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WWDC '08 Sees Slimmer, Improved, 3G iPhone
Many of us have been watching Apple's WWDC 2008 keynote unfold live. There are many exciting tidbits, but most of all is the announcement of the 3G iPhone. Featuring an even thinner profile, black plastic back, metal buttons, flush headphone jack, improved audio, GPS support, and improved battery life, this is bound to make quite a few people stand up and take notice. Update 18:54 GMT by SM: Best of all it looks like they really took the price point to heart, 8GB iPhones are now $199 and a 16GB model will be available for $299, coming to an Apple store riot near you on July 11,2008.
I know people are excited about it and all, but I would think that we'd wait at least until Steve is done talking about the 3G iPhone on the stage before posting this on Slashdot... Digg is for posting announcements before they're even done announcing them. I'm pretty sure there's still some features that haven't been covered yet...
3G 8 GB iPhone at $199!!!
Galileo: "The Earth revolves around the Sun!"
Score: -1 100% Flamebait
$299 for 16GB, now THAT's affordable!
Didn't even blink at the first entry, because of lack of 3G. Now, color my ears "perked."
Any technology distinguishable from magic is insufficiently advanced.
Metal Buttons? I thought the iPhone didn't have any buttons.
Anthropic principle: We see the universe the way it is because if it were different we would not be here to see it.
$199/8GB, $299/16GB. Available 7/11 in 22 countries.
"National Security is the chief cause of national insecurity." - Celine's First Law
All of the featrure you mentioned will be available in "early July" to the original iPhone users when the 2.0 version of the firmware is released. Only hardware upgrades like GPS and 3G won't be.
What is the data rate $20 /m $40 /m also 3g cap? 5gb may be too small for this phone.
Beat my expected $250 price. Nice going Apple.
Quick, somebody find a reason why it's not good enough yet, or I might have to absolutely freaking love it! This looks like a smash hit to me.
If senility was a race, I would win.
Or really interest those of us who are already pissed off at Verizon.
Out of modpoints but really liked a post? 1BDkF6TtmmeZ3yqXbz9yhdYVqRYnwFoXDj
and almost NOTHING about the mac....despite WWDC being billed as something for both Mac AND iPhone devs....who cares about mobile me? I guess it shows where Apple's priorities are, since given all the shit that has been wrong with Leopard, they certainly aren't on the Mac.
Monstar L
While at $199 you get great many features like GPS, 3G, full browsing along with fully functional phone, its the darn at&t lock-in for 2 years with $20 premium every month (on top of a typical smart-phone tariff) that I need to shell-out gets me thinking. Still a great bargain compared to my windows mobile phone with blue-tooth GPS dongle and third-party crappy applications.
The rock bottom price for a GPS device nowadays is $150. You can switch to the iPhone for merely $199. Can't beat it. Oh and for our european friends: It's merely â126, Four our british friends: it's merely £100
Nature journal lied in Britannica vs Wikipedia Ask to retrac
Oddly enough, one program, "Loopt" is available on both providers, but I cannot find it in any of the App listings on Vz's website.
Those who believe the Internet is private,
find their privates are on the Internet.
True, but Apple customers are quite used to taking their yearly beating, and begging for more. No 3G kept me from the first iPhone, but I'll get one now, just so I can laugh at those who blew $500 on the first version, WITHOUT 3G. I intend much abuse.
Like with using Bluephone Elite to quickly type up a text message using a real keyboard and leaving my phone in my pocket...
Seriously, this is the only technological hinderance keeping me from getting an iPhone now that it covers everything that Sony Ericsson has to offer -_-'
Either way, it's damn tempting to get one now...
Omitting certain countries is in my opinion not the best way to make your coverage look better:
http://www.blogsmithmedia.com/www.engadget.com/media/2008/06/wwdc-keynote_185.jpg
Isn't there something missing in the North Atlantic?
Does Apple allow existing users to upgrade, possibly restarting their 2yr contract, or are they forced to hold to the terms of their previous contract with the old hardware?
- First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then ???, then profit.
Depressing, still no video and no camera upgrade. Half what I was hoping for but the other half was a disappointment. How about charge another $100 and give me a better camera model and what's with the no video support???? Kind of a let down after waiting a year.
The main reason I would want an iPhone is to eliminate the need to carry around my phone and my iPod. Since I have just over 25GB of music on it at the moment, it looks like I'll have to wait a little longer. I'm not sure why they came out with a 32GB iPod touch and not a 32GB iPhone, but it's pretty disappointing to me.
Yes, you can dance to Radiohead.
I want to wait for android to be released, but with nothing on the horizon I'm willing to shell out a modest $200 for an improved iPhone. I've heard rumors that Google may make an announcement shortly after this one, maybe within a week or so? (I hope) Anyone know?
I am not upset about purchasing/owning the iPhone 1.0. It's been leaps and bounds above my Treo 650 and I needed a new iPod anyway.
I knew from day 1 that that price would come down on future versions. The Apple Lisa was $9,995 in 1983 which is around $21,000 today in 2008. That was the baseline model. As technology grows, things get cheaper. If you haven't picked up this, then perhaps you shouldn't buy technology products. You didn't "have" to buy an iPhone, and you should have seen this coming. You shouldn't also buy such a phone if you can't afford it.
At the same time, they are upgrading the firmware on the older phones still. My current one still gives me all the battery life I need for reasonable use. I am in a major city (Boston) with wifi almost everywhere. I don't drive, and thus the GPS is a non-feature.
Anyone that acts "upset" over the new features, and price drop, needs to grow up.
They didn't add any killer features for me. If they had added even something like the (much rumored, but obviously a lie) video chat functionality or something insane then maybe I'd have thought otherwise. Funny how those rumors/lies got around.
Tibbon
tibbon.com
The OS has had a full point release and there doesn't seem to be much for it.
Where's iChat or am I supposed to keep spending like $0.15 a text for SMS. Speaking of SMS, where's the damn MMS?
How about spam filtering on the mail client. This is supposed to be "just like the desktop OS X" so how hard can it be to upgrade the mail client to more completely resemble the functionality of mail.app on the desktop?
No discussion of how the 1st gen phones will handle location.
Nice one month slip on the OS and app store.
So as a 1st generation owner, the only major upgrade in my day to day is the ability to get 3rd party apps. Hopefully 3rd party apps will fill in the gaping holes.
A little adblock would be super helpful too...
Sheldon
Somehow, I don't think that will be enough to stem the anger over the new price point. If I own an early iPhone today, I am not a happy camper.
Why? Because a consumer electronics company refreshed a product? Should I be pissed at Sony every few months when they upgrade their camcorders? Should I be mad that the camcorder I bought from them five years ago cost more and is less capable than one I could buy today? Ditto with HP - the LaserJet model I bought in 2001 cost about $900. I can get one today that does the same job (and has more RAM) for $300 (or less). HP owes me $600!
From the apple site: "# Requires new 2-year AT&T rate plan, sold separately." In other words, there's no such thing as a $199 iPhone. Plans start at $59.99, so you're looking at a minimum outlay of $1638.76 plus tax over two years.
So, Phone Geeks. Your wisdom please:
Are people that do not live within a 3G service area completely SOL, or will it fall back to Good'ol Edge?
I think that's available for third parties to create.
Seth
$5 / month hosted VPS on linux = awesome!
If you buy Apple hardware early, you're a sucker. this happens with practically all of their products. They should know better by now.
Of course, I guess there have to be early-adopters for them to bring out the good, cheap 2nd version.
I have an iPhone 1.0 and bought it knowing that I don't live in a 3G area (that and GPS are the only new things I won't be able to get). That's like saying anyone who owned anything prior to a new version coming out is going to feel stupid. If anything I would think that geeks understand that technology usually a) moves at a quick pace and b) gets more features and usually goes down in price over time.
"Unwilling" is always your problem and nobody else's.
Still no MMS support? Count me out. That's something I gotta have! Sending to email is not sufficient.
Colin Dean Go a year without DRM
Yes, but will it run Li... Wow, that's pretty cool. Sweet touch screen. Look at it flip, awesome! Gotta get me one of those!
Invenio via vel creo
Will over seas iphone be unlocked by law and will it work in the us.
What contract do you have to sign to get those prices? Do I have to pay $100/month to AT&T? For how long? Fifty years?
Early adopters pay more. That's how it works. When your manufacturer releases a new product a year later that's cheaper, you have no, no place to complain.
You can buy GPS's all day, as many as you want, for under $100. Here's one. Here's another.
And no monthly service fee, or penalty for early cancellation.
"National Security is the chief cause of national insecurity." - Celine's First Law
Wow, you must have posted that on a v1 iPhone.
Open Source Drum Kit, LPLC deve board - mjhdesigns.com
Shh... don't interrupt his gloating, he thinks he's won something...
as i sit here watching the live update on my iphone, all i can think of is how i cant wait to watch the live update of a future iphone 3 on this new iphone 2
sink, swim, score and be happy
Me no do feel stupid now, as me has do been using iphone for.... Oh, screw the witty reply - it's been the best phone year of my life, and you are dumb.
"Have you heard of some type of thing?" -- anon
I bought an iPhone at the $400 price, and I don't feel like a sucker. I bought it because I wanted the features that the iPhone had. I wanted a portable media player with a large screen for video that integrated with the software I was already using for my music (iTunes). I wanted to be able to use my gmail account with it. I wanted to do IM (Meebo.com). I wanted a good UI (I hate the Windows Mobile UI). $400 was pretty steep, but in the end I felt it was worth it.
I don't feel bitter at all about this. I knew when I bought the first iPhone that there would be another version a year or so down the line. It was just common sense. But I didn't want to wait, so I paid a premium. Thats not a big deal for me.
If I can get one for $200 with my current plan, though, I'd be really tempted to get the 3G.
I bought my iPhone on day three (hey, I'm not stupid enough to buy launch day only to find out there's a massive bug) for $600. I'm quite happy still. See, unlike the rest of the world, I haven't had to put up with a shitty cell phone for the past year.
:)
Tech gets cheaper over time. I'm more pissed that I once spent $50 for a 30-pack of CD-R blanks and only had eight or so work after waiting half an hour to find out the burn failed, only to now be able to buy discs that burn in a minute for fifteen cents apiece with 99% reliability. At least my 1.0 iPhone worked properly at launch and continues to do so
How are sites slashdotted when nobody reads TFAs?
Does this mean that the iPod Touch will be $99 and $199 for 8GB and 16GB? It's been stated by El Jobso before that the price points would be $100 less than the comparable iPhone capacity.
I have an iPhone, and this doesn't really bother me at all. I fully expect hardware to be upgraded.
Not to take away from your pleasure, of course. I understand that you're likely a bitter, lonely asshat who only feels joy when he can make others suffer, however inconsequentially. I suggest a career in middle management, you'll probably find immense happiness being in that position of tiny power.
Before everyone goes on a diatribe about what the new iPhone doesn't have or what it doesn't do, remember the long history of the iPod. The first iPod isn't anything special compared to the last several generations. If there are features that you would like to have or features you don't like, just wait and a newer version might address it. It's funny watching the intensity of fanboys and naysayers. If you don't like it, don't buy it. In summary here's the history and the naysayers.
2001:
.
Apple: Introducting the iPod: 1000 songs in your pocket.
Naysayers:"No wireless. Less space than a Nomad. Lame." Seriously who's going to buy this? It is Mac only, uses Firewire, and costs $400!!
2002;
Apple: iPod 2.0: Touch sensitive scroll wheel. Now compatible with Windows. Up to 20GB
Naysayers: Okay, more space than a Nomad, but no wireless. Firewire only. Still expensive. Easily scratched
2003:
Apple: iPod 3.0: UI Redesign. Now USB compatible. Up to 40GB
Naysayers:Still waiting for wireless. Still expensive. No video or photo capability. Really I need something smaller, maybe flash based. Easily scratched. Still expensive
2004:
Apple: iPod mini: Smaller version of iPod. 4 or 6 GB disk based. iPod 4.0. UI Redesign. Clickwheel. Up to 40GB. iPod 4.1: now with color and photo capability. Up to 60GB
Naysayers:Still no wireless. Still expensive. No video. Maybe a phone/iPod combination would work. Easily scratched. Still expensive
2005:
Apple:iPod Shuffle: Ultra-portable iPod. Up to 1GB. iPod mini v2: New colors. iPod nano: Flash based. Color. Replacing mini. Up to 4GB. iPod 5.0: Now with video. Up to 80GB
Naysayers:No screen on the shuffle. Small video screen on the iPod. And it's not a touch screen. Replace the profitable mini, are they insane? The nano scraches too easily! Still no wireless. When is Apple going to make an iPhone? Still expensive
2006:
Apple:iPod Shuffe: Even smaller. Metallic shell. Up to 2GB. iPod nano: New scratch-resistant metallic shell. More battery life. Up to 8GB.
Naysayers:I can't use the new shuffle as a USB stick! Still no wireless or widescreen or touchscreen. No iPhone. Easily scratched. Still expensive
January 2007:
Apple:iPhone: multi-touch, widescreen iPod + mobile phone + internet browser + wireless
Naysayers:I wanted the phone part to be separate. It's only on AT&T. It's not 3G. I can't buy music wirelessly. It's frickin' expensive.
September 2007:
Apple:iPod Touch: iPhone without the phone. iTunes Music Store built in. iPod nano: New form factor. Video. Up to 8GB. iPod Classic: Metallic shell. Up to 160GB
Naysayers:iPhone is still only AT&T and not 3G. iPod touch is only 8GB and 16GB. And it's frickin' expensive.
February 2008:
Apple:iPod nano: new colors: iPod shuffle: new colors. iPouch Touch: 32GB available
Naysayers:iPhone is still only AT&T and not 3G. iPod Touch and iPhone are still expensive
June 2008:
Apple:iPhone 2.0: 3G, GPS, Slimmer, faster, more apps. 8GB $199. 16GB $299
Naysayers:iPhone is still only AT&T. Still expensive!!
Fast forward to the future . .
2020:
Apple:iPod femto: Size of a business card, but thinner. Direct neural interface. No charging, uranium battery last 5,000 years. Up to 500TB. iPhone X: Instantaneous, realtime language translation. Up to 20PB
Naysayers:Should be 1PB. Neural interface is only in HD and not Extreme-HD. Should have used plutonium batteries that last 10,000 years. iPhone isn't 6G. Language translation only covers "major" languages and not Swahili. Still expensive.
2021:
Apple:iPod femto: Plutonium batteries. 1PB. iPhone XI: 6G. Language translation now includes Swahili.
Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
I'm surprised that it maxes out at 16GB's still. I was expecting 32GB's. I'm a bit disappointed that once again there is no camera on the front to allow for video conferencing. And it still looks like you can't use it as a modem for your laptop.
I'm using a Palm Centro right now and while I think it sucks compared to the iPhone, its pretty valuable in that I can connect my MacBook Pro to it to get Internet connectivity. And since I pretty much carry my laptop with me everywhere, the value of the iPhone is somewhat diminished for me. Plus, my wife and I are on Sprint's employee plan and we pay a combined $60 a month for unlimited data.
I'm an ATT&T customer, but I've got a Pay-As-You-Go plan. I'm guessing that I can't work that with an iPhone.
(The PAYGO plan costs me <$20 a month. I just don't use a cell phone enough to make it worth $60 a month, which was the cheapest plan available for iPhone v1.)
I own an early iPhone, and I'm a pretty damn happy camper. Don't know about you.
When buying gadgets, you have to evaluate the value proposition as of the moment when you hand over the money. Holy shit, has this been a nice phone. When the 3G model is released, I will be lining up like a stereotypical fanboy, because the 1.0 hardware's ownership experience has been an exceptionally good one.
The iPhone 3G is NOT slimmer - not if you look at the depth. In fact it is a couple of mm's thicker than the predecessor The 3G tech spec page says Height: 4.5 inches (115.5 mm) Width: 2.4 inches (62.1 mm) Depth: 0.48 inch (12.3 mm) Weight: 4.7 ounces (133 grams Old tech spec: Height: 4.5 inches (115 mm) Width: 2.4 inches (61 mm) Depth: 0.46 inch (11.6 mm) Weight: 4.8 ounces (135 grams)
Comment removed based on user account deletion
I'm guess $99 for an 8gig model... LOL
Verizon is building out its network to support the iPhone. My understanding is that EV-DO is a 3G flavor of GSM so it should be compatible with the iPhone. Verizon is also opening up its network so you can use non-Verizon devices, such as the iPhone. Be patient, grasshopper.
If I used a sig over again, would anyone notice?
No, it's actually a little thicker than the outgoing model. But hey, you can't expect to get all the details right when you post a keynote summary before the keynote has actually ended.
My wife and I both have prepaid phones that we use sparingly and our total cost is under $20/month. As we hit our 30s and started a family, our use patterns changed dramatically - we're no longer 20-something party animals who need to be yapping/smsing on the phone to everyone throughout the day. We saved almost $500 in cell charges last year without changing our behavior.
So, is *anyone* providing coverage of Snow Leopard?
Mod the parent up as informative for letting us know that the new version is thicker than the old one.
My question is: Does the new version support flash? Can it now use the real internet or is it still locked to the Flashless Safari internet?
"I zero-index my hamsters" - Willtor (147206)
no increased internal capacity = epic fail.
Er, no. Given past pricing strategies I humbly suggest that if the US tag is $199, it will in fact by £199 and â199.
No it isn't.
It is a symptom of a larger problem.
If you can read this, I forgot to post anonymously.
It's actually true of all products. DVD players we're like $1000 when they first came out now they're like $50.
The "Where to buy" page (http://www.apple.com/iphone/buy/) no longer lists it as available through the online apple store. Apparently it will only be available through apple or AT&T stores, so they will likely force you to sign a AT&T contact when buying the phone. It seems this is their answer to the hacks which allowed activation of the iPhone without getting a AT&T contact.
I'm pretty sure EV-DO is distinctly CDMA. It's the only 3G option here in Corvallis, OR right now, and it's provided by Sprint, who deals exclusively in CDMA.
There's no "buy" or preorder button on the Apple store. I want this thing, but there's no way in hell am I going to rush some store for it.
Verizon uses CDMA technology instead of the world-wide GSM. hence a verizon phone will only ever work on a verizon network.
The data service will still be limited to verizon only phones. Sorry but if your stuck on Verizon your screwed. AT&T suks but at least they use GSM. So you can switch to t-mobile in the USA.
i thought once I was found, but it was only a dream.
Why would I feel stupid? I've had a great phone/iPod/EDGE web-surfing gadget for a year, and have enjoyed it thoroughly. Once the new one is available for sale, I'll have a great phone/iPod/3G web-surfing gadget which I'm sure I'll enjoy just as thoroughly, and my wife will inherit the EDGE version (her old Motorola U6 is long overdue for a replacement anyway).
What makes you think I would expect innovation to come to a grinding halt just because I've spent a bit of cash on a gadget? I bought the iPhone with the understanding that it would be replaced with a newer, more-feature-packed model sooner rather than later (taking into account the almost-annual new-iPod release cycle).
What would you recommend to folks considering the iPhone 3G? That they hold off on buying it, because it's eventually going to be replaced by a cooler model anyway?
Just once I'd like someone to call me 'Sir' without adding 'You're making a scene.'
Rubbish. If potential customers are *unwilling* to buy a product, it is the vendor's problem. More so than the consumers', even.
If I am unwilling to purchase an XBox 360 for whatever reason, opting instead for a PS3, is that really my problem? No, if it's anyone's it's Microsoft's.
I like basketball!!1!
I guess you missed the announcement of the next keynote, all about SnowLeopard... Starting right now, in fact :)
And who's covering it? Nobody.
I'm sorry, I'm 30. what the hell is mms?
EV-DO is a data only technology, it complements Verizon's existing CDMA voice networks. And despite Verizon allowing non-Verizon devices on their network, it still has to be a CDMA device, which the iPhone isn't.
End of Line.
No, EV-DO is a flavor of Qualcomm's CDMA2000, not GSM. That article is simple talking about Verizon upgrading their EV-DO network to the newer and faster Rev A version.
What is happening though is Verizon will be switching to a GSM technology called LTE for their 4G network. So maybe with the next iteration of the iPhone will be available on Verizon. But until then, I'll stick with my HTC 6800 and a network that actually has 3G coverage.Sweet, slick, good looking, and fully controlled by FairPlay DRM. No, not only music, but ALL apps on it. Thing twice, befor jumping into deep **^&...
Artur
Everything I've read says that GSM and EV-DO are NOT cross-compatible, even though they're both 3G. I think you're reading more into that PCWorld article than is actually there....
-Pope Peter Porker, S.O.W., K.M.K.R., U.G.O.A., F.S.G.S.D.
Maybe he has plenty of disposable income. There are people who spend thousands of dollars for seats at sporting events, but they are generally in the 'set for life' category rather than the 'sucker' category. Same thing could be true for people who like gadgets.
Nerd rage is the funniest rage.
I think that the differences in functionality between DVD and VHS were substantially different than the difference between an iPhone and Blackberry or whateverhaveyou.
I don't really see anything that great about the iPhone (or anything else from Apple, really) from where I sit, but I suppose its a matter of personal preference.
They could show off to their girlfriends they were cool like Steve and had money to throw away.
Nonsense. If "unwilling" were solely the consumer's problem, then there'd be no pressure on the vendor to make a product that consumers are willing to buy.
We all know what to do, but we don't know how to get re-elected once we have done it
OK, so the iPhone is or will be available in lots and lots of countries. But if I have an iPhone bought in one country, can I use it in another WITHOUT using horrendously expensive international roaming, by plugging in a country-specific SIM chip or some other means? THAT's what I need to know -- not that I can buy a brand new iPhone there.
New 3g iphone speed:
Time to download lonelyplanet.com.
Edge: 48 seconds.
3g: 20 seconds.
Comcast (!!!) 5 seconds.
Priceless?
Why do you think he put GPS in the new phones? So he could more quickly find dissenters like you. (I have visions of police from Minority Report descending from copters...)
It's both - for example, not willing to be a slave is a very specific problem to an individual, as well as a greater problem. Although you can get into differing grades of importance (unwilling to have kids educated with others that don't share religion, or unwilling to eat at McDonald's when all of your friends go out), there's always the subjective and personal implications that people call up when they use the phrase "I'm unwilling to..."
It's just being contrary to say that someone's opinion of unsuitability is shared by nobody.
Besides, there's no indication that the original poster said he/she was speaking for anybody else.
You don't need Geeksintraining if you're on Slashdot.
Yeah, last week my mate spent $200 on a hooker...
Sucker. I can sort myself out for nothing! And now I've got the cash for an iPhone.
I hate how cell phone companies bury the fact that you need ongoing service buried.
Dimensions from Engadget -
Model
Weight (grams) Size (mm)
iPhone 3G
133 115.5 x 62.1 x 12.3
iPhone (EDGE)
135 115 x 61 x 11.6
HTC Touch Diamond
110 102 x 51 x 11.35
HTC Touch Pro
165 102 x 51 x 18.05
Sony Ericsson Xperia X1
158 110 x 52.6 x 17
The best part has been the price. Let hope the iPhone dev team gets to work soon and comes up with a way to unlock this.
Apple listened to developers and enterprise customers in nailing the iPhone feature list. No objections or gripes here.
The 3G iPhone pricing is very un-Apple in being very attractive and without an obvious price premium. In fact, it is priced for mass-market consumption right now. That means there will be millions out there a year from now. And the ecosystem/market will flock to this high-profile platform, in turn creating even more pull.
The stock is down today about 4%. Why Jim Cramer is saying "sell on the news" is beyond me. AAPL is going to be a lot bigger and more profitable a year from now.
There is no technology risk here, so sit back and watch one of the great technology markets of a lifetime unfold.
quick summary of the posts in this thread, by first sentence:
"Unwilling"
No it isn't.
Rubbish.
Nonsense.
You don't need Geeksintraining if you're on Slashdot.
GSM is much better than CDMA because of its interoperability.
Insert SIM card & talk.
Some overseas iPhones will be sold unlocked (France I know for sure), but unlocking the phone is so easy, I don't see why it should be a problem if it's sold unlocked or not.
[Fuck Beta]
o0t!
Last I heard, unlocked iPhones were being sold in France, but they're significantly more expensive than the locked iPhones. When I crunched the numbers a few months ago, I think the cost came to over $1,000 USD (probably even more now, since the dollar is still getting weaker compared to the euro).
In addition, Apple won't provide support for iPhones outside their country of purchase, so if anything goes wrong with it, you'd have to make an international trip just to get it serviced.
Is the end of the iphone? Its no longer exclusive, i can see it fading like the razr. Hell all good things have to come to a end.
It is a symptom of a larger problem. Yeah, it's not like they could sell very many units with that kind of restriction;-)
Quote Wiki;
"They sold 270,000 iPhones in the first 30 hours on launch weekend."
I was talking to my local Cellular provider (Telus) and was asking about things, and it came up that Telus is working on a 3G network that is based on W-CDMA. The guy that worked for Telus said that new phones designed to work on W-CDMA would also work on GSM based systems.
:)
I don't know if that means that GSM phones will also work on W-CDMA, or even if he was correct at all. If anyone knows though, it would be someone here. If you know, enlighten us, or at least correct me
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Is this not the perfect platform for geohashing?
Just curious..
My wife has a 16GB iPhone and I have some craptacular LG CU575 flip phone. What will be the price for me if I'm already on the AT&T and just want the iPhone? (I'm betting full price of $500).
*sigh*
Ok, they listened to customers, but they didn't hear anything about MMS? Is it such a difficult feature to add? How about cut and paste?!
Twelve-and-three-quarter inches. Unyielding. This wand belonged to Bellatrix Lestrange.
It looks like all this press isn't the best thing for att.com, they are "Down for maintenance"
Ok. So I hear the news on the radio that the new $199 IPHONE will be available in July. After trying mightily for a half-hour, I finally get through on Apple's overloaded website server. I have my credit card in hand, and I'm ready to buy - even if it means waiting till July. But there's no option to buy online. I don't need or want to find an Apple retail store, nor do I have the time, and I refuse to find a brick and mortar AT&T mobile phone retailer, where I will have to deal with a slick, commissioned salesman who won't know as much about the product as I do. I just want to buy the phone online, lock myself into a 2 year contract with AT&T, and wait for my new phone to come in the mail.
Apple has just made a critical error. Starting with the trouble I had accessing their website, and now finding out I can't just click and buy online, I've had enough time to take a cold shower, stop and catch my breath, and I'll just wait until the second generation of the new 3G phones comes out on the market, after all the bugs have been worked out in the first round of new IPHONES. Some other guy can be the first sucker to Woot. Nevermind.
Maybe, but generally those who are "set" don't bother posting long-winded justifications of their expenses on forums like /. ;)
everything in moderation
does an iPhone 3G include internal maps and routing capabilities?
Or will routing be an additional cost from a third party? Will maps cost extra, or even be available internally, or will it depend upon pulling the local area from the web? How much good will that do if you're lost in the backcountry, where you're lucky to have cell coverage, let alone 3G data.
"National Security is the chief cause of national insecurity." - Celine's First Law
Remember the jailbroken iPhones? There were a few software updates that bricked them, so unlocking a locked iPhone might be risky.
Apple claimed the bricking happened because the jailbreaking process damaged the iPhones in some way. A lot of people suspected that Apple in fact deliberately bricked them. I don't know if anyone conclusively proved it one way or the other (I don't have an iPhone, so I didn't follow it closely).
Nationwide 3G coverage provided by AT&T by the end of this month to early next month, I believe.
They've been upgrading their network.
Or Sprint. My father has been desperate for a good excuse to kick Sprint to the curb and buy and iPhone, and this is just about as good an excuse as he's likely to find. I may very well find myself with one of the new iPhones, even though I don't have a lot of use for it, or desire for one.
I should clarify that I'm not rich, but I just knew what I was getting into when I bought it. Never have I purchased a piece of consumer technology to have it go up in price and decrease in features as time went on. I expected the price to drop and the features increase. Again, compare the Apple Lisa at $21K vs a Mac Pro at $2500.
I count the money as "spent". It's not an investment piece and I feel that I've gotten my money worth just in its use. Again I needed a new phone and a new iPod anyway. The iPod was going to be $300 or so and a new phone around a hundred. Well worth it. However I should disclose that I wrote it off as a business expense on my taxes.
No one should have bought a $400 phone in this economy without being able to count it as "gone" without massive financial impact. I did see a lot of people buying this phone that shouldn't have and couldn't afford it- stupid idea.
This is about having proper expectations when you purchase technology. Also a device (should) do the same features that it does on day one and provide similar value. My Commodore 64 still does what it did in 1983, and still provides that value regardless of what else is out there or on the current pricing of them.
Tibbon
tibbon.com
The Apple website says Canada is in the list of countries that get the 3G iPhone on July 11. I guess that means Rogers, since they're the only GSM network (since they bought Fido).
I read that the US AT&T unlimited data plans were $20/mo. Browsing through rogers.com I see that $25/mo gets you some text messages and 4MB of data. The closest to "unlimited" is $100/mo and you get 1GB of data. In both the AT&T and Rogers cases these are on top of your regular monthly bill for voice.
Rogers need to dial its prices back to about 1/10 of what they are now if they want to be in line with the US.
whoopty fucking do, another apple product, lets rush out and get it to make sure we're smuggier then the last fanboi
I'm sure it is a matter of personal preference. I'd seen blackberries and various other cell phones with keypads and what-not, but when I saw the iPhone it made me feel old. Not tired or such, but it gave me it made me think "Wow, I can't believe all of this has finall come together." Music, phone, text, web, all in a pretty darn good interface. I'd never gotten that feeling with any other similar device.
I have plenty of complaints and quibbles as a user of an iPhone, but it's such a useful device to have around and I've yet to see a competitor come close. One funny thing is if it had come out a year earlier, when I was commuting in a car and living in the city I'd lived in for seven years and had a rather routine existence, I probably wouldn't have cared as much. My parents bought me a first-gen iPod back in the day and I used it a handful of times before I realized it was pointless for me.
Fair enough, but everyone has problems of differing sizes. Can you guess how big a problem this guy is to Apple?
I can afford the iPhone itself. In fact, I could afford the old $399 iPhone. What I can't afford is over $60 per month for the minimum plan (over $60 when you add in the various fees they tack on for fun). If they offered a $30 per month plan I would probably buy one. If they had a $20 plan, I'd be buying one now. I don't need a lot of talk time. In fact, I'd be willing to pay for every call as I so rarely make calls. I just want the unlimited data. Hell, give me no voice calls at all, no SMS, just data and I'll use my pay-as-you-go phone for the extremely infrequent calls I need to make with it.
--- What?
hey, the ppc6800 (mogul for me) isn't so bad ass! It does everything i want it to (except sprint tv at the moment).
With custom roms, i'm set!
My abilities are only limited by my imagination
Which is why I said plenty of disposable income. The point is that different people treat $500 differently, and for the ones that don't need to care (which probably includes plenty of people who are not 'set' when you are talking about $500), spending $500 does not a sucker make.
Nerd rage is the funniest rage.
Doubtful. And this is most likely a Flash problem, rather than an Apple problem. It's a mostly closed standard, and even the 'official' implementations aren't all that great.
Adobe's implementation of Flash is remarkably inefficent, and Adobe notoriously refuse to release the player for any non-x86 platform (apart for legacy support of MacPPC, which is pretty grim even compared to the other, better-supported versions).
I wouldn't hold your breath waiting for flash on mobile platforms. You'd probably have more success developing your own standard and convincing the world to switch (I'm not kidding).
The various OSS flash implementations have been progressing at a snail's pace, although I wouldn't put much more hope in those than I would in WINE (ie. it'll never be stable enough to be useful). However, Adobe have recently relaxed their grip on the SWF specification, so we *might* see some progress.
Still, I wouldn't hold my breath. I don't typically count myself among the flash-haters, but the recent problems arising from the lack of cross-platform support and the absurd levels of CPU usage imposed by the player are a huge problem.
-- If you try to fail and succeed, which have you done? - Uli's moose
You're mixing up technologies. CDMA, TDMA, FDMA, OFDMA are all ways of getting the data in and out of the air. CDMA the cellular technology isn't just the air interface. GSM 3G uses W-CDMA as an air interface. That says nothing about which frequency bands, authentication or other interoperability barriers you'll encounter. It's just the way they utilize the bandwidth. LTE is based on OFDMA, which is kind of like CDMA crossed with TDMA and FDMA (your data is not only XORed with a chipping code like CDMA, but you also have timeslots to transmit them in and a number of subcarriers you're allowed to use.) I don't think you'll see a grand unified mobile network anytime soon. :-)
Well, it's true that AT&T will have nationwide 3G coverage, for certain definitions of "nationwide" which exclude several entire states, and major portions of the country. Although their map shows presence in every state, this is a mirage. There are quite a few states where AT&T doesn't offer service at all. If you happen to be an AT&T customer from somewhere else, you get 3G coverage from a parter, but you can't get a local phone number on an iPhone (or any other AT&T phone) in those locations.
If you mod me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine.
This requires just one persistent connection and is extremely scalable.
On every phone I've used so far, maintaining an open connection destroys battery life. I wonder how Apple is going to pull this off...
AT&T's wireless Web site is down for maintenance.
http://www.wireless.att.com/cell-phone-service/site-map
Interesting!
Trying to find quick feature anwser...
I'm not an iPhone fanboi by far, but I do friends and clients that like them. (Yes I prefer Windows Mobile because of the massive feature differences, like remoting into my desktop or servers.)
However, does v2 have Voice recognition and digit dialing? This has been one of the biggest hang ups of people I know, most being bluetooth users and have been clicking their ear piece or stereo headset and saying "Dial Auntie Mame Mobile" or "Dial 555-1212" or other Start Camera and Lookup Contact commands Newer multimedia phones even let you do "Play Madonna" from your stereo headset.(My 80+ grandma uses bluetooth, and wouldn't drag a phone of out her purse just to look at the screen and find a contact to dial by hand anymore.)
I can't find it mentioned anywhere, if anyone has a heads up or tip on this must have feature, post a link...
The price to own and enjoy an iPhone over the past year hasn't budged, so I don't feel stupid at all. I was kind of expecting there to be a new one by now, but a Summer 2008 phone was no good to me last year... even just the usable mobile maps and email features made it all worthwhile. In case you haven't noticed waiting for better gadgets means doing without them in the meanwhile.
Chris Morgan
W-CDMA, despite name similarities, has nothing to do with CDMA-2000 which is a standard developed by Qualcomm mainly used in the US market.
If he's the only one? Very small. If he's one of a big group, potentially a whole lot bigger. What's your point?
-- http://frobnosticate.com
* Too big.
* No disk mode.
* No possibility to add an external keyboard.
The new one is much cheaper, but, frankly, why pay anything at all for a device I do not want?
Where I live, we have two providers: Alltel and Verizon. I'm already pissed off about the buy-out, of course, but of relevance here is the fact that, for me, it's not that I'm unwilling to switch - it's that I'm unable to. The iPhone and OpenMoko are GSM-only for the foreseeable future, and I'm going to be stuck with crappy Verizon software, without even the ability to install Alltel software on my phone the way that all my Verizon friends have done because Alltel will be no more.
On a side note, I like how Verizon says they'll let you cancel your Alltel contract when they complete the buy-out. Fat lot of good that does me, since they'll at that time have a monopoly on my region.
Verizon isn't the best provider anywhere!
With the buzz on some other sites, it is conceivable that the handset will be free, but the contract is where they make the money. European mobile phones are sold in a very different way to the US. We will know soon enough.
Make that five; one friend, two co-workers, myself, plus the original poster, at the least.
It's a larger problem than you're implying. The iPhone is wonderful, but why would I want to pay a minimum of $700 per year (minimum) to use it when I have perfectly good service with my current cell phone providor already?
Jobs just got finished talking about how one of their major targets was reducing the cost, but the cost of switching to AT&T is too great for me, and I would imagine I am not alone in that sentiment.
And this is to say nothing of the problems I and others may have with AT&T steming from the illegal wiretapping row, poor previous customer-service experience, or service availability limitations!
It looks like their app store model is still very centralized, not at all well suited to installing arbitrary software willy-nilly, as open source DIY-ers are prone to do.
Of course, if someone makes a good ssh client for it, I'll probably buy one anyway.
There's no failure quite as dissatisfying as a complete and total solution to the wrong problem.
Where I live, Verizon is the worst provider. Some people around here imagine that Verizon is the best, but they just fall into the hype. As someone that has used four different providers (due to my various employers giving me different services, etc), I can tell you that, easily, my worst experience was with Verizon.
I guess it all depends. By the way, I live in one of the top 10 urban areas in the US. And I don't have an iPhone.
3G network that is based on W-CDMA
In other words, what the rest of the world calls UMTS?
If J.K.R wrote Windows: Puteulanus fenestra mortalis!
It certainly is just preference.
I've used a Windows Mobile phone for the past 2.5 years. I started tracking my usage of the features. e-mail and web browsing are the two features I use the most. Both are horribly flawed on Windows Mobile.
Pocket Outlook is great, as long as you're only connecting to Exchange servers. Switch to IMAP, and the server configuration determines the usability, because Pocket Outlook does not support IMAP namespaces properly. The mail server from which I get my mail uses namespaces, and Pocket Outlook locks up when I try to get mail there. I had to do stupid hacks (forwarding mail off, at first, and later using a proxy to re-write requests.)
Pocket Internet Explorer (PIE) is a different beast. It's crap, even for a mobile browser. Simple pages will render fine, but anything even moderately complex will not work. When I first started using my phone, I just did everything through Google's gateway. That's really not how I want to use the web. Later on, I started using my phone to copy down interesting URLs for perusal at home. The browser on my phone became little more than a portal to IMDB and Wikipedia.
Opera Mobile is a bit better, but you pay for it, and it's still got rendering issues with some sites.
What's great about the iPhone, in my opinion, is the support. Even though it has a real web browser, popular websites fall all over themselves trying to put together a version of the site optimized for iPhone's screen. When there isn't an optimized version, you can view the full version (albeit slowly--hopefully 3G will help address that) and zoom specific portions of the page that you want to look at. For me, since what I really want is a data device (I could do without the phone part, honestly), the better the browser and mail client, the better the device. I've tried all the major phone operating systems, and by far, Apple blows them away. RIM does come closest, no doubt, but the web browsing experience just can't compete.
Here's a hint. If you keep holding out for the next-great thing, you'll never have anything to show for your efforts.
Hate to break it to you buddy, but Verizon is the only provider that can reach a lot of places. For example, practically everyone out in the Wyoming/Idaho area use Verizon because it's the only service with reliable coverage, especially in mountainous areas.
Wise men say, "Forgiveness is divine, but never pay full price for late pizza."
One thing that Apple rarely does is promote any model name changes with the aforementioned updates. My coworker has a 1st gen iPod. My kids have the current gen iPods. They're all called "iPod", so there's no easy way to differentiate them, but you can bet my kids are watching h264 video and my friend is not. Ditto for computers, phones, etc. When you try to look up RAM or other component pricing for an Apple product, you have to be very clear about the product description or you'll be steered astray. "What? You have an iMac? Is that the Tangerine model with tray-load CD player at 333MHz? or is that the latest model with everything built into the screen?" No model number, no sub-name, nothing easily differentiates the various animals that are called an 'iMac'. True, cars have been doing this for years, but people are used to including the car year or age to differentiate it.
My call is that people get most of their "buyer's remorse" from Apple because year after year, Apple keeps releasing a MacBook Pro, an iPod, an iPod Shuffle, an iMac, etc.
I'll bet $299. Who ever wins get the split the diffence ($100). You can't lose with that bet (the worst you'll pay is $399;-))
And it's under NDA. So no obvious live feeds.
Ah, apart from http://www.apple.com/ca/press/2008_06/snow_leopard.html then.
With a two-year contract, the price of an 8GB iPhone 3G will be $199; the 16GB model will be priced at $299
Unlimited iPhone 3G data plans for consumers will be available for $30 a month, in addition to voice plans starting at $39.99 a month
~~"Of course, that's just my opinion. I could be wrong." ~~Dennis Miller
What cap? The current at&t plans are unlimited data, and I don't see any indicator that that will be changing.
/var/run/twitter.sock is a twitter socket puppet.
A couple of things here;
1. It got uglier. It's slightly fatter than the original and the tapered edges make it look even worse! (This is the reason the MacBook Air is so fugly)
2. No 32GB! I'll pass thanks
From my perspective, these are the things I didn't hear that I had wanted to hear...
:-)
* No expanded capacity. I had hoped for 24Gb or 32Gb models
* No improved camera. I had hoped for more megapixels, maybe a flash, or at least better controls and options and editing
* No mention of copy/paste. Come on! Copy/Paste!
* No mention of rotatable keyboard, across all aps
* No MMS. Come on! Multi-media messaging is standard on most phones sold now!
* No mention of email search. Contact search is great, but let us search through everything. Pervasive search!
That said, I'm still buying one
- Spryguy
There are three kinds of people in this world: those that can count and those that can't
That depends on the state of your current contract with AT&T. If your contract is up, only the cost of a new iPhone and a new plan. If your contract isn't up, there's upgrade costs, fees, etc.
Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
The relative quality of the cellular providers varys wildly depending on location. In my area I would rate AT&T as the absolute bottom of the barrel by a wide margin - dropped calls, people being dropped directly into voice mail despite my phone having signal, ludicrous failure rate on incoming SMS. On the other hand I've had Verizon for about six years now and Sprint for four. No problems with either one.
Well, not really. What its really about is spreading some of the interesting innovations in Leopard universally throughout the system. For example, the reference to multi core processors in the Snow Leopard press release is clearly about spreading the new NSOperation, among other things. Stuff like that. This goes pretty far beyond a "bug fix" release.
If you mod me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine.
I dunno, there are some places in New Hampshire I've been where they're literally the only game in town which would, if regrettably, make them the, "best" provider by default.
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Spectrum should not be owned. As long as the spectrum is owned by a small number of companies that don't really compete, we will all have to use the crap they allow us to use to connect to their network.
A half measure would be for regulators to devise reasonable standards for connecting to networks so that any device made could be used. This would give people the ability to guard their privacy but it would not save the economy from tremendous parasitic communications costs.
I am a name troll of Westlake. Visit my homepage to learn why.
If you're really experiencing lots of kernel panics on Leopard, you should check to see if you have a hardware problem. Bad RAM or a flakey disk drive can both cause that problem.
If you mod me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine.
What the rest of the world would call, " UMTS v 2.0" if such a thing existed, but yes, ostensibly.
Frankly, some of the announcements were just lame. Scientific calc? Oh wow, that took what... maybe five minutes in XCode... Why haven't they ported Grapher.app yet? Announcements for VoIP apps were conspicuously missing. So were P2P apps. Gee, I wonder why? </ sarcasm> Yet they can still manage to lob an "ActiveStink" joke... Hmm, maybe people with glass phones shouldn't throw rocks...
I'm with you.
Verizon's coverage is leaps and bounds above AT&Ts where I am. yet I find myself debating weather to get on AT&T just for rollover and iphone. When I talk to my girl at work our Calls can get dropped like 6 times in two hours. I literally have to turn my head a certain way and if i forget, bang call d/c'd
While the workphone (verizon cell) has never had one dropped call even when im out in the company car going out on remote ranches. Shame I have to choose between a network or a phone.
-- "of course thats just my opinion, I could be wrong." --Dennis Miller
I think you misunderstood my comment. I fully understand that $500 is worth more or less to different people. My point was, those who have no problem blowing $500 don't tend to feel the need to justify it to others, they just do it.
everything in moderation
They launch a phone without many features people expect in free phones, and charge $600 a pop. Now companies like Samsung offer up serious competition with the i900, and suddenly Apple is charging $200 a pop.
Lesson 1: Competition is good.
Lesson 2: If you paid $600 for an inferior product, you were hosed.
I'm really curious to see the price point on the i900, which last I heard, will be available in January (a few months earlier than the 3G iPhone).
http://blindscribblings.com - Tasty pop-culture in conceptual fashion.
You sound like an adult. Does it sometimes feel lonely being the only adult?
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Flash really isn't necessary for video if you have a decent browser, which leaves annoying adverts (the worst are these new ones that jump over half the page), annoying all-flash websites (those I am happy to live without), and flash games (meh). The only time I turn it on is for You Tube, and that's only because they don't offer alternative formats. The real internet is getting along just fine without flash, and is (IMHO) moving away from it to more open formats not controlled by one vendor.
The op's post didn't read like justification to me. More like insight into the mind of a 1.0 owner who doesn't have bizarre expectations of a technology company.
Nerd rage is the funniest rage.
This phone isn't being marketed to you! Turns out, not everyone on earth has your life, lifestyle, or priorities!
Also, I hit my 30s and started a family - and I'm likely to get one. Turns out not even all the people in your rough age and social cohort have the same priorities as you!
Hate to break it to you buddy, but Verizon doesn't have a network that's compatible with 3G phones. Until Verizon modernizes their network, GSM phones aren't an option no matter who the provider of the phone is or what their restrictions are.
Data plans are now $10 more than they are now, so $30/month, with a $39.99/month minimum voice plan... (all in one convenient 24 month contract!) I'm sure that more than makes up for Apple's decrease in price, since they get a cut of that in their profit sharing deal with AT&T. Not dissing Apple or the iPhone, as I was an early adopter of the original, and will probably be an early adopter of this one.
There didn't seem to be any info on improved Bluetooth support. Does this one support stereo audio (A2DP) and/or OBEX? What about DUN, so it can be used as a bluetooth modem over HSDPA/3g? The DUN Bt profile is pretty basic.
Here in Silicon Valley, there used to be areas where the higher-priced homeowners didn't want ugly cell towers so coverage was bad; AFAICT, that's mostly no longer a problem with the major carriers, though a few of the hilly areas have spotty coverage, and nobody seems to be charging for roaming any more, so any gaps are pretty transparently covered. It's a big change from five years ago, and especially from 10 years ago. And text messages between people who use different carriers seem to work fairly consistently; it used to be that they might take a day to get delivered if you were unlucky.
Bill Stewart
New Fast-Compression-only CPR http://preview.tinyurl.com/dy575ks
We've all read that Apple's relationship with AT&T hasn't gone swimmingly and gawd know plenty of people (me included) REALLY don't want to get cell service from them, if only for privacy reasons. Apple may do plenty of jerky things but they ain't dumb. Or slow. So it's only natural that they've created a routearound. I agree that the markets are *somewhat* different, but far from "completely". Plenty of overlap there, especially from the several year perspective.
So no, I'll be watching the iTouch and the iPhone as just what they are: devices from the same platform for the same general kinds of customers. No more "completely different" than buyers of BMW versus buyers of Mercedes.
It's all about the information. And what we do with it.
As as early adopter I thought I might add my 2 cents worth.
I have enjoyed my iPhone for the last year. Now that the price has been lowered iPhone market share will likely increase faster. That means higher market share for Safari (including mobile) in general, and the iPhone in particular. This means more sites will be optimized for the iPhone (and more sites will support Safari). Therefore Apple releasing a cheaper iPhone in no way hurts me, but can help me.
EV-DO is a 3G flavor of CDMA, so no luck there.
As for Verizon "opening up" their network, that's a funny variety of newspeak. It is still more closed than any GSM carrier. Verizon's variety of "open" means that they are publishing specs and setting up a certification lab so that 3rd party manufacturers can make devices compatible with their network. You can't use any old CDMA phone and use it on Verizon, it has to be Verizon certified.
Compare to GSM, where you can take any unlocked phone, put in a sim-card from any GSM carrier you like and off you go. There is no need for the phone to be $cell_carrier_x certified, it is sufficient that the phone complies with the GSM spec.
The CDMA family is:
CDMA (2G) - CDMA2000 (2.5G) - EV-DO (3G) - UMB (4G)
The GSM family is:
GSM (2G) - EDGE/GPRS (2.5G) - UMTS (3G) - HSDPA/HSUPA (3.5G) - LTE (4G)
If J.K.R wrote Windows: Puteulanus fenestra mortalis!
And how did one button is all anyone ever needs now become button(s)?
"It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
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Yep. It varies hugely. In the NYC area verizon is good, TMO is good, ATT is good, Sprint i hate (well nextel) for various reasons. Each has their own minor dead zones. I'd give verizon a small edge over TMO and ATT i don't use often.
Out in wisconson visiting some friends however...i had 4-5 bars with TMO no matter where i went. Verizon wireless card? Lucky to get 2 bars, 1 was usually all I got if i had service at all. Ugh...1xRTT = death!
You can get rich if you own a politician, but you have to be rich to buy one in the first place.
I am in the market for a new phone and have been awaiting the release of the next iPhone and also the first Android phones. I think, based on this presentation and the earlier demo of Android, I am going to wait for the Android's release later this year. At the very least it won't be anywhere near as shackled as the iPhone. (Just my $0.02 - YMMV)
Forgive the pun.
A comparison was being made between the iPhone 3G and a "GPS." based on the iPhone having a 33% price premium. I pointed out that it was a 100% premium. Someone said that was for a GPS with no maps. I pointed out that an iPhone doesn't have maps at the stated price, either (you need to pay for service, too).
So, make a fair comparison, and add the minimum cost of service to the iPhone price, making it $199 plus $70/month times 24 months. Now you can fairly compare to a GPS with a map. $150 for the GPS vs. $1879 for the iPhone. Or, maybe you can find an iPhone 3G somewhere without service, and just use the GPS feature without service and maps. That's the comparison I made - $100 vs. $199.
"National Security is the chief cause of national insecurity." - Celine's First Law
Remarkably inefficient; Now that's something that should be said again and again, and four times more if you're on a Mac. I cannot fathom why it takes one full 1.83Ghz core to decode FLV video in flash, when I can do 720p with less CPU usage when it's h264 in QT.
you can buy it at the new customer price as an existing customer once your upgrade period comes ( I think it's at 18 mnths).
I do like my xv6700 (mostly because I think it came out before Verizon could figure out how to lock down a phone running windows mobile).
Based on that, it would be hard for me to leap to an iPhone, but given that it is such a popular platform (which invariable draws eager hackers), I may sell my 6700 and go to AT&T.
Out of modpoints but really liked a post? 1BDkF6TtmmeZ3yqXbz9yhdYVqRYnwFoXDj
If AT&T is going to subsidize these by ~$200, and with no advertised non-contract price point, they will likely make you sign a contract at the same time you purchase the phone. This is AT&T's solution to the unlocking problem.
When I moderate, I only use "-1, Overrated". That way, I never get meta-moderated!
"If I own an early iPhone today, I am not a happy camper."
Translation: My phone is made of bakelite and gutta-percha.
Verizon EVDO service works fine with 3G phones. They just have to be EVDO 3G phones, as opposed to HSDPA 3G phones.
Now I can download porn with my 3g iPhone from everywhere and 2x faster ! Thanks Apple !
I've seen unlocked iPhones for £269/336/$538 in Leeds, UK.
GSM isn't 3G. AT&T's "3G" service is HSDPA.
Looks like Apple has picked up on the slashdot meme and turned it from a bug into a feature -- look at http://www.apple.com/iphone/features/wireless.html on the bottom right it advertises the phone as having "More wireless. Less space." And given that iTunes is installed, they could have easily added, "LAME."
Other than the fact that my wife laundered my phone the other day (it's drying out, working some), I've not had any significant problems with Sprint in 12 years other than billing and customer support. Those aspects are abysmal. At this point, I can't tell what the costs of AT&T's 3G plans for the iPhone are going to be, but I'm sure going to be doing some hard comparison between the 3G iPhone and the "Instinct" that Sprint is coming out with in a couple weeks. Their $100 "everything" plan would be a small price increase over what I'm currently paying for 800 minutes with a few features added on.
The Spoon
Updated 6/28/2011
I, for one, am tremendously unhappy with this kind of temporal data plan recursion. Even if it is innovative, infinite pricing schemes relying on iterations of the present I find to be unacceptable!
The Rise and Fall of Online Community
Why won't Apple or AT&T sell me the damn thing online and ship it when one is available? I just don't have time to go to a damn store and wait in some bullshit line in order to buy something that should be available from an online store.
Hi Apple! Hi AT&T! I'm your target market. Please make it easy for me to buy your product.
I don't care how awesome the phone is. Until I can pick my carrier, I won't buy one.
In your rush to diss Verizon, you conveniently forgot that Sprint with 52 million US customers uses CDMA. Verizon users can switch to Sprint.
This space for rent.
hahaha "modernizes". Verizon's EVDO network is MUCH faster than AT&T's 3G network.
Engadget did some speed tests on the new 3g iphone.. it's only 200kbps. Barely twice the speed of the EDGE iphone. Verizon's EVDO network, on the other hand, is 3 times as fast as the new "speedy" 3G AT&T network.
actually AT&T's 3G service is UMTS. HSDPA is 3.5G.. and engadget cast some doubts on whether or not the iphone supports HSDPA since they were capping out at 200kbps in their hands-on tests.
Do Americans write "co-worker" because they can't spell "colleague"?
That was classic intercourse!
Jesus was a compassionate social conservative who called individuals to sin no more.
TO START
PRESS ANY KEY
Where's the 'ANY' key? I see Esk, Kitarl, and Pig-Up...
The most embarrassing bit is that, if you extract the .FLV, VLC can play it reasonably efficiently. QuickTime can do it too, given the proper codec (and many mac haters like to think of QT as the poster child of inefficient software!)
I'm amazed Apple hasn't developed their own specification. If they got their WebKit folks to promote an Open-Source flash alternative, there would be a reasonably good chance of it seeing widespread acceptance. Apple's history with OSS is a bit shaky, although it's clear that any sort of "flash killer" will need the support of the community if it wants any hope of succeeding. The backlash against Microsoft's surprisingly-not-bad Silverlight should be sufficient evidence to convince Apple to go the open-source route.
Heck.... thanks to the "Core" libraries, the underlying frameworks are already there.
Flash's days are numbered. That much is for sure.
-- If you try to fail and succeed, which have you done? - Uli's moose
You may, for example, have friends who are not wealthy enough to have but the most basic phone service. Or maybe you have people who want to call you from their office, where local personal calls are kosher and non-local personal calls are not.
Not nearly the issue it used to be now that most people have cell phones that don't care about who you are calling, but still an issue.
paintball
Does the new 3G iPhone support Bluetooth Stereo headphones?
The WWDC 2008 Keynote Video is up now. Enjoy.
silverlight: On the mac, it's almost as crashy: http://inessential.com/?comments=1&postid=3491
I don't know, comrade.
I blogged about the idea of 'transparent synchronisation' today.
I think it's interesting that the next killer mobile application may not be a mobile application at all, but rather, an application that makes it completely irrelevant and transparent that I am mobile. Regardless of whether I sit down at my desktop at home, my laptop in the airport lounge, or my phone on the go, I get the same, live, consistent view of all of my electronic stuff. This is a hard problem, that's been done quite poorly for the most part. I wonder if Apple has cracked it with Mobile Me?
M@
"....people being dropped directly into voice mail despite my phone having signal..."
While I was reading these words my fully charged iPhone with five bars just told me I had a new voicemail without actually, erm, RINGING so I could take the call.
Also call waiting thing went away mysteriously at some point.
Still no phone as modem capability.
Wake up and open up Apple.
If a job's not worth doing, it's not worth doing right.
What about windows?
Plans start at $70/month (before taxes and fees) now. It's $40/month phone + $30/month data.
The $200 lower price for the phone hardly means much considering you'll spend over $2000 in service over the two year contract.
Yes, price. Nice point here.
If I am to wait for the Iphone to come to Brazil, I will have to pay something around US$ 850. EIGHT HUNDRED AND FIFTY DOLLARS, yes, thatÂs how much it will cost here. Well... US$ 200 in the US... so i guess IÂm gonna wait for some friend to go to the US and buy one for me. Jailbreaking is not a problem, I couldnÂt care less for AT&T anyway...
-Andre
Sorry, I *knew* I shouldn't have attended WWDC this year.
Notmysig
That's valid if you buy a full blown GPS packaged together with- / locked to- some expensive mapping function.
If you go to the bargain bin you can find very cheap GPS receiver. Which are basically just GPS antennas that communicate using serial cable / SDIO connector / bluetooth link to the device of your choice to be used with the application of your choice.
No fancy screen nor built-in software.
For even cheaper, you can find devices (from Parrot, for example) which double as bluetooth car handsfree and bluetooth GPS receivers. (And cost less than both combined).
Then you can use it with your EEE PC (hum... does google provide an API in Google Maps to use it with a GPS ?)
Or, if you hate Garmin that much, steal one of their Map application and run it on your PDA, just for the sake of stealing from those you hate.
On the other hand, given Apple's past stance toward bluetooth, you can pretty much be sure that iPhone 3G's bluetooth could only be paired with handsfree, and would never be allowed to function as a glorified bluetooth GPS receiver for your laptop.
On the other hand, I don't pretty much give a damn about Apple and thus haven't followed their speach. Maybe in fact Steve has announced that the iPhone 3G is going to be much more open than the iPhone 2G.
"Sufficiently advanced satire is indistinguishable from reality." - [Tips: 1DrYakQDKCQ6y52z6QbnkxHXAocMZJE61o ]
Get over yourselves people, this is the BEST PHONE EVER MADE. Period. End of Sentence. The rest of you peeps need to shut yo face.
Unless you are in an extreme fringe area, the most common cause of dropped calls is crashing baseband due to firmware bugs---flaws in the phones themselves.... From what I've seen, this usually manifests itself as a sudden drop from five bars of signal to zero, then coming back up a few seconds later. If that's what you are seeing, it's not your carrier. It's your phone.
Check out my sci-fi/humor trilogy at PatriotsBooks.
get yourself a domain name you cheapskate
I've dropped my phone hard at least once a month for the past 14 months. It set me back about $800 so I try to take good care of it, but sh!t happens, and when it does, plastic bounces. It doesn't shatter like glass. Go ahead, read the comments at the flickr page. They illustrate the point nicely:
All you iPhone fans are just alike. You brag about how durable your glass phone is until you break it. Then you're crying because of the $200 repair bill... Funny how the 3G iPhone casing is no longer aluminum and now made out of this "inferior" material as well. Perhaps they should have replaced it with glass since glass is SOOO durable.
These problems were reported by everyone on my team. AT&T tried swapping us completely new phones. Then a new model of phone. Then a second new model of phone. Then we switched to sprint.
And then subsequent updates unbricked the phones.
Make sure you get in all the pertinent details.
Mac OS X and Windows XP working side by side to fight back the night.
perhaps you should stop treating your phone like a horseshoe and more like the expensive electronic gadget that is. If the iPhone had a plastic screen I wouldn't have wanted one. The glass is superior to a scratched up crappy looking piece of plastic
http://www.rootstrikers.org/
It was my impression that AT&T went directly from EDGE to HSDPA without any intermediate step. However, I could easily be wrong about that.
Have we heard anything on support for Flash files on the iPhones. I would like to view webpages built in Flash, or view flash advertisements... just curious.
A lot of people still have their $100 rebate from their original priced iPhones. Remember the $500/600 price tags on them? See http://blog.wired.com/gadgets/2007/09/steve-jobs-eats.html to job the memory.
Remember that the credit doesn't count towards itunes purchases, only Apple Store purchases. So I plan on using it towards a 3G phone.
Snow Leopard press release.
If you mod me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine.
I bought the phone to use it, not to stick on a pedestal behind a velvet rope to admire its beauty. It's a phone. If you use it, you're going to drop it. Fact of life. Plan on it.
The glass is superior to a scratched up crappy looking piece of plasticThis really isn't a logical argument. Plastic, scratch resistant screen protectors are about $2 on the high end and they work beautifully. If you did somehow manage to scratch it, just peel it off and stick another one on in its place. I've had the same one for 14 months. There isn't a scratch on my plastic screen.
Colleague is the generic professional subset of co-worker.
then it is bought/paid separately. Unless you can quote something concrete (I saw that at the bottom of Apple's site too) from Apple it is still dubious what the jailbreaking real price will be.
You needed to footnote your post.
How would you apply the subsequent updates to a bricked iPhone?
If you can't afford the plan, you're not in the target demographic. Yes, I know, it's shiny and all. Get over it.
I do friends and clients as well, but not based on their phone preferences. This reminds me of that one guy's sig around here, saying that the real iPhone killer is gonna be sex robots from Japan. He may be on to something.
It's going to come down to TCO. When Jobs first talked about the roadmap earlier this year, one point was that Crackberries require a server in between the phone and the Exchange server, while the iPhone won't. And I think Enterprise has standardized on Exchange a lot more than on Crackberry.
So it sounds like Enterprise can allow iPhones to trickle in, with direct Exchange access, and if there's a Crackberry server sitting there too, evaluate the cost over time of keeping it around.
It may very well end up being similar to the way in which Macs have recently infiltrated the Enterprise. A few employees ask if they can please, please, please have one; IT and management eventually say "sure, but you have to provide your own support," and next thing you know, one-third of the organization (or two-thirds, in some cases) have them.
Village idiot in some extremely smart villages.
Where's the form for sending in my current iPhone for a cheap/free upgrade to the new one?
The iPhone goes to Latin America and there's something very interesting happening there: the Dominican Republic will have 2 suppliers!
Claro and Orange
http://www.apple.com/la/iphone/buy/
I know the DR is a trendy country (I lived there many years) but why would apple have 2 suppliers there?
I dunno, re the web. I used to use Opera on my N95... then I just did a firmware upgrade last week, and the internal Nokia browser (based off, I believe, WebKit)... man, leaps and bounds ahead.... intuitive zoom in, zoom out, based on whether you're scrolling, or reading. Worth a new investigation. PIE on an MDA, though? Evil.
You act as if Apple didn't factor that into their original agreement with AT&T, and the exclusive deal has no upside for Apple. Given the success of the iPhone it's just really hard for me to see this as a big problem for Apple.
No doubt the kickbacks from AT&T are sweet, given the market position they were in a couple years ago... Verizon turned down a deal because they didn't believe Apple could make a smartphone... Apple went exclusive because they knew the product would be good enough to make many people switch. All in all it makes perfect business sense.
Yes, more often than not Apple finds a way to screw the customer, but that doesn't mean they are making a mistake...
My understanding is that the iPhone underground was quick to blame Apple for the "bricking" but then, as understanding of the firmware was increased, the general consensus was "Yes, the early unlocks did damage the firmware, not just unlock it." Later updates and underground tools were able to undo that damage, so most unauthorized unlocks have not resulted in permanent damage to the phone unless something went terribly wrong in the unlock process.
Except a big pile of cash. Which you can spend on the next-great-thing-that-actually-meets-your-needs when it turns up.
199$? They seem to aggressively push the IPhone into the market. Who else sees this move as a direct attack to Google Anroid?
"See, unlike the rest of the world, I haven't had to put up with a shitty cell phone for the past year."
The rest of the world has had better phones for years. And they've been free with contracts. Yawn.
This post contains benzene, nitrosamines, formaldehyde and hydrogen cyanide.
You might want to check the parent...
Yeah. My bad. Mostly was just responding to the condescending jerk above. "Hate to break it to you" is right up there with "Sorry to burst your bubble" in my list of peeves.
Ha ha, typical non-American (probably European) trying to sound intelligent but, as is par for the course, coming across like a complete dumbass. A colleague is someone in your profession that you may or may not work directly with. A co-worker is someone you actually, you know, work with. How does it feel to be owned, moron?
That is just so 2005.
Actually that is the reason I did not buy a Sony Erricson P990 in 2006, instead going for a Vodafone branded TyTn (which I've done well by).
Funny that you mention meeting my needs, since the iPhone 1.0 does that and more. This is why this whole conversation about "early adopters" feeling stupid is really, well, stupid.
You'd probably have more success developing your own standard and convincing the world to switch (I'm not kidding).
Microsoft are trying to do something like that with Silverlight. Microsoft would do it, if Apple wanted to play.
My Karma: ran over your Dogma
StrawberryFrog
half the reason why sprint has that number of users is because they bought nextel, and got the contractors with the push to talk market.
but sprint doesn't use the same CDMA tech as verizon. their phones aren't interchangeable. yet I can take my GSM phone to europe, buy a local sim card and get a local phone number to use.
i thought once I was found, but it was only a dream.
It seems like the good folk in the crowd agreed with you. While Steve was laughing at how slow the old iPhone was, people in the crowd were CHEERING. Some serious Coolaid in that crowd. I think for effect he should have got out an iPhone 1.0 and smashed it, pointed at a guy in the crowd who had one, and laughed.
Such Apple fanboyism that I say I want an iPhone but can't leave Verizon because ATT is horrible in my area, and I get modded -1 offtopic and labeled "unwilling" to change my provider to a vastly less superior one.
wouldn't that also make them the worst provider too?
-= Who are The Headlocks? =-
Yes, but that's nothing new.
The iPods/iPhones don't seem to have model numbers listed on the Apple specs pages, but if you add an iPod to your cart in the Apple store and then view your cart, it shows a model number.
correct me if i'm wrong but isn't the the iphone 0.48" and the old one is 0.43" ?
I'd like to chime in and say that any way of watching video that uses up 90% of my processor and freezes when I multitask earns nothing but derision from me.
I like Adobe, and I do like Flash in some places, but not for video.
Apple is going after the mass markets, people who will not spend $500 on a phone. The early adopters, apple geeks, and phone=status luxury users are already in, and now it's time to sell to the big hump on the bell curve.
And let's remember that with an iPhone comes the necessity to use iTunes, which introduces the users to apple software and makes the transition to Mac computer hardware likely...er. I cheer for our white hard plastic robotic overlords! Oh, and don't tell me that Wall-e is not a plot to prepare the mass consciousness for their arrival!
Which is also up there with "is always your problem and nobody else's," IMO. Seriously, some people's only real choice is Verizon if they want service that works somewhat consistantly, so it's not their problem and nobody elses...it's basically an entire portion of the nation's problem.
Wise men say, "Forgiveness is divine, but never pay full price for late pizza."
A domain name for some apps which can start the screensaver and close all your open apps? Come on, ain't worth it. He probably discovered Xcode and was fooling around ;)
.sig: No such file or directory
In that case, sounds like their tower is hosed.
Yes, the iPhone is great but will it take down someone trying to hurt you? I don't think so. If you want an apple with a bite, how about a candy apple red cell phone with kick. Check it out at http://www.officialsafetyandsecurity.com/product/SM-CELLred
If only they could make everyone not want one! Then they would be close to making a profit!
You seem pretty knowledgeable about cellphone technologies, so I'll ask you my question that went unsolved elsewhere: Apple has a SIM lock on the iPhone that makes it only work with AT&T in the US. Is that SIM lock done in hardware or software? In other words, if for some reason, later down the road, Apple started selling iPhones that were not SIM-locked to AT&T, would they be able to issue a software update that would remove the lock for older iPhones, or would owners of older iPhones have to buy the new, unlocked-out-of-the-box iPhone?
There was also a fairly high failure rate on deliveries to their SMS gateway as well. In any case, regardless of the source of their problems it disqualified them as a carrier for us.
Okay. Fair enough. I apologize for calling you a condescending jerk.