Slashdot Mirror
Sklyarov Indicted
Nutcase was the first to write with news from the AP that "Dmitry Sklyarov, 27 and ElComSoft Co. Ltd. of Moscow were charged with five counts of copyright violations for writing a program that lets users of Adobe Systems' eBook Reader get around copyright protections imposed by electronic-book publishers." Here's a link to the AP story at the Washington Post. Here is the story at Salon as well. Update: 08/29 01:57 AM GMT by T : Here's the EFF's release on the indictment, too -- including information about where to go if you'd like to demonstrate your reaction publicly.
Wouldn't it have been nice if ebook technology had been around when Ben Franklin instituted the first Libraries in the U.S.? Franklin could have been indited too!
You indicted Sklyarov!
How the hell can Elcomsoft be indicted for breaking a U.S. copyright law when that firm is in RUSSIA!?
The indictment alleges that the programmer and the company conspired for "commercial advantage and private financial gain."
We should be hanging everyone who is guilty of these things.
I smell a wumpus! [S]hoot or [M]ove ->
This guarantees it will go to court proper... if he is convicted, that will be trouble... but if he isn't, its a bigger victory.
An innocent verdict is a stronger precident than a guilty one, even if we have to trade one-for-one...
"ElcomSoft was culpable because it sold the program for $99 in the United States through an online payment service based in Issaquah, Wash., and with a Web site hosted in Chicago."
...Don't host in the states. Rackspace Europe? Verio AsiaPacific?
Dave
I write a blog now, you should be afraid.
5 criminal charges against him!? I see about 3: trafficing software that violates DMCA, selling software that violates DMCA (which is his company, not him). Ok, so it's two. Little help please?
Has the court posted the pdfs of today's proceedings anywhere?
The One Rule Of Chess You'll Ever Need: Don't play someone who carries a kit in their bookbag.
Because you're an anonymous coward, maybe?
God help you if you did.
/ice.
Where's my checkbook?
It's time to make anothe donation to the EFF.
Seriously, each and every one of us should make a small donation to the EFF so we can fight this miscarriage of justice. We don't have to put up with bad laws! Just because Congress has been bought and paid for by the members of the MPAA, the RIAA, and the BSA doesn't mean we have to bend over and take it.
This DMCA crap has got to be stopped.
Besides, the EFF raid hats are really cool.
My word processor was written by Stanford Professor Donald Knuth. Who wrote yours?
We must send a strong signal that we are not going to let our freedoms trampled on. Adobe started this as a test of the vialibility of the DMCA. Then, to get on the public's good side, they backed out. Too late! It's the thought that counts. They must pay the consequences. If we do nothing, the DMCA will stay on the books.
While I support the protection of copyrights, the way you handled this Adobe was unforgiveable. Well it just so happens I work for 2 colleges as a IT technician and several hundred people ask me advice on hardware and software, including teachers. I regret to inform you Adobe, I will be turning away as many people from buying your products and giving you revenue as I possibly can. Oh this does not including the several thousand every year I help on irc resolve hardware and software issues and many times these people also ask me for hardware and software advice.
Can you see a pattern here Adobe?
It's called use every legal means possible to deny you revenue.
I suggest other IT techs do the same.
Perhaps Slashdot should provide a link listing many non-Adobe replacments for Adobe products.
jason.salopek@hushmail.com
jason.salopek@usa.net
How many of us would, say, create a company whose purpose it was to distribute Free Tibet materials, travel to China, give a speech on freeing Tibet, and then be surprised when we got arrested?
This is probably a bad analogy to be using when I'm taking the side of the US in this, but each country has a right to autonomy. Unless you're given diplomatic immunity, you abide by the laws of the country you're currently in. If doing something in one country is illegal in another country, you may be tried & prosecuted when you try to enter said country (drug & crime lords or terrorists who enter the US but don't engage in criminal activities while here)
Just because you think its a bad law doesn't give you the right to ignore it. I acknowledge civil diobedience as a form of protest, and part of that is paying the penalty, which Sklyarov is currently doing.
But shoulda, woulda, coulda, the fact is he was indicted and could spend 5 years in jail if convicted. What does this say for the future? If Dimitry is convicted I don't think we realize the amount of trouble a wide range of people could be in. This case has far reaching implications in many areas including cryptography, DVD, music (digital and CD), who knows even Samba and Wine could be effected depending on what some people consider to be a proprietary protection system.
Be afraid, and be sure not to lose this one.
I can only imagine the US would be screaming bloody murder about this happening to one of its citizens: anyone recall the fracas that ensued when russian officials imprisoned a US-citizen student on bogus drug charges? Not that it would really get anything done (what with Dubya in office with his lovely fsck-all attitude towards other nations) but I would love to see Russia give us a little diplomatic hell for screwing with one of their own.
... not in here, pal, this is a mercedes...
Now let's all concentrate on getting the guy home to his wife and kids, and not use him to further our political ends. If someone volunteers to be a test case for the FSF or others, that's fine; he did not, and is a unwitting victim of our police state.
Peace, or Not?
company conspired for "commercial advantage and private financial gain."
Isn't this the whole point of running a company? God forbid if it becomes illegal to seek commercial advantage or private financial gain...
Then again, the article might have meant to say "illegally conspired..."
this story is really alot more complicated and shady than it appears (i think msnbc has the scoop).
is there no room for differing opinions on slashdot?
Shit.
Whether or not we agree with the laws, there is a big difference between the two morals.
No one cares any more.
and nonviolent protests are scheduled in Moscow (Russia),
London (England), Boston, San Francisco, Los Angeles,
and Black Rock City, Nevada.
Gee whiz, they don't mean that *other* Moscow or London, Ontario? Whew, I'm glad for that clarification.
I feel a bit dirty bashing the EFF... I love those boys. Just happens to be one of those pet peeves of mine.
Wah!
But to see why, you have to first know the reason the DMCA exists to begin with. I talk about that here.
Now, it's important to realize that the corporations behind the DMCA want to use it as a terror weapon. How else can you prevent people from creating and trafficking in copyright circumvention devices (software or otherwise)? A law which nobody behaves is a useless law. But a terror weapon isn't effective if people don't believe you'll use it.
If the prosecution were to drop this case, it would make it clear that the DMCA is a law that the government isn't willing to enforce (after all, if they're not going to enforce it against a foreign national, what chance is there that they'll enforce it against a U.S. citizen?).
So they'll take this case as far as the defense is willing to go, hoping that the defense runs out of resources or time before this gets to the Supreme Court.
And trust me, the government will put a lot of money and resources into this case. They want to get and keep a conviction as long as possible, because that's what the government's masters (the corporations) want. so expect to see this case drag on for years, if not decades.
Use 'slashdot stuff' in the subject line in any email you send me if you want to get past the spam filter.
we all figured on this happening, right? now, if he's *convicted*, that'll suck.
- A.P.
"Remember when the U.S. had a drug problem, and then we declared a War On Drugs, and now you can't buy drugs anymore?"
This make my blood curdle. This man has a wife and two children. He is a guest of the United States of America. And he has been put in jail to await prosecutions for what?! - talking to a group of computer professionals about the weaknesses inherent to particular encryption technologies!
The "freedom" we love to chatter about is not merely an abstraction, an interesting conversation at a summer BBQ, a fly in the ointment of our libertarian campaigns. Freedom is real. Dmitry's children can't see their father. He's been branded a criminal. This is wrong, wrong, wrong.
Give Dmitry freedom! Give him freedom in a country founded on the principle of freedom!
If Dmitry is not freed, I propose that everyone with the capability of shutting down an email server do so upon his conviction.
--Lawrence Lessig for Congress!
Ho! Ho! Looks like Corel are celebrating GNU/Linux's 10th birthday in their own "style"
MEEPT!!
Let's burn Adobe till the roots.... piss on the American Flag, nuke Microsoft !!!
So some damn Russkie gets nabbed. BFD.
Brian Moyles is a tard.
Why, in this country of supposed freedom, do we allow companies to control not only specific markets, (in the case of Micro$oft monopoly) but also allow them to lobby towards laws that take away freedoms, such as freedom of speech.
I know that ElComSoft Co. Ltd made mistakes when they started selling a program designed to defeat a specific type of encryption. I feel that this is wrong. Unfortunately, arresting a programer for giving a speech about how he broke the encryption is hogwash as well. (did I really say hogwash...)
This country (the USA) was founded upon ideals that one man can speak his mind, and express himself in whatever way that he chooses, as so long as it doesn't detriment others. (thus, yelling "fire" in a theater is wrong) I see no reason why showing an encryption to be faulty and how to circumvent it AS A ACADEMIC STUDY wrong. As I said before, I think that the company was at fault, but can the "oh so mighty" hand of the US touch a company in Russia? Nope, we can't, at least legally anyway. So the goverment uses a poorly worded law to push the corporate views on American people. What will be next? Will I be arrested because I point out a security hole in Microsoft's hotmail site? No, but if I start selling a product that will allow it's user's to read other's email, I can and I should be arrested. I don't believe that Sklyarov ownes this company, he is just a programmer.
This person has been arrested for violation of the DMCA. I don't believe in the DMCA, and unfortunately, I cannot make my congressman or senator understand why. (The breaking of encryption is over their heads, and copyrights and patents lasting forever is very vague to them as well.) They are too pressured my lobbyists throwing bags of money at them to listen to something that would blackball them in the lobbyists eyes. So what happens? More rights are taken away from all Americans, and 85% or more of Americans don't know of don't care.
It is a sad state.
Ben Franklin ( I think ) said that "the price of freedom is eternal vigilance." But Americans have become to apathetic to even care about there government, much less the actions that the government has been taking. And because of this more and more skewed laws have worked there way in the the US Code. Sadly, today, they could arrest almost anyone with the inordinate amount of laws on the books. They chose here and now to arrest Mr. Sklyarov. I hope that he wins, and I hope that the court system invalidates this very askew law. It would help put more freedom back into the individuals hand, and away from the greedy corporate entity.
Blah Blah Blah.
The indictment said ElcomSoft was culpable because it sold the program for $99 in the United States through an online payment service based in Issaquah, Wash., and with a Web site hosted in Chicago.
What his company did was against the law. He was part of it. If you plan on doing commerce in a country you should know their laws and abide by them or prepare to pay the consequences.
I am not saying by any means that this is a fair and just law, but it is law. Do I hope he goes to jail? No. I hope he wins and the DMCA is thrown away like the garbage it is. Just don't think because you don't think a law is right or just means you can go around breaking it as long as you please. This is the way the justice system is designed.
The software doesn't "get around copyright protections." Copyright is a legal protection, the software merely allows you to get around copy protections. Does anyone else think the difference is important?
Sometimes I feel like I'm living in a world that doesn't want to get smarter, doesn't want to press harder for knowledge, and doesn't want to know the truth about itself.
I feel like I'm in a different era of living where government, the leaders and etc are suppressing our own cravings to know more and defy what 'the law' tells us is "correct".
Oh well, it's nothink an AK47 and a Rooftop can't fix--right?
Go see ramdac
This is sad, real sad. As an American, this is embarassing. I can't make it to any the protests/demonstrations. Is there anything a single person can do to make a difference in this area?
According to this article from the NY Times, the great e-book revolution has failed to materialize. Based upon the fact that very few people actually use e-books, the real damages in the Sklykarov case are minimal.
Frylock: That's not a toy!
Master Shake: You say that about everything you own. You should own toys. They're fun.
This may be a bit picky and offtopic, but it irked me somewhat to see the Electronic Frontier Foundation called teh Electronic Freedom Foundation.
Why is this moist???
Why does the official EFF press release read:
Even if one were to ignore the serious legal questions involving the DMCA, this case hardly cries out for criminal prosecution.
while the AP release reads:
Even if one were to ignore the serious legal questions involving the (copyright protections), this case hardly cries out for criminal prosecution.
Reader Joe Six-Pack may be curious enough to poke around for information regarding DMCA, but probably gets a glazed expression when presented with the phrase "copyright protection". What the hell kind of biased media coverage is this?
'Cause anyone using it is going to be the target of Russian and other European virus authors from now 'till doomsday. And these babies are going to be some of the nastiest ever seen. Needless to say XP along with .nyet is a sitting duck.
"A United States grand jury this afternoon indicted Russian company Elcomsoft along with previously jailed programmer Dmitry Sklyarov on charges of trafficking and conspiracy to traffic in a copyright circumvention device." ...
...
..., that's trafficking.
So
VCR's, Cameras, pens, paper, CR-R's,
Hell, what if you hear someone read out of a book, and remember it ?
And what about the people that just move these things around
Better lock us all away huh ?
--- There isn't any problem that can't be solved by a small, low yield nuclear device, is there??
Has anyone here ever been to one of these protests? I attended an EFF protest of the DMCA in Pittsburgh a few weeks ago. It was scheduled for noon, but I was busy then, so I showed up around 2:30 pm. Nobody was there. No sign of a protest, no signs, nada. Later a friend of mine who was there said they left around 2, because they were tired. That's perhaps the sorriest excuse for a protest I've ever heard. I'm sure they left a lasting impression on society.
-bugg
5 years for the first and 10 years after. So that's 5+4(10) = 45 years. 45 + 27 = 72. Dmitry will be 72 by the time he gets out of prison. That it *IF* he gets out at all. By that time his ass will make the goatse.cx guy's stretched ass look like a pinhole.
At least get him for something that has no socially redeemable qualities. Tools for stealing eBooks can kind of be justified (my tottering, old, blind grandmother who runs QDOS on an Abacus IIe needs to print the latest drivel from Stephen King onto braile tapes), but their spamware (just take a look at elcomsoft's site) is beneath contempt.
Young man,
there's no need to feel down
Because your plane
back home can't get off the ground
I said young man,
Get comfy in your new town
There's no need to be unhappy.
Young man,
There's no place you can go
I said young man,
Until you cough up some dough
You will stay here
until you've served all your time
For your insignificant crime.
It's fun to stay in the U S of A,
Because of that old grand D M C A
For cracking DVD's,
Or an e-book or three,
You'll get jailed for eterniteeeee...
It's fun to stay in the U S of A
Because of that old grand D M C A
For proving to the world
That our encryption's a toy
You'll get jailed with all the boyyyyyyys...
--------
Bleah! Heh heh heh... BLEAH BLEAH!!! Ha ha ha ha...
If they aren't, why the hell aren't they?!!? It was Skylarov under their employ writing the program. So you're telling me that if I write a program for my company that violates some stupid law in some other country, I cannot ever hope to go to that country under fear of prosecution?
If he did it solely and entirely to make a financial gain, then sure I can see this case having a point. But without that, it's entirely pointless.
But luckily, if this case goes to a jury (which I believe that with penalties like that it must go to a jury) they will never convict. There is no way that any group of 12 people could unanimously send a father to prison for 5 years because he wrote a program for his employer that, really, does jack all. How many e-books are there? What does this program really affect ??? This guy has done practically nothing. It's like arresting me for dropping a piece of paper out of my pocket and sticking me in prison for 5 years for "defacing public property" or something stupid like that. This is overkill to the nth degree.
Sorry, but this just gets me all wound up again.
Mind you, it was no surprise that they indicted. There was no way that they were not going to indict, but lets hope to God that this insanity stops before it gets to court, and that if it does get that far that they won't convict. Maybe then I'll still believe that the USA has at least a shred of hope...
If God gave us curiosity
I have never seen anything to date that said Sklyarov himself was involved with the Ebook decoder project. Just being with a company that did illegal things is not illegal in itself; otherwise we would arrest all their janitors and secretaries.
Even if he did work on the Ebook project, he could claim that he did not knowingly do anything wrong since (1) it was not illegal work in Russia and (2) it work done solely for a Russian company. While claiming ignorance of the law is no excuse, I don't see how a jury could convict him directly given these facts.
That being said, shouldn't the United States be going after the company's officers (CEO, etc.), and not Sklyarov?
Sklyarov, you've got my support. RATM.
Thank you, drive through.
I'll start baking the cakes with the steel files in the center, you start manufacturing the government-friendly wake up plan (read: b*mb).
If the government is to be an example, we ought to detonate some US dignitaries (read: politicians), or at least torture their families.
Stop and tell me you don't understand before you go and mod this as troll.
Fighting in the courts and the streets just isn't good enough. We need some power at the legislative level. If a significant percentage of U.S. I.T. workers struck, that could be a devastating blow to the economy. We need to plan and organize such a strike, and then give the EFF the power to call it. See if they can get somewhere in congress with a real threat behind them.
"Hey hon, they just indicted Skylarov..." (stroking USA off of vacation list).
WTF? He's Russian, the company is Russian, the software is legal in Russia (and should be everywhere).
I'm completely baffled as to how things like happen. You Americans need a serious sit-down with your so-called lawmakers and congressman. Or even better, have another freakin' tea party.
Later
-Ben (wandering to bed with thoughts of 'Though Police' and 'Big Brother')
This is truly a dark day for criminals everywhere. I hope those jerks that actually obey laws are feeling proud of themselves today. :(
Sorta OT, but I must say: I apologize to the rest of the freedom-loving world for our court, legislative, and executive system (regardless of who-signed-the-DMCA). This is truly sickening. I can only hope that enough Americans can get up off their butts and support some sort of change in the law. This, however, is doubtful. Due to the growing apathy in both the voting population of the US and of her elected officials, I have developed into qute the fatalist -- however a deep, dark corner of me still has hope.
As someone above suggested, "where is my checkbook -- time to donate to the EFF."
I'm sure "SlashdotMedia" will improve on all the wonders that Dice Holdings blessed us all with
I hate to say this, but the grand jury indictment doesnt suprise me one bit. As much as we hate it, the DMCA is the law. And there's plenty of evidence that Dmitry violated the DMCA. Right now the most important thing is to get Dmitry home to his family right now. If that sets a precedent for the DMCA, that's great, but let's not make Dmitry a martyr at his own expense (yes I realize that's an oxymoron). The DMCA can be challenged later, probably in the Supreme Court. Unfortunatly, this means that there will have to be more and more Sklyarov/Felton/2600-esque cases untill the DMCA is gone for good.
The washington post says "...Sklyarov could face a $250,000 fine, and the company could be fined $500,000 if convicted. ...".
The EFF says "Sklyarov -- who is out of custody on $50,000 bail -- could face a prison term of up to twenty-five years and a US $2,250,000 fine. As a corporation, Elcomsoft faces a potential US 2,500,000 fine."
Who is right?
:wq
5 counts... 5 for the first 10 for the rest. Nope, kids won't be seeing daddy until he is 72 and that's if they see him at all. and they'll probably toss him in solitary and chain him to a bed like Mitnick.
Hey, show up on time. Kind of hard to get a group organized if everyone plans on showing up whenever it's convenient.
This person has basically said is is guilty of the crime so why shouldn't he be convicted? He admitted to creating the hacking software and even gave a presentation on his illegal hacking activity at a convention full of criminal hackers. Actually the FBI was quite restrained. They could have arrested all those hackers at the conference for teaching hacking but they didn't. They only went after the hacker that had the worst hacking violation of any of them. Do programmers really want to be associated with hackers who try to shut down the internet and delete everyones data with Melissa virii
How about helping out WITHOUT going to cali?
But I sincerely hope that the EFF will use the power of public support to push the feds for a plea bargain with no jail time, or just deportation maybe. I'm not a lawyer, and I definitely despise the DMCA and support Dimitry, but with the site that was hosted in the US and the fact that Elcomsoft was profiting from this, I don't think that this is a winnable case. Ethics and common sense are on our side, and I believe the Felten case is very strong, but I believe Dimitry would be convicted simply because a judge's reaction will go something like 'right or wrong, the law is the law.' Or maybe I've just been watching too much Law & Order.
The indictment alleges that the programmer and the company conspired for "commercial advantage and private financial gain."
So this is now a crime? When will we see Microsoft hauled in on this charge then? Or Adobe? Or any for-profit entity for that matter?
By the way, the original subject of this post was "This is illegal?!!", but I had to change it because of the "postersubj compression filter". Note to CmdrTaco et al: Your dumbass lameness filters are broken. They don't stop trolls and ASCII art, and they annoy legitimate posters. Either fix them or get rid of them. Or at least put a meaningful error message in there. "Postersubj compression filter" doesn't yield much of a clue as to what's wrong unless one wants to slog through the morass of Slashcode to find out what triggered the message. And I don't.
And the brethren went away edified.
At any rate, I'm considering initiating a personal/cororate boycott of Adobe products, including PDF. I've fought long and hard to replace word documention with PDF (word isn't suited for technical docs anyway). Is there a good replacement for PDF? PostScript? Before anyone shouts something wierd like TeX or DVI; be serious, that may work in a lab or research group, but not for coporate america.
there are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots
Whatever happened to mobbing the capital, capturing your leaders, and publically separating their heads from their bodies?
What? That's not civil? We're beyond that?
Well, *I* am, and you might be, but *they* surely aren't. And you don't use a college vocabulary while talking to a 2-year-old, now do you? Catch my drift?
Protesting won't help. Let's paint the words 'DMCA' on a UHaul and fill it with Africanized Honey Bees and leave it in Virginia.
Consider too that many of the best minds are not from America, and this sort of bullshit will easily dissuade them from ever touching on American soil.
The DCMA and disgustingly similar concepts are going to box the United States in, and slowly but utterly stagnate it.
Summary:
Prosecution for Speaking (thought police) =
Fewer bright citizens immigrating (or just plain aiding) for fear of prosecution =
Fewer innovations in the USA =
The eventual demise of an empire.
Quite the leap, but you know... I ain't the only one saying it.
It seems that this site has been taken down. Looks like people are starting to lose interest in this case just as people lost interest in the DVD cracking software. The DMCA seems like is has been very effective at removing copyright threats from the picture.
Why can't we organize and show them what were made of?
What's wrong with you people? I've been reading a few of the posts here and some of you blamed the justice system, the DMCA, ElcomSoft, even Dmitry Sklyarov. Hell, even Microsoft for some reason got blamed. Looks like Adobe got off easily, only one person blamed Adobe so far and that person got flamed and insulted. What do you want me to say? You get the kind of government you deserve.
First off, he isn't a US citizen. He is a visitor from a foreign country. This leaves him with fewer resources, fewer rights, and little understanding of the rights he does have.
IANAL, and I don't know exactly what rights an accused foreigner has in the USA, but I'm sure that the feds are less inclined to play by the rules they have to when dealing with a citizen.
Secondly, he isn't just any foreigner, he's Russian. If the general public is going to take notice of the DMCA, the feds want a good impression. Lots of people (sadly and surprisingly) still view the Russians as "the enemy" and will view Dmitry as an "evil communist." Thus they might see the DMCA as something that fights the evil commies.
This also might strike fear into citizens of other nations, and convey the message that no country is as powerful as the US, which will FIND a way to subject everyone world wide to its laws.
As a Citizen of the US, I am very angry about this. Dmitry should be freed and sent home immediately, and then the White House should send an apology to the Russians for this behavior.
I know that they'd demand the same for one of our citizens cought up in a BS situation like this in another country.
"You spoony bard!" -Tellah
I questioned early on whether the ACLU would risk their hollywood gravy train by coming out in support of Sklyarov. Several Slashdot posters indicated they would use the feedback page to see why the ACLU was totally silent (try searching for "Sklyarov" -- absolutely nothing). Still nothing, though.
Those of you who are ACLU supporters should take careful note of this.
Sometimes it's best to just let stupid people be stupid.
I'm really confused. Since when can one man be held responsible legally for what his employer does? I design server software for my company which sells billions in server products around the world and it really doesn't seem even remotely viable that they could decide that, because I wrote the code, I should be held liable for the president, VP, managers, other employees, stock holders and everyone else involved decided for the company to do. Most certainly, how is this man responsible for where his employer does business and where their website is hosted? And FURTHERMORE, why did they wait until he gave his speech to arrest him instead of arresting him at the airport when he arrived in the states?
It is time to download the lastest browser technology. Go get IE 6.0 from Microsoft at this link and see for yourself the best browsing yet. The browser is also relatively small. Only about a 16 meg download. There is no excuse. Everyone can take advantage of this free new browser now.
...get the fuck out of this worthless country? If my survival was threatened I would do whatever I could to stop the threat even if it will ultimately fail. If it meant killing my agressors then I have no qualms about doing so. Either leave or kill your those threatening to destroy you... and believe me the courts are against you. Nothing else is a viable solution.
Had a hell of a time getting this past the lamness filter. But here is a link to a post on alt.ascii-art regarding this case
Ascii artist &
Bend over, comrade!
If you're at LinuxWorld or just in or near SF, it's tomorrow night. Stallman and Lessig are speaking, free beer, music, representatives from the EFF an FSF, and plenty of opportunities to donate, join the EFF, etc.. See you there.
Here's the web page.
Sheesh. What is this world coming to?
Mod this guy to HELL! TO HELL!
spend the time you'd be writing the same things you said last time news on dmitry was posted here writing to your congressman or attending/organizing rallies.
less talk, more action.
Honestly, if you said that there was NOT a snowball's chance in hell that this was going to affect immigration, I would have been with you. Honestly, the real deal is that Russian people, and people the world like the USA as a #1 choice for immigration the world over. GOOD EXAMPLE? Russian mail order brides. I don't want us to piss Russia off, but the real deal with this is that he did commit a crime in the good 'ol USA. That is the same if you commit a crime in Russia. We might get pissed, but we would have to lump it. I don't like the DMCA. But what if I wrote a book? I'd be upset if y'all stole it.
You're really stretching this one.
You are seeing the creation of the new drug war. You can expect to see the following features of DW-I in instant replay
- criminalization of perfectly ethical behavior that powerful segments of society happen not to approve of,
- draconian penalties for these supposed crimes,
- justification of this nonsense on the basis of huge ass-pulled numbers purporting to show how much damage the "crime" is doing to the economy,
- legislators and public prosecutors fanning the fire to further their careers,
- courts that will set aside your traditional freedoms because the wankers in the FBI can't get their convictions in a free society,
- ultimately, absolutely no impact on the behavior that Drug War II was supposed to control, and
- a new eco-niche for genuine crime, created by the new legal system and exploited by punks who will ultimately be the next generation's Organized Crime (cf. prohibition, Drug War I).
Fear for your freedoms.Sheesh, evil *and* a jerk. -- Jade
From the article:The indictment alleges that the programmer and the company conspired for "commercial advantage and private financial gain."
Ummmmm...everytime Slashdot posts a story on dirty dealings by $evil_corporation isn't this what all the apologists tell us every $evil_corporation has a "right" to do? We don't expect them not to make a profit right... right !?! Wait..now I see...$bigger_evil_corporation owns the laws. So that's how that works...---Most Definitely not a Karma Whore---
What happened to those ate-my-balls websites?
DMCA ate my balls.....
are a true artist. You show us how good free art can be, which is clearly far superior to anything the RIAA or MPAA have come out with in years.
Freedom of information is here! Everybody rejoice!
I'm willing to sacrifice all my freedoms to win the War on Drugs. Drugs are terrible and they need curtailed at once. I don't care how many people have to suffer in prison or be killed because of the War on Drugs... it's worth it. There are always casualties in a war and the War on Drugs is a very just war. So shut your mouth! You are a menace to society!
I am a Russian programmer working in USA and I think this guy should go to jail. Those crackers in Russia should stop cracking somebody's else software and begin developing their own for a change. And the Russian government should shop supporting piracy - beginning with a huge market next to Moscow downtown where anybody can buy 600MB CD with all kind of pirated software for $5. The problem is - they just don't know how to develop software. They only know how to crack and steal.
...of Dmitry's chains banging on the bars of his cell door. LOL... ROFL...
That's fucking funny.
What sort of complaining / treaty violations / export restrictions / military action would that generate?
Just a non-US citizen's (no I don't think I will claim citizenship through my father) quick rant
I think its funny that there is a PDF version of the petition, considering PDF is an adobe created product
The news.com site also covered the story.
Looking for any old 8-bit Heathkit/Zenith software/hardware - http://heathkit.garlanger.com
Well, it seems to be official. Fair use in the U.S. is dead. Look at what the indictment boils down to:
Note that the indictment clearly indicates that AEBPR is only useful to purchasers of ebooks in Adobe's format, so there can be no allegation of it being used for widespread piracy. Instead, Sklyarov's apparent crime is to allow people to actually use the ebooks they've bought and paid for. Of the items enumerated as being restrictable by the publisher or distributor, only distribution is forbidden by copyright law prior to the DMCA, and then only when the fair use exemptions don't apply. It seems rather overreaching to me that the DMCA criminalizes being able to do such ordinary actions with an ebook such as having the computer read it aloud or print it, let alone making copies for backup or use on another machine.
Note also that the indictment makes no mention of the AEBPR being used to violate copyright law. No evidence is offered that any of the handful of its purchasers used the program for any illegal purpose. The mere fact that it allows the purchaser full use of a bought ebook and the theoretical possibility of commiting an act (unpermitted distribution) which is already illegal under century old copyright law, is reason enough to send a man to jail for 25 years. Scary.
And publishers wonder in vain why ebooks aren't selling very well? Gee, if you don't let the purchaser do anything with them, making ebooks far more restricted and less useful than print books, and totally upset the balance between public and private interests enshrined in copyright law, you should expect this. Indeed, I'm frightened that ebooks have sold as well as they have. The freedoms and rights associated with reading seem to no longer apply in the digital world if the interests that bought the DMCA have their way.
DMCA-like laws and worse are on the fast track in all industrialized nations (courtesy of supra-governmental organizations). Global corporate capitalism is running wild now and is an ever-accelerating force for worldwide repression of every human interest that does not serve the bottom line.
Within ten years there will not be one place left to stand on earth that is not in the grip of trans-national capital.
Within fifteen years people like Richard Stallman will be "taken out" in "active defense" of corporate interests. Go ahead, laugh. It won't be so funny in 2016 when you're on the hit list for being dumb enough to shoot your mouth off.
Where do we go from there? Slavery or revolution. With revolution the only alternative to perpetual servitude left to ordinary people, and corporations holding the media, the military, the police and the weaponry -- well, it's going to be the biggest, most disgusting bloodbath in human history. Think space-based weaponry being used against streets full of rioting protesters - aka your kids.
Want a sneak preview of your children's future? Take a look at the the way the Palestinians are living tonight.
Your lust for, and deference to, money is creating a bullet for the head of every child in America not born into corporate royalty.
Remember this.
Proteus7
Then escalate. If Dmitry is convicted, and you have the power, shut down any email servers you control for a week.
--Lawrence Lessig for Congress!
I suggest we all hit the books, become lawyers, congressman and senators and abolish unjust laws like the DMCA. Then we can hunt down the real criminals responsible for such laws and lock their asses up.
but the EFF news release says this:
I think that rules out pretty much everybody here!
Really? My understanding is that he didn't sell or provide the software here. The company he works for did. The fact that he owns a part of that company has on place in this discussion. Ford stock holders own part of Ford, are they being sued in their own right?
No, the only way they could get him was with a real streach on the "long arm" provision of US code. That's the real stretch.
IANAL
Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.
...for building the car used in a vehicular manslaughter.
When did judges take a plunge in intelligence? Or was I misled?
Is no one else aware of that here?
Killing them would fit the crime better and it would be much cheaper. In fact I'm sure many people would do it for free. They don't deserve three meals a day and free shelter. They deserve a powerful death initiating blow to the head. Hmm, I do believe the penalty for treason is death.
Yeah, you won't find a lot, considering the guy's name is Skylarov...
For the record I found nothing on their site under the correct spelling, though... How often does the ACLU get involved in copyright anyway?
--hongpong.com
From the AP story:
"If there are legal things to do with the tool, then you don't ban the tool and you don't ban the person who came up with the tool,"
What legal things can you do with this tool?
I know this post is going to get slapped down faster than a burger on a grill but the publishers of eBooks hold the copyright on the book itself... the digital wrapping of someone else's text... and fair use or no they have ultimate say over what formats it can be retransmitted and reporposed in. If they produce a file with blocks in it that prevent copying, and you cirmcumvent those blocks, it's no different than taking someone's written word, rewriting parts of the text, and then giving it to other people. Modifying someone's own work and handing it out without attributing the owner, my friends, is not fair use.
I wrote President Bush, Senators Santorum and Specter, and Representative Hart, and gave $50 to EFF.
Do something besides bitch on slashdot.
The ACLU has a rather unseemly history of collaboration with IP content providers like the RIAA.
Go straight to the nearest Russian Embassy and ask to be sent back to Russia. You have ZERO chance of getting a fair trial and more than likely the DOJ will do the same thing to you they did to Kevin Mitnick. They will stonewall you until you beg them to throw you in jail. Run to the freedom of Russia, it is your only chance to see your family again.
Fascism should more properly be called corporatism, since it is the merger of state and corporate power - Benito Mussoli
Allow me to propose a new model, or perhaps an old model if you will: labor markets. Imagine eliminating the idea of intellectual property altogether. Instead of copyrights and licenses, you have buyers and sellers of labor. It's a solely free market solution and it ensures that all information is free at the same time. Let me demonstrate:
A company needs software. A particular open source package fulfills their needs except for a handful of needed features. The company then hires (or more likely, contracts) a programmer or team of programmers or software company to add the features they need. They do this, however, with full knowledge that those features will be released to the public under the GPL and will likely become part of the official code base of the package so that others may use them. (psst.. remember what your CS profs told you about the virtues of modular design? :-)
The owners of a large amphitheater would like to sell some tickets so they search for some popular bands. A particular band has become a hit nearly overnight because they have a really cutting edge sound and have marketed themselves successfully on local radio, on the Internet, and by giving out their music for free at every opportunity. The amphitheater owners compete for bands by what percentage of the ticket price will be given to the band and by providing a nice stage with quality equipment. The bands compete for gigs by offering to perform music that people want to hear live for a reasonable price.
Note a common theme in all this? Competition! True free markets of any type always work because they are natural. They don't require regulation. They don't require false incentives. There's no man in the middle to gum up the works.
I'd say it's high time we brought out the WD-40.
I know, how's about we all pick up and move to Canada. Let the US rot in hell as systems crash and there aren't any computer people to fix them. This law is complete BS, I can barely stand to even think about the United States Government right now, let alone the hundreds of dollars taken from my paycheck for taxes every two weeks...
My Karma was at 49, then they switched to words. All that work for nothing!
Unless adobe will fund the legal action to free
Sklyarov, I will bitterly be against purchasing
their products. Also avise people on any alternatives.
Boycott Adobe NOW!
p.
Outside of a plea bargin the sentence will be determined by the federal sentencing guidelines.. At least there isn't a manditory minimum..
"Welcome Ladies and Gentlemen to the end of the twentieth century and the arrival of friendly fascism.
Regrettably, millions will die as before. But just think of the tremendous selection amd savings you'll gain. Of course the loss of freedom and democracy are tragedies, I know, but consider the entertainment value contained within and to remind you, it is you, the people, who have mandated this course of our fate so please come with me...
Look at the new face of power in America. This is your future you can never leave. Who said tyranny can't be fun? Friendly fascism having so much fun, what else do you need?
You'll learn to like what you must do. If you resist you are suppressed. You are told who to fight and when by Bush the Nazi Fascist Friend. Alienating technology wipes out our sense of community.
Millions will die just like before. We disconnect and start the war. We make life a commodity. We turn animals into machines. Kinder and gentler slaughter house. Big business and big government distract us with entertainment. They manufacture our consent while we destroy the environment."
Consolidated
What is the Immigrant status of Sklyarov?
Is he on a temporary work visa? A visitors visa?
Does he have a green card?
The waiting line for green card is really
long... (I'm not a laywer) but immigrants fall under different laws than Ammerican citizens...
Anyway....
Now considering that Dmitry is a Russian citizan being detained in the USA wouldn't this most likely make the Russians somewhat ticked off? Well couldn't this story become the story of an innocent russian man being held in America by Putin and be brought to the attention of Bush in a public spotlight. Thus, thursting this story into the national headlines and from their bring the faults of the DMCA into light. Just a thought.
WHY ARE THEY STILL WALKING FREE? WHAT WAS THE BAIL?
DMitry presents a talk about the security of Adobe's eBooks and, in a country supposedly RENOWN for its FREE SPEECH RIGHTS, is thrown in jail. They wrote the software in Russia, where it is legal to do so. 25 years and 2.5M dollars fine for breaking a security algorithm that Adobe coders didn't take more than a day and $1,000 to create, to put in a product they probably haven't sold even $1M worth of. What nonsense!
The DOJ/FBI is brain dead. They can burn up religious wackos and their kids, or snipe women and children, but they can't successfully persue the prosecution of Gates & Company in any meaningful way -- Microsoft is behaving as if the fix is in, and the XP reg wizard, the EULA, plus their lap dog, the BSA prove it. They have already shed any pretense that the "punishment" will be anything more than a Billion or two hand-slap, which totally stupid WinXX users will be more than happy to pay. How knows, in another decade or two Gates could be the first Trillionaire.
Meanwhile, in Russia, some schmuck and his company is being targeted for violations of a few Russian laws. One violation will be the fact that they are selling software that does NOT include copying and backup capabilities, a requirement for software sold in Russia, even if it was written someplace else. These schmucks will be pawns in a negotiation with the US gov, resulting in an exchange of prisoners, and DMitry will go home a free man.
Clinton fired over 1,000 FBI agents before they could indict him in the Whitewater -- Resolution Trust Corporation multi Billion dollar debacle, and replaced them with his politically correct drones, a massacre much worse than Nixon's firing of seven prosecutors. But, never mind, they'll work just as well for Dubya.
I'm still willing to give up all my freedoms even if it helps catch one more drug user or stops the flow of drug information (other than anti-drug information that is). Censorship is required to win the War on Drugs therefore it must be implemented.
NOWHERE in my wildest dreams did I think they would convict him for conspiracy and trafficking, of all things. But it has happened. He has been convicted and could face up to 25 yrs. (THAT JUST BLOWS MY FUCKING MIND!)
So as a disgruntled citizen, I feel it is my duty to inform everyone who "SUPPOSEDLY REPRESENTS ME" in the government, to tell them just how FUCKING PISSED OFF I AM!
I STRONGLY URGE ALL OF YOU WHO READ THIS TO DO THE SAME!
The infamous rant site lumthemad.net decided to put their two cents on this issue at http://lumthemad.net/story.php?story=2252, from the "other" side. It's an interesting read.
-Chu
The law is the law. Break it and pay the consequences. You may not agree with some laws but becoming a martyr is your own choice.
Only the State obtains its revenue by coercion. - Murray Rothbard
Why is this so hard to understand?
I was with a group of about 6 people; shame NOBODY was around to provide signs, etc, when we showed up.
-bugg
I've set up a discussion at the NYTimes page. Here we are all agreed. We need to let the other media know that this is an important topic! here
Please feel free to add your own thoughts to this, and send it to everyone on your mailing list. It's time to get the word out to *EVERYBODY* exactly what this means to them.
SUBJECT: Help the blind, go to jail
Hi,
You know I normally don't send these things, but I think this one is extremely important, if we want to live in a free country.
On Tuesday, August 28, 2001, a Russian programmer named Dmitry Sklyarov was charged with a crime in the United States. The crime? Writing a program that enables blind people to access books stored in Adobe's proprietary eBook format. Under a new US law (the DMCA), it is now a felony to use any controlled electronic file in a way that has not been explicitly permitted by the publisher.
In Russia, where Dmitry wrote his program, Adobe's eBook software is illegal because it also prevents people from being able to print or back up the products that they bought. In America, we too have a right to fully use the products we buy, but our government hasn't made it illegal for private companies to restrict those rights. Dmitry's program made it possible for Russian consumers to use their eBooks as allowed by law. Here, enabling people to use the products they buy has become a felony.
For more information about Dmitry's case, see any of these sites:
http://www.freesklyarov.org/
http://www.anti-dmca.org/
http://www.eff.org/
You can help!
Raising public awareness of this issue is very important. Please forward this message to other people you know, and ask your congressional representative to free Dmitry, and repeal the DMCA.
Thank you,
--Joel
We know that both Bunner's and Skylarov's cases were heard on the same day.
/. post
Do we have any idea when results of Bunner's appeal will be in?
EFF's copy of the appeal
[insert humourous sig here]
I pray Dimitry has the strenght to go through all this hell. Ultimately truth shall always be won.
Never have I seen such negative speaking of the DMCA from a "real" news source, even the Associated Press:
Is it just me, or is that the most neutral, almost pro-Sklyarov paragraph you've ever seen? It even continues:
Beautiful. Absolutely beautiful.
Dlugar
Computer Go: Writing Software to Play the Ancient Game of Go
u hv vltd DMCA...
Our lawyers will be at your door shortly...
So, after the arrest Adobe got email-bombed by us guys (&gals) trying to voice our protest (see http://www.boycottadobe.com or .org - too lazy to check)
As it seems now, the protest has to be taken to higher ranks in the legal system.
Can anyone supply email adresses of the people involved? I mean lawyers, consulars, attorneys, judges, congresscritters, whatever?!
I think about the only way this could lead to a conviction is the sheer ignorance of a lot of the involved people (see Microsoft Antitrust case). Well, ignorance can actually be a form of violence. And there is only one cure for it, so who can i tell what is going on, what the real-life analogy is, and how i am feeling about this (even as a foreign citizen... i think, i hope actually that every voice counts!)
+++ath0
Here's what I sent the ACLU via their feedback page. I'll let you know if they reply.
I am curious, what is the position of the ACLU on the plight of Dmitri Sklyarov, the Russian programmer currently in federal prison for a speech crime? Specifically, is the ACLU against prosecuting programmers for comitting speech crimes, and is the ACLU committed to overturning the DMCA?
You can learn more at:
http://www.freesklyarov.com/
A response would be greatly appreciated.
All a Grand Jury hears is what the Prosecutor wants them to hear. It's not a trial, but merely the prosecution's presentation of their prima facie case - witnesses mostly, maybe hard evidence.
It's an old saying around courthouses that a Prosecutor can get a Grand Jury to indict a ham sandwich.
The trial won't be so one-sided, one hopes.
What do you call yourselves, land of the want... land of the imprisoned was it ?
no no no, land of the free i think you call yourselves.
Land of the free, but you imprison people who are invited to your country to speaking freely.
You all should be ashamed of yourselves, youl never get me visiting, why should anyone trust the US
Good idea - show the lawyers judges government and legal system on a whole how intelligent and balanced and mature the open source movement is by running a mailbombing and DOS attack on them
This is BTW illegal.
Thats why these guys act the way they do - because you are all dickheads who act before you think - they see you as a threat because you are incapable of rational thought.
Tell me genius how is mailbombing people going to help dimitri ? i would think it wold prove that he is a hacker with great power ?
Anyway this is immature and stupid - you fight cases like this in court - why dont you donate your pocket money (yeah your nick proves you are in middle school) his legal defence team.
better yet sell your computer and donate it - might be a more usefull thing and will keep you from posting this crap
Since this Sklyarov incident began, I've heard lots of rumors about what he actually was charged with -- giving the speech, writing the program, selling the program, etc -- but very little authoritative about why he was arrested.
Now that he's been indicted, and the indictments are public, we can find out -exactly- with what he's been accused of doing.
Once I know what he's accused of doing, I can direct my outrage better -- The US shouldn't be charging him with writing the "circumvention device" when he wrote it in Russia where it was legal (and thus outside of US jurisdiction); or, the US shouldn't be charging him with giving a speech about it because that violates 1st Amendment protections of free speech; or, the US shouldn't be charging him with selling it because it wasn't him, it was a third party or his employer, not him, that was selling it.
Right now, I don't know why to be upset.
What is a "burglary tool" anyway, genius? Are there no other uses for "burglary tools" (i.e. screwdrivers, crowbars, computers, etc.) than committing burglaries?
I'm sure you could do something illegal, with, say, Windows XP. Ban it.
Sucks.
Please fly him back to Russia in your private jet...this is too risky for him now.
I can't believe you responded. What a fucking loser dork-wad cumbubble you are.
The indictment itself is available as PDF from the US Department of "Justice".
Protests are generally expected to last several hours (save police intervention). If they don't, then the organizers have failed at their jobs.
Is this expectation written into a protestors guide to good protests or something? Instead of blaming the organizers for a poorly organized protest why don't you make your own signs and do some of the organizing yourself. DIY.
The rally in SF should be fairly large seeing that the Linux world expo is in town.
Here's what I think. If you want to kill a weed, you fight it at the roots, or remove the roots all together.
In the case of the DMCA, the roots are large companies. In Sklyarov's instance, Adobe was the one who got him thrown in jail in the first place. I personally will NEVER buy or use an Adobe product again (or any big company's software for that matter). I won't help support this kind of behavior. I think protesting is nice, but hit these companies where it hurts, their profits, and they will stop acting this way or go out of business. Either result is fine with me. I don't understand why people can't see this, or if they can, why they don't act upon it.
Adobe dropped their charges. This was only a PR move, however, they knew the government would still prosecute Sklyarov, which is what they wanted. They only dropped the charges to get public focus off of them. Anyway, if you want the government to recall stupid laws like the DMCA, en mass write (not by email since they won't read it) your representatives and let them know that you want this law gone or they will not be voted into office again. If they don't comply, keep good on your promise to withhold your vote from them. Educate everyone you know about the DMCA (or any of the other retarded laws our retarded government has passed) and encourage them to do the same.
One would think in a civilized society, somone on the prosecution would stop for a second and actually think about what they are doing. They original plaintifs have since changed thier minds, the public (at least those who know about it) is against it, the man is not even a U.S. citizen! The case in completely unwinnable, and unworthy. At best it will get thrown out right away, at worst it will go all the way to the Supreme Court before getting struck down. Why can't the prosecution see that they are in a perfect lose-lose situation. They don't even have the moral imperative on thier side to keep going, becuase locking up somone for what amounts to thought crime is morally wrong.
I realize this is ranting, but please, where is the glimmer of intelligence in these people that tells them to give up now?
"Your superior intellect is no match for our puny weapons!"
It's on their front page. There is also the opportunity to make comments and to possibly reach a crowd that is not enamored with computer technology.
sure, it's available on web-based media; what about the local and national newspapers in print, CNN, FOXNews, ABC, CBS, on cable? Most people still get their news from traditional news sources (print and TV).
That's where I want to see these news, and until then I will not be satisfied.
The above post is totally devoid of any facts, seeks only to provoke an emotional response
While the problems of the DMCA are obvious, and right in front of us, we all need to realize that the real problem hides behind this stinking pile of legislative dung.
The true problem is Copyright law itself. As long as the status quo is maintained, there is nothing to prevent new, more malicious versions of the DMCA. Or, even worse; if certain institutions lobby hard enough and copyright law itself is updated to take our rights away from us.
Understand a little bit of history. Copyright law was created to protect publishers. Not artists, scientists, or authors. Publishers. To make money at publishing, you had to buy an enormously expensive printing press. Then, you had to pay an author for the rights to publish his work. Then, you had to pay an editor to do his thing. Then, you set up the press, churned out copies, and marketted the book. A lot of money was spent before there was a penny returned from sales.
Now, another company has already bought their press. They buy one copy of your new, successful book. They don't have to pay the author or the editor. They make the cover look similar to the original to save on marketting, and churn off copies of their own. Instant profit.
Fast forward to 2001. Copyright law is still in effect. Why? It only costs a handfull of U.S. dollars to run off hundreds of pages at any local copy machine parlor. It costs next to nothing to drag-n-drop it onto a zip disk. It costs next to nothing to ftp it.
But we have these mammoth institutions that base their entire profit margin on the "ownership" of information. These institutions are lobbying and creating software protections to perpetuate their business model.
Until Copyright is abolished, the rights of the artist, the author, the scientist, and the common man will continue to be oppressed by the greed of these copyright holding institutions.
On 08/28/2001 you contributed $50 to
the Electronic Frontier Foundation for a one year membership
with the organization.
Thank you. Our work is dependent upon your continued support.
What will be next? Will I be arrested because I point out a security hole in Microsoft's hotmail site? No, but if I start selling a product that will allow it's user's to read other's email, I can and I should be arrested.
Why should you be arrested even then? It's good that you can see how wrong it is for Skylarov to be indicted for a speech, but you've still let the government brainwash you a bit.
You should be arrested if you break in to a computer with malice of forethought and read other people's email. You should not be arrested if you: talk about how to break in, create a tool to break in, distribute a tool capable of breaking in. All of those things are protected by free speech, whether the government currently realizes it or not.
"And like that
ok, so you showed up 2 and a half hours late, and were expecting SOMEONE ELSE to bring the signs, and you're complaining that SOMEONE ELSE didn't do their job because there was no protest? Cheese and fucking rice, what did you expect, free latte and a fucking salad bar? Motorized walkways so you wouldn't get blisters from marching?
Frankly, I am of the opinion that Dmitry should spend the rest of his life in jail and get buttfucked by big huge niggers until he makes this look like a virgin, but even if I was on your side I would be kicking your ass for being ONE PATHETIC FUCKING PROTESTER.
hey we all know you are a dickhead - we have seen your posts - if i got your advice i would do the opposite
ANYWAY dickhead
adobe dropped their case - unfortunately for dimitri what he did is a federal crime in the US - so why would it be adobes fault?
If he hadnt made a big deal out of his hacking he would not be in this shit now - hes a moron and you are worse
thats right testing the lameness filter is this post lame is it lame because I dont use any punctuation or capitalization or maybe it is lame because i am using the word lame too many times
It's just a Crazy Ivan, not like anyone would miss him if he slipped through the cracks and "disappeared" from prison, like so many of his comrades.
Could President Bush Pardon Skylarov if he wanted?
Please give us some more money.
Serously the guys a hacker and in Russia they dont have due process so they dont give a fuck
what they want are world bank loans, aid, support and development capital - they want losers like this out of there
Get out of school and look at the world before you post this crap
Unless it causes harm it's hard to do, but the threat of harm may still cause damage.
But this way they can get it dealt with quickly.
'There is a Light that never goes out.'
This indictment is quite a preposterous scenario -- a foreign company, a foreign citizen, an untested law with the masses crying "unconstitutional" for its stomping on Fair Use and squeltching free speech and stymying legitimate research. The "injured" party is even calling for the indicted's release.
Perhaps the best way to get this law overturned is for the Federal Gov't to press for criminal charges in such a ridiculously overboard and publicized manner as is going on here. This way they generate a high profile case to lure enough public hatred for the DMCA that it makes it that much easier for a court to overturn it. I don't see anyone standing up for the DMCA now but the federal prosecution.
This could be just what we need. Maybe the Feds are on our side now, and just have to play evil for a little longer.
Watch closely for a wink at the camera from a DOJ attorney.
Tim is gay...
..
.o888o.
... dF' `8
.o8888888o .8
.8
.8888888"""8888888
.88'8888 8888888
:8"o8888888888888888
:".88888888888888888
.888888888888888888
.8888888. .oooooo
o88888888888.
o8888888888888. P
o888888888888888.
8888888' `888888:
8888888"""""""""""'
88888888o 888888"
888888888b__d888888
88^888888888888888'
:8" 88888888888888'
:8 888888888888'(R)
:8 `88888888'
-8 _dF""""
`8ouo8"
"^"
The National Guard? Don't know about that. In Pennsylvania, at least, the National Guard is one weekend a month and two weeks a year.. of drinking. A bunch of guys get together, shoot off some guns and get pissfaced. ;)
Besides, we couldn't take out NATO, even if we wanted to. To take on that many countries at once would be to start the Third World War. We'd be seen as the equivalent of Nazi Germany (Which, in reality, we are. Re: Internment camps, where many Japanese-Americans died from lack of medical care. And looking at those lovely inward-facing machine guns.)
While France would more than likely roll over and surrender instantaneously, the UK, among others, would not. We do not have the manpower or resources to wage a war against the entire world on multiple fronts. We would not be able to hold ninety percent of the ground we gained. Of course, we could launch nukes, but then, we'd receive nukes in turn.
And that's what scares me. The arrogance that says, "We can beat up anyone! The US can't be beaten!" We crawled back from Vietnam with our tails between our legs.
NATO is our only real source of allies. If we went to war against them, all our enemies would unite. We would not win; and that's the problem. If the United States faced destruction, I have no doubt that some moronic ass would launch off all our nukes as a final act of defiance. Well, no, not defiance, idiocy.
Of course it is Adobe's fault. They requested that he be arrested but not be prosecuted. Unfortunately they can't stop the government, Dmitry will be prosecuted to the full extent of the law.
Adobe should at least accept responibility for their actions and pay Sklyarov's legal bills.
Yes, I said that. Adobe intended to slap his wrist and instead dropped him into the meat grinder. He is suffering more hardship than they intended. They are at the very least responsible for his legal bills and some sort of compensation for his detention in the US. (I assume Dmitry is not allowed to work to support his family while he in the US.)
Yeah 350 million population of the us - 50 people who post this shit on slashdot
What revolution - the 'normal' people (you know the sheep who pay taxes, vote, use MS products, actually buy copyright movies and books etc) would rise up and skull fuck you so fast your eyes would spin.
Whos scared of an overweight big talking pasty faced turd anyway - geez i bet the US military are quaking in their boots.
THE GOVT HAVVE SPOKEN - LIKE MITNICKE ETC FROM NOW ON IF YOU BREAK THE LAW THEY WILL STICK A LARGE BAT UP YOUR ASS - YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED BY THIS AND OTHER CASES AND IF YOU IGNORE IT YOU DO SO AT YOUR PERIL
I refuse to argue with Anonymous Cowards - if you want a discussion get an account....
Did you know that most software projects are doomed to failure? I guess that explains Sourceforge. I mean give me a break. This project is in planning and that project is pre-alpha etc. What ever happen to "shut up and show me the source?" Now anyone can setup a Sourceforge project who is thinking of a program but doesn't want to code it. Some linux lamer wants some clone of some software so he goes out an creates a Sourceforge project in hopes that the code will magically write itself. Please if you are serious about starting a real project then produce a little code first and then see if anyone is interested. Sourceforge may have been a good idea at one point but now it is getting out of control. There really should be default behaviour that pre-alpha planning and whatever should come up last in the search. Why lead people on and let them think "oh there is a linux version of that kind of thing" when in fact there isn't.
Why would you assume the words in a slashdot article were spelled correctly? He probably did what any sensible slashdot reader does. Look at the hard words in the article and just assume they are wrong so he picked a different spelling. :-)
I'm going to cry myself to sleep tonight because I cant believe how fucking whiney and pathetic the typical "haxx0r" is... Its like this, gang. Real "haxx0rs" dont get caught, not are they titannicaly stupid enough to hold a goddamn lecture on what they did..Second of all, the next time you start to bitch and moan about how your First Amendment rights are being jeopardized by those oooh-mean-and-nasty Big Brother corporations, ask yourself, "Gee, but havent I already violated their rights first?"
Get over it. He had a trial, and he was found guilty. A criminal went to jail, like thousands of others. Sorry -- You cant have a hero today, little Billy. End of story.
Yeah, this post is flamebait. But its also true. Go through what I just wrote line by line and tell me where i'm wrong before you mod me down.
Bowie J. Poag
Blhh bleh bllh bllh bllh
Blth blhh blih blsh blih blsh blah
blth bleh blsh blth
The indictment said ElcomSoft was culpable because it sold the program for $99 in the United States through an online payment service based in Issaquah, Wash., and with a Web site hosted in Chicago.
If Napster is culpable, why arent the "online payment service" and the hosting company culpable?
Ok, so the Feds find themselves in a tough position-- they've got to enforce this law that Adobe themselves say they don't want enforced.
If they drop all the charges, this looks too obviously like they were just Adobe's bitches, a private police force at the beck and call of big business ("arrest him? Ok. Don't arrest him.. Ok.")
If they do indict him mildly, they set up a situation where Dmitri's sentence might turn out to be enough of slap on the wrist that it's worth contesting on principle, and then this would surely become a test-case for the constitutionality of the entire law. Since they ARE bitches to big business, the government doesn't want this. If it's gonna be tested in court they'll want a more clear-cut case of some obviously evil megapirate somewhere, not a sympathetic programmer out to topple an unjust law.
So what did they do? They decided to throw the book at him, pile up enough charges that it becomes a very high-stakes game for Dmitri personally. Dmitri will be intimidated (and rightly so) into negociating his way out of it. He's got nothing to gain from being a test case in a bad American law...and everything to lose.
After the judge dismisses some charges along the way, Dmitri will likely plea-bargain his way down to probation or something and skip off to Russia shortly thereafter.
The Feds look like they're not pussies, the law remains unchallenged, Dmitri gets a slap on the wrist, and the MPAA/RIAA's message is preserved: "Don't fuck with us. We WILL fuck with you."
W
-------------------
This is my SIG. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
I don't think the software companies and the like have as much to do with its existence as folk here believe. Follow:
I have a [computer tech support] client who is a freelance journalist. He's IN LOVE with the DMCA, because it gives him the right to sue publishers who are reprinting his work digitally. He is pursuing every article he ever wrote, since he only signed over "first serial rights" and by that light, publishers have no right to re-use his articles.
Fine and dandy as far as that goes, but he has absolutely NO understanding of the impact of ANY other part of the DMCA beyond being a mechanism for protecting his copyrights. He has a bulk lawsuit in the works that he expects to settle in the neighbourhood of half a million dollars. I doubt he's alone.
So.. repeal a bad law just because the majority of its clauses fuck over everyone from consumers to developers? Hell no, not so long as it'll let him suck his just due out of publishers.
THAT is the sort of uphill battle we're in for. The "fair use" aspects are small potatoes compared to the copyrights and reprint permissions claimed by hundreds of thousands of journalists (which include a LOT of powerful politicians and lawyers).
~REZ~ #43301. Who'd fake being me anyway?
Not to get Katzian or anything, but are you guys gonna stay the cringeing bullied nerds you were in junior high forever? You're like these bears with claws and these teeth, and you keep thinking, 'How do I kill the bunny? How do I kill the bunny?' Just kill the damn bunny!
But... at least Russia still has a few chips to bargain with - nuclear weapons, vast resources that US companies want, etc.. etc...
Not sure if Putin wants to spend those chips on Dmitry, but pointing out the hypocrisy of the situation might have some leverage.
If Dmitry was from a smaller/third world country he'd be a lot more screwed. At least Putin still has a direct line to Washington - for what its worth.
I'm not sure where you block quote comes from, I assume from the indictment text?
If so, it appears that the prosecutor is deliberatly casting the case in terms that will allow the defense to challenge and break the DMCA.
The law will stand until a judge declares it invalid. The first step in that process is for the prosecutor to charge someone with the law. Dmitry is being charged in a very favorable light. No emphasis about how the unprotected books could then be published illegally. Equal weight is given to the three legitimate uses. (copying, printing, and text to speech.)
Someone with a very fine sense of how that district works should read that indictment and see what is between the lines.
yeah, but it didn't ask me $0.45...
Thank you, drive through...
I would think there would be at least 100 people working in Midtown alone who participate in a Manhattan protest. With all the dot-commers between jobs it could easily swell into the thousands. If anyone knows of protests being organized for NYC, please post the info.
Its nice to see that US corporate officers and employees can cower behind the corporate shield for liability but the DMCA can put blame on one man and violate his first amendment right to speech at the same time?
Second, Adobe chose to invoke the DMCA demon, tipped law enforment to the speech, and is part of this big propaganda/scare tactic. They chose NOT to go the way of a civil lawsuit. They wanted this gestapo crap and since they've gotten what they wanted they just bowed out and left everyone bitching about the evil DMCA and not the coporations that bought it and use it.
Where's the big adobe boycott? The DMCA can be overturned at any moment, but business tactics like these will stick around if they think they can get away with it and right now they are getting away with it.
Here's one. Don't go to the United Snakes. Don't do business in the United Snakes. Don't host in the United Snakes. Sure, they've got some nice cities, and Burning Man is pretty cool, but hell, nothing is worth supporting such an evil empire. We moved all our servers out of the country two years ago and no one from our organization (anti-prohibition activists) goes there anymore, Burning Man or no. . .
You declare (OSS movement==/. readers)? Interesting. I admit that the term "mail-bombing" was a little of. I was thinking about voicing my opinion towards those in charge. DOS attacks have not been mentioned by me. I was planning to show my maturity (and opinion) in a long, fact-ridden email.
Spam, Mailbombs and DOS attacks are. Valid protests by individuals aren't (at least not yet).
I was about to voice the rational thoughts I am supposedly incapable of. I just need the right direction to point it at. And mailbombing is certainly not going to help. But, remember, I did not suggest it. And again, voicing my protest is certainly not going to hurt if done in a correct manner. But it might just help, and the way i see it it is the only option I have to help from abroad (aside from donating to the EFF).
And this paragraph proves your immaturity - readily assuming I reside in the same country as you do. I have been using this nick (in slight variations) ever since I first logged in to some remote machine on my C64 with a 300baud acoustic coupler. The nick has hence been with me for *more* than half of my real lifetime (which sums up to almost a quarter of a century now). It's hard to break old habits. And it's also hard to voice these opinions and thoughts in an "alien" language. So, if you find mistakes, slightly wrong terms or weird phrasing, don't think "middle school loser". Think "european". Thank you.
Your advice is taken. Lemme think. Um... NO!
+++ath0
1. There is no legal, fair-use purpose for the sexual abuse of a child.
2. Your victims are children, not evil corporations.
3. You're not Russian.
4. I'll bet you didn't even submit a story with a link to a news report on a respectable site.
5. You don't have the backing of numerous protesters.
6. You're god damned goat raping son of a bitch pedophile.
7. Michael Sims and Jon Katz want you to go to prison, because it will be easier for them to rape you while you're there.
8. You will see a good argument here.
The Reuters story had one fascinating bit that the AP story neglected:
"ElcomSoft sold the $99 program, called Advanced eBook Processor, on its Web site for about a month before taking it off the market in June after Adobe complained.".
So at the time of the complaint by Adobe, the actual crime (conspiring for commercial advantage) wasn't even existing. THEY WEREN'T SELLING THE PRODUCT HERE ANYMORE!
This is truly bizarre. "Hi, your software violates US law, please stop selling it." "Okay." "Hey, we're back, we're going to have you arrested anyway."
(Yes, I now DMCA is the actual law being cited and covers breaking encryption, but the charges include about capitalizing on the encryption breaking and that simply isn't being done in the US. Plus, Adobe had already 'tainted' their case by admiting they knew of the product and had worked out a reconciliation with them.)
Personally, I hope someone with disabilities (blind, say) sues Adobe because their ebook standard not allowing voice-reading. The ADA doesn't cover it (only commercial facilities) but if any eBooks are used for gov't work, then there might be a case.
A.
A gaggle of geeks standing in front of the courthouse is nice, but a real protest would peacefully shut down something of *real* importance.
Might be interesting if all routers/servers under private control went out for 24 hours as protest. Wouldn't totally turn off the net (the corporations run most of it) but might slow things down enough to make a point. Seems to me the only people who really care about this are the nerds - who wield at least some control over these things.
Wasn't his big mistake to sell the program? Shouldn't he have just placed the code into the public domain just like the DECSS guy? Once they started selling it, then his company and also himself became fundamentally at odds with the companies that funded the DMCA.
Skylarov clearly wanted to tell the world about his discovery, which also put him at odds with his own company as well as the DMCA.
All in all, this is such a shame. Adobe came up with a horrible marketing idea, and then developed crummy technology around the idea. Shouldn't the market place determine how horrible it all is?
`12345 67890-=q wertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;'zxc vbnm,.//.,mnbvcx z';lkjhgfdsa \][poiuytrewq=-098765 4321``123456789 0-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;'z xcvbnm,.//.,mnbv cxz';lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrew q=-0 98754321``12345678 90-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghj kl;'zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbvcxz';lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq= -0987654321``12345 67890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;' zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbvcxz';lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-0 987654321``123456890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghkl;'zxcvb nm,.//.,mnbvcxz';l kjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-0987654321``1234567890-=qwe rtyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;'zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbvcxz';l kjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-0987654321``1234567890-=qwe rtyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;'zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbv cxz';lkjhgfdsa\][po iuytrewq=-0987654321``1234567890-=qw ertyuiop[]\asdfghjk l;'z xcvbnm, .//.,mnbvcx z';lkjh gfdsa\][poiuytre wq=-0987654321``1234567890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl ;'zxcvbnm,. //.,mnbvcxz';lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-0987654321``1 234567890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;'zxcvbnm,.//.,mn bvcxz';lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-098764321``12345678 90-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;'zxcvbnm, .//.,mnbvcxz';lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-0987 654321``1234567890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;'zxcvbn m,.//.,mnbvcxz';lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-098 7654321``1234567890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;'zxcv bnm,.//.,mnbvcxz';lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-09876543 21``1234567890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;'zxcvbnm,./ /.,mnbvcxz';lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-0987654321``12 34567890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;'zxcvbnm,.//.,mnb vcxz';lkj hgfdsa\][poiuy trewq=-0987654321``1234567890- =qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;'zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbvcxz';lkj gf dsa\][poiuyt rewq=- 0987654321``1234567890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;'z xcvbnm,.//.,mnbvcxz';lkjhgfdsa\][poiu ytrewq=-0987654321``123456780- =qwertyuiop[]\asdfg hj kl;'zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbvcxz';lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=- 0987654321``1234567890 -=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;'zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbvcxz';lk jhgfdsa\][poiu ytrewq=-0987654321``1234567890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfg hjk l;'zxcvbnm,.//.,m nbvc xz';lkjhgfdsa\][poiu ytrewq=-0987654321``1234567890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfg hjk l;'zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbvcxz';lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-0 987654321``1234567890-=qwer tyuiop[]\asdfghjk l;'zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbv cxz';lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-0987654321``123456789 0-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;'zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbvcxz';l kjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-0987654321``1234567890-=qwe rtyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;'zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbcxz';lkjhgfds a\][poiuytrewq=-0987654321``1234567890-=qwertyuiop []\asdfghjkl;'zxcvbn m,.//.,mnbvcxz';lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrew q=-0987654321``1234567890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl; 'zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbvcxz';lkjhg fdsa\][poiuytr ewq=-0987654321``1234567890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjk l;'zx cvbnm,.//.,mnb vcxz';lkjhg fdsa\][poiuytrewq=- 0987654321``12 34567890-=qwertyu iop[]\asdfghjkl;'zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbvcxz';lk jhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-0987654321`` 1234567890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjk l;'zx cvbnm,.//.,mnbvcxz';lkjhgdsa\][poiuytrewq=-0987654 321``1234567890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;'zxcvnm,./ /.,mnbvcxz';lkjh gfdsa\][poiuytre wq=-0987654321``1234567890-=q wertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl ;'zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbvcxz';lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=- 09 87654321``1 234567890-=qw ertyuiop[]\as dfghjkl;' zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbvcxz';lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrew q=-0987654321`` 1234 567890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjk l;'zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbvcx z';lkj hgfdsa\][poiuytrewq= -0987654321``123456 890 -=qwertyuiop[]\asdf ghjkl;'zxcvbnm ,.//.,mnbvcx z';l kjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-0987654321``1234567890-=qwe rtyuiop[]\asdfghj kl;'zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbvcxz' ;lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-0987654321``1234567890-=q wertyuiop[]\asdfghj kl;'zxcvbnm,.//.,mnb vcxz';l kjhgfd sa\][poiuytrewq=-0987654321``1234567890- =qwertyuiop[]\asdf ghjkl;'z xcvbnm,.//.,m nbvcxz';l kjhgfdsa\][poiuy trewq=-0987654321``1234 567890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;'zxcvbnm,.//.,mn bvcxz';lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-0987654321``1234567 890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;'zx cvbnm,.//.,mnbvcz';lkjh gfd sa\][poiuytrewq=-0987654 321``1234567890-qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;'zxcvbnm,./ /.,mnbvcxz';lkjhgfd sa\][poiuytrewq=-098765432 1``1234567890-=qwertyuiop[] \asdfgh jkl;'zxcvbnm,.//.,mnb cxz';lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-09 87654321``1234567 890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;'zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbvcxz' ;lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq= -0987654321``1234567890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;'z xcvbnm,.//.,mnbvcxz';lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq =-0987654321``123456789-= xz';lkjh gfdsa\][poiu ytrewq=-098765 4321``1234567890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghj kl;'zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbvcxz';lkjhgfdsa\][poiuyt rew q=-0987654321``1234567890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl; 'zxcvbnm,.//.,m nbvcxz' ;lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-0987654321` `234567890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghj kl;'zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbvcxz' ;lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-0987654321``12345678 90-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjk l;' zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbvcxz';lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-0987 654321``1234567890-= qwertyuiop[]\asdfgh jkl ;'zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbvcxz';lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-09 87654321` `1234567890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;'zxcvbnm,.//., mnbvcxz';lk jhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-0987654321` `1234567890-=q wertyuiop[]\asdfghjk l;'zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbvcxz';lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=- 0987654321``1234567890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;'zx cvbnm,.//.,mnbvcxz';lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-098765 4321``1234567890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;'zxcvbnm, .//.,mnbvcxz';lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-0987654321`` 1234567890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;'zxcvbnm,.//.,m nbvcxz';lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-0987654321``123456 7890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;'zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbvcxz ';lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-0987654321``1234567890-= qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;'zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbvcxz';lkjh gfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-0987654321``1234567890-=qwerty uiop[]\as dfghjkl;'zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbvcxz ';lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-0987654321``1234567890-= qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;'zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbvcxz';lkjh gfdsa\][poiuytrewq ,.//.,mnb vcxz';lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-098765432 1``1234567890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;'zxcvbnm,.// .,mnbvcxz';lkjhgfd sa\][poiuytrewq=-0987654321``1234567890-=qwertyuio p[]\asdfghjkl;'zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbvcxz';lkjhgfdsa\][p oiuytre wq=-098765 321``12 34567890-=qw ertyuiop[]\ =-0987654321``1234567890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl;' zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbv cxz';lkjhgfdsa\][poiu ytrewq=-0987654321``1234567890-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfg hj kl; 'zxcvbnm ,.//.,mnbv cxz';lkjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-0987654321``123 456789 0-=qwertyuiop[]\asdfghjkl; ' zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbcxz';l kjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq =-0987654321``1234567890-=qwertyuiop[] \asdfghjkl;'zxcvbnm,.//.,mnbvcxz';l kjhgfdsa\][poiuytrewq=-0987654321`
Didn't you hear? He was a traitor to the British crown, and under sentence of death for his part in revolutionary activities.
We sure could use him right about now.
-jcr
The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
Besides, what makes you think all sysadmins and programmers are against the DMCA? Who do you think works at Adobe, just a bunch of lawyers? It's programmers who created this monster in the first place.
In short, a strike ain't gonna happen.
I wouldn't live in the US if you paid me.
And, hard as it must be for you to belive it, so wouldn't lots of people.
Part of the reason, actually, is the arrogance of people like you, showcased so well in your comment.
You can keep your country. It sucks.
I don't give a damn if Adobe backed off. The very LEAST they could do if they were sincere about making amends is foot the bill for Dmitry's defense.
-jcr
The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
bad anaology...it's more like breaking into somebody's house and charging him with B&E for each item he takes
Slashdot 's editors are dickheads
I am glad to see the american public is being protected from dangerous criminals such as this guy.
.....
Land of the free... My ARSE!
The number of adults behind bars, on parole or on probation reached a record
6.47 million in 2000 -- or one in 32 American adults, the government reported Sunday
Worse than communism by a long shot.
This fracas is Adobe's fault, and nobody else's.
-jcr
The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
...cause he wasn't convicted you fuck nugget.
He was INDICTED! That's quite different.
He was indited, that only means that there was enough evidence to provide a resonable suspicion that he commited a crime. Nothing more
He will probobly be convicted if the DMCA if not over turned by then. There is a movement in this country that is growing to over turn the dmca, even congress is talking about how it has over stepped it's bounds. Before long it will be a thing of the past.
It's not the OS it's the user that sucks. If it's user friendly, you get stupider people. - clinko
Their time has passed. Today, they're bloody close to useless.
If you want to support the causes that the ACLU stood for in the past, send your money to Amnesty International and/or the EFF.
-jcr
The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
The wonderful thing about our government is that even though the DMCA is terrible we HAVE REMEDIES TO STRIKE IT FROM THE BOOKS.
Enough people didn't chime in back when the DMCA was being drafted, and now it's The Law.
This is our second chance. The DMCA is being tested in a court of law.
Even if it's upheld, we can still appeal it! Numerous times!
No matter what any of you think about this individual law the USA's system of law is great.
-TheAmigo
if Sklyarov is found guilty, then every manufacturer of firearms should be found guilty of murder. all he did was writer code allowing people to do something. the same as gun makers making weapons not necessarily designed to kill people.
Try DjVu. The files are smaller, and the reference library and the Unix netscape plug-in are GPLed.
Product info at www.djvu.com, Technical info and demos at djvuzone.org, and source code at sourceforge.net/projects/djvu.
Has anyone considered starting an organization to inform/pressure politicians, spread the word - like the big boys of business do?
"But we don't have that kind of money/power."
You folks of all people should know as Open Source developers that you can take on anyone, with some hard/organized work. I guess maybe that's what the EFF is supposed to be. But I see the EFF being more of a protector of sorts, rather than an organization who's sole purpose in life is to pressure/inform politicians.
Anyone care to comment?
Remember that paper letters and faxes almost always count more in the eyes of elected officials than E-Mails.
Still, now's a good time to start carpet-bombing Washington with paper *and* Bits:
----------
Dear ,
I write you today in order to ask your support to help overturn the law known as the DMCA, or Digital Millennium Copyright Act.
This law is currently being used by the federal government to quash the Free Speech rights of a Russian computer programmer, Dmitry Sklyarov, who was arrested for using his programming skills to demonstrate that Adobe Corporation's E-Book security was flawed and held without bail for several weeks in the United States. This is despite the fact that what he did is a protected right in Russia, and many in the United States believe that this use of the DMCA violates the First Amendment to the constitution.
I don't know about you, but it's a pretty sad day when a Russian has more freedoms in his homeland than an American does in his. It's even sadder that a Russian was arrested in the United States for exercising his rights to Free Speech, something the United States fought for decades to promote in Communist-controlled Russia.
I'm not alone in my feelings. Thousands of individuals who share these beliefs are organizing protests and fundraising campaigns to help Dmitry, who is being unfairly prosecuted by the U.S. government.
Even the company who leveled charges at Sklyarov, Adobe, has since dropped its charges. Still, the Department of Justice continues to try to persecute this poor individual under a bad law.
As your constituent, I ask you to help overturn the DMCA so that it cannot be used as a bludgeon by profit-minded companies against individuals who chose to express their First Amendment rights in this manner.
It is your duty as an American to see that this man's basic rights are not trampled on.
Do your duty, .
The next Slashdot story will be ready soon, but subscribers can beat the rush and slashdot the links early!
And yes, it is incrediblly ironic that a man in the United States of America needs to flee to Russia and seek political asylum.
Cryptnotic
My other first post is car post.
It seems to me that the best way to protest this is for all of us that are capable of doing so to create eBook decryption programs in our favorite languages and distribute them, and send notarized letters to the FBI admitting that we've do so and demand that the law be enforced on us. They can't arrest and prosecute thousands of people. And if they even tried, there's no way it could be ignored. Clogging the federal court system with thousands of DMCA violations is the best way to kill this thing dead.
I find it quite interesting that the EFF's press release mentions that there will be protests held in multiple cities, including Black Rock City, Nevada.
Burn, baby, burn!
surely this software is not breaking copywrite laws, and it is the people who use the software who are; i.e. the software is like a gun manufacturer; if the gun is used to kill some one the person who uses the gun is prosecuted for murder, not the manufacturer?? make sense?
Is it a boat?
God, I want out of this god-damned country.
I'm no anti-corporatist (I hold several patents that I intent to profit from).
I'm no anarchist (I absolutely respect the rule of law).
I'm no L/libertarian (I can't stand people who talk about doing rather than doing).
I'm no American (I expect my government to respect me).
Bye-bye. I'm off to live in a free country.
-b
If I wanted a sig I would have filled in that stupid box.
Meanwhile, is there even a Sklyarov legal defense team? IANAL, but I'd start with questions like, was Sklyarov read his rights under the Vienna Convention and granted prompt access to a Russian consolate under that treaty? Although the US tends to ignore international law when convienent (particularly the Vienna convention, according to my research) now that Mueller's actually been named as the head of the FBI, there might be less resistance to letting him just go home. Though I wouldn't hold my breath. Keep in mind that our government's observance of the Vienna convention endangers our citizens travelling abroad, too. We've pissed several countries off already and I'm sure that our notification of our rights under the Convention will be slow or non-existant in those countries should we be arrested there.
Immediately follow that up with the juristictional issues. Again, those issues could easily lead to the dismissal of the case after an appeal or two. It would have the added benefit of short circuiting other cases being tried in California even though the "crime" never took place there.
Of course, if he can just get a plea bargain that results in his immediate deportation, that'd be the route I'd advise him to take. Just get the hell out and never come back and tell all your friends that "The Land of the Free" is really "The Land of the Corporate Interests" and has been for decades.
I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?
The difference should be important. But only in terms of educating the lay public about what is going on here. The point is really moot as far as Sklyarov's case goes. Copyright protection is a matter of civil law, not criminal law. Copy protection should be a matter of contract law and civil law because that is what software licenses are for.
This is why the DMCA is so draconian; it has made a crime out of the violation of a private agreement to not copy a piece of software. If the license for the software says, "thou shalt not copy and distribute this software" and you accept the license, you have entered into an agreement with the software manufacturer and are liable for civil damages should you violate that agreement. Then the DMCA comes along and says that if you invent a way to defeat built-in copy protection of a given piece of digital data you have committed a crime. It doesn't matter what you do with your invention; just the act of inventing it is a crime. This seems a little bit like thought-crime. So this issue really has nothing very much to do with Copyright and has more to do with cracking an encryption scheme -- regardless of whether or not you actually copy the software or distribute it.
So if you want to argue the fine points of semantics, don't lose sight of the real issue; that the mega-corp lobbies of Amerika have pushed through a bad law that makes a crime out of a civil breach.
Stay in your shithole country and be quiet. Someday we might let you guys in on this "Internet" thing that we own.
I guess I'll take this opportunity to link to this entry in my Smokedot diary. I encourage webmasters to read it, because I'd like some assistance.
The short version: if you're a webmaster, and have pages on your site related to digital copyright issues - especially Sklyarov's case - check your logs for hits from the 198.25.0.0 - 198.26.255.255 netblock, which is controlled by NIPR (DoD Network Operations - a quick whois of 198.25.0.0@whois.arin.net will confirm this) containing a user agent of "Inktomi Search". A pair of machines at Kelly AFB in Texas with that user-agent have been the source of regular hits to my page on Sklyarov, about once a day. The hits are regular and targeted enough to convince me it's not a case of kiddiez spoofing, and I've had at least one report of very similar behaviour toward another site; targeted hits from a couple DoD boxen using a web spider. I'm doing some light investigation of the activity, and would be very interested in any logs documenting this type of behaviour.
If nothing else, I'd love to know why DoD machines are being used to search for copyright-related pages.
Side-note: some of the information I've gathered on NIPR implies that the group has constructed a firewall around the DoD workstations and servers; hence, any hits from NIPR.mil addresses may be the firewall/border routers and not the actual boxes performing the searches. However, at some point, DoD boxes are involved, and I'd like to know just what they're up to.
Someday, you're going to die. Get over it.
IANAL
Someone may have mentioned this before, but after reading the charges in the indictment, and referencing the applicable law (Title 17, Section(b)(1)(A)), it appears that inumerable people are guilty of this crime.
"No person shall manufacture, import, offer to the public, provide, or otherwise traffic in any technology, product, service, device, component, or part thereof is primarily designed or produced for the purpose of circumventing protection afforded by a technological measure that effectively protects a right of a copyright owner..."
To me there are a coupe details that leap out at me here. First the use of the words component and part. Software design is filled with reused parts and components. Does this mean the author of Tree.h commited a crime when his component object was used in the decryption software?
Secondly, the phrase "effectively protects a right of a copyright owner" is unclear. If a person like Dmitri breaks an encryption scheme then that encryption scheme did not effectively protect the rights of the copy right owner.
Finally, Fair Use (Title 17 Section 107) allows for the copy of copyrighted works for specific purposes. Since the Exclusive Rights (Title 17, Section 106) are "subject to Subject to section(s) 107", I don't see how his software violates any right. Under Fair Use Copyright owners do not have the right to prevent their work from being copied.
Am I making some colossal error in my interpretation of these laws?
Indictment: PDF
Copy Right Law: Cornel / US Code
Okay, we've got protests getting organized left and right. I've received fundraising requests in my email. I see people up in arms and outraged with righteous indignation.
Good for you.
But where the hell were you guys for all the other crap going on in this country and all the rest? From the looks of things, you all act as if this were the first injustice ever perpetrated in history.
In California our prisons are overflowing with those who got arrested, indicted, convicted and sentenced for nothing more than ingesting chemical substances. Unwittingly violating the DMCA is just one of hundreds of nonviolent acts that can land you in jail. Why do we only care about one of them?
Let's free Sklyarov, but at the same time lets get all the other people convicted of nonviolent activities freed as well.
A Government Is a Body of People, Usually Notably Ungoverned
... their explanation is a load of hooey, as any first-year law student can point out. The problem rests in the usage of the word ``the people''. According to the ACLU, ``the people'' in the Second Amendment refers to a collective right held by the State, not an individual right held by the people.
If we are to believe this, then every other instance of ``the people'' in the Bill of Rights needs to be interpreted identically. Otherwise, we wind up in a state of Constitutional inconsistency. While it is not impossible from a legal perspective to have the same phrase mean two completely different things, it is certainly deeply frowned upon.
This is the strongest argument in favor of the Second Amendment being an individual right, not collectivist--because any other interpretation would strip us of all our individually-held rights under the Constitution.
Alan Dershowitz (a well-known and respected attorney) is fervently opposed to firearms, but even he acknowledges the importance of viewing the Second Amendment as protecting an individual right--as Dershowitz says, ``any argument that can be used to take away someone's Second Amendment rights will sooner or later be used to take away their First Amendment rights.''
The ACLU is walking down a very slippery slope here. They know it's a slippery slope, and they don't care. It would be too hard, and too politically unpopular, to defend the Second Amendment. So they don't.
Personally, I think there's a spot in hell close to the fire saved especially for those people who lack the courage to defend the things they do not like in order to stand up for the things they do.
Finally!
Copywrite, which was made to provide incentive for developing new things and creativity, can FINALLY take it's place where it truely belongs: Making sure that anyone who proves that someone else's idea wasnt that great will be imprisoned.
So much for the declaration of independence. Looks like that does the same thing.. I guess It's invalid now.
it's the Justice System of the USA which thinks it has the right to convict people for crimes they have 'committed' outside the USA. The USA may think they are allowed to do this, but what a person does in, say, the Netherlands, is not of the USA's business. Now EVERY citizen of EVERY country needs to know the USA laws, because he/she can get arrested when he/she visits the USA, and get convicted for a crime based on USA laws, that only IS a crime according to THOSE laws, but f.e. not according to the laws in the country the 'crime' was committed. (example: in the Netherlands you can legally buy and sell hasj, smoke hasj etc.)
Never underestimate the relief of true separation of Religion and State.
I am thinking of adding a listing for Toronto, but I will not have much time to donate to preparations.
the US Constitution burning in flames.
I read through the FAQ, and then wondering about how to help, looked at donations, and then the Donation Matching Company's list, and lo and behold, Adobe Systems is on the list ! Weird or what ?
http://www.eff.org/support/matchinglist.html#A
Cheers,
Winton
...he would get the fuck out of dodge the second he can. He's lucky he even made bail. He's GOING to lose at trail. The bail is already lost because the government will seize it as damages after his parent co is convicted at the same time. (They put it up...)
Dude. Be smart. Haul ass. Odds are you will not be extradited back.
The U.S. gubment loves to put people in a cell for pissing off large corps.
There's no expectation of a fair trail here.
This ain't Russia...ya know... : P
Oh, he did? Guess then you should start making more jails damn fast - after all, if MS is eventually proven guilty there will quite a rush, because we need to convict every person working there for the crime the company they were employed by has made.
... you would be upset at the person who stole it, but would you go wild and demand that every employee of company that made the hammer thief used to shatter a window and break into your house should be hauled off for producing a tool that can be used for either good or evil? No, I dont think you would, but when it is not a hammer but a software then you do? Why is that?
And what comes to stealing
Don't you understand? Only hackers are worth defending, despite the fact that their criminality is far more genuine. Besides, if geeks were to start protesting the incarceration of drug users, they'd have to hang out with people who aren't geeks. They'd also have to admit that arts students, who are often heavily involved in this sort of protest, are capable of being right about something. Geeks aren't usually willing to admit that anyone who isn't exactly like them could possibly know something. Least of all arts students.
He should do somethiing bad like work without permit, or everything possible that will get him deported, then ignore the court case and never set foot in usa.
What if, as a response to the Sklyarov case, Moscow made a law that put Bill Gates and the whole Microsoft outsite legality? Like, make it illegal to sell software for money unless assuming responsability for that software's stability (see the MS Windows EULA)
Then, charge Bill Gates for violating this law and declare him and any other MS representative persona non grata on Russian land?
Now, beside the mere fact that nobody could politically afford such a thing (imagine the falldown in diplomatic relations this would imply), I also fear that nobody in Russia really cares about this whole case. I have read somewhere that the government has banned some demonstrations in support of Dimitry Sklyarov... but again I may be wrong (seen a lot of news about "general Ivan Sklyarov" and more than once confused those to be related to Dimitry's case :))
Back to the topic; can anyone living in Russia tell us what kinds of reactions does the population or the authorities have?
so why is it ok for USa
We in the UK have a lot of subs with nukes.....we could EASILY sneak right up on your coasts (with the whole of the pacific to hide in ) and launch, and even the pie-in-the-sky star wars wont protect you.
MAD = Mutual Assured Destruction !
to break US laws. One may be a criminal and never even know it.
Should I tkink twice before steeping on that plane to Chicago? Who knows what strange thing (maybe even this /. post) I have done that makes me convictable under US law...
In aphgan, its illegal
to practice christianity and internet is banned.
Now you do that in usa, visit Afgan and they WONT arrest you.
But usa does? whos the nazi now?
Elcomsoft payed Sklyarov's US$50k bail. They hired and are paying his legal representation. Dmitry's boss has been acting as a sort of spokesman since Dmitry was arrested, visiting him in jail and relaying information to the EFF and the free-sklyarov mailing lists.
Gee. Could that be the reason for the EFF's acting as Adobe's de facto PR firm when this story first hit the news (see the first few
And don't forget their outright evil effort to cancel others' privately planned--they'd say "unauthorized," I suppose--"free Dmitry" protests by announcing on Slashdot that all protests were off until they could help Adobe get their story straight. And, today, they continue to try to defuse the
Well-dressed! Just like MLK said twenty-some years ago yesterday: "I have a dream! That one day a man will be judged not by the color of his skin, but by whether his belt matches his tie!" How proud he would be to see his dream still lives in the (well-dressed) minds of the good people at the EFF! Please--I beg you--send your money to these idealistic defenders of freedom! The new Abercrombie catalogs came today!
(...just noticed I'm in kind of a mod-me-down phase lately...oh well...)
Your mouth is like Columbus Day.
It's because we're capitalists. We believe everything should belong to us in mass quantities. I'm not afraid to admit it, I want mass quantities of many things.
Since it affects our ability to acquire we care. If it affects the environment, children, the low income, the terroristed, we don't give a rats ass. What a society, eh?
terroristed == terrorized.
:) Time to figure out what I can do without in this world... instead of what I "can't live without."
Now I'm even starting to TALK like the leader of this place.
From the affadavit, written by the FBI agent handling the investigation and arrest:
Yes, it's one of the larger software companies in Russia. If you've followed this case at all you know that Dmitry wasn't even the only Elcomsoft employee at Defcon when he was arrested. All these facts are very easily available, so there shouldn't be any need to guess or make stuff up.Hey, what do you know? Before I was a geek I was an art student. Maybe that explains why I'm one of the only ones not posting sob stories day in and day out about how my CDs have copyright protection or I can't read my eBook while I'm driving on the interstate and keep my real copy safe at home. There are more important things in life than knowing and having it all... especially "stuff that matters."
Errr.... must get new computer.... *bash* NO! Must go paint!
I see you kind people know he is should free. Bad law and he make everyone know about. I hope that make him free and make thing better for America. I read that he is hero here, is true, no. 'If this happens, then with any luck the plight of this poor Russian will come to an end and his sacrifice will have served as a catalyst to awaken a broader spectrum of America to the injustice of this law. If in doing so it leads to the Digital Millennium Copyright Act being suitably revised, he will become the latest, if somewhat unwilling and accidental, champion of the First Amendment and a somewhat unusual protector of the U.S Constitution. ' Make free, please. Love Iva
Can you be convicted under the DMCA? Have you ever written code to convert one file format to another? Especially a proprietary file format? For a company? Might the evidence that damns you to jail for longer than a crime of rape woud be in your own Resume? Stranger things have happened...
I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?
On attempting to access zork.net I get the following:
Your request has been blocked and recorded by the SonicWALL filter as it is deemed inappropriate for the Zuken corporate environment. Contact Systems Support or HR about accidental requests or business-critical requests.
should be arrested when they enter the US because they travelled along autobahns at 170mph? (I believe that is higher than most US road speed limits)
Where graffiti etc. is illegal.
in da mothafuckin HIZOUSE!!!!!
Why isn't the reverse happening now? My girlfriends (who speaks Russian) tells me that the case is being covered in the Russian press, but its very much a 1/4 column on page 6 type of story. Perhaps Russia wants the big US corporations to invest in their country and doesn't want to upset them?
Anybody seen any comment from the Russian government?
"Dmitry should be freed and sent home immediately, and then the White House should send an apology to the Russians for this behavior.I know that they'd demand the same for one of our citizens cought up in a BS situation like this in another country."
Hmmm, a little optimistic methinks. I reckon the Americans would probably send the request for immediate return of their citizen along with immediate trade embargos that could take chunks out of the host country's economy.
Swap 'Russian citizen imprisoned in US for breaking US law' with,
I think it's time for us to speak up and be counted, my friends. Whatever your opinion, let your local politician know. Amnesty International has been very successful over the years in helping prisoners of conscience by encouraging people to write and contact their politicians and the media, keeping these forgotten people in the public view. We should take a leaf out of their book.
It'd be cool if this tirade actually focused enough media attention on this situation to effect a repeal of this law. It's possible. The law is wrong and there are many in the /. community who are vocal; sometimes get noticed; and, don't have a hobby besides technology.
/. are your silent friend while you're off painting.
You might be off doing art, but you'll probably continue geeking out your machines to those graphic ends regardless.
The "minions" you appear to refer to on
Acknowledge that and don't alienate those who'll rabidly be defending your interests while you're painting your ideas.
If you can help them, you should. If you're part geek/part artist, you shouldn't criticize those who are just geek. They might be helpful to you when you're more focused on your art.
Artists tend not be judgemental. I am one. I'm also a geek, but respect the diverse opinions this forum depicts and don't make judgements. I couldn't since I'm an artist.
www.dedserius.com
VB != VisualBasic
ascii spork, you are my new hero!
Not even the mighty USA is immune from economic downturns. Although many in the US think that they are the dog that wags the tail (world economy) sometimes the tail does wag the dog.
You start chasing out websites, soon... Who would have thought that people would be looking away from the USA for the right to free speech??
This excessive legislature will be the undoing of the US. Built on innovation, entrepreneurship and the freedom of expression, some wigs in Washington seem to have taken it upon themselves to preserve the American way.
The only problem is that the American way, until now has been freedom, both of expression and of innovation.
Live today. Tomorrow will cost a lot more!
But, hey, why stop there? If we have such unbounded trust in our legal officials, why do we bother with laws at all? Why not give police complete freedom to pick up people that are engaged in unsavory activities according to their judgement, give prosecutors complete freedom to craft punishments, and give judges complete freedom to impose whatever they see fit for whatever action they see as illegal or detrimental to society? Given the penalties currently on the books, we might as well.
What this comes down to is that the US is increasingly not a country of laws but a country run by the law enforcement and justice system. The distinction is profound and it is very important to keep it in mind. In fact, we have a name for the latter situation: it's called a "police state".
Some possible defenses in this case:
1) Did the government/Adobe ever go after the people/website
where the software was sold ? If not why not ?
2) Is there any "legal" proof that he wrote the softwarein question ? If not then comming to the US and
speakng about it is more free speech and like the
SDMI case.
Anyway some random thoughts....
This US justice shit has gone too far, kidnapping foreign people for no reason (Adobe retreated) and promoting US as the last country where one could find fair trials. It's a circus, paid clowns babbling whatever bs that makes'em most money and making general public somewhat content about the show.
I can tell what's fair when I see such actions. Maybe Adobe and other corporations should understand not to treat individual people as they treat other corps. It may backfire other ways than to what they are prepared for.
Preserve old classics: copy your collection onto all hard drives.
The biggest kid on the block? The correct term for that country of yours is rogue state.
Along with the other protests around the world, tomorrow there will be a protest outside the US embassy in London, as well as a protest in Edinburgh, at 1:15 pm.
Full details can be found at http://uk.eurorights.org.
"Free software as in beer, copy protection as in racket" - Telsa Gwynne
I'm bang alongside helping and protesting for Sklyarov, but are there any ways to donate for his family? I'm sure they've got enough concerns and expenses as it is.
"The Sage treasures Unity and measures all things by it" - Lao Tzu
Taken from the Washington Post: "Brad Templeton, chairman of the Electronic Freedom Foundation, an Internet civil liberties organization based in San Francisco". I always thought that Electronic Frontier Foundation was defending him. Guess I was wrong :)
(example: in the Netherlands you can legally buy and sell hasj, smoke hasj etc.)
Not to burst youre bubble but in the Netherlands it is illegal to buy, sell or have hasj in your possesion. But the goverment will not prosecute persons that have small amounts of hasj or use small amounts of hasj. This policy is in writing, but it is not a law.
Joost
Isn't a lawyer that's trying to get him OUT of jail?
Build it, Drive it, Improve it! Hybridz.org
I am all for giving power back to the individual, although fighting it with this example isn't great. Dmitry was SELLING the software, that kind of pisses me off. If he had been distributing the software freely then this probably would have no judicial concequence. If they were indicting him for distributing free software, that's when I think we should rise. Don't get me wrong, the DMCA is evil and the corporate power seen in the government is appalling; but let's pick our fights a little better. That way, the rest of the world (non-techies) can maybe side with us.
Sklyarov was indicted in America for participating in speech that would be free in Russia. With regards to history, this is both ironic and sad.
I'm ashamed to be an American at this moment.
I'll remember who started this also. I have to use Acrobat Reader to read some documents (it being a web standard and all), but never again will I purchase an Adobe product. Whether or not you do the same is your business.
Let's get drunk and delete production data!
We should be protesting against Adobe
until they make a public contribution
to the EFF and, ideally ship some
hundred or so programmers to Washington
for various rallies.
You have no rights! Wake the F!@! up!!! The government does what it wants especially when the price is right!!!!
Developing the alternative ebook reader is not a crime in the country in which it was developed. He should be freed because of lack of juristiction.
Trafficking in the reader, is a crime in the US, and the effects are felt in the US (until the govt. firewalls us like China). However, it was Elcomsoft (codefendants) who were doing this, and not Sklyarov.
What Sklyarov is guilty of is the long-abhorred practice of being $NATIONALITY in vicinity of $CRIME. He's going to get nailed to the wall.
Yes, the nick is flamebait
What part of Europe are you from?
FYI: The part liberated by the British 21st Army Group.
Sorry for the OT, but you didn't have an email adress, and I can get pretty worked up about this typical US ignorance of history.
Moderators: feel free to mod me down, this post deserves it, but the ignoramus deserved the flame. If you don't believe me, follow the URL.
Mart"I know I will be modded down for this": where's the option '-1, Asking for it'?
I was wondering about this. Maybe the people at the FBI realise that the DMCA is going to be nothing but a big barrel of headaches, and have decided to push it far enough that it breaks - far enough that it's more than obvious that it's very wrong.
The "for financial gain" bit had be thinking too. Since when has selling something for financial gain been wrong?
There's also the whole question of legitimate juresdiction. If they can arrest someone for breaking a US law outside of the US, the opposite must also apply - any other country could arrest a US citizen for something they might have done legally in the US.
Quote from Dire Straits (hopefully not illegal!):
If the law is allowed to stand, it will backfire for sure. I think the FBI probably sees that.
-- Steve
I looked around for a letter written to the DOJ to drop this case, but came up with my hands empty. If such a petition were on-line (with thousands of signatures) it would make for a nice item for the Press to point to next time the DOJ makes a statement.
The on-line petition should be well written, thought out (by EFF) and should allow me to enter my Name, Address, Telephone and give me an area to write Supporting Comments and a place to put in a credit card number for a donation. This should be hosted on the EFF site. The petition should not be a "vote" and thus any non-supporting comments should be immediately removed. Those in-favor of this process can get their own web-site.
Be wary of advice of people who don't have the balls to not reveal their name or their email.
Jason Salopek
I think he should get life.
I don't know why I bother even replying to a email like this because not only do you resort to childish name calling, once again another case of someone without the balls to give their name or email.
Jason Salopek
Does anyone have email addresses, so that a non-US citizen can voice their
disgust over this situation?
Do you think that this will make crypto security conference organizers think twice about having meetings here? I guess the DMCA could really hurt our ability to be an acedemic powerhouse in the security/cryptography field. I certainly wouldn't want to enroll in a U.S. based PhD program if my research could land me in Jail.
I bet this isn't an intended consequence of the DMCA is it.
I'm really surprised no one has thought of putting this in terms that matter to (average? normal? hick?) Americans.
Sklyarov produced a tool. People might do bad things with this tool, so the tool is illegal and Sklyarov is in jail. Let's carry this analogy over to, oh say, guns! They are tools that can do a great deal more damage than anything any of us software engineers (assuming we don't work for a defense contractor) are likely to do. By the very logic behind the DMCA, America is opening itself up to a law to outlaw guns (let's not mention cars or lots of other things in the name of staying focused).
What better way to get "real" Americans and certainly all of the Republicans to back Sklyarov and tear down the DMCA!
Having said that, we all know the reason the U.S. has a law banning the creation of software tools which might do something bad and not a law against guns is because of money plain and simple.
It is for many reasons like this that I no longer live in the United States (although I miss many things about it...cheap, high quality sushi anyone?).
When I first told my (relatively non-technophile) wife about the whole DMCA thing and especially about a Russian being one of the first people prosecuted with it, she shook her head and said, "See honey, that's why we left."
Onnel
I would have thought it was obvious, but this is a geek/nerd site. As such, readers are interested in geek/nerd issues. In general, the overcrowding of California prisons, the legalization of currently controlled narcotic substances, and penalties for illegal nonviolent crimes are not geek/nerd issues.
To suggest that because we support a cause peripheral to yours we must support yours with the same enthusiasm is a) naive, b) self-defeating, and c) illogical.
Careers should combine three things: what you can do, what you want to do, and what you can get paid for.
how is it sinful again? oh thats right it isnt. but ill go along with that. i guess you should stop drinking alcohol too. how alcohol has been dealt with is the same way marijauna should. prohibition didnt work for alcohol it wont for mj
Please mod this up, it is incredibly insightful.
The Skylarov case make me embarassed to be an American, it represents the exact opposite of everything this country was founded on.
how about staging a book burning (or old adobe software burning) in front of Adobe offices..
Since that basically is what the DMCA fight is all
about anyways.. control of thought, expression and writing in the digital age.....ie book
burning in the modern acge a la Fairenheit 451..
This is a type of action that might make it clear to the mainstream press what this fight is really about... control over our expression, and companies attempts to control press, throw people
in jail for thoughtcrime...etc..
And why Adobe? Well, they started it, and as far
as I am concerned, it was companies like these
that lobbied/bribed/pressured our congress people
to get this law.. so now they can use all that
political power and money to get Dmitry out, and
then get rid of this law, or suffer the
consequences publicly in the street from us.
Slashdot seems to have disabled sigs. Perhaps if Taco could learn to fucking code, trolls like myself wouldn't be running this place.
C - A language that combines the speed of assembly with the ease of use of assembly.
If you were to be arrested in, say, Afghanistan, because the company you work for is run by a woman (and is trying to do business there), would you meekly accept whatever punishment they meted out? After all, you tried to "push" your illegal woman-owned company there, right?
-Legion
Would it make sense to file an FOI request, asking for an explanation of their spidering of your server? I would not be so naieve as to expect a comprehensive truthful answer, but it might be interesting to study whatever excuse they give.
I find it absolutely amazing to see how the copyright interests have thoroughly infiltrated the government. The conspiracy theorists often claim that the U.S. is governed by a coalition of shadowy organizations. Given the mere existance of DMCA, enforcement that falls just short of launching a stealth bomber mission against Elcomsoft, and now all the research of DMCA opponents, the conspiracy theorists are looking smarter by the minute.
If Chewbacca lives on Endor, you must aquit.
appollogies for poor spelling
Don't forget to write the owners of the country a letter detailing why you are boycotting their country so they know why they've suddenly lost a good chunk of their tech workers.
You know, when I started writing this I was thinking, "hey, easy +1: Funny point!" But really, it's too close to reality to be funny. This shit has got to stop.
Remember, as American citizens it is not our RIGHT to overthrow a corrupt government, but our DUTY.
-Legion
Stop whining.
The cost of freedom is too high for you. Indeed, we do not deserve freedom.
Here is its cost, count it carefully:
1. Re-create the DMCA-infringing software to defeat eBook technology. The best and brightest on Slashdot could do this if they put their minds to it.
2. Everyone who feels strongly about it should not only distribute the source, but also openly decrypt eBooks and make the resulting unencumbered PDFs available- be they servers in the US or outside her borders, CD's, IRC, wireless broadcast, public readings, whatever.
3. Everyone who participates in this should do it absolutely openly, and with the full expectation of being arrested and convicted to the fullest extent of the law. When arrested, demand a trial. Do not plead "no contest" or "guilty". By going to trial, you will make your conviction sentence more severe. Do this knowingly.
4. People must go to prison. Lots of people. For a very long time. A few hundred won't work- but thousands upon thousands of people in jail or prison, not developing software, not being productive- hurts the nation. In fact, there's a limit to how many people can be in jail at one time in a given country. Currently, I believe there are about six million incarcerated in the US. We' need to assess just how many generally young, educatied/technical people would need to be in prison to make the System hurt. Perhaps- just perhaps- if everyone in the U.S. Slashdot/EFF community- lurkers, goat-sexing trolls, hackers, wanna-be's all ended up flooding the prisons, it could turn into a situation where the law was, in fact, unenforcable. And, of course, I'd welcome foreign supporters willing to be arrested as well...
Picture this: 5,000 geeks in kangaroo (court) outfits distributing circumvention software for free on the steps of the very courthouse where Dmitry is currently being tried....
5. Civil opinion might just question what the hell is going on. Laws could be changed or repealed once public sentiment was stroked. Then again, given the outcome of the current drug war in the US, perhaps not.
It's almost too late to stand up and take control of the laws in America, short of a revolution. But it can be done. Peacefully. Ghandi walked to the sea and made salt, breaking a Brittish law (on par with the DMCA) and ended up a martyr.
Seems to me more than a few people decided to walk instead of ride the bus down south in the 60's....
Where are our balls?
Shut up, be entertained, and stop thinking.
-Ouija- poke 53280,11:poke 53281,12
nutcase you suck!!!!!
http://www.goatse.cx/
How can we get revenge for this? Obviously boycotting adobe is one thing we can do. They started it and deserve to pay. Please reply and list things we can do to DOJ to avenge this act (and no I don't mean blowing things up). This is for the wife and two kids.
it's the fact that the civil breach was intentionally multipled 1000s of times over
People use knives every day without killing. To argue that the makers of knives "intentionally multiply" the killings 1000s of times over is plain stupid. Sorry.
On top of that making a tool that **cannot directly be used in a criminal act** should not in any way be *criminal*. It could be *civil* at best and only when it has been proven that the *primary* purpose of the tool was the said breach.
The solution has nothing to do with enforcing some super-silly law. As in the case with the knives, the solution is in **improving the education and the moral of the general public**. This is not liked by some though... Why, o why...?
I would agree that there are many injustices in America, and basic freedoms being taken away. All that said, where exactly is a place to go that you could enjoy more freedoms?
I'll admit that Russia is beginning to look very attractive, but they still need to get their act together, and learn what ideas they need to reject from western democracies (like the DCMA... BTW) but still allow their citizens to enjoy basic freedoms.
China? Yeah, right.
Australia? A resonable choice, but it is becoming more like the US in all the wrong ways.
New Zealand? I don't know if they would appreciate it if a couple of million Americans suddenly showed up in their country (assuming a mass exodus). Still, it has some appeal to Americans wanting to get out of the country.
Anywhere in Europe? America is made of people who wanted to get away from Europe. I think both America and Europe are better for everybody leaving. (no pun intended)
Africa? Again... yeah, right.
India? WTF?????
Latin America? Heck, the United States needs to point guns just to keep people out. Brazil isn't too bad (I've lived there) but the governments in this region are still too unstable, and rather prone to military takeovers.
Canada? From the viewpoint of Americans, this is simply a country that should be called US-#2. I know canadians and that isn't exactly true, but at the same time, their laws tend to follow the US at least for things that affect the average person. Again, this is a good choice if you simply have to get away, but extradition is much easier from Canada than many other countries.
Middle East? And you want to go there for more freedoms? Yeah, right. Israel isn't too bad for the ordinary citizens, as long as you understand that everybody else in that region wants to kill you as an ordinary citizen. It is also hard to become an Israeli citizen if you are not a Jew.
Moon? Mars? Antarctica? At least there isn't a government at these three locations, but there are some rather important technological problems that need to be solved, and probabally a whole lot of money before you can even think of living in these places. The environmentalists would probabally have a hard time with a large, permanent settlement in Antarctica, which could only be successful anyway if they did mineral extraction (oil, natural gas, mining, etc.) The oil from Antarctica would be extreamly expensive.
Anyway... I'm just saying that America may have its problems, but so does the rest of the world. Instead, at least for now, you need to work with what you got and at least use the basic freedoms that you still have. That and be grateful that at least America will let you leave if you want for now. Indeed, leaving America isn't a problem, the problem is trying to get back in. Even as a US citizen.
Noone I know likes to read books on the screen. with elcomsoft or without. Ha!
I'm serious. If you find one that's really better, let us all know. From my researches, the Scandinavian countries look best from an all-around perspective, but they're not exactly encouraging immigration. Plus, they've been known to knuckle under to corporatism/imperialism. (I'm not knocking them for that, it's realpolitik.)
Good luck, and report back.
Why do you say that? Aside from Adobe's meaningless "oh, we didn't mean it" statement after their meeting with the EFF, they have shown no indication that they give a damn about Sklyarov. Until Adobe takes an affirmative step toward defending him, we can assume that his arrest and imprisonment is exactly what they want.
How to solve most of our problems: 1.Lots of nuclear plants. 2.Cure aging.
How about boycotting the .pdf format entirely? The ONLY signal that will be heard is drastically reduced profits. If no geek anywhere ever encoded a document to .pdf format again, and instead demanded the use of a Free format using free (beer) or reasonable commercial software, the effect on Adobe's profits would be noticed.
Can or has someone already made a viewer plugin for LaTEX or another file format? Hell even a MS Word viewer would be better; Microsoft's actions, however reprehensible, were at least conducted in the marketplace and did not involve buying enough Congresspeople to establish a "legal" extortion scheme plus Gestapo techniques.
Also, write your Congresspeople - dead tree, intelligently and thoughtfully worded, no "Information wants to be free" rhetoric.
Of course he was indicted. Indictment simply means that there is enough evidence to warrant a trial. It says NOTHING about if the law is good or not. I says NOTHING about constitutional issues. ALL an indictment means is that there is ample warrant to apply the resources of the court system to trying this case because there is sufficient evidence to suggest that a guilty verdict is POSSIBLE (not probable or even likely, but POSSIBLE).
Now, here's a hint of what will happen next. There will be a hearing to discuss constitutional issues. The defense will raise the issue of the constitutionality of the DMCA and it's application. The judge will enter the hearing into the record of the trial but will proceed anyway. More than likely a guilty verdict will be returned. The defense will appeal based on the evidence supplied at the aforementioned hearing. At this point the courts will look at the constitutionality of the law and it's application. It won't happen before the appeal process. Prior to the appeal's court the judges aren't going to weight in on constitutional questions
This isn't a reason to "give up" on the american legal system. It is simply the way the system is designed to work. The legislative body has passed a law. A lower court is applying the law as it understands it. An appeals court will (likely) look at the wording of the law, how it was applied, and what it was intended to address and rule on the constintutional issues. It is precisely the way the system is designed to work. Moaning about "unfairness" at this stage is just demonstrating ignorance of the way the system works.
The US has lately been intentionally making the relationship with Russia worse, feels like it's going towards a new Cold War.
Examples: the farce of "negotiations" over the 1972 missle defence treaty, the capture of a fishing boat crew by Canadians, the recent incident with the US Ambassador in Moscow.
What Bush wants is to push Putin, irritate him, as a show of strength and just to see how far he (Bush) can go and how Putin will respond.
The Sklyraov incident falls into the same pattern.
-- Kostya
The dates for the second count under each charge (June 26) is the date that Elcomsoft reposted their site subsequent to notice from Adobe and take-down of their original site by Verio.
I don't think the government actually expects that it can prevail on all counts as counts 2 and 4 and counts 3 and 5 do not in fact appear to state separate offenses. They just appear to be taking a buckshot approach prior to putting this in front of a judge.
Just saw this in another threadf t. pdf
http://xml.openoffice.org/xml_specification_dra
OpenOffice's XML-based file format [openoffice.org]
The Web reference choice of format is powerfully ironic, isn't it.
Anyone who believes FREEDOM is being trampled upon and responsibility mocked should be concerned with this situation.
_ al ert.html
If you are not able to go to the protests, then still get involved by checking out
http://www.eff.org/alerts/20010808_eff_sklyarov
Let's not forget that the alleged copyright circumvention device (the software) does not run in a vaccuum. It requires a computer (Dell, Compaq, Gateway, et. al.) and the operating system (MS Windows). On that basis those companies are just as liable for making a copyright circumvention device, regardless of the fact that their hardware and software have legitimate purposes. Similarly, if I bring up the e-book reader on screen and hit the PrtScrn key can't I then copy what is on screen? If so, can't I then also publish that in Adobe Acrobat? Can't I paste into Adobe Photoshop? I guess that then makes Acrobat and Photoshop copyright infringing devices. All of those companies have thus made copyright infringing devices, and trafficed in said devices for commercial gain. Indict 'em now!
I don't get this law.
If I published some copyrighted material under an encryption system that performed, say, a Fourier Transform on the plain data, could I claim that anybody publishing an FFT routine is subverting my encryption?
That would be neat with some strange consequences.
I'm no constitutional scholar, but the US constitution only applies to US Citizens and those on US soil. Dmitry never broke a law on US soil. Your reading would imply that that phrase has the meaning "Congress shall have the power ... to regulate commerce _in_ foriegn nations," which is patently incorrect.
If the US doesn't want people *buying* circumvention devices, they should have put that in the DMCA and prosecuted Americans for buying the program sold by Elcomsoft. That would have eliminated any nasty jurisdiction problem. Nowadays, the economy's global until an industry lobby group throws a few soirees in the nation's capitol. Then it's jingoism time.
I don't need large brains to have a good time.
"Okay, we've got protests getting organized left and right. I've received fundraising requests in my email. I see people up in arms and outraged with righteous indignation. Good for you. But where the hell were you guys for all the other crap going on in this country and all the rest? From the looks of things, you all act as if this were the first injustice ever perpetrated in history."
Oh, get over it. The fact that people who have never stood up to join a skirmish in the never-ending struggle to Prevent Injustice (tm) have suddenly done so is a GOOD THING. Even if this is the only fight a given individual gets involved in in her life, this is still a good thing. As a bonus, some of the people who get outraged about this will be exposed to the broader picture - that there's lots of Bad Things going on in the world, and that action by ordinary people can sometimes make a difference - and go on to contribute to other moves to reduce injustices in their communities and around the world.
Berating people for not having 'seen the light' about [insert injustice of choice]is exactly the sort of thing that discourages people from making a habit of contributing towards this sort of process.
All Dmitry did was to write a program to take the contents of the book and display them in another less restrictive format.
So, following that train of thought shouldn't MS also be indicted because I can open an ebook and hit ATL-PrintScreen on every page and paste those images into a drawing program and print each and every page or run them through some OCR software and get normal text back?
When are the totally clueless politicians and lawyers for the government going to get a clue that this is nothing you can keep from happening in some shape or form.
Anonymous because I can be....
If the mob were to kidnap someone and hold out for a ranson premised on the idea of a "mod defence fund" then I don't think this script would read much different.
How about the Sklyarov goes home and the USA finds a USA citizen for a scape goat and then we non-americans just ignore the USA legal system instead of trying to subsidize it?
If you're going to supply a form letter at least make it readable:
Change that unreadable run-on sentence to something like: "This law is currently being used to quash the Free Speech rights of Dmitry Sklyarov, a Russian computer programmer. Mr. Sklyarov was arrested after using his computer programming skills to demonstrate the serious security flaws in Adobe corporation's E-Book technology. Adding insult to this arrest, Mr. Sklyarov was held without bail for several weeks before being indicted." I also think any letter should emphasize that Sklyarov wasn't sneaking around, he was speaking at a conference on computer security.
Where is the man when one needs him!
For the berating, I do apologize. I was on my feet all day at LWCE and I was tired and exhausted. But I will not apologize for my main point.
There's a lot of unjust imprisonment in the world, but to focus on one to the exclusion of all else is counter productive. Yes, I said counter productive. The rest of the world is going to look at the protests and think "hackers only care about hackers, so this protest doesn't mean anything." They will be wrong, but that is what they will think.
People won't care about our issues until we care about theirs. And if no one cares about anyone else's issues, we cease to be civilized.
I don't want to berate anyone for rallying around Sklyarov. But I do want to open people's eyes tot he fact that Sklyarov is not alone.
A Government Is a Body of People, Usually Notably Ungoverned
Subject says it all. Some people should read before posting.
ENIAC was created principally to crack the Nazi encryption code and that was the birth of electronic computing machines. And the same talent is now being punished for creating a digital world that let's these corporates even exist!
Ok, here's a new opportunity for the DOJ to get Micro$oft (or any software company for that matter).
First, I have just come up with a revolutionary new technical copyright protection scheme for text documents and an associated text document viewer that enforces that protection scheme. The scheme consists of adding the word "PROTECT" just before the EOF of any text file. My program will refuse to copy or display any text file that doesn't have this protection enabled. I also have a Rights Enabler program that I will send to any licensee so that they can protect their works under my scheme. I have decided to charge a license fee of 1 cent for an individual (or corporation) to utilize my protection on any number of works they choose to.
OK, now that I have a completely valid and reasonable protection scheme, I have to worry about those subversive elements out there trying to circumvent my protection. Well, Microsoft makes a program called "notepad" which allows users to remove my protection scheme. And, they are distributing this program in the US!!!
Now with a well placed call to the FBI I should be able to have Bill Gates arrested along with everyone working at Microsoft. I mean after all they "developed and provided tools to others which would allow them to access a technologically protected work" DMCA (section 1201(a)(2))
So, DOJ get to work and put them all in jail!!!
ah my sig finally caught some replies. you're definately from the uk 'realise'.
The Feds should be going after Microsoft!!!!
------
www.moneybythenumbers.com
*instert obligatory "free Sklyarov" statements here*
Now, let's pretend for a moment that you are the executive branch of the US government. You see a law that the previous administration enacted that you don't like. How do you get rid of it? The executive branch is the only branch of the three that can neither create nor strike down laws. All they can do is (not) enforce it.
Bush and his people could try to convince Congress to modify the law, but the last time the DMCA went through there not so long ago, it got an awful lot of support. The idea might lose some votes this time around, but not many. (MPAA and RIAA represent a big chung of US exports, economic troubles, blah blah blah)
They could decide not to enforce it, more or less ignore the white-collar copiers and only bring it up against those that should be thrown in jail. Unfortunately, that still leaves the ugly wording of the law lurking under the surface to strike back at inopportune times (say, when the next president comes into office). Besides, if you slack too much in enforcing the law, you get impeached for not doing what you're supposed to be doing.
The only other real option they have is to get the courts to strike it down (or at least modify it majorly in their interpretation of it). But, when there's a good chance that the case will appear before a judge that you didn't help put into office, how do you make sure that the court decision goes your way?
By enforcing the law in the broadest and strictest way imaginable, in a way that not only blatently demonstrates the unconstitutionality of the law as-is (so the judge would have to be a complete and utter facist to let it stand), but also pisses off enough constituants to convince Congress not to try it again any time soon.
Is what is happening really some sort of "master plan" by the Attourney General, lying in wait until they got just the right kind of nudge from dim-witted CEOs at Adobe? Probably not, Occam's Razor being what it is. However, if it's not being done on purpose, then they seem to be shooting themselves in the foot by going forward with a case that's such an attention magnet.
Don't you appreciate satire? It's not a judgement, it's a perspective.
You really can't expect much more than that out of someone who isn't claiming to be running the protest (nor has the time to organize a successful protest)
-bugg