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Home-Grown TiVo Stories?
PolyDwarf writes "I'm in the process of figuring out how I'm going to build a homegrown TiVo machine (i.e. a computer sitting next to or in my home electronics stack).
My question for is "What's worked best for you?" Most solutions I've researched are great if you have regular cable. However, satellite systems and digital cable boxes seem to present a special challenge, in that the software on the PC needs to know about an IR connector that is then hooked up to the front of the digital cable/satellite box.
Who has done a solution like what I'm researching? What cases/processors/memory/TV Card/IR transceiver/OS/software/etc worked out for you? Did the end result justify the pain and hassle?"
Freevo and linux have been working pretty well for me. Just setup xmltv and go.
A great place to look for small form factor machines is over at mini-itx.com, great small form factor stuff. For software, freshmeat.net and a bit of scripting is your friend :D
mythtv.org looks promissing, version 0.8 works well, dunno about the receiver stuff as I just have cable.
I am only a few weeks into my project..but my biggest concern is noise. I would be interested to hear what cases/fans/disks people use to keep noise to a minimum.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/forumdisplay.php?s= &forumid=26
They'll be your friend.
Regular cable is best, just because of TV tuner cards.
Also check out http://www.mythtv.com if you want to go the linux route.
I have an old Celeron 433 with an STB TVPCI (BT848 chipset). For software I'm running IULabs IUVCR (their site seems to be down) which changes the channel and sets all the encoding options. Everything captures to AVI, which I then play on that computer or any other on the network (nothing has TV out yet)
For scheduling everything is run through the MS Task Scheduler and is under manual control.
Travis
How many of these topics will we see?
They are $200 and you save time, money and effort. Even the geek effect isn't worth it this time.
Spend the money and help a company.
Here's a list of sites that can help if you're married to doing this:
Freevo
XMLTV
they're not THAT expensive, and its probably not worth the effort at all to try and duplicate all that functionality.
I suppose its one thing if you want to do this for the purposes of learning how to do it, but if you're going to build it to try and save money, just buy a tivo. you're going to wind up spending as much or more money and a LOT of time fine-tuning everything to your preference, and working out little bugs with a self-built solution.
so, unless this is a project that's more about the journey than the destination, get a tivo.
He's talking about building a PVR that does all the functions of a TiVo without actually being a TiVo.
Check out Freevo.
It uses XMLTV for listings.
Some guidance may be found at http://www.avsforum.com Search for "HTPC" (Home theater personal computer). Granted, the basic HTPC goes well beyond Tivo-like functionality and worries about things like progressive-scan DVD output, and doing Tivo-like things with High Definition sources.
What happened to the days of using a VCR? Yes its not cool or geeky or even the best quality but it certainly suffices for tape delaying a show. Plus a good VCR costs like $60 nowadays with tapes to be had for under a buck. Cheap and a tried a true technology(plus no monthly fee!).
Soon you won't have this problem with digital cable. CE manufacturers and the cable industry have agreed on a standard to allow for digital cable ready devices (like today's cable ready TVs and VCRs).
Soon (within the next year or so) you should be able to get a digital cable ready tuner card which would solve your problem. Since HDTV is sent over digital cable as well, dealing with HDTV is no problem either when you get ready for that.
For a really nice PC based Tivo substitute, have a look at http://www.mythtv.org.
Even more interesting, mythtv is starting to integrate support for a hardware MPEG2 encoder to be found at http://ivtv.sf.net. The first commercially available consumer MPEG2 encoder that has linux drivers;)
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To stave off all the wankers sure to fire up with their superior "I don't watch TV!" pablum, here's the obligatory theonion.com article. Grow up, folks. There's plenty of quality programming out there and PVR's (TiVo included) are a great tool to filter the good stuff out from the worthless programming. Avoiding television because you don't like Survivor is like staying off the Internet because AOL is here. It just means you're incapable of scrutiny.
My setup:
G4 500
200 GB internal storage
EyeTV TV tuner (1 coax in and 1 RCA video/audio in)
RCA video in/out
2 S-video out
1 S-video in
1 RCA audio in
1 RCA audio out
1 1/8" stereo miniplug in
1 1/8" stereo miniplug out
SCSI
USB
FireWire
serial x 2
dual ethernet
DVD-RW (Pioneer 104)
Mac OS X Jaguar
Keyspan Remote
drives a 14" VGA and 27" TV
VCD DivX MPEG-4 etc. support
online scheduling w/ TitanTV
Full Internet Access
screen resolution on the TV up to 1024x768
and much much more
sound yummy? Its killer, and I'm putting together a web page w/ all the pics from the assembly and the final product.
Don't worry slashdotters, you'll get a peek at this beauty soon.
He wants a computer based PVR, not TIVO. Happily, TIVO has not copyrighted the concept (yet).
Sounds like you want something small, silent and with one of those nice Hauppage cards - and a really big HDD!
I'll see your Constitution and raise you a Queen.
I just built myself a new MythTV (www.mythtv.org) box a few weeks ago with the following hardware:
Shuttle SK41G case+MB+PSU - $250
120GB Maxtor Fluid Dynamic Bearings 5400RPM HD - $130
WinTV dbx model 401 card - $100
Athlon 1800+ (I did not need to get this fast a processor, but I wanted speed left over for other things too) - $60
512MB DDR ram: $70
New remote control: $20
Total: $630
It works great, does ff/rew/pause of live TV, downloads TV listings off free websites, lets you record all showings of a show, has a webserver builtin so you can set recordings remotely, etcetc.
It also looks pretty and works great with a remote control so you really can use it like a set top box.
There are even optional modules for showing the weather, playing MP3s, and running various emulators/games.
It also supports multiple frontends and backends, so you can make an ultimate setup with 10 tuner cards and 20 TVs all connected to the same video storage if you're so inclined.
So what do you think of the video quality?
You can't grep a dead tree.
The MythTV Project is what you want. As often noted on Slashdot, it does nearly everything that TiVo does, and a heapload more. It's open source, and under active development ... however, it's not quite at full functionality. The most recent stable release is version 0.8 and while not without some bugs seems to work quite nicely. I've paired it with a AVerTV Studio TV capture card, a Shuttle FV25 mainboard, and a Celeron 1.4 GHz processor. To my understanding, MythTV supports external tuner devices such as satellite systems. Installation/construction is straightforward but not for the faint of heart. Some RPMs exist for certain required components, but much of installation involves the "./configure; make; su; make install" cycle.
IF -- and this is a strong supposition -- you either have spare hardware laying around that's pretty strong (eg, in the GHz range rather than 100s of MHz) or have a weird bent on building your own systems, then by all means roll up your sleeves and dig in! However, if you are looking for the least expensive or easiest alternative, then buy a used or refurbished TiVo.
Put my fist through my alarm clock with its ding-dong death inside my ear. - The Blackjacks.
While the temptation to make a PVR is really great at the moment, what with mythTV and friends getting better and better, it really isn't practical at the moment. At least here in the UK, for me, it isn't.
Why?
All but 4 (well, 4.5 counting ch5) channels are sent through cable for me. Admittedly, those channels do have the better programming on, but it would be somewhat lame not being able to record cable channels.
For instance, I have digital cable (ntl). All the decoding is done in the cable box and shoved through to channel 7 on the tv. This means you can only record from one pre determined cable channel. Unless you somehow set up lirc to send a 'channel change' ir command to the cable box every time it wants to change cable channel. I've thought about this, but it would be tricky and probably unreliable.
The question really is: can I justify building a PVR for just 4 channels?
Malike Bamiyi wanted my assistance.
My question for [you] is[,] "What's worked best for you?"
Tivo
There is a small outfit selling pre-built systems that look pretty good. Box is called the Orpheus from Panadora Systems. Allows HD PVR and comes in a chassis that looks like a stereo component.
Myhtpc seems to be coming along pretty well if you want to run your pvr on windows
www.myhtpc.net
Can't get more accurate than that. A lot of decent TV cards have remote controls that work with lirc which makes things inordinately easier than getting something external like an irman. Add an LCD from crystalfontz or something (MythTV has built in interaction with LCDd).
All the above stuff is great - but - what if you are using a satellite source as input (e.g. Dish Network)?
My understanding is the Dish Network broadcasts in MPEG-2 format, and the receiver decodes this. If this is the case, then any solution which doesn't intercept the signal before its decoded with result in a degraded output. Tivo claims to work with Dish Network but so far I've received no response to an inquiry regarding whether or not they recompress the video. I'm assuming they do... and if so, any setup which duplicates Tivo will also suffer degradation.
So is there any way to get around this problem? Dish Network doesn't really provide any info. I would get one of their PVRs if I knew how to copy their internal hard drives onto my computer and be able to archive each show as an mpeg2 file without any recompression.
Aren't the tivo's with 80 gig drives more like $350-400? I'm sure there's a street price. But $200 seems a little low. Also can tivo serve as an mp3 jukebox, burn dvd's and vcd's?
I'm in the research phase of the same project. Inherited a free computer with a 500 mhz celeron.
Figure a 60$ tuner card, 100 gig drive (90) and a dvd burner (250?) will cost me the same as the 400 tivo. If I really want to get fancy I'll throw it in a $150 sound dampened black a/v computer case and I'll be good.
Of course that still leaves lirc to go, but I need something to do when I can't sleep.
and no one cares, the person that asked this question did not mention anything about a choice between, building a pvr, or not watching tv.
i wonder why people that dont watch tv have to justify it to others constantly. with all that free time i guess, they have nothing else to do
The main reason I see to doing this myself would be to integrate everything.
I want an entire home theater system based around a PC. This means, no TV, no stereo reciever, no rack full of other shit. Instead, I want a PC, a nice set of speakers, a projector (and optionally a monitor too).
I want to be able to access all my media (movies, music, tv, radio, etc) from one interface. The big advantages to this are the convenience (assuming it works out okay), the space efficiency, the re-use/sharing of components (hence cost efficiency, maybe). This is quite possibly the best bang for the buck available (if it's really doable). Sure, there's also a geek factor to go along with it, but that's on top of the other benefits.
In my case, I don't care if it looks like typical home theater equipment. Afterall, it's not typical home theater equipment. A regular case is fine, it makes cooling much easier, and being able to put it somewhere to keep the noise to a minimum is nice too. A wireless keyboard/mouse/remote setup would be good for anyone who lives alone, because you could send the output to multiple devices (projector, regular tv, monitor, etc), but use one computer to control everything.
Having a central storage device, with the ability to backup to CD/DVD, is also a major plus. The upgradability and scalability are nice too. Let's not forget, the MPAA has no say about what features I might implement on such a system either.
Down with Saudi Arabia!!!
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I've just installed an All-in-wonder 7500, and while it performs ok, it probably isn't as good of a solution as buying the real thing (tivo).
while i am allowed to schedule weekly recordings, the recording software sometimes crashes (if i try doing other things), which might not happen if you just have a dedicated box.
price-wise, i blew close to 200 bucks on hardware alone (card + HD) and am now getting mediocre performance.
i'm still satisfied that i can record tv shows, and convert my vhs to vcds (thank you apex:), but if you're looking for the best solution, i'd say go with tivo.
If you don't know what AltaVista is (was), get off my lawn.
Alienware seems to have a good model, looks nice too. Apple needs to bring back the Cube for this very purpose...
"Don't worry slashdotters, you'll get a peek at this beauty soon."
Yep, and then we're gonna slashdot you and your arrogant self-love into digital oblivion. God damn; I hate people that boast about their computer specs.
That's what's holding me back from going mythtv -- I am on ExpressVu and want to be able to save the MPEG stream directly to HDD or at with a minimum of screwing around.
There are some DVB PCI cards from Germany (ExpressVu is standard DVB, throw in your access card and you're done) but they're on the order of $400!! I've been through the schematics of my old 2700-series receiver and while I can tap off the digital audio, the unencrypted MPEG video stream seems to never leave the custom decrypt/decode chip. :-(
I suppose I could use RCA out and an IR mouse to change channels, but I am really looking for something I can put all in one box and, as I said earlier, not screw around.
This is -1 Redundant, but just buy a Tivo. The Tivo service alone is worth the subscription fee, and Tivo v2 users who have a Mac will absolutely love the new Media Pack, allowing for Rendezvous discovery of iTunes / iPhoto libraries.
Look at yourself. You watch TV and you still have time to harrass people as a Coward on /.
/. is a lot like a Tivo. You can let the best parts build up, and then just watch the good stuff.
You are a model TV watching citizen, that all should look up to.
Why slashdot? Why not?
Seriously. It works.
I tried to roll my own. I bought an ATI 8500DV specifically because they touted their awesome TV-on-Demand capabilities. Seemed perfect.
8500DV: $235
Until I tried to use the damn thing. Oh. It doesn't work well with my motherboard. I was planning to upgrade anyway.
Refurb motherboard: $50
XP1800+: $95
ATX Case: $40
DDR RAM: $100
Okay. We're up and running. TV-on-Demand works great. Scheduling recordings isn't that good, tho. The software's pretty bad. Can't do anything automatically. Can't clear out old searches. No conflict resolution. Only a week's worth of data. And it sure wasn't cheaper than a Tivo when I figure in the cost of the new PC. But I can handle setting up scheduled recordings once a week. And the live TV stuff is great.
Oh. The live TV stuff stops working if the machine's been running for a few hours. Maybe I should upgrade to the latest drivers and software. Great. Now it doesn't work with one of my games. Try a different version. Now TV-on-Demand is worse. Try a different version. Hey! Finally have a setting that spits out SVCD format. Too bad TV-on-Demand is totally broken now.
And so began the downward spiral. After a few weeks, I just bought a damn Tivo. $200 for the unit, $80 for a network adapter (series 1), $250 for lifetime service. About what I spent on the computer solution with one major difference. IT WORKS. I can leave it alone for days, weeks, months at a time.
If there were only a way to hack a cable modem to let a computer access the digital video stream and record it (only my subscribed channels), I'd consider doing this. In the meantime, I'm fine with my TiVos.
There is no spool.
Documentary? As if. That was a sketch on Saturday Night Live, episode 222, originally aired on December 20, 1986.
Would I know that if I didn't have a life? Ha, I think not.
Wow, what timing. I spend a good chunk of the weekend working on this exact problem. Using normal CATV splitter I took the coax from the back of my digital cable box and brought it to the TV and my tuner card. The IR is where i got stumped. I considered just buying a simple IR repeater and a universal remote so i could control the digital box from my computer room. However along the way I stumbled across the LIRC project. A simple homebrew reciever (basically a IR detector, power regulator, capicator and a restistor,connected to the serial port) and an even more trivial transmitter (an IR led and a current limiting resistor) couples with the LIRC package let me do some of the control remotly. Its not a perfect solution but I'm still working on it
http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,3973,692134, 00.asp
I'm actually going to use PVR on a box I'm working on for my 2 year old daughter. I'm going to custom build a Media Center PC using Linux but it's going to be tricky because my two year old will have to learn how to operate it. It's requirements will be more than just watching TV but PVR is actually one of its primary requirements. Music, DVDs, etc. are some other requirements.
I'm currently using an old gateway p200 desktop case we had in our storage room(pics and specs below).
Software i found and love is myHTPC.net
My personal HTPC site
I know that, and you know that, but Laurie Garrett does not know that.
Try Googling for her name. Read the Metafilter thread that comes up as the second result. This woman writes for Newsday.
After downloading episodes of 24, Alias, and Smallville which were in HDTV format I really am a believer in it. Fantastic looking, even on my 17" monitor.
Unfortunately the software with the PCI cards I've seen aren't that great and are Windows only. (Sadly none are yet available for my Mac)
Your comment is fine for people in the US. However here in New Zealand the options are considerably more limited as I expect they are in the vast majority of countries, large and small alike.
Never, ever lose a file again. Ever.
I'm using the following:
:(
WinXP, Athlon 2400+, WinPVR (Hauppage),400 GB hd space.
Good things: Great signal quality, and so with all my space I can record as much as I wish. After that, commercials can easily be cropped with the mpeg editor. A quick divx-ing through gknot and it's all done.
Bad things: Stupid Hauppauge drivers are inconsistent. Their scheduling program only starts up correctly maybe 75% of the time. Also, their installation instructions are rather hackish as well (unplug my ethernet connection to install?). Because of its lack of consistency, however, any show I really need to record and am not going to be home for... I use my VCR
I haven't really researched out to see if there's any good work arounds, but all in all, when it does record, I have no complaints at all.
0- Eamonman Proud member of DNRC
I have both a Tivo and a homebrew, and unless you have real serious moral obligations to purchasing something from a company instead of building your own, consider getting a Tivo.
Homebrew: All parts (sff case, mb, memory, cpu, tv card, large hdd, etc. using MythTV) = ~$650
+: Yours to do with whatever you please, using actively maintained popular open free software, easily hardware upgradable, fun to play around with, much more software functionality (MythMusic, emulator front end, weather modules, etc.)
-: Hardware failure is your problem, TV software not quite up to par, more expensive, not quite as slick looking (without looking real hard for a decent case), maintainers can stop working whenever they get the urge, good luck getting digital/satellite TV working well with a cheapo TV card
Tivo + Lifetime subscription = ~$600 (add a larger hdd for more money)
+: Company paying people to maintain software and accurate listings, nice to look at, full featured and completely functional, hacker friendly, warranty makes getting a replacement unit easier, software head and shoulders above competition (IMHO YMMV blah blah - I'm sure other posts outline such functionality), it's a device that doesn't care if the power gets yanked on it, is built to support all sorts of television (digital cable, satellite, coax, whatever)
-: Warranty voided if you open it up, no control over software or updates, company controls any and all software, if Tivo goes out of business listings and software are at their mercy (although there's rumors of a Plan B if that should happen), only does the TV thing (unless you feel like paying for the lackluster Home Media option).
Simply put:
Like tinkering? Have a lot of time and money to burn? Roll your own. Otherwise, there's an excellent effortless pvr already available for the same cost. Worst case scenario, buy a Tivo and keep the receipt (choose monthly sub instead of lifetime). Give it a test run. Don't like it? Return it and make a better one.
The real question is: Has anyone started trying to hack together drivers for the Tivo hardware so you can use their box but your own software?
I have an HDTV tv which has a standard VGA port, which the manual says will accept 1080i input: 1920x1080 60hz interlaced.
Does anyone know of a video card which will support this resolution (and refresh rate)? Several support the resolution, but none seem to do 60hz interlaced.
Spotted this earlier today in a web advertisment: http://www.lbdata.net/dvr/
:) Until I am older and more settled, I would like to avoid (to the extent practical) things that require subscriptions, telephone priveleges, etc. I'd pay quite a bit more for a box where the programming / scheduling fee was built in up-front, or (of course, better) didn't exist at all. I can program a VCR, and by extension a DVR, if it has a decent UI ;)
I have no idea what OS it runs.
I have no idea if anyone has ever ordered, received, and been happy with one.
I have no idea why it looks like it has built in speaker thingies.
Just the same, it looked like a cool box, so someone out there besides me is probably interested
timothy
jrnl: http://tinyurl.com/c2l8yr / foes: http://tinyurl.com/ckjno5
This follows very closely to the article yesterday regarding TiVo Fanatiscism. From there, I was delving for software solutions to a TiVo / PVR situation, and mythTV and Freevo were both offered up.
/. crowd, but you've got to admit that the general populace does not use linux/unix/bsd. Therefor for a software solution that would cater and be enjoyable by all, I'd honestly think a Windows option is a must. I'd use it on both platforms from two different machines, but I'd like the option of both.
My only question here is, and I know I'm risking a horrible wrath of flamage from this;
Is there a software solution that offers Canadian and USA TV-Guide listings, functions as a PVR fully with MPEG1/2 encoding, and allows queing recording. For me digital/satellite support aren't a must, but surely will help down the road when I get digital/sat.
And here's the kicker... Anything that has Windows ports as well as a Linux source? This is where the flamage will probably ensue, judging from the general
I didn't feel like supporting tivo or any other monthly charge for service, so I decided to build an HTPC. Sure it costs more, and takes some time, but I am a geek.. I admit it. CPU: AMD 2500+ 333mhz CPU Fan: Zalman CNPS6000 Motherboard: MSI K7N2G-ILSR Case: Supercase TU-150 RAM: 2X 256mb PC2700 Samsung chips HD: 60gb + 2X 120 gb maxtors (hate fatwallet.. it makes you poor) TV Card: Leadtek winfast "Deluxe" TV2000XP TV/FM TV Signal: Dish Networks --------------Reasons: CPU Fan: heard it was a very quite fan.. Motherboard: Has built in TV-out (s-video) + Optical Out (SPIDF) + SerialATA RAID + Dual Channel DDR memory slots Case: Looks pretty cool. and doesn't cost as much as coolermaster. HD's: 60 for OS and stuff the other 2X120GB HD's were because of the staples deal.. off of Fatwallet. TV Card: cheap card. OS: Win2k ----------------Results: The computer is pretty quite. Using the leadtek card, I am able to use titantv to sched. recording of TV shows. I am using it to record simpsons, and movies off of movie channels. Also also stream some simpsons eppisodes for friends.
I have both a ReplayTV and a Pinnacle TV Tuner.
The only thing I use the tuner for is to grab episodes of Buffy, because my college's crappy cable service apparently doesn't agree with the ReplayTV, and it picture distorts. (Note: This is a TOTALLY non-standard problem with the ReplayTV. No one else in the world has this problem, so far as I can tell) The TV tuner happens to handle that one channel better.
Past that, I would never use my TV tuner when I could use my Replay, and for one simple reason: The Replay has a GUI and a built-in channel guide (Which is what you pay $9.95 a month for), and the tuner doesn't. The Replay can thus be told "Get me every episode of Iron Chef that appears on any channel", whereas the TV tuner has to be manually programmed based on show time and station, show by show, with you holding a TV Guide and knowing when things come on.
This doesn't sound big, but it's huge. The ReplayTV/TiVo is simply a more convenient piece of technology.
Note, however, that I haven't experimented beyond Pinnacle's native program. Maybe some of the TiVo-like programs have accurate channel guides. But make damn sure they do before you invest in this box, or else you'll find that it's entirely not what you wanted.
Philip Sandifer's academic website
Personally, I still have a VCR.... three of 'em, in fact, and I use them quite often for making copies of things for other people.
However, I get much better quality making the original dub using a digital recording (well, I've had a few times where it's gone odd, but typically it's a much higher quality, and I don't end up introducing macrovision in there 'till the final run to tape). It's easier to edit out the commercials once, if I'm going to be making multiple copies to tape, or even just changing the playback order.
Oh..and let's not forget storage... I'm recording at about 1G/hr... so with 2x120G drives in my system, I don't have to worry about changing tapes every few hours. [and actually, every show, as when I used to send everything straight to VHS, I tried to keep shows in order on each tape, so some nights, I'd be switching tapes every hour or 30 minutes, and having to get the next one queued up and wait for my VCR to to its recording calibration test in just a minute or so.
Now, I can collect up a few shows, and when I want to dump to tape, I just prep a job to run overnight, or do it right before I leave for work....
hmmm...that reminds me...I was supposed to dub a new copy of Invader Zim for a friend who wore our her tape. (she has a TiVo, but well, she doesn't have enough space on it to keep all of her Zim)
Build it, and they will come^Hplain.
PIII 1ghz, 1 gig RAM, 180gb hard drive
ATI AIW radeon 7500, 128mb RAM.
1u case, audio/video modulator to broadcast to all the TVs on the Whole House Video Distribution System.
Running win2k and Showshifter, with web plugins.
Is there software that can filter commercials out? I've heard TiVO does this.. but I don't own one so I can't verify. :) :)
I just use the GuidePlus program that came with my Radeon, but I'd really like something a little more reliable.. and perhaps that will run when my console is locked (on the Windows machine that is my recorder)
If no one can recommend software that cuts commercials (while recording), can anyone recommend good FREE software that can edit an existing MPEG2 stream and chop sections out manually? All of the video editing software I've found that's free will only allow you to hack either end of a clip off, but not cut sections out of the middle.
I hope this wasn't too confusing.
We're really not interested in hearing how you spent $700 and who knows how much time to achieve something easily bought for $200 and set up in 5 minutes.
> My question for is "What's worked best for you?"
I couldn't be happier with my solution.
- For the complete works of Shakespeare: cat
I am not buying a tivo until they integrate 802.11b
A few years ago (in my P-133 days), I hooked my oscill-o-scope to a IR receiver, and figured out the patterns to my old Sony VCR. I then hooked a I/R LED (RadShack, $.50) to the wires normally used for the internal speaker (yeah, you have one!), and then wrote some small progs in C+ to reproduce the same waves out of my speaker port, which worked pretty well. Might be an idea.
Google: Beta.
How much more offtopic can you get?
Come on, this is a topic about tivo alternatives!!
Friggen american's, sheash!
Radeon 8500 AIW
Athlon XP 1700
512 MB DDR Ram
2 x 80gig segate baraccuda IV
Wireless remote included with radeon
Software: snapstream http://www.snapstream.com/
Snapstream is network aware I guess you would say, I can watch tv from any computer in my house, or from the tv that snapstream is on. Screen shots at the link below
http://www.snapstream.com/products/sspvs/screen
and on a side note I had an uptime of 90+ days with this setup before the power went out.
Bewarned that Snapstream is very Microsoft dependant for the most part, I'm dealing with it because it works. Software was the hardest part for me to decide on.
Does anyone actually have a Java program designed to control air traffic, or for the operation of a nuclear facility?
Why not just buy a TiVo with DirecTV? There's no point in reinventing the wheel, especially if it comes in a nice AV-rack-sized box.
Michael C. Hollinger
I do not want to liberated to the sort of society that GWB and his rich friends want to run.
I do not want liberated to having the DMCA imposed in me.
I do not want liberated so that anyone on the bus or train next to me could be carrying a firearm.
I do not want to be liberated so that my country no longer has a National Health Service or any other parts of a welfare state.
Go ahead and liberate the people opressed by unelected dictators but don't assume that we want to live in a society like yours afterwards.
I'll see your Constitution and raise you a Queen.
Ye gods, man! If I take out a second I'm going to repaint the house, not build a media system. How much did you pay for all that?
My Setup:
TiVo (bought new for about $300)
Linksys USB Ethernet adapter for TiVo ($30)
AudioTron (bought on close-out for $130)
Slow frankenstein PC for MP3 storage (100 bucks?)
Used 10mbit hub bolted to the wall (free)
Korean DVD player ($40? Not sure...)
10 year old Sony AV receiver (I think it was $400)
Speakers my brother gave me when he got divorced
It's not pretty but it works. And I never have to fuss with it. If I want music, I switch the receiver on and pick an MP3 playlist on the AudioTron. If I want a DVD, I switch the input to that on the TV. If I want regular TV, the TiVo handles it. I didn't have to build anything, it all just stacks on top of the TV. I did use some pieces of scrap wood to hold up the back of the AudioTron (it's 19'' wide, but half as deep as any other component). One day soon, I'll paint the wood black or something. Everything's easy to maintain. If the TiVo goes on the fritz, I unplug it and send it back. If I want 6.1 sound, I buy two new speakers and replace the receiver. When the DVD player breaks, I'll get another at the grocery store.
The biggest features (besides never have to screw around with anything and the fact that it required no construction) are that the whole system was cheap as hell and it all just works. The biggest drawback? No bragging rights. But the again, my truck doesn't have a tuck-and-roll and a flame job, my PC doesn't have a window cut into the case with blue neon lights lights behind it. I don't entertain much so there's nobody to show off for anyway.
Don't worry slashdotters, you'll get a peek at this beauty soon.
Well, you have me there. Nobody would want to see a pic of my TiVo sitting on top of the TV. I have one if anyone wants to see, though. I thought the use of scrap 1x2s was particularly inspired...
-B
Ash and Hickory, straight-grained and true, make excellent bludgeons, dandy for the cudgeling of vegetarians.
It's hard to beat a Tivo. Especially now that they support changing channels via Serial port on the most common digital cable box. (GI/Motorola DCT-2000). (Assuming you have the latest firmware on the digital box, unfortunatly mine it too old... ).
You can also aquire the guide data from the serial port on the back of most Satellite boxes. Either MPG or APG.
If you figure out the format let me know.
(I have the specifications from ATSC (www.atsc.com) for the data in-stream, but not sure how to package it up for the serial port stream into my Tivo. (As it would fix the fact I cannot get Guide data from Tivo for my area, but APG or MPG would solve the problem since it IS supported.).
most cable/satellite companies are starting to roll out their own PVR solutions. By the time I got some home brew tivo working it'd only be half as good and my cable company will be offering me one for a few bucks a month. Time Warner's already offering digital cable boxes with built in DVR functionality.
c ts ?category=10052&expand=Y&rootCategory=10050&local= 0
http://www.timewarnercable.com/dispatcher/produ
A lot of Satellite boxes have a serial port. Probably called a low speed data jack. A simple 4 to 6 byte command will change the channel. Depending on what software you end up using, it shouldn't be hard to add support for the receiver. I did for the newer RCA codes and Snapstream.
A number of posters have raised the question of why building your own is worth it. There are a number of great reasons (and FWIW, I own a TiVo and love it):
1) It's likely that you can get some of the features you want more quickly by using something based on open source. If it doesn't have what you want, you can just add it!
2) The idea of having the people that produce or distribute the content having any control over how it's watched really annoys me. It's my TV, and I'll watch it the way I want. Does this happen? You bet: DirecTV controls the features that get added to your TiVo at home.
3) You can archive everything. Hard disk space is really cheap. It's pretty easy to imagine a huge collection of movies that you just skim from your feed. Sure, you can hook a PVR up to a recordable DVD, but you really want this to be built automagically.
4) Nobody's monitoring what you watch. Sure, TiVo has a nice privacy policy, but the fact that such info is even collected scares me.
Take a look at http://www.aardvark.co.nz/pvr/
I built a homebrew Tivo. I did so mainly because I had a bunch of parts around, and I felt like seeing what I could do with it.
On the one hand, it was kind of fun getting set up.
On the other hand, it took a hell of a lot of time, the video quality was substandard, and it was a pain in the ass to set the programming. I couldn't do good compression in realtime, so I had to save in crappy MJPEG compression and then later recompress in batches. Even with a 80GB scratch drive in it, the thing was always battling for more space due to the large initial files.
Did I mention that 2 or 3 different times, kernel upgrades broke my TV card?
I eventually dismantled the system. I'm considering buying a real Tivo soon, but even if I don't, I will not be making another homebrew one. It just isn't worth the time and effort. The V1 Tivos can be configured so you can pull the video right off via ethernet, and people are working on that functionality for the V2 ones. And if you care about playing DivX and stuff like that, mod an XBox. You can play pretty much anything on them, with a lot less effort.
-[Blaine]- "'Oh dear,' says God, 'I hadn't thought of that,' and promptly vanishes in a puff of logic."
I've seen a few of these articles on Slashdot where someone asks advice on rolling their own Tivo like device. Invariably there's a lot of replies that say "just buy a damn Tivo", "here's what I did: bought a Tivo", and "check out this site for info: tivo.com".
TIVO DOES NOT SELL THEIR PRODUCT OUTSIDE OF THE US AND UK! Buying a Tivo is not a solution to many people reading this site. The only solution to experience the joy of using a PVR that so many of you are raving about, is to create their own.
Let's recap. If you live in Canada, you cannot buy a Tivo. If you live in Germany, you cannot buy a Tivo. Even in Soviet Russia, you cannot buy a Tivo. And so on...Get the point?
Besides, isn't this site supposed to be aimed at geeks? I would think that creating a PVR from spare computer parts is a worthwhile geek activity.
Well, I, for one, dont give a damn about PVR, all I want is to play my DIVXs on my TV :-)
I live in Canada - TiVo is not supported here, for love or money. Besides, I would prefer a totally DRM free and open, networkable appliance. I am really looking forward to seeing HDTV and time-shifting support.
I wish these open source projects would pool their efforts - I hate to see duplication of effort between Myth TV and Freevo.
My rights don't need management.
TiVo only works (well, the guide part & therefore most of its nice stuff) within the USA. I lived in Canada - not good enough, had to build my own ATi AiW setup. Now I live in Australia, and I can't even do that. DigiGuide, here I come.
Homebrew solutions are still the only solution for most of the world's population
Why would anyone engrave "Elbereth"?
He's also probably lying.
Please explain how [cracking the case of a TiVo machine and swapping drives] is more challenging than building an entire machine, hard drive and all, to host one of the opensource solutions?
For one thing, you have to crack the case. I haven't used a TiVo machine before, but I'd assume that "cracking the case" refers to something along the lines of what had to be done to open some old Macintosh computers. A fellow needed a Torx screwdriver with an 8 inch handle, as well as a special tool to pinch the sides of the case to release the clips that hold the face on.
A Dell[1] PC, on the other hand, can be opened with a twist of a thumbscrew on the case.
[1] I picked a name.
Will I retire or break 10K?
I'm running an old P2-300 in my entertainment cabinet dedicated to tv-in and out. The video capture I use is a Dazzle DVC1 (a mediocre but passable MPEG1 encoder for its time) set to the vcd standard bitrate. For automation I'm using AutoMouse in combination with the original Dazzle software and MS Task Scheduler; The scheduled Automouse macros take care of starting the recorder and setting the appropriate length of each recording.
For channel changing, I have my vcr timer set to record one minute of the desired channel, leaving it there for the duration of the shows. This method requires a sacrificial but infitely reusable vhs tape (and a vcr that stays on a channel after timer recordings).
It's not an elegant pvr setup by any means, but it has served me well since 99.
Not bad video from the EyeTV. its straight to MPEG-1, so you have to edit it in the EyeTV app, and its about 650MB per hour. Equivalent to VHS quality (LP). And the VCDs that you can burn w/ Toast play in almost any recent DVD player and honestly don't look too bad. I put some South Parks on a VCD and took them to my mom's house and her big ass 40" HDTV, and to be honest it didn't look or sound all that bad. I mean, we're not talking DVD by any standard, but definitely worthwhile.
Plus I can put my 4 favorite zombie flix on one data DVD.
Look at it this way. If you're a television fan, the world is full of opportunities to experience and talk about television. Imagine trying /not/ to be exposed to television and realizing television was leaking out of the human beings around you? You'd assume people were becoming saturated with the television-information. And if people were saturated with a thing, you might be curious what that information was composed of and where came from. The information is garbage and it comes from people who have a vested interest in devising ways to control your behavior.
Kind of like choosing to walk around in dogshit and wondering why people sometimes look at you with horror and disgust.
This is what you're seeing here.
That's weird, I thought the "Ask Slashdot" thing sorta implied that they wanted feedback from people who had built home-grown Tivo's. At least that's the impression that I got.
And you know what? I have spent a bunch and put a lot of time and effort into it.
It was fun.
And worth every minute and penny because I like to make things. What I don't like to do, however, is derive self-worth from posting silly oppositional-defiant things on the internet just to facelessly attempt to demean a stranger.
"I'm too cheap to purchase an awesome product from a company that needs consumers, so how can I build my own [insert product here]?"
TiVo service is not available in all developed countries. Do you call an estimated $200,000+ to relocate your family to the United States "too cheap"? Building a set-top PC is much cheaper than $200,000.
Will I retire or break 10K?
Sounds cool, actually. I put a little bit more $ into it for the premium of using Mac hardware, but I really wanted OS X driving my entertainment center. I find it far more functional and flexible than XP Media Edition, and with Konfabulator, anything is possible :)
I haven't tried Tivo personally. With the money I spent I could have, I'm sure, but hey, I'm a project kinda guy.
I think I failed to mention that I painted it gloss black with silver metallic highlights. crappy paint job, but oh well.
head -1 /dev/urandom | cut -b -120 > ~/.sig
dd if=/dev/urandom of=$HOME/.sig bs=120 count=1
Now you don't have to worry about embedded newlines.
I wish that company (atechfabrication) made a nice little mini-itx case ... looks like a sturdy box for a car media / blackbox / gps-map do-everything machine.
:)
$350 is a lot of money for a case; if I were a millionaire, one of those would be in my underground lair
jrnl: http://tinyurl.com/c2l8yr / foes: http://tinyurl.com/ckjno5
I would recommend heading over to the avsforum.com Those guys have done just about everything you could think of when it comes to intergrating a computer into your home theater setup.
MooCow
I agree, if all you want to do is record tv shows and you live in the U.S. that tivo is the way to go. But can't you also use homegrown set-top boxes to do things like play PlayStation games? I know there was a play station emulator, is there one for PS2 yet? Because if my set-top box could not only record T.V. shows, but play DVD's and PS2 and X-Box games, etc! Now I am starting to think I want one too!
jesus fucking christ, like we give a shit about your computer.
i have a 3 year old pos computer (it was bottom of the line when i assembled it back then), but you don't see me wasting tons of money on a new one and posting the specs for everyone to admire, now do you? and you know why? because i'm comfortable with my penis size. i suggest you consider some therapy for your issues.
joe_b
Disclaimer: I have not created a "homebrew" TiVO.
Now, having said that I would like to point you to this link, where you can find a nifty linux project. Let me know if it works for you!
To know is to have knowledge....to understand is to be enlightened.
Is there any hope for a digital cable tuner card? Yeah, I know I can probably control my digital cable box, but then I'd also have to watch what I'm recording, and thats no fun. Itd also be nice to be able to save the video streams directly... And yeah, TiVos might be cheap in comparison. But I hate paying a monthly fee for stuff I can do for free. I'd also rather be able to use the stuff I record. I'd also like to play DVDs with the same box. I'd like to be able to play music with the same box. You can add those features to a PC for very cheap - or free if you already have the hardware for capturing and playing video. With TiVo, youre stuck with what you get - and thats only recording and playing. Might as well train a chimp to use your VCR for you.
I am really surprised that no one has mentioned Windows XP Media Center. It has one thing that many other apps lack, the easy User Interface. http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/mediacenter/
Right now you still have to buy Media Center box from a vendor like HP, but the OS is already on the filesharing networks and someone release a hack to any XP Pro machine to turn it into a Media Center. (Its on sharereactor.com - an emule network)
I am putting together a high end entertainment system for my non-technical Dad and this seemed to make the most sense.
Also, Anandtech did a nice review: http://www.anandtech.com/showdoc.html?i=1766
I paid 49.99 for my hughes direct tv receiver. Can't see how what your doing is even worth it.
Good commercial detection requires a living human brain. Since you can usually count on one of these during TV viewing, why not use it?
Have a button, that a person presses on the remote, as soon as they see a commercial. Then the Tivo/whatever checks backwards until it finds the blank frame, and cuts from there, until it sees the next blank frame. Also, have it find the first recognizable video frame of the commercial, and store some sort of hash. This could be used to compare from, and you could deduce which blank frames mean the beginning of a commercial, and which mean the beginning of a show.
Sure, you have to see the first 1.2 seconds of a commercial, but only once ever. Might even distribute the hashes in some internet database and help out the neighbors.
This is currently one of the methods I use. Great new 3.0 fullscreen interface and a web base interface. Serial control of a DSS box with IRBlaster control too. The 3.0 version is still in beta but there is a free upgrade to it after it is released. You can even record shows to put on or stream to your PocketPC
Get a ReplayTV and DVArchive. You use the ReplayTV to schedule and record your shows and DVArchive to backup the shows and watch them in other locations. You can also watch shows on the ReplayTV from the DVArchive machine (or multiple DVArchive machines).
DVArchive can be set up to automatically download the shows from the ReplayTV. I haven't looked into whether MythTV supports DVArchive though.
P.S. Someone was asking about regular cable and Satellite. The ReplayTV has two inputs (although you can only record one show at a time) so I have one setup for my Dish Network box and the other for my local cable. The ReplayTV grabs both guides and unifies them for viewing and recording.
What, me worry?
So,
There's all these postings saying "just get a Tivo". What would be the best route for an Aussie ? Remember, we have PAL here, not NTSC, and I doubt there's a subscription service.
Is it possible to use a Tivo from the UK in Australia ?
I built a system up for exactly this purpose - DVD playback, MP3, TV tuning, Cable-TV tuning, digital VCR, etc. I wasn't happy with the typical DVD player's support for less "mainstream" formats either (such as DivX, MPEG4, SVCD, etc), so I was pretty motivated to find a better solution.
In the end I gave up on the TV tuning part of the project. I ended up with a dead-silent machine that can play almost any sound or video codec with perfect quality, but could not find a decent solution to the TV tuning functionality.
Quality was my first real problem with the TV signal. Even the software supplied with the Leadtek TV-2000XP resulted in lousy picture quality. The UI was awful too! I didn't want a monitor, so I was depending heavily on my TV out support.
The second problem was that the UI was never really intended to be used as a VCR replacement. It's like nobody ever seriously considered that I didn't want a keyboard or mouse (just a remote).
Finally, drivers were buggy, crashes were frequent, and I gave up.
On the other hand, I now have the best DVD player on the market. Picture quality is better than any commercially available DVD player. The digital audio output supports standards that my amp can't begin to decode (Dolby Digital 7.1 is a little too advanced for my amp).
My advice to anybody trying this sort of project is to focus on the achievable first - TV tuning is not yet mature enough to be a viable option.
Buy yourself a Realmagic X-Card, a copy of JovePlayer (easily the best DVD player application in the world, but requires the X-Card), and build the machine. Then look at extending the functionality as the software/hardware matures.
Lurgen.
The most important bits...
RealMagic X-Card
Jove Player
Zalman CNPS-6000Cu (silence is golden)
Seagate 60GB hard disk (nice and quiet)
I've been using MythTV for a few months and love it. I can't believe how well it works and how fast it's growing new features. The dev list is thriving and fun to follow. It works so well my non-techie wife even uses it without my help.
I reflect your pompous signature back upon you.
You should have seen what I used to have: the same TV and receiver and an old Thinkpad running XMMS with a patch cable going from the headphone jack to the aux speaker-in on the receiver. We didn't save video; we had to remember when to be home. :-)
I haven't tried Tivo personally. With the money I spent I could have, I'm sure, but hey, I'm a project kinda guy.
Yeah, I hear ya. I'm the same way. Problem is, I have more projects than I can reasonably be expected to finish in my lifetime. It was time to cut down. And the wife wanted a PVR-type thing. So TiVo it was.
I think I failed to mention that I painted it gloss black with silver metallic highlights. crappy paint job, but oh well.
Well now you're talking. :-)
I had this idea for using one of those Shuttle XPC form factor mini PCs as the basis for an entertainment center, and then Alienware came out with one. It runs XP Media Center Edition, which is a deal breaker in and of itself (never mind the cost; those XPC cases are like $150 so I have no idea how they can get away with selling their low-end unit for $1,700). It's just as well since my wife would have niether waited for me to get off my ass and build something or wanted me to spend the money for an Alienware box.
Another idea I had for a project was an in-dash audio player that would stream MP3s to my truck's stereo. It would be based on a Linux PC (the guts out of a laptop), aand have 802.11b connectivity. I was going to write scripts that would detect when the truck was in range of my home network and then rsync all the music files it didn't have and go on standby. I was going to use an old palm pilot as the display/remote. Then I saw that these guys made a unit called an Empeg that did almost exactly what I wanted. I shelved my projet and decided to buy an Empeg. Except the soon-to-be-released Wersion 2 was going to have a PCMCIA slot (which meant an Orinoco card could slide right in there) so I waited. Then SONICblue, those no-talent assmonkeys, bought Empeg out and killed the in-dash unit. I've since given away the laptop which was the basis for my original idea.
I don't know what the moral of those two stories is. Carpe Diem? Scratch your itches? Do what makes you happy? Dunno...
-B
Ash and Hickory, straight-grained and true, make excellent bludgeons, dandy for the cudgeling of vegetarians.
In responce to the many "Just buy a Tivo" posts. Here is why I won't but a Tivo:
It is a closed system in which Tivo Inc dictates what I can do with it not me. For example I can't transfer shows over the network onto my computer, something which they were probably never allow due to MPAA and the like pressure. You can hack it do what you want to a certain extent, however the legality is questionable. Furthermore, it seams that Tivo Inc can even instruct it to record a show, without the users consent, as it did for BBC in Britan.
I want an open system in which I can control and add software to, legally.
Yeah, I know. My old .sig was dd used exactly like you say. I saw it everwhere so I switched to something 'different' (but under 120 characters itself). And I had a version that used cat, but it wasn't nearly as 1337 as head.
I only care as long as I get something. Or maybe even not. I could handle having just a newline as a .sig...
-B
Ash and Hickory, straight-grained and true, make excellent bludgeons, dandy for the cudgeling of vegetarians.
Do any programming guides have full support for DirecTV, yet? Everything I read indicates there are still issues on the completeness (specifically pay-per-view). I have a DirecTiVo & LOVE it but I'm looking to the future when I may consider upgrading.
Does anyone have this working?
Licences are $1000 and you save time, money and effort. Even the geek effect isn't worth it this time.
Spend the money and help a company
I'm not saying Tivo is evil. But I'm sure you get my point. Besides. Not all of us live in the USA.
I also live in Canada - TiVo isn't _officially_ supported here, although I run my TiVo with local guide listings, current time zone and current listings. I support it using xmltv and assistance from a bunch of people on the Internet, along with a couple of perl/tcl scripts (although some people are using VB for their guide downloads.).
For me I think I spent $300 + shipping + $ for new drives, but that's it, and I've been running it for ~1yr now.
Sadly it doesn't have HDTV, but I haven't been able to determine if any of the HD tuners out there will take component input anyways... (there is no over the air HDTV channels that I know of in my area)
Really I love my TiVo, I couldn't build a comparable machine for a comparable price at the time.
(We don't help any people from TiVo supported countries with getting the service for free, so don't bother asking)
Few things
1) TiVo is not a DVD Player
2) TiVo is not an MP3 Player (from disk)
3) TiVo can not play DivX movies (from disk)
4) TiVo is not an Ogg Player (from disk)
Lets add the price of TiVo, with a DVD player that is quality (can play the DivX movies as well) Plus the 1year subscription cost to TiVo's service. Hmm.. It might still be cheaper to buy the DVD player and TiVo, but then thats all you have. You cant go and play new media types that pop up. Additionally you can have your extra computer do some extra number crunching (digital conversion, seti, you name it) in the free time.
Here is what I built, and its working great for me:
AMD 2200+ Athlon chip
256 Megs DDR
ATI Radeon AIW 7500.
Windows 2K.
I tried running this under Windows XP, but if I moved the mouse during captuer I lost frames (windows XP was not working for me). Windows 2K works great with ATI's software. I'm able to capture sVCD Quality directly with ATI's newest Media Center (Note, the Media Center that came with the product, 7.5, blows, must upgrade).
I went Windows 2K only because the Capture drivers arent there for Linux yet, only view.
I can also do TV-On Demand (Pause Live tv, rewind, etc).
Go out and buy a Tivo. Use it for six months and make notes about it's features. Write down what you like and what you think could be implemented better. Then in your design, implement the features you want and improve on the ones you think could be better.
I have snapstream version 2 and run it on a 800Mhz box for recording. The box is hooked up to the network and streams shows to my clients in the house even while recording.
I am a beta tester of version 3 which is very close to coming out. Version 3 has a full screen interface plus it will do all the web server stuff that version 2 will do. Although the full screen interface requires a little bit of a faster machine it's a clean / quick interface with lots of features. Check it out!
I had a stand alone tivo with upgraded disk & lifetime subscription... that killed all my 'home brew' urges. but now i have a sony sat-t60 (direct-tivo)... again with upgraded disk space. major benefits: better mpeg encoding than the regular tivo hardware, RECORD TWO CHANELS AT ONCE (can't speak enough about that feature... it's like mainlining tv) and now that DirecTV sells the service it's only 5$/month! (personally that sucks for me since I bought the lifetime). Anyways, at a 5$/month price point it's a no-brainer for anyone who's sampled it's usefullness... and record 2 at once is another killer feature (try that with a home brew & 1 box recording 2 hbo movies at the same time). I'm all for open source and freevo & mythtv are excellent projects... but a $5/month I'll stick to recording gilmore girls & buffy at the same time - X.
You may be able to get away with just setting up an IR interface on your computer to command the Digital cable box or satellite receiver or whatnot. Then, connect the receiver to some kind of TV card (Bt878-based cards work very well, and are linux supported). You might be able to set something up with an IR diode connected to some kid of IR encoder- I have seen something like this over at rentron.com, or you can build your own using any kind of cheap microprocessor platrorm (any parallax chip, 8051, even gameboy will work).
I own a Tivo and 2 ReplayTvs They are great Machines. About a Year and a half ago I moved to Thailand and had to come up with a PC based alternative. I Found that most programs out there were very light on features except Showshifter. Showshifter works an ir Blaster (RedRat) to control my Sat Box. It recompresses my shows to divx after it records them (there are other formats to choose from). The best part was I built everything using 3 year old parts (except for the RedRat) that I had lying around (PIII667, ATi AIW). Total cost 70$.
SM
Actually, freevo has a main page. http://www.freevo.org . while I haven't installed it yet, I want to mod an xbox and see if there's anyway in hell that I can get a tv capture card on using either a pci slot, or modified usb. If that doesn't work, and it probably won't, I'll just get an old athlon, cheap mobo, etc. and build my own system.
The "authorized" service center is selling refurbished Tivos with a 90 day warranty:
HDR112 14 hours $90
HDR212 20 hours $100
HDR312 30 hours $130
HDR612 60 hours $150
I was selected to participate in a special "Buy an Additional TiVo" offer. I was so selected, they sent me three emails!
I use the Creative digital VCR. It is super solid on my AMD 1.4, 512 ram, 120GB, and win2k. It has a scheduler, no guide though. I love it it does MPEG-2 encoding on the fly. only uses 26% of CPU when on full screen. and 3% for standby mode, even while recording! I really like it and it is worth the $80 you can find it for.
One of the big factors affecting the success of a home-made Tivo-like device is your choice of video capture/tuner card.
I've done the research and produced a project website for a digital PVR project which tested both dumb and smart capture cards.
Unfortunately there's no clear winner and such a comparison goes to show that life is always full of compromises.
However, after many months, I have to say that I've grown accustomed to the power and convenience of a smart tuner/capture card with onboard MPEG encoding.
The Hauppauge PVR250/350 are just brilliant if you want to use your PC like a VCR. There's a review and comparison with the Pinnacle PCTVpro card on my site.
I was going to (and still will a little later) explore all the Linux and open source options for a PVR but the reality was (last time I looked), many of these projects are very much in their infancy and are hardly a "turnkey" solution to matching a Tivo.
The most promising I've seen is the Linux Video Disk Recorder
I especially like the idea of installing multiple MPEG cards to record multiple channels at the same time.
Ruby on Rails Screencast
thedbp:
I think I saw your post over in the other tivo thread, but I've still not figured out if that EyeTV thing can change the channel on a cable box, and you don't list that in the setup there.
From the Hacking the Tivo FAQ , here are several programs for windows.
Ligos: Windows based PTV.
PowerVCR: Windows based VCR.
WinVCR: Windows based VCR.
SnapStream: Windows based PTV (freeware and commercial version).
ShowShifter: Windows based PTV (freeware).
VideoLAN is an open source, multi OS video streaming program.
When I signed up for Dish Network service, it was an extra $25 to upgrade my equipment (which was free, with a $50 istalation fee and 1 year contract for $37/month) to the PVR version, which has 40 hours of recording, requires no additional monthly feem uses the built-in guide from the Dish (duh), and all around rocks.
It was a bit unstable at first, but they've since upgraded it and actually added some good features (like slo-mo) without taking anything away. So, it was basically a total one-time cost of $75.
It's cell phones only at my house. I know I can use a wireless USB adapter with a series 2 TiVO, but...
the fine print says I'll still need a phone line to do the initial setup call.
Anyone know if I can use the USB network adapter and the right dialing prefix (,#401 I think) even for the initial setup? I'll probably build my own MythTV box if I can't get by without a phone line. The geek factor is appealing, too, but with non-techies in the house having to use the PVR too, it'd be nice to have something that Just Works.
...a market economy is the only way that you sustain a high enough average level of wealth that we can afford to be arti
Software wise, MythTV is by far the best solution atm, although Freevo is coming along.
Open Source PVR Hardware Database
Or for those stuck on windows, www.myhtpc.net. It's easy fast and works great with all your MSWin(tm) hardware. I use it with an Athlon 800 on Win98SE with an IrMan from evation.com and it runs everything i throw at it just fine. It even has Project64 integrated into it, so i can just use my remote to start my N64 games. Great picture viewing options too, metadata support so you can add info to movies and music, and xmltv support. All without the hassle of a linux setup.
Why haven't television stations started broadcasting thier schedules on the verticle blank interupt? (black lines around the edge of the tv screen) I remember wayy back with win98 they had some bundled app that got limited internet content via the VBI and a capture card, why not a TV schedule?
I'm only mentioning this because of all the "I paid $250 for my tivo lifetime subsciption" comments. VBI schedules seem like a win for everybody.
And not getting the "quality" of TiVo subscription service is exactly what I want.
I got TiVo when they where still advertizing their product and promoting the "Season Pass" feature as something you set and don't have to worry about, the TiVo will automatically record the season even if their is scheduling changes. The reality is, if there is a hick-up in the TiVo subscription service then the TiVo might just automatically delete the season pass in mid-season. I had a season pass for Buffy on Chicago's WGN channel 9 be deleted four times until I sold off the TiVo crap machine. Each time I called support to complain they gave me the run around:
Me: Why does this keep happening?
TiVo "support": What is your cable company? They must have notified us that you aren't getting the WGN line-up through your cable any more.
Me: I'm using standard antenna.
TiVo "support": Huh?
Me: Rabbit ears. Over the air free broadcast. Standard antenna. No cable service.
TiVo "support": Oh, then our guide data supplier must have thought that the channel went off-air. You know that TV channels come and go, right?
Me: Who is your guide data supplier?
TiVo "support": Zap2It
Me: So, your telling me that Zap2It, a Chicago Tribune affilated company had throught that Chicago WGN channel 9, another Chicago Tribune affilated company had gone off-air?
TiVo "support": This will have to answered by a line-up specialist.
Me: Can you have one get in touch with me?
My voice mail later had a message that the specialist could see that the line-up data was working again and to call if I had any further questions. I called back and left a message asking what was being done to keep the problem which had occured three times already from happening again. While the "specialist" never called back, I got my answer a week later when the season pass/line-up deleted for the forth time.
ANYTHING is better than the TiVo rip off for "Nature of Television disclaimer-ed" program guide "data" or the lack of data.
And how to ensure that my season passes aren't auto-deleted again by TiVo wasn't answered in their "You ask, we answer" segment. Should have been "You ask, we blow you off (or scape-goat on Zap2It)."
Btw, another feature advertized at the time I got my TiVo was that the TiVo would continue to improve for free through software updates without anything additional having to be done by the TiVo owner than plugging in the phone line. Home Media Option sounds like a software update. Getting the USB ethernet adapter is listed as an **seprate** pre-request to getting HMO. They aren't billing for the hardware for HMO so they must be billing for the software update. So... lets see:
Advertized claim: Season Passes will record an entire season of programs regardless of scheduling changes.
Actual truth: TiVo reserves the right under the "Nature of Television disclaimer" for the Season Pass to be auto-deleted in the middle of the season.
Advertized claim: Software updates are free with nothing additional required of the TiVo owner.
Actual truth: TiVo charges $100 plus $50 for each additional TiVo.
At what point does TiVo become guilty of fraud?
And all TiVo has done is *REDUCE* a computer to a PVR. Several things that can be quickly and easily done has been artifically excluded from TiVo. For example, in addition to getting guide data, it would make sense for TiVo to provide offline web browsing. Even a cheap old Palm III running Avantgo or a cheap alpha pager makes it easier to get the weather or sport scores than a TiVo does. And while the TiVo requires your zip code as part of activating your service, to get the weather, you still need to record it. And think about the possiblities on a networked PVR that have been artifically put aside by TiVo HMO. A TiVo will send/recieve mpeg streams from another TiVo but not to any other computer? Why shouldn't I be able to stream a VCD through my PVR as easily as an audio MP3 or view a JPG? As a customer, do I really get to decide where the line is drawn in the sand as to what my PVR can do?
In reply to your first comment, remember that the Tivo is pretty much only available in the US (and Canada?), so for many people it's just not an option.
Also, if you wanted to make all those points about it being better than the sum of its parts, why didn't you say so? You might have got moderated up. As it was your post added nothing to the debate and was quite rightly moderated down.
Just buy the Tivo. Take the money that you would have poured into building the PC and buy another hard drive for the Tivo. On a slightly related note, does anyone know of software to control a DSS receiver? I know this must be possible because I've been the first Tivo's were plugged into a DSS receiver and could change channels (though it was laggy).
What's life? Life's easy. A quirk of matter. Nature's way of keeping meat fresh.
Check out Freevix - http://www.freevix.org/ It is a mini distro designed for this. It's goal is to create a flash bootable linux running freevo. Check it out - it's a cracking piece of work!
I've got life time subscriptions on both of my Tivos and they have already paid for themselves in the savings I get by not having a monthly fee. ReplayTV has a subscription fee but it is lifetime and built into the cost of the machine. The thing I've been mulling over lately is hardware emulation of the Tivo. At some point I will have a hard time finding replacement parts for my Tivos, drives do die. If I could emulate the hardware I could use whatever the latest storage technology is and not have to worry about losing my lifetime subscription. Also this way if the company ever goes out of business I can still use their UI which I find most pleasing.
... and you can no longer buy Tivos in the UK.
I'm not sure you can even register for a new subscription any more, which would not bode well for buying one off ebay...
I have a tivo and a homebrew using freevo. Once upon a time I was going to just DIY a PVR but as people are saying the tivo is a great product at a better price.
So why the homebrew? DVD playback and ripping to hd. CD quality audio from hd (media server one day). 24 bit archiving of my vinyl collrction. The homebrew is more than a tivo and if I ever get around to sorting out tivonet they will make perrferct partners.
Now one day opensource pvr software may eclipse tivo and I'll be ready for that too
Of course cheap its not.
Mark
encode to mpeg-2 and you won't have an issue. the vcd's turn out really nice, and the free software is getting really advanced. chapters, etc. divx is a hack for computers; mpeg-2 is a standard for video.
I've tried a few windows solutions before I jump into Linux/MythTV and I'm not going back nor considering any TIVO/ReplyTV stuff. It works like a charm and has more features than anybody else. In a few months It might even have DVB suppor, plus the current Analog support. I don't know if somebody mention but it has a website where you can remotly control the box (like snapstream) but at the same time it has real front end that makes you feel better than a TIVO owner! The final proof for me was my wife. She can't live without Myth now. I had to put together a different box in order to continue experimenting becasue that one can't be down, or else... By the way Myth doesn't re-record programs already pre-recorded, it has a beautifull skip-commercials feature (and the 30 secons jump, of course), 2 tunner capability (that works great, but need horsepower), DirectTV support (that I'm using and works really good), and it is an endless platform of possibilities for tweekers and the like. If you only install 1 tunner a Duron 1.3Ghz is enough (that's my experimental rig). If you go to two, you need 1.8Ghz (or an AMD PR of at least 1800). Maybe is not the best PVR project right now...but by version 1.0 it will be...and all free and open. You got to love it! P.S.: This is my first "serious" or practical application that I put together with Linux and it was a perfect excuse to learn a lot!
I want to rip shows and burn them to permanent storage on VCDs or DVDs or something. I want to wait till the end of the season, then take a Saturday to play disk swap and make a complete season set of all my favorite shows. I might even want to make excerpts or bring the digital movie files to other locations or loan to friends.
Of course, at the moment, I don't think "roll-your-own" meets my needs, either. Not reliable enough, and nowhere near turnkey enough for me. I love programming but I want to rely on a tested and true solution for all this rather than fixing all the bugs myself and debugging my hardware.
So, I'll wait, and leech off of other people's efforts when the time comes.
Secession is the right of all sentient beings.
In the slightly-less-extreme category, there are those of us who buy old cars and keep them running. I own a 10+ year old Audi that with a few hundred dollars in modifications has 280hp, all wheel drive, 5-speed(these are getting rarer and rarer-dammit, I don't WANT an automatic!) an ENORMOUS amount of interior space and trunk space, gets about 22-24mpg highway, weighs 3600lb(that's VERY light compared to cars its size today- full-size luxury cars nowadays tip the scale at well over 4,000lb- often much more!) It looks like "some old Audi"(nobody will ever steal it.) I get to blow the doors off most everything save the cream of the crop of sports cars.
I know what you mean about them not making the car I want. I don't even know if you can get cars without power everything, and cloth seats anymore. I am all for advancing technology, but don't force it on us.
Heh, that must be one of those Audis that got spanked by the M3. Of course, EVERYONE got spanked by the M3 in the late 80s early 90s. :-) I own a 1988 M3 and I definitely know what you are talking about. The only things you have on me are HP and AWD, and if I had the $$ I could match you on the HP.
I know what you mean about the posers. It was very satisfying to pass a 911 on the track, and to have the guy in the NSX go off track twice trying to catch me. Of course, if we were at a bigger track, like Road America, they would have blown by me on the straights, but this was at Gingerman. You have to watch out for some of those P cars though, if you can afford one and learn how to drive it, they are pretty top-notch. Of course, if I could afford a new 911, I'd rather get a couple E30 M3s instead.
My beliefs do not require that you agree with them.
Sheesh. For $250 you can get the Hughes combination DirecTV/TIVO box. You'll probably spend more to build your own. Just get the Hughes.
Here in Europe we have "teletext", which is a set of pages broadcast by most stations with all kinds of content, including program schedules, in color and rudimentary graphics with hypertext-like links between the pages. A sort of world wide web avant la lettre. All modern TVs over here have built-in support for viewing and navigating these pages.
It also has the latest news, traffic info, the weather forecast, entertainment info, subtitles, you name it. I've always wondered why this has never been introduced in the States, I think it would have been very succesful. We've had it for a long time (at least fifteen years, probably longer).
Give it a rest pudknocker
Will any of the PVRs interface to my antenna rotor? I receive signals off the air from 5 cities. No cable for me. Will the Tivo, Replay, Freevo, or MythTV interface to my rotor to optimize the reception for a given channel? Alternatively, assuming that I install multiple antennas, will any of the PVRs select from among multiple coaxial cable feeds?
NMM
"Hello, World", 17 errors, 31 warnings
something that hasn't quite come out yet but is due out any day (I'm in their beta program so I've seen the latest version -- released last week) is SnapStream's Personal Video Station 3.
3 _s creenshots.asp
so it does the full-screen interface and it also natively supports several different PC-based remote controls (StreamZap, ATi Remote Wonder). they recently announced that they won't be charging a subscription fee for their TV listings in the U.S. (you download 2 weeks worth of TV listings and can browse they locally, offline in the full-screen user interface).
the program guide lets you record once, record always or record only first-runs of a particular program. the full-screen program guide doesn't have search capabilities but otherwise, you can do everything you'd want to be able to do.
SnapStream's Personal Video Station 3 also records shows in MPEG-2 or Windows Media. it has "trickplay" which means that while you are watching live TV or recorded TV you can pause, rewind, or fast-forward through your programs.
The interface is also really nice looking, very clean... you can see screenshots of version 3 here:
http://www.snapstream.com/Products/Products_PVS
It hasn't been released yet, but it will soon... so anyways, it's definitely one to keep an eye out for.
Alright I resisted posting for a while but seeing all these people posting $650+ solutions I had to.
i splay.php?s= &forumid=26
Here's what I got:
1. VIA Mini-ITX EPIA 8000... $99
2. 128 MB PC133 RAM... $20
3. 20GB WD HDD... $69
4. Hauppage TV Tuner card... $129
5. Cupid case (looks like a home theatre component)... $60
6. Laptop DVD Drive w/ converter... $60
7. Windows XP Media Center Edition... free (MSDN Universal)
Total: $437
I could've built it using free software, I just chose not to. If a professionally built and supported piece of software is available free to you, why go with a beta?
If you're going for JUST Tivo functionality, you can leave off the DVD Drive and save some cash. Oh, and the more recent Cupid cases have a flash connector built in... so you can view media on CF cards and the like...
My ONLY caveat to the whole thing is that the Quicktime movie format relies on good floating-point support... so Quicktime movies are practically unwatchable. (I got a framerate of 3-5 fps on the first two episodes of animatrix)
DivX, DVD, MP3, and most other media formats I've tried have been great.
BTW, Off-Topic, but did anyone else notice that the chronologically first two posts rated at 5 were posted by users with uids only 5 apart?
Read avs forums (Score:5, Informative)
by scootr1 (159749) on Monday April 21, @06:49PM (#5776658)
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/forumd
My setup (Score:5, Informative)
by Kallahar (227430) on Monday April 21, @06:50PM (#5776663)
(http://quickwired.com/)
I am disrespectful to dirt! Can you see that I am serious?!
Or a woman.
The tivo guide is great when it's working. But when it doesn't it appears they don't have the ability to do anything about it.
I had a similar experience with the Lineup people.
My cable provider added some channels to my system and getting tivo to acknowledge that they were there was like pulling teeth. They wanted me to fax over a copy of the lineup. As if that would provide more proof than me telling them. After about a week of me calling they either figured it out or simply added it to keep me from calling them.
I have a simple solution with a standard DishNetwork receiver and an ATI All-In-Wonder Radeon video card. I run the receiver's S-video output to the ATI's S-video input, and the audio output to my sound card. I can use the ATI's video capture to record MPEG-2 720 X 480 and 48 kHz 16 bit-stereo with 5.1 surround encoding intact at a rate of 8MB/second or 28.8 GB per hour. I have to set the satellite receiver to record at the same time as the ATI Scheduler, so the receiver turns itself on and changes to the proper channel and the hard drive starts filling up with video. Since the receiver gets it's time from the satellite, and Windows XP gets it's time off the internet, they are always synced to within a couple of seconds. To play I use the ATI's S-video output to feed a 32-inch TV, but the quality is good enough that it could be burned to a video CD or a DVD. I now have Windows XP running on a AMD Athlon 1800+ XP with 512 MB RAM, but I ran the same basic setup starting 3 years ago with a Pentium 1 running Win98 with 64MB RAM and an All-In-Wonder 128.
I don't know if this is relevant to you, but i just finished biulding such a system. The big thing that you need to worry about is hard disk bandwith, and I/O functionality. This is the specs of the system that i just biult;
-iWill MPX2
-2x AMD Athlon XP 1.73GHz (2100+)
-1gb registerd pc2100 (2x512mb)
-ATI all-in-wonder Radeon 9000 (not doing gameing, and this is a good card for the money)
-Promise sx4000 32bit/66MHz PCI RAID w/256mb cache
-2x 80gb 8mb cache WD hard drives (RAID 0)
-2x 100gb 2mb cache WD hard drives (RAID 0)
-1x 80gb 2mb WD hard drive (boot drive)
-430w antec power supply
For recording live TV, and for what i'm doing (backing up my whole DVD collection, and video editing), you CANNOT have enough hard drive I/O, which is where that great RAID controller and large RAID arrays come in useful. I often find myself recording live TV, ripping a movie, and watching a previoulsy ripped movie all at the same time. Dual-procs are also a god send for this application, and a dual-athlon machine can be biuld for cheap, you can use two XP procs insted of MPs, just short the L5 bridge.
What you basicly need: Fast hard drives (preferably in RAID 0, a basic PCI RAID controller is less then $60), LOTS of ram, a TV tuner (the AIW radons are great, lots of software and a kick-ass remote) and dual-procs are nice, if you want to go that route.