Nintendo DS Gets Sleeker Final Design, Same Name

Ravi Hiranand writes "Nintendo has announced the final name of their Nintendo DS handheld, and it will be called... Nintendo DS. The final design of the system is viewable on their official site (screenshot) - looks sleeker and far less chunky, but still a bit awkward. There's also an English-language press release full of waffly language, but the only things you need to know are that there are 120 DS games in development (20 from Nintendo) and that the price, release date and launch lineup will be announced later."

Comments

May I be the first to say...

[funny-jack]

...dang, that is hot.

I WANT ONE.

Re:May I be the first to say...

[Anonymous Coward]

...dang, that looks like a 1980s donkeykong handheld (scroll down)

Crushing any competition

[darth_MALL]

Offering 100+ games in the early stages of this things life is going to cement them a damn nice seat in customer heaven. They must have a lot of faith and support from the devs that this thing will be a hit. Good for them.

Re:Crushing any competition

[Maestro4k]

• Offering 100+ games in the early stages of this things life is going to cement them a damn nice seat in customer heaven.

Actually I wonder if it might not help at all. The new design seems to be less kid oriented than past Game Boys have been, so it looks like they're trying to respond to the potential threat of the PSP and its much more adult oriented approach. If that's the case most of the existing games aren't going to mean much to adult buyers, they're largely kid focused.

I also doubt parents will be too keen on shelling out money for a slightly spiffier Game Boy for their kids after doing so for the Game Boy SP not that long ago (what's it been, about a year?) It may be a hit but I doubt it'll be a huge hit right after hitting the market, it'll take some time to build up momentum. If Sony gets their PSP to market fairly close to the DS's launch it may further muddy things.

Personally I think the GBA and GBA SP will sell stronger than the DS for a good 6 months to a year, depending on how long it takes for a library of DS-only games to arrive that take advantage of the dual screens.

Re:Crushing any competition

[Mike Hawk]

Likely misleading. If it is backwards compatible they would list all GBA games currently in development as games in development for DS. There is no way there are 120 games in development for DS. I declare shenanigans.

Re:Crushing any competition

[buffer-overflowed]

They also have the (almost) full library of the Gameboy/GBC/GBA since they're supposedly using the GBA processor as the secondary processor.

So, at launch, it'll have 120 games in the pipe and several thousand back-titles already out.

Re:Crushing any competition

[Bloomy]

There could easily be 120 games in development exclusively for the DS, just as there could be 59 games in development for the PSP. "In development" doesn't mean launch titles, and it might not even mean any code has been actually written yet.

Re:Crushing any competition

[darkain]

not too sure about this, considering in the past, they actually mentioned the "existing library of over 500+ titles", so, a much smaller number like 120 may actually be DS games. also, considering how they are churning out the re-makes, a great deal of the games are most likely classic SNES and N64 games.

Re:Crushing any competition

[marika]

I think the fact the the gamecube didn't have many games at launch really killed the console. I think they are trying to do the right move to stay at the top of the handheld consoles.

Re:Crushing any competition

[88NoSoup4U88]

"I also doubt parents will be too keen on shelling out money for a slightly spiffier Game Boy for their kids after doing so for the Game Boy SP not that long ago (what's it been, about a year?)"

Some credit where credit is due : This is not a 'slightly spiffier Gameboy' : Allthough the idea takes us back to the LCD-handheld games Nintendo started with in the digital world ; the possibilities are endless**

** At least alot more than previous monoscreen handhelds had.

Re:Crushing any competition

[Maestro4k]

• Some credit where credit is due : This is not a 'slightly spiffier Gameboy' : Allthough the idea takes us back to the LCD-handheld games Nintendo started with in the digital world ; the possibilities are endless**

The possibilities may be endless but at launch there will be few (if any) games that take advantage of those possibilities. Parents (especially those who aren't gamers themselves) are going to view this as exactly what I called it "A slightly spiffier Game Boy". Possibilities aren't going to matter much to a parent with limited funds and a kid with a Game Boy Advance or SP already.

Re:Crushing any competition

[darkain]

it wont be backwards compat w/ anything before the GBA, so, this will limit it to aprox 500 existing titles, not thousands. still tho, it is quite alot.

Re:Crushing any competition

[buffer-overflowed]

Depends on whether or not they keep the Z80 core in the ARM7 they're using for the secondary screen. I haven't seen a definative yay or nay on that yet.

Re:Crushing any competition

[darkain]

its been offically stated several times, it will NOT include the Z80 instruction set. its more than just the instruction set tho, as it also effects the voltage, as well as the link port wiring. and at this point, there is no need keeping backwards compat, pokemon red/green was remade for the GBA anyways, so, why else would anyone need an older gameboy?

Re:Crushing any competition

[.pentai.]

Do you have a link stating that it won't support original gameboy / color titles?

The people I talked to last E3 stated it would be compat. all the way back...just curious if it's changed, if they were wrong, or if you're wrong here...

Re:Crushing any competition

[Anonymous Coward]

I declare shenanigans

I declare you watch too much SouthPark.

Please at least have the decency to rip off your catch phrases from sources that 95% of the world aren't going to be familiar with.

The AC is the only true non-Karma Whore

Re:Crushing any competition

[Abix1982]

I'm sorry but you're *SO* wrong. Quantity != Quality!

Re:Crushing any competition

[Anonymous Coward]

Once again I will say it. Anyone who uses the expression != is automatically a dick.

Re:Crushing any competition

[tonejava]

I also doubt parents will be too keen on shelling out money for a slightly spiffier Game Boy for their kids

Okay there is the assumption that only kids play GameBoy/SP there. I'm not arguing that yes they do take up a majority of the market but do you really think the PSP is targetted at kids? Looking at the specs of the PSP I highly doubt it.

I think nintendo have done a great job of neutralising the childish look that the prototype had as it aims to bridge the user group across from kids and more senior users.

I was a bit concerned the whole "safety curve" version may be the only version available which definately looks like a kids toy but with the technology embedded in it I think it's much more.

Re:Crushing any competition

[Anonymous Coward]

Too bad there's so many N fanboys around here who have been brainwashed that they can't realise that this is the god-honest truth. You'll be modded down for sure.

I'm so sick of seeing the same damn games for every new nintendo system with just updated graphics. Fer chrissakes, dump the damn mario, metroid, zelda games and come out with something NEW for a change.

Unfortunately, people are so simple they keep falling for the same old rehashes.

Re:Crushing any competition

[PhoenixFlare]

I think the fact the the gamecube didn't have many games at launch really killed the console.

Eh? From everything I can see, the Gamecube is doing quite nicely in about 2nd place, either running neck-and-neck or slightly beating the XBox in the US. And that's to say nothing of Japan, where they're even farther ahead.

Sure, Nintendo has had failures in the past, but with the GB/GBC/GBA, the Cube, and soon the DS, they're not going anywhere for a while.

Re:Crushing any competition

[Anonymous Coward]

The parent is obviously aware that Nintendo can declare that 120 games are in development by "fiddling the numbers" but is saying that it is a meaningless(or close to) statement in that it does not indicate DS only titles that are going to be available on / shortly after the launch

everyone grab a broom!

Re:Crushing any competition

[Rallion]

Quantity may not equal quality, but it sure as hell seems to equal insane sales numbers.

Re:Crushing any competition

[TechniMyoko]

Dont forget, most GBA games are disneyesque license exploitational side scrollers

Re:Crushing any competition

[TechniMyoko]

yellow wasnt, pokemon puzzle (the singular most addictive game known to man) Zelda DX and oracles, thats all the GB/C games I own/care about

Re:Crushing any competition

[squall14716]

I've only heard that it will be backwards compatible with the GBA, but not GB/GBP/GBC. And I don't care, I have a GBC that I never play anyways.

Re:Crushing any competition

[tepples]

pokemon red/green was remade for the GBA anyways, so, why else would anyone need an older gameboy?

You didn't mention Pokemon Yellow: Special Pikachu Edition. Yeah, granted, it's got the same monsters as Red, Green, and Blue. But has Nintendo announced a GBA port of Pokemon Gold, Silver, and Crystal?

Re:Crushing any competition

[tepples]

Fuck Disney and get digital drugs for your GBA.

Re:Crushing any competition

[Anonymous Coward]

Do you prefer <> ?

Re:Crushing any competition

[zonker]

you know, the same thing you said could be said about the ps2 at launch. it's launch titles were pretty piss poor (certainly not taking advantage of the possibilities for a while), but somehow it got to where it is today. i think with enough developer support and backward compatibility it will see the possibilities come to fruition in a short time after launch...

Re:Crushing any competition

[zonker]

please read my article which touches a little on your first sentence here...

Re:Crushing any competition

[Anonymous Coward]

tell that to your average ps2 fanboy. "ps2 has like 200 times more games than your system, so it's better!"...

Re:Crushing any competition

[13Echo]

I agree. Nintendo's Gamecube is certainly NOT a failure. It's difficult to look at it and the X-Box when they are eclipsed by the PS2, for sure. But the PS2 sales have really slowed down significantly, and as a result people are looking for a second or third console.

It's important for people to remember that Nintendo, in spite of not being "number one" in terms of consoles, is still the only one of the three that consantly returns a healthy profit year after year. That is, in part, due to the success of the Game Boy, but the Gamecube is certainly no slouch. It's a great console with some great (unique) titles. As someone that is really enjoying Tales of Symphonia at the moment, I'm glad to be a Gamecube owner.

Re:Crushing any competition

[sindarin2001]

Perhaps you should open your eyes and realize that just because a game uses familiar characters doesn't make the game a rehash. Sure, there are a lot of cookie-cutter sequels out there, BUT THAT HOLDS TRUE FOR ANY SYSTEM. Take a look at what Nintendo did with the Metroid series and Metroid Prime. Still Samus, but it's in 3d with a totally different system of gameplay, and yet it still retains that "feel" of the Metroid series. Perhaps a better example is Wario. Wario has been in countless games in the past, and Warioware is one of the most original games out there. Just because the character is familiar doesn't mean the game is a direct sequel. Perhaps if you'd actually PLAY (heaven forbid!!) some of these "old rehashes", you'd actually understand this concept.

Re:Crushing any competition

[Maestro4k]

• you know, the same thing you said could be said about the ps2 at launch. it's launch titles were pretty piss poor (certainly not taking advantage of the possibilities for a while), but somehow it got to where it is today. i think with enough developer support and backward compatibility it will see the possibilities come to fruition in a short time after launch...

This is true, and there was hesitation in parents to buy a PS2 for kids who already had a PS1 (there still is, I worked at a Wal-mart in Electronics last year while hunting a new job in IT). The PS2 had an advantage of being out of the gate earlier and had time to grow a library of titles that took advantage of the platform before the competition started. Nintendo may not have this advantage as the PSP is slated to come out pretty close to the DS's release. If Sony slips on the PSP release date it will help the DS, but they can't count on that.

Personally I think it'll end up with the PSP creating more of a new market, with primarily adult gamers. Nintendo will continue to enjoy dominance in the kid-oriented handheld market for some time to come. That said, if Nintendo tries to compete with the PSP in the adult market it may shoot itself in the foot pretty badly, they should focus on their strength (kids-oriented handheld gaming) and protect that market segment. Let Sony take the risks financially to establish an adult market, Ninetendo can always try to break into it little by little as time goes by. Trying to do compete for it now will have them sharing the risks.

For what it's worth, Nintendo seems at least partly aware of its kid-oriented approach. Signs of this are the colors of the Gamecube (Purple really isn't appealing for the color of a console for most adults) and the fact that it doesn't have a CD tray, but the pop-open cover to insert CDs. That may sound strange but it's actually a big deal to many parents, younger kids especially are quite good at breaking the CD trays, the Gamecube allows the parents to not have to replace the console as often due to abuse. Unfortunately there are signs that Nintendo is losing this focus (frankly they have the 6-10 or so market fairly firmly wrapped up, whether they realize it or not). They've apparently discontinued the purple Gamecube having only platinum and black available now. The latest redesign on the DS seems very much targeted at adults and not kids. One of the first things I thought of looking at it was "that hinge doesn't look nearly as strong as the old one" and I'd be willing to bet that real-life use (and abuse) will prove that to be true.

I think it boils down to this: Nintendo's not in a good position to fight Sony directly on Sony's terms, they need to protect their strengths (kid-oriented gaming both console and handheld) and push to expand those. Right now it looks like the DS is being positioned to go head-to-head with the PSP, a prospect I'm really not sure Nintendo can win. Losing could spell the end to Nintendo, and remember they've declared the day they get out of the console/handheld hardware market is the day they get out of the gaming business. They won't do what Sega did and start develop their in-house properties for other systems.

GBA Compatible?

[Schnapple]

Do we have a final word on GB/GBC/GBA reverse compatibility? I'd hate to get a GBA SP and then this thing come out and I could have saved my time/money.

Of course that's probably the exact reason Nintendo hasn't said anything (if they haven't).

Re:GBA Compatible?

[harlingtoxad]

Plays GBA carts in addition to DS games last I heard.

Re:GBA Compatible?

[jx100]

Did you miss the announcement of the GBA slot on the bottom? (DS cartridges aren't going to be shaped the same).

Re:GBA Compatible?

[solive1]

According to what I've read around the internet, the DS will be backwards compatible with the GBA. However, older GBC and GB games will not be compatible. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

By the way, I'm getting one of these as soon as it comes out. It looks so much hotter than it did at E3.

Re:GBA Compatible?

[brejc8]

Yes it will. They have included an ARM7 processor on it (doubled the speed too) in order for it to be backward compatable as well as the ARM9 for normal operation.

Re:GBA Compatible?

[acidos]

I remember it being mentioned back at E3 that the DS will have two slots. The primary one will accept DS media. The secondary slot will support GBA/GB cartridges.

I still haven't heard anything about peripheral compatability. Specifically, will I be able to hook a DS up to my Gamecube with the GBA->GCN cable to play FF:CC with it.

Re:GBA Compatible?

[Jeff DeMaagd]

I've never seen anything that said the older games wouldn't work, and it really doesn't make sense, as I thought GBA was a 16 bit superset of the GB instructions.

Re:GBA Compatible?

[solive1]

I've read that the GBA has a chip inside of it that emulates the GBC and GB functions so that the older games can be used in the GBA. The DS will not include that chip (according to my sources).

Re:GBA Compatible?

[gamgee5273]

Nintendo said, at E3, that only GBA games will work. Any of the trade magazine sites can be looked at for that tidbit of info...

Re:GBA Compatible?

[tuffy]

as I thought GBA was a 16 bit superset of the GB instructions

Near as I can tell, the GBA has a custom ARM 7 chip with an embedded Z80 for backwards compatibility with old Gameboy titles. If the DS leaves out the Z80 functionality, it'll lose compatibility with the old Gameboy and Gameboy Color titles. But I don't think there's been any definite word whether that's the case or not.

Re:GBA Compatible?

[darkain]

from what nintendo consumer service will tell you, in their info base, it says GBA games play perfectly, whereas, anything older, will NOT. this is because the GBA has a GBC processor along side it. in the DS, they opted out on continueing to have the aditional CPU used for the GBC. also, there was various other changed in the hardware, such as the voltage differences, as the link port difference.

another note: "the DS does not replace the GBA, but is marketed along side it", and now you know what they mean by that.

Re:GBA Compatible?

[darkain]

the ARM7 CPU isnt just there for backward compat, however, as the ARM7 and the ARM9 are operational at the same time, thus allowing each CPU to be dedicated to a screen.

Re:GBA Compatible?

[Anonymous Coward]

If by sources you mean official statements then you are correct.

Re:GBA Compatible?

[drinkypoo]

With as much power as the GBA has, it wasn't really necessary to include a Z80 but it was the easiest way to guarantee compatibility. If the DS has much more processing power than the GBA, it will be utterly unnecessary to include an actual Z80 to emulate GB and GBC. They'll probably do it anyway though, because a Z80 is so cheap that it might as well be free, they can probably tuck a Z80 core into some corner of one of their custom chips.

Re:GBA Compatible?

[NanoGator]

"Do we have a final word on GB/GBC/GBA reverse compatibility?"

Wait for Spaceworld. Nintendo has repeatedly avoided promising that capability. I think it's a strong possibility, but I wouldn't cash a check based on it. I wouldn't put it past Nintendo to toss it at the last minute, especially if they have trouble reaching their target price.

Re:GBA Compatible?

[RyuuzakiTetsuya]

Game Informer cornered a DS developer at E3 and got him to fess up that yes, the DualScreen is GBC/GB compatable. :)

Re:GBA Compatible?

[PhotoBoy]

This is correct, luckily the current GBA is able to emulate a classic GameBoy perfectly in software (not using the GBA's hardware chip), so I would expect the extra horse power of the DS would easily allow for GBC emulation in software too.

The only limitation to playing GB and GB Colour games on the DS would be having some sort of re-writable media like the flash cards available for the GBA.

Re:GBA Compatible?

[GFLPraxis]

Would this technically be the first dual-processor console?

or at least the first dual-processor handheld?

Re:GBA Compatible?

[Zangief]

Wait for Spaceworld.

You will be waiting a long time. Nintendo won't be making spaceworld this year :(

Re:GBA Compatible?

[Corngood]

There have been plenty of multi-processor consoles, the extreme case being Sega Saturn. The PS2 has a setup similar to the DS, using the PS1 cpu as a programmable IO controller.

As far as handhelds, it may be the first with two proper processors, but I haven't really looked into it.

Oh, now that I have a quick search...

http://www.cyberiapc.com/vgg/atari_lynx.htm

CPU: Dual 16-bit custom CMOS -Mikey and Suzy (16MHZ / custom CPU on its own is 8-bit)

Re:GBA Compatible?

[SirDaShadow]

Would this technically be the first dual-processor console?
or at least the first dual-processor handheld?

Nope. Plenty of 16bit and 32bit machines had additonal processors, albeit more akin to co-processing more than "main" processing (Genesis/MD and Neo Geo,68000 + Z80 for sound, SNES 65816 + SPC7000 for sound, for example)

Re:GBA Compatible?

[tepples]

The only limitation to playing GB and GB Colour games on the DS would be having some sort of re-writable media like the flash cards available for the GBA.

And given how quickly the GBA got cracked, Nintendo's probably going to try harder on the homebrew exclusion front than just the GBA's seek/read bus plus verification of a 192-byte header. Watch the DS's SDish media be signed and encrypted where Nintendo holds the private keys.

Yes, I must have one...

[scowling]

...because two screens are clearly superior to one screen. Logically, this machine must be exactly twice as much fun as a handheld game with only one screen.

I can barely control my excitement, because it is a given that Nintendo will eventually release the QS with four screens. That amount of fun is sure to explode the heads of children and the elderly.

Re:Yes, I must have one...

[underpar]

Isn't the second screen there so you can leave stuff like maps open? That way you don't have to keep going back and forth, right?

Was I not misinformed?

Re:Yes, I must have one...

[irokitt]

Well, I believe it will be up to the individual game design teams, but leaving maps and ilk open would be one use.

Let me know when they port Nethack.

Re:Yes, I must have one...

[goatpunch]

With 2 screens, they can finally do that faithful Donkey Kong Game & Watch conversion that we've all been wating for.

Re:Yes, I must have one...

[Anonymous Writer]

Isn't the second screen there so you can leave stuff like maps open?

The article says that it has touch screens. Perhaps the second screen is meant to have buttons customised for whatever game is being played. This way they could actually be labelled with names to clearly define their function, and they could work like GUI elements like sliders.

Re:Yes, I must have one...

[pHatidic]

How exactly would you propose they port nethack when the controller on goes in the four cardinal directions? I suppose you could hit B and then scroll up and across to where you wanted to go, but that would sort of take the fun out of it...

Re:Yes, I must have one...

[pete-classic]

Yes, but how many asses does it have?

(Image is fairly safe for work.)

-Peter

Re:Yes, I must have one...

[aardwolf204]

We just recently replaced our CRTs with 19" LCDs in the office. Our manager sent a thank you to the CFO who authorized the purchase to say thank you, adding that the increased resolution (1280) enhances productivity. She didnt realize that her CRT could go up to 1600. I was CC'd and as soon as I got the email I went to her office to tell her that with 2 19" LCDs I would be TWICE as productive.

Just Imagine, a screen for slashdot, a screen for work! But no, I'm still using one screen, and every so often I've got to minimize mozilla and get back to the code. :(.

Re:Yes, I must have one...

[88NoSoup4U88]

"The article says that it has touch screens."

IIRC, only the bottom screen is a touchscreen.

Re:Yes, I must have one...

[timts]

thinking about this, viewing video on top screen and surfing web on lower screen would be cool! there's a PDA module to convert GBA to a PDA, not very useful. but for NDS, it has touchpad! it's already a PDA!!!

Re:Yes, I must have one...

[darkain]

ask reggie, i'm sure he has kicked every single one of them.

Re:Yes, I must have one...

[Anonymous Writer]

IIRC, only the bottom screen is a touchscreen.

Having the lower one as the touch screen on the same panel as the controls while viewing the game on the upper screen would be the logical way to go. However, the article says "The unit includes a new storage slot for the touch screens stylus" then says "Dual screens, chat functions, a touch screen...", so it's confusing to tell if the stylus is for the touch screens or if that was a typo and they meant "touch screen's stylus". I presume the second statement "a touch screen" means that the latter is correct and they simply missed an apostrophe, so I think you're right.

Then again, it could all be errors in quotes or translation from Japanese and both screens could be touch screens; both having touch capabilities would just be added functionality that wouldn't hurt. For example, if you were running some kind of paint program for use with the stylus, the upper screen could be used for editing the image, while the lower screen could be used for selecting the editing tool and color. Or the upper screen could be used for selecting text and the lower screen could be used for text entry like the Grafitti area on the Palm handhelds or a screen keyboard. Having a stylus means that it will probably have PDA-like capabilities, and having one screen that doesn't work with the stylus would be a hindrance for it working as a PDA.

Re:Yes, I must have one...

[iphayd]

In fact, they already have the marketing for the QS...

(Picture of the QS with the faces of four television stars, one on each screen)
The Fab Four
Q stands for quad, dumbass.

Re:Yes, I must have one...

[Anonymous Coward]

"Q stands for quad, dumbass."

Yes, but uh, what's the S stand for again?

Re:Yes, I must have one...

[Exatron]

Why not just do it the way most other games do it? Check to see if two directional buttons are in the pressed state simultaneously and then act accordingly.

Re:Yes, I must have one...

[CMRichar]

" That amount of fun is sure to explode the heads of children and the elderly."

Not really. Most elderly people will actually be bitching about how "back in [their] day, their handhelds only had one screen...with four colors, three of which were grey...and the ran on non-rechargable batteries that died every five minutes."

The REALLY elderly will be complaining that back in THEIR day, gaming was done respectably, on the tv. in only four colors. three of which were grey. But they'll most likely be zombies by then, so it'll be OK to kill them.

Re:Yes, I must have one...

[crasher35]

The bottom screen is the only touch screen as far as I've heard. I remember IGN saying that they made the cover that they put over all of their GB screens extra tough on the bottom screen to resist the abuse it would get from constantly touching it. So I guess you don't need to worry about scratching the bottom screen.

Re:Yes, I must have one...

[FryGuy1013]

Back in *my* day, my handhelds only had one screen, four colours, three of which were green and the other was a different green. Of course, I'm only 21 so I don't know..

Re:Yes, I must have one...

[Anonymous Coward]

Which inevitably leads to the rebirth of the VirtualBoy!

Re:Yes, I must have one...

[DeadScreenSky]

Nah, at E3 Nintendo revealed it is just one touch screen. No way they could make that big of a mistranslation. :D

Re:Yes, I must have one...

[Lectrik]

Q is for Quickie, that's good enough for me...
wait...
no...
now i'm going to suffer from an image of Cookie Monster getting... ARGH!!!!

I also need to know...

[DdJ]

...the feature set.

The one thing I'm dying to know that I haven't been able to discover is if this thing will be able to function as a GBA connected to a GameCube. Does it have the connector the Cube uses to connect to a GBA? Can it download code over that port and execute it as the GBA does?

If so, I'll probably buy one. I was going to buy a second GBA just for when people come over to play Final Fantasy: Crystal Chronicles. If this thing can serve that niche as well as do everything else they say it'll do, I'll buy one of these and delegate "backup GBA controller" status to my current GBA SP.

Re:I also need to know...

[GweeDo]

To anwser one of your questions, yet it will have single cart multiplayer like the GBA currently does. As for actually linking, it is all wireless. They have a proprietary system for when you are within 100' and then they offer 802.11 for internet multiplayer from what they said at e3.

Re:I also need to know...

[DdJ]

That's not one of my questions. I want to know if it will do exactly what the GBA currently does, not something like what it does. I already knew you'd be able to play some multiplayer games with one cart. I'm concerned with the mechanics -- will you be able to do it exactly the same way, with the same physical cables, as a GBA? When another participant in the multiplayer game is an actual GBA?

I know wireless linking is an option for the non-GBA titles, for the DS-specific titles. But GBA titles are in general not going to be able to use that. Is that cable port there for them? If so, that's probably enough for cube connectivity, because that's exactly the way the cube connects today.

Re:I also need to know...

[crasher35]

I honestly don't know, but the fact that I heard that SquareEnix is working on Crystal Chronicles for the DS should be enough reason to buy it. Think about it. On the top screen you have the 3D part of the game, on the bottom (which is the touch screen) you have what would normally be the GBA menu and you can connect up with your friends wirelessly or possibly through the internet (considering it is 802.11 compatible).

Here's a link to where I found out... http://gameboy.ign.com/articles/534/534070p1.html

More about the DS here http://gameboy.ign.com/articles/534/534070p1.html.

Re:I also need to know...

[Anonymous Coward]

I remember reading that the Pictochat demo at E3 was using cables instead of the wireless functionality, so cables of some sort can definitely be used with the DS. Given that it would be ludicrous to break compatibility with the GBA cables* when they are making it compatible with the GBA games, it's a safe assumption that you will be able to use the thing just like a GBA with other GBAs or with the Gamecube.

Re:I also need to know...

[Anonymous Coward]

Sorry. I forgot to add my footnote.

The DS may or may not use different cables, but knowing Nintendo, the chances of an adaptor being available are pretty high.

Re:I also need to know...

[tonejava]

It will probably work on the same wireless concept as the waverbird controllers...well it only seems logical doesn't it???

Re:I also need to know...

[crasher35]

Not necessarily as the Wavebird uses an RF signal, while the DS I heard uses a proprietary signal (which many mistake for blutooth) for it's DS to DS connections (I'm not talking about the 802.11 connection). I doubt the proprietary signal is RF as, first of all, RF isn't proprietary, and second of all, RF probably wouldn't be very good for wireless connectivity.

Re:I also need to know...

[tonejava]

Okay, so I was speaking metaphorically, of course they would probably have a special plug for the gamecube, and this still leaves one question about the wireless adaptor for GBA/SP. Is this strictly only for Pokemon LG/FR or will it work provided there is another receiver for any game that has connectivity? Will it be compatible with the NDS? Why would nintendo go and create these options that are totally incompatible with each other?

Lots to think about there....

Re:I also need to know...

[_KiTA_]

Yes, it has the same adapter port the GBA does. All GBA accessories are compatable. You can hook it up to a GC and it acts like a GBA.

I wager it will detect current generation flash carts and prevent them from running, so amateur development might be stifled.

Re:I also need to know...

[tepples]

I wager it will detect current generation flash carts and prevent them from running

People speculated about exclusion of flash cards before the release of both the SP and the Game Boy Player. It didn't happen; in fact, if I remember correctly, TOD was the first thing I ran on my Game Boy Player.

Re:I also need to know...

[SmittyTheBold]

Do you even know what you're talking about? RF = Radio Frequency. It's the onyl game in town for "wireless" connections save IR (InfraRed) connections. Since IR relies on line-of-sight between transcievers, you can bet it'll be RF of some sort.

Re:I also need to know...

[13Echo]

Um...

You do know that 802.11 and Bluetooth ARE RF, right?

Did you think that they used sub-atomic particle transmitters or something?

Re:I also need to know...

[DdJ]

Got a pointer to that "all GBA accessories are compatible" info? I've got link cables, cube cables, a card reader... I'd really like to see some official statement from Nintendo that all GBA accessories are compatible. Or at least a photo that shows the port. Got any URLs? I've hunted for them and been unable to locate 'em.

This is the deciding factor between me getting a Nintendo DS and an old-style GBA with Afterburner. I'll get one or the other, for multiplayer Cube games that use GBAs. If the DS won't work that way, a GBA with Afterburner will be my best bet.

(In this context, tethered to a console, the lack of rechargeable batteries and the large size are simply non-issues.)

Re:I also need to know...

[stonecypher]

No. The DS has no cable slot whatsoever. However, the GBA has had a wireless device for some time now which is usable with all cable-based games, and it is suspected that the N-proprietary protocol that services that is the same which is offered alongside 802.11 in the DS. Nintendo has always gone a considerable distance to maintain backwards compatability in their portable devices, this time going as far as offering two seperate cart slots, and for two generations now including multiple host CPUs to accomodate previous generations. The amateur community believes that backwards connectivity will be offered, but only via wireless. (Because the plug changed between the CGB and the GBA, this means no more network GBC games, as there's no GBC wireless adaptor.)

As far as how the cube connects today, all you need is a device which supports JoyBUS. Cube doesn't care if it's SIO, ethernet, wireless, tin cans and string, maybe even appletalk.

Re:I also need to know...

[crasher35]

^_^' Eheh... guess I was never informed. Now that I think about it, that does make sense. Yeah, I'll shut up now.

Man!

[Anonymous Coward]

It looks like a futuristic Game and Watch :D Maximum respect!

Re:Man!

[marcomarrero]

Yeah.. it's a Game and Watch! First the GBA NES Retro, and now the Game and Watch Retro. The perfect harwdare for emulating Punch Out arcade! And PlayChoice 10 too. :P

It should have really been called G&W retro.. The DS name sounds kind of lame, like an auto trim line. But.. that's ok, Nintendo is targeting the system to people younger than the Game and Watch!

yuk

[Anonymous Coward]

that's ugly as hell

Codename DS

[fbrain]

Its a good job Microsoft project code names don't get taken through to release. XP is easier to type the Whistler.

Any one else know of any products being released with their code names?

I know not all products have code names etc. I'm just interested.

Re:Codename DS

[Axem]

Actually, at some time there were rumors that it would be called the Nitro, which might've been its codename.

Re:Codename DS

[J-Hawker]

Mac OS X ships with code names. Tiger is up next.

Re:Codename DS

[Deadguy2322]

Actualy, XBOX was acodename, but they stuck with it because so many people had latched onto it. This appeared in several articles around late 99-early 00.

Re:Codename DS

[darkain]

the rumor spawned because that is what one of the 3rd party developers slipped up and called it during an interview around E3 time. i *THINK* it was one of the capcom developers, but not 100% sure.

Re:Codename DS

[xNoLaNx]

The Play Station X project ended up becoming popularly called the PSX instead of the PlayStation despite no retail usage of the X in the 'acronym'

Re:Codename DS

[Anonymous Coward]

That means there's a realistic chance that the XBox 2 will be called Xenon (my friend who's addicted to X2 - The Threat found it really funny)?

Re:Codename DS

[Spleener12]

The Playstation 2 was referred to as "Playstation 2" long before its announcement, if I recall correctly. Though I guess that's different- Playstation 2 was the media's name for it back then, not necessarily Sony's code name (if indeed it had a codename at all.)

Re:Codename DS

[Anonymous Coward]

Yup, marketing folks liked the code name for Project Gotham racing so much they kept the name, much to the embarassment of the developers.

Re:Codename DS

[Anonymous Coward]

Actually, that stands for Play Station Xperimental.

Yeah, to the X-Treme, I would imagine.

Re:Codename DS

[Anonymous Coward]

All of the recent Mac OS X updates have been released with their code name - Jaguar, Panther and the upcoming Tiger. The reason Microsoft doesn't release software by their codenames is because we would have 'Windows - We're really going to screw them over this time', and 'Office - This time it won't crash as much'.

Re:Codename DS

[Anonymous Coward]

Actually, the codename for the DS was at first Iris. It was changed to Nitro a while ago (which AFAIK is still the current codename).

(Posting as AC because I'm not sure if that's still covered by NDA)

Re:Codename DS

[M3wThr33]

In the game MagiNation, the main character is named Tony Jones because it was an easy one to think up. It just ended up sticking.

Re:Codename DS

[ildon]

Quake 2 was just supposed to be a working title, and Doom3 was never supposed to have that title. Id went out of their way to call Doom3 "the new Doom game" instead of "Doom3" before they just gave up and stuck with it. I think I remember reading something about Quake 2's tentative title already being trademarked or copyrighted so Id just went with what everyone was calling it anyway.

extra button?!?

[Norb]

one thing i noticed was that button above the d-pad. i hope that is just the power and not like a regular button.. it would suck to have to move your thumb to use that one.

Re:extra button?!?

[MagicM]

If it's a normal button, that would at least give right-handed people some sort of 'fire' button for their left hand.

Then again, I guess there's nothing keeping game developers from showing the game up-side-down, and requiring the player to use the stylus on the 'top' screen...

Re:extra button?!?

[darkain]

are you *sure* about this one? what about that little slider at the bottom to the left of the GBA slot? that seems more like a power slider, than the button above the d-pad being a power button. i asumed it was either select or start.

it would make more sense for the slider to be the power for the device, as that is the same exact location it is on the GBA.

Re:extra button?!?

[Anonymous Coward]

If it's a normal button, that would at least give right-handed people some sort of 'fire' button for their left hand.
It's not visible in the shot, but it does have shoulder buttons.

Re:extra button?!?

[Anonymous Coward]

uhh. .since the button is labeled "POWER" that would lead me to believe its the power button, but you can take that as you wish.

Re:extra button?!?

[crasher35]

look here.
If that doesn't work, then try going here first.

Re:extra button?!?

[MysticalMatt517]

That is indeed a power button. I've looked at a few close up shots and it says "power" on it.
It's probably a good thing it's so far out of the way. It would suck if you could accidentally hit it ;-)

Re:DS stands for...?

[filtur]

I would wager that it stands for "Doesn't Suck." The handheld market is one thing that Nintendo has continued to do well in and not make silly stupid mistakes. (IE, maintain a stranglehold)

Homebrew Coding...

[dmayle]

Let me just say that I want to be one of the first to start doing some homebrew coding on this. I imagine it would work wonderfully as a double-function PDA/Gameboy. What with the Wifi, Blutooth, touch screen, and the ability to scroll a web page across the two screens, I can't wait to get at it...

Re:Homebrew Coding...

[buffer-overflowed]

Plus it'll have enough power to emulate up to the SNES/Genesis. I wonder if we'll be able to use old GBA flash carts and still take advantage of the improved hardware...

Probably not, but it'd be nice.

Re:Homebrew Coding...

[KDR_11k]

The thing allows complete remote-booting over WiFi, so it should be fairly easy to get the code in there once you have the tools to compile it.

Re:Homebrew Coding...

[Anonymous Coward]

Really? Do give us a link.

Re:Homebrew Coding...

[darkain]

you can scratch the blue-tooth off of the list. that was a mistake of an online article that confused "wifi" with "bluetooth", instead of realizing it was really 802.11b. but non-the-less, i want a VoIP application for the DS. i think it would be great.

Re:Homebrew Coding...

[sqrt(2)]

We already have SNES emulation on the GBA

Re:Homebrew Coding...

[DarkVein]

You absolutely MUST implement Dasher text input. There's all sorts of stuff on that site, including pre-compiled demos for most every desktop platform.

Re:Homebrew Coding...

[darkain]

i dont think it has ever been stated if it will boot from both the nintendo wireless protocol AND WiFi... odds are, its only the nintendo protocol. what im curious about is this: is the DS compat w/ the GBA wireless adapter? there has been no word on this anywhere from what i know.

Re:Homebrew Coding...

[NanoGator]

"What with the Wifi, Blutooth, touch screen, and the ability to scroll a web page across the two screens, I can't wait to get at it..."

What just kills me is that there are some people out there with no imagination who think all that is a gimmick. Is it really that hard to imagine what these extra features potentially mean for a portable system?

Re:Homebrew Coding...

[buffer-overflowed]

I can't get to the link, but unless things have advanced a heck of a lot in the past few months it's far from perfect. Sound doesn't work and only a handful of games are playable.

Re:Homebrew Coding...

[stonecypher]

Let me just say that I want to be one of the first to start doing some homebrew coding on this.

C'mon in. Water's just fine.

The DS Wiki has a significant amount of technical information, and has for months. Also, drop in on efNet #gbadev and ask around. #dsdev is still pretty empty. We've already got two emulators underway, a toolchain which is probably complete short of hardware defines (based on gcc 3.4,) and a fair amount of knowledge about the host machine.

No wonder they don't announce the price...

[spoonboy42]

From the press release:

The retooled Nintendo DS features a thinner, black base and an angular platinum flip-top cover.

Damn, Nintendo, really shooting for the luxery market with this one, huh? Hoping people will assume it's better than the PSP because it has twice the screens and ten times the price? ;)

Re:No wonder they don't announce the price...

[solive1]

Actually, the DS is supposed to be priced lower than the PSP.

Re:No wonder they don't announce the price...

[spoonboy42]

See the joke was about Platinum, which is a precious metal, being... oh, never mind.

Re:No wonder they don't announce the price...

[trueneutral]

The price is actually going to be a lot lower than the PSP. While the PSP is rumoured to be anywhere from $400 and up, the DS is going to be from $180-200. So, in otherwords, the price factor is going to be a large issue when it comes to deciding between them

Re:No wonder they don't announce the price...

[spoonboy42]

Platinum = expensive = joke

Re:No wonder they don't announce the price...

[nkh]

It's OK to explain a joke once, it's useless to explain it twice ;)

Re:No wonder they don't announce the price...

[Anonymous Coward]

ha

Re:No wonder they don't announce the price...

[Anonymous Coward]

In Soviet Russia, joke explains YOU!

Re:No wonder they don't announce the price...

[tepples]

Probably only "precious" in the sense of figurines depicting hydrocephalic Eloi kids with teardrop shaped eyes.

Re:No wonder they don't announce the price...

[burns210]

They are just looking for ways to up the price of the DS, so that it is on par with the PSP at launch time.

Re:No wonder they don't announce the price...

[Anonymous Coward]

I realize you're a troll, but platinum is the COLOR not the material, jackass.

Not bad,

[AC-x]

It certainly looks fairly good, much better then the first prototype shots of it I've seen,

However, I'm gonna have to say I prefer the PSP in terms of looks, it's just that little bit sleeker (tho with all those shiney surfaces it'll probably get scratched up real easy).

As for which system will be better it all depends on the battery life and most importantly the games.

Re:Not bad,

[Anonymous Coward]

i believe i remember reading that the psp will have much shorter battery life. It reads optical media and apparently that is what would drive down the battery life the most.

Great....

[blankinthefill]

Another chance to spend a large amount of money on an item that I know I'll use far less than it (may be) worth. Let the unnecessary spending on over-priced systems begin!

Re:Great....

[Anonymous Coward]

That is one of the far underrated advantages of haveing a wife, IMHO. Reckless spending? Buh-Bye. :)

Re:Great....

[Anonymous Coward]

No, your reckless spending goes buh-bye. Her's, meanwhile, goes up an order of magnitude.

Re:Great....

[Anonymous Coward]

Oh yeah that's really insightful. Ha ha... ha... ahem.

DS vs PSP

[grunt107]

Since Sony announced 100 developers for their device and its portable music/vid capabilities, will the DS lose out to the PSx juggernaut (can 20 more games make/break a game)?

How much importance is given to the 2-screen design (other than a 'neat' factor)? Also, since the PSP has 1 bigger screen will this make a difference in the long run?

Re:DS vs PSP

[rabbot]

Sony may have 100 developers but only a few of them will actually make good games. It's been that way since PS1. Quantity over Quality.

Re:DS vs PSP

[metamatic]

It's not so much the number of games, as the type. I suspect Sony will go for older gamers, the way the PS1 did when the NES was the market leader.

I have a GBA, and there are some great games, but 90% of what's out there seems to be targeted at 8-14 year olds. Nintendo has pretty much ignored the adult market on the GBA, and if they do the same with the DS it may prove a costly mistake.

Re:DS vs PSP

[tuffy]

Since Sony announced 100 developers for their device and its portable music/vid capabilities, will the DS lose out to the PSx juggernaut (can 20 more games make/break a game)?

If the PSP comes to market at $300 with 3-5 hours of battery life compared to 10+ hours for the DS and a probable $150 price tag, the DS will bury the PSP easily - despite the PSP's obvious technical merits. Battery life and initial cost are everything in the portable market, and the backwards-compatibility with the huge GBA library gives the DS even more of an edge.

Re:DS vs PSP

[chris462]

f the PSP comes to market at $300 with 3-5 hours of battery life compared to 10+ hours for the DS and a probable $150 price tag, the DS will bury the PSP easily - despite the PSP's obvious technical merits. Battery life and initial cost are everything in the portable market, and the backwards-compatibility with the huge GBA library gives the DS even more of an edge.

You must work for Sega.

Re:DS vs PSP

[trueneutral]

Actually that's untrue. Check the link here http://gameboy.ign.com/articles/534/534070p1.html Near the bottom it says that 120 DS releases are planned.

Re:DS vs PSP

[zip159]

That's because only 8-14 year olds actually buy handheld gaming systems.

Ohh wait... this is Slashdot, I take that back...

Re:DS vs PSP

[rayde]

When those 20 games are from Nintendo's in-house developers yes, those 20 more games can make or break a system. It has long been held that Nintendo has the best first party games. Those 100 other games will likely find their way onto both the DS and the PSP in most cases. Then you're left with the 1st party exclusives... the area where Nintendo has traditionally dominated.

Re:DS vs PSP

[Anonymous Coward]

You must work for Sega.

Either you are a troll or ignorant. Remmeber the game gear? No? Sega made it. Chewed through batteries. Had color. Better than the game boy. Remember it now? Didn't think so.

Remember the Atari Lynx? Had color and better games than the game boy.. but chewed through batteries. Still don't remember it? Didn't think so.

Jackass.

Re:DS vs PSP

[wolssiloa]

If you don't like the games, don't buy the system. Nintendo has always targeted the younger market. That's who their focus is. If you want a greater selection of adult games get a Sony then. Targeting the younger generation may not make them as much money, but it is not a costly mistake nor will it be for the DS.

Re:DS vs PSP

[wolssiloa]

that's absolutely right. Nintendo's portable systems have always been slightly lower tech., but for some reason they always seem to survive and become the market leader

Re:DS vs PSP

[grunt107]

Actually, I was referencing the 20 extra for the DS (120 - 100 PSP). Do those extra 20 help the DS?

Re:DS vs PSP

[Anonymous Coward]

Costly mistake...like those 110 million Gameboys they've sold as of 2000 with the lineup you hate?

Re:DS vs PSP

[Txiasaeia]

8-14 year old comment notwithstanding, I thoroughly enjoyed Final Fantasy Tactics Adv., Tactics Ogre, Advance Wars, Metroid Fusion, F-Zero, Mario 3, Mario World, Warioworld... the list goes on. These games might be targetted at kiddies, but hell, they're still enjoyable for me!

Re:DS vs PSP

[poofyhairguy82]

Nintendo has pretty much ignored the adult market on the GBA, and if they do the same with the DS it may prove a costly mistake.

If by costly mistake you mean remain a market leader while bringing in a fat profit. If adults want handheld games, they should blow the dust off their PDAs.

Re:DS vs PSP

[KDR_11k]

The PSP has 60 games and 100 developers, though.

Re:DS vs PSP

[Spleener12]

Take this further- the winning system in a given generation is almost always the weakest. It's purely luck, yes, but still, note that the PS2 is slightly less powerful than the GC and Xbox and winning by a landslide, and the PS1 was significantly more powerful than the N64 (the optical storage medium was its only advantage) and kicked its ass easily.

Re:DS vs PSP

[Anonymous Coward]

GameCrazy received notice last week that PSP pricing will start at $349.99 (confirmed pre-order price).

Re:DS vs PSP

[Thag]

You forgot the fact that the PSP is also an inch thick, which pushes it squarely into "brick" territory. And the design doesn't even protect the screen.

I think Sony took one look at the DS at E3 and realized they were screwed. They seem to be doing a lot of cost-cutting and cancelling of unprofitable product lines lately. I think they're trying to cover up an expected loss on the PSP.

All IMHO, of course.

Jon Acheson

Re:DS vs PSP

[hkmwbz]

Just because it doesn't have blood and gore doesn't mean that it is only playable to kids. For real adults, what matters is gameplay. If it's a "cute" game but plays great and is fun, who cares? Only angst-bitten teens need blood and gore to convince themselves that they are grown up and cool.

As for Nintendo making a "costly mistake" by continuing in the handheld market as they have done until now... That must be why they completely own the entire handheld gaming market worldwide, right?

Re:DS vs PSP

[Daetrin]

Yeah, it sucks to keep playing those kiddy nintendo games like Eternal Darkness, Metroid Prime and Rogue Squadron.

Re:DS vs PSP

[crasher35]

I think you meant that the N64 was significantly more powerful than the N64 as clearly the PS1 (as much as it pains this Nintendo demi-fanboy to say) won that generation of consoles. Also because the N64 had was more powerful than the PS1 (with the exception of storage medium).

Re:DS vs PSP

[crasher35]

That might not be the case with the DS and the PSP as they are so different I would think that it'd be very difficult to bring a DS game to the PSP. The DS just has more control avaiable than the PSP, and it'd be pretty hard to substitute the DS' touchscreen with anything on the PSP. This is on the hunch that most DS games will use the touchscreen capabilities.

Re:DS vs PSP

[tonejava]

Although Nintendo have always advocated that they are not in the market to make multifunctional platforms like the PlayStation and XBox but strictly games consoles.

Although it amazes me that they decided to start selling video paks of pokemon - though I guess from the marketing side of things it may make sense.

So Nintendo don't stick to an industry standard but they have been able to create one for themselves. Who is to say that we won't see rewritable game paks for other media (vid/aud)?

If PSP includes functionality to play 3.5" cd's how many shops do you think are going to start selling them? You'll find people ripping their own CD's and compiling their own, don't think the music industry would like that! Neither do I think many others care but Sony does have a high stake in the music industry as well.

Okay so my last 2 statements are contradictory, so what... ;-)

Ultimately it all comes down to whats best for each company not just for their clients.

Re:DS vs PSP

[euxneks]

However, if the PSP can play movies and music AND games, I don't think it'll die that easy. I agree that the gamers in the audience would rather have a cheap and cool gaming system with a huge battery life, I can't deny that I would love to have an all-in-one portable gaming/music/movie device. Not to mention I'll have a good job soon with _no_ student loans - Gadgets here I come!

Re:DS vs PSP

[metamatic]

They owned the console market too. Now look at them.

Re:DS vs PSP

[Kremmy]

Actually, the cartridges are a significantly more /powerful/ storage medium, due to the fact that they can contain add-on hardware (SuperFX chips in the SNES, the rumblers in various GBC games (pokemon pinball)), really most any kind of co-processor that one might find useful could be stuck into the cartridge. Whereas the optical storage mediums are just that... storage mediums.
Surely they could have stuck a CD reader on a cartridge if they felt the a strong enough need for it.

Re:DS vs PSP

[ildon]

If you look at the current crop of GBA games it's pretty much exactly the same thing. Maybe 1/25 is actually even worth looking at, and most of them are SNES or PSX ports or pseudo sequels.

Re:DS vs PSP

[ildon]

Because people are always dying to re-purchase what they already own in an entirely new media format just so they can watch/listen to it on their game device when they probably already own a portable MP3 and/or CD player, and most of the movies they would want to watch on DVD and/or VHS.

Yes, movies and music are exactly why people will buy the PSP.

Re:DS vs PSP

[chris462]

Either you are a troll or ignorant. Remmeber the game gear? No? Sega made it. Chewed through batteries. Had color. Better than the game boy. Remember it now? Didn't think so. Remember the Atari Lynx? Had color and better games than the game boy.. but chewed through batteries. Still don't remember it? Didn't think so.

Next time I'll wrap my message in <sarcasm> and </sarcasm>, just for you.

Re:DS vs PSP

[euxneks]

Do you own a DVD player? Do you own an mp3 player? You had to switch from one format to another at one point in time.

It's bunk if you think that having to switch formats will be a reason for it's downfall. People are buying cd players, people are buying DVD players, what happened to media on tape formats? It evolved Heck, even CD players are becoming obsolete now.

I think if you're able to store a couple gigs of music on those tiny discs and be able to play it on that tiny player, the pros outweigh "having to change formats" any day. And I'll do it again when the next one comes out.

Re:DS vs PSP

[ildon]

With the way media companies are acting now, I don't expect Sony to release any recorders or recordable version of their PSP discs. It would make it too easy to pirate the games.

You know it's a good thing...

[Zaranne]

That I just can't seem to find my old GB's or my GBA (I hate moving). Now I can buy something else to lose.

At least my Xbox is too big to get lost that easily...

So is KOTOR gonna be on that thing? Or maybe Panzer Dragoon...

Battery Life

[bunburyist]

I find that battery life has been a big deal with new handhelds from nintendo, the gba and gba had excellent battery life, I hope I can expect more of the same out of the DS. I'm concerned that with higher performance will come lower battery life, which greatly limits the portability of the devices.

Re:Battery Life

[Klar]

Any idea what type of batteries they use?

Re:Battery Life

[darkain]

internal Lithium-Ion, just as the GBA-SP had. meaning:
A) built in battery
B) you cant change batteries whenever you want
3) it comes w/ a rechardable battery!

Re:Battery Life

[Threni]

> the gba and gba had excellent battery life,

Well, you have to include a light if you aren't going to play your games outside in the sun, and lights eat power.

Re:Battery Life

[Threni]

4) The battery will have a shelf-life of about 2 years, after which you'll have to take your gba apart, fit a replacement, put it all back together and hope it still works. Rechargable AA Ni-mh at 2000 mah is a much better idea.

Pt ?

[Mateito]

The retooled Nintendo DS features a thinner, black base and an angular platinum flip-top cover

Platinum? Sheesh. They are going for the top end of the market, aren't they?

1. Buy Nintendo DS
2. Melt casing into ingots
3. Profit!

Re:Pt ?

[musikit]

you forgot to use fire crystal

Re:Pt ?

[Spleener12]

Hm. I should do that to my platinum Gamecube controller. It was a steal at Gamestop at just $18 used.

GameBoy in general rocks

[kennedy]

I loved my GBA, and i LOVED my GBA SP.... i cannot wait to get my hands on the DS.

Re:GameBoy in general rocks

[Anonymous Coward]

All I can say is... Wow. What an insightful post. You don't happen to be using AOL as your ISP do you?

Portable Games

[Klar]

I've been held back from buying portable systems for the last few years because of past problems. My first portable was the Atari Lynx(which came out just after the gameboy, and had a colour screen), within a few months of paying the big cash it took to buy, games became very hard to find, and stopped being produced. After this, instead of buying a gameboy, as I wasnt a big fan of the cartoony graphics, I bought a sega Gamegear.. although this system lasted me a bit longer than the lynx, games became much harder to find.

Now, I think I will wait to see the actual release and game development of the new sony and nintendo portables before I shell out the cash. I guess I will have to settle playing games on my laptop for now.

Re:Portable Games

[Anonymous Coward]

you buy 2 shitty handhelds and then call it quits?
Why don't you do some research into the *games* you want to play, and then get the handheld that plays those games. At this rate, your next handheld purchase will be the NeoGeo pocket.

Re:Portable Games

[Xaroth]

You probably played arcade games a lot when you were younger, too, right? And you say you play games on your laptop? Given your current track record, it looks like laptop gaming is preparing to die.

For the love of id, DO NOT ATTEMPT TO PLAY GAMES ON YOUR HOME COMPUTER!!! You've killed enough systems already!

Re:Portable Games

[Kirby-meister]

After this, instead of buying a gameboy, as I wasnt a big fan of the cartoony graphics

Well, there's the problem right there - you generalized all Gameboy games as cartoony, and figured cartoony graphics makes for bad gameplay. While you do have Pokemon and such, you also have your Zeldas, your Metroids, and your Castlevanias.

I really think it weird people let cartoony graphics get in the way of having a good time with a game. It sounds like the person is a teenaged boy who wants to prove his "matureness" by buying what he perceives as adult things.

I guess I'm comfortable with my maturity enough that I can play games like Super Puzzle Fighter II Turbo or Zelda: The Wind Waker without feeling like I'm playing a kid's game; I'm just playing a fun game, after all.

You should really rethink your priorities on what you think makes handheld gaming goodness...

Re:Portable Games

[gUmbi]

My first portable was the Atari Lynx...I bought a sega Gamegear..

I don't feel sorry for you...I owned a TurboGrafx-16

Re:Portable Games

[mog007]

I havn't gotten a chance to play Wind Waker yet, but I assume it keeps in the same vein as past Zelda titles, just with Cell Shading for the "cartoonish" effect. I don't understand why that would be a turn off, I thought XIII was a pretty cool game, and I hope they release a sequal because the ending sucked.

XIII was based on a comic book series I believe, and the devs used Cell Shading to make it feel like you were playing a comic book. It's not a kid's game by any means, considering all the references it makes to the Jack and Bobbie Kennedy.

Re:Portable Games

[Filiks]

Yup. He could have bought a Turbo Express, been out $300, and not be able to read the text of the TG-16 games. I loved my Game Gear. Had ten or 15 games that were all great.

Re:Portable Games

[bedouin]

I still think the Turbo Grafx Express is one of the coolest portables ever made; maybe one day I'll pick one up used.

The coolest thing about Game Gear to me was you could play the entire Master System library on it with an inexpensive adapter.

Oh, and the second generation Lynx units were (much) nicer than the original.

I have a tendency to always buy the underdog machines as well, and I never feel bad about it. In fact I usually do it intentionally. Sometimes it feels better to have 4 or 5 quality games no one else has access to, rather than 15 or 20 you could easily play at a friend's house, or on an emulator a few years later. There were a number of games for my Master System that had no equivalent NES versions, and friends ended up playing for hours on end whenever they came over.

Eh, I'm not sure I was ever able to justify the purchase of an Atari 7800 though. But even it had a couple gems -- and the entire 2600 library behind it.

Re:Portable Games

[TRACK-YOUR-POSITION]

I'm curious--have you actually played the Pokemon game boy RPG games? While they can't compete with newer Final Fantasy games in terms of graphics or story, the combat system is simulataneously simpler and deeper.

Re:Portable Games

[Anonymous Coward]

Well if you're a simpleton, then simple games will amuse you for hours.

Do you still play with dolls? Do you play with Tonka toys? What's that? You "outgrew them"? Well, that tends to happen to some people with video games as well.

Re:Portable Games

[aliens]

Who says cartoony graphics == simpleton?

I suppose you don't play Go or chess. Such simple childish graphics. What simpleton must play those.

Stupid AC

Re:Portable Games

[Kirby-meister]

So tell me, do you think BMX XXX was a better game than Tetris? :)

Playing a game just because it seems mature is itself extremely immature - it makes it seem like you aren't comfortable enough in your adulthood. Who the fuck thinks that a game with a bunch of cursing and breast physics thrown in to hide the obviously shallow gameplay experience is "mature"? It just plays off the teenager's frame of mind that they need to look cool and adult.

Besides, the analogy is off. Toys like dolls and tonkas no longer interest grown ups because they tend to lose the ability to make the toy fun for them through their imagination. Games, however, are like movies - they provide most of the entertainment for you, and the fun part is testing your skills and reflexes against someone else's logic.

There is a reason why gamers are extremely nostalgic.

Re:Portable Games

[burns210]

You are skeptical that games will be available for the DS? Are you kidding me... Every gameboy game, ever created, will be forwards compatable with the DS... The Gameboy line is the best selling console line in history of gaming, period. The GB SP sold(i think) near on par or better than the SP2 in Japan for a long time)...

There are, even now, several hundred gameboy Advanced games available, many of which are killer. Old games will run as well. That doesn't even mention the 20 in house games Nintendo has coming out, just for launch!

Based on E3, I'm glad they changed design

[larsoncc]

While playing the DS, I noticed that my hands were sometimes pushing a couple of buttons at the same time - basically, the buttons were small and pretty close together.

Comparing the old button design to the new (old design), you can see that they've altered the layout.

This is an absolutely welcome change in my book. With the buttons in a side-by-side, wider layout, they'll feel a lot more comfortable for adult hands.

Re:Based on E3, I'm glad they changed design

[irokitt]

It's somewhat sad for me though, with my little hobbit fingers and such. I guess us tiny people aren't planned for in the US anymore.

Re:Based on E3, I'm glad they changed design

[Blastrogath]

It's really a trade off in any case. They can't make it ergonomic for everyone, there's too much variety to do so.

Re:Based on E3, I'm glad they changed design

[Eil]

I remember reading once that game systems released in the US have controllers that are 30% larger than the Japanese counterparts. I don't know how how much truth there was to that, but as nearly every game system in the world originates in Japan, I could see how a prototype handheld might have the buttons crammed closer together and then separated a bit to make it easier to play for US gamers.

Re:Based on E3, I'm glad they changed design

[Anonymous Coward]

False.

The original launch controller for the Playstation in Japan was a certain size. The launch controller in the U.S. was slightly larger. All future controllers in both regions were based on the new default American controller size.

The controller had been designed smaller from the beginning due to a miscalculation in the age of the target demographic in Japan. That's all. When it was determined that adults were buying PlayStations for themselves and not necessarily for their kids, Sony went with the bigger controllers and stuck by that new demo.

More recently, MS Japan designed the default Japanese XBox controller to be an all-around better and more comfortable pad. That involved shrinking down from the original American pad, which was so huge that it was uncomfortable to many users even in the home country of its designers (Americans). This resulted in the Controller S, which is almost unanimously considered the far better controller than the old "Duke," by Americans and Japanese alike.

Simply put, what works better for one region typically also works better for the other. Extremes in either direction (too small or too large) are bad for both regions. American and Japanese consumers are not so dissimilar that you'd need to pander to one's comfort at the expense of the other's. Smart design goes a long way towards universal convenience.

Re:Based on E3, I'm glad they changed design

[real_smiff]

i also like how they've curved the stereo speakers towards you, and the control pad away. very natural, very classy. i'm actually starting to feel iwantoneofthose, which i wasn't from the e3 design. guess it proves looks do matter, after all :/ but it's a functional aesthetic aswell, i guess.

Re:DS stands for...?

[KDR_11k]

Because we all know how the NGage outsold the GBA...

A big step up

[GizmoToy]

I remember getting blasted when the first pictures of this thing were leaked. I didn't figure anyone would buy it considering how sleek the PSP is going to look. I see they took "my" suggestion to heart... although it is still a little odd. Anyway, it is a vast improvement over the last design we saw. It may not be as pretty as a PSP, but its definately not bad.

Re:A big step up

[cowscows]

maybe I'm just not hip, but I don't see what's so attractive about the PSP. It looks like an old sega game gear with more rounded edges and some shiny parts. It's way too big to fit in any pockets; if I throw it into a bag, the screen looks like it'll get scratched to hell; and if I wear it around my neck from a string like they're showing, it'll get scratched to hell and I'll probably get mugged.

The specs are impressive, but if they battery life isn't up to snuff, it's dead in the water.

Cheesy...

[quecojones]

It may end up being a kick-ass product, but from looking at those pictures, it just reminds me of those cheesy throw away calculators they sell for $2. You know, the ones that are supposed to look like a sleek/sexy PDA, but are really just crappy calculators?

Being a Nintendo handheld, it'll probably rock, but... I'm not buying anything that looks like that. Sony's the one that'll get my money.

Re:Cheesy...

[Clock Nova]

You're not buying a game machine because of the way it looks?

So, if the DS comes out, and it turns out to be the greatest hand-held game machine ever created, has a library of hundreds of great titles, great battery life, and costs less than the PSP, you still won't buy it?

Re:Cheesy...

[Kirby-meister]

It is really weird seeing people justify purchasing one handheld/console over another just because of looks.

The looks of the console should be last in priorities. The games you'll play and the experiences you'll have with the console, now those are the real priorities...and yet you throw away the chances that you'll ever buy one based on one of the least important features of a game console - it's looks?

Re:Cheesy...

[quecojones]

No. I'll wait until they do a revision DS like they did before (GBA->GBA SP).

Re:Cheesy...

[quecojones]

1 - I don't have to justify anything to anybody.
2 - I didn't say I'd buy the PSP because it looked better. I said I wouldn't buy the DS because of the way it looked. For me, it's not an either/or (DS/PSP) decision. If the DS looked better, I'd be happy to buy both.
3 - Nintendo won't die because I don't buy a DS. Sony won't win the handheld war because I buy a PSP. Get a grip. My personal choice in gaming systems isn't that big of a deal to the industry (I can be a bit full of myself sometimes, but I'm not that much of an ego mainac). :P
4- I'll just wait until they do the next revision like they did before (GBA->GBA SP). ;)

Re:Cheesy...

[Exatron]

You're still being superficial. How does the look of the DS affect your ability to enjoy the games? They're still the same no matter how the hardware looks.

Re:Cheesy...

[quecojones]

Your point?
I mean, it's not like I'm trying to deny it or anything...

Re:Cheesy...

[Kirby-meister]

Who said I cared whether you got a PSP over a DS? I'm for any platform that has good games (and some that don't have any good games...); I just think it's weird (and kind of stupid) when people say things like "wow that looks cool, it would provide me with lots of fun...but it looks ugly, so I won't get it." Who stares at their console while playing a game?

Re:Cheesy...

[tonejava]

It is really weird seeing people justify purchasing one handheld/console over another just because of looks...

So why did Nintendo change the look to something less, how would you put it, childish?

Re:Cheesy...

[quecojones]

Looks aren't everything, but do you really think that the N-Gage's looks (or how it would make you look by using it as a phone) didn't factor into people's decision not to buy it?

Who ever said I was choosing one over the other? I had planned on buying them both. Now I'll just get one and wait for the next revision of the other (DS).

What, you play games with your eyes closed? :P

Re:Cheesy...

[quecojones]

My point exactly. Looks do matter. Maybe not as much as they do to me for everyone else, but they aren't insignificant either.

Holy shit!

[ikewillis]

The GBA and the GBA SP had a kid!

You're lucky

[KDR_11k]

It is the power button.

Re:You're lucky

[Scuff]

Actually, wouldnt it suck to slip and accidentally hit it in that case? While it would obviously suck as a normal button, I was hoping it would do something like toggle the backlight on and off.

Nintendo's got twenty?

[mblase]

Let's see... there's going to be a Super Mario game, a Mario Party game, a Mario Kart game (watch the drivers in front of you and behind you at the same time), a Metroid game, a Zelda game, two Pokemon games ("Fuschia" and "Teal"), and probably a version of Tetris that uses both screens as a single play area.

That's eight right there. Any obvious franchises I've overlooked?

Re:Nintendo's got twenty?

[KeeperS]

Donkey Kong, Animal Crossing, Pikmin, Starfox... those are some more. Nintendo really does have a lot of franchises. Hopefully we'll see some new stuff as well.

Re:Nintendo's got twenty?

[88NoSoup4U88]

Wario ware Inc. :D Love that game : And the extra possibilities they have with the stylus is gonna rock it even more.

I hope they dont confine that game to only using the stylus ; the Wario Ware as of now, also rocks my socks off for those 5 spare minutes a day :)

Re:Nintendo's got twenty?

[Anonymous Coward]

Probably a Wario game; a Yoshi game (maybe a Yoshi tetris game too?); a Castlevania game; an assortment of sports franchise games; some recent movie titles like Harry Potter, Spiderman 2, etc; Final Fantasy XYZPDQ; etc.

Re:Nintendo's got twenty?

[Lynxara]

For a Japanese launch? Super Robot Wars, Gundam, and Megami Tensei spring immediately to mind. I really have a hard time imagining the DS not having at least one game from each franchise. Multiple Gundam and Megami Tensei games are easily possible.

Re:Nintendo's got twenty?

[Anonymous Coward]

Animal Crossing.

Re:Nintendo's got twenty?

[DeadScreenSky]

Eh, the subject was Nintendo franchises. I know they are gunning for Gundam with Bandai (and hence most of Super Robot Taisen), but they aren't Nintendo-brand yet.

Re:Nice try!

[Darth Maul]

Wha? Are you just a Sony fanboy, or do you have some logic to back up that statement?

Let's see ... Nintendo has complete dominance of the handheld gaming market. They have 120 games in development for the DS already.

So why will the PSP "mop the floor"? Because it can do so many polys per second? Or has such-and-such megahertz chip? The PSP has *zero* backwards compatibility with earlier PSone and PS2 discs. So they're basically starting from scratch to compete with the player who already has complete dominance *AND* is building in backwards compatibility with older GBA carts.

Care to rethink your statement?

Please ${DEITY}

[Willeh]

Let this not suck as much as the virtual boy does (or did, rather). The design struck me as really cool and retro, and the 2nd screen can add alot of stuff to games (What exactly is left as an exercise to the reader). Apart from the usual remix of mario/ sonic/ rpg's, nintendo could make a nice lineup with a compilation of sorts from old game & watch title, if they're not as stingy as the current lineup of flashback NES titles, and bundle a few nice games together for cheap. Then they could remake the look of the portable to look like the game & watch machines themselves, instant retro look and feel (Much more than the GBA nes remake).

Re:Please ${DEITY}

[Anonymous Coward]

Did the Virtual Boy make your eyes burn after five minutes of play, or is that just me?

Re:Please ${DEITY}

[Anonymous Coward]

You probably forgot to adjust the focus. I never had any problems with that.

Re:Please ${DEITY}

[drinkypoo]

I have a virtual boy. I think it's a really, really cool system. What it is not is a handheld, it's a tabletop, and there is really not much market for tabletop systems. The virtual boy cost too much to produce and people were adjusting it improperly, and the frame rate was too low and flickery - perhaps its one flaw besides the paucity of worthwhile games. I mean, when there's only about three games worth buying (mario tennis, wario land, and red alarm) it's kind of hard to sell a system that expensive.

Re:Please ${DEITY}

[Anonymous Coward]

You're looking for late April, man. Nobody else has thought the words "Virtual Boy" in connection to the DS since mid-May, when a certain Reggie Fils-Aime dropped a certain bomb on Sony's collective heads. :)

Re:DS stands for...?

[acvh]

I know many people whose phones can play mp3s, and none of those people listen to mp3s on their phones. Similarly I know many people whose phones can take pictures, and once the novelty wore off (and it did, quickly) they stopped taking pictures with their phones.

Give me a game machine that plays good games, a phone that makes good connections and a camera that takes good pictures and I'll be happy. A hybrid device that does all three poorly is useless.

Back to the beginning

[pico303]

Reminds me of those old handheld LCD games that Nintendo started with, before the NES.

Re:Back to the beginning

[Dr.Knackerator]

Yeah, the Game and Watch. Its truely uncanny :)

piccy

Re:DS stands for...?

[Anonymous Coward]

exactly! every other cell phone, MP3 player, camera combo has 0wn3d the market.

What are these guys thinking? don't they know anything??

Re:DS stands for...?

[rabbot]

That's right. You're definitely not their target market. Nintendo is into making GAMING machines. Go buy an NGage. They do one thing and they do it better than anyone else. Pretty simple.

Ports?

[General Sherman]

Looking at the key layout, there ought to be a bunch of SNES ports for this thing. It's probably more powerful than it.

XABY 4 LyFe baby!

Re:Ports?

[Chemical]

The GBA is already port wasteland. With the potental this thing has, I hope it doesn't suffer the same fate. Hopefully it wont get a single port. Of course I know that's impossible. Already Wario Ware and Metroid Prime are being ported.

Re:Ports?

[88NoSoup4U88]

It can run games that ran on the N64 (Mario64 for example) : So i assume that it would be able to run/port SNES games.. or NES :)

Re:Ports?

[tgibbs]

The GBA is already port wasteland. With the potental this thing has, I hope it doesn't suffer the same fate. Hopefully it wont get a single port.

The GBA couldn't do a decent job with a lot of SNES games because of its limited button selection. With the DS, many titles (Street Fighter II, anyone?) can be moved over intact (except for figuring out something to put on the second screen). I'm hoping that it continues the tradition of the GBA of being a mecca for classic 2D gaming. There are many great games that are all but forgotten, and probably have never even been encountered by younger gamers.

Re:Ports?

[burns210]

Actually, the GBA SP was the ~SNES handheld, give or take. Reports are that the DS is at or better in some respects to the N64... First round games probably won't be, but that is true of ALL devices... Wait for round 3 or 4 of games and you will be blown away... The entire SNES library should be ported, but also a good chunk of N64 games as well.

Re:Ports?

[General Sherman]

I'll forgive Nintendo for shying away from online games if they port Super Smash Bros. to the DS.

Re:Ports?

[88NoSoup4U88]

Since that was a great party game, I think it's very likely it will see a launch on the DS too.

Re:Nice try!

[KDR_11k]

The PSP doesn't have a touchscreen, though. If someone made an RTS or FPS for both the PSP and DS that could interface both devices via WiFi, I'd expect the DS players to mop the floor with the PSP players, kind of like how PC players completely destroyed DC players in Q3A.

real 3d

[scaaven]

this might not sound cool, but you probably would be able to render the 2 screens in a 3d environment with the eye level of each screen seperated by a little bit. Then you could hold the unit vertical and cross your eyes until the 2 screens meet. then you would be looking at a neat 3d game. of course, people might not want to cross their eyes for extended periods of time... -scaaven

Re:real 3d

[KDR_11k]

In other words you want a Virtual Boy emulator for the DS?

Re:real 3d

[Anonymous Coward]

Except that, if I'm not mistaken, the DS can only render one screen in 3D at a time.

Re:real 3d

[scaaven]

hell yeah. mario tennis forever!

Re:real 3d

[Rallion]

Argh, you're one of those idiots that crosses your eyes for the 3D "Magic Eye" pictures, aren't you? You don't cross them! You have them both look perfectly straight! Unfocused!

Note that it would be nearly impossible to play a game like that, it's like only watching in peripheral vision. Visual Boy was better since that wasn't an issue.

Re:real 3d

[ildon]

Have fun ruining your eyes.

Re:DS stands for...?

[PhoenixFlare]

I'm obviously not their target market.

Indeed. Generally, when people want to buy a game system, or at least a Nintendo game system, they buy the thing to play games as the primary function.

Craming a huge number of functions into a handheld gaming system has not worked very well yet - the N-Gage, for example.

100+ in dev does not mean 100+ at launch

[LordZardoz]

Do not confuse games currently in development with games available at launch. Besides, Do you really think that EB / Walmart / whatever will want to give up the shelf space for 120+ games for an unproven console?

And while there is a chance that the in development also includes the GBA titles currently on the go, I dont think that Nintendo is going go play that sort of game with this launch.

END COMMUNICATION

Re:100+ in dev does not mean 100+ at launch

[cubicledrone]

for an unproven console?

Nintendo.

Unproven.

Remember folks. You can't win, and even if you do win, you're still "unproven." Nintendo owns what, 193% of the handheld console market?

Re:100+ in dev does not mean 100+ at launch

[Anonymous Coward]

Although, if GBA is any indication of what it's going to be like for this system, it won't be too long. GBA game development cycles range from 6 to 12 months, depending on the budget of the game, unlike the 1-2 year cycles of most normal console systems.

Re:100+ in dev does not mean 100+ at launch

[sqrt(2)]

WOW! 193%!? How do they do it?

Re:100+ in dev does not mean 100+ at launch

[Anonymous Coward]

Almost everyone who purchased a Gameboy Advance had to rush out and buy a Gameboy Advance SP because they couldn't see to play their games. That or the grandparent was just making up statistics...

Re:100+ in dev does not mean 100+ at launch

[Anonymous Coward]

Cheat Codes

Re:100+ in dev does not mean 100+ at launch

[sqrt(2)]

I don't have a SP. Still using my ol' Regular GBA. I just can't justify spending 100$ for a backlight and fliptop.

Re:100+ in dev does not mean 100+ at launch

[Anonymous Coward]

- Presented in DoubleVision (where drunk)

Or where played on the DS ;)

Re:100+ in dev does not mean 100+ at launch

[Anonymous Coward]

That is why it less than 200% market share. 7% of the GBA customers refused to be consumer sheep...

Re:100+ in dev does not mean 100+ at launch

[joNDoty]

Actually, I do think that Walmart/whatever will give up the shelf space for 120 games for an unproven console. It's happened before. Initially they get great sales on new game systems, not based on the merits of the console, but on the novelty of the idea. Nintendo DS has a whole lot of novelty with that 2-screen approach. In my opinion, two screens is not a good idea, but marketers know that at this stage, a new product from nintendo is going to sell at least enough for them to clear their inventory.

Re:100+ in dev does not mean 100+ at launch

[Huogo]

I couldn't justify $100 either, but I could justify $50. For whatever reason, someone bought a used GBA w/box for $50 on E-Bay (It retails new for $70, and the new model [sp] is out. Not quite sure why people on e-bay will buy things for so much, but I like it). So after selling my GBA, the GBA SP only cost me $50.

Re:100+ in dev does not mean 100+ at launch

[adachan]

Stores do not give up shelf space. They are paid for it. Whoever pays the most gets the space. I was working at Office Depot and back in the day there was a pretty heated battle between HP and Compaq for the coveted "endcaps". This makes stores a good income. Same thing goes for grocery stores and potato chips.

Re:100+ in dev does not mean 100+ at launch

[urbaer]

And while there is a chance that the in development also includes the GBA titles currently on the go
I believe it would be hard to pass off a GBA title for a DS title, given that a GBA title would blank the bottom of the screen (or just have a logo or something). Work would still need to be done to convert a GBA title to DS.

I think the launch games would really have to use the dual screens well to improve sales of the DS.

Re:100+ in dev does not mean 100+ at launch

[DarkEdgeX]

I'm curious how this got modded insightful. The Gameboy Advance, which this seems to be the next logical step for that proven lineage, was widely accepted by retailers at launch. In fact it only took a year or so before Gameboy Advance products had fully displaced Gameboy Color products.

Re:100+ in dev does not mean 100+ at launch

[ildon]

For $25 and some work I just installed an Afterburner in mine.

I'll pass...

[Bhodi]

It looks like a waste of money and battery life. Also looks a bit too big. If it doesn't fit in my pocket, I'm not buying it. The GBA *barely* fits.

Re:I'll pass...

[Mitleid]

I had problems fitting things into my pocket, too. The trick, see, is to have your penis removed.

In all seriousness, though, I agree. It's a bit larger than I was expecting, but so is the PSP, so I guess we'll just all have to wait and see what kind of library each system is going to boast. Personally, I'm not all that excited for the DS. My Advance SP does me just fine as it is now, and unless I try a DS upon release and it just completely blows me away, I won't be in any rush to buy it anytime soon. I do give props to Nintendo for innovating, even if everyone else claims this is just a technologically souped-up rehash of those horrid Game & Watch things...

Re:I'll pass...

[Anonymous Coward]

Are you telling women to stick this in their vaginas?

Re:I'll pass...

[Anonymous Coward]

Ooooo. Kinky.

well,

[kingstalemuffins]

yeah, it looks pretty good, but is it as good as the Virtual Boy?

Wrong name

[Dr.Knackerator]

It should called 'Game and Watch'

clicky for piccy

Game & Watch

[darkain]

just so long as they remake Game & Watch games for it, im set!

Original Ideas: 0

[koi88]

Quote:"Original Ideas: 0 /only half joking"
Actually, Nintendo is one of the few gaming companies where you can expect original ideas.
The whole device is a nice new idea (more original than "play PS2 games everywhere", isn't it?)

Re:Original Ideas: 0

[crasher35]

Yes, I agree with you wholeheartedly on this.

Re:Original Ideas: 0

[GFLPraxis]

Very true. And that's why I have a GameCube.
Nintendo has shown more innovation than just about any other game system manufacturer (aka Microsoft and Sony).
Not only are the games unique (Zelda, anyone?), but the games on the other systems are mostly, well, generic (XBox has lots of sports and shooting games, PS2 has lots of racing games, etc).

Plus the GBA SP is just awesome.

Re:Original Ideas: 0

[grumbel]

Aehm, well, how many Marios got rereleased for the GBA was it 4 or 5? And how many of them were new ones? Something around zero, rest was ports of SNES or even NES games. How about a Zelda? Well, again a SNES port. Ok, we got two new Metroids, but those were rather similar to Super Metroid, not necessarily a bad thing, however overall there hasn't been all that orginial ideas of Nintendo in the GBA area, just far to many rereleases of titels that already got rereleased in the times of the SNES (ie. MarioAllStars).

In general I agree that Nintendo is good for original ideas, but on the GBA they really havn't done much, 'Mario&Luigi Superstar Saga' would one of the few original ones that comes to mind and even that is 'just' a successor of MarioRPG.

Looking at the Nintendo DS the first few titles I have seen where a patched up Mario64, a MarioKart and MetroidPrime version, overall not all that original. Sure I hope that Nintendo will provide some cool stuff, but I fear that the whole DualScreen thing will just end up as a useless gadget that hardly any game will make much use off, as it happened with quite a few Nintendo gadgets before (GBPrinter, GBA link, 64DD, SNES Mouse).

Re:Original Ideas: 0

[koi88]

Yes, nowadays on there seem to be a great many of sequels on any platform.
Sequels are a sure seller.
The movie industry loves sequels, book authors do and let's not talk about TV.
Yet I think Nintendo is one of the most likely places to find real new ideas. They can be hidden in a big franchise like Mario, or they can come as new titles like Pikmin.

I don't think he 2nd screem will share the fate of other little-supportef. litt 0gadgets, as it comes standard all devices, and gma companies will wonder if a spinning logo there will satisfy the customer.

Re:Original Ideas: 0

[tepples]

Aehm, well, how many Marios got rereleased for the GBA was it 4 or 5?

Turn the M upside down, and you get WarioWare, arguably one of 2003's few original games for any platform.

innovating is good

[drgonjo]

I like the fact that nintendo continues to innovate, and a handheld is one of the most well suited niches for exploration. I have yet to try dual screen touch screen gaming, but in the hands of creative devs I think there are a lot of possibilities. Factor in the wireless support and things just get better. Imagine an FPS where the second screen shows a live map and stats, while the main screen features the action or a multiplayer strategy game where the main screen displays the shared world map and the second screen is where battles take place. Some people might see these kinds of features as pointless, but I believe anything that adds depth to the gaming experience is more than welcome. We've been dealing with games designed for game pads and single screens for two decades and mixing things up a bit can only contribute to the evolution of gaming.

In other news...

[Anonymous Coward]

Mozilla's Firefox browser is still called Firefox.

The only thing you really need to know...

[Anonymous Coward]

is that clearly, Nintendo is incorporating a George Foreman grill into this newly-redesigned DS, judging by these photos. How can you lose... I can pretty much always go for a burger, and with this new handheld, I can grill myself one on the go, while playing DS and GBA games!

Seriously, though. I mean, the closed-shell picture of the DS might as well have been straight off the george foreman box. They're friggin identical.

You all just wait. Give it a week or two... we'll get a press release confirming my suspicions.

Even Neater

[Anonymous Coward]

www.gp32.com

Better, faster, brighter...

Re:Even Neater

[KDR_11k]

Touch screen? WiFi? Four face buttons? Games?

Re:DS stands for...?

[darkain]

Lets see... it is most likely fast enough for MP3 playback, as its faster than the old 486 i started with for MP3s.

next, it has a built in mic.

lastly, it was built in WiFi (802.11b).

VoIP anyone?

Release date and price

[DarkMavis]

EBGames has the DS on their website for pre-order. The price is $199.99 and the release date is 11/29/2004. Again, this is according to EBgames.

Re:Release date and price

[rayde]

the link you mention...

Note that it does state: "The ship date and retail price have not been confirmed and therefore are subject to change. If the retail price is decreased you will receive the lower price."

Re:Release date and price

[Anonymous Coward]

linky.

Seems suspicious though - everything else (all games and periperals) have a ship date of March 2005. I wonder if this has anything to do with the Japanese launch date (hardware will be available then for those willing to import, as the Gameboy hardware itself is the same worldwide - just no US localised titles available).

Re:Release date and price

[DarkMavis]

Thanks!

Re:Release date and price

[Zed2K]

Thats my birthday but no way in hell will I pay $200 for a portable gaming machine.

Re:Release date and price

[Anonymous Coward]

You do realize that they just made both of those up, right? EB would take pre-orders on the second coming if someone could prove that it'd happen.

Re:Release date and price

[JackAxe]

My friend works for GameCrazy and says it's listed for $169 in the computer. Sounds like EB is jacking up their price. :)

Re:Release date and price

[i64X]

What EB says doesn't always go the way they plan it. I ordered Gran Turismo 4 last November from them because they said the relase date was going to be 1/1/2004. We know how that worked out, don't we. :-/

Re:Release date and price

[Anonymous Coward]

GameCrazy also has the PSP going for $350.

Sony's on crack. Nintendo wins.

WiFi

[ItaliaMatt]

Says in the japanese to english translation (thank you worldlingo):
As for the DS user, it is possible to connect with the maximum of 16 people (16 DS) with local wireless network. Guarantee carry-over factor is approximately 10 meters, but depending upon circumstance furthermore it spreads. The high response rate where it is necessary for the communication game play of real time to be guaranteed, IEEE802.11

This sounds cool and I wonder how hackable this would be. I remember the stupid link cables for other portable game consoles.

I wonder how this will compete with teh PSP?

[spacerodent]

Hm Pretty soon we're gunna finally have hand held competition again for the first time in years. THe gameboy advance has been supreme for years and in the next year at most we're looking at the DS and PSP competing with it. (I'm ignoring the Nokia abomination) Let's hope a little healthy competition is good for the market. Personally I'm really looking forward to the PSP, mainly becuase the games seem like they will be focused on a more mature audience. The idea of a turn based metal gear game sounds great.

News flash

[Anonymous Coward]

You're a poseur not a gamer.

Re:News flash

[Anonymous Coward]

Poseur?, phfft. You're quite the pretentious little faggot, aren't you? Got a news flash for you: "gamers" tend to be "losers". You might not be a gamer, but you sure are a loser.

Re:News flash

[Anonymous Coward]

Your sunny disposition is not so distant from that of a loser's.

And still, you just might be a gaming poseur. Hmm.

game cart compatiability!

[sosuke]

i wanna know if i can still use my X-Rom! i wont also if because of the beefy new specs we can get full snes emu, mabye even n64?! check out http://www.pocketsnes.net

Re:game cart compatiability!

[tepples]

You're not going to get N64 emulation anywhere near full speed, as the DS processors are 66 MHz + 33 MHz, while the N64's processors were 93 MHz (CPU) + 60 MHz (tri filler and DSP).

Interesting Design Layout

[SolidiusRock]

This design, although not much different from the last one, does allow for things that most gaming handhelds can't. Real Estate. By having that second screen, you can have a completely different screen for items, map, etc, without comprimising view space. Furthermore, it's obvious that you now have inate stereo support without being required to use headphones. Not to mention a "flexible" screen that can allow you to hold your hands at a specific (compfortable) angle most of the time by having a pivoting screen. Much like a laptop in relation to your neck.

All in all, in specs on technology and considering Sony's major issues with hardware, I'm going to say that the DS will by far be the most stable. Unless Sony does some design tweaks. Personally, the PSP sounds like it might have issues with battery life with the requisite of running a motor for the drive. This is where carts shine.

G&W

[justforaday]

Wow, talk about a rebirth of the Game & Watch line...I just may need to dig up a hundred or so bucks to pick one of these things up when they're released...

Reminds me....

[Karem Lore]

Of those dual screen LCD games like Donkey Kong that I used to play as a boy...

Retro

[VGProjects.com]

Looks very retro to me. But I do like that it looks a bit more like a device then a toy. It does have a sleek stylish appeal to it. I still think the PSP is the better looking of the 2 though.

Re:Retro

[Keruo]

exactly what I thought
I think I have some green donkey kong game from nintendo stashed away somewhere which looks almost identical as that thing

er.. yeah, it's my... uhhhh... pda....

[mr. methane]

Aw heck why even pretend. I'm gonna buy one the day it comes out.

Best part is, I have a son who loves his gameboy, so I don't even have to admit it's for me when I buy it.

I have no idea what ninetendo's overall financial situation is like, but it's sure easy to picture them placing an order for a printing press to mint their own greenbacks, just to cut out the middleman. /me slobbers.

Japanese info not nearly so waffly

[baxissimo]

The Japanese information page on DS contains some good info.

Like it says the DS will have two slots: one for the new compact and slim DS media, and one for GBA media. The thing will play GBA games! Neat! Was that widely known? I sure didn't know it.

Also it will have two CPUs and ARM7 and an ARM9. Doesn't say anything else about them though.

16 channel sound w/stereo headphone jack. 3D graphics better than N64.

Connect up to 16 players (in a 10 meter range) using wireless network. Using either IEEE802.11 or a proprietary protocol. Or connect to the internet over WLAN and you can game with people farther away.

Includes a microphone with which it says you may be able to play games in the future soley with voice commands. Also allows for voice chat during internet gaming. The most interesting thing to me is it says it can detect the direction from which sound is coming and you can use that to direct a character on screen, say by snapping your fingers in the direction you want the character to go.

Other stuff is pretty well known. Double screen, and lower screen is a touch screen, and that will allow for exciting creative new games yada yada...

Re:Japanese info not nearly so waffly

[baxissimo]

... oh and it says both screens are fully 3D capable, and back-lit, "enabling you to play comfortably in any lighting environment".

Re:Japanese info not nearly so waffly

[Illissius]

Interesting, haven't heard half of that (though the backwards compatibility was fairly known). The internet part is especially interesting - did it specifically mention internet gaming over WLAN, or did you just extrapolate that?

Re:Japanese info not nearly so waffly

[baxissimo]

Nope I didn't make it up. It says

"Also, if you connect the DS to the internet using wireless LAN, it is possible to play together with a great many people from far away."

You can see the gibberish translation of the same thing in the next post down.

Re:Japanese info not nearly so waffly

[Illissius]

Which I did, roughly two seconds after hitting the submit button ;).

Sherlock translation of Nintendo site

[Anixamander]

Gotta love OSX...

Feature of NintendoDS
The latest line of game machine ' NintendoD s ' of Nintendo Co., it could not enjoy with the former game machine, until now the unique game play which is not is implemented. Personal entertainment this portable/as for the communication equipment, it was possible, made the wireless communication of 2 types possible to operate in the touch panel sound with two pictures. As for the game developer, being to be possible, to produce the game with completely new conception it does.
The doubles clean two liquid crystal pictures, until now offer the epoch-making game play which is not, can experience the game simultaneously from two points of view. For example, with the race/lace game point of view from the driver's seat, already in one picture it can look at the whole race/lace in one picture. With the roll playing game, the game event happens in one picture, already it is possible in one picture to show the possession item of the prayer. In addition, it can also use two pictures as one large picture and the leading part must push down, it starts projecting the enormous monster. In the future, the user does the game in one picture, in order already for mail exchange with of the DS user to be possible in one picture even, becomes. In the complete 3D picture, the game can enjoy each picture of 3 inches, comfortably with any brightness due to back light.
The function which is not the present game machine, PDA (the portable information terminal) there is a touch screen function the way in the liquid crystal picture under the touch screen. In other words, the prayer operation does not depend on the button and being also the ?to be good, does. It is possible it just touches to the liquid crystal picture, to make the character move with the dedicated pen, and the finger to modify point of view. In addition, if the keyboard software is displayed, also character entry of message and the like is simple. Utilization manner of the touch screen with the idea of the game developer if spreads without. The picture is protected with the film of strength in order to maintain durability, the dedicated pen for inputting has been attached.
As for the microphone prayer perhaps it reaches the point where in the future in just sound can operate the game. As for the DS software, it can recognize everything to the sound which hits the hand from the specification with voice. When liking to make the character move, just to specify the direction with voice it is necessary being it does. Furthermore if audio entry function is utilized, while to do the game with the user, in order for the voice chat which utilizes Internet to be possible even, it becomes.
As for the wireless DS user, the maximum of 16 people (16 DS) with it is possible with local wireless network to connect. Guarantee carry-over factor is approximately 10 meters, but depending upon status furthermore it spreads. The high response rate where it is necessary for the communication game play of real time is guaranteed, also the consumption of the battery is little with the utilization of IEEE802.11 and individual communication protocol. In addition, using wireless LAN, if you connect DS to Internet, also the many people who leave far and possessing also game play are possible.
Depending upon the game shared game software, using wireless communication with the wireless by the fact that it exchanges the data, only 1 there being a game software, it reaches the point where it can enjoy the opposition play with crowd. Using communication, it is possible also to have experiencing "the trial play" of the game software in the multiple prayers, probably is.
The 3D graphics which exceeds ?????? 64 with the graphic engine which 3D anew was developed, was implemented. The game is expressed at 60 frames/second, finely description such as fog effect and cell shading has become possible.
It becomes possible, the game to expand the utilization of sound and music audio with channel sound 16 to be deeper, from it can feel with the body, probab

Re:Sherlock translation of Nintendo site

[narcc]

The picture is protected with the film of strength

Which they found in a secret area in castle 2...

Finally! A/B/X/Y!

[Kredal]

It's about time a portable Nintendo device has four right-thumb buttons! Now they can do GOOD ports of every SNES game, and not have to mess with the controls to make them fit in the confines of the GBA!

Back to the old school

[p4ul13]

It reminds me of the original NES controller. I'm not really in the market for a portable game console, but the retro look makes me start to consider it.

I can't help but think that the resemblance to the old NES is intentional to try to make some sales to people (like me) still clinging to their youth.

...Off to play some Donkey Kong.

Re:Nice try!

[Anonymous Coward]

First off the PSP is Sony's first entry into the mainstream handheld gaming, it's bound to have it's ups and downs, but secondly, PSone and PS2 are FULL FLEDGED CONSOLES not handhelds, so no one would expect backwards compatibility. As for a touch screen...who the hell is gonna take the time to grab a touch-pen or try to grab exceedingly small items on the already small screen with thier big fingers? I can see really great possibilities for homebrew coding uses for the touchscreen rather than practical game usage.

Nintendo, although they know the market are going out on a limb trying something as impractical as the touchscreen. I can see the secondary screen as being a great inventory/map display for what I have or what I've picked up but as for its actual interactivity, I feel its rather too complex for frantic gaming. RPGs and RTS games would fair the best with the second screen but beyond that I can't really see anything really practical. As for Sony its thier first forte into Nintendos "territory" So I wish them the best. I just bought a GBA SP so I don't plan on getting a new GB just for games I wont play. Sony will most likely get my money because of their game lineup. A lot of the games like Gran Turismo and Metal Gear are ones I play on a regular basis at home on the PS2 and if they port over existing games and even make new ports from new games for the PS2 I'll be a happy man.

All in all, its a matter of preferences, as it is with the Console Wars, this will be the same. Some people will like the games on PSP more than DS, some will like the system design more than others, some will enjoy the dual screen/touchscreen concept, some won't, etc, etc. Don't get your panties in a bunch when people voice thier opinions on which handheld they like. You can have the most powerful hardware and all the games in the starting line up you want but in the end it all ends up in the hands of the consumer. Pick your favorite, I have. PSP ^_~

Features of the DS

[Zarian]

Here are a list of features for the Nintendo DS:

Full backwards compatibility with all previous GameBoy systems(the Virtual Boy was not a Gameboy system)
Use of a SD card slot for N.DS games.
Built in 802.11g/wifi, plus Nintendo propriety wireless technology/protocol
2 LCD displays, one standard GBA style screen, one touch sensitive display.
6 action buttons, 4 face buttons 2 shoulder buttons.
Backlit screens.
Microphone port.
Use of the Gameboy cartridge slot for connecting peripherals.
~10 hours of battery life/ rechargeable battery.

Re:DS stands for...?

[Marc Desrochers]

After having read the first 7 replies, I will simply reply to myself since I don't want to reply to you all. I have to admit, I agree with you all. I've never had an interest in mobile gaming, hence my not being Nintendo's target market. None of the games have ever appealed to my gaming tastes. You all seem to make the same point that a device should do one thing well rather than several poorly, which I totally agree with. The only feature which I would personally want, at least as an option, on any device is MP3/OGG. The rest to me is a waste since I too would probably tire quickly of the mediocre quality of all the other features. I'm a strange breed though. I have no cell phone, no digital camera, no PDA. No electronic portable devices at all, except for the pager, but that's job related and I remove it any time I don't HAVE TO be wearing it. I so often find that my friends with such devices become slaves to them, or simply irritating in their social behaviour. I choose not to be, convenience be damned.

Dual Screen

[littleghoti]

Obviously...

Re:Dual Screen

[Anonymous Coward]

DS seems stupid to big and kinda hard to watch 2 screens. And what about sonys new handheld, has huge screen and is a lot smaller......

Re:DS stands for...?

[xNoLaNx]

http://dac.thefathippo.com/nintendods2.PNG you mean that.

Waiting for Pemberton and Squamish

[Psymunn]

Living in Vancouver, BC, microsoft code names humour me quite a bit. Last weekend i was drinking in whistler, sitting at the longhorn salloon with a nice view of blackcomb thinking of all the big skii lodges owned by MS execs.

Re:Nice try!

[EulerX07]

Battery life.

Existing huge gaming library.

Strong 3rd party support.

Reputation in mobile gaming.

No moving parts.

It is a nice try. So nice it'll succeed.

*sigh*

[M.C. Hampster]

I'm sure I will be buying one, but I'm disappointed in the lack of an analog control stick. I really thought Nintendo might have worked it into the final design. There could be issues with trying to get one sturdy enough built into a portable device, but I really think Nintendo could pull it off. Oh well.

Re:*sigh*

[blendmaster]

how do you get an anlog stick on a handheld that folds? on my gb color i had a snap on anlog stick thingy but i had to take it off when i was not using it. they could have somthing like that but definitly not anything built in.

Re:*sigh*

[M.C. Hampster]

how do you get an anlog stick on a handheld that folds?

There are several ways you could do it. You could have the stick mostly inset into the bottom of the case, along with a small dimple in the top to create room. I'm sure it could be done, especially by Nintendo.

It just seems like an analog stick is a must-have for 3D games. You need that precision in your control scheme.

Re:*sigh*

[Anonymous Coward]

You've got touch screen. There you go - custom analog stick. Bit flat though, but could be nice for FPS, RTS, ETC.

Re:*sigh*

[narcc]

It just seems like an analog stick is a must-have for 3D games. You need that precision in your control scheme.

I don't know about that. Wolfenstein 3D and Doom worked fine without an analog joystick. So did Dark Forces and Duke Nukem 3D.

Before anyone says anything about halo or whatever their favorite FPS is, remember that we're talking about a gameboy here.

support?

[minus_273]

how long before an emualtion package is released. I'm sure a machine as powerful as this should be able to emulate gb and gbc. I would also be interested in athe PDA features as well as possible linux builds :)

Re:support?

[Anonymous Coward]

why would you want to emulate gb or gbc games if the system is already backwards compatable?

Re:Finally! A/B/X/Y!

[KevinKnSC]

Yeah, just in time for all the N64 ports! Note to Nintendo: When designing a handheld system capable of running games for $console, please include at least as many buttons as were present on $console's controllers.

Wasted Space

[trashme]

Doesn't the top half of the DS look like so much wasted space? The small screen leaves so much room for nothing but speakers. Why not make the top screen a wide format?

Price of Games

[Anonymous Coward]

Has there been any mention as to the price range for games? I'm expecting around $35 USD.

Some may disagree, but $35 is way too high. I have a GBA SP, but only a few games because I just can't justify paying that much for what amounts to a SNES game on a tiny screen with poor resolution and tinny sound. I can buy PS1 games for under $10 these days, PS2 games for $20 and a few Gamecube games for $20 so why should I spend more money for GBA games?

To make matters worse, from the reviews I've read more than half of the GBA games are utter crap.

Re:Price of Games

[Spleener12]

First off, the PS2 and GC games you speak of are probably fairly old (like, around a year). GBA games at that age are probably the same age, even less if you head to Gamestop and get 'em used. New PS2/GC games actually go for around $40-50 a pop, for the most part.

And more than half of games for every system are utter crap. That's why you read reviews in the first place, no?

Is it just me?

[vsigma]

or this is just like the old school handhelds that nintendo used to sell with the dual LCD screens (remember king kong and the one with the 'walking' jaws and vines you had to climb in a green case?)?

Are video games starting to become like fashion - every 20 years, we start back where we started??

Re:Is it just me?

[Spleener12]

remember king kong and the one with the 'walking' jaws and vines you had to climb in a green case?

That's Donkey Kong- DK Jr, if I recall correctly.

Somewhat off topic, a company sued Nintendo back in the 80s claiming that DK was a rip off of King Kong. (Monkey kidnaps girl, etc etc) If I recall correctly, the lawsuit ended when it turned out the company didn't even own the rights to King Kong in the first place.

And the resemblance to the G&W system is probably a coincidence, but given the recent surge in old school Nintendo stuff, you probably are right with the fashion comparison.

Re:Is it just me?

[J-Hawker]

"Somewhat off topic, a company sued Nintendo back in the 80s claiming that DK was a rip off of King Kong. (Monkey kidnaps girl, etc etc) If I recall correctly, the lawsuit ended when it turned out the company didn't even own the rights to King Kong in the first place." Not only did MCA not own the rights to King Kong, but Nintendo used a prior case in which MCA argued that King Kong was in the public domain to win the lawsuit.

Throwback to the 80s

[chrispl]

I had a little japanese Nintendo games that followed the EXACT same design back in the mid 1980s.

I remember one had the Mario Bros shuffling boxes around, another had the Disney characters putting out fires.

It was a flip top just like this with the screens and controls in about the same positions.

So technically for Nintendo this is a retro design.

Unfair moderation on parent

[Anonymous Coward]

What the hell? Offtopic? He's talking about the DS, you know, and simply commenting that it looks like a combination of the GBA SP and the GBA. If you, you know, RTFA, then you might think that too.

(fucking dumbass mods...)

Blah

[Anonymous Coward]

The Sony PSP looks way better. Built in bluetooth, WIFI and even a camera! Can't wait to buy one.

Re:Blah

[Anonymous Coward]

You're either trolling or just severely misinformed.

PSP does not have bluetooth. It uses WiFi for everything, while DS has WiFI and a custom-developed analog to bluetooth.

PSP does not have a built-in camera, either.

So if you're trolling, you got me. That's okay, I'm fucking anonymous.

tv tuner?

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm just wondering but why doesn't nintendo add a tv tuner option to gameboys? I know there are a couple for GB advance but they're pretty bulky.

Advance Wars is cartoony but mature gameplay

[xswl0931]

Advance Wars is an example of a game with cartoony graphics, but with gameplay that adult gamers will enjoy (turn based strategy).

Virtual Boy

[Jagasian]

This one looks like it is going to be another Virtual Boy. The split screen thing is bad for so many reasons. A better design would have been a Gameboy Advance SP with a larger screen, faster CPU, more memory, better battery life, built-in wifi, and games stored in flash memory (10 games take up the same amount of physical space as 1 game).

My point is that the Gameboy line has proven itself, and evolutionary improvements to the Gameboy line have also proven themselves. However, revolutionary changes have proven themselves to be bad ideas (e.g. Virtual Boy).

Re:Virtual Boy

[Anonymous Coward]

Fine, I'll bite. Sure, it would be cool to have games stored in memory, and I think on all other points it at least matches the GBASP. Regardless of that, though, why are 2 screens "bad for so many reasons"? Can you list a few of those reasons for us?

Re:Virtual Boy

[Anonymous Coward]

I love Nintendo for having made the Virtual Boy.

Its name alone has become a litmus test to differentiate between real gamers who know what they're talking about, and "gamers" who spend too much time reading video game history summaries on the web to know what constitutes a good gaming system or even a good game.

Understand that your "Virtual Boy" metaphor is tied to your narrow perception of the Nintendo brand name, not any true relationship between the VB and the DS. Once you can do that, you'll have caught up with the rest of us.

Re:Virtual Boy

[grumbel]

Two screens aren't much usefull for gaming. Sure there might be this or that nice idea that will provide nice new gameplay, but for the majority of games the second screen will just display the map or some other not much usefull information that could easily made available via the pause screen menu. Just one large screen would certainly be more usefull for most games.

The only thing that makes the second screen interesting is the touchscreen ability, however I doubt that it will be that much usefull for most games.

Last not least, the second screen looks like a waste, both screens are the same size, so the upper half of the DS just looks extremly empty, would have made much more sense to just make the second screen smaller, since for sure most games will use it only for secondary information, not for game critical stuff.

Re:Virtual Boy

[Anonymous Coward]

I find that most games (that I play, at least) are better on a bigger screen because of all the status information/palettes that are displayed on the main screen. You've often got time, score, lifeforce, power levels, spells/items/widgets tray, etc., on there which all could be nicely displayed on the second screen meaning that all the space on the (admittedly small) main screen is actual gameplay. As for the map, yes, that's easily available via a pause screen, but that pulls you out of the game. I and most gamers I know prefer to see a map during play since when it's needed is often when you're lost or heading towards some specific target and it's a real pain to have to keep jumping back to the map screen to see if you've missed a turn in the dark or something. I think that's a big reason why a lot of games have a map that overlays the gameplay, which is nice so long as you can turn it off when you don't want it but can really clutter things up.

Personally, I'm looking forward to an always-on map or a tray of magic spells that I can select by touching them rather than using a pop-up display or the like, but mostly I'm interested to see what developers with creativity do with it that I'm not even thinking about at this point.

Re:Virtual Boy

[Jagasian]

WTF are you talking about? I used to own a Virtual Boy, retard. The stereoscopic effect was cool, but the red and black LED-like color of the graphics was lame.

Re:Virtual Boy

[PhoenixFlare]

Nintendo is just damned if they do and damned if they don't these days. If they put out more of the same, they're blasted by people that think they're unimaginative and stale. If they move on to different things, people like you moan about how nothing new could possibly work out, and they should just upgrade their old designs forever.

I say: Kudos to Nintendo for still being willing to take chances. If you don't like the new stuff they put out, don't buy it.

How the fuck do mods rate you up?

[Inoshiro]

As you can clearly see from this image that's been on PlanetGamecube since this morning, it's a power button! Why do mods reward people who can't be bothered to look at the zoomed version of pictures? It's not hard!

What is hard is to RTFA and actually make an insightful comment, or draw attention to something not covered by the subject material. The parent post does not do this!

Re:How the fuck do mods rate you up?

[Anonymous Coward]

yeah, i was also thinking how anybody can get a +5 by whining as well.

j/k :)

D'oh!

[Spleener12]

I meant that the PS1 was significantly less powerful, yes.

Innovative system v.ss Innovative games

[Verrou]

I continue to see posts about how everyone is excited to see Nintendo innovating in the handheld market, and excited by the processing power the new DS boasts. I'd like to point out though that the real key to the handheld gaming market is far less the system, and far more the games. What it seems to me that most reviewers and market watchers miss is that handheld gaming is really a paradigm shift from standard video gaming.

Consider how handheld gamers play: they are constantly on the go, often they want to play for only a couple of minutes at a time to fill time in between other tasks. Screen size, more than screen resolution, limits the detail with games may be displayed, etc, etc...

I am far more interested in seeing what games come out for the DS than the system itself - this is the reason that I put little faith in the PSP (disclaimer: I am platform agnostic, owning both a GameCube, and PS2). Truth be told this is really where Nintendo's strength lies; creating and publishing high quality games appropriate for the system on which they have been created.

-Just my 2 Cents

Re:Innovative system v.ss Innovative games

[Anonymous Coward]

Don't get me wrong, I find your viewpoint logical and admirable, but is it really all that impossible to envision how the capabilities of the hardware affect the effectiveness of the software?

The potential for innovation is far greater on the Nintendo system. Greater potential may not always lead to greater achievements, but it certainly does not preclude them. And come on, we're talking about Nintendo here, the masters of the art. I fully expect to be entertained by what's in store with the DS to a degree that is logistically impossible with the PSP, given its design limitations. Perhaps that would be different if I were into low-res movies on the go, but I certainly am NOT (for reasons you mention). The PSP is not in my immediate future partially because of this.

looks rather old

[qkw]

I'm seeing a direct parallel to those old handheld computer game "consoles" from about 10 to 15 years ago. You all know the ones, so I have one simple question.

Will I be able to play that King Kong game thing? Catching people or things flying out of windows is just my thang.

Re:looks rather old

[urbaer]

I'm seeing a direct parallel to those old handheld computer game "consoles" from about 10 to 15 years ago.
I assume you mean the Nintendo Game and Watch.

Will I be able to play that King Kong game thing?
You mean Donkey Kong? Yes.

Plus the other great features

[Anonymous Coward]

This thing has got 801.11b and Bluetooth too... so this is gonna be great. You'll be able to use Chat, which has a call feature to "Ring" other DS's on your local 802.11b LAN. Go on the net using the 802.11b lan as an access point to check your mail - This machine is gonna be the business.
Who wants to watch a Movie on your handheld? I know my arms would get tired holding it up? Nintendo all the way. They are the only people to innovate!

Open Style

[ssssmemyself]

Open Style! You know what you doing! Open Style for great justice!

what a scoop

[real_smiff]

"Nintendo has announced the final name of their Nintendo DS handheld, and it will be called... Nintendo DS."

thanks Ravi, thanks Slashdot. i'd be lost without you.
(sorry, i must be the only person who thought this was funny. maybe there was some irony in there, or even a changed letter, but i missed it).

great story! yay for nintendo! i'll buy me a DS!

It's just me or...

[MorseKode]

I really don't like the idea of a handheld with 2 screens, i mean i thinks it's ugly, unpractical, and wouldn't a second screen distract your vision from the first one? Why do they need 2 screens instead of a bigger one like the PSP ?
I think, that Sony as (almost everytime) design it's far far better than this 2 screen mounstrosity.

Thank you

[GoofyBoy]

Interesting.

Too bad you haven't been modded up yet.

Is it just me, or somebody else thinks that

[melted]

two screens are a bad idea? How can this possibly improve the gameplay? I can only see one screen at a time anyway.

Re:Is it just me, or somebody else thinks that

[MorseKode]

Well, if you read the post under yours, you would clearly see you are not the only one.

My favorite thing about GBA

[baxissimo]

My favorite thing about GBA -- that in my mind makes it even better than the consoles -- is this: no freaking region code crap.

I can walk into a store in Akihabara and buy me a game and it plays just fine on my US purchased unit, no modding necessary.

I wonder if DS will continue the region free practice. I just have this sneaking suspicition that Sony is planning to use region codes on PSP.

And I must have a PSP...

[Rallion]

...because two hojillion megahertz are clearly superior to one hojillion megahertz. Logically, this machine must be exactly twice as much fun as a handheld game with only one hojillion megahertz.

I can barely control my excitement, because it is a given that Sony will eventually release the PSP2 with four hojillion megahertz. That amount of fun is sure to explode the heads of children and the elderly.

(The prediction in mine is more realistic, and yet more asinine. Wee.)

Re:Nice try!

[coopaq]

Care to rethink your statement?

I believe the PSP will have better hardware, better style, faster CPU and a nicer screen and therefore allow "better" games.

I am after the quality of the games instead of quantity.

Playing a slew of old games for older hardware is ok and I like MAME, but the new technology and great NEW games is what I am after and believe the PSP will deliver.

The Playstation took over the console market and Sony seems like they will have repeat performance with the PSP.

In any case as always I will buy both. It's just a question of which one I will enjoy more.

Current pecking order in my house in order of enjoyment is: PC, XBox, PS2, GC, DC, GBA, PocketPC. MAME on PocketPC is great though!

I'm astonished...

[Thedalek]

It seems I'm the only one who looked at the closed version from the angle they pictured it, and thought, "Why are they making a silver Virtual Boy?"

Miyamoto Interview

[curmi]

For those who are complaining that Nintendo has cartoony graphics and produce only kids games, you might find the following interview interesting.

http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2004/07/29/10906 94037678.html

I personally prefer the Miyamoto philosophy (I'm 35), but I admit I may be in the minority in the western world.

Re:Nice try!

[Anonymous Coward]

Wasn't the ps1 sony's first foray into the console market?
Didn't it do incredibly well against the existing established competition (Nintendo again)

The implicit logic is that a better machine allows for games with more features, and more powerful code. That is why it is likely that the PSP will do reasonably well.

Personally I Like the idea of the DS and will be getting one of them and staying away from Sony products (I've never really liked anything from ps other than tekken and then it's nothing next to arcade) but I'm hardly indicative of the market at large

Tetris Attack for DS

[tepples]

You can play many GB mono compatible games in emulation using a GBA flash cart. This includes Pokemon Yellow, Gold, and Silver, which Nintendo hasn't announced porting. This does not include Crystal or Puzzle.

However, Pokemon Puzzle was remade for GBA, under the name "Panel de Pon", one of the multiboot extras in Nintendo Puzzle Collection (Japan only). Rumors claim that the DS doesn't seem to support GBA multibooting or any other GBA link cable functionality; if you want to play Pokemon Puzzle on a DS, you'll need a GBA flash card and the ripped .mb ROM. If your flash card's menu software doesn't support ROMs in .mb format, you'll need a multiboot menu as well.

And if anybody cracks DS's smaller Game Paks, watch somebody port Snes9x, and you'll be able to play Tetris Attack, the Super NES version of Pokemon Puzzle.

Re:Tetris Attack for DS

[TechniMyoko]

I have the Nintendo Puzzle Collection, Ive yet to figure out how to copy the multiboot rom onto the flashcart ins ome manner. Assistance would be appreciated as Ive asked the maker of my cart to no avail.

On a side note, I wrote the gamefaqs menu translation guide for puzzle coll.

Re:Tetris Attack for DS

[tepples]

Ive yet to figure out how to copy the multiboot rom onto the flashcart ins ome manner.

You have to figure out the multiboot protocol and then write a GBA program that receives the file and pretends to execute it but instead writes it over the serial port to a PC. I think Loopy wrote such a program, but I can't seem to find it.

Or you could just pirate the already dumped multiboot collection off some GBA warez site. Look for Panel de Pon and lots of NES games in "GameCube Multiboot Games (c) Nintendo (J) - EURASIA", available on eMule as "EUR-MBGC".

Re:Tetris Attack for DS

[TechniMyoko]

I managed to find the nfo (useless) but no the actual file.

Who decided to use nfo as an extention, windows uses that for system information, why didnt they just use txt?

Re:Tetris Attack for DS

[tepples]

Who decided to use nfo as an extention, windows uses that for system information, why didnt they just use txt?

I think warez groups' use of the .nfo suffix, which represents text in the Code Page 437 encoding (as opposed to .txt, which most commonly represents ISO 8859-1), predated Windows's use.

That said, I found this on eMule (you'll need to strip spaces because /. can't handle ed2k links): ed2k://|file|Panel.de.Pon.(J).mb|210304|2BE95356AC C09344D9DE939E8F3CD71A|/

Re:Tetris Attack for DS

[TechniMyoko]

Found/downloaded it, and I offer my gratitude.

Sega Nomad

[tepples]

No. Atari Lynx had a CPU ("Mikey") and a blitter ("Suzy"). The blitter wasn't programmable in any meaningful way, not like the Jaguar "Tom" and "Jerry" coprocessors. Calling the Lynx dual-CPU would be like calling my Celeron 866 MHz PC dual-CPU because its TNT2 GPU is more than just a dumb frame buffer.

The Sega Nomad, on the other hand, had both a Motorola MC68000 and a Zilog Z80.

PS2 through PS4

[tepples]

The Playstation 2 was referred to as "Playstation 2" long before its announcement, if I recall correctly.

I remember reading an article sometime in the mid-1990s when Sony announced the names "PlayStation 2", "PlayStation 3", and "PlayStation 4" for its next consoles. Remember that this is from well before the Final Fantasy VII era. Back in 1994-1995, Sony required all developers to go through the 3D API in the BIOS, so that Sony could just upgrade the MIPS processor and reimplement the 3D API to match the new console's hardware rather than requiring the new system to be register-compatible (which is what Sony ended up doing anyway).

Then Sony ended up announcing the "PlayStation 9" names (and by implication, "PlayStation 3" through "PlayStation 8") in an early commercial for the PS2.

Pressure-sensitive + Control Pad

[tepples]

Does Sony have a patent on pressure-sensitive buttons such as those used in the Dual Shock 2 controller? If not, watch Nintendo make the DS's Control Pad pressure-sensitive.

Phone and music player for GBA

[tepples]

Unless this thing has an MP3 player, a phone and a digital camera [...] I don't imagine it will be that hot of a seller.

The Game Boy Advance system has a camera and a passable music player (which converts the MP3s to GSMs first). Not everybody who buys Nintendo handheld game hardware can afford 40 USD/mo for mobile phone service.

Anybody notice..

[Coleco]

it looks like the old nintendo handheld games.. cool!

Check it out:

http://www.retro-trader.com/nintendohand.htm

They changed something else!

[osrevad]

LIEK OMG! They actually put TWO speakers on it

Re:DS stands for...?

[ildon]

Uh... totally ignoring all the GB games playable on the GBA, there are still hundreds of games of pretty much every genre ever released on a console, so what exactly are your gaming tastes? MMORPGS? RTS's? Flight sims?

Re:Nice try!

[Anonymous Coward]

You're right, better hardware always means better games. That's why the N64 dominated the PS1, the Dreamcast destroyed them both, the X-box totally dominated the PS2, and the GameGear owned the handheld market back in the early 90's.

Oh wait none of that happened. Idiot.

Re:DS stands for...?

[Rabenblut]

This has been said so many times, but...

I have a neat digital camera and a Sony cd-MP3 player.

I never use them.

My SonyEricsson K700 is a so-so camera and a crappy videocamera. Also a radio and a mp3 player with way to little memory and battery life. It's also pretty hard to write email with it, especially longer ones. The BBC wap page is really small and there is only one picture per news article. The http version of the site is either very slow og fails to load completely.

This is still a LOT better than my MP3 player, radio, camera, and all the other specialized gizmos because they are all back home og lost or the charger is somewhere else or...

Anyway, the phone is in my pocket ALL the time so I can use it all the time. It's also a great phone and gets good connections. Connection quality of course usually depends on the network and not the phone, but you get the picture.

Re:Finally! A/B/X/Y!

[cynical kane]

Actually, it would be great to have a port of Mario 64 that could use the touch-screen thing for the camera, instead of those stupid yellow buttons.

HUGE DS pics look like PDA

[Anonymous Coward]

Check out these nice pictured of the DS, this thing almost looks like a PDA and it has a stylus!

Re:Finally! A/B/X/Y!

[KevinKnSC]

It seems like going back and forth between the touchscreen and the regular buttons would be slow, though.

Ugly

[Peachy]

It's an ugly beast. That latest pic bears more than a passing resemblence to the original Game&Watch dual screen games.