Slashdot Mirror
Best Buy Uses DMCA To Quash Black Friday Prices
Sethb writes "It looks like Best Buy didn't learn from Wal-Mart last year, and has now invoked the DMCA in order to prevent FatWallet from posting information about what items they will have on sale the day after Thanksgiving. Hopefully FatWallet will stand up for themselves again, and Best Buy will be laughed out of court."
Major Book Publishers use DMCA to quash blurbs and book reviews!
This law is getting just a shade ridiculous.
ill be saving lots of money by sticking with ad-busters "National Buy Nothing Day" on "black friday" and sticking up for our culture.
or whats left of it.
have fun at wal-mart suckers
Using the DMCA to block competitors off selling products you're not even the sole distributor seems be a braindead concept. But then, there are lawyers as well....wasn't there an important sentence in King Lear about that profession?
At least the Germans have some laws governing sales, so they have some logic in there.
...or does everyone else have a HUGE list of businesses they refuse to do business with?
And Best Buy DOES seem to have some pretty good prices, too, at least on new-release DVD's...
I'm not saying the DMCA oughta cover this, but this is definitely something that can hurt business.
Try not. Do or do not, there is no try.
-- Dr. Spock, stardate 2822-3.
I always thought that prices per se can't be copyrighted. Now situation when people post scan of upcoming ads (which was not the case with BestBuy and FatWallet) can probably fall under copyright violation, as only author of that page can lawfully distribute it (short of posting it with design/layout critique and "never use this font in publication" kind of thing :) )
:)
In this particular case it's not worth it anyways, as most of the deals were easily available from other retailers for about the same price. It would be good though, to finally get those lawyers into the court and get a precedent of them being slapped with "No can't do" decision. That way any upcoming price-related DMCA cases would be still-born
Hyperom.com
This is a troll but the grandparent isn't?
Stupid pot smoking mods.
What about the rest of us, who are 'merely' people, and not incorporated profit-driven organisations?
At first read I thought to myself "What the hell?!" but now that I sit back, chug my daily dose of caffeine, and think about it, I wonder if maybe Best Buy is in the right and has an interest in keeping their items and prices under their hat.
;)
As said above, releasing such data would cripple Best Buy's ability to price and stock their items strategically. But on the other side of the coin, I believe BB would benefit much more by having the data released to a limited degree and allowing people to at least see WHAT will be on sale. If I wanted a new notebook all year (I do... Christmas gifts anyone? =P) and saw that BB had the model I wanted on sale, I would be inclined to stop in and see just how much cheaper it would be.
In the end, BB has a vested interest in keeping the exact prices secret, but can benefit from the releasing of rough item descriptions and price deductions. Also, the negative publicity they would get from this would just be shooting themselves in the foot and making them seem like they have something valuable to hide.
I wonder... if they want to keep the sale information secret, will BB have big men in suits standing at the door searching for camera and writing utensils as individuals walk in and out?
Thinking outside the box is so big now that doing so is really putting youself back in the box. There is no box.
Yes. The grandparent of your post is offtopic, whereas the parent of your post is troll or flamebait (this is why we need a disgusting mod - too much kiddie porn and goatse on /. lately).
So the grandparent post didn't deserve a modding down?
I don't get it.
I still have my response emails from Target, Wal-Mart, and Best Buy from last November/December when the same thing went down. They basically said, "Our prices are designed to help our customers save money and these 'hackers' are violating your rights as a consumer as well as ours. We shall defend ourselves by any means neccesary"
What a joke.
i have to laugh to myself every time i see Big Business using the DMCA to inhibit competition, filter innovation and silence people talking about pricing rumors.
It's silly things like this that further illustrate that the DMCA is a Bad Thing(tm).. it's this kind of evidence we'll need when it comes time to take it to SCOTUS
*prays*
What's the legal justification/argument for this? I don't see how you could hope to apply the DMCA here, but then again I've read the law is hopelessly vague so I guess anything's possible.
Hi! I make Firefox Plug-ins. Check 'em out @ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/youtube-mp3-podcaster/
Is it the primary purpose of society/government/law to protect business?
The primary purpose of government/law is to further the advancement of society; but unfortunately sometimes we lose sight of that.
I'm sorry, but you really jumped the gun there. He didn't say that using the DMCA in such a fashion was right (in fact, quite the opposite). He just said that businesses do have a legitimate concern in this case.
Most corporations really aren't evil. The government does protect them (read: not the primary purpose), but that's because most businesses do a huge public service. The rest of us work for those businesses. Who else would we work for?
Slashdot: Where people pretend to be twice as smart as they really are by behaving like children.
"Is it the primary purpose of society/government/law to protect business?"
Not exactly but it is their responsibility to foster a healthy economy and promote jobs for its citizens. If a company is not doing well then the economy will be affected and jobs will be lost so in a way it is the primary purpose of the government and laws to protect businesses.
devise, to quash news of the creators' newclear power, planet/population rescue initiatives? not surprising eye gas?
don't worry about phonIE corepirate nazi MiSinformation/censoring devices, such as va lairIE/robbIE's whoreabully infactdead (not working at all) PostBlock(tm) devise.
for example:
--Due to excessive bad posting from this IP or Subnet, comment posting has temporarily (forever, if we knew what that meant) been disabled. If it's you, consider this a chance to sit in the timeout corner. If it's someone else, this is a chance to hunt them down like with fuddles' corepirate nazi bouNTy hunters ?pr? scams. If you think this is unfair, we don't care.--
consult with/trust in yOUR creators... get more oxygen on your brain. seek others of non-aggressive/positive behaviours/intentions/motives. get ready to see the light.
couldn't be simpler?
Seriously. I don't see how their "secrets" of what items are going to be on sale at what time should be priveledged information. They should do a better job of keeping their secrets if they don't like it.
On the other hand, maybe if I find out (hypothetically) that the printer I was going to buy tomorrow at Fry's will be 20% less at Best Buy, I'll wait to shop at a Best Buy.
"You spoony bard!" -Tellah
FIRST REPLY!
Never, in the history of the company, has Best Buy had an advertised sale item on the shelf. So it's a moot issue anyway.
Friends don't let friends shop there, they are a terrible store.
---
SCO is weenies
Gator is Spyware
Microsoft is thugs
Sec. 512 F of the DMCA:
`(f) MISREPRESENTATIONS- Any person who knowingly materially misrepresents under this section--
`(1) that material or activity is infringing, or
`(2) that material or activity was removed or disabled by mistake or misidentification,
shall be liable for any damages, including costs and attorneys' fees, incurred by the alleged infringer, by any copyright owner or copyright owner's authorized licensee, or by a service provider, who is injured by such misrepresentation, as the result of the service provider relying upon such misrepresentation in removing or disabling access to the material or activity claimed to be infringing, or in replacing the removed material or ceasing to disable access to it.
another glorious headline for the company that pays my bills. sometimes it hurts :(
WTPOUAWYHTTOTWPA
What's the point of using acronyms when you have to type out the whole phrase anyways?
what else could it be?
.contracts renewed.
& oe =UTF-8&q=world+opinion+u.s.+war&btnG=Google+Search
/out at almost everywon whois experiencing the results of their owned whoreabull stock markup fraud/?pr? ?firm? hypenosys FUDgePacking(tm)?
.asp on that. when the lights come up, there'll be no going back, & no where to hide.
from a mynuts won post previously titled:
no 'stuff that matters' answers on google?
maybe not to corepirate nazi puppets? the rest of US however, don't give a fud about getting your 'advertising'
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8
lookout bullow. get ready to see the light. tell 'em robbIE? tell 'em about the monIE. you're quick to
gnu millennium spells doom for stock markup frauds, aka corepirate nazis, aka the walking dead
that's right. J. Public et AL has yet to become involved in open/honest 'net communications/commerce in a meaningful way. that's mostly due to the MiSinformation suppLIEd buy phonIE ?pr? ?firm?/stock markup FraUD execrable, etc...
truth is, there's no better/more affordable/effective way that we know of, for J. to reach other J.'s &/or their respective markets.
the recipe is:
consult with/trust in yOUR creator. vote with yOUR wallet. more breathing. seek others of non-agressive intentions/behaviours. that's the spirit.
use key words/indexing to identify yourself/your products.
the overbullowned greed/fear based phonIE marketeers are self eliminating by their owned greed/fear/ego based evile MiSintentions. they must deny the existence of the power that is dissolving their ability to continue their self-centered evile behaviours.
as the lights continue to come up, you'll see what we mean. meanwhile, there are plenty of challenges, not the least of which is the planet/population rescue (from the corepirate nazi/walking dead contingent) initiative.
EVERYTHING is going to change, despite the lameNT of the evile wons. you can bet your
we weren't planted here to facilitate/perpetuate the excesses of a handful of Godless felons. you already know that? yOUR ONLY purpose here is to help one another. any other pretense is totally false.
pay attention (to yOUR environment, for example). that's quite affordable, & leads to insights on preserving life as it should/could/will be again. everything's ALL about yOUR motives.
Just because you have a way to make money doesn't mean it's illegal for someone else to detract from it.
I mean, come on, get real.
Lots of things can hurt business.
Your competitor selling stuff cheaper than you can hurt it.. should that be wrong too?
She's had many visions that have come true and today she had one vision of horrifying clarity. She just called me about having seen a cataclysmic taking place next week. "Black silhuettes of mangled corpses, adults and children, flying in searing hot wind against a bleeding red sky pierced by a square tower made of four smaller towers with needles at the endpoints."
Scary stuff. She was really shaken by it.
I won't be buying anything that day. Why go to the store at all? It will be crowded, people will push and shove to get their hands on the lastest, bestest, cheapest item, forgetting *why* they're there in the first place.
This 'holiday' has gotten so far away from the original meaning that it shouldn't be called 'Christmas' anymore.
Society, marketing and more marketing shames everyone to buy, buy, buy. Makes me ill to see 'Christmas' decor up *the day after Halloween*.
Spend time with your family and friends. Let them know you love them. Give them a gift, even. Just don't get sucked into the 'holiday spirit' of finding the best deal on Takgagamoochi cards or whatever.
Your time is the best gift. Or old Playboy mags.
It's usually beneficial to the consumer when this sort of competition is started. A prime example where I live is Meijer vs. Wal-mart. When Meijer arrived, the price war that followed was a great one for us consumers. I imagine that a similar thing might happen in this case.
--a
America has been based on consumerism for the last 50 years. Doesn't that make it part of American culture?
Much of a store's profits are made on strategy. When this kind of data is released, it cuts into the ability of a business to price things appropriately to the demand.
I'm not saying the DMCA oughta cover this, but this is definitely something that can hurt business.
There is no such thing as a right to profit.
Businesses will try to get as much money as they can from their customers, while customers will try to get what they need/want for the cheapest price.
Using the DMCA to deny a customer's right to find a beter bargain is just another sympthom of how much the system is skewed in favor of business.
Big stores often try and undercut the smaller stores by reducing prices on some items to the point where money is lost for the sole purpose of forcing smaller stores to close their doors. Eventually this leads to a monopoly. I would argue that even if you have two large corporations that share an industry it is still a monopoly.
Price strategies for small stores where there are 100's of competitors should be protected. They all have different things on sale at different times. But when there are only two or three chains, then there is no reason to protect this information, and a good reason to release it. By releasing this pricing information you give the small mom and pop stores a heads up. If best buy is going to blow out VCR's at a loss of 10 dollars a VCR, it might not be a good year for Dad's Electronics to stock up on VCR's.
Maxtor 120GB 7200RPM Internal HD w/8MB Buffer - $50 A/R
SanDisk 256MB CF Card - $40 A/R
SanDisk 256MB SD Card - $50 A/R
DVD XCopy: Gold - $20 A/R
Norton SystemWorks/AntiSpam/Firewall 3-in-1 package - $0 A/R
Lite-On 4x Multi-Format DVD Burner - $80 A/R
Samsung 17" LCD Monitor - $280 A/R
ATI Radeon 9600 128MB - $70 A/R
Sony P-10 5MP Digital Camera w/free 64MB MS - $400 A/R
Canon Powershot A70 3.2MP w/free 64MB CF - $300 A/R
Just one in particular :)
Companies making small computing devices like routers and PDA's seem to like Linux quite a bit.
At the Univ. of California, at least, we are not allowed to release student information such as grades to anyone, including parents, without the student's permission. See e.g. Section IV(B) of http://www.ucop.edu/ucophome/policies/bfb/rmp11.ht ml.
Where's the logic in this? Sure there are people who go and buy a bunch of stuff just because it's cheap, which is equally as dumb. However if there are products that you'll probably buy anyways that happen to be on sale, you're only hurting yourself. I'm always amazed by the people who try to be "non-conformist" but end up supporting the system they're trying to fight against.
Anyone have a link to the actual scan? There must have been some good stuff on there!
The rest of us work for those businesses. Who else would we work for?
Maybe ourselves? If all the corporate owned chains in the country went out of business and were replaced by mom-and-pop stores, you wouldn't see any tears from my eyes.
Okay let's assume for a moment that these (let's call them) "lawyers" are professionals of the legal profession. This assumption would lead one to understand that these "lawyers" are reasonably intelligent, educated and keep current with the practice and application of law.
Given that there has been prior failure of the exact same application of the law we fondly refer to as the "DMCA" and assuming they are aware of this, then it is clear that these "lawyers" are not interested in using the "DMCA" as it was intended and are instead using it as a refridgerator. (As a means to apply a "chilling effect" to anything that might seem like competition or might otherwise endanger their profitability.)
I know I am really out on a limb here suggesting that these "lawyers" would even dream of using law for purposes it was never intended. But I'm just presenting a possible explanation for their behavior without suggesting they are morons.
Hopefully FatWallet will stand up for themselves again, and Best Buy will be laughed out of court.
No, no, NO.
If Best Buy gets laughed out of court in the middle of December, they've already won. Fat Wallet took down their ads, had to hire a lawyer, free speech was stifled.
I am sad to see that FatWallet blinked this time, after staring down Walmart and getting them to back down. The argument that facts cannot be copyrighted seems solid, and the DMCA shouldn't change that (except for removign due proes, of course.) We need this case to go to court, and the countersuit to be pursued even after Best Buy drops it two weks after the fact.
Fuckers.
The only possible good outcome here is if Fat Wallet stood up, kept up the ads, and countersued.
The DMCA doesn't change whether something is copyrightable, and facts
Okay, the DMCA is designed to make illegal to circumvent the copy control technology on a copyrighted work. So how, exactly, does the DMCA apply here?
File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
If regulations prevented this disclosure, it would be a case of government actively restricting what citizens may know and share about the goods and services on the market, for the purpose of benefiting corporate profits.
Yet this is precisely what you admit to.
Do you honestly believe that this behavior, in principle, is acceptable?
How far shall the government go in blinding consumers to benefit the corporate bottom line?
Please let us know; I'm sure Consumer Reports would like to start making plans now if their publication will be banned for distribution in the United States next year.
Go to hell.
The good bargains have been taken down (maybe slashdotted?) Please them post here;)
The DMCA protects encrypted content from decyphering and illegal copying. But sending plain HTML over an encrypted link is entirely different. SSL protects the pipe between the server and the client from third party interception. There is no 'cracking' involved since the client and server agree on the encryption algorithm and keys to be used before the transmission takes place.
When all else fails, run.
This is so true. Best Buy is King of never having items in stock you want to buy. They are also the best at screwing people out of rebates. On two occasions even though I included the receipt, the actual UPC seal etc, they have flat out lied and said something was wrong and they couldn't issue the rebate. What am I going to do? Sue them over a $20 rebate? Bunch of mother fuckers they are. I think its bestbuysucks.com that's a great place to go to read about how shitty a company they are. So many people have been screwed by them its just not funny. Amazingly the employees feel the exact same way. If you've ever wondered why the 4 guys in blue shirts run away when ever you walk up to ask a simple questionn its because they hate their job, their manager, and especially customers. Bad Karma at that place.
If you wanna get rich, you know that payback is a bitch
Actually, the first and second posts in this thread need modded down, and most of this whole thread needs to be modded offtopic, except for the discussion on how it needs to be modded...
You may get mom and pop selling you computers, but they won't be building the circuitry.
Slashdot: Where people pretend to be twice as smart as they really are by behaving like children.
Reads article..
Oh! This is great! Thanks for telling me about it BEST BUY !!
While it was meant as a joke, and im sure few will even see it:
This is true, in this day and age, companies rule the earth.. ( that and government )
If you think you can avoid them totally, good luck living off your home farm, and walking everywhere.. its not practical.
Or try avoiding paying taxes for that farm when you cant walk to work.... see how far that gets you..
---- Booth was a patriot ----
So, for the rest of the world: what is FatWallet (when they aren't being DMCA slaves), and how did they know Wal-Mart's planned prices when nobody else did?
Best Buy got sued a while back because a guy in the Washington D.C. Metro Area was shopping for a new laptop and went store to store with his old laptop writing down prices and features because he wanted the best value. Best Buy didn't allow this and even when so far as ripping off price tags. This guy took them to court for false advertising saying their attitude didn't reflect their name "Best Buy". Judge ruled in favor and said if Best Buy wanted to practice that type of behavior, they would have to post a sign in the front that said "We do not allow competive shopping". Needless to say, Best Buy changed a few things and I think the guy got a free laptop out of them to boot.
If you could post those here, it'd be really good reading. Your paraphrase was probably close, but it doesn't make sense (of course, the original emails didn't either!) :)
creation science book
For those of us who missed the FatWallet posting, what did it say? Curious...
Hahahaha...as the FBI are generally considered by "people who know" to be the only major commercial producers of kiddie porn, it's very likely that they know all about those sites.
Excellent investigative reporting.
Even if Best Buy delays the prices for just a week it's done it's job. The reason the prices are kept secret is because they don't want their competitors to know.
And they'll loose a pittance on the suit while making bank on the sale.
GJC
Gregory Casamento
## Chief Maintainer for GNUstep
This isn't another child pornagraphy link.. Is there anyway to see what it is before you click on it....? Or maybe where it is really linked too...
You can't copyright facts in the US. (Although see the draft intellectual property rules of the Free Trade Association of the Americas on database copyright.) So take the info from the ad, and convert it to a table of items and prices.
People who buy from bix box stores are not interested in quality or even watching for sales. They shouldn't care if Fat Wallet mentions their sales.
Yes. The grandparent of your post is offtopic, whereas the parent of your post is troll or flamebait (this is why we need a disgusting mod - too much kiddie porn and goatse on /. lately).
Would you please check the "No Karma Bonus" box when posting offtopic like this? That way the mods waste less points on you, you loose less karma, and I don't see you post nor feel the need to go read the trolls you are discussing just to figure out what's going on.
Everybody wins.
P.S. "Troll" Applies to the offtopic porn postings, no need for a new label. They get modded down, that's all that matters.
You can't take the sky from me...
You may get mom and pop selling you computers, but they won't be building the circuitry.
There's no reason a cooperative can't be formed to own a chip fabrication plant. Except of course that monopoly chip manufacturers wouldn't allow it.
This 'holiday' has gotten so far away from the original meaning that it shouldn't be called 'Christmas' anymore.
No kidding! "Christmas" used to be a fun celebration of the winter solstice, something especially important for those people living in Northern Europe, where the winter nights are especially long and dark. A good reason to get together with friends and family, exchange gifts, and cheer up the season.
And then those stupid mystical religious people had to come along and appropriate it for themselves by connecting it with the supposed birthday of their "prophet". Bleah.
If not, there can be no truth in her visions since they'll always come from the Lord of the Lies, Satan.
I strongly urge you to ask God for help!
why does the US have this law?
A blog I run for the wealth
You can't unarguably make this statement either.
I'd say the primary purpose of government/law is to give citizens the tools they need to protect thsemselves and their property.
I always use the BINDS Link Safety Checker. It basically compares the link against a database of known nasty links and tells you if its safe or not. Really cool.
General/Corporate Inquiries
For general comments and questions about Best Buy Co., Inc., contact:
Best Buy Co., Inc.
Corporate Headquarters
P.O. Box 9312
Minneapolis, MN 55440-9312
This story hasn't gotten a lot of attention outside of FatWallet's forums and Slashdot. If this activity bothers you, take a few minutes, write a letter, lick a stamp, and let them know you're paying attention. They are very unlikely to win if this goes to court, so they don't need a whole lot of motivation to stop the idiotic activity. I, for one, won't be patronizing their store again. I mean really, if you need your "retail" electronics fix, they have plenty of competitors who offer the same junk at the same high prices.
Kick them a letter and thank them for making the choice of where to shop a little easier.
"God is dead!" - Nietzsche
"Nietzsche is dead!" - God
Not exactly but it is their responsibility to foster a healthy economy and promote jobs for its citizens.
Care to prove this?
You might as well have said that it is the responsibility of government to insure that every citizen has access to milkshakes.
From godaddy.com: Profanity error
:( And im too lazy to check anywhere else.
It wont let me
DMCA is not the best approach for Best Buy, or anybody else, but there is a serious problem with people posting prices ahead of time...
1) it's private information, probablyy under some kind of NDA.
2) the "leaked" ads can cause people to go and buy the stuff ahead of time, which counters the intended effect of the ad. Furthermore, it screws customers that weren't privy to the extra info.
3) it screws the company on the "best price" strategy, since other companies can market the same price.
this really screws up some of the economics of "draw" products, I think ethically, people should be bound to protect it.
They produce a product which, in the end, really contributes very little to society besides, admittedly, keeping a lot of people employed.
Well, I'd say that's a pretty big contribution. Proportional to the number of people employed, in fact.
Not only that, but they fund artistic and socio cultural events too: Free outdoor concerts that advertise beer, TV shows brought to you thanks to the support of their advertisers (and sometimes, viewers like you), etc.
Sure, they are often annoying, intrusive, stupid, insulting, degrading, dammaging to the social fabric and just plain wrong, but they are not an homogenous force of evil, they contribute too, sometimes.
But anyway, my point wasn't that advertisers need to be gotten rid of - but that the Corporations have no business whatsoever trying to keep accurate and information information out of the media.
On that we are in total agreement.
You can't take the sky from me...
We don't want....them. Us vs. them. If 'they' trusted 'us', we might trust them. In the mean time...give 'em hell.
Here it is: Your IP address is 192.168.1.1. See how smart I am? Eat that wanker!
Oh! So that's what this thread is about. Seriously, I thought maybe the article was written by these fine reporters or something!
The Simpsons Season 1, The Italian Job, Anger Mangement, Chicago, 28 Days Later, Charlie's Angels 2, The Lion King SE: $11.99 each (DVD)
Madden 2004 (PC) - $14.99
RCA 52" Rear Projection HDTV - $1000
Daewoo 42" Plasma TV - $2300 A/R
Panasonic 5.1 700-Watt Home Theatre w/progressive scan DVD player (speakers are built into stands) - $500 w/$50 free gift card
600-Watt version of above w/o speaker stands - $350 w/free $50 gift card
Bose 3-2-1 Home Theatre System - $900
Pinnacle Studio 8 - $0 A/R
MS Digital Image Suite 9.0 - $20 A/R
Canon ZR60 MiniDV Camcorder - $300 A/R
MAG 19" LCD Monitor - $430 A/R
SanDisk 256MB USB Memory Key - $40 A/R
Sony Clie SJ-22 - $100 A/R
Casio 2.3" Handheld TV - $40 A/R
APC 350VA UPS - $5 A/R
FujiFilm FinePix A303 3.2MP - $150
Maxtor 120GB 7200RPM Internal HD w/8MB Buffer - $50 A/R
SanDisk 256MB CF Card - $40 A/R
SanDisk 256MB SD Card - $50 A/R
DVD XCopy: Gold - $20 A/R
Norton SystemWorks/AntiSpam/Firewall 3-in-1 package - $0 A/R
Lite-On 4x Multi-Format DVD Burner - $80 A/R
Samsung 17" LCD Monitor - $280 A/R
ATI Radeon 9600 128MB - $70 A/R
Sony P-10 5MP Digital Camera w/free 64MB MS - $400 A/R
Canon Powershot A70 3.2MP w/free 64MB CF - $300 A/R
so much for that - the editors have already pruned out dmca-able material.
Besides this crapola repeat of the free speech throttling WalMart deal I don't shop anywhere they charge a restocking fee. I don't return stuff that wasnt broken when I bought it or just pure crap. Charging be a restocking fee becuse you sold me junk is bogus. Best Buy can bite me.
As you can see I don't care about my karma.
http://www.virus2.net
this is not a troll. just beware of lots of java and flash.
I think the establishment of communist and socialist governments argue against this thesis.
the growth in cynicism and rebellion has not been without cause
> Maybe ourselves? If all the corporate owned chains in the country went out of business and were replaced by mom-and-pop stores, you wouldn't see any tears from my eyes.
No, because you'd have died of starvation years ago. What, you watched Fight Club and really believed that crap about clothes that last a lifetime and growing crops on highways?
Well, I'll tell you. They are associations between real-world events/objects, wishes, fears and memories, and their veiled representations in one's mind. In short, veiled imagery the unconscious mind uses to communicate disturbing/repressed thoughts to the conscious mind. They are usually experienced only in dreams, but may also emerge because of a mental illness or under the influence of drugs.
So when you read my post so that I said "red sky equals high, you got it wrong. I do not mean that the high would produce visions of a red sky. Only that even (unconscious) craving for the high may be associated in her brain with sky and hence shown as such in the dream/vision.
Yeah... And do you honestly think a jury - or even a judge - will know the difference between encrypted data and unencrypted data over a secure medium? suuuuure.
Learn about Photography Basics.
...in the U.S., the laws are no longer created to protect the interests of the citizens. Laws are written to the specifications of large corporations and their lobbyists, and "justice" goes to the highest bidder. If you want free speech, what you say had better not offend anyone who can afford more expensive lawyers than you.
"Can't you people just wait until Thanksgiving??"
It helps to know before hand how much money to make available to spend while the frickin banks are still open.
Not everyone has $5000 laying under the seat cushins, especially in the Bush economy.
I don't know about other jurisdictions, but in BC, a notice served after 4:30 isn't considered delivered until after 8:00am the next business day... I think it's intended to prevent stupidity like this. I wouldn't be at all surprised to find that Best Buy timed their email to arrive after the lawyers had gone home.
There's nothing like the fear of the unknown to get people to do stupid things.
Free Software: Like love, it grows best when given away.
I'll be working for triple time!
Well if I want to I may take the week off(with pay) and mumble something about how little I'm making and wait for the BIG FAT Raise!
Eat shit and die loser get some skills!
Absolutely
BestBuy is nothing but a shit hole. When the chain came to our area, I was happy to see it because Circuit City did not cut it for me. I hoped to see a better selection, lower prices and somewhat educated sales people. Yeah, right...
What we have here is a complete clusterfuck that is full of high school dropouts, stupid managers and anal security folks who check my bags everytime I come there. The prices are not as good as on PriceWatch and the service is poor. In fact, I am not going to purchase a single item from them after one of the sales people told my friend that a more expensive video card had a longer life span than the cheaper one (ATI 9800 was the cheaper card in this case).
I have to admit, their initial DVD collection was impressive compared to what their competitors had to offer. But it all changed after I got a high-speed internet connection.
A common argument tactic is to push the debate into a false dichotomy--all or nothing--is a commonly used one. We see this with the MPAA/RIAA in copyright extension and copy prevention techniques (which attempt to keep you from making even non-infringing copies). In this instance, since you can't avoid doing business with all the companies that hurt you, you are somehow ethically justified in avoiding none of them. With this logic it's okay to throw up your hands in disgruntlement then pay to see the next Star Wars movie, buy proprietary software, or the next flashy tech trinket you want.
Don't fall for this trap. Nobody is asking you to avoid all companies that harm you. You can choose to avoid some of them and still lead a perfectly productive and entertained life. Start with the easy ones like major movie and record publishers. You might even save a few bucks in the process (which you might choose to spend on organizations and artists that aren't trying to restrict your freedom to share). With other goods and services, you can find alternatives. You can tell businesses that don't hurt you why you're willing to buy stuff from them instead of their competitor. Don't let the best be the enemy of the good.
Digital Citizen
Can we all just interpret this to mean that Best Buy admits their prices are higher than their competition?
;-)
After all, if their prices were lower they would want to tell everyone so people would shop there, right?
'Sensible' is a curse word.
The goal is to SCARE fatwallet into removing prices. Sale prices are FACTS and you cant copyright FACTS. The NFL cant copyright the outcome of a football game (Team X 30, Team Y 27), because it is a fact that Team X beat Team Y, however they can and do copyright the tv/radio description of the game.
The Doormat
If you're not outraged, then you're not paying attention.
> What about the rest of us, who are 'merely' people, and not incorporated profit-driven organisations?
We are employed by those businesses, and live off their goods and services.
I've already mirrored the information on my meager ISP webspace: http://web.tampabay.rr.com/mblitch/bf2003/
a sp ?id=home
Other mirrors are up. Use the example of bittorrent and help spread the load and information. I have not seen nor read any complaints from Best Buy, so I do not know what their issue may be.
http://www.andy-akb.com/bf/
http://www.uswebstreet.com/~cmptrdude1/default.
http://cpanel19.gzo.com/~every/blackfriday/
http://www.quepons.com/blackfriday.html
Cave, wreck, and deep diver.
no we haven't, we've just become more specific - want we want is to further the advancement of American society.
One thing to know...
If you have advanced knowledge of what Best Buy will put on sale 2 weeks from now, you can buy that item today from them at the higher price, and then claim the 110% price protection offer they make to get an additional 10% of the discount. In fact, you can do the same to Circuit City using Best Buy's sale, or vice-versa because Circuit City has the same "price protection" policy.
Therefore, they don't want you to be able to see their price drops coming... and that's why sale info is top secret until the day the sale goes into effect, at which point it's public info.
The primary purpose of government/law is to further the advancement of society; but unfortunately sometimes we lose sight of that.
Maybe we lose sight of that because damned few of us agreed that was the purpose to begin with.
Some of us might even wonder whether the "advancement of society" was a meaningful phrase at all.
Phiwum's law: anyone that names an obvious law after himself and then puts it in his own sig is just pathetic.
Buy the items on the leaked list NOW then return on Black Friday to claim your price protection discount.
I love capitalism!
When when the politicians realize they've created a monster?
Fucking bastard! That link was foul!
Keep in mind most of the deals are via large rebates, and those rebates are probably only valid for dates X through Y, and I bet X is on the day after turkey day. So while you may get a lower price, you probably wouldn't get the rebate.
Nice thinking, though.
I saw an interview with a few police officers on the local news channel here in Milwaukee, WI. The officers were neither for nor against these speed trap websites. They basically said as long as people slow down in the problem areas, they don't have a problem with it.
How the hell is posted what's on newspaper ads a violation of the DMCA? It's not as if the postings themselves circumvent a copy protection mechanism. Hell, newspapers aren't copy-protected, let alone the ads themselves.
In fact, in some cases you can see the ads in their entirety online (http://newspaperads.mercurynews.com/ for example). It's where I get Fry's ads (remember the fiasco with Fry's Electronics and Fry's Ad Website, a non-profit community site that posted scans of frys ad so ppl at work or school and those don't have immediate access to the newspaper can see what's on sale, etc.)
O well....this black friday thing with BestBuy isn't new. They did this a year ago too. Like the old Japanese saying goes, "only death cures stupidity."
The Sunday, November 16th weekly ad was also pulled Saturday morning. This is worse because the early edition of the Sunday paper was already available with the Best Buy ad included.
The BF posting only listed about 8 items.
Actually, if the moderators don't rein in the goatse and kiddie porn, I'm going to stop coming here. I don't know how Slashdot makes its money, but I won't be helping with it anymore.
That stuff, like the people who post it, comes from the bottom of the hull.
If that is what Slashdot is about, then I'm outta here.
Isn't this sort of potential disclosure of trade secrets covered by existing law? Can't Best Buy claim that the information was stolen? It seems that a court would rule that since any disclosure of such information serves no public interest, the information is the exclusive property of Best Buy.
What annoys me are all these mail-in rebate promotions these companies use. When you factor in all the added wasted time and the fact that the company holds onto your money so long and it's like pulling teeth getting it back, it's not worth it.
Rebates are taxes on laziness, or more appropriately a false-advertising campaign designed to target people who aren't inclined to jump through the hoops necessary to get the rebates. If the company does an "instant rebate" at the time of purchase, that's another matter, but my policy is I do NOT buy any product that promises a certain price "after rebate" - that's BS. What I pay at the POS is the price of the product and I'm not giving the manufacturer additional information or worrying about documentation, mailing crap and keeping track of that malarky. I encourage everyone else to avoid any product promotions involving rebates so we can send a message to these retailers that we're not going to play their stupid false advertising game.
Who cares if people know what the exact items on sale are gonna be? If anything, it helps Best Buy. I mean, if I knew that a certain video card I wanted was gonna be on sale, I'd plan to buy it from them.
They're gonna tell us the items on sale anyway.
It amazes me how Best Buy, or anyone else, thinks this is remotely illegal. This world is populated with whining babies.
We have secretly replaced these Slashdot mods' sense of humor with a rusty nail. Let's see if they notice!!
So it is in the government's interest to let FatWallet continue as is. The internet is only going to continue to expand consumer information, so business plans that rely on hiding information from the costumer are going to fail. Best to let it happen slowly so that these stores can get used to it and change their business plan to compensate.
This is actually a pretty nasty way of using an anti-competetive tactic against them. If you study game theory, you can see that the 110% protection they offer really only allows both stores to sell the product for more, and is thus anti-competetive (e.g. the Nash equillibria rises when they use this trick).
Wanted to make a couple points perfectly clear. When we rec'd the dmca notification and electronic delivery of a copy of a subpoena, it was late on Friday night. To be on the safe side, we acted to remove the specified information to remove any potential liability. (as legal counsel was not immediately available for guidance) Saturday was spent putting together the legal team, the real work starts tonight and tomorrow. Last year, Wal-Mart backed down before we filed our Motion to Quash - it remains to be seen what Best Buy's attitude will be in the battle of intellectual property counsel. We certainly do not believe that there is a legitimate copyright issue at hand, but as I had stated to Best Buy before information was even posted on our site, the potential for "trade secret" does exist here, but it is their responsibility to protect their intellectual property. Once a trade secret is made public, trade secret protection is no longer available. I am not a lawyer, and I didn't stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night - But this is where the current thought pattern is - stay tuned for more details early this week. Tim Storm President FatWallet, inc.
Sorry, that's just too tin-foil for me. What do you mean "wouldn't allow it"? If you could put together a stable business model where a cooperative could sustainably produce chips -- yeah, it would be allowed...what conceivable way could it be stopped? What possible rationalle would the powers that be have to WANT to stop it?
Eventually, they will have to get past DMCA's and start suing the releasers directly...lots of work.
The whole "black Friday" thing is a marketing game to get you in the stores. There's only so much time to get in and out of each store...that's the "hook" to the great deals. You have to decide which deals you think are more important and generally plan for only 2-3 major shops for the day..with the long lines and all. That makes you try to get other gifts on your list that AREN'T on sale jsut to get the shopping done! that's how they get the $$$$. Posting everything online weeks ahead of time isn't really fair...but I guess from a marketing standpoint, they really should just deal with it...or stop whining after the ad is released publicly....but the issue right now is that the ad is NOT PUBLIC YET. So they have every right to C&D. Best thing would be to force every single printer to make new adds with different prices 3-4 days beore the holiday...FOR FREE!
Remember WACO and Ruby Ridge? The gubbermint doesn't want competition. Threatening to replace big companies with communist cooperatives threatens big governments traditional money flow.
LOL!
Already taken! Redirects to bestbuy.com!
Of course, it is probably exhilarating as hell and I would love to dive. However, my damn pulmonologist keeps harping about pulmonary barotrauma and asthma. Fuck it...
Incorrect, according to the time stamp, the other guy posted it 5 minutes before you.
Funny, maybe. Off-topic, yes. Insightful?! Hell no!
While the DCMA is clearly the wrong route to stop the leak of information, the pre-release of sale pricing could hurt Best Buy. Best Buy spends a lot of money calculating "lift" or increased sales certain ad placement will yield. Not only could this effect the calculations by having more people hold off to buy a product at the sale price -- it also gives competitors an advantage. Best Buy might have legal grounds to go after the site for publishing "trade secrets". This almost boarders on corporate espionage; someone is stealing sensitive internal data. It would make more sense if Best Buy offered to not press charges if the site gives up their source. After all -- who has more lawyers? Even if they can't win BB could make the little guy's life a living legal hell.
Hopefully they will sue you for sources! After all, that info is under NDA somwhere, someone violated that contract...and you are a business, not a member of the press...you have no "right" to free speech here. After they sue you for sources, they should make YOU & your source pay for new ads with different prices...the ones you reported were not "offically" released, they are under no obligation to honor them under any consumer protection law! Part of the agreement of course would be to never publish Best Buy prices again...which you would willingly sign...should they sue you for the extra liablity or lost sales...lawyers on commission are very good at "numbers"! Sorry to burst your bubble.
Mastercard explicitly denies the same, but mentions on their website many banks choose to do so voluntarily.
every day http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Random
I used to have to deal with the math involved in credit rating.
Having, and using, a major credit card shows lenders you can handle your finances. so you get points for that. the more points, the 'better' your credit.
Now you can loose points if you debt is too high. Generally, what is too high depends on your income.
When you use a debit card, you have just given somebody complete access to your bank accouts.
Not even considering intentional fraud, how often are mistakes made? you buy something for 9.99, and then get charged 99.99. that would come out of you bank account immediatly, and you would be screwed.
If you use a debit card, I suggest it is off a seconf accout that you transfer oney into.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
WTF? If it is so "top secret", why is it customary for Sunday newspaper inserts to be sent to the delivery folks on Wednesday or Thursday before the date?
And best buy's 'price protection' would only match the price up to 30 days after the sale, it doesn't give you 110%.
Get a clue...
What do you mean "wouldn't allow it"?
I mean they'd use their monopoly powers to put the cooperative out of business.
If you could put together a stable business model where a cooperative could sustainably produce chips -- yeah, it would be allowed...what conceivable way could it be stopped?
Patent lawsuits, DMCA and copyright lawsuits, predatory pricing, collusive deals with other hardware manufacturers...
What possible rationalle would the powers that be have to WANT to stop it?
Campaign donations, bribes, protection of stock market investments, pressure from local constituents, tit for tat deals with others who have one of the reasons above...
It has come to my attention that Best Buy is attempting to abuse the DMCA to stifle the release of the 'black friday' sale specials, on the site fatwallet.com. As I do all my product and buying research and nearly all of my equipment purchases online, this quite frankly, ticks me off. Not only will I not by patronizing best buy in 'black friday' I will not be doing so ever again.
Perhaps you will learn that being asinine does not win you friends.
Therefore, they don't want you to be able to see their price drops coming... and that's why sale info is top secret until the day the sale goes into effect, at which point it's public info.
Then maybe they shouldn't leave this information publically available on their webservers ahead of the sale.
Which, from what I've gathered, is what happened. I RTFA, and most of the comments here, and yet not one person has explained just what happened here, other than "fatwallet removed some info due to a DMCA threat by Best Buy".
Perhaps submitters could try linking to actual information instead of a message board filled with "comment removed" next time.
Endless arguments over trivial contradictions in books written by ignorant savages to explain thunder in the dark.
Hmm, let's see. This is supposed to be private information at the moment. Should a person (or a company) have the right to keep sensitive information private if it poses no harm to anyone? I'm inclined to answer yes. I understand that these are prices that people willbe paying in a few weeks, but these are just estimates right now, technically. You can't go to the store and buy it for that price now, so the public has no reason to know these prices.
:p
"But I won't buy it now if I can get it cheaper in 2 weeks!" Argument: invalid. Try watching Trading Places starring Eddie Murphy. Maybe it will teach you something about how markets work, and it is a very humorous movie.
Are bait and switch tactics wrong? Yes. Has Best Buy ever used this tactic in my experience with them? No.
Turkey Friday sales are intended to get customers to choose to spend ther valuable time at the store that you are operating over another store. The more things that have awesome sales at your store, the more customers your store will have lined up waiting before the doors open. Limited item sales are solely meant to encourage people to come to your store first (where they will probably spend the most money AND buy everything that you offer that they were planning on buying that day in an attempt to limit the number of stores they have to go to).
Last year I went to BB's opening on Turkey Friday, and they told me how manyof the item I wanted that was on sale they had, and they even were making a waiting list for people to get on for items that had al been claimed in case people decided against buying them.
Yes, I believe the DMCA is a fairly absurd law. However, it is actually being put to a good use in this case. This is sensitive, private information. The non-release of it isn't harming anyone or truly impinging on their freedoms - i.e. nobody's child is going to be kidnapped as a direct result of this information being withheld.
As for the argument that the information should have been protected better, what the hell do you think they are doing now? Geez. This lawsuit is obviously just for show. Get a clue. This is protection (although arguably not the best).
Boycotting Turkey Friday sales? If you are going to buy a product, why would you avoid shopping for it when you will probably get the best deal on it?
Oh, by the way... companies without profit margins?!? Some of you are so completely brilliant that it astounds me. It has been tried, and it failed (/is failing) miserably in every instance. The general name for this type of economy is Communism. I believe you've heard of it.
I didn't want to end with the Communism comment, but I'm lazy.
Make that Communications, not commudications
The original poster was correct, assuming that you are not carrying a balance. Most credit card providers will not charge you any interest on purchases if you pay 100% of your balance when it is due. Thus, your money remains in your checking account until you pay the credit card bill earning a whopping 1.5% - 2.2% APY interest on a money market account or 0.5% - 1.5% APY interest on a interest-bearing checking account.
This is a replay of what happened last year. FatWallet deletes pre-release information as soon as it gets a DMCA threat... because although it's questionable whether the DMCA is the right law to apply, it is clear that this is information FatWallet is not allowed to have on its webboard because it is a trade secret until it is published. It's not worth fighting it because this would be a bad choice of testcase...
Jesus Christ, moderated as flamebait, because apparently everyone that reads this place has the same rabid opinion as everyone else? fuck, I might as well just go read Google News.
"Champagne for my real friends - and real pain for my sham friends!" http://ericblade.postalboard.com/
too much kiddie porn and goatse on /. lately
/. has a large European base. They especially love the scat-kiddie porn.
Too much kiddie porn is never enough for the typical shashbot.
Ans don't forget,
We are ALL incorportated into profit driven organizations. Do you have a job? They are for profit; if not, you would not have one. Do you purchase goods and services? Hello, they are for profit as well. I think where you're going with this is that business does not care about the 'people', however without the people there is no business. THAT'S where corporations have lost their perspective . They consider the 'people' as a burden on profits and that's just stupid.
[SIG] Remember Mattel handheld games?
It appears it's not about advancement of society, and only about protecting business when it promote's the general welfare or secures the blessings of liberty.
- in order to form a more perfect union
- establish justice
- insure domestic tranquility
- provide for the common defense
- promote the general welfare
- and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity
-- U.S. ConstitutionThis isn't the sig you are looking for... Carry on...
Exactly my point. High ethics, low morals - they'd do *anything* possible *within the rules of the system* to get their client the winning side of the case. Creative use of an ambiguity in a law is fine and dandy - actually *breaking* one is a big no-no.
Think - if they were immoral *and* unethical, we'd hear a lot more about lawyers doing things like evidence tampering and the like.
(For the AD&D fans out there - ethics is the lawful/chaotic angle, morals is the good/evil angle. Most lawyers are so lawful neutral (at least as far as their profession is concerned) it's sickening - they don't care at all about good/evil as long as the rules are followed...)
But what if FatWallet loses? This would set a horrible precedent.
1. While facts are not copyrightable as far as I know (IANAL), still isn't there a "fruit of the poisoned tree" doctrine? One shouldn't profit from illegal activity. If someone violated BestBuy's copyright, e.g., by photocopying a flyer before release, then there would be a legal (and certainly moral!) problem with FatWallet profiting from the information derived from the illegally made copy.
/. is all for privacy. But isn't this really a privacy issue? Someone has taken BestBuy's private information and published it. That BestBuy is a corporation doesn't mean that their privacy doesn't matter: after all, a corporation is just constituted by a bunch of individuals (shareholders or owners and their employees). I am myself rather minimalistic on alleged rights to privacy, but anybody who thinks I have a right not to have the contents of my private documents published on the web by hackers should surely accord that right to BestBuy.
2. Normally
He had rich parents with rich friends... which made financing a company a lot easier.
Good product? You a tard or something?
As for distribution, remember the antitrust action in which MS was declared a monopoly? Bush didn't buy the EU government antitrust people.
Tech Public Policy stuff
wasn't that a month ago?????
Forever live the fighters!
These people look deep into my soul and assign me a number based on the order I joined.
http://www.bestbuysux.org/html/com10-03.html
These people look deep into my soul and assign me a number based on the order I joined.
Seeing as how I work at a local Best Buy, in computers no less. I'm tasked to be a runner on Black Friday (day after Turkey Day to the uninitiated), which means that I go around busting my ass getting everyone the computer bundle (or just plain computer) they get. I also work more than 10 hours straight that day. It makes me want to cry now.
Screw dress code, I'm wearing tennis shoes.
Sorry, I'd never join the Young Republicans.
The best way to live outside the law is to stay within it.
...how are you, fatwallet.com? All your discounts are belong to us.
the endless pursuit of stuff is killing us and what's worse, it's making us shallower.
/end rant gotta get some sleep
I'm afraid that Coke is a pretty good shorthand reference for American culture. American cities are hidious, with maybe two exceptions (San Fran, New Orleans). The sole urban design goal seems to be the breakdown of community and conversion of citizens to consumers. We've lost a tremendous amount of personal time to work. Is that a good trade-off? What about pro-family values? Can you raise your kids from work? Once they are fed, housed, and clothed, is the delta income worth the -delta face time? Did you get a choice re: -delta face time?
GDP is not a sound measure of societal health. I don't think it's even a good measure of economic health. Where externalities aren't monetized (you aren't charged for pollution), but cancer treatments are, you have a skewed measurement and eventually warped values.
Price protection very rarely applies to one-time- only discounts or clearance items. I dug around for the scoop at the Best Buy website, but it said "see store for details" instead of giving me the nitty gritty. I doubt, though, that they will do it. A competitor will be even less likely to price match, given the sales category of these items.
One would hope that your federal government is not being run on a for-profit basis.
Of course, many products and services can be (and are) provided on a not-for-profit basis, provided by people who are gainfully employed. Quick examples: consider a church pastor, a scout leader, or a food bank director, none of whom are government employees and none of whom are working for profit.
And in a for-profit business, the profit is normally claimed by the business owner(s), not the employees (who are considered an expense to be minimised).
Nope, sorry. The price protection does not apply to the black friday sale, and the ads that go out will say so.
A free market does not operate efficiently unless there are knowledgable consumers and purchasers. This means not hiding prices from your customers or competitors. I don't know what "fair" has to do with it. Are you saying that anytime something decreases the potential profits of a company it is unfair? So you think fraud should be legal? Extortion? Shake-downs? Sometimes certain actions are not allowed even though they are good for a single company because they are bad for the economy as a whole. Maybe price disclosure should be one of them.
And anyway, if they really wanted to keep this stuff a secret they should use trade secret law, not copyright or DMCA law. With trade secrets and NDAs they could legally control the disclosure of prices until they published them to the public.
They could have sent a C&D for trade secret violations or contract violations. However they sent a DMCA takedown notice which means there is a copyright violation or there is a circumvention of a copy or access control mechanism. Maybe their lawyer is just stupid, but I doubt it. It's probably another WalMart case where they claim their prices are copyrightable.
I hate the DMCA as much as anybody, but let's do a reality check.
:)
Newpaper ads have time-sensitive copy protection. They are not publicly viewable until the date of the newspaper's publication. Anybody that admits they got Black Friday info from any step of the publication process openly admits to 'circumventing' the time-sensitive copy protection, and admits a basis for having DMCA used against them. Seems to me the way to get around this is to DENY the source came from anywhere in the publication process.
After all, it's not the DATA the retailers are trying to keep secret. They publish it themselves, AT THE RIGHT (for them)TIME.
It's the TIMING of the release. Maybe therein lies the answer to getting this info out legally.
What if somebody didn't post this until Wednesday afternoon? Closed on Thanksgiving, so nobody to serve a cease and desist to until Friday, and by then they are publicly available, just in a more useable form if posted all together on the web.
Of course, I could be wrong.
Your IP address is 127.0.0.1. I *know* it is.
I think you meant "than you realize" :)
that is the question.
Oh yeah. Here is my TPS report, coversheet included.
There's nothing wrong with a few homemade things.
Instead of giving your tots an X-Box, teach them something about the real world and frustration: Give them a Rubic's Cube. It'll never get solved.
No, wait. That was just my inner troll.
Actually, what I really had in mind was this: Legos. Tinker Toys. Erector Sets. Go for Lego Mindstorms and scientific toys, too. Flex their brains a little. Get ant farms and bug collection kits. Heck, buy one of those new-fangled computers. Maybe a USB microscope from ThinkGeek. Get the critical thinking started early. Why?
Do you want them to be part (MOO!) of (MOO!) the (MOO!) hurd (MOO!) at (MOO!) Walmart, or would you rather have them building, thinking, deconstructing, discovering, inventing, or whatevering something?
At 7 years old, NOVA was really interesting. I walked around with more useless-to-me-at-the-moment scientific information at that age than most graduate students wish they could keep in their head. As I got older, I promptly forgot it, too. The point is, though, that now I'm a scientist, and it probably had more to do with the toys I had to play with than me waking up one day thinking "I'm going to contribute to the body of knowledge."
Man. Now I want to go dig up all my air/water rockets and gyroscopes and things.
I know it's wonderful.
I know it's complex.
You should try particle physics some time.
Oh. Wait. Multi-million dollar colliders would probably be chalked up as being somewhere in the neighborhood of "materialistic," huh? Does that disqualify me from having a deep understanding of life and the world around me?
P.S. That demon/penis thing? Oh yes. It was funny.
Word on the street (no doubt obtained by violaing the DMCA) is that Wal-Mart is going to have a GameCube with Zelda:Wind Waker available for $74.95 from 6AM to Noon on Black Friday! I don't think I can pass that deal up!
No, they don't have a right to make money.
"Best Buy should have guarded their pricing info better."
Yeah, and that rape victim shouldn't have worn that short skirt either, right?
There's a Mercedes gap too. I want one and can't afford one, but it's not government's job to do anything about it.
So slap that baby back up there...show some spine...and wait for the lawyers to be pissed off enough to sue you properly! Of course the protections that following the "letter" give you are a little too good to pass up aren't they! That's why it was down in a hot minute.
Vendors pay a fee regardless of the type of currency used.
* Credit cards? Approx 3%, plus any chargebacks
* Checks? Same deal -- CheckMate is a service that ensures checks have a legit number, and the merchant must still deal with bounced checks.
* Cash? Big merchants have to pay for armored car service. Smaller merchants must still spend all the time counting and setting up deposits, as well as obtaining rolls of change. The banks aren't free moneychangers -- all of this as fees as well. More cash on hand also increases the liklihood of robbery, from outside or from an employee.
Paying cash in a restaurant helps the waitress at the expense of the Federal Government by allowing her to not report 100% of earnings -- but short of tax evasion, there are few businesses that benefit from using cash.
Support a few technologists in Washington.
10% of your credit score is based on how often people inquire to your credit rating. The more often the lower it is. People who use more credit are considered larger risks. Check out howstuffworks.com "How Credit Scores Work".
Here's a fast mirror, for those interested.
The primary purpose of government is to protect people from criminals. Where are you from, Europe?
I want to delete my account but Slashdot doesn't allow it.
The primary purpose of government/law is to keep me from killing rich people.
Thanks to all who posted the Best Buy Black Friday List...does anyone have the Wal Mart Black Friday list or a link to it?
Thanks!!
In terms of material living standards, the glories of mass consumption have brought widespread availability of refrigerators, toasters, consumer electronics and cars. It has also had the amazing and contradictory effect of actually decreasing the number of Americans who say they are happy (in addition to having detrimental effects on the environment).
Buy Nothing Day symbolizes the need for moderation, a juxtaposition to the "extreme shopping" motif of American society the other 364 days of the year.
Under capitalism man exploits man. Under communism it's the other way around.
Hasn't Best Buy learned anything about lawsuits yet? http://www.geocities.com/zippy55512/bestbuy/
Why exactly do they not want me to know what the prices are? I'm not going to get up early and wait in a really long line on the off chance that one of the sale items may possibly interest me. So guess what? Since I don't know for sure that anything I might be interested in is on sale, I'm not going, and they also lose sales on any other regular price items I might get while I'm there for the sale. Hey, if they make it hard/inconvenient/annoying to shop, it means they don't want my money, and I can certainly oblinge them in that.
Ok, so I'm an Anonymous Coward, but at least I'm saying -something- On Black Friday, I am going to the three Best Buy's in my area with small pieces of paper that say BESTBUYSUX.COM and putting them on all cars in the parking lot. Then running away, but then comming back :) If we can get enough people to do this, maybe it'll get the point across.
I'm not sure, but Content Removed, see first post seems a little Content Removed doesn't it? Isn't Content Removed supposed to be Content Removed under Content Removed? If I were Content Removed, I'd start Content Removed and Content Removed until Content Removed stopped Content Removed the customers. But then again, what do Content Removed know? I'm just a Content Removed with Content Removed and a sense of Content Removed. Ahh well.
BZEERPPP! Wrong. The great fallacy of the age reasserts itself - the idea that everything must "advance" (usually defined as some sort of growing, eating, consuming, bloating, or complexifying behaviour).
This kind of idea is at the root of the consumer culture. The function of society is to exist, not to change. The function of law/government is to manage societal interactions. Individuals or groups within the society may have other goals, but government,law, and society are essentially as purposeless as evolution itself.
As that fat elitist bastard Edward Abbey said, "Growth without limits is the philosophy of a cancer cell."
Sorry for the O/T reply, but the quote you have attributed to Shakespeare was actually said by Francis de S. Fenelon (1651 - 1715), French arch bishop.
and the Garden District, touristy as hell, I grant. I had no use for Bourbon St., but Royal is another matter. I didn't see any sludge, but I did hear the band in Preservation Hall.
It was like the Disneyland ride "Pirates of the Carribean", only for real.
I did glean some info on the gnarly aspects from "Down by Law", a movie by Jim Jaramouch. Charmingly gnarly. A disfunctional place for disfunctional people.
I have no use for Florida.
The two I picked just happen to be the only cities where any part of them were built by people who cared what the outcome would look like.
If you think the vast majority of Americans have a problem with drugs, uh, you aren't paying attention. They advertise drugs on t.v. Nothing more mainstream than that. The drugs are delivery systems for alcohol, but if you think there's a moral difference between it and the others, you are insane.
I believe it is the especially blighted cities in Texas where you'll find drive through liquor stores. Is your definition of "not hidious" those cities that most prominantly feature big box retail outlets surrounded by wastelands of parking? Vast monoculture subdivisions of prefab, vinyl sided houses? That sums up most of the rest of the U.S. Santa Fe has some interesting bits, but it ain't adobe if you paint cement brown.
and Wallingford does have some distinction. There's not much left of Fremont, in my mind, anyway. I thought about including it in the list, but I think most of the beauty of Seattle was here before the buildings went up. Downtown has some cool buildings, too, but none of them give me anywhere near the "wow!" that the Victorian houses in S.F. give me - even the crack houses have paint jobs signed by the artiste! That said, Seattle is a lot more livable than S.F. or N.O., and it is quite pretty. I think Bellevue is downright ugly. Might as well be Columbus.
It seems like the DMCA is a card often played by large technology-oriented companies. Its time for Fat Wallet, and Slick Deals and the rest of them to fight for what they believe in. After all it is america and they need stick it to Best Buy and these other tools who insist on using the DMCA. I mean seriously this DMCA shit has got to stop, first kevin mitnick, then that kid from europe with his DVD CSS stuff, that russian kid for his adobe font stuff, whats next, are the Creators of Linux going to jail for using code from the Windows TCP/IP stack!? Wheres the DMCA Sux tshirt when you need it. Think Geek, make that and also a bumper sticker, I'll wear it down in DC and show the Senator Hatches whats what!
click here to incinerate homeless people
That guy got "Flamebait" for correcting his own post.
Well, if she will blue-tac her Iron Maiden album covers to her walls..
dude thats bs the best buy employees arent even allowed to see whats in the ad untill it is released to the general public. i know for a fact since i am a best buy employee and we only get to know a few of the major items that will be on sale that day.