Slashdot Mirror
Netscape 7.0 is Out
MrJones was one of many many users to submit that Netscape has released
Navigator 7.0 unto the world. With their dwindling market share, it'll be interesting to see what affect this has on internet users. But here's hoping it makes a dent.
Argh! Things don't have an affect!
Yes! That guy!
What's the difference between it and Mozilla?
Where is a link to a page describing the differences?
Why bother?
Unitarian Church: Freethinkers Congregate!
I'm surprised to see netscape is still around, but it's kind of like a tree falling in a forest... anyone who might be interested in using it is already using moz.
To make laws that man cannot, and will not obey, serves to bring all law into contempt.
--E.C. Stanton
But where is the platform support?
...
Some of us have SPARCs on our desk. Or PA-RISC machines. Or RS6k's.
These were all supported with Communicator
NS7 is useless to me till I can run it on these platforms...
--NBVB
Why should/would I use Netscape instead of Mozilla? Not getting enough pop-up windows in my life? Feel the need for a more closed solution?
Every year during my review, I just pray the words "slashdot.org" aren't mentioned.
There's no anti-javascript popup ads support. I'm sticking with Mozilla.
Why the quick jump to version 7? Is it just to match AOL v.7 or some other strange reason that my small non-marketing brain can't figure out?
THIS SPACE FOR RENT
The CNET review of 7.0 is here.
Title: Don't switch browsers
Summary:
We had high hopes for Netscape 7.0, but we're sorely disappointed, especially by the missing pop-up suppressor. There's no practical reason to switch from either IE or Mozilla.
People still use netscape? oic. . .
"Um, so what, Netscape is dead, use mozilla"
"yeah, big deal, it's based on Mozilla 1.0 when the Mozilla Organization just released 1.1, kudos to Netscape's already outdated browser".
Yes, but a lot of the time it's easier to:
1- have users download the familiar Netscape product instead of "that mozilla dinosaur thingy".
2- Introduce Netscape to organizations; at least it's a familiar name and brand for them.
I'm a rabid mozilla user, but still I'm pleased to see that Netscape is still alive, if maybe under AOL's life support infrastructure.
As a member of the moral community, this news deeply saddens me. It has been several years now since we have slain the hideous dragon of Netscape and replaced it with the more virtuous Microsoft Internet Explorer, a browser that is infinitely more pro-family, pro-American, and pro-virtue. Now, we see the final dying gasp of Netscape, its last-ditch attempt to do further damage to the moral fabric of a great nation. Well, I say: let them try! For with every beat of my heart I shall hhehhehehehe ahh, piss on it. I don't have this in me today. hehhehe sorry
Data shows Netscape browser usage down to just 3.4%
7 38 50%2C0.html?nlid=AM
Microsoft's rival browser, Internet Explorer, by contrast, has an estimated 96%
of the market, according to Internet research firm WebSideStory.
http://computerworld.com/newsletter/0%2C4902%2C
-=Mongr=-
Think of what might happen if the gazillions of AOL users started using Netscape when they upgrade to the next version of AOL!!!!!
AOL has the power to change the browser demographics of the web.
Wait for 7.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1, it'll be the one that makes everyone switch back!
fslg503-985-8686503-985-8686503-985-8686503-985-8
I like FreeBSD and Linux, and other open source products because they are the best products for me. But for everyone else, go on and use IE!!
"Version Inflation" -- to your average luser, "the higher the version number, the better it must be."
Forget netscape - we need to get the word out about how good Mozilla is. As a tech guy I've heard all about Mozilla and I use it all the time - but the average user thinks it is a new monster in JP4 or something! If Mozilla could get its name out (ie Super Bowl Ad), it would REALLY catch on....
smd4985
Print preview, Spell-checker, faster GUI and more Stability (i hope so) are fine. Are there other new features? And what happend to Issue 163648?
-Tabbed browsing
-Bookmark groups of tabs
-Website icons (address bar)
-Full screen mode
-Download manager
-Click to search
All seems fairly familiar from Moz. However when you actually do the download, check out the new License (not on the download page, the one in the file). It expressly forbids linking with GPL software. Yikes, what happened over there?
So that you wont have to /. mozillazine.org here's the text with links:
Netscape Communications Corporation today launched the final version of Netscape 7.0. This latest release is based on Mozilla 1.0.1, making it the first Netscape browser to be built upon post-1.0 code. The new version boasts several enhancements over the 0.9.4-based Netscape 6.2, including tabbed browsing, the ability to save complete web pages, print preview, site icons (Favicons), a download manager, full screen mode (Windows only), Quick Search within Mail Newsgroups and Address Book, return receipts, mail labels, (Secure Multipurpose Internet Mail Extensions) S/MIME mail encryption, CSS support in Composer and one-click web page publishing.
Netscape 7.0 also has several features not found in Mozilla. These include the ability to access Netscape Webmail and AOL accounts directly from within Mail Newsgroups, a button to easily toggle the display of My Sidebar in Navigator and P3P (Platform for Privacy Preferences) support for automated cookie handling. Improved instant messaging features including file transfers, Buddy Alerts and Buddy Icons are provided by AOL Instant Messenger for Netscape and ICQ for Netscape. There's also a round throbber with a cool animation.
Netscape 7.0 can be downloaded from Netscape's web site or FTP server. More details can be found at Netscape Browser Central or in the Release Notes.
09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0
If you prefer bleeding edge code with more bugs then use Mozilla. It doesn't have any of the above and has the popup blocker UI. Web developers will also appreciate stuff like the DOM inspector and JS Debugger modules.
One of the main challenges faced in getting users to use standards-compliant browsers over obsolete programs such as Netscape 4-series is also the computers. At places still using older systems or franken-systems, Moz (may just be too hefty for Windows. It doesn't seem as much of a problem on PCs, because IE is available, but many people still use NS4 for the mail client (and I cannot in good conscience tell them that Moz's is overwhelmingly superior, despite weird stuff like NS4 Mail encoding all messages in Rot13 by accident). It is an even bigger challenge with Macs, because many older Macs just won't comfortably run IE/mac, so NS4/mac is the browser of choice for aging Macs.
But saturating the market with standards-compliant browsers is helpful anyway. I could only wish more people knew about Mozilla, for their sake.
Karma: T-rexcellent.
When I tell people to switch from IE, I never suggest Netscape. I suggest Mozilla. Besides the few feature difference, Mozilla sounds new and exciting to many people, while Netscape 4 did a lot of damage to the Netscape name. For those who still like Netscape anyway, I explain the relation between the two, and they're generally okay with not using Netscape if they're still using the same code.
Mozilla installs, Netscape doesn't :(
When extracting the file "libpcl4.s" I get the error:
Error [-620]: A xpistub call failed.
This is on Gentoo linux.
Then it will really show that IE has won....crash bang ouch that hurts....stop it taco.
Why do you doubt? Allay your concerns.
Save Maine's economy: write stuff down. All comments are exclusively my own, not my employer.
I used to use Netscape 7.I used the AIM, the eMail, everything. But, that bad boy would use up to 50,000k of my memory(so says the olde task manager) so it brought the system to a crawl... Thanks to you guys, I now use Mozilla, which uses a lot too, but not near as much as Netscape. Also, I understand there are no more pop ups on the web....
What, me Tweet?
Please,
As a webdesigner, a web game developer, and as an internet user, please for the love of God, start the browser war back up.
When we have competition, at a scale over 20% for the browser, we will FINALLY see standards begin to matter!
AOL needs to:
- Aggressively work with computer makers to ship NS as the default browser in place of IE. More power to them if they also get AOL on it.
- Aggressively work to woo corporations to using Netscape again. Thats where Netscape was immensely powerful before, and where they can be again!
- Replace AOL's IE rendering engine with NS. They began with a closed beta, continued to Compuserve, moved it to AOL 4 Macs, now they need to do it on ALL of AOL.
With that, we may see a reverse in the tides. ANYTHING short of all of that, and it will be just a ripple.
PLEEEEEASE AOL, NS7 *IS READY*!
GPL'd web-based tradewars themed space game
So, Netscape has released another 'productized' version of Mozilla. Big deal. Let's take a look at the Exciting New Features it has:
And a couple other minor GUI tweaks. I'm not saying that Netscape isn't making progress (okay, so I am), but is this really worth a whole version number?
http://ufaq.org/files/adblocker.xpi
I have not tried it with the final version of Netscape 7, but it should work unless they've blocked it some how.
09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0
I checked /. about 10 minutes ago... no new on netscape, but I decided to upgrade(because netscape was already on my machine, it was just 10 versions old and I thought I'd see if they were making any progress... install version 7(not realizing it was brand new), set /. as my home page, and voila, notice that version 7 is out. creepy.
many people hate Netscape what with the AOL stuff the ads etc etc. But just about everyday here at work I convert someone to Mozilla and/or show them some way in which it is better than IE. This has gotten to the point where next week I have a meeting with our MIS department to implement Mozilla in addition to IE as a standard. The moral of the story start using it and when people have a problem with IE test using Mozilla many times it will work and people will start to use it and love it. Also the whole blocking popup thing is a good way to sell people on it. :)
Cypherpunks: Civil Liberty Through Complex Mathematics. Those who live by the sword die by the arrow.
Aside from the tabbed browsing, new to Netscape, it doesn't seem like 7.0 is that great an upgrade. Here's a CNET review on the new version...as much as I generally distrust CNet's reviews of software, they're pretty much on the money with this one, it seems.
"I may be quite wrong." - Socrates
These seem like the thinnest of thin cosmetic crud type changes. This is really pathetic. Woowee now that I have no need to use the browser to launch AOLIM they integrate it, ooooh themes and skins, wow zipee !!!
Long live Mozilla.
---
IMHO, of course.
May the SOURCE be with you.
With their dwindling market share, it'll be interesting to see what affect this has on internet users.
In no way should anyone from VA being talking about marketshare!!
I prefer impact because it's spelled the same way for the noun and verb, unlike affect and effect. It's affected to complain too much about impact.
Either it's not happening (the comments I've seen so far might explain why), or NS is withstanding it quite well.
I was shocked how fast I downloaded all 28 megs (NS, RealPlayer, Java 2, Flash, etc.) for a full install, even over my company's typically laggy connection.
Yes, I use NS7. It's more polished than Moz overall. I've been using the PR all summer (Why didn't they go through multiple PRs??? There was PR1 and that was it...) Yes, Moz might have some neat features, but overall I've had too many negative experiences with it. (Like refusing to access SSL pages - "Please download the PSM" - I DOWNLOADED AND INSTALLED IT, DELETED AND REINSTALLED IT AGAIN - WORK GODDAMNIT!)
Interesting how Netscape Radio compares to (say) Musicmatch's radio offering. Haven't checked to see if it runs under Linux yet (2 hours 'till I get home), but it's gonna hurt MM if it can compare, considering that it appears to be free.
retrorocket.o not found, launch anyway?
Niggers are so dumb they think they are "Sticking it to the man" when they convert to a religion founded by a slave owner (islam). Haha, dumb ass wogs, the arabs where the first people to raid africa for slaves. Man, niggers are so dumb. Fucking beasts.
I think Mozilla 1.1 Beta has crashed maybe 3 times for me. 1.0 crashed fewer than that. I restarted the browser and I was back in business.
IE6 brought my home 2000 Server machine to its knees last night and the one at work down this afternoon. At home it took 10 minutes to log me out so I could log in and start over, at work I had to hard reset as it wouldn't even log out properly. And it's far from the first time for either of those boxes it's happened.
I wonder if the Linux version of NutScrape-7.0 has those ads too? They wouldn't be that stupid to include AOL ads for the Linux users. Would they?
I'll stick with Mozilla & Konquer.. thank you very much.
The funny thing is that 4.79 is listed at 11/7/2001, while this is actually brand new: 8/15/2002.
dunno why they're supporting this old ver, but whatever..
As a way of encouraging users to switch to Netscape, AOL announced that it would continue to rely on Internet Explorer as the lockin browser of choice for AOL subscribers.
I'm really amazed to see the popularity of Netscape, especially version 4.* and especially for the "newbie internet users". The fact is, ISP often offer a free CD containing MS IE5 and NN4.7. Right.
...
...
I was a NN user two years ago, when I had no alternative. Today, let's face it : NN4.* is crap. I mean IE is not the best browser for specs compliance, and crashes quite often. But NN4.* doesn't even support CSS1, which is really a shame if we plan to use HTML4.01 Strict. Opera is quite a good, rapid, nice browser, but since the free version has a banner and since it's not on the ISP CDs, it will never make it amongst beginners.
[ right, you'll have noticed that I only speak about windows, since any normal linux user will use a recent Mozilla (or galeon & co) or Konqueror. I'm talking about people who don't even know what a setup.exe is. ]
So the problem is : I've never seen any ISP shipping its CD with a NN >4 browser. Since NN6 is such a sloooow program, it's not much of a surprise, I agree. We'll see what NN7 will change in this business.
However, the fact is : many internet users are beginners, and many beginners use the browser they were given in the first place (IE5 or NN, maybe they prefer NN because of its mail client which is less effective in virus auto-install). What's wrong with that ?
NN4 *is* deprecated. I mean it doesn't support recent standards. So if you are a webmaster, and that you or your customers want the majority of the people to be able to view your website, you have no choice but make your HTML code NN4 compliant. And to some extent, recent-standards-non-compliant.
I wouldn't be whinning about that here if my customer didn't make me recode his website to make it NN4 compliant (wow, great creepy code with tables, frames, and all).
A solution would be for the ISP to *stop* distributing this old NN version with their CDs. Mozilla is mature enough to replace it, isn't it ? Or even a recent NN version
Let's hope ISP will wake up, eventually, and update their CDs so that we'll finally be able to use the new possibilities the W3C has been working on for two years
theefer
My sig says it all. I'm still waiting, too. :)
siri
I have to wonder how they get these stats. I mean, it would lend to common sense that they are using the user agent string on server statistics. The problem is, how many people have to spoof their user agent as MSIE in order to get sites to send them the right (unbroken) html? I know I do.
Netscape 7.0 will not allow me to open Netscape Web Mail - it just carries me to a blank page. To open Netscape Web Mail I have to use Internet Explorer.
for a while, and it seems pretty stable. I'm gonna go get the final version.
- Bill
I jsut upgraded from 6.2.1 to 7 and it seems to function perfectly, despite me meeting only one of the minimum system requirements. I've got a Pentium 200MHz, Win95b and 128MB RAM. 1 out of 3. 7 actually seems to start faster than 6 and functions exactly as expected. You guys can slam Netscape all you want, but with an install this friendly, I think you ought to rethink your enemies.
Anything you say will be held against you.
I downloaded it today (before this was posted) and ran it. Mozilla 1.1 that is. It wasn't slow, but it was ugly and didn't seem to want to render pages with any type of regularity.
So I tossed it off and went back to Opera. No fuss, no muss, no big issues. Opera just works. And when I get my home system back up and running, Linux will be running Opera as well.
I've used Mozilla off and on since M12 or something like that, and never liked how it felt or handled. Netscape 4.x was ok for me, but not Mozilla. But that's just one opinion on the land of trolls and thoughtful posters.
They stuck me in an institution, said it was the only solution, to...protect me from the enemy, myself
Netscape Still gives a person the choice to have a browser that comes with a mail client that supports imap. Thats one reason we use it where I work as a sysadmin. Its easy to create and manage profiles for all our users in a matter of seconds, and has great support for using ldap for an address book.
Netscape on solaris is supported by SUN. The latest version available on Solaris is 6.2.3 u can get it from
Netscape On Solaris
Also solaris mozilla binaries take about 4-5 weeks before they are available on mozilla.org. And building it from source is pain in the A$$.
for the last time people, I am "frodo from middle eaRTH", not "middle eaST".
Far too AOL for me and after getting busted with the smart download tracking I just don't trust them.
Saying Java is nice because it works on all OS's is like saying that anal sex is nice because it works on all genders.
I used to used netscape before mozilla launched big time, then I came across Opera. Opera 6 IMHO is faster to load, faster to get pages, and better at FTP (when required). It has excellent Pop-up suppression, a built in google/amazon/ebay/and far more! I'm a stuck user on Opera, and IE when those bastards called webmasters use IE friendly code. I think I'll stick with Opera and prey for Opera 7 being super fast...oh wait on my machine it loads nealry as fast as IE and 3 times faster than Mozilla.
So it can be manually enabled in Netscape... is the same possible in IE? There's no indication that Microsoft is planning on introducing such a feature, so I thought I'd ask.
The coolest voice ever.
That's the difference between the browser Mozilla and the company Netscape? How do you compare a browser to a company?
The Internet suite distributed by Netscape Communications, a unit of AOL(tw), is called "Netscape". Version 4.x was called "Communicator". It began to be officially known as "Netscape" starting with version 6.
Ooooh! You meant the difference between Mozilla and Navigator, right?
From Mozilla 1.1, I pull down the Window menu, and I see the word "Navigator". I guess both Netscape and Mozilla use the term "Navigator" to refer to the web browser component.
Will I retire or break 10K?
It appears they've removed roaming access from Netscape. This allowed for remote storage of bookmarks on a properly configured server (via http) so that you always had the same bookmarks regardless of what machine you were running on. Maybe they dropped it because the implementation they were using was bad, but for me it was a nearly invaluable service. Anyone know if some sort of similar service is in store for future versions of netscape or mozilla?
A squid eating dough in a polyethylene bag is fast and bulbous, got me?
If you must do it, the least you could do is email the site and let them know they are losing potential customers. At least then there is a chance that they will fix the markup and so next mozilla user to come along won't have to change their UA string.
So I grabbed the latest Mozilla today, and then on a whim headed to netscape and grabbed 7.0. This was about four hours before the /. article on 7.0. I had no idea it was that new.
At any rate, it is certainly an improvement over 6.0 -- so for all us semi-geeks that don't run mozilla but still root for it, this is our chance at tabbed browsing (lovely), improved download management (quite nice indeed), and those silly little icons for each website (silly).
It's a good thing. Don't bash it. Celebrate it.
Support a few technologists in Washington.
So it is important that Netscape survives.
My dad doesnt speak a word of english so hes forced to use netscape 4.x. I know there are some languages: German, French, Spanish etc. But when will Netscape release nordic versions (swedish, danish etc.)?
These countries might not be that big in size, but they are all strong IT nations.
For one, there is a plethora of application that requrie an application certification before you can use them in a "supported" environment. An infamous application coming to mind is Oracle Applications 11i.
Mozilla isn't going to do the dirty work, so like every other version of netscape, they have a better chance of competing with Microsoft, especially with Oracle's anti MS beliefs to begin with.
Netscape "dummies" up the process so end users can plug and play, alot better then mozilla does, and netscape offers more bells and whistles that a normal windows user probably will use and enjoy.
I personally liked the fact that they're serving up the release quickly, (took all but 10 seconds to install over ds3) have been great on following up with fixes, and face it, without netscape there wouldn't have been a mozilla!
I had turned popups on (a blog comment page required them) and forgotten about it. Visiting Netscape's page pops up a BIG HUGE ad for Netscape 7.
mozilla is not intended for end-users, only for developers
However when you actually do the download, check out the new License (not on the download page, the one in the file). It expressly forbids linking with GPL software. Yikes, what happened over there?
Netscape 7 includes proprietary components such as Netscape Instant Messenger and possibly some sort of Sun Java(tm) runtime environment. It is based on the Mozilla source code, which is MPL/GPL/Lesser GPL licensed; Netscape Communications simply chose the MPL option.
Will I retire or break 10K?
I officially asked MS about this as part of a review I wrote recently for a major magazine and the answer was a simple "no, we won't be doing that." There are literally dozens of third party blockers though. Go to download.com and search for 'popup'
"Impact [is] spelled the same way for the noun and verb, unlike affect and effect."
I've heard this before, yet it's wrong. Affect can be a noun or a verb, or a transitive verb. Effect can be a noun or a transitive verb. I have a feeling that the noun vs. verb mentality is most prevalent amongst speakers of American English, although I have no evidence to back it up, especially considering my links are to an American English dictionary.
The article says that the statistics are generated using HitBox technology, which is cookie-based. If you are blocking cookies, then perhaps you do not appear on the register. Since the mozilla cookie-blocking feature began about the same time as the fall of market share from > 10% to 3.4%, perhaps this can be explained by people using mozilla's blocking features.
Opinions change daily as new information arrives. Stay tuned.
Quite a few languages are supported, though maybe not in the very latest version. Here's mozilla's language page
It doesn't have any of the above and has the popup blocker UI. I consider both of those things pluses. I haven't downloaded 7, so I don't know if those frills are optional, but I won't use any of them.
Science may someday discover what faith has always known.
So I'm surfing on over to Netscape's browser page to have a look at the new monster when...OH MY LORD!!!! Jumping out from behind my desk I run to the wall and yank my network cable from the wall jack.
It seems as though Netscape has been spying on me while I surf the internet, how else could they produce a browser for the way I use the web? I must say that I feel torn by the obvious intrusion into my personal space and the fact that Netscap 7.0 must now be a Lynx clone. It sure would be nice to run a text only browser with a Netscape interface.
Maybe when I get brave enough to go back on the web I'll give it a try...
Signatures are for Nerds!
Just downloaded and installed NS7....outside of the nice eye-candy, I'm not to entirely impressed yet. There certainly isn't anything to change me over from Moz 1.0, and if anything, there is too much pushing for their "Netscape Network". Add that to removing the ability to prevent pop-ups, and you have a Microsoft-esque attempt at grabbing market share. Stick with Moz or Galeon.
"When I die, I want to go like my grandfather did, quietly and in his sleep. Not like the screaming passengers in the back of the car."
Microsoft announces the release of Internet Explorer 7.0...
Microsoft relases cumulative patch for Internet Explorer 7.0 hours later...
The reason we don't have a browser war anymore, is because people LIKE buggy software...
not to mention the fact that Netscape 7.0 is already behind Mozilla 1.1... Way to keep up with the software guys!
If you're looking here for something insightful or thought provoking, you're probably looking in the wrong place.
It does, uh, slightly.
Actually, it supports JSSS - JavaScript Style Sheets, which was Netscape's stylesheet language proposal. Unfortunately for them (and, rather fortunately for us) it got rejected, partly because nobody else would implement it.
So when CSS was accepted, they had to quickly hack together a way to get it into the browser, but since a complete rewrite of the stylesheet engine was out of the question, they were forced instead to write a CSS -> JSSS translator. Much of the problems with NS4's CSS support is that it isn't a 1:1 mapping with JSSS.
Death to NS4!
$5 / month hosted VPS on linux = awesome!
Maybe we need a website with a database devoted entirely to giving websites like CapitalOne a hard time for being IE only.
Does such a website exist? Maybe if we got together we could email these people and thier bosses to get them to support Netscape.
Does such a website exist?
"Communism is like having one [local] phone company " - Lenny Bruce
Given the raft of security bugs surrounding IE and forged certs, isn't it kind of dangerous to do your banking on IE? Wouldn't Mozilla or Konqueror be a safer choice?
That way at least the site registers one time that a mozilla user was there. But I find that 99.9 % of sites work just fine with moz.
You are extremly bald.
Are you bald today?
Do you live in Baldsville?
Excuse me, your baldness is showing.
Though art bald today.
Everyone talking about Mozilla v Netscape.
Try a *stable*, fast, standards compliant browser like Opera.
The reason Netscape has poor market penetration, quite simply is because it sucks. It's bloated slow compared to IE, pure and simple.
I think it gets way too much marketing hype, people should not be led to believe that Netscape is the best alternative.
BTW, don't complain about Opera not being free, if you don't want to pay or look at the banner ad, then use this serial number:
Name: JUSTiC Company: JST Corp s/n: w-v5cma-MUfav-jFhLV-SaiAK-LiJzn
Netscape 7 is out.
Internet explorer is in..
thank God the internet isn't a human right.
i could not find anything that ns7 had that mozilla 1 doesn't (except for bundled "AOL Free & Unlimited" and RealAudio icons everywhere after install). in fact, there's no straight-forward way to disable popup ads (I've noticed netscape.com has several), whereas in mozilla you can. the whole download -> install -> try -> uninstall cycle took about 20 minutes.
EarthLink just released a new pop-up blocker that works with Internet Explorer 5.01 Service Pack 2 to 6.0 for EarthLink and Mindspring users.
:-)
I'm using it right now and it's an excellent program. The best part about EarthLink's blocker is that you can set it to preview the blocked pop-up, open the pop-up on the second click (which is useful for pop-ups that are necessary like forms that need to be filled out), and even select certain web pages where pop-ups are needed. Best part of this pop-up: it's free.
See this is just wrong. Who the hell cares if it was valid HTML or not? It should just work! We run into this all the time with our TIFF and PS printing software. 90% of all TIFF an PS files in existance violate the Tiff and PS specs in some way. And guess what? WE HAVE TO STILL PRINT IT CORRECTLY!!!! If we wrote to the TIFF and PS specs and FU to all our customers that complain about us not printing what they saw on the screen in InDesign or what ever app they were printing from, we'd be completely out of buisness by now.
Until Mozilla/Netscape can properly render "broken" IE formatted webpages, it has NO HOPE of taking over market share. I personally won't use it for that specific reason. And I bet that most people using a web browser are a lot more interested in whether it works, rather than some lofty moral superiority it exudes.
Get off your high horses and do what the rest of us have to do. Make software that works dammit! Be pragmatic for once. Geez.
Contrary to popular belief, coding is not all free blow-jobs and beer. Those things cost MONEY!
Affect is a verb. Effect is a noun.
Somebody needs to go back and get their GED. Or did they "loose" it?
...os/2 version 8.0 will be shipping soon. ...wordstar 2003 was recently released. ...Netware has recently updated its enterprise class firewall. ...Vivo has revved their technology.
Yawn.
Cheers
-b
(Hey, man, I hit the karma cap. I got a license to troll, don'tcha know?)
How am I going to click the mailto if I can't get into their site?
Now I've never tried Netscape 7.0, but according to CNet's review of the browser its about even with IE 6 and worse than Mozilla 1.1 I do use Mozilla 1.1 and I love it. People complain that it doesn't display pages correctly, but I've had no problems with it. The pop-up blocker is great and tabs are sweet. It feels just as fast, if not faster, than IE. So I can't see why to not use it.
SIGFAULT
big time! I think Netscape was the first dot-bomb... they lost the browser market to MS, and the server market to Apache... so much for being a WWW pioneer... An excellent example of how employing whiz kids by itself does not make a company invincible...:)
Netscape browsers, historically, have been nothing but an annoyance. High CPU/Memory utilization, memory leaks, lack of support of their OWN HTML extensions, slow speed, out-of-box problems with standard plug-ins etc., are few of the problems that I had run into, for every time I attempted to use any given NS version... NS browsers since the 4.x release have been just awful! Both on Win and Ux platforms!
Luckily, the Mozilla folx got their act together and put the has-been-but-missed-out-big-time Netscape browsers out of its misery!
Mozilla is now my DEFAULT browser on all the platforms...
SIG ALERT
slashers are moaning the AOL broswer thing. Trust me you will be impressed with the verison that is coming out. completely rewritten from the ground up. Both ip tunneling and the desktop imaging issues are gone
How does one disable slashdot ads? Oh, and will this be moderated -1, Exposing hypocrisy?
here's what the bbc story says about netscape 7: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/2223794.stm
Take a look at the Mozilla Calendar.
I specifically do not want features like messaging in my browser!
It's a pity no web browser has intelligent pop-up control built in. You can get the same three from the aftermarket, but it works best when the policy is part of the browser. I'd particularly like something that lets you configure your policy on the fly -- like Konqueror does with cookies, only for popups.
Effect is a noun.
Not necessarily; you can effect a change, for example. Used in that sense, "effect a change" means cause the change to occur.
It could be just a function of the computers I'm using now vs. those I was using then:
:) It's based on RealPlayer, but despite Real for Linux it doesn't appear to be supported unter Linux, although I have yet to try it.
NS7 seems a LOT faster than NS6.
Mozilla still seems a bit on the slow side for me...
I tried firing up the Radio app - Looks nice. Too bad I'm at work and couldn't crank it up.
The only problem I've seen with it are one or two minor JS issues so far (The "equipment credit" plan description pages on dishnetwork.com don't seem to work right in NS7.)
retrorocket.o not found, launch anyway?
Actually, anyone using this information to show that everyone uses IE on the internet, or who thinks IE is all anyone uses, needs their head examined.
Considering the number of surfers that run OSes that don't even support IE, I don't see how these statistics can be right:
Microsoft 95.97 %
Netscape 3.39 %
Other 0.64 %
Perhaps if they actually broke down Other into Mozilla, Konqueror, Opera etc. and explained how they tell IE from them I could have a little more faith...
For my two cents, keep using Mozilla and Konqeror as much as you can, and keep pushing your friends to use them. Don't do anything that might make things more difficult and tempt you to switch back to IE, and do no more "advocation" then you are comfortable with. (But do all you *are* comfortable with!)
... they released version 4.8 (of the browser that won't die, no matter how many Web Developers are begging and pleading for it to)!
http://www.zeldman.com/daily/0802c.html ~3/4s of the way down the page.
I really don't know why more people don't use this program. I've been using it for about a month, and its PERFECT, no popups get through. Look, I'm going to make it easy for all of you to get it by posting links:
The download page
The actual file
Now for those of you who don't want to use it, here is a little FAQ:
How much RAM does it take?
Looks like about 4.5 MB
How much does it cost?
Well, you can pay the company $24.99, or you can just use this product key: MP739343291188802719 and use the program for free.
Does it work?
Yes, I have not had a single popup get through since I installed it.
So now you see that you don't have to use a certain browser like Mozilla, you can use Netscape or IE if you want and you will never have to worry about popups again. Whenever I see slashdot articles about popups I think its kind of funny because to me popups don't exist.
In case this post looks suspicious, no I don't work for the company or anything, I just really like this program and want to share it with the slashdot community.
hey, i just installed this and even on porn sites the popups didn't get though, this will change my life (or at least the porn surfing part of it).
To use client-side XML you need a way to specify the fine details of your documents -- how much space between paragraphs, how big is your text, that sort of thing. XSL isn't up to that yet, so that leaves you with CSS. And CSS is quite nice -- easy to work with, powerful enough for most web documents -- and most documents in general. But.
Both Mozilla/Netscape and IE implement CSS -- badly. Mozilla makes some stupid mistakes with layout, while IE's CSS support is incomplete and buggy. Wouldn't be that hard to fix, but they've both been working on it for five years now!
If there's a standard that web designers should be pushing for it's CSS.
I love alternatives to IE! I use Omniweb myself. Why? It's fast!! Netscape has always been so dog slow it's intolerable. If 7 is in any way speedy, I'll check it out.
"What the American public doesn't know is what makes them the American public." -Ray Zalinsky (Tommy Boy)
As sorry as it is we need a monopoly to beat a monopoly.
This is one of the stupidest comments I've ever heard. What the hell are you talking about? AOL does not have a monopoly on ISPs at all, I don't know what their market share is but I really don't think its even 50%. You are a fucking moron.
Or did they "loose" it?
You should not jest about such matters.
Proudly correcting Slashdot's most irritating linguistic error since 2002.
The moderation was NOT "Offtopic." The moderation was "Flamebait." Typical characterization for a white, self-hating liberal. If you hate your heritage, then knock yourself out, but stop lashing out at those of us who are proud of who we are and what we've accomplished.
Net-whah?
I kiss you!
For my sanity, usefulness, and the pleasure of all, please kindly do the following:
Blog,Twitter
AOL is where good software goes to DIE...
Cases in point: ICQ, WinAmp, Netscape Navigator. Use IE and/or Mozilla and forget Netscape.
Surprise! Most desktop power users who are already on a niche desktop OS prefer Mozilla over Netscape.
You know I just don't think its fair how much shit AOL/netscape get for contributing to the Mozilla project. You do remember who started this whole ball rolling? You do also realize who has paid people to work on this?
Oh so big deal they add a few aol icons to your desktop that you can instantly delete.
You know Moz may end up being the default browser for linux desktop OS's, but you got another thing coming if you think that the few remaining corporations or "grandma's" out there that use Netscape are going to migrate to Mozilla over Netscape. Do you think ISP's are going to start bundling Moz over Netscape? Really think about the fact that Mozilla is about technology, while Netscape is about a supported end user project. That is the goal of the Mozilla project, to put out great technology, not to replace Netscape.
Personally I think the Netscape 7 "package" finally represents a realthreat to MS. With the new DOJ rules, Netscape/AOL can finally have a real chance at getting some OEM's to not use IE, Outlook, and messenger and WMP. They can just drop in their own products and the end user won't miss a step, since it will be preloaded.
So you all you naysayers, I say your picking the wrong fight.
If you wanna get rich, you know that payback is a bitch
Netscape 7 for Linux is delivered with "Shockwave Flash 5.0 r48" which is known to have a security flaw which could allow attackers to run malicious code.
In an effort to "do my part", I managed to persuade about a dozen people to install and use Mozilla here at work. Half them instantly declared themselves too lazy to learn a new browser. IE is good enough, they say. The other half doezen loved what I showed them, and installed and used it for about a week. Unfortunately, they went back to IE one by one. Why? There were always one or two sites they visit regularly that didn't work quite right in Mozilla. Of course, in all cases it is the website's fault, but that doesn't change things. For most people, IE is still the path of least resistance. Quality doesnt mean much to them.
Since windows ships with IE, people are going to use IE and people are going to develop for IE. As long as IE is built into Windows, it will be the dominant browser. The fact that IE is so standards non-compliant is no mistake... its keeping the competition in a corner. Some of us don't mind lurking in that corner, but the vast majority won't even find it.
Personally, I can say I am finally attached to Mozilla 1.1 (largely because of OptiMoz). I was a big skeptic of Mozilla until 1.0, but now Mozilla is my browser. Still, there are a few sites out there that I must visit which I have to downshift to IE for.
There has been spell checker for Mozilla for some time now. You can download the mozilla spell checker from mozdev.org.
The site claims that the spellchecker should land in the mozilla tree probably right after 1.0. I guess it's late... but you can still download it yourself.
"I'm The Bounty Bear. I will find him anywhere. I'm searching."
It seems Radio@Netscape depends on popups to work.
This is all stupid. who gives a rats ass? STFU and post something worthwhile.
I would be very interested to know what slashdot's browser percentages are.
My guess it goes something like...
64% IE (silent majority)
20% Mozilla (loud minority)
10% Opera (for people who like to browse really fast)
5% Konquerer (hey, it came with my distro)
3% Lynx (for people who just can't get enough command lines)
(yeah, it adds up to 102%. The editors can't spell, either)
OS X 10.2 users can expect to see a blank menu bar and no windows opening up, no controls to click, and no menus to select. What a QA travesty! This problem has happened on 3 different machines running Jaguar, so it's clearly a Netscape hairball.
Even MSIE runs when you click on it. Maybe that's how they gained all that market share!
Shut up and eat your vegetables!!!
When I try to install it and when the installer starts to unpack the fiels I get this ./netscape-installer-bin: error while loading shared libraries: /tmp/xpiJaVtv2/bin/libxpistub.so: undefined symbol: NS_NewNativeLocalFile
I think I'll stick with mozilla
There is an awesome program called Proxomitron thats basically a local proxy. It will block popups, javascripts, ads, cookies, and anything else you might want (it has about 5 billion options and you can add your own block lists). Since its a proxy which modifies html code that gets sent to your browser, it works for every browser, but its Windows only. I would probably kill myself if I had to web surf without it again ;/
You can get get the Linux spellchecker.xpi and the Windows spellchk.xpi from the Netscape FTP site along with some other options that aren't included with Mozilla. Yea, I know that there is a spellchecker project for Mozilla but it's not really ready yet - and my wife is really complaining about it.
Anyone stupid enough to choose Netscape over Mozilla deserves exactly what they get. Honestly, the meaning people attach to silly names is just amazing to me.
They're the same damned thing, with bullshit ads tacked on(oh, i'm sorry. "convenient links"), and things AOL doesn't like taken away. What's the freaking point? Just so you can feel safe because it says "Netscape" on the icon?
And don't give me the whole "It's more stable" thing. I use Mozilla every day and it never crashes.
There's also a round throbber with a cool animation
I wasn't going to change from Mozilla to Netscape but - now you tell me there's a new throbber?
GOTTA GET IT!!
Exactly what I have been waiting for... one of these idiotic racist flametrolls to post an IP, trying to get people to go to it. Anyways, FYI, /.'ers, here's a rundown on this racist:
His host is Oarnet. Contact Greg Steele (1-800-627-6420 or webmaster@oar.net) and let him know just what his customer is serving on their lines. Oar's TOS does not allow for hosting of these types of sites.
That particular computer's security setup is much like it's owners... moronic. Here's a list of open ports found, along with service names if available.
21 HPServ FTP server V1.7.212.5
22 SSH 1.99 OpenSSH via Perl
23
53
79
80
143 IMAP
1027 POP3 (resist.com SENDMAIL)
To go further... this machine does not have NetBIOS enabled. SMB status comes back as positive (enabled, broadcasting). The machine, when rdns traced, comes back as resist.com. The machines local name is localhost, which can lead you to savely believe that it is a Win* box.
Why am I giving it to you? Information is free, isn't it...
SELECT * FROM users WHERE clue > 0
0 rows returned
It's not about sharing profiles. That line in prefs.js is what you would set for Netscape 7.0 if you wanted to disable popups. So even if you did not install Mozilla, you could not disable popups that way unless you sacrificed Radio@Netscape.
but that's neither here nor there...
'nuff said. eh? :)
These are my friends, See how they glisten. See this one shine, how he smiles in the light.
This could be one reason to use NS7 over Mozilla 1.1.
This has been a show-stopper for many people I have shown Mozilla to; tell them that to all intents and purposes there's no spell-checker, and they say "You're kidding! See you later".
Sure, there's a plugin called MozillaSpell or something, but it's buggy as heck and crashes more often than Starbug.
"Nine times out of ten, starting a fire is not the best way to solve the problem." - my wife
Wondering if they've fixed the extremely annoying habit of Netscape reloading a page from the server every time you resize the window or print it out.
This is my chief complaint against Netscape.
Reloading from the server doesn't do good things when you've filled out some web forms and want to print the page out before you hit "submit."
Why can't the behavior be like IE's where it just re-renders the page from memory cache?
Also, it would be nice if page rendering while printing would be such that the right-hand edge of the page doesn't get cut off (override the page's hard-coded width, for goodness' sake!).
Give me my freedom, and I'll take care of my own security, thank you.
It's true that affect and effect have noun and verb forms each. However, it's also true that 90% of the time, effect is a noun while affect is a verb.
Common usage inclues:
What will be the effects of this action?
What things will this action affect?
Because they are used in a related context so frequently, it does not surprise me that people have trouble with them, hence the simple rule of thumb: effect == noun, affect == verb.
In truth of course, you can 'effect' to bring into being, and something may have an 'affect', meaning an assumed aspect, perhaps even a pretentious one. In practice, these words are uncommon enough (though not rare) that many people are completely unaware of them.
And probably yes, especially Americans. Our poor schools :-(
-josh
but at least try it. Netscape 7 is DAMN FAST!
"Jesus saves, but everyone else in a 10 foot radius takes full damage from the fireball."
AOL surely knows that if it comes down to a fistfight between web designers who Do It Wrong and AOL, AOL will win. There are more AOL users than there are CapitalOne customers. Would AOL get lots of calls? Yes. But CapitalOne would lose customers.
If AOL went with Netscape, broken websites would have to stop crippling non-IE browsers or start losing major traffic.
It's rare that you're presented with a knob whose only two positions are Make History and Flee Your Glorious Destiny.
My translation, but otherwise correct:
Q: The menus at the top of the screen aren't working when I click on them using Opera.
A: Your browser needs to identify itself as MSIE. (Instructions on how to do that).
Result: I must ID as MSIE to use my online bank, so in order to keep things simple it does so *all the time*. Their support doesn't see this as a problem, and don't bother to fix it. And no, I won't change because they're a very good bank otherwise.
Oh, and in case you're wondering, it's www.skandiabanken.no
Kjella
Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
I thought I might have been trolled or flamebated!!
Anyhows, I'm using mozilla.
... no, I'm serious.
I use Mozilla myself and wouldn't touch hotmail with a 10 foot pole on my own account. But I have to leave an IE icon on my desktop for my friends to use hotmail. Hotmail gets more hits from my computer than all other IE-only sites combined, and I wouldn't be surprised if that's normal.
So, can anyone answer the question? If the answer is "yes", I'm switching in a heartbeat.
Preferential Voting: easy as 1-2-3
Netscape 7.0 will not allow me to open Netscape Web Mail - it just carries me to a blank page. To open Netscape Web Mail I have to use Internet Explorer
Warning:Badly quoted Simpsons lines ahead
Bart Simpson: The ironing is delicious
Lisa: Thats Irony!
Bart: Is it??
Burma?
Get off your high horses and do what the rest of us have to do. Make software that works dammit! Be pragmatic for once. Geez.
Translation: I'm a Windows programmer. Don't try to confuse me with standards or good software practices, and don't pee in my rice bowl.
What a fool believes, he sees, no wise man has the power to reason away.
I download the OS X version, but I can't get past the registration window. I can't enter my screenname, clicking in the field is not recognised, I have to force quit the app.
I guess it is not compatible with Jaguar.
-- "maybe happiness is a fragment of existence, but with better packaging"
Go to xulplanet.com and grab the preferences toolbar. Works with Netscape. I find it indespensible, even on Mozilla.
I mean, Microsoft has a jumping apeshit monkeyman CEO hawking their wares, what does Netscape have?
Heh, I can't help but laugh at all the people saying "I can't believe how well Netscape's site is taking the slashdot effect.
Are you people nuts? Don't you realize that the reason Netscape hasn't been slashdotted is because NO ONE FROM SLASHDOT CARES
Nope, nobody... Not even a Beowolf Cluster of machines running Netscape turns anyone on around here.
Netscape 6 was kicking a dead horse. 7 is grinding its testicles up and putting it in soup Enterprise style.
/^[A-Z0-9._%+-]+@[A-Z0-9.-]+\.[A-Z]{2,4}$/i
What a fool believes, he sees, no wise man has the power to reason away.
I've been spending hours and hours to write patches for Mozilla as an individual contributor and my default browser is Mozilla, but I got disgusted when I saw all the unfair comments about Netscape. For those who are criticizing Netscape, are you so blind or narrow-minded that you don't realize that the commonly beloved Mozilla 1.1 would have never reached its current state without the AOL/Netscape cash? The majority of the strongest Mozilla hackers are paid by Netscape and even if many of them have come from the open source community, Netscape gave them the opportunity of being paid for working full time on it. And what about the dozens of computers (tinderbox.mozilla.org) that are running 24 hours a day to detect perf/build regression? And who gives the money to run the ftp servers? the news server? the bug database? I agree that one can criticize the way AOL/Netscape want to get their money back. Turning off the popup blocker may not be a good idea. But it's definitely non sensical to say that Mozilla is better than Netscape: Netscape uses Mozilla as a development build. Please, don't forget to be grateful to Netscape for pushing the standards and giving us the possibility to hack a browser to fit to some extent *our* needs that are clearly different from Netscape ones. May the trolls keep their feet on the real ground.
the same cnet?>
Not EVERYONE has a PC!
Well then, have you been a good little (whatever)? Santa Claus will put your name down in his book to get a PC for Christmas! HoHoHo!
'Twas the night before Christmas, when all through the house not a creature was stirring, not even a mouse. (No PC) The stockings were hung by the chimney with care, in hopes that St. Nicholas would put software in there.
I have no idea what you just said, but it sounds interesting.
Thanks to Microsoft, your average end-user has gotten over the petty desire for that elusive concept of "stability".
People will pass up steak once a week, for crap every day.
Look for these lines in the prefs.js file in your profile directory, and make sure that they have the values indicated below. If the lines don't exist, just copy and paste the lines below into your prefs.js file.
user_pref("capability.policy.default.Window.open", "noAccess");
user_pref("dom.disable_open_during_load", true);
For lots of details about prefs, go here.
The functionality is probably in the code; there's just no way to access it from the GUI menu-based preferences.
Look for these lines in the prefs.js file in your profile directory, and make sure that they have the values indicated below. If the lines don't exist, just copy and paste the lines below into your prefs.js file.
user_pref("capability.policy.default.Window.open", "noAccess");
user_pref("dom.disable_open_during_load", true);
For lots of details about prefs, go here.
Wow, this was an excelente week with mayor releases /. aproved news post!! /. :-)
like Mozilla 1.1 and Netscape 7.0
Hey, and also my first
Woohoo, thanks
P.D.: this is what happend when you stay all night
up refreshing ftp.netscape.com every 10 minutes.
Get my e-mail after a captcha test in: http://tinymailt
You can't help wonder what the hell the point of Netscape releasing a new browser is any more ?
Nobody gets excited, nobody really cares that much either, because we all know it's simply marketing talking and not innovation.
Mozilla is the true competitor to iexplore !
A slashdotting - you get the stick first and then the carrot !
Saw a review at www.e-review.tk...thought it was worth a mention
I have a large school district about to switch over to Mozilla. They, like many educational institutions, refuse to use IE, instead sticking with Netscape 4.7x (NN6 was unusable).
I had a tech person install Mozilla over Netscape 4.79, and she was instantly impressed.
It's a very cool movie... love your sig...
...who the hell cares?
Oh so are you advocating vigilantism against someone for excersizing their right to free speech? That is fascism my friend. You are worse than any racist.
A customer of ours still uses NS4.7. Apart from the hassle of switching 30k users to something else, they've got another problem: An outdated proxy that can't handle HTTP1.1. They evaluated Mozilla 1.0 and found that this couldn't handle HTTP1.0 proxies. This one stuck. I can't convince them to try a more recent release(that works with the outdated proxy) and I can't sneak in NS7.0 since it is based on an old release. This means we're stuck with NS4.7. Thank god I'm working on the backend as our designers have to cope with this dinosaur. Built-in JRE for Applets is 1.1.5. Blech. CU Bjoern
20 minutes into the future
The mistake Americans seem most prone to making is using "insure" when they mean "ensure". Why is this so prevalent?
"The invisible and the non-existent look very much alike." -- Delos B. McKown
I believe their numbers are wrong. Not only do I know of several netscape users(which is actually a pretty good test -- most of the time, if I don't know someone with the software, the market share is below 5%), but according to stats reports on several sites I've visited, netscape makes up around 16% of internet users. Perhaps an optimistic number, but not considering that I know so many people who actually use netscape(or a variation, such as mozilla, or galeon, or K-Melelon), it doesn't seem like the nubers given are accurate.
It's been a long time.
Because they set the dragon free, thats why. Sure the company lost its vision at times, and got stomped (somewhat unfairly) as a business entity.
Netscape probably more than any other company popularized web surfing, and was te first to release the power of the browser paradigm for the desktop-- which is why Microsoft acted so ruthlessly to crush them.
So whait if they got bought out by a conglomerate. It might turn out that their action beore capitulation saved the free software field from perceived obsolescence. We get misty for the subsidiary and hope that the new owners will wield the sword the community forged. It would be affirmation of the philosophy again, as goesthe server, so goes the desktop.
So we root for the brand name because it validates the idea, we deal with the commercialism in the name of mass acceptance. We let one of our products compete. That's why we pull for Netscape.
And nowadays, it's a matter of proving a point. Opera and Konqueror non withstanding, I don't think anyone who has used Mozilla 1.0 can deny it is a great browser, and fewer could honestly say it lacks anything that IE has. Most would have to admit Mozilla surpasses it.
So go AOL, make it convenient to use another browser!
Acquiescence leads to obliteration
Also add enquirey/inquirey to the list. Do Americans *ever* use the former?
I personally am anti-american-english. English is only English when it comes from England. Just like football is only football when it's played with the foot.
Anyway, I usually follow the thought that Effect is the outcome, and Affect is the process. I've never used different..
The browser stats mentioned are collected by hitbox.com, and come from webbugs. They're used by sites to determine which browsers to market at (at least, thats what hitbox themselves say you should use them for)
If your site gets 80% IE hits, so you decide not to worry about NS compatibility, your site will not get visited by NS users. So your % IE hits will go up.
Doh. The only way to get fair statistics is from a site used by everybody which doesnt discriminate against browsers. The closest thing I know of to this is Google's zeitgeist.
The browser graph doesnt have figures, but relative proportions are obvious:
IE 6 gets about 8 notches
IE 5, 5.5 get about 5 notches each
NS4.x/other seem to have dropped from 2 notches each a couple of months back to 1 notch each;
IE 4 gets about 1/2.
Dividing by 20.5 to get market share:
IE6 39%
IE5.5 19.5%
IE5.0 19.0%
NS4.x 4.8%
Other 4.8% (includes Moz, galeon, etc)
IE4.x 2.4%
If you look at this statistics comparison you'll see that the guesstimates up there are not in violent disagreement with reality, with the exception that the 'source1' stats (assumed to be hitbox or a hitbox-a-like) are scoring low for NS and 'other' compared to all other sources now including google, whereas upsdell.com itself sees an excess of Mozilla hits. I reckon this all adds up to a classic case of self-selection.
I'm sorry to see it, but netscape has: :P
1. Too much loading time.
2. Too many things I don't need.
3. Too much "designish" thingies that disturbs a clean interface.
4. Did I say too much loading time?
I don't see how you can fault IE for not having a complete P3P implementation, when P3P itself is not complete. You can fault Microsoft for insisting that IE be integrated with everything. A bad idea for a bunch of reasons, not the least of which is that it makes holes like this inevitable.
Unfortunately, Microsoft's superintegration approach is being too-thoroughly imitated by the very projects that are supposed to give us an alternative: Mozilla, KDE, and Gnome.
It is a weird world. And the language continues to shift without regard for the 18th century Latin-derived, stuck-up, weren't-really-true-in-the-first-place rules.\
But seriously, WHO uses "enquirey" regularly?
$you = new YOU;
honk() if $you->love(perl)
I do. The meanings are quite different. Enquirey is more about asking questions; inquirey is more about an investigation. Thus, many enquiries might be made as part of an inquirey. There are situations where the words are inter-changeable, that is, where either meaning is valid.
And I'm not talking about the drugs. Dunno what happened to my spelling today, but I should have been putting "enquiry" and "inquiry". The clue was in your statement when you said "we don't use either". But I carried on anyway. Hopefully the Mozilla spellchecker (spellchecker.mozdev.org) will one day be integrated with TEXTAREAs in browser... until then, I will struggle on ;)
Mozilla 4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; compatible; Mozilla 5.0; Gecko 2002053012; en-US)
The scripts I use to check browsers actually check for the presence of "Gecko" in the user-agent - if they see "Gecko", they register a "Mozilla based browser" if they can't otherwise determine the user-agent. That way browsers like Galeon get registered as being Mozilla derivatives for the purposes of site design.
Likewise, if they see "Mozilla 4.0 (compatible; MSIE 4.0; compatible; Opera 5.0)" they'll register that as a hit for Opera. So just leave Gecko in there, and you can probably fool most scripts into accepting the browser as being IE while still registering to a human or to more intelligent scripts the presence of a Mozilla-based browser.
You are in a maze of twisty little relative jumps, all alike.
It's a shame how this always happens.
The release of Netscape 7.0 is overshadowing the (much more important) release of Netscape 4.8! It's so fresh, there isn't even a page for the release notes.
By the time Netscape 15.2.1.4.1 is released (2 months from now), we may finally be up to Netscape 4.9!
On a serious note, I wish Netscape didn't go the Mozilla route. While I love that their browser is open source, their real browser product (Netscape 4.x) is still widely used, is closed source, and is getting neglected in favor of Mozilla, despite many features Netscape 4 has, that Mozilla hasn't. This is not to mention that Netscape 4 performs so much better than Mozilla, or that the Netscape 4 interface is still better than Mozilla.
Mozilla is more like software produced through staff meetings. It tries to be everything to everyone, so now no one uses it exclusively. Everyone might use it, but always in conjunction with the old Netscape, or some other browser.
Mozilla just didn't work out. I think that with a fraction of the work, features and stability fixes could have been added to Netscape 4 that would have allowed it to take back the desktop.
This is not flame-bait, nor is it a Troll... If it was, I would be posting at +2. So, if you disagree with me, at least reply, and let me know why. Anonymous moderations don't teach anyone, anything.
Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant
use mozilla
Oh yeah, look! Salon Readers!
/.
Hello! *flaps hand*.
How are you gentlemen !
Too bad that you will be reading this because it's at +2!
FUCK cunt SHIT wank BILL GATES felates monkeys in his spare time! Hot grits! Natalie Pr0tman. All your base are belong to graspee! Imagine a beowulf cluster of salon readers! Could they change a lightbulb? Probably not. Goatse goatse goatse.cx!
P.S. Please leave this comment at +2 to introduce Salon readers to the "joy" of
graspee
make the Salon readers suck our collective dong.
Hell, it's the W3C's hammer of doom coming to knock Bill upside the head, for christs sake.
This is my sig. There are many like it but this one is mine.