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First-Person Account Of Video Game Addiction
The Evil Couch writes "Jive Magazine, an entertainment magazine based in Atlanta, has just released a feature article that the editor has spent over a year investigating on gaming addiction. Starting from being on the outside of the gaming community, she has gone from being a somewhat normal person, to being one of the higher level characters in Anarchy Online. 'People have worse entertainment addictions than playing computer games. If I am going to be addicted to something, I would choose online gaming over drugs, bowling, gambling, television, or being a baseball fanatic easily. I don't have to wear ugly shoes, lose my hard earned money or do the wave next to someone I don't know and that just about makes it a no-brainer for me. It IS after all just a video game, like Neal describes in his great novel, Snow Crash. It is just another amusement park.' Sounds like a happy ending to me."
"Sounds like a happy ending to me."
Until all that radiation from your monitor goes to your head. Although, it seems that has already happened.
I once had the Everquest on my back, but I kicked. Believe me, these addictions do screw up real lives...
:wq
In an industry scrutinized by the government as a drug infested haven that pollutes our communities and destroys the ability to lead a productive life, there is another industry that has the potential to become even more dangerous than any drug addiction. I'm not supposed to be writing this. What was supposed to happen was I prove my thesis that I couldn't be sucked into a virtual reality like many people I have met before. I never really understood what I was getting myself into when I started my research experiment, playing a Massive Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game.
Three years ago at a nightclub I bumped into an old friend of mine who went by the nickname "Iggy". I was really amazed to see him because no one had seen nor heard from Iggy in over a year. Many of his friends had all wondered what happened to him.
"Jesus Iggy, where in the hell have you been?!"
"Everquest," was all he said. He looked down at his feet when he said it.
"Huh?" I had no clue what he meant.
"I've been playing Everquest."
As we spoke, Iggy opened up to me and confessed that he had lost his job, his friends and didn't want to go out much anymore.
"It's an addiction. I'm only out tonight because the server is down for patching and I'm miserable."
For some reason, he couldn't look me in the eye while he was talking. He was obviously embarrassed.
"Um. Okay." I mean, what was I going to say to something as incredulous as that? I've heard of game obsessions, like those college kids in the seventies that murdered their whole family while playing a Dungeons and Dragons game, but I just thought that sort of obsession lies only in the minds of sociopaths or people with a lot bigger problems than playing a game. Iggy was a really nice, normal guy who had lost a lot to some online role-playing game called "Everquest". I had no idea what to make of it.
I never saw Iggy again. Neither has anyone else who knew him that I have asked. Since that night I really pondered the absurdity of his situation. It nagged at me.
On the web you can put the words "gaming addiction" into Google and discover a thousand and one sites for support groups, self help courses, testimonials and various studies. There's the "Everquest Widows" forum, a site called "Ariadne - Understanding MMORPG Addiction", and a myriad of articles on topics like game addiction and the innocent bystanders that suffer from it.
As one Everquest Widow puts it, "I plan on starting "Widows Weekly." It will be a group that meets in a local coffee shop. Here, spouses can talk and help one another through this difficult process, and begin to realize that there is a life out there despite the loss of our loved ones. I plan to send the bill for coffee and snacks to Verant. It would be but a small compensation on their part to repay me and others for the loss of our loved ones--so pay up, Verant!" -- Christine Gilbert CD Mag.com
What I find interesting is that many of the people who author these articles or sites have usually neither played the games or have just been the "victims" such as spouses or family. Others who dissect the topic of game addiction tend to be outsiders looking in, shaking their heads or turning the study into one giant mouse in the maze science experiment. It's rare that you find someone, who actually plays games passionately, speak up or write anything about negative side affects.
The more people I met who played computer games, the more I wanted to understand the obsession. I also had another stake in this because my partner, Low, is a gamer and a "geek" in every sense of the word. Not to mention my fiancé. It was beginning to cause some strain on us from time to time in terms of "quality time". I was getting really angry with him on a regular basis actually. According to Low, it was I who had the problem, not him. This is how most gamers think. Deal with their gaming or don't deal with it at all. They will play either way.
So I eventually decided to do some investigation and find out what makes these gamers and role players tick. What sort of recreation has the ability to absorb people to the extent that marriages break up, jobs are lost, and they lose friends? How does playing a game on a computer make someone lose functionality in the REAL world, because they want to spend too much time in some imaginary reality? For crying out loud, I thought, it's just a game.
I had a lot of questions but no one I talked to had answers. Gamers would tell me, "You won't understand unless you are a gamer yourself." Ok, no problem. I figured I could just play a game I find entertaining and get bored and write about what nut cases gamers really are.
It just wasn't that easy. This little experiment of mine turned out to be more dangerous than I ever imagined.
I wasn't able to begin playing a game right away. The opportunity just never really presented itself directly to me. There just wasn't a game I really liked enough to "get into it" for long enough. Low would play his Quake, Unreal Tournament, Black & White, Carmageddon, Fallout, Diablo II and a multitude of other first person shooters, but nothing seemed all that captivating to me and there was no way I could play these games with him due to his extreme level of skill and years of practice in a 3D environment.
I played a little Diablo and actually had a bit of fun with that, but I found I only really enjoyed it when I played with Low or our friends in multi-player mode. We would go "adventuring" together as they call it, fighting demons and wizards and monsters and coming out winning or dying, but having some fun just playing together. It was my first taste of actually playing with another player in a game as a team. But when Low moved onto the next game, bored with Diablo, I didn't have the same drive to play anymore. So I put my project aside and put up with his gaming as best as I could.
Massive Multiplayer Online Role-playing Games (MMORPG) have been around for many years. You can find thousands of websites, magazines, web-zines and the like that are devoted to the enormous market out there for online gaming. Sites like GameSpy, that literally receive millions of visits per day from gamers and industry types from all over the world, provide an almost infinite amount if information about these types of games. Hundreds of thousands of people play games like Everquest, Dark Age of Camelot, Asheron's Call, and Ultima Online each day from all over the world. With the upcoming launch of The Sims Online, analysts and game reviewers are expecting the largest online game community ever seen to develop.
"The Sims promises to be one of the most interesting human experiments in the history of the Net." -- David Kushner, Entertainment Weekly
Low had tried many of these MMORPG's. He never stuck with one very long because, as he puts it, "I got tired of being a crappy tree-elf that always fell out of the damn tree village." In Ultima Online, he "got tired of having all my stuff stolen from me and getting killed by stupid 'PKers' (Player Killers)." Apparently for him, the rewards were far and few between to keep him interested in these games. He also has a very short attention span with most games. Play it, beat it, and move on to the next game is his motto. The more games you play in a single year the more well rounded you are apparently. With the new enhanced graphics engines, hardware and development that goes into games these days, it's amazing how stimulating the market can be right now.
Early in 2001, however, Low's opinion of online gaming changed drastically. He read an article about a new online role-playing game that was set about 30,000 years into the future, on a colonized planet. The story line was science fiction themed, with monsters, mutants, futuristic weapons, wars, and sinister political plots. The player would have the ability to create a character avatar from a wide variety of attributes and be surrounded by very realistic 3D graphics, with incredible scenery and sound. You would have to defend yourself, form guilds, make friends and alliances and your goal would be to "learn" or level your character as the game progressed in order to increase your skills and possessions. There would be PVP (player versus player) combat, PVM combat (player verses mobile or "mob" for short, a term used to explain computer generated enemy or monster) and a variety of other things one could do while in the game online. You could fly a plane, morph into animals and go on dangerous missions and epic quests. The game was called Anarchy Online.
Something about this Anarchy Online game really had his attention and right after it came out in July of 2001, he bought his copy and began playing, and once again I lost him to a game. He could not stop going on and on about how "cool this or that was" or the graphics or all the people he was meeting. His excitement was just ridiculous in my eyes but I had been through this before. Nevertheless, the game also captured my interest because of its science fiction theme. I am a sci-fi buff and the storyline had such a great plot that they actually sell the novels online for it. I read the chapters as they were released and was hooked on the storyline.
Low bought another copy about two weeks later. "I want you to play with me." By this time we were under some strain because he was really absorbed by this game every night. It looked really intimidating to me and I opted not to play it right away, stalling for time. The 3D environment bothered me because any game I had ever played, like Diablo, for example, had always been in third person view, which is a bird's eye view of the environment. The 3D graphics were dizzying as I looked over his shoulder from time to time.
In the end I caved in under the pressure and began playing it in September of 2001. I was a horrible player in the beginning, running into walls and getting lost or killed all the time. It didn't matter to me. I was playing a game with my boyfriend and found with each day that went by, I wanted to log on and play more and more.
So what was the appeal? Before I realized what was happening, I became addicted to playing this game. While logged into this game I met wonderful people, via their avatars, laughed to funny antics via chat window discussions, and experienced a futuristic sci-fi world via incredibly realistic 3D graphics and sounds. We ran through swamps with mutant wolves chasing us, the sound of our feet making wet suction sounds just like you would have in reality. We could hear birds chirping in forests we scouted and vultures crying overhead as they spotted us and attacked.
Our adrenaline would pump as we fought for our lives against twenty-foot tall robots with buzz saws for hands, or as we went on safaris to hunt giant brontosaur-like animals. We had the ability to heal and save each other as well as other members of our team at the time. We also had the ability to gain the respect, over more than a year later, of many online players, for being a great couple of characters in this game. We have, in fact, become high-ranking officers in our guild, which is almost like a family or alliance with other people to help you in the game.
In South Korea, some in-game alliances are valued more than real life friendships. A game called Lineage: The Blood Pledge has captivated approximately a third of the population. In Lineage, characters can take on the role of Princes, Wizards, and Knights and vow their loyalty to their clan or guild. This loyalty had lead to an incident in 2001 where a player was nearly beaten to death in real life for virtually killing the character of another player.
"He boasted that he had offed the gangman's virtual character just for the fun of it. Bad idea. The roughnecks dragged the 21-year-old into the urinal and pummeled him until he was covered with real-world bruises." -- By Michelle Levander, Time Magazine
It is easy to lose yourself to your imagination while you become someone you could possibly never be in the real world. You can become a hero, a bad ass, a wealthy person, someone with special powers or gain an enormous amount of respect from people who look up to you. This isn't to say you can't be that kind of person in reality, but what if everyone had this ability to find respect, admiration and status, simply by being in the environment long enough. What if all you had to do was play each day and level higher and higher, each goal leading to a new goal of achievement and possibilities. And what if you never had to leave the comfort of your chair to do this?
What if you could really become a diva, a soldier, a magician, or a samurai, and people respected or admired you unconditionally as long as you had a long red bar looming over your virtual head. Or, as in especially my case, what if while you were in this virtual reality, you didn't have to worry about deadlines, due dates, over 1000 emails per day to read and answer, or day-to-day stress that comes with what I do. The virtual reality could absorb you so much, that for the time you are logged in, you forget everything else. It doesn't seem to matter whether you are a strict role-player (someone who stays in character) or 'hardcore' (someone who spends more time in-game than an average user). You still can be addicted and absorbed with the attention you get.
The official Anarchy Online Community Forum, which gets thousands of posts per day, has also been one of my sources for observing how obsessed people have become with the game. Recently, a devoted and well known player had to throw in the towel due to her addiction problem.
"The level to which I got into things here is what has lead me to this point where I must say goodbye. My internet addiction and denial of it has taken me to a point where I must get a hold of it. I realize that many people have what it takes to play a game like this "casually" in a healthy manner. I am unfortunately not one of those people. I am currently battling bi-polar disorder (manic depression) and the escapism that a game like AO offers is too much like a drug for me."
The ability to be respected, to be admired, and to succeed, even in an imaginary world, is a very powerful lure. It can cause a person to produce endorphins, a chemical released into the brain that causes a feeling of energy and well being. Gaming also causes adrenaline production and extreme excitability. Scientists have proven that endorphins and adrenal rushes are incredibly addictive.
"There are indications that pleasurable games and activities cause the body to produce endogenous opiates such as endorphins. These substances are actually addictive. Some addictive drugs, such as heroin, are chemically similar to these natural substances, while other addictive drugs are thought to stimulate their production."
-- Leonard Holmes, Ph.D. from the article, Is Pokémon Addictive? 1999
It should be easy to see why gaming can be addictive as a direct result of the physical effects on the body. I also believe that people can become addicted to respect, admiration and power as well. Even though the production of endorphins can be a positive side affect in one way, it can be easy to overindulge and put aside productive living. But there are many ways to do this and online gaming is not the only vice out there. People find many different ways to escape the problems in their life or to combat stress.
People log on each and every day to find a level of respect that doesn't come easily in day-to-day life. They log on to escape reality or to escape other real problems such as illness and stress. I have met people in this game who have mental disorders or physical impairments. I have also played with people who are in IT jobs all day long, listening to customer complaints, getting bitched at regularly. Some have even admitted that they never hear the words "good job" in the real world.
One player who works in the IT technical services industry, told me "I get my faith in people restored when I get online. People treat me with respect and are actually nice to me. They don't expect anything in return. Also, they believe me when I tell them something because of my level in the game."
I know of other overly stressed out people who log in each day to escape their day-to-day experience of working or living in hard reality. We met a person in game, for example, who is an EMT. Everyday he witnesses death and horrible accidents. He told us that he plays the game to get it all out of his mind. I also met a nurse online with a similar story, and a school teacher who teaches eleventh grade in the Bronx, NYC, who is very stressed out by his job.
"Most human beings pass through periods in their lives, when they feel compelled to engage in some apparently mindless activity that, for the time being, seems to provide some relief from the prevailing chaos in their lives. This could be something as simple as spending hours in front of the television set. Or going on uncontrollable buying sprees just to feel and smell the newness of the product. Or getting into a series of dead-end relationships. Or going on eating binges. Or playing computer games, uncaring of unattended work piling up. Or playing snooker every evening at the club regardless of the family's legitimate demand for more attention. In other words, binging on anything potentially destructive to the body or the soul. Fortunately for many of us, after a period of this compulsive indulgence, we pull ourselves back to the mainstream and get on with our lives, until the next compulsion hits us."
-- Dr. Vijay Nagaswami, from the article, Who? Me? An addict, The Hindu Folio 2001
This is not to say that there are not positive aspects to interacting with people online. Online gaming opens the doors to people who might not have the ability to do so due to time, geography, or many more reasons. Gaming online is an inexpensive and quick way to make new friends, chat with people all over the world and share an experience with people you would never meet because they may be continents away.
One of our online friends, for example, who goes by the character name "Docker", lives in Leiden, Netherlands. Another friend, "Chanell" lives in Einselthum, Germany. These are really interesting people we would never have met if it was not for the game we play online. I asked Chanell why he started playing online games.
"It all began with Diablo II being released. Then my friend, Yppo, made me try it online. I found it was an incredibly boring and annoying game. Then Yppo made me try it online and I loved it. I joined his clan and had months of online fun, then it got boring, close to the moment DAoC [Dark Ages of Camelot] was released in Europe. While I went to DAoC, Yppo chose to go to A.O." Eventually Chanell started playing A.O. as well.
When asked how playing A.O. affects his social life, he reflected, "As for my friends... yes we hang together a lot less. This could be related to A.O. or the fact that we don't work in the same city anymore. I am not totally sure. I still have a lot of phone calls and meetings so I am not "lonesome" it just isn't an as high frequency as before."
And with that I can only think that one's social life is in the eye of the beholder. I interact with Chanell almost every day. In fact I interact with more people than I ever have before because of playing a computer game. They just are not all physically in my proximity.
Interaction with people... It got me thinking and I began to develop my own theories on what causes the addiction. Psychologists can use fancy terminology like "Motivation Factors" and "Attraction Factors" such as self-esteem and self-image problems. They can harp on the role of achievement problems and relationship deficiencies in a person's personality. But I think I can sum it up to one word that would work for any individual needing his or her game "fix" each time they log in, regardless of how well rounded they are in their lives or how much of a basket case they could be perceived as.
RESPECT.
I think it is just that simple. I like the feeling I get when people look up to me in the game or ask my opinion. It seems to be a common drive for players in general. That is, to be respected for being the best and reaching the next level in the game.
Not everyone who plays games neatly fit into these Psychologists stereotypes. "Solories", another Anarchy Online player, is an example of someone who just logs on for the sake of play.
"I would say that I am responsibly addicted, meaning I have never been late to work due to AO.
My wife would prefer that I not play AO as much as I do, but I always make time for her every night, and try and do one thing planned together every weekend. I have never been late to work, but the first night I played AO I stayed up until 4:00 am and had to get up at 6:00 am and the next day I played until midnight. I don't feel that AO affects my work habits, work is work and when it is time to play, it is time to play. I enjoy watching my character grow in his skills and MMORPG's in general let you get away from the normal day to day monotone life and do something out of the ordinary. In AO I am Solories Enforcer of Rubi-Ka a defender of the cause. I fight battles that help my guild get better and help the clans win a war against the Omni."
In the process of my gaming experiment, I became a casualty of the concept of being respected. If someone had asked me in September of 2001 if I expected to be obsessed with an online role-playing game a year down the road, I would have said with confidence that I am one of the most level headed non-addictive persons I know. No way could this happen to me. In fact, I would have been reminded of poor old Iggy and his demise.
I technically have ended my experiment. In the process, I haven't lost my job, and due to our simultaneous obsession, I have not lost my fiancé either. I haven't lost my real life friends, but they do sometimes look at me funny when I talk about the game I play. Low and I get our work done, run our business and have a great balanced life together I think. Anyone who actually knows me in real life can tell you that I have no self image or esteem problems and in fact, I have been accused of having quite an ego. I won't even go into Low's ego. I will admit though, that I have missed quite a few parties, nights out with the girls, shopping, and some chores needed around the office and home because of Anarchy Online. I will also admit that I want to log in as much as I possibly can every single day.
People have worse entertainment addictions than playing computer games. If I am going to be addicted to something, I would choose online gaming over drugs, bowling, gambling, television, or being a baseball fanatic easily. I don't have to wear ugly shoes, lose my hard earned money or do the wave next to someone I don't know and that just about makes it a no-brainer for me. It IS after all just a video game, like Neal describes in his great novel, Snow Crash. It is just another amusement park.
"Amusement parks in the Metaverse can be fantastic, offering a wide selection of interactive three-dimensional movies. But in the end, they're still nothing more than video games."
--Snow Crash by Neal Stephenson
And I will leave you with that. Signing on now... Tenjikiito, level 157 Female Solitus Adventurer, Advisor to the Clan Guild Synergy Factor, the best damn guild on the world of Rubi-Ka, with the best damn virtual people one could ever virtually meet.
Special thanks to the following people for help with my research and leveling:
Sohjiro (Low Tek), Theevilcouch, Demnspawnt, Akarah, Chanell, Sheffy, Mr. Cheeze/Conqueso, Solories, Kirishami, Docker, Ramzie, Boco (who is to blame for all of this), Sultanx, Asmoran, Caddock, Meurgen, Tergwannabe, Trus, Ayanamie, Cplkane, Spherana, Ankokujin, Thedwarf (aka Notmyfault), Stromm, Molg, Butwalrus, Ciyt/Toonot, and Yokoduna.
Related links:
Anarchy Online
Dark Age of Camelot
Ultima Online
Diablo II
The Sims
Everquest
Try Anarchy Online free for 7 days! (We dare you to). =]
Ouch!
Karma: Censored (mostly affected by decency laws)
Drug addicts, can eventually become wrapped up enough in the life style, that they can become dealers, or sometimes get freebees.
Play Everquest long enough, eventually you can sell your character for megabucks on Ebay.
More proof, that evil begets evil.
0110100100100000011000010110110100100000011000100
I didn't know anyone played Anarchy Online anymore. ;P
She's totally right though. There are worse things than being a high-level gimpotron on the Root Beerius shard. Lots worse. More annoying, more destructive, etc. But the expense of playing a Pay-to-Play seems kinda like a drug habit to me...Oh well.
Kickin' it self-righteous school.
Considering the audience, I don't think we need to read an article to understand gaming addiction...
Game addiction is a serious problem, one that's almost as wretched, terrible, and harmful for loved ones than drug, sex, or gambling addictions.
Take, for example, the EverQuest Widows page. Their opening paragraph states simply that "EverQuest-Widows is a forum for partners, family, and friends of people who play EverQuest compulsively [who] turn to each other [for emotional support]".
So please catch yourselves before you joke about addiction. All addictions, not just ones related to drugs, are serious problems that must be solved before disaster strikes.
In conclusion, I urge you all to read this heart-wrenching essay in which Jeffrey Stark talks about how a video game ruined his young life.
Truly a sad story. Remember people: games are for fun/entertainment, and are not real life. Same goes with Slashdot!
If you celebrate Xmas, befriend me (538
I'm not advocating drug use or even sexual addiction, but just disagreeing on the issue of computer game addiction. I've gone through phases when I've spent a lot of time playing computer games, mostly offline but sometimes online, and the main benefit is the sense of escape, not skill development or interaction with others.
-- http://www.MarkWelch.com/ Pleasanton California
An old friend of mine was a MUD addict. He claimed it to be more addictive than crack. As a result of his MUD playing, he flunked a semester of school, since he wouldn't go to class, study, do his homework, etc.
Sounds pretty far fetched, but MUDs can be so damn enticing.
reech bee-yond ur clip-0n
"the editor has spent over a year investigating on gaming addiction." I wish I could call my playing to much video games something scientific like that. *sighs, goes back to playing PS2*
After reading through the article, I fail to find what the first industry alluded to in that paragraph is. It doesn't seem to be gaming, or more correctly, online gaming. It does seem to be a "drug infested haven". Sounds like the U.S. Congress, or perhaps Big Business.
chmod 000 -R /usr/bin/games /usr/local/games
It worked for me.
maybe it would be better not to have some self-control, and not have any addictions.
...is it possible that this guy was just addicted to video games for a year and now is trying to rationalize it by writing an article about it?
I think you mean...
In SOVIET RUSSIA
YOU addict Games!
If you can't see this, click here to enable sigs.
And in our upcoming story about heroin addiction, we'll have an interactive special feature where you can enter your zip code and find the location for the dealer nearest you!
One might ask the same about birds. What ARE birds? We just don't know.
Good God, video game addiction. Talk to someone who has a real addiction or their family. Trust me the family of an alcoholic would beg their family member to stop drinking and take up video games.
You jackass. Besides, tubgirl.com is much worse
Having all my money going into arcade games was morale destroying. I believe that there is no difference between being addicted to video games and VLT's (slot machines).
It's not whether you win or lose, it's just that you have to keep playing. It's a vaguely sexual feeling -- that you might be found out, that you'll be "in trouble."
Profoundly depressing, actually. After a couple of years I managed to stop, but there was no self help groups back then, nobody to talk to (and who takes a 12 year old that's spending $50 a day on video games seriously anyway??)
If you're addicted, step back, do whatever, throw out the computer. Quit two, three, four times or as many as it takes to get it out of your life. And don't go back.
The baby's fine -- please stop sending business cards.
- Doesn't beat his wife.
- Doesn't drink.
- Doesn't do drugs.
- Doesn't sleep around.
But all he does do is sit in front of the TV and talk on Internet chat rooms. Just because you don't beat your wife doesn't mean you are a good person. And just because playing video games doesn't make you a bad person doesn't mean it is good for you.--Your sex
Sex - Find It
Myself, I totally wasted about three years on MUDs, 1993-1995. And I only consider myself cured from all the psychological after effects of that life since about a year. I still haven't finished my CS study, but it's finally going fast, I'll finish that thesis soon. Still, years down the drain.
And from what I hear of these MMORPGs, they must be more addictive. I will stay the fuck away from every online game.
So this article reads familiar. Author knew someone who wasted years, cut himself off completely (so did I - apart from MUD playing friends). She didn't believe she could be sucked in, tried the game, and was also trapped.
So these games are exactly like heroin, addiction-wise. If you haven't played a MMORPG yet, don't start.
That said, LPC is still a cool programming language :-)
I believe posters are recognized by their sig. So I made one.
I remember this time last year i was just kicking my everquest addiction. I realized that it just wasn't fuffilling at all. My social life was trashed, except with my friend who also played. I wasn't even enjoying the time I did spend playing it. When I canceled my subscription it felt as if I risen to a new level of councousness.
Now I have a lot more friends, have lost 40 pounds and am much happier than I was before.
I still play video games some, but not a lot.
Also, please note the difference between a mental addiction and a chemical addiction. A mental addiction is all force of habbit, like video games or marajawana. A chemical addiction, to nicotine or alchahol is much different and a lit harder to kick.
Help I'm a rock.
While I agree that games are "better" being addicted to than most drugs (coffee, anyone?) I really can't agree with the conclusion of this article. Gaming addiction can be expensive as hell (especially if you're on dial-up and pay per minute, as we do in Sweden). I had a brush with this sort of behaviour when my brother was playing Ultima Online every day for about half a year -- although he eventually just got tired of it. Any activity which holds you from interactive with other people for a very long time is quite harmful to you, even if you don't actually *like* people.
and I am a Slashdotaholic.
Where's the line drawn between addiction and fandom? I've been hooked on Command and Conquer games since they first appeared. I've tried others in the genre like Starcraft, but they just haven't done it for me. I'm going through withdrawl waiting for Generals to finally make it to the shelves, annoying the piss out of the local software shop guys everytime I'm in the mall by asking them to give me the up to date release date.
When I do get a new C&C game, I normally spend the next 3 weeks playing that in my free time. I find myself staying up until 3 or 4 am, and my girlfriend gets hooked too, so that doesn't help things (is she an "enabler?"). After about 3 weeks, it doesn't give me as much of a "high" as it used to, so I don't play it as much. But then comes the expansion pack and another 3 weeks of my life.
So I ask you, when does this become an addiction and when is it just being a fan?
Friends help you move. Real friends help you move bodies.
These "people" are pathetic. They are simply people with zero self-esteem, zero drive, and who are intrinsically lazy. They have the willpower of a doorknob. I know this is gonna be modded "flamebait", but it's very simple. It's not a physical "addition" and it's insulting to people with real additions. These are just lazy fucking slobs who use "addiction" as a crutch so as they don't have to get their fat asses off of the sofa. Any serious problems that strike these people and their families are brought on by themselves. It's that simple.
It seems a bit irresponsible for her to dismiss gaming addiction as "just another amusement park". Clearly some people don't have the same willpower as she does, and for them gaming addiction is a real problem that causes them to become antisocial and lose touch with their friends, their jobs, their lives. The very word "addiction" means that the compulsion is stronger than the person's resistance. Any kind of behaviour which resists one's better judgement is damaging, IMHO.
I think video games, especially online games, are addictive not only for their stimulation, but also their communication. What better way to communicate with someone then to use primeval instincts like killing?
On another note, knowledge can also be addictive, take the everything2.com phenominon. 50,000 people addicted to knowledge
Sig (appended to the end of comments you post, 120 chars)
Obsessive-compulsives can get addicted to video games.
Film at eleven.
[PowerPoint] is a tool for capitalist presentation
...between online roleplaying and other games, even online ones is the amount of time needed to get "into the game" every time you play.
If I compare my Everquest addiction (which is over) to my Counter-Strike addiction (which is being revived) I'd say that I can pop in for a quick game of CS, but just as quickly log out again and go off to some social activity, whereas EQ would keep me tied to the screen.
The problem with EQ (and AO, DAoC, whatever) is that you need on average around an hour just to get going in the game. You need to get to some place where you can kill something, find a group, wait for friends, etc etc...
Once you enter the high level game in any online RPG you will have to sacrifice even more time. 24-hour non-stop playing sessions of a 50+ member guild for some rare item are not uncommon in the very high end game.
THAT's when your life starts going down the drain...
Question is, when're they going to start legislating games? I mean, if Evercrack and MUDs are the "hard" games, then what about so-called gateway games? Are they going to make Pacman illegal because it can lead to more severe game abuse? And they do have anecdotal evidence that video gaming can lead to violence and other crimes. Who knows, people might start committing armed robbery because they can't afford the next Evercrack expansion.
The above is not a comment on the "War on Drugs." If you take it as such, you're a low-down good-for-nothing hippie crack dealer terrorist who is against democracy and everything else the US stands for.
If not all sentients are human, couldn't it be possible that not all humans are sentient either?
st-t-t-t-t-top insul-sul-sulting me and and my adddict-ict-ict-iction.
The nerve. Caffeine is a REQUIRED part of life just like food,shelted, and sex.
I think the best part is the "JOIN NOW!" Anarchy Online advertisement resting at the top of article's page ...
=) jay (AO sucks, DAOC forever - Commence flaming)
I would choose /. addiction over online gaming, drugs, bowling, gambling, television, or being a baseball fanatic easily. I don't have to wear shoes and have found all sorts of new ways to Profit! It IS after all just a web site, like CowboyNeal describes in his great new book, /.ed
Essentially, this woman just conveyed that she is an addict, but justifies her addiction as healthy, as she could be doing something worse...??!
Well, I'm glad I'm addicted to nicotine. Without cigarettes, I might be smoking crack! Thank god I found this addiction before I moved onto something more serious, like bowling or television.
-agent oranje.
What is the difference between a drug addiction and a video game addiction? I'd say most people use drugs because drugs make them feel better, they alter the chemicals in their brain. Isn't playing a MMORPG just the same thing only instead of using chemicals you are using light and sound, along with relationships to other people online to provide the same high? People who become accustomed to playing these games will go through withdrawl, and eventually they will need to game more to get the same feeling they had attained before. An addiction is an addiction, it doesn't matter to what. A drug addiction may end up being more detrimental to one's health, but that doesn't necessarily make it more important than an addiction that has the potential to ruin one's social and family life. People who truly become addicted to substances or activities are usually the people who would become very depressed otherwise. Some people will turn to drugs, others might find videogames and decide it's okay because it can't hurt them. Videogame addiction may stem from the same problems as drug addiction and should be addressed similarly.
I was a MUSH addict back in 1995. I'd play for hours at a time, instead of going out to look for work (I'd been laid off from an ISP before the internet REALLY boomed) or paying enough attention to my wife and new son. And I payed for it with a divorce and a lot of very hard times.
The addiction to EQ and MMORPG's is very similar. There is a sense of community that is often lacking in our 'real world' For me, it was emotional support that my wife didnt have the energy to give me while dealing with our child.
It's easy to call people who get addicted to games losers, or deride them for their lack of character. But in the end, it's about finding something there we dont find elsewhere. I was on the beta for Earth and Beyond, and even ran a fansite in the days before it was even beta... but I got out when I saw myself going down the same road I had in 95. Not everyone can do that... and the sooner people realise the fact that these games are addictive for a reason and make the effort to break the cycle, the sooner there will be less Everquest Widows.
One thing that makes this a little worse than other addictions is that it can be done anywhere, thanks to thing like the gameboy.
I was invited to Thanksgiving dinner by a friend. It was me, another mutual friend, her, her parents and her brother.
Her Brother was about 26 I'd say, and he spent the entire time sitting amongs the rest of us on the couch playing Metroid Fusion on his BGA. He had headphones one and would make random comments like "Ah there it is!" or "Now where did he go." We would all look at him thinking he was addressing someone.
What's probably worse is that neither his parents nor his sister made him stop. They just let him be a zombie amongst us. I must admit that I was like this about 10 years ago with the first gameboy. In the car especially, but I was 13, he is 26 and no one seems to really care enough to do anything.
With most other addictions you have to be in a certain area to do it, or it costs a lot of money. ie. portable tv's aren't that cheap and don't get good reception, but gameboys, gamegears, etc.. work just as well anywhere and no one really looks at you oddle if you use one.
"Not knowing when the dawn will come, I open every door." - Emily Dickinson
I'm not saying that everyone will be affected this way... But I urge you all to be careful. You, in the Slashdot crowd, are easily the most susceptible... and I suspect that many of you are affected already.
Good luck to you all.
Thus should we say that those people that died from playing too much computer games have died of overdose?
It's not a physical "addition" and it's insulting to people with real additions.
Just like a gambling addiction, there are neurochemical "rewards" for winning.
Has anyone suffered at the hands of this diamond gem? It's a dated game, I know, but when I received it, it was PURELY a matter of having other things I more greatly desired to do that enabled me to leave the machine. In early college I missed countless dinners.
4:00 p.m. Home from class, sit down to CivII.
7:39 p.m. Look at clock for first time. Missed dinner. Dammit.
In the summer, it was only friends who wanted to play street hockey or my job at Burger King that got me off my computer. The game is brilliantly designed so that there is NEVER a point where you have nothing to do on a given turn; you never have all tasks sufficiently completed at once, and the game returns control to you with 50 new tasks to close or issues to tie up.
Not to mention the testimony I can give of the at least 11 other people, many of them not even my friends, who borrowed the game and became similarly addicted. 8, 10, 15 hour spans of playing are not at all uncommon. Neither is skipping meals or staying up so late you elect to miss class.
The way you beat it is to have obtained a life BEFORE you get into video games. Develop one of your talents, know where you are empowered. I knew I could leave the game (reluctantly) and go practice my music, shoot hoops, or walk the dog. I'm no Zack Morris; people are not crawling out of the woodwork to be my friend, but I subsisted on my own strengths. Without them, I could have easily fallen into the game and never come back.
Having a life: the anti-addiction entity.
hi, I like pancakes -.-- -.-- --..
They are simply people with zero self-esteem, zero drive, and who are intrinsically lazy. They have the willpower of a doorknob.
Your statement about them having the willpower of a doorknob is correct. But to say they are intrinsically lazy is false. How many hours do they put into these games? Generally, these people play for hundreds of hours.
I've never found a game which captivated me so thoroughly, but many people have.
It was about a week ago that an article was posted to slashdot, citing Will Wrights concern about the ethical issues surrounding the Sims Online, and as well he should be. He is supplying a product which stimulates the pleasure center of the brain, as any drug dealer does.
Working in maxis tech support, there were a number of callers who we dealt with all the time, and many others I had simply heard stories about. People who had lost their jobs, people who played the sims 8 hours a day, people who called Tech support, just to have someone to actually talk to. They were so absorbed in the game, the only people they shared any frame of reference with were the people who worked to fix the game.
We've heard about everquest, and the like, but I gaurantee, when the sims online comes out, it will offer 100s of case studies for psychiatrists world wide.
Next time an article like this gets posted, it will be in newsweek, or time, not gamespy.
"Inattention makes clowns of us all" -Bean
I don't have many friends, I don't have a girlfriend, my family dosn't really like me and I don't really have much else going on in my life or many prospects for the future. I plan to become addicted to an MMORPG as soon as I graduate from university. So I'll go to my tech job in the day, and play the MMORPG at night. Is this really so bad? I don't think I could do much better in terms of a social life even if I tried so why not just let me be happy? I think MMORPGs are a legitimate alternative life style for some people.
You run a porn site and post to Slashdot probably 30 times a day, constantly refresing the main page in search of the elusive First Post.
So who's the lazy loser again?
Yes.
I tried playing EQ way back when. I didn't find it very fun at all, mainly because I felt the setting lacked personality, the players lacked personality moreso.
I then tried the Anarchy Online Beta for... about a week during the summer. I thought the game sucked. Probably a good thing.
I tried playing DAOC. This lasted a bit longer, because the setting was much more interesting. I started playing close to the time the game began.
I actually had some fun going out and killing things, unlike EQ. I thought the people in the
game were a bit better as well. I even joined a guild. Unfortunately, the fun didn't really last too long.
When I got to around level 15 or so, I began to realize that the game was quickly turning into a part time job. I had to spend more and more time on the parts of the game I didn't like. To make matters worse, quite a few people from the EQ community seemed to have discovered the game, and the servers started to get filled with lamers.
Since I was only taking one class at the time that was really that difficult, it didn't really hurt me that much... but I felt that I would just have to keep pouring more and more hours into the unrewarding aspects of the game. At the same time, I began to feel alienated from my guild because a lot of the members were putting in 60+ hours a week! I decided to quit the game, which was a good thing.
I think the real reason I tried these MMORPGs was to recreate the fun I had playing D&D during high school.
The reason I think I enjoy NWN so much right now is that it isn't an MMORPG. I can play once a week, or less, and not worry about being left behind by the people I know. I'm not playing a monthly fee, either, so if I don't play very much, it isn't like I'm wasting cash.
"You spoony bard!" -Tellah
i was somewhat addicted to games when i was a kid. then i went to college and took up computer science. now that i understand the algorithms and stuff behind the games, the magic is gone.
now i wish that someone could suggest a game for me to get addicted to.
Gyrate Dot Org - "Where high-tech meets low-life"
typing with one hand...
people work half the day or more; is that an addiction when you are never fired? if you are laid-off...how many people have you seen com close to a nervous breakdown as like an alcohol or drug withdraw? and what is there to say abou game developers who churn out a constant stream of fun games (eidos, idsoftware, bioware, coff8microsoft8coff)? and are amish people addicted to sex just because they casually have about 10 kids in their family? holdon a second,,,
ouch sweee doggyyy...
k back...or are mexicans all alcoholics because their country is always poor and all the men can only afford cheep beer and to put gas in their cars? please dont make assumptions...it is simply a cause-effect relationship of a seemingly free-world. imagine a non-mercifull world... imagine if everyone is perfect and nobody went bankrupt or got in a fight. thankfully, now nicole kidman is available to be my brde because she got in a fight with her 130lb peice of excrament husband sitting in the sun. wait a second';.,.
yow grrrrrrr, woooooo!
k back...some opportunity will not be available if the world was perfect. as for me, i'm going to take some aspirin for my painful left arm; it was injured after i punched my neighbor...i told him not to touch that blue wire going across the backyard wall...i gitta rerun my 1000baset cable now that its broken. because of my actions, i gotta keep the aspirin factory in business.
thankyou
oh and my leftt arm isn't injurred from punching my neighbor...it's muscles are painfully soar from too-much uhm...movement. cant tell you about it i cant trust you mkay bye
But I'm sure you already Gnu that.
You have an excellent point that there are three different forms of addiction which should be regarded as very different:
Combined and Physical addictions tend to be narcotics-related and tend to be understood in a simplistic way by non-addicts. But the war on drugs hasn't had a new twist since the rise of ecstacy in North America; fighting drug addiction cannot hope to attract the funding or media attention it once did. So now purely psychological addictions are en vogue.
I'm not suggesting that some addictions should be left untreated, but it is important to keep their power in mind when making judgements about the sufferers. Right now the hot addiction in Canada is gambling. Should I feel as sorry for someone who goes through mood swings when they stop gambling as someone whose heart stops when they go off heroin? Should I wish the government to devote equally proportional tax dollars to each? Should I spend as much of my time worrying and learning about each?
If anyone needs to quit, the best way is to move somewhere where it is hard to get broadband.
I was hooked on Tribes, eating pringles, and smoking pot. All of them fit together. I basically came home from work and sat up till 3 a.m.
Basically when I moved I just decided to not get an internet connection. I had one at work, so I could still shop, check email, etc from there. I was very suprised how easy it was to get off.
As for gaming I just played single player. Single players is pot as Multiplayer is to crack. It is better not to quit cold turkey.
To pass the time I started working out a lot, and just hanging out at a local bar. Met people and got into shape. After a year I decided to get out of the dessert and get an internet connection. Now I barely use my computer other then for a stereo or to casually surf. Maybe it's the fact that I code for 8 hours a day, but I think it has more to do with the fact I actually have things to do and people to hang out with now.
The only problem is that I smoke more cigs now, and drink more then I probably should. Hmmm... maybe some of us are just prone to addiction. Or maybe it is just part of our consumer based society that "trains" us for it. I'm hooked on caffiene, moved to diet coke for the teeth and gut, but I'm still hooked. Have been since I was about 12. Starts off with sugar and just keeps going. Modern people tend to hooked on things.
These "people" are pathetic. They are simply people with zero self-esteem, zero drive, and who are intrinsically lazy. They have the willpower of a doorknob. I know this is gonna be modded "flamebait", but it's very simple. It's not a physical "addition" and it's insulting to people with real additions. These are just lazy fucking slobs who use "addiction" as a crutch so as they don't have to get their fat asses off of the sofa. Any serious problems that strike these people and their families are brought on by themselves. It's that simple.
This is about the stupidest mod 5 post I've ever seen. ANY addiction is brought on by the person themselves you dumbfuck, alcohol, crack, heroin etc. A possible exception would be sexual abuse, but hey, that's not a real one either huh, just a bunch of weak minded perverts who need to exercise some self control right? You need to get off your high fucking horse and recognize when you're talking out of your ass. Addictions affect different people in different ways.
Since I fit in the class of "addicts", I figured I would post my thoughts and observations of myself..
I think the social interaction is very much undervalued here. When I was in college, I worked two jobs to pay my way, so "free time" was rare. However, from both of my jobs I could get on the internet, and I wound up spending entire days playing MUDs and chatting on IRC. Thanks to the wonders of screen, I could go from home to class to my jobs, and simply reattach to my running IRC session. Sure, I had no girlfriend, but then again, none of the girls I knew would have enjoyed being taken on a date involving a 3AM moonlit stroll through the campus, since I got off work after the bars and resturaunts and such closed. Chatting online gave me a chance to talk to people instead of staring at a terminal in an empty server room late at night. I even picked up speed typing skills to boot. I greatly valued my social interaction with these "virtual" people.
Only, these people are no more "virtual" than I am! I have known some of them for almost a decade. Some I have visited in person, and had a blast getting to see the so-called "virtual" person. Others are in other countries, places I'll never get to go but love to hear about. Calling these people "virtual" is an insult to their real world counterparts.
I now work 9-to-5 as a software developer, and I don't get to IRC from work. I don't have time at home on the evenings to play games much, but I still chat with my friends on evenings. Perhaps people might call me an "addict" still, but I don't let it interfere with other things I want to do.
If you lost it in all that rambling, the point here is twofold:
1) social interaction is social interaction. Ask yourself what benefits do you gain from constraining people to be in the same place at the same time (aside from the possibility of sex)?
2) The internet provides a useful source of social interaction. Turning it off (regulating it, in other words) because some people can't handle their addiction won't help anyone.
If I have been able to see further than others, it is because I bought a pair of binoculars.
'Simply' no self-esteem? And alcoholics are just stupid fucking slobs who need to lay off the sauce, eh?
Talk about insulting, you insensitive clod.
Having had a mean active presence of 10+ hours a day on a MUD, displacing sleep until 4-5am while still participating in school, I still wouldn't call it an addiction. But it did displace regular activities, upsetting my sleep rhythm, and partially ruining my first year in university.
Was it an addiction, though? I logged on first thing in the morning, between classes, and when I got home. You call it.
n/t
drink and be filled with the holy spirit
hey i said holy spirit!!!
In other words playing video games does not automatically make you an addict if you practice control and don't use them to fill an emotional void of some sort. Just like having a few drinks at a bar with your buddies doesn't make you an alcoholic.
Is the phrase "Moderation in all things." really so hard for the modern world to understand?
On a side note, if a severe beating is the penalty for cold blooded PK'ing in South Korea I wonder what they do to cheaters? And is there any chance we could adopt it here? :)
Marijuana not being physically addictive is a long-standing street myth. Hard science has shown that marijuana can and does produce physical withdrawal symptoms, the if-and-only-if of physical addiction. Because of the fact that marijuana is fat soluble and therefore is eliminated from the body at a much slower rate than most other drugs, withdrawal is not as noticable in most cases. But a recently isolated THC antagonist has proven that when marijuana is blocked all-at-once, physical withdrawal similar to that associated with opiates occurs.
Clearly, because people trying to quit won't be shooting themselves up with the antagonist, the occurence of hard-core withdrawal is highly unlikely (I want to say impossible, but I can't be sure about that). But, as someone who has used marijuana chronically and heavily and tried to go cold turkey can tell you (yes, that's me), *some* withdrawal symptoms definitely can occur. I had a very hard time falling asleep for two weeks. I had a complete loss of appetite for over a week, during which I had to force myself to have even a small bit to eat (and even that was grossly unappetizing). This is all aside from the anxiety and depression that occurred frequently for about a week and a half--I hesitate to classify that as a symptom of physical addiction because it very well could have been a result of psychological addiction. (My personal opinion is that the anxiety was a result of physical addiction, but not the depression. This is because of new understanding of the role of THC in the brain. It is an agonist at the anadimide receptor, which means that it blocks the uptake and breakdown of anadimide. Kind of what Prozac does with serotonin. Anyway, anadimide has anti-anxiety effects, and the sudden absense of the receptor's agonist results in lower levels of anadimide in the brain [because it starts getting broken down again], and this leads to higher anxiety levels.)
Anyway, I am certainly not saying that marijuana is nearly as dangerous as other drugs in terms of addictive capacity, just trying to educate folks a bit.
she has gone from being a somewhat normal person, to being one of the higher level characters in Anarchy Online...sounds like a happy ending to me
no, sounds like she really didget addicted. Can you say "rationalization"?
Sounds like a pretty nice ending to me.
Yeah right. Just ask the two people I know who actually LOST THEIR JOBS because of game addictions. These statements are nothing but self-serving masturbation to give game addicts a false sense of security that they don't have a real problem.
Sure, game addiction isn't as bad as crack or alchohol, but I've seen it cause serious havoc in people's lives, including getting fired from their jobs, just like alchoholics and drug addicts.
Casual gaming is great, and maybe even constructive, just like social drinking. But when it becomes an addiction it can be as disruptive to your life as any other kind of addiction, and ignoring it or saying it is OK because it's not physically harmful like alchohol is doing a disservice to people with serious cases who may need help before they end up in the unemployment line.
Unless you are a psycologist who has done serious research in this area I suggest you keep your opinions to yourself. Unless you are completely oblivious, surely you realise that the words you use to describe these gaming addicts are the same ones people used to describe other kinds of additions before people bothered to look at how horribly addictive and harmful those additions can be.
I know a guy who has retired and bowled every day except weekends FOR THE PAST 25 YEARS. Real nice guy too, about 80 years old and bowling is the reason he is able to be so well physically inclined. half a block away from him in a parallel neighborhood (same dimension
ADDICTED TO RETIREMENT! FIRE THOSE INTERNS! PUT THESE OLD BUMS BACK TO WORK IN THEIR OFFICES; THEY'RE STILL ALIVE AND KICKING!! j/k
(*bahdum*cheesh*)
My experience with video game addiction goes back to the hayday of Quake. The way it was like was exactly the same way that crack addicts or heroin addicts are portrayed. That is to say, I sacrificed basically a couple of years that I can't really remember and what justified playing Quake, say, 12 hours a day was that there were other 'friends' I had that did the same thing, and that's really the only thing we had in common. I'm sure I would have fit the psychological profile of an addict in other ways too.
My point is this however. Since then I've done and tried a variety of different drugs and while they're fun, they've never interfered with my life in any way, and I always felt like I got bored really quickly and it was just a pasttime. also I rarely drink and it doesn't really appeal to me most of the time.
I was really good about not playing games for a while. But I had to go cold turkey..
Then a year ago one day I was suppose to to meet up with this girl that I really liked and I ended up playing puzzle fighter for 8 hours straight and totally losing track of time. After that I wiped all my games and broke all my game cds and vowed never to return to video games.
So really for me games interfered with my life as much as a serious drug problem would, I disagree that it's 'better' than a drug addiction. Maybe somewhat more healthy physically I guess.
I've never been into MMORPG, but I have had some marathon sessions with Sim City and Civilization and any good FPS. My trick to setting an alarm for myself is to ignore my bladder for as long as I can. Having created a competing need that escalates in realtime, I have an unavoidable time limit: going to the bathroom == turn the game off. At some point "just one more turn" no longer outweighs "I'm about to piss myself".
Anyone who loves or hates any language, platform, or manufacturer, doesn't know what they're talking about.
Can I still call it evercrack ? - everything else is just plain crack.
Rough.
The kid that lived next door to me my freshman year in college was addicted to EverQuest. I asked him how much he played once, and he showed me the cumulative time he had been playing on just one of his characters: 54 days. It's scary considering he didn't start playing until a few month into freshman year. He didn't come back sophomore year...
I wonder how the "Evercrack" stories will contribute to the current calls for more explicit regulation of the computer/video game industry?
... before movie companies realized they could make more money selling non-R rated movies) ... I'm not sure we can regulate MMORPG based on the "addiction" argument.
... we'd have "Evercrack houses" in major urban (and even some suburban) communities. Imagine what else people would be providing in these Evercrack houses ... shudder.
... social life difficulties, non-satisfactory career, self-image issues, etc. This does not mean that these people should not get help. But it does mean that we should be treating the underlying illness and not just the synmptoms (addiction).
While I do have problems with some titles which (I believe) explicitly market to an inappropriate segment of our population (much like rated R movies during the 1980s/90s
I keep thinking about the lessons thus far from the "Drug War" -- there are significant (unintended) costs to such regulation/criminalization. If we put an age limit, I think we make MMORPG a more subversive activity. This opens the door for kids to engage in other, more harmful subversive activities -- similar in the way some people are introduced to drugs through "underground" music scenes or serious alcoholism from weekend binge drinking during college. Can you imagine if we criminalized MMORPG for youths
Like many of the other posters, I agree that many Evercrack addicts would have fallen into some other pitfall even if they had never played MMORPGs. Addictions in general often are a manifestation of some other problem
I remember that. And afterwards, didn't they take out their kidneys and sell them?
-Dave
Read more about the symptoms, stories, and the 12 steps of Bandwidth Junkies Anonymous on their website!
---
Open Source Shirts
If you stop and think about it for a second, your real life addiction is ruining your roleplaying life. You've already missed several quests, and your traveling partners have moved on to another part of the world. We really need something to break people's addiction to the "real" world, as it takes so many roleplaying lives, its an epidemic. "Social Interaction" has become like a drug to some roleplayers, and they are quickly flocking to this addiction. It is a proven fact, also, that 100% who exist in the real world eventually die. You heard me right! 100%! This is a terrible statistic, and we must do something about it! The "real" world addiction ends here!
You've gotten a whole lot of negative responses, but I actually agree with you, whether you're trolling or not.
Other than compulsive disorders, addictions are caused by the subject. If someone who starts drinking to 'kill their pain' becomes an alcoholic, it's their damn fault. Likewise, if someone plays games from boredom and gets addicted, it's also their fault.
I'm glad to see you're not scared to tell it as it is.. meanwhile these other lefty-liberals will claim it's the evils of society that cause people to get addicted to stuff. To that I repeat what you said.. horse shit.
mogorific carpentry experiments
Personally, I believe that game controllers are coated with crack. This has two effects; first, you have to play every day, which wears out controllers. Second, to get your fix, when the crack wears off the controller, you have to buy another one.
Seriously though; My joystick (thrustmaster F22 pro) takes up more space than my mousing area. You have to have priorities.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
But a recently isolated THC antagonist has proven that when marijuana is blocked all-at-once, physical withdrawal similar to that associated with opiates occurs.
Yes, and when a brick is hurled at people's head pain can occur similar to that of being hit in the face by a heavy object...sigh.
Why is it that every negative study on pot has some kind of crazy catch in it? Its allways "monkeys trapped in closed boxes pumped full of smoke" or "mouse injected with more THC in one go than a chronic user would get in his entire lifetime".
Now there's the "if we inject this chemical that causes withdrawl symptoms, we see withdrawl symptoms" study...damn, who'd have thought it?
But, as someone who has used marijuana chronically and heavily and tried to go cold turkey can tell you (yes, that's me), *some* withdrawal symptoms definitely can occur. I had a very hard time falling asleep for two weeks. I had a complete loss of appetite for over a week, during which I had to force myself to have even a small bit to eat (and even that was grossly unappetizing). This is all aside from the anxiety and depression that occurred frequently for about a week and a half
Ok, you had loss of apetite, trouble getting asleep, and you classify that as "aside" from the depression? Those are symptoms of depression. Maybe (I don't know you, I'm just guessing here) you were already suffering from depression and self-medicating with the pot? Quitting cold-turkey is sure to hurl you back into depression then...
I'm not advocating getting stoned here, but if you want to educate people, do it right instead of spreading the FUD.
You can't take the sky from me...
Thus should we say that those people that died from playing too much computer games have died of overdose?
From what I remember, there were allegations in at least one of these cases that the owners of the cafes were putting amphetamines (or whatever) in the water to keep people alert and playing.
"Slashdot - News and Chat Sites Deviant". (Click "homepage" link above for details).
im addicted to computer games AND drugs...worst part about it is they make a perfect combination.
I hope you count yourself lucky. To not understand such a problem you must have amazing willpower in all areas of your life.
I would be interested to know your thoughts on people with gambling addictions, porn addictions etc.
Whether you like it or not these addictions are a very real problem to a lot of people and it's not "willpower" that is required to overcome them.
Did you know that there are many people who are able to break their smoking addictions by sheer "willpower" who find themselves unable to overcome gambling addictions and the like? IF it was a matter of willpower, don't you think that this would never happen?
Essentially you are correct that these people only have themselves to blame... it IS only their doing that has brought them to this, BUT the same can be said about your so-called "real" addictions. IT is counter-productive to label these people as less worthy for help with their addictions.
The truth is, whether people have a chemical addiction or a mental addiction, if their addictions are ruining their lives or the lives of others they often cannot fix the problem on their own.
I have a GF and God knows she is beautifu and she can PERL and Java and C C++ , she is a ComSci and an Economics specialist, her parents are fucking rich. I am a Com Sci major making decent bux driving my beamer and I am a fucking good systems analyst. But for fuck sakes, someone tell me what to do? I am addicted to pussy. When I feel, smell, see, think of pussy I become this fucking idiot who gives no rats ass about relationship, work, family, friends, nothing. I pick up chicks and I fuck them. And they fall for me, they fall in love with me because I am such a mother fucking intellectual and a very confident guy. Most of the time they fall for me, though sometimes I suffer a rejection (and boy do I hate to be rejected) and I fuck them. I fuck them and fuck them until one of them finds out about another, I cannot let them go on good terms. I fuck them and fuck them up, and I fuck up myself, because I fall in love with them, but I cannot keep them to myself always. There is just not enough time, there is not enough time for me to be with them. I have to be with one and then another, and another and they want, no... they need me to spend time with them. I fantasize about been with all of them at once or at least about been many people at once so I can be with all of them. The beautiful ones, the sweet ones, the silly ones, the young, the intelligent, the married, with children, with no life, with hopes, everything. I cannot stop trying to get into their panties and because I succeed it drives me nuts, but I cannot stop thinking about the NEXT one, even though I want to be with this one again and again. They LOVE it when I am with them they want me in their lifes but I cannot be with all of them. They do not know about it, well most of them do not. 3 months ago it happened that 3 of them knew and actually we still continued seing each other they hoped I would stay with them exclusively. but I digress. I want this to stop. I am fucked up, I am mentally and physically handicapped because of it, I cannot do much of anything, I am barely active at work (they will get rid of me, I swear I cannot stop even due to this threat). Ah, fuck. I wish I was dead.
You are justifying your own alcoholism for staying away from the viles of computer technology? You need serious help in alcoholics anonymous. I suppose you are currently working for Silicon Graphics Inc; that explains why you can pay so much for computer hardware and still don't have enough to complete your engineering schooling woes. What a pitty...
I'm glad I read slashdot.org 7 hours a day just so I can lend unfortunate people like you my knowledge. Unlike you, I work for a fortune 500 company and have completed my 8 years of schooling to work 20 hours a day and make $30 million a year. I'm successful, and you're just addicted...oh wait'...
I don't usually post on /. - i come here to read the humourous trolls and the poorly moderated comments (everyone should browse at -1 and make their own minds up who is talking sense).
/. and only take 10 minutes of my time.
Anyway reading this, there seems to be a lot of holier-than-thou comments, about the weak wills of people etc. But who is it hurting really?
Lets see, the economy? it is unproductive in that sense true, but people aren't cogs in a machine.
Their loved ones? well they may be ignoring them, but it's a free choice, if you'd rather play a game all night (after night) than play with your spouse, something isn't right with the relationship. Maybe in their game they meet people they would never talk to in regular everyday life.
Themselves? well, perhaps, in YOUR opinion, but quality of life is a relative and subjective thing, at the end of the day they are free to choose what makes them happy (see mr goatse.cx for proof that people enjoy many alternative recreational activities to extremely painful looking extremes).
It seems to me people are too quick to condemn others choices, we're all addicted to something, even if its just our/your way of life in general. i especially enjoyed the post further up putting down the gameaholic way of life that ended with a sig linking to free porn. Games may damage your eyesight eventually, but that bloke will go blind a lot sooner.
btw i quite intensely dislike rpg's myself, massively multiplayer or otherwise, all the trolls and goblins i need are right here on
What do you want? A fucking cookie?
First off, if you were a college student student that even HAD $20k/year that you could blow, nobody is going to fucking care; you pampered little trust-fund bitch.
And your 5-year relationship... don't get me started on how high school romances need to die after graduation. Most friends from high school are just that, high school friends, and you're going to lose them too, once you've moved on with your life and are no long being forced to spend 8hr/day with them.
Cry me a fucking river. You couldn't cut the mustard in school & became an obsessive, reclusive geek with no social life or social skills. OMG! Isn't that the classic negative stereotype?
Welcome to the fucking club. It doesn't matter what the fuck you do, unless you're a single mom who dropped out of HS and doesn't know who the fathers of ANY of her three children, nobody cares how you fucked up your life or really even wants to help. The sooner you realize that you're not going to get any help, sympathy or special treatment, the sooner you're going to stop being a victim & get your shit together and clean up your life yourself.
my sig's at the bottom of the page.
Statement 1: Human beings are sensual animals. Anything that gives a rush of pleasure can be addicting. It doesn't have to be a directly injested chemical to cause addiction, although that helps. Eating, shopping, fuc*ing, running, gambling, smoking, cleaning, sky-diving, drinking and gaming can all be addictive.
Statement 2: While there are certainly some drugs and activities that can be more addictive than others, broadly speaking induvidual psychology and personality type plays a far greater role in determining if you will become addicted than the activity itself. There are millions of people who play computer games without showing any signs of addiction. There are millions of people who drink without ever becoming alcoholics. People who are prone to addiction tend to find new addictions if one is denied to them. As proof of this, walk into any AA meeting and count the number of people who have substituted smoking, eating or sex for alcohol.
Counter-statement 1: Human beings are thinking animals. Being aware of the dangers of addiction means being aware of your own weaknesses and capacity for abuse. Understanding that you are an addict means being able to step back from the activity and see its effects on yourself, your work, and your family.
Counter-statement 2: If you are a self-aware induvidual, you have no-one to blame for your addiction but yourself. It's not Sony's fault that they make a compelling product, or that Phillip Morris' is wrong for making cigarettes that are addictive. On the bright side, if you are a thinking induvidual you also have the power to stop your own addictive behaviour. This takes effort, and is not always easy - but it can be done.
Its not that bad..... At least counter strike cured my pr0n addiction.
"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." - Voltaire
There was an article I read a couple of months ago which argued that the word "compelling" should be used to describe the kind of game that people usually refer to as "addictive".
You don't call books you can't resist putting down, or movies you keep watching over and over addictive do you? You call them compelling. Addictive implies a physical addiction and being in a category together with crack. Compelling implies something being of so high quality, it naturally is something you don't want to stop (whichever medium applicable) playing/watching/reading/listening to/thinking about.
That's about as breif a summary as I can make of the (free subscription required) article.
Nobody man ever sucks a cock to get more video game time.
For some of us there is nothing else.
:)
/.).
I've been a gamer since the age of six. Eighteen years later I'm still saving the world, slaying dragons, and rescuing princesses. What did you do today?
Seriously though, gaming is all I have ever known. A broken home didn't offer much stimulation. Interaction at home was practically nonexistant. Unless you're the aggressive type. I don't feed on it, so it never really interested me. My sister on the other hand, seems to crave it.
School was no sanctuary either. Of course, I was the geek. In the entire school there was maybe 6 of us. Yes we spent our time playing Dungeons and Dragons, Doom, and whatnot. But can you honestly sit here and tell me that these are bad addictions that cause me to be anti-social, lazy, and a unproductive member of society?
You obviously have no idea what gaming can be about. Have you ever thought to look into how much effort goes into preparing for a weekend of D&D? And how much fun you AND YOUR FRIENDS can have together. Social interaction is NOT necessarily defined by hanging out at the mall, or at work long hours with coworkers - it could be in the comfort of your own home with some close friends). A lot of gamers are recluses because of the way they are stereotyped. This thread is dripping with it.
I can only argue with the ignorant for so long before I realize it's futile (hence rarely posting on
Try talking to a hardcore gamer about games. You'd be surprised how much more there is to it. Talk about what interests you. I bet (s)he can twist whatever you do for fun into an 'addiction' too.
Is it really an addiction if this is the only thing life really has to offer that is stimulating? If the outside world is dull and bland, why be there? Maybe it's not so wrong if the person can't break from time to time to deal woth work and such. Maybe that person realizes that what he is doing is more important to him/her than going to that crappy job again. Let me assure you that work and relationships are not the end-all-be-all of this world. If they are for you, I'm sorry. You're going to need a lot of help.
Sure, some people are weak willed and are late for work, miss a payment, or whatever because they were playing a game. How many times have you come to work late because you were up late drinking? Or on a date the night beore? Or reading a book all night that you've been dying to read? Or even working late the previous evening? My point being, you can twist anything in to an addiction. Nothing in this world is healthy for you. You might as well do something you enjoy and ignore people that have nothing better to do that stroke their egos by telling you you're useless because you enjoy something they can't even begin to grasp.
Oh I'm sorry, It's not addiction if it's your thing, right? Didn't mean to point any fingers. But for the purposes of this article, stop thinking about fishing this weekend for a second, stop typing your lures, and take that ridiculous hat off. Oh, but fishing is productive... I forgot. Because you do it.
Now if you'll excuse me, I have to go to bed. I'm up 2 hours past my bedtime because I was playing Baldur's Gate : Dark Alliance. I enjoyed every minute of it. I'll still be enjoying it at work tonight while I have to put up with the boss. I'll be half asleep thinking to myself while he drones on about what a pitiful man he is, what a worthless existence we all are really living, and how I'm going to save the world or slay a dragon later tonight. No respect I tell ya...
We are all Gods unwanted children. Did you ever consider he may hate you too?
There's a tendency in talking about this to either a. defend the substance ("it's not the game's fault! It's the personality of the person/their lack of willpower/etc! Anything can be addictive!") or b. attack the substance ("won't someone think of the children..." etc.). Both are somewhat wrong-headed. It's naive to think that the game/whatever has nothing to do with it - some things are intrinsically more likely to be part of addictive behaviour than others. Some games are more addictive than others, and MMPORG's seem to lead the pack (there's a lot of possible reasons - their open structure, the psuedo-social aspect and the sense of competition and fear of getting "left behind", the enormity of the game-zone, etc.) MUDs and MOOs used to be the culprit, probably for similar reasons. (The whole "endorphins" explanation that gets tossed around, like the article has it, is really overextended. There are limbic systems far more extensive than that one at play, and it doesn't explain the nature of addiction any more than talking about the digestive system explains world hunger. And other, more 'neuroactive' games, don't show the same addictive effects as the frankly slower Everquest and company.
Even though many people play FPS's a lot, I haven't seen the sort of destructive fall-out from them that I've seen with other games - I don't know of anyone who failed out of school or became an antisocial shut-in because of Quake or Counterstrike.
In a sense, people who really like video games but would never let them interfere with the normal functioning of their lives (personal and professional) abuse the term "addiction" when they describe themselves as addicted to the games. I found the article underinformed and somewhat irresponsible - the realities of addiction are far more complex than a little controlled "experiment" will illuminate.
Hey, this sounds like a helluva way to get a Stella. Become an on-line gaming adict, have your RL go down the tubes, sue everybody you can think of for taking advantage of your poor, sorry, individual responsibility lacking backside. Make lots of money and have fun playing on-line games while doing it!
:-)
What a scam. I want a cut from anybody who pulls this off since I thought of it. Hmmm, maybe I should patent it
They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither safety nor liberty.
Ben
All the people slamming on video game addicts might find it interesting to read up on addiction.
Addiction is present in many people as a predisposition, and many, many things can fill the addictive role. Drugs, alcohol, food, exercise, and yes even games. Can a video game addiction be compared to drugs and alcohol? Well as far as brain chemistry goes, they are all providing the same addictive stimulation. Repetitive action resulting in a reoccuring reward is what the seeds of an addiction are rooted, and a video game does just as good a job as the others. Of course, by removing the taboos that are in place for drug and alcohol addiction, it makes it even easier for someone to justify playing video games to an unhealthy level.
On the topic of the article I think the writer wimped out by not giving Everquest, the granddaddy of addictive online games, a spin instead of Anarchy Online. The formula for Anarchy Online is flawed, and just doesn't suck in players like EQ does.
I'm not advocating drug use or even sexual addiction
What a relief! Thousands of Slashdotters going out and irresponsibly engaging in wild rampant sex... that's just mad. Mad, I tell you.
The coolest voice ever.
Good thing you didnt get about ******* people addicted to online mmorpgs in the past 2 hours.
A pity that the truth is so politically incorrect nowadays. But you, sir, spew truth from every oriface.
I've seen people with physical addictions. It wasn't a pretty thing, watching them attempt to remove those addictions from themselves. I'm not speaking of, "Oh, boo hoo, I'm so lonely, and, and, if I don't log into my server and kill Sarnaks with my 'friends', I'll just die!"
I'm talking pain. Gut wrenching, searing pain. Violent, uncontrollable shaking. Loss of coordination due to that to the point where people can and do hurt themselves trying to do simple tasks. Headaches that make one feel as if their head is between the hammer and the anvil.
Addiction. Give me a break. These people who are "addicted" to gaming, eating, etc. are probably the same idiots who go running straight to Prozac because they feel the world owes them something.
Last time I really played a multiplayer game and got addicted was Action Quake 2. I've had episodes with Duke Nukem 3D, Ultima Online and Counter-Strike, but Action Quake 2 really ate up my time. I'd spend several hours every day, just after 6 until around 10 playing Action. I'd ignore my homework, family, tv, and just play for 2p a minute on Wireplay. I played like this four about two years, until my 56K modem decided to assign itself a new IRQ address. Nowonly being 14 I thought it had broken, so we sent it off for repairs, and I got knocked down to a 14.4K modem. I spent ages in chat rooms on this, but could never play AQ2, no matter how much I wanted to. When my 56K came back, and reinstalled itself correctly, I just didn't find AQ2 fun anymore. It was pointless, easy, repetative. I found after I'd collected my thoughts in the few weeks I'd not had my modem, I'd found that the game wasn't so brilliant, and it was just the same thing, over and over and over. I never played again ever since. I had a similar problem with Ultima Online, until one day I lost my Ostard on a server, got so pissed off I almost cried, and realised what I'd become. I deleted one of the main files so i could never play it, renamed the executable .DONOTRUN and took the first letter off the directory, to remind myself.
Still, i think its funny enough just looking at Asperger Syndrome. I expect most of us can say somone we know has it. Then again I think some of this is just as much stupidity in justifying life as is saying a child has Hyperativity Disorder. Surly a single swift clout round the head and a stern look is enough to resolve some of these problems?
If you really want to quit one night, do somthing to remind yourself, somthing that actually takes much too long to fix for you to normally be bothered with, and walk away.
Wow, what an insensitive response. It strikes me that the original poster was trying to help others by making them aware of something that they might be affected by, yet might not see for themselves.
Read the last few lines of the post again. If you can't understand it when people have the best interests of others at heart, someday you'll likely end up desperately needing help while stupidly turning it down because of your own pride.
I for one hope that the original poster overcomes his/her demons and even if you won't, I'll certainly give them a cookie for posting their "story" in a potentially hostile environment like this one...
STOP . AMERICA . NOW
They used them to create potions of Tasha's Uncontrollable Hideous Bladder!
Who wouldn't? Those potions sell for three platinum a piece!
Since when? (Since piracy.)
From dictionary.com:
;-)
addiction
1a. Compulsive physiological and psychological need for a habit-forming substance: a drug used in the treatment of heroin addiction.
1b. An instance of this: a person with multiple chemical addictions.
2a. The condition of being habitually or compulsively occupied with or or involved in something.
2b. An instance of this: had an addiction for fast cars.
Perhaps this source isn't reputable enough to support my upcoming claim, but I'd like to point out that the preceding definition makes no mention of the impact addiction has on one's social life. I'm pointing this out because the cited article, and public conciousness, tends to append "social desolation" to addiction's list of symptoms.
This bothers me. My roommate has a heavy, self-professed dependency on soda. My parents can't get started in the morning without a cup of coffee. My siblings will fall over dead (I kid you not!) if they miss "awesome tv show X." However, they all have healthy social lives; does this mean they are not addicted? Just because these habits don't separate them from society doesn't mean they aren't addictions, IMHO.
I, on another hand, have no social life; in fact, I'm generally loathe to interact with people. I would rather hack than "hang out" (::shudder::). Does this mean I am addicted to hacking?
I find that I am happiest hacking, that is why I choose to do it. I find that I dislike socializing, and it substracts from the time I have available to my personal pursuits, so I choose not to do it. These are concious decisions; neither compulsive nor habitual. I also vacation from hacking at intervals, and I indulge in many other hobbies and interests in addition to hacking; though it may be my primary occupation, it is not the sole proprietor of my livelihood. Therefore, I would conclude that I am not addicted to it.
On the contrary, it is those individuals who simply _must_ interact with each other in perpetuity that are the addicts
Note: I am aware that this post constitutes a form of human interaction. My aforementioned lack of a social life is in the traditional sense; I do manage to exchange information with other human beings through various mediums from time to time.
Is this sort of thing really an addiction? Sure, lots of people are really addicted to MMORPGs, but to me this author (and many others) doesn't sound addicted at all. The only effect it has on her life is that she has "missed quite a few parties, nights out with the girls, shopping, and some chores needed around the office and home because of Anarchy Online." So instead of hanging out with RL friends, she is hanging out with online friends. So if she's addicted to MMORPGs, then is everyone else addicted to real life? I'm sure that there are many people who lose far more time in their lives trying to be with their RL friends than MMORPG players who spend time with their friends. Friends online can be just as good as friends offline, so why is it bad to spend time with online ones? I've never played any MMORPGs, but I want to, mainly so I can make some friends.
all this happened on Everquest?
The best education consists in immunizing people against systematic attempts at education. - Paul Feyerabend
How real will games have to get until they are no different from normal socializing. If I can meet real human friends in a virtual bar and play virtual pool and drink virtual beer, is that different from being there? You can't laugh at this question, you know it will happen.
And that is simply fooling the senses, the mind is much easier to fool. Even a muck or mud can by text transport you out there to a world you've never before known. Novels and stories have been doing the same thing for millenia, now it is a shame that popular media exists such that multiple people can intereact in the same novel, and in fact write the story as the experience it?
God has heard of no such thing as online gaming. Human morality is just catching on to this whole internet thing, and it will be playing catch up for quite a while. How long will it be until enough people agree that a fufilling existence can be found in places both closer and further away than "outside"?
As a professional game developer, I know first hand what it is like to be addicted to video games. In fact, my job requires it. Imagine working 10 hours a day (if its not crunch time) on a game and then going home and playing yet more games to make sure that your competition doesn't have an edge on you. We jokingly refer to this as "market research". Your whole life is based around games.
It sucks. I did it for about 7 years and then just got burnt out (as did a number of my colleagues). There is so much more to life than games. I feel sorry for the up-and-coming developers who want to prove to the world how badass they are. They pour their heart and soul into lifestyle which ultimately benefits a publisher that couldn't give two shits about you.
Now that I'm older and wiser I've learned to not take my job home with me. Sure I'm not as caught up on what happens at the end of the fifth level of TimeSplitters 2, but I'm a whole lot happier for it.
I think we need a Hunter S. Thompson style reporter to cover gaming addiction.
I an see it now, fear and loathing in the Sims Online.
There won't even be people left to post comments at /.
Snow Crash (a computer virus that infects hacker neural code).
is that post considered Insightful?
Obviously the poster(ameoba) has serious problems himself and is lashing out against the orginal poster for getting attention he(ameoba) thinks he deserves. I sense a lot of jealousy, anger and remorse in that post. It is not insightful but rather 'incite'ful.
If someone is trying to climb out of the gutter you dont kick them in face because they got slime on your shoes. You pick them up and point them in the right direction.
The best education consists in immunizing people against systematic attempts at education. - Paul Feyerabend
Roulette rolls you!
ANYTHING can be addictive! Chocolate can be addictive, as can television, reading books, shopping, and so forth. Online gaming is easy to target because it is a relatively new thing and because the stereotype of online gamers is very narrow. Like many diseases and social disorders, there are many people who are far more prone to addiction than others. This is both genetic and environmental, and there are many out there who will be addicted to many things in their lifetime, and if it isn't one thing it will be another.
This entire argument over online gaming is moot. The gaming industry is doing what it does and doing it well, and this is evidence by the quality and use of their games. If you or someone you know spends too much time playing video games, then try to help, but don't waste your time blaming a company or its programmers for such a problem. I have seen people sue mcdonalds for acquired eating disorders and shopping networks for provoking shopping addictions; I consider those sorts of responses to be complete BS and am only offended more by the fact that such frivolous cases are actually taken seriously. This isn't akin to the lies cigarette companies made decades ago about their products
We are all responsble for our own actions. Occasionally others are to blame for messes we get into, but this is not a case like that. Gaming can be an addiction like any other, and can be just as destructive.
I have played Diablo, Icewind Dale, Warcraft, and many of the other great games we've all heard about. In some cases I spent way too much time playing, but I made sure over time to set my priorities straight and make sure I don't spend too much time on the computer. Anyone can do this, it is all a matter of willpower. Everquest is addictive because it has a cumulative committment. As you play you gain experience, items, and notoriety within your circle of gamers. The longer you play, the harder it becomes to just walk away from that. The same basic idea is true for any other addiction.
...but I think I'd enjoy a side-scrolling, third-person account of video game addiction more myself. Even Metroid is first-person now...
Green-voting, republican-registered, socialist-libertarian.
Yes, I play games, an awful lot. In the vernacular, I would be called a gaming addict. I've called myself that, and have no problem with it, so feel free. Whether it is a "real" addiction could be argued to death. I don't get the shivers when I'm not playing a game, but I certainly think about it often enough. It fills my time. I reject out of hand all accusations that I merely am rationalizing anything. I frankly don't see it as by default irrational in the first place, so there's no need to spin it to make it appear so.
Here's the real end of the story. People are responsible for the consequences of their own actions. Of the myriad positions made on this point, the ones that have been modded up appear to fall into one of two catagories.
1) These "gaming addicts" are worthless and spineless, without the self control the gods gave moths.
2) The games made me do it! I couldn't stop myself! They're dangerous! Keep away!
There is (at the very least) a third way to look at the whole "addiction" scenario. Maybe, just maybe, people have respsonsibly taken a look at the world around them, their lives, and sundry other things, and have chosen to spend a large portion of their time playing video games. Who gave any of you the right to pass judgement on another person's social situation? Hmm? I'm waiting. The world is a hellhole these days. Our government seems intent on passive-agressively stripping us of our rights, moving us inexorably toward the gods know what kind of war. People with a grudge against me because of a government I can't stand and have excercised my franchise against are out there looking to kill anyone who might happen to be around, and scare the fuck out of the rest of them. If you disagree with anyone, they want you marginalized or dead. I wouldn't wish this world on anyone. How can you be surprised that people would feel the need to form their own communities to try and insulate themselves. Why do you give a damn whether that community is online or person-to-person?
No one gets out of this alive, eh? So take a look at the log in your own eye before you worry about those around you. You techno-fetishistic, mysoginist, life-less circuit-heads. (Hit a little close to home? Good. No? Consider yourself suitably insulted, in whatever way fits.)
Is this a cry for help? It's not better. Don't do this. Simply put, every other problem of yours will get worse. Plus you'll have lots of new ones. Think about it.
I used to game a bit. I don't really anymore. Running linux full-time helps with that btw :) Find something healthy/constructive that you like to do, and get addicted to that instead. Some people call this a "hobby". You'll still be addicted, but at least your liver won't be fucked up.
Warcraft III is better than SC and others for addicts since games are much shorter. With a 90 food cap, people rush more, and send in armies faster. The result is that you get in more games and have more of a chance to stop. With SC, i would delay dinner for hours waiting for a game to finish. Now with WCIII, i can finish a game in 25min and get back to the real world (temporarily)
I could blame the bad term i had last year on games, but really the gaming was a result of other things. Namely, the fact I'd been going to school too long and didn't take a break when I needed one.
I've spent far too many hours playing games, the basic reason being that it is far easier to become successful and respected in the game community than in real life. For a long time, my ambitions for what might happen in real life were diverted to UO, because major goals were achievable on a timescale of weeks/months instead of decades.
For great justice.
People have worse entertainment addictions than playing computer games. If I am going to be addicted to something, I would choose online gaming over drugs, bowling, gambling, television, or being a baseball fanatic easily. I don't have to wear ugly shoes, lose my hard earned money or do the wave next to someone I don't know and that just about makes it a no-brainer for me. It IS after all just a video game, like Neal describes in his great novel, Snow Crash. It is just another amusement park.' Sounds like a happy ending to me."
Hmmm, something seems to be missing here, oh yes, physical human contact: people meeting people. For instance: I bowl on the weekends, do I bowl for the cool shoes, um NO; I bowl to drink a couple of beers with four friends and socialize. Do I go to a football game for the joy of spending money? No, I go to be with friends and cheer on a team as they play.
While I have no problem with online games (I have a level 72 Diablo 2 Paladin) I would *never* treat online gaming as a replacement for human contact, I just seems *obvious* to me, am I missing something here?
my name is Pyrrus and I am addicted to slashdot.
from the article: Three years ago at a nightclub I bumped into an old friend of mine who went by the nickname "Iggy". I was really amazed to see him because no one had seen nor heard from Iggy in over a year. Many of his friends had all wondered what happened to him.
Man, that is so 100% what happens to me about every two weeks. My answer is not "everquest", it's "girlfriend".
How we know is more important than what we know.
But aren't all the cool games online and charge fees?
I suffered for years from video game and technology (i.e. Slashdot-esque geek) addiction... etc... etc....
Maybe this is a stupid question, but why?
Here is my story
I started p;aying games back when I was about seven years old. It all started with my NES, and man did I love it. I played it hard for a while, about 3 or 4 hours a day. Not much longer, we got a computer, and I started playing Dune 2, I lost so much time to those games. By the time I got to high school, I was the biggest gamer in my school.
I remember back in grade eight, the teacher had us all write something nice about each of us on a piece of paper. Out of about 25 people, 15 or so all said either, he is good at nintendo or video games. I never realised that this was bad. I am naturally intelligent, and I did no homework or notes or studying for tests. I was able to pull about an eighty average, while playing these games.
Once I got to high school, I started to get more advanced games, I had an N64, SNES, and a powerful computer (heck, I am typing this on that computer) I was playing hardcore my Command and Conquer and zelda on the nintendos. My marks were slumping a bit, but I was not challenged by the classes and I didn't care. Then in grade eleven we got the internet. I started downloading so much junk, and playing online games like a crazed heiena on crystal meth. My marks were about eighty because I was "learning" so much from the internet. Then I discovered pokemon, Final Fantasy, and a few other games that I hardcore played.
I was logging on about eight hours a day on those things, that and downloading music. I never did any homework, all I was doing was playing games of half-life, and Total Annihilation. It was about halfway through my final year, and I started to really think about what I had been doing.
I was by far the most intelligent person in the school, but I wasn't going to get any scholorship because I did not work in the classes and that brought down my grades. (I ended up second in the class by about 1%) I have never had a girlfriend. I was drastically overweight. I had spent tons of money on games and internet connections. I had never learnt how to do homework or to study. My grammer and language skills were degrading and as were my skills in the real world.
After that I entered university, and I made a promise to myself. No more video games. I packed up my nintendos and my computer games and left them at home, while I went off to the university. Now in my second year, I am faced with the aftermath of my life I had when I was younger. I have already lost about 50 lbs in the last year and a half. I have made numerous friends. My self-esteem has skyrocketed. I will freely admit that I was addicted, but I have worked with it and now have it undercontrol.
Like all addictions, one never gets over it. I have on this computer very few games, like solitare, and I catch myself playing them, even though I try not to. I surf the web far to much, like right now, I am typing on slashdot instead of studing for my econ final tomorrow that is worth 100%. They are hard to deal with, and when I first stopped the games, I felt strange.
I still to this day have problems stemming from the games I played in my youth. I have poor workhabits, and at university that causes failure. I have never had a girlfriend. However, I do have some good things that came from the video games. I am a CS major, learning how to program in C++ probably inspired from all my computer games. I can hold my head up high and say to all my friends that I am a better game player than them. When I hear them talk about everquest, I laugh inside because I can see their addiction and they can't. They still get to beat thiers. I don't have the added wasted time here in universtiy of playing games, unlike some of them. I never watch TV, because I never got into it, and since I don't play games anymore, I have more free time than ever before. My work ethic is slowly growing better here in the University. My collection of video games it worth a lot.
True games have cost me alot, financally, physically, and mentally, but I have started to get out of the hole. I feel that I have had to face obsticals that have made me stronger overcoming them. I must say that instead of getting scholarships, but working for tuition has made me work harder at school.
Video games are addicting, but it is possible to get out from their grasp. The road to recovery is long and hard, but also fufilling and filled with rewards. The hardest step to take is the first one, to get rid of the games and work to be a better person.
Thanks Kendric
When did addictions become so trendy? I mean, a decade ago, people were only addicted to stuff like drugs, alcohol, or cigarettes. These days, I hear people saying they are addicted to video games, movies, shopping, sitcoms, pop, and big macs.
Maybe I'm just an insensitive clod, no wait, hold the maybe.
They get fired, they get their welfare or unemployment insuracne or whatever you have there, use that money to buy food, and continue to play (now closer to 24 hours per day). Ya, so their a bit of a drain on the economy, but other than that they arn't really hurting anyone.
Sex is not a basic need like caffeine is. For an existence proof, look no further than the hundreds of /. posters in this forum!
Photography by Jewels
Am I the only one that read this as "Photograph my jewels"?
Err... what's wrong with bowling ? At least you move a bit more.
All I have to say is, walk a mile in a man's shoes before you say the scrapes and bruises on his feet are unsightly.
What is it with the endless string of poorly written articles?
Some people get addicted, deal with it. Its good for Sony's bottom line.
When some portion of the human race doesn't have to spend all its time scrounging for food, it is going to get addicted to something. Politics, religion, television, sex, alcohol, caffeine, nicotine, complaining, the web, you name it.
/. is my favorite video game addiction.
"You never want a serious crisis to go to waste." - Rahm Emanuel
>So really, I don't consider there to be any difference between traditional addictions like nicotine
Sorry, but that's just stupid. You will not experience real physical withdrawal when coming off MUDs or THC. You will do so coming off opiates and other addictive substances. People have died during withdrawal. Psychological addiction is NOT physical addiction, not by a long shot.
I think it's easy to get addicted to the sense of accomplishment you feel as you play some of these games. Someone posted: there's never a turn where there's nothing to do, always something else to achieve. IMO, wanting to accomplish something useful in your lifetime is a genuine human desire. A very noble desire.
But the sad thing is that these virtual accomplishments are worthless. When you end a session, nothing in the world has actually changed. Just a few bits twiddled somewhere. Nothing changed.
But it IS hard to break addictions, even when you know the harm they can cause. Maybe someone can do some research into how a gaming addiction can be broken. I think countless people can be benefitted by such a study. And I'm certain that, having successfully left gaming, not one person will regret this achievement.
Phase 1: Leave for a vacation
You need to break the mental cycle. Everything in your mind and around you can draw you back in. Go somewhere interesting and different for a week and a half, and make sure it takes at least 8 hours to get there. You may bring a laptop, but have no games installed and avoid web browsing. Leave music at home, and avoid anything that will remind you of home.
Phase 2: Enjoy your vacation
While on vacation, treat yourself to something nice. Remember what it's like to feel alive. Take a tour. Start up some conversations (Especially if you're single). If you're shy, force yourself to talk to some people. Your brain is outside of your normal cycle. Thoughts will take new paths and flow more freely. Take some photos.
Phase 3: Examine your life
At the end of your vacation, spend some time thinking about your situation. Are you happy with your job/career? Do you feel secure at home? Have you accomplished or are working towards your dreams/life plans? Think about your age, how much time you expect to have left, and how you'd like to spend that time.
Phase 4: Getting home
Put a vacation photo on your desktop to help empower your mind. At this point you won't have a desire to play games. You can do one of two things:
a) Hard approach - Treat the games as mental parasitic poison. Uninstall all of them. Get out some scissors and destroy the CDs.
b) Moderate approach - Games are ok in small amounts but keep an eye on yourself. Spend a certain time each day evaluating yourself and how you want to seriously live life.
Either way, you will suddenly have an abundance of free time. Do not turn on the TV! Avoid too much music! Feels boring, doesn't it? That's the true nature of reality. Spend this time wisely. Avoid receiving the negative influences and criticism that got you in trouble before.
Congratulations! You are a new person.
Drugs have addictions, games don't, no more then gambling does. Sorry, I don't buy it. You make your choices in life, I love games but Monday morning I am off to work, not Dark Age of Camelot, much as I would love to, I got bills to pay. When its my wifes Birthday, I don't ignore her and play games, I take her out. We all have resposiblities, some choose to live up to them some don't and pay the consequences, but it was never about an addiction, it is about maturity. These kinds of media driven "excuses" to justify destructive gambling and gaming habits as "addictions" simply compound the problem by removing a certain sense of onus of responsibility from the individual who needs to address it the most, thenselves. Sorry, I don't buy it. If gaming is ruining your life, address it, stop making excuses and grow up. There is no shame in gaining from our mistakes in life, there is in not learning from them.
gaming 'paraphanelia' (posters, artifacts, clothing items with game logos, etc.)
Dude, if you're paid money for this advertising shit, game addiction is the least of your worries.
Single player games tend to have an ending,
... just like in real life.
and you can learn how to 'beat the game'.
When you've done it enough, you move on.
Multiplayer games add another dimension:
you have to compete with other people,
but there's usually just one objective,
so everyone involved gets bored eventually.
However, persistent online games never end,
and there are literally hundreds or thousands
of ways to compete against the other players.
You could spend your entire life trying to be
the best at everything. (Note: some people try,
and we call them addicts.)
But think about this: There is no real winner
in a MMORPG
(Maybe that's why they're so compelling.)
I have a technology addiction (albeit, fortunately, not a really bad one). I bet a very large % of other /. readers do as well - and the posts on this subject seem to confirm this.
Does anyone have any advice, or know of any good support groups (which ironically will probably be online) which could help people like me get their addiction under control? Or any other tales of recovery?
Read reviews of shopping cart software
At least games like this keep the social retards at home and off the street! haha!
Help! I'm addicted to air. I've tried to quit hundreds of times, but I'm always back on the stuff within 3 minutes. Does anyone know an effective way to quit? Is there a patch?
:(
p.s. I've heard that the withdrawl kills you if you stop for more than 5 minutes...
I chose not to choose life, I chose something else... (reading Slashdot :)
That said, LPC is still a cool programming language :-)
Hear! Hear! If you create the game (wizard/creator) rather than simply play the game. I know a few friends of mine who learned to code.. and code well... using LPC. Much better than the alternatives for these fellas (falling into gangs, drugs, etc.). Some times addiction can be turned positive.
I spent my entire Sunday playing Leisure Suit Larry 6. Sure, I could have been out flirting with real women all of that time... but the next time I have to light a cellulite burning lamp of knowledge to bone a chick with transparent pants in the penthouse I break into, I'll know that my zipper can be used as a match strike plate. I think it pays to devote a percentage of ones time to mastering the arts. It shows you care.
You can make a lot of money selling drugs because of the addiction right? But that is illegal. You say games are not like drugs? How come I made $30,000 dollars since July 11th selling 'virtual' items for one of the more popular online games? I used to think that game addiction was nonexistant and ridiculous. Lol, nope it is cetainly real. Oh yeah, did I mention I am only 16? ^_^ and if you don't believe me if it makes you feel better I wouldn't believe myself either. (Like I didn't believe my friend that said he made $1,000 selling items a year ago, heh)
Yeah right, like Unix ever had any addictive games.
Are you sure gaming is everything life has to offer?
--
Internet Explorer (n): Another bug -- that is, a feature that can't be turned off -- in Windows.
I am a very heavy gamer. However, I have not developed what I would consider an addiction. After reading the article and some of the other replies in this thread, here are my opinions.
1) The sort of person who is likely to become addicted to gaming is probably getting more out of playing those games with their time then the other activities that are available to that person.
2) There is nothing inherently wrong with choosing to play a game rather then interacting with people.
3) The only time an addiction should be considered dangerous is when it begins to supercede things that should not be superceded. To that end, any activity that causes you to fail in your responsibilties to others, or causes harm to yourself and others is bad.
4) There are things more important in life then heavy gaming, drug use, and gambling. One of those is Soap.
END COMMUNICATION
Funny.
The same thing happened to the author of Word Freak. He started out investigating the world of competive Scrabble playing & ended up becoming totally hooked. If I remember correctly, he ends up being ranked over 1600.
A pretty good read if you're looking for something over holiday travel.
-Bill
SlashSig Karma: Excellent (mostly affected by moderatio
This is a topic I have thought long about. The question that always pops into mind is "What drives a person to extreme behavior?". With that question in mind as it relates to above story, I came up with this: people become consumed with the act of creation. In a MMORPG, the creation is that of an alternate, virtual life, replete with status, relationships and accomplishment. The person is rewarded frequently for success, and is continually challenged to improve. I liken this to the type of "addiction" or obsession that a painter or sculptor must feel at the end stages of creating their latest piece. I dont think it would be at all uncommon to find out that an author in the midst of a creative burst can write without rest for hours and hours, without ever feeling tired or hungry. I know that personally I get that feeling when programming or solving a complex computer issue. The act of creating that program and the feeling that the solution, the final act of creation, is just around the corner, is an amazingly powerful one. In most peoples "real" lives, the time and opportunity for meaningful creativity are very limited (the soul is crushed!) and it is human nature to seek creative expression. The MMORPG readily provides this outlet.
Sounds like you got a bit of a problem...
This being Slashdot, watch for the morons who'll no doubt jump out of the woodwork to decry the article, comparing the hobby of computer gaming to heroine addiction, alcoholism, and gambling. No doubt a few weak-willed souls will jump up to the plate to confirm this pathetic pandering bullshit with their own sordid tales of playing EverQuest night and day, or whatever the hell the current rage is.
Slashdot - home of the cyber-Oprah's, always willing to jump on the latest hand-wringing bandwagon.
Max
My god carries a hammer. Your god died nailed to a tree. Any questions?
Hmmm, is that why you spent all day ranting on slashdot, Tuesday December 3? Your posts started before 9AM and end after 6:30 PM with the longest time between posts being less than three hours. Thirteen posts are still visible and there may have been more. At fifteen minutes per post, you do read the articles don't you, your Slashdot habbit cost you about four hours that day. That's a lot of time for a single day, even if you are just a "porn stuff" dude. All of that time could have been spent growing your collection.
Most of your posts are offensive, much like the one above. Do you get a little rush from acting that way? Or are you paid to troll this place?
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.
Professional Athletes I'd say have an unhealthy addiction to their sport.
God spoke to me
Wow, so I guess your comment is meaningless because it wasn't given to me in person, therefore it's not "real".
Your viewpoint is very 80's.
What has Horsey shit got to do with it?
I played muds off and on from 92-96 or so, even coded for a few. I played EQ, DAOC, AO, you name it.
Wanna know how many active MMORPG accounts I have? Zero. Haven't played one for a year or so.
I just got bored with the genre and quit. It didn't ruin my life any more than watching old episodes of Star Trek did in the 80's, I didn't suffer from any withdrawel or it didn't scar my life(well, maybe William Shatner's bad acting did).
The horror, the horror.
How about instead of blaming mud "addiction" you just fess up and admit you were young and irresponsible?
It's okay to have character flaws, not every mistake in your life needs an excuse.
Oh, and LPC was a BITCH to debug though. But I was always fond of the Nightmare lib.
addiction is not an easily defined term because its rarely used properly and theres different types of addiction.. Surprising (or not) to many people, is many drugs are not whatsoever addicting in any different sense that entertainment is addiction.. in other words.. its something that you believe is fun to do... physical addiction is another animal completely.. your body starts to 'normalize' with the drug in it, and without the drug you suffer withdrawal symptoms.. withdrawal symptoms are also not directly porportionate to how addictive the drug is (another misconception) .. believe it or not.. cigarettes are basically more addictive or as addictive as any illegal drug physically..
now.. defining who is a 'psycho-active' addict is not entirely simple.
conventional methods say
1. can this person function in society? if yes then
2. is there behavior considered normal? if yes then
3. is prolonged use harmful to personal health? if no then - "this is not psycho-actively addictive
obviously some large flaws in it.. many people that dont have obsessive addictions and rather suffer from mental disorders *still* cannot function in society.. so its not as if addiction is the only downfall.. 2 normal changes constantly and is rather dynamic.. chances are msot people *arent* normal even if you set their personal addictions aside. 3. Personal health is all relative to what you do i suppose.. spending countless hours behind a computer is not physically healthy and using drugs sure isnt either, but then again... a lot of stuff is *not* healthy that we dont commonly associate with addiction (over-eating... being blatantly lazy etc.)
so a better way to "classify" addictions is just by asking *THIS* simple question?
Has the activity you are engaging in failed to provide what it was originally intended for (stress release usually, mileage may vary.) and instead actually adding to your stress load (or whatever else the case may be)... in this case.. you are definetely suffering from addiction.. ultimately all but the most hopeless addicts can determine whether or not their 'addiction (as most would refer to it as)' has become a problem...
the people sitting behind there machines rationalizing the fact that addiction is completely irrational are probably being hypocritical to the extreme.. find somebody without some type of abnormal behavior and .. ill give you a cookie..
Just had to post a comment re: the parent's mention of gambling in the list of addictions. I agree that it could be viewed as an addiction, but I have to add that there are various gambling classes.
The first is non-skilled casino betting. (Slot machines, Roulette, etc). Personally, I would never play games like this because there is virtually no chance of making a substantial profit and the house always wins.
The second class is sports betting, or placing bets on the outcome of a sports event. This does involve chance, but it isn't as hopeless as the first class of gambling, and there is potential for profit.
The third class is skilled card games (Poker, Blackjack). Unfortunately, when people become too good at these types of games, they are often banned from casino establishments.
I am only involved in the 2nd gambling class. In 1999, I was involved in I.T (a Linux system admin). My job consisted of admininstering nameservers, mail servers, and an MRTG server. It payed quite well, since it was before the bubble burst, but it was frighteningly boring.
I was quite involved in the racing scene even then, and in the middle of 2000, realised that I was making more on the race track on some days than I was from a month's salary check. That's when I decided to stop doign boring I.T work and pursue professionally what I had always considered a hobby.
It's all a question of being smart. I use spreadsheets to calculate my betting budgets, and I use OpenOffice's Math and Spreadsheets to calculate the algorithms that I use for betting on horses. I don't always win, but when I spend the money I have allotted myself, I don't spend any more.
Remember there's a world outside the MUD. That's easy to say, I know it, but there are a few easy techniques you can use to make sure you never forget that.
1. Every few hours, force yourself away from the computer, and go take a walk. Yes, I do mean outside. Yes, I am serious. Go now. You won't need to be away for THAT long, 20-30 minutes is how long I usually spend when trying to make sure that my passions for programming, knowledge (everything2 is as addictive as any MUD) and mudding don't develop into addictions. Sometimes, when you're feeling particularly reclusive, force yourself to take your walk in a populated area, just to make sure that your subconscious still has a fresh image of what people look like.
2. Remember that the values of the MUD world are not real. You may be the guild master, have a wizard character and a billion XP on your main mortal, but that shouldn't give you satisfaction enough that you forget real-world values. When was the last time you visited a friend? Are you neglecting your {girl|boy}friend? If you're having difficulties keeping these things in mind, a simple way to make sure you don't forget that XP can't give you a hug when you need one is to take a long mudding break every now and then. I mean at least a couple of weeks. When you get back, some of the competition may have climbed to a higher experience level than you, but you should be able to see that this is not the end of the world.
3. A weak mind is more prone to obsessive behaviour and addiction than a strong one. The mind lives in your brain, and your brain is part of the complex system that is the human body. If you're an anti-social gamer/MUDder/noder/coder, odds are you feed on a strict diet of sugar, starch, spice, caffeine and nicotine, and never get any exercise. I know you don't want to, but you really have to change this. Keep a bowl of fresh fruit nearby instead of the bag of chips. Get some daily exercise. Keep in mind that your body is a system of which your brain is a part. As a computer geek, you should know that overall performance is improved if you eliminate bottlenecks. A possible explanation for the silly old adage that a healthy soul lives in a healthy body is that the supply of blood (with fresh, life-giving oxygen and other goodness!) to your brain possibly becomes more efficient if you keep your body more efficient. This will remind you that you HAVE a body, something computer obsessions make you forget.
4. Make sure you have at least one hobby not related to computers, and make sure you maintain it with the same zeal that powers your computing hobby. Learn how to paint, learn how to play a musical instrument or use your voice as one, take up martial arts, whatever. The point is to make sure you don't forget that your mind can do other things than play MUDs / write e2 nodes / write C code. Aikido and playing the electric bass worked for me, your mileage may vary. This will also give a rich quality to your hobby life / voluntary skill development that you wouldn't have gotten on computers alone. Nowadays I'm as likely to spend a couple of hours honing my slap/pop technique or learning a scale as I am to spend them hacking away on the computer.
5. See people who don't play MUDs. Ideally, people who don't like computers at all. No, they're not lamers. No, they're not ignorant. They just have different interests than you, and "different" does not necessarily imply "superior" or "inferior". Go to your local heavy metal bar, or hang out with your newfound band or martial arts buddies, or whatever. This will help you remember that other people have interesting lives too, which in turn will help you remember that there is a vast and interesting world with billions of rooms and the most well-coded mobs you've ever seen, right in front of you!
An alcoholic / drug addict can never become a social drinker / casual user, but an obsessed gamer, programmer or e2 noder most certainly can develop sane computing habits. Give it a try. Learning to appreciate the real world trains your mind and makes computing more enjoyable, not less. You're a human being, your mind makes you able to do lots of interesting things instead of just focusing on one single skill. Specialization is for insects.
I speak as someone who has been through both an alcohol addiction and a period of obsessive MUDding.
Six sick
There is a chemical component to process addictions. When you are getting a hit, your brain releases the opiates. You do go through withdrawl - trust me on this.
. This sig unintentionally left blank. I meant to put something here, but I'm busy.
I had spend over 100 Days of play time in my Dwarven Paladin in Everquest. Last year shortly bevore Christmas I deleted him and closed my account. You ask why? Well, it's kinda shocking to recognize that 1 more day of camping in EQ is so important to you that youre searching an excuse to delay(and cut short) your visit to your family ...
and pretty proud of it.
It should be taught in schools.
I spend 10 hours a day every day there.
It has gotten so bad, I've lost my girlfriend, I've dropped out of school, and all their employees know me by name.
Next year, I will move to Florida, so I can go to Disneyworld.
There are a number of fallacies being expressed in this thread.
The first is that, for some reason which is never explained, interaction with humans by going out and meeting them in the flesh is somehow good, while interacting with their chosen images in an online world is somehow bad. There are many reasons why this argument is threadbare, and there are even counterarguments to favor online interaction, but I'll point out just one fallacy that undermines it all: so-called "direct" interaction is actually nothing of the sort, it's just better-integrated electronic interaction with those people in your physical proximity. Your eyes and ears (both electronic signal interfaces) provide you with most of that alleged "direct" interaction unless you're in sexual contact, and that's no different online. The difference is primarily one of bandwidth and degree of integration with your senses; it's early days in that respect online, admittedly, but if your anti-online argument relies on those underdeveloped aspects of it then you have to admit that your argument will lose validity in the future as those things improve.
The second fallacy relates to bandwidth of interaction and its importance. The signals we receive are merely hints to our perceptual machinery, as our minds perform an immense amount of interpretation on the data that comes in. The extent of this internal processing is so collosal that we are easily immersed in virtual worlds when reading novels, and the bandwidth of incoming data there is absolutely minute, a tiny fraction of today's typical modem bandwidth. In a modern online MMRPG, the bandwidths involved are much closer to those in so-called "direct" interaction that those involved in reading, so the low-bandwidth argument is not convincing. In any case, I've yet to hear anyone trying to claim that reading is not worthwhile owing to low bandwidth compared to "direct" interaction with people.
And finally, since the topic of so many contributions has been addiction and loss of time that could better be spent in worthwhile personal development, it is worth pointing out an unstated or forgotten insincerity on the part of many people that criticize online worlds. Something like 85 percent of people in the developed world that come home after work or school and begin some form of entertainment (as opposed to more work), do so by turning on the television. This non-interactive medium spoon-feeds them brainless addictive pap for the masses for hours each day, almost entirely bypasses their intellectual machinery, wastes their time while creating nothing in which they can take pride, and certainly involves no worthwhile social interaction. The concept of a TV watcher somehow finding fault with people that inhabit an online world full to the brim with an intense interactive social fabric is so incongruous as to be funny.
PS. I come to this from the perspective of where things are going in a few decades' time. It wasn't so long ago that family and friends used to be puzzled by my inhabiting Internet communities like this one and many others --- "That's not real life, just gazing at a monitor, you shouldn't be wasting your time" was their (usually unstated) view. Now several of them use the Internet, and even inhabit their own online communities without any encouragement from me. Apparently there is "life" online as well, it turns out, haha. Well, it's early days still, I'll be the first to admit, but anyone that thinks of online worlds purely in terms of addiction and waste of time simply does not understand what the future holds.
"The question of whether machines can think is no more interesting than [] whether submarines can swim" - Dijkstra
I was also addicated to muds for a very long time, because I needed them for my esteem. The pavlonian response of earning levels, beating your foe, or successfully "teaming" with other people in a clan can be quite addictive. Also that whole numbers/social status thing can do wonders for the ego.
But you brought up what I consider to be a really good point. There is a huge difference between online games and offline games. With online games you can learn to socialize with others if you are not so good at it, as well as improving your sense of self-esteem. I agree, however, that there is a danger in letting yourself get trapped such that only the MUD or MMP-RPG determines your self-value.
So while bowling does bring you in contact with others and possibly improve your dexterity or physical abilities, I still believe that MUDs and MMPRPGs can do good things for one's self-perceptions and social skills. Eventually I was "mature" enough in the online world that I could be a "better" man outside of it.
I used to be one of those annoying little toddlers that would kill-steal, raze, and generally grief others. I morphed into a person who contributed to the mud-community in quite large ammounts, had a significant number of friends, and socialized frequently. Transitioning from mud life to real life was a bit clunky, but some of the very same skills I learned without fear of repudiation in the quasi-social world of muds allowed me to be more mature in the real world and get things relatively right on the first go.
Basically I feel I can blame quite a lot of my successful real-world relationships on my having grown up in the social environments of MUDs.
N
PS: those that are still lost as to what a MUD is, go here for a quick idea. Basically everquest, daoc, etc. are startling similar to MUDs (and are considered by many to be graphical MUDs while MUDs are considered by many to be computerized versions of D&D).
Reality is a slackware box running on a 386 tucked away in god's sock drawer.
Dexter and Lind's make some pretty nice looking shoes, nowadays.... ;)
rm -fr
There is an amazing tendency for people to confabulate around 'mental problems'. For example, the argument about whether this is a real addiction is truly a side-issue (especially when there's no accepted definition of what that means).
;)
Yes, some people have ruined theirs and others' lives by playing computer games.
What is important here is how people decide to start/stop indulging.
When you start (or think about starting), do you exaggerate how it will make you feel? Do you minimise or not even think about the risks? Do you think about what your life will be like in 1 or 3 or 5 or 10 years time if you continue making awful decisions like this. BTW, computer games now are lame compared to how good they'll be in 10-20 years.
Answer the same questions as for when you think about approaching hot women
When you think about stopping, do you generally put it off? How will you anticipate feeling if stop at that moment? What would have to happen for you to stop right then? Can you commit yourself to stopping?
FWIW, I have been unable to avoid wasting huge amounts of time on a game so I simply don't own any. Realise that games 10 years from now will make current ones look very lame indeed. Unless you are all still playing Wolfenstein...
Dave (addictions therapist).
I have been addicted. It/I ruined my life for years. When I tried to stop, all I'd think about was the addiction. Then I'd just let myself have a taste. Just a taste, that's all I need. A taste and then I can get back to what I need to do. Then a taste would turn into a gorge. The process would begin again.
To me it came down to this. It's an addiction when it's easier to get high than to just deal with everyday life.
How many potheads to you know that will have a hard day and insist on getting high "rather than having to think about it"? That's an addiction. They'll come right back and say "Hey, it's just pot. It's not physically addictive. What they don't want you to know is that it's also mentally addictive. You get to the point where you can't live without it. Where it's easier to get high than to deal with the hardships of life. That's the mental addiction.
I believe that video games can be addictive as well. Hell, one of the guys in my lab group is addicted to Ultima Online. If you suggest to him that he might be addicted, he'll blow up at you and insist you don't know shit. If you ask him why he's only gotten 4 hours of sleep per night for the past few months, he'll tell you that work is too hard. If you ask him why he doesn't spend time with his wife anymore, he'll say she just doesn't understand his gameplaying and she's been getting pretty bitchy lately. It's getting easier for this dude to get online an play with some "friends" (non of which he actually knows locally) than to deal with a normal life.
So what's the point of my post. I'm kinda lost myself. Addiction is real and it doesn't matter what form it takes. It's really something that can ruin lives and relationships.
"It's a tarp!" -- Dyslexic Admiral Ackbar
Well, the answers you seek are in the studies themselves. Instead of trying to make up other dumb ideas such as bricks hitting faces, why not look at the facts scientists are finding everyday instead of trying to ignore them?
It seems also geographicly biased:
Dutch studies show no effects, french studies show huge effects.
Couldn't be political now, could it?
So, qwestion is: who ordered these studies? If they are US- governmentt sponsored, be sure to find adverse effects with any drug...
Sig (appended to the end of comments I post, 54 chars)
The linked article seems more like an ad for AO then a study of gaming addiction. She sets herself up as the test subject and then only mentions briefly (and shallowly) the effects she experienced.
... sure looks like an ad, or at least a favorable review.
Other players are mentioned but it isn't made clear if they are addicts as well (or does AO imply addicts only?), nor is any mention made of the downside (or lack thereof) to their gaming habit. All the bad examples are taken from other games (EQ, the Korean CS casualty, etc).
Overall I got the message that AO is great, come play and if you spend a bit more time playing it then you should, well that's OK (at least you're not doing drugs)
If gaming was widely recognised as a sport we wouldn't see all this belly-aching about addiction.
:-)
Every sport has lots of athletes who show symptoms of addiction. They make huge personal sacrifices to compete, and would strongly resist stopping, yet we never hear them labelled as addicts. I'm sure the same also applies to other activities, like arts & crafts. Ever heard of folk art addicts? To get rid of this image problem we need to have gaming recognised as a sport, and destroy the "childish pastime" image.
So dear critics, to hell with you all! I'm going to keep gaming until I die of RSI.
Day by day this world going to be more messy. More people doesn't want to live there. There are no real meaning.
To day we had Evercrack and people says this is a big big big problem.
Are u sure ? Do you thing about next 5 years. When Virtual Reality come to reality I thing they banned Massive Multiplayer Online Games.
[My english is better than most other people's Turkish, so please point out mistakes politely. Thank you.]
to fight my addiction to MUDDing (jedi mudd) in the early 90 to mid 90s, i adopted two simple rules for myself. i no longer played massive multiplayer network games and i only buy myself one video game a year.
i almost flunked out of college because of my weakness. i'm sure a lot of open source code has gone unwritten because of addiction to games.
andrew
Why did I lurk so long before registering for a Slashdot account? I could have had a Slashdot ID of less than 100000.
My elven mage was once slain, backstabbed by a greedy little halfling theif.
The question of whether a computer can think is no more interesting than the question of whether a submarine can swim.
...NERDS!!!
On a social, intellectual, and oftimes physical (deprivation, couch-potato-beer-pizza-and-a-PC syndrome) it's often just as bad, possible worse because it's not really a recognised addition but more of a social disease (people don't think of you as an addict, just as a geeky loser).
The effects don't really outcrop as much to other people though, except through neglect though. I've been playing a lot of SC lately, and I know my girlfriend sometimes feels ignored (she's got exams though, and when I do pay attention to her she says I'm distracting - catch 22).
I've never heard of somebody beating the *!@#@ out of somebody because of gaming addiction though, unless it's in an internet cafe together and one person is being a cheat/cheapass/etc/ (happened I think, but no real violence as often enough geek=weak).
In fact, this addiction led to the development of a system known as "moderation" and then "meta-moderation" as the amount of respect (known as Karma) climbed higher. Finally, in order to break the cycle of addiction, Karma was capped at 50 points, then changed to a meaningless text (Excellent, mostly due to .....).
Still, the addiction continues. ______ just keeps track of Karma points on a well used analog device known as a memo-pad, using another analog device (a pencil), and has a current total of over ___ (affix your own imagined number here) Karma points. But no, I 'm not addicted -- really. I just need another few first posts, andd +5 funnies to break the record...honest!!
So why post? I like the author's point: for respect not so easily gained in the real world.
...Open Source isn't the only answer -- but it's almost always a better value than the alternatives...
OK, first of all, I think that a lot of over-PC type interaction goes in the same boat.
I know a lot of people who play CS, they also used to go out and frag each other in paintball until moving seperated them.
You also get those who play MMORPGS and ignore life in general. How does that compare to those obsessed with Shadowrun or "role-playing" of the non-PC genre. Some of these people are obsessed too, and oftimes it's not healthy.
A lot of the case is, PC's allow a broader availability of interaction. If you go and ring up your Shadowrun/AD&D friend at 3am to yack about your new character/quest/whatever, he's probably going to want to strangle you. If it's some guy in Australia over the internet, he's awake and ready to go.
And internet communication/gaming does have its positive benefits too. For me, I was the #1 geek at school (even before I was into computers). Unpopular as heck, girls wouldn't touch me, etc etc. When, because I was helping maintain the lab PC's, I was able to keep it open after-hours for deathmatches - I got my own little geeky cult (friends!!!). My social standing improved somewhat, and at least I felt like I was appreciated for something (master of Q2 was I).
Later in HS, around the time I got a car, I'd acquired quite a list of local ICQ contacts. I actually ended up hooking up with a lot of these people in real life, and going out for coffee with them, making friends etc. Actually, my best friend is somebody I met online, as is my girlfriend.
lately, I've started playing Starcraft again, and yeah, major addiction. I'd have to say that if I weren't playing SC I probably wouldn't be doing anything more productive. I've a few programming projects I'm working on (contracted on my time, not at my regular job), but the weekend let me burn off a lot of stress. Otherwise, I'd have probably reread a book or watched a show.
So what you have to consider is, if these people weren't plugged in - what would they be doing. Do they have enough of a life (or the ability to get one) that the game is counterproductive, or does it at times actually add a meager element onto an already low social calendar?
I've been a gamer on and off all my life. I played MUDs on local BBS systems with my 2400 baud modem, followed the FPS rage from Wolfenstein to Quake, RTS games from Command & Conquer to Age of Empires. Now I'm fairly active with Dark Age of Camelot. I would say that I'm addicted. But I would honestly say that I was addicted to snowboarding at the same time, until my second snowboarding accident. I was addicted to movies for a long time as well. It's easy for me to get caught up in something that I enjoy. The real question for me is not whether it's healthy or not. The real question is what actually matters to me. Is it more important to lead my online friends on a 6 hour raid to push the enemy back from our frontier, or storm the fort with my paintball gun and some buddies at my back? Or take some friends out for coffee and a movie? Is my time better spent practicing with my band or instructing a lower level guild member on realm vs realm fighting techniques?
As a Christian, the question means nil to me when when it's brought up in that way. I'm here to serve my God. My best friend died while serving in Bolivia; but unlike a lot of my friends, I'm not called to serve in a 3rd world country or be a preacher. I'm here to help my friends who have problems with their marriages, employment, health etc... I'm here to be a living example of God's love. Some of my closest friends now are people I've met through Dark Age of Camelot. I was a very intraverted child; I used to communicate better via my computer than I did face to face. That's changed as I've grown older, but I still have the ability to talk to someone heart to heart over the internet.
The average person will not run into an extreme case of addiction playing games online. Perhaps they'll neglect a class or two, big deal. It happens. I missed over a week of work both times that I broke my arm snowboarding. Was that better than the time I stayed up til 6 am leading 150 people in a raid and didn't come in to work til 10? Perhaps. It still hurts to raise my arm above my head... and the burning sensation in my eyes from looking at my monitor for 12 hours straight will go away in a day or two, I'm sure of it.
I keep forgetting my place. Jesus is for losers. Why do I still play to the crowd?
The problem here is not that this guy is ignoring his gal, but rather that he just doesn't realize that this gal is not as important to him as online gaming is. He needs to make a priority call on girlfriend vs. gaming and act accordingly. Yes, this will probably be ugly and painful, but it's the best solution in the long run.
;)
Yes, this is insensitive. So what, I'm an insensitive guy. There is no room in my life for a girlfriend and I don't delude myself or some poor woman by acting otherwise. It's probably the same way for this guy, but he's being an ostrich about it.
Just because a majority of people need lots of companionship, doesn't mean that everyone does. For example, my social needs are scant and intense social situations (large groups of people and/or strong emotions with people) cause me pain. Occationally, I miss the companionship a SO would provide, but that pain is slight compared to the pain of an always-on relationship. If my viewpoint is socially deviant, so what, I'm not hurting anyone.
People have worse entertainment addictions than playing computer games. If I am going to be addicted to something, I would choose online gaming over drugs, bowling, gambling, television, or being a baseball fanatic easily...And I will leave you with that. Signing on now... Tenjikiito, level 157 Female Solitus Adventurer, Advisor to the Clan Guild Synergy Factor, the best damn guild on the world of Rubi-Ka, with the best damn virtual people one could ever virtually meet.
Ok. Here are a few points.
1. Addictions to drugs, bowling, gambling or TV are more socially acceptable than addictions to MMORPG's. This explains why MMORPG's are an embarassing topic and why computer illiterate people have trouble understansing this type of addiction.
2. Historically people have been addicted to gambling, drugs, bowling(hey, it's possible...), TV, etc but this list does not include all possible addictions. It is possible to be addicted to anything, even virtual people that virtually meet. If you alter your lifestyle to accomodate your hobby then you have an addiction. It is that simple. If your hobby is underwater basket weaving and you spent your rent money on scuba gear then you have an addiction. Classic symtoms include skipping responsibilities, class, non-essential meals or in my case, avoiding friends and altering my work schedule to fit into my Everquest schedule.
3. Get outside help so you can verify if you have an addiction. As they say, 'denial' ain't just a river in Egypt. Your opinion certainly does matter but an impartial test of your hobby/addiction/whatever is what counts.
I had a major addiction to Everquest. I put in 30+ hours a week for two years. That's 3360 hours in two years or 140 days played. I finally came to realize that an addiction by any other name is still an addiction. Good news is I just got a 25% raise, am going to the gym again and dating - in fact I blew off a date tonight because I plan on doing 16 hours today - next addiction to master will be this workaholic thing, hehe.
People can be addicted to ANYTHING. End of discussion.
Scott Lockwood? Is that you?
XXXVI: ... gets eaten.
The thickness of the proposal required to win a multimillion dollar
contract is about one millimeter per million dollars. If all the
proposals conforming to this standard were piled on top of each other
at the bottom of the Grand Canyon it would probably be a good idea.
XXXVII:
Ninety percent of the time things will turn out worse than you expect.
The other 10 percent of the time you had no right to expect so much.
XXXVIII:
The early bird gets the worm.
The early worm
XXXIX:
Never promise to complete any project within six months of the end of
the year -- in either direction.
XL:
Most projects start out slowly -- and then sort of taper off.
-- Norman Augustine
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