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I think drawing with our hands shows us many of those things we naturally don't notice. Such as how vital a wrinkle, mole, muscle is to an expression. How much can be shown with how little. A smooth curve. Actually having to do something is a very important lesson.
Digital may be useful, but analogue is infinite.

What if you can't even tell the difference? Being Slashdot, I'm sure most of you have heard of a CCG called Magic: The Gathering. Many of the artists who draw the artwork for the cards have been switching to digital media. This has concerned many of the players of the game, who prefer the more traditional looking artwork. One of Wizards' writers addressed this concern in a very eye-opening article in which he demonstrates that many of the artists are so talented (both as artists, and with digital media), that they're able to produce artwork that is so beautiful and authentic-looking that you can't even tell whether it was done with conventional media, or with a computer.

And for an example of some stunning work in the digital realm, check out these incredible photo-realistic illustrations done completely in Adobe Illustrator.

I'm not worried. I think as tools improve (think Intuos) and artists embrace digital media, artwork will get better, not worse. And there will always be a segment of the crowd who sticks to the traditional media, just like there will always be photographers who refuse to give up film. Can you tell whether a photo was taken with film or digital? No. Can you tell if a painting was done with oil and canvas, or on a computer? This may surprise you, but the answer is no. Check out this link and see for yourself. Don't underestimate what these skilled artists are capable of.

I think drawing with our hands shows us many of those things we naturally don't notice. Such as how vital a wrinkle, mole, muscle is to an expression. How much can be shown with how little. A smooth curve. Actually having to do something is a very important lesson.
Digital may be useful, but analogue is infinite.

What if you can't even tell the difference? Being Slashdot, I'm sure most of you have heard of a CCG called Magic: The Gathering. Many of the artists who draw the artwork for the cards have been switching to digital media. This has concerned many of the players of the game, who prefer the more traditional looking artwork. One of Wizards' writers addressed this concern in a very eye-opening article in which he demonstrates that many of the artists are so talented (both as artists, and with digital media), that they're able to produce artwork that is so beautiful and authentic-looking that you can't even tell whether it was done with conventional media, or with a computer.

And for an example of some stunning work in the digital realm, check out these incredible photo-realistic illustrations done completely in Adobe Illustrator.

I'm not worried. I think as tools improve (think Intuos) and artists embrace digital media, artwork will get better, not worse. And there will always be a segment of the crowd who sticks to the traditional media, just like there will always be photographers who refuse to give up film. Can you tell whether a photo was taken with film or digital? No. Can you tell if a painting was done with oil and canvas, or on a computer? This may surprise you, but the answer is no. Check out this link and see for yourself. Don't underestimate what these skilled artists are capable of.

What about the Open Game license? I was under the impression that while all the interesting flare and history (things good for a DM or setting up a campaign) were all owned content, the /rules/ themselves (That is, the things a searchable DB would be good for) were, as the name implies, "Open".
That is, while I can't give away detailed descriptions of the cities in Ebberon, it's perfectly okay for me to use one of any number of free, searchable online databases.

please correct me. I assume I'm missing something here.

as an aside, only one person in my group buys a book, we then pass it around.

I ran a game once where they had to cast "calm animal" on the paladin's mount because an avatar of "Lurue" showed up. Yes, she's that hot (to horses & ponies).

It's a conspiracy! See also Planet Half-Life and Wizard of the Coast.

Wizards of the coast announced today that they will start making a My little pony RPG. Coincidence? I think not.

You see a shadow fall over the sun. You turn, your whispy purple mane floating in the breeze, make a spot check. roll, roll, a 3 not so good, luckily the Roc is large enough so that you still spot it. roll for inititave. Ill be GMing the new MLP RPG with major influence from the book of vile darkness, and heavy use of libris mortis. http://www.wizards.com/

I've thought about getting together with some other "over the hill" D&D geeks on occasion to try table top gaming again, but there isn't enough time for most people to make it a regular scheduled item.

There are several very active nationwide/worldwide "living" campaigns in progress right now. You might be surprised how many members are old enough to be bringing their kids to play, too. You very likely can find a table in your area. One of the nice features of the "living" campaigns is that you can participate sporadically. You can do one weekend convention every month or two whether you have a group or not. If you find a local group, you could do one evening every week or two.

Start here:
http://wizards.com/default.asp?x=rpga/hq/newcomers

Perhaps the most populous campaign is here:
http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/Living_Greyhaw k/

Now we use DnD 3.5 (with a couple of house rules) and I have to say the mechanics are better in almost every way. The core rules are elegant and allow for almost infinite variations in character construction. We use the new rules to give structure to the story and to conduct our battles. We have a good time.

All that said, DnD 3.5 is a different game with a different flavor that some don't like as well. IMHO, the reason why some are unable to accept changes has far less to do with the old rules being superior, and a lot more to do with people being unable to tap into what made it fun for them in the first place, i.e. the problem isn't with the changes in the game, it's the changes within the player. They are getting old. They are getting crotchety. They remember everything as being more fun, so what came before must have been superior. That and a certain percentage of gamers are fan-boy asshats who must disparage everything not "true to the original vision". Not everyone is like that, but I am sure you can think of some gamers that you know that fit that description.

So, in summary: Try it. You might like it. It's just like in the old days: If you have a good group and a good DM, you will have a good time. And failing that, there are worse ways to spend a few afternoons on the weekend than hanging around with your buddies eating cheetos and drinking too much soda.

If you can't get together with your buddies anymore, try making some new ones. Check out the Living Greyhawk Campaign. Chances are there are gamedays forming nearby. The quality of the players is, on average, a lot higher then you will find in a pick-up game at your comic store, and the stories tie a huge number of players together. http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=lg/welcome

I don't really see your point. That's much better value than you get at the cinema (and the game is replayable), so what's the big deal?

That's a false comparision. Half-Life 2 Episode 1 isn't up against movies. It's up against other video games who can potentially offer a better dollars per fun-hour ratio. $5 per hour is pretty expensive for video games. Suggesting that it's all okay by comparing it to movies is as silly as suggesting that both movies (about $4/hour locally) and video games are grossly overpriced because I assuming a moderately regular play schedule I can enjoy myself for about $0.37/hour (Assuming a $90 investment, 2 year lifespan, playing about 30 times a year for 4 hours a game).

The reality is that different forms of entertainment are not interchangable. I've happily paid $125 for 3 hours of entertainment; that doesn't mean I'm willing to pay $400 for a game I expect to play for ten hours.

Even assuming we can compare such forms of entertainment, it's hardly a clear win. The proposed Half-Life pricing is roughly $5/hour. Locally I pay around $4/hour for first run movies. If I'm willing to catch a matinee, I can pay about $3/hour. Budget theatres after a few months: $1/hour. Rental: $1/hour, assuming one other person watches it with me. When I purchase a first person shooter, I'm hoping for about 15 hours of gameplay in exchange for $50; roughly $3.50/hour. At $5/hour Half-Life Episode 1 is expensive. However, if it's as good or better than HL2, I'm willing to consider it.

Eberron

Not all RPGs use the d20 system, so there are systems out there that don't share the same kind of license. It just happens that the d20 system is some of the most popular. The d20 system is also open, which means that there is no royalty paid to anyone, so I'm curious to the sarcasm expressed in your post.

Good plan.

Step 1: Find an artifact that converts {G} to alternating current.
Step 2: Use an infinite mana loop (e.g. this + this + this) to generate infinite {G}.
Step 3: Convert infinite {G} to a.c. as required.
Step 4: PROFIT!!!!!!!

Hang on, I filled in all the steps.. something must be wrong with this plan...

Good plan.

Step 1: Find an artifact that converts {G} to alternating current.
Step 2: Use an infinite mana loop (e.g. this + this + this) to generate infinite {G}.
Step 3: Convert infinite {G} to a.c. as required.
Step 4: PROFIT!!!!!!!

Hang on, I filled in all the steps.. something must be wrong with this plan...

Good plan.

Step 1: Find an artifact that converts {G} to alternating current.
Step 2: Use an infinite mana loop (e.g. this + this + this) to generate infinite {G}.
Step 3: Convert infinite {G} to a.c. as required.
Step 4: PROFIT!!!!!!!

Hang on, I filled in all the steps.. something must be wrong with this plan...

Idem for WotC's Star Wars Roleplaying Game, which has been belly-up for about 18 months now (or, "suspended indefinately", as it is referred to on WotC's Forums), all to the benefit of the "less hassle for continuity checking", "gotta catch'em all" miniatures game. Despite all this, I still find myself looking forward to seeing what Lucas'll cook up for his upcoming SW TV series, though. It'll better be really good, for their sake ... the fans might not be as - forgiving - as they once were ...

And, much like the Passion of the Christ, it shows glaring the massive double standard being applied. Violence, blood, and gore are bad and will scar and ruin our children... except for when it's an accurate reproduction of a Bible story. Magic, magical creatures, and fantasy worlds are evil and the devil trying to corrupt the children, unless it an accurate reproduction of a beloved Christian author's work.

The variation you speak of is called 'Risk 2210 A.D.' made by Avalon Hill - which i think was once Hasbro but now is WotC? I worked for a startup a few years ago and we would play or continue games of risk on our lunchbreak in the conf room [Before i started working there they were playing HalfLife]. After a while it became routine and we looked for a new game. I found this online and it became a new hit at lunch -- before we knew it we had 3 sets and multiple games going [and had to laminate the cards]. It was a fun updated version of risk and much more interesting than any of us thought it would be before we bought it. you can read more about it: http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=ah/prod/risk2 210 or view pictures: http://www.boardgamegeek.com/imagegallery.php3?gam eid=1829 . fun game

Whoops. Here is the same comment, but I fixed the formatting.

First off, ignore the trolls. Many gamers go against stereotype and some are just like "normal" people. For instance, I'm a doctor currently DMing a game, one of my players is a professor, and another is a police officer. We're all sucessful and married. Hardly people living in their parents basement. RPGs can be a great way to be social, make friends, and play a game that can stimulate your mind and imagination.

Your location may have a local game shop where they sell RPGs. They should have a bulletin board where people will be looking for gamers. Either contact an ad that looks interesting or put up your information. Make sure you notify the person (or put in your ad) that you are a beginner. Groups are starting up all the time, and IME getting into a game is never a problem.

Ignore any games going on at the game store. They can be good for beginners, and some game shops may have excellent games going on, but more likely they are pit stops for desperate gamers, and a breeding ground for bad DMs and players. You will likely be put off if your first impression is from one of these games.

Another option is to put your information on the wizards of the coast bulletin board: http://boards1.wizards.com/forumdisplay.php?f=347

If you go to a game and don't enjoy it, politely notify the DM, and find another. Not all games cater to all people, and while one group may be horrible for you, another may be a perfect match.

Have fun!

Why don't you just sign up for the B&N class?! That's what it's there for. There are lots of internet resources for finding other players, but a good place to start would be to join the RPGA. You could also inquire at the local game shop if they sell D&D stuff.

First off, ignore the trolls. Many gamers go against stereotype and some are just like "normal" people. For instance, I'm a doctor currently DMing a game, one of my players is a professor, and another is a police officer. We're all sucessful and married. Hardly people living in their parents basement. RPGs can be a great way to be social, make friends, and play a game that can stimulate your mind and imagination. Your location may have a local game shop where they sell RPGs. They should have a bulletin board where people will be looking for gamers. Either contact an ad that looks interesting or put up your information. Make sure you notify the person (or put in your ad) that you are a beginner. Groups are starting up all the time, and IME getting into a game is never a problem. Ignore any games going on at the game store. They can be good for beginners, and some game shops may have excellent games going on, but more likely they are pit stops for desperate gamers, and a breeding ground for bad DMs and players. You will likely be put off if your first impression is from one of these games. Another option is to put your information on the wizards of the coast bulletin board: http://boards1.wizards.com/forumdisplay.php?f=347 If you go to a game and don't enjoy it, politely notify the DM, and find another. Not all games cater to all people, and while one group may be horrible for you, another may be a perfect match. Have fun!

It's fairly easy to find the books used, it seems. At least most of them. So, it has not entirely gone away. As for an update, I believe that D20 modern and D20 future has conversions for Alternity. As an added bonus, Wizards has some documentation for converting creatures from Alternity to D20. You can reach it here: http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=d20modern/we/ 20031007a.

See those ads:

http://craphound.com/images/wowdanddad.jpg

and the ensuing website from Wizards...

http://www.wizards.com/gamenight/default.asp?dcmp= BAC-DNDGAMENIGHT

Here is an introduction for people that don't know (yet) the fantastic game called Diplomacy. It is available as a board game, a computer game , or you can just play it by email. Highly recommanded !

Check out the 'history' http://www.wizards.com/dnd/DnDArchives_History.asp

This is a really great site, though I sorta hoped that when I went there I would have seen this.

"Sharn, City of Towers."

In fact, Sharn has a whole book dedicated to it, its personalities and quirks, and its vertically stacked and striated neighborhoods.

And then up the Lightning Rail a ways, you'll reach Wroat, Starilaskur, and finally, the crown jewel of the continent of Khorvaire, the Mournland. That ought to be a trip.

The craft in the background is an Airship. There's some techno-magical elements in Eberron, where spellcasters forge powerful beings (usually elementals) into control devices for trains, ships, and airships.

Here is a better illustration of the craft:
http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/ebw_gallery/8288 1.jpg

In the game, the Holy Flame army uses the flying craft to get to Xen'drik, and move about the continent.

I thought of (and googled for) Robo Rally too when I saw the article, and it appears that they've reissued the game, which had been most lamentably out of print for 4 or 5 years.

Still costs around 50 bucks, but IMO definitely worth it.

http://www.wizards.com/roborally/

You'll be happy to know there is an online version of Magic: The Gathering at http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=magic/magicon line

I don't think it is worth it's cost. I've went through this book and opted out. At it's price point it certainly can't beat the effective utility of scores of existing netbooks with plot points, adventure hooks, and character concepts ready to roll with perhaps some tweaking for edition revision and suiting them to your own campaign. This book should be lower in priority than purchasing new monster manual books or even a campaign book that has much of the information the DMG II has but suited to a specific world. With the monster manual you can create endless possible organizations and societies and slowly introduce new elements by allowing monstrous races. It's ceiling is much higher than one offered by a DMG supplement. What I would find much more useful is better DM screens for groups of varied experience levels.

This is completely different from 3E -> 3.5E. My hesitation to convert was mostly monetary. Buying new books becomes very painful. For the money, an older book of plots and hooks are of greater value and utility. Besides, when you do digging like that, you have a greater chance of surprising a group of experienced players or bringing back feelings of nostalgia. A PC that reads the DMG II may not find the application of the things within the book as impactful as if one was to use old/net books that are distributed blisfully cheap-or-free. Besides... the internet is the best resource. WotC has a random tavern generator, there are a handful of random treasure/npc/town generators. I hope very much that this book doesn't do well. WotC is printing money every month. Accessory books for just about every class at $20+ price points seconds before pumping out new core books and rules is a slap in the face. This isn't a Pokemon card game that WotC is holding randsom, but it's fell into an enterprise structure that treats it like it is. New cards/rules/books = money for rehashing the same thing and enumerating possible ideas and elminating them from creativity. Thanks for CRAFTING a Ninja prestige class for a Medieval-fantasy game. I couldn't have possibly done it myself :|.

I've been a long time game geek from the pen and pencil D&D days, what has been most challenging for me is to find games computer and non-computer that I can play with my 12 year old daughter. She is relatively innocent still, so stuff like Doom 3 and Half-Life were relegated to after she went to sleep. I played EQ for four years and finally burnt out on the same old pull-and-kill every night.

So what follows here are the games we've found that I can enjoy with her and are pretty much age appropriate and a lot of fun.

1. Neverwinter Nights - yeah, it's graphics are not state of the art, but what it lacks in graphics it makes up for in replayability, story, game play and ability to customize and create your own adventures. We just finished Hordes of the Underdark and it was a real challenge and a heck of a lot of fun. She loves it. And the ability to play any of the literally 100's of user created modules for free just makes it that much easier on my wallet. She begs me to play most nights and their is a content control to lower the violence level. We both love this one and it doesn't take a massive computer to run. Just be aware that each computer you play on (if doing multiplayer) will require a copy with a license key.

2. Heroes of Might and Magic 3 w/ In The Wake of the Gods free expansion (WOG)

HOMM3 was a great game even before the user created WOG expansion. After 3DO went under, some users out there took the best parts of Heroes 4 and some of their own ideas and created an expansion that gives you a ton of new options and content. If you liked it before, get the WOG download and check out the changes - new monsters, demolish buildings, build new towns, give magic items to your hero's champion, etc. Here's a link to the WOG site - http://www.strategyplanet.com/homm/wog/wog.shtml

3. Magic the Gathering Online (and off)

Again not a great graphics game, but the game play is always awesome and the online version enforces the rules. That eliminates a lot of the quibbling that goes on in real life Magic games. The only drawback here is cost - you have to pay for your online boosters. There is a good aftermarket, however, on Ebay and other sites where you can sell your entire collection or just buy that one card you need to get your deck tuned up. We like playing in real life too as I've been playing 10 years and have lots of cards laying around. Give it a try - free on the demo site. http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=magic/magicon line

4. Neopets

She loves the Neopets site and I have to admit that some of the games are fun for a while. It keeps her interested and I would recommend it for any kid. My sister-in-law spends hours on the site. There is a reason that MTV bought it - you don't want to leave because there is so much to do there. Oh, and it's totally free. www.neopets.com

5. MAME

We've got an old 300MHz box setup with an X-Arcade dual joystick. Nothing like firing up a game of Galaga or Black Tiger. My daughter loves discovering those old games and trying to beat them. Dig out that old PC in your basement, what are you waiting for.

Non-Computer Game All Stars

1. Puerto Rico

This board game has great replayability as every game ends up different. It sounds cheesy trying to become the governor of a little island by growing and selling coffee, sugar, indigo and corn, but the game revolves around tough decision making and its weird turn based system is pretty cool once you get used to it. An all-time favorite at our house.

2. Talisman

If you can find it, pick this one up. Games Workshop made this and a number of expansions some years ago and it went out of print for a long time. The originals sell for huge amounts on Ebay, but I found a recent reprint at a local game store a few months ago for $75. Great g

See http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=products/eber ron/864100000, http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=products/eber ron/864300000, and http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=products/eber ron/177300000.

But I don't think that's the reason why. Disclaimer before I continue: I've nowhere near as much experience with Dragonlance as I do with the Realms-so some of these factors might not be applicable to Dragonlance.

First off, geography. Doing a FR MMORPG is a huge task, because you have to cover all of Faerun. Which you probably can't. So you have to set borders. WHERE? The Realms does not lend itself to setting borders on the areas you're playing in, and that's fine. The only place you could use without setting arbitrary borders would be the Dalelands, and that has its own problems(hugely detailed, too few cities, no metropolises, too undiverse a monster/enemy population). If you try and take on all of Faerun, you actually run into the same problem-you'd need to set arbitrary boundaries(sure, the Spine of the World's to the north, but how about the Endless Wastes to the east? Those are past the Sunset Mountains, yes, but you could easily get around them by going to the north of Lake Ashane and heading along the Golden Way).

Additionally, any MMORPG has to set itself from its competitors. Ignoring the system/rules options the developers implement, you face the fact that D&D is so old. It's especially apparent in the Realms, which is so old and so influential that a lot of Realms content(which has uniquely Realmsian twists and aspects near-always) has been ripped off and put in other games over the years(minus the uniquely Realmsian aspects and twists, of course). An MMORPG wouldn't preserve those aspects-and as such, it would seem tired and worn out to your average MMORPG player,even with the D&D Online name.

What's Eberron's responses to these?

1. Set it on Xen'Drik. Yeah, it's a continent, but not too large of one-and you can set boundaries wherever you like, it's that undetailed.

2. Be Eberron-infused with new concepts and a slightly different theme from what's out there-seem different from the rest of the pack.

3. (No, you didn't miss a paragraph above) Eberron is new. Eberron is undetailed. As such, Eberron can give the developers the freedom they need to develop their setting as they want to-they don't have to be constrained(see how well SWG did with that)

And of course they gain interest in their new setting-but I don't think that's it.

See http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=products/eber ron/864100000, http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=products/eber ron/864300000, and http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=products/eber ron/177300000.

But I don't think that's the reason why. Disclaimer before I continue: I've nowhere near as much experience with Dragonlance as I do with the Realms-so some of these factors might not be applicable to Dragonlance.

First off, geography. Doing a FR MMORPG is a huge task, because you have to cover all of Faerun. Which you probably can't. So you have to set borders. WHERE? The Realms does not lend itself to setting borders on the areas you're playing in, and that's fine. The only place you could use without setting arbitrary borders would be the Dalelands, and that has its own problems(hugely detailed, too few cities, no metropolises, too undiverse a monster/enemy population). If you try and take on all of Faerun, you actually run into the same problem-you'd need to set arbitrary boundaries(sure, the Spine of the World's to the north, but how about the Endless Wastes to the east? Those are past the Sunset Mountains, yes, but you could easily get around them by going to the north of Lake Ashane and heading along the Golden Way).

Additionally, any MMORPG has to set itself from its competitors. Ignoring the system/rules options the developers implement, you face the fact that D&D is so old. It's especially apparent in the Realms, which is so old and so influential that a lot of Realms content(which has uniquely Realmsian twists and aspects near-always) has been ripped off and put in other games over the years(minus the uniquely Realmsian aspects and twists, of course). An MMORPG wouldn't preserve those aspects-and as such, it would seem tired and worn out to your average MMORPG player,even with the D&D Online name.

What's Eberron's responses to these?

1. Set it on Xen'Drik. Yeah, it's a continent, but not too large of one-and you can set boundaries wherever you like, it's that undetailed.

2. Be Eberron-infused with new concepts and a slightly different theme from what's out there-seem different from the rest of the pack.

3. (No, you didn't miss a paragraph above) Eberron is new. Eberron is undetailed. As such, Eberron can give the developers the freedom they need to develop their setting as they want to-they don't have to be constrained(see how well SWG did with that)

And of course they gain interest in their new setting-but I don't think that's it.

See http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=products/eber ron/864100000, http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=products/eber ron/864300000, and http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=products/eber ron/177300000.

But I don't think that's the reason why. Disclaimer before I continue: I've nowhere near as much experience with Dragonlance as I do with the Realms-so some of these factors might not be applicable to Dragonlance.

First off, geography. Doing a FR MMORPG is a huge task, because you have to cover all of Faerun. Which you probably can't. So you have to set borders. WHERE? The Realms does not lend itself to setting borders on the areas you're playing in, and that's fine. The only place you could use without setting arbitrary borders would be the Dalelands, and that has its own problems(hugely detailed, too few cities, no metropolises, too undiverse a monster/enemy population). If you try and take on all of Faerun, you actually run into the same problem-you'd need to set arbitrary boundaries(sure, the Spine of the World's to the north, but how about the Endless Wastes to the east? Those are past the Sunset Mountains, yes, but you could easily get around them by going to the north of Lake Ashane and heading along the Golden Way).

Additionally, any MMORPG has to set itself from its competitors. Ignoring the system/rules options the developers implement, you face the fact that D&D is so old. It's especially apparent in the Realms, which is so old and so influential that a lot of Realms content(which has uniquely Realmsian twists and aspects near-always) has been ripped off and put in other games over the years(minus the uniquely Realmsian aspects and twists, of course). An MMORPG wouldn't preserve those aspects-and as such, it would seem tired and worn out to your average MMORPG player,even with the D&D Online name.

What's Eberron's responses to these?

1. Set it on Xen'Drik. Yeah, it's a continent, but not too large of one-and you can set boundaries wherever you like, it's that undetailed.

2. Be Eberron-infused with new concepts and a slightly different theme from what's out there-seem different from the rest of the pack.

3. (No, you didn't miss a paragraph above) Eberron is new. Eberron is undetailed. As such, Eberron can give the developers the freedom they need to develop their setting as they want to-they don't have to be constrained(see how well SWG did with that)

And of course they gain interest in their new setting-but I don't think that's it.

1|= y()u (4|\| r3@d 7#][5, y0|_| /\r3 @ IVI0/\/$+3|2 &33|

Source: Magical Hacker

Also, 1f u c4n r34d +h1$, u r3411y n33d +0 g37 141d

A short history of D&D can be found here

And the official home page for D&D can be found here

A short history of D&D can be found here

And the official home page for D&D can be found here

Well, another incredibly great game is DnD(dungeons and dragons) and/or D20 modern. There are no limitations as to how you want to play it. Whats even better is that you can find all the information you need at http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=d20/article/s rd35 and basically anywhere else on the WoTC website. Also, www.enworld.org is a very useful forum for additional info/questions.

Im would recommend another Wizards product, namely Betrayal at House on the Hill.

http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=ah/prod/betra yalhouse

You can think of it as "The Un-Official Scooby-Doo" game. The premise is that the players are exploring a haunted house. About halfway through the game, one of the players is randomly determined to be the traitor who now usually becomes the adversary. I say usually because there are 40 different betrayal scenarios based on which items have been discovered, and where they were discovered. Each game runs about 45-60 mins, and because of the multiple scenarios, you can play this game all night.

Agreed.

Maybe we need to fork off SA for trolls.

That or I need to carry my +3 flaming troll bane long sword more often.

According to their press release Robo Rally is being reprinted by Avalon Hill/Hasbro in July.

Attack takes everything I like about Axis and Allies (different units with offensive/defensive capabilities, an economic system, naval combat) with everything I like about Risk (picking your own territory and more or less random unit placement for a less predictable tactics and strategy) and manages to avoid most of the bad stuff from both. It can be found at Toys R Us currently for about $20, or you can order it from http://eaglegames.net/ for $30.

Best of all, if you like the basic game, which contains all the economic cards, land units, cards representing naval units, and a board representing the western hemisphere of the world, you can buy an expansion. The expansion contains plastic naval units with more complex combat rules, a political system (your governments can be fascists, communist, monarcy, or democracy, with different bonuses and strengths for each), and a board representing the other half of the world. The basic game is good for six players and three to six hours of play, the full game can support 10-12 for some all-day sessions.

The games rules are fairly easy to learn in one go, although the implications as far as tactics go take a while to sink in. The units and board look great, and are large and detailed. The game single handedly reawakened my group's interest in the genre, bridging the gap between beer and pretzels and more serious wargaming. (I don't want to mislead the grognards, its still pretty beer and pretzels, but if all you've played is Risk and A&A, it can stretch you a bit.)

Speaking of Risk, I also like the new Risk 2210. Its classic Risk, but with "hero" units that can roll eight sided die against the standard six, sea and moon bases to conquer, some battle and diplomacy cards (somewhat similar to Castle Risk), and nuclear devastation tokens that can completely alter the board from game to game. Its a pretty fun diversion for Risk fans.

You said board or table top games. So how about Dungeons And Dragons

Been playing it off and on for 13 years and still love it.

See here. To save you the time, here's a list of stuff I found from that story, games that sounded interesting or worth checking out.

First, I decided I should really get into Go. Some links from that Slashdot story: here, The Second Book of Go here, here, here, here, and here.

Other games:
Apples to Apples - got this for my cousin, they liked it.
Settlers of Catan - got this for myself, very nice game, try a local hobby shop or here or try Amazon.com

Others: Puerto Rico (Similar to Settlers of Catan), Lord of the Rings board game was mentioned, Kill Dr. Lucky, Deadwood, Give me the Brain, Lightspeed Games, Fluxx is fun, very random and quirky.

There's more! Mind Trap
Munchkin , Heroscape, Ticket to Ride, Mystery of the Abbey, Memoir '44, Queen's Necklace at Days of Wonder, Bang!, Betrayal at House on the Hill, Articulate
Killer Bunnies (and Quest for the Magic Carrot), Illuminati , Acquire .

Some other reviews/top game lists here:
here
here
here

Happy gaming!

See here. To save you the time, here's a list of stuff I found from that story, games that sounded interesting or worth checking out.

First, I decided I should really get into Go. Some links from that Slashdot story: here, The Second Book of Go here, here, here, here, and here.

Other games:
Apples to Apples - got this for my cousin, they liked it.
Settlers of Catan - got this for myself, very nice game, try a local hobby shop or here or try Amazon.com

Others: Puerto Rico (Similar to Settlers of Catan), Lord of the Rings board game was mentioned, Kill Dr. Lucky, Deadwood, Give me the Brain, Lightspeed Games, Fluxx is fun, very random and quirky.

There's more! Mind Trap
Munchkin , Heroscape, Ticket to Ride, Mystery of the Abbey, Memoir '44, Queen's Necklace at Days of Wonder, Bang!, Betrayal at House on the Hill, Articulate
Killer Bunnies (and Quest for the Magic Carrot), Illuminati , Acquire .

Some other reviews/top game lists here:
here
here
here

Happy gaming!

Check out Acquire. Very simple game to learn that isn't so simple to win. Description: In the beginning, the companies are small. But they grow. And merge. And reform. And merge again. Those who buy the right stocks and merge the right companies thrive. Those that don't, fall behind. This classic business game has never looked better. An all plastic board with plastic tiles that fit snugly to it add a three dimensional quality that brings the game to life. Now corporations are capped with skyscrapper roofs that create a mini skyline. The companies have been renamed to reflect a 21st century economy but no rules have changed. The game can be learned in minutes. Which tile to play, which company to invest in, and when to merge two companies is a skill that takes many games to master.

I recommend any game by Avalon Hill or Steve Jackson Games.

Illuminati is a favorite.

Diplomacy is a blast! It's like Risk, but without the ramdomness of dice. This game is ALL about making/breaking alliances.

I used to really like a game Avalon Hill used to make called Titan. They don't make it anymore though and it's hard to find now.

Star Fleet Battlesis always a fun game if your up for reading binders upon binders of rules. I never bothered learning any other rules than for the Starfleet vessels though.

I recommend any game by Avalon Hill or Steve Jackson Games.

Illuminati is a favorite.

Diplomacy is a blast! It's like Risk, but without the ramdomness of dice. This game is ALL about making/breaking alliances.

I used to really like a game Avalon Hill used to make called Titan. They don't make it anymore though and it's hard to find now.

Star Fleet Battlesis always a fun game if your up for reading binders upon binders of rules. I never bothered learning any other rules than for the Starfleet vessels though.