Slashdot Mirror
Militants Planned Attack On Indian Software Firms
Alien54 writes "Militants killed in an encounter in New Delhi on Saturday night planned to attack leading software companies in Bangalore in addition to the Indian Military Academy in Dehra Dun, Delhi police said on Sunday Indian police claim the men were members of Lashkar-e-Toiba - a Wahabi militant group fighting for an independent Kashmir. Apart from maps of call centers police also recovered 100 kilos of dynamite, 10.5 kilos of RDX explosive, 450 detonators, three AK-56 rifles and a satellite phone."
"Dear GOD, where is my TECH SUPPORT?!?!! Nobody in the call center is answering!" Feel free to mod me -1 heartless bastard.
Quid festinatio swallonis est aetherfuga inonusti?
Africus aut Europaeus?
Isn't that a little bit of an extreme reaction by the Kashmiris for losing their IT jobs?
Can you say Identity Theft?
Actually, why did the militants do this? Attacking companies that brings prosperity to the region hardly seems a way to inspire support from the locals or anybody else.
More proof that terrorism doesn't make sense.
There are many call centre operations in India or whereever. If a few get blown up it takes only seconds to divert the call to a new building and a couple of days to say "Check the power cord and reboot".
At the end of the day, Dell (or whomever) don't really care about the quality of the tech support much (and tech support quality is pretty hard to measure). Where there's a buck to be saved, save it!
Engineering is the art of compromise.
"Abdul! I tried to call tech support for the explosives, but all I got was one of those damn foreign Americans! Bloody outsourcing!"
Oh, wait. Physically attacking a software company? Where's the fun in that?
# cat
Damn, my RAM is full of llamas.
For the same reason that Al Qaeda attacked the WTC and Pentagon - to make themselves heard.
Terrorism is not about sense or economic benefits.
I'd like to thank the New Delhi police for a job excellently done.
And why are software companies so important as opposed to centres of government to these terrorists?
Get a free iPod Nano 4GB!
That was the point. Those were Kashmere terrorists blowing up Indian call centers. Al Qaeda was not overly concerned that 911 might be harming NYC's prosperity either, on the contrary!
The motives of such acts of violence can have many forms. But just labeling it as mindless terrorism is ignoring the larger picture. Know your enemy, Know yourself.
...islamic militants are just as frustrated with tech support as the rest of us!
many a time i wanted to throttle the fool on the other end of the phone in bangalore...
> Militants? Militant whats? Militant Communists? Militant Republicans? Militant Anti-Caste activists? Militant Hindu Nationalists? Militant Islamists? Militant Christian Doomsday Fundamentalists? Militant Hello Kitty Fans?
> Just saying 'militants' is ignorant reporting.
Perhaps it's militant dislexics who missed the word 'Wahabi' in the overview.
Sheesh, evil *and* a jerk. -- Jade
Just do it. It's got to be cheaper than the fisticuffs.
Another brilliant post by Truth Quark! 60 years of conflict suddenly resolved! ...
Now, about Palestine
it did say Wahabi which is a fundamental and usually radical form of islam
You know, they're probably just /. readers who happened to read this story and decided they better include a phone in the attack. It's a bit deadlier that way.
Good-Tutorials
Bug 133925: Primary source code archives at Bangalore outsourcing site destroyed by Lashkar-e-Toiba militants.
Priority: Critical/Stopper
Al Qaeda attacked visible symbols of hatred for the fundamentalist Islamic world. These militants wanted to attack software companies that are visible signs of India's prosperity so I don't the parallel or the militants' logic.
I realize the logic must be very twisted but there had to be some reasoning involved, I mean why not attack BJP offices in Uttar Pradesh?
I'm not arguing, just curious.
For one, the BJP is losing power. Also, Bangalore is where a lot of Indian investment is headed. Attacking this would be easiest (New Delhi and Mumbai have large Muslim populations and excellent security).
In the past, they've tried to attack the Parliament, but failed. I guess they wished to try an economic target this time.
11 of 25 posts so far have been about Call centres and outsourcing.
I know most of it is humour (of some sort), but don't you think this is being just a bit insensitive? Mod me down if you must, but there must be a limit to self-centredness, even for Americans.
</karma-suicide>
StrayByte.Net
Maybe economics are involved somehow? Is the software/IT industry very important to India?
-- BTW, I've been living in a cave for the past 10 years
-- Sigs are for losers
You have to understand that Kashmiris don't associate themselves all that much with India. They side more with Pakistan, but prefer an independent state, like Nepal.
The money generated from Bangalore tends to go to other parts of the country, as Kashmir is quite rich on its own. That is why attacking Bangalore's software companies made little difference to the terrorists.
The point of terrorism is exactly that - terror !. Once people are afraid, they have essentially achieved their target. These people are not just "militants" - but terrorists.
Indian software industry is obsessed with Information security that it often does not expect an attack with a car bomb in the parking under ground. And Bangalore is a cosmopolitan city full of all kinds of people. You won't be watched by the entire crowd because you have a 3 inch beard.
Security is an illusion - but it is a precious illusion for those who keep it.
Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum videtur
The Kashmiris want independence, and the Kashmiri terrorist groups are working to this effect with backing with some Pakistani and some Al Qaeda help.
This is not all too different from the Sikh groups who wanted independence for Punjab in the past.
I never said it was mindless terrorism, but it is terrorism nonetheless. What is surprising to me is the number of Slashdotters who see this as an opportunity to mock Indian tech support, almost as though this was Fark.com
> One of these days, we'll have intelligent reporting that doesn't treat
... wow. If you don't want to be treated as reactionary, then don't react after reading just a headline.
> the readers like scared, reactionary six year olds.
Maybe one of these days we'll have readers with an attention span that lets them read past the first line in the article. You can't expect us to believe you're a big fan of critical thinking if you don't read as far as the second sentence: Indian police claim the men were members of Lashkar-e-Toiba - a Wahabi militant group fighting for an independent Kashmir.
I knew attention spans were getting short, but
Lashkar-e-Toiba is a millitant group connected with Al-Qiada and wishes to 'free' Kashmir. They are Muslim Islamists and believes that they are in jihad with almost everybody except them. Talk about ignorance!
Would you prefer that we called them disaffected individuals with poor impulse control?
Mea navis aericumbens anguillis abundat
The "Militants" were a group called the LeT - Lashkar-e-Taiba
Here's some more background on them. Looks like they're tied into the infamous Al-Qaida too.
Find a job you like and you will never work a day in your life.
I agree with you but I don't think Kashmiris want people with AK 47's to rule them. That would be autocracy and not democracy. But they have little to say in a world where might is right.
Yep, that along with a united Ireland and peace between Palestine and Israel. For some reason, some people don't see it that clearly.
-- Using the preview button since 2005
Please describe how to reproduce; thanks.
When work is outsourced to countries that are not very stable, or have terrorism problems, or civil wars, it makes portions of that country wealthy. Those wealthy portions become a target for the local Bad People, simply because it will hurt their enemies more than bombing the poor portions.
How the fuck can you talk about "critical thinking" when you don't even read the damn article?
I second this. Kashmiris never wanted to be part of India and the intervention of the Indian army has caused atrocities there that only made their feelings worse. Let the people have their freedom and decide their own future.
You know, India has stolen a lot of US jobs. It seems that most of the call centers employ people who can't speak (or understand) English very well at all -- and yet they're perfectly willing to take a contact doing phone support for Americans! But despite that, I find I have two feelings about India:
I hope this kind of terrorism is caught each and every time, in every country.
My Greasemonkey scripts for Digg &
If you look into slight history, there were a series major bomb blasts occured in Bombay, the financial capital of india in 1993 in places like the Stock Exchange. These resulted into a lot of tension and communal riots between the people.
This one seems to be kindof similar to them, just targetting a little more high-tech organizations. These militants just cant see a country prosper and the people getting happy. If you cant do well, dont let anyone do well.
Well the current situation definitely doesn't improve Kashmirite's perception of India, feeding such thoughts. It is just possible that an India-backed independence would be the only way to ameliorate bad feelings.
Of course I understand it's never that simple, but laying all the blame on one side isn't the way to go.
It is a pity that words like "Militant" are used for these groups. We really need a word that summarises "Organised criminal gangs that want to steal entire countries". Of course {flamebait} this word would be useful because we could apply it to the Bush/Rumsfeld/Wolfowitz/Rice/Blair/Berlusconi gang as well as the insurgents in Iraq, the part of the IRA that is opposed to the peace process, and the Taliban.{/flamebait} But words like "militant", "terrorist" and "insurgent" conceal rather than illuminate reality.
Panurge has posted for the last time. Thanks for the positive moderations.
Uh, I'm guessing you have no idea about the history behind the India-Pakistan conflict over Kashmir because, if you did, you'd know it's not that simple.
When India was struggling to achieve independence, it became clear that the religious unrest would likely drive the country apart. The solution to this was partition, which divided India into two countries, India and Pakistan (literally "land of the pure"). Kashmir, which was then a kingdom, decided that it didn't like either choice, and its ruler declared Kashmiri independence for itself.
Everyone accepted Kashmir's position but shortly after independence and partition took place, Pakistan unilaterally invaded Kashmir claiming it for itself. Kashmir, with no hope of surviving by itself, and with no other help coming from elsewhere, asked India for assistance. This call for help put India in a bind, because it didn't want to provoke Pakistan unnecessarily (partition itself had been a bloody affair) and so it presented Kashmir with the only viable option: become part of the sovereign state of India.
Kashmir chose India over Pakistan, and officially became part of India. Hence, legally at least, Kashmir is Indian territory. However, Pakistan didnt (and still doesnt) accept this, and refused to withdraw its claim on the region.
Whether or not Kashmir should become independent is a very stickly question. Personally, I'd like to see it happen but, frankly, there's too much at stake - not least of all national pride - for either India or Pakistan to seriously consider it. So the status quo, with part of still Kashmir occupied by Pakistan, remains and probably will continue to do so for some considerable time. Certainly, until Pakistan readopts democracy, its unlikely to change.
By the way, while the India-Pakistan division was based on religion, it's a fact that India now has a bigger Muslim population than Pakistan. And, apart from a few religious zealots on either side, most Hindus and Muslims (and Christians, Buddhists, etc) manage to co-exist peacefully in India.
"Accept that some days you are the pigeon, and some days you are the statue." - David Brent, Wernham Hogg
..... can you please ensure the "Insightful" on the comment avobe is amacked down please?
If this person can't be bothered to read the posting it can't surely be called "insightful"...
IANAL but write like a drunk one.
You represent everything that is wrong about slashdot.
"Orthodoxy means not thinking--not needing to think. Orthodoxy is unconsciousness." --Eric Blair
..., can I call you comrade, can't I? I mean, you show such ignorance about how open markets work that either you have been in cave for 50 years or are a Communist, comrade. Which one is it?
The Indians are not stealing your jobs. US people in particular, and Western people in general, are pricing themselves too high given the expensive lifestyles they lead.
Which expensive lifestyles? SUVs, overeating, rampant consumerism, irrational Imperial wars in the other side of the planet. All tha adds up until your economy, or parts of it, become uncompetitive.
Indians are "stealing" your jobs in the same sense that a more capable, cheaper worke in the US would be stelaing your job if he was hired to do it instead of yourslef, comrade.
As for the English capabilities of the Indians,, frankly, stop beating that horse. It has been fucking dead for ages.
IANAL but write like a drunk one.
Oh no!
And there go US plans to build in offshore redundancies to protect against (the suddenly highly probable) risk of planes crashing into their onshore development centres!
Regards,
Shaitan
> How about merging Pakistan and Bangaladesh with India like they originally were? That would be even finer solution.
Better yet, we could quit fighting the future and let the Black Helicopter Guys establish a single world government!
Sheesh, evil *and* a jerk. -- Jade
For heaven's sake, when did Slashdot become Politically Correct (TM)?
Call them what they are, terrorists. Or if "terrorists" is not acceptable, then how about "necromancers festering on people's grief and death"? That's pretty accurate.
Sigged!
From: ()S/\M/\ (47/M/cave)
To: infidel@localhost
Reply-To: 72virgnluvr@hotmail.com
where are the well-covered NUB1LE H0USEW1VES in
my area who wanted to meet me?
i declare it a pagan and Crusader lie!!!!!!
DEATH TO HVHAKAK@18j987.bdx.com.in!!!!
Most people reading this article might think that Lashkar-e-Toiba is just another one of those Islamic groups from the general area of Iraq fighting just to piss America off, but this isn't the case.
Lashkar-e-Toiba ("Army of the Pure") are one of the largest terrorist outfits operating in Jammu and Kashmir, fighting to have their states seperate from the rest of India. In a sense, they're fighting for their freedom.
Though, their professed ideology goes beyond merely challenging India's sovereignty over the State of Jammu and Kashmir. The Lashkar's rhetorical agenda, as outlined in a pamphlet titled, Why are we waging jihad, includes the restoration of Islamic rule over all parts of India. This is where they get marked as terrorists.
The Indian government has held it responsible for the series of massacres on August 1-2, 2000, which spread over three districts of the State led to the killing of more than 100 persons within a gap of 24 hours, most of who were unarmed civilians. This doesn't help people to harbor sympathy for their freedom fight either.
Remember how they set IniTech on fire ? Awful, awful people.
> And, apart from a few religious zealots on either side, most Hindus and Muslims (and Christians, Buddhists, etc) manage to co-exist peacefully in India.
One of the most pathetically funny things I've ever seen was a broadcast news story from a few years back, showing two rival groups of Buddhist monks fighting in the street over control of a temple. They were serious about it too; some of them were using what looked like quarterstaffs.
I'm pretty sure it was on the Pacific Rim rather than in India, though.
Sheesh, evil *and* a jerk. -- Jade
Oh Crap! I can't, damn those Militants! Damn them and there clear speech! Damn them!
"I may be full of crap about this game, and I may be wrong, and that's fine." -Jack Thompson
> Yes and you do know its spelt Dyslexic
Perhaps you've stumbled across the reason I know so much about how dislexics think!
Sheesh, evil *and* a jerk. -- Jade
Kasmhir is a part of India. The way you put it it sounds like Kashmiris are not Indians.If you follow news you will find that the government of Kashmir is elected.Also the majority of Lashkar-e-Toiba members are non kashmiris.Read it here
BBC Profile of Lashkar-e-Toiba.
So it is not Kashmiris attacking Indians.Believe it or not most Kashmiris are sick and tired of terrorism.They will rather get on with their life and business.Tourism which was the main source of income for kasmiris declined drastically after the terrorists upped their attacks.
Lashkar started in Pakistan and has its headquartes in Pakistan and after the US declared it as a terrorist organisation it no longer opeartes publicly in Pakistan.
TechSutra
You mean as opposed to Attacking the Indian Parliament? Someone's already done that...
AK-56 is a chinese knockoff of the soviet SKS, which is also manufactured in pakistan.
To be on topic, the LeT is mostly comprised of Pakistani extremists and is a declared terrorist outfit by the USA and one of the first Kashmiri terrorists outfits to be banned by Pakistan. To end on a positive note, read this editorial in the pakistan newspaper Dawn.
...that I had mod points today to mod down these stupid annoying Funny posts.
I guess even an American can get sick of the typical American attitude sometimes...
I don't think most Americans would notice the difference, other than hold times and chants.
* Winners compare their achievements to their goals, losers compare theirs to that of others.
Please describe how to reproduce; thanks.
Unprotected sex with a member of the opposite gender.
Isn't it annoying when people start the message in
Shutting down free speech with violence isn't fighting fascism. It IS fascism!
StrayByte.Net
In muslim thought there are two main areas of the world, the land of unbelievers the dar-al-Harb which is a permament abode of war. Then there is the dar-al-Islam, the lands Islam conquered through war, the land of believers which are an abode of peace. Just be thankful if you live in a country that does not border a muslim state, because where muslim states border non-muslim states there is constant conflict orcheastrated by the muslim parties. In muslim thought jihad, a war to make the land of harb into the of Islam is one of the prime duties of every muslim, unlike stupid Western leftists whining about their imperialist past, most muslims are most proud of their imperial past, their times of former military prowess, which are now long gone. May the ground open up and swallow the entire muslim world, good riddance.
Yeah, but the ones who planned the terrorist attack are Islamic militants who want Kashmir to go to the Islamic Pakistan instead of being controlled by India as it is now.
My other first post is car post.
HAHAHA, how many terrorists really do have a 3inch beart? Open your view a bit and see that you wouldn't spot a terrorist if he was your neighbour
Word has it that the LeT is setting up call centers to respond to inquiries about their latest efforts.
Find a job you like and you will never work a day in your life.
Though it was a shocking incident and almost before a decade the world really understood terrorism .... in mumbai life continued at usual the next day
chk google for http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&c2coff=1&cl ient=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial& q=mumbai+bomb+blast+1993+attendance&btnG=Search
Striving to be common...
I'd mod you as -1 arrogant and assuming. How do you know he's an American? Sure you could have read his blog and inferred, but I'd bet you just couldn't resist a knee-jerk anti-American comment. Very original.
Americans have the most to lose, after all their economy is mostly drastically over-inflated hype, and since every single American owes the world $50,000, of course you'd expect them to be whining and griping about the strength of other nations in comparison.
Americans: it is your own damn fault. Stop ignoring the crimes of your government.
; -- the corruption of government starts with its secrets. a truly free people keep no secrets. --
That's amazing that you didn't get modded down to -5.
;)
Last time I made an anti-American comment someone told me "You are, quite simply, not welcome here then" and I got modded Redundant. I guess most people don't see it once it goes below 0 so getting to -5 is hard.
I can tell you're not American simply because you can spell centre
Can your karma go above being Excellent?
How do you know he's an American? Sure you could have read his blog and inferred, but I'd bet you just couldn't resist a knee-jerk anti-American comment. Very original.
I had a quick look at his blog, and figured he was American, from that and the post of course. I'm not anti-American or Americans in general, I'm writing on an American website with an American designed (built in Asia) computer, it'd be a little hypocritical : )
I was annoyed by the post (and the host of others like it on this and previous stories about India) because it seems to me that xenophobia and ignorance about the world are valorised at the moment in the States, and that's a real shame.
Xenophobia exists everywhere, but that doesn't make it acceptable. If this failed attack had been in NYC, you can bet he (and many other readers of this site) would have a very different reaction, and all the talk would be of how to get those dirty Saudi^^^^^ Iraqi terrorists etc etc.
Do you one better, it might put that company out of business.
Imagine the better part of a companies data (backups and all) its employees and IT structure blown to smokey little bits and pieces. The term crippling blow comes to mind.
Of course I am sure they all have taken this into account, I mean it had to occur to them that there was a reason they were getting the service/labor so cheap. Or it didnt occur to them, and wont until some major US company goes kaput because of something like this, and then everyone acts shocked and runs around like chicken little when the sky was falling, the economy collapse's and the world as we know it ends. Or not.
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe." --Albert Einstein
Because the alternative is trying to attack military targets. Which is near impossible when all you have is dynomite and pea shooters.
Its not like it was when the revolutionary war was fought, you can line up as a civilian and fight the military anymore. So they hit the gov't where it hurts the most, in the pocket book. They lose business's and the tax money from them and their products and citizens and their tax's.
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe." --Albert Einstein
No, this will never end. The problem is not that much simple. If Kashmir goes out, Pakistan will shift its focus to other region such as Punjab or Himachal Pradesh or Assam. ISI (Inter Service Intelligence) is more active in these states.
India as a country cannot allow this to happen.
The main goal of Pakistan is to destablise India and I really dont know what they are going to do with that.
#include std_disclaimer.h
Yeah I am American, but the post was meant as a VERY sarcastic poke at America-centrism. So come on, lighten up.
Quid festinatio swallonis est aetherfuga inonusti?
Africus aut Europaeus?
Mutants Planned Attack...
I am trying to get the facts for you, but any individual can have their own opinion.
Kashmir by constitution is part of India and most of the Kashmiris are muslims. But there are other religions as well. Jammu region is wholly dominated by Hindus while Ladakhs are buddhists.
They will either be eliminated or massacred if Kashmir becomes independent or joins Pakistan. Believe me that will be the case.
And nobody denied Kashmiris any freedom. They are as free as me in India.
#include std_disclaimer.h
I thought Kashmir was a heavily disputed part of India and Pakistan, and this has basically been an issue since Pakistan has become an independent state from India?
... so to say Kashmir is part of India would be largely misleading and incorrect.
Actually, according to the Wiki, China even occupies a large portion of Kashmir
I've always said that Indian software is dynamite, baby!
1:Find country with lax labor laws with nearby neighbors described as "militant" to target's country.
2:Remove the ability to access the data physically or remotely via destructive means. (null routing companies and countries linked to target, political manipulation, EMP, conventional explosives, N/B/C if desperate)
3:Repeat 2 periodically to insure no third party benefactors such as other countries with proper labor laws (using documented loopholes such as offshoring) are able to prop up target country.
Bug will manifest itself in countries where lax labor laws, political instability and deep pocketed groups meet.
Possible solutions:
-International pressure to encourage target country to harmonize trade laws with countries with higher labor law standards to remove bugs with Free Trade. Militants would still be present but would be in clear minority if present.
-Limited protectionism until harmonized labor law standards are guaranteed and permanent elimination of all "Ivy League"* style exclusions/barriers to higher education in third party countries such as US/UK. Usefulness would gradually increase as a wider base of the population gains higher education without (practical and theoretical) barriers to entry as documented later on.
-Countries who provide residence for third parties in the benefit of this bug would be "creatively encouraged" to disallow "representation of a person" to any organization that offshores (and all supporters of disallowed organization to prevent shifting of labor to circumvent) under laws concerning bribery.
Ivy League style exclusions, specified:
- Leaving in impractical loophole of excessive amount for admissions/tuition to maintain indirect requirement of fallback of being "well-connected" in the process of obtaining education. Eliminating this may anger the existing benefactors into using defensive measures, but it is a must.
- Admissions policies that are designed to reject the usable majority to design a deep pocketed minority that proceeds to apply similar policies to society for a nonbeneficial (see Google projects with policies that mirror some universities) and possibly destructive result (See Harvard, Yale, and the non Ivies Berkeley and Stanford).
- Hypocritical policy of wanting more students that come from backgrounds that arent targeted by them, but only allowing minority amounts of them outside of public controversy to calm public outrage.
"Forget the engineers." -Carly Fiorina, briber of MIT Technology Review.
.. chinese made Type-56 (T-56) variant on the ak-47. its pretty popular in the sub continent and all over south and southeast asia.
learn from yesterday, plan for tomorrow, party tonight
or one out of three ain't bad
How about merging Pakistan and Bangaladesh with India like they originally were? That would be even finer solution.
Yeah, that's it. Reinstating British colonial rule is always the answer.
to make themselves heard.
If that was their objective, they sure did a lousy job:
They didn't claim or even admit responsibility. They hardly communicated anything about their wishes or intentions. If the attack had a goal, it was ridiculously vague ('to terrorize the USA into leaving the Middle East alone') and had no chance in hell of succeeding.
Especially as what little they said made clear they hate the US so much that even pulling out of the Middle East wasn't going to guarantee freedom from being bombed.
You're right, it's not about sense. It's about blind, consuming hatred.
i was reading through his articles yesterday after seeing the article posted on slashdot yesterday.d itorials/outsource_baghdad/index.html
and one of them was touching this subject: http://www.ranum.com/security/homeland_security/e
Kashmir becomes independent...next day China walks in like they did with the part of kashmir pakistan had managed to capture a few decades back, uses the added military advantage to browbeat the three other nations into submission and/or nuke the hell out of them from up there, build up their military might even more and proceed to beat the tar of USA (and this is one country that can actually try it thanks to sheer nuber of cannon fodder they have got... acceptable collateral damage and all) and all other countries over the world.
Sounds unrealistic ? But China has been egging to get a go at that region for years. And you have a president who starts attempting to capture a terrorist in Afghanistan and ends up bombing some dictator in Iraq... so let us leave unrealistic out of it... So goodbye to Indo-pak conflict ...hello to World War IV!!
You are so brilliant...
Hey wait a second, those weren't terrorists--those were liberators liberating American jobs!@#
They deserve medals!
identify to whom this group belongs, that you do it correctly. This group belong to a sect called the "khawarij", the same group that 'Usamah Ibnul Laden belongs to. Not the so called and wrongly named "wahabi" group also known as the "Salafee" movement. If you are still ignorant on this subject matter, then I refer you to "The Wahabi Myth" so that you can find out more.
The Koran does sanction jihad and does delineate the world into dar-al-Harb and the abode of Peace(dar-al-Islam), a form of permament war until all non-muslims are under the land of Islam paying the jiyza poll tax for their very right to existence under Muslim lands.
008.007
YUSUFALI: Behold! Allah promised you one of the two (enemy) parties, that it should be yours: Ye wished that the one unarmed should be yours, but Allah willed to justify the Truth according to His words and to cut off the roots of the Unbelievers;-
PICKTHAL: And when Allah promised you one of the two bands (of the enemy) that it should be yours, and ye longed that other than the armed one might be yours. And Allah willed that He should cause the Truth to triumph by His words, and cut the root of the disbelievers;
SHAKIR: And when Allah promised you one of the two parties that it shall be yours and you loved that the one not armed should he yours and Allah desired to manifest the truth of what was true by His words and to cut off the root of the unbelievers.
009.029
YUSUFALI: Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued.
PICKTHAL: Fight against such of those who have been given the Scripture as believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, and forbid not that which Allah hath forbidden by His messenger, and follow not the Religion of Truth, until they pay the tribute readily, being brought low.
SHAKIR: Fight those who do not believe in Allah, nor in the latter day, nor do they prohibit what Allah and His Messenger have prohibited, nor follow the religion of truth, out of those who have been given the Book, until they pay the tax in acknowledgment of superiority and they are in a state of subjection.
Remember Nick Berg who was decapitated, that is sanctioned in the Koran as well:
008.012
YUSUFALI: Remember thy Lord inspired the angels (with the message): "I am with you: give firmness to the Believers: I will instil terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers: smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off them."
PICKTHAL: When thy Lord inspired the angels, (saying): I am with you. So make those who believe stand firm. I will throw fear into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Then smite the necks and smite of them each finger.
SHAKIR: When your Lord revealed to the angels: I am with you, therefore make firm those who believe. I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them.
My source is the following website which contains side by side three of the best English translations of the Koran.
So mr. lying muslim, I do not need to read some stupid website to tell me what the Koran thinks. I have read the Koran, not only that but there is many translations of Koran on the internet so I can easily bring up the relevant verses without need to type them myself.
The nation of India hereby thanks your President and his glorious War on Terror, for giving rise to such short sighted policies as the promotion of Pakistan to MNNA status (Major Non-NATO Ally).
And by Pakistan, I mean a nuclear armed country which has demonstrated its willingness to proliferate WMD technology, whose intelligence services and military are thoroughly penetrated by Islamic radicals, whose President's life is under constant threat, and whose feigned ignorance of anti-India terror cells is tantamount to tacit support.
WARNING: DO NOT LET DR. MARIO TOUCH YOUR GENITALS. HE IS NOT A REAL DOCTOR.
I grew up in a very blue-collar family: nobody cared when Smith Corona went to Mexico, and when all of the manufacturing jobs went elsewhere. It was a great thing because those blue-collar jobs were replaced with white-collar management. I experienced my youth with parents just trying to find a job in their "field" - to little avail. Nobody spoke up for my family.
I worked very hard to get myself into school, through school, and out of it - and now, my degree is about 1/4 as valuable in a wrecked job market. People spoke, but nothing's been done.
Until you're on the top, there's never any change because there is nobody looking out for you. If there's a buck to be made, and you're not the source of it, then what good are you?
Why wouldn't the militants outsource the insurrection to those very same software companies?! Don't armed militants have to save money too?
If someone says he and his monkey have nothing to hide, they almost certainly do.
Apparently you don't know the history. Kashmir is of great strategic importance to India, Pakistan and China. Kashmir was an autonomous state after the British rule ended and India & Pakistan were free. Pakistan invaded Kashmir. The King of Kashmir, Maharajah Hari Singh, sought India's help and agreed that Kashmir will merge with India but still have autonomy. Pakistan was defeated and Kashmir became a part of India. Pakistan tried again few years later and was defeated. The Kashmir issue is screwed up because the then Prime Minister of India, Jawaharlal Nehru, to become an international peace hero, agreed in hurry to Simla agreement. Ever since then India has been suffering on Kashmir issue. It is ironic that India won three wars against Pakistan but the outcome was never favourable to India, sigh! India lost a war with China over Kashmir too so there is an on going dispute over the borders with China. Kashmir is, and always was, recognized as a part of India by UN.
:-)
Hope that clears up the confusion a little bit
- Jalil Vaidya
Hey, cheer up, Gothmolly posts at -1 by default now.
-mkb
... "Samuel Huntington observes in "The Clash of Civilizations, "Wherever one looks along the perimeter of Islam, Muslims have problems living peacefully with their neighbors... Muslims make up one-fifth of the world's population but in the 1990s they have been far more involved in intergroup violence than people of any other civilization." Hunington goes on to show that more than half of the "ethnopolitical" conflicts of the world involved Muslims and there were "three times as many intercvilizational conflicts involving Muslims as tehre were conflicts between all non-Muslim civilizations. The conflicts within Islam also were more numerous than those in any other civilization.. Conflicts involving Muslims also tended to be heavy in casualities... Three different compilations of data... yield the same conclusion: in the early 1990s Muslims were engaged in more intergroup violence than were non-Muslims, and two-thirds to three-quarters of intercivilization wars were between Muslims and non-Muslims. Islam's borders are bloody, and so are its innards."" [46]
Spencer, Robert. "Onward Muslim Soldiers: How Jihad Still Threatens America and the West", (Regency Publishing: Washington, D.C; 2003) 183.
Footnote 46:
Samuel P. Hunington, "The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of the World Order", (New York: Touchstone, 1997), 256-8.
You do not even that little statistic to figure it out, just turn on the tv or read a paper. The civil in war in Lebanon that muslims got the upperhand in, muslims jihadis in Kashmir, muslim Chechens with Middle Eastern cousins waging jihad on Russia, Israel vs Arabs, muslims causing unrest in Thailand, Arabs in Sudan vs black muslims and black non-muslims, Azerbaijan vs the Armenians of Nagarno-Karabagh, where muslims border non-muslims there is conflict more often then there is peace. Islam is a warlike and retrograde force on the planet, a true pox on all that should be considered decent.
Saying a country is stealing jobs is wrong. The US is the foremost proponent of the free market economy and has tried hard to globalize that idea. What has happened is the US has been successful. The only problem is that there are two sides to everything, including a globalized free market system.
If you're running a business, won't you try to minimize your costs? Won't you go to the company that can give you what you want for the lowest amount of money?
Well guess what? Now, companies don't just look for the lowest price in the US, but all over the world. Is it any surprise then, that they manage to find a LOT of other places where labor comes cheap, ESPECIALLY when converted into US Dollars?
And answer me one more thing please. Why is nobody grumbling about people stealing jobs from Nike sweatshops?
Find a job you like and you will never work a day in your life.
Freedom from war and freedom to live.
Just like in Israel/Palestine, N. Ireland, etc, I bet most Kashmiris never wanted to be part of anything especially a war.
It's usually only a few assholes/idiots who cause most of the trouble.
Otherwise it'll just be lots of heated words and everyone else just ignores them and gets on with their lives.
Look are most Kashmiris much better off if they aren't part of India? I doubt it. Sure India isn't such a great country but what's the big deal being part of it? Is the Indian gov that evil as it is? I doubt it. Plus democracy in India is probably not as big a farce as it is in the US.
In fact the odds are there'll be genocide if one of those Militant Islamist groups takes over - just look at the track record round the world - e.g. Sudan, Indonesia, Turkey (e.g. Armenia, Kurds), even in Nigeria the Islamists burnt churches and rioted because of what a _newspaper_ said re Muhammad and a beauty contest.
Even recently in Pakistan some actress got death threats just because of an on-screen kiss - such threats in Pakistan are no joke - over there people's throats have been slit for less.
Would this attempt effect the raging outsourcing that's been happening over the past few years ? will companies that outsource some of their call center/software dev./etc services to india be concered after reading such news ?
Won't somebody please think of the Karma!
You my dear friend, have uncovered the true reason why american companies are outsourcing so much ...yes , yes! ... must have been that building that got trashed in NY a few years back ... Imagine the better part of a companies data (backups and all) its employees and IT structure blown to smokey little bits and pieces. The term crippling blow comes to mind.
Bullshit. Being an Indian, I can tell you that Lashkar-e-Toiba is a Pakistani terrorist group, FUNDED by Pakistan and TRAINDED by ISI, the intelligence service of Pakistan. The terrorists are trying everything - from asking Kashmir to be a state of pakistan to making Kashmir an independent state. Once it becomes independent, the Kashmiri people will themselves "ask" to be merged with Pakistan and Pakistan will "reluctantly" "accept" the offer. Either that, or Kashmir will be an independent state only for name sake; in reality it will be in control of Pakistan. Just look at how Pakistan is controlling it right now. Don't believe everything General Musharraf says. In fact, don't believe ANYTHING he says. If you know the truth, you'll realise that every word Musharraf says is actually just blackmailing India (or extortion or threatening, if you want to be a language nazi).
There was an attack in NYC, it didn't fail. We watched on TV as @$$holes from around the world rejoiced. Now you want us to feel sorry when it happens to you? It's seems to me the only national leader who immediately came to the US to offer help was Tony Blair.
was annoyed by the post (and the host of others like it on this and previous stories about India) because it seems to me that xenophobia and ignorance about the world are valorised at the moment in the States, and that's a real shame.
Dude, he made a joke about the number of tech support reps that are located in India for various companies. How is that Xenophbic, ignorant, or self centered? The only ignorance I see is in your hatred of Americans. You can claim your are not anti-American but your posts suggest otherwise.
If this failed attack had been in NYC, you can bet he (and many other readers of this site) would have a very different reaction, and all the talk would be of how to get those dirty Saudi^^^^^ Iraqi terrorists etc etc.
It's hard to pin down one industry you could joke about in NYC. Had it been planned for Canada someone could have said "WHAT ABOUT MY HOCKEY/MAPLE SYRUP". It wasn't a xenophobic comment. I suggest you evaluate yourself for bias before trying to pass judgement on others. Your "Saudi/Iraqi" comment was so ignorant I wont even touch it.
Being an Indian I can tell you that Lashkar-e-Toiba is a Pakistani terrorist group. Read my other comment here.
I think you are confusing Xenophobia with black humor. The only reason that it is funny is that it was a failed attack. A failed attack on any tech support call center would probably meet with same type of jokes. It would not matter if it was in Idaho or India.
See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
Any attack on our call centers is an attack on America. We should be clear on that.
The Soviets gave us much more reason to be terrified than the Wahabis probably ever can. But they never directly attacked our interests. Why? Because we threatened total destruction of their homeland. What is the homeland of the Wahabis? A hint: Mecca is its capitol. What could make the Wahabis stop? A suggestion: A credible threat to totally destroy Mecca if they ever step over the line again.
Look, Moscow is an incredibly beautiful place deeply rooted in world history too. But why were we so much readier to take ultimate action against those who believed in the utopia of Marx, but unwilling to offer to same level of threat against those who believe in the heaven of Mohammed?
Both Marx and Mohammed are equally flawed branches of the same tree our own culture grows from. Both have had worldwide followers who, despite sometimes good motivations, individually, collectively brought repression and backwardness to large parts of the world, while threatening more enlightened and realistic regions.
We're not angels, and the followers of these two flawed ideologues aren't devils: the Russians weren't, and neither are the Islamists, on the whole. But threatening the Russians with total destruction, and meaning it, was integral to surviving their threat and ultimately (or at least temporarily) dissolving their global reach and the depth of repression in their homeland. Let's make the same threat to the Islamists. And let's let them know that, just as we were prepared to defend our interests across the world from the Russians, so too will any significant strike in any part of the world against our interests be the end of Mecca.
"with their freedom lost all virtue lose" - Milton
Unprotected sex with a member of the opposite gender.
I just hate it when tech support throws out all those technical terms.
See my journal for slashdot ID's by year. Mine created in 2005. http://slashdot.org/journal/289875/slashdot-ids-by-year
Whuuaaaa? Or to disuade American ecconomic tampering in the region?
Most american's think their boss has more power than their government or god. I'm pretty sure that everyone else doesn't want an American boss.
India is also a nuclear power, the population far surpasses that of Pakistan. Are you saying you want the US to provide India with security? It seems to me that if Pakistan is such a threat to India, it's in India's best interest to eliminate that threat. I personally would rather that my son and nephew not have to risk their lives for every territorial dispute that comes along. I supported the war in Iraq, we left Saddam in power when I was there. That was a big mistake, we paid for it for 10+ years of deployments to monitor a no fly zone that became "Where shall we drops some bombs today?", while the UN fattened there own and Saddam Husein's wallets with billions made from the oil for food scam .
After 9/11, I started playing "what if" games. What if terrorists...
* Set off a WMD at a major vendor's HQ, taking out hundreds of key developers thereby crippling development of or shutting down a popular product?
* Set off a WMD at a trade show or technical conference, killing off top talent from across the industry?
Knowledge is how to play a game, intelligence is how to win, wisdom is knowing what game to play.
Kashmir becomes independent...next day China walks in like they did with the part of kashmir pakistan had managed to capture a few decades back, uses the added military advantage to browbeat the three other nations into submission and/or nuke the hell out of them from up there,
...hello to World War IV!!
And the rest of the world just stands by and lets this happen? What happens to China's trade relations? Why would China risk alienating the world? It's simply not worth it.
build up their military might even more and proceed to beat the tar of USA (and this is one country that can actually try it thanks to sheer nuber of cannon fodder they have got... acceptable collateral damage and all) and all other countries over the world.
OMG RED CHINA IS COMING!!! Seriously, this scenario isn't even close to realistic. The chinese have about 20 nuclear weapons, give or take a few. The US has around 7000. It would take 164 to destroy US command and control, since China doesn't have that, it's an utterly unrealistic scenario for them to pursue. It would take about 400 nuclear missles to wipe out Chinese command and control. There isn't a realistic military option for the Chinese against the US.
Even if China woke up tommorow with Russia's nuclear capabilities (10,000 weapons) why would she attack the US? Her own trading partner? That is plain silly. If China wants to dominate the world all that is needed to to continue growing her economy and evolving while the US moves to a more service based/low tech economy and the dollar continues to drop.
Sounds unrealistic ?
A US/China conflict is even more unrealistic that a US/Russian one at this point.
And you have a president who starts attempting to capture a terrorist in Afghanistan and ends up bombing some dictator in Iraq... so let us leave unrealistic out of it...
If you don't understand the fact that he is trying to transform the region and not just 'capture Osama' then you are brain dead. I'm not saying it's going to work, because history says that nation building is usually a failue, but things are looking pretty good right now.
So goodbye to Indo-pak conflict
Unlikely, the only way you get World War IV is to drag the US and Russia into it on conflicting sides which is not going to happen.
You are so brilliant...
Before you go spouting off about nuclear war scenarios, why don't you go read a bit about what each country is capable of?
Americans have the most to lose, after all their economy is mostly drastically over-inflated hype,
I wouldn't call the American economy 'over-inflated hype' that isn't very accurate. The problem is twofold, the American people spend more than they have, as does the government.
Americans: it is your own damn fault. Stop ignoring the crimes of your government.
Please list the 'crimes of the American government'. This I would like to see. Oh, and in your own words, don't just link me to some Geocities site.
oh, I think it's just that it was early in the morning, look at it now ; )
(posted as anonymous before by mistake)
>> xenophobia and ignorance about the world are
>> valorised at the moment in the States
> Welcome to america. Dont like it ? Leave. This is how the
> world works: They hate us, we hate them
QED
I think the terrorists were identified. It's unemployed american workers wanting their jobs back.
I wonder why Gartner Group and all of those consulting firms that make big money from offshoring do not come out and say:
a. Safety is much much lower in India
b. Someone may steal your data, source code and there is nothing you can do about it
c. Help increase India's economic output and its production of unregulated pollution
d. Help India corporations get big enough to buy out USA corporations
After reading endless anonymous threats to "Kill spammers" or "Knock off the RIAA" on Slashdot it looks like some of them finally went off and tried it against outsourcing. Never piss off desperate cobol programmers I guess.
It is by the juice of the coffee bean that thoughts acquire speed, the teeth acquire stains. The stains become a warning
Bada-Bing
'over-inflated' == "spending more than you have"
.. oh wait, militant mass programming of police-state-asseted inebriated peon hordes, America and its Gigantic Drug and Propaganda Apparatus is very great at that.. but in fact, the only bouyant export from the U.S., economically, is police force/forms of warfare, and we all know (those of us who were paying attention in History class) just how long police states can go before collapsing on themselves. (Hint: not very long.)
... And on ... And on ... (not a single Geocities link there, buddy ..)
Hype, because Americans, due to their proclivity for cults of personality and inability to dis-introvert themselves long enough to escape Club Med Nirvana and have a Real Look At The World, hyperbolically still consider theirs the greatest nation on Earth, irresponsibly, when in fact as a nation America is far, far, far less great than many others in an exceedingly expansive number of realms, such as education, agrigultural sciences, manufacturing, even 'entertainment'
Every single one of those Shock and Awe weapons could've been used for far, far greater, peaceful purposes which would have made an awesome impact on world stability, but instead Americans allow their politicians to use its technology to destroy. [Is George W. Bush really the best America can do? Honest?]
Show me a cruise missile, and I'll show you a highly effective way of peacefully delivering a very badly needed water pump and medical supplies, to precisely where its needed, very rapidly. Show me a fleet of B52 bombers with heavy lift capabilities, and I'll show you a Dafur that didn't need to happen. 10,000 pounds of Uranium would do well to safely improve the condition of life for multiple millions of people, yet America prefers it be weaponized "just in case".
Crimes of America: Vietnam. Honduras, Nicuragua. Venezuela. Iraq "Highway of Death", Desert Storm. Afghanistan. Iraq War Two. Sure, you've got excuses for every one of these 'wars', but for every excuse to kill, there are also a hundred reasons not to kill thousands of people.
The list goes on
; -- the corruption of government starts with its secrets. a truly free people keep no secrets. --
1. Only Islamic Kashmiris do not associate themselves with India. Many Muslim do. Also Hindu and Bhuddist (and they are minority) do.
2. Government spend a huge amount in form of infrastructure, industry, grants, development schemes in that state.
3. The indian state of Jammu & Kashmir has three big regions. Kashmir is only 1/3rd of the state and gets the BIGGEST chunk of the grants. The state has had no to minimla income since the terror found home. It is indian tax payers who are helping the state sustain itself.
http://planningcommission.nic.in/popup/jk.htm
http://indiabudget.nic.in/
Spend some time at these websites to understand the topic you claim to be expert on!
where did my sig go? where's my sig at?
Wahabi militant group is simply doublespeak for terrorists. These are the same islamic nut cases that let a bunch of Saudi school girls burn to death because they weren't wearing their head scarves and so couldn't leave the burning school building. Wahabi "militants" were the nutballs who ran the Taliban. bin Laden is a Wahabi militant as is Hamas and most of the Palestinian terror groups.
These guys' idea of an "independent" Kashmir is nothing more than another Sharia state to replace Afghanistan and give bin Laden a safer place to hide out.
You can tell a great deal about the character of a man by observing those who hate him.
Terrorism is not about sense or economic benefits.
Don't forget al Qa'eda planned attacks on Microsoft since its monopoly position puts it in control of such a huge portion of the US economy.
The real economic damage probably would have come later, when an unpatched vulnerability was exploited.
My God, it's Full of Source!
OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
Do you really think third-rate military dictators would laugh at America and burn our flag in contempt if Ronald Reagan were president?
If 'militants','activists', or radicals' use terroristic tactics, how are they not terrorists?
Calling these people 'militants' is as repugnant as calling Himmler an 'activist' These people are terrorists pure and simple or no one is.
Dude, he made a joke about the number of tech support reps that are located in India for various companies. How is that Xenophbic, ignorant, or self centered? The only ignorance I see is in your hatred of Americans. You can claim your are not anti-American but your posts suggest otherwise.
Self-centred and ignorant because it takes something very serious in India/Pakistan and turns it into a joke about call centres (which seems to be the farthest most comments get here on any story about India). It's not just that joke - look down through this story and you'll count tens of jokes that are all just as lame and just as insulting to people who have died and are dying in a conflict that's been going on for ages. Yes, it's a joke and not something to get righteous about, but I don't think it should go unchallenged.
Saying Xenophobia is valorised was a general comment on the insular attitude of the Bush administration since 9/11 who have consistently encouraged the country to disparage other nations (France comes to mind) and promoted a climate of fear and eternal vigilance against an undefined foreign enemy. I couldn't pretend to talk about all Americans and wouldn't want to. I certainly feel no 'hatred of Americans' but if that makes it easier to dismiss the criticism...
Somehow I don't think if that same joke was made about a failed attack on IT companies in NYC on this same site, people would be defending it as funny.
Now you want us to feel sorry when it happens to you? It's seems to me the only national leader who immediately came to the US to offer help was Tony Blair.
What? Even Saddam Hussein condemned the attacks.
-mkb
Actually, the "mistake" Nehru made was agreeing to UN mediation which eventually led to a ruling for holding a plebiscite. It was conditional on Pakistan withdrawing from the territory it had occupied. Since they didn't oblige, India had a reason not to follow through either. Hence the current impasse.
Shimla agreement came much later (conclusion of Indo-Pak '71 War) where Bhutto and Indira Gandhi hashed out the ceasefire agreement. It basically said that bygones be bygones and the whole matter will be solved by the two parties bilaterally. Indira's "mistake" was not getting more out of Bhutto even though she was the victor in the war. The story Indians are told is that Bhutto literally begged her not to insist on a black&white treaty that made him lose face politically at home. Indira apparently let him go easy since Pakistan already lost Bangladesh as a consequence of the war.
Quite Messy.
Well considering the Jews are responsible for 9/11 and the Iraq war and insurgent bombings and Yasser Arafat's death and Laci Petterson's death, and Michael Jackson's child molestation and the Pope's fever and smog in Los Angeles and the 2005 tsunami and world hunger and U.N. sexual abuse in the Congo and genocide in Darfur and malaria and everything else evil in the world you are probably right. Blame the Jews!!!
Why is it that the proponents of "one nation under God" are so eager to get rid of "liberty and justice for all"?
Talk about the world being a small place. I am an American living right near the IMA and have just been in Bangalore. The alleged attack on IMA affects me directly (much harder/impossible to go to the golf course there and the nearby FRI where civilians are permitted). Although I can't imagine why any room temprature IQ terrorist would want to attack them. That place is heavily guarded. As much or more so than any US military base I have been to in the US. On special occassions, they have plenty of tanks guarding gates much smaller than themselves. If you have been to any significant size IT organization in India, you would notice they have slavishly adopted a number of ISO (& other) certification for their processes. Consequently, most of them have a disaster recovery plan so even if their primary center is wiped out, the client assets are protected. Additionally, large American firms have wisely minimized their risk by distributing their exposure to muliple companies. Net net -- the apparent targets (Indian military, US clients) of these alleged terrorist had little to worry. I wouldn't even be surprised if the whole thing is fake encounter meant to boost the record of some local police official (after all no logical connection between IMA & Polaris). Nevertheless, in the process, I have been personally inconvinienced. Insensitive bastards!
The quality was rather good too.
emt 377 emt 4
Nice job of self-editing your memory, there. I suggest you actually go back and read some articles from right after 9/11. The outpouring of symapthy and support from all over the world for the US was like nothing we've ever seen before -- or, given our behavior since then, are likely ever to see again. For Christ's sake, Syria offered to help us track down the perpetrators. What a difference a few years make ...
The correlation between ignorance of statistics and using "correlation is not causation" as an argument is close to 1.
Journalists hope that if they suck up to this monsters, being careful to call them 'macho' names like "militant" they won't get hurt and may even get leads that let them have a cameraman in place when a bomb goes off in a marketplace (as is happening in Iraq). The typical journalist mindset (particularly in the European press) is, "Go blow up that schoolbus filled with Jewish schoolchildren. That's OK. Just leave me alone."
And have you noticed something else? Around the world it's the political left that's displaying the same zeal to keep blood-thirsty Middle-East tyrants and religious zealots in power that their fathers and grandfathers displayed for Stalin and Mao. The mainstream media is trying to get us to believe that the threat is from "religious fundamentalism," but the evil is the same that attracted so many to Karl Marx, a ideological rationale to kick people around and build a brave new world. It's the same zeal for blood that makes feminist so rabidly proabortion. It's the 'progress comes through death' mindset that lies at the heart of Darwinism, as Darwin himself stated so coldly but eloquently in the last paragraph of The Origin of Species.
Sick, sick, sick! Thank goodness the Internet and bloggers are giving us an alternative to scum who can't tell the difference between a terrorist and a militant.
--Mike Perry, Seattle
Editor: Dachau Liberated
Editor: Eugenics and Other Evils
Wow. So you missed the reference? No suprise.
You fail to mention that the king might have been Hindu, but the majority of Kashmiris were Muslim and either wanted to side with Pakistan (Islamic State) or be independent. Let the Kashmiris be free and autonomous then, since that was the agreement afterall.
would you have cared if it was a company which didn't "take away american jobs" ?
.....
I don't think so
What part of "capitalism" and "free market economy" do you not understand ----
Looks like they accomplished THOSE objectives perfectly.
Why is it that the proponents of "one nation under God" are so eager to get rid of "liberty and justice for all"?
Honestly, no I would not care. But in that case they would not be *deserving*, but they would not be relevant.
---- Booth was a patriot ----
Its rather interesting that ppl here are so much against Indian call centres, complaining about language issues. Of course, you're not gonna understand ppl there, and they're not gonna understand u cause u guys have different accents, not becaue either side can't speak english. I'm from Vancouver, Canada and I find it hard to understand ppl from the South US, australia, and the UK. Here in Canada, when I call up a gov agency, I get some french person speaking english and its pretty hard to understand them too. Not because they don't know english, its because their accent. What I'm even more suprised about is /.'ers who need to call tech support. Can't fix ur own comp eh?
All right, that's it, I don't care about IT outsourcing any more. Those are our geek brothers and sisters over there, and they're being attacked! Indian or Pakistani or Chinese or Thai or Turk or Russian or American or German or Finn or Swede or Brit or Mexican or Brazilian or Spanish or...
Geek is geek. A threat to Indian geeks is a threat to all of geekdom!
Kill the bastards.
No, but I don't believe any world leader does.
-mkb
These people used to be called terrorists - until they resorted to killing whoever called them that. No news organization will now use the word terrorist to describe them because if they do, they will kill whichever member of that news organization they can get their hand on. The same is true of the terrorists in Iraq who are going around killing innocent citizens to further their agenda and spread terror - Iraqi news organizations are forced to call them "insurgents" rather than the terrorists that they are because members of the news media in Iraq have a habit of turning up dead when they use the word terrorist to describe these people.
Mmmm.. Donuts
I called the other day because my Toaster wasn't my toast correctly and I got some guy on the phone saying: "I don't care about your toaster, you zionist pig infidel Yankee American." So I was like, "well, could you transfer me to tech support before you blow yourself up."
This is my sig.
It's seems to me the only national leader who immediately came to the US to offer help was Tony Blair.
Then you're a fucking ignorant moron.
The whole world with very few exceptions was more supportive of us than at almost any other time in our history.
The fact that he pissed all of this good will away is one of the major reasons a lot of Americans hate Bush.
We watched on TV as @$$holes from around the world rejoiced.
So that would be some stock footage of Palestinians dancing? Oh, and Funkmaster Kim from the DPRK didn't immediately condemn the attacks. Ho hum
"We returned the General to El Salvador, or maybe Guatemala, it's difficult to tell from 10,000 feet"
I lived in Bombay at that time. Actually there was a lot of tension and communal riots before the bomb blasts in Bombay.
It's almost as if the bomb blasts had the opposite effect. There was a very eery calm and absence of violence and reaction in the aftermath of the bombs. The people of Bombay decided not to be cowed by the terrorists and to defy them. Attendance in offices the next day was actually higher than it was during typical days. The blood banks were overflowing within hours after the attacks and they actually had to ask people not to show up to donate blood.
Mmmm.. Donuts
While simultaneously oppressing the hordes of citizens in the streets celebrating? Nice self-editing of your own memory. Arab governments trying to silence their over joyous citizens in order to prevent a pissed off America thirsting for Muslim blood from storming into the Middle East was typical of 9/11.
I am sorry, Sir, but you are a moron and an ignoramus. India has been fighting terrorists similar to the 9-11 ones for two decades now. Only America didn't notice because anything that happens outside the USA doesn't matter, does it?
All your favorite sites in one place!
Why shouldn't a country that foreigners think won't be able to pay off it's huge debt slice open it's wrists and bleed the last of it's money for corrupt third world government to "help" their people by building themselves a new harem, palace or fund a terrorist attack on their enemies? We all know that when America dies it will go to heaven be given 70 virgins.
Having an independent election at present is unfair; I understand that, over the past 20 years, the Kashmiri terrorists have systematically driven out all the Hindus and most of the moderate Muslims, so the region is predominantly Muslim right now. Any election will result in Kashmir voting to join Pakistan.
This would be like if, in the US, the right wing and neocons drove out all the democrats, non-christians and all left-leaning folks, and subsequently conducted a referendum to decide whether or not the US should be a theocracy.
The other issue is this: most of the terrorists fighting in Kashmir are not Kashmiris. They are Islamic fundamentalists from other countries funded, trained and politically backed by Saudi Arabia and Pakistan. Many of them have publicly declared that Kashmir is only the first step, and they will not stop until they have planted the Islamic flag in Delhi.
Magnus.
Kashmir is majority Muslim, and its inhabitants want to either join Pakistan or become independant. Its not just the terrorists who want Kashmir out of India, its the Kashmiris themselves.
m l
Some background on the whole situation here
http://www.fathom.com/course/10701013/session2.ht
Human rights abuses have been committed by both the Indian army and militants. The Indian army has been accused of killing 50,000 people in Kashmir since 1989.
http://www.hrw.org/reports/1999/kashmir/
Four more years of dead!
A blog about stuff.
That country has no money, is a home of some of the worst people and only foreign policy they have is to "kashmir" just to keep the local folks distracted.
Well ... look, they are not going anywhere. India will be bigger, stronger and better world citizen and one day, just like cleaning out a trash can, will clean out pakistan when they stink too bad.
Yes, I am indian and I am very proud of my country with the progress made in there. Try running a country with 1B population, >80% people under the poverty line, 100's languages, 10 different religons, economically drained by the Brits for 100 yers and still able to come up with a woman as head of state, space technology, self sufficient in food and couple of nobel prizes in 50 years.
Please let me know when you find one !
- People who believe other people have no right to live, got no right to live ...
Pity there's no +1 Roger Waters Reference...
-ZK
Couldn't they just sneak in during the middle of the night and install an unpatched version of Windows 98 on all the computers? That should disable the call center a lot longer than 100kg of Dynamite!
I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
I don't understand this. I thought Islamic == Muslim??
Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
If everyone over there 'sparked one up' and listened to that song a few times....doubful that anyone would be very motivated to kill anyone....
Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
Thank you Zemkai! Tell him what he's won, Jim!
on various boards and to friends, co-workers and family...
When "Osama/Al Queda/Biggy Terrorists" acquire a nuke...they will acquire just one and THEY WILL NOT BRING IT TO THE US.
Instead they will set it off in India in the general area where the US and other Westernized nations have sent their offshored technical/support and engineering jobs.
This action alone will bring the US/Westernized economies to their knees worldwide. Furthermore, it is how the terrorists can actually win by getting winning through the efforts of their enemies.
India's response will be to assume that IT HAD TO COME THROUGH PAKISTAN...and launch a nuke at Pakistan.
With that powder keg lit...US comes to India's aid...China presses Taiwan thinking our hands our full...we hit back as a form of saying, "not so fast".
And Russia? Germany? UK? France? I find myself having a hard time calling their responses. Lot has changed since the Cold War.
If and when this happens - the terrorists get to watch the big boys do most of their work for them which is simple - take each other down - while they go one building their network.
=8-)
My bad ... read Islamist (generally used to refer to extreme of the muslims)
where did my sig go? where's my sig at?
We could deter the Soviets because they are for the most part rational people. Islamic militants are already committing terrorists acts against pilgrims carrying out their sacred duty of a Haj to Mecca... what makes you think they would be detered by threats against Mecca? Again, deterrents only work against people that are capable of logic. Unfortunatly, the only thing that will work against extremist Islamic militants is killing every last one of them, but doing it in a way that doesn't encourage others to join their cause.
I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
after all, they might have to code at home.
-- Tigger warning: This post may contain tiggers! --
True, but any <insert-belief-set> militant group is simply doublespeak for terrorists. Christian, vegetarian, feminist, racial pride, etc.
Fo an intro to Wahhabism that doesn't resort to conclusions like "nutballs" and "islamic nut cases", there's an article here (probably with its own biases, but I found it more informative and it includes references.)
Statements that appeared on rueters did not coincide with the vitrol spewed forth in the local media of many of our so called allies. The crap that we blew up our own buildings or the Isreali's were tipped off started immediately and even made Canadian press. Every single day hundreds of anti-american posts are posted here on slashdot. And long before 9/11 ever happened the European press on any given day sounded more and more like Al Jazeera.
Terrorism isn't terrorsim until the WTC is attacked. And only then is it terrorism and only *that* is terrorism. If you have had 20+ years of attacks on innocent people by a band of murderers based in and funded by some other country, it is just a local conflict largely of *your* making, so fix it.
And the way to fight terrorism is the way the US fights terrorism and every one else should drop their problem and come join the US. If you disagree the *US* may soon become your problem.
Agreed. During the campaign, they showed Kerry on TV at somebody's house in Vermont or New Hampshire, holding a rally. There was a really big 'geek' waiting to talk to him. When he finally did, he told Kerry about IT jobs that were being offshored. Kerry said wow (clearly unaware of this), and asked an aide to give his contact information to that geek. Nobody else has brought this up other than Kerry. And how are we supposed to know that when a company lays off 3,000 people, (which makes the news), if it's not simply re-hiring those people in a different country? And then their CEO gets a 12 million dollar bonus? Suddenly, you don't feel sorry for the company anymore.
Cover your eyes and click this link!
Are you referring to Ronnies "triumphant" invasion of Grenada in '83 or running away from Beirut in '84 after 241 Marines were murdered in their sleep by a terrorist, with no response by your godling Ronnie? You neocons need to start READING history instead of listening to rightie talking heads. Reagan is one of the worst presidents in our countries history and the rights ignorance of what actually happened during his tenure while trying to turn him into some kind of god is tantamount to insanity. But to answer your question, yes I think third-rate military dictators would laugh at America and burn our flag in comtempt if Reagan were president. They were doing it while he WAS president and his policies are part of the reason we are were we are today.
this is an example of how our government has ceased to represent us. Face it, we are in a corpritocracy; or a government for the purpose of corporations. Mostly influenced by larger, multinational concerns which rarely report profits in the countries where they are earned.
We invaded Chile years ago to keep low the price of copper for our phone systems. This has been going on for a long time but is now pervasive. The only conflict now is which coprorations get to have the say; when energy overlaps the financial houses, who gets to control which policy is followed? When there is no longer enough largess of the population to steal, it's really going to be dangerous when Drug Manufacturers turn against HMOs and Big Oil fights against Weapons Dealers (UNICOL vs. GM).
To understand what is really going on, you have to read; "Confessions of an Economic Hitman".
>>"ad space available -- low rates!!!"
American Apparel makes fantsatic t-shirts here in the US (LA to be specific).
Although I don't know where they get their source material (they'd probably mention it if it was US-sourced, but I couldn't find mention of it anywhere on their site).
I feel with you but you must think...
You cannot prevent terrorism in a free country. Think about that.
Ok, so if you cannot prevent it without obliterating freedom and liberty, how do you stop terrorism? How? I sure don't know, but I would start with taking away their motive... their incentive. Then removing their resources.
Knowledge is like ignorance.. too much can be just as bad as not enough.
Terrorism is not about sense or economic benefits.
What makes you say that? The WTC attacks were marketing pure and simple. The idea is not only to cause pain, suffering, and economic damage to your enemies, but to do so in such a way that sympathizers will pay more into your system. This is why providing solutions to the problems raised in terrorist propaganda will be the easiest way to destroy them-- they are only a bunch of common criminals without their marketing....
LedgerSMB: Open source Accounting/ERP
don't you feel some, eh, sympathy for wahabists?
Also I dont think it is being applied anywhere.
Islam does not allow people to wage war only to rule/invade others. But on the other hand, many people have abused the religion and its beliefs to their advantage, which doesnt mean that the religion endorses those evil. I feel sorry for the actions of those b@st@rd$ for their actions since they not only harm the world in general but actually humiliate such a large "good" crowd that is out there.
BTW there is one thing I noticed. Whenever a Muslim does something wrong the _whole_ ISLAM comes under trial! Do you agree? Of course recent examples mite make you believe that it has something to do with Islam but its actually evil entities of the world, which have nothing to do with the world, Islam or anything. And they have accomplices in every circle. Its a shame we allowed them to get so big/over-powering.
I would buy the american made high priced things, but now, hell yeah I am going to buy the asus motherboard so I can still throw money at rent and food!
Just do it. It's got to be cheaper than the fisticuffs.
But it wouldn't be profitable for the arms merchents that prod them on and do their best to aggravate the situation. Goes for the Middle East, also. There's no profit for the weapons industry in peace. To lose that business could wipe out America's/Europe's biggest export market. The trade defecit would jump 10 times what it is now. And their lobbyists make the entertainment and pharmaceutical lobby look like high school punks. Peace is just bad for business.
What?
The rest of the Arab world not only condemned the attacks, they held prayer vigils and sent condolences. Kuwait sent so many flowers to the US embassy that it ringed the entire compound. Iranian students burst into spontaneous (unplanned) peace demonstrations in support of the US. Egypt's Al-Azhar University, the highest Sunni authority by many, categorically condemned the attack, and reiterated their previous fatwa that suicide bombing was a major sin. The Organization of the Islamic Conference in Qatar that year condemned the attack. Sheikh Qaradawi, a notable figure appearing on Al Jazeera, condemned the attack as well.
You don't believe me? Go see some photos all over the Muslim world of solidarity with America on 9/11 and condemnations of the attack from the Arab and Muslim leaders and scholars.
It should be obvious too that the Wahabi sect depends for its power base on people who know little about the world. I define as "obscurantist" any religion which seeks to prevent its followers from acquiring knowledge that might cause them to ask too many questions. Modern communications, which make it possible (for instance) for poor Indians to learn more about the outside world through the WWW and mobile phones, are a threat to this kind of dominance through ignorance.
Panurge has posted for the last time. Thanks for the positive moderations.
I must of missed that. Besides flowery words, how did the the "Whole world with very few exceptions" support the US?
Talk is not support. Blood and treasure is support.
Democrats or Republicans. They are both taking us to the same place and they are not afraid of us anymore.
Damn, I hope he reads this before he trys anything.
Democrats or Republicans. They are both taking us to the same place and they are not afraid of us anymore.
Clue train: I don't fucking care what you think. I just want Bush (or whoever makes those decisions) to reconsider his strategy of supporting Musharraf so much on one hand and wailing about terrorists attacking USA (which is happening) OTOH. BTW, try going to Kashmir and getting the honest opinions of at least 100 people. You'll know what I'm talking about. AFAIK, it's people who watch FOX who are being spoon fed propaganda by Musharraf. How many interviews of Musharraf have you seen compared to interviews of an Indian Prime Minister or minister or bureaucrat? And BTW, the whole world isn't exactly like whichever country you live in. There are differences.
American support of Pakistan foments an environment wherein Pervez Musharraf becomes even less popular, and unlike in a semi-democracy like India, he will necessarily be removed by force from office in a regime change. Probably by somebody worse, maybe an Islamic radical. Who then has access to nuclear weapons and American dollars. And depending on future arms acquisitions, American F-16s. Interestingly enough, the same thing happened in Iran, when the US sold a squad of F-14 Tomcats to the Shah pretty much the same month that he was ousted. (Thanks, History Channel!)
WARNING: DO NOT LET DR. MARIO TOUCH YOUR GENITALS. HE IS NOT A REAL DOCTOR.
I didnt say that. All I said was that there are bad people, really bad ones, but there is also the media which helps the cause further. You have a point that the so-called Muslim phreakos/phundamentalists did all the above henious acts, but I just wanted to say that this has nothing to do with Islam. No religion in the world can allow that.
Anti-American moderator with a subtle sense of humor? Pro-American idiot who thought redunant means something else?
chl