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CNET Accuses Apple of Over-Hyping Launch
An anonymous reader writes "A columnist at CNET is questioning whether Apple over-hyped last week's launch. From the article: 'Jobs' announcement of a new leather case for the iPod was especially ridiculous. Like the queen announcing a new toaster in Buckingham Palace. It seemed odd that Jobs was troubling himself to introduce fashion accessories to Apple's products.' Is Apple a victim of its own success? Can it hold a low-profile product launch anymore -- or do we inevitably expect too much?"
So now let's over-hype the over-hype!
Jesus... let it go.
Like the queen announcing a new toaster in Buckingham Palace.
I think you underestimate the importance of toast to we English. And iPod accessories to Apple users.
We, inevitably, expect too much.
What is this doing on the front page of slashdot?
It was my understanding that the press event was rather small by most standards. Perhaps it was the press and the rumor sites that over-hyped things - not Apple. I know that I had no idea the event was even going on until others pointed it out to me and were tracking the rumor sites looking for the next big announcement. If anything, perhaps the fact that nothing overly major was announced was intentional and designed to throw people off so as to better keep public expectations in check. I wouldn't put it past them.
Hexy - a strategy game for iPhone/iPod Touch
Publicly traded companies NEVER overhype anything.
By the way, did you hear about the new twelve-blade razor for Gillete? It's the best razor ever!
Note to mods: I'm probably being sarcastic.
I didn't see much Apple hype actually. They held the event in a tiny little auditorium at One Infinite Loop, they didn't invite many people, and they didn't hold it at a major conference.
The hype I saw was coming from media outlets like CNN, CNET, and all the Mac news sites; not from Apple.
Overhyped? Of course it was overhyped. Goodness, that's what companies do - it's called advertising, marketing, PR, or whatever you want to call it. If you don't take everything that companies trying to sell you something tell you about the products they're trying to sell with a large grain of salt, then it's your own fault really.
quidquid latine dictum sit altum videtur.
Wow. Kettle and soot and all. CNet complaining about HYPE? CNet IS the definition of hype. They are one of the preferred corporate hype tools... Apple must not have greased the story's author with enough free shit.
If you want news from today, you have to come back tomorrow.
His biggest objections seems to be that the Mac Mini is not a PVR. Of course, if it had included everything necessary for a PVR--ATSC HD tuner, analog tuner, cable card capacity, huge hard drive--it would have been considerably more expensive, and analysts would be criticizing Apple for releasing an $1000 computer to duplicate the functionality of a device that your cable company will rent you for $10/month.
Cause that sounds like everyone's nightmare: forgetting to wear pants at a public event.
[Fuck Beta]
o0t!
There was no web cast, no mention on Apple's page until the products were introduced, how is that hyping? They weren't hyping the press event, they were hyping the products they put out which makes sense. As for the items they sold. First we have the iPod hi fi, pretty big announcement as far as Apple's concerned. It'll either be huge or a massive flop... for once I kind of hope Apple has a flop because from what I've heard the specs on the thing are not exceptional and the design is weak in my opinion. The new Mac mini is a pretty big announcement for a whole lot of people. And the leather case, well why not intro it with other products. Don't imagine Jobs spent forever on that bit, it's kind of like the successor to the iPod sock, which for the record I actually own, seems like a strange idea but they work very well. They don't keep the iPod from getting scratched a lil but they keep the big ones off, and they protect it from falls pretty well. Have you ever tried to find a good case for your iPod? I bought a DLO one that actually scratched my screen! I welcome an Apple branded one.
What were they expecting?
Apple said they were going to announce some "fun new products". Forget the pouch, jeez. They introduced an Intel-based Mac mini with amazing features inside of the same form factor as the old mini, and a nifty set of iPod speakers that has unseated the previous leader in this category in the opinion of most reviewers (Bose).
Apple stopped always putting all of its eggs in the Macworld/WWDC basket, and introducing products when they became available. The Intel-based Mac mini is a pretty damned good product, and a huge hint at Apple's admittedly tentative and cautious steps toward the living room.
So what's wrong with that?
What were we supposed to get?
An Apple cell phone?
An Apple tablet?
A touchsheen video iPod?
Anyone expecting those things at every single introduction is expecting too much.
It was only overhyped by Slashdot. This happens every time.
What's funny though, is that this is a dramatically different situation than it was in 1998, when I got my first Mac. I dare say Apple has done so well in the last few years that the long standing
"You know why you do not see me styling wit my homies? Because I have no homies!!" -Mojo Jojo
A pocket-sized, full-screen device needs some sort of screen protection--especially a touchscreen, which are notoriously fragile. The leather sleeve is an accessory to the touchscreen full-screen iPod, whatever it ends up being called. It's Apple's answer to the obvious question of "how do you protect the screen?"
Build a man a fire, he's warm for one night. Set him on fire, and he's warm for the rest of his life.
But this new leather iPod case will be the most ergonomic, newest, leathery, caseyest case ever made! It promises to take the storage business to hip ergonomic heights not even reached by the trapper keeper. Like bird flu pandemics, asteroid strikes,and terror threats, this announcement can not be over-hyped.
No! Not in the electronics business! Never!
Whoo, signature!
DesireCampbell.com
Perhaps in their zeal to provide content, they neglected to provide functionality. Many assumed that the new Mac mini would, among other things, provide Tivo functionality. It doesn't. Yet, it connects to your TV, beams content around your house, and otherwise has everything it needs to be a Tivo, except software.
It is starting to look as if the Beatles were right after all. Apple should not be in the content business. Perhaps it is time for someone with a clue to get into the appliance business.
-- Stephen.
My biggest complain is that these nimrods keep calling that stereo thing a "ghetto-blster"
I'm assuming that most of these bloggers and columnists lived through the 80's and should know WTF a Ghetto-Blaster looks like
For those of you who lived sheltered lives during the 80's and early 90's, a Google Image Search for Ghetto Blaster is highly informative.
Oddly enough, the GIS turned up no pictures of automatic weapons in the first few pages. Cause that's the other thing that comes to mind when I think about ghetto-blasters.
[Fuck Beta]
o0t!
All they ever announce is the same products with a new form factor. Maybe they will replace one processor with another if they want a BIG announcement.
Jeez, when will people give it up? So it wasn't a major product launch, it wasn't intended to be! Did the video even show up on Apple's site following the event...no. That should be enough of a clue to the news media by in large that Apple is not making it a big deal. Wait until April 1st, then there will be a great event, introducing all sorts of things that deserve hype. Apple will probably back that event and hype it up, but c'mon people, let's face it, Apple is a company that has to introduce things that they bring out, it's part of the job of marketing and advertising, so this one didn't introduce something amazing... I'm not sure why CNET and most news companies can't get over it. Apple is an awesome company, but c'mon are they really expected to deliver hope and salvation at every event they do (even if it's in their cafeteria with limited press invited)? Wait until April 1st my friends, that will make people forget an event like this even happened.
I accuse CNET and slashdot for over-hyping Apple's over-hyping.
It's a fashion thing. The iPod is cool, it's stylish, but with all the fluff stripped, it's an MP3 player. Now, when people have an MP3 player, they got one. It's not like you need one again after 6 months (unless it's badly made and it falls apart, but then I would kinda doubt people would get the same model again).
Sooner or later, the market is saturated. What now? Sure, you can release a new model (and Apple did). Only works once or twice as well, there's only so much room for improvement. You can make it smaller, you can make it hold larger armounts of music, but when it's small enough to be no longer visible (don't forget, fashion is also about showing what you got) and when it can hold the equivalent to 100 CDs, people don't want it any smaller or bigger.
So accessories come into play. And besides selling those MP3s for 99 cent, that's where the money comes from. Because the players are sold. You will probably sell a few more, but that's no longer the big market.
Now, it's incredibly hard to patent sizes. Sure, you can patent a design, you can patent the brand, but there's no way to keep third party vendors from selling gadgets that "just happen to" fit the iPod perfectly. How should you patent the earplugs? It uses a standard socket, any earplug would do. How do you make your customer buy your add-ons instead of others, which are probably cheaper?
You start hyping. You have to make sure that your customers know that YOUR, and only YOUR accessories offer the value they're looking for. You NEED those earplugs, because they're original and without, the iPod is no longer cool. You NEED our case because only with it, you show the world that you have the original and only then you are part of the family.
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
The question you need to ask is: Where is the hype coming from?
Did Apple claim that their press conference would herald fantastically interesting products that would reshape the industry? As I recall, they merely announced a press conference and said they would have some "fun stuff". That's it.
This wasn't Steve walking on stage at MacWorld - which is a hypefest by design, where only the biggest products are released - this was Apple introducing another Intel-based Mac to show its partners and investors that it was committed to, and proceeding with the transition from PPC. The fact they had some other, far less interesting products ready at the same time, and decided to show them off as well seems to be more of a logical exploitation of the press conference. Would it have made sense for Apple to simply make no mention of their other new products while the media's attention was focused squarely on them? I don't think so.
People are so used to Apple throwing them curveballs that they build up entirely unrealistic expectations of the company, and get angry at Apple when they fail to live up to these fantasies. You can criticize Apple for borking the video chipset in the new Minis, but you can't really get mad at them for not releasing a product that may only exist in your mind.
it's only over-hyped becase we make it over-hyped. Why do you think they didn't have it webcasted live on the apple site? or that they only allowed like 200 people and that there wasn't any fuss made on the apple site? sure, they closed down the apple store during the "unveiling," but that's just something that they have to do to prepare for the new items. Part of Apple is going to want they extra hype and attention and really does want us to be mezmerized by "What will Steve give us today?" but in reality I think that they really didn't want this to be a big deal, which it obviously shouldn't have been. Steve loves the element of surprise, and I know we like the Shock and Awe that they usually give us, but I think that the lack of televising and small venue should have tipped us all off. We all keep hoping for "that next new item" but we really need to just chill out and remember to take our medication today.
Just wait till the bondage/S-&-M types get hold of those... can you see a black iPod wearing chains and spikes with stiletto heels?
C|N>K
The contract that you are referring to is one of the oddest ones I've heard about, though I don't make it my business to seek out the odd ones. I don't think that Apple Computer should be breaking its contracts, but I also don't think that the premise of that contract with that Apple Corp makes sense either, it was overly far reaching based on Beatles paranoia.
It may very well be that the recent product launches is designed to provoke a lawsuit so the issue can be settled once and for all. I for one don't think that Apple computer's products infringe on Apple Corps products, and the same goes to their respective names and trademarks. With many or most trademark systems, it appears that it is legal to operate under similar or identical trademark names so long as they aren't in the same product category and don't use confusingly similar logos.
This has got to be the biggest conspiracy over nothing that I have every seen. First, Slashdot posts a sensational post about how the new products at Apple are overhyped and links an article that doesn't over hype anything! Then Cnet comes out with an article saying it's over hyped which slashdot posts as well! Ten out of Ten points for getting lots of hits and comments but -1000000 points for lack of intelligence. I say what everyone else is saying... what hype?
For a product to be overhyped I have to see it somewhere other than slashdot which does get a high bandwidth of users but does not have mainstream penetration.
"All great wisdom is contained in .signature files"
Yes, it's a fair charge. Fashion is fickle and every comment that the iPod phenomenon is turning tacky is a warning that no company can sit on its laurels for long. The iPod's leather posing pouch and the ghetto-blaster model are tacky, too.
During 2006, it's quite likely we'll see an increasing number of articles saying the iPod thing is over. When every kid on the block is toting one, it's time to get rid of it and buy something reassuringly "exclusive" instead. Never underestimate snob appeal.
Las qué passoun
tournoun pas maï
Wall St. Geek.com has some analysis up that shows that Apple stock rises before annoucements, but rarely keeps the momentum afterwards. In fact, after major announcements (including the original iPod), the stock sank. Here's the link.
Today's UF
here... enjoy the subtle dig...
Donald 'Duck' Dunn: We had a band powerful enough to turn goat piss into gasoline.
Apple is all about fashion, image and looking cool. Hype is part of what makes the whole image.
Engineering is the art of compromise.
I think you underestimate the importance of toast to we English.
Er.. Is there a Grammar Nazi in the house?
Apple: Really cool!
CNET: Are you sure?
Apple: Well, maybe not really, really cool, but still quite cool.
CNET: Just 'quite' cool you say?
Apple: Not just quite cool - pretty cool.
CNET: 'Pretty' cool? Nah! We're not interested. Who wants to report stories about stuff that's just pretty cool? We're CNET. We only report the coolest of the cool dude!
Apple: OK, OK. They're actually really cool.
CNET: Great, we'll be there for the announcement.
3 hours later...
CNET: Hey! You lied! You said that stuff was really cool but it was just pretty cool. We wasted expensive web site space on 'pretty cool'! What kind of lame ass web site do you take us for?
Apple: Um...well...we tried to tell you...
"The White House is not an intelligence-gathering agency," -- Scott McClellan, Whitehouse spokesman.
bitch
What Amazing Features are in the new Mac Mini?
It has Exactly The Same features, just some extra ports on the back and an Apple remote (which you can buy anyway..)
Man, this is so sad.
Why is everyone so jealous that Aple is the bestest and inovativestest company in the universe?
I mean come on! They invented the mp3-player, they produce the wrold's most powerful personal-computer (using the new bestest Intel-processors), and they are overall very modest about it.
They never use dirty tricks like product-placement (or can you remember seeing a iPod casually displayed in Blade III?) or blog-astroturfing (all Mac-sites are of course completely independent business entities operated by fans, not, as some evil sources and whois-info on the domainnames claim, run by Apples PR-department).
o, the only thing they can actually be accused of is that they are actually guilty of doing not enough promotion for their products. I think the iPod would have sold even better if there would have been a bit of a campaign for it.
Investors aren't happy about this.
Didn't we already have this conversation for a very similar article? The C|Net columnist is probably just a Slashdot reader who paraphrased everything that was said on the forum last time around and handed it to his editor.
...and in other other news Windows is STILL for pedophiles.
1. Gigabit ethernet (*usually* unheard of on a product of this size and price - yes, yes, yes, I'm sure you'll come up with examples of other computers that have GigE, but none will be that size *and* price category)
2. The Apple Remote can't be used without IR, which the old mini didn't have (nor did it have Front Row, and yes, that's just software, but still, Front Row can't be "officially" added to a computer without it without hacking it, and even then, technically "pirating" it - and you still have no way to control it via IR without adding third party products like an IR receiver)
3. The ability to play 1080-line HD (which the previous mini didn't have the horsepower to do), which is a huge step toward, oh, I don't know, using it as an HD media center
4. Optical S/PDIF audio input and output (huge addition - previous mini did not have)
5. The ability to actually do sharing with Front Row of music, photos, and video from other computers on the local network (a big functional improvement and almost a necessity for a "media center")
6. Less important: the fact that it has a dual core processor in a 6.5"x6.5"x2" form factor, the addition or 802.11a, and Intel HD Audio
So yes, it's a mini with amazing features, by most estimations. If *you* don't like it (and I'm not saying you do or don't), fine - don't get one. But that doesn't change the fact that it has an array of new features that make it dramatically more useful as a media center than it was before).
over expectations by unrealistic idiots kills it.
Except that the "megahertz myth" is correct in relation to Intel's Pentium 4 design.
Intel itself had to backpedal hard on that. After all, NONE of the current Intel processor line are marketed by clock speed, but by their new model naming scheme. After all, customers would be scratching their head with the "current" processor releases that perform better, but have a lower clock speed than the previous generation.
Overhype?
Never!
"Nine times out of ten, starting a fire is not the best way to solve the problem." - my wife
Unbelievable. You didn't even spell "post" right. Nor did you get the first post. Simply stunning.
http://cyclocosm.com Pro cycling at its worst
It should be even more basic than that.
'Jobs' announcement of a new leather case for the iPod was especially ridiculous. Like the queen announcing a new toaster in Buckingham Palace. It seemed odd that Jobs was troubling himself to introduce fashion accessories to Apple's products.
Think about it.
A marketer tried to get the best currently-new offering from a company to sell better.
It's the exact same thing that any marketer, anywhere around the world would do.
If you watch QVC, you can see salesmen doing the same deal for thing after thing, time after time. ("This ball of twine is the most amazing, lifechanging thing ever!")
It's just good business. Apple isn't going to churn out something like the introduction of the Apple, the Macintosh, or the iPod every year. Matter of fact, if you count those lines, they've been managing better than one lucrative industry-changing product line a decade, which is pretty damn good.
The only unusual thing is that some Mac users seem to take a polling approach instead of a event-triggered approach to being notified about new Apple products (which means that sometimes, there isn't much there).
Any program relying on (nontrivial) preemptive multithreading will be buggy.
I, for one, welcome our new over-hyped overlords.
How many escape pods are there? "NONE,SIR!" You counted them? "TWICE, SIR!"
What it sound like to me is that some other product got yanked out of the presentation at the last minute and that was put in its place. Steve Jobs is known to be a stickler for having things correct for those presentations. Maybe something didn't work right, got yanked and replaced with a second stringer that was on stand by (it was going to be introduced and sold anyway, it just wasn't going to get the dog and pony show to go with it).
Architectural plans are like computer source code with a couple of differences: You only compile once.
Those features are ten a penny on every PC these days.
You could say that the Mac Mini was underpowered in it's original incarnation. It's not like they COULDN'T have had these features (HD movie playback is a chipset support issue; Core Duo can't do it on it's own, either) on a PowerPC Mac Mini that size, they certainly had the Northbridge for it in the G4 Macs and PowerBooks.
Saying that the "Mac Mini has amazing features for it's size" is really just totally underestimating what you can do with technology these days. If you get rid of the PCI slots on your average PC board and solder the CPU down, you can get all those features in a board that size. Nano ITX is stark proof of this kind of miniaturisation.
Perhaps working for a company that designs solutions like that, I am jaded and cynical and simply unamazed at these obviously life-changing things Apple have put into this new box?
Or maybe in actual fact.. they just aren't amazing. I rest my case.
slashdotc: warning: jokes.AustinPowers.frickinlaserbeam() in slashdot.groupthink has been deprecated.
You start hyping. You have to make sure that your customers know that YOUR, and only YOUR accessories offer the value they're looking for. You NEED those earplugs, because they're original and without, the iPod is no longer cool. You NEED our case because only with it, you show the world that you have the original and only then you are part of the family.
Apple may be pretty good at herding consumers, but they're absolutely nothing compared to, say, De Beers. De Beers created the diamond ring as a cultural item less than a hundred years ago. Now, you have to give your lady love a diamond ring -- no alternatives.
The story I linked to is pretty interesting -- if you have a couple minutes, it's a worthwhile read.
Any program relying on (nontrivial) preemptive multithreading will be buggy.
I just looked up the word, and it said: "inspiring awe or admiration or wonder"
Basically the new features are "we added some new but scarcely amazing features but most importantly, still managed to get it in the same size box".
Then again, another definition was 'overused as a hyperbole for "good."'
This happens a lot. Not just with Apple. People say the strategy is to "buy on the rumor, sell on the news." Of course, the article to posted also has a few incidents where the stock was up long after the news and down before it. I don't have earnnigs tables and charts handy but its possible that MacCon or whatever isn't the only influence on the stock.
I Browse at +4 Flamebait
Open Source Sysadmin
warning: [deprecation] IForOne() in Slashdot.GroupThink.Jokes has been deprecated.
Nano ITX.. yes. What do you get with nano itx? A 1gz VIA process, 2 usb ports, 100mb network, minimal sound, minimal video. How much does this cost? $350-$400 (yes those 8 layer boards arnt cheap) for the motherboard alone. No hard drive, no wireless, no ram, no case. Build me a nano itx computer that compares to the mac minis for anywhere near the price. I will buy 1000.
I rest my case.
http://search.ebay.com/Nano-ITX
Slashdot coverage of the iPod.
from the well-thats-not-very-exciting dept.
Get off my launchpad!
Overhyped? Hmmm. The press invitations specifically mentioned that Apple would be introducing some "fun new products". Fun new products. Roll that phrase around in your mind for a little bit. Fun new products.
Does that sound like an earthshaking announcement to you? Like Apple was going to introduce OS XI or make a "fuck Intel; we're using Cell processors now" kind of announcement?
If so, you're nuts. I was expecting some iPod-related announcements, perhaps the fabled "Video iPod" (yawn) at most and some capacity bumps at the least. I'd say their product announcements fell right in the middle of that modest spectrum.
It's true that Apple created some hype by not issuing any hints about the products they'd be introducing. Most of those journalists would have stayed at home if you told them in advance that they'd be introducing a new Mini, a leather slipcover, and a boombox. But hey, I can't really blame a company for wanting to create excitement about their products. That's called capitalism, folks. What Apple really did was capitalize on the press and public's fascination with Apple. They simply allowed the press and public to create the hype for them.
So was Apple cannily trying to promote and sell some product? Sure. Did Apple themselves overhype the event? I would say absolutely not.
OtakuBooty.com: Smart, funny, sexy nerds.
Those features are ten a penny on every PC these days.
You have a PC that runs FrontRow? Do tell!
-jcr
The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
P.
Apple overhyped this "launch" because they launched them with a CEO-hosted press event.
What company needs a CEO-hosted press event to announce a boom box?
Or leather case? Or computer upgrade?
Seriously, when's the last time a company held a press event to announce a boom box?
Apple has themselves to blame. They could've introduced these products without the fanfare, just like any other company.
-- "I never gave these stories much credence." - HAL 9000
now now! lets face the fact! its no over-hyped. just pur marketting. its not any leather case, its a apple leather case annouced by Mr. Job. if it didn't came out of the mouth of Mr. Job. who the hell in the right mind would buy a 100$ case for a 300$ ipod? i would probly get a cheap 20$ one and save the 80 buck for my ipod upgrade. Now with Mr. Job's sceal of approval at the conference, its like cK initial's on a pair of boxers. its Fashion! you can sell boxers for 100$ even if they don't cost more than 5$ to make. and that the competition are more that willing to sell them at 20$ with 300% markup ;)
I accuse Cnet of writing crappy articles. But besides, when Steve announced the leather case, he also announced 4 other products, like the mini with Intel cpu. So what's the big deal?
Anyone wondering if the disappointment in this announcement is just what Steve wanted. The hype has gotten so big around Steve's announcements latley the only way he could suprise anyone is to announce a new product by showing up unannounced at a random apple store and giving them away. Reducing the expectations would make easier to Steve to wow everyone with the unexpected.
For starters, Apple didn't hype anything. Second, the Apple products that were released, are IMHO far more important than any new ipod or tablet would have been, they deserved hype. All these Apple-Fan boys are just too stupid to realize the importance of the new Mac Mini products.
They symbolize Apple moving into Microsofts Media center territory, and are probably the most important announcment since the first iPod.
And Yes, I bought the core duo mac Mini the opening day. I've got it here at the house. I was impressed with how easily It hooked up to my HD Television, but must say that I'm disappointed at how crappy the software is. This is the first OSX machine i've owned, and I expected it to not be so painfully slow, given that they advertise a huge speed increase with these Intel chips. I also expected it to have basic functionality for keyboard shortcuts. Heck I couldn't even close an alert dialog or tab between the 'Yes/No' buttons without using the mouse.
Big ones, small ones, some as big as yer 'ead!
Give 'em a twist, a flick o' the wrist...
Uh, you didn't even spell your sig right.
Pro cycling at it's worst --> Pro cycling at its worstreplying to trolls is gay. you reply to trolls, ergo, you are gay.
When someone other than Via gets their mits to it, you'll see the same cool stuff as happened with MiniITX - who wants a Via chip? Nobody.
But a Pentium M MiniITX board would kick ass. And does. They're around somewhere.
It's about engineering it into a small space. Mac Mini was not "amazing" to get that small in the first place, putting an Intel chip in a space that small is not "amazing" either.
That was on purpose. I'm not sure if Slashdot has code for filtering "first posts".
I'll say it again. IT is very much like the fashion industry ("XML! It's so modern! It's so now! It's so you!"). Or the US auto industry of the 50's which sold crap but had cool tail fins. Though I must add that most Apple products, while not perfect, are not crap. But they do understand how design and fashion drive consumer retail and technology much better than any other player out there right now.
putting the 'B' in LGBTQ+
Windows Media Center edition?
I actually run PowerCinema. It does more than Front Row in much the same way.
Overhyped or not, it's not just CNet who thinks it was. There is also the ever so well informed Joy of Tech.
Windows Media Center edition?
Not even close.
-jcr
The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
Every time apple wipes it's ass people clap. who the fuck cares? not me you fuckers.
The media's job in two steps:
1) Create false expectations
2) Pounce on those who fail to live up to its created expectations
I guess Apple's just getting what governments have enjoyed for all these years...
Why is running Photoshop not "real work"? And you do realize that Macs are huge in scientific computing (solving real problems) don't you?
... and then they built the supercollider.
Saying that the "Mac Mini has amazing features for it's size" is really just totally underestimating what you can do with technology these days. If you get rid of the PCI slots on your average PC board and solder the CPU down, you can get all those features in a board that size. Nano ITX is stark proof of this kind of miniaturisation.
You make a good point. The problem is that only Apple seems to be actually selling something that works out of the box. Sure I could get a Linux box (maybe a Shuttle?), with MythTV, but that would need some technical know how. I could get a TiVO, but I can only use that as a PVR and nothing else. I could use Windows, but I want a Mac.
Yes, its probably not amazing, but it certainly offers a nice alternative to what else is on the market. If you know of any current equivalents of the Mac mini, or upcoming products then please mention them. I am more interested in stuff which is ready out of the box for the non-computer people.
Jumpstart the tartan drive.
It's spelled correctly. I just didn't punctuate it correctly. Duh.
http://cyclocosm.com Pro cycling at its worst
Troll? Funny. And to the point.
Some people...
Five Blades !!!
http://www.theonion.com/content/node/33930
>>> "Many women specifically don't want diamonds"
I think you meant "some women say they 'dont want diamonds'"!?
I heard he was a fruitarian during his early days as well..
Raise your hand if you have iTunes ...
...
...
...
/. visionary. Taken from http://apple.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=22940&ci d=2467504
Raise your hand if you have a FireWire port
Raise your hand if you have both
Raise your hand if you have $400 to spend on a cute Apple device
There is Apple's market. Pretty slim, eh? I don't see many sales in the future of iPod.
Another
Time gives a whole new perspective to things, doesn't it?
Warning: Opinions known to be heavily biased.
One of the console manufacturers ought to parody them... "What is a PowerPC processor doing in a gaming console? Things Macs could never do!"
rather than a CNET editor's overinflated idea of him or herself, let's expand more on the razor phenom. To whit: I don't know how many of you remember the first stainless steel razor. It was called the Wilkinson, it came from England, and because it was stainless, I could use it for maybe two weeks per. Okay, my beard was lighter back then, too. It was great, and it put Gilette Blue Blades out of business. Within a decade, the razor wars began. The trick they played: giving away the razor, and selling you the blades. The Blue Blades were maybe .25 a pack. The Wilkinsons were around a dollar.
Then there were two blades. They cut closer, but they don't last as long. Price of a package: four or five bucks when introduced. Now, they're up to FIVE, and going. But now, with five blades, I know it only works the way it's supposed to for two or three days, and a pack is over ten bucks!
All of this made me do something I always said I never would: I bought an electric razor. Sure, it was about 50 bucks, but it's good for two, three years. Oil it and replace the blade about once a year.
The razor companies need to learn a new trick when keeping their free razor in blades costs more than an electric that doesn't need perpetual refilling.
There's a lesson in there for all corporations, including Apple, and the stupid tech tabloid, CNET.
We're talking fashion gadgets here. That's something you sell only, by default, by creating a market for it. Because essentially, there is none.
You don't need Gucci shoes. The vanilla ones you get are just as good. Even if they're half as good, you could buy two pairs (or more) for the price of a pair of Guccis. But you need Gucci 'cause you want to show your sense of fashion.
Are they "better"? Do they look "better"? Be objective. Are they in any way superior to ordinary shoes? Probably not. But they are from a famous designer. The brand is well known and people who know their fashion will identify them, they will consider you to be someone with a similar sense of fashion and will respect you. Not for what you are, but for what you wear.
Silly? Maybe. Personally, I'm compelled to say yes. I'd prefer to be known and respected for what I do and who I am. Not for what I can afford to "waste" my money.
It's a peacock thing. Show off that you can waste resources without worrying.
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
It's so much fun, I hope they do this more. You know, announce fun new products. Then we can see everyone go crazy (yey, FTL or cold fusion, what do you think?). Oh, and you know what, you can also check their stock prices!!!!!!
God, what fun we have.
I think, therefore I am...I think.
A leather case for 100 USD can add up to some serious profit (my Samsung mp3 player cost 88 USD). What would it cost to make and ship a zillion of those buggers? What is the return rate for failed components? I can't blame Apple even though I dont like the way media fawns over anything Apple does. I have seen Apple on major US news magazine covers twice, and cant remember seeing another makers computer on the cover of Time like I saw the iMac (the one that looked like a lamp).
There is a lot of expectation and focus on Apple now since people are waiting for the Intel iBooks and such. So Jobs and Apple ran with that. I can't blame Apple. Look at all the exposure they got when the Nanos scratched easy. Media loves to follow Jobs and Apple. I can't ever find a compelling reason to buy any of their products (they make great stuff but always come with a kick in the shins since th9ings are either too expensive or missing features) but I like their attempts at innovation.
Now CNET is a place that REALLY generates more heat than light!
It isn't dual core.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
I, for one, welcome our new overhyped iMasters.
I've used (and like) both Linux and Osx, although the people who tend to use these OS'es froth at the mouth over them.
OSX IS THE BEST! I LOVE YOU APPLE!!!!!!
LINUX ROCKS! SCREW YOU WINDOWS DUMMY USERS!!
Apple im sure knows this. Sure it's just a leather Ipod case, but IT'S APPLE!!!! YAYA!!~!! *dances*
I think I stick with Windows mainly because I'm scared of the the users of the alternative operating systems. I don't want people to think im some freak product patriotic nutjob.
There is nothing informative about this post.
There was no advertising, marketing or PR involved.
A simple note was sent to the press to come see some "fun" new products.
Apple didnt create the hype - numbnuts like you guys and other tech blogs did. All Apple said is that they were making announcement.
And nice Straw Man-like fallicy of ignoring the superstar of the announcement -a new intel based desktop computer configured for easy use of enternament media. If all you heard was a leather case then then you are the one with a problem, not Apple.
Hmmm... who is the "lame" one here?
They're so up themselves, they've started overhyping things in secret! I mean, diabolical.
~~~~~ BigLig2? You mean there's another one of me?
No. Weak is the JBL On Stage which, along with sounding like a GE Super Radio, version 1 was a complete piece of crap which shorted out and caused numerous complaints... or maybe the Bose Sound Dock which for $300 you get another piece of crap sounding iPod speaker system.... or of course there is iHome... which again sounds as good as a $30 GE Super Radio but sells for $100.
Apple knows exactly what its getting into. Not too hard to trump the competition here.
Actually, toast racks are vital--the British don't believe in hot or cold food. Everything has to be room temperature. (I've actually seen unrefrigerated soft drinks as "cold drinks." And of course, there's no ice.)
I know, I know--it's retailiation to what us Merkins do to tea.
Maybe Steve is just really into leather.
But they sure believe in hot and cold water - always out of separate taps in the handbasin in the loo - it's gotta be a law or something.
"Is Apple a victim of its own success?"
Apple isn't a victim of anything - the people in charge are just full of themselves. Being able to even stay in business selling computers at margins three to four times the industry average made Jobs and co. arrogant enough to assume that consumers are so stupid they'll pay $99 for a cheap leather iPod case with a design that completely counters the excellent design of the iPod itself.
Of course, this might actually not be a bad strategy. The Republican party managed to take control of the USA by insulting the entire nations intelligence, so maybe Apple can make even more money by doing the same.
The invite list was really small. The event was held in Apple's cafeteria! There was no over-hype here. Just having the CEO announce it doesn't hype anything--Steve Jobs isn't just an ordinary CEO, he's Apple's main orator, and of course he'll announce these things. This small press event was held to get the new products into the news, but that's not hype.
Apple DID announce these without their usual fanfare. These goofy press people were buying into Thinksecret and Appleinsider's rumors.
When will people realize these rumors sites are hurting Apple? This isn't the first time in the last six months that all the rumor sites said one thing, and Apple fell short (dual-core G5s, which ended up coming out much later).
"Sufferin' succotash."
Speaking of the leather case (which was a good idea, but...) have you seen the PRICE on it? Jesus. What did they do with this thing to make it $100? Inlay it with diamonds? I almost got one of these for my iPod until I saw the ridiculous pricing. What is funnier, is that the case for the nano (which we would assume would be smaller, and use less material) is the SAME price as the one for the iPod 60gb.
BeauHD. Worst editor since kdawson.
Apple is a normal company. Why does the public constantly expect them to do the impossible? I think over history, Apple has shown with some regularity that they can pull "the impossible" out of their hat. Now with Jobs and NeXT genes on board, that sense is even more intense. Whether Apple's products are brilliant successes or bizarrely interesting failures, nobody can deny that what they're doing as a rule seems more interesting that what Dell/Gateway/Microsoft et al are ever doing. And occasionally (Macintosh, NeXT, Newton, iMac) Apple/NeXT have done things that were completely mind-blowing and heretofore impossible. I'm speaking as a longtime PC owner and Linux, not a Mac owner (though I do love my Newton)-- I have a healthy respect for the real innovation Apple has brought to the industry (compare to Microsoft's "innovation"...) and I have trouble understanding why Slashot users are such haters when it comes to Apple and Steve Jobs. posted by: aussersterne
i agree
Something tells me Jobs won't be inviting Cnet to the next announcement. If he doesn't invite 'em it'll show me what a nazi he is.
.. you dont need a press conference to announce a leather case.
Anyway, i agree with Cnet
That said, I honestly could care less either which way.
The columnist at CNET is talking about it, that's free publicity. If it was really uninteresting, he wouldn't had bothered tapping any keys about it.
-------- -------- Support Wesley Clark for president!!!
Slashdot readers are not "such haters when it comes to Apple and Steve Jobs". There is a distinct pecking order of companines and OS's. Apple is not at the top, of course, but they are no where near the bottom. Here is a tentative top 10 list of Slashot OS preferences :-)
1 Linux (all distro's with RedHat near the bottom)
2 Apple (on Mon, Wed and Fri)
3 BSD (on Tues, Thurs, and Sat)
4 Palm OS ('cause i have no idea)
5 Amiga ('cause it was way ahead of its time)
6 BeOS (see above)
7 C64 ('cause it can run a web server)
8 OS/2 (floats around the list depending on who nice IBM has behaved in a given month)
9 CP/M ('cause it's not Windows)
10 Windows (all flavours of Windows are generally grouped together from Win 3.1 to Server 2003. They all bluescreen as soon as they are powered up)
On a slightly more serious note, it has ALWAYS astounded me that Apple enjoyed so much love for maintaining total control over hardware, software and distribution. Unlike MS, Apple is free to bundle and package their products any way they see fit. As long as both companies pay their taxes and avoid paying bribes and kickbacks, I say let them bundle software and cajole the world into buying their wares any way they can.
Is this sig nificant?
It would be nice for you to let us know the alternative?
...and don't get me started on the toilets that fill to the brim with water!
Are you referring to the single hot+cold 'fawcet' things that are prevalent in the USA? In which case, having experienced both for many years, I prefer the separate ones. They are much simpler and don't break anywhere near as often.
I have the same opinion of the plugs in sinks/hand basins in the USA. Waaay too complicated for their own good. I find they often do not work (i.e. don't stop water running down the plug hole) and are unnecessarily difficult to fix. What is wrong with a plain and simple plug-on-a-chain?
Where is Merkin? I've never heard of that country.
"Persistance is Fertile" - Me. I can quote myself if I want to.
Somebody has got to photograph some big-name rapper with that speaker box on his shoulder, early '80s style.
Yeah, and if anything, I thought the single most unique/interesting thing about that new Apple leather iPod case was something they overlooked in the product announcement. It appears from the Apple Store photos and info that they actually have a little "tongue" that you pull on to slide the iPod up and partially out of the case whenever you need to peek at the screen on it. (The biggest initial complaint I heard about their leather case was "It doesn't even have a window in it to view the display!")
I sure wouldn't spend that kind of money on an iPod carrying case -- but cases are a big deal to a lot of folks. Look at the killing the cellphone industry makes on cases. And the fact that it solves the dilemma of "How do you protect the iPod screen and still make it convenient enough to glance at it when needed?" is at least worth noting.
How to get as many people inflamed as possible. Post an anti-apple/iPod article. Whats funnier, is all the apple fanboys that took the bait. damn funny. Its just a little piece of electronics people.. with a badge on it?
What are you talking about? The closest PC is an Aopen MiniPC, which uses the old Pentium M Dothan, not the new dual core, and is several hundred dollars MORE expensive.
l http://lib.store.yahoo.net/lib/myaopen/MINIPC.html
We are living in a world where the Mac is cheaper AND more powerful than the similar PC. The comparable system from AOpen is $686 to Apple's $599!
http://lib.store.yahoo.net/lib/myaopen/MINIPC.htm
http://www.apple.com/macmini/whatsinside.html
GPL Deconstructed
You're clued in to the "special allure" of Apple and of Macintosh (and of the iPod now, as well, I suppose). This is one of the ways that Apple truly is different from other PC companies, though it's not one of the ways we Mac Addicts like discuss or admit.
I think it works in much the same way as the way Las Vegas takes people's greed, repackages it, and sells it back to them.
Much of the disappointment felt after these announcements is because people mistake Steve Jobs for Santa Claus, and expect to get whatever it is they're hoping for. I've personally handled this problem by not having expectations of anything or projecting my desires. I don't really get into the rumor sites (nor do I peek at presents before Xmas). Then I can somewhat objectively evaluate whatever is being offered without feeling bitter disappointment. I think I learned this as a kid, since in my experience, Santa was often disappointing.
It's not offtopic, dumbass. It's orthogonal.
Their Next Version(TM) and their sorry under-produced-yet-still-undersold game consle are two recent examples.
So who's over-hyped?
Beta is broken and the link to classic doesn't work. Stop wasting our time or there won't be anybody left here.
Have you guys considered that maybe Apple is no longer just a technology company, but also a fashion company? People don't find anything wrong with fashion designers hyping new hand-bags. You are being self-centered to think that you, a basement dwelling troll, are still Apple's main market; their central customer is now the fashion conscious girl walking down a Manhattan boulevard with her iPod.
LS
There is a fine line between being a cultivated citizen and being someone else's crop. - A. J. Patrick Liszkie
Yeah, and the key here is that Apple knows that most people don't want to do more. Some people just don't get it.
The problem you have there is that you think less is best, and refuse to accept anything you can simply only use half of.
PowerCinema does EVERYTHING Front Row does and more. But you can use it for Front Row stuff alone. Or you can only use the music player. It's your choice.
As for those suggesting that AOpen's box is the only alternative? No, I'm afraid that's a little out.
It's the only alternative if you REQUIRE a 12x12x6 box to do all that stuff, but there are plenty of options for doing it in other ways.
Even in Apple's market, the Mini is a tiny little niche (eclipsed in sales by the laptops, and even the iMac - it is still being sold as a way into iTunes and iPod) and in AOpen's core business it is probably even smaller. For all the "hype" surrounding small PC's, nobody buys them. If they were that big a "deal" then Dell would be selling hundreds of thousands of them per week.
Hint: they just aren't. ITX is a bit of a flop because people don't want a totally unexpandable tiny board when they think of a PC. They want PCI slots and SLI and the ability to drop in a new processor when they think they need to upgrade, even if they never use the ability - it is some perceived Value Added feature of a larger, bulkier system. NanoITX moreso because Via can't even get their own (underpowered) systems out of the door, and producing a completely nonstandard form factor (won't fit in a standard ATX case, and needs a PSU adapter) isn't much fun for system builders, let alone end users.
Mac Mini has amazing new features? No. Still no. Front Row is not AMAZING. It's been done before. 4 USB ports has been done before. Intel Core Duo and an Intel chipset, is so mundane besides it's newness, that I dread to think how easily impressed some people are around here.
Are Apple guilty of hyping too much? No. I think you guys are going to take the blame for that one. Although I will forgive you for not thinking a folded bit of leather is the Second Coming, saying that the Mac Mini is now an AMAZING device is a little much.
the British don't believe in hot or cold food
Of course they do
Tea: must be hot.
Beer: should be room temperature.
Revenge: Best served cold.
Well, if you like to put your hands underneath a flow of some warm water (not scalding hot and not freezing cold), then you'll like the type of faucet that lets you adjust the mixture of hot and cold. If you want to put the stopper in the basin and fill it up with water for some reason, then maybe you prefer the separate type.
My other first post is car post.
I'll tell Steve to put you on the list of people we won't allow to buy an Apple product. That should hold you. This is how it goes: Apple's had a stunning series of, well, victories. The switch to Intel, the video iPods, the contract with Disney and the deal with all the studios -- this has been major, hopeful announcements, on top of the amazing sales of iPods and the rise in market share -- and I think that people are expecting world-beaters every time Jobs hits the stage. Well, it doesn't happen. This January's MacWorld saw iLife 06, a solid advance, and the intel iMac and MacBook Pro. Cool, but the designs didn't change. Yes, they work with the new processors. It's a time of transition, and I think they're concentrating on nuts and bolts. Now, the new Mac mini looks like the old one, but faster. (By the way, the only Mac faster than the Intel iMac is the Quad, get it? These new machines do nothing much stylistically, but they're FAST. (Oh, and nobody's booted Windows from them yet, either.) So this time, the underwhelming, and maybe ill-advised iPod Hi-Fi, is less than a hit. Did Apple "promise" all the fancy stuff that ThinkSecret, and Apple Insider, said they would announce? No. But it's proof that Apple excites curiosity about their next move. There were so many guesses out there -- video iPod with full screen video and touchscreen controller? Didn't happen. New iBooks that weigh about two pounds, etc.? No. Media box that wirelessly downloads movies from Mars? None of them either. Just an old Mac mini with an intel chip and a speaker that's not bad in the lows, but kind of sucks in the treble. No wonder Apple tries to shut down rumor sites: it's publicity with a mind of its own. THEY created the specific buzz, Apple didn't. So people feel disappointed, and those who don't wish Apple all that well say, "Aha! Just as I said! They suck!" And the negative stories begin. Same process happens in celebrity stories: Oh, Angelina's crazy, she sleeps with her brother and sucks men's blood. Oh, wait, she's adopting babies and is living with a cute guy: Angelina is wonderful! It's a cycle. You tell the story going up, and then you tell the story going down. None of it's actually true, one way or another. Gore was liked in his early years in the Clinton years: he was the sensible reformer in the press, actually cutting down the size of the bureaucracy. And then, there were never those sex rumors about him. But when he ran for prez, the dogs were unleashed. He was a liar (they had to change what he said to make it sound like he lied, but no matter.) He hired a female consultant to tell him how to be a man! He lies about what he did! He lied about "Love Story!" He says he "invented" the internet! He's crazy! None of it's true. This is what they call a "meme," a story line. It doesn't have to be true. Yeah, sure, Apple over-hyped an event where all they promised was "some fun products." The rumor sites went crazy. Apple didn't say a word. So then they get blamed because these products aren't as cool as the last five world-changing products they brought out. Sure. Want to buy the Brooklyn Bridge?
No, I don't. Don't tell me what I think. I said that less is better in the case of FrontRow for Apple's target audience.
I don't see what the rest of your post has to do with me specificly. I don't recal saying that Apple over-hyped anything, or that the new Mac mini had amazing new features, so why address it to me? I was simply pointing out that more features is not always what people are after, and that Apple knows this very well.
So what do you have in the uncultured land then?
Apple raised the price of the Base line Mac Mini quite a bit -
even if they are including the wireless and bluetooth functionality built in,
it STILL lacks the TiVo DVR type functionality.
And iTunes can rip CDs easily - iTunes should also copy DVDs directly into iPod format just as easily.
HDMI in and HDMI out connectors would fit in the place of that huge DVI connector,
and the Digital Video Recording software would fit right in with the Front Row software and
that cute little 6 button remote control. Most Cable and Dish boxes support an external recorder.
So add the DVR and bump up to a Real Graphics chip (ATI or nVidia) (say the 8 pipeline chips) - and the Mac Mini suddenly is useful for entertainment and gaming too.
Apple got it 80% right so far - so I'll give them a B- on design, and B- on marketing focus.
But as it is, the Mac Mini is no where near ready to 'conquer the living room' just yet.
I think the factor here for not designing totally new stuff too soon is that they want to put the unfamiliar intel stuff (new chip set, and for apple users, something totally new, even if on a totally irrelevant level for most consumers) into an already familiar design. I wouldn't put amazing on the product, but I'm not in marketing, so that doesn't count.
Anyway, your perspective is not typical, wouldn't you say? As a mainstream low price mass market (they wish) product, the features and form factor are pretty amazing (until the next thing comes along). This sentence doesn't work if you leave out words like mainstream, you have to see the whole picture, and since the words amazing and fun are used in a marketing context, it's silly to use them outside of their context. Marketing speak is a bit silly by definition and in any context, but marketing in itself isn't.
Your area of expertise takes you ahead of the market and makes you see lots of specialized products. I bet you aren't easily impressed (you lucky bastard!)
I think, therefore I am...I think.
Did Apple "hype" it at all?
Or did CNET and the other Apple-razzi overhype it?
Yep.
I am pretty die hard apple, but a friend of mine has his mini PC thingy with media center for about a year and a half now. It does some things with OSS, like the DVD functionality, and it runs Windows home edition or something for the rest. It isn't flawless or particularly elegant, but I'd say it's still a bit ahead, even if it doesn't appeal to me. Too fiddly by far.
He has it built in his couch (ha!) and hooked up to his flatscreen, and complemented with a nice little speaker system. All in all pretty good.
It's a bit silly to claim Apple's superiority in the living room at the moment.
I think, therefore I am...I think.
-Eric
SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
Modern technology.
-Eric
SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
But honestly. Apple sent out an e-mail to some members of the press saying "we'll release new products on Tuesday." If that's over-hyping, I'm a blare. That's not even a noun.
Frog blast the vent core.
he may not by thanks to maxxuss, i do!
Using core duo minis in place of dual-G5 Xserves starts to make sense when you consider the reduced power/cooling/space/$$ and with performance probably not too much worse, especially if you don't need lots of memory and will access a central file store via gigabit enet.
I was intrigued by the question: Is Apple a victim of its own success? To whom should I turn for an authoritative answer on the topic, if not my old friend Google.
The direct approach, "apple is a victim of its own success" returns only 35 hits. But plugging in the more general search term, Apple * "victim of its own success", yields 4,700 hits, and includes pages with the fragments "Apple is apparently the victim of its own success," "Apple could become the victim of its own success," "Apple may be becoming a victim of its own success," and "Let's see if 1996 is the year that Apple finally becomes a victim of its own success".
Obviously, the X * "victim of its own success" format is going to tap more deeply into folk wisdom on this sort of topic -- so I was inspired to investigate web punditry's views of other values for X. The obvious first choice was Windows, and the result was 8,580 hits. Microsoft only brought in 2,780 hits, Intel 2,670 hits, AOL 2,160 hits, Firefox 1,740 hits. Plugging in Cisco resulted in 1,630 hits, but for AMD it was a mere 943 hits. It's unclear whether that means that AMD is not a success or not a victim.
Other entities alleged to be, or in danger of becoming, victims of their own success include email (10,900 hits), the Internet (7,370 hits), the Euro (1,990 hits) and Walmart (1,430 hits). Interestingly, Hamas yielded only 160 hits, while America rated 24,300.
But among the 196,000 hits for a Google of the bare "victim of its own success" are a few surprises: Singapore, Crime Stoppers, Penthouse, Asperin, the Mediterranean, Australia, Google, the US Army, Netflix, RateMyKitten, Quebec's child care system, World of Warcraft, Japan, Net retailing, Pap smears, Half-Life 2, Monsanto's Roundup, Sun's mobile Java and many more.
Probably the only conclusion I could rightfully draw from this exercise is that the phrase "victim of its own success" is a badly overworked cliche.