Slashdot Mirror
Airport Security vs. Cyborg Steve Mann
CompaniaHill writes: "The New York Times (free reg, etc.) has a story on University of Toronto engineering-professor-turned-cyborg Steve Mann's recent run-in with humorless airport security. Apparently his preplanning and documents were sufficient to get him through the Toronto airport security on his way to St. John's in Newfoundland, but not sufficient to get him through the St. John's airport security on his way home. Two days later, after strip-searches, forced removal of implants and x-raying and other ill-handling of delicate hardware, he returned home in a wheelchair. Mann's lawyer is attempting to recover the cost of the $56,800 in damaged hardware, while his doctors are studying his body's response to the removal of the implants, some of which he has had for over twenty years."
Good Salon article at http://www.salon.com/tech/feature/1999/10/20/cybor g/ if anyone's interested in more...
Welcome to Canada... bend over please.
crazy dynamite monkey
my god! what good are cyborgs if they can't even contend with simple airport security officers?
darth vader would be ashamed!
Just raise the taxes on crack.
No, you suck it, you were beat by carrolljim by like a minute. Suck it. Suck it.
How the heck do they force the removal of implants? Shouldn't they just say "Sorry, you can't board this plane?"
For those of you who don't know, Prof. Mann is generally considered to be the "Father" of Wearable computers, having contstructed one of the first ones out of an Apple 2 in the early 80s to portably control his photographic equipment. He is now a professor at the University of Toronto; he also has an informative personal web page.
Hilary Rosen's speech was about her love of money and her desire to roll around naked in a pile of money.
Anyone else see that show on the MIT (IIRC) guy who had a wearable computer?
Face rec, face rec!
Wow, I can totally cripple someone far more learned than me _and_ make seven dollars an hour! Woo-hoo!
Seriously, though, next time, take another route home. Zeppelin or something.
--saint
What the hell? What if someone has a pace maker? And X-Ray radiation really isn't the type of stuff that you want to play around with. I hope he takes them for all they're worth.
A penile implant, with sufficent force, can be used as a weapon.
Job? I don't have time to get a job! Who will sit around and bitch about being broke and unemployed then?
does anyone have a generic login for NYT? it appears they bashed the slashdot2000/slashdot2000 one
I thought that people with metal implants got papers stating what kind of implant and where they are? Even so, that treatment was utter bull; you'd think that at a certain point you would just know that the guy is ok!
;)
Anyway, if he's a cyborg, why not just strap on the optional jet pack and fly there yourself?
Vote monkeys into Congress. They are cheaper and more trustworthy.
Seriously? What serious harm could they have thought he could really do?
"Oh my god, he's going to TYPE SOMETHING"
geez.
This is even worse than them rifling through my PDA when I get on the plane.
"Peace, Love and Apathy"
if anyone read my post a week ago, airport security is simply retarded. they decide they are going to nail someone and they do just that.
me and my girlfriend had to wait for 2 minutes while they chemical tested all of luggage and carry ons, and shoes and purses for explosives. this was because her shoes (complete with metal shoe lace ends) set off the metal detector.
later in the trip tourists are posing with the reserve offices for pictures... i saw this many times. tourists have their arms inches away from machine guns carried by 5 foot tall women and all the airport cares about are my stinky shoes.
then the kicker is the woman on the airplane knitting with HUGE knitting needles.
this guys sensor that opens doors is going to do about as much damage as my stinky shoe. yes, when i fly i want to be safe, and that is why i defend the 'fly naked' campaign.
MARIJUANA, SHROOMS, X: ONLINE?! - E
You can take the machine out of the man,
but you can't the man out of the machine.
Welcome my friends, welcome to the machine.
No I'm not trolling.
ma, this one event deals with a lot of issues. Overbearing security, not having any authority to review situations like this on a case by case basis, whats happens when some one is unplugged, how being "plugged in" for long periods of time might effect you phsyology.
I hope all the facets of this incident are followed.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
but it's about 450k. http://wearcam.org/steve5.jpg
Dear Slashdot: next time you want to mess with the site, add a rich-text editor for comments.
A monopoly in "Canaduh". Above any kind of boycott or reprisal. Basically, fly with us, or walk. And if you don't like our attitude, eff you. Stop flying? We'll just get the government to tax your ass harder to pay for all our surly, incompetent staff.
He's lucky they only damaged his implants.
--- Jump!! Fire!! Bullet time!! - Lego version of the Matrix
as i refuse to signup for the ny times site:
Does anyone have a mirror of this article?
In a related story, Britney Spears announced that she would never perform in Canada again.
only half a Mann?
JOhn
Campaign for Liberty
That they destroyed his equipment and pulled off is electrodes was wrong, and they should be held accountable for this. No airport security agent should ever be unprofessional like that (which is why I support the federalization program currently in progress in the US). But the guy had to be inspected.
sulli
RTFJ.
The article you reference is about Kevin Warwick. HE is a plonker who likes to get press by putting a TINY chip in his arm to turn on the lights when he comes to work, or has a chip plugged into his (AND HIS WIFE'S) neurons so they can have better sex. In short, a POSER compared to Mann.
HOLY SHIT, Idiot! You're not even talking about the same ideas, never MIND the same person! Get your facts straight!
I love the way the security guards seem to make a point out of stopping people who obviously ARE NOT threats. Remember the story about the Medal of Honor recipeient a few weeks ago? Why was he searched? How many other more credible threats stroll onto planes while the security guards are busy with Grampa and Grandma? Maybe the security guards "Atta" pay attention to who is walking by them, and not just pick every third person, eh?
"It's not a war on drugs, it's a war on personal freedom. Keep that in mind at all times." Bill Hicks
slashdot9999/slashdot9999
Seven of Nine whine this bad when they removed her implants.
Stevis
We've got two lives, one we're given, and the other one we make. --Mary Chapin Carpenter
How can you be that much of a freak and not expect to get hassled?
Don't these airport security people watch TV? There are only but a few doctors in Starfleet who could successfully re-assimilate a Borg back into society yet these yahoos try to do it on their own, and without the aid of at least an EMH Mark I.
'Same speed C but faster'
Steve Mann SEEKING COMPENSATION - Prof. Steve Mann, a walking experiment in wearable computers, went through a three-day ordeal trying to board an Air Canada plane bound for Toronto.
TEVE MANN, an engineering professor at the University of Toronto, has lived as a cyborg for more than 20 years, wearing a web of wires, computers and electronic sensors that are designed to augment his memory, enhance his vision and keep tabs on his vital signs. Although his wearable computer system sometimes elicited stares, he never encountered any problems going through the security gates at airports.
Last month that changed. Before boarding a Toronto-bound plane at St. John's International Airport in Newfoundland, Dr. Mann says, he went through a three-day ordeal in which he was ultimately strip- searched and injured by security personnel. During the incident, he said, $56,800 worth of his $500,000 equipment was lost or damaged beyond repair, including the eyeglasses that serve as his display screen.
His lawyer in Toronto, Gary Neinstein, sent letters two weeks ago to Air Canada (news/quote), the airport and the Canadian transportation authority arguing that they acted negligently and seeking reimbursement for the damaged equipment so that Dr. Mann could put his wearable computer back together again.
The difficulties that Dr. Mann faced seem related to the tightening of security in airports since the terrorist attacks of Sept. 11. But he had flown from Toronto to St. John's two days earlier without a hitch.
On that day, Feb. 16, he said, he followed the routine he has used on previous flights. He told the security guards in Toronto that he had already notified the airline about his equipment. He showed them documentation, some of it signed by his doctor, that described the wires and glasses, which he wears every waking minute as part of his internationally renowned research on wearable computers.
He also asked for permission not to put his computer through the X-ray machine because the device is more sensitive than a laptop. He said that the guards examined his equipment and allowed him to board the flight.
But when he tried to board his return flight on Feb. 18, his experience was entirely different. This time, he said, he was told to turn his computer on and off and put it on the X-ray machine. He took his case to Neil Campbell, Air Canada's customer service manager at the St. John's airport, and spent the next two days arranging conversations between his university colleagues and the airline.
The security guards continued to require that he turn his machine on and off and put it through the X-ray machine while also tugging on his wires and electrodes, he said. Still not satisfied, the guards took him to a private room for a strip-search in which, he said, the electrodes were torn from his skin, causing bleeding, and several pieces of equipment were strewn about the room.
Once his system was turned off, turned on again, X-rayed and dismantled, Dr. Mann passed the security check. When he was finally allowed to go home, some pieces of equipment were not returned to him, he said, and his glasses were put in the plane's baggage compartment although he warned that cold temperatures there could ruin them.
Without a fully functional system, he said, he found it difficult to navigate normally. He said he fell at least twice in the airport, once passing out after hitting his head on what he described as a pile of fire extinguishers in his way. He boarded the plane in a wheelchair.
"I felt dizzy and disoriented and went downhill from there," he said.
Air Canada said that there was no record that any of Dr. Mann's baggage had been lost and that the Canadian transportation agency, Transport Canada, had required that his belongings be X-rayed. "We don't tell the security firms that there is going to be an exception made," said Nicole Couture-Simard, a spokeswoman for Air Canada. "We don't have that authority."
Transport Canada declined to comment on the case except to say that it was reviewing it.
Considering that even tweezers may be confiscated when a passenger boards a flight these days, the stricter scrutiny that Dr. Mann faced may not seem surprising. But for him, the experience raises the question of how a traveler will fare once wearable computing devices are such fixtures on the body that a person will not be able to part with them.
"We have to make sure we don't go into a police state where travel becomes impossible for certain individuals," Dr. Mann said.
Since losing the use of his vision system and computer memory several weeks ago, he said, he cannot concentrate and is behaving differently. He is now undergoing tests to determine whether his brain has been affected by the sudden detachment from the technology.
Alejandro R. Jahad, director of the University of Toronto's Program in E-Health Innovation, who has worked closely with Dr. Mann, said that scientists now had an opportunity to see what happens when a cyborg is unplugged. "I find this a very fascinating case," he said
Of course, this isn't much compared to the abuse some other people take. Innocent people regularly get sodomized by security who "know" they are drug mules, and verbally abused and humilitated despite being clean. (I call it sodomy, because what else would you call it when someone shoves their fingers up your bodily orifices against your will?)
That said, I wonder if Canada's legal system is as hot on violations of rights as the USA's once was. Somehow I think it's not, and the deterrent effect of lawsuits isn't likely to change the practice.
Scientists restrict study to entire physical universe; creationist
This is *not* Kevin Warwick, the British psuedoscience jackass who's been walking around for a few years with an RFID pet tag under his skin.
It is Professor Steve Mann (http://eyetap.org/mann/), one of the first inventors of a *real* wearable, and a downright cool guy. I didn't know he had any implants- does anyone have any more information? I'd imagine his equipment would be a bit more advanced than the snake-oil Warwick's been showing around.
You may want to read a little closer. His wearable computer couldn't go through because it was more sensitive than a laptop. He wasn't carrying a laptop, as far as the article says. His equipment was more sensitive.
I understand them wanting to check him out, and maybe even a strip search is in order, but when they had documentation signed by his doctor stating everything he's said, and they were unwilling to accomodate his requests to speak in person to his doctor or colleagues, yet still will not make an exception... there is a problem. Furthermore, their disregard for sensitivity of his equipment is a travesty. He may very well be suffering serious problems now because some $10/hour monkey didn't know when to quit.
Every once in a while I like to masturbate a new word into my vocabulary, even if I don't know what it means.
While we want to make sure people can express themselves and make interesting uses of technology, how in the world are the various security systems going to deal with people "embedded" with weapons and even bombs?
- James
It's freaking me out. Why is the article making such a big deal about turning the computer on and off? I'm guessing it can handle it and cause no significant damange to man nor machine.
Unless they had him turn it off and on in the style of BOFH...
We should make a video game out of this.
The terrors of travelling with the new airport security measures.
"All Your Implants Are Belong To Us"
Sounds like a hit to me.
"Peace, Love and Apathy"
To be so completely integrated into one's computers - it must be a godlike feeling, to have all that data available at will. And then to lose all that power, all that data and insulation from the day-to-day world - no wonder Mann feels crippled. I remember reading that people who depend heavily on electronic organizers to store contact info have a harder time remembering phone numbers and addresses, and I know that my spelling skills have deteriorated slightly since I started relying more on spellcheck.
I know this is something that's not really going to sound right, but "rape" is the best word I can think of to describe this. Where the hell were this guys lawyers? How could the security dudes not realize what an incredib;e achievement Mann's gear is? I repeat: that poor bastard.
I'm the stranger...posting to
glad to see someone else sees the other side here. how can they validate the doctot's papers? how can they know it's not a bomb? many make the point these security gaurds are generally dubm. and they are. too dumb to tell the difference between a wearable computing aparatus and something potentially dangerous. imagine that. personally I hope they're always more careful than smart...
we speak the way we breathe --Fugazi
What about Kevin Warwick? I imagine he'll never be flying again, either.
What we call folk wisdom is often no more than a kind of expedient stupidity.-Edward Abbey
Some airport security people are pretty dumb -- but I just can't picture one dumb enough to let a Sith Lord board!
Even though everyone knows that all reporters everywhere are completely unbiased (wink, wink, nudge, nudge), I think that it is important to consider that we are very likely only hearing one side of the story here.
--something witty
You, sir, are obviously a fucking imbecile.
I think the breathless police-state tone of this story is going a wee bit overboard.
From reading the New York Times article, it doesn't sound like Mann had any "implants" "forcibly removed". It sounds like they tore electrodes off his body. In other words, they pulled tape off his skin, and it caused bleeding. Unpleasant, sure, but it's not like they strapped him down and used a drill to extract chips from his brain. More like they pulled off a Band-Aid too fast.
The reason that he ended up in a wheelchair was that since he no longer had his cyborg navigation gear, he supposedly got confused while walking around the airport and hit his head on a pile of fire extinguishers. I don't even know where to start with that one.
Now, clearly what happened sucks, because $56,000 of gear was lost or damaged. Clearly he should be repaid, and probably security was rude to him. But I don't think it's all that shocking, given that here's a guy, covered in wires and batteries, getting on a plane post 9/11.
In my opinion, the truly interesting part of this article is that once his technological aids were removed, this guy ceased to be able to complete basic tasks like walking. This has significant ramifications for wearable computing. Is it augmented reality? Or is it a crutch without which he can't function?
Monkeytreats
Sorry old chap, you're a troll.
and pulled off is electrodes was wrong,
Based on this one comment I could claim Mann is a pretty lousy hardware designer.
What he did was the equivalent of soldering the keyboard to the motherboard. Couldn't he have at least forseen having to one-day disconnect and had instead used a micro molex connector or something?
Duh.
https://www.accountkiller.com/removal-requested
Toronto and St. John's are two very different places. Toronto being the largest city in Canada and St. John's is more of a small town. He has a documentary made about him that was heavily advertised in T.O. Other parts of the country don't have a clue about him (sometimes i wish i didn't have a clue either - the documentary kept my attention for about 30 seconds)
Without a fully functional system, he said, he found it difficult to navigate normally. He said he fell at least twice in the airport, once passing out after hitting his head on what he described as a pile of fire extinguishers in his way. He boarded the plane in a wheelchair.
am i the only one who thinks this is funny? malfunctioning cyborg tripping through a rural airport. i hope that's in the next documentary.
Since losing the use of his vision system and computer memory several weeks ago, he said, he cannot concentrate and is behaving differently. He is now undergoing tests to determine whether his brain has been affected by the sudden detachment from the technology.
maybe the strip search really got to him...
March 14, 2002
At Airport Gate, a Cyborg Unplugged
By LISA GUERNSEY
SEEKING COMPENSATION - Prof. Steve Mann, a walking experiment in wearable computers, went through a three-day ordeal trying to board an Air Canada plane bound for Toronto.
STEVE MANN, an engineering professor at the University of Toronto, has lived as a cyborg for more than 20 years, wearing a web of wires, computers and electronic sensors that are designed to augment his memory, enhance his vision and keep tabs on his vital signs. Although his wearable computer system sometimes elicited stares, he never encountered any problems going through the security gates at airports.
Last month that changed. Before boarding a Toronto-bound plane at St. John's International Airport in Newfoundland, Dr. Mann says, he went through a three-day ordeal in which he was ultimately strip- searched and injured by security personnel. During the incident, he said, $56,800 worth of his $500,000 equipment was lost or damaged beyond repair, including the eyeglasses that serve as his display screen.
His lawyer in Toronto, Gary Neinstein, sent letters two weeks ago to Air Canada (news/quote), the airport and the Canadian transportation authority arguing that they acted negligently and seeking reimbursement for the damaged equipment so that Dr. Mann could put his wearable computer back together again.
The difficulties that Dr. Mann faced seem related to the tightening of security in airports since the terrorist attacks of Sept. 11. But he had flown from Toronto to St. John's two days earlier without a hitch.
On that day, Feb. 16, he said, he followed the routine he has used on previous flights. He told the security guards in Toronto that he had already notified the airline about his equipment. He showed them documentation, some of it signed by his doctor, that described the wires and glasses, which he wears every waking minute as part of his internationally renowned research on wearable computers.
He also asked for permission not to put his computer through the X-ray machine because the device is more sensitive than a laptop. He said that the guards examined his equipment and allowed him to board the flight.
But when he tried to board his return flight on Feb. 18, his experience was entirely different. This time, he said, he was told to turn his computer on and off and put it on the X-ray machine. He took his case to Neil Campbell, Air Canada's customer service manager at the St. John's airport, and spent the next two days arranging conversations between his university colleagues and the airline.
The security guards continued to require that he turn his machine on and off and put it through the X-ray machine while also tugging on his wires and electrodes, he said. Still not satisfied, the guards took him to a private room for a strip-search in which, he said, the electrodes were torn from his skin, causing bleeding, and several pieces of equipment were strewn about the room.
Once his system was turned off, turned on again, X-rayed and dismantled, Dr. Mann passed the security check. When he was finally allowed to go home, some pieces of equipment were not returned to him, he said, and his glasses were put in the plane's baggage compartment although he warned that cold temperatures there could ruin them.
Without a fully functional system, he said, he found it difficult to navigate normally. He said he fell at least twice in the airport, once passing out after hitting his head on what he described as a pile of fire extinguishers in his way. He boarded the plane in a wheelchair.
"I felt dizzy and disoriented and went downhill from there," he said.
Air Canada said that there was no record that any of Dr. Mann's baggage had been lost and that the Canadian transportation agency, Transport Canada, had required that his belongings be X-rayed. "We don't tell the security firms that there is going to be an exception made," said Nicole Couture-Simard, a spokeswoman for Air Canada. "We don't have that authority."
Transport Canada declined to comment on the case except to say that it was reviewing it.
Considering that even tweezers may be confiscated when a passenger boards a flight these days, the stricter scrutiny that Dr. Mann faced may not seem surprising. But for him, the experience raises the question of how a traveler will fare once wearable computing devices are such fixtures on the body that a person will not be able to part with them.
"We have to make sure we don't go into a police state where travel becomes impossible for certain individuals," Dr. Mann said.
Since losing the use of his vision system and computer memory several weeks ago, he said, he cannot concentrate and is behaving differently. He is now undergoing tests to determine whether his brain has been affected by the sudden detachment from the technology.
Alejandro R. Jahad, director of the University of Toronto's Program in E-Health Innovation, who has worked closely with Dr. Mann, said that scientists now had an opportunity to see what happens when a cyborg is unplugged. "I find this a very fascinating case," he said.
Carthago delenda est!
So that's why those airport dogs were going crazy...
help fill in hidden movie endings @ End of the Credits
Now, I don't think he/she misread the post, though he may have worded his/her response badly.
The question is, what could there be in a computer system that would be sensitive to X-rays...
Maybe flash memory is potentially vulnerable, but laptops contain that... can't think of much else...
They REMOVED STUFF FROM HIS BODY!?
Why didn't he just take a boat back or something? Did they not allow him to simply leave?
autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
No we're not hearing the only side of the story. The article quotes the airline, and they claim no responsibility. I fail to see how you're questiong NY Times, but want to hear it directly from the airport, who's going to have their lawyer give you the standard "no comment" response.
You're not going to hear from the guys who actually did this, unless it's as a dark silhouette with a disguised voice on Dateline in a few months. I'm not waiting until then to make my decision on which side is right.
Please subscribe to see the more insightful version of th
But I don't think it's all that shocking, given that here's a guy, covered in wires and batteries, getting on a plane post 9/11.
The world post-9/11 is no different from the world pre-9/11, except perhaps for the fact that people are willing to accept any old damn thing in the name of security. After all, The World Is Dangerous, And We Might Die!!!
I guess the Terrorist trump card just got its value doubled. I find it laughable that this game has to be played at all.
What we call folk wisdom is often no more than a kind of expedient stupidity.-Edward Abbey
Terrorism is bad -- no one will argue against that. But you have to be careful that the cure isn't worse than the disease.
Since losing the use of his vision system and computer memory several weeks ago, he said, he cannot concentrate and is behaving differently.
"they" have seem similar occurrences in individuals that often use PDA to jot down things in that some individuals tend become dependant on the technology. I am sure this case is making for an interesting study, but I am more curious on learning more about some of the devices he has wired himself into and how he uses them. So far this is probably the best link I have found detailing the technologies he is using.
Saying Java is nice because it works on all OS's is like saying that anal sex is nice because it works on all genders.
If you want to find out how Mann's unique headgear works and why it is so much better than Xybernaut's then visit http://about.eyetap.org/
:)
I designed the about.eyetap site as part of my ECE1766 coursework at the University Of Toronto btw, but I already received my course grade, so this isn't a shameless plug
I used to live in Newfoundland, in St. John's (well actually Mount Pearl, but unless you've heard of it you can just call it St. John's, since it's more like a sub-section of the city). Knowing the mentality of the people there, it is very likely that this was some sort of practical joke. No, really. We Newfoundlanders are like that.
STEVE MANN, an engineering professor at the University of Toronto, has lived as a cyborg for more than 20 years, wearing a web of wires, computers and electronic sensors that are designed to augment his memory, enhance his vision and keep tabs on his vital signs.
:)
Jeez, I wonder what his wife thinks of all this?
Oh, wait...
Where are we going and why am I in this handbasket?
Seeing as these implants gave him as much trouble as they did, and I remember a story a few weeks ago on the first implantable locator chip for humans, what is the end result? We have just reached the age where it is concievable that a decent segment of the population will have some sort of implant. My grandfather has trouble getting through the airport with his pacemaker as it is and he requires documentation from his doctor on occasion. If implants get to the point where some are elective and may be bigger than the grain of sand that the ID chip is, we surely have quite a problem ahead of us.
mod this parent up
Augmented vision (camera & hud glasses)
Handheld chording keyboard
Any mic/headphone setup
Wireless/cellular hookup
Without his input/output devices, he would have lost access to his memory enhancement programs (smart conversation tags to lookup keywords, replay stored audio, etc.), vision enhancement programs (recording, environment reconstruction, text overlay), and probably all of his sending/receiving capability.
I pray that he backed up his rig before he flew. All the data he accumulated/uploaded while in Newfoundland is probably toast. (Why the hell was he in Newfoundland anyways? Was he speaking or just visiting?)
In one fell swoop they cut him off from his augmented memory and processing, and then threw his visual system for a loop, hence the need for a wheelchair. Oh, and of course, they trashed some very expensive, hard to replace, custom equipment. Not nice. I'd hate to think what might have happened if Mann had needed vital implants (heartrate regulator, insulin, etc.) that would have summarily been stripped along with the rest of his hardware.
Man his "late 90s" pic makes him look like a dork. If he's going to go all crypto-cyborg he really needs to use better shades.
Anyway, he's obviously a dangerous spy. Just look, in the first image, he's waring a t-shirt with a MAP OF CHINA what more evidence do you need!?
autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
Exactly my point. What piece of equipment did he have that couldn't be x-rayed? I can't think of anything that would be so sensitive - maybe it was a bunch of FPGAs or other programmable devices that might get scrambled, but I doubt even that.
sulli
RTFJ.
[sarcasm]One more reason why Canada sucks![sarcasm]
"I've got a web server on my body. The I.P. address of my body is 128.100.10.122."
And the link, it seems as though my traceroute dies somewhere in Newfoundland.
Saying Java is nice because it works on all OS's is like saying that anal sex is nice because it works on all genders.
The article is short. Registration is long
...but not while the evil days come not.
I worked for this guy,
HE DOES NOT HAVE IMPLANTS of any kind, and
most of the time I saw him he wasn't wearing his wearcomp, it's not like he's sonsry dependant on the thing.
He did play by the rules.
The rules are: Unless they have a damn good reason to do otherwise, the authorities are to leave you alone.
Schwab
Editor, A1-AAA AmeriCaptions
If you want to find out how Mann's unique headgear works and why it is so much better than Xybernaut's, then visit http://about.eyetap.org/
:)
I designed the about.eyetap site as part of my ECE1766 coursework at the University Of Toronto btw, but I already received my course grade, so this isn't a shameless plug
Also here is an article from the UofT newspaper about the ECE1766 course.
It's about control.
It's both control of the passengers (You *will* drop your trousers and paint your arse green!) and control of the drelbs who run the security checkpoints (follow *every* rule *exactly* or you're fired!) Security- related professions are magnets for rule-bound control freaks.
Most of the stuff is ridiculous. "Turn the laptop on and off". Tweezers. Fingernail clippers. Very little about security and a whole lot about "I'm in charge and you're not!"
Control freaks at play.
Welcome to the Turing Tarpit, where everything is possible but nothing interesting is easy.
With the possible exception of the X-ray issue, I point out that the bomb/drug-sniffing equipment is there for precisely that eventuality.
Let's give the drooling fucknozzle behind the counter the benefit of the doubt for a moment and think about what would have been reasonable.
At most, they should have stripped him to check where all the wires/electrodes went, and run the sniffer over each electrode to make sure nothing naughty was concealed beneath the electrode, nor anything else that didn't get X-Rayed.
Upon finding no explosives and no drugs, they should have let him put his clothes on and travel.
All of which is beside the point, which is that the goon should have started by reading the goddamn papers Prof. Mann was carrying, that authorized him to carry the gear on the flight.
(...and called his supervisor when he realized he couldn't understand the words with more than one syllable, and let the supervisor make the call.)
Trust me - if he was really trying to blow up the airplane, would he try to go through security with all of those wires, electronics, etc? The whole point of being a terrorist is getting by security, not getting hassled by them.
Your right to not believe: Americans United for Separation of Church and
Airport security is afraid someone is going to knit an Afghan...
You might remember this one: Congressman Dingell (who has a metal hip) gets strip-searched. Looks like it happened on January 5, 2002.
At least they didn't try to carve it out. On the other hand, he probably got preferential treatment 'cause he's a high-and-mighty elected official. (Yeah, right.)
<joke> I guess the people manning that particular security station voted for his opponent... </joke>
"...America's great minds of today, teaching America's great minds of tomorrow. Poor bastards." -- A Beautiful Min
Given that he accessed everything through his wearable, and that his HUD was quarter VGA (240x180?), he probably designed his site for that medium, which explains the big text and scarcity of graphics. Add that to the fact that he probably wrote the code for his site on his wearable, and this is what you get.
Try using lynx to visit the site, and tell us if it still seems confusing.
Two years ago Steve Mann had a very similar run-in with AirCanada, they being very hostile towards him bringing his equipment on-board, and damaging some of his equipment in the process.
His detailed description with photos is at Air Canada Irresponsibility.
Can we get a "-1 Wrong" moderation option?
It's crazy that this kind of stuff goes on nowadays. Hell, I remember when you could walk on the plane with no problems - now the people working airport who are intimidated by us geeks ripped Steve apart just so they can say: I did it. Crazy world.
He just happened to have shot his country's best hope for a medal in the marathon that time.
Ther black man was training in the streets of Pretoria. Of course being black in South Africa, he couldn't afford treadmills and other equipment which would have kept him off the streets and away from attracting the wrong kind of attention.
The cop's justification: "He was running. He had to be running from something."
NOTHING was ever done about the cop or the situation that cost the country a possible Olympic medal, never minbd that somebody DIED for NOTHING!
Steve Mann is lucky that they didn't try high-voltage electrocution to see if the implants were really in there deep.
There is nothing as stupid and as dangerous as an armed petty-bureaucrat. They are our version of officious tyrany (Pol Pot, Bin Laden, Hitler, Stalin, Hussein, [your favorite despot here,]) but without money, opportunity or charisma. But they share the motivation.
Is there intelligent life on earth?
MSBPodcast.com The opinions expressed here are my own. If you don't like 'em... Think up your own stuff.
As a member of the wearable computing mailing list for over two years, and a Canadian I am personaly outraged! I will be sending a letter to Air Canada, aswell as Transport Canada. This is wholy un-called for in an enlightened society. Personaly owning some home-brew wearable stuff myself I can attest to the fragility of such pieces of technology. In the quest for smaller and lighter structural integraty get put in the back seat. THOSE BASTARDS!
... So Prof. Mann walks up to the Big under paid Newfie with a 10 cent badge and says I wanna get on that plane ... The Newfie says 'No' and the Cyborg says stop yanking my chain !!!!
God bless The Rock and its screetch!
I didn't see anything about removal of implants in the article. Electrodes were pulled off of his body (supposedly causing bleeding). THat's hardly the removal of implants.
Huh?
When somebody becomes a federal employee, they suddenly get a whole new batch of brains? If the government wanted to militarize airport security in the name of homeland defense, I could at least kinda sorta understand. (i.e., nobody comes through that hasn't at least been through boot camp, and a court martial is in order for anybody that fscks up).
Merely federalizing the employees does what? I have yet to hear a good response to this. You've got the same schmuck that worked for Schmuckville Airport, now getting paid by the federal government. The only difference is you're shifting the burden of paying for them off the 'frequent flyers' and onto the population as a whole.
Brilliant.
Sleep is just a poor substitute for caffeine, anyway. -Bob Lehmann
instead used a micro molex connector or something?
Yeah sure, he should have done that. Then they would have said "Whats that in your skin?"
RIP, out come the connectors. The point is, by reading the article, if they really don't have the authority to grant any exemptions then they sure as hell don't have the authority to strip search or harm anyone who hasn't put up any physical resistance. I mean, what reason could they have for detaining him without allowing him to speak with his doctor or colleuges?
Were they afraid he was going to goto the phone and blow someone up? Or shoot someone? If he was going todo that he would have blown up or shot the guards long before they strip searched him.
In days when you can attempt to blow up a plane with a setup that only exposes a few wires sticking out of a shoe, it was a good call to pull this freak out of the line and inspect him further.
As for his fainting, losing memory, behavioral differences since the incident, etc... well thats what you get for using technologies and medical procedures that haven't been tested very well.
what a dumbass.
... can you imagine anyone in their right mind letting someone looking like this through security?r es/99.07.ma nn.jpg
http://www.media.mit.edu/physics/pictu
Quite possible he did, but if they wanted to remove everything metal off him, then that means every sensor and every bit of wire.
Grab.
I would have expected this kind of facist treatment from any airport security in the United States, but Canada should have been different... I guess we've finally corrupted them beyond all help.
Maybe the guards had all just been watching "Cops" or something. ^.^
(Or, maybe the presence of US military in pretty much every airport that has US flights is having an effect on their behavior.)
I use Windows... like a two dollar wh.. why don't I just go ahead and not finish that sentence.
He obviously could remove it, since he put it through the X-ray. Apparently, they yanked on the wires coming out of his body anyway, like pulling on the PS2 socket with pliers after disconnecting the keyboard.
__
Do ya feel happy-go-lucky, punk?
Lucky he never went to Canada in the game, would have made Bob page well happy, JC with no augmentations.
Nooooooo my 1337 sniping skillz
(well that was what concentrated my skill points on)
In one fell swoop they cut him off from his augmented memory and processing, and then threw his visual system for a loop, hence the need for a wheelchair.
I'm a graduate student at the University of Toronto, and interact with Prof. Mann on an intermittent basis (did a project under him a few years back, meet him in the lab whenever I'm borrowing his soldering equipment).
He can see fine without his HUD. It's not a complete visual transformation overlay - it's a wearable computer display, functionally equivalent to most of the other wearable displays you can buy. He's been working on information-overlay projects for years, many of them successful, but to say that he has "vital" vision-enhancement programs running at all times is a drastic overstatement.
Likewise, "augmented memory" consists of him either teleconferencing with someone or doing a Google lookup. He's perfectly capable of finding his way through this university, or an airport, without augmentation.
Use common sense, people. If he was disoriented, I'd suspect it to be the result of a many-hour delay with inadequate food/water or of an overly-zealous search as opposed to loss of any electronics.
How does airport security know his doctor isn't Osama? C'mon.
The article is short. Registration is long
...but not while the evil days come not.
Ira Howard, please phone home!
Fascism starts when the efficiency of the government becomes more important than the rights of the people.
While damaged equipment etc. is a valid point,
people are acting as if he had been violated by asking him to remove his computers.
Tell me if Mann was middle eastern guy, do you think no one would have minded him wearaing a bunch of computers and wires and getting on a plane?
Does this guy EVER take a SHOWER?!?!?!
-Russ
Me
Despite the claims in the slashdot blurb, Mann does not have any implants. The NYTimes story mentions that electrodes were removed from his skin. These are the same as those sticky things they attach when someone gets an EKG or polygraph test, and are presumably used by Mann to measure physiological things like heart rate or skin conductance. Mann claims that when they were removed he bled -- kind of like ripping off a really sticky band-aid...
What if a person required such tools in order to move, breathe, or even think? Would this not be the equivalent to destroying an experimental respirator which has already been O.K.'ed by a doctor?
Don't get me wrong, NOT searching would leave the possibility for a person claiming to be sick to be used as a bomb - but to RIP electrodes from a person's skin is reactionary, cruel, if not downright monsterous.
They could have just denied him access to the plane instead.
Ryan Fenton
Unless you are entering into an AIRPORT with strange things attached to your body!!! Sheesh.
mje0w!!!1!
And my point is that we don't *know* what exactly comprises his setup, so we can't be saying that it shouldn't be x-rayed. Laptop, sure. Stick it through. But stuff that's controlling a man's body?
Every once in a while I like to masturbate a new word into my vocabulary, even if I don't know what it means.
If I were him, I would take a train to go home.
Well, you just pass all your expieremental equipment through the X-Ray machine - it shouldn't cause problems...
Sheesh - I try to avoid things that might even remotely cause problems.
This seems like a reasonable request for expieremental 1-off equipment.
Cheers!
I just saw a 90 minute film on Steve Mann called Cyberman at SXSW in Austin, basically he has for about 20 years now hooked up a camera and video screen to his glasses. I believe his setup can now zoom, playback and bring up a crude command line prompt, he also has a single hand keyboard for input, and yes he walks around with this all the time. He also has renegade antennas setup around his city to stream video from his head to the web.
However a few times they showed him going into retailers like walmart and gap with a consumer video camera (just to start shit). When an employee asks him to not bring the video camera in, he starts being a little smart ass about it. like "Well don't you have video cameras in here, why can you video tape me and I can't video tape you", "What if I told you that my glasses we're a video camera, would that be ok?". generally not agreeing with the store and making a jackass out of himself.
I also saw him take off his glasses constantly, he would slip them off to do something, then put them back to walk around (then look around like a space cadet ), but it did not seem that he was in any way disoriented without his gear. So I don't buy that all of a sudden once his stuff was busted up by the security guards (which we're just trying to do there freakin job) that he started bumping into things, or at least not more then normally.
I think what happened at the airport is that for "I'm cyberman" reasons he opted to keep his gear on, got shit from the security guards, proceeded to be a complete smartass while thinking, "if they fuck with me, I have it all on film", but when they broke his gear and is alibi that's when he really god pissed. I'm sure he was already expecting shit, but maybe hoping he could have covert footage of it to show the 8 o-clock news as well.
-Jon
this is my sig.
-Sam Dunham
a couple of days ago i watched the nature of things special on Steve Mann. they have a website about him with lots of pictures and information.
I guess resistance wasn't futile after all (for the security guards)
Fascism starts when the efficiency of the government becomes more important than the rights of the people.
There's a picture of the ProComp and some elctrodes on one of Mann's myriad sites (wearcam.org, wearcomp.com which seems to be down, eyetap.org, U. Toronto EECS, CBC)
Biosensors used in the author's "smart clothing" apparatus include ProComp ECG, EEG, respiration, and sweat sensor built into a Jantzen bathing suit. Upon arriving home, late at night, one is generally too hot from just climbing the stairs, etc., so when first going to sleep, the underwear tells the heater to turn off, but after a couple of hours sleeping, when one's metabolism slows down, the underwear senses the resulting changes in one's body temperature/conductivity, and turns up the heat. Our clothing of the future may some day be interoperable and interconnected, so that it keeps track of our physical condition and allows us to decrypt this information for evaluation by a doctor or other professional of our choosing. Further description of the "smart underwear" prototype, and anecdotes on the author's experience designing, building, and using it is appears in [Mann96b].
It's curious that this page puts an emphasis on personal safety, suggesting that heartrate vs. footsteps could indicate a subject was in distress and that a network of cyborgs could protect each other.
Another of Mann's interests is surveillance. His investigation into the horror that the watchers feel when watched back is interesting, but it always seems to involve a certain amount of confrontation (see his videos if you don't believe me). Did the security personnel know he had cameras in his sunglasses & how did they react when they found out?
Across the room, the dancer danced. I saw her. Men swarmed around her, queueing up to distribute their dollar bills. I trotted towards the dancer, paying careful attention to the protocol that governed the dancer/patron interaction.
As I gazed at the rapidly blinking lights, I began to experience a stabbing sensation in my temple. The pain was excruciating, and I collapsed to one knee as the following message scrolled past my CONSCIOUSNESS-BUFFER:
The pain continued in short jolts, and the body continued to move towards the dancer. Suddenly, I realized that it was not me who was urging the body forward. Yet it continued to move at breakneck speed towards the dancer. I saw her mouth open wide as both of Atkins' hands reached out and grasped her breasts. But I felt nothing, as it seemed that sensation had left me. Angry noises swirled around me, and feeling slowly returned.
The floor was damp and cold on the side of my cheek and a warm, dull pain was running through my back. Someone was sitting on me.
"Sir, sir, are you listening?" I could move again-I struggled to right myself. "Sir, I am going to let you up, and you are leaving this establishment. You leave right away, or we are calling the cops."
"Get up!" the person sitting on my back finally relented, and I stood up, trying to turn around, but he gripped my arms tightly and continued to push me towards the door.
"-a mistake! He didn't know! He's a foreigner!" another voice-this one was Krantz. He did not seem happy. "Hey! He's Canadian!" The grip on my arm relaxed a bit. I breathed and scanned myself for errant processes. I could determine nothing unusual on the digital side of my consciousness. What had happened to me? I craned my next to see Mr. Krantz, who seemed to be on the losing end of a conversation with the man who was trying to eject me.
"-I'm sorry sir, your friend is gonna have to learn a little more respect before we let him back in here." With that, the man gave me one final shove through the door. A sweaty Krantz followed me out, gasping his hot breath into the chill night air.
"What happened to you in there?" Krantz puffed. His arms shifted into place, making an odd humming sound. "We were supposed to be having a carefree, hedonistic romp!" I was unable to answer. Krantz turned away momentarily, as if he were searching for something his jacket.
"I didn't want to do this already, but..."
I was unable to hear the end of this sentence, because after hearing a dull metallic thud, I suddenly lost contact with the body as of 16:43:04 CST.
Unable to access the body's senses, I waited in limbo until 17:35:47 CST, when I began to hear faint noises, as if they were coming through a wall. The noise became clearer and more distinct...it was a familiar voice. Krantz's. He was muttering something over the phone, as my heavy lids drew up and the blurs converged to form his back. I visually scanned the area-a bed, chair, small table, loud air conditioner-drawing it against my reserves of human data, I concluded that it was some sort of motel.
As I attempted to stand up, two bungie cords restricted my arms. I must have groaned.
"Ah," said Krantz, covering the telephone's receiver with his right hand. "You're up." Without speaking, he hung up the phone and turned my way, jumping towards me on the bed, so he was right on top of me, glaring straight into my face. I began to wonder how much longer I could possibly survive.
"Okay, well, I just talked our old boss, and he says that you didn't contact him after the job. So you're either the computer, or you've gone rogue," said Krantz nonchalantly, as he snorted more of his sour white powder. "He doesn't care which. But he wants you dead. And that will be very, very, good for me."
I struggled against my bonds, but to no avail. Krantz eyed me and sneered. "I have to know one thing first...are you really Atkins, or the computer?" He was quite interested in my origin; however, I noticed that he was more interested in himself. Perhaps I could use that fact to my advantage...
"You seem to feel very strongly about that."
"About that you dying will be beneficial to me? Yes, I do feel very strongly about that."
"And why is that, Mr. Krantz?"
"Because I'll be a priority at the Project again. They'll give me the funding that I deserve. You think I don't belong at the Project because I don't know computers. Well, I do! I'm 'hip'! I'm 'with it'! I deserve R&D more than some pie-in-the-sky ATM research!"
Krantz brought his fist down on the nightstand. It caved in, splintering into several pieces. The skin on Krantz's hand was ripped a bit, and I noticed a glint off one of the motel lights. The hand was metal. Its coldness sent a shiver through the body as I felt it grasping my neck...
I am a sentient ATM.
OK...
I think this is terrible... and I certainly do NOT know my rights here.
But couldn't Mr Mann just turn around and leave the airport? I would think this would be MUCH better than being dismantled. The only reason I could think of is that maybe he had to leave on an emergency.
If they DID force him to take his implants out, wouldn't this also quality as a kind of kidnapping? I mean they take you into a room against your will.
When this happens can a person just say "no thanks... I will just pass on taking this flight and contact my lawyer."
Kevin
When judging this matter it would pay to remember that most security people are probably just average Joes and probably never even heard of this guy before.
They had an obligation to verify his claims and to check that some guy who turns up in a "wired" state isn't just another crazy terrorist.
That they knew nothing about the technology or the way it was being used probably explains why the incident was so problematic.
But hey, this is a post Sept-11 environment and if you turn up at an airport, wired up like a Christmas tree, then you're going to have to expect that you're going to draw the unwelcomed attention of security.
Just imagine if they'd took his claims at face value and it turned out that he had five pounds of C4 up his backside, wired to a detonator under his tongue, controlled by a timer in his cool dark glasses.
Better safe than sorry.
Unfortunately, unless we want to replace those brawny security guys with ComSci PhDs then this kind of thing will happen.
I wonder exactly how cooperative the guy was, or whether he might perhaps have been a little arrogant or outraged that his word and documentation had been challenged? Remember -- he's the one who'd just spent hours in the cramped confinement of a commercial flight and that makes most of us a bit snotty sometimes.
Sam
But hey, maybe he could combine his idea and NanoGators, and have a Porsche implanted...
I realize the above is a joke, but it just perpetuates the lie in the write-up of this story. The Times article says absolutely nothing about "forced removal of implants."
I did a some web searching and haven't found what exactly is implanted into Steve Mann's body.
Anyone know what sensors he has implanted?
Sounds odd...
No, when they get Federalized, we HOPE that the end result isn't the winner of the cheapest bid.
The airlines want cheap security. So, you get cheap workers. As long as the airlines are doing the work, and paying the wages, the pressure is to keep wages down. Low wages, poor workers, high turn-over (You know that turn-over was really high 100%+ for airline security staff last year don't you?)
See
Pay is low, and turnover high-- 500% at one
airport-- and their training is often minimal. Federal inspectors have repeatedly been able to easily get weapons and potential bombs past them. (This is from a PBS study done before 9/11/2000)
The old security system was a race to the bottom. Airlines didn't really care about security. They just wanted us to feel better.
The new system might not be better, but for different reasons. Personally, I think it will be, but that's just my opinion.
The personnel they can command will be better, and the ability to fire workers that don't perform will be better. Generally, treat your workforce better - get better performance.
I'm sorry, but once you start concealing things that you can't have X-rayed, with hardware inside your body, all security bets are off -- and there's no reason why airport security should take your word for what you're concealing.
What's to stop someone from having a bomb implanted, then six months later blowing it up on a plane?
Oh, he had a note form his doctor... no terrorist could ever get one of those. I feel kinda bad for the guy, but he mostly brought the situation upon himself.
At very least, he needs to make special arrangements with airport security at every point along his trip to obtain some type of special pass.
Then, there's also the imposition upon other travelers like myself. How much does it cost to have people trying to make "special arrangements", wasting security personnel's time, etc. We all pay for nonsense like that with increased ticket prices. The more I think about it, the less I feel sorry for the guy.
Why are you letting these clowns ruin our country?
Higher pay, more training, citizenship requirement. The quality of screening will definitely go up. (Admittedly, it will be starting from a pretty low level.)
sulli
RTFJ.
THIS GUY IS NOT A CYBORG. That girl I met in a Second Cup with a cochlear implant is SO MUCH MORE a cyborg than some professor waiting to die sitting at a desk in a university.
What kind of hare-brained logic is that? If you don't resist they can't strip search? So as long as you behave yourself you can stick a bomb up your shorts and they can't go in there looking for it? Here's the deal: They can strip search anyone they want. They can hold you without telling you why. There is no place where you have less rights than when entering a country.
Back in 1999 when I was very active in wearable computing I remember Steve and a few of the "old timers" were contemplating what would happen? Steve mentioned that he was sure that he had became dependant(sp?) on the technology but was unsure of what effects it might have with a sudden severing..
I guess this is the unexpected research part of that discussion so long ago... Thad Starner is america's cyborg, but to a much lesser extent (from what I recall.. it may have changed now) I would love to hear his insight to this.
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
Alright then _no_ rock music how 'bout just these violent video games. Here's one titled "Kill for Jesus!"
heuristic algorithm seeks stochastic relationship
http://www.wearcam.org/steve5.jpg
"Here I am, with a brain the size of a planet, and I can't fit in an airplane. It's probably for the better, as if I did get on I'd have to suffer through airline food. But I'm stuck with Canadian cooking anyway. Woe is me."
Yeah right:
I wonder what would happen if Kevin Warwick would walk too close to one of those speedpass readers they have at a gas station? free gas?
So this airport has a convenient stack of dangerous fire extinguishers which any passenger can reach after going through "security". So much for removing all weapons...
I am suprised to see that, post-9/11 (an incident committed with box cutters) and post-shoe burning guy, people still think the guy should get carte blanche.
That's because you're making the same mistake that the government is. Since you're probably not an expert, it's excusable. Here's the way it is:
There will be NO more hijacked airliners flown into buildings. Ever. The passengers on the plane to Pittsburgh changed the rules.
Airport security could be dismantled tomorrow morning without changing a damned thing. All this crapola has the net effect of:
1) Giving jobs to lots of wannabee storm troopers who enjoy ordering people about (and they're now FEDERAL EMPLOYEES, i.e., unfireable).
2) Making the sheeple "feel safe" (even though the ACTUAL added safety is nonexistent. In fact, this probably DECREASES safety by diverting resources from areas where terrorists ARE likely to attack).
3) Giving the government more of an excuse to keep tabs on every American citizen. You can bet that internal passports will be next on the agenda.
Think about it.
Of course the webserver on his body is not responding. The article just explained that he's now off-line. It's a hardware problem caused by wetware.
This is yanked right off the st. johns airport website..
--- Paste ---
Security, Customs and Immigration
Passenger Screening
Screening has taken on an unprecedented amount of importance given recent world events. In accordance with applicable Transport Canada standards and regulations for Canadian Airports, measures are implemented to ensure the highest level of security. These safety measures, among other things, include close screening of passengers and their carry-on baggage.
No passenger has to submit to a search of his or her person or his or her baggage. However, if they choose not to have their baggage searched, they cannot board an aircraft.
--Note this paragraph.. you are not required to searched, however if you intend to get onboard you must..
Security screening at St. John's International Airport is the responsibility of the airlines who have designated Shannahan's Investigation & Security Ltd to perform security screening on their behalf. Security officers conduct authorized searches of persons, personal belongings, baggage, goods and cargo in accordance with Transport Canada requirements. These searches may be one or a combination of manual or mechanical searches. Mechanical searches are performed via walk-though metal detectors, hand-held detectors and x-ray machines.
All mechanical search devices are proven safe for use in scanning. However, if you have concerns, regarding the scanning of your person (or a child under your care), you can request a manual search.
Mechanical search devices have been tested and will not damage or harm in any way:
Electronic Equipment
Computer Disks, Magnetic Video or Audio Tapes
Computer Hard Drives
Medications
Photographic Film up to 1600 ASA
Passengers with concerns regarding mechanical scans of these items can request a manual search instead. All electronic / mechanical items which you wish to bring aboard an aircraft will have to be activated at the security screening checkpoint. Please ensure that your laptop computer battery is charged prior to coming to the airport to help ensure that you quickly continue on your journey.
Passengers who have concerns about items that should not be carried on board an aircraft should contact the air carrier they are traveling with.
At St. John's International Airport, Customs and Immigration services are available 24 hours per day for all passengers arriving from international destinations. Customs officers process travelers' and commercial goods. They also monitor and control the importation of firearms, drugs, and other goods. The air terminal building at St. John's has some of the finest, most sophisticated facilities for passenger processing and handling, including venues for Canada Customs and Immigration servicing and customs brokerage.
-- Eof of Paste --
So as stated here he could have just walked away, requested a laywer, got a private flight, or driven to another airport.
Don't lie, this is gonna be you in 5-10 years going through this same shit, hassled at the gate. You'd be wearing your computer right now if you could.
I make these: http://beatseqr.com
Why, exactly?
Do you honestly believe the current over-the-top level of airport security is useful or necessary?
We had too much idiotic airport security before 9/11 and it didn't do a damn thing; what's going on now is a matter of closing the barn doors after the cows have gone. It doesn't make any of us safer against terrorists, it just makes a few people feel better to see that the authorities are "doing something". It's all for show.
I would pay at least $10 more per ticket to fly on an airline that didn't have any airport "security" at all. I would much prefer the security of knowing I could arrive fifteen minutes before the plane leaves and still make my flight to the security of knowing my fellow passengers have been harrassed and annoyed and degraded and forced to wait behind lines and answer useless questions.
Mann is the canary in this coal mine. His experiences should tell us we've gone too far and it's time to let the pendulum swing the other way for a bit. Let's start by getting rid of the "did you pack your bags/has anyone unknown to you" questions and the requirement to show a picture ID...
I play Nerd-Folk!
". . .when they had documentation signed by his doctor stating everything he's said . . ."
AFAIK, there really isn't any efficient way to authenticate a doctor's note. Maybe we need to develop a system to do so, but I don't think anything even remotely reliable exists now.
If this had happened on a U.S. domestic flight, I wonder if he could have sued under the ADA?
** The opinions expressed here are my own, and do not reflect those of my employers - past, present, or future**
From how he looks in the pictures, maybe they were afraid he was going to assimilate the plane?
One line blog. I hear that they're called Twitters now.
Air Canada is a worthless, pathetic excuse for an air line. Last quarter they managed to loose $390,000,000. Of course that's after 911. Before that, in the first three quarters of 2001 they only managed to loose $874,000,000. That's ok though, as you say they can just suck on the Federal Liberal government's never-ending cash supply stolen from the Canadian populous.
There are some other options though. Fly Westjet if you can. They are expanding their service east, though there are still quite a few places you can't get to with them.
Of course you'll only be able to fly Westjet if it's still in business. Air Canada has slashed prices on western flights to try to drive Westjet under. Interesting how they can slash their bloated prices when they need to destory anything resembling competition.
Beyond their incredible abilities to rob tax payers and customers alike and still managing to come up shorter than seems possible their staff are the biggest bunch of government employee assholes you've ever seen. I feel lucky if I get through a Canadian air terminal if I haven't had an Air Canada Waste Of Fecal Material spit in my face and kick me in the nuts.
They are scum and the entire lot of them should be gutted like dogs in the street.
His wearable computer couldn't go through because it was more sensitive than a laptop.
But he willingly put it through anyway. He could have mitigated his damages by renting a car and driving to another airport. They are not responsible for his equipment unless they forced him to break it.
But it certainly raises it.
information should never cost money....especially in this pure of a form.
I have no desire to reach nirvana.
Power-tripping rent-a-cops?
One line blog. I hear that they're called Twitters now.
its not a typo its a bug in slashcode (slashdot) you jerk, that adds ascii space randomly into a http url citation
Not to be a conspiracy theorist but why not, couldn't he have a doctor in on it and have some sort of device in the laptop? I dunno seems like an easy enough thing to do.
basically never ever make exceptions, not when 6 thousand people's lifes are at stake
This story should point to the glaring holes in all security stations and methods. Steve Mann is not going to be the last person to want to get on a plane with cybernetic implants. But what happens when it's not a nice professor or a lunatic with a lot of official looking paperwork (i.e. Dr. Kozinsky).
What they did to Dr. Mann was totally unjustified, but more to the point, was probably done out of ignorance. This will be a nasty civil suit, but I seriously doubt that airport security around the world will react to it by looking into cybernetic implants and how to tell the difference between an artificial ticker and an artificial bomb ticker.
The most recent bomber in Israel had munitiions strapped to his chest. It won't be long before they'll have them concealed inside their chests. We need to have methods of protection from that sort of thing in place now.
__________________
... and I have a computers lecture right before Professor Mann's course (check it out at http://wearcam.org/ece1766.htm) in the same room.
Hence I see Steve Mann, usually on a weekly basis.
All you Slashdot'ers will be relieved to know that he is still using his wearable computer, his display glasses still work, etc.
I personally have doubts about this article for three reasons:
A) The issue has shown up in a NY times article, yet I haven't heard about it from any of my campus news sources OR the Toronto Star (www.thestar.ca)
B) I've never seen Professor Mann wearing electrodes as mentioned in the article, and can see no reason as to why he would (his system is not biometric, to my knowledge he uses a sort of keypad as well as visual feedback of his eyes to interface with it)
C) Even though Professor Mann wears his device most of the time, my computers professor (who I believe knows him personally) has seen Professor Mann remove his device without disability.
I've emailed my computers professor to see if he knows any more about this story, I'll reply if I find out any more.
--
Eamon McDermott
ENGSCI 0T5
ERTW$$
I seriously don't have a problem with not letting a guy with extraneous wiring on an airplane. I am surprised security even caught it.
However removing his devices by force is not right.
What about pace makers? Aren't x-rays a little dangerous around pace makers? I can imagine the conversation:
Idiot guard: "We need you to pass through the x-ray machine."
Pacemaker implantee: "I can't. I have a pace maker."
IG: "I'm sorry, but we have to have you pass through the x-ray machine."
PI: "You don't seem to understand: if I go through there, I COULD DIE!"
IG: "We really don't care. Please pass through the x-ray machine."
[PI passes through]
PI: "...Uggg! Oh god! *THUMP*"
IG: "....Ummmm...shit! Does this mean I'm fired?"
Boss: "You're fired!"
Zodiac Survey
If he wants to drape computers all over himself at home, if he wants to stick bits of technology in various orifices and incisions, fine. Let him do it all he wants at home or in whatever misguided institution will hire him.
Nobody has the right to make the hundred-odd people behind them wait for ever. Nobody has the right to expect to be able to carry tons of weird gadgets aboard an airliner.
When you want to mix with the rest of society you have to conform to certain standards. If you fly, then you and all your gear (with the exception of certain hand-check items, like film) gets X-rayed. Or it gets put in checked baggage, where at least you won't be around to whine when it gets X-rayed.
Steve won't play by those rules. Steve deserves everything he gets.
Fuck Steve Mann. If I see any wanker pretending to be a borg in an airport I'll have a quiet word to a national guardsman, just to make the fool think twice about doing it again.
With the possible exception of the X-ray issue, I point out that the bomb/drug-sniffing equipment is there for precisely that eventuality.
And last time I checked, most airports do not have the handheld bomb detection devices yet. And there are not enough bomb sniffing dogs to go to every airport either. The device is what, $50,000 US? Time for some taiwan copies to hit the market!
Alright, maybe those security people are a bunch of doofuses. But this story is screaming "hyper exageration." Come on...they just up and ripped off electrodes? Now, I don't know any more about this story than what's written above, but it sounds to me like he had so much metal and equipment attached to him that they pulled him aside to check him out. He starts to get steamed, then they start to get steamed, and maybe a couple of his electrodes comes off while they're moving him around. Or maybe they ask him to detach the equipment, and some of them come off as the wires are tugged.
And "equipment scattered around the room?" Big deal. What are they supposed to do, just give it a once over, then let him through? If he really had that much stuff, they have to check out each piece, and to do that properly, it has to come off his body. Arguing otherwise is like saying that you want them to check all handbags, but only while they are still hanging on the shoulders of the passengers. At any rate, I would bet GOOD MONEY that there are definitely two sides to this story.
And by the way, everyone's calling these people idiots, but then the overwhelming implication here is that they shouldn't thoroughly check out a guy who tries to get on with machinery attached to his body? Get real. Be reasonable.
Evil is the money of root.
They better get used to the fact that sooner rather than later, people are going to start implanting all sorts of things into their bodies. It may be a bomb, it may be something harmless. But in the name of security, they cannot rip the stuff out of your body.
There has to be a way to securely identify the implant to the authorities. Maybe a serial number that is unique to the item, given by the manufacturer and then stored on a databse somewhere. Then, when walking through a scanner, it can sing like a canary about it's legitimacy.
Hell, pacemakers and implantable defibrillators already do this -- you hold an interrogator to the pacer and it gives up the manufacturer's name, serial number, mode, and cardiac rhythm data that it has stored.
There must be a secure and private way that this can be made to work on a large scale.
Not to disagree entirely with your post, or to offend you in any way, but what exactly makes you think that the gov't. wouldn't just go for the lowest bid as well? Its well known that they don't *have* to, but neither do corporations. The incentive to go with the lowest bid is still the same on either side of the fence. Fixed budget means that the less is spent on the security personnel, the more gets spent on the administrators. Over the past 6-8 months I've gotten a bit jaded, so I have to say: if you're not linin' your pockets, you're not livin' the dream. Unfortunate, but true.
If I owned this airline then I would be the first to call him up and offer him a free ticket on a bus or ship. The last thing I would want is to hold up flights because some idiot decided it was cool to stitch a laptop to his body.
And the whole doctors note? Give me a break. I can understand a doctor giving out a note to a kid in a wheelchair so he doesn't have to go to gym class but signing off on cyborg implants so you can board an airline? Where does the doctor derive this authority? The airline never agreed that he could board with his equipment. Before signing the note the doctor never communicated with the airline to verify that the equipment was safe.
Finally, this guy put himself into this mess. He can very easily get himself out of this mess by removing his cyborg equipment.
Then he has no business attempting to cary it onto an aircraft because everyone knows that X-ray checks are not optional.
These people who for some reason believe that they are so special that rules do not apply to them really make me wonder. From the person in the post office who doesn't need to stand in line right up to Professor Mann, where do they get that idea?
Would you like a letter from a doctor stating that you're exempt from paying taxes this year because you're allergic to form 1040? I'm not really a doctor, but I'll be happy to write one for you. The IRS will surely accept it.
Well we know we detain him. Now what?
Answer that and you'll see the problem we have with the situation.
No. Not even then.
If you're interested in gaining control of an airliner, the last thing you want to do is attract the attention of security personnel. As such, you have to look normal. Since Prof. Mann looked anything but normal, there's a fairly low probability that he's a hazard to air travel safety (although one could legitimately question the RFI radiated by his equipment if it couldn't safely take an X-ray). A quick check of his ID -- hell, even a quick Web search on his name -- would have quickly confirmed that the man was absolutely no trouble at all.
Prof. Mann was detained not for being a potential threat, but because he questioned The Rules.
Believe me, the guy you want to keep off the plane doesn't look or act like Mann. The Bad Guys will be appear very normal. That's why Congressmen are being detained and strip-searched in airports, because they're acting normal; very suspicious these days.
Schwab
Editor, A1-AAA AmeriCaptions
You don't have to be subjected to strip searches, or searches of any kind if you decide not to board the plane. As soon as they pulled off the first electrode, why didn't he just walk away? If it was an issue of principle, he could have continued to argue in a safer manner, perhaps having a physician brought in to properly remove or inspect the electrodes. Or, he could have taken the bus home! (I'm sure there are ferry boats to the mainland.)
-kidlinux.
Idiot guard: "We need you to pass through the x-ray machine."
It's a metal detector - not an x-ray machine.
Congratulations, you just qualified for a job as an airport security screener.
If I were Dr Mann and anyone was insisting that they do to him or start to do duch a thing, I would simply have left the airport and found another way home. I mean that sounds Orwellian; was he being detained? Could he have simply left, especially when they were starting to literally injure him? Is Newfoundland surrounded by a security force field that only airplanes can get through?
What am I missing here?
You are in a maze of twisty little passages, all alike.
No they are not. Microwaves can be dangerous to pacemakers. X-ray wavelength is shorter than the visible spectrum, while Microwaves are longer wavelength.
See here.
Hell, they checked my laptop case coming and going when I went to Houston from Dallas out of Love field. (Clue: Love Field and Intercontinental both are _small_ airports, usually used for commuter flights in and out of Dallas and Houston- they normally don't rate a hand-held bomb detector unit...)
I am not merely a "consumer" or a "taxpayer". I am a Citizen of the State of Texas
Am I the only one completely disturbed by the fact that airport security would yank off the electrodes? What if he actually were a terrorist, and those were wires connected to an explosive device! Even if this was done in the name of security, I think someone should go back to airport security school. Thank god it was not some terrorist with a bomb inside of him, because the whole airport could have been obliterated! This is not only bad security, it is beyond neglegence.
It's cool technology and all, but WTF? He's a freak and a geek and a performance artist - what the hell does he expect to happen? Next thing you know someone will have a simulacrum of a large TNT device emplanted in their body - just the shape, not the real thing. And boo hoo, won't understand why some people get kinda pissed about it.
Letters from doctors and airlines mean nothing. Their pieces of paper that are easily forged.
No rational security guard or "manager" doing their jobs would have the knowledge or authority to make the kind of exceptions to security procedures that this guy expected.
I am highly concerned he was let through Pearson security so easily. Ripped from his skin? Disoriented and couldn't walk straight? Half a million dollars of equipment? Whatever. Cyborg? If it is that bad, he should not have been flying, not without a Transport Canada ruling, like are needed for other highly exceptional circumstances.
Give me a break. The "article" as well as the Slashdot lead in all sound *HIGHLY* one sided.
I give this side of the story a credibility rating of 2 out of 10, and the possibility that Professor Steve Mann is a pompous jackass a 7 out of 10. That the people in St. Johns did their job as we've requested them to do? 8 out of 10, losing points for putting his video glasses in with the baggage and not keeping track of his possessions.
The reason September 11th worked out the way it did was that people have been taught to give the nice terrorists what they want when they take over the plane- before then, everyone was under the line of thinking that eventually it will all work out and if you don't provoke the terrorists you're less likely to get hurt/killed in the situation.
Problem is, this was never the case to begin with and people have all been largely lucky up to this point. As it has always been, but people didn't realize it until the 11th was that the moment an agressor takes over a plane/ship/etc. and holds you hostage, your life is forfeit and you must win it back either by your actions or someone else must win it back for you. With this in mind, I do not believe that people will placidly sit still with agressors with knives or even handguns. They can nail a few but they're going to be beaten to a bloody pulp by the rest.
I am not merely a "consumer" or a "taxpayer". I am a Citizen of the State of Texas
...I had to put up with the humiliation of having my brain forcibly removed. After all - it's a lethal weapon. I can design bombs with it, I can think unpatriotic thoughts, I can even memorize tunes that have a copyright. My brain was a terrible thing and it ought to have been removed. Everyone else should submit to having their brains removed too and the world will be a much better place. Except politicans of course - there's no need to have their brains removed.
-- SIGFPE
IT's pretty much plain jane PC hardware, poorly wired together....
People thinking that someone implanting 'devices' on his/her body is normal... I am a geek to the n'th degree, but when I see stories like this and all the freaks that rise up to defend this stupidity as somehow 'normal' makes me want to puke and distance myself from the whole geek culture...
Some geeks need to seriously back away from all things technical and do some soul searching while taking an early morning stroll on a quick mountain trail, and not just going to bed after an all-night RPG...
For some reason, I can picture the other side as...well, incompetent.
"Well, we saw this guy in line, with really thick sunglasses and refused to let his bags be X-Rayed. Frank noticed some wires running down the back of his neck, and Geez, I thought this guy might have a few sticks of dynamite under that jacket. So we took him into a room, where he refused to cooperate, and put on airs that he had special equipment that we couldn't touch. A friend of his signed a piece of paper saying don't touch it. Well, we had to check the darn thing so he didn't threaten the plane"
Unless the NG guys are carrying M1 Garands, they don't have any clips on their person at all. They might have a magazine or two if they are shouldering an Armalite or a Colt. Sorry to nitpick, but calling a mag a clip is like fingernails on the blackboard of my mind.
BTW, the "guards" I've seen at San Diego, Reno, Las Vegas, Phoenix, and Portland airports were all similarly unarmed. A smart group of terrorists would storm the airport with baseball bats, pepper spray and M16 and 92F/1911A1 magazines...
-B
Ash and Hickory, straight-grained and true, make excellent bludgeons, dandy for the cudgeling of vegetarians.
Look at the school system, public school teachers get paid more than private school teachers, but are generally worse because they stay at their jobs forever no matter how much their teaching deteriorates.
"The question of whether a computer can think is no more interesting than that of whether a submarine can swim" -EWD
grep -ri 'should work'
I think that far and away, when the security responsibility and cost lies with the airlines, the temptation is too strong...
:)
When the Gvmt runs the security program, but it's paid for by the airlines, then the tendency to go real cheap isn't there.
This is an area that the airlines have shown themselves to be unworthy. Will the Gvmt do better? Time will tell.
The result may be no better, but at least the conflict of interest isn't there.
You and I are both jaded - I find the whole political (rep and dems) to be TOTALLY SCUMMY and the hope I used to have that the small guy might get a break has been totally lost.
[Sigh]
Cheers!
You forget, this is Canada. You have no rights.
The only reason it's not a playground for fascist
butchers is that they're all acting like Doug and
Dave MacKenzie.
Now in the U.S., you'd get the twice the brutality,
but you would have the comfort of knowing that it
was illegal, although of course no court in the land
would give a flying wahoo about that.
-I like my women like I like my tea: green-
gonna have to move from America to europe in a month.
in my personal baggage: 5 Harddisks filled with personal data.
Whenever we purchase a plane ticket each of us has the opportunity to decide whether we think the value of the services being offered to us is worth its cost. What I'm saying is that in my personal utility function this business of lining up to be xrayed and interrogated and searched has no value at all; it only serves to make plane travel take an hour longer than it otherwise would. So just as I might be willing to pay $10 more to save an hour off my travel time by taking a faster flight, I'd be willing pay $10 to save an hour by accepting a faster (but less "secure") check-in process.
Some other /. poster said it best at the time of the event:
No amount of inconvenience will give you the security you desire.
Forcing people to turn on their computers doesn't protect us against smart people with bombs in the spare battery compartment, sending people through a metal detector doesn't protect us against smart people with sharp ceramic or glass or obsidian or plastic objects, and everybody knows this. And I for one am sick of all this nonsense. We should stop pretending that the solution to a failed strategy is more of the same.
Nope, from now on I want to fly the Unfriendly Skies. And if somebody tries to take my plane, we'll all have our own knives and guns aboard to stop them in their tracks. Who's with me?
I play Nerd-Folk!
Once again /.'ers are being ridiculous. Come on folks, you have a choice here. You can pay security agencies a ridiculous amount of money to train its personel to recognize, analyze, and make judgements on (admit it folks) one-of-a-kind wearable computer devices, or grin and bear it when a pretentions (although incredibly intelligent) scientist decides to wear a full cyborg costume to the airport.
The only thing that scares me is that he got through security easily in past.
Strap yourself with a computer filled with c4, put some wires in your skin, say youre a scientist and you are good to go.
ridiculous
> carte blanche
It's called "innocent until proven guilty". In the
U.S. we have a tradition that this is an inherent
human right, not a priviledge granted by the
goverment, revokable as expedient. Of course that
tradition does not exist in Canada, historical
british statesmen such as Wilberforce notwithstanding.
-I like my women like I like my tea: green-
Ira Howard, please phone home!
Wassup, Lazarus? I was in the Gay Deceiver getting some.
BTW, the "Gay Deceiver" was the name of a multi-universe traveling space vehicle/car/AI in "The Number of the Beast" by Robert Heinlein, for those of you who have no clue.
--- Think of it as evolution in action ---
I can personally speak to the stupidity of airline security. I travel frequently (weekly), and know the routine, take off all metal, put it in my bag, take my laptop out, let them run it all through the xray machine and go about my buissness. Well the Xray "technician", I use that term very loosely I think crackhead (from the looks of her) working the Xray system would be a more apt description, saw something odd (probably drug induced hallucinations) and Xray'd my laptop for about 5 minutes, then they had me turn it on and off and Xray'd it again. Suffice to say it destroyed the system. I don't get it, I am a white male in my early 20's, clean cut etc etc. I by no means fit any profile of a terrorist (which so far have all been Middle Eastern Men, ages 18-40). Oh well, airport security is not effective and will not do anything in the future other then annoy people, cause delays and destroy delicate equipment.
What I don't understand is, why didn't he take a train, or some other form of transport? You can get pretty far in three days...
That's an easy question.
"Remove that thing on your head so we can xray it please"
"No."
I was not trying to start a flame war. I just felt sorry for this guy, and I posted that. Period. I am sorry my post offended you - if you could explain what made it offensive, I could avoid such transgressions in the future.
I'm the stranger...posting to
Any passenger on your plane could have a pound of C4 stuffed up his ass, and security would never know it.
There is no airport security. The loopholes are endless. XRaying laptops is just blatantly stupid make-work. The entire frigging performance is insulting: it's a show targeting the gullible, who are supposed to believe that it makes a difference.
What really blows me away is that anyone believes it.
--
Don't like it? Respond with words, not karma.
How would federalization help?
Yes, I support having Federal inspectors. But the government's response has been:
"You, you and you. Congrats, you're now a federal worker!"
That doesn't help! It's the same exact people, now getting benefits from a different tier/branch
AFAIK, you cannot be forced into having something X-Rayed. Instead, you can request that your belongings be hand-inspected, which arouses suspicion and causes delays. the most common occurrance is Photographers, as X-Rays kill film.
[Security Guard]: Excuse me, sir, you're going to have to remove that equipment and place it in the machine.
[Passenger]: I can't do that, it's my oxygen tank and wheelchair.
[SG]: Sir, you will have to turn off and on your equipment and place it in the X-Ray machine.
[P]: Um... You don't understand. I'm disabled. I need my motorized wheelchair and oxygen to live...
[Security Supervisor]: What seems to be the hold up here?
[SG]: This man refuses to let his equipment be checked through security. He's acting suspiciously, he wont even stand up.
[P]: Look, I'm unable to stand. I need this oxygen to breath. What is wrong with you people?!
[SS]: Sir, please calm down, or we'll have to have you removed and your equipment confiscated.
[P]: Aren't you listening? I'm diabled. It's not like I chose to bring this stuff with me.
[SG]: Sir, place the equipment on the X-Ray machine now! I'm not going to tell you again.
[P]: Look you stupid cow, I couldn't even if I wanted to.
[SS]: That's it.
Struggle struggle, yank yank
[P]: Gasp, wheeze
[SG]: Sir, if you don't get off the floor, we will have you removed from the building! Sir? SIR?
[Bystander1]: Look, that man is choking.
[Bystander2]: Oh my god! He's must have anthax! AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH!
Panic panic, crash crash
THE END
Sig
Appended to the end of comments you post. 120 chars
Maybe it's out of line, but it sounds like he was baiting airport security with this. In an age where suicide bombers are racking up the death toll on both sides of the Israel/Palestine "war" (they won't call it that, but anywhere people kill each other qualifies, in my book), it would seem that someone implanting a bomb in their body is not only plausible, but if they're willing to die, it's downright good planning. How many people are willing to take a chance getting on a plane, knowing that the guy sitting next to them is potentially a (forgive the pun) ticking time bomb?
Steve Mann is an interesting fellow, to be sure. He even comes across as rational at times, but honestly, don't give me the honest looking face and the "aw shucks" shrug. He knew it would cause some heartache, and wanted the newsprint for it. I applaud the folks at the airport. For doing their job...
"Goodness, how did you people live long enough to invent tools?" -Hobbes (the tiger, not the philosopher)
Being disoriented from not taking off the glasses...
Half million dollars worth of equipment...
This guy probably avoids rain and water, and other types of matter in liquid form like the plague.
He probably hasnt showered in years.
But judging from that really funny looking picture of him, he probably doesnt have any friends anyways to smell him.
Ionizing Radiation wipes outs ROM and FLASH memories. The Radiation breaks down the charge on the memory cells causing them to reset.
Well, it's a shame the security personnel weren't cyborgs, they could have done a web search on the spot. Well, maybe in a few years.
You might want to see someone about that hoplophobia of yours.
I play Nerd-Folk!
This is why you support the federalization...!!!! What planet are you living on?! Government employees are the MOST INCOMPETENT employees around. (I refuse to call them government workers).
Still works.
Good judgement comes from experience, and experience comes from bad judgement.
- W. Wriston, former Citibank CEO
For example, you could have carried two or three of these .
The Parent Post is offtopic but iterating this through replies to the parent is redundant.
heuristic algorithm seeks stochastic relationship
Actually, you can look at the events of the airline bailout more thoroughly. Sure, the reward that you talk about seems just like that - free money. But, it looks more to be like a subsidy. We can compare it to past farmer-gov relationships. The government doesn't want the market flooded with an excess of products, otherwise the price of the products will drop out due to the extreme surplus of supply, and various farmers will go broke - which we don't want under certain circumstances because not all farmers may produce all products (as well as other reasons). So they (the gov) pay the farmers to either not produce a certain amount of a certain product for a given time period, or they buy already produced products and store them or allow them to go to waste. In this case, the gov just bought $15 billion worth of plane ticets, and the airlines didn't produce the flights (a service here, but keeping the product mentality going is more pleasing). As well, I am sure the airlines wouldn't have minded at all to not receive the bailout as long as the amount of scheduled flights remained the same. The amount of money lost far exceeded the bailout that the airlines received, so the net reward gained was still negative (the attacks can be considered a reward here - just kind of like getting underwear for Christmas is a present, heh).
Steve is a bonafide asshole and a plagiarist to boot. He's invented his own myth and you id10ts buy into it because he's the only thing uglier and more socially inept than yourselves. Plus you don't have the slightest clue of a) what he's doing, b) what parts of it are interesting, c) what he's actually invented, and d) how little parts b) and c) have to do with part a).
I only wish the exaggerated reports of his ordeal were true. Just ask anyone who's had to work with him what a thieving, duplicitous, and self-promoting purveyor of half-truths he is.
Here is what his colleagues at MIT used to think of him (and a damn sight more kindly than they do today).
The solution really seems quite simple, and it's definitely not the one they chose:
Don't allow him to board the plane yet, get him to stay for some days until management can confirm his documentation (call the universities, for example), then personally oversee his boarding the plane a couple of days later, after a reasonable, non-intrusive search.
Don't they have to do something like this when someone with special needs of medical attention/equipment needs to travel anyway?
If the guy happens to be famous enough to appear on the media, you might want to pay for the hotel and new airplane ticket just like when the airlines resell your ticket. But that's strictly a PR move.
Most likely, he takes charge of the extra expense on his trip, security takes charge of the extra expense of making a couple of phone calls and personally overseeing him for 20 minutes when he finally boards the plane.
No strip search, no destroyed equipment, little wasted time for other passengers and most likely no lawsuits.
Freedom is the freedom to say 2+2=4, everything else follows...
Someone could also carry on a pack of matches and some nonmetal baloons fitted to his or her body filled with gasoline. There are limitless ways bad people can do bad things. It isn't naive so much as stupid if we expect highschool flunkies to make it safe to fly.
I think I'll stick to the train when I have to travel. Slower, but cheaper and I like it. No anal probes are needed either.
He wasn't trying to Enter Canada. He was already there (and got in no problem.) He was trying to LEAVE.
Nipok Nek
Why choose white shoes?
I can't decide who the bigger jackass is, the NY Times reporter who brought us this retarted crap, or the pathetic moron attempting to board the plane. This isn't news, it's more in line for the Onion. I'd be less nauseatic if this were a stupid joke. Greg
I don't know about Canada, but my understanding is that in the United States, FAA regulations require only that airport security personnel must hand-inspect *film* and *cameras* if requested.
Many larger photographic shops can sell you a luggage tag with the FAA regulation printed on it, which can come in handy when you run into idiot security personnel who flat out refuse to hand-inspect anything or flatly demand that their x-ray machine is safe and that you must have your film x-rayed. (Most x-ray machines *are* safe, but a few aren't, you can't trust the signs on them, and some film seems mysteriously more sensitive.)
All things considered, however, I think before taking anything Steve Mann says seriously we should hear a report on him from someone from the MIT wearable computers group. The many people I've met from the group do not speak of him in warm fuzzy terms, to put it extremely mildly.
It's great that the Rump Ranger Brigade in the Geek Compound can put 'features' in the Slashcode that break HTML links, but they refuse to fix the Page Widening Bug.
It's almost time to start actively crapflooding this site.
do you think we could ratchet down the rapid technophile rights rhetoric a bit?
Mann's got more than a bit of the performance artist and cyborg evangelist in him. This type of situation is pure gold to him, and the more he can play it up, the better the publicity.
If anyone's seen the documentary about him, he's got a serious hard-on about getting in the faces of authority figures and confronting them with his gear. I wouldn't be surprised if he was more than a little obnoxious with the airport security staff. Which isn't to say that they were right, but it's usually not a smart idea to blatantly piss off the people with the guns.
Man! A life-time of making newfie jokes finally proven right!
So, a newfie security guard strip searches a cyborg and...
You can't take the sky from me...
I know lots of people like to make fun of government workers (and for good reason), but security is one thing that government workers do better than private companies. Just compare your average rent-a-cop to your average police officer. The professionalism and training of real law enforcement officers is far beyond what you'd find with security guards. Unfortunately, the new federalized airport security isn't a real full-blown law enforcement agency, and I'm afraid it will end up closer to DMV quality staff.
THIS GUY IS NOT A CYBORG!
There, I feel better. Imagine my excitement when I read this article implying there was a human being who is a cyborg. I was intently interested in what incredible technology must have gone into him in the form of these "implants," and what horrible condition (thinking of Stephen Hawking) he must be in that he cannot function without them.
Folks, wearing an X10 webcam on your face does not make you a cyborg. And I'm mad that someone got my excitement up.
Read the comments, read the article, and do some google searching. This guy would like to attract a lot of attention -- and sure, wearable computing is a great thing. But he doesn't have implants, and he is not a cyborg.
I wear glasses to enhance my vision. That doesn't make me a cyborg. This guy wears a webcam over his eye to enhance his vision. And he thinks that's such a spectacular thing, he's named the concept "The EyeTap principle", apparently thinking it's just incredibly original. What a concept! Carrying around a camera and showing what you see to the world! Get real.
I'd give anything to see the note from his doctor. As his "implants" were nothing more than sticky electrodes like a heart patient might wear in the hospital (giving readouts about as exciting as coke machines and Christmas trees attached to the net, I'm sure), what possible medical explanation could be given that he requires these things on his person. They are possessions, not body parts. Maybe his experiment might be interrupted and the equipment damaged, but there is no medical need here, and thus a note from a doctor is nothing more than an attempt to be special and have people bend the rules.
I sound excessively negative here, but I'm a little bit mad at the grandstanding and sensationalism of this person. I note the article claims he's never had any problems like this before (a verbatim quote he gave to the media I'm sure), but his website claims he had similar problems in 2000. I guess the problems weren't so bad he'd vow never to fly Air Canada again.
One more time, and say it with me (you'll feel better, too): STEVE MANN IS NOT A CYBORG.
Secession is the right of all sentient beings.
>When you want to mix with the rest of society you have to conform to certain standards
Part of those standards dictate that you aren't allowed to make others bleed or experience pain without their express consent.
>Steve won't play by those rules. Steve deserves everything he gets.
And so do the airport security. If you don't play by the rules of society (which are defined as laws) then you go to jail.
>If I see any wanker pretending to be a borg in an airport I'll have a quiet word to a national guardsman, just to make the fool think twice about doing it again.
Would you make him bleed?
I would hope not.
If you could be told what you can see or read, then it follows that you could be told what to say or think - BoC
I love to fly. I love goin in the airport. I always feel safe in the airport thanks the high calibre individuals we have working at x-ray security.
How bout this crack squad of savvy motivated personnel? Feel pretty good with them at the helm?
The way you want to set up your X-ray security is you want the short heavyset woman at the front with the skin-tight uniform. That's your first line of defence. You want those pants sprayed on, you want them so tight the flap in front of the zipper has pulled itself open and you can see the metal tangs hanging on for dear life.
Then you got that other genius down at the other end looking at the TV screen. This Einstein has chosen to stand in front of X-rays fourteen hours a day as his profession. (makes whirring sound) He's lookin in the TV set, I always look in the TV set, I cannot make out one object, I dunno what this guy is doing. It's my own bags I cant understand one thing. What was that? He's going "What is that a hairdryer with a scope on it? That looks ok. Keep it movin." "Some sort of bowling ball candle? That's fine, just, we don't wanna hold up the line."
Except that your analogy fails. Public school teachers have to put up with MASSIVE amounts of bullshit just to teach. They also are forced to put in large amounts of unpaid overtime (typically called ajunct duties - things like supervising dances, clubs, etc.) That said, the good teachers are at public schools because they DO make more, but are also forced to teach according to fucked up regulations that private schools don't need to. It's the administrators (and larger class sizes) that have fucked up our schools - NOT the teachers (there are exceptions of course...)
Suuure. Tried it lately? As far as I can tell at the Canadian border, you've got precisely a 50/50 chance of making it in without hassle. (For non-citizens, at any rate.) And two weeks ago, they detained a friend of mine because although she's a Canadian citizen, she's got a Great Britain birth certificate. The trouble is, it's completely up to the discretion of the border guards. God help you if you get the cranky woman at the truck crossing at 3 AM. =)
~ Leilah
The nazis loved the sound the M1s clip made when that last round was fired and the clip ejected from the rifle, in fact, many in a firefight fired and listened for the clatter of that M1 clip on a hard surface....pop up, fire at the GI and that was the end of the GI. Later, many got smart and left a round chambered, reloaded a fresh clip and waited for nazi boy to pop up and BANG! nazi boy went down. The clatter from those clips caused many deaths of our fighting men in WWII, and after many wised up, they would toss an empty clip onto a rock to "force" the enemy to show his face because he heard that familiar sound, and he would be shot dead because he "assumed" the GI was out of ammo.
206.39.38.2, DDN-BLK-36, DOD NET INFO CENTER. 800.365.3642 206.36.0.0-206.39.255.255 NET RANGE.
If microwave waves messed up someone's pacemaker, he was standing in a really bad place.
The reason that microwave cookers used to screw up pacemakers is that they gave off big rotating fields of magnetism. It didn't have a thing to do with the microwave waves themselves. Pacemakers are programmed using magnets, and exposing them to giant rotating magnetic fields is a bad idea.
People operating a microwave cooker shouldn't be hit with microwave waves at all. Microwave waves, while fairly harmless to a pacemaker, will cook you. Anyone being hit with them is a bad idea, it's like getting a sunburn inside your body, hence the whole shielded door interlock thing. Small amounts of them are okay, but microwave waves are able to cook a turkey, they're certainly able to cook you, and unlike conventional stoves, you cannot feel the microwave waves, as they are heating the inside of you up, where you do not have nerve endings.
Of course, none of this applies any more, as current microwave cookers don't give off that much magnetism anymore, and current pacemakers are much less sensitive to random magnetism. (And there are no people with 'old' pacemakers out there, they have to be replaced every ten years or so when the batteries fail.) So the old 'can't have pacemakers around microwaves' doesn't apply anymore.)
In case anyone cares, yes, I do have a pacemaker, and I microwave all the time. The only time I get nervous is when people run those handheld metal detectors all over my body. And I don't stand go into power planets because of the giant generators.
If corporations are people, aren't stockholders guilty of slavery?
Look at the attack on paris middle 90, or the attack on Frankurt Airport. For those who were in frankfurt , ever wondered what is this big metalic statue in hall B ? Welll this was the exact place a bomb explosed killing lot of people. To sum up, we have a long history of beeing target of terrorist. So maybe we take it more seriously on a local way, like security in airport and U train.
C. Sagan : A demon haunted world:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0345409469/
visit randi.org
He wasn't trying to leave either. He had flown from Toronto to St. John with no problem, and was trying to fly back. Both of those cities are in Canada.
The professionalism and training of real law enforcement officers is far beyond what you'd find with security guards.
Well, I'm not too impressed with the police forces of our nation - trained they generally are - professional? only some - and the bad ones taint the whole force. (Not to mention, it seems the good cops never want to hunt down the bad ones, and end up protecting them - to their own detriment.)
That said, the rent-a-cop's are lots worse, though we don't usually have the rent-a-cops shooting mentally ill people because they were a "threat" to the officer!
Frankly, it seems to really hinge on staff at the top that want results. Look at the post-office. In all my dealings with them in the last 15 years or so, it's gotten lots better. I believe that this is largely because of an individual at or near the top that wants the job done right. He demands good performance from those directly under him, and they do the same, and so on until you reach the employees at the bottom. It's a law I follow - see crap at the employee level? Give the company one chance to fix it. If you don't get much response, you can be sure it's straight from the top. Find another vendor...
Well wait and see how the new airport security works. With Herr Ashcroft at the helm, I'm worried about how things will work. There doesn't seem to be a bunch of accountability in any of the justice department arms, and I suspect there will be little here too. (On a side note, it's funny how we keep giving law enforcement more and more power - but never seem to add the responsibility to go with it. I.E. You get additional powers for wire-tap (pen and trace) but if we find you used it wrong, you loose your job, and you'll never work in law enforcement in the US again - ANYWHERE! Until the consequenses of bad behavior cost the people who do it heavily, we'll continue to see law-enforecement abuse. Heck, if I could get away with it, I'd probably be guilty too...)
Cheers!
I'm going to sew your asshole shut and forcefeed you like the chickendick that you are.
SCORE.
I guess I should have explained. By "professional" I don't mean that they're nice guys and never abuse their authority. I meant that they can arrest an armed and dangerous suspect without getting killed or hurt.
St. John's is just shy of 100K people, with a sister city right next door pushing that to abot 130-150K. It's also the provincial capital. And this is not a rural airport, it's an international hub (being physically closest to Europe still counts for something, b'ys.) While he certainly wouldn't have the exposure he has in Toronto, we're not talking backwater hicks, either. Factor in that it is still a small enough place that a visit from him would constitute local celebrity news, and you've got a better than even chance that his presence was known.
Actually prior to 9-11-2001 I don't think you can find many acts of terrorism in US airports that required the use of any type of military or police intervention with automatic weapons.
....... NOPE. Two shots ... maybe. But they are trained to use thier weapon including how it's carried. They wear body armor. "Ever tried to ... ", nope... but the guardsmen have! It's part of their training. I'd grade them an A for their presence, a C for the number of guardsmen being used, and the whole US airport security system a C due to their inexperience in actual civilian airport security experience.
If you would like to ask yourself why these other airports from other countries do need these the go right ahead.
As for the inference that NG (National Guardsmen) would fumble around with their weapon
Lastly the reason of the NG being present is as a precaution and to give the flying public the message that some kind of response to terrorism is close by.
I don't give a $hit if a guard has their hand on the handle, trigger, or their crotch. Because the element of surprise is a given for the terrorist. If you think the military could treat civilian airport security the same way it does with it's own airfields your wrong. If left up to the military youd be writing to bitch about how your rights are violated by the stormtroopers manning the airport security gates.
By far more terroristic acts have been done at non-us airports around the world and this website lists a few dating back to the late 1960's.
Integrity is what you are when nobody is looking.
Implants! Yeah right. Steve Mann is a total asshole and this a childlish publicity stunt. Steve Mann is an embarassment to the field of wearable computing. His performance (or non-performance, he sent asshold grad students in his stead) at the IEEE International Symposium on Wearable Computers (ISWC) in Zurich this October was a complete embarrassment and the papers he writes are absolute shit. He thinks he invented wearable computer because he strapped a 40lb desktop to his back in the 80's. The only thing he has contributed to this field is silly pictures.
I could pull a Steve Mann paper out of my ass. Its very simple.
Step 1. Add pictures of self in progressivly more riduculous getups starting with 1985 and moving to the present year. Wear oversized MIT sweatshirt to hide huge cables and look important.
Step 2. Fill half the paper babbling about Steve Mann's history of wearable computing which revolves exclusivly around papers he wrote. Be careful to leave out any references to mobile phones, wristwatches and PDA's but rather imply backpacks with 386s in them were the beginning of mobile computing.
Step 3. Doctor up a screen shot of running Emacs overlaid in AR. Possibly the worst interface ever.
Step 4. Propose promising yet obvious future applications but take no steps to implement them.
Step 5. Ramble on about how the current state of privacy and surveilance will be turned on its head if everyone straps a desktop and a web-cam to their back.
Step 6a. Present at conference. Generally be an asshole. Give demo with a with a head-mounted display on. Allow no one to see what you claim is in your head-mount.
Step 6b. Optionally you may skip the conference, send smartass grad students. Claim your civil rights are violated by airport security. Make all American attendees glad you come from Canada now rather that from MIT.
If you want to flame me back do it here.
"No airport security agent should ever be unprofessional like that (which is why I support the federalization program currently in progress in the US). But the guy had to be inspected. "
No. Federalization has nothing to do with professionalism. It will simply make the matter worse. Against a private company screener you could stand a fair chance to recover damages, against the Federal Government your toast.
Government screeners know they are immune to most things a private company employee would have to worry about, and they willingly use the threat of the law (Read : the whole GOVERNMENT) to exploit those who must pass through their lines. How many stories have you read about sleeping "professional federal agents" or having metal detectors unplugged while operated by "professional federal agents"? I have seen many, and they come each week.
Don't fall for that bullshit line from the DNC, Professionalism DOES NOT EQUAL Federalism. If this was such a good idea then why don't the European countries support federalized airport security? Simple : Accountability.
* Winners compare their achievements to their goals, losers compare theirs to that of others.
None, so it's lucky that they didn't do that:
You (and the moderators) fail the cluecheck. Looks to me like Captain Cyborg here is equally as guilty in the stubberness stakes, and is now happily milking this for publicity. It's an interesting story, but don't read things into it that aren't there.
If you were blocking sigs, you wouldn't have to read this.
Handheld? Why handheld?
Every airport I've gone through in recent months has a system to do explosive residue 'tracing'. They take a little gauze patch held by a little wand and wipe it on the laptop case, the attache handle, my shoes and anything else that might have come into contact with bomb-making material (exactly what that includes, I don't know).
Then they put the gauze patch in a machine that makes a little 'beep' and blinks a green light if you are ok. (I assume if a red light and a buzzer sounds, your laptop is going to get a visit from the bomb disposal squad.)
The handheld stuff would presumably be useful for faster screening of many more items/passengers as the system I've seen takes a lot of time. I wonder how much of this was was because Mann was indignant and uncooperative because they didn't just read his papers and let him through?
Hey, I live in St. John's, Newfoundland, right now I'm about a 2 minute drive from said airport. I want to apologize for small people who think they have been put on top of a pedestal since Sept 11th, or the people above them who pressure them so much not to let any exceptions (even obvious ones) through making them feel they have no choice but to obey or lose thier job.
:)
What I want to know is, WHY was he here at all? We're a pretty small place, I can only assume he was here to visit the university, I want to know who he was here to visit.
I hope his experiement is not ruined and that he was not traumatized by the event. Newfoundlander's are actually known for our friendliness! REALLY!
Again, sorry from the PRO-cyborgs in Newfoundland.
- The latest in DVR video surveillance technology! www.remotesentrysystems.com
i think it depends on the airport. at sea-tac the NG was at the security checkpoints, m-16 unslung, fingers on the triggers. you are right though, every single time i've flown overseas, it's hard to go anywhere in the airports and not see police with unslung automatic weapons.
Login: cypherpunk230
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Pass : cypherpunk230
They removed the last cypherpunk I made
Oh well. Now they will see a huge increas in pupularity of 19 year old retired clergymen living in Afghanistan hehe.
That "explosive" trace detector must detect traces of nitrate -- that's about the only thing that is common to all common explosives. One trouble is that nitrates also have many non-explosive uses. Walk across a lawn after it's fertilized and your shoes will beep the detector -- that's the likely reason for an incident in San Francisco recently, where they closed the airport after the moron in charge of the machine let the suspect shoes get away. Playing cards will leave nitrate traces on your hands.
And still, it's not going to detect all explosives. NO3 is the usual oxidizer for explosives, but there are other possible oxidizers. The sniffers will catch commercial and military explosives, and probably anything a Tim McVeigh could cook up on his own, but I'm pretty sure my high school chemistry teacher could have made a batch of nitrogen-free explosive if he wanted to. I might even be able to do it myself, if I didn't mind a rather high risk of blowing up the kitchen and myself... A terrorist group with arab oil money could certainly afford a better lab than that high school, and if they could send men to flight school to learn to fly jumbos (but not to land and take off!), they wouldn't have any trouble at all getting a few of their guys into a chemistry major at a US college...
I think I should point out, for the benefit of non-Canadian readers, that St. John's is in Newfoundland, the province that newfies come from.
On the other hand, apparently Reid (the "shoe bomber") first attracted suspicion by 'acting weird', at least, if the reports are to be believed.
Determined, competent highjackers will, indeed, act normal. But security also has to be worried about whackos who think the Nebuloids from Planet Zeppo want them to fly a commercial airliner to Uranus.
Apparently the security guards were rude, and perhaps unnecessarily rough. But Dr. Mann had to expect some attention and concern. It also sounds like there were some bureaucratic problems that prevented the guards from being notified.
PHEM - party like it's 1997-2003!
Hmmm... first, they are M16A2s... military does not even carry in active inventory AR15s anymore.
Second, they are chambered and locked, on safe.
Third, having just flown through Paris, you will notice that those are Internal Security troops, an extension of their version of the FBI (think BATF stormtroopers here).
Fourth, at JFK for every two you see there are two you don't... look around a bit more. They also have a emergency response team for the tarmac (two hummers, M60s on each with 2000 rounds and LAWs, as well as 16 men) and four inside ERTs consiting of 12 men each. As well, there are FBI, Sherrif, and State police in both plain clothes and uniform, some armed with MP5s.
Fifth, having your weapon slinged is not that big of an impediment to bringing it into action if it is 'cocked and locked' 1-3 seconds max and you are on target and ready.
Sixth, you must be under the general assumption that any terrorist actually willing to undertake a firefight in an airport terminal would have the skill and talent to go to CQB with these guardsman and best them. Terrorist types are not known for their accurate shooting; in fact, their limited weapons training by most accounts is for assasination style drive forward and kill the target attacks with little thought to tactic or extricating yourself from the fight at the end in one piece. Further, they are not taught to shoot straight, but rather spray which is not the best way to take down a target.
Seven: Most of the guardsman, if you look closely, are wearing second chance Class II or III torso body armour (no plates) which would stop pistol and submachine gun rounds (or at least limit their penetration force). Granted, getting shot up (especially if you are a 5' tall woman of typical female body stature and physique) even while wearing body armour is no pleasant experience, but you probably won't kill them unless you are trained for head shots or using penatrative ammo.
Eight: Why would a terrorist type person come in and shoot up the guardsman. Unless their goal is to blow themselves up in the terminal or at the gates where there are alot of people, this makes no sense. Even if they are trying to get to the crowded areas to suicide bomb, they don't have great odds of getting through the chokepoints that the secruity search area is... the ERT force would pounce on them in those tight quarters and keep them from harming the larger civie population in the open concourses and gate areas.
Most likely they are going to go for the airplane anyway, which means they would not be armed... They will use ceramic or non-threatening weapons, or use cut-outs to place weapons aboard (remember that supposedly the Airport staff has been screened and they are searching airplanes before boarding). They will try to board peacefully and non-obrusively and wait until airborne and isolated from all but the random Air Marshal before acting.
The 'guardsmen' you saw are Army National guard. They have recieved some additional (if short) training beyond their normal security police training, and usually are decent shots. I wouldn't call them 'shooters' by any stretch, but their job is more one of intimidation and support for the civie security and police functions at the gate. The real power is hidden away and that is quite normal for a security force.
You may be right that since they don't have their weapons at Port Arms and finger on the trigger that someone one might manage to get the two at the gate, but I guarantee you that they wouldn't get to the Jetway they are wanting without a major firefight. The post standing guardsmen are for show and there to assist the airport security and sherrifs with rowdy passengers. The ERTs on the other hand are not 'riot' and law enforcement types, they are go in and kill anything that moves types like you saw in Rome (or would see in Germany).
The Paris gendarme security you saw are militarized, to be sure, but I don't know if I want a post guard with his finger on the trigger, so to speak, to be the only assurance of security I have. I am sure they have more security on tap like we do, but I can't say that a man with his finger ready to rock and roll is a good idea.
Security should instill a sense of security in the passengers and staff WITHOUT scaring those they are there to protect. Non-obtrusive security FORCE is better than naked force, and usually far more effective.
Fuck baby Jesus in his widdle mouth.
Uh, who's DAVE MacKenzie? Perhaps you meant Bob? Take off, eh?
Saint John=New Brunswick
St. John's=Newfoundland
Whether Mann is a jackass or not is irrelevant. People have legal rights to be jackasses, and their legal rights are not impaired by being jackasses. Being a jackass does not grant security personnel license to commit battery or otherwise violate the laws that normally apply.
Security may have needed to examine Mann prior to allowing him to board, but that does not mean they had to pull devices off his body. They could have asked or required him to remove the devices. Pulling a device that is a attached to a person from a person is clearly not part of a normal search and hence cannot be deemed to have been consented to by the person as the result of prior implicit or explicit consent to a general search. Therefore separate permission is clearly required. In the absence of such permission, removing a device from the body of a person constitutes battery.
Coincidentally, last month I wrote to the Manchester, New Hampshire, airport authority and to the security company inquiring about the new sign saying FAA regulation requires laptops to be X-rayed. I asked what reason they had to believe this would not damage laptops and who would be liable if it did. Neither party has answered. Past studies may have shown components are unlikely to be affected by typical airport X-ray screening, but components keep shrinking, so who says the conclusion is still valid?
I doubt X-raying laptops is useful anyway. From what I was able to observe, the laptop shows up on the X-ray display as a black rectangle or a grey rectangle with black rectangles in it. It appears to be no evidence would be visible about the presence of blades (since sharpness is not visible in the cross-section) or what is behind the black rectangles.
The 5.56 ammo is actually quite a bit of an overpenatrator, but that is by design. It is a high velocity round that stays relatively in tact on impact with the body and slices through at high velocity (unless it hits bone), curving and tumbling but keeping high E for quite a while. It creates terrible wound cavities and channels... this is from a design perspecitive and military thought that injuring your victime actually takes out three men (two to carry off the wounded man).
/.
There is actually an A3 version that deletes the push assist. So far it is only seen in limited quantities with security forces and some spec ops units. It has a redesigned bolt head and spacer, a shorter but more lively bolt return spring, and it is short in overall dimensions by about 2 inches. Commanality of parts is about 80%. Another feature is the incorporation of a box/drum mag adapter on the bottom of the mag well so that 50/90/100/120 round drum mags can be used (helps to stabilize the weight/load characteristics of the mag when the rifle is handled violently). There is no full auto with the A3 as well, only single/safe/burst modes.
The original M16 does not exist in active duty units anymore. You will only find it still serving with SWAT units and BATF/FBI. There are plenty still in military armories however, and some smaller NG units till see them in intermittent service. 90% of all variants in use in the US today are A1 and A2... quite a few were sold off or what not to third world friendlies.
Also, depending on the scenario, the M16 is in fact a bit too long for this kind of duty. Remember it is used by NG troopies at security check points (translate chokepoints). Tight spaces and long arms don't mix well. However, this is what they are trained on so I doubt you see the military issuing CAR versions or some of the limited short guns (MP5s for example) they have for Ranger and other special duty forces.
Other wise, your post is accurate... surprising for
Look, obviously no one is going to fly a terminal into a skyscraper. But if you read a little history, you will see accounts of how in the 60's and 70's, in places like Rome and Greece, teams of terrorists would wip out machine guns simulatneously in two seperate airports and shoot into the crowds until they themselves were shot, without any regard for personal safety. This is why european airports have armed guards, and why they now have them in the US. A lot of people congregate in airports, from all over the world, and it makes a pretty strong statement when you randomly slaughter citizens from 10 countries at once. It's not all about the airplanes, you know.
- If This Peace Is Fictious, I Shall Destroy It
(The following is in reference to Canadian practices only, since I have no clue how it works in other countries)
No, they can't strip search you on a whim, and no, they can't hold you without telling you why.
To hold you beyond a rational time for questioning, you must be read your rights. To be stripped, you must be read your rights and there must be probably cause.
How do I know? I used to be a border guard. The whole 'you have no rights at the border' thing is a total myth.
They are doing this all wrong.
Don't take knives from people, hand them out in the terminal. Make sure every passenger over 18 is armed and dangerous and then we'll see who tries to hijack our planes.
they shoulda just shot the stupid asshole and let U of T and the airline deal with it.
if you dont conform you deserve to be shot anyway.
its darwinian selection.
The fact remains that if I was a terrorist trying to cause maximum chaos -- I sure wouldn't bother with anything remotely near the airport. Why go through the hassle? Everyone has a heightened sense of awareness about the whole thing - and you have to spend all that time training to learn to fly the plane, before you're even ready to do anything with it.
Why not look into sabotaging trucks carrying hazardous chemicals, or blowing up an arena or stadium during a huge concert or ball-game, or derailing trains, or any slew of other relatively unprotected means of transport and venues that are out there?
You're inherently "unsafe" any time you venture out in public. The airport is no different than any other place, other than the fear people have of getting on planes. (If they crash, you're nearly certain to die.)
I'm more concerned with the possibility of a mechanical failure than some wacko hijaacking the plane. At least I have the possibility of stopping a hijaacker. I don't forsee being able to climb out on the wing and do a quick engine repair before the plane crashes....
Idiot guard: "Take off your shoes"
Cro Magnon: "I don't think you want me to do that"
IG: "TAKE OFF YOUR SHOES"
CM: "But..."
IG: "TAKE OFF YOUR SHOES YOU !@#$"
CM: takes off shoes. A large toxic cloud emerges. People panic. People die. "I tried to warn him"
Slow down, cowboy! It has been 4 hours since you last posted. You must wait another few hours.
No.
The low-intensity X-rays used at airports don't even cloud film, unless you have special (X-ray sensitive?) film.
Of course, you can always insist on a hand check, as you point out.
I understand them wanting to check him out, and maybe even a strip search is in order, but when they had documentation signed by his doctor stating everything he's said, and they were unwilling to accomodate his requests to speak in person to his doctor or colleagues, yet still will not make an exception... there is a problem.
Well, exactly how are they going to authenticate the doctor's message? Or know that the doctor is to be trusted? Should you be able to get a bunch of gear onto an airliner uninspected by posing as a cyborg?
The bottom line is that, for now, if you want to be a cyborg, air travel is going to be inconvenient.
Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
I'm from this city in Newfoundland, and although this seems extreme, I can't totally blame security at the airport. In the meantime, I'd like to hear the 'real' story, cause I am sure if the professor didn't want to remove those implants, he wouldn't, especially if his well being was at stake. If his gadgets made security nervous, I'm glad they did the right thing and not let him on.
In defense to those at St. John's airport, ie, security personnel, St. John's could be a prime target for someone with ill intentions to try to get on a plane with some harmful device or item. There is only 1 security gate, and not nearly as much security as Toronto for example. If someone did get aboard at St. John's and had a weapon, then critizism would be reversed, pointing fingers. But it would seem now St. John's has tight security and stops at any sign of breach.
I boarded a flight here in St. John's late August of 2001 to Toronto, and through the detector
came a rough looking guy in all denem with a briefcase, odd combination. Security stopped him, what did he have in his briefcase? a box cutter. He got on the flight, but I couldn't tell if the cutter did or not, but they did some heavy questioning. Anywho, guess who got back the night before the 9/11 attacks from Houston, glad I
wasn't stuck down there during that. Could have been worse if I did.
Americans seem anxious to take off their shoes, but when a guy comes through with all these gadgets strapped to him and denied access, you get all upset.
Regards...
Unfortunately, the email nobody@nowhere.com has already been used.
Catmeat
(A female military officer from Azerbijan, earning $150K a year in the field of customer relations)
Well, in my opinion the gov't has no problems with spending more then enough money on projects, and if this is put under Bush's homeland defense idea, then it'll get as much money as it needs.
Now we still have the problem of the actual people that get hired to do this, I just hope that they care about their job and do it correctly.
Oh Lord, save us from Heinlein later garbage. The novels in which he thought he was so sophisticated and witty.
(Clue: Love Field and Intercontinental both are _small_ airports, usually used for commuter flights in and out of Dallas and Houston- they normally don't rate a hand-held bomb detector unit...)
No, sorry, you're clueless. (Sorry for the ad hominem, but you have to admit you set yourself up for that one...)
Houston Intercontinental(IAH) is NOT a small airport (you probably meant Hobby (HOU), the "old" airport, still quite active, but much smaller than IAH): IAH is Continental Airlines home hub and the 17th busiest airport in the *world* by passenger count and 13th by traffic. Love Field in Dallas is no slouch, either: it's the home base for Southwest Airlines (the only airline making significant money at the moment) and would be far busier if it weren't for meddlesome federal rules limiting the use of this really convenient in-town airport to avoid "hurting" the regional behemoth. In fact, Love and Hobby are such success stories, and so well liked and used by travellers, that several years ago, the FAA started insisting that whenever a new regional behemoth is opened, the old airport must be *destroyed* and rendered unusable, even for general aviation (private planes). Denver and Austin are examples of cities that have suffered mightily because of this, and are forced to live with ridiculously expensive white elephant airports that might as well be in another county...
"The future's good and the present is nothing to sneeze at." - Roblimo's last
Well, screw him. Idiot. Travelling by plane this day and age with all that crap on. You can refuse to be searched and therefore refused to board. It does not take two days to return to Toronto if you choose a ferry instead of the plane.
good explanation, thanks
We don't call it ScareCanada for nothin'!
>if you dont conform you deserve to be shot anyway.
>its darwinian selection.
That's a strange view on Darwinian Selection. Here I was always thinking that Darwin said Monocultures are destined to die out.
Yeah, *one pass* through x-ray *shouldn't* hurt *normal* 400 speed visible light photographic film.
And no one *ever* takes their film through two or more airports, right? Like, on the return trip?
My experience has shown two is the absolute limit. Three or above (trips through x-ray), you're begging for image damage--which is not acceptable!
And if you're carrying IR or UV film (I do airphoto analysis) you definitely don't want to let the film go through even *once*.
When a client is paying $10,000 for airphotos and analysis, do you really want to have to do it again because of the *x ray* machines?
AC