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Accidental Wii Suicide
Paul Taylor noted a story that I would have thought to be an April Fool's Day joke a few weeks from now, which makes it only seem more tragic. A 3-year-old shot herself with a gun after mistaking it for a Wii controller.
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This is manslaughter. Whoever left a gun near a 3-year-old needs locking up.
But the fact that there are no charges being pressed enrages me. The article says:
Law Enforcement: If You're a Gun Owner, You Have to Be Responsible
Or what? Someone will shake their finger at you?
Cheyenne Alexis McKeehan was a victim of either neglect, ignorance or willful intent of her stepfather. Which one, no one can ever be sure of. Regardless of the circumstances he improperly stored a loaded handgun in his home in reach of a three year old.
Saying "terrible lapse of judgment" and "be responsible next time" isn't enough for me. This man should be charged with child endangerment so that people take their Second Amendment Rights seriously and responsibly should they choose to exercise them.
Were I a prosecutor, I would push for the jury to see that going through the trouble to find a toy (not regularly distributed commercially here) for your child identical to the loaded handgun that you "happened" to leave on the table one evening is more than suspicious.
If you have children, invest in a home security system before a handgun, folks.
My work here is dung.
Did a dog pop up from behind the bushes and chuckle afterwards?
Why is the Wii controller even mentioned in this freakin' story? The kid shot themselves with a loaded gun left laying around by the parent. This has nothing to do with the Wii, and everything to do with some dumbfuck leaving a loaded gun laying around with a three year old in the house. I don't care what you child does for fun, leaving a loaded gun all willy-nilly where the child can reach it is the height of responsibility.
We don't need gun control, we need idiot control.
Living With a Nerd
See, video game really do make our youth violent.
And they said that the radiation would get to us all.....
in a more serious note, this sucks. Who the hell leaves their gun loaded and out in the open, ESPECIALLY WITH CHILDREN AROUND????
Plus, "The Nintendo game called Wii"... some mighty fine reporting there, lou.
Cheyenne Alexis McKeehan was a girl. Perhaps reading the story, Taco, might have been useful?
Sadly, he is dead and so far as I know, didn't leave a note to tell us what he thought he was doing when he killed himself.
It is pure speculation on the part of interested parties to say that he thought it was Wii contrller.
Nintendo better get a good lawyer. You know they are going to sue.
"I'm not a quack, I'm a mad scientist! There's a difference." - Dr. Cockroach
No, that is NOT A WII ACCIDENT, that is plain stupidity from the parents side.
WTF is wrong with you submitter? This is negligent homicide by the family. They left a loaded, cocked, pistol on a table where a three year old can get it. A three year old does not have a concept of life and death, and does not commit suicide. By throwing around the S-word you're taking the blame off the people it truly belongs to: the parents. People who cannot treat firearms with the respect they deserve should not have them.
Already the news is making an issue out of the fact that it's a Wii-related death. It's not. It's a loaded gun left out in the open. It doesn't matter if the Wii gun "looked" real, it wasn't. You can have a real, pink, Hello Kitty revolver there. It doesn't matter. A loaded and cocked gun was left where a curious child can get it.
A 3 year old had access to a loaded shotgun and shot herself to death with it, yet somehow we obviously know that it was mistaken for a Wii controller?
I don't buy it. Something smells like Jack Thompson.
I went to eat some animal crackers and the box said, "Do not eat if seal is broken." I opened the box and sure enough..
Let me observe one postless day to the memory of this child.
Do you have to be to leave your gun out with people in your home, let alone a child? Dad wasn't allowed to do anything upon entering our home after work, not even take off his shoes or coat, until he walked straight to the safe and put his gun away. If he ever forgot, Mom would have kicked his ass out of the house faster than you can say First Post!
It's good to see that the /. editorial bias is still very much well and truly alive. What's the point of this story (especially posted under games?) if it isn't to exploit one family's tragedy to promote the political ideology of the /. gatekeepers? I guess common decency and good taste are not among their core competencies.
First of all, this wasn't an "accidental suicide", it was an accidental death.
Second of all, putting "wii" in the title is highly misleading and is typical of today's media which is more interested in tabloid journalism, trying to grab everyones attention by assuming all your readers are more responsitive to these kind of headlines.
My respect for Slashdot just went down a few.
Because we all know that is going to happen.
Don't blame the absurd gun laws that allow every douchebag the "right" to bear arms.
Don't blame the neglect, irresponsibility and carelessness of adults in the house.
Ignore the fact that this would only happen in America because of #1.
Blame the Wii because we all know the toy gun accessory it comes with gave the kid the wrong impression.
I feel sorry for the kid and the family.
Video games kill people!
Really? A toddler pulling the trigger of a .380? A toddler?
I smell bullshit.
the parents.
The mother is only speculating why, since she can't ask the kid who's dead.
What about this? She was 3! Three year old like playing with things. They left a loaded gun out in the open. I wouldn't leave an unloaded gun around my 10 year old nephews.
Don't leave guns in the reach of toddlers, especially if you have a toddler living with you. And if you do, remove the ammo from it.
"The agriculture ministry is not in charge of Gundam" - Japanese ministry official.
"Cheyenne Alexis McKeehan of Norene, Tenn., shot herself Sunday night after her stepfather left his loaded Smith & Wesson handgun out on a table, Wilson County Sheriff Terry Ashe said." I think I see where this story went wrong. Seriously, this isn't an accident--- it is a completely avoidable death. What kind of idiot leaves out loaded handguns with children in the house? I hope this guy rots in prison. Further, it wasn't a suicide--- it wasn't the child's attempt to kill herself. Finally, this story has about as much to do with the Wii as it does an NES. How much Wii-shooting can a three-year-old possibly do? I don't think the Wii had anything to do with it--- the kid saw what she thought was a toy, played with it, and now her father's the poster boy for redneck idiots. The connection between "Wii" and "child playing with loaded handgun" is so short that it shouldn't even be news.
No portion of this post may be rebroadcast without the express, written consent of Major League Baseball.
The WiiMote was apparently used inside some I'm assuming 3rd party contraption that looked just liked the real gun. So, ye sit is kinda sorta a Wii story if the girl thought the real gun was indeed her WiiMote gun. Not the Wiimote itself, but the WiiMote inside the gun.
And sorry to go all sexist conspiracy theory, but can a 3 year old girl even pull the trigger of that gun? I have ZERO experience with real handguns but I'm assuming some strength is required to pull the trigger far enough to get it to fire.
I heard about this story a few days ago via Twitter. Apparently, the father heard something outside and took his gun with him to investigate. It turned out to be nothing so he went back to sleep, but not before putting his loaded gun on the coffee table. Wait, I think that needs more emphasis: HE PUT HIS LOADED GUN ON THE COFFEE TABLE.
The next day, the 3 year old was playing, saw the gun, thought it was a game controller and shot himself. Now I'm not a gun owner and I've never even held a gun, much less fired it, but even I know this much about gun safety:
You never leave a gun (especially a loaded gun) someplace where a child can get it!!!!
Why didn't the dad simply put it away? "He was tired" isn't a valid answer. As a parent, I've had plenty of times when I've been tired, but I don't leave weapons lying around when I am. (And having had someone prowling about my house at 2am, I can tell you you tend to get very alert, very fast.) As a parent, your child's safety and well-being is priority #1, even above your own. Losing 10 minutes of sleep while you put the gun away is nothing compared to the risk of your child discovering the loaded gun the next morning before you remember about it.
My sci-fi novel, Ghost Thief, is now available from Amazon.com.
Please note that this was not a licensed Wii controller. People are stupid enough as is; they don't need a confusing headline to help them decide games are evil.
... But you have to read the article to see "Smith and Wesson". Unreal.
I can see where the conversation gets muddy when someone commits a violent act after playing violent video games. Not saying anything about that beyond that its at least an interesting topic. But when a TODDLER finds a LOADED GUN ON A COFFEE TABLE and SHOOTS HERSELF WITH IT are we really going to try to blame it on VIDEO GAMES?!?!?!
Why stick up for big business?
It seems clear the family were a bunch of gun-nuts. They purposly sought out a realistic looking gun controller for use a by a 3 year old, when all the quality stuff in normal shops is made of white plastic and looks nothing like a real gun.
Then they leave a real gun, with the safety of, loaded through, ready to fire on a table with a kid.
What part of this doesn't shout dysfunctional family to you? But don't worry, the lawyer will blame all this on video games.
And the gun nuts will explain just how safe guns really are, because they ain't as nutty as this guy was. Nope, they are responsible gun nuts.
MMO Quests are like orgasms:
You may solo them, I prefer them in a group.
I have a rifle. There's this little thing called a trigger lock you can buy... you can also slide the breech out, remove the firing pin assembly and store it separately in your sock drawer or something. Then you can stuff the ammo in your mattress.
An IQ test should be part of the purchase process for a firearm.
Don't kid yourself. It's the size of the regexp AND how you use it that counts.
If this gets a lot of attention, I can see Nintendo suing the parents. To my knowledge, there isn't a single Wii accessory that looks like a realistic gun. And aren't there laws about certain features toy guns need to have (bright orange plastic, et cetera) anyway?
Also, when is this idiot (the stepfather) going to be charged with manslaughter?
Something doesn't make sense.
Firstly, they have a Wii controller that looks like a very realistic imitation of a real gun.
Secondly, this is a controller that you have to actively make an effort to go out, find, and buy, because you would never find it through regular channels.
Thirdly, the father is claming that he had no idea that they owned such a controller, or even any knowledge of what games the child is playing. What the hell kind of game does a 3 year old play that requires a realistic gun controller? Grand Theft Stroller?
Either the parents are grossly incompetent and stupid, or they're incompetent and stupid AND they're trying to mollify their guilty conscience by putting some of the blame on a video game accessory that they should never have owned to begin with.
I guarantee the parent is already feeling more remorse than you ever will in your life, and I guarantee he will never be irresponsible with firearms again in his entire life.
But no, that's not enough for a tough guy like you -- you won't be happy until he's rotting away in prison with people who actually WILL pose a threat to others for the rest of their lives.
What exactly do you hope to accomplish with prison? Revenge? How cute.
Well because I am a sane individual I would say the "blame" if there must be some lies with the person that left a loaded, cocked gun with the safety off, lying about where a toddler could reach it..
I can hardly blame a toy manufacturer for making a replica.
"The fact that there are things like this Wii toy that look like guns, make it all the more important for the adults to keep the guns away from the children," said Paul Helmke, president of the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence. "Keep it locked up, keep it secure, or don't have it at all."
Why does that make it more important? I fail to see how leaving a loaded weapon in reach of a child can be less important in any way.
And the idiot who left a loaded gun on the table for the kid to play with deserves something slightly more serious than a "you have to be responsible" lecture. Like 20 years in prison, for example.
the toddler in TFA is a referd to as shooting herself, not himself...
People, what a bunch of bastards
From TFA: "The unfortunate thing is that this Nintendo game called Wii had what looks like a solid black, basically automatic-looking type mechanism that operates the game,"
No, the unfortunate thing is that the fucking gun was left out in the first place. Would the child still have shot herself if the gun was left out and they didn't even own a Wii? The anti-gun/anti-vidya game loons are gonna have a field day with this one...
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Cheyenne Alexis McKeehan of Norene, Tenn., shot herself Sunday night after her stepfather left his loaded Smith & Wesson handgun out on a table, Wilson County Sheriff Terry Ashe said.
Cheyenne's mother told police officers that the child was used to playing a shooting game with the Nintendo Wii video game console and likely confused the real gun with the realistic-looking black toy gun, the sheriff said.
Not his offspring.
And I just love how the child's mother jumped to suggest the possibility that the kid confused the real gun with a toy - defending her man. And herself.
Cheyenne's stepfather, Douglas Cronberger, 32, owned a semi-automatic pistol that he normally kept in a secure location, out of the reach of Cheyenne and the couple's 1-year-old child, Ashe said.
But after taking it out to investigate a possible prowler, Cronberger left it on a table and forgot about it, officials said.
When Cheyenne fired the gun, Ashe said, her mother, Tina Ann Cronberger, 32, was within three feet of her child.
Cheyenne was pronounced dead on arrival at a local hospital.
You see officer, I was about to shoot someone lurking in the bushes. Turns out it was just the wind. So I left the gun on the coffee table. Just in case. Aaand... I forgot about it.
And my wife is so used to our kids holding guns, she didn't even bother to move when her daughter picked it up.
Don't worry. We will be more careful with the spare child.
This one belongs to both of us.
Dead one was my wife's.
Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens
No, the unfortunate thing is that her brain-dead redneck father left a loaded handgun sitting on a table unsupervised and within reach of a three-year-old child.
SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
I'm with the crew that says this doesn't add up.
1) Stepfather goes out of his way to buy obscure Wii controller that looks like the handgun he owns
2) Stepfather leaves loaded gun on coffee table in the living room, presumably where the Wii controllers sit. (Not in the bedroom, not on a shelf, etc. Even if he's lazy, you would probably leave a loaded gun somewhere other than your living room.)
3) Stepfather leaves the gun on the coffee table with a round in the chamber and the hammer cocked. (This is important because a 3 year old probably wouldn't have the strength to overcome the hammer action and pull the trigger otherwise.)
Too many "coincidences" here. That's all I'm saying.
Saw it on 4chan first. /.
Getting sloppy
Divorced guys know ALL about this scenario.
The ex's new boyfriend doesn't have the fact that they are his kids programmed into him 24/7
http://slashdot.org/~GuyFawkes/journal
Is this another attempt to blame a death on games?
For those who managed to wipe out their offspring in bizarre and unusual ways.
Deleted
Let's get this out of our systems: The parents were horribly irresponsible and deserve to be charged with some kind of crime. In most states (including mine) it is a felony to leave a weapon where a minor can gain access to it.
That being said, as a responsible gun owner, I don't like my son to have guns as toys. Toy guns are safe. Toy guns never hurt anybody. Toy guns teach every bad habit that gun safety teaches you not to do. Kids literally think guns are toys and can be handled cavalierly.
From the time he could talk I have drilled my son that when he sees a gun, what does he do? "Run away and tell a grown up." What if your friend wants to pick it up? "Run away and tell a grown up." What if your friend has it first and wants to show you? "Run away and tell a grown up."
They even show a picture of the gun (along with the lifelike Wii gun). http://a.abcnews.com/images/Technology/abc_pistol_100309_mn.jpg
You're gonna die from a hearth attack or a stroke. Possibly cancer.
Stress does that to ya.
Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens
A 3 year old knows the difference between a real gun, and a lightweight plastic controller. According to the parents, the gun was sitting on the table for a whole day. In a little trailer.
Apparently, loaded, cocked, and with the safety off. And then the little girl pointed it at herself and pulled the trigger? Sounds dubious to me that someone who has spent years with guns doesn't know that you don't point it at yourself.
But even if thats the case it was negligent homicide - you don't forget to keep a loaded, cocked, and ready to fire weapon out for an entire day, in plain view.
I wouldn't be shocked if the autopsy shows no signs of gun powder residue on her hands/arms, and it turns out that the father shot her, and they made up a BS story to cover.
1. A felony gun charge means this man won't ever be able to legally own a gun again. That's a good thing as far as I can tell.
2. More news coverage, which means more reminders to gun owners to be responsible.
3. More news coverage, which reminds society of the dangers of firearms, and helps us continue the debate about "a well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."
4. Remember, it wasn't his child. He was the stepfather. Nearly all parents love their own children with everything they've got. Stepparents -- not so much.
Lots of parents are criminally negligent to children they love. It doesn't change the state's responsibility to society as a whole, as well as to the children in the home. This man will still live with at least one other child (a 1 year old). He's clearly not fit to live in a home with children. Yes Martha, any responsible gun owner will tell you that this situation is absolutely impossible for a responsible gun owner. Left it on a table? Forgot about it? Nonsense. As soon as the threat is mitigated, you return that firearm to a holster, and then to a locked cabinet. No exceptions, not ever.
Support a few technologists in Washington.
You can modify guns to reduce the trigger pull to nearly nothing. Or they can wear down so the spring doesn't offer as much resistance. Or you can have an old revolver with a lousy safety that doesn't put a physical barrier between the hammer and the cartridge, so that dropping it upside-down on a hard floor will set it off. Yes, metal guns are noticeably heavy, but so are cats and dogs, and toddlers haul them around all the time. Purely hypothetically, it's possible for a toddler to haul a loaded, chambered .38 off a table and either pull a soft trigger or drop it on the ground where it discharges into them. This is why every gun safety course I know has a section on storage, and how cardboard boxes aren't sufficient.
It's the parent's fault no matter how you look at it, but "never attribute to malice what can be adequately explained by stupidity," right?
No OS on the planet can protect itself from a user with the admin password. - Yvan256
Obviously the gun should have been locked up and the parents are horribly horribly negligent. But I am also curious why the toddler shot herself with the gun. Was she just fumbling with it or are you supposed to shoot yourself in the game? Also, what was mom doing 3 feet from the child while this was occuring?
Finally, a loaded .380 S&W feels a lot different from a Wii controller. I am impressed a 3 year old could even pick it up.
No shurikens?
Hide in the shadows and throw them at the burglars without showing yourself.
On a plus side - they are silent so you won't disturb the neighbors.
Just remember to buy a meat grinder or two so you can feed the corpses to your pet piranhas.
Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens
It took me a few seconds to figure out which was the controller. A picture of the controller, and the model pistol the father owns Granted I'm from the UK and have never seen a gun like that up close, but the realism of that unit is scary.
The dad was an idiot, though. I don't see him recovering. As for it being accidental? I couldn't speculate, but to all of the people saying that a kid couldn't pull the trigger... Kids have two hands, remember?
Finally had enough. Come see us over at https://soylentnews.org/
But how can you confuse a metallic looking hand gun for a Wii remote?
The parents apparently aren't too bright to leave a loaded gun around.
The kid appears to have not been to bright to confuse Shiney Metal Thing for a Wii remote.
Mean as it is, isn't this natural selection at work?
My sympathy I assure you, but something has to filter the Idiocracy out.
"The kid didn't know any better" isn't an excuse.
The kids should have known better and that is the parent's fault. Stupid breeds stupid. Fact proven once again in a sorrowful incident.
Parent's at fault, punishment: sterilization seems appropriate and living the rest of their existence knowing they got their own child killed; and society has deemed them to stupid to have another child. It's a win-win for the rest of humanity.
I am an ass I guess, but having kids is a privledge, not a right and allowing stupid people to breed isn't doing anyone any good, expecially the kids that suffer their negligence.
-=[ Who Is John Galt? ]=-
"The unfortunate thing is that this Nintendo game called Wii had what looks like a solid black, basically automatic-looking type mechanism that operates the game," [the Sheriff] said. (from the article)
What? That's the unfortunate thing? What about the stupidity of leaving a gun out? Or having a gun in the same house as a toddler? Am I the only one who thinks that once again someone tries to pin a death to a game rather than than weapons or people?
I'm wondering if the media are once again gonna start the usual "Videogames kill people" shitstorm. I'd love to see them label the Wii of all things a "training simulator for murder" etcetc. Would be damn funny to watch.
Is 12 months too early to teach their remaining child about gun safety?
Or should they wait until it grasps basic language and concepts like "bad" and "wrong"?
When exactly does that happen?
Obviously not at 3(2) years, or their daughter may would have been alive now.
Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens
In the face of an absolute tragedy, the journalism is almost as bad. Using these sort of horrible incidents and making absurd connections to gain hits/views/attention on a news article is absurd.
"Three year old shoots self with gun" or "Nintendo causes kid to commit suicide" .. one is a more accurate description of a real event, and one is journalism exploitation.
If you own a gun, you don't leave it near a kid. A kid means anyone not responsible enough to know the consequences of pulling its trigger -- this may mean up to 18 years old, if the situation so warrants. To leave a real gun, loaded and ready for shooting, within reach of a three year old should be a criminal offense. The father didn't pull the trigger, but he might as well have.
Ever see a three year old? Ever see a three year old pull/grab/touch/suck/eat/play with EVERYTHING in sight?
This happened in Tennessee. It was the step-father's gun. Also, if the kid was familiar with gun use because of Wii, shouldn't the TV be dead instead of the kid? The guy claims he heard a prowler, so why did he cock the gun unless he had actually encountered an intruder? It seems to me that either this guy was high (paranoia could easily explain the cocked gun, and the supidity necessary to put said gun within reach of the kid), or lacks the minimum IQ that should be necessary for gun ownership. Either way, something is seriously wrong in that trailer park (check the video).
The story is trying to give Nintendo bad press and is largely trying to connect the dots and rationale of a toddler "suicide" to the video game console when in reality, it was some idiot being negligent with a firearm. The story should read, "Another Idiot Negligent w/ Firearm." Period.
yeah, because her dad is probably really well right now.
He's an idiot, but I dunno if he really needs jail. I'm sure the loss of his child is punishment enough.
I can't imagine how terrible being in his situation would be, sounds worse than jail.
Stupidity is indeed a crime; just watch Cops or look at what's in prison. This guy's stupidity actually got somebody killed.
What happens if you don't have both hands free so you can chamber a round while fending off an assailant with the other hand?
Use your teeth to cock the gun.
Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens
This man makes a horrible mistake that will likely haunt him and his family forever, and all some of the people here can say is "I'm upset that he hasn't been charged," or "he should be locked up."
Because that's the solution here...For the state to lock the guy up. Yeah, because incarceration has worked so well to fix all of the problems in our utopia called America.
As if jail time going to bring the girl back, or undo what happened.
It was a horrible accident, and yeah, as a gun owner the man should have known better - but accidents happen. People forget to follow proper procedure on occasion, and on this occasion that error led to this accident.
Trust me, if there was anything fishy about this situation or about this guy they would have him locked up.
The parents should be left alone. The LAST thing they need is for the state lock them up after something like this happens - there is no worse punishment than what they are already going through.
Then I am sure we'll have the usual crowd ready to throw all of our rights under the bus with the tired, old, ridiculous "let's ban guns" argument - you know, because criminals that are ready to kill or rob or break every law inm the book will definitely decide to obey a new gun law because.......because why?
The only thing that I would hope for out of all of this is that it serves as a sobering reminder how very important safety and following procedure is when you are dealing with any tool that has the capacity to kill or maim (firearms, vehicles, power tools, electricity, etc)...
In addition to firearms safety, this is as much about home safety and "childproofing" as it is anything else.
Do you have to be to annoy all of us by starting your comment in the subject line? Shame on the mods that gave you points.
It's possible (I don't know, just guessing) that someone's trying to make the point that, if you have young kids and game controllers that look like guns, your kids will first learn that all guns are toys. I suspect it's better to teach kids that all guns are dangerous (first) and then later teach them that toy guns are not dangerous in some situations. (Some situations: e.g. don't point a toy gun at a Police Officer or other armed person.)
Not citing any legitimate law codes, but a quick search of google relates that in the state of TN there is no law against leaving a gun out and accessible to a child. So before the "why didn't they lock him up" questions fly (too late by now, I'm sure), that would be because it doesn't appear to be against the law.
Search for child access prevention in the page
OK, so what Wii game involves pointing the gun at yourself? It doesn't sound like much fun (remind me not to buy it). Does the controller even work when you point it at yourself?
The only thing being "used to playing a Wii game" should have taught this child is which end goes forward! And that is should be pointed at the evil brainless beings.
The fact that the Wii is even mentioned at all in this tragedy just boils down to human beings natural instinct to try and deflect some of the blame/responsibility when they screw up.
-hps
I have some questions here
1st, who in their right minds leaves a loaded gun on a table?
2nd, who leaves a loaded gun on a table with a 3 year old in the house?
3rd, who lets a 3 old play shooting games?
4th, who lets that 3 old play shooting games with a gun-shaped controller?
5th, who makes a gun shaped controller for a Wii?! It's a platform mainly aimed at KIDS!!!
This points to a real issue with the 2nd amendment (rights to bear arms bit) - maybe people like this step-dad should no longer be legally a person, and thus not allowed to bear arms. Let's legally call him a Retard, or something. Seems fitting.
There's no way a 3 year old could pick up a gun, hold it, and pull the trigger. They are heavy and made for adult-sized hands. I call bullsh*t...
I am not aware of any games for the Wii that teach all of those skills, let alone at a level that a three-year-old could likely comprehend and manage. Perhaps they have access to some Wii titles I am not familiar with?
Oh, wait. The gun was left laying around loaded, cocked, and ready to fire within reach of the three-year-old . It's good to see that we are properly placing blame where it belongs - on Nintendo, of course.
Damn_registrars has no butt-hole. Damn_registrars has no use for a butt-hole.
What if the guy walked away from his car, and his step-kid hopped in, started it up, and killed herself in a crash? That's more like the situation here.
Constitutionally Correct
Just pointing out that article leaves out mention that the gun was normally kept in a safe, but there had been a prowler around the house earlier in the evening.
I'm sorry for the kid, but parents stupid enough to leave a loaded gun at reach of a 3 year old (and then blame a wii controller!) should have died long time ago leaving no offspring.
Grimbleton, I see that name all over this thread. You're one of those redneck NRA type gun-lover that posts stupid comments going against all common sense. Just keep your guns lying around like you do, maybe you'll provide us with some entertainment when you show up in the Darwin Awards for killing yourself or shooting your balls off by accident. You will make a mistake sooner or later and I just hope it's you who will suffer from this and not your or anothers innocent child. The kind of comments you make show me you think lightly of guns, which pretty much guarantees that you will fuck up one day or another... think about that. Do you think the danger you need defense from 24/7 is more likely to kill you than your own gun with this dumbass attitude?
There were 40,150 vehicular deaths in 1993 as well.
Guns are about the right to self-defense. You know, protecting the right to life itself. Cars are "only" about the right to travel freely.
Constitutionally Correct
IANAL but I'm pretty sure the courts refer to this as "mitigating circumstances" during sentencing...
:(){
"In the United States, he said, a gun in the home is 21 times more likely to injure a family member than protect the home from intruders. " He didn't mention that this statistic is mainly made up of intentional homicides. IE Husband shoots wife for insurance money. The actual accidental death by a toddler with a firearm is overshadowed by the amount of children drowning in swimming pools.
I don't have kids yet myself, but I do own several guns. I grew up in a household with guns. My father grew up in a household with guns. My mother grew up in a household with guns. Three of my grandparents grew up in households with guns. The other thing all these households had in common was gun safety. As a small child, I never saw any of my family's guns left unsecured outside the direct control of an adult. Even before I was old enough to be shooting/hunting, gun safety was paramount. All of my father's guns had trigger locks and were kept in safes. The ammunition was never stored with the gun (and they were never loaded, and CERTAINLY never had a round chambered... "the bullet doesn't go in the gun until you intend to use it"), and was itself locked up well out of the reach of any children. There was a gun kept in my parents' bedroom, but it was similarly locked, secured, and unloaded. I was taught gun safety, my younger sister was taught gun safety. Any time other children were over, the last step before they came was always a security check on all the guns, and making sure nothing was in view that might get kids even curious about the presence of guns. None of us has ever had an issue (and by the way, I'm a big fan of shooter and other video games including violence, and I never confused my duck hunt gun with any of the real guns lying around, so that's just absurd).
When (responsible) parents have toddlers around the house they go through great pains to make sure kitchen sinks are locked, glassware and other breakables are well out of reach, and any of the countless other hazardous and quite potentially lethal things are inaccessible to children. The carving knife in the wood block on the counter is a good analog, and we don't hear nearly as many stories of children hurting themselves with them. Why don't parents take the same precautions with guns? This isn't about the child thinking it's a toy, this was about the parent (ok, step-parent) thinking it was a toy.
Like you're the only man who never made any mistake? Who the fuck mods this idiot up???
The Wii is relevant because the kid thought she was going for a control
Is that not a bit presumptuous? Does anybody know for sure what the child thought? Maybe the article is being written by somebody is against violent video games.
Weirdly, it's possible that punishment is something he needs right now. Punishment by an external entity might make it possible for him to live with himself.
realize that there are people who do stuff like the following:
[WARNING GRAPHIC]
http://4gifs.com/gallery/v/AnimatedHorrors/Murdered_in_woods.gif.html
http://johnjacobh.wordpress.com/category/merced-pitchfork-murders/
http://www.jpfo.org/filegen-a-m/deathgc.htm#chart
and you will realize having a loaded weapon at all times is the only option
A terrible accident. When kids are around your gun should always be either on your person or in a safe. If the father was investigating someone walking around the property he definitely should have kept it on him afterwards in case there was someone up to no good. Beyond that though, and kid old enough to be playing shooting games and in a family that shoots knows the difference between a real guy and a toy or at least should. So, double fail on the parents for not drilling firearms safety into their 3 year old who they allowed to play shooting games, but 3 seems a bit young to be shooting anyhow.
Bottom line though is government has no business prosecuting this family. It's a terrible loss and his loss is enough. Punishment for the sake of punishment, or money grabs by government are not going to change what is already done. This is a personal matter and a terrible shame, I'm sure the parents have learned from this.
Is there any Wii accessory that looks anything like a real hand gun, even a little? I have the "gun" attachment from the Link game and it looks more like a shower head than a hand gun.
I'm picking up your sarcasm.
No, gun ownership is not a "god given right". It is, however, a Constitutional right (which for all intents and purposes is the same thing). This has been upheld by the Supreme Court time and time again.
It's interesting to note that while gun ownership is a Constitutional right, having children is not. Therefore, I believe that it might be appropriate to require that aspiring parents take a test to demonstrate that they are capable and knowledgeable enough to bring a child into a world with firearms. If they refuse to take this test or fail it (as the dolts in this story clearly would have), then perhaps they should not be allowed to have children. This is a basic issue of the enumerated rights listed in the United States Constitution, and it's time to ask ourselves if we take them seriously.
The unfortunate thing is that this Nintendo game called Wii had what looks like a solid black, basically automatic-looking type mechanism that operates the game,
No, the unfortunate thing is that there was a goddamned loaded gun in reach of a toddler! The owner of the gun should be in prison! The controller shape is questionable, yes, but the blame lies squarely on the gun owner's ridiculous negligence.
You are not the customer.
Are you saying but for the fact that you would be punished via jail time, that having your child killed is not deterrent enough? Wow.
TODO: create/find/steal funny sig.
FTA "The unfortunate thing is that this Nintendo game called Wii had what looks like a solid black, basically automatic-looking type mechanism that operates the game,"
I like to leave prescription drugs in a big bowl with "candy" written on the side. If any kids die of an overdose I'll blame the pharmaceutical companies.
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Here's the Semi Auto Pistol Hand Gun Adapter for Wii Remote. It's not even a controller; it's just a case that fits over the standard controller. From some angles it looks very real.
Once you see the detailed photos, it's clear how a kid might point at himself, looking for the Wii controls. On the gun/controller, there are the usual Wii buttons visible on top. On the real gun, of course, there's just the slide.
What does this have do to with a Wii, is there a game where you are suppose to pick something up and shoot yourself?
This story belongs under "editorials" not "games". It is expressing the opinion that someone has that this death was related to the Wii. There is not a shred of evidence that this would not have happened had the family not owned a Wii.
When a child burned down the family trailer after watching Beavis and Butt-Head, cooler heads eventually prevailed and realized that the cartoon didn't have anything to do with the fact that the mother of the child was an idiot. While Beavis and Butt-head were never the same afterwards, we collectively came to realize that the cartoon was not actually at fault.
Similarly we need to collectively come to realize that the Wii is not at fault in this child's death. Nintendo did not put a loaded gun within reach of a three-year-old. And the opinion that a three-year-old learned unsafe gun manners from a game console is not news for the slashdot front-page; rather it is an opinion that deserves to be recognized as such.
Damn_registrars has no butt-hole. Damn_registrars has no use for a butt-hole.
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I think the important thing here (aside from the tragedy of a 3 year old's death, of course) is that tfa is actually placing blame where blame is due. They haven't blamed the games, they've blamed the parent (or step-parent) for leaving the loaded gun on the table. They don't even mention what "shooting" game the 3 year old was used to playing, although, should a 3 year old really be playing any shooting game? Reminds me of the old "Daddy can I play?" difficulty setting on Doom or Duke Nukem or Wolfenstein (I don't remember which one).
Tragedy. Truly.
"Don't meddle in the affairs of a patent dragon, for thou art tasty and good with ketchup." ~ohcrapitssteve
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Comment removed based on user account deletion
Interesting how they seem to be emphasizing that the toy was too realistic looking instead of the fact that a loaded gun was left within reach of a THREE YEAR OLD. It doesn't matter whether the child would or would not have been able to tell the difference between a toy and a real gun. At that age, do you really think that knowledge would have stopped her from picking it up and playing with it? From the three year olds I have observed, I would say No. This will be ridiculous if the parents try to turn this into a lawsuit against Nintendo or the manufacturer of the controller.
1. Who lets a 3 yr old play with a FPS that uses realistic guns? 2. Who leaves guns out around a 3 yr old? 3. Who the hell blames the video game for points 1 & 2?
~corporate tool, but employed~
I've been spending a lot of time with lots 2-3 year olds lately. With that day-to-day experience fresh in my mind, I can report they aren't usually a bunch of drooling morons. They're just little uneducated and irrational people. They may not comprehend death, but they definitely comprehend "this could hurt me or break something".
I saw a class full of 2 year olds see what happens when you drop a glass cup in a sink. Now they all use plastic or paper cups in the sink, and I never see them taking a glass one over. I figure a gun going off would make an impression equal to a glass breaking.
If you tell them something is dangerous, demonstrate the fact such that it sinks in, they usually don't do it again. Usually.
WTF is up with the title?????
This is a NOT a frikkin suicide !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
This is a TODDLER (THREE YEARS OLD) who shot himself when the IDIOT parents left a real LOADED gun out.
Get the facts straight
I hate to say it, but parents have been known to murder their young children, and I have to doubt that a three year old could easily operate a real gun. As another poster pointed out: the gun would not only have to be loaded, and within easy reach of a 3 year old, but most likely: the safety would have to be off, a round would have to chambered, and the the gun would have to be cocked as well.
real gun control is when a gun owner controls the gun 24/7/365 in all aspects including who can access it and who can't. Nintendo is not to blame, nor is the controller manufacture for making a realistic looking video game accessory. society as a whole needs to learn not to jump to conclusions quickly, and that every situation is different. maybe every child should be brought to the firing range and shown how permanent the affects of pulling the trigger can be?
Darwinism in action. For the parent's new-found lack of offspring.. not the kid.
... /.ers are actually thinking of the children, and not making lame OMGWTF jokes....
Blame the Wii. It's all the Wii's fault isn't it? I bet this kids was destined to play Grand Theft Auto/ steal cars and kill hookers too. A tragedy indeed that they let their kid play with a gun-shaped controller, shooting things on the TV. I won't let my 8 year old do it.
A tragedy that there was a lapse of judgment to leave a gun out, LOADED and the safety OFF. I'm not pleased in any way this kid died because of her parents, but I'm glad the Mom had to witness first-hand her and her husband's own idiocy.
If guns kill people do Pencils misspell words? Think about it.
The gun doesn't kill but the guy behind the trigger. I say resuscitate the toddler and give him the chair!
I know I will burn in violent flames for this. But karma really is irrelevant here.
We'll hear people defending arms with: "You need a gun in case of self-defence.", "It's a fundamental right for it is in the constitution.", "Speaking loud is in many ways ruder that carrying a gun." or "If we outlaw them only criminals will have guns." Old hat.
In many ways the USA people set an example to the world. Science, free speech, entrepreneurship and lots of other fields. But when it comes to guns the majority of the USA people completely loose it. It doesn't get into their heads that loosely controlled gun possession and violent deaths are stronger linked together than pollution and climate change.
In civilised countries you are hardly ever attacked and hence you don't need guns for self defence. Your constitution was written in a completely different era. It would take time but eventually very few guns will be in circulation and even criminals will use guns less and less.
Go on, call me a tree hugging hippy. Easy enough. But don't escape from the fact that many lives could be spared if the US people wouldn't allow themselves to be played by the gun lobby. Us living outside the US can only observe and see the lunacy. I distract myself from occurrences like this one either through very dark, bitter and cynical jokes or through a sad, respectful silence. I now will choose the latter.
I hadn't the slightest objection to his spending his time planning massacres for the bourgeoisie... (P.G. Wodehouse)
The family's story about this incident doesn't really ring true.
While a 3 year old might mistake a real gun for a video-game controller, the feel, heft and pull strength required to hold and fire it is beyond most adults who aren't used to it, much less a diapered toddler.
Sounds like a case for CPS to me.
Of course the liberals want to punish the step father and mother for exercising their God-given, American right to do whatever the f**k they want to do, whenever they want, regardless of the consequences.
What if a burglar had come in and the 3 year old had shot the criminal? Well, that'd be a much nicer story that the NRA could hang their hat on.
No, instead she decides to become a poster-girl for tha anti-gun, obama-facsists. This child needs to be punished in some way, but of course, she took the easy way out and avoided the consequences of her actions... typical liberal.
Was the gun hers? No. Therefore, she got what was coming.
Case closed.
All the posters arguing for no punishment of the parents have the same argument: No punishment is worse that that of losing a child.
And I agree because I would feel that way and obviously those making the argument would have the same feelings.
But that doesn't mean that all parents have those feelings. Some parents torture, mutilate and kill their children. I couldn't imaging doing that to a child; neither could you.
But yet some parents do horrible things to children. The "punishment enough" argument is fallacious. This should not be about punishment, and using "punishment enough" to ignore the problem is as bad as the original act itself.
Clearly in all cases of this kind, the parent has failed and society has an interest in some appropriate intervention to correct the parent and protect other children.
"I believe in Karma. That means I can do bad things to people all day long and I assume they deserve it." : Dogbert
Whether he feels bad about it or not there should be a severe punishment for this level of recklessness, negligence and stupidity.
Exactly. Using that judgment, every person who recklessly drives and kills someone should be let off the hook because "they feel horrible about it." The same analogy can be used for any other situation where someone feels remorse for their actions.
That would be a good analogy if the stepfather had recklessly shot and killed someone. This case is more like leaving a car unattended and unlocked with the keys in the ignition.
It's still a very stupid and dangerous thing to do when there are children around, but arguably it's akin to leaving any other dangerous items (e.g. knives, power tools, meds, etc.) around or having a swimming pool easily accessible. Far more kids drown every year than are shot. :-(
My thoughts when I read this were more along the lines of the following:
If the kid was playing with realistic-looking toy guns (rather than the more common fake-looking toy guns) in a household where real guns are available, one might assume it was because the parents wanted the kid to be familiar with firearms and firearm safety. Why else would the parents go out of their way to get such a realistic-looking toy gun?
I would not have been at all surprised if the child had shot the TV (that is, if she had fired the gun like she played with the Wii game gun). The fact that she actually shot herself leads me to suspect that she may have had more trouble with the real gun (gun weight and trigger weight) than she was accustomed with the toy gun, and in trying to get it to "work", ended up concentrating more on pulling the trigger than where the gun was pointing.
That, of course, is pure speculation; but if it is close to the truth it would be both tragic and ironic, but not necessarily reckless (because the parents would have been trying to familiarize the child with guns). :-(
I have daughter a bit younger than the girl in question. I also happen to own several firearms which spend the vast majority of their time locked up in a safe.
I do not have ANY toy guns in the house. Period. Precisely for this reason. That includes my Wii for which I would find shooting games fun.
This is a mistake preventable on a number of levels. Loaded firearms should either be on your person or locked up, never anywhere in between. And, no gun is a toy until a child is able to understand the difference between the two.
"Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives" should be a convenience store, not a government agency.
Here are a couple of links to the local newspaper that broke the story. Interestingly, they're far less sensationalist than the national coverage.
http://www.tennessean.com/article/20100309/NEWS01/3090354/Wilson-County-child-s-shooting-death-blamed-on-gun-Wii-mix-up
http://www.tennessean.com/article/20100308/NEWS03/100308009/Accidental+shooting+kills+Wilson+County+child
Something tells me they were doing it wrong.
Suicide: a person who kills himself intentionally
[wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn]
This is not a suicide. I doubt a 3 year old had it so rough that they felt they just had to end it all.
http://xkcd.com/558/
The difference between a white toy with an orange tip and a black can't-buy-in-this-country fake gun is the difference between a sip of wine and 30 seconds with your daughter and a bottle of gin and a night with her.
What part of this is right? Having a loaded gun in the house with a 3 year old? An unsupervised 3 year old? A 3 year old playing video games? Horrible.
-- Prepared at the direction of, or to be sent to Legal Counsel, in anticipation of litigation. Attorney Client Pri
My grandfather spent part of his 20s traveling around Europe killing fascists with a belt-fed machine gun. When I was little, less than 10 years old, I pointed some toy gun at him, a pop-gun or something -- you know, one of those toy guns with a cork in the barrel attached to a string or whatever.
He took me aside and calmly told me "don't ever point a gun at someone unless you plan to shoot them."
Some lessons you learn and never forget, and I'm glad I learned that particular lesson in that particular way. Some things just aren't worth messing around with, no matter how small a chance it is to go wrong.
This story is simply awful, and it has nothing to do with how realistic the Wii gun looks. Guns are fascinating to people of all ages, even three year olds, even with objects that may only vaguely or symbolically resemble guns. I wish there were more emphasis among gun owners in America on the "well-regulated" part of the second amendment, and not in a banning-every-gun kind of way.
I think they have materials for kids even that young. The NRA program is really good and Eagle Eddie himself never promotes guns, touches a gun, holds a gun, or anything else. I know some shrill critics say he's the NRA's Joe Camel, but that's BS, Joe Camel smokes cigarettes and Eagle Eddie is banned from ever holding a gun in any program materials.
The program is "if you see a gun, Stop, Don't Touch, Leave the Area, and Tell an Adult."
They have great coloring books and sticker sheets that go with this. Please parents, none of these materials promote the NRA or guns in any way, they simply are to keep kids safe. I am not even a member of the NRA. Please promote these programs in your schools and homes, even if you don't own a gun, a lot of your neighbors do.
How is this a wii accident? It's a weapon accident for crying out loud! And who is to say he mistook it for a controller?
Two points:
1) Replace "gun" with "bottle of poison that looks like a fruit drink", and it's pretty clear that the parents should be charged with criminal neglect.
2) How do you know (other than the bullet) what was going through the 3 year old's brain when he picked up the gun? If guns were laying around a lot, maybe he wanted to play with a real one.
This isn't about a "Wii suicide", since it is unlikely the 3 year old was trying to kill himself. It also isn't about the Wii or even guns. It's about irresponsible parents who leave dangerous objects laying around within the reach of a 3 year old.
By that reasoning, we wouldn't need speed limits. If dying in an accident does not scare people to drive safely, getting a speeding ticket wouldn't either.
The question is that deterrence depends on how likely is the punishment, not on how harsh it would be. Many drivers, particularly those with unsafe habits, do not think they could ever get into a deadly accident, but getting a speeding ticket is highly probable in some roads.
In the same way, almost no one who owns a gun thinks a shooting accident could happen the way he handles his guns. Having a high probability of getting a stiff punishment for unsafe gun handling would be a better deterrent than a possible death by accident. If people would get jail time for any accidental gun discharge or for letting a child get caught carrying a gun that would be a much greater incentive for safe gun handling than occasionally reading about a death by gun accident.
Wii controllers don't kill people, people kill people.
This was a CHILD, who didn't know any better. If the kid had accidentally shot his parents and they died for being stupid enough to leave a loaded weapon near their 3 year old, that would be Darwin award worthy....
Here's to the crazy ones
This story should not have the Darwin tag. The moron with the gun was a stepfather, therefore the girl did not have his genes. To make a judgment on the stupidity of a three-year old is unfair. She wasn't stupid so much as naive. Anyone else with me?
He's an idiot, but I dunno if he really needs jail. I'm sure the loss of his child is punishment enough.
That's for a judge to decide. There is no excuse for leaving a loaded firearm lying around a young child. None. End of discussion.
Just because he feels terrible (and while likely, we don't actually know if he does - it was a stepfather so it wasn't even his kid) doesn't mean he should be excused from punishment - and by punishment I mean up to and including jail time and having any remaining children removed from custody. Anyone negligent enough to leave a loaded firearm around a child should expect to be put in prison for some amount of time. Remorse might mitigate the punishment but it doesn't excuse the irresponsible action.
A drunk driver might feel bad too but they still should expect to go to jail if their irresponsible actions kill someone. This is no different as far as I'm concerned. A parent that has a child die due to this kind of clear negligence is undeserving of the right to raise children. Just because you produced them doesn't mean you are qualified to raise them and tragically some people go ahead and prove that fact in the worst possible way.
Nice one
I'm going to start embedding the word "wii" here and there in my articles on rural sanitation over the next month and see what turns up here.
So how did she turn off the safety?
Irrelevant question. A loaded firearm should never, ever, ever be withing reach of a three year old. Whether the safety was engaged, trigger locks installed, or any other precaution was taken is completely irrelevant. SHE SHOULDN"T HAVE HAD ACCESS TO THE GUN. The only way to completely ensure a three year old cannot discharge the gun is to keep it safely away from her. I cannot fathom of a reason why a S&W handgun would need to be out on a table in the house unsupervised and loaded.
Maybe I'm a bit sensitive with four young daughters of my own, but I rather dislike the title "Accidental Wii Suicide" for this article. I don't suppose it could be changed to something more appropriate? I also strongly disagree with the Darwin tag. The subject is the death of a toddler, not the death of someone who should be removed from the gene pool.
I sincerely hope I'm not alone by expecting better from Slashdot.
I knew all those Dora The Explorer Wii Games and Wiggles music that glamorize suicide would have this result.
In spirit, the parents responsible for this just removed their progeny from the gene pool, thus removing their own. I understand why that sounds like a Darwin award. But the rules are clear. Killing an innocent doesn't count, and it left the offending parents able to reproduce again. No Darwin award for these morons.
http://www.darwinawards.com/rules/
What irks me much, much more is its filing under the guns-don't-kill-toddlers-do dept. Especially since the article below it is under the well-that's-so-sad dept.. Although the latter was meant sarcastically, the juxtaposition with the former is unsettling.
"Love heals scars love left." -- Henry Rollins
Or your daughter might accidentally shoot herself. If punishment is intended to deter or rehabilitate you, what more do you think they really need? Any punishment now would just be for the sake of making these people pay.
You could say the same about seat belts, yet it most certainly took laws and education to increase seat belt use. You're thinking like a rational, sane person. Some people need to be told not to do stupid things like leaving a loaded gun within reach of a 3 year old.
I agree with previous posters - this case needs to be publicized to death. However that's done. If I were a creative prosecutor, I might plead this case down to 20,000 hours of community service each, payable over 40 years. If I let these people off the hook, I want them dedicating their lives to the cause of gun safety. If it's true that their pain is enough punishment, they'll want to do that anyway. Win-win, right?
Failing that, I want them incarcerated. Not as punishment or rehabilitation, I just want them in jail for as many of their child bearing years as possible so they don't get a chance to repeat the same mistake.
You can't tell a 3 year old "don't ever touch that without Daddy's help" and expect them to really listen, or remember that you said that next week when you aren't standing right next to them. A three year old has very limited higher reasoning abilities. Their brain won't be fully developed for another 15 years or so. Even a 6 year old might not be inclined to remember or follow such rules. Maybe an 8 year old is old enough for you to begin teaching them responsibility about important things, but they are definitely not old enough to have UNSUPERVISED access to a loaded gun, that is insane.
The blame for this lies SQUARELY on the father who left a LOADED GUN in a place where his VERY YOUNG CHILD could access it. That kind of negligence should be criminal, even if it doesn't lead to a terrible tragedy like it did in this case.
I'm in a similar situation. My guns are either locked up or on my person at all times, but I take different defense in depth measures to prevent this sort of accident if I screw up and leave a gun within reach of my small children. I don't ban toy guns, but I do make sure they are easily distinguished from the real thing. Kids love toy guns, and I'm not convinced banning them from your home makes much difference either way. What I DO make sure of is that my kids can tell the difference, and know to treat them differently.
From the age of two or so, I have the kids handle the each of my real guns so they know what they feel like, in contrast to the toys. The weight, the material, the smell, all make it easy to tell real from fake. And I drill them that if they see a real gun anywhere, they need to tell us immediately so we can lock it up. I actually talk about the possibility of this scenario, where I forgot that I put it down somewhere, and they need to tell me about it. This can be taught much earlier than safe gun handling and firing, which I don't start until around five or six, and not with handguns at that age.
I then test them on it. I leave the real gun out somewhere, like on the bathroom counter, with fake bullets loaded in the magazine, or with the gun disabled somehow depending on model. So far, each test has resulted in correct behavior, with all of my kids. Let me repeat that I don't rely on this, and I don't expect to leave a gun lying around anytime soon. It is just defense in depth, because I don't want to end up in a story like this one.
--Jaborandy
I kind of want to see the story develop further. A few questions I'd like to see answered. - The summary uses the pronoun "himself", but TFA says it was a girl. What was the gender of this child and does "CmdrTaco" know more than he or she is letting on? - How does anyone actually know the motivation of the kid? Perhaps she played with a controller that looked like a gun, and then mistook a real gun for it, but we don't know that's actually what went through her mind. And there's still the question of why she pointed this gun at herself. Also, apparently the mom was three feet away when it happened. Did she not notice the kid playing with the gun? - Forget leaving a loaded gun out, what kind of a parent lets their 3 year old play a shooting game with a realistic gun??? This level of negligence is staggering to me. I hope the police aren't just investigating manslaughter, but also a possible homicide. I hate to accuse parents who have just lost a child of murder, but all we have to go on from what I see is their testimony of what happened, and everything just seems a bit too convenient. Either both parents are criminally incompetent, or this was less of an accident than we are led to believe, based on what we know now.
Suggestion: Be very careful to pay the rent on time.
Why is there an "insightful" mod and why isn't it "-1"? If I wanted insight, I wouldn't be reading
OH MY GOD.
/. and I'd think most of the people stupid enough to do something like that wouldn't be here. I really hope that's the case. If not, please, I implore you, think about what you are doing. You are putting her life and your family's life in danger.
"Locked, cocked, and ready to rock"? Are you serious? You keep your gun in its flimsy plastic case on the top shelf of your closet and not locked up in any way, but loaded, cocked and ready to go? And you expect your 3 year-old to listen to you and to not sneak in the closet when daddy isn't watching? What the hell is wrong with you? Kids don't listen! They're kids, they don't know better for the most part! No matter what you teach them you have to still protect them!
Thank God she isn't tall enough to get your gun where you have it now, and I pray that she doesn't have any long toys to poke the case down, items she could throw up there to knock it down, or that you don't have a ladder around she could drag over and use. When my son was 4 he was fairly resourceful, I'd bet any amount of money that he could have gotten stuff out of the top of my closet without too much of a problem if he really wanted to.
God I pray I'm getting trolled. I sincerely hope with a cheesy line like "Locked, cocked, and ready to rock" and with all the "fucks" in your post that you are joking. I'd hope you wouldn't be that dumb as to trust a young child not to touch a loaded, cocked, unlocked gun in the house in a location where she could potentially get to it. It is
". . . a gun in the home is 21 times more likely to injure a family member than protect the home from intruders."
BULL-$#1T!
If he spoke those words exactly as written in the article, it's a flat out lie. More than likely, Helmke quoted a real statistic and the writer sort of "accidentally" twisted it to achieve the desired effect.
A true statement is: "A gun in the home is much more likely to be used to KILL someone living in the home than to be used to KILL an intruder." The anti-gun crowd is more than willing to proliferate this stat and then let people like this writer blatantly mis-quote and misinterpret it to achieve the desired effect. I've seen/heard statements like the one made in this article at least 100 times from various sources. Such statements are clearly based on the aformentioned fact, but they're almost always inaccurate.
Even when quoted accurately, the statistic is totally misleading because the number of cases involving the death of a member of the household includes suicides, justifiable homicides (e.g. an abused spouse acting in self defense) and murders in addition to accidents.
Furthermore, in the vast majority of defensive firearms uses, in the home or otherwise, no shot is ever fired. When a shot IS fired, there are obviously plenty of "misses" and numerous incidents in which the criminal is merely wounded.
I guess the 'darwin' tag that was there got "voted down" and disappeared anyway, so it's a moot point now
It just kinda touched a nerve... I have a 2.5 year old daughter and there's no way I'd ever leave a loaded anything around her
Here's to the crazy ones
I want to know what the father was really doing. While it is an acceptable explanation that he thought there was a prowler around, I find it hard to believe that after that kind of scare (Honey there's someone outside, go get the kids and stay in the living room! or Honey there someone outside, I'm going to get my gun and check) that the parents wouldn't be more attentive to the situation. If I need to pull a gun out to go check out a possible danger to my family, my family knows it and is not casually laying around the house watching TV and Facebooking. It is more likely the guy was outside shooting things for fun, came back in the house and left the gun on the table. It just sounds better to say he was trying to protect his family.
She shot herself "after her stepfather left his loaded Smith & Wesson handgun out on a table"! 3 year olds play with what ever they find laying around, I know I've had two of them. If they had not had a Wii, and the circumstances were other wise the same the same tragedy would still of happened. DON"T LEAVE LOADED GUNS WHERE CHILDREN CAN FIND THEM AND PLAY WITH THEM!
Meddle thou not in the affairs of Dragons, for thou art crunchy and with most anything.
Just rememeber, guns don't kill people, people kill people.
Oh wait... Somehow a gun was involved. Good thing there are laws which allow for this.
This sounds like an horrible human tragedy.
Title and teaser appear inappropriate to me.
I'm sure I will be notice if gay-rapers start going door-to-door before they ring my doorbell.
Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens
The "don't charge him, he's suffered enough" crowd seem to not be aware that there's a reason why we have a separate sentencing process after conviction. We charge and convict people for crimes on purely material grounds, and then sentence on moral grounds.
Are you adequate?
If his concience is punishment enough then he wont mind the jail time that he 100% should be doing, so should mom. If someone does something wrong and they dont get punished because someone dies thats not a good precedent to set.
There are many rules of gun safety, or rather, many ways of stating the same general principles. A good one is to assume the safety's gonna fail some unknown day, and treat the gun accordingly.
Gun safety involves a lot of redundant measures. If somebody hands you an unloaded gun, you check for yourself to make sure that it really is unloaded. You keep the safety on if you're not shooting it, even if you've already checked the gun's not loaded. You don't point the gun at anybody you're not gonna shoot, even if you've checked it's unloaded and you have the safety on. You don't put your finger in the trigger unless you're gonna shoot right then, even if you've checked that the gun's unloaded and the safety's on. And so on.
So you really shouldn't be asking why the safety wasn't set, because it doesn't matter. You should be asking what happened with all of the other safety precautions that should have prevented this.
Are you adequate?
Yeah, I thought about that method, but would rather that all guns in the house were reported to me until she's old enough to take a proper use/safety course.
Especially I've made my mind up after having the Ruger LCR around. It's lighter than many toy guns out there...
"Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives" should be a convenience store, not a government agency.
Why did you pick the year with the most firearms deaths in the US?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Ushomicidesbyweapon.svg
Meant to also mention that S&W has a pink lightweight that might look very toy-like and attractive to a little girl.
"Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives" should be a convenience store, not a government agency.
The way the criminal justice system works is that conviction on a charge is purely about the material facts of the case, whereas sentencing on a conviction is about just punishment. So the stepfather's remorse or lack thereof just isn't relevant to whether he should be charged and convicted of some crime. Only after he has convicted is that his remorse becomes relevant in determining the just sentence for his crime.
Are you adequate?
A 3 year-old fumbling with a gun might switch the safety off, for all you know.
Gun safety involves multiple redundant measures: always treat gun as if it's loaded, always verify whether the gun is loaded, don't switch safety off unless you're shooting, don't put finger on trigger unless you're shooting, don't point the gun at people unless you're killing. You shouldn't be relying on a gun's switch-operated safety mechanism to keep a bullet from shooting at a child in the first place, which is why it's just not very relevant at that point whether the gun had a safety. If the child at first fails to shoot the gun because of the safety, well, they may very well "succeed" after playing with it for a couple more minutes.
Also, the kind of safety mechanisms that a gun has is very dependent on its design, and some guns really need more failsafes that others do. A single-action semi-automatic pistol like a Colt 1911 very much needs have a switch safety, because it was designed to be carried cocked and with a round in the chamber, and it has a very light trigger action (3-5 pounds); there's a grip safety and a thumb switch safety because it's otherwise very easy to shoot the gun by accident, and the person most likely to get shot is the guy holding it. A double-action revolver, on the other hand, is carried uncocked and has a 12-pound trigger pull. Double-action semiautos are carried with a round on the chamber but uncocked; the first trigger pull is very heavy and subsequent ones are light, so a common safety mechanism is a switch to safely decock the gun after it's been shot, leaving it in its initial heavy-trigger state.
Are you adequate?
Damn!!! There are a lot of people here that apparently have guns. I havent have a use for gun so far, and I think i never will. The only reason to carry a gun is because there other people with guns. If you are not carefull for just a second things can go bad in a sec. Maybe they are just saying the guns they see on video games.
There isn't a single thing which makes sense about this situation.
1) Most 3-y-o children can't pull a firearm trigger. I've got two children, and neither could do so at 3 (because I wanted to see what they'd be capable of, not that I'd leave such things in their reach). They're not able to get their hands around the trigger, nevermind exert enough pressure for most triggers. Unless we're talking about a hair trigger (you won't find them on a non-custom handgun). The handgun was likely a S&W Sigma (by its description in the article, but the media is even worse about reporting gun related stuff than they are technology and science), which does -not- have a light trigger (it's known for having a heavy, gritty trigger, even for a handgun). ... in the head? ... while her mother was nearby - if not watching, but at least present?
2) How did a 3-year-old mistake a real gun for a Wii controller, given it looks nothing like anything Nintendo has made in over 20 years?
3)
4)
Also, take a look at the GIS for the likely gun in question. It is, for all intents and purposes, too large for some adolescents and many women.
~/ssh slashdot.org ssh: connect to host slashdot.org port 22: too many beers
Come on! Why not nominate her for the Darwin Awards?? She sure he can beat the 1st place as anybody who dies like her is a dork, that's the reason of the Darwing Awards celebrates! ;) *chuckles*
Proper home defence requires a credible deterent. That means a loaded and cocked (with safty off) gun under the pillow and on the coffee table at all times.
Aside from the obvious 'why wasn't the safety on' and 'what was a gun lying around with a 3 year old about' comments, what about the guns weight. Sorry, but those things are heavy. So much so, that I doubt that a kid that age could have lifted it. What else was going on?
Are we sure this wasn't just a wii-mote suddenly accelerating?
Either the parents are grossly incompetent and stupid, or they're incompetent and stupid AND they're trying to mollify their guilty conscience by putting some of the blame on a video game accessory that they should never have owned to begin with.
Or the stepfather
1) Encouraged the kid to play with a toy in the shape of a realistic gun.
2) Left a loaded gun in the place where the kid was used to find said game controller.
Accident?
I lost my sig.
Seriously people.
A gun is a weapon. It's used to kill things. It is very dangerous, and people can lose their lives through accidental and malicious use of them.
Don't buy a gun. Don't keep a gun in your house. Don't carry a gun.
The danger of gun ownership far outweigh the benefit of recreational use.
A handgun is not going to prevent your government from abusing its power. Governments have much bigger weapons than you can buy.
A handgun is not going to prevent someone breaking into your home. Maybe you'll shoot the guy. Maybe he'll shoot you. Either way, you just cost someone their life.
I know the parents were negligent in this case, but people who own handguns are making the world a more dangerous place for everyone.
What is wrong with you?
RS
I firmly believe in a person's right to own guns here in America, until they've proven they're not responsible or capable of safely using/storing them. Keeping a loaded gun in reach of a toddler is one of the dumbest ideas ever. Even if the toddler doesn't have a toy gun, or has any idea what the gun is/isn't they're still a toddler and will still play with it. Especially if it's shiny.
Not that I am blaming Nintendo's designers in any shape or form (it was clearly the parents' (or in this case step-parents) fault for leaving the loaded weapon within reach of an unsupervised child) but perhaps this could be one of the reasons why toys today are no longer supposed to resemble real weapons.
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It's still criminal negligence. Sending text messages from your cell phone is legal. Sending text messages while driving is legal (in most states). And you might have great intentions while sending that text message while driving - but it doesn't matter a whit if you your negligence results in harming someone else.
Why was a three-year-old playing a shooting game?
Sad, guns should be locked up to prevent these kind of accidents.
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