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The Technology Behind Formula One

axlrosen writes "An article in the NY Times about the technology behind Formula One. The wealthiest teams arm themselves with powerful advantages, almost entirely centering on computing controls in the cars and computer simulation in design. Car data is sent in multi-megabyte wireless bursts each time the team's cars flash past the pits, often in excess of 200 miles an hour. It is simultaneously sent over the Internet to a larger data center in Maranello, Italy, where more complex analysis is done. AMD is expected to supply a supercomputer roughly as fast as the world's 10th most powerful machine to the Swiss-based Sauber Petronas racing team... I love the crazy steering wheel - anyone know what all those buttons and knobs do?"

586 comments

  1. Background article by ralphb · · Score: 5, Informative

    HowStuffWorks has got an interesting article on CART (not F1, but similar) cars at here. It mentions some of the sensing, telemetry, and computing technology used. There's even an explanation of the controls on that crazy steering wheel.

    1. Re:Background article by WarriorPoet42 · · Score: 3, Funny

      From the article: "You can run a small country on $2.8 billion and still get change,"

      Can I get that in small bills, please?

    2. Re:Background article by kwiqsilver · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I was just about to post that...
      What makes champ car really cool is the in-car camera with all the useful info (like accel/brake pressure, rpms, speed, etc) when they show champ car racing on HDNet. It looks like the replay mode in GranTurismo 3, but in HDTV.

    3. Re:Background article by xp · · Score: 2, Funny

      From the article: Each team has at least one member affectionately known as the DAG -- the Data Analysis Geek -- whose specific role is to pore over the reams of data a car produces during a practice run or a race and help the team use that data to maximize the car's performance.

      Nice job. You can call me Mr. DAG.

      ----
      Your Boss Might Be A Muppet

    4. Re:Background article by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

      CART and Formula 1 are only similar in looks. If you know the details they are as different as night and day.

      Pneumatic valves vs. valve springs, composite materials vs. non, and the list goes on and on.

      However, the rising costs of F1 are making teams reign costs in by banning some of the more exotic stuff ... like depleted uranium crankshafts!

      The proof is in the pudding as they say, compare budgets:

      Formula 1 - $350 million dollars a year for a top competitive team

      CART - $50 million dollars a year

    5. Re:Background article by abhisarda · · Score: 4, Informative

      Some more stuff-

      Sky Sports(UK) has a race day program(1 hour) before every formula1 race starts. Once every 2-3 races, they examine the technical aspects of formula1 racing. The steering wheel is discussed twice during the racing year.
      The steering wheel costs more than your average luxury sedan. For this 2004 season, FIA made manual shifting mandatory but the top teams still manage to work their way around it and have part of it computer controlled.

      About sponsorships, formula1 car workings, upto date news- see BBC Formula1 Many articles on the RHS.
      For those who don't get Speed Channel, you can follow live timing(and a lot more) and unbiased commentary on the formula1.com website.
      If you are a car collector, you can buy actual parts of the BAR forumla1 car from the pure racing club at BAR(flash).
      Also take a look at its quarterly magazine( its nice).
      I hven't read the article yet but there is a lot of money sloshing around in F1. Ferrari alone spends 500 million$ a year(and this was 2 years back). BMW vaulted to one of the top teams because they put some of their best engineers and spent a buttload of money(350 million+) initializing the team.
      Even Minardi which is the poorest team in f1 spends as much or more than the top Indy racing teams.
      During 2000-2002 there was a lot of controversy regarding sale of global tv rights to Kirch(German media company). A lot of F1 teams threatened to form a new series of their own from 2008. The threats aren't so loud now but the issue still simmers.

    6. Re:Background article by Black+Rabbit · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Keep in mind, though, Formula one is cutting edge in other ways.

      Just look at the drivers listings.

      CART is full of:

      a) people on their way to F1
      b) people retired from F1 (Mario Andretti, Emerson Fittipaldi)
      c) people who couldn't make it in F1 (Michael Andretti, Alex Zanardi)

      If I remember correctly, the year that Andretti Jr. and then-F1 champ Nigel Mansell switched places, Andretti couldn't make it more than five laps in his first three races combined, and came home with his tail between his legs halfway through the season. Nigel Mansel cleaned everybody's clocks!

      So it's more than just technology. Americans can't get past the drive-fast-turn-left NASCAR mentality!

    7. Re:Background article by giberti · · Score: 2, Informative

      Additionally Formula 1 pushes the envelope in Saftey, which is something CART does not.

      The F1 site has some nice general information regarding the engineering etc here.

      --

      AF-Design, web development.
    8. Re:Background article by sentientbeing · · Score: 5, Funny

      im pretty sure one of those yellow and black knobs is a cigarette lighter.....

      --

      ------
      beware he who would deny you access to information, for in his mind he dreams himself your master
    9. Re:Background article by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm not sure I understand the advantage of a crankshaft made from depleted uranium.

      For a crank, you'd want something extremely strong, but as light as possible. Now I'm not sure how strong uranium is, for all I know it's as soft as lead. But I do know that it's fricken HEAVY.

      So what's the advantage to gain here?

    10. Re:Background article by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah, because of a few high profile deaths in the last decade (or so), F1 has become one of the forerunners in safety (to the point of making the sport much less fun and profitable).

    11. Re:Background article by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I would think that it is becasue they had problem getting them strong enough with other materials. And maybe the extremly high rpm, up to 18500, make weight less important.

    12. Re:Background article by TehHustler · · Score: 2, Informative

      They do this in F1 now too.

      --

      TheHustler
      http://www.elmarko.org/ - Useless bilge
      http://www.asylum-games.co.uk/ - Co-Founder
    13. Re:Background article by joeberk · · Score: 1

      No one's spending $50 mil a year in CART.

      Maybe Ganassi or Penske spent $15 or $20 mil for a two car team, in the 1999 to 2001 gravy days... and maybe Honda/Toyota spent $5 million on them... but that's not $50 million a year.

      Heck, this season, I suspect they're spending $50 mil a year for the entire 18 car grid.

      If Minardi came over to ChampCar with their budget they would dominate.

    14. Re:Background article by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Because it is a troll. Only a very small portion of the US actually likes or even cares about left turn racing. It's a southern thing, and everyone knows how southern hicks are. Saying that is how the entire US is, is like saying that France is full of surrender monkeys. While some perhaps lack courage, applying that to the whole country arbitrarily is just trolling.

    15. Re:Background article by Lord+Kestrel · · Score: 1

      But would Minardi actually want to? There is almost no media coverage in the US of the CART circuit, and I doubt there is much in Europe. They get far more eyeballs viewing in Europe on the F1 circuit, and thus get more money from sponsors.

    16. Re:Background article by dilweed · · Score: 1

      Isn't CART a misnomer? I thought they changed over to ChampCar and IRL?

    17. Re:Background article by BearWash · · Score: 1

      Everyday mortal teams in other forms of motor racing use titanium cranks. F1 is different -- what they use may come from Hallibuton's mining site on Mars, for all I know.

    18. Re:Background article by davegust · · Score: 1

      The minimum budget during the "gravy days" was about $10 million per car per year. Fernandez Racing spent $20 million per year. Penske, Ganassi, and likely Green and Newman-Haas spent much more than that. Michael Andretti himself made $8 million a year. $50 million was certainly not out of the question for the top teams.

    19. Re:Background article by TomServo · · Score: 2, Interesting

      They sorta do this in F1, but really only the RPM. I don't believe the F1 teams are willing to share telemetry data like that, so they actually base the RPM on the in-car shot on the tone of the engine being picked up by the ambient microphones on the cars. It's reportedly "very accurate", but it's not a true reading of the car's actual RPM.

      This is, all based on things heard from the commentary on Speed Channel here in the states, but I have no reason to doubt it.

    20. Re:Background article by TomServo · · Score: 1

      'Course, Toyota is occasionally reported as spending more than Ferrari, but it really hasn't gotten them very far. BAR also spent out the nose, and until this year, they were in just as bad of shape. It's nice to see that they finally managed to put all the pieces together and become a real team again.

      Admittedly, I do think that if you *don't* have the money (Minardi), you cannot compete, but having the money doesn't mean that you can. Here's hoping Gascoyne can get a new chassis in for Toyota that has some real aerodynamics and make another team that's capable of winning a race.

      Oh, and VERY cool on the BAR site, I just got myself a nice little BAR pit-crew shirt, so I'm a happy camper.

    21. Re:Background article by Animekiksazz · · Score: 0

      I would but I have no points. I like how you worded it :) *pretends to mod parent up*

    22. Re:Background article by mangu · · Score: 1, Interesting
      Additionally Formula 1 pushes the envelope in Saftey


      Not really. The last driver to die was Ayrton Senna, 10 years ago, in a freak accident. A suspension rod went straight through his helmet faceplate. How unlucky can you get? Formula 1 cars only crash after going through a gravel pit, and then they hit tyre barriers. In CART, IRL, or NASCAR they hit the wall without any speed reduction. It's only because the angle is usually shallow that drivers survive crashes in those races.

    23. Re:Background article by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That couldn't be. Tobacco sponsorship is banned in Canadian course, among few others. Besides, with total tobacco sponsorship ban on 2006, the last thing Ferrari team needs is a cigarette lighter to sustain the tobacco habit.

    24. Re:Background article by x0 · · Score: 4, Informative

      I think maybe you should have provided the full context of the story rather than witlessly blathering on:

      When Michael Andretti signed on with McLaren, the cars were powered by the all conquering Honda motors. By the time he actually drove the car, those motors had been replaced by Ford Cosworth V8s. At the time, hardly in the same league as the then massively dominant Honda.

      There was a rule change at the end of the 1992 season which severly limited the testing the teams could do. This had the effect that every track Andretti showed up to in 1993 was completely new to him. Huge disadvantage.

      You might have also mentioned that the dismal 5 laps in the first few races was caused by mechanical failures and getting punted off the track, not by lack of skill.

      Andretti fanboy? Not really. The traitor SOB went IRL racing...

      --
      In the immortal words of Socrates, who said; 'I drank what?'
    25. Re:Background article by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      try to watch a f1 race nowadays, you willnotice on major accidents with more than 3 drivers involved (or even just 1), the tyres dont get out from the transmissions like bullets, theres a system of lockers that make then tie together in case of accident.

      Thats why you dont see big fences between tracks and public

      Another difference is the quality of image, i get indycar from eurosport(that btw just shows it because they cant afford to pay F1 licenses, thats a old diferendu) and doenst even compare.
      On other way i like the infographic of indycar, whit the driver listing and the players face & profile displayed on the tvset

    26. Re:Background article by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well... it's DUrable

    27. Re:Background article by FireAtWill · · Score: 1

      Today, $5M/car is about the starting point in Champ Car racing. So if you wanted to buy an entire generic grid it would cost you about $90M. But to win you'd want to spend more. Ironically, in the more affordable IRL you're going to spend more than that because of subsidies offered by Toyota and Honda. And for that extra investment you get to go around the Milwaukee oval about 10 MPH slower than the Champ Cars this year. The F1 cars are absolutely astounding. But a lot of that expense is arguably needless. Steve Matchet (sp?) is an ex-F1 Engineer turned announcer and he will readily concede the point that once everyone has, for instance, carbon fiber suspension wishbones (as opposed to the steel ones mandated in Indy and Champ Cars), the advantage is gone and you're just spending money to keep up.

    28. Re:Background article by Dylan2000 · · Score: 3, Informative

      BMW vaulted to one of the top teams because they put some of their best engineers and spent a buttload of money(350 million+) initializing the team.

      A small(?) nitpick, there is no BMW team in Formula One, they just supply the engines for the Williams team, just as Michelin supply the tyres and HP supply computer systems.

      Williams is one of the most successful Grand Prix teams of them all with a long and rich history and this is my real pet hate, living in Germany, to always hear it being referred to as BMW when BMW has no influence over anything to do with the car or the team. They just make the engines, like Honda, Renault, Judd and many other companies have done before them.

      Not picking on you, it just gets my goat when people get this wrong.

      --
      Build your own website - full service homepage system your m
    29. Re:Background article by FireAtWill · · Score: 1

      As a fan of American open wheel racing (and technology), I wish that NASCAR and oval racing series could be viewed as a niche sport for the deep south. But the reality is that *any* NASCAR race now gets better TV ratings than the Indianapolis 500.

      Jeff Gordon, not Sam Hornish or Paul Tracy, stands beside Britney Spears in the pantheon of Pepsi-Cola endorsemement dieties.

    30. Re:Background article by karit · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Renault had it on their site live at Monaco. I wacthed it during the race, but it got Slashdotted and haven't seen it on their site since.

      --
      http://blog.karit.geek.nz/
    31. Re:Background article by ThePackager · · Score: 1

      F1 races are held RAIN or SHINE. The materials, the electronics, the sheer imagination transferred to reality. They are the one truly international sport, along with soccer, I suppose. The sound of the cars and gawd, the pageantry overwhelms the millions of fans from Malaysia to Indy to Imola. Even with Schumi running away tear after year, you see those stands full, don't you? Have you ever spoken with fans in Germany or Austria or Southeast Asia, as I have? THey are maniacs for the whole deal. Sure there's politics and the money seems unbelievable, but haven't men always aspired to be the fastest on for wheels for the last century? When do you think a woman willget to drive?

      --
      Please have respect for people with different abilities, especially children.
    32. Re:Background article by gfody · · Score: 1

      And maybe the extremly high rpm, up to 18500, make weight less important.

      the high rpms make weight more important

      --

      bite my glorious golden ass.
    33. Re:Background article by Shadowlore · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      Americans can't get past the drive-fast-turn-left NASCAR mentality!

      Not insightful, but quite trollike.

      Especially after the third LeMans win in four years by the American Corvette Team, the win of the MLP2 class in Lemans by Clint Field (an All American team), and of course that an American team won the GT class as well. Yup, Americans won all but one class at Lemans this year. Twenty four hour endurance race on a long and varied course.

      Not to mention the American Lemans Series, or the SCCA.. I'd bet there are more Americans involved in actually racing other than NASCAR than in all of Europe.

      But hey go ahead, keep comforting yourself with that belief. That way should you ever find yourself in a race like the above you can be even more shocked when the Americans run right past you and are standing on the podium while you look on.

      --
      My Suburban burns less gasoline than your Prius.
    34. Re:Background article by dfn_deux · · Score: 1

      Even though you meant it in jest, I assure you that is actually more than 1 driver in Nascar whom has had a cigarette lighter installed in instrument cluster on their dash so they could enjoy a mid race smoke... I'm not sure exactly how they work it with the helmet and all, but I've actually seen a picture of the cigarette lighter in Nascar car before. Wish I could remeber the source of the photo....

      --
      -*The above statement is printed entirely on recycled electrons*-
    35. Re:Background article by Goldberg's+Pants · · Score: 1

      F1 is insane. I'm a huge fan, have been for 20 years.

      Go back just ten years and you'd see how different the wheel is. Just a couple of buttons. Now it's like the flight deck of a fighter. Fitting, given F1 cars have more in common with planes than cars.

      I highly recommend checking out "The Secret Life of Formula One" if you can. It's a Discovery Channel documentary about F1. If this article interests you, you'd LOVE that three part documentary.

      Sadly, F1 these days is crap compared to 20 years ago. A lot of that is caused by the march of technology.

    36. Re:Background article by silvwolf · · Score: 1

      CART and Formula 1 are only similar in looks. If you know the details they are as different as night and day.

      And even then, only at first glance. Last year, or the year before, at Indy Motor Speedway during the 500 there was a static display that had an IRL car and an F1 car. The difference between the two were amazing.. aerodynamics, exhaust, cockpit, etc. The overall shape of the cars is the same, but that's about where the similarity ends.

    37. Re:Background article by Mr_Dyqik · · Score: 1

      A woman drove for Brabham (I think) in 1992. She didn't qualify for at least some of the races she turned up at.

    38. Re:Background article by goatan · · Score: 1
      Formula 1 cars only crash after going through a gravel pit, and then they hit tyre barriers.

      So they don't crash into each other and Monaco Doesn't exist then. Sadly the most exiting Thing in CART racing is the crashes but it's the same for F1 as well, gimme rally anyday and take the wings of the CART and F1's

      --
      Saying Apple is better than MS is like saying Botulism is better than rabies.

    39. Re:Background article by jeremyp · · Score: 2, Informative

      The real context here:

      Michael Andretti competed in 13 races. He retired from the first four races following three collisions and a spin. The collisions may or may not have been his fault. His other three retirements were another spin, another collision and a throttle failure. So that's one mechanical failure and at least two driver errors.

      In that year Mclaren had five wins and nine podiums and finished second in the Constructors championship. That doesn't suggest uncompetitive to me except in respect of Williams who were miles ahead of everybody that year and the next three.

      --
      All I want is a secure system where it's easy to do anything I want. Is that too much to ask ~~ Randall Munroe
    40. Re:Background article by capncook · · Score: 1

      Even with Schumi running away tear after year, you see those stands full, don't you?

      Not a Schumi fan, eh? JK :-)

      I thought it was pretty interesting that when I was at the US Grand Prix F1 race at Indy last October, the stands were not 100% full, yet the total number of people there far outnumbered any other F1 race.

      Even in a sport that isn't fully embraced by the American public, we just do things bigger around here :-)

      --
      Learn to fly! www.beapilot.com
    41. Re:Background article by tcr · · Score: 1

      Go back just ten years and you'd see how different the wheel is. Just a couple of buttons. Now it's like the flight deck of a fighter.

      Yeah, but you could argue that some F1 cars were MORE "advanced" ten years ago or so. They had advanced traction and driver aids which were eventually banned, to put more emphasis on driver skill.

      I remember a lot speculation ten years ago about the Williams which many claimed could "drive itself" with data streamed from the pit wall. Since then, of course, the aerodynamics have been revolutionised, and more and more horsepower is squeezed from the 3 litre V10 engines each season. But the current crop of F1 cars would be improved even further by things like computer controlled variable ride height (banned) and ground effect technology (pioneered in F1 by Lotus in '77). This probably won't happen due on the grounds of safety.

      --


      Information wants to be beer.
    42. Re:Background article by tcr · · Score: 1

      That's the default broadcast feed, but there's a Pay Per View offering from the FIA offering all the data and car-cam shots you want (IIRC).

      From what I've read, Formula 1 PPV has been a bit of a flop, so the "free" broadcasts seem to be getting better every year with better camera angles, etc.

      --


      Information wants to be beer.
    43. Re:Background article by TomServo · · Score: 1

      Ahh, I don't believe those are available in the states, at least not via my cable company. I can get that Nascar thing that follows like 5 or 6 drivers with all that data (and I think radio communication), but I'm not a huge Nascar guy, so I haven't bothered to check that out.

      As is, though, the default broadcast feed is pretty damn good these days, and the commentary has improved quite a bit on the US side, so I have no complaints and plan to stick with the default feed for now.

    44. Re:Background article by giberti · · Score: 1

      With Budwiser signing on to Williams BMW, I would espect to see more promotion of Formula 1 in the US. Who knows, someday we might even get a second race (we are a pretty big country after-all) However, BMW isn't looking as good as last year. But I think we have all see the BMW commerical with Montoya taking the hair off the front of the camera...

      It was a Speed channel interview last year with Williams, sortly after inking the deal that said they were looking to bring more american "fun" to the team with Budwiser as a sponsor.

      --

      AF-Design, web development.
    45. Re:Background article by Shadowlore · · Score: 1

      Sure, Americans can't get past the drive-fast-turn-left NASCAR mentality! gets listed as insightful, but pointing out how Americans won 75% of Lemans this year, EuroPean no-left-turn-only and very grueling 24 hour race, and that an America team has dominated the GTS class for 3 of the last four years (taking 1st AND 2nd this year) is flamebait. Woohoo! Well that's a prime example of those who can't trying to bash those who do.

      What can I get for this post? Surely Troll or something, right? How about an "I dared to point out the obvious flaws and bias in the parent post and all I got was the lousy flamebait moderation'? Anyone, anyone? Hey sounds like a good T-shirt for thinkgeek.com

      --
      My Suburban burns less gasoline than your Prius.
    46. Re:Background article by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well BMW did buy into the team in a BIG way ( though only sponsorship wise). The team is now officially no longer williams GP engineering or even williams f1, but BMW-Williams-F1.

      What hacks me off is hearing the cars called BMW Williams' that's wrong, they are Williams BMW's as the chasis manufacture should be listed first.

    47. Re:Background article by Goldberg's+Pants · · Score: 1

      Bollocks to that. It's the DRIVERS world championship. It will always be the pinnacle of motorsport not because of the the technology, but because it's the ONLY series where teams have to BUILD their own cars. The rules explicitly forbid using another teams chassis. (See the Sauber controversy early this year looking like the F2004.)

      As for that Williams, it's the most technically advanced racecar ever. If I remember it's the FW14B. Can't remember for sure.

      F1 needs to quit whining about tech and realise that without passing and real racing, there are only going to be the sad bastards like myself watching.

    48. Re:Background article by joeberk · · Score: 1

      Autoracing1.com is the Weekly World News of motorsports journalism.

      If someone was spending F1 money in CART, they'd have made McLaren's 1988 season in F1 look competitive, from the perspective of other teams winning.

      (McLaren won 15 out of 16 races in the 1988 F1 season, and they only lost the 16th race because their car was taken out by a backmarker while leading the closing laps.)

  2. war driving by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    brings war driving to a whole new level

    1. Re:war driving by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

      One of the neat tricks teams can use to spy on other cars is monitoring their in car camera feed and sending the audio through a dsp to find out stuff like what valve timings they're using. It works with a mic on the side of the road too, but then you've got to correct for the doppler effect.

    2. Re:war driving by Blademan007 · · Score: 1

      Highly unlikely. F1 teams have been encrypting data, voice, and other communication for at least 10 years. NASCAR teams have just recently started this. Uniden Bearcat scanners have been worthless in F1 for a long time.

    3. Re:war driving by torqer · · Score: 2, Funny

      Yeah -- except due to high speed man/car accidents the chaulk )( symbol is replaced by a chaulk outline.

  3. steering wheel buttons by L-Train8 · · Score: 5, Informative

    The McLaren website has an interesting flash doo-dad that explains the steering wheel. Go here and click on "interactive steering wheel.

    --

    Don't forget that Friday is Hawaiian shirt day.
    1. Re:steering wheel buttons by CaptnMArk · · Score: 4, Funny
    2. Re:steering wheel buttons by Webmoth · · Score: 2, Funny

      "What's this Bf button for?"

      "NO! Don't touch that!!!"

      (Push)

      Bang! "Ow!" Bang! "Ow!" Bang! "Ow!"

      "Ooooo, I can't watch!"

      "WHY DIDN'T YOU TELL ME WHAT BF STOOD FOR???"

      "I thought you knew..."

      --
      Give me my freedom, and I'll take care of my own security, thank you.
    3. Re:steering wheel buttons by Macsimus · · Score: 3, Informative

      That McLaren steering wheel is great, but it's a bit out of date. The launch-control buttons (the green ones in the upper corners) probably aren't there anymore or do something different. Launch control was banned for the 2004 season, although Renault has been having amazing starts without it this year, and their process is still a bit of a mystery.

    4. Re:steering wheel buttons by Waffle+Iron · · Score: 5, Funny
      When I was a kid, there was an animated series on TV that explained what race car steering wheel buttons do.

      For example, one button controls the cars "Jump" feature, allowing it to jump over canyons, rivers and the like.

      Another button extends the circular saws from the front bumper so that the car can race through the jungle at full speed.

      Another one closes the top and enables underwater operation, and there's one that extends a set of wings so that the car can fly for short distances.

      The exact functions of the buttons vary by race team. Some of the evil race teams install unfair buttons, like spiked wheel hub extenders or fire dispensers.

      I really think that these buttons were overused and shifted the focus of the drivers from racing to implementing dangerous technical tricks. If they had only put some of the button effort into fuel tank safety, many of the lesser-known drivers would have avoided gruesome deaths in huge fiery explosions. I'm still emotionally scarred from witnessing some of those scenes at such a young age.

    5. Re:steering wheel buttons by tomasito · · Score: 0

      "Quick! Jam his radio! Hit the switch on the left!"

    6. Re:steering wheel buttons by op00to · · Score: 3, Informative

      Is it? I heard their amazing starts were due to a loophole in the gear shift rules. Basically, it works like this:

      The team has (for example) 500ms to let the computer control the engine to execute a gear change. Renault has got gear changes down to a science, and only needs 10ms. The other 490ms are still "ok" to have the computer control the engine. It's not a lot of time, but every little bit helps...

      My numbers might be off, but this is the way I understand how they do it..

    7. Re:steering wheel buttons by geekd · · Score: 3, Informative

      Dude, that is the funniest thing I've read all day.

      I remember that show!

      (it's Speed Racer http://www.speedracer.com/ , for the clueless)

      Actually, it's on SPEED Channel all the time now. I watched it again for the first time in may years a few weeks ago. Many of the drivers faces are based on '60s F1 drivers. There is one recurring villan that looks just like Graham Hill. http://www.ddavid.com/formula1/hill_bio.htm

      -geekd

    8. Re:steering wheel buttons by tstoneman · · Score: 2, Funny

      If I remember correctly, the steering wheel buttons are:

      1) Smoke screen
      2) Oil Slick
      3) Machine gun
      4) Rockets

      Of course, you also need the button to properly dock with your trailer so that you can be loaded with the supplies.

      I'm surprised that after 20 years, it still looks like Darth Vader's toilet!

    9. Re:steering wheel buttons by cayenne8 · · Score: 1
      Yeah...but, where are all the important buttons (A-G?)...you know for the automatic jacks to make the car jump in the air...the homing pigeon robot...the saw blades....the one that turns the car into a submarine???

      I mean, this car costs tons of money, but, if he comes up against the 'Car Acrobatic Team'....he's toast......

      --
      Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
    10. Re:steering wheel buttons by TomV · · Score: 2, Informative

      The speculation in last week's Autosport was, oddly enough, that Renault's big advantage at the moment may actually be down to their being around 50 bhp down on the other big teams. While this ought to reduce maximum speed and acceleration out of the corners, it may have two key counterbenefits: firstly, a rather smoother and more driveable torque curve, hence part of the better getaways, and, more significantly, better fuel consumption, giving a choice of longer stints between pitstops, shorter refuelling times during the stops, or running the car lighter for a stint of the same number of laps. In practice, they're likely to be compromising between these approaches, staying out for one or two laps longer than their rivals while spending a second or so less in the pits, and also putting a lighter car higher on the grid in qualifying and, of course, getting away more easily from a standing start.

    11. Re:steering wheel buttons by GTRacer · · Score: 2, Interesting
      My understanding of the SpeedChannel commentary went like this:

      Renault figures out, based on track conditions, fuel load, air temp, etc. what the ideal clutch pressure/engagement speed is for a wheelspin-free launch and set that into the computer. Red lights go off, Alonso pulls the upshift paddle (or releases the brake - not sure which) and the computer grabs first with a hopefully-optimal clutch drop.

      If the number-crunching goes wrong the start is less-than-perfect. But in any event, they aren't using proper TC, just a really slick first-gear engagement!

      GTRacer
      - Enjoying the 2004 Schumacher Victory Tour (Monaco cancelled due to inclement conditions)

      --
      Defending IP by destroying access to it? That makes sense, RIAA/MPAA. Go to the corner until you can play nice!
    12. Re:steering wheel buttons by balbeir · · Score: 1

      Yes, but...

      where is the horn ?

    13. Re:steering wheel buttons by BigBir3d · · Score: 1

      Nope.

      Clutch control. The found a way to control the bite point exactly.

      Rules dis-allowed launch control, which was combo of traction control and automotated clutch engagement, IIRC.

    14. Re:steering wheel buttons by evil0ne · · Score: 1

      Also found at the US Grand Prix website is a nice explanation. http://www.usgpindy.com/news/2004/images/williamsg raphic

    15. Re:steering wheel buttons by Ripping+Silk · · Score: 1
      altho in the day of exploding fuel tanks, they didn't have buttons on steering wheels...

      hell, they didn't even have seat belts !!

      --
      this is not a flawless plan.. this is inspiration
  4. The New Direction In Sports by ackthpt · · Score: 4, Interesting
    I'm a cycling fan and you would be correct to assume I'm on the edge of my seat regarding the upcoming 2004 Tour de France. For the past few years cyclists have been getting better connected to the team directors with radios and able to feed performance information via radio back to the team car where a trainer or doctor monitors heartrate and who knows what else. Some in the sports media and among fans of the sport gripe that this is taking away the exciting guesswork of the sport and turning riders into little more than robots. e.g. How does the peloton know how much speed to pick up to sweep up a break away with a 12 minute lead, 10 km from the finish line? Knowledge, feedback and monitoring the opposition. Sometimes they still get it wrong and a break succeeds, but not often these days.

    Having bought one of the top flight cycling computers, which came with software far more sophisticated than I need. I could go totally overboard on my power to mass, VO2 Max, heartrate training, etc. For what? To beat guys on my weekend rides? If I were a Pro I would need to have not just a coach, now, but a team behind me to monitor my fitness, nutrition, energy levels, and a slew of other data, where once I'd pretty much only need a coach. The bar is being raised and without money or sponsorship where does this leave the talented natural who can't meet the bar?

    There's considerable complaining about how uneven F1 is, with Ferrari's huge budget. It's hitting all sports. Spend to win and use money and technology to remove so much doubt the mystery of the game is ultimately solved.

    It was good to watch the Pistons dismantle the Lakers, but how less often are we to see upsets anymore?

    --

    A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
    1. Re:The New Direction In Sports by no+reason+to+be+here · · Score: 4, Insightful

      It's hitting all sports. Spend to win and use money and technology to remove so much doubt the mystery of the game is ultimately solved.

      Doesn't always work in all sports. In baseball, for example, the Yankees, who spend the most of any team, have remained competetive, but are not guaranteed a Championship, as the last few years have shown. In fact, the World Series winners the past few years have all been mid-market teams (2003 Marlins, 2002 Angels, 2001 Diamondbacks). Conversely, the Mets, who spend the 2nd most in baseball, have been in the cellar for the last few seasons. Same for the Rangers, who also boast a fairly high rate of team spending.

    2. Re:The New Direction In Sports by aj50 · · Score: 1

      The uneveness in F1 is now appauling, I've seen only two of the races this year whereas in 2002 I didn't miss any of them. Having a sport so unbalanced like this can't be any good for the people who run it as they will be losing viewers and therefore money from sponsors. Hopefully the FIA will restrict the use of computers and telemetry and give lower teams a chance.

      --
      I wish to remain anomalous
    3. Re:The New Direction In Sports by ackthpt · · Score: 1
      Doesn't always work in all sports. In baseball, for example, the Yankees, who spend the most of any team, have remained competetive, but are not guaranteed a Championship, as the last few years have shown.

      Mostly because George Steinbrenner spends most of that budget on salaries, particularly on star names rather than building a team of players wo work together. You can pretty much bet, though, that someone like Barry Bonds has his swing analyzed and others track where pitchers are likely to throw, etc. I wouldn't be hasty to chalk up the impressive batting these days purely to steroid use, some of these players must be relying more on information systems to eliminate doubt.

      If you could demonstrate a system that would improve team batting by 0.050 or more, you'd have an instant and eager market.

      --

      A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
    4. Re:The New Direction In Sports by kmankmankman2001 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Ferrari isn't winning because they have the most money. BMW-Williams, Toyota, Ford (Jaguar-Cosworth), etc. aren't exactly collecting foodstamps you know.

      Ferrari is winning because they have assembled a fantastic team. From the engineering talent that designed the car to the logistic support to the pit crew and, of course, one of the greatest drivers in the history of the sport - Michael Schumaker.

      I'm also trying to remember who won the World Series last year. The Yankees, right, cause they have the biggest payroll? Ooops, no, it was the Florida Marlins with a payroll at the other end of the spectrum.

      Analogies are great except when they don't hold up.

      --
      "The bigger the lie, the more they believe." - Det. Bunk
    5. Re:The New Direction In Sports by another_mr_lizard · · Score: 5, Informative

      Ferrari budget was over 250 million last year. The next biggest spender was McLaren at 120 million. Jags budget last year was in the region of 70 million.

      Even with equal budgets Schumacher would probably still be sneaking the championship, but currently no team spends like Ferrari and that is damaging the sport.

      --
      "My parents were strict, but they never pitted me against livestock" - Doug Stanhope
    6. Re:The New Direction In Sports by asoap · · Score: 3, Insightful
      This is the old argument of "how fast do you want to go?" "How much money do you have?".

      The real question you should be asking is. How do you stop it? Nascar seems like the one organization that tries to make everything equal. But it totally fails. The same rule applies. Whoever has the most money has the best shot at winning. In Nascar all of the cars are the same. The exact same bodies, and most of the settings are the same. The only difference is the motors, but those are more similar than different. They use technology that went out of the style in the mid 70's mixed with modern technology. For what? It's still not even. The team with the most money will have the best driver. The team with the most money will hire the best mechanics to setup the car the best.

      So if it's not even in the first place, then why try to make all the cars even also? That is how you get F1.

      -asoap

      --
      Treat me like a marketing stat, and I'll treat your movie like a series of ones and zeros
    7. Re:The New Direction In Sports by alphafoo · · Score: 5, Informative
      The bar is being raised and without money or sponsorship where does this leave the talented natural who can't meet the bar?

      One one hand, the bar has always been raised. Rowing has been a popular sport for some time now. But what do you do if you are in the 99.9% of the world that cannot get access to a boathouse? You don't compete in rowing, that's what.

      On the other hand, if you are able to meet the basic requirements to compete, talented amateurs rise up through the ranks and tend to get sponsorships. As an example, I started racing triathlon a few years ago, and used an old bike and cotton gear and no wetsuit. I couldn't shell out $1300 for race wheels, so that made me less competitive. I trained hard, read books, and starting finishing on the podium, and got ranked All-American. I read a book on how to get sponsorships, applied for a bunch of them, and got some for this season. One of those sponsors loans me $1300 race wheels for my big races in exchange for my being a billboard, so now I don't have to buy them. If I can go that little bit faster, I can win bigger races, get bigger sponsorships, and so on.

      Incidentally, cycling deserves a lot of credit for sticking to its roots. The rules on bike frame geometry are strict and have kept much faster frame designs out of the peloton, mainly in deference to tradition, AFAIK.

    8. Re:The New Direction In Sports by The+Ape+With+No+Name · · Score: 1

      I'm also trying to remember who won the World Series last year. The Yankees, right, cause they have the biggest payroll? Ooops, no, it was the Florida Marlins with a payroll at the other end of the spectrum

      Yeah, check out the book "MoneyBall" by Michael Lewis. Sabermetrics comes out of the Rotisserie and into the general manager's office at the Oakland A's. Excellent read.

      --
      Comparing it to Windows will be a moot point, since El Dorado is going to have a 40% larger code base than XP.
    9. Re:The New Direction In Sports by ifwm · · Score: 1

      "I wouldn't be hasty to chalk up the impressive batting these days purely to steroid use.."

      It's not batting that is improved by steroid use, it's power hitting. Batting would actually be hindered by steroid use, with the exception of more homeruns equating to slightly fewer outs. In reality, the batting averages have remained relatively stable for years.

    10. Re:The New Direction In Sports by The+Ape+With+No+Name · · Score: 1

      Same for the Rangers, who also boast a fairly high rate of team spending.

      Hell, they are still recovering from their inept management team from the early 90s. Wait a minute. Isn't he the same guy who....

      --
      Comparing it to Windows will be a moot point, since El Dorado is going to have a 40% larger code base than XP.
    11. Re:The New Direction In Sports by fiannaFailMan · · Score: 1
      The rules on bike frame geometry are strict and have kept much faster frame designs out of the peloton, mainly in deference to tradition, AFAIK
      At uni I did my final year project on bike frame design. Actually the diamond frame is pretty difficult to improve upon. Carbon monocoque is the only deviation I've seen from it but a lot of people have heard scare stories about them smashing to pieces in crashes, and I've heard others talking about it being too siff for their liking.
      --
      Drill baby drill - on Mars
    12. Re:The New Direction In Sports by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

      Ferrari does have the most money. If you check, their budget for R&D is the highest amongst all teams, including Williams, Toyota, and etc. albeit they are not all that far behind. Ferrari does in fact have a very good car and team, however, too much emphasis is placed on drivers.

      I'm willing to bet that if you shifted the top five drivers from their teams, the finishing order of the races will be more based on the quality of the car than the quality of the driver. Example, how good would Michael Schumaucher had been in an '03 BAR Honda? Or a Minardi or Jordon? Probably not as good as they all think he is. What would happen if Jenson Button was in a Ferrari?

      Spending budget analogies work when you apply it to buying technology. When a team can afford a P4 3.0GHz over a PII 133Mhz how doesn't this analogy apply?

      Where it doesn't work is when you apply it to baseball teams and their budgets because then you are applying subjective values to human players. Given A.Rods salary of $100M, does it mean he's 100x better than a player with a salary of $1M?

      You can actually use "quantitative" measurements in F1, ie "this engine is 10.3% more efficient than last year's engine", where as in baseball you use "qualitative" measurements as in A.Rod is better than Joe 2nd Baseman.

      Think again.

    13. Re:The New Direction In Sports by ifwm · · Score: 1

      Why is it damaging the sport? And please don't tell me it's not fair to the have-nots. Sorry man, but this is sport, where there will always be have-nots. The goal is to win within the spectrum of the rules, not to keep the playing field even so the other guy can eat your lunch.

    14. Re:The New Direction In Sports by another_mr_lizard · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Do you watch F1?
      Due to the extremely high performance aero on these cars overtaking has been reduced in some races to near zero - the dirty air produced by the cars makes slipstreaming (very important for overtaking). I do appreciate F1 for the technology and engineering that goes into it, but the style of racing has changed so much over the last 10 years that it has lost much of what made it exciting.

      I'm a McLaren fan but couldnt care less about Schuey winning as long as the racing is good to watch. Right now it isnt.

      --
      "My parents were strict, but they never pitted me against livestock" - Doug Stanhope
    15. Re:The New Direction In Sports by alphafoo · · Score: 1
      Wow, that would be a cool project! Well, there are the beam bikes that have been ridden with success at the world championships in Kona, but I'm also talking about aero bars, which can be used in time trials, but not in road races. (Caveat: shorty bars that don't extend beyond the brake hoods can be used in UCI races.)


      And even with the diamond, there is the all-important seat tube angle. Riding a 78 degree bike is a pretty different experience than a slack 72, and I'm not even sure if the former is legal in UCI races.

    16. Re:The New Direction In Sports by another_mr_lizard · · Score: 1

      Should have previewed that.

      It should have read - the dirty air produced by the cars makes slipstreaming (very important for overtaking) impossible.

      --
      "My parents were strict, but they never pitted me against livestock" - Doug Stanhope
    17. Re:The New Direction In Sports by ackthpt · · Score: 1
      It's not batting that is improved by steroid use, it's power hitting. Batting would actually be hindered by steroid use, with the exception of more homeruns equating to slightly fewer outs. In reality, the batting averages have remained relatively stable for years.

      Barry Bonds is all the focus these days for alleged steroid use, due to his impressive increase in power hitting, but his batting average has also gone up considerably, to the point he gets walks frequently. Clearly someone worked with him on changing the way he studies pitchers, prepares himself and how he swings. I wouldn't be surprised in the least to learn he's had his swing analyzed with computers and adapted.

      --

      A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
    18. Re:The New Direction In Sports by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You are wrong. Baseball is not Formula 1.

      Ferrari IS winning because they have the largest budget and the most resources ... it has been that way for years now. They have had the luxury of complete backing from FIAT, thus they have had time to gather the neccsary resources and build the facilities to build a winning team.

      To win in Formula 1 you MUST have CONSTANT development. In the course of a single year there are over 1,800 different engine design changes. 1,800! To do this takes bags of money and resources. Something that Ferrari, via FIAT has is Spades.

      Talent is important and also takes a lot of money, (66 million a year for Schumacher alone) but development is all important.

      And yes, analogies are great except when they don't hold up.

    19. Re:The New Direction In Sports by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      Carbon fiber can be "tuned" for a given amount of flexibility in specific directions. By putting piezo stress and/or flex sensors on an ordinary bike you could determine what the best settings would be and through the use of some of the world's most carefully guarded software, which is to say carbon fiber stress analysis/design kit, you could get whatever results you wanted. Well, within limits, but certainly you could mimic any kind of metal frame.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    20. Re:The New Direction In Sports by Keith+Mickunas · · Score: 1

      Look at what all that money has gotten McLaren this year, absolutely nothing. They earned about half of their points so far this year only because two teams were disqualified from the last race. It's not just about the money. Remember, Schumi won championships before he went to Ferrari. I think this is a case of the right driver finding the right team at the right time. What he can do with that car is amazing.

    21. Re:The New Direction In Sports by ifwm · · Score: 1

      Yes, I watch F1, and you didn't answer my question. You claimed Ferrari was ruining the sport by spending too much, the got off on a tangent about aerodynamics and passing.

      More importantly, you're enjoyment of a race is subjective, and important only to you, I find the races compelling as they are.

    22. Re:The New Direction In Sports by strictnein · · Score: 1

      "Ferrari starts with F!"

      You remember the driver Victor Sciado, the famed Ferrari driver? That was his explanation on why Ferrari was doing so well these days.

      Strange guy.

    23. Re:The New Direction In Sports by nate+nice · · Score: 1
      It was good to watch the Pistons dismantle the Lakers...

      Watching LA lose, and in the fashion they lost in, makes me believe that maybe the world ,somehow, is a just, good place.

      --
      "If you are a dreamer, a wisher, a liar, A hope-er, a pray-er, a magic bean buyer ..."
    24. Re:The New Direction In Sports by HBPiper · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I have always found that reading about F1 in Road & Track was much more thrilling than actually watching a race. At least for the last 15 years or so. The most fun was watching Nigel Mansell leave F-1 and go to Cart where he trounced everybody. Now that was some racing.......

      --
      "I went on a diet, swore off drinking and heavy eating. And in fourteen days, I had lost exactly two weeks. Joe E. Lewis
    25. Re:The New Direction In Sports by another_mr_lizard · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Ferrari's massive overspend means that they can find the quickest solution to an engineering problem, not the cleverest. For instance, the dramatic increase in exotic metals that have been used over the last few years (which has been curtailed somewhat this season) - smaller teams cannot compete with Ferrari's spending power and had to engineer a solution round the problems that didnt involve purchasing 15lbs of to solve overheating gearboxes.

      Apologies if you didnt get the link to how this affects passing and aero, but aero was the last big engineering improvement in F1, again due to the cost. Windtunnels were rare even 10 years ago but are now seen as mandatory. Great engineering but it has changed the type of racing we see more dramatically than any tyre or engine change I can remember.

      Subjective or not its not your opinions that matter. The ones that do belong to Bernie Ecclestone and the FIA. Viewing figures have plummeted over the last 5 years, as have the sponsorship deals and TV revenue. The FIA have made it quite clear that they believe the changes will focus the teams development into other areas and hopefully benefit the sport as a whole.

      --
      "My parents were strict, but they never pitted me against livestock" - Doug Stanhope
    26. Re:The New Direction In Sports by LurkerXXX · · Score: 1

      That's because instead of spending funds on salary, they are spending more in secret bat-corking labs. That's the real tech in baseball. corking so the umpires can't tell. ;)

    27. Re:The New Direction In Sports by old_unicorn · · Score: 1

      Formula One is also a TECHNOLOGY formula. Part of the competition is to see who can design the best car. Most other motrsport fomulae are purely trying to see who is the fastest driver. Most of the team owners only care about the constructors championship, and regard the driver's championship as a 'nice to have'. This angle will always draw a more competitive approach to finance and design.

      --
      ***You learn something Every day. And then you die.***
    28. Re:The New Direction In Sports by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ...and, the team with the most money runs the most cars, and pools all the data from its teams to make the best driver-team competitive. Sure, the other teams learn, but the best driver-team gets first dibs at the good stuff when push comes to shove.

      There aren't any 4-car F1 teams (which might be prohibited by its rules anyways).

      But, let's face it, how many people were really IROC fans?

    29. Re:The New Direction In Sports by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The sport is no longer centered upon the driver. It's around the technology. Hell, why not just take the driver out of the sport entirely and have the computers run the race?

    30. Re:The New Direction In Sports by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah, Toyota, Honda, Renault, Mercedes and BMW are all sooo poor.

      The difference in funding isn't nearly as great as you make it out to be.

    31. Re:The New Direction In Sports by asoap · · Score: 1
      This is where we don't see eye to eye. Because real motorsports are as you say a "TECHNOLOGY formula". This idea of making all the cars equal, so that it's driver vs. driver is new. In the old days they didn't all say "Ok, drumb brakes and carburated engines is all we need. Let's draw the line here and not develop cars any further." That's like saying "8k is all you need for an OS." Carol Shelby built the cobra because he thought he could build a car better then the competition. He didn't want to build the exact same car as someone else.

      Personally I think if you want to make all the cars equal, and have it driver vs. driver. Everyone should get John Deere riding mowers, and race those.

      -asoap

      --
      Treat me like a marketing stat, and I'll treat your movie like a series of ones and zeros
    32. Re:The New Direction In Sports by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You're still missing a big point: the effect of drivers on the entire team. For one thing, some engineers are more willing to work for your team if some driver is in it, so with Schumacher in the team you're more likely to attract a Ross Brown.

      Also, if you listen to interviews of Ferrari team members, they all talk about how Schumacher works super-hard all the time and that motivates everybody else to work hard too etc, especially during off-season testing.

    33. Re:The New Direction In Sports by a7244270 · · Score: 0
      The uneveness in F1 is now appauling, I've seen only two of the races this year whereas in 2002 I didn't miss any of them. Having a sport so unbalanced like this can't be any good for the people who run it as they will be losing viewers and therefore money from sponsors. Hopefully the FIA will restrict the use of computers and telemetry and give lower teams a chance.

      Its got nothing to do with budget. Ferrari is simply fortunate enough to have the greatest driver of all time working for them.

      In the last 20 years, every champshipship was won by either Williams, McLaren, or "team that Schumacher happened to be driving for at the time", which would be Benneton and Ferrari (teams which pre-Schumacher had never won a championship, and hadn't won a champiDC in 20 years respectively)

    34. Re:The New Direction In Sports by kmankmankman2001 · · Score: 1

      Please actually read what I wrote. I did not say that Ferrari's RACING budget wasn't larger - I said they didn't have the most money, period. I don't understand how other people seemed to have totally misinterpreted that really simple statement.

      Stack Ferrari's annual revenue stream against that of Ford or BMW and tell me Ferrari has more money - I laugh. Ford has WAY more money than Ferrari and chooses not to increase their F1 racing budget. Their call. But they can hardly cry "poor" and that they are losing (badly)because they can't compete financially with Ferrari.

      --
      "The bigger the lie, the more they believe." - Det. Bunk
    35. Re:The New Direction In Sports by juiceCake · · Score: 1

      Actually, viewership is up this year so though they had lost some viewers in recent years now they are gaining some.

    36. Re:The New Direction In Sports by V.+Mole · · Score: 1

      That's pretty much what everyone said about McLaren 1987-90, when they were the dominant team. In '88, Senna and Prost won all the races but one. That was better, though, because you didn't which of Senna or Prost was going to win.

    37. Re:The New Direction In Sports by juiceCake · · Score: 1

      Ferrari also designs and builds their own engine (as does Toyota) whereas the other teams do not. Is this factor included in the budgets? For example, say BAR's budget is $10/year and Honda's engine budget is $8 dollars a year is the BAR budget then $18/year?

    38. Re:The New Direction In Sports by microTodd · · Score: 1

      I second that notion about bikes.

      I regularly participate in triathlons, strictly amateur. Someone once asked me what my least-favorite part is. I quickly answered, the cycling.

      With running and swimming technology doesn't help much. Its all about your personal skill. But with biking people can have very distinct advantages. I bought my bike for $200 at Target. The winner at the last tri I ran had a custom-built bike that cost hime more than $5000. Money literally bought him an advantage.

      --
      "You cannot find out which view is the right one by science in the ordinary sense." - C.S. Lewis on Intelligent Design
    39. Re:The New Direction In Sports by V.+Mole · · Score: 1

      How does the peloton know how much speed to pick up to sweep up a break away with a 12 minute lead, 10 km from the finish line?

      If the breakaway is 12 minutes ahead 10km from the line, they are not going to be caught, unless they all fall off of their bikes...

      Assume the breakaway group/rider is moving at 20kph (not very fast, say it's uphill). They'll finish in 30 minutes. The peloton 12 minutes back has an extra 4km to go (20kph * 0.2h). That means they have to average 28kph to catch the breakaway, or 40% faster. Extremely unlikely. (Yeah, you can slow the speeds down enough to make it work...)

    40. Re:The New Direction In Sports by Jabes · · Score: 1

      There's considerable complaining about how uneven F1 is, with Ferrari's huge budget. It's hitting all sports. Spend to win and use money and technology to remove so much doubt the mystery of the game is ultimately solved.

      It's not all about budget in F1. The Toyota team (currently running 8th, with 4 points vs Ferarri's 124) are rumoured to have a bigger budget even than Ferarri.

      McLaren have probably got the third biggest budget (behind Ferarri and Toyota) and are 6th...

    41. Re:The New Direction In Sports by acey72 · · Score: 1

      You're spot-on there. Reading the race review in Autosport, with all the stats and charts showing relative positions is *more* interesting than the race itself.

      However, is this right? Should reading a review on paper (now that Autosport.com has gone subscription - grrrrrrr!!) be more enjoyable than the race itself?

      I don't know - it's a bit different I suppose, between interesting and enjoyable.

      Maybe, but one of the best things I've seen on TV this year were the (lamentably short) scenes of Montoya having a go at passing Klien during the European GP - pure, no holds barred, racing - push, push, push at every opportunity, don't let him relax for a moment, push, push, push, he'll make a mistake soon enough, push, push, push.... That was fantastic to watch, even if it was only for 6th, 7th, 8th place....

    42. Re:The New Direction In Sports by mikrorechner · · Score: 1

      I'm a cycling fan and [...] I'm on the edge of my seat...

      ouch... I bet that hurts...

      --
      "Oh, a lesson in not changing history from Mr I'm-my-own-Grandpa." - Dr Hubert Farnsworth
    43. Re:The New Direction In Sports by mangu · · Score: 1
      It's not just about the money.


      In Formula One today, it's 99% about the money. Two reasons: first, money buys exotic materials; second money buys testing and re-designing. Why is Ferrari so reliable? They test, and test, at their own private track, all year round. Force it until it breaks, see what broke, redesign it. Repeat. Sure, it's not just about having money, you also need to spend it well. McLaren is an example of how not to do it. Spend on technology, not luxury. But, still, McLaren's budget is, by all account I've seen, at least $100M less than Ferrari's.


      What he can do with that car is amazing.


      Yes, like hitting the wall when following the pace car.

    44. Re:The New Direction In Sports by belroth · · Score: 1
      What he can do with that car is amazing.


      Yes, like hitting the wall when following the pace car.


      When pushed off by Montoya.
      --
      I hereby inform you that I have NOT been required to provide any decryption keys.
    45. Re:The New Direction In Sports by Keith+Mickunas · · Score: 1

      "Yes, like hitting the wall when following the pace car."

      He's made one mistake this year, that's it. Everything else has gone pretty damn good for him. Winning 7 of 8 races doesn't just happen because of his team spending so much money on the car. Otherwise Rubens would have some victories, or at least more second place finishes.

    46. Re:The New Direction In Sports by rodgerd · · Score: 1

      In rugby England have four times the player population of New Zealand, multiples of the New Zealand rugby union's income stream. They can afford to send a team touring New Zealand with 19 staff (for a sport with 15 on-field players and 7 reserves), including a lawyer in case any of the players get in trouble.

      They got their arses handed to them last weekend.

    47. Re:The New Direction In Sports by rodgerd · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Then who'll give a shit about F1? It's the pinnacle of car-based motorsport. Turning it into a technological little-league a la F3000 or Indy Lights will make it about as popular.

      The easy way to inject a bit more interest in F1 would be if the best cars weren't being driven by the best driver. This is why MotoGP just got interesting, with the previously all-conqueroring Rossi leaving Honda (best bikes) and joining Yamaha (next best bikes). Made it very interesting.

    48. Re:The New Direction In Sports by ackthpt · · Score: 1
      I regularly participate in triathlons, strictly amateur. Someone once asked me what my least-favorite part is. I quickly answered, the cycling.

      I forked over large last year for my primier road bike. It's light, stiff, responsive and great handling. When it started pouring, as it does in the early part of the year, I shelled for a winter bike, a measely $550 and though steel came killer equiped. Put on some aero bars and a disc on the back and It's practically a TT bike. Granted some time spent making it a little more aero could shave a few seconds. More to the $$$ point, though would be shelling and getting into a wind tunnel and working on position and getting the full rundown (maybe I'd be better in a different gear than I think I'm good in, etc.)

      --

      A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
    49. Re:The New Direction In Sports by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      LOL, brake-checking people in the dark it's very bright... Guess all his technology and money didn't really help him out there huh? Wait... you mean without the technology and money, he isn't 'The third greatest driver of all time'?? Who'd a thunk it!

    50. Re:The New Direction In Sports by mangu · · Score: 1
      Otherwise Rubens would have some victories, or at least more second place finishes.


      Well, at least Rubens scored points on every race this year, which is considerably better than Kimi Raikkonen did. You don't see a Ferrari trailing smoke, do you? OTOH, remember Rubens in Brazil last year? He would have won, if he hadn't run out of gas. His team didn't call him to the pitstop, perhaps on purpose. I'm not saying that Barrichello is in the same class as Schumacher, but the Ferrari team certainly stacks the cards. Ferrari has a long tradition of only letting one guy win. That's why Gilles Villeneuve died. Didier Pironi, who was Villeneuve's Barrichello, broke the house rules and won one race that was meant for the #1 driver. At the next race's qualifying session, Pironi again broke the rules and had a better lap time than Villeneuve. With a few minutes to the session end, Villeneuve was so desperate to better Pironi's time that he crashed and died. Google for Pironi and Villeneuve if you want other viewpoints of this story, but I think everyone agrees that the beginning of the end for Gilles Villeneuve was when Didier Pironi won a race that Ferrari had decided he shouldn't win.

    51. Re:The New Direction In Sports by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "if this was a war for oil..."

      silly rabbit, it was a war for Oil, paying higher prices at the pump is one of the many benefits for Oil that has resulted. Oil is a business, not a product :)

    52. Re:The New Direction In Sports by karit · · Score: 1

      And the only 2 sports with higher viewership is the Soccer World Cup and the Summer Olympics, which only hapen every 4 years

      --
      http://blog.karit.geek.nz/
    53. Re:The New Direction In Sports by karit · · Score: 1

      There aren't any 4-car F1 teams (which might be prohibited by its rules anyways)

      Rules say 2 drivers 2 cars in race. (Though that part of the rule book is about a page long)

      --
      http://blog.karit.geek.nz/
    54. Re:The New Direction In Sports by karit · · Score: 1

      It was a good game. Looking forward to the next game :)

      But then the UK teams always seem to send under strength touring teams down under.

      --
      http://blog.karit.geek.nz/
    55. Re:The New Direction In Sports by stars_are_number_1 · · Score: 1

      At least the Rangers are better than the Mets this year. All it took was the removal of the highest paid player in the history of sports.
      Go figure.

    56. Re:The New Direction In Sports by flewp · · Score: 2

      Psssst.

      Even Trulli (who won the race) later said JPM was following too closely. Also, MS has ALWAYS warmed up his tires and brakes (by accelerating hard and then braking hard) before the safety car is due to exit the track (which it was going to do upon arrival of the pit lane).

      Also, JPM himself admitted you can't get too close to MS at these times because of the fact that MS does such things. MS's brake lockup though, is inexcpliciple. (I just butched that word, I know)

      --
      WWJD.... for a Klondike bar?
    57. Re:The New Direction In Sports by flewp · · Score: 1

      Renault builds their own engines.

      --
      WWJD.... for a Klondike bar?
    58. Re:The New Direction In Sports by flewp · · Score: 1

      Well, you might have a point. If MS were in an 03 BAR which suffered from horrible consistancy, then yes, he'd have a hard time winning. But Ferrari in it's current state is because of MS (and also Braun and Todt and hte rest of the team).

      For proof, look at Benneton before and after MS. Also, look at Ferrari before MS and after. MS is widely regarded as having a lot of valuble input into the design of the car. Sure, he doesn't actually shape out the aero packages and everything, but he's excellent at conveying what needs to be done to the car in a way the engineers can interpret it and sort things out.

      --
      WWJD.... for a Klondike bar?
    59. Re:The New Direction In Sports by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In 2003:

      Ferrari - $418.23m
      Toyota - $386.51m
      McLaren-Mercedes - $359.22m
      BMW-Williams - $359.04m
      BAR-Honda - 309.87m
      Renault - $255.23m
      Sauber - $154.57m
      Jaguar - $141.93m
      Jordan - $79.92m
      Minardi - $46.58m

      Source: F1 Racing, April 2004
      www.f1racing.co.uk

    60. Re:The New Direction In Sports by MrWa · · Score: 1
      One one hand, the bar has always been raised. Rowing has been a popular sport for some time now. But what do you do if you are in the 99.9% of the world that cannot get access to a boathouse? You don't compete in rowing, that's what.

      99.9% of the people on this plant must be in a pretty dire situation if they can't find a boathouse when the Earth is 70% covered with water!

    61. Re:The New Direction In Sports by TheLink · · Score: 1

      Well the banning of drug money^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H tobacco sponsorship doesn't help much.

      So far F1 still gets a decent viewing audience - at least in my country.

      TV viewing figures as a whole have dropped, so it's no surprise viewing figures for F1 drop too. Is the drop more than for other similar stuff?

      It's just there's a lot more of everything else to watch, compared to years ago - e.g. X-games. Then there's the internet, online games etc. People are finding plenty of things to do other than watch TV.

      --
    62. Re:The New Direction In Sports by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And don't forget that the first time schumi won the world championship he was still driving for beneton.

    63. Re:The New Direction In Sports by andr0meda · · Score: 1


      I think Schumacher wins because his car is more reliable, and because his crew manages to use the pitlane to get him ahead. Over the last 5 years or so, I haven't seen *any* interesting racing fight with him for 1st place. His team mate isn't even allowed to go for 1st place if Shumi is somewhere near it.

      But he deserves to win, and gets my respect primarily because he has a way of telling his team what is wrong with the car, and how and where they can improve, better than anyone else. But don't tell me he is the best driver ever. There was only one and, he passed away racing.

      --
      With great power comes great electricity bills.
    64. Re:The New Direction In Sports by goatan · · Score: 1
      The uneveness in F1 is now appauling, I've seen only two of the races this year whereas in 2002 I didn't miss any of them. Having a sport so unbalanced like this can't be any good for the people who run it as they will be losing viewers and therefore money from sponsors. Hopefully the FIA will restrict the use of computers and telemetry and give lower teams a chance.

      Also take of the wings slap on big grippy tyres instead and get some driver skill back into it.

      --
      Saying Apple is better than MS is like saying Botulism is better than rabies.

    65. Re:The New Direction In Sports by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And don't forget that the first time schumi won the world championship he was still cheat^H^H^H^H^Hdriving for beneton.

    66. Re:The New Direction In Sports by goatan · · Score: 1
      I mod down ALL Anonymous Coward posts, and mod ALL "Funny" as "Offtopic".

      How sad, what else Insightful as Flamebait Offtopic as funny Trolls as Informative?

      --
      Saying Apple is better than MS is like saying Botulism is better than rabies.

    67. Re:The New Direction In Sports by goatan · · Score: 1
      The most fun was watching Nigel Mansell leave F-1 and go to Cart where he trounced everybody. Now that was some racing.......

      He's on of the true greats and probably the most entertaining driver as well. He wouldn't back down. He would either and often ending up blowing something up, giving to much throttle in the corners and crashing or wining (the amount of races he lead and lost for these reasons is unbelievable) But he learnt his profession and ended up being to only person to win F1 CART back to back.

      Yes I am a Mansell Fan still think he was the Fastest, maddest driver ever (not counting the older generations of drivers as I don't know from personal experience) but definitely not the most refined one.

      --
      Saying Apple is better than MS is like saying Botulism is better than rabies.

    68. Re:The New Direction In Sports by goatan · · Score: 1
      Also, JPM himself admitted you can't get too close to MS at these times because of the fact that MS does such things. MS's brake lockup though, is inexcpliciple. (I just butched that word, I know)

      But why do think he does this ? it is precisley so the car behind has to back of just before the pace leaves. Schumi tries to bend the rules as much as possible, even to the point of ramming someone off the course twice to preserve his lead and win in the chamionship.

      --
      Saying Apple is better than MS is like saying Botulism is better than rabies.

    69. Re:The New Direction In Sports by a7244270 · · Score: 0, Troll
      How sad, what else Insightful as Flamebait Offtopic as funny Trolls as Informative?

      I don't know about you, but my time is a limited resource. I come here to stay current on the latest tech news, and to learn from the smart people who respond to the articles.

      Most of the anonymous coward posts are flamebait, trolls, or other crap, and most of the jokes are just plain stupid. Seriously, does anyone still think that first posts, beowulf clusters and jabs at soviet russia are funny ? Are you really interested in joining GNAA, or the kill a puppy foundation ?

      Theres an inverse relation between signal to noise ratio and the quality of the readers, and consequently the quality of the comments, and the last few years here have been the proof of this.

      Now, it is definitely true that speech should not be curtailed, voices need to be heard, medium for free speech, blah blah blah, but that's what usenet is for - not a site which is trying to attract advertising revenue.

      The only thing slashdot has going for it are the comments from the smart readers. I'd hate to see even more of them get driven away by the cowards.

    70. Re:The New Direction In Sports by flewp · · Score: 1

      But why do think he does this ? it is precisley so the car behind has to back of just before the pace leaves. Schumi tries to bend the rules as much as possible, even to the point of ramming someone off the course twice to preserve his lead and win in the chamionship

      No, he does it to warm up his brakes and tires. After following the safety car around, a Formula 1 car's tires and brakes become cooler than their ideal operating temperatures. Monaco especially requires some really heavy braking in parts, and also demands high grip tires. Besides, the incident took place WELL before the safety car was due to enter the pits.

      --
      WWJD.... for a Klondike bar?
    71. Re:The New Direction In Sports by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah... in the dark tunnel... which makes you wonder *WHY* someone would hammer on the brakes going from the (bright) outside, to the tunnel... OH RIGHT, he's M.S. and allowed to do dangerous things, because he's on Bernie's favorite team... At least he doesn't resort to ramming people of the road (hi, DC) to get his championship wins, OH WAIT, HE DOES!

    72. Re:The New Direction In Sports by juiceCake · · Score: 1

      Ah yes, that is right. Renault have become an all in one team as well. I have to rid myself of the Benetton association.

    73. Re:The New Direction In Sports by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'd make you a friend, but don't particularly want to attract the trolls to myself (I've done it before, it wasn't pretty).

  5. Blue AC? by Ratso+Baggins · · Score: 5, Funny

    The blue one labled AC is kinda obvious - all expensive cars come with air.

    --

    --
    "we live in a post-ideological world..." - Billy Bragg.

    1. Re:Blue AC? by QuijiboIsAWord · · Score: 0, Funny

      I just figured the driver has an Anonymous Coward mode he can slip into.

      --
      -Hmm...I got a G+ invite, better remember to remove the request from my sig...-
  6. it will take a supercomputer... by Ubergrendle · · Score: 5, Interesting

    ...to help a team beat Michael Schumacher. The guy is ridiculously good, and he's paired with a great car. F1 basically is a contest to see who will finish 2nd.

    Tiger Woods in golf, Wayne Gretzky in hockey, Michael Jordan in basketball -- all three of these guys dominated their respective sports at one time or another. But I don't think anyone has ever dominated a sport as much as Schumacher has in the past few years. Its getting so bad that F1 is actively NOT promoting Schumacher, as people are losing interest...

    --
    John Maynard Keynes: "When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do?"
    1. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by frodo+from+middle+ea · · Score: 2, Informative
      Yes, and the fact that, that guy has an ego that would put hitler to shame doesn't help the overall F1 image either.

      When his own teammates accuse him of not playing as per team rules, you can begin to understand how much hated this guy is.

      But give me F1 anyday over Nascar.

      --
      for the last time people, I am "frodo from middle eaRTH", not "middle eaST".
    2. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by hanssprudel · · Score: 1

      Sauber are not going to beat Ferrari, they are, more or less, Ferrari's B team, running with last years Ferrari engine and gearboxes.

      Schumacher is a genius, but it is about time that he put his foot down and demanded that the team get a second driver of close to his caliber, so we can see some actual racing. Ferrari's clear 1, 2 strategy may be working, but the lack of excitement has hurt F1 to the point where it is hurting both Ferrari and Schumacher himself as well.

    3. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by Troed · · Score: 2, Informative
      No.

      At Albert Park in early March, Ferrari and Sauber had the same V10 engine.

      New 'long life' rules meant last year's scarlet unit was not reliable enough to be fitted to the Sauber C23, so the customer team got works- spec Ferrari power.
      link

      ... they have however not gotten the same updates, but when this season started Ferrari and Sauber had the same engines.

      That's how much difference the REST of the car makes!

    4. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by WordUpCousin · · Score: 1

      But I don't think anyone has ever dominated a sport as much as Schumacher has in the past few years

      He's not exaggerating..

      Current 2004 results

    5. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by bastion_xx · · Score: 4, Informative

      Yes, and the fact that, that guy has an ego that would put hitler to shame doesn't help the overall F1 image either.

      Unlike JPM, Villnevue, Senna, Prost, Coultard, Ralf S., or any other the other winning drivers?

      I actually think Michael has a good diplomatic approach during the post race interviews. Most people appear not to like him because he's not lovable like Jordon or Tiger Woods.

      But, to bring this back on track: yeah there is a ton of money spent on F1. Guaranteed that once tobacco money is taken out of the picture (I'd say by 2008 at the latest), overall spending will go down unless the FIA finds some way to compensate for it.

      Personally I like that the teams innovate. Anti-lock brakes, traction control, ECU development, etc. and examples of technolgoy that has been tested in race cars first (although not necesssarily developed there) and then deployed in production run vehicles.

      Plus, they are damned fast! :)

    6. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by another_mr_lizard · · Score: 1

      "But I don't think anyone has ever dominated a sport as much as Schumacher has in the past few years"

      You should go look at the history books then. Until Schueys most recent championship Juan Manuel Fangio was the most succesful driver of all time. Unlike Schumacher there was a lot of ex and future champions racing him - something that has been lacking for Schumacher since the late 90's.

      --
      "My parents were strict, but they never pitted me against livestock" - Doug Stanhope
    7. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by TomV · · Score: 3, Informative

      Schumacher is a genius, but it is about time that he put his foot down and demanded that the team get a second driver of close to his caliber, so we can see some actual racing.

      Absolutely. Ferrari's dominance in recent years is similar to McLaren's in the mid-late 1980s, but with the crucial difference that in McLaren's most dodminant season, 1988, although the team won 15 of the 16 races with John Barnard's revolutionary MP4/4, and took 199 Constructor's points to second-placed Ferrari's 65, since Ayrton Senna took eight of their wins and his team-mate Alain Prost took seven, the season was gripping to the very end, Senna finishing with 90 points to Prost's 87. You knew a McLaren was likely to win each race, but as to which one...

      Meanwhile, it's staggering to see what *can* be achieved by teams with a tenth of the budget of the frontrunners, and what *can't* be achieved, yet, with Toyota's budget, rumoured to be even bigger than the half-billion dollars Ferrari are said to spend each year.

    8. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by ralphus · · Score: 1

      Schumacher is good but he's no Senna. Senna died before his time or Schumacher's name would be a shadow to Senna. Schumacher doesn't have half the soul or drive to win that Senna did. People aren't losing interest in F1 and F1 is promoting the hell out of Schumacher. It's American audiences that prefer rednecks driving in a circle to real racing that make F1 unpopular in the US.

      --
      Revolutions are never about freedom or justice. They're about who's going to be top dog. -- Kilgore Trout
    9. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Unlike JPM, Villnevue, Senna, Prost, Coultard, Ralf S., or any other the other winning drivers?

      You are right with one exception: Coultard. Everybody ho knows him closer likes him and his modesty. Maybe the lack of aggression is the reason he is not winning...

    10. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by jocknerd · · Score: 2, Insightful
      But give me F1 anyday over Nascar.


      Amen to that. I'm in the heart of NASCAR country. I just don't see what it has to offer. Carburated engines. Tauruses. Give me a break. I put NASCAR on the same level as Pro Wrestling.
    11. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by bastion_xx · · Score: 1

      You're right. I meant Mansell. For some reason those two are interchangable, but only in my head. :)

    12. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      He's about as lovable as Mike Tyson.

    13. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by Neil+Watson · · Score: 1

      There is no doubt that many F1 drivers are somewhat self-centred. The same can be said for fighter pilots. Someone who has the courage and confidense to do those things (like driving a car around a hair pin corner at over 80km/h) is bound to have an ego.

    14. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by nester · · Score: 1

      valintino rossi is possibly the best motorcycle racer ever (many would argue). he has dominated motogp. he won almost every race last year, on honda's v5. this year he switched to yamaha, and won (iirc) the first four races. in the history of motogp, no rider has ever won the first race after switching teams.

      he tested (secretly, but it got out) ferrari's f1 car, months back. he was only a few seconds off pace, and it was the first time he had ever driven an f1 car.

      considering racing on two wheels is much harder than four, i would expect him to out drive any f1 driver, if given the chance. he's said he's more interested in world rally (which he's tried before).

    15. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by Enygma42 · · Score: 1

      "But I don't think anyone has ever dominated a sport as much as Schumacher has in the past few years"

      The only other I can think of is Kelly Slater, the surfer that used to be on Baywatch. He's actually an insane surfer and has won the World Championship 6 times.
      He came out of retirement at 30 to come back as a main contender for the title for the past two years.

      The only difference is he doesn't have the ego that Schuey has!

      --
      "hehe, website" - Homer Simpson
    16. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by EinarH · · Score: 1
      And don't forget active ride suspension developed mainly for Formula 1 in the late eighties and outlawed in 1993 becasue it was too good. A couple of years later most of the tech stared trickling down to reglar cars.

      Same with carbon brakes, soon to be outlawed in F1. Mercedes and Audi allready deliver cars with carbon brakes.

      And much of the advanced turbo development comes from rally cars (Saab, Mitsubishi, Lancia, Renault, Subaru)

      --

      Melius mori in libertate quam vivere in servitute.

    17. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by achesloc · · Score: 1

      I am not really much of a formula one fan due in large part to schummy's dominance. Formula one has always been a competitive racing series, but with the cars the way they are there is very little passing, save for the first lap. I typically will watch the first few laps, decide they are running way faster than I have ever come close to in my road course driving and switch the channel. I don't even bother watching the end of the race because it is essentially scripted.

      I wish could back to the old days when ayrton senna and jean alesi were around. Formula one has been a great racing series for long time, but the schummy thing is definately making me turn away.

    18. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by TopShelf · · Score: 1

      Probably the greatest F1 race I ever saw was in Spain I believe, when Senna had the first active suspension system in his Lotus. He was basically able to complete the race with fewer stops for tires because the suspension reduced tire wear, whereas Nigel Mansell (sp?) got a fresh set of rubber with about 20 laps to go, and started setting record lap times trying to catch up to Senna. It came down the final lap, and after a great battle between the two, Senna won by a fraction of a second.

      It was a great (and rare) example of different technological approaches playing out wheel-to-wheel for the victory, right alongside the personal battle between the drivers.

      --
      Stop by my site where I write about ERP systems & more
    19. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by jd · · Score: 1
      Ayrton Senna, Alain Prost and Manuel Fangio were respectively the best drivers in their era. There have always been "top" drivers, though.


      There was a time when McLaren couldn't lose. Between Alain Prost and Nikki Lauda, nobody else could come close. I believe one year, there was a 1/2 point difference between the two for the championship title, with Prost 1st and Lauda 2nd.


      Schumacher is merely the next generation of top driver. If you look at the points scored as a function of races, though, I doubt he's any better than the other "aces".


      I believe Senna, Fangio and Prost are currently tied on the number of GP championships won (5). Senna is ahead of everyone on the number of actual races won, to the best of my knowledge. He certainly wins outright on the best all-weather driver.


      Fangio, with a vastly more primitive car, could lay claim to be the most skilled of the lot, by the mere fact that the driver was a larger factor in races, back then.


      In terms of head-to-head racing, Prost and Senna were virtually equal. I've seen them duelling an inch or so apart, at maximum speed, down straights.


      To claim one driver is "the best" is to forget a lot of history. There were drivers better than Schumacher, and there will be again.

      --
      It's a small world and it smells funny; I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money; Take back what I paid (SoM)
    20. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by platypus · · Score: 1

      considering racing on two wheels is much harder than four, i would expect him to out drive any f1 driver, if given the chance.

      I also think so, NOT!

    21. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by JCCyC · · Score: 1

      Coulthard is IMHO more aggressive than Prost and Ralf. He's sulking this year because the car sucks and he knows his career is coming to an end.

      He had many admirable tussles with Schumacher in past years. Remember The Finger?

    22. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by JCCyC · · Score: 1

      Jerez de la Frontera, 1986.

      Love that JPS paintjob.

    23. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      But give me F1 anyday over Nascar.

      or any other series where the cars do more than just turn left?

    24. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by JCCyC · · Score: 1

      Even Germans can't stand him. I once went to Germany and visited a friend I met at this newsgroup -- it was 2000, and he was rooting for Mika Häkkinen against Schumacher. Amazing!

    25. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by npsimons · · Score: 1
      ...to help a team beat Michael Schumacher. The guy is ridiculously good, and he's paired with a great car. F1 basically is a contest to see who will finish 2nd.

      Wow! I knew this guy in college! He was my roommate for a couple of semesters! I never knew he was an F1 racer. The secrets some people keep.
    26. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by juiceCake · · Score: 1

      "I am not really much of a formula one fan due in large part to schummy's dominance."

      I don't understand why people aren't much of F1 fans because of Schuey's dominance.

      I'd can understand a statement like: I'm not much of a formula one fan due to most of the teams and drivers not being able to rise to the level of Schumacher and Ferrari.

      I don't understand how Schumacher or Ferrari are the major factors or have anything to do with the mediocrity (in contrast) of the other teams. If F1 is boring, it's not Ferrari's fault. Indeed, they are the best of example of what the other teams should strive for. The failure of the other teams is the problem.

    27. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by juiceCake · · Score: 1

      "I believe Senna, Fangio and Prost are currently tied on the number of GP championships won (5). Senna is ahead of everyone on the number of actual races won, to the best of my knowledge. He certainly wins outright on the best all-weather driver."

      Micheal has the most race victories of any drivers, with Alain Prost second. Micheal is at 77 and counting.

      As for Championships:

      Schumacher: 6 (and counting)
      Fangio: 5
      Prost: 4
      Senna: 3

      "To claim one driver is "the best" is to forget a lot of history. There were drivers better than Schumacher, and there will be again." It is very difficult to compare drivers across eras, but clearly, I'd say these drivers are all in the same league. I'm a little surprised you didn't mention Jimmy Clark, but so be it. You could argue that Fangio's cars, though more primitive, were less stressful physically, not to mention slower than modern F1 cars and thus argue that the latest drivers are better, etc. But such arguments cannot be won and indeed, seem to me to be ridiculous. I'm not sure why people are fascinated with defining "the best".

    28. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by 16K+Ram+Pack · · Score: 1
      Off the top of my head, I can think of a few athletes...

      Sergei Bubka in the Pole Vault not only broke the world record a number of times, but dominated for years.

      Also, Ed Moses in the 400m hurdles had some staggering unbeaten run (can't remember exactly).

      That's not to take anything away from Schumacher, who I rate as the best all-time driver, particularly when you compare him with any team mate he has.

    29. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by TomQ · · Score: 1

      Most successful driver of all time: Michael Schumacher. He owns nearly all of the records (no. of championships, no of race wins, no. of points, most wins in a season, most wins at a single track, most points in a season etc...) About the only exception is the number of poles: Senna still holds that - 65 but Schumacher is rapidly closing in... however he has needed a lot more races to do so.

      Contrary to the stated opinion of most people, Schumacher is not arrogant - he just seems that way. Actually the people who know him say he is a Family man, private and his team loves him (his engineers and the people back in the factory basically work for him) He is always thanking them...

      Obviously I',m a Schumi fan - so don't take it from me:
      The (in)famous British Commentator Murray Walker says so top!

      I agree that to say one is the best is to forget history.
      Schumacher has said that it is impossible to compare drivers from different eras - Fangio was awesome in his time etc...

      One comment that is consistently said about Schumacher is that he only uses part of his brain to drive, unlike most drivers. He gets a constant commentary from the pits about _EVERYTHING_ else that is happening on the track... No other driver can do that.

      He took a crap team (Before he won it in 2000, Ferrari hadn't won a championship since 1979) to the absolute
      pinnacle...

      Good site: http://www.itv-f1.com: ITV-F1 - Great commentary during the race too...

      Cant wait for the British GP -I'm going :-)))))

      tom.

      --
      -- Tom
    30. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by erich_cool2hate · · Score: 1

      "But I don't think anyone has ever dominated a sport as much as Schumacher has in the past few years." Richard Petty.

    31. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by 16K+Ram+Pack · · Score: 1
      I'm tired of people knocking Schumacher.

      From what I've heard, he works well with the team and gives a lot of feedback to the engineers, far more than many drivers such as certain British world champions whose cars failed and they always blamed the team.

      I think he's the best driver ever. How? Look at how far ahead he always is of his compatriots or co-drivers. If there's two cars, in a team, and one is streets ahead of the other, what does that tell you? Remember, Mansell and Piquet, Senna and Prost? Both pairs were in teams and were very close. AFAIK, no driver in the same team as Schumacher has come close.

      I've also heard that he makes far more adjustments to his steering than most drivers, so can take corners just that bit quicker.

      Everyone mentions Ayrton Senna, and he was great, but then so was Alain Prost. Senna was rarely more than a notch above Prost. I seriously think, though that paired up, Schumacher would have beaten either of them.

      BTW Have fun at Silverstone. Set your alarm early, or better still, get a flight in!

    32. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Unlike JPM, Villnevue, Senna, Prost, Coultard, Ralf S.,

      who's this Vellnev, prost etc.?

    33. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by TopShelf · · Score: 1

      I've still got a JPS t-shirt from one of the Detroit races back then. Of course, it's a weee bit small for me these days. But it's still cool! No matter what my wife says...

      --
      Stop by my site where I write about ERP systems & more
    34. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Schumacher yeah that guys good, (I'm American) and I've heard of him but wouldn't recognize him. He's famous in Europe, but when he was in Las Vegas last year about the only people who recognized him were visiting Europeans. Apparently he likes it that way rather than being smothered in the spotlight all the time.
      Just goes to show that F1 racing is popular in Europe, etc. vs. the US.

    35. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by vakuona · · Score: 1

      Racing on two wheels seems harder than racing on four, but in F1, there is not a lot of margin for error. Take for example Kimi Raikonnen, at the 2002 French GP. He was leading the race, and he went of with Michael following right behind. Michael immediately stepped up and took the lead. The smallest mistake is punished and it may well be impossible to recover. So it not only important to be fast, when you are fast is equally important. Michael Schumacher has won races because he was fast when he needed to be, even when he didn't have the fastest car. A few seconds off the pace is a lifetime in F1. Some pole positions for example have been won by literally thousandths of a second. For the last 2 years, the qualifying has been a single lap affair, and so there is no recovering, but there is no compromise either. PLus F1 is really punishing in terms of the G forces involved when turning and braking.

    36. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by ^DA · · Score: 0

      Personally I was a great fan of F1 racing until two years ago then Mika Hakkinen quit. That was the only guy that could give Schumacher a run for his money.

      Last year I watched maybe the first five or six races and then stopped. Schumacher won everything. This year I haven't watched one race. It's just not exciting anymore...

    37. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by Rower · · Score: 1

      I agree with you about the greatness of Schumacher. I read a few years back about how his team-mates couldn't use his suspension settings because he liks his car VERY stiff (and this is taking into account that F1 cars are pretty stiff to begin with) with no give, "like a go-cart" the article said. Apparently this makes the car act a little different than normal (I guess it would make it skid or drift more) and can be hard to control. I remember also reading about how he learned to get around the track on only one or two gears while driving world endurance cars for mercedes (lemans 24 hrs). This was during some race when he had lost all of his gears but 2nd and fifth and still managed to win. The engineers had determined driving around the course in fifth gear was the best compromise betweem not slowing down to much and saving fuel. He also works out for like eight hour a day, hes literally a superman!

      --
      Hooo Son! This'uns a Hawg!
    38. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by achesloc · · Score: 1

      I also agree with this. I wasn't placing blame on schummy in particular with that statement. The failure of other teams is certainly the issue at hand. As a result of this failure, ferrari/schummy dominate. It makes it boring to watch for me. It just isn't as cool as it used to be.

    39. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by palndrumm · · Score: 1

      How about Layne Beachley? Not only has she won the women's surfing world championship 6 times, she's won it 6 times in a row...

    40. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by TheLink · · Score: 1

      Ego? Examples?

      He's been winning for the past X years, so if he thinks he's great, hey that's just being honest and realistic.

      It's the other F1 racers who think they're great but they actually aren't that good, who have ego problems. Eddie Irvine was one example.

      However you look at it, Schumacher is very noticeably better than Rubens. Rubens is good, but good just gets you number 2 driver. You want team priority, all you have to do is drive well enough to be number 1 driver. Don't think the team doesn't know how well you drive nowadays, with all the telemetrics.

      Drivers like Senna and Schumacher can take corners with exactly the same angles every time. Repeatable laps after laps.

      Schumacher has been known to race around a track in twilight conditions (when testing cars[1]) and he's only about a second slower when it's dark - F1 cars have no headlights.

      [1] It's also what these guys do out of playing that makes them so good. Michael Jordan practiced a LOT more than most other basketball players. Similarly for Pete Sampras in tennis (but he never won in clay ;) ).

      --
    41. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by Enygma42 · · Score: 1

      What the..?!?! We all know girls can't surf! :)

      Alright, I'll give her that then, I wasn't aware she won it 6 times in a row.

      --
      "hehe, website" - Homer Simpson
    42. Re:it will take a supercomputer... by biz0r · · Score: 1

      I hold NASCAR pretty low (I also am in the midst of NASCAR fanatics), but not quite as low as Pro Wrestling. I mean, atleast the outcome of the NASCAR race is unknown to everyone...you gotta give them that...they DO still race even though it's quite lame (IMHO) to watch Joe Hicksville do circle laps for 3 hours.

      --
      /* sig */
  7. Steering wheel doodads by digidave · · Score: 4, Funny

    "I love the crazy steering wheel - anyone know what all those buttons and knobs do?" "

    I'm pretty sure I saw buttons for Ctrl-Alt-Delete on there.

    --
    The global economy is a great thing until you feel it locally.
    1. Re:Steering wheel doodads by AviLazar · · Score: 1

      Do you think it's windows OS? ANd if so, what happens when you get a BSOD (especially with no visible screen to tell you?)

      --

      I mod down so you can mod up. Your welcome.
    2. Re:Steering wheel doodads by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm pretty sure I saw buttons for Ctrl-Alt-Delete on there.

      They use it periodicaly to prevent hard crash. Nobody likes to see BSOD when running 350 km/h. They use it usualy during pitstop, you can notice, that in poor teams, which can not afford fast systems, pit-reboot takes slightly more time...

    3. Re:Steering wheel doodads by DevNova · · Score: 1

      RTFC.

      There is a screen there. Top center. It even says so in the caption.

  8. The buttons by ministry92 · · Score: 0, Redundant

    Control the car... (duh!!)

  9. Buttons and Knobs by b12arr0 · · Score: 5, Funny

    I think the buttons and knobs control things like the oilslick and exhaust cloud. :)

    1. Re:Buttons and Knobs by hpulley · · Score: 1
      I think the buttons and knobs control things like the oilslick and exhaust cloud. :)

      Ah, so that's what Takumo Sato is doing wrong!

      --
      $#!^ happens, but why does it always have to happen to me???
    2. Re:Buttons and knobs by X-Nc · · Score: 1

      In F1 the buttons all mean something. There's the gear shift adjuster, the pit lane speed limiter, the clutch, the radio transmit button... While it may be true that buttons and knobs are for show in passanger cars, they definitely aren't for F1. I'd recomend you go to the F1 site for more info.

      --
      --
      If I actually could spell I'd have spelled it right in the first place.
    3. Re:Buttons and knobs by WillRobinson · · Score: 1

      You just took me to seriously. Yes I agree with you, I was just being my normal lighthearted self.

    4. Re:Buttons and knobs by X-Nc · · Score: 1

      Sorry. Since F1, along with Ozumo, are my favorite sports it's sometimes hard to tell the humor from the uninformed.

      --
      --
      If I actually could spell I'd have spelled it right in the first place.
  10. I know , I know! by L.+VeGas · · Score: 1, Troll

    anyone know what all those buttons and knobs do?

    Well, the one with little scissors on it means "cut". The one with two pages means "copy". The little clipboard and piece of paper means "paste".

    Oh and that great big knob? That's the radio.

  11. Button uses by hoyty · · Score: 5, Informative

    The buttons have a couple of uses. Usually 3-4 are for fuel mixture, how much fuel the engine is given. This determines HP and mileage. Then there is usually a rev limiter button for pit speeds. Other things on the steering wheel can include shifters or kill switches.

    --
    Hoyty
  12. Super Speedway... by Cyclopedian · · Score: 4, Interesting

    If you've watched the IMAX film "Super Speedway", you'll see how they build a CART racer from scratch. It doesn't focus a lot on applied computer technology in this field, but it's still informative.

    Such as this tidbit: modern brakes on CART (and F1) racers can bring the vehicle to a total stop from 200mph in 1.6 seconds. Imagine the g-forces.

    -Cyc

    1. Re:Super Speedway... by Dr.+Evil · · Score: 1

      The speeds are stunning. 1.6 seconds at 200mph is 143 meters. If stopping speed is linear (which it isn't of course), that's still about 70 meters to come to a stop... most impressive to me is that the tires can hold that well to the road.

    2. Re:Super Speedway... by JonTurner · · Score: 3, Insightful

      >>a total stop from 200mph in 1.6 seconds. Imagine the g-forces. ...not to mention the heat! 1000C+ is typical after braking at the end of a straight, with normal operating temperature between 400-800 degrees Celsius!

      More info from http://www.f1technical.net/article2.html : "A mere 4 seconds is the amount of time it takes for a Formula One car to go from 300km/h to a complete halt. At 200 km/h, a Formula One contender requires just 2.9 seconds to stop completely, a process that will have been accomplished over 65 meters. At 100km/h, these values are just as mind-blowing: 1.4 seconds and 17 meters! Under these heavy braking periods, a driver is subjected to a horizontal deceleration of close to 5,2G."

      and...

      "These brakes are extremely expensive as they are made from hi-tech carbon materials (long chain carbon, as in carbon fibre) and they can take up to 5 months to produce a single brake disk. The first stage in making a disc is to heat white polyacrylo nitrile (PAN) fibres until they turn black. This makes them pre-oxidised, and are arranged in layers similar to felt. They are then cut into shape and carbonised to obtain very pure carbon fibres. Next, they undergo two densification heat cycles at around 1000 degrees Celsius. These stages last hundreds of hours, during which a hydrocarbon-rich gas in injected into the oven or furnace. This helps the layers of felt-like material to fuse together and form a solid material. The finished disc is then machined to size ready for installing onto the car."

      "There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing and mountaineering; all the rest are merely games." - Ernest Hemingway.

    3. Re:Super Speedway... by ifwm · · Score: 1

      I read an article several years ago that said some F1 cars could drive upside down because of the downforce they produce. That would be worth watching.

    4. Re:Super Speedway... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      uhhhh no not quite, that is a slight exaggeration.

      Formula 1 brakes, because they are carbon fiber and thus better than CART, will stop a car from 180 m.p.h to 50 in 2 seconds.

    5. Re:Super Speedway... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
    6. Re:Super Speedway... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      re: F1 brakes.... I read an article in Car and Driver mag that stated that the deceleration force caused by simply lifting off the gas of an F1 car while at 200+ MPH is greater than the full braking force of a late model Corvette.

    7. Re:Super Speedway... by Just+Some+Guy · · Score: 1

      s/some/all/. You don't get 3g of lateral acceleration without serious downforce. I heard a long time ago that the typical F1 car hits its weight in downdraft at 60mph, but have no evidence to support that.

      --
      Dewey, what part of this looks like authorities should be involved?
    8. Re:Super Speedway... by JonTurner · · Score: 1

      At 200mph, drag due to wind resistance is substantial even on a low CoD F1 car, but enough to = braking performance of even a modest street car? No way. Even a comparitively enormous NASCAR racer doesn't lose speed that quickly at 220MPH, and it's three times the weight with double the frontal area of an F1 with probably .3 greater coefficient drag! Factor in NASCAR's greater rolling resistance and larger drivetrain frictional losses and that claim looks incredibly doubtful.

      BTW, I've owned Corvettes and they have some of the best brakes on any moderately-priced sports car. While it's nowhere close to F1/Cart/Nascar level, those four big four-pot brakes and 14" rotors scrub off speed surprisingly well and shed heat effectively (they can do 100mph-> 0mph-> 100mph cycles repeatedly without fade). Vettes stop hard, the limiting factor often being available grip on the road, not grip on the rotor.

      In summary, if that statement was in C&D, it surely came from the "letters to the editor" section or from an uninformed junior writer "sexing-up" his writing with sensational though inaccurate statements.

    9. Re:Super Speedway... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actually, on F1 cars the G-forces during braking can be as much as 5.5 - I have no idea about CART.
      F1 uses carbon-carbon brakes (both the brake disc and the brake "pads" are made of carbon) - the same method as in airplanes.

    10. Re:Super Speedway... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      youre ignoring engine braking at 18,000 rpm and the fact that they dont WANT low drag coefficients, theyre dragging all over the place in order to get downforce in the turns.

  13. These are truly amazing cars by adequacy · · Score: 5, Funny

    When I switch on Speedvision at my friend's house to watch Formula One, what amazes me most about these cars is not just their speed but their ability to turn left (of course) but also to the right. As a NASCAR fan, this "bidirectional steering" thing the Europeans are doing is truly amazing. Maybe someday it will come to the states.

    1. Re:These are truly amazing cars by CompWerks · · Score: 1
      --
      If you can read this sig - the bitch fell off.
    2. Re:These are truly amazing cars by gosand · · Score: 5, Interesting
      When I switch on Speedvision at my friend's house to watch Formula One, what amazes me most about these cars is not just their speed but their ability to turn left (of course) but also to the right. As a NASCAR fan, this "bidirectional steering" thing the Europeans are doing is truly amazing. Maybe someday it will come to the states.

      You mean like the US Grand Prix ? (I know you were joking)

      I have been to the Indy 500, and the US Grand Prix. I can tell you that to me, F1 is much more impressive than Indy cars. Thankfully, I have never been to a NAASCOOORRR race, but there were plenty of ignorant rednecks at the Indy 500 for my tastes. What is most impressive to me about F1 is their handling. Holy Crap! When I went, it was raining part of the time, and they were still going insanely fast through the corners. When it dried out, they were even faster. Unbelievable. The downforce on those cars, and the suspension/tires is amazing. Not to mention the braking ability. The sheer speed is nothing sto sneeze at either. Hell, their *average* speeds are impressive.

      I have heard NAASCOOOORRR fans say that F1 is too much technology and not enough driving, but F1 has the best of the best when it comes to sheer driving ability. Then there are those absolute FREAKS who do rally. Those guys are nuts.

      --

      My beliefs do not require that you agree with them.

    3. Re:These are truly amazing cars by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      We'll just jump ahead to extreme racing. F1/Indy cars, at track speed, generate enough downforce to operate on an inverted roadway. Replace the back-stretch with an elevated and inverted section of track and transitions.

    4. Re:These are truly amazing cars by Kallahar · · Score: 1, Interesting

      If you want to see some truely amazing driving check out WRC. 120mph on a frozen mountain road with a driver who doesn't know the course (the passenger says things like "turn right next" in order to navigate.

    5. Re:These are truly amazing cars by Leroy_Brown242 · · Score: 1
      One of my favorite race sayings,"You have a roll cage in a race car for if you roll. You have a roll cage in a rally car for WHEN you roll"

      IMHO, rally drivers are not crazy, they just are a bit more comfotable on the bleeding edge of control than your typical driver.

      Besides, you have not lived until you've gone over 100 MPH on loose gravel ]:3}>

    6. Re:These are truly amazing cars by nolife · · Score: 1

      And in rally, the drivers fix the cars during the race. Its great to see a co pilot get out every time he sees water near the track to fill up a leaking radiator so they can make it to the end. For those that have never watched or seen highlights from a race, I suggest checking the clips at the WRC web site.

      --
      Bad boys rape our young girls but Violet gives willingly.
    7. Re:These are truly amazing cars by LighthouseJ · · Score: 1

      I always make jokes to friends that like NASCAR that NASCAR teams have extensive tests to make sure the steering wheel can turn left. They have guys for tires, guys for gas, and one guy to replace the non-left-turning steering wheel when there is one.

      F1 is cool, the fact that the engines have pneumatic ignitions (aka use a compressor to start the car) because it idles at 9000 RPM's, and redlines at 18,000 RPM's. However, my favorite type of racing is Rally racing, with the BTCC coming in a close second.

    8. Re:These are truly amazing cars by Strange+Ranger · · Score: 1


      Can anyone give a definitive reason for why there are no rallies in the USA? We have so much darn land after all. What's the deal? NASCAR and Indy can't touch rally racing.

      Seriously, can anyone see Speed Racer in a NASCAR race? What's wrong with this country?

      --

      Operator, give me the number for 911!
    9. Re:These are truly amazing cars by snillfisk · · Score: 1

      Some of the true magic about going to one of the WRC-events, is travelling to get there.. So don't let the missing native events stop you! If you live in the US, you could have gone to the Rally Mexico a couple of weeks back -- or even rally argentina which is coming up in a months time :-)

      We're currently considering going to Germany in the late august, but we'll have to wait and see if it becomes a reality (we were there in 2002)!

      --
      mats
      One man's ceiling is another man's floor.
    10. Re:These are truly amazing cars by racer19 · · Score: 1

      but there were plenty of ignorant rednecks at the Indy 500 for my tastes

      Not just at the Indy 500. I was at the inagural USGP @ Indy a few years ago and a family started to pack up their belongings to leave just a little ways into the race. When asked why they were leaving they replied, "Because the cars aren't running really close and passing back and forth." To which someone replied, "This ain't Nascar!" Their response? "I know, that's why we're leaving!"

      It's sad when the American public values contrived, fake competition over the real thing.

      --
      Could someone please point out to me where in the Constitution, exactly, is the "Right To Not Be Offended"?
    11. Re:These are truly amazing cars by Carnivore · · Score: 1

      I will never understand why we USians as a whole would rather watch rednecks turn left than a rally. Our country is huge! We could have all kinds of rally conditions without leaving the continental US. It would be _so awesome_. But no, "NAASCOOORRR", as the parent so eloquently put it, is the huge motorsport.

      I guess I'll have to continue to lust after the WRX for my American rally experience.

    12. Re:These are truly amazing cars by Carnivore · · Score: 2, Informative

      Just a nitpick-- the drivers _do_ know the course--they're the ones who write the course notes. They get to drive the stages some time before the race.

      That does not diminish the exceptional skill of the rally drivers. There are simply too many obstacles and sharp turns on the narrow roads for the driver to react unless he is reminded of what is approaching. It takes quite a bit of concentration to listen to the co-driver, who is 5-6 directions ahead of the driver, and still drive the car. On gravel/mud/snow. In the rain/sleet. At 200 km/h.

      Speedvision's coverage of the WRC is excellent, as well. The announcer actually has the ability to shut the hell up for minutes at a time, so that we can listen to the driver/co-driver and the car. I've never seen any other coverage like that.

    13. Re:These are truly amazing cars by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      go fast, turn left...
      nascar sucks just for this reason alone, what they only have one road corse in the season? cmon, there are more than that in the states. nascar should be racing horses, they are in the darkages, carbs, they might as well have a points inginition system. that new fangled MSD box is just confusing them. now dont get me started on NHRA, prostock, FC, or TF. they neew to allow electronic FI in the classes.....

    14. Re:These are truly amazing cars by bmj · · Score: 1

      World Rally Cars aren't far behind in the technology department, and they suffer much more abuse of the course of a rally weekend....

      --
      Whereof we cannot speak, thereof we must be silent. --Ludwig Wittgenstein
    15. Re:These are truly amazing cars by 16K+Ram+Pack · · Score: 2, Interesting
      Is the Indy racing stuff to do with Americans liking to see Americans win?

      Looking at the sports Americans like, it's quite localised - American Football, Baseball, Ice Hockey. Basically, hardly anyone else plays them.

      They've picked up Football (the proper one) only as a ladies game (where there's little competition). I wonder how long interest will be held if someone gets a better ladies team out there.

    16. Re:These are truly amazing cars by Blofeld · · Score: 1

      While the USGP is a good time, I have to suggest making the trip to Montreal for the Canadian GP. Montreal, in general, is a very European city. With the GP in town, it becomes even more so, and allows you to get a better feel for what makes F1 racing such a big draw around the world.

    17. Re:These are truly amazing cars by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What is truely entertaining is watching Marcus Gronholm fix (or not fix) a rally car. He usually just drives them back to service with three wheels left.

    18. Re:These are truly amazing cars by Kallahar · · Score: 0

      Actually I'm almost positive that the driver doesn't drive the course (excluding previous year's races). I saw a speed channel special on it and they talked about how the co-driver rides along on the course taking down notes the day before the race, then has to be able to read his own handwriting while bouncing down the road the next day :)

    19. Re:These are truly amazing cars by brutus_007 · · Score: 0

      [quote]
      I have heard NAASCOOOORRR fans say that F1 is too much technology and not enough driving
      [/quote]

      In which case, you need only mention two names to them... Andretti (went to F1 for a season, failed miserably and went back to SCRAPCAR) and Montoya, a.k.a. JPM. He was in SCRAPCAR and went to F1. I've heard him in interviews say they're both exciting, but F1 is more competitive and more of a thrill (paraphrasing here, but that was the gist of it).

      --
      I have 1 million monkeys on a million year contract to make me a better sig.
  14. Jamming! by itwerx · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Wonder how long it takes before they start either jamming each other's transmissions or playing man-in-the-middle and injecting false data...?

    1. Re:Jamming! by tanveer1979 · · Score: 1

      They will start doing that when they get bored of participating and want to throw a billion dollar + investment away, coz after that they will be expelled. F1 regulations are too too stringent with disqualification over the slightest errors. In this Sundays Race Raif S(Micheal's bro) came second, but was stripped of the second place and disqualified coz the brake ducts(which carry brake oil to wheels) were slightly bigger than regulations. The net effect of using those ducts was about 10% increase in braking for first 5 laps and subsequently going on to 70th lap when the brake disks are almost cooked it would be about 1%. Yet disqualification was sudden and swift with no chance of any appeal whatsoever. So you can well imagine how far is Jamming and interference!

      --
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    2. Re:Jamming! by G+Samsonoff · · Score: 1

      Or malicious spectators could engage in this, like those dirt bags at the Reno air races that try to jam the air-to-air voice transmissions...

    3. Re:Jamming! by Enigma_Man · · Score: 1

      Their transmissions take enough abuse as it is, dealing with the thousand-some-odd horsepower they generate pushing into stiff axles and giant wheels...

      Oh... you meant...

      -Jesse

      --
      Nothing says "unprofessional job" like wrinkles in your duct tape.
    4. Re:Jamming! by Mindjiver · · Score: 1

      Well. I presume they all use frequence hopping and that would make it quite diffucult to jam the signal.

      --
      I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!
    5. Re:Jamming! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Brake ducts carry air to the brake discs. Brake lines carry fluid to the calipers. Wheels don't need to be lubricated with oil.

    6. Re:Jamming! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You don't know what the fuck you're talking about.
      READ UP BITCH

    7. Re:Jamming! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      Wonder how long it takes before they start either jamming each other's transmissions or playing man-in-the-middle and injecting false data...?

      They're not a bunch of nerds who think running war3z hax0r t004s on their WIFI cards is cool. Grow up.

    8. Re:Jamming! by itwerx · · Score: 1

      They're not a bunch of nerds who think running war3z hax0r t004s on their WIFI cards is cool. Grow up.

      Every system has vulnerabilities. The question is the cost/benefit ratio of exploiting those vulnerabilities.
      E.g. Ft. Knox is not actually impregnable, but the effort and risk of penetrating it exceed the potential payoff.
      In a case like this however, where millions of dollars are at stake and the safeguards much less extreme, l33t hax0r5 aren't the only people who will be at least considering the benefits of tampering.
      If it can be done with a high enough certainty of anonymity (low risk) I can guarantee somebody has, or will, do it.

      Just your friendly local security analyst's 2c... :)

  15. Thats why by alex_ware · · Score: 1

    on the helmet is the AMD logo ;-) and they say it is essentially a computer nope it probably is a computer

    --
    If you have nothing useful to say post as AC.
    1. Re:Thats why by Zlurg · · Score: 1

      AMD sponsors Ferrari. They're not a sponsor of the series and I don't think are on any other cars. HP sponsors Williams BMW. Sun sponsors McLaren Mercedes. I'm not sure who Suber have in their camp, but the Saubers have last year's Ferrari engine (and have for several years used the previous year's Ferrari engine), so it's possible they have AMD on their sleeves.

    2. Re:Thats why by jridley · · Score: 1

      Hell, it's probably at least several. The LCD panel probably has one by itself. There's almost certainly a microcontroller to integrate all the button presses and shoot them down a serial line. There may be another to get data from the main onboard system and shoot it into the LCD.

    3. Re:Thats why by juiceCake · · Score: 1

      "but the Saubers have last year's Ferrari engine"

      Actually, they have this year's Ferrari engine.

  16. Does the tech need a roll bar? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    And how about speed holes and racing stripes?

    Gosh, I hate Formula 1 racing, they are NASCAR rednecks, with more money in other countries.

    1. Re:Does the tech need a roll bar? by javcrapa · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Actually f1 racing requires far more skilled pilots than nascar, on nascar you get to see rookies, on f1 piltos have a BIG resume. I hate nascar becasue cable tv s plagued with it and I (and most people outside us) find it terribly boring, but since "gringos" like the sport its on tv

  17. Things are going to change... by DaedalusLogic · · Score: 5, Interesting

    New regulations are being ushered through to eliminate a lot of the computerized systems in F1 cars. No more fancy traction control, the engines are going to be smaller, and there might even be an honest manual gearbox in future seasons. I doubt this will effect the telemetry advances, you still need all that data. What it will do is eliminate the edge Ferrari and BMW Williams have over everyone...

    Go out and look for articles on the changes. I read a great piece in Autoweek a month or two ago.

    1. Re:Things are going to change... by SoTuA · · Score: 1
      It happens every year.

      Team X comes up with great new tech Y.

      Team X wipes the floor with everybody else.

      Regulations make Y ilegal or restrains it hard.

      Back to square one.

      (Remember Williams' active suspension? It got Nigel Mansell a chamopionship!)

    2. Re:Things are going to change... by arf_barf · · Score: 1

      You have not been following the 2004 season have you? BMW sucks, Mercedes is just a shadow of itself (and yes, both teams have budgets on par with Ferrari).

      My take on this is: it's the drivers. Remember, that Schumacher won the first title racing for...FORD :-) which at the time was nowhere as advenced as Williams....

    3. Re:Things are going to change... by Neil+Watson · · Score: 1

      This is what make racing good for the automotive industry. I believe turbo chargers were once banned in F1. The result was fuel injection. Traction control, antilock breaks and countless others owe their starts to racing.

    4. Re:Things are going to change... by tanveer1979 · · Score: 1
      What it will do is eliminate the edge Ferrari and BMW Williams have over everyone...

      Well Just ferrari here. BMW is doing very badly. Now its Honda/Ferrari/Renault and maybe Toyota if they get a good driver. Jaguar is looking in the mid rungs and Sauber is also not too bad. So except for Ferrari sitting at the top, reset competition is pretty close. But in two years I expect Honda and Toyota to catch up. Those guys have lots of money. But I wonder wether this will effect popularity because as of now F1 has its biggest audience in Europe and Asia is just catching up.

      --
      My Aurora : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o91ZsGwJYyg
      FB : https://www.facebook.com/TanveersPhotography
  18. Interactive F1 steering wheel by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
  19. For the American audience by fiannaFailMan · · Score: 2, Informative

    Formula 1 is Grand Prix racing, similar to Indycars but I believe the speed is slightly slower, tracks are more varied than the ovals that you're used to, and it's the major motorsport that the rest of the world watches. There is also competition between various teams who construct the cars rather than all of them being built by one or two manufacturers as (I think) it is in Indycars. Most of the constructors are British-based with the obvious exception of Ferrari.

    --
    Drill baby drill - on Mars
    1. Re:For the American audience by NetJunkie · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I like F1, and Le Mans, but the problem most Americans face is that the races are on at like 3AM. I sometimes catch a race real late or maybe watch one on tape delay, but it just isn't the same as Live.

    2. Re:For the American audience by hanssprudel · · Score: 0

      Average speeds over a lap may be slower in F1 then with indycars racing on ovals, but only because F1 reaces of courses that actually require driving. Head to head, an F1 car will leave an indycar in the dust (the difference isn't so much speed and acceleration, but handling and especially braking).

    3. Re:For the American audience by dougrun · · Score: 1

      Indycars don't come close to being an F1 car! They are lower on the totem pole. They can only turn left, literally, their chassis is designed that way. F1 cars are lighter than Champcars (CART) but not as fast. With the push-to-pass button Champcars get 800hp. Theres a good car comparison on carts website. Watch them in HDNET or SpikeTV this weeknd at Porltand and look for me! I'll be there.

    4. Re:For the American audience by nxg125 · · Score: 1

      Can you say TiVo? :)

      --Nick

    5. Re:For the American audience by Zach978 · · Score: 1

      Also, don't forget to watch the USGP this weekend...it's America's only F1 race each year, so don't miss it. Sun. at 1 PM EDT on SpeedTV.

      --

      "I told you a million times not to exaggerate!"
    6. Re:For the American audience by turbo_magic_hat · · Score: 1

      Indycars (IRL/Cart) tend to top out at faster speeds - on an oval the Indycars would slaughter an F1, but F1 are optimised to keep as high an average on straights and corners as all races are on different courses including the streets of Monte Carlo. Every time an Indycar guy tests an F1 they comment on the higher G-forces and braking efficiency over their home sport.

      --
      --- Hell hath no fury like a Heron in a boob-tube ---
    7. Re:For the American audience by Troed · · Score: 1

      A few of the F1-cars have over 900hp. They also have superior track handling and brakes compared to CART-cars. The common reasoning is that an F1 car will outpace any IRL or CART car - except on ovals.

    8. Re:For the American audience by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actually if you were to put an F1 car up to a CART/Indy car, the F1 is vastly superior, not only in technology but in power/speed/acceleration. The speeds at the Indy 500 tend to be higher on average because the cars are going in circles while the F1's are racing through city streets in some cases. An F1 car (even the "slower" cars) are amazing peices of hardware, 3 liter engines cranking out 1100hp or more, most F1 engines don't even have camshafts anymore. I wish more people in the US would start watching F1, I would love to have a F1 race here on the west coast to go see. The US Gran Prix is this weekend I believe.

    9. Re:For the American audience by NetJunkie · · Score: 1

      Yes. Like I said, tape delay. But that's not as good as watching live.

    10. Re:For the American audience by smclean · · Score: 1
      Their cars are only designed to turn left? *cough* .. that must be a real problem on all the road courses in the CART/IRL circuits. Long Beach, Mid Ohio, Laguna Seca, Vancouver.. lots of others. I haven't followed indycar stuff in a while, but they certainly turn right.

      Sean

      --

      "'Yrch!' said Legolas, falling into his own tongue."

    11. Re:For the American audience by jocknerd · · Score: 1

      I don't know if Indy Cars are faster than F1. I saw an interview with Michael Schumacher on 60 Minutes a couple of years ago and he mentioned that he thought the F1 cars could possibly go as fast as 300 mph if not for the road courses they run on. He also mentioned that he will never race at Indy (Indy 500). He says its too dangerous.

    12. Re:For the American audience by jocknerd · · Score: 1

      The IRL has differentiated themselves from CART in that all their races I believe are on oval tracks now.

      I caught the IRL race in Richmond a couple of years ago. It was amazing to watch these cars run on the half mile track.

    13. Re:For the American audience by Malc · · Score: 1

      I think you'll find F1 cars have less straight-line speed, but when Cart (or Indycar or whoever it is) competed in Montreal last year on the same circuit, their lap times were significantly less. Indycars are big, slow and heavy, and just not nimble enough on windy circuits.

    14. Re:For the American audience by Tet · · Score: 1
      when Cart (or Indycar or whoever it is) competed in Montreal last year on the same circuit, their lap times were significantly less.

      Yep, from memory, the F1 cars were running around 4 seconds per lap quicker. Given that F1 cars are around 3 seconds per lap faster this year than last, I'd expect the difference to be even more pronounced now.

      --
      "The invisible and the non-existent look very much alike." -- Delos B. McKown
    15. Re:For the American audience by Blofeld · · Score: 1

      The two racing series actually share a common track, they both race at Circuit Gilles Villeneuve in Montreal (obviously at different times).

      If you compare lap times, F1 is significantly faster on a comparable track. I seem to recall reading that the last place qualifier for F1, usually a Minardi, bested the fastest single lap time for an Indycar be several seconds.

    16. Re:For the American audience by TomV · · Score: 1

      One key factor here is the drag which comes with aerodynamic downforce. To get through the twisties fast, an F1 car has enough downforce to run upside-down. The payoff is the drag which limits the top speed on the straights. It's very much horses for courses, in that CART was running in the 240s on Ovals a couple of years ago, while the F1 cars peak at about 200 as they're about to brake on the banking at Indianapolis. However, the f1 car would slaughter the Champcar in the infield at Indy.

      It might be interesting to see how fast an F1 car could run with the wings trimmed to a minimum on an Oval, although they still wouldn't get much benefit from their lightness, agility and deranged brakes in that situation, so the dedicated oval-racer might well still win. At Monaco, OTOH, no contest.

    17. Re:For the American audience by smclean · · Score: 1

      Ohhh. Wow. Yeah I actually saw the IRL race at the california speedway last september-ish. First race of that scale I'd ever been to. I had a real good time. Only reason I have no clue what is going on in motorsports is that I have no cable TV at the moment.

      Sean

      --

      "'Yrch!' said Legolas, falling into his own tongue."

    18. Re:For the American audience by JCCyC · · Score: 1

      I believe the highest measured straight line speed in a Formula 1 car was by Jean Alesi at Monza in 2001 -- 359.4 km/h ~ 223.3 mph

      May be outdated, though.

    19. Re:For the American audience by pedx1ng · · Score: 1

      And interestingly, the fastest ChampCar driver was still slower than the slowest Formula One driver in the slowest car of the time (Alex Yoong/Mindardi).

    20. Re:For the American audience by cgori · · Score: 1

      Top speed is all about gearing, plain and simple. I'm sure with a reasonably tall gear package they could hit absurd top speeds in an F1 car.

    21. Re:For the American audience by dspyder · · Score: 1

      SPEED Channel reruns the days races on Sunday evening. Not quite as fun as live, but who watches anything live these days anyways?

      Australia is another good race to watch, as are some of the Far East races since they come on late Saturday night here on the west coast :)

      --D

    22. Re:For the American audience by Malc · · Score: 1

      Some ChampCar drivers do well like Montoya. Some fizzle like Andretti. F1 drivers seem to do better going the other way. Look at the affect Mansell had, but when he returned to F1 he was too fat to get in the car!

  20. buttons by dougrun · · Score: 5, Informative

    N is the Nuetral button to kick the transmission into N. E is the cockpit extinguisher. L is probably the pit lane speed Limiter. Others control brake bias, fuel mixture, radio communications, the wheel's screen (pi display), and other handling stuff. The steering wheel alone is about $50-100k. (a Champcar figure but should be close).

    1. Re:buttons by dan_sdot · · Score: 1
      E is the cockpit extinguisher. L is probably the pit lane speed Limiter.
      No, E is the eject button and L is the lasers. Obviously.
    2. Re:buttons by dr_dank · · Score: 1

      Others control brake bias

      The million dollar racecars usually have that. The brakes on my economy car on the other hand spout racial slurs with alarming regularity.

      --
      Where does the school board find them and why do they keep sending them to ME?
    3. Re:buttons by lembree · · Score: 1

      Here's how *real* race car steering wheels are supposed to work:

      http://www.speedracer.com/cars-mach5.htm

    4. Re:buttons by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Brake bias is actually one of the few controls NOT on the steering wheel ... by mandate it must be controlled via mechanical means through a knob typ located on dash to the drivers right

    5. Re:buttons by jamesl · · Score: 1

      Strangely, the next post on the thread was rated "5" for saying exactly the same thing you did.

      Welcome to Slashdot!

    6. Re:buttons by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Brake bias isn't on the steering wheel. There are regulations in place to prohibit electronic brake bias control. The mechanical brake bias control is behind the steering wheel on the right. It is amazing to watch Schumi shift and change the brake bias at the same time.

  21. Reaction Time? by artlu · · Score: 0, Redundant

    That is amazing that there is that amount of data streaming down the pipelines, however, does this help the driver in the actual race? If so, is there regulation for that? I understand that the data can be later analyzed and then used for tuning, but the data should also be able to recognize if there is an engine error and the car is going to instantly explode.

    GroupShares

    --
    -------
    artlu.net
    1. Re:Reaction Time? by at_kernel_99 · · Score: 1

      As noted in the article, the team analyzing data gets to see things that would be impossible to relay to the driver via gauges. The example cited involved an exhaust leak in shumacher's car. They knew it was an exhaust leak by monitoring pressure in the engine & exhaust. They knew it wasn't going to cause a critical suspension error by monitoring the temperature of various components throughout the car. Pretty cool stuff actually.

    2. Re:Reaction Time? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes. In 2002, at Monaco, David Coulthard was having an engine issue (visible smoke), and using two way telemetry (now banned) McLaren was able to "fix" DC's engine allowing him to win the race.

    3. Re:Reaction Time? by ravind · · Score: 1
      does this help the driver in the actual race?
      Yes it does, the team constantly communicates with the driver via a microphone and speaker in the helmet. It's not unusual for you to see a driver backing off towards the end of a race because he's been informed that the brakes are overheating, or that he needs to reduce fuel consumption if he wants to make it to the end of the race without refuelling.

      If so, is there regulation for that?
      As far as I know, the regulations do not place any restrictions on what might be communicated to the driver, from the pits, during the race.

  22. Yes, Watson Glen will be a much more exciting by georgeha · · Score: 1

    race when the NASCAR cars turn right.

    1. Re:Yes, Watson Glen will be a much more exciting by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actuall its plenty entertaining watching them try to turn both ways. I only watch the road racing nascar events as they are comedic.

    2. Re:Yes, Watson Glen will be a much more exciting by RogL · · Score: 1

      The first few seasons of the "second-tier" Busch Series at the Glen were crashfests. By the end of a race, most cars had dents all the way down the right side (the ones still running, anyway). Very fun to watch - I was used to the sports-cars & GTP, they stayed on-track a bit better.

    3. Re:Yes, Watson Glen will be a much more exciting by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It is Watkins Glen

  23. How'd they get so rich? by CompWerks · · Score: 1, Interesting
    I always wondered where the hell all of these F1 teams get so much cash. I know there tons of corporate sponsors, but I'd love to see the ROI of a 2x2 vodafone sticker on the front of a F1 car traveling @ 200 mph.

    --
    If you can read this sig - the bitch fell off.
    1. Re:How'd they get so rich? by proj_2501 · · Score: 1

      well, they don't get any money from ticket sales. FIA eats all that up plus the TV rights, as far as i know.

    2. Re:How'd they get so rich? by CompWerks · · Score: 1
      Also,

      Forget to mention, that Michael Schumacher is the highest paid athlete in the WORLD

      --
      If you can read this sig - the bitch fell off.
    3. Re:How'd they get so rich? by Apreche · · Score: 1

      The Ferrari 360 costs a minimun of $160,000. Now imagine that there are thousands of collectors who want the Enzo Ferrari. That's where the money comes from. Winning F1 means your car is the best car in the world. But the technology from the fastest car in the world into a car that you can buy, and rich people will be all over it in a second. And F1 is rediculously popular everywhere except for the US. But US popularity is increasing while decreasing elsewhere because of Schumacher.

      --
      The GeekNights podcast is going strong. Listen!
    4. Re:How'd they get so rich? by miike · · Score: 1

      A lot of the money is coming from the car manufacturers behind the teams. Although ferrari only has a small logo on their F1-car I can imagine them getting a huge reputation boost from their F1 performace. Toyota is another team created and almost entirely fundeded by their "parent" company. The car manufacturers can also to some degree benefit from the research done in F1.

    5. Re:How'd they get so rich? by TomV · · Score: 1

      The budgets are definitely a bit squeezed at the moment, partly due to worldwide recession, and partly because (it pains me, I love this sport above any other) because the racing is so staggeringly dull in recent years. Nonetheless, F1 claims (over the season) a TV audience only matched by the World Cup and the Olympics, in the region of 3.5 billion people watching at least one race each year. While the figures are all kept very secret, and vary from team to team, a couple of years ago the word was that a Williams rear wing was worth about UKP30 million in sponsorship, the front wing about 15 million, and the sidepods 10 million each. This, ISTM, is probably the real reason why the aerodynamic characteristics which destroy proper racing by making slipstreaming impossible, and destroy visual excitement by eliminating the powerslide, aren't going anywhere, even as the team owners themselves complain that the downforce has to be slashed.

    6. Re:How'd they get so rich? by bastion_xx · · Score: 1

      Actually they do get some money out of the FIA. Bernie ponies up travel dollars based on constructor championship points if I'm not mistaken. Are there any good sites that describe the finances of F1 including the teams, sponsors, drivers (some who have to pay for their drives) and the FIA? Would like to know some of the background info I would.

    7. Re:How'd they get so rich? by proj_2501 · · Score: 1

      my little brother is obsessed with ferrari and reads the uk version of f1 magazine religiously. they have frequent bernie gossip so i'd start there

    8. Re:How'd they get so rich? by feargal · · Score: 1

      The BBC has a sponsorship guide which details the average costs. Unfortunately it's in flash and I haven't installed it yet so you'll have to check it yourself.

      --
      "A goldfish was his muse, eternally amused"
    9. Re:How'd they get so rich? by brutus_007 · · Score: 0

      Atually, more recently, I heard he was second behind Tiger Woods. Either way, that's buttloads more money than I make in a year. Maybe I should start slapping logos all over myself?

      --
      I have 1 million monkeys on a million year contract to make me a better sig.
    10. Re:How'd they get so rich? by brutus_007 · · Score: 0

      Some sponsorship deals are worth OODLES. Jaguar is losing HSBC next year, which is one of their main sponsors (rear wing + others), and that's a loss of 70 MILLION dollars for the season, which is a significant chunk of change, specially when you consider that the top teams have a budget ranging around 200-250 million dollars per season. That 70 million is a lot of R&D in any form, wind tunnel, track time, chasis evolution and design, you name it.

      --
      I have 1 million monkeys on a million year contract to make me a better sig.
    11. Re:How'd they get so rich? by sik+puppy · · Score: 1

      That 2x2 sticker probably cost $50k or more. Marlboro's latest contract w/ Ferrari was 7 years, $700 million. That ought to keep Schumi paid for a bit.

      --
      The first thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers. Shakespeare, Henry VI, Part 2, Act 4, Scene 2
  24. Brake Balance by The+Ape+With+No+Name · · Score: 5, Informative

    On a F1 car a car's front-to-rear brake balance can only be adjusted with an analog lever or knob. If you watch Michael Schumacher go down a long straight, you will see him reach with his right hand to adjust the brake balance. Interestingly, the Ferrari has a shifter interface on the left hand that allows both up and down shifts but only downs on the right (I think). When he adjusts the brakes he can continue to shift with his left hand. Also, because the cars use compressed air to shift and are always in gear (essentially) there is a lockout button (N) for stewards to put the machine in neutral on top of the bonnet. So an F1 car is not all high-tech, but a mix. I wish it were more like the the 60s though. Rolling death rides. Those guys had to be brave, talented AND FUCKING NUTS.

    --
    Comparing it to Windows will be a moot point, since El Dorado is going to have a 40% larger code base than XP.
    1. Re:Brake Balance by thedillybar · · Score: 1
      Also, because the cars use compressed air to shift

      Actually I believe they're hydraulic. If a driver stalls the car, they have to lift the drive wheels off the ground because it won't shift w/o the hydraulic pump, and it won't start in gear (unless it's off the ground).

    2. Re:Brake Balance by GPLDAN · · Score: 2, Insightful

      If it were like the 1960s, this year would have seen the death of Jensen Button, JPM, and Jarno Trulli. Oh yeah, and Michael would eventually perish as well. It took Jimmy Clark dying and Jackie Stewart saying "this is bullshit, enough is enough" to get safety pushed up.

      The late 60's and early 70's, esp Jackie's drive at the Nordschliefe, were insanely great. But if you ask Dan Gurney, nothing was worth the price paid.

    3. Re:Brake Balance by The+Ape+With+No+Name · · Score: 1

      True. But they have also sacrificed competitiveness. F1 deaths don't occur in car-to-car incidents -- see Ayrton Senna. Stewart makes this point. They occur when the engineers produce a vehicle that can't be handled by a human. So F1 is right to make safety a concern, but they still want the speed and flair. I would like to see them merely slow the cars down so there would be some passing.

      --
      Comparing it to Windows will be a moot point, since El Dorado is going to have a 40% larger code base than XP.
    4. Re:Brake Balance by SharpEdges · · Score: 1

      "I wish it were more like the the 60s though. Rolling death rides." Yes, drivers getting killed every weekend would be just great, wouldn't it? Good thinking.

  25. What does Formula One mean? by L.+VeGas · · Score: 0, Troll

    I've always wondered this. Is it like Formula 409? Or Heinz 57? Does it just sound cool like MacOSX.

    "What formula do you use to win?"

    "The simplest formula of all. FORMULA ONE!"

    Seriously, anyone know?

    1. Re:What does Formula One mean? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I would of gone with love formula number 9.

    2. Re:What does Formula One mean? by Zlurg · · Score: 5, Informative

      You're not far from the truth. Formula-1 USED TO MEAN the simplest of all regulations: no restrictions, just go win. Things have gotten stricter and stricter and now it doesn't mean the same. There are other formula feeder-series, like Formula 2 (spec engine, all else open), Formula 3 (now Formula 3000) with a spec chassis and engine block but all else open) Formula Ford, and some other minor series with manufacturers' names attached.

    3. Re:What does Formula One mean? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0


      You're not far from the truth. Formula-1 USED TO MEAN the simplest of all regulations: no restrictions, just go win. Things have gotten stricter and stricter and now it doesn't mean the same. There are other formula feeder-series, like Formula 2 (spec engine, all else open), Formula 3 (now Formula 3000) with a spec chassis and engine block but all else open) Formula Ford, and some other minor series with manufacturers' names attached.


      There is no Formula 2, it's dead
      Formula 3 did *not* become Formula 3000

      Formula 3000 is the step after Formula 3.

      Formula 2 (the _second class_ cars you used to see running in an F1 race) was replaced by an independant series, F3000.

      F2000, F4000, and F3 are regional/national series.

  26. british touring car championships by rapiddescent · · Score: 5, Informative
    I've done some work for one of the major teams in the BTCC. These are 2.0 litre normally aspirated 1000kg cars that have been homologated from standard euro saloons. Even at this level, data is gathered from the car and analysed carefully to detect even the slightest dent in the power map. Most of the teams use the same off the shelf package for analysis.

    However, the championship do not allow wireless data xfer anymore and only unencrypted voice is allowed to communicate with the driver. There is a sturdy DIN style plug that one of the engineers plugs a laptop into and downloads the data from the car when it is in the pits. A 20 minute race typically will see about 30Mb of data being retrieved. The organisers TOCA stopped wireless xfer because team managers were able to change the cars characteristics mid race and then reset them back before the scruitineers got a look in!

    Most of the teams use windows xp on sturdy laptops with more powerful computing back at base - I guess because most of the software is off the shelf.

    Formula1 is another ballgame...

    1. Re:british touring car championships by ASIO · · Score: 1

      That's probably why the Aussies and our V8 Supercars - http://www.v8supercars.com.au - are banning telemetry (amongst many other things, see http://www.motorsm.com/motorsport/auto/AUS_V8_Supe rcar/2005_rules.asp for details.) for the 2005 season.

      --
      On the other hand, you have fingers :)
  27. The buttons do a lot of stuff by asoap · · Score: 3, Interesting
    Dynamic Suspension (the suspension changing automatically via electronics) and also changing settings of the car automatically from the pits has been outlawed in f1. So when you see the driver pressing buttons he can be doing stuff like changing fuel maps, suspension damping, viewing differnt informatio. They also have a 'turbo' button. Which has nothing do with a turbocharger. But it works like this. If you are at the last few laps of a race, and you want to catch the guy ahead of you, you press this button which lets you raise the rpms of the motor another 500 rpms, which gives you a little extra boost. But you also sacrifice the health of the motor.

    Years ago, when a driver crashed, you would see him get out and throw his steering wheel against something. That doesn't happen any more because those steering wheels cost $50,000.

    -asoap

    --
    Treat me like a marketing stat, and I'll treat your movie like a series of ones and zeros
    1. Re:The buttons do a lot of stuff by nxg125 · · Score: 1

      Years ago, when a driver crashed, you would see him get out and throw his steering wheel against something. That doesn't happen any more because those steering wheels cost $50,000.

      And also because they get a hefty fine if they don't replace the steering wheel!

      --Nick

    2. Re:The buttons do a lot of stuff by CaptnMArk · · Score: 1

      It also costs $10000 if you fail to put the wheel back in the car.

    3. Re:The buttons do a lot of stuff by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Actually, the drivers have to put the steering wheel back on so that the car can be moved by the track crew. The drivers/teams will get fined if they do not do so.

  28. Technology is killing F1 by Timesprout · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I think they should remove most of the technology to level the playing field for the smaller teams. F1 should be a bit more in the spirit of man and machine racing each other, not man determines direction computer controlled racing machine is pointing in.

    --
    Do not try to read the dupe, thats impossible. Instead, only try to realize the truth
    What truth?
    There is no dupe
    1. Re:Technology is killing F1 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well then it would be Nascar, and Nascar is boring.

  29. CART and F1 by draggy · · Score: 1

    CART / IRL is to F1 what a Cessna is to a F22 Raptor.

    --

    Let's not all suck at the same time please

    1. Re:CART and F1 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actually, last year both CART and F1 raced at the same circuit in Montreal, and the top CART cars were lapping at times about equal to the 10th place f1 cars, that's not that big of a difference.

    2. Re:CART and F1 by draggy · · Score: 1

      You forget to mention that the Ile Notre Dame course wasn't the same, to prevent such comparison!

      In any case, the CART cars had 1 less chicane and still managed like 7 second slower laps! That's not very fast when you compared a normally aspirated F1 V10 to a turbocharged ethanol burning V8!

      CART and IRL are still ways behind, with reasons of budgetary sanity which keeps most teams afloat!

      --

      Let's not all suck at the same time please

  30. Rule Changes Coming by Zach978 · · Score: 1

    There are a lot of rule changes in the talks. One of them is to have a "standard FIA ECU for the engines". The ECU is the electronics that control the engines. The problem with changes like this is that F1 is supposed to push technology to the limits, but when you let the teams do all kinds of high tech stuff it gets too expensive and you have too much of a divide between the best and worst teams. We'll see if the changes cut costs or make the races more exciting...I just hope that the FIA doesn't forget that F1 should be expenisive and high tech.

    --

    "I told you a million times not to exaggerate!"
    1. Re:Rule Changes Coming by another_mr_lizard · · Score: 1

      "I just hope that the FIA doesn't forget that F1 should be expenisive and high tech"

      I would rather the excitement of the sport returned rather than the neutered high-tech parade that we get to watch these days.

      The FIA's rule changes are to stop the big three (Ferrari, McLaren, Williams) from just throwing ridiculous amounts of money at a problem rather than engineering a solution.

      --
      "My parents were strict, but they never pitted me against livestock" - Doug Stanhope
    2. Re:Rule Changes Coming by Troed · · Score: 1

      The FIA's rule changes are to stop the big three (Ferrari, McLaren, Williams) from just throwing ridiculous amounts of money at a problem rather than engineering a solution. ... which doesn't happen. The big three this year are Ferrari, Renault and BAR.

      Money didn't help Williams and McLaren, so why change anything? Apparently the current system works.

    3. Re:Rule Changes Coming by another_mr_lizard · · Score: 1

      I mentioned this elsewhere, but never mind....
      Ferraris budget 2003 season - 250 million
      McLarens budget 2003 season - 120 million
      Jaguars budget 2003 season - 70 million

      Williams were somewhere between McLaren and Jag, but definitely closer to McLaren.

      --
      "My parents were strict, but they never pitted me against livestock" - Doug Stanhope
    4. Re:Rule Changes Coming by another_mr_lizard · · Score: 1

      Oops, missed the bit about this years big three. You obviously watch a bit of F1 so you should recognise this by now - its only just getting to half way through the season and theres always a couple of teams who rise through the ranks to punch above their weight in the first half of the season. Get enough points early on and you can still get a respectable finish at the end of the season.

      Look at Jordan a few years ago with Frentzen, or the performance of the Saubers of the last 3 years (performing way above their budget).
      Renault looked like the one team who make the climb up to the big boys, but I think the departure of their technical director Mike Gascoine may have put paid to that.

      --
      "My parents were strict, but they never pitted me against livestock" - Doug Stanhope
    5. Re:Rule Changes Coming by TomV · · Score: 1

      The difficulty with this approach, well-intentioned as it is (I adore F1 but my god it's been dull the last few years), is that if a team has a huge budget it will spend it on something. Whatever areas the FIA clamps down on may be levelled, but there will always be something else, be it half a dozen new windtunnels, a team of 1000 aerodynamicists, more supercomputers, vast amounts of simulation to bypass limitations on on-track testing, and so on, and so on.

      Half of me loves the competitive engineering aspect of F1, but the other half really wants to see the return of the possibility of human error, the old skill of pressuring an opponent for lap after lap until he misses a gear-change, or forcing him to drive too hard early in the race so his car won't last the distance. But with semi-automatic gearboxes and rev-limiters, traction control and so forth, it just doesn't happen like that anymore.

      Personally, I'd slash the aero grip in favour of mechanical grip from big fat slicks, put in a control ECU (as the FIA is threatening) to eliminate TC, ban the auto gearboxes (also in the pipeline), raise the power to grip ratio, and above all ban refuelling to eliminate the current 2 or 3 sprint races in favour of a single race from start to finish, where it's worth looking after the car and the tyres, where you can't just sit behind another car waiting to gain a place at the pitstops, where you have to think and you have to race.

    6. Re:Rule Changes Coming by CaptnMArk · · Score: 1

      To Williams and McLaren budgets you need to add BWM and Mercedes engine budgets probably on order of 50-100M at least.

    7. Re:Rule Changes Coming by another_mr_lizard · · Score: 1

      The way I read the FIA's proposals is that they are guiding the teams towards more traditional engineering in F1 terms (engine and gearbox). If this is combined with the proposal for bigger teams to supply smaller teams with engines this should hopefully drag the back of the field a few seconds closer to the front.

      Some excellent improvements suggested there, but I'd add re-introducing turbos and rather than removing pitstops make them optional.

      --
      "My parents were strict, but they never pitted me against livestock" - Doug Stanhope
    8. Re:Rule Changes Coming by Troed · · Score: 1

      I've missed five races since 1992 ... ;) I consider this season to be one of the closest (behind Schumi) in many many years. There's always been dominating teams - it's incredible how short memory people have.

      At this point in the season we have (at _least_) 6 cars/drivers who can fight for pole, and positions behind Schumi are very hard to predict. I also agree with Renault that if their cars hadn't broken down on Montreal it's not sure at all that Schumi would've won.

    9. Re:Rule Changes Coming by TomV · · Score: 1

      Some excellent improvements suggested there, but I'd add re-introducing turbos and rather than removing pitstops make them optional.

      No problem with turbos, it all fits in with raising the power to grip ratio. And I wouldn't ban pitstops, not at all. Tyre changes are all part of the fun for me - I still remember the excitement of old-school McLaren 4.2 second tyre changes. But at the moment, the pitstop timing is basically about fuel loads, and is predetermined by the time the race starts. When the car pits fo fuel, the team may as well put on some fresh boots. But without refuelling, tyre changes depend on circumstances, and a driver like Prost could gain massively by mechanical sympathy, looking after the tyres so he needed fewer stops than other drivers, or so that he could really burn them in the closing laps to take the flag.

      Don't get me wrong, with every change I'd make, I still think Schumacher would win plenty of races, becasue he is a race-driving genius. But I'd enjoy his wins more, and I suspect he might, too.

  31. Linux? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Unsuprisingly when compared to yesterdays sports and technology story they dont use linux. Guess your penguins only for flashy scoreboards for now, huh?

  32. Buttons by openSoar · · Score: 5, Informative

    Article on the steering where here that describes hat each button does. I think this one is from the 2002 season but most things are the same.

  33. 408 attempts too early! by ShinmaWa · · Score: 2, Funny

    Who cares about the technology of Formula 1? It took them another 408 attempts to get it right!

    (its a joke people)

    --
    The /. Effect: Thousands of users simultaneously accessing a site to not read its content.
  34. While we're talking about car racing... by GillBates0 · · Score: 2, Interesting
    I'll take the liberty to recommend the 3D IMAX Nascar movie for likeminded 3D/slashdot buffs.

    That movie's the next best thing to experiencing the joys of 250mph+ car racing, and an absolute must if you're into car racing games (TD, NFS, etc). I also learnt a couple of neat facts like driving in quick succession (about 5ft apart) helps the successive cars to avoid drag, and the air flow from the following car helps push the leading car along.

    Anyway, enough ranting...here's hoping for a 3-D car racing game for the PC.

    --
    An Indian-American Hindu committed to non-violent thought/speech/action alarmed by the global explosion of radical Islam
    1. Re:While we're talking about car racing... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Most PC games that run under directX can run in 3D with the addition of stereoscopic glasses.

      These are pretty cheap $100 ish or less.

      I've had a blast honking around in GPL in 3D.

  35. It's a good point, but... by fiannaFailMan · · Score: 4, Interesting

    the price of all this equipment is always coming down. I remember when my mates and I were all using toeclips and we had to look on jealously at the pros using Look pedals, nowadays everybody has the Looks. It wasn't so long ago that a wrist/handlebar mounted heart monitor with a radio telemetry strap was out of range of mere mortals, now you can pick them up for less than $70 and with a boatload of functions.

    --
    Drill baby drill - on Mars
    1. Re:It's a good point, but... by ackthpt · · Score: 1
      It wasn't so long ago that a wrist/handlebar mounted heart monitor with a radio telemetry strap was out of range of mere mortals, now you can pick them up for less than $70 and with a boatload of functions.

      True, but like in the H2G2 book, you still need Majikthise and Vroomfondel to tell you what it all means, that or attend school while training.

      --

      A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
    2. Re:It's a good point, but... by qwpo12 · · Score: 1

      I'm a golfer and the time one has to spend keeping up with all the new technology isn't coming down. I've gotten sick of it actually.

  36. F1 Technical by richj · · Score: 4, Interesting

    This is a great site for a lot of the technical aspects of F1.

    http://www.f1technical.net/

    I found it funny that the NYT waited until the Ferrari was in Canada so they could shoot pictures of it without the Marlboro ads the car typically has painted on while racing outside North America. :)

    1. Re:F1 Technical by Malc · · Score: 1

      That can't be the reason because many European countries don't allow cigarette advertising either. Why do you think we suddenly got races in Bahrain and China, and talk of other places too?

    2. Re:F1 Technical by xdroop · · Score: 1
      More likely, the NYT waited until the cars were in Montreal, where they could send a photographer for $500 for the weekend to shoot some snappies, as opposed to $3000 to one of the european races.

      Also, the photos would be more timely, considering the US race is this weekend.

      --
      you should read everything on the internet as if it had "but I'm probably talking out of my ass" appended to it.
    3. Re:F1 Technical by richj · · Score: 1

      That's probably the most likely reason, though my girlfriend is a freelance press photographer and winds up shooting a lot of things for agencies all over the world. It wouldn't be hard for the NYT to get someone somewhere else to do it cheaper than sending one of their staff guys up to Canada.

      But I think if NYT called Ferrari and said "We're running a story on the technology behind your team", Ferrari would be happy to send a million photos of the cars, all with the biggest sponsor: Marlboro.

      It would be great if this kind of publicity got more Americans to watch. My g/f was actually the one who got me interested, and I think it's a terrific sport for anyone who is into engineering and technology.

    4. Re:F1 Technical by richj · · Score: 1

      I didn't know that was the reason behindthe changes in the venues. To tell you the truth, this is the first season that I get up all-hours to watch the race.

      It might be good though, I got a couple of those 1:18 scale models of the cars for my birthday - one of them is the Ferrari (with Marlboro decals). After my 6 year-old neice saw the car we caught her trying to figure out how to "light a Lucky."

  37. What the buttons do by jdehnert · · Score: 2, Interesting

    The buttons control all sorts of aspects of the car. Brake bias, sway bar settings, fuel mixture and horsepower, pit speed rev limiter, etc.

    Now the really AMAZING part is that if you watch the races, you can usually see Schumacher fiddling with these settings during a race and often in a turn or at well over 100 MPH.

    I race myself in an open wheel car, and I do OK, but my concentration is usually at close to 100% all of the time, so seeing Schumi adjusting things in a turn just blows me away every time.

    --
    Eschew Obfuscation
    1. Re:What the buttons do by KALIK · · Score: 0

      Hmm. they kinda look a lot like Baush and Lomb contact cases to me, maybe they are the sponsor!

  38. Timing by AviLazar · · Score: 1, Troll

    While the driver has a lot of cool buttons and features, at 200 MPH, does he really have the time to worry about the things? I mean lets face it, a slight (and i mean SLIGHT) jerk of the stearing wheel at 200 MPH generally means flying to one's death....

    --

    I mod down so you can mod up. Your welcome.
    1. Re:Timing by AviLazar · · Score: 1

      I am going to keep posting on STUPID moderations. How is the above a troll? It is a legitimate question!
      Jesus, the moderation system really needs an overhaul

      --

      I mod down so you can mod up. Your welcome.
    2. Re:Timing by Moofie · · Score: 1

      Yeah, I bet they just put them there on the steering wheel, to confuse and distract the driver.

      All the drivers that are in the habit of jerking the steering wheel are DEAD. Darwin said they lose.

      --
      Why yes, I AM a rocket scientist!
  39. The Steering Wheel by aluminumcube · · Score: 5, Informative

    The steering wheels are all proprietary items for each team, so I can't tell you exactly what Ferrari's does.

    But-

    - Behind the wheel are two paddles. Pull one and you get an upshift on the computer controlled sequential gearbox, pull the other for a downshift. The cars have what are essentially normal manual transmissions, but instead of the driver controlling the clutch and shift forks, computer controlled hydraulics do the job and produce perfect shifts. Typically, pulling both paddles will put the car in neutral (allowing drivers to get out of a spin if possible)

    - On the upper right and left, the + and - buttons are probably backup shift buttons. For the team I worked with, the paddles behind the wheel could sometimes be problematic, so they had backups in the same place as the wheel in the picture.

    - The yellow "N" switch is "Set Neutral." Press it once and the car stays in Neutral even if the steering wheel is removed. Drivers are required to, upon exiting the race due to a mechanical failure or crash, replace the steering wheel (which they need to remove to get out of the car) and place the vehicle in neutral so crews can remove it. If they don't, they are fined an obscene amount of money.

    - The red "L" switch is the pit lane speed limiter switch. In F1, the pit lanes have a very rigorously enforced speed limit. Hitting that button causes the computer to limit the car's speed to whatever the track pit speed limit is.

    - The LED display can show a whole bunch of data. From moving track maps to onboard telemetry, timing, gear status, Gran Turismo...

    I don't know exactly what the rotary switches do on that car, but I have seen them for:

    - Brake bias; controls the front and rear split of pressure on the brakes allowing the driver to set the car up based on tyre wear and fuel weight (in F1, fuel is measured by weight, not by volume).

    - Engine fuel mapping; drivers can conserve fuel at the expense of raw power or gain raw power at the expense of fuel depending on the tactical situation.

    - Oil/Water cooling; they can control how much water and oil is flowing through the coolers. In wet races or if your trapped behind the slipstream of another vehicle, it becomes important to control these things. F1 car engines require heat for all the components to work properly, but too much heat of course, kills them. It is a constant game of keeping these things in balance. Usually, engineers in the pit lane will inform the driver of exactly what changes to make (by the rules, they cannot simply have radio commands control the vehicle).

    Of course, the rest of the buttons are for the radio, drinking water pump, the fuel filler flap, rear caution light and those sorts of gizmos.

    A few of the buttons are also like the water/oil cooler controls in that they only exist for the driver to press when the engineers tell him to.

    All of that for around US$30K per steering wheel...

    1. Re:The Steering Wheel by pknoll · · Score: 1
      Excellent overview, but I believe this is incorrect:

      - Brake bias; controls the front and rear split of pressure on the brakes allowing the driver to set the car up

      As far as I am aware, you cannot use the computer to adjust brake bias. This must be done via an analog control, usually a knob or lever with control cables. On the F2004, it is behind the steering wheel on the right side.

      (Reference: 2004 Canadian Grand Prix Speed TV telecast; commentary over in-cockpit view of Schumacher while adjusting the bias).

    2. Re:The Steering Wheel by Riturno · · Score: 1

      For additional information on steering wheels check out: Steering Wheel

  40. Steering Wheel Buttons and Controls by SaxMaster · · Score: 5, Informative

    The steering wheel controls, as a couple posters above have said, are used to change fuel mixture, rev limiters for pit speeds, as well as adjusting launch and traction control systems. What they DONT tell you in the article is one of the things that makes Schumacher so good is how he utilizes that wheel during a race, aside from steering the car :) He adjusts his mixture, TCS systems and gearbox on the fly during the race, sometimes in the middle of one corner anticipating the needs of the next corner (!) This adjustability and all the testing he does is one reason he dominates the competition. Schumi's wheel has even more controlls than the wheel they pictured in the article, which belongs to Barachello.

    --
    "Dancing is the vertical expression of a horizontal desire" --Robert Frost
  41. News.com by Eezy+Bordone · · Score: 1
    Has this as well. No registration.

    Here is the link.

    --

    -EB

    Do you ever walk alone like a drifter in the dark?

  42. money by eille-la · · Score: 0, Offtopic

    and more money.

  43. A girl's best friend goes kablooie. by switcha · · Score: 2, Funny
    The wealthiest teams arm themselves with powerful advantages,...

    And diamonds!

    Whoops!

    --
    You know what? ... A little club soda *did* get that out!
  44. F1 Rules by Apreche · · Score: 3, Informative

    F1 Steering Wheel

    Formula 1, if you didn't know, is the premiere motorsport in the world. Every rule about car design in F1 falls into one of two categories. Rules that prevent the egineer from killing the driver and rules that say the car must not fall apart. The result is the most technologically advanced cars in the entire world. These are the fastest four wheeled motor vehicles on earth that can make both left and right turns. Every race car driver falls into 3 categories. Driving F1, wanting to drive F1 and too afraid to drive F1. If you think Nascar is dumb because they go around in circles, F1 is for you. I've heard it described as driving a go-kart with a jet engine. (it's really just a V10).

    Oh, and some other information. Michael Schumacher is the greatest driver in F1 today, he has won the championship the last 6 times. He is the highest paid athlete in the entire world. He drives a ferrari, the best car there is. It looks like he is going to win again this year, he has lost only one race so far. And while it seems boring to watch the same guy win every time it shows you why F1 is so great. The best driver wins every time. And this guy is the undisputed greatest driver of cars to ever live.

    The US grand prix in Indianapolis is this sunday at 1pm. It is the only race in the US this year. If you haven't seen an F1 race I highly reccomend you check it out. Imagine Nascar, with right turns and no rednecks. It doesn't suck.

    --
    The GeekNights podcast is going strong. Listen!
    1. Re:F1 Rules by tazanator · · Score: 1

      umm your not realted to Michael Schumacher are you? I only ask cause your whole post is (now mind you I'm tring to be helpfully here) but it is just a little biased maybe?

      --
      I'm told you are what you eat, does that mean I can be you by tomorrow with some A1?
    2. Re:F1 Rules by CaptnMArk · · Score: 1

      Actually, a good driver in the best car wins all the time.

      75% car 10% pit strategy 10% driver 5% luck

      more or less

    3. Re:F1 Rules by Ced_Ex · · Score: 1

      If Schumacher is so good, let's see him win a championship with an '03 BAR Honda. He's just lucky that he gets paired up with a great team and car. Any F1 driver with a smack of talent in a Ferrari can win the championship. Does that mean Barrichello is the 2nd greatest driver??

      --
      Live forever, or die trying.
    4. Re:F1 Rules by Apreche · · Score: 1

      By your logic Barichello should win... but he doesn't. In fact he is 20 points behind Schumi. He's only 10 points ahead of Button. Barichello and MS both drive ferrari, if it was all car they would have about the same number of points. But Schumacher always wins because he is that much better. No matter who you put in Barichello's car they will lose. That is how you know he is so good. If you think not, then why don't you go and race him and we'll see who is faster?

      --
      The GeekNights podcast is going strong. Listen!
  45. The buttons by Tranzig · · Score: 1

    The actual meaning and the layout of the buttons on the wheel is secret and varies by driver, but usually there are buttons for setting the balance and torque of the brakes, the pitstop speed limiter, the differential, the ratio of fuel and air, and probably much more.

  46. Amen on Cycling by The+Ape+With+No+Name · · Score: 1

    One of the wonderful things about the Giro this year is that Damiano Cunego won it and was not even his team's man to do it (Gilberto Simoni was the leader). How did he do it? Old Skool. Riding with flair and bravery. With poetry! I like Lance Armstrong as much as the next USian (he's a great story and a stand-up guy, but not my favorite rider), but the guy is a machine. He knows to the gram of carbs he has ingested and that he needs X more carbs to go at 44.3456 kph which will put him in the lead with 100 meters to go on a stage that averages 3.3% gradient.

    Back in the day, cats like Eddy Merckx would just check out on the peloton. He would ride with one hand on the back shifter, daring any punk to try to ride with him. No nutrition experts. Nothing. Uphill. Downhill. Flats. It didn't matter. And he was the greatest ever on steel frame bikes built in a barn by a friend, not 11000USD 6.8kg space machines like you have today.

    Watch and learn on the Tour this year. Tyler Hamilton or some other 'hard' man will win it.

    --
    Comparing it to Windows will be a moot point, since El Dorado is going to have a 40% larger code base than XP.
    1. Re:Amen on Cycling by noewun · · Score: 1
      Armstrong wins because he's a genetic freak. He's got the second highest VO2Max ever recorded (93.5) and generally has lactate levels under load half that of most other riders. No matter what endurance sport he embraced, he'd be ruling it.

      You can't compare the late 60s/70s with today's racing, as almost everything is different. Because of training methods and the UCI point system, the general level of competition is much, much higher, and race speeds are reaching unheard of levels.

      As for F1: from a former racing nut who still knows more F1 and sports car trivia than anyone should, the sport has been deathly dull for the last few years. Once the drivers go back to actually driving the cars, we may see some racing again. We will also see that Schumacher is overrated without all the tech.

      --
      I am a believer of momentum and curves.
    2. Re:Amen on Cycling by The+Ape+With+No+Name · · Score: 1

      Armstrong wins because he's a genetic freak. He's got the second highest VO2Max ever recorded (93.5) and generally has lactate levels under load half that of most other riders. No matter what endurance sport he embraced, he'd be ruling it.

      Granted. But I doubt he could ever touch a psychotic like Merckx or Hinault in terms of just being tough on the bike. If Eddy Merckx decided he wanted to win a race, he did. Guys would ask him if he was there to win or not and drop from race if he said 'to win' because he was unbeatable. As for the the difference in training methods and the UCI I think that is relative. What is not relative is the equipment. A 1978 Raleigh Tour model weighed nearly 30lbs dressed out. My Giant ONCE TCR weighs 16.5lbs with Ultegra components. With the Stock Campy Record, it was b 15.4lbs. The bikes today are so responsive and you are operating the mechanics at a much higher efficiency than back in the day. Every turn of the pedals sees more power to the ground.

      --
      Comparing it to Windows will be a moot point, since El Dorado is going to have a 40% larger code base than XP.
    3. Re:Amen on Cycling by noewun · · Score: 1
      ut I doubt he could ever touch a psychotic like Merckx or Hinault in terms of just being tough on the bike

      I think a man who came back from cancer would have no problem in the toughness department.

      Armstrong is a better climber than Mercx, who was more like Indurain - keep pace in the mountains and kill 'em in the time trials. Armstrong and Hinault would probably be pretty equally matched in skills and abilities.

      Merckx was known for his viciously light bikes; remember drillium?

      --
      I am a believer of momentum and curves.
    4. Re:Amen on Cycling by The+Ape+With+No+Name · · Score: 1

      Toughness: notice I said "on the bike." I like Armstrong, but he is no Tyler Hamilton. As for climbing, Merckx did it all. It did not matter. IIRC, he did win mountain stages. My point is that it was about breaking spirits not going faster. Hinault was a bastard. Armstrong less like Hinault in that respect. Remember Hinault finishing with a broken nose soaked in blood? That's Hamilton. Armstrong and Hamilton are alike in that they both know how to talk and don't act like assholes like Hinault did.

      Merckx was known for his viciously light bikes; remember drillium?

      Could he use it on the Tour? I think the rules were different for the Tour back then and did not follow the rest of the world. It was after the Classics permitted derailluers that the Tour did so. This is the case today as well, especially with regard to doping. Anyhow, I think the more salient point is this: stomp on the pedals on a 1969 bike vs. a 2004 bike. There is no comparison. Merckx makes this point himself about modern bikes. The equipment is so much better.

      --
      Comparing it to Windows will be a moot point, since El Dorado is going to have a 40% larger code base than XP.
    5. Re:Amen on Cycling by noewun · · Score: 1
      ould he use it on the Tour?

      Could, and did.

      For the record, let's not forget that Merckx failed a drug test, too. And, like I said, it's very difficult to compare riders from different eras.

      --
      I am a believer of momentum and curves.
    6. Re:Amen on Cycling by The+Ape+With+No+Name · · Score: 1

      Doping: unfortunately, so did Tom Simpson ... the hard way. Doping is ruining the sport and it is not even as prevalent as it is in places like Track and Field or American Football. I played football in college and everyone juiced. Everyone. Yes, we won football games.

      But Merckx won on heavier bikes as well. Interestingly, Schwinn produced drillium bikes back in the day. Give me my carbon fiber anyday. I wonder what the ride was like?

      You are right. It is difficult to compare riders from different eras, other than in one way: 5 Tours. 5 Giros. 3 Vueltas. With nowhere near the support they have today. This much is true.

      --
      Comparing it to Windows will be a moot point, since El Dorado is going to have a 40% larger code base than XP.
    7. Re:Amen on Cycling by platypus · · Score: 1

      To add some freakish numbers (source, oh, and lets not discuss Mr. ferrari)

      VAM (Vm/h) Vertical Metres Per Hour (Vm/h)

      1800+ Vm/h: Lance Armstrong - and Pantani of olden days
      1650-1800 Vm/h: Top 10 / TdF GC or mountain stage winner.
      1450-1650 Vm/H: Top 20 / TdF GC; top 20 on tough mountain stage.
      1300-1450 Vm/h: Finishing TdF mountain stages in peloton
      1100-1300 Vm/h: The Autobus Crew

      This means that Armstrong has the ability to climb 1800 meters altitude in one hour. Btw. this translates to more or less 500 Watts power output for one our.

    8. Re:Amen on Cycling by perly-king-69 · · Score: 1
      Armstrong's story is frankly, astounding. To come back from his illness to any form of competitive sport must have taken courage and strength which I cannot even begin to comprehend. As a season-long competitive cyclist I believe that he wouldn't hold a light to the likes of Mercxx, Coppi, Hinault or Anqutiel.

      Armstrong has a single objective - Le Tour, and rides and trains on the stages from the beginning of the year. His preparation is phenomenal - but whilst other riders are racing in top level events, he is preparing for that one single race. He'll win again this year - Ullrich hasn't been in top form for most of this season and Vinokourov and Beloki will not be there. But come the end of July he'll have hung up his wheels for another season.

      --

      --
      This sig is inoffensive.

    9. Re:Amen on Cycling by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So what about the heavy bikes, because everyone rode heavy bikes, so that equalizes out across the peleton.

      Same as today. The bike sort of matters, but Eddy Mercx pretty much won whatever he raced in, until he was punched in the liver in that one TdF.

      Plus, Eddy did have a pretty good team behind him as well.

      Sort of like comparing Michael Jordan and Kobe Bryant. Sure, they're both great players. But Jordan's personality and talent stood out from EVERYBODY. Kobe's doesn't, except for on CourtTV.
      At least he hasn't been a whining bastard about his problems in the press.

    10. Re:Amen on Cycling by noewun · · Score: 1
      Doping: unfortunately, so did Tom Simpson ... the hard way.

      At home I have a quote from an interview with Anquetil, in which he is asked if he ever doped. He says, roughly, "of course I do. It is impossible that any human being race 220 days out of the year with the help of drugs." In the olde days, doping was as widespread, but not as punished. I think thing are actually getting better.

      --
      I am a believer of momentum and curves.
    11. Re:Amen on Cycling by The+Ape+With+No+Name · · Score: 1

      Plus, Eddy did have a pretty good team behind him as well.

      The British Eurosport commentator (I forget his name) said that Merckx did not need a team. This from a guy who rode against him. He rode off the front. I have a killer poster of him dropping some unfortunate soul and the guy looks like he's been shot. Problem is: the guy was on his own fucking team.

      --
      Comparing it to Windows will be a moot point, since El Dorado is going to have a 40% larger code base than XP.
  47. Auto/Semi-Auto Gearboxes may stay by Camaro · · Score: 1

    I think on an episode of Windtunnel with Dave Despain someone said that the teams said they wanted to keep the current technology of gearboxes because it wasn't all that new and fancy anymore since it had been around for ten years already. Although I think it might be cool to see these guys trying to bang through the gears with an H-pattern shifter and a real foot clutch, I also believe it might not save much money for the smaller teams to have to redevelop a lot of parts to to fall in line with new rules.

    1. Re:Auto/Semi-Auto Gearboxes may stay by ifwm · · Score: 1

      Even if they went back to real manual shifting, they wouldn't have to use a clutch, because you don't need one if you match the rpms right. It's been done in virtually every kind of race car, for as long a racing has existed. Also, they would probably use sequential gearboxes, not "H-pattern."

    2. Re:Auto/Semi-Auto Gearboxes may stay by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

      You're right that sequential gear boxes would be obvious (no reason to ban those), but it would be pretty hard to start after a pit stop without a clutch!

  48. Reply to original story: by Bob+McCown · · Score: 2, Funny
    I love the crazy steering wheel - anyone know what all those buttons and knobs do?"

    About Mach 2, depending on how you hit. Let's ask Dale Earnhardt.

  49. Mod this down by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I accidentally moderated a perfectly good post down so I am posting real quick to kill my moderation in this forum

  50. NASCAR does go both directions by dan_sdot · · Score: 3, Informative

    ummmm.... actually NASCAR does go turn both directions. There are round courses where they only turn left, but there are also "road tracks" where they turn both ways. An example is the Infineon Raceway in Sonoma. Click on the map on the right side of the page to see what it looks like.

    1. Re:NASCAR does go both directions by Leroy_Brown242 · · Score: 1
      ummmm.... actually NASCAR does go turn both directions.

      Yes, but you are using the minority as an example. Besides, watching a bunch of circle track chumps try to drive a road course is not very fun. It's much more exciting to watch road race proffesionals drive on courses like Hockenheim, Laguna Seca, Long Beach, Monico, or my home track Portland International Raceway.

    2. Re:NASCAR does go both directions by Chewie · · Score: 1

      True enough. The fact that a) there are very few road courses in a NASCAR season, and b) they are always won by one of the 5 guys who did road racing before NASCAR makes it sort of boring.

      It is fun, though, to watch someone who 0wnz0rs a circle track spin out in the dirt because he didn't know how to turn right.

      --
      49 20 68 61 76 65 20 74 6F 6F 20 6D 75 63 68 20 66 72 65 65 20 74 69 6D 65 2E
    3. Re:NASCAR does go both directions by tgd · · Score: 2, Interesting

      To be fair, they usually significantly dumb down the track or drive simpler road tracks.

      At Watkins Glen, for example, (my favorite track to drive), they skip the toe of the boot, which is the most complicated part of the track to drive well.

      Not slamming NASCAR, but there's a world of difference in the type of driving they do.

      They're all (F1, NASCAR, etc) pansies compared to the drivers in SCCA ProRally, CARS and WRC, though. I mean, really. They don't even have trees to hit!

  51. What Technology? by Viceice · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Everytime some engineer dreams up a killer piece of technology, it gets banned. Figured out an effective shape that generates downforce? Get banned. Figure out how to recofigure ur car on the fly? Get banned.

    And what about traction control? Adaptive suspension? not to mention 1001 other things that make a car go faster and safer, and turn better.

    I hate it the way they keep banning technology. It used to be that F1 was the pinnicle of automative technology. Not anymore. Now you can buy a road car with more technology in it then an F1 car.

    Sheesh.

    --
    Sometimes I wish I was a plumber, then I'd know how to deal with other people's shit.
    1. Re:What Technology? by visgoth · · Score: 1

      Indeed. I wonder what sort of machine would be devised if all these limits were removed. Budget be damned, as long as the end result is mechanically sound, and not a rolling coffin, then I'd love to see it racing.

      --
      My patience is infinite, my time is not.
  52. Hydraulic by The+Ape+With+No+Name · · Score: 1

    Yeah, you are right. I think they experimented with compressed air at one time. I think the hydraulics are easier to balance on weight, but are just as heavy as a compressed air system.

    --
    Comparing it to Windows will be a moot point, since El Dorado is going to have a 40% larger code base than XP.
    1. Re:Hydraulic by nxg125 · · Score: 1

      Yeah, you are right. I think they experimented with compressed air at one time.

      I believe they do use compressed air to close the valves, though. Doing it mechanically is too slow, especially when it has to happen like 300 times a second.

    2. Re:Hydraulic by thedillybar · · Score: 1

      Woah. The valves only need to open & close when you're shifting...

    3. Re:Hydraulic by Icculus · · Score: 1

      Woah. The valves only need to open & close when you're shifting...

      It's the intake and exhaust valves on the engine that use air instead of springs, not the shifting mechanism.

    4. Re:Hydraulic by thedillybar · · Score: 1
      It's the intake and exhaust valves on the engine that use air instead of springs, not the shifting mechanism.

      Ah ha. I'll buy that.

  53. Playing by 'team rules' is the problem by Animaether · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Just my opinion, for the most part (based on facts, sadly)...

    He does play by team rules, that's partly the problem.

    Who doesn't remember Barricello being in #1 position in front of M. Schumacher on #2 being ordered by the Ferrari team to let M. Schumacher win ?
    Those kinds of tactics are exactly what are hurting Formula 1 as a whole, and not just the Ferrari/M. Schumacher image.

    Mind you, any team M. Schumacher has been in has also always been cutting-edge to the point of risking safety. This ranges from cars being sprayed with fuel in the pit lane due to cutting corners to make tanking faster to crewmen getting hurt by driving into them.

    Not taking away that M. Schumacher is a great driver, mind you, but so were Aeyrton Senna and Nigel Mansell - but those loved the sport. M. Schumacher, I'm afraid, tends to love mostly himself and will do anything to further his image.

    1. Re:Playing by 'team rules' is the problem by feargal · · Score: 2, Interesting

      On the best of days, for the best of teams, the pit-stop is still a hazardous affair. Coming in at high speed, braking at the last second to stop on a dime, pumping huge volumes of fuel, leaving again with maximum acceleration the instant work has finished - it's pretty dangerous. That's why all the mechanics have fire-proof gear, tough boots and so on.

      Every team and driver have had their problems in the pits, I think it's unfair to single out M. Schumacher. Besides, I wouldn't say Benneton were unsafe in the pit-stops - they probably were the best trained.

      If I were the front jack man, and I had to pick a driver to stand in front of, it'd be M. Schumacher. Not because I reckon he'd be the most concerned for my safety though; he'd want to hit his markings just right to minimise the stop time.

      He is of undoubted skill, but his arrogance makes it easy to take shots at him. My main problem is that right now nobody else is as good as him. I wouldn't mind if he won every single race, just as long as he had to fight hard for each victory.

      --
      "A goldfish was his muse, eternally amused"
    2. Re:Playing by 'team rules' is the problem by gowen · · Score: 3, Insightful
      Those kinds of tactics are exactly what are hurting Formula 1 as a whole, and not just the Ferrari/M. Schumacher image.
      No, whats hurting F1 is, on the majority of courses, its almost impossible to overtake, which means that its almost never maneuvers that win races, but consistent speed and a good pit stop strategy.

      Schumi's great, but even he uses the pit stops to actually overtake (on the rare occasions when he's not on pole).
      --
      Athletic Scholarships to universities make as much sense as academic scholarships to sports teams.
    3. Re:Playing by 'team rules' is the problem by GPLDAN · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I advocate a one-fuel tank strategy for F1, even if you cut the laps in the race from 70 to 50. No pitting, pit stops don't exist. 3 Hour long qualifying sessions, teams can only draw one session, draw is random, best lap counts - you can come in as many times as you want during qualifying. But the tires and fuel have to last the whole race. There would be huge changes in the cars, but they are already talking about mandating V8s. I think it would make the sport great again.

    4. Re:Playing by 'team rules' is the problem by Blofeld · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I would agree with both points, and add another, regulations. Current regs are allowing for insane amounts of downforce, and little in the way of mechanical grip.

      I was reading that at the USGP, cars hit around 200 mph at the end of the long front straight. To make the next turn, the cars need to brake to around 70 mph. They start braking at the 50 meter mark! With such rapid deceleration (possible due to the amount of downforce at high speed), there is a very slim margin of error, thus overtaking is indeed difficult.

      It has been said by many that to increase passing, put emphasis back on mechanical grip so that drivers can do things like overtake around the outside of a turn, which is almost unheard of today.

    5. Re:Playing by 'team rules' is the problem by homer_ca · · Score: 2, Insightful

      That's true. With evenly matched cars, it's impossible to overtake on the track. You'd need a car significantly faster than the one in front. I think the big reason for that is the high corner speeds and short braking distances from aerodynamic downforce. If you look at races with low downforce cars and motorcycles, there's a lot of passing. Nascar stock cars are big, fat and slow on a road course, but it's fun to watch because there's passing and you can really see the cars sliding around. The last few years MotoGP racing was dominated by Valentino Rossi and Honda, but the races were still close and not runaway wins. Now with Rossi switching to the slower Yamaha (he needed the challenge) this season has some great close racing. If you're bored of the F1 parade watch MotoGP! You don't know what you're missing.

    6. Re:Playing by 'team rules' is the problem by tbuskey · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Try watching MotoGP motorcycle racing.

      It *is* possible to overtake. Riders are pushing the limits of themselves, the suspension, the engine, and the tires. Oh - no pit stops either.

      And one of the greatest riders ever, Rossi, switched from one of the best bikes ever (Honda) to Yamaha so now you're seeing him race at his limit too.

      I find most car racing kinda boring after seeing the lead change 3 times in as many corners during MotoGP

    7. Re:Playing by 'team rules' is the problem by tbuskey · · Score: 1

      Look at MotoGP motorcycle racing. Less then 500lbs with 220HP. They're also narrow enoug that passing is common. Not just once a lap, but sometimes in successive corners.

      Bikes also have that kind of deceleration & acceleration.

    8. Re:Playing by 'team rules' is the problem by frodo+from+middle+ea · · Score: 1

      wouldn't that be barricello playing by the team rule, and schumacher pressuring the team to make rules to suit him than his teammates., rather than schumacher playing by the rules ?

      --
      for the last time people, I am "frodo from middle eaRTH", not "middle eaST".
    9. Re:Playing by 'team rules' is the problem by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What utter bollocks.
      That is unquestionably just your opinion and those so called 'facts' are just an extension of your opinion. They don't even merit a point by point rebuttal.

    10. Re:Playing by 'team rules' is the problem by StressedEd · · Score: 1
      If you're bored of the F1 parade watch MotoGP!
      You don't know what you're missing.


      I quite agree. Also the "Superbikes" championship. One dream race would be Rossi (on a Honda) vs Shu (in a Ferrari) over the Monaco course! ;-)


      Ok, only practical if you could get decent downforce on a bike... Something I was coincidentally discussing just before the England Switzerland match [which England won 3-0 in case you were wondering].....


      Seriously though, without detracting from F1, if you want seriously exciting motorsport take a look at the Moto GP and Superbikes... Very tight, fast action with some seriously gutsy performers.

      --
      Be nice to people on the way up. You will meet them again on your way down!
    11. Re:Playing by 'team rules' is the problem by dspyder · · Score: 1

      I am a HUGE Formula1 fan (born in England, raised and living in the US) but I just bought a motorcycle (2000 Honda CBR600F4) and started PVRing the MotoGP races.

      Holy crap are they awesome!!!!! For me hard to follow since I don't know the riders, their bikes, or their helmets yet... nor any of the intricacies of the rules... but I'm definitely hooked! Their website (besides all the flash crap) is one of the best out there as far as the scope and detail of the CONTENT available! They even have the full races for you to download in digital format! F1 will NEVER do that!!!!

      The Italian MotoGP race is well worth downloading!

      --D

    12. Re:Playing by 'team rules' is the problem by Paul+Jakma · · Score: 1

      Look at MotoGP motorcycle racing. ...Not just once a lap, but sometimes in successive corners.

      Amen. Actual real racing. Especially now that Rossi is on Yamaha and hence the other "mere" mortals on HRC now have a machine advantage. It's just fascinating to watch the Honda's use the honda-lane on the straights and then watch Rossi claw it back on the twisty backs, sometimes lap after lap. At the last MotoGP for a couple of laps in a row Rossi was listed in second place, even though he spent most of each lap in the lead, because Tamada on the RCV211 could out accel Rossi from the last corner to the finish line. Rossi actually got him on the brakes at the first corner on occassion - Tamada led for only a few hundred metres on that lap!

      Less then 500lbs with 220HP

      Far less. The HRC RCV211s are 145Kg (~320lbs), excluding fuel, which is limited to 24l (22l next year) and hence no more than 20kg max at beginning of race. Even with the rider onboard, who'll be somewhere between 50 and 70kg (eg Barros ;) ) max you're looking at no more than 145+20+70 = 235kg or 517lbs.

      And 220HP is what the RCV211V was allegedly *at least* making when it was first introduced several years ago. I'm guessing it's at least 230HP by now, if not more. The lap times have fallen dramatically each year for the 4 strokes, where the 2 strokes before them had reached an effective plateau, which most likely is due to the manufacturers developing the new 4 strokes further and further and getting more HP.

      Bikes also have that kind of deceleration & acceleration.

      Acceleration: yes, indeed the bikes possibly may even out accelerate F1 cars. Deceleration, no way - F1 cars pull huge G's on the brakes, bikes just do not have the grip to do the same and even if they did, they still wouldnt be able to without flipping unless they were designed to have much lower CoG (which'd be pointless given the lack of grip).

      --
      I use Friend/Foe + mod-point modifiers as a karma/reputation system.
    13. Re:Playing by 'team rules' is the problem by karit · · Score: 1

      Taking your foot off the accelerater in a F1 gives you 1G of decelleration (and that is before hitting the breaks)

      --
      http://blog.karit.geek.nz/
    14. Re:Playing by 'team rules' is the problem by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What a load of bullshit. You imply that team orders are hurting F1, despite the fact that they were banned years ago. And you make out that MS is an egotistic maniac, despite the fact that he is surrounded by drivers who are fare more arrogant such as ummm Montoya, Coultard, Ralph, Villenueve (yes I know he is retired, but he is still a wanker and worth mentioning). MS is a champion and he never fails to acknowlege the team behind him. Perhaps you should pay attention and look at the way the Ferrari team interact with Michael, this is not a man who considers himself above those who work hard to put him on the podium. It's sad that your pathetic dribble was modded as "insightful" by people who obviously have no idea. Get back under your rock and stop showing what a small man you are with your tall poppy bullshit.

    15. Re:Playing by 'team rules' is the problem by Animaether · · Score: 1

      Then he still plays by the team rules. He was ahead in the championship already, letting Barricello win would not have hurt that. However, with him winning, his place in the championship became all that more secure. He could have chosen, against team/personal directives, to not overtake Barricello. That's what I meant :)

    16. Re:Playing by 'team rules' is the problem by rynoski · · Score: 1

      (based on facts, sadly) riiiiight. have you even watched a race? team orders were banned after that incident but even the great "fang" used team orders. hell, he told his team mate to give him his car. i dont see rubens giving his car away. i remember fuel being splashed around, but i don't remember it being because they cut any corners, you cant make stuff up and call it factual. and i cant remember a time when mr schumacher hit his crew, although i wouldn't want to work for jordon. Mansell was good, but far from great. and i think you would have to look very hard to find someone who loves the sport as much as michael.

      --
      There are two types of people in the world: 1) those that can extrapolate from incomplete data.
    17. Re:Playing by 'team rules' is the problem by Animaether · · Score: 1
      Hello Anon,

      I started out that it was largely my opinion - thanks for re-iterating what I already wrote.

      As for the facts :
      SPIELBERG, Austria -- Michael Schumacher won the Austrian Grand Prix on Sunday when Ferrari teammate Rubens Barrichello let him pass just before the checkered flag.
      Barrichello, who had led from the start, received orders from his team to let Schumacher win.
      "It was probably the wrong decision to do it this way, I am not very happy," said Schumacher, who is trying to win a record-tying fifth Formula One title.

      CNN.com - Ferrari and drivers fined $1m - June 26, 2002


      -----

      A terrifying picture. Fire begining to engulf Jos Verstappen's Benetton at the German GP 1994

      F1 Teams Driven for:
      Jordan (1991)
      Benetton (1992-1995)
      Ferrari (1996-)
      - http://www.mschumacher.com/biography.html
      The FIA's investigators, in trying to find the cause of the Hockenheim pit, fire discovered a safety filter missing from Benetton's FIA approved refuelling system.


      -----

      Schumacher runs into crewmember

      -----

      And I didn't even mention this little incident :
      Michael Schumacher & Jacques Villeneuve, Jerez 1997

      Schumacher needed to beat Jacques Villeneuve in the race to clam his third drivers title. After the second set of pit stops Villeneuve had closed in on Schumacher. Coming into Curva Dry Sac Villeneuve dart up the inside of Schumacher under braking. The German turn in on Villeneuve in a deliberate attempt to take the Canadian out.

      Schumacher's instinctive reaction when someone is about to pass him, is to squeeze that person's car against the edge of the track.

      You question this statement? It is in fact a direct quote from his team when he tried to explain himself after driving into Jacques Villeneueve back in 1997, in an unsporting attempt to win the world championship.


      -----

      The above are all facts. Some of them may not have been investigated by the FIA to full detail, etc. But the fact remains that these things happened. These things, along with following Formula 1 for over a decade (well-including Schumacher's career) have lead me to believe what I do : Schumacher is a great driver, but a crappy sportsman, and he does hurt Formula 1.
    18. Re:Playing by 'team rules' is the problem by Animaether · · Score: 1

      Howdy AC,

      If you had written a bit more eloquently, people may have paid attention to you.

      I'll read past your attempts at insults towards me and Formula 1 drivers and will ignore your fannboyism and address the core issue you raise : That he acknowledges his team.
      Well woop-tee-doo. I'd acknowledge my team too if they helped me win. However, the ways in which 'his team' has done so, along with personal actions, leaves much to be desired when considering this is supposed to be a sport.

      Do I believe Michael Schumacher to be egotistical ? Yes. That's my opinion.
      Do I believe him to be a maniac ? Uhm, no.

    19. Re:Playing by 'team rules' is the problem by gowen · · Score: 1
      If you're bored of the F1 parade watch MotoGP! You don't know what you're missing.
      I do watch MotoGP, for exactly the reasons you mention.
      --
      Athletic Scholarships to universities make as much sense as academic scholarships to sports teams.
  54. Re:Jamming has been done by Zlurg · · Score: 1

    Monaco 2002, David Coulthard's McLaren suffers major engine disruption. Technicians in the pit spend several laps (might even have been over a dozen) trying to get the car to stop smoking so horribly. They finally got the car fixed, David went on to win the race, and the FIA banned two-way telemetry soon thereafter.

  55. formula one! by surreal-maitland · · Score: 1

    when i first read the title i thought 'what's an article about dog food doing on /.?'

    --
    -ninjaneer
  56. I am floored! by Tired_Blood · · Score: 1

    I see a NY Times link without the standard apologies and it doesn't redirect me to a subscription page.

    What the hell is going on? Is this really slashdot?

    --
    This is not my sig.
  57. In the beginning, God created the 1's and the 0's by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The program was without form, and void, and darkness was on the face of the monitor; and the Spirit of God was moving over the face of the data.

    And God said, "Let there be FORTRAN" and there was FORTRAN. And God saw that the language was good; and God separated the code from the binaries. God called the code ASCII and the binaries he called Compiled. And there was evening and there was morning on the first day.

  58. telemetry by BigBir3d · · Score: 1

    For those that don't follow F1 racing...

    The article hints (slightly) at the wireless telemetry, but does not expand on how important it is. Each F1 car has hundreds of sensors, most of which are monitoring temperatures of various parts. At any givin time, Ferrari (by far the leader in F1 for both technology and strategy) knows the exact temperature of each tire, brake pad, rotor, exhaust header, oil, fuel, brake fluid, other hydraulic fluids, etc. Not to mention the custom EFI maps that vary based on fuel load (as weight drops, less power is required to maintain same lap time), aggressiveness of the driver (playing catch up versus safely out front), outside temp, fuel temp (as it relates to density), humidity, etc. The list just goes on and on. There are at least 100 seperate processors on any F1 car, all of which have physical back-ups (F1 car is a hot, violent, vibration filled environment).

    There are new rules that do not allow for 2-way telemetry. Ferrari was working on (and others presumably) adjusting the car beyond the onboard capabilities of the car, on the fly! That's right, the engineers could see the data coming off the car, analyze, and then send "fixes" back to the car, without it ever coming in for a pit stop. Of course, that would be very pricey, and every tech nerd out there would have been scanning the airwaves trying to figure out how to pirate a signal and replace it with something less than optimal. Not that any team would ever do such a thing... ;) Yes, encryption was part of it. Remember, these are probably _the_ smartest people running these teams (well, not Jordan or Minardi) that you could find.

    The cars are just amazingly cool. They are works of art and science. Sadly, the racing on the track leaves a lot to desire (Michael Schumacher went from 6th to 1st without passing a single car for position on the track last week in Canada).

  59. Nascar by SirLanse · · Score: 3, Informative

    I know /.ers love tech gadgets, but if you want to see the drivers compete - NASCAR. They do not allow squat of computing on board during the race.

    1. Re:Nascar by GPLDAN · · Score: 1

      Cars with carburetors and big block V8s, dropping 600hp into a tubular frame covered with a thin veneer of sheet metal made to look like a sedan that is shares nothing in common with. Make them RWD, and put slicks on them. Make them run primarily ovals. Make the track as crowded as possible, so all that gaudy advertising can fill the track.

      I laugh at shows that feature "NASCAR technology" only to feature something about a new jack. Adavcnes in material science have made these cars last longer. Make these cars rub and race in ovals and create artificial closeness by allowing catchup during yellow flags. Virtually insure yellow flags by having owners run multiple cars and tech drivers how to put it into the wall at key moments in the race to draw a yellow. Make the difference between winning and losing about fuel consumption only, and yet create a totally rigid structure for aerodynamics. Give engine manufacturers who develop new ways to create horsepower inside this tight little box of restrictions a weight penalty, so all the manufacturers are about equal and everyone gets a chance to win.

      no thanks.

    2. Re:Nascar by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That's where you go down the straight, brake, turn left, etc. Hope you beat the other guy in the pits of he crashes out....

      *Yawn*. Give me motorcycling where you see people pass each other!

    3. Re:Nascar by jackmakrl · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I hate NASCAR. Nothing puts me to sleep faster (except motocross racing). If you want to see some *real* racing watch FIA World Rally. Some of the in car footage is insane.

    4. Re:Nascar by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You have no idea what you're talking about. Firstly, these cars are running ~800HP on a normally aspirated V8 burning unleaded gasoline without fuel injection. Secondly, these blocks turn 9500RPM for the majority of some races and most make it without blowing up. That's some incredible technology right there. These drivers don't have curise control to keep their speeds down on pit road, they have to do it manually by watching the tach, they have to feel what's going wrong with the car, not have their crews see it on a computer, and they have to shift like regular drivers, they don't have electronic shifting to do the work for them.

      Did I mention that their cars don't fly to pieces when they just bump someone? And no, drivers don't intentionally crash to help their team.

    5. Re:Nascar by GPLDAN · · Score: 1

      I shorted them by 150hp.

      http://auto.howstuffworks.com/question588.htm

      I didn't say anything about aspiration. I said they had carburetors. As the website says, these engines are built to very fine tolerances, but they make the horsepower through huge displacement. As for shifting, don't be so stupid. they shift leaving the pits, they get into 4th, and they stay there.

      And, if you think "rubbin in racin" - then you like the fact these cars are patched together with duct tape in the pits. Oh, and Dale Junior actually blurted out on the radio that he spun at Bristol intentionally to draw the yellow and give his team mate the ability to re-pit. He was fined for it. Dale Senior was killed, Sterling Marlin was crucified because he rear ended him ehrn Dale pulled up trying to block for Waltrip. Happens all the time.

  60. Scientists 'selectively breeding' Formula 1 cars by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Science Blog has a related item today about scientists 'selectively breeding' winning Formula One cars.

  61. I Might Also Add... by aluminumcube · · Score: 5, Informative

    The most expensive part of the steering wheel is, by far, the custom connectors.

    The steering wheel body is all carbon fiber and all the teams can do composite work like that in their sleep (I have some cool CF toys that a couple of the composite shop guys made for me, they are scary good artists with the stuff).

    The buttons are all hardcore off the shelf units from the aerospace industry.

    The computing components are all well inside the body work, usually up in the nose or above the driver's legs.

    The god damn connector though! It was something like 30 pins and they absolutely need to be hardcore because the wheels get taken on and off the car over and over again. They need to also twist with the wheel and lock up tighter then a bankvault without any extra levers or other things to fiddle with. When I was working with the team, I was shocked at how much effort it took to make those damn things...

    1. Re:I Might Also Add... by OrsonKart · · Score: 1

      The computing components are all well inside the body work, usually up in the nose or above the driver's legs.

      Odd. There may be small junction boxes up front, but most of the electronics should be as close to the centre of the car, and as low as possible. Also there are sometimes cooling problems to take into account whih may affect the siting of the boxes

      I know that at Benetton, the steering wheel also needed programming and communicated with the rest of the car via a CAN(N?) network.

    2. Re:I Might Also Add... by Desco+Bin+Lada · · Score: 1

      The steering wheel body is all carbon fiber and all the teams can do composite work like that in their sleep (I have some cool CF toys that a couple of the composite shop guys made for me, they are scary good artists with the stuff).

      Umm... Right. Do you think they can make me some of these "toys"? My wife gets lonely.

  62. I could use this on my couch by GillBates0 · · Score: 1
    if only for the "Drink" button on the bottom left:
    "The driver presses this to deliver a drink to his helmet via a tube".

    come to think of it, where's the "Pee" button? I could use that too *sigh*.

    --
    An Indian-American Hindu committed to non-violent thought/speech/action alarmed by the global explosion of radical Islam
    1. Re:I could use this on my couch by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It Depends(tm)...

    2. Re:I could use this on my couch by Jabes · · Score: 2, Interesting

      You might not want to hear this, but when they gotta go - they gotta go.

      An average formula-1 race lasts about 90 minutes (there is a 2 hour maximum for any race). Somewhere hot, say, malaysia, the air temperature is 40 degrees C (104F). Or more.

      Now, imagine you're dressed up in a fire proof coat sat right next to a powerful engine. You're going to get very hot, right?

      They drink lots of water before and throughout the race to prevent dehydration. They can lose 3-4kg throughout the race.

      So it's not unusual for them to have to "go" during a race.

      Watch out for the dark spots when they get out of the cars... used to show up quite a bit on the silver McLaren suits.

      Not quite so glamarous thinking about pissing yourself, is it? You would think with a $400m budget they could sort that out!

    3. Re:I could use this on my couch by tcr · · Score: 1

      Not quite so glamarous thinking about pissing yourself, is it? You would think with a $400m budget they could sort that out!

      Given that the forces for even a gear change are described as "like being hit on the back of the head with a hammer", would you really want a plastic hose attached to your genitalia? :-)

      --


      Information wants to be beer.
    4. Re:I could use this on my couch by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Depends.

  63. Button use by stinkydog · · Score: 1, Insightful

    Which button controls Internet Explorer?
    Nothing like a little in-race pr0n to get the motor running.

    It seems like some buttons are missing. Proposed new controls:
    DOS
    EMP
    NOS

    SD

    --
    âoeWho knew something as harmless as willful ignorance could end up having real consequences?â
  64. Buttons. by starphish · · Score: 2, Funny
    "- anyone know what all those buttons and knobs do?"

    Well, it looks like one of the buttons on the bottom left is the CNN logo. I guess this is for the straightaways. Maybe the driver doesn't want to miss Larry King Live.

    --
    Yeah, yeah, yeah. The story is a dupe, the topic is boring, the facts weren't checked. WE GET IT!!
  65. Microsoft Connection by Ann+Elk · · Score: 1

    FWIW, Neil Konzen (one of the original authors of Windows 1.0) retired from Microsoft several years ago. He was a big Ferrari fan. The last I heard, he was working for Ferrari writing control firmware for their F1 engines.

  66. F1 Perks by Boiner · · Score: 0

    This is the only thing you need to know about F1...

  67. I'd be more worried about betters by phorm · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Participants have too much vested interest in the race to ruin it playing with things like this.

    Spectators, on the other hand, may have bets on the outcome - in which caes foul play is much more profitable per the risk.

  68. Going to the USGP... drop me an email by GPLDAN · · Score: 5, Interesting

    gpl_dan@yahoo.com. I will be in section C, way up high in row HH. Drop me a line if you will be there. Halfway between S/F line and T1. I'm hoping for Renault to do one of those crazy "we don't have launch control - wink wink" starts from row 3. :-)

    A few years ago, F1 used to have two-way telemetry to the car. Computers were adjusting brake-bias settings on the fly on a TURN by TURN basis. Cars were dynamically adjusting settings to optimize for all kinds of things. Really, it was getting silly.

    Eccelstone, the guru who presides over Formula 1 and looks like a cross between an evil elf from LOTR and Andy Warhol, had to make changes. He banned that. before last year's season, he reduced qualifying to a one lap shot instead of your best lap over time, and he created the parke-ferme, a parking garage that cars had to roll into after they pulled off the qualifying lap. Teams were (are) not allowed to touch the cars between the end of qualifying and the race start. At all.

    this created goofy things, such as last week's Canadian race where Schumi qualified back because his brother Ralf (we call him Little Ralfy) and the BMW-Williams just decided to go totally lite on fuel for the purpose of getting the pole. He had to pit 12 laps into the race, but it was part of the strategy. michael went for a 2-lap strategy and won.

    So, now - the rule changes have created a more boring sport. Unless you are some hard charger with brass ones (hello Montoya and Sato) you rarely risk passing for position, except at the start. It's just not worth the risk, wait for the pit strategy to kick in. It also promotes blocking. Rubens blocks for Michael and executes Team ferrari strategy, that's his role in life.

    The technology is shattering the smaller clubs. Arrows is gone, Minardi will probably be gone, Eddie Jordan is constantly broke and needs Ford engines to run. Now the dollars are cutting into teams that are bigger. Jaguar may pull out of F1 if they lose Webber, a promising driver. Honda was thinking of dropping BAR, after they dropped Jordan and leaving altogether, knowing they could not match the spending that Toyota was going to do. Toyota is something like 5x the size and wealth of Honda, something I didn't know until I started wacthing F1.

    Drivers are no longer valued for just driving prowess, but the engineers they can bring WITH them, and their leadership abilities within the organization. Michael Schumacher is part CEO, part engineer, part driver and basically gets what he gets because he is a large reason that Ferrari executed the plan it had. He brought Ross Brawn with him from Bennetton Ford.

    There are the big six in F1 right now - Honda, Toyota, Renault, Mercedes, BMW and Ferrari. Everyone else is an also-ran. Sauber uses 2 year old Ferrari engines, I think this year they upgraded to 1-year old engines. And to emphasize how big of a disadvantage that is - this year at Canada, the times were approaching 3 SECONDS faster than last year. The difference between a 1:12 and a 1:15 per lap is so large, old tech will leave you in the dust.

    In contrast, if you attend Champ Car (formerly CART) it's like going to a damn vintage race. Spec chassis with spec Ford engines, standard turbo, no traction control, no ABS, manual gearboxes. It's like watching F1 in 1989. And IRL is KILLING it, this is almost certainly the last year. Nobody wants to see those tanks doing makeshift street courses. Americans like ovals, and speed speed speed.

    F1 is brilliant, but they know they can't keep going as is. You hear crazy rumors all the time. One is that the V12s will get chucked, and everyone has to go to V8s. The spectacle and sound of a V12 revving at 19k RPM is amazing. THe cars will deafen you from 100 yards away. the carbon fiber chassis and cutting edge brake tech is stunning to see in person. Seeing a car brake from 200mph to 40mph in 200 feet really can't be described until you see it happen.

    1. Re:Going to the USGP... drop me an email by sterwill · · Score: 1

      V12s are gone. F1 cars all use V10s now.

      In my opinion, the FIA needs to open up the engine rules.

      Allow V8, V10, V12. Normally aspirated engines at 3.5, 3.0, and 2.5 (respecitvely). Turbo at 2, 1.5, 1 litre (respectively). These displacements are just examples, real sizes would need tweaking. The advantage to these changes would be that engine manufacturers would be able to exploit their own different strengths as applied to different designs. For example, Honda may choose a turbocharged V10, Ferrari a standard pressure V12, Ford may go back to a high torque V8. This may provide for an enjoyable shakeup in power availability.

    2. Re:Going to the USGP... drop me an email by mihalis · · Score: 2, Informative

      F1 is brilliant, but they know they can't keep going as is. You hear crazy rumors all the time. One is that the V12s will get chucked, and everyone has to go to V8s. The spectacle and sound of a V12 revving at 19k RPM is amazing. THe cars will deafen you from 100 yards away.

      The cars only have V10s already. V12s are long gone. They had 3.5 liter capacity a few years ago and that's down to 3 liters and speeds are up.

      The next frontier seems to be either max revs (unlikely) or minimum engine numbers (if Ferrari, Honda, BMW etc had to make 100/year then they'd have to sell a good few - might cut overall costs and help the lesser teams).

    3. Re:Going to the USGP... drop me an email by mihalis · · Score: 1

      Sorry to reply myself, but...

      I missed a bit in haste. I meant to write "The current talk is about V8s and 2.5 liters - that's true, but if it happens it will only temporarily reduce the horsepower levels. The next frontier..."

    4. Re:Going to the USGP... drop me an email by OrsonKart · · Score: 2, Informative

      Michael Schumacher is part CEO, part engineer, part driver and basically gets what he gets because he is a large reason that Ferrari executed the plan it had. He brought Ross Brawn with him from Bennetton Ford.

      I dunno about CEO and engineer, but he did take a large slice of the Benetton team with him...but he forgot about me :-) When Schumacher arrived at Ferrari, they recruited Ross Brawn, Rory Byrne (Chief Designer), a few top of designers, + 1 Aero + 1 electronics guy. It was a blow to Benetton, but you have to remember that the team comprised 300+ people.

      When he left it was Benetton Renault. We dumped Ford after winning the championship with them in 1995.

    5. Re:Going to the USGP... drop me an email by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Eccelstone, the guru who presides over Formula 1 and looks like a cross between an evil elf from LOTR and Andy Warhol, had to make changes.

      Bernie does not "preside over Formula 1". He is the head of the commercial/marketing arm and has absolutely no power over technical or sporting rule changes.

      Rule changes are handled by a group of people headed by the president of FIA, who is currently Max Mosley.

    6. Re:Going to the USGP... drop me an email by caitsith01 · · Score: 1

      "Rule changes are handled by a group of people headed by the president of FIA, who is currently Max Mosley..." ...who is in bed with Bernie Eccleston on virtually everything. Eccleston has *huge* influence over what happens - most decisions are ultimately 'commercial', anyway.

      This is why the teams are constantly threatening to leave and start their own series.

      --
      Read Pynchon.
    7. Re:Going to the USGP... drop me an email by xdroop · · Score: 1
      I'm hoping for Renault to do one of those crazy "we don't have launch control - wink wink" starts from row 3. :-)

      Launch control (detecting wheelspin and dynamically adjusting engine output) is illegal. Having a pre-programmed engine map (where the rate of output change is set ahead of the launch) is legal. It is like a computerized version of Top Fuel dragster's "launch control".

      --
      you should read everything on the internet as if it had "but I'm probably talking out of my ass" appended to it.
    8. Re:Going to the USGP... drop me an email by GPLDAN · · Score: 1

      Yes, I know. It was banned last year. Yet Renault continues to blast off the line better than any other team. Last year, much was made of how Renault had made great strides with LC. It seems to be a subtle difference from the driver's standpoint. They used to push a button to launch the car, now they just seem to push a different button to handle the clutching.

  69. Maybe it takes some thing else by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Maybe Ferrari gets help from certain Italian intelligence service people who help Ferrari to do some shit with the radio-tuned settings of other cars.

  70. Sun/McLaren have been doing this for a while... by jerk · · Score: 1

    You can read about it here, here, and here.

  71. Jeff Gordon by The+Ape+With+No+Name · · Score: 1

    Same for the Rangers, who also boast a fairly high rate of team spending.

    I have a friend who insists that Jeff Gordon would win easily at F1. But he doesn't. Why? Because he isn't man enough to try it. This could be the only reason. The money is WAAAAAY better than NASCAR. The exposure and fame are exponentially greater as well. Why doesn't he try F1? He's scared. I have been to an F1 race as well as many NASCAR races (I grew up in a small VA town with a NASCAR Nextel CUP track). The cars are so incredibly fast in F1. NASCAR pales in comparison both as a motorsport and as a product, especially in terms of popularity. F1 is to NASCAR as World Cup Soccer is to the NFL.

    --
    Comparing it to Windows will be a moot point, since El Dorado is going to have a 40% larger code base than XP.
    1. Re:Jeff Gordon by noewun · · Score: 1
      Why? Because he isn't man enough to try it.

      No, because there's no reason for him to. He already makes multi-millions of dollars a year, has a range of endorsements and loves the series he is in. Why switch to a different series which would require him to relocate, etc., just to drive a different series?

      There's also the fact that modern F1 is one of the most boring spectacles I've ever seen.

      --
      I am a believer of momentum and curves.
    2. Re:Jeff Gordon by jocknerd · · Score: 2, Informative

      There was a show on SpeedVision about a year ago with Jeff Gordon and Juan Montoya. They swapped cars and ran laps on Indy's F1 course. Gordon was absolutely awestruck by the F1 Williams/BMW he was driving. It took him several laps to get used to it. He was constantly braking early in the turns. Eventually he got the hang of it and actually posted some lap times that would have qualified him for the 2002 Indy Grand Prix.

      He's a hell of a driver and I would love to see him leave NASCAR and go race F1. He said driving that car was the most incredible experience he ever had driving.

    3. Re:Jeff Gordon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      According to him he couldn't compete in F1 at this stage in his career. Maybe if he was 19 again he could could take a shot at F1.

      Checkout what he has to say about a ride in BMWs F1 car:

      http://www.formula1.com/race/news/1745/722.html

    4. Re:Jeff Gordon by FigWig · · Score: 1

      Wrong. Jeff Gordon said he would love to race F1 and there is serious talk that he will race soon. Gordon did surprisingly well in a rally and had some time in an F1 car when he and JPM swapped vehicles. No question he is an excellent driver.

      --
      Scuttlemonkey is a troll
    5. Re:Jeff Gordon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The money is WAAAAAY better than NASCAR.

      Actually, Frank Williams said that he'd hire Jeff Gordon to drive his car, but that he couldn't afford him.

      F1 drivers have higher salaries than NASCAR drivers, but NASCAR drivers make most of their money through endorsements. With Villeneuve gone, Michael Schumacher is by far the highest paid F1 driver, and the only one who could really compete with a guy like Jeff Gordon when it comes to total income.

  72. What I want to know is.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    when are you guys going to realize that *BSD is is dead?

  73. Crazy Steering Wheel by syslog · · Score: 2, Interesting
    The crazy steering wheel in the pics does a ton of stuff. It allows the driver to change tons of parameters of the car - change fueld air mixture, raise, lower the car - change the braking characteristics etc etc - the list goes on and on. F1 cars are absolute marvels of tech. However, the driver has a *lot* to do with winning, regardless of what some might say. Like in the Canadian Grand Prix this last weekend, Michael S. won the race because he was best driver on the track - period. The amount of strategy that goes into each race is mind boggling - fox example when both Michael S and the other Ferrari driver were in the 1-2 spots, Michael intentionally slowed down to conserve his brakes, which had a problem. But he did not let his teammate pass, because he has the greatest chance of carrying Ferrari to victory, and a win for the other driver would make the season more difficult for Ferrari. And the other driver knew this and adjusted his driving to tail Michael, at the same time not letting the #3 & #4 car pass. Pretty exciting stuff if you know what you are watching.

    naeem

  74. Steering wheel doodads-Quick exit. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    " "I love the crazy steering wheel - anyone know what all those buttons and knobs do?" "

    I'm pretty sure I saw buttons for Ctrl-Alt-Delete on there."

    Were's the one for the ejection seat?

    ---
    "Sorry, but according to our tests, you are trying to post from [a F1 cockpit. YOU ROCK DUDE!]"

    "Please [crash the car] or ask your [competition, or lazy pit crew to help you] to do so, because [F1 cockpits] are used to spam web boards like this one."

  75. Money does help in sports by adrock037 · · Score: 1

    There are of course cases where mispending does occur and conversely teams get good players on the cheap. This is a combination of mis-management and luck. The bottom line is that having money to spend on players, or in this case technology will help. Overspending on mediocre players or overspending on mediocre technology will hurt.

  76. Ah but by The+Ape+With+No+Name · · Score: 1

    This goes against /. canon. See, if X is better because it is more popular, more techie, not the "norm," etc. then it is what should be done. He may be a multimillionare but he's no Schumacher millionaire. MS pulls down $50 million just to sit in the car. Gordon and NASCAR guys make nowhere near this amount of money to just drive the vehicle. Scumacher's Omega watch endorsement money exceeds Gordon's base salary.

    Boring: granted. But if Ferrari doesn't win. no one will watch. It is hard to understate how popular Ferrari is and how rabid the tifosi are.

    --
    Comparing it to Windows will be a moot point, since El Dorado is going to have a 40% larger code base than XP.
    1. Re:Ah but by noewun · · Score: 1
      But if Ferrari doesn't win. no one will watch. It is hard to understate how popular Ferrari is and how rabid the tifosi are.

      F1 had no trouble with TV audiences in the early and mid-80s when there was enormous competition for the title. In 1985 you had four drivers with legitimate shots at the title, and it was one of the best years in F1 history.

      --
      I am a believer of momentum and curves.
    2. Re:Ah but by The+Ape+With+No+Name · · Score: 1

      F1 had no trouble with TV audiences in the early and mid-80s

      I guess, I am talking from the European perspective. I recently saw a truck at a rest stop in Italy that was completely painted like the Scuderia Ferrari. I thought "Cool a team truck." Nope. He was hauling freight to Slovenia. It is a fan base not unlike the Dale Earnhardt worship you see in the States.

      --
      Comparing it to Windows will be a moot point, since El Dorado is going to have a 40% larger code base than XP.
  77. Obligatory Simpsons joke by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
    Nuclear Catastrohpy about to unfold and Homer does not know what button to press to stop it...

    Homer: Eenie, Meanie, Minie - Mo!

  78. Um, Formula 1 machines are racing prototypes by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

    The Champ car machines are all standardised. They use the same Lola/Reynard chassis and Ford V8 engine. They're more like Formula 3000.

    An F1 car costs an order of magnitude more than a champ car, prototype chassis, prototype engines, prototype electronics all the manufacturers make their own and that order of magnitude more spent doesn't even buy you a winner. Not that the hundreds of millions spent on the cars gives you interesting racing.

    MotoGP and WSB are far more interesting.

    1. Re:Um, Formula 1 machines are racing prototypes by davegust · · Score: 2, Interesting

      The Champ car machines are all standardised. They use the same Lola/Reynard chassis and Ford V8 engine. They're more like Formula 3000.

      Until three years ago there was alot of interesting comptetion in CART - engines from Toyota, Honda, Ford, and Mercedes - chassis from Reynard, Lola, and Swift - tires from Firestone and Goodyear - big budgets.

      It was a poor mans Formula 1, with great drivers, some great tracks, and the frightening spectacle of the super speedways. I mean a world record 246MPH qualifying lap! And the horsepower they used to run!

      Unfortunately, the money is gone now, and Champ car is surviving with as a spec type series. It still has some great drivers, great tracks, and a good fan base -- especially in Mexico and Canada. It's still serves as a feeder series to F1 along with F3000. Let's hope Honda and Toyota come to their senses and bring their money back to Champ cars.

      Let's also hope the same thing doesn't happen to F1.

    2. Re:Um, Formula 1 machines are racing prototypes by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      f1 -> worldwide
      indy car -> us only

      thats the diference

      My country has spent lots of money improving our national track, paying lots of trips(and presents) to politcians, sportsmans, car businessmans, journalists, for lobbying in FIA. And, what we have is only a promisse that our situation will be held in 2010 and not before but without guarentes.
      (we had hold 1 championship per year for the last 15 or so, until 5 years ago)

      We hold f3000 but i doubt ppl would be happy or forget F1 if in anytime someone appear with indycar racing.

  79. Worst pun yet... by SkankhodBeeblebrox · · Score: 1
    From the article:
    Indeed, AMD, the Avis of the PC business to Intel's Hertz, is trying to turn the tables in Formula One racing.
    Megahertz myth indeed!!
  80. Why they restrict things... by JakiChan · · Score: 2, Insightful

    There are usually 2 reasons for a technology to get banned in F1. The first is that it makes things too easy. They want to make the drivers have to work for the victory. That's why they removed launch control - launching the car takes skill (since you have way more power than traction). The other reason is to slow the cars down. The safety technology has trouble keeping up with speeds the cars are capable of, especially in the corners (where an accident is most likely). That's why the tyres have grooves, for example. They need to go slower. And this safety focus has helped - just look at 10 years ago when we lost 2 drivers in one weekend (including the great Senna) and nearly lost Rubens...

    I consider myself a Tifosi but when Schumi is walking over everyone it's no fun. And then he loses but wins by default...I'd rather see some variety on the podium so that the end of the year is exciting. As it is I'm cheering for Jenson since I think he's doing great this season.

    --
    "Where quality is like a dead stinking rat - you just can't miss it."
  81. Satellite by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I thought each car used to direct their data
    towards a satellite (always overhead) and the
    satellite would send it back down to the pit.
    In this way the data is always current and
    not subject to the delay of retrieving the data
    every lap.

  82. The buttons by Sloppy · · Score: 2, Funny
    I saw a documentary on the TV that explained what the buttons do:

    Button A deploys the powerful jacks. This can make the car jump.

    Button B changes the tires into special tires for rough terrain.

    Button C makes two circular saw blades come out of the front of the car. This lets you drive through a forest; it'll just cut down the trees as you drive through them.

    Button D makes the windshield bulletproof and the cockpit crashproof.

    Button E turns on the high-beams.

    Button G releases the homing robot. It can fly back home and carry messages to your girlfriend or mechanic.

    --
    As copyright owner of this comment, I authorize everyone to defeat any technological measure which limits access to it.
  83. 200 mph is no big deal by MOMOCROME · · Score: 2, Informative

    There are hundreds of example of drivers recovering from tire blowouts and suspension failures at that speed. (usually on a straightaway, though). I've done it myself at ~150 mph.

    The effects of a tire blowout at that speed are intense, but within the capabilities of even the top end street-legal sports cars, a $10 M formula 1 racing system.
    driven by alert and experienced drivers.

    There are also plenty of examples of fatal crashes at 55 mph, so i don't know what to make of that.

    But the point remains: if you can react against a damn blowout at 200mph, you can definately snake your thumb over to click a button on the steering wheel.

  84. V8 Formula 1 cars by Gordonjcp · · Score: 2, Interesting
    A couple of years ago, there was a programme on TV about F1. Jacque Villeneuve took out a F1 racing car from the mid-1970s, all huge rear tyres, little skinny fronts (looked almost like a dragster), manual gearbox, V8 into open pipes... The look on his face when he came back in! Can't quite remember what he said, but it was along the lines of "This is fantastic, what racing's all about, but you'd never be able to race one today".


    Thing is, F1 is about putting cars out with the absolute hottest technology possible on board. The current regulations ban so many cool things that would give the less spendy teams a bit more of a chance.

  85. What the buttons do by b1t+r0t · · Score: 1
    A - jet propulsion and car elevation
    B - special tyres for rough terrain
    C - sawblades at the front of the car for cutting through anything in his way
    D - bullet proof windshield
    E - super bright headlights
    F - for driving underwater, equipped with an oxygen supply and periscope
    G - robot bird released as a messenger pigeon

    Pretty cool, huh?

    --

    --
    "Open source is good." - Steve Jobs
    "Open source is evil." - Microsoft
  86. More technical info on F1 cars ... by RageEX · · Score: 2, Informative
    Article on the steering wheel.

    Articles on other technical aspects of F1.

    I think last spring F1 became the biggest sport in the world according to TV viewing numbers (excepting the Wolrd Cup finals).

    Americans are retards when it comes to racing. Which is a shame because F1 was thriving in America in the 60s and 70s and we actually had some Americans drivers.

    If I was a billionaire I'd upgrade Watkins Glen, kickout the proffitable but contemptable Wiston Cup jerks, and try to get F1 back on the best road coarse in the country.

    1. Re:More technical info on F1 cars ... by BCW2 · · Score: 1

      If you add all the televised racing series, it's been the biggest for over ten years. Indy, CART, NASCAR, F1, and the various sportscar series in the US and Europe.

      Before Tony George's ego shot him in the wallet(he owns Indianapolis Speedway), the Indy 500 was the largest single day sporting event in the world with attendance over 400,000. After he caused the split between CART and his IRL it has fallen every year until this one. You used to have to wait for someone to die to get moved up the ticket list, now you can walk up and get some on race day.

      --
      Professional Politicians are not the solution, they ARE the problem.
  87. F1 Overhaul by Ced_Ex · · Score: 1

    Given the technology that F1 uses, it's no surprise that the top team happens to have the largest budget. Unfortunately the difference between the top team's budget and the bottom team's budget is desparingly huge! This causes a problem in the competitiveness of the sport, which makes for boring races of follow the leader. You could essentially switch the top 10 drivers' rides and the race order would be still ranked by manufacturer as opposed to driver talent, give or take one position.

    There is a couple of problems with F1 today. Not enough teams have the money to compete at such a level, yet at the same time, you can't cap the budget. F1 is supposed to be the TOP OF THE LINE technology, bleeding edge stuff. When you restrict things like that, are you really getting "Formula One" anymore? More like "Formula 1.36".

    What's going to wake up F1 is when you get CART cars which have rules governing the make up of the cars going just as fast as F1 cars. CART = F1 = no more F1. (yeah, I know, bad math)

    I don't have a solution to this, other than having the top team release its research at the end of the season to the lower teams. How else can you even out the competition without capping budgets, or restricting advances in technology?

    --
    Live forever, or die trying.
    1. Re:F1 Overhaul by OrsonKart · · Score: 1

      >>Unfortunately the difference between the top team's budget and the bottom team's budget is desparingly huge!

      And it is compounded by the fact that succesful teams get huge prize money, free tyres, free travel, free engines (excluding Ferrari, Renault, Toyota etc)

      >>What's going to wake up F1 is when you get CART cars which have rules governing the make up of the cars going just as fast as F1 cars

      Maybe in a straight line, but an F1 car would leave a CART car for dust if you introduce some (fairly) wiggly bits.

  88. What you all fail to realize by qwerty75 · · Score: 1

    Is that Formula 1 is one of the only motorsports where the technology developed for the race cars Actually makes it into future production vehicles. Technology for Anti-lock brakes, Clutchless manual transmissions, Hydrolic valves, tire technology, Fule injection, the list goes on and on. Some of the tech they have has not made it or is still to expensive for mas production. Nothing new has come out of NASCAR for 50 years. Still pushrod V8's with large displacements to produce power. Still carborated, all very mechanical. Low tech at it's best. Heck, F1 cars now use tires with TREAD. They had to do something to SLOW them down. Everything about an F1 car is High Tech. From what I understand they can actively change the suspension setup from the pits for every single corner on the track. NASCAR's answer to that is Staggerd tires. The rest of the world is blowing past the US in terms of technology and improvements for cars and almost all of those improvements come from Racing. F1 is the proving ground for Engine, Transmission, and all other automotive technology in the Future. NASCAR is the proving ground for all the Technology of the Past.

    1. Re:What you all fail to realize by BCW2 · · Score: 1

      F1 has always been the height of technology. The tire only have four straight grooves cut in them. That is not tread. They do have rain tires, so does CART. Goodyear actually has produces a rain tire for NASCAR to use on road courses. It would be impossible to use them on an oval track for any car.

      This Sundays NASCAR race at Michigan will look just like the USGP at Indy, a boring follow the leader snoozathon because both series have forgotten that passing should be done on the track, not in the pits.

      --
      Professional Politicians are not the solution, they ARE the problem.
    2. Re:What you all fail to realize by js290 · · Score: 1

      F1 tires do not have treads. They have grooves. BIG difference. Treads are used to siphon water away as to make it safe to drive in the wet. The groove tires were the stupid idea of the FIA to try to slow the cars down by reducing the size of the contact patch. This was never going to work as any tire engineer would have told you the tire manufacturer would simply kick the compounds up a notch to compensate for the grooves. Had the FIA been listening to the teams, they would have reduced the effects of the aerodynamics and gone back to wider slick tires, not narrower grooved tires. Also, the transfer of technology from racing cars to street cars is overstated. The composites industry was ready to supply the Big 3 back in the 70s, only to be turned away. They didn't make race cars with structural composites until the late 80s. A lot of the stuff you see in high tech racing cars now has been used for a long time in the aerospace industry. F1 is to the point of being extravagant for the sake of being extravagant. Not particularly interesting. If you want to see some real racing at the higest level, two wheels is where it's at.

      --
      "Tempers are wearing thin. Let's just hope some robot doesn't kill everybody." --Bender
  89. Another waste for money. by qualico · · Score: 1

    How much money do you think pours through this industry?

    Adding computers to control every aspect, regulated or no, is just diluting the entertainment.

    I just can't see how we are improving our world with such a flagrant waste of resources to watch cars run around a track over and over again until someone wins by 1/1000 of a second.

    Now if they can create rules such that the cars must be made from recycled materials, (computers et al), then maybe we can see some benefits.

    1. Re:Another waste for money. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What the fuck makes you think you deserve to benefit from the *sport* of F1?

      Jerk.

    2. Re:Another waste for money. by BCW2 · · Score: 1

      Benifits of auto racing transfered to your car:
      disk brakes, fuel injection(efficiency), seat belts & any other safety feature, the core design of every tire produced in the radial era(ie tires that can exceed 100mph without exploding, and can corner with grip), suspension parts & design, materials in car construction(strength vs. weight (less weight better fuel economy)).

      Most improvments to street cars in the last 50 years were found at the race track first. Thats why manufacturers have a presence in most racing series, it's where they learn and try things, sometimes called practical R&D.

      --
      Professional Politicians are not the solution, they ARE the problem.
    3. Re:Another waste for money. by qualico · · Score: 1

      Good point.
      Just wish they didn't have to go to such expense, both monetary and environmentally.

      No doubt the computer aspects will filter back to commercial uses at least.

    4. Re:Another waste for money. by BCW2 · · Score: 1

      At least F! finally changed the fuel regs to allow pump gas only a couple years ago. That ended the fuel wizards mixing at the track in full chem suits. They tried to call that gasoline but the content was less than 60%. Pure benzine is a very dangerous cheical.

      --
      Professional Politicians are not the solution, they ARE the problem.
    5. Re:Another waste for money. by sik+puppy · · Score: 1

      You ought to price those sponsorship decals. Marlboro's last deal with Ferrari was 7 years/$700 million. Thats some very expensive advertising.

      --
      The first thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers. Shakespeare, Henry VI, Part 2, Act 4, Scene 2
    6. Re:Another waste for money. by qualico · · Score: 1

      Ya and I've heard it said that Williams has the formula for how that money gets distributed. Thats one powerful guy.

      Maybe the rocket building industry could do well from such injection.

      Also, back on topic of the computer input.
      How about the clutter on the tv screen now?
      All kinds of stats and window perspectives.

  90. Mod Parent by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0


    very informative, cheers

  91. Formula 1 steering wheel explained by sspenser · · Score: 2, Informative

    It's 2 years old, but the Scuderia.net has the 2002 wheel explained at their website. FYI ... the "Oil tank" button is (I believe) a release for a reserve oil tank that they carry in the event that its needed.

  92. Isn't this all a little overkill? by Lethyos · · Score: 1

    Why don't they just install a racing chip and be done with it?

    --
    Why bother.
  93. NASCAR by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Non Athletic Sport Centered Around Rednecks :)

  94. Drag Racing by tdrury · · Score: 1
    I've always been a huge fan of Indy cars (back when it was CART), F1, rally, and road-racing. Drag racing has never really interested me. Until, that is, I found out a little more about the technology.

    Some factoids ripped from the NHRA site:

    nitromethane-powered engines of NHRA Top Fuel dragsters and Funny Cars produce approximately 8,000 horsepower

    Top Fuel dragsters and Funny Cars use between 10 and 12 gallons of fuel for a complete pass, including the burnout, backup to the starting line, and quarter-mile run

    the fuel-line pressure for NHRA Top Fuel dragsters and Funny Cars is between 400 and 500 pounds which translates into 65 gallons of fuel per minute

    it takes just 15/100ths of a second for all 8,000 horsepower of an NHRA Top Fuel dragster engine to reach the rear wheels
    Not from that site, but I recall an factoid that a top fueler pumps enough air on a single 1/4 mile run to inflate the Goodyear Blimp.

  95. Jingoistic American response by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The cars are different because the history of racing is different in the US and Europe. In Europe, racing originated as a rich man's amusement, where the emphasis was on the competitors themselves and tracks in the 10-20 mile lap lengths (out of town, down to the village, over the hill and home). In the US, early races were staged as spectator events, largely on county fair horse tracks. This led to the predominance of oval track racing here, and road course racing in Europe. The cars were bred in different environments and thus evolved differently.

    If I remember right, there was a standing prize offered for a number of years for anyoune who could win the Indy 500 with a Formula 1 car. This was never claimed largely because the races in Formula 1 are considerable shorter, and thus the cars are built less durably to save weight.

  96. Those crazy steering wheel buttons... by mikael · · Score: 1

    ... I love the crazy steering wheel - anyone know what all those buttons and knobs do?"

    More importantly, how long before we can get steering wheel controllers with all those buttons for our favourite console systems?

    --
    Vintage computer adverts: http://www.vintageadbrowser.com/computers-and-software-ads
  97. Tron? by edrams · · Score: 1

    That racer's helmet looks slightly Tron-esque. Just saying...

  98. yeah by Trepidity · · Score: 1

    It's been all downhill since they got rid of that guy hand-cranking the engine to start it. Fucking ignition motors.

  99. other amazing F1 facts by edsarkiss · · Score: 1

    - current F1 engines hit nearly 19,000 RPM. that's 3x the speed of a typical car engine, and 1.5x the speed of a fast motorcycle engine.

    - at 19,000 RPM, the pistons in the engine experience 10,000 g of acceleration/deceleration as they move up and down

    - the pistons reach a maximum vertical-axis speed of 132 feet per second, or 90 MPH

    - the cars IDLE at 4,000 RPM, near the maximum speed of many automobile engines

    - the cars generate enough downforce (roughly 1300 lbs) at 90MPH to *drive upside down*

    - at a maximum of 200-210MPH, the car is exerting nearly 5,000 lbs of pressure onto the ground, thanks to its aerodymic profile

    - the faster the car goes, the faster it can go around a turn (see above)

    --

    SIGUSR1
    1. Re:other amazing F1 facts by wicka_wicka · · Score: 1

      And they do all of this on 3L V10's...BTW, about the driving upside-down, an F1 car is basically just an upside down wing.

      --
      hi
  100. bmw williams steering wheel diagram by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

    http://www.usgpindy.com/news/2004/images/williamsg raphic

  101. The more things change the more they stay the same by kid+zeus · · Score: 2, Interesting
    We shouldn't forget that there was a time that Americans competed fiercely in both this style of racing as well as in the groundbreaking engineering aspect. Nobody typified both traits as much as Jim Hall. After he introduced high wings to devastating effect, they were banned. Then he introduced something else:

    The 2J was as radical as the 2E and 2H had been. Maybe more so. The car looked like a white brick. A very fast white brick. The car carried two motors. A 465 cubic inch Chevy V8 powered the rear wheels and a 274 cc Rockwell snowmobile engine powered a pair of "sucker" fans in the rear bodywork. The fans sucked air out from under the car, creating a vacuum that held the 2J on the track. Sliding Lexan skirts were placed around the bottom edge of the body to seal the "plenum" area under the car. Enough suction could be generated to hold the car upside down on the ceiling of a room! Where a wing generates downforce (good) it also generates drag (bad). The suction device generated downforce with no drag loss.

    Reigning F1 World Driving Champion Jackie Stewart qualified the 2J third at Watkins Glen and drove the race's fastest lap, but his race was cut short by brake problems. The Chaparral team missed the next three races but returned to competition in September at Road Atlanta. They also brought a new driver with them, Vic Elford. Elford drove the 2J in three of the remaining four races. (The team would miss one more race.)

    Elford was fastest qualifier in all three of those races but he only finished one (sixth at Road Atlanta). Something always broke. But the competition felt that, with a year of experience under their belt, the Chaparral team would bury them in 1971. Competitors were always lobbying the SCCA to ban the 2J. At the end of the season it was. The sliding Lexan skirts were said to have violated the "moveable aerodynamic device" ban. With that, Jim Hall closed up shop. An era in international autoracing had come to a close.

    Also, there is another type of racing that approaches the excitement and sheer driving skill of F1, and that would be Rally. The control those guys evince under such conditions is truly mind-boggling. Beyond that, for pure joy of automotive race, it's hard to beat the beauty of GT. The cars, the tracks. Not the same rush as F1, but for a car lover it's heaven.

  102. The Music behind Formula 1 by ink · · Score: 1

    The technology is great an all, but you really need to have the music to understand Formula One; but only if you have at least 5.1 DTS on your tele.

    --
    The wheel is turning, but the hamster is dead.
    1. Re:The Music behind Formula 1 by edsarkiss · · Score: 1

      I've got SpeedTribe -- it's great!

      but the racing is from the 24 Hours of LeMans, not Formula 1.

      --

      SIGUSR1
    2. Re:The Music behind Formula 1 by cgori · · Score: 1

      What about the babes?!

      (I love yahoo's sense of humor with the URL, btw -- "glamour"?!)

  103. turbochargers by ed1park · · Score: 1

    Can anyone explain the restriction in F1? Was it getting too dangerous?

    1. Re:turbochargers by OrsonKart · · Score: 1

      It was a bit before my time, but I can remember reading that Gerhard Berger had, in his 1.5L car, over 1200bhp available to him during qualifying. Now they are limited to 3L normally aspirated engines, down from 3.5L in 1995.

    2. Re:turbochargers by mihalis · · Score: 1

      Turbochargers : Can anyone explain the restriction in F1? Was it getting too dangerous?

      1500bhp qualifying specials

      "press here to overtake" buttons (boost control)

      all kinds of unpleasant anti-competitive features for turbo-teams agaisnt non-turbo teams, none of which entertained the fans or reflected driver skill

    3. Re:turbochargers by rgraham · · Score: 1
      Can anyone explain the restriction in F1? Was it getting too dangerous?
      We're getting off topic here, but yes. Right up before they changed the rules they had little 2.0 litre four cylinder engines putting out 1000bhp. The cars were simply getting too fast and the FIA (F1's governing body) decided the best way to slow the cars down was to decrease their horsepower. When the FIA banned turbo charging, increased displacement to 3.5 litres and allowed refueling suddenly you saw V8, V10, and V12 engines being employed. Those were interesting times since you saw some teams going with a relatively underpowered, fuel efficient V8 or powerful, fuel inefficient V12, or something in-between. The rules were changed again a few years ago and all the teams how have to run 3.0 litre V10's. However, it's looking like another rule change will be coming for the '06 season which will mandate 2.5 litre V8s. This latest proposed change is to again both slow the cars down and decrease cost.
    4. Re:turbochargers by sik+puppy · · Score: 1

      They were using 1.5 liter, 6 cylinder turbocharged engines. In qualifying, they were using as much as 9 bars of boost (ie around 135 pounds) on custom fuels that cost north of $200/liter. Turbo engines cost somewhere around $60k each (1980ish), and you would use at least 3 engines per race weekend.

      F1 has been trying to keep the costs somewhat sane, and the turbos were causing problems. The cost of running a F1 team for a weekend will run an indy car team for an entire season.

      --
      The first thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers. Shakespeare, Henry VI, Part 2, Act 4, Scene 2
  104. Obligatory Spaceballs comment... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I just hope that the pilot fascent his seatbelt before pressing the "ludicrous speed" button...

  105. F1 Software by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The leading supplier of software to Ferrari is apparently UK based Ricardo (http://software.ricardo.com). Free licences may be available to engineering students apparently. The software F1 teams use usually includes Computational Fluid Dynamics (for external aerodynamics for internal gas flow), Finite Element Analysis (for temperatures, and mechanical stresses), valve train analysis etc.
    Multi processor systems are the norm in this game. The system requirement for computational fluid dynamics software are astronomical (less than 4Gb RAM is on the low side for FEA in particular), and many of the systems that are used for this purpose are multi CPU or clustered with proprietrary networks like Myrinet. (http://www.myrinet.com/)
    Nastran (NASA developed orignally) is a more general CFD solver for those who are interested. Expensive though.
    This software is pretty much available for the customers platform of choice, providing it runs X11 or Windows. AMD64 is proving a popular choice for this type of application, as is Intels Itanium II.

  106. You ought to check out the technology we use... by eaddict · · Score: 1

    ..in slot car racing! Companies like Carrera,Scalextric are doing cool things. We haven't gotten that far in our St Louis club yet...

    --
    "If you are on fire you can just stop, drop, and roll. If you fall into Lava you are just dead." - my 5yr old daughter
  107. They're not the only ones doing data acq by DG · · Score: 1

    Even us poor little bastards use it.

    See http://farnorthracing.com for more info. I've got some data from the car on the site.

    DG

    --
    Want to learn about race cars? Read my Book
  108. Been there done that :-) by OrsonKart · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I used to work for the Benetton F1 team when Schumacher was around. I joined in 94 as their sole software engineer tasked with writing data analysis, strategy and telemetry sw. 94 & 95 were great years - we won around 60% of that year's GP's and the bonus was $$$$ :-) In those days the on-board data loggers contained 4mb(now 128Mb) and the real-time telemetry was a pitiful 9600 baud, which didn't work 100% on every track (e.g. Hockenheim and Monaco). I found Schumacher to be a good egg, fairly quiet, polite and interested in your work. Happy days. wrt the super computer etc, I'd take that with a slight pinch of salt. F1 teams are prone to exagerate slightly. PC's are adequate for most of their tasks excepting cfd and design work which is usually done on unix boxes.

    1. Re:Been there done that :-) by BCW2 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Chek out last weeks Autoweek magazine http://www.autoweek.com McLaren just opened a new shop. $900 million worth. I wouldn't be suprised at a supercomputer. Just wish theyd had some inside shots.

      --
      Professional Politicians are not the solution, they ARE the problem.
    2. Re:Been there done that :-) by js290 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      CFD and vehicle dynamics modelling would require some real computing power. I think HP supplies Linux clusters to Williams. A microcontroller with a 128MB compact flash card could probably log all the data they need from a race. Plus, collecting data is pretty easy. The real trick is making sense of the data.

      --
      "Tempers are wearing thin. Let's just hope some robot doesn't kill everybody." --Bender
    3. Re:Been there done that :-) by OrsonKart · · Score: 2, Interesting

      IIRC The main CFD processing used to be done at night when all the designers had gone home. They used to distribute the processing over ~30 unix workstations. We also used to have HP kit like Williams and Jordan.

      Vehicle dynamics modelling was performed on PC's.

      >>A microcontroller with a 128MB compact flash card could probably log all the data they need from a race

      Maybe back in the 1980's. Today's loggers are doing a large amount of processing. They have around 200 different sensors on the cars, some logged at 10Hz (pressures, temperatures) some at 200, 300, 500 or 1000Hz. At these rates 128Mb is not enough for a race, so the number of channels and their frequency are cut back. This is not so important now that most teams have microwave telemetry.

      IIRC the memory was not compact flash, it wasn't fast enough.

      >>The real trick is making sense of the data.

      No shit :-) In Addition, another trick was making sense of the data in a timely manner, which was my main objective. Just think about qualifying:

      1. The car comes in.
      2. You download the data from the car (twas by fibre)
      3. The race engineer talk to the driver: "The car is rubbish"
      4. The race engineer examine the data
      5. The race engineer issues instructions to the mechanics
      6. Mechanics make changes to the car
      7. The driver goes out
      8. Repeat 4 times during the (old) qualifying hour

    4. Re:Been there done that :-) by OrsonKart · · Score: 1

      McLaren just opened a new shop. $900 million worth

      They should have spent it on the car :-)

    5. Re:Been there done that :-) by js290 · · Score: 1

      >> Vehicle dynamics modelling was performed on PC's.

      Were they using ADAMS? The people I knew that did vehicle dynamics used ADAMS on UNIX boxes.

      >> No shit :-) In Addition, another trick was making sense of the data in a timely manner, which was my main objective. Just think about qualifying:

      I was thinking more for the engineers who designed the cars, not just the ones supporting the race. The race engineers seem to be looking for instant gratification for the race weekend, while the car designers seem to have to take account of the data as a whole.

      Your point about the driver input is missed by many fans, I think. It's clear that Schumacher has superior driving skills, but it also seems like he gives feedback that's useful to the engineers as well. Plus, he gets to work with engineers that understand what he's telling them.

      --
      "Tempers are wearing thin. Let's just hope some robot doesn't kill everybody." --Bender
    6. Re:Been there done that :-) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They purchased ADAMS (back in ~94/95) and I remember around 5 people attending an in-house training course, but AFAICR it was never used in anger.

      The people who do the vehicle modelling tend to use Matlab to create models/simulations.

      I'm not sure how much the designers used data collected from the races/tests. I recall the stress guys asking for data frequently so that they could do stress simulations on the parts.

      Schumacher has a brain, which cannot be said for all drivers, no, really! I remember him following a car and the only way to overtake was at a certain point on the track, which was off the racing line and hence dirty. He spent 4/5 laps going off-line at that particular point to gradually clear the track. He then over took.

      I remember at one race weekend when I introduced some new sw and he got his calculator out and started adding up values to check I'd got the correct answer!

    7. Re:Been there done that :-) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So were you the guy responsible for the "software" traction control?

  109. Don't forget diff mapping by DG · · Score: 3, Funny

    F1 uses electronically-controlled differentials, which also has its own map. At least one of the rotary controls is a diff map selector.

    Another one is probably a TC agressiveness control.

    And on Michael's wheel, one is a knob limiting the maximum engine RPM on Rueban's car. ;)

    DG

    --
    Want to learn about race cars? Read my Book
  110. Ferrari never won a championship before Schumi? by ^BR · · Score: 3, Informative

    Well, where have you been...

    Ferrari has 13 constructor championship titles and 9 Ferrari driving pilots won the drivers championship...

    1. Re:Ferrari never won a championship before Schumi? by a7244270 · · Score: 1

      I said benetton never, ferrari 20+ years. Ferrari of course has a great F1 history.

  111. Rally in USA by Camaro · · Score: 2, Informative

    While it's true that the only World Rally Championship event in North America is in Mexico, you can see rally events in the US with the SCCA Pro Rally series. If I remember correctly the past season saw the tragic death of a driver and co-driver from a Subaru team in this series.

    1. Re:Rally in USA by gosand · · Score: 1
      If I remember correctly the past season saw the tragic death of a driver and co-driver from a Subaru team in this series.

      Maybe this is the information that needs to get out in order to get Americans interested in the sport. Morbid, but true.

      But this brings up an interesting point - NAASSSCOOORRR is boring. Fans love the wrecks. Rally is frigging exciting, and I don't think people want to see the wrecks. They want to see the limits pushed, and some amazing driving. THAT is exciting. I don't want to see F1 drivers crash, I want to see RACING. When I went to that Indy 500, people became interested only when there was a wreck. Steven Tyler sang the national anthem that year, which was cool. But some drunk redneck pig-fucker kept yelling "J-J-J-Jaded" ALL DAY LONG at about half hour intervals. I wanted to leave after about an hour anyway, he just expedited the desire.

      --

      My beliefs do not require that you agree with them.

  112. Steering wheel buttons by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The picture on the front page is of Michael Schumacher's Momo steering wheel (www.momo.it).

    The buttons and nobs control howthe car behaves.

    the "N" button is a Neutral button for the gearbox.
    Other buttons do things like turn on and off traction control, activate the fire supression system, control pit requests and communications (pus h to talk and so forth), control transmission behavior, etc.

    The nobs control things like break bias (Front vs. rear and left vs. right), break pressure, torque vs. horsepower settings, and stuff like that.

    There are also LED's at the top of the steering wheel to indicate engine speed and a light to tell the driver the ideal time to shift. The screen above the Momo label can be customized (by buttons and/or nobs) to show things like transmission, oil, engine, and coolant temperatures, etc.. Also, there are paddles behind the steering wheel (one on each side) to control the sequential manual gearbox. The car does have a clutch, but it is not used during the race. The sequential transmissions can shift in a few miliseconds...more than sixteen times faster than the fastest driver in a normal road car. So fast, taht an F1 or rally driver (Rally cars use very similar transmissions) can shift from Neutral up to sixth (or seventh) and back down to neutral in the time it takes to make ONE shift with a traidional manual transmission.

    (sorry, i'm kinda a car freak)

    All of this, the driver has to be able to control and manipulate at or over 200 MPH.

  113. CART was the model for safety by davegust · · Score: 1, Interesting

    Actually that not a fair assessment. CART was first with HANS (head and neck restraints), pit lane speed limits, wheel tethers, monocock crash test requirements. Before the money disappeared, CART had a huge budget for safety R&D. They were the model in the racing industry for proactive safety programs.

    F1 still doesn't have a traveling trauma team or safety team. They rely on local authorities for medical response. If CART had run that way, Alex Zanardi would be dead today.

    F1's biggest advantage in safety is improved track design to prevent the deadly crashes to start with - run off areas, etc. That's great, and Champ cars are catching up by wisely abandoning oval tracks.

    1. Re:CART was the model for safety by karit · · Score: 2, Informative

      The marshalls may be local. But Sid Watkins is the head doctor and travels to all the grand prixs and drives in a car that is driven by a F3000 (race level below F1) driver. At each GP Sid has meetings with all the local hospitals and the doctors who are going to be on duty over the weekend.

      All the races are controled by Charlie Whiting who manages all the marshalls and other aspects reagarding saftey during the race.

      --
      http://blog.karit.geek.nz/
    2. Re:CART was the model for safety by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      F1 still doesn't have a traveling trauma team or safety team. They rely on local authorities for medical response. If CART had run that way, Alex Zanardi would be dead today.

      Alex crashed in Germany. Germans have that no speedlimit autobahn thing, with much more severe wrecks. I think they'd have done just fine.

      Ofcourse, F1 could actually afford to have a vascular surgeon and full surgical team on staff if they so desired, while CART cannot.

    3. Re:CART was the model for safety by FireAtWill · · Score: 1

      The CART safety team does the same thing. They visit the local facilities, have meetings, learn the setup and operation of the hospitals, arrange for the complete medical records of all the drivers to be on site, etc. It's pretty amazing. All of them are very good, but I think that CART has been at the forefront.

    4. Re:CART was the model for safety by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      All true, but the parent poster was correctly refuting the claim that "F1 still doesn't have a traveling trauma team or safety team".

  114. Anyone know what the buttons do? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If the car is running Windows I know what CTL-ALT-DEL is for!

  115. Sorry - blatent troll coming up.... by acey72 · · Score: 1

    Which button is it for "engine blow up" - this seems to be the McLaren way this season :)

    ACey

    Not that I'm complaining - the Maccas are at least a distraction from the pretty poor showing of my favoured team, BMW/Williams.

    1. Re:Sorry - blatent troll coming up.... by fluxrad · · Score: 0

      Someone mod parent up.

      --
      "It is seldom that liberty of any kind is lost all at once." -David Hume
    2. Re:Sorry - blatent troll coming up.... by flewp · · Score: 1

      It's not so much a button as it is a pedal operated by the right foot....

      --
      WWJD.... for a Klondike bar?
  116. Well I'll be danged by gwoodrow · · Score: 1

    Who'da thunk it? I still thought they just crammed a note into a beer can and tossed it to the pit. That's what I do when I'm in a rush to work down at the con-stru-shun site but need to leave a note for the lil lady about what I want for dinner. She cooks it up real nayce - we don't need no fancy shmancy computer bursts.

    (Yes, this really is how some of us down in Georgia talk - ESPECIALLY about racing.)

  117. Turbo engines were banned earlier than 1992 by Blademan007 · · Score: 1

    The article states: "The seesaw battle around the role of computing in Formula One began in earnest in 1992 when the federation eliminated turbocharged engines in an effort to control race car speeds."

    Turbo engines were banned earlier than that.

    I do recall reading that Gerhard Berger qualified for the German Grand Prix in the late 80's with a 1.5 liter turbo qualifying (grenade) engine that produced 1500 bhp. Those engines were designed to last less than 10 laps of the track.

    1. Re:Turbo engines were banned earlier than 1992 by BCW2 · · Score: 1

      Until the last three years everyone ran a grenade for qualifying, in most series. Nascar teams had Q engines runing a special 0 weight oil. Then drop in the race engine with regular racing oil. Indy cars used to do the same things with heavier oil, but in the 60's they added nitromethane to the methanol, put a little "pop" in the fuel. Great power but hell on bearings and rings, switch or rebuild the engine. Sometime in the early 80's I might have done the same thing with an Outlaw sprint car. Of course we were going to rebuild the engine the next week anyway. Nothing like a 2 foot long blue flame out the header in a night race, and the 8 foot yellow one when the driver backed off was spetacular.

      --
      Professional Politicians are not the solution, they ARE the problem.
  118. Another summary... by Shoten · · Score: 2, Interesting

    A couple of years ago, Wired had an amazing article about F1 racing, particularly in terms of how it evolved yearly from the technological arms race. A team would develop something astounding, and others might copy it, and by the next year it would be outlawed. Innovation after innovation came and went like this, with few of them being allowed to remain. What I most liked about the article was the picture of a Mercedes-Benz F1 motor mounted to the dyno, looking utterly gorgeous (spotlessly clean, I should add) with its huge shiny exhaust pipes glowing cherry red. :)

    --

    For your security, this post has been encrypted with ROT-13, twice.
  119. Ummm..... Indeed by cardshark2001 · · Score: 1
    Car data is sent in multi-megabyte wireless bursts each time the team's cars flash past the pits, often in excess of 200 miles an hour.

    Quite true. I'm pretty sure the data travels at about 186,000 miles per second.

    --
    WWJD? JWRTFA!
  120. No, No, No. by www.sorehands.com · · Score: 1

    It is Auto Jacks, Grip Tires, Rotary Saws, Cockpit cover, Special illumniation, Underwater mode, and homing robot bird.

  121. After watching LeMans last weekend... by slasher999 · · Score: 1

    I think I'm hooked. It was just last year I started taking Nascar seriously, and now I'm finding some great stuff on the Speed channel. I used to watch Nascar back when I was a kid (70's and early 80's) just because I liked the "fast cars". Now it's more about the physics and math involved. I was really hooked on LeMans and to a lesser extent on the Indy race a couple of weeks ago. Now I'm saving up $100k for a new Audi.

    1. Re:After watching LeMans last weekend... by B4RSK · · Score: 1

      Which Audi? RS6?

      Very sweet car...

      I suggest you start a bit lower though. Get a WRX STi and have it tuned. No, I don't mean riced. Tuned. I suggest the Tommy Kaira engine talked about in this review

      Of course if money is no issue get the RS6!!

      --
      Some people are like slinkies--basically useless but they bring a smile to your face when pushed down the stairs.
    2. Re:After watching LeMans last weekend... by slasher999 · · Score: 1

      WRX? Whoa, I'm in the over-30 crowd. Don't think I'd look too "stylin" in a kiddie car, no matter how big the powerplant under the hood.

    3. Re:After watching LeMans last weekend... by B4RSK · · Score: 1

      I'm in the over 30 crowd too -- and could go and buy the RS6 / E55 AMG / M5 without having to wait to save first. ;)

      If I go that route I'd either go RS6 or E55 AMG, but what I am considering instead is a used Ferrari 348. Not the most practical car in the world, but hey, you only live once.

      Currently I drive a Subaru Legacy B4RSK. Sadly Subaru never exported this version to North America (I'm in Japan), but they plan to export the new model due out in September. The US model should come with around 300HP and of course has a more "adult" style to it.

      Is the WRX considered a kiddie car in the US? It isn't here... In the more tuned forms it is a race/rally car and I sure wouldn't want an inexperienced driver behind the wheel. Damn things go like rockets.

      Anyway, good luck with your saving, I'm sure you'll be happy with the Audi if that is the way you go!

      --
      Some people are like slinkies--basically useless but they bring a smile to your face when pushed down the stairs.
  122. Formula 1 Technical Analysis by Lomby · · Score: 1

    There is a great book about the technical details of Formula 1 cars (it even explains the meaning of all the buttons on the steering whell :)

    It written by the RAI's (Italian TV) technical commentator for the F1 championship.
    I can only suggest it for the people interested in all the technological details about the F1 cars: it sports lot of beautiful color drawings and diagrams, showing really every small part of the cars.

    Title: Formula One 2001: Technical Analysis
    by Giorgio Piola

  123. Avis vs. Hertz by bugmenot · · Score: 1

    Indeed, AMD, the Avis of the PC business to Intel's Hertz...

    Anyone care to explain what the heck this metaphor means?
    --
    This account has been seized by the GNAA. That is all.
  124. F1 steering wheel functions by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

    The web log:
    http://saltire.weblogger.com/2003/09/17#a776
    has a fairly authoritative background on the functions on the F1 steering wheel.

  125. Here's an exception.... by g00bd0g · · Score: 1

    I work for Easy Racers, we race streamlined bicycles. In 2001 Reynard, a renowned racing car chassis builder, tried to compete. They had Sydney Olympic Gold Medallist Jason Queally and a $250,000 budget. The result? They failed to go as fast as our record set 15 years ago in our Gold Rush streamliner.

    No doubt that if more companies jumped in and threw money at it a similar effect to the F1 cars would occur. But for now, money means nothing...

    Gabe

  126. two questiona for NASCAR fan by kill+$(pidof+explore · · Score: 1
    I talked with another NASCAR fan once when I told him I watch F1 instead of NASCAR, he talked about how great NASCAR is and said "you can tell which team the car is immediately by just look at it", is F1 car looks all the same to NASCAR fans?

    I played racing game alot,and feeling that the oval track is most boring one... any comments?

  127. Perfect opportunity for US fans to watch this wknd by dspyder · · Score: 1

    The US Grand Prix at Indianapolis is on this weekend! SPEED Channel is having live coverage all weekend, with the big race on Sunday.

    If you're a race fan of any kind, or just curious about the technology, it's definitely worth checking out!!!

    --D

  128. Eats, shoots and leaves... by ackthpt · · Score: 1
    If the breakaway is 12 minutes ahead 10km from the line, they are not going to be caught, unless they all fall off of their bikes...

    You overlooked the comma. I didn't say they had a 12 min. lead 10 K from the line, but would have a 12 min. lead somewhere prior to that point, like at 80 K to go then get caught near the finish. Typically sprinters teams reel in the breaks on flat courses, climbers reel 'em in on the mountain courses.

    --

    A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
  129. No. It's a contest to see who'll finish third. by fluxrad · · Score: 1

    You forgot Rubens Barichello. The guy's a pretty good driver in his own right and is usually finishing right behind MS.

    Of course it helps that Ferrari doesn't have an engine blow on them every race. Guys like Coulthard and Sato could be much farther up in the points if they weren't running with POS engines.

    At least the WRC is on too.

    --
    "It is seldom that liberty of any kind is lost all at once." -David Hume
  130. WRC tech is much more useful than F1 tech by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Drive an Audi Quattro, Subaru ( especially WRX STi ) or
    Mitsubishi Evo.

    Try to pick a day with rain or snow.

    They will leave a lasting impression on you, trust me.

  131. Clarification re: 'CART' and IRL by FireAtWill · · Score: 1

    CART's assets were bought by OWRS as a means to continue to the "Bridgestone Presents The Champ Cap World Series Powered By Ford". Many 'CART' teams have gone to the IRL - started by the owner of the Indianapolis Motor Speedway - the cause of the current schism in American Open-wheel racing.

    The Champ Car series is still commonly called CART, but that is waning.

  132. Re:The more things change the more they stay the s by CharlieG · · Score: 1

    Well, back in the "Old" days, I'd say the other 2 types of racing that were exciting as F1 were CanAm and the same eras GT/LeMans type cars - the Era of the Porsche 917, for Ford GT40, etc - Each of those cars (along with Ferrari) had a small period where they totally dominated the field.

    --
    -- 73 de KG2V For the Children - RKBA! "You are what you do when it counts" - the Masso
  133. Buttons and knobs by WillRobinson · · Score: 1

    Have been placed on high preformance machinery that has lusers for along time. They do actually nothing. They are there to make the lusers feel like they have some sort of control . . .

  134. Mansell V Mi Andretti by FireAtWill · · Score: 3, Informative

    It's true that Mansell won the CART championship as a rookie and Michael Andretti washed out of F1. But the reasons were more about commitment than the quality of CART's talent pool.

    Mansell moved across the pond to Florida. Andretti tried to commute to Europe from Pennsylvania. Nonetheless, he did earn some kind words of respect from the late great Ayrton Senna, and did finally manage a podium finish before his premature departure from F1.

    However, as an epilogue, it should be noted that upon returning to CART, Michael Andretti won the very first race against Mansell and the rest of the field. In fact, in his second season, Mansell wasn't able to accomplish much at all against the CART field.

    Since that time, CART has had two drivers graduate quickly to F1 success and two who haven't been that impressive.

  135. Re: Damaging, my ass by Coyote · · Score: 2, Interesting

    My God, man. You're watching history being made. Enjoy it.

    If incredibly dominant teams damaged the sport, it would have already been terminally ill after the McLaren/Proust/Senna years when other teams were lucky to finish on the same lap with the leaders.

    --
    My metamoderation cancels your moderation
  136. The greatest truth by BCW2 · · Score: 1

    To make a small fortune in racing, you have to start with a large one!

    --
    Professional Politicians are not the solution, they ARE the problem.
  137. Why not just cap the total amount of money? by caitsith01 · · Score: 1

    Some sports do this to great effect. Here in Australia we play our own version of football and each team is strictly limited in how much money can be spent on player salaries each year. This means teams can either have lots of reasonably good players, some great players and some bad players, or lots of great players if they are prepared to get paid a bit less (which they are, in many cases). It is very effective in evening out the sport, though - while there are some perennial power teams and strugglers, most teams can turn their fortunes around in a few seasons. We also have a preferential draft system that gives priority to the teams that come last - not the American way, for sure, but effective nonetheless.

    Regarding F1, I think there should be a hard limit on spending, not on drivers but on technology. It would still be a technology competition - but part of the restriction would be 'who can build the best car for 100 million a year?'

    Even though, as Toyota is ably demonstrating, money does not guarantee success, a lack of money certainly guarantees failure. Look at Jordan - a few years ago they were in a position of potentially winning races and getting on the podium regularly, and now they are pathetically trailing behind as the big teams engage in a technological arms race. As many people have opined this past two years, it's not that the Williams is getting worse, it's more that the Ferrari is that much better than it was. You only need to look at the laptimes year by year to see that - for example, last race the records were blown away despite the FIA's numerous speed-reduction rules. Sauber is another good example. They basically drive a cut down, out of date Ferrari - and they get whipped by the current Ferrari.

    --
    Read Pynchon.
  138. Yeah right by caitsith01 · · Score: 1

    If Schumi had an actual driver as a team mate then he might not be able to dominate the sport, which neither he, nor Ferrari, nor most of the nations of Italy and Germany want to see. It is widely rumoured/reported that Schumacher's contract used to actually stipulate that the second driver not compete with him. He's not going to 'put his foot down' any time soon. Plus, if he cared what others thought of him he wouldn (a) have crashed into Hill in a championship decider, (b) have crashed into Villeneuve in a championship decider, or (c) be upholding the EU mandated standards for stereotypical teutonic arrogance.

    Of course, almost all other F1 fans would love to see Villeneuve or Montoya or Button driving the other Ferrari... it would almost bring back the glory days of two brilliant maniacs driving each other off the road week after week, a la Mansell, Prost, Senna and co.

    --
    Read Pynchon.
  139. What the buttons do by alwaystheretrading · · Score: 1
    "I love the crazy steering wheel - anyone know what all those buttons and knobs do?"

    Hey, that's easy...
    The green switch activates the nitro
    The blue switch activates OnStar
    The White switch engages stealth mode
    The Yellow switch shoots rockets out the front
    The Red switch is the ejection seat
    The Purple switch releases the oil slick
    The big black button in the center is the horn
    The white button with the ferrari logo is the "Win Race" button.
    The screen in the center is a built in game boy and the remainder of the buttons make up the controls for the game. Of course it comes pre-installed with a race car game.

  140. V12 by caitsith01 · · Score: 1

    Ferrari was the last team to use a V12, and they phased that out quite some time ago (just before they became totally dominant, strangely enough). All the top teams now use V10s, I remember some talk of the lower end teams using V8s but I don't know if any of them actually do at the moment.

    None of the other teams has used a V12 for even longer. You used to be able to tell the Ferraris just by the sound because they were so much higher pitched that the rest of the cars. They sounded great, but unfortunately they broke constantly and weren't all that fast compared to the awesome Williams, McLarens and Bennetons of the 1990s.

    --
    Read Pynchon.
  141. Other exciting motorsport events... by Goonie · · Score: 1
    While the MotoGP is exciting, the 125cc support category is more exciting still if you ask me. The machines are mostly very evenly matched, the limited power places a lot more emphasis on slipstreaming, the riders are mostly young and not particularly sane, and so the racing is really, really close and there's lots and lots of position changes.

    The World Rally Championship is also very cool.

    --

    Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from a rigged demo
    --Andy Finkel (J. Klass?)
  142. The steering wheel explained by asb · · Score: 1

    This is the steering wheel of world champion Mika Häkkinen: http://www.avaruusmies.com/jokes-files/img/135.jpg

    --
    Antti S. Brax - Old school - http://www.iki.fi/asb/
  143. interesting, but by SharpEdges · · Score: 1

    Interesting article, if you are new to formula one, otherwise old news. However, they give too much credit to technology for Michael Schumacher's success and not enough to the man himself. He's literally the most dominant driver of his era and is probably as good as or better than most of the all-time greats as well (though making comparisons across eras given the huge changes in cars is difficult). I'm not really much of a Schumacher fan but to see him as anything other than one of the all time great racing drivers is absurd. He would win with or without his fancy steering wheel and telemetry. Give him four wheels and a gas pedal hooked up to something with at least one piston and he's good to go.

  144. 650kg weight limits by RMH101 · · Score: 1

    the cars are always lighter than the 650kg that's the minimum weight for racing - so they're ballasted down with lead or titanium plates - as low as possible for better weight distribution. the crank's pretty low in the car - hence you can make it *really heavy* and not penalise yourself. you'll just need less ballast for FIA regulation.

    1. Re:650kg weight limits by tiled_rainbows · · Score: 1

      Yeah, but there's angular momentum to think of - a heavy crankshaft will not just add to the overall mass of the engine, but will take longer to spin up to high RPM than a lighter shaft, meaning that it could theoretically affect the rate at which the engine could get up to High RPM, and thus lower the max accelleration.

  145. wrong by RMH101 · · Score: 1

    one of the things max moseley's new regs brought in two years ago, along with banning 2-way telemetry, was banning encrypted comms between pit and car. it's back to the days when you *can* pick it up with a scanner. i'll be doing this next month at silverstone.

    1. Re:wrong by Blademan007 · · Score: 1

      "one of the things max moseley's new regs brought in two years ago ... was banning encrypted comms between pit and car..."

      OK. So it isn't so now. But prior to 2 years ago?

    2. Re:wrong by RMH101 · · Score: 1

      ...it was.

  146. How do.... by goatan · · Score: 1

    You make a small fortune in Formula 1? Start with a large one.

    --
    Saying Apple is better than MS is like saying Botulism is better than rabies.

  147. Buttons everytwhere! by MasTRE · · Score: 1

    > I love the crazy steering wheel - anyone know what all those buttons and knobs do?

    Apparently, one of them is the "drink" button. Awesome!

    --
    Must-not-watch TV!
  148. Re: Software cheats by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I was working at LDRA when the FIA hired us to examine the source code for Benetton and Mclaren. Let me just summarise by saying Schumacher is a good driver but the B194 certainly took advantage of the driver aid bans intorduced that year. Secret engine management traction control and the launch control program found under a secret munu option #13.
    Schumacher wouldn't have had a hope of winning if his car was legal and the result would have been similar to 1993 but with Senna winning quite comfortably in the legal Williams.