:"Orgone Generators" by profplump · · Score: 4, Informative

      You're probably just trolling, but I'm in the mood for an Internet argument, so I'll bit anyway.

      Microwaves aren't new. There's a good deal of microwaves floating around the universe (including at ground level on Earth) from natural sources. And there have been both mobile and fixed location broadcast microwaves in use for decades, at much higher power levels than WiFi installations. Not to mention all the nuisance sources of microwaves like, you know, microwave ovens. A typical household microwave puts out almost 1 kW -- even if you assume 99% of that is contained in the appliance, it's still 10 times more power <I>leaking</i> than a 6dbi omnidirectional WiFi transmitter (legally) intentionally emits.

      Moreover, we actually <i>have</I> studied the interaction of microwaves with the human body. First, there's about a 10 dB reflection loss at the human-air boundary at WiFi frequencies, and attenuation inside the body is about 2 dB/cm. Therefore there is very little interaction beyond the first couple of centimeters, assuming the signal is strong enough to overcome the reflection losses in the first place. And guess what those microwaves do when you interact with them -- I know it's tricky, because science hasn't caught up with the human body -- but studies suggest that a typical interaction involves energy transfer via polarization in molecules with a strong dipole moment. Which, you know, is a lot like what happens to the flesh-like materials you might try to heat with a microwave oven.

      So in summary, you can sense microwave fields. If they are sufficiently strong, you should be able to detect them by the heat generated when you absorb the EM energy. Not that you'd be able to distinguish microwaves from infrared radiation, or from simple conduction, but you could detect the presence of an energy source.

      Also you example of "in the past, some people didn't believe new, poorly understood science, but most people believe what is now well-established science" doesn't really support the idea you're trying to defend -- that the totally invented beliefs of hippies might be true in spite of science. It's possible for totally invented beliefs to be true -- even a broken clock is right twice a day -- but the "in spite of science" part makes it hard to take them (or you) seriously.

    23. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Intrinsic · · Score: 0

      Please, for the LOVE OF GOD, mod parent up, and label as FUNNY.

    24. Re:"Orgone Generators" by F34nor · · Score: 1

      Next time try DMT.

    25. Re:"Orgone Generators" by couchslug · · Score: 1

      They were abandoned in place. Sounds like free stuff to me!

      --
      "This post is an artistic work of fiction and falsehood. Only a fool would take anything posted here as fact."
    26. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Nursie · · Score: 2, Funny

      Seriously weird folks.

      If you want to read more about "Orgone" and the crackpot that came up with it, look up Wilhelm Reich.

      I have a wireless router under my bed, near the head end. Strange how I'm not suffering from the "illnesses" these idiots are claiming.

    27. Re:"Orgone Generators" by dusty123 · · Score: 1

      I think, those fears have to be taken for real. People who suffer from that, are really affected by it, I have heard of many cases, where people get really ill, although this may be not much more than the well-known placebo effect. Fears from the unconsciousness can very often not be calmed by logic. However, another irrational belief that culminates in some device called "Orgone Generator", seems to relieve people from that fear, thus the unconsciousness found it's own solution. Well, my personal suggestion in this case would be to sponsor these Orgon-Generators, maybe, even implement them in the Wifi-Device. If marketed the right way, those Wifi-Hotspots may be seen as something positive, something that people like to set up as they produce "positive energy".

    28. Re:"Orgone Generators" by niiler · · Score: 2, Funny

      Yeah, I have a crazy relative who is just fine around these things until he notices them. He's great around traditional 60 W lightbulbs (powered by AC voltage at 60 Hz), but show him an LED, say the green one that turns on when you turn on certain devices, and he is being poisoned. He often leaves the house to avoid E&M fields, and because it's so cold outside, takes a plugin space heater with him (giant extension cord and all).

    29. Re:"Orgone Generators" by AWhistler · · Score: 1

      So call now and get yours! We can't do this all day.

    30. Re:"Orgone Generators" by argStyopa · · Score: 2, Funny

      The only reasonable way to test your hypothesis would be to actually STICK a hippy in a microwave. Better still for an adequate statistical sample, perhaps 100 would be better. Then, maybe another 100 with their Orgone generators and see if there is a different result.

      It's really a no-lose experiment.

      --
      -Styopa
    31. Re:"Orgone Generators" by coastwalker · · Score: 1

      I second that, though my router is at the foot of the bed. I found their campaign website and emailed them to tell them the good news that I have done the best I can to destroy my health with wicked Wi-Fi but have singularly failed to damage my chakras or anything else that I can think of. I am sure that they would welcome further testimonials to support one side of the story or the other to janesiran@yahoo.co.uk

      Oh and I hope you addressed your post to everybody, not just the seriously weird folks.

      --
      Facts are history now plebs have politics for religion on social media.
    32. Re:"Orgone Generators" by hesiod · · Score: 1

      There is a strong connection between LSD and BSD.

      Next time try DMT.

      Is that a Linux Distro?

    33. Re:"Orgone Generators" by cbiltcliffe · · Score: 2, Funny

      They've got a job. Building Orgone generators!

      --
      "City hall" in German is "Rathaus" Kinda explains a few things......
    34. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Pope · · Score: 1

      That's cuz you've been paid off by the phone company, man.

      --
      It doesn't mean much now, it's built for the future.
    35. Re:"Orgone Generators" by SerpentMage · · Score: 1

      You know what amazes me. These people are actually buying these things. So where can I sign up to sell these things?

      I mean after all if we use PRECIOUS stones all is ok. After all PRECIOUS stones ALWAYS emit postive energy...

      ROTFL...

      Again where can I sign up to sell this?

      --

      "You can't make a race horse of a pig"
      "No," said Samuel, "but you can make very fast pig"
    36. Re:"Orgone Generators" by cbiltcliffe · · Score: 1

      Prefer GMT, myself....

      --
      "City hall" in German is "Rathaus" Kinda explains a few things......
    37. Re:"Orgone Generators" by notnAP · · Score: 5, Funny

      All energies that take wave form are positive.

      And then, they're negative.

      And then, they're positive.

      And then, they're negative.

      And then, they're positive.

      And then, they're negative.

      And then, they're positive.

      And then, they're negative.

      And then, they're positive.
      ...

      Some make these transformations wicked fast.

    38. Re:"Orgone Generators" by AGMW · · Score: 1
      If someone stole the Orgone generators, would that make then Andgone generators?

      I'll get my coat ...

      --
      Eclectic beats from Leeds, UK
      handmadehands.co.uk
    39. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      then show signs of serious paranoia when they explain that it is only illegal because of some complicated conspiracy?

      And yet between the legality of Liquor and tobacco, the limited success in the ongoing "war on drugs", and the relative availability of pot, I can't help but wonder if they're right. ... sometimes at least.

    40. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Deadstick · · Score: 1

      He'll have to hurry if he wants to beat Denon to the patent...

      rj

    41. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Thiez · · Score: 1

      Why adapt to people who hold irrational ideas? If people think an 'Orgone Generator' is going to help them, they are free to purchase it themselves. Once you start giving in to peoples irrational believes they'll just see that as proof that they were right and science was wrong.

    42. Re:"Orgone Generators" by dusty123 · · Score: 1

      The point is, that the unconsciesness is very powerful, probably more powerful than the consciesness. If one denies it, he will run into troubles. The point is, that people are actually right. When they feel ill, this is very, very real for them, thus it is meaningless to deny it, even worse, this denial will stimulate them to fight things. Another solution would be to tell them, that there's no know rational explanation, however, we accept that they find their salvation in their "Orgone Generator", thus we encourage them to set one up or even help/sponsor them to do so. I know quite some families where a wireless lan is set up and one or more family members get afraid of its radiation, so, if the industry produces wireless lan devices with "Orgone Generators" included, things may get more easily accepted.

    43. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Offtopic

      Cannabis has never killed a single human being in recorded human history...look it up.

      Alcohol kills by both overdose and withdrawal, and that's scores of people, every single day of the year...look it up.

      Make all the hippies/pot jokes you want, the potsmokers who don't drink alcohol will have the last laugh...we shall see, won't we?

      Heavy alcohol consumers ought to be paranoid about their health in a decade or two. Just my "tokin" .02

    44. Re:"Orgone Generators" by blueZ3 · · Score: 1

      As you know, the concept of the suction pump is centuries old. And really, that's all this is, except that instead of sucking water, I'm sucking life. I've just sucked one year of your life away. I might one day go as high as five, but I really don't know what that would do to you, so let's just start with what we have. What did this do to you? Tell me. And remember, this is for posterity, so... be honest. How do you feel?

      --
      Interested in a Flash-based MAME front end? Visit mame.danzbb.com
    45. Re:"Orgone Generators" by roc97007 · · Score: 1

      Gold? Just out in the open?

      Where was this again?

      --
      Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
    46. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Eli+Gottlieb · · Score: 1

      Damn you, don't encourage the chavs!

    47. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hal_Porter wrote:
      "Incidentally, does anyone else find it ironic when hippies loudly proclaim that pot is harmless and then show signs of serious paranoia when they explain that it is only illegal because of some complicated conspiracy?"

      Maybe, but we can't talk to you because your perch is too high.

    48. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

      Incidentally, does anyone else find it ironic when hippies loudly proclaim that pot is harmless and then show signs of serious paranoia when they explain that it is only illegal because of some complicated conspiracy?

      Actually more of a convergence of 3 big industries. Cotton,Tobacco, and Oil. Hemp competes with all three.

    49. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Chih · · Score: 1

      Oh, I wish I had some mod points, heh

      --
      For best results, avoid doing stupid things.
    50. Re:"Orgone Generators" by shrikel · · Score: 1

      I am an expert and am willing to testify that Wifi is bad for your health. Now whom do I speak to to get some hush money?

      --
      Any sufficiently simple magic can be passed off as mere advanced technology.
    51. Re:"Orgone Generators" by NiteShaed · · Score: 1

      I think, those fears have to be taken for real. People who suffer from that, are really affected by it, I have heard of many cases, where people get really ill, although this may be not much more than the well-known placebo effect. Fears from the unconsciousness can very often not be calmed by logic. However, another irrational belief that culminates in some device called "Orgone Generator", seems to relieve people from that fear, thus the unconsciousness found it's own solution. Well, my personal suggestion in this case would be to sponsor these Orgon-Generators, maybe, even implement them in the Wifi-Device. If marketed the right way, those Wifi-Hotspots may be seen as something positive, something that people like to set up as they produce "positive energy".

      You know, for some reason, when I read this post I kind of heard it as a William Shatner voice-over in my head.....

      --
      Some bring out the best in others, some the worst. Some bring out far more.
    52. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And while you're reading Gardner, have a listen to Hawkwind's song Orgone Accumulator, from their 1973 album 'Space Ritual'.

    53. Re:"Orgone Generators" by azenpunk · · Score: 1

      my ammeter reads positive energy flow though...who do we believe?

      wait i remember from highschool electronics, we need to take the RMS of the waveform...ok lets send Stallman to the UK and sort these folks out.

    54. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I prefer the "Orgone Accumulators" Hawkwind sang about.

    55. Re:"Orgone Generators" by azenpunk · · Score: 1

      well they're right about why it's illegal. but it's not really complicated. it started partly as an excuse later in the depression (1937) to kick mexicans out of the US so we could have more jobs for our own citizens, also i believe there was alot of racist and class discrimination that contributed. it was probably a strong mix of genuine ignorance about it and the purposeful manipulation of that ignorance to get a law passed. there was alot of "negroes get wild on pot and rape our women!" type propaganda floating around back when.

      the biggest effect drug prohibition has these days is to fund criminal organizations.

      anyways, alot of that 'conspiracy' bit is true, though i doubt it was a conspiracy of pure malice ("hey, lets get together and take pot away from the masses, that'll help keep them down!") and more a mix of ignorance and seeing it as a handy way to help along an ulterior motive. hippies just tend to get a bit childish when talking about it ("it's not fair, man!"), plus one effect pot has is to artificially stimulate the part of the brain that thinks things are cool and novel, which can help one see such 'conspiracies' as something other than mundane politics getting inconvenient for them.

      i think we should build good cases against the biggest members of the drug cartels, legalize the drugs they sell, then track them down through the now well-documented distribution channels and prosecute for the crimes they've committed, more on the murder side of things though.

      no i dont' smoke pot and i have no interest in it. yes people do get carried away with it and waste their lives away but you've no right to stop them as long as they don't go harming others.

      hmm...'plain old text' isn't preserving my whitespace, i bet it will after i put this line in.

    56. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      waow, reminds me when someone rearranged my DNA by the use of strange sounds when I was staying in San Francisco, tripping at a friend's house

    57. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Dread_ed · · Score: 1

      Reading the wikipedia entry about orgone made me think "conspiracy" and I don't smoke pot.

      "Investigation into orgone was effectively ended when the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) obtained a federal injunction barring the interstate distribution of orgone-related materials, on the charge that Reich and his associates were making false and misleading claims, and under the terms of that injunction destroyed all devices and written material associated with orgone or its promotion.

      Damned if that doesn't sound spooky.

      --
      When the only tool you have is a claw hammer every problem starts to look like the back of someone's skull.
    58. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Zonnald · · Score: 1

      Wouldn't Hemp be more profitable - as by competing in 3 industry sectors it is more useful then any one of the other 3. Therefore why for instance wouldn't the tobacco lobby support pot and make it into a viable consumer product?

    59. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Hal_Porter · · Score: 1

      For better or for worse the FDA regulates medicine in the US. They decided that orgone energy was bullshit and that it was being advertised as a medical treatment and banned it.

      Actually I don't have a problem with this. You can sell what you want, but if you want to claim it has medical benefits you need to get it FDA approved, which implies a bunch of tests. The FDA regulates these.

      --
      echo -e 'global _start\n _start:\n mov eax, 2\n int 80h\n jmp _start' > a.asm; nasm a.asm -f elf; ld a.o -o a;
    60. Re:"Orgone Generators" by aqk · · Score: 0

      Hey, I haven't had a good one since 1997.
      And that's BEFORE my wife left me!

      ..
      ,
      -

      Ok, ok.. I know what you're gonna say. Let me beat you to it, you /. smartass:
      - And she hasn't had a good one UNTIL she left me..! ...
      (sigh)

    61. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "...back and forth between the resin and suspended metal particles."
      Would that be bong resin?

    62. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Linuxmonger · · Score: 1

      You cannot abuse LSD, but it can surely abuse you.

    63. Re:"Orgone Generators" by LoadWB · · Score: 1

      *whimper* *whine* *whine* *whimper*

    64. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Look up Wilhelm Reich.
      The US government burnt his books and threw him in prison. Therefore he mustn't have been on to anything. right?

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wilhelm_Reich

      esp. the part about --- Orgone accumulators and cloudbusters

    65. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Dread_ed · · Score: 1

      I say this not to be contrary, and certainly not to give fodder to our poor paranoid schitzo brothers and sisters or their closely related tin-foil-hatted kin, but out of true curiosity. Barring something that is actually harmful why whould the government destroy research materials?

      Mind you I don't believe this shit works, but the government certainly felt threatened by it enough to take some drastic action. Curious to me, and offensive that our government can do that to an area of research, regardless of the way it is marketed.

      --
      When the only tool you have is a claw hammer every problem starts to look like the back of someone's skull.
    66. Re:"Orgone Generators" by Hal_Porter · · Score: 1

      Actually that's a fair point

      As far as I can tell these devices didn't do anything at all. So that means the FDA should be able to stop them being marked as medical devices, but not destroy them.

      It's a classic case of government bureacracy metastasizing into areas it should be. Of course the other irritating hippy trait is being in favour of socialism in one form or another, which would imply that government bureacracy would cover much more than medical devices.

      --
      echo -e 'global _start\n _start:\n mov eax, 2\n int 80h\n jmp _start' > a.asm; nasm a.asm -f elf; ld a.o -o a;
    67. Re:"Orgone Generators" by lessthan · · Score: 1

      I want one!!

      --
      Space Shuttle was a program that strapped humans to an explosion and tried to stab through the sky with fire and math
    68. Re:"Orgone Generators" by jrothwell97 · · Score: 1

      So making things up is an acceptable substitute to science that's been tested and proven over the last hundred and twenty years? EM radiation is nothing new.

      Correlation is not causation. Spearman's Rank is not infallible.

      --
      Those using pirated Tinysoft signatures(TM) are a real threat to society and should all be thrown in jail.
    69. Re:"Orgone Generators" by vistic · · Score: 1

      You know... some things are just so stupid they shouldn't actually need any debunking.

    70. Re:"Orgone Generators" by vistic · · Score: 1

      Slap him upside the head for me. Thanks.

  5. They have it all wrong by Shadow7789 · · Score: 1

    Everyone knows it's cell phones that cause health problems.

  6. hippies by timmarhy · · Score: 1

    I think it's funny that the hippie movement in SF imploded within months.

    --
    If you mod me down, I will become more powerful than you can imagine....
    1. Re:hippies by tigerbody1 · · Score: 1

      What are you talking about?

    2. Re:hippies by Hognoxious · · Score: 1

      Do you mean hard SF or soft?

      I always thought hippies preferred fantasy anyway.

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
  7. 23 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Consult your pineal gland. :^)

  8. Old news by Forthan+Red · · Score: 0, Troll

    We're recycling week-old news now?

    1. Re:Old news by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I know, usually its more like month or year old! I'm very impressed with idle right now!

  9. Not Ironic by NotQuiteReal · · Score: 1

    No, it would be a coincidence, even if they are harmful to your health.

    --
    This issue is a bit more complicated than you think.
    1. Re:Not Ironic by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actually since hippies are rather concerned with Health in general it would be ironic if they were in fact harmful to people's health. This is a good example of cosmic irony.

      There is more to irony than dramatic and tragic irony.

  10. Was interested until... by alienunknown · · Score: 0, Troll

    I know there are groups out there that are against wifi for many kooky reasons but fox news has as much credibility as the onion.

    1. Re:Was interested until... by alienunknown · · Score: 1
      For some reason someone has marked me as a troll but I wasn't trolling, I was merely trying to refer to how fox news seems to sensationalise their news. There is always some reference to some group that they have an agenda against. I'm surprised they weren't labelled as video-game loving/DnD-playing hippies.

      I am just a bit cautious about the credibility of their news articles.

    2. Re:Was interested until... by Lehk228 · · Score: 0, Troll

      it's entirely possible (and quite likely) that the groups cited in TFA, AND Fox News are both fecking morons

      --
      Snowden and Manning are heroes.
    3. Re:Was interested until... by captjc · · Score: 3, Funny

      Don't insult The Onion by comparing them Fox news. The Onion is America's finest news source.

      --
      Slow Down Cowboy! It's been 1 hour, 47 minutes since you last successfully posted a comment
  11. Very sensitive people? by tsa · · Score: 1, Interesting

    I read once that people who work on the antennas in mobile communication towers suffer from headaches, dizziness, nausea, severe tiredness, brain fog, disorientation and loss of appetite, loss of balance, and an inability to concentrate if they are exposed to the radiation for too long. So maybe those hippies are just extremely sensitive people. Do they use mobile phones?

    --

    -- Cheers!

    1. Re:Very sensitive people? by Joe+Tie. · · Score: 3, Informative

      They're not. It's been tested far more than something like this deserves. Their problems always magically disappear the second they're put into a double blinded test.

      --
      Everything will be taken away from you.
    2. Re:Very sensitive people? by Chmcginn · · Score: 0
      A lot of those towers use pretty hefty microwave transmitters for line-of-sight transmissions. Right in the center of the beam, it's strong enough to kill birds in seconds. Right at the edges, it's enough to cause organ damage over long periods of time.

      There's a huge difference between low-grade microwave emissions exposure and exposure to the frequencies used for wifi.

      --
      Have you been touched by his noodly appendage?
    3. Re:Very sensitive people? by topham · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Assuming for a moment it's true; are you aware of the inverse-square law?

      Get this, working on an antenna broadcasting at several hundred thousand watts is worse than sitting 2ft from a 1 watt (at most) transmitter...

    4. Re:Very sensitive people? by tsa · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Yes I am aware of the inverse square law. My point was that if the hippies really suffer from what they claim, they must be very sensitive to electromagnetic radiation in the microwave range because WiFi usually transmits using even less power than a mobile phone. So if they use mobile phones but say they suffer from the WiFi radiation they're likely to be affected by somethning else. I should have written it down more clearly though.

      --

      -- Cheers!

    5. Re:Very sensitive people? by Rennt · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I've done maintenance work on these antenna's, and the safety warnings are no joke. Worksafe regulations forbid you from hanging in front of the drum unless the powersource has been isolated. A couple of people are killed every year because they didn't follow guidelines and had their internal organs cooked.

      Having said that, wifi (radio frequency radiation) has nothing to do with this kind of high power directed microwave radiation and is completely harmless - just don't get them confused.

    6. Re:Very sensitive people? by Nethead · · Score: 3, Funny

      Er, how about us hippie broadcast engineers? I know not to climb a FM tower while it is live and I know not to touch an AM tower and the ground at the same time (you have to jump to the tower to change the light blubs :)

      --
      -- I have a private email server in my basement.
    7. Re:Very sensitive people? by Detritus · · Score: 1

      Insightful, my butt. The number of systems with enough ERP to hurt birds or humans is very small. It's things like military search radars and Deep Space Network ground stations. Your typical point-to-point microwave relay system isn't running any more power than a small light bulb. Wi-Fi uses S-band, which isn't any more dangerous than other microwave frequencies. It also runs at very low power,

      --
      Mea navis aericumbens anguillis abundat
    8. Re:Very sensitive people? by wm2810 · · Score: 1
      Is this some kind of joke? Kill birds in seconds? Let's see, a typical line-of-sight microwave transmitter:

      Caregon IP-MAX
      traffic throughput = 150-400 Mbps
      frequency range= 5 to 38 GHz
      Maximum Power Consumption = 25W - 80W

      Stratex Networks Eclipse
      traffic throughput = 155 Mbps
      frequency range= 5 to 38 GHz
      Power Consumption = 40W - 50W

      Ericsson MINI-LINK HC
      traffic throughput = 155 Mbps
      Power Consumption = 48-110 W

    9. Re:Very sensitive people? by Detritus · · Score: 2

      A couple of people are killed every year because they didn't follow guidelines and had their internal organs cooked.

      Cite? I've heard these sea stories for decades. The only factual reports of injuries that I've read involve RF burns and increases in rates of cataracts.

      --
      Mea navis aericumbens anguillis abundat
    10. Re:Very sensitive people? by tigerbody1 · · Score: 1

      Sorry - I don't believe you.
      Please site some references:

    11. Re:Very sensitive people? by dastasha · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I served a four year apprenticeship repairing and aligning 100 watt UHF power amplifier modules on a daily basis, among other RF devices. All this was done on a test bench at approximately groin level. Despite the warnings I received at the time, it certainly has not affected my ability to reproduce. I have three normal children to prove this. The closest I ever came to injury from electromagnetic radiation was the odd RF burn on my fingers.

    12. Re:Very sensitive people? by Gonoff · · Score: 1

      Please site some references

      Or even CITE them

      --
      I'll see your Constitution and raise you a Queen.
    13. Re:Very sensitive people? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      >Their problems always magically disappear the second they're put into a double blinded test.

      always eh?

    14. Re:Very sensitive people? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Then surely we need double blind tests available on health insurance.

      The only problem is how we test the efficacy...

    15. Re:Very sensitive people? by vrai · · Score: 1

      I'd be interested to see proof as well. The only reports of antenna related fatalities I've been able to find involve people falling off them.

    16. Re:Very sensitive people? by FishAdmin · · Score: 1

      I served a four year apprenticeship repairing and aligning 100 watt UHF power amplifier modules on a daily basis, among other RF devices. All this was done on a test bench at approximately groin level. Despite the warnings I received at the time, it certainly has not affected my ability to reproduce. I have three normal children to prove this.

      ...and five little mutant children in the basement. But let's not talk about them!

      --
      Last night I played a blank tape at full volume. The mime next door went nuts.
    17. Re:Very sensitive people? by catbertscousin · · Score: 1

      Er, how about us hippie broadcast engineers?

      You're totally awesome, dude. Far out. They can't stop the signal.

      --
      No good deed goes unpunished. - Avon, Blake's 7
    18. Re:Very sensitive people? by slimjim8094 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      That's the cool thing about science - nobody cares whether you believe it.

      Try googling for 'rf double-blind' or if you'd like an actual journal article, here

      In short, there was no correlation.

      --
      I have developed a truly marvelous proof of this comment, which this signature is too narrow to contain.
    19. Re:Very sensitive people? by drunkenoafoffofb3ta · · Score: 1

      Nah, people that claim to be sensitive to microwave/ mobile phone/ WiFi/ whatever radiation somehow mysteriously lose that sensitivity when subjected to double-blinded trials of their ailment/skill. BBC's Panorama made a huge fuck-up by broadcasting similar proaganda in Dec '07: http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/bbc-editorial-complaints-unit-debags-the-panorama-wifi-scare/ Turns out there was an agenda-- the proponent in the show was selling protective devices. Alas, they weren't Faraday cages, they were useless trinkets. Even people that pretend to be hippies are slaves to the cash.

    20. Re:Very sensitive people? by geekoid · · Score: 1

      yes, becasue a none conductive ramp couldn't possible be built~

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    21. Re:Very sensitive people? by Neuroprophet · · Score: 1

      I don't buy it. I've got two friends who work as Cell Technicians. Basically their job is to drive around all day fixing broken cell towers, providing routine maintenance or installing hardware upgrades. They've both been doing this going on almost 10 years. Neither have had any health issues.

      There is one odd thing though. Between the two of them, they have had six children. All girls. I made a joke to them about the radiation from the towers affecting their Y sperm and they told me they wouldn't be surprised. Amongst their coworkers' children there are about six more girls and only one boy.

      It's most likely a coincidence and unrelated to their job though. I'm sure something like this on a large scale would have been noticed. Then again I could be wrong.

      All this is anecdotal so take with necessary grain of salt.

    22. Re:Very sensitive people? by sjames · · Score: 1

      While I don't see any incident reports on Google for death by RF burn, It is only reasonable that an RF burn can cause death. They tend to be deep 3rd degree burns. While typically small and in the extremities, if one happened in the chest, it could be quite another matter. We know that an 800Watt microwave oven can thoroughly cook food using RF energy. Meat is Meat even if it's a person.

      I suppose the major reason death by RF doesn't happen much is that areas where it could happen are generally locked up, the pain is enough to convince a person to move quickly away, and those who do have access to those areas take the precautions very seriously.

      Of course, none of this applies to 802.11 devices which are under 1 Watt.

    23. Re:Very sensitive people? by geekoid · · Score: 1

      And you shouldn't..you should learn how to look up studies, read studies, and think for yourself.

      For exampl, a good place to find medical studies(in general) is pubmed. Now, it's a collection of published studies, so you need to understand how to read them. What blind means, when a blinded test isn't any good, and so on.

      Rule of them, if at least 30% of the people in a good study don't show an effect, there probably isn't one. Please apply that rule with common sense.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    24. Re:Very sensitive people? by geekoid · · Score: 1

      No one is that sensitive.

      These Blinded studies have been done to death, no effect.
      If these pople get into a running automobile they've been exposed to more EM.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    25. Re:Very sensitive people? by 16K+Ram+Pack · · Score: 1

      There was an experiment carried out on the Should I Worry About TV show, where they switched on mobile phone masts for a week and then off, and asked people to record their health. They told them a lie - that in week 1, the masts were on, and in week 2, they were off. They were actually the other way around, and the reports of people's health suggested that they were sicker when the masts were off.

      The whole thing is psychological.

    26. Re:Very sensitive people? by TechnicolourSquirrel · · Score: 2, Informative

      Their problems don't disappear at all in a double-blind test. They just fail to correlate with the actual presence of the signal. Often their 'problems' become exacerbated and they send themselves mentally into a crisis because of their belief that they are being subjected to RF, even though it happens to be off in that part of the test. These trials usually end up with a significant number of people dropping off due to such 'crises'. Mind you, the symptoms of the 'sensitives' are actually real and can be life-threatening, so they should absolutely be taken very seriously and they never 'disappear'. They just aren't caused by what they are convinced they are caused by.

    27. Re:Very sensitive people? by tigerbody1 · · Score: 1

      Well, I saw another TV Show with contrary results... So, which is true and accurate?

    28. Re:Very sensitive people? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      yes, because broadcast engineers can't jump~

    29. Re:Very sensitive people? by azenpunk · · Score: 1

      i know this is a 'friend of a friend' sort of deal, but i used to work in telecom doing installation and one of the guys i worked with used to do some cell tower stuff in texas. well one winter they were working on one tower (doing what exactly i don't know) but one of the new guys on the crew decided that since he felt warmer in one spot he'd stand there when he wasn't doing anything. he was kicked to the deck and hurried down the ladder and rushed to the hospital. i'm told he was pretty close to dying from the incident and ended up with some major health issues. i wasn't there, i can't say for sure, but i spent alot of time with the guy who told me this and i believe that story and the basic facts, the exact details might be a bit embellished though. i know, 'anecdote' != datum.

    30. Re:Very sensitive people? by Nethead · · Score: 1

      Non-conductive is a different thing at 5,000V at 10A at 1MHz than at lower frequencies and voltages. And most of these things are out in wet cow fields (drive out Marine Dr toward the house boats and you'll see a nice directional array there.)

      --
      -- I have a private email server in my basement.
    31. Re:Very sensitive people? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      _maybe_ a couple of people are killed every year worldwide. I expect the cause is only incidentally RF though; an unexpected RF burn leading to a fall from a tower. As for internal organs cooking... humm, maybe on a really hot day at an isolated site and they land on a metal roof. sizzle sizzle.

    32. Re:Very sensitive people? by 16K+Ram+Pack · · Score: 1

      Yeah? What show was that?

    33. Re:Very sensitive people? by tigerbody1 · · Score: 1

      I think it was called
      "Your Money or Your Life: You make the choice"

  12. BOOO by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    BOOOOOORING

  13. Donny: What did he say, Dude? by tshetter · · Score: 0, Offtopic

    Shut the fuck up Donny!

    /You're out of you're element!!

  14. Nutcases by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Great, now any time someone suggests investigating whether or not Wifi has any long term effect on peoples health, they'll get lumped together with this group of crazy people.

    1. Re:Nutcases by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Good, because they belong there. Funny how all these "health effects" dissapear as soon as you do a double blind study.

  15. Finally a practical use for orgonne technology, by Plazmid · · Score: 1

    making hippies think they are protected from "harmful" radio waves, so other people can enjoy the internet.

  16. Maybe it only hurts vegetarians... by Narcocide · · Score: 1

    fruit bruises easily too

  17. I got an Orgone Accumulator by thewils · · Score: 1

    ...and it makes me feel greater.
    I'll see you sometime later
    When I'm through with my Accumulator.

    --
    Once I was a four stone apology. Now I am two separate gorillas.
    1. Re:I got an Orgone Accumulator by germansausage · · Score: 1

      Yes! Hawkwind. In case of sonic attack on your district follow these rules....

    2. Re:I got an Orgone Accumulator by thewils · · Score: 1

      ...do not panic...

      --
      Once I was a four stone apology. Now I am two separate gorillas.
  18. Yess! by no-body · · Score: 1

    I love it! Replaced my wireless router with Gbit wiring in the house; works much better.
    Will put up a sleeping pyramid and several orgon collectors as well to compensate for the remaining waves.

    I mean - where is all the crap on the planet coming from?

    Nobody gives a shit about it any more. Gotta start somewhere cleaning up.

    1. Re:Yess! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      You remind me of what it's like chatting on IRC at 6 in the morning. As in, you sound like a pissed Aussie who's almost too drunk to type. Why are their so many pissed Aussies on IRC? All laughing at their own jokes in all CAPS and calling everyone else gay. /me slaps all people found typing and drinking

    2. Re:Yess! by CheshireFerk-o · · Score: 0

      i was thinking 'ppl still use irc'??? but then i remembered im on /. =D ive been idle in irc channels for 13 years and havent seen regular traffic in 3, and these are 100+ppl channels back in the day. damn u AIM for ruining irc

  19. Million-dollar idea for somebody by Tsar · · Score: 5, Interesting

    1. Buy a couple hundred acres in the National Radio Quiet Zone and build a resort/spa/retirement community for all the well-heeled electromagnetophobes.

    2. Quietly buy up as much of the valley as you can, then support campaigns to get Blue Cross and Medicare to cover electromagnetic hypersensitivity.

    3. Profit.

    I'd do it, but I don't believe I could live with myself. Especially if I had to give up ubiquitous broadband.

    1. Re:Million-dollar idea for somebody by Bruce+Perens · · Score: 4, Informative

      It's not that quiet there. The coordinator of the zone has been very cooperative with ham radio operators and other users. It's only necessary for the coordinator to protect their radio-astronomy project, not to shut off RF entirely.

    2. Re:Million-dollar idea for somebody by anaphora · · Score: 2, Funny

      This place can't be real. If they don't have the internet or radios, how would we have heard about it?

    3. Re:Million-dollar idea for somebody by Yvanhoe · · Score: 1

      Amish people have a patent for that anyway

      --
      The Wise adapts himself to the world. The Fool adapts the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the Fool.
    4. Re:Million-dollar idea for somebody by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You forgot a very important step:

      ???????

    5. Re:Million-dollar idea for somebody by 91degrees · · Score: 2, Informative

      Does it matter though? You just need to convince punters that it's a radio quiet zone.

    6. Re:Million-dollar idea for somebody by Danathar · · Score: 1

      No, you would just have to SAY that you are giving up broadband. Since you are already burning Karma, the act of lying to your customers about the existence of your broadband in the area in question should not be a problem.

    7. Re:Million-dollar idea for somebody by ekimminau · · Score: 1

      So why give it up, then?

      One would deploy EMI shielded Cat5e or Cat6 (or Cat11) cable and make sure your equipment is all properly grounded.

      There was an interesting discussion on grounding GbE here: http://www.sigcon.com/Pubs/news/2_2.htm that hints this may actually not work as expected, though.

      You could always just hire a company http://www.fms-corp.com/ to come and make sure everything is all properly shielded but then you move to the next component in the chain and start exploring 60Hz AC EMF http://ieeexplore.ieee.org/stamp/stamp.jsp?arnumber=00065035 and the output from your normal computer systems.

      Personally, I prefer to think of it as the catalyst for turning my children into the "X-men" of our future.

      --
      Armaments, 2-9-21 And Saint Attila raised the hand grenade up on high, saying, 'O Lord, bless this Thy hand grenade' N
    8. Re:Million-dollar idea for somebody by geekoid · · Score: 1

      There are places like that....they even come with TVs.
      Not joking.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    9. Re:Million-dollar idea for somebody by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You mean it'd be bad for your chakra?

    10. Re:Million-dollar idea for somebody by azenpunk · · Score: 1

      that's not important, the name alone will be sufficient to milk the phobics for good money.

    11. Re:Million-dollar idea for somebody by petermgreen · · Score: 1

      There was an interesting discussion on grounding GbE here: http://www.sigcon.com/Pubs/news/2_2.htm
      That article appears to be about 1000baseCX (a largely dead standard that used a special balanced individually shielded twisted pair cable) not 1000baseT (the dominant form of gigabit ethernet).

      --
      note: i'm known as plugwash most places but i screwd up registering that here somehow in the past and now can't register
    12. Re:Million-dollar idea for somebody by RockDoctor · · Score: 1

      I'd do it, but I don't believe I could live with myself.

      Why not? Parting the over-endowed retarded from their cash has always been morally defensible, as you're unlikely to put the money to as bad a use as it's previous caretaker.

      Especially if I had to give up ubiquitous broadband.

      Ubiquitous broadband as in "in every house", or as in "in every corner of every room of the house, so I can post on Slashdot while I shower". If it's the latter, make arrangements for IR laser as a transmission medium on a room-by-room basis. But you really can't stand having CAT5 coils around, even for making a lot of money?

      BUT WHY does SlashDot occasionally downgrade users to a 25-char-wide compose box?

      --
      Birds are not dinosaur descendants;birds are dinosaurs, for all useful meanings of "birds", "are" and "dinosaurs"
  20. Ironic by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Yes, it would be ironic. Most of what hippies do is justified in part on human or animal health grounds. Environmentalism, organic food, alternative medicine, yoga - need I go on?

    And it would be ironic of someone who defined themselves in terms of striving for better health actually did damage to someone's health. Think doctor giving you a cold, and you'll get the drift.

  21. As reasonable as the morons who wont eat ham by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Seriously, how much more stupid is this that the middle east morons on both sides
    who wont eat bacon or a ham-cheese sandwich because the bogeyman told then not to?

    Its the same level of stupidity.

    1. Re:As reasonable as the morons who wont eat ham by no1home · · Score: 1

      Um, actually, the pork thing was quite reasonable in its time. The prohibition against eating pork existed for simple health reasons. Before refrigeration, it was just too easy for pork to go bad and develop trichinosis. Now, the modern practice is rather silly since we scientifically understand it and can prevent problems by keeping the pork cold enough before cooking or serving. How did we get from ancient health code to modern dogma? In ancient times, rules of conduct (social values, health codes, who can breed with whom) were passed down by religion! And all too often, religion becomes thoughtlessly followed dogma. (Before anybody berates me with biblical info, I am aware that the pork prohibition is related to the prohibition against any cloven-footed animal.)

      So, in a more concise answer to your question of how this hippie thing is any more stupid than the pork thing, the pork thing may now be dogma, but it comes from a valid reason whereas the hippies have access to modern science to tell them they're full of shit.

      --
      I hope this comment is well received... I could have moderated instead!

      Persecutors will be violated!
    2. Re:As reasonable as the morons who wont eat ham by Chalnoth · · Score: 2, Insightful

      This is why you cure ham. This process is very common all across Southern Europe, and works quite well to disinfect the product. Basically, the restriction against eating ham only cropped up just because there was an unusual ancient tribe some thousands of years ago that didn't raise pigs. Somehow they got this practice into their holy books and, well, the rest is history.

    3. Re:As reasonable as the morons who wont eat ham by mr100percent · · Score: 1

      Pork still isn't that healthy to eat today, loaded with fat and about half the world population does not have refrigerators or freezers or adequate means to eat it safely

    4. Re:As reasonable as the morons who wont eat ham by umghhh · · Score: 1

      If they cannot control their environment which they perceive harming then putting whatever makes them feel better is a good thing.
      If you compare it with habits and beliefs of general population or even /.ers you may find that those are not that much different in structure and effects and looking at hatred and lack of respect that is usually associated with any discussion involving religion/belifs (on /. and elsewhere) you may conclude that the conduct of hippies is rather sensible. At least they did not blow anybody up or shot with shotgun as it seems to be the habit of late.

      Interestingly your story about how trichinosis has something to do with storage of pork is a good example of how 'well' informed general population is. For your information - the warms that live in pigs flesh and which cause the disease if humans consume such badly processed (cooking is killing the larva) flesh need living mammal to develop. So it is not meat going bad before consumption but meat being infected before the animal got sliced into your nice piece of ham. There could be other reasons why pork is not allowed in certain cultures - economic concerns for instance.

    5. Re:As reasonable as the morons who wont eat ham by profplump · · Score: 1

      First, you're assuming that the dogma was created for an originally valid reason. It may have been -- your theory is not totally unreasonable. But by and large the world did not understand communicable or food-borne diseases until very recently, and while your reasoning is logical given modern knowledge it's a stretch to say some ancient politician reached the same conclusions without that knowledge. Even the ancient reasoning was similar to what you describe -- if someone observed better health in populations that avoided pigs -- it is extremely unlikely that anyone studied enough populations to collect anything other than an anecdote or two, and therefore the decision was no more based on science than modern hippie dogma. And without any particular evidence relating to the reasoning behind the law it's entirely possible that pigs are verboten simply because some ancient politician wanted to put his pig-owning business competitors out-of-business.

      Second, modern Jews and Muslims both have access to modern science, modern food preparation and butchering techniques, and most have access to refrigeration. If "hippies have access to modern science" is enough reason to call hippie dogma dumb then "Jews have access to modern science" is enough reason to call Jewish dogma dumb. But by definition dogma operates in opposition to science -- dogma is not to be questioned -- so you can't expect scientific reasoning to be used to overturn dogma.

      Third, I'd argue that a typical person <i>does not</i> have access to modern science. Certainly society as a whole has a whole has the requisite knowledge to make an informed decision, and certain individuals may as well, but the average person has a very poor understanding of "modern science" and treats most of the "science" they do know as nothing more than modern cultural dogma.

    6. Re:As reasonable as the morons who wont eat ham by Carewolf · · Score: 1

      You don't need an intelligent designer.

      By pure "evolution" of religions the people with benificial rules would be more succesfull and more likely to outcompete others.

    7. Re:As reasonable as the morons who wont eat ham by profplump · · Score: 2, Insightful

      First, modern pork is leaner that it's ever been. Roasted pork tenderloin, for example, is significantly less fatty than roasted mutton (about 22% fat by caloric content, vs. 42% for mutton). I use mutton as an example because it's not outlawed by any (non-vegetarian) dogma, and is a typical foodstuff in places where pork is not allowed. Even ham is comparable in fat content to mutton.

      Second, it doesn't require refrigeration to cure pork into ham. Traditionally preservation is the reason for curing meat in the first place. The fact that it can also be used to change or enhance flavor is a secondary usage, at least before refrigeration.

      Third, in places where people don't have access to refrigeration, extra dietary fat is probably not a bad thing. It's not like dietary fat is fundamentally bad -- you need a good deal of it to be healthy -- like most things it's only bad in excess. And I can virtually guarantee that people who live without ready access to refrigeration don't eat enough meat to be worried about too much dietary fat intake.

    8. Re:As reasonable as the morons who wont eat ham by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      "Before refrigeration, it was just too easy for pork to go bad and develop trichinosis."

      Good theory... except for the fact the trichinosis evolves on a living pig, not a dead one.

      "Now, the modern practice is rather silly since we scientifically understand it and can prevent problems by keeping the pork cold enough before cooking or serving."

      Unbacked assertions have been never consider "scientific practice". You are "laughing" at some other's faith but fail to see you yourself are a devote of the Church of Science (there's a scientific explanation for this; if I don't know it I'll invent one out of my ass).

      What has put to an end trichinosis on modern countries are sanitary controls on live populations of farm pigs and post-mortem analysis of suspected meat (like that from wild oars) nothing to do with refrigeration.

      Oh! and muslims won't eat pork because it's a dirty animal, just this.

      "the pork thing may now be dogma, but it comes from a valid reason whereas the hippies have access to modern science to tell them they're full of shit."

      Just like you. The fact that your shit is politically more palatable doesn't make you less full of it.

    9. Re:As reasonable as the morons who wont eat ham by turbidostato · · Score: 1

      "This is why you cure ham."

      Nope.

      "This process is very common all across Southern Europe, and works quite well to disinfect the product."

      Nope.

      Trichinosis is a parasitic illness produced by eating "eggs" (I don't know the proper English word) from 'Trichinella spiralis'. Only proper cooking will kill them. Cured ham (Spanish jamón, Itailan prosciuto, etc.) is a known vector for this illness.

      Curing meat is *not* a disinfectation process but a conservation one... and it conserves Trichinium "eggs" just as good as it preserves pig's flesh.

    10. Re:As reasonable as the morons who wont eat ham by bytesex · · Score: 2, Insightful

      But chicken is about as 'unsafe' as pork, yet the whole friggin' world eats chicken.

      --
      Religion is what happens when nature strikes and groupthink goes wrong.
    11. Re:As reasonable as the morons who wont eat ham by Joce640k · · Score: 1

      *Everything* was dangerous in those times if you didn't eat it within half an hour of killing it. Why was pork singled out?

      --
      No sig today...
    12. Re:As reasonable as the morons who wont eat ham by Chalnoth · · Score: 1

      If the curing is done properly, it is quite effective. And your post fails to explain why cured ham is very frequently eaten uncooked in southern Europe, with little to no problem of trichinosis. Basically as long as you use enough salt and cure them for long enough, it isn't an issue.
      A description of acceptable curing processes for ham by the USDA is described here.

      Bear in mind that if these were ineffective, trichinosis would be rampant in the US, and even moreso in Southern Europe where cured ham is far more common.

    13. Re:As reasonable as the morons who wont eat ham by nazsco · · Score: 1

      no excuse.

      At the same time of the events you mention, Arabs were showering daily and doing other things for their health out of knowledge. not because someone choose to concentrate power and scary the rest out.
      .

      So, it was stupid then and it's even more stupid now.
      .

      So grandparent post is right. all events are equally stupid
      .

      Orgone == !eating pork in the past because of religion == !eating pork now because of religion == eating and drinking the symbolic flesh and blood of christ == burning big crosses.

    14. Re:As reasonable as the morons who wont eat ham by nazsco · · Score: 1

      > but fail to see you yourself are a devote of the Church of Science

      LOL

    15. Re:As reasonable as the morons who wont eat ham by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      Excellent points but...

      But by definition dogma operates in opposition to science -- dogma is not to be questioned -- so you can't expect scientific reasoning to be used to overturn dogma.

      Well, many people probably desire or expect many dogmata to go unquestioned, and so we cannot expect scientific reasoning to win out automatically. That is why many believe that dogma should be deliberately opposed with great care and zeal. To this end, we should better understand and empathize with the dogmatic mind, and perhaps find ways (peaceful ways, obviously!) to persuade it to become more introspective and thoughtful about beliefs that are inherited and not tested.

      I guess what I'm trying to say is: if scientific reasoning and inquiry are products to be sold, then they're in desperate need of a good marketing/PR firm.

      (A bit OT: this is probably why a lot of atheists are strongly in favor of studies in comparative religion being made part of a standard curriculum for history courses in public education: when one starts to see not only

      • that different cultures teach different kinds of seemingly odd things that are strongly correlated with their respective geographic regions of origin, but
      • that they also evolve and speciate over time

      ...then one is much more likely to identify one's own dogmatic beliefs as an accident of birth (at least partially)---rather than necessarily being the result of a telepathic encounter with an invisible friend.)

      Third, I'd argue that a typical person does not have access to modern science. Certainly society as a whole has a whole has the requisite knowledge to make an informed decision, and certain individuals may as well, but the average person has a very poor understanding of "modern science" and treats most of the "science" they do know as nothing more than modern cultural dogma.

      Sadly true. Hence the need for an intellectual opposition that is careful, zealous and empathic.
      Carl Sagan wrote about television possibly being better employed to this end. E.g. in The Demon-Haunted World he suggested that someone should produce a fictional detective program like the X-Files, except where everything seemingly supernatural would turn out to be a case of fraud or otherwise due to interesting natural causes---sort of like Scooby-Doo for grown-ups. I think he would have been mostly pleased by MythBusters.

    16. Re:As reasonable as the morons who wont eat ham by jeff4747 · · Score: 1

      But by and large the world did not understand communicable or food-borne diseases until very recently, and while your reasoning is logical given modern knowledge it's a stretch to say some ancient politician reached the same conclusions without that knowledge.

      Modern knowledge was not required.

      Thog eats pig.

      Thog dies from horrible disease

      Og eats pig

      Og dies from horrible disease

      Mog notices the pattern, doesn't eat pig. Doesn't die. Doesn't know why eating pig is fatal, and really doesn't care. Adds "Don't eat pig" to dogma.

    17. Re:As reasonable as the morons who wont eat ham by jeff4747 · · Score: 1

      Everything was not dangerous. Cooking meat made it last for a significant amount of time. In addition basic preservation methods (smoking, drying, salting, etc.) were already known.

      What made pork dangerous is the preservation methods of the day did not protect against a specific parasite.

    18. Re:As reasonable as the morons who wont eat ham by jahudabudy · · Score: 1

      Orgone == !eating pork in the past because of religion == !eating pork now because of religion == eating and drinking the symbolic flesh and blood of christ == burning big crosses.

      Uhm, what? I get that you find religious beliefs that you don't share to be "stupid", but how is systematic terrorism (burning crosses) aimed at political ends even in the same category? Or do you just lump every human behavior you disagree with into one large category?

      --
      ...sometimes, in order to hurt someone very badly, you have to tell that person terrible lies. - PA
    19. Re:As reasonable as the morons who wont eat ham by ginbot462 · · Score: 1

      google: "brain tumor actually worm"

      --
      Atlas Shrugged : Thematic Story :: Battlefield Earth : Organized Religion
    20. Re:As reasonable as the morons who wont eat ham by coolsnowmen · · Score: 0, Offtopic

      True, and I'll go a step father. The most dangerous food is food that hasn't been cooked through. As I use a meat thermometer to make sure my meat is cooked, the most dangerous food to me is raw vegetables.

    21. Re:As reasonable as the morons who wont eat ham by no1home · · Score: 1

      First, a correction of something I mis-spoke of: the prohibition against cloven-footed animals is actually a prohibition against eating non-cloven-footed animals. Though cloven-footed, pigs are left out because they fail the other requirement of being a ruminant (cud chewing). I really ought to have paid much more attention to what I was writing at 1:00 in the morning! I'm sorry for my mis-information.

      Now to to reply to your points:

      Religious rules or conventions comes about for a variety of reasons. Many have more to do with social control than anything else. However, most have a reasonable beginning to them. Rules prohibiting sibling marriage/breeding are a prime example. Without understanding any genetics, it was easy to see that too much of this led to problems. Often, this idea was seen clearly enough that people were required to marry outside their entire group. Food-borne illnesses are no exception here. While I have been corrected many times over on the source of trichinosis (thank you for enlightening me! again, I should have done better and writing so late was a bad idea.), the idea that a given food item that is not inherently poisonous getting banned for health reasons stands. Though most don't get sick from it, enough do that it is decided to not allow it. No scientific study needed. No need to examine large populations or do double-blind studies. As to your guess at the real reason for the ban on pork, you managed to hit on one of the few ideas not in the list of theories for its existence! Many theories abound, each with some support, and the health reason is one of them.

      It has been suggested that trichinosis may be one of several factors that led to religious prohibitions in Islam and Judaism against eating pork products, such as in the kashrut and dhabia halal dietary laws. The medieval Jewish philosopher Maimonides advocated such a theory in The Guide for the Perplexed, as did medieval Islamic authorities. This topic is controversial.

      (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trichinosis#Epidemiology) Yes, this idea, as with many of the theories for pork and other religious food laws, is controversial. Also like the other frequently competing theories on religious food laws, it is supported by solid reasoning. It had adherents as far back as the 12th century, including Maimonides, a great Jewish thinker. See his books "The Guide for the Perplexed." (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guide_for_the_Perplexed) A competing theory is economic:

      Anthropologist Marvin Harris proposed that the Jewish prohibition against pork results from mundane socio-economic concerns. Although wild pigs forage in the forests, there are no such environments for them in the region that was Canaan, and consequently they must instead be fed grain; however, the grain which pigs eat is also that eaten by people, and so the pigs would compete with humans for survival during years of bad harvest. As such, raising pigs could have been seen as wasteful and decadent; Harris cites examples of similar ecological reasons for religious practices, including prohibitions against pork, in other religions of the world.

      (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kashrut#Mundane_socio-economic_concerns_.28specific_to_the_pig_taboo.29) As with the health-code theory, this economic reasoning no longer holds true in most parts of the world, but (if this is the reason) was true at the time.

      I knew as I wrote the part about access to science that I should take the time to explain what I meant! So now I'll clarify... Yes, in modern times, Jews, Muslims, etc. all have access to science and scientific reasoning. It is also true that science is rarely used to overturn dogma, religious or otherwise. However, at the time of the creation of the principal that became the religious rule, the explanatory science did not exist and the principal became codified into the religion to preserve it for future generations. It is extremely rare for a

      --
      I hope this comment is well received... I could have moderated instead!

      Persecutors will be violated!
    22. Re:As reasonable as the morons who wont eat ham by azenpunk · · Score: 1

      people forget that the reason pork was fatty was because it was raised to be fatty. the lard harvested from pigs was used year round on the farm now they raise them lean because of our half hearted health craze, and because the farms are corporate, no farmer to use all that lard year round.

      also pork is healthier because pigs aren't fed meat scraps anymore, which has helped reduce the chance of getting trichinosis from undercooked pork. i wouldn't make a habit of risking it though.

  22. Commant by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

    FiWi connectians doesn't mess up your ability to think, you knough.

    1. Re:Commant by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Iams serious. Why was I moderationed funny?

  23. Residents, not hippies by bornwaysouth · · Score: 4, Interesting

    It is not a bunch of hippies doing the complaining, it is the residents. They have little use for the WiFi, which has been used 422 times in 6 months. I suspect the locals know exactly what they want. Maintaining jobs and a way of life, which draws on 5000 years of hocus pocus. Orgone generators are right in there as a mix of crystals and gold and romanticism.

      As for the headaches? Quite genuine reporting I'd say. My father told me that a satellite receiving station near where he worked was found to generate a wide mix of ills in the 3 months following its official opening. This was not published because it would have embarrassed the Minister. Due to a cock-up in parts supply, they faked the opening and it sat idle but impressive whilst headaches abounded.

    Headaches occur, and people want causes assigned. It's a matter of opinion whether it is better to blame an aerial or a spell cast by a witch. Just so long as the majority have a good laugh in the pub in the off-season. Witchcraft is a bit like Royalty. A good historical reason for people to kill each other, but really just a useful source of tourist dollars these days.

    1. Re:Residents, not hippies by andersa · · Score: 1

      Main Entry: hippie
      Variant(s): or hippy \hi-p\
      Function: noun
      Inflected Form(s): plural hippies
      Etymology: 4hip + -ie
      Date: 1965

      : a person who rejects the mores of established society (such as WiFi-networks) and advocates a nonviolent ethic ; broadly : a long-haired unconventionally dressed badly informed person
      -- hippiedom \-p-dm\ noun
      -- hippieish \-p-ish\ adjective
      -- hippieness or hippiness \-p-ns\ noun

    2. Re:Residents, not hippies by ElectricTurtle · · Score: 1, Insightful

      422 users, not uses, which is pretty decent for the cost as is, $34/person/year. That's extremely cost effective, considering that most broadband costs many more times that a year. Not to mention that the number of users is only likely to go up, and the cost per user is more likely to decrease rather than increase. I'm sure that in smallish town like Glastonbury there are plenty of luddite codgers who will always think that virtually any tech is bad and wasteful, and those wankers can fuck off.

      I find it amusing that you cite an anecdote about a satellite station that supposedly caused headaches... during a time that it wasn't even actually operational. Perfect example of how this shit is all in people's stupid heads and not medically real beyond the placebo effect.

      --
      I support the Slashcott and will not be reading or commenting from 2/10/14 to 2/17/14. Beta is steaming pile of dog shit
    3. Re:Residents, not hippies by zoney_ie · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Well, it's a bit worse than people simply attributing existing ills to some piece of technology. It would seem that people, if they think something will make them ill, can indeed make themselves ill to some degree, or at least be convinced that they are ill (which from their perspective, is much the same thing - or even worse, as real cures won't work on the latter). It's the reason that a lot of the superstitious stuff can actually seem to work at times, and why it's quite important not only to combat such nonsense, but act in an understanding way to those who've fallen for it. The peddlers of superstitions require a sterner approach though.

      It's certainly not all a bit of a laugh. At the very least such superstitions do give rise to troubles of the mind (which lets face it, usually result in a poorer physical condition too).

      --
      -- *~()____) This message will self-destruct in 5 seconds...
    4. Re:Residents, not hippies by debruce · · Score: 2, Informative

      sounds like something an orgone generator could have easily cured because 1) due to parts shortage the station was OFF and 2) it was a RECEIVING station.

    5. Re:Residents, not hippies by shrikel · · Score: 1

      422 users, not uses

      Surely you can understand his confusion though; on that side of the pond they don't pronounce the "r" in "users".

      --
      Any sufficiently simple magic can be passed off as mere advanced technology.
    6. Re:Residents, not hippies by kieran · · Score: 1

      t is not a bunch of hippies doing the complaining, it is the residents.

      The residents of Glastonbury - i.e. the people who couldn't accept the festival doesn't run all year. There is no higher concentration of hippies outside of the US West coast.

    7. Re:Residents, not hippies by captaincinders · · Score: 1

      I have actually taken part in a 'trial' when we put up a temporary Tetra mast. We sent round health surveys before and after the transmitter was switched on, and then again several months later. Anyone like to predict what the outcome of the trial was? Before switch on - low incidence of people feeling unwell. After the switch on - high incidence of people feeling unwell. After several months - reduced numbers of people feeling unwell. Several months later we still had people complaining about the severe effect on their health and included the start of one lawsuit for compenstation for the severe health effects suffered by one person (headaches, cronic fatigue, warm skin, dizzyness, and unfocused eyes from what I can remember.) Thing was, we never actually switched on the transmitter, and came clean . The results of the 'trial' made the lawsuit go away and were apparenty used several more times as a counter to make other lawsuits go away as well (but I had left by then so did not know any details). Conclusion is simple. People believe what they want to be true.

    8. Re:Residents, not hippies by aaron+alderman · · Score: 1

      It's called scapegoating. Its where you blame your problems on someone or something else. Perhaps one of the most troubling aspects of humanities ability to notice false patterns (ever since Martha moved into town there has been nothing but bad luck) and to not end up on the other end. The whole mythology of Christ, which our societies have emerged from, revolves around an elaborate scapegoating. Problems never get solved (unless its psychosomatic) and people are killed or run out of town due to these irrational beliefs.

  24. Ouch, that's rather scathing!!! by Klootzak · · Score: 1

    Use Humor instead: In other news Samzenpus was seen wearing his "Respect My Authoritah" Cartman T-shirt while adding this to the mainpage ;)

    --
    A Man's ethical behavior should be based effectually on sympathy, education, and social ties -- Albert Einstein
    1. Re:Ouch, that's rather scathing!!! by jandersen · · Score: 1

      It was humour, just not very kind.

  25. Hippies Smell by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    #1. Take responsibilities for you statements and more importantly actions - Period.
    #2. See #1
    #3 If in doubt... fuck you.... hippies. Grow up.

  26. Yeah ... by edahl · · Score: 1

    Warning: Hippies may or may not cause nausea and contempt towards said group. I've heard a lot of these kinds of incidents lately. Some douche has a bright idea on something that might cause a health hazard if they put som effort into it, and suddenly, you've got children and mothers and hippies everywhere with electro magnetic and WiFi allergies. *MEH*

    1. Re:Yeah ... by cliffski · · Score: 4, Interesting

      The problem with wifi health scares is the same as with nuclear health scares. Regardless of whether the pro-wifi and pro-nuclear groups are right or wrong, they are terrible at public relations. In both cases, the default response to public health concern is a derisory snort and the tendency to talk down to the people raising the concern as though they are idiots. People who do not work as engineers or biologists are not idiots, as you find out when you have to employ said people for more money than you earn to fix your plumbing or do your accounts. They are just not privy to the same understanding of the relevant issue as you are.

      The same problem occurred big time in the UK with the MMR injections. The state talked down to concerned parents and treated them like idiots, the net result of which was to make them even more determined that there must be a scandal and a cover-up. Talk sensibly about the health risks of wifi (such that they exist) and show how such things have been tested independently and shown to be of no concern, and you will win-out. Laughing at anyone who raises concerns may make geeks feel smug, but it's a losing strategy and always will be.

      --
      DRM-free indie games for the PC and Mac: Positech Games
    2. Re:Yeah ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I know I'm just an A.C., but somebody seriously ought ta mod the parent up some. Very insightful, for a Slashdot poster.

    3. Re:Yeah ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The same problem occurred big time in the UK with the MMR injections. The state talked down to concerned parents and treated them like idiots

      Because they are/were idiots. How should one treat an idiot, apart from like an idiot?

    4. Re:Yeah ... by Neoprofin · · Score: 1

      The problem is, that while they may not be dumb, they refuse to believe that they're completely ignorant and uninformed about the matters they're trying to affect. I know that I don't know a damn thing advanced chemistry, so the last thing I should be doing is getting together my angry mob to go down to the university and demand that they stop experimenting on amino acids because acids are dangerous! How do you respond to something like that without being a little snarky? "I'm sorry but everything you just said is absolutely and complete wrong and I respect you less for having said it."?

      The second problem is that once people get it in there head that there's some sort of dark conspiracy no amount of proof or information is usually successful in bringing them back because people only believe what they want to. My aunt believes that denim makes her daughter depressed, these guys think WiFi is any more harmful to them than the other 50K kinds of EM radiation they're being bombarded with from natural and man-made sources.

    5. Re:Yeah ... by hoofie · · Score: 1

      You sir, are an anonymous fuckwit. Many educated people [including myself and my wife who is a nurse] were worried about the MMR debate. Many recent UK governments have badly screwed up health problems [mad cow disease, salmonella etc.] After some thought, we decided to go ahead with the normal vaccine as the single vaccines would have exposed our daughter to even greater risk. In the end the original study was discredited but my point is; when the government and authorities screw things up enough, even people with common sense and education doubt what they are being told.

  27. Studies? by nick_davison · · Score: 0, Troll

    Although there have been many studies that show no correlation between WiFi and health issues

    More or less studies than have shown cigarettes are awesome for you and everyone should smoke them?

    Or that global warming doesn't exist?

    That Microsoft operating systems has a lower total cost of ownership than Linux?

    That DDT, Agent Orange and Thalidamide are all totally safe?

    To be fair to the hippies, there is a fairly long history of things being repeatedly investigated and found to be safe... right up until they were found not to be.

    Unless you live in the state of California - where everything, including reading this post, can give you cancer and needs to carry a warning message, just to be on the safe side.

    It does, however, remain true that a Guiness a day will, indeed, keep the doctor away.

  28. See for yourself. by shockwaverider · · Score: 1

    I was at Glastonbury for the winter solstice and was chuckling to myself at this story in the local newspaper.

    The company that runs the WiFi also provides some high quality streaming webcams - See for yourself.....

    http://www.checkglastonburylive.com/

    --
    Remember kids! Guns don't kill people - Americans kill people.
  29. Oh noes! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Don't forget, wifi also eats babies!

  30. Re:Very funny, indeed *YAWN* by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    But it does mention Glastonbury. Google it?

  31. umm... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    What does "idleispants" mean?

    1. Re:umm... by residue · · Score: 1

      Obviously, you're not a golfer.

    2. Re:umm... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I've played a bit. I've never heard anything like that.

  32. All things are true by Weaselmancer · · Score: 1

    Even the false things.

    --
    Weaselmancer
    rediculous.
    1. Re:All things are true by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      How can that be?

    2. Re:All things are true by hesiod · · Score: 1

      If something is false, a true statement will point out its falsity. Therefore, the false thing is true.

    3. Re:All things are true by Weaselmancer · · Score: 1

      I don't know man, I didn't do it.

      --
      Weaselmancer
      rediculous.
  33. ob: south park quote by Kierthos · · Score: 5, Funny

    hippies... hippies... they say they want to save the world, but all they do is smoke pot and smell bad.

    --
    Mr. Hu is not a ninja.
    1. Re:ob: south park quote by Chrisq · · Score: 2, Funny

      hippies... hippies... they say they want to save the world, but all they do is smoke pot and smell bad.

      Compared with Geeks who drink black coffee and smell bad.

    2. Re:ob: south park quote by wiredog · · Score: 1

      At least we're awake.

    3. Re:ob: south park quote by elrous0 · · Score: 1

      We should hold a jam concert to protest those hippies! We'll show them that we're not going to take their shit, by using the power of music!

      --
      SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
    4. Re:ob: south park quote by DigitalSorceress · · Score: 1

      ... and have jobs

      --

      The Digital Sorceress
    5. Re:ob: south park quote by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I drink coffee, smoke pot and bathe (daily for each!)--still just another geek though.

      More WiFi, not less!

    6. Re:ob: south park quote by geekoid · · Score: 1

      Until the have real bills to pay, then suddenly they are all about the man.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    7. Re:ob: south park quote by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You can't ahve Jobs man he is his own man man!

  34. Orgone Accumulator by advocate_one · · Score: 1

    I've got an orgone accumulator
    It makes me feel greater
    I'll see you sometime later
    When I'm through with my accumulator
    It's no social integrator
    It's a one man isolator
    It's a back brain stimulator
    It's a cerebral vibrator
    Those energy stimulators
    Just turn your eyeballs into craters
    But an orgone accumulator
    Is a superman creator
    It's no social integrator
    It's a one man isolator
    It's a back brain stimulator
    It's a cerebral vibrator
    I've got an orgone accumulator
    And it makes me feel greater
    I'll see you sometime later
    When I'm through with my accumulator.

    Just crack open the throttle on that Silver Machine... I'm standing on the runway waiting for takeoff...

    --
    Donald 'Duck' Dunn: We had a band powerful enough to turn goat piss into gasoline.
  35. tin foil hat wearing.... by Phusion0 · · Score: 1

    Yeah, you may remember this story from March '08 about the norcal hippy town that turned down free public wifi from Sonic.net due to health concerns.... -->> http://hardware.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/03/26/0118237 I live in that little town and I love my hippy brethren, but they're fucking nuts. I want my WiFi, damn it... every time I try to educate someone on the subject I get the same kind of "that's just, like, your opinion, man" response. I guess I'm stuck leeching wifi around the residential areas.... *sigh*

    --
    Smokedot.org
  36. See "Bad science" by Kupfernigk · · Score: 4, Informative
    It's worse than you realise. This is being led by people who have a vested interest in peddling FUD - one of the "protestors" claims to run an independent consultancy on EMC, but actually runs a company that sells tinfoil hats and so on. (See the Ben Goldacre Bad Science columns in the Guardian for information). The real issue seems to be that Glastonbury has a small but vocal number of people who don't want the town to develop, and want to stop anything that might make it more attractive to small businesses.

    The local paper (Fosse Way) published this story without the slightest critical analysis whatsoever. As someone who has worked on, inter alia, the EMC Directive, I wrote to them asking whether the person complaining of headaches had taken part in a blind test. Perhaps needless to say, the letter has not been published and indeed I've had no acknowledgement of it.

    BTW, they do not have a "way of life which draws on 5000 years of hocus pocus". The Glastonbury thing dates back to no more than the 19th century: it's as fake as Druidism in Wales. Glastonbury is just a small town in Somerset that used to make its money from the leather industry till it went bust under Thatcher. Now it's a retirement suburb, the most Conservative part of the district. Currently a few protestors are trying to stop the demolition of the old factory buildings to put up an industrial estate - the old buildings cannot be brought up to modern standards and are a complete eyesore.

    Why do I complain about this? Because I live in the part of Somerset that is a net contributor of taxes to keep the residents of Glastonbury from having to have industry and jobs, that's why.

    --
    From scarped cliff or quarried stone she cries "A thousand types are gone, I care for nothing, no not one."
    1. Re:See "Bad science" by Chrisq · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I know its bad science but I am not sure that it hinders Glastonbury's business. Every other shop sells crystals, mystic books, figurines that will improve yoir fertility and so on. It could even aid business, someone will cash in on the idea that Glastonbury is protected by Orgone generators to sell ones you can take home to protect your own environment.

      As religions go its not that bad. Nobody calls for death to those who use the wrong type of crystal or prefers herbalism to energy fields.

    2. Re:See "Bad science" by meringuoid · · Score: 1

      Can they get sound-cancelling orgone generators too? Then maybe the locals can quit whining about the noise, and we can get a decent sound system on the Pyramid stage this year...

      --
      Real Daleks don't climb stairs - they level the building.
    3. Re:See "Bad science" by CTachyon · · Score: 1

      As religions go its not that bad. Nobody calls for death to those who use the wrong type of crystal or prefers herbalism to energy fields.

      Yet. Give it a hundred years or so.

      --
      Range Voting: preference intensity matters
    4. Re:See "Bad science" by aaron+alderman · · Score: 1

      Until something goes bad (flood, drought, poor tourism) and they need a scapegoat in the form of say a "witch" and run them out of town or kill them. This type of thinking is never good and can lead to "good people doing bad things" because they were too stupid to stop and think if what they are claiming is based on evidence or reason instead of superstition. So no, this type of religious thinking isn't "not that bad" and leads to so-called justifiable homicide from incorrect premises. (Witches should be killed, fortunately witches do not exist, etc)

    5. Re:See "Bad science" by CAIMLAS · · Score: 1

      Eh, they're pretty hostile towards anyone who doesn't fit their subculture, or is at least somewhat accepting of it, though - as a rule. Sure, you don't have herbalists fighting out with the crystalists, but you've got plenty of both doing things like, oh, keying SUVs, marching with Code Pink, and petitioning people on PETA's behalf.

      --
      ~/ssh slashdot.org ssh: connect to host slashdot.org port 22: too many beers
  37. hangin' fine with the kind by Nethead · · Score: 1

    I'm an old hippie that is into ham radio, ex-broadcast engineer, wifi junkie, and general RF geek. I can report that my charkras are fine and dandy. See how they glow.

    --
    -- I have a private email server in my basement.
    1. Re:hangin' fine with the kind by Rolman · · Score: 1

      Then you're in the best position to sell them the service of "fixing and maintaining all the Wi-Fi transmitters so that they are chakra-friendly and give them louder orgasms instead of headaches".

      They could get rid of the 'good-vibe' generators and you get to keep the money. Everybody wins in this stupidity contest.

      Seriously, all superstitious people are a con man's dream.

      --
      - Otaku no naka no otaku, otaking da!!!
  38. Receptionist by dargaud · · Score: 1

    The receptionist at work complained that she started getting rashes and other symptoms after we installed a wifi repeater outside her office door, claiming she's electrical sensitive. The problem was that the wifi wasn't even up and running until a few weeks later when the mesh was finished. And also she doesn't have a problem with the cell phone in her pocket which is orders of magnitude more powerful... And she claims that her alarm radio is sending radio-waves at her during the night and waking her up. That's the idea and you get the picture... Some people here have good fun.

    --
    Non-Linux Penguins ?
    1. Re:Receptionist by Detritus · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I've discovered, on several occasions, that a visible ham radio antenna will cause large numbers of problems with the television sets and hi-fi systems of my neighbors, even when the antenna has never been connected to a transmitter. Many of the complainants are intelligent people, but the logic center of their brain shuts down when they see an unusual antenna.

      --
      Mea navis aericumbens anguillis abundat
    2. Re:Receptionist by yendor · · Score: 1

      The Electrically sensitive people have been known to suffer for persecution from people who have the audacity to expect them to have consistent symptoms along with some verifiable reactions to fields.
      Mostly the poor persecuted sufferers have been able to sense fields with less than 50% accuracy, less than the test group that simply guessed.

    3. Re:Receptionist by geekoid · · Score: 1

      Time for lay-offs. Clearly she is looking for a reason to sue the company..best to downsize before she files some BS complaint.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
  39. English people don't say "like", feckwit. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    There is absolutely no way an English hippie would talk like that.
    Sod off with your US stereotypes, tosser.

  40. Hippies are the disease... by cffrost · · Score: 1

    ...DEFCON has the cure.

    --
    Thank you, Edward Snowden.

    "Arguments from authority are worthless." —Carl Sagan
  41. Hellllooooooo by kaiwai · · Score: 1

    Mate, there is a reason why the tranmission towers are turned off when being serviced; I don't know what shit box operation you're running in the US but in most other countries they don't subject employee's to radio waves that can kill birds.

    1. Re:Hellllooooooo by Nursie · · Score: 1

      Any evidence of this bird-killing?

      The only thing I can find is that lights on towers can confuse migrating birds. Nothing about harm from RF.

  42. my body is my property: don't rape me by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I can't just walk through your house through an open window/door, whether you're using it or not.

    Similarly, why should you be able to generate EM radiation that's sent through my body?

    If you reject my position on the grounds that the radiation's harmless to me, then I argue that walking through your home is harmless to you.

    You, a human, are knowingly and willingly violating my body with your generated radiation in a way more comprehensive and intimate than if you were to rape me. If you were disease free and gentle, the rape might be just as harmless to my body as the radiation, yet rape remains unacceptable. Why is that? If it's about psychological rather than physical harm, then stop and consider that psychological harm is precisely what you're doing to these hippies.

    1. Re:my body is my property: don't rape me by Detritus · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Everything generates EM radiation, even your own body.

      --
      Mea navis aericumbens anguillis abundat
    2. Re:my body is my property: don't rape me by DaveV1.0 · · Score: 1

      I guess this means that Sol is raping everyone on Earth with it's neutrino flux.

      --
      There is no "-1 offended" or "-1 you don't agree with me" mod options for a reason.
    3. Re:my body is my property: don't rape me by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And everyone is operating at different frequencies. There is natural and artificial EM radiation that compliments or can cause illness. If you've ever walked across a lay line that was strong enough, you would have felt it. I have. Whether or not WiFi is that dangerous remains to be seen. It probably is to some people that are over sensitive to most EM radiation.

      Just because scientists refuse to take the issue seriously, doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Up until just a few years ago, they didn't take parallel dimensions seriously at all.

    4. Re:my body is my property: don't rape me by influenza · · Score: 1

      But why is it specifically wifi, and not cordless phones (that use the same frequency), cell phones, radio/tv stations, baby monitors. The radios used for taxis and emergency services. CB radios in transport trucks.

      That's the part I don't understand. Why is wifi a problem for people when none of these other things are?

  43. What about the sun? by Fross · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Those hippies are going to be royally fucked when they realise the huge ball of incandescent gas at the middle of our solar system is the largest electromagnetic transmitter within several billion miles. How are they going to fix THAT one?

    1. Re:What about the sun? by Reziac · · Score: 1

      Tinfoil umbrellas??

      --
      ~REZ~ #43301. Who'd fake being me anyway?
    2. Re:What about the sun? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Those hippies are going to be royally fucked when they realise the huge ball of incandescent gas at the middle of our solar system is the largest electromagnetic transmitter within several billion miles. How are they going to fix THAT one?

      Ya maaaan, but, like, that's natural man, it's not, like, all polluted by science, man

    3. Re:What about the sun? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I don't know, could they jury-rig some technobabble to explain how

      The basic and simplified theory of how the orgone devices work is that the negative energy is attracted into the device by the organic component and then it gets bounced back and forth between the resin and suspended metal particles. Crystalline structures within the mix cause the energy to get organized and re-radiated as a positive, clean energy.

      actually makes the entire earth one huge orgone generator? It wouldn't be that much further off-field from the explanation of orgone generators they already have...

    4. Re:What about the sun? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This is my favourite joke ever:

      Q: What's orange and looks good on a hippie?

      A: Fire! ;o)

  44. No known "Health issues" by unity100 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    as if modern medicine is able to fathom full extent of physiological and psychological issues of homo sapiens sapiens ....

    something not being known yet doesnt mean it doesnt exist.

    1. Re:No known "Health issues" by Eil · · Score: 1

      something not being known yet doesnt mean it doesnt exist.

      Strictly speaking this is true, but it's not a valid defense against criticism.

      Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. There is not just little evidence, there is zero evidence that wifi radio signals affect human physiology in any way.

      From my home office I can usually pick up 8 or 9 wifi signals and that's not counting all the other 2.4GHz systems in my home and neighborhood. Practically every square inch of the developed world has anywhere from dozens to thousands of both weak and strong radio signals flying through the air at all times. You just don't know about them because you're not the user of those signals. Office buildings and apartments are perhaps the worst. If wifi were harmful as some say, almost all of the urban population in developed countries would be sick or dead already.

    2. Re:No known "Health issues" by aaron+alderman · · Score: 1

      Nor does selective memory, confirmation bias, psychosomatic induced illness, willingness to belief, distaste for progress mean that they exist too.

  45. Low power by Britz · · Score: 1

    Wifi usually has very low power. DECT is usually much more harmful. It is not such a good idea to keep the wireless phone on the nightstand if it is not in the cradle it keeps radio connection with.

    Electromagnetic radiation can be a real, measurable hazard to health. But usually the worst offender is the radio clock on the night stand less than 50 cm away from your head. Cheaply made and poorly shielded it can have an effect on you body.

    Here is to hippies:
    http://www.southparkstudios.com/episodes/103815/

    1. Re:Low power by geekoid · · Score: 1

      Nothing in your home is giving off enough EM to effect you. Excluding home built/modified crap.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    2. Re:Low power by Britz · · Score: 1

      I do believe this to be different. They did some CT scans of the head while exposing low doses of EM and found effects. And many radio clocks that are powered by 110 or 220 V instead of batteries do give off enough to have an effect at close range.

  46. old story... by yoprst · · Score: 1

    "We've got fivefold increase of health-related complaints since we installed that cellular antenna. That's pretty scary. What's gonna happen when we actually start to use it?"

  47. Snorers by Dr.+Hok · · Score: 1

    These people simply snore. They drink too much, or whatever they do to balance their chakras, then suffer apnea during sleep. All the mentioned symptoms fit quite well:

    FTFA: "headaches, dizziness, nausea, severe tiredness, brain fog, disorientation and loss of appetite, loss of balance, inability to concentrate, loss of creativity"

    --
    Say out loud: I'm an Aspie and I'm somewhat proud, I guess. Uh. Can I write an email in all caps instead? Hm...
  48. Tin Foil Hat by mfh · · Score: 1

    You need one, dude.

    --
    The dangers of knowledge trigger emotional distress in human beings.
    1. Re:Tin Foil Hat by Chih · · Score: 1

      I can't wait for the research study confirming the detrimental health effects of covering your head with tinfoil. It will drive people mad

      --
      For best results, avoid doing stupid things.
  49. They must be really sensitive by Kupfernigk · · Score: 1

    If Glastonbury shopkeepers can really hear the noise from Worthy Down, which is at Pilton, then I'm impressed. Especially if they can hear it above their own continuous whining.

    --
    From scarped cliff or quarried stone she cries "A thousand types are gone, I care for nothing, no not one."
    1. Re:They must be really sensitive by sesshomaru · · Score: 1

      You know, I'm starting to hear echos of the movie Hot Fuzz here. All we need are people in cloaks and everyone talking about "the greater good."

      --
      "MIT betrayed all of its basic principles."
  50. Solution by DeadPixels · · Score: 1

    Announce that you're turning off the network in response to public demand. Leave it on. Wait for hippies to declare that things are much better now and WiFi is a health risk. Announce that the network was never turned off to begin with.

  51. Great, problem solved! by golodh · · Score: 1
    Isn't the march of progress wonderful?

    Now we can tell anyone who feels their chakra's are being interfered with by GSM antennas that all of their problems will be resolved through the installation of ... whatsit ... ah yes ... Orgone generators! Brilliant. Problem solved.

  52. Sorry, no way. by snspdaarf · · Score: 2, Informative

    My office has several microwave links, and I have seen birds perched on the feedhorn of an open grid parabolic antenna for several minutes without dropping dead. Granted, that is not the center of the beam. Maybe their feet are just cold.

    --
    Why, without your clothes, you're naked, Miss Dudley!
  53. Microwaves by phorm · · Score: 1

    Hmmm. I wonder if they could build a device that captures there microwaves, focuses them, and slow-cooks some pot-brownies or something of the like. If I build it in a pyramid shape I bet I now know who my target audience would be...

  54. Orgone generators by Maury+Markowitz · · Score: 1

    Admittedly, this makes a lot of sense. An imaginary treatment for an imaginary problem. Eggg-celent.

    1. Re:Orgone generators by geekoid · · Score: 1

      The done side is it makes some people think it's 'proof' of this made up BS. Gives it a false sense of legitimacy.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
  55. Someone Call Cartman Already by maz2331 · · Score: 2, Funny

    Bring in Cartman to fix the situation.

  56. Glastonberry Green by BodhiCat · · Score: 1

    The hippies clained that the wi-fi network caused "headaches, dizziness, nausea, severe tiredness, brain fog, disorientation, loss of balance, inability to concentrate, loss of creativity." Coincidentally the wi-fi became active at the same time as the local harvest of Glastonberry Green. Should we blame the wi-fi??

  57. But what if ... by klaasb · · Score: 1

    But what if the radiation of their chakra's interferes with my wifi network?

    --
    if your pants fit well, it's not only because of the pants ...
  58. Like the old adage states by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If you can't stand the hotspot, get out of the village.

  59. If they're really hippies... by 517714 · · Score: 1

    Their health problems are probably associated with old age.

    --
    The US government have made it clear that we have no inalienable rights; any we do not defend vigorously will be taken.
  60. glastonbury festival by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    those hippys are a bunch of numbnuts.. the glastonbury festival is flooded with wifi.. the green fields have there own node running aswell with 900 mhz and 5ghz links...
    i swear most of them are talking out of there veggie butts all of the time......you give a hippy a laptop a wifi connection and your logs will show a huge jump in torrent abuse due to the fact of the shear amount of crusty porn getting downloaded...

  61. Too much pot? by DaveV1.0 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    "headaches, dizziness, nausea, severe tiredness, brain fog, disorientation and loss of appetite, loss of balance, inability to concentrate, loss of creativity"

    Sounds like they have all the symptoms of smoking way too much pot.

    --
    There is no "-1 offended" or "-1 you don't agree with me" mod options for a reason.
    1. Re:Too much pot? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Lol, sounds like you're talking out your ass.

    2. Re:Too much pot? by Reality+Master+101 · · Score: 2, Informative

      Dunno about loss of appetite... if one of the symptoms had been "munchies", then that would have clinched it.

      --
      Sometimes it's best to just let stupid people be stupid.
    3. Re:Too much pot? by rubink1 · · Score: 0

      Some group was doing this here in Santa Fe and I wrote about it some time ago. Allergic to the Wifi in Cafes, so they found it appropriate to try and BAN it. I would say, just don't go to the cafes. Or outside your house. But I bet their neighbors were full of wireless APs, band they just didn't know it. Morons....

      --
      DGC
    4. Re:Too much pot? by Flere+Imsaho · · Score: 1

      Loss of appetite a symptom of smoking way too much pot? I think you're confusing your recreational chemicals there, buddy.

      --
      It gripped her hand gently. 'Regret is for humans,' it said.
  62. I sense a business opportunity by acb · · Score: 1

    If there is a significant market niche who believe that WiFi generates negative energy and that one can convert this into positive energy by means of an "orgone generator", someone could make some money by selling WiFi base stations with built-in orgone generators. Just buy a bunch of generic Netgear boxes, case-mod them to look vaguely mystical, using a lot of crystal and gold leaf and such in the process, and sell them at a steep markup. Presto; hippies have good, life-affirming orgone-enhanced WiFi, and you have their money. Everyone's a winner.

  63. That all depends on what the meaning of is, is by Iowan41 · · Score: 1

    The bread and the wine really are changed by God the Holy Spirit into the body and blood of Christ. (1 Cor. 10-11) We aren't told the means. It could be a conferral of identity, or something like quantum entanglement. It isn't "capernetic" What this has to do with wifi, I fail to see.

    1. Re:That all depends on what the meaning of is, is by techprophet · · Score: 0

      I disagree, but /. is not a place for religious debate, so I will end the discussion here. I was responding to the AnCow.

  64. First Exposure to Radio Waves??? by spiedrazer · · Score: 1

    Yes, these are certainly morons and are they really serious? Do they think that these are the first radio waves they have been exposed to? They never complained while thier bodies were constantly bombarded with tv/radio/cellphone/cordless phone/military radar/space background radiation etc. ( not to mention all the pot & shrooms) but as soon as a wireless network fires up they all become walking antennae?

    --
    Keep passing the open windows...
    1. Re:First Exposure to Radio Waves??? by CheshireDragon · · Score: 1

      Yes, these are certainly morons and are they really serious?

      Yes they are. C'mon, there are still people that believe in a god of some sort. Like you say with all the other invisible waves in the light/sound/RF spectrum why have they not bitched about gamma radiation, or even UV from the sun? HAH!

      --
      "That's right...I said it."
  65. a word... by BrokenHalo · · Score: 1

    It is obnoxious to make your posts in monospaced fonts just to make them stand out. If you really prefer these fonts, just use lynx/links and just leave us to go our own way.

    1. Re:a word... by Zonnald · · Score: 1

      Being a little dogmatic aren't we? Hey, speaking of which didn't Obelix eat pigs (wild boar) and he too had a Dogmatix.

    2. Re:a word... by BrokenHalo · · Score: 1

      Being a little dogmatic aren't we?

      No, I just think monospaced fonts are an unworthy way to make one's post stand out. More useful just to make it worth reading in the first place.

  66. Well, actually... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    A few years back I set up a radio network for a municipal water water system using spread spectrum data radios and tested the thing in one little room on our company campus. I noticed that after about two hours in the room I'd get start getting a headache that got more severe as the day went on, and this was not a mental thing as I wouldn't have believed it, if it happened to someone else.

    Of course, we're talking about 35 5-watt radios in one pretty small room, and I doubt any 802.11 transmitter is putting out that kind of juice. But still, I think there is some definate health hazard to the RF saturation that we're exposed to on a daily basis.

  67. The solution by BubbaDoom · · Score: 1

    I think we'd all be better off if we'd ...

    Nuke the hippies!!


    Its hard to find the right situation to say that.

  68. Refusing to Immunize by Firethorn · · Score: 1

    I still have mine, so I'll be fine

    What about the people who CAN'T get vaccines? Like newborns, people alergic to eggs, had a reaction in the past, have a supressed immune system due to disease or drugs for a transplant?

    Another point would be that vaccines, depending on the vaccine, are only 90-99% effective. Some people's immune systems either don't learn, or don't keep the antibodies. I have an aunt like that. You can vaccinate her against chicken pox all you like, 3 months later or so and she'll be vulnerable to it again.

    Herd immunity is still a good thing.

    --
    I don't read AC A human right
    1. Re:Refusing to Immunize by plague3106 · · Score: 1

      What about the people who CAN'T get vaccines? Like newborns, people alergic to eggs, had a reaction in the past, have a supressed immune system due to disease or drugs for a transplant?

      Oh well. That's life. People get sick, and sometimes die. We aren't going to ever overcome that, just like we'll never have a crime free society.

      Another point would be that vaccines, depending on the vaccine, are only 90-99% effective. Some people's immune systems either don't learn, or don't keep the antibodies. I have an aunt like that. You can vaccinate her against chicken pox all you like, 3 months later or so and she'll be vulnerable to it again.

      Well, sucks to be her then I guess. At the end of the day, I only care about my family and friends. Anyone else I'm not going to worry about.

    2. Re:Refusing to Immunize by Firethorn · · Score: 1

      Oh well. That's life. People get sick, and sometimes die.

      But, due to the wonder that is herd immunity, we can keep that way down for diseases we have vaccines against.

      Well, sucks to be her then I guess.

      Yes, it does in some ways. However, she's also a Registered Nurse, and apparently the best in her ward at CPR. Do you really want somebody like her to be out sick when you or one of your loved ones to have a heart attack?

      I only care about my family and friends. Anyone else I'm not going to worry about.

      What if you or your family/friends happens to be one of the ones the vaccine doesn't work for? Sucks to be them, I guess.

      --
      I don't read AC A human right
    3. Re:Refusing to Immunize by plague3106 · · Score: 1

      But, due to the wonder that is herd immunity, we can keep that way down for diseases we have vaccines against.

      You seem to think people are nothing more than cattle. Fortunately, the rest of us realize that people have rights, and that includes the right to refuse any injection or medical procedure.

      Yes, it does in some ways. However, she's also a Registered Nurse, and apparently the best in her ward at CPR. Do you really want somebody like her to be out sick when you or one of your loved ones to have a heart attack?

      Really? And you've qualified what it means to be "the best in her ward?" Did her CPR work every single time, but other RNs only save 50% of their patients with CPR? Please, spare me your appeals to emotion. Every RN must be CPR certified. And personally, if I'm having a heart attack, I'd much prefer a doctor over a RN.

      What if you or your family/friends happens to be one of the ones the vaccine doesn't work for? Sucks to be them, I guess.

      Indeed it does. Yet I'm not about to go out and force every other person to have the vaccine.

      I'm sure the world would be much safer if we had police monitoring everyone's move 24/7. I still think constant monitoring is a bad thing. Ya know, a huge violation of rights?

    4. Re:Refusing to Immunize by Firethorn · · Score: 1

      You seem to think people are nothing more than cattle.

      Not me, the diseases act like we are. Discounting the whole different germs thing.

      Fortunately, the rest of us realize that people have rights, and that includes the right to refuse any injection or medical procedure.

      Fine and dandy, enjoy the non-vaccination without a good reason colony.

      you've qualified what it means to be "the best in her ward?"

      Nope, why I used the word 'apparently'. I say that on the basis of OTHER nurses and doctor's words. That and she's the first one called for when the need crops up.

      And personally, if I'm having a heart attack, I'd much prefer a doctor over a RN.

      Really? You'd prefer a doctor fresh out of med school over a RN who's done CPR hundreds of times? Doctors are employed based on their knowledge; Nurses are more skill oriented.

      Yet I'm not about to go out and force every other person to have the vaccine.

      My grandfather had polio. I've studied the issue. We're far better off having people vaccinated than unvaccinated. Without the pressure to become vaccinated, we wouldn't have eliminated smallpox from the wild and come close with polio.

      There are good reasons why schools require vaccinations for students to attend.

      still think constant monitoring is a bad thing. Ya know, a huge violation of rights?

      And you're comparing a shot, cup, or mist up against a police state.

      --
      I don't read AC A human right
    5. Re:Refusing to Immunize by plague3106 · · Score: 1

      Fine and dandy, enjoy the non-vaccination without a good reason colony.

      Hmm.. you claim to respect rights, but imply that those that don't wish to be vaccinated be forced to live somewhere else.

      Nope, why I used the word 'apparently'. I say that on the basis of OTHER nurses and doctor's words. That and she's the first one called for when the need crops up.

      Wow, you must tell me how your aunt manages to be awake and alert 24/7. I'm inclined to believe that the other nurses are just as capable, or your aunt would never be allowed to leave.

      Really? You'd prefer a doctor fresh out of med school over a RN who's done CPR hundreds of times? Doctors are employed based on their knowledge; Nurses are more skill oriented.

      You again present false choices, as if the hospital only has doctors fresh out of med school. Please. Also, feel free to tell a cardiac surgeon they only have knowledge, but no skill. I have a feeling they will disagree.

      My grandfather had polio. I've studied the issue. We're far better off having people vaccinated than unvaccinated. Without the pressure to become vaccinated, we wouldn't have eliminated smallpox from the wild and come close with polio.

      I never debated that vaccinations are good. I dislike the notion that anyone be forced to be vaccinated, especially when there is a risk involved with getting the vaccine in the first place.

      And you're comparing a shot, cup, or mist up against a police state.

      Yup.. see all too often rights are trampled on by those seeking to do some kind of "good." Banning transfats is another such example. I have a right to eat foods with transfats, and others have the right to make food with transfats. I have no problem with disclosure, so people can make their own decisions, but outright banning is a violation of rights. I much prefer individual freedom and the risks that come with it over government dictating many of the aspects of my life.

    6. Re:Refusing to Immunize by Firethorn · · Score: 1

      Hmm.. you claim to respect rights, but imply that those that don't wish to be vaccinated be forced to live somewhere else.

      I have a 'right' to not be attacked by you. Whether by weapon or disease. You don't have the right to be a carrier, when it's so easy to prevent.

      I'm inclined to believe that the other nurses are just as capable

      When she's available, she's generally the one to do it. When she's not somebody else does. Try to keep up.

      as if the hospital only has doctors fresh out of med school. Please. Also, feel free to tell a cardiac surgeon they only have knowledge, but no skill. I have a feeling they will disagree.

      I exaggerated. Still, my aunt's been around for longer than most of the doctors in her ward. And you specified doctor, not surgeon. Besides, I never stated that doctor's don't have skills, I said that they're employed on the basis of their knowledge. Give a doctor and a nurse ten years experience and guess which one will have more experience inserting needles.

      I dislike the notion that anyone be forced to be vaccinated, especially when there is a risk involved with getting the vaccine in the first place.

      Given that I specified 'without a good reason', what risk? Vaccines are extremely safe except for a few segments of society. In order to protect them, we want to vaccinate as many of the rest as we can.

      Banning transfats is another such example.

      Transfats don't jump from carrier to carrier. They aren't contageous. Makes a big difference.

      --
      I don't read AC A human right
    7. Re:Refusing to Immunize by plague3106 · · Score: 1

      I have a 'right' to not be attacked by you. Whether by weapon or disease. You don't have the right to be a carrier, when it's so easy to prevent.

      You don't have any right not to get germs. If I have germs, and you get them and unless I purposefully infected you, it's not an attack. It's life. Germs and viruses will always exist, I recommend you get used to that fact. Unless you also want to claim I "attack" you every time I start my car, buy some new gadget or clean my house (which kicks up dust and germs). And yes, I can choose to get sick, it's my right. Your rights include being informed and staying away.... they do not include forcing me to undergo a medical procedure.

      When she's available, she's generally the one to do it. When she's not somebody else does. Try to keep up.

      Which proves my point; she's no better or worse than any other nurse. So it's irrelevent to me or anyone else if she's out sick.

      I exaggerated. Still, my aunt's been around for longer than most of the doctors in her ward. And you specified doctor, not surgeon. Besides, I never stated that doctor's don't have skills, I said that they're employed on the basis of their knowledge. Give a doctor and a nurse ten years experience and guess which one will have more experience inserting needles.

      Your exaggeration makes your case look weak and silly. Not a great way to prove your point. And a surgeon is a medical doctor. In an case, it's the MD (surgeon or not) that I'd rather have over an RN. As far as inserting needles goes, any idiot can do that, in many cases even Medical Assistants can do it, and they are the lowest level of patient care providers. Your aunt really isn't as important as you think she is, so her being sick is irrelevent to this discussion. She performs greatly appreciated work, I'm not dismissing that... but she's completely replacable too. Plenty of others can do the same things.

      Given that I specified 'without a good reason', what risk? Vaccines are extremely safe except for a few segments of society. In order to protect them, we want to vaccinate as many of the rest as we can.

      Well, given that you don't know how you'll react to a vaccine until AFTER it's adminstered, I'd say that's good enoug reason. Also, I don't need a good reason. I have a right to refuse that anything be consumed, injected, or what have you. Just like I have a right to refuse a life saving surgery. I don't need any reason, let alone a good one. It's my body, you have no rights to it.

      Transfats don't jump from carrier to carrier. They aren't contageous. Makes a big difference.

      I already addressed this silliness above. People get sick from germs and viruses. It will happen, you need to accept that there is always risk in life. Your right to reduce risk ends when you're forcing your will on another.

  69. Exploiting Misinformation for Profit by Viperlin · · Score: 0

    look if your going to invent little Scientology-like spirits that live inside you, it'd be smart to make sure they don't get harmed by radio waves its not our fault your god made them vulnerable ok (I am aware how offensive and ridiculous this reply is, but by now I consider it the only approach, at least meet some kind of logic on their side, then realistically take the piss using the laws of the dream-world they choose to live in)

  70. "hippies" by O'Nazareth · · Score: 1

    It is just Fox News who qualify them of "hippies". I think there are lots of people who are scared of technologies. And "being hippie" has never been to do with being against new technologies. Anyway, everybody is against technology when it does not profit them. You need to make people make money from it. Install a nuclear power plant that will employ everybody in this village, the project will better welcome than a wifi network.

    I like the text of the petition though, it sounds so much like monoxide dihydrogen. They did not get much from being talked about in the news. 72 signatures?

  71. Drats! by danwesnor · · Score: 1

    Hippies Say WiFi Network Is Harming Their Chakras

    Drats! They've discovered my evil plan!

  72. Here is the deal: by geekoid · · Score: 1

    Prove a Chakra exists, then we will talk.

    Woo Woo...all aboard the made up shit train.

    --
    The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
  73. Camoflage by boyfaceddog · · Score: 1

    How long would it take to hard-hack a WiFi AP to look like a GoodVibes (tm) device? Two birds, one stone, so to speak.

    --
    Here will be an old abusing of God's patience and the king's English.
  74. Cascade Effects in Complex & Biological System by j-stroy · · Score: 0

    So often "pure" rationalizations fail in the realms of complex systems and biological systems, such as the principal of bio-accumulation of toxins, where extremely low environmental levels of a substance may aggregate to very high levels in a predator species. Or japanese subway cars where the high number of cell phones, and the closed metal shell of the car, can cause standing waves (microwave hotspots) within the car, far greater than the individual phones power output. Resonance can cause astonishing accumulations of power from very low power sources.

    The most compelling description of neuronal damage in the brain due to microwave EMF at low levels, similar to a cell phone were studies which found that the blood brain barrier membrane in rats dilated slightly under low level microwave EMF. This then allowed albumin proteins to pass through the membrane into the brain, where subsequent neuronal damage was caused through the molecular interactions.

    So, the amount of power required to induce the membrane change was in fact too low to directly cause tissue damage, but the brain was profoundly perturbed due to a subsequent cascade of effects. The world (and us) are symbiotic and minor changes can destabilize the entire system. Acting like a know-it-all cuz you weren't open to following a counter-intuitive concept all the way through is kinda dangerous.. znew=z^2+c

  75. Try It by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If you don't believe there is something to this (though I imagine these folks are a little beyond the pale), then I challenge you do this simple experiment: An hour before you go to bed shut of all the breakers to you house, ie. cut the electricity completely (ok. you may have to forgo the frig, but cut all the rest...), then see just how you feel in the morning as opposed to most mornings.

  76. Soylent Green by querist · · Score: 1

    How about a local "harvest" of Soylent Green? Then the hippie problem will be solved.

  77. sexpistols by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "never trust a Hippie"

  78. Hippies by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    FUCK the hippies. Time to move on has LONG gone past you whackos.

  79. Sympathy for "hippies" by dafing · · Score: 1
    While being a fully paid up nerd, I've often thought it must suck to be someone who hates technology, a lot of religious cults dont listen to the radio for example, they wont use telephones even "its a pipeline to filth" whatever that means.

    My grandmother works as a interviewer/poll person, she goes door to door asking people if they would do a market research poll. She found a group of ultra conservative religious people, sort of like mormons or something, where the women are not allowed to do basically anything, and theirs a "leader" who censors magazines, cutting out articles, pictures, headlines he doesn't think are suitable for his flock, crazy. How do these people feel about radio waves whizzing through their bodies at the speed of sound? Even if they don't use radios etc because "that Eminem chap swears", the actual transmission zaps through them regardless!

    Imagine if we DO find out these radio waves are bad for our bodies in the future, these people who lived in "third world conditions" end up having cancer/whatever from our signals. Is that fair? Do these people have to wear Farraday Cage Burka everywhere because you want to talk on your cellphone to your girlf....mum?

    Lets just hope the Leader keeps censoring stories about Radio Frequencies for fear that these cults rise up in some sort of christian Jihad against our invisible death ray beams.

    --
    --- ...or a new slashdot signature. Dear aunt, let's set so double the killer delete select all
    1. Re:Sympathy for "hippies" by The_Unforgiven · · Score: 1

      ...How do these people feel about radio waves whizzing through their bodies at the speed of sound? Even if they don't use radios etc because "that Eminem chap swears", the actual transmission zaps through them regardless!

      I, for one, would be very interested to hear that there radio waves passing through me at the speed of sound.

      --
      http://wsulug.org
    2. Re:Sympathy for "hippies" by dafing · · Score: 1

      ok, well speed of light according to this "Yes, all electromagnetic radiation -- from radio waves to x-rays -- travel at the speed of light. " http://www.colorado.edu/physics/2000/waves_particles/lightspeed-1.html for an american site, at least it uses correct units :) It also seems to be formatted for an iPhone? are you interested now?

      --
      --- ...or a new slashdot signature. Dear aunt, let's set so double the killer delete select all
  80. I want to see a blind study by SnapperHead · · Score: 1

    With so many people claiming sickness from wifi we really need some blind studies.

    Take a group of people far into the wilderness with some wifi equipment. Leave them out there for a few days and don't tell them if they equipment is on or off.

    Ask them if they have any headaches or other BS they are claiming. I am willing to bet, in a blind study you will find out that the claims are ridiculous.

    *IF* after a few studies they find it to be true then I would agree with it until then I call BS and ask them to STFU already. :)

    --
    until (succeed) try { again(); }
  81. Electromagnetic pollution flagged 30 yrs ago! by HongPong · · Score: 0, Troll

    Here's the problem folks: the FCC refuses to acknowledge electronic devices' emissions having any effect on the human body besides thermal. I.E. cellphones must only cause your tissue to heat to a certain level. However, the FCC refuses to regulate the other possible effects of this radiation. Period. This, of course, is of pivotal importance to the high tech and telecom industries, because it lets them keep their products within the 'no effects' category without any government intervention.

    Personally, I get dizzy from 45 minute cell phone calls and have to shake it off. By that time the phone is certainly warm. Its other effects? Officially, the government passes the buck!

    Check this: the devious Stanford Research Institute (which was, indeed, contracted by the CIA to do remote viewing research in the 1970s, see Operation STARGATE) wrote a very interesting thing about the "Changing Images of Man," the kind of thing spit out by ominous acid-dropping elite scientist types.
    http://www.skilluminati.com/research/entry/scientists_on_acid_the_story_behind_changing_images_of_man/
    In this marvelous example of 1970s establishmentarian utopianism, there is a good deal of info about studies in "electromagnetic pollution." Think of that: the very phrase is totally alien to us now, even though we are subjected to so much more than we used to be. Their main study cited was about a lady who got schizophrenic-style symptoms; it turned out she had an unshielded power conduit in her wall that was filling her apartment with powerful EM radiation. Once the power conduit was properly shielded, her health problems abated.

    If these cats knew it could affect people then (since of course our bodies operate within a kind of electromagnetic flux), why aren't there more substantive studies today?!

    For some time I had a WiFi router right next to the head of my bed; I would stare at it as it blinked at me, thinking of all the energy going thru my head. I was happy to have it go away. I don't use WiFi in my home, though of course it leaches in. I strongly feel that longterm studies about cellphone use are coming up rather ominous, especially for younger people whose thinner skulls are less resistant to the microwaves. What is everyone going to feel like after 30 years of intense WiFi and especially cellphone exposure?!

  82. Anonymous Coward by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Nice Lebowski reference.

  83. Orogone generators lame. by Fantastic+Lad · · Score: 1

    This would be an example of one of the many New Age gimmicks which serves primarily to make people stop thinking.

    In the box of non-orthodox stuff, there's a fairly stark difference between wishful silliness and truthful ideas. For some reason, people have trouble differentiating between the two. I don't get why. Some things just have that "air of lame", and when you look into them, (as I did with the orogone thing) you find out that, yes, they are indeed lame ducks.

    But that shouldn't make people from turn off. It's the old logical fallacy: "All cows are animals, therefore all animals are cows."

    Or lame ducks.

    Some ducks can fly.

    But you won't know which ones unless you do some exploring!

    After all, learning is fun, and who wants to do as they're told all the time anyway? People are always telling us what is right and wrong to believe and they enforce it with social pressure. Social pressure is for the birds. The lame ones.

    -FL

  84. this is a general statement, noone is pinpointed by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    wow why cant we all just get a long huh? the funny thing is the real hippies from the late 60s are the ones who were expanding there minds and opening up to new ideas to witch we partly owe for today's technology.
    Yes this is my opinion, man!
    sounds like there are some ego problems here! hah LET GO! haha

    peace, love, n happiness,
    some gypsy

  85. Re:this is a general statement, noone is pinpointe by millennial · · Score: 0, Flamebait

    LOL

    The idiots who spent their time getting blazed out of their minds are NOT who we have to thank for modern science. You are *kidding* yourself.

    --
    I am scientifically inaccurate.
  86. Re:this is a general statement, noone is pinpointe by ScrewMaster · · Score: 1

    LOL

    The idiots who spent their time getting blazed out of their minds are NOT who we have to thank for modern science. You are *kidding* yourself.

    Perhaps he just has a lot of faith in his powers of suggestion.

    More likely he just did a little too much acid at Woodstock.

    --
    The higher the technology, the sharper that two-edged sword.
  87. I can out pedant you by NotQuiteReal · · Score: 1

    Sure, those things you mention are part of the popular impression of hippies, but not mine. I tend to thing of them more in terms of the actual dictionary definition, for example. I.e. mostly just anti-establishment, not so much pro-anything.

    So, no, it would not be ironic if they were harmful to your health, merely a coincidence, if not an expected result.

    --
    This issue is a bit more complicated than you think.
  88. shut the fuck up by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I'm glad somebody gets it.

    You can say how there are all sorts of "atrocities by Christians", but what you really mean is "atrocities by people who call themselves Christian."

    There's a huge difference. The Spanish Inquisition (which nobody expects, I know, I know...) runs completely against pretty much every teaching Jesus ever gave.

    If you prefer the wording Raffaello used:

    christians are responsible for numerous and well documented heinous atrocities specifically due to their religion (crusades, inquisition, witch burning, annihilation of heretics, etc.).

    That wasn't specifically due to their religion. It was specifically due to their own warping and perverting of what they liked to call their religion for their own ends.

    jesus christ you're a stupid shitbag

  89. Idle formatting by tehcyder · · Score: 1

    Just as a heads up to whichever genius designs the Idiotpart of slashdot, it's impossible to read in IE7 (at work!) as the nesting keeps squeezing comments into thinne and thinner columns until you end up with one letter per line...
    Another reason not to bother with Idle.

    --
    To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
  90. Scientific evidence on the dangers of RF radiation by Anonymous+Cowherd+X · · Score: 0

    RTFA The Radiation Poisoning Of America. It's based on scientific research done by several reputable scientists and research institutes. Check the NOTES section for a complete list of references.

    If you still believe RF radiation is completely harmless within FCC approved exposure limits, consider this:

    Current FCC exposure limit in the US:
    580 microW / cm^2 = 5.8 W/m^2

    Current exposure limits in Russia for the 0.3-178.4 GHz frequency band (as reported by a friend of mine from Russia who works as a telecommunications engineer on cell phone towers and other types of RF equipment):
    0.1 W/m^2 - for 24 hours at the most
    0.1-1 W/m^2 - for no more than 2 hours
    1-10 W/m^2 - for no more than 10 minutes

    You may also want to know why Microwave ovens were banned in Russia in 1976 and read Dr. Mercola's Ten Reasons to Throw out your Microwave Oven.

    For even more information check Wireless Networks (Wi-Fi): Consumer Health and Safety Advice.

    There you go, scientific evidence as requested.

  91. I'm gettin one o those! by pr0cess · · Score: 1

    Awesome! And maybe we can sell excess positive energy back to the utilities to lower our monthly bill! I'm going out to Home Depot and getting me one of those organ generator thingies tomorrow morning!

  92. hippiehate by mrconformist · · Score: 1

    This blog is for "nerds" as it says right, so i assume that the hippie hate comes from nonhippie-nerds? I guess nerds need to reflect the abuse they received in school onto hippies. I don't claim to be either, but I don't dis either anyhow. Here is an awesome article on Psychic Warfare that actually offers evidence of EMFs affecting pyschic abilities. http://www.brainsturbator.com/articles/psychic_warfare_from_1981_2008/ read that and then tell me that the "hippies are just stoned out of their minds and not in touch with reality." Seriously, being sensitive to the world is not a flaw, but a gateway towards superpowers. heard of a faraday cage? "When you're inside [a Faraday cage], a psychic, for example, has their performance increased by a thousand fold. A Faraday cage shields you from the electromagnetic radio waves, allowing only extremely low frequency (E.L.F.) magnetic waves to get through. I don't think there's a psychic warfare research lab that doesn't make use of them today." --Andrija Puharich, random online interview

  93. Re:Scientific evidence on the dangers of RF radiat by Detritus · · Score: 1

    That's not what I said. I was looking for documented instances of anyone actually cooking their guts, as described in some urban legends.

    I used to regularly get safety bulletins warning employees not to wear contacts while doing electrical work or carry disposable butane lighters while arc welding. The contacts would get stuck to your eyeball and a butane lighter could explode with the force of a quarter-stick of dynamite. All bullshit, but many people, including safety managers, believed it.

    I'm not going to stand in front of a high-power RF emitter. I'd rather be safe then sorry, and I've worked around systems that combined multi-kilowatt transmitters with very high-gain antennas. I'd rather not get premature cataracts or some other injury. I don't worry about cell phones or VHF/UHF hand-held radios, which can often put out 5+ Watts on their high power setting. The only injury that I've seen real documentation on for hand-held radios is the accidental firing of electrical blasting caps that were carried next to a radio that was accidentally switched into transmit mode.

    --
    Mea navis aericumbens anguillis abundat
  94. You posted... by 3.2.3 · · Score: 1

    ...a Fox News story? To Slashdot? Really?

  95. For somebody who studies reiki... by Ehwaz003 · · Score: 1

    ... the usage and theory of chakra's is familiar for me. And still, even I, had a good laugh from this. I've encountered more morons in the alternative religions and therapies then I can count...
    Seriously, the theory is nice, as long as you can keep your reality check mechanism going. But alas, most of them are far off.

    It's NOT a coincidence that people like these shout that Wifi's, DECT's, power lines, etc. hurt their 'inner self', but most of them just talk about it to *sell* an object like the one in the picture with the fine article.

    It's nice to see how much they shout about these negative waves hurting your, but in the same breath they also mention that they happen to have a special device to make it all go away... for the minimum price of half a month's salary.

    *sigh*
    It will never stop. The only enlightment that MOST of those people achieve is making your wallet lighter.

    I dare say that I try to practice it all honestly. If somebody has a headache, I advise them to seek a doctor, if they hear somebody talking in their head, I direct them to a psychologist. I don't start working on chakra's, advice to drink 'healing' water or tell them to meditate daily half an hour before the sun sets.

    There are a lot of coocoo-heads. Too much, if you ask me.

    --
    I give massages and reiki treatments (for real!). More info here: http://www.universele-levensenergie.be
  96. That explains... by A+New+Normalcy · · Score: 1

    ...these symptoms: "headaches, dizziness, nausea, severe tiredness, brain fog, disorientation and loss of appetite, loss of balance, inability to concentrate, loss of creativity" It's affecting me here in SoCal! Brain fog; good line, that!

    --
    ...Lorenzo / I'm into kinky crustaceans. I just discovered internet praWn.
  97. Those transformations sound like... by A+New+Normalcy · · Score: 1

    ...neutrino oscillation.

    --
    ...Lorenzo / I'm into kinky crustaceans. I just discovered internet praWn.
  98. The sun is the primary cause... by A+New+Normalcy · · Score: 1

    ...of the nasty pre-cancerous crappy spots that my dermatologist keeps removing from the skin covering my chakras.

    --
    ...Lorenzo / I'm into kinky crustaceans. I just discovered internet praWn.