Slashdot Mirror
KDE 3.0 is Out
Emilio Hansen noted that KDE 3.0 is
on their site. There
is no official announcement yet, but this looks like the real deal. No debian
packages yet, but you can snag RPMs from various distros or src for the
do it yourself. Updated by HeUnique:Here is the announcement, enjoy.
It's a trap! Some guy on the KDE team has his desktop calendar all screwed up... he think's that TODAY is April 1!
What I want to know is who is spending time lurking on ftp sites to get scoops like this?
Conversion Rate Optimisation French / English consultant
Good grief.
Give the poor sods a chance to get the distribution ready, please. Perhaps they didn't WANT people downloading it just yet... Hence no announcement, just yet??
Bandwidth and hosting costs money, as poor old distributed.net is finding out. A few mirrors being updated, and then linking to the appropriate announcement would be a bit more considerate than putting up the first submission on the 3.0 release.
ooooooh! What does this button do? - DeeDee, Dexters Lab.
But it's slashdotted already. Off to find a mirror...
As a user of KDE (and GNOME and WMaker), I am very happy to see this release. The RC's looked great so this must be even better. Now it's GNOME's turn... Keep the competition going, it makes everything better! Congrats to the KDE Team.
------
Random, useless fact: I type in startx entirely with my left hand.
Coming back with a 404.
Anyone have this up and running (other than the KDE developers ;-) with screenshots they can post showing KDE 3.0 in action on an average users box?
Slashdot their main FTP before the mirrors are ready. That's a really bright idea!
True warriors use the Klingon Google
The KDE developers have not announced the release of KDE 3.0 yet because the mirrors have not gotten KDE 3.0 yet. Since they have not announced the release, do you think there might be a *reason* they have not announced it?
The editors at slashdot *know* the effect it has on a web site or ftp site when a story runs about that site. They *know* that the kde ftp site will get hammered because of this story. The *know* that the KDE developers obviously aren't ready yet BECAUSE THEY HAVE NOT ANNOUNCED THE RELEASE.
Yet, you announce the story anyway, before the actual release. Now, the ftp site will be slammed *before* the mirrors get a copy, which insures that things will be a huge mess for quiet some time.
This is the most incredibly discourteous and unprofessional behavior I've seen on a web site. Show some freaking respect towards the open source developers who create code (and give you something to write about on this site) and DO NOT ANNOUNCE A RELEASE BEFORE THE RELEASE.
Your lack of caring about the impact of your actions on this site really disgusts me.
I am still finding memory leaks via valgrind
.0000000
oh well it is a
hopefully GNOME people will profile their code like KDE did for memory leaks
because it really stablized when it was percived that memory was something to worry about
regards
john jones
I tried the CVS release of KDE 3 included in Red Hat's Skipjack beta. Like a man admiring his neighbor's well groomed lawn, I've got to say that it looks *beautiful*. There's some good stuff in there.
One of my favorite features is that the panel can optionally display the "description" of each item, rather than the "name" of the application. That's far more useful for the novice user. I suggested that the GNOME panel do that about.... 2 years ago (??) on one of the gnome mailing lists, but never got around to submitting a patch myself.
Go out and download an ftp client and you will notice that 350 out of the 350 available anonymous users are already logged on.
Thanks,
Then it must be time for the following posts: :)
- how KDE kicks GNOME's butt
- GNOME is now a dead-end for the Linux desktop
- why GNOME 2.0 will be better
- KDE looks too much like Windows
- KDE loading times
- KDE/GNOME are bloated, use iceWM/XFCE/Blackbox/whatever
- who needs a GUI? the command line is where it's at
- people making lists of expected posts
Any more?
I've got a fever and the only prescription is more COBOL.
That is so weird. My response went to the wrong post and I am positive I clicked on the right reply. This was supposed to go to the 404 guy.
as an user of gnome I would like to know: is there a KDE 3 feature list or screenshots available anywhere?
Fabio - Sumare/Sao Paulo/Brazil/South America/Earth/Solar System/Milky Way/Universe
http://www.morroida.com.br
Is it just me, or does anyone else find this unethical behavior? Granted, the release of KDE 3.0 is News for Nerds, and Stuff that Matters, but is it so important to get the scoop on something like this that you are unwilling to allow time for propogation? For a popular software release like this, I believe the editors should consider it their ethical duty to wait for the official announcement, and post a list (or at least a link to a list) of mirror sites.
The way it stands now, the mirrors may be having difficulty getting a copy of the distribution, as a hoard of eager slashdotters floods the primary ftp site.
Just to recap, I have no problems with someone submitting this story as soon as they see they possibly can, but I believe the editors have a responsibility to be respectful in their decision when to post the story.
When it reaches that version then we will have reached nirvana.
The beauty of Linux is that we will always have a choice. KDE 3.0 will help me get my wife to use Linux, but I prefer something more hardcore, like scwm .
weeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaakkkkkkk! Linux isn't just for the pompous, pretentious, exclusive, arrogant, "I'm better than you because I use the CLI," "anything that resembles a desktop is evil because it's like Windows," "I hate Microsoft because I'm supposed to" ultra-elitists anymore. Although it seems most of you still think it is, judging by the comments that appear on Slashdot in general. There are literally thousands of packages available and no one can use them all. Do us all a favor, simply don't install Gnome or KDE - and shut up.
I'm using the skipjack beta and the cvs version was so good i killed gnome
KDE 3 is already apt-get_able for Conectiva Linux for a few days
/etc/apt/sources.list the lines:
Just make sure you have the snapshot in your
rpm ftp://ftp.nl.linux.org/pub conectiva/snapshot/conectiva main extra orphan gnome experimental games kde
rpm-src ftp://ftp.nl.linux.org/pub conectiva/snapshot/conectiva main extra orphan gnome experimental games kde
then:
apt-get update
apt-get install task-kde
apt-get clean
and go for it.
of course if you are not using the snapshot version yet, you might want to:
apt-get dist-upgrade
"I can't give you a brain, so I'll give you a diploma" - The Great Oz (blatently stolen sig)
Don't get me wrong though. I am happy for everyone who uses KDE and the developers deserve high praise but it hardly signals the death of Gnome.
Oh, btw, when did trying to get a desktop on linux become a war? Did the KDE League sign a declaration? Did Sun pony up for some small arms for the Gnome Foundation? Inquiring minds want to know!
I don't want knowledge. I want certainty. - Law, David Bowie
My sister (15 year old mall rat) now REFUSES to use windows, since I showed her linux. She used to complain that the box I had set up for her kept crashing, so I set up a dual-boot for her, to see if she could learn. Obviously, I wouldn't want her to become frustrated with something just because she couldn't understand it, so I set up something closest to what she understood.
She understands how KDE works, because, for the most part, it's fairly intuitive. She did use linux. Not only is this a (small) proof of viability for linux in a consumer market, but it does show where even a "bloated" window manager can have it's place.
Tell me, would you rather have a bloated window manager and the linux kernel, or windows for someone you loved?
01101001 01100001 01101101 01101110 01101111 01110100 01100001 01101100 01100001 01110111 01111001 01100101 01110010
I have Red Hat Linux 7.1 and 7.2 boxes. What's the correct way to upgrade from KDE v2.2.1 and v2.2.2? Should I uninstall KDE packages and then install or use rpm -Uvh?
:)
Thank you in advance.
Ant(Dude) @ Quality Foraged Links (AQFL.net) & The Ant Farm (antfarm.ma.cx / antfarm.home.dhs.org).
Yes, I'm superficial. I decide on my desktop environment based on how fuzzy it makes me feel inside when I look at it. If you're running 3.0 or one of its RCs, post a screenshot!
Is the ftp getting hammered slashdots fault? I mean, people would have found out sooner or later, sure this is a huge forum, but there are other means. Maybe it's about time we looked for a better mirroring system than having it where the public can get it and hope the mirrors mirror it first... if it's not released yet, maybe it shouldn't be anywhere we can get it.
Oh please!
If you don't want it to be downloaded, don't make it available. If you want to conserve bandwidth to, let's say, push it out to the mirrors, then MODIFY YOUR ANONYMOUS USER ACCESS LIMITS.
You have complete control of how your stuff gets posted on your public ftp servers. Don't complain too loudly if you screw up and get slashdotted.
on an uk mirror, and I thought what happened? I came to slashdot and then saw this, bloody hell i'm downloading now at 1kb/s. shit!
DVD Ripping, Divx, VCD, SVCD under Linux
I installed the last rc (3?) of KDE3 and had to uninstall it because it slowed down my PC so much. I had to put it together piecemeal (some rpms and some tarballs) and in the end had to back it out.
I am using 2.2.2 now and am very happy with it.
Everyone else seems to love KDE3, so maybe there was something wrong with the rpms? Has anyone else had these problems?
I'm downloading KDE3 right now, but to anyone who already has it - have they fixed the atrocious font problem they had? At least on my machine (2.4.5, Slackware 8, KDE 2.2.2), no matter what I did about fonts, it always defaulted to Agate. It made terminal windows completely unreadable, an incredibly annoying problem. I mean, I'm sure it was something I could've fixed, but it drove me nuts. If it was just me, does anyone have any suggestions?
Gnome's panel *does* display a description rather than a name, and has for quite some time. When you click 'properties...' on a launcher, there's a field called "Comment". That's what shoes up when you mouse over the description.
-d
=== "Some people see the glass as half-empty. Others see it as half-full. I see the glass as too big." -G. Carlin.
Even if Linux -maybe- it's not intended to be for "everybody" as windows apparenlty is, think about a company that wants that "everybody" secretaries AND EVEN LAWYERS :-) use linux for dily use, to save some money, and for stability. End "stupid" users deserve to be in touch with that beatiful thing linux is.
In the other way (even if I like Mandrake) the terminal and WindowMaker (I like XFCE SO much, too) it's enough for the most admin/network things.
That's exactly what I was thinking. I'm hoping I'll finally be able to convert my wife to Linux with the help of KDE 3.0 and get her off the horid Win98.
The only problem is will I be able to install Mandrake/KDE 3.0 on a 1.2 gig drive? Hopefully if I carefully choose the packages installed I will.
Ricky Silk
kung foo ezine let me waste your time.
Don't confuse Slashdot with journalism. The site is still run like a college kid's pet project. Sure they're making money and have thousands of readers but that doesn't make the staff qualified journalists/editors. They're geeks with a popular geek web-site -- nothing more.
I come here almost everyday to see what they've collected because it's usually a nice mix. It has a the right amounts of tech, science and politics to keep me coming back. But, I never read their 'editorials' or Jon Katz because it's amateurish bunk. And, usually skip or skim the comments for the same reason :).
Actually, Microsoft Word is extremely awkward for editing papers that contain a large number of equations. You really need LaTeX (or LyX) for that. And, if you're using those, UNIX is much more natural. MATLAB also works well on unix. I'd get a lot less work done if I had to mess around with MS Windows.
Just what Linux needs really , more bloatware that sucks up CPU cycles and brings a low spec ... no wait , hold on... errr
machine to a halt for no good reason. Another well known OS did just that and look what happened
to it!
Everyone complains that Slashdot isn't the site for breaking news anymore and yet the community negatively responds anytime it posts a timely article / release.
I guess I'm just a Slashdot apologist...
I wonder how many people bitching on this thread first hit the link in the story, then decided to bitch about how people shouldnt be flooding the site since they couldnt get through.
"Enlightenment is your ego's biggest disappointment." --Yoginanda
IMHO, KDE 3.0 is good enough to serve as my primary desktop envirnment, especially thanks to Konqueror 3.0, which is fast, and can be used for anything from websurfing to networking and filemanagement. The look and feal of the entire desktop is soooo great! Antialiased fonts, lots of themes etc!
Keep up the good work KDE developers, Thanks for yet another great release!
Which uk mirror? It seems to me that no mirror has 3.0 yet... Or you were downloading 2.2.2?
-- No sig today
So, I'm really really ignorant of all of these window managers and what the distinctions are between X11, KDE, Gnome, Windowmaker, etc. I've been to gnome.org and kde.org, but I was hoping to find one big uberpage that laid it all out from square one.
I feel somewhat like Homer Simpson when he tried to drum up business for the bowling alley (first reading advanced economics, then introductory economics, then finally websters dictionary).
Anyone got a link or two?
I totally agree. Even LinuxToday, beaten up to death some time ago by /. , was respectfull of the schedule and at least up to now did not announce
anything (which by the way is natural since there was no announcement yet).
Yesterday night I saw 3.0 in ftp.kde.org, and I almost posted a story (not supposed to be published) asking the /. editors to please NOT announce anything until the release was official .
Then I thought, no, they will not do that again. Oh well ...
Just consider. Presume that 97.5% of Slashdot readers will be courteous. No, make that 99%. That means that only .01 will react inappropriately. Say that there are 10,000 slashdot readers who are both discourteous enough and interested enough to do the download (with a 5 second interval between tries).
.05 seconds. How long does a response cycle take?
Then that gives 100 people trying every 5 seconds. This averages one try every
Now try to make a better guess at the real numbers.
There are things that are wrong to do because of the effects that you can predict with fair certainty that they will have. In fact, those are the only things that are wrong to do (they are also the only things that are right to do, but that's a separate discussion).
It is fairly certain that the posting of this story will cause the distributing servers to become clogged at nearly the worst time. Causing this to happen sounds to me like an ungood thing. If you do something, and the effects of doing it are predictable, then those effects are caused by what you did. Therefore this posting is the Slashdot editors causing the KDE servers to be overloaded.
I'm not saying that the individual downloaders aren't also culpable. But that sure doesn't exonerate the Slashdot editor.
I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
The news story they posted isn't true. KDE 3.0 has NOT been released yet.The fact that there are some packages on their ftp site does not mean it is a release.
The KDE 3.0 release happens when the developers say that the release is official, and slashdot should respect that.
The KDE developers *are* being reponsible. They put the packages on the main ftp site so that the mirrors could mirror it. They were obviously going to wait until the mirrors had finished before announcing it.
This has nothing to do with violence and video games or any other half ass analogy you may try to make. This is clear cut and simple. Slashdot ran a false news story about an application that has not been released yet.
It's not even been announced yet, so please don't take down kde.org by slashdotting it. Use a mirror, list here. I got it from the Norwegian mirror which was very fast for me (I'm in Norway, YMMV, look out your window and check). It's a cool 100 megs though.
"Oppression and harassment is a small price to pay to live in the land of the free." -- Montgomery Burns.
Then, why are you still reading Slashdot ? Go read some MSNBC or stuff. Maybe Slashdot posted this one because it got submitted a lot ?
And what is this Katz-bashing all the time ? If you don't like to read stories from him then just don't ! Go to your preferences and exclude him from the authors you'd like to read from.
Slashdot is not a news site like C|NUT or The Register or whatnot, it works totally different. Keep that in mind.
First you don't even know when to stop posting ridiculous stories on 1st April (one or two may be funny, half-a-dozen isn't).
Then you can't wait for the fucking official KDE 3.0 announcement, which would have included details about mirrors, screenshots, compiling instructions, etc.
I found a fast mirror... Stay away!
I must say that Konqueror 3.0 looks really good with antialiased fonts and great themes!
Kde 3.0 is an awesome release, that surely will help Linux to gain some users from you know who :)
Have any of you really checked the ftp out. It maybe full 350/350 ANONYMOUS user. But I could still get a prompt for login quick. I'm sure the mirror sites have their OWN logins to get data so I'm sure its not going to be a problem mirroring to other servers. I think some of you need to work on your research rather than your homework. As thats only true way to learn.
Here are some of my screen shots (CVS version 3.0.5) I've installed all the fonts which come with windows XP pro, and i'm suing the high performance liquid 0.9.2 in some of them. 1 2 3 4
dmarien
I got the anti-aliased fonts working and the desktop shortcuts with Konquerer, Kmail, Kppp and OpenOffice and she was happy.
_ __
The woman mostly surfs the web and reads email anyway and it works for her. People tend to over-estimate the needs of most home users. Linux on the desktop is really just a matter of setting up the icons and menus in a logical fashion and listening to the end-user on what to change.
She has not asked about changing window decorations and styles and basically found her self jumping on and working immediately. For her the OS does not really matter along as she can open that attachment her friend sent her in Word format.
_______________________________________________
ACK
I can't wait...
Best Slashdot Co
Although I am still working on getting connected the to ftp server and have not yet installed it, I have seen some Screenshots of the 3.0 theme and think it's overall smoother and more professional looking than 2.2.
Saying Java is nice because it works on all OS's is like saying that anal sex is nice because it works on all genders.
They never said it was released. In fact they actually said there wasn't an announcement yet. They only said its out there on their ftp site. So the story was quite true. There are packages available and they are publicly available.
Slashdot does not /. a site, the users do. Put the blame where blame belongs. /. Posted a story which was NEWS, if the users of /. beat the tarshit out of the KDE ftp server before the mirror is up then the fault belongs to the users and the sys admins that are incapable of handling the load.
This is like saying that Napster shouldn't have let the cat out of the bag on mp3 sharing until the music industry had time to react. Tit-for-tat, be consistent.
My $0.02 will always be worth more than your â0.02, so
Are your truetypes well integrated? "less $(xlsfonts)"
Do you use a recent freetype2? The later the better. Earlier versions CRASH on certain fonts.
Do you use Xfree86-4.2.0? No version before that is recommended with fontaliasing.
Do you use the right qtlibs?
Moritz
Linking to the kde.org ftp site before they've had a chance to mirror and announce it first is like bombing a hospital.
No it's not. It's not even close. If I really have to explain why, it wouldn't do you any good anyway.
Nope, no sig
This is at least the third comment about this. If KDE wants to not have everyone downloading it, they can put it on CVS! Public, or non-public.
./ hadn't announced it. Monday Slackware 8.1 beta was released, and their servers were down to a crawl, yet the announcement hasn't reached slashdot or slackware.com yet.
When KDE puts it on their ftp, they are releasing it, it's not after the stupid release announcement. I have a feeling that it would be overloaded even if
"And we have seen and do testify that the Father sent the Son to be the Savior of the World"
1 John 4:14
Has anyone else had problems compiling QT with -xft on Mandrake 8.1 ? Despite having XFT working in 2.2, when I specifiy -xft in configure, it still compiles without it. Anyone?
S.t.e.v.e.
Who modded this post as "insightful"?
I can't see any reason why this is supposed to be insightful. There IS NO "desktop war"!
No, there is no war between GNOME and KDE
wether you believe it or not, that is the truth.
They aren't fighting over anything, this is healthy competition people! KDE wouldn't have to so far if GNOME didn't exists, and GNOME wouldn't have been so far either without KDE.
You don't believe me? Subscribe to the mailing list, congratulate the developers about that they won the "Linux desktop war", and they will flame at you instead, saying that the desktop war does not exist.
Still not convinced? Both GNOME and KDE have already decided on a unified launcher format (.desktop files), drag and drop (both QT and GTK+ support Xdnd) and cut & paste (the clipboard code in QT 3.0 is fixed, so yes, you CAN cut & paste properly between GTK+ and QT apps). Now they are even working on a unified theme format.
Really, comments like this make me sick.
You're acting as if everything in life is meant to be competitive and to kill each other.
Try Mandrake 8.2. If you don't install all the server stuff, everything (yes that's including GNOME + KDE + development headers + compiler) fits within 800 MB!
There's a solution for that different nonprofit projects' FTP main sites that don't want to be hammered before mirrors catch up.
Junkies posting stories to Slashdot use ftp.
Mirrors use rsync.
So just make it so that rsync and ftp processes access the release directory as different users on the server.
Don't allow access to the FTP user on the new release directory for some time until all mirrors update through rsync. Only then chmod the latest release directory to let anonymous ftp users in.
Chmod only takes a fraction of second to execute.
So in addition, there will be no poor soul that in a hurry would download a partially copied, uncomplete file...
The guys probably put the release in the FTP to allow the mirrors to update themselves BEFORE the official release being announced. Now, the main FTP will be slashdotted and the mirrors will have a great difficult updating themselves, harming everyone worldwide except a few greedy users that will be able to download KDE3 two or three days before the rest of us. Great job indeed.
The fact is that either Slashdot is a common journalist enterprise, that will break the news no matter what or they are part of the community that reads and feeds them and eventually pays for their existence. If it is the former, they are perfectly right. If they have any intent to keep being the latter, they just do this community harm for the joy of publishing something some hours ahead of other sites. Not to mention that the KDE team would probably be glad to break it first to Slashdot and that other OSDN site, FreshMeat.
Let me start out with saying that I think the Debian people are doing a good job with the resources they have. I love the distribution and the ease of upgrades. It takes a lot of time to package something correctly ahearing to all the Debian rules, but it's starting to annoy me how if I was just running Redhat, I could be running KDE 3 already, whilst it'll probably take another 4 months or so for KDE 3 to make it into sid. Maybe this is one of the downfalls of Debian, because of the strict packaging guidlines, authors aren't willing to release .debs because of the ammount of time it takes to package them.
I suppose I could just grab and compile it myself.
I didn't write, "is the same as bombing a hospital," I wrote, "is like bombing a hospital." If you don't understand how simile works or can't see what kind of similarity I did mean then explaining it wouldn't do you any good.
Linking to the kde.org ftp site before they've had a chance to mirror and announce it first is like bombing a hospital.
Unless there are people in desparate need of KDE (without it, they'll die!), this has got to be the stupidest analogy I've ever seen.
- A.P. (need my GNOME i.v. drip!)
"Remember when the U.S. had a drug problem, and then we declared a War On Drugs, and now you can't buy drugs anymore?"
I'm pulling down the Redhat rpms at 154K and I'm not telling any of you where I got it from. yayaya prepositions at the end of sentences blah blah blah
semantics. Similes are meant to establish either:
-a comparison of similar degree
or
-a comparison of similar nature
Your "simile" does neither. It's only vaguely comparable in nature and degree, and therefore, it is invalid.
Does anyone know off hand how I can get diffs from beta2 to KDE3 final?
I would like to conserve bandwith of the mirrors and I'm sure that a lot of other people would like to do the same.
Thanks in advance for you help.
If I remember my 7th grade English classes correctly, a simile expresses noteable similarities between two different things. Thus, you were expressing a noteworthy similarity between the killing and wounding of the sick and their care providers to showing a large number of people that an ftp site has software they might enjoy.
Don't try to deny that you made a completely rediculous statement. Instead acknowledge the fact that you obviously just smoked a slab of rock, and move on.
Also, it would be an important example of how usenet binaries serve and important and legal purpose.
I would really support a Slashdot code of ethics that says: you can't announce major software before the developers do unless you have already posted it to Usenet.
Does anyone have the list of KDE packages that I need to dump? Obviously, rpm -qa |grep kde would be a start, but I think there are other KDE packages aren't obvious.
:)
Thank you in advance.
Ant(Dude) @ Quality Foraged Links (AQFL.net) & The Ant Farm (antfarm.ma.cx / antfarm.home.dhs.org).
For service pack 2 !
KDE is a major memory hog. I personally run FluxBox. No comparison on speed.
DRINK DUFF (responsibly) DRINK DUFF (responsibly) DRINK DUFF
In my experience, if you run sid, it usually takes less than a week to get a new release of something. The main exception is XFree86, because it's such a complex package and completely vital to almost every system, and so the maintainer is (rightly, IMHO) very change-averse.
I would be surprised if it takes more than a week for KDE3 to hit sid. If you want the increased stability of woody, you have to wait a little bit longer, but you don't get days like today where python is completely broken.
I'm pretty sure there have been aptable repositories for KDE3 provided *by the Debian KDE maintainers* for some weeks already (as a GNOME user myself, I wouldn't know for sure, but I've seen it mentioned). So the bulk of the work is done.
The GNOME2 betas are a little harder to play with, because unless you want to destabilize your existing GNOME setup, you can't parallel-install GNOME2. Nonetheless, most of the beta is packaged, if you're willing to take the risk of installing it.
There are some freeBSD packages at freebsd.kde.org, but they are not yet right. There is at least one known problem. They will be re-generating the packages soon, but they would like experts (those who can work around the current known problems) to find any other problems that need to be fixed before a general release is done.
A general release will probably be on freebsd.kde.org long before anyplace else. I'd expect ports to be updated in a couple days though, so cvsup once in a while.
Thanks for the link, bro.
Fuck, why did I have to run out of Mod points this morning? You deserved one of them.
That does clear up things a bit... thanks.
To remove the old packages and install the new ones, run:
/where/you/downloaded/the/KDE3/RPMS
:(
cd
rpm -e `rpm -qa |egrep ^kde`
rpm -Uvh *rpm
I still think I will be dealing with dependency issues as you noted.
Ant(Dude) @ Quality Foraged Links (AQFL.net) & The Ant Farm (antfarm.ma.cx / antfarm.home.dhs.org).
Why? Because if you copy Windows, you set the user up with expectations on how the system will perform. Yet in KDE even simple stuff like the menu clock and copy and paste are different. KDE looks like Windows, but lacks the core functionalities. I know a ton of "just starting to become tech nerds" people who've installed Red Hat or SuSE out of curiosity and end up thinking that Linux=2nd rate Windows.
In the long run, difference pays off. The first time I used a UNIX box, I took one look at ugly old X Windows and knew right away that it was very different from my Windows 95 box. The difference piqued my curiosity, and I ended up learning a lot about UNIX (HP-UX to be exact).
KDE will never out-Windows Windows. And it shouldn't try. Since it's a different OS, why don't they take that opportunity to offer a different desktop, one without all the inconsistencies of Windows?
(-1, Raw and Uncut is the only way to read)
Let the techies get to the stuff before it's announced, so the general public isn't locked out of the servers...
Hate to break it to you, but 'the general public' is not going to be downloading KDE!
"And like that
That's why there are distributions - so that these problems can be ironed out by people with the time to do so. If you were going to install (and possibly compile) by hand an updated major version of the Windows GUI, you wouldn't be too surprised that there were some issues, would you?
Fonts will be fixed out of the box in new distributions that include KDE 3. This is not a problem for the mainstream user. Lack of applications is maybe a problem, but configuring fonts is not.
Your right to not believe: Americans United for Separation of Church and
Keep in mind that Debian had packages in sid for kde 2.1 and 2.2 way before redhat. At the time there was alot of grumbling from redhat users, if only I used distro x..
News is news. Read the /. tagline. Is this news for nerds? Yep. Is it stuff that matters? Yep. I guess it's also news for whiners who like to bitch about slashdot. Maybe whe need a new site: slashwhine.org where people can go and complain about stuff.
I came here to see what peoples' reactions to the install of 3.0 were. Now I have carpal tunnel from scrolling through thousands of bytes of people who screech like a penguin with a cpu fan up its wazoo. Guess I entered the wrong "community."
Last, sigh, then maybe I'll shut up. News isn't to protect the subject, it's to inform the public. You decide what to do with it.
BTW: Does anybody know if the WYSIWIG Problems
f ice-1.2-release-plan.html the WYSIWIG problem will be solved in kword 1.2, wich means several months of waiting.
of KWord are solved?
not yet. according to http://developer.kde.org/development-versions/kof
What ? Me, worry ?
Taking a look at http://download.us.kde.org/pub/kde/stable/3.0/Red% 20Hat/i386/ just now, it doesn't appear that there's anything there yet, or even in the src directory. Is this really out or is this just slashdot jumping the gun because someone created a 3.0 directory structure under stable?
Um, Mr. flipflapflup, there is evidently something you do not know. For a high-visibility package such as KDE, in order for everyone to get it, it has to get to the mirror sites. That's why when a release is made and put on a site, no announcement goes out: this is to allow at least a day for it to get to all the mirrors. If some dork posts an alert to Slashdot prematurely, the primary site gets hammered and the mirror sites can't get in. Everyone suffers from horrendously slow downloads from the primary site.
What's scary is that CmdrTaco evidently still does not realize this, and continues his irresponsible policy of announcing releases prematurely.
First, if you shout fire in a crowded theatre and people get crushed in the panic, then you're responsible, not the movie theatre for not being able to handle the rush.
Secondly, most sites (except the largest commercial ones) certainly can't handle 1/2 million slashdotties all hitting them at once, so to put the blame on the site just doesn't cut it. If slashdot wants to be a good netizen then they should warn web masters before linking them - especially if they're going to be hit with a gazillion attempts to download a huge tarball.
They used ports to generate the packages; they're waiting on the official release to put them on CVS.
Have trouble in Trig?
There seem to be some packages in the Conectiva and FreeBSD subdirectories.
you're right -- it can only hold 17 Gb minus 60 Mb after you install KDE -- maybe you should invistigate a NAS solution
dmarien
Since when?
Alien claims to work on RPMs, apparently converting them to .deb files.
Has anyone tried this with KDE3? Or have alien horror stories?
---Your karma ran over my dogma
They need to write a script which can automatically download and install kde, similar to garnome
If you use Linux, please help development of Autopac
Careful man... some of the younger trolls might start hitting you up for your sister's name and phone number. I mean... she uses Linux and hates Windows! ;-)
"I may not have morals, but I have standards."
Why don't you try another distro like Gentoo?
The KDE3 maintainer already said that the ebuild for kde3 will be out tomorrow.
ebuilds are source++ you just do an "emerge kde3" and it downloads the source and compiles (with options perfect for your machine) it and installs it. It will also automatically download anything it depends on and do the same - ALL FROM SOURCE. So with one command you get a perfect build of KDE3 with no hassles.
Also note that we have had a kde3cvs ebuild for a while - where you just do "emerge kde3cvs" and it grabs the source from CVS and compiles/installs it - so if you want to live on the BLEEDING edge you can.
Gentoo really is amazing - you should check it out.
Derek
I hate to defend slashdot here, but if they didn't put out the information first, another news service would. If slashdot didn't report this newsworthy information, then I would question the ethics of slashdot. People might even switch to a service that would report this.
As far as I'm concerned, this was a mistake of KDE to put this on their FTP site before announcing it. I'm sure there is a better mirror system than putting the files up before releasing them.
Does KDE by any chance now support edge flipping (IE. Move your pointer to the edge of the screen and jump to the next screen)?
This is the single reason that I can't use KDE for more than about five minutes before becoming totally exasperated. I use this feature CONSTANTLY in Gnome. What's the point of having four desktops if I can't move to 'em quickly? (I know I could probably do this with keyboard shortcuts, but it's not the way I work).
KDE 1.X had this feature, and when 2.X came out I switched to Gnome. Seriously, the coolness of this feature is what got me hooked on Linux desktops in the first place - it is, to me, the most useful feature of any desktop environment/window manager.
Anyone wanna code this into KDE for me?
There has been a lot of discussion about KDE 3.0 here, but I haven't found one bit about why 3.0 is better than 2.0.
Heck, I can't even find that on KDE's site.
They'll probably have that up soon. Can someone fill me in on why 3.0 is a must-have.
Go Gusties
So... I guess it is not out yet!
I had some problems getting the right support RPMS with my RH 7.1 system, but that's nothing I'm not used to.
As noted here by someone else, it's a little slow to start up. I wonder if that is an artifact of it starting up for the very first time. The look and feel are very similar KDE 2.2.2 for me.
The big difference so far is performance. Menus snap into place quickly, window operations are faster, pages render more quickly, the file manager is fast, and so on. My computer has a 300Mhz Celeron.
Also, a lot of web pages now work correctly, where they didn't in the 2.x series.
Overall stability is unknown at this point.
Your design to a real part online: Big Blue Saw
Posted by CmdrTaco on 10:17 AM April 3rd, 2002
from the congrats-to-our-gumshoes dept.
Fred Furburger noted that KDE 3.0 is on mirrors-only site. There is no official announcement yet, but this looks like the real deal since it is on the mirrors-only site. Updated by HeUnique: No debian packages yet, because the mirrors-only site seems to be down. Don't know why...
A Government Is a Body of People, Usually Notably Ungoverned
Head over to #kde on irc.openprojects.net for the release party :)
XML is like violence. If it doesn't solve the problem, use more.
Well, since KDE3.0 was only officially released a few hours ago, I don't see how Redhat can have packages ready for it yet.
I suspect what you're referring to is KDE3.0-RC3. In other words, not the final release.
A Government Is a Body of People, Usually Notably Ungoverned
I am using KDE2 with antialising turned on. The main problems are:
1. Use that new libXft that a big article was posted about in Slashdot a few weeks ago.
2. The defaults in KDE are awful, apparently it picks the first font alphabetically if it can't figure things out, which is some unreadable cursive thing called "Arioso". Changing all this was a chore, as the control panel is unreadable, and there were a zillion bugs so that the fonts kept reverting. Log out, log back in, try to fix them again, repeat a few times, and eventually I got them. Still get that cursive font every now and then.
Anyway after that bit of hell, it does look quite nice. And I did not do any of the stuff people say is needed: I did not install Windows fonts and I did not edit the .xftconfig file.
KDE3.0 I hope will fix these problems:
1. When they turn antialiasing on, default to something usable. Even better is to ship KDE with antialiasing turned on by default.
2. Change the font selection to select everything in pixel size (rather than "point size") so that the sizes don't change when your X server is upgraded to something that claims a different resolution (this also caused some pain for awhile). If they insist on this, please allow users to select fractional sizes. I would also round to the nearest pixel size if the selected pixel size is within about .1 of an integer (this may be Xft's responsibility).
3. Distribute the fixed libXft as part of the distribution so everybody gets nicer fonts without having to think about it.
Seriously, I don't want to start a flame war, but I've tried to run KDE a couple of times, and I keep switching back to Gnome. I'm not saying that Gnome is better than KDE, but I have yet to find a compelling reason to throw out all the experience I have with the Gnome tools and way of doing things, to learn Just Another Window Manager.
My question is, what does KDE offer that Gnome doesn't? Why should I make the effort to switch?
Your Servant, B. Baggins
KDE 3.0.0 final tarballs were released to a group of packagers 9 days ago. That's how everyone has final packages, and that's why I have some packages that end in _3.0.0-1_i386.deb.
We have had experimental debs for some time, but have not wanted to release them to the public as they weren't ready for general consumption. The only release that was vaguely public was the whole RC4 fiasco, and its being made public was not my doing.
* cough*
KDE3 won't enter sid for a while yet; not until woody is released. Don't hold your breath. The reason we do this is because KDE2.2.2 currently takes up about 2.5gig of archive space, and forking with KDE3 would not only cause havoc with the woody release, but it would also make it impossible for us to issue any 2.2.2 fixes, and bloat the archive massively. I'm not going to be a party to this.
*cough*youwillhaveanaptsourcefrommeinabout12hours
With situations like this I don't think the editors can do anymore (or less) than they did. The fools who have nothing better to do at 9am in the morning than build and install a X.0 release of kde deserve to be frustrated with slow downloads or timeouts. Meanwhile those of us who wait until it is convienient to upgrade aren't bothered at all and we have the benefit of the ignorant masses finding all the bugs for us. I say post the story and let the chips fall where they may. Maybe if this sort of thing becomes too disruptive to the kde team they will submit a story themselves early with the request that it be delayed until the mirrors are ready.
If the distro doesn't work right, complain to them - they're supposed to be integrating this sort of thing. Fonts are not a problem with recent RedHat or Mandrake distributions, for instance. I really don't care if you use or like Linux on the desktop, but don't say that it isn't usable on the desktop, because I know plenty of people including myself who are quite happy with it.
Personally, I don't see the whole font problem at all, but that's just me. As long as I have a fixed-width and a variable-width serif font then I'm just fine. I don't see much of the point to having a zillion font choices that all look alike, except that some are anti-aliased and thus are fuzzy as hell too.
Your right to not believe: Americans United for Separation of Church and
>If you don't like the lack of professionalism at Slashdot, don't go here.
/. calls attention to something like this, then OTHER PEOPLE suffer.
The man was pointing out the FACT that when
Don't give me this lazy "Oh yah it's like free speech, man, you don't have tuh..." cod philosophical bollocks.
We're talking about CONSEQUENCES of ACTIONS here, you fool. You come across like a 13-year old schoolboy who's just read Teach Yourself Existentialism, and I'm frankly astounded you were modded up for it.
"And the meaning of words; when they cease to function; when will it start worrying you?"
Who wins the desktop war is something which always appears whenever some new from GNOME or KDE appears in /.
Well, so now it's time to say my opinion: no one will win the desktop war. Or at least, I want to think that. I don't Linux/UNIX to become a Microsoft world with one look, one Micro$oft browser, one Micro$oft desktop, one billionaire, one fence with one Gate...
I want to be free, like Linux, I want it open, with lots of things to choose. I like to change between KDE, Gnome, WindowMaker. Right now I'm using Gnome, but I got really excited with the new version of KDE. I'm probably going to switch to it after I download and install it - I like to try new things :)
So, for all of those who only see one good and one bad in the world (computer games, holywood movies and american policies vision of the world...), I hope that you don't succeed.
Gnome, KDE and all the other developers - keep up the good work!
It sure feels better, but I did a comparison on my terminal server (1/2 gig of ram and 850 Meg Duron). The total RSS from "ps aux | grep kde | grep user" for KDE2 to log in was 76 megs. For KDE3 to just log in was 104 megs.
I guess you have to sacrifice something for preformance. Ill stick with GNOME.
-- 4 8 15 16 23 42
Well Thats what I want. Ok so you use Xrender, wheres keiths alpha channel extention? I've been waiting for that and hes been working on it for what seems like years now.
If you use Linux, please help development of Autopac
Unfortunately the linux development world is often extremely hostile towards usability people. Usability is largely viewed by many linux developers as a BS field of study. Practitioners of usability engineering are told that they are doing nothing more than simply whining or, in the words of one kernel hacker "I can't believe people actually get paid for criticizing the work of others." Usability problems won't go away in KDE or GNOME because they are not problems with the underlying technology (mostly) they are problems with the way that certain humans (i.e. programmers) think. Debugging people's opinions is a hell of a lot harder than debugging software.
I came to X using a Sun Workstation running whatever it was called then. The I used Motif, I always loved Motif. Then under Linux OpenLook, then Motif, then WindowMaker, then GNOME and KDE. For the last few years I've been using KDE and occasionally GNOME.
Last week having discovered the joy (best word for it) of running OS X on an iBook (best computing experience for about 12 years!), I decided on FVWM2. It is clean, fast and nice looking, and does everything a window manager should do: manage windows, be clean and fast and look nice. A friend has just switched to twm - we're amazed at how we fogot about how great X is and how great these window managers are.
My point? Ditch these heavyweight Windoze look alike window managers and all this gimicky Linux Desktop stuff and get back to the using lightweight, efficient WMs and using X as a distributed windowing environment. Stop restricting X, free yourself!
I'm just waiting for the KDE 3.0 to get into sid, so I have a few questions for people already using it:
1) Is it really faster? I keep hearing this, but apparently, most people think fast actually means slow. I've been trying to find a decently fast desktop for my 1.5GHz/256MB Athlon XP, and so far, only Fluxbox+GTK fits the bill. It runs Galeon, Evolution, etc at a pace only slightly slower than Win2K on my 750MHz Duron... Still, I like KDE better (prettier, certain apps like KDevelop are nicer than comparative GNOME ones) but so far, 2.2.2 is unusably slow. I don't want to hear anything about packages and optimizing and whatnot, been there done that. I'm running Debian sid with 2.4.18 + xfs + preempt + lock-break + O(1) sched, with X at -11 (per Debian defaults) and Fluxbox at -10. Doubt I can optimize much more. I just want to know: Does KDE 3.0 finally make KDE even remotely comparable to (well-optimized installs of) Win2k/XP?
2) Did they fix the annoying font display problems? There is this peculier issue with all KDE applications that causes the Microsoft Courier New font to be displayed very strangely. The text itself is fine, but it looks like all the lines are double spaced. When using Courier new in KDevelop or KWrite, one gets about 70% as many lines on screen at once as one can in any GTK+ or regular Xlib program. I've seen this problem reported in a few places (such as here ) but I've never seen a resolution. I doubt its on my end, since I've had this problem in every single install of KDE 2.x I've ever used, including Mandrake and Debian.
3) Does anyone besides me think that the whole OS-X UI on Linux is an asthetic nightmare? First, I don't much like the OS-X look. Second, KDE isn't OS-X. It's KDE. It should have it's own personality. It's getting hard these days to find a theme that doesn't look like some other OS. Even then, the themes are never as well put-together and consistant as the originals they copy.
4) Is it hard to understand that you can have good looks without all the glitzy, performance robbing features? I have yet to see a Linux UI that matches the elegance and polish of BeOS or MacOS. In the end, the UI does little more than move some bitmaps and text around the screen. XF86 4.x on my RivaTNT can blit 3000 100x100 bitmaps to the screen every second. It is trivial to make a UI that looks good (which is more a function of the quality of the drawing in the bitmap) and is also fast. Additionally, stuff like transparency and animation, while nifty, doesn't make up for the fact that there is not a single Linux UI that looks polished and elegant. GTK+ looks dated, and 3rd party themes are of depressing quality (and not really developed much anymore, apparently). Plus, GTK+'s container mechanism makes for some rather annoying display quality. Resizing a Gaim window, for example, causes the 4 icons along the bottom to spread farther apart, to the point a comical distance seperates them. KDE is a bit better, but there are still many places where it just doesn't look professionally put together. It's like American cars vs. European cars. Sure American cars have all the things that European cars do, but they're just not as well put together.
A deep unwavering belief is a sure sign you're missing something...
Looking at the file list it looks like KDE 3.0 includes the file "arts-1.0.0-1.i386.rpm", yet my KDE222 distro, and a few others I've checked, have the file "arts-2.2.2-2.i386.rpm". Any idea what gives, or is someone's version number out of sync?
UNIX? They're not even circumcised! Savages!
I already downloaded the bare.i from the Slackware 8.1 "april fools beta" as is called on the slackware ftp. It's a 2.4.18 kernel on the boot disk, which is really nice. They also included SysV junk.
It's only 1.4mb, download it for yourself. It is in the Slackware-current directory.
"And we have seen and do testify that the Father sent the Son to be the Savior of the World"
1 John 4:14
I agree that this is a problem, but isn't it poor planning on the part of the KDE developers that allowed this to happen?
I mean, why would they open up the anonymous ftp until *all* the mirrors had a chance to sync up? Shouldn't they use password protected ftp or some other mechanism to get the binaries to the mirrors *before* opening up the anonymous ftp servers?
Even mailing a harddrive over snail mail to the mirrors and having them all set it up before opening up anonymous ftp anywhere would be better than asking the mirrors to get it from anonymous ftp along with the rest of us!
and where are these packages, kind sir?
*cough*youwillhaveanaptsourcefrommeinabout12hours* cough*
:)
Well, so much for my big night out. Guess I know what I'm going to be doing at ~4:32 AM
I can see it now, "Sure baby, we can go back to my place, but first I've got to update my sources.list and upgrade to KDE3."
"Ohhh, I love it when you talk dirty......"
Silly me, responding to this nonsense.
/. article Koffice is being developed by a group of around *six* people and the progress they've made so far is remarkable given their slender resources.
Please note that I use both KDE and Gnome, although mostly KDE, but I am formally involved in neither project.
Executive summary: the original writer is an ignorant bigot obsessed with licences and the fact that he can't program closed-source programs in QT without paying anything. He believes corporate support from Sun and HP is a fine thing for Gnome (didn't do much for CDE, though, did it?) but corporate support for KDE from the vastly smaller Trolltech is somehow sinister. The rest of his points are either (a) purely subjective, eg integration and look of the interfaces (b) flogging dead horses (eg the *alleged* GPL violation of KDE 1.x) (c) actionable libel, notably his accusations of a *funded* astroturf campain on behalf of the KDE team (d) childish and baseless character assassination of the KDE project and anyone or anything involved in it (e) vapourware or FUD.
Anyway, here's my point-by-point response:
"The KDE project is famous for its funded and organised trolling of weblogs and message board associated with Linux and Free software/open source. Outrageous newbie impressing claims are made for the software and huge quanities of FUD are spread to destroy competitors. If this sounds familiar, then you are correct, most of these tactics were lifted straight from Microsoft's arsenal of dirty tricks."
This is an outrageous slur! Some proof please? Remembers, extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence... In particular, who pray tell is funding this campaign?
I'm not aware of Gnome lacking in advocates!
Myth #1 - KDE is more integrated than GNOME
Yes it is; the application and dialog behaviour is far more consistent and the structure is modular with applications able to use a wide variety of services. I'd expect the gap to narrow as GTK develops further.
Myth #2 - KDE is easier to use
Yes it is, because of greater interface consistency and (for most users) its much criticised default Windoze look&feel (see above).
Red Carpet seems to run fine on Red Hat but it's a nightmare on SuSE which I use; I've found it worse than useless.
I note that you have had to include Ximian tools to propose superiority over KDE; this is like me saying that, say, a SuSE-enhanced KDE with the same tools would be a match.
Myth #3 - KDE is more popular
"In what sense? Arguably more people use KDE, but it is a close run thing. "
You've just said it - you believe KDE is more popular.
Commercial use? Name me one HP and Sun which *right now* ships with Gnome as its default interface. And stop trying to sell futures (just how late is Gnome 2 running???)
Myth #4 - Konqueror is the best Linux browser
It's the one I most use because it is (a) faster than Mozilla (b) has extremely flexible cookie handling (c) has that nice Duplicate Window feature (d) renders nearly everything fine (e) works really well as a file browser as well.
Yes, it has problems with Javascript (apparently fixed in KDE 3). For those pages that give problems I use Mozilla. But I don't use Mozilla as my default browser. For me Konqueror is *the best all-rounder*. Your mileage may vary; browsers are subjective things.
Since when is Nautilus the default Gnome browser rather than work in progress???
"Myth #5 - KDE applications are better/more advanced than GNOME ones due to the ease of developing in C++ using the Qt toolkit "
KDE's applications have been written from scratch. Gnome in many cases (eg GIMP and OpenOffice) has taken on board as "Gnome" applications that were already well advanced before Gnome was out. I have no problem running either of these applications under KDE; does that make them part of the KDE project?
Please note that as per a recent
Please don't bullshit about how wonderful Gnome 2.x will be; I thought it was the KDE people who spouted vapourware... Please compare KDE with what Gnome has out *now*!
"Myth #6 - KDE is faster and takes less memory than GNOME "
I'm not a developer so I can't comment on your accusations about programming style, except to say that I would have thought that the much-touted Gnome advantage of being able to use any language rather than just C++ would make script kiddies far more at home than in KDE.
The gcc problem I understand is a very real one with c++ and the KDE crowd are as aware of that as anyone, and that pre-link etc are interim hacks.
I haven't done detailed tests but AFAICS Gnome and KDE run at pretty similar speeds on my machines; certainly there isn't enough difference for it to be a deciding factor.
"Myth #7 - GNOME development is slower. KDE releases faster. "
My greatest criticism of the Gnome project is the AFAIC amateurish way it is managed. KDE has maintained a far more disciplined development environment (easier partly because they have consistent releases of QT to build on) and keep hitting release target after release target. It seems to me that in Gnome too many things are going on at once (incrementally developing the toolkit as well as the applications and environment all at once) which makes development a less straight-forward and more iterative process.
"KDE is destined for noisy advocates porn and MP3 boxes." Please explain? I've worked in IT for twenty years, am in my mid-forties and use KDE as my standard work and home desktop. Oh, sorry, this is just another totally baseless slur.
"Myth #8 - The Qt toolkit is cross-platform and yet takes advantage of each individual platform "
And GTK compares how?
"Myth #9 - TrollTech is a friend of Free software
To Be Written. Ideas: Qt started out as non-Free. KDE developers knew this violated the GPL, didn't care, stole others' GPL code by porting it to link (in violation of the license) with Qt and are therefore untrustworthy. KDE core developers work for TrollTech. Expensive per developer licensing for writing closed-source with Qt, and hence KDE. Trolltech only moved towards the GPL because of the success of GNOME. Labyrinthine licensing nightmare (3 licenses to deal with). Gradual migration of features belonging in KDE into Qt (and so into TrollTech's IP portfolio), allowing easy porting of apps to the revenue generating Windows world (see TheKompany for a perfect example), thereby making KDE an irrelevant launcher of Qt applications. Claims made that Qt is GPL, while true, hide the real truth. There cannot be a real fork of Qt for the KDE project: Core developers work for Trolltech; any fork would need to be full GPL and hence ban any closed-source apps from KDE altogether (all KDE apps must link with Qt); Any commerical licensees of Qt (non-GPL) would and could only follow TrollTech. KDE is stitched up good and proper. "
Right, this is where I get really angry.
a. the GPL violation was *on RMS's definition of the GPL*. Fair enough, he wrote it. Note however that KDE was started by Germans who may have well understood it quite differently in translation and Europeans are less litigation-obsessed than Americans anyway. I believe that there was an honest misunderstanding and belief that they were fulfilling the spirit and letter of the GPL
b. "stole others GPL code". Not this chestnut again! The only GPL code that was wrongly linked I understand was a small part of the KDE 1.x printing code. This was corrected in KDE 2. No *developer* has ever come through and taken on the KDE team for this; it was a storm in a teacup initiated by the RMS cheer-squad to provide further justification for Gnome (which frankly I believe started off as an NIH exercise, with the licence issue a rationalisation).
The KDE developers were and are not "untrustworthy"; they merely formed an interpretation of the GPL which did not correspond to that of RMS. As they had a different first language and were in a different nation in a different continent with a quite different attitude to litigation this is understandable.
Or should only English-speaking Americans be allowed to develop GPL software? Oh that's right; Sun and HP are both American companies.
"KDE core developers work for TrollTech."
Let me get this straight: Sun and HP funding Gnome is OK but TrollTech, a tiny Norwegian concern, funding KDE isn't???? Are you for or against commercial sponsorship of open source software development?
"Expensive per developer licensing for writing closed-source with Qt, and hence KDE."
!GASP! You mean if you want to make money from closed-source apps Qt should be entitled to some? The bastards....
"Trolltech only moved towards the GPL because of the success of GNOME."
KDE is full-GPL now, so that is irrelevant. I should say, however, that effort via the early days of Gnome *for the sole purpose of sabotaging a competing project for the sole reason that its developers disagreed with a license interpretation* was the ugliest and most self-defeating (Micro$oft must have been laughing their arses off...) activity I've ever seen in the free software world.
"any fork would need to be full GPL and hence ban any closed-source apps from KDE altogether"
And your problem is?
"Any commerical licensees of Qt (non-GPL) would and could only follow TrollTech. KDE is stitched up good and proper. "
And it doesn't matter for GPL apps, which is what I thought we were most interested in. Is Gnome stitched up by the support of Sun and HP?
"Myth #10 - KDE is more than attractive, but GNOME/GTK is ugly
To be Written. Ideas: Mosfet liquid theme is an ugly and unstable hack. GNOME GTk icons are better thought-out and of a far higher quality than the poorly drawn and cartoonish and confusing KDE ones. Qt is basically a Windows-look on a Unix platform. "
Frankly, despite my use of KDE, I've always thought Gnome looked prettier on its default install. Remember however that the Windows-look interface to KDE is only a default and there are plenty of other icon kits you can use. Mosfet's theme, by the way, runs great for me and does not seem to make the system more unstable (and it has been extremely stable).
And back to the beginning:
"It is my hope that this, in some small way, will redress the balance and re-introduce two things almost eradicated by the KDE project: Honesty and facts. "
Nope, lies and more lies.
If you were using Debian Linux, installing KDE would be as difficult as typing:
apt-get update
apt-get install kdebase
This causes apt-get to automatically search for the required software packages, and then it installs them in the correct order - automatically.
But for some reason, people think that using a Redhat based distro is easier and more user-friendly. They are wrong. Of course, apt-get exists for Redhat based distros, but because it doesn't rely on the Debian community, policies, and package sources... its not as good.
So in other words, you're saying *BSD is dead, right? :)
Does anyone else here find it kind of stupid how these release numbers are going? SuSE 8, Slackware 8 (magically skipped versions), RedHat 7, Mandrake 8. It's like they're competing for the highest version number. And then it comes to GNOME 2, KDE 3.. wtf are these guys doing? Trying to attract people with higher version numbers? Boy.. good luck to NetBSD :)
Damn Slick
Great Job to all the KDE team!!
1 Question, when, if ever, will we get an installer?
> That's why when a release is made and put on a
> site, no announcement goes out: this is to allow > at least a day for it to get to all the mirrors
Surely surely surely, the people who run mirrors should have their own ftp accounts, they should not be using an anonymous acount. So then all these people could be told about the new release, go and get it, etc. If the kde folk didn't want anonymous logins clogging there server, they wouldn't put the new files available to anonymous users.
And sorry for calling you Shirley.
No, the arts-2.2.2 is incorrect. The real version of arts shipped with kde 2.2.2 was 0.4 or 0.6, kde3 ships with arts 1.0. So your distro numbered the arts after the kde version numbers and not the arts version numbers. If they keep it up, it shouldn't matter (and you'll get arts-1.0 sold to you as arts-3.0), if they don't, go hit them with a stick ;-)
Subpixel rendering is really only useful for LCD monitors. It knows that LCD pixels are made of RGB,RGB,RGB elements, and can address them like rGB,RgB,RGb to move the pixel horizontally to the most accurate location (here the capital GBR and BRG represent two white pixels that only have an unlit g element between them). If you try to do this on a CRT monitor where the RGB elements don't have a 1:1 ratio with pixels, you get strange colored crap around your fonts.
Seriously, though, I tried rc3 and it was great(a bit unstable, though, but it was beta)... I'm now downloading kde3 release. Why aren't there any mandrake rpms?