Slashdot Mirror
Kevin Free
An anonymous reader writes: "Surely many of you will remember that before there was ever a cry to 'Free Dimitry Sklyarov', Free Kevin Mitnick was the call of many. He was convicted on 'hacking' charges, though many on the Internet found the charges and trial to be unfair. He was freed in January 2000, but not allowed to touch a computer or log onto the Internet until January 20, 2003. See the story at CNN or read some background info at freekevin.com. "
PRAISE THE GOOD LORD, USA!
Wait... you mean free-as-in-beer, or free-as-in-speech?
[PowerPoint] is a tool for capitalist presentation
how long will it take to shake the rust off?
On MSNBC (yeah, yeah, I looked...) that he has just received his Ham Radio operators license.
"As long as defiance continues, they can't claim victory." -Slashdot comment
Say, by watching DVDs on linux, or reading an e-book on linux, or... The odds are stacked against him. I suggest he take up VB.Net classes and work on IE plugins and IIS maintenance.
S
Are you implying that the slashdot crowd could ever forget Kevin Mitnick? I'm insulted
Wouldn't this story be more appropriate on Jan. 20? Or are you setting yourselves up for a pre-emptive Dupe?
"Ask not what your country can do for you." --John F. Kennedy
I am less than sympathetic towards Kevin Mitnick. He committed a crime, and he got punished for it. Poor baby.
However, I think not ever allowing him to use a computer again is a foolish punishment. Computers are too essential to life in America today for that to be a reasonable punishment.
Personally, I would like to see some sort of bargain between the court and Mitnick, whereby he gets to use computers again, but will face an ever tougher punishment if he is discovered hacking again.
Oh yeah, I remember the "Free Kevin" campaign, especially since every issue of 2600 for the longest time had something about it. I remember their big campaign to get Miramax to drop the movie they were going to make about the whole incident, where the "heroic" FBI agent chased down the "evil" hacker, who suprise attacks him and hits him over the head with a trash can lid. Pretty funny. They had a thing on The Learning Channel about him, Woz, and Capt Crunch a few weeks ago, interesting show. You have to respect someone who managed to stay on the run for over a year, create a fake identity, and get a high paying job at a law firm with that identity. Too bad he got caught in the end, after all it was nothing but a set up for the goverment to make an example out of someone...
Sort of like how we take away the driving priveledges of mutliple DUI offenders?
Foolish, right?
Linux - Because Mommy taught me to Share.
He has pulled the biggest con of them all, now they HIRE HIM to do the security.....
Bravo, this guy is a work of art.
Neck_of_the_Woods
#/usr/local/surf/glassy/overhead
while he's been offline and will stick it to the man soon!
-Bob
I am looking forward to seeing what his first experience with, say, Windows XP, or the new version of Mandrake is ...
Not anyone else, perhaps NO one else, was a hard core computer user, took a say .. 10 year break .. and is now gonna be back in the system. Should be interesting to hear what he says ..
Info Week Version, for those slashdotting CNN
Mitnick was freed in January 2000. The terms of his probation, which expire January 20, require he get government permission before using computers, software, modems or any devices that connect to the Internet. His travel and employment also are limited.
Also:
Christopher Painter, deputy chief of the Justice Department's computer crime section and the former assistant U.S. attorney who prosecuted Mitnick, said that once the former hacker's probation is over, he won't be subject to any special surveillance.
"Not any more than anyone else would," Painter said. He added that "if there's any indication that anyone is engaged in illegal conduct, we're going to look into that."
So, it's not all reset-button and blue skies against Da Man. Until Mitnick gets a full-blown Presidential pardon, he's going to remain a marked man.
Mod Karma -1: I sed bad wurds. If I cep my mouf shut, I wud be at riyses.
Geez. That brings back memories. I used to have that yellow and black bumper stick on the back of my car. One summer I was driving to SummerCon, and I was pulled over by a Georgia state trooper, on 85 right outside of Atlanta. He actually knew what the sticker meant, and we discussed the merits of the case. It was a very cool experience and made me regain some trust in our government, all of which has subsequently been eroded. AND I only got a written warning for going 83 in a 70mph speed zone. Hell yeah.
The FBI took all my computers from some bullshit. This was a year ago. They told me I'd have it back in 6-4 weeks after they ANALYZED it.
Whatever the fuck that means.
When do I get my shit back! Free me!
The theories do not change over time. Though there may be new languages, methods do not change much.
This is like someone asking, "are you a mainframe group or a PC group?" Most of it is the same, except if your mainframe crashes, heads will roll.
Fight Spammers!
Another version of this story was posted on CNET news. Where he states how he's going to raise money for his $16k legal fees, making corporate videos for how to not be socially hacked.
If there is one thing at all notable about the whole thing, it's the ridiculous overreaction of the court during the sentencing.
I for one am getting tired of the term 'hacker' as being a bad thing. Mr. Mitnick is probably the world's first high-profile 'Social Engineer' and overt detective. What he did was to satisfy his own curiousity (-2, sp?) and dig into that which interested him.
He stepped on some toes, and pissed off people with his 'information wants to be free' attitude. I don't advocate what he did over the way he was treated, but let's use some judicious thought processes before we go lauding or condemning EITHER side. He'll become a productive member of society, even if it is just for the novelty of being 'allowed' to use mainstream communications devices (re: telephones, HAM radios, computer terminals, etc.)
1. People glorify criminal activites all the time. Turn on a TV or watch a movie.
2. It's not stealing, it's copyright infringement.
GPL zealots are few but loud. Ignore zealots of all kinds, they are not logical.
Story here. in it, Darci says:
"In totality, defending himself in the FCC case, cost Mitnick approximately $19,000, making his license the most expensive one in America. He is currently selling items on eBay to recover the costs incurred in this action. He is also still accepting donations to his FCC defense fund."
anyone else seen this movie and noticed a striking resemblence to mitnick's story? i mean replace the check forging with computer hijinx and you've got the same story down to the excon working for his enemies!
..then let's free EVERYONE who commits acts of unauthorized breaking and entering, stealing personal information, etc.
It's amazing how much sympathy has poured out for a guy who stole people's credit card numbers...
--- Grow a pair, liberals... stop letting the Republicans bully you!
So download all your goat pr0n before Jan 20 ;-)
When I am king, you will be first against the wall.
...that KM will get a lot of special attention from John Ashcroft and the rest of our friends in the guvmint? Do you think someone at a three-letter agency will find a way to classify him a potential terrorist and tap everything he does online for the next 5 years?
... Is here: http://www.labmistress.com/content/pn/html
rtnz
"Not being allowed to use the Internet is kind of like not being allowed to use a telephone," Mitnick said Thursday in a phone interview.
hehe
6-4 weeks?
I can't live the button-down life like you. I want it all! The terrifying lows, the dizzying highs, the creamy middles! Sure, I might offend a few of the blue-noses with my cocky stride and musky odors--Oh, I'll never be the darling of the so-called "City Fathers" who cluck their tongues, stroke their beards, and talk about 'What's to be done with this Kevin Mitnick?'
Now, seriously, what did you mean by 'overt detective'?
I always thought that the idea of freeing Kevin was retarded. I'm not even interested in what he was charged with originally. The guy skipped bail and ran from the law for two years. Why? I'm sorry, but I don't buy anyone's excuses about how there was no way he could get a fair trial under our corrupt, draconian legal system.
The media, for all intents and purposes, keeps the legal system fair. If you are being unjustly accused, there are many American organizations who will work to get the word out about your case, and in these cases justice pretty much always prevails. Look at the Dimitry case; ridiculous charges are leveled at him, Slashdot posts a story about it every two weeks, and in the end he gets off. Now look at Mumia Abu-Jamal; tens of thousands of ill-informed teenagers go around spouting off nonsense about how he's innocent, a search on Google reveals numerous web sites dedicated to his cause, yet almost 20 years after his first conviction, he still sits on death row, and my impression is that that is where he belongs. I've read all the pro-Mumia web sites and I've read a lot of anti-Mumia literature as well. I just don't see any evidence myself that he's innocent.
But back to Kevin. My biggest concern right now is that he learn from his mistakes and his time in prison so that he can find a way to use his obviously great talents for positive things. Look at Kevin Poulsen, one of the more famous hackers of the early 80's. He got caught, plead guilty, served a short prison sentence, and now does great computer security research for Securityfocus.com, among others. I have respect for him. I don't have much for Mitnick.
-- Have you ever noticed that at trade shows, Microsoft is always the company that is handing out stress balls?
So would it be social engineering if I satidfied my curiosity by going into your house and looking around at your stuff? Maybe taking what I wanted? Face it the man was a criminal.
How did this loser get to be a hero? He's a thief, a con man, and a crybaby. He's not even much of a hacker, he stole cell phone accounts and got other information by conning people, not by devilishly clever hacking. He got off way too lightly.
Surely many of you will remember that before there was ever a cry to 'Free Dimitry Sklyarov', Free Kevin Mitnick was the call of many. He was convicted on 'hacking' charges, though many on the Internet found the charges and trial to be unfair. He was freed in January 2000, but not allowed to touch a computer or log onto the Internet until January 20, 2003. See the
>
>
Kevin Mitnick was a theif and a fool. He wouldn't have given a shit about any of his "supporters" if positions were reversed and it really amazes me to see that there are still some morons who haven't copped onto this fact.
He's a fucking piss ant that deserves to be in jail. While we're all trying to accomplish something using computers as the tools that they are, he and those like him do nothing but add to the overall cost (in terms of time) of using a computer.
Yah, I know the argument -- guys like him show us the holes, blah blah blah---how about showing us by fixing them or starting your own consulting company.
Crackers are nothing more than talented people with out enough imagination to create something useful.
nohup rm -rf ~/. >& zen &
...by the Internet of 2003?
Kind of like the unfrozen guy on South Park, who was from a time when the Internet was slow and hard to use (1996)...
that he's been /.-ed? I mean, he can't very well look it up himself until January 20, can he?
Sometimes I worry that I'll develop Alzheimer's disease, but no one will notice.
Kevin was on Off the Hook recently, talking about how he's owned a laptop for a year now, and he's just not allowed on the internet. When asked by a caller what OS he used, he said he used to use SunOS and VMS back in the day, but now he uses Windows XP and thinks it's quite nice. Really sad, actually.
Was he interviewed on Slashdot concerning his charges and what not? I seem to remember someone who was charged with almost the same thing on here.
Anyone else know what I'm talking about? Possibly a link to the story?
No, dear God, don't let it be true! This woman would go down into the history books...
From the Article: "Mitnick, who began using ham radios when he was 13, said it cost him more than $16,000 in legal expenses to convince the FCC to renew his license. Typical renewals are free. "It's the most expensive amateur radio license in the world," Mitnick said. "
Though I think it's bogus that the FCC requires that you use windows to access their site: article
Shop smart, Shop S-Mart.
The quotes prove the opposite of what the poster claims -- Mitnick is actually as free as any of us on 1/20/2003.
Jeez! learn to read!
be caught again, because he thinks what he did was not a crime. The next time he will be shot.
In this administration, what is worth respecting? The abrogation of basic civil rights? Tax cuts for the wealthy, very wealthy and super wealthy? The war against terrorism that hasn't found Osama or Mullah Omar? The economy going into the W dip (recession, slight uptick, recession). Imperial presidency? Republican controlled Supreme Court choosing the president?
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Kevin won't tell the US govt. some of the passwords for encrypted stuff on his computers and if the NSA can read it they aren't saying.
So, they've decided to adjust his attitude by kicking his ass as hard as they are legally allowed.
It's Christmas everyday with BitTorrent.
Are you in charge of maintaining and storing the database? If not, then it isn't your problem, is it?
If he had been caught while Bush (dubya) was in power, he would have been sent to Camp X-Ray for "terrorist activities".
The Welkin: Online Music Reviews
Kevin was in the DC area for his book signing tour "The Art of Deception" in November this year. He showed up at the DC2600 meeting and hung around for a while.
;-).
Very personable, helpful, nice guy. No, he did not talik me out of any cc#s or pws, hehe... well... I don't think he did...
I spotted him walking through the food court and said "Hey, there's Kevin", he circled around a few times, guess he did not hear me calling his name, and he sat down and stayed for the meeting. As would happen, it was the smallest meeting in years, only 3 of us were there before Kevin got there and I don't think the count got above 15 all night. Go figure.
Several of us got him to sign blank CD-Rs (he wrote "this is not my data" under his signature. He also gave away copies of his book (free as in bird
I got signed disks for my son and me, then many of us went to his book signing at Microcenter the next day. He drew a pretty large crowd there too. Bought 2 copies of his book, one for me one for my son and added the signed stuff to my son's Christmas stuff.
A few years back I helped out with the "June 4th, Free Kevin" demonstration in front of the US Supreme Court, was glad to finally meet him in person.
Eve Fairbanks says I drive a hybrid!LOL
I listened to an interview with Kevin last week on NPR (National Public Radio in the US). Since the beginning of the year he has been allowed to use a computer to write a book. Part of the deal was that he not mention it to the press. Well, his probation officer accidently mentioned it in an interview so the cat is out of the bag.
"God fights on the side with the best artillery." - Napoleon, Marshal of France - speaking truth to power
I was busted hacking MCI and ATT in 84 for long distance codes(for phreaking purposes), which I then used to call bbs'round the world. I also was accused digging around in patient info in two local hospitals.
//s,Trs80s, and one Commode 64.
I was all of 14. I could pass myself off as a bell employee, had a valid ID. I was able to get a list of celeb phone numbers and harass them in a 14 year old manner.
These are all true.
1. Yoko Ono- Asked her to send me nekkid pics so I could start a bulemics club using her photo instead of stinking fingers down our throats.
2.Don King - Called him and home and asked who did his hair cause I wanted a similar doo.
3. Joan Rivers, just to tell her she was a hag.
Busted into teleconferencing systems, wreaked havoc with corporate PBX's.
I did all of this stuff with a group of friends, we social engineered, brute force attacks, all done from a hodge podge of Apple
We had a great knowledge base of other hackers plus bell lineman headsets, phone company gear.
In short we had a lotta fun and did a lotta damage to companies. 250k in phone charges to MCI alone, and the only reason we got caught was because an early 80's version of a script kiddie turned us in.
Fortunately most companies were amused, we showed them our exploits, they made us promise not to tell, and cut deals the FCC and with our parents not too let us touch comps for 5 years. No court, no fines, nothing. A little tiny slap on the wrist.
And I was very angry then. Now I fondly look back on that time with a grin(as do my parents NOW) and thank god my parents did not have to shell out 250k for the hacked codes, or for the 500 floppies of pirated software, or my ten meg drive fulla of bomb plans, software, and general mayhem.
Point is that we can do a lot of damage with our curiosity. Mitnick had others peoples code, compromised systems, and got busted. You do something illegal, and especially in an industry with closely guarded secrets you are going to get burned, and deserve punishment. It could be corporate espionage or selling out to a foreign power.
AS for the security not being good. If I walk into the 7/11 and Apu is in the bathroom and I know I can walk over and steal a bag of funions and a Big Gulp without paying, does it make it right? If I know I can bust into a system and take whats not my mine? Does the crime justify my curiosity?
If I get caught speeding can I tell the cop that I was just seeing how fast she goes, just this one time?
He knew he was wrong, and looking at his crimes, he messed with some big players, and felt the heat. Albeit some of it might have been unecessary, but a message was sent.
As for Kevin, he just built on a culmination of tools and tips that others had been sitting on for years and using. I do not see any shining brilliance, just a very intelligent guy who used availible tools. Like Linux and UNIX tools. Making use of availible resources.
Social engineering is a tool employed by charming people and sociopaths. I, unfortunately, know it is one of my great skills, but rarely trot it out anymore.
We all wanted to be David Lightman and see Protovisions latest games. And Lightman got bit in the ass wy a WOPR(always wanted to say that)
And in the old days the spirit of hacking was fun. We did get into systems, the phone company, build blue boxes(and the other ones) stole payphones and hooked them up at home, hacked the blue special box at kmart to turn it on by remote(best hack ever). And in the day we policed ourselves.
Puto
The Revolution Will Not Be Televised
You either didn't understand what I wrote, or don't read very closely before you post.
I DO NOT ADVOCATE WHAT HE DID OVER THE WAY HE WAS TREATED. Both sides were wrong, in my opinion.
He was a social engineer (i.e. - CON MAN)
Yes, he was a thief.
Yes, he is a common criminal.
His punishment did not fit the crime.
There was and still is too much hype surrounding the whole affair.
I'm sorry if you misunderstood my post(comment). Lighten up and read.
Hope that $16,000 Vanity Call was worth it...
http://www.qrz.com/detail/N6NHG
Actually he was granted the use of a laptop in order to write his book, he just can't use the internet for a few more weeks.
Just think of how much SPAM he has!!!!
Great Linux Site
How does that work exactly?
;)
>telnet internet
MOTD follows:
Welcome the to the Internet!
All activity is logged
LOGIN:
Username:
Yeah, just like he can whistle nuclear launch codes into any telephone.
invading countries in the name of oil companies
Umm. When did Bush say "I hereby invade country X in the name of oil company Y"?
Which country are you referring to?
Which oil company?
"bombing innocent people"
You mean the Canadians? Sorry, accidents happen. The pilot who did it got punished.
Or did you mean the Afghans who cheered in the streets after the US liberated them?
Just curious.
The article mentioned Kevin's radio show on KFI, but sadly it was canceled months ago. It was a fun show run loosely with guest interviews, call in questions, and general advise. Kevin handcuffed by his not being able to touch computers and such had various co-hosts that would handle the keyboard for him. The show was on around 4am Sunday morning so it wasn't like it was chewing up prime time, but KFI still canceled.
Now KFI is the usual lame ultra conservative crapola, and the computer comedian Jeff Levy. Levy is hilarious to anyone who knows anything about computers. Poor saps who don't know less than Levy call in for help. They are mainly told to reboot, reinstall, and buy my sponsors utilities. Perfect exmaple of the blind leading the blind.
The deal was that the gov't wouldn't return his equipment unless he first allowed them to decrypt its contents. This sounds draconian but it consistent with the rule they won't return evidence that may be or contain contraband. There could be more credit card #'s, security hacking info, etc. So he was free to keep his passwords, but not to get his stuff back if he wouldn't allow it to be searched, I would suppose because some of the encrypted info is incriminating for even more offenses. It's a bed of his own making, and not a rule written for Mitnick alone.
As for keeping his hands off computers, it was an odd condition, but bear in mind this was his second conviction -- he wasn't learning.
Of course, until we have a real AI personality, this send of free isn't appropriate to thinking about software, while the other two are. Are you incapable of making this distinction, or just being deliberately dense?
I do like the idea of adding more kinds of free to the mix, as well as poking some fun at those who take themselves too seriously, but I think it needs a little work to actually be funny.
that's right. buy sum Godless, ill eagle, payper liesense, hostage ransom, stock markup felons. that's who?
nothing gnu about that dough.
mod US up robbIE. J.'s STILL getting his pocket picked DOWn here. we won't mention lairy again, honest.
Okay, no one is calling him a hero. But look at the sentence he was handed. For "stealing" thousands of dollars' worth of software that was later released as FREE as in source? Oh, yeah... You have to charge someone with a crime within DAYS, not YEARS. And about this whole "Kevin is such an evil guy" reading other people's data... He checked out Shimmy's data and Shimmy got mad but what the FUCK was Shimmy doing? Developing packet analysis tools for the US Government to read data without authorization! The irony of a man who is an enemy of the people trying to act like a hero for tracking down Mitnick... Let's not forget John Markoff falsely claiming in the NYT that Mitnick broke into NORAD... Give me a fucking break, it's not about Kevin being a hero, it's about how being a bit inquisitive gets you a disproportionate amount of jail time, under circumstances where the guy who busted you is MORE morally culpable than you, and the authorities keep you until they can properly invent what to charge you with.
You know, I used to think Mitnick was a myth in man form; not necessarily a man that didn't exist, but one that oozed some intangible breed of talent, but then I began seeing him on television and hearing him speak. Weirdly enough, he appears to have zero depth of character and he keeps recycling the same dead "social engineering" story everytime a camera is pointed at him. Kevin Mitnick is a terribly simple man with outdated arguments who, perhaps by virtue of brain atrophy as a result of his extended incarceration, has lost his ability to formulate complex arguments.
Perhaps it was John Markoff's ability to lay on the superlatives. Perhaps like Keven claims, all that stuff in Cyberpunk was, um, bunk.
And check it out, the man plans to open a security firm so he could consult people on how to avoid social engineers, no doubt! He has nothing in the way of skills anymore, if he ever had skills!
I read the first chapter of Mitnick's new book, The Art of Deception. Helluva lot of first person pronouns in that mother, I'm telling ya. Lots more than Tsutomu Shimomura's "Takedown." And there are a lot of silly social engineering "scenarios" in that book that gives the book a HOWTO feel for adolescents! Kinda like 2600 magazine or some subversive text from Loompanics Unlimited. I am thoroughly bored hearing about Kevin Mitnick.
- IP
Can you imagine leaving your email accounts for three years?! He'll have gone over the storage limit a hundred times over, what with the revolutionary new offers for penis growth offers, mortgage payments made easy, and little RC race-cars.
How much email do you think your accounts would collect in THREE YEARS?!
-Trillian
a related story on C|Net.
dd
IIRC Mitnick was held in pretrial detention for ~4 1/2 years, then released on a plea and time served. I spent a while some time ago trying to understand how this happened.
Now, his initially being in detention w/o bail after an extended run as a federal fugitive should not surprise anyone. If you fled you pretty much demonstrated that you are a flight risk.
Also, that we was held longer that the 100-day Speedy Trial Act span is unsurprising because of the numerous "tolling provisions" that can stretch out that time. I think most prosecutions are affected by these.
Finally, that he waived Speedy Trial Act protection is not uncommon and was partly to his benefit, as it gave the defense more time to prepare for trial. In other words, he didn't waive to be nice to the gov't, although he was under considerable pressure to do so.
All this I understand except -- how did it all add up for 4 1/2 years? I have read a ton of criminal cases and never heard of anything like it. I'm not interested in hearing dark conspiracy theories. I suspect it was a failure of the system more than prosecutorial manipulation, and don't want to see it happen again. Was Mitnick partly responsible?
BTW, conditions in pretrial detention may have been better -- prisoners there, being pretrial, have incentive to play nice (I visited one of these places, and it was much nicer than even federal prison) -- and the 4 1/2 years may not have been excessive for his second offense, his flight, and other aggravating factors. But I don't think this is the right way to be doing things -- it would have been lovely if he proved to be innocent.
.. Just on TECH TV last month. So he wasn't allowed to touch a computer then????
And in the day we policed ourselves.
... when your first words were "I got busted..." In Soviet America, they police you....
Whoops! Lost me in this last sentence
Seriously, what d'you think was your turning point? Getting busted, apparently not, because you were still resentful. I doubt kiddie prison would have helped either way to get scared straight or anything; rather you internalized these values at some point. So when did you decide ripping off Apu wasn't OK, even if he was overcharging you for day-old donuts?
He has pulled the biggest con of them all, now they HIRE HIM to do the security..... Where, in Soviet Russia?
True believers seek redemption from the sin of death.
Mitnicks own book
The Art of Deception: Controlling the Human Element of Security by Kevin Mitnick, William Simon & "the Woz" Steve Wozniak.
And a bunch about the case:
The Fugitive Game: Online With Kevin Mitnick by Jonathan Littman
Takedown: The Pursuit and Capture of Kevin Mitnick, America's Most Wanted Computer Outlaw-By the Man Who Did It by Tsutomu Shimomura, John Markoff
and The Cyberthief and the Samurai: The True Story of Kevin Mitnick-And the Man Who Hunted Him Down
If your house is left open and people are kicking it in the back yard and someone comes in and robs your house, oh well, too bad. We used to live in a society where lots of people did live like that. Now our houses are all closed and our doors are locked. And we still have breakins. Because we don't have sentry bots and DNA encoded locks? No, because we have criminals who take advantage of security holes, however huge or minor, and it is their fault, not ours!
Yes, let's all go back to the Wild, Wild West.
Here's a clue. Mother nature always builds a better mouse to circumvent man's best mouse traps. There is absolutely no such thing as enough security precautions in this business. So if someone breaks into something, by your logic, it's always the fault of the victim.
So what do you say I break into your house and we declare it yourfault? After all, you didn't have enough security to keep me out. And hiding behind the law is like totally uncool, so let's keep the cops out of it.
BTW, nice stereo...
--- Grow a pair, liberals... stop letting the Republicans bully you!
I'd have bought bumperstickers and picketed for Skylarov (if I felt it would accomplish anything), but not for Mitnick. The fact that Mitnick was abused by the legal system after being caught does not change the fact that, to my mind, he was a real criminal, and Skylarov was not. That's based on my own moral and ethical sense, of course, and I am no lawyer, but it's something I feel strongly about.
Get off my launchpad!
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Its ironic that the same person who cliams :
One, that he did not get a trial..bu tforgot to mention that he waived jury tiral..
Two, that government was lying about costs of traking him down and keeping him out of omcputer systems..
Now hgets paid to keep others out of computer systems.. the very labor cost she objected to in his own trial!
My prediction is that he wil not stay off probation long..too many twists upon ones self to trust..
Don't Tread on OpenSource
Keep at it, tyke. You'll learn vi yet.
Here are some pointers... You can abbreviate 1,$ to %. And it isn't necessary to match the entire line AND place the 'g' at the end -- either one will suffice. You can achieve the same effect with fewer keystrokes with either of these examples:
Of course, that will leave a bunch of empty lines; is that what you really want? If not, maybe you should try:
Or even:In the end the most priceless and biggest con that Kevin pulled off was on you.
He got sympathy by choosing to delay his trial and sentancing, he committed the crimes and knew he was caught. Instead of pleading guilty he delayed his trial sufficiently that he got SYMPATHY from you.
It really was the greatest scam he pulled off.
So, in the end, he spends 5 yrs in jail and retains the right to make money off the same people he screwed over in the first place and you people hand over cash to him for it.
pitifull.
I'm trying hard to figure out why I'm supposed to be happy that Kevin Mitnick is finally going to be able to touch a computer again, or even why I'm supposed to care. Why is this guy such a hacker icon? As far as I'm concerned, he's an idiot more than he is some Jesus-like hacker dude.
Everyone does something stupid at least once in their life. I've broken into systems in the past, but it was just to see if I could do it. I wasn't out to prove anything to anyone else, and it only took me a short while to figure out that busting into other computers is, a) stupid, b) boring, c) seriously illegal. I had the sense, somehow, even after the first time I did it, not to do something really dumb. Dumb, like create havoc and taunt the feds, and keep on with it even as they mercilessly hunt you down.
Can someone explain to me why Kevin Mitnick is someone to revere, and why we should care that he's not still rotting in prison, much less able to use computers again?
I beat kevin will end up back in jail for downloading, if not even sharing (OMG!) a mp3. That will be something worth protesting.
I said there we had a hodge podge of machines in our group. I had an Apple ][ with a 10 meg Corvus drive. Never said I had a Commodore. My bad for not saying for what comp I had. There was also another company that built harddrives for the Apple then, they were external,well they all were. Can't remember their name.
And before you call bullshit, read the article. And if you want to call me a liar, do it with your own handle. I posted with mine.
Puto
The Revolution Will Not Be Televised
I think the most important thing about freedom of speech is that we excercise it with honesty. Speak critically of the government (and it's officeholders) but do it honestly. Say Bush messed up but only when it's true.
/.) these days: people will lie, fabricate, stretch the truth, exagerate, or whatever you want to call it in order to further their own viewpoint. Lying is the opposite of the truth and only serves to move us farther from the truth when the truth should be our goal, IMO. I am constantly called a liberal by those who are blindly fighting for the conservative team and am called a conservative by my liberal friends because I refuse to take crap from either side in washington. I call it like it is, whether I voted for the guy or not. Politics should not be a team sport.
That is my biggest problem with political discussion (and MS vs *nix when
The truth doesn't care what I think.
Here is a link to the dept of justice site that actually gives the facts. Gee, wouldn't that be different, eh? The facts that is...
Here's a nice snippet backing my statement:
Mitnick was sentenced today by United States District Senior Judge Mariana R. Pfaelzer. The 46-month term was agreed to by Mitnick and the United States Attorney's Office. Mitnick was previously sentenced by Judge Pfaelzer to an additional 22 months in prison, this for possessing cloned cellular phones when he was arrested in North Carolina in 1995 and for violating terms of his supervised release imposed after being convicted of an unrelated computer fraud in 1989
Because, if he is, I see no reason to rejoice about his regained freedom. One can hope that his time in jail has afforded him the opportunity to pay his debt to society and to mend his ways. Cheering Mr. Mitnick because he committed his crimes using his computer is disingenious, to say the least.
Closing ranks is one thing; embracing crookedness because of a shared trait is an altogether different issue.
Jon Johnson and elmsoft did nothing but *read some files that were originally encrypted on their own systems!
The DMCA is absurd and I do not like comparing the 2 arrests. If we support anyone who hacks then no one will take us seriously when an injustice occurs like the case with Jon Johnson and Elmsoft.
The difference between the cases are night and day and the doj actually had a legitmate case with Kevin.
http://saveie6.com/
but the girls just laugh when I ask them for money.
The truth doesn't care what I think.
that's right, due to J. Public's ongoing outrage, at having his "future" pulled out from under him, buy felonious stock markup FraUDs, & the continuing ill eagle "collaboration" between yOUR fudderoll gov't., & the FraUDuleNT kingdumb of fud, there's going to be some real changes coming soon.
it's times like these, where some folks with intelligence, integrity, & yOUR interests at heart, should be called upon, to try to help to drag US out of the immoral cesspool of Godless deception, the rest of the wwworld sees US as trapped in. right robbIE?
right, isn't that the guy who ran for president before?
i think he was blacklisted up on capitoll hill quite a while agoo.
he has some good ideas, but his name has been blackened buy those who would be eXPosed disempowered by implementation of his type of thinking/programs. you should put a link up to his website, if he's allowed to have one.
i DOWt his reputation could be much worse than that of those "in charge", WHOaRE trying to billed some phony momeNTdumb, while they plan their escape.
In other news, the FBI's "Carnivore" system is experiencing malfunctions, and was taken offline Saturday. The FBI denies allegations of an intrusion.
Also, though there was no physical violence, I would not refer to the last bit of succession as peaceful. The Constitution was rent asunder by the "Supreme Court" in the most stunningly partisan bit of thievery in years.
Whatever problems there are with the system, the comments were specifically and directly aimed at the current administration. It deserves no respect. 100% screwup.
According to an interview with Kevin on "The Screen Savers" he won't be free as in speach for some time yet.
It appears there's a "gag order" attached to his deal that forbids him from telling his story for a few more years yet.
He'll be back on the internet, but he can't talk about it.
KFG
Sun didn't claim he did millions in damages. The feds did. The feds asked Sun, Novell, etc.. how much the software Kevin copied cost to develop, and then used that as a figure to charge him with theft.
Kevins lawyer accurately pointed out that, as these companies never reported these supposed "thefts" to their shareholders in their annual reports, as required by law, either there was no theft, or all of these companies were in serious breach of securities laws.
He didn't steal the numbers. He had possession of them, as did just about every decent hacker of that time period. The list of numbers was available from a number of different sources. The real criminal who got away with something here is Netcom, who had the list of credit card numbers available in unencrypted form on a computer connected to the Internet. If one of the numbers was mine I know exactly who I would be upset at: Netcom, for doing the electronic equivalent of leaving my information next to an open window. Kevin was probably one of hundreds of people who had that list of numbers, yet he seems to be the only one who did any time for it.
You know, things always get marked down substantially after a holiday, but Free!?!!?
To the tune of King Whatsizname
Kevin Mitnick is now free
from his pro-ho-ba-tion
hack away with mirth and glee
and keyboard masturbation
Will he hack the New York Times
to show he's really pissed off?
Or visit lots of gay porn sites
and charge it to John Markoff?
Free Kevin..... .. ... inside every pack of cornflakes.
(Spudley Strikes Again!)
I had a similar albeit vastly lamer experience. I was lucky enough to go to a private school that specialized in science and technology. As an insecure kid I wanted to find out more about my classmates, and partially inspired by Enders Game I used a few tricks to get root access to the teachers server. In the end I learned a lot about technology and about people but mainly I got burned. I was disappointed because schools don't keep records on students beyond report card grades and comments, but even though the information I was looking for didn't exist I kept hacking. I would LIKE to say that I did it out of curiousity but think I did it because it made me feel powerful. If I was curious about how the systems worked I could have asked the admins (who I considered friends) and I'm sure they would have given me the opportunity to play around all I wanted. I kept my misdeeds a secret for an entire year, and then after I graduated bragged about them to someone I hardly knew, who through sheer incompetence managed to get himself caught immediately. Of course, he blamed me quickly and I got burned. It ended up ruining a few relationships and getting me in a crapload of trouble. I admire the misdeeds of John "Cap'n Crunch" Draper and David Lightman as much as the next geek, but I don't buy their excuses any more. I think that like me they were hooked on the feeling of power they got from hacking, and power is not a good enough excuse to get away with a crime. In the end I'm impressed by some of what Kevin Mitnick accomplished, but I don't have any simpathy for him. He acted like an asshole and he helped to create this whole atmosphere of fear around hacking.
... I feel sorry for the dude cuz he has a *lot* of catching up to do... and maybe that's why his legal punishment was (for once) so appropriate?
Now, if only our legal system had a way to make the punishment fit the crime in all other areas also...
Disregarding for the moment any questions of evidence, proof of guilt, circunstances, trial, etc. The sentence that Mitnick served was possibly one of the hardest that any (geek, nerd, etc.) could serve, IMHO eg, being starved for information.
(waves) Hi Kevin!
C|N>K
Kevin frees YOU!
YES, there is a McDonald's in Hanoi Square.
Everybody should go buy Freedom Downtime. It's a two hour long documentary on the Free Kevin movement. There's also a lot of info on the injustice down to Bernie S. This is a great and entertaining way to learn the facts about how the (in)justice system screwed Kevin Mitnick.
Phone rings...
FBI: We are the FBI and we are here to help... We want to get a tap on KM's data. we want it all logged.
Tech: You'll have to wait in the snoop queue.
FBI: We are the FBI, you can't make us wait!
Tech: The NSA guy is here in person and he claims he's 1st.
FBI: *&#*-*!
[Door breaks down. Men with large guns enter]
DHS: We are the Department of Fatherland Security, were here to help.
[Poor phone monkey gets nailed by a stray bullet]
DHS: Give us a tap on KM's data NOW.
NSA: we were here 1st and were with the NSA
DHS: Ours is bigger than yours!
[Much machoism is displayed with people wiping out badges and such]
Meanwhile in another room....
Corp Dude [from Sun or Nokia or NEC its hard to tell]: So its all taken care of now? You'll let us no so we won't get embarrassed again?
BOFH: Yes it is all taken care of, we will make sure your alerted to any hacking attempts you need to know about. Let me put down these money bags, they are getting heavy.
Maybe being his ISP wouldn't be so bad...
I forget the URL, but it was in the chapter of his book that was "lost in the edit" but ended up on the web. I forget the URL but it should come up here again during the discussion.
Personally, I believe him. He was a social engineer, not a technical hacker and very good at it too, causing no end of problems to a number of companies. However once caught, he was labeled as 'extremely dangerous' and caught up in a circus where he was first banned from using the phone as well as the computer. I don't believe he was innocent one little bit. At the same time, certain persons involved in prosecuting the case were busy trying to use him to promote themselves. Innocent, he wasn't, but he was treated badly by an incompetent justice system.
See my journal, I write things there
We all know he broke the law and didnt get a trial; But just because he was put their for hacking doesn't mean that he is going to do it again. Although many people think that he didnt get a long enough sentence, i think that people need to let things progress. You all know after this he will become very wealthy and be paid by somebody to hack for them!!!!
Kevin Mitnick is no hero, except maybe to script kiddies and people who LIKED the movie Hackers (for any reason other than Angelina Jolie that is *schwing*). It is because of people like him that the word 'hacker' is in common mis-use to describe a computer criminal when we all know that 'cracker' is the correct term.
I have zero sympathy for him. He was not wrongfully accused. The things he was convicted of are the things he did. The punishment that was met out was harsher due to his celebrity status, but if he couldn't do the time, he shouldn't have committed the crime.
I'm pleased that he seems to have changed his ways. I'd be even more pleased if he would take some time to chastise those who praise him for his former deeds and remind them that breaking into other people's systems and being destructive is not a glorious pursuit, but done by pathetic losers with an inferiority complex. Anyone can break and destroy. True talent is held by those who can create. Mostly I'm glad that his probation is almost done because I get sickened every time some punk posts "Free Kevin!" crap.
Muslim community leaders warn of backlash from tomorrow morning's terrorist attack.
Mods, make up your mind... this is showing as a +2 Troll at the moment!
mitt nick is a fuckken l4m3r
free dick sucking!!!! p0rn 4 all!
The only time this has happened is to the prisoners at gitmo. Guess what? Due process for American law only applies to American citizens. Give me one example where this has happened to an american citizen under Bush?
And this baseless canned liberal response gets modded +5??? 'Hmm, something something, Bush==Hitler'. And this is insightful?
All the liberals on
Like it or not, millions of people want YOU dead. Whose side are you on?
To mention Kevin Mitnick in the same vein as Dimitry Sklyarov is obscene.
Wonder if this is really Kevin,
does this count as a parol violation?
"Nimis exaltatus rex sedet in vertice - caveat ruinam!"
Yes, your insight is that rape sentences are too mild.
For one thing, "Mitnick would have been better off raping somebody" callously ignores that rape also produces a rape victim.
Also, the severity of Mitnick's sentence has to be understood in light of his multiple past convictions for very similar offenses, back to a juvenile bust. The earlier sentences were light. Clearly his learning curve is not one of the best.
Mitnick is a garden-variety serial felon. If anything his sentence was quite light, especially from the perspective of his victims. He paid what, $4100 in restitution? And he bloody well can "still make a living" doing something else. Preferably something honest.
The statement that you made is completely false, and Kevin was never indicted nor convicted of stealing any credit cards.
It has frequently alleged that Mitnick possessed a file containing credit card numbers. Whether this is true or not, we're not sure; given Mitnick's mendacity it probably is. But for to rebut he was "never indicted nor convicted of stealing any credit cards" is disingenuous and a long way from showing his innocence. The government has discretion as to which charges it brings, and either believed the charges it filed were adequate or did not feel their evidence on this issue was sufficient beyond a reasonable doubt. It is ridiculous to infer innocence as you do ("Don't you think they would have pursued charges for this breach, if they could have pinned it on Mitnick?"). Yeah, OK they couldn't "pin it" -- so what?
That Mitnick never used the file, and that others may have possessed it earlier, or had access to it, is immaterial to guilt. So are his motives. We'll never know, but what we do is sufficiently damning that one hopes it will take years to redeem himself, if he ever does. So far his track record is pretty bad -- how many convictions now? A dozen? Three separate occasions?
You forgot the other moral: Prosecute the Mitnicks.
You have to respect someone who managed to stay on the run for over a year, create a fake identity, and get a high paying job at a law firm with that identity.
... for being a professional liar? Here are some other talented fugitives. Who cares how "bad" they are.
Respect him
Too bad he got caught in the end, after all it was nothing but a set up for the goverment to make an example out of someone...
Not really. This is a guy who fled supervised release, was on his third trip or so through the courts for the same basic offenses, continuing committing crimes on the run, and has shown only the vaguest signs of remorse. That's all without mentioning anything about tech stuff. Yes, they made a great example of him for other prospective fugitives and computer snoops.
DOJ's missteps do not make Mitnick smell like a rose. For perspective the DOJ provides a nice table of cybercrime cases -- Mitnick ("notorious hacker") has ample company.
Kevin will be able to surf pr0n like a madman after January 20th, 2003. I suggest http://www.persiankitty.com :)
I usually don't post "MOD PARENT UP" comments, but this time I think that moderators really screwed up. I think that five out of six Darci Wood's comments in "Kevin Free" discussion with Score:1 and the sixth with Score:3 is simply an outrage, no more, no less.
These are the most interesting comments in this discussion and I've only read them by accident, after clicking "replies beneath your current threshold" link, while as I was browsing at +4 threshold. There are almost 500 comments in this story so far, with over 300 Score:1 comments. That way, if the most interesting comments are at Score:1, together with 300 other pieces of junk, no one will read them. But I guess I'm saying the obvious.
You may mod me down, I don't care, but you're making a big mistake by not modding Darci Wood's comments up in this discussion.
root@aio:~# nmap -sX -iR -p1- # Ho, ho, ho! Merry Xmas, everyone!
There are two things here that I'm genuinely surprised nobody's brought up yet. The first is the book detailing Mitnick's exploits (written, naturally, from the perspective of the victor)-- Takedown, by Tsutomu Shimomura. Those unfamiliar should read it with a salt shaker nearby-- journalist John Markoff is listed as a contributor but he offers more spin than strictly necessary. It also only details Mitnick's crimes, and stops short of any rights abuses he may have suffered. But, it's an excellent primer for security issues and a cautionary tale for security experts.
Secondly, and this is a bit more tongue-in-cheek, what does Kevin think of the security and crypto issues these days? The DCMA springs immediately to mind (given the Syklarov comparisons), but what about DRM? MS's glaring holes and lax patchwork to repair them (i.e. nobody's found it yet so we don't have to fix it)? The teeming throngs of script kiddies who emulate his "work" in order to simply piss off as many people as possible? It would be nice to get some insight from "the bad guy".
"Why Subscribe?" Good question...
Can he use Internet2?
Just wondering...
Not that we're going OT or anything, but I would like to see statistics broken down by circumstances, criminal history, etc. Recall that rape used to be punished by death, esp. if the offender was black and the victim white. It does sometimes draw a life sentence now.
Some BJS sentencing stats. The 1998 stats for state sentencing indicate a mean sentence of 147 months (12+ years), of which on average a prisoner will serve about 60% (7+ years). I'd like to see a graph of the sentences, but that's me. They excluded life sentences from the averages, distorting the mean (IMHO they should have use3d actuarial tables to estimate life expectancy). Finally, the median would be a better measure here than the mean.
ANYWAY I don't see how Mitnick would preferred this sentence. He would have served it in "the big house" instead of pretrial detention and would come away with the tag of violent perverted felon.
The trouble in both cases comes from inconsistent conventions. Either use English conventions or "hackish" conventions, but not both. In hackish, you might have said:
In Standard English, double quotes would have been more proper, i.e.:
In hackish, there are other conventions which might have proven helpful. Perhaps using [period] to specify the "." character, for example.
Note also, that although the sysadmin constructed the message, it was intended for an audience more versed in Proper English than various computing-derived variants of the language, and so the sysadmin did "The Right Thing" in choosing the path of least surprise. If a trailing period were the last character in the password, then perhaps an extra bit of prose could have made that sufficiently unambiguous.