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Telnet into Dreamcast?
Jeos wrote to us with a fun Saturday afternoon project: "OK so today I was bored, and I did what anyone with a Dreamcast and a portscanner would do, I did a port scan on my Dreamcast. The results are interesting"-click below to read more.Update: 09/12 08:02 by H : Yes, this is a hoax - or sources from inside Sega say it is.
Starting nmap V. 2.12 by Fyodor (fyodor@dhp.com, www.insecure.org/nmap/)
Host (129.***.**.***) appears to be up ... good.
Initiating TCP connect() scan against (129.***.**.***)
Port State Protocol Service
23 open tcp telnet
80 filtered tcp http
113 open tcp auth
179 open tcp bgp
12345 filtered tcp NetBus
12346 filtered tcp NetBus
TCP Sequence Prediction: Class=random positive increments
Difficulty=561888 (Good luck!)
Sequence numbers: 2B26AFA0 2B49A760 2B5316DA 2B647480 2B7655AB 2B852F62
No OS matches for host (see for more info)
Nmap run completed -- 1 IP address (1 host up) scanned in 33 seconds
The OS fingerprinting didn't guess the OS, big surprise, but the interesting thing is all the ports that are open. The ones that interested me the most were 23 and 80, the normal telnet and web server ports. I tried to connect to my Dreamcast with a web browser, no luck there. Then I tired to telnet into it, jackpot! I was able to telnet in, and prompted to give a username/password. Of course I had no idea what the username or password would be, I wonder if it's some sort of backdoor for Sega?
Now i have to see if I can do anything interesting with the other ports.
Starting nmap V. 2.12 by Fyodor (fyodor@dhp.com, www.insecure.org/nmap/)
Host (129.***.**.***) appears to be up ... good.
Initiating TCP connect() scan against (129.***.**.***)
Port State Protocol Service
23 open tcp telnet
80 filtered tcp http
113 open tcp auth
179 open tcp bgp
12345 filtered tcp NetBus
12346 filtered tcp NetBus
TCP Sequence Prediction: Class=random positive increments
Difficulty=561888 (Good luck!)
Sequence numbers: 2B26AFA0 2B49A760 2B5316DA 2B647480 2B7655AB 2B852F62
No OS matches for host (see for more info)
Nmap run completed -- 1 IP address (1 host up) scanned in 33 seconds
The OS fingerprinting didn't guess the OS, big surprise, but the interesting thing is all the ports that are open. The ones that interested me the most were 23 and 80, the normal telnet and web server ports. I tried to connect to my Dreamcast with a web browser, no luck there. Then I tired to telnet into it, jackpot! I was able to telnet in, and prompted to give a username/password. Of course I had no idea what the username or password would be, I wonder if it's some sort of backdoor for Sega?
Now i have to see if I can do anything interesting with the other ports.
*Rubs hands together* And this just happens to be the one I ordered at work! Muhahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahahahahha!
---
Joseph Foley
InCert Software Corp.
The res. of a TV is not so low that a web browser on it is "useless". I use a decidedly average Sanyo 52cm as the monitor for the stranger of my two PCs, and it's passable, though to be able to use it at a distance you really have to increase the font size one notch.
I've used it in both 640x480 underscan and 800x600 overscan. (both PAL) You lose a few lines, but it copes.
I'm sure with HDTV, or even a "normal" Sony Trinitron, it would be perfectly workable. Then the issue is the web browser program itself.
CJ.
Yes, this is highly likely, as there are still countries that have non-standard dialtones.
_ ___________
I remember having one BigAss(tm) fight with the compuserve dialup software in Hungary some years ago, until i realized that the damn modem didn't consider the Hungarian dialtone to be a dialtone!
dufke
_______________________________________________
__
Comment submitted. There will be a delay before you understand what you posted.
I would concure that they are prolly not using a differnt light (laser) source. Getting more bits onto a CD style platter involves layers, and varying the focal point of the reader head. The very top layer of the disk would have data on it, but is semi opaque. The layer under that has data on it, and it accessed by focusing the reader head laser to a deeper depth, thus attaining double the density of a traditional disk. Then there are 2 sided disks requiring a dual focus/dual reader head drive to read them. Bottom line: the CD style storage disk (CDrom/DVD/DreamCast) could hold a LOT MORE data than the dreamcast or the current DVD format is exploiting today. (Byte had an interesting article on this topic when DVDs first came out.
I'd like to see some of the documentation that says a Yamaha CDR can burn a GDR on a standard CDR disc. Have any of you actually seen a GDR? The GD-ROM is actually written in two sessions. There is a single density session near the center of the disc that can be read by any CD-ROM drive. The majority of the disc however is a high density session that is on the outer part of the disc. This is achieved by using a proprietary compression format. The high density section is also read from the outer edge of the disc inward, instead of from the inner edge outward. Also, GD-ROMs currently CAN NOT be burned on regular CDR machines. Burning a GDR currently requires a special Sega produced machine. A standard game disc takes approximately 1.5 hours to burn.
This is rather pointless, the server itself could easily diconnect the client, rather than make the client disconnect itself. Does the IRC server politely tell the irc client to please disconnect itself when someone issuses a KICK or BAN command on a user? hell no, it just freaking boot em out, doesnt care what the client does, cause after that point, it doesnt matter.
quick test:
visit http://www.mav.net/teddyr/access/info.shtml
dial in via ppp with a normal pc/mac/etc/machine, find out what the ip address that is assigned to your machine is (the domain name); then check the page above if its within the same "range"... (ie; if it says proxy or cache in the machine name... then it is transparantly proxied; same if the machine ip shown is not the same as winipcfg or pppd tells you that you have....
https://www.mav.net/teddyr/syousif/
--
Time is on my side
Actually, that's only part of the cool thing. The other is that a Dreamcast costs between 10% and 20% of a good "gaming" PC, and somewhat less than a more basic model. If Sega is on the ball, this could be a huge selling point with parents: "Buy the Dreamcast. It's cheaper than a PC, your kid can browse the web with it, and it's at least a US$1000 less than a computer that'll play the same games." Sounds like a winning pitch to me.
I was considering picking up one of these kewl little boxes, but I really wouldn't have much use for one. If a user can DCC information back and forth over the DCIRC client, then a person could download MP3s onto a zip drive while playing "kill em all!"(c)anygame inc. That might make buying one a little more tempting.
GDROMs are regular CDROMs with less error checking IMHO. You can burn GDROMs from Yamaha(?) Cd writers.
Of course I had no idea what the username or password would be, I wonder if it's some sort of backdoor for Sega?
I don't know about you guys, but I wouldn't store any personal documents on my game system (I don't even think I could), so Sega can have all the backdoors they want on my dreamcast (not that I even own one, yet).
It is interesting however. Maybe they could use it to check for illegally bootlegged games (If the games come on CD, I'm pretty uneducated on the subject).
SuPz.orG
Ok so from previous posts we know that they are filtering the 12345 etc ports. Thus stopping BO and other such harrasment. We also know he is connecting through his school. Now what ports are 'open,' well it's the 80 and 23. To follow up we all know what 80 and 23 are used for. The simple answer is that his school is blocking these ports so you can't run servers. In fact I'm suprised that 21 isn't showing the same thing. We see that nobody else is getting this, and with his web broswer open he was useing the other ports for the browsing, notice they are not filtered. Come on people we are smarter then this.
Last I knew blue lasers hadn't been perfected to work for more than about 30 seconds, so I really, really doubt that it's a blue laser. I can stick a GD-ROM in my normal CD ROM drive and it will read the disc as well, so it's seeing something on the normal CD wavelength. It could be using some sort of overlay, which could concievably up the capacity to 1 GB.
Well the modem is included with the system...seeing that I have on right next to me and it came with the modem.
(It rules by the way. I have sonic and soul calibur and I'm having a blast.)
Use the Z-modem protocol between Information Superhighway routers to compress the plaintext. ~LordOfYourPants
Try 80 min media : 700MB storage. Most new PC games are stored on this format.. thus limiting the number of ppl getting a sucessful backup. :)
--
Is what seperates a Hacker from Users. Natural curiosity.
I would doubt it most ti calcs are powered by a z80 which i think is not 32-bit clean :) OTOH, the 89 is a much better calc than the 83-87s, its actually a 92 without the kewlness. Anyways maybye i'll convince my parents to buy me an 89
Shine on, you crazy diamond.
I would concure that the DC drive prolly isn't using any special light/laser source. One of the things that makes todays CDrom/DVDdrives so afordable is the cheap/safe laser. Getting more data on a optical platter involves layers, and focusing. The disk would have 2 layers (the top layer would be semi opaque/seethrough. and the bottom layer would not) When the reader head focuses the laser on the top of the disk, that layer of data would be read. When the laser focuses further down into the disk, *that* lower layer of data would be read. This gives you double the data density without a lot of cost. Then there is a double sided/dual focal point drives that can read twice as much again. The bottom line? You will be seeing cheap plastic optical platters storing 4.7Gbytes(todays DVD) / 10Gbytes / 20Gbytes without having to alter the laser source or sector structure. (I think Byte magazine had an article on this when DVD first came out) comments welcome.
So if I'm the first person to crack into the dreamcast and change its files, do I get to keep it? (a la LinuxPPC :)
So... what probably happened is that the website you accessed to tell you your IP gave you the IP of whatever proxy server (remember, it could be transparent, esp. at a university) you were using.
The remote site only tells you the IP of the packets it gets from you.. which probably come from a proxy.
This is too weird... I just have two questions:
1. (dumb one) How was this thing getting its TCP/IP? Ethernet port, serial PPP, what?
2. Doesn't the Dreamcast run WinCE?
iSKUNK!
This little article really started to make me think about the possiblility of companies and their control over almost anything that they want to sell. I've seen the many articles on SlashDot about this topic, but this never really hit home until I saw some concrete evidence (at least in my opinion). Very interesting..
It's a shame that the docs of the hardware don't cover this or at least give some insight into why those particular ports are open, etc.. I think users that actually spend hard earned money (or not so hard earned) to buy the product deserve to know.
Matthew
_____________________________________
sortakinda.ca | canadian paraphrasing.
Here's the nmap -v against my Dreamcast on the net via ppp at the ISP Best.com: [root@pocket tm]# nmap -v 205.x.x.x Starting nmap V. 2.3BETA5 by Fyodor (fyodor@dhp.com, www.insecure.org/nmap/) No tcp,udp, or ICMP scantype specified, assuming vanilla tcp connect() scan. Use -sP if you really don't want to portscan (and just want to see what hosts are up). Host (205.x.x.x) appears to be up ... good. Initiating TCP connect() scan against (205.x.x.x) Adding TCP port 113 (state Open). The TCP connect scan took 40 seconds to scan 1487 ports. Interesting ports on (205.x.x.x): Port State Protocol Service 113 open tcp auth Nmap run completed -- 1 IP address (1 host up) scanned in 40 seconds. Note: the browser was on irc at the time, which is how I figured out the IP address, and probably why port 113 was open (for username authentication) Why the heck would a Dreamcast let you telnet in anyway? It's not like you can store files on a Dreamcast, or run apps remotely... Toshi
just call up sega and say you want the username and password. maybe they'll give it to you...
hopefully its not a defualt username and pwd for every machine...
=P
Global warming is good for you!
If the DC was behind NAT/MASQ the IP would show
up to be the router that does the NAT:ing.
The open ports are consistant with this (telnet, BGP4, http), all are services that are running
on pretty much every cisco router.
I'll be dialing up to a Linux box sitting about 2 feet away from it, and connecting it to the 'net through a gateway to my ISP.
This means that I'll have a machine sitting behind my firewall giving God-knows-what responses to God-knows-what requests.
Great.
It never occurred to me that my video games would be a security risk...
Dewey, what part of this looks like authorities should be involved?
surely these will surface soon after realease, but what can happen once you get in? if it runs wince, maybe you could change the software (do video systems such as these even use disk drives, daveo is not familiar with them?) and write your own video-game api! now that would be one certain sweet project!
-DAVEO
Now, give it a few months, and see the script kiddies crashing Sega consoles.. ;-P
-- I'm the root of all that's evil, but you can call me cookie..
Ok, so if Dreamcast accepts telnets, wonder why? Some undocumented connection for later use? Anyway, I can just feel a hundred /.'ers right now trying to get in. I wonder how long it will take?
-- Moondog
I found the Byte Magazine article mentioned in my previus post. I think this article will answer your questions regarding today optical storage.
Nope... 4.0 and up.
What you're thinking of is internet access that comes via a tunneled IP protocol atop AOL's proprietary internal communication protocol.
PPP dialup is in beta testing for the newer clients (and what better test platform than all them Dreamcast users -(
We should follow the proud tradition created by the users of SlashDot and done since the begining of time and slashdot someones Dreamcast just for the hell of it.
If we dont, someone might think we dont exist anymore, and therefore that Linux is dead, that since WinCE runs on the Dreamcast and we failed to slashdot the Dreamcast that Sega is actually MS and that Bill Gates is actually Sonic and that Im waaaay off topic. What a world.
Time to go to bed.
While is entirely possible that the Dreamcast has it's own TCP/IP stack, I suspect that what you port scanned was really a proxy server of some sort that the dreamcast uses for it's internet access.
-- Superlame http://catpro.dragonfire.net/joshua/
Waitaminute.... the damn thing just came out. And your all ready bored with it????
------------------------------------------
Byron Ray
"The code I write borders on black magic. Modify it at your own peril."
Not bad actually - it uses some pretty legible fonts, and of course they're at a pretty large size. So you have to scroll a lot, but it's quite good in general. Better quality than the video out on my old Voodoo Rush board for sure.
Accually I think the sega rep does, he just wasn't expecting such a question and probably didn't realize there was a telnet port open on the dreamcast.
a: no. i tried scanning for open ports on my dreamcast, i saw telnet was open, and i tried using telnet to access it. i did this from my dsl-connected computer. i got the login and password prompt in the telnet window. the dreamcast works fine, even when i'm using telnet.
r: whoa, man. i dunno.
a: alright..
r: i couldn't give you any dns or anything
a: yeah?
r: that'd be ILLEGAL!
It seemed that he was starting to catch on towards the end there.
CNN is carrying an article regarding the release of Dreamcast, apparently quite a few games made it out that were defective. For more info:
o blems/index.html
http://www.cnn.com/TECH/computing/9909/10/dc.pr
PS: I know this isn't directly related to port-scanning the box, please don't moderate me down!
Your Brain + EEG + LEGO Robots = Brainstorms
Um... CE comes with the dream cast, so you wouldn't have to spend any money on it...
"Subtle mind control? Why do all these HTML buttons say 'Submit' ?"
ReadThe ReflectionEngine, a cyberpunk style n
I tried portscanning my DC (US DC, running the packed-in web browser, showing this very article on /. on my TV :) and the latest nmap showed no ports open. I could ping the DC but telnet on any of the ports mentioned did nothing. I'm positive I got the right machine because my PPP dialup has a fixed IP and DNS =)
Anyone else tried this and had it work? What disc did you have running in the DC?
Did you try diconnecting your dreamcast and trying the port again? If it still works... it ain't your dreamcast. If it doesn't.. it MAY have been
Perhaps, if it does exist, it is used for some authentication of sorts, when you initiate games online with it ?
I'm not sure how it works, I dont have one, but it seems to me connections through a medium, like some big gaming server, instead of direct connection between the two isps and hence the dreamcasts, would be a waste of bandwith.
The authentication could be to avoid country mixups, lets say it was Sonic adventure japanese and american ( heh if that game cannot use gaming online, forgive me on that, i dunno virtually anything about it )
Username: SonicAdventure
Password: here the japanese game connects to the american, hence tries a password like 'jappa'.
It cannot connect, the connection dies, and the game gives you an error. This could also work with version differences, if you can download some game-patches or similar that would change the two games.
that's about it
-scar
Well, you might end up spending more mone for Visual C++ then you're dream cast (pluss running somthing like a webserver would be slow of a CD-rom). *but* you can code stuff for CE if you want, check out:
http://msdn.microsoft.com/cetools/ for more info. but I don't know if you would need to burn CE on the CD as well or not.
writing a CE application would probably be easyer then writing somthing that would actualy run on a DreamCast.
also, was the 'dream cast portscan' done while a game that used CE was running? I would think that nmap would detect CE. Or was it just the sega ROM that was scanned?
"Subtle mind control? Why do all these HTML buttons say 'Submit' ?"
ReadThe ReflectionEngine, a cyberpunk style n
While I know TV's resolution sucks, I am interested in this question because I rented a Dreamcast a while ago. Anyways...
Did you use the RF modulator when you tried it? The RCA's produce a much much much higher quality picture... Didn't come with S-Video or I would have tried it...
The Kermit protocol sends data similarly to the way uuencode encodes data.
Could it just maybe be the Slashdot effect, and you were the 1000th caller asking the same question? I'd be pretty annoyed if I were Tech support and had to answer the same question 1000 times already within a single day...
Then again, it 'could' be a big conspiracy...
Be patient, the whole thing will be hacked withing a month or two anyway...
Starman97@Gmail.com (bring it on spammers)
Port 113 is reserved for the autb protocol.. I don't see why someone'd want to 'auth' a DC... I could just see it returning 'Sonic' :)
da w00t. mtfnpy?
I got my DC's IP address from a web site that reports your IP. Then I tried telneting to port 23. It seemed to work, because it asked for a password (no user name though). A couple of hours later, I did the same thing. Figured out my new IP, and then tried to telnet to port 23. This time though, I got nothing. I tried turning the unit off and on, and repeating the same process. Using the Web Broswer CD that came with it. Still, I coudlnt get anything from port 23. I'm not sure what this means. Maybe, I'm just missing something here, but I thought it would be something worth mentioning.
How about removing the GD-rom drive from Dreamcast and then connect it to PC? Has anyone examined if the GD-rom is using a standard IDE connector? I assume Sega must be using IDE or something very similar. They can reduce production costs by using standard PC components.
Imagne a beowulf cluster of all of the Dreamcasts Out there
Not only did I have it loaded, it was showing this very /. article on my TV when I ran the portscan.
:)
Again, no ports were open and the Dreamcast only responded to pings. I suspect the original guy accidentally hit an NT box or something
A great idea: A dreamcast linux port!
Every platform! Whats next?
With this new moderation system in place, you should have gotten (Score:0 Funny)
---------
PovRayMan
----------
Check out my blackbox styles
what would slashdot be without this post?
Actualy, I belive that work was done to get NetBSD to run on the thing, so you may not need to port linux.
I don't know how usefull the system is for *general purpose* computing (IE they spent all there money on sweet graphics chips). With built in networking it might be posible to build a beowulf cluster, but I don't know how easy it would be to get a program to run on dreamcast (Sega may have 'locked it down' to prevent game piracy, and unlicensd games)
"Subtle mind control? Why do all these HTML buttons say 'Submit' ?"
ReadThe ReflectionEngine, a cyberpunk style n
if I understand correctly, not just for Sega perse, but for anyone writing the GDROM that goes into the Sega, since the internet connection software is part of the GDROM.
Anybody remember back to the days of prodigy when people were finding all sorts of personal information in their cache files that had nothing to do with Prodigy?
Now if they used it to gather information on playing habits to make a database and use some Baysian logic to make AI smarter it might be worth it!
'confused' by NAT'd hosts? No kidding...
If something is hiding behind address translation.. you *cant* scan it...
Maybe he didn't have a game ;)
Use the Z-modem protocol between Information Superhighway routers to compress the plaintext. ~LordOfYourPants
AOL 4.0 and up can also dial PPP connections. (Top secret beta-tester info. but i never liked them anyway...) My sister forces us to keep our account.
Opinionated Law Student Strikes Again!
What exact words come up when you telnet to the machine? We can determine if you are just hitting a router or proxy server or something of that sort by the telnet banner. If it says "User Access Verification" followed by "Password:" it is probably a cisco router (for example). Or if it says Linux or FreeBSD or something.. you get the idea. If it says Sega login: then things will be very interesting :-)
Of course it's a redirect, why would netbus be open. Think about it, it's obvious what's going on.
Well...if the Dreamcast unit has an IRC client - is it capable of recieving DCC file transfers?
I'm sure it's just filtering (notice nmap reports "filtered") HTTP requests so that users can't run http daemons, and 12345/12346 to block NetBus crackers from getting in. I doubt it's proxying/monitoring. Entirely the ISPs fault.
An earier post to this topic mentioned that this his DC was using Port 113 for IRC . . regardless of what port is being used . . my question still remaines... can a DC-IRC client DCC
Good point. I remember seeing in my logs a VA Research host (kernel.varesearch.com, I think) that was surveying my kernel. Well, at least I hope that's what they were doing. Has anyone else noticed this?
It's pretty inconvienient to sniff an analog modem connection directly.
Here's how you might go about it:
Never used Dreamcast myself, but I presume you can program in a phone number that it dials to get ot the net?
If for some reason you can't pick an arbitrary number, take it to work and make friends with your PBX admin. They can get it to drop on a particular extension no matter what number it dials.
Have your own PPP server answer the call. If it's a *nix machine, you can probably sniff the PPP interface directly.
If you can't sniff the PPP, or your PPP server is a Windows box or some such, just pull it off the Ethernet after it's routed.
As far as I remember, that was Earthlink, not Netcom.
:o)
Search through deja.com or some (anti) scientology websites and it should show the "truth". I'm 99% positive it was Earthlink.
I know I'm off topic... just correcting
-nicole
In case anyone didn't already notice, when using IRC the host of the clients are listed always as NS-XXXXX.real.host.net aka mine was... NS-27268.dialup.anchorage.greatland.net I recently quit working at that ISP so I no longer have access to the portmaster. I just emailed a friend there to get the real IP address.
Just think, run a copied game -- zap your dreamcast.
Mod your Dreamcast? First time you hook it to the net, your firmware gets erased.
Try and port Linux to it (a non-licensed product), the Charo in your VMU pops to life and kills your penguin!
--
A mind is a terrible thing to taste.
"A mind is a terrible thing to taste."
My best guess would be that the ISP doesn't want users to run web servers (bandwidth?).
Sony sold a system called the Yaroze, that was supposed to be used to hack the playstation with a PC and GCC, but the licencing requirements were rediculis (you couldn't sell your game yourself, sony had first dibs on marketing, also the system was missing some of the advanced modeling libs)
I don't know if you can use a Stock CE dev kit for the dreamcast however, Sega may have put some locks in the DC to stop unauthorized games from being sold
"Subtle mind control? Why do all these HTML buttons say 'Submit' ?"
ReadThe ReflectionEngine, a cyberpunk style n
Some areas in www.dreamcast.com are accessible ;)
only trough a Dreamcast.
I think they check "User-Agent" browser's header.
Once you know it, you can browse these areas
from a PC (ok, a really stupid idea, but...
Can anyone try to connect a dreamcast's browser
with a machine running 'nc -l -p 80'?
What are the crackers going to do? Steal your high scores?
Marko Karppinen
That reminded me - I see that someone's come out with a C compiler for the TI-89, called TI-GCC... And the TI-89 has enough archive memory to hold a Linux kernel. So how long do you think it'll be before someone ports Linux to the TI-89?
That'd make my calculator so much cooler. The 89 is already closer to a computer than a calculator, so it's too bad it's got such a clunky OS.
--
Win dain a lotica, en vai tu ri silota
Both the 89 and 92/92+ are running 10 mhz m68000 chips, just like the old Macs but 2 mhz faster. The latest ROM gives the 89 just over 600k mem total I believe. I could see Linux on it pretty easy, and since there's already a mk68k Linux port I bet it wouldn't take much at all to adapt to the screen and mem type.
Has anyone noticed that 3 ports (80, 12345, 12346) are filtered? My, oh, my are there a lot of silly replies here.
i just wrote a quick cgi script on my linux box to print out the ip address of the client visiting it. I then went to the cgi script on the dreamcast, and telneted into it. didn't work. i don't have nmap installed, so I'm not going to telnet random ports, but i can tell you that i couldn't get anything out of port 23 and 80. And the cgi script worked right- the client address was different than my linux box's and was on the subnet my isp uses- so it seems to be pretty valid. gr, i hate bogus posts, especially when it gets all the slashdot readers all excited like that. ah well. -ethan
get another job... man... :)
"Subtle mind control? Why do all these HTML buttons say 'Submit' ?"
ReadThe ReflectionEngine, a cyberpunk style n
One reason I can think of that Sega might want a back door into someone's dreamcast is so that they can run diagnostics offsite. It might save money in the long run if problems with the machine can be diagnosed by the tech support operative while you're on the phone (provided that you have a second phone line just for your Dreamcast), in some cases that would otherwise require that the machine be shipped in for repair. Possibly, the support person could update the machine's firmware remotely.
That's about all I can think of. As for why they use Telnet instead of some proprietary protocol... who knows.
uh, the last time I checked you didn't need to have access to a machine in order to disconnect it from somthing...
"Subtle mind control? Why do all these HTML buttons say 'Submit' ?"
ReadThe ReflectionEngine, a cyberpunk style n
Maybe this is a way for Sega to make a big group and as each Dreamcast connects to the Internet, it let's Sega HQ know of it's IP, it downloads RC5 blocks on a Sega-made RC5 client for the Dreamcast and starts cracking it. I wouldn't mind having millions of 200 MHz proprietary CPU's cranking out RC5 blocks for myself.
someone netbussed my dreamcast and now sonic is giving me the finger! :(
Bah.. if you leave your car doors or your windows open in my neighbourhood I'm gunna come knock on your door and tell you how lax your security is. The security of your box/house affects my security.
How we know is more important than what we know.
how complicated would it be to write simple programs for the dreamcast? could this be done in c or c++ for a win ce or *bsd api? Can't be done!
if one were to write a program for the dreamcast, could it be put on any normal cd-rw and used immediately, or would any special modifications be needed. The disk is propitary so,.....wait for it . . . . . . . . . Can't be done! It turns out that the original poster did a wonderfull deep scan of a router. I think your odds of hacking said router would be more interesting/fun.
that would be cool as hell use it as some X11 web brower type deal
MarNuke
TV resolution is fairly low, but it's not completely useless for web browsing...look at all the WebTV boxen out there. :-) On a more serious note, I have a K6-200 here with a Velocity 128 that I use primarily as a DVD/CD/MP3 player (parked under the TV just like a VCR). I've also fired up Internet Explorer on it, just to see what it looked like. With the display set to 640x480 and large characters, it's usable on most reasonably well-designed sites. On sites that were designed with more screen area in mind, it doesn't work so well. (People who hack their own HTML with vi/emacs/Notepad/[insert the text editor of your choice here] are more likely to generate pages of the former type. People who think FrontPage is the end-all-be-all of webpage editors are more likely to generate pages of the latter type.)
In addition to the design of the site you're viewing, the quality of your video card's TV-out signal has a lot to do with whether you'll get usable results. If your card has some kind of flicker-reduction capability (the Velocity 128 does), you should get a reasonably solid picture. If your card doesn't, the interlace will drive you batty. (I turned off the flicker reduction once to see what it was like...not recommended.)
20 January 2017: the End of an Error.
DHCP is a protocol used on ethernet LANs to do dynamic host configuration. ISPs use "dynamic IP" setups where RADIUS or TACACS spits out a random unused IP from a network for the user to use. DHCP is NOT used in dialup connections.
Many of us [hear] complaints that computers are too hard to use - there's no simple way to operate a computer like a television (push a button, and you're there). (We all know we hate these comments, but almost have to admit it.)
Of course not. The only thing you can do with a TV is watch it. Computers are far more useful. The fact that the average shmoe doesn't appreciate how useful is computer can be is a different matter.
The good thing about Dreamcast is that any John Q. Gamer (even their parents) can use this thing - they don't have to be computer literate!
If people want a simple entertainment device, they should get a TV. They might even do well to support the onset of digital / interactive TV. These people obviously have no desire for a useful machine like a computer, or an expensive and slow replacement for a telephone like a WebTV.
Question: Was Dreamcast built to be a game machine, or a hacker toy?
Romulus
Terrorists can attack freedom, but only Congress can destroy it.
The Dreamcast comes with a 56k modem for internet game play and web browsing and the like (it actually includes an irc chat client which I thought was awesome).
The OS issue is not as clear cut. The dreamcast supports two OS's, and games are allowed to pick and choose which one they want to run on top of. A heavily modified version of WinCE is one choice, which should allow for easy ports of PC games (or rather, would make for easy ports to Win32 from the Dreamcast I would be willing to bet). The other choice is Sega's own proprietry OS, that is rumored to be based on the Saturn's OS. It would be interesting to know if the person who did this TCP/IP scan was running the web browser CD when he did this, or one of the games that supports internet play, such as Sonic Adventure.
Not a java IRC thing. Its a Sega IRC server thing. They protect the hosts of ALL users logged in.
Routers, or at least decent Cisco routers, can very easily redirect ports to another machine. I could for instance, redirect all incoming requests to port 23 on an interface to another machine.. say my firewall, where you would then authenticate and telnet on from that host into the internal network.
"Did anyone try to access the web server and see what was open (if not exactly what happened)? "
;-)
Netcat+telnet experiments would be nice.
"What about the two "NetBus" ports? Is there a version of NetBus for WinCE (or whatever Dreamcast runs) that I don't know about?"
No, when Nmap says it's filtered, it means it's a connection denied thing (ie: no open port). 100061 on Win32
I'm wondering WTH is on port 179, and why there's a Netbios/WINS server port open on the damned thing.
--
Internet Explorer (n): Another bug -- that is, a feature that can't be turned off -- in Windows.
does anyone know if sega plans to implement an ethernet card in dreamcast?
I know it would be initially not practical for the common user, but with more and more cable providers and isps offering high speed access, it would be a good idea in the near future.
You don't use port 80 to surf the web, outgoing connections use a random port for connecting, if it was, you couldn't surf the web and serve pages at the same time.
Also you don't need to have a outgoing port listening for connections...
"Subtle mind control? Why do all these HTML buttons say 'Submit' ?"
ReadThe ReflectionEngine, a cyberpunk style n
I think this proves I don't have a life :)
"One World, One Web, One Program" - Microsoft Promotional Ad
If there isn't a web server inside, which would be tough, maybe this port is open for surfing, something similar to WebTV?
-Ian "If you can read this, thank a geek." http://www.geekforce.com
Actually, I was talking about being able to connect to AOL through TCP/IP (i.e. dial up to a real ISP and then connect to AOL through it)
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Well now that I have a NGPS (PSX2) dev box, I've been contemplating trying to compile up a linux kernel for it :D Wouldn't be much use without a keyboard and stuff but it would be interesting just for the sake of cool-ness.
Geez.. I might get one of these things just to have it on the network. Wonder if you could burn something and use it as a server. Heh.
Anyone tought about bruting the telnet session? After all, no admins to monitor the attempts, right?
quux26 --> Lazlo
My
Quux26
www.crashspace.net
In my dorm room I've got two RJ-45 jacks, one for phone, and one for ethernet... a regular modem wouldn't do me much good...
"Subtle mind control? Why do all these HTML buttons say 'Submit' ?"
ReadThe ReflectionEngine, a cyberpunk style n
I know my parents don't like computers being left on... imagine billy saying "but ma, I can't turn it off I'm helping crack RC-5"
News for UW students
If that is true, then why doesn't somebody put Linux (or something) on a game disk?
Isn't ping flood a DOS attack? What would the point of that be - unless you just wanted to crash your Dreamcast. This is pretty weird, if you ask me - I'd hate to think that Sega had less-than-honorable intentions with this one... Although I can't imagine what those might be, if any. Maybe it's for the NSA :)
Put a modem into your computer and dial from your dreamcast directly into you machine. I suspect what nmap picked up was a filtered port (as someone hinted to earlier) many isp's do this in an effort to stop users from hosting websites and wasting bandwidth. If indeed there is a telnet port open you can run a standard dictionary crack on it but that raises a few interesting questions:
What would you see once you logged in? if i remeber correctly these machines are based on winCE chips.
What prevents you from getting into any other dreamcast machine on the web? They aren't likely to have set the passwords different on each one.
- MbM
- MbM
Why would there be a telnet port open if:
a. You can't telnet into your DC.
b. You can't telnet out from your DC.
It doesn't make sense.
*-emufreak-*
www.kontek.net/pp
not PPP, they use a propritary link protocol
"Subtle mind control? Why do all these HTML buttons say 'Submit' ?"
ReadThe ReflectionEngine, a cyberpunk style n
The real test will be when SEGA releases the 10/100 card for the dreamcast and we can simply test this on a LAN. That way there would be no ISP routing or monitoring going. According to everything I've read so far the 10/100 NIC should be released within the next 6 months (as long as it's in time for Quake 3 Arena). At least then we can get a definite answer to the whole telnet idea. It should be interesting if nothing else.
-Beguile
ok obviously if sega runs all the game services this will serve no purpose, but how about if games allow you to start your own servers independant of segas services in the future.
now i dont see why they would need it, but why the hell did id software need a backdoor in quake 2?
You could write dreamcast programs as easily as writing a Win CE program, the problem comes when it's time to compile.
I'm a loner Dottie, a Rebel.
they don't let you use calculators when you're taking a verbal part.
And the math is all basic geometry or simpler, so if you've got the brains to be putting stuff on your calculator, you can memorize the pythagorean theorum.
now the GRE's...
In Capitalist America, bank robs you!
They use a higher density structure than CDs. You can probably think of it as a Mode 3 CD-ROM. Whereas Mode 1 is 650 megabytes and Mode 2 is 740 megabytes. On a normal CD the pits near the center of the disk are much closer together than the ones on the outer layer. Why is this so? Because the first CD-ROMs were single speed, the servo that spun the disc couldnt go from 4x to 6x which means the farther out on the disc you go the slower you have to spin it in order to be able to read the data. So they made the outer layers less dense so they would only need a single speed motor, this kept the price relatively low. Newer CD-ROMs have multi speed motors that can slow down on the outside and speed up on the inside, this is allows them to read Mode 2 CDs, which have a little higher density than Mode 1 CDs. Sega's GD-ROM packs the outside of the disc as densly as the inside of the disc and has a very good variable speed motor. This is what enables a regular CD-ROM to read the first track of a GD.
I'm a loner Dottie, a Rebel.
actually a ~ infront of the ident means it FAILED to get a response back from 113. When the IRC Server gets a response from the identd it allows the user to be set exactly as configured. Therefore either 113 is blocked or not open
I wonder if he tried an anonymous login, or standard root/root & other default passwords.
Since we already know the Dreamcast can run FreeBSD, it would be interesting to have a Linux port.
I have no idea what the name and pass is for the machines. We have never even heard about this...
Where do you get this version of twitch, I mean winCE? Could an average joe compiler something for? Does anybody know what this would entail? It would make a nice little generic network device: cheap, easily configured with the change of a cd...
I suppose I'm not too threatening, presently, but wait till I start Nautilus
OpenBSD has already been ported, maybe Linux isn't too far behind...
Where do you get this version of twitch, I mean winCE? Could an average joe compile something for it? Does anybody know what this would entail? It would make a nice little generic network device: cheap, easily configured with the change of a cd...
I suppose I'm not too threatening, presently, but wait till I start Nautilus
apparently to reset the Dreamcast's internal memory, hit and hold X+B on your controller with the Worldnet disc inside (while booting up) until you get to the sign up page. on gamesages they say the controller has to be on port 'B'
http://www.s4biturbo.com/
I theorise no consperacies here. Although I acknowledge that games for console systems aren't developed on the consoles, bugs may arise at a later date.
I am willing to bet that the telnet entrance gives the user read-only access to registers, and maybe even snapshots of memory. Such tools could be useful to have memory snapshots show up in a web browser on the same PC as the development going on.
Unfortunately, I haven't followed the specs of the system, but I'll assume also, that Sega may exploit open ports with later addon products.
I know this is sort of off-topic, but are the new Office & Frontpage 2000 CD's 800MB? I ask for legitimate reasons, as we just buy the licenses needed for additional copies at work, but needed more physical disks for techs to run around with installing it, and I couldn't duplicate them.
When in danger or in doubt, run in circles, scream and shout. --Robert A. Heinlein
if you're concerned about sega having a basckdoor to your dreamcast, why don't you just intercept it's internet connection and see what gets sent on port 23? You can set up a ppp server on your linux box, and then have it get to the internet through there. Just use tcpdump, and you're golden. I suspect if sega had some kind of backdoor access to it, the auth would be based on serial #.
Since they probably never expect 99.999% of dc owners to try to access their DC via telnet, but they know crackers will do scans and find em eventually, they'd want to make sure that somebody getting one username:passward pair wouldn't then have access to every dreamcast box. So when you connect to their equivalent of battle.net, you tell them your ip, and your serial # and then they use the predetermined username:pass for your box to do whatever it is they wanted to do. Not too tricky. You may even get to see the "arcane" commands they've programmed into the thing.
-earl
pfft.. read the damn docs that come with nmap.. people scan boxes all day, every day.. it is no more an attack or "invasion of privacy" than a neighbourhood watch.
How we know is more important than what we know.
Kris
Kriston J. Rehberg
http://kriston.net/
Kriston
I don't see where ping is problem. All netwroked versions of quake (at least since since quakeworld/1996) have responded to ping. Have you been ping flooded playing quake? no? I thought not. It's an very efficient way to judge network latency, and generally pretty harmless.
Why would a CE macine ie. the dreamcast have ports open for netbus??? there are just enought mistakes to prove this is a hoax:
1. How do you install the NetBus crack onto CE, let alone NetBuster?
2. How do you port scan a machine that only has a serial port (how did you find a connector & the pinout) or a modem that only connects to the numbers in the dreamcast's database (game servers)
3. A proper port scan actually tells you the machine's IP adress, & why are you so afraid of showing your dreamcast's IP if it's only a dreamcast not your PC.
/* FUCK - The F-word is here so that you can grep for it */
Yes, I agree that it's cool. I just went to Hitachi's website and read up on the SH-4 that the Dreamcast uses. Several interesting things stuck out: 360 MIPS 1.2 GFLOPS (Not 1.4 as Sega advertises, but still very impressive) 800 MB/Sec bus, not too shabby (especially for $199) Code compatible with the SH-3 Further down we find details on processor utilization from several tasks... v.90 software modem: %15! I see that it's a good thing the PVR2 allegedly does the modem controlling. That is a tremendous number. All in all very impressive.
You have to compile programs for a specific architecture. eg. i386, PPC, m68k. Thus, you need a compiler that compiles specifically for the dreamcast.
Okay, more info. I just read through some of Hitachi's SH4 programming manual (ouch) and it says that the Dreamcast can only sustain 900 MFLOPS. Interesting. Marketing didn't mention that.
"My God, this must be a truly remarkable corn chip, to be so widely and confidently touted."
Um, they've already done a basic port of BSD (Net, I think) - why spend money on WinCE when you can use BSD for free. Besides: Do you really trust WinCE?
werd man.. screw going through an ISP.. put the damn dreamcast on your LAN.
How we know is more important than what we know.
I don't personally have access to a Dreamcast of my own to experiment on, but let's have a little more information, please! A have a few questions about this article...
1) Through what means was the portscan performed? Was the modem attached to some sort of ISP or what?
2) What about the other protocols running:
23 open tcp telnet
80 filtered tcp http
113 open tcp auth
179 open tcp bgp
12345 filtered tcp NetBus
12346 filtered tcp NetBus
Did anyone try to access the web server and see what was open (if not exactly what happened)? What about the two "NetBus" ports? Is there a version of NetBus for WinCE (or whatever Dreamcast runs) that I don't know about? If people are concerned about telnet insecurities, wouldn't NetBus be a larger risk?
3) Has anyone attempted to brute-force their way through telnet, or any known exploits for the other protocols to check against a faulty implementation?
I find this information very interesting, but honestly I'm not sure whether or not I believe it without further details!
Your Brain + EEG + LEGO Robots = Brainstorms
How difficult would it be to port Mozilla to the dreamcast? It would be useful I think for these users to have a standards compliant web browser that works similar to those on a PC. If the porting of Mozilla was done through WinCE we'd have to pay license fees wouldn't we? What about the other options? Do you have to pay fees to Sega for distributing dreamcast software? Would Sega be interested in helping the Mozilla project to get a decent web browser on their platform?
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I would suspect Sega enabled this feature as a way to debug the Dreamcast - I would also suspect most other console manufacturers do the same, only with proprietary hardware interfaces.
But what really interests me in how well the Dreamcast pulls off this 'convergence' thing that big companies like Microsoft, Sun, and others have been harping about. I mean, last year, these two companies were saying "We're gonna make it easy for everyone to access and use the Internet! Just watch!"
Here we are a year later and out of nowhere comes Sega with this console that not only plays some really great games, but also connects to the Internet and enables you to browse the web. But what's so special about that - I can hook up my computer's G400 to a TV display, too. The really cool thing is the power of the Dreamcast is hidden from the user.
Many of us here complaints that computers are too hard to use - there's no simple way to operate a computer like a television (push a button, and you're there). (We all know we hate these comments, but almost have to admit it.) The good thing about Dreamcast is that any John Q. Gamer (even their parents) can use this thing - they don't have to be computer literate! On the other hand, there's enough power in the device that real computer hackers like us can go to the length of making interfaces to the device (provided there are external ports and such) to harness that power - and the fact of the matter is, we will if given the chance.
- Shaheen
You should never take life too seriously - You'll never get out of it alive.
He said that the tilde (~) wasn't there when the user was on IRC with a dreamcast, therefore ident port 113 must have been open.
--
If Dreamcast lets the disc boot an OS, would it be possible to hack the interface and burn a CD to boot Linux?
A witty saying proves nothing. -Voltaire
Yes, that's it.. Sega has installed a backdoor on every dreamcast and is convincing users to connect up to the internet often. That way Sega gets a distributed super computer that you, the user, are paying for. With this super computer they will take over the world.
How we know is more important than what we know.
add-header Cache-Control: max-age=0
add-header Pragma: no-cache
You'll still be redirected through the cache server; there's nothing you can do about that. But the cache server will never try to fill your requests, so you'll always get fresh data. Our ISP tried a cache server too; as far as I know they're still using it, but we finally got our range of IPs excluded. While they were still caching us, though, this approach worked.
and then no one can hack your Dreamcast.
Besides, where else will you plug in the hardware hack to allow you to play Jap games on the US system (and vise versa)
guns kill people like spoons make Rosie O'Donnell fat.
Actually I have seen the term, SoftModem being used by modem manufacterers. *I guess they don't like windows either* ;)
--jcbender
The way the GD-ROM discs work is like this:
There's a boot sector on the disc that boots either the bare-bones boost strap OS that Sega developed and then runs your application ontop of that. The data sector contains the compiled application and all data for the game.
OR
The boot sector contains the CUSTOM Windows CE for Dreamcast which loads, boots, inits the system and then launches the game application.
The WinCE method is nice because it offers developers the ability to develop games in DirectX 6.0 for CE and crosscompile them for the DC. The real hacking problem is getting a GD-ROM burner.
Anyone feel like ponying up the $20k for a developers license so we can start hacking the system and serial port?
--==[ AOL YIM ICQ : Levendis47 : levendis47@yahoo.com ]==--
Actually, it's AOL 2.5 and up.
---
Assuming someone is able to break into the system through telnet and gain access to the hard-coded files, how much more work would it take to make a dreamcast emulator? After all, with the new nvidia chip coming out, a PC could very possibly handle dreamcast games . . . Just a thought.
Yes... their IRC client only allows you to join one channel at a time (AOL? heh) and the DC doesn't come with a keyboard by default. I remember doing something like this when my mom took my keyboard away and I used charmap to type. :)
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Ping flooding is not a "nuke" tiem dos attack. It simply saturates the connection of the box. Any OS getting enough packets from a ping flood to saturate their link will suffer lag and possibly be unreachable.
xm@GeekMafia.dynip.com [http://GeekMafia.dynip.com/]
What ISP are you dialing up through that you saw port 80 open? I've noticed that disturbingly Netcom/Mindspring has started diverting all traffic aimed at port 80 through a proxy server of theirs. I suppose nominally this is to improve caching and make my web browsing faster or something, but you can bet they're tracking everywhere I browse.
A side effect of this is that nmap will *always* show an open port 80, because when nmap sends packets aimed at port 80, they wind up going to Netcom's proxy server and not the intended host. Also means that if nmap is doing its fingerprint testing against that port 80, it will get the fingerprint of the proxy, not of the actual host.
If the machine you're portscanning from is going through a Netcom dialup, you're probably just seeing the port 80 on their proxy, and not on the dreamcast. The fact that 12345 and 12346 are also both showing up is also indicative that a router somewhere between your scanner and the dreamcast is doing some filtering/proxying/monitoring. Unless it's just coincidence, I can't imagine why Sega would open those ports.
Is there a cracker our there for port 23 which can interact with the Telnet protocol to try to brute force the password/username combo?
:)
if so... let's start cracking
Dreamcast USA version has a 56k modem inside and supposedly you will be able to purchase a 10 mbs ethernet card later before X-mas to play with all you friends ( it'd be neat if you could play Q2 at a LAN party with it ). To accomplish this it has to have an IP protocol stack. The parameters and source code for the current stack are actually free ( or sorta free ) if you download the Development Suite for WinCE from Microsoft's web site. Hey at least its cheaper to develop for the dreamcast than any Sony playstation machine.
Wiggeda Wiggeda Wack - Kriss Kross
..when connecting that thing to the net? Maybe it contacts some wierd addresses too. And then the men in black suits monitoring these broadcasts can telnet back to your console and check if you have any pirated software etc.. or maybe download the history file(or cache index) from your web browser.. or maybe take over your irc sessions.. or maybe i'm just a little too paranoid. - Juha
"Slashdot. News for nerds. Hoaxes that don't matter." This is the second time this week that everyone's gotten all worked up about a hack that was just to good to be true (myself included) . We can all do better. I don't want "Hoaxes that don't matter" to be the motto.
I had a complete BBS on my HP48. You could login via IR or a modem via the serial port, and read mail and such. I was even working on a DOORS interface for it to work with my 2 player battleship game I made.
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Very interesting. I do have (and use) the WinCe SDK, reading through the CE Builder SDK info the DreamCast is referenced a few times. The hardware OS is boot from GDRom only, all directX D3D, internet, etc.. is all disc specific. While possible it could be a back door, from a developer viewpoint its probably unlikly to be anything interesting.. as well as vendor and developer specific.
Do you mean if you burned them on a CD? I think so, since you can play regular CD's on it.
Hmm Sega was talking months ago about the possibilty of hooking your dreamcast up to a Cable modem or ADSL modem. Mabey thats why it's there.
Top 5 reasons to telnet into your Sony AIBO:
5) Play virtual frisbee with your pet: it's just like the real thing but without the exercise!
4) Configure the house training subsystem to avoid oil on the carpet!
3) Fix that problem in the "fetch" routine!
2) You can't teach an old dog new tricks, but you can download rollover-1.1.2.tar.gz!
1) Improve security to keep those pesky mechanical cats away!
Jeos, as others have indicated you may have actually been probing your providers set up. There's not enough information to determine whether that is so or not. In that case be very careful about brute forcing it, if it is actually your provider that you're looking at they may become somewhat miffed.
If you're running a linux box it should be possible to set it up as a mini provider. You'd probably have to set up a DHCP server, PPP and telephony obviously. Your provider would then be taken out of the loop and the IP address of the dreamcast box would be easily detectable. If nmap or whatever still detected open ports you could be pretty sure that it was the real deal.
I think this is pretty interesting, I may run out and buy one just to check.
I mean, it wanted a username/passwd and the os is in rom (I assume). So, if the l/p is the same for all dreamcasts and you can get in and do things, who knows what, to them, then this can't be a good thing. If the passwd gets out, kinda like the cisco problem where there was a second default passwd, then all people using dreamcast can be "hacked". Maybe it's just me, I don't know, but I know I don't like the idea of someone being able to telnet in...
I can see where telnet would be useful for a game.
Debugging.
A programmer could telnet into the machine and look at or change variables, do step execution, etc.
Anyone who has done any embedded development can see the logic in this. Game consoles are, in fact, embedded applications. I used to work with ZWorld controllers that allowed me to monitor the execution of the software through the serial port. It was a godsend. IIRC, Sony's AIBO was debugged by telnetting into it.
I checked the http server log for my site (dricasworld.com - complete coverage of the Dreamcast's online capabilities) and got a hostname of a Dreamcast user. Scanned it for open ports and none of those mentioned in the article were open. The guy either blundered and scanned the wrong IP or is full of it.
For $200 using a dreamcast as an MP3 player would be a convient and reletively cheap solution.
As I understand it dreamcast can run other OS's like WinCE off a bootable CD. So it is likely that a linux port to dreamcast hardware could run as well.
So here is the idea include a minimalist linux dist. on a dreamcast boot cdrom along with a collection of MP3s as well as an MP3 decoder (mpg123).
Yet another idea is to use a cd with WinCE, a MP3 decoder and a collection of MP3s. Licensing issues would probably make this illegal.
A third idea (and likely the simplest) would be to port an MP3 decoder (again mpg123) to the built in dreamcast operating system. Then have a burned CD that contained an MP3 collection an MP3 decoder and possible an interface (so you could select songs from your controler)
Not a bad idea, at least one these ideas is possible. I have no doubt that someone will eventually port linux to dreamcast. Using WinCE is likely simple but as I said before including the code on your burned cd is probably illegal. Porting a MP3 decoder directly to the dreamcast operating system is probably the best solution.
Tell me what you think.
better yet, SEGA@home. a lot of the games involve searching for aliens, after all!
Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler. -- A.E.
can the j-spec and euro dreamcasts play american discs?
------- Oh damn.... the Sigfile escaped... -Great OM
I think a lot of people aren't realizing that the game that's being played could have a lot to do with it. Other comments have said that they've scanned dc's for ports and haven't found anything. If there are in fact ports open at all, it is probably the doing of the game. Besides, what kind operating systems open ports themselves, that's a user space operation .. well not with windows broken mentality anyway.
rm -rf ~/.signature
just out of curiousity, has sega limited what ISP dreamcast users are permitted to connect to? is there a default provider?
pity my ignorance...
-raj jr
It looks more like the response to your scans is coming from something other than the dreamcast. Perhaps the ISP is filtering or something.
(Personally, i think it should be put online and everyone should try to hack it. Then, if it *IS* the ISP filtering traffic.. we catch them in the act when they complain)
It bothers me slightly to see messages like this... While I do sympathize with your feelings, Rob and the other newsdudes are doing the best they can to publish important, meaningful, and kewl news.
I for one would much rather see one or two hoaxes now and then than I would like to see (or rather NOT see) all the cutting-edge stories they refrain from posting because they might be a hoax.
You admit that you got swept away in the excitement yourself, why isn't it okay for (Hemos, in this case) to be swept away too? It certainly wasn't like it was a glaring hoax. My first thought was that it would a totally cool feature!
In any case, I don't think its fair to attack slashdot for posting hoaxes. Like I said, its much better to post questionable material and let the user decide for him or herself whether it is true, than it is to blatantly censor things. In being liberal in their posting, Slashdot is passing the ability to decide to US, rather than deciding what is useful or stupid for us.
Which brings up another thought for me, but I will discuss it in a thread of its own.
Random and weird software I've written.
hey can we put rc5 on a dreamcast? I mean it has a nice fast processor. and it's 128bit so cracking 64bit code should be childs play, right?
char *stupidsig = "this is my dumb sig";
Hmm. It's running windows.... Try user: admin, no password ;-P
I have DSL at home and the first person to put a web browser on my TV that has an ethernet port will get my check for up to $500. I really don't care if it is Sega, Nintendo, Sony, or WebTV (they seem likely to be first).
I called Sega a few muinets ago and asked for the U/P. Once I explained the Telnet thing, the customer service rep became *very* aggrivated, and said that Sega has left a lot of ports open, and the reason "will be announced at a later date". Right.
I thought this would make a good joke but then I realised it wasn't the least bit funny.
--
Fuck the system? Nah, you might catch something.
First of all if the telnet thing is real, its probably an easter egg not back door. I'd try "Joshua" as the username and see if it brings up War-Games. If Sega/the developer of the game wanted info about you it would send proprietary "game statics" through the net to some address. Secondly, people are asking about converting a DC into a "PC", the Saturn could take a normal PC keyboard with an adapter, I would think there would be a simlar thing for the DC. Since the GD-ROM use red laser tech to burn their disc, it should be posible for most CD-R drives to burn a GD, though it may take low-level control of the burning laser.
I'd love to get my Dreamcast running BSD or Linux...and get online with it. Please give me a url, or something. :)
How are you sure that the user in question didn't log off before you had time to scan them?
...
Bitchslapped? Give Rob a bitchslap from bitchslapped.com.
Here you go... most everything you'd want to know about copying a GD-ROM. GD-ROMS are physically no different than a CD-ROM, just the low-level formatting of the disc. So all you should need is the right software.
e x.html
http://www.johny.sk/cdrinfo/reviews/dreamcast/ind
Me and a couple guys on IRC spent a while trying to telnet my DC. the only open port was 113, the ident port. needless to say we could do nothing there. We tried several port scanners and everything we could think of. So sounds like a load of BS.
NetBSD has far better support for Sparc I'm sure, its by far an older project. FreeBSD has in the last year been working on Sparc/Alpha varients of the OS. This is definately a good thing. It shouldn't be the goal of FreeBSD, NetBSD is far better. But, FreeBSD's goal is for a great server OS, which it is. PowerPC, Sparc, Alpha, and perhaps later IA-64 are all good platforms for servers. FreeBSD supporting this allows it not to be so restricted.
"Open Source?" - Press any key to continue
Let me get this straight; you have a new Dreamcast AND you were bored? That doesn't make the Dreamcast sound too enticing :)
The Yamaha 4416S will write "GD-ROMs" no problem... All you need is the software! :-) I know the 4416S, 6416S and above will do it, I'm not sure about the IDE drives though. Non-Yamaha drives will not write GD-ROM. I'm expecting GD-ROM support in software like CDRWIN this fall... Viv.
I seriously dout this thing was scanned over a modem connection, morelikely ethernet, it says scanned in 33 seconds, I have only been able to do that at home, on ethernet, ofcorse, i dont have a dreamcast yet :(
Well all you need is a uudecode, and you'll be able to send it binary data. It won't be the fastest way of transfering files but it's used alot when there are no other way to do it. Eg when you don't really have the access/time to ftp it.
/emj
Sega would have no comment on it because the OS resides on the disc. So whatever game was running while he scanned would have those ports open. So it's entirely open to the developer as to what is being used.
First off, AOL doesn't work with the DC. I forgot why, but it doesn't. Also, no, it doesn't use IE. It uses Planetweb's browser, more info here.
I recall some ad saying the modem was an external one and not included with the machine.
;)
Since the dreamcast runs winCE i wonder if the modem is a winmodem
Don't underestimate AOL, we all hate them, but they're the biggest "ISP". There's already 300,000 Dreamcasts operating in the US and Canada, and that's one large and easy market for them to go after. Pop in the disc, and turn it on. Jacob Rens Daily Videogame News and Info: http://www.the-nextlevel.com
Does it make you happy you're so strange?
You can bet anything AOL's gonna start distributing "50 Free Hours!" AOL Dreamcast GD-ROMs in every gaming magazine soon...
Does it make you happy you're so strange?
for some odd reason i feel funny with any console. i was looking at dream cast just cause i like sega. well as best i can remeber if it is running ce there are a few exploits going on , and i am not to sure of how this works soit might be just a glitch for now maybe it will update its self in the future.say sega put code in where when connected it checks for patchs and what not for new games , inform code to save to a card.i think that would be nice , bt i think there is going to be some exploits on this one very soon. i realy dont want tot think that sega is plaining backdoors, and if i get a dream cast i am going to wait for the linux disc. but i could use a low cost monoter for a home network. its going to get intersting , but your going to have to pry my computer out of my cold dead arms . i have always liked computers more then console gaming platforms. so i might pick one up but i will keep the manila coffin.
I havent seen the dreamcast myself yet but supposedly cant you talk to that fish guy in that game seaman with some sort of microphone? would it be possible to login to a dreamcast system via telnet and somehow tap into that microphone to spy?
Their ads jokingly say that it knows everything about you, but maybe it's logged into some vast database Sega has assembled with everything about you.
Hmm... trading info back and forth between the machine and the server while you play. Major conspiricy theory stuff here ;-)
- Jacob Rens
Daily Videogame News and Info: http://www.the-nextlevel.com
Does it make you happy you're so strange?
A bit off topic, but is there going to be an RC5 client for this sucker?
;)
If you were me, you'd be good lookin'. - six string samurai
I think that was NetBSD, not FreeBSD. Free's the one that goes for servers on x86 (and somewhat on a Alpha/Sparc). NetBSD is the extremely portable BSD varient.
"Open Source?" - Press any key to continue
DaveO:Hi, I just nmapped my DC and saw several open ports! I could even telnet into it and get a login prompt! What are you trying to pull?
Sega:Ummm, sorry sir, I don't know about any maps or netting.... The extra ports on your computer are for possible expansion in the future, to allow for new featu-
DaveO:What are you talking about?!? This is an invasion of my and every American's privacy! You people make me sick!
Sega:I'm sorry you feel this way. Honestly, there have been additional connectors on SEGAs console systems for years, allowing for future upgradability, such as more controllers, external storage, etc. I don't really see how this affects your privacy. You could always return the system if you can't live with this.
DaveO:This is ridiculous, I can't believe you thing you are going to get away with this you ^##%@#%$@
-click-
cot.
23 open tcp telnet
80 filtered tcp http
113 open tcp auth
179 open tcp bgp
12345 filtered tcp NetBus
12346 filtered tcp NetBus
The 'filtered' in the above means that those ports are actually intercepted somewhere in between
--
Ignorance is no excuse
Perhaps the ports are open for upgrade reasons. Consider the following scenario: Sega realizes there has been a small bug. They decide to release an upgrade for the operating system. They send registered users a letter telling them to go to a web site or whatever. The user goes, and from there, an applet connects to their dreamcast (from the server side), gets the system information from a telnet session by "logging in" and then the dreamcast spits back OS version info, firmware revision, etc, and then the applet uploads the correct operating system revision to the dreamcast. Is this possible?
According to this portscan, the dreamcast supports BGP! For those of you who aren't familar with BGP, it's a policy-based routing protocol used (for instance) at the NAPs.
So does this mean that Sega is going to start selling routing cards for the dreamcast? It's good to see that someone's finally working on an internet device that isn't just a client, but an affordable router! It's high-time I got rid of that crappy Cisco we have over here and replaced it with a fine piece of networking machinery, like a Sega. I'm so happy to see a router that's not just cheap - but you can also play games on!!!
Seriously, though, it does indeed appear that your ISP is doing something silly redirecting ports. This is particularly probably since nobody else can recreate this test. Either that or Sega chose a really bad port number to bind on.
I just kinda figured that if you could telnet into a dreamcast, then wouldn't it make sense to debug, and monitor performance etc. through telnet? It seems like it would be a really convinient way to debug a faulty machine that some person brings back to the store. You know, you buy a dreamcast, you play with it, it doesn't work the way it should you take it back to the store. Then the tech guy for the dreamcast, telnets to it, and monitors what is happening, where the glitches are and that sort of thing. I figure it is just there for troubleshoot faulty equipment.
:)
Of course, who knows, maybe the dreamcast has a really tiny camera in it, and is sending out an image of te inside of your home every few seconds to some government agency
Ok, what do we have here ? We have a machine that allows data input (the CD drive and the telnet port), remote access and data output (outgoing ports).
So far, we do not know how the stuff inside works. For example, we do not have any Dreamcast emulator. But this may happen soon.
IF we manage to understand the inner protocols of the system (after all, it has been done for the playstation, it is probably feasible for a WinCE machine, isn't it ?), then we might produce slightly modified CDs to have the console do rather cool things
Remote Dreamcast playing on your computer. Setting some mechanism to redirect display directives through the outgoing port, and accept commands from incoming. Ever tried a 20-players Destruction Derby over the internet ?...
This might work the other way round : by telnetting into the console and interfering with its display output, we might modify the look of the games at will - imagine : themes for your Dreamcast !
X servers for Dreamcast. Yeah. Now this may have implications that I cannot even imagine - or it may just be plain bullshit as well. I don't know. I don't even want to know. The very concept in itself (come on, X on a console !) is enough to make me wonder.
Thomas Miconi
Karma Police - enforcing peace of mind by all possible means
If there are any Canadians that wish to test this out I can help. I work for an ISP which has POP's in Calgary, Edmonton, Toronto, Winnipeg, and Vancouver. I can set you up with a test l/p, and we can see what games open what ports.
:wq
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Ok heres a little more info on the Dreamcast, I was the one who posted.
I was running the web browser CD on the Dreamcast and I was dialed to my ISP, my university. I ran the port scan from my computer. I obtained the IP of the Dreamcast from a website which gives you your IP. It's possible this is wrong, but this is the only way I can think of to get my IP. As far as I know there is no direct way to get the IP, the Dreamcast doesn't tell you your IP.
I would like to try and find a l/p for it, although it'll be kinda hard since I don't even have a username. If anyone knows of a good brute force program for telnet let me know. My email is aminidab@mailcity.com.
i called sega's dreamcast number (1-888-345-SEGA), they asked for my name and phone, and i proceeded to fake it:
:P
rep:can i please have your name and phone number?
aaron:doody doody doo!
r: thanks, how can i help you?
a: well.. i was using my dreamcast, and i tried to telnet into it. it asked me for a username and password.
r: huh?
a: i tried telnetting into my dreamcast from another computer.
r: is telnet ppp?
a: huh?
r: do you know what ppp is?
a: yes. both computers are connected via ppp. the dreamcast is connected over modem and my computer is connected via dsl.
r: uhhhh...
a: anyway, could you give me the username and password?
r: you shouldn't need one.
a: everything works fine - thats not the problem. i just want to see what it does.
r: do you use at & t worldnet?
a: no.
r: well just go to "other" when you reboot, and that will tell you how to sign up. did i answer all your questions today?
a: well, no. that's not the problem, everythign works fine. there's no other number i could call?
r: you mean your isp?
a: no. for dreamcast.
r: that's me!
a: okay. do you know a login and password for the dreamcast?
r: you need a login and password when you start the dreamcast?
a: *chuckle* i think we're misunderstanding each other. i'll start over. my dreamcast is connected via modem, via my isp. my computer is connected via dsl, via another isp.
r: okay...is your isp worldnet?
a: no. i tried scanning for open ports on my dreamcast, i saw telnet was open, and i tried using telnet to access it. i did this from my dsl-connected computer. i got the login and password prompt in the telnet window. the dreamcast works fine, even when i'm using telnet.
r: whoa, man. i dunno.
a: alright..
r: i couldn't give you any dns or anything
a: yeah?
r: that'd be ILLEGAL!
a: *chuckle*
r: alright, sorry i couldn't help. have a good day.
a: you too!
hmm..and i don't even own a dreamcast
Ya know, if you've spent so much money on such a powerful piece of equipment you might just want to know a little about it...
... but for "password", try "NSAKEY".
http://www.softrare.com/openbsd-sh4/
Kris
Kriston J. Rehberg
http://kriston.net/
Kriston
Great. Now I have to put a blanket on top of my dreamcast.
if(!toilet_paper) roll.replace(new roll);
Why bother encoding it like that? You can send binary data across telnet sessions (on most good implementations) anyway. Remember using Kermit and Z-Modem between machines? :)
At what price learning? At what cost wisdom? The price is a man's peace of mind, and the cost is his life.
and then you can see what's really going on...
The GD-ROM is actually written in two sessions. There is a single density session near the center of the disc that can be read by any CD-ROM drive. The majority of the disc however is a high density session that is on the outer part of the disc. This is achieved by using a proprietary compression format. The high density section is also read from the outer edge of the disc inward, instead of from the inner edge outward. Also, GD-ROMs currently CAN NOT be burned on regular CDR machines. Burning a GDR requires a special Sega produced machine. A standard game disc takes approximately 1.5 hours to burn.
dreamcast with a special 40$ cable will plug into a vga monitor, according to the folks on irc. and i think i read it in some web pages too. perhaps this will help your 'low rez' problem
Is the dreamcast browser able to run any of the countless java irc clients on web pages? Are any of those capable of dcc? If so that could be another loophole to bypas DC's probably lack of dcc support.
Nice call. Jerky :) I thought you were going to ask him if he had prince albert in a can . . ar if his refrigerator was running. (hey man...your cats on my fence) . . but seriously . . I think it's kinda funny that the Sega rep doesn't seem to know what Telnet is?!?!
As another user has stated, ping flooding is a denial of service attack. As I am now stating, Dreamcast doesn't use an out-of the box, stock release of any OS, meaning that "exploits" aren't known yet. Therefore, if you're going to hack it, you'd better be more than a script kiddie who has no idea what they're doing other than hitting buttons that say "p1ng fl00d" or the like...
Hello, I'm debating with a friend of mine exactly how GD-ROM has accomplished its increased data space over CD-ROM. Does anyone here actually know for a fact what wavelength it uses for example? My friend assumes its blue, but I don't think that's neccessary. As standard CD-ROMs aren't at maximum efficiency, and its not using the minimal red wavelength.