Ask Slashdot: What Are the Books Everyone Should Read?

SciFi list by Toe,+The · 2014-01-01 10:23 · Score: 2

Popular:
Stranger in a Strange Land
Ender's Game
Slaughterhouse Five
The Hobbit

Among the less well-known in the genre, but (imho) equally deserving:
Aristoi
Consider Phlebas
Steel Beach
The Peace War

Re:SciFi List by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:42 · Score: 0

Lucifer's Hammer and Ringworld were great too.
Re:SciFi list by immaterial · 2014-01-01 10:47 · Score: 1

The Worthing Saga: I like Ender's Game, but The Worthing Saga is definitely the best of Card's work (if little-known). A great story about the meaning of pain and choice. If you read and liked The Giver in grade school, it was essentially a ripoff of The Worthing Saga, with different dressing.
Re:SciFi list by Narcocide · 2014-01-01 11:02 · Score: 2

Yea, Card comes off as a lot more Mormon in this book than most his others, but despite the somewhat heavy-handed moral delivery its a really enlightening and thought-provoking epic. I'd definitely say that I'd have to agree with you that of all his works this one will give just about any reader the most perspective on humanity.
Re:SciFi list by immaterial · 2014-01-01 11:03 · Score: 1

Looking back at my post again, I feel the need to clarify that I think The Giver is also a great book, and better for a younger (grade school) audience than The Worthing Saga. I don't know if Lowry intentionally pulled from The Worthing Saga or if the similarities are just a massive set of coincidences, but that doesn't take anything away from the story.

If you know a kid that enjoyed The Giver (here in California it's often assigned in school around 6th grade) and they are strong readers, they may be interested in reading TWS and comparing how the same underlying story can be written for different audiences (kids vs. adults). It's right about the time kids start transitioning to more complex books anyway, and it makes for some interesting insight. I did this with my friend's kid (we actually read TWS together because reading isn't his strong suit - working on that!) and it was a fun process.
Re:SciFi list by immaterial · 2014-01-01 11:10 · Score: 1

There's no escaping Mormoness in his work, but fortunately I don't find it detracting from the story. Hell, at the root of it it's answering the question, Why does God allow (pain | bad things to happen)? but the answers are relevant to anyone. Everyone experiences these things whether they believe in god(s) or not.
Re:SciFi list by davester666 · 2014-01-01 16:54 · Score: 1

The Dictionary. all the other books are in it.
Zing! Thank you. I'll be touring south Burbank all week.

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Sleep your way to a whiter smile...date a dentist!
Re:SciFi list by Number42 · 2014-01-01 18:38 · Score: 2

What about Neuromancer/Count Zero/Mona Lisa Overdrive, The Diamond Age and other books in the cyberpunk sub-genre? Good stories, even if they're not as "deep" or thoughtful as those on your list.
Re:SciFi list by canadian_right · 2014-01-02 03:09 · Score: 2

god allows suffering because god doesn't exist.

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Anarchists never rule
Re:SciFi list by Narcocide · 2014-01-02 03:49 · Score: 1

This is not actually a possible explanation omitted by the book, believe it or not. You should read it; you would like it.

Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:23 · Score: 4, Interesting

0. THE BIBLE
1. Homer’s Iliad
2. Homer’s Odyssey
3. Exodus & Ecclesiastes & The Psalms
4. Virgil’s Aeneid
5. Socrates’ Apology
6. The Book of Matthew & Jefferson’s Bible
7. Plato’s Repulic
8. Seneca’s Letters from a Stoic
9. Aristotle’s Poetics
10. Dante’s Inferno
11. The Declaration of Independence
12. The Constitution
13. John Milton’s Paradise Lost
14. Shakespeare’s Hamlet
15. Newton’s Principia
16. Adam Smith’s Wealth of Nations and Theory of Moral Sentiments
17. Henry David Thoreau’s Walden
18. Mark Twain’s Huckleberry Finn (& all of his work)
19. Shakespeare’s Hamlet
20. Ludwig von Mises’ A Theory of Money and Credit
21. F.A. Hayek’s The Road to Serfdom
22. Herman Melville’s Moby Dick
23. Einstein’s The Meaning of Relativity
24. Joseph Campbell’s The Hero With a Thousand Faces and The Power of Myth
25. Ron Paul’s Revolution & End the Fed
26. THE BIBLE

Re:Well... by symbolset · 2014-01-01 10:30 · Score: 1

I was going to put the Bible in there, but then you should include several versions, and several other such works as well. The Gita, Qabalah, Koran.

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Help stamp out iliturcy.
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:31 · Score: 0

Von Mises, a Crackpot Supreme and out dated Libertarian Lunatic Fascist! be sure and pair him with some Korzybski and some Wilhelm Reich for some REALLY deranged childrens' reading!
Re:Well... by mlts · 2014-01-01 10:32 · Score: 5, Interesting

Here are a few that are mentioned because of importance, or don't first come to mind.
1: The Bible (because good or bad, it influences our society.
2: The Koran (similar to #1)
3: 1984
4: Brave New World
5: The Magna Carta
6: Dale C. Carson's "Arrest-Proof Yourself". This is an important book in the US to learn and understand. People may not agree with it, but it is how things function.
7: Applied Cryptography
8: Atlas Shrugged (one should sometimes read stuff just to show the errors in thought to boost critical thinking.)
9: Communist Manifesto (same as #8)
10: Wealth of Nations (same as #8 and #9)
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:45 · Score: 5, Insightful

And then read Christopher Hitchens' "God is Not Great" for an opposing point of view
Re:Well... by JaredOfEuropa · 2014-01-01 10:50 · Score: 4, Insightful

8: Atlas Shrugged (one should sometimes read stuff just to show the errors in thought to boost critical thinking.) 9: Communist Manifesto (same as #8) 10: Wealth of Nations (same as #8 and #9)
I'd recommend those to any young person. Not just to show errors, but also to be exposed to ideas that one rarely encounters in the classroom (YYMV per country). This can help to translate "deep down feelings" into a set of core values, which helps one to think critically about ones own convictions.

--
If construction was anything like programming, an incorrectly fitted lock would bring down the entire building...
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:02 · Score: 4, Funny

I think John Rogers sums it up well: There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.
Re:Well... by ShanghaiBill · 2014-01-01 11:04 · Score: 5, Interesting

1: The Bible (because good or bad, it influences our society.
The Bible doesn't influence our society because of what it says, but because of what people that haven't read it think it says. Reading the bible can also be detrimental to your religious faith. But a big benefit is that with a thorough knowledge of the bible, you can really annoy any missionaries that knock on your door. I think I have managed to get on some sort of black list, because I have noticed several groups of clean cut bible carrying young men visit my neighbors but skip my house.
Re:Well... by crutchy · 2014-01-01 11:08 · Score: 2

00. The Constitution
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:15 · Score: 2

It's unfortunate that hard working individuals are seen as a fantastical idea in this day and age while couch surfing writers like Karl Marx are idolized.
Re:Well... by runningduck · 2014-01-01 11:28 · Score: 5, Informative

I understand how the "errors" comment relates to #8 & #9, but how does it relate to #10? Have you read the Wealth of Nations? What errors did you find? I suspect that you have been exposed Adam Smith's work via someone else's filter and interpretation.
Unlike Atlas Shrugged and The Communist Manifesto, The Wealth of Nations does not take a position and is consistantly observational throughout the book based on data of the time. Although Adam Smith is often noted as the father of capitalism, he is first and foremost a philosopher. It is clear throughout his works that he does not always agree with what he observes, but lays out the facts regardless. Most people latch onto the observations regarding self-interest in The Wealth of Nations and extrapolate it to mean that "greed is good" when in fact Smith is more focused on the notion that people have to do what is best for themselves and their families. A reading of his earlier work, The Theory of Moral Sentiments, expands upon his observations and helps balance the nuanced conflicts within each of us and society as a whole.

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-rd
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:33 · Score: 4, Informative

> couch surfing writers like Karl Marx
Karl Marx was an economist. Ayn Rand was a fanatic.
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:42 · Score: 0

The stories from the Bible influenced Western culture during the Middle Ages and into the Age of Enlightenment. After that, the Bible only influenced Western culture via artifacts from earlier times. So we're at least one or two degrees removed from direct influence.
Something similar happened with the Koran. As you said, today neither the Bible nor the Koran directly influence modern culture, only the ideologies of conservative religious cults which are loosely based on the traditional theology, and really they only influence politics, not culture per se.
Re:Well... by gnasher719 · 2014-01-01 11:52 · Score: 3, Informative

I can't comment on "Atlas Shrugged", although I often see it mentioned as justification for some horrible nonsense being posted.

I did download and listen to Ayn Rand's "Anthem" however, and what a piece of shit it is. Unbelievable characters, including a totally unbelievable protagonist, escaping from a totally unbelievable post-whatever society. I had the vague impression that the author was trying to tell the reader something, but that whatever that message was, it had nothing to do with any sane world.
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 12:01 · Score: 0

8: Atlas Shrugged (one should sometimes read stuff just to show the errors in thought to boost critical thinking.)
I tried. I really tried. But the writing was so god-awful that I couldn't even get to the bad ideas.
Re:Well... by CrudPuppy · 2014-01-01 12:16 · Score: 5, Insightful

First, I don't see why Ayn is expected to not create fantastical characters in a work of fiction. Nobody would read it if it were just a mirror image of society.
Next, the book was not meant to be just a story that entertains. She felt very strongly about certain ideals since she transitioned from Communism to Capitalism, and she writes at the very edge of the continuum. You read it, you analyze it, you adopt the ideals that make sense to you and reject those that don't. Not sure why this concept is so foreign nowadays. I don't share her atheism, but I certainly share her ideals on capitalism.
I found the book very entertaining and highly thought-provoking. It's the only book I have read since university where I have taken copious notes whilst reading it.

--
A year spent in artificial intelligence is enough to make one believe in God.
Re:Well... by demonlapin · 2014-01-01 12:44 · Score: 2

If you're a Westerner, you really ought to spend more time getting to know the Bible before branching out. Christianity has been a major factor in Western Civ for nearly 2000 years, and there are a lot of references to it.
Re:Well... by mi · 2014-01-01 12:48 · Score: 1

I would replace some of the early philosophers (whom I personally found unreadable) with Plutarch. Parallel Lives in particular. And Tacitus' historical works.

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In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
Re:Well... by EmperorOfCanada · 2014-01-01 12:54 · Score: 1

I found Atlas Shrugged boring; I stopped before I could even get enough info to solidly agree or disagree. To me she is like Malcolm Gladwell, pointing out the obvious and making it seem profound. Oooooh if you practice something obsessively since childhood you will become good at it. I never thought of that, I just thought that people just jumped down from the stands threw on a uniform and scored the winning goal.

It seemed that her point was that lefty governments will take away the hard work of smart people. It seems that the real problem with her work is that it was so bad that when governments are criticized for taking away the hard work of smart people that people attack them for being under the spell of Atlas Shrugged. Sometimes it is just bag government.

So in a weird way she twisted the thinking of some of those who love and some of those who hate her.
Re:Well... by EmperorOfCanada · 2014-01-01 12:57 · Score: 1

Yes I suspect that if Mr Smith were allowed to watch the Wolf of Wall Street before writing his book that he might have been a bit more specific as to what should be avoided in capitalism.
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 13:07 · Score: 0

I see your 00 and raise you:
-1. Webster's Revised Unabridged Dictionary.
The Constitution may be written in plain, easy to understand language, but it's clear speakers of English do not understand plain, easy to understand language. Sure, we wouldn't have incompetent judges insisting private communications involving more than two parties somehow manage to escape the Fourth... Among other things.
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 13:13 · Score: 0

Lol, you're an idiot.
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 13:18 · Score: 0

What errors are we talking about?
Re:Well... by PopeRatzo · 2014-01-01 13:41 · Score: 1

the Drunken War Jester of the Genocidal Bush Reign? The Grim Reaper hauled boorish little Hitch squealing off to Hell with 3/4 of the Scythe jammed up that jingoistic twit's gaping asshole!
You must be an exceptionally devout Bible-reader, judging from your tone.

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You are welcome on my lawn.
Re:Well... by Circlotron · 2014-01-01 13:45 · Score: 1

Indeed. And for those that don't agree with an author's point of view doesn't mean you shouldn't read and so make yourself better informed as to why you hold a differing view.
Re:Well... by PopeRatzo · 2014-01-01 13:48 · Score: 4, Insightful

Of course you are right. I see precious little evidence that the Bible has influenced society much at all, except to give people stuff to fight about. Part 1 is about making sure your enemy is smote and placed beneath you and don't eat pork or have buttsex and Part 2 is all about, "forget Part 1".
And as soon as some Christian leader starts to actually take the Christ stuff seriously, like Pope Francis, all the Christians start getting mad at him for being a commie. Go figure.

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You are welcome on my lawn.
Re: Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 14:06 · Score: 0

Yes, the bible (any version) should be in there, but only because so much in our culture refers to it. It's actually a s**t poor excuse for literature and has almost no redeeming value as a standalone read, other than the fact that so many references to it make more sense if you have read the awful thing....
Re:Well... by MickLinux · 2014-01-01 14:14 · Score: 1

o/t, maybe, but I'd love to discuss that with you. I too know my Bible moderately well, and the only reason I could think of for avoiding your house would be if you were to argue minutiae that you didn't believe, and thus were only spouting mindless noise.

--
Correct Horse Battery Staple: 72 bits of entropy. Enter "Correct H" into google. When it generates the phrase, that's
Re:Well... by melikamp · 2014-01-01 14:16 · Score: 1

You give Pope Francis too much credit. His office is a carbon copy of the office of the high priest, and is a mockery of anything Jesus stood for. Nearly every organized Christian sect starts with rejecting "Part 2" nearly fully, by grossly misinterpreting it.
Re:Well... by MickLinux · 2014-01-01 14:18 · Score: 1

I think you are confusing Christians with fundamentalist Capitalists. I can't think how or why.

--
Correct Horse Battery Staple: 72 bits of entropy. Enter "Correct H" into google. When it generates the phrase, that's
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 14:38 · Score: 0

I was going to put the Bible in there, but then you should include several versions, and several other such works as well. The Gita, Qabalah, Koran.
So we're including fictional, quasi historical books in the list then? Seriously, telling your friends kids they should read the bible will just make you look like a jerk. Encouraging them to read books that contradict their parents religious beliefs may kill friendships too.
Re:Well... by Doctor_Jest · 2014-01-01 15:32 · Score: 1

And yet, Karl Marx got it wrong.... go figure.

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It's the Stay-Puft Marshmallow Man.
Re:Well... by PopeRatzo · 2014-01-01 15:33 · Score: 2

I think you are confusing Christians with fundamentalist Capitalists.
Actually, I'm referring to American fundamentalist Christians, who practice what some call the "American Civil Religion" because it has so little in common with the teaching of Christ.
Do you know that a majority of American Christians believe that free-market capitalism is a biblical principle? I don't remember where I read the survey, maybe the Atlantic magazine, but it's very recent, since Pope Francis made his comments about the failure of supply-side economics. And it's that supply-side economics which is the true object of faith for many Americans who self-identify as believers.
People use Christ for all sorts of things. I'm sure you've seen the posters of Jesus with a rifle across his lap, or the one with him and Ronald Reagan looking down from heaven together.

--
You are welcome on my lawn.
Re:Well... by Rob+the+Bold · 2014-01-01 16:03 · Score: 1

Here are a few that are mentioned because of importance, or don't first come to mind.
1: The Bible (because good or bad, it influences our society.
This was on the "Summer reading before my class" list from one of my high school English teachers. (She was Jewish, as I recall, if that matters to you.) The primary reason was all the Western literary references you wouldn't understand without at least a basic knowledge of the Bible.
For example: In Western literature -- or its squellae* -- anyone with initials J.C. is probably a "Christ figure".
Go ahead, test it. Try, oh . . . say, "The Terminator".
*Yes, I'm being silly by calling "film" a pathology. I kid.

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I am not a crackpot.
Re:Well... by sonamchauhan · 2014-01-01 16:27 · Score: 2

> I don't share her atheism, but I certainly share her ideals on capitalism.
In other words, you share her atheism. Else that, or you share her God.
http://caimbhriainmyrddin.blogspot.com.au/2011/07/hal-crowther-alarming-revival-of-ayn.html
Re:Well... by ClickOnThis · 2014-01-01 17:12 · Score: 2

Karl Marx was an economist. Ayn Rand was a fanatic.
And yet, Karl Marx got it wrong.... go figure.
Arguably, they both got it wrong. Par for the course in Philosophy, a field where one tries to nail Jello to a tree, and sometimes succeeds, however briefly.

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If it weren't for deadlines, nothing would be late.
Re:Well... by IICV · 2014-01-01 18:02 · Score: 3, Insightful

First, I don't see why Ayn is expected to not create fantastical characters in a work of fiction. Nobody would read it if it were just a mirror image of society.
Do you really not see the difference between Frodo Baggins and Dagny Taggart? Frodo is a fantastical character - he's a short-statured member of a race of hairy-footed little men who live in hills, have eleventy-first birthday parties and possess a strange resistance to magic. But despite all this, he's understandable as a person: he hopes and struggles, he gives up and sometimes he wins. The actions he takes are ones we could see ourselves taking, if we happened to be in his fantastical situation and under the stresses he's under.
Dagny Taggart is a fantastical caricature - she's a human, but not as we know it Jim. Everything she ever wanted sort of just happened to her, and she just does random insane shit because that's what the author needs her to do in order to move the plot along. It's really hard for an actual human being to identify with her, because she's the barest sketch of one.
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 18:35 · Score: 0

1: The Bible (because good or bad, it influences our society.
2: The Koran (similar to #1)
3. slit your wrists...
Re:Well... by kenwd0elq · 2014-01-01 19:02 · Score: 1

The Federalist Papers. Provides a lot of background on what the writers of the Constitution were thinking about when they wrote the Constitution. Too bad most of our current political class has never read it.
Re:Well... by kenwd0elq · 2014-01-01 19:07 · Score: 1

Also; everything by Frederic Bastiat, but especially his short essay "That Which Is Seen, And That Which Is Not Seen".
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 19:45 · Score: 0

Except that the Koran is demon inspired book and the Bible is inspired of God.
Re:Well... by dunkelfalke · 2014-01-01 20:02 · Score: 1

Have you actually read Capital?
Many things from there are taught in economics courses even now - somewhat reworded, of course.

--
"It's such a fine line between stupid and clever" -- David St. Hubbins, Spinal Tap
Re:Well... by dbIII · 2014-01-01 21:47 · Score: 0

Number 8 - Atlas Shrugged: If you want to read a rejection of the idea of democracy from someone that came from a communist country to live on welfare in a capitalist one. Thus very limited experience with democracy before demonizing it and almost no participation in capitalism before singing unquestioning praise.
If you want Russian insights go with the people who wrote about what they experienced in depth in their own country instead of a newbies guide to what she thought was wrong with the USA. Or read Asimov who had a little bit of the Russian background but knew a lot about American society before he started writing.

Stalin would have got value for money if he had funded Rand and her anti-democratic rants.
Re:Well... by dbIII · 2014-01-01 21:49 · Score: 1

Brainwashing about how this democracy thing sucks and we should all just follow the people with the most money you mean?
Re:Well... by dbIII · 2014-01-01 21:51 · Score: 1

She felt very strongly about certain ideals
So did Phillip K. Dick, Heinlen etc (for SF alone) but they had plot instead of shoving a hose connected to a high pressure sewage pump down your throat about it.
Re:Well... by MaskedSlacker · 2014-01-01 23:33 · Score: 1

As an ECONOMIST, Marx's analysis is largely faultless. His basic analysis of what we today call the business cycle is sound. He was correct about the problem of positive feedback loops in the boom and bust cycle, and he was correct that, if left unchecked, such a cycle would inevitably lead the poor and starving to revolt. That analysis formed the basis of later, more detailed work, which is still used by governments to this day,
Then he decided to be a philosopher of human nature and political theorist instead. We all know how THAT turned out.
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 23:48 · Score: 0

Reading those books without academic credits or monetary compensation and staying wake while doing it is the real challenge, particularly for a person not from the Anglo-shpere of cultural rightiness.
Re:Well... by Goose+In+Orbit · 2014-01-02 00:04 · Score: 1

Yes I know this place is US-centric - but sometimes it would come in handy for the rest of the planet to be taken into consideration once in a while.
That said - if it helps explain the US mindset to the rest of us, then it may be of some use...
Re:Well... by MaskedSlacker · 2014-01-02 00:16 · Score: 1

He was very specific already. Anyone who didn't understand didn't read it in the first place. They just fabricated a rationalization for their own assholery.
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 00:59 · Score: 0

I think the big story here is that apparently, the majority of human beings in 2014 consider a philosophy of voluntary association to be "childish", "threatening", "dangerous", and "short-sighted".
This, of course, is what the majority of human beings have believed since they first said goodbye to the animal kingdom -- where a philosophy of voluntary association is "childish", "threatening", "dangerous", and "short-sighted".
Re:Well... by crutchy · 2014-01-02 01:06 · Score: 1

many nations have a Constitution... they just don't have the same marketing might as the US constitution
Re:Well... by stdarg · 2014-01-02 01:55 · Score: 1

Oh man, what a horrific blog post. I can't believe I waded through that to find something to support your assertion that Ayn Rand's theories on capitalism are inextricable from atheism.

She not only would have rejected Jesus and his gospels, she actually did—-repeatedly. Christ’s message that the poor are blessed and the meek will inherit the earth is antithetical to Rand’s belief that the poor and meek are no more than mulch where the dreams of the mighty take root.
What a bunch of crap. You and that blogger both missed the fact that capitalism has created more wealth for the poor and meek than any other economic system. While millions starved under Communism, the more capitalist grew rich and developed social safety nets for the poor.
Look at China:
1. Modern China, embracing capitalism and trade with capitalist countries and lifting millions of people out of poverty
2. Hard communist China, with programs like the Great Leap Forward... which led to the Great Chinese Famine! Read the first paragraph under Causes.. even China today admits that Communist mismanagement of the economy and agriculture was the principal cause of the disaster
So yeah.. What Would Jesus Do? Impose communist bullshit and make half the world starve... or embrace capitalism..
Armchair communists are so stupid.
Re:Well... by CrimsonAvenger · 2014-01-02 02:00 · Score: 1

I see precious little evidence that the Bible has influenced society much at all
Hmm, Sundays off of work. Christmas & Easter, two of our major holidays. And those are just some of the most superficial ways it influenced our society.

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"I do not agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it"
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 02:04 · Score: 0

I find it interesting when people insist on taking Atlas Shrugged so literally. Perhaps it's because the core ideology of the 'hero' characters is so ruthlessly fundamental, people find it abrasive and just toss it aside as a work of fantasy as justification for disliking some of the more extreme ideas in there.
I think the fact it is so fantastical and that most of the characters are extremely one-dimensional caricatures is almost the point. Seems to me the storyline is just a set piece for Rand to really get at the core of her political philosophy and prod at the really difficult dilemmas in the debate on where a society should lie on the scale between communism/socialism and capitalism.
The book takes the ideal of purely meritocratic capitalism to its extreme and there are some cold, inhuman edges to this which I personally find too much. But the core ideas that entitlement should not be expected by any section of society and that capitalism should ultimately benefit the individual and wider society in fair proportion to the individual's skill level and work ethic I am completely behind.
One idea this book exposed me to that I had not really considered before was it's possible to critically analyse communism and reason that it is, fundamentally, immoral. I think many if not most people lucky enough to live in a free market capitalist society would agree that communism/socialism seem very definitely wrong, but you can't really knock the principles behind them (sharing, equality, etc etc) from a moral standpoint. The amazing revelation for me from this book was that indeed you can, and should, fight against these types of ideas which curtail individual choice and freedom, which after all is the ultimate source of happiness for the vast, vast majority of people.
Re:Well... by findoutmoretoday · 2014-01-02 02:10 · Score: 1

As a Westerner you do like most and you avoid to read it, and I know many reasons to keep it that way.
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 02:26 · Score: 0

Or: The God Delusion by Dawkins, Richard
Re:Well... by grouchomarxist · 2014-01-02 02:37 · Score: 1

Next, the book was not meant to be just a story that entertains. She felt very strongly about certain ideals since she transitioned from Communism to Capitalism, and she writes at the very edge of the continuum. You read it, you analyze it, you adopt the ideals that make sense to you and reject those that don't. Not sure why this concept is so foreign nowadays. I don't share her atheism, but I certainly share her ideals on capitalism.
That may be very well for you, but Ayn would say that if you disagree with any of her ideas, especially including atheism, then you don't understand her at all.
Re:Well... by clodney · 2014-01-02 02:54 · Score: 1

I read Anthem in high school, and it remains the only Ayn Rand book I have read. Even as an idealistic 15 year old my conception of Ayn Rand was of someone who would object to laws regulating what side of the street to drive on as an intolerable infringement on her liberty.
Re: Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 03:04 · Score: 0

Reading the Bible will tell you exactly nothing about any of the major current churches that claim it as their, er, Bible. Still worth dipping into to prove to yourself that this is true though.
Re:Well... by canadian_right · 2014-01-02 03:12 · Score: 5, Insightful

As an atheist I often recommend that my religious friend read the bible. Most haven't read the "good book", and most find actually reading it a much better argument against being religious than anything I could tell them.

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Anarchists never rule
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 03:17 · Score: 0

Ain't nobody got time fo' dat! Seriously, that would take half a lifetime.
Re:Well... by canadian_right · 2014-01-02 03:25 · Score: 1

Capitalism is a good system to allocate scarce resources, and it has created wealth for a lot of people, but raw, unfettered capitalism is a disaster for the average person. For a just society to work with our current level of technology capitalism and free markets are an important part of a mix of policies that should include socialist elements to ensure everyone has at least a minimally satisfying life.
Believing there is only one true way to run a society, for example dog eat dog capitalism, or strict communism, generally leads to disaster. A mix of elements that has been shown to produce the best result for the most people should be used. And that best mix has been shown to be a mixed economy like those in northern Europe, France, and somewhat in Canada. The more laissez faire capitalism of the USA is a failure compared to these countries when you look at objective yard sticks like life expectancy, income disparity, social mobility, average salaries, access to medical care, education, etc...
Economic dogma is just as bad as religious dogma.

--
Anarchists never rule
Re:Well... by ShadowBot · 2014-01-02 03:25 · Score: 1

Wow! I wish I could rate your post higher than 5 Crudpuppy!
The fact that you disagree with a central theme of a book does not mean you cannot gain a lot by trying to understand where the writer is coming from!
Ayn Rand books highlights some of the (real and potentially serious) flaws in an increasingly socialist philosophy.
Her suggested soultions are incredibly unrealistic and overly extreme..., her writing style is boring and overly repetitive..., most of her characters are simply implausible.
But, being able to understand where she is coming from, without being carried away to the extreme by her evangelism, will greatly enrich your ability to understand and interact with econonic and political issues in your own society.

--
Quantum Physics a.k.a. sub-molecular statistics
Re:Well... by grub · 2014-01-02 03:33 · Score: 1

The BileBall? All I know about The BileBall it is that it has an Old and New Testicle. I'm fine with that.

.

--
Trolling is a art,
Re:Well... by Kelbear · 2014-01-02 03:39 · Score: 1

I second this, you don't have to read the bible as a religious pursuit.
Knowing what's in the bible allows you to catch a lot of references in the west, but more than that it's very interesting material from an anthropological perspective since it had such a tremendous impact on western society, and continues to do so to this day. You don't need to believe in it in order to understand that it's an incredibly significant book, and enjoy it with the kind of nerdy delight that accompanies the study of fascinating and complex apocrypha. It's useful in conversation, especially when people trot out misquotes or quote it without having understood the context of that passage.
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 04:18 · Score: 0

I'd wait until they have some demonstrated critical thinking ability before reading most of those. If you can't recognise a logical fallacy when you see one then you might not gain much from e.g. the Communist Manifesto. That document is clearly aimed at people who accept what they read at face value.
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 04:25 · Score: 0

Perhaps the conservatives shouldn't have broken the economy through corporate welfare and taking rights away from the workers. 70 years ago, one could get ahead by working hard. These days holiday bonuses and merit raises are increasingly hard to come by. HR drones look for ways of avoiding to pay benefits and CEOs are richly rewarded whether they succeed or not.
Everything that might benefit the working classes is written off as Marxist, and the people doing it have never even bothered to read the Communist Manifesto. Marx himself marveled at the wonders of Capitalism, he just strongly disagreed with allowing the moneyed class to treat the workers as replaceable cogs for exploitation and felt that the workers had a right to some of that which they produced.
I guess I'd put the Communist Manifesto on the list simply so that people don't sound like uneducated, hicks when the subject comes up. The book isn't what a lot of people seem to think.
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 04:27 · Score: 0

I take it you've never met a Bible thumper. They've "read" the book, but they've no clue what any of it means. Chances are they're taking the literal text out of context to justify whatever they want it to believe. The fact that people need to teach other people how to read the book is a pretty good indication that they're not reading it correctly.
Re:Well... by Coffeesloth · 2014-01-02 04:29 · Score: 1

Having read the bible several times I would have to disagree with including it unless you read it in the original language. Too many beliefs have crept in with the translations that corrupt the writings. And if you do include the bible then you should also include the koran and the torah to allow for a broader understanding of religion as a whole. I will agree with most of the rest of your list though... :-)
Re:Well... by CowTipperGore · 2014-01-02 04:41 · Score: 1

So yeah.. What Would Jesus Do? Impose communist bullshit and make half the world starve... or embrace capitalism..
Assuming you believe the New Testament of the Bible represents the words, or at least the intent, of Jesus, you can just see what Jesus had to say.

Armchair communists are so stupid.
Rabid Christian Capitalists are hypocrites and, generally speaking, embarrassingly ignorant of both economics and religion.
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 04:57 · Score: 0

don't give a kid a copy of that without also giving him "Jennifer Government" by Max Barry. It's a fun read set in a dystopia libertarian society.
No need to say, "read both and make up your mind", they'll do that regardless.
Instead, explain what is a strawman argument is, and see if they can find the characters that fit the description.
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 04:58 · Score: 0

Her ideals on capitalism went right out the window when she got sick and needed the government welfare money. It's easy for those who don't need help to claim that nobody should need help. Rand was a borderline fascist and a social darwinist, her ideas don't hold up to the slightest amount of actual analysis.
Re:Well... by Archangel+Michael · 2014-01-02 05:06 · Score: 1

I've read the bible, in several versions, a few times. I remain faithful because of the narrative that most people miss. Man is flawed. ALL of us. None are perfect. And yet, we can strive to do better, and that striving has its own rewards. And yet, the greatest thing I've come away with, is that YHVH doesn't compel people to obedience, except those that choose to obey. We should all learn this lesson, that we should not compel others to our own "morals" (which is why I am also a Libertarian). None of us are capable of even keeping our own moral values, except those that have none (and even they are often hypocritical)
Most of today's Christianity misses that point. Even Jesus didn't condemn the hookers, while he DID condemned the "religious authorities" of his times, calling them hypocrites and vipers.
And when they say "WWJD" I tell them, making a scourge and acts of destruction are still on the table ;)

--
Agent K: A *person* is smart. People are dumb, stupid, panicky animals, and you know it.
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 05:07 · Score: 0

I don't see anything hypocritical with accepting the repayment of what was taken from you unjustly (i.e. by force). And by the way, I'd like to see some actual evidence for that.
Re:Well... by Capt.Albatross · 2014-01-02 05:15 · Score: 1

It's unfortunate that hard working individuals are seen as a fantastical idea in this day and age while couch surfing writers like Karl Marx are idolized.
'Atlas Shrugged' is a fantasy, and one, furthermore, that is based on simplistic wishful thinking. 'How the Other Half Lives' is an example of a book about hard-working individuals.
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 05:35 · Score: 0

Ayn Rand couchsurfed for many years and lived off Social Security
Re:Well... by brunnegd · 2014-01-02 05:41 · Score: 1

The criticisms of Atlas Shrugged come from the liberal media, in concert with their liberal government friends, most of whom graduated from Harvard. They see the book and its ideas as a threat to their concepts of an all-knowing, all controlling government. Much in the same light as was exposed in 1984, Animal House, and Brave New World.
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 05:45 · Score: 0

And then read Christopher Hitchens' "God is Not Great" for an opposing point of view
THANK YOU!!!!
Why fill kids heads with lies designed to control them???
Re: Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 05:49 · Score: 0

How, uh, edifying.
Re:Well... by stdarg · 2014-01-02 06:05 · Score: 1

Tell me what he said. I haven't read most of the Bible. I find it HIGHLY UNLIKELY that Jesus espoused anything like communism or socialism. I suspect he said stuff like be nice to poor people. You do realize that charity is not incompatible with capitalism?
Re:Well... by LienRag · 2014-01-02 06:15 · Score: 1

Actually, no.
Karl Marx was a philosophe, and considered that he needed to understand economy to further his philosophical goals of emancipation.
Anyway, the communist manifesto is highly dated; The Capital is obviously a book of his time, but being observational and analytical rather than programmatic, it is an excellent description of the industrial revolution.
Re:Well... by david672orford · 2014-01-02 06:24 · Score: 1

I agree with you about the nerdy satisfaction to be had, even for those who do not agree with the theology. The last three quarters of Genesis with its descriptions of early Middle Eastern cultures is fascinating. The book of Ester gives us a look into a vanished culture as well as a being gripping story full of dramatic and subtle turns of events. The gospels are also worth reading, but for a different reason. They completely lack the pomp and solemnity so familiar from artistic depictions. In them Jesus is a dynamic figure who criscrosses the country on foot and whose speeches so anger the establishment that he sometimes has to flee immediately after giving them. Finally, I would recommend the book of Acts for its depictions of the Roman world of the first century including extensive descriptions of sea voyages, legal proceedings, and city life.
Re:Well... by CowTipperGore · 2014-01-02 06:38 · Score: 1

Matthew 19:20-22 The young man said to Him, "All these things I have kept; what am I still lacking?" Jesus said to him, "If you wish to be complete, go and sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow Me." But when the young man heard this statement, he went away grieving; for he was one who owned much property.
Luke 12:32-34 Do not be afraid, little flock, for your Father has been pleased to give you the kingdom. Sell your possessions and give to the poor. Provide purses for yourselves that will not wear out, a treasure in heaven that will never fail, where no thief comes near and no moth destroys. For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.
Mark 10:25 It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God
Luke 12:16-20 And he told them this parable: “The ground of a certain rich man yielded an abundant harvest. He thought to himself, ‘What shall I do? I have no place to store my crops.’ “Then he said, ‘This is what I’ll do. I will tear down my barns and build bigger ones, and there I will store my surplus grain. And I’ll say to myself, “You have plenty of grain laid up for many years. Take life easy; eat, drink and be merry.”’ “But God said to him, ‘You fool! This very night your life will be demanded from you. Then who will get what you have prepared for yourself?’
Luke 12:22-26 Then Jesus said to his disciples: “Therefore I tell you, do not worry about your life, what you will eat; or about your body, what you will wear. For life is more than food, and the body more than clothes. Consider the ravens: They do not sow or reap, they have no storeroom or barn; yet God feeds them. And how much more valuable you are than birds! Who of you by worrying can add a single hour to your life? Since you cannot do this very little thing, why do you worry about the rest?
Doesn't sound like much of a capitalist to me...
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 07:10 · Score: 0

11. Bhagavad Gita
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 07:41 · Score: 0

You can't get a job by the sweat of your brow anymore. 40 years working in a factory, plus pension? A pipe dream when free trade and cheap transportation make Bangladesh practically next door. And I guarantee you it doesn't cost even $400 a month just for a roof over there.
Re:Well... by shutdown+-p+now · 2014-01-02 08:05 · Score: 1

The same goes for The Capital, by the way. You may not agree with the conclusions presented therein, but it's still worthwhile for the observations that it captures alone, and, at the very least, if you disagree with its logic, you need to be able to articulate why - which is impossible if you are not familiar with it. Like many such books, most people who haven't read it "know" about it from the refutations of Marx's ideological opponents, and, as usual, most of those are soundbites that vastly simplify or outright distort what he wrote (e.g. the critique of the labor theory of value - not Marx's invention, but something that he definitely helped popularize - is all too often dealing with a strawman and not the real thing).
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 10:19 · Score: 0

Your conception is wrong:
http://capitalism.aynrand.org/yaron-answers-what-would-driving-laws-be-like-in-a-free-society/
Of course, I don't recall where Rand specifically targeted traffic regulations. It may not have hit her radar of 'shit that mattered'. Which is to say, your conception is very wrong. She wasn't an anarchist though she might prefer an organizational structure as suggested by Yaron in that link.
It wasn't a BFD (to her - else she could have written about it).
To Rand, the "intolerable infringement on her liberty" was living as a prisoner inside the confines of the USSR. She got out. She moved to a society where she could speak/write her mind with complete freedom (regarless of whether or not that society still exists as it did at her death in 1982), not drive like a maniac. That was the shit that mattered. Grow the fuck up already.
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 10:41 · Score: 0

The Protocols of the Elders of Zion
Re:Well... by EmperorOfCanada · 2014-01-02 14:30 · Score: 1

I did read it and there was no mention of Quaaludes. Actually it has been a long time but I don't remember him covering the banking sector corrupting the government into handing the nation's wealth to them and a few of their friends. But knowing his genius he did cover it. I almost wonder if that is why economists end up coming up with really stupid ideas; the problem being that he sort of wrote a near perfect textbook and that in reality that the entire branch of economics should be making tiny fixes to his book instead of trying to write a new one.

And yes people read whatever they want into Wealth of Nations; often to justify their completely batshit economic ideas that have almost no relationship with his. Sort of like Intel saying, "The Atom architecture is better than the ARM architecture because Atom is close to Adam and thus the Bible says so. Intelius 3:17"
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 14:58 · Score: 0

I read Atlas Shrugged while young and easily influenced, open to libertarian values, but even naive I could tell what a badly written book that was. It is boring, dragged out, and thought provoking only in a way of "there are people who actually are this inhuman?"
If anything it convinced me *against* libertarian values.
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 17:42 · Score: 0

1984
Animal Farm
The Master and Margarita
Anna Karenina
War and Peace
Julius Caesar's Chronicles
Gibbon's Fall of the Roman Empire
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 21:32 · Score: 0

Blah blah blah.
And your point of view is so valid and important, that you are hiding it behind the AC.
Re:Well... by geekbastard · 2014-01-03 05:49 · Score: 1

The criticisms of Atlas Shrugged come from the liberal media, in concert with their liberal government friends, most of whom graduated from Harvard. They see the book and its ideas as a threat to their concepts of an all-knowing, all controlling government. Much in the same light as was exposed in 1984, Animal Farm, and Brave New World.
Fixed that for you. I'm not sure the fantastic John Landis film from the 70's was telling the same tale as those other works. Though if looked at from a certain angle I suppose some similarities could be found.
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-03 07:37 · Score: 0

I think you just show your ignorance of Catholic theology and ecocnmics here. Pope Francis did not say that supply side economics were a failure. He said that adherance to supply side economics could not replace charity when dealing with the poor. Christ said that the poor will always exists. No economic system will ever reduce poverty to zero. Like democracy capitalism is the worst system every created, except for all of the others. The reason that there will always be poor people is that some people will always make bad decisions and some peopel will always be unlucky. Like the homeless man who is homeless because he has burned all his bridges with family members, friends and employers some people just will always be poor.
Not a popular state of affairs for the left, but an accurate protrayal of the way things are.
Re:Well... by LaughALot · 2014-01-03 08:26 · Score: 1

In the late stages of the Second World War, Evelyn Waugh was trapped in Europe in the company of Randolph Churchill, the boorish son of the wartime prime minister. "In the hope of keeping him quiet," he wrote to Nancy Mitford, "Freddie and I bet him £20 that he cannot read the whole Bible in a fortnight. Unhappily it has not had the result we hoped. He has never read any of it before and is hideously excited; keeps reading quotations aloud... or merely slapping his side & chortling 'God, isn't God a shit!'."
Re:Well... by PopeRatzo · 2014-01-03 15:51 · Score: 1

I think you just show your ignorance of Catholic theology and ecocnmics here. Pope Francis did not say that supply side economics were a failure. He said that adherance to supply side economics could not replace charity when dealing with the poor.
That is a very interesting interpretation of what Pope Francis wrote. In fact, he never mentioned anything about supply-side economics and its ability or inability to "replace charity".
Here's the money quote from his mission letter:
âoeSome people continue to defend trickle-down theories which assume that economic growth, encouraged by a free market, will inevitably succeed in bringing about greater justice and inclusiveness in the world,â Francis wrote in the papal statement. âoeThis opinion, which has never been confirmed by the facts, expresses a crude and naive trust in the goodness of those wielding economic power and in the sacraÂlized workings of the prevailing economic system.â
âoeMeanwhile,â he added, âoethe excluded are still waiting.â
He's pretty clear about the "inability" of free markets and economic growth to "succeed in bringing about greater justice and inclusiveness in the world.â
I'm amused by the way conservative Catholics and other purveyors of the American Civil Religion (evangelical Christianity) are trying to spin the Pope's pretty straightforward statement.
Here's the full text of the Pope's letter:
http://apps.washingtonpost.com/g/page/politics/pope-francis-denounces-economic-inequality-consumerism/619/

--
You are welcome on my lawn.
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-04 06:37 · Score: 0

> You read it, you analyze it, you adopt the ideals that make sense to you and reject those that don't
And then you lose your job or blow your money and resources on a wild-ass startup because what makes brilliant sense at 14 is no longer beaten out of you by parents who know better. Laisez faire captalism is what happens when people whose parents pay for everything important think they're brilliant profiteers and moralists because they get an allowance.
Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-04 06:54 · Score: 0

Pope Francis is *fascinating*. He's a Jesuit, a Catholic order of priests that are often considered the right arm of the Church and were leaders of the Inquisition. But they're now also the scholars of the Catholic Church, deeply involved in medicine and technology. I take their theology very seorusly, because *they* take it serously, and they're wonderful to explore logic and science with. They traditionally also filled the role of the "Devil's Advocate", a real Catholic official that tried to verify or discredit the miracles and claims made for candidates for sainthood. That office has been closed, and there's been a huge flood of minor saints with poorly established "miracles" to their name. I hope Francis brings this office back, it was a wonderful office that helped protect the *believability* of Catholic claims.
Several people on my thesis committee were Jesuits. In a battle of wits, I want them on *my* side, because they take it seriously. And lord, do they make other orders nervous. Their demands for proof of claims and documentation and the chain of custody of data was very helpful to me as an honest researcher making claims that disproved decades of "respected" work in my field. The underlying claims of decades of rowk turned out to be true, but the experiments were clearly flawed and perhaps some had even been fraudulent. We never would have found *why* things failed in my tests without their involvement, nor how to do the work right.
And lord, can they drink like fish! I swear, most of them only say Mass to get a free drink from their church.
Re:Well... by stdarg · 2014-01-04 21:06 · Score: 1

None of your quotes are anti-capitalist.
The first two say to sell your possessions and give to the poor. Capitalists sell stuff. Capitalists engage in charity as I already pointed out.
Then we see it's hard for rich people to go to heaven. Most people in capitalist societies are not rich.
Then there's some parable about someone who spends his last day thinking about his business without knowing that he's dying. What does this have to do with capitalism? It might just as well have been a parable about a guy wasting his time with a stamp collection even though he's about to die.
Last one is about God providing for you or something. Again I don't know what you think this has to do with capitalism specifically. Do you think capitalism is the only economic system where people have to work for their food? How do you think food is provided in communist societies?? Do you think God just gives it to everybody and nobody has to work??
If anything, the quotes you found are about how to be a Christian IN a capitalist society. It's like you're forgetting that the people in a capitalist system are still people... they still have families, they still love things, they are nice or mean, they have priorities other than money, they have emotional needs and maybe spiritual needs too. Capitalism is just an economic system, it's not a 100% complete blueprint for your life.
I suggest that you look to your Bible for values, but look at the real world to see how best to implement those values. Like I suspected, Jesus said (twice in your quotes) to give to the poor but did not lay out HOW to give. So it's up to you to choose. Well guess what... capitalism gives to the poor. It has given more to the poor than any other system, and lifted the most poor out of poverty. So if your value is "give to the poor" then a smart person would say "Ah, let's make a capitalist society to help the poor." Not "Oh gee, capitalism sounds evil, Jesus wouldn't approve, let's just be communist even though it makes everyone's lives worse."
Re:Well... by OneAhead · 2014-01-05 16:53 · Score: 1

I think that's exactly what GP meant with the sentence in parentheses following "Atlas Shrugged". See also his #9 and #10.
Re:Well... by CowTipperGore · 2014-01-06 05:52 · Score: 1

You equate selling all of your possessions, giving the money to the poor, and giving up your life to follow Jesus with selling some stuff and giving a pittance to charity? The rest of your retorts are equally ridicules and ill conceived.

"Oh gee, capitalism sounds evil, Jesus wouldn't approve, let's just be communist even though it makes everyone's lives worse."
Your fascination with capitalism vs communism and the good/evil nature of these theoretical economic systems is juvenile. I never suggested that either system is good or bad. I merely pointed out the error of your WWJD comment.
Re:Well... by stdarg · 2014-01-07 10:44 · Score: 1

You equate selling all of your possessions, giving the money to the poor, and giving up your life to follow Jesus with selling some stuff and giving a pittance to charity?
No I'm not equating them. Typically people who aspire to be like Jesus don't reach the goal 100%, and that's considered ok. If Jesus says "Sell everything and give it to the poor" that doesn't become a commandment, it just means Jesus wants you to give to the poor, and ideally give enough that it makes you uncomfortable.

The rest of your retorts are equally ridicules and ill conceived.
You posted some stuff from the Bible that was supposed to show Jesus endorsing communism, and I don't think it did. I took the time to respond to each point and you come up with this crap? Thanks!
Seriously, if you don't want to have a discussion, why did you bother posting?

Your fascination with capitalism vs communism and the good/evil nature of these theoretical economic systems is juvenile. I never suggested that either system is good or bad.
Good/evil nature? All I said was that historically capitalism has produced more wealth and lifted more people out of poverty than communism. What does that have to do with the "nature" of the economic system? What is juvenile about that? When did I use the words "good" or "evil"?
Thanks for wasting my time!
Re:Well... by CowTipperGore · 2014-01-07 11:45 · Score: 1

If Jesus says "Sell everything and give it to the poor" that doesn't become a commandment, it just means Jesus wants you to give to the poor, and ideally give enough that it makes you uncomfortable.
You remind me of too many Christians who give a bad name to that Jesus guy. He apparently made some pretty clear statements but you're sure he didn't really mean them. Between me and you, I'm okay with you not caring what Jesus said, or not believing that the Bible accurately reflects it, or any other host of arguments. But to claim that he didn't mean what he said is a pretty weak one.

You posted some stuff from the Bible that was supposed to show Jesus endorsing communism, and I don't think it did.
Again, your simplistic black or white view makes the conversation difficult. I never said he endorsed communism. I said he wasn't a capitalist. There is a huge range of options between those two. But you've assumed that someone opposing unbridled capitalism must be a communist.

Seriously, if you don't want to have a discussion, why did you bother posting?
I enjoy a good conversation but posts like yours tend to irritate me. I say things that I normally wouldn't or come off ruder than I probably should have. The views you've shared on this thread are terribly simplistic and unrealistic. Posting stuff like
capitalism has created more wealth for the poor and meek than any other economic system. While millions starved under Communism, the more capitalist grew rich and developed social safety nets for the poor...What Would Jesus Do? Impose communist bullshit and make half the world starve... or embrace capitalism.
indicates that you have a very shallow understanding of economics, history, and religion. You've done nothing thus far to disabuse me of that notion. Perhaps they don't really represent your thoughts, but what you've posted really leaves little room for discussion. Capitalism does not exist in the real world. Neither does communism. Capitalism is a brutal system that results in most of the wealth concentrated at the top, some middle class trying to grab their piece of the pie, and a lot of really poor people at the bottom. Communist systems theoretically eliminate this huge disparity but have little incentive for growth and are inherently unworkable because they require people in charge who will take advantage. What you have in the real world is a mix of these and other economic systems in various quantities. More capitalistic societies have done poorer at providing safety nets for those that the capitalists build their wealth upon. Less capitalistic societies have done poorer at harnessing human ingenuity and sustaining growth.
Re:Well... by jwhitener · 2014-01-07 12:59 · Score: 1

Well, influence or not, there seems to be a bigger problem with having the average person read the Bible: the Bible cannot be read in isolation.
I fail to see how any casual reader is going to get anything out of the Bible without the help of trained scholars explaining different sections in historical context. Taking a class about Biblical history might be worthwhile, as a means of understanding some of the historical influences on western culture, but the Bible itself is full of tiny stories (some true, some false, some embellished, some horrible translated over time, etc...) that have very little real value without a lot of trained interpretative skills.
Re:Well... by stdarg · 2014-01-08 03:22 · Score: 1

You remind me of too many Christians who give a bad name to that Jesus guy. He apparently made some pretty clear statements but you're sure he didn't really mean them.
Yeah I'm completely sure he didn't mean that every person should sell everything and give it to the poor. Know why? It's logically impossible. If everybody is selling, and nobody is buying, then nobody can actually sell anything.
Look, I'm not a Bible scholar and I don't pretend to be one. I don't care which is why I freely admitted I haven't read most of the Bible. To me it's perfectly plausible that in your quote about selling everything and giving it to the poor, since he was actually talking to one particular guy who happened to own a lot of property, he was purposely giving him a personal challenge that he would fail, so that the guy knew what it was like to fail, to have empathy with others who fail like poor people. Or maybe it's a lesson about how to get into Heaven -- not just by being good because it's easier for some people to be good than others, but by being good in a way that causes you to sacrifice painfully according to your own situation. That's also a common theme I believe.
The Bible is not an econ textbook. Reading economic theory into some random quote from Jesus is frankly stupid. I'm pretty sure Jesus is big on empathy, and a lesson about empathy is more fitting with the Bible than a lesson about what economic system you should support.

But to claim that he didn't mean what he said is a pretty weak one.
The guy chiding me for my "simplistic black or white view" is arguing that nobody could disagree about what Jesus meant versus what he said. Classic.

I never said he endorsed communism. I said he wasn't a capitalist.
Good for you. I never said he was a capitalist.
I don't think Jesus said much about economics at all in the Bible. That's why I challenged you to show that he did say something for an economic system -- and I left out capitalism because you already revealed that you don't think Jesus embraced capitalism. Remember what I said? "Tell me what he said. I haven't read most of the Bible. I find it HIGHLY UNLIKELY that Jesus espoused anything like communism or socialism. I suspect he said stuff like be nice to poor people."

There is a huge range of options between those two. But you've assumed that someone opposing unbridled capitalism must be a communist.
Good for you. If you're not going to say what he IS, then the discussion is free to move to what he IS NOT. And I said he is not a communist or a socialist. So? The fact that Jesus is not a communist does not exclude your "huge range of options."
Frankly I don't know why you're hung up on Jesus and the Bible in this discussion. The person I originally responded to claimed that to embrace Ayn Rand's ideals about capitalism, you must be an atheist, or at least reject the Christian ideals of God. I disagree. And in the question "What Would Jesus Do?" the operative word is WOULD. Not DID. It's not "What DID Jesus Do." So the question of whether Jesus WAS a capitalist or a communist is neither here nor there. Those concepts were not well formed back then. Jesus was none of those things, which is why I said it's highly unlikely that you'll find quotes espousing any economic system.
The question is what economic system WOULD Jesus support RIGHT NOW. If he would support more capitalist systems because (as I said) they ended up in hindsight bringing more wealth and stability to people than the alternatives, then the original poster's insistence that Christianity and capitalism are incompatible is incorrect because it's something Jesus WOULD support. (Not DID support.)

Capitalism does not exist in the real world. Neither does communism.
Yup. This isn't high school. You don't need to explicitly add the standard disclaimers every time you use words like capitalism a
Re:Well... by CowTipperGore · 2014-01-08 04:18 · Score: 1

I never said he was a capitalist.
You spent several posts trying to defend your assumed support of Jesus for capitalism. And now you suddenly claim you never said he was a capitalist? Technically, no you didn't say he was a capitalist. You said he would embrace capitalism instead of communist bullshit. I posted some quotes and said he doesn't sound like much of a capitalist. You disagreed. Now you're apparently backing away from that. That's fine.

If you're not going to say what he IS, then the discussion is free to move to what he IS NOT. And I said he is not a communist or a socialist. So? The fact that Jesus is not a communist does not exclude your "huge range of options."
Perhaps that is what you wish you said or meant to say. However, it is simple to look at the thread above and see that you actually said: What Would Jesus Do? Impose communist bullshit and make half the world starve... or embrace capitalism... I didn't make any claims to Jesus's support for any economic system, that was you, remember?

Frankly I don't know why you're hung up on Jesus and the Bible in this discussion
I'm not "hung up" on Jesus and the Bible. You took the conversation there and I disagreed with your spurious claim.

...And in the question "What Would Jesus Do?" the operative word is WOULD. Not DID. It's not "What DID Jesus Do." So the question of whether Jesus WAS a capitalist or a communist is neither here nor there. Those concepts were not well formed back then. Jesus was none of those things, which is why I said it's highly unlikely that you'll find quotes espousing any economic system.
I didn't claim he was a capitalist or communist, only that your original claim was bullshit. If you want to believe that Jesus would be the Wolf of Wall Street rather than Mother Teresa, feel free. Just realize that you have no actual support for the idea.

Modern countries with great safety nets for the poor, like say Denmark, are "more capitalist" than, say, the USSR. Therefore "more capitalist" societies can do a better job at providing safety nets. And I'm not just being tongue-in-cheek here or arguing on a technicality -- I think it's the fact that Denmark is more capitalist than the USSR that gives them the wealth to provide those safety nets. And ultimately safety nets are as much a function of wealth as government type or economic system.
Wow. Denmark is your example of a more capitalist society? Denmark has the highest total tax pressure in the world. It has the smallest private sector in Europe and supports one of the biggest public sectors. It is generally considered one of the most socialist nations today and the antithesis of what capitalists want in their world. Denmark’s people also constantly rank among the happiest in the world and they work far less hours than Americans, while enjoying excellent infrastructure, health care, and other measures of quality of life.
Re:Well... by Hognoxious · 2014-01-11 11:12 · Score: 1

Par for the course in Philosophy, a field where one tries to nail Jello to a tree, and sometimes succeeds, however briefly.

There's probably a temperature range where it's cold enough that it goes hard but too warm that it goes brittle.
The jello, not the tree, FFS.

--
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
Re:Well... by stdarg · 2014-01-13 10:03 · Score: 1

You spent several posts trying to defend your assumed support of Jesus for capitalism. And now you suddenly claim you never said he was a capitalist?
Yes! I never said he was a capitalist, or that anything in the Bible would support capitalism. And if you read the posts I responded to (before you entered the conversation) maybe you'd understand. I was replying to someone who said the extreme capitalism that Ayn Rand espoused is incompatible with traditional Christianity. The blog post that the person gave as support of that view said, among other things, that the treatment of the poor in particular was one point where Ayn Rand's capitalism was overtly incompatible with Christianity. My view is that capitalism, even the extreme kind, is not incompatible with Christianity, and I gave the example of capitalism fulfilling the traditional Christian duty to help the poor.

You said he would embrace capitalism instead of communist bullshit. I posted some quotes and said he doesn't sound like much of a capitalist.
No, in your little recap you're forgetting your first post in response to me where you said "Assuming you believe the New Testament of the Bible represents the words, or at least the intent, of Jesus, you can just see what Jesus had to say."
Important not to forget that first post because..

However, it is simple to look at the thread above and see that you actually said: What Would Jesus Do? Impose communist bullshit and make half the world starve... or embrace capitalism... I didn't make any claims to Jesus's support for any economic system, that was you, remember?
In that first post, you in fact DID claim that his support for an economic system existed and was supported by text in the Bible. You did not name the economic system in your claim, though the implication was that he was anti-capitalist (otherwise you wouldn't have disagreed with me). You further implied the support was clear and easy to understand without nuanced interpretation (you used the words "just see").
When called on it, you attempted to produce quotes that support your claim, but they did not. Your quotes did not speak to ANY economic system and did not answer my question of Jesus's theoretical modern support of capitalism vs communism in the slightest.

I'm not "hung up" on Jesus and the Bible. You took the conversation there
Ridiculous. You do realize the thread was going on before you jumped in? The person I replied to said that Ayn Rand's capitalism is incompatible with traditional Christianity. He was replying to someone who said he disagreed with Ayn Rand's atheism but appreciated her views on capitalism. That's what took the conversation to the point about whether capitalism and Christianity are incompatible.
You are the one who took the conversation to the actual text of the Bible and what Jesus supposedly said about capitalism -- which turned out to be totally unfounded, because the quotes had nothing to do with capitalism or any other economic system, as I suspected initially.

Wow. Denmark is your example of a more capitalist society? Denmark has the highest total tax pressure in the world. It has the smallest private sector in Europe and supports one of the biggest public sectors.
Yup. Granted.

It is generally considered one of the most socialist nations today
Do you know what defines socialism? Public ownership of the means of production. Do you know what the means of production are? Let me quote Wikipedia for you:

In economics and sociology, the means of production refers to physical, non-human inputs used in production; that is, the "means of production" includes capital assets used to produce wealth, such as machinery, tools and factories, including both infrastructural capital and natural capital.
Now let me ask you, in Denmark, do you think mo
Re:Well... by CowTipperGore · 2014-01-13 11:05 · Score: 1

Yes! I never said he was a capitalist, or that anything in the Bible would support capitalism. => So yeah.. What Would Jesus Do? Impose communist bullshit and make half the world starve... or embrace capitalism
If the nits that you wish to pick are that you said he WOULD embrace capitalism rather than he IS a capitalist, then you're arguing semantics that don't exist. This whole discussion has become pointless.

In that first post, you in fact DID claim that his support for an economic system existed and was supported by text in the Bible.
No, I didn't. This is a lie. Or perhaps I'm assuming too much and you are simply failing at logical reasoning. You seem to think that my argument against your position is an explicit advancement of what you see as your negative position. Therefore, if I'm arguing against your claim that Jesus would embrace capitalism, I'm obviously saying that Jesus was a communist or at least made clear his support for some other economic system. This is a fallacy.

You did not name the economic system in your claim, though the implication was that he was anti-capitalist
Ahh, and here we are again. If I say I don't believe in the Christian God nor their religious dogma, does that automatically make me an atheist? Does it make me a Muslim? Can you use my statement to show I support any particular religion? Of course not. I claimed that Jesus's words, as reflected in the Christian Bible, do not show him as a capitalist. Simple. The first half of your latest post is wasted; you're trying to build a strawman.

When called on it, you attempted to produce quotes that support your claim, but they did not. Your quotes did not speak to ANY economic system and did not answer my question of Jesus's theoretical modern support of capitalism vs communism in the slightest.
Because the only way to know which economic system Jesus would be more likely to support is if he explicitly expounded upon the pros and cons of the various options? And if that is your position, how the hell did you decide that he would embrace capitalism? In your simplistic view, capitalism is good and communism is bad; Jesus was a good guy; therefore, Jesus would embrace capitalism and shun communism. End of story.

You are the one who took the conversation to the actual text of the Bible and what Jesus supposedly said about capitalism...
So yeah.. What Would Jesus Do? Impose communist bullshit and make half the world starve... or embrace capitalism.. You're claiming those aren't your words? Or, do you mean that I challenged your comment so that makes me responsible for the conversation? Interesting view either way.

...which turned out to be totally unfounded, because the quotes had nothing to do with capitalism or any other economic system, as I suspected initially.
Your responses made obvious that a letter addressed to you, from Jesus, clearly laying out his objections to capitalism, would have been waved away as insufficient. Seriously, I wasted very little time on that part of the conversation because it was clear you had no interest in reasonable discussion.

Do you know what defines socialism...I agree with you that Denmark is one of the "most socialist nations today." That is beyond dispute. Where we disagree is that Denmark is A SOCIALIST NATION.
Again, your simplistic black and white outlook makes discussion impossible. I never said that Denmark is A SOCIALIST NATION. As I've said in previous posts, there are no pure capitalist nor socialist nations - they don't exist. Every real world economy is a mix. You agree that Denmark is as close to the EVIL SOCIALISM end of the scale as any country today, yet hold them up as a capitalist success.

They tend towards socialism but are rather more capitalist than soci
Re:Well... by stdarg · 2014-01-14 04:42 · Score: 1

If the nits that you wish to pick are that you said he WOULD embrace capitalism rather than he IS a capitalist, then you're arguing semantics that don't exist. This whole discussion has become pointless.
You're contradicting yourself. If my argument is based on semantics that don't exist, then the discussion is not pointless because my argument is incorrect and you have the opportunity to point that out.
That being said, there is an important semantic difference between "would" and "did". "Would" is present tense, conditional. It describes a hypothetical situation taking place in the present. "Did" is past tense, indicative. It describes what someone, well, DID in the past.
The fact that you don't pick up on semantic differences doesn't mean they don't exist, it means you don't read very carefully and jump in without understanding what you're replying to.

No, I didn't. This is a lie. Or perhaps I'm assuming too much and you are simply failing at logical reasoning.
Or the third possibility, you don't understand the implications of what you yourself wrote. That seems to happen a lot with you. Go back and read it again. What I said was accurate. You claimed Jesus weighed in on capitalism vs communism, and that you could back it up with quotes from the Bible, which you then attempted to do.

Therefore, if I'm arguing against your claim that Jesus would embrace capitalism, I'm obviously saying that Jesus was a communist or at least made clear his support for some other economic system.
No, and clearly I never believed that because I did not criticize your quotes on the grounds that they failed to show Jesus was pro-communist or pro-something-else. You argued against my claim he would embrace capitalism, and you should have shown some evidence that he was anti-capitalist. IF you recall (which you obviously don't, so scroll up), I criticized your quotes for not being anti-capitalist. Since your quotes did not show that Jesus was not a capitalist (they did not speak to capitalism or any other economic system, you may as well have quoted Jesus discussing the sunset one night), you failed to defend your argument. You ended your post with "Doesn't sound like much of a capitalist to me..." and I started my reply with "None of your quotes were anti-capitalist." So where did you come up with this bullshit argument that I think you think Jesus was a raging communist?
As I've said repeatedly, you're not going to win the argument by quoting the Bible. Jesus did not discuss economics in the Bible as far as I know. It's not there. Your idea of quoting Jesus to answer my question was frankly ignorant and showed that you were incapable of discussing the meat of my post (whether capitalism has helped more poor people than other economic systems, which was about 75% of the text I posted, versus ONE LINE at the end about Jesus as a conclusion) so instead you latched onto a perceived weakness (that I'm a rabid Christian) which turned out to be false.

If I say I don't believe in the Christian God nor their religious dogma, does that automatically make me an atheist? Does it make me a Muslim? Can you use my statement to show I support any particular religion?
If you don't believe in the Christian God nor their religious dogma, it automatically makes you something other than Christian. I can state that definitively. Could be atheist, could be Muslim, could be something else. If you claim there's a document that answers the question of whether you embrace Christianity or not, then I would expect to find a statement in it that is either anti-Christian or pro-something-else. If there is no such statement, then your answer was a non-answer and you shouldn't have said it.

You're claiming those aren't your words? Or, do you mean that I challenged your comment so that makes me responsible for the conversation? Interesting view either way.
I've t
Re:Well... by CowTipperGore · 2014-01-14 05:47 · Score: 1

First, I claim that the quotes you provided are not anti-capitalist. If you agree, don't reply to this point, and we'll be done with it.
I've made perfectly clear that I don't agree and that further discussion of this point is useless. We can't talk about trees when you insist that oaks have teeth and walk around at night. I told you days ago to feel free to believe what you want. You can no longer claim ignorance. But who cares?

Second, I claim that capitalism is more successful than other economic systems at accomplishing some of Christianity's most important goals such as being kind to the poor, due to its historical success at elevating the poor out of poverty and raising standards of living.
And as long as you are free to define capitalism as any system that has been successful, I guess you're right. But in the real world, capitalism sucks at being kind to the poor so it gets tempered with some socialist pieces to help. Or a lot of socialist pieces, like your example of Denmark.

Third, I claim that because of that positive claim and the lack of claims AGAINST capitalism being compatible with Christianity, capitalism IS compatible with traditional Christianity and one does not have to choose between being a "good Christian" and a "good capitalist." In other words, the typical Christian duties like being kind to the poor can be fulfilled by an individual living in a capitalist society without violating the few principles of capitalism that direct personal behavior.
Yet another moving target. Absolutely, an individual living in a capitalist society can follow typical Christian duties. That is not the same as Jesus being a capitalist.

That being said, there is an important semantic difference between "would" and "did". "Would" is present tense, conditional. It describes a hypothetical situation taking place in the present. "Did" is past tense, indicative. It describes what someone, well, DID in the past....I warn you though that semantics are important and if you continue to slip up about stuff like did vs would which have very different meanings, I will continue to point out your errors. Read more carefully.
This section is a great example at just what a mammoth waste of time this has been. You are an idiot and I'm done hoping that you have some capability for rational discourse.

The Bible by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:23 · Score: 3, Insightful

Start with the Gospel of John and then Romans.

Re:The Bible by RelaxedTension · 2014-01-01 10:47 · Score: 4, Interesting

Good pick!

The Bible has has intrigue, death on a massive scale, hypocrisy, and damnation, the makings of a great work of fiction. And that's just the parts the character god plays, never mind the other players that come and go. As you move through the stories, you get a sense of the ruthlessness of all involved (especially the writers) to stop at nothing in their attempts to control those around them through fear and intimidation. Thrilling!

On the minus side they forgot to do a continuity check after the constant re-writes that were done century after century to "update" it to current "standards". This leads to a fair amount of contradictions the subplots, such as what a person can and cannot do to anger the main character (spoiler: He gets mad at pretty much anything that has to do with personal pleasure, or things that don't involve group chanting and prostrating).

It is an epic read though, and if you can stick with it you are certain to come away with a greater appreciation of those afflicted with mental illness.
Re:The Bible by clarkkent09 · 2014-01-01 11:01 · Score: 3, Insightful

You cannot understand a lot of the modern Western society's norms, customs and even laws, never mind art, music, architecture and so much more without being familiar with the stories of the Bible. It is a matter of basic education about the society you live in which, thank God, was not created by militant atheists like some others I could mention.

--
Negative moral value of force outweighs the positive value of good intentions.
Re:The Bible by Immerman · 2014-01-01 11:31 · Score: 1

Really? How many societies can you name that were created by militant atheists? I can think of several that fell under their sway at some point, but none actually created by them. Atheism as an organized force seems to be a fairly recent phenomena. And really I think the problems with those can be laid at the militant part, societies built around militant religions tend to be at least as bad, once normalized for population size and technological capability.

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--- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
Re:The Bible by Bing+Tsher+E · 2014-01-01 11:43 · Score: 1

There are a number of failed societies: The USSR and North Korea come to mind. Also the PRC.
Re:The Bible by clarkkent09 · 2014-01-01 11:51 · Score: 0

How many societies can you name that were created by militant atheists?

I think 20th century Communist countries come pretty close. They may not have succeeded perfectly in their goal to erase any remains of the traditional order, usually based on religion, and to create a new socialist man, but they sure tried hard enough to kill tens of millions in the process.

--
Negative moral value of force outweighs the positive value of good intentions.
Re:The Bible by Tsingi · 2014-01-01 12:09 · Score: 3, Insightful

created by militant atheists
You mean the atheists runing around killing abortion doctors on the command of no god whatsoever, or the atheists blowing themselves up in the name of no higher order?
Or do you mean that the bad things that were not done in the name of a god are the fault of all people that don't believe in gods?
There is no such thing as atheist dogma, so there is nothing for militant atheists to be militant about. There are non-religious dogmas, such as Stalinism. Please explain how all atheists are responsible for, or support these. You know, like how all Catholics support bigotry because they subscribe to Catholocism.
Re:The Bible by ranton · 2014-01-01 13:24 · Score: 4, Insightful

There are a number of failed societies: The USSR and North Korea come to mind. Also the PRC.
Doing something in the name of non-religious dogma such as Communism is not the same thing as doing something in the name of Atheism. When I root for my favorite football team I am not doing it in the name of Atheism just because I happen to be an atheist. But when I root for the US team in the Olympics I am doing it in the name of patriotism or nationalism.
What matters is why someone is doing what they are doing. My atheism is only responsible for things I do in the name of atheism, not everything I do just because I have no religion. And just about the only thing I do in the name of atheism is defend why it is the only rational viewpoint to have, or advocate why organized religion is no longer necessary (not trying to start that debate in this thread, just pointing out some actions I perform because of my atheist beliefs). These are the only things you can blame my atheism for.

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-- All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. -- Edmund Burke
Re:The Bible by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 13:31 · Score: 0

I can explain the bigotry. It's necessary for most religions. For example, faith, is a type of bigotry.
Re:The Bible by RelaxedTension · 2014-01-01 14:20 · Score: 1

Actually, those states sought to replace the religious worship of gods with religious worship of the state. North Korea is a perfect example of that. They can't abide a possible rival for the hearts and souls of the people, so they just replaced the religions. It amounts to the same thing as any organized religion, with the exception of the state and their leaders being real actual things, while religions that have nothing but an unprovable promise.
Re:The Bible by PPH · 2014-01-01 15:57 · Score: 2

And then read "Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds". The Bible will then become clear for what it is.

--
Have gnu, will travel.
Re:The Bible by Concerned+Onlooker · 2014-01-01 16:01 · Score: 1

"...militant atheistsâ¦"
I have yet to see an atheist that is as militant as Jerry Falwell, Pat Robertson or any of your garden variety tent revival blowhards.

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http://www.rootstrikers.org/
Re:The Bible by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 16:32 · Score: 0

You cannot understand a lot of the modern Western society's norms, customs and even laws, never mind art, music, architecture and so much more without being familiar with the stories of the Bible. It is a matter of basic education about the society you live in which, thank God, was not created by militant atheists like some others I could mention.
One should read the bible in preparation for that glorious day one can stand up to correct the spittle-chinned, bible-thumping huckster huckster, elected by popular vote, after said demagogue uses a misquotation to defend an abhorrent policy.
Re:The Bible by smash · 2014-01-01 17:08 · Score: 1

Nah he means the militant atheists who used WMDs on civilians in WW2, invaded the Gulf, continually bomb weddings in Afghanistan, etc. oh wait...

--
I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
Re:The Bible by smash · 2014-01-01 17:09 · Score: 1

I got about halfway through the first page of the bible before the bullshit flag had been raised (not due to fantastic unbelievable events, but due to contradiction with itself), and I ceased, rather than further poison my mind.

--
I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
Re:The Bible by bingoUV · 2014-01-01 19:40 · Score: 1

Ok, so you are an atheist. If you happen to be militant as well, it is completely correct to say your post was made by a militant atheist. Irrespective of which -ism the post was made in the name of.

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Bingo Dictionary - Pragmatist, n. A myopic idealist.
Re:The Bible by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 23:18 · Score: 0

militant atheist = someone that disagrees with a theist
Re:The Bible by canadian_right · 2014-01-02 03:35 · Score: 1

I don't collect stamps. Is everything I do militant not collecting stamps?
Being an Atheist is like not collecting stamps. The non stamp collector doesn't want the stamp collectors passing laws that make non stamp collectors second class citizens, but most of the time the non stamp collector is not obsessing about not collecting stamps.

--
Anarchists never rule
Re:The Bible by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 03:39 · Score: 1

Atheism implies naturalism. Naturalism, brought to its logical conclusion, requires exercise of 'might makes right' (the sort of moral consequence of survival of the fittest). If you are the superior evolved being, then it's your duty to enslave or annihilate any lesser beings. This was the justification of Hitler and Stalin, among others. They've been responsible for the deaths of 100M+, and you're going to compare that to abortion-doctor-killers and suicide-bombers? I don't agree with the latter either, but let's get order of magnitude in perspective and understand where great destruction really comes from.
Re:The Bible by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 03:50 · Score: 0

You cannot understand a lot of the modern Western society's norms, customs and even laws, never mind art, music, architecture and so much more without being familiar with the stories of the Bible.
you can get most of that by reading the childerns versions of those stories. 95+% of westerners never go beyond that anyway.
Re:The Bible by ranton · 2014-01-02 04:35 · Score: 1

Ok, so you are an atheist. If you happen to be militant as well, it is completely correct to say your post was made by a militant atheist. Irrespective of which -ism the post was made in the name of.
Okay, I re-read the grand parent and he did use the words "created by militant atheists" so he was actually wrong because by some definitions of "militant atheists" it would apply to some communist countries.
Later in his post he makes it clear what he means: that there are no cultures where militant atheism is integral to the culture. There are ones where the state has tried to abolish all other strong social structures, like religion, but none where this was a central tenant of the society.
But I do concede that he chose his words poorly in the first sentence, and I did not catch that.

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-- All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. -- Edmund Burke
Re:The Bible by Archangel+Michael · 2014-01-02 05:28 · Score: 1

When atheists (via their government) kill religious people for their religion, then yeah, we can blame Atheism. If one wants to lump all "religious people" into those that "kill abortion doctors", then the reciprocal is also true. Unless of course your a hypocrite atheists that has one set of values for atheists, that aren't applied to everyone.
And I have run into more than a few militant atheists that DO condone violence against people of religion, simply for having religion (these are the same people persecuting Christians, Jews and Falung Gong in Atheist countries via government fiat). While YOU may not be one of them, I will lump you into that crowd for the same reason many atheists lump all Christians (and religions) in with the Abortion Doctor Killers. What is good for one ought to be good enough for all.
How does one defend against not believing in something? I do not feel compelled to defend against my non-belief in Pink Unicorns. How does that even work?

--
Agent K: A *person* is smart. People are dumb, stupid, panicky animals, and you know it.
Re:The Bible by Shalhav · 2014-01-02 06:05 · Score: 1

Doing something in the name of non-religious dogma such as Communism is not the same thing as doing something in the name of Atheism.
I'll grant you that there are atheists who do not want to eliminate religion. A few decades ago, they constituted the majority. Today, though, their numbers seem to be shrinking, and the remainder of atheists like Dawkins share their over-hyped fear of religion with Communism's legitimate fear of religion. (Legitimate because religion IS a threat to Communism.)
Re:The Bible by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 07:05 · Score: 0

Then you haven't looked very hard. Stalin, Hitler (he wasn't a theist as some try to claim by stretching the truth). Dawkins, though he hasn't killed anyone, wants to ridicule theists everywhere they are found.
Re:The Bible by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 07:51 · Score: 0

Religion is not a football team. Religion is not a nation. Atheists definitely do not understand this, but nearly every "religious" person you meet doesn't understand it either. Religion is a way of living your life. Buddha, Moses, Confucius, Jesus, Mohammad, they all tell you what you should and should not do to lead a happy and fulfilling life. Granted it isn't always consistent, but if everybody understood what those religious leaders were trying to tell us then "in the name of God" just wouldn't make any sense. Because it doesn't. People who do things "in the name of God" have already decided in their little minds that God is small and powerless enough to fit into their puny little minds and needs their help. Religion is about questing for answers and striving to better yourself, not about actually having any of those answers.
Re:The Bible by shutdown+-p+now · 2014-01-02 08:07 · Score: 1

As a work of fiction, Bible is superseded by the Game of Thrones. Just as much war, blood, incest and other icky things, but with a fast paced storyline and quality writing.
Bible as a work of non-fiction... well, that is firmly in the realm of psychiatry.
Re:The Bible by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 08:58 · Score: 0

How on Earth did a recommendation list for great Sci-Fi turn into a religious discussion. Crap on toast!
Authors to try: Gene Wolf, Robert Jordan, George R.R. Martin, (he wrote much more than The Game of Thrones, for a taste treat of new authors try Warriors, edited by George R.R. Martin, Nancy Kress, and an oldie, HD Thoreau: Walden and Civil Disobedience.
For funny, yet different, twisting plots, Kim Harrison.
Re:The Bible by ranton · 2014-01-02 09:59 · Score: 1

When atheists (via their government) kill religious people for their religion, then yeah, we can blame Atheism. If one wants to lump all "religious people" into those that "kill abortion doctors", then the reciprocal is also true. Unless of course your a hypocrite atheists that has one set of values for atheists, that aren't applied to everyone.
And I have run into more than a few militant atheists that DO condone violence against people of religion, simply for having religion (these are the same people persecuting Christians, Jews and Falung Gong in Atheist countries via government fiat). While YOU may not be one of them, I will lump you into that crowd for the same reason many atheists lump all Christians (and religions) in with the Abortion Doctor Killers. What is good for one ought to be good enough for all.
How does one defend against not believing in something? I do not feel compelled to defend against my non-belief in Pink Unicorns. How does that even work?
The idea that good people can be swayed by religion to do horrible things is almost impossible to refute. But so is the idea that good people can be swayed to do great things because of their religion. The comparison being made by many people is between the different actions someone takes because they are religious, not necessarily every action they take.
Would a good person donate more money to the poor because he is religious than he would have if he was more secular?
Would someone turn the other cheek if he is religious but would have retaliated harshly if he was not?
Would the crusades have happened based purely on nationalism and not because of religious fervor?
Would as many people become suicide bombers if it weren't for religious demagogues?
The important part of each question is whether the suspension of rational thought (faith) and the surrender of your own judgement to religious scripture (obedience to God) is responsible for any of the proposed scenarios. If a psychopath is killing because he enjoys it, religion isn't to blame even if he is Christian. But if a misguided youth straps a bomb to his chest only because he thinks it is God's will, religion shares in the blame. It is hard to argue that religious thinking never causes problems, but it is very fair to argue that it does much more good than harm. If someone who would have been selfish instead decides to help his fellow man based only on his religious ideals, religion gets credit for that as well.
But then back to atheism. As your rightly pointed out, you can't do something in the name of nothing. But someone can surely do something against a religious person because they feel being religious harms society. Just like someone who bombs an abortion clinic does so to improve society, an atheist could kill a religious leader for the same reason. It isn't really atheism that is to blame, but you could make a case that a dogmatic belief that all blind faith is harmful shares in the blame. In the case of Stalin, for example, it was devotion to the communist state that caused violence against religious figures (not belief in rational thought).
Both sides of the spectrum would be appalled by both reactions. I am sure you are appalled by abortion clinic bombers, just as I would be appalled by the actions of a religious leader serial killer. The difference comes in how even the moderate people on both sides view each other's beliefs. I do not think that religion is morally wrong, and even zealots like Dawkins would agree with me. But large numbers of religious people do think many people who disagree with their faith are morally bankrupt in some way, whether it is because of abortion, homosexuality, or a number of other moral differences.
This is the reason why you see far more people doing bad things in the name of religion than you see people doing bad things in the name of rational thought. When deluded individuals can look to the opinions of even the moderates on their side of the debate for validation, it is far more likely that they will be reaffirmed in their beliefs and then eventually act on them.

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-- All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. -- Edmund Burke
Re:The Bible by Archangel+Michael · 2014-01-02 10:50 · Score: 1

Good People can be swayed to do horrible things ... period. It doesn't need religion, nor does religion stop them. Correlation does not equal causation.
The one thing I have learned is that we humans have a wonderful knack of being able to justify anything, given the right set of circumstances. As you have stated, people do things in the name of religion that are horrible, but you have failed to say that religion itself is bad, or makes most of the followers of religion bad or even a small number of them is equal to the whole.
In logical fallacy terms you're using "cum hoc ergo propter hoc" (correlation = causation fallacy), because you're equating all the evils committed in the name of religion, to ALL religions and religious people, which is clearly not the case. If this were true, then the greatest death toll in history is caused by "atheistic governments" (USSR, China, Vietnam, Korea ...). Yes, these governments are declared "atheistic" (no god) and have persecuted and killing millions of people, simply because they had "religion". Which, if I were to say is caused by "atheism" you would no doubt protest as also being "cum hoc ergo propter hoc", and rightly so.
People are rational. Most people are rational most of the time. I know plenty of "rational people" who are bat shit crazy, but mask it very well. Which brings me back to my point, people are fully capable of doing very irrational things, because we humans are exceptional at rationalizing very irrational things, given the right circumstances.

--
Agent K: A *person* is smart. People are dumb, stupid, panicky animals, and you know it.
Re:The Bible by ranton · 2014-01-02 12:24 · Score: 1

As you have stated, people do things in the name of religion that are horrible, but you have failed to say that religion itself is bad, or makes most of the followers of religion bad or even a small number of them is equal to the whole.
I failed to say that because I don't believe it. I don't believe it because it is not held up by the evidence. I didn't even imply that. I even outright refuted that idea in my post.
I do believe that religion is an overall bad thing, because it gets people used to the idea of believing strongly in spite of its implausibility, But it is benign enough that I think the best route is to just let religion flame out as time passes. The US is possibly the only advanced society that hasn't marginalized religion yet, which is probably because a major political movement has been taking advantage of it for a few decades now. But whatever the reason for the religious backlash in the US today, I believe it will pass with time. I even attribute the war against science to have more to do with a backlash of human ignorance and is not very related to religious beliefs.

n logical fallacy terms you're using "cum hoc ergo propter hoc" (correlation = causation fallacy), because you're equating all the evils committed in the name of religion, to ALL religions and religious people, which is clearly not the case.
I didn't say that at all. In fact I went out of my way to express that what you mention is an incorrect way to look at the problem. One of the examples I gave was that you cannot blame religion if someone is killing for fun just because he happens to be religious. But it is not a logical fallacy to say that some people do commit horrible acts primarily because of their religious beliefs. It is exceptionally rare, but it does happen.
The dangerous thing that rational members of any ideology commit is labeling those who do not share the same ideology as immoral or inhuman. This is not rare at all. This can be done in the name of religion, such as in the abortion debate, or in the name of nationalism, such as in the third Reich or communist Russia. Once you label something as immoral based only on a difference in opinion (caused by ideological belief, not rational belief), you invite crazy people to act on that warped sense of morality.
A religious person who labels abortion as murder is partially culpable for the actions of an abortion clinic bombing. It is not because they share the same beliefs, it is because they help foster a community where their ideological beliefs dictate morality instead of a more rational debate within society. A religious person who simply states they believe that God has a plan for every human fetus, so they would never abort their own child, shares no such blame because they have not demonized those who disagree.

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-- All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. -- Edmund Burke
Re:The Bible by bingoUV · 2014-01-02 14:12 · Score: 1

I don't collect stamps. Is everything I do militant not collecting stamps?
Are you a militant too? Anyway, I guess you haven't got a hang of this grammar thing, so you could say "this post was made by a militant non-stamp-collector". See, simple. Specifically, "militant" is not an adverb.
Citizens and n-th class of citizens are irrelevant as a reply to my post so I'll ignore that. Same for obsessing.

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Bingo Dictionary - Pragmatist, n. A myopic idealist.
Re:The Bible by Archangel+Michael · 2014-01-03 06:20 · Score: 1

Well, you're being extremely bigoted against anything that doesn't fit your own belief system, and hardly rational in the process. You postulate that people who believe __________ are responsible, at least "partially culpable" for everyone that does harm in the name of that cause. In your case, you state that those that believe Abortion is murder.
Do you not know that there are Atheists that have killed (also via atheist government decree) people because they had religion? THAT makes you, according to your own "rational thought" at least partially culpable. (see Reign of Terror, France)
“if a person doesn’t think that there is a God to be accountable to, then what’s the point of trying to modify your behavior to keep it within acceptable ranges?” - Jeffry Dahmer - atheist

--
Agent K: A *person* is smart. People are dumb, stupid, panicky animals, and you know it.
Re:The Bible by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-03 07:51 · Score: 0

No I'm speaking of the athetist who killed millions of unborn humnan beings, slaughtering whole counties full of people (Georgia and the Ukraine come to mind.) and attempting to destroying a 2000 year old civiliztion.
Of course there is an atheist dogma. That dogma is that life has no meaing, that there is no absolute right and wrong, that bigoty is being agianst violation of Natural Law. You can pretend that atheism isn't a religion. That is of course not true. It certainly is a philosophy and like all philosiphies it has a set of primary dogmas and logical conclusions which fall out of those dogmas.
One being that somehow in your mind being bigoted agianst Catholics because you disagree with their dogmas and the logical conclusions which come out of those dogmas is alright while Catholics adherance to thier dogmas and the logical conclusions coming out of them makes them bigots.
Stalin was not just some holder of non-religious dogmas. He was an atheist. An atheist who once attempted to demean the power of the Pope (and God) by asking how many divisons he had. I guess Pope John Paul II showed his successor.
Re:The Bible by ranton · 2014-01-03 10:59 · Score: 1

You postulate that people who believe __________ are responsible, at least "partially culpable" for everyone that does harm in the name of that cause. In your case, you state that those that believe Abortion is murder.
Yes, I do believe that the opinion of Abortion is Murder is an irresponsible opinion and that anyone who believes it shares responsibility for creating an atmosphere where such a large number of people believe it. Believing that a fetus is a human being is perfectly fine, but disregarding the opinion of others and declaring that anyone aborting a fetus is murdering someone is when someone has crossed into dangerous territory.

Do you not know that there are Atheists that have killed (also via atheist government decree) people because they had religion? THAT makes you, according to your own "rational thought" at least partially culpable. (see Reign of Terror, France)
The is a big difference here that I have been trying to articulate. Any atheist that openly says being religious is immoral is making the same dangerous mistake as someone who says abortion is murder. Any atheist that believes this and takes part in proliferating this opinion to the public is partially to blame for the actions of nuts who kill just because their victim is religious.
But an atheist who believes religious people are simply misguided is no more complicit than a religious person who only denounces abortion because it is not God's will (and would openly say that not following God's will is perfectly acceptable behavior).
I would also like to state that I understand religious people often feel obligated to share their interpretation of God's will to help enlighten or "save" others. As long as they believe the good they are doing outweighs the damage of a few nuts (which is very minor if put in perspective), that is a perfectly fine opinion to have. I disagree with it strongly and advocate against the opinion, but it is not an immoral opinion to hold. I drive fast even though I know that I may encourage others to do the same, which makes me complicit in our culture of overly aggressive drivers. I simply find that to be acceptable to me.

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-- All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. -- Edmund Burke
Re:The Bible by rosencreuz · 2014-01-04 02:22 · Score: 1

Better read the newer and correct version: Koran.
Don't even think about downvoting me, otherwise you'll burn in hell!
Re:The Bible by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-05 06:00 · Score: 0

If you had even the most basic grasp of the relevant history, you would understand that Stalin wanted to eliminate social structures which might compete with the dogma of communism, not atheism. Well, mostly that, but also settling some personal scores and eliminating powerful individuals who might be a direct threat to him, including some former advisers and so on.
- T

It's kind of long and meandering by thegameiam · 2014-01-01 10:24 · Score: 4, Insightful

But really, make sure The Bible is on the list. Actually having read it opens up a tremendous world of understanding of other art and literature, regardless of one's religion.

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Need Geek Rock? Try The Franchise!

Re:It's kind of long and meandering by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:36 · Score: 0

This.
I think too many people disregard it immediately because of it's association. But it covers so many stories from ancient history that, though widely geographically separated, appear in writing from all over the ancient world. If you truly understand it, and given some context from the rest of the ancient world, it really becomes fascinating.
Re:It's kind of long and meandering by R3d+M3rcury · 2014-01-01 10:50 · Score: 5, Funny

The Dictionary. All other books are generated from this one.
Re:It's kind of long and meandering by Trepidity · 2014-01-01 10:59 · Score: 4, Interesting

Yeah, despite being an atheist I'm quite glad my high school included some pertinent excerpts from the Bible in the European literature class (which led to some controversy with some parents). If you're reading European literature prior to the 20th century, you miss large amounts of context and a ton of allusions that the author would've considered obvious to readers of the day, if you aren't familiar with some of the basic figures and stories in the Bible.

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Re:It's kind of long and meandering by hashtagdeals · 2014-01-01 11:05 · Score: 5, Insightful

I'd say the opposite, the dictionary is the combination of all books and writings in to a single entity. The dictionary never introduces a new word.
Re:It's kind of long and meandering by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:18 · Score: 0

But really, make sure The Bible is on the list.
But make sure you read from it the New Testament (the Christ "thing"), not just the Old Testament (the "Jew" story - not that it's not good, but it's the less important in my opinion) - even better, make sure you find a good "club" to read it with them so they can help you better understand it and even experience it (by "club" i mean a church - by "good"... i mean not crazy! I am a Greek Orthodox -something like the Catholics- , and almost all people in our "club" believe in both evolution AND God... crazy people we are!).
Re:It's kind of long and meandering by fermion · 2014-01-01 11:30 · Score: 2

TL;DR
Seriously, this is something that can be read when the attention span is longer and there is more context for the naughty bits. No one wants boring lists of who begat whom and who tried to kill whom. The incest and polygamy and slavery will appeal to many the undeveloped mind, but again, is this what kids should be exposed to?
If you want to indoctrinate a kid into the religious cult, use Little Pilgrims Progress. It is short, sweet, and makes everyone seems like loser. It is more effective at creating Christians than Twilight is a creating Vampires.
If you want just general 'miracles happen' try The Little Prince.
If you want debauchery and long winded elegant writing, then you are to the Canterbury Tales. This will help with the SAT scores
Yes, the bible is cultural model, but, as shown by the behavior of the average christian, it is not that is read as whole. Rather it is taken piecewise and then used to construct a reality that is acceptable to the user. As has been my experience, as one who was read it, the main use it to tell others that their bible based beliefs are much less than that. For instance, as those who push school prayer don't want to accept, the bible says that praying in a public secular setting is exactly what one does not want to do.

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"She's a scientist and a lesbian. She's not going to let it slide." Orphan Black
Re:It's kind of long and meandering by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:34 · Score: 0

You need to read the new testament, Pinocchio, the old testament and The Monk. Then you know enough about human nature. Sun Tzu, Machiavelli and Gaetano Mosca might be helpful too. The rest is optional.
Re:It's kind of long and meandering by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:35 · Score: 0

I think say Shakespeare would disagree...
Re:It's kind of long and meandering by Selur · 2014-01-01 12:07 · Score: 1

"bastard operator from hell" if you wonder about IT support
Re:It's kind of long and meandering by ObsessiveMathsFreak · 2014-01-01 12:37 · Score: 1

it actually works the other way around.

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May the Maths Be with you!
Re:It's kind of long and meandering by deviated_prevert · 2014-01-01 12:51 · Score: 1

You need to read the new testament, Pinocchio, the old testament and The Monk. Then you know enough about human nature. Sun Tzu, Machiavelli and Gaetano Mosca might be helpful too. The rest is optional.
Yes the all the rest is optional except the Kama Sutra especially if Pinocchio is on the list.

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This message was not sent from an iPhone because Peter Sellers really was a deviated prevert without a dime for the call
Re:It's kind of long and meandering by demonlapin · 2014-01-01 12:52 · Score: 1

(which led to some controversy with some parents)
For heaven's sake, why? Were they utterly daft? I mean, there were a lot of awful things about the Christian elementary schools my wife and I went to (hers Catholic, mine Protestant), but western culture is just swimming in references to Christianity, and at least we got exposed to that. You're blind to the most common source of allusions out there if you don't know at least something of the Bible.
Re:It's kind of long and meandering by melikamp · 2014-01-01 13:02 · Score: 1
If the point is to expose oneself to good art and literature, then some parts of the Bible should be avoided. I won't name bad books, and I won't name all the good ones, but these are my favorite from the literary point of view:
1. Genesis
2. Exodus
3. Job
4. Proverbs
5. Ecclesiastes
6. Song of Songs
7. Wisdom
8. Sirach
9. Ezekiel
10. Daniel
11. Luke
12. John
13. Acts
14. Hebrews
15. James
16. Jude
Re:It's kind of long and meandering by Trepidity · 2014-01-01 13:11 · Score: 1

Mixture of atheist parents offended that the school would assign a Bible reading, and non-Christian religious parents offended that the school was assigning a reading from the scriptures of a different religion and nothing from their own religion's scriptures. It's been a long time, but I think it was more of the 2nd category complaining.

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Re:It's kind of long and meandering by melikamp · 2014-01-01 13:22 · Score: 1

Too contrived. The only book one needs is the UTF specification.
Re:It's kind of long and meandering by MickLinux · 2014-01-01 14:28 · Score: 0

Let me get this inehere: I see a lot of people saying read the Bible for history, or its literary value.
No.
Read the Bible, because it is the Word of your creator, and He is involved in your life.
Read it because anyone should have, and often reference, the user manual.
And pshaw to those who say 'inconsistant'. You haven't read and cross-referenced it enough. There IS history in the Bible, and it includes peoples' misunderstandings, and how God deals with them.
Take for example, 'thou shalt not kill' vs. Elijah putting to death the priests of Baal. But look closely: G-d never told him to do that; and if you read Maccabees you will see that it is implied that he faked the fire from heaven to do it... and he feels guilt (take my life for I am no better than my fathers), and yet gives excuses even still (I'm on the run because of my zeal for the Lord, and I'm the only one left). But G-d responds in mercy, while still saying 'that lie stinks to heaven'. So it isn't inconsistant; you simply haven't read it with any depth, perhaps because you were taking it as a fantasy instead of a user manual.

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Correct Horse Battery Staple: 72 bits of entropy. Enter "Correct H" into google. When it generates the phrase, that's
Re:It's kind of long and meandering by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 14:52 · Score: 0

Read the Bible, because it is the Word of your creator, and He is involved in your life.
Except all those inconsistencies and different versions of history between the books, plus all the changes/translations made to the books along the way highlight that it isn't the perfectly transcribed word of god. If it were truly penned or inspired by a god then it would be consistent between books and consistent through translations. It's simply not, and you're deluding yourself if you think it is. Most christians I know think the King James version is the standard, when the reality is that's probably the most edited and adulterated version out there. Things get worse when you have to start adding in other Canonical scriptures like the First book of Maccabees to resolve some of the apparent conflicts.
Re:It's kind of long and meandering by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 16:34 · Score: 0

It ain't those parts of the Bible that I can't understand that bother me, it is the parts that I do understand.
-Mark Twain
One does well to put on gloves when reading the New Testament; the proximity of so much impurity almost compels to this...I have searched in it vainly for even a single congenial trait...everything in it is cowardice and self-deception.
-Friedrich Nietzsche
The inspiration of the Bible depends upon the ignorance of the gentleman who reads it.
-Robert G. Ingersoll (1833-1899)
There can be no doubt that the Bible...became a stumbling-block in the path of progress, scientific, social and even moral. It was quoted against Copernicus as it was against Darwin.
-Preserved Smith
So far as I can remember, there is not one word in the Gospels in praise of intelligence.
-Bertrand Russell
With so many intelligent people warning you about it, perhaps you should avoid it
Re:It's kind of long and meandering by AmiMoJo · 2014-01-01 18:17 · Score: 1

In that context Existentialism and Humanism by Jean-Paul Sartre is a much better read. It is short and to the point, explains the basis of modern philosophy and critical thinking clearly, and is both modern and relevant.

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const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
Re:It's kind of long and meandering by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 19:35 · Score: 0

I have several times, most recently the KJV. It's a wonderful novel. Full of blood, murder, deceit betrayal, epic genocide, wars of and on religion, infanticide, socialism, communism. It truly is a horror novel, rivals anything Steven King has written.
Re:It's kind of long and meandering by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 20:01 · Score: 0

I disagree. I read the Bible, and I was surprised by how little insight it gave me into modern Christianity. It's meandering enough that, for any given moral position, you can find some way to support it from the text. All the interesting stuff happens at the interpretation stage.
Re:It's kind of long and meandering by quenda · 2014-01-02 00:10 · Score: 2

Read the Bible, because it is the Word of your creator, and He is involved in your life.
My creator is a vain, genocidal, psychopathic, cruel, sadistic, monster, beyond the worst villains of history?
No thanks, if I'm going to be a Christian, I'd rather avoid reading the bible at all costs, except the warm-fuzzy bits of the new testament.
Re:It's kind of long and meandering by ByteSlicer · 2014-01-02 01:54 · Score: 1

But really, make sure The Bible is on the list.
Meh. I read it, but didn't like the ending.
Re:It's kind of long and meandering by findoutmoretoday · 2014-01-02 02:29 · Score: 1

Read the Bible, because it is the Word of your creator
Too bad I don't speak the languages of my creator.
Re:It's kind of long and meandering by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 06:04 · Score: 0

Given the dord of a dictionary, it's inevitable that on occasion it will mysteriously generate new words.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dord
Re:It's kind of long and meandering by Matheus · 2014-01-02 09:40 · Score: 1

Circular reference... chicken or the egg in a manner of speaking but for the most part you're both right. The first dictionary post-dates the first written word so not ALL books come from the dictionary. There is also an important fact that the dictionary is a closed / regulated book of a *specific set of words considered by whomever to be part of the real language. Most books contain at least a few words that are not allowed in said dictionary for a number of reasons. That being said, the first dictionary came a long time ago and at some point it became the source, not the repository of, most people's extended vocabulary. The point is not that the dictionary doesn't invent words but that the writers of the books go to it to find the ones they want to use. Also a portion of the dictionary came from the spoken word directly and may or may not have ever been included in printed form elsewhere before inclusion so in the printed sense the dictionary would be the "first".
In mathematical terms one would like to think that the dictionary is what would happen if all books (of a given language) were shoved into a proper Set BUT instead that set requires a garbage ( morality) filter to make the set even smaller. It is also a snapshot in time so only catches up to modern changes in the language every so often making it even smaller.
Re:It's kind of long and meandering by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-15 03:20 · Score: 0

In other words, it's a dictionary.

What to read by jodido · 2014-01-01 10:24 · Score: 1, Insightful

Communist Manifesto--might seem dated but it's going to be big in the not too distant future. What other solution is out there?

Re:What to read by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:31 · Score: 0

What other solution is out there? Really? Spoken like a true communist tool.
Re:What to read by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:33 · Score: 0

What other solution is out there?
Start a new form of governance and make the old one obsolete. It's easier than you think, and it's being worked on right now.
Re: What to read by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:37 · Score: 0

Christ, talk about trying to fight stupid with stupid.
Re:What to read by ShanghaiBill · 2014-01-01 10:56 · Score: 1

Communist Manifesto--might seem dated but it's going to be big in the not too distant future. What other solution is out there?
Great idea! What could possibly go wrong? The worst that could happen is that 100 million people are murdered or starve to death, and a billion more are impoverished. Maybe the Russians, Chinese and Cambodians will volunteer to be the guinea pigs.
Re:What to read by glavenoid · 2014-01-01 10:58 · Score: 0

It's easier than you think, and it's being worked on right now.
Bwaaaaaahaaaaaahaaaaaaaahaaaaahaaahaaahahahaa!! That's rich. Thanks for giving me literally the best laugh I've had all year. If you can't see the glaring and obvious problems with that proposal I don't know what to tell you. I won't bother to explain because you won't understand anyway
You can take your reddit circle-jerk form of governance to your reddit hivemind island y'all are trying to create and see how it works out there before inflicting it on the rest of us. It'll make Lord of the Flies look like a veritable utopia.
On second thought, I'd like to participate in this idea in a way you can understand: For this proposal, I bestow upon thee one downvote. It is my only regret than I may not bequeath more downvotes in this matter.

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I, for one, am looking forward to the inevitable /. beta rollout fallout.
Re:What to read by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:59 · Score: 1

Communist Manifesto--might seem dated but it's going to be big in the not too distant future. What other solution is out there?
"The Road to Serfdom". Any book that changed the course of history for 50 years should be read. It continues to be relevant, now more than ever considering that the Communist Manifesto is already big in the here and now. Communism is the road to serfdom. "Marxism has led to Fascism and National Socialism, because in all essentials, it is Fascism and National Socialism.... The generation to which we belong is now learning from experience what happens when men retreat from freedom to a coercive organization of their affairs. Though they promise themselves a more abundant life, they must in practice renounce it; as the organized direction increases, the variety of ends must give way to uniformity. That is the nemesis of the planned society and the authoritarian principle in human affairs.... Fascism is the stage reached after communism has proved an illusion." [p. 32].
Re: What to read by khallow · 2014-01-01 11:00 · Score: 2

Works for forest fires so it's obvious it should work for stupidity.
Re:What to read by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:01 · Score: 0

Added bonus: it has not been

burned by communists
Re:What to read by Trepidity · 2014-01-01 11:03 · Score: 5, Insightful

I think Marx's Capital has aged somewhat better, in part because it's less a proposal of what to do, and more just a detailed analysis of how capitalism works. You can take that analysis and do whatever you want with it (embrace it, oppose it, etc.), but as an analysis it has a lot of interesting stuff.
The Communist Manifesto is interesting as history and rhetoric, but it's from a completely different context. Some of the stuff in it no longer makes much sense, e.g. even most modern Marxists are puzzled by the parts where it calls for a reversal of urbanization and a re-spreading of the population across the country. Other parts of it are now so mainstream that they're no longer seen as radical or communist, e.g. the part of the manifesto where it calls for abolition of child labor and introduction of free public schools.

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Re:What to read by glavenoid · 2014-01-01 11:27 · Score: 1

It'll make Lord of the Flies look like a veritable utopia.
Although implied in my previous statement I'll go ahead and explicitly state: William Golding's "Lord of the Flies" should also be on the list of books everyone should read.

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I, for one, am looking forward to the inevitable /. beta rollout fallout.
Re:What to read by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:35 · Score: 0

If you can't see the glaring and obvious problems with that proposal I don't know what to tell you. I won't bother to explain because you won't understand anyway
Regardless of the subject, this always means "I don't like your idea but I'm not smart enough to formulate an intelligent argument against it."
I am not endorsing or agreeing with the grandparent AC, only highlighting the parent's inadvertent admission of being too stupid to refute it.
Re: What to read by Immerman · 2014-01-01 11:36 · Score: 1

But fires are self-limiting by the consumption of their fuel. Stupidity can apparently burn indefinitely, with few limits short of reaching such heights that the bearer decides to disguise themselves as a speed bump to startle their friends.

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--- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
Re:What to read by Bing+Tsher+E · 2014-01-01 11:46 · Score: 1

Communist Manifesto--might seem dated but it's going to be big in the not too distant future. What other solution is out there?
It's the precipitate that we should be concerned about.
Re:What to read by Bing+Tsher+E · 2014-01-01 11:48 · Score: 1

Actually, regardless of the subject, YOUR response means "I can't bother to say anything meaningful to disagree, so I'll just type something clever and meta."
Re:What to read by Bing+Tsher+E · 2014-01-01 11:55 · Score: 1

Sure, if you want to read a failed 19th century book on Political Economy. There are countless other pipe-dream books on Political Economy you could sample from, too, though.
Maybe Henry George's Single Tax theories, for instance.
There's no reason to only focus on obsolete economic theories like classical Marxism. For dabblers, there are other ideas that haven't been given the chance to be the gargantuan failure that Marxism has been.
Re:What to read by glavenoid · 2014-01-01 11:57 · Score: 1

Regardless of the subject, this always means "I don't like your idea but I'm not smart enough to formulate an intelligent argument against it."
Wrong. Self-evidently stupid ideas do not require *any* arguments against them, intelligent or otherwise, such as the one I'm making right now TO the one I'm making now.

only highlighting the parent's inadvertent admission of being too stupid to refute it.
Wrong. I am, however, too stupid to argue with you, which is self-evident from the previous part of this comment.

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I, for one, am looking forward to the inevitable /. beta rollout fallout.
Re:What to read by Trepidity · 2014-01-01 11:58 · Score: 4, Informative

You clearly haven't read Capital, if you think it's a pipe-dream proposal, or a proposal at all. It's mostly just an analysis of capitalism; unlike the Communist Manifesto, it's not a proposal of or advocacy for any particular alternative.

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Re:What to read by chill · 2014-01-01 12:01 · Score: 2

Thanks for giving me literally the best laugh I've had all year.
Considering it is January 1st, I'm not sure this has the impact you think it does.

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Learning HOW to think is more important than learning WHAT to think.
Re:What to read by glavenoid · 2014-01-01 12:05 · Score: 1

Thanks for giving me literally the best laugh I've had all year.

Considering it is January 1st, I'm not sure this has the impact you think it does.
That's the joke, which tends to expire January 2.

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I, for one, am looking forward to the inevitable /. beta rollout fallout.
Re:What to read by Karmashock · 2014-01-01 12:28 · Score: 1

Honestly?... communism just turns into dictatorship...
So... the future is probably dictatorship. People like you don't respect freedom. You don't respect democracy. You don't respect the individual.
And as a result, when there are enough of you... a dictator will use you to dominate the rest of us. And then we'll live under peonage.
Ideally, the most clever of us will rise in the ranks of the tyranny and carve out reasonable lives for ourselves. But all in all it will be bad for most people.
But on the bright side... you won't get to make choices anymore. Your choices will all be taken away. No one will ask for your opinions. You will be told what to think.
And if you're dumb enough to disagree... at best you'll wind up in a labor camp.
Communism.
Smell the despair.

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Re:What to read by GameboyRMH · 2014-01-01 13:23 · Score: 1

Let me guess, you think that metagovernment would amount to "mob rule" and you think that would be worse than some other form of government in which a minority can overrule the will of the majority over and over again, effectively making them dictators, even if they can only be dictators for a limited time.

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"When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
Re:What to read by glavenoid · 2014-01-01 14:46 · Score: 1

From the metagovernment FAQ:

There are no empowered leaders in an open source government. There can be people who are recognized as leaders, but they have no actual authority over other people, only the power of their reputation. There may be some basic administrative bodies to handle accounting and administration of the computers, but these institutions also are governed by open websites. All people may participate in every such website. In the initial formation of the open source governments, there may be nonprofit institutions which exist to facilitate the implementation of the governments. These institutions are transient and goal-oriented. At such time as the community participating in the website wishes to dispense with these institutions, they are required by their bylaws to disband.
All right, first of all, in general, the open-source projects that tend to succeed are the ones with a well-defined empowered leadership or even a BDFL, not the ones that are left to twist and contort at the whims of every user who wants to fork the whole project at, say, 80% completion due to some otherwise minor disagreement. We've seen this countless times in the open source world, and it's proven to not be a very good model for maintaining a software project, let alone a government.
Also, governed by websites? Who are the people implementing these websites? Are the sites prone to the problem of fracturing and forking? This would be a major problem since they seem to be an integral part of this whole idea.
That's just the first issue of many I have with this particular metagovernment idea. Honestly I think it's pretty self-evident from reading the FAQ, let alone the rest of the site, to see why this idea is doomed from the get-go. If you poke around the metagov't site and read some, not forgetting the discussion pages, it becomes clear that the idea is already falling victim to its own ideals by becoming convoluted to the point of being contradictory in its own implementation. Failure is being built into the system.
Here's a link to that FAQ again Scroll down for this little tidbit:

Who will have the power to make sure that decisions are implemented in the real world?
There are two kinds of power at work here: legislative power (making the laws) and executive power (enforcing the laws). Since everyone can contribute equally to the making of the rules, everyone holds legislative power. If the community wishes to grant any executive power to any person or organisation, for instance a police force, it would have to come to a consensus on the laws which determine this power.
What if one community decides the laws in a neighboring community are decadant/uncivil/unjust/whatever, and create laws that supersede the neighbors' laws? There then seems to be a major problem with jurisdiction and enforcement. Keep in mind the idea of what a "community" is is necessarily and arbitrarily mutable since any person or group can choose to form a new community with its own governance at any time and for whatever reason.
Then there's the Scoring System Here is an example of a core idea so self-evidently stupid that if a person thinks it's a good idea then it's unlikely they would be able to understand the reasons why it's not until they personally watch it fail.

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I, for one, am looking forward to the inevitable /. beta rollout fallout.
Re:What to read by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 15:02 · Score: 0

If you can't see the glaring and obvious problems with that proposal I don't know what to tell you. I won't bother to explain because you won't understand anyway
Whether you agree or not, that's on the level of putting fingers in your ears and going "nyah nyah I can't hear you!" Grow the fuck up.
Re:What to read by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 15:10 · Score: 0

Obvious never is. I'm not the above AC, but I shared their reaction. You didn't contribute anything but childish vitriol sans argument--however, that AC up there IS trying to contribute something: namely, trying to make you aware of your error, in a forum where actual logical arguments are highly prized. Listen to that AC, and you might actually better yourself. If you really wanted to do the OP you replied to a favor, you would've tried to explain to him your issues the first time around, rather than acting like a bratty child. Instead, you chose to make fun of him and contribute zilch until called on it. Their proposal was serious, and worth arguing to merits and demerits of, but your reaction was the equivalent of the class clown derailing the teacher. You ought to go back to Reddit yourself, or whichever hole you crawled out of, because this place is way above your level of education.
Re:What to read by glavenoid · 2014-01-01 15:25 · Score: 1

No, it's more on the level of an underhanded complement, such as: "If you're gullible enough to buy into this self-evidently stupid idea then it's highly unlikely any attempt at persuasion to the contrary will be met with any consideration, therefore I won't bother since we're only on a website talking about another website". The "complement" part here is in being generous by suggesting the party to which this statement is directed would be literate enough to read it. The "underhanded" part is in the fact that that party probably wouldn't.
Or perhaps a less harsh way of saying "you're such a god damned idiot it's a bloody miracle you haven't choked to death on your own drool" which goes for most AC comments, including yours.

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I, for one, am looking forward to the inevitable /. beta rollout fallout.
Re:What to read by Concerned+Onlooker · 2014-01-01 15:56 · Score: 1

"Honestly?... communism just turns into dictatorshipâ¦"
Sooner or later everything turns into dictatorship. The rose-colored glasses approach to capitalism is just as bad as the rose-colored glasses approach to communism. In the end the people have to be on guard against oppression from whatever system they have chosen.

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http://www.rootstrikers.org/
Re:What to read by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 16:01 · Score: 0

What other solution is out there?
A class on human psychology?
Re:What to read by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 16:12 · Score: 0

You know, there's a solution for that. It's called "don't feed the trolls". But, seeing as you chose to feed, why not with something constructive? This is, by-and-large, a forum for adults, not children. The adults here are capable of ignoring that which they dislike, forming rational arguments for or against a position, and attempting to help their fellows form better arguments in the future. It's a thing called "maturity". The children (you, among others), retort with insults and vitriol. Perhaps, in the future, you can contribute constructively to the community.

BTW, it's "compliment". A complement is something else entirely.
Re:What to read by glavenoid · 2014-01-01 16:25 · Score: 1

You didn't contribute anything but childish vitriol sans argument
What's your point? You seem to have understood mine well enough.

that AC up there IS trying to contribute something: namely, trying to make you aware of your error
AC's fallacious assertion:

Regardless of the subject, this always means "I don't like your idea but I'm not smart enough to formulate an intelligent argument against it."
I am not endorsing or agreeing with the grandparent AC, only highlighting the parent's inadvertent admission of being too stupid to refute it.
...was in no way "trying to make [me] aware of [my] error", and in no way better than the comment I made which prompted said reply. To not acknowledge this undermines whatever point you think you made.
Furthermore, I made no error, and there was no inadvertent admission to anything, but I bet that AC felt clever for having made such a comment, so there's that. I know what the both of you are trying to say as both of your comments are trite and predictable, perhaps predictable enough to have been intentionally solicited. But then again, perhaps not since I'm too stupid to do such a thing.

[blah blah blah] in a forum where actual logical arguments are highly prized.[blah blah blah some more]
This is /. dude. You must be new here. The only times "actual logical arguments are highly prized" around here is when:
1.they already suit the reader's personal agenda.
or
2. Whatever /. has deemed worthy that particular day.

If you really wanted to do the OP you replied to a favor,
It's obvious I didn't.

rather than acting like a bratty child
Correction: I was being a dick, not a bratty child.

Their proposal was serious,
Which is why it was so pathetically funny, which, in turn, is why I made my original comment in the first place!!

and worth arguing to merits and demerits of,
Oh wait, now you're serious. Hey buddy, I got a bridge to sell you...

You ought to go back to Reddit yourself, or whichever hole you crawled out of, because this place is way above your level of education.

Not so, I only really come around here any more to stoke the fires from time to time. The fact that you think this place is deserving of some level of education says more about whatever delusional world you live in because, unlike you, I haven't proposed any level of exclusivity to this site, and nor, by implication of such, have I suggested to be a member of said exclusive class. It's a website about (recently moreso) arbitrary stuff where people are often coarse with one another, but in no way suggests or demands any level of intelligence or education. It's pretty pathetic if you think you're special by virtue of visiting this site, which is a logical inference from your statements.
All too often someone comes up with some stupid idea around here, or seriously parrots some tired idea (*cough* beowulf cluster, raspberry pi, 3d printing, year of the linux desktop, etc. et al., ad nauseam) in a cliche fashion that would make for a nice in-joke if not for the lack of self-awareness of said person kowtowing to the /. groupthink. Without an occasional flamewar such as this one, we all are in danger of becoming /. yes-men, allowing the site to control our thoughts and ideas rather than the other way around. I hope I drove some people away for a few months because when they come back they'll hopefully be in a better position to see all the BS around here.
The difference between me and other harsh AC comments is that I at least have the courtesy to everyone else here to log in and post under my username when I stir the shit-soup, unlike you.

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I, for one, am looking forward to the inevitable /. beta rollout fallout.
Re:What to read by Karmashock · 2014-01-01 16:28 · Score: 1

I'm not defending capitalism. I'm defending my rights and my individuality.
Just because you're determined to be a slave doesn't mean you have to drag everyone else down with you.
Just grease yourself up for a gimp suit, put on your leash, and enjoy a life on your knees.
Some of us want to live on our feet.

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Re:What to read by glavenoid · 2014-01-01 16:40 · Score: 1

BTW, it's "compliment". A complement is something else entirely.
Ohh, you got me in a spelling error. I know the difference you pathetic pedantic moron.
Check this out, AC: My "excellent karma" in the slashdot system states that I've contributed way more than you have since you won't bother to even log in. I've had this account for more than 12 years and have never once left anything but a polite (or at least civil) comment to anyone who logs in. I've seen the shit you've posted, and no I don't mean "you"-you since you are too afraid to be accountable for the comments you leave here. Get an account and log in if you want me to take you seriously. Hell, if the original AC in this subthread had logged in I wouldn't have been such a dick to him or her in the first place because I'd have had a better idea that they were at least somewhat invested in the /. community, therefore deserving a fair investment of my time.

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I, for one, am looking forward to the inevitable /. beta rollout fallout.
Re:What to read by Concerned+Onlooker · 2014-01-01 17:57 · Score: 1

Oh, please. Defending individual rights is what my post was all about. I just happen to think that capitalism/corporatism is as inclined as any other system to tend towards enslavement because in the end it's all about sociopaths taking control.
By the way, I've read most of what Ayn Rand wrote and was rabid about her so-called philosophy for a long time. Now I just think she was extremely limited in her view of the world.

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http://www.rootstrikers.org/
Re:What to read by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 18:04 · Score: 0

First, I don't normally post AC *except* to reply to trolls like you. Like you, I have excellent karma and an account with a UID in your range. Secondly, you misspelled "compliment" twice in a row. Your stance that AC are less deserving of civility than non-AC is just a load of horse shit. Grow up already.
Re:What to read by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 18:07 · Score: 0

TL;DR: I'm a flaming fuckwad and prefer that everyone know it.
Re:What to read by IICV · 2014-01-01 18:09 · Score: 1

I think Marx's Capital has aged somewhat better, in part because it's less a proposal of what to do, and more just a detailed analysis of how capitalism works.
I remember reading somewhere that Marx was a great diagnostician, but a terrible doctor. He had a really good idea of what was going to happen to the working classes and where society was going to go, but his prescriptions for what to do about it were completely unrealistic.
Re:What to read by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 19:05 · Score: 0

Be careful about how you read that book though, I had a literature class in which the professor claimed that the "proper" way to read Lord of the Flies was "The people need strong competent leaders, preferably with a military background so that they understand the value of discipline or society will devolve into some kind of Brave New World-meets-Marxism-orgy-porgy disaster of happiness, anarchy and then the downfall of society" (paraphrased).
Of course, he was "kind of" right-wing and conservative but I can definitely see how someone with his background and opinions could read it that way.
Re:What to read by kenwd0elq · 2014-01-01 19:17 · Score: 1

The Communist Manifesto and Atlas Shrugged are to examples of DYSTOPIAS; these are Bad Things. I know that President Obama is using Atlas Shrugged as a "How To" manual, but that's the wrong way to use it.
And any reading list that includes Marx must also include Machiavelli; "The Prince" can greatly mitigate Marx's pernicious influence.
Re:What to read by glavenoid · 2014-01-01 19:51 · Score: 1

First, I don't normally post AC *except* to reply to trolls like you.
Good for you. You're an admitted bona-fide slashdot coward. Got a problem with having a modicum of accountability, or something? BTW, thanks for taking the bait. The fact that some AC assholes here had to get all hypocritically high-and-mighty with me for poking fun at an obviously stupid idea just wasn't enough. I wonder if one of y'all are the original AC who proposed the original stupid idea and got your feelings hurt... Hey!! It could be ...YOU!!! But wait -- by that same logic it could have been ...ME!!! And by extension of that principle, for all I know I could be the only one replying to myself throughout this whole thread. Well, except for the guy who posted from his account.

Like you, I have excellent karma and an account with a UID in your range.
Do you want a medal or something? Sign in and prove it and then I'll apologize for being such a meanie. While you're at it, you can add me to your foes or freaks or whatever if you haven't done so already. Hell, even friends if you're not too prude. Or is that prudent. I obviously don't know the difference between words as evidenced by your next clause (and the final word of my post):

Secondly, you misspelled "compliment" twice in a row.
Yeah, I didn't get the memo that making the same spelling error twice in a row totally invalidates everything I wrote. It's not like the correct meaning can't be inferred by context which you obviously did since you posted your insipid correction.
Not that my comment needed superfluous invalidation anyway since its validity was in question by virtue of its very existence. I do, however, find the fact that you find my spelling peccadilloes noteworthy amusing. I can almost see all the orange Cheeto-shit you got all over your patchy neckbeard in your haste to make that observation more than once. Probably not Cheeto® Brand though since they're too expensive for your mom to buy.

Your stance that AC are less deserving of civility than non-AC is just a load of horse shit.
Then it's at least in good company with whatever sensibility you possess (or lack, for that matter) that would make you post the comment(s) that you did. For all I know you're the infamous GNAA troll, or the old kombucha guy, or that weirdo who continuously botches the lyrics to the Golden Girls theme song. Hell, you are probably that guy who is making all those perverse comments about becoming aroused by the smell of another poster's anus. As far as I'm concerned, you're all the same except for the rare occurrence where someone has a legitimate need to make AC posts such as when violating an NDA or providing potentially identifying information.
AC's making stupid comments, and non-ACs calling them out and trolling are a venerable tradition within the /. institution. If you don't realize this then you probably lied about your uid range.

Grow up already.
Right back atcha, though I doubt you possess the self-awareness or integrity to recognize the sanctimonious hypocrisy of your most eloquent parting jab. At least I know I'm being a moron in this thread and will show a bit of common courtesy by admitting it.
Thanks for the little flamewar, but until you log in with your account so I can apologize for calling you a meanie I'm probably out. Getting a little tired.
BTW, it doesn't matter if you or anyone reads this. I had fun writing it irregardless.

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I, for one, am looking forward to the inevitable /. beta rollout fallout.
Re:What to read by glavenoid · 2014-01-01 20:05 · Score: 1

Thanks for the little flamewar, but until you log in with your account so I can apologize for calling you a meanie I'm probably out.
An editorial error, as some words were accidentally deleted. I, of course, meant I'll apologize for being a meanie not for calling you a meanie which I never did to that commentator. I did call him or her a coward, a pedantic moron and a neckbeard, which are among the things I'd be apologizing for.
Sorry for any inconvenience.

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I, for one, am looking forward to the inevitable /. beta rollout fallout.
Re:What to read by glavenoid · 2014-01-01 20:18 · Score: 1

Yes, exactly. Unlike the rest of you flaming fuckwads living in denial of your highfalutin, self-righteous, flaming fuckwaditude.
At least someone gets it.

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I, for one, am looking forward to the inevitable /. beta rollout fallout.
Re:What to read by Karmashock · 2014-01-01 23:47 · Score: 1

Perhaps but they lack the force of law under capitalism. They use market forces to maintain power not machine guns.
Furthermore, there isn't one master sociopath to deal with under capitalism but rather a whole class of them which compete against each other. That competition breeds a degree of chaos that an average man can exploit to carve out a bit of freedom. Under a totalitarian state there is no such chaos to exploit. Its at best an oligarchy and more often a dictatorship. Everything concentrating on a single point.
As to Rand... I think its limiting to base your philosophy on any one person or thing. We're all just people making our own little minds up in this game called life.
I would like to keep my right to keep making my mind up for myself. Communism means i lose all my rights. You'll likely say something about what I describe as not being actual communism... to this I respond that you don't know what real communism is in the first place.
The means are the end, dear friend. You become what you do. To enact communism you're going to have to kill a lot of people. You're going to have control everything. You're going to have to monitor and persuade at gun point most of the population. Do you honestly not see how that will change your system from your ideal to your nightmare?
Truly stop and think about it. What you do will be what you create. You intentions will be irrelevant if to get what you want you must do that and you will...
If you value freedom and the individual then you'll start by valuing freedom and the individual enough to leave people alone.
That's all I want from you and all I offer in return. Leave me be.
If you can't do that then we are at war. And at that point the only law between us is the law of tooth and claw.
Does that sound like the generally passive Rand? What is mine is mine. Violate my rights and the social contract is void and there is no law between us.

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Re:What to read by Goose+In+Orbit · 2014-01-02 00:09 · Score: 1

Ad infinitum...
Re:What to read by MaskedSlacker · 2014-01-02 00:36 · Score: 1

Don't feed the trolls.
Re: What to read by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 01:10 · Score: 0

Oh yeah, thanks for reminding me:

Bob Altemeyer - The Authoritarians

(can be freely downloaded from uni of Manitoba website)

Gives very valuable insight into the frame of mind and perspective of people such as parent poster.
Re:What to read by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 03:47 · Score: 0

you understand that most of those death came about because they were dictatorships with mentally ill or partially incompetent leaders right?
not that I'm advocating communism (the mixed model economy has proven to be far more effective and resilient) but so far most of its failing have been because of their politics, not necessarily their idea's.
Re: What to read by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 04:17 · Score: 0

The way of Kings by Brandon Sanderson
Re:What to read by nickol · 2014-01-02 06:27 · Score: 1

Karl Marx's Capital is a detailed analysis of how capitalism worked in 19th century. Just imagine a world without trade unions, patents, copyright, cinema, automobiles, telephones. It was Karl Marx's world and he described it.
Re:What to read by tibit · 2014-01-02 07:57 · Score: 1

I think you missed IICV's point. He clearly agrees with you. Capital is a diagnostic work. The Manifesto, on the other hand, is the "how to fix it" work, and the three of us agree that it belongs in the "terrible doctoring" category.

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Re:What to read by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 08:09 · Score: 0

There's no reason to only focus on obsolete economic theories like classical Marxism.
There's no reason to only focus on obsolete religious theories like classical Christianity. I mean, come on. Scientology is newer and I hear some of them got pretty rich too.

Of course by symbolset · 2014-01-01 10:24 · Score: 2

The Iliad and The Odyssey. Canterbury Tales. Moby Dick. Oedipus trilogy. Beowulf. Rubaiyat.

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Re:Of course by Zedrick · 2014-01-01 10:45 · Score: 2

> The Odyssey

Just don't grab the greek one by misstake, it's quite boring compared to:

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/352775.Odyssey?ac=1a
Re:Of course by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:13 · Score: 0

Yes, but remember the Iliad is *MUCH* darker than the odyssey. A coles notes movie version of the Odyssey is to watch "Oh Brother, Where Art Thou? (2000)". A coles notes version of the Iliad is more like watching the Brad Pitt version of Troy (2004). I read the book which was translated by T.E. Lawrence (A.K.A. Prince Dynamite, Lawrence of Arabia) --an English intelligence officer/tactician/special forces operative/archaeologist/map maker. He had studied Alexanders tactics, wrote dissertations on medieval fortress design and studied middle eastern languages and history at Cambridge before he was a map maker in the English Army in WW1. He could also translate Greek/Latin/Farsi/Pashtu/Turkish (including ancient versions) into English and could use a sniper rifle, fuse high explosives, read a compass and --as stated-- knew tactics as well as Alexander, Sun Tzu or Michael G. Vickers.
Re:Of course by hson · 2014-01-01 14:30 · Score: 1

And The Satanic Verses. It is truly a masterpiece. Not at all what I tought before I started reading it.

''To be born again,' sang Gibreel Farishta tumbling from the heavens, 'first you have to die. Ho ji! Ho ji! To land upon the bosomy earth, first one needs to fly. Tat-taa! Taka-thun! How to ever smile again, if first you won't cry? How to win the darling's love, mister, without a sigh? Baba, if you want to get born again . . .' Just before dawn one winter's morning, New Year's Day or thereabouts, two real, full-grown, living men fell from a great height, twenty-nine thousand and two feet, towards the English Channel, without benefit of parachutes or wings, out of a clear sky.

'I tell you, you must die, I tell you, I tell you,' and thusly and so beneath a moon of alabaster until a loud cry crossed the night, 'To the devil with your tunes,' the words hanging crystalline in the iced white night, 'in the movies you only mimed to playback singers, so spare me these infernal noises now.'

Gibreel, the tuneless soloist, had been cavorting in moonlight as he sang his impromptu gazal, swimming in air, butterfly-stroke, breast-stroke, bunching himself into a ball, spreadeagling himself against the almost-infinity of the almost-dawn, adopting heraldic postures, rampant, couchant, pitting levity against gravity. Now he rolled happily towards the sardonic voice. 'Ohe, Salad baba, it's you, too good. What-ho, old Chumch.' At which the other, a fastidious shadow falling headfirst in a grey suit with all the jacket buttons done up, arms by his sides, taking for granted the improbability of the bowler hat on his head, pulled a nickname-hater's face. 'Hey, Spoono,' Gibreel yelled, eliciting a second inverted wince, 'Proper London, bhai! Here we come! Those bastards down there won't know what hit them. Meteor or lightning or vengeance of God. Out of thin air, baby. Dharrraaammm! Wham, na? What an entrance, yaar. I swear: splat.'

Out of thin air: a big bang, followed by falling stars. A universal beginnlng, a miniature echo of the birth of time ... the jumbo jet Bostan, Flight A 1-420, blew apart without any warning high above the great, rotting, beautiful, snow-white, illuminated city, Mahagonny, Babylon, Alphaville. But Gibreel has already named it, I mustn't interfere: Proper London, capital of Vilayet, winked blinked nodded in the night. While at Himalayan height a brief and premature sun burst into the powdery January air, a blip vanished from radar screens, and the thin air was full of bodies, descending from the Everest of the catastrophe to the milky paleness of the sea.
Re:Of course by nbauman · 2014-01-01 18:24 · Score: 1

I'll second that. That's a subset of the Great Books.
I'd add the Apology of Socrates and On Liberty by John Stuart Mill.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_books#Sample_list
Re:Of course by symbolset · 2014-01-01 21:22 · Score: 1

It should of course be mentioned that nearly all of these can be had for free from Project Gutenberg, and probably Goodreads and Google Books as well. There is no excuse any more to have not read them.

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Re:Of course by nbauman · 2014-01-02 03:25 · Score: 1

It should of course be mentioned that nearly all of these can be had for free from Project Gutenberg, and probably Goodreads and Google Books as well. There is no excuse any more to have not read them.
That's a good point. Actually, some of the more recent books went back into copyright under the Micky Mouse copyright extension act. James Joyce only went into public domain in 2012. http://joycefoundation.osu.edu/joyce-copyright/fair-use-and-permissions/about-law/public-domain http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/books/2012/01/james-joyce-public-domain.html
But the idea of having the entire Great Books on a Kindle that weighs less than a Modern Library Giant Edition is awesome.

Bad Science by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:24 · Score: 0

And its sister book Bad Pharma
Both vital to maintain the integrety of the healthcare system

The Jungle by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:24 · Score: 0

They made me read this in something like 8th grade, and it still sticks with me. Teaches you what it's like when capitalism is allowed to run rampant.

I won't say unions are godsends, but there has to be some check on industry or we end up with legal slavery.

Re:The Jungle by XcepticZP · 2014-01-01 13:20 · Score: 1

I won't say unions are godsends, but there has to be some check on industry or we end up with legal slavery.
10-50% of your income is taken away from you every year, and you think capitalism is the problem? My, have you got lots to learn. For every 10 minutes you work, 1-5 of it was for the state. You can mangle the definitions, and twist the meanings all you want... but at the end of the day, eventually you'll realize that you already are a legal slave, just not a 100% one.
Re:The Jungle by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 13:47 · Score: 0

Never said differently. Now read The Jungle and you'll see what real, 100% slavery is like.
I am forced to pay for the entities that give me protection from criminals and invaders, that provide roads and regulate utilities, that educate the children around me so they're not dumb as rocks, and so on -- these are not horrible things to have to pay for. That's society. You don't get to have pure, unadulterated freedom if you live within a society. There has to be order.
And society is not perfectly efficient. I will absolutely admit that government is wasteful and that much of the money spent there is on crap for politicians and lobbyists.
But compare it to the alternative. Read The Jungle. It's fiction, but based on the cold, hard realities of what it was like to work for industry when there were no government protections. Hell, I'll gladly pay 10-50% of my income just to have government prevent me having to work in those conditions.
Re:The Jungle by dbIII · 2014-01-01 22:01 · Score: 1

It's the price of not being a hermit.
Re:The Jungle by XcepticZP · 2014-01-01 23:08 · Score: 1

Government and the state are not the same thing as "society" or "community". Either way, your logical fallacy is false dillemna. "Either we have a state that steals money as taxes, or we must live as hermits".
Re:The Jungle by dbIII · 2014-01-02 00:30 · Score: 1

No. It's not a false dilemma. Hopefully you'll work it out and grow up.
Re:The Jungle by XcepticZP · 2014-01-02 01:17 · Score: 1

Ah yes, the old "plug my ears, go la la la and call people names" defense mechanism. I see it has served you well.
Re:The Jungle by dbIII · 2014-01-02 09:26 · Score: 1

Hey look Peter Pan - you are posting on an internet that grew out of something paid for by the taxpayer. There's no fallacy - but maybe a phallusy of you pretending that being a selfish prick can be excused by calling participation in society "slavery".
Re:The Jungle by dbIII · 2014-01-02 11:04 · Score: 1

Ah yes, the old "plug my ears, go la la la and call people names" defense mechanism
As in you marking me foe for instance?

The manual by El_Muerte_TDS · 2014-01-01 10:26 · Score: 5, Funny

Just for once, read the f'ing manual.

Re:The manual by TeknoHog · 2014-01-01 10:51 · Score: 5, Funny

The fucking manual, also known as Kama Sutra.

--
Escher was the first MC and Giger invented the HR department.
Re:The manual by behrooz0az · 2014-01-01 11:32 · Score: 4, Funny

Just don't forget to get a recent version: http://xkcd.com/414/

--
Moderating "-1, Disagree" is simple censorship. Have the guts to post your opinion. -- Spazmania (174582)
Re:The manual by logical1010 · 2014-01-01 12:08 · Score: 1

The Manual is good but I wouldn't put it on a must read list.

--
There is something wonderful in seeing a wrong-headed majority assailed by truth. ~John Kenneth Galbraith
Re:The manual by mattie_p · 2014-01-01 13:14 · Score: 1

My wife says: "If you need a manual, you're doing it wrong."
Re:The manual by melikamp · 2014-01-01 13:25 · Score: 3, Funny

$ man wife No manual entry for wife $
Re:The manual by mattie_p · 2014-01-01 13:43 · Score: 1

$ man wife No manual entry for wife $

$ man fucking No manual entry for fucking $
At least in my distro
Re:The manual by VortexCortex · 2014-01-01 17:11 · Score: 1

$ man wife No manual entry for wife $
$ man fucking No manual entry for fucking $
At least in my distro
$ man finger $ man fsck $ man make $ sudo make me a sandwich.
noobs: The September that never ends.
Re:The manual by Alien1024 · 2014-01-02 00:48 · Score: 1

Tried apropos...
$ apropos fucking fucking: nothing appropriate
How prudish.
Re:The manual by pikester · 2014-01-02 18:09 · Score: 1

That would be fantasy for most people here.

Everything by C. J. Cherryh by msobkow · 2014-01-01 10:26 · Score: 1

Best author of all time, hands down. Reading her books is like watching a movie.

--
I do not fail; I succeed at finding out what does not work.

Re:Everything by C. J. Cherryh by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:33 · Score: 0

your kin are recent to the concept of thumbs and a middle brow, it seems...
Re:Everything by C. J. Cherryh by khallow · 2014-01-01 11:02 · Score: 1, Funny

Thumbs might be a new thing, but I bet they always had that middle brow.
Re:Everything by C. J. Cherryh by msobkow · 2014-01-01 12:03 · Score: 0

Didn't your mommy call you upstairs for supper half an hour ago?

--
I do not fail; I succeed at finding out what does not work.
Re:Everything by C. J. Cherryh by Libertarian001 · 2014-01-01 12:15 · Score: 1

I read two of her books and absolutely hated them, and both were highly recommended. I don't think I'd ever read anything of hers again. Too much stuff that's actually good out there.
Re:Everything by C. J. Cherryh by smash · 2014-01-01 17:20 · Score: 1

Reading her books is like watching a movie.
They make you dumber? Comparing literature to a movie is NOT encouraging.

--
I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
Re:Everything by C. J. Cherryh by bloodhawk · 2014-01-01 20:10 · Score: 1

Reading her books is like watching a movie.
could you have come up with a worse possible insult for a writer? though I did find much of her stuff pretty ordinary (ordinary enough that I don't read anything of hers anymore) I would not consider it as bad as a movie.

Cryptonomicon? by l0ungeb0y · 2014-01-01 10:26 · Score: 3, Insightful

Sure, if you think that reading should be an exercise in excruciating drudgery.
That book bored me to tears, resulting in my finally giving up and throwing it in the trash.

Re:Cryptonomicon? by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:39 · Score: 0, Flamebait

get a big stack of 'Archie' comics, much more your speed, along with a sack of tasty Dullard Chews (tm)
Re:Cryptonomicon? by McSnickered · 2014-01-01 15:22 · Score: 1

I wouldn't list Cryptonomicon as classic literature, but it definitely has been one of the most enjoyable books I've ever read.
But everyone's tastes are different. I've tried reading Neuromancer twice and gave up less than half-way through. I just got to the point where I couldn't stand reading it, but many others I've talked to say it's one of their favorite all-time books. Go figure ...

--
They call me the working man. I guess that's what I am.
Re: Cryptonomicon? by nomadic · 2014-01-01 16:39 · Score: 1

Interesting! I had the opposite situation; read Neuromancer a couple of times but tried Cryptonomicon twice and just couldn't get through it. Just found it tedious.
Re:Cryptonomicon? by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 16:48 · Score: 0

Seconded. I like a complex story, but Cryptonomicon was a drudge and one of few books I abandoned halfway through.
Re:Cryptonomicon? by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 03:00 · Score: 0

Say what you want about this book but there's some truth about manual override...
That said, this is probably the only thing I can remember about the book, so you're probably right, not a must read.
Re:Cryptonomicon? by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-08 21:15 · Score: 0

Awwwww *pat pat*

GEB by gbjbaanb · 2014-01-01 10:28 · Score: 5, Insightful

GÃdel, Escher, Bach: An Eternal Golden Braid

Godel, Escher, Bach is not a simple read. The ideas are complex and the logic subtle. But it is a completely satisfying book, and reading it is one of those rare experiences when you leave feeling smarter than when you started.

its true, though I felt like a complete simpleton after reading it - its an awesome piece of writing. Its not something to read casually though, you're gonna have to think, a lot.

Re:GEB by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:58 · Score: 1

I've read it, and I agree with this review of it. Spend your time on a more useful book.
The best books are those that teach you something you do not expect. It can be a fiction book, or a non-fiction book, exploring a particular subject. Funnily enough, I found a lot of great books from Slashdot comments.
My insightful favourites are:
Snakes in Suits, When Psychopaths go to Work (nonfiction)
Freakonomics (nonfiction)
To live forever, by Jack Vance
The Space Merchants, by Pohl and Kornbluth
I don't read much nowadays though, and when I do, it's software dev specific...
Re:GEB by logical1010 · 2014-01-01 12:13 · Score: 1

And along side G,E,B. I'd add Chaos by James Gleick. A one two punch in non-fic science.

--
There is something wonderful in seeing a wrong-headed majority assailed by truth. ~John Kenneth Galbraith
Re:GEB by melikamp · 2014-01-01 12:27 · Score: 1

Have you tried NOT reading it, though? May be you should doing THAT before you pass judgement. As an ardent admirer of the work of all three men in the title, I suspect my mind was spared from yet another piece of quasi-philosophical pulp.
Re:GEB by RandCraw · 2014-01-01 13:11 · Score: 1

GEB *is* a great book. Like it or not, it's a read that you will never forget. Hofstader's writing is a fugue itself, composing and playing variations on many themes as the narrative unwinds. Think of it as a fictional tale on metaphysics where the plot ricochets and glances off real ideas grounded in mathematical principles, some of which are apparent, while others need a little coaxing to show themselves.
I think the trick is for the reader to have patience. Don't push yourself to finish the book in a timely manner. Feel free to skip ahead or put it down periodically. As you read, consider adding a subplot or two of your own invention, so that the words of Achilles and the Tortoise might reveal more of your own Matrix.
Re:GEB by maitas · 2014-01-01 14:26 · Score: 1

I read it two times, first in English and second time in Spanish. If your first language is Spanish I recommend this way to read it. The Spanish version has a lot of extra information that Douglas added for translation simplicity, and it makes things a lot more clear.
Re:GEB by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 15:16 · Score: 0

If you expected everything in GEB, welp, you must be a genius. Can't help you there, I'm all out of pins to deflate your ego with. GEB is one of the first books I can think of giving to someone who *really* wants to expand their mind. It is not an easy work to get through as a whole--it's long and tedious at points, with no shortage of "exercises for the reader" (usually followed in the next chapter by a simplifed version you can read as a bedtime story to your kids). You will, however, be a wiser person for having (critically) read it.
Re:GEB by njnnja · 2014-01-01 16:54 · Score: 1

I totally agree with GEB, but would add that the book is not really about understanding Godel's proof, although that it the part that most people dwell on because it is the hardest part for most people to get and therefore the part they spend the most time on. To really get the most out of the book, I recommend Nagel and Newman's Godel's Proof first so that you understand the basics and can simply enjoy Hofstader's artistry.
Re:GEB by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 00:52 · Score: 0

"I am a Strange Loop" is a much better place to start as Douglas Hofstadter has his thoughts much more in order when writing it. Not to mention the lifetime's experience in explaining himself makes strange loop an exponentially simpler read.
Re:GEB by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 04:54 · Score: 0

Parent here. No, I did not expect everything in GEB. However, the "cliffs notes" in the linked review should be obvious to anyone who has a science education and/or has lots of curiosity. The rest is, as you said, long and tedious. The "enlightenment" from GEB can be more productively attained by reading other, better written works.
Re:GEB by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 06:03 · Score: 0

I liked that, and loved this too:
http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/2081.The_Mind_s_I
Re:GEB by almitydave · 2014-01-02 06:45 · Score: 1

Pulp it's not. I'm also an admirer of the three, and this book is very well-written. Really, it earns all the good Slashdot mods: insightful, informative, interesting, & funny. I would definitely include it on a shortlist of essential books.
Hofstadter's main thesis has to do with what makes an intelligence, but it's by no means the only thing to get out of it. It's given me a tremendous insight into the workings of the brain. It has a section that explains how DNA works. He talks about P/NP, logic, music, lots of things. He didn't convince me of his main conjecture - that consciousness is an emergent phenomenon of systems sufficiently complex for self-representation - but he doesn't try to prove it in this work, merely suggest it. Even if you're religious like me and think he's an anti-religious atheist nutjob trying to explain away the soul, it's still worth a read (I don't think those things).
My other suggestions for a short list of essential books (that I've read) would be:
-the Bible (at least some selections, maybe Genesis, Exodus, Gospel of John, and one of Paul's epistles): the Judeo-Christian tradition being one of the foundations of Western civilization
-The Last Days of Socrates (Euthyphro, Apology, Crito, Phaedo)
-Shakespeare play: lots of options; Hamlet and Romeo & Juliet would be top contenders
-The Lord of the Rings
-Foundation Trilogy (Foundation, Foundation and Empire, Second Foundation)
-A Brief History of Time
I would consider these to be the shortest list of books that everyone should read that I can make. Of course there are tons that are beneficial, and many that I haven't read. Following these, to be well-rounded there should probably be some Dickens, a Russian tome, some Plato, Aristotle, Aquinas, some good 19th & 20th century philosophy (I'm not well-read in this area).
Other strong recommendations by almitydave include Dune, Machine of Death, Salem's Lot (haven't read it yet, but hear it's the best Stephen King), 20,000 Leagues Under the Sea, A Christmas Carol, Beowulf, Hitchhiker's Guide series, and Paradise Lost.

--
my, your, his/her/its, our, your, their
I'm, you're, he's/she's/it's, we're, you're, they're
Re:GEB by almechist · 2014-01-02 10:23 · Score: 1

Have you tried NOT reading it, though? May be you should doing THAT before you pass judgement. As an ardent admirer of the work of all three men in the title, I suspect my mind was spared from yet another piece of quasi-philosophical pulp.
I can't let this comment go unanswered. GEB is a singular achievement, not quite like anything else you will read, to dismiss it unread as "quasi-philosophical pulp" is an indication that you're probably just too lazy to investigate the book in any way, let alone actually take the time to read it. Obviously, the author shares your admiration for the three men in the title, but I would say the book is not primarily about those three, and it can in fact be read, enjoyed, and understood (probably in that order) without any prior knowledge of their life and works. It is at times challenging, admittedly, but always in a fun and adventurous way, it's never flat or boring. It is one of the few books that is almost guaranteed to get you to really think about the true nature of consciousness and intelligence, which is what the book is really about at its core.
In short, this is a work that has changed people's lives. You dismiss it at your peril, and to your own detriment.
Re:GEB by gregor-e · 2014-01-02 10:36 · Score: 1

I would add The Mind's I. It has a way of inverting one's ego, or perhaps molding it into a Klein bottle.
Re:GEB by melikamp · 2014-01-02 19:20 · Score: 1

Obviously, you haven't tried not reading it, or you would know EXACTLY what I am talking about. Here's my cure: listen to some Bach, put a drawing of Escher on the wall, and pick up a copy of Enderton's Logic.

read for fun by wsxian · 2014-01-01 10:28 · Score: 1

Andre Norton: Time Travelers Any Doc Savage book Foundation Series by Asimov Emma by Jane Austin The Last of the Mohicans by Cooper Freddy the Pig by Brooks Business Law (any edition starting with the 4th) by Chessman The US Constitution And not the least of all: The Whole Earth Catalog

Re:read for fun by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:01 · Score: 0

What the fuck is with this list? was this a breathlessly typed mess or did you think you were separating everything with a newline?
Re:read for fun by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 15:22 · Score: 0

Probably the newline thing. Even as a veteran Slashdotter, I still get tripped up by it on occasion, since my comments are set to default to HTML. I would put the Foundation series high on my list too. Doc Savage--well, I grew up with him, and while fun, it didn't particularly impact my view of the world.

Orwell by hellebore · 2014-01-01 10:28 · Score: 4, Insightful

Animal Farm

Re:Orwell by wsxian · 2014-01-01 10:30 · Score: 1

No. Might as well have them read 1984 by Orwell. I disliked those two books.
Re:Orwell by smash · 2014-01-01 17:23 · Score: 1

Like/dislike isn't why they are mentioned. They are educational.

--
I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
Re:Orwell by ClickOnThis · 2014-01-01 17:35 · Score: 1

Animal Farm
No. Might as well have them read 1984 by Orwell.
I disliked those two books.
You may have disliked them, but they're both part of the Canon of 20th century literature.

--
If it weren't for deadlines, nothing would be late.

kamasutra by johnsnails · 2014-01-01 10:29 · Score: 1

kamasutra

Animal farm and 1984 by whoever57 · 2014-01-01 10:29 · Score: 5, Insightful

Just as relevent now.

--
The real "Libtards" are the Libertarians!

Re:Animal farm and 1984 by cultiv8 · 2014-01-01 11:26 · Score: 1

A People's History of the United States by Howard Zinn, for background

--
sysadmins and parents of newborns get the same amount of sleep.
Re:Animal farm and 1984 by Bing+Tsher+E · 2014-01-01 12:01 · Score: 1

Looking at that domain, I take it History is a weapon for class warfare, eh?
Many historians might disagree.
Re:Animal farm and 1984 by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 12:24 · Score: 0

Today is more like "The Iron Heel".
Re:Animal farm and 1984 by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 12:33 · Score: 0

I second this!
Also "What Uncle Sam Really Wants" by Noam Chomsky.
Re:Animal farm and 1984 by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 20:22 · Score: 0

Honestly, 'hearing' you say, "Just as...", gave me a perspective shift. I had forgotten that even 1984 was more about Orwell's present day than an actual prediction of the future. Still, given present day realities (e.g., dareievensaytheNSA), wouldn't you say, "Even more relevant now" is a more accurate phrasing?

The Dark Tower by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:29 · Score: 0

need i say more?

SciFi List by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:30 · Score: 0

mote in gods eye

Just have a couple by dugancent · 2014-01-01 10:30 · Score: 3, Insightful

Michael Pollan - The Omnivore's Dilemma
Christopher McDougall - Born to Run

--
SJWs are the new boogeyman. -Me

Re:Just have a couple by CowTipperGore · 2014-01-02 05:03 · Score: 1

No mod points today but I agree 1000% on The Omnivore's Dilemma.

Reasons for:SciFi list by Toe,+The · 2014-01-01 10:30 · Score: 5, Interesting

Posted too quickly and should have said why...

Stranger in a Strange Land - really stretches your mind. What is religion? What is humanity? Little questions like that.

Ender's Game - A great morality play; and a very exciting read.

Slaughterhouse Five - (or really anything and everything by Vonnegut. The guy is a great master, and every one of his books will open your mind.)

The Hobbit - Okay, not Sci Fi, but a great book on greed. Pure and simple. Or perhaps not so simple.

Aristoi - A deep look into a future of plenty, where society needs rigid controls to prevent a nano tech disaster. Also great insights into mind-computer interfaces and where they can lead.

Consider Phlebas - A different take on a future of plenty, where society is so advanced, the artificial intelligences we have developed treat us like their pets.

Steel Beach - Yet another take on a future of plenty, more near-term, and about the angst it can engender.

The Peace War - Just read it.

Re:Reasons for:SciFi list by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:22 · Score: 1

Hitchhicker's Guide to the Galaxy.
Re:Reasons for:SciFi list by ozmanjusri · 2014-01-01 12:12 · Score: 1

The Machine Stops

--
"I've got more toys than Teruhisa Kitahara."
Re:Reasons for:SciFi list by no1nose · 2014-01-01 14:40 · Score: 1

All of the above are great. I would like to add: The Worthing Saga
Re:Reasons for:SciFi list by chipschap · 2014-01-01 15:28 · Score: 1

To "The Toe" : terrific list. I've read some and now will plan to read the rest. I'll add one: The Difference Engine.
Re:Reasons for:SciFi list by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 15:44 · Score: 1

War is a racket - Major General Smedley Butler
Read that one book of confessions and never again support any war anywhere ever again.
Also,
Confessions of an Economic Hitman - John Perkins
Once you finish those two, you are pretty much enlightened and pissed at the same time.
Re:Reasons for:SciFi list by Evil+Pete · 2014-01-01 17:23 · Score: 1
Nice SF list. Such a list could go on and on and on. Here are some I would recommend, just at random. I'll probably miss quite a few that I really like.
- Star Maker by Olaf Stapledon, this book just defies words
- Chthon, the novel that was edged out by Ender's Game, had a big effect on me.
- Cryptonomicon
- In the Ocean of Night
- Dune
- Songs of Earth and Power, fantasy by Greg Bear
- The War of the Worlds
Agree with Consider Phlebas. I just gave up on the list there are too many even before you get to non SF stuff.
--
Bitter and proud of it.
Re:Reasons for:SciFi list by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 18:43 · Score: 0

The Mistborn Trilogy by Brandon Sanderson - An Amazing Epic Fantasy built around a unique Magic system that makes sense (unlike the Lord of the Rings which is just fantastical with no actual rules to which they must conform) ... Its an Ocean 11 style book where the "Evil God" has already won and they try to over throw him.
Re:Reasons for:SciFi list by Joce640k · 2014-01-01 23:02 · Score: 1

Oh, dear. this thread's going to be a total trainwreck...

--
No sig today...
Re:Reasons for:SciFi list by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 00:47 · Score: 0

you are a nerd
Re:Reasons for:SciFi list by ByteSlicer · 2014-01-02 02:16 · Score: 1

Ender's Game - A great morality play; and a very exciting read.
I've read it, and liked it, but "exiting" was not the impression it left on me.
It read almost like a documentary: everything was detached, without emotion. There was no real pacing; things just happened when they had to happen.
Re:Reasons for:SciFi list by DarthVain · 2014-01-02 03:16 · Score: 1

Just two things:
Hobbit: First book that is faster to read than it is to watch the movies... :)
The Peace War? By Joe Haldman? Yes good, but how can you even mention it without the even better Forever War?
Re:Reasons for:SciFi list by brm · 2014-01-06 16:52 · Score: 1

Read "Ender's Game" the short story instead. The novel is kind of like the novel form of Moby Dick.
Re:Reasons for:SciFi list by GlennC · 2014-01-07 08:28 · Score: 1

I wholeheartedly agree...Card's novels are drek, but his short stories are very readable.

--
Go on, citizen, stamp the vote card. R or D, your choice.

Re:goodbye slashdot by Morpeth · 2014-01-01 10:30 · Score: 1

Actually I think /. should just stop letting ACs post at all, since 95%+ of the time is just trolling/flamebait, or some unstable person ranting like a lunatic. Please by all means, leave /. and never come back.

--

'The unexamined life is not worth living' - Socrates

Re:goodbye slashdot by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:31 · Score: 0

So post your list, or farewell!

The Road to Wigan Pier by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:33 · Score: 0

By George Orwell.

Really interesting look at life.

Enders Game - Orson Scott Card by LaughALot · 2014-01-01 10:33 · Score: 2, Funny

Whenever you see bugger read it as formic - ROFLMAO

THE all-time most popular book by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:34 · Score: 0

Clearly for those who despise the notion of God or Faith, it would be insulting to read; but for anyone who allows for the possibility of things beyond the physical world our human bodies are constrained to, the Bible may offer insights and illuminations greater than any other book. Even if it has no life-changing impact on you personally, to ignore the single most influential compilation of writings would be negligent for anyone claiming to be scholarly, open minded, or simply curious about what all the fuss is about. Because - let's be honest - "Christian" behavior certainly doesn't always [ever completely] reflect the teachings contained with the Bible - so read it yourself.

Re:THE all-time most popular book by khallow · 2014-01-01 11:06 · Score: 2

but for anyone who allows for the possibility of things beyond the physical world our human bodies are constrained to, the Bible may offer insights and illuminations greater than any other book.

Only if you ignore all the other religious books making the same sorts of claims. But having said that, I think "Engines of Creation" would give the Bible a run for its money on the above claim.
Re:THE all-time most popular book by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 13:01 · Score: 0

the Bible may offer insights and illuminations greater than any other book
So might the Satanic Bible.
A book which incidentally is much less dense and difficult to read, contradicts itself far less often, and is a great conversation starter on buses.

Who, not what by paiute · 2014-01-01 10:34 · Score: 1

Instead of specific books, I usually recommend to people looking for reading material that they read the entire output of certain authors: Orwell, Sinclair, van Tilburg Clark, Shute, Faulkner, Dos Passos, Francis, O'Hara, Doctorow, and some others.

Oddly, some of my favorite single works come from writers whose other books which I either can't get past the first chapter or don't pick up because of the subject. For instance, Gravity's Rainbow is in my top five all time, but Pynchon's other books never engaged me. Stephenson's group about the Waterhouse/Shaftoe families is up there as well, but I vividly remembering picking up Anathem in a bookstore and leafing through it for a minute, then putting it down with no interest in it.

--
If Slashdot were chemistry it would look like this:Cadaverine

Re:Who, not what by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:46 · Score: 0

>...Doctorow...
A good indication that you should ignore the rest of his list as well.
Re:Who, not what by Bing+Tsher+E · 2014-01-01 12:02 · Score: 1

Naw. Everybody is entitled to make mistakes without being totally disregarded.
Re:Who, not what by paiute · 2014-01-01 12:10 · Score: 1

>...Doctorow...
A good indication that you should ignore the rest of his list as well.
E. L. - I hope you didn't think I meant Cory.

--
If Slashdot were chemistry it would look like this:Cadaverine
Re:Who, not what by Andy_R · 2014-01-01 12:40 · Score: 1

Anathem rewards persistence, it's not an easy book to get into, but if you stick with it, you'll be taken on a seriously impressive journey. There's a strong chance you'll come out the other side thinking it's one of the best books ever written, and that Fraa Jad is... well, I can't say much without spoilers, but he's one of my favourite literary characters ever.

--
A pizza of radius z and thickness a has a volume of pi z z a
Re:Who, not what by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 01:57 · Score: 0

No one should read the entire output of Doctorow. In fact, noone should be exposed to Doctorow at all. While I agree with many of his ideas, his writing is just pure shit.

1984 by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:34 · Score: 0

1984 - soon to be known as the handbook of modern living. Get a copy quickly, before they all disappear into the memory hole.

Here's a brief list by redmid17 · 2014-01-01 10:34 · Score: 2, Insightful

What you listed: Fahrenheit 451, To Kill A Mockingbird, In The Heat of the Night, Huckleberry Finn, Cryptonomicon, One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest, A Wrinkle In Time, When Rabbit Howls

All good stuff here. I'd add on the Bible, How to Win Friends and Influence People, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance (or On the Road), Animal Farm, Brave New World, 1984.

I'd also add some books *not* to read: Catcher in the Rye, Girl of the Limberlost

If someone recommend CitR to you, you can question their taste from then until they die. If someone tells you it changed their life, I'd just stop talking to them.

Re:Here's a brief list by JaredOfEuropa · 2014-01-01 10:45 · Score: 4, Insightful

If someone tells you it changed their life, I'd just stop talking to them.
If someone told me any book changed their life, I'd start talking to them to find out more. If anything, such an event always makes for great conversation.

--
If construction was anything like programming, an incorrectly fitted lock would bring down the entire building...
Re:Here's a brief list by jddj · 2014-01-01 10:48 · Score: 3, Informative

Sorry, I think Catcher in the Rye is worth the read. Not life-changing, but yeah, read it - worthwhile.
++On The Road - awesome book - might supplement it with some third-party history of the beats.
Recommend Dune in the Science Fiction realm. Take the series as far as you wanna - but at least Dune.
Don't Make Me Think by Steve Krug is essential for the web developer, and I think "Simple and Beautiful" by Giles Colburne a close second. Maybe top it with "The Design of Everyday Things" by Don Norman - you'll never look at a door handle the same way again.
Recommend for ANY coder Kernigan and Ritchie "The C Programming Language" - such a brief tome, and a comprehensive document on how to write in the language that rocked the world. Would be a good read for any tech writer, as well.
Whatever they say about Steven Ambrose (and they say a WHOLE lot...accusations of plagarism, f.e.), "Undaunted Courage" presents the Lewis and Clark expedition in Technicolor - if only they could teach with books of this quality.
If you're gonna read any Stephen King, gotta read The Stand, for the sweep of it.
Re:Here's a brief list by egcagrac0 · 2014-01-01 11:39 · Score: 1

If someone recommend CitR to you, you can question their taste from then until they die. If someone tells you it changed their life, I'd just stop talking to them.
You don't need to read it, carrying a copy with you at all times suffices.
Re:Here's a brief list by ClickOnThis · 2014-01-01 17:44 · Score: 1

I'd also add some books *not* to read: Catcher in the Rye, Girl of the Limberlost
If someone recommend CitR to you, you can question their taste from then until they die. If someone tells you it changed their life, I'd just stop talking to them.
Shame on you. CitR is a great book.
CitR has a timeless message for disillusioned adolescents. We can all grow from J. D. Salinger's insights.

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If it weren't for deadlines, nothing would be late.
Re:Here's a brief list by Warma · 2014-01-01 21:43 · Score: 1

If someone recommend CitR to you, you can question their taste from then until they die. If someone tells you it changed their life, I'd just stop talking to them.
Others have already objected to this, but I'd really like to know why Catcher in the Rye is a bad book. Do you care to elaborate on your position?
I read it just a while ago, and found both the atmosphere and the main character interesting. The book is also very fast-paced and compact, so it is by no means tedious.
I admit that personally the main character had views, which were extremely far from my own positions on life, and considering how smart he is portrayed as, the general mentality of the book feels very off. I.e. you'd think that a person in his situation and with his mental faculties would not act the way he acts. However, I don't think that this is enough to actually dislike the book, considering its strengths.
Re:Here's a brief list by voidphoenix · 2014-01-02 05:04 · Score: 1

Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance

Second this (and pretty much all of the books listed by redmid17). Lila, the sequel to Zen, is also a pretty good read.
I'd add the following to the fiction list: The Name of the Rose, A Game of Thrones (heck, the whole A Song of Ice and Fire series), Jonathan Livingston Seagull and Illusions, Alice in Wonderland/Through the Looking Glass, Starship Troopers, Robinson Crusoe, Swiss Family Robinson, Gulliver's Travels, Twenty Thousand Leagues Under the Sea (and anything else by Jules Verne), Sandman (especially Season of Mists), Neverwhere, American Gods (and anything else by Neil Gaiman).
Non-fiction: The Road Less Travelled (this, like Zen, you read over and over and learn something new every time), Meditations (Descartes), Critique of Pure Reason, The Prince (Machiavelli), Thus Spake Zarathustra (and Nietzsche's other works), The Art of War, The Book of Five Rings, anything by Carl Jung and Joseph Campbell.
Fiction/non-fiction, depending on the reader: Mythology (I read Edith Hamilton's when I was very young and Bullfinch's much later, either will do), Tao Te Ching, Divine Comedy.
Many of these I recommend not because I categorically agree with them, but because they broaden perspectives and make you think.

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Excuse me, wtf r u doin?
Re:Here's a brief list by redmid17 · 2014-01-02 06:23 · Score: 1

Ah the Art of War, totally forgot that one. Great catch. Not sure I'd recommend Critique of Pure Reason for most people. I had to read it in German in college, so that probably affected it a bit but I didn't get much out of it.
Re:Here's a brief list by redmid17 · 2014-01-02 06:33 · Score: 1

It might be a great book, but it doesn't mean it's worth reading. When I read it as a 14 year old, I found Holden worthless and like many teenagers, I was fairly disaffected and whiny myself. Frankly its message isn't for most people, and those who identify with it can spend their time reading better books with more likable characters.
Re:Here's a brief list by redmid17 · 2014-01-02 06:38 · Score: 1

The atmosphere is interesting. The main character is intolerable. The books vacillates between 80 different scenarios in just over 200 pages. It's not fast-paced. It's just a short book. Whiny, ennui filled teenager/adolescent has been done before, obviously, and it's been done far better than Salinger did it. Most of it revolves around Holden and his portrayal. At some point, an angst filled teenager as a complex character has to hit a limit. Salinger went far beyond that to the point of alienating the reader, and I say that as someone who made that judgment as the angst-filled, isolated 14 year I was.
Re:Here's a brief list by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 09:45 · Score: 0

When I consider the possibility the countless teenagers that felt like Holden felt may have killed themselves, I think that Salinger may be one of the greatest serial killers in history, and I thank him for that.
Re:Here's a brief list by Warma · 2014-01-02 20:21 · Score: 1

Funny you should say that, since I feel that angst-filled teenagers are portrayed extremely poorly by popular culture, and almost all depictions of youth feel as if they were done by adults with only a vague understanding of what being young actually feels like (it's always girls this, girls that, my parents don't understand me, when those with real angst seem to have problems, which are a tad more serious). In Catcher in the Rye, Salinger went above and beyond this, making the character stranger than reality instead of approximating and falling short. I felt that this was the whole point of the book, and precisely the reason it was interesting.
If I were meaner, I'd ask whether 14 years of age really was the best point of life to read this work and make the permanent judgments, which you pass on to middle-aged strangers in the internet, but instead I simply admit, that 13-15 was also the point in life where I had the most free time and did the most reading. Most of my impressions on literature stem from those years.
I still have one request, however. Please tell me who has, in your opinion, done the whiny, ennui filled adolescent properly. I really can't think of anyone.
Re:Here's a brief list by redmid17 · 2014-01-03 05:11 · Score: 1

Goethe did it pretty well as did Twain. I don't think Shakespeare did it too poorly either. Granted those are some of the most talented writers ever, but the point still stands. For someone trying to portray NYC and how an aimless, wanna drifter of a team would interact it with it, Salinger got it half right. The environment is perfect. Holden just encountered far too much of it to be believable, especially at that period in time.

2 that left an impression on me by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:35 · Score: 0

The Hawkline Monster and Flowers for Algernon

Read the Bible by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:35 · Score: 1

I was a Christian before I actually read the damn thing. Now I am convinced that God does not exist. Most people who go around spouting off how great it is and blind quote scripture like robots have clearly never read the thing for themselves but instead have had others interpreting it for them. Forget about Muslims' 72 virgins in heaven, Christians have at least 10 and on top of it all one ends with the conclusion that both God and Jesus are hypocritical lying pricks.

Four Agreements / Don't shoot the dog by rvw · 2014-01-01 10:36 · Score: 1

The Four Agreements by Don Ruiz Miguel, easy read, very inspiring, if you're open to this kind of thing. For me it made a difference in my life, especially the second one - don't take anything personally. Just reading the agreements is not enough, read the book because it explains why. Reading the book is still not enough however.... You need to practise this to make it effective. Then read the book again because it has more layers than you realise the first time.

Another interesting read: Don't Shoot the Dog by Karen Pryor. This book is about operant conditioning, how we learn things by positive or negative reinforcement, consciously or unconsciously. It explains a lot of things about your own behavior. The most important lesson: positive reinforcement is the way to go, but it won't be easy. It's a fun book! It explains click training, how that works for animals. It's often confused with manipulation; like anything it can be used for good and bad things.

Re:Four Agreements / Don't shoot the dog by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:46 · Score: 0

"Four Agreements" is a dumb down new age rip off of Carlos Castaneda (a fake and plagiarist who ripped off Hokey Injuns of the New age with warmed over Dzogchen), which itself is _not_ high quality literature, but at least had an interesting psychedelic drug angle. Anyone who is impressed by Don Miguel Ruiz has the reading comprehension level of a King Charles Spaniel and Bad Taste that is truly subhuman.

Authors rather than books..... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:37 · Score: 4, Interesting

Rather than thinking about books, I would think about authors. Mark Twain, Gabriel Garcia Marquez, Friederich Nietzsche, Feodor Dostoevski, Tolstoi, Voltaire, Edgar Alan Poe, Pablo Neruda, etc.

Watership Down by Reliable+Windmill · 2014-01-01 10:37 · Score: 5, Insightful

by Richard Adams. I truly believe it helps people build empathy, and sympathize with animals and understand how frail and exposed they really are.

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Signature intentionally left blank.

Re:Watership Down by mrbester · 2014-01-01 11:00 · Score: 1

The Girl In The Swing is a better Richard Adams book. It's not for kids though.
Henry Williamson and John Fowles should get a mention too.

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"Wait. Something's happening. It's opening up! My God, it's full of apricots!"
Re:Watership Down by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:35 · Score: 0

"by Richard Adams. I truly believe it helps people build empathy, and sympathize with animals and understand how frail and exposed they really are."
Be prepared to say Goodbye to rabbit stew forever as long as your kids are still at home.
Re:Watership Down by melikamp · 2014-01-01 12:42 · Score: 1

Second. I am not sure it helps anything, but it is one of the best epics you will read.
Re:Watership Down by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 04:50 · Score: 0

This. A thousand times, this.

don't read To Kill a Mockingbird! by Michael+Wolf · 2014-01-01 10:38 · Score: 1

It's soul-crushingly boring. All those years ago it had daring content, but now it's just long and tedious.

Try Pride and Prejudice. The great thing about it is that it's hilarious from the opening sentence. Also, it turns out that one of the seemingly odeous characters in part has some social anxiety problems that masquerade as something different, which some people on this website may be able to identify with. There are so many other interesting characters, some with completely obvious flaws, some whose appearances are completely deceptive, and some who are in the middle, straightforward but with issues going on that surprise even themselves.

The contrast between the two books couldn't be greater in terms of the pleasure you will get. And the second has more to teach about life as well, despite being written 100 years earlier.

Re:don't read To Kill a Mockingbird! by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:50 · Score: 0

christ! it only takes 20 minutes to read a tiny, simple little book like To Kill a Mockingbird! your attention span must be like that of a Capuchin monkey to be "bored" by it! Typical articles in the New Yorker are 6x as long. you are subliterate and subhuman, though it is a crapulous little book perfect for the tepid cultural indoctrination junior high school is standardized to.
Re:don't read To Kill a Mockingbird! by serviscope_minor · 2014-01-01 21:51 · Score: 1

Try Pride and Prejudice.
A while back three was a thread about Jane Austen. The amonut of bile poured out towards this book here was astonishing, much of it by people who had never read it.

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SJW n. One who posts facts.
Re:don't read To Kill a Mockingbird! by MaskedSlacker · 2014-01-02 01:07 · Score: 1

I've read it. Probably five or six times. It's a brilliantly written, well-paced narrative that so trounced the genre conventions of its day that it invented a genre that still exists.
AND I HATE EVERY SINGLE CHARACTER IN IT.
From page one, I want them all to just die in a fire. Every one of those pathetic, entitled, spoiled snobs is a waste of time and oxygen.
I do have to admit though that I only have this reaction because it is so brilliantly written. It has to be for you to hate the characters like they were real.

Joy of Sex by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:38 · Score: 0

At least you have something to do afterwards.

basic works by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:39 · Score: 0

Gordon W. Allport: The Nature of Prejudice
Richard Dawkins: The Selfish Gene

Must Read Books by Trouvist · 2014-01-01 10:39 · Score: 1

In Order:

Stranger in a Strange Land - Robert A. Heinlein
The Fountainhead - Ayn Rand
Communist Manifesto - Karl Marx
Atlas Shrugged - Ayn Rand
Ender's Game - Orson Scott Card
The Divine Comedy - Dante Alighieri
Brave New World - Aldous Huxley
Mein Kampf - Adolf Hitler
Alas, Babylon - Pat Frank
Godel, Escher, and Bach - Douglas Hofstadter

This should give anyone a good look into the way humanity works, and you can truly look past any libertarian, communist, or religious. Lots of thinking and perspective. I've omitted many others have already suggested.

Re:Must Read Books by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:22 · Score: 0

On the Genealogy of Morals is the one I would recommend. Once you see the division of morality into the two camps, it will forever alter the way you see morals. It also helps explain what many people find confusing about religious morality, especially the different types of Christianity like the gospel of wealth and the persecution complex and why they are necessary evolutions of the message with Christianity in the majority. It also provides a lot of insight into atheistic and modern Islam (the concepts, not the book itself).
One word of warning, when reading his books, find a good translation. Many of them are unnecessarily burdened with proto-nazi language, but translations made later do not have such a burden.
Re:Must Read Books by clarkkent09 · 2014-01-01 11:28 · Score: 1

I wonder how much the order in which you read books makes a difference in your world view. If you read Ayn Rand first, will Communist Manifesto seem completely hateful and ridiculous and vice versa. Maybe an interesting experiment.

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Negative moral value of force outweighs the positive value of good intentions.
Re:Must Read Books by GameboyRMH · 2014-01-01 13:34 · Score: 1

I think that would be true if the reader is unintelligent. Otherwise I think it would just increase the likelihood on the reader giving up on the second book as their persistence to keep reading through stupid drivel wears down.

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"When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
Re:Must Read Books by GameboyRMH · 2014-01-01 13:57 · Score: 1

The only good thing I've heard about Mein Kampf is that the first chapter or two is really interesting, then it turns into a long slog of boring, stupid hatred - that part, it seems nobody disagrees about.
I've also heard that Hitler's writing style is a lot like Ayn Rand's, so brace yourself...

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"When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
Re:Must Read Books by shutdown+-p+now · 2014-01-02 08:13 · Score: 1

Since your list is heavily skewed towards politics, I'd also add The Dispossessed by Le Guin to it. Also, does it really need two books by Rand? One is hard enough to get through, and she was not exactly known for generating new and exciting ideas all the time.

Sci-fi, non-fiction, and a classic by danpbrowning · 2014-01-01 10:39 · Score: 4, Interesting

"The Brothers Karamazov" by Dostoyevsky. Characters and conflict that will really come alive in your mind.

"Foundation" by Asimov. Start of a really good sci-fi series. I read the entire book as if computers were described in the story all along, only to realize after I was done that he wrote the book before computers were even invented. Whoa!

"Israel" by Martin Gilbert. A fact-based history starting in late 19th century using Arabic sources that will make you shudder to realize how many lies are believed about the history of the Arab/Israeli conflict as well as the sheer magnitude of the current level of anti-Israeli propaganda (i.e. "news").

"Band of Brothers" by Stephen Ambrose. A great portrait of American heroes from The Greatest Generation. Better than the TV miniseries.

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Daniel

Re:Sci-fi, non-fiction, and a classic by nickol · 2014-01-02 06:07 · Score: 1

This is interesting. As a native Russian speaker I assure you that "Brothers Karamazov" is incrediby boring and tedious book with unnatural characters. One of the worst books of Dostoyevsky. On the other hand I've read "To kill a mockingbird" in translation and found it interesting. Not in "must read" category, but good enough.
Maybe something is "found in translation".

Lord of the Rings, and even the movie by Gothmolly · 2014-01-01 10:40 · Score: 2, Insightful

"Put aside the Ranger, and become who you were born to be."

"It's like in the great stories, Mr. Frodo. The ones that really mattered. Full of darkness and danger they were. And sometimes you didn't want to know the endâ¦ because how could the end be happy? How could the world go back to the way it was when so much bad had happened? But in the end, it's only a passing thing... this shadow. Even darkness must pass."

"I don't know how to say it, but after last night I feel different. I seem to see ahead, in a kind of way. I know we are going to take a very long road, into darkness; but I know I can't turn back. It isn't right to see Elves now, nor dragons, nor mountains, that I want - I don't rightly know what I want: but I have something to do before the end, and it lies ahead, not in the Shire. I must see it through, sir, if you understand me."

You want your kids to have a positive outlook, be confident in their ability to solve challenges, read them good, hero fiction.

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I want to delete my account but Slashdot doesn't allow it.

Re:Lord of the Rings, and even the movie by Immerman · 2014-01-01 12:07 · Score: 3, Interesting

>You want your kids to have a positive outlook, be confident in their ability to solve challenges, read them good, hero fiction.
I agree, emphaisi on the good. And I think it's worth pointing out something somewhat unusual about The LotR and The Hobbit that make them particularly good- there's absolutely nothing special about the hero. He's just an ordinary guy who rises to the demands of extraordinary circumstances. No super powers, no magical birthright, no (pseudo-) divine messenger. Granted, the ring does bestow a powerful advantage, but one that comes at such a high cost (at least in LotR) that it's rarely invoked.
Superhero stories, from Beowulf to Superman, let children dream of being one of the Chosen Ones empowered to do great things. "Everyman" heroes show kids that you don't necessarily need magic powers or great deeds - sometimes a great hero is simply doing what must be done even though they'd much rather be comfortable at home. You tell me which is more likely to inspire a man do something heroic like betraying his government for the sake of his people.

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--- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
Re:Lord of the Rings, and even the movie by cyberchondriac · 2014-01-02 03:46 · Score: 1

And for once, the hero wasn't an orphan.. not Bilbo, anyway. But Frodo was. Why must heroes nearly always be orphans or adopted or something..?

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Look back up at my post, now look back down, you're on the Internet. Now look back up. I'm a signature.
Re:Lord of the Rings, and even the movie by Immerman · 2014-01-02 05:48 · Score: 1

I suspect it has to do with giving them a "mysterious background", sort of a literary shorthand to say "this person is somehow special". If you look at old European stories, from Norse to Greek and beyond, the common literary methods of the era were being a divine half-breed, being a child of incest, or being the result of a virgin birth. Occasionally they would combine two or more to indicate that someone was *really* special.

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--- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
Re:Lord of the Rings, and even the movie by Matheus · 2014-01-02 10:00 · Score: 1

I agree but a couple asides:
Gandalf = "divine messenger". He is portrayed as the "everyman's" wizzard but his powers and knowledge shouldn't be taken so lightly.
Frodo's other companions also tend to be larger than life and help out in crucial ways.
Also: The ring is what it is but the story is filled with "gifts" that Frodo (or Bilbo for The Hobbit) are bestowed that give them superhero like abilities such as Stinger, the Elven Mail and the Phial for example.
I give more credit to Samwise for being a true everyman.
Re:Lord of the Rings, and even the movie by strikethree · 2014-01-02 18:37 · Score: 1

Don't forget the part about the Scouring of the Shire where Merry and Pippin realized that they had grown up quite a bit and and were able to deal with things that they had previously thought were big, scary, and beyond their reach. Sam and Frodo realized they had matured and become wiser too. A good experience for children to see.

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"Someone needs to talk to the tree of liberty about its ghoulish drinking problem." by ohnocitizen

here are a few by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:41 · Score: 0

Thinking, Fast and Slow
Daniel Kahneman

The Lord of the Rings
J. R. R. Tolkien

The Seven Habits of Highly Effective People
Stephen R. Covey

Love in the Time of Cholera
Gabriel Garcia Marquez

The Call of the Wild
Jack London

Watership Down
Richard Adams

The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy
Douglas Adams

Dune
Frank Herbert

The Stand
Stephen King

A Farewell to Arms
Ernest Hemingway

The Wheel of Time series
Robert Jordan aka James Oliver Rigney, JR

Sula
Toni Morrison

People smart by Maxo-Texas · 2014-01-01 10:41 · Score: 2

http://www.amazon.com/How-Be-People-Smart-Giblin/dp/9380227302

How to be People Smart by Les Giblin.
This book greatly contributed to my retirement at age 51.

The advice on only giving yourself 1 no per 9 yes's will completely change the way you interact with others in a highly positive way.

The rest is equally good. Very basic. Very obvious. But few know or practice anything except knowing the most important word in any language.

Dale Carnegie's book's on dealing with worry are also extremely useful.

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She was like chocolate when she drank... semi-sweet at first and then increasingly bitter.

Re:People smart by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 10:21 · Score: 0

If you don't mind me asking, how old were you when you first read Les' book?
Thanks
Re:People smart by Maxo-Texas · 2014-01-03 21:47 · Score: 1

In my mid 20's the first time. I stumbled across it in a used book store.
I made sure my daughter read it as well. That and Dale Carnegie have really helped her career (as well as her good work ethic, etc.)

--
She was like chocolate when she drank... semi-sweet at first and then increasingly bitter.

None by Kohath · 2014-01-01 10:42 · Score: 3, Interesting

How about if we all read different books? Then we'll have lots of different ideas to discuss. It'll be like we're thinking individually instead of just following along with the group.

Re:None by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:50 · Score: 0

Yes. Nothing so tedious as having people trying to get you to read books that you have no interest in.
Re:None by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 21:02 · Score: 0

Yes, except that, among the millions of books that exist, there are a few that really deserve everyone's attention. And those should be put forward so that noone misses them. Like in music: you don't have to listen to Beethoven, Mozart, Bach, Brahms, Pokofiev or Stravinski all the time, but it's good idea to, at least, try their music at one point in your life.
Re:None by eulernet · 2014-01-01 22:01 · Score: 1

I recommend the following approach:
1) read as much different books as you can, try to find books that you'll enjoy
2) forget everything you read
The second point is to let you understand that books may bring enjoyment and give some individual points of view, but they are just limited points of view.
Re:None by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 22:42 · Score: 0

Exactly.
It's also about taste, not everyone likes the same things, just by reading these comments you'll see just how different those tastes are.
Personally, I only read books in school because I had to for school work. Hated them all, and until I reached 25, I've only read technical manuals willingly. After that I accidentally discovered a book I liked and started reading constantly every since, on average a couple each week (took me a while to reach that number, but you get my point).

A small list by sandbagger · 2014-01-01 10:42 · Score: 1

The Bible - As Canadian Northrop Frye said, this is the basic code for understanding Western Civilization, its laws cultures and ethics.
Shakespeare - Not only are his works very funny, but they're really good stories.
Code of the Woosters - PG Wodehouse at his best
The Joy of Cooking - Get a 1950s version before all of the processed food came in.
The Complete Editions of National Lampoon and Playboy - If you want to understand me.

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---- The above post was generated by the Turing Institute. Maybe.

Re:A small list by GoodNewsJimDotCom · 2014-01-01 10:56 · Score: 1

I second the Bible. Even if you don't want to believe in a God who loves you so much he died for you, it helps you understand those who do. My favorite books other than that are The Hobbit and Lord of the Rings.

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God spoke to me
Re:A small list by funwithBSD · 2014-01-01 11:14 · Score: 1

You don't need to read the whole bible, you really need:
Genesis - Origin story and the 10 Commandments
Psalms - Poetry and thoughts
Matthew - The Beatitudes
John - God as logic, Logos or the Word - The Fusion of Greek Philosophy and Christianity
Romans - Salvation and taking the Word to the World
Revelations: You need to understand where the idea of an Apocalypse comes from

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Never answer an anonymous letter. - Yogi Berra
Re:A small list by GameboyRMH · 2014-01-01 13:44 · Score: 1

Maybe Leviticus to understand where many of the fucked-up ideas in fundamentalist Christianity come from, but that's like telling you to read Atlas Shrugged to understand objectivism...way too much to slog through for what really amounts to just a small number of fucked-up ideas that horrible people love. The excess words don't give them any more depth.

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"When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
Re:A small list by funwithBSD · 2014-01-01 14:06 · Score: 1

Leviticus has the Hebrew law, so I guess they are fucked up too? Such intolerance.
To my knowledge, no christian sect follows the Hebrew laws, although a few like Seventh Day Adventists try.
Mostly Evangelical Christians look to the Pauline (who was a converted Jew, not the Apostle) letters, the most significant of which I listed.

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Never answer an anonymous letter. - Yogi Berra

An incomplete list from my shelf by Cronopios · 2014-01-01 10:43 · Score: 4, Informative

A Confederacy of Dunces
Catch-22
Dharma Bums
Lord of the Flies
Momo
On the Road
Siddharta
The Golden Notebook
The Grapes of Wrath
The Razor's Edge
A Clockwork Orange
Brave New World
Player Piano
Slaughterhouse Five
Snowcrash
The Diamond Age
The Dispossessed
The Island
The Stand ...

--
Windows users:
Internet Explorer is obsolete. Please upgrade to Google Chrome or Mozilla Firefox.

Re:An incomplete list from my shelf by 605dave · 2014-01-01 12:15 · Score: 3, Insightful

I rarely see Player Piano mentioned, but I think it is as prescient as 1984 or Brave New World.

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Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a difficult battle. - Plato
Re:An incomplete list from my shelf by melikamp · 2014-01-01 13:16 · Score: 1

For me personally, A Confederacy of Dunces is easily worth the rest of the list. READ IT!
Re:An incomplete list from my shelf by bob_super · 2014-01-01 21:35 · Score: 1

Nation, by Terry Pratchett, because it's supposedly young adult, but it touches a lot of very crucial topics.
And of course, the whole Discworld series, because it's satire on a massive scale.
Also, Cyrano de Bergerac, just because.
Re:An incomplete list from my shelf by FudRucker · 2014-01-02 00:49 · Score: 1

I just finished "The Grapes of Wrath" a few days ago, I seen the movie several times and loved it and the book is even better, what a classic!!!

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Politics is Treachery, Religion is Brainwashing
Re:An incomplete list from my shelf by jimharris · 2014-01-02 04:37 · Score: 1

No offense, but this list seems like one an old hippie would make up. I guess the counter culture lives on in young people. This list begs for some depth and diversity even though I like the books on it. How about Pride and Prejudice, Anna Karenina, Lady Chatterley's Lover, The Sun Also Rises, Sister Carrie, Homer, Shakespeare, Chaucer, Milton, etc.
Re:An incomplete list from my shelf by Cronopios · 2014-01-02 06:00 · Score: 1

As the subject of the post said, the list is incomplete, so it obviously lacks diversity.
I could go on with non-English literature, such as
Aleph
Blindness
Cronopios and Famas
Fictions
One Hundred Years of Solitude
The Book of Disquiet
The Idiot
The Sound of the Mountain
The Tale of Genji
The Tin Drum
The Trial
War with the Newts ...
but you don't want me to list my whole collection. Hopefully those are enough to add some depth to the previous list, even though I didn't include any non-fiction.

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Re:An incomplete list from my shelf by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 13:44 · Score: 0

Yay for Confederacy of Dunces. I have to revisit that book every year or two.

Goodreads by morcego · 2014-01-01 10:43 · Score: 2

Goodreads.com will provide you with several recommendation reads, as well as several book clubs.

As for book clubs, if you are into SF/F, you might want to check Sword and Laser (www.swordandlaser.com), which is both a book club and a podcast.

As far as book lists, check this one:

https://www.goodreads.com/list/show/12864.Novels_mentioned_in_Among_Others_by_Jo_Walton

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morcego

good lists by kqc7011 · 2014-01-01 10:44 · Score: 2

Each branch of the military has a reading list that is very good. Usually they are put out by the members of the Joint Chiefs of Staff. For those of you that get your military knowledge from television, reading some of the books on these lists will help you gain a understanding of how the military works and lives.

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Passionately Indifferent

Fantasy suggestions by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:45 · Score: 0

If you are into fantasy then I would read everything by Brandon Sanderson. Start with the Mistborn Trilogy and then get hooked on the Stormlight Archives.

The Loeb Classical Library by Any+Web+Loco · 2014-01-01 10:45 · Score: 1

Just kidding. That said, it's definitely worth reading "A Loeb Classical Library Reader" - it's a subset of the Library and gives a great introduction to Classical Greek & Roman thought.

Naturom Demonto by kaoshin · 2014-01-01 10:46 · Score: 1

When thou retrievest the book from its cradle, you must recite the words, 'Klaatu Barada Nikto'.

The Big Read by E.R. · 2014-01-01 10:47 · Score: 2

A decade isn't very long in book years, so I'd recommend browsing through the top list from BBC's 2003 survey The Big Read.

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E.R.

goodreads by bhlowe · 2014-01-01 10:47 · Score: 1

I've been using the web site and iPhone app goodreads https://www.goodreads.com/. While not perfect, it is a nice way to keep track of what you've read, want to read, and see what others are reading. Better integration with Audible would be nice.

House of Stairs by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:47 · Score: 0

House of stairs

"Systems of Survival" by Jane Jacobs by pacanniff · 2014-01-01 10:47 · Score: 1

Subtitled "A Dialogue on the Moral Foundations of Commerce and Politics", this work is a compact yet penetrating examination of what distinguishes the means and ends of government and business.

For Americans: James Baldwin-- any nonfiction by twistedcubic · 2014-01-01 10:48 · Score: 1

His statements about race relations sound fresher than anything you will ever hear today. If listening to discussions about race tends to give you a headache, try to read as much (non-fiction) James Baldwin as you can. You may still get a headache, but at least you finally get to hear it straight. And it may lead you to reading his (and others) important fiction books.

Flatland: A Romance of Many Dimensions - Abbot by stox · 2014-01-01 10:48 · Score: 2

The Dialogue Concerning the Two Chief World Systems - Galileo
1984 - Orwell
Gödel, Escher, Bach: An Eternal Golden Braid - Hofstadter
The Foundation Trilogy - Asimov
Frankenstein; or, The Modern Prometheus - Shelly

--
"To those who are overly cautious, everything is impossible. "

Extraordinary Popular Delusions by umdesch4 · 2014-01-01 10:48 · Score: 1

Extraordinary Popular Delusions & the Madness of Crowds, written in 1841 by Charles Mackay. ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extraordinary_Popular_Delusions_and_the_Madness_of_Crowds ) Classify this one under "Those Who Fail to Learn from History Are Doomed to Repeat It".

Re:Extraordinary Popular Delusions by Two99Point80 · 2014-01-01 11:23 · Score: 1

Absolutely. The parallels to more-recent events are striking/depressing...

non-fiction by davebarnes · 2014-01-01 10:49 · Score: 1

http://www.amazon.com/Handbook-Chemistry-Physics-94th-Edition/dp/1466571144

--
Dave Barnes 9 breweries within walking distance of my house

Re:non-fiction by hubie · 2014-01-01 11:16 · Score: 1

The 66th edition is WAY better.
Re:non-fiction by TheloniousToady · 2014-01-01 11:36 · Score: 1

Although the CRC book is renowned partly for its math tables, I'm a great fan of the very inexpensive and useful Schaum's Outline of Mathematical Handbook of Formulas and Tables for those. Even though you can find that same information online now, having it on paper can still be very handy.
Re:non-fiction by rcjhawk · 2014-01-01 12:47 · Score: 1

Formulas? You want Formulas?
http://people.math.sfu.ca/~cbm/aands/toc.htm

This version has the naughty bits:
http://apps.nrbook.com/abramowitz_and_stegun/index.html

And here's the Revised Standard Version:
http://dlmf.nist.gov/

I second (or 3rd by this time) by koan · 2014-01-01 10:51 · Score: 1

Iain M Banks Culture series, some of the best SciFi I have ever read, I still chuckle every time I think of the drone bringing the body-less human head (still alive) the gift of a hat.

I had the pleasure to find this, it is (they are) a BRUTAL read, but it was worth it.
http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/author/473

--
"If any question why we died, Tell them because our fathers lied."

Bill Bryson, Short History of Nearly Everything by retroworks · 2014-01-01 10:51 · Score: 2

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Short_History_of_Nearly_Everything = Best Science book I've ever read, very approachably written and very funny.

There are other important ones mentioned here already, I'd add Crime and Punishment, Walt Kelly's Pogo comics, Larsen's Far Side comics, Hesse's Siddhartha, and Huckleberry Finn.

--
Gently reply

Re:Bill Bryson, Short History of Nearly Everything by hubie · 2014-01-01 11:19 · Score: 1

Surely You're Joking, Mr. Feynman!
Any of the works of Stephen J Gould and Steven Hawking written for the general population.

Heinlein by Lawrence_Bird · 2014-01-01 10:54 · Score: 1

without doubt: The Moon is a Harsh Mistress

Re:Heinlein by brausch · 2014-01-01 11:19 · Score: 1

This would be on my short list as well.
Also add "I, 2, 3, Infinity" by George Gamow

--
"Almost every wise saying has an opposite one, no less wise, to balance it." - George Santayana
Re:Heinlein by Jay+Maynard · 2014-01-01 13:43 · Score: 1

This would be at the top of any list I'd compile.

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Disinfect the GNU General Public Virus!
Re:Heinlein by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 13:48 · Score: 0

"1, 2, 3, Infinity" is horribly dated.
Re:Heinlein by Warma · 2014-01-01 23:57 · Score: 1

I have to agree to this, but on the same breath, I kind of dislike Heinlein on the whole. He has written things like The Cat Who Walks Through Walls and Sixth Column, which are absolute garbage.
In this light, it's difficult for me to decide what to think about the author. Is The Moon is a Harsh Mistress just an accident, like Ender seemed to be for Orson Scott Card, or have I read too little of him and stumbled on the bad ones?
Re:Heinlein by Lawrence_Bird · 2014-01-02 04:49 · Score: 1

Anyone who writes over 30 books and 60 shorts is bound to have a few duds.
Re:Heinlein by shutdown+-p+now · 2014-01-02 08:19 · Score: 1

If you read that, then the next book you should read is The Dispossessed. Those stand side by side as two masterpieces of political sci-fi, coming from almost diametrically opposing political viewpoints (though both describe anarchist societies, thise are different in practically every other fundamental thing). Each one is thought-provoking on its own, but it's most interesting to compare and contrast the ideas therein.
OTOH, don't bother with Rand. The literary value of her books is nil, and the political philosophy is presented in a very dull and unrealistic way. There's nothing useful to take away from them that isn't in TMIAHM.
Re:Heinlein by Warma · 2014-01-02 20:06 · Score: 1

Indeed, but my dud:good ratio for Heinlein is more than 2:1, which is why I brought this up.
Re:Heinlein by Lawrence_Bird · 2014-01-03 04:39 · Score: 1

Everyone should read Atlas Shrugged. Yes, it is long and probably could have done with better editing. But many people will see great insights/parallels between the story and events of the past few years. Unless, of course, if you are a progressive Dem. In that case, skip.
Re:Heinlein by shutdown+-p+now · 2014-01-03 05:25 · Score: 1

That's funny. You basically just confirmed what I always believed to the book - that it's the most blatant example of preaching to the choir that I've ever seen. Basically, those who already have beliefs in agreement with Rand will just keep nodding throughout the book (if they can get through the writing). And those who disagree will just shrug and call it the juvenile heroic fantasy with completely skewed morals. So what is the point, then?

"The Way of All Flesh," by Samuel Butler by dpbsmith · 2014-01-01 10:56 · Score: 2

This book is more irreverent and more subversive than Mark Twain. And it is very funny and an entertaining read. It's especially good if you happen to be feeling annoyed at your parents.

He said: "Oh, don't talk about rewards. Look at Milton, who only got â5 for 'Paradise Lost.'
"And a great deal too much," I rejoined promptly. "I would have given him twice as much myself not to have written it at all."

Surely nature might find some less irritating way of carrying on business if she would give her mind to it. Why should the generations overlap one another at all? Why cannot we be buried as eggs in neat little cells with ten or twenty thousand pounds each wrapped round us in Bank of England notes, and wake up, as the sphex wasp does, to find that its papa and mamma have not only left ample provision at its elbow, but have been eaten by sparrows some weeks before it began to live consciously on its own account?

All animals, except man, know that the principal business of life is to enjoy it- and they do enjoy it as much as man and other circumstances will allow. He has spent his life best who has enjoyed it most; God will take care that we do not enjoy it any more than is good for us.

Never learn anything until you find you have been made uncomfortable for a good long while by not knowing it; when you find that you have occasion for this or that knowledge, or foresee that you will have occasion for it shortly, the sooner you learn it the better, but till then spend your time in growing bone and muscle; these will be much more useful to you than Latin and Greek, nor will you ever be able to make them if you do not do so now, whereas Latin and Greek can be acquired at any time by those who want them.

Nothing is well done nor worth doing unless, take it all round, it has come pretty easily.

Tennyson has said that more things are wrought by prayer than this world dreams of, but he has wisely refrained from saying whether they are good things or bad things. It might perhaps be as well if the world were to dream of, or even become wide awake to, some of the things that are being wrought by prayer.

And, best of all:

[Mendelssohn] wrote "I then went to the Tribune [a room in the Uffizi Gallery in Florence]. This room is so delightfully small you can traverse it in fifteen paces, yet it contains a world of art. I again sought out my favourite arm chair which stands under the statue of the 'Slave whetting his knife' (L'Arrotino), and taking possession of it I enjoyed myself for a couple of hours..." I wonder how many chalks Mendelssohn gave himself for having sat two hours on that chair. I wonder how often he looked at his watch to see if his two hours were up. I wonder how often he told himself that he was quite as big a gun, if the truth were known, as any of the men whose works he saw before him, how often he wondered whether any of the visitors were recognizing him and admiring him for sitting such a long time in the same chair, and how often he was vexed at seeing them pass him by and take no notice of him. But perhaps if the truth were known his two hours was not quite two hours.

--

"How to Do Nothing," kids activities, back in print!

My Recommendations: by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:56 · Score: 0

For the shorter readers (And the taller ones if they haven't read them yet)
1. Have Space Suit, Will Travel -R.A. Heinlein
2. Rocket ship Galileo - R.A. Heinlein
3. The Moon is a Harsh Mistress - R.A. Heinlein
4. Pokadyne of Mars - R.A. Heinlein
5. Dragonsong - Anne Mcaffery
6. Dragonsinger - Anne Mcaffery
7. The White Dragon - Anne Mcaffery
8. Huckleberry Finn - M. Twain
9. At least two translations of the bible (To point out that while it is claimed to be the word of god, it's translated by humans and should be treated accordingly. Also it contributes a lot to western 'Culture' and bias)
10. At least two translations of the Koran (Same reasoning as number 9)

For the Taller Readers:
1. Job, a Comedy of Justice - R.A. Heinlein
2. Stranger in a Strange Land - R.A. Heinlein
3. At least two translations of the bible (To point out that while it is claimed to be the word of god, it's translated by humans and should be treated accordingly. Also it contributes a lot to western 'Culture' and bias)
4. At least two translations of the Koran (Same reasoning as number 3)

Robert H.

Re:My Recommendations: by egcagrac0 · 2014-01-01 11:51 · Score: 1

9. At least two translations of the bible (To point out that while it is claimed to be the word of god, it's translated by humans and should be treated accordingly. Also it contributes a lot to western 'Culture' and bias)
10. At least two translations of the Koran (Same reasoning as number 9)
My understanding from Muslim acquaintances is that they learned Arabic so they can avoid the inevitable errors in translation.
My understanding from many Christian ministers is that they've studied classical Greek and Hebrew, again, to avoid similar errors in translation.
I agree with reading the several translations if you want to find out why not to implicitly trust a translation of a religious text.
Re:My Recommendations: by euroq · 2014-01-01 14:53 · Score: 1

Yes, the Koran is the exact word of God and there are no translation errors.
However, people still say that the Bible is the word of God regardless of translations.
And interesting note, there's even a "conservative bible": http://conservapedia.com/Conservative_Bible_Project Some of the highlights are "Express Free Market Parables" and "Utilize Terms which better capture original intent: using powerful new conservative terms to capture better the original intent;[9] Defective translations use the word "comrade" three times as often as "volunteer""

--
Just because the U.S. is a republic does not mean it is not a democracy. Democracy/republic are not mutually exclusive.

Infinite Jest by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 10:58 · Score: 0

by David Foster Wallace. Long and sometimes a bit of a slog, but worth reading and rereading.

Some Useful Non-Literature Books by SlashdotOgre · 2014-01-01 11:00 · Score: 1

Here's a few generally pratical books that I genuinely believe anyone can find some value in:
Boy Scout Handbook -- Great source of info for anything outdoors related including basic first aid, how to tie knots, survial skills, etc.
How to Win Friends & Influence People by Dale Carnegie -- A series of insights on how to effectively deal with people.
The Way to Cook by Julia Child -- Julia considered this book her magnum opus; it teaches you how to cook almost anything you can imagine.

--
Sadly, PS/2 was yet another victim of USB, which doesn't care what you plug into it, the electrical slut.

Science Fiction by Earthquake+Retrofit · 2014-01-01 11:01 · Score: 1

I would add:
The Moon is a Harsh Mistress and Time Enough For Love by Heinlein, Neuromancer trilogy by Gibson, Snow Crash by Stephenson and anything by Asimov, Benford and Clarke.

--
Fifty years of Yippie! 1968-2018

Mostly harmless by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:02 · Score: 0

Hitch hikers guide to the galaxy

Book recommendation by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:03 · Score: 0

Advice to Clever Children, Celia Green

If you're from Earth by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:05 · Score: 0

Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy

"Don't Panic" one of the most profound lessons to learn.

Not easy to answer by mrbester · 2014-01-01 11:09 · Score: 1

Looking through the posts the general consensus is SF with the Bible thrown in as a token gesture "just because" and the usual dystopian suspects of nineteen eighty four / Brave New World. Some have tried with Kerouac / Hemingway. IMO you lot should read more and not just the stuff that gets made into movies (or you'd *like* to be).

The problem is the age range. It's too broad to ask this question and get decent answers. It needs breaking down into different age groups (there's nothing wrong with Beatrix Potter for the 2yo for instance)

--
"Wait. Something's happening. It's opening up! My God, it's full of apricots!"

The Prince by Nicolo Machiavelli by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:10 · Score: 0

http://www.gutenberg.org/files/1232/1232-h/1232-h.htm

A manual for 'how to rule' written at a time when it was somewhat 'cool to be stupid' and thus very accessible & easy to read.

Throughout my education the only thing I had ever heard about Machiavelli was that 'we all know the ends do NOT justify the means.' As if that was his only point & there was no reason to pursue the matter any further.

Turns out he said a bit more than that. And whether you agree or disagree isn't as important as being able to recognize the strategies involved. Not everyone on the planet seems to have received the memo on the ends not justifying the means...

Re:The Prince by Nicolo Machiavelli by TheloniousToady · 2014-01-01 11:42 · Score: 1

Agreed. The book has a bad rap for its "Machiavellian" ideas, but in reality, it's a brief, well written, and very interesting set of lessons in practical politics. I've read it several times over the years and undoubtedly will read it again one day.

My recommendations by Kevin108 · 2014-01-01 11:11 · Score: 1

Ayn Rand - Atlas Shrugged

Michael Crichton - State of Fear

Cody Lundin - 98.6 Degrees The Art of Keeping Your Ass Alive

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It's a perfect time for being wasted.
A perfect time to watch the stars.
- Burden Brothers, "Beautiful Night"

Re:My recommendations by euroq · 2014-01-01 14:56 · Score: 1

Atlas Shrugged is not a very good book. It's got unbelievable heros, horribly predictable drama, and redefines the meaning of the term "long winded". You may like its message, but it doesn't belong on a list of books that everyone should read.

--
Just because the U.S. is a republic does not mean it is not a democracy. Democracy/republic are not mutually exclusive.
Re:My recommendations by hubie · 2014-01-01 17:13 · Score: 1

The 88 page John Galt monologue almost did me in, but I was that far into the book that I decided it was going to be a battle of wills and I was going to put my head down and finish it no matter how laborious it became. My Dad said the same thing about working his way through War and Peace.

Replay by unne · 2014-01-01 11:11 · Score: 2

By Ken Grimwood

--
Unne Liljeblad, Mix Engineer

Stuff to read and skip by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:11 · Score: 0

I just read 451 and believe me you can skip it. You can skip Salinger as well and skip On The Road too.

But definitely read Orwell, Animal Farm and 1984. Twain is great. Jane Austen is great.

God is not great but Christopher Hitchens sure as hell is. But he was hella wrong about Iraq.

The Prince is sooo much fun.

Constitution by ShanghaiBill · 2014-01-01 11:12 · Score: 1

If you are an American (or even if you are not) I recommend reading this: The Constitution of the United States of America.

Re:Constitution by rossdee · 2014-01-01 15:50 · Score: 1

If you are not an american, you should read the constitution of the country that you are from.
Re:Constitution by unitron · 2014-01-02 16:58 · Score: 1

If you are an American (or even if you are not) I recommend reading this: The Constitution of the United States of America.
Too bad they keep trying to shelve it in the Fiction section these days.

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I see even classic Slashdot is now pretty much unusable on dial up anymore.

Sun Tzu by ja · 2014-01-01 11:13 · Score: 1

The Art of War

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send + more == money? ...

Canterbury Tales by Em+Adespoton · 2014-01-01 11:14 · Score: 2

Under the Illuminated by Monks category: read the Riverside edition of Canterbury Tales -- it'll provide a lot of the back story and "assumed" knowledge. It definitely provides a different perspective on that era, as well as being entertaining. Plus, you'll get all the Chaucer references when people make them :)

Reading List by jd · 2014-01-01 11:14 · Score: 1

Weirdstone of Brisingamon//Moon of Gomrath
Neuromancer
The Sleeper Awakes
Darkness is Rising
Monkey (the abbreviated Journey to the West)
The Black Cloud
A For Andromeda
The Molecule Men
Eight Keys to Eden
Dusty Death
Spy who Came In from the Cold
633 Squadron

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It's a small world and it smells funny; I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money; Take back what I paid (SoM)

Re:Reading List by approachingZero+ · 2014-01-01 14:10 · Score: 0

The Spy who came in from the Cold, damn good book. You have some great ones in your list.

--
'I don't know what it's called. I just know the sound it makes, when it takes a man's life.' ~ Four Leaf Tayback
Re:Reading List by jd · 2014-01-01 14:38 · Score: 1

Thanks. I tried to pick a range of genres and then specific books within them that challenged the reader in one way or another. It's tough.

--
It's a small world and it smells funny; I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money; Take back what I paid (SoM)

Bill Bryson A Short History of Nearly Everything by joeldick · 2014-01-01 11:15 · Score: 1

Should be mandatory for anyone who wants to be a citizen of Earth.

Summa Technologiae by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:15 · Score: 0

or anything else by Stanislaw Lem.

Zen by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:16 · Score: 2, Interesting

Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance.

M7 Ilst by TitusGroan8856 · 2014-01-01 11:17 · Score: 1

1) Catch 22 2) LOTR trilogy 3) Stranger In a Strange Land 4) Everything by Ray Bradbury 5) The entire Discworld Series 6) The Gormenghast series. 7) Of Mice and Men 8) Also sprach Zarathustra: Ein Buch fÃ¼r Alle und Keinen 9) PhilosophiÃ¦ Naturalis Principia Mathematica 10) God Is Not Great

Re:goodbye slashdot by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:18 · Score: 0

I second the motion!

It's a difficult question by kruach+aum · 2014-01-01 11:19 · Score: 5, Insightful

As I read a lot of books, I've heard this question asked a couple of times before, so I've thought about it for a while and come to the conclusion that there's not really one book everyone should read. People are different, and they take different things from what they read. There are few books I've enjoyed as much as The Name of the Rose, but I also understand that that's because I love both Sherlock Holmes and the debate over realism/nominalism concerning universals in the middle ages -- I wouldn't recommend it to anyone in my immediate family, because I know they would probably die of boredom before even finishing the introduction. They wouldn't get why the revelation at the end is so great, any of the philosophy, or even the Burgos-Borges link. The Name of the Rose's embeddedness in several different contexts contribute hugely to why I think it's such a good book, but if you lack those contexts it's really nothing more than an entropically extravagant piece of firewood. So perhaps "books I enjoyed" is not the right interpretation of "books everyone should read".

So perhaps non-fiction then. I'd love it if more people looked at the world scientifically, and there are definitely books that can teach you to do that. However, you can't teach someone who doesn't want to learn. You can make The Demon-Haunted World required reading, but you can't make someone actually think about what it says. Thinking is something you have to do by yourself, and if you don't want to think about something being forced to read a book isn't going to make you. So perhaps "books I think people should think like, or at least about" is not a proper interpretation of "books everyone should read" either.

What book someone should read depends on what they're interested in, what they already know, and what they've already read. If they like sci-fi they should read The Cyberiad, Neuromancer, Ted Chiang's short stories. If they like fantasy and have already read LotR, they should read Bridge of Birds and Perdido Street Station, to see what else can be done in that genre. If they like horror they should read Poe and Lovecraft. If they like thinking just because they should read Borges.

For every reader there's a book that they should read, but there's no book that everyone should read.

Re:It's a difficult question by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 12:32 · Score: 0

I agree -- no one list for everyone.
The premise of "The Great Books" is that there is a Great Conversation, and certain books will get you into the room, but what you do next depends on your interests. I agree with the conversation premise but not the specific list. "The Greak Books" is a good start from a humanist perspective, but it ignores large chunks of human experience.
With that in mind, I'm making an annotated blbliography based loosely on "If civilization collapses, and you have to rebuild from scratch, what do you need to know?" I've put that on the web as:
http://www.seanet.com/~hgg9140/
You will notice I largely skip literature per se. It isn't that I don't value world literature/theater/art. It is rather that I want to understand how to do it, so that if it were all lost we could restart -- starting with stories and chants around the campfire.
Re:It's a difficult question by mendax · 2014-01-01 12:39 · Score: 1

Name of the Rose is a "must read" for any thoughtful, intelligent person. Even though it takes place in 1327, the issues the novel discusses are eminently relevant to today; indeed, to any period of time, past, present, or future. Religious freedom, censorship and banned books, the love of knowledge and scholarship, controversy over fundamentalist religious dogmas and doctrines, the danger of a theocracy, and the roles love should play in a person's life are all issues that are discussed in this wildly entertaining mystery.
It's one of those books that ought to be read again and again over a person's life like one's favorite Dickens novel(s) or Tolstoy's War and Peace, books that are so densely packed with delicious and minute detail that a subsequent read will turn up new discoveries to titillate the intellect. Great literature is that which is worthy of being read throughout a person's lifetime, and Name of the Rose fits that mold brilliantly.

--
It's really quite a simple choice: Life, Death, or Los Angeles.
Re:It's a difficult question by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 21:15 · Score: 0

Actually, I think it's a bit like food. If you don't try eating things that you don't like, you'll end up only eating french fries, pasta and steak. Sometimes, it needs effort to create a taste, but, eventually, it pays. That's exactly why schools have compulsary reads. To make sure every children has, at least, tryed to read something else than comic books. I remember when I was a 12 and they made me read Camus, Sartre, Hugo or Maupassant and I didn't like it (it lacked super-heroes, orcs and trolls). Then, almost twenty years later, I found great joy in re-reading those classics, and am now ready to understand them and love them. Like broccoli or cabbage.

Biology and physics by olau · 2014-01-01 11:20 · Score: 1

What level are we talking about? If you really want to learn about the world, the world of fiction is not enough IMHO.

My sister graduated with a Master's in biology a decade ago, and I've recently started borrowing some of her books. They assume a basic understanding of chemistry, but otherwise target high-school student knowledge so aren't too hard to get into. Really recommended. For instance, you could pick up a college-level general introduction book on zoology or animal physiology and learn more about the world around you and your own body than you'd learn in a lifetime.

That, and a book about physics, but I actually think those are bit harder for the uninitiated because they tend to spend a lot of time on the math, which is fine if you're into it (like me) or actually need to figure out something in practice, but probably boring if you're just after the knowledge.

I remain sceptical of the idea of classics when it comes to fiction. You need to figure out what kind of stuff you like and go from there.

PS: now you mention communist book-burning - if you're up for an ideological challenge, I would suggest you try getting your hands on a short intro book on the economic ideas of Marx (basically a take on an analysis of the capitalistic system). I found that pretty interesting, because, well, that's the way our societies still work (the framing is of course a little dated).

That and his ideas on historical materialism - in the words of Wikipedia: "It is a theory of socioeconomic development according to which changes in material conditions (technology and productive capacity) are the primary influence on how society and the economy are organised."

This is opposed to most of the history I was taught in primary school which focused on individuals to a large degree - king B took power from king A and then did X. When he died, king C did Y. When you think about it, that level of focus is just absurd. Societies are shaped by the masses. E.g. the primary driver behind the French revolution wasn't intellectual ideas - people were hungry and the system collapsed.

Re:Biology and physics by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 19:00 · Score: 0

Societies are shaped by the masses.
True, but I don't think we should discount how individuals in the right (or wrong) place at the right time can severely shape the course of a nation or even the world. France would be quite different without Napoleon, Modern history would be different without Hitler. etc. Heck on an obscure note, Korea's entire writing system wouldn't exist without one king... Though to prove your point as well, it probably wouldn't gotten wide spread use without the Japanese occupation creating a strong desire for national identity.
Re:Biology and physics by bzipitidoo · 2014-01-01 20:18 · Score: 1

I agree with your comments about the mainstream treatment of history. Too much focus on insignificant political figures. As an example, consider some of the leaders of the Western Roman Empire during its collapse. It might seem that the insane acts of the leaders were the reason the collapse happened, stuff like Emperor Valentinian III personally murdering his best general out of fear of usurpation, and himself falling from power soon afterwards to the very usurping manipulators who stoked his fears, but there's a lot of other stuff going on. The Roman political system was a shambles and could not handle emperors who were just sane enough to cling to power, but not sane enough to run a nation. Lead poisoning likely played a role in the otherwise incomprehensibly crazy acts of many of the leaders. They didn't just use lead in the pipes of the aqueducts and linings of pots, the upper classes sprinkled lead salts in their wine to sweeten it! So even if the political system could act swiftly to replace a deranged leader, it would not have helped much because the population all the leaders came from suffered the same problem. The US has had a number of bad leaders, but so far has had the good fortune of not having to deal with a truly lunatic leader, the sort of person who might in a bout of suicidal depression order the launching of the nukes. Let us hope the checks we have on the President make that impossible. And that we are being careful enough of the dangers of the raft of novel chemicals we have discovered and employed in recent times. Another policy that undermined the empire was the love of walls, and the whole idea of shutting out the rest of the world. They had to engage the barbarians, and while they did sometimes, the Romans preferred to dismiss them as savages and wall them away. Today, some political elements in the US swoon over the idea of building a great wall along the Mexican border. Starting around the year 250, the long term weather took a turn for the worse, becoming less steady and hurting their agricultural production. Today, we are faced with Climate Change.
Try some Jared Diamond, especially Guns, Germs, and Steel, for a broader perspective.

--
Intellectual Property is a monopolistic, selfish, and defective concept. It is "tyranny over the mind of man"

VNs by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:22 · Score: 0

Best author of all time, hands down. Reading her books is like watching a movie.

So the very best books are like movies? Why not just watch movies then?

If we are going to have a ranking of types of media, I'd put comics way up there. The flexibility of non real time pacing you get in books, as well as the option to choose between imagery and text to use each where it is best. Personally, I see even more flexibility from the visual novel format, which can leverage sound, animation, text and imagery selectively where desired, even optionally interactivity: its just so much more choice for the author (Which of course still has to choose some trade-off between quality and effort, but more options is better). Books, movies and comics are all just subsets of what you can get with a visual novel. There are opensource visual novel tools available, and its perfectly possibly to deploy cross platform, or multi-platform (html5 can do it).

I'm a bit surprised I haven't seen more content presented in the visual novel medium. It seems mainly used for Japanese dating sims. I've seen a few webcomics embracing some of the features, but I'd expect more widespread use of the approach by now. At least you can preorder Steins;Gate, and the megatokyo VN is in the works but I really haven't seen much else of interest (ok, katawa-shoujo was nice (and free), but I mean other genera mostly). Anyone got any other recommendations?

Re:VNs by msobkow · 2014-01-01 12:01 · Score: 1

No, it's that her prose paints such a vivid visual it's like watching movies. A good book is way better than a movie, because a book has the time to explore the details instead of being cut to fit a two hour window. :)

--
I do not fail; I succeed at finding out what does not work.

one of many by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:23 · Score: 0

"nonviolent communication" by Marshall Rosenberg. explains in laymans terms how to effectively communicate with others, and reduce conflict. it works, its easy to apply, and it changes your life. and it DOESNT make you rich.

A tiny but delightful book by Henry Van Dyke ... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:24 · Score: 0

The Story Of The Other Wise Man.

Lots by dwywit · 2014-01-01 11:25 · Score: 1

Just read lots and lots - but here's a few I like:

Known Space series by Larry Niven.
Anything by Anthony Burgess - e.g. A Clockwork Orange, A Dead Man in Deptford, Any Old Iron
The Prince - Macchiavelli
Canterbury Tales
Beowulf
Le Morte D'Artur, any of the Arthurian Romances
Peanuts collections
Calvin & Hobbes collections

--
They sentenced me to twenty years of boredom

http://goo.gl/SdXDto by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:25 · Score: 0

There is my list of books for 2013.

The Tao of Pooh by Two99Point80 · 2014-01-01 11:26 · Score: 1

Benjamin Hoff. Cause for optimism, unlike his later "The Te of Piglet".

Read Darwin. by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:26 · Score: 0

On the origin of species. At least the first quarter of it or so.

The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy & a few m by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:27 · Score: 0

1984, as mentioned by several others is a definite must-read. And re-read.

But I'ld also throw in some JRR Tolkien, and a Sherlock Holmes story as well as anything not too heavy by Stephen King.

The perfect book for nerds by TheloniousToady · 2014-01-01 11:27 · Score: 2, Insightful

Here's one that may not exactly be literature but certainly is a classic: "How to Win Friends and Influence People" by Dale Carnegie. Among secular books, this is one that can truly change your life. You can read the free condensed version if you must, but instead, I recommend you skip that and get the actual book, which is available at your local public library. Read it, understand it, live it.

Basically, social skills are essential to success in nearly any sphere of life, and if you're truly a nerd, you may be lacking in that department. Even if you do have some basic social skills, the book will help you improve them and, most importantly, will help you really understand where you've been going wrong. Winning friends and influencing people isn't all that complicated, but it may not be obvious to nerds like you and me.

For example, one simple prescription from the book that most folks could benefit from is, "Become genuinely interested in other people." What's so mysterious about that? But how many of us know someone who wants you to be interested in them, but doesn't show any interest in you? (I seem to be surrounded by them.) With that little bit of wisdom, though, you can either become more likeable to people by showing an interest in them, or you can understand why you don't much like someone who's self-absorbed - if you don't already.

Re:The perfect book for nerds by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 14:53 · Score: 0

... "How to Win Friends and Influence People" by Dale Carnegie. Among secular books, this is one that can truly change your life.
Basically, social skills are essential to success in nearly any sphere of life, and if you're truly a nerd, you may be lacking in that department. Even if you do have some basic social skills, the book will help you improve them and, most importantly, will help you really understand where you've been going wrong. Winning friends and influencing people isn't all that complicated, but it may not be obvious to nerds like you and me.
This assumes that someone like me *wants* to learn how to win friends and influence people. I don't. I don't want to change my life. I don't want to be "successful". People that aren't true nerds oftentimes don't understand this. We... don't... care... And we are happy that way.
Re:The perfect book for nerds by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 18:21 · Score: 1

How to Win Friends and Influence People
It's hard to convince me to read a book when the very title offends my ethical sensibilities. First, it implies that friends are something to be "won" like trinkets at a carnival. The title immediately objectifies living beings with souls. Perhaps that's an error, but then it goes on to suggest that we should "influence" these beings much as we would influence the outcome of our programs by careful design.
My prejudice was confirmed when it was explained to me in a corporate setting that all the employees in an office were going to be sent to Dale Carnegie training. The objective? To turn them all into better leaders. See the problem there? What the fuck is wrong with being a good follower? I got better advice from listening to my father who was in the Navy. You have to be a good follower to be a good leader.
Sorry, I pretty much have to shove that kind of thing into the same category as any other for-profit seminar. It's almost all bunk that will, at best, simply rob you of money and time. At worst, it'll turn you into a douche and perhaps even disrupt the entire culture of your workplace.
Yes. A lot of nerds need better "people skills", and *some* of what you'd learn from DC is valid. It's the motivation that's sketchy. We should learn to take an interest in people because they're interesting and/or because that's the moral position. Your lack of interest in a particular person might be because you lack empathy... but the person might also really be a bore. There's no simple answer to that question. Maybe a genuine bore can be corrected; but since you're a nerd taking remedial people skills classes that's probably not something you should try.
Anyway, sorry. I can't recommend that particular approach...
Re:The perfect book for nerds by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-13 09:42 · Score: 0

Yeah, I read it. And everything in it is true. But I just don't much like people. On the other hand, it's a very good manual for sociopaths, as it gives very explicit instructions on how to appear as though you are interested in others.

Broaden your horizons (even more)! by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:30 · Score: 0

While I appreciate that some (most?) people reading this don't read any language other than english – I would like to point out that there are books written in languages other than english/greek/latin. My native language is a small one compared to english and I wouldn't really recommend any literature written in it. However – even in my language there are a multitude of translations of works from all over the world – I can only imagine the situation being even better in the english speaking world.

As for recommendations:

1. The russian realists. Tolstoy is brilliant, though Dostoyevsky isn't anyone to sneeze at either.
2. Yukio Mishima
3. Plato – a brilliant stylist
4. Friedrich Engels wrote a brilliant treaty on historical materialism called The Origin of the Family, Private Property, and the State: in the light of the researches of Lewis H. Morgan
5. The bible has already been mentioned.
6. Shakespeare – can't write english without having read him (my opinion)

The list goes on and on and on My tip in short: Look outside your present time and or nationality. And read the Nobel prize winners – some of them are good!

The Giving Tree by davidwr · 2014-01-01 11:34 · Score: 1

Shel Silverstein's The Giving Tree, because it teaches us that no matter what our stage in life, we can still be of value to others.

--
Knowledge is how to play a game, intelligence is how to win, wisdom is knowing what game to play.

First things first. by hey! · 2014-01-01 11:34 · Score: 5, Insightful

I care more about *how much* and *how often* you read, than *what* you read. If you read more than 50 books a year that tells me a lot more about you than the titles you read. I think everyone should read at least 20 books a year, with two or three genres of fiction and non-fiction represented. Once we get to that point, THEN we can argue what titles should be in the "canon".

This is not the middle ages, where a gentleman could return from university with a library of fifty or so books that'd do him for the rest of his life. There's just too much information in the world and entering the world to rely exclusively on a canonical list of titles. It's more important to be a habitual knowledge seeker who can take pleasure in reading.

And we need some kind of antidote to the 24 hour news cycle, in which the more people read or watch the less informed they become. That antidote is books, in large quantities.

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Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.

Re:First things first. by melikamp · 2014-01-01 13:36 · Score: 1

I care more about *how much* and *how often* you read, than *what* you read.
So, quantity over quality? Really?

If you read more than 50 books a year that tells me a lot more about you than the titles you read.
All that tells me is that you are probably unemployed.

I think everyone should read at least 20 books a year, with two or three genres of fiction and non-fiction represented.
You forgot to mention why. Why at least 20? Why both fiction and non-fiction? Assuming that everything you read is well-written, what is wrong with only reading blogs and periodicals? What is wrong with only reading non-fiction? What is wrong with only reading fiction? What is wrong with only reading and writing personal correspondence? What is wrong with not reading anything thick for 2 years while writing your own novel?
Re:First things first. by hey! · 2014-01-02 00:39 · Score: 1

You can't spare the time to read one book a week on average? Really?

--
Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
Re:First things first. by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 06:44 · Score: 0

Fictional works provide very little in the way of actual knowledge. At times there are philosophical quandaries presented in fiction of some use, but nothing that can't be found on tvtropes.org, I suggest people read this and make fiction as boring, predictable, and cliche as it is - upping the ante a little bit. I believe my kids gather knowledge from Hunger Games and Harry Potter, but science fiction, a highly educational genre, really provides little more that a drop of knowledge in an ocean of tripe for the well read adult.
Re:First things first. by Quirkz · 2014-01-02 06:58 · Score: 1

I averaged a book every few days when I was single, a book every few weeks when I married and was running a side business, but now with kids I'm lucky to average a book a month, unless you want to include 4-6 kids' books daily in that mix. I assume I'll rebound when the kids get older, but I don't know how long it will take to get back to 1/week.

--
The Quirkz Handbook of Self-Improvement for People Who Are Already Pretty Okay
Re:First things first. by Monkey · 2014-01-03 05:51 · Score: 1

I only read while I'm taking a shit, but I can still get around 20 books a year in.

A Couple of Suggestions by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:35 · Score: 0

I would add Les Miserables and Atlas Shrugged TOGETHER as companion volumes as essential for understanding thought of the left and right. And Time Enough for Love just for fun.

Re:goodbye slashdot by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:36 · Score: 0

I find it refreshing that there is a forum where i don't have to jump through hoops or associate some non-existent social media identity just to contribute to the discussion. Perhaps I am part of the 5% fringe though.

Good Book... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:37 · Score: 0

Why not the Bible?

My List by fast+turtle · 2014-01-01 11:37 · Score: 1

Asimov's Foundation Series
Heinlens "Time Enough for Love" The Moon is a Harh Mistress
Frank Herber "The White Plague"
Damn near anything by Frederick Pohl "Mote in Gods Eye"
All of the "Executioner Series - Mack Bolan"
James P. Hogans "Giant Star Trilogy" Good Tech and has a very surprising Ending
The Hardy Boys and Nancy Drew Novels
Tom Swift
Subscription to Fantasy and Science Fiction, Analog, Galaxy and the other monthly magazines. A Real Mix of stories in there along with articles on Space and Technology.

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Mod me up/Mod me down: I wont frown as I've no crown

Re:My List by approachingZero+ · 2014-01-01 14:07 · Score: 0

Damn, I also forgot Foundation. very important series.

--
'I don't know what it's called. I just know the sound it makes, when it takes a man's life.' ~ Four Leaf Tayback

2013 Reading List by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:39 · Score: 0

http://goo.gl/SdXDto

The Demon-Haunted World by Darri · 2014-01-01 11:39 · Score: 1

By Carl Sagan.

Changed my perspective quite a bit, haven't looked back since.

http://books.google.com/books/about/Demon_Haunted_World.html?id=Yz8Y6KfXf9UC

One Second After by William R. Fortschen by starglider29a · 2014-01-01 11:39 · Score: 1

Not because it's a great book. It's a good book. The books listed all discuss how to think logically, feel compassionately, seek truth, govern (or dominate) wisely, and every civilized person should be reading them.

But One Second After forces you to think about what happens when logic, compassion, truth, and governance flash into oblivion under the power of an EMP. If you have read all of the above, you need to read One Second After to make you think about what happens if everything they taught you about civilization vanishes.

What do you miss first? How do you know what happened? How long will your meds hold out? Why didn't I think of this beforehand? Why didn't I prepare? Why did the government not harden against this? How can I read all of the above books if my Kindle is bricked?

Plato - The Republic by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:39 · Score: 0

Should be mentioned in the same breath as The Bible.

1984? Hardly. Try A Brave New World by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:42 · Score: 5, Insightful

A Brave New World describes the current world much better than 1984 ever could. 1984 and Animal Farm are about Stalinism and control through fear. A Brave New World is about control through entertainment. The first is much easier to convince people to fight against; the latter is, apparently, impossible.

Re:1984? Hardly. Try A Brave New World by ahabswhale · 2014-01-01 15:52 · Score: 1

Sorry but 1984 is much better written imho and goes to the heart of the matter.

--
Are agnostics skeptical of unicorns too?
Re:1984? Hardly. Try A Brave New World by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 19:48 · Score: 0

... Brave New World is about control ...

Indirectly. It's really about the inability of the protagonist to adapt from a culture driven by monogamy and community morals to one driven by genetically inheriting your job.
Re:1984? Hardly. Try A Brave New World by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 01:42 · Score: 0

I disagree with this analysis. Huxley's novel Island also shows what a world could look like with the elements of Brave New World flipped into positivity and the results are also fairly true - thus exemplifying the case that the world can be many books at once, not just one.
Re:1984? Hardly. Try A Brave New World by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 07:57 · Score: 0

Academic question: would Brave New World be better or worse than modern day society? In Brave New World every person has near absolute security and must never face real hardship, at the cost only of their humanity. In reality we don't come so close to that much security, but haven't most of us lost our humanity anyway? Do we have any humanity left except for our suffering?

A few of my favorites by Peter+Simpson · 2014-01-01 11:43 · Score: 1

Tolkein - Lord of the Rings - a cornerstone of fantasy - and a Quest
Bernard Fall - Hell in a Very Small Place - those who don't remember the past are doomed to repeat it.
Mallory - La Morte d'Artur - or is it "Le Morte"? The Arthurian Legend
Arthur C Clarke - The Sentinel ( aka 2001: A Space Odyssey)
Asimov - I, Robot - the book is better than the movie
Homer - Illiad and Odyssey
Rise and Fall of the Roman Empire (yeah, I haven't read it -- I only got as far as "Omnia Gallia in partes tres divisa est.")
Two Years Before the Mast - Havahd boy ships out on a square rigger -- then discovers what work is.
Ransome - Swallows and Amazons - for tweens who yearn for freedom
Kerouac - On the Road

If you're in Software Development: Brooks - The Mythical Man-Month - and make sure your boss reads it, too.
Awww...heck, just pick it up and read it! Or walk into the library and pick a book at random.

Re:A few of my favorites by approachingZero+ · 2014-01-01 14:06 · Score: 0

Yes, Tolkein is a must. I missed that in my list, one of the most important books of my youth. Two Years before the Mast, good. Will look into your list.

--
'I don't know what it's called. I just know the sound it makes, when it takes a man's life.' ~ Four Leaf Tayback
Re:A few of my favorites by Warma · 2014-01-02 00:50 · Score: 1

Asimov - I, Robot - the book is better than the movie
So far this is the most absurd line in the whole comments section.
Re:A few of my favorites by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 03:18 · Score: 0

Gallia est omnis divisa in partes tres, quarum unam incolunt Belgae, aliam Aquitani, tertiam qui ipsorum lingua Celtae, nostra Galli appellantur.
Hi omnes lingua, institutis, legibus inter se differunt.
Re:A few of my favorites by unitron · 2014-01-02 17:04 · Score: 1

Just to be picky, The Sentinel is the short story, and 2001: A Space Odyssey is his novelization of the movie that took the story as its launching point.

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I see even classic Slashdot is now pretty much unusable on dial up anymore.
Re:A few of my favorites by Peter+Simpson · 2014-01-10 02:59 · Score: 1

The book is almost always better than the movie...:-)

Two More by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:43 · Score: 0

Time Enough for Love and Earth Abides

Personal Recommendations (with reason[s]) by wisenboi · 2014-01-01 11:45 · Score: 1

Person recommendations (with short-form reason[s]):

The Quantum Thief (and I'd assume, the sequel "The Fractal Prince"), by Hannu Rajaniemi - the story dives into topics of personal security, public access memory, intra-stellar colonization,and hitting one or more Singularity events in technology and social splintering. Pacing is quick, detailing incredibly potent, yet giving you time to see parallels in where we are and where we could be, in the not-so-distant future. A wake-up call started decades ago by previous and existing speculative fiction authors and thinkers.

Sprawl Trilogy novels (Neuromancer (1984), Count Zero (1986), and Mona Lisa Overdrive (1988)), by William Gibson - cyberpunk literature that looks at the embedding and transformation-strong elements of technology alongside its own and society's deterministic properties. Puts to task the idea of isolation of the self and the integration of society into a ubiquitous whole through cyberspace, and its physio-socio-psychological backbones. Admittedly, Gibson's writing style can be very sparse/minimalist at times (especially with the more recent literature in the Bigend Trilogy) but the ideas are there and strong, nonetheless.

Heck, anything from William Gibson (including the Bigend Trilogy, in the last decade or so) is a good read.

Last, but not least, is More Than Human, by Theodore Sturgeon. This focuses on the idea of a potential future evolutionary adaptation, where a consummate human being, a gestalt, comes into being through a variety of children - should one be lost or removed permanently, another will be compatible elsewhere in the world. Individually, the children have limited abilities. In tandem as the gestalt (still physically separate), their abilities amplify.

There are more, but their names escape me, which tells me that they're not as crucial or best suited for this post.

--
If anyone needs me, I'll be in the Angry Dome.

Re:Personal Recommendations (with reason[s]) by wisenboi · 2014-01-01 11:48 · Score: 1

I'm kicking myself in the head for this. Another excellent core series to read is the Dune franchise, by Frank Herbert (and the subsequent complementary work by his son, Brian Herbert, and his collaborator, Kevin J. Anderson). Space Fantasy not being locked down by rigid technological detailing, if I ever saw one. Concepts focused are on apex human evolution, parallels in historical patterns/fallbacks to feudalism and matters of ecological and resource-based monopolies. Religious tones interestingly used to push an exotic, spiritual experience without being stuck up its own proverbial rear.

--
If anyone needs me, I'll be in the Angry Dome.

3 Good Ones by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:45 · Score: 0

1984 by George Orwell
Animal Farm by George Orwell
The Hobbit by J.R.R. Tolkien

The Elements of Style by TheloniousToady · 2014-01-01 11:45 · Score: 1

Although not specifically literature, "The Elements of Style" by Strunk and White will teach you more about how to write than any other 105 pages on the planet. It's also a surprisingly lively and interesting read for such a thing. (BTW, please don't castigate me for any needless words above. ;-)

Re:The Elements of Style by PPH · 2014-01-01 16:06 · Score: 1

Ain't that the truth?

--
Have gnu, will travel.

Re:goodbye slashdot by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:47 · Score: 0

I think you should stop sticking you tongue in men's assholes and sucking the shit out but I've kept quiet about it. Why don't you do the same?

1984 Whales Etc by rueger · 2014-01-01 11:48 · Score: 1

1984 - if only so that you'll know that 90% of people who reference it have never read it.

Moby Dick - (actually, as an audio book) because it really is an amazing and epic tale.

The Elements of Style - Strunk and White - because, like, teh Interwebs

--
Three Squirrels

Re:1984 Whales Etc by wonkey_monkey · 2014-01-01 12:13 · Score: 1

1984 - if only so that you'll know that 90% of people who reference it have never read it.
But you just told me that, so do I still have to read the book?
Wait... have you read it?

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systemd is Roko's Basilisk.

The Protocols of the Elders of Zion by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:50 · Score: 0

That should do for a start. Then you can see what lies in store for you and your children in the future, once the Jews have finished flooding your country with third world savages...

Re:The Protocols of the Elders of Zion by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 12:13 · Score: 0

They're fake, dickhead, along with the Hitler Diaries and the Emancipation Retraction.

Off the top of my head by Ichbin+Einberliner · 2014-01-01 11:50 · Score: 1

Just a few off the top of my head: "The Fatal Conceit", F. A. v. Hayek About the origins and maintenance of civilization. "The Future and Its Enemies", Virginia Postrel About the folly of trying to plan a society's future. "Atlas Shrugged", Ayn Rand Here heroes were unrealistic, but here villains were right on the money. "The Millionaire Mind", Thomas J. Stanley Who the rich really are. "The Bible", great ammo for when some fundamentalist tries to bamboozle you "Ceremonial Chemistry", Thomas Szasz The war on some drugs is doing more damage than the drugs. "The Lord of the Rings", J. R. R. Tolkien It may ruin the movies for you. "The Wealth of Nations", Adam Smith

Keep it interesting and real by BringsApples · 2014-01-01 11:53 · Score: 1

2 books:
The Psilocybin Solution
Darwin's Unfinished Business

Both by Simon G. Powell

--
Politics; n. : A religion whereby man is god.

Seconded. by sonamchauhan · 2014-01-01 11:56 · Score: 1

I also suggest the books of Genesis, Daniel and Revelation.

Million Dollar Education by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 11:56 · Score: 0

These following series of books were used as the Classic Liberal (as in book, libre) Education. They are no longer taught in full or at all because they are deemed to good for peasants and would allow the common man to become "liberated". Cheers

The Great Books of the Western World (Encyclopedia Britannica)
The Great Books of the Eastern World
The Harvard Classics

Be sure to check out Trivium education dote commercial.

Maurice Maeterlinck by behrooz0az · 2014-01-01 11:56 · Score: 1

It's just unbelievable no one has mentioned him, yet.
Some of his work are quite impressive.

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Moderating "-1, Disagree" is simple censorship. Have the guts to post your opinion. -- Spazmania (174582)

my kind of book by DrEasy · 2014-01-01 11:57 · Score: 2

I like fiction that makes me think:

Fictions - Borges
I, Robot - Asimov
Never Let Me Go - Ishiguro

--
"In our tactical decisions, we are operating contrary to our strategic interest."

Don't Tell Mom I Work on the Rigs by aXis100 · 2014-01-01 11:59 · Score: 2

Don't Tell Mom I Work on the Rigs: She Thinks I'm a Piano Player in a Whorehouse - http://www.amazon.com/Dont-Tell-Mom-Work-Rigs/dp/1600940250

Hilarious laugh out loud story of a guy that grew up in country Western Australia and went on to work in some of the most extreme locations on the planet. He's a fantastic story teller and it's a great read.

Only one recommendation, but it's a doozy. by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 12:01 · Score: 0

The Practical Cogitator. This book was a life changer. I need to get another copy because people keep borrowing mine and won't give them back. http://www.amazon.com/The-Practical-Cogitator-Thinkers-Anthology/dp/0395346355

Personally read in 2013 by Pollux · 2014-01-01 12:01 · Score: 1

Tears of My Soul, by Kim Hyun Hee

If anyone would like to receive the best insight currently possible on the North Korean regime and how perverted their hold is on their citizens, then this is the book to read. But that's the icing on the cake. Anyone who seeks wisdom on suffering, listen to the words of a woman who blew up an airplane carrying 115 passengers and has to live with that fact for the rest of her life. She knows better than anyone what suffering truly is.

Best novel of the 20th century by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 12:02 · Score: 0

The Master and Margarita by Mikhail Bulgakov - Penguin Classics

Three stories in one book - The devil visits atheist Stalinist Russia and exposes its hypocrisy, Jesus and Pontius Pilate leading up to the crucifixion, and a love story thrown in. What other book features a chapter of a naked witch riding a broom over Moscow?

Keeping away from science fiction... by chill · 2014-01-01 12:04 · Score: 1

The Art of War (Sun Tzu)
Brave New World (Aldous Huxley)
The Demon-Haunted World: Science as a Candle in the Dark (Carl Sagan)
Think and Grow Rich (Napoleon Hill)

The History of the Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire (Edward Gibbon)
The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich (William Shirer)

--
Learning HOW to think is more important than learning WHAT to think.

Re:Keeping away from science fiction... by unitron · 2014-01-02 17:09 · Score: 1

Rise and Fall is tough sledding and it might help if you start it armed with considerable respect for the author by first reading his "Berlin Diary".

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I see even classic Slashdot is now pretty much unusable on dial up anymore.

Misc Titles by michael_cain · 2014-01-01 12:06 · Score: 1

Shakespeare's Romeo and Juliet -- Given the number of good things that have been written that borrow the whole story, it's worth reading the original. Shakespeare borrowed the story himself, but improved it greatly.

Niven and Pournelle's The Mote in God's Eye -- Ignore how much Larry and Jerry wish we would give up an elected executive and install a monarch; it's still one of the very best first contact novels.

Michener's The Source -- Fictional but well-researched story of the evolution of religions in the Middle East, warts and all. Actually, more about the warts than anything else.

Re:Misc Titles by snevig · 2014-01-01 15:24 · Score: 1

Came to add The Source. Since you've already mentioned it, I'll just add that it's my favourite book of all time. I've read it at least 6 times and I've wound up with two copies of it in my "library" of a couple of dozen books.

Another favourite which isn't yet in the comments is Sarum by Edward Rutherford.

Basic Readings in Life by cervesaebraciator · 2014-01-01 12:07 · Score: 2

Many fine books (especially in fiction) are offered above, so I thought I'd take a different approach to the question. The following ten books are, in my view, fundamental for anyone who wishes a broad education. That being said, I didn't pick these from some list of "classics." Each of these books have challenged me and have changed my life, even those I vehemently disagree with. They chiefly address that most important question: How we shall live a good life? These are worth reading, which is to say they're worth reading more than once. It's a bit of a mélange, but I wanted to limit myself to only ten works.

1. Plato, Republic (add Phaedo and Phaedrus if you like that)
2. Aristotle, Nicomachean Ethics
3. Confucius, The Analects
4. Cicero, On Duties (esp. Book III)
5. Plotinus, Enneads (I.6)
6. Dorotheos of Gaza, Discourses (esp. "On Renunciation" and "On Refusal to Judge our Neighbor")
7. Augustine, The Confessions
8. Marx, Communist Manifesto
9. Leo XIII, Rerum Novarum
10. Wendell Berry, Life is a Miracle

Hop on Pop by wonkey_monkey · 2014-01-01 12:07 · Score: 0

Hop on Pop.

It was so sad, the way they hopped on Pop.

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systemd is Roko's Basilisk.

The Joy of Cooking by Chemisor · 2014-01-01 12:10 · Score: 1

Once you understand how frail and exposed they are, you should learn how to cook them. They are delicious!

Ken Follet by SternisheFan · 2014-01-01 12:12 · Score: 1

The Pillars of the Earth, is a historical novel by Ken Follett published in 1989 about the building of a cathedral in the town of Kingsbridge, England. It is set in the middle of the 12th century, primarily during the Anarchy, between the time of the sinking of the White Ship and the murder of Thomas Becket. The book traces the development of Gothic architecture out of the preceding Romanesque architecture, and the fortunes of the Kingsbridge priory and village against the backdrop of historical events of the time.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Pillars_of_the_Earth

Thoughts on the Koran by Pollux · 2014-01-01 12:13 · Score: 3, Funny

I've tried reading the Koran. So far, I've parsed the first eight Sura.

Even being a Christian and having significant historical knowledge of the Bible and its history, the Koran is still very, very difficult to understand for a westerner not familiar with the history of the Koran. There are significant direct references to Biblical, Arab, and Islamist events that are frequently made and referenced throughout its passages. Even more difficult are the indirect references. Many messages and commands require background knowledge in order to construct what is being said. If you want to study the Koran, you are best off taking a university course on it, or at least going to some community and/or Islamist center where the instructor knows and understands the material.

I found the Old Testament far more entertaining. Granted, all the lineages were a bit dry, and detailed blueprints of the Arc of the Covenant just don't help me day-to-day, ya know, but heck, collecting foreskins for a king to wed his daughter, that stuff's just good as gold!

Re:Thoughts on the Koran by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 23:34 · Score: 0

Granted, all the lineages were a bit dry, and detailed blueprints of the Arc of the Covenant just don't help me day-to-day
Some good blue prints for that leisure condo a typical billionaire would like can be found at the end of the New Testament.
Re:Thoughts on the Koran by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 07:49 · Score: 0

If you're interested see classes and lectures by Nouman khan
on youtube
He's familiar with Western culture and has classical Arabic training
Re:Thoughts on the Koran by Dread_ed · 2014-01-02 11:33 · Score: 1

There are significant direct references to Biblical, Arab, and Islamist events that are frequently made and referenced throughout its passages. Even more difficult are the indirect references. Many messages and commands require background knowledge in order to construct what is being said.
You just described the term "isagogics", which is an important part of any valid scholarly attempt to understand a theological manuscript. Oddly, most people that undertake an attempt to understand the bible do so without it, and therefore misconstrue, misapply, or even miss completely the meaning of the text.

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When the only tool you have is a claw hammer every problem starts to look like the back of someone's skull.
Re:Thoughts on the Koran by rich_hudds · 2014-01-02 23:12 · Score: 1

Thanks for that. David and the Foreskins, great story. I shall teach my son that one so he can mention it at school when David and Goliath is brought up.

I expect it will surprise his teacher.
Re:Thoughts on the Koran by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-04 00:58 · Score: 0

What translation have you read ?
Re:Thoughts on the Koran by Antique+Geekmeister · 2014-01-04 07:00 · Score: 1

Not all teachers. I remember that in one course we had a long discussion about the history of religious genocide in the Bible. But my teacher on this was a theological history teacher. It was a fascinating course: the concepts of a "promised land", a "manifest destiny", and "the divine right of kings" all were examined. I do believe it helped prevent their getting tenure, but the material was fascinating.

Instead of the Communist Manifesto by Snarfangel · 2014-01-01 12:16 · Score: 1

Read Henry George's Progress and Poverty. The writing is clearer, and it offers ideas compatible with capitalism.

BTW, I don't want to suggest in any way that George was a communist. He was arguably more of a capitalist than most, in that he didn't want to tax capital at all -- or labor, for that matter -- just land (and by extension, natural resources with inherently fixed supply). Karl Marx's writing is a more difficult slog, and his importance is more how he was able to convince otherwise rational people to behave irrationally en masse, rather than economic ideas that would be useful to implement.

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Down and Out in Paris and London by kinglog · 2014-01-01 12:18 · Score: 1

Orwell's _Down and Out in Paris and London_ is one of the best books about being poor

Nietzsche by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 12:22 · Score: 0

Reading any of the later works of Nietzsche is quite enlightening. I also read science and philosophy books by the likes of Dennett, Dawkins, Damasio, etc, and find Nietzsche's intuitions and clear visions quite astonishing. I've read modern books from current scolars explaining their new theories that were actually described, more vividly, in a single paragraph from Nietzsche, about 150 years prior.
And if you've never read him, throw away your current idea of who he was and what he wrote. The best part may be how he wrote: beautiful, concise, at first glance cryptic, but after some thought you realize it was the best way possible to express the idea. Some parts I understood only because I read the likes of Dawkins and Damasio beforehand. I'm not sure if I'm reading those parts wrong, or if it was way, way harder to read it right in his time.

Also by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 12:24 · Score: 0

Three men in a boat by Jerome K Jerome

book reads by tleaf100 · 2014-01-01 12:27 · Score: 1

Brian Bates = the way of the weird. its a good read and reminds/teaches folk that there is more to life than just science,tech,good solid explainable ideas,some things in life are not as easily explainable.

Unless its football. by tuppe666 · 2014-01-01 12:27 · Score: 1

by Richard Adams. I truly believe it helps people build empathy, and sympathize with animals and understand how frail and exposed they really are.

I can't find a reference on the internet, but Richard Adams was requested to support for preventing rabbits being exterminated after damaging a football field. The response from Adams was "they sound like a bloody nuisance". Although really I wouldn't trust my memory on any facts.

What is sadly true and its even more clear in another of his books http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shardik (Seriously just read first chapter) which essentially describes a bear running through a burning wood. we actually care more *because* its an animal...and I say that as someone who likes natures, for a day trip. What you learn is human nature.

Simple Question, Strange Responses by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 12:32 · Score: 0

What about:

Bash,

Classic Shell Scripting,

Bash Programming,

C/C++ Programming.

These are O'Reilly Books/Media. Sad that none of these were mentioned above in any of the posts and Slashdot is suppose to be a "Geek News For Geeks" blog.

I guess Linus Torvalds does not read Slashdot either.

Better to reads Linux Weekly News.

1984 by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 12:32 · Score: 0

1984

Hayek's The Fatal Conceit by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 12:46 · Score: 0

It's a better read than The Road to Serfdom.

Ed Snowden by Patent+Lover · 2014-01-01 12:52 · Score: 1

Edward Snowden's: What the Fuck is Our Government Doing and How Much is it Costing Us?

Short Stories and Poems are good too. by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 13:06 · Score: 0

It might be easier to start some people on short stories and poems. It's less of a commitment.

Harrrison Beregon - Kurt Vonnegut
The Quiet Man - Maurice Walsh
If - Rudyard Kipling
The Death of the Hired Man - Robert Frost
Psalm 23, of course, if they haven't read it. It reads best in the King James version.

Any non-mainstream book by loufoque · 2014-01-01 13:06 · Score: 1

Just read any non-mainstream book. It's the best thing you can do to get out of the way society has formatted you.
In particular, you might try reading books from a variety of countries and cultures instead of just reading English "classics", that are only classics because people read them in the past and they ask the next generation to read them as well..

Re:Any non-mainstream book by csumpi · 2014-01-01 14:12 · Score: 1

+1

How to read a book by Boronx · 2014-01-01 13:15 · Score: 1

There's a lot of great books on here, but I'll mentioned one that changed and greatly improved my reading, especially of non-fiction books:

"How to read a book" by Mortimer Adler.

I guarantee you will find something in there that will improve your reading habits. I found quite a bit. I did not know that I did not know how to read a book.

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Play Command HQ online

Germs, Guns and Steel by Mars729 · 2014-01-01 13:19 · Score: 1

I think that Germs, Guns, and Steel by Jared Diamond is an important and eye opening read.

Wtf? by w_dragon · 2014-01-01 13:20 · Score: 1

I got to the bottom of the comments and no one had suggested 'The C Programming Language'. Slashdot, I'm not sure I know you anymore.

Re:Wtf? by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 14:59 · Score: 0

Well it was suggested 2 hours before your post. I'm more surprised the nobody had mentioned Robert Anton Wilson.

The Total Money Makeover by psalm33 · 2014-01-01 13:23 · Score: 1

by Dave Ramsey...or a similar book about how to create a budget, how to stick to it, and some common sense answers about debt, credit, loans, and investing (I don't really care if you pick Ramsey's book, or a different one on the same subject, but his is very straight-forward, and easy to understand the key points). I'm sure it's not a popular subject with most of the Slashdot crowd, but the OP did say books "everyone should read". Everyone really doesn't need to read the Hobbit, but everyone should know how to manage their money: it's an essential life skill in 1st world countries.

My peculiar list by mendax · 2014-01-01 13:25 · Score: 1

Alcoholics Anonymous—The beginning chapters of the AA "Big Book" ought to be read by everyone. In all seriousness, I have yet to meet a person who does not need to be in a Twelve Step program. Just replace the words "alcohol" and "alcoholic" with your own poison, vice, obsession, or difficulty in life and you'll probably find that what you read there applies to you and that practicing the Twelve Steps and leading a life of increased humility would help you cope with it in a healthy way.

Ecclesiastes—Probably the most philosophical book of the Bible, one that has a great deal of value for me.

George Orwell's 1984 and Animal Farm—Both books are reminders of what unchecked government power will lead to and offer us countless reminders of the value of freedom and how costly it is when you lose it.

The Epic of Gilgamesh—The Sumerian/Babylonian story of a proud arrogant king, two-thirds divine, who is humbled by death, his human limitations, and his own mortality.

William Golding's Lord of the Flies—A book that demonstrates in spades the best and the worst features of the human condition and I think gets to the heart of what human beings really are.

Charles Dickens' Dombey and Son—While all of the Dickens' novels I've read have a similar philosophical character, this book is in my opinion his best.

Umberto Eco's Name of the Rose—Even though it takes place in 1327, the issues the novel discusses are eminently relevant to today; indeed, to any period of time, past, present, or future. Religious freedom, censorship and banned books, the love of knowledge and scholarship, controversy over fundamentalist religious dogmas and doctrines, the danger of a theocracy, and the roles love should play in a person's life are all issues that are discussed in this wildly entertaining mystery. It's a modern classic as dense and well-written as the best of Tolstoy or Dickens.

Carl Sagan's Cosmos—No book I know of does as good of a job of using the science to promote the humanities. It's a great read.

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It's really quite a simple choice: Life, Death, or Los Angeles.

Anything by John Taylor Gatto by Mars729 · 2014-01-01 13:31 · Score: 1

His message is that the eduction system is designed not to education. His Underground History of American Education is available full text online. http://news.slashdot.org/story/04/09/06/1722203/the-underground-history-of-american-education http://www.johntaylorgatto.com/ He has other books that are easier reads if you choose.

"Seneca - Letters from a Stoic" is second to none. by Qbertino · 2014-01-01 13:33 · Score: 1

That's an easy question to answer.
Top of the list and second to none:
Seneca - Letters from a Stoic

Then the works of Epicurus, Diogenes, Socrates & Aristoteles, in that order. Confuzius is a nice addition to that aswell.

Everything in our society and/or entire world that involves correct usage of basic brain functions goes back to what these people have written down.

Fallbacks to that:
Simple modern Zen Literature, perhaps condensed by Alan Watts or some other western advocate of Zen philosophy. ... But then agian, stoicisim is nothing but the wester variant of that, and one that's partially more fitting to western mindsets or perhaps even more refined than some eastern variants. .... Although eastern variants can be more poetic, if that's your thing.

Sidenote: People are recommending the Bible as a top-list must-read here. I really don't know why - probably some USA thing (watch me getting modded into oblivion for that half-sentence) ... anyway, stoicisim/zen will make you happy for the rest of your life, no matter what and will most probably also make you a better person for it. If you feel better when including the bible, add Jesus of Nazareth teachings (and *only* those!) later, they are *much* easyer to understand and apply when you have become a stoic!

BTW: Most of those books are public domain / copyright free and downloadable as PDF for free.

Good luck and have fun.

--
We suffer more in our imagination than in reality. - Seneca

well worth reading by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 13:36 · Score: 0

Stephen Mitchel's translation of the Tao Te Ching is definitely on my list of books to share. The little pocket edition is pretty perfect. Well worth sitting with, and revisiting often.

Books with an unsavory flavor but worth it by shoor · 2014-01-01 13:38 · Score: 1

A couple of books I read recently come to mind. "My Life as a Pimp" by Iceberg Slim, and "The Valachi Papers". The reason is these books tell about the seamy side of life from the inside out. Iceberg Slim was quite literate. Joe Valachi was barely literate but he was intelligent and interviewed by an excellent writer, Peter Maas. A lot of "The Sopranos" comes from "The Valachi Papers".

So much for the unsavory; In the 'savory' department I'd recommend "Autobiography of Benjamin Franklin" and "Narrative of the Life of Frederic Douglass, an American Slave",
"Act One" by Moss Hart is another autobiographical classic, by a successful American playwright of the 1st half of the 20th century.

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In theory, theory and practice are the same; in practice they're different. (Yogi Berra & A. Einstein)

Books about topics that interest them first and fo by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 13:39 · Score: 1

The worst thing you can do to someone who doesn't read much, is to point them at a book because it is a 'classic' or in some way exceptional.
First, truly find what they like and then make suggestions at least in the edge of that genre. Get them hooked. Get them comfortable with devoting time to the solitary activity of reading, then move on to the better stuff.

"The Cathedral and the Bazaar" by Raymond. by mrflash818 · 2014-01-01 13:43 · Score: 1

I'd recommend reading "The Cathedral and the Bazaar" by Raymond.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Cathedral_and_the_Bazaar

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Uh, Linux geek since 1999.

Orwell, Madison, Strunk, and Kernighan by RandCraw · 2014-01-01 13:45 · Score: 1

In these times of Rising Police State USA, "1984" and "Brave New World" could not be more relevant or compelling as reflections on where unmonitored unchecked government power will lead. Likewise, "The Federalist Papers" serve as perhaps the best reminder that freedom requires cool careful consideration and eternal vigilence -- by each of us, of our own government.

On a lighter tech note, I also choose "Elements of Style" by Strunk and White. Not only is it the best book ever written on how to express yourself clearly, but I know no other book that better prepares you to think clearly too. Likewise, Kernighan and Ritchie's "The C Programming Language" is a paragon of clarity and simplicity in describing the principles and syntax of a programming language. The brevity of the original edition (at 228 pgs) is also a reminder of the need for economy and focus in design, *especially* among today's enormous, complex, one-tool-for-all-problems languages and the 1000+ page tomes needed to describe them.

42 by savuporo · 2014-01-01 13:46 · Score: 4, Informative

I cant belive i didnt find "Hitchhikers Guide to Galaxy" here. It has answers for everything.

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Re:42 by physicsphairy · 2014-01-01 23:48 · Score: 1

Hence why it hasn't been mentioned --- the people with all the answers have no reason to Ask Slashdot.

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When things get complex, multiply by the complex conjugate.

Playboy by Ukab+the+Great · 2014-01-01 13:52 · Score: 1

For the articles.

Re: by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 13:56 · Score: 0

And the subby listed it as classic literature. Really? Cryptonomicon is classic literature?

Re by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 13:59 · Score: 1

Well if you are going to read either 1984 or A Brave New World might as well go right to the source of both those works and read We.

Re:Re by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 15:33 · Score: 0

A book whose title is a common pronoun (We) should've included some reference to the author, or something substantially easier to google. I found it, but only by association (searching for 1984 and Brave New World along with it). I consider myself well-read and I've never heard of this book. For everyone else, the author is Edward James Brown. I'd also add The Turner Diaries for some uncomfortable, yet insightful reading. That book is a prime example of how you need not agree with everything you read, but you should consider viewpoints you oppose to make yourself a better person.
Re:Re by nitio · 2014-01-01 22:59 · Score: 1

I believe the book We the author refers is the one written by Russian author Yevgeny Zamyatin (ISBN# can be found here)

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http://stoploudness.org/

Books... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 14:02 · Score: 0

It's a matter of personal choice, but I recomend as a must read Bradbury's "The martian chronicles", and Dawkins' The God Delusion.

Hornblower (Kirk was based on him) and . . . by approachingZero+ · 2014-01-01 14:03 · Score: 0

Connections - James Burke
The Northwest Passage - Kenneth Roberts
Assignment in Utopia - Eugene Lyons
A Fire in the Deep - Vernor Vinge
The Ladder of Rivers: The Story of I.P. (Print Olive) - Harry E. Chrisman
At least one book by J. Frank Dobie
The Stand - Stephen King
The Brass Ring - Bill Mauldin
At least one book by Tony Hillerman
The Last 100 Days - John Toland
QB VII - Leon Uris

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'I don't know what it's called. I just know the sound it makes, when it takes a man's life.' ~ Four Leaf Tayback

Re:GEB / Hofstadter by TaoPhoenix · 2014-01-01 14:05 · Score: 1

"GEB (Score:4, Interesting)
by gbjbaanb (229885) on Wednesday January 01, 2014 @05:28PM (#45840105)

GÃfdel, Escher, Bach: An Eternal Golden Braid [goodreads.com]

Godel, Escher, Bach is not a simple read. The ideas are complex and the logic subtle. But it is a completely satisfying book, and reading it is one of those rare experiences when you leave feeling smarter than when you started.

its true, though I felt like a complete simpleton after reading it - its an awesome piece of writing. Its not something to read casually though, you're gonna have to think, a lot."

Let's see if I can do an homage to that funky book.
4 3 2 1 3 2 2 6 2 4 5 4.
The sentence I will write in my next post is true. The one I wrote in my last post wants to be true. ... Nah. It's been too long since I read it to do it right. : (

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My first Journal Entry ever, in 8 years! http://slashdot.org/journal/365947/aphelion-scifi-fantasy-horror-poetry-webzine

Anything... by jcdick1 · 2014-01-01 14:07 · Score: 1

It doesn't matter what it is. Just do it on a regular basis, like a certain amount of time a day, or every Saturday afternoon from 3:00 to 5:00 pm. It could be comic books, it could be the Torah, it could be Scientific American. Just read.

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What?

geometry and theology by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 14:08 · Score: 0

Confederacy of Dunces - the funniest book every written.

Books banned by Churches that condemn them by Circlotron · 2014-01-01 14:08 · Score: 1

Churches spent a lot of time and effort to dissuade people from reading the Bible back in the day. William Tyndale http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Tyndale, John Wycliffe http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Wycliffe and Jan Hus http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Hus in particular were considered enemies of the church because of their efforts to put the Bible in the hands of ordinary people. Clearly there is stuff in the Bible that churches really don't want you to know about. Stuff that condemns them in no uncertain manner. My favourite is in Revelation chapter 17, the stated end of religion (the Great Harlot) at the hands of political powers (the Ten Horns). That day can't come soon enough.

2312 by csumpi · 2014-01-01 14:10 · Score: 1

2312 by Kin Stanley Robinson

A sci-fi masterpiece that will leave you a lot to think about.

Re:2312 by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 18:50 · Score: 0

I would also like to recommend the Mars series by Robinson. In my opinion much better hard sci-fi than a lot of the older stuff recommended by practically every nerd (also, what's with this hard-on for pseudo-meritocratic totalitarianism that seems to pop up in a lot of sci-fi fans?).

Two others about Russia by approachingZero+ · 2014-01-01 14:11 · Score: 0

The Gulag Archipelago - Solzhenitsyn The Long Walk - Slavomir Rawicz

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'I don't know what it's called. I just know the sound it makes, when it takes a man's life.' ~ Four Leaf Tayback

Re:Two others about Russia by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 14:56 · Score: 0

Also, The Great Terror, by Robert Conquest. Anne Applebaum's GULAG is another fine work.

China? by mi · 2014-01-01 14:12 · Score: 1

With China's influence over the world continuing to grow, people should be reading about the Three Kingdoms — either the "dry" history, or the more popularized version.

Surprisingly enough, in 300 comments on this page already, no one has mentioned China yet...

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In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.

World Almanac by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 14:13 · Score: 0

I was stationed on a submarine back before ipods, laptops, and computers were common. I took an Almanac with me and we had encyclopedias on board in our small library.

Even now with everything available to me at just about any time, I still read the Almanac along with random Wikipedia articles along with watching "How it's Made" and "Modern Marvels". There is a lot of interesting real things out there in our world. Being a technology, electronic, computer person and a geek or nerd my entire life working in the field and also as a hobby, I think I'm a little odd in that I've have ZERO interest in fiction and science fiction and literature in general.

Harvard Classics by ninetyninebottles · 2014-01-01 14:16 · Score: 1

The Harvard Classics were the answer to your question as of 1900. They still hold up as a pretty good start on an education.

Educate yourself in the evils of socialism/fascism by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 14:31 · Score: 0

The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich

Dickens' "The Chimes" by mike.rimov · 2014-01-01 14:32 · Score: 1

Hey, its even a New Year's Story. If you take a moment to understand the picture he's painting, it'll give you some good perspective on your life. eBook Here

East of Eden by Pagey123 · 2014-01-01 14:37 · Score: 1

Please take the time to read East of Eden by John Steinbeck. I have yet to read a better novel that captures the "human condition" and just what it means to be human. In a letter to Pascal Covici, editor at Viking Press, Steinbeck himself best sums up this novel:
"Dear Pat,
You came upon me carving some kind of little figure out of wood and you said,
“Why don’t you make something for me?”
I asked you what you wanted and you said, “A box.”
“What For?”
“To put things in.”
“What things?”
“Whatever you have.” You said.
Well here’s your box. Nearly everything I have is in it, and it is not full. Pain and excitement are in it, and feeling good or bad and evil thoughts and good thoughts—the pleasure of design and some despair and the indescribable joy of creation.
And on top of these are all the gratitude and love I have for you.
And still the box is not full.
John"

Provoking. by mtthwbrnd · 2014-01-01 14:45 · Score: 1

"What are the books that everyone should read? I don't care if it's been banned by schools, burned by communists, or illuminated by 15th century monks. If you think everyone around you should read it, I'd love to know about it." I provide links to the full text but encourage people to purchase the books to support the Authors (apart from the deceased ones I guess!). 1. Jewish Supremacism, David Duke. (Full text: http://tinyurl.com/mzpaczb) 2. Jewish History, Jewish Religion, Israel Shahak. (Full text: http://tinyurl.com/jvlho5v) 3. The Secret Behind Communism, David Duke. (Full text: http://tinyurl.com/jwv6j45) 4. Beyond Chutzpah, Norman Finkelstein. (Full text: http://tinyurl.com/nxqxcwn) 5. The Israel Lobby and U.S. Foreign Policy, John Mearsheimer & Stephen Walt. (Full text of paper: http://tinyurl.com/yh7sojq)

Comment removed by account_deleted · 2014-01-01 14:49 · Score: 1

Comment removed based on user account deletion

Most good authors alredy mentioned by others by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 14:51 · Score: 0

But I really miss Robert Anton Wilson http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Anton_Wilson#Bibliography

the philosophy of freedom by johnrpenner · 2014-01-01 14:53 · Score: 1

probably one of the most important books in western philosophy since kant's critique of pure reason — rudolf steiner's 'philosophy of freedom':

EVERYTHING DISCUSSED in this book centers around two problems which are fundamental to the human soul-life. One of these problems concerns the possibility of attaining such insight into human nature that knowledge of man can become the foundation of all human knowledge and experience of life. We often feel that our experiences and the results of scientific investigations are not self-supporting; further experiences or discoveries may shake our certitude. The other problem is Has man any right to ascribe freedom to his will, or is freedom of will an illusion arising out of his inability to recognize the threads of necessity on which his will depends, just like a process in nature? (Rudolf Steiner, The Philosophy of Freedom)

http://wn.rsarchive.org/Books/GA004/English/RSPI1963/GA004_preface1.html

Re:the philosophy of freedom by johnrpenner · 2014-01-01 15:01 · Score: 1

a better translation:
There are two fundamental questions in the life of the human soul towards which everything to be discussed in this book is directed. One is: Is it possible to find a view of the essential nature of man such as will give us a foundation for everything else that comes to meet us — whether through life experience or through science — which we feel is otherwise not self-supporting and therefore liable to be driven by doubt and criticism into the realm of uncertainty? The other question is this: Is man entitled to claim for himself freedom of will, or is freedom a mere illusion begotten of his inability to recognize the threads of necessity on which his will, like any natural event, depends?

There are some good ones. by eyenot · 2014-01-01 14:54 · Score: 1

"The Humanure Handbook: a guide to composting human manure", by Joseph Jenkins. 2005. This book will single-handedly re-teach you everything there is to know about composting, will shatter all the myths you *thought* you knew, and will make you seriously consider the present and future of modern humanity in our willingness to throw away fresh water and spoil the water table. Winner: Independent Publishing Award; Amazon.com Category Bestseller; Foreward Magazine's Book of the Year Award Finalist; Three Rivers Environmental Awards; Independent Book Publishing Association Benjamin Franklin Award; Mother Earth News Books for Wiser Living Recommendation.

"The Child and the Machine: How Computers Put Our Children's Education at Risk", Alison Armstrong and Charles Casement. 2000. As someone who learned to program computers in the home from age 8, I appreciated many of the points made in the case against introducing computers in the classroom. The author seems not to be too well familiar with the inner workings of machines, and some geek faux pas litter throughout. But the case against similar minds spending mega-bucks on pushing computers at disinterested children is well-made. The well-researched book rails against those who make money purely by pressuring schools to adopt expensive computer placement contracts, and points out that not only is there a lack of evidence that involving computers in schooling is beneficial but cites numerous evidence to the contrary.

"The Little, Brown Essential Handbook". This is that book you were assigned in College Level Writing. Going to write a blog? Be professional about it. There are too many unprofessional writers smearing across the interwebs.

"Consuming the Inedible: Neglected Dimensions of Food Choice". ed. Jeremy MacClancy, Jeya Henry, Helen Macbeth. 2007. In this, Volume 6 of the Anthropology of Food and Nutrition, you will find the details of what people eat when food isn't available. From the cover photo of a little girl picking her nose to the final (the 18th) paper titled "The Use of Waste Products in the Fermentation of Alcoholic Beverages", you're in for a fun read about things like eating clay, dung, salt, lime, garbage, etc.

"Interpersonal Communication: The Whole Story". Kory Floyd. 2009. This is the book assigned in many college Interpersonal Communication courses. It's fun and eye-opening. Having trouble in your marriage, at work, between friends, etc.? The answers may lie in this book. Contains numerous exercises that might help you find out how well you communicate. Full of useful lingo and jargon that you can use to describe interpersonal communications. Equally useful for the super-analytical as for the casual know-it-all.

"The Confessions of Aleister Crowley: an Autohagiography". It's an old book, good luck getting a hardcover copy. It's definitely worth the read. The man's life, as told by himself, makes for wonderful adventure reading.

"Strange Angel: The Otherworldly Life of Rocket Scientist John Whiteside Parsons". George Pendle. 2005. Here's the first man to successfully develop rockets to add thrust to airplanes for the U.S. military. The first man to develop a castable fuel, GALCIT 53. The American man whose inventions and achievements were taken from him and given to a Nazi, and who was almost forgotten by history. Probably due to his involvement in the Ordo Templi Orientis, Aleister Crowley's sacred lodge. Parsons is the man who L. Ron Hubbard stole the money, boat, and girlfriend from to run off and write Dianetics and start Scientology. A fascinating personality.

"Caswal of Axoth". John Petrush. 2005. The strangest, most violent, sci-fi page-turner I've ever had the pleasure of not being able to put down.

"The Ambidextrous Universe" by Martin Gardner. The symmetry of every last symmetric or asymmetric thing in the universe is explained in excruciating detail.

--
"Stratigraphically the origin of agriculture and thermonuclear destruction will appear essentially simultaneous" -- Lee

george macdonald — phantastes by johnrpenner · 2014-01-01 14:56 · Score: 1

regarded by c.s. lewis as his 'master' — contemporaries with lewis carrol — one of the most brilliant fantasy writers ever — george macdonald, 'phantastes' and 'lillith':

http://web.archive.org/web/20131017224627/http://etext.lib.virginia.edu/etcbin/toccer-new2?id=MacPhan.sgm&images=images/modeng&data=/texts/english/modeng/parsed&tag=public&part=1&division=div1

Two different questions here. by fluffy99 · 2014-01-01 15:04 · Score: 1

If you're looking to encourage reading as a hobby, simply find out their interests and recommend something appropriate. Say the kid like sci-fi, then maybe point him towards Heinlen, etc. There are lots of good suggestions above that might peak someones interest, and certainly some written in styles that would make them unapproachable or dry for most teens (Shakespeare and the Bible for example).

Once the bug for reading is planted (it might take time to grow given the generally short attention span of under 21 crowd), then maybe make suggestions or even send them the ebooks.

Aren't new years resolutions generally about improving yourself, and not about telling others how to improve themselves?

How to Lie with Statistics by Darrell Huff by PapayaSF · 2014-01-01 15:07 · Score: 3, Interesting

This should be required reading for everyone of junior high/high school age. It's basically a brief introduction to statistics, focusing on all the ways they are often misused. It's short, funny, and permanently changed the way I view news and politics. Once you know this stuff, you'll see examples everywhere, especially when partisans have an ax to grind. E.g., years ago I saw a group's study that purported to "prove" that California's taxes and regulations had no negative effects on businesses. Further investigation revealed that they studied only existing California businesses, not businesses that had closed down, or moved out of state, or never got off the ground. Um, sample bias?

--
Q: What does the "B." in Benoit B. Mandelbrot stand for? A: Benoit B. Mandelbrot

Re:How to Lie with Statistics by Darrell Huff by Scorch_Mechanic · 2014-01-01 15:27 · Score: 1

Very much this book. I personally believe that this book should be on every high school econ (and or gov't) class reading list. Comprehending this book will make you a better citizen, whatever your personal beliefs.

--
You should turn signatures off.
Re:How to Lie with Statistics by Darrell Huff by Rob+the+Bold · 2014-01-01 16:24 · Score: 1

This should be required reading for everyone of junior high/high school age.
Excellent choice: Short. Easy to understand. Explains complicated topics in a user-friendly fashion. Has pictures.

--
I am not a crackpot.
Re:How to Lie with Statistics by Darrell Huff by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-13 09:49 · Score: 0

May as well add Toxic Sludge Is Good For You, then.

I nominate by shentino · 2014-01-01 15:16 · Score: 1

1984
Animal Farm

From a coder with a lit. degree by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 15:21 · Score: 0

The Bible
The Republic - Plato
The Brothers Karamazov - Fyodor Dostoevsky
Moby Dick - Herbert Melville
Leviathan - Thomas Hobbes
Beyond Good & Evil - Friedrich Nietzsche
The Illiad & The Odyssey - Homer
Democracy in America - Alexis de Tocqueville

More contemporary:

2666 - Roberto Bolano
Blood Meridian - Cormac McCarthy

My List (apologies if already mentioned) by Doctor_Jest · 2014-01-01 15:22 · Score: 1

Brave New World, Aldous Huxley
C.S. Lewis Space trilogy (Out of the Silent Planet, etc.)
Night, Eli Wiesel
On Anger, Seneca
The Road to Serfdom, Frederick Hayek
Free Speech for Me, but not for Thee, Nat Hentoff
Lawrence Lessig (Free Culture and any of his others.)
2001: A Space Odyssey (great movie too.) Arthur C. Clarke
The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich, William L. Shirer
Common Sense, Thomas Paine
Nostromo, Joseph Conrad
Moby Dick, Herman Melville

And anything by Philip K. Dick. The must-reads on him are well, most of his work.

--
It's the Stay-Puft Marshmallow Man.

I retired at age 45 - never read that book. by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 15:23 · Score: 0

I retired at age 45 - never read that book. No inheritance. Just hard work, living below my means and stock investing.

However, I did read _The Moon Is a Harsh Mistress_ and learned what TANSTAAFL means along with 15 other Heinlein books.

* The Bible - best way to create a smart atheist!
* The US Constitution - very quick read even with the amendments.
* Insert 3 favorite SciFi books.
* Insert 3 banned-in-school books.
* The Buddha - learn about a non-Christian/Jewish religion
* Insert 3 know-human-beings books. 80% of my success was due to other, nice, people. 20% was my hard work, diligence, and luck. Understanding and knowing how to work with others is a key aspect of being a kind, wise, human.

I cannot recommend the Koran. English translations have turned it into a group of phrases sorta like taglines from BBS email days, so much is lost in the translation. "There is no god but god ..." Huh? What? If it was meant to be a poem or song, then that might be ok. As a translation, it is meaningless. It could just as easily say "There is no shoe but shoe" A better translation is needed.

Re:I retired at age 45 - never read that book. by Maxo-Texas · 2014-01-01 15:32 · Score: 1

Living below my means was critical as well.
I really think the 250k house basically prevents you from retiring.

--
She was like chocolate when she drank... semi-sweet at first and then increasingly bitter.
Re:I retired at age 45 - never read that book. by ranton · 2014-01-01 17:22 · Score: 1

I really think the 250k house basically prevents you from retiring.
Living below your means is really important, but advice that uses actual numbers without context isn't very helpful. Where I live, $300k is just about as cheap as detached homes get in the best school districts. But you can also easily make $60k right out of college in STEM fields. Having a $300k house by your early 30s is very reasonable even if you are saving very well. And in my life quite a few of my biggest opportunities have come from the connections that came from rich neighbors that I wouldn't have had if I'd stayed in a $150k townhouse.

--
-- All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. -- Edmund Burke
Re:I retired at age 45 - never read that book. by Maxo-Texas · 2014-01-02 15:22 · Score: 1

True-- problem with a forum like this which could render communication useless unless you adjust for your circumstances.
Where I live in texas, the range was 100k for a 3/2 to 240k for a 4/3 with a den in a really nice neighborhood. And some neighbors and contact are probably more useful than others. My college and dnd buds were helpful. But to my fundamental point- being agreeable and respecting others opinions at work (even when they were not perfectly correct) was important to my success.
I knew smarter people who were argumentative who didn't do well as they could have. I know many people with great incomes who not only can't retire early but would be destroyed if they lost their job even for a few months. But they have dodge Vipers and 275k houses (now 350k houses).

--
She was like chocolate when she drank... semi-sweet at first and then increasingly bitter.

"1984" by George Orwell, which could be renamed "2 by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 15:25 · Score: 5, Interesting

"1984" by George Orwell, which could be renamed "2014"

Dolt.. by Doctor_Jest · 2014-01-01 15:26 · Score: 0

I know I shouldn't feed the trolls, but get bent. The tired, debilitating Keynesian crapola that is causing the western world to take a swirly down the tubes needs a counter-argument.

I notice you don't bother to put anything down as a counter-argument, so I'm going to assume AC that you're a Statist Progtard.

And what do we say to progtards? Get bent.

--
It's the Stay-Puft Marshmallow Man.

Re: Dolt.. by maest · 2014-01-01 17:49 · Score: 1

from von Mises, I'd go straight to Human Action.
Re:Dolt.. by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 00:34 · Score: 0

Pot, kettle, black? The Western world's been going to shit mostly due to crypto-libertarian influence over the past 30 years. Although I wouldn't expect anybody who uses a juvenile term like Progtard to contemplate why it is that the more the world turns into a paradise for selfish psychopaths, the worse things seem to get overall.

Re:goodbye slashdot by weilawei · 2014-01-01 15:27 · Score: 1

I think you should learn to use the filters, but you'd really be doing yourself a disservice. Anonymity is what allows people to post controversial opinions and hold debates on taboo subjects to the benefit of all. This may be a US-centric website, but we welcome all kinds. Not everyone shares your freedoms, or even agrees that you still have real freedom, when anonymity is a necessary cornerstore of free spech. More to the point, the fact that Slashdot is uncensored (in the sense that things are not removed wholesale unless they break the reading experience) is what promotes a culture where taboo ideas can be sanely discussed. Your proposal would cut Slashdot off at the knees, for the sake of being able to live in your own bubble.

Illusions by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 15:30 · Score: 0

By Richard Bach (of "Johnathan Livingston Seagull" fame). The story of the next messiah, who decides he doesn't want to be the next messiah, says "I Quit" and takes up barnstorming.

Notable quote: "Your only obligation in any lifetime is to be true to yourself"

The Authoritarians by WOOFYGOOFY · 2014-01-01 15:38 · Score: 2

The Authoritarians by Bob Altermeyer. A psychological researcher spends a lifetime following up the thread left by researchers like Stanley Milgram's (Obedience to Authority) and lays out once and for all the who, why and how of the authoritarian personality type.
They're always with us, but at this point in time in America, they're clearly at the helm so this is a very relevant - and riveting- book.

If you want to know why people who listen to Limbaugh and Hannity are the way they are and why they're never going to change and why reasoning and evidence is totally irrelevant to the 30% of Americans who fit this profile, then this does more than argue some likely hypothesis; it proves the author's point through the application of the scientific method . Fascinating just for the reveal of his methodology, to see how a scientist even approaches something as amorphous as "authoritarian personality type. This book actually changed my life.

And here it is for free:

http://home.cc.umanitoba.ca/~altemey/

My Suggestions by I_have_a_life · 2014-01-01 15:44 · Score: 1

1. Dante's Inferno - Probably the only classic that I actually re-read.
2. Guns Germs and Steel by Jared Diamond - This book has many answers about our history as a species.
3. The God Delusion by Richard Dawkins - Amazing well written and humorous.
4. The Lord of the Rings by JRR Tolkien - Everything you need to know about morality.
5. Dune by Frank Herbert - Is there a better sci-fi book?
6. Snow Crash by Neal Stephenson - Once you finish reading it you'll know where all that Matrix nonsense comes from.
7. The Hero With a Thousand Faces by Joseph Campbell - Pratically explains why Star Wars is a cultural phenomenon.
8. The Greatest Show on Earth by Richard Dawkins - A very readable book on evolution.
9. The Meditations of Marcus Aurelius - Because Hannibal Lecter said so!

On a more serious/on topic note by rickb928 · 2014-01-01 15:46 · Score: 1

The Hobbit
Grapes of Wrath
Raisin in the Sun
The Brothers Karamazov
Doctor Zhivago
Last of the Mohicans
A Separate Peace
I, Robot
Lord of the Flies
A Wrinkle in Time
The Chronicles of Narnia
A Tale of Two Cities
Catch-22
A Clockwork Orange
Hawaii
Some of these are intended to inspire interest in the author, others are just classics in their own right.

--
deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.

Afew of my Favorite by chrispatch · 2014-01-01 15:52 · Score: 1

Shogun
Stranger in a Strange Land
Lords of Discipline
The Hobbit
the Lord of the Rings trilogy
The Great Escape
All Quiet on the Western Front

Just a few that spring to mind , obviously.

Re: some good ones. (for the child) by eyenot · 2014-01-01 15:56 · Score: 1

I forgot you mentioned a child.

Tales From the Thousand and One Arabian Nights. Penguin Classics. There are two editions of this book that I've handled. One is a single tome, which I received when I was 8 and proceeded to never forget. The other I gifted to my two brothers when they were 9 and 10, and it was a 2-volume version, a celebratory version if I recall, limited edition. If the whole house is going to be reading, you might want the 2-volume version (it's expanded, not just split in two) because once the kid starts talking about how great the stories are you'll want to put down what you're reading. The adult themes are not spared. Sometimes the stories involve lewd sexuality.

"Where Did I Come From?" It's always good to have The Talk. But after you do, it's good to have a reference around for the kid to read. This one works. It's illustrated, frank, and honest. Moreover, it's short and to the point and doesn't try to fill the kid's head with things. My parents also kept around a copy of "The Joy of Sex" and didn't seem to care if I read it. So maybe get both of those and keep "The Joy" on the parents' bookshelf.

A book on the history of magic tricks. The biggest, thickest, oldest tome you can get covering the greatest span of history possible. My parents had a couple of these. If the book has an illustration of an old Arab in a turban carrying a secret water tank on his back with a tube running down his sleeve, you got the right one.

A book on monsters. The actual kind. Human history is full of "monsters". Pieced-together mermaids. Tales of creatures with fins parading across the countryside in 15th century France. There are some old tomes on this history as well.

"The Secret Teachings of All Ages". Manly P. Hall. 1928. This is written simply enough for an 8 year old with an avid reading habit. The pseudo scientific claims made here and there within should be balanced by a decent book on modern geometry and math and a book on the sciences.

I recommend something similar to "The Giant Golden Book of Mathematics". More or less everything is inside of it, even calculus. It's all very well illustrated. Copies are hard to come by. There are some other books sort of like this that treat math as a serious subject for children, but not many. A quick perusal of "math books for children" on the web turns up countless impetuous results.

There are numerous books on "the way things work" by David Macaulay. Etc.

--
"Stratigraphically the origin of agriculture and thermonuclear destruction will appear essentially simultaneous" -- Lee

Top-Of-My-Head-Ten by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 15:56 · Score: 0

The Foundation series by Isaac Asimov (if you read any one series, ever in your life, and care anything for the future of conscious entities in the universe, you should to read this)
The Man Who Planted Trees (L'homme qui plantait des arbres) by Jean Giono (being a decent being)
Gödel, Escher, Bach by Douglas Hofstadter (mind. blown. repeat until englightenment.)
Stranger in a Strange Land by Robert Heinlein (instructional manual for being a decent being)
The Moon is a Harsh Mistress by Robert Heinlein (instructional manual, but not in the sense of the previous item)
The Giver by Lois Lowry (and there's an adult takeoff on that, but I can't for the life of me recall the name)
Cryptonomicon by Neal Stephenson (if you're a hacker--and you haven't read this--you're stunting yourself)
A Fire Upon The Deep by Vernor Vinge (plenty to chew on)
House of Leaves by Mark Z. Danielewski (read it while listening to the album Haunted by his sister, Poe (AKA Annie Danielewski))
Northern Bushcraft by Mors Kochanski (The more you know, the less you carry)

Whose resolution is it? by zippthorne · 2014-01-01 15:59 · Score: 1, Insightful

Hang on. Your new year's resolution is to tell other people to do something that you believe will improve their lives?

--
Can you be Even More Awesome?!

Cryptonomicon is extremely boring by gweihir · 2014-01-01 16:07 · Score: 1

Maybe when I am 80 or or so, I will try to tackle it again but please do not recommend that one. It may make people think that Stephenson is a bad author, whih is not true in general.

--
Most ACs are not even worth the keystrokes to insult them. Be generically insulted by this and ignored otherwise.

At least one Fitzgerald novel by Rob+the+Bold · 2014-01-01 16:20 · Score: 1

I'd suggest reading at least one F. Scott Fitzgerald novel. The Great Gatsby is the most popular and certainly an easy read -- if you're a reasonably fast reader, you can knock it out after lunch on a public holiday and be done by supper. This Side of Paradise is very good too, but should preferably be read for the first time before the reader is in their mid twenties. Once you're an English teacher, it's too late.

But seriously, tell your young ones not to wait till they're old to read Fitzgerald. And if they like him, he's got a metric assload of short stories to fill those idle times between leap years.

--
I am not a crackpot.

Some of my favorites by mikein08 · 2014-01-01 16:22 · Score: 1

Edward Abbey - Desert Solitaire Ken Follett - The Pillars of the Earth Ayn Rand - Atlas Shrugged (I know, the (il)liberals here have no concept of what the woman is trying to get across, which does not surprise me, but it truly describes the situation into which we are ever more rapidly descending).

Reoccurring Asks by Jakeula · 2014-01-01 16:25 · Score: 1

I feel like this is another Ask Slashdot that has been reworded and recycled a few times. I stand by my previous response to the question: Think and Grow Rich. It's a helpful guide to becoming a positive, productive, and relatively happy person. Many books listed above are also great so mine is just an addition to the suggestions above.

Can't believe nobody's mentioned Cormac McCarthy? by CCTalbert · 2014-01-01 16:29 · Score: 1

No where near SciFi or Fantasy, which seems to be the bread and butter of most /. folks, but... I think he's an amazing writer. His writing is dense and rich with old terms and phrases that have disappeared. His characters are coarse, gritty and flawed, and they speak and act like real people and not people in books (albeit exceptional people). The stories are sometimes just plain painful (but good).

"Blood Meridian" gives you characters that are just despicable and evil, but fascinating. "The Road" is post-apocalypse, which ought to suit a lot of /. folks. If you liked the movie version of "No Country for Old Men" as is usually the case the book is better. I'm afraid his "Border Trilogy" has made me never want to visit Mexico.

What a quesion, to pick just a few of the many by Trax3001BBS · 2014-01-01 16:32 · Score: 1

ARMOR by John Steakley but only half way through.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armor_(novel)

It's an amazing book it grabbed me like a Stargate brain sucker.
Just non stop action and it kept going and going - very good read till just over half
way, then book takes care of business, who these people were what we are
to them, all the filler of the first half is poured on the second Everybody I've
loaned the book to agrees as well, yet all of us have finished it just in case a bit of the
first makes a comeback.

I'm serious if the entire book kept up what he had at the start it would of been unblevable.

the "Heechee" Saga by Frederik Pohl was another good read, the first of the series I got fer free
from the library (my pushers at the time) the book was being tossed out by the library so I picked it up
still in it's sleve and showed many years behing it. I still think about the people in the ships that have returned in
about two weeks with a great find "becoming one of them", or just as easly still be watching the wall, waiting to
see the half way mark.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gateway_(novel)

Lord of the rings, and the Conan series are a few of the many that have left a mark on me

TI-89 Manual by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 16:37 · Score: 0

If you understand every operation this device does and how to do it, the world is your oyster!

Re:TI-89 Manual by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 16:49 · Score: 0

Then, read the manual for a sinclair ZX-81 and you are done!

Just google "Banned Book List" by Wycliffe · 2014-01-01 16:51 · Score: 4, Interesting

Notice how several of the above books have been banned at one point or another?
If you want a decent list of "must read" books a good starting point is to just read all the books
that have been banned at one point or another. By definition controversial books are a great
source of views "contrary" to the norm and are generally written in a way that opens your mind
and make you think otherwise there would have been no reason to ban them.

Re:Just google "Banned Book List" by packrat2 · 2014-01-02 00:52 · Score: 1

the most popular are also the most complained about.
think of housewives setting up lynchmobs as a hobby...
the joy-de-jeur (vie) of a nice simple 3 min hate.
packrat

--
packrat ; writer-informer. http://packrat.comicgenesis.com http://www.youtube.com/area163 https://www.smashwords.com/

Re:"1984" by George Orwell, which could be renamed by smash · 2014-01-01 16:53 · Score: 1

Bumping parent up: "1984" By George Orwell, I'll also add "A Brief History of Time" by Stephen Hawking.

--
I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.

Medicine does NOT have to taste bad... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 17:10 · Score: 0

Some of the recommendations I've seen above look like they are based on what "Good Literature" is supposed to be. Ick.

First, anyone who has not read The Phantom Tollboth by Norton Jester (or had it read to them, if they are not able to read it for themselves) really should do so. Don't skip this book just because it is accessible to folks approximately 10 years old, it is great fun and has insights that should satisfy anyone looking to be "enriched" by reading.

While we're still on books accessible to most people, do not overlook Terry Prachett's series about Tiffany Aching, beginning with Wee Free Men. Yes, the protaginst is a pre-teen girl - get over it. She's a great character, and besides, she is aided and abetted on her journey by the Nac Mac Feegles, and these guys could easily hold their own with the toughest NFL fans, anywhere. For one thing, they believe they are already dead and that this is the afterlife, much like the one promised to Norse warriors who died in battle. If you find Pratchett at all readable, check out the Disk World books, particularly Hogfather, which would have made a very timely read just >before Christmas rather than after. Pratchett is a master of gentle satire, and if you don't find Hogfather readable, at least read that last bit, a few pages from the end. You'll know it when you see it.

If you are interested in travel, try The Innocents Abroad (Mark Twain, available at http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/3176). My wife and I just visited Italy, and I read the parts describing places we were visiting - his observations are very on target, and I had forgotten how sarcastic he can be when he is being derisive. Wow. He is also a very acute observer of human nature, and does not exempt his own motives and actions from comment.

For great science fiction, try Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep (no, having watched Blade Runner does not count - they left far more of that book out than they left in) or Ubik by Philip K. Dick. Yes, Dick turned out his novels quickly, and is sometimes accused of being a hack. But his universes are very intriguing, and don't fall apart two days later...

OK, now for an author who probably doesn't offer very much in the way of opportunities for advancement. But if you like comedy, and are willing to follow closely, you really should try something by PG Wodehouse. He is a master of the "nothing wasted" school of comic plotting. In a typical book, you will meet approximately a dozen characters in the first chapter (possibly two), who he then mixes and matches in unexpected ways following a story that is likely to keep you guessing all the way to the end. Don't expect the fate of the world to be hanging in the balance, more often it is the fate of a relationship between two people, but his books are great fun. Perhaps Something New (http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/2042)?

Happy hunting!

Lead minds to answers, but don't make them think. by VortexCortex · 2014-01-01 17:18 · Score: 1

God & Golem, Inc.
A Comment on Certain Points where Cybernetics Impinges on Religion
- Norbert Wiener

Specifically because there are ethical lessons in there you apparently haven't learned.

Replay by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 17:19 · Score: 0

Replay by Ken Grimwood. I try to re-read it every year

A Dumas by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 17:21 · Score: 0

The Count of Monte Cristo entertains and teaches.

Re:disappointing list by Lord+Kano · 2014-01-01 17:25 · Score: 1

The Ender series was a lot deeper than you're giving it credit for.

LK

--
"Hi. This is my friend, Jack Shit, and you don't know him." - Lord Kano

Anna Karenina by enter+to+exit · 2014-01-01 17:38 · Score: 1

Anna Karenina is easily the best book I've read. It's fairly dense though. The book is the epitome of realist fiction (basically the characters sweat if it's hot) and on each reading you get something different from it.

Tolstoy was an interesting and thoughtful man and wrote a lot of good stuff.

Also, on a side note, don't read if you don't enjoy it. There's nothing particularly beneficial about reading. Historically literacy was a sign of education and the association has remained. Reading is a very slow activity and requires full attention - If you can extract a story or info from another (more forgiving) medium, why not?

philosophy for the teenagers... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 17:40 · Score: 0

In conquest of abundance - paul feyerabend

Tuning books by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 17:42 · Score: 0

I lived in a communist country and I never heard of burning books that you speak of. That's what facists and churches do.

Reading is not believing by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 17:44 · Score: 0

Sure you can't make people believe anything but that does not mean that exposing them to the ideas is useless. Demon Haunted World is no 1 on the list that should be read if we don't want a world full of unscientific magical thinking morons.

William Faulkner Meets Clark Gable by Venner · 2014-01-01 17:47 · Score: 1

I'm a huge fan of classic film, and one of my favorite anecdotes is a conversation related by director Howard Hawks between William Faulkner and Clark Gable in the director's car as he invited both men along on a hunting trip.

Despite being famous in their respective fields, the two men had never met each other. Moreover, Faulkner didn't watch movies and Gable didn't read. As the conversation in the car went on, it got on to the topic of literature. After listening a while, Gable asked Faulkner the best authors to seek out if one wanted to be well read.

Faulkner responded, "Oh, Thomas Man, Willa Cather, Ernest Hemingway, John Dos Passos, and myself of course."

"Oh," ask Gable, "do you write Mr. Faulkner?"

"Why yes, Mr. Gable," replied Faulkner. "And what do you do?"

--
A preposition is a terrible thing to end a sentence with.

Instead of The Bible... by NotPeteMcCabe · 2014-01-01 17:50 · Score: 1

Asimov's Guide to the Bible. That way you'll get all of the bible stories that are so useful in understanding and interpreting much English literature, but you'll get them in a more useful historical context.

required reading for humanity by Mr.+Slippery · 2014-01-01 17:51 · Score: 1

I'll skip the SF and tech and famous literature, since they're sure to be represented elsewhere in this thread, and give a few from the remainder of my required reading list for humanity:

The World's Religions, Huston Smith. (Originally published as The Religions of Man, the original is not as complete but if you find a cheap copy in a used bookstore grab it.) Whether you're a Xian or an atheist or whatever, you're going to have to eventually deal with people from other religions, and this is an excellent orientation as to what the world's major faiths are about.

The Book: on the Taboo Against Knowing Who You Are, Alan Watts. There are some other books by Watts that I personally like better, but this is a good introduction to some of the concepts of Eastern philosophy.

Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance, Robert Pirsig. Anyone who works with technology ought to read this.

The Cartoon History of the Universe and The Cartoon History of the United States, Larry Gonick. Gonick really hits the sweet spot, giving you an overview of history that's lighthearted and breezy while still informative. Also his The Cartoon Guide to Sex is a book I would give to teens and young adults.

Chocolate to Morphine, Andrew Weil & Winifred Rosen. It's targeted at high school kids, but this is a book everyone should read to understand why people use drugs and why drug prohibition is doomed to failure.

Also, in my completely biased opinion everyone should read this. :-)

--
Tom Swiss | the infamous tms | my blog
You cannot wash away blood with blood

Flatland. by jafac · 2014-01-01 17:52 · Score: 1

Seriously. This book did more to change my perspective and views on life than any other book I could name. (though, I will say that The Hobbit is what single-handedly made a lifelong backpacker and hiker out of me).

--

These are my friends, See how they glisten. See this one shine, how he smiles in the light.

Great Western Literature by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 18:08 · Score: 0

Here is a list of 5 books that shaped western civilization. You can probably download these for free from Kindle or Google books. Enjoy!
Republic by Plato
Paradise Lost by John Milton
Enchiridion by Epictetus
Nicomachean Ethics by Aristotle
Divine Comedy by Dante

Mahabharata by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 18:09 · Score: 0

If you have time and patience. Mind you this is not exactly a holy book like Bible, it is a story of kings fighting for the throne. Sorry for my english

http://www.holybooks.com/mahabharata-all-volumes-in-12-pdf-files/

God, no. by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 18:38 · Score: 0

You've said too much already.

Try this on for size: by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 18:54 · Score: 0

Before I give my list, everybody should watch Thug Notes.
Its like spark's note's summary and analysis, but gangster.
The summary is hilarious and the analysis is SPOT ON,
actually quite brilliant. He's got quite a great list reads so far:

Thug Notes

As for my list:
Breakfast of Champions
Lolita
Catch-22
Sirens of Titan
The Sun Also Rises
The Great Gatsby
Slaughterhouse 5
Crime and Punishment
Notes from Underground
The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy
The Princess Bride
1984
Anna Karenina
The Death of Ivan Ilyich
Candide
Don Quixote
I could go on player

And BTW, reading literary fiction (not bullshit fiction or nonfiction) has been shown to help your brain and empathetic abilities:
For Better Social Skills, Read a Little Chekhov

and storytelling is one of the most effective forms of communication:
The Neurocience of Storytelling

Better yet: A beginner's guide to the Bible by MikeTheGreat · 2014-01-01 18:56 · Score: 1

As someone who's tried this I'm going to say that I'd actually recommend reading something that explains the Bible (either concurrently, before, or even instead). Especially if you haven't read a Bible before. Not only are many passages opaque but the writing style is incredibly concise by modern standards. Not to mention the thousands of years of history since it was written. Having something that will help demystify what each passage means really helps open up the Bible.

Think of it this way - you wouldn't try Emacs / Vim for the first time by digging into source code, instead you'd find a 'tutorial for beginners' Digging into a Bible (not matter which version you choose to read) is way, way more complicated than Emacs or Vim. Smart people have dedicated their lives to understanding it, and some of them have have written orientations for beginners - go read one of those!

Three bookw worth reading by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 19:01 · Score: 0

Three books that are a must:
Fast Food Nation - Eric Schlosser's monumental work on the fast food industry. A once-in-a-lifetime book.
The Shock Doctrine - Naomi Klein. Anyone who is interested in politics should read this. It is again, a book that in uniqe.
SHAM - How the Self-Help Movement Made America Helpless - a great book about the self-help culture that paralyses the US. Authored by Steven Solarno

Sagan's Demon-Haunted World by coder111 · 2014-01-01 19:21 · Score: 4, Insightful

Before you start reading anything, do read Sagan's Demon-Haunted World first. It's a good introduction into telling lies and bullshit apart from stuff you can believe. I think scepticism and logic and scientific method are very lacking from today's education and peoples minds. This book takes a small step in fixing that.

As for other books worth reading- other comments have plenty of good suggestions.

--Coder

Re:Sagan's Demon-Haunted World by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 06:44 · Score: 0

It's called critical thinking
Re:Sagan's Demon-Haunted World by bearvarine · 2014-01-08 12:32 · Score: 1

Demon-Haunted World is a very good recommendation. To that, I would add: Man's Search for Meaning - Viktor Frankl (a Nazi prison camp survivor)

War and Peace, Anathem, The Black Book, etc. by cowtamer · 2014-01-01 19:21 · Score: 1

Here are my favorites, if you're not stuck on a single Genre:

War and Peace: This one is a classic for a reason. Very clear and vivid descriptions, covers politics, philosophy, and even a bit of science and math if you read carefully enough :). Notable, of course, for its very well developed characters. NOT dull at all, despite the formidable length.

Anathem: Stephenson's best work so far. I like it for the same reasons I liked War and Peace (see above)

Snow Crash and The Diamond Age:
Two far-fetched futures from Neal Stephenson -- full of inspiring ideas and a bit of humor.

The Black Book (Orhan Pamuk)
I love this book for the atmosphere it creates as well as the exploration of the themes of identity (both individual and cultural), East vs West, etc. Orphan Pamuk won the Nobel prize in literature recently.

The Ringworld; Integral Trees; Building Harlequin's Moon (Larry Niven & collaborators)

These books are worth reading for the ideas and the world-building.

Glory Season (David Brin)

Brin is like a Larry Niven who can write beautiful prose. The book is indescribable -- also good for trolling your feminist friends (it takes place in a female dominated society and pokes fun of current stereotypes)

Brave New World (Huxley)

A past dystopia that will be eerily familiar.

East of Eden (John Steinbeck)

Read this if you enjoy epic cross generational tales and insights into human nature. I wish I had read this book 4 years earlier than I actually did.

Travels with Charlie (John Steinbeck)

Very insightful travel diary

My List by vikingpower · 2014-01-01 19:34 · Score: 1

1) Homer, the Odyssey - arguably the greatest work of fiction ever made by man, and one of the cornerstones of western literature.

2) The Peloponnesean War, Thucydides - the first time in history a human thinks loud about politics and human motivations to act; also, deep insight into political stupidity leading to catastrophic state failure.

3) The collected poems of John Keats - to get an idea of what one can really do with the english language.

4) The Hyperion Cantos, by Dan Simmons - all of the former provide deep and not-so-deep background for these 4 magnificent sci-fi novels.

--
Religous speak to God. Insane are spoken to by God. When all shut up, one can finally hear Shostakovich in peace

Current events... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 19:50 · Score: 0

'Another Nineteen'

My Faves by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 20:08 · Score: 0

"Notes from the Underground" - Fyodor Dostoyevsky
"Cather in the Rye" - J.D. Salinger
"9 stories" and particularly "Teddy" - J.D. Salinger
"Candide" - Voltaire
"Dead Souls" - Nikolai Gogol -> this book provided an expertly articulated picture of those crazy Russians
"Zurich Axioms" - Max Gunther -> Excellently crafted book on investing.

translation of the holy quran by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 20:12 · Score: 0

... the Book that changed lives of millions of people ... and is still doing so ...

top 3430 sci fic books by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 20:18 · Score: 0

Top 3430 science fiction or fantasy books , as voted by USENET.
pseudopodium.com/HellsBibliophiles/top100ftp.txt

Top 1,000,876 books freely available on the web onlinebooks.library.upenn.edu

great reads by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 20:22 · Score: 0

Capitalism & Freedom by Milton Friedman is a life changing book, not a light read though
would also recommend Keynes' general theory of employment, interest & money

GEB by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 20:22 · Score: 0

By hofstadter, I concur. GEB

Nobel prize site
Pulitzer prize site

No standard lists which are informed mostly based on what others also said, plus it is history, not will (i.e. new things are added by will and old things are there without the lists being maintained mostly). So, prize sites

Surely You're Joking, Mr. Feynman by goldcd · 2014-01-01 20:26 · Score: 1

God is Not Great
If this is a Man

Books that affect the way you view the world by davesag · 2014-01-01 20:34 · Score: 2

Here's a short list of 32 book's I've read that really affected how I look at the world (with links to Goodreads):

0) The Dancers at the End of Time Trilogy by Michael Moorcock - A literary dandy of a series. Short, sweet, funny and eternally optimistic. Stays with you.
1) The Illuminatus! Trilogy By Robert Shae and Robert Anton Wilson. - Truly hilarious - the literary equivalent of taking LSD. Once you've read it you'll never see the world in the same way again. This book invented the Illuminati conspiracy myth as we know it today.
2, 3, 4, 5) Hyperion / The Fall of Hyperion / Endymion, The Rise of Endymion by Dan Simmons - Heavy, difficult, big-idea science fiction / space opera set in a deeply religious future. The end made me cry. (Also check out Drood by Simmons. It's creepy and great.)
6) Solaris by Stanislaw Lem - a moving and beautiful critique of the scientific process - also made me cry. (read any Lem you come across, it's all great)
7) Gravity's Rainbow by Thomas Pynchon- a monster of a book - took me 3 years to read - but worth every bit of it. Affects how you perceive the world. (Also worth reading the companion so you can see what you missed the first time around)
8) Accelerando by Charles Stross - Truly a book for our times. Read any Stross, it's all pretty good.
9) The Master and Margarita by Mikhail Bulgakov - funny, trippy satire of the soviet era and religion.
10) The Sacred Book of the Werewolf - Funny, especially if you've read The Master and Margarita by Bulgakov but ultimately this is a book about the nature of perception and reality.
11, 12, 13) American Tabloid / The Cold Six Thousand / Blood's a Rover - James Ellroy. - Shocking, funny, tense, amazing. You'll never look at US politics in the same way again. Very few sentences longer than about 4 sentences unless it's dialogue, newspaper extracts or wiretap transcripts.
14, 15, 16) The Baroque Cycle by Neil Stephenson - Terrific fun nerd core historical adventure that reveals the history of money and science. Then go read all of Stephenson's other books, especially Cryptonomicon, Snow Crash, The Diamond Age and Anathem.
17) The Gulag Archipelago by Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn - scary because it's true and increasingly relevant. You'll look twice at train carriages after reading this.
18) Any / all of the Culture books by Iain M Banks, but especially Surface Detail.
19 and 20) The Commonwealth Saga by Peter F Hamilton - pure fun space opera.
21)

--
I used to have a better sig than this, but I got tired of it

Re:Books that affect the way you view the world by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 13:50 · Score: 0

Thanks for this list. You have a lot of books that I love so I'm going to try out all the rest.

My list by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 20:55 · Score: 0

Here's my must-read list:

The stranger (Camus)
The plague (Camus)
Ad nauseam (Sartre)
The process (Kafka)
The castle (Kafka)
1984 (Orwell)
Brave new world (Huxley)
The picture of Dorian Gray (Wilde)
The alchemist (Coelho)
Against the grain (Huysmans)

My list in order by mynamestolen · 2014-01-01 21:01 · Score: 1

1. Howard K Bloom, The Lucifer Principle: A Scientific Expedition Into The Forces of History. Says "evil" doesn't exist. Shows the biological basis of "evil" and how societies work.

2. Flowers for Algernon 1966 novel by Daniel Keyes. (was banned for a while by morons. I learnt about it on slashdot)

3. The Inheritors by William Golding (author of Lord of the Flies) is an imaginative reconstruction of the life of a band of Neanderthals as they meet Homo sapiens

4. Bone People, by Keri Hulme

5. Eric Hobsbawm - Labouring Men, – brilliant series of little essays on topics of English working class history

6. Moby Dick by Herman Melville is vastly underrated. Melville is brilliant. His imitations of Shakepearean language are outstanding

7. Middlemarch by George Eliot

8. Rohinton Mistry, Fine Balance (1995)

9. The Hare with Amber Eyes by Edmund de Waal.

--
work in progress

My top 10 list, altering fiction and non-fiction by Kilobug · 2014-01-01 21:08 · Score: 1

1. Foundation - Isaac Asimov (well, the whole Foundation cycle) - the best scifi cycle of all times (that is a purely objective statement, right ?)
2. Gödel, Escher, Bach : an Eternal Golden Braid - Douglas Hofstadter - clever, insightful and amazing book on AI, nature of consciousness, mathematical structures and art
3. Dune - Frank Herbet - another breathtaking scifi cycle
4. A Brief History of Time - Stephen Hawking - nice introduction to how the universe work.
5. Ringworld - Larry Niven - some glimpse at our possible future : massive scale engineering
6. The Selfish Gene - Richard Dawkins - nice introduction to genetics and how selfishness at gene level can lead to altruism at people's level
7. Permutation City - Greg Egan - another glimpse at another possible future : mind upload
8. The End of Time - Julian Barbour - controversial, radical but interesting proposal : and if time itself was just an illusion ?
9. Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality - Eliezer Yudkowsky - hilarious and enlightening fanfiction about "what if Harry was a math/science genius when he entered Hogwarts"
10. Modern Operating Systems - Andrew Tanenbaum - to understand how your computer really works

(Note : I could have added some political books, but not wanting to start a flamewar I didn't)

Fine list by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 21:20 · Score: 0

Except for the bible, which is a terrible read - an arcane old mixture of various tribal writings.

My main takeaway from Atlas Shrugged by fegu · 2014-01-01 21:27 · Score: 1

Everyone should at least read Franciscos speech on money, from Atlas Shrugged. I remember it being an eye-opener, even though I must agree that much of the rest of the book is far fetched. I googled it and found this one (no affiliation): http://www.working-minds.com/money.htm

People with an all-consuming interest in something - and strong ideals - could also read the prequel, The Fountainhead. If nothing else you will gain knowing nods and instant respect from the cultural elite for answering Howard Roark when asked about your favourite architect. Works for me.

--
"There is no substitute for thinking" - Bjarne Stroustrup

My Two Cents by Niterios · 2014-01-01 21:34 · Score: 1

I try to add new ones that have probably not been mentioned: The Gospel According to Jesus Christ by José Saramago (Portuguese Literature Nobel Laureate). Brings a brilliant insight of the events surrounding the establishment of Christianity by Jesus. It is not precisely something I would recommend to absolutely everyone, but certainly everyone that is/was christian. One Hundred Years of Solitude by García Márquez or any of his novels or collections of short stories. I do not think any of García Márquez's books have taught me extremely deep life lessons, but I still think everyone should read some of his books just to experience his amazing storytelling. Additionally, I think his books can be useful to more deeply understand Latin American culture, so García Márquez is a must read for anyone interested in Latin America. Don Quixote by Miguel de Cervantes. Don Quixote's ridiculous lifestyle makes this novel a really fun read. Nevertheless, I think its deepest value comes from the theme of fiction versus reality that the novel discusses. I think that all the content that has been created using this theme makes Don Quixote a valuable read.

Quran by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 21:50 · Score: 0

Read with an open mind.

Re: Bible by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 22:02 · Score: 0

You won't understand the Bible just by reading some translation of it. Firstly, there are huge cultural and linguistic differences between us and the people who wrote it. Secondly, you will have been exposed to a lot of misinformation that will tend to make you misunderstand it. So I'd recommend reading some good books about the Bible instead. There are thousands of good books about the Bible. Unfortunately there are also millions of bad books about it.

I'll suggest Focoult's Pendulum by dbIII · 2014-01-01 22:08 · Score: 1

I'll suggest Focoult's Pendulum - because I feel like being an utter bastard.
A lot of it is like reading a very long collection of lists of conspiracy theories and the you finally get to the action and the very bad pun on the last two pages. Most of the book is just the setup for the bad pun. It's as if it was written for a bet and I doubt a lesser author could keep anyone reading such a thing for more than ten pages.

My suggestions by jonwil · 2014-01-01 22:22 · Score: 1

Liars and Outliers - Bruce Schneier (even more relavent with the whole NSA thing and the fact that every new Snowden revelation gives us another reason not to put our trust in computer security or the people who created it)

There was an excellent book by Leo Laporte that was perfect reading for anyone who doesn't know a lot about computers (or thinks they know a lot more than they actually do) but I cant remember the title and its likely out-of-date anyway.

In terms of fiction, Cryptonomicon is a great read, as are the William Gibson cyberspace novels (Neuromancer, Count Zero and Mona Lisa Overdrive)

Its not a book but if there was a book along the lines of the film Elysium it would be worth a read as it seems to be very much where earth is headed (a bunch of rich people with everything handed to them and access to the best of everything including medical care and a much larger bunch of poor people with little access to medical care and working as wage slaves for "the man"). Recommendations of any books along those lines very much appreciated :)

Not a sex book by hooiberg · 2014-01-01 22:30 · Score: 1

Perhaps you are aware that the kama sutra is mainly a guide on how men and women should live together and how their roles in a marriage should be. Only a minor (although admittedly popular) part considers bed sport.

books to read by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 22:30 · Score: 0

The Prince. Machiavelli
Reamde, Neal Stephenson
A Brief History of Time, Hawking
Shakespeare, all of it, sonnets, plays etc.
Douglas Rushkoff, he has a number of books ranging on different subjects, but Nothing Sacred is a good start, especially if you are being recommended books like the bible
Douglas Adams
The Hobbit and Lord of the Rings
Slaughterhouse 5,
The Alchemist
Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance
The Little Prince
The Art of War
Jonathan Livingston Seagull

Tom Robbins by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 22:36 · Score: 0

Fierce invalids away from home in hot climates.

A must read for those of us striving to be fun well rounded people. But way more importantly its hilarious and beautifully written

Re: Tom Robbins by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 05:38 · Score: 0

Ah... any tom robbins ... but especially Skinny Legs and All as well as Jitterbug Purfume ( longevity and love and, of course, a red-headed waitress)

strange question.. no right answer. by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 23:29 · Score: 0

We could start by asking the question, should everyone read? Or even: why do we read?

Reading something means you're listening to a monologue from another person.

What should the requirement be of the content of that monologue so that it behooves that everyone should read it?

Should it improve our basic ability to survive ? man, solitary, away from society is dangerously close to extinction without the proper means to protect himself from the environment and knowing how to harvest food from it. Do we expect to always live within a society that coddles our every need?

Should it improve our ability to work together? The benefits we get from specialization and other forms of co-operation far outweigh the problems

Should it give us the basic facts about our world? Knowing what the world is, and how it has come to be is beneficial, but will knowing some simple never-changing facts be better than knowing a system of thought?

Should it give us a prism of thought to view all problems through in an effort to solve them? With a hammer, all problems will look like nails, can that still be effective given the right hammer?

- The question is inherently leading, it is pro-society and hints at "if everyone knew this, we would all benefit" - I've seen a few moral stories being posted, but inherently they won't ask you to think of the big question. What is human co-operation, how does it benefit the masses, and how can I use it to my advantage.

The only book I'd recommend is "Cosmos" by Carl Sagan. Otherwise I'd recommend all documentaries by David Attenborough, it is the only way to free you from the boundaries of human society and look at all the other solutions other species have found to interact.

None by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-01 23:31 · Score: 0

There is not a single book that everyone should read.

Thousands of random answers no consensus by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 00:12 · Score: 0

A thread like this just has thousands of random answers and no consensus - you could go to Barnes and Noble and look at the shelves and get basically the same answer. I don't know what this accomplishes, other than filler for the slow holiday period. (I think this question is asked every year or two.)

I'd throw out Shelby Foote's history of the American Civil War just because he is one of the best writers ever. He makes history engrossing. But that's just another random answer. You have to start with a person's interests, and work from there. I'd never read Ayn Rand because I just don't care about political philosophy. If I did care, I'd read something shorter.

My tuppence worth.... by Enter+the+Shoggoth · 2014-01-02 00:15 · Score: 1

the one book that I suspect no one else will mention but everyone aught to read is John Ralston Sauls's Voltaire's Bastards

--
Andy Warhol got it right / Everybody gets the limelight
Andy Warhol got it wrong / Fifteen minutes is too long.

Re:Atlas Shrugged by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 00:25 · Score: 0

Whether or not you agree with her 'philosophy' Ayn Rand has got to be the worst 'name' published writer in terms of her inability to develop characters, capture believeable dialogue, or allow the reader to work anything out for themselves. Instead she hammers her (blindingly obvious) point home again and again and again. Reading one of her books is like being locked in a small room with a three year old using a jackhammer. I wouldn't wish her books on my worst enemy. Your experience may differ, but I would never want to need to rely in any way on anyone who rated her writing

The Art of Computer Programming by kenlevasseur · 2014-01-02 00:30 · Score: 1

I haven't seen this mentioned. I'm a math prof, but taught data structures in the 80's using Knuth vol 1&3. I don't think I've ever seen a text since that I liked better ( even my own). Over the years I've enjoyed just browsing the three print volumes and the recent online stuff.

My website by Rolgar · 2014-01-02 01:10 · Score: 1

I've created a website about the books I plan on making available to my children. It's called Fanatics4Classics. The book covers are affiliate links to Amazon 1) because hopefully it will support the site and 2) I like to read Amazon reviews for books, and hopefully others will find them useful as well 3) Amazon has covers for most books, and using their bandwidth is free.

I have an index (linked) of the best 800 fiction, philosophy & books about government and a huge history selection from Gutenberg (and torrents to download all of those books in either epub or mobi (for Kindle)).

The Amazon links include all of the Gutenberg books except the history (for those who like printed books or want to view the reviews) as well as another thousand books from the 20th century that are still under copyright. All of them are organized by reading level and genre.

The site is not completed yet. I'm planning on linking to the best works of Science and other areas of study, a much more extensive list of more modern history (because the our ability to research history is much better now), and links to other sites my wife finds useful in homeschooling our kids.

I'm doing this because my wife and I like the Thomas Jefferson Education model which promotes reading classics as a key component of education, and while they have a good selection of books on their site, I felt it was incomplete. Anyway, browse around, find something interesting, and read a book.

Guns, Germs and Steel by clay_shooter · 2014-01-02 01:21 · Score: 1

Guns, Germs, and Steel: The Fates of Human Societies by Jared Diamond,

My suggestion by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 01:21 · Score: 0

The three Brothers Karamazov, War and Peace, Journey to Arcturus, any of the top Russian authors,
In the Spirit of Crazy Horse, Lame Deer; Seeker of Visions. Anything by Sherman Alexie, God is Red, On the Better Way to Catch a Snake.

What to read by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 01:23 · Score: 0

I try and read as much as possible, my main source of books is charity shops (thrift stores); of course there is a lot of dross there, but picking out quality stuff leads to a variety in what I read and it's cheap to boot.

hyperion (cantos) and thawn by nachtkap · 2014-01-02 01:40 · Score: 1

Dan Simmons - Hyperion (Cantos)
At least the 1st novel is like a kick in the stomach at times. It also moved me to tears on a level I would thought impossible. Includes: Spiked killing machine, Poetry, evil AI's and a Scifi world/society that feels way more believable then Star Trek/Wars ever was.

Timothy Zahn - (1st) Thawn Trilogy
It is hard not to like these books if you like Star Wars IMO.

Imaginary Friend - The Bible
Most of it can be skipped but select parts like Genesis and the Sodom and Gomorrah bit should be read. Cant imagine that there isn't a list for that.

My "short" list consists of the best known books of these people: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Nobel_laureates_in_Literature. Names like Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn, Ernest Hemingway, Hermann Hesse and Bertrand Russell speak for themselfs.
I have only read very limited passages from those authors. That glimpse convinced me however that their works must provide the best access to differing points of view possible.

One Day in the Life of Ivan Denisovich by spoot · 2014-01-02 01:52 · Score: 1

One Day in the Life of Ivan Denisovich | Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

here's the pdf --> http://www.mrebookclub.com/book/One_Day_in_the_Life_of_Ivan_Denisovich.pdf

Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance by jacerie · 2014-01-02 01:56 · Score: 1

Amazing book that can have a dramatic effect on the way you view life. Reading it requires patience as you will only be able to consume so much of it in one sitting, but it is very thought provoking. A must read for anyone before they venture out into the world. I can't remember how many copies of this book I've given out to people.

Great books by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 02:02 · Score: 0

Any of Anne McCaffrey's Pern series (if you want to encourage teens to read)

How to Win Friends and Influence People by Dale Carnige (everyone should read this one)

Best-selling book ever on the political economy by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 02:03 · Score: 0

Henry George’s first book, Progress and Poverty: An inquiry into the cause of industrial depressions and of increase of want with increase of wealth The Remedy, was self-published in 1879. It went on to become the best-selling book ever on political economy,* and in the 1880s and 1890s.

Absolutely the best economic analysis explaining how the economy works!

This interesting video explains the theory: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XL3n59wC8kk

The Razer's Edge, W. Somerset Maugham by MonsterMasher · 2014-01-02 02:12 · Score: 1

A fantastic book for today. Look to more then success and money. Seek more from your life!

"Me", not "I", FFS by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 02:13 · Score: 0

"Part of my New Year's resolution is to encourage reading as a hobby in those around me — especially my friends' children (ages 2 to 22), but my wife and I as well.

How about learning to write instead of interfering with other people? Some time invested in learning when to use "me" versus "I" would promote basic literacy whenever you open your mouth or let your fingers hit the keyboard.

The Book of Certitude by rossdee · 2014-01-02 02:16 · Score: 1

The Book of Certitude (also referred to as the Kitab-i-Iqan)

Re:"1984" by George Orwell, which could be renamed by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 02:22 · Score: 0

"1984" by George Orwell, which could be renamed "2014"

... which could be renamed "Today," or you could just read the newspaper.

Literature or Knowledge? by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 02:28 · Score: 0

As much as I appreciate the humanity of a good story, and those listed here are some of the greatest, in my opinion there is no greater story then the truth. Therefore I recommend Scientific literature. Books, which are not dry and can keep your attention, but at the same time open the universe we live in to human thought. I have a few for the list, but this one seems to catch most of the best. http://www.goodreads.com/list/show/692.Best_Science_Books_Non_Fiction_Only

History of the Peloponnesian War by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 02:37 · Score: 0

Thucydides great work is an education in itself.

Crystal Desert by David Campbell by starmanron · 2014-01-02 02:38 · Score: 1

Want to escape for a while? You''ll be transported to the magnificent beauty and fantastic workings of Antarctica. It's on my "Definitely Re-read List."

Last and First Men by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 02:48 · Score: 0

I'd vote for adding "Last and First Men" and "Star Maker" from Olaf Stapledon to that list. If for no other reason, I'd recommend them just for the level of big picture thinking and vision they involve which is far beyond most anything else I've ever found. As it was written in the 1930's there's a lot of fine details that seem "obviously" wrong, but the grasp of what humanity is and can be seems pretty dead on from our best to our worst.

Books to read by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 03:00 · Score: 0

Sex at Dawn
The Ethical Slut

Hitchiker's Guide by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 03:04 · Score: 0

While it is mildly amusing at several points, I can't understand the wank-fest that this series enjoys in nerd culture. I *gasp* found the movie more interesting than the books for the most part.

Also JP Hogans' 1982 Voyage From Yesteryear by Paul+Fernhout · 2014-01-02 03:09 · Score: 1

About a gift economy powered by robots and fusion in conflict with current-type scarcity-based institutions (some similar themes as in later Giants novels). And also Frederik Pohl's "Midas World" (1950s about material abundance from fusion, again in conflict with older economic values). Also, Theodore Sturgeon's "The Skills of Xanadu" short story (prescient 1950s about mobile computing and open source making and sharing in conflict with a scarcity/conquest viewpoint). Iain Banks' Culture Novels touch on these themes too. Al really pressing things to understand as our economy changes as various technologies proliferate...

I also recommend "900 Grandmothers" by R. A. Lafferty for two stories on the Camiroi (Education and Polity/Custom) . And lots of stuff by Ursula K. Le Guin, especially a "Wizard of Earthsea" and "Always Coming Home".

Collections: Asimov's collection of old sci-fi he read called "Before the Golden Age". "The Ascent of Wonder: The Evolution of Hard SF" edited by David G. Hartwell and Kathryn Cramer. The World Turned Upside Down by Eric Flint , James Baen , David Drake.

The Bolo and Beserker series for two other series views of robots (along with Asimov's). And "Silent Running" and "Red Dwarf" for more views on them.

The Diamond Age. Shockwave Rider.

Read and liked many of your choices too! We probably are similar in age to go through such a set.

Lots of non sci-fi stuff is important too if we talk broadly about this. But the list is so large there... Fiction (e.g. Charles Dickens, Shakespeare, Grimm's fairy tales, non-western stuff), Non-fiction (e.g. Horowitz and Hill: the Art of Electronics, Dr. Joel Fuhrman: Eat to Live, Bartholomew: Square foot Gardening, Gingery: Build your Own Machine Shop from Scrap, Weiner: The Human Use of Human Beings and Cybernetics, Winner: Autonomous Technology, Bateson: Steps to an Ecology of Mind), Biography (e.g. Benjamin Franklin, William C. Norris), etc.. Religious -- various obvious classics that shape the thought of so many people via stories as well as commentary on them.

So many books overlap though. And so many themes come up in different ways in different books in different ways. It is sort of like our books are all part of a global informational hologram. To talk about just one influential book or of few is to like to get a tiny fragment of a hologram -- you may get a whole picture of life but of lower quality with limited viewing angles. More books adds more viewing angles and more detail. We may see the world in a grain of sand, but a whole beach worth of sand adds more possibilities.

Asimov said he was glad he read widely besides sci-fi.

--
A 21st century issue: the irony of technologies of abundance in the hands of those still thinking in terms of scarcity.

A must read by jeffasselin · 2014-01-02 03:10 · Score: 1

I seriously believe everyone should read "The Brothers Karamazov", that you cannot be a complete human being without reading it.

I also recommend waiting till you're in your twenties before doing so.

--
If he explores all forms and substances Straight homeward to their symbol-essences; He shall not die.

Re:A must read by wcrowe · 2014-01-02 03:37 · Score: 1

I could not agree more.

--
Proverbs 21:19

Recommendation by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 03:12 · Score: 0

I would add Watership Down to the list as it is a good introduction to religious and political allegory as well as a warning against the perils of fascism.

Must read? Great read - yes by dcblogs · 2014-01-02 03:25 · Score: 1

David Hackett Fisher's Paul Revere's Ride

We by DarthVain · 2014-01-02 03:29 · Score: 1

Both were based on "We" which I recently read.

Was a bit hard to get into, but once you do it is an interesting read. Some parts are a bit weird. Also some parts are funny because of how long ago it was written, and also how they didn't understand some things all that well at the time. Also I read the English translation from original Russian, and it makes you wonder as to the choices they made in interpretation. Was written early 1900's, but Translated much later, in the early 1970's (or at least my version was). Using ballast in rocketry for example or how electricity is applied and used. Though one of my favorite terms was something like "it was like a phonograph in my head playing over and over"... Heh!

It also in addition to commentary on government and society, it also touches on religion with the same sorts of themes. The guiding principle being complete control and happiness VS freedom and possible strife.

Great Books of the Western World by wcrowe · 2014-01-02 03:36 · Score: 1

Great Books of the Western World. My ex-wife had a collection of these. Neither she nor I managed to get through all of them. I think it is still available as a collection via Encyclopedia Britannica. I don't know if it's necessary to read every title. I will let others debate that. I do think it is a good starting place if you're wanting a list of books that educated people should read.

--
Proverbs 21:19

Cook books by sjbe · 2014-01-02 03:37 · Score: 1

The Joy of Cooking - Get a 1950s version before all of the processed food came in.

There are better cooking books than this one though I don't mean to denigrate The Joy of Cooking. The Joy of Cooking was/is important but there are better options out there to seriously learn cooking technique in my opinion. The Joy of Cooking isn't exactly a bible for professional chefs. I put it on par or maybe a little behind Julia Childs "Mastering the Art of French Cooking" which is also well worth reading.

Off the top of my head I might suggest:
* Larousse Gastronomique
* The Escoffier Cookbook
* Professional Chef (by the CIA)
(yes these are largely French cuisine based and not really aimed at home cooks but French cuisine is undeniably important - I don't know the equivalents for Chinese, Japanese, Indian or Italian cuisine)

A few other favorites though not definitive references and not really must reads:
* Ratio by Michael Ruhlman
* anything by Alton Brown
* Charcuterie by Brian Polcyn and Michael Ruhlman
* Cookwise by Shirley Corriher

Re:My top 10 list, altering fiction and non-fictio by wcrowe · 2014-01-02 03:42 · Score: 1

10. Modern Operating Systems - Andrew Tanenbaum - to understand how your computer really works

I do wish more young developers understood how computers work. I don't think all the schools are teaching this any longer.

--
Proverbs 21:19

Here are some suggestions by StormyWeatherL33T · 2014-01-02 03:44 · Score: 1

* For younger kids: Charlotte's Web What the Witch Left The Lion the Witch and the Wardrobe * Older/Young Adult/Adult: The Eye of the World (they also have an edited version for younger readers) In Defense of Anarchism (actually a very intelligent and thought provoking critique of democracy) Tao te Ching The World According to Garp The Stranger, by Camus Immortal Poems of the English Language (a great compilation) Hitchiker's Guide to the Galaxy Neuromancer On a Pale Horse Map of the World Where the Red Fern Grows Joy Luck Club

St. John's Reading list by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 03:46 · Score: 0

St. John's College reading list is an extremely comprehensive list of Western literature.

http://www.stjohnscollege.edu/academic/readlist.shtml

The Lady Tasting Tea by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 03:52 · Score: 0

by David Salsburg - an interesting history of something everyone is effected by but does not want to admit it - statistics.

Shakespeare by ab0mb88 · 2014-01-02 04:04 · Score: 1

It isn't an easy read to start but once you can read and follow along with what is going on you will find that you are much better at absorbing any material you read.

Worthwhile Reading by robertc5 · 2014-01-02 04:15 · Score: 1

The Constitution ofthe United States
The Federalist Papers

Because, you should know where you stand.

October Sky by edrobinson · 2014-01-02 04:17 · Score: 1

I feel that this is a great read for anyone. It's a true story with a bit of fictionalization about a group of boys in a West Virginia coal mining town during the Sputnik era. It recounts their undying efforts to 'git 'er done against strong opposition.

Books by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 04:18 · Score: 0

The Best Money Can't Buy - Jacque Fresco
Science and Sanity - Alfred Korzybski
How to Talk with People - Irving J. Lee
Walden2 - BF Skinner
Tyranny of Words - Stuart Chase
A People's History of the United States - Howard Zin

Not "must reads" per se, but books i've enjoyed... by Lisandro · 2014-01-02 04:26 · Score: 1

...in no particular order.

"Passage", by Connie Willis. Yes, "The Doomsday Book" is probably her better known work, but "Passage" is immensely gripping. A light read but quite thought provoking.
"Contact" by Isaac Asimov. Forget the movie (which wasn't half bad either); the book is great and focuses more on the characters' religion and spirituality. I've recommended it to a number of relatives who hate sci-fi and they all thanked me.
"Atlas shrugged" by Ayn Rand. Yes, it is long. Yes, some dialogs are way longer than they should. And yes, it is heavy handed. Love it or hate it, it will make you rethink
"Brave new word" by Aldous Huxley. People keep saying we live in a 1984-future, but Huxley's work reflects our present much better than Orwell could ever imagine. Or fear.
"Rendevouz with Rama" by Arthur C. Clarke. Perhaps the first real page-turner i ever read; if the first chapter grabs your attention you'll have a hard time putting this one down.
"A man without a country" by Kurt Vonnegut. A series of essays by Vonnegut which are short, humorous, depressing and thought-provoking all at the same time. Highly recommended.
"Starship troopers" by Robert A. Heinlein. Also heavy-handed and infused with Heinleins' view of politics, but it is very well-written and leaves you pondering after the last page is done. Rico's discussions with his history and philosophy teacher are though-provoking indeed.
"In cold blood" by Truman Capote. Non-fictional account of the Clutter murders on 1959 which is so well written and researched that feels like a novel.
"Foucault's Pendulum" by Umberto Eco. Long and slow in parts, but stylishly definitely one of the best written works i've ever read. The thinking man's version of "The Da Vinci Code".

must read books by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 04:43 · Score: 0

The Singularity is Near

How about a little Math? by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 04:43 · Score: 0

Mathematics for the Nonmathematician by Morris Kline isbn-10 0-486-24823-2

Wonderful book - teaches Math from a historical / practical perspective.

I assume HGTTG was already mentioned... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 05:01 · Score: 0

My Side of the Mountain (runaway goes off into the mountains to live off the land, told in the form of a journal)
Guns, Germs, and Steel (one theory for why some civilizations industrialized and others did not)
Chicks in Chainmail (collection of medieval short stories written by feminists)
Masters of Doom: How 2 guys created an empire (history of the computer game Doom)
Winnie The Pooh (greatest children's book ever)

I would also recommend seeking out books used in college "World Literature" and "Women in Literature" courses. Usually 3-4 inches thick and filled with the cream of the crop short stories, poetry, and essays. Check online used college book stores.

so many for so many different reasons by ohearn · 2014-01-02 05:18 · Score: 1

Bible and Koran for cultural influences all around the world and if you want a good grip on the Bible get as old af a version as you can plus the newer translations both and the The Apocrypha Constitution, and really the federalist papers as well for more insight into the mind set of many of the country's founders OK this one if US-centric, but shift documents appropriately for whatever country you live in I good Highschool/college 101 level textbook on physics, biology, and chemistry Most people don't need to retain it all unless they go into science or engineering of some sort, but really things everyone should have a basic handle on Illiad, Oddessy, Lord of the Rings, Shakespeare, Chaucer just the joy of reading them and expanding one's mind, plus the cultural references that stem from them The Hayne's manual on whatever vehicle you own, because the ability to do basic maintenance and repairs on one's vehicle is a very practical skill to have Any decent cookbook for similar reasons, as well as a basic intro to sewing book (by hand or machine) Plato's Republic, so much of the political structure in the Western world is based on ideas contained in this book Fahrenheit 451, Starship Troopers (just pretend the movie never existed), 1984 all for insight on where society in different ways Rules for Radicals, and the Communist Manifesto because regardless of which side of the political isle you fall on, ideas from these two get used in politics a lot The Art of War, because even if military history and strategy aren't your thing, some of the ideas can be used in almost every aspect of life

Re:Not "must reads" per se, but books i've enjoyed by Lisandro · 2014-01-02 05:27 · Score: 1

Gah, "Contact" was written by Sagan, not Asimov. I hereby surrender my geek cards...

Book by brunnegd · 2014-01-02 05:28 · Score: 1

Atlas Shrugged. And then The Fountainhead. Two book that tell us it is OK to stand up for your principles.

The Franklin Cover-Up by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 05:39 · Score: 0

The Franklin Cover-Up by John DeCamp.

"Beyond Growth" by economist Herman E. Daly by echtertyp · 2014-01-02 05:40 · Score: 1

The only economics book that that doesn't wave hands and try to change the subject when the really hard questions come up.

Some here, some not... by DriveDog · 2014-01-02 05:48 · Score: 1

For various ages & stages:
Fade - Robert Cormier
Monkey Wrench Gang; Desert Solitaire - Edward Abbey
Spook Country - William Gibson
A Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur's Court - Mark Twain - (I found it slow at first, but it's an excellent commentary on the gullibility of people in Medieval times - wink)
The Right Stuff; Electric Kool-Aid Acid Test - Tom Wolfe
Hackers - Steven Levy
What the Dormouse Said - John Markoff
(Try reading Electric Kool-Aid and Dormouse back-to-back to glimpse some of the cross-fertilization that occurred.)
Dharma Bums - Jack Kerouac ( I liked On The Road, but found it, well, aimless.)
East of Eden - John Steinbeck (The one Steinbeck I enjoyed; I hated the rest, including The Grapes of Wrath in particular. )
I'd skip Catcher in the Rye. Not bad, just seemed like a waste of time.
Daybreak 2250 AD - Andre Norton ( I suspect other Norton works are good, but can't say. )
Catch-22 - Joseph Heller
Cryptonomicon - Neal Stephenson
2001, 2010, 2061, 3001 - Arthur C. Clarke ( Read them all, in order. You can watch the film 2001 instead, as there's nothing more in the book, meaning-wise. Since everyone should watch 2001 anyhow, there you go. )
Cradle - Arthur C. Clarke & Gentry Lee
Everything written by Carl Hiaasen, but maybe start with Sick Puppy or Striptease. They fictions are funny, but also excellent commentaries on our world (not just Florida).
Surely You're Joking, Mr. Feynman; What Do You Care What Other People Think?; Six Easy Pieces - Richard Feynman
Stranger in a Strange Land - Robert Heinlein

Maybe not for everyone:
Daemon; Kill Decision - Daniel Suarez ( Both very good, I enjoyed them a little more than Gibson, but it's hard to beat Stephenson. )

An Enemy of the People by mtrachtenberg · 2014-01-02 05:59 · Score: 1

Ibsen's An Enemy of the People. Too many of us put too much faith in the media and in democracy, and Ibsen's masterwork is an accurate corrective. Newspapers engage in crusades as long as it doesn't hurt their bottom line. People will ignore facts that are inconvenient. Politicians will do what majorities ask for, even if it means trashing the truth. We live in the tobacco company era and are still ignoring the global science community's warnings about climate change -- unless enough of us learn to think for ourselves, our prospects are not good.

A couple off the top of my head by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 06:01 · Score: 0

Jack Herer - The Emperor Wears No Clothes
William Cooper - Behold a Pale Horse
Anything written by Hunter S. Thompson

The Selfish Gene (Richard Dawkins) by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 06:07 · Score: 0

A landmark in the study of evolution (be sure to get latest edition)

Almost anything by Dawkins is great.

Everyone should read a book they love. by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 06:08 · Score: 0

Unfortunately, most school reading lists are filled with CRAP. "Enlightened" books are okay for only a small segment of any class. You need easy books, hard books, autism books and FUN books too.

Do some people like reading manuals? Fuck, let them read a manual. That's a pretty good life skill. Do they like reading porn? They better have a damn good report to go with it. The reading material was NEVER that important. The important thing is making sure the student can UNDERSTAND the book and has the ability to articulate it. That's the whole point of a reading project in the first place!

Oh wait, this question wasn't about students. Eh, same idea applies.

Quote re Marx by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 06:12 · Score: 0

Not sure who said this, but "Just because Marx got the wrong answers doesn't mean he wasn't asking the right questions."

meta-book by MisterToad · 2014-01-02 06:32 · Score: 1

I recommend we start with "How to Read a Book", Mortimer Adler and Charles Van Doren

--
Dick

high impact literature by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 06:40 · Score: 0

Book of Ecclesiasstes - Wisdom of a pessimist.
Book of Proverbs - wisdom of an optimist.
Manwatching - Desmond Morris - how to analyze body language
how to win friends and influence people -dale carnegie - handling people
Animal Farm - George Orwell.. Ruthless politics
Pygmalion - george bernard shaw... How people respond to social hierarchy
you just don't understand -deborah tannen -- tell me what you really mean
Outliers - Malcolm Gladwell - ..how society influences who succeeds in life.
Pineapple Army - Kazuya Kudo - the intersection between all out war and civilian self defense
Language in thought and action by S. I. Hayakawa (Semantics and how politician lie)
Dilbert ( Comics) - Scott Adams - office humor
Calvin and Hobbs (Comics)- Bill Watterson - man-adult-child humor
I, Robot - Asimov - when Artificial intelligence vs. Man
Art of War - Sun Tzu - a Study in War
The Prince - Machiavelli - A Study in Politics
On War - Carl von Clausewitz - a Study in War
The Wizard of Oz - L. Frank Baum
Mythical Man Month - Fred Brooks ( mistakes in corporate project management)
Dress for Success - John T Molloy ( look the part)
No Man is an Island - John Donne

Social by Baldrson · 2014-01-02 06:59 · Score: 1

The Extended Phenotype by Richard Dawkins, The Social Conquest of Earth by E. O. Wilson and, for fiction, Camp 38 by Jill von Konen.

--
Seastead this.

A list .. by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 07:00 · Score: 0

On The Road - Jack Kerouac
The Invisible Man - Ralph Ellison
Lolita - Vladimir Nabokov
Neuromancer - William Gibson
The Day of the Locust - Nathanael West

Yes, 42!! by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 07:38 · Score: 0

I was thinking that about three replies ago. Thanks for recommending it

A Tale Of Two Cities by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 07:52 · Score: 0

If the Bible is on your list, this book will help you understand its basic message.

Jared Diamond's stuff! by tibit · 2014-01-02 07:53 · Score: 1

Jared Diamond's Guns, Germs and Steel - it explores the entire history of human species, with focus on the last 11,000 years. I highly recommend it, especially for those who, like myself, thought for a while that history is just a bunch of boring stuff ;)

--
A successful API design takes a mixture of software design and pedagogy.

Re:Educate yourself in the evils of socialism/fasc by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 07:58 · Score: 0

Hopefully so that you'll know that they're not the same thing.

Good Reads by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 08:03 · Score: 0

Cryptonomicon

Mind of the Raven -

The Gulag Archipelago - Solzhenitsyn

The Poisonwood Bible - Barbara Kingsolver

The 13th Valley - J del Vecchio

Kabloona - Gontran de Poncins

Top of the World - Hans Reusch

Metamagical Themas - Doug Hofsteader

Re: some good ones. (for the child) by tibit · 2014-01-02 08:12 · Score: 1

I'd say that a few classics by Dr. Seuss are a must, no matter what your age is. They are mostly just unabated fun and irreverence of the good sort.

--
A successful API design takes a mixture of software design and pedagogy.

not books, but some things to read now and again by clovis · 2014-01-02 08:26 · Score: 1

Lincoln's Gettysburg address
George Washington's inaugural and farewell addresses
Eisenhower's farewell address
The Declaration of Independence. The whole thing; all of it.
La Marseillaise (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/La_Marseillaise)
The Internationale http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Internationale

Wilhelm Reich by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 08:42 · Score: 0

And Introduction to Orgonomy. The Murder of Christ. Character Analysis. People In Trouble. And the book that made him a target of the Nazi's : The Mass Psychology of Fascism.

Re:"1984" by George Orwell, which could be renamed by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 09:15 · Score: 0

Either you haven't actually read '1984' or you don't actually live in 2014. Orwell was writing about something far greater than privacy and government secrets. Complaining openly that you're actually living under a "Big Brother" government is indulgent, childish, and a bit ironic.

My list by Leggman · 2014-01-02 09:18 · Score: 1

The Deathbird Stories by Harlan Ellison - each individually is thought provoking; together they are hard to beat

--
You don't eat crackers in the bed of your future or you get all...scratchy! - The Tick

Black like me by sir-gold · 2014-01-02 10:11 · Score: 1

Black like me, by John Howard Griffin

True story of a white journalist who wandered around the southern states during the 1960's disguised as a black man, in order to see first hand the effects of racism and poverty.

Re:Black like me by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 15:56 · Score: 0

Yes, thank you. I was trying to remember the name of that book; I read it a long time ago.
It explains very well how dangerous, ridiculous things were during segregation. It's as if Salvadore Dali had been asked to design a fucked-up society.
Speaking as someone who was an adult (white) during the time of 100% segregation, I can tell you the "Black like me" is an understatement of how bad things were.

Some good Sci-fi/Fantasy by Endophage · 2014-01-02 10:34 · Score: 1

Good Omens - Terry Pratchett and Neil Gaiman. A comedy about the coming of the anti-christ. Very British humour.
Nine Tomorrows - A collection of shorts by Asimov. Some very interesting visions of the future that have been the basis for a number of more recent authors' work.
Snow Crash - Neal Stephenson. The backdrop is an interesting vision of a hyper-privatised world.
Foundation - Asimov, the whole trilogy. At a deep level, it observes the cycles of civilization and the optimal methods of control exerted at different stages of development.
The Marching Morons - Cyril Kornbluth. Sometimes I feel this is where the world is headed.

The Harvard Classics by wurp · 2014-01-02 10:57 · Score: 1

"
The Harvard Classics, originally known as Dr. Eliot's Five Foot Shelf, is a 51-volume anthology of classic works from world literature, compiled and edited by Harvard University president Charles W. Eliot and first published in 1909.[1]

Eliot had stated in speeches that the elements of a liberal education could be obtained by spending 15 minutes a day reading from a collection of books that could fit on a five-foot shelf. (Originally he had said a three-foot shelf.) The publisher P. F. Collier and Son saw an opportunity and challenged Eliot to make good on this statement by selecting an appropriate collection of works, and the Harvard Classics was the result.
"

All are in the public domain. Finding good compilations is hard, but I've done it for several of the 51 volumes.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harvard_Classics

In case you want to put in some legwork, I have some of them up here: http://static.bobbymartin.name/Calibre%20Library/

Here are the paths:
Calibre Library/Bibliobazaar/Harvard Classics 01B - John Woolman (138)
Calibre Library/Plato/Harvard Classics 02A Euthyphro; The Apol (48)
Calibre Library/Charles Darwin/Harvard Classics 04 (125)
Calibre Library/Eliot, Charles W. (Charles William), 183/Harvard Classics 04 (245)
Calibre Library/Eliot, Charles W. (Charles William), 183/Harvard Classics 06 (247)
Calibre Library/Charles Darwin/Harvard Classics 07 (244)
Calibre Library/Charles Darwin/Harvard Classics 07 (243)
Calibre Library/Virgil/Harvard Classics 13 - Aeneid (38)
Calibre Library/Eliot, Charles William, 1834-1926/Harvard classics 33,34,__ (246)
Calibre Library/Eliot, Charles William, 1834-1926/Harvard Classics 33,34,__ (248)
Calibre Library/Charles William Eliot/The Harvard Classics (188)
Calibre Library/Unknown/The Harvard classics The Apol (127)
Calibre Library/Unknown/The Harvard classics New Atla (126)

If not, wait a few weeks and I'll probably have them organized and more easily accessible here: http://www.harvardclassics.net/

Buddhist Perspective by nuclearsugar · 2014-01-02 11:08 · Score: 1

The Dhammapada - by Eknath Easwaran
It can be read and appreciated simply as wise philosophy. Dhammapada means "the path of dharma": the path of truth, harmony, and righteousness. Eknath Easwaran's translation of this essential Buddhist text, based on the oldest version, consists of 423 short verses gathered by the Buddha's direct disciples after his death and organized by theme: anger, thought, joy, pleasure, and others.
--- Better than a thousand pointless words is one word which brings inner peace.
--- Our life is shaped by our mind; we become what we think. Suffering follows an evil thought as the wheels of a cart follow the oxen that draw it. Our life is shaped by our mind; we become what we think. Joy follows a pure thought like a shadow that never leaves.
--- One's own misdirected thought can do one more harm than an enemy.

An Introduction to Buddhism: Teachings, History and Practices - by Peter Harvey
I have often felt that my perspective of the east is greatly advised in knowing the history and philosophy of Buddhism. This book is a no-nonsense explanation from a scholar. Its a comprehensive introduction to Buddhist tradition as it has developed in three major cultural areas in Asia, and to Buddhism as it is now developing in the West. It is intended to be a textbook for students of religious and Asian studies, but it will also be of interest to those who want a general survey of Buddhism and its beliefs. Unlike many other general books about Buddhism, it not only explores the world views of the religion but also attempts to show how Buddhism functions as a set of practices. It thus includes chapters on devotion, ethics, monastic practices and meditation. Such practices are related to Buddhist teachings and historical developments. Emphasizing as it does the diversity found within different Buddhist traditions, the book aims throughout to underline common threads of belief, practice and historical continuities which unify the Buddhist world. Dr. Harvey answers questions that are often asked by people on first meeting the tradition, and in his section on Nirvana offers a novel interpretation of this ultimate, transcendent mystery.

The Book on the Taboo Against Knowing Who You Are - by Alan Watts
Alan Watts explores the question of who we really are. He claims that man seems to live in an illusion of being a separate ego 'housed in a bag of skin'. He discusses the many ways this mistaken identity leads to destructive behavior in relationships, both between people, nations and in relation to the natural environment. He uses examples familiar to most educated Westerners. He sets out to offer an alternative perspective, mixing Western science with ancient Eastern philosophies. For this purpose he wants to draw on insights from Vedanta philosophy.
--- "The social doublebind game can be phrased in several ways:The first rule of this game is that it is not a game. Everyone must play. You must love us. You must go on living. Be yourself, but play a consistent and acceptable role. Control yourself and be natural. Try to be sincere. Essentially, this game is a demand for spontaneous behavior of certain kinds. Living, loving, being natural or sincere—all these are spontaneous forms of behavior: they happen "of themselves" like digesting food or growing hair. As soon as they are forced they acquire that unnatural, contrived, and phony atmosphere which everyone deplores—weak and scentless like forced flowers and tasteless like forced fruit. Life and love generate effort, but effort will not generate them. Faith—in life, in other people, and in oneself—is the attitude of allowing the spontaneous to be spontaneous, in its own way and in its own time."
--- "Other people teach us who we are. Their attitudes to us are the mirror in which we learn to see ourselves, but the mirror is distorted. We are, perhaps, rather dimly aware of the immense power of our social environment."
--- "Just

Factual by mtpaley · 2014-01-02 11:59 · Score: 1

Asimov's New Guide to Science is a must read. The knowledge in that book is incredible.

Art of Manliness by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 11:59 · Score: 0

I'd recommend the books listed by http://www.artofmanliness.com/

Most of those books have been covered by others - but I like this list.

There are the books you read, and then there are the books that change your life. We can all look back on the books that have shaped our perspective on politics, religion, money, and love. Some will even become a source of inspiration for the rest of your life. From a seemingly infinite list of books of anecdotal or literal merit, we have narrowed down the top 100 books that have shaped the lives of individual men while also helping define broader cultural ideas of what it means to be a man.

A starting point by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 12:30 · Score: 0

When I was a teenager I read Colleen McCullough - Masters of Rome series. This was the spark for me to explore literature and therefore comes highly recommended by me.

Formative by gibneyt · 2014-01-02 13:38 · Score: 1

Aztec by Gary Jennings

Books by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 14:19 · Score: 0

gosgog:

Shakespeare, all or any of 'em....Mark Twain, & tons of other stuff, and if you want to learn 'why the Muslim Terrorists exist' read LEON URIS' "THE HAJ".

One site to bind them all by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-02 15:51 · Score: 0

This is my goto site when I'm tired of playing solitaire:
http://www.cheezburger.com/

Re:The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy & a fe by unitron · 2014-01-02 17:01 · Score: 1

...as well as anything not too heavy by Stephen King.

Except The Colorado Kid.

Admire the "noir" cover, and then move on to something else in which to actually invest time.

--

I see even classic Slashdot is now pretty much unusable on dial up anymore.

Re:disappointing list by MikeBabcock · 2014-01-02 17:45 · Score: 1

Its possible you completely missed the story for the words.

--
- Michael T. Babcock (Yes, I blog)

An esoteric list for you by MikeBabcock · 2014-01-02 17:55 · Score: 1

Mere Christianity by C.S.Lewis (whether you are one or not), it will open your mind.
See No Evil: The True Story of a Ground Soldier in the CIA's War Against Terrorism by Richard Baer for the same reason.
State of Fear by Michael Crichton, because its almost as much fun as Jurassic Park.
Fairy Tales Every Child Should Know, Hamilton Wright Mabie, because there's great wisdom in old stories.

--
- Michael T. Babcock (Yes, I blog)

This by Etherwalk · 2014-01-02 18:45 · Score: 1

Do you really not see the difference between Frodo Baggins and Dagny Taggart? Frodo is a fantastical character - he's a short-statured member of a race of hairy-footed little men who live in hills, have eleventy-first birthday parties and possess a strange resistance to magic. ...

Dagny Taggart is a fantastical caricature - she's a human, but not as we know it Jim. Everything she ever wanted sort of just happened to her, and she just does random insane shit because that's what the author needs her to do in order to move the plot along.

This. The Lord of the Rings was very much a Romantic work, in the capital-R sense. Not escapism, but something that reflects on the way the world should be and how we respond to challenge. Game of Thrones rejects Romanticism outright, and damns it--it has this sort of Victorian-esque sense of both rejection of and yearning for that Romanticism. There's a reason for that beheading in Game of Thrones, and that Resurrection in LOTR.

LOTR is best before you "grow up," or after you really grow up.

A short list off the top of my head by Dabido · 2014-01-02 19:37 · Score: 1

Spring Snow - Yukio Mishima

The Outsider - Colin Wilson

A Clockwork Orange - Anthony Burgess

Ringworld - Larry Niven

Junky - William Burroughs

The Plague - Albert Camus

Nausea - Jean-Paul Sartre

Fox in Sox - Dr Seuss

Love in the Time of Cholera - Gabriel García Márquez

Shogun - James Clavell

In Cold Blood - Truman Capote

--
Sure enough, the cow costume was hanging up next to the superhero outfit and sailors uniform. (S,Spud)

For the many theists who think they're atheists. by buybuydandavis · 2014-01-02 22:15 · Score: 1

Max Stirner - The Ego and His Own.

Book by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-03 03:44 · Score: 0

1984, by George Orwell

Buddhism is useful, even to an atheist by echtertyp · 2014-01-03 03:56 · Score: 1

Coming from a 100% scientist, I still have to give props to Buddhism as a very useful mental framework for our quirky human minds. I especially like the Buddhist insight that ego is at the root of a lot of human ills. See yourself as part of the world, not one man battling for respect and wealth, and life gets a lot easier and nicer. And oddly one seems to get more meaningful stuff done.

Great Books by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-03 04:36 · Score: 0

Animal Farm by George Orwell
Heart of Darkness by Joseph Conrad
Brave New World by Aldous Huxley
The Trial by Franz Kafka

5 Must-Reads for Future Scientists/Engineers by TWToxicity · 2014-01-03 07:54 · Score: 1

1) Brave New World by Aldous Huxley
2) On The Origins of Species by Charles Darwin
3) 2001: A Space Odyssey by Arthur C Clarke (watch the movie after reading the book)
4) The Foundation Series by Isaac Asimov
5) Pandora's Star by Peter F Hamilton

Dont forget the two lords: by MacroRodent · 2014-01-03 08:13 · Score: 1

1. The Lord of the Rings

2. The Lord of the Flies

Two books that can hardly be more different. One heroic, the other demonstrating why human societies eventually screw themselves up...

A Useful Reminder by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-03 08:53 · Score: 0

A Canticle for Leibowitz

All works by Eustace Mullins.... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-03 17:00 · Score: 0

You don't need to be a CSR to know this either:

http://www.eustacemullins.us/

Re:All works by Eustace Mullins.... by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-03 17:04 · Score: 0

17) The Gulag Archipelago [goodreads.com] by Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn...
That's not the best Solzhenitsyn book to start with... start with "200 Hundred Years Together"... it is not for a CrackSmokeRepublican. And you can Gweogle that.

Reading suggestion by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-03 19:38 · Score: 0

Voltaire's Bastards, by John Ralston Saul

Stanislav Grof's LSD Psychotherapy by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-06 04:02 · Score: 0

The author of this book spent more than fifty years of his life studying the depths of the psychedelic experience. During these years, he personally conducted more than 4,000 psychedelic sessions in the context of psychotherapy. LSD Psychotherapy is a summation of everything he has learned during the process.

I collected some excerpts in this Reddit post: http://www.reddit.com/r/Psychonaut/comments/1aspae/a_tribute_to_stanislav_grofs_lsd_psychotherapy/

"The Wallace" by eionmac · 2014-01-06 06:40 · Score: 1

A play on freedom, what to do to get it and maintain it. The actions of greed, advancement and lust in some persons and the cruelty of those in power (power corrupts) to keep it
The play by New Zealander Sydney Goodsir Smith, published by Oliver & Boyd of Edinburgh, Scotland, 1960, is in the "Lallans" (Scottish) dialect of English.
Once read , it changes how you look at the persons 'seeking' financial/social advancement in any polulation.
I am biased, as a Scot living in England, but it made great sense to my Russian colleagues.

--
Regards Eion MacDonald

Name of the Wind by Patrick Rothfuss by drkoemans · 2014-01-07 08:26 · Score: 1

You SHOULD read it because it is extremely well written and regardless of what your interests are, there really is something everyone can identify with in this book. You should read it because why are we here if not to enjoy ourselves from time to time?

Who says them interwebs isn't educatiative? by Hognoxious · 2014-01-11 11:24 · Score: 1

Since when was 99% half?

Seriously, I never knew that was a book title. I thought it was just a figure of speech.

--
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."

K&R2 by Anonymous Coward · 2014-01-12 04:54 · Score: 0

The C Programming Language Second Edition, By Kernighan and Ritchie.

Read it to your little ones as a bedtime story.

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